The Megyn Kelly Show - A Mom and Small Business Owner, On How She Ended Up at the Capitol January 6, and Fighting Against COVID Lockdown ｜ Ep. 58

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00:00:30.580 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:00:42.020 Hey, everyone.

00:00:42.980 I'm Megyn Kelly.

00:00:43.740 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:45.200 Today on the program, something extraordinary, a woman named Lindsey Graham, not the senator

00:00:50.600 from South Carolina, but a mom and business owner who's been living up until recently in

00:00:57.340 Salem, Oregon, with her family and engaged in what she's called an act of civil disobedience 1.00

00:01:03.220 against the governor's highly restrictive lockdowns there back in May.

00:01:07.360 Now, originally, we booked Lindsey because we wanted to talk to her about that as part of

00:01:12.140 the COVID show that we aired a couple days ago.

00:01:15.980 But in the midst of the interview, it became clear that Lindsey is an extraordinary woman,

00:01:20.940 and she was very open and honest about not only the lockdown and what it did to her, but the Capitol Hill protest and riot and why she was there.

00:01:31.600 She did not participate in the riot.

00:01:33.300 She says she did not storm the Capitol.

00:01:35.580 She went to the Capitol and she listened to President Trump.

00:01:38.360 And she she did us the favor of walking us through how she got there that day and how she got to a place of believing that indeed that day the election would be overturned.

00:01:51.480 And it was an extraordinary view into the larger picture of what happened that day and spoke volumes about where we are as a country.

00:02:02.880 We're going to talk to her in a second, but I just I just want to talk to you about why I think this is so important.

00:02:09.340 In the wake of Trump's election, right back in 2016, some of the media decided it was time to do some soul searching.

00:02:15.800 They were stunned.

00:02:16.880 How did it happen?

00:02:17.840 How do we miss it?

00:02:18.640 They asked themselves.

00:02:19.300 Papers like The New York Times hired folks like Barry Weiss.

00:02:22.780 She told us that just the other day.

00:02:24.540 She's a center lefty. 1.00

00:02:26.060 They wanted, to their credit, to help understand.

00:02:29.220 They wanted to understand a wider range of voices, including Trump supporters.

00:02:33.160 She wasn't one, but she was about as far right as they'd go.

00:02:36.520 And as she explained to us on the show the other day, that experiment ended in disaster.

00:02:41.360 Thanks to The Times' nonstop internal bullying of her and intolerance of the very ideological diversity they purportedly sought out in an effort at, quote,

00:02:49.300 understanding.

00:02:49.900 But over the past four years, and certainly over the past few months, we have seen zero effort to understand Trump's core supporters.

00:02:57.920 The media and the Democrats hate them.

00:03:01.440 And it shows.

00:03:02.600 And I understand there's political differences, but the media is supposed to be an impartial arbiter.

00:03:06.820 The media is not supposed to let their own opinion infiltrate their reporting because it's important that people on both sides of the aisle trust you.

00:03:15.860 But the media has surrendered to their hate for Donald Trump and for MAGA at large.

00:03:22.520 The patriots, as they call themselves, are loathed by the press. 0.92

00:03:27.300 We have seen all of Trump's voters summarily dismissed as racist, bigots, xenophobes, transphobes, misogynists, and on it goes. 0.86

00:03:36.540 And since the Capitol riot, it's only gotten worse. 0.94

00:03:39.520 Now they're actually saying you're a Klansman.

00:03:41.820 You're a Klansman.

00:03:42.980 If you were at the Capitol that day, even just to listen to Trump, some are being canceled just for attending the rally.

00:03:51.440 Forget the riot or the walk to the Capitol.

00:03:54.180 The media from Anderson Cooper to the Atlantic has openly mocked the Trump supporters there that day as low-life, classless, poor, olive garden-eating deplorables.

00:04:05.340 You remember that from Anderson?

00:04:06.900 And it does no good, right?

00:04:09.500 It does a lot of harm.

00:04:11.080 You would think maybe the media would ask themselves, how do we lose so many of the people who were there that day?

00:04:19.160 How could we do a better job of reaching them instead of mocking them?

00:04:22.780 How could we become an acceptable option for them so that they could hear what we, the MSM, mainstream media, deem to be facts?

00:04:32.040 You would think they'd stop to ask that and you would be wrong.

00:04:35.500 The media seems content to simply judge these people as untethered loons without ever pausing to ask, did we play any role in forcing them away from our newsrooms?

00:04:46.180 And that's where Lindsey Graham, Oregon mom, comes in. 1.00

00:04:52.880 She's a business owner in Salem, Oregon.

00:04:55.220 She was at the Capitol that day.

00:04:56.900 She did not riot. 0.94

00:04:58.220 But she was a true believer in Trump, in a stolen election, and in what she called a holy war to keep him in office.

00:05:07.740 We spoke with Lindsey a few days ago, as I said, with an eye towards discussing her rebellion against the COVID lockdowns and the resulting blowback from her governor, something over which, by the way, she's now filed a lawsuit.

00:05:18.600 But the discussion morphed into how she wound up at the Capitol on January 6th and came to believe Trump could hold on to the presidency that day.

00:05:26.300 And the discussion was riveting, riveting.

00:05:30.520 I sat and thought about it for a long time.

00:05:34.480 It really affected me.

00:05:35.760 A week ago, prior to knowing Lindsey or speaking with her, I actually tried to raise some of these points in an interview with the BBC.

00:05:44.640 I suggested that the media could use some self-reflection right now, that blaming Trump obviously made some sense for what happened at the Capitol,

00:05:52.440 since he created the story of a stolen election and then fanned the flames for months.

00:05:57.500 But I said that the media, too, bore some responsibility for the distrust in information behind the willingness to believe those claims.

00:06:08.400 Here's part of what I said.

00:06:10.860 I mean, I think the media destroyed itself, but Trump certainly helped.

00:06:15.480 You know, he sort of set a trap that they walked right into and it worked really brilliantly.

00:06:19.760 I remember listening to all of his disparaging comments about CNN when I first when he first became a national figure as a presidential candidate.

00:06:28.320 And I had watched a lot of CNN, even though it was on Fox.

00:06:31.200 And I was like, this is unfair.

00:06:32.460 CNN may be a little boring, but it is fair and it's factual and it's not biased against Trump.

00:06:37.640 And then they spent the next four years proving him right.

00:06:41.520 Right. Proving me wrong.

00:06:43.060 They jumped.

00:06:44.200 They hated him so much.

00:06:46.080 They checked their objectivity.

00:06:47.640 And it wasn't just CNN.

00:06:48.800 All of them did.

00:06:49.620 They just couldn't check their own personal feelings about him.

00:06:53.620 Either that or they signed on to what I call the Jorge Ramos theory of covering Trump.

00:06:58.820 He was at Univision and he advocated prior to Trump's election that we needed to cover him differently, that you needed to outwardly call him a racist, sexist, misogynist, all of it.

00:07:09.420 And that that was important for history.

00:07:10.880 And I think too many journalists agreed with that at their own peril.

00:07:13.940 That part of the reason we saw what happened on the Capitol here two weeks ago was because there's been a complete lack of trust, destruction of trust in the media.

00:07:22.420 And people don't know where to turn for true information.

00:07:25.760 They don't trust the media anymore.

00:07:27.740 And it's a major problem.

00:07:31.440 I stand by every word of that.

00:07:35.100 Every word.

00:07:37.180 Well, the supposed luminaries on Twitter attacked it.

00:07:40.160 Right.

00:07:40.340 It made me trend was as they often do.

00:07:42.200 But once again, they do so at their peril.

00:07:44.380 The media refuses to see the truth.

00:07:46.440 Right.

00:07:46.680 People from The New York Times were attacking the sentiment.

00:07:48.860 The Democrat, the Democratic coalition, coalition was attacking the sentiment is just baffling.

00:07:54.020 They actually used that word.

00:07:55.580 This is just baffling.

00:07:57.620 There's no willingness to take a hard look at how we got here.

00:08:01.680 If it involves any accountability by the press or the Democrats and the overreaching, they did.

00:08:06.100 The story of Lindsey Graham, mom, wife, business owner, patriot, tells the real story.

00:08:13.100 Listen and you decide whether distrust in the media helped drive Lindsey to her acceptance of Trump's claims, her presence at the Capitol that day, and her belief that the mainstream press loathes people like her.

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00:09:38.880 Join me now, Lindsey Graham, the Patriot Barbie, which is so much better than the senator from South Carolina.

00:09:47.780 I love that moniker.

00:09:48.840 And is it born of the fact that you own hair salons?

00:09:51.820 It is born of the fact that in liberal Salem, where I opened my business and was cancel cultured, the liberals made a meme out of my face wearing a MAGA hat and called me Patriot Barbie.

00:10:05.620 And I thought, well, that's not an insult.

00:10:07.920 I like it.

00:10:08.700 And so I took it.

00:10:09.600 I'm going to own it.

00:10:11.640 Good for you.

00:10:12.540 I like that.

00:10:13.680 I read you had six locations.

00:10:15.480 Is it all the same business?

00:10:17.320 No.

00:10:17.720 So we have six.

00:10:18.640 We had six businesses.

00:10:19.920 We had four tanning salons, a gym and then my hair salon as well.

00:10:24.060 OK.

00:10:24.660 And you and your husband owned this together?

00:10:27.880 Yes.

00:10:28.900 And how long did it take you to build up these businesses?

00:10:32.340 Well, I've been building my salon for almost 12 years now.

00:10:35.980 Um, we've acquired the tanning salon slowly over the last six years and, uh, the gym was actually brand new.

00:10:43.220 Uh, we had just opened it.

00:10:44.520 We worked for about a year on it before we opened it, uh, right before the shutdowns.

00:10:48.740 I imagine you don't, you don't have huge margins in these business where, you know, you make a ton more than you owe on the lease and the facilities.

00:10:56.460 No, absolutely not.

00:10:57.800 That's, that's why we have six.

