The Megyn Kelly Show - Deep Dive： The Truth About Minnesota's ＂Trans Refuge＂ Bill That Gov. Tim Walz Pushed Through ｜ Ep. 894

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00:00:30.980 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:42.640 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and today's deep dive special

00:00:47.580 episode that you're going to want to hear. Today, we are taking a very specific look at one very

00:00:53.720 specific Minnesota law, thanks to governor and now VP candidate Tim Walls, that the corporate

00:01:01.460 media continues to get totally wrong and continues to tell you doesn't exist or do all the things

00:01:09.980 that I have been telling you it does. I'm going to give you an example, okay? I've been talking

00:01:15.300 about it on this show. And then recently I went on the road with Tucker Carlson and explained

00:01:21.360 to him what will happen as a result of this Minnesota so-called trans refuge law.

00:01:28.720 And many people can't believe their ears. It's so radical. And they think I must have my facts

00:01:33.980 wrong. I must be spinning this. Well, I don't. And I'm not. Before I went out and spoke about this

00:01:40.340 publicly, I did my homework. As you know, I'm a lawyer and I consulted with many experts both

00:01:45.280 inside and outside of Minnesota on whether this law did what my own lying eyes told me that it did.

00:01:51.400 But they weren't lying. They were right. And I'll just give you a flavor for the discussion with

00:01:57.120 Tucker. You can see the whole thing online. But here's what I said. I come here and someone's like,

00:02:02.120 are you going to ask her about Taylor Swift? I've got thoughts. Screw you, Taylor Swift. 1.00

00:02:11.320 She turns around. Not only does she pick a side in a hotly contested presidential election, 0.73

00:02:17.260 alienating at least half of her fan base. But she says the reason she's voting for Kamala Harris

00:02:23.660 is because of Tim Walz's LGBTQ stance. Do you know what Tim Walz has done on the LGBTQ front?

00:02:35.820 Tim Walz... Let me tell you what's going to happen. Okay? Here's what's going to happen.

00:02:40.320 A little girl sitting in Wisconsin, who's maybe on the spectrum, maybe has acne, maybe is a little

00:02:48.460 heavyset, maybe feels upset because her parents are getting divorced, something like that,

00:02:52.900 is going to find herself down a rabbit hole on Reddit. And her parents aren't going to know

00:02:57.940 because they're getting a divorce and they're not focused on her right now. And she's going to

00:03:00.780 spend hour after hour on that thing. And Reddit's going to tell her she's actually a boy.

00:03:04.800 And she's going to get sucked into this gender cult. And she's going to say, mom and dad, 0.71

00:03:09.700 I want puberty blockers into cross-sex hormones, which will sterilize her and deprive her of all 1.00

00:03:14.660 sexual pleasure for the rest of her life. And they're going to say, no, you're a girl. And 0.98

00:03:19.700 she's going to say, but I want top surgery, this benign thing, this double mastectomy where I'll

00:03:24.600 have tubes coming out of me and I'll never breastfeed a child. I want that too, because I'm a boy.

00:03:28.260 And they're going to say, no. And she's going to go to a judge in Minnesota. And because of Tim

00:03:34.860 Walls, the court will take custody of her, use the Medicaid funds in Minnesota to provide her 0.93

00:03:41.800 all of those things, chop off her breasts, sterilize her with the puberty blockers into 1.00

00:03:46.540 the cross-sex hormones. And when this girl inevitably comes to the conclusion that she didn't want any of 0.91

00:03:51.360 this, that it only added to her problems, which were the divorce and the acne and the puberty and not

00:03:56.260 any trans issue, who is she going to go to then? This is all because of Tim Walls. That's what 1.00

00:04:02.780 Minnesota is doing right now to little girls and boys, taking custody away from the parents so that

00:04:07.560 they can have these procedures without any loving parent there to help. And that's what Taylor Swift 1.00

00:04:13.300 just endorsed for your children. So screw you, Taylor Swift. 1.00

00:04:18.860 So that is my interpretation of the law. And now I've brought on two legal experts on this law

00:04:25.800 to talk about it. We are joined now by Bob Roby. He's a Minnesota attorney, a family law attorney

00:04:32.260 who was almost going to testify about this law, but we'll get into what happened. And Matt Sharp,

00:04:40.660 who's senior counsel with Alliance Defending Freedom, which has been speaking out about it

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00:05:43.180 Guys, thank you both so much for being here. Great to have you.

