AOC vs. Vance, Bongino Leaving FBI, and Coldplay ＂Kiss Cam＂ Woman Speaks Out, with Glenn Greenwald ｜ Ep. 1216
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 55 minutes
Words per Minute
184.70468
Summary
The shooter who killed two and wounded nine at Brown University is still on the loose. Plus, it's AOC v JDV in a potential preview of 2028, and Glenn Greenwald joins The Megynkel show to talk about personal responsibility.
Transcript
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Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.
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We've got our twinkly Christmas trees and I've got a sparkly Christmas shirt and it's happening.
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It's high noon and we're going to tell you why that term is in the news today.
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It's actually, I think, my favorite story of the day.
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It has something to do with that viral video of the couple at the Coldplay concert last summer.
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The shooter who killed two and wounded nine at Brown University Saturday, still on the loose.
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Amazingly, the completely dark, shaded, unreadable video that they put out of the suspect hasn't ginned up any leads.
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And the authorities don't seem to have much more, although there is one glimmer of hope and we'll tell you what it is.
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Plus, it's AOC versus JDV in a potential preview of 2028.
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Here to talk about all of this and more is Glenn Greenwald.
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He's a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist and host of Rumble's System Update.
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We talk a lot about personal responsibility on this show.
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That's gojevity, G-E-V-I-T-I dot com slash Megan.
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Because no one should control your health decisions but you.
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I feel a little bit like the Grinch after that big buildup you gave yourself about how Christmassy you are.
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But I'm going to try and get in the holiday spirit, even if it's not with my clothing and background.
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Like I have about 200 sparkly little diamonds, fake diamonds on my black shirt.
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Makes me feel like I'm ready for Santa and some Nog.
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So there's so many fun things that I want to go through with you.
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I'm like genuinely some days you just wake up and the news cycle is amazing.
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And then you see who the guest is and you're like, it's Mana from heaven.
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This is exactly the man I want to be talking to.
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New poll puts Dem Star ahead of Vance in 2028 showdown.
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AOC leads JD Vance for first time in 2028 election matchup, colon, poll.
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AOC retweeted the poll with just the word bloop, B-L-O-O-P, and an exclamation point.
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But Grok says, it seemed to be a playful exclamation, like a lighthearted, there it is,
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So this poll had her up 51-49 over JD Vance in a poll of 1,500 registered voters taken
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between December 5th and 11th in a hypothetical 2028 matchup.
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She's enjoying the fact that she's beating Vance, and so is the mainstream media running
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We actually took a look at this poll done by Argument slash Verisite.
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And the first thing we do with any poll here at the MK Show is we go to 538, which is an
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aggregator of polls, and we see whether they use it.
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Well, they, because they exclude the least reliable polls, and it's not rated by 538.
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It is not accepted by 538 as a legitimate poll.
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New York Times as well says it does not meet their standards to be included in their polling
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It is not a traditional independent polling outlet like Gallup or Pew.
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It is a media organization offering proprietary polling alongside its opinion journalism.
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It's a D.C.-based media company that employs people like Matt Iglesias.
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They say, we make a positive, combative case for liberalism, and Verisite is their offshoot
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You can be a partisan outlet like Fox and have an objecting polling outlet.
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But in any event, what do you make of Bloop, like she's beating J.D. Vance in a head-to-head
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And what does it tell us about whether she's likely to run?
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You know, I've been doing journalism for 20 years now.
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I've been paying, as a result, very close attention to politics, and it's a passion of
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The very first thing that ever made me have, like, even a glimmer of wanting to turn away
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is the way in which Democrats have decided that because it worked for Trump, they're
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now supposed to be, you know, kind of, like, loose with their language and show how cool
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they are and how they don't speak like D.C. politicians.
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They have all these consultants advising them on what to do.
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And AOC is a particularly horrible case of it because, you know, when she was elected,
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She's now, like, heading into her mid to late 30s, heading into 40 years old.
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And she's still trying on top of, like, that really cringy Democratic effort to sound, you
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know, like, playful and relatable and cool to kind of have it infused with this very young
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And I also don't understand why, if you are, you know, like a liberal outlet, which, of course,
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this is trying to produce polling numbers that suggest that someone who has no chance to
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be president could actually credibly run when it seems so counterproductive.
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Like, why would you want to build up somebody with a fake poll who you know will get destroyed?
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So it just the whole thing seems so bizarre to me.
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So she came out today and she was asked about it by Pablo Manriquez.
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Do you think that you'll beat, that you could beat J.D.
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Vance in a head-to-head race for president, as polling suggests in 2028?
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Listen, these polls, like, three years out are, you know, they are what they are.
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If I really have to continue to watch Democrats behaving in this manner, I don't know if I
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Like, for as much as I love the work, it might actually make me just go in and want to, like,
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Because, you know, it would be one thing of, like, that's really how she were, that were
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Was that, was there anything, you know, like, just smooth about that?
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You know, it's just, I think that is the main problem is, is, is Democrats, the big problem
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And if you don't even have a personality, it's very hard to convince people that you actually
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Like, even if you're, even if your personality is fake.
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My, my team's always giving me the latest, which I appreciate.
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He tweeted out, he tweeted out, AOC has something you can't teach.
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What, what that thing is, we probably disagree on.
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She is all performative emotion, very little substance.
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Frankly, as, as a lot of kids who grow up in alcoholic or drug-addled households can be,
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like, one of the things they learn is to, like, tamp down emotions.
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I'm married to one, so I can make the Presbyterian jokes.
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But they're, they, they are emotionally regulated because you can only have one explosive personality
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And most kids born to drug addicts, like J.D. Vance was, she wasn't a drug addict when
00:10:44.120
They don't have, they're not prone to overly emotional outbursts like AOC is.
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And so, honestly, if you actually think it through, like her out on the trail with her
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screaming, there's so many videos of her screaming at the crowds.
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It would be like a surgeon with a scalpel against, like, a fish flopping on the deck, unable to
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For a long time, I think the way people thought, who were Republicans on the right side, right
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wing side of media, was to talk about her as though she was some sort of radical, like
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some sort of far left dissident, some sort of extremist.
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And the first person who actually understood what AOC really is was Marjorie Taylor Greene,
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who never attacked her as a radical, but always attacked her as a fraud.
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Somebody who was actually really nothing more than this empty careerist, this Democratic
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She had like a little bit of flavoring of trying to sound like more on the left wing
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But very quickly, she just morphed into a Democratic Party operative.
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So whatever else is unique about her is just pure show.
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It's like a theater kid sort of behavior that draws attention to herself.
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But it's not because of any interesting or compelling or substantive ideas.
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She's really there is nothing radical about her unless you just think that ordinary Democratic
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And then on the J.D. Vance side, I always wondered about J.D. Vance's ability to be a compelling
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politician because of that lack of kind of overt charisma.
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And the thing that really convinced me that I don't think it'll ever be, obviously, in comparison
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to Trump, that it's almost like a bar too high for anybody or even like Obama or Clinton,
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like the great politicians, he doesn't have that.
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But when he debated Tim Waltz and he was able to modulate how he was speaking and conducting
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himself while at the same time being uncompromising on his views, knowing that it was America's
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And it was a very kind of, you know, kind of sandpaper, the sharp edges off and the ability
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to do that for 90 minutes, no matter how much they're trying to provoke you, while at
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the same time delivering your message effectively.
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And I think the more he's on the national stage, the better he's going to get.
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No Democrat, I promise you, wants 2028 to be J.D. Vance versus AOC, no matter how much
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AOC is doing her little fake dances for journalists when asked.
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I told the audience about this earlier this week.
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And can I tell you, Glenn, he's gotten a lot better at the—like, he always had charisma,
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He wasn't really ready to let you in when he was younger.
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Obviously, I'm a member of the press, so we're used to people being defensive toward us.
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I have to tell you, like, he worked that room like Bill Clinton.
00:14:04.720
He was inquiring about people's children by name.
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He was making everyone feel like they were special in not an artificial way, not like
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an Obama kind of way, but like a real—like a talent, like a political talent.
00:14:20.380
And so my number one thought in watching him was he's using this vice presidency not just
00:14:26.180
to help the nation, but to help his own political skills.
00:14:31.760
Well, and I think also, you know, we have to remember that he is still quite young, and
00:14:37.520
he has had a lot of very kind of contradictory impulses, right?
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Like he grew up as, you know, in the way that you described, but like a very, you know,
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familiar now, like working-class family with addiction and all kinds of family problems.
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And then suddenly he's in Ivy League schools, and he's with Peter Thiel, and he's, you
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know, in high finance in Silicon Valley, hating Donald Trump.
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And then he starts, you know, evolving politically as well.
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And sometimes it just takes a while in life to find yourself, like to feel comfortable with
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who you are, to really have a good sense of self-possession.
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And that can take, you know, into your 30s or early 40s, which is where J.D.
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And I don't think that's a very uncommon evolution.
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And I do think that you can see a kind of greater comfort in J.D.
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Vance's own skin the more he kind of becomes convinced about the values he wants to pursue
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I still think it's going to take a lot of work, given that people do have suspicions
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when somebody has had so many different kinds of manifestations of who they are and what they
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But he's obviously very skilled at expressing himself and at communicating.
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And he has a lot of time to build that trust that the public needs.
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Well, it'd be very interesting, too, to see him up against an AOC when they start talking
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about their personal backgrounds, because AOC wants us to believe that she grew up the way
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She could barely get food onto the table like these are lies.
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Vance's history is actually extremely tumultuous.
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Middletown, Ohio, is a working class neighborhood when he grew up in it.
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It wasn't like he was not going to eat, but he did have Pepsi in his baby bottle.
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I mean, he grew up in a way that is really not great and slept in his jeans.
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He writes about how when he was at Yale Law School, he went to a party that they offered
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I think it was I'm trying to remember the analogy, but like they offered him maybe like
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He did not understand the silverware on the plates, you know, next to the plates.
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He really came from nothing and miss, you know, literally saying I could barely put food
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She grew up in Yorktown Heights, which is a lovely suburb of Westchester.
00:17:05.760
So just from that standpoint, it would be fun to watch them on the, you know, destitution
00:17:13.740
Well, and also like, you know, she plays out that bartender thing, like being a bartender
00:17:17.800
in Manhattan is not exactly like being on the factory line in the middle of like some, you
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The way she likes to pretend it is, you know, like in your mid twenties, you're a bartender.
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Most people consider that, you know, quite fun.
00:17:31.340
Um, I think like, but I think like the Donald Trump, uh, appeal makes like illustrates a
00:17:41.040
His, his, you know, father was, was quite wealthy.
00:17:43.940
He was a real estate developer who was quite wealthy.
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Nonetheless, the way in which he was kind of a real estate developer, you know, they lived
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in Queens, the real estate that they had was not very glamorous.
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And Trump was always looking at Manhattan and seeing this kind of, you know, glamor that
00:18:01.820
And when he got to Manhattan, he was always looked down upon because he came from the outer
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You need to live in New York to really understand that socioeconomic dynamic of how people in
00:18:12.500
And that did develop in Donald Trump, this genuine outsider resentment and mentality that
00:18:18.900
I think is almost a prerequisite to being a popular politician in, in the United States
00:18:23.320
and even in the broader West, because of how much contempt people have for, for the elite
00:18:28.700
And if you seem like you're too comfortable within, or that you really are more identified
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with that elite class and that you don't have that genuine outsider mentality, I think a
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lot of people are going to sniff that out and, and immediately kind of reject you.
00:18:46.940
You know, I think I said on your show before, she always reminds me of somebody who just came
00:18:50.540
out of like a board of directors meeting at like a health insurance company where she's
00:18:55.000
the general counsel, you know, like there's absolutely everything about her reeks of like
00:19:02.900
And if you're JD Vance, no matter how you end up and, you know, I had a working class background
00:19:08.100
I'm not comparing it to JD Vance's, but there's always a part of you, you know, it's
00:19:12.560
There's always a little bit of resentment in you that you grew up in a certain way and
00:19:15.900
didn't have things that most other, that a lot of people, other people had.
00:19:19.140
And I think that is a prerequisite for, for being successful in American politics, given
00:19:23.680
how much the establishment is hated in general.
00:19:26.900
Speaking of the Democrat HR meeting that Kamala Harris just walked out of, there's a headline
00:19:31.940
that just broke before air by Shane Goldmacher in the New York times.
00:19:35.340
The DNC is scrapping its report on what went wrong in 2024.
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Ken Martin, the chairman of the DNC, said on Thursday he had decided not to publish a
00:19:49.780
So the report exists that he ordered months ago into what went wrong for the Dems last
00:19:55.540
Party officials have conducted more than 300 interviews with Democrats in all 50 states
00:20:00.040
to create a document that Mr. Martin had once pitched as crucial to charting a path forward.
