The Megyn Kelly Show - ＂Bombshell＂ Testimony Dud, and Biden and Trump in 2024, with Andrew Klavan and Stephen L. Miller

00:00:00.480 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:00:11.700 Hey, everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:15.020 We have a big show lined up for you today, but I want to start with why the woman all over the news today,

00:00:22.460 25-year-old White House aide Cassidy Hutchinson did not deliver the bombshell that many now claim she did yesterday.

00:00:32.020 OK, let's talk about her testimony. The January 6th committee called its star witness yesterday in its case against Donald Trump.

00:00:39.800 With all due respect to Ms. Hutchinson, I remain unmoved.

00:00:44.060 I will start with this. As many of you may recall, I raised questions about Donald Trump's temperament to be president

00:00:50.620 at a debate back in 2015. I think that was a fair issue then, and I think it was at the root of why he lost in 2020.

00:00:59.460 I also think his temperament problems were evident in how he reacted to his 2020 loss, including before and on January 6th.

00:01:07.140 He lost, he couldn't take it, and he embarrassed himself and the nation with his behavior. That's my take.

00:01:13.420 But what's happening on Capitol Hill is a very long sleight of hand.

00:01:17.160 This committee has one goal and only one goal, stop Donald Trump from running again in 2024.

00:01:23.560 They're worried he could win. They absolutely loathe him, and they will do what it takes to stop his political resurrection.

00:01:32.520 Just look at the makeup of the committee. No Trump defenders, not a single Trump ally, no objective trier of fact.

00:01:40.500 We talked earlier this month about how they doctored the riot video and the Trump soundbites used at this hearing.

00:01:48.280 And if this committee would just be honest about its mission, I might be more invested.

00:01:52.440 I might be more interested. Instead, it cloaks itself in sanctimony, purporting to be a fair-minded, down-the-middle finder of fact,

00:01:59.380 just looking to get to the truth of January 6th.

00:02:02.460 It's a lie. And they prove every time they get together that it's a lie.

00:02:07.420 Which leads us to Cassidy Hutchinson, aide to Trump's chief of staff, Mark Meadows.

00:02:14.380 Her testimony is causing Democrats and the press to collapse onto their fainting couches today.

00:02:21.040 And we are going to go through her major points one by one.

00:02:23.800 First, she testified that President Trump allegedly knew that those trying to get into his rally on January 6th had weapons and that he did not care.

00:02:35.720 I was in the vicinity of a conversation where I overheard the president say something to the effect of,

00:02:40.340 you know, I don't effing care that they have weapons.

00:02:43.780 They're not here to hurt me. Take the effing mags away.

00:02:46.820 Let my people in. They can march to the Capitol from here.

00:02:49.420 Let the people in. Take the effing mags away.

00:02:51.640 Mags, meaning the magnetometer. Stop screening them.

00:02:55.160 They're not going to hurt me.

00:02:56.800 Trump didn't care that some were trying to attend his rally,

00:03:00.560 were armed because they weren't going to hurt him.

00:03:04.180 That's the claim. If true, it's certainly callous.

00:03:06.840 He wasn't the only person at risk that day.

00:03:09.220 But what actually happened in this case?

00:03:11.540 Did the Secret Service stop screening the people?

00:03:14.020 Were they let in?

00:03:15.400 No one has suggested that.

00:03:17.380 In any event, did anyone think prior to yesterday

00:03:20.360 that Trump saw the crowd later fighting with Capitol Hill police on TV that day

00:03:25.080 and thought totally law abiding citizens who pose zero danger or threat to anyone?

00:03:29.720 Of course not. He knew he knew that they were potentially dangerous.

00:03:33.080 We knew he knew and he did nothing to stop it because he clearly liked what they were doing.

00:03:37.580 That's awful, but it's not a new stop the presses bombshell.

00:03:42.440 Moreover, there is a real question about whether Trump even actually said what Ms. Hutchinson's testimony suggests.

00:03:52.600 All right.

00:03:52.860 If you listen to her full testimony, you will hear that what she actually claims was she was in the vicinity,

00:04:01.000 quoting, of, quote, a conversation where she, quote, overheard President Trump say something, quote,

00:04:08.400 to the effect of, I don't care that they have weapons.

00:04:11.640 A lot of qualifiers in there.

00:04:13.780 She was near a conversation, not involving her, where she overheard something to the effect of.

00:04:19.940 A first-year law student could have driven a truck through the holes in that testimonial.

00:04:24.300 Unfortunately, none was present yesterday, never mind a full-fledged lawyer presenting Donald Trump's defense

00:04:31.740 or even just pressing the witness on certain problems with her testimony.

00:04:36.360 I'm not calling her a liar.

00:04:37.700 I'm saying there were problems that any defense lawyer would have exploited.

00:04:41.760 Indeed, Trump has had no defense at all at any one of these hearings or the depositions leading up to them.

00:04:46.780 Okay, second, Ms. Hutchinson claims that Trump, after that rally, got in his presidential limousine known as the Beast,

00:04:56.580 demanded to go to the Capitol, and had a physical altercation with his driver when the driver refused to take him.

00:05:04.380 The president said something to the effect of, I'm the effing president, take me up to the Capitol now.

00:05:10.220 To which Bobby responded, sir, we have to go back to the West Wing.

00:05:17.120 The president reached up towards the front of the vehicle to grab at the steering wheel.

00:05:24.000 Mr. Engel grabbed his arm, said, sir, you need to take your hand off the steering wheel.

00:05:30.160 We're going back to the West Wing.

00:05:32.560 We're not going to the Capitol.

00:05:33.900 Mr. Trump then used his free hand to lunge towards Bobby Engel.

00:05:39.900 And when Mr. Ornato had recounted this story to me, he had motioned towards his clavicles.

00:05:46.120 Okay.

00:05:47.280 Does anyone really believe that Trump reached for the wheel of the beast and then tried to essentially strangle his security?

00:05:54.680 I mean, please.

00:05:56.620 Here again, Ms. Hutchinson was not a party to the actual exchange.

00:06:00.480 A man named Tony Ornato got the story from Bobby Engel, head of Trump's security detail, who was in the car at the time.

00:06:09.060 All right.

00:06:09.260 So Engel was there and he apparently told it to Ornato, who told it to Ms. Hutchinson.

00:06:15.760 Ornato, when he told Hutchinson, I will say this, that guy, Bobby Engel, was there.

00:06:20.320 So that helps her testimonial.

00:06:21.960 But here again, she paraphrases.

00:06:23.460 If you listen to her full testimonial, she goes on and says, well, the president said something to the effect of.

00:06:30.480 I'm the effing president.

00:06:31.620 Take me up to the Capitol.

00:06:33.220 What does that mean?

00:06:34.200 He said it or he didn't.

00:06:35.140 What does that mean?

00:06:35.700 Something to the effect of.

00:06:36.940 Which words are you unsure of?

00:06:39.000 Effing?

00:06:39.740 Take me to the Capitol.

00:06:40.880 Why can't you remember, Ms. Hutchinson?

00:06:42.700 Why do you keep saying to the effect of and recounting all of these conversations to this committee?

00:06:48.580 Which, by the way, Ms. Hutchinson did throughout her two-hour testimony yesterday.

00:06:53.220 Her memory appeared to be rather shaky.

00:06:56.480 Listen.

00:06:56.620 Then Tony had relayed to me, something to the effect of where I overheard the president say

00:07:02.640 something to the effect of, something to the effect of, Mr. Cipollone said something

00:07:08.040 to the effect of, the president said something to the effect of, and he said something to

00:07:12.960 the effect of.

00:07:13.980 Something to the effect of.

00:07:15.140 And I remember Pat saying to him something to the effect of and Pat said something to the effect of and very clearly had said this to Mark.

00:07:27.640 Something to the effect of. I remember Pat saying something to the effect of and Mark had responded something to the effect of.

00:07:36.200 Something to the effect of. You remember it very clearly. Then tell us what it was.

00:07:39.640 Not to the effect of. What exactly? What were the words used? Tell us.

00:07:42.480 last night the driver and Mr. Engel the head of Trump security reportedly disputed Miss Hutchinson's

00:07:49.260 claims about that alleged confrontation with Trump in the beast though they reportedly admit

00:07:54.820 that Trump was angry he couldn't go to the Capitol they unlike Miss Hutchinson have

00:07:59.760 firsthand knowledge of what happened in that car why won't the committee let us hear from them

00:08:03.280 also here again is it really a surprise that Trump wanted to go to the Capitol

00:08:07.860 he promised to do exactly that openly and on the record in his rally speech we've all heard it a

00:08:12.680 million times many wondered since then why he never actually did it and knowing the reason namely that

00:08:17.260 the secret service refused to take him is new and somewhat interesting but is it really all that

00:08:22.280 damning to Trump whose goal we have always understood was to go number three Miss Hutchinson

00:08:28.900 testified that later back at the White House Mark Meadows the chief of staff her boss told the White

00:08:34.800 House counsel Pat Cipollone that Trump was totally indifferent to the crowd's hostility toward Mike

00:08:39.520 Pence who was on Capitol Hill they're literally calling for the vice president to be effing hung

00:08:45.380 and Mark had responded something to the effect of you heard him Pat he thinks Mike deserves it he

00:08:52.160 thinks Mike deserves it here again listen to the full thing her testimony's full of qualifiers

00:08:57.080 she heard Cipollone the White House counsel say quote something to the effect of we need to do

00:09:03.200 something more their count they're calling to hang Mike Pence and then Meadows allegedly responded

00:09:09.200 something to the effect of he thinks Mike deserves it this is these are her words then the White House

00:09:14.620 counsel said something like this is crazy etc how sure are you madam what words can't you remember

00:09:20.620 why what specifically did the White House counsel say what specifically to Mark Meadows say in response

00:09:25.060 this is a big conversation you're not sure you didn't write it down you're 25 you're 24 years old

00:09:30.020 this is a big moment why wouldn't you take a note why not or if you did where are they were they

00:09:35.900 produced can we see them let me see them right now do they refresh your memory and by the way what if

00:09:41.620 any prejudices does Miss Hutchinson have against Mr. Trump not impugning her again she seemed like a

00:09:46.860 very nice young woman to me but Trump is now claiming that this woman wanted to move with his team to

00:09:52.560 Florida continue working for him after his term ended but was rejected suggesting this is about sour

00:09:58.480 grapes and if she really was so horrified as she claimed yesterday by January 6th and his behavior

00:10:03.380 and the tweet stuff about Mike Pence did she actually apply to go with him to Florida after that is that

00:10:08.160 true I have no idea no one asked her because no one is there to defend Trump or provide any semblance

00:10:14.400 of balance or fairness but even giving Miss Hutchinson the benefit of the doubt is anyone surprised to

00:10:20.420 learn that Trump was not feeling particularly loyal to or protective of Mike Pence on January 6th

00:10:26.300 when the crowd was chanting they wanted him hanged Trump sent out a tweet condemning Pence it was

00:10:33.120 totally outrageous and it garnered a ton of news coverage this testimony offers some behind the

00:10:38.780 scenes color but that's about it and then finally Miss Hutchinson testified that Rudy Giuliani and Mark

00:10:44.560 Meadows both sought pardons from Trump for their actions or inaction on January 6th color me shocked

00:10:50.720 they knew what had happened inside that White House they knew it was inexcusable and they wanted to get

00:10:56.160 out of jail free card after not doing more to stop it okay none of this reflects well on Donald Trump

00:11:01.760 does anyone think January 6th reflects well on Trump but there's no need to pretend that this is some

00:11:07.680 earth-shattering game changer it's additional flavor on an already cooked meal the attempt to claim

00:11:14.420 otherwise comes from people who already loathed Trump I actually think I'm in a unique spot

