Dan Bongino on Status of Charlie Kirk Assassin Investigation, Plus, Cultural Decline, with Mark Halperin, Emily Jashinsky, and Peter Navarro ｜ Ep. 1149
Live from SiriusXM headquarters in New York, Megynkellekis explains why she's still debating whether or not to cancel her upcoming cross-country tour in honor of Charlie Kirk, who was killed in a helicopter crash last week.
00:00:00.520Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.
00:00:12.220Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show. We're coming to you live today from Sirius XM headquarters in New York.
00:00:19.460And I want to start with something that we've been talking a lot about in my house since Charlie Kirk's assassination last week.
00:00:28.080And that is the tour that we announced last Monday, Megyn Kelly Live. This is the first time we've taken the show on the road.
00:00:35.980It's a cross-country tour set to begin next month. We're going coast to coast.
00:00:41.820And we began selling tickets last week and we began our promotional tour where I've just been calling into local radio stations and talking about the tour and the cities it's coming to.
00:00:52.000And Charlie was supposed to join us on one stop of that tour in California.
00:00:59.780And we paused all of our promotional efforts as soon as Charlie was killed.
00:01:06.160Just out of respect, first of all. And second of all, because he was in a lot of the materials and the ads that we were running.
00:01:12.840Totally inappropriate, given what's happened. And then we had a serious discussion internally with my team and internally with my family about the tour.
00:01:27.000Because as you probably know, if you listen to the show, I don't actually go out there that often.
00:01:32.240I'm not like Charlie in that way. I'm more of a private person.
00:01:37.340I know it's odd because I have a public job, but I just am more of a private person.
00:01:42.420And most of my spare time is spent with my family.
00:01:46.120And in all of those talks, I've heard everyone's concerns.
00:01:50.580And I'm well aware of the challenges that now face us in doing this.
00:01:54.780And all I can tell you is there is no fucking way I am canceling one stop on this tour.
00:03:59.360We're going to make it safe for my team and my guests and you.
00:04:02.100And we are going to get together and we're going to talk about the things that matter.
00:04:07.640And we're still going to have some fun.
00:04:10.140You know, I was really looking forward to the tour and sort of having a raucous good time.
00:04:13.960And I think that still will be the case because if you're coming out of your homes and you're going to spend your time with me, I want you to enjoy yourself.
00:04:20.840You know, I'm sure that the stop in California where Charlie was going to join us will be more somber.
00:04:28.020And we're still debating what to do there.
00:07:01.500Everyone's going to go out, have a good time, talk about the news and do something really important, which is say what's true and what's real.
00:07:11.480Whether there's a threat or there's not.
00:07:32.160Throughout the weekend and even since our AM update show this morning, there have been significant developments in this investigation.
00:07:37.060FBI Director Cash Patel appearing on Fox News this morning, giving several updates first.
00:07:42.680Patel said investigators have found DNA evidence linking alleged assassin Tyler Robinson to the scene.
00:07:51.040OK, they said that they found Robinson's DNA on a screwdriver that was on the rooftop from which he took the shot, as well as the towel that was used to wrap the firearm believed to have been used in the shooting in that nearby grassy knoll wooded area.
00:08:04.380Director Patel says DNA found on the rifle is still being analyzed.
00:08:09.740Patel also discussing that Robinson wrote a note of some sort before the shooting.
00:08:15.520This is different from what he engraved on the bullet casings.
00:08:20.540He, in addition, wrote a note of some sort before the shooting stating that he believed he had an opportunity to, quote, take out Charlie Kirk and that he was, quote, going to take it.
00:08:59.960He, the suspect, with another individual in which he claimed that he had an opportunity to take out Charlie Kirk and he was going to do it because of his hatred for what Charlie stood for.
00:09:10.820Those are factually accurate investigatory findings by the FBI that we've handed over to the local authorities and the federal authorities to make their prosecutorial decisions.
00:09:21.000But I believe in this instance of such public importance, the public has a right to know.
00:09:25.980Now, it sounded like he had left that note in the apartment that he shared with his so-called boyfriend transitioning into female, which is not a thing.
00:09:38.080And that the note had been destroyed, but that they had managed to recreate it somehow.
00:09:43.900Director Patel also confirming reporting that Robinson himself is not cooperating with the authorities.
00:09:48.740He indicated that the FBI is looking into social media accounts that appear to indicate foreknowledge of an attack on Kirk, but said they must be careful in how those messages are obtained so as not to taint the legal process.