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Mr. Martin will instead keep the findings under seal, saying he believes the following.
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If the answer is no, it's a distraction from the core mission.
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He knows, but they don't want to release it to the public.
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And my only thought on this is, does it read at the top?
00:20:33.280
And he's like, holy shit, our entire base is black women who love her, but they're not
00:20:45.200
And it was so obvious in 2024 what that grave was, which was they were between, you know,
00:20:53.320
Either they went with Kamala Harris, who they, you know, everybody, it was a consensus until
00:20:59.340
the day she became the nominee that she was one of the all-time worst politicians.
00:21:03.400
Every time she opened her mouth, she embarrassed herself.
00:21:11.460
She had every advantage and it couldn't even make it to the first primary.
00:21:14.860
And then, of course, soon as she becomes a nominee, everybody just in the media comes
00:21:18.560
together and says, oh, no, this is one of the most exciting candidates ever.
00:21:21.440
Look, Charlie X or XC or whoever is like Brat Summer.
00:21:26.000
And this was going to, you know, take her over the line of victory.
00:21:30.140
But everyone in the Democratic Party knew she was a terrible candidate.
00:21:33.600
The problem was they couldn't pass over her, even though she was second in line, because
00:21:38.180
black women are an important part of their base.
00:21:41.160
And there'd be a lot of anger and a lot of resentment had they said gone to Calvin Newsome
00:21:46.480
or some white man with whom they had a better chance of winning.
00:21:50.280
Glenn, what's so amazing is, so they took their medicine, they held their noses, and
00:21:55.240
they swallowed their medicine like good boys and girls.
00:22:01.160
She's not grateful that like, okay, we gave, she's like, yo, bitches, you only gave me 107
00:22:08.400
Because listen to what she said on a podcast this week, SOT30.
00:22:14.480
You have said in previous interviews, your focus is on 2026.
00:22:21.480
But, you know, I have to ask you, are you thinking about 2028?
00:22:25.260
Do you feel like you have unfinished business that you want to do?
00:22:36.860
Yeah, well, if you do make a decision, and whatever the decision that you make, there
00:22:44.180
are going to be millions of people who will support you with whatever you want to do.
00:22:56.540
Like that is leaving the door as wide open as one possibly can without saying, obviously
00:23:07.420
And first of all, when she decided not to run for governor in 2026, meaning like that
00:23:11.700
office is beneath her, that was already an announcement that she's running in 2028.
00:23:17.300
She certainly doesn't intend to disappear from political life.
00:23:22.500
But the whole point of her book, starting with the title, as you just alluded to, was that
00:23:29.140
their only reason I lost was not because I'm a terrible candidate, because I stood for
00:23:33.660
nothing, because people don't really want to hear me speaking, because they don't trust
00:23:42.480
And so if that really is in your mind, the reason you lost, which of course, in her mind
00:23:47.460
it is, of course, you're going to then think, oh, but if I get to be the nominee, but this
00:23:51.820
time with a normal amount of time, I'm going to roll over everybody.
00:23:58.460
And, you know, again, going back to that problem that Democrats have, if Kamala Harris wants
00:24:02.160
to be the nominee, there's going to be a lot of people on whom that party depends who believe
00:24:10.480
And if she doesn't get it, there's going to be a lot of concern that those people are
00:24:14.700
going to be so angry that they're going to stay at home and the Democrats can't win
00:24:17.980
again with Kamala Harris or without the people who are going to be alienated if she's not the
00:24:24.560
This is like, how lucky can the Republicans be?
00:24:36.520
If you had 108, could have had a different result.
00:24:45.640
Staying on hard news before we get to the really fun stuff, which I'm looking forward
00:24:48.800
to, we got to talk about Brown University and the shit show that is the police situation
00:24:57.900
They are saying now that they have DNA from the scene, like the killer's DNA.
00:25:03.600
They said for the first time yesterday that, um, they have some DNA on, uh, shell casings.
00:25:10.540
Chief Perez said, told reporters that they have it, uh, a law enforcement official familiar
00:25:16.520
with the case who spoke on condition of anonymity also said that the DNA as well as fingerprints
00:25:26.860
And then on background, somebody else added it.
00:25:28.720
It's on the, uh, shell casings, which is great.
00:25:35.440
A Fox news on Wednesday asked, uh, chief Perez, whether investigators were able to find live
00:25:41.520
And he said, investigators were able to get physical evidence.
00:25:49.080
And we're in the process of examining that evidence.
00:25:55.100
And so what that means is that, um, they're now going to run that through the federal database
00:26:01.780
of perps who are already in the system and see if there are any matches.
00:26:07.160
And if there aren't, then they're going to bring in a genetic genealogist, like a CC Moore
00:26:12.800
who can take whatever DNA relational hit they might get, because, you know, if I commit a
00:26:20.660
crime, but I'm not in the, I think it's called CODIS, the system that they have, they're not
00:26:25.760
going to have a match, but they might, if like my fourth cousin twice removed, if their DNA is in
00:26:32.580
there, they might say, oh, this, the killer's fourth cousin twice removed is in here. And then
00:26:38.120
you have a genetic genealogy come in here and like map out that person's whole family tree,
00:26:43.820
start figuring it out. It's, it's investigative work and figure out like who could have been at
00:26:48.900
Brown university on Saturday, December X and so on. So I do think it's great news that they have DNA
00:26:54.640
and that hopefully will help us get a name and solve it. However, if you have doubts, you are more
00:27:00.760
than entitled because they really don't know what they're doing out there. They announced yesterday
00:27:06.780
made clear, they haven't even interviewed all the students who were in the classroom where the
00:27:16.520
shooting took place. They announced that it was a review course for an exam. So we're not sure who
00:27:24.520
showed up and who didn't. What you, why wouldn't you just go to all students who take the class
00:27:31.400
door by door and interview all of them? Why is it like, gee, I don't know. Listen here to top five.
00:27:38.520
You know, this explained to us, uh, five days later, how many students were in that classroom?
00:27:44.100
Can you now say how many kids were in that classroom into the gunman come in from the back? So these people
00:27:49.680
never knew it was coming or did he come in front with full view of everybody? And that's all part
00:27:55.700
of the interviews. And actually we're cooperating with Brown to get the roster. Uh, that was a
00:28:00.020
study hall. So we don't have the number. We're still getting, uh, information as far as who was
00:28:03.900
there. I know Brown sent out a, an email, uh, to the students to notify us if they were present
00:28:09.760
and we're still getting that. So I can't give you an exact account now. Well, Brown sent out an email,
00:28:14.720
Glenn. So they're on it. I think what's amazing here, Megan, is that, I mean, you know, any human
00:28:22.140
institution, no matter how capable you think it is, is going to have incompetence is going to have
00:28:26.880
mistakes is going to have failures. And obviously that includes the police and investigators. They
00:28:32.000
make mistakes all the time, but for a crime of this magnitude at one of our nation's top universities
00:28:38.180
for 11 people to have been shot, two of whom have been killed on, on campus where everything is
00:28:46.480
monitored. There are cameras everywhere, or at least there should be. It turns out apparently
00:28:50.620
that there aren't for whatever reasons that some, there's speculation about why when you see police
00:28:56.820
incompetence on this level, it really is. It's alarming. I think the other interesting aspect of it is,
00:29:03.840
because, you know, I've spent a lot of time in my work on things like mass surveillance and facial
00:29:09.540
recognition and all the ways that we might be surveilled. There's obviously real dangers to
00:29:14.300
having mass surveillance, but in a case like this, you kind of wish that police were able to trace
00:29:21.100
everybody's movements in a way that that's a lot easier. And it kind of points to this conflict that
00:29:26.480
we have. But I just, I think everybody finds it inconceivable, not that there's police incompetence,
00:29:32.600
but that on a case of this magnitude of this scale at, at a place like Brown, it looks like the
00:29:39.840
keystone cops. And it, and you really do start wondering why, like, is this just really how
00:29:46.340
incompetent they are? Or is there something about this case and like the university environment and
00:29:52.120
academia and all the values that we know prevail there that are causing impediments in, in the
00:29:58.680
investigation that's making this incompetence worse? I want like, it's amazing to me that they
00:30:03.580
have not yet interviewed all the students present, the immediate eyewitnesses to the shooting, not
00:30:08.780
only because they may have identifying information about the shooter, they may be able to actually
00:30:14.200
clarify what he yelled. Because so far, all we've heard is from that one TA who said to me, it was
00:30:19.520
incomprehensible. And to the students I know of, they couldn't understand what he was yelling either.
00:30:24.000
Maybe some other student has a different story. And maybe a lot of these students record prep
00:30:29.860
meetings. They have like one of those newfangled apps that everybody has on their phone who are
00:30:34.160
college students, Glenn, that where they record these things. And maybe one of those students has
00:30:39.200
a whole recording of it. Um, and the police just need to find them. Why wouldn't they get the full
00:30:44.780
roster of 200 students and in one day knock on all of their doors? This is so crazy. Oh, well,
00:30:50.580
they sent out an email. Oh, well, great. Okay. Terrific. Because the killer's on a loose.
00:30:54.600
So you might actually want to put pedal to the metal and get on this. Now there was another
00:30:58.220
sort of heated moment where the Providence mayor, who's really just the worst actor. I mean, he's,
00:31:04.080
there's a lot to choose from. The university president seems like a complete nimrod. Um,
00:31:08.140
not impressed at all with the police chief. Um, the AG is contradicting the, the Providence mayor,
00:31:15.020
but the Providence mayor is the worst. He is the worst. And he's the one who's like,
00:31:19.300
I don't think there's an ongoing threat. Why not? Well, cause no one's been shot since Saturday.
00:31:24.120
Oh, okay. Terrific. I'm sure we're fine then. Um, he was asked a question about the lack of cameras.
00:31:30.840
And I have heard this from multiple people who I know who are like in the area and asking these
00:31:35.620
same questions, whether the lack of cameras is somehow related to the fact that Providence is a
00:31:43.720
sanctuary city and, and whether there was an, a conscious decision to take down some of the
00:31:49.380
cameras or deactivate some of the cameras so as not to get alleged illegals, um, on camera in a way
00:31:55.820
that would be used by the feds or capturable by the feds. This guy's going to ask this question.
00:32:01.460
It's hard to understand him and I'm going to summarize it when we come back. So just take a
00:32:04.920
listen, see what you can glean. And then I'll clarify what his name, what he's asking. His name is
00:32:08.480
Chaz Kalanda, and he's speaking to the Providence mayor yesterday.
00:32:14.640
Sanctuary city law that we have, you don't want to recall illegal immigrants and you don't want
00:32:19.880
to provide the footage to the FBI or immigration authority. One camera and that will be, it come
00:32:26.120
out from your detectives. They are afraid of mine. They're angry at this investigation that these
00:32:30.740
people are running reversing. Put the camera off. They can identify that person. You imagine how the
00:32:36.020
family want to go through. We heard from both the Brown police chief and the provost of Brown who
00:32:45.500
have shared that they have been fully cooperative and shared, uh, been forthcoming with all, uh,
00:32:50.940
data and evidence that they have. Okay. But that doesn't answer the question. Just to reiterate what
00:32:55.860
the question was, cause we went back and verbatied it. Uh, we have a sanctuary city law here. You don't
00:33:01.000
want to record illegal immigrants and you don't want to provide the footage to the FBI or immigration
00:33:05.340
authorities, one camera. And now it's come out from your detectives. They're friends of mine.
00:33:10.200
They're angry at this investigation. These people at Brown university put the camera out. That's how
00:33:16.260
he phrased it. They can identify that person. You imagine how the family is going through what
00:33:22.120
they're going through. Tell the truth to the media, put the cameras open. So that was our best verbatied
00:33:27.060
it. He's suggesting that they turned off cameras. I've heard this from others on the scene that they
00:33:32.080
believe Brown, uh, Providence residents, that some of these cameras were intentionally turned off
00:33:36.740
for the very reasons that reporter stated your thoughts on it.
00:33:42.340
Here's the thing. So there's been a lot of speculation online about what happened at Brown and
00:33:47.760
also what happened with the killing that some people think might be related of this nuclear physicist
00:33:53.720
who, who was also killed, uh, at MIT in roughly this at MIT. Right. Exactly. Um, and a lot of the
00:34:02.000
speculation, some of it turned out to be false. Others of it turned out to be very unfounded.