00:11:20.720 on this front I feel no need to defend Trump or his character as my audience knows but I know a

00:11:26.500 sham trial when I see one and this is not justice it is not fair and it is not to be trusted joining me

00:11:33.760 now Andrew Klavan host of the Andrew Klavan show for the daily wire and is also a best-selling author

00:11:39.320 and his most recent book which is amazing is titled the truth and beauty how the lives and works of

00:11:45.560 England's greatest poets point the way to a deeper understanding of the words of Jesus

00:11:50.740 thank you so much for being with us again today Andrew great to have you it's great to see you

00:11:58.980 Megan I love that opening remind me never to get cross-examined by you on the stand I think I think

00:12:05.800 you pointed to exactly what the problem with this these hearings is it's the lack of any kind of cross-

00:12:13.220 cross-examination any kind of fine fact finder of truth any objectivity and what's so distressing

00:12:19.160 about it is the way the press even some of the right-wing press like the Wall Street Journal and

00:12:24.280 some of the people on Fox News are using this the term well yes it's a show trial but there is no but

00:12:30.260 there is no but after that sentence it's a show trial and you're absolutely right about Trump and

00:12:34.920 you're absolutely right about January 6th it reminds us all that Trump Trump is a tragic character

00:12:39.800 because the very belligerence and narcissism that gave him the power to fight back against the press

00:12:45.260 and the deep state and the Democrat machine made him just a rude and abusive person who the voters

00:12:52.200 ultimately rejected because of that and it's it's sad to remember that but on January 6th he put the

00:12:57.720 these weapons in the hands of his enemies and they're using them but they're using them incompetently

00:13:02.460 because they're just so hungry to destroy him that's right these these are points Ron DeSantis can raise

00:13:08.940 if he's fighting against Trump or the primary or whoever the Democrat I don't know if it's going

00:13:14.000 to be Biden uh is if they wind up running against Trump in the general these are points for them to

00:13:18.660 raise totally fair points you can you can spin you can get political you can hold no to account for

00:13:23.520 all this but what what offends me as a lawyer and as a citizen is this committee trying to pretend

00:13:29.000 that it's some objective finder of fact because they have two never Trumpers who hate Trump even more

00:13:34.540 than the Democrats on the committee doing their bidding so they can call it bipartisan uh and not

00:13:40.160 a single Trump defender so this woman would have benefited from from some cross-examination maybe

00:13:45.920 she would have done fine maybe she would have said I'm sorry that's a verbal tick to the effect of I

00:13:51.740 always do that no these were the actual words thank you for making me clarify or maybe she could have

00:13:57.480 responded to no there's no sour grapes I never did apply to go with Trump to Florida that's a lie

00:14:01.980 and um you know I didn't want to continue whatever well we won't know because of the way this committee

00:14:07.640 handles itself and where is their moral standpoint you they're accusing him of an insurrection at the

00:14:13.720 same time uh they're calling the Supreme Court illegitimate telling people to take to the streets

00:14:18.460 because duly appointed justices have made a decision that they don't like uh they they coddled the

00:14:24.040 rioters of after George Floyd's death uh encouraged them not just coddled them they encouraged them uh 25

00:14:29.660 people died billions of dollars worth of damage done by violence and uh they kept telling us the news

00:14:35.340 kept telling us it was mostly peaceful uh and now they're basically claiming that this act of idiocy

00:14:41.820 on January 6th and there's just no other way to characterize it as a total act of stupidity

00:14:46.960 is somehow uh the worst thing since the Civil War it's it reminds me of like the Reichstag fire you know

00:14:53.920 where somebody actually did set the Reichstag on fire but Hitler used that to uh to close down the

00:14:59.600 government to close down people's freedoms I'm not comparing them to the Nazis just the cat the

00:15:03.920 strategy of taking this essentially uh minor but horrific uh incident and turning it into

00:15:12.060 a second revolution it just wasn't it just wasn't that and this poor woman I agree with you I feel for

00:15:18.600 her she's 25 now which means during the time she's describing she was 23 or 24 uh the press keeps calling

00:15:25.600 her a top aide it's hard for me to believe that a 23 year old who's essentially just out of college

00:15:30.280 uh would be a top aide uh it's hard for me to believe that she was privy to too much of uh what

00:15:35.820 was going on and as as you pointed out every almost everything she said was hearsay and and nobody said

00:15:42.400 anything about it my question now because there were reports for instance that the uh Secret Service

00:15:48.280 wants to deny the absolutely absurd story of Trump in the car uh you know are they going to let

00:15:56.900 Secret Service testify is that even going to make it onto the air and if it doesn't what does that mean

00:16:01.800 about all the journalists saying it's a show trial but if they can't even come in and say the this story

00:16:07.360 is absolutely untrue I'm the driver I'm the guy it didn't happen if they can't do that what's the point

00:16:13.480 of her testimony at all that you're you're exactly right there's a reason in a courtroom you don't

00:16:18.400 allow hearsay it's considered unreliable if I want to report to you what you know my neighbor said

00:16:24.760 they they don't want me to be able to do that they want me to have to put the neighbor on they want to

00:16:29.800 hear from the neighbor to hear exactly what the neighbor said and the more it's like the game of

00:16:34.580 telephone the more links you have between the actual speaker of the conversation and the person

00:16:39.320 sitting on the witness stand the less reliable it is and you know you could hear that in her

00:16:44.180 testimonial about like okay so the beast driver is the one having the confrontation with Trump

00:16:49.440 you know allegedly attacked by him as he's driving the car as Trump's leaning I don't even know if you

00:16:54.120 can reach the steering wheel when you're the president in the back of the beat I'm gonna imagine

00:16:57.580 there's a divider but I have no idea um so so that guy experienced that and he talks to the head of

00:17:03.540 security who's apparently also in the car and then they go back to the White House and then the head of

00:17:08.120 security relay something about what the driver experienced to this aide and now she's trying to

00:17:13.580 remember something to the effect of some come on in a court of law they would not allow and I realized

00:17:19.620 she also testified the driver was sitting there while this was being relayed and didn't stand up and say

00:17:23.960 none of that is true but now they are reportedly saying this isn't true um Richard Engel of NBC News

00:17:30.140 is reporting I think was it Richard Engel no um not Ray Engel uh Peter Alexander sorry the White House

00:17:35.380 correspondent there's reporting that it's that they're prepared to say this wasn't true the bit

00:17:39.220 about him confronting reaching for the steering wheel and actually physically attacking anybody in

00:17:43.540 the beast and one of those guys angle the head of security was interviewed by this committee already

00:17:48.700 so either Liz Cheney already knows that this guy is in dispute with this witness and put her on

00:17:55.820 anyway without asking her about the dispute which is a massive problem for Liz Cheney if it happened

00:18:01.040 or Liz Cheney interviewed Engel and got a story that perfectly lines up with what Hutchinson testified

00:18:08.120 to and now this guy's flipped and she's got to bring him back before the committee to find out why

00:18:13.120 he's flipping is he flipping does he want to disavow his earlier private testimony that we haven't been

00:18:16.860 subjected to or she didn't ask him right or she didn't ask him which is another problem for her

00:18:22.600 either way it's not good and they haven't made his earlier testimony public because this committee hides

00:18:27.500 half of what it does more from the rest of us they they do this private investigation and at the end

00:18:33.240 we all know what happens Trump gets condemned Trump in their perfect world gets convicted by a DOJ

00:18:38.260 investigation which very clearly seems to be underway they're investigating Trump for crimes associated

00:18:43.000 with this and a compliant media will push the narrative just as much as the Democrats want them to

00:18:48.780 you know you know what's kind of funny about it too is if you step back for a minute and you think

00:18:53.320 what if everything they say happened what if it's just as bad as as they say it is and all their assertions turn out

00:18:59.020 to be true then in that case Mike Pence saved the country if that's true then Mike Pence as I actually believe

00:19:06.120 in some sense he did I think Mike Pence acted with tremendous courage and integrity and great and Mike Pence is

00:19:11.380 everything the Democrats hate they did nothing for four years but make fun of his you know of his fidelity to his wife

00:19:19.780 of his Christian faith they lied about his feelings toward gay people and his actions toward gay people

00:19:25.660 and they just made him sound like a dunce and a clown and all those values that they hate with every fiber

00:19:32.840 of their being saved the country under their own scenario in fact not just Mike Pence but every time

00:19:39.340 Trump tried to pressure a functionary to do something wrong and that functionary stood up against him it was

00:19:44.900 because he was a Christian it was because he was quoting the Bible in his own mind and saying you

00:19:50.000 know my my service to God means I have to defy the president of the United States so all the values

00:19:56.980 that the Democrats have worked and slaved to destroy in this country are what saved the country under their

00:20:03.280 own story under the story that they're trying to tell the heroes turn out to be all the people they hate

00:20:08.480 so I don't really think you know with inflation being what it is with the border being open

00:20:12.840 uh with so many things uh going wrong the pandemic still as as bad as ever really uh I don't think

00:20:20.220 this is going to help the Democrats at all I think this was actually a misguided attempt even even with

00:20:26.800 the press making those uh claims well it's a show trial but I think ultimately people just could not

00:20:33.560 care less about what happened uh so which what now is in our history is so long ago now there are some

00:20:41.620 reports that Trump is getting ready to announce that he's running in 2024 as soon as this holiday

00:20:49.420 weekend I don't know whether that's true on confirmed reports uh if he does it it'll clearly be a middle

00:20:55.620 finger to this January 6th committee um which you know sounds Trump like uh but what what do you make

00:21:03.180 of that I mean this will be an albatross around his neck if he decides to run again and if the

00:21:11.820 Republicans don't let him have it in the primary process then he's definitely going to get it in

00:21:16.900 the general but I can't imagine a Republican challenger wouldn't touch the January 6th stuff because

00:21:23.440 these primaries are slugfests does anybody remember what Chris Christie did to Marco Rubio

00:21:28.880 last time around I mean two times ago it's just it's brutal so what do you make of it I mean do

00:21:34.700 you think Trump will run again and do you want him to well I I don't want him to I think he's

00:21:41.780 probably the only person who could lose to the Democrats at this point uh I am hearing from his

00:21:47.600 close friends and people who um you know know him well and speak to him all the time that he is a hundred

00:21:53.440 percent running that nothing in this world can stop him from uh from trying to overturn this blow

00:22:01.340 to his ego that was this loss and I believe him you know I I believe that there's still some time

00:22:06.740 before he has to decide so maybe he'll turn back what I really feel is that Trump Trump in his way

00:22:12.940 was a godsend uh Trump was the exact right person uh to stand up to what has become a machine of lies

00:22:20.100 which is not just the Democrat party but it's also the deep state and their media which is almost all

00:22:25.440 the media and it took a bowling ball like Trump a guy who just doesn't care what people think of him

00:22:30.060 what he says what comes out of his mouth to really put a dent in that machine and I think he was

00:22:35.400 truly just sent by heaven to bring this country to open up this country again but all the things as I

00:22:41.420 said before all the things that gave him the power to do that also made him an unviable candidate

00:22:45.960 and I think if he were a different man a better man he would now step aside and name DeSantis or

00:22:53.400 someone like him as his uh replacement and say this is my legacy I I paved the way for this and now that

00:23:00.400 a younger man and a more statesman like man uh do what has to be done and I think that that would be a

00:23:06.260 beautiful thing but I am being told and told again uh that he is 110 percent running and I and I think he

00:23:13.360 is the one person you know who could lose yeah I know I mean the polls show that he wouldn't lose

00:23:20.040 but who knows he's just such a divisive figure and you know you know DeSantis and I know DeSantis

00:23:26.460 and the name very well the country doesn't know that name as well and Trump's got those loyal loyal

00:23:30.680 loyal supporters and one of the things that one of the dynamics that emerged to me in the wake of her