00:10:02.380His work will directly lead to Pam Bondi's prosecution of this shooter or the Utah state authorities.
00:10:25.620However, the Washington Free Beacon, they don't have to abide by any of those protocols.
00:10:29.480And they are citing three people at the FBI familiar with the investigation, reporting that the bureau is looking into posts by at least seven different accounts.
00:10:38.740Several of the accounts appear to belong to transgender individuals.
00:10:41.800And at least one of them followed the suspect in this case, Tyler Robinson's roommate.
00:10:47.460OK, so followed the roommate, the boyfriend with whom Robinson was reportedly in a romantic relationship.
00:10:55.600Minutes after Charlie Kirk was pronounced dead, the user posted on X, we fucking did it.
00:11:02.820This person has since deleted the account.
00:11:06.440Another user, five days before the shooting, wrote, quote, you guys, I have something big coming soon.
00:11:37.060Chud, apparently a sling derogatory, slang derogatory term for right wingers.
00:11:43.020This user has also deleted the account.
00:11:45.140The Free Beacon also reporting a TikTok account by an individual who appears to be transgender, writing, quote, Charles James Kirk does not know what's coming tomorrow.
00:12:15.960And there's new information regarding Tyler Robinson, the suspect, as well.
00:12:20.100As I mentioned above, he was in a romantic relationship with his roommate, who's a biological man pretending that he can become a female.
00:12:28.600And in the process of that, quote, transition, this news was confirmed to Axios by six sources.
00:12:34.780And not just that, but as we reported in our own AM update this morning, Tyler Robinson himself appears to have a link to so-called furry culture and a website to this culture, which is linked to the trans community and which involves people dressing up like animals and getting some sort of sexual fetish out of it.
00:12:54.440By the way, that same so-called boyfriend who was trying to trans himself into female was constantly all over the Internet in furry costumes.
00:13:04.000That's where the things stand this morning at 1213 Eastern Time.
00:13:09.960Joining me now to go over all the breaking developments is the deputy director of the FBI, Dan Bongino.
00:13:15.340If you are stressed about back taxes, maybe you missed that April deadline or your books are a mess.
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00:14:20.580Dan, thank you so much for being here.
00:14:22.500Let's just start with this person with whom the suspect was in a romantic relationship.
00:14:29.100Can you confirm this information that it was this man transitioning from male to female and that the two of them were in a romantic relationship together?
00:14:36.640It appears, Megan, from the information we've accumulated both forensically and digitally in the comms between the two and some of the statements from family and friends that there was a relationship here that may have been beyond platonic.
00:14:54.100I think we have a good body of information at this point indicating that.
00:15:00.320And can I just say, if I was listening to you open there, just let me say in advance, I don't do a lot of media coming from a media space.
00:15:08.600And I may surprise some people, but I haven't.
00:15:10.840I've only done a few media appearances since I've been here for the last six months.
00:15:14.220But we believe, both the director and I and others, that given the public interest, significant public interest in this case, understandably, that it's important we get out ahead and share as much as we can.
00:15:27.420I only say that because there are things I'm not, as a deputy director, able to come to communicate to you and other things I will.
00:15:35.400So I just want you to understand, don't mistake sometimes my lack of an answer for anything other than there's a reason.
00:15:42.800No, we don't have Dan Bongino podcasters sitting here.
00:15:46.580We have Dan Bongino, deputy director of the FBI, and you have to be more careful in that role.
00:16:31.700However, there is apparently a network of people, whether they were friends.
00:16:36.900And I think you hit on the important question in the open.
00:16:40.940Given his network of friends and associates, what was the level of foreknowledge about this attack?
00:16:47.300Did they know something and refuse to say something?
00:16:50.200Did they know something and think it was a joke?
00:16:52.380Now, as an attorney, you're well aware.
00:16:55.640There's going to be a lot of opinions on the matter.
00:16:57.860However, we have to build a probable cause case and get over that hurdle in order to properly charge other people if they do have involvement.
00:17:07.260And so that's – but this, I want to assure the audience, I was pretty clear on this in the news appearance this morning.
00:17:41.740But we're not done at all looking into any possible support or aiding and abetting in the case.
00:17:47.680Do we believe that Twiggs had advanced knowledge of this shooting, given the fact that he clearly received texts from Tyler telling him where to find the gun, what was written on the casings, and so on?