00:05:45.500 Thanks for having me. Thanks. Okay. So Bob, you are one of the many experts I spoke with before

00:05:52.980 I went out there and commented at all on this thing months ago. And you tell me whether I have

00:06:00.140 overstated the draconian nature of this law. No, the scenario you set up is absolutely spot on as far

00:06:09.420 as what this law does. There's no question about it. When a bill uses terms like emergency custody

00:06:17.240 and describes what would warrant a court taking emergency custody in a case, you got to pay

00:06:28.320 attention. I mean, it defines gender affirming care, which the bill puts in the category of neglect or

00:06:35.980 abuse warranting emergency custody by a judge. And it defines gender affirming care, which is a total 0.73

00:06:44.580 euphemism. I mean, you know, gender, what's caring? You know, that's gender, you're denying care. That's 0.93

00:06:52.820 what the Minnesota narrative has been crafted into this bill. And it's defining it to include the very

00:07:00.580 things you talked about, you know, any kind of hormone blockers, any kind of, you know, and it's

00:07:07.140 the classic scenario. This has happened. This is not just a theory. I mean, you know, Washington

00:07:12.620 Examiner reported on this thing with Abigail Martinez's daughter, who was put on testosterone

00:07:19.040 hormones and ended up throwing herself in front of a train and they had to pick up her pieces. And this

00:07:25.940 is, this has happened. This is a nightmare for people in Minnesota and, uh, and anyone, uh, you

00:07:34.180 know, who's, whose kid might end up there. Matt, what's your take? Yeah, I agree. And in fact, I take

00:07:41.260 it one step further, Megan, not only would this apply if a girl was in Minnesota, but let's say you

00:07:46.340 have a young lady living in Ohio and she has a woke aunt that says, you know what? I think you would 0.51

00:07:51.100 benefit from puberty blockers and hormones. Let's take you to Minnesota. So she can now transport this 0.96

00:07:56.400 minor to Minnesota and use this law to get custody of the girl and then start making decisions saying,

00:08:02.480 I'm going to put you on the blockers. I'm going to put you on the hormones. I'm going to get you 0.96

00:08:05.620 these surgeries, undermining that girl's parental rights back home in Ohio. So not only is this a

00:08:11.200 front to kids in Minnesota and harming them, but across the country, parents now have to worry about

00:08:16.540 someone taking their child to Minnesota and stripping away their custody and their ability to

00:08:21.080 protect kids from these dangerous drugs and surgeries. So God forbid, Bob, this happened to

00:08:26.660 me. Now I live in Connecticut. Um, and suddenly my kids were a child of mine were in Minnesota

00:08:33.160 and somebody, cause it doesn't even have to be a relative that gets, it could be like planned

00:08:38.840 parenthood that files the petition and says, we want to get this kid here in Minnesota. So now my

00:08:44.760 husband and I remain in Connecticut. We are outraged. Where's our child? Who the hell filed a petition to get

00:08:50.180 them into the jurisdiction of a court in Minnesota? And they're in Minnesota physically right now.

00:08:55.220 And God, God knows what's going to happen. We would normally go to a court in Connecticut where

00:09:00.000 we live, where let's presume in this hypothetical, thank God scenario, there's a psychiatrist who sees

00:09:06.300 the child and there's a, you know, I don't know, a teacher and, and everybody who's looking after the

00:09:11.420 child's mental health along with my husband and me. And we would say to a Connecticut court,

00:09:15.300 go give us our child back. Like please issue a subpoena that we can run into Minnesota with 1.00

00:09:21.760 saying, give us our child back. And that's how it would work in virtually all circumstances.

00:09:26.920 If somebody were to like, take your kid across straight state lines and try to keep him or her

00:09:30.520 from you. But Bob, you tell me what would happen if we went to Minnesota with that subpoena from

00:09:35.840 Connecticut, thanks to this law? Well, and in Minnesota, in dealing with, with, uh, abuse

00:09:44.060 situations, and that's, that's how this has been categorized by the bill in dealing with abuse

00:09:49.800 situations. It's it, you can imagine it's warranted for the court in the place where the child is,

00:09:56.800 is found to be. If the child's immediate safety is at risk, then the court takes on jurisdiction to,

00:10:04.960 uh, for the safety of the child. So by putting this scenario into the category of, of cases that

00:10:13.380 warrant exclusive and emergency jurisdiction, they are, they are cutting out the Connecticut court,

00:10:20.620 uh, saying where we have the kid here, the kid's at risk, uh, of harm, immediate harm,

00:10:28.540 warranting our jurisdiction. So you don't have any, that's exactly what this bill does.

