Cocoaididioterrorism (CODI) is here, and it s here to stay. It s time to live with it, not live cautiously biding our time until it s gone. Megyn explains why.
00:04:25.680Joe Biden, who eviscerated President Trump for COVID deaths on his watch and ran for office
00:04:32.040on the promise that he would shut down on the promise that he would shut down the virus, finally admitted there are limits to what the federal government can do.
00:04:48.980This is the same person who said Donald Trump should be booted from office because some 200,000 Americans had died of COVID at the point he made the argument.
00:04:56.800Far fewer than would die on Joe Biden's watch, which, by the way, was all post-vaccine.
00:05:03.140Two hundred and twenty thousand Americans dead.
00:05:08.300If you hear nothing else I say tonight, hear this.
00:05:12.680Anyone who's responsible for not taking control, in fact, not saying I take no responsibility initially, anyone who's responsible for that many deaths should not remain as president of the United States of America.
00:05:26.080And this president, if he's reelected, you know what will happen.
00:05:32.160Cases and deaths will remain far too high.
00:05:35.900Now we're over 800,000 deaths in America and the cases are as rampant as they have ever been here.
00:05:43.260Now that that's the case, it's, well, no president can solve this.
00:05:47.200As Rich Lowry of National Review asked this week, and where does Trump go for his apology?
00:05:51.060The rise in Omicron, a relatively mild virus, thankfully for the vast majority of people who get it, has forced even the prophet Fauci to admit that the obsession with case numbers as a metric for community response is off base.
00:06:09.460As you get further on and the infections become less severe, it is much more relevant to focus on the hospitalizations as opposed to the total number of cases.
00:06:22.460More shockingly, he has finally, finally, almost two years into this pandemic, admitted the need to balance the goal of minimizing COVID with the need to live our lives as Americans, a free people.
00:06:39.800The CDC last week with Fauci's blessing shortened the quarantine time for people with COVID and those in close contact with them down to five days from 10.
00:06:53.180I mean, obviously, if you have symptoms, you should not be out.
00:06:56.400But if you are asymptomatic and you are infected, we want to get people back to the jobs, particularly those with essential jobs, to keep our society running smoothly.
00:07:07.440So I think that was a very prudent and good choice on the part of the CDC.
00:07:13.280You see, he's saying there are other things to consider beside this obsession with zero COVID.
00:08:09.980That's their own problem that they created.
00:08:12.240So we'll see if they if they change that or not.
00:08:15.400But the truth is that that 10 days was a made up standard from the beginning, as was the six feet distancing rule, as was the cloth mask rule, as was the 70 percent for herd immunity rule.
00:08:26.060I could go on. The point is, we have been lied to.
00:08:33.740We have been led around like mules on a tether by government bureaucrats like Fauci, who want to shut down your job while he makes north of four hundred thousand dollars a year.
00:08:44.380And we learned this week is set to retire with a pension of over three hundred and fifty thousand dollars a year.
00:08:49.800These people want to muzzle your kid all day at school while they parade around Maslisk at dinners and the Met Gala and so on.
00:08:58.480They want to scare parents into sticking an experimental vaccine into their kids arms over and over and over.
00:09:05.520Not one, but two shots and then a mandatory third or no sports or school or indoor fun of any kind.
00:09:13.340Despite the data that unvaccinated young people face a risk far less severe than that of fully vaccinated adults.
00:09:22.780By the way, the Justice Department just admitted in a filing in support of its vaccine mandate that people between the ages of 18 and 30 have about the same risk of of, you know, from covid as those who are 50 plus who are fully vaccinated.
00:09:39.480So the unvaccinated 30 year old has about the same risk as the fully vaccinated 50 year old.
00:10:31.580Of course, the boys will remain masked for the foreseeable future.
00:10:35.220Or the notice in my friend's New York City building mandating that all contractors, delivery personnel and employees servicing residents in the building must now be fully vaccinated.
00:10:46.500OK, so now you're cleaning lady, your plumber, your pizza delivery guy.
00:10:50.320They got to get vaxxed to do their jobs.
00:10:52.700Despite all of that, the House of Cards is coming down.
00:10:59.180The realities of covid are becoming undeniable.
00:11:02.740When even the leftists start to realize that covid comes for all, even Democrats in New York City, even members of the media, the politics will moderate.