00:23:35.240 testimony yesterday was his supporters there won't be one thing in there that they dislike and to the

00:23:40.800 contrary they'll love all of it you know that he was like let them in I don't care if they're if they

00:23:45.520 have weapons they're not gonna they're not gonna hurt me and and the fact that he tried to live up to

00:23:51.240 his promise to them to to go to the capital with them so we've heard some of the supporters say I don't

00:23:55.620 understand why he didn't come he said he'd come and we went there for him why didn't he go now they

00:23:59.940 have their answer he tried according to her he almost punched out a secret service agent in order to

00:24:04.300 get the beast to take him there instead of 1600 um so you know who does this rattle support with

00:24:10.920 nobody I think his core base is still there and the nomination I still think is his for the taking

00:24:16.760 with because there's just nobody who could garner 30 percent of the GOP in the way he can you know

00:24:21.840 and that's that's what it's about in the primary process all right now I want to shift gears and talk

00:24:26.040 about this because Trump had a great week prior to this yesterday I wonder if the things are related

00:24:32.340 um but he had a great week with Roe versus Wade and Casey being overturned clearly in part as a

00:24:38.940 result of the three justices that he appointed and you know I wonder whether he could be persuaded to

00:24:45.260 just let that be his legacy you know to I realize he's not really pro-life you know Trump's not really

00:24:50.740 I just don't believe that but no one cares you know people who are pro-life are like I don't give a

00:24:55.000 damn you actually agree with me just do what I need to get done and he did so do you think that that

00:25:00.740 plays it all into like wait a minute why don't I just go out on this this is a win go out on this

00:25:05.260 win nah well that's I think that may be a little wishful thinking uh you know I I it was a tremendous

00:25:12.080 victory for Trump this week I mean it was three uh great decisions from the Supreme Court top among

00:25:19.500 them obviously Roe v Wade the the overturning Dobbs the overturning Roe v Wade and it was all because of

00:25:25.440 Trump Trump and Mitch McConnell uh Mitch McConnell saw his chance and he took it and he understood

00:25:29.900 that Trump unlike a lot of other Republican presidents was going to stand behind him even when

00:25:35.120 they did what they did to Brett Kavanaugh uh and just tried to destroy the man Trump was just that

00:25:39.760 character who was going to stand by him and it was a tremendous victory and it makes a lot of the

00:25:44.500 never Trumpers look really bad it makes a lot of the people who couldn't understand that this was

00:25:48.680 a special moment that this was a special character uh that you had to look at him in a nuanced

00:25:52.680 balanced way uh it makes them look ridiculous and I I there was a lot of stuff you know I I used to love

00:25:58.300 national review but there was a lot of stuff coming out of national review saying basically we don't

00:26:02.240 have to credit uh Trump for this but no this was this was his victory and it was the best thing about

00:26:07.980 his presidency to say that he could see it that way and let go I that just doesn't sound like the Trump

00:26:14.960 that all of us know uh but it it was a tremendous moment and it really did that just the panic and the

00:26:23.120 anger and the absolute nonsense uh that it comes babbling out of Democrats mouths in in the wake of

00:26:29.620 it uh just shows you uh why they spent so much time trying to defeat him I mean this is basically

00:26:35.640 his third impeachment trial that they're running and he's not even president anymore so they're really

00:26:40.920 passionate about it well and the Brett Kavanaugh situation is the greatest example of Trump's

00:26:46.940 temperament being hugely important in many ways and obviously we've already talked about the downsides

00:26:53.800 of it but that any other president I mean there would there's another president on earth prior to

00:26:59.220 Trump now he's set an example I can't say there won't be one in the future but uh that would have

00:27:03.200 stood by Brett Kavanaugh given what they were doing to him it took a guy like Trump and what they did

00:27:08.560 to Brett Kavanaugh was deeply wrong and deeply unfair so that's when a lot of people changed their minds

00:27:14.040 on Trump um and and realized wait a minute that the upsides to this sort of weirdness about him

00:27:20.320 are far greater than the downsides and but then he would continue doing the downsides and give more

00:27:25.980 pause all right wait let me stand you by right there because I know that you were on the air when the

00:27:30.180 when the Dobbs decision came down and got it very emotional about it and I want to talk to you about

00:27:35.200 it and the incredible racist attacks now that we're seeing on Clarence Thomas as the meltdown of the

00:27:42.080 in response continues much much more to talk about with Andrew Klavan the one and only one of my

00:27:45.900 favorite guests he's amazing you got to read his book very moving I read the whole thing uh and you'll

00:27:50.320 love it Andrew you're right the court uh they're batting a thousand this week on some great you know

00:28:00.960 religious liberty cases and and gun rights cases which kind of look like no-brainers but a previous

00:28:06.420 court would not have come down the way they did you know it's like how is he how is the coach

00:28:11.200 kennedy establishing religion on the 50 yard line when he's privately just taking a knee to say a

00:28:16.080 prayer and people come to join him whether they want to or not how is that the establishment of

00:28:20.420 religion like the establishment clause jurisprudence it's just all over the place it's a nightmare we

00:28:24.780 could use some clarification on it and the court's inching there but anyway talk to me about that

00:28:29.180 moment and and our viewers should know you used to be a liberal right I mean like yeah it's not like

00:28:34.460 you've been some dyed-in-the-wool conservative you know your whole life and but it was emotional for you

00:28:39.000 when you heard about Dobbs tell us yeah yeah it had been weighing on me more and more no question

00:28:44.100 about it uh you know I haven't heard anybody else say this but this is what bothered me about it is

00:28:48.720 that there's a fundamental difference you know abortion is going to continue I think abortion is

00:28:54.300 a grave evil I've come to that opinion over a long time I was pro-abortion in my youth I lost an argument

00:29:00.080 with a friend one day and that just worked on me over the years until finally I changed my mind

00:29:04.460 um and abortion is going to continue in some of the states uh evil is always going to be with us

00:29:10.220 there's nobody you know we're going to have evil institutions but there's a fundamental difference

00:29:14.620 an essential difference between a country where evil is done which is every country and a country

00:29:19.140 that establishes that evil as a right because when you say that evil is a right you effectively

00:29:24.360 dehumanize the class of people to whom that evil is done so there's a difference you know slavery was a

00:29:30.680 grave evil but there's a difference between having slavery and having Dred Scott where you say that

00:29:36.000 that an African American isn't an American can't have the rights of an American uh there's a difference

00:29:41.500 between being an anti-Semite and even having an anti-Semite government and passing the Nuremberg laws

00:29:46.440 that strip Jews of their rights and dehumanize them when you say that abortion is a right you take this

00:29:52.320 this unborn child who already doesn't have a voice and you take away any possibility of his having a voice

00:29:58.380 uh when you dehumanize someone he loses that right that we all have that we all depend on

00:30:03.100 to say to your fellow human look at me I'm just like you I'm the image of God you you can't do this

00:30:11.180 to me and more and more uh it began to seem to me that the logic of that dehumanization was working

00:30:17.200 on all of us until you know and my friends will tell you my friends here at the Daily Wire will tell

00:30:22.060 you that I would say to them you know I'm not sure this is a good country anymore I'm not sure that a

00:30:26.920 country where we have to discuss whether it's right to butcher children to change their gender

00:30:31.680 uh is is a good country and all of it to me was traced back to Roe v Wade was traced back to the

00:30:37.860 idea that not only could abortion be performed in certain circumstances something that I think people

00:30:42.980 should argue about and vote on uh but we had a right to do it and obviously it was obvious to me

00:30:49.080 that that right would start being you know legal safe legal and rare and would end up with shout

00:30:54.920 your abortion even if you did it one second before that baby was born because a lot ideas follow

00:30:59.820 their logic uh out to their furthest point uh and it was beginning to just weigh on me it was certainly

00:31:06.180 a major part of my prayers every day that this country had truly lost its way and I I love this

00:31:12.400 country I mean I love this country the way people love their mothers because this is my mother country I

00:31:17.820 mean this made me everything I am it gave me everything I have uh it has fashioned it has allowed me to

00:31:23.800 fashion an independent personality in a in a world of conformity uh and I'm an artist so that matters

00:31:29.700 a lot to me uh and yet I felt it had gone terribly terribly wrong and so this this decision the minute

00:31:37.080 I saw it I mean it my heart just exploded because the minute I saw it I thought you know this this

00:31:42.440 doesn't make us a good country it gives opens the possibility for us to be a good country it means

00:31:47.020 that evil will be done but we are no longer evil we are no longer saying that this child cannot make

00:31:54.160 an argument that no one can stand up for this child and say look it's a human being you know treat it

00:31:59.460 like a human being because you know that to me is the only argument we're having we're not having

00:32:03.280 arguments about a woman a woman's right we're not having arguments about health care we're having

00:32:07.420 an argument about whether or not an unborn child is a human being and you know I think there's a little

00:32:14.480 leeway to make arguments there but not as much uh as you would think and certainly not going anywhere

00:32:20.180 near uh you know 16 18 24 weeks that's ridiculous uh and so we're arguing about the humanity of this

00:32:27.920 child and when you say at the highest level this is beyond argument this is beyond vote you've made

00:32:35.580 it so that I mean justice is supposed to be blind it's not supposed to be mute but you've essentially

00:32:39.260 ripped out justice's tongue because that's the argument we all use that's the foundation of the golden

00:32:44.060 rule just look at me I am the image of God I am your image you have to treat me as you would be

00:32:49.980 treated and they took they stripped babies of that right and in doing that to me they stopped doing

00:32:56.520 evil and became evil and it touched all of us and it has changed our culture uh in a million different

00:33:01.740 ways I mean I could I won't but I could go on and talk for uh an hour on the ways that I think

00:33:07.320 that has changed our culture for the worse and this opens the possibility that we can begin to

00:33:12.420 climb out of that and that to me is a beautiful thing I mean a beautiful thing I did not want to

00:33:17.140 I'm I'm getting up there in age and I did not want to walk out the door uh leaving the country

00:33:22.620 in the state the cultural state it's in now and I haven't heard anybody else talk about that but

00:33:27.460 that's the thing that weighed on me so much that's the thing that I kept uh bringing to God and that's

00:33:32.940 the thing that broke my heart when the that wonderful decision came in wow well said I mean

00:33:38.820 it's like Lila Rose said the other day uh she was on the program reacting to the decision you know

00:33:43.520 she she heads up live action which is a uh pro-life group and she was saying now we have a fighting

00:33:48.640 chance what this decision does is it's not a total win but it it gives us a fighting chance to persuade

00:33:54.600 people before we didn't even we didn't have that really you know it was like we couldn't even get in

00:33:59.120 the fight now now they're in and now they have a full-throated opportunity to say

00:34:04.060 there this shouldn't be allowed or or this is why you should make a different choice and um I I know

00:34:10.600 that you feel this personally because I I learned something about you preparing for today I I knew

00:34:14.280 that you had you know written all sorts of movies and books and so on but I didn't realize that you

00:34:18.720 had written the drama Gosnell the trial of America's biggest serial killer about Kermit Gosnell a case in

00:34:25.860 which I have a lot of interest I was on the air every day when that broke and it was incredible it was

00:34:31.560 unbelievable that this guy existed and serial killer is the right word for him and uh in the

00:34:38.400 state of Pennsylvania and I'll never forget you know the big reveal was ultimately that Tom Ridge

00:34:44.840 a Republican governor who was he fancied himself pro-choice but Republican um basically allowed it

00:34:52.700 to happen he had stopped inspections of the Gosnell abortion clinic and uh you know he thought for

00:35:00.780 political reasons that wasn't going to play and then we later found out that Gosnell was murdering

00:35:05.980 babies in their ninth month in utero in horrific disturbing ways the nurses who came out and talked