00:10:33.780 Because they consider abusive not to give the kid this so-called gender affirming care.

00:10:39.660 Right. Exactly. That's what they've categorized. And to say that it's only for outstate kids is an,

00:10:45.480 as a bald face deception. I mean, if this is what warrants abuse in Minnesota, how does a,

00:10:53.260 how do all parents in Minnesota think that this is not going to be used to measure their own family's

00:10:59.720 situation in state? I mean, you can't, you can't say this is abuse for kids outside the state,

00:11:06.980 but we're not going to protect because that's the language. Now we're not going to protect kids in

00:11:11.960 the state. We're not going to apply this. No, you, you, you, you have an equal protection problem

00:11:17.380 immediately. So you say you're protecting kids. You can't apply it to kids who are from other states 0.87

00:11:22.840 and not your own kids. So, I mean, it's, it's a bald faced lie to say, this isn't going to be

00:11:27.440 applied to, to Minnesota kids. It's a, it's a standard that they've established now for neglect

00:11:34.240 or abuse, warranting emergency jurisdiction. And this is the scariest scenario. I mean, we've got,

00:11:40.960 you know, this has happened already in other States and walls. I mean, South Dakota outlawed these,

00:11:47.840 these measures, these kinds of treatments, uh, along with the whole country of Sweden,

00:11:53.300 who is way ahead of us on this. They did a full study, follow-up study of, of patients who went

00:12:00.660 through trans surgery and treatments and found that there's their suicide rate was 19 times higher,

00:12:08.180 19 times, not percent, 19 times higher than the average. And they banned all these things because

00:12:14.820 they didn't want to hurt children. I don't know why, why governor walls, uh, what he has against

00:12:22.100 children, but it's a, it's pretty apparent. Yeah. And let's just look at the language of the statute,

00:12:28.060 Matt. Um, it was, uh, it's HR one 46 and it's, it reads as follows in part temporary emergency

00:12:36.860 jurisdiction. A court of this state has temporary emergency jurisdiction. If the child is present in this

00:12:44.680 state and sub three, the child has been unable to obtain gender affirming healthcare as defined in

00:12:52.960 section 543.23 paragraph B. What does that 543.23 paragraph B says? What does it say about gender

00:13:01.180 affirming healthcare? Gender affirming healthcare means quoting from the statute, medically necessary

00:13:07.700 healthcare or mental healthcare that respects the gender identity of the patient as experienced

00:13:14.520 and defined by the patient. And that may include, but is not limited to one interventions to suppress

00:13:23.300 the development of endogenous secondary sex characteristics, meaning puberty blockers to

00:13:28.860 interventions to align the patient's appearance or physical body with the patient's gender identity.

00:13:37.800 Three interventions to alleviate the patient's symptoms of clinically significant distress resulting

00:13:44.260 from gender dysphoria. And it goes on from there that covers all of it. Puberty blockers, cross-sex 0.98

00:13:50.660 hormones, surgeries, period. Yeah, it's, it's absolutely terrifying. So you, you play out the

00:13:59.320 scenario. Imagine you've got a mom and dad and like you described a young girl that she's maybe on the

00:14:04.300 spectrum. She's dealing with confusion, anxiety, depression, other things. And the parents say,

00:14:08.760 let's put a pause, let's, let's wait and see, and let's try and treat the other things first. What,

00:14:13.880 as Bob was saying, so many European countries are doing, so many U S states are doing is prioritizing

00:14:18.700 good mental healthcare over this medicalization. But under this law, Minnesota courts now have the

00:14:24.060 authority to use that emergency jurisdiction language you cited and saying, because mom and dad,

00:14:29.120 you will not give these girls puberty blockers, hormones, these dangerous, potentially sterilizing 0.89

00:14:34.480 surgeries. We're going to take jurisdiction and we're going to start deciding this is medically

00:14:40.300 necessary and immediately putting her on these drugs and now allowing her to access these surgeries 0.94

00:14:46.280 and everything else that comes with this. And as Bob said, this is not a hypothetical. We've actually

00:14:51.220 had a case just across the state line from Minnesota and Wisconsin, where a school district there was

00:14:56.300 socially transitioning a girl, pushing this teenage girl that was dealing with depression and anxiety

00:15:01.360 during all the COVID crisis and pushing this girl towards embracing a male identity, hiding it from

00:15:07.500 the parents, refusing the parents when they then tried to intervene and protect their daughter.

