The Megyn Kelly Show - AOC and Bernie's Wild Town Hall, Mamdani Clams Up, and Victoria's Secret is Back, with The Fifth Column

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00:01:00.820 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.

00:01:06.300 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly, welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:15.640 Buckle up, we got a lot to get to today.

00:01:17.340 AOC and Bernie Sanders had a town hall on CNN last night.

00:01:20.700 Why?

00:01:21.740 Why again?

00:01:22.760 I mean, honestly, like, why are you doing, like, when I was at Fox, if we had a town hall,

00:01:27.120 we were gearing up for an election, and we'd put on the candidates and talk to them about

00:01:32.220 their positions.

00:01:32.920 What are these two that is fighting the oligarchy?

00:01:35.020 Did we go over her private jet and his?

00:01:37.140 Here's just a sample.

00:01:40.240 You won't believe, won't believe who they're blaming for their party's woes.

00:01:44.240 Why does Republican messaging on social media seem so much more effective than Democratic

00:01:50.560 messaging?

00:01:51.600 And what can we do about it?

00:01:52.540 Well, that's a great question.

00:01:56.440 I think the Republicans are effective.

00:02:00.820 They have learned a lot about social media.

00:02:03.100 And by the way, it doesn't hurt that they have friends on all of the major social media

00:02:10.140 platforms.

00:02:10.800 So because they have also been very clear, especially digitally, about what they believe,

00:02:16.620 that women are inferior.

00:02:18.740 Oh.

00:02:19.220 And they do not deserve equal rights.

00:02:21.720 That they believe that LGBTQ Americans are subhuman.

00:02:26.620 And they are able to radicalize and target and exploit a generation of young boys, in particular,

00:02:37.040 away from healthy masculinity and into an insecure masculinity that requires the domination of

00:02:44.060 others who are poorer, browner, darker, or a different gender than them.

00:02:49.280 Let's be perfectly clear.

00:02:53.060 There was indeed one party that radicalized today's young men, and it was yours, madam.

00:02:59.040 It was yours.

00:03:00.280 It was yours who blamed them for literally everything just because they were born and born male.

00:03:06.600 The nerve, your side demonized them at every turn and laughed when they ever dared to express any actual pain at the circumstances that they were forced into through no fault of their own.

00:03:19.500 You are absolutely disgusting to now try to turn it around and say it is the Republican Party which came to their rescue that, quote, radicalized them.

00:03:29.320 You don't know any young Republican men.

00:03:31.760 I guarantee you right now that woman knows zero Republican men because none of them would be seen with her.

00:03:36.940 And for her to come out there and try to turn what she and her brethren did to them for years around it all, never mind to then blame it on the party that actually stood up for them, is the height of gall.

00:03:52.900 That is infuriating, and the Republicans want to treat trans people as subhuman.

00:04:00.420 It's your side, your side that wants to take non-trans children, perfectly healthy children who may be going through normal emotional distress, and literally give them double mastectomies so that you can feel better about who you are.

00:04:17.800 That's what you and your party are doing.

00:04:21.420 The Republicans are standing up for minors who deserve to have adequate and healthy sexual function when they get older, who deserve to breastfeed their children, who deserve to have children and not be sterilized at age 14 by puberty blockers into cross-sex hormones, a problem with which they will deal for the rest of their lives long after you have sailed into the sunset.

00:04:47.680 So you can take a seat on lecturing the right half of the country on the dehumanization of trans people.

00:04:56.860 How dare you?

00:04:58.420 How dare you?

00:05:00.860 Okay, so we're three minutes into the show.

00:05:03.440 Deep breaths.

00:05:05.320 I had read the soundbite.

00:05:06.640 I had not seen it played out.

00:05:08.660 It's different when you hear it.

00:05:10.040 F that woman.

00:05:11.240 Like, if she runs for president, I might run.

00:05:14.800 Honestly, like, I'll find my way into the ticket somehow.

00:05:18.120 Like, there's no way this person can run for president or be president.

00:05:21.800 No, no, no, no, no.

00:05:25.980 Okay, let's keep going.

00:05:27.280 There's more.

00:05:28.400 There was a big 24 hours for Democratic socialists not named AOC.

00:05:32.020 The New York City mayoral candidate Zoran Mamdani, sadly, the man who's probably going to be the next mayor of New York, unless something very dramatic happens, was on Fox News yesterday ahead of his debate tonight.

00:05:44.880 And it was pretty interesting.

00:05:48.240 You know, I saw Brit Hume after we're talking about how he's very charming.

00:05:51.600 You know, he's a great talker.

00:05:52.700 He's very smiley.

00:05:54.160 And like most snake oil salesmen, he can sell.

00:05:57.800 He can sell.

00:05:58.900 And that's why he's leading in the polls and is probably going to be the next mayor of New York.

00:06:02.280 God help us.

00:06:03.140 Literally, God help us.

00:06:04.260 Say a prayer for New York.

00:06:05.080 And the ladies of The View, they're claiming that Republicans, the evil Republican Party that AOC says has radicalized young men into insecure masculinity, that the Republicans, they don't go on The View because they're too scared.

00:06:21.740 They're afraid.

00:06:23.040 They don't want to do intellectual battle with Joy Behar, who checks notes.

00:06:29.800 Whoopi Goldberg.

00:06:30.920 Joining me now to react to all of this, our pals from the Fifth Column podcast, Camille Foster, editor-at-large for Tangle News, Michael Moynihan, host of The Moynihan Report on Two-Way, and Matt Welsh, editor-at-large for Reason.

00:06:46.200 Go subscribe now to their new YouTube channel at youtube.com slash at.

00:06:50.800 You got to put at on the new YouTube addresses.

00:06:53.480 It's annoying.

00:06:53.980 We have to do it with our MK Media shows, too.

00:06:55.900 But it's youtube.com slash the at sign.

00:07:00.280 We the fifth.

00:07:01.360 We the fifth.

00:07:02.660 And you will find them on the road with yours truly for the Megyn Kelly Live Tour, which starts next week.

00:07:08.920 They will be with me on November 21st in Anaheim, California.

00:07:13.020 It's just outside of L.A.

00:07:14.240 Look forward to seeing all of you there.

00:07:16.340 Get tickets now.

00:07:17.040 If you haven't, 10 cities, one month.

00:07:19.800 Megyn Kelly.com.

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00:08:26.520 Guys, welcome back.

00:08:27.900 Hey, Megan.

00:08:28.260 Hey, Megan.

00:08:28.600 Thanks for having us.

00:08:29.560 Awesome.

00:08:30.060 So I was with you in your new fancy studio where you sit right now.

00:08:32.980 I have to say, I feel like the kickoff went really well.

00:08:36.460 Very, very well.

00:08:37.760 It was the day drinking that really sold it, I think.

00:08:40.180 Yeah.

00:08:41.140 I need to do more of that here on the MK Show.

00:08:43.820 You know, Megan, I thought it really loosened you up.

00:08:46.360 Uh, and then I saw the first three minutes of this episode and I realized that you don't

00:08:51.680 need the booze.

00:08:53.380 You got it.

00:08:54.320 You're ready to go.

00:08:55.560 It depends which button you want to press.

00:08:57.940 But yeah, those in particular make AOC.

00:09:00.380 Let's just start there.

00:09:01.420 The nerve, the thing about the men is really bothering me, that it was the Republican Party

00:09:06.520 that radicalized young men.

00:09:08.400 I mean, that, I realize politicians lie and they constantly blame the other side for their

00:09:14.340 own sins.

00:09:14.980 That's not a new thing.

00:09:16.680 But on that issue in particular, it's just so galling, you guys.

00:09:20.420 I mean, who doesn't know?

00:09:22.160 You guys are men.

00:09:23.160 And, and like, we all know young men, I'm talking about like 18 year olds, 16 year olds,

00:09:30.100 20 year olds who feel dejected, completely disaffected by the constant messages of the

00:09:38.740 last five years in particular, that they're to blame for everything, that they're not hireable,

00:09:44.340 that they're not worthy of college admissions, that their pain doesn't matter.

00:09:49.840 You know, I'm thinking right now of my pals over on GB News and Lawrence Wright, who got

00:09:57.680 into this, he's a, he's an actor in Great Britain and he, they just try to cancel him

00:10:02.940 at every turn because he speaks truths that are uncomfortable.

00:10:05.780 And he got canceled because he was having rhetorical battle with this other woman, with

00:10:13.040 this woman who was mocking the notion that Great Britain, which, um, had just appointed

00:10:20.200 a minister for women should appoint a minister for men to look at the number of male suicides

00:10:26.760 and attempted suicides and the spike in male anxiety and depression.

00:10:31.200 And she mocked it.

00:10:32.600 She thought it was a joke.

00:10:33.820 She sneered at it.

00:10:35.440 And he responded to her like, F you and said something like, what, what kind of a man would

00:10:40.840 ever want to shag that, you know, typical British style.

00:10:44.680 His life got blown up.

00:10:46.540 Lawrence Fox, I said Lawrence, right?

00:10:47.820 And he's a documentary filmmaker, Lawrence Fox.

00:10:50.140 Um, he tried to stand up like for guys he knew who had, who had committed suicide.

00:10:56.600 And he was thinking of them as this woman who was like, F them, who cares about the men?

00:11:00.580 And we've seen that at every turn.

00:11:02.220 And now this woman has the nerve.

00:11:03.660 It's her party and not just her party, but her branch of it.

00:11:06.600 The wokest of the woke on the left that caused all that shit.

00:11:11.160 And was there pushback by CNN to say, uh, no, of course.

00:11:16.980 Why?

00:11:17.240 I mean, are we shocked?

00:11:18.160 But anyway, what do you guys make of it?

00:11:20.140 There's a, uh, like five, six years ago, um, when, uh, Jordan Peterson was first coming

00:11:25.020 to prominence and starting to sell out arenas, I'd started looking into the phenomenon

00:11:28.680 because it was interesting and I want to write about it for a reason.

00:11:30.800 And I wrote about with some criticism of him, but also it was fascinating to see how many

00:11:36.260 people in media, uh, preemptively dismissed him because he had a male audience.

00:11:41.720 It's as if, if there's a place where young men who are obviously searching in some way,

00:11:46.520 um, are gathering in, uh, preponderate numbers, then there is something kind of already inherently

00:11:52.420 suspect about this.

00:11:53.480 We see this with our friends, uh, Andrew Schultz and what do they call them?

00:11:56.960 The podcast dude, bros, um, been like, uh, like, oh, they have a male audience.

00:12:02.160 So, you know, um, it's as if we all kind of understand that that is a problem.

00:12:05.860 That's been the overall vibe sent to, uh, sort of seeking men.

00:12:10.440 And the idea from AOC that the Republican party is sitting here thinking about how to

00:12:15.880 usher people, young men into insecure masculinity.

00:12:19.780 Can you imagine like Mike Johnson?

00:12:21.520 Yes.

00:12:21.980 What do we do?

00:12:22.760 I'm going to usher them into it.

00:12:24.420 It doesn't even begin to make sense.

00:12:26.000 Yeah.

00:12:26.180 I didn't need the internet for my insecure masculinity.

00:12:29.320 I just, just kind of a genetic thing, I think, but no, I mean, it is, I don't know if she,

00:12:34.680 uh, said this word, but I, and I tried to watch this thing on CNN and every time I unmuted

00:12:41.420 it, it was like the billionaires.

00:12:43.200 And I was like, okay, it's the same script over and over again.

00:12:45.420 But AOC, I mean, actually AOC does a very good job of making Bernie look normal.

00:12:50.640 Cause you know, he's not the, he's like, I don't toxic.

00:12:53.320 What, what are you talking about?

00:12:54.380 I don't think that's Bernie's vibe so much, but that prefix of toxic masculinity, which

00:13:00.640 became so sort of mainstream, people say that in a way as if it's a common phrase and we

00:13:05.460 all understand it's meeting the, there's never a toxic femininity.

00:13:08.980 And I can assure you from so many experiences, my wife, good Lord, is there ever.

00:13:14.340 And I'm doing, uh, just seminars in Anaheim in November around the show.

00:13:19.800 It is also a thing, but it's not a thing.

00:13:24.080 It's just the way people are.

00:13:25.300 But the thing is, is when you say this, people are radicalized online, young men are being

00:13:30.520 radicalized online.

00:13:31.780 Okay.

00:13:32.200 Let's take that premise and say, it's true.

00:13:34.780 I don't, I mean, the verb is obviously thumbing the scale.

00:13:37.680 They're being radicalized.

00:13:38.960 Maybe they're just being informed from a different source that they hadn't otherwise been exposed

00:13:42.420 to changing their politics, politics as young people do.

00:13:45.900 But typically it's a glide path from high school into college where you have the Noam Chomsky

00:13:51.660 bit and you become radical.

00:13:53.600 Some people stay there.

00:13:54.700 Most people then become investment bankers and forget all about it.

00:13:57.820 But this is kind of a, like the obverse of that where people are starting at 18 years

00:14:02.460 old and they're, you know, interacting with totally different political news sources that

00:14:06.880 they hadn't had before.

00:14:08.220 And they're just being enlightened by them.

00:14:09.920 They're being convinced.

00:14:10.720 But the thing that she's missing was a million things she's missing.

00:14:13.480 But the main one is what brings them there.

00:14:16.240 Megan, your soliloquy at the beginning of the show explains some of that, of why people

00:14:22.120 get there.

00:14:23.040 And they're a little overwhelmed by what happened in Me Too, what happened in 2020.

00:14:28.340 They said, you know, I don't feel that this is the country that I'm a part of.

00:14:31.420 These aren't the friends that I'm a part of, these supposedly toxic people.

00:14:34.660 And then there's a chorus of people out there who aren't a part of the mainstream that are

00:14:38.620 speaking to them.

00:14:39.660 That's a pretty fascinating thing.

00:14:41.520 That's not something to denounce and say, God, we have to sort of push back on this.

00:14:45.460 And there's, they, they, they think trend people are sub or LGBTQ are sub human.

00:14:51.680 Yeah.

00:14:51.880 I'm not sure.

00:14:52.500 Lord.

00:14:53.180 It's, it's, didn't she open the clip saying something along the lines of they said explicitly

00:14:57.060 what they want to do.

00:14:58.280 Yeah.

00:14:58.560 And then goes on to every single position that they have.

00:15:02.840 So I guess that's how we can just kind of discount what they say, but Megan, you, you

00:15:06.320 were kind of outraged, but it seems like you should maybe be reassured because AOC hasn't

00:15:12.240 learned anything from the, I know you're not wrong.

00:15:15.700 I did think that, you know, like she's just going to keep losing.

00:15:18.720 She's just going to keep driving young, even young men typically vote Democrat for the reasons

00:15:24.060 Moynihan was saying, but now not, not in the last election and not in the next election.

00:15:28.820 If this is what the Democrats took away, keep going, Camille.

00:15:31.680 Well, she wasn't the architect of every single bad idea that rose to prominence over the last

00:15:36.860 couple of years, but she was certainly at the, at the head of the parade, like chat championing

00:15:41.960 all of these ridiculous causes, defund the police.

00:15:44.980 She was there front and center.

00:15:46.320 I remember her saying something along the lines of this is where our politics are right now.

00:15:50.420 If you aren't with it, then you need to get the hell out of the way while we run

00:15:53.440 over you and essentially impose chaos across the entire country.

00:15:57.980 They have yet to apologize or even reckon with the fact that they have helped to bring

00:16:03.320 about their own reckoning to use the word another way in a slightly different context.

00:16:07.840 And that is the fundamental takeaway from the most recent election.

00:16:11.260 One could, one could say, you know, Donald Trump has a mandate.

00:16:14.600 Maybe it's somewhat debatable.

00:16:16.520 What you can't say, however, is that Democrats did themselves any favor over the course of the

00:16:21.500 last, uh, over the course of the previous administrations?

00:16:25.480 Yeah.

00:16:26.120 I don't, I, to me, the whole thing is so infuriating and it's so disingenuous and like, it's not

00:16:30.780 going to work.

00:16:31.260 Those young men are never going to look at her and say, oh, okay, she gets me now.

00:16:35.580 Um, not, not least of which, because she's leaning in, but also she's been making a thing

00:16:41.540 out of this.

00:16:41.960 This is she's, she thinks she's onto something.

00:16:43.540 We just ran a Instagram clip of her a couple of days ago where she used the same turn of phrase

00:16:48.540 of insecure masculinity.

00:16:49.860 Like that's what the Republicans are.

00:16:52.080 That's why they're acting like men again.

00:16:54.600 That's it.

00:16:55.300 You're insecure.

00:16:56.440 If you are an actual man who doesn't cower, who doesn't feel the need to, you know, wear

00:17:03.360 a man bun who actually has testosterone and understands that some, some urge toward aggression

00:17:10.200 and, you know, competition is natural.

00:17:13.680 And it's born with you if you're a normal man, um, she's turning those men off, you

00:17:19.920 know, by the millions continues to, I guess I should say.

00:17:22.360 And here's the second sound by along those same lines.

00:17:24.800 This is deeply insulting for the obvious reasons, but it's also yet another like pot

00:17:30.440 shot at young men in a way here.