00:10:59.420 We can't, we can't just operate on one.

00:11:01.940 How many employees do you have?

00:11:03.420 Uh, the tanning salons and the gym probably had somewhere between 30 to 50 combined employees.

00:11:10.540 Um, but I didn't have any employees at my salon itself.

00:11:13.600 Was it just you or you just had independent contractors?

00:11:15.900 Yes.

00:11:16.140 It's just, we had, I had independent contractors.

00:11:18.160 I had about 25 girls at the time of the shutdowns. 0.99

00:11:21.440 Okay.

00:11:22.460 So last March rolls around, COVID hits and you get the order that you have to shut down.

00:11:28.640 And as I understand it, at first you said, I got it, uh, I'll do it.

00:11:33.460 I understand.

00:11:35.000 And you did.

00:11:36.720 Yes.

00:11:37.220 Yes.

00:11:37.660 So March 23rd, um, Kate Brown ordered a complete lockdown of all non-essential businesses.

00:11:43.500 And so we did close down our gym, our tanning salons and my hair salon, um, for, it was

00:11:50.540 only, it was only for about six weeks before I decided, uh, that we would most definitely

00:11:55.840 not survive, um, financially, we would not survive if we continued at that, at that pace.

00:12:01.200 And she wasn't offering up an opening date.

00:12:03.880 So.

00:12:03.980 Can we talk about those six weeks?

00:12:05.980 I mean, I, I don't own, I guess now I do, but at the time I didn't own a small business

00:12:10.320 and I just, I wonder what it's like to have put all those years into these businesses and

00:12:16.160 then watch the expenses continue to ratchet up and the income go to zero.

00:12:21.500 Can you just help us understand what that was like for you?

00:12:24.560 Yes.

00:12:24.820 You are one of very few people who understand that concept probably because you're a business

00:12:29.580 owner now, but, um, I just had a discussion with someone about how, when you're, when

00:12:34.700 you lost your job during a lockdown, um, you, it was as simple as applying for unemployment

00:12:39.300 and not only did they grant you unemployment, they granted you extra bonus money just for

00:12:43.640 the heck of it.

00:12:44.480 Um, but business owners did not get, get that same courtesy.

00:12:47.980 So like you're saying, we were shut down and told we couldn't operate.

00:12:51.920 Um, we still owed rent on all six businesses.

00:12:55.740 We still owed the, you know, financial debts, like, you know,

00:12:59.580 interest rates and credit card payments on equipment and rental, things like that.

00:13:04.400 We still owed the utility bills on all those businesses.

00:13:08.220 And so a lot of these businesses, like you said, don't have a high, um, margin of profit.

00:13:13.700 And so you use those, you use, you know, the income every month to pay those bills.

00:13:18.600 And then you take that money home to your family.

00:13:20.600 Well, now not only do we not have that money to pay those bills, we don't have the money to

00:13:25.700 bring home to our family either.

00:13:27.000 However, and, uh, upon paying those bills, a lot of business owners were basically digging

00:13:31.060 into their retirement, digging into their savings, or I mean, completely going bankrupt.

00:13:35.600 Um, because it's, it's, it's not as simple as just closing down and not having an income.

00:13:40.860 It's actually, they're, they're deducting your income.

00:13:44.180 They're going into debt, just trying to keep the businesses afloat.

00:13:47.060 Mm-hmm.

00:13:48.580 I know that's, what's crazy to me is, you know, here in New York, we have rent abatement.

00:13:52.600 So, okay, you don't have to pay your rent during the time that we've mandated you not

00:13:56.300 be in business, but it's still ratcheting up.

00:13:59.020 You're going to have to pay it when we go back into business.

00:14:00.720 It's like, oh, how are they supposed to do that?

00:14:02.900 Are they just magically supposed to get a year's worth of income to pay back the landlords?

00:14:07.580 And so I can understand a sense of panic setting in.

00:14:11.680 I mean, how would you describe what you were feeling?

00:14:13.520 It was, it was a little bit of panic.

00:14:16.820 It was, um, most devastation that we had, you know, I personally had spent my entire

00:14:21.900 adult life building the business that I was working in and I was also doing hair as well.

00:14:26.760 And so I was losing money as a stylist, not working.

00:14:29.880 And it was sort of this overcoming feeling of if I don't do something, we won't survive

00:14:36.840 this.

00:14:37.300 And this is, this is all we do.

00:14:39.080 Um, we can't, I can't go out and get a quote, essential job to accommodate the lifestyle

00:14:44.100 that we've established being business owners.

00:14:46.700 And so it was very much a panic and devastation and concern for not that immediate moment,

00:14:53.680 but our entire future as a family.

00:14:56.080 What would we do if we didn't have these businesses?

00:14:58.580 We don't have other careers.

00:14:59.800 We're not licensed in other areas.

00:15:01.980 Um, we had just built a beautiful home for our family.

00:15:04.560 We, we would, we would literally be filing for bankruptcy and, and finding new careers

00:15:10.460 and starting over in a life that was completely unknown.

00:15:13.340 And we actually had a newborn at the time.

00:15:15.320 And I was thinking, I can't, I can't do, I can't start over with my children.

00:15:19.380 So I need to stand up and do something.

00:15:21.440 How many kids do you have?

00:15:23.500 Uh, we have three.

00:15:24.580 One is, um, almost seven.

00:15:26.080 One is four.

00:15:26.860 And then the newborn is now 10, uh, 10 months old.

00:15:30.000 Oh, wow.

00:15:30.720 So before we get to what you did, I just want to, I'm curious because you're a conservative

00:15:36.940 living in Salem, Oregon, which that's probably a whole other story.

00:15:41.500 Um, and I, as I watched this, as I watched what was happening to the businesses during

00:15:47.540 the lockdown, I saw a lot of sanctimonious, rich news anchors lecturing Americans on how

00:15:56.760 they needed to suck it up, be patriots, right?

00:16:01.420 They were using that word in that, in that way, you know, we're fighting a war and you're

00:16:06.320 just going to have to, like, we don't want to hear about the pain of business owners because

00:16:09.420 people are dying.

00:16:10.360 And this was back in the, you want to kill grandma phase of the pandemic for people who

00:16:16.320 raise concerns like the ones that you're voicing now.

00:16:19.940 So what was your reaction when you saw this kind of thing discussed in the news at the time?

00:16:23.560 So from, from the very beginning, especially watching the media, I felt like something

00:16:28.500 was amiss.

00:16:29.400 The, the numbers made sense.

00:16:32.500 Um, but the way that they were promoting them did not make sense to me.

00:16:36.400 Um, and being a business owner who was shut down immediately and knowing the devastation

00:16:40.560 that was going to fall upon, uh, millions of Americans financially, it didn't make sense

00:16:46.700 that that wasn't being reported, but you know, two people dying was being reported.

00:16:51.440 And so I felt from the very beginning, I felt very skeptical, skeptical about what the media

00:16:56.680 was portraying and what the news was saying.

00:16:58.960 Um, and that didn't play a role in opening my business because, because I didn't believe

00:17:05.580 the agenda that was being promoted.

00:17:07.580 And again, like you're saying, the government agencies, um, that were so eager to shut us

00:17:14.660 down, um, are the same people that are still collecting a paycheck and, uh, their medical

00:17:20.040 benefits and all the perks that, you know, they were so quick to take from us.

00:17:24.440 And so the same thing, yeah, watching the news feed that knowing that, well, of course

00:17:29.440 your job is essential.

00:17:30.260 You're still getting paid.

00:17:31.140 So you're going to drive into everyday Americans, um, how cautious they need to be because you

00:17:37.840 don't have to practice what you preach.

00:17:39.440 So it's a lot easier to do as I say, and not as I do.

00:17:44.180 So we get to May 2nd and you had reached your limit.

00:17:48.280 And what did you do?

00:17:50.040 So May 2nd, I had decided that I would open my business.

00:17:55.560 I didn't realize how controversial it would be.

00:17:57.520 It was a decision that someone needed to, um, because otherwise how long would we be

00:18:03.820 locked down?

00:18:04.820 And I was okay with doing it because I felt like our family specifically desperately needed

00:18:10.020 to.

00:18:10.640 And so, um, it actually got on the media on accident.

00:18:13.680 I had posted in a group on Facebook that I didn't realize was public.

00:18:17.500 And so I said, Hey, fellow patriots, I'm going to open my business.

00:18:21.600 I'd appreciate your support.

00:18:23.020 Um, and then that started getting shared and, um, it's, it went viral pretty quickly.

00:18:28.160 And that's when the news started contacting me about, um, about reopening.

00:18:32.800 So at that point I had accidentally kind of committed myself to this, uh, to this big

00:18:37.420 adventure.

00:18:37.800 So what, how quickly did, uh, governor Kate Brown or her, her people crack down on you?

00:18:45.320 Oh, before I even opened, before I even opened my doors, I, I planned to open on May 5th and

00:18:51.600 on May 4th, I was at the salon cleaning, um, and getting ready and Oregon OSHA showed up,

00:18:58.780 um, came inside and said, listen, if you open tomorrow, we're going to come back.

00:19:03.960 We're going to issue you, you know, a thousand dollar citation.

00:19:06.680 Um, and then you're going to close.

00:19:08.540 And if you don't close, we're going to issue you a $70,000 citation.

00:19:11.620 We're going to red flag your door says your facility is unsafe and it's going to be, you

00:19:15.620 know, basically permanently closed until that $70,000 citation is, is paid.

00:19:19.460 So that was before I even opened my doors.

00:19:22.240 Um, and did you open?

00:19:24.460 I did.

00:19:25.280 Yes, I did open.

00:19:26.740 Um, I I'm very, very thankful for Americans, especially patriots, conservatives.

00:19:32.420 They immediately shared my story.

00:19:34.820 They immediately opened to go fund me and made sure that if I did receive a $70,000 citation

00:19:40.900 that, um, I was taken care of.

00:19:42.720 And so for me, it was like, all these people are counting on me.

