The Megyn Kelly Show - Biden Takes Credit for Hostage Deal, and Elon's Media Matters Lawsuit, with Victor Davis Hanson, Marcia Clark, and Mark Geragos

00:00:00.620 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:12.400 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show. I hope you had a wonderful

00:00:17.220 Thanksgiving, that you enjoyed the holiday with those you love. If you missed our American News

00:00:23.100 Minute last week, that's my email to you. You can sign up if you want. It's just one a week,

00:00:28.100 and we bring you up to speed on the week's news. You can sign up at megynkelly.com.

00:00:33.020 I recounted our, what we call, fakesgiving we had with our family right before the real deal,

00:00:38.820 and some absolutely hideous food experiences, courtesy of yours truly, over the years. So

00:00:44.220 you'll enjoy the post, and I hope your food exchange, at least, went better than mine always does.

00:00:52.520 Always. Okay. Over the past three days, there's been a lot of news. Well, we've all been enjoying

00:00:58.080 hopefully time with our families and Black Friday shopping. The world has watched as dozens of

00:01:03.560 innocent hostages have been released by Hamas in exchange for far more Palestinian prisoners,

00:01:11.640 many of whom did absolutely horrific things. One side, you have totally innocent Israelis,

00:01:17.940 and the other side, you have Palestinians in jail in Israel who are being released

00:01:21.820 because it's a hostage situation over there in Gaza, and the Israelis can't get the innocence back

00:01:27.360 unless they release people who have been justifiably accused, have either been convicted or awaiting

00:01:33.100 trials on crimes. See? This is not exactly how the media will present this exchange to you. It'll be

00:01:38.900 more of a tit for tat. You know, both sides let out, sadly imprisoned people. No, that's not what went on

00:01:46.080 here. Keep that in mind. Among those released, the first Israeli-American, little Abigail Eden.

00:01:52.660 Abigail returns to Israel, an orphan. Her parents were murdered by Hamas, and she had a birthday

00:02:00.020 while in captivity. Yesterday, President Biden celebrated the news of her freedom.

00:02:05.300 Today, she's free, and Jill and I, together with so many Americans, are praying for the fact that she is

00:02:13.340 going to be all right. So, those who are now wrapping Abigail in love and care and the supportive services

00:02:21.400 she needs, she's been through a terrible trauma. You know, her mom was killed in front of her.

00:02:28.420 Abigail ran to her dad then, who then was gunned down, gunned down as well, while using his body

00:02:35.200 to shield little Abigail. She then ran to a neighbor for help, where they were all taken

00:02:41.220 hostage. That entire house of neighbors were taken hostage by Hamas and held for 50 days.

00:02:48.700 What she endured is unthinkable.

00:02:53.280 She's almost certainly not okay. You're seeing the videos now of these little kids coming out of

00:03:00.540 captivity and being held by their relatives, and you can tell they are anything but okay.

00:03:05.980 One silver lining to this horrible story, Abigail's older siblings, ages nine and six,

00:03:10.960 survived on 10-7 by hiding in a closet. Again, all this stuff is so reminiscent of Nazi Germany

00:03:18.680 and what was done to Jews then, hiding in the closet to avoid certain death, children.

00:03:24.220 Here at home, we continue to witness deranged protests and anger directed at those

00:03:28.360 who call Hamas what they are, murderers, terrorists. Honestly, these Hamas terrorists are subhuman.

00:03:36.380 What they did to those children and babies is subhuman. One college professor was punished

00:03:41.800 for doing just that at the University of Southern California. And one of the world's highest paid

00:03:47.240 supermodels, Gigi Hadid, cannot stop posting inflammatory and anti-Semitic messages to her 79 million

00:03:55.140 followers on Instagram. Hey, IMG models, any problem with that? Second thoughts at all? Do you have any

00:04:02.300 Jews at all working at IMG? Might want to look into Gigi. She's been accusing Israel of abducting,

00:04:09.120 raping, and murdering Palestinian children. Then, because she knows she'll never face any consequences,

00:04:14.720 she goes a bit further, accusing Israel of harvesting organs. Been doing it for years,

00:04:21.680 she says. Victor Davis Hanson is a senior fellow at the Hoover Institution and author of the book,

00:04:27.320 A Dying Citizen. VDH, welcome back to the show. Let's just start with the release of some of the

00:04:36.540 hostages now. Some 50 in all have been released, including an American, as we just pointed out.

00:04:41.940 And first of all, it is unbelievable. Like, when I listened to President Biden over the past few

00:04:47.800 days, all I hear is, I, I, I, I, me, me, me, me, me. I did it. My team's been working. I did this.

00:04:54.940 I've been negotiating. Here's just a sample, but we could have had four other examples in this one

00:04:59.840 soundbite. Take a listen to Sop 2. Under a deal reached by extensive U.S. diplomacy,

00:05:05.640 including numerous calls I've made from the Oval Office. Today has been a product of a lot of hard

00:05:11.500 work and weeks of personal engagement. I, along with my team, have worked around the clock to

00:05:16.140 secure the release. I've consistently pressed for a pause in the fighting for two reasons,

00:05:21.580 to accelerate and expand humanitarian assistance going into Gaza, and two, to facilitate the release

00:05:27.960 of hostages. What's he doing? What U.S. president, what commander in chief, upon the release of some

00:05:35.260 hostages, just one American, gets out there and uses I, I, I, me, me, me over and over. No U.S.

00:05:42.080 president does that. They talk about we, we and our allies. He's making it political, is what he's

00:05:49.160 doing. Yeah, he does, because he's afraid of, I guess, a quarter million voters in Michigan. But

00:05:57.700 what gets me about it is that he mentions Hamas almost in neutral terms. He expresses empathy with

00:06:04.180 the hostages. But never does he ever elaborate that there's one side who's taking captives, and the

00:06:10.320 other side isn't. And there's one side they're giving, that have to give over three convicted

00:06:17.300 terrorists for every hostage as they get back. And that this is a complete violation of war. It's just

00:06:24.100 barbarous. But he talks about it in these neutral terms. And so does the U.N. So does Europe. I mean,

00:06:31.420 the Irish president said that one of the Irish captives was lost and then found. So nobody ever

00:06:39.360 really says, this is horrific, that this is not a nation state. It's not a legitimate government.

00:06:47.560 It's a bunch of terrorists that take little kids' hostages and murder their parents. And that's what's

00:06:55.800 lost in all of this. And then when he brags about the pauses, what he should say is, this is a very

00:07:01.560 difficult situation where there's no good solution, because the IDF will now lose more soldiers, and

00:07:09.800 Israel will be less secure because they're being hijacked by this terrorist group, because they value life

00:07:16.820 more than Hamas values death, I suppose. But there's something wrong about the whole thing. Everybody's lost

00:07:24.600 sight of what Hamas is doing and who they are. Right. I mean, there's, you know, these celebratory

00:07:30.140 headlines, and we'll talk about the media in a second. But these celebratory headlines, all I can

00:07:35.320 feel is horror as we get more details on the individuals who were taken hostage by Hamas.

00:07:42.340 My notes on my packet that my team puts together to me are, hostages so old, and then the next page

00:07:48.920 reads, and so young. And I just wrote down some of the ages. 85, 77, 76, 79, 78, 84. Then the youth,

00:07:59.680 4, 5, 8, 2, 10, 4, 8, 9, 9, 11, 13, 3. I could go on. These are little kids. They're babies. A two-year-old

00:08:14.900 is a baby. So is a three-year-old. And the elderly, Victor, I mean, my mom, my mom is 82. My mom, like

00:08:23.900 there's an 85-year-old, an 84-year-old. My mom uses a walker. She has real difficulty getting around. She

00:08:30.700 has medications she needs to take. I think about these women in their mid-80s or late-70s to put

00:08:38.920 them through this kind of horror. And then, I mean, yes, of course, we're glad that they've been

00:08:43.540 released. But I mean, it's like the media is ready to move on from the horror that these women were put

00:08:49.040 through. Well, I mean, it's, get this feeling, I don't know if it's hyperdramatic or what, but you're

00:08:56.440 almost get the feeling you're living in maybe 1933 or 1944 in Germany, when you're starting to see

00:09:03.140 something transpire that's growing every day. When you look at the United Nations, you see that

00:09:08.160 Iran is the head of the Human Rights Forum and that the Secretary General, as soon as he heard

00:09:15.240 about October 7th, he said that you can't understand the murdering without listening to the, evaluating

00:09:20.340 the context. And you look at what Europeans are saying, you look at what's happening at our

00:09:24.420 universities, and you look at our own government. I mean, Jean-Pierre, until she tried to correct

00:09:30.980 herself and say she didn't hear it, basically said there was no anti-Semitism they knew of, that the

00:09:36.100 problem was Islamophobia. And on the, I think it was the third day after October 7th, Anthony Blinken

00:09:42.140 and the Turkish foreign minister of all people were calling for a ceasefire. And you, and this thing

00:09:47.200 is just accelerating. It's like a snowball. And it's, it's scary because no one is saying these people

00:09:54.560 are SS murderers, and they, they're a death cult, and they're killing innocent people, and they take

00:10:00.420 hostages, and they decapitate, and they mutilate, and they do every incomprehensible pre-civilizational

00:10:08.020 act, and they're abhorrent. And we don't hear that at all from anybody. No, no, what we're hearing is

00:10:14.540 still from the president, there has to be a two-state solution, two-state solution. And I don't know if

00:10:20.140 you saw it, Victor, over the weekend, but Hamas captured two Palestinians who were believed to be

00:10:26.160 cooperating with the Israelis. I did see them in front of a cheering crowd, shot them, and then

00:10:32.360 hanged them from an electrical tower. Cheering, cheering, yeah! This is the kind of stuff we know

00:10:37.320 from people like Yonmi Park happened in North Korea, happens in North Korea. So this is what Hamas is

00:10:43.120 doing. And I guess Israel and we, as their ally, are supposed to talk to these. We're just going to sit

00:10:48.880 down and chat with these folks who would take two-year-olds and 85-year-olds and string up their

00:10:54.020 own people by electrical wires and talk about how we can all live in peace in a two-state solution now.

00:11:01.360 What is really the worst thing about it is that when you look at the people who are cheering us on

00:11:07.400 or making excuses or contextualizing it, they're university faculty, administrators, politicians,

00:11:14.220 head of states, media people. But they're not the, I mean, it goes on at Stanford and Harvard and Yale

00:11:21.460 and Princeton. It doesn't go on at grade schools. It doesn't go on at communities, colleges. I live

00:11:27.180 in a very impoverished area, 95% Hispanic, working class people. They understand what's going on.

00:11:35.240 This is a sickness and illness among our elite. And the more, it's really sad because I, you know,

00:11:41.240 we all believe in the enlightenment, but as a general rule, the more education someone has,

00:11:46.040 the more morally bankrupt they are on the Middle East. And I don't know how to communicate with

00:11:53.340 people in this administration. It's either, as you say, narcissistic or all it talks about is what

00:11:59.660 it has done to restrain the IDF from trying to create an atmosphere where they won't do this every

00:12:06.200 single month as the Hamas leader in Lebanon promised that he would do, that this is going to go on and

00:12:13.600 on and on and on. And when you have the first news of it, and the head of the UN says that this

00:12:20.260 murdering has context, i.e. it's justified. Where do you, where do you turn for sanity? The president

00:12:26.980 of Harvard, the UN, the president of the United States, the press secretary of the White House? No,

00:12:33.400 it's all madness. Yeah. I mean, I truly, it's like, maybe we should chat with the people who put

00:12:39.720 live babies in ovens about reaching an amicable solution to this. I mean, this is an absurdity.