00:17:58.640And that he had those when you guys went knocking on his door.
00:18:03.500Well, given the cooperation of that subject at this time, I don't want to say too much about what he's saying or not saying.
00:18:12.120However, there are indicators just beyond Twiggs that there were a lot of warning signs here in this case.
00:18:18.760And having said that, this is a good moment to put out there.
00:18:23.620When you look at these targeted violence attacks, political assassinations, space I'm unfortunately all too familiar with in my time with the Secret Service, school shootings, not random violence, not domestic violence, but targeted violence for political or ideological reasons.
00:18:39.080You see a lot of these warning signs in advance where they tell people, is that the case here?
00:18:51.540And I'm not suggesting it's in this case.
00:18:53.200But we hear, oh, I thought it was a joke.
00:18:55.500And, you know, I hate the just generic advice of the see something, say something, because it gets blown off.
00:19:01.600But this happens, unfortunately, all too many times.
00:19:04.620And there were a number of warning signs there that this individual suspect in the case had taken a dark turn.
00:19:11.980And I want to put out in advance, obviously, as well as the deputy director, that everyone's presumed innocent in our republic, no matter how vile the crime is.
00:19:21.680But facts are facts, evidence are evidence.
00:19:24.140And we really, really feel both Cash and I feel the need to talk to the public here.
00:19:29.120And, again, I just don't want anyone in the public to assume sometimes my lack of an answer is in any way a problem with clarity.
00:19:37.120There are just some reasons we can't talk about some things.
00:19:39.360But we really do want to address as many of these issues as we can with the public.
00:19:44.160Director Patel said on Fox & Friends this morning that the suspect had a text message exchange with another individual in which he claimed that he had an opportunity to take out Charlie Kirk.
00:19:59.120And he was going to do it because of his hatred for what Charlie stood for.
00:20:03.940So that sounds pretty explicit by the director that in advance there was a text exchange with another individual in which Robinson claimed he had an opportunity to take him out and he was going to do it.
00:20:14.180So that would lead any of us to conclude, Dan, that there was at least one other individual who knew that Robinson was planning to murder Charlie.
00:20:22.720Yeah, that was a reference to the note you referenced in your opening of your show that according to the evidence we have now that that particular statement may have been on the note.
00:20:37.320There's we're still investigating whether that note was in fact seen in advance.
00:20:44.780But there there is some evidence here that there were some, you know, pre attack indicators, the specificity of that and when they knew it, when they saw it, that we're still looking into.
00:20:54.580Do we believe that there's potentially some sort of trans group online that may have had foreknowledge of this attack?
00:21:04.320Well, there's a number of forensic digital pieces we have indicating that this was ideologically targeted.
00:21:17.040I mean, Charlie Kirk was obviously a prominent, well-known public figure known for espousing proudly his conservative views.
00:21:30.280That's, you know, we've had a relationship that goes back years.
00:21:33.820I have had to put a lot of those emotions aside in order to assist our FBI team in getting answers on the case.
00:21:42.140But some of the digital footprints we have and traffic we have that we were able to accumulate after we had the suspect in custody seem to indicate that there was a significant ideological component to this attack.
00:21:58.300I mean, clearly, I mean, clearly Charlie was a target.
00:22:00.620Clearly, he was a conservative commentator.
00:22:02.620And when you look at the evidence we've accumulated from friends and family and digitally, the communications traffic, there appears to be a real significant anger at Charlie Kirk because of some of his ideas.
00:22:16.120Did that include his ideas on transing children and trans individuals?
00:22:21.600Well, when you look at some of the bullet casings, the inscriptions on some of the bullet casings and some of the digital traffic to people in his network, it appears that may have been a part of it.
00:22:35.820It appears pretty significant in this case, especially given the relationship.
00:22:39.400We want to make sure we nail that down for, of course, for charging documents in conjunction with our state and local partners.
00:22:47.960But I don't want to give up exactly what we have on the digital side right now.
00:22:53.820That's fine. I don't want to make you do anything that would compromise the investigation.
00:22:58.020I want you guys to keep your hands clean.
00:22:59.300Is it true that Robinson is not cooperating?
00:23:04.740Robinson, to this point, is not cooperating.
00:23:07.680He has an attorney, which is his constitutional right to do so.
00:23:11.880And hence, that's why, you know, I did a cable interview news this morning about this case.