00:17:33.600 It is South 13 rhetoric and beliefs were ignorant, uneducated, and sought to disenfranchise

00:17:43.040 millions of Americans far from the working quote, working tirelessly to promote unity

00:17:50.080 unquote, asserted by the majority in this resolution.

00:17:54.600 So Charlie Kirk was uneducated and ignorant, according to AOC.

00:18:01.540 What could be further from the truth, right?

00:18:03.940 I mean, like you can take your shots at Charlie Kirk, uneducated and ignorant are not two of

00:18:09.600 them.

00:18:09.940 And she goes with uneducated because he didn't go to college.

00:18:12.080 That's what she actually thinks of the working class from which she hails, right?

00:18:16.460 She wants us to know she's AOC from the Bronx.

00:18:19.460 She's not whatever her real name is from Westchester, Sandy, Sandy Cortez from Westchester.

00:18:26.340 So she's got to take a dump on people who don't go to college.

00:18:29.120 You're uneducated as though that's the only way one can educate oneself in 2025 America.

00:18:34.400 It's a lie.

00:18:35.080 Charlie knew it was a lie.

00:18:36.060 It was actually one of the things he felt most passionately about was that with all the

00:18:39.720 online access we have now, Hillsdale College, et cetera, which I know he was a big fan of

00:18:43.760 their online properties.

00:18:45.420 You don't need to go to college to just go and be indoctrinated into left-wing thinking.

00:18:49.840 So she's such an elitist snob at the Met Gala, but she's going to wear her dress saying

00:18:54.420 tax the rich.

00:18:55.140 So that makes it OK.

00:18:56.600 You know, saying she's working class Bronx, but dumping all over people who don't get a

00:19:00.740 four-year college degree.

00:19:01.620 Like, she's just a hypocrite and ignorant.

00:19:05.600 See, anybody who doesn't share her opinions of the world has to be ignorant.

00:19:09.180 It can't be a good faith disagreement, a genuinely, you know, felt difference of opinion.

00:19:14.940 Take somebody who's without question well-educated, Michael Knowles.

00:19:19.500 He shared Charlie's views, I think, on everything.

00:19:23.000 I don't think there was any daylight between them.

00:19:24.500 And he could make mincemeat out of AOC in any debate, as Charlie could have as well.

00:19:32.140 Let's take the trans issue, right?

00:19:33.840 Michael Knowles has been arguing that in the most forceful terms possible for a long, long

00:19:37.300 time.

00:19:37.940 Is he ignorant?

00:19:39.020 Is that his problem?

00:19:39.920 Or does he just have a much different view of the issue based on his own reading and research

00:19:44.120 versus AOC?

00:19:44.840 The whole thing is diminishing, and she feels especially empowered to do it because it was

00:19:51.340 a white guy, Charlie Kirk, as is Michael Knowles for that matter.

00:19:54.500 Your thoughts?

00:19:56.120 I might be a little bit oversensitive to this being a college dropout, but-

00:20:02.000 I went to college, Matt.

00:20:02.900 You just couldn't hack it, right?

00:20:04.140 Right.

00:20:04.320 That's okay.

00:20:07.000 It's interesting to use the word uneducated, isn't it?

00:20:09.440 Like, why isn't that word?

00:20:10.640 Why isn't it wrong?

00:20:11.920 Why isn't it ignorant?

00:20:12.860 Ignorance is actually much more defensively.

00:20:14.360 You could say, well, you know, this person just somehow doesn't understand or hasn't learned

00:20:18.840 a lot about the world.

00:20:19.800 Okay, you were wrong about that, but like, that's at least an argument.

00:20:22.800 And uneducated suggests that there is a fix that these people could go through by being,

00:20:30.160 you know, inert sheep vessels to be the recipients of the transmitted virtues of the graduates from

00:20:37.680 the Columbia Teachers College or something.

00:20:39.580 It is crazy, crazy, crazy elitist to say such things.

00:20:45.660 And it's really ironic and fun almost that AOC and Bernie Sanders, who were kind of, you know,

00:20:52.500 part of the DSA wing of the party, which is ostensibly supposed to be for working people,

00:20:58.360 they could be telling you a story about young men in this country and having a theory of the case

00:21:04.140 where they'd be able to make their socialist arguments.

00:21:07.160 And that theory of the case is we have a really weird, kind of unique in the rich world

00:21:12.580 problem of people of working age, not working, right?

00:21:16.420 And this is disproportionately men, but not only men compared to the rest of the world.

00:21:21.780 So what's your theory of the case for that?

00:21:23.740 And how are you going to address it?

00:21:25.400 They could do that with empathy and sympathy.

00:21:28.980 They could also look at the fact that we have crazy disability policies in this country that

00:21:34.940 they probably supported in many cases that people are opting into, even though they're

00:21:38.920 not quite disabled, but they don't want to do that because that would call into their

00:21:41.780 own things into question, but they're not doing any of that.

00:21:44.140 They are instead calling you uneducated because you disagree with how they look at the world.

00:21:49.600 And this is why we're seeing this kind of shift of the political demographics in this country

00:21:57.220 from who is the party of the rich and who is not.

00:21:59.860 It's an amazing thing because we've given AOC far too much credit for being a skilled

00:22:06.020 politician.

00:22:07.280 I mean, the thing that allows AOC to have, as you pointed out, Megan, a town hall for no one in

00:22:14.480 particular, for no election in particular, just a random one is because people in the media

00:22:18.660 love her.

00:22:19.260 I interviewed her the day that she won her election against Joe Crowley, I think.

00:22:24.620 And it was unbelievable.

00:22:26.820 It was a local race in a district, I think.

00:22:29.760 Has she been to the district yet?

00:22:32.500 If she's there, we should see if she wants to have drinks.

00:22:36.020 But yeah, it was amazing how much people just wanted this young, reasonably attractive

00:22:43.580 person who was a bit of a socialist.

00:22:45.900 And, you know, by the way, young people not working, if you want to see where that really

00:22:49.780 happens, go to socialist countries like Spain, where like young people, unemployment is like

00:22:53.940 48, 50 percent.

00:22:55.180 But it's an incredible thing of how little they have learned about politics.

00:23:00.680 And I just say this, you know, as objective as I can, not in any partisan way, is that you

00:23:05.560 don't do working class politics by saying things like these voters and these people who disagree

00:23:11.960 with me are uneducated.

00:23:14.580 And, you know, having your, you know, rallies at Colombia for Hamas and not mentioning hostages

00:23:21.740 and things like this, this is a mile away from the average working class voter.

00:23:25.640 Donald Trump.

00:23:26.640 I mean, it was the thing that I had to figure out early on in 2016 of saying, and we've

00:23:32.340 talked about, I think we might even talk about it when you were on our great new YouTube

00:23:35.820 show, Meg and Kelly.

00:23:37.080 Which is awesome.

00:23:38.240 Which is great.

00:23:39.060 The first guest was really a real crackerjack.

00:23:42.200 But when we were talking about this, and this is the thing that people, we discovered something

00:23:47.740 in 2016, Donald Trump, the billionaire, right?

00:23:51.160 Oh my God.

00:23:51.840 He's talking about how rich he is.

00:23:53.160 How can he connect with working class voters?

00:23:55.080 It's like, no, no.

00:23:55.740 Well, he wasn't pretending to not be rich.

00:23:58.420 He was saying, I'm a rich guy and you guys are getting screwed because I know how the system

00:24:02.920 works and the system exists to screw people like you.

00:24:05.560 Whereas all these other people that are trading stocks on the house floor are saying, you

00:24:10.240 know, as a working class person, and I'm commuter Joe Biden who gets on the Amtrak, it's not

00:24:15.700 believable.

00:24:16.580 With Donald Trump, it didn't have to be believable.

00:24:19.420 He wasn't pretending to be somebody he wasn't.

00:24:22.140 And that really resonated with people where you have somebody talking about the working

00:24:25.100 class, like AOC, who is making these arguments that is, talk about polarization.

00:24:30.820 It's not that you don't, you know, we are on different sides of an issue.

00:24:34.240 I'm trying to persuade you, you're fundamentally a bad person.

00:24:37.920 You have these ideas that make people subhumans.

00:24:40.720 You don't, you don't even go to college.

00:24:42.400 That's your problem.

00:24:43.800 How the hell after 2015 to today, we have a decade of not learning this very, very simple

00:24:50.960 lesson on how to talk to voters.

00:24:52.620 It's astonishing to me.

00:24:53.920 The contrast between AOC and Bernie is really fascinating.

00:24:57.240 He is supposed to be kind of carrying the torch for him going forward.

00:25:01.160 Clearly, the cultural power center of the Democratic Party is in Mandami.

00:25:05.640 It's in AOC.

00:25:06.500 It's in Bernie and has been in Bernie for more than a decade now.

00:25:09.280 But it's the younger lot that bring this kind of social justice edge along with them.

00:25:15.620 And that is the thing that I think many, many voters are incredibly turned off by.

00:25:20.140 The economic populism, you find that on both sides of the aisle at this point.

00:25:25.260 Donald Trump has a lot of those qualities.

00:25:27.980 He's pursuing a lot of policies that would ordinarily be identified with someone like

00:25:31.960 a Bernie Sanders.

00:25:33.280 But it's that other thing that is the problem.

00:25:35.760 And it's that other thing that continues to be front and center in so many of these

00:25:39.160 conversations.

00:25:39.740 And we're going to talk about Mandami in a little bit.

00:25:41.800 But the question about Hamas and his preposterous non-response to it is just, it is mind-boggling

00:25:48.680 that these people aren't willing to just lie about this stuff, at least consider your

00:25:54.000 objectives because that will actually help you win elections.

00:25:56.920 This other thing is a, it is a total loser.

00:25:59.580 You can only win by default with Donald Trump and Republicans essentially making themselves

00:26:05.200 unelectable.

00:26:06.380 That's the only hope that you have if you are going to maintain this course or even

00:26:10.200 double down on the same stupid rhetoric that lost you the last election.

00:26:13.520 And keeping in mind the question, the question they were asked was, why is your policies,

00:26:19.820 your rhetoric not resonating with people in the way the Republicans were?

00:26:22.900 They were like, that's exactly why that's happening.

00:26:26.240 At least, anyway.

00:26:28.320 No, I love how it's like, oh, you know, all their buddies own the social media.

00:26:31.660 Like, is that what the Democrats are telling them?

00:26:33.460 Like, I can't get anything trending because Elon owns X.

00:26:36.980 Yeah.

00:26:37.200 Elon wants engagement.

00:26:38.360 That's all he wants.

00:26:39.380 He wants Democrats logging on, Republicans logging on and staying on and retweeting things.

00:26:43.800 He's not falsely helping Republican memes go viral.

00:26:49.380 Republicans are doing that all on their own because they are clever.

00:26:52.620 I mean, look what they did to that exact video.

00:26:54.920 I'll show it now.

00:26:55.580 They got their hands on the clip we just showed and watch.

00:26:59.440 Why does Republican messaging on social media seem so much more effective than Democratic

00:27:04.180 messaging?

00:27:04.920 And what can we do about it?

00:27:07.080 Well, that's a great question.

00:27:08.120 I just want to point out for the record that on the Fox Business Network, we had a actually

00:27:22.680 drunk Camille Foster wear a sombrero while doing a guacamole tasting contest.

00:27:29.660 That's not right.

00:27:31.080 Yeah.

00:27:32.600 Nothing to do with the cancellation of that show.

00:27:36.440 Well, Camille's been everywhere.

00:27:38.120 I saw Camille in a clip we're running.

00:27:41.300 Well, might as well get to it now.

00:27:42.640 I mean, I'm not that into AOC and Bernie.

00:27:46.820 You were sitting next to this lunatic white lady who's been making the rounds saying all

00:27:52.640 sorts of terrible things about whites and Republicans.

00:27:55.960 Like, that's her thing.

00:27:56.800 I don't know who she is.

00:27:58.540 She's from the South.

00:27:59.640 And she's like made her name by trying to say, like, I'm like the white racist Republican

00:28:05.180 whisperer, even though she's always been a Democrat.

00:28:07.220 She wants us to claim she's deep in these Republican circles.

00:28:09.940 She's got all the good, all the goods on the right wing.

00:28:13.360 Poor Camille got dragged into this because he was sitting next to her or near her.

00:28:18.100 And this happened.

00:28:19.200 I'm a white woman that has lived in a red state my entire life.

00:28:23.840 And I can tell you when I'm around white people, they test the racist water.

00:28:28.880 They test it on people like you all all the time.

00:28:33.420 And they'll try to say all color things.

00:28:35.580 I put my hand up.

00:28:36.920 It absolutely happens.

00:28:38.600 And you're fortunate that maybe you haven't experienced it.

00:28:41.040 Can I just say, literally this August, a white person said the N-word in front of me.

00:28:48.120 This is that woman who chimed in is the one who's like, why didn't anyone ask me how I

00:28:52.020 feel about what was it, tariffs or something?

00:28:53.720 I can't remember what it was.

00:28:54.460 Like, because no one gives a shit.

00:28:55.840 Your opinion is totally irrelevant to us.

00:28:57.580 That's why.

00:28:58.180 But I love, I love your facial expression.

00:29:01.260 Camille.

00:29:01.760 Like, what?

00:29:02.600 I'm an active, I'm an active listener.

00:29:06.280 At least I'm not trying to interrupt her.

00:29:08.260 Yeah.

00:29:08.460 Like, what circles is she hanging out in?

00:29:10.880 Because unlike this Jennifer Welch, I actually am surrounded by Republicans all the time.

00:29:17.040 And I've never heard anybody test the water.

00:29:19.260 And what does it even mean?

00:29:20.420 Like, in my mind, testing the waters is like when you're trying to score drugs and you're

00:29:23.920 like, you party?

00:29:25.960 You know, this is how I imagine it would be done.

00:29:28.220 I don't know.

00:29:28.640 I've never done a drug.

00:29:29.920 Other than booze.

00:29:30.800 That's really committed.

00:29:31.620 That's what Megan asked.

00:29:32.160 Is that not it?

00:29:33.520 I'd be like, that's water testing.

00:29:34.660 No, it's exactly what it is, Megan.

00:29:36.560 Interesting.

00:29:37.200 You know, at some point in the exchange, she did kind of suggest that, you know, they

00:29:41.760 may only suggest that they're joking.

00:29:43.960 They're kind of telling jokes.

00:29:45.100 No, no, they're jokes.

00:29:46.100 Like, sometimes people make off-

00:29:47.480 You know, they're actual jokes.

00:29:48.960 Sometimes they do that sort of thing.

00:29:50.260 What do you, like, as if there's like a circle of whites and it has to be south of

00:29:54.580 the Mace and Dixon and they get together around like the backyard barbecue and they're

00:29:58.640 like, I can't even think of what to say.

00:30:04.380 What I can think of is this racist, I heard this racist story of this girl trying to get

00:30:09.740 somebody to say the N-word by saying, finish this sentence, salt, and then it's bad.

00:30:17.100 But I'm just trying to think of like, what circles is she walking around in?

00:30:21.160 You know what I mean?

00:30:21.620 It's like, people aren't saying that.

00:30:23.380 No, they're not.

00:30:23.880 How do you dip your toe in the racist water to see if other people are going to blurt out

00:30:26.920 with, yeah, something super racist.

00:30:29.080 Thank God you tore the label off so we can get this started.

00:30:32.820 Well, I'm going to answer this for Camille because I know he wants to go back on the

00:30:35.780 show and be-

00:30:36.780 You just want to be ecumenical.

00:30:38.720 I am not ecumenical.

00:30:40.420 There's something nice about these people here across the room.

00:30:42.940 Here is what happens when that happens with her.

00:30:45.800 It never happens.

00:30:48.260 She's making it up.

00:30:50.360 That does not happen.

00:30:51.820 Like this is, oh, do you know our friend who's the famous liberal podcaster?

00:30:55.820 Let's test out some racist jokes with her and see how we can go.

00:31:00.500 You know what I mean?

00:31:01.200 I mean, it's a plausible thing.

00:31:02.700 Well, I like your podcast, but I have a joke about some Mexicans.

00:31:08.540 It's like, what?

00:31:09.180 That's not happening.

00:31:10.700 God damn it.

00:31:11.440 And if it is happening, you should not keep the people around.

00:31:14.660 Don't invite them over anymore.

00:31:16.300 Where are you hanging out?

00:31:17.840 My friends don't make-

00:31:20.120 Well, my friends do.

00:31:21.160 I don't even-

00:31:21.620 I'm not even sure what she's talking about.

00:31:23.540 How are they even edging up to it?

00:31:25.540 She's such a lunatic.

00:31:26.920 It could be like, anyone want some watermelon?

00:31:30.160 She's like, oh, here it goes.

00:31:33.120 You did it.

00:31:33.820 Get back at it.

00:31:34.540 No, actually, there's watermelon and hot dogs in the backyard.

00:31:37.220 Help yourself.

00:31:37.700 I'm just saying, she's a lunatic, this person.

00:31:41.140 Here she is, Cory Booker, of whom she's not a fan.

00:31:45.440 Here, watch.