00:35:14.500 about what he was doing what he was making them do they were given immunity so they could be honest

00:35:19.080 about it we just grew some tales and that I think that whole case which you now are so familiar with

00:35:25.900 that was a bit of a turning point on hearts and minds on this issue you know the best scene in that movie

00:35:32.120 and I can say it's the best scene because though even though I wrote it I took it right out of the transcript

00:35:35.940 of the trial uh was when the defense brought on a regular abortionist uh a legal abortionist a non-insane

00:35:45.580 uh abortionist and had her describe what she did uh when she was aborting a child and it was virtually the

00:35:51.760 same thing uh that Gosnell was doing and so it actually that the defense was well he was just

00:35:56.820 doing abortions which to some extent was actually true uh when I was researching that I talked to the

00:36:03.140 um prosecutor and she was talking about uh the voir dire the interviews of the jurors and every time

00:36:10.200 she came to a male juror and asked his opinion of abortion he would say oh well that's not for me to

00:36:17.120 talk about that's only for women to talk about every one of them they were afraid to have an opinion

00:36:21.340 because they were male and not female a distinction which apparently no longer exists but did at that

00:36:27.120 time and that speaks to what I was saying before about stripping people of their voices almost

00:36:33.200 everything the left does if you notice it is not an argument it's a reason why you shouldn't be able

00:36:37.780 to speak every everything they say it translates into shut up and they've been so effective at it

00:36:43.400 and the idea that because you're a man you can't comment on whether the destruction of an infant life

00:36:48.740 is a good or a bad thing uh is just incredibly corrupt but that was part of the Gosnell thing

00:36:53.980 and the reason Gosnell was not arrested is because nobody wanted everybody knew what he was doing

00:36:59.160 but nobody wanted the taint of what he was doing to touch abortion because it was too hot an issue

00:37:04.520 oh my gosh well uh the cynicism in response to the Dobbs decision and what it means and what it

00:37:11.940 doesn't mean for other cases and other rights continues uh right on down to Hillary Clinton who by the

00:37:17.840 way now I think it was CNN's Chris Eliza tweeted out something saying this is her moment they're

00:37:24.520 actually starting this up again they're actually going to try to push her on us again but she's out

00:37:31.540 there um in her in her brilliant punditry talking about Justice Thomas in the most offensive way listen

00:37:39.700 to her I went to law school with him he's been a person of grievance for as long as I've known him

00:37:48.400 resentment grievance anger and the thing that uh is well there's so many things about it that

00:37:55.120 are deeply distressing but women are going to die Gail women will die my god I've never heard anything

00:38:04.440 less true about Justice Thomas he's exactly the opposite of a person of grievance his only grievance

00:38:10.660 I've ever heard from him is he he refuses to be used as white liberals puppet as something less than

00:38:17.680 an equal citizen when he refuses to just mouth their talking points on issues of race they've been they've

00:38:26.440 been doing this to Clarence Thomas since he was appointed and they basically accused him of being

00:38:31.420 the the wild sexual black man and now he's the angry black man they'll pull out any kind of cliche

00:38:37.400 uh racist remarks they have but they don't you know this is the thing about the left now they are

00:38:43.460 a racist party you know I say this all the time they're they're a right-wing racist they're racists

00:38:47.980 all over the place uh but the left is now a racist party the Democrats are a racist party they believe in

00:38:53.040 racism they think it's good racism because it's pointed at white people but in fact it's not pointed at

00:38:58.340 white people white is just a word they use uh when they want to attack people so Clarence Thomas becomes

00:39:04.000 white when he ceases to disagree to agree with them uh Clarence Thomas is you know it used to be

00:39:09.740 the sort of accepted wisdom that he was the second place to Antonin's coming back I think Scalia learned

00:39:16.260 a lot from Thomas I think Thomas's philosophy is more solid I think he's thought it through and I think

00:39:21.500 he's a brilliant jurist one of the things about reading the both the decision on Dobbs and the

00:39:27.740 defense uh is how the first of all the clarity of Alito's legal logic is it's impeccable and you can't

00:39:34.800 really find a place to drive through uh the sad the saddest one was uh Roberts trying to kind of

00:39:41.040 mealy mouth his way out of the position he found himself in but when you looked at the

00:39:46.400 dissent from Kagan and the others they they admitted that there were conflicting rights between

00:39:54.080 the unborn child and the mother but how can there be conflicting rights if the unborn child is not a

00:39:59.300 human being uh you know objects don't have rights only people have rights and so their their logic

00:40:04.460 doesn't really hold together and and Clarence Thomas is so clear he is I gotta say he's a radical uh in

00:40:12.020 in his uh originalism uh he basically said you know we should use this logic and get rid of over

00:40:17.720 and get rid of one bunch of other decisions that the rest of the court was saying not but he's he's

00:40:22.580 an honest guy of integrity you know what Alito feels the same way he he just didn't want to say it like

00:40:28.940 these the more conservative jurists privately likely agree with Justice Thomas they just recognize the

00:40:35.900 country's not quite ready for the total elimination of what's called substantive due process which was

00:40:41.300 controversial from the start and also if you got rid of substantive due process all that would mean

00:40:45.580 is all these rights go back to the states to decide you know we're truly a federalist society if it's

00:40:50.180 not really explicit in the constitution or has a long long history of being a right not mentioned but

00:40:55.080 recognized in this country um then you have to fight for it on a state-by-state level it's really not

00:40:59.220 that controversial people are like he wants to do away with gay marriage that's not true he wants to he

00:41:03.980 would like it to be a state-by-state matter he doesn't see it as a constitutional right that's pretty much

00:41:08.120 how everyone in the country felt up until about 10 years ago like it's not it's the it's at the core

00:41:13.100 of our system is federalism you know Madison knew that a giant democracy would collapse a giant

00:41:18.960 republic would collapse but a lot of little republics patched together uh could survive and he was right

00:41:24.060 he proved that he was right that's why we have gun rights and that's why they want to take those gun

00:41:28.060 rights away and that's why we have uh different decisions I mean even murder is a state-run uh a state

00:41:34.240 decided crime you know we have those different ways of looking at things because we know that a

00:41:39.420 series of little republics will remain republics where one great big republic is going to suddenly

00:41:44.480 just become a an authoritative regime and that's what the left is pushing for and has been pushing

00:41:49.540 for for a long time so part of the problem in interpreting Thomas and the court and all these

00:41:54.900 things is we have a bunch of morons on television uh offering their own punditry on it and you know I

00:42:00.660 mean I'd be remiss if I didn't mention the ladies of the view and joy behar okay now she's talking

00:42:06.160 here not about row but about the coach Kennedy case where the football coach who I mentioned

00:42:10.960 he was privately praying on the 50 yard line and students decided to join him and he got fired

00:42:15.620 because the school said you're basically you're forcing kids to do it and there was no forcing

00:42:19.640 whatsoever the art the only real argument was you have authority and therefore they might feel like

00:42:25.120 you're not going to start them on the football field if they don't do it even though the guy had

00:42:29.500 absolutely no history of doing that to students who didn't join anyway listen to where joy behar

00:42:35.420 took that win for coach Kennedy uh in this sound like I would like to know if it would apply to

00:42:43.260 Colin Kaepernick for example he takes a knee I don't know if this is really legal or any of what I'm

00:42:48.600 saying but it seemed to me like the guy takes a knee and he gets thrown off the team but he could

00:42:53.800 be praying to praying you know that these people would leave him alone I don't know why he's praying

00:42:58.540 but he could be praying how do they know what you're doing when you take a knee doesn't that

00:43:03.820 look like prayer to you suddenly it's illegal for him but it's okay for this it's illegal it was

00:43:10.940 illegal you see for Colin Kaepernick also is Colin Kaepernick was doing something completely different

00:43:17.480 so what what could be worse than differentiating between two things that are completely different

00:43:21.500 but look vaguely the same you know one is working for a private corporation one is working for a public

00:43:26.080 school where the government is shutting you up for doing it and the NFL can tell its players to do

00:43:31.420 whatever the hell it wants to tell them to do um and when it comes to speech but I love that she's

00:43:35.840 suggesting Colin Kaepernick was told it was illegal for him to take a knee but it is it is true that one

00:43:42.360 of them was praying and one of them was protesting the flag under the flag of the NFL he was wearing an

00:43:47.220 NFL uniform at the time so they had a perfect right to tell him not to do it it's I mean the view has got

00:43:52.340 to be is a source of constant stupidity it's amazing to me that a show with hosts named whoopee joy and

00:43:58.360 sunny could be such a font of misery and depression I think they would live up to their names you know

00:44:04.460 it's so true so uh okay last thing because I I didn't really get to it yesterday and I felt so bad

00:44:10.280 uh this migrant crisis down at the southern border continues and may was the worst month that we have

00:44:15.680 had in terms of the encounters with migrants and now we we know that 51 people are dead inside of this

00:44:21.940 semi-tractor trailer uh 101 degree temperatures they were left there and somebody was heard moaning

00:44:28.160 and finally they were rescued no water to me there's just a consistency here because the Democrats

00:44:34.060 they clearly don't care they now they want us to say oh women are going to die women are going to die

00:44:37.400 as Hillary Clinton said they're all about life except of the baby and now they're all about oh we know

00:44:42.500 we we're a country that accepts immigrants you know we have to improve people's lives except they won't

00:44:47.120 talk at all about incidents like this which border hawks have said all along is one of the reasons

00:44:53.480 why we need to secure our southern border people will die they'll die at the hands of illegal immigrants

00:44:59.020 who come across and unleash hell especially on the ranchers who are down there we've seen examples of

00:45:03.160 that and they'll die thanks to these traffickers who couldn't care at all about the people who they

00:45:09.120 are taking across the southern border once they have their money they exploit them they die

00:45:12.980 where's aoc in her little white uniform now you know i i just do not understand why they are not

00:45:20.600 under more pressure and this is one of the things i fault the republican party for uh you know what is

00:45:26.040 the logic of this what country doesn't have a border what country doesn't regulate the number of

00:45:31.420 of immigrants who come in and what country doesn't also make sure that those immigrants who come

00:45:36.280 in are schooled in the ways and nature of the country i mean this is the way this is we are a nation of

00:45:42.020 immigrants but the way we managed being a nation of immigrants was making sure that the people who

00:45:46.700 came in loved it wanted to be here had a good reason for being here could be used by the country

00:45:52.220 and elevated by the country all of those things have gone by the board and it's like we're not

00:45:56.220 supposed to exist as a nation anymore uh you know this is what part of what douglas murray calls

00:46:00.520 the war on the west this idea that somehow we are uniquely evil and i personally i think it's the

00:46:05.960 other way around i think it's unique uh what america has done how it's elevated freedom how it

00:46:10.680 has kept there's no free man walking on the face of the earth or free woman who does not in some way

00:46:16.480 owe that freedom to american blood and treasure and i think that that's a remarkable thing and we should

00:46:20.960 be very cautious of our our country i want immigrants to come in i want our country to be refreshed i'm

00:46:27.000 incredibly proud i'm incredibly proud to live in a multi-ethnic country i love uh you know where i live

00:46:33.360 there are a lot of multi-ethnic people all together and and couples and all that and i i think what an

00:46:38.540 achievement what that i saw in my lifetime that we created a country like this but no you don't just

00:46:44.920 take the border down i mean it's ridiculous so why don't the aren't the republicans louder about this

00:46:49.860 why haven't they come up with i mean we had the power uh when trump was in office why haven't aren't

00:46:54.620 they able to come up and just say all right you know we're going to do this one thing is we're going

00:46:58.980 to close the border and regulate who comes in and then we're going to worry about the people who are

00:47:02.760 already here another day i mean they have this idea that the whole thing has to be solved at once

00:47:07.800 that there's no compromises that can be made uh they they blow it again and again almost as if and