00:23:17.920That's why there are some questions I'm hesitant to answer.
00:23:21.520Because if he was if he was cooperating in this case, again, most of us in the legal space, you included, know this.
00:23:27.420It's obviously easier to get answers because he is a suspect in the case.
00:23:32.040So you'd like to hear from the suspect if you're suspicious of the suspect, what exactly they say they may or may not have done.
00:23:39.420So there are some elements to the mechanics of of the of the crime where it would be helpful at this point if Robinson was cooperative.
00:23:51.480But he has a constitutional right, which is exercised at this point.
00:23:56.100We feel, however, again, everybody's innocent until proven guilty.
00:23:59.640But we feel, however, that we've built an extremely strong case.
00:24:17.560I mean, but I do want you to know as taxpayers and citizens, you pay for the FBI.
00:24:24.740You pay for your Utah DPS and other entities out there that there's been none of this kind of internal fighting that may have happened in the past.
00:24:33.880I mean, our ERT, our evidence response team, Megan, that was a massive crime scene, massive crime scene.
00:24:41.240Hundreds of people, articles of there were, you know, I can't get emotional about this.
00:24:49.860But I was there in the crime scene and we spent a couple of days there, both the director and I.
00:24:57.560And when you go in the room where they had put the school bags and then, you know, one of the things, sorry, but one of the things that really hit me, there's a room where all of the personal articles that were left behind at the scene, which were significant, were being stored on the campus.
00:25:14.400And, you know, when you're processing all this and it hits you, weird, you know, weird things.
00:25:22.300You think about the weirdest of things and I just, I couldn't believe how many water bottles would everybody had one of those water bottles.
00:25:29.260The kids have these fancy water bottles and they were everywhere in the room and there was a baby carriages and things like that.
00:25:36.820And our evidence response team responded and immediately had this crime scene ready to go.
00:25:44.560And we had an agent there in 16 minutes from the time Charlie was shot.
00:25:48.680And thanks to the incredible work of the state and local partners as well, they were able to process this crime scene and accumulate an unbelievable amount of forensic evidence.
00:25:57.900When you walk the crime scene, there is little they did not think of, you know, when I was up there on the roof.
00:26:03.940Do we have any idea why the roof wasn't covered by security?
00:26:39.820I think in the future at political events, regardless of who's speaking, I think there's going to be a significant change in security posture going forward.
00:26:51.540Mm hmm. Back on the subject of the defendant and his boyfriend, the boyfriend Twiggs, is he still cooperating?
00:26:58.180As of this point, the family and friends, we have a good number of people, including the the romantic partner who have been who have been cooperating and continue to that could change.
00:27:15.920Of course, we hope it doesn't where it's very beneficial to have these folks cooperating.
00:27:20.960It's of note that pursuant to the press conference where we put out the photo of the suspect at the time and the video and the reason we put out the video.
00:27:31.100I just I'll answer your question. But this is important, too.
00:27:34.060There's a tie in here. The reason we decided and there's a lot of second guessing going on.
00:27:40.480And that's important. Listen, this is a taxpayer funded operation.
00:27:43.540The FBI, it's not a private company. You have every right to question everything.
00:27:47.020You pay for it. But we have an explanation forever. Nothing we did was by accident.
00:27:52.860You know, when we held that press conference at night, the reason we had the the the governor and everyone put out that video is we wanted to anchor the new photos we had released.
00:28:03.300And we're going to put out in front of a national primetime audience.
00:28:05.960We wanted to anchor it to the video so you understood why we were looking for this particular suspect.
00:28:11.860Now, to get back to your question about cooperation, pursuant to that, it was just a short time after, thankfully, due to the work of all the partners involved in this, the there were members of the suspect circle that recognized him and agreed.
00:28:29.200And he went and they turned themselves in.
00:28:31.080Like I said this morning, his dad, his dad recognized him.
00:28:34.300Yeah. Yeah. And that was due to the, you know, the work of these folks.
00:28:38.640Again, this is no time for don't be silly, you know, victory laps.
00:28:42.540None of that stuff matters. You know, this is a serious crime that's had repercussions and will have repercussions moving forward that are going to be very dramatic for political dialogue in the country.
00:28:52.520But, yeah, that that decision was was not an easy one.
00:28:57.440You know, you don't want to put out a picture and say, well, that picture came out earlier.
00:29:01.820Yeah, but it didn't come out earlier to a primetime audience of potentially five to 10 million people.