00:31:46.980 There are votes that you've made that were heartbreaking to me, like the vote for Kushner.

00:31:52.380 That really pissed me off.

00:31:53.920 This administration, it's not, are they fascist?

00:31:56.820 They are fascist.

00:31:58.000 It's not, we're on the precipice of fascism.

00:32:00.260 Texas is sending troops to Illinois.

00:32:02.980 I feel like the opposition needs to be, fuck, no, across the board, we're not giving you

00:32:09.660 a centimeter.

00:32:10.780 And you're one of them that's kind of been disappointing to me because we podcasted before.

00:32:14.900 They're serious about Project 2025.

00:32:16.960 They're going to do all this shit.

00:32:18.180 What do you have to say about the capitulation that you've participated in and where the Democratic

00:32:23.420 Party is right now?

00:32:25.020 Well, first of all, I would say-

00:32:26.420 White women don't get to talk to black men like that.

00:32:28.320 One of the things I dislike about the Democratic Party is that we do a circular firing squad

00:32:32.360 all the time.

00:32:33.360 Their party, they disagree.

00:32:34.980 There's a wild disagreements in the Republican tent, and yet they don't shoot at each other.

00:32:38.660 And we have a really good way of holding up these purity tests that if I agree with

00:32:42.000 you on 95-

00:32:42.440 That's such bullshit.

00:32:43.840 Come on.

00:32:44.380 That's such bullshit.

00:32:44.920 Come on.

00:32:45.560 You're racist.

00:32:46.160 They fire at each other all the time.

00:32:48.100 Trump has sent so many people out to pasture.

00:32:51.720 She's, I mean, that, that, that's, that lady's out of line.

00:32:55.620 You're not allowed to talk to a black man like that.

00:32:57.320 I've been told, put on my listening ears, take a beat, and maybe be quiet before you

00:33:03.900 tell a black person that they're wrong.

00:33:05.620 You black men like that in a wheelhouse.

00:33:08.440 Shamil, she was very polite to me.

00:33:10.580 And that, that Booker guy.

00:33:11.500 She was very polite to me.

00:33:12.860 You know, you know that the clip actually makes me think about though, Megan, is something

00:33:16.540 else that came on, came up during that same CNN appearance, which I'm very curious about

00:33:20.220 your perspective on to not change topics, but maybe expand it a little bit here.

00:33:24.400 Yeah.

00:33:24.540 My aren't, or do you think it would be feasible for Democrats to try and work with the administration

00:33:31.340 on various immigration issues to perhaps try and find a way to more peaceably execute these

00:33:39.880 deportations?

00:33:40.820 Do you think that the administration might be open to that?

00:33:43.040 Do you think that that might be a constructive move for Democrats?

00:33:46.420 I mean, I've often heard people reflect on the fact that Barack Obama deported lots and

00:33:52.820 lots of people, way more people.

00:33:54.460 That was in the town hall.

00:33:56.280 But the fact that he managed to do that without deploying the National Guard actually seems

00:34:01.040 really important too.

00:34:02.420 And maybe Democrats could build some bridges, could actually build up some, some equity amongst

00:34:08.600 voters and show their, their reasonableness on an issue that a lot of Americans are actually

00:34:13.460 fine with, with respect to actually-

00:34:15.400 Assumes facts, not in evidence.

00:34:17.380 But do you think if Democrats were to reach out, that there might be an opportunity for

00:34:22.480 them to work with the administration?

00:34:23.680 Oh, I definitely think Trump would.

00:34:24.780 Trump would 100% work with them.

00:34:26.400 He's, he's so bipartisan.

00:34:27.740 Like he, he would be like, great.

00:34:29.260 He loves counting these wins and being like, see, this person and I, we're together.

00:34:33.460 Look at the, the prison reform he did in Trump 1.0.

00:34:37.760 That was with Van Jones.

00:34:39.360 I mean, he's totally fine working with people across the aisle.

00:34:42.900 It's the Democrats who won't do it.

00:34:44.520 It is, let me give a simpler case.

00:34:48.000 Husband and wife get divorced.

00:34:49.760 They fight like animals toward each other.

00:34:53.140 They're the nastiest two humans can be to one another, notwithstanding the fact that they

00:34:56.440 have children with whom they need to share custody and, you know, split time and drop

00:35:01.460 them off and pick them up and see each other.

00:35:03.320 And they turn the kids against each other and they know it's very damaging for the children

00:35:06.740 to pass negative messages through them to the other one, but they do it.

00:35:10.020 They fight in front of them and the judge or the, you know, custodial guardian, I light

00:35:16.780 them, we'll say, please, please, please.

00:35:18.600 It's like Judge Judy used to say, you have to love your child more than you hate your spouse.

00:35:22.600 Please behave better.

00:35:23.860 And they can't do it.

00:35:25.260 Why?

00:35:25.380 Because their emotions run so high toward this person.

00:35:30.120 It's a hatred.

00:35:31.520 I can't help myself.

00:35:34.080 That's how they feel.

00:35:35.060 They can't even for their beloved child.

00:35:37.420 They can't get it in check.

00:35:38.800 And that is the Democrats and Donald Trump.

00:35:42.080 Like, I've had so many Democrats say to me, this is it's like a relationship with with

00:35:49.560 Hitler or, you know, one of his top lieutenants where your character is defined and will forever

00:35:56.700 be defined on whether you stood up.

00:35:58.680 So there's no, there's no working with, there's no calming down and, you know, getting yourself out of that trance.

00:36:07.240 It's the same way the husband and wife can't do it.

00:36:09.620 Neither can these Dems.

00:36:10.600 They will not be working with him.

00:36:11.960 That's my take.

00:36:12.520 I think also, though, there is immigration enforcement is a presidential issue at this point.

00:36:18.180 It is the executive, starting really with Barack Obama when he did DACA, which was a huge executive power grab.

00:36:25.260 I'm going to just say these 4 million people are exempt from immigration enforcement.

00:36:30.280 He had his pen and his phone.

00:36:31.920 He had his pen and his, well, Donald Trump has used the pen and phone more than any president since FDR and bragged about it.

00:36:37.500 He keeps getting larger and larger mock pens to do this, but presidents are enforcing law.

00:36:44.620 And so there's less actual material for Congress to work with a president on this.

00:36:50.500 And meanwhile, this president is enforcing law in a pretty aggressive way.

00:36:54.620 He's deploying ICE against the wish, or deploying the National Guard against the wish of mayors and governors.

00:37:00.800 And ICE is out there doing very, very aggressive raids in masks, oftentimes, or at least enough that we've seen on video footage of American citizens in many cases.

00:37:13.740 And so, of course, Democrats in those cities are going to react negatively to it and not going to be thinking, like, this is the time for bipartisan immigration reform.

00:37:21.860 It's just not how that's going to work.

00:37:23.320 But I think to Megan's point.

00:37:24.420 They have to wear the masks.

00:37:25.540 They're getting doxxed, and there are actually bounties out on them now.

00:37:28.600 You'd be an insane person to be an ICE officer.

00:37:31.520 Now, you don't think what?

00:37:32.720 Yes, they do.

00:37:33.580 Easy for you to say.

00:37:35.160 It's true.

00:37:35.780 It's easy for me to say.

00:37:37.060 Easy for you to say.

00:37:37.780 You're not risking your life every day actually just trying to clean up Joe Biden's mess with children at home.

00:37:42.340 And these people are literally putting a bounty on your head.

00:37:44.580 They are actually putting bounties on their heads.

00:37:46.720 That literally just happened with these gangs.

00:37:51.380 And the head of the Border Patrol just had a $10,000 bounty put on his head.

00:37:55.720 It goes up to $50,000 now.

00:37:57.340 Why wouldn't they wear a mask?

00:37:59.020 They don't need to show their face.

00:38:00.360 They know it's ICE.

00:38:01.840 They're armed.

00:38:03.040 They're wearing ICE jackets.

00:38:04.740 They just don't need to show what their particular face looks like.

00:38:08.640 Just on the issue of the kind of bipartisanship, to your point, Megan, it's funny because what you're referencing just happened in the clip that you showed.

00:38:18.600 This woman, that weird skeletal woman who is talking.

00:38:24.700 Have a burger.

00:38:27.040 You'll be happier.

00:38:28.020 I'm trying to describe.

00:38:28.880 I don't like when people don't look healthy.

00:38:31.860 It's just me.

00:38:33.020 Okay.

00:38:33.680 I'm for women.

00:38:34.660 I am not a toxic man.

00:38:37.840 I'm for women.

00:38:38.360 What does she say in that deranged soliloquy that is supposed to be a question?

00:38:47.880 She says, and this is how you prevent people from working together to Megan's point, is you say that it's not as if we're on the precipice of fascism.

00:38:56.540 We are in full fascism, that if this dummy had any idea what fascism actually was, would mean that she didn't have a show in which she talked to an opposition politician, which doesn't happen in a fascism dummy.

00:39:09.720 I mean, the fascism is just evident by appointing Jared Kushner.

00:39:12.560 Yeah.

00:39:12.940 That's obvious.

00:39:13.940 You mean Kushner.

00:39:15.420 Jared Kushner.

00:39:17.280 I don't even know what she's talking about.

00:39:18.780 How did he appoint Jared Kushner?

00:39:20.480 He just helped find peace in the Middle East.

00:39:22.300 She's upset about it.

00:39:23.000 I mean, good Lord.

00:39:24.200 I mean, if I want to get in trouble amongst a certain precinct of my friends is my unreserved praise for Jared Kushner in what he did with the Abraham Accords this time around, too.

00:39:37.840 Give the guy some credit.

00:39:38.820 They mocked him for saying, I read 25 books on the Middle East.

00:39:41.800 Maybe you guys should read 26.

00:39:43.980 Yeah, they were the right books.

00:39:45.500 Wait, I've got one more Jennifer Walsh for you.

00:39:47.720 I've got one more for you.

00:39:49.800 That's the lady.

00:39:50.660 That's the undernourished lady.

00:39:52.300 Angry lady.

00:39:53.240 Apparently with all the racist friends.

00:39:55.640 You tell me this sounds a little racist, too, from her.

00:39:58.840 This is she's ripping on J.D. Vance.

00:40:00.400 I believe this is because he was like those guys, those so-called young Republicans who had the racist text chain with the ridiculous comments that was outed yesterday by Politico.

00:40:13.560 J.D. Vance is like, I'm not going to get my pro.

00:40:16.420 I'm going to start not going to start clutching pearls over these guys when we've got a Virginia attorney general candidate who's literally calling to put two bullets in the head of Republicans and their children.

00:40:25.580 And this the other side says nothing.

00:40:28.540 Here she is talking about that with Chris Hayes on Wednesday.

00:40:33.540 He is married to a woman of Indian descent.

00:40:36.180 Yes.

00:40:36.500 He has mixed race children.

00:40:38.700 So to all of the MAGA voters out there, if this man will not defend his wife and will not defend his kids, do you think he gives a crap about you or anything to do with you?

00:40:50.740 She's mad that J.D. didn't get offended more by a bunch of 22 year old knuckleheaded losers in some text chain private amongst them saying racist things.

00:41:05.780 She's mad he didn't stand up for his brown wife and his mixed race children as their knight in shining armor because Usha Vance needs to be protected from all of her Supreme Court clerkships.

00:41:18.980 I mean, like they can't understand a world in which a person is like, whatever, I don't need to comment on every stupid comment that's made by somebody in my party.

00:41:31.200 However, you Democrats do need to comment in the Virginia race involving one particular candidate who is on the record as admitting to having said he wants Republicans to die along with their children.

00:41:44.620 Seems like a much bigger deal.

00:41:46.740 Why do these Democrats always do this?

00:41:48.400 They always bring up the fact that he has a mixed race children and an Indian wife to somehow require more of J.D. Vance.

00:41:58.960 Yeah, actually, she mentioned the same stuff during that appearance on CNN that we had together as well and used this phrase like brown, his brown children, which during the appearance, I actually suggested that was probably not appropriate and was something that she should avoid.

00:42:14.220 But I do also think that J.D. right to call out the hypocrisy, as you just highlighted as well.

00:42:21.080 But his comments about this have not been particularly good.

00:42:24.900 And he entered into this fray voluntarily on X, didn't do it in a particularly eloquent way.

00:42:31.880 And then the next day further compounds the problem for himself by commenting on it further, saying things like, I will tell my kids not to post things online because if you post things online, that's very bad for you.

00:42:42.460 No, that's not really it, J.D.

00:42:44.120 The issue isn't that they are posting things online.

00:42:46.860 It's that they are posting deplorable things in this secret group chat.

00:42:51.060 And it seems that some of the people in that group chat might have been a bit older, not kids, as he continued to characterize it.

00:42:57.280 And there might have even been elected officials who are in this group chat.

00:43:00.260 I don't know.

00:43:00.960 My suspicion is that a lot of this is precisely what you would expect to happen in these clandestine signal groups, like people just kind of talking, shit talking and doing all sorts of other locker room talk.

00:43:11.300 Maybe some of these people have authentically nefarious, awful beliefs.

00:43:15.640 But what you can say in a context like that, if you are J.D. Vance, one of the standard bearers of the Republican Party, a party that does have some material challenges with respect to actual racist sentiments that are bubbling up in our polity right now.

00:43:31.220 Totally disagree.

00:43:32.180 Totally disagree with that, Camille.

00:43:33.680 It's the Democrats who are the racists.

00:43:35.500 Republicans do not have that problem.

00:43:36.780 Maybe the Republicans of some years ago, I don't know what you're referring to, but today's Republicans are signing on, in particular, young black men like there's no tomorrow.

00:43:44.300 It's black women who vote Democrat.

00:43:47.520 But it's the Democrats who divide us by race nonstop and try to tell us we're one thing because of this color of our skin.

00:43:53.940 I think you are right that overt race essentialism is the unique kind of bailiwick of Democrats right now.

00:44:02.700 But there is a version of that that has become more prominent on the right.

00:44:07.360 Nick Fuentes, who we talked about the other day, who has been on the right.

00:44:10.720 I don't know what he is.

00:44:11.600 I think he would characterize himself that way.

00:44:14.800 At a minimum, he is kind of in orbit around the right.

00:44:18.120 And I wouldn't say that.

00:44:18.900 I don't think that's true.

00:44:19.980 Who does he like?

00:44:20.520 He hates Trump.

00:44:21.840 He doesn't like Trump.

00:44:22.860 He hates J.D. Vance.

00:44:24.140 He was singing Gavin Newsom's.

00:44:25.940 I don't watch Nick Fuentes, but I see the reports on him on X.

00:44:29.620 He was seeing Gavin Newsom's praises, like full throated praises.

00:44:34.520 I think the reason he likes Gavin Newsom, according to what X told me, is he's white and he's got a white wife and he's got white kids and he doesn't like the fact that J.D. is, you know, got in this mixed marriage, whatever.

00:44:46.760 So it's like he's not of the right.

00:44:48.540 I don't know what he is, but he is not of the right.

00:44:50.520 Keep going.

00:44:50.840 I don't know how I don't know how we want to position him, but but I will.

00:44:53.660 Let me offer this in terms of what J.D. could have said.

00:44:56.540 Right.

00:44:57.080 J.D. could have said the issue here is that the people in this group were saying deplorable things and the deplorable things that they were saying.

00:45:04.520 It's not just that they were racist or that they use the N word.

00:45:06.700 They were degrading people because they suggested that their dignity was not a function of their humanity.

00:45:11.960 Those are fundamental.

00:45:14.040 OK, I get that.

00:45:15.260 I get it.

00:45:15.480 I get it.

00:45:15.960 You can say that while also highlighting the hypocrisy of the other side, as opposed to just dismissing the actual problem.

00:45:23.380 I get it.

00:45:23.580 But, you know, you got to understand the mindset that we're all in right now.

00:45:26.820 I mean, like I think those of us on the right in particular who are close with Charlie and J.D. Vance was among them.

00:45:31.960 He's the one who just brought back his friend's fucking corpse on Air Force Two.

00:45:37.960 And I had been with J.D. at the White House the day this story broke.

00:45:42.780 And he tweeted like, I'm not going to pearl clutch over this.

00:45:45.380 When we were all hugging Erica Kirk, who was in tears as she accepted posthumously Charlie's presidential medal of freedom, that the mindset right now is.

00:45:58.240 You cheered when our friend basically got his head blown off, you cheered, you laughed, you made memes out of it and T-shirts showing it.

00:46:09.740 I guarantee you some cretins are going to make it into a costume.

00:46:14.640 And I don't have any time or tolerance for you saying you didn't like comments in what was supposed to be some private chat between a bunch of losers who I don't know if there were elected officials in there.

00:46:27.460 But I've been following the story.

00:46:29.420 No elected official has been accused of saying anything racist in that threat.

00:46:32.840 It's the chair and the vice chair of something called Young Republicans, which I don't even totally understand.

00:46:38.720 In all my years covering politics, I've never heard of them.

00:46:41.480 A lot of groups call themselves like Young Miss, Young That.

00:46:43.720 It doesn't mean that they represent all of that party in America.

00:46:46.240 So I can see why he did it.

00:46:49.860 He was basically like, don't fucking lecture me on how we're supposed to be talking in a way that's more genteel and not offensive.