00:19:47.300 I didn't realize this would be a big deal.

00:19:49.160 I didn't realize this would be the threat before I even opened, but because, you know,

00:19:53.540 financially, financial despair was my biggest concern, knowing that those citations would

00:19:58.560 be, would be paid for and I'd be covered.

00:20:00.640 It was, I was able to continue forward bravely, you know, because of them, because of their

00:20:06.080 support.

00:20:06.400 Because it turned into a David and Goliath situation.

00:20:10.720 People were, they'd had it with a lockdown and the, the stifling of business and they

00:20:16.600 saw you as a, as somebody who was being civilly disobedient and they liked the point you were

00:20:22.080 trying to make.

00:20:22.860 I, let me ask you this, cause I know you come from a, a long line of military folks, pro pro

00:20:28.220 police.

00:20:29.220 And I, I could definitely, as somebody who practiced law for a while, make the opposite

00:20:33.020 argument.

00:20:33.380 You know, the, the thing that binds us together is the rule of law.

00:20:36.200 You might not like it, but you gotta follow it.

00:20:39.080 You know, society was sort of working together at the time.

00:20:41.580 And if they didn't like it to try to flatten the curve, remember that term?

00:20:46.380 So what would you say to people who say that, right?

00:20:48.660 Like you got to follow the law, even if you don't like it.

00:20:51.940 Um, well I had, by then I had consulted an attorney, um, prior to opening and we had both

00:20:58.200 agreed that this was not law.

00:20:59.540 Um, that, that constitutionally it wasn't law.

00:21:02.700 I felt and believed in my heart and it wasn't law that it couldn't possibly be legal in America

00:21:07.900 for Kate Brown to tell me that I couldn't provide for my family.

00:21:12.280 And so with that conviction, um, I, I, I moved forward thinking, I know that this isn't

00:21:19.500 illegal if you will.

00:21:20.800 And I know that there are police officers out there who believe that it would be morally,

00:21:26.860 ethically and legally wrong to arrest me for doing someone's hair when I'm trying to feed

00:21:31.260 children.

00:21:32.000 And so I was taking the risk that eventually in court, this could be proven to be illegal.

00:21:38.540 But at this, at that point, I was so morally convicted that, that this was not the right

00:21:45.980 decision in America for Americans that I was acting more on those beliefs and convictions

00:21:52.100 than I was afraid of, you know, being put in handcuffs.

00:21:57.620 So what happened?

00:21:58.360 How long were you open and did they ever manage to shut you back down?

00:22:01.320 So the timeline, if I can recall, um, I did open, um, OSHA, Oregon OSHA came back.

00:22:08.980 I told them that they did have to get a warrant to come back.

00:22:11.160 Um, and they did, they got one, they came back and they were met with a lot of, um, supporters

00:22:16.540 who were blocking the entrance so that they couldn't get in.

00:22:19.440 And so, um, at that time being pro police, right.

00:22:24.780 I was asked, please keep the peace.

00:22:27.180 If you can, if you will cooperate with our investigation, we do have a warrant.

00:22:30.060 If you'll cooperate, we will not come down there where there could be violence and such

00:22:34.820 if you'll cooperate over the phone.

00:22:36.620 And so I did, um, upon the conclusion of that investigation, uh, they did issue me a

00:22:43.260 $14,000 citation.

00:22:45.200 Um, but in the course of that investigation, it took about, it took about five days.

00:22:49.540 I was visited.

00:22:50.800 Oh, I was, I was, I received email correspondence from the Oregon health licensing office, which

00:22:56.520 threatened to revoke my facility license and it threatened to revoke my license to do

00:23:02.360 hair, to be a hairstylist.

00:23:03.960 I received a notice from Oregon health authority that if I didn't shut down and cease service

00:23:10.080 that I would be issued a $50,000 fine or $5,000 a day, plus a class C misdemeanor.

00:23:17.200 Um, yeah, they released the full power of the Oregon state government.

00:23:21.660 They did.

00:23:22.220 Yeah.

00:23:22.800 And then, and this is the most, most shocking, and this is, you know, kind of what shocked

00:23:26.560 America and it still shocks me.

00:23:28.360 Um, but three days after I opened, uh, Oregon's child protective services showed up at my home.

00:23:34.680 Um, and they interviewed my child, uh, without me in the room.

00:23:39.420 They did a full inspection of my home, um, based on a complete, complete fabrication of

00:23:46.520 a report.

00:23:47.740 And, you know, to me, the timing is, is too ironic.

00:23:53.440 Um, the report was allegedly, you know, falsely called in the morning that I opened.

00:23:59.880 And so to me, it was like, they tried everything to shut me down and intimidate me.

00:24:05.740 And the last thing that they were going to do was come after my family.

00:24:08.480 Hmm.

00:24:10.100 Yeah.

00:24:10.640 What, how was that resolved?

00:24:13.640 Um, so I made it very public that they did that.

00:24:16.900 And some of the things that they were doing were illegal, like interviewing my children

00:24:20.620 without me present.

00:24:22.680 And, um, they, they wanted to come back and interview my three-year-old daughter.

00:24:28.360 And at that point I knew that I didn't have to cooperate with them.

00:24:31.180 So I said, no, and we filed a tort claim against them, letting them know that we would be

00:24:36.880 taking legal action against the, the organization.

00:24:40.540 And, um, they closed the case the day after that was released.

00:24:45.380 Wow.

00:24:46.380 Yeah.

00:24:46.780 So when, when did the salon close?

00:24:49.060 Um, so we did never, we never closed.

00:24:52.720 Um, I stayed open throughout all of that.

00:24:54.820 I never did.

00:24:55.480 I took the $14,000 citation from OSHA.

00:24:58.420 I said I was going to fight it.

00:24:59.580 And so as long as I'm in litigation with them, my doors are open.

00:25:04.580 And so we never closed back down.

00:25:06.980 We stayed open throughout all of that.

00:25:09.240 Wow.

00:25:10.080 And now are you allowed to be open?

00:25:13.600 So Kate Brown, her majesty allowed us to be open, uh, on May 18th, which was 13 days after

00:25:20.780 I opened and she didn't initially have us in the first phase reopening.

00:25:25.540 So I don't know if my civil disobedience let kind of shine some light on the idea that I'm

00:25:34.080 going to publicly not be shut down.

00:25:35.780 And so you better open up salons because everyone else is going to see that we can, we can be 0.99

00:25:39.780 open.

00:25:40.560 And she made sure that she wouldn't be embarrassed publicly.

00:25:44.380 Um, that's the way I like, that's how I like to think of it.

00:25:48.700 You know, their response is your County.

00:25:51.900 It's considered at extreme risk for potential spread and that, you know, business owners,

00:25:58.520 if, if a bunch of business owners did what you did, it would set the community back.

00:26:02.560 It would keep them in the extreme risk category longer than they had to be.

00:26:08.400 Well, I mean, of course I clearly disagree because those scientific quote unquote, you know,

00:26:17.020 that data that she's reading, she, she had opened salons, um, 20 minutes down the road

00:26:23.820 while I was, while I was defying the lockdown, she had opened the salons 20 minutes down the 1.00

00:26:28.600 road to think that someone from Salem, isn't going to drive 20 minutes and take their COVID 0.88

00:26:33.540 with them 20 minutes down the road is clearly ridiculous. 0.73

00:26:38.820 So all you're saying is you're trying to control, I mean, from the very beginning, you are a 0.95

00:26:44.720 governor and you're trying to control an act of God.

00:26:48.840 You're trying to control a virus. 0.97

00:26:51.080 There is no way anyone should think they have that much authority and the pure, um, ridiculousness

00:26:59.040 of her mandates and the, and the, and the idea that you can tell a virus what County they 0.97

00:27:04.460 can and can't cross is, is so asinine that it made it so much more unbelievable for me. 0.91

00:27:10.360 And it just, it strengthened my resolve.

00:27:13.460 So how are you doing now?

00:27:14.640 I feel like the attention may have made people perhaps more loyal to you.

00:27:19.420 Are you okay financially?

00:27:21.260 Cause I know obviously you suffered a hit.

00:27:24.080 Yes.

00:27:26.520 So, um, you get to be the first to know that, um, my family actually had to leave the state.

00:27:33.440 We, we had to move away.

00:27:35.260 Um, after, oh, I haven't talked about this so long.

00:27:41.820 Um, after I opened, you know, the cancel culture came at my salon pretty hard.

00:27:48.300 Um, I was called all kinds of names.

00:27:50.540 I was threatened.

00:27:51.260 Um, even just recently Antifa has started targeting me and tracking me.

00:27:56.300 Um, and after CPS came, um, and, you know, threatened to take our kids away.

00:28:02.260 We realized that we couldn't, we couldn't stay in Oregon.

00:28:05.040 It just, it wasn't safe.

00:28:06.400 So are you, are you, are you saying where, where you went, Texas?

00:28:13.440 Yeah.

00:28:14.000 You know, um, a red state.

00:28:15.460 I'll tell you that much.

00:28:16.760 Yeah.

00:28:17.700 Yeah.

00:28:18.060 I understand.

00:28:18.840 It's, it's hard to feel like your community loathes you.

00:28:22.400 It really, it is.

00:28:24.140 And that's, that's the weird place we've gotten to even, and listen, I mean, we saw people

00:28:28.680 on the left, um, pursuing acts that they referred to as civil disobedience many times

00:28:34.220 over last summer.

00:28:35.260 And they, they recovered a lot differently by people who might be judging you.

00:28:39.100 Up next, we're going to get into how Lindsey Graham wound up at the Capitol on January 6th

00:28:45.800 and the relationship she had with the press prior to that point and with Trump.

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00:30:16.340 And now back to Lindsay.

00:30:18.020 Can I ask you, Lindsay, because I know my producer told me that after all this, you were one of

00:30:28.480 the people who went and heard President Trump on, you know, this now infamous day of January

00:30:33.380 6th at the U.S. Capitol.