00:34:07.780
And a lot of people are saying not unreasonably that one of the problems with this kind of online
00:34:13.400
sleuth thing is that it often leads to politically motivated speculation or things. Okay. I agree with
00:34:20.740
that. I do think that's an issue. The reason that happens though, is because of the inability or
00:34:26.580
refusal of people in power and in authorities to answer the most basic questions, to give us the
00:34:32.760
most basic information about a crime that of course is a great concern to a huge numbers of people and
00:34:38.380
ought to be. And it's in that vacuum of like this evasive kind of answer, this refusal to give any kind
00:34:46.280
of, to be accountable in any way that citizens start thinking we can't trust the police. We can't
00:34:51.600
trust investigators. They, they lied to us. They they're incompetent. They cover things up. And this
00:34:57.060
is why you see so much of this kind of doubting, like with the Charlie Kirk shooting or with any kind
00:35:03.020
of crime, any kind of major event where people no longer trust institutions of authority. And I think
00:35:08.040
in that exchange, you see the reason, like, if that's the reason they turned off the cameras say,
00:35:12.460
so where the cameras turned off, like, why can't you just give straight answers on that? And when
00:35:17.040
we don't get those, that people start thinking we have to figure out on our own and we can't trust
00:35:21.560
the information we're being given. And although it can be a problem because it leads to false
00:35:25.760
speculation that spreads like wildfire, it's also the fault of the people who are supposed to be
00:35:31.520
exercising this power responsibly when they, when they, when they do things that make the other
00:35:35.620
people lose trust in what they're saying. All right. I want to keep going. There's a lot
00:35:40.040
of news to get to. Uh, speaking of lack of trust, the FBI has been suffering that for many years now.
00:35:47.520
And the two people at the top of it under Trump are of course, Kash Patel and Dan Bongino,
00:35:51.660
who I think most Republicans, I mean, maybe not the establishment types, but most MAGA faithful
00:35:56.940
supported going into those two top roles. And then there was some real questioning after the
00:36:03.760
Epstein debacle, both when the pair of them went on with Maria Bartiromo and said, they believe Epstein
00:36:10.720
did kill himself and that there wasn't a murder. And you just had to look at the tape from the prison
00:36:16.520
cell. And then even the left-wing media started to challenge that. Uh, so there was a real crisis
00:36:22.460
of confidence. Then Dan Bongino threatened to quit, uh, over his blowout with Pam Bondi, but he didn't
00:36:29.380
quit. He stayed and it's been a tumultuous nine, 10 months. I think it's fair to say, even for two guys
00:36:37.500
who had previously been trusted by MAGA, but there's no question there's been an erosion of that since
00:36:42.800
they went on the inside, you know, as can happen, especially when you go to an organization that
00:36:46.860
distrusted. Now we get news that Dan Bongino is stepping down. Uh, he sent out a tweet yesterday. I
00:36:53.640
think he said effective early January. So he did not make it a year. And, um, now he's already getting
00:37:02.320
some blowback. This is what the left is saying, but this is the reason I'm playing. This is you're
00:37:09.660
also hearing this online from some on the right, which is kind of telling because I love Bongino and
00:37:16.580
I've been kind of taken aback at like the, I don't know that this, the shift in opinion by some,
00:37:22.880
even on the right. But here's Nicole Wallace, uh, with her two cent take.
00:37:29.540
This guy is a freaking joke. He wears t-shirts that are obviously too small. And he went on Fox
00:37:36.220
news and complained about how long the workday is as the number two at the FBI. The FBI is you two
00:37:41.720
know better than anyone protects children from child sex traffickers. Um, and on that topic,
00:37:47.440
Dan Bongino had a successful podcast in part because he peddled conspiracy theories
00:37:52.240
about Jeffrey Epstein and then got to the FBI and let Pam Bonney roll over him when they decided
00:37:57.660
to cover up the files. Cause Donald Trump's name is in them. A fact confirmed by Susie Wiles this week
00:38:02.560
in 11 on the record interviews with Chris Whipple. I want to know if either of you can speak to the
00:38:07.700
lasting damage or the danger that we're in because a guy that is a joke was the number two at the FBI.
00:38:14.120
Okay. First of all, they did not let Pam Bonney roll over them. She's their boss. The FBI is not
00:38:21.260
an independent agency that doesn't answer to anybody. They answer to Pam Bonney. If Pam Bonney
00:38:25.660
directs the strategy that we're not releasing anything more on the FBI, on the Epstein's file,
00:38:31.000
then that is what Cash and Dan had to do. I'm sorry that they were very outspoken on Epstein beforehand,
00:38:37.900
but like to pretend that they had independent autonomy when DOJ, and frankly, let's face it,
00:38:43.720
it must've been Trump's call, made a call is to ignore reality. However, I'm going to give you one
00:38:49.420
more soundbite, Glenn, and it is the moment she referenced when Dan went on Fox in May of 2025,
00:38:57.980
I gave up everything for this. I mean, you know, my wife is struggling and I'm not a victim. I'm not
00:39:06.520
Jim Comey. It's fine. I did this and I'm proud I did it. But if you think we're there for tea and
00:39:11.300
crumpets, well, I mean, Cash is there all day. We share it. Our offices are linked. He turns on
00:39:17.060
the faucet. I hear it. He's there at, he gets in like six o'clock in the morning. He doesn't leave
00:39:21.520
till seven at night. You know, I'm in there at seven 30 in the morning. I, you know, he uses the gym.
00:39:26.800
I work out in my apartment, but I stare at these four walls all day in DC, you know, by myself,
00:39:32.820
divorced from my wife, not divorced, but I mean, separated, divorced. And it's hard. I mean,
00:39:37.060
you know, we love each other and it's hard to be a part.
00:39:40.440
So she mocked him for it. Many did. But to me, that explains why he's leaving. I mean,
00:39:45.020
there's a thankless job where he's losing support, even amongst some MAGA faithful because of the
00:39:49.600
nature of the FBI and what I said with Epstein, even though I think Dan was very opposed to how it
00:39:53.580
was handled by Bondi. And, um, I'm sure he, I haven't talked to him, but I'm sure he's like,
00:39:59.400
this is a fucking thankless job. I'm out of here. I want to go back to my family, my wife
00:40:04.220
and my podcast. So my question to you is, can he do that now? Given some of those issues that,
00:40:12.360
I don't know if people realize, you know, Dan, Dan Bongino, uh, is had his podcast on rumble where
00:40:19.080
he's also, um, uh, a major investor. And that podcast was, I mean, the call to success is to
00:40:28.020
wildly understate the case. He was making enormous amounts of money. He had a massive audience of
00:40:35.520
people unbelievably loyal to him and loyal to him because of how much trust they had, they had in
00:40:42.360
him. And one of the reasons they had so much trust in him was because he was such a emphatic
00:40:48.660
critic of the deep state of these organizations. And among the things he was telling them was that
00:40:56.000
the U S government was concealing the Epstein files because it was trying to protect the world's
00:41:03.840
most powerful people from being exposed as child predators because they know that Jeffrey Epstein
00:41:09.220
didn't kill himself. And because Jeffrey Epstein had blackmail power over all these people and were
00:41:15.780
therefore forcing them to keep these, these files concealed. This was not an ancillary issue for Dan
00:41:21.140
Bongino. This was something he talked about over and over and over. And then also other things as well,
00:41:26.480
you know, like the, the, the guy who killed Trump and all the stuff that supposedly was being covered up
00:41:30.900
about that. None of which is, has been released under the FBI's leadership. And so when you then
00:41:37.640
months into Dan Bongino stint, watch him go on Fox and obviously in a very uncomfortable way, say
00:41:43.620
we found no evidence of blackmail. We don't think it's appropriate to release these files.
00:41:48.280
Please trust us when we tell you that he'd absolutely killed himself. Obviously the people
00:41:53.120
who have been listening to Dan Bongino for all these years and believing that this was like one of the
00:41:57.520
very few people who they could trust turn around. And in an instant, soon as they're inside abandoned,
00:42:03.800
so many of the core beliefs that they had been insisting were true is obviously going to erode
00:42:10.220
your, the, the, the confidence and trust that, that people have in you. And I also think one of the
00:42:16.160
things that it's worth remembering, you know, we all have talents and we all have talents, which means
00:42:21.900
we're not talented at everything. Usually we're all talented at something. And it's important to be
00:42:26.700
humble enough to realize that because you succeed in one thing, doesn't mean you can succeed in
00:42:30.760
something and anything else. Dan Bongino is a very effective outsider, like a very effective
00:42:35.880
critic. He brings people along with him running the FBI is an entirely different skillset. And I think
00:42:45.380
a lot of people in, in, in the MAGA movement, because of how validly, uh, critical they were of
00:42:51.260
these institutions decided that the people who are there for their whole career, who have the quote
00:42:55.740
unquote expertise all need to be thrown out. And I totally understand that in part even agree with
00:43:00.840
it, but it doesn't mean that you can just pop up some, some guy who's a very talented podcaster
00:43:05.680
and put him in this like administrative job that he obviously doesn't want to be in like, sorry,
00:43:10.680
but getting to work at seven 30 and leaving at seven o'clock inside an office, that is not exactly
00:43:15.980
uncommon. That's not a backbreaking job. That's the experience of most Americans. Like you go out to
00:43:21.080
your office, you're separated from your family, your kids, because you're working like Dan Bongino
00:43:25.480
made it sound like, you know, he was like carrying the cross of, uh, of the crucifix on, on his back
00:43:30.360
for days. And I just think it kind of illustrates that humility is needed, like to realize what you're
00:43:36.640
good at and what you're not. So I think, I think he didn't really want to do it. That's what I think.
00:43:43.020
I think he didn't really want to do this, but he, I'm guessing here, I haven't talked to anybody
00:43:47.540
about this, but I'm guessing that Trump thought he'd be the perfect person to do it. He and cash
00:43:50.700
because they'd been so critical of the FBI. So he found FBI critics to come in so that the MAGA
00:43:56.560
base would, would trust the new leadership. But then I think neither one of them fully appreciated,
00:44:02.940
just like they didn't appreciate over at HHS or DHS or DOJ. The fact that these organizations are
00:44:10.240
completely replete with leftists and it's very freaking hard to change the culture, to change
00:44:17.940
the, the motion, the forward motion of these things in a leftist direction, just because you
00:44:23.260
have leadership, that's different there though. They're, they're trying, they're definitely trying.
00:44:27.620
And so I've, I've felt very much for both of them. And I will say this at, I think really the
00:44:33.220
catching of the January 6th, the pipe bomber, you know, assuming this is the guy, uh, which so far,
00:44:37.780
I believe it is, was huge. Like, I almost feel like if you're Dan Bongino, you can say, you know
00:44:42.280
what? It was divine right order. Like they put me in there because it seems like he really spearheaded
00:44:46.940
that. I did something that really mattered. Who knows what this guy was capable of? What if he had
00:44:51.500
tried to bomb something else? And maybe he saved lives. You know, maybe he was there at that time,
00:44:56.660
which was another one of his quote unquote conspiracy theories. I'm not citing you there, but like
00:45:01.160
another thing that people point to and he pushed it and he wanted January 6th pipe bomber found and he
00:45:06.420
found him. And maybe Dan just said, you know what? I did something that really mattered.
00:45:11.180
You know, I, I let cops be cops again, as he in cash keeps saying, and now I just want to get back
00:45:15.760
to, as you point out the thing that I'm great at and my family and government service is not for me.
00:45:22.520
Yeah. Let me, let me just say one thing though, to, to, and it's not really like disagreeing per se,
00:45:27.020
but I think just for me, at least a more way, precise way to explain it. I don't think these
00:45:31.660
institutions are filled with what I would call leftists. Like I've never met a leftist who says
00:45:36.240
my goal is to go work at the FBI or become like a CIA operative. I think what these people are,
00:45:41.880
are more like establishment operatives. They're like institutionalists. These are people who want
00:45:47.820
to protect the permanent power faction in Washington. That's really not subject to elections. And you can
00:45:53.080
put people at the top who are determined to kind of blow it all up, but you know, being at the top
00:45:59.980
doesn't mean that the entire infrastructure under you that's been cultivated for decades. And these
00:46:04.800
people are inculcated about how these institutions should work. They can easily resist, you know,
00:46:11.420
the comings and goings of politicians. Every American president has discovered that,
00:46:15.520
that there's this huge part of Washington that they nominally control, but that, that don't,
00:46:19.460
they don't really have any ability to change at all, no matter how much they want to. And I bet you,
00:46:25.100
that was also part of Dan Bongino's frustration is you can get in there and say, okay,
00:46:29.220
we're in control. Now we're going to fix this institution. And yet, you know, you can't just
00:46:33.460
get rid of the entire FBI. There's experienced, you know, operatives in there and investigators,
00:46:38.200
and they have like an ideology about how things should be done. And they're not going to just
00:46:42.280
instantly give up the power that they have and the ideology that they've been trained to have
00:46:46.780
forever. Simply because a couple of guys at the top have been critics on a podcast. And I'm sure that
00:46:51.660
has to be frustrating to try and reform the deep state and find that you're actually not able to do so,
00:46:57.900
even though you have a democratic mandate from the American people to do it.