00:12:47.560 And it's, it was president Biden's message all weekend that that's the only possible way out of

00:12:52.800 this, that it must happen. Just looking at my exact notes on exactly how he put it, but he said it over

00:12:57.800 and over. Um, we need to renew our resolve to pursue this two state solution where Israelis and

00:13:04.100 Palestinians can one day live side by side in a two state solution with equal measure of freedom

00:13:09.440 and dignity, two states for two peoples. And it's more important now than ever. What,

00:13:15.840 what is he talking about? I don't know. We have a two state solution for decades. They've rejected it

00:13:22.420 time and time again. And now they're cutting off children's heads. Well, this is an absurd lie.

00:13:27.640 And we have a three, we have a three state solution because we have one group of killers

00:13:32.140 in Gaza. And then we have another group in the Palestinian authority that's cheering us on

00:13:36.640 and killing people. And we have Israel. So he never says two state, what does that mean? Is he going to,

00:13:43.820 if he really did believe that, would he say to the Israelis, get rid of Gaza, kill them,

00:13:49.180 kill the Hamas people, and then we'll let the less terrorist, less killing, uh, PA take over.

00:13:55.620 He can't even say that when he says two state solution. I know, I know there's a lot of naive

00:14:01.760 people who believe that, but even the naive people must understand, and they do understand that that

00:14:07.340 can't involve Hamas. So the Israelis are the only people who can apparently deal with Hamas,

00:14:12.200 but he wants to let Hamas off the hook and then have a two state solution when Hamas is even has

00:14:17.600 executed the Palestinian authority people. So he's incoherent. And, you know, and we, nobody said

00:14:25.920 to us after 9-11, don't go into Tora Bora and bomb because there might be civilians. We all knew there

00:14:31.320 were civilians packed all around the Al-Qaeda people. And we bombed the blank, blank out of Tora Bora.

00:14:37.160 We bombed the blank, blank out of houses in Afghanistan where we knew the Taliban heads were.

00:14:44.020 Nobody from Israel, much less anywhere else said, please, United States, I know you're angry,

00:14:50.620 but don't lash out and try to, uh, you're going to kill innocent civilians. Nobody said that to us.

00:14:56.420 It's only Israel. You know, every one of these issues, Megan, refugees, uh, settlers, proportionality,

00:15:04.420 they only apply to Israel. Nobody's talking right now about Arab Muslims killing 500,000 people

00:15:11.480 or a million Muslims in Uyghur camps or Russia leveling Chechnya. Nobody says a word about that

00:15:20.340 or refugees. I mean, the Palestinians are the only people in the world who were refugees 80 years

00:15:25.900 after they lost their supposed home. Not the Greek Cypriots, 200,000 of them were ethnically cleansed

00:15:31.960 in 74 by the Turks, not 13 million Germans that were ethnically cleansed from East Prussia by, you know,

00:15:39.360 for good reason, maybe, but same time as a Palestinian, not a million Jews that were ethnically cleansed from

00:15:45.700 Cairo and Damascus and Beirut and Baghdad. Nobody says a word. It's only this weird group that says we are the

00:15:52.360 only victims in the world. And we are the only refugees 80 years after this.

00:15:56.400 Right. Nobody intervenes on their behalf at all when they're not killing people. So that's,

00:16:01.540 you know, further encouragement to them. Um, yeah. So now so far we've gotten 39 Palestinians

00:16:06.500 released, but there's a proposed list of 300. They're demanding about three to one in order to

00:16:12.180 release these, uh, Israeli hostages. And we believe there are some 10 Americans. They are not just this

00:16:16.940 one little girl, by the way, on my comments about the videos, this is the girl who Gail King interviewed

00:16:24.260 the father of insensitively, uh, in my view, where she was asking about, Oh, it's all just political.

00:16:29.920 Now, you know, Palestinian children have been, are dying to, uh, and he said, I have zero appetite

00:16:34.300 for this conversation right now, uh, for the, for you getting political, are you raising politics

00:16:39.120 or the politics of it? So they have video of her being reunited with her older sibling.

00:16:45.400 And you can see, you can see that this girl, it's not normal. The dogs are jumping on her. It's sweet,

00:16:51.820 but you can see the little girl in VO2. She's clearly traumatized Victor. Here it is. So that

00:16:57.380 this is her in the red shirt. So she gets down. The older sibling is hugging her, touching her face,

00:17:05.740 pulling her clothes. These two sweet little dogs, they look almost like puppies are coming over,

00:17:09.840 wagging their tails. They're obviously very happy to see her. And the girl's not really moving. I mean,

00:17:15.660 we're just never going to know the full trauma that was inflicted, not only on girls like this,

00:17:20.660 but on those who witnessed the killings that day, you know, those, those who witnessed the murder of

00:17:26.080 the parents, like some of these kids did. Um, and I don't, I just don't know how we're just still

00:17:32.120 pretending that these are people we can bargain with that they're, they're not. Um, okay. I just

00:17:37.560 want to, I want to get onto the way that they're portraying these Palestinian prisoners who are being

00:17:44.860 released. Okay. Because it is so dishonest. I'll give you a couple of headlines. Now that keep in

00:17:51.760 mind, the Palestinians who are being released from prisons, for the most part, committed serious

00:17:56.460 crimes or accused of serious crimes. In a couple of instances, they were relatively small, like

00:18:00.260 throwing stones at officials. But many of these are attempted murders, attempted suicide bombers.

00:18:06.960 And that's who Israel had in prison. So now you get headlines like this from the AP,

00:18:13.640 Palestinian families rejoice over release of minors, comma women, like just innocent minors and

00:18:20.140 women, you know, Victor, just like the Israelis, uh, who were in those Gaza camps, Palestinian

00:18:24.980 teenager dizzy with happiness to be freed. That's the BBC tears and joy. A second batch of 39

00:18:33.340 Palestinians freed from Israeli prisons, Al Jazeera, Reuters relief, sadness for Palestinian

00:18:39.940 prisoners freed in hostage deal. Al Jazeera with another one released. Palestinians recount harsh

00:18:46.760 conditions in Israeli prisons. Oh, really? Were they getting raped by the Israeli prisoners or prison

00:18:53.080 guards? I'm going to go ahead and say no. Uh, Israeli, okay. Al Jazeera chocolate cake,

00:18:58.200 loving parents await Palestinian teen Israel might free. Um, and here's, here's how it was properly

00:19:07.100 covered by the times of Israel crowds hail second group of freed Palestinian prisoners, including

00:19:12.760 would be suicide bomber. Yes, that's appropriate. Here's, here's the one headline from the New York

00:19:20.400 Times. They put out this picture of this Palestinian woman who was freed and that she's hugging somebody

00:19:28.600 receiving her. And the headline is a disfigured woman whose case has become well known is among the

00:19:35.740 Palestinians released in response to which, um, this guy on Twitter, Adam James tweets out this

00:19:42.860 disfigured woman is a car bomber who having blown herself up in an attempt to kill Israelis,

00:19:48.960 demanded that Israelis pay for her plastic surgeries. And yet times calls her a disfigured woman whose

00:19:56.580 cases become well known is among the Palestinians released the moral equivalency between three-year-olds

00:20:03.480 snatched by butchers. That's how our friend Batya Anghar Sargon put it. And people like this poor disfigured

00:20:11.460 alleged suicide bomber is absolutely stomach turning.

00:20:15.260 You know, I, when we talk about all this, you want to say, why is this? Why the asymmetry? Why this

00:20:22.420 different standards? Why the suspension of any morality when we discuss these issues? And then,

00:20:27.440 you know, we were having this conversation in the seventies or the eighties or the nineties, and we did,

00:20:32.220 we could say, well, there's 500 million Arab Muslims in the Middle East, and there's only

00:20:36.400 10 million Jews and people are amoral. And they're just going with the numbers. Or maybe we could have said

00:20:43.600 at that time, there's oil, 40% of the world's reserves are in the Middle East, we got to be careful.

00:20:50.760 But this is different now. It's almost, and I'll be very blunt. The BBC is broadcasting from London,

00:20:59.120 where there, there is a huge number of people who came from the Middle East who live there as resident

00:21:05.440 aliens, first generation immigrant students. And there's also this DEI idea that in the Western

00:21:13.660 world, but specifically in the United States, that you can be racist or you can equate Jews with so-called

00:21:20.760 white settlers or white privilege or white rage or white supremacy. And there's no downside because

00:21:26.380 you're yourself have been declared a victimized, marginalized person. And then people from the

00:21:31.260 Middle East and the hundreds of thousands have fled tyranny and autocracy and violence and poverty.

00:21:38.620 And they come over to the West and they, by voting with their feet from a very different paradigm that

00:21:45.020 gives them prosperity and security and freedom. And what do they do with that? They immediately

00:21:50.900 romanticize the very types of government and social life and culture that they themselves rejected.

00:21:57.760 And that's, what's new about all of this is that fusion between DEI elites and so-called marginalized

00:22:05.440 people and people from the Middle East in the West. And they are very vocal. They're still a minority,

00:22:12.800 but they have got a special resonance in the media and academia, even in the corporate boardroom. It's,

00:22:21.180 it's amazing. And that's what makes us different from these conversations we had in the seventies and the

00:22:26.440 eighties and the nineties where people would listen to Israel and they would at least be open to

00:22:32.620 understanding the unique challenges they face living over there. But now it's incoherent. It's just crazy.

00:22:39.640 And I think that's because we have so many people who are demonstrating and protesting in universities here,

00:22:46.520 and they feel they're exempt from criticism. And you can really see, Megan, that the demonstrations in the West,

00:22:52.900 mirror image, the methodologies in Palestine, because one side who demonstrates wears mask

00:22:58.840 and they fight with the police and they deface property and they occupy public spaces and they

00:23:05.540 suspend traffic and they scream genocidal chants from the river to the sea and they harass passerbys.

00:23:11.700 And the other side doesn't. And it's, and yet when you mention that people think you're crazy,

00:23:16.660 but that's the deep, I think that's, what's the common denominator to all of these asymmetrical,

00:23:23.680 uh, stories that we're hearing.

00:23:26.320 You're so right. My gosh, you're so right about everything you just said. The, um,

00:23:31.140 the, you've got one more from Reuters, which is worth reading on the headline. They posted on X.

00:23:37.360 Hamas reaches, releases 13 more Israeli soldiers and four foreign nationals to the Red Cross in a second exchange.

00:23:47.020 13 more Israeli soldiers. What are they, they're talking about that? Well, who did they release?

00:23:52.120 I just read you the ages, 85 year olds, two year olds, women. This is, these are not,

00:23:58.240 they are not releasing Israeli soldiers. And of course, then they got pummeled, including from, uh,

00:24:04.940 the American Jewish committee tweeting do better. These are innocent civilians who were kidnapped

00:24:08.900 from their homes. Did you notice some of them were dressed in their pajamas? It's because they

00:24:13.680 were in their beds when they were dragged to Gaza tweets out Dr. Alexandria, Alexandra Herzog of the

00:24:19.840 American Jewish committee. Later they were forced to delete the post, but this is no accident. This

00:24:26.260 really is just, it's no accident that the press has aligned itself. And as you point out this weird

00:24:31.860 coalition of, you know, the pro-Palestinian crew, the elite university crew, and then just the,

00:24:39.500 the people who have signed on to wokeification and race essentialism. And I, and that brings me to,

00:24:46.420 uh, this Hillcrest high school. This is unbelievable. So this Hillcrest high school is in,

00:24:53.600 hold on, it's video 11 and it's in Queens, uh, New York, where these students basically took over.