00:30:35.540 And I wonder, as somebody who was there, and I know there was a picture of you actually on

00:30:39.880 the Capitol steps that day, how do you see it?

00:30:43.020 How do you see what happened that day?

00:30:45.040 And also, before we get to that, why was it important to you to go?

00:30:48.460 Well, when I decided to go, and it was sort of last minute, I felt like something big

00:30:54.060 was happening in our country.

00:30:55.540 I felt like I was one of those kind of conspiracy theorists.

00:30:58.960 I thought Utrecht was going to pull something out of his sleeve.

00:31:00.980 I got to be there when that happens.

00:31:02.540 I need to be around my people, my people being Trump supporters, conservatives, Republicans.

00:31:07.400 I feel like it's a once-in-a-lifetime kind of day, and I don't think I can miss it.

00:31:13.940 And so I kind of rearranged my whole life to go.

00:31:15.760 And I thought that at the end of that night, we would be popping champagne bottles and chanting

00:31:21.800 Trump 2020.

00:31:23.500 And obviously, that's not what happened.

00:31:25.320 But that's why I went.

00:31:28.440 I wanted to be around my fellow conservatives when the moment came about that didn't actually

00:31:37.040 happen.

00:31:37.720 So that was a big disappointment.

00:31:38.880 But what happened there is, of course, as we're seeing so, so widespread in the media, nothing

00:31:48.060 like what they're making it out to be.

00:31:50.280 And that's a firsthand experience.

00:31:52.080 There were hundreds of thousands of people there that didn't know that some of the things

00:31:59.300 were going on, that the media is acting like it took over the rally.

00:32:04.220 This was what the rally was about, was sieging the Capitol and violence and the dishonesty that

00:32:12.200 took place amongst, quote, Trump supporters, to be labeled domestic terrorists.

00:32:18.080 It's such a slap in the face to the people like myself that all we're really, really, truly

00:32:25.560 doing is trying to get some truth out there, trying to get a conservative viewpoint out there

00:32:29.880 and trying to do what is actually best for America and Americans.

00:32:35.580 And to me, it just proves how big of a holy war we're in, that we're being silenced, that we're

00:32:41.580 being censored, that the people that are actually trying to do what's best for America and support

00:32:46.220 a great president are being labeled domestic terrorists and being cancel cultured and terrorized

00:32:53.700 by their own communities again.

00:32:55.420 Mm-hmm.

00:32:57.480 What do you, like, some of the reports were, of course, the people going there knew there would

00:33:02.560 be violence because there were online chat rooms and so on saying, bring your guns and bring the zip

00:33:08.220 ties and so on.

00:33:09.540 Had you seen any of that prior to that day?

00:33:13.420 No.

00:33:13.960 And I will tell you that I am very much a part of chat rooms and Trump supporters and

00:33:19.440 conservative feeds.

00:33:20.380 Because never once did I see, not once did I see someone saying, bring your guns, be

00:33:28.660 armed, wear your bulletproof vest.

00:33:30.820 This is, this is the day we take back America. 0.92

00:33:34.060 I mean, nowhere.

00:33:36.020 There was, if that were the case, I wouldn't have gone.

00:33:38.580 My husband would have told me, no, you're a mom, you stay home. 0.82

00:33:41.620 And I, I was thinking about my three children before I went there and I went, it's perfectly

00:33:45.700 safe.

00:33:46.120 It's a Trump rally.

00:33:47.000 We're going to wear American flag paraphernalia, we're going to chant USA and we're going to

00:33:51.960 walk around the Capitol and that's going to be that.

00:33:54.000 It was the safest trip I could imagine.

00:33:57.480 So no, I didn't see any, any situation where I felt like any Trump supporter was encouraging

00:34:04.040 or inciting violence.

00:34:05.000 And that includes Trump himself.

00:34:07.300 Were you surprised when, you know, you, you, I take it you, you went from his rally to the

00:34:14.040 Capitol because since you were at the Capitol, but were you surprised when other people started

00:34:17.900 to sort of rush in and the, and then, you know, there was some violence outside with

00:34:21.380 the cops, uh, based on what I saw on television with, um, them trying to hold back the crowd.

00:34:27.960 Right.

00:34:28.500 Um, I didn't actually see, um, that, you know, that surge of people when the doors opened,

00:34:34.460 um, people going in the Capitol, that was kind of shocking to me to hear that a, we were being

00:34:39.420 allowed in the Capitol, but be that it became violent once they were inside.

00:34:45.320 Um, and again, it's, it's, you would almost have to be there to understand the perspective

00:34:50.620 of like that happened in a tiny, tiny portion of the Capitol and the Capitol, as you can

00:34:55.340 imagine is massive.

00:34:56.560 And then hundreds of thousands of people are just outside taking selfies and playing music

00:35:00.940 and having a good time and waving their flags.

00:35:03.660 And they have no idea that in this little 1% of the crowd that these horrible things are

00:35:09.400 happening.

00:35:10.260 It was very, we were just ignorant to it and naive and, um, having not seen, you know, that

00:35:18.180 particular moment or this particular moment, it's like, you're trying to tackle what happened

00:35:22.260 to a child in Disneyland.

00:35:24.160 There's just no way that 99% of the people were even present for, for those moments.

00:35:31.040 What was the first inclination you had that things have had gone wrong?

00:35:36.160 Um, someone had said that a woman, and at that time there was all kinds of misinformation.

00:35:40.720 They had said a girl had gotten shot and I didn't even know what that would mean.

00:35:44.720 Um, someone said a 14 year old girl got shot, which is clearly not at all what happened.

00:35:49.920 Right.

00:35:50.560 Um, but I thought, you know, what's a 14 year old girl doing here? 0.96

00:35:53.700 First of all, and what did she do to get shot?

00:35:55.800 And where is this happening?

00:35:57.240 Cause we're just waving flags and chanting, where are people getting shot at?

00:36:01.200 Um, so I was like, well, that's not good.

00:36:04.580 Um, and then I did see quite a bit of the tear gas stuff happening.

00:36:09.620 So I imagined that there were things, um, happening up on that area.

00:36:13.900 And, um, I actually did get close enough to the area where the police were starting to

00:36:20.540 say, okay, you guys aren't even allowed to be here anymore.

00:36:22.160 And they started just tear gassing the general crowd.

00:36:24.800 And I managed to get tear, tear gassed as a, as a, a standby observer as well.

00:36:33.640 You never went inside.

00:36:35.600 No, no, definitely.

00:36:36.960 I was nowhere near being inside.

00:36:39.360 Um, which is, is, it's just, it's surreal to say, because when I watched the videos of

00:36:45.000 my, my, my fellow Trump supporters being escorted inside by the police, they, you know, they

00:36:51.380 opened the doors, they guide them inside.

00:36:53.340 There's even a video of one of the Capitol police helping an old lady up the stairs.

00:36:57.620 I think, you know, wrong place, wrong time.

00:37:00.320 Because if I would have been standing at that specific area and a, and a Capitol police officer

00:37:04.940 said, come on in, I would have thought, well, this is a once in a lifetime opportunity.

00:37:08.700 Also, I've never been to Washington DC.

00:37:10.860 You're going to let me in the Capitol.

00:37:12.500 I'm in, I would have walked in.

00:37:14.400 It just, it seemed, it was very clear in the videos that they were being welcomed in.

00:37:19.540 And so to know that two weeks later, the FBI would be calling you and saying, did you

00:37:26.080 storm the Capitol?

00:37:27.180 I would have been like, well, no, I was escorted in.

00:37:29.400 But just to think that, that, I don't know, the Trump supporters were sort of trapped in

00:37:33.920 a way.

00:37:34.220 They were welcomed in.

00:37:35.040 And now, you know, if you say you were there, the FBI wants to talk to you.

00:37:38.740 What about when you see the other videos?

00:37:40.340 You know, as a, as a, I too, I have law enforcement in my family and I know, um, you're supportive,

00:37:46.720 but like when I saw those videos of them beating the cop and the cop, like struggling to breathe

00:37:52.880 as he was trying to get out of the crowd.

00:37:54.480 And now, you know, we know a cop died.

00:37:57.200 Like I was horrified.

00:37:58.700 I, it was so upsetting.

00:37:59.940 And I, I mean, what did you feel when you saw that?

00:38:03.180 Cause it wasn't all peaceful Trump supporters as, as you know.

00:38:06.960 No, it was, I mean, it wasn't, it definitely wasn't.

00:38:09.180 The videos don't lie.

00:38:10.320 You can't create, the media can try to create an agenda for the entire group, but you can't

00:38:14.860 create an agenda for that specific moment.

00:38:16.860 Um, I would never, ever in my life condone that sort of behavior.

00:38:21.240 And I didn't see the video of that.

00:38:23.160 Um, I probably wouldn't want to, it would, it would kind of break my heart.

00:38:27.200 Um, but I do know, or I've heard that it happened and I do believe that there were people there

00:38:32.040 that made some very, very, very poor choices.

00:38:36.000 Um, they went there potentially with the idea that yes, this was the day that they were going

00:38:40.900 to take the, they take our country back quite, quite literally.

00:38:45.400 Um, and knowing that the Capitol police had to face that is disturbing.

00:38:53.280 Um, especially with the repercussions of that, knowing that if you are a Trump supporter,

00:38:57.980 um, and you, and you took, you partook in that kind of behavior and you ruined it for everyone.

00:39:04.680 Um, there, there should be some, there should be some guilt there because that's never been

00:39:10.780 the way of Trump supporters.

00:39:12.520 That's never been the actions of a Patriot.

00:39:15.800 Um, and there was no way that that specific day, anyone in the very many people in the

00:39:23.020 crowd believed that we were going to arm up and quite literally take back the Capitol.

00:39:27.900 Oh yeah.

00:39:28.220 The media has been talking about the group as, as if it's one with one motivation and that's,

00:39:32.920 that's unfair.

00:39:34.020 Um, you know, that's, that's, that's obviously unfair, but can I back up?

