The Megyn Kelly Show - Dems in Decline, Newsom's Bizarre Trump Troll Attempt, and Truth About DC Crime, with Halperin, Spicer, and Turrentine

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00:01:00.980 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:03.220 Live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.

00:01:12.980 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly.

00:01:14.740 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Wednesday.

00:01:17.100 We've got a great show for you today, beginning with the state of American politics

00:01:20.460 with three guys who know it better than most.

00:01:23.200 Because there's something happening in America with the Democratic Party.

00:01:27.920 And for one of our guests who really cares about this, it's pretty alarming.

00:01:32.080 Meantime, the most prominent Democrats, like Governor Gavin Newsom, are behaving in some

00:01:37.520 pretty bizarre ways while they try to fight Donald Trump, drawing the ire of some of their

00:01:42.960 most famous media allies.

00:01:45.240 Joining me now to discuss it all, Mark Halperin, host of Next Up on the MK Media Podcast Network,

00:01:49.520 Sean Spicer, and Dan Turrentine.

00:01:52.020 Together, they are the hosts of The Morning Meeting on Two-Way.

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00:03:03.680 Guys, welcome back.

00:03:04.680 Great to see you.

00:03:05.740 Thanks for having us.

00:03:06.200 Good to be here, Megan.

00:03:06.780 Thank you.

00:03:07.840 Okay.

00:03:08.260 So there's a lot to go over.

00:03:10.420 But I really kind of want to start with this New York Times piece, Out of Power.

00:03:13.840 This hit today by Shane Goldmacher with Jonah Smith and is going on about the voter registration

00:03:22.800 crisis that the Democrats are facing.

00:03:25.440 The subhead is the party is bleeding support beyond the ballot box, according to a new analysis.

00:03:31.740 And the highlights of this thing show as follows.

00:03:36.140 While there are still more Democrats registered nationwide than Republicans, though they point

00:03:40.760 out that simply because in states like California, you can register by party, whereas in a lot

00:03:46.880 of red states, you can't.

00:03:48.400 So that's even questionable.

00:03:49.520 They say, nonetheless, for the first time since 2018, more new voters nationwide chose to

00:03:57.520 be Republicans than Democrats last year.

00:04:01.400 Of the 30 states that track voter registration by political party, Democrats lost ground to

00:04:07.340 Republicans in every single one between 2020 and 2024, and often by a lot.

00:04:15.560 That four-year swing toward the Republicans adds up to 4.5 million voters, a deep political

00:04:23.440 hole that could take years for Democrats to climb out from.

00:04:27.360 It goes on to say, all four presidential battleground states covered by the Times analysis, Arizona,

00:04:34.020 Nevada, North Carolina, and Pennsylvania, all of them showed significant Democratic erosion.

00:04:41.180 In North Carolina, Republicans erased roughly 95 percent of the registration advantage that

00:04:48.260 Democrats held in the fall of 2020.

00:04:51.800 They quote Michael Pruser, who tracks voter registration closely as the director of data

00:04:57.940 science for Decision Desk HQ, an election analysis site, quote, I don't want to say the death

00:05:04.380 cycle of the Democratic Party, but there seems to be no end to this.

00:05:08.840 There is no silver lining, there is no cavalry coming across the hill.

00:05:13.560 This is month after month, year after year.

00:05:18.700 That's a red alarm for the Democrat Party, five alarm fire, however you want to put it.

00:05:24.120 And to me, it's very interesting because I don't think you can, I don't think this is all Trump.

00:05:31.420 I, you know, support Donald Trump, but I don't think you can say he did this because the erosion

00:05:38.680 was steady from 2020 to 2024, Mark Halperin, which tells me it's the Democrats that are causing the

00:05:47.220 mass exodus.

00:05:48.060 Your thoughts?

00:05:49.440 Well, a little bit of both.

00:05:50.420 I applaud The New York Times for finally writing this piece.

00:05:52.940 I'm next month going to publish a story about the decline of network television news on the rise

00:05:57.220 of YouTube.

00:05:58.320 This has been going on for a long time, but this is not, it's not some breaking news.

00:06:03.080 We were talking about it on Two Way last fall because the numbers were there.

00:06:07.000 I think that it's partly the Democrats' woke weakness.

00:06:11.080 It's partly Trump.

00:06:12.660 But part of why this happened and why it's continued to happen is the Democrats and their allies

00:06:17.660 in the media live in a blue bubble.

00:06:18.960 This alarm should have been pulled, as my joke suggested, years ago, because it's been happening

00:06:25.080 right before everybody's eyes.

00:06:26.200 But because the press doesn't like to write negative stories about the Democrats, it's

00:06:30.320 only now that they're saying, well, we better confront this because nothing really is being

00:06:34.420 done to address it.

00:06:35.220 As the story says, they don't really have a plan to fix it.

00:06:37.760 Part of this is mechanics.

00:06:39.560 Allies of President Trump were extremely professional and skillful using technology and blood, sweat,

00:06:45.340 and tears to re-register people, get people registered.

00:06:48.740 But part of it is, is not the mechanics, it's the reality that the Republican brand, partly

00:06:53.580 Trump, has risen with groups that previously were Democratic-leaning groups, like younger

00:06:58.480 people, young Black men, young Hispanic men.

00:07:00.820 But part of it is the Democratic brand, coupled with their lack of the mechanics, has really

00:07:06.660 accelerated a trend that is, as the story says, it's not over, and the Democrats currently

00:07:11.620 don't have a circuit breaker.

00:07:12.660 The steepest declines, Sean Spicer, have been in registrations among men and younger voters.

00:07:22.640 This doesn't surprise me at all, especially the men.

00:07:25.160 And the Democrats know it, too, now that they're spending $20 million to try to learn how to

00:07:29.560 speak to men.

00:07:30.840 Like, they should talk to me.

00:07:32.640 I'm speaking to three men right now.

00:07:34.240 It's easy.

00:07:34.800 It's very easy if you're just normal.

00:07:38.060 But it's no surprise to me.

00:07:39.680 And this cannot be easily fixed, like, oh, we'll get a male nominee, or, oh, we'll start

00:07:44.800 swearing more.

00:07:46.080 What you need to do, I mean, among other things, is root out DEI at every level in this country,

00:07:52.920 because DEI, at its heart, demonizes men.

00:07:57.340 And it leads to men being the fall guy at colleges and schools, K through 12, and men being the

00:08:05.120 last now to get hired for jobs and the least likely to receive any sort of hand up, really

00:08:10.980 in any category in America, which is why older men, middle-aged men, young men, teenage men are

00:08:19.880 flocking to the Republican Party.

00:08:22.040 I'll just give, I'm just going to show you one thing before I give you the floor.

00:08:25.520 This was on my feed last night.

00:08:28.680 It jumped out at me.

00:08:29.780 It was from, hold on a second, I wrote it down, the university this came from of these

00:08:33.600 young guys.

00:08:35.240 Stand by.

00:08:38.260 Sigma Nu Fraternity, University of Missouri.

00:08:41.900 This was from last November.

00:08:44.260 But here is how they began recruiting the, they're doing it again now because it's recruiting

00:08:49.980 season for fraternities, but this is how they began recruiting, um, one year ago, right

00:08:55.160 now.

00:08:56.840 There was never any doubt, Kamala.

00:08:59.800 You're fired.

00:09:02.060 All the guys are dressed like Trump, wearing the red MAGA hat.

00:09:08.120 And doing the YMCA.

00:09:12.220 Sean, that's relief.

00:09:13.540 That's hope.

00:09:14.100 That's we need Trump because we young men need Trump.

00:09:19.960 And I think all of that's reflected in these numbers.

00:09:22.900 Yeah.

00:09:23.420 I mean, look, if you had told me when I started at the RNC in, uh, February of 2011, uh, that

00:09:29.300 we would be in the position now, I wouldn't believe it.

00:09:31.420 I mean, from a data standpoint, a voter reg standpoint to Mark's point, there's two big

00:09:35.220 M's message and mechanics.

00:09:36.860 They don't have either.

00:09:37.960 And they're suffering massively.

00:09:39.720 Voter registration is inherently labor intensive and expensive.

00:09:44.460 So it's something you got to go out there, get people to either volunteer their time

00:09:48.460 or knock on doors, target people.

00:09:50.500 And all of the data that's extrapolated is critical in these, in, in elections.

00:09:54.600 So, you know who to go to, what their voting history is, everything.

00:09:57.260 So this is, this is the secret sauce of winning elections is having people registered and then

00:10:02.500 having voter history on them.

00:10:03.840 And, and I'll give you just a handful of examples that you mentioned this in, in Pennsylvania,

00:10:08.460 Democrats in November of 2024, just a few months ago, when the election was held, held a 3.1

00:10:14.740 voter registration, 286,283 more than Republicans.

00:10:19.660 That is down a point in plus.

00:10:22.740 They are now down to an advantage of 174,723, right?

00:10:27.240 You look at North Carolina, another battleground state, Democrats had an advantage of 105,675

00:10:32.700 voters. They are down to 17,377, a critical battleground state Senate race coming up in a

00:10:40.300 governor's race. These are going to be impactful in these next, not just the midterms, but in the,

00:10:45.660 in, in the subsequent presidential elections.

00:10:47.660 And Democrats, as I said, have not just a message problem to your point about these guys at

00:10:52.460 fraternities and older union workers who don't realize why maybe the union boss still supports

00:10:58.340 the democratic party, but for cultural reasons, they've lost working men and women, but they also

00:11:03.100 were going to have a mechanical problem that Mark alluded to. And it costs money. The financial

00:11:07.500 advantage of Donald Trump and the RNC right now is just North of $300 million cash on hand.

00:11:12.620 And the DNC has 13 million. It's not even a fair fight. And that's the bigger problem. They can't

00:11:18.500 even, even if they come to your point, if they came up with a message and started drinking beer

00:11:22.560 and talking about like, they, they would like women like Cindy Sweeney in their jeans. Keep going,

00:11:30.960 Sean. No, they, they lack then the resources to implement it. So not only do they have a message,

00:11:36.200 they don't have the resources to take care of the mechanical problem that exists to go out and

00:11:41.100 register these voters. They are, this could be the big divide that occurs. The DNC, by the way,

00:11:46.240 and you alluded to this, but this is critical to understand under Obama organizing for America,

00:11:51.240 they kind of shunned the DNC aside, built their own political organization, surrounded it around

00:11:56.340 Barack Obama. And then when he was gone, you had a shelled out DNC. Biden really didn't do much to

00:12:01.900 put it back on life support. And right now, Ken Martin, yes, they actually have a chair, but he is

00:12:06.640 completely feckless and useless. So you now have a democratic party that doesn't have any functioning

00:12:12.400 capabilities. The DNC is dead. And this is an unbelievable problem from where I started at the

00:12:18.140 RNC, $25 million in debt to now an RNC that is dwarfing their, their rival, the DNC.