00:29:06.540I was sitting in the command post, Megan, with our entire team, which was significant.
00:29:11.960There were a large number of people there from state and local officials to our FBI team to people who are going to manage the media because the media can be your friend and was our friend in this investigation.
00:29:23.500I said to them when they came in, I said, you know, someone's sitting next to this guy in a restaurant right now.
00:29:28.540Mm hmm. And when they walked back in and we had an ident and a name, a identifier, I mean, to speak in jargon, we had an identifier on it.
00:29:39.200I don't want to say exactly what they said, but when they walked back in the CP, you know, and I looked at cash and we just this sense of relief.
00:29:46.840We were you there, Dan, when he was brought in?
00:29:48.740Three hours. No, he was brought in to to it was about forgive me if I'm not exactly correct, but it was about three hours from where we were in Orem and that whole Provo area.
00:30:02.040It was a different place near St. George. So he was brought in there. So we had to transport him back.
00:30:08.120We just wanted to be sure. Obviously, Megan, we didn't care where he did as long as it was a law enforcement facility and we could appropriately take a suspect at the time into custody.
00:30:21.480And now I got to ask you this and you know why. But is he being watched so that there can be no suicide?
00:30:28.620Yeah, that's that's what we've been told from local officials who have custody over him right now, that he is he is, in fact, on watch.
00:30:36.320That's a that is obviously going to remain a concern is that did he buy this gun legally?
00:30:45.380I don't want to say right now how he acquired the gun, but there was I will say there was some significant concerns expressed by the suspect in the case about the gun and retrieving the gun.
00:30:59.220And the reason I bring this up is, again, I'm here with you in every effort to share what we can appropriately share so that information vacuums aren't filled.
00:31:10.120There was some conversation I heard on. I'm sorry, it was a news chat.
00:31:13.780I forget which one I was listening to about retrieving the weapon.
00:31:18.480And there was some confusion where I believe that one of the hosts thought it was a retrieval from an FFL, a firearms dealer.
00:31:28.020The digital comms traffic that we have and the concerns the suspect in this case were expressing where it was retrieving the firearm from the crime scene, not not from a firearms dealer.
00:31:40.940Well, that's another thing that people are confused about, because if Cash said that they found his what we presume was his screwdriver on the top of the building and they found his DNA on it, leading many to believe he had disassembled the gun when he jumped off of the roof.
00:31:54.340But then it appears when you guys found it in the woods, it was assembled.
00:31:58.020So can you provide any clarity on that?
00:32:00.180Yeah, and I was a little hesitant in a media appearance this morning to go into specifics on especially the video and where the gun was.
00:32:11.380And there's a reason. Again, we only want to be transparent here.
00:32:18.240The suspect, yeah, the suspect not cooperating, the video is obviously grainy.
00:32:25.360And as folks in the video space know out there, we can we have a number of really excellent tools in our lab, which is they're doing amazing work and they've been up and handling this for days now.
00:32:38.560But the video is very grainy and I want to be very clear and I don't want to.
00:32:43.080Oh, there was you know, I've already seen some online.
00:32:45.320Yeah, I can see it on the screen. You'll see it's a grainy video.
00:32:48.140Now, I've been I've been on that roof in that corner and when you see the camera in the distance away, it's clearly not the best video.
00:32:57.520Now, let me just go back to what I said before and I'll get into the gun.
00:33:01.040Don't let me forget the gun portion of it.
00:33:02.980It's because I just want to watch this for a second.
00:33:05.200You'll see here. Yeah, there's there's a couple different what we call it.
00:33:19.640Sometimes there's an audio on. I should be better.
00:33:21.540This is a former media person. I forget there's an audio component only.
00:33:24.700I got you. Watch it. The camera is quite far away.
00:33:27.840It's not the best camera to see exactly what happened to the gun.
00:33:32.800However, we have some working theories and one of them is that he he drops the firearm fully assembled onto the ground and and then retrieves it.
00:33:43.020Now, the firearm we're processing in conjunction with our ATF friends, but the firearm was wrapped in a towel.
00:33:50.320And as the director said this morning on on a cable news appearance, the towel, we did get a pretty strong forensic DNA hit.
00:33:59.920So that's the only reason. Again, I don't want anyone to speculate.
00:34:03.200Oh, they're not sure where the gun is. Oh, no.
00:34:06.120I just we have to be careful what we put out in the video is not the best quality.