00:25:02.800 They were very angry. They caused a mob scene because their teacher, one of them had showed,

00:25:08.840 had shown up at a pro-Israel rally with a, with a sign that read, I stand with Israel.

00:25:17.440 So she went to one of these peaceful protests. They've blurred her face for her own protection now.

00:25:22.520 So she showed up. It just says, I stand with Israel. That's what it says. She posted it on

00:25:28.020 her Facebook. Well, the students lost their mind. They lost their ever loving minds. They made a

00:25:34.340 group chat, decided to quote, expose her to talk about it. And then to talk, and then they talked

00:25:40.040 about starting a riot from the New York post and riot. They did look at this video from their school.

00:25:45.960 It was hundreds of kids rampaging to the halls for nearly two hours. Look, they tore the sink out of

00:25:54.140 the bathroom facility, ripped down tiles of the walls, chanted, jumped, shouted, waved Palestinian

00:25:59.900 flags and banners. These kids don't know shit about, sorry, Victor, about Palestine. They know

00:26:04.520 nothing. They know nothing about Palestine. And, uh, they were freeing the yelling, free Palestine,

00:26:10.740 screaming, this teacher needs to go. They want her fired. Uh, they, the NYPD got wind of the

00:26:16.840 plans just in time to get to the school. They rushed the teacher into an office and locked the

00:26:21.340 doors. So once again, you have another Jewish, I think she's Jewish, at least Jewish supporter

00:26:26.380 having to hide behind closed and locked doors so that the angry mob of pro-Palestinian protesters

00:26:32.200 doesn't get to her. Um, they found out where she lives, her address, her phone number, her family,

00:26:38.900 all of her personal info. And then the videos were posted to TikTok because that's what these young

00:26:43.680 people do. Most of the comments applauded the rioters, jeered the teacher. And to your point of

00:26:50.980 the woke of vacation and all that, uh, one calling her a cracker ass bitch. NYPD had to send 25

00:26:58.380 officers to the scene. At first, they just suspended three people. Then after backlash,

00:27:04.460 now four arrests have been made. Still not enough. And they're going to get a lot more just like it.

00:27:10.020 By the way, last point before I give it to you, there are 571 public high schools in New York city.

00:27:15.640 This one is ranked 540th, 540th. It's college readiness score of the average graduate

00:27:22.380 out of a possible 123.5. They can't do math. They're not that proficient in reading,

00:27:31.020 but they certainly understand what cracker ass bitch means. And that's what she got labeled

00:27:35.920 for standing with Israel. What do you make of it? Well, I mean, they're, they're ignorant and

00:27:41.380 they're arrogant and they're ignorance because they haven't been taught anything except that

00:27:46.220 they're special people and they're victims. And so therefore they feel that they can say or do

00:27:50.980 anything to any other person, but the subtext of all that is, I think there's two subtexts. Number

00:27:55.820 one, they're accustomed to have no consequences. So when they get together, they say, we're going to

00:28:00.680 go after this so-called Jewish or white teacher. We're going to try. I think they probably would

00:28:04.980 have killed her if they had gotten ahold of her. And they thought we are victimized. Cause I think as

00:28:10.160 I read the story myself, about 85% of the high school are so-called marginalized people and we are

00:28:16.460 victims and she is a white rage, white supremacist, white privilege teacher. So if we go after her,

00:28:22.500 there will be no consequences whatsoever. And we're going to equate Israel with, uh, Israel over there

00:28:30.600 with white people here. And that's what's happening. And they do it because they're cowardly and they

00:28:37.380 know there's no, there's no consequences. And there will be very few consequences. If the roles had

00:28:43.020 been reversed and everybody knows that if white students had gone after some Latino or black

00:28:49.240 teacher, and they should have been, they would have been published rightly so, but the opposite's

00:28:53.720 not true as we see here. And that's going to embolden people because there's no deterrence anymore.

00:28:58.220 Once you say that I'm a victim and therefore anything I do and say, no matter how hateful or cruel

00:29:04.360 will not be punished because of my victim status, then you've opened yourself up to just what we see.

00:29:10.180 And we're going to see more of it. Uh, a friend of mine goes to all the school board meetings at her

00:29:16.780 public school in New York and keeps her finger on the tab of what's happening at the other public

00:29:21.700 schools as well. A couple of weeks ago, she went to the high school board meeting and someone there

00:29:27.740 said condemning antisemitism, right? Like you and I are doing right now, condemning antisemitism

00:29:34.400 is white supremacy. It's, it's white supremacy to stand up against antisemitism because if you're

00:29:43.900 antisemitic means you're anti Jewish. And I guess they just say Jews are whites. They're in their

00:29:50.100 view. They may or may not be, uh, but in their view, they're whites. They're, they're politically

00:29:53.940 white is how they see them. And therefore antisemitism is just fine. Being anti white is just fine.

00:30:00.500 They've been open about that for quite some time in this country. Yeah. I don't understand to the

00:30:05.660 logic of it. And I don't understand the logic of the pro Hamas protesters. Everybody knows

00:30:10.460 there's 250,000 so-called, uh, Arab votes in Michigan. But when you look at the polls,

00:30:17.020 whether it's DeSantis or Haley, but especially Trump, he's way ahead. And do they really believe

00:30:23.840 that what you just saw on those tapes or what people are doing at USC or my campus or at Harvard

00:30:30.940 are swarming the rotunda or shutting down the Manhattan bridge and then yelling all of this stuff

00:30:38.020 and trying to kill people? Do they really think that it come, uh, 2024, that that's going to help

00:30:44.260 them? Because what they're doing is they have control the loud institutions and they get all the

00:30:49.980 visibility. But when you actually look at polls, 65% of the people for, for all the media propaganda

00:30:56.860 don't sympathize with Hamas and they don't, they're not, they don't like this, even at this late date

00:31:02.280 in American culture and life. And so if the Republicans, whoever they nominate, if they could

00:31:08.520 unite, uh, you're going to see a really big pushback against all this. And you can already feel it,

00:31:14.500 that people are very, they're just quietly simmering. They'd look at this and they said,

00:31:18.500 you know what, if we continue down with open borders and importing people from hostile terrorist

00:31:25.140 nations that hate us and not treating everybody on the basis of their character rather than the color,

00:31:31.600 we're not going to survive. We're going to go, we're going to revert or descend into a tribal,

00:31:36.640 chaotic, everybody against everybody, Hobbesian state. And I think, I think 2024 is going to be a

00:31:44.900 landmark election in that regard. You, you're so right. And I, I saw you tweeting about,

00:31:52.040 about what they're doing with the military. They're doubling in the wake of a recruiting crisis.

00:31:56.140 They're doubling down on pushing DEI on our troops, requiring our troops to be versed in DEI and all

00:32:03.460 the languages of diversity, equity, inclusion, all the terms. And at the same time, they're,

00:32:08.640 who's the other group that's truly in crisis now in America? And we're short on our recruits for

00:32:13.120 the military and we're spreading them all over the world, potentially. Um, and secondly,

00:32:18.220 we have an open border, so they're flooding across the border and we can't handle the number of,

00:32:22.800 uh, illegal migrants who are coming in. So the border patrol, what do they get? They get a memo

00:32:28.640 from the department of Homeland security at the same time when people are seriously considering

00:32:32.460 impeaching, uh, Mayorkas, the head of DHS for this open border. What do they do? DHS orders border

00:32:40.140 agents to use preferred pronouns for illegal immigrants. This is unbelievable. This is per

00:32:46.360 guidance obtained by the heritage foundation's oversight project, DHS guidance titled guide to

00:32:50.600 facilitating effective communication with individuals who identify as LGBTQ plus tell CPB

00:32:57.100 agents to avoid using certain terms. Do not use he, him, or she, her pronouns until you have more

00:33:03.640 information about or provided by the individual. Don't use words like Mr. Mrs. Sir, or ma'am.

00:33:08.400 They discourage any pronoun use until you have more info about the individual quote.

00:33:13.000 If an incorrect pronoun is used and then corrected by the individual, meaning the illegal

00:33:17.840 acknowledge the oversight and use the correct pronoun. These border patrol agents are getting

00:33:25.660 attacked. These people are coming into the country. Some of them are rapists. Some of them

00:33:31.240 are criminal. Some of them are carrying drugs. And we have to tell the CPB agents to worry about

00:33:36.780 she, her pronouns and making amends if they happen to call somebody by the wrong gender.

00:33:44.020 You know, that's besides the insanity, that's a typical bureaucratic response. When they can't

00:33:51.340 deal with a felony, they focus and fixate on the misdemeanor or this isn't even a misdemeanor.

00:33:56.840 It reminds me of Michael Bloomberg when they couldn't get the snow off the streets

00:33:59.920 of New York. He was talking about supersized Coca-Cola because, and they all do that. And

00:34:05.840 that is they're completely impotent when they have these existential challenges because

00:34:09.600 they don't have, they feel the remedy is worse than the disease. They don't want to be considered

00:34:14.060 illiberal so they won't touch it. But then they have to have some token that they're doing something

00:34:19.300 to justify their mostly worthless existence in the case of Mayorkas. So they do some, I don't know

00:34:26.180 what it is, a virtue signal performance art, a little token. And we're all supposed to say, wow,

00:34:32.620 they may have led 8 million people in the country and we don't have any idea who they are. We know

00:34:37.400 some of them are very bad people, but at least they got their pronouns right. And that's something.

00:34:42.380 And that's how they, that's how that strange mind. And in the case of the military, you know,

00:34:47.160 it's very funny after driving out the one, I mean, when Mark Milley and Lloyd Austin got in front of

00:34:52.160 the Congress and said white supremacy, white rage, white privilege. And then they had all of this DEI

00:34:57.680 and then they got everybody out of the military who had legitimate concerns about the vaccinations

00:35:04.340 and said that natural immunity, even though they'd had COVID, it wouldn't be enough.

00:35:09.240 So now they're sending out 8,500 letters for people to come back, come back. We're sorry we kicked

00:35:15.260 you out. And the subtext is that the one, since they talk about demographics, and I don't think

00:35:21.120 I care about demographics, but they do. When you look at the actual number of people who died in

00:35:26.360 Afghanistan and Iraq, it's 75% were white males and they drove them all out, even though they're only,

00:35:32.880 you know, 35% of the population, they died at double their demographics. And yet when you insulted

00:35:38.900 them, insulted them, insulted them, and then you kicked others out because of the vaccination,

00:35:43.340 suddenly you're 20, 30,000 people short in the military, but more specifically, you're short of

00:35:49.500 the people who volunteer to go to combat units. And then you now have to write these little

00:35:53.920 Weasley letters. Well, we're sorry about the vaccination. Can you please come back?

