The Megyn Kelly Show - Biden Politicizes Trump Trial, and Hillary Tries Blaming Women For 2016 Loss, with Stu Burguiere and Dave Marcus

00:00:00.620 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:12.060 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show. I hope you and your family

00:00:15.880 had a good Memorial Day weekend and gave some thought to what it was all about and the sacrifices

00:00:22.640 of our troops and their families who pay the ultimate price so that you and I can have the

00:00:28.240 lives we do. If you haven't yet, please go check out our interview with Sean Ryan, which we posted

00:00:34.140 yesterday. And thanks to all of you for the feedback so far. I'm so glad that you liked it

00:00:39.200 as much as I did. I continue to think about Sean a lot and got a lot of feedback from his fans saying

00:00:45.420 they've never heard him quite like this. What an extraordinary man. Extraordinary man. And

00:00:50.460 just someone you're going to want to know. I'm like personally glad that he has a podcast.

00:00:57.520 podcast so I can keep talking to him. Do you know what I mean? Like I can keep tabs on him.

00:01:02.500 I can see how he's doing and hear how he's doing and stay in touch with him. We're so lucky to have

00:01:08.200 this guy in the national conversation and our lives and having served our country. He makes you proud to

00:01:13.240 be an American and just like a human. He's a normal, thoughtful. I don't know if I've ever had somebody

00:01:19.640 on the show who is just so authentic and honest. Many have come close, but Sean Ryan is in a class

00:01:27.200 of one. Anyway, check it out now onto the news because there's a lot of it today. My gosh, we

00:01:32.260 are drinking from the fire hose when it comes to this Trump trial. They're in the middle of closing

00:01:35.480 arguments right now. Todd Blanche, who represents Trump, is first up and is in the midst of it. He

00:01:42.780 started a couple of hours ago in this New York City courtroom in the business records trial of

00:01:48.760 former President Donald Trump. My pal sent this to me. You know, you know how we began this trial with

00:01:55.260 our fake like romance novel slash porn reading of the way the reporters were covering Trump's facial

00:02:04.680 movements during the voir dire. I mean, really, they took the most boring aspects of this trial

00:02:10.820 and made it into their own personal Trump porn. He sent me a screen grab from CNN. Hush money. Trump

00:02:17.080 hush money trial live in the courtroom. New 926 AM. Trump scanned the rose to his left as he walked down

00:02:26.540 the center aisle, pursing his lips. They never stopped. They can't get enough of it. These lips

00:02:37.720 were pursed. Make sure you include that. Outside of the courthouse, it's just as ridiculous.

00:02:46.660 The campaign of President Biden, remember, they were above it all. They weren't in favor or against

00:02:50.540 these prosecutions. It really just kind of had nothing to do with them. They were above it all.

00:02:53.980 Trump is the criminal loser who has to go to criminal court. President Biden is the president.

00:02:58.840 He's in the Oval Office, for God's sake. You see the difference between these two men?

00:03:03.580 Well, the latest polls seem to have caused a change in heart. And now the campaign of President Biden

00:03:09.360 is holding a press conference featuring Robert De Niro and January 6th police officers. I kid you not,

00:03:19.040 it's happening right now. We're going to show you some of what they're doing. We'll get to all of it

00:03:23.420 today with two of our favorites. Stu Bergeer is host of Stu Does America on Blaze TV. And Dave

00:03:29.260 Marcus is a columnist for Fox News and the Daily Mail. Stu, Dave, welcome back. So I'm going to read

00:03:37.620 you some of the closing argument as it's gone so far. But what do you make of above it all Biden

00:03:43.560 now actually going, right? The Democrats were salivating. Trump's stuck in court. He's not

00:03:49.600 going to be able to say anything. But Joe Biden's got the whole nation to himself. Meanwhile, they're

00:03:53.560 like, holy shit, all the action's over there. We better get over there right now. Who do we send?

00:03:57.520 Get Robert De Niro. He's one of the biggest stars on earth. Everybody will love him. Well, he got booed

00:04:02.940 to the point where he started to like get upset. Somebody, and I got to imagine it was a Trump

00:04:09.360 supporter, must have hit one of those car alarms, the annoying car alarms, which took over half of his

00:04:16.080 remarks. He was so annoyed. He's not used to going into the room and not being the most popular guy

00:04:23.960 there. Stu, so what do you make of their running to Trump sometimes when Muhammad won't go to the

00:04:31.100 mountain? You know, it has to happen. Politico today saying the Dems are in full freakout mode over

00:04:36.940 the Biden candidacy and how it's going and which is not well. So what better way to turn the narrative

00:04:43.240 around about your, you know, 80 plus year old doddering candidate than send out an 80 plus year

00:04:48.340 old doddering celebrity to support him in front of a courthouse where he shows up, by the way, in a

00:04:55.280 cloth mask outdoors. He walks up in a mask, I guess, to prevent COVID-19 outdoor transmission, which

00:05:05.640 scientists will tell you has never occurred outside of very close conversation. And then he,

00:05:11.680 of course, steps up to the podium and when he's surrounded by everybody and removes the mask

00:05:16.060 immediately. It's actually a really good microcosm of how this is going so far for Biden.

00:05:21.720 So true. Unless the mask red vote, it couldn't have been any better.

00:05:26.400 Yeah, it's true. It's just embarrassing. This is an embarrassing situation. And they are now

00:05:31.660 getting to the point where I think they've had this narrative in their head since the beginning,

00:05:36.180 Megan, I think, where they thought, you know, look, people, you know, Trump left office and wasn't all

00:05:40.360 that popular, right? He leaves in 2020, even before January 6th, you know, his approval rating was

00:05:45.100 never sky high. People will remember eventually that they didn't like him. They'll see him on TV.

00:05:51.080 He'll start tweeting again or something. And the people will be reminded. And the closer and closer

00:05:55.300 we get to this election, I think they're realizing that the average everyday situation for the average

00:06:01.580 everyday person is overwhelming whatever distaste they had for Donald Trump's personality or

00:06:07.280 hijinks outside of office, they don't seem to be thinking about that. They seem to be thinking

00:06:13.580 about their bank accounts and the fact that they're paying, you know, $9 a gallon for milk.

00:06:18.200 And this is a big problem for them and one that is overwhelming whatever concerns they have about

00:06:23.340 Trump. They look back at Trump as something that, you know, it was a positive memory in their mind as

00:06:27.280 opposed to what they have now. And they might not like Donald Trump, but what they do know is they

00:06:31.180 don't know they don't want what they have at this moment.

00:06:33.420 Dave, here's some sound from outside the courtroom. De Niro talking about what's going to happen.

00:06:39.440 We keep hearing this from Rachel Maddow and others. If Trump wins, suggesting we'll never

00:06:44.880 get rid of him. He's going to stay in office forever and ever. He will single handedly bend

00:06:48.240 the Constitution to his will. Sat won. If Trump returns to the White House, you can kiss these

00:06:54.420 freedoms goodbye that we all take for granted. And elections, forget about it. That's over.

00:07:01.340 That's done. If he gets in, I can tell you right now, he will never leave. He will never

00:07:09.480 leave. You know that. He will never leave. What does that mean? Is that the country we

00:07:19.400 want to live in? Do we want him running this country and saying, I'm not leaving, I'm dictator

00:07:24.900 for life? This is not a threat. This is a reality. And that's why I've joined the Biden-Harris

00:07:32.700 campaign, because the only way to preserve our freedoms and hold on to our humanity is

00:07:38.660 to vote for Joe Biden for president. Really? We don't have a choice.

00:07:47.240 Okay. Just to follow up on that, Dave, here's a little bit of the pushback that he was getting

00:07:53.940 and how he handled it and sought to.

00:07:58.080 for these low lives, for Trump. They lied under oath.

00:08:05.640 They lied under oath. Who lied under oath? What are you telling me? Excuse me? They lied under oath?

00:08:13.940 What are you saying? They're traders. I don't even know how to deal with you, my friend. I don't

00:08:23.780 even know how to deal with you. Dave, should Robert De Niro have been dealing with them at all?

00:08:33.540 Listen, if you look over De Niro's shoulder in that first clip, you can see Biden comms director

00:08:38.720 Michael Tyler thinking to himself, oh, my God, my career is over. I mean, it's like it's right there

00:08:44.380 in his eyes. Like you could completely see it. No, I'm going to be honest with you. You know,

00:08:48.380 I've covered every inch of this trial for The Morning Wire every day. So I'm there nine o'clock

00:08:53.340 this morning. There's my TV. There's my laptop. There's my thing. And I see Biden Harris going to

00:08:58.820 do a presser at the trial. I thought like, well, that doesn't seem like a very good idea. That

00:09:04.180 doesn't send the message. This isn't political. Right. But I thought, OK, that's dumb. And then

00:09:09.420 I'm scrolling Twitter. And I don't know if you guys know Phil Wegman. He's a buddy of mine.

00:09:12.660 Wonderful White House correspondent for Real Clear Politics. One of the few guys who asks the tough

00:09:17.080 questions. Right. Serious journalist. I'm a goofy columnist. He's a serious journalist. Right.

00:09:21.820 And he quote tweets the press release. And he says, one of the speakers will be Robert

00:09:27.380 De Niro. My hand to God. My first thought was good for Phil. This is funny. This is a good

00:09:34.200 funny joke. It's nice to see Phil let his hair down. And I was like, wait a minute. Phil

00:09:39.800 wouldn't make this joke in this situation. And I still couldn't believe it was real. I am

00:09:45.420 absolutely flummoxed. That is the dumbest move that I've ever seen a presidential campaign

00:09:49.380 make in my entire life. You know, Biden's campaign staff reminds me of a line from

00:09:55.060 Glenn Gary Glenn Ross when Ricky Roma looks at the office manager and he says, your job

00:09:59.700 is to help us not to fuck us up. And that's what I'd be saying if I was Joe Biden to my

00:10:05.680 campaign staff right now. They're horrible. Look, I don't know if they're going to switch

00:10:09.280 out Joe Biden. They got to switch out these fools because this was a hot mess.

00:10:13.660 Yeah. And honestly, like the January 6 cops, the thing is to these two in particular, especially

00:10:21.340 Fanon, have been so partisan, so political. I mean, they hate President Trump. And I get

00:10:31.780 that maybe they have additional reasons to dislike him, given what happened on J6. But if you listen

00:10:37.620 to in particular, this guy Fanon, I don't know Harry Dunn as well. Everything he says about

00:10:43.080 Trump is interpreted through the most harsh partisan Trump derangement syndrome afflicted

00:10:49.640 lens. It's like, OK, we we get it right. Like these are and De Niro, too. I was on Fox News.

00:10:57.680 I was in the primetime of Fox and we had Robert De Niro on camera in an exclusive rant about Donald

00:11:07.160 Trump is the first time he'd really come out and said how he felt about politics. And we broke

00:11:12.440 that on my show when he ran and lost to Hillary Clinton. So what is it that they think has changed

00:11:21.840 between then and now that De Niro couldn't get Trump defeated in 16 to Hillary, but somehow

00:11:29.880 he can do the job now against Joe Biden? It is strange calculus. I don't understand it at all. I mean,

00:11:36.980 obviously, the Democrats have this quote unquote advantage of having all of the celebrities on

00:11:43.500 earth liking them instead of Republicans. And they trot these people out constantly. I've never

00:11:47.940 really seen much success with this approach, though. I don't I don't know that it does anything for

00:11:51.920 anyone. You kind of understand in theory that the Capitol police officer approach, right? These are

00:11:57.240 people who look on January 6th. Some Capitol police officers were victims of being hit with flagpoles and

00:12:05.120 things like this. There are some that I think are, you know, characters that you would want on your

00:12:09.800 side. You mentioned Harry Dunn, though. He's not one of them. I mean, Harry Dunn has what the person

00:12:15.680 said to De Niro, at least part of it was accurate. He has lied under oath. Our own Steve Baker here at

00:12:21.260 the Blaze has done extensive reporting on this with video. He got access to all of the cameras inside the

00:12:26.860 Capitol. Harry Dunn said under oath that he was in one place in the Capitol and had a confrontation.