00:34:10.620It's it's not. And for no other reason than it's, you know, the video was that camera where it is, is not a crime scene camera.
00:34:18.300It's a camera designed for just general surveillance on campus.
00:34:21.440And when you're there, you'll see it's it's it's a distance away.
00:34:24.620But I missed my point. I want to wrap this point up because it's really important.
00:34:28.800You may fairly enough as as taxpaying citizens again, say, well, you know, during the presser, why release screening video?
00:34:36.560Because that is the crime scene there. That's where we you know, we have evidence of a suspect who shot from that location.
00:34:45.160We have a suspect who appears to be on camera. They're fleeing the location.
00:34:49.320And we wanted to anchor that. This is really important to the photos we were releasing.
00:34:54.120What we didn't want is we release a photo and people say, well, why? Why that particular photo?
00:35:00.060We thought the video, how the quality is OK, but not, you know, the pixels are not great.
00:35:06.560We wanted to be sure we could anchor it to here's why this particular suspect is of interest to us right now.
00:35:13.300The I got to ask you about this Fox News report by Jackie Henrich, the White House correspondent,
00:35:18.380who says you and Cash are under fire, political fire, that she reports the White House.
00:35:25.200Pam Bondi, Todd Blanch, her deputy, have no confidence in Cash Patel.
00:35:29.080Citing one source, Pam in particular, cannot stand him. Blanch either.
00:35:32.360They said referring to Pam Bondi and Todd Blanch.
00:35:36.000Bondi and Blanch denied the characterization.
00:35:38.100White House officials denied any plans to remove Director Patel.
00:35:41.380But the headline is that knives are out for Cash Patel.
00:35:44.920It ends with something about you, Dan, saying three sources also point out Dan Bongino's days are more likely numbered than Patel's.
00:35:52.000As he threatened to quit amid fallout from the Epstein feud with Bondi.
00:35:55.620I want to give you a chance to comment on those two pieces.
00:36:15.160So just to be clear, an off-the-record person who was not willing to put their name to any of this, who may not like what the director and I are doing here, off-the-record, off-the-record, said, wow, these guys are in a lot of trouble.
00:36:29.420On the record, everyone from the president to Todd to Pam to everyone else says the exact opposite.
00:36:35.800So your story, not you, but the story is what?
00:37:05.700We've arrested over 800 sexual predators in Operation Restoring Justice.
00:37:10.460We engaged in a massive nationwide manhunt for violent fugitives in Operation Not Forgotten.
00:37:17.200We've arrested now between illegal immigrants and violent felons during Operation Summer Heat and our emergency removal operations with our DHS and ISIS partners.
00:37:29.540The violent crime rate is dropping to historic lows.
00:37:32.980We've had Operation Viper ongoing for a long time in conjunction with the White House in Memphis, something I can tell you on your show today.
00:37:40.800The White House, the Department of Justice and Cash and I got together early, and we've been engaged in this summer heat violent crime effort.
00:37:49.320You know, you have four of 10 FBI's most wanted.
00:37:53.240We've accumulated, we've dealt with the L.A. riots, the Coeur d'Alene shooting, the attack on the Minnesota lawmakers.
00:37:59.400We've dealt with school shootings, the Palm Springs incident, the Boulder, Colorado attack, public corruption cases.
00:38:06.060We have had epic, epic disclosures in the transparency front on things you never would have seen.
00:38:11.980If the White House was unhappy and President Trump was unhappy, you and I have known the president a long time.
00:38:18.240You really believe the president's not just going to call it?
00:38:20.840Just to be clear, I don't mean to get personal, but you know the president like I do.
00:38:24.580Do you think he's the type to not call you?
00:38:26.820So I'm a little skeptical of garbage reporting about unnamed sources who may not like what I just told you,
00:38:34.020who are saying, oh my gosh, the knives are out.
00:38:35.980When everybody on the record is saying, what are you talking about?
00:38:46.140I got to ask you this, Dan, and I know you got to run, but just before I let you go, a word on Charlie,
00:38:51.100because you have to, like, you're in this, I'm in a unique position in that I had to report on the death of my friend as it happened.
00:38:59.920And you're in the unique position of now having to investigate your friend's murder.
00:39:04.480This has got to be a strange, strange headspace to be in as you have to be both a cop and check your emotions at a time when you're still a man, you're still a friend.
00:39:15.440You know, whenever I need good advice, I talk with my wife.