00:11:39.500One of the headlines I want to get to you with you is not just the latest in covid, but the revelation that you specifically were targeted, targeted, targeted by Fauci and others at his level, including Francis Collins, for your position with the other doctors in the in the great Barrington recommendation.
00:12:00.500And so, you know, personally, what it's like to have the world look at Fauci as a god.
00:12:06.060And when he comes against you, there are there's fallout.
00:12:19.800There's only learning to live with it, with which you and the other great Barrington docs saw very early on.
00:12:26.440So the thing about covid is that we knew even from the from even like April of 2020 that a very substantial number of people had already been infected outside of the can of public health.
00:12:39.960There were so many people in like, for instance, I did a study in the early days of the epidemic in Santa Clara County, where we found four percent of three and a half.
00:12:48.600It was a two and a half percent of the population had already been infected.
00:12:51.540And in L.A. County, four percent of the population already infected by April of 2020.
00:12:56.440Fifty times more cases, 40 times more cases than public health authorities knew about.
00:13:00.440If that's the case, that it's so easy to spread, the lesson should have been right then.
00:13:06.460There's no chance of stopping disease from spreading down to zero.
00:13:11.980Instead, we have pursued for two years this very foolish path where we just we thought with this illusion of control that we had some technology to stop the spread of the disease from and bring it down to zero.
00:13:26.440And instead instead of pursuing normal, reasonable things like protecting the vulnerable, you know, especially especially the older population, we decided we were going to shut society down in order to to end the virus.
00:13:39.200Well, in retrospect, that's turned out to be an enormous mistake.
00:13:44.900And despite despite that, you're not going to get an apology, even though we now know I was stunned when I saw this just because it's rare you actually find the proof in writing.
00:13:54.620But you you came under severe attack from Francis Collins, now retiring director of the NIH, and Anthony Fauci, who were on board in late December.
00:14:06.820This was revealed, but they were on board from the time you came out with the Great Barrington Declaration with trying to smear you and the other doctors of behind the Great Barrington piece who said, you know, let's let's do focus protection.
00:14:20.000Let's let's focus on protecting the most vulnerable, but the rest of society should remain open, which is basically where they've where they've landed.
00:14:27.520OK, so it's been revealed now thanks to this is the American Institute for Economic Research published emails from some of these scientists revealing that they want to discredit you.
00:14:37.160And they had a conference in October, early October, 2nd through the 4th, 2020.
00:14:43.580This is four days after the conference.
00:14:46.180Dr. Francis Collins called three of the scientists in attendance, quote, fringe epidemiologists and sent a directive to Anthony Fauci and other senior staff to publish.
00:14:57.800He wanted a quick and devastating published takedown of the Great Barrington Declaration's premises.
00:15:03.600He stayed on it. Fauci was on board. He wrote the same night to let Collins know that there was already a devastating takedown of the declaration in Wired by some science reporter, not not a doctor, not a doctor at Stanford named Matt Reynolds.
00:15:17.620And then by mid-October 2020, Collins emailed again to boast about calling the three scientists, you and your two colleagues, fringe in The Washington Post, told Fauci the ongoing campaign to take down the Great Barrington Declaration won't be appreciated in the Trump White House.
00:15:33.860But Fauci assured him, oh, don't worry, the Trump White House is too busy dealing with other things to worry about Great Barrington and went on to make sure that pieces were being published, trying to diminish you and smear you as a doctor and the theory behind the Great Barrington piece.
00:15:50.260So your feeling upon learning that there was a coordinated campaign against you.
00:15:55.320You know, I kind of sensed, even from the last year, that there was some very strange things happening.
00:16:02.800Reporters started calling me very shortly after we wrote the Great Barrington Declaration, asking me why I wanted to let the virus rip through society.
00:16:11.220The Great Barrington Declaration doesn't say that we want to let the virus rip to society.
00:16:15.560We said we wanted to take action to protect the vulnerable.
00:16:20.000We had a lot of discussion about that.
00:16:23.140And what I actually hoped out of that was a broader conversation with public health officials who know the living circumstances of the elderly in their communities and are perfectly capable of devising creative ways to protect the vulnerable.
00:16:35.820Instead, we got a propaganda campaign.
00:16:37.880We had people accusing me of wanting to expose people to the virus, wanting to let the virus rip through society.
00:16:47.860It was a propaganda campaign initiated and directed by the top levels of scientific leadership within the federal government, including Francis Collins and Tony Fauci.