00:15:11.760 So this law takes what's happening in Wisconsin and other States like it and magnifies it so that now

00:15:17.340 the judges can order these kids to be put on these drugs and surgeries. And the parents back home have

00:15:22.720 no recourse. They can't get a subpoena. They can't do anything to protect their kid under this law.

00:15:27.840 And that's ultimately going to do a lot of damage to kids in Minnesota and across

00:15:31.180 the country that are going to continue to be damaged by this harmful gender ideology. 1.00

00:15:35.880 How can it be, Matt, that an unrelated adult can step in and be the person to spearhead this seizure

00:15:45.000 of a loving parent couple's child? Like, I mean, I don't agree with it, but I can at least

00:15:53.100 picture the nosy aunt interfering. But how can a Minnesota court say some stranger,

00:15:59.980 let's say with the human rights campaign or some GLAAD affiliated organization can step in after

00:16:06.840 receiving a complaint from a child they do not know and effectively rest custody away from the

00:16:13.460 parents without showing that they're abusive in any way other than they won't affirm this identity

00:16:19.540 or allow these procedures?

00:16:20.960 Yeah, this is a direct attack on parental rights. There's no doubt about it. We have always respected

00:16:26.720 the role of parents of good mom and dads to make decisions about their kids, to guide and whether

00:16:32.840 it's their health care, their mental health, their education, whatever it is. And this Minnesota law

00:16:37.460 says you don't even have to be a parent, just a adult acting in the role of as a parent. That could be

00:16:42.360 anyone, like you said. It could be Planned Parenthood. It could be a profit-motivated gender clinic 0.67

00:16:46.540 that says, child, come to Minnesota. We can get emergency jurisdiction and make sure that we're

00:16:52.620 going to get you these drugs and these surgeries and do irreversible damage and we'll take care of

00:16:56.940 pushing your parents out of the picture, stripping away their custody, stripping away their ability

00:17:01.660 to do it. So now you have this system that, like you said, an unrelated adult, someone at a gender

00:17:07.120 clinic, someone at Planned Parenthood can misuse this law to insert themselves in the role of parent

00:17:12.180 and strip away the ability of parents to safeguard their kids from this harmful gender ideology. 1.00

00:17:18.280 As I read the law, Bob, in Minnesota, Medicaid does have to cover these types of procedures

00:17:26.860 for youth and others. And so it's also something that the taxpayers could potentially have to pay for

00:17:33.860 if the child doesn't have the funds or if Planned Parenthood doesn't want to do it gratis because they

00:17:38.940 do do some of this, at least the medicine, doling out. Yeah. Well, that's part of the whole picture.

00:17:47.460 When you take this scenario and plop it in the middle of a neglected or abused child's situation,

00:17:56.260 you can certainly imagine if some kid was being trafficked and their parents are nowhere to be found

00:18:03.600 and some, you know, good Samaritan tries to bring the kid in and get help, that that scenario you could

00:18:11.880 see, well, we shouldn't have to have the parents to help this kid, you know, you know, and meet the

00:18:17.900 child's basic needs and keep the child safe. But when you take, this is unprecedented that to say that

00:18:25.160 define this type of situation as abuse or neglect, it's putting all of the mechanisms around it

00:18:33.580 that are normally only warranted where a child's at risk of harm. South Dakota would say,

00:18:40.680 you're the one, you are the abuser state of Minnesota by doing, you know, they've outlawed

00:18:46.840 these things. So, I mean, it's, it's putting, it's putting Minnesota at a, at a, a very hostile

00:18:54.240 position with other states. What happened, Bob? Cause you, I, this came down,

00:19:01.820 this was passed narrowly on a party line vote and then signed into law over, you know, a very

00:19:08.760 sharply divided, even in Minnesota, which is a blue state, um, by governor Tim Walz. But so you were

00:19:15.460 going to testify, you're a lifelong family attorney. And from what I understand, not some died in the

00:19:20.200 wool conservative, um, you were going to testify against this law. Tell us what happened.