00:35:59.800 Well, that's one thing. I mean, Joe Biden's poll numbers, they fell after the disastrous withdrawal

00:36:04.200 from Afghanistan, which let's not forget, included the death of 13 service members because it was so

00:36:09.200 abominably affected. And they've never recovered. If you look back at the polling trends for Joe

00:36:15.460 Biden and his approval, and these Democrats scratching their heads, they don't understand

00:36:19.460 why he's getting beaten so badly by Trump, not to mention the others running for the Republican

00:36:23.100 nomination. It all starts there. And then they wonder why people don't want to sign up for their

00:36:27.440 military. It also starts internationally, Megan. We've never recovered because Vladimir Putin took

00:36:35.740 a long look at that in August of 2021. And that's one of the reasons on February 24th, he thought he

00:36:41.720 could go in without consequences. And to be frank, when we did that, and Iran looked at that, and we

00:36:48.000 were offering, I guess, 1.2 billion per hostage, or the Gazans thought, wow, this Biden administration,

00:36:54.720 they had a Chinese balloon go over the United States with impunity. They were humiliated in

00:36:59.480 Afghanistan. They were taken surprise by Ukraine. They're not going to do anything to us. And Iran

00:37:06.520 can give us all the weapons we want. They won't touch Iran. And we lost deterrence globally. And it's

00:37:12.800 really going to hurt us. It's just the beginning. It's not the end. You point out, I mean, right now,

00:37:18.640 most of these candidates, most politicians will admit that China is our biggest concern,

00:37:22.840 the biggest threat. And what happened last week, we didn't get to this before the Thanksgiving break,

00:37:28.300 but what happened last week was all these business executives gathered out in San Francisco. This was

00:37:33.120 when Gavin Newsom cleaned up San Francisco at the drop of a hat for the Chinese president, but not for

00:37:39.180 his own constituents, not for the people who actually live in San Francisco. And what happened at that

00:37:44.880 meeting? All of these highbrow American chief executives gave the guy now committing a genocide

00:37:55.280 against the Chinese Uyghurs, the Muslims committing a genocide against Muslims, a standing ovation,

00:38:03.480 a standing ovation. Are the pro-Palestinian workers within their organizations going to try to take them

00:38:10.640 down because of what they cheered on? This man who's committing genocide against Muslims? No,

00:38:16.620 it's just Palestine. Why? Because that's Israel. But this spectacle, which we never got to, which just,

00:38:22.720 I can't believe my eyes, American business leaders giving a standing ovation to the Chinese president.

00:38:30.280 Watch it.

00:38:42.360 My God, just FYI, among the American executives gathered there, Apple CEO, Pfizer CEO, FedEx CEO,

00:38:51.060 Salesforce CEO, Boeing CEO, Blackstone CEO, BlackRock CEO, MasterCard's independent board chairwoman.

00:38:58.420 And this is, you know, a who's who in American corporate, in our American corporate structure

00:39:05.840 on their feet, cheering the man. And they're probably aware that the Chinese were probably

00:39:11.140 taping it to see who was clapping and who was present, who wasn't. And then when they have a

00:39:16.260 surprise, when China takes over, and we saw that in the Red Sea this week, when there was a hijacked,

00:39:22.220 supposedly Israeli ship by these terrorists from Yemen. And the Chinese, two frigates just watch the

00:39:28.220 whole thing happen. They didn't respond to any of the SOS calls. It was a United States ship and a

00:39:34.580 Japanese ship that came to the rescue and got rid of the terrorists and saved the ship. And the

00:39:40.020 Chinese were sitting right there and did nothing. And that's what's going to happen if these

00:39:45.040 executives want to really empower China, because they're spending now more than we are. And of

00:39:51.880 course, the service on our national debt, the interest payments are more than our defense budget

00:39:56.620 for the first time in history. But there's going to be a rude awakening when the Chinese start to

00:40:02.040 replace us as the global enforcer of free trade and free communications and stuff, free transits.

00:40:09.940 And their own corporate culture won't survive under a Chinese hegemon. It just won't.

00:40:14.900 They're short-sighted, you know.

00:40:17.360 It's really unbelievable. I mean, it's like, imagine us doing that with the Russians during

00:40:23.700 the Cold War. They know full well what China's doing with its spying on us and its own human

00:40:29.620 rights violations within China. But Apple wants its money, right? They want their Chinese business

00:40:36.140 deals. They want to continue building their iPhones over there. And, you know, all of these guys,

00:40:41.880 it's like they're asking for whatever crumbs they can get, because China's giving money

00:40:45.760 to Americans in order to buy land and buy the movie business and buy this, the bank business here

00:40:53.160 in record numbers. So they want, they've got their own hands out. That's really what we're seeing.

00:40:58.920 And so do the universities. 360,000 students that pay 110% of full tuition. They're the only people

00:41:06.380 who do. And the universities count on them as cash cow. And they give a blind eye to what the

00:41:11.920 Communist Party does when it surveils its own students. And some of them, maybe 1%, which would

00:41:17.660 be about 3,000 plus, are engaged in active espionage against the United States government. But we don't

00:41:23.680 do anything because of the money. And that's a good point. It's the money.

00:41:28.600 It's amazing. I, you know, Mark Cuban came on the show when we first launched. I gave him a hard

00:41:32.420 time for the NBA's and his team's relationship with China, taking money from China, from somebody

00:41:37.340 committing human rights violations when they're out there protesting BLM, BLM, America sucks. We're

00:41:42.120 racist. Say absolutely nothing about China. Look at all those CEOs. He was far from alone. Look at

00:41:47.380 all those CEOs cheering the man behind it. Get a moral compass, get a moral compass that doesn't

00:41:56.380 point true north on the dollar sign or the yen, uh, people. Okay. So stand by. We're going to

00:42:02.120 squeeze in a quick break and we'll come back with the one and only VDH, who stays with us.

00:42:12.420 So Victor out at University of Southern California, not too far away from where you are in

00:42:16.940 California. Um, you've got a USC professor who, Professor John Strauss, who is Jewish and early in

00:42:25.200 November had an interaction with pro-Palestinian students. He walked by them and said, people are

00:42:30.920 ignorant. And then added Hamas are murderers. That's all they are. Everyone should be killed.

00:42:36.660 And I hope they all are. That's what he said in full. Um, and yet a shortened, he says,

00:42:44.860 doctored clip of him was put out and it cuts out all context about Hamas. Take a listen to the

00:42:52.340 that they released on him, this group, trying to make him sound like he wanted students and everyone

00:42:56.740 else dead. So that's what they had him do. But the full thought is all about Hamas saying Hamas are

00:43:13.020 murderers. That's all they are. Everyone should be killed. I hope they all are. Long story short,

00:43:16.220 he was misrepresented. And now what's happened to him is he's getting punished. He's got to teach

00:43:24.520 only from home. The students who misrepresented him and doctored the tape and put it out and caused

00:43:30.940 his reputation to be damaged. No, no problem. Um, they've put him on paid administrative leave.

00:43:36.380 He has to teach his classes online and he's admitting he's very unhappy about this. The

00:43:42.700 academic freedom Alliance has called on the university to immediately reinstate him.

00:43:48.400 But there are two petitions. One has 11,000 signatures saying, please reinstate him.

00:43:53.460 One has 7,000 signatures saying, fire this guy, fire this, the state you, it will come as no

00:43:59.540 surprise to you of American universities today. Yeah. Well, the president of USC is making a

00:44:05.980 judgment and he's thinking in his little brain, uh, who is going to give me the most trouble tomorrow

00:44:12.280 if I weigh a certain way, is it going to be the students and the faculty who are pro-Israel or pro-DEI,

00:44:20.180 pro-Hamas? And he made a very calculated judgment. And that is, I'm going to have a, again, an asymmetrical

00:44:27.320 attitude because I know the Palestinian students are yelling every day from the river to the sea,

00:44:32.720 which is a call for genocide. And I don't do anything about that. And I know, you know,

00:44:37.840 UCLA it's beat the, beat the blank Jew with a pinata and they don't do anything about that there.

00:44:44.440 So they all know what they're doing and they make a calculated judgment of the least,

00:44:48.620 path of least resistance. And they know that if they attack a 70, 72 year old Jewish professor

00:44:54.700 and nobody's going to complain and maybe some donors will call up, but they have a multi-billion

00:45:01.020 dollar endowment. And so that's what they do. And it's moral cowardice. It's happening all over the

00:45:06.340 United States and somebody who goes to a lot of universities and works at one, uh, I can tell you

00:45:12.180 that that's exactly how they feel. They feel that what is going to be the least path, path of

00:45:18.740 difficulty tomorrow. When I wake up, is it to side with Israel or to just be neutral? Or is it to

00:45:25.400 virtue signal your concern for Hamas and Palestine? And they know, they know the calculus and that's

00:45:31.460 how they ask because they have no morality. And by the way, the woman who misrepresented him

00:45:35.160 is this activist Tara Al-Ami, who is the one who, who posted this. And this person has apparently,

00:45:44.400 she apparently lives in Canada. She has actually called for Israelis to die, celebrated their deaths

00:45:49.760 and has been doing it for a long time. In January of 22, she tweeted to an Israeli Jew. We said by all

00:45:55.700 means necessary from the river to the sea, don't give an F whether or not you can swim. In December,

00:46:01.480 2021, she tweeted, they are occupying my land and killing my people. So yeah, I'm going to hope for

00:46:05.640 their death. This is the person we're supposed to be believing. She accurately edited this video

00:46:11.040 and that she's outraged that he allegedly said everyone should be killed. Now that's not what

00:46:16.100 he said, but even by her standards, that's an okay thing to say. What he actually said was Hamas.

00:46:21.560 Then that brings me to Gigi Hadid, another misrepresenter. You remember the youngest

00:46:27.660 Kardashian, Kylie, had to take down her empathy post toward Israel in the wake of 10-7. There was so

00:46:33.340 much pressure on her to pull it. Enter Gigi Hadid, a supermodel of Palestinian descent. She posts,

00:46:39.980 Israel is the only country in the world that keeps children as prisoners of war. And she posts these

00:46:47.980 pictures of these guys, Victor, who are, honestly, they went on a stabbing rampage in a settlement in

00:46:56.440 East Jerusalem. They knifed a security guard. They hit a 13-year-old boy who suffered critical injuries.

00:47:03.340 These poor, it was all on video. But she wants us to condemn Israel. Then she accused them of body

00:47:08.460 harvesting, including present day, of innocent Palestinians. I mean, there's nothing you can

00:47:14.640 say to get you fired from IMG, the modeling company, or from Hollywood, apparently right now,

00:47:20.200 if you are bankable and you actually make people money with your face.

00:47:25.600 Yeah, and she knows that as someone whose family comes from the Middle East, she should read the

00:47:30.720 Hamas charter and what they set out as the parameters for female behavior and what the role of

00:47:36.520 women is. It's to get married, stay home, and produce more jihadists for the cause. And they

00:47:43.080 understand about the dress code and what women's rights are in the Middle East. It's so frustrating

00:47:48.260 to see all of these people who say that they're championing all of these Middle East agendas,

00:47:54.440 and yet they always do it from Western liberality and security and freedom and prosperity. And they

00:48:00.640 never once, just once, just one time say, you know what, I do recognize that I'm in a special place,

00:48:07.140 and that my family or I voted with my feet to reject my Middle Eastern connections and to adopt

00:48:13.800 Western connections because of what they gave me. There's no gratitude. They always interpret our

00:48:19.600 magnanimity as weakness to be exploited, never to be reciprocated with kindness. It's really disturbing.

00:48:25.980 It reminds me of 1930s Germany again. It says nobody's speaking out, and every day it gets worse

00:48:32.680 and worse and worse. They won't pay attention. Victor, got to run. Great to see you. Thanks for

00:48:37.000 being here. We'll be right back with Kelly's Court. Now we turn to Kelly's Court. Right before we went

00:48:46.360 into the Thanksgiving break, Elon Musk's ex, formerly known as Twitter, sued the vile media matters.

00:48:53.780 And there's a disturbing update today in the Derek Chauvin story. My God, did you see,

00:48:58.980 did you hear what happened to him over the weekend? Not only did the U.S. Supreme Court reject his

00:49:05.340 appeal, but something terrible happened to Chauvin. We're going to get to that with some of our

00:49:09.120 favorites, Marsha Clark, lawyer and New York Times bestselling author, and Mark Garagos, trial lawyer

00:49:15.280 and managing partner of Garagos and Garagos. Welcome back, Marsha and Mark, our legal dream team.