00:46:58.020 I am not here for it.

00:47:00.740 Yeah, I would say that there's a couple of things about that.

00:47:03.280 There's one opportunity here for a conversation.

00:47:06.880 I don't want to say what somebody should tweet or not.

00:47:10.220 I mean, my advice is to elected officials is just don't tweet.

00:47:13.920 It's just never a good idea to tweet.

00:47:15.180 But I've learned that lesson myself.

00:47:18.100 But I mean, there is.

00:47:19.900 Next stop, what you say on the air.

00:47:23.580 Oh, yeah, no, I mean, I got a timeshare in Greenland.

00:47:28.560 And I think that's the only salvation for the truth, I think.

00:47:32.380 And by the way, I want to say our group chat is very racist towards Camille.

00:47:37.940 And he's on it.

00:47:38.920 And so I can't.

00:47:40.360 I think it's kind of hypocrisy for me to denounce it when I call.

00:47:43.860 I don't say the N word, but I say some other stuff.

00:47:45.900 You do occasionally.

00:47:46.720 Yeah, a couple of times I've said it directly.

00:47:48.180 Oh, by the way, I'll give you back the floor.

00:47:49.620 But by the way, I just printed this out.

00:47:51.000 You know, Hunter Biden.

00:47:52.780 Hold on.

00:47:54.660 Hunter, in the laptop and the text that nobody would publish, refers to his attorney, George

00:48:01.280 Maziras, as the N word repeatedly.

00:48:04.060 N-I-blank-blank-A.

00:48:06.520 You better not be charging me whatever rates.

00:48:09.880 He goes on.

00:48:10.360 He says it repeatedly.

00:48:11.560 I don't remember.

00:48:13.060 Where were all the Democrats condemning this Republican chat when Hunter Biden was using

00:48:16.560 the N word over and over and over and over?

00:48:19.220 I think that's the N-I-G-G-A.

00:48:20.900 As in my nigga.

00:48:22.380 Yeah.

00:48:22.780 Yeah.

00:48:23.400 Yeah.

00:48:23.540 He's been trying to get us to say this.

00:48:26.560 He's been trying to get us to say that.

00:48:28.240 But that we all could.

00:48:29.540 I think if we did that, we completely disarm actual racists.

00:48:33.280 We should just do it.

00:48:34.020 I'm not doing it.

00:48:34.800 I'm telling you to do it.

00:48:35.740 I'm not saying what Jennifer Welsh thinks.

00:48:36.860 I think it might be bad for you.

00:48:37.800 I've literally never heard anybody utter that word, even with the A at the end, in my presence.

00:48:42.460 I've seen it on TV.

00:48:43.980 Open up the Bad News Bears from like 1977.

00:48:47.020 You get every single one from like, oh my God.

00:48:49.740 Like we tried to watch it with our kids.

00:48:51.180 We were like, mute, mute, mute.

00:48:53.700 We're just mongering and being racist, which is like, I literally see where it's starting to

00:48:57.960 And then the remake they had, they just changed it to sort of anti-Armenian.

00:49:01.840 Oh, well.

00:49:02.760 Which is funny.

00:49:03.940 Because it's something we can all support.

00:49:06.000 Yeah.

00:49:06.460 Given the Kardashian factor.

00:49:08.240 I think I interrupted you, Moynihan.

00:49:09.980 So I apologize.

00:49:10.860 Keep going.

00:49:11.120 Look, I was just saying that I think that there is a legitimate conversation to be had.

00:49:16.500 And I don't, and this is not going to do with J.D. Vance.

00:49:18.180 I don't think this is like, like the sort of province of J.D. Vance, something he should

00:49:21.460 have a conversation about.

00:49:22.680 But there is a legitimate conversation to be had about what the right is in this kind

00:49:28.400 of Groyper phenomenon.

00:49:29.400 It is a thing.

00:49:30.340 Like if we can talk about, you know, the people that get out there and praise the death of

00:49:34.700 Luigi Mangione, sorry, the killing of the executive by Luigi Mangione.

00:49:40.060 I mean, this is not a majority of people, but enough to go down there and cheer at a courthouse,

00:49:44.140 right?

00:49:44.560 Nick Fuentes was at January 6th.

00:49:46.700 And I think he was wearing a MAGA hat that day.

00:49:48.300 He's been disaffected from Donald Trump because Donald Trump has been very pro-Israel.

00:49:52.920 He doesn't like J.D. Vance because his wife is Indian because he's a racist.

00:49:57.560 I mean, this is a pretty straightforward thing.

00:49:59.540 It's not like I have to do some Kremlinology here.

00:50:02.480 But there are those, if you want to have the conversations about the radicalization of

00:50:06.320 young men, that's an insane conversation in the way they're having it.

00:50:09.660 But there is a small group of people who are being introduced to conservative politics

00:50:13.760 in a 4chan, 8chan way that is troubling.

00:50:17.600 And you see a lot of it on it.

00:50:18.800 By signaling.

00:50:19.720 And it's just like, it's, you know, and there's a part of this where people started saying

00:50:23.640 the word retarded a lot more and just saying it constantly to say how this is how transgressive

00:50:28.600 I am.

00:50:28.860 That's actually gotten to a place where people use racial slurs for the same reason.

00:50:32.600 I don't know if they're racist, but they just say it because that's the transgressive

00:50:35.660 things.

00:50:35.940 There's a conversation there that's interesting, but it's never the one that we're having because

00:50:39.840 it's trying to say, this group is racist or this group is not racist.

00:50:43.620 There is a serious conversation to be had about some of these outer precincts in the

00:50:49.780 horseshoe theory of far right, far left, and what they mean to the movements of the both.

00:50:54.380 I got to take a break, but when I think about 4chan and the groups, I think about lying in

00:50:59.020 wait, Democrat killers.

00:51:00.600 That's what I think is happening over there.

00:51:02.800 I'm not worried about racial slurs by a bunch of losers who feel empowered by saying them.

00:51:07.660 I'm worried about trans Tifa getting their next victim and assassination planned because

00:51:12.860 that's what we're actually seeing off of those discussion forums.

00:51:16.760 It's deeply troubling.

00:51:17.980 Stand by.

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00:53:28.440 We are going on the road.

00:53:33.940 Megan Kelly Live, 10 stops across the country.

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00:54:58.880 Okay.

00:54:59.040 I wanted to do one more soundbite from the AOC-Bernie interview before we completely move

00:55:03.960 on from that, because it was kind of interesting and maybe potentially telling, and it was on

00:55:08.100 the subject of whether she's going to challenge Chuck Schumer in his next senatorial bid.

00:55:14.780 Here it is.

00:55:15.180 But are you saying that Senator Schumer should not be worried about a primary challenge from

00:55:20.140 you?

00:55:20.560 I mean, no.

00:55:22.460 Let me jump in on this one.

00:55:23.780 Let me, this is, see, this is what we're talking about.

00:55:27.260 This is what we're talking about.

00:55:28.280 This is what we're talking about.

00:55:28.900 You have a country that is falling apart.

00:55:31.720 We had a house, housing crisis, a healthcare crisis, an education crisis, massive income

00:55:37.160 and wealth inequality, a corrupt campaign finances, and the media says, oh, you're going to run,

00:55:41.640 what are you going to run for?

00:55:42.240 Nobody cares.

00:55:43.540 Nobody cares.

00:55:45.400 It's the House Speaker and President Trump and the Vice President saying it.

00:55:48.380 Right.

00:55:48.720 Pardon?

00:55:49.140 Well, of course, they're saying it to deflect attention away from the real issue.

00:55:52.680 And he'll tell you what the real issue is.

00:55:54.720 Let's see if CNN talks about it.

00:55:57.940 And you'll just have to wonder because we cut the soundbite too early.

00:56:02.100 Okay.

00:56:02.500 The billionaire.

00:56:04.940 Why it was about healthcare.

00:56:06.000 But why, why such a, why such an adverse reaction to the subject of whether she's going to challenge

00:56:12.680 Chuck Schumer in a primary bid?

00:56:16.480 She kind of had that blush, didn't she?

00:56:18.360 The first thing before she started gesticulating wildly.

00:56:20.960 Well, I, again, listen, back to, I think, I thought she said no at the beginning and then

00:56:25.740 spun that into something else.

00:56:27.300 She did say no, but she might've been saying, no, that's not what I'm saying.

00:56:30.340 So it's hard.

00:56:30.820 When you, when you say this, when you do this, well, this is what the media does.

00:56:35.820 This is the problem.

00:56:37.500 It's not, it's actually, that is the problem with politicians.

00:56:40.320 It's a totally sensible question.

00:56:42.320 It's a, it's a question that New Yorkers want to know that people in that are interested

00:56:46.460 in politics want to know that America would like to know about.

00:56:48.700 It's a totally reasonable question.

00:56:50.280 And the deflection is here to say, well, there's other things happening in the world that are

00:56:54.640 bad.

00:56:55.020 Can you not walk and chew gum?

00:56:56.580 Yeah, but do not have two questions we can talk about.

00:56:58.920 And they do talk about, cause I watched that damn thing.

00:57:01.140 They do talk about healthcare.

00:57:02.220 They do talk about all these other things.

00:57:03.720 Is it, what is wrong with asking that question?

00:57:06.080 It is, that is a complete ridiculous, you know, what about things?

00:57:10.420 But the safest politics in America is being mad at the media.

00:57:14.280 This is true.

00:57:15.220 Yeah, because Americans hate the media more than they hate even their own lives, or actually

00:57:19.600 they love their own lives.

00:57:20.440 They hate the media.

00:57:21.120 Democrats don't hate the media.

00:57:23.060 Democrats hate the media too.

00:57:24.200 Bernie does.

00:57:24.880 The populist side, right?

00:57:26.280 The populism, there's a reason why Bernie and Trump both kind of rose up at the same

00:57:30.660 time.

00:57:31.020 And that part of the democratic party, um, has always been, had something against the

00:57:35.840 media.

00:57:36.040 I covered the Ralph Nader campaign in 2000 when he got 2.7% of the vote, he was against

00:57:40.760 the oligarchs in the media and the corporate media, this and the corporate media, that every

00:57:44.520 single day, he wouldn't stop talking about it.

00:57:46.400 And it's popular because people do feel alienated from the media.

00:57:49.300 I think their analysis of the media, uh, has been absolutely wrong for a really long time.

00:57:55.400 And they will say with a straight face that the media is run by Republicans and, and corporate

00:57:59.740 lobbies.

00:58:00.680 The, and, and they've been saying that for 30 years, they're wrong, but it's a popular

00:58:04.560 message.

00:58:04.940 You can always blame it.

00:58:05.900 I was once, uh, moderating a libertarian party debate.

00:58:08.800 God help me like, uh, uh, presidential debate, uh, I know, uh, back in like 2016 or something.

00:58:14.360 And one of the candidates, um, just decided, and he's a guy I know, um, and, uh, and friendly

00:58:20.220 with, uh, but he decided to take a perfectly normal question.

00:58:23.360 Like, you know, would you abolish, uh, everything?

00:58:26.480 Um, and, uh, and then that's the problem with the media.

00:58:29.220 And then afterwards he was just like, you know, I gotta do that.

00:58:33.220 I give an example of this on the, on the kind of left version of this.

00:58:38.380 Is, um, John Oliver, who's a, uh, apparently a comedian, but he has a show on HBO and he

00:58:45.760 did a whole piece on, uh, my friend, Barry Weiss the other day.

00:58:49.320 And in the lead up, it was so dishonest.

00:58:52.320 Keep going.

00:58:53.080 Oh, horrible.

00:58:54.040 But in 10 minutes, he's like, he's like, you know, the corporate media.

00:58:57.280 And he, he talks about Jeff Bezos and the guy who owns, who owns the, uh, um, LA times

00:59:03.360 now, Patrick, uh, whatever his name is.

00:59:06.060 Yeah.

00:59:06.580 Soon's young.

00:59:07.120 And he's been on your show.

00:59:08.320 He's a bit maha, uh, Jeff Bezos, who's nobody's idea of a conservative, but he's been, you

00:59:14.220 know, say, let's make the editorial page of the wall street, the Washington post free

00:59:18.300 minds and free markets like reason.

00:59:20.320 So now he's in the, the, the, you know, the sites of people like this, but it's like, I

00:59:26.280 was thinking, watching this, have you never heard of Carlos slim?

00:59:30.000 Have you never heard of any of these other billionaires who have taken over media corporations?

00:59:34.420 And the reason now that they're re spinning this is that, well, they're becoming a little

00:59:39.480 bit disaffected and you have people bringing Barry Weiss in to bring it to shake it up.

00:59:44.000 CBS, the third place in the ABC, CBS, NBC rating sweepstakes for news.

00:59:49.720 And that terrifies them.

00:59:51.840 So now they're turning all the guns on the media because the owners in their, I think

00:59:57.900 this is a completely demented worldview are people that are nominally of the right.

01:00:02.380 This is our territory.

01:00:03.680 We get to own the media, not you guys when we do.

01:00:07.340 And that's, you know, and Bernie Sanders, one obvious thing that is so damn obvious that

01:00:11.680 you don't even notice it.

01:00:13.000 And he's like, is CNN going to talk about this?

01:00:15.800 And it's like, you're on CNN.

01:00:17.680 You're on CNN.

01:00:19.400 Why is he talking about Bernie Sanders?

01:00:20.800 You're very good at the imitations.

01:00:23.640 Yeah.

01:00:24.020 We've noticed this before, but you're very talented at that.

01:00:27.260 Here's, here's what's really bothering now.

01:00:28.860 Okay.

01:00:29.100 So it, first of all, all you saw for the listening audience was extreme physical discomfort.

01:00:34.980 Like she got the hands above the midline immediately.

01:00:38.280 He jumped in to save her.

01:00:40.520 Clearly they both knew that she did not want to talk about primarying Chuck Schumer.

01:00:45.120 And that if that were to come up, he was going to run in to save her.

01:00:47.740 He was a little asleep at the switch.

01:00:49.540 So she got really uncomfortable.

01:00:50.820 She doesn't want to talk about it, which suggests she's going to do it.

01:00:53.700 Um, either that or a presidential run.

01:00:56.180 I don't know, but for whatever reason, she really didn't want to talk about it.

01:00:58.860 And wasn't able to deftly handle it.

01:01:00.340 Like any politician can, when they get asked a question that they don't want to answer.

01:01:03.660 That's, uh, you know, a day ending and why that it should be.

01:01:07.580 Um, but on the subject of like, why they're getting so upset about these media buys,

01:01:12.460 maybe this has something to do with it.

01:01:14.240 Um, I'm trying to find our pal, Harry Enton.

01:01:17.760 He's on my very long sought list someplace.

01:01:20.900 I'm searching you.

01:01:22.380 There we go.

01:01:23.300 Okay.

01:01:23.760 So three, I started on the wrong page.

01:01:25.900 Yeah.

01:01:26.540 So three, maybe this has something to do with it.

01:01:28.860 You go back to April, Kate Baldwin.

01:01:30.980 What were we looking at?

01:01:32.260 Well, we were looking at the Democrats with a very clear shot of taking control of the

01:01:36.620 U.S. House of Representatives, according to the Cauchy prediction market odds.

01:01:39.920 We saw them at an 83% chance.

01:01:41.800 But those odds have gone plummeting down.

01:01:44.500 Now we're talking about just a 63% chance.

01:01:47.440 While the GOP's chances up like a rocket, up like gold, up from 17% to now a 37% chance.

01:01:54.180 If you go back to April, look at the generic congressional ballot.

01:01:56.560 What'd you see?

01:01:57.220 You see plus three Democrats in 2025 in April.

01:02:00.100 You see plus three Democrats back in April of 2017.

01:02:03.280 Now jump over to this side of the screen.

01:02:04.840 What happens?

01:02:05.620 Well, the Democrats are no longer keeping pace with the pace that they were setting back

01:02:10.480 in 2017, 2018.

01:02:11.960 You look back in 2017, you saw that the Democrats had leaped up to an eight point advantage.

01:02:17.720 I think a lot of folks like myself are looking at this.

01:02:19.940 We're seeing, hey, wait a minute.

01:02:21.240 Those national polls are Democrats are not gaining the way that we expected.

01:02:24.680 Then you add in the fact that the state legislators are adding potentially more GOP seats like they've

01:02:29.440 already done down in Texas, like they've done in Missouri.

01:02:31.620 And then you add in the potential gutting of the VRA.

01:02:34.160 And all of a sudden it becomes much more difficult for Democrats to gain.

01:02:39.440 So that's a long way of saying they would like to blame the media for their newfound electoral

01:02:46.320 problems.

01:02:47.340 It's got to be the evil media getting bought up by all these Republicans, as opposed to

01:02:52.040 us and our own messages that are tone deaf and off point and driving people away and have

01:02:58.120 rendered the Democratic Party the worst thing one can be, which is totally uncool.

01:03:04.160 It's amazing to be in the position that they're in right now and not having a huge structural

01:03:11.100 advantages, right?

01:03:12.340 Like the president always loses ground in the midterms.