00:39:31.100You probably do the same thing with your husband.
00:39:33.400You know, they know you better, right?
00:39:35.220Nobody knows you better than your spouse.
00:39:36.960They see you at your best, your worst.
00:39:38.440And she said to me, you know, about an hour or so after we found out I had texted her, I said, you know, he's dead.
00:39:49.520And because this floor is a skiff, you can't carry your cell phone.
00:40:03.000And I went back to my phone, and I called my wife.
00:40:05.660And we were talking a little bit, and she said to me a little bit into the call, she said, you know, would you rather be on the air with your audience right now, walking people through this, or would you rather be in this job, you know, hunting this person down?
00:41:37.480And what a high bar he's got to get over every morning to go out there and make sure he's asking the right questions.
00:41:45.480And not doing anything to, you know, like you heard him super careful because the last thing he wants to do is say anything to Megyn Kelly or anybody else that would jeopardize the prosecution.
00:41:56.420That's really where the rubber meets the road.
00:41:58.840These guys are doing all the investigative building blocks to hand the right evidence over to the prosecutors.
00:42:03.720You know, the main goal is, A, get the evidence and B, don't fuck it up.
00:42:07.820Don't do anything that's going to give the skilled defense attorney.
00:42:10.500And there will be one in this case because this guy is going to be a media star.
00:42:13.980So a lot of defense attorneys who are super talented will volunteer to do this, even though they normally wouldn't do defense work that's pro bono, to give that person a way to wiggle out very high stakes to what we're seeing now.
00:42:28.080And yet you see a Trump administration that's determined to be transparent.
00:42:31.600When do you ever see the FBI come on television and talk about arrests like that?
00:46:29.340And Mark, I totally get what you're saying.
00:46:31.640I'm also wondering to what extent they've been pushed by media reports.
00:46:35.120These are public posts in a lot of cases.
00:46:37.200The Free Beacon report that you mentioned, Megan.
00:46:40.320I'm sure because the FBI is looking at the reporting that's coming out publicly, they then are trying to balance what they say with what's out there.
00:46:49.360And, man, what a difficult situation to find themselves in.
00:48:30.880And I am not suggesting government conspiracy, like they intentionally kept somebody off the roof at all.
00:48:35.760I just genuinely don't understand how they could not have done that, given what we saw in Butler 14 months earlier.
00:48:40.940But that, too, is a bit of like a hindsight, because I think while they were conscious of security there,
00:48:46.400I don't think any of us goes into an event prior to this thinking we need presidential level security.
00:48:51.420Well, yeah, that's an important point.
00:48:52.520And actually, I've checked in with some of my friends who work in the campus conservative lecture space.
00:48:56.520And one of the things they told me, this was really interesting, it's that because, and you may know this, Megan,
00:49:00.920because you speak in highly public places, when you're outside, the benefit of that for a conservative speaker is that the leftist trolls on campus can't buy up the tickets, like if you're inside.
00:49:12.340And because these groups, I mean, Charlie was enormously popular, but he's not Justin Bieber.
00:49:18.720And Turning Point USA is not, you know, it's not Paramount or some major corporation.
00:49:24.580So you actually are just not even in the habit of having that kind of money to put behind security.
00:51:27.080Trump's Department of Justice sued three major Medicare brokers for pretending to be unbiased while allegedly pushing people into the plans that got the brokers the biggest kickbacks.
00:52:50.240And I never really thought about it, but it made sense to me, guys, when I read what they were saying, which was if they had to hear the terrible news, they preferred to hear it from people who actually knew Charlie and appreciated Charlie and loved Charlie and knew what he did as opposed to like, what are you going to tune in, CNN?
00:53:08.300And listen to one of these people who's helped demonize him over the years, tell you this stuff.
00:53:11.840It's just like another interesting piece of the media story, right?
00:53:18.220And on the media story, I have to spend more a minute on Karen Atiyah.
00:53:23.620So this woman may or may not be familiar to our audience.
00:53:26.940She worked, I think, at one point for The New York Times, but has been with The Washington Post for a long time.
00:53:31.740And I mentioned her right after 10-7 because she and I followed each other on X.
00:53:37.660And it was an interesting relationship because she's this lefty black woman at The Washington Post and I'm this righty white woman in the digital lane.
00:53:45.960But we followed each other and like I would like her posts with her cat, you know, like you kind of go to the safe ones, you know, or like it just to me, it restored my sense of humanity.