00:12:32.080 We have the video from that time. He was on the other side of the building, nowhere near where

00:12:37.500 he said he was. This has been shown with video over and over again. Please look at Steve Baker's

00:12:43.080 reporting on this. And he's he went on to, of course, run for a congressional seat, which he lost

00:12:48.600 in a primary a couple of weeks ago. But he has been someone that the Democrats have tried to use this

00:12:54.560 idea that he's this hero cop and large parts of his story have already been proven to be untrue.

00:13:00.640 They don't care. They have this idea that they can still control this narrative and

00:13:05.900 forever through the mainstream media. This has been true. They've been right. They've been able

00:13:10.340 to do this. I just don't think 2024 the same story. I don't think rolling out famous celebrities

00:13:16.380 and people who have our newsmakers whose stories have been proven at least half untrue.

00:13:22.720 That's not going to work anymore because you don't have a media that is going to tell the story

00:13:27.840 lock, stock and barrel the way they want it. And I think they're going to wake up to a situation

00:13:32.540 where they just don't have the control they believe they do. And I think it's just now that

00:13:38.360 we're within six months, it's starting to terrify them. Yeah, that's right. They they are losing

00:13:42.900 control. I mean, the fact that they sent emissaries over to lower Manhattan to speak at the Trump trial

00:13:48.640 is amazing. And it does show you that what Trump's been doing since he's gagged and he can't speak

00:13:53.480 of bringing in surrogates to offer comments every day has rattled them, too. They're like,

00:13:59.640 oh, no, we better get somebody over there to counter that rather than doing the above the

00:14:04.260 fray. We're going to talk about inflation routine above the fray. We're going to talk about you and

00:14:09.340 your pocketbook and the issues we know matter, which was the approach they said they were going

00:14:13.020 to do. And obviously nothing's working for him, which is why they're in full freak out mode.

00:14:17.280 We'll get to that Politico article. But let me stay on the Trump trial because we've got we don't

00:14:22.400 so frustrating, of course. Right. We don't have cameras in there. All we get is tweet storms from

00:14:26.560 those who are either in the courtroom or in the annex for press where they hear everything live,

00:14:31.020 but don't necessarily see everything live. And we've got a bit of, you know, what we what we

00:14:37.140 sort of are calling a transcript. So I'm going to read you some of it. OK, this is from Todd Blanche's

00:14:41.640 closing argument, skipping around here. And again, understanding this is not verbatim. This is

00:14:45.620 pulled together via Anna Bauer, Andrew Giuliani and Katie Fang, who are diverse ideologically. So

00:14:53.640 that's good. That's what you want to pull from. OK, Blanche gets up there and says President Trump

00:14:58.500 is innocent. The district attorney did not meet their burden of proof, period. You should want and

00:15:03.780 expect more than the testimony of Michael Cohen. You should want something beyond the word of a woman

00:15:09.340 who claims that something happened in 2006. You should want more than Keith Davidson, an attorney

00:15:15.120 who was really trying to extort money from Trump in the lead up to election. This morning, I'll talk

00:15:20.080 to you about what you say and hear in the courtroom, but also what you didn't hear, what you saw, I guess

00:15:25.620 that should say. This case is about documents. It's a paper case. It's not about an encounter with

00:15:31.020 Stormy Daniels 18 years ago, which Trump has denied. It's not even about a confidential settlement.

00:15:36.820 It's about whether when Trump was living in the White House as leader of the free world,

00:15:41.840 he had anything to do with payments to his personal attorney at the time. Were those payments false?

00:15:48.980 Were they done with intent to defraud? The answer is absolutely not. They were accurate and done with

00:15:54.680 no intent to defraud. Moreover, there was no conspiracy to influence the election. You cannot convict

00:16:01.460 Trump on the words of Michael Cohen. There were key conversations he claimed he had, meaning Michael

00:16:08.140 Cohen, with Dylan Howard, with Keith Schiller. Howard was AMI. Keith Schiller was Trump's bodyguard.

00:16:14.540 Allen Weisselberg, the CFO of the Trump org, none of whom were witnesses in this trial.

00:16:19.340 Michael Cohen is the witness they called. The words Cohen said to you mattered. And he said a number

00:16:25.860 of things do you understand that were lies, pure and simple, I think it is. He goes to the business

00:16:33.100 records that form the basis of the charges, focusing on the checks. Trump signed them while he was in

00:16:37.540 the White House. You have to find that these documents were false and that he made them with

00:16:44.460 intent to defraud. Don't forget, the checks themselves don't say anything incriminating.

00:16:49.920 They're just 35 grand from the Trump org signed by Trump to Michael Cohen over the course of several

00:16:55.980 months to pay back this 420 grand, which we've gone over what was in there. And, but the stubs

00:17:02.180 say retainer, retainer. And the prosecution's arguing that was a lie because there was no retainer

00:17:07.860 because Cohen wasn't working for Trump as a lawyer in 2017. Trump didn't write retainer. Cohen submitted

00:17:13.160 an invoice to the Trump org that said retainer for legal services performed. The Trump org had a drop

00:17:18.940 down menu of how we categorize all outgoing expenses. Legal expenses was one of the items

00:17:24.720 and they clicked it. And that's what happened. And in this stub for the check was just reflected what

00:17:30.440 the lawyer had written on the check retainer. Trump is not shown to have known about or, or approved

00:17:37.820 or written any of that. All we have for the fact that Trump allegedly knew about a scheme to bill things

00:17:44.760 as expenses when they really reimbursements for hush money is the word of Michael Cohen. And, and

00:17:49.240 that's what Todd Blanche is saying here. Okay. I'm continuing Blanche turns to the vouchers in the

00:17:56.040 Trump organization ledger system. Deb Tarasoff, who worked for Weisselberg in accounting, Blanche

00:18:01.580 says, told you these vouchers were put in the system. They were a result of what the invoice was

00:18:06.680 submitted by Cohen. This is getting to the point I just made. And that was consistent with what she

00:18:11.460 understood was happening at the time. Cohen was acting as Trump's personal attorney. They're

00:18:16.820 trying to say what Trump said outside of the legal proceeding early on in this case. He was my

00:18:20.540 lawyer. We put down legal expenses for the money I gave him. What's wrong? What's false?

00:18:28.020 Tarasoff told you she never did anything at the direction of Trump. Blanche reminds the jurors,

00:18:33.240 there's no dispute that Cohen was rendering legal services to Trump in 2017 while Trump was in the

00:18:39.740 White House and that he was serving as Trump's personal attorney. As a matter of fact, Cohen testified

00:18:44.960 as much. There is a reason why in life that usually the simplest answer is the right one. That's not

00:18:51.260 what Mr. Cohen told you on the stand. Mr. Cohen was paid to be president Trump's attorney. And Cohen guys

00:18:58.740 did admit that while he wasn't working for him full time, he did at least a few incidents of legal work

00:19:06.280 for Trump and Melania during 2017. He was billing himself as Trump's personal attorney. He was using

00:19:12.040 that label to get other work. And even though they didn't sign a retainer agreement for that year,

00:19:17.800 they had never signed one. Michael Cohen always worked retainer free for the Trump organization.

00:19:24.020 So it was not unusual for him to do that. I'm going to keep going and then I'll bring you guys in.

00:19:30.060 The government wants you to believe that Cohen, Weisselberg and Trump had some kind of agreement

00:19:34.720 to falsify the records that Cohen wasn't working for that $35,000 a month, that it was a reimbursement

00:19:42.680 for the storm repayment, among others. Then Todd Blanche shows a May 2017 email in which Cohen tells

00:19:48.960 the recipient to call him about the foundation matter he was working on at the time for Trump.

00:19:54.680 Blanche, the government wants you to believe Cohen was doing this work for free. Even if Cohen was

00:20:00.380 working for a small fee, there was a retainer agreement, Blanche says. Just wasn't in writing

00:20:05.140 is their point. He mentions Cohen's testimony regarding his consulting retainer agreement

00:20:09.960 with Novartis. That's how a retainer agreement works, Blanche says. You're on call. That's why

00:20:15.760 he was getting $35,000 a month to be available if and when Trump needed him. By the way, I have an

00:20:22.760 attorney on retainer right now. Same thing. He's not doing anything for me. It's if I need him.

00:20:28.320 And if anybody messes with me, I will sick him on you and it will be highly unpleasant for you.

00:20:33.120 This is not unusual to have a lawyer on retainer for people in, you know, significant posts.

00:20:41.620 Michael Cohen was Trump's personal attorney, period. Okay, so that's it for now. I'll get to some of

00:20:47.960 the some of the rest of it. But he's trying to make the case. There was no falsification. This is a

00:20:53.740 falsification of business records case that the government can't even get past step one. What was

00:21:00.220 written down was a legal expense. It was a legal expense. It wasn't a reimbursement. And those

00:21:06.160 $35,000, $35,000, $35,000 monthly payments to Cohen were for actual legal work. The question is,

00:21:12.960 will the jury buy it? Dave, let me start with you on that one. Yeah, look, not for nothing. Another part

00:21:18.560 of the prosecuting case that you have to believe in order to believe their theory of the case is

00:21:23.900 that Trump was aware of all of the details of these payments, right? Well, in order for that to be

00:21:28.280 true, Trump would have had to have known that Michael Cohen was stealing $60,000 from him. I mean,

00:21:33.480 that's established, right? Cohen admitted it. It makes absolutely no sense. It's completely bizarre.

00:21:40.020 You know, I will say, and you mentioned, how do you know about the jury? You know, I covered the

00:21:44.660 Ghislaine Maxwell trial. It was another situation. No cameras, no recording devices. It was even worse.

00:21:49.880 You couldn't even have your phone or whatever. And it is very hard to explain to people who aren't in

00:21:56.080 the room how the room feels, what's going on. I'll let you in on a tip. If you ever have to do it,

00:22:01.380 sit next to a British journalist. They still learn shorthand. It's sorcery. These guys just have a

00:22:07.340 trans... You got to buy them lunch, but like, they'll tell you exactly what it's. It's amazing what they can do.

00:22:13.220 Um, word for word. And, but, you know, I've watched all of this to the extent that you can

00:22:19.040 watch it. And there's so many holes in this case. And I know that everybody says he can't get a fair

00:22:26.840 trial because New Yorkers are Democrats. Look, I spent decades living in New York. They're Democrats,

00:22:31.700 but they're not idiots. They're Democrats, but they're not fundamentally dishonest. And I'm very

00:22:36.220 hopeful that this jury is going to come back and tell the prosecution that they didn't make their case

00:22:41.180 because I don't want to live in this America where we say, oh, well, this is in a blue district so

00:22:46.500 that the outcome will be this way. This isn't a red one. It's this way. So I think it would be

00:22:50.360 wonderful for the country if this jury looks at how flawed this case is, makes the right decision,

00:22:56.040 and we can all take a little sigh of relief.

00:23:00.140 I wish I were as confident as you are. I just think this judge is leading them right to the

00:23:04.620 conviction water. And it's going to be very hard for them not to drink. I'm an optimistic guy.

00:23:10.980 Yeah. I mean, I'm neither an optimist nor a pessimist, but I'm a bright sider. I would say

00:23:16.520 I'm a bright sider. But I just don't believe that. I'm thinking, does that make me an optimist? If

00:23:24.080 you're a bright sider, maybe you are. Anyway, a story for another day. I just don't. I think they

00:23:29.100 will convict him. I do, because I think that their partisan instincts will be, let's get rid of him.

00:23:34.860 We have an opportunity. And I think the partisan judge is going to make it next to impossible for

00:23:40.320 them not to. I wouldn't be shocked if there is a holdout on the jury, but I wouldn't bet on that.

00:23:46.980 That's my own statement now. Who knows? I've been wrong before. Stu, it is interesting to hear them

00:23:52.360 methodically go through. They're spending a lot of time. They're only going to do two hours. We heard

00:23:56.180 that Team Trump did not want to bore the jury. They were very cognizant of the fact that this

00:24:00.440 jury does not want to sit there for 10 hours of a closing. So they said, we're going to limit it to

00:24:05.220 two, two and a half at the most or in break right now. And they were hoping the prosecution would do

00:24:09.280 the same. Then we heard the prosecution's closing was going to be about four and a half.