00:39:37.920 Cause I do think you're an interesting person to talk to you about this because we've heard

00:39:41.620 so much, so many assumptions put on the Trump supporters who were there that day.

00:39:46.700 And as somebody who was one of them, you know, who was not, not storming the Capitol, but

00:39:50.940 present and, and you, you know, I'd love to know what you think and, and sort of how you

00:39:55.320 got to the point because you said I was a conspiracy theorist and I really thought he was going

00:39:59.920 to pull something out of the hat and turn the election around that day.

00:40:02.920 And somehow with the lawmakers, I assume you mean, but like how, how did, what made you

00:40:08.340 believe that?

00:40:09.040 Right.

00:40:09.200 People are sort of trying to retrace what made you believe that?

00:40:12.460 Um, I just, I try to take in as much information as I can.

00:40:15.080 And it, it made sense to me that in my own mind, that if you want to try to steal an election,

00:40:22.120 um, from, you know, a Senator or whatever, uh, that you're probably going to get away

00:40:27.840 with it, but to steal an election.

00:40:29.600 And I, and I do believe it was stolen to steal an election from an acting president that takes

00:40:34.620 a lot of guts.

00:40:35.640 And I feel like that the president, the standing president would have some sort of, you know,

00:40:40.380 executive branch that we don't know about to handle these kinds of things, because to

00:40:44.240 me, that's completely treason.

00:40:46.340 And so as I'm getting more and more information from conservatives who've done some legal background,

00:40:51.700 um, looked into the constitution, who've looked into, you know, these different branches

00:40:55.420 of the presidency, it made sense to me that there's no way they're going to get away with

00:41:00.440 this president Trump will never let them get away with this.

00:41:03.720 And so I, I felt that just led me to just watch more and more of these people with their

00:41:09.960 ideas.

00:41:11.140 Um, and I don't know, I don't know what happened, why he couldn't, I don't know how, I don't

00:41:18.020 know how the election could have been stolen to the extreme that it was and the evidence

00:41:21.800 so blatantly disregarded.

00:41:24.120 Um, but you know, the conservatives that kind of kept feeding information here and there about

00:41:29.660 it, it made sense to me.

00:41:31.520 And so I, I just believed in my heart that that the good would prevail, that the truth

00:41:35.520 would be revealed.

00:41:37.100 Right.

00:41:37.880 Do you like, were you watching cable or was it internet?

00:41:41.780 Like, do you, do you mind helping me understand the sources?

00:41:44.300 Because I tell you, I am an honest broker here.

00:41:47.480 I genuinely seek to understand.

00:41:49.300 I understand the mainstream media is not trustworthy anymore.

00:41:51.880 And I'm trying to understand where conservatives are going to get their news.

00:41:56.240 And I also want to understand how so many people who were on the Capitol that day, really

00:42:01.040 like you believed he could turn it around.

00:42:03.600 Right.

00:42:04.160 I think, um, what we've started doing, unfortunately, is just listening to each other.

00:42:09.140 So Instagram, Facebook, I mean, we're being largely censored now.

00:42:13.560 So I, I just actually went to look up, you know, three or four Patriots that I met at

00:42:17.900 the Capitol that day and their, their profiles are completely gone.

00:42:21.980 Um, but what I was doing was listening to my like-minded Americans.

00:42:26.360 Okay.

00:42:26.820 We believe that the election was stolen.

00:42:28.760 What do we think is going to happen?

00:42:29.860 And that's, I mean, that's obviously.

00:42:31.420 How would you find them?

00:42:32.480 Like, how would you find them?

00:42:33.480 Um, so for me, I would, I would go on Instagram and I would, you know, type in a hashtag Patriot

00:42:38.420 or hashtag stop the steal or a hashtag Trump 2020.

00:42:40.860 And then I would find those people and kind of see where they fit in the conservative family.

00:42:47.580 And then, you know, once you follow them, you start to see their information.

00:42:52.320 And so much of it seems legit.

00:42:54.020 I know it's not news and I know it's not reputable and I know it's not fact.

00:42:57.260 Um, but, but I have learned that there is no fact out there anymore.

00:43:01.920 There is no truth out there, period, even on the mainstream media, especially on the

00:43:05.300 mainstream media.

00:43:06.040 And so where do I get the page that I trust?

00:43:09.640 Um, nowhere is the answer really.

00:43:11.880 So then I just kind of have to think for myself.

00:43:14.020 Most conservatives who get to that place first, their first stop is Fox or maybe now

00:43:18.960 Newsmax, you know, some for some OAN.

00:43:22.300 Did you, did you stop there at all before going to Insta and Facebook?

00:43:27.260 Uh, Newsmax and OAN is what I'm, I've decided is more reliable.

00:43:32.720 Um, gosh, I, I dive so deep into it that sometimes it's, it's overwhelming because there's

00:43:39.240 so much information out there.

00:43:41.060 Um, OAN is, is, is a broadcast that I would trust.

00:43:46.000 Um, but a lot of the times you kind of get, um, they're, they're very careful because they,

00:43:51.620 as real reporters should be, they, they need to be discerning about what they put out

00:43:55.200 as factual.

00:43:55.780 And so it's, it's almost like I was looking for seeking out the conspiracy theory to kind

00:44:02.900 of validate that.

00:44:03.940 I think I was, I was trying to not have to accept that Biden is going to be our president.

00:44:08.060 And so a lot of the times I would just go to the people who I thought, well, they've

00:44:12.420 already done all that research for me.

00:44:14.060 And then they've put it all into this one little video.

00:44:15.740 So I'm going to just watch that one video so that I'm not obsessively sitting at the

00:44:19.800 computer trying to figure out what's happening to our country.

00:44:22.380 Does that make sense?

00:44:23.760 How do you feel now?

00:44:24.660 Yeah, totally.

00:44:25.420 I I'm following you, but how do you feel now?

00:44:27.560 Do you feel like that was a mistake?

00:44:28.960 Do you regret that?

00:44:31.180 No, no, no, no.

00:44:31.920 I don't regret it.

00:44:32.620 Mostly because I didn't do anything to regret.

00:44:35.940 Right.

00:44:36.200 If, if I had believed in my heart that the conspiracy was true and it was my job to storm

00:44:42.460 the Capitol and take back the country, I would probably have a lot of regrets right now.

00:44:46.120 I still went to the rally.

00:44:47.740 I, I, my voice was heard.

00:44:49.160 My, my pajama onesies were seen.

00:44:51.300 My flag was waved and it was, it's going to be a once in a lifetime experience for a very

00:44:56.620 different reason than I anticipated.

00:44:58.720 Um, but I didn't do anything regretful.

00:45:00.820 Um, it gave me a little bit of hope for a few days and that you can't really regret

00:45:04.640 that Biden, unfortunately is, is president and that's really too bad, but there's nowhere

00:45:11.240 really to go, but to try to take care of our own family and kind of proceed forward.

00:45:15.820 Do you feel like you were misled now?

00:45:19.500 Um, not, not intentionally.

00:45:22.460 I mean, I was misled because I, I did listen to and follow information that obviously didn't

00:45:28.040 happen, but I don't think anyone that I followed had the intention of, you know, creating discourse

00:45:33.240 or creating violence or inciting violence or trying to mislead me.

00:45:36.520 I think that they felt like I felt like that truly something was going to be revealed that,

00:45:41.740 that good would prevail and that this is kind of our last hope to hang on to before, you

00:45:46.700 know, this, this horrible president is inaugurated in.

00:45:49.320 Do you, what do you think of, because there are a lot of people who think president Trump

00:45:54.120 was irresponsible in his messaging on this, uh, leading people to believe that, for example,

00:45:59.840 Mike Pence had powers he didn't really have.

00:46:02.340 Is that fair?

00:46:04.540 Uh, to, to know the, to say that I, I, I feel like I would need way more legal knowledge

00:46:13.760 than I definitely have.

00:46:15.340 And so, I mean, up until it happened, I, I believed that, that he had the power to, to

00:46:22.200 take control of the situation.

00:46:23.480 Clearly he doesn't or, or he does, but that's being hidden.

00:46:26.960 I don't know.

00:46:29.120 Yeah.

00:46:29.540 How did you feel when that, when that, so when that particular house of cards came down and

00:46:33.500 you realized it's not happening, how did that feel?

00:46:38.480 Uh, pretty, pretty devastating.

00:46:40.480 I mean, I was in the middle of the rally, waving my flag and finding out that I'm waving

00:46:43.940 a flag for the president that I love that is not going to be reelected.

00:46:50.220 Um, so it was very disappointing.

00:46:52.420 I would, I would, I would say it felt like at that moment that the crowd sort of kind of

00:46:55.980 lost their resolve.

00:46:57.680 Um, it was very disappointing.

00:46:59.480 What, what was the moment?

00:47:02.200 Oh, when, um, you know, I was telling you that there was just chatter.

00:47:05.200 Um, and we, none of us could get internet service.

00:47:08.420 Uh, they had, I don't know if they'd shut down the internet or the phones were just clogged,

00:47:11.980 but the chatter amongst the rally kind of like telephone, if you will, was that Mike Pence

00:47:18.280 didn't, he certified the results.

00:47:20.920 And so we were all there waiting for him to, like I said, pull an ace out of his sleeve

00:47:26.380 and there was no ace.

00:47:28.160 So that was that.

00:47:30.120 Did you feel like a lot of people who believed he had that power felt betrayed by him that

00:47:34.340 day?

00:47:34.680 I think, you know, Trump definitely fanned that particular fire, but what do you think

00:47:38.480 about Mike Pence now?

00:47:40.160 Oh, I think that if he had the power and he didn't take it, um, that we should be as disappointed

00:47:47.420 in him as, as we are.

00:47:49.080 Um, if he didn't have the power, then I think he'd be put in an impossible situation that

00:47:53.200 to be quite honest, he never should have been put in and that we have plenty of other people

00:47:57.360 to blame for putting him in that position.