00:12:24.920 Dan, Maria Cardona, I mean, she's been around forever. I'm sorry, but Maria Cardona, what,

00:12:30.600 what has she done? She hashtag part of the problem. She's quoted in here as saying,

00:12:37.400 we fell asleep at the switch. Not it, Maria. No, not it. The problems were glaring.

00:12:44.180 They were all around you. Your party went insane and you encouraged it. You did nothing. It wasn't

00:12:50.540 like you missed it. You loved it. You thought it was actually a winner to go woke and shove these

00:12:57.160 messages down the throats of young people who are sick of being told how to think and talk and young

00:13:03.540 men too. And now you're bearing the fruit of your bad labor. They point out in the Times article,

00:13:10.280 for years, the left has relied on a sprawling network of nonprofits, which solicit donations

00:13:16.560 from people whose identities they need, they need not disclose to register black, Latino and younger

00:13:22.280 voters. The underlying assumption has been most of those new voters would vote Democratic. And then

00:13:30.060 they got burned. Cardona says in today's day and age, I guess you just can't register a young Latino

00:13:36.620 or a young black voter and assume they're going to know that it's Democrats that have the best

00:13:41.900 policies because they're flocking just like the rest of young people to Trump, to team red. Your

00:13:48.600 thoughts, Dan? Megan, you're absolutely right. I mean, Democrats thought that the Obama coalition,

00:13:54.480 they used to call it the coalition of the ascendant. It turns out it's the descendant. I mean,

00:14:00.020 as Mark mentioned, this has been going on now for years. We talked about this in 2022, 2023 and going

00:14:08.100 into 2024. You saw these voter registration gaps narrowing and in some cases Republicans surpassing.

00:14:14.840 Think about last October as Kamala Harris was slightly behind Trump. What was one of the things

00:14:21.100 Democrats said? We have the ground game. We do this better than anybody else. It's what the party has

00:14:26.500 kind of hung its hat on now going back to 2008. It turns out the Republicans have left so far ahead

00:14:33.460 of us that we now have a serious problem. And as you were just alluding, the number of people who

00:14:39.720 would say last year, we knocked on doors in Philadelphia, Atlanta, and said, are you going

00:14:45.140 to vote? People would say, yes. The problem is it wasn't for Kamala Harris. It was for Donald Trump.

00:14:50.260 And so, you know, as Sean said, it's a message and mechanics. We always talk about this,

00:14:54.840 and I think you do too. What issue do Democrats have that's an 80-20 issue for us, right? Culturally,

00:15:00.360 we remain totally disconnected. The party does not want to talk about this stuff. After the election,

00:15:05.400 everyone was like, we need to make a bunch of changes. But there is still a fear within our

00:15:09.940 leadership that if we start talking about this, they will be canceled. Even when you had Rahm Emanuel

00:15:15.760 on, he almost apologized. He was like, I have to go to the witness protection program,

00:15:19.520 which tells you how nervous they all remain. So I think the party has a lot of problems.

00:15:24.720 And I'm glad it's now being talked about in places like the New York Times, where,

00:15:28.240 as Mark said, in the blue bubble, this might be news.

00:15:31.140 Here's what they say, Mark. They're talking about the flips in county registrations.

00:15:37.420 Bucks County, Pennsylvania, which is one of the prettiest places on earth, man. You want to go

00:15:41.720 someplace nice. Go to Bucks County, Pennsylvania in the fall, around Halloween. Have a glass of wine at

00:15:48.060 the outdoor bar on the main drag there. Go for a little walk on the Erie Canal remnants in the back.

00:15:54.000 It's beautiful. Absolutely beautiful. And historically split Dem Republican like much of Pennsylvania.

00:16:02.720 This tilted Republican in registration for the first time since 2007. In the fall, Trump became the first

00:16:11.540 Republican presidential candidate to carry the county this century. They talk about what happened

00:16:16.600 in Miami-Dade, down in Florida, where the number of active Republican voters zoomed past Democrats

00:16:22.720 months after Trump became the nominee. Democrats, as recently as November of 2020, outnumbered the GOP

00:16:29.160 there by 200,000. The margin's totally gone. It's flipped the other way. Statewide in Florida,

00:16:35.200 1.2 million voters swing flipped from Dem to Republican. According to the Times analysis,

00:16:42.460 North Carolina, they say, could be the next to tip. State records show the Democratic edge there down

00:16:48.500 to less than 17,000 voters from 400,000 four years ago. Saying it again, the Dems had a 400,000

00:16:59.060 voter advantage in North Carolina in 2020. It's down to 17,000. And they point out Pennsylvania

00:17:07.060 may be on deck. That's shocking. I mean, all these states, we were very worried. They don't mention

00:17:13.140 Virginia. But like North Carolina, those of us who, you know, want Republicans to win, we're very

00:17:18.440 worried about states like this going not just purple and swingy, but full blue, kind of like Virginia did.

00:17:25.460 This is pumping the brakes on some of that, Mark. Yeah, look, again, hats off to New York Times.

00:17:30.720 I finally wrote the story. But think about if the shoe were on the other foot. Think about if the

00:17:34.740 four years when Donald Trump was trying to retake the White House. Imagine the registration numbers

00:17:39.340 move the other direction. OK, well, how would the New York Times have written that story? They'd say,

00:17:44.580 and again, this is not a red state or blue state or purple state phenomena. It's coast to coast.

00:17:49.480 The New York Times would say this is a repudiation of Donald Trump, that Americans are voting with their

00:17:54.080 voter registration forms away from Donald Trump's Republican Party. What this story doesn't say,

00:17:59.020 and again, as you said in the beginning, it's not all attributable to Donald Trump. But on his watch,

00:18:03.940 when he was the unambiguous face of the Republican Party, the trend has been uniformly in the other

00:18:11.040 direction. And mechanics matter. But part of what Donald Trump has done is built a much more formidable

00:18:15.940 machine than the blue side has in both the government, in the official party apparatus and the

00:18:21.660 allied groups. So the Democrats, some of them, I've already talked to some about this story,

00:18:26.820 they're saying, well, there's a Trump phenomena. J.D. Vance or Marco Rubio are not going to be able to

00:18:31.540 drive the same thing. I'm not so sure, because again, it's a complicated. It doesn't make sense.

00:18:36.820 It's a complicated. Just look at neither of us is good at math, I assume, because we're all in

00:18:41.420 journalism. We came over here because we didn't have to do math. But all these numbers where the

00:18:47.100 Democrats were reaching these peaks, there's 2020. So that wasn't about, you know, if that was about

00:18:54.260 Trump, it was negative about Trump. The next four years is when they lost everybody, which to me says

00:18:59.220 it was about Biden, Harris, Woketopia, George Floyd, COVID excesses, all of that.

00:19:06.260 It's a lot about that. But look, what defines Donald Trump's time over the last decade, right,

00:19:10.600 2015 to 2025, is putting in sharper relief than any Republican or conservative or commentator has

00:19:18.180 done all of the vulnerabilities the Democrats have on those issues, on woke issues, on immigration,

00:19:26.120 on trans issues that many people in the country think have gone too far.

00:19:29.720 I have to take you on this.

00:19:31.300 He has exploited.

00:19:31.760 I agree with you. Trump is our best. He's our greatest warrior on woke. I agree. However, I was there.

00:19:39.820 I remember this podcast launched in September of 2020. And we were talking about the COVID excesses

00:19:45.920 that we were talking about, the George Floyd excesses in the EI nonstop. Trump was a non-factor

00:19:50.620 other than J6, which was hanging around Republicans' neck like an albatross. No one wanted to mention

00:19:55.920 the name Donald Trump. It was associated with this very, very negative thing that the country hated

00:20:00.660 for two years, the storyline was not about Trump. It was about the Democrats who were literally

00:20:07.380 ruining the country to the point where everyone felt like a boot was on the neck and we were changing

00:20:13.660 fundamentally, which helped lead to Trump's resurgence in that very boring launch he did at

00:20:19.560 Mar-a-Lago where I said I fell asleep and it was true. And then Trump got his mojo back bit by bit

00:20:26.040 and remembered who he was and we remembered what we loved about him and started making the case

00:20:30.580 and Susie Wiles with the discipline and all that. But I'm telling you, I know, I know in my gut,

00:20:37.040 these numbers are not about Trump. They are about Democrats.

00:20:41.860 Well, you're right. For a period, it was not about Trump as much as it was 2015 to 2020. But again,

00:20:48.360 to me, you can't disentangle them because even as he was repudiated, even after January 6th,

00:20:54.720 Trump still put the Democratic Party in that box during his first term. So you're right. There's a

00:20:59.660 period where Trump's not the visible face, but the phenomena of the Trump revolution against all

00:21:04.840 this stuff. It's it's it's 10 years. There's some there's some lower points. But and we've seen it

00:21:09.880 accelerate in a lot of these states when Trump came back on the stage. But you're right about that

00:21:14.020 period. I disagree with you. I I think Trump here's where Trump came in. Trump's brand was very bad in

00:21:21.740 2020. It was very bad. And people were not openly wanting to associate with the Republican Party at that

00:21:27.400 point. But here's what happened. The Democrats so embarrassed themselves, Dan, that people started

00:21:32.480 to think, what's the alternative? Where do I go? And that's when Trump came back and then hit it at

00:21:38.560 just the right time, started saying all the right things in his rally speeches, started like being

00:21:43.060 the big middle finger that he was first time around, though generally on different issues.

00:21:48.480 He wasn't we weren't doing like the open woke thing as much from 15 to 20 as we were from 20

00:21:54.960 thereafter. And then they indicted Trump four times. Then they shot Trump once and tried to

00:22:01.820 assassinate him a second time. All those things made it about Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump.