00:24:13.580 You know why? Because they have to stitch together a Frankenstein of a legal case. There are so many

00:24:21.820 hoops they have to jump through. The judge has ruled now that you don't actually have to prove,

00:24:30.480 have to all unanimously agree on which underlying crime Trump committed when he was falsifying

00:24:40.360 business records. You could think he violated a tax code. You over there, ladies and gentlemen,

00:24:45.760 on the end part of the jury box could think he violated election law. You in the middle could

00:24:52.000 think he violated Murphy's law. And as long as everyone agrees he violated a law and that the

00:25:00.400 financial records being written as they were was an attempt to conceal it, you're home. So this is,

00:25:07.760 this is what I say when I'm like horse, water, conviction, drink.

00:25:14.020 Yeah, it does feel like that, doesn't it? It just feels like everything has been tilted. The whole

00:25:19.520 playing field has been tilted to get this result. And I think if you go up to the average person

00:25:23.980 in a normal situation and you say, all right, well, you have to believe a bunch of different

00:25:27.460 things. You have to believe that he had the affair with one or both of these women. And I think a lot of

00:25:33.380 people would say they think he did. And then you have to believe that he made these payments,

00:25:37.880 right? And I think, you know, there's fewer than fewer people, but some would agree with that as

00:25:42.980 well. But then you also have to believe that he made these payments with the intent of holding on

00:25:47.340 the election and not for personal, you know, gain or protecting his family. And then you have to also

00:25:54.320 believe that he falsified the business records to protect the election that had already occurred.

00:26:01.360 Because even if you get to all of these different things they've set up that you need to believe

00:26:06.620 to convict him in this case, fundamentally, he's not being charged with the affair. He's not being

00:26:12.540 charged with the payments. He's being charged with the business records that all occurred after he was

00:26:19.820 already president. So how could he be fixing the election if he was already president when he was

00:26:26.680 doing these things? It makes no sense. It makes no sense how they turn this into 34 felonies when I

00:26:34.120 mean, we're all really talking about one incident, right? We're talking about one payment that was

00:26:38.560 broken up into 12 payments, a bunch of checks that he signed. But I mean, how is he charged with an

00:26:43.300 individual felony for Michael Cohen submitting an invoice? None of this makes any sense logically.

00:26:49.980 But because this judge, as you point out, Megan has tilted this playing field in this way.

00:26:55.580 He's not allowing a lot of that to even be considered. A lot of this is just sort of being

00:27:00.280 brushed aside. And there's a very specific thing they have to come to. And I hold out a little bit

00:27:06.260 of hope, maybe not much, but a little bit of hope because look what, you know, if you look at New York

00:27:11.340 state, something like 30% of people voted for Donald Trump. There are certainly people that even voted

00:27:16.120 for 13% voted for him in Manhattan, Stu, which is where the jury came from.

00:27:20.720 It's true, but 13%. And these are 12 individuals, not just 12 random individuals off the street,

00:27:27.020 but 12 individuals that the Trump team had a large hand in allowing under the jury. So is it possible

00:27:34.800 that one or two of them just come through and say, wait a minute, I get that I don't like Donald Trump.

00:27:39.400 Now, wait a minute. This is like, you know, being sent to Jenny Craig HQ with an assignment of

00:27:46.820 emerging with a supermodel, right? Like a waif-like supermodel from the 1990s.

00:27:53.920 You could probably find someone who's not quite as ample as the other gals, but you are not going

00:28:00.940 to emerge with a Kate Moss. That was the assignment that Trump's lawyers were given in doing jury

00:28:06.560 selection. This is not their, the pool of potential. I'm open-minded to Trump jurors

00:28:12.600 was about as skinny as this pen. There's like, that's like finding.

00:28:17.920 Wait a minute, Megan, Megan, a lot of these people, maybe not these specific jurors. A lot

00:28:23.180 of these people voted for Rudy Giuliani twice. A lot of these people voted for Michael Bloomberg

00:28:27.660 three times, right? That's not the same thing. Those two are not even the same species as Trump

00:28:33.520 in the minds of New Yorkers. I do live there, Dave, when you did all 17 years in Manhattan on

00:28:39.480 the Upper West Side. I know these people very well. And if there's one thing that unites

00:28:44.320 New Yorkers, other than being pissed off about what, when the snowplows come and where an alternate

00:28:51.260 side of the street parking, it's their hatred for this man. Yeah, but see, no, but Megan, you and I

00:28:58.140 run in slightly different circles in New York, right? I mean, you didn't spend a lot of time in a

00:29:01.880 moving truck, I bet, right? That's not how. I did a fair amount of time on the subway and the

00:29:07.740 Upper West Side is full of lots of middle class people. It's not all. I know. And if those working

00:29:12.840 class voters are out there, Dave, I see what you're saying. Where the hell were they in the

00:29:16.480 vote? They didn't vote for him. They did not turn out in droves at all. No, they didn't. I just think

00:29:23.420 that there's a difference between what there's two lawyers on this jury. The rest of them are all

00:29:28.000 either like nurses or working. Have you seen the lawyers on TV? They all hate Trump.

00:29:34.440 You know, just because you're a lawyer doesn't excuse you from TDS. No, I'm saying the lawyers

00:29:39.000 are more likely to hate Trump. Just ask Fannie Willis. Ask Jack Smith. Ask Alvin Bragg. Ask

00:29:42.580 Judge Rashawn. Those are lawyers, too, who hate him. I'm saying the lawyers are more likely.

00:29:47.460 Anyone with a college education is more likely to hate Donald Trump. That, I guess, is my point.

00:29:52.380 And I think the people without a college education are are probably more willing to be fair to the

00:29:57.560 guy. That's that's that's that's I agree with that. I agree with that as a principal. But I just

00:30:02.360 those people, they didn't turn out to vote for the guy. And they're surrounded in Manhattan in

00:30:06.980 particular, which is not blue collar. Manhattan's not. It's the wealthiest of the boroughs.

00:30:11.820 This would be different. That's why he said, bring me someplace else. Take me to Staten Island,

00:30:16.180 which which has a greater population of red voters. And there are pockets of New York State

00:30:20.620 that are redder and pockets of the five boroughs that are redder, which is how we got a Giuliani

00:30:26.040 who is very socially liberal, but fiscally more conservative. But they hate him just as much

00:30:30.160 they hate Trump now. And the city's gotten bluer and bluer and bluer. And the state has gotten

00:30:34.900 bluer and bluer and bluer. But our governor right there right now is out there currently calling the

00:30:40.800 Trump voters what losers and jokers. She's openly disdainful of the right. Anyway, my point is clowns,

00:30:47.540 clowns, clowns. The Trump supporters are a bunch of clowns. She feels comfortable enough in this,

00:30:51.760 you know, once formally Republican governed state to call Trump supporters clowns. Anyway,

00:30:57.280 I hope you're right, Dave. I really do. I hope you're right. And I've, I've been wrong many times.

00:31:01.560 Don't hope too hard because it doesn't happen that often, but yeah,

00:31:04.640 I just feel like the setup is there. All right. Let me give you a little bit more from the closing

00:31:09.360 so far with Todd Blanche, spending a lot of time trying to prove that there was no

00:31:14.040 falsification. He makes the point that I just made about, um, the, the Trump organization's

00:31:21.320 ledger system and how things were going to be documented. And he says, you know, you heard

00:31:26.320 about, um, from this Tara soft who worked in the finance department accounting, how she decided to

00:31:32.700 put information on the voucher system. She was told by her boss and accounting to post to legal expenses.

00:31:39.300 There's no evidence. President Trump knew anything about this system. And you can see what Tara soft

00:31:45.540 did was exactly what her boss told her. She posted his expenses, Cohen's submissions to legal expenses.

00:31:50.880 She did not follow up. She did not follow Trump or Weisselberg's instructions. He, she followed a

00:31:56.060 lower employee's instructions because that's the way they always did it with legal fees is what he's

00:31:59.840 saying. Uh, he says, you heard that everything that came from a law firm was labeled the same way

00:32:05.580 as a legal expense, whether it was Michael Cohen or Jones day or Skadden Arps or whomever. They all

00:32:12.080 got documented. If they came in from a lawyer or law firm as a legal expense, but the government is

00:32:16.900 now criminalizing what Ms. Tara soft did. That's absurd. Um, okay, going on onto the checks, which

00:32:23.900 were labeled as being paid out for a retainer. These checks don't have any of the language that you will

00:32:29.120 see in the invoices Michael Cohen submitted. It's just one word generated by the Trump organization's

00:32:36.040 accounting system as filled out by this Deb Tara soft. You heard that sometimes Trump looked at the

00:32:41.440 checks and sometimes he didn't because his signature was on them. Uh, sometimes the checks were half an

00:32:46.560 inch thick that he was sent to sign. You can't convict president Trump because you can't find that he had

00:32:52.400 full knowledge. That's reasonable doubt. It matters where president Trump was during this time. He was

00:32:58.040 frequently multitasking, constantly being interrupted as he was the sitting president of the United

00:33:03.940 States. It's a good point. So all that stuff about Trump being a micromanager, tougher to sell when he's

00:33:10.420 leader of the free world, managing a few other things. The idea that he was part of a scheme to book a

00:33:16.000 legal expense and remember the scheme involved booking a legal expense as a legal expense is absurd.

00:33:24.300 Um, if you accept Michael Cohen's version of events, you have to believe that Cohen, Weisselberg and

00:33:30.480 Trump were all in this together, but the documents they've put forth contain lies. He mentions the

00:33:37.320 gross up of the reimbursement for the stormy Daniels deal and the red finch services. That was the 50

00:33:42.480 grand and that Michael Cohen stole from Trump on the government will try to argue that there was some

00:33:47.800 type of tax scheme here, but there's no evidence to support that. You don't have to go further than

00:33:52.360 we've gone here, but where is the intent to defraud? You saw an evidence that the Trump org

00:33:57.280 reported on a, on a tax form, the payments that Trump made to Cohen. What's false or misleading

00:34:04.960 about documenting the payments you made to the IRS? If there's something false or misleading here,

00:34:10.920 why was it reported to the IRS? How can there be any intent to defraud when Trump one discloses it

00:34:17.500 to the IRS to tweets about it? And three discloses it on a government ethics form. Wow. All right,

00:34:25.980 wait, let me just keep going. This is good stuff. Now he turns to the predicate, the predicate crime,

00:34:31.700 a conspiracy to influence the election by unlawful means. It doesn't matter if there was a conspiracy

00:34:36.980 to win an election. Every campaign in this count in this country is a conspiracy among people to help

00:34:42.180 somebody win. You have to find that this conspiracy was done unlawfully by unlawful means. David Pecker

00:34:49.180 of AMI National Enquirer told you AMI purchase stories all the time. It wasn't unique to Trump.

00:34:55.520 Many politicians work with media to promote their candidacy. It was standard operating procedure.

00:35:00.820 Hope Hicks told you the same thing. And we know from David Pecker that this was done in the case of

00:35:05.840 Arnold Schwarzenegger and his campaign and many other public figures who are in the news for

00:35:10.720 some potentially seedy things. There's nothing wrong with a politician like President Trump

00:35:16.020 trying to get positive news stories and avoid negative ones. That's a campaign and there's

00:35:22.280 nothing illegal about it. But the idea that sophisticated people like Trump and David Pecker

00:35:26.920 and the National Enquirer could influence an election is itself preposterous. He notes the

00:35:33.220 relatively low circulation numbers of the National Enquirer. The idea that the National Enquirer could

00:35:37.660 criminally influence the election by republishing a story that was already out there should make you

00:35:43.500 shake your head. It makes no sense. He turns to the Trump Tower meeting in 2015. I believe that was

00:35:49.740 with Pecker. There were there was no in-depth discussion at that meeting about how they would

00:35:54.920 publish positive stories or kill negative ones. It was just a general discussion about Trump's

00:35:58.840 candidacy. This is where that Pecker said, like, how can we help you? Remember the words catch and kill?

00:36:04.480 Well, they told you that was the heart of the agreement. But Pecker, Cohen and Trump didn't

00:36:08.640 even discuss catch and kill at that 2015 Trump Tower meeting. And they didn't discuss financial

00:36:13.180 arrangements at that meeting either. And Pecker himself told you there's nothing unusual about

00:36:18.140 catching and killing. What did he tell you? Told you that they only published about half the stories

00:36:23.740 they bought. And he's been in the industry for decades. So that's meaningful. That matters.