00:19:27.400 Yeah. I mean, I, I do a lot of neutral work in this area, uh, and I've been doing juvenile court

00:19:33.260 cases, adoption, contested adoptions. Um, you know, this is not, this is not a party issue.

00:19:39.660 Uh, but I, I came down when I, I mean, I was some, some people alerted me to this and they said,

00:19:44.820 they're going to try to pass this legislation. Would you come down and just talk about what you

00:19:48.220 know? And, you know, I'd looked into the Swedish study that was done. I'd looked into the, the

00:19:52.780 background, the homework, the facts, and just, just was just the policy behind this was insane. I was

00:19:58.680 like, I'm going to go down there and talk to these, uh, the judiciary committee, uh, about, you know,

00:20:04.200 what are the facts behind, behind this whole issue? You guys need to have that on the table.

00:20:08.220 And I went down and, and, um, you know, I sat there and, you know, uh, they, the committee,

00:20:15.160 which was controlled by Democrats refused to allow anyone to testify, including me,

00:20:20.960 uh, that were, you know, from the general public, they had the author of the bill and a doctor who

00:20:27.900 was in a position to, to benefit from this bill were the only ones allowed to speak in the committee.

00:20:33.420 And, uh, I, I made the trip down to St. Paul for nothing apparently that day. It was, um,

00:20:39.960 but that's the kind of controlled. Now, if this issue got before a judge, um, the judge certainly

00:20:46.240 wouldn't say, well, I'm only going to hear from people on one side. And so what's happening down

00:20:51.280 at the St. Paul legislature in Minnesota is that, that any kind of notion of due process or full

00:20:57.260 review of issues is being shut down. And that ought to, that, that ought to concern everyone

00:21:04.220 in Minnesota. We, we, we don't have a good process for, for discussing these, these issues

00:21:12.120 at the Capitol. And this is what the result is.

00:21:15.140 Even when it comes to children and their wellbeing. And Governor Walz is just fine with that. He signed

00:21:19.960 right off on it. Let's just spend a minute on the person who sponsored the bill, Representative

00:21:24.620 Lee Finke, who is a democratic farmer labor party. That's how, uh, Lee is described 42 years old.

00:21:34.020 Lee is the first openly transgender member of the Minnesota legislature. Lee is quite clearly a man

00:21:42.180 posing as a woman and Lee is, and there you can see governor Walz right behind Lee. Lee is responsible

00:21:49.280 for a lot of the radical legislation that's getting pushed through in Minnesota. This one in particular,

00:21:56.180 Bob, um, I don't know whether Lee has any biological children of his own, but Lee has effectively managed

00:22:03.940 to endanger everyone else's thanks to pushing this through. Yep. Yeah, that's true. I don't know much

00:22:11.260 about Lee personally, other than what you just went through, but, um, why, why this person is being

00:22:19.400 given so much power by the administration is, is mind boggling. Um, right. Influence there is just,

00:22:27.760 I mean, what's going on? I, people in Minnesota ought to be just freaking out over this and it takes a lot

00:22:35.000 to get Minnesotans freaked out because they're pretty passive aggressive as many know, but,

00:22:40.220 but this, if this doesn't wake them up, I don't know what would I, I'm not know, Bob,

00:22:46.320 do you think they don't know? You know, do you think they believe? Because right now I said this

00:22:49.420 a couple of months ago on my show and all these people tried to fact check me saying this not true.

00:22:53.060 It's not true. It's not true. So then they believe it's not true, but it's true. It is true.

00:22:57.940 And governor Walz, go ahead and sue me. If it's not true, sue me, sue me for defamation,

00:23:02.280 for defaming you here openly. Let's have that litigation. It's true. And so he can't,

00:23:07.840 but go ahead, Bob, do they not know? And I've, I've been, I was threatened on the Senate floor.

00:23:12.640 I mean, not by name, but one of the Senate, one of the senators sponsoring the bill said this

00:23:16.540 attorney ought to be reported to the bars. And I said, I said in my mind, please do, please do.