00:22:06.160 And he became super cool and larger than life and made the Republican brand cool for once.

00:22:14.960 Some people say again, I say for once. I don't know if it was ever cool before that.

00:22:20.200 But and that's so that's where we are today. But I just think the Democrats, if they think, OK,

00:22:25.480 Trump's going to leave and we'll be OK again, are completely wrong. They are in for quite an

00:22:31.580 awakening because it's about much more than him. Look, I totally agree with you, Megan. And I actually

00:22:38.100 think it could accelerate because Trump still has forty eight point five percent of the country that

00:22:43.860 really dislikes him. They just like his personality, his style. J.D. Vance, let's assume that the

00:22:50.740 likelihood that he's the nominee, he can talk MAGA with the best of them, but also can present a much

00:22:58.440 more accessible and welcoming personality and family dynamic to voters. So he could end up polling even

00:23:06.240 more people. Look, we are culturally disconnected. I think the other part that accelerated the transition

00:23:12.140 is the economy. Remember, we were dismissive of inflation. Then Joe Biden spent two years telling

00:23:18.840 everyone you should be grateful because we're better than the rest of the world. And so I think

00:23:23.880 we drove people away culturally. We've driven people away economically. You know, young black men,

00:23:29.820 Latinos, what did they say in focus groups? We miss Trump's economy. It was better for me under him

00:23:36.400 than Joe Biden. And so I'm going with Trump. So I think you're right. The Democratic Party did its

00:23:42.960 darn best to drive people away. And still today, I would ask anybody, what are we doing to win them

00:23:49.500 back? Any turn of momentum we have is usually because Trump makes a mistake or it's a stylistic

00:23:55.460 thing. And I think we'll talk about Gavin Newsom later. But there's no meat on the bone for a voter to

00:24:01.160 say, I want to go back with them. Because fundamentally, though, here's the problem. The Democratic Party

00:24:05.820 is a patchwork of random coalitions. There's no through line. It's like if you subscribe to the

00:24:12.940 LGBTQ, A, B, C, D, E, F, G, then you're part of our party. Not because, but we're just going to say,

00:24:19.220 yeah, you're in our party. You have two left hands. You're in our party. There's nothing that the party

00:24:25.040 stands for. And when I was talking about young voters a moment ago, you think about union voters

00:24:30.180 are exactly, to me, the epitome of voters that the Democratic Party lost. They used to stand for them.

00:24:35.700 And then they started insulting them, saying, well, if you go to church, if you have a gun,

00:24:40.120 if you watch these programs, you're not really a good Democrat anymore. And so you've alienated

00:24:44.900 people. And you don't know. The problem for the Democrats is that they can't figure out how to

00:24:49.100 get back because the woke policies where they're going to the lowest common denominator, standing up

00:24:55.080 for every kid that has one problem and telling the entire classroom that you need to acknowledge that

00:25:00.100 and conform is losing people. There's no bringing them back. And so until there's a fundamental

00:25:05.360 reckoning in the Democratic Party about what they stand for, they're not going to be able to message

00:25:10.760 them. As Dan pointed out, think about the people that are getting play on the Democratic side.

00:25:16.680 It's for cheap stunts, memes, some social media stuff, like fleeing to sanctuary political cities,

00:25:23.140 as the case of Democrats in Texas, who then came right back for doing something that every other

00:25:30.020 Democrat has supported in gerrymandering. The point is they're not for anything. There is no message.

00:25:35.600 And the fundamental point that I made before is two problems, message and mechanics. And they've got

00:25:40.740 neither. You got it. And here's here's what the Democrats are doing. So we've had going on a year

00:25:47.980 now since Trump's election. And they saw the same data that we've been discussing and that we all

00:25:54.360 learned in that election. And this is where we are. I'm going to show you how they're handling,

00:26:01.320 for example, in Boston, Trump's crackdown on immigration. OK, this is this is how they're

00:26:07.100 handling it. It's at 29. It's a it's a mariachi band. This is effective. There's, of course,

00:26:30.700 a sign language person. There's a sign that reads dissentist patriotic.

00:26:48.920 Oh, my God.

00:26:49.820 OK, you get it. You get the Sean Spicer. Is this going to win back the men and the young

00:27:02.300 people? Absolutely. Absolutely. If I were the Democrats, I would double down on this. Just

00:27:06.380 keep doing more of this. This is the secret sauce, folks. You found it. I love roll the

00:27:12.500 R's and sing this. I mean, honestly, they are doing more of it here. I will. I take you back

00:27:18.120 to Florida, Senate Democrats down there. And what they did is they were walking through

00:27:23.820 protesters and sought 30. Gay, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay. And then here's another one.

00:27:39.440 My team was ready for this. The Rapid Response Choir in Sot 31.

00:27:44.480 Do you have joy? People out there are going to try to tear you down, but the world outside

00:27:53.620 can't take us down. And that's what this song is about.

00:27:57.320 This joy that I have. The world didn't give it to me. The world didn't give it. The world

00:28:07.000 can't take it away.

00:28:08.980 You know, Megan, the morning meeting's been testing out some opening songs. This might,

00:28:13.680 we might have to hire these guys.

00:28:15.640 You need your own Rapid Response Choir. That one was about Doge. Hands off Noah. They were,

00:28:20.480 I mean, Mark, you've been covering politics for a long time. Is this the way back into the hearts

00:28:25.120 and minds? Young people, men, Latinos. I mean, there was a mariachi band. Is that openly racist

00:28:31.200 or is that the way back in with Latinos?

00:28:34.280 Well, look, no party can ignore the energized base. They can't ignore these people's passion.

00:28:41.340 But for the Trill Dars.

00:28:42.200 For the Trill Dars and for these issues, even if they're not popular. But they have to fuse that.

00:28:48.860 They have to merge that with a more moderate, centrist, mainstream sensibility, which is the

00:28:55.040 only way they're going to win elections. And this is a job for a very talented politician.

00:29:02.380 You know, you can talk about demographic trends. You can talk about issues. You can talk about

00:29:06.420 mechanics. But you need charismatic leaders who get it. You need charismatic leaders who can say,

00:29:11.700 as Donald Trump does, the base of my party is vital to me. But I'm talking about issues that

00:29:17.280 have 70-30, 80-20 appeal to my side. But that takes talent. Because if you're talking about

00:29:22.900 something that is appealing to 80% of the country, some of your base is going to wonder, well, why are

00:29:27.540 we talking to those people? They're not true believers. That takes talent of a Clinton or George

00:29:33.240 W. Bush or Barack Obama or Donald Trump. And part of their problem is they just lack that person

00:29:39.360 who can bridge that divide. And when you don't bridge the divide, what you see, as Dan often

00:29:44.280 points out, is people like Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries, who'd like to bridge the divide,

00:29:49.000 but faced with their limited ability to do it, just go with the base. Just empower the base. Because

00:29:54.000 those are the loudest, those are the angriest, most active people in the party. And you cannot grow the

00:29:59.600 party if you're just giving in to them. You have to cater to them, make them feel good, make them part of

00:30:03.620 the coalition. But you cannot let them call all the shots. But herein lies the conflict between

00:30:09.420 getting back men, Hispanics, young voters, which I firmly believe requires that DEI be absolutely

00:30:18.620 extinguished into fairy dust. It must be completely excised from the party. And this group that calls

00:30:30.880 themselves the resistance choir and goes out there, you know, with their pink pee hats,

00:30:36.440 singing the songs about woke issues and so on. I mean, that would like there that's those are two

00:30:43.080 factions or former factions, at least of the Democratic base, the wokesters and then the

00:30:47.320 Hispanics, black voters and young people. And, you know, they've lost Hispanics. They've lost young

00:30:53.880 people. They're losing blacks by the day, all of whom I think have recoiled in response to the

00:30:58.440 nonstop woke lessons. So I don't know. They're in a bit of a pickle. But let's talk about generational

00:31:04.700 politicians. Does that include Gavin Newsom? I'll ask you that question first, Mark.

00:31:11.120 Is he a generational politician?

00:31:13.460 Is he the kind of guy you're talking about who can, like, come along and genuinely inspire,

00:31:17.780 you know, like an Obama type who can completely rally these people back into the Dem party?

00:31:22.840 Well, he's the closest thing there is right now. And it's interesting. He's gone from being

00:31:26.680 dismissed by almost everyone we know to now, I believe. I talked to Patty Salise Doyle,

00:31:33.060 Democratic operative on next up. She and I agree he's in tier one by himself now. Now,

00:31:39.060 he is not as bad as his critics say, but he's not as good as a generational politician who could

00:31:44.620 clearly solve this. And I continue to believe his ambivalence of that running will play a role

00:31:48.860 here in his decision in the end. But he's as good as they have right now. And he's laying down a lot

00:31:53.660 of tracks about the right way to do this. Will he be the person who does it successfully and be the

00:31:59.020 nominee in the end? I don't know. But, you know, like I've seen kids, not particularly good soccer

00:32:04.300 players in second grade, but everyone else on the team is really bad. And so they look fantastic.

00:32:09.920 In a very weak field right now, he's a pro. He's a he's a governor of one of every seven Americans.

00:32:14.840 He's been on the national stage a long time. He knows a lot of people throughout the country.

00:32:19.200 He's he's doing stuff now that others can't do. And that makes him right now, again,

00:32:25.480 in a class by himself. I don't think he'll be the nominee in the end necessarily. But I do think

00:32:30.280 every other person who'd like to be a leader of the party in the context of running for president

00:32:34.580 in 28 have to ask themselves if they can do anything like what Gavin Newsom is doing now

00:32:39.820 in standing up to Donald Trump. And I don't believe most of them would have a clue about how to do it.

00:32:44.120 OK, so Gavin Newsom has decided to hire two young whippersnapper press people who look a lot like

00:32:51.940 the Kareem Jean-Pierre press pool, like the people she was using in her press office who look like

00:32:56.500 these, you know, weird hats and strange haircuts and like the Rainbow Coalition. So he's hired two

00:33:04.880 of those folks to write his tweets. And here's an example of where it's going. It's all it's turned

00:33:09.680 in his entire tweet feed has turned into imitations of what might be a Trump tweet. For example,

00:33:16.340 wow, in all caps. Wow. What an honor on Mount Rushmore. Thank you. Dash GCN with an image of

00:33:22.560 Newsom on Mount Rushmore. Then there's a poster image of Kid Rock pointing like Uncle Sam. It reads

00:33:30.880 Kid Rock wants you to support Gavin Newsom captioned on X. I accept dash GCN.