00:49:21.420 Nice to see you. How are you? Great to have you both here. I'm great. I love doing this because

00:49:26.940 I get to see Marsha and you. So thank you. We were just talking about that, Megan. It's the only

00:49:33.040 chance to do a whole home week with each other. So I'm happy to be the source of that. Your post

00:49:39.060 Thanksgiving Day host. All right. So let's start with Elon, because he said this was going to be this

00:49:43.600 mega lawsuit, thermonuclear lawsuit against media matters. And just as a quick refresher for those who

00:49:49.820 weren't paying attention last week to this media matters is a disgusting left-wing group whose sole

00:49:54.720 purpose in life is to take down conservatives or anyone who says conservative things or leans

00:49:59.640 conservative or allows conservative exchanges of ideas. I can speak to this person firsthand. I've

00:50:05.600 been their target many, many times. They take completely innocent content or comments and then

00:50:11.720 blow them up into a national story after day, after day, after day, trying to ruin you,

00:50:16.680 trying to ruin you. Um, I can't even tell you how many times it's happened to me and people I know

00:50:21.300 at Fox. So now their target is Elon Musk. And in particular, they're saying that on Twitter,

00:50:27.840 they found blue chip advertisers ads right next to, uh, vile antisemitic content. They wrote quote,

00:50:39.620 X has been placing ads for Apple Bravo, which is owned by NBC universal IBM Oracle and Xfinity,

00:50:48.620 which is Comcast next to content that touts Hitler and his Nazi party. They were reported that IBM

00:50:55.960 subsequently released a statement saying it has suspended all advertising on X while we investigate

00:51:00.140 this entirely unacceptable situation. So this is media matters telling you X is placing ads for these big,

00:51:06.980 big, big blue chip companies next to content touting Hitler and Nazis. Um, Elon Musk sues saying this was

00:51:15.920 an intentional attempt to take down my business. You would not have seen such ads next to such content

00:51:22.400 unless you did what media matters did, which he says involved them creating a false account,

00:51:30.360 then going on and intentionally liking anti-Semitic content, anti-Semitic content, Hitler, Hitler,

00:51:36.580 Hitler, Nazi, Nazi, Nazi, and following the brands, Apple, IBM, infinity, and so on. And then their ads

00:51:45.060 pop up next to your content. They don't, the ads, it's an algorithm. They're not reading in particular,

00:51:50.940 what they're next to. They're recognizing that you like their businesses, you follow their businesses,

00:51:56.520 and then they populate your site. And while Elon Musk and X do a very good job overall of cracking

00:52:03.860 down on truly vile anti-Semitic speech, they're not perfect. You know, they gave the numbers in

00:52:08.620 the lawsuit of just like, I don't know, it was tens of millions of posts, maybe hundreds of millions.

00:52:13.620 And this small, small number get through and media matters blows it up to make it seem like it's

00:52:18.240 everywhere. And Apple's supporting it. These are the three elements or three claims they brought guys

00:52:23.520 tortuous interference with contract, the contract being between X and its advertisers saying media

00:52:29.340 matters tortuously, unlawfully interfered with that contract. Business disparagement, which is

00:52:35.060 basically defaming a corporation. And intentional interference with prospective economic advantage,

00:52:42.500 which requires an economic relationship between X and the advertisers, the defendant's knowledge of it,

00:52:49.420 and intentional acts on the part of the defendant to disrupt that relationship. And then indeed,

00:52:55.420 actual disruption and economic harm to the plaintiff, meaning X. So, Marsha, how do we like

00:53:01.000 these claims in this lawsuit by Elon? He's entitled to make them. Can't say I'm a big fan of media

00:53:08.520 matters myself. I'm just not a fan of cancel culture in general. And I don't like the idea of people

00:53:16.740 setting others up because they don't like their political views or their sociological views,

00:53:21.240 depending on whatever we're looking at, what issue is at hand. That said, they're making the reports

00:53:29.840 that they are, if they're false, and if they are, in fact, jury-rigging it, as you've indicated,

00:53:35.520 that is the claim by Elon Musk, then the lawsuit will expose that. And it would be unfair.

00:53:40.680 I don't like the idea on his part of trying to silence media matters. It seems to me like there's

00:53:48.580 an awful lot of hypocrisy in this, going back and forth. He doesn't like what media matters is

00:53:53.900 saying. Now, if they're doing something nefarious, and if they really are corrupt, as his claims seem

00:54:00.660 to indicate, that's one thing. And he is going to expose it with a lawsuit. He's entitled to do that.

00:54:05.620 And let's find out what the truth is here. Good idea. That said, Elon Musk himself has said things

00:54:11.460 that indicate he has a certain tendency to lean on the anti-Semitic side. And so there is a little bit

00:54:19.360 of fire where the smoke exists to indicate that he might want to put his thumb on the scale in favor

00:54:25.780 of certain kinds of thinking, certain kinds of hate groups. That indicates perhaps he did do what

00:54:33.600 media matters is saying. I don't know. I don't know what the truth is. But they have a he has a right

00:54:38.100 to sue. And they have a right to fight back. But whether or not I really I have to defend. I have to

00:54:44.280 defend him on the anti-Semitic content allegation, because here's what he did. I think you're referring

00:54:49.220 to this tweet. He sparked outrage. This is according to The Hill, when he responded to a user on the

00:54:54.480 platform who claimed, quote, Jewish communities have been pushing the exact kind of dialectical hatred

00:54:59.520 against whites that they claim to want people to stop using against them. And it went on and he

00:55:05.220 responded with, you have said the actual truth. And people were like, oh, my God, what is he saying?

00:55:11.260 Like, this is clearly an anti-Semitic trope that he's responding to. But then he wrote in another post,

00:55:17.460 which I think was an attempt to clarify this, the Anti-Defamation League, which purports to defend

00:55:22.840 against anti-Semitism, but really is very woke and calls everybody a bigot. I mean, everybody

00:55:30.220 who's not in line with their race essentialist views and trans essentialist views and all those

00:55:35.180 views. He said that the Anti-Defamation League unjustly attacks the majority of the West, despite

00:55:40.580 the majority of the West supporting the Jewish people in Israel. So that's what he was trying to

00:55:44.180 say. He's a billionaire. He's a little off sometimes socially. And I will give him the benefit of the

00:55:49.300 doubt in this because I don't see other posts. I don't see like a long history of Elon, you know,

00:55:54.380 flirting with this kind of content. And this is what he says he was trying to raise in the ADL. I

00:56:00.320 mean, there's not a week goes by where they're not calling Tucker Carlson a racist and a bigot and

00:56:06.080 anti-Semite. Like, I mean, and any conservative, you could, I'm sure they called me names. I don't

00:56:10.480 know. Anyway. So, Mark, how do you like the legal claims? Because this isn't really about

00:56:15.840 Elon's tweet. It's about Media Matters claim that X is posting ads for these brands next to content

00:56:25.100 that touts Hitler and Nazis, which may be factually true. It may have happened in the case of this

00:56:31.560 Media Matters user, but he generated it. He caused it to happen. And no social media platform is entirely

00:56:38.740 foolproof. Well, I'll tell you about the legal claims. If you look at the coverage of this lawsuit,

00:56:45.820 they talk to the so-called experts, you know, I say that so-called as we sit here commenting on it,

00:56:53.320 but the so-called experts have been kind of diminishing the claims by saying, why did he

00:56:59.120 file in Texas? Why he's trying, it's got a weak case. So therefore he's picking or choosing his

00:57:05.340 venue. The fact remains that not only does he have lawyers who are former solicitor generals there in

00:57:13.600 Texas, but he's now got the AG fresh off of his vindication in the house there in Texas, Ken Paxton,

00:57:22.180 opening up an investigation. And I will tell you that there was a similar lawsuit here in California

00:57:29.780 a number of years ago, accusing Facebook of this very same thing and having ads that were linked to ISIS

00:57:38.280 ISIS and other kinds of terrorist groups, things of that nature that got legally nowhere in terms of what

00:57:46.580 was said. I think, and for, I disagree with some of the commentators, I think he's laid out a case that will

00:57:54.280 survive what's called a 12B6 or a motion to dismiss initially because he has pointed to what they have done in

00:58:04.280 their methodology. And I think if he's correct that what they've done in the methodology is to kind of

00:58:11.960 jerry-rig this, to use your term, then he gets past the motion to dismiss, and then it'll be interesting

00:58:17.900 once he gets a new discovery. I mean, the thing is, in defamation, you can say something that is

00:58:25.400 factually true within the four squares of the document, but is grossly misleading, right? And that's

00:58:32.780 what he's claiming about their statement. Yes, maybe there was a case in which, thanks to what

00:58:38.280 you did, Media Matters, you were able to see blue-chip brands next to anti-Semitic comment,

00:58:43.080 content, but your statement about us, X, lacks the context that you made it. It was your goal in

00:58:50.800 going on there to create an account that would like enough of that content that that content would

00:58:55.500 be generated over and over and over, and then to follow blue-chip brands, which would then

00:58:59.380 populate your site. I mean, and if you look at the vast, vast experience of users on X, 99% of them

00:59:06.520 do not have that experience, all context left out of your reporting, which was meant to disparage us.

00:59:11.920 And by the way, I'm old enough to remember being a liberal who supported the ACLU, and the ACLU was

00:59:18.600 supporting people who were marching in Skokie, Illinois. So you have to wonder what has just happened

00:59:24.220 to this idea of free speech, and this idea of basically canceling those who are supportive of free speech.

00:59:32.200 Here, you've got what is particularly irksome in this case, is if it's true that they were trying,

00:59:39.940 they were reverse engineering this report, then that should be held accountable, and they shouldn't be able

00:59:47.220 to cloak themselves in the First Amendment, so to speak, if they are demonstrably shown to have

00:59:55.440 created the situation that they're condemning.

00:59:58.840 Well, exactly. I mean, that's the problem with this whole thing, is that we don't know. We don't

01:00:04.200 know. But if what he's saying, as I said before, if what he's saying is true, he's got a lawsuit there,

01:00:09.200 and he could win that lawsuit. And if he's not, I mean, that's a whole different story. And yes,

01:00:13.980 the experts, as Mark said, are saying, oh, he filed in Texas, where there's no real connection

01:00:19.400 to the case on a substantive level. That's true. He gets himself a champion that I don't know that

01:00:26.400 you would necessarily want in Ken Paxson, who, by the way, is still facing charges in civil court,

01:00:31.480 even though he won. Ultimately, he was impeached. He did not. He did get acquitted, and that to me is

01:00:37.020 a political thing, but he's got a lot of baggage himself. I'm not sure he's your best avatar.

01:00:41.680 That said, if Media Matters did indeed set this up, it's a valid lawsuit. Because you're right,

01:00:50.360 Megan, you can be telling the absolute literal truth, but do it in such a way as to make it

01:00:57.480 defamatory because it is so misleading. And that is his allegation. It's a valid allegation. And as

01:01:02.860 Mark said, you get past summary judgment with it. We'll see what happens.

01:01:06.280 You've got your step for that context on that. Media Matters is based, I think, in Maryland or D.C.

01:01:12.640 Elon's company, X, is based in Nevada. So people are wondering why it was filed in the Northern

01:01:17.560 District of Texas. And clearly, he thinks the law and the forum are good for him. I mean, really,

01:01:22.760 all lawyers do that. That's not an unusual tactic.