00:36:29.960 And by the way, he says the Karen McDougal story, which which is going to be important. I'll tell

00:36:35.840 you why. Also was not a catch and kill. Why? Because McDougal wasn't interested in selling her

00:36:41.480 story. She wanted to write articles. And the agreement with AMI did just that. OK. He talks

00:36:48.440 about the Trump doorman story. That would have been the biggest story because that the National

00:36:52.840 Enquirer ever had if Trump had fathered a love child out of wedlock. The reason they never published

00:36:57.500 that one because it was not true. It was false and goes on. OK, and I'll get to the rest.

00:37:04.160 So, again, he's talking about there was no falsification. And then this whole conspiracy

00:37:10.620 to to influence an election. He's making the point, guys, that that's just another way of saying

00:37:17.220 Trump tried to win. Right, Stu? I mean, that's really. A negative spin on something every candidate

00:37:24.760 does. Not this particular situation, but conspiracy to influence an election is something every

00:37:30.620 candidate does. Yeah, it's a it's a fascinating way to think about it. But of course, it's true.

00:37:36.620 Everyone's working together to try to get their candidate to win, to influence others. That is

00:37:41.440 very, very common when it comes to election time. And the fact that they're trying to vilify that they

00:37:47.040 have to come up with something that's tied to an actual crime, which is what I guess they're

00:37:51.320 struggling with. This is why this makes absolutely no sense. You know, one of the things that came

00:37:56.400 out in the trial, going back to the part you were talking about with with Cohen and these legal

00:37:59.940 expenses, one of the things that came out is that Cohen was actually doing legal work for Trump at

00:38:05.880 this time at leading up to when he became president of the United States. So like the idea that these

00:38:13.540 would be annotated as legal expenses is completely normal. It's how you would do it. You're not going to

00:38:20.760 put hush money payments, even if that's what it was. That's not how this is going to be recorded

00:38:25.040 in some sort of official internal document. And that's another part of this that I think is

00:38:29.440 important. These were my understanding was and correct me if I'm wrong on this, Megan, these were

00:38:33.400 internal notations. These weren't filed on any federal forms. These weren't submitted to the IRS

00:38:39.400 as legal expenses. They were they were submitted in they were in their internal record keeping

00:38:44.920 software, for lack of a better term. And Stu, I'll do you one better than that.

00:38:51.460 They were written down. These these payments falsely documented to win an election

00:38:57.520 after Trump was already president. Trump was in the White House and had won.

00:39:02.720 Yeah, that's their conspiracy to influence the election falsification payments.

00:39:08.260 Right. For this to be true, you would need a flux capacitor. You'd need to be able to go

00:39:12.600 back in time. I love the flux capacitor. I'm totally in the market for that.

00:39:16.120 Mm hmm. I need one of those myself. That would be it.

00:39:18.580 Have you been watching Dark Matter on Netflix?

00:39:23.540 I haven't. No. Is it good?

00:39:25.040 Oh, you got to watch it. It's crazy. And I think they've kind of they've got a flux capacitor

00:39:29.580 in that. Sorry, you were making a point, though. It was time travel related, but like these

00:39:34.840 things, this is what you need. You need to have time travel. You need to have all of these

00:39:40.000 assumptions built on top of assumptions built on top of assumptions. And I know, Megan, you've

00:39:44.480 been watching this stuff for a long time. As someone who jumps in on these big trials like

00:39:48.900 I do, I'm watching as a normal person who's really interested more. I mean, less in a way

00:39:53.880 personally in what happens to Donald Trump. I mean, I care about that because I care about

00:39:58.220 other people and I care about what it means to the rest of the country, but following

00:40:00.900 it more from a political standpoint, this is completely absurd. Is this normal in our legal

00:40:06.940 system? I mean, is this happening to people all the time? Because I feel like I have a

00:40:12.200 whole new crusade in life if this is the normal way our legal system is operating.

00:40:17.980 No, it's not normal. This is Judge Mershon's fault and the fault of D.A. Alvin Bragg, who are

00:40:24.040 partisan hacks? That's why we're seeing this absurdity happen right here. Let me fast forward

00:40:30.560 with you just a little. Oh, Doug Brunt is listening, my husband, and he's watching it with me on Apple

00:40:39.200 dark matter. Thanks, Duggar. Appreciate that. Here's Cohen. Sorry, not Cohen. Blanche getting ready

00:40:47.780 to wrap up, just jumping ahead and we can go back and do some more of the middle there. He kept it

00:40:52.020 tight. He highlights the fact that this big catch and kill scheme between Trump, Cohen and David

00:40:59.320 Pecker, and he's saying there was no such thing. And by the way, catch and kill was like a normal

00:41:03.840 thing anyway. So it's, it's not a conspiracy to win an election, but now he's highlighting the fact

00:41:08.340 that David Pecker didn't want it to have anything to do with Stormy Daniels payment. Here's how he put

00:41:13.220 it. This is a good argument. That's the conspiracy. He asks incredulous. That's it. There's supposedly

00:41:19.860 this big conspiracy to catch and kill all the negative stories about Trump. But as soon as

00:41:25.740 it comes to it with Stormy Daniels saying it's a month to go before the election, I'm going to go

00:41:30.180 public. Pecker wants nothing to do with it. He won't pay, which is why Michael Cohen had to pay.

00:41:36.120 What sense does that make? He says, by the way, Stormy Daniels, Daniels did not testify before the

00:41:40.660 grand jury. So why did she testify in this case? I'll tell you why they did it to inflame your emotions.

00:41:46.160 It's objection overruled here. Interesting. Blanche focuses on that October 24, 2016 phone call

00:41:53.180 that Michael Cohen testified. He allegedly made. Well, he did make it to Keith Schiller,

00:41:59.340 Trump's bodyguard. He alleged that it was actually to speak to Trump to tell him he had handled the

00:42:05.260 stormy matter. And then he was cross-examined with his texts to Schiller before that phone call was

00:42:11.800 actually placed, in which Cohen was getting harassed by a 14-year-old boy who kept bothering

00:42:16.080 him. And he was saying, what should I do? And the conclusion was Cohen was going to, Cohen had

00:42:24.180 resolved to tell Keith Schiller, Trump's bodyguard, that he wanted to bring this to the Secret Service.

00:42:28.580 And he did tell Keith Schiller that. And then I think Schiller said, call me. So he called Keith

00:42:33.840 Schiller. Now he wants the jury to believe that phone call, which was 90 seconds long, was actually

00:42:38.000 him asking to speak to Trump. So here's Blanche on that call today. He says, this was Cohen's sworn

00:42:45.220 testimony, his voice rising dramatically. This was a lie. Blanche says the defense put in evidence

00:42:55.640 what that call really was about, the harassing phone calls Cohen had received from this 14-year-old.

00:43:00.540 That is perjury, Blanche practically yells. Cohen has repeatedly lied under oath. He lied to his

00:43:10.240 family. He lied to his banker. He lied to the FEC, Federal Election Commission. He lied to every single

00:43:15.760 reporter he talked to for about a year. He's literally like an MVP of liars, says Todd Blanche.

00:43:23.580 He's also a thief. He admitted to stealing from the Trump organization, admitted to committing a felony

00:43:29.560 on the stand in front of you. But what should matter to you are the lies he told in this courtroom.

00:43:37.500 Before I sit down, I want to talk about 10 reasons why there's reasonable doubt in this case. And he's

00:43:44.020 just now starting to go through them. Pretty good, Dave. He's starting to ramp it up. And really, this case

00:43:50.340 at its base boils down to exactly what he's hitting on. No one can trust Michael Cohen or a word he says.

00:43:55.860 Yeah, I'm glad he's wrapping it up. I was starting to worry that it might get a little long. And I'm

00:44:00.420 glad that he's going to end it with a sort of bullet point of here's the 10 reasons for reasonable

00:44:04.800 doubt. That seems smart to me. Can I just ask, how has nobody found this 14-year-old yet? I mean,

00:44:12.360 where's TV USA on this? This kid could be like the biggest star on the right wing in the last five

00:44:19.360 years. I remember talking to my producer when that part of it broke. And of course, the big deal

00:44:26.340 there was that he got caught at least in a lie of omission, right? Oh, you didn't mention that this

00:44:31.300 was also about a 14-year-old who was harassing you? But I just remember John being like,

00:44:37.040 I'm sorry, say that again? And I'm like, yeah, a 14-year-old was prank calling. And we were just,

00:44:41.880 we honestly kind of like thought, sat for a second. I think we were both thinking like,

00:44:45.240 what are we doing with our lives? Like, this is all so silly and ridiculous.

00:44:50.580 And now that 14-year-old can vote, voting. I want to know who the 14-year-old is voting for.

00:44:55.160 It could be in Congress. It's not Congress. 22.

00:44:58.260 Yeah. Yeah. We need to know this kid. I think we're all on his side.

00:45:02.440 Absolutely. We wouldn't want to harass Michael Cohen.

00:45:04.840 Someone's got to find this person. But, you know, it goes back to the one mistake that I thought maybe

00:45:09.080 the defense made was putting Costello on. I was really a fan of the idea of just don't put anybody on.

00:45:15.240 Just let the prosecution rest and then say, they didn't make the case. That's it. And you sit

00:45:20.700 down. And I know that that's risky. But I feel like Costello also came off a little

00:45:26.580 Damon Runyon, guys and dolls-ish, right? And I thought it was kind of better to have that only

00:45:33.280 be Michael Cohen. But yeah, this whole thing looks shady and bizarre and ridiculous. And I think that's

00:45:39.960 why you saw, taking it full circle, this ridiculous press conference today, because the Biden campaign

00:45:46.340 understands this is not opening them. It's hurting them.

00:45:50.300 And Megan, if I might too-

00:45:51.300 Well, that's the question. Yeah, go ahead, Stuart.

00:45:52.760 Sorry, go ahead. Just on Cohen. One of the things we see with Cohen, and he's a person who,

00:45:58.820 you know he's lying because it's the only thing he's capable of doing, right? Like every time he opens

00:46:03.440 his mouth, he's lying. And that has been true for not just the last couple of years. It has been true

00:46:09.100 every minute he has been in the orbit of Donald Trump. And if there's one thing I hope Donald

00:46:14.180 Trump takes out of this, if he hopefully is exonerated here, and hopefully, you know, he goes

00:46:18.700 on and has a great life, maybe president of the United States again, is any time he senses anyone

00:46:24.420 around him who is anything like Michael Cohen, get them away from you. People like this do nothing

00:46:31.040 but destroy. This is why he was hired. Yes. Why was he hired in the first place? This is why Trump

00:46:34.720 hired Michael Cohen, because he's a dirtbag. And Trump was looking for a dirtbag to help him in a

00:46:40.460 dirty industry, which is the New York real estate industry. This is not where you go with the clean

00:46:44.820 fingernails with it speaking the Queen's English. I mean, it's infamous for having a lot of shady

00:46:51.000 characters in it. Trump was kind of born into it and knew how to work it and operate within it. And

00:46:56.560 you can't do it with the white shoe lawyers. I think that's why he had this guy working on,

00:47:03.800 you know, so closely with him. It doesn't make Trump look great, but I understand why he did it.

00:47:09.240 He couldn't find a perfectly ethical guy to handle these things with the muscle and language that might

00:47:16.720 be needed for one to be truly heard, to use the left's language in this rough crowd. He needed

00:47:23.160 to be heard here. Listen to this, Dave. That's also why Cohen couldn't go to the White House.