00:17:01.360What it essentially did is it sent a signal to all other people, scientists and others, who were having qualms with this lockdown-focused policy and told them, you know, it's a nice career you got there.
00:17:16.220If you were to speak up, you know, that nice NIH grant you have, well, I mean, I don't know.
00:17:22.340It would be nasty if something were to happen to it.
00:17:24.660In effect, they had created a conflict of interest where you have these people who are charged with tens of billions of dollars of scientific funding.
00:17:35.000The careers of scientists are made or broken on whether they can get funding from the NIH.
00:17:41.560And so now you have the head of the NIH essentially saying this is a fringe view to someone, you know, like, okay, you can ignore me.
00:17:49.460But, like, you had Martin Kulldorff at Harvard University and Sunetra Gupta at Oxford University signing on and tens of thousands of others epidemiologists and scientists signing on.
00:17:59.300Essentially, to call all of that opposition fringe, what was at play here?
00:18:04.220What they wanted to do was to create a false sense that there was a scientific consensus when there wasn't a scientific consensus.
00:18:11.640They effectively lied and created a propaganda campaign in order to get their policy.
00:18:16.500And, unfortunately, they got their way.
00:18:20.160It's stunning to see how political they are.
00:18:23.420I mean, we've sort of seen it over the past two years, but it's stunning to see it in writing.
00:18:27.540And to talk about, as you point out, you and your two colleagues who came on this show right when you published it in October of 2020.
00:18:41.720Last I looked, these aren't fringe organizations.
00:18:44.100I realize you don't speak for your entire institution.
00:18:46.820But you came out with a thoughtful alternative to the devastating lockdowns that we've seen.
00:18:52.720And when you came on my show, you highlighted the devastation that the lockdowns were causing.
00:18:57.300That was one of your great concerns that, yes, we're only looking at harm from COVID.
00:19:01.200But we need to look at the hunger, for example, that's going to happen in foreign countries as a result of this and so on and the deaths that we're going to see as a result.
00:19:28.880He the role he's played in this epidemic has been, I think, in large part negative.
00:19:36.660He has silenced scientific discussion around his policies.
00:19:41.160He has pushed forward policies like lockdowns that are blind to the harms they have caused, as if they were the only responsible thing to do when they were not.
00:19:51.740There were alternatives available, like focus protection.
00:19:54.760And, you know, the fact that he is the head of the NIH where he controls or they have the NIAID where he controls the budgets of epidemiologists and virologists and others who have been put elevated to the top of their ability to comment on COVID policy, that itself has created this enormous conflict of interest.
00:20:17.920He should never have been in charge of COVID policy.
00:20:20.840I mean, in effect, he's been the de facto president of the United States for the last two years, setting the most important policy followed by the United States and actually around the world.
00:20:34.360It's far past time for him to step down.
00:20:37.880Have you heard from him or from Francis Collins in the wake of this revelation?
00:21:38.920And then he acted in this irresponsible way, silencing debate, when instead he should have been embracing it.
00:21:44.640And the irony, the irony of now Fauci on TV saying, well, the reason we're shortening the quarantine period from 10 days to five is because people need to get back out there to work.
00:21:56.060You can't have a society run like this where this many people who are infected are sitting out for 10 days.
00:22:01.080Finally admitted, admitting some balance is required.
00:22:06.900You can't design every policy around how do we minimize the disease's spread.
00:22:11.740You have to be realistic about the fact that society must go on.
00:22:16.740But you you made that recognition in October of 2020 and were called fringe and publicly attacked by Fauci and Collins and others doing their bidding because of it.
00:22:27.800There's a lot to go over with Dr. J. Bhattacharya on on COVID, on the latest on Omicron and what we're seeing now with the response of public policy.
00:22:39.100Remember how AOC loved to attack Ted Cruz when he left Texas during the crisis down there?
00:22:45.800Wait until you hear how she's responding to her critics who just accused her of doing the exact same thing.
00:22:50.880Saw the pictures of her in Florida on vacay.
00:22:54.660Plus, later today, we're going to get you up to speed with my own reaction and Andrew Branca's to the Kim Potter verdict.
00:23:01.720And we'll have the latest in the saga of the transgender swimmer breaking collegiate records at UPenn as two top swimming executives speak out right here.
00:23:13.020Let's talk a bit about Omicron and what's real and what's not real.