01:03:16.500 It just that's it's unless you are Bill Clinton and it's you're in the middle of an impeachment

01:03:20.960 process in your second term, which sort of creates a boomerang effect.

01:03:24.660 And the averages are staggeringly high.

01:03:27.000 Donald Trump is a divisive, polarizing politician who, you know, his his numbers never go too

01:03:35.240 low, but they never go too high either.

01:03:37.300 And he's been around for a long time.

01:03:39.360 And there can be people who like him and they just have Trump fatigue enough already with

01:03:43.180 all the craziness.

01:03:44.420 It's incredibly favorable atmosphere for which them to run.

01:03:50.480 And they're doing this not greatly.

01:03:52.600 Um, it's, uh, I think it's incredibly damning of where Democrats are.

01:03:56.020 You've got Trump fatigue, but you've also got resistance fatigue.

01:03:58.680 I think a lot of people are exhausted by the hyperbolic rhetoric about fascism is coming,

01:04:03.180 even while you're seeing these somewhat controversial policies where the National Guard gets deployed

01:04:08.440 in Illinois and you've got this no King's day response.

01:04:11.240 And there's scenes of tear gas.

01:04:13.580 There are these scenes of people being, uh, grabbed up in, in, um, uh, court court houses

01:04:19.140 and various other places, but it's, it's charged.

01:04:22.160 You would actually expect it to have more repercussions, perhaps to show up in the polling

01:04:26.080 a little bit more.

01:04:27.240 The Democrats, people are in favor of it.

01:04:29.080 They're not doing anything and they are still losing round.

01:04:32.360 It's very strange.

01:04:33.260 The people are in favor of it in, in, you know, they, the kind of those momentary scenes

01:04:39.880 come and go.

01:04:40.720 I think one of the things you can't, um, underestimate is that we saw a lot of polling

01:04:45.920 about how Democrats and how Republicans, particularly young Democrats and Republicans were moving

01:04:52.760 away from, uh, Israel on when it came to foreign policy.

01:04:56.060 What that ultimately doesn't matter when you see what happens with the hostages being released,

01:05:01.540 Donald Trump speaking in front of the Knesset world leaders, uh, praising him, everybody in

01:05:06.400 Israel praise the man, by the way, who is, you know, uh, he has.

01:05:09.880 Dinner with Nick Fuentes is an anti-Semite and there's a big image of him on the beach

01:05:13.960 of Tel Aviv that he can see flying in on air force one.

01:05:16.800 I mean, God, these, these Jews in Israel have really misunderstood this anti-Semite that

01:05:21.920 they're cheering.

01:05:22.500 It's like, I kind of trust them.

01:05:25.660 You know, I just, that's my answer.

01:05:26.820 He's such a bad anti-Semite.

01:05:27.720 Trump sucks at anti-Semite.

01:05:30.420 Oh my God.

01:05:31.280 He's the worst anti-Semite of all time in the way that he's not good at it.

01:05:34.900 Don't take that out of context, people.

01:05:36.660 But the thing about you, you see he's the worst anti-Semite.

01:05:40.460 Good Lord.

01:05:41.340 Just flip that there.

01:05:42.140 Flip it there.

01:05:42.600 Um, but no, the, the amazing thing to me is you have somebody on TV and this pains me

01:05:48.280 to say this, but you have AOC and Bernie Sanders in Bernie is the guy that could do it.

01:05:55.280 AOC is the one who can't, because the first clip we saw of AOC is exactly why she going

01:06:00.180 to run for president.

01:06:01.120 So she can't.

01:06:02.140 And the reason she can't is the thing that pains me to say is Americans, unfortunately

01:06:06.300 for us, libertarian types, they love economic populism.

01:06:10.200 They love this stuff when, and Marjorie Taylor Greene is talking about how we're kicking

01:06:14.520 people off of healthcare and she's, you know, drifting away from even further away from that

01:06:19.000 former version of like Reaganite conservatism, which was free market, et cetera.

01:06:24.460 But the problem is they're saddled by this cultural policy.

01:06:28.800 AOC cannot get away.

01:06:30.300 We see the Zoran Mamdani doing like a run for Gaza, you know, on like October 8th or something

01:06:36.020 and saying that, oh, I don't want to, this is not, I'm the mayor of New York.

01:06:39.080 It's like, you're running for Gaza, like what?

01:06:41.160 You care about these issues?

01:06:42.540 These are issues that are not popular amongst like a broad swath of people because they're

01:06:48.460 too extreme.

01:06:49.240 I mean, when she's talking about men and the toxicity and blah, blah, blah, you can't be

01:06:53.900 president by it.

01:06:54.400 If you just did the Bernie thing, that is how Democrats could gain ground.

01:06:58.480 Harry would be showing different numbers.

01:07:00.280 Yeah.

01:07:00.480 And this, this plays up also to Virginia, right?

01:07:03.420 I mean, you have a gubernatorial race there that is now getting saddled with AOC, like

01:07:08.940 culture war issues that it absolutely does not need to be.

01:07:12.980 Complete cell phone.

01:07:13.440 It's a complete cell phone.

01:07:14.600 Yeah.

01:07:14.740 It's not hard to say, no, I'm against this.

01:07:17.220 No, you shouldn't like fantasize about the death of people.

01:07:20.100 And we shouldn't have in high schools or junior high schools, people who were born male in

01:07:25.720 a female locker room.

01:07:26.700 That's not a hard, straightforward.

01:07:27.800 Did you guys see that setup that the Dems tried to do on Winsome Sears yesterday and

01:07:33.440 it completely backfired on them?

01:07:35.480 So the Democratic Party of Virginia tweeted out at Winsome Earl Sears saying Sears must

01:07:42.640 call on these young Republicans implicated in the racist tech scandal to step down from

01:07:48.100 their positions.

01:07:49.960 And Winston Sears retweeted it with a response that read, easy, they absolutely must step down.

01:07:56.460 Now it's your turn, Abigail.

01:07:57.800 I mean, just such a burn.

01:08:00.580 So good.

01:08:01.720 They did not see that.

01:08:03.520 That is a Winsome.

01:08:05.340 Yeah.

01:08:05.660 Right?

01:08:06.060 So we're yelling that because Winsome is Jamaican like Camille.

01:08:09.760 So I'm an American.

01:08:12.040 I was born here.

01:08:12.840 Yeah.

01:08:13.240 But you know.

01:08:14.000 Yeah.

01:08:14.540 She nailed it.

01:08:15.980 And Abigail Spanberger has still not withdrawn her endorsement of the I love murdering Republican

01:08:22.040 children, Jay Jones.

01:08:23.420 But so make me attorney general.

01:08:25.660 Instead, the Democrats want to talk about these young Republicans in that text thread.

01:08:28.940 OK, let's keep going.

01:08:31.280 I do want to get to Mom Donnie.

01:08:33.080 That's coming up.

01:08:33.740 But since we touched on Democrat messaging and how they just kind of keep resorting to

01:08:38.980 hysterics about Trump like that, like that's going to work.

01:08:42.300 They haven't learned that lesson either from 2024.

01:08:44.620 They had ratcheted up the fascism and the Hitler accusations.

01:08:47.520 I mean, two and 11.

01:08:49.020 They lost.

01:08:51.000 They're still at it.

01:08:52.720 Here's Bradley Whitford, who played a top presidential aide on the West Wing.

01:08:57.700 And I'm telling you, it's like Yul Brynner.

01:08:59.960 We learned in American musical theater the course I took when I was in 10th grade that

01:09:04.800 I made my high school boyfriend take with me.

01:09:06.500 And he was captain of the football team.

01:09:07.540 And he never forgave me for making him sit through everything.

01:09:10.720 West Side Story, The King and I.

01:09:13.140 It was wonderful.

01:09:14.600 Anywho, as we learned about Yul Brynner in that class, he got into like some temporary

01:09:19.200 delusion after playing The King and The King and I.

01:09:21.400 And like for a period really thought he was The King.

01:09:23.300 And that that is what's happened to Bradley Whitford.

01:09:28.140 I'm sorry to tell you.

01:09:29.400 And he played a top presidential aide in the West Wing.

01:09:31.660 And now he thinks he is a political expert.

01:09:34.080 He offered some of that expertise on The View yesterday and obviously was cross-examined

01:09:42.180 super hard by the fact based Joy Behar.

01:09:47.900 Let's take a look at how that went in SOT 22.

01:09:50.300 And right now, public servants are under attack.

01:09:55.260 Yep.

01:09:55.620 It's been politicized in a way that is unprecedented.

01:09:59.780 I am living in a world where we have internment camps.

01:10:03.620 Yes.

01:10:04.380 Where in my community, people are jumping out of vans and people going through a legal asylum

01:10:10.980 process are being taken away without charges.

01:10:16.140 And the thing that's very upsetting to me right now, and we're giving these internment

01:10:23.080 camps funny names.

01:10:25.040 Yeah.

01:10:25.680 Like there's some fun.

01:10:27.420 Alligator.

01:10:27.840 To be had in the inhumanity of it all, it's a very strange time for me.

01:10:38.940 It's a disgrace, really.

01:10:40.020 It's a disgrace.

01:10:41.100 Yeah, it's a disgrace.

01:10:43.360 Okay.

01:10:44.080 So there are internment camps.

01:10:45.920 I mean, I didn't know that.

01:10:46.740 I thought Alligator Alcatraz was a place we were putting illegals who we were arresting

01:10:52.740 and about to deport in a place where we could manage them humanely before they had to ship

01:10:57.460 right on out of here.

01:10:59.460 Alligator Alley actually is or Alcatraz is actually kind of nice compared to a lot of the prisons

01:11:03.820 where they'd normally go.

01:11:04.880 If you want to know the truth, there's no internment camps here.

01:11:07.400 And the notion about as they're going through a legal asylum process, okay, in the same way

01:11:14.180 Joe Biden can say, come on in, come on in.

01:11:16.340 We may give you asylum.

01:11:17.520 Go through the process.

01:11:18.600 The next president can say, we're not going to.

01:11:21.040 Your process has ended.

01:11:22.280 Goodbye.

01:11:23.100 That is okay to do.

01:11:24.500 There is no obligation on the part of President Trump to see that through to the end.

01:11:27.960 He can make a summary decision.

01:11:29.840 Actually, I totally disagree with that policy.

01:11:31.720 We are not granting 10,000, 30,000 Haitians asylum.

01:11:35.220 After all, we have enough.

01:11:37.340 So the rhetoric hasn't calmed down.

01:11:40.100 I'm going to give you one more and then I'll toss it to you guys.

01:11:41.980 Here it is, SOC 23.

01:11:45.320 I'm talking about my dad a lot.

01:11:48.280 He died a long time ago.

01:11:51.280 He would be over 100 years old.

01:11:56.520 110.

01:11:57.520 He fought in World War II when fascism was on the rise.

01:12:01.020 He was on a minesweeper with torpedoes coming at him.

01:12:05.100 He was Antifa.

01:12:06.580 He was Antifa.

01:12:08.380 Yes.

01:12:09.060 Go ahead.

01:12:10.360 Oh, my God.

01:12:12.600 He would wear a frog costume and he'd be outside of the torpedoes.

01:12:18.640 Nice.

01:12:19.080 Your father would be in Portland.

01:12:24.560 I cannot shake this sense.

01:12:28.100 Megan, we love coming on the show.

01:12:30.500 We enjoy all of our various conversations with you.

01:12:32.800 No, there's no but.

01:12:34.440 There's no but here.

01:12:36.280 We have agreements.

01:12:39.040 We've had sustained disagreements.

01:12:40.740 We've discussed all of these various policy choices that are being made, etc., etc.

01:12:46.300 What we try not to do in those conversations is engage in the kind of hysterics that he was engaging in.

01:12:53.080 Yeah.

01:12:53.440 The inflamed language.

01:12:55.080 Everything is on 10.

01:12:56.680 Everything is the worst imaginable thing.

01:12:59.100 This episode of the Megyn Kelly show is actually an opportunity for Democrats.

01:13:05.520 Just watch this.

01:13:06.560 Just pay attention to what's being said here.

01:13:08.640 All of the things that you're doing that are harming, you don't have to do them.

01:13:12.000 You could make your counter-arguments, you could make your case without resorting to absolute absurd nonsense.

01:13:19.620 You don't think they know this?

01:13:20.840 I don't think they know it because they keep doing this.

01:13:23.740 Unless what they secretly want is for MAGA to win forever.

01:13:27.240 I am offended by the frequency with which people abuse the historical record by saying things like,

01:13:37.500 Let's even be nice to them and say, at this table, as you well know, Megan, we have a lot of disagreements with Trump and the way he handles things, etc.

01:13:49.040 But the idea that this is fascism, that is something that I have been arguing against, and I get these emails all the time, such and such a bad thing happens.

01:13:59.740 Oh, do you think it's fascism now?

01:14:01.480 No, I don't, as a matter of fact.

01:14:02.820 Because fascism was a very real thing, and what they're trying to provoke is an idea of Adolf Hitler.

01:14:09.880 And I have a picture on my phone.

01:14:11.720 I was on the subway the other day because I'm a working-class hero, and I take the subway and get harassed by people all the time.

01:14:18.460 And there was a woman across from me who had a button on that had a picture of Trump facing Hitler.

01:14:25.000 And it was just like this 65-year-old Upper East Side woman who had a picture of Hitler.

01:14:29.280 And it said, like, you know, continue the resistance.

01:14:32.120 I can show it to you.

01:14:32.960 I think I sent it to you guys, this picture of it.

01:14:35.000 But this kind of rhetoric, internment camps.

01:14:37.160 By the way, I wish the people of The View would have been asked the follow-up question, what do you guys think of FDR?

01:14:42.840 You're a big fan of FDR?

01:14:43.840 Yeah.

01:14:44.520 How'd that go?

01:14:45.440 Who was responsible for the internment camps?

01:14:48.640 Who got that idea into our heads?

01:14:50.260 It was FDR.

01:14:51.560 It was Trump.

01:14:52.060 Sorry.

01:14:52.360 But this idea that we're at fascism, where you can say that there are authoritarian instincts.

01:14:59.140 Fine.

01:15:00.000 Fascism is a very distinct thing.

01:15:02.180 And I think it's an insult to all of the people that survived fascism, that actually fought real fascism, paid with their lives.

01:15:09.480 And the comparison is not even in the same universe.

01:15:13.600 Trump is a lot like Hitler.

01:15:16.800 It's just that he's saving the Jews instead of killing them.

01:15:19.780 But other than that, they're the same.

01:15:21.900 But it's a big triple screen.

01:15:23.500 Yeah, yeah.

01:15:24.020 Get them all in one place.

01:15:25.380 That's what he's doing.

01:15:26.200 Right.

01:15:26.700 But he's, I mean, he would save six million if he could.

01:15:30.080 That's how much of a fascist he is.

01:15:32.120 That's, it really is looking in the mirror image of Hitler.

01:15:35.740 He's trying to save all those Jewish lives and make Israel a safe place for decades.

01:15:40.200 And that's why we have to wear buttons condemning him.

01:15:42.920 Hold on.

01:15:43.220 There's one more that we have to play, according to my team.

01:15:46.120 Oh, yeah.

01:15:47.700 Do we really?

01:15:48.320 I'm so over him.

01:15:49.780 Yeah, we do.

01:15:50.300 I'm not going to do it.

01:15:51.240 I don't know who it is, but we do it.

01:15:52.360 All right.

01:15:53.280 I'll just look at it.

01:15:54.640 He does this all the time.

01:15:56.540 Stop 20.

01:15:57.620 The original No Kings protest was 250 years ago.

01:16:01.880 Americans decided they didn't want to live under the rule of King George III.

01:16:05.920 They declared their independence and fought a bloody war for democracy.

01:16:10.120 We've had two and a half centuries of democracy since then.

01:16:13.540 Often challenging, sometimes messy, always essential.

01:16:16.460 And we fought in two world wars to preserve it.

01:16:19.960 Now we have a would-be king who wants to take it away.

01:16:23.320 King Donald I.

01:16:24.920 Fuck that.

01:16:25.700 Why does he think it's going to work this time?

01:16:29.500 I'm glad that we like 1776 again, right?

01:16:34.580 Yeah.

01:16:35.200 Right.

01:16:35.540 Because we had a whole five-year span there where that wasn't the real founding of the country.

01:16:40.000 The real founding is when we started slavery here, and all politics has been downstream from that.

01:16:45.600 And 1776 was a hypocritical lie, and we never really meant it.

01:16:50.240 And just look at all the slaveholders who did X, Y, and Z.

01:16:52.780 The Revolutionary War is awesome.

01:16:54.560 The Declaration of Independence is awesome.

01:16:56.620 I hope everyone's got semi-quincentennial fever as much as I do.

01:17:02.820 And I'm not unhappy at all that they're calling their protest No Kings.

01:17:06.960 I don't like kings either.

01:17:08.380 And if that's getting you back in touch with your 1776ness, if, for example, you would tell

01:17:14.580 from this lesson that, hey, maybe when my party has the presidency, we will also give the president

01:17:21.720 less power because then he will abuse it in ways that George Washington wouldn't have liked.

01:17:26.620 I would love that to be a conclusion.