00:47:31.700 And that pissed Cohen off. That's exactly why Michael Cohen was not allowed to come to the

00:47:36.240 White House is exactly what you just said. That's not his milieu. No, God, Trump was smart enough not

00:47:41.460 to do that. Puck News Echelon poll last week. 85% of Americans say they've heard a lot or some about

00:47:49.220 the case. Only 45% could identify what the case is actually about. 45% of those who have heard a lot

00:47:55.060 about the case could identify what it was about. 72% on both sides said the case has zero bearing on

00:48:01.840 their opinion of Trump. 34% of Trump supporters and Trump leaners say a guilty verdict would make

00:48:07.820 them more likely to support him. It's not going the way the Democrats thought it was going to go,

00:48:14.280 guys. It's it's that's why we have Robert De Niro of the J6 cops there still. Well, you know,

00:48:20.960 it's funny. It's exactly why I remember thinking when all this started with all the legal charges

00:48:26.180 against him, they've got 91 charges against him. They're not going to go over 91. They're going to

00:48:30.320 get them on something. Right. And, you know, theoretically, maybe they will. But now it looks like

00:48:34.960 three of the four main cases are going to be pushed past past the election. You've got one of them is

00:48:40.160 the Fannie Willis disaster. And now this one, which is the biggest joke and has always been the biggest

00:48:46.720 joke among them. You know, I really do. You're having the electorate say, we don't care. We don't

00:48:52.880 care if there is a conviction, which is going to be, you know, a tall order if the jury follows the law.

00:48:59.100 Stand by much, much more on the opposite side. Stu and Dave stay with me for the show.

00:49:04.960 Would you like to hear the top 10 reasons that the jury should find Trump not guilty and find

00:49:11.960 reasonable doubt? Oh, yeah. Summarized. And I don't know that he listed them like it. And this

00:49:17.760 is the number one reason. But here we go. Number one, invoices. Cohen created the invoices. President

00:49:22.920 Trump had no intent to defraud. There's no proof beyond a reasonable doubt that that's what we spoke

00:49:28.040 about earlier, too. No proof that President Trump saw anything at all with those vouchers that were

00:49:34.440 created by the Trump accounting team legal expenses from the dropdown menu. Three, there's absolutely

00:49:39.740 no evidence of any intent to defraud. He disclosed it to the Office of Government Ethics. Similarly,

00:49:46.240 there is no proof to influence the 2016 election. We talked about both of those, too. He filed the

00:49:51.480 right tax returns. He disclosed these payments to Michael Cohen. And he couldn't have been trying to

00:49:57.780 influence the 2016 election with these falsified documents because he was already president by that

00:50:03.200 point. Four, no intent to commit or conceal. Remember, this is an important piece because

00:50:10.060 in order for the falsification of business documents to be a crime, given that we're past

00:50:14.740 the normal statute of limitations, they have to prove that the docs were falsified in an effort

00:50:20.820 with intent to commit or conceal another crime, other unlawful activity. This is number four. He says,

00:50:29.900 there's no falsification of business records, period. And anything that people try to talk about regarding

00:50:36.360 that is wrong. He must have said something else because that actually kind of whatever. Okay, so that's

00:50:41.320 his point. Number five, no evidence to illegally influence the 2016 election. The word illegally is what's

00:50:49.340 important there. Six, AMI would have run the story. I'm not sure where he's going with that. Seven, McDougal. Karen

00:50:57.120 McDougal did not want her story published, so it wasn't a catch and kill. Eight, Stormy Daniels' story was already

00:51:03.960 public, so why would Trump be paying to silence it? So again, they're arguing about whether she was paid off, which

00:51:10.960 we've questioned on the show, whether that's a smart move. The defense that Trump didn't do the

00:51:17.820 payoff, that Cohen did the payoff, that's all. I mean, but it's fine if Cohen did, if Michael Cohen

00:51:21.920 was reimbursed, true, too. Trump's decided to deny it all. Number nine, manipulation of evidence. The

00:51:28.200 government has made mistakes in presenting this trial, and we have caught them. Number one, that tape

00:51:34.220 between Trump and Cohen talking about the payout to Karen McDougal, that was inaudible and appears to have

00:51:39.580 been cut at just the right times by Michael Cohen. So they don't think this shows any pattern by Trump

00:51:45.980 and Cohen to work together to pay off women alleging affairs with Trump. The Karen McDougal tape is not

00:51:52.640 great for Trump, who claims everything was a Michael Cohen deal, right? But it's not, there's no tape for

00:51:58.620 Stormy, but they're trying to say it's inaudible and it may be incomplete, too. That October 24th call,

00:52:04.660 uh, the one to Keith Schiller, right? Um, I think that's the one we went over that. Number three,

00:52:11.360 Mr. Cohen's phone. They didn't tell you that Cohen actually wiped his phone and synced his phone to

00:52:18.180 his laptop. You didn't see any evidence that the laptop was searched. We know that the September 6th

00:52:23.440 recording was synced. How can you trust that it's reliable? You can't, you have to rely on Mr. Cohen

00:52:29.160 again. Cohen made up that call, the alleged one with Trump. He made up how it was received. And

00:52:35.500 there's nothing you can trust about what Cohen said. Number 10, Cohen is the embodiment of reasonable

00:52:42.200 doubt. Michael Cohen is a human lie machine. Michael Cohen is the gloat, the greatest liar of all time.

00:52:53.440 I like, I like that last one guys. Did you read that? Were those in reverse order from how he

00:52:59.240 presented them? I'm Kelly McGuire. Do you know the answer to that? She just sent it to me. This is

00:53:03.820 from, I think the gloat was the last one he presented if I'm not mistaken. Gloat had to be

00:53:07.620 number one. What Steve? Yeah. The gloat was at the end. I should say this was via Andrew Giuliani,

00:53:16.540 who is Rudy Giuliani's son. He's been doing great coverage of the case. Go ahead, Dave. Yeah. So gloat

00:53:21.280 is, I thought that, I thought the first few were actually sort of the strongest. And then we got

00:53:25.940 into, to sort of some, some haziness and then gloat was obviously a good line. I mean, yeah,

00:53:32.700 I mean, I don't know. I think I just would have ended on like the stuff that we were just talking

00:53:37.360 about. Right. Which is that this makes no sense. It obviously wasn't in order to affect the election

00:53:41.840 and even if it was and all that, but, but look, I think that those are 10, I think there's,

00:53:47.100 those are at least seven or eight, um, very solid points. You only need one, uh, for reasonable doubt.

00:53:54.060 Uh, and, and I guess the prosecution is going to spend four and a half hours trying to knock

00:53:59.800 these down. Now it's God bless the jurors who have to sit there for that. I mean, the answer to all of

00:54:05.040 those initial points for the prosecution, Dave will be a stew will be no Trump may not have been

00:54:12.380 looking at every check stub, um, of the payouts to Cohen. He, yes, we admit he signed the checks

00:54:20.420 and the checks didn't say much on them, but he was there when the scheme was birthed. That's what

00:54:26.720 they're going to say. They're going to say he didn't have to see all the check stubs. He didn't

00:54:31.500 have to see the dropdown menu that this accounting gal was using. He's the one who formed the scheme

00:54:39.980 in a meeting with Cohen and Weisselberg where they agreed. Cohen would pay her off. He would be

00:54:47.540 repaid. They would make it look like legal expenses when in fact it was a reimbursement

00:54:52.180 that it would be doubled 130 up to 260 along with some other payments that they were going to owe

00:54:57.980 Cohen reimbursement on and that that's how he would be repaid. You don't have to show Trump had

00:55:04.580 knowledge of dropdown menus or check stubs or any of that other stuff. I mean, that's a stretch. I

00:55:12.220 think you do have to show some of that. I mean, but I, to your point, that is what they're going

00:55:16.780 to go to. And I, you know, I understand, I look, I, there are parts of this that I think are going

00:55:22.040 to be believable to jurors, right? I mean, if you were to tell me that the actual truth here,

00:55:26.520 and we don't really know the truth, but if you were to tell me the actual truth was that he did have

00:55:29.940 multiple affairs with these women and these payments were, were designed basically to shield

00:55:35.820 him from a, you know, a post access Hollywood tape fiasco in the middle of a campaign, like I

00:55:42.320 wouldn't pass out of shock. Like I, it wouldn't be the most stunning news I'd ever heard in my entire

00:55:47.220 life if that were the truth. But that being said, it's still, all of this has to be built on the one

00:55:54.140 person who has told them this narrative from beginning to end, which is Michael Cohen. And,

00:56:00.220 you know, the last part of this, I think still is the strongest because you can go through and I

00:56:04.980 think prove to people and show that the, you know, the legal case doesn't line up, but that's not

00:56:10.400 always how a juror is going to think in these situations. At the end of the day, they do know

00:56:15.000 people like Michael Cohen. They do know people who are untruthful over and over and over and over

00:56:19.960 again and untruthful right to your face and will say anything that they need to say at any moment

00:56:25.520 that will benefit them. Michael Cohen was incredibly pro-Trump to an almost impossible level when he

00:56:33.540 worked for him. And the second he decided it was better for him to be anti-Trump, he was not anti-Trump.

00:56:40.140 He was resistance beyond Robert De Niro anti-Trump on TikTok for multiple years, writing books about

00:56:50.960 how he couldn't wait to get revenge on the guy. And then he comes in front of the trial and is this

00:56:55.880 like schoolboy just trying to tell the truth because he cares so much about the legal system.

00:57:01.140 Every person knows someone like that. And when he is the central point of failure for this entire

00:57:08.280 case, I think that's the strongest point the defense can bring up and, and ending on it,

00:57:14.080 I think is, is a good idea. Yeah. He said, um, that the, uh, Todd Blanche said, you know how

00:57:19.780 Michael Jordan is the goat? Well, Michael Cohen is the gloat and then filled in those letters

00:57:26.340 appropriately. I love it. Oh, Tom Brady. No, it's Tom Brady. Tom Brady's the goat, whichever they're

00:57:31.420 both the goat. And Tom, and by the way, Michael Jordan is the goat. It's not LeBron James.

00:57:37.260 Um, then he says, thank you all for listening to the jury. This is via Anna Bauer also doing great

00:57:43.200 coverage. This isn't a referendum on your views of Trump, uh, or who you voted for. That's not what

00:57:49.520 this is about. The verdict you're going to reach has to do with the evidence you heard here and nothing

00:57:53.940 else. If you do that, focus on the evidence heard in this courtroom. This is a very quick and easy,

00:57:59.160 not guilty verdict. Thank you. Um, however, he got in trouble because I guess Blanche said you can't

00:58:08.980 send Donald Trump to jail with the lack of evidence and testimony here. And judge Mershon asked Todd

00:58:15.180 Blanche, why did you mention prison? Judge Mershon says that was an outrageous and highly inappropriate

00:58:20.800 reference to reference the punishment that the defendant might be facing. Uh, it's hard for me to

00:58:26.440 imagine. He says to Blanche that that was not intentional. I will give the jury an instruction

00:58:31.600 on it. Now I wonder what that instruction is going to be because technically he could, he could go to

00:58:39.780 jail. Mark Garagos was on here a week ago today, really making that point in the strongest terms

00:58:46.100 possible or about a week or so ago. Um, that if it were Dave Marcus or Stu Berger, probably not Megan

00:58:52.420 Kelly, you'd be going to jail and jail and jail came up already. Right. Wasn't stormy Daniels asked

00:59:00.180 like, would you like to see him go to jail? Right. And she said, like, if he's guilty. So, I mean,

00:59:06.560 this isn't the first time. I think it's like, and Cohen, you're generally not allowed to reference

00:59:10.100 the punishment. You're not allowed to reference the punishment to the jury. So I think, I don't

00:59:13.580 think the judge is going to say there's no possibility he could go to jail in this instruction.

00:59:16.940 I think it's just inappropriate, right? He's saying he committed that in bad faith. Um,

00:59:24.160 it sounds like Blanche did what he needed to do. I'm very happy to see. He did not press the,

00:59:30.920 I did not have sexual relations with that woman point. He did not harp on the, there was no

00:59:37.140 interlude between Trump and stormy. He just said, Trump's denied it. And that was allowed to stand.

00:59:42.600 That's good. Kind of interesting. Cause Trump did not deny it in this case, right? He did not,

00:59:46.640 he did not take the stand and say that in this case, but Todd Blanche argued it in his opening

00:59:51.500 and argued it in his closing. So in any event, he didn't spend too much time on it. But again,

00:59:56.300 I do have real questions about the wisdom of arguing. He knew nothing about any of the

01:00:00.500 reimbursement scheme. I really think a stronger, cleaner way would have been, yes, this lunatic

01:00:06.260 came to him threatening to say she had an affair with him three weeks before the election.