01:01:26.960 I was going to say, since when is forum shopping verboten? I mean, by the way,

01:01:31.260 every lawyer I know, that's the first thing they say is, what forum and what judge?

01:01:37.320 Yeah. So, I mean, it's not surprising he did that. He wants to hurt them.

01:01:40.760 I'm not going to lie. I'm 100% rooting for him. I hope he takes them down. I am in complete favor

01:01:46.060 of cancellation of Media Matters. You know how many people they've gotten canceled with their

01:01:49.760 lies over the years? I mean, the list is longer than Santa's scroll. They're in the business of

01:01:54.100 canceling only people on the right. It was originally an organization founded in connection with

01:01:58.860 the Hillary Clinton crew, this disgusting man, David Brock, who I cannot stand. And this is their

01:02:07.000 only design, is to hurt conservatives or people on the right or conservative thought. They wanted

01:02:10.660 all of it shut down. And now Elon Musk has found himself in that group because he allows free speech

01:02:16.880 on Twitter in a way, X, that they don't like. I really, I would love, this would be to me like

01:02:22.600 when Gawker was taken down, right, by Peter Thiel. It would be a victory. This is not about free

01:02:27.780 speech of Media Matters. It's about a disgusting, vile organization whose sole business model is to

01:02:32.900 take down other businesses or personalities whose speech it doesn't like. And whether it likes or

01:02:40.120 doesn't like it is based on its politics, the politics of those running Media Matters. I hope

01:02:45.700 your asses are canceled. Team Elon, going to own my bias on that one. Okay. So that's case number one.

01:02:52.760 Let's move forward because there's a lot more to get to. Oh God, this was disturbing. The hockey

01:02:58.620 throat slashing case. Oh my God. I've been looking forward to talking to you guys about this because

01:03:04.460 it's dark and it has some interesting legal angles. So most of our listeners and viewers probably heard

01:03:12.800 about this. It was an American athlete named Adam Johnson who was killed, excuse me, in a hockey

01:03:19.780 accident incident on October 28th. His neck was cut by the skate blade of a man on the opposing team

01:03:30.900 named Matt Petgrave. Matt Petgrave was playing for the opposite team again in Sheffield, England.

01:03:38.640 That's where this happened. And what happened was Matt Petgrave was, he was skating. Okay. Johnson,

01:03:48.360 the victim was skating toward the net and Petgrave on the opposing team skated toward Johnson, collided

01:03:54.700 with another player and Petgrave's legs kicked up, reading out from Time Magazine, as he began to fall.

01:04:03.200 Hold on. We'll watch it here. Legs kick up as he begins to fall, slowing it down.

01:04:09.520 There. Petgrave is in the red and the victim Johnson is in the white. And, um, his neck was slit. Both

01:04:23.160 players fell to the ice. Johnson disturbingly rose up after the injury. It's just, he was not okay.

01:04:31.740 There was blood on his Jersey and he was dead soon thereafter. Um, normally you would look at this

01:04:39.180 and say it was absolutely horrible, but a freak accident. We had this happen in Connecticut just

01:04:45.540 last year. You guys, you know, at high schools nearby where one player did this to another

01:04:51.240 completely accidentally. And there was absolutely no allegation otherwise by anybody. Everybody saw

01:04:58.800 that it was a total accident. So normally we'd look at a case like this and say freak accident.

01:05:02.980 But in this case, people looked at this and said, it didn't look like the freak accident that happened

01:05:09.300 at that Connecticut school. It looked intentional. And you have NF NHL after NHL player or former player

01:05:16.880 come out to say that looked like an intentional kick. He was trying to hurt him. And sure enough,

01:05:23.200 now he is being investigated by officials over in the UK for manslaughter. As I understand it,

01:05:31.540 an arrest, they won't say it's him, but they say this incident has led to the arrest of a man

01:05:36.580 on suspicion of manslaughter. He's been released on bail, but to me, it sounds like he hasn't officially

01:05:43.520 been charged or maybe just not yet indicted. This is the defendant. We believe in the case. So

01:05:49.240 as the former prosecutor, Marsha, how do you like this case? Tough one. It's a tough one. You do have

01:05:55.620 the commentator, as you mentioned, Megan, saying that was a deliberate kick. I'm sure of it, but

01:06:01.540 that that's not a bright line. That's one commentator. And we know that accidents happen in hockey a lot.

01:06:07.980 It's a dangerous sport. You do have the skating blades, you have a hockey sticks, you have every

01:06:13.280 and speed and incredible speed. And then you have ice to fall on. I mean, all of this is a recipe for

01:06:18.880 all kinds of very nasty injuries. And so it's going to be hard. You have to prove gross negligence

01:06:26.500 or you have to prove something, an intentional misdemeanor that created a dangerous, almost

01:06:33.780 fatal situation. And proving that under these circumstances, fast moving game, fast moving

01:06:39.380 action with everybody slipping on the ice, it's not going to be an easy thing unless you get

01:06:44.800 a bunch of experts saying, look at this, that's a deliberate kick. I just don't know. I think it's

01:06:50.800 a tough one.

01:06:52.420 Mm hmm. Mark, just to let you know, Petgrave's former coach, Elmo Atola, said, quote, I coached

01:07:01.160 Matt Petgrave for a very short stint. I wanted to get rid of him immediately. He has no respect for

01:07:05.820 himself or his opponents. He used to get into a bit of a mess. He's a very dirty player.

01:07:10.500 But then the former NHL general manager, Kerry Kaplan, said anybody suggesting this is not an

01:07:16.340 accident either doesn't understand hockey or was not close enough to the situation. Last year,

01:07:21.940 Petgrave, for what it's worth, was the league's most penalized player with 129 infractions in 54

01:07:28.220 games. Right. And I would bet you in those cases that it was clear cut that it was intentional when

01:07:35.680 he was getting penalized. This is anything but clear cut. I kind of I'd even go farther than

01:07:40.700 Marsha and just say it is a freak accident. It doesn't look to rise to the level of criminal

01:07:46.480 prosecution in the game like this to from my eyes. So unless I'm missing something, I understand that

01:07:53.520 there's a great uproar and it's horrible. It's awful. It's tragic. But that doesn't mean that it's

01:07:58.520 criminal. How do you even prove like they say that the authorities over there are saying we've been

01:08:06.140 speaking to highly specialized experts in the field to assist our inquiries. We continue to work closely

01:08:11.320 with the health and safety department at Sheffield City Council. They seem to be trying to do a forensic

01:08:18.640 examination of hockey and what would normally happen. I mean, is that even possible for police

01:08:26.780 to figure that out, Mark? At least in the United States or in specifically in California, you'd be

01:08:33.620 making a Sargon motion, which is basically this is junk science. This shouldn't come in in a civil

01:08:40.640 case, let alone a criminal case. I don't even know how you get to the point where you're so unsure of

01:08:47.000 whether it was intentional or not, that you're hiring experts to opine in an area that I don't even

01:08:53.500 think you could say it would be acceptable or generally accepted scientific principles. I mean,

01:09:00.920 to me, it's just, it's somebody who's struggling to attach liability where there is none. I mean,

01:09:06.860 clearly it's horrific, but everybody called it a freak accident to begin with. Now you're just

01:09:12.740 struggling to make it something else. Yeah. It's kind of hindsight reconstructing and saying,

01:09:18.540 you know, analyzing it second by second, millisecond by millisecond to look for something that happened

01:09:24.740 so quickly. I don't even know how someone could even think that fast. I mean, I have read somewhere

01:09:30.220 that they were saying, oh, his blades could have been unusually sharp, you know, sharper than most

01:09:35.540 blades would have been on his skates. Well, but that also makes you go faster. So how can you say that

01:09:40.920 that's an intentional act that's creating a dangerous condition or knowingly dangerous condition?

01:09:45.360 It seems to me like it's a lot of Monday morning quarterbacking, looking for something,

01:09:49.780 as we say, picking pepper out of fly stuff to look for, you know, something to build a case on.

01:09:57.340 And I don't see, I think Mark is right about the scientific viability of any testing they're

01:10:02.180 going to do. How on earth are you going to have a scientific test that can reconstruct something like

01:10:07.260 this that happened within two seconds and say that you have something that's reliable enough to even

01:10:11.760 put before a jury. So I think that the likelihood of this going forward as a criminal case seems

01:10:17.700 very slim, very dim to me is the UK. So every country has its own standards. But I think I know

01:10:25.380 in California, this probably would not be fought. There was just such outrage over there. And I think,

01:10:31.200 you know, there may be just a need or feeling like we have to respond to the outrage that people are

01:10:36.540 feeling with an investigation. But I mean, he's been arrested. So it's it's more than just an

01:10:40.120 investigation from from the way it sounds. It would be one thing if they found some motive,

01:10:45.040 you know, like these two had a beef. There'd been a threat right before the game. You know,

01:10:49.480 now you're getting closer. But I agree with you, too. So far, even if it was intentional,

01:10:53.880 I don't know whether it was or wasn't. You have to have proof of that. You have to have some proof

01:10:58.400 that there was a decision made that amounted to criminal recklessness. And I just don't know.

01:11:04.620 I will say now they're making the neck guards mandatory, at least at the high school level.

01:11:10.900 Now, I know, because in our in our school, they it's big for hockey, too. And that seems like a

01:11:17.820 good idea. I mean, why wouldn't you hockey? Why wouldn't you do that? Right. Yeah. Why wouldn't

01:11:22.760 you? So I mean, it's just it's very rare. You know, this one happened in 2022 here. It had the last

01:11:28.360 time it happened. I think it was 10 years before that. And the time before that was 10 years before that.

01:11:32.280 Very, very rare. But I mean, if I if my kids played hockey, I would absolutely want this on

01:11:37.440 this kind of protection. All right. So let's move on. New York State is doing something that is.

01:11:43.080 I don't know. It's I bet Mark doesn't like it as the defense or defense lawyer here, but

01:11:48.800 I've never seen anybody do this before where the statute of limitations has run on all these sexual

01:11:54.540 assault claims, but then they open it. Now, I understood when they did that for kids who are

01:11:58.720 the victims of pedophiles like you're a kid, you may not remember it till you get older,

01:12:03.740 you have flashbacks, you get therapy. Even that was criticized. But that one at least made some

01:12:06.940 sense to me. This is like you were an adult. You didn't do anything about it at the time.

01:12:13.180 The statute of limitations ran the doors back open, walk right through it. And boy, are they ever

01:12:18.680 Megan? If I told you how much time I've spent in the last week up until Thursday,

01:12:25.360 so that people understand the statute was set to expire. It was not renewed Thursday at midnight.

01:12:33.380 I spent the entire- What statute? Tell them what you're talking about.

01:12:36.980 It's the Adult Survivors Act, where they revive the statute for assaults that had taken place in

01:12:45.740 some cases back in the 80s and the 90s. I spent the last week, I don't want to say babysitting,

01:12:52.740 but I will tell you, engaged, fully engaged with various clients who were either in the crosshairs

01:13:00.340 or thought they would be in the crosshairs for the- Up until Thursday at 12.15 p.m. or a.m.,

01:13:08.540 I should say, until- Name names.