00:47:14.040 i'm not certainly not the only person saying this it's almost as if both parties uh want the crisis

00:47:19.300 to continue because it helps them with their base but i think it's i think it's a shame not just

00:47:24.060 because of the deaths of the people and the abuse of the people and the women who are constantly

00:47:28.320 being raped uh as they're brought over by these uh criminal coyotes but i just think it's it's a crime

00:47:33.800 all along and we should uh and we should stop it yeah i i totally agree andrew thank you so much

00:47:39.460 it's always such a pleasure talking to you uh we will do it again soon i hope and we'll be right

00:47:43.000 back with steven miller known as red steez who i'm really looking forward to meeting i haven't talked

00:47:48.600 to him yet joining us now for the first time is steven miller the other steven miller known on twitter

00:47:59.680 as red steez and one of my favorite follows so if you're not following him there you should

00:48:04.600 he will make you laugh regularly and has great insights uh he is also host of the versus media

00:48:10.740 podcast on patreon welcome to the show steven nice to meet you thanks megan it's a pleasure

00:48:15.940 yeah don't tell people to follow me on twitter now i have expectations

00:48:19.180 okay you know expect very little but you might one day be mildly amused

00:48:23.900 um yeah do you do you get confused for the other i'm the good looking yeah i i'm the good looking

00:48:30.720 one um he's you know i'm the one with the hairs i like to say so there were a couple pieces written

00:48:36.080 about that when he kind of hit the scene and i was just like uh yeah i'm gonna have to start using

00:48:41.420 the middle initial now just in case casey ever wants to piggyback off you know my name you know i was

00:48:47.060 like no i gotta throw the middle initial in there now you're more conservative and he's more

00:48:51.000 conservative so i can see that you know the confusion at least there's not you know he's

00:48:54.660 not saying crazy things that you never just never agree with i'm just trying to out crazy him on

00:48:58.780 different levels well i'll look forward to those tweets because that that'll be interesting to read

00:49:03.800 uh i like steven miller he's like he's one of those guys who's he's not like he's not well loved

00:49:09.940 you know pretty much every article written about him says something terrible and they call him a

00:49:13.820 white supremacist because he's a hardliner on immigration but you see stories like the one we just

00:49:17.960 talked about and it's like why aren't you a hardliner on immigration why isn't everybody

00:49:22.900 if you're not a hardliner on immigration you encourage traffickers to take people innocent

00:49:26.760 people across the southern border because they know nobody's going to stop them and next thing

00:49:31.100 you know you got 51 dead people 39 men 12 women suffering to death uh on based on some promise of

00:49:39.000 a better life that they thought nobody that they thought that they could achieve without any law

00:49:42.980 enforcement interfering right and and of course our media ignores this we went we went straight from

00:49:48.340 uh concentration camps at the border three years ago to what is the southern border you speak of

00:49:53.800 what are what are the you know these migrants that are what are what is happening here and uh and of

00:50:00.320 course you know we get the same kind of trope from the administration that we're working hard to

00:50:04.540 stop all of this and i think it was the white house press secretary said yesterday that the border is

00:50:09.280 closed and i don't know 51 dead bodies splayed out on a texas highway suggests otherwise and that that

00:50:15.460 was the kind of claim that fact checkers in the golden age of fact checking that lasted four years

00:50:20.240 would have lit the white house press secretary up over and we got nothing we got nothing at all over it

00:50:26.000 and um it's it's in and it's out of the news uh as fast as it came and it went and that's it

00:50:31.160 it never happened it's so true and yesterday you know the january 6th hearing dominated the news cycle

00:50:37.700 scant mention of this crisis i mean it's not just the 51 people who are dead it's also may being the

00:50:45.260 absolute worst month in u.s history when it comes to these migrant crossings and encounters no one

00:50:50.300 seems to care i mean i realize january 6th is a story but it's also an old story and i opened up the

00:50:56.520 show today by saying even what we heard from miss hutchinson was largely just new color on old news

00:51:03.300 did anybody think trump was loyal to pence on january 6th and was out there defending him and had his

00:51:08.780 back right did anybody was anybody shocked that he wanted to go to the capitol he said that explicitly

00:51:13.380 in his speech we knew he wanted to go to the capitol you know is anybody surprised that trump concerned

00:51:18.460 that his crowd size wasn't big enough on january 6th said let everybody in weapons or no weapons

00:51:23.480 he wanted the shot to look good yes it's callous and understandably it wasn't a good decision

00:51:29.060 but then there's no follow-up on did the secret service stop using the magnetometers on people i

00:51:34.800 doubt it did they start letting people with the weapons in so trump could have a good shot of his

00:51:38.680 crowd i doubt it that was notice noticeably missing but the media decides to melt down this is it we've

00:51:44.420 got him he's done they've done it a million times it's never true and stories like this one about you

00:51:49.800 know joe biden southern border quote unquote policy totally collapsing and resulting in scores of deaths

00:51:55.820 it's ignored yeah and another thing about january 6th that hearing was unscheduled they they scheduled

00:52:01.640 that at the last minute because they had this bombshell supposedly and this is a democrat-run

00:52:07.320 committee so even the republicans on there and i know you know i know a lot of people aren't fans

00:52:11.820 of kinzinger chain but they are republicans in name at least you know they don't control when these

00:52:15.720 hearings happen so you had a democrat-led committee uh that called a last-minute hearing they were i think

00:52:21.280 they were adjourned until mid-july uh because they're basically trying to you know string this out

00:52:25.820 as long as they can until the november elections and i i said this on my podcast yesterday that it

00:52:31.520 sure looked like it was a way to change the news cycle they were kind of getting hammered on their

00:52:36.160 row loss which is the biggest democratic party loss probably decades uh it cannot be under understated

00:52:42.880 enough how you know devastated they are over this and i think that this was a way to change the news

00:52:47.240 cycle back to something like january 6th and you know alluding to something that you said i i think i was

00:52:52.820 the first person in all of what i guess you could call conservative media out of the gate with

00:52:57.900 impeaching remove trump over what happened on january 6th and i'm kind of with you where i look

00:53:03.900 at it and i say okay we have all of these things that trump tried to do and at every single place

00:53:09.360 either by his cabinet or by his attorneys or by uh judges uh or by state officials uh he was stopped

00:53:16.740 at every single way and instead you know we get overwrought monologues from you know jake tapper the last

00:53:22.060 honest man in journalism about how our democracy is hanging on by a thread and as we saw the clip

00:53:27.420 with boris johnson he was kind of like what are you talking about you know this was of course it

00:53:31.580 was a bad day uh congress was delayed from certifying results for eight hours yes people died there were

00:53:38.120 you know police officers who have that day have suffered trauma and then we of course had ashley

00:53:42.280 babbitt and but eventually they certified the vote and it went on and joe biden was sworn in and here

00:53:49.100 we are today and so i i look at it kind of how you said we have all of these things where we're being

00:53:54.020 told that he tried to do but it didn't happen and i kind of look at it and say if it didn't happen

00:53:58.600 then what are we talking about um i do think this is a i do think this is a political investigation

00:54:04.060 and i and i contrast it with the robert muller investigation robert muller wasn't on cnn every night

00:54:08.980 he wasn't you know he didn't have guys leaking things it was he went to work to figure out you know

00:54:13.980 what was going on here and in the end he didn't find much and they were disappointed with that also

00:54:18.820 and you can and you compare it to this investigation where uh there's leaks happening all over the place

00:54:23.800 everything that adam ship magically ends up on cnn and we get every journalist and now you have kind

00:54:29.840 of a new administration star who's going to be making the rounds on media and on the view and

00:54:34.960 already there's parts of her testimony they're being called into doubt and you know it's the old

00:54:38.900 twitter joke where they say how is trump going to slip out of this one and trump slips out of it and

00:54:43.280 they kind of just go ah well nevertheless on to the next thing right in a way it's forgive me for

00:54:49.680 the analogy but it's kind of like the johnny depp amber heard trial where she gave her emotional

00:54:55.240 testimony and it's like right okay i mean i actually believe a lot of what she testified to

00:55:00.120 and and found her credible in some of the assertions and then came the cross-examination which just left

00:55:07.040 her a withering puddle of contradictions and obvious lies she she lied repeatedly on the stand

00:55:14.220 and by the time that lawyer was done with her i was saying forget it i don't believe a word she said

00:55:19.480 i this is not a truth teller and i need to reassess you know my opinion of her which i did that that

00:55:26.440 second piece never happened for miss hutchinson it hasn't happened for a single witness there

00:55:31.440 it's it's all set up to drive you to one conclusion and i've said before as a lawyer

00:55:36.720 i used to try cases it would have been really easy to win every single one of them if i didn't have

00:55:41.460 an opponent if nobody ever cross-examined my witnesses or put my claims to the test or objected

00:55:47.500 to any of my testimony and yet still steven what we had yesterday was a media i'll give you a couple

00:55:52.840 of you know here's a couple of highlights right jonathan carl the testimony by cassidy hutchinson makes

00:55:58.920 it crystal clear donald trump envisioned a full-blown coup on january 6th uh david french of course the

00:56:05.460 25th amendment should have been invoked within hours of january 6th chris wallace um she was a great

00:56:11.780 witness absolutely precise she was just brilliant and you know i opened the show today with no offense

00:56:19.200 to miss hutchinson she's a young person and i'm sure she did the best she could but like every single

00:56:23.400 thing she testified to was he said something to the effect of something to the effect of it was something

00:56:28.100 to the effect of he i remember very specifically he had said something to the effect of well what

00:56:32.340 which is it what what what what did he say where are your notes you were a young woman you're telling

00:56:37.880 me there was one testimony where the white house council allegedly went to her and said make sure

00:56:42.400 trump doesn't go from the rally to the to capitol hill make sure you got to make sure i mean you're

00:56:47.600 telling me as a young 24 23 year old woman you wouldn't be home in your diary saying holy shit the

00:56:52.860 white house council put it on me to make sure the president does where's that let's see that

00:56:57.660 yeah and you know what i i do take issue with um the fact that we've never heard any of this for two

00:57:04.760 years we we none of us had heard the name of you know cassidy hutchinson unless you're in dc

00:57:08.860 and i i take an issue with people who accepted paychecks from this administration for years and then

00:57:16.820 suddenly i now i've grown a conscience because it seems to me that you know i'm being promised things or

00:57:21.920 i can do i have a media tour in front of me or i can appear in the woman on the view i can rehab

00:57:26.360 and yeah they're you know people who you know went to work for this administration and gladly accepted

00:57:32.120 paychecks for years are kind of like a dime a dozen out of this we have miles taylor from uh who wrote

00:57:38.120 the supposedly the anonymous a new york times off that and you know and you you have i think now you

00:57:43.480 have some of pence's comms people coming out and um they they discovered as many kind of ex-conservative

00:57:49.200 pundits have that it's very warm under that dragon's wing and i'm sure you're you're certainly

00:57:54.080 no you're certainly not someone i have to explain that to um where it's like okay now i'm going to

00:58:00.100 come out and it could be rehab or that promises of a contributor gig or somewhere all i have to do is

00:58:05.380 say these stories and you know as someone who you know i'm kind of attacked from both sides of both

00:58:10.740 you know the pro-trump and the anti-trump sphere um i look at it and say you know i i wrote on january 6th

00:58:17.480 that they should impeach and remove him and this is kind of my attitude with january 6th where

00:58:21.280 i'm fine examining trump from that day i'd like to know what he was doing for an hour and a half in

00:58:26.440 the white house uh while you know pence was forced to coordinate with esper from the department of

00:58:31.620 defense to get the national guard in there to kind of clear all those yahoos out um but i'd also like

00:58:36.060 to examine everything from that day i'd like to examine why the capital was left for the most part