01:00:12.820 It's a nuisance value number. We decided to pay it off. Cohen did it, whatever you could say he did

01:00:20.520 it on his own or not, which however he did it. I, yes, I reimbursed him because why should he be out

01:00:25.880 130 grand for this payment? Um, and that's it. I didn't do it to save my ass on the election or for

01:00:31.840 any reason other than she was annoying and she was threatening to bother me. So I made her go away,

01:00:37.020 which is par for the course for any very rich man doing business in New York. And by the way,

01:00:42.620 even if I did do it to help my election, talk to Brad Smith. That's not a crime. That to me

01:00:47.200 is a very clean and frankly, honest defense. Trump went another way and I think confused things,

01:00:55.940 but we'll see if the jury can hold on to the audience of the public though, but there's also

01:01:00.480 the public, right? So what you're asking, what you're asking Trump to admit to more or less in

01:01:06.700 the trial would have implications in the election. And it wouldn't though. It wouldn't, it wouldn't.

01:01:11.760 Well, everyone thinks he had sex with Stormy. I try not to think about it, but

01:01:17.420 I think I might be the only one who started to doubt it. I've started to doubt it as a result of

01:01:26.700 her cockamamie me too claims at the 11th hour. In this case, it just made me start to see her

01:01:31.200 as just a liar who's looking for attention. So I don't, if I had to put money on it, I'd say they

01:01:37.720 did it, but I certainly wouldn't find it beyond a reasonable doubt. Not that that is required of

01:01:42.080 this jury. I mean, Trump maybe is lying about that if he's lying for Melania's sake and the sake of his

01:01:47.180 family. And because he's told that lie, if it's a lie from the beginning, Stu, that's the one thing

01:01:51.020 Trump's been very consistent on. He claims he did not have sex with Stormy Daniels.

01:01:54.920 He does. And look, it's probably both, right? I mean, he's, if it's true that he was hiding this,

01:02:00.520 he's probably hiding it from voters and hiding it from his wife. I mean, like that's.

01:02:04.320 How would you want to admit it?

01:02:05.800 Right. No one wants to admit such things. You know, it's, it's just like, it's, it's bizarre to,

01:02:11.280 to watch all of this play out. Cause I think what you, you point out is really smart, Megan,

01:02:15.380 in that like, when you go to a jury, I think sometimes it's, it's not Trump's style,

01:02:20.060 but it's smart to give a little ground, right? To say, Hey, you know what? These things happen.

01:02:25.400 Here's exactly what went on. You get, you gain some credibility with average people. I think

01:02:30.240 when you do that, and we have evidence that Donald Trump did 100% act this way when the story was

01:02:38.360 completely false with the doorman and the love child story. Yes. That was a false story. And he still

01:02:45.680 paid off the doorman to get it out of the way. So I don't know. He really has legitimate credibility

01:02:51.600 to say that even on a false story, I went out and did this because this is how, look, this might not

01:02:57.060 be the way you act in your life, but rich billionaires who are on TV all the time do this

01:03:01.800 stuff. And it's the way of the world. It's a way of managing your, your PR as you're entering an

01:03:07.520 election. And like, in some ways, I think that would have been a more effective defense. Now, of course

01:03:12.720 they, you know, you mentioned the, the elect elections official, they could have brought

01:03:16.460 on the stand who was blocked, right? So they couldn't bring up this entire defense. And I

01:03:21.380 think that's been part of the limitation and at least, well, they did get out of David Pecker

01:03:27.440 that they did this catch and kill for Arnold Schwarzenegger and Rahm Emanuel, Rahm Emanuel,

01:03:33.000 when he was going to run for Chicago mayor, a Democrat. So it's basically friends of David

01:03:38.640 Pecker who get the special treatment. It's not just a Trump thing. Sorry, keep going.

01:03:43.320 No, I mean, it's clear. It's clear what this is, I think. And people look, we're adults here. We

01:03:49.040 understand this. No one's looking, you know, for some perfect person who's, who's never made a

01:03:53.660 mistake. Like, I don't like the idea of setting a precedent that we have presidential candidates

01:03:58.060 paying off people a couple of weeks before the election. That's not a good thing in my mind and

01:04:02.720 not something we should encourage for the future, but like people, individuals get to make these

01:04:07.560 decisions at the ballot box. If that's something that says, Hey, I don't want a person who's doing

01:04:11.400 that. You can go and we have the ultimate jury. It's coming up in November. They can all vote

01:04:16.680 and they can all have an opinion and we can figure out who we think should lead this country.

01:04:20.500 The Democrats, the left, you know, brag, they're all trying to take that choice away from us and

01:04:25.460 trying to kick us off of that jury. And that's the biggest violation of my mind.

01:04:29.840 You know, I feel about this kind of the way I felt when I saw all those Dave Portnoy stories come out

01:04:34.560 with all like a lot of women accusing Dave Portnoy of being kind of gross. And that is

01:04:40.980 don't marry Donald Trump. Don't slide into Dave Portnoy's DMS and have sex with him within an hour

01:04:48.240 of meeting him. These are bad ideas. And I am not going to vote for Donald Trump to be my husband.

01:04:56.160 Like I, that's not happening. Right. And I can admire Dave Portnoy and his talent as a broadcaster

01:05:04.020 without thinking it's a good idea to, you know, slide into his DMS. I just think like we're kind

01:05:09.900 of past the point as an election, as an electorate of being that buttoned up on a man's sex life and

01:05:19.380 the weirdness in it, as long as it's not a me too situation. You know what I mean? Like

01:05:24.240 I don't, I don't have to marry him. I don't have like, I need somebody who's going to close the damn

01:05:31.420 border, Dave. Right. It's like, and by the way, if we're going to go there, why is Joe Biden taking

01:05:36.640 inappropriate showers with his daughter, according to her? Can we ask that? Where's the trial and the

01:05:42.780 endless media coverage on it? Yeah, absolutely. I've been telling Stu for years to stop dropping into

01:05:48.080 Portnoy's DMS, but he never answers. I've got glad that you're backing me up on this stuff.

01:05:55.400 No, look, I think you're absolutely right. I just want to go back just quickly on, on the jury thing,

01:06:00.940 this idea of, well, why don't we present our own version of here are the events? I, you know,

01:06:05.600 I remember my mom is a criminal defense attorney and she used to talk to me about that point very

01:06:09.820 directly. And she said the worry that she always had with that was that then instead of saying to

01:06:15.040 the jury, if you have any reasonable doubt, you have to find not guilty, you're putting these

01:06:20.920 competing theories in their mind and that the jury might say, which theory do I believe more

01:06:26.340 and go that way. So you've gone from giving yourself the highest level of standard to a 50-50 choice

01:06:33.740 between, in any event, that's all complicated. From the electoral standpoint, I agree with you a hundred

01:06:40.280 percent, Megan. I mean, I think at this point, short of, of exactly, you know, there being

01:06:45.500 allegations of, of sexual assault. And we even had those with Trump, honestly. Um, well that that's

01:06:51.060 right, Dave. And that had come out separate and apart the stormy. It's not like stormy was like

01:06:56.200 Donald Trump raped me. Now that would have been worth paying to stop, right? Like if that, that would

01:07:04.660 have gotten a bigger number. And if that had happened, it would have been an absolute game changer

01:07:08.240 potentially. I don't know though. Cause all these other women did come out and say what they said,

01:07:11.940 but, but to your point, the access Hollywood tape broke in October. And then we did have a parade of

01:07:17.840 women come out and say, yeah, look what he did to me on an airplane. Look what he did to me in a hotel

01:07:22.820 room, et cetera. Look, I'm not, I'm not sure that we're better off today than we were, you know,

01:07:29.180 in, in the eighties, I won't say the nineties because Bill Clinton skated on some, on some pretty

01:07:34.780 serious sexual stuff in the nineties. Right. But in the eighties, Gary Hart didn't write Gary Hart's

01:07:40.820 campaign. And he had a real good chance at winning Gary Hart's campaign ended because there was a

01:07:46.560 picture of a woman in a bikini sitting on his lap. That was all it took in 1984. Now I think part of

01:07:54.020 that is that we didn't have social media. Part of that is that journalism was able to sit on stories,

01:08:00.700 right. We didn't know about all of JFK's stuff. I don't know if we're in a better position today

01:08:07.020 than we were when that kind of stuff was disqualifying because today nothing's

01:08:12.980 disqualifying. I mean, there's just, there's just nothing that's disqualifying anymore. The idea seems

01:08:18.540 to be if that's my guy and he's going to get done what I want to get done, you know, I don't care if

01:08:23.480 his son was sitting on the board of Burisma and did X, Y's right. Right. I mean, it just doesn't

01:08:28.040 matter anymore. And that does worry me a little bit as a society, because I'm old enough to

01:08:33.320 remember when it wasn't quite like this. I like that point. I mean, I feel the same. Like I am

01:08:39.680 saying, I don't want to marry Donald Trump. Not that that's an option, but I'm just saying I don't

01:08:43.700 want to marry Donald Trump, but I would much rather be able to vote for a president whose character I

01:08:47.660 admired, you know, who, who I didn't think cheated on his wife repeatedly. And especially after she just

01:08:52.360 gave birth to their baby. But even as I say that, I don't know what their deal is. I don't know what

01:08:59.520 Bill and Hillary's weird marriage is about either. I don't, all I know is like, if I could have a

01:09:06.120 strong leader who I respected and admired and who I could show off to my children, I would love it.

01:09:11.080 I told the audience when I was in LA, I got to go see privately the movie Reagan, which is coming

01:09:20.000 out in August. Run, don't walk to the nearest theater. It's so good. I was very powerful. I was

01:09:30.080 glued to my chair. It's whatever you're thinking. It's too little. It's amazing. And, you know, sure,

01:09:38.260 they're not like making a movie of all of Reagan's downsides, but they do hit a couple of them. Like

01:09:44.680 they, they call a couple of things to, to, to note and you just leave having such deep respect for him

01:09:50.400 and loving country and being a little fond for like how we kind of, he loved his wife. I'm sure now

01:09:57.080 there's going to be some stories about it. So like, this is what I wrestle with Dave, because is it that

01:10:01.340 Reagan was genuinely better husband to somebody like Nancy? And we liked that and genuinely better man

01:10:06.560 who'd been raised right in a Christian family that taught him good ideals. Or is it that the press

01:10:11.760 didn't pick apart his life the way they do to our modern day politicians? I don't know, Dave,

01:10:18.960 what do you think? I think it's probably both. I keep getting you. No, I'll throw to Stu, but yeah,

01:10:23.260 I would say it's both. Yeah. I mean, I, I think with Reagan, honestly, I do think he was just a better

01:10:29.540 person than a lot of these people today. I mean, I just, I have to say it. I think he, I mean,

01:10:33.280 this is a guy who wound up writing an entire book of his love letters that he wrote a love letter

01:10:36.720 every day to his wife. I mean, he was, I think a really unique and special person. We're not always

01:10:41.600 going to hit that standard. And I think people get a little sensitive when it comes to talking

01:10:46.060 about the 2024 election. This is a separate point from the 2024 election. You look at the candidates

01:10:50.600 we have, you mentioned the problems with Biden. Trump famously has had all sorts of these issues

01:10:56.460 in relationships throughout the years and don't even start looking at the RFK junior life, his

01:11:02.620 womanizing that he's admitted to. I mean, he might have the, the worst record on this front of all of

01:11:08.060 the candidates. This might not be a 2024 election issue, but it is a sane thing to think about that

01:11:15.140 maybe in 2028, we can all look forward and maybe find someone who can do a good job on the border

01:11:20.800 and isn't constantly cheating on their wives. That's not an insane standard. There are 330

01:11:26.700 million people in this country. We should be able to find a person who can check off those two boxes.

01:11:32.060 Yeah, that'd be nice. Or, or a serial cheater in the case of at least Bill Clinton, you know,

01:11:36.440 it's like, my God, we took a deep dive into his troubles. Who knows? I've got to, speaking of Hillary

01:11:41.520 Clinton, bring you some, some election news. Okay. I'm going to get to her in one second, but first let's

01:11:46.420 pick up where Dave Marcus started the discussion at the top of the show. This Politico argument,

01:11:52.420 article, Dems in full blown freak out over Biden. That's the headline. A pervasive sense of fear

01:11:59.720 has settled in at the highest levels of the democratic party reports Politico nearly five

01:12:05.800 months from the election. Anxiety has morphed into palpable trepidation. According to more than a dozen

01:12:12.500 party leaders and operatives, the gap between what Democrats will say on TV or in print and what

01:12:18.200 they'll text to their friends has only grown as worries have surged about Biden's prospects.