00:47:01.700
And then you, and then you get what to me seems like a clear order from the president himself,
00:47:07.460
not, not to keep going on Epstein. Oh my God. It's a, it's a worst case scenario.
00:47:13.840
But by the way, I do believe, I totally agree with, and it's an important point about the FBI,
00:47:18.060
more institutionalists, but I do know for a fact that over at DOJ, they're having a problem with
00:47:23.640
actual leftists in the lawyer class up and down the ranks who will not just do what the leadership
00:47:30.260
wants them to do. You know, they're, they're, and that makes sense, right? You and I are both
00:47:33.740
lawyers. We know how lawyers are. Okay. I want to keep going. Cash Patel went on with Katie Miller.
00:47:39.500
And again, I like Cash and he was just on the show two weeks ago today, but while under fire for like
00:47:45.300
paying too much attention to his girlfriend, Alexis, he brought his girlfriend, Alexis, and they did a
00:47:50.840
joint interview, which I don't think was a great move. Uh, like I understand why Katie Miller wanted
00:47:55.620
it. That makes sense. I understand why Alexis wanted it, but Cash, like my advice to Cash,
00:48:00.200
this is free, take it or leave it. The romance should not be in the papers. It should not be in
00:48:04.780
the news. It should not be on podcasts. You know, it should just be off, off the radar because too much
00:48:12.060
attention has been brought to it already because he's been flying around in the FBI play, playing,
00:48:16.780
playing to like, go see her. That was raised in the interview. And here is what
00:48:20.500
that sounded like SOT 18. This nonsense about, Oh, you're taking a private jet. We're taking the
00:48:27.160
FBI plane because Congress 20 years ago said FBI directors are not allowed to take commercial air
00:48:32.480
travel ever. It's ironic that they're saying, Oh, you're going on vacation or you're going to see
00:48:37.640
your girlfriend perform. And if I was actually abusing it, I would go see every one of her shows.
00:48:42.500
I think I get to like 15%. Okay. I'm just going to give you one more. Um, SOT 19, just stand by,
00:48:51.320
SOT 19. What's an area that you disagree with Cash on? Oh,
00:48:57.720
come on now. Oh no. I think that it's really in like random things. Like I don't like spice and he
00:49:10.580
does like, I like spice. I just, I can't handle spicy foods. I'm trying, I'm working on it. Like
00:49:15.500
I said, I'm Mediterranean. So I have it in me. I just, I need to get there with it. No, the going
00:49:19.500
out, the going out to eat is hilarious because I'm Hindu and I don't eat beef and she has a really
00:49:25.020
significant seafood allergy. So when we sit down at a dinner table or go to an event,
00:49:30.500
we have to like make sure we've provided these instructions. And so then when we're out to
00:49:35.700
dinner at a nice dinner, um, she'll order like a steak, which is great. And then I'll order like
00:49:40.260
the seafood and everything else. And it's like on a divided line, like it can't cross. But we make a
00:49:44.940
really good surf and turf team at like events. If it's like, Hey, it's going to be steak and lobster.
00:49:49.100
Like that's great. Perfect. Just different place. Divvy us up. Like we're, we're happy.
00:49:52.560
It's less than ideal. Glenn, it's less than ideal when they're already in the news.
00:49:59.540
Well, let me just say, first of all, I'm uncomfortable with this whole Katie Miller podcast,
00:50:05.000
not because I don't think she should be able to have a podcast. She's, you know, perfectly
00:50:09.600
entitled to one. She, she, she, before the Trump administration, what was, was doing this sort
00:50:14.340
of work. It's not like she just invented this at the same time. Her husband is, I would say the
00:50:19.680
most powerful person in the Trump administration. Wait, do me a favor, do me a favor and like hold
00:50:25.660
that point right there. So at the same time, Stephen Miller is one of the most powerful people
00:50:29.140
because I got to hit this hard break and we'll come back right after Glenn lucky for us is here
00:50:33.900
for the whole show. What a great Thursday. Don't go away. Grand Canyon university and affordable
00:50:40.220
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advisor free of charge. Glenn Greenwald is back with me now. He is the host of Rumble's
00:52:40.100
system update. If you want to get smarter, listen to Glenn. Glenn, you were saying you have a problem
00:52:47.340
with the podcast because Katie Miller's married to one of the administration's most powerful people,
00:52:51.240
Stephen Miller. Right. And so first of all, I'm not even sure that people who get invited onto Katie
00:52:57.600
Miller's show really feel the ability to say no given the power that her husband has, but also I
00:53:07.800
don't have any problem with partisan media. I used to compliment you on the fact of audience and yet
00:53:13.880
you would interview Republican and conservative politicians as a journalist, like in an adversarial
00:53:19.760
way. This podcast is not designed to do that. It's almost like a form of state TV, but then
00:53:27.460
it doesn't like, it tries to personalize these people. Like the last one she had before Cash and
00:53:34.320
his girlfriend, she had a Mike Johnson. And for some reason, Mike Johnson's wife, like there's a
00:53:39.800
lot to ask Mike Johnson. He's the speaker of the house, but she's trying to do a softer, you know,
00:53:45.160
there's like a million angles of Mike Johnson being asked tough questions. He's trying to do like a more,
00:53:48.940
a softer side. I know, but like, you know, I ended up learning that like the person who wears the
00:53:55.880
pants and the family, as they put it, the one with the veto power, the one who makes all the decisions
00:54:00.060
is Mike Johnson's wife. And I'm like, why am I listening to this? But that doesn't mean it's not
00:54:05.420
for anybody. By the way, I, I mean, Mike Johnson is actually quite funny and I think showing a softer
00:54:10.680
side and like his personal side might be of interest to some people. I like Mike Johnson
00:54:14.700
too. I just don't know why I have to hear the details of. You don't have to, don't click on her
00:54:21.720
face. Telling his girlfriend. Like, and that is even something. Oh man. Glenn, your, your connection
00:54:30.260
is struggling. We're like struggling. Okay. But like that, that's fine. But the speaker of the house
00:54:36.380
is the FBI director. And I get what you're saying. Like not everything has to be very
00:54:40.760
substantive. And these are people who have, you know, personal lives and private lives.
00:54:44.820
It just all seems a bit incestuous because it's Katie Miller. So it's just, it, it seems very
00:54:51.100
propagandistic to me. It all seems like designed to promote these people and not really get to know
00:54:57.380
them. Well, I mean, you can know that, you know what I mean? Laura Trump has a show on Fox. So of
00:55:03.400
course you go on with Laura Trump, who I love, obviously, you know, you're not getting an
00:55:07.980
objective interviewer, but isn't, so you take it for what it's worth. You know, you take it with
00:55:12.060
that grain of salt, but it's no different than you'd see over on MSNBC where they're more in the
00:55:16.240
tank for the Democrats than Katie Miller is for the Republicans. You know, it's like, she's doing a
00:55:21.560
different thing over there when it comes to like hard versus softer news, which is fine.
00:55:26.720
I guess. I mean, but like, but you were even making the point, you know, like cash Patel and
00:55:34.300
his girlfriend and their relationship. Okay. But I was ripping on cash for that. That's not Katie
00:55:40.960
Miller's fault. That's like Katie Miller wanted to do that with their show, which is like, okay,
00:55:45.260
great. And cash, but cash should have said no, in my view, not because Katie's inappropriate,
00:55:50.260
but because there's too much news already about cash and his girlfriend, which I'm sure they would
00:55:54.960
love to put to bed. They would love that to go away. Could you say no? Could you, can you say
00:56:00.380
no? Like, isn't the weight of her husband behind her? I'm not even saying like you're using that.
00:56:06.400
That's an interesting question. I'm just saying like, okay. I feel that's what I feel like there's
00:56:10.620
a dynamic there that is, you know, her husband doesn't just work in the white house. I do think
00:56:16.520
he's the one who Trump listens to more than anybody. Well, let's hope so. Stand by. I want to
00:56:21.540
play a little bit more from cash and Alexis on the show. Watch this. So what's the ideal date night?
00:56:28.980
Staying in. Yeah. I was going to say at this point, probably like doing that thing,
00:56:32.980
sitting on the couch, watching whatever, sleeping. Our favorite restaurant is Mizumi in Las Vegas.
00:56:38.940
We go there as often as we can, but Las Vegas has the best food in the country. So we're spoiled in
00:56:44.520
that manner, but DC, I don't know. What do you like? How do you keep your personal relationship
00:56:50.700
strong when so much of what you do during the day isn't discussed outside of, you know,
00:56:56.980
a classified setting? She has this great ability to not only never ask me about my job, but never
00:57:03.060
care to because she knows we're not going to discuss it. What's the most important meeting
00:57:09.880
she's ever called and you stepped out of? I've never had to step out of a meeting because
00:57:15.720
if it was an emergency, I obviously would really never had to do that. I think I had to call you
00:57:21.620
during dinner though, when I cut my finger open. Oh yeah, there was that. I did. That was a lot.
00:57:27.580
That was, I was, yes, I was not in DC and she informed me she accidentally cut her finger open
00:57:33.380
and I said, okay, are we getting stitches? Are we at the hospital? Are we good to go? And her mom was
00:57:38.960
sending me funny texts and I knew it was fine. Yeah. Have you written any love songs about Cash?
00:57:47.040
You know, it's funny. I don't think anyone's ever asked that. Um, you know, yeah, I have.
00:57:54.320
Okay. So again, this is my advice is my free advice that they, they are free to ignore, but I,
00:57:58.840
I think, and I believe they're in love. I actually think they'll wind up married and it'll actually
00:58:02.040
be quite sweet. Um, and good for them. It's hard to find love in Washington, but, but since she's so
00:58:08.900
much like this relationship has been too much in the news and it's undermining Cash now it's
00:58:13.460
undermining. I know he doesn't like that because he loves her and he's been defensive of her,
00:58:16.220
which is also sweet, but I think she, no, she should be off air. It should be just, just Cash.
00:58:23.500
And if he wants to personalize himself by going on a softer interview, you know, format that works,
00:58:29.720
that's good. But this is calling too much attention to something that's already become
00:58:34.280
an Achilles heel for him. The right doesn't like it. Go look at Twitter, go look at X. Like there
00:58:38.720
are no positive comments about it. So that's fine. We may not like reality, but we should accept reality
00:58:44.840
and just keep the private life private. Keep it over there. Stop talking about it. Stop making news on
00:58:51.040
it. You know, people are going to try to make news about every time he goes to visit her for a concert
00:58:54.980
anyway. There's no reason to like lean in. Yeah. I mean, I do think part of the issue is,
00:59:01.420
is that it is different. Like Mike Johnson and his wife have been married 20 years. They have seven
00:59:06.160
kids. They adopted two. They have five biological kids, you know? So I think people are more open to
00:59:11.800
the fact that, you know, if you want to know Mike Johnson, you kind of have to know his family and
00:59:15.680
his wife. Like that is an important part of a politician's public profile. A girlfriend is
00:59:19.900
different. They're young. There have been, and even though, yes, it is true. He does have to
00:59:24.640
find the FBI private plane. When you have enemies inside the FBI, as we just talked about resisting
00:59:29.040
his reform and they're leaking things like he's constantly taking his private plane to Las Vegas.
00:59:33.280
He's constantly taking it to Nashville to see her shows. I just, as you said, it just,
00:59:40.240
it rubs people the wrong way when people are economically struggling, when there's already a
00:59:44.740
perception that people in the political class live this way. And I agree with you. It's a poor
00:59:50.080
decision to go in and, and, and do it. But I do question whether he felt kind of compelled.
00:59:57.420
It just, I don't know. You're right. I'm not the target audience.
01:00:00.120
I think they should follow the Doug Brunt rule.
01:00:03.420
Doug's, Doug's family, when he was younger, before we had met, they would take a big trip every
01:00:10.040
year, like a big family vacation. And their rule, when they're kids, they had four kids,
01:00:14.480
Doug's one of four. Um, their rule, when the kids started to get, you know, in their twenties
01:00:18.620
was no one can, no significant other can come unless you're at least engaged because they didn't
01:00:24.880
want the cast of girlfriends or boyfriends temporarily coming with their family on like
01:00:29.480
their biggest memories and biggest vacations. And that's probably not a bad rule for administration
01:00:35.960
officials. Like don't for an interview, like don't bring the person in for an interview.
01:00:41.100
If they're not, if you're not at least engaged, uh, because you're probably going to take a lot
01:00:45.100
of shit and God forbid they break up. It's going to get even worse, but I don't think they will.