00:23:22.220 Let's get that discussion in the news. Something that has to get out in the open because these private,

00:23:28.040 you know, empty threats are, are ridiculous. I mean, they know that what I'm saying is true. I

00:23:35.920 mean, it's absolutely rock solid. I'm not partisan. I am, I am for, I care about kids. My whole career

00:23:42.260 has been around family law and, you know, trying to make things better for kids. And I, I, this is,

00:23:48.540 this is about kids' own welfare and their, and their wellbeing. And they've, they've politicized

00:23:54.520 this thing. They're crazy. Yeah. Well, I think to that point, a lot of parents are shocked when

00:23:59.580 they hear about this. It's one of the things we hear all the time when parents call us and we've

00:24:04.240 had a case in Michigan and Colorado and other places where these schools are transitioning kids

00:24:10.200 and they're hiding it from parents. And these parents call us and they're shocked because in

00:24:13.880 their mind, they're thinking, surely the government's not going to take away my kid.

00:24:17.120 They're not going to interfere. They're going to let me know if my child is struggling with gender

00:24:21.240 confusion. In fact, when, when you talk to parents left, right, whatever they are on the political

00:24:25.520 aisle, they agree that they ought to be the first call when this is happening. So I think there is

00:24:30.400 a sense of, of parents like disbelief that Minnesota would do something like this, that they would

00:24:34.880 actually say, you're an unfit parent. We're going to strip away custody of you. If you don't 1.00

00:24:39.580 immediately put your kids on these dangerous puberty blockers and hormones. So I think conversations

00:24:44.660 like this, where we let parents know this is happening, no matter where you are in the country,

00:24:48.960 this isn't just a California or a Massachusetts issue. It's happening in Minnesota. It's happening

00:24:53.720 all over the country where these policies and these laws are being pushed that undermine parental

00:24:59.100 rights, that push kids down these one-way streets towards gender identity. And what the message parents

00:25:03.720 need to know is be on the lookout. Don't assume that, you know, your school that you love has your

00:25:08.540 best interest because quite often we're seeing they're adopting policies and they're pushing this stuff

00:25:12.700 on kids and sometimes even intentionally hiding it from parents. For example, I mentioned the

00:25:18.120 Michigan case. The family there, this had been happening for months that the school was changing

00:25:23.620 their records, changing documents before they sent them home to the mom and dad to erase the fact that

00:25:28.980 the school was treating the daughter as a young boy. And it wasn't until a slip-up happened and a

00:25:34.560 document came home and the teacher forgot to catch it and make the correction that the parents found out

00:25:38.980 that this had been happening for months. This is the type of deception that's happening. It's the type of

00:25:43.540 actions by the government that are undermining parental rights. And what we're seeing in

00:25:47.420 Minnesota is it being taken to a whole new level. We're now the full force of state law and power

00:25:52.400 to judges to take away parental rights is being pushed there. And it ought to be a real wake-up call

00:25:57.140 for families across the state and across the country. Once you allow social transition, which these

00:26:02.520 schools are doing in so many states without the parents' knowledge or consent, that child almost

00:26:08.340 always pursues the rest because it's very difficult to reverse once you've come out and said, oh, I'm a

00:26:14.200 different gender and I'm dressing like that different gender and acting and changing my name. It's very

00:26:18.740 hard for these kids to then say, I made a mistake and go back on it. Before you know it, these so-called

00:26:23.860 harmless puberty blockers are given, which cause all sorts of potential health risks to the brain, to the

00:26:30.400 body, to the bones, and then straight into cross-sex hormones. And sure enough, your odds of becoming

00:26:37.160 completely sterile are through the roof and your odds of ever having sexual pleasure, as I said in

00:26:43.700 that clip, are, I mean, all but predetermined. And I received this information in the first instance

00:26:49.420 from trans activists who are on tape being honest about this and talking about the risk before people 0.54

00:26:55.940 they don't think will criticize them. But it's verified. I mean, it's not even a controversial thing

00:26:59.880 to say. They will admit that on the other side. And so, Matt, they take these kids who are having

00:27:05.260 the normal growing pains that we all went through and they fast track them into these radical drugs

00:27:13.200 and then surgeries all outside the care of their parents. That's what Wall's blessed, which is why

00:27:22.320 I was angry in that particular clip at Taylor Swift. It's not her fault, but I actually think Taylor Swift

00:27:27.960 probably had no idea that she just blessed this regime the three of us have just discussed.