01:17:28.100 It's not going to be a conclusion at all.

01:17:30.480 But I will take baby steps towards the direction of actually being happy and proud of the American

01:17:36.920 founding and trying to be rejuvenated by it.

01:17:39.780 I think we all can benefit.

01:17:42.120 Hey, I've never heard the Democrats tout the First Amendment as much as they did in the wake

01:17:46.240 of Kimmel.

01:17:47.040 So great.

01:17:47.840 And, you know, it does support the theory that they have to have it done to them in order

01:17:54.700 for them to get back in line on our shared common principles, like free speech.

01:17:59.520 But wait, I want to read you what Trump said about these no kings.

01:18:02.960 So the audience knows these Democrats are organizing these left wing groups like the

01:18:07.020 ACLU and MoveOn.org and Human Rights Campaign are organizing these no kings protests.

01:18:12.620 They tried to do it in June.

01:18:14.020 They had about 1700.

01:18:15.200 Now they're doing it again.

01:18:16.080 They have about 2200 people across the country having these rallies.

01:18:20.820 I just hope they keep their clothes on.

01:18:23.000 We've seen some in like Portland where they're naked and naked on bike.

01:18:26.580 I was just going to say that that's got dangers.

01:18:28.760 We're in Portland.

01:18:30.420 Yeah, that's the weird.

01:18:32.480 That's dangerous for both sides.

01:18:34.580 Like there's no good outcome for women or men in going naked on a bike.

01:18:38.740 OK, but here's what Trump says.

01:18:40.900 A huge thank you to all the no kings protesters yesterday.

01:18:44.540 I was very concerned a king was trying to take my place.

01:18:48.540 But thanks to your tireless efforts, I am still your president.

01:18:52.520 Great job all.

01:18:53.720 That is incredibly funny.

01:18:58.760 But to Matt's point, I think it's a really, really important point of that, particularly

01:19:03.360 going through the whole kind of 1619 era, which was a long era for people who live in

01:19:09.840 certain states and went to certain universities, that this idea that America has been one long

01:19:16.760 uninterrupted string of indignities and horrors visited upon X group, the love of the country,

01:19:25.180 that everything has been great, according to Robert De Niro.

01:19:28.120 Until now, it's like, good Lord, that's like a Paul Johnson version of American history rather

01:19:32.980 than a Noam Chomsky one.

01:19:34.180 And just one small point.

01:19:35.240 We didn't save democracy in World War One.

01:19:36.940 It was we shouldn't have been there.

01:19:38.060 That was a big mistake.

01:19:39.380 But World War Two is great, but big mistake in World War One.

01:19:41.880 But getting back to that idea that there's something worth saving.

01:19:45.500 But the problem is they don't believe any of this shit.

01:19:48.740 And the second it's no longer relevant to the points, the protests they're having, the

01:19:53.240 points that they're making, they're going to go back to saying that this country has

01:19:58.380 that original sin and it can never get beyond it, which is the thing.

01:20:01.500 I've got to play now Ketanji Brown-Jackson from the Supreme Court argument yesterday.

01:20:05.960 I don't know if you guys watched any of this, but there was a very good update in our morning

01:20:10.700 update, our AM update show today on what happened to SCOTUS yesterday.

01:20:14.040 And if you haven't listened to that, I highly recommend it.

01:20:16.100 Take three minutes of your time to listen to that piece of the show, which is only 15 minutes

01:20:20.800 long to begin with.

01:20:22.080 But long, long story short on this case that was just argued yesterday.

01:20:26.900 Comes out of Louisiana.

01:20:27.720 Louisiana has six representatives.

01:20:31.260 They had one district that was majority black.

01:20:33.960 And there was a lawsuit saying somehow that's racist.

01:20:36.740 We're one third of the population in Louisiana, said a bunch of black complainants.

01:20:41.040 And we shouldn't only have one district.

01:20:43.160 This is illegal race discrimination under the Voting Rights Act.

01:20:47.540 That case wound its way up.

01:20:49.240 The courts said, you know what?

01:20:50.860 This is racist.

01:20:52.120 You have to create another district.

01:20:53.220 So they created two, two majority black districts in Louisiana.

01:20:55.780 Then non-black, which I guess is just everybody who's, you know, white or Hispanic or Asian,

01:21:02.600 whatever, non-black complainants filed their own lawsuit saying, this is bullshit.

01:21:07.340 Why did we create a second district just for black people?

01:21:09.940 Like, it was, there's nothing wrong with the way we did it before.

01:21:13.340 And it's basically like, to me, I read it as Republicans being like, hey, if we want to

01:21:17.600 gerrymander, we can gerrymander.

01:21:19.320 You can't gerrymander based on race, but you can certainly do it based on politics.

01:21:22.580 The Democrats are the ones who taught us that.

01:21:24.800 So long story short, it goes up to the Supreme Court.

01:21:27.000 They hear an argument last spring where then they held their opinion and they said, let's

01:21:30.060 re-arguate with some additional constitutional provisions addressed, not just the Voting Rights

01:21:35.360 Act.

01:21:35.620 Let's talk about the 14th Amendment.

01:21:36.800 Let's talk about the 15th Amendment.

01:21:38.200 Try to convince us whether this scheme can stand under those tests.

01:21:43.860 So they went back before the Supreme Court yesterday, both sides, and now it's Louisiana

01:21:47.680 and the non-white complainants and the Trump administration on one side.

01:21:52.620 And it's the, sorry, non-black complainants.

01:21:57.060 And it's the black complainants on the other side, right?

01:22:01.620 Well, along with like the ACLU and all these other groups who say this is racist, racist,

01:22:04.980 racist.

01:22:05.180 So that's, that's the argument in a nutshell.

01:22:08.140 Can, can Louisiana, was Louisiana right to create a second district that's just black

01:22:13.020 majority because somebody said Voting Rights Act, this is discrimination because there are

01:22:16.420 more blacks in the state than, than appear to be represented, assuming that they mostly

01:22:21.200 vote Dem and Louisiana in this district wide lines, these lines.

01:22:27.640 It's not going to go the way of the black complainants.

01:22:31.740 It's going to go Louisiana's way.

01:22:33.680 That seems really clear.

01:22:35.280 The Supreme Court seemed very much ready to side with the Trump administration in Louisiana

01:22:40.760 and say, this is bullshit.

01:22:42.940 This looks like politics, not racism.

01:22:45.940 And there's a difference.

01:22:48.240 But here is Ketanji Brown Jackson swooping in to try to rescue this scheme by comparing

01:22:56.800 black people today in 2025 America to disabled Americans who had absolutely no facilities made

01:23:06.800 available to them prior to the Americans with Disabilities Act.

01:23:09.440 Listen.

01:23:10.740 And my kind of paradigmatic example of this is something like the ADA.

01:23:17.220 Congress passed the Americans with Disabilities Act against the backdrop of a world that was

01:23:22.720 generally not accessible to people with disabilities.

01:23:26.500 And so it was discriminatory in effect.

01:23:29.680 Congress said the facilities have to be made equally open to people with disabilities if readily possible.

01:23:37.280 I guess I don't understand why that's not what's happening here.

01:23:40.560 The idea in Section 2 is that we are responding to current day manifestations of past and present

01:23:49.780 decisions that disadvantage minorities and make it so that they don't have equal access

01:23:55.320 to the voting system.

01:23:58.660 Right?

01:23:58.960 They're disabled.

01:24:01.320 Disabled.

01:24:02.640 So 2025 America.

01:24:04.340 The irony of this being a black woman sitting on the Supreme Court of the United States comparing

01:24:11.380 herself to basically disabled people 50 years ago who couldn't get into any building because

01:24:18.640 none of them had ramps.

01:24:19.680 There's been no progress.

01:24:20.920 We're really back where we were.

01:24:22.540 Everything's racist.

01:24:23.400 And therefore, we can't change anything because we're basically still in the Jim Crow South.

01:24:28.320 Yeah, I mean, they're virtually obliged to make an argument.

01:24:34.580 Why are you looking at Camille Moynihan?

01:24:36.960 Because he's disabled and I feel bad.

01:24:41.240 I was giving it a try.

01:24:43.640 Yes.

01:24:45.120 I think that the original sin here, like of all of this, and I find it genuinely fascinating,

01:24:52.320 is that there is this racial essentialist philosophical commitment in the law.

01:25:00.160 It's baked into the law.

01:25:01.320 The reason everyone is always, well, have we done enough here?

01:25:05.900 Is it time to sunset these laws?

01:25:08.280 It's because everyone knows that this sort of affirmative discrimination or affirmative bias

01:25:14.620 in the law, whether you're discriminating against people because you dislike them or because

01:25:18.140 you want to help them, it is antithetical to the principle of equality under the law.

01:25:23.780 It is antithetical.

01:25:24.940 They're at odds.

01:25:25.760 We're trying to remedy some past harm by making the law do something that we know is at odds

01:25:32.620 with the spirit of the Constitution.

01:25:35.060 And as a result, the argument she has to level is, well, no, no.

01:25:39.320 I mean, we just haven't done enough yet.

01:25:40.760 I mean, they're basically just children.

01:25:43.160 We need to help them.

01:25:44.220 And in her case, Supreme Court Justice essentially making an argument because she self-identifies

01:25:49.060 this way, you need to help us.

01:25:50.880 Like, you haven't done enough for me.

01:25:52.500 I find the entire thing pretty obscene, but I also think we're uncovering something here.

01:25:58.200 And to the extent that there is a correction here that's being made by the Supreme Court,

01:26:01.960 and we've seen a number of rulings along these lines that suggest that people are well past

01:26:06.560 this.

01:26:06.780 Even in California, they've managed to knock down affirmative action efforts there.

01:26:10.860 People want equality under the law.

01:26:14.300 They prefer that to equity.

01:26:16.700 Like, this, in many respects, is the crux of the debates and some of the arguments that

01:26:21.520 we were having back in 2020, 2021, when the Black Lives Matter thing was ascendant.

01:26:26.240 Do we want a country where everyone is treated the same way, or do we want a country where

01:26:31.780 we designate you disadvantaged or advantaged, and then we prioritize you under the law so that

01:26:36.280 we can level the playing field and turn America into Harrison Bergeron?

01:26:40.020 And I know which one of those things is attractive to me.

01:26:43.300 It's unfortunate that Ketanji Brown-Jackson and so many other people are stuck in this

01:26:48.540 outmoded way of thinking.

01:26:50.300 It is entirely possible to address people's needs without imagining that all of us who

01:26:56.560 happen to have a particular hue in our skin are categorically disadvantaged, or that everyone

01:27:01.480 who is a little lighter is categorically advantaged.

01:27:04.100 It is obnoxious.

01:27:05.720 It is wrong.

01:27:06.460 It is an abject falsehood that we should be all looking to move beyond.

01:27:11.700 And I'm happy we're having some of these disagreements.

01:27:14.140 I hope that we have them in, like, substantive enough ways for people to actually understand

01:27:18.300 what's happening here.

01:27:19.400 No one wants discrimination, except for the people who are advocating for discrimination

01:27:23.940 openly.

01:27:25.600 And whether you're advocating for it because you want to help people or not, doesn't matter.

01:27:28.900 It is still discrimination.

01:27:30.080 Yeah, it's like Chief Justice Roberts says, the answer to dividing us by race is not more

01:27:34.920 dividing us by race.

01:27:36.020 The answer to past discrimination is not more discrimination, contrary to what Ibram X.

01:27:39.640 Kendi says.

01:27:41.180 A fact check on something I said a minute ago, that Trump No King's post was not real.

01:27:46.920 I got fooled by the internets.

01:27:51.020 That's sad.

01:27:51.400 It sounded like him.

01:27:52.320 As the best fake tweets will lead you to believe that it's real.

01:27:55.220 It sounded like him.

01:27:55.780 But in any event, well said, Camille, and we'll now await the decision, because part

01:28:00.720 of what that Harry Enten clip we played was referring to was if the Supreme Court does

01:28:05.880 find in favor of Louisiana, this could lead to redistricting in a number of states that

01:28:13.040 actually could cost the Democrats a number of seats.

01:28:16.000 The number I heard was as many as seven, potentially.

01:28:19.300 And so it really would matter electorally.

01:28:21.920 It's kind of funny to me how the Republicans essentially are saying, we are gerrymandering,

01:28:27.480 but not on race, based on politics.

01:28:29.200 We're not trying to keep down blacks, just Democrats.

01:28:32.360 And everybody's kind of like, yeah, that's the thing we're all really familiar with,

01:28:36.000 the Democrats do it to the Republicans and vice versa.

01:28:38.380 OK, we're going to take a quick pause.

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01:31:56.180 We are going on the road.

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01:31:59.260 Megan Kelly live.

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01:32:55.600 The guys from The Fifth Column are back with me.

01:33:02.320 Zoran Mamdani seems poised easily to win this mayoral race, which is depressing because he gives answers like this when asked very straightforward questions on Fox News by the very talented Martha McCallum.

01:33:14.360 If you are asked tomorrow night if you give credit to President Trump for the ceasefire between Israel and Hamas and the return of the 20 living hostages, would you raise your hand?

01:33:28.480 When it comes to the ceasefire, I am thankful and I have hope that it will actually endure and that it will be lasting.

01:33:36.480 And I continue to have concerns because I've seen reports still just in the last few days that five Palestinians were killed by the Israeli military.

01:33:42.940 And that's what gives me pause about issuing any kind of praise or celebration at a moment when it is still so in its infancy.

01:33:49.980 And what I will tell you is that in that same moment, it is also one that requires a focus on ensuring that that hope, that belief in a better future is one that is emblematic in our policies right here in New York City as well.

01:34:02.800 And that's what we're hoping to lead with.

01:34:04.120 Would you give President Trump credit or not to any extent credit or not?

01:34:07.320 I think it's too early to do so.

01:34:08.620 Too early to say.

01:34:09.200 But if it proves to be something that is lasting, something that is durable, then I think that that's where you give credit.

01:34:14.680 You're an asshole.

01:34:15.520 We have fucking 12, 20, 20 hostages are free.

01:34:20.260 Don't be such a dick.

01:34:21.840 I'm sorry, but like 20 hostages are free.

01:34:24.220 What do you mean it's too early?

01:34:25.980 Today's the day.

01:34:27.680 Back forever.

01:34:29.100 Why is he doing that?

01:34:30.340 Why?

01:34:31.900 Because he doesn't want to answer the question.

01:34:33.500 I mean, your point is right.

01:34:34.860 I mean, he's an asshole because, I mean, we say, well, if it's lasting,

01:34:37.920 if anybody watched those scenes on, I believe it was Monday night, and I stayed up to watch them.

01:34:43.680 It was, you know, they were being released at 9 a.m. in Israel.

01:34:47.060 And it was like unbearable to watch it because it was so happy and so depressing.

01:34:52.800 And because, you know, you have people who have 28 bodies that didn't come back.

01:34:57.080 I mean, I think eight did, and one wasn't even a dead hostage.

01:35:01.220 It was a Palestinian.

01:35:02.840 And it was like to watch all of that and the families and the joy and the heartbreak was unbelievable and unbearable almost to watch.

01:35:11.360 But it was a happy, joyous moment.

01:35:13.160 And if you can't share in that joy, something's really wrong with you.

01:35:15.880 So, you know, you had Zoran Mamdani's wife, and I don't blame him for his wife's politics,

01:35:22.100 but posting something on Instagram, you know, mourning the death of this Hamas operative,

01:35:28.220 which who is called Mr. Fafo, if you've been following this, you know who he is.

01:35:31.800 Yes, yes.

01:35:32.520 He celebrated 10-7.

01:35:34.300 Yeah, he celebrated 10-7.

01:35:35.860 There's a video of him joyous on that day.

01:35:38.220 And who was killed by other Palestinians.

01:35:39.980 What Mamdani says, five people were killed by Israel since the ceasefire.

01:35:46.040 I don't know who those people are.

01:35:47.280 I don't know if that's right, if they were fighters, if they were raising guns to people.

01:35:50.340 But there's lots and lots of video online that anyone can open their eyes and see of Palestinians being killed by Hamas.

01:35:58.220 In the Wall Street Journal, it's an incredible story, a really deeply reported story yesterday on the front page of the Wall Street Journal

01:36:04.060 of what has happened since Hamas has not been fully disarmed.

01:36:07.840 And, you know, Trump's response to that, which was a great one, is if you don't, the word we is what he used.

01:36:13.620 He said, if you don't disarm, we are going to do it.

01:36:16.940 So you better be smart about this, which was like-

01:36:19.480 Trump did actually say that one, unlike my tweet.

01:36:21.500 He actually did say that.

01:36:22.760 That was him.

01:36:23.740 That was not-

01:36:24.220 They will be disarming.

01:36:25.300 Hamas will be disarming.

01:36:27.300 Or we will disarm them.

01:36:29.300 Let me give you a second Zoram Mamdani soundbite on this exact front.

01:36:33.580 She asked a very good question here in Sot 5.

01:36:35.620 So, you've denounced Israel and the United States for the response to the slaughter on October the 7th.

01:36:43.460 In fact, at times, you've called it a lasting stain, the response.

01:36:47.660 And at times, you have left October 7th out of your statements completely around this issue.