00:58:40.680 with a skeleton police crew uh why there was no defenses there while they knew that there was going to be a

00:58:45.500 large rally on the mall i'd like to examine uh why pelosi didn't just draft impeachment articles on a

00:58:51.520 napkin while hiding out in a bunker they could have done that uh pelosi uh reportedly said if you

00:58:57.500 don't invoke the 25th amendment as david french said i will impeach him well that never happened

00:59:02.240 neither of those things happened and so i'd like to examine everything from that day but we know that

00:59:07.700 that's not really going to happen and we largely know like you said how trump felt because he gave a

00:59:12.780 speech in front of everyone yes you know he said i'm gonna go to the i'm gonna go to the capital

00:59:16.680 with you and then and i've always looked at it as he kind of you know slinked off to the oval office

00:59:21.900 and he kind of went and he pouted and you know we all know all of that happened and of course

00:59:27.760 we get the story yesterday of you know trump uh grabbing the wheel of this from the secret service

00:59:34.820 of the of the limo and i said on twitter you know his critics can't decide if he's a feeble old man

00:59:40.720 who can't lift a glass of water or walk down a ramp or if he's john mcclain trying to commandeer

00:59:45.720 the most you know the most protected vehicle in the world pick one i'm fine with it pick one and

00:59:50.760 go with it you know he's the rock you constantly offer us these yeah you constantly offer us these

00:59:56.180 these contradictions and i've always kind of said that you know trump is someone who's always held

01:00:00.960 a mirror up to his worst enemies and it's some of his worst critics and if you in the long term

01:00:06.740 and something that i've always tried to you know maintain my sanity through the last three four five

01:00:11.440 six years is that you know the worst thing you can possibly do is become like him in some ways and

01:00:17.120 again we saw this yesterday we saw the hyperbole happening we saw this you know we saw people saying

01:00:22.540 people remember this in decades and i was kind of like i don't know people are going to remember

01:00:26.120 this at their next gas station fill up so it's not that these these hearings shouldn't happen

01:00:31.060 i think they're very polarized i think they're very political it clearly to me looks like a politically

01:00:36.460 driven um hearing and a politically driven matter that doesn't mean that i agree or disagree with

01:00:42.980 everything being said it doesn't mean that we shouldn't hear testimony from people um but like you

01:00:47.920 said every time that there's a a new piece of testimony out it's we've got him this time and i i think

01:00:54.280 somebody said on twitter i don't want to credit this to me that the only way to get rid of donald trump

01:00:58.560 is to beat him at the ballot box and that's it you're not going to get rid of any other way

01:01:02.960 by him well that's the other thing is um the something you said just reminded me of another

01:01:09.020 problem with cassidy's testimony so she and this would have been brought out had this not been

01:01:13.660 you know whatever you want to call it show trial sham trial it's sham it this is this is not anything

01:01:18.740 close to a fair and balanced hearing like you'd see in a court of law or any proceeding having to do

01:01:23.440 with the legal system um she testified that mark meadows her boss the chief of staff wanted her to

01:01:31.720 write out a note that was to be sent out under the president's name saying if you it was it was

01:01:40.760 basically it was saying if you did not enter the capitol grounds lawfully please leave and uh she said

01:01:47.120 mark meadows dictated that note and i wrote it and there's my note here's my note right here

01:01:51.840 well somebody and i think it was the white house counsel's office came out eric hartman i'm just

01:01:58.220 going off memory here so forgive me and he said i i wrote that note she didn't write that note

01:02:03.480 now yeah that's weird okay that's weird because eric herschman thank you steve cracker my ep um he

01:02:12.120 comes you you know whether you wrote the note show me the note is it it was it handwritten because i

01:02:19.020 think they were testifying it was handwritten if i if i wrote i know my handwriting i wouldn't say

01:02:23.080 that that was my handwriting if it weren't my handwriting so why did she say she wrote the

01:02:27.420 note if she didn't write the note i don't know what happened but oh this is where i was going with

01:02:31.240 it because the committee comes out and what they should say is that's something we should look into

01:02:36.020 you're right there's an inconsistency there all they say is inconsistency or not we believe her

01:02:41.380 she's credible like okay so you're gonna be the fact you're gonna be the the person who presents

01:02:46.440 the trial the finder of fact any inconsistencies that don't support the witness's testimony that

01:02:51.060 you like we get instructed to ignore because you have deemed her credible and therefore the ministry

01:02:56.100 of justice and information will tell us how to feel though it just underscored the unreliability of

01:03:01.720 this whole proceeding yeah and you saw you know you saw members of our media basically just flip out

01:03:08.540 over the the claim of the secret service of grabbing the steering wheel of the beast and then

01:03:14.260 when this was kind of questioned by several secret service agents i think it was the head agent on duty

01:03:19.260 at that time said no this didn't happen suddenly our media downgrades it to this is an anecdote and

01:03:24.680 that word was used several times it was used by maggie abram at the new york times was used by john

01:03:28.800 word of yahoo and it's no hold on this is sworn testimony and she if this is a problem now okay and

01:03:36.980 it's not about like you said if she did or didn't do it's like now you have an inconsistency

01:03:41.480 and that if one part of her testimony becomes not credible and is disputed by on source and people

01:03:47.880 willing to testify well now you have a problem and it's like you said we're not looking at this our

01:03:52.460 media is so kind of head driven into uh this narrative and agenda bias of this issue that they're

01:03:59.660 not stepping back and looking at this objectively and you mentioned john carl and john carl said yesterday

01:04:05.460 on twitter he made a very simple semi said thank you cassie hutchinson and it regardless of what

01:04:10.660 you think about donald trump when journalists do john carl wrote a bestseller off of donald trump

01:04:15.480 and the antics in the white house press room and so you know this is another problem i have with a lot

01:04:20.880 of his critics donald trump is the best thing to happen to some of these people uh he's the best

01:04:25.340 thing to happen to jim acosta's career he's the best thing to happen to guys uh formerly of the

01:04:29.760 lincoln project they made thousands of dollars off of him millions so again yes in some case yeah

01:04:35.840 they made bestsellers jim acosta now it's a television show uh strictly on you know his

01:04:40.440 antics uh with the white house press briefings you know michelle cinders now nbc news pundit and so i

01:04:46.640 have a this is my biggest problem with a lot of these people in media who claim that they're defending

01:04:51.040 democracy or claim that this is what this is about um when we know that that's not what this is about

01:04:56.860 we just saw this report yeah we just saw this john carl did that wait hold that thought because

01:05:01.140 i i i didn't know he did that how does john carl know that cassidy hutchinson is a truth teller

01:05:08.200 and no offense to this young woman again i'm sure she served our country honorably and she's doing

01:05:12.260 the best she can but i i don't actually know that for a fact where i could tweet out thank you

01:05:16.780 cassidy hutchinson i haven't had the chance to hear her claims subjected to cross-examination and i

01:05:22.660 don't know whether this is a self-aggrandizing bitter person who wanted to go with trump

01:05:26.060 and was rejected i don't know and he doesn't either that's a totally inappropriate tweet

01:05:31.580 yeah and this is from some i don't think it's necessarily inappropriate from say

01:05:36.240 someone who we know is uh uh who has their you know progressive or liberal views out in the open

01:05:42.560 correct um but from someone from people who who sell themselves as the abc news washington

01:05:48.520 correspondent that's a you know that's a big title that sounds serious i should take you seriously

01:05:52.980 when it comes to the matters of the white house um but you know again and people who follow my

01:05:58.360 twitter feed they see that i generally leave people you know leftist journalists alone i'm friends with

01:06:03.120 a lot of them um i have no problem with you know honest journalism from the progressive left and i would

01:06:08.780 encourage more people on the right to read it so you actually know what they're trying to argue a lot

01:06:12.760 of the time uh my problem is people like that people who you know they try to sell themselves under

01:06:17.320 the mantle of you know we're we're brave truth-telling journalists who are like firefighters

01:06:22.220 and and oh also don't you misgender me or i'm gonna you know leave the newsroom screaming and crying

01:06:28.260 and so again i do think it's wildly inappropriate for someone like john carl to tweet something like

01:06:33.380 that out and say thank you cassidy hutchinson and and as you as you see democrats you say that this is

01:06:39.340 about maintaining our democracy or whatever these this is the same party who just spent 42 million

01:06:44.080 dollars in primaries that just happened last night to elevate trump candidates trump endorsed

01:06:50.120 candidates and mega candidates so no this is not about preserving democracy and as i mentioned jake

01:06:55.080 capper's kind of overwrought speech performance with boris johnson uh where he said you know i talk to

01:07:00.500 people in canada and australia and um places where they say you know this they're really worried about

01:07:05.520 democracy in america no jake that's what you think is happening and you know to to people like that

01:07:11.180 the end of democracy to them is republicans winning another election and i think they're simply setting

01:07:15.900 this up for what's going to be a pretty bad night for the democrats in november by the way so uh my

01:07:21.560 crack team just points out that now a day later after jonathan carl probably got hammered he tries to

01:07:27.940 explain the thank you cassidy hutchinson tweet which he sent out yesterday at 2 50 p.m and now today

01:07:34.360 uh a day later he tweets out where others have refused cassidy hutchinson was willing under oath

01:07:41.440 to tell the world what she witnessed at the white house during the extraordinary events of early

01:07:45.180 january 2021 it is for that reason that i said thank you yeah yeah the problem with a lot of these

01:07:54.040 people hear organs in their head when they start to speak

01:07:56.420 that is really true i've never heard anybody put it that way but god you're so right um all right so

01:08:04.540 we're seeing similar sanctimony and i said you know sort of fainting couch behavior not just with respect

01:08:11.300 to cassidy but with respect to the supreme court's behavior this week i.e its decisions um that it has

01:08:18.000 come to on things like roe and so on and um you know that sort of the hysterical pearl clutching that

01:08:23.700 we've seen there i think is also largely an attempt to change the narrative in advance of january 6th

01:08:28.820 i mean in advance of uh the 20 2022 elections but what's been weird about it is they're pretty

01:08:35.400 explicit like the media on every channel is like but will it pierce the bubble when it comes to the

01:08:41.340 january 6th thing and the abortion is it going to change the new york times was explicit about like

01:08:45.140 will it change the narrative in advance of the midterms like i remember the back the day when

01:08:50.680 the media used to be biased but it wouldn't just be open about the fact that they were trying to

01:08:54.760 use their bias to change the political outcomes now it's like open like have we done it yet what

01:08:59.060 do the polls say is it working yeah yeah i mean one of one of the reasons you've heard about

01:09:06.840 the reasons why we need to uh put the january 6th hearings up and the reason why we need to stop trump

01:09:11.680 is because they're trying to install pro-maga people on all of these state levels um so you know trump

01:09:16.780 can run again in 2024 and then just steal the election out from under him and i said uh if

01:09:20.960 things keep going the way they're going and if joe biden keeps governing the way that he's governing

01:09:24.780 joe trump's not going to have to steal anything in 2024 and that's kind of the prelude to what we're

01:09:30.020 seeing in november and i think the polling just came out on this road decision i think it was like

01:09:34.520 11 of the country is paying attention to it um and you know so you'll have kind of the late night

01:09:40.360 group therapy sessions for lids on you know jimmy kimmel and the colbert report or steven colbert and

01:09:45.840 you know which is all this has become which is where celebrities just come out and air their

01:09:49.720 political grievances and we just saw like wanda sykes say this oh wait two nights ago which is

01:09:54.660 stand by stand by yeah just play it she can say it way better than i can she was on steven colbert

01:09:59.780 and this is her take on it it just sucks man it it really does i mean you know it's like the

01:10:06.840 the country it's no longer a democracy right i mean we're it's no longer majority rule