01:00:48.340
I actually think they're a very sweet couple. My money is on them getting married, but okay,
01:00:52.340
let's move on. Um, and all the best to them because I am rooting for them. Okay. Where do we go next?
01:00:58.600
Um, oh, well, let's spend a minute on Rob Reiner. There's really not a lot of news in that case today.
01:01:03.280
He, uh, Nick Reiner was arraigned. He was brought in, he was charged officially. And, uh, the judge
01:01:11.100
confirmed that he had waived his right to a speedy arraignment and they, they continued it till January
01:01:16.160
7th. He was wearing a suicide, uh, smock, they called it. We weren't allowed to see him in court.
01:01:21.520
And then his attorney, Alan Jackson, who's like a famous attorney came out after the fact and called
01:01:27.480
the whole situation, very complex and serious. Let's allow the system to move forward in a,
01:01:33.000
in a way it was designed. No one understood exactly what he was telegraphing, but he wants
01:01:37.700
you to know this is very complex. Is it? Um, and then there was this, which I thought was worth
01:01:45.460
playing wall street journal reporter, John Jurgensen had an interesting report yesterday on the party at
01:01:52.340
Conan O'Brien's the night that Rob and Michelle were killed. They'd been there and they,
01:01:57.480
had brought their son, Nick, who by all accounts had been acting inappropriately. And he filled in
01:02:01.720
some of those details in this report, which he then spoke about on CNN. Sot three.
01:02:07.600
During the party, he was approaching people there asking questions that in that context
01:02:13.560
seemed confrontational, strange, uh, or especially, are you famous asking people there? Are you famous?
01:02:20.520
So you can imagine, imagine a party of actual famous people and fame adjacent people who are really
01:02:26.100
used to strange behavior out in public, but here they are at a gathering of their peers at a party
01:02:32.580
hosted by Conan. It was unsettling to some. So Bill Hader was one of the people he approached at the
01:02:37.620
party. There was an awkward exchange and made more awkward by the fact that he had met Hader earlier
01:02:41.940
in the night. Um, so when Rob had introduced him. So when he came up and asked him questions such as,
01:02:48.220
what's your name? Are you famous? Um, it was, it was unsettling and described as scary from,
01:02:54.260
from Hader's perspective. So think about it, Glenn, it wasn't just this guy Hader, but apparently Nick
01:02:59.480
was going up to all these famous people. If you listen to the longer interview, all these famous
01:03:03.420
people at Conan O'Brien's house. And he was making the point, the reporter there that, you know,
01:03:08.900
in a room full of famous people at Conan O'Brien's Christmas party, um, it's very strange to keep
01:03:17.520
asking people, are you famous? Right? It's one thing if one famous person shows up at a party of
01:03:23.500
non-famous people and then meets somebody who doesn't know who they are. And the person says,
01:03:28.660
oh, are you famous? You know, like that's happened to all of us. Actually, funny story, just as an
01:03:33.640
aside, Doug and I, one year we went to the Met Gala. We were, we went to the after party after we
01:03:38.800
went to the gala. We're standing in the red rope line, waiting to get into the after party. We're
01:03:43.860
speaking with this young woman and, um, you know, one thing leads to another and it makes, it's pretty
01:03:48.680
clear that she's some sort of an athlete. I'm like, oh, what do you do? She goes, I play soccer. I'm like,
01:03:53.380
oh, are you any good? She's like, yeah, yeah, I'm pretty good. That woman was Alex Morgan.
01:03:59.440
Who is in fact very, very good at soccer. So I'm just saying, sometimes you meet somebody who's
01:04:04.880
famous and if it's not in your wheelhouse, you don't know. That's not, that's not what was
01:04:09.800
happening with Nick Reiner. He was behaving weirdly and inappropriately. And it just sort of sets the
01:04:15.820
stage for his, his bizarre behavior that evening, but not so bizarre. He's going to get off on an
01:04:22.520
insanity defense. So I haven't had the chance to ask you about this whole case. Where are you on it?
01:04:26.640
What do you think of it? Because of my husband's political career, I used to be at parties all the
01:04:32.300
time with like big Brazilian celebrities that I don't actually recognize. And probably Brazil's
01:04:37.280
most famous singer came up to me once and said, oh, I'm so happy to meet you. I really respect your
01:04:41.980
work. And I said, oh, what do you do just to get it off me? I was like, do you work for this political
01:04:46.660
candidate whose event we're at? And he's like, no, I I'm in music. And I pictured him like, you know,
01:04:51.400
kind of playing like the, like a clarinet on the corner. And then my husband was dying of
01:04:56.600
embarrassment. And he interrupted like Caetano. I'm a huge fan. His name was Caetano Veloso,
01:05:00.540
like the most famous musician in all of Brazil, kind of like the Michael Jackson or Bob Dylan.
01:05:05.780
I was like, what do you do? Do you like, do you work? Yeah, it was horrible. Anyway. I think,
01:05:11.360
you know, one of the things I think is interesting about this case is that a lot of American families
01:05:17.500
suffer from addiction, it used to be a lot more stigmatized than it was in the sense that people
01:05:22.600
really thought it was like a moral failing. And here you see, you know, the son of an extremely
01:05:27.460
famous wealthy person who by all accounts was like a very dedicated father and his wife, a very
01:05:32.880
dedicated mother doing everything they could for this kid. And then even into adulthood to save him
01:05:39.180
in some way from addiction. And as so many American families have experienced, like sometimes that
01:05:45.060
demon is the hardest one to battle. And I think it's a good reminder that it cuts across all
01:05:50.460
socioeconomic lines. And then I also think there's this sort of interesting aspect, you know, if you're
01:05:55.780
poor and you're trying to raise kids, that's very difficult. But sometimes if you're very rich and your
01:06:00.480
kid is born into great wealth, that also can be very difficult because they might not have motivation.
01:06:05.600
They might, you know, feel like too heavy of an expectation. I think there's a lot of things in this
01:06:11.500
story kind of like as a morality play that Americans can learn from. And especially when it comes to
01:06:16.800
addiction, because of what a pervasive problem it is for families across the country. I think every
01:06:21.080
time there's a story that involves addiction, it can be important to kind of break down the stigma and
01:06:27.640
create some empathy for families who, you know, might feel like it's their fault. But in reality,
01:06:32.400
it's something that, you know, infects so many parts of society.
01:06:36.460
And it sounds like Nick Reiner had some significant mental health issues prior to the
01:06:42.260
addiction, which, you know, from all accounts, like by age 10, we're really manifesting in the
01:06:47.880
family. It's a nightmare. I mean, what do you do with a child who is mentally disturbed in a way
01:06:53.900
that they have really upsetting social behaviors, but they're not committable. It's not at that level.
01:07:01.560
They haven't broken the criminal law, so they're not going to go to jail. They're just going to be
01:07:07.160
dependent on you in an upsetting and disruptive, negative way forever. I mean, that's a curse.
01:07:17.940
That is why you sit around, if you're lucky enough to have healthy children and look at,
01:07:23.620
you know, your life and say, thank you, God, thank you, God, thank you, God, for giving me three
01:07:27.460
healthy children. And it's not saddling me with that burden. I feel like the Reiners got saddled
01:07:32.820
with that burden. That's how it looks to me. Yeah. And like in their situations, like impossible
01:07:38.200
to know what to do. You can like let them, you know, end up on the street and be homeless,
01:07:42.600
but it's your still your, your, your kid. Like you, you love him. You've raised him. He's your,
01:07:47.820
you know, your family. But then if you let them stay in your guest house and support him,
01:07:52.680
are you like enable, it's just such an awful dilemma. And to go through that for so many years
01:07:58.400
and have your payment be dying in that manner at the hands of that person, it's, it's like
01:08:06.460
uniquely sickening. And so sad because Rob Reiner was 78. His dad, Carl Reiner, also famous. Rob had
01:08:13.520
been in a similar situation to that of his son lived to 98. You know, I mean, he clearly had some good
01:08:18.940
genes, even on the male side, which is rare. And, uh, who knows how much longer he could have lived.
01:08:24.560
You know, the other two children seem to be madly in love with their parents. And there's a third
01:08:29.180
child to a first daughter that they, he adopted when he's married to Penny Marshall. So you, you know,
01:08:32.940
your heart has to go out to them. Uh, all right. I want to keep going. Cause there's a lot of other
01:08:37.200
stuff we want to get to. And this is the story that I've been waiting for. The Coldplay kiss cam lady
01:08:44.020
has decided to speak out. And the headline is she's the victim. Just in case you didn't know
01:08:50.920
she's the victim. We made her the victim. She really, she did something very minor that was
01:08:55.900
wrong, but it wasn't really that big. People are nasty and they need to stop harassing her.
01:09:00.960
The only part of that that I agree with is people should stop harassing her. Apparently she said some
01:09:05.840
in-person and like nasty writings and so on that that's unnecessary. Uh, but the rest of us are fully
01:09:11.760
free to comment on her behavior and she's going to have to deal with it because it happened and
01:09:17.300
happened on camera and it wasn't well handled. So she has sat, she has now sat with the New York
01:09:22.940
times and also with, uh, the telegraph, I think, or no times of London for dueling interviews. She sat
01:09:30.420
for an entire day with the New York times and, uh, Lucy Liu who writes, uh, okay. About how
01:09:40.980
okay. Coldplay kiss cam HR boss, Kristen Cabot on 16 seconds that ruined her life. And this whole
01:09:51.040
piece is an attempt, I think, to shame us for shaming her and to talk about how she's been sort
01:09:57.400
of slut shamed and also to paint it as totally unfair because according to Kristen Cabot, when she
01:10:04.920
got caught on the kiss cam with the, with her boss of this company, astronomer, she was head of HR that
01:10:12.820
her sin was simply quote, I made a bad decision and had a couple of high noons and danced and acted
01:10:20.200
inappropriately with my boss. And it's not nothing. And I took accountability and I gave up my career
01:10:27.780
for that. That's the price I chose to pay. You did not choose that. It was not your choice. Um,
01:10:35.300
I want my kids to know that you can make mistakes and you can really screw up, but you don't have
01:10:39.840
to be threatened or be killed for them. Well, obviously that last line is true, but she's
01:10:45.840
trying to turn this into like a heroic moment for her. First of all, it's too soon. We're still,
01:10:51.020
still too fresh on the mind. You have demanded that we restore you to your pedestal in life
01:10:55.920
before we're kind of over what we saw. And second of all, I don't believe you that you were both
01:11:02.100
separated when that happened at all, which seems to be her main defense. Glenn, she says she was
01:11:08.160
separated from her husband. And the reason she recoiled when the spotlight, the kiss cam was placed
01:11:13.520
on her and this astronomer guy, the CEO was that her soon to be ex-husband was in the audience that night
01:11:19.940
at Coldplay and she didn't want to humiliate him. And you have to go like halfway into the New York
01:11:28.220
Times article, which is lengthy before they even mentioned the fact that her boss was also married.
01:11:35.500
And, and that was the focus of the outrage. It only came out weeks into it that she too,
01:11:41.380
Kristen Cabot was also married. And it did come out at that time that they were in some sort of a
01:11:46.180
separation, but the boss was not separated, even though he now claims that he was, I don't believe
01:11:53.080
him for one second. What his wife did when the story broke was to take down her socials, to change
01:12:00.480
her last name back to her maiden name immediately on some of her socials. And, you know, here's the
01:12:06.060
most telling part. You know what the boss didn't do? His name is Andy Byron. You know what he didn't do
01:12:12.940
when the scandal broke and he was about to get fired and he'd been publicly humiliated. He did
01:12:17.140
not release a statement saying, my wife and I are separated. That is literally all he had to do for
01:12:23.220
me to believe him. But he did not do that. And his wife did not do that. By the way, there are reports
01:12:28.840
that they are together right now. They are still together. So I don't believe that he was separated.
01:12:34.900
I accept that this gal, Kristen Cabot was, but that was the scandal that, that it was a cheating
01:12:40.780
situation as called out by Chris Martin. When we all saw their reaction, we should play the video
01:12:45.820
just so we can remind people how it looked. Here it is.
01:12:55.540
Either they're having an affair or they're just very shy.
01:13:01.520
Either they're having an affair or they're very shy.
01:13:04.020
Okay, so your thoughts on Kristen Cabot trying to rehabilitate herself. I don't know how many
01:13:09.680
months is it to happen in July. So what, five months after the event?