00:23:23.980What I my takeaway and having read many different sources now over the past couple of weeks is Omicron is indeed far more mild version of this virus than Delta.
00:23:34.880That you are very, very unlikely to be hospitalized or to die from Omicron unless you are, you know, among the very elderly or very immunocompromised and and haven't been vaccinated.
00:23:47.520Those are the people who need to worry, who have, you know, one or two of those three factors on that for the rest of us.
00:23:54.020If you get Omicron is probably going to be basically like a cold.
00:25:02.280Well, for one, these absolutely ridiculous, coercive, anti-scientific vaccine mandates just have to end.
00:25:10.200There is no good argument for a vaccine mandate even before Omicron, because the vaccines don't stop disease spread.
00:25:17.340Now, with Omicron, given that the disease is mild and we have such a large fraction of the population either vaccinated or recovered from COVID, and you have a relatively mild version of the variant going around, I don't see any good argument to do to fire people on the basis of the fact that they didn't take the vaccine, which is what we've been doing.
00:25:37.000The staff shortages, by the way, you mentioned earlier about about about the finally taking into account other harms from the from the policies.
00:25:44.760You know, the staff shortages caused in hospitals are in part due to these vaccine mandates, the the slowdown in in in in the inability to like manage patients to have to like we're actually overwhelming hospital systems in part because of these vaccine mandates.
00:26:01.720It's a lot of these sort of short sighted policies, I think, should absolutely end, especially in light of Omicron.
00:26:06.420Yeah, they're saying some of the so-called flight mare problems that we saw over the holiday season with the flights not taking off or do it in part to staff shortages that they don't have enough pilots.
00:26:16.420They don't have enough flight attendants to actually staff the flights.
00:26:20.200So we have to get more realistic because everyone's getting Omicron.
00:26:23.860I mean, it's you can be double vaxxed and boosted and Omicron's likely to come your way and there's not much you can do about it.
00:26:30.260The vaccine isn't very effective at preventing Omicron.
00:26:33.940You can spread, unlike with the very first variant of this virus where we didn't know.
00:26:38.240It looked like the vaccines might provide provide some measure of protection against transmission of that version of covid.
00:27:03.160Tell me if this is true, that so far I heard this actually on The Daily, the New York Times podcast today, that the if you've had Delta, it doesn't necessarily give you great odds of staving off Omicron.
00:27:18.160But if you've had Omicron, you have better odds of staving off Delta.
00:27:23.720I mean, there's still the studies on that need to be done more carefully still.
00:27:28.360I don't I'm not convinced one way or the other on this.
00:27:30.900I think that previous infection, no matter what variant, provides protection against future variants in terms of severe disease.
00:27:39.120That seems very clear that when reinfection happens, it tends to be milder than if and it's very it's relatively rare.
00:27:45.820Like with the literature before Omicron suggested that at one year, only somewhere between 0.3 and 1% of people were reinfected.
00:27:56.780So you get infected, recover, and then a full year later, only 1% of people get get the infection again.
00:28:03.040And the infections tended to be milder.
00:28:04.680So that was the literature before Omicron.
00:28:08.140It looks like from the preliminary literature, Omicron does evade the protection you got from Delta and from the other variants in terms of infection.
00:28:20.440It seems to me like Lisa's my gestalt, not yet based on I don't think any solid studies as yet.
00:28:26.720But like I think based on what I've seen thus far, it seems like there is a higher reinfection rate with Omicron, even if you had Delta before.
00:28:35.480Whether it goes the other way around, Megan, I just haven't seen any literature to suggest one way or the other.
00:28:40.440And this is what they were reporting today in the New York Times reporting that if you get Omicron, you have a lesser chance of then getting Delta than if it went the other way around, which, of course, will lead a lot of people to say, well, great.
00:28:53.440If I have to get one variant, I'll get Omicron and I'll prevent the double.
00:28:57.840You know, I'll prevent another Omicron and I'll prevent a Delta because there are a lot of people who either can't get vaccinated or have just chosen not to get vaccinated.
00:29:04.800And, you know, they're not afraid of covid, you know, for whatever reasons, maybe it's the 18 to 30 year old said that they don't need to be afraid of covid unless they're immunocompromised in some way.
00:29:14.240So, I mean, you can understand it. The the rate of spread, however, is at an all time high in the country.
00:29:20.620That's why Fauci is saying stop looking at case numbers. And now it so happens.