00:33:39.680 Kid Rock, by the way, replied saying the only support Gavin Newsom will ever get out of me is

00:33:43.620 from Deez Nuts. Here's another one. He Scott Pressler, who registered speaking of Republican

00:33:53.860 registrations, who basically turned Pennsylvania red with his voter registration efforts or got,

00:33:59.120 you know, very, very close. He posted a video about it and Gavin Newsom's office responded

00:34:05.780 saying, thank you, Nancy Mace, calling Scott Pressler, Nancy Mace. Scott Pressler has very,

00:34:15.120 very long hair. Nancy Mace doesn't. So I don't know. It doesn't really work for me. And then

00:34:19.980 somebody on Fox responded saying, you're kidding me, right? You're constantly raving about protecting

00:34:26.180 gay people. And now you use your official press office to troll a gay conservative and call him a

00:34:31.440 woman in response to which the press office replied, you sound woke. All right, here's another

00:34:38.160 one. Not even, this is all caps, not even J.D. Just Dance Vance can save Trump from the disastrous

00:34:45.220 maps war he has started. Not even his eyeliner lines look as pretty as California map lines. He will fail

00:34:53.580 as he always does. Sad. And I, the peacetime governor, our nation's favorite, will save America

00:34:59.280 once again. Many are now calling me Gavin Christopher Columbus Newsom because of the maps, exclamation

00:35:04.520 point. Thank you for your attention to this matter, GCN. This has led to a split amongst some on whether

00:35:13.020 this is an effective strategy. Joe Scarborough, not a fan. I'm going to give you a little sampling of

00:35:20.680 that 27B. The Democrats are trying to find their footing and it's, it's, it's quite embarrassing,

00:35:29.360 actually. I mean, Gavin Newsom, I mean, have you seen what he's doing online and say, just take a deep

00:35:36.380 breath. Don't, don't try to turn the ship 180 degrees and, and one, they don't know what to do.

00:35:43.840 I have a good idea. Instead of trying to make school Donald Trump, talk into the camera about

00:35:52.280 affordability. Donald Trump's not on the ballot in 26. He's not on the ballot in 28. So why are you

00:35:59.920 going, I'm going after Donald? No, you're not, you're not running against Donald Trump.

00:36:06.480 Dan, thoughts?

00:36:07.380 I don't often disagree with Joe Scarborough, but on this I do, because one, I think you will be

00:36:13.700 running against Donald Trump until January 20th, 2029. Like whether you like it or not,

00:36:19.960 Trump is the sun that everything orients around. I actually think this is really smart. I think what

00:36:25.260 Newsom is doing is filling a leadership void in the party that desperately wants somebody to take on

00:36:32.900 Trump. And look, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. If you just look at Gavin Newsom's

00:36:38.820 following on X, Instagram, and TikTok, he is rapidly accumulating followers and retweets. He is filling

00:36:46.060 people's feed. I see, you know, people who are like, I'll call it super depressed progressives,

00:36:51.740 like in my own family, who would think Gavin Newsom's the greatest thing ever right now. And so look,

00:36:57.040 what he lacks is substance. At some point, he'll have to put an agenda together. But for right now,

00:37:02.900 he is like, he is energizing Democrats. And Mark said this before, when Chuck Schumer wants to say

00:37:09.080 something, he either says it in the well of the United States Senate over 20 minutes in dry, serious

00:37:14.620 tones, or he puts out a press release on X, literally a photograph of a press release, and

00:37:20.700 Democrats yawn and pull their hair out. What Gavin Newsom is doing is lighting a fire. I think it's great

00:37:26.960 in the long run, it's not enough to obviously win a presidential, but I agree with Mark, he's in the top

00:37:31.660 tier. Now, we disagree a little. I think AOC is in there with him, but it's working for Gavin Newsom

00:37:36.980 in a primary. You're not the only one who feels that. Here's CNN's Harry Enten, the data guru over

00:37:42.860 there in SOT 27. I think it absolutely has been working in terms of generating attention, which is

00:37:48.760 what he's trying to do, right? I mean, take a look here. Let's take a look right at the at gov press

00:37:53.500 office followers on X. That's, of course, where you get those sort of the account where Newsom posts those

00:37:58.140 Trump-style mocking types of tweets. Look at where we were on June 1st. We basically had a clown car,

00:38:02.960 a clown car for first. Newsom, AOC, Buttigieg, 11%, 10%, 8%. But look at where we are now. Look at

00:38:10.380 this. Look who's jumped up all the way up to 24% chance, about a one in four chance of getting the

00:38:15.060 nomination. Gavin Newsom. AOC staying pretty steady at 13%. And then, of course, we have Pete Buttigieg,

00:38:21.100 who has stayed absolutely steady at 8%. So at least at this particular point, the prediction markets

00:38:26.520 are saying, yes, yes, this strategy is paying off. Of course, the key question is, will this actually

00:38:33.020 work when you're trying to actually, votes are being cast and counted? Sean, thoughts?

00:38:39.940 Look, I agree with both of them. It's a pretty pathetic field when Gavin Newsom is considered the

00:38:46.240 only tier one candidate. That says a lot about the other folks that you're running against. I mean,

00:38:51.920 so you combine everything, the message, the mechanics, the candidates, the current leadership,

00:38:55.720 they're in a world of hurt right now. I get Newsom's strategy. I mean, look, he gets credit.

00:39:01.720 It's sort of like when you get, I used to call them circle 60s when I was in high school. It meant

00:39:05.660 you got an F, but we're going to give you a circle 60, which allowed you to pass the course. And I

00:39:10.000 think he's getting a circle 60. We're learning a lot about Sean today.

00:39:14.860 Yeah. You might want to look at those transcripts. But he's getting a circle 60. And what do I mean by

00:39:21.660 that? I give him, this is the teacher would say to me, okay, you came to class, you tried,

00:39:26.060 you just failed the test. So I'm going to give you credit for showing up and participating.

00:39:30.660 And I give credit to him for participating. He's out there, he's trying to do it. But the

00:39:34.840 fundamental thing that's so interesting in his strategy is this. Most Democrats find Trump's

00:39:40.640 tactics abhorrent. So if you find the tactics abhorrent, and then your goal is to emulate them,

00:39:46.540 it's sort of like, I just, I think he may get plaudits from a lot of the DC insider beltway

00:39:53.760 pundit class and reporters. But I have a hard time believing that people who are going to go to a

00:39:59.120 caucus in Iowa or Nevada are going to find this enjoyable or the people. But I mean, I think he's,

00:40:05.060 he's mocking it. Like he's not actually embracing it. Like this is my new bit.

00:40:09.040 Right. I get it. But I just think that if you don't like the behavior in the first place,

00:40:13.260 somebody who's then doing it, I get why he's doing it to troll him. But I think that it's hard

00:40:18.060 to say, Oh, what Trump's doing is so wrong. I'm just going to do it. Except there's one other

00:40:22.880 difference besides the fact that it's meant to be a performance art rather than whatever it is,

00:40:27.200 the president Trump does. He's only targeting the president. He's not making fun of other people

00:40:31.700 so far. Well, he made fun of Scott Pressler. Yeah. Sorry, to be clear, he's making fun of Republican

00:40:39.680 politicians. He's not going after other entities. Now, maybe he will. But, but the,

00:40:44.740 Scott Pressler's not a politician. He's a, he's a, he's a combatant. He's on the, he's on the field.

00:40:50.760 He's a combatant. So I'm just saying the, the, the, the Democrats like the fact that it's mockery

00:40:56.220 of people who are. I don't know. I think you're splitting hairs there, Halperin. That's who Trump

00:41:00.760 goes after. Trump's not, he's not picking random private citizens to attack. He attacked people who

00:41:05.940 attack him. He went after Taylor Swift because Taylor Swift endorsed Kamala Harris and Tim

00:41:10.260 Walsh. He wasn't picking on her for no reason. But those aren't political pros. I just, I just

00:41:15.220 telling you what, what some Democrats, what some, I think what some Democrats don't like is he's

00:41:20.140 spraying, you know, the whole country of anybody who he doesn't want, who wants to attack rather

00:41:24.880 than political combatants. I'm just saying to me, that's, that's, that's why some Democrats can

00:41:29.700 justify it. But Megan, I want to get, I wouldn't underestimate of all the candidates we've

00:41:35.580 talked about in 2028. Who else has drawn fire from Stephen Chung and all these different people

00:41:41.120 in the white house. They're taking the bait. They're elevating Newsom to an equal that we feel

00:41:47.360 like when you speak, we need to go after you. And if you're Newsom now. Trump does that with everyone.

00:41:53.440 Well, sure. But you think about it this way now, Democrats are going to be asked you with Newsom or

00:41:57.400 Trump. That is the dynamic Trump used in 2023 when he was getting arrested and all this stuff. You with

00:42:03.660 me or you with Nancy Pelosi and, you know, Joe Biden. So it is elevating Newsom. Again, you got

00:42:09.200 to win the primary to get to the general. It's smart. He's separating himself. Back here to Joe

00:42:14.560 Scarborough in 29A. Like you're trying to do everything to distract the American people from

00:42:21.260 the fact that you're screwing up on job one. And job one is helping working Americans and helping

00:42:29.480 the middle class afford their lives and build a life where their children are going to live better

00:42:36.000 than them. That's the American dream. And you have done nothing but play politics over the past year

00:42:41.640 now. It's really not that hard to do. We'll see you. Cut and paste. It's really not hard to do.

00:42:47.240 Gavin Newsom. He wants to own Donald Trump. He wants to be Donald Trump like you can't be Donald

00:42:53.140 Trump like. Hey, Gavin, talk into the camera and talk about making life more affordable,

00:42:59.700 not only for people in California, but if you want to talk about people in New Hampshire,

00:43:04.060 our people in Iowa, our people in South Carolina, they would like to know how their lives can be more

00:43:09.500 affordable, not how you can own Donald Trump. Donald Trump is not running again.