00:47:59.900 More with Lindsay in just one second.

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00:49:36.960 We covered the electoral challenges on our show with an open mind.

00:49:41.880 As a lawyer, I wanted to see if he had the goods, right?

00:49:44.900 Like, let's go into these courts and see what Rudy Giuliani, Sidney Powell can present.

00:49:49.660 But what I found was whenever asked for the fraud evidence in front of a judge, Rudy would

00:49:56.920 say, this isn't a fraud case.

00:49:58.420 We don't have it.

00:49:59.680 But in front of a microphone, he would say fraud, fraud, fraud.

00:50:02.800 But you can't lie to a judge for the ethical rules of being a lawyer.

00:50:06.640 And so to me, that was powerful evidence.

00:50:09.300 I also thought it was interesting that people like Andy McCarthy, who voted for Trump, he's

00:50:12.560 a right-leaning lawyer, he found the same.

00:50:15.900 You know, he analyzed each one of the lawsuits that was filed.

00:50:18.580 So had you heard any of that?

00:50:21.540 And what do you think of that?

00:50:24.060 You know, I hadn't heard of that specifically until after the rally.

00:50:27.500 I want to say even after the inauguration is when only one person had posted something

00:50:34.280 about that.

00:50:35.480 And she said, keep an open mind when you read this.

00:50:37.440 And I read it and I thought, well, that's interesting.

00:50:39.040 And I kind of went to trying to pretend that I'm a lawyer, which I'm very, very much not.

00:50:43.420 And thought, well, is there some side effect that would happen if you said that was fraud?

00:50:50.920 Meaning if you alleged that there was fraud, would you have to name the person in charge

00:50:55.860 of creating that fraud?

00:50:56.820 And so is that why Rudy Giuliani didn't say that there was fraud because they didn't know

00:51:00.360 who they could name because it was so widespread?

00:51:02.380 And again, I'm not a lawyer.

00:51:05.120 So I sort of took that and said, well, OK, so, you know, maybe there's fraud.

00:51:09.880 Maybe there wasn't.

00:51:10.480 I was led to believe there was.

00:51:11.640 I could very much be wrong.

00:51:12.740 I have no problem admitting I'm wrong.

00:51:14.960 Either way, it's over now.

00:51:17.540 So I'm going to just accept, you know, my this this communist life.

00:51:22.920 So now how do you feel?

00:51:26.360 Do you feel like do you trust Rudy Giuliani?

00:51:29.460 Oh, well, yes.

00:51:32.800 And until until we know what his intentions were for saying that, you know, in certain

00:51:39.620 situations and then not saying it in other situations, I wouldn't mind hearing the reasoning

00:51:44.000 for that.

00:51:46.400 No, I'm just I'm just taking it one day at a time, probably like the rest of my conservative

00:51:50.820 friends.

00:51:51.280 And I say this without any judgment.

00:51:54.180 So please take in that spirit.

00:51:55.300 But do you do you regret putting your trust in these folks on the Internet who misled you?

00:52:06.000 No, I don't.

00:52:08.160 Again, because I don't feel like they they may have misled me unknowingly.

00:52:14.580 I don't think that was their intention.

00:52:16.220 And I think that they were just trying to put information out there.

00:52:19.460 We're all trying to we're all trying to counter the mainstream media who's so severely saying

00:52:24.340 one thing that we're no longer OK with being quiet.

00:52:27.840 And so we need to severely say the other thing.

00:52:30.840 This is where everyone keeps saying America needs to unite.

00:52:33.680 Right.

00:52:33.840 We both need to take it down a notch and meet in the middle.

00:52:36.160 But that's not going to be possible until the liberal left wing media stops so severely

00:52:43.120 pushing their agenda that we don't feel that we need to be on the utmost defense saying

00:52:49.020 the complete opposite thing at all times.

00:52:51.640 And so what I think happened was I think conservatives thought, don't you tell us that Biden's going

00:52:56.220 to be president?

00:52:56.800 He's not.

00:52:57.400 And this is this is what's going to happen.

00:52:59.000 And we have faith that this is what's going to happen.

00:53:01.320 And, you know, had I had I taken that information and done something regrettable, then I would

00:53:06.620 regret it.

00:53:07.320 But I didn't I didn't take that information and do anything regrettable besides making a

00:53:13.840 few posts that, you know, Trump's Trump's the rightful president.

00:53:17.020 Well, obviously, he's not.

00:53:18.300 So I look like a dum-dum, but that's no skin off my back.

00:53:21.640 Do you know?

00:53:23.580 And listen, I've been very critical of the mainstream media, so I'm not going to I'm

00:53:27.100 not going to disagree that they are they were they had Trump arrangement syndrome.

00:53:31.680 However, do you think it's possible that you and the group that you're talking about

00:53:36.400 me have overcorrected, right?

00:53:37.880 Like you go too far the other way, like maybe if you guys went to a 10, if the mainstream

00:53:41.920 media is at a two or a three, maybe you should have stopped at a seven.

00:53:46.460 Do you know what I'm saying?

00:53:49.120 Yeah, I mean, I definitely.

00:53:50.520 I definitely believe it was overbored.

00:53:53.680 I myself was totally overbored.

00:53:55.140 I was talking to my husband, telling him all these things I believe are going to happen.

00:53:59.200 He's shaking his head going, honey, you're just a mom and a business owner. 0.71

00:54:05.400 You're not a conspiracy theorist.

00:54:08.260 Yes.

00:54:08.740 I mean, I definitely think it was it was totally overblown and it's laughable now.

00:54:13.040 Um, but I think it was just it was people that were desperate for something to hope for.

00:54:17.840 We were desperate for hope.

00:54:19.900 Um, and not that that hope is gone, but it's it's quieted down quite a bit.

00:54:24.720 Um, but we're just we're hoping for something that's going to change America because whatever

00:54:31.580 is whatever is being done is not working.

00:54:33.520 It's making it worse.

00:54:34.260 And do you yeah, I saw some tape of some some women and some men I was actually I saw it.

00:54:40.980 It was a clip from OAN that I saw online and they were actually saying things like I would

00:54:45.520 die for President Trump.

00:54:47.400 I was taken aback by that.

00:54:49.100 I know people love him and they love him dearly.

00:54:50.760 But like I was taken aback by that.

00:54:52.880 What what do you think of that as somebody who's a diehard?

00:54:55.620 Yeah, we need we need to be careful what we what we say about President Trump, because

00:55:00.720 the media is already trying to say that we are a cult and we are fanatics and we now we're

00:55:07.280 domestic terrorists.

00:55:08.960 Um, I don't think I would I don't think I would die for President Trump.

00:55:12.900 I I would die for my children.

00:55:15.100 Um, but saying things like that being a little too radical and I don't want to sound like I'm

00:55:20.680 criticizing that person if she he or she truly believes that they would die for Trump.

00:55:24.820 And that's their feeling.

00:55:26.440 But to put that on record may just encourage the media even more to say how insanely radical

00:55:33.200 all Trump supporters are.

00:55:36.260 And it's terrible that we have to think that closely about what we say, because the left

00:55:40.040 can say whatever they want.

00:55:41.760 And it's it's God speaking.

00:55:43.860 It's God.

00:55:44.260 It's it's biblical.

00:55:45.580 But anything we say can be so convoluted and twisted and it's just going to feed their

00:55:50.480 agenda.

00:55:50.820 And so I, for one, and I'm pretty outspoken, obviously, and, um, probably will say things

00:55:58.580 that should be maybe not have been said or could be misconstrued.

00:56:03.200 But I would like to say that I'm going to be a little more careful about the things being

00:56:07.800 said now that the media is intentionally targeting Trump supporters as, you know, quote, terrorists.

00:56:13.120 Well, how do you how do you feel about that, about Trump being booted from Twitter, about

00:56:17.840 Parler being shut down, about videos that suggest widespread voter fraud being banned

00:56:23.160 now from Facebook, YouTube?

00:56:25.900 I mean, being a person who's now been censored, it's pretty devastating.

00:56:30.720 I mean, they they actually took your voice away and I didn't even have that many followers.

00:56:35.820 I mean, imagine being the president of the United States and social media has become the

00:56:41.160 way that you speak your opinion and say what you need to say to the people that support

00:56:46.380 you and they just took it away.

00:56:48.880 It's it's I mean, legally, I can understand that legally it's their platform and they have

00:56:55.440 the right to have community standards, which look like BS to me.

00:57:01.880 But as a person, it's it's pretty devastating to just kind of have your opinion removed because

00:57:11.780 someone else's opinion says that your opinion doesn't matter.

00:57:14.080 Are you scared that you're going to lose the ability to express your opinion or get the

00:57:20.800 opinions of people you respect online?

00:57:23.620 Oh, absolutely.

00:57:24.440 I've I've my Instagram has already been disabled and deleted.

00:57:28.520 I can't log back into it.

00:57:29.640 They removed all my contacts.

00:57:31.060 They removed all my content, all my followers.

00:57:33.900 The username is there, but I can't log into it.

00:57:36.860 So they have silenced me and I've had to start completely over.

00:57:40.300 And they did so at a time when my voice was really starting to be heard.

00:57:44.080 And so I didn't violate community standards.

00:57:48.780 Some of the some of the posts that they were flagging as hate speech were not even I mean,

00:57:53.500 there were pictures of me in my American flag pajamas.

00:57:57.540 So it's like, you know, where's the where's the supervision of these people deciding whose

00:58:04.080 opinion does or doesn't matter?

00:58:05.460 So I'm terrified that I'm going to be silenced the louder I get.

00:58:08.920 It's more terrifying.

00:58:10.720 And as soon as I get that warning now, what do you do now?

00:58:14.100 Like what what where do you go now for information?

00:58:17.820 Oh, well, since being silenced and that was I mean, that was only like two or three days

00:58:22.780 ago.

00:58:23.080 So I've sort of had to like step back and say, OK, do I regroup and like start all over,

00:58:29.360 which is what I've decided to do as of yesterday, which is very debilitating.