00:29:24.080Most of us agree with him and have been saying don't look at case numbers as the metric all along.
00:29:28.040That's that hasn't been the right metric from the very beginning.
00:29:30.260But now even he's saying it because what you tell me, how bad will it get?
00:29:36.300And should we be basing any policy, school closures or otherwise, a number of cases at this point?
00:29:42.540Absolutely not. It makes no sense to base the school closures or any other kind of policy on on case spread alone.
00:29:50.200I think the thinking was that you look at case spread because you want to get a sense of how how well we're doing with our with our masking or lockdown policies to try to stop the disease from spreading around.
00:30:03.320Right. In New York, in the early days, there was every day there would be a press conference bragging about how we were getting the virus under control.
00:30:10.820And for a long time, every time the cases went down, it was it was a success of the governor that was running the state as long as it was a sort of blue state governor.
00:30:21.200And if the cases went up, then then obviously was a failure of the governor of the policies that usually in a red state.
00:30:28.200I think that kind of politicization based around a scientific fallacy that we have some possibility of controlling the spread of this virus at all is has been completely destructive to the confidence that people have in public health.
00:30:41.940Public health should not be politicized in the way it has been. It should not be used for political purposes the way it has been.
00:30:47.680And I think so from a scientific point of view, from an epidemiologic point of view, tracking cases by themselves, if maybe interesting, it's something epidemiologists can talk to each other about.
00:30:59.160But to use it to drive policy and especially to use it to drive panic and fear in the population has been completely irresponsible.
00:31:08.420And I'm really glad to see that that they're finally scaling. You're sort of pushing sort of tracking back from that.
00:31:15.240Now, I am seeing that when you look at rates of hospitalization and death, the numbers are promising.
00:31:21.060I mean, nobody wants to see people still dying or being severely hurt by covid, but it's a reality, especially if you're very old or very sick and haven't been vaccinated that, you know, it poses a real threat.
00:31:33.100So if you're in those groups, for sure, you should be getting vaccinated and you should be looking into one of the therapeutics.
00:31:37.940God forbid you contract covid because especially this this Pfizer drug can really, really prevent you from dying.
00:31:44.640However, if you look at the numbers out of South Africa and they're the ones who first alerted us to Omicron, they're encouraging.
00:31:49.860A South African study just found that the hospitalized patients during the Omicron surge were far less likely, far less to have severe illness or to die.
00:31:59.220Seventy four percent of hospitalized patients required oxygen therapy during Delta.
00:32:03.820During that wave, the number in South Africa dropped to seventeen point six percent amid Omicron.
00:32:09.420That's huge from seventy four to seventeen.
00:32:11.760The median length of stay in the hospital prior to Omicron was seven to eight days.
00:34:48.420They should have been stocking up all summer long for this very predictable winter surge that's come along.
00:34:54.100It really does make you think it's all about politics.
00:34:56.200You know, it's like, well, it was a DeSantis thing, a death Santis thing.
00:34:59.360And so we can't be associated with that, you know, because he has to be demonized the whole Florida policy, just like you three guys and gal, I should say, two guys and a gal at Great Barrington Declaration.
00:35:09.180You need to be demonized anything once they've decided it's anti what they're saying for the moment has to be demonized rather than considered, tested, kicked around, you know, the normal scientific process.
00:35:20.360And it's really to the detriment, A, yes, of our well-being, but B, of our trust in these institutions and public health in general.
00:35:27.640Yeah, I mean, I think for me, I don't, I don't, I had never thought about this disease as a political thing.
00:35:34.460And it's, it comes as a matter of some shock and sadness that has become politicized in this way, because I think that kind of politicization has made it difficult to actually consider alternate ideas that actually might work better than the ones we've adopted.
00:35:48.620A lot of the, the, the, the attacks on, on me personally, and on, on the, on the Great Barrington Declaration generally, and on, on, on early treatment, on, even on the, on the vaccines themselves have been fueled by this political politicization of the, of the discussion of public health.
00:36:06.480And, you know, I, frankly, it's, it's, it's, I, I don't even blame politicians.
00:36:11.520It's public health itself that has been responsible for this.
00:36:15.520Does anyone looking at the actions of Dr. Fauci doubt what political party he favors?
00:36:21.080Is there anyone who looks at the actions of public health generally and how they treated Dr. Scott Atlas last year, for instance, just for the crime of advising a president?