01:13:14.960
I'm a little conflicted on this. I don't know if we see this the same way. I think the thing that
01:13:20.040
was most bothersome was that she's head of HR. And that's a job where you're supposed to be
01:13:27.980
enforcing rules of workplace propriety. And so for all the people who might be having an affair with
01:13:36.300
their boss, to have it be the head of the HR, who a lot of people, like there are few worse people
01:13:43.220
in general. I don't mean to like overly generalize, but usually like HR managers are the worst. Like
01:13:49.060
those are the people who are just constantly like monitoring you and like pretending they're trying
01:13:53.740
to support you. And in reality, they're really just working for the corporation to protect the
01:13:57.860
corporation against you. So I think a lot of this, yeah, yeah. For anything, I think a lot of the
01:14:02.620
is from people's experience with HR and the fact that she was an HR manager. I do think there's a
01:14:10.040
question when there's a married couple and then there's a woman who ends up having sex with the
01:14:18.960
man in that married couple who actually bears most of the blame in that situation. Like to me,
01:14:25.560
it has always seemed like the person in the marriage who has promised the fidelity
01:14:29.380
responsibility is the one who bears most of the blame and not the woman who doesn't have a similar
01:14:35.140
commitment. Um, and then, you know, we also, I don't, I don't disagree with that. The person who's
01:14:41.380
breaking the vow has to answer to the person they made the vow to. That's really the main sin.
01:14:48.300
Right. And a lot of times we don't know what's taking place in other people's marriages. I mean,
01:14:53.240
the fact that they are still together might signify that for whatever reason, she, the wife had,
01:14:59.000
didn't react in the way that other people reacted on her behalf. Um, and then why'd she change all
01:15:05.080
her social media then? I mean, she clearly did have a reaction to it. That right. She was probably
01:15:11.260
embarrassed. Yeah. And, and, and it was a very embarrassing situation. Like I don't blame her
01:15:16.640
for wanting to distance herself, but the fact that she's still with him, who knows why? And then
01:15:22.440
finally, like we have a lot of people in very exactly probably that's, that's one of the reasons.
01:15:29.220
Um, but then there also like, there are people in very high political positions that we know we elect
01:15:34.820
and that we let lead us these days who 40 years ago would never have been even remotely conceivably
01:15:39.980
possible. Gary Hart got driven out of, you know, the 1998, 1988 race when he was discovered having an
01:15:45.360
affair with Donna Rice, probably for anyone younger than us, that's old, that's, that's things they've
01:15:50.220
never heard of. And yet, you know, you fast forward it and you have people like Bill Clinton who gets
01:15:54.840
reelected and Donald Trump who has had his own very public adulteries and affairs and overlapping
01:16:01.720
sorts of things. This makes me start to wonder like, why are we so obsessed with that couple and
01:16:08.320
shaming them when the mores have clearly changed or on the people who, who have a lot
01:16:15.320
more power and influence than they? Hmm. Okay. So it's interesting. I mean, like you're not wrong
01:16:21.040
that they hold women to different standards than they hold men to like the public. And that's wrong.
01:16:26.220
I mean, a shitty marriage can lead to infidelity on either side. Um, and, and not to quote Woody
01:16:34.200
Allen, but I am going to quote Woody Allen, who I don't believe did anything to his daughter,
01:16:38.360
Dylan at all. It's, these are lies that were made up against him by Mia Farrow, um, who was trying to
01:16:43.960
manipulate her daughter to avoid losing custody during a divorce and to hurt Woody. Um, but in
01:16:49.020
any event, he, he did have a, have an affair with and fall in love with, and then marry Mia's adopted
01:16:55.060
daughter, Sun Yi when she was young, she was 19. Um, the heart wants what it wants. So these, you know,
01:17:03.740
it is true that couples in bad marriages sometimes make bad decisions. And this only became the public's
01:17:10.860
business because they were caught on the Coldplay kiss cam. I guess what I think they should have
01:17:16.860
done is just come out right away. Like come out right away and give, just give an interview and,
01:17:22.320
and don't have even a hint of a tone that you're the victim. Just come out and say, I'm totally
01:17:29.280
humiliated. Um, I shouldn't have done it. And she is calling herself out for being the head of HR here.
01:17:35.320
She just, she acknowledges that's bad, uh, to be with the head of, of the, the company. But I mean,
01:17:41.280
I had a couple of high, high noons and danced and acted inappropriately with my boss and it's not
01:17:48.260
nothing. It's not nothing, but I mean, come on like that. Now that is downplaying what happened.
01:17:54.980
And I will tell you just from talking to other women, they get very angry when they see this kind
01:18:01.120
of thing, because they start to picture their own husband up there with another woman. And, uh,
01:18:07.280
even though the husband made the vow, they start to think about like, well, how, who's working
01:18:11.920
against me and how, without thinking about their own role and sending the marriage South to where
01:18:18.060
the husband would be potentially in a position to want to look at another woman. Right. And it's like,
01:18:22.720
it raises very complicated feelings for everyone involved.
01:18:26.160
People look at it through the prism of their own lives and what is, has either happened in their
01:18:33.860
own lives, what they've done, what their spouse has done, what they fear might happen. And I think
01:18:40.600
that's where the kind of, that's why some of these things resonate. I guess all I'm saying is, is that
01:18:47.780
the public morality being imposed on them seems inconsistent for me with the public morality that
01:18:55.400
we've kind of allowed to take root where we know that a lot of people with a lot of power in
01:19:03.820
politics or in business do this and far worse. And let me ask you a question to the conclusion
01:19:09.880
as a society, that's not our business. Yeah. Let me ask you a question. Is it because of the way
01:19:15.180
they reacted on cam? Like they telegraphed shame immediately, which is something Trump has never
01:19:22.460
done. Right. Like, exactly. I think that, that changed the way we all felt about it.
01:19:28.300
I totally agree. I totally agree. They exactly. I think that's, I think you're absolutely right.
01:19:33.320
I haven't thought about it that, but I think that's exactly the key to it is that they, and Chris,
01:19:38.140
Chris Martin noticed it right away. Right. He said, Oh my God, look at how ashamed they are. Like they
01:19:43.140
must be doing something wrong. So if they react like they're doing something wrong, of course,
01:19:47.540
the public is going to say, Oh yeah, they they've done something wrong. And so I do think that's the
01:19:53.860
part where like either you, you, you, you do this behavior and you say, look, this is my life. This is
01:20:00.160
my choice. This is not your business. Or, you know, if you're going to act like you just got caught doing
01:20:05.700
something terribly wrong, don't be surprised when everybody else sees it the same way. And I think
01:20:11.100
that is the key to why that became such a big story. I think you're very right about that.
01:20:16.100
She's now trying to turn it around into like an example for her children. Um, I don't know. I
01:20:21.300
think leave the kids out of it. Just keep out of it. And like, that's just meant to humanize her
01:20:25.440
in the public's eye. Like she's really, she trying to play up the death threat she got. She's trying
01:20:29.680
to play up like certain people have said something to her. Like she alleges that the gas station,
01:20:34.120
some woman was like, Oh, how can you live with yourself or whatever? Okay. When you are embroiled in a
01:20:39.140
public scandal, people are going to react like that's modern day America, 2025. And for whatever
01:20:47.000
reason, her moment was caught on tape. She's going to have to live with that.
01:20:51.220
Yeah. I can't stand when people act like that is something that has only happened to them.
01:20:57.680
You know, if you're at all in the public realm and, and I guess in defense of her, like they
01:21:04.060
didn't choose to be, although if you, you know, if you want to do that, go to a place that's private,
01:21:08.540
um, keep it behind closed doors. Like everybody in the public. Exactly. But if you're, you know,
01:21:15.160
if you're in the public realm, you're going to get people angry at you. You're going to hear
01:21:19.380
terrible things said about you. And so often, like, we all know this happens, you know, to,
01:21:25.660
to, to any of us in the public realm. And I really can't stand when people whine about it as though
01:21:30.660
they're uniquely victimized by it, especially when they made a choice to enter the public realm and,
01:21:36.580
and to, to do that. Like there's benefits from having a public platform and that's one of the
01:21:41.480
costs and just accept that and stop whining about it because it happens to everybody.
01:21:45.720
Totally. In my own case, if somebody says something nasty to me, I usually just blow them off. Or if
01:21:51.440
they're particularly aggressive, I'll shoot a remark back, but I don't take it any further than that
01:21:57.280
unless they actually physically threatened me or my family. And then they're going to get a visit from
01:22:02.140
the cops, but that's my general rule. Like, and if they're truly nuts, then they're going to get a
01:22:06.120
restraining order against them. Like you have to assess whether this is a, an actual threat to you
01:22:10.220
and your family, or whether this is just some critic, which is like, if you're in the public eye,
01:22:15.080
you have to take criticism. You have to take pot shots. Sadly, it's part of the deal, like toughen
01:22:20.260
up, get a thicker skin. And unfortunately for this woman, her bad moment, you know, her bad decision
01:22:26.700
was caught on camera. That wouldn't have happened had she kept her bad decision private, behind closed
01:22:32.500
doors, like, like civilized people having an affairs, like in a, in a dark corner of some bar,
01:22:37.700
not, not on the Coldplay kiss cam, something with which she's always going to be associated.
01:22:45.800
Okay. So that was it. She's back. And she really, really would like us to know she's
01:22:49.960
not exactly sorry, but she's kind of pissed off at the rest of us. All right, stand by. We have to
01:22:55.240
take a quick break and then we're going to be right back more with Glenn Greenwald. Don't go away.
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Glenn Greenwald is back with me. Glenn, the news is breaking right now from the New York Times
01:24:02.300
on Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein. They think they've got him this time. They've really got
01:24:08.340
him this time. Here are some highlights. Hold on a second. My team is sending me the name of the
01:24:13.740
article. It's Don's Best Friend. How Epstein and Trump bonded over the pursuit of women. And left-wing
01:24:22.840
X is going nuts over what's in this article right now. Here are some highlights. The Times interviewed
01:24:29.260
more than 30 former Epstein employees, victims of his abuse, and others who crossed paths with the
01:24:34.200
two men over the years. Again, I feel the need to point out victims of his abuse gets used very loosely
01:24:39.900
by everyone about Jeffrey Epstein. Who? Have their claims been proven in a court of law or otherwise?
01:24:49.020
Like, we don't know. They continue to just accept, like, certain women who are adults who were
01:24:55.020
allegedly, quote, molested by Jeffrey Epstein when they were 22. Like, this is tricky. In any event,
01:25:02.880
that's what they say. An examination of their history by the New York Times has found no evidence
01:25:08.020
implicating Mr. Trump and Mr. Epstein's abuse and trafficking of minors. Okay, that's great. That
01:25:12.640
seems like an important thing to remember. During a flight together in the early 1990s, Mr. Trump came on
01:25:17.760
to another Epstein employee traveling with them, telling her that he could have anyone he wanted,
01:25:22.120
according to a different Epstein worker who learned of the incident. A separate Epstein employee from
01:25:26.040
that era recalled, Trump would occasionally send over modeling cards to Epstein to peruse like a menu.
01:25:32.760
Okay. So he sent over modeling cards to Epstein, and he said on a plane that he could have anyone he
01:25:39.440
wanted. Got it? A few times a week, the phone would ring in Mr. Epstein's office. Trump would be on the
01:25:45.600
line. On one occasion, recalled an Epstein assistant from the mid-1990s, Mr. Trump refused to give any
01:25:51.400
name at all. The first assistant, who often worked late, recalled that sometimes when the office emptied
01:25:55.700
out, Mr. Epstein, oh, this is the part that they're loving. Mr. Epstein would check to see that she was at
01:26:00.900
her desk, and then he would put Trump on speaker. Mr. Trump, she said, seemed to enjoy regaling Mr. Epstein
01:26:05.660
with tales of his sexual exploits, and Mr. Epstein seemed to delight in how uncomfortable it made her to
01:26:11.640
overhear them. She remembered one call in the mid-1990s on which the two men discussed how much
01:26:16.180
pubic hair a woman, a particular woman, had, and whether there was enough for Mr. Epstein to floss
01:26:21.100
his teeth with. On another, Mr. Trump told Epstein about having sex with another woman on a pool table,
01:26:27.340
according to the former assistant. Now there's this other woman who says she's afraid to be identified
01:26:32.660
or even to be talking to the New York Times because she is afraid she will be executed. One woman,
01:26:37.660
then a model, and a college student in her early 20s living in Manhattan said she attended four
01:26:42.560
parties at Epstein's mansion. It was like a pissing contest. Who had the most women, she recalled.