00:58:35.220 I'm going to have to continue to use whatever platforms arise that are going to be less censored

00:58:41.820 and less, less way they target conservatives.

00:58:47.580 So, I mean, both Facebook and Instagram have targeted my page and my fellow patriots pages

00:58:53.160 saying that they're going to be removed or deleted and then they've actually been removed

00:58:57.620 or deleted.

00:58:58.020 So there needs to be a new platform really that is more focused on conservatives.

00:59:04.680 And unfortunately, like I said, this is where the extremism comes in, because if you had

00:59:08.220 a platform that across the board kind of said, well, I guess Antifa can say whatever they

00:59:13.740 want because we're not controlling it.

00:59:15.240 And I guess patriots can say whatever they want because we're not controlling it.

00:59:17.960 You are going to get a lot of a lot of things being said that, you know, as a platform,

00:59:23.340 you may not agree with, but so far Instagram and Facebook have been so radically biased

00:59:29.060 against conservatives.

00:59:30.520 Again, like I'm saying, they'll let Antifa target and post pictures of business owners

00:59:35.500 and passively incite violence against these people, you know, posting their business, posting

00:59:42.060 where they work, their work address, things like that.

00:59:45.140 And that flag that for hate speech and it will not get removed.

00:59:48.560 But then you've got Lucy Graham over here, Patriot Barbie, holding a sign at a Trump rally 0.99

00:59:53.160 wearing pajamas and that gets flagged for hate speech.

00:59:57.140 And so now it said, stop the steal.

01:00:00.760 Okay.

01:00:01.860 Yeah.

01:00:02.860 So that's it.

01:00:05.040 Do you.

01:00:06.100 So, okay.

01:00:06.960 Well, I just want to ask a couple of other questions.

01:00:09.200 Thank you for being so generous with your time.

01:00:10.780 I know this went long, but what do you think now about President Trump?

01:00:15.280 Because of course, his detractors and much of the media say he's done.

01:00:19.900 There's no way he can run again.

01:00:20.960 And the party needs new blood, too.

01:00:23.940 I heard that.

01:00:24.900 What how do you see him now?

01:00:27.040 You know, I believe he's been a fighter for America, not for his own personal vendetta

01:00:32.080 or agenda, but for Americans.

01:00:35.080 And so that I mean, he has endured a lot during his presidency.

01:00:39.160 He's been the worst, in my opinion, the worst treated president we've ever seen.

01:00:42.640 And I think social media has a lot to do with that and the mainstream media.

01:00:45.740 And so I don't I think that after he's been through what he's been through as the president,

01:00:50.280 if he can endure that, I don't think he's going to stop.

01:00:53.720 And I don't know what that means for him, whether it's to go into another branch of the government

01:00:59.880 or to start his own.

01:01:02.080 Maybe he's got to start his own social media platform.

01:01:03.840 That would be great.

01:01:04.340 I don't know what that means for him, but I don't have I have a lot of respect for President

01:01:10.540 Trump.

01:01:10.940 He has endured a lot.

01:01:12.060 He's continued to fight when he's been the most violently attacked, you know, on social

01:01:18.220 media.

01:01:19.280 And he's done it all for Americans.

01:01:21.920 And so for that, I respect him a lot.

01:01:24.060 And I'm I'm still going to support, you know, whatever adventure he takes on for America.

01:01:29.420 Who else could you get behind?

01:01:30.540 Just curious for like 2024.

01:01:32.460 Oh, man, I could get behind probably either of his sons or daughters who have just as

01:01:41.200 much resilience and stamina and patriotism.

01:01:44.460 I could get behind his press press secretary, Kayleigh.

01:01:52.560 I could get behind some of the Republicans in in government now, like Matt Gaetz, that have

01:02:01.380 just so publicly and bravely stood up for him when it was clear that the trend was to condemn

01:02:07.120 him, because I've been that person who stood up against what everyone else says is wrong.

01:02:15.000 And that's a very, very hard place to be standing in the middle of, you know, all of your your

01:02:21.680 fellow colleagues and say, I know that you all believe we should impeach him.

01:02:25.260 But here's why I don't think you should.

01:02:26.880 And here's why I shame you for doing so.

01:02:28.540 That takes a lot, a lot of bravery and a lot of future endurance of hate and cancel culture

01:02:38.140 and such.

01:02:38.720 So I respect anyone that had that kind of bravery.

01:02:41.920 What do you think of Ted Cruz?

01:02:44.240 I don't know much about Ted Cruz.

01:02:46.440 I try to get information here, here and there.

01:02:49.340 But Ted Cruz is someone that you'd have to refresh my memory about his status right now.

01:02:55.040 OK, I was just as curious because he was sort of he ran against Trump, but then he kind of

01:02:59.160 went pro-Trump and he was going to argue a Supreme Court case challenging the election.

01:03:03.220 But the Supreme Court didn't take it and so on.

01:03:05.220 So, you know, I just wondered.

01:03:07.960 So let me so let me ask you this.

01:03:10.980 If if if I were to come to you and say, Lindsay, you have to help me solve this problem.

01:03:17.360 You have to help me reach people in your circles who who really, really believed that the election

01:03:25.560 was going to be overturned that day.

01:03:26.900 And and that wasn't true.

01:03:28.920 And how are we going to get them to trust?

01:03:32.840 Media again, how are we going to get them out of the place where they feel their only

01:03:37.460 options for, quote, real news are Insta and Facebook posts?

01:03:41.860 What would your solution be?

01:03:43.940 Oh, boy.

01:03:44.520 I would say that every network needs to have some kind of accountability department where

01:03:51.860 I mean, I just read I just read on an article where some some news station had, you know,

01:03:59.020 their entire staff was registered Democrat.

01:04:01.880 And so if there was some kind of accountability where the corporation or the business or the

01:04:07.640 association itself had to have a variety of political opinions.

01:04:12.780 And mind you, I don't believe that the U.S.

01:04:15.120 is divided between Republicans and Democrats.

01:04:17.180 I believe that we all have multiple areas of opinion and somehow we've gotten divided between

01:04:23.480 Republican and Democrat.

01:04:25.240 But I think that if each news news station had different different opinions on their panels

01:04:32.260 that they had to consult with and each person got to say, look, I think that that's biased.

01:04:36.640 You're taking this article, but your headline is saying this and your headline is leading

01:04:41.300 people to believe that the article is going to be positive about this, but it's negative

01:04:45.240 about this.

01:04:46.700 And I've experienced that for myself.

01:04:48.420 I've sat down and done interviews and the things that I've said, they've somehow twisted

01:04:52.120 it into me being, you know, X, Y, Z.

01:04:54.400 And so if you had accountability there and people started to see, OK, here's one reporter

01:04:59.260 reading the story this way and here's another reporter reading the story this way.

01:05:02.340 They both have facts, but the way that they're saying them and the way that they're twisting

01:05:05.160 them and the way that they're presenting them are very, very different.

01:05:08.320 Now we've got both sides and I can choose for myself which side I believe is the most,

01:05:13.700 you know, accurate.

01:05:15.580 And then you'd have you'd have conservatives saying, OK, we've got you know, we've got

01:05:20.740 both sides of the story.

01:05:21.540 We've got both people reporting.

01:05:23.300 They're being fair about it.

01:05:25.060 Now we don't have to be so extreme the other way.

01:05:28.020 Everything could just be presented fairly and presented.

01:05:30.520 Um, without so much bias, we'd be there.

01:05:35.520 There'd be people way more likely to tune in, listen to both sides and and choose for

01:05:41.560 themselves.

01:05:43.160 You know, the most factual.

01:05:45.880 Another question for you, I will tell you, I'm I don't judge or feel the need to, you

01:05:51.180 know, get into your beliefs about what you heard in the news, except for one thing.

01:05:55.560 Um, Mike Pence never did have the power to overturn that election.

01:06:01.040 And and I do feel that people were misled about that, that that the president of the

01:06:07.820 Senate, which is what he was doing there that day, is is a presider, not a decider.

01:06:13.500 And he he never did have the power to overturn the vote.

01:06:17.480 And I I thought it was unfair to the Trump supporters who who did have legitimate questions

01:06:23.480 in a lot of cases about mail in voting at a greater level than ever and whether they

01:06:29.420 were really processed fairly.

01:06:30.700 And, you know, was was everything handled fairly?

01:06:33.800 Um, but that that was a lie.

01:06:38.920 And I just wonder whether I hope you accept my representation to you.

01:06:44.880 And I wonder if it like.

01:06:48.160 If I were to say to you, what about broadening out your sources in getting news?

01:06:54.000 You know, what about I'll tell you what I do every day because I don't trust the mainstream

01:06:57.500 media either.

01:06:58.280 I'm not I'm not arguing on their behalf.

01:07:00.440 Um, every morning I go to this website, real clear politics dot com, and it has editorials

01:07:06.760 from the left and the right pro Trump, anti Trump.

01:07:08.960 It's got them all.

01:07:09.720 And I I know it's hard work, but I have to read.

01:07:12.520 I have to read both so I can figure out what the facts are.

01:07:15.340 I mean, you could skip that step and just listen to me.

01:07:17.080 But but if you want to do it yourself because you sound like you you do read a lot, you could

01:07:22.700 do that.

01:07:23.100 But I I do wonder, you know, in this era of information, whether we should all be more

01:07:28.560 protective about what we put in, you know, what we allow in, because I do think it's

01:07:34.320 warping people's sense of reality in some cases.

01:07:37.960 What do you think?

01:07:39.220 I would I would agree with you 100 percent.

01:07:41.200 I would like to point out that I just give you a really good idea about news, but it already

01:07:44.800 exists.

01:07:45.980 Yeah, that's the story of my life.

01:07:48.180 I've always got these, you know, million dollar ideas and someone's already thought of them.

01:07:51.260 But yes, I agree.

01:07:53.880 I I used to be a very I wouldn't say middle of the road, you know, in politics.