00:27:34.060 Yeah. You know, I would encourage her, sit down with the detransitioners. Sit down with people like 1.00

00:27:38.840 Chloe Cole or Presha Mosley that went through this, that had the doctors pushing them to take the 0.79

00:27:44.360 hormones, that had the doctors pushing them to have their breasts removed, and sit down and hear their 1.00

00:27:49.360 stories where they said, I just wish someone had said, wait a second, it's okay that you don't feel

00:27:53.420 comfortable in your body. But that doesn't mean you need to take these hormones. That doesn't mean

00:27:58.060 you need to undergo these surgeries. Because when you hear those stories and you see how these kids

00:28:02.080 were manipulated and pushed towards this, you would stand out and speak out against any law like what

00:28:07.720 passed in Minnesota. You would say, we don't want to judge stepping in, taking custard away from parents

00:28:13.240 and putting a child on these irreversible surgeries and drugs that can do lifelong damage to them.

00:28:18.860 Because as you said, Megan, once that damage is done, it can't be undone. And we're ending up with

00:28:23.260 more and more stories of detransitioners speaking out and just saying, I wish someone, an adult in 1.00

00:28:28.400 the room would have just said, wait a second, pause, let's think through this. And what Walls is

00:28:33.440 doing in Minnesota with this law is fast tracking those kids and now putting the full weight of

00:28:38.080 Minnesota law and courts behind them. Imagine you now have a judge saying, yes, young girl, we're

00:28:42.480 going to get you this surgery, we're going to get you these hormones, and how difficult it is for that 0.98

00:28:46.240 child to step back from that. But that is where we're pushing these children to.

00:28:50.340 Removing the adults in the room who care most about the child, who are the parents. But Bob,

00:28:57.260 you told me something interesting a couple months ago, which is in Minnesota, you can't find a

00:29:05.280 therapist now who's going to explore these issues with the child and have an honest discussion about

00:29:12.740 whether this is divorce related or God forbid, a sexual abuse that's coming back to haunt a young

00:29:18.280 girl, which we see in a lot of these so-called trans kids. They're just dealing with problems as a

00:29:24.480 result of abuse, real abuse, because they consider that now conversion therapy.

00:29:30.680 Oh, yeah, that's a whole nother discussion, a whole nother show probably, but the whole conversion.

00:29:36.660 And that's another euphemism, a made-up word, and it's meant to insult Christians because it's using

00:29:42.760 the word conversion. And what they're actually talking about is simply therapy that explores

00:29:48.800 with the patient, what are their desires for their life? And are there things that are getting in the

00:29:57.520 way and frustrating that? And just having an honest, open conversation with self-directed therapy,

00:30:03.160 they can't do it because it's basically, we'd say, one way to gay policy now on professional

00:30:11.280 counseling and therapy. Yeah, that's a whole nother discussion. But that's the environment that's been

00:30:18.420 created here in Minnesota. And now the administration's got taken steps to put teeth into enforcement

00:30:25.560 of this because they know very well that many outstate county agencies are probably going to be

00:30:32.960 very hesitant to go down this road and, you know, get kids permanently, you know, medic, you know,

00:30:44.480 hormone treatments and surgeries. So there's been a commission created, a new one in Minnesota that

00:30:51.520 I'm just finding out more about now. But the nightmare is not over. It's getting worse.

00:30:56.760 That would do what? What would they do?

00:30:58.620 They would override. Yeah, they would be able to override the discretion of

00:31:02.800 of these county child welfare agencies that are technically a part of the state system,

00:31:11.320 but are contextualized in the community they're in for the most part. And this commission would

00:31:18.720 have the ability to override their discretion and enforce these policies.

00:31:23.440 So you're telling me that if a more conservative leaning or just rational county has a child and

00:31:30.680 protective services person who says, I've evaluated little Sally and you know what? She confessed to 0.91

00:31:36.980 me that she was the victim of a sexual assault when she was very young on some trip with some

00:31:44.220 stranger. And I think that's really what's going on here. I don't think we should be aggressively

00:31:49.200 intervening with this girl with cross-sex hormones and surgeries before this is explored and understood

00:31:54.980 that now Minnesota is creating a commission that would remove the judgment of the child and

00:32:00.720 protective services person to just full steam ahead it with little Sally. 1.00

00:32:06.000 Potentially. And it's again, yet to be seen what, you know, what all the details would be on this,

00:32:10.700 but I, you know, I don't want to overstate it, but, but the fact that this commission has been

00:32:14.400 created and it has what have, it has the ability to intervene in these other, this decision-making

00:32:20.620 in any county in the state, um, is, is very concerning. So I don't even know. I mean, it's

00:32:26.600 just, just when you think you've gotten to the full darkness, Matt, you learn something else. Um,

00:32:32.380 I don't, I don't know what to say. I don't think this is in any way, the kind of policy that could pass

00:32:38.640 at the federal level, no matter what Tim Walls and Kamala Harris try to do if they win. I just don't

00:32:44.440 think even with the Democrat controlled Senate, potentially, I'm just talking worst case scenario

00:32:48.480 here and a Democrat controlled house. Um, I can't imagine that this kind of thing would be passed,

00:32:55.800 but I suppose we shouldn't rule anything out, but this, there can be influence on policies

00:33:02.200 by a sitting president and vice president state after state after state. And there are things that

00:33:07.660 can be done at the federal level to make it all easier and faster and to de-stigmatize it.