01:13:11.540 Yeah. No, there's no names. But I will tell you that, and mind you, you saw what happened with Diddy,

01:13:18.580 and I've represented Diddy in the past. And that was every client's worst nightmare is that it would

01:13:28.060 come up, that there were demands that were made, that then you would try to settle, or you would

01:13:32.920 try and get it not filed in some fashion. And then what happened in Diddy's case is once it became

01:13:40.420 public, then there was a pylon after that, with cases that were decades old, if you will. The mayor

01:13:50.500 of New York was also one of the late-breaking cases. There's been about five of them with California-based

01:13:58.980 people here. So it was a week to remember in terms of waiting it out minute by minute until that

01:14:07.620 statute kind of sunset, if you will. I find it, and I know you anticipated this, I find it horrific

01:14:18.220 that you have a situation that's not kids, where somebody can be accused of something. In Eric

01:14:26.200 Adams' case, it was 1993. Axel Rose, I believe, was 1989. I've got others that were 2001, 2003. How are

01:14:34.900 you supposed to defend? The whole idea of a statute of limitations is you're supposed to be able to

01:14:40.320 timely decide or defend yourself. How are you supposed to defend yourself from decades-old

01:14:46.280 allegations? How are you supposed to get witnesses? How are you supposed to get where you were,

01:14:52.220 get itineraries, and put together a defense? To me, it's fundamentally unfair. You could not do it,

01:14:58.920 by the way, in a criminal case. But when you're fighting over other people's money, you can do it.

01:15:04.900 I have to agree. I think, like, we saw this done to Brett Kavanaugh, and it was like,

01:15:09.380 how the hell did he know exactly where he was? I mean, amazingly, he had that date book that actually

01:15:13.840 did give him some waves of defending himself against Christine Blasey Ford. But there is a

01:15:19.580 reason we have the statute of limitations. The defendants are entitled to due process. If you

01:15:24.440 asked me what I was doing 30 years ago, I have no idea. I don't keep date books. I would have

01:15:28.480 zero way of defending myself against any accusations of bad conduct, Marsha. So I do,

01:15:35.960 as much as I feel for these women and their allegations, the due process standard should

01:15:41.320 not allow this passed. You know, we set these statutes of limitations for a reason.

01:15:46.340 Can I ask Marsha a question? Because this is what got in my craw last week, Marsha. And I'd love to

01:15:51.620 know your response. I understand it. If a woman has been wronged, and she's between a rock and a

01:15:59.100 hard place, and she feels like this has been horrific, and this gives her a new opportunity.

01:16:06.100 My problem with this is, why the gold rush in the couple of days before the statute expires?

01:16:12.960 You mean to tell me, out of all of the days of the year, the 365 days of the year, it just so

01:16:19.360 happens that on day 360, that all of a sudden, all of this horrific emotional distress comes to a

01:16:26.260 head, just as the statute's about to expire? I hate to be cynical, but that was kind of my reaction.

01:16:32.440 I must have said that 500 times in the last week.

01:16:36.580 Here's my response to it. I feel badly for the women. I mean, former prosecutor,

01:16:42.200 I do feel that way. I feel like I want them to have their day in court. It's not going to be the

01:16:47.340 same as a criminal case. And the points you raise about the statute of limitations and the ability

01:16:51.960 to defend cases that are that old, how do I reconstruct where I've been, what I've done,

01:16:56.820 who I was with, what might have happened in some instances, so old that it would be very difficult

01:17:03.040 to dredge up a memory if you're the man, but the woman is much more likely to remember this

01:17:09.640 and be traumatized by it and suffer for years as a result of it. In fact, you guys just pulled up

01:17:16.340 the story of Julia Orman, who just filed. She's one of the late filers that Mark remembered,

01:17:23.780 but she's somebody who suffered a real attack, a real attack, forcible oral copulation by Weinstein,

01:17:31.640 and is now suing her agents, the Weinstein Miramax and, I believe, Disney, and as well as CAA. So I

01:17:40.060 think she has a real case there. And the ability to have your day in court after you have suffered

01:17:46.380 terribly and felt that you were being dismissed, no one would look at you, no one would even file

01:17:51.260 the case. You know, prosecutors were not all that wonderful back in the day, and I mean quite a long

01:17:56.360 time ago, and made it very hard to get a case filed. When you didn't have physical evidence,

01:18:01.780 you didn't have corroborating witnesses, they really were responding to the times, the sociological

01:18:07.320 times, where people were very inclined to disbelieve rape claims, and very inclined to say,

01:18:13.100 she's lying, she's making it up, woman scorned, all that sort of thing. And so it was very hard for

01:18:18.300 quite some time to get a case filed, and then very hard for quite some time to get a jury to convict.

01:18:24.300 And we're finally at a place where I think we're starting to understand that women don't

01:18:28.520 necessarily react in the way you expect, and they don't necessarily want to tell a lot of,

01:18:33.200 you know, it's still the most underreported crime. So I want to see these women get their

01:18:37.820 day in court. If they can't make the case, they can't make the case. But we're not talking about

01:18:42.220 criminal sanctions here either. You know, and that's why the concerns about the statute of limitations

01:18:47.600 and the ability to defend are fair concerns, for sure. And, you know, it's going to be

01:18:52.300 a problem in proving the case from the prosecution side of it, plaintiff's side of it,

01:18:58.880 that they say, you know, when this came forward, where would you have been? Why didn't you report

01:19:03.160 it sooner? And why did you wait for this process to the last minute, to the very literally last minute?

01:19:08.860 In particular may raise those questions, because Harvey Weinstein's been out there as a pariah

01:19:12.740 criminally since 2017. I mean, that's really, the Roger Ailes thing happened in 16 at Fox,

01:19:18.940 but nothing happened for another year. And in 17, when the New York Times broke the Harvey Weinstein

01:19:23.740 story, that's when everything exploded with the New Yorker, although all of it.

01:19:28.900 Yeah. So look, all of this is going to come out. I mean, you know, the women are going to be up

01:19:32.880 against it once again, to defend their inability to file earlier and to wait as long as they did,

01:19:38.580 that's going to, you know, be brought out. The men are going to have the problem that they do

01:19:42.580 with proving where they were and what they were thinking of who they were with.

01:19:45.400 All of that's one to shake out eventually, but having me and letting them have their day in

01:19:49.520 court, I am not opposed to this. I think that, damn it, finally, we're getting to the place where

01:19:55.020 we're taking women seriously. I'm for it. So let me, let me walk you through, or the public through

01:20:01.280 our audience, some of these allegations that Julia Orman has levied, because they're interesting.

01:20:06.320 She, she was a huge star. You know, she was in Legends of the Fall with Brad Pitt. She was in,

01:20:12.600 um, what was the movie? She was great. Not Selena, Serena. What was it? You guys remember?

01:20:22.920 I'm Sabrina. Sabrina, Sabrina. That was a great one. Anyway, her star was on the rise.

01:20:29.180 And this is what she alleges. She says that, okay, her career was at a high point in the mid nineties.

01:20:36.500 This is from a Rolling Stone article. When the alleged assault occurred by Harvey Weinstein,

01:20:40.560 she had enjoyed success, uh, on TV and films. I guess she's British. She said she first met

01:20:46.920 Weinstein in 94 to, to discuss, uh, some potential projects and he acted appropriately. They remained

01:20:53.180 in touch. He often sent her scripts, et cetera. Around 1995, as her profile continued to grow with

01:20:58.540 movies such as Sabrina, there it is in first night, she started working with, uh, Brian Lord and Kevin

01:21:04.320 Huvain at CAA. Now, Kevin Huvain was my agent too. In August of that year, according to the lawsuit,

01:21:12.280 Lord and Huvain secured Ormond and her production company, a deal with Weinstein's Miramax,

01:21:17.880 even though she alleges they allegedly knew very well about his propensity for sexually

01:21:23.420 assaultive and exploitative behavior. It's relevant because she's suing CAA too. Ormond subsequently

01:21:29.580 moved from England and New York, where she started living in an apartment paid for by Miramax by the end

01:21:33.480 of 95. She was in talks to star in one of their productions. She claims Weinstein was not interested

01:21:39.580 in discussing business at a dinner that happened, I think in 95, December, 95, insisting they discuss

01:21:44.820 it later. She claims he purchased multiple alcoholic drinks for her, eventually said they could discuss

01:21:49.180 business back at the apartment. He allegedly said I'm paying for Ormond recalled being too inebriated to

01:21:54.540 even put her keys in the door to open it when they returned inside the apartment. She claimed he agreed

01:21:59.040 to pay for the Africa trip she needed to go on, then disappeared. She eventually found him in the

01:22:03.640 bedroom where he had stripped down to his underwear. Hello, this was a thing with this guy. It's called

01:22:08.260 a pattern. I've interviewed so many of his victims. This is one of his things. Blindsided, Ormond made

01:22:14.880 clear to Weinstein that she did not want to do anything sexual with him because literally no person on

01:22:19.520 earth who's sane would want to. That was my editorializing. But Weinstein broke down, pleaded,

01:22:24.180 continued to remove his underwear and ignored her protests, says the lawsuit. Lying face down on the

01:22:29.020 bed, he persuaded Ormond to massage him. Shortly after, he rolled over and started masturbating. At

01:22:33.320 that time, she froze. Weinstein then removed her trousers, climbed on top of her and continued to

01:22:38.960 masturbate. He then forced her to give him oral sex. After some time, he got off her and left the

01:22:44.280 apartment. She says a few weeks later, in January of 96, she confronted him. She said your contact was

01:22:50.200 completely unacceptable. She wouldn't tolerate it. He knew what he did was wrong. And then she started

01:22:54.440 to see signs he was retaliating against her. The way that Miramax executives were treating employees

01:22:59.280 of her production company, when she reached out to Lord and Houvain at CAA for help, she told them

01:23:04.380 about the alleged assault. She claims neither expressed any surprise nor any empathy, that they

01:23:12.020 focused on the assault from his perspective, asking whether he might have believed she had consented,

01:23:15.920 suggested that it was his perception of the event, not her actual lack of consent that legally

01:23:21.720 mattered. Again, these are her allegations. They deny it. Lord and Houvain and CAA and Weinstein

01:23:26.960 also. Furthermore, the suit says Lord and Houvain of CAA told Ormond if she took her allegation to

01:23:31.580 the cops, she may not be believed. She risked further angering Weinstein and cautioned her against telling

01:23:36.780 others lest she be sued by him for libel. They said you could get a lawyer and seek a settlement,

01:23:41.620 but you should not expect more than a hundred thousand dollars, the going rate for being

01:23:46.800 sexually assaulted by Harvey Weinstein, her allegation. She didn't pursue any action and said

01:23:52.540 Weinstein continued to retaliate against her. And she said both Weinstein and CAA then ruined her

01:24:00.060 career. That's what she's alleging, that they basically decided she was damaged goods. And that's

01:24:05.080 why we didn't see or hear more from and of Julia since. I mean, she's gotten roles for sure, but

01:24:12.760 she's saying for a good decade plus, they stymied her. And if so, that would be illegal. Again,

01:24:18.320 they all deny it. CAA says it's hired Paul Weiss, same law firm that looked into the Roger Ailes

01:24:23.340 allegations and that they didn't find any there there. Now they, they confess though, they hired

01:24:28.380 Paul Weiss to defend them, not, not to do an independent objective investigation. So surprise,

01:24:34.780 surprise, their lawyers on their payroll exonerated them when, when charged with defending the company.

01:24:41.120 Um, it's dark, it's disturbing. And I have to say, it's my opinion, Marsha. I believe every word of it,

01:24:45.720 every word I believe, but I don't know that it goes anywhere. What do you think?

01:24:52.060 Well, I, that's the question, you know, and a good one because yeah, I, I believe it too. And

01:24:57.520 there's a reason why we believe it. We've heard this is cookie cutter, you know, this behavior,

01:25:01.860 the pattern on everyone's part that you've just described so well, um, is exactly what happens,

01:25:07.360 whether they're movie stars or just regular people. Um, they're told they're not going to be

01:25:11.900 believed they're dissuaded in so many ways and everybody takes them out. Well, it was just you

01:25:16.200 misinterpreting him and you put yourself there and then victim blaming and all the rest of it.