01:10:13.320 these judges are just they basically lied when they were you know being during their confirmation

01:10:20.600 hearings right the problem is that middle stuff it's it's those states in the middle that that

01:10:25.980 that red stuff why do they get to tell us what to do when the majority of us live out you know new

01:10:34.200 york california and we're paying for all this crap really i mean right we're putting the bill if i'm

01:10:40.840 fitting the bill know your position you know i'm saying you know for real like look if i say hey

01:10:47.600 let's go out to dinner you don't get to pick the restaurant just shut up and eat

01:10:51.060 yeah there's your ad there's your ad i mean there's just to slap a page for the rnc on that

01:10:58.980 i don't know how many cliches someone can stick into something and say well here's what the political

01:11:03.380 right's been saying all along that you know you have a progressive elitism in the coastal city

01:11:09.440 san francisco new york dc los andeles and then they believe that in the you know there's this

01:11:14.820 useless chunk of land called america in between those cities and here she is kind of confirming

01:11:19.440 that and this idea that nine you know nine of five justices uh on the supreme court sent a decision

01:11:26.940 back to the states to vote on is no longer a democracy shows you that hollywood's really not

01:11:32.380 sending their best here um and i guess it's too much to ask for these people to just have kind of a

01:11:37.980 monicum of civics education before they go on national tv and bark this all up um and and i

01:11:43.800 said with roe the one of the biggest freakouts of why we're seeing this is exactly what i said

01:11:48.280 roe has kind of been this protective blanket for them for the last 30 40 years where they don't

01:11:53.260 they don't have to talk about what abortion involves in specific details they can kind of

01:11:58.000 just point to it and say right there that's roe that's it's abortion that's hey what else do you

01:12:01.460 want and now they're going to have to go kind of state to state and and specifically lay out where

01:12:07.800 they stand on this issue and we know that um it's probably three four five six percent of the

01:12:13.880 country is at a position where the extreme fringe of the democratic party is which is abortion up to

01:12:18.780 the moment of birth and in ralph northam's case you know post postnatal birth and so they're going to

01:12:25.620 have to go out and defend this and i think they know that they're in a problem where the majority of the

01:12:30.020 country isn't there the majority of the country isn't exactly for life either she actually said

01:12:36.720 what happened to majority rule what happened we're no longer a democracy that's literally what's about

01:12:42.780 to happen majorities will rule on this issue state to state just exactly the way it was supposed to be

01:12:48.660 the supreme court is the one who curtailed that who short-circuited it back in 1973 saying you no

01:12:54.480 longer get to vote one way or the other we're just saying a mostly cis white male supreme court

01:12:59.780 save for one person did that yeah the supreme court that overturned roe was more diverse than

01:13:05.280 the one who instituted it and uh again they kind of have a problem with that it's why you see all

01:13:09.780 the vitriol specifically going after clarence thomas for getting all uppity i guess um and i also know

01:13:15.920 not just that because it wanda sykes is one thing but we uh i go on this gb news which is uh it's not

01:13:24.200 fox news but it's a more right-leaning news over in great britain they launched about a year ago and i love

01:13:29.120 them they're doing a really great thing they're very balanced um they're smart and great britain

01:13:33.580 needed this so anyway my pal dan wouldn't he ran he put together this butted soundbite of some of

01:13:39.000 these singers in response to the dobbs decision on abortion i'm going to play it for you for people

01:13:46.040 listening it starts with lord the singer then it starts with i think the lead singer from green day

01:13:51.300 yeah green day you'll hear him he's ready to renounce his citizenship heard enough from him

01:13:56.480 and then it finishes up with uh olivia rodrigo who's a very big star and uh so listen to this meltdown

01:14:03.200 make accessing that wisdom your life's work

01:14:09.340 because everything depends on him

01:14:14.440 i'm devastated and terrified and so many women and so many girls are going to die because of this

01:14:38.760 and um i wanted to dedicate this next song to the five members of the supreme court

01:14:44.800 who have showed us that at the end of the day they truly don't give a s*** about freedom

01:14:49.820 okay that's that's the best thing lord's done in years can we just be honest about that

01:14:55.480 i was kind of i was kind of i was groove i was grooving to that a little bit i was like okay

01:15:03.140 lord's founder groove again she's not you know a sellout pop star so i just want to put that out

01:15:08.020 they want guys gonna renounce his citizenship okay he's gonna renounce his citizenship okay good go ahead

01:15:12.320 bye he's he's you know he's been doing that since the the days of george w bush it's nothing new and

01:15:18.140 it's nothing we haven't heard before so okay goodbye don't don't make us even happier that you

01:15:23.840 know this decision happened please no please green day just you know no continue to play our continue

01:15:29.380 to play your music and make us all miserable please i just i think it's so it's so strange to hear

01:15:35.340 people come out and talk about how women are gonna die women are gonna die it's like abortion's not

01:15:39.360 illegal okay it's going to be it's going to be banned in some states but you will still be able to

01:15:44.800 get an abortion it's going to be harder if you live in one of those states but we are not going

01:15:48.740 back to a time where it was impossible to get an abortion and you had no options as a woman that's

01:15:54.280 not what's about to happen and there's also absolutely no like hesitation or tact in recognizing

01:16:02.560 that every abortion takes a life it does i mean whatever your position is on abortion you can be pro

01:16:09.620 choice you're dishonest if you deny that that is a life inside of you it may not be fully formed

01:16:15.520 but there's just no like they're so free about being i saw a picture of a woman at the supreme

01:16:20.660 court with a huge pregnant belly she was obviously eight plus months pregnant and she had written on

01:16:25.540 her belly this is not a baby or this is not a person that's how crass the other side is about

01:16:31.020 treating this yeah i think and and something you know the the pro-life side and and this is an issue

01:16:37.420 that's you know my my hobby or there's there's far more people who are well educated and philosophical

01:16:43.380 about this than i am but you know when you have a culture that celebrates this stuff we saw michelle

01:16:49.620 wolf on comedy central or had her had her show on netflix where you know she does celebrate your

01:16:54.260 abortion and comes out and she's as a marching band and everything and she no longer has a show and

01:16:59.440 that's kind of like i think that that really shows where this culture is and you know i think a lot of

01:17:05.420 that is performative and i think a lot of it is meant to offend the political right and something

01:17:10.300 i've said on my podcast and i kind of fall i think into this brand of you know fund it which is if you

01:17:16.600 take away their ability to offend you if you're if you're on the right and you take away the left's

01:17:21.720 ability to offend you whether it's abortion or religion or whatever then you you rob them of a lot

01:17:27.780 of power it's something that andrew breitbart you know used to preach is about just kind of being a

01:17:32.400 happy warrior and if you disarm them in that way um then they lose a lot of the power and they lose

01:17:38.660 a lot of the arguments and i think that there's an aspect of the young new political right that

01:17:42.960 understands that um and and something that something the pro-right political right has had on their side

01:17:49.120 ironically enough from the party of science is medical science you know the abilities of you know

01:17:55.480 advanced science now with ultrasound and fetal heartbeats and things like that

01:17:59.400 and so now you have a party that i guess just general believes that science is how hot it is

01:18:04.540 outside right now and so the political right is has been armed with some of these new weapons and

01:18:10.220 they're i think better more equipped to handle this fight than say they were even 20 years ago

01:18:15.420 that's true i yeah i've said for a while now the the right needs to be more like the irish we're just

01:18:21.640 unoffendable drunk all the time yeah drunk and unoffendable it's a wonderful way to go through

01:18:26.880 donald donald trump helped some of us with that you know we just we got through the last four years

01:18:31.720 you know it was a little hairy but yeah i mean yeah i'm just you have you have to approach these

01:18:37.740 things as you know again and i said this with ben smith on his buzzfeed podcast which is um

01:18:43.420 you know this is problem i think with journalists is they don't understand what say social media is

01:18:49.300 what twitter is and um and people like me are very apt to take advantage of that and if you can make

01:18:54.740 people laugh or if you can kind of show them a different side then you're going to win those

01:18:58.320 arguments and this is again a problem a lot of journalists have with what twitter is and what

01:19:02.480 the internet is and they just don't understand it yeah i'm going to find during the break i'm squeezing

01:19:06.920 a break i'm going to find the there was a meme about the irish allegedly being offended by the

01:19:11.740 the lucky charms guy and it landed so great i'm going to find it i'll bring it to you on the opposite

01:19:16.220 side of this quick break more with i would say the one and only steven miller but that would not be

01:19:20.800 accurate the one and only red steez right after this don't go away

01:19:25.080 so steven this just in we amazingly got our hands in some video of trump in the beast taking over

01:19:35.940 control of the wheel and wait until you see how he was driving watch this

01:19:41.220 are you aiming for these people no maybe that mine

01:19:56.380 it is john mcclain i really do wonder trump trump's opinion on mimes i think he's probably

01:20:11.060 scared of mimes i mean they frighten a lot of people he sounds like someone who just would be

01:20:15.220 like no if you ever saw like a bomb it's like oh no coming at him well he might like it like they

01:20:20.680 they never touch you and he's into that he doesn't you know he does he's a germaphobe i love that though

01:20:24.960 your reference john mcclain made by crack team go find them they're not going to interrupt him they

01:20:28.680 can't decide on you know who he is or what he is let's see you know he kind of just fits he's kind

01:20:33.920 of like you know to choose the form of the destructor to our media and they just they conjure him up

01:20:39.020 and however they need him to be at that moment it's so funny just the thought of him like yes

01:20:43.200 you will give me the wheel of the beast oh sure okay um so i did find my team found the lucky charms

01:20:49.940 meme and my irish friends and relatives will appreciate this putting it on the board uh and

01:20:54.760 i'll read to the audience what it what it says irish protest for the removal of lucky charms

01:20:58.980 leprechaun image because it's offensive just kidding the irish aren't offended by jack shit because

01:21:03.880 they're not p words yeah yeah that's a meme that memes can be classified as hate speech now you know

01:21:12.340 we have to be careful so yeah um by the way are you a basketball fan ncaa uh not really uh i i don't

01:21:22.940 really watch ncaa basketball but i did like one year i think three years ago predict the final four

01:21:29.740 and the champion like all the way i did my bracket with my friends and i think i just walked away from

01:21:34.620 it after that i'm like i didn't watch a single game and i beat everyone so i think i ended up in

01:21:39.240 like the top 1800 of espn and so maybe that was just you know my my autism i don't know but yeah

01:21:45.660 that's uh i don't really watch it no well i ask because uh we watched the entire march madness

01:21:52.480 tournament like everything this year because my young son yeah actually got hurt he's fine but he was

01:21:57.240 in the hospital and um for like a week so we just sat there and we watched all of it and that's

01:22:02.340 unusual for me but i got to know uh this one guy i think he played for if i oh god who was it was

01:22:07.700 it boston anyway his last name is timmy and he was on fire in this one game was it i can't remember

01:22:13.420 who he played for gonzaga and it'll come back gonzaga okay gonzaga and he was on fire and he just

01:22:18.900 opened up a can of whoop ass on the other team and there was no stopping every time he gave timmy the

01:22:23.560 ball he he would get the ball in the net and it was so impressive and he was interviewed after the

01:22:29.400 game by a sports reporter and said like what what did you say to your teammates in the halftime because

01:22:34.540 then they all came out they were all doing what you did and he's like this big six foot seven guy you

01:22:39.900 know this man's man and he goes i just told them you know we may lose this game but we are not going

01:22:44.800 to lose it by being a bunch of soft guys yeah and everyone my young son included understood that

01:22:53.340 soft guys was a euphemism for the p word that i i don't say that word but i see that it was used in

01:22:58.420 the lucky charm meme and uh even timmy knew that you should just say soft guys when in front of a

01:23:02.820 camera so he and i are simpatic yeah no i no i'm not going to say i want to i want to be invited back