01:07:59.320 I've always been right leaning conservative, but I've always are used to be very open minded

01:08:07.040 about side A and side B.

01:08:09.940 And honestly, I'd like to get back to that point where I'm at now.

01:08:14.660 There was just such a line drawn in the sand for me when I opened my business.

01:08:18.460 And, you know, the left attacked me and the right supported me.

01:08:22.060 I sort of decided, well, these are my people and I'm going to I'm going to stay over here

01:08:25.540 with them.

01:08:26.660 But you're right.

01:08:27.660 That's not that's not the best way to get to to gather information is to only listen to

01:08:33.500 people who are thinking like you.

01:08:35.300 I'm completely aware of that.

01:08:38.260 And honestly, I will be writing down that website that you said, because to me, that that's

01:08:43.980 exactly what I'd like to hear is I'd like to hear both sides and then decide for myself.

01:08:47.660 And it isn't it isn't going to be the best decision for anyone to only listen to what

01:08:56.920 is going to feed your agenda.

01:08:59.060 And that is what I've been doing quite a bit of.

01:09:01.660 Well, and especially especially, Lindsay, when you're in a vulnerable state, you you have

01:09:07.400 been made vulnerable through no actions of your own.

01:09:12.560 And what's been done to you by the state, it's unfair.

01:09:17.840 And I understand the need for the lockdowns initially and you obeyed them.

01:09:21.820 But it's really hard to ask any American who's worked her whole life to establish her businesses

01:09:27.240 and employ some people and take care of her children and who's the mother of a newborn 0.96

01:09:30.560 baby to just let it all slip away and then trust the establishment that's sitting back in

01:09:36.140 judgment of her.

01:09:37.740 And I just I'm to me, that's the bigger picture is that you had a you had a rough year.

01:09:43.980 And maybe maybe you got pulled into some information circles that that weren't trustworthy.

01:09:50.100 And it's just something to consider as you're getting back on your feet, right?

01:09:54.080 Because you're you're the master of your ship.

01:09:56.160 You'll decide which way to steer it.

01:09:59.360 I love that.

01:09:59.840 I love that analogy.

01:10:00.740 And yes, you're right.

01:10:02.160 I've I've had a year of trying to discover who I am again and having to rethink my whole

01:10:08.180 life and start our family fresh somewhere.

01:10:10.000 And this fresh person is has developed a very biased, you know, kind of one sided, if you

01:10:18.840 will.

01:10:19.180 I still have some great plenty of gray areas, trust me, in my beliefs.

01:10:22.200 But you are right.

01:10:24.140 I've kind of leaned toward, OK, well, when I put myself out there and, you know, in the

01:10:28.840 main circle of people, I opened myself up to the the cancel culture and the lefts who

01:10:35.500 would come at me with just name calling and attacking and violence and threats.

01:10:39.740 And then I've got my patients over here who have nothing but nice things to say about me.

01:10:44.300 And so for me, yeah, it's been kind of a safety net.

01:10:47.380 Like, OK, well, you you go away.

01:10:48.740 I'm not listening to you anymore.

01:10:49.960 All you're doing is calling me names anyway.

01:10:51.840 And I'm only going to listen over here.

01:10:53.260 I think once I can kind of find that balance of, you know, where my life is now and after

01:10:59.180 what I've been through, which is, I mean, still ongoing, it'd be nice to settle somewhere

01:11:03.840 back in the middle where I feel safe enough, if you will, to sort of explore all all those

01:11:10.380 all those outlets.

01:11:12.860 Well, I think it's great that you essentially took a risk just telling your story to me and

01:11:17.140 telling and being honest about your feelings and how you consume information.

01:11:20.660 I think you're helping people by being open about that.

01:11:24.460 And it's it's not for anyone to judge.

01:11:26.100 It's it's an interesting case to sort of dissect and think about.

01:11:29.740 And, you know, now you sort of having the big reveal at the end.

01:11:34.100 Right.

01:11:34.300 Like there was there was no rabbit in the hat.

01:11:36.740 There was nothing.

01:11:37.720 Right.

01:11:38.200 So you can think, too.

01:11:39.260 You can think, too, about how'd I get there?

01:11:41.900 Right.

01:11:43.000 Right.

01:11:43.360 And, you know, one of the things that I would love to say to the left, to liberals,

01:11:49.320 I can't say to them because they're so busy attacking and calling names.

01:11:53.720 But if you've got, you know, a person, a liberal or left left wing that's listening to something

01:11:58.560 like this and saying, OK, so, you know, the majority of the people in our party are attacking

01:12:05.100 so, so ferociously that they're not even listening.

01:12:09.260 Well, is that really is that really going to get your voice heard?

01:12:12.160 But if if if the people that you're trying to reach and this is what unity looks like

01:12:17.380 is me being able to say what I believe and you being able to say what you believe in

01:12:20.240 us, agreeing that maybe we disagree.

01:12:22.020 But here's our reasons.

01:12:23.020 And now at least we're more educated.

01:12:24.200 Right.

01:12:25.360 There the left in my experience, the left has has so violently and ferociously come after

01:12:33.820 patriots that we don't we don't want to converse with them.

01:12:38.140 We want we want nothing to do with them at this point.

01:12:40.540 So I've had a couple decent conversations with liberals on my page and I'm shocked and

01:12:48.360 I'm going, oh, my gosh, you can you can have a friendly debate with me.

01:12:51.580 This is this is so rare.

01:12:53.160 It's one in a million.

01:12:54.100 Half the time I'm blocking them because they're not saying, hey, Lindsay, what do you think

01:12:58.100 about this?

01:12:58.560 Let's have a conversation. 1.00

01:12:59.280 They're saying you're a racist, fascist, selfish murderer. 1.00

01:13:03.180 And I'm like, OK, well, then if that's what you believe and you don't know me, we can't 1.00

01:13:06.960 speak.

01:13:07.200 And so if they if the left could hear what they're doing and they're silencing themselves

01:13:13.800 and creating the divide, we would we would be a very different America right now.

01:13:19.640 And the weird thing is that we're blaming.

01:13:22.440 Everyone's blaming everybody, but it just I mean, it simply goes back to humanity.

01:13:27.100 And if we could just there could be a little more humanity in our communication, that would

01:13:31.740 be fabulous.

01:13:32.240 And until that happens, you know, we're very much going to stay divided.

01:13:35.340 And yeah, so well said.

01:13:39.620 Listen, I am sending you tons of love.

01:13:42.760 Good luck with your your new babe and good luck with the salon and the businesses.

01:13:47.960 And thank you so much for being here in your honesty.

01:13:50.960 Thank you.

01:13:51.520 I appreciate the opportunity.

01:13:52.900 Thank you.

01:13:56.940 So today's episode is brought to you in part by Grove Collaborative.

01:14:00.120 Take the guesswork out of going green.

01:14:02.580 It is hard sometimes, right?

01:14:03.780 You're not sure how to do it.

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01:14:06.500 Go to grove dot com.

01:14:07.840 No, no.

01:14:08.840 Grove dot co slash mk to shop for all of your sustainable home essentials.

01:14:14.280 Grove dot co slash mk.

01:14:16.440 OK, on Wednesday, you are not going to want to miss the show.

01:14:19.920 I felt fired up at the end of it.

01:14:23.720 I felt it's just like I was ready to fight, you know, and I think you'll be ready to fight.

01:14:27.620 But we get an interview with Jodi Shaw.

01:14:31.560 Jodi Shaw.

01:14:32.620 She's like a celebrity to me.

01:14:34.580 Did you hear Glenn Lowry mention her when he came on my show?

01:14:37.500 He was holding her up as a heroine, too.

01:14:39.380 She is she's basically an administrative assistant at Smith College in Massachusetts who was sick and tired of the critical race theory stuff being shoved down her and her colleagues throats. 0.90

01:14:50.900 And so she took to her little microphone and put out some online videos objecting to it in the most articulate, compelling way.

01:15:01.020 And Jodi's story is just part of a much larger mosaic, which Chris Ruba has been documenting.

01:15:07.740 He's the guy who got President Trump to ban critical race theory mandated sessions at the federal level and for people doing business with the feds.

01:15:14.880 Joe Biden's already reversed that. So you'll get an inside look into what's now being fed, not just to federal contractors, folks and employees, but to your kids.

01:15:24.960 Rufo's been all over what's happening in the schools.

01:15:27.900 And you need to know you need to know.

01:15:30.180 Just here in New York, we saw the Dalton School just fight back against this a couple of days ago.

01:15:34.500 And the Dalton School is as left as they come.

01:15:36.980 Trust me, it's one of, if not the most progressive liberally, I mean, politically progressive in the nation.

01:15:42.980 And the parents there sent a seven page letter to the administrators saying, we're sick of this.

01:15:50.020 This is divisive. It's the anti-racist agenda is nothing of the sort.

01:15:56.240 And we're not going to stand for it any longer.

01:15:58.600 And that's exactly what Chris Rufo has been trying to stop.

01:16:02.100 It's what he's been taking a look at.

01:16:03.800 And if you read their letter, I mean, it's it's shocking.

01:16:06.680 I'll just I'll give you just a little bit, little news here.

01:16:08.820 This is a quote. Every class has had an obsessive focus on race and identity.

01:16:14.400 Racist cop reenactments in science class, de-centering whiteness in art class, learning about white supremacy and sexual identity in health class.

01:16:26.120 Many of us do not feel welcome here anymore.

01:16:29.820 So anyway, that's all Wednesday.

01:16:32.240 Jody Shaw and Chris Rufo. Don't miss it. And we'll talk then.

01:16:34.960 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. 0.94

01:16:37.980 No BS, no agenda and no fear.

01:16:42.500 The Megyn Kelly Show is a Devil May Care media production in collaboration with Red Seat Ventures.

The Megyn Kelly Show - February 01, 2021

A Mom and Small Business Owner, On How She Ended Up at the Capitol January 6, and Fighting Against COVID Lockdown ｜ Ep. 58

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