01:26:47.640
She requested anonymity to describe her experiences in detail, saying she feared for her family's safety
01:26:52.520
after Mr. Trump said some of his critics could be executed for sedition. Okay, that was, that's,
01:26:59.500
I think, very different from her situation. Last but not least, this one involves Marla Maples,
01:27:04.860
Trump's second wife. Tina Davis, who modeled for Ford in the mid-1990s, and her mother, Sandra Coleman,
01:27:11.280
attended a Mar-a-Lago party in late 1994 when Tina was 14. During a trip to the bathroom,
01:27:18.260
they ran into Trump's new wife, Marla Maples. They had not met her earlier. Ms. Maples clasped her
01:27:24.700
hands, Ms. Coleman recalled, and looked her in the eye, quote, whatever you do, do not let her around
01:27:30.840
any of these men, and especially my husband, she told Ms. Coleman. Protect her. Okay, Ms. Maples,
01:27:40.780
because you remember, like, all the negative comments Ms. Maples has said about Trump since
01:27:44.340
their divorce, since Trump ran for office. She's constantly been out there saying,
01:27:48.160
he's a Me Too-er, he's an Epstein enabler. He, no, not a word. She's never disparaged him.
01:27:53.340
Ms. Maples denied making the comment. I would always protect young women in any way I could,
01:27:58.160
she said, but I am sure I did not specifically say that about my daughter's father. So that's the big
01:28:05.180
dump from the New York Times, Trump and his best friend, Epstein. Your thoughts on it, Glenn?
01:28:13.760
Okay. Is it actually breaking news that Donald Trump in the 80s and 90s, as a young, good-looking,
01:28:23.100
extremely rich Manhattan real estate developer had a strong interest in women and even womanized?
01:28:31.520
Like, we heard the Access Hollywood tape in 2016. People thought it was going to
01:28:37.060
sabotage his campaign, and it didn't. Yes, Donald Trump had a very active sex life,
01:28:42.620
a very strong interest in women, even when he was married. This is kind of what I was talking about
01:28:46.920
earlier. And people have decided that this is not disqualifying. And the other part of it is,
01:28:53.600
and this is something that I think is so important, the whole Jeffrey Epstein thing,
01:28:57.600
and I have to say, in a way, the American right kind of made this monster, and it's now sort of
01:29:03.160
attacking them, where it became like every person who ever talked to Jeffrey Epstein, who ever met
01:29:07.700
Jeffrey Epstein somehow had suspicion on them that they were a pedophile or had an interest in
01:29:13.700
underage girls. A lot of the so-called victims, as you said, Michael Tracy has been really doing
01:29:19.180
among the most courageous work on this because he's been fighting against the tide in this.
01:29:23.620
A lot of these women who claim to have been victims of sex trafficking or Epstein victims
01:29:28.960
never met Jeffrey Epstein until they were like 22 or 23 or 24, not underage at all. So he was also
01:29:36.020
surrounded by a lot of women who were definitely young, but well above the age of consent. And all of
01:29:42.620
this is being done now with innuendo by the New York Times and by the American left, just trying
01:29:47.640
in any way to take some of this dirt from Jeffrey Epstein and throw as much of it as they can on
01:29:52.900
Trump, which might be politically effective given everybody watched Trump fight so hard to conceal
01:29:58.680
the files. But until there's evidence that Trump actually had any kind of relationship with an
01:30:05.400
underage girl, and there actually has never been anything remotely close to that, all this is,
01:30:11.100
political activism disguised as journalism, which is everything that you read me from the New York
01:30:17.320
Times, which I haven't read yet, but the parts that you read me are empty in terms of anything
01:30:23.300
I know. I'm yawning like, okay. I mean, he was a playboy and he loved to talk about his sexual
01:30:29.120
exploits. Got it. I want to tell you this is just in. This is breaking from WPRI.com, which I think is a
01:30:37.880
local news outlet. The headline is police probe potential ties between Brown University attack
01:30:43.120
and MIT professor slaying. That is interesting. It doesn't mean there is, there is a link. It's
01:30:48.600
police are probing it. And previously they had said, we don't believe there's a link. So now it's,
01:30:53.320
it is news that there could be. Um, um, here's the excerpt. Target 12 is confirmed. Law enforcement
01:31:02.160
is now examining possible ties between the two crimes. Multiple people familiar with the
01:31:08.040
investigation said they have discovered evidence showing the two may be linked. Well, now that's
01:31:15.920
interesting. And I don't know how I'm not jumping to conclusions, but I will note the MIT professor
01:31:21.160
was Jewish. The professor whose class was attacked. He wasn't, he wasn't, he wasn't, he wasn't Jewish.
01:31:28.120
There was a lot of, my team just told me that he was. No, I, the latest I saw is that he, he wasn't,
01:31:34.440
I think he was like a, a defender of Israel. Um, but not himself Jewish, but you know, there's a lot
01:31:41.320
of stuff going on around line. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So I don't know that as my team told me that they had
01:31:46.960
seen he was in any event, we have no idea what the ties were. And the woman whose class was attacked
01:31:51.700
at Brown is an Israeli, a pro-Israeli activist. However, she was not even there that day. It was
01:31:58.520
a review class. She was not even in the class and it does not look like, you know, there hasn't been
01:32:04.280
a mention that like the kids targeted were Jewish, et cetera, inside. In fact, well, all we know so far
01:32:09.380
is that the one girl who was killed was the vice president of the college Republicans. And the other
01:32:13.480
young man who was killed was a naturalized citizen from Uzbekistan who was studying to be a neurosurgeon.
01:32:19.280
So we, we don't see the pattern so far and it may not emerge, but it is news that they are
01:32:23.800
probing it and there's potential links. I mean, but don't worry, Glenn, everyone's safe. Don't worry,
01:32:29.320
go out there and live your life as normal. Just like the mayor of Providence said, because
01:32:32.260
you know, no one's been shot since Saturday. Oh wait, maybe, maybe they have, I don't know.
01:32:37.440
Keep sending your child into this classroom. And also there's, these are super sophisticated
01:32:40.780
investigators. Don't worry. They're going to catch this person anytime now. I think the confidence
01:32:46.060
level should be very high in, in these police, police investigators and the, the local politicians.
01:32:50.620
I know. All right. One other thing I want to get to, well, there's two, if I have time,
01:32:54.100
um, the vanity fair photographer who took those hideous pictures of the Trump administration for
01:32:59.940
their big piece. Susie Wiles gives them 11 months of access, 11 interviews with this guy,
01:33:06.420
Chris Whipple. Then the, the thanks that they get is what Susie says are out of context,
01:33:13.200
pull quotes. Um, I get it. Shame on her for trusting them, but the pictures were so offensively
01:33:20.460
unflattering of a good looking group. JD Vance is attractive. Caroline Levitt's attractive. Susie
01:33:25.180
Wiles is attractive. It's not hard to take a nice picture of them at all. This photographer went out
01:33:29.500
of his way to make them look bad. His name is Christopher Anderson. He works for vanity fair as a
01:33:34.580
freelancer showing the extreme closeup of poor Caroline Levitt, who is like so much more attractive
01:33:39.880
than this. JD Vance, who looks like some sort of a demon, uh, in this weird picture. And then Susie
01:33:45.100
Wiles, who really looks like she is not a Marco Rubio, who looks like ruddy and poorly complected and
01:33:51.180
I don't know, dirty. There's Susie Wiles in what looks like a mugshot with somebody potentially
01:33:55.940
pinching her ass. That's what that looks like to me. It's just so bad all around. And this photographer
01:34:00.780
says, um, he's not sorry. He says what? Cause you can see Caroline Levitt's lip injections. You can
01:34:10.040
see the little marks where the needles had gone in not too long before this. And just note to all
01:34:14.280
ladies, do not sit for a photo photograph or a photo shoot. If you have those marks on your face,
01:34:19.840
trust no one. She had to learn that the hard way, sadly, but here's what he says. I didn't put the
01:34:24.800
injection sites on her. People seem to be shocked that I didn't use Photoshop to retouch out
01:34:28.680
blemishes in her injection marks. I find it shocking that someone would expect me to retouch
01:34:33.220
out those things. I'm surprised that a journalist would even need to ask me the question of why
01:34:38.300
didn't I retouch out the blemishes? Because if I had, that would be a lie. I would be hiding the truth
01:34:43.660
of what I saw there. Well, what can I say? That's the makeup she puts on. Those are the injections she
01:34:49.620
gave herself. If they show up in a photo, what do you want me to say? I don't know if it says something
01:34:54.160
about the world we live in, the age of Photoshop, the age of AI filters on your Insta, but the fact
01:34:58.680
that the internet is freaking out because they're seeing real photos and not retouched ones says
01:35:02.780
something to me. And he says, I've been doing this for a long, long time. He points to his picture,
01:35:09.740
the photos he took of Barack and Michelle Obama. Now let me show you what those look like.
01:35:14.960
The photo of Barack Obama. It's close, but it is a one third shot. It's got his necktie. Here's
01:35:25.060
Michelle Obama, who by the way, looks pretty. She's doing like a kissing face and it's a profile,
01:35:29.880
which by the way, will look better on virtually everybody instead of straight on. And she looks
01:35:36.780
cute because she's like making like a kissing motion and she's got shadows on her face that are
01:35:41.260
kind of flattering. And there's Barack Obama, again, a profile, which is better for anybody
01:35:45.800
who's going super up close. And you've got enough of his shoulders and chest that you can see necktie,
01:35:51.820
collar, and the lapels of his jacket. Same thing here. You can see his neck and the neck of his
01:35:57.200
shirt. And again, it's in profile, which I'm just telling you is, is more flattering on everyone.
01:36:03.840
And this is his defense to trying to make them obviously Glenn look terrible. Your thoughts.
01:36:09.580
Two things. One is that is such a disingenuous statement from the photographer. Okay. I just
01:36:15.980
take pictures. However they come out, that's not my fault. You know, I would, when I went during the
01:36:20.360
reporting, I had, you know, profiles in every single magazine, they were almost overwhelmingly
01:36:24.400
positive because people, the media liked the work and the pictures were great. And then I had a whole
01:36:29.060
new set of profiles when I kind of started splitting over at the left over Russiagate and Trump
01:36:33.980
going on Fox a lot. And they all looked like I was some kind of like demon troll unleashed from the
01:36:40.300
depths of hell. You know, it's so obvious like that they play that game. They pick the photos and
01:36:45.820
make it look good or bad based on whether they like you or not. Everybody who has any role in media
01:36:51.080
understands that. But I will say, I do think like Trump has spent 10 years calling these media outlets
01:36:59.060
fake news. Everybody knows like Vanity Fair or Rolling Stone or whatever hates Trump and the
01:37:05.240
Trump administration. So I do kind of blame, you know, Susie Wiles and like these Trump officials
01:37:11.320
who continuously give access to these media outlets that they know hate them and then act like surprised
01:37:16.900
or indignant when they're not treated fairly. Like, you know, if like, you know, Trump used to get
01:37:22.340
Trump gave Maggie Haberman, you know, full access to the Oval Office and every article that came out
01:37:27.640
would be incredibly negative. And he'd be like, she's a liar. She's a fake reporter. And then the
01:37:31.520
next week she'd be right back in the office. Michael Wolff too. Exactly. Oh yeah. I mean,
01:37:37.800
Michael Wolff, so many of those kinds of choices. And I get, you know, maybe you hope that this time
01:37:43.380
they're going to be fair, especially if you give them a lot, they're not going to be fair to you ever
01:37:47.480
that it's embedded in their DNA. Like don't have any expectation other than the fact that this is going
01:37:53.000
to be the result. But that statement by the photographer, like who, why are you blaming me
01:37:57.700
for the fact that her like pock marks or her injection marks as though he has no choice or
01:38:02.940
the editors have no choice over which photo they use? Please. It's like so insultingly deceitful.
01:38:09.740
Totally. And to think like he would ever have done this to Michelle Obama, which he didn't,
01:38:14.880
or Kamala Harris is a lie. It's a lie. And there is no question he did his level best to take
01:38:20.780
attractive people and make them look bad. And so, yeah, I mean, to quote the, the genius of Animal
01:38:28.300
House, you fucked up. You trusted us. And yeah, that's, that's live and learn. Now wait, stay with
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me another 10 minutes, Glenn, because there's one other story I want to talk to you about. It's a
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01:40:13.000
Hey, everyone. It's me, Megan Kelly. I've got some exciting news. I now have my very own channel
01:40:19.280
on SiriusXM. It's called the Megan Kelly Channel, and it is where you will hear the truth unfiltered
01:40:24.460
with no agenda and no apologies. Along with the Megan Kelly Show, you're going to hear from people
01:40:28.920
like Mark Halperin, Link Lauren, Maureen Callahan, Emily Drashinsky, Jesse Kelly, Real Clear Politics,
01:40:34.860
and many more. It's bold, no BS news only on the Megan Kelly Channel, SiriusXM 111, and on the
01:40:47.940
Glenn Greenwald is back with me. So tomorrow, we're going to do the show in the morning,
01:40:52.460
and then I will be getting on a plane to go to Arizona to speak at the Turning Point big event,
01:41:00.200
their AMFest production, stands for America Fest 2025. And it was very important to me to go to this,
01:41:05.900
though normally I can't go to this one because we're usually going off to our family vacation for
01:41:12.180
the holidays in Montana. So this year, I said, I'm absolutely going. Try to keep me away because
01:41:18.380
we're all getting out there to try to honor Charlie. This is the first big event since he
01:41:24.340
died. And the last one I was at as well, which was in July, where he interviewed me,
01:41:29.880
and we talked all about Epstein. So I will be there. And Charlie's been on my mind a lot lately
01:41:34.880
for many reasons. And that's why this news jumped out at me and what I wanted to talk to you about,
01:41:40.100
Glenn. There is a woman named Jeannie Beeman, and she works at a Target store in Orland, California.