01:23:10.900 so all right speaking of soft guys um harry prince harry and his wife megan markle have some things to

01:23:19.280 say about roe and uh the decision i know you were waiting for the megan markle reaction are we not

01:23:25.680 respecting their privacy now is it like oh yes miss i wanted my privacy just gave a joint interview to

01:23:31.700 vogue and just in case she wasn't getting enough attention she decided to partner with gloria steinam

01:23:36.880 on it and what she said was my husband and i talked about that a lot over the past few days

01:23:42.820 the dobbs decision he's a feminist too uh his reaction last week was guttural guttural like mine

01:23:49.840 what does this tell women she asks it tells us that our physical safety doesn't matter and as a result

01:23:56.500 that we don't matter now here's a profundity for you from from the duchess of nothing but we do

01:24:04.380 women do matter and this is one of the reasons i called gloria immediately and asked to do this

01:24:10.780 we matter so vogue does you know vogue magazine decides to do a profile like that vogue magazine

01:24:18.000 which never put melania on the cover right an actual supermodel didn't actually make it uh but

01:24:23.180 megan markle calls up and wants you to know her feminist husband had a guttural reaction to dobbs

01:24:28.740 when did megan markle become a biologist did that just happen like

01:24:32.980 how could you figure it out there's a lot of bio there's a there's a lot of sudden biologists

01:24:38.520 you know who are speaking up for on behalf of whatever a woman is i guess um yeah i mean

01:24:44.400 i don't know it's probably one of the best things we ever did is we helped usurp the crown of britain

01:24:49.140 you know by at least you know having prince harry marry an american and so we have a straight shot to

01:24:54.340 the crown now it took a few hundred years but um they got back at us though sending those two over

01:24:59.840 here we didn't need that they should have just stayed across the pond um the other thing is she's

01:25:04.580 not the only woman weighing it as you know uh hillary weighed in and took a shot at justice thomas

01:25:09.160 and i saw you responding to this tweet that also got my attention cnn's chrysalis a tweeting

01:25:15.140 unbelievably quote now is her moment hillary clinton now is her moment with a link to a cnn article

01:25:25.280 called entitled the whispers of hillary clinton 2024 have started oh my god steven yeah what's

01:25:34.620 chrysalis a journalism's answer to a question no one asked is once again pulling out his trick about

01:25:40.860 hillary clinton he does this like every few months he does and uh the interesting thing to me about

01:25:46.520 hillary is anyone who any candidate who loses to somebody like donald trump you would think would

01:25:54.480 just be put on a mule and sent out into the desert with like a big paper mache head never to be heard

01:25:59.580 from again and instead she's still kind of this media power broker they all gather around her every

01:26:05.380 time she kind of pokes her head out of her hole and it's really interesting to me that there was

01:26:11.200 really no reckoning for her over that it was it was russia did this or russia stole the election or i

01:26:17.200 guess russia made her forget that the state of wisconsin existed for 106 days and so i look at that and i

01:26:24.100 just say here she comes again and this is chrysalis's big game and we saw the report in the new york times

01:26:30.580 it said she she wishes she was being consulted more by the biden administration um so she does kind of

01:26:36.200 have this media strategy which is i'll i'll talk to you i'll i'll talk and they all kind of jump at it

01:26:40.680 and again i i don't know i don't know what their plan is is their plan to replace an 85 year old joe biden

01:26:48.620 with a 78 year old hillary clinton um i think it really speaks to the lack of depth that the democrats have

01:26:56.640 and i've i kind of predicted this on my on my podcast i've been on this for a couple of weeks

01:27:01.380 here uh that i don't think joe biden's going to be the 2024 nominee i think there's too many factors

01:27:06.280 and also this muted response to roe uh as i said to you this is this is the worst defeat these people

01:27:11.900 have suffered in decades and joe biden's response was to get on an airplane and fly out of the country

01:27:18.000 and if you're on the left what does that look like to you and so i said on my podcast i said i think

01:27:24.740 there's going to be an open primary and i said and the name that i won't be shocked to see jump in

01:27:28.600 there is congresswoman ocasio-cortez and just last night stephen colbert asked sir you know you're

01:27:35.440 going to be 35 running for president and i just i kind of just took a bow on this one so that for

01:27:40.720 whatever reason they can't wait to get the old man out of there and i don't understand why they

01:27:45.600 think that hillary is kind of their great white hulk in all of this now is her moment who would have

01:27:53.020 the temerity to write that about hillary clinton now this is her moment she's had about 10 000

01:27:59.100 moments all of which she's blown to smithereens yeah she's won what exactly one election in the

01:28:05.820 state of new york uh for those of you who remember that was a that was an election that she was kind

01:28:10.960 of goaded into by her media they're like you can go run for senate in new york go do that and then of

01:28:16.420 course she ran and she won and she hasn't won an election since and uh i i don't see the political

01:28:22.520 left settling for her uh we saw kind of two instances where in 2008 they were just like okay

01:28:29.040 let's let's just vote for her and get this over with and then but of course barack obama hits the

01:28:33.660 scene and they couldn't dump her fast enough and then it almost happened again with bernie sanders

01:28:37.960 but who wouldn't watch that primary i mean i would love to watch a debate between aoc and hillary

01:28:42.220 clinton that would be so fun come on you might be the only one i would moderate it i i would yeah

01:28:50.060 it would probably go easier for you than than the one debate i so one thing i wanted to ask i wanted

01:28:55.380 to ask you one thing and i put this question out on my podcast um you were kind of the first person

01:29:00.880 speaking moderating debate you were kind of the first national pundit that kind of saw trump's ire

01:29:06.860 leader and i i was wondering about you what was that like where you didn't see a lot of support

01:29:12.220 in like the journalistic community because at that time it was really funny to people at msnbc and cnn

01:29:19.200 and morning joe that trump was kind of beating up on you know the people at fox he was beating up on

01:29:24.900 marco rubio and ran paul and while they were kind of having you know five billion dollars of unearned

01:29:31.300 media on his way to the on the way to the presidency what was that kind of like to not have a lot of

01:29:35.760 support from your own colleagues where it was like uh you were the first person to draw that ire and

01:29:40.900 they loved it because of course you were a fox and you know you're making kelly but then of course

01:29:46.020 uh when the election season rolls around when he secures the nomination suddenly he's adolf hitler

01:29:51.780 and he's not allowed on saturday night live what was that kind of like in i didn't experience it like

01:29:56.100 that i i thought the media you know i i thought it was a joke that the people over at msnbc or even

01:30:02.420 democrat politicians like hillary clinton were saying oh hillary was like megan kelly is a

01:30:08.980 fantastic journalist and for him and i was like i remember going on there and saying if i'm so

01:30:14.440 fantastic why don't you let me practice some of that fantastic journalism on you come on the show

01:30:19.100 yeah let's let's do this thing and so the the left pretended that they cared about me you know the

01:30:24.800 attacks i mean they they pretended that they cared because they thought it would hurt trump and the

01:30:29.300 right was mad at me not all the right but the core trump supporters was mad they were mad because

01:30:33.340 they didn't think my question was fair so like i guess kind of like that's part of the business you

01:30:38.140 know it's like you got to be able to take your licks and your rhetorical i was i was at national

01:30:43.000 i was at national review when against trump came out so uh and i was kind of one of the online faces of

01:30:49.020 that when that came out i kind of just went okay let's go i was kind of the guy on twitter who was

01:30:53.420 willing to muck it up with them so i can definitely understand the bruises there but you know i opened the

01:30:58.760 the show today just so happens i opened the show today with a reference to that debate because

01:31:02.360 the question that i asked trump about that day yes it had mentioned women and so on but what it was

01:31:07.420 really about was his temperament do you have the temperament to be president go back and look at it

01:31:12.280 that's what i asked him and i think that was a very good question i think i was raising a good issue

01:31:18.240 that would go on to be a problem for him but yeah unlike unlike most of the media i could see that he had

01:31:24.840 that problem and if you look at the course of my journalism over the trump years i think it reflects

01:31:29.800 that i could also see the upsides of his oddity you know like he is a wrecking ball and i totally

01:31:38.140 get why the republicans chose him ultimately and i see all the good he did and i don't think there

01:31:43.740 was another republican in that race that could have done it that certainly no one would have stuck by

01:31:47.160 brett kavanaugh we would not have a reversed row i think had mit romney even won in 2012 i just think

01:31:53.000 they they would have caved on fights that trump never caved on so i i feel like i'm in this unique

01:31:59.320 spot steven because i really i think unlike most people i don't have trump derangement syndrome

01:32:03.800 but i'm not under his spell either i can see his qualities and i can see his flaws too

01:32:09.600 i kind of said that coming out of that that four years i was like whoever can kind of come out of

01:32:14.320 here with their sanity intact is kind of the people you need to pay attention to and that could be people

01:32:18.960 who voted for him it could be people who uh liked him it could be people who don't want him to run

01:32:23.300 again now or or what have you and i never really liked the term kind of trump derangement syndrome

01:32:29.420 but there there there is a certain level of surrounding your entire punditry identity around

01:32:36.200 him because he's not going to be around he's not going to be you guys when you're at national review

01:32:41.340 and you know you you know that's that's the dispatch people that's like the jonah goldberg and

01:32:46.260 i like jonah but like the lincoln project republicans those guys have trump derangements

01:32:50.600 and national review does not like trump they're true conservatives um and that's okay but i listen

01:32:56.020 to their podcast all the time i love the editors and i read national review a lot and um they're not

01:33:01.880 fans of his but they will defend trump often on policy they will never defend it yeah you have to

01:33:08.480 you have to be able to understand how he happened and i think that that is still kind of gone

01:33:14.300 completely unexamined on the political left and of course our media who again paved the road for him

01:33:20.000 and uh said you know let's give this guy five billion dollars in free media because he's going to make

01:33:25.580 republicans look crazy and he'll never win and well oops then they spent four years atoning for that

01:33:31.820 and they never really had their own reckoning for their own role in this and that's kind of why guys like

01:33:37.760 me exist that's kind of our whole careers i'm here to remind you of kind of your past with this stuff

01:33:44.580 and i'm here to remind people like morning joe about you know the fawning attention you gave him

01:33:49.740 and the fact that you were a member of mar-a-lago for years and years and years and you know we know

01:33:55.160 what you were doing and we know it was a hillary campaign strategy to elevate him above the field

01:34:00.280 i'll tell you can i tell you something i'll give you just a little color on that and then they did

01:34:04.800 so morning joe kept going to mar-a-lago and so on trump asked me to go to mar-a-lago too he invited

01:34:09.960 me to go to mar-a-lago back before the debate and all that i said no yeah and i i kept a record of that

01:34:15.400 invitation and i had the record of that underneath my questions at that presidential debate just in

01:34:20.200 case you never knew what he's going to throw at you like i never went because that's not an

01:34:23.880 appropriate thing for somebody in the media to do but too few people understood that and uh they

01:34:29.820 were compromised and then have spent the next five years trying to make him pay for their own

01:34:34.460 bad behavior red steez yeah i quit i gotta go because i'm out of time but i really enjoyed this

01:34:40.920 i hope i hope you come back steven invite me back i will be happy anytime thank you done okay don't

01:34:46.980 forget at red steez s-t-e-e-z-e and you won't you won't be sorry that you followed him he will amuse you

01:34:52.480 and entertain your mind tomorrow someone i've been trying to get on forever security expert

01:34:58.320 and author gavin de becker you will love this see you then thanks for listening to the megan kelly show

01:35:05.280 no bs no agenda and no fear

The Megyn Kelly Show - June 29, 2022

＂Bombshell＂ Testimony Dud, and Biden and Trump in 2024, with Andrew Klavan and Stephen L. Miller ｜ Ep. 347

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