00:53:56.680Like you can have this relationship with somebody.
00:54:38.340So now it's morphed from all I did was like a tweet to I liked it, but it was a private tweet to or private like to I liked it, but only because I secretly didn't like it.
00:54:49.440And then she responded, and now you're probably hoping that one of your followers finds me, my address, and causes harm to me because of a like.
00:55:14.200That was the end of our weird little fake friendship.
00:55:16.820And now she's out there tweeting about Charlie.
00:55:19.680So she's been with a longtime columnist with the Washington Post.
00:55:23.760And she's now claiming that she was fired for her Blue Sky Post following Charlie's assassination and also the Minnesota lawmaker Melissa Hortman.
00:55:32.540The Post accused her of gross misconduct, unacceptable behavior, and endangering colleague's safety.
00:55:36.960She rejects the charges as false, hasty, and a violation of journalistic fairness.
00:55:44.380For everyone saying political violence has no place in this country, remember two Democratic legislatures were shot in Minnesota just this year.
00:55:52.840Part of what keeps America so violent is the insistence that people perform care, empty goodness, and absolution for white men who espouse hatred and violence.
00:56:04.440I don't care for empty rhetoric because America, especially white America, is not going to do what it needs to to get rid of guns in their country.
00:56:54.160And it couldn't have happened to a nicer lady.
00:56:56.600She's representative of all these people around the country.
00:56:58.980Even if everything they're saying about Charlie were true and in her case and others, it's not the mentality of someone who would root for someone's death to be so cavalier about it.
00:57:11.060It's really shaken me as much as anything that's happened since he was killed.
00:57:14.200I just I struggle to understand the mentality of someone like her who would do who would do that.
00:58:40.200Yeah. And what's interesting is the performative nature of it, too, that you would do this into a camera and then post it on the Internet.
00:58:47.100It's not just feeling a moment of private joy, which is still reprehensible, but actually then sharing it.
00:58:52.600And part of me wonders if just the opportunity to share it is actually what makes people think that they should feel joy.
00:58:59.520Because you can get likes and retweets for posting stuff like this on TikTok or wherever it is.
00:59:05.440And the fact that I mean, I think we just all need to pause for a second and think about why a teacher of children would think that's OK.
00:59:13.940And from what I can tell, dozens of professionals, to your point, Megan, I mean, there are people compiling databases that are you have to go through and verify and confirm it.
00:59:22.880I'm not a huge fan of some of what I see looking like crackdown type stuff, but there needs to be shame and there needs to be a pause and say, what in our cultural psychology right now is making so many people think it's rewarding to post that publicly, to celebrate stuff like that publicly?
00:59:42.440It was completely insane. And it's beyond just the reasonable spectrum on the reasonable spectrum of opinion on an editorial board of a newspaper is completely we're talking about like doctors and nurses.
00:59:55.040I genuinely don't get it. I don't get there. There are a lot of people on the left. I can't stand a lot of long list.
01:00:00.840Never in a million years would I celebrate something like this happening to them.
01:00:04.680I want to add one more level of insanity to it.
01:00:06.680But the Washington Post, the New York Times this weekend wrote about these things and their reproachfulness in the news stories was not about what people were writing.
01:00:14.720It was about people trying to call attention to it and they're being fired.
01:00:17.620All of a sudden, after two decades of celebrating cancel culture, of having no hesitation to help people get fired, all of a sudden, it's like, how could people be how could people be identified as doing something wrong and be fired?
01:00:33.540And it's like, it's like, no, these stories should be about what's wrong with America, that people who are teachers and doctors and pilots would say these things about a man who was just assassinated.
01:00:43.560No, it makes me wonder, like, how can we have that teacher teaching a class full of students that may include kids from conservative families?
01:00:50.600How can we have that pilot flying a plane that may include someone like me?
01:01:09.780I mean, honestly, some of us have actually experienced cancel culture up close and personal in our face over talking about fucking Halloween costumes.
01:01:17.660And now they want me to feel bad that somebody gets fired because they cheered a political assassination of an innocent 31-year-old father of two.
01:03:25.700They can't help but go back to their orientation of, you know, they spent the weekend trying to say that this guy was super MAGA and that's why he killed Charlie.
01:04:35.320Again, you just think if this were a Democratic person of Charlie's place in the world, close to Barack Obama, these vigils would have led every newscast.