01:36:53.980 You just talked about Israelis killing some Palestinians, but Hamas is killing Palestinians within Gaza.

01:37:00.400 And they have not returned the bodies that they promised to return, including two Americans.

01:37:06.040 So, what is your response to what Hamas is doing now?

01:37:09.780 I think those are bodies and remains that should absolutely be returned.

01:37:13.180 And I think that I have no issue with critiquing Hamas or the Israeli government,

01:37:17.620 because my critiques all come from a place of universal human rights.

01:37:20.680 And my focus, however, is right here in New York City in transforming the most expensive-

01:37:24.400 Do you believe that Hamas should lay down their weapons and leave the leadership in Gaza?

01:37:29.540 I believe that any future here in New York City is one that we have to make sure that's affordable for all.

01:37:34.740 And as it pertains to Israel and Palestine, that we have to ensure that there is peace.

01:37:38.460 And that is the future that we have to fight for.

01:37:40.280 But you won't say that Hamas should lay down their arms and give up leadership in Gaza?

01:37:43.680 I don't really have opinions about the future of Hamas and Israel beyond the question of justice and safety,

01:37:48.840 and the fact that anything has to abide by international law.

01:37:53.340 Absolutely.

01:37:54.400 Is Hamas aside as separate from justice and safety?

01:37:57.800 But by the way, I mean, the idea that he hasn't made any comments about the future of the region-

01:38:03.580 Right.

01:38:04.180 A provable, demonstrable lie.

01:38:06.460 On a daily basis.

01:38:07.240 On a daily basis.

01:38:08.760 On Instagram and in comments.

01:38:10.680 But if you cannot say, and I'm sorry, this city is the city that I live in, the city that I love dearly.

01:38:17.980 It is not the Middle East.

01:38:20.220 But if you say, well, I make comments all the time, but I'm not going to make one right now, by the way.

01:38:24.680 I will speak about Hamas, but I'm not going to say it right now.

01:38:27.280 If you cannot say that this is a knuckle-dragging death cult that murders Jews and enshrined in their charter

01:38:35.160 is the elimination of the state of Israel.

01:38:37.280 And if you cannot denounce that, I don't think you should be mayor of this city.

01:38:40.760 And I don't think that's a crazy opinion.

01:38:42.500 And not just murders Jews.

01:38:43.380 Totally agree.

01:38:44.200 No, murders Palestinians.

01:38:46.080 Yeah.

01:38:46.460 A vector of-

01:38:47.280 Anyone non-Hamas is potentially in danger.

01:38:49.720 Non-Hamas, yeah.

01:38:50.160 No, it's terrifying.

01:38:51.240 Cuomo is within like 10 or 11 points of him, according to the latest poll.

01:38:55.120 But he would need Sliwa to drop out, the Republican, and he would have to be banking on Sliwa's 15%

01:39:01.020 to all go to Andrew Cuomo, which is a big question mark, because I think I speak for all Republicans

01:39:05.660 when I say we can't stand Andrew Cuomo, and we don't want to help him.

01:39:09.080 But we also want to stop Zoram Mandani, so it's very hard.

01:39:12.880 What?

01:39:13.420 Say it again.

01:39:13.880 Say it again.

01:39:14.100 You should keep his promise to come on the fifth call and stop punting.

01:39:17.340 Yeah.

01:39:18.240 Oh, Andrew Cuomo?

01:39:20.080 Yes.

01:39:21.000 Scheduled interviews in the mega-

01:39:23.120 Will you do me a favor?

01:39:25.460 Do me a favor.

01:39:26.280 If that does wind up happening, would one of you guys just call me beforehand?

01:39:30.820 Let's just have a conversation beforehand.

01:39:32.560 No, no.

01:39:32.800 We want it to happen, so please don't say this on the air.

01:39:36.160 We will call you, but don't say it.

01:39:37.820 I'm only going to say good luck and have a great time.

01:39:41.140 That's all I want to say to you.

01:39:42.660 All right.

01:39:43.520 Before we go, we have to do something lighter that I really wanted to bring to you.

01:39:48.200 You may or may not be aware, because you focus on a lot of things on the fifth column.

01:39:52.720 You have a lot of things that you need to report on.

01:39:55.720 But in 2021, something dramatic happened over at Victoria's Secret.

01:40:01.480 And you probably missed it, but I'm just going to tell you how this went down.

01:40:05.120 But the headline from the New York Times was,

01:40:07.780 Victoria's Secret swaps angels for, quote, what women want.

01:40:12.520 Will they buy it?

01:40:14.120 The Victoria's Secret angels, those avatars of Barbie bodies and Playboy reverie, are gone.

01:40:19.240 Their wings, fluttery confections of rhinestones and feathers that could weigh almost 30 pounds,

01:40:23.340 are gathering dust in storage.

01:40:25.460 The fantasy bra dangling real diamonds and other gems is no more.

01:40:29.140 In their place, seven women famous for their achievements and not their proportions.

01:40:39.540 They include, well, I'm going to show you in a minute.

01:40:43.300 Don't put it up yet, Deb.

01:40:44.400 I'll show you in one second who it included.

01:40:46.860 And these women that they selected, quote, will be spearheading what may be the most extreme

01:40:52.320 and unabashed attempt at a brand turnaround in recent memory,

01:40:56.700 an effort to redefine the version of sexy that Victoria's Secret represents and sells to the masses.

01:41:03.580 Here was the woman leading the charge.

01:41:05.440 Yes, Megan Rapinoe, lover of all things trans.

01:41:16.860 That's what we got instead of the angels.

01:41:20.920 We also got the plus-sized model.

01:41:24.780 We were told we needed to celebrate body inclusivity.

01:41:27.940 So advocate Paloma El Cesar, she was there.

01:41:34.840 Here she is in the middle.

01:41:35.800 She's a little, you know, a little hefty, not too big.

01:41:38.760 But this is what they wanted you to admire and whatever else you do when you look at the

01:41:43.300 Victoria's Secret models instead of the girls in the wings.

01:41:49.640 I admire you.

01:41:50.920 Telly.

01:41:52.320 I'm just, whatever you do in your own private time is up to you.

01:41:55.940 And so that was the question.

01:41:58.120 Will this effort, spearheaded by these women who were not only going to participate in the

01:42:04.580 campaigns, but going to be advisors?

01:42:07.180 They were going to be, Megan Rapinoe was going to advise Victoria's Secret on what beauty means

01:42:11.000 and how to turn around the Victoria's Secret brand.

01:42:14.180 So they were spearheading the most extreme and unabashed attempt at a brand turnaround in

01:42:18.500 recent memory.

01:42:19.540 An attempt to redefine the version of sexy that they'd been going with.

01:42:24.860 Well, they just had the latest Victoria's Secret show.

01:42:27.700 So, and let's see how that went.

01:42:32.160 Huh.

01:42:34.120 We're back.

01:42:36.160 You're back.

01:42:37.180 The angels.

01:42:37.740 The angels are back.

01:42:39.560 Let's go.

01:42:40.200 The angels.

01:42:41.460 The 30-pound wings.

01:42:43.480 Yeah.

01:42:44.060 The 10-foot-tall women with the rocket bodies.

01:42:49.300 Yeah.

01:42:49.820 The tans.

01:42:51.780 Yeah.

01:42:52.360 The no fat.

01:42:53.700 It's all back.

01:42:55.920 You're victorial for the accomplishment.

01:42:57.700 Sorry.

01:42:58.660 So you're shocked.

01:42:59.640 Shocked that it didn't work.

01:43:01.140 Are you demanding more?

01:43:02.340 Megan Rapinoe, please walk me through your thoughts.

01:43:05.980 Megan, I don't want you to put me on the spot like this, because I, as I said earlier,

01:43:10.120 I love all women and I have to empower them.

01:43:13.120 But I think that these women are really doing a job of empowering women that the other ones

01:43:19.220 couldn't.

01:43:19.960 I don't know why, but they love it.

01:43:22.720 There's something intangible.

01:43:23.640 I think like the second girl, her novel was incredible.

01:43:26.420 Did you read her novel?

01:43:26.920 Uh-huh.

01:43:27.320 The second girl was like that?

01:43:28.820 Oh, it was in Russian, but like, I think it's in translation now, but it's amazing.

01:43:34.080 It's been a lot of time.

01:43:35.460 A lot of time with it.

01:43:37.240 The great, it's only a man could do this.

01:43:40.180 Not that.

01:43:41.200 Only a man could say the thing at the beginning is that we are going to do things for women.

01:43:46.360 We're going to put women out on the catwalk for women.

01:43:49.240 Have you ever seen a woman's Instagram feed?

01:43:53.360 It's all hot women.

01:43:55.100 I'm like, what is all beautiful women?

01:43:58.200 Granted, it's who you are following on Instagram.

01:44:00.760 Yes.

01:44:01.000 We don't want to look at Megan Rapinoe any more than a man does.

01:44:06.340 Nobody wants to look at her.

01:44:07.400 I'm sorry.

01:44:07.900 That's just the way it is.

01:44:10.800 Literally, nobody wants to look at Megan Rapinoe.

01:44:12.720 And everyone, male and female, if they have eyes, would like to look at those Victoria's

01:44:17.720 Secret angels and say, hashtag goals.

01:44:20.880 The goals are different, but they're there for both of us.

01:44:24.580 And somebody figured that out.

01:44:26.980 Because, you know, these women are fine, but I only have an eye for one woman and wife.

01:44:32.440 Oh, Lord.

01:44:34.300 But they're fine.

01:44:36.200 Yeah.

01:44:36.480 They're doing fine.

01:44:38.120 I want to have a universalist thing, too, at the end and say that

01:44:42.580 I have an eye for all women.

01:44:44.440 Yes.

01:44:44.700 And it's obvious when I'm in a room.

01:44:48.980 I'm very respectful of their achievements.

01:44:52.820 Yes.

01:44:53.120 You know, I love it.

01:44:54.120 Can you guys indulge me literally just three extra minutes?

01:44:56.700 I know I do this to you all the time.

01:44:57.760 I promise I will have you out of here by the top of the hour.

01:44:59.880 But I've got to go over this other piece of this story.

01:45:02.200 And you are the perfect guest for it.

01:45:04.620 There was a report on CNN just a couple of days ago that the headline of which is as follows.

01:45:13.160 After years of progress on gender, the male gaze is back.

01:45:19.460 Gaze.

01:45:20.260 Progress on gender.

01:45:23.040 Gaze as in G-A-Z-E.

01:45:26.680 Yeah.

01:45:27.320 The male gaze have always been around.

01:45:29.520 They did not go away.

01:45:31.180 The male gaze were always there, CNN.

01:45:33.980 No.

01:45:34.880 And this.

01:45:35.520 OK, it's written by somebody named Madeline Holcomb, writer for CNN Wellness.

01:45:39.200 And here is what she writes.

01:45:41.780 In the past decade, I saw the evidence of progress in my media diet.

01:45:46.520 The movies, the shows, the books, the advertisements I consumed were increasingly giving women a seat at the table.

01:45:53.100 Heroin chic fell away.

01:45:54.500 And body positivity entered the fashion world.

01:45:57.420 Stories about a woman stealing her man were traded for celebration of the girl's girl who resisted the competition for men's attention.

01:46:03.760 It seemed like women were taking a deeper breath with such heavy cultural restrictions.

01:46:07.320 And then there was a shift.

01:46:10.700 The recent rise of weight loss medications.

01:46:13.620 It coincided with social media influencers sharing ways to get smaller and no longer celebrating bodies of all sizes.

01:46:21.260 Advertisements followed suit, making men's desire once again a dominating factor in how stories are told and how women are portrayed.

01:46:30.100 The culprit, I have learned, is the male gaze.

01:46:35.980 It's the gaze.

01:46:37.440 They get blamed for everything.

01:46:39.120 It was always there.

01:46:40.560 But now it has stepped back into the spotlight.

01:46:43.980 The male gaze came roaring back this summer.

01:46:46.800 The Sydney Sweeney ad she mentions.

01:46:49.320 Another beauty campaign that was led by somebody hot.

01:46:52.500 And this year saw viral content around the only fan lunatic who wanted to break the world record for most sexual partners.

01:47:00.120 Somehow that's part of what Republicanism and their desire to bring back what is normal male behavior.

01:47:05.740 If you are observing women in movies, TV, fashion, social media, and marketing, and they don't feel as fully materialized as their male counterparts, that is the male gaze.

01:47:20.160 That's the male gaze.

01:47:21.360 The woman's value is reduced in so far as existing for pleasure or basically to be an object, says the Loyola University of Chicago Quinlan School of Business professor.

01:47:34.180 They quote, and then just a bit more, and I'll give it to you boys.

01:47:37.600 It's Bond girls and a long, lingering shot panning up a woman's body in an advertisement for soda.

01:47:44.120 Looking at Cindy Crawford, clearly.

01:47:46.040 It's when an action movie accessory is running through explosions in tiny shorts and flowing.

01:47:57.420 Every man is enjoying these images in their head right now.

01:48:02.740 That's the way life works.

01:48:05.300 Flowing curled hair before collapsing helplessly in the hero's arms.

01:48:09.820 And a social media star making a recipe while all dolled up and explaining her steps in a soft, sultry voice.

01:48:18.680 Okay.

01:48:19.480 So that's her theory.

01:48:21.780 By the way, you won't be surprised to learn she later reveals that the prevailing perspective in stories, art, and advertising is not just male, but white.

01:48:30.060 And all of this makes those who don't align with those identities have less power.

01:48:35.740 It's disempowering.

01:48:37.640 She feels unmaterialized.

01:48:39.880 I follow Halle Berry.

01:48:41.120 Do you remember that Bond girl, the one that was like 350 pounds?

01:48:45.060 It was like running a scene with the Bond girl.

01:48:47.680 Do you remember when James Bond was 350 pounds?

01:48:50.620 Yeah, yeah.

01:48:50.940 That is the actual...

01:48:52.360 I would take all of this more seriously if they were advocating for me.

01:48:55.700 Like, what about how I feel every time I see Henry Cavill or The Rock or something get cast and something, and they're just focused on their abs?

01:49:02.960 Like, how does that make me feel?

01:49:04.720 Have you ever seen a fat guy with his shirt off on the cover of a magazine?

01:49:09.080 Yeah.

01:49:09.340 I've seen very big women in The Rock.

01:49:12.720 Who? Seen who?

01:49:13.800 Have you ever seen a fat guy with his shirt off on the cover of a magazine?

01:49:19.080 Men's health.

01:49:19.880 It must have been like a Chris Farley magazine cover.

01:49:24.640 It's a laugh line.

01:49:26.200 It's like John Candy.

01:49:27.440 It's like a laugh line.

01:49:28.440 And it's like there was that moment, which she laments, I do not lament, that moment where the Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue, like, minimum was like 500 pounds.

01:49:39.760 Yeah.

01:49:40.280 Minimum.

01:49:40.940 It was just like this baseline and, like, missing a limb.

01:49:43.860 It was everything you couldn't just...

01:49:46.620 And then I was just like, oh, okay.

01:49:48.740 You must share my fetish.

01:49:50.940 I'm looking for the hockey match.

01:49:52.200 I'm not interested in that.

01:49:52.980 No, and they were literally putting transvestites, or transsexual, like men, posing as women.

01:49:57.280 You know, like people with penises in the Sports Illustrated swimsuit model.

01:50:01.260 And now if you don't like that, that's because you're, I guess, part of the problem.

01:50:05.960 White, male, and empowered.

01:50:09.840 Has failed.

01:50:10.540 I mean, Victoria's Secret reverts to the wings.

01:50:13.100 The Sports Illustrated swimsuit model puts swimsuits...

01:50:16.220 Playboy?

01:50:16.880 Playboy went...

01:50:18.180 Non-nudity.

01:50:18.760 Non-nudity for like a hot...

01:50:20.460 Yeah, a couple of days.

01:50:21.160 Yeah.

01:50:22.540 They were like, what are we doing?

01:50:24.740 Wait, who are we?

01:50:25.960 An Irish bar not serving whiskey.

01:50:28.240 This is not going to do it.

01:50:29.560 These companies aren't taking money anymore, because like no one, if it was an actual money-making concern,

01:50:34.480 would just like throw all that money off the table.

01:50:36.540 But the best example of this, of the failure of this kind of ideology that was forced on us.

01:50:42.400 Market was not deciding here.

01:50:43.580 Progress on gender.

01:50:44.940 Yeah, progress on gender.

01:50:46.020 Imagine that.

01:50:46.740 Progress on a biological reality.

01:50:48.600 And by the way, I just want to be...

01:50:49.540 Stop looking.

01:50:49.860 To the listeners of the Megyn Kelly show, the viewers of Megyn Kelly show, that through

01:50:54.620 all that period, I heroically, as a dissident, kept on gazing at women, and no one stopped

01:51:02.100 me.

01:51:02.500 I was like, look, there's a hot girl.

01:51:04.400 Oh, no, no.

01:51:05.040 Not even in the show.

01:51:05.720 Is this a story about another surreptitious subway picture you took?

01:51:09.420 Oh, which one?