01:25:21.080 And then of course, as an actress, your, your career gets killed and she did drop out of sight.

01:25:25.660 This was a rising star who was looking like she was going to go all the way. She was phenomenal.

01:25:30.320 And I was a big fan and, and yes, I'm, I'm sure it did destroy her in so many ways. Um,

01:25:35.920 they have the power to do it. What happens in a lawsuit, what happens in court can be a different

01:25:41.360 story. And that's why I was acknowledging the problems with defending this lawsuit for the defense

01:25:46.740 side is going to be brought out. How am I supposed to defend myself now? That is going to get some

01:25:51.500 sympathy from the jurors, the inability for some of the victims to remember all of the details,

01:25:56.380 to explain themselves, to explain why they took so long to come forward. Some like Julia Ormond

01:26:00.940 will have some very good reasons for it in terms of just her career and all of the people piling on

01:26:06.500 to tell her, stop it. Don't do it. Don't do it. Um, and that's going to be pretty compelling at the

01:26:10.980 end of the day though. I don't know how this shakes out. You have to be willing to step up, step forward

01:26:16.660 and take your shot and just say, I'm glad to be able to tell my story. At least I'm not being

01:26:21.360 muffled. At least I'm not being, um, gagged anymore. And that's an important thing. I think

01:26:27.120 for all of these, you know, in his case though, Mark, she's got, she's got a decent shot. It's like

01:26:32.640 if he's, if he takes the stand, as you know, in New York, they're letting quote prior bad acts come in

01:26:38.400 against you. That's one of the reasons he got convicted in the first place. They're letting prior

01:26:41.940 allegations of bad behavior come in to show pattern, especially in a case like this. This

01:26:46.680 is our pal, Arthur Idoll has been representing Weinstein. He represented him in the New York trial

01:26:50.440 trying to say, this is bullshit. You shouldn't allow those prior claims to come in, but you

01:26:53.980 definitely can allow prior convictions of sexual assault and rape to come in. He's got a bunch of

01:26:58.820 those now too. So it's going to be tough with this beautiful actress whose name everybody knows

01:27:03.800 up against this troll, Harvey Weinstein, who's literally now in prison for him to be like, I didn't do it.

01:27:09.720 Well, I don't, look, you're never going to get Harvey on the stand. Number one, number two,

01:27:15.900 the idea that I want to go back to the one, the thing that shows you what a nerd I am,

01:27:23.600 the idea that they've hired a firm that's going to do the investigation that ends up defending you at

01:27:30.020 the same time. You know, that was, if that was a small firm or a solo practitioner, they'd tell you

01:27:36.480 that you were conflicted and report you to the state bar, how, how you can hire a firm,

01:27:41.920 have them do an independent investigation and then defend you. And I've been, I've been in that

01:27:48.560 situation. I can't tell you how many times here in Los Angeles where with friends of mine who are at

01:27:54.500 the big firm. And I'm asking them, of course, I mean, how are you not going to find that the

01:28:00.200 university or that the institution you're representing didn't do anything wrong when

01:28:06.180 you're now defending them after we filed suit? So that's the part of this that really irks me.

01:28:12.820 I don't think that you're ever going to see CAA and Harvey ever take this to trial. It'll get,

01:28:18.480 the insurance companies will jump in and get involved in it. It'll get settled.

01:28:21.640 I will say this about CAA to Marsha's point a second ago. So I mentioned Kevin Huvane was my

01:28:28.760 agent at CAA for a while and he represented Meryl Streep among many, many others.

01:28:36.720 Um, at the time Meryl Streep took to the Oscar stage, having won one of her many, um, and said

01:28:46.640 the following about Harvey Weinstein. So, okay, there she, Julia Orman is alleging that CAA

01:28:52.640 discouraged Orman from making a claim against Harvey Weinstein saying really it's his perspective

01:28:59.780 that matters most. And we're supposed to believe their defense that no, it didn't happen, but

01:29:05.800 this is Kevin Huvane's probably best known client Meryl Streep at the Oscars about Harvey Weinstein.

01:29:12.440 Watch. So I just want to thank my agent, Kevin Huvane and God, Harvey Weinstein.

01:29:28.940 This is what she was up against, Marsha. This is what Julia Orman is going to be able to tell the

01:29:34.000 jury she was up against. They were all thick as thieves. And one actress who had starred in a

01:29:40.720 couple of movies didn't count. Well, so didn't count. There was no way she was going to be heard.

01:29:48.480 She was going to be drummed out as you know, she probably was in many ways, uh, given what she

01:29:53.560 could have been. So, I mean, if you're talking about a career loss, you're talking about a life

01:29:58.460 in so many ways ruined, I really do hope that she has found a way past it. And I hope this lawsuit

01:30:04.160 helps her to do that as I hope that does for all of these women. And, but you're right. Look at

01:30:09.000 look at the debt that was stacked against her. I mean, that's enormous, enormous. I don't know

01:30:14.380 how anyone comes out and says, no, listen to me. No one would listen to her. So they would turn off

01:30:19.780 her mind. She had no power and she was up against quote God, uh, before we take a break, others who

01:30:27.460 have been sued on these last minute filings, Eric Adams sued for an alleged sexual assault. He says he

01:30:32.900 literally doesn't even know this woman. He's never met her in his life. Um, Axel Rose accused by a

01:30:38.900 woman of being raped by him back at a hotel room. She's got details, but 30 years ago, uh, Mark

01:30:45.560 mentioned Sean Combs. He's got, I think by latest count, three allegations of rape or sexual assault

01:30:51.760 against him. Very detailed women alleging a pattern of alleged drugging and then rape. One woman says

01:30:58.580 when he came to visit her, to tell her to stop these allegations, he choked her to the point she

01:31:03.380 passed out. These are all allegations, which he vehemently denies, but these are the cases that

01:31:08.560 are going to be in the news over the next year or two. Thanks to the extension of this statute of

01:31:13.660 limitations. When we come back, Mark's neighbors accused of serial killing. No, it's not, but somebody

01:31:21.540 very well known accused of killing three people. And it has to do once again with Hollywood agents

01:31:28.180 stand by for more on that. Hey everyone. It's me, Megan Kelly. Mark your calendars. News nation,

01:31:33.940 Sirius XM December 6th at a live primetime event. The news nation, Republican primary debate,

01:31:40.440 Sirius XM's Megan Kelly returns to the moderator seat. I'll ask the questions you want to hear real

01:31:46.180 issues, tough questions, every contender, because if you want to be the leader of the free world,

01:31:50.840 you better be ready to give America the answers they're looking for.

01:31:54.480 Live from the University of Alabama, the News Nation Republican primary debate,

01:31:59.140 moderated by Sirius XM's Megan Kelly and News Nation's Elizabeth Vargas.

01:32:03.500 December 6th, 8 p.m. Eastern. Watch it on News Nation, America's fastest growing cable news network.

01:32:09.820 Find News Nation on your screen at joinnn.com or listen on Sirius XM Triumphs Channel 111.

01:32:15.540 Go to Sirius XM dot com slash MK show to subscribe and get three months free. Offer details apply.

01:32:22.080 The News Nation Republican primary debate. See you on the debate stage. To find News Nation on your TV,

01:32:27.580 go to joinnn.com.

01:32:29.940 Derek Chauvin stabbed in prison and it looks like it was pretty severe. Um, they say he's stable,

01:32:42.960 but they had to use life-saving efforts. EMS was requested. He was transported to a local hospital.

01:32:50.120 Very annoying that the Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison, who prosecuted him,

01:32:56.380 was notified about the attack, but Derek Chauvin's family was not. And this, at the same time,

01:33:02.940 the U.S. Supreme Court declined to hear his appeal. So he's been sentenced. He's going to

01:33:06.440 have to serve out his, what, 23-year-old, three-year sentence. And yet he's a walking target.

01:33:12.580 Is there anything that can be, he can't spend 23 years in solitary, Mark. So what can be done to

01:33:18.560 protect him or any former law enforcement officer who winds up going to jail?

01:33:22.920 I, you know, I'm actually, I know this is morbid and somewhat cynical. I'm surprised he's lasted as

01:33:29.120 long as he has, frankly. Uh, he's a, you know, other than child molesters, police officers, especially

01:33:36.020 somebody as notorious as this, do not have a long shelf life in prison. I had thought maybe because

01:33:42.900 it was the federal system, it would be different. And I think his calculation was one of the machinations

01:33:49.240 they went through in terms of getting sentenced federally was so that he could serve his time

01:33:54.840 federally or in a federal facility thinking or the expectation that would be safer. Obviously,

01:34:00.800 it didn't pan out.

01:34:01.860 They're not a bunch of nice guys there either. Marsha, is there anything that can be done for

01:34:06.280 former law enforcement? You know, love him, hate him, think he was wrongly convicted or not. Derek

01:34:10.700 Chauvin deserves not to be killed while in prison. And yet I'm sure he is target number one. We

01:34:16.740 profiled the fall of Minneapolis, the latest documentary, offering a lot more to this story

01:34:22.160 than people may know. I'd hate to think that that documentary had anything to do with what happened

01:34:27.800 because in it for the first time, he gives an interview and he says he thinks this whole thing was a

01:34:31.160 sham. What can be done?

01:34:34.880 It is an ongoing problem. This is not a new issue that they always face. When a police officer gets

01:34:40.540 in prison, they're in incredible danger, incredible danger from everyone. And you're right,

01:34:47.920 they can't spend their whole lives in solitary. And so you do want to put extra detail on them. You do

01:34:53.940 want to have them in a location that is the most likely to be safe for them. But there's no such thing

01:35:00.360 as perfection. And as you can see, you can take every precaution and still wind up in a situation

01:35:06.480 like this because they're imperiled from all sides. All right. Lastly, real quick, Sam Haskell,

01:35:12.520 Hollywood royalty, I'm told, has a son, right, who was also Sam Haskell. And Mark, he allegedly killed

01:35:22.080 his wife and her parents and was very bad at hiding the evidence. What's the story?

01:35:28.360 Well, the worst part about this is it looks like he was apprehended, or at least is the subject of

01:35:35.320 the accusations because he was trying to hire day laborers to take out the garbage bags that were

01:35:41.260 filled with body parts. And then when they protested, he said it was a Halloween prank. This is obviously

01:35:47.100 somebody who's suffering from some extreme mental infirmities. And if any of this is true, it's a

01:35:55.860 horrific story.

01:35:57.540 I mean, I laugh because of what a bungler he is. But this is truly horrific. This is as dark as it gets,

01:36:04.220 Marsha.

01:36:05.140 Yeah, it is. And the workers were the ones that called 911. It does sound to me like there's mental

01:36:10.700 disturbance here as well. It's just so bizarre.

01:36:13.520 Beyond. Well, we'll see whether he tries to rely on that because he's arrested and in a lot of

01:36:19.420 trouble. And those three workers are going to testify against him. He tried to say they were

01:36:23.160 carrying out something else. And then they thought the bags did not, they were not hard enough to be

01:36:29.220 the other thing he said they were. And they smelled a rat into their credit. They did something about

01:36:34.260 it. Thank you both so much. And I'll see you all tomorrow.

01:36:37.480 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - November 27, 2023

Biden Takes Credit for Hostage Deal, and Elon's Media Matters Lawsuit, with Victor Davis Hanson, Marcia Clark, and Mark Geragos ｜ Ep. 675

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