01:12:23.200 A couple of examples, one democratic operative in close touch with the white house said,

01:12:28.500 Oh my God, Mitt Romney might, Oh, this isn't, Oh my God, Mitt Romney might become president. It's,

01:12:35.700 Oh my God, the democracy might end. One advisor to major democratic party donors,

01:12:40.640 donors ask me on an hourly basis. What I think said the activists calling it so much easier

01:12:45.160 to just show them. So while they read it, I can pour a drink. The list of why we could win is so

01:12:50.080 small. I don't even need to keep the list on my phone. Pete G and Greco, a longtime democratic

01:12:55.620 strategist who's worked on multiple campaigns, including presidential. If the frame of this race

01:13:01.040 is what was better, the 3.5 years under Biden or the four years under Trump, we lose that every day

01:13:06.920 of the week and twice on Sundays. Um, and there's more than there's a Siena poll, uh, on New York

01:13:14.300 state, you guys, New York, Dave, that's our state. Um, Biden's weaker numbers show as follows.

01:13:22.860 Biden's leading Trump in New York by only nine points, nine points. Four years ago, Biden won New

01:13:31.140 York by 23 points. Biden's underwater with every single demographic delineated in the poll, except

01:13:40.460 black voters, 53% of Latinos, 54% of whites. This is in New York reported having an unfavorable

01:13:49.600 opinion of Joe Biden. That's amazing. That's like, I mean, if that's it, but in Biden's running ads in

01:13:58.600 New York, which we'll get to in a second, but he's the, the Democrat president is running ads in New

01:14:04.060 York state, Dave. Yeah, listen, I, I, I don't think that it's a coincidence that we're seeing this

01:14:11.300 political article days after that Bronx rally, or, or even days after walking into the libertarian

01:14:17.680 conference and walking into the lion's den, getting booed, giving it back. You know, you had the,

01:14:21.960 the, the massive rally in, in Wildwood. Um, Trump is tapping into something that is very basic to

01:14:29.600 American political DNA, which is that you are expected to go into the places where people don't

01:14:35.140 like you, right? Bill Clinton had to give the sister soldier speech. We all remember Chris Christie on the

01:14:40.700 boardwalk screaming at people about the teachers unions, right? This is part of American political

01:14:45.360 culture. And Donald Trump is now, this has not really been part of his shtick before he's now

01:14:52.940 leaning into that in a really effective way. So number one, Americans like it because it's what we

01:14:58.340 expect from a West wing episode with Jeb Bartlett. But number two, like everything else, it's just

01:15:03.420 another example of something that Joe Biden plainly can't do, right? Joe Biden plainly can't walk into a

01:15:10.220 room like that libertarian room or walk into a deep red part of the country and pull off with

01:15:15.160 Donald Trump is pulling off. That's not going to change. Uh, and so I understand why, you know,

01:15:20.960 the, the, the panic had already been at 10. I understand why it's at 11 today.

01:15:25.800 Speaking of that libertarian convention, they invited everyone. Joe Biden said, no,

01:15:31.220 Trump said, yes. RFKJ said, yes. They wound up nominating some lunatic who thinks we should have

01:15:37.100 more drag queen story hours. So great job libertarians. And, uh, Trump having walked into that

01:15:43.600 lion debt, lion's den got a little ornery when they started booing him, but it was actually

01:15:48.480 kind of funny. Here's a clip. Stop five. I will be a true friend to libertarians in the White House.

01:15:59.120 That's nice. That's nice.

01:16:02.380 Only if you want to win. Only if you want to win. Maybe you don't want to win. Maybe you don't want

01:16:13.180 to win. No, only do that. If you want to win. If you want to lose, don't do that.

01:16:18.020 Keep getting you 3% every four years.

01:16:28.580 We should point out, by the way,

01:16:29.760 That's what people love about Trump. He's getting booed and he made a joke. It was funny.

01:16:33.220 It's funny. He handled it well. I mean, like, look, and by the way, the libertarian high water

01:16:37.140 mark is 3%. We should point out they don't typically get 3%. I think they got that in 2016,

01:16:42.560 which is pretty much a high water mark. But they cost the Republicans Georgia in the Senate.

01:16:47.900 In 2020. Yeah, 2020. And this is the guy, by the way, the guy they nominated was the guy who was

01:16:53.220 running in that 2020 race as a libertarian. He's a nutcase. He thinks we should have more drag queen

01:16:57.220 story hours. He doesn't see any problem with it whatsoever. Yeah, that was a fascinating interview.

01:17:01.980 I saw part of that. I mean, it seems like a seems like, you know, the libertarians are an

01:17:06.080 interesting group. I think they have a lot. There's a lot I like about libertarians.

01:17:09.960 Oh, we have him. Sorry. Wait, wait. Here, I'll show you. Here he is.

01:17:12.460 His name is Chase Oliver. It's not six. Good job, MK show team.

01:17:17.400 Why do you think that the drag queens want to read to children?

01:17:21.120 Because I think that they are performance artists and they want to be able to have

01:17:25.600 different levels of performance art. It's the same reason as why do the Wiggles sing to

01:17:29.660 children? Because they want to have a marketplace to kids.

01:17:32.760 Chase, Chase. They want to be able to, they want to be able to.

01:17:34.960 The Wiggles is made for children. It's, it's obviously family friendly material.

01:17:40.960 Drag queens are not what you call family friendly kind of entertainment.

01:17:45.900 But a man in a dress is what drag is, right? I mean, let's just be real. A man in a dress

01:17:52.000 or a woman in a suit is what drag is. That is not inherently sexual.

01:17:56.560 Oh my Lord. Good job to Austin Peterson on rumble for asking him that question. So they're just like

01:18:01.780 these guys. Okay. Those lunatics who want to show up their fake boobs to my three and four year old

01:18:07.220 kids and yours. They're just like the Wiggles here. Watch.

01:18:11.000 Greg, now I'm walking down the street. We want to cross the road. What do we do, Greg? What do we do?

01:18:16.960 Same exact thing.

01:18:17.660 Stop with the lights. Look both ways. Look both ways again.

01:18:22.720 Oh yeah.

01:18:23.920 Wait for the traffic to come to a stop. Then cross the road.

01:18:29.160 That's good clean entertainment right there. That's, I don't know, that, that is not same.

01:18:33.220 So glad my son's 14 now. It's a good song. Anyway, we've taken a, we've diverged,

01:18:39.300 but that's the libertarian candidate. Trump goes in there. The point is he will go into the lion's

01:18:44.380 den and he'll go where he's loved and where he's not loved, including places like the Bronx to try

01:18:48.920 to get votes. And that is why Joe Biden is running ads in New York. Now, what ads is he running?

01:18:56.860 They're incredibly dishonest and we're going to take a break and come back to that. But before we go,

01:19:00.360 before we do that, I've got to get it in this one thing. Hold on team. I've got to get in the fact

01:19:05.440 that Hillary Clinton just weighed in publicly again on why she lost. And just in case you were

01:19:12.000 thinking it was because she didn't go to Wisconsin, you are wrong. It is you women of America. It is

01:19:19.000 your fault. She now sits down for an interview and decides that the reason she didn't win is

01:19:25.480 American females that they didn't like that. She wasn't perfect. She, uh, this is, uh, okay.

01:19:34.880 With an interview with the New York times, she saw her defeat as inextricable from her gender.

01:19:41.280 But once James Comey did that to me, obviously a reference to him announcing the problems with

01:19:46.660 emails, the people, the voters who left me were women. They left me because they just couldn't take

01:19:53.160 a risk on me because as a woman, I'm supposed to be perfect. They were willing to take a risk on

01:20:00.140 Trump who had a long list of let's call them flaws to illustrate his imperfection because he was a man

01:20:07.420 and they could envision a man as president and commander in chief. And she has a warning now for

01:20:15.220 those bitches. Her warning is authoritarians, whether they be political or religious based,

01:20:22.720 always go after women. It's just written in history. And that's what will happen in this country

01:20:29.620 too. If you reelect him, the daily mail has a running tally of those she has blamed for her 2016 loss.

01:20:37.660 It is 44 people and topics long. Um, we put together our own stop montage just for a little,

01:20:46.720 just a little walk down memory lane and the many things that she has blamed for the fact that as

01:20:51.640 my kids would say, she's a loser. Here it is. I take absolute personal responsibility. I was the

01:20:58.000 candidate until the combination of Jim Comey's letter on October 28th and Russian WikiLeaks

01:21:05.420 raised doubts in the minds of people who were inclined to vote for me, but got scared off.

01:21:12.480 I inherit nothing from the democratic party. I mean, it was bankrupt. Its data was

01:21:20.180 mediocre to poor. So Trump becomes the nominee and he is basically handed this tried and true

01:21:28.480 effective foundation. No, we have an electoral college problem. Like take the Benghazi tragedy.

01:21:34.540 But boy, it was turned into a political football. There was certainly, we know, a plan from Putin and

01:21:43.200 the level and the highest levels of the Kremlin to influence our election. You had Citizens United

01:21:48.420 come to its full fruition. So I also think I was the victim of a very broad assumption. I was going to win.

01:21:56.980 Were you a victim of misogyny? Yes, I do think it played a role.

01:22:01.980 Yes, that too. That kitchen sink over there too, by the way, that hurt me. What do you think, Stu?

01:22:07.500 Oh, it's fascinating. I love the new one, the new remix that just came out of the,

01:22:13.940 I'm a woman, so I'm expected to be perfect, which was the exact same thing Fannie Willis said. Remember

01:22:20.740 after she got caught in her affair, she went in front of the black church and said the exact same

01:22:25.240 thing, which I don't know if this is a new thing. We are not expecting you to be perfect. What we are

01:22:29.900 expecting Hillary is you not to be the worst candidate that has ever run for president. That is basically the

01:22:35.020 standard you needed to hit in that election and you were unable to achieve it.

01:22:38.320 She was the goat of that. Speaking of goat and gloat, she was the goat of that.

01:22:42.000 The goat of worst candidate? Yeah. Don't you think?

01:22:44.760 Joe's the goat. Joe's catching up. I don't know. Yeah, he's giving her a run,

01:22:50.180 but I don't know. I just think she was just so unlikable. And I love that she wants to blame

01:22:54.140 her own sex now for it. It's like, okay. So no one told you not to go to the Midwest.

01:22:59.420 Everyone's blaming white women for everything, like conservatives, liberals. I mean,

01:23:03.820 white women can't catch a break, man. Yeah. We're to blame. It's the fault of the Karens.

01:23:08.420 She's blaming the Karens. Yeah. Well, guess what, Hillary? It's going to happen again. And you're

01:23:14.100 not even on the ticket this time. All right, quick break. And then I'm going to show you this ad

01:23:18.180 that Biden ran on Trump in New York. And we have a little fact check for you. It's unbelievably

01:23:23.520 dishonest. Standby.

01:23:24.740 I'm Megan Kelly, host of the Megan Kelly show on Sirius XM. It's your home for open,

01:23:31.220 honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political,

01:23:35.220 legal, and cultural figures today. You can catch the Megan Kelly show on Triumph,

01:23:39.640 a Sirius XM channel featuring lots of hosts you may know and probably love. Great people like Dr.

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01:23:52.800 Kelly show on Sirius XM at home or anywhere you are. No car required. I do it all the time. I love

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01:24:21.500 Offer details apply.

01:24:28.420 As we talked about, Politico is out this morning with an article about Democrats freaking out about

01:24:33.680 President Biden's election prospects. One interesting point was made by Manhattan borough

01:24:39.040 President Mark Levine. He's one of the ones having a meltdown. He told Politico, quote,

01:24:44.160 New York Democrats need to wake up. The number of people in New York, including people of color

01:24:48.780 that I come across who are saying positive things about Trump, is alarming. Well, as we covered last

01:24:55.160 week, former President Trump went to the Bronx, we just discussed it here too, to hold a campaign

01:24:59.960 rally. He's the first Republican presidential candidate to do that since Ronald Reagan in 1980.