00:43:15.140 I don't know. I, I, I'm kind of, I'm kind of against Scarborough and in favor of Gavin Newsom's

00:43:25.760 plan here. I don't want to see Gavin Newsom become president, but he is generating more attention for

00:43:31.700 himself than we've seen from any other candidate and that we've, than we've seen for him. And like

00:43:38.060 the same old, like once you get the eyes on you, then you can start talking about what's happening to

00:43:43.260 people in New Hampshire, Sean, but like, you need to get the eyes on you first.

00:43:48.500 Yeah, I will say I've now in the last 25 minutes, watch more MSNBC than I have in the last five years.

00:43:53.980 I think you mean MS now.

00:43:56.660 Oh, my apologies. My apologies. I didn't acknowledge that brilliant branding strategy.

00:44:02.760 So I, the thing that I find that I kind of disagree with is at some point people,

00:44:08.080 you know, Scarborough has got a point here, which is there's got to be some sort of plan about

00:44:13.040 being, making life better. And that's where I think that there's a fundamental problem here with

00:44:17.800 all these Democrats. What are they for? They've criticized his crackdown on crime, his crackdown

00:44:23.000 on the border, his crackdown on trade, billions of dollars of new revenue coming into the federal

00:44:29.060 government through tariffs, which most of them previously supported. They've criticized him

00:44:33.500 on gerrymandering, which they led the way on in Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, et cetera.

00:44:38.040 Being too mean to Europeans.

00:44:39.900 Yeah. Which now we've got a NATO that's paying theoretically 5% of their GDP, which is not

00:44:45.720 true. But the bottom line is he got NATO to ante up. Mark Root, the secretary general said

00:44:50.520 on the other night, Trump was right in his criticism and he has achieved results.

00:44:55.520 The bottom line is, name something that they're for. Name one thing they're for.

00:45:00.380 And the answer is zero. Oh yeah. Abortion and LGBTQIA.

00:45:06.720 Here's our friend Mark Halperin sitting down with Joe Scarborough and getting into some of

00:45:11.480 these issues on his MK media show. Next up, Sat 29B now.

00:45:18.180 What about people thinking of running for president? Should they be a Democrat? Should they be talking

00:45:22.180 about Trump or should they similarly move on and talk about the Republicans?

00:45:25.300 No, no, no. Again, because Trump is so baked into the cake. Again, it's like the Iraq war.

00:45:31.900 You just, nobody's going to change their mind about Donald Trump. And we keep thinking-

00:45:37.280 You did.

00:45:37.800 This is going to happen and this will, this is when the walls are closing in on Donald Trump.

00:45:43.200 Something I've probably said 87 times. No, no, it's, the walls aren't going to close in on Donald

00:45:48.660 Trump. And that's not your concern. Your concern is getting elected to Congress. Your concern

00:45:55.420 is winning the House of Representatives. Your concern is taking over the committees. And by

00:46:01.840 doing so, being able to stop a lot of what Republicans are doing.

00:46:07.120 Okay. I'll let you take it, Mark, but I've got to say the irony, like the gall of Scarborough,

00:46:14.560 of all people to say, you can't change people's minds on Donald Trump. Like he is the living

00:46:19.440 Sybil when it comes to Donald Trump. Nobody kissed Trump's ass more. Nobody, including Hannity in 2016.

00:46:29.900 I know I was there. And then when he found out he wasn't going to be vice president or be brought

00:46:35.620 along for the ride, he completely turned on Trump. He and his bride Mika and spent the next

00:46:41.660 eight years bashing him to hell. And then when Trump wrested power back from everyone in the

00:46:48.140 country, he went and bent the knee and kissed the ring at Mar-a-Lago. So please. Okay. Sorry. He was

00:46:53.740 your guest. So you're not in the same mind space as yours truly. But what it's basically the same

00:46:58.600 point he's making there. No, that like focus on the issues. Don't get too wrapped up in the Donald

00:47:03.960 Trump thing. You're not going to move minds or hearts by making your potential race or come back

00:47:09.400 as a dem about him. Well, a few things besides Joe being my guest, he's my friend and I've resolved

00:47:15.260 not to step between the two of you. So I'll pass on on some of those characterizations. But I'll say

00:47:21.960 this. Joe is a big believer in thinking and knew about Trump. Maybe not in the exact way you described

00:47:27.080 it, but he's come to appreciate how formidable Trump is as a political force. And I think what his

00:47:33.180 main point is, is that if you try just to do what Gavin Newsom is doing without talking to voters

00:47:39.440 about the real lives, improving their real lives, you will just, you will be caught up in the

00:47:43.860 centrifugal force and you won't have a path to being president of the United States or leading

00:47:48.420 a coalition into a majority. So you can't ignore Trump. As Dan said, he's going to, he's going to be

00:47:54.620 the dominant force in our politics through the election. But I think if you listen to my conversation

00:47:59.120 with Joe, he's advocating not being, uh, letting your biorhythms, your daily political biorhythms

00:48:05.280 be about trying to beat Donald Trump at his own game, because Gavin Newsom's not going to do that.

00:48:10.560 And he's the best equipped of anyone in the party to try to do it.

00:48:14.680 Or Dan, the Dems could go with this. Watch.

00:48:18.620 My name is Veronica. Yeah. We need to see it again.

00:48:32.680 Look at the signer.

00:48:36.400 Okay. You get it. You get it. You get my point. The signer's trying to sign.

00:48:41.100 Ooh, it's so on brand for the Dems. We got to get the sign language lady so she can sign the

00:48:48.440 Trildar. You got to get the mariachi band. Every Republican's brought a mariachi band at an

00:48:54.040 anti-illegal immigration rally. This is all about immigration. They'd be getting called

00:48:58.340 racists up and down the dial, but it's fine because it's Michelle Wu, the Boston mayor who's woke.

00:49:04.360 Yeah. I think I'd pull a muscle if I tried to hit a high note that, that, that high, uh, doing that.

00:49:11.380 I look, I, I think party is not cool. That's my point, Dan. The party is uncool. And I guess

00:49:17.820 Gavin Newsom is making an attempt to put an end to that by trying to act like Donald Trump. And like,

00:49:24.800 he's not afraid of the big, bad bully, which makes him somewhat cool or so he hopes.

00:49:30.620 Yeah, I think that's right. I mean, look, go back to Bill Clinton's famous line,

00:49:33.980 strong and wrong beats weak and right. Like there is a performative side to being president,

00:49:39.040 to being a leader. You do have to show that you're not afraid, that you're willing to throw

00:49:43.840 a punch and take a punch and keep going. You also need to inspire people with, as Mark said,

00:49:49.620 an agenda that focuses on the real lives of real people. I think one of the big things that Democrats

00:49:54.640 constantly refuse to acknowledge is that Trump's rise was fueled on his agenda, being against the

00:50:01.140 wars, being a, you know, trying to change trade, being against the open borders of immigration,

00:50:06.600 which, you know, Sean was there, the RNC's famous autopsy after 13 was that the party needed to be

00:50:12.220 more hospitable to loosening immigration laws. So, so Trump got people behind him on policy,

00:50:20.200 on a bold agenda. So ultimately we've got to go there, but you could have the greatest agenda on

00:50:26.920 earth. But if you're a wimp, if you're, if you're on a, if you're afraid of JD Vance, afraid of,

00:50:32.320 of the online world, you're not going to go anywhere. So, I mean, again, this is a baby step

00:50:37.100 for the party with what Gavin Newsom is doing, but ultimately it's definitely not enough to become

00:50:41.440 president. Yeah. To me, it feels more like an audition than an actual like campaign. It's an

00:50:49.300 audition to be considered for the campaign. That's how I read it. In any event. Okay. More with Mark,

00:50:53.700 Dan and Sean coming up. Why did Abby Phillip over on CNN explicitly attack two of her guests this week?

00:51:01.500 We'll show you what she did. I've been talking a lot lately about Riverbend Ranch and that's

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00:52:06.120 Welcome back to the Megan Kelly Show. Back with me now, Mark Halperin, host of Next Up with Mark Halperin,

00:52:11.400 Sean Spicer, and Dan Turrentine. Sorry for the changing pronunciations of your last name, Dan.

00:52:16.160 It's time, time, like time, right? Yes, yes. That's okay, though. All my life.

00:52:23.400 I know, I'm sure. That's like my name, too. I got the Megan, I got the Megan, I got the Megan. I don't

00:52:29.500 even, I don't know how to pronounce it, so it's fine. Okay, I do want to talk about an extraordinary

00:52:34.100 thing that's going on. It's related to this whole Smithsonian crackdown that Trump is doing,

00:52:38.380 which I totally applaud. Having taken my family through D.C., we went through some of the museums

00:52:43.160 in April of 2023. I thought it was ridiculous how much focus there was on all the worst chapters

00:52:51.160 of America. And by the way, at that time, they were still doing the online, there was a digital

00:52:57.040 trigger warning for the founding documents, like you might be triggered if you read the

00:53:02.920 Constitution. I mean, we've really, truly lost our minds for the last five years. And it's evident

00:53:08.160 as you walk around these museums. So Trump is trying to stop this. He's not saying get rid of

00:53:14.640 everything related to slavery, like the left is claiming. He's just saying, why does the focus

00:53:19.200 have to be so much on all our darkest chapters, as opposed to communicating what an extraordinary

00:53:26.100 and special nation this is, which, yes, has not always gotten it right, not by a long shot.

00:53:31.640 He's talking about focus and emphasis, but you wouldn't know that to listen to his critics.

00:53:35.820 So Abby Phillip has this, I mean, literally nobody's watching that show. I think it's

00:53:41.100 just us four, just for just pulling clips. We pulled the ratings. They are dreadful. My

00:53:46.260 God, they're so bad. All of CNN is going away. Trust me. I looked at the numbers today. But

00:53:52.560 in any event, she's there hanging on like the rest of them. And the only thing that's good

00:53:56.920 about her show is sometimes she puts on Scott Jennings and it's fun to watch him fight. And

00:54:01.620 then she had Jillian Michaels on the other day and Jillian Michaels raised this issue about the

00:54:06.140 Smithsonian. Well, what is Abby Phillip do? She decides to go on an even more terrible person's

00:54:15.640 podcast, Kara Swisher. And she decides to shit all over her guests when speaking to Kara Swisher.

00:54:22.900 These are the people who make the show tolerable for some small faction of Republicans. And she

00:54:28.540 decides to take a massive dump on both of them. Let's see, I'll give you, let's just do what she

00:54:35.760 said about Jillian Michaels first, not four. And then when it became clear that she was trying to

00:54:41.520 sort of downplay slavery, I was just like shocked. Like, are you really going to do this on national

00:54:47.220 television, giving her an opportunity to not do it? But she continued on. And then later on,

00:54:52.460 she said that she got this list of talking points from the White House about exhibits that they wanted

00:54:59.620 to dispute. And frankly, it was pretty ignorant. Look, I don't like to talk about negatively about

00:55:07.000 guests who come on the show because I just don't think that's good form. Even when I disagree with

00:55:12.060 people, I respect their right to embarrass themselves on national television. I think

00:55:17.620 it is their right to do that. You respect their right.

00:55:21.160 There we go. So I don't like to talk negatively about them, but she was ignorant and she embarrassed

00:55:25.700 herself. And that is her right. So it's not exactly the most, I've never seen Mark Halperin do this

00:55:30.740 after somebody swings by next up or two way.

00:55:33.660 I learned that from David Brinkley. You don't speak ill of your guests after they leave. And certainly

00:55:38.740 not after they've been nice enough to give you some of their time.

00:55:43.060 So she did. And she took a shot at Jillian. And then she took a shot at Scott Phillips. Sorry,

00:55:48.200 Scott, who makes this show worth watching, trying to find the soundbite in which she goes after

00:55:55.400 him. Scott Jennings. It's top five.

00:55:58.880 Never bringing people on to say crazy things. Let's be frank about that. That is never the intention.

00:56:04.860 Okay. People's decisions to say crazy things are never expected or predictable. Um, however,

00:56:12.220 I mean, and I know that, that folks, um, really dislike Scott for his, his views, but, but I would

00:56:20.640 say that, um, you know, there are views that you don't like that you think are unfounded, um, but that

00:56:29.260 are pretty widely shared. And I think Scott falls into that category. Now, there are definitely times

00:56:36.980 if you watch the show, um, that we have conversations where I will say to Scott and others, just stop

00:56:45.460 because we're not playing whatever game it is that you want to play in this moment.

00:56:50.540 Got it, Sean. So she needs to apologize for Scott Jennings because she's heard CNN's audience is

00:56:57.780 overwhelmingly left that people don't like him. And he says crazy things and, you know, he's such

00:57:02.660 a lunatic. It's worthwhile airing those views because they belong to MAGA. Yeah. By the way,

00:57:07.980 I mean, the only time that anyone talks about CNN now, but that, that is as close to watching CNN as

00:57:13.060 I come though. So now I've got MSNBC and CNN is, um, but the only, the only, it's going to take

00:57:22.580 forever for me to, but I bet you that by the time I get that logo, right. Uh, that they will be out

00:57:28.880 of business anyway. So that's actually, um, the only reason that the only reason that people talk

00:57:34.680 about CNN now is because of usually something that Scott Jennings has actually said. So their

00:57:40.320 relevance is actually pretty much tied to Scott Jennings going on shows. Um, that being said,

00:57:46.300 I, I find it interesting how she's described that people don't like Scott because of his views. Well,

00:57:52.680 I'm sorry, that that's a very myopic look at the world, meaning basically all the people that we

00:57:58.440 have come on my show or my network at CNN are people who agree with me that think that everything

00:58:03.300 in MAGA is horrible. That I just, I've watching CNN implode is amazing. You, you would think that

00:58:10.140 after they got rid of everyone like Jim Acosta, they fired Brian Stelter once that they would at

00:58:15.020 least sort of learn their lesson. Instead, they bring Brian back and double down on stupid.

00:58:20.120 It's so bad. Let me just give you a little taste of how she's doing at 10 PM. Uh, this is just the

00:58:26.840 other night on Tuesday at 10 PM, Greg Gutfeld in the key demo that they use to get advertisers

00:58:32.300 pulled in a three, a three, which is 327,000, which is not bad at 10 PM.

00:58:38.600 Abby Phillip, 91,000. She did not even break a hundred thousand. I'm telling you guys don't

00:58:45.940 understand. You know how bad this is. This is so dreadful. You cannot stay in business like this.

00:58:51.980 This is the prime time. The prime time demo did not break a hundred thousand. Thanks to Abby Phillip

00:58:58.920 who went down from her almost equally crappy lead in at nine, which was 112. Anderson Cooper had

00:59:07.900 86,000 versus Jesse waters, 290, uh, 7 PM. Laura Ingram gets 264. The 7 PM on CNN gets 76. Brett

00:59:19.640 Baer gets 226. Jake Tapper, 73. The five, which is the number one rated show on TV gets 332. Jake

00:59:27.240 Tapper gets 85. These numbers are just absolutely dreadful. And by the way, Abby Phillip is in last

00:59:34.040 place. She's also losing to MSNBC. You, you cannot, you cannot stay employed. And I guarantee you,

00:59:41.180 she's making millions of dollars, millions of dollars for putting no points on the board because

00:59:45.560 that's how cable news operates for now. But as Mark pointed out in the beginning of the show,

00:59:49.980 newsflash cable news and TV news is on a bit of a iceberg, uh, or I guess a bit of a ship about to

00:59:58.440 hit an iceberg. YouTube is where it's at. Uh, and so she's on a sinking ship, but in any event,

01:00:03.280 the solution, Dan is not to then start ripping the two guests you've had on who've said things that

01:00:09.820 conservatives agree with. I mean, Megan, what were we talking about to start this show? The decline of

01:00:16.240 democratic voter registration advantages and the struggles of the democratic party.

01:00:20.720 And now you have a host on a channel watched by a lot of Democrats in which you're saying that the,

01:00:26.540 the, the primary guests and Scott Jennings who represents 50% of this country that I have to

01:00:31.820 shut him down often because his views are so unacceptable or not mainstream in her telling,

01:00:38.240 right? This is the feedback loop. This is the, you know, they're crazy. They're wrong.

01:00:43.740 We're right. All they say is lies and we're always right. And, you know, I look at Donald Trump,

01:00:50.540 RFK, Tulsi Gabbard, like this big tent. They have a lot of kind of, it's a raucous coalition.

01:00:56.720 We are increasingly getting narrow. And even in our media filters, there is still this kind of

01:01:02.500 Trump derangement syndrome of focusing on the man on process on right versus wrong,

01:01:07.980 instead of kind of welcoming the big debate. We're not going to get better until we open up.

01:01:13.860 These, these, these places don't have a business model in part, because I guarantee you,

01:01:19.080 none of these anchors numbers are going to get better. They're just not. The audience has spoken

01:01:23.320 as our friend, Britt Hume would say, sometimes the dog won't eat the dog food and they don't seem

01:01:27.600 inclined to make any changes and their identities are up in the air. Whether you're talking about MS now,

01:01:32.640 see, I did it or CNN, uh, they, they pay lip service to the notion. No, we don't want to just

01:01:38.060 appeal to the left. We don't want to be biased. We want to, we want to appeal to all customer,

01:01:42.500 potential customers. But then if you look at their coverage from Friday till Monday

01:01:46.320 of president Trump's efforts to try to get a peace deal, it's, it's as hostile and as, um,

01:01:52.440 myopically deranged as any coverage of Trump I've seen ever. It's just, it's just mocking him,

01:01:58.860 uh, accusing him of just being in it for a Nobel peace prize of dividing Europe, of saying the

01:02:04.760 Europeans had to come to keep him from making a deal. He can't make a deal without Europe and

01:02:09.260 Zelensky. It's all just made up. So, you know, I want strong news organizations, but these places

01:02:15.820 are going with primetime anchors in particular who simply do not have an interest in bigger numbers,

01:02:21.920 because if they did, they would recognize that they're turning off more than half the country.

01:02:26.640 And with Scott, Scott is the best thing to have. I'd like to see her in Abby Phelps numbers with

01:02:31.120 Abby Phelps numbers without Scott. Cause anyone I know who watches the show is watching for Scott.

01:02:37.280 Exactly right. They, they liked the conflict at a minimum. And what does she do? She goes out and

01:02:41.700 dumps on him. That's the thanks he gets. She was one of the worst going out there and saying,

01:02:46.520 Oh, the Europeans rushed to the white house out of nine 11 level concerns about Trump. Wrong.

01:02:52.400 That's her bias. And then back to again, speaking about what we did in the first

01:02:56.620 hour. So this is what she does after Jillian Michaels reflects some of those concerns about,

01:03:02.140 you know, that Trump and team Trump have about the Smithsonian, the museums. Like,

01:03:05.500 what are we doing? Why are we like America's all about slavery? That's the only thing we've ever

01:03:09.600 done. That's what defines us. Not the liberation of Europe and the safe, saving the free world.

01:03:15.020 Not the defeat of communism in the 1980s. No, it's all about slavery. We've never been able to get

01:03:20.000 past it. We're still just as racist as we were. She decides the other day to go out there and open

01:03:24.740 up her show with this. Sat one. Last week on this show, a guest shocked the table by arguing in part

01:03:35.820 that slavery in America can't just be blamed on one race and that museums put too much focus on the

01:03:42.100 role of white people who participated in that terrible institution. And now tonight, that same

01:03:48.080 argument is being pushed by the president of the United States. Donald Trump says that one of the

01:03:53.480 reasons for his crackdown on Smithsonian museums is, quote, everything discussed is how bad slavery

01:03:59.380 was. It's important to say objectively, slavery was indeed bad. It was evil. And it is impossible

01:04:07.180 to understand the true history of this country without fully grappling with slavery's impact.

01:04:12.560 For many of the white Americans who did not personally own slaves, they benefited from a caste system

01:04:17.700 that concentrated wealth and political power in their hands. When we acknowledge the existence of

01:04:23.520 black people who operated George Washington's Mount Vernon or the black hands that built the White House,

01:04:29.660 we are acknowledging the existence, the perseverance and the contributions of the souls that white

01:04:36.600 supremacy sought to erase. And I share this not as a lecture for you, but as a lesson.

01:04:42.520 Really? Oh, OK. Thank you. It's a miracle she has 91,000, Sean. A miracle.

01:04:48.740 I mean, look, there's a few things there. One, I would just say with respect to Scott Jennings,

01:04:53.560 whether it's Scott Jennings or Jillian Michaels, when you go out and do that to a guest,

01:04:57.620 to Mark's point about David Brinkley's lesson, they're never coming back again. And as a 53-year-old

01:05:02.600 man, I would have no way. I rarely stay up till 10 o'clock. So the idea that Scott Jennings is going

01:05:08.560 to want to stay up and go on that show again is nuts, right? They're going to alienate guests

01:05:12.720 because it's hard enough as an older guy to stay up that late. But the bigger and broader point that

01:05:17.140 I think is sort of, you know, from the Trump going after the Smithsonian to the Kennedy Center

01:05:22.640 is a huge contrast from Trump 1.0 to 2.0. And it's this, the first term, we largely set aside

01:05:30.540 culture, if you will. Trump said, I'm just not going to go to the Kennedy Center. I'm not going to

01:05:33.800 be involved in the Kennedy Center Honors. We're not going to like deal with higher education.

01:05:36.680 We'll just focus on some of these policy agendas. They didn't yield the field in Trump 2.0.

01:05:42.140 They're basically saying, as Andrew Breitbart did so correctly, politics is downstream from culture.

01:05:47.740 And therefore, if we really want to make change, we need to attack the culture in our country and

01:05:52.580 their pervasiveness of the woke DEI culture that has grown, especially in the last four years.

01:05:57.540 They're taking on the Kennedy Center. They're taking on higher education. They're taking on the

01:06:01.560 Smithsonian's, right? They are actually understanding how much more powerful they can be this time,

01:06:06.920 taking on corporations. But the bottom line is this administration, Trump 2.0, is vastly different

01:06:13.620 than 1.0, where he did a lot of great things. And I'm not, I think this time he understands the power

01:06:18.340 and levers of government in a way that he didn't in Trump 1. And frankly, he has a team around him

01:06:23.880 that's willing to take on that culture war that we didn't in the first term. And so bravo to them

01:06:29.900 for doing this, because this is where real change will occur. What she doesn't realize is the country

01:06:36.400 is with Trump on this. There's very few people who aren't far left woke Democrats who want to walk

01:06:43.500 into the Smithsonian museums throughout Washington and just be reminded of our darkest chapters,

01:06:49.160 just bring back the absolute worst things we did over and over and over, as opposed to celebrate

01:06:55.240 the rich cultural history of America and its achievements. So what does she do? She puts on

01:07:00.240 her school marm outfit with like the, the, the ruffles in her, like the, the monochromatic red outfit

01:07:07.000 with the, with the silk ruffles coming down George Washington style, you could argue, looks like the

01:07:12.440 carat or whatever the thing is that they used to wear, um, with her little, you know, red jacket and sits

01:07:18.620 on the, on the three quarter chair, the stool in front of, in front of the screen. And indeed

01:07:23.800 lectures to us complete with graphics with explaining to us that there was this thing called

01:07:29.680 slavery and it was bad. And here's why it was bad. And here's how all the white people benefit.

01:07:35.360 This is absolutely fucking absurd. Literally nobody is challenging that we had slavery and that it's

01:07:43.220 bad. It's all about focus, which I don't know her. She may be dumb. I was going to say she's too smart

01:07:49.560 to not understand that this is probably very dishonest, but she might be dumb. So I'm actually

01:07:54.280 not going to give her that the benefit of that doubt. It's absurd. We got to switch gears because

01:07:57.980 there's breaking news right now at union station, the Washington DC train station where Trump and his

01:08:05.400 team are in the middle of trying to clean up the homeless problem. They're trying to clean up

01:08:10.360 homeless problems on the streets of Washington, trying to stop crime with the national guard and

01:08:14.920 others. It's working by the way. And now some protesters, remember last week we played the

01:08:19.640 video of the protester, the one white lady who was going to hand out the plastic neon colored

01:08:24.440 whistles for the homeless to blow. If somebody tried to remove them, wait, it's like, well, who's

01:08:32.560 coming? Who's going to come and get you? Literally like, is there's a brigade of people waiting to

01:08:37.680 rescue the homeless? If so, where have they been? Why are they just waiting until the national guard

01:08:42.140 approaches them and for them to blow their whistles? Like do something today. Don't wait until the

01:08:47.560 whistle incident, white lady. But here is what's happening there. First, let me just give you a

01:08:51.960 feel for what the protests look like. And you're about to see Stephen Miller and the vice president.

01:08:56.480 Watch. All right, that's it. Give him a B plus on the rhyming. The catchiness, it needs work. It's not

01:09:22.760 like a jingle that stays in your head. Here is Stephen Miller, who showed up and did not mince

01:09:28.660 words. There are homeless encampments that have made it impossible for families to use public parks

01:09:35.580 and public recreation for as long as I've lived here. There are hundreds of residents of this city

01:09:41.560 who are shot in street violence every single year, making it one of the most violent cities

01:09:48.440 on planet Earth. And the voices that you hear out there, those crazy communists, they have no roots.

01:09:55.440 They have no connections to the city. They have no families they're raising in this city. They have

01:09:59.540 no one that they're sending to school in this city. They have no jobs in this city. They have no

01:10:03.400 connections to this community at all. But they're the ones who've been advocating for the one percent,

01:10:09.200 the criminals, the killers, the rapists, the drug dealers. And I'm glad they're here today

01:10:13.940 because me, Pete, and the vice president are all going to leave here. And inspired by them,

01:10:18.220 we're going to add thousands more resources to this city to get the criminals and the gang members

01:10:23.680 out of here. All these demonstrators that you've seen out here in recent days, all of these elderly

01:10:28.940 white hippies, they're not part of the city and never have been. And by the way, most of the citizens

01:10:34.360 who live in Washington, D.C. are black. This is not a city that has had any safety for its black

01:10:42.580 citizens for generations. And President Trump is the one who is fixing that with the support of the

01:10:48.400 Metropolitan Police Department, the support of the National Guard and our federal law enforcement

01:10:52.500 officers. So we're going to ignore these stupid white hippies that all need to go home and take a nap

01:10:58.140 because they're all over 90 years old. And we're going to get back to the business of protecting the

01:11:02.840 American people and the citizens of Washington, D.C. He's amazing. He's standing next to Pete

01:11:07.560 Hegg says secretary of defense and J.D. Vance sitting vice president of the United States in Union

01:11:11.780 Station, taking this on directly. It's extraordinary elderly, stupid white hippies can go home. D.C.'s a

01:11:20.680 black city and they appreciate what we're doing. Boom. Truth bomb dropped, Dan.

01:11:25.960 Yeah, as usual, he might be a little over the top in his rhetoric, but he is right. Look, D.C. was home

01:11:33.780 for me for 20 years. My family still lives there. Before Trump did this latest move, when I would call

01:11:39.700 down there just to check in with people, ask how their families are, etc. The last few years you heard

01:11:44.800 increasingly, Dan, crime is getting really bad again here. You know, you can't walk. The Capitol Hill

01:11:49.980 staffers who live up on the Hill would talk about, you know, taking Ubers five blocks because they

01:11:54.680 didn't want to walk home anymore. Going to a Nationals baseball game, that's about how half

01:11:58.820 my walk from the Hill down. People don't walk down there or at least walk back at night after the game

01:12:04.620 anymore. It is bad. And so I think when what Donald Trump did, this is where it drives me nuts as a

01:12:10.820 Democrat. Rather than say, look, this move is insufficient, right? Ultimately, we need 10,000 more

01:12:18.500 police officers. You know, nationwide, we need to have more resources. It's obsession about the

01:12:25.480 process. It's obsession about Donald Trump. He's authoritative. We are basically defending crime,

01:12:32.500 saying, well, it's OK. It's in urban cities. It's not that bad. It drives me nuts that as a party,

01:12:38.520 we again will not focus on the substance and try to outflank him, but instead go down the rabbit hole

01:12:44.720 of process arguments. Megan, you know what's so funny about this? Two things. One, I used to live

01:12:50.760 next to Union Station. It is a shell of itself now. Most of the stores are gone. It truly has been a

01:12:57.560 homeless encampment in there. It's disgusting because it's an absolutely beautiful, beautiful

01:13:02.100 building. And it's kind of scary when you get off the Amtrak now just to walk out. But for all these

01:13:07.140 people on the left in particular who decry the use of the National Guard, now you three are, I think,

01:13:13.080 called New Yorkers or been in and out of the city. I don't go that often. But when I do train up to

01:13:18.320 New York City and I get out at Moynihan or Penn, I believe those individuals are National Guards

01:13:22.900 that are protecting Penn Station and Moynihan Station. And no one has ever had a problem with that,

01:13:28.140 right? The idea of bringing in additional security forces to the nation's capital, so whether you're a

01:13:33.380 visitor, a diplomat, a student, or a resident there, that it's safe should be welcomed by all. This is

01:13:40.420 another example of Trump just doing common sense things that the left gets triggered by and makes

01:13:47.300 stupid responses. Again, this is where if they had any sense, they would just say, on this issue,

01:13:52.240 we agree with the president and move on. But they want to fight him on every single thing. And this

01:13:56.620 is what makes, we talked about this, why we're losing people. It's not just young men. It's basically

01:14:01.760 anybody that cares about their personal safety and security or their families. There aren't people

01:14:06.540 who feel safe in the nation's capital. And to ignore it and to dismiss it, as Kara Swisher,

01:14:11.040 our previous example on another subject, dismissed the other day on CNN and said it's a made-up

01:14:16.920 controversy by Donald Trump, it's just simply not true. I mean, to Dan's point, I put this out on

01:14:22.000 Twitter the other day. If you are a Democrat, do me a favor, go to the neighborhood of your choosing

01:14:26.820 when the sun goes down, ditch your security detail, and walk five blocks, and then you can talk.

01:14:32.220 None of them will do that because they know it's true.

01:14:35.720 Wait, and look at this one, Sean. It's not just Kara Swisher. Take a look at Eugene Daniels,

01:14:40.320 who was at Politico. Now he's at MSNBC, head of the White House Correspondents Association,

01:14:48.780 who constantly, yeah, sorry, MSNOW, correct. Thank you. Thank you. Who, he loves to dress up like

01:14:56.000 Beyonce. This is, I mean, literally like Beyonce, like a woman, like his big bottom showing.

01:15:01.120 Yeah, look, look, this is the head of the White House Correspondents Dinner, I mean,

01:15:05.100 Association and Dinner. And he wants you to know there's no crime problem to speak of in D.C.,

01:15:11.540 SOT 26. I have walked the streets in heels, nail polish, and shorts on pride, and was just fine. So

01:15:18.500 the streets of D.C. are not strife with crime, as everyone's trying to say.

01:15:23.580 I'm sorry, but you're an idiot, Eugene. You're right. He's an idiot because he didn't get mugged

01:15:29.420 during the pride parade. He can speak for the black community. I have to tell you something,

01:15:34.840 Mark Halperin. As somebody who believes 100% in what they're doing down there and shares many of

01:15:41.720 the principles that J.D. Vance shares and what Stephen Miller was articulating there,

01:15:47.400 it is just, it's not just what they're doing. The fact that those three guys went to Union Station

01:15:52.340 while there were these ridiculous protests trying to stop them from cleaning it up

01:15:56.400 and fought, and Stephen Miller saying, you know what, we're going to go back to the White House

01:16:01.100 and we're going to double down and we're going to send more troops because you're doing this.

01:16:04.680 Or Tom Homan saying to the sanctuary cities, one of my guys took it in the face in sanctuary cities

01:16:10.220 thanks to you mayors not protecting him. We're going to target sanctuary cities above the other cities

01:16:15.400 now. I can't explain how gratifying it is for someone like me, and I'm sure many who are listening

01:16:22.440 now, to hear that, to hear unapologetic fighting for ideals we know to be just.

01:16:32.180 Well, the parallel to what's gone on in the Ukraine-Russia negotiations is pretty stark and clear.

01:16:38.040 I said that was as bad a case as anti-Trump coverage as I've seen. This is pretty bad too.

01:16:42.840 And it goes back to Democrats have ruled this city forever. And as Stephen Miller said,

01:16:50.000 the residents of the city, predominantly Black, have not had safety for their kids,

01:16:54.260 for their neighborhoods, for their communities. If the Democrats have a better idea,

01:16:58.740 they should put it forward. But if not, they should welcome an effort to try to fix things. And

01:17:04.540 really, when we start to get intertwined with the immigration stuff, and all of these reporters

01:17:11.540 saying, how outrageous that they're trying to detain and deport people who are here illegally.

01:17:18.140 They just, again and again, not just on the wrong side of public opinion, not just on the wrong side

01:17:23.280 of the politics, but on the wrong side of doing what's right for D.C. We need to be vigilant. They

01:17:28.700 shouldn't be violating civil liberties. They shouldn't be doing things that are inefficiently done.

01:17:32.980 They shouldn't be using the military in a gratuitous way. But the president has a plan to try to fix D.C.

01:17:38.660 where tourists from around the country in the world come, where citizens have not been afforded the

01:17:43.440 most basic responsibility of government, which is public safety. And instead, they want to turn it

01:17:48.740 into another violation of norms that offends them about Donald Trump.

01:17:53.160 Mm-hmm. Okay, so we've teased it long enough. Might as well get to MS now. I mean, I think for most

01:18:00.260 of us is going to be MSDNC for the duration. But in any event, they've decided to change their call

01:18:05.980 letters because they had to, because there's been a split at the corporate level, and NBC did not want

01:18:11.740 to share the call letters with the Loser Sister cable channel anymore and insisted that there be a

01:18:17.620 breakup. I love that NBC is pretending it's this unvarnished brand that has no political bias attached to it

01:18:24.860 whatsoever in the eyes of the consumer. So if we could just separate legally from MSNBC, people will

01:18:30.400 realize that. That's why the rebranding happened. Now it stands for MS NOW, which stands for News

01:18:37.220 Opinion and the World, which doesn't make any sense. Is there no news and opinion in the world? Like what

01:18:45.660 my source, my source for news opinion in the world? Like what do you mean? News opinion like in the

01:18:53.360 world, outside of the world? How did we have to add the world? I don't totally understand. But in any

01:18:58.440 event, MS NOW is the new call sign. And here, back to Joe Scarborough, Mark's favorite, defending the

01:19:08.400 name with this positive spin, SOT40. They even have a graphic of, this shows we're independent. Like when

01:19:14.800 you have somebody come into your company for working for like big corporations and say,

01:19:20.040 and you're talking, you're saying, and they go, we want you to be entrepreneurial. We want you to

01:19:24.240 come up with new ideas. We want you to push the boundaries. I'm excited about that. So I'm excited

01:19:29.180 about this. I've always thought about this network and CNBC and USA, and actually all of those assets

01:19:34.320 as insurgent networks, right? Insurgent, insurgent network. And so it does seem an ideal time to

01:19:40.460 rebrand, an ideal time to embrace a new identity, to, as you said, to be an insurgent network.

01:19:45.680 You know, Megan, I finally figured out what the, what the people who rebranded new Coke,

01:19:50.600 where they went. Now we know. Insurgents. This will not be the name. Yeah, I agree.

01:19:57.160 It won't? No. What's the name going to be? Just MS? I don't know, but something better. I mean,

01:20:02.060 it's so misguided. They originally said, you know, they weren't going to change the name,

01:20:06.120 but it won't be the name. It just, it's too stupid. Like it's too stupid. And my, I no longer draw a

01:20:12.780 check from Comcast. So I can say openly that whoever came, whoever came up with this process

01:20:17.980 needs to reevaluate the process in place to make decisions. Cause this is just a, a, you know,

01:20:24.000 several week long PR hit, then I'll have to pay someone else to come up with a new name.

01:20:27.500 They're not to embarrassingly tell the media there's yet another new name. Big mistake.

01:20:32.020 I would say.

01:20:32.760 I honestly, I, I, to go with insurgents as you're like, we're an insurgency. I mean, literally most,

01:20:37.900 most adults of a certain age understand that term as about Iraq and ISIS and a group that killed

01:20:45.240 American service personnel. It's not really what, how you want to describe yourself as a news

01:20:49.240 organization, like a bunch of disgusting, heartless killers. And by the way, if you,

01:20:54.460 you listen to the full soundbite there, they're what they're bragging about is that now you see

01:20:59.160 they're going to be, um, this is a, their break from legacy media. This is their break. So they're

01:21:06.040 no longer part of legacy media. They're basically doing what the four of us are doing. You see,

01:21:10.320 this is their attempt to make the cable news channel MSNBC into like a two way or a next up or a

01:21:17.580 Megyn Kelly show trying to revitalize their relevance, Dan. It's like, like what an obvious,

01:21:23.460 why don't, why doesn't anyone come out and say this was so fucking stupid, but they insisted that

01:21:29.320 we do it. So, all right, that's who we're going to say we are now. I love it. Cause I agree with

01:21:35.060 Mark. I think it's the dumbest name I've ever heard that the jokes online were hilarious about

01:21:40.960 great. Yeah. Really stands for. I look, I think if you're going to relaunch like this, like, let's just

01:21:47.580 say the name is great. If we all wanted to go along with it, what's the new product? What is

01:21:53.520 the insurgent new ideas or formats or hosts or shows that you're going to have that says like,

01:21:59.340 this is new, this is clean. This is exciting. We get it. Yeah. We're, we're going to, you know,

01:22:03.840 mimic people like Megyn Kelly and others who are drawing ratings and growing rapidly.

01:22:08.380 I don't understand, you know, what, what they did. It was just like, yep, we're going to continue

01:22:13.220 to do the same lineup with the same posts, but with a different name, but we're insurgents now.

01:22:18.860 That's exactly right. You know, I'll give you, I'll give you a little bit more Rachel Maddow.

01:22:23.060 She spoke to it again, more bullshit on how this is like a real plus sat 41.

01:22:30.180 In the end, once that is stood up, we will no longer have to compete with NBC news's properties

01:22:35.700 for the news gathering, the product of the news gathering organization. We can apply our own

01:22:41.260 instincts, our own queries, our own priorities to getting stuff that we need, um, from reporters

01:22:48.040 and correspondents. And so it's going to, it's going to be better. Oh my God. All right. I mean,

01:22:53.400 I've, I worked at NBC. NBC is the deep pocket. NBC is the one that has the teams that actually can

01:23:00.340 cover world events and has the money. And MSNBC was the beneficiary of that to try to say it's a

01:23:06.100 benefit to lose those pockets and be now the non money-making loser cable sister,

01:23:13.260 stepsister that no one wanted is just another blatant lie. Go ahead, Sean.

01:23:18.220 I was going to say, I know we started the show by talking about the, the issues that the Democrats

01:23:23.000 have on messaging and the DNC in particular. I now feel even worse for MSNBC. I mean, you talk about

01:23:29.460 stupid. They're out there. It just doesn't make sense. The bottom line is they got sold off

01:23:33.300 and they're acting like somehow they're an insurgent. It doesn't, no one buys it. It just,

01:23:37.720 it's amazing how like, do you really think that, right? No one wanted you. You literally couldn't

01:23:42.840 keep the name anymore. And you're acting like this is a good thing. You got broken up. Like this is

01:23:47.920 the person who got broken up with being like, I wanted to be single. I just, I didn't really want

01:23:52.140 to be dating anyone anymore. Like they got, they got dumped. That's the answer. Give me, give me.

01:23:56.940 It's like your parents raised you to age 14 and then put you up for an adopt for adoption and,

01:24:02.620 and said, change its name. We don't want it to have any affiliation with us. And you're out there

01:24:07.920 like, sure. I have an insurgent now. I'm an insurgent. I'm thrilled to no longer have a dollar

01:24:12.900 to my name to pay my bills because truly, I mean, this, this is the new situation for them. Go ahead,

01:24:17.380 Mark. Give me access to my chat GPT account in 20 minutes. I'll get them a better logo and a better

01:24:22.540 name. Okay. Before I let you go, Mark Halperin, Vladimir Putin was not arrested when he came

01:24:28.260 through for the summit. I heard some nonsense on two way. Would you like to account for that

01:24:33.920 prediction? I can't, it wasn't, it was a joke. My, my point of the thing, and I may explain this

01:24:38.340 several times, happy to do it again. My point was it's kind of, it was kind of incredible to host on

01:24:43.340 United States soil, a murderous dictator. And that the, the, uh, the, uh, the moment was for the

01:24:49.480 president to manage and justify the reality that if he showed up in Europe, he probably would be

01:24:54.880 arrested. I didn't, I didn't have any sources saying he would be arrested. I didn't literally

01:24:58.800 mean he