00:36:30.660I have any doubt about the sympathies of public health and their politics, that kind of political leaning in a profession should ostensibly be politically neutral, fuels distrust, fuels the kind of bad outcomes that we've seen.
00:36:46.920Um, and that's something that I think public health needs to look itself very carefully in the mirror and, and deal with going forward because public health needs to be trusted by everybody.
00:36:56.140It should be for the public at large, not for just a part of the public with whom public health agrees with politically.
00:37:02.520The, um, the, the, the point is underscored by the fact that AOC, who has spent the past two years ripping on DeSantis and any Republicans who push back on the Fauci narratives, um, decided to take her vacation.
00:37:13.720She's, of course, from, uh, New York state, from the Bronx, well, really from Yorktown Heights, which is a Tony area of Westchester.
00:37:20.180Um, she decided to take her vacation down in Florida.
00:37:23.440Not, not the great state of New York, my home state, uh, but down to Florida.
00:37:27.960And, uh, DeSantis' office sent out a tweet saying something like, welcome to Florida where we're free.
00:37:32.140And she decided to respond, this is not for you, Jay, but basically for our audience, she decided to respond by saying those who were attacking her, uh, were Republicans mad that they can't date her.
00:37:43.720And that they are projecting their sexual frustrations onto her.
00:38:20.120And I'm so sick, Jay, of the, the masking, you know, like, like I said in the, in the intro, our school sends out this letter like, oh, of course, of course these boys are going to stay masked indefinitely.
00:38:30.520I just don't know what to do to make them see reason.
00:38:33.700I mean, I think, uh, uh, you know what, I, I, uh, applaud anyone who wants to live, live their life.
00:38:41.200I mean, I think that is in, in our lives, we have to decide what's important to us.
00:38:45.640And if a politician wants to go to Florida and, uh, have a, you know, have a vacation, I'm, I'm not going to, I'm in no role to criticize, but I, you know, my, my wife would love to go, like move to Florida as well.
00:38:58.060California has been in many ways, much more miserable than I, I mean, I've lived here for many, many years and, uh, it has been a, uh, kind of a miserable time the last two years, uh, with so many of the policies focused on control of one virus, as opposed to thinking more broadly about public health.
00:39:15.440Uh, generally, I think it's, it creates a living situation that doesn't feel free.
00:39:19.900And so it's not surprising to me that, uh, that people want, find attractive, a place like Florida that where, uh, public health is taken much more holistically.
00:39:28.560Mm-hmm. The, I have a friend who's out in LA right now on a vacation and she was hiking outside. It's beautiful there. You know, if you want to hike outside. And, uh, she said, most of the people were wearing masks outside while they're hiking. It's like, hello, you don't need my, even my brother-in-law who I love. He, we saw him over the holiday and he, he was offering us these little things that you can put under your mask that make it easier to breathe. I don't, it's like these little plastic things. And I said, Ken, I don't, I don't want to make the mask more
00:39:58.560user-friendly. I want the mask off. That's my goal. I refuse to submit to fashion or comfort or anything else with these masks. In the meantime, I want it off my face and I want it off my kids' faces. And I just don't think short of moving, um, or politics, I'm going to be able to convince these heads of school out here that it's the right thing to do. What do you make of the masking?
00:40:21.620I mean, I think we have vastly oversold masking as a solution to this epidemic, uh, as a solution to controlling the spread of the disease. At the beginning of the epidemic, there were dozens of randomized studies with the flu, randomized studies conducted in community settings, even in hospital settings where it, they showed very little efficacy against control of viral spread. And back then it was the flu, right? That, that they'd done these randomized studies, dozens of them. Um, since that, since COVID,
00:40:51.540there've been two randomized studies and both have found either small or no effect in terms of the efficacy of masking and protecting against disease spread, both protecting UN and protecting others. Um, very, very low efficacy. Uh, when you
00:41:05.060have public health putting, going so four square behind one, a, a, a intervention, uh, universally adopted, pushing it for universally adopted, uh, with such low levels of efficacy, it's going to breed distrust. And especially when you're told, well, it's not that, it's not that problematic to wear. It's like, you know, there's no cost to wearing it. There's no harm. Well, anyone, I mean, truly there's, uh, is there anyone that can honestly say that they prefer wearing a mask? If they, uh, I mean, it's, it's, it's okay. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,