01:25:05.640 Before that rally, the Biden campaign, clearly seeing some of the numbers we're discussing,

01:25:10.620 released an ad trying to paint Mr. Trump as a racist who hates black and brown people. Watch.

01:25:19.140 Of course I hate these people. Donald Trump disrespecting black folk is nothing new. He

01:25:24.080 was sued for refusing to rent his apartments to black families and call for the execution of five

01:25:28.660 innocent black and brown teenagers. And it's more than anger, it's hatred. It's why Trump stood with

01:25:33.480 violent white supremacists, warned of a bloodbath if he loses the next election, and if he's president

01:25:38.420 again, vowed to be a dictator who wants revenge on his enemies. Now, who do you think that is?

01:25:44.400 Of course I hate these people.

01:25:46.200 Wow. That's incredibly dishonest and misleading. Remember when President Biden tried to paint

01:25:52.480 himself as the only one who could unite the nation? All we heard was unity, unity, unity. Well,

01:25:58.080 it's a lie. We decided to fact check this ad. As you heard at the beginning and end of the ad,

01:26:02.880 Mr. Trump states, of course I hate these people. What? He hates black and brown people? That's a

01:26:07.860 headline. How could that not have been used against him prior to now? Because it's not true.

01:26:13.160 The ad goes on to say that it's an example of Donald Trump disrespecting black folk,

01:26:18.280 which is, quote, nothing new. That line is from a 1989 interview on CNN with the late Larry King.

01:26:26.080 Was Trump just this raging, lunatic racist that Larry King was putting on with impunity over there on

01:26:32.520 CNN? No. Mr. Trump was on to talk about that, an ad that he had placed in several New York City

01:26:40.360 newspapers with the headline, bring back the death penalty, bring back our police. The ad ran 12 days

01:26:47.840 after the infamous Central Park gang rape, when a white woman out for a jog in Manhattan Central Park

01:26:55.040 was raped over and over again by multiple people and left for dead. She lost almost all of the blood

01:27:02.960 in her body. Days later, five black and brown teenagers were arrested in connection with that

01:27:08.980 rape and assault. In the interview, Donald Trump told Larry King the ads that he was placing were

01:27:14.640 not prejudging the teens, but rather advocating for the death penalty if they were found guilty.

01:27:19.420 Trump's 1989 ad that he placed in the paper does not mention the then suspects,

01:27:24.620 only the horrific rape that had made international headlines at the time. It was so gruesome and awful.

01:27:31.100 Trump's ad was mainly about crime overall in the city and the need to do something about it.

01:27:35.360 Here's the full clip of Trump saying, of course, I hate these people.

01:27:40.420 They said, of course, I hate these people. And let's all hate these people because maybe hate is what

01:27:45.660 we need if we're going to get something done. I mean, it's incredible when a reporter asks me

01:27:50.600 whether or not I have compassion for the people that did this crime. I have absolutely no compassion.

01:27:57.420 Right. No compassion for the people who did this crime. So he's not talking about

01:28:01.360 all black and brown people as President Biden's cynical ad would like you to believe.

01:28:06.860 The ad also talks about Mr. Trump being sued for refusing to rent his apartments to black families.

01:28:11.580 That's a reference back to the 1970s. And yes, it's a lawsuit from 50 years ago.

01:28:17.040 In 1973, the DOJ filed a civil rights case against the Trump firm. Donald Trump and his father

01:28:23.320 eventually entered into a consent decree to settle the litigation in 75. That agreement contained no

01:28:30.600 admission of guilt, but it required the Trumps to institute a series of safeguards to make sure

01:28:34.740 apartments were rented without regard to race, color, religion, sex or national origin.

01:28:38.220 And Mr. Trump, never one to back down, went on to write in his 1987 book,

01:28:43.180 what we didn't do was rent to welfare cases, white or black. The Biden campaign ad also accuses Mr.

01:28:50.240 Trump of saying there will be a bloodbath if he loses the next election. That's a reference,

01:28:58.360 of course, to a speech Donald Trump gave in March and even major media outlets who are not friendly

01:29:02.880 to Trump admitted he was talking about a bloodbath in the auto industry. If he loses, watch.

01:29:11.040 If you're listening, President Xi, and you and I are friends, but he understands the way I deal.

01:29:16.400 Those big monster car manufacturing plants that you're building in Mexico right now,

01:29:22.600 and you think you're going to get that, you're going to not hire Americans and you're going to sell

01:29:27.360 the cars to us. Now, we're going to put a 100 percent tariff on every single car that comes across

01:29:33.380 the line and you're not going to be able to sell those cars. If I get elected now, if I don't get

01:29:38.940 elected, it's going to be a bloodbath for the whole. That's going to be the least of it. It's going

01:29:43.680 to be a bloodbath for the country. So not a bloodbath against black and brown voters,

01:29:49.600 as President Biden is suggesting. In the past, we've debunked the Trump wants to be a dictator

01:29:55.260 scare tactic also used in the ad. We'll just skip that. You guys have seen that. It's a nonsense

01:29:59.660 charge and it's been fact checked by many. So this is a completely dishonest piece of propaganda

01:30:05.540 that the former president is using. And people should know it's a lie. The whole thing's a lie.

01:30:11.240 Guys, this is so, I mean, just when you don't think you can be even more grossed out by modern

01:30:18.280 American politics, someone finds a way. I mean, this is just so gross and divisive and it shows

01:30:22.800 his panic, Dave, about what's happening in particular with black male voters.

01:30:28.280 Yeah, it's a disgusting ad, but I mean, the most important aspect of it is the first thing that

01:30:33.360 you said that this ad is running in New York, that they are spending millions of dollars in

01:30:38.140 the most expensive media market in the country for a state that they're not supposed to be able to

01:30:43.560 lose, you know, whatsoever. I'll tell you, I remember June, maybe July of 2022. And I started

01:30:52.400 going to my editors and I said, Hey, can I give you something on Lee Zeldin? Because I'm hearing

01:30:57.400 stuff. And they said, Dave, come on, he's losing by 40. There's no story here. Stop it. And I knew he

01:31:04.060 was losing by 40, but I was hearing stuff in the bodegas and the bagel shops, like stuff I hadn't

01:31:07.860 really heard before. Two months later, he starts creeping up. He ended up losing by four. Now,

01:31:13.840 look, COVID had a lot to do with that because Cuomo obviously was a disaster. Hochul was a disaster on

01:31:18.600 COVID. So there were other things. The two places where Republicans did really well in 2022 were

01:31:24.260 Florida and New York, right? They picked up five seats in New York. So that poll that you cited that

01:31:30.660 has Trump down by only nine, the fact that they're already spending money in the empire state tells me

01:31:37.080 that Joe Biden's nervous about it. And I don't live there anymore. But from what I remember from

01:31:43.040 quite recently, I think he has reason to. I mean, Stu, if you look at Trump's ad,

01:31:50.180 bring back the death penalty, bring back our police, and it's in the tiniest type ever. So forgive me,

01:31:54.460 I'm going to have to read it. But I mean, everything that's in here, this would go over well with your

01:31:58.920 average voter. He asked, what has happened to our city over the past 10 years? What has happened to law

01:32:03.140 and order to the neighborhood cop? We all trusted to safeguard our homes and families. The cop

01:32:07.060 who had the power under the law to help in times of danger keep us safe from those who would prey on

01:32:11.980 innocent lives to fulfill some distorted inner need. What has happened to the respect for authority?

01:32:19.060 What has happened is the complete breakdown of life as we knew it. And he goes on to talk about

01:32:25.380 roving bands of wild criminals in our neighborhoods, dispensing their own vicious brand of twisted

01:32:32.480 hatred on whomever they encounter. At what point did we cross the line from fine and the fine and

01:32:37.780 noble pursuit of genuine civil liberties to the reckless and dangerously permissive atmosphere,

01:32:42.760 which allows criminals of every age to beat and rape a helpless woman and then laugh at her

01:32:47.700 family's anguish? And why do they laugh? They laugh because they know that soon, very soon,

01:32:51.540 they will be returned to the streets to rape and maim and kill once again, and yet face no great

01:32:55.980 personal risk to themselves. I mean, it sounds an awful lot like a country I can look around and see

01:32:59.520 right now. Yeah, I mean, if anything, that stuff. Now, the crime levels are lower than those days

01:33:06.260 right now. But the punishment, I mean, the way we're, you know, actually, you know, the prosecutors

01:33:12.600 in all these areas and major cities are the way they're prosecuting crime right now is they're

01:33:17.720 letting everybody off unless your last name happens to be Trump, and then you get the full trial.

01:33:22.940 It's fascinating. I mean, I think even thinking back to that ad, I mean, I've heard of that ad over

01:33:27.180 the years, of course. And even I had forgotten that he didn't actually name the Central Park five in

01:33:33.040 the in the ad because that was the accusation was that he kind of came out and just said, oh,

01:33:36.820 they're guilty. Kill them right now before the trial, which is not what he said. But he didn't

01:33:40.920 name them in the ad. And even if he did, it would be a bad mistake, but a 45 year old mistake and not

01:33:49.000 necessarily one that should decide a 2024 election. All this stuff adds up to what you're talking about

01:33:55.220 here. You know, when you're running ads in New York and you're rolling out people like Robert

01:33:58.580 De Niro for press conferences, these are not the actions of a campaign that believes it's ahead.

01:34:05.000 These are the actions. Let me add to that. Let me add to that, too, because now they're not only did

01:34:09.160 the Biden campaign dispatch people to Trump's trial, but they say that if and when Trump is convicted,

01:34:14.680 Biden's going to make a statement from the White House. He's going to do it from the White House to

01:34:18.840 act like he's above it all. This is colossally stupid. Did he do that on October 7th?

01:34:24.640 I don't think he made a statement from the White House on October 7th. I could be wrong. He didn't.

01:34:29.300 He did. No, he didn't. But but the Trump trial.

01:34:32.980 Yeah. Then we have to see him in full commander in chief regalia while he's got his emissaries at

01:34:38.220 the actual courthouse just spewing nonsense. But this is like I don't want to see my Oval Office

01:34:43.020 used for this. I didn't want to see my DOJ used for this either. But this is you know, this is the

01:34:48.120 race we've got. I do think it'll be a huge mistake, Dave, if he actually does this from the White House.

01:34:52.640 But I mean, he's got to do it now. Right. It's probably a huge mistake for him to debate,

01:34:58.160 but he's got to do it now like this. They're stuck. Right. Unless they're not. And unless

01:35:04.420 there's some switcheroo at the convention or or whatever it is. But this is bad. It's getting

01:35:10.580 really ugly. I don't I don't understand how they can make the claim that this trial was not political

01:35:16.840 anymore, given these two press conferences. And it's an enormous thing to admit, because

01:35:22.040 all they've got is Trump is a threat to democracy. And right now it's a 50 50 country on that question.

01:35:28.860 And it's a 70 30 question on immigration. It's like pot meat kettle on that charge these days,

01:35:35.000 too. I'll give you the last word. I mean, honestly, if you're a Democrat,

01:35:37.860 you better hope they get a conviction here, because if he if they if they don't get that,

01:35:41.320 I think you could see a real sort of rubber band effect of people thinking we were going to get 91

01:35:45.700 charges and now we're going to get none before this election. I think it could actually be a

01:35:49.680 pretty significant factor in changing the polls in Trump's favor. And I wonder if he gets convicted,

01:35:54.540 whether it would change the polls in his favor, too. Like nothing they do is working, which is why

01:35:59.080 they are in the full fledged panic. Stu and Dave, you always bring peace, prosperity to the program.

01:36:05.180 Thank you for that. No panic at all. Great to see you both. Thank you, Megan. Tomorrow we'll stay on

01:36:09.300 closing arguments with our Kelly's Court all stars, Arthur Idala and Mark Iglarsh. Martha is back.

01:36:18.720 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - May 28, 2024

Biden Politicizes Trump Trial, and Hillary Tries Blaming Women For 2016 Loss, with Stu Burguiere and Dave Marcus ｜ Ep. 803

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