01:51:11.840 The first you're photographing the woman's button, but really, what else is on that camera

01:51:16.080 roll?

01:51:16.260 Can you hold still, please?

01:51:21.540 But honestly, like all of this is, it's not totally unrelated to the AOC clip we started

01:51:26.500 the show with, right?

01:51:27.400 Like they tried to beat maleness out of men for years.

01:51:32.320 They tried to tell you you were toxic in your masculinity if you wanted to look at the

01:51:37.500 beautiful angels.

01:51:39.260 And every man alive knew that was a lie.

01:51:42.140 Correct.

01:51:42.700 And also that you were a collaborationist if you were a female who appreciates female

01:51:46.120 beauty too, which-

01:51:47.400 Oh, wait, wait, Matt, she writes this.

01:51:48.980 She says, I'll let you finish it.

01:51:51.240 She writes, women sometimes turn the male gaze on one another.

01:51:54.080 It happens when they objectify themselves, promote traditional gender roles as the ideal

01:51:59.860 way of living, and or enforce beauty standards for others.

01:52:04.780 See, you're right.

01:52:06.900 That's internalized racism of gender, right?

01:52:09.580 Yeah.

01:52:10.200 It's the same idea.

01:52:11.340 Internalized misogyny.

01:52:12.920 Internalized misogyny, right?

01:52:13.540 I've been accused of that many times.

01:52:15.060 I hate myself, and I hate women, and that's why I have to rip on women.

01:52:19.640 Meanwhile, I'm an equal opportunity offender.

01:52:21.880 I have plenty of men I've ripped to shreds.

01:52:23.820 The evidence will speak for itself.

01:52:25.140 It's exactly true.

01:52:26.300 Megan doesn't hate women.

01:52:27.600 She just hates lots of women, and it's not because they're women.

01:52:30.600 It's because they're idiots.

01:52:32.320 It's true.

01:52:33.680 My daughter was watching this supermodel documentary on Apple Plus or something, which

01:52:39.220 was great.

01:52:39.640 I was really interested in it.

01:52:41.760 He's such a supportive dad.

01:52:43.580 I want to support you and sit here and watch, and don't talk to me during it.

01:52:48.900 I need to go to your room.

01:52:50.200 Can you pass me the blanket?

01:52:51.940 But the funny thing about this, to your appointment, who is responsible for this, it is actually

01:52:56.680 the male gaze, YS, because it was just all the people doing these fashions, all gay

01:53:02.260 men doing this.

01:53:03.480 And it's like, deep down inside, they're still men.

01:53:07.520 They're still strep men.

01:53:09.040 A little bit.

01:53:09.840 It's like, I'm a diabetic.

01:53:10.820 I still produce a little insulin.

01:53:12.580 There's a bit left.

01:53:13.680 They're like, we know what they want.

01:53:15.880 And so the male gaze and the male gaze, it's both the problem.

01:53:21.460 Yeah.

01:53:22.120 The projection.

01:53:23.040 I support them.

01:53:23.760 The amount of projection in our politics.

01:53:25.200 A little insulin.

01:53:25.720 They are puritanical in the extreme.

01:53:30.180 They're trying to police your desires.

01:53:32.380 You are not allowed to like that.

01:53:33.600 They are not.

01:53:34.540 It's not.

01:53:36.220 You will like Megan Rapinoe.

01:53:38.280 Yeah.

01:53:38.660 No.

01:53:39.040 What a failed project.

01:53:40.220 Do you like this?

01:53:40.780 I'm like, no, I am not going to like this.

01:53:43.280 Oh, no.

01:53:43.640 No.

01:53:43.720 I'm going to continue easing.

01:53:45.780 We filmed this here in Soho, and it is a challenge to walk two blocks in Soho because

01:53:52.540 of my male gaze.

01:53:53.480 It's actually true.

01:53:53.960 It's like I walk in a studio, I walk into potholes, I'm like walking.

01:53:58.060 And not far away in Chelsea, it is a problem to walk because of the male gaze too.

01:54:03.260 I mean, it's.

01:54:03.700 Yeah, but that's the time when I feel good, Megan.

01:54:05.760 Yeah.

01:54:06.020 Because the male gaze on me.

01:54:09.460 This is a funny story.

01:54:11.440 Doug and I lived in Chelsea when we first got married.

01:54:14.020 And it was like, I had an apartment and we both moved in there.

01:54:17.040 And he was living in a different place altogether.

01:54:20.100 But anyway, we moved into Chelsea.

01:54:22.160 And at the time, I had two little shih tzus.

01:54:24.400 And after they went to the groomer, they'd get like the little bows in their hair.

01:54:27.500 You know, they look very sort of frou-frou.

01:54:30.060 And Doug, being a great guy, he would walk the dogs.

01:54:33.200 You know, I wasn't always the one who walked them.

01:54:34.700 He would walk them too.

01:54:35.640 And one day he came home and he goes, no rule.

01:54:38.620 He goes, no more hot pink poop bags for the dogs.

01:54:42.540 It's tough enough out there.

01:54:43.880 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:54:46.040 Hey, Doug.

01:54:47.460 I mean, Doug walking to Chelsea is going to be a problem.

01:54:50.560 Doug walking to Chelsea is a problem.

01:54:51.760 But it's not, I mean, the thing is, as a man, when you're on the other end of that.

01:54:55.900 Because, you know, women don't, they don't really do it to you in a bit.

01:54:58.860 But when men do it to you, you're like, oh, that's pretty, that's pretty cool.

01:55:01.840 Because, you know, it makes me a little like it.

01:55:04.340 It depends on how intense.

01:55:05.280 He's debating in the position.

01:55:06.720 I don't think Doug enjoyed it.

01:55:08.560 I think he was against it.

01:55:10.000 And he was kind of relieved when we moved to the Upper West Side, where we just got

01:55:12.820 harassed by Greenpeace.

01:55:13.900 Totally different story.

01:55:15.300 I do want to say one of the.

01:55:16.320 He's been in every time against Greenpeace.

01:55:18.420 One other real connection that this story, because this is obviously she's a lunatic,

01:55:23.020 this person.

01:55:23.580 But did you see the news that NBC laid off some 150 staffers and they're all from the

01:55:29.980 DEI department?

01:55:31.500 Like the, you know, yeah, like the Pride department and the DEI department, basically all that.

01:55:37.540 The gender and the race people who are enforcing the gender and the race rules over at NBC.

01:55:42.720 And we're seeing that at company after company after company.

01:55:45.740 But obviously the NBC one jumped out at me because I thought, I thought they were super

01:55:48.920 non-racist and super pro-Pride and super all that.

01:55:51.320 And like all this shows is they were lying all along.

01:55:54.460 They've all been lying all along.

01:55:55.960 They hired these people because they were threatened by BLM and the human rights campaign.

01:56:01.980 And it's all coming down.

01:56:04.440 The house of cards is coming down around us.

01:56:06.480 Every day there's another article about how there's been mass layoffs at a company and

01:56:11.260 it's all the DEI people.

01:56:13.000 And this is so promising because the more of this that happens, I'm sorry for anybody

01:56:17.320 to lose their job, but I'm, I totally don't believe in this job.

01:56:20.040 So that's where my comments come from.

01:56:21.960 Um, the more of this that happens, the more likely we're going to see a world in which

01:56:27.940 they eliminate that fake major at all of these top Ivy league colleges where you can major

01:56:31.920 in like whatever gender studies or DEI is probably now itself a major.

01:56:36.680 And therefore people won't be funneled into this fake profession and be living their lives around race

01:56:42.880 essentialism or gender essentialism or whatever it is.

01:56:45.740 So it's a very good sign that that layoff at NBC, as much as I do feel for people losing their jobs,

01:56:50.600 is a very positive sign.

01:56:52.100 Um, as is the news, we haven't gotten to it this week, but the news about, um, the, the young college age students

01:57:00.920 no longer identifying with anything other than male or female.

01:57:05.860 Like they're, they're saying goodbye to non-binary and trans identities.

01:57:11.460 Uh, it was at like 9% at the, at places like Andover prep school and, uh, Columbia university.

01:57:17.940 And now it's fallen to 3%, like it's way down.

01:57:21.840 So the incoming freshman class is far less.

01:57:24.980 And even bisexual is going by the wayside.

01:57:27.680 They're not identity.

01:57:28.500 They're heterosexual numbers have gone up.

01:57:31.000 The male gays have stayed the same.

01:57:32.940 The female lesbians have stayed the same.

01:57:35.620 Um, but hetero is going up and, uh, bi is going down.

01:57:40.360 And then over on the gender front, non-binary and trans are way down.

01:57:45.120 The freshman class is far more, forgive me, normal than the senior class at these universities

01:57:51.400 and even high schools are.

01:57:53.500 And that's yet another reason to celebrate.

01:57:55.780 Thank God, right?

01:57:56.660 But unfortunately that fad cost a lot of people very, very dearly.

01:58:01.660 So it's, it's sad what they've been put through by disgusting, corrupt medical system.

01:58:06.560 But I see all of this as reason to be optimistic and hopeful.

01:58:11.200 How about you guys?

01:58:11.700 Yeah, the, a lot of people, um, who I know were really allergic to the analysis that some

01:58:19.220 of those numbers, that spike number of people self-identifying in middle school and high

01:58:24.640 school as non-binary or, um, or whatever, um, uh, uh, say this is social contagion.

01:58:31.460 And I would say this because I have a 17 year old daughter and I saw, um, her circles, like

01:58:37.580 suddenly everybody was non-binary, was a lesbian, was like a member of the, and just look at

01:58:42.840 him like, I've known you your whole life.

01:58:44.640 You are so not trust me.

01:58:46.560 I know this was, this was a social contagion moment and people are allergic to that because

01:58:51.740 they think that there's, it's all about a negative association with the underlying

01:58:55.300 condition, which I don't have any negative feeling towards people who expressing who they

01:58:59.560 actually are or identifying as they actually are.

01:59:01.360 That is fine.

01:59:01.980 What I have, uh, I don't have a warm feeling about is like peer pressure on 13 year olds,

01:59:07.900 um, to get rewarded for being marginalized into an identity that they don't actually have.

01:59:13.120 And that took place.

01:59:14.560 And there was some dire consequences for some people as part of that.

01:59:17.660 But when you, one of the things, one of the reasons you see these numbers going down

01:59:21.860 is, you know, obviously the culture changes, but the reward system changes.

01:59:26.080 And there, I mean, when you are a white guy who has, you know, no dog in this fight, you

01:59:33.580 in these kinds of sweepstakes, you don't, well, I, as a, uh, black, uh, this, that, when

01:59:38.720 you're just like a white guy, you could choose non-binary cause it was meaningless.

01:59:41.920 Right.

01:59:42.580 And that, and there was some, there was some reward to that.

01:59:45.720 You, well, I'm a non-binary person and everybody wanted to get involved in that.

01:59:49.820 I saw this close up of saying like, you know, well, I don't use those pronouns.

01:59:53.580 And it's like, they, they, they look, there's no indication physically, the way they dress

02:00:00.520 that they are anything but the gender that they actually are.

02:00:03.740 They got a little extra credit for that.

02:00:06.420 When you take the credit away, it's much like the DEI stuff in, um, you know, at NBC.

02:00:11.720 We talked about this on the show the other day, Megan, about, you know, what you, I talked,

02:00:15.000 oh, you know, I talked about this with your brilliant, brilliant producer, Steve Krakauer,

02:00:18.580 who was on the Moynihan Report, uh, two days ago, I think two days ago.

02:00:22.000 And Steve was making a great point.

02:00:24.100 And we had a conversation about these shows, right?

02:00:26.240 These, these Jimmy Kimmel shows, they cost, you know, $300 million to make.

02:00:30.240 And they have a fraction of the viewers of like the Megyn Kelly show.

02:00:33.360 And, you know, Steve making the point that they'll be picking these things out.

02:00:36.780 I mean, if they're smart, these very, very low production costs, cause they're losing

02:00:40.420 money.

02:00:40.960 And, but what is the first thing you do when you're at NBC and you're like, okay, we're

02:00:45.680 losing money.

02:00:46.240 Cause we're spending a bazillion dollars on all these late night shows, these other shows

02:00:49.400 that don't make money and you have a department of 130 people who do nothing, but kind of

02:00:54.260 wag their finger.

02:00:55.600 I mean, the market is deciding there that these are the first people you can find.

02:00:59.480 And if they produce content as in Vice, where Michael used to work, the content they produce

02:01:03.560 is so hysterically unpopular.

02:01:05.100 You cannot believe the numbers.

02:01:06.440 Yeah.

02:01:06.600 Which I outlined in my piece for the free press about when I got a hold, cause nobody ever

02:01:12.300 had the numbers of which, uh, pieces online performed.

02:01:15.120 Well, the YouTube stuff, you could see that all those, those numbers were juiced, but

02:01:19.340 I got a, an Excel spreadsheet of which, uh, uh, pieces performed well.

02:01:24.080 Someone gave it to me and I wrote about it in that piece and all the ones of, you know,

02:01:28.520 uh, Gwen Stefani is problematic because she wore a Bindi or things like that.

02:01:32.960 Or the jet, it was absolute rock bottom.

02:01:36.720 And to Megan's point that nobody believes this.

02:01:38.900 I also wrote about in that piece, um, people that I saw on calls speaking in this insane

02:01:44.420 language.

02:01:44.900 And then I would speak to them two hours later.

02:01:46.820 They'd be like, Oh yeah, that's ridiculous.

02:01:47.880 I don't believe any of that.

02:01:48.620 Oh my God.

02:01:49.600 Oh, that's crazy.

02:01:51.340 It actually happened.

02:01:52.560 It happened to me.

02:01:53.820 The house of cards is it's falling.

02:01:55.860 You can feel it.

02:01:56.600 You see it every day in the paper, online on X, a new report of some company eliminating

02:02:01.700 this department altogether.

02:02:02.980 Next up, we have to do the majors in the colleges.

02:02:05.000 So these people aren't misdirected for an entire four years plus in getting an education.

02:02:09.600 They could actually, you know, either skip college or get like a real, a real major that

02:02:13.940 might actually prepare you for life.

02:02:15.680 Not that.

02:02:16.380 And I'm super encouraged by it.

02:02:17.840 I really think there's a lot of reason to hope notwithstanding that more on AOC and her

02:02:22.240 backward messaging on where we allegedly are.

02:02:25.260 I love you guys.

02:02:26.460 Thanks for sticking around late.

02:02:27.760 And it did take longer than three minutes.

02:02:29.380 I apologize.

02:02:30.200 Great to see you.

02:02:30.980 Always.

02:02:31.540 All right.

02:02:32.740 See you soon.

02:02:34.300 Bye guys.

02:02:35.740 Love them.

02:02:36.600 It's always such a great day when the fifth column comes on, when you can talk about anything.

02:02:39.260 I mean, it's wonderful to have a guest, a group of guests who can talk about anything.

02:02:43.820 Not everybody can go in depth on, you know, Gaza, politics, culture, and Victoria's Secret.

02:02:51.140 And funny as hell, all three of them make me laugh every time they're on.

02:02:55.720 Okay.

02:02:56.080 Tomorrow, another favorite guest.

02:02:57.860 VDH is here.

02:02:58.900 We will.

02:02:59.460 See you then.

02:03:01.960 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show.

02:03:03.880 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

02:03:13.620 Okay.

02:03:14.480 Flights on air Canada.

02:03:15.880 Oh, wow.

02:03:16.760 Mallorca.

02:03:17.280 That's new.

02:03:18.020 Oh, nice.

02:03:19.260 But Vienna is a classic.

02:03:21.080 Mozart, palaces, and schnitzel.

02:03:23.460 Mm.

02:03:23.640 Now you're cooking.

02:03:24.900 If you're hungry, deli brings the heat.

02:03:27.060 Heat.

02:03:27.940 Cartagena's got sun and the sea to cool off.

02:03:30.540 So does Martinique.

02:03:32.100 Mm.

02:03:32.720 And that French cuisine.

02:03:34.080 Book it.

02:03:35.040 Yes, chef.

02:03:36.120 Wait.

02:03:36.820 What about Lyon?

02:03:38.080 Choose from our world of destinations, if you can.

02:03:41.400 Air Canada.

02:03:42.660 Nice travels.

02:03:43.640 From 20th Century Studios.

02:03:46.720 Everything dies, but if that's not bad.

02:03:50.500 On October 24th, discover why critics are calling Springsteen Deliver Me From Nowhere,

02:03:54.780 an intelligent journey into the soul of an artist.

02:03:57.200 I don't need to be perfect.

02:03:58.240 I just want it to feel right.

02:03:59.640 Golden Globe winner, Jeremy Allen White.

02:04:01.580 Trying to find something real in all the noise.

02:04:03.840 Academy Award nominee, Jeremy Strong.

02:04:05.820 You always do.

02:04:07.320 I'm the same.

02:04:07.780 Springsteen Deliver Me From Nowhere

02:04:11.080 All mean theaters, October 24th

The Megyn Kelly Show - October 16, 2025

AOC and Bernie's Wild Town Hall, Mamdani Clams Up, and Victoria's Secret is Back, with The Fifth Column ｜ Ep. 1173

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