00:33:14.020 And I, I worry a lot about even that level of federal interference. Your thoughts.

00:33:20.020 Yeah, I completely agree, Megan, the, the power of whether it's an executive order or agency action.

00:33:25.600 Remember a lot of where we're seeing gender ideology being pushed at the federal level is

00:33:29.800 through these federal agencies, these bureaucrats. So whether it's the title nine rule that's being

00:33:34.860 rewritten to erase sex and federal law and replace it with gender identity, that has all come through

00:33:40.240 these executive actions through these administrative rules. And so we have got to be on the lookout. We

00:33:45.740 can't just say, well, this is only happening in Minnesota or California. These types of policies

00:33:50.240 are already being pushed at the federal level. So we've got to be vigilant. We've got to educate.

00:33:54.580 We've got to point out these stories, but they are popping up everywhere. I mean, even yesterday in

00:33:59.540 Kentucky, Governor Beshear did an executive order on one of these so-called conversion therapy

00:34:04.620 counselor censorship laws. So they're using every power that they have at the executive level to do

00:34:09.640 it. And at Alliance Defending Freedom, we're going to continue to stand against it, whether it's at

00:34:13.320 the state level or the federal level, we're going to stand against these laws and stand with families

00:34:17.560 and kids to protect them from these dangerous drugs and surgeries.

00:34:21.580 Thank God for Alliance Defending Freedom. Thank God.

00:34:24.300 I thank God every day for you guys. And I mean, the, like the number of things they've already done

00:34:31.120 with Title IX, you know, saying it's discriminatory not to let the boys into the girls' bathrooms and

00:34:37.580 locker rooms saying, and then they expanded it saying it's now discriminatory in the workplace. It's

00:34:43.080 hostile work environment. If you don't use preferred pronouns, well, I won't go ahead and sue me.

00:34:48.780 Um, and what's to stop them from saying, oh, it's discriminatory not to treat as abuse a parent's

00:34:56.040 decision not to quote affirm and offer these quote life-saving gender affirming care options

00:35:01.820 like this Lee Finke has been trying to push on us. And for what it's worth, I mean, my view on,

00:35:07.440 on Lee is Lee made some very bad life choices. And as many people do, they then want to see those

00:35:15.380 choices repeated by others. And it's somehow validated to them. And this is why, in my opinion,

00:35:23.120 this Lee is working so hard to pave the way to this very difficult lifestyle he's chosen for himself,

00:35:29.160 for all of our children. And, and he's going to get his way unless we continue speaking the truth.

00:35:36.320 You guys, thank you. Thank you so much to you, Bob. You've been so helpful. And you, Matt, I honestly,

00:35:42.760 Alliance Defending Freedom is the best. And to all of you listening, if you wanted to donate to them,

00:35:47.420 they can use it and it'll be put to good use. All the best guys. Thank you. Thanks, Megan. Good to be

00:35:53.260 here. Oh, it's like, honestly, I wish I weren't right. I wish it's upsetting to talk about. This is

00:36:02.400 so deeply wrong to my fellow women who are on the fence in this election. I know Trump can be an

00:36:11.740 asshole. I know you don't like his temperament. I know January 6th was bad. You're voting for this

00:36:21.480 regime that we just went through. If you vote Harris Walsh, you're blessing this. You're elevating the man

00:36:28.880 who did it to bigger, greater, more widespread power. I'm begging you to reconsider. Begging you.

00:36:38.500 Thank you for listening. And we'll see you next time.

00:37:08.500 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

00:37:38.500 Thanks for listening.

The Megyn Kelly Show - September 20, 2024

Deep Dive： The Truth About Minnesota's ＂Trans Refuge＂ Bill That Gov. Tim Walz Pushed Through ｜ Ep. 894

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