01:41:51.220
She's older, Jeannie is, and she was minding her own business, doing her job, when a much younger
01:41:57.220
woman, who we now know is named Michaela Ponce, P-O-N-C-E, came over and harassed poor Jeannie
01:42:04.960
over the fact that she was wearing a shirt honoring Charlie. And here is the video that we know of
01:42:13.220
because the videographer, Michaela Ponce, posted it to her TikTok. Saw at 26.
01:42:21.960
Let you wear that shirt here? Yes. Why? Why are you taking my picture?
01:42:27.840
Why are you wearing that shirt? You're working. It's not a Target shirt. It's a red shirt. I can wear
01:42:32.100
any red shirt. It's not a plain shirt. It doesn't have to be. It's a Charlie Kirk shirt.
01:42:38.720
Yes. Oh, yes, I know. Are you fucking stupid? No.
01:42:42.080
Why the fuck would you wear that? You're at work at Target. That's not a Target shirt. It's
01:42:47.460
not a plain red shirt. You support a racist. It's not racist. You support a racist. He's
01:42:56.100
not a racist. Yes, he is. Yes, he fucking is. I'm sorry, but I'm not going to stand here
01:43:01.140
and argue with you. You're not. You should go get your manager. You should not be allowed
01:43:03.980
to wear that at work. Unacceptable. Un-fucking-acceptable. That's your opinion. The opinion is he's a fucking
01:43:11.500
racist and you support him. That's your opinion, ma'am. And you should not be allowed to wear
01:43:16.740
that. This is going to be taken above your fucking head. That's insane. Insane.
01:43:23.020
It's infuriating. It's really, really infuriating. This is an older woman. Jeannie's obviously,
01:43:43.400
you know, not a spring chicken. And she's obviously not a rich woman. And she's working at Target,
01:43:49.520
paying her bills, making an honest living, trying to pick up after people. And she gets harassed by
01:43:56.200
this absolute prick, Michaela Ponce. And Michaela's so proud of herself for harassing Jeannie that Michaela
01:44:04.540
posts it on her own TikTok because she's looking for likes, Glenn. She's looking for thumbs up and
01:44:11.880
hearts and props from her leftist crowd that's going to think she's awesome for saying Charlie Kirk's a
01:44:18.520
racist and calling Jeannie fucking stupid. You're fucking stupid. Well, that's not how it went.
01:44:26.780
What happened since then is Michaela has, we've now found out, who works as a medical assistant
01:44:38.260
employed by Enloe Health, a nonprofit healthcare system in Chico, Northern California. Michaela's
01:44:45.060
place of employment, the medical center, has now received over 6,000 calls from some very upset
01:44:53.420
Charlie Kirk fans. Here is the CEO of Enloe Health, the employer of Michaela Ponce, who spoke out on it
01:45:05.100
Enloe Health acknowledges that the off hours behavior by a medical assistant employed in one of our
01:45:11.800
allocation clinics, as depicted in a recent social media post, was abhorrent and deeply concerning.
01:45:18.580
We appreciate the many individuals who have seen this post and exercised restraint as they voice their
01:45:24.240
personal views regarding the situation. Unfortunately, many thousands of others have chosen to use profanity-laced
01:45:32.000
language to express their disapproval to Enloe caregivers. I believe there was a period of a few hours where we've
01:45:38.800
received over 6,000 calls. And those are starting to evade a little bit right now. I can tell from my own
01:45:47.020
email box that the emails are starting to subside a little bit. But yeah, we were overwhelmed there for a while.
01:45:53.740
That's Mike Wiltermood, the CEO. And had I had his number, I probably would have been one of the people
01:45:59.400
leaving a profanity-laced message like, Mike, what the fuck is going on with Michaela? She sucks because
01:46:06.240
you feel better when you express your outrage about her abject harassment of an elderly woman
01:46:11.020
just trying to pay her bills and honor Charlie Kirk while doing it, who was assassinated three months
01:46:16.740
ago. Now, clearly, Michaela has learned that there are millions of us who loved Charlie and have felt
01:46:25.860
inspired by his faith-based conservative messaging and who are 100% in Jeannie's corner because Michaela
01:46:34.020
has been forced to issue the following statement to Action News Now.
01:46:40.260
I want to take full responsibility for my actions and say clearly and sincerely that I was wrong.
01:46:45.020
I behaved badly and I regret it deeply. I want to directly apologize to Jeannie. I'm truly sorry
01:46:50.520
for approaching you at your workplace and putting you in an uncomfortable and unfair position.
01:46:54.580
You did not deserve that and my behavior was wrong. She's not, she hasn't changed her mind about
01:47:01.120
Charlie or apparently about thinking Jeannie's fucking stupid. She's sorry that she approached her
01:47:06.560
at work and acknowledges maybe Jeannie didn't deserve that. And I would submit to you the reason that
01:47:12.680
Michaela issued that statement is because old Mike Wiltermood is probably thinking about firing her ass
01:47:20.600
because of the 6,000 profanity-laced phone calls he's received. Now, let's check back in with Jeannie
01:47:26.740
at this point in our story and see how she's doing. She gave an interview and did not know that this had
01:47:34.700
turned into a thing because Jeannie's older and probably is not following Michaela on TikTok. But she did
01:47:46.280
I know people are calling for her to be fired for this. Do you think that that's right? Would you like
01:47:51.700
that to write? No, I don't think that's that's right. Like one thing I have is two wrongs don't make a
01:48:00.100
right. You know, she wronged me, but I don't want to wrong her or I don't want her her wrong because it's
01:48:08.000
not going to make it right. I mean, that was her opinion. She but she's the one that put it on
01:48:15.160
Facebook or put it on on that. So, you know, but I really wouldn't want to see her somebody lose
01:48:25.880
their job over it. That is so sweet. Jeannie is so sweet. I mean, it had it been me, I would have been
01:48:32.880
like, fire her ass, Mike. She's terrible. Why would you employ this person? But I'm a hothead on these
01:48:38.300
things. And here is the final piece of the story, Glenn, that will make you believe in the power of
01:48:45.940
the American people just one week before Christmas and in the middle of Hanukkah. Here it is.
01:48:53.320
Since the incident, multiple fundraising campaigns have been set up to help Jeannie from Target
01:49:00.200
recover from the incident. She wasn't fired. Target, to its credit, is standing by Jeannie and not
01:49:05.980
telling her she does not, she cannot wear that shirt. But people are, they just want to make Jeannie
01:49:10.340
feel good and show her that we love her. And they originally were trying to raise $20,000 to send
01:49:16.500
Jeannie on a nice vacation. When we last checked, the Give, Send, Go campaign had already raised over
01:49:24.480
$200,000 for Jeannie just to show her that we love her. So this story has it all. It's got the
01:49:34.600
outrage factor. It's got the benevolent Jeannie who didn't call for the firing. It's got the berated
01:49:40.800
Mike with Wilter Mood who would like the profanity lace phone calls to stop. And it's got our villain,
01:49:48.840
Michaela, who was very well forced into issuing an apology, which I'll take. It's better than no
01:49:57.700
apology. And the great American people who said, we love Jeannie and we're on her side and we want
01:50:04.460
her life to be better. So here's $200,000. All right, now tell me everything you think.
01:50:12.980
Well, first of all, I can't wait to go donate right when I'm done with this interview. And I'll tell you
01:50:16.580
why. It's not because she wore the Charlie Kirk shirt. It's because imagine the generosity of
01:50:23.220
spirit to have somebody. I mean, this is a woman who works at Target. That is a hard job. That is
01:50:29.600
not an easy life. She's making very poor money. And you can be filled with resentment. Obviously,
01:50:37.280
the woman that Michaela wanted her fired. So imagine running around and saying, no, I don't want her
01:50:42.840
fired just because she, she did that to me. That already is such an admirable person. Like how many
01:50:49.140
of us would, would react that way? As you said, like you're kind of a hothead. I don't know at all
01:50:54.240
that that would be my reaction, but I, I, I respected and admire it so much. But I also think there's
01:51:00.140
like this generational thing, which is like, I don't mind that people dislike Charlie Kirk's ideology.
01:51:06.640
He was a very political person. He had very strong political views. People disagreed with it.
01:51:10.840
That's totally fine. The idea though, that like, we now attack each other, like not politicians,
01:51:18.720
right? Like you can yell at politicians for the, you go into a target and see some like older woman
01:51:22.980
working because she has to at a very difficult job standing on her feet all day. And you're going
01:51:27.600
to berate her and attack her and film it and put it on the internet. Like you've done something noble.
01:51:32.560
That to me signifies like this very rotted spirit that has entered our discourse based on the idea
01:51:38.580
that anyone who has different political views than us is an evil person who should suffer in every
01:51:44.040
single way. And the fact that you have this one woman who's supposedly the villain, because she's
01:51:48.740
wearing a t-shirt of a racist, evil person being so clearly the better person while you have this
01:51:55.120
other woman, so self-righteous thinking she's so moral acting in a way that no matter your ideology
01:51:59.960
is so revolting. I think there's a lot of lessons in there that I hope people take away who are like
01:52:05.880
Michaela, but I doubt will. It does happen on both sides. There have been a lot of people who have been
01:52:10.880
attacked for other kinds of views for wearing. And I think we need to get back to the spirit that like
01:52:14.940
part of what is America, like part of what we love about it is that if you're a private citizen,
01:52:19.760
you can express whatever views you want and you don't lose your job over it. You don't get publicly
01:52:24.840
attacked for it. You know, that behavior needs to be scorned. And it was scorned in this case.
01:52:30.700
And the cherry on top is that that woman who displayed so much like moral kindness and generosity
01:52:36.640
of spirit got a just reward. Like it's so rare to have karmic justice like that on every aspect of
01:52:43.580
the story. So it is a really enjoyable one. It's one I hadn't heard. So I went with you on that journey
01:52:48.220
and was so happy at the end. Shout out to Jeannie for keeping it together in the moment too,
01:52:53.560
right? When your blood could really be boiling, you could be, you know, I'm sure she felt under
01:53:00.900
attack. The woman called her a piece of shit. She called her fucking stupid. She was saying that
01:53:07.460
she was supporting, yeah, threatened her job, which I'm sure Jeannie needs. Um, obviously was saying
01:53:13.720
that she supported a racist, which implies that Jeannie's racist. Like it had it all. And then she
01:53:18.460
tried to publicly shame Jeannie by putting on her TikTok, just waiting for all the likes.
01:53:24.220
Michaela just couldn't, she couldn't wait for everyone to give her props and, you know, finger
01:53:29.220
snaps. And the side of reason roared, roared. I love it. And I kind of do support the profanity-laced
01:53:39.080
phone calls, though it's not Mike's fault, but he heard us. He, Mike, sorry, sorry, Mike
01:53:44.840
Wilterspoon, um, Wiltermood, Wiltermood. It's an interesting name, CEO of California-based and low
01:53:50.340
health. But I do think you should keep an eye on this one, Mike, because I have a feeling Michaela,
01:53:56.420
uh, does not have a generosity of spirit when it comes to people who are on the right side of the
01:54:01.660
aisle who may indeed walk into your clinic one day wearing a Charlie Kirk shirt or not, but deserve to
01:54:07.860
be treated with respect and kindness, even if they happen to be right-leaning. So there's that,
01:54:13.500
Glenn. It's a nice story to end our segment with. Perfect ending, Megan. Absolutely. Reason and,
01:54:18.960
and sanity prevail, even in California. Great to see you, my friend. Have a Merry Christmas,
01:54:25.180
Happy Holidays, and we'll see you on the back end. Always great to see you, Megan. You too. Same to
01:54:29.820
your family. We'll see you shortly. Lots of love and thanks for everything this year. Uh, we are back
01:54:34.900
tomorrow with Buck Sexton. We'll see you then. Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show. No BS,
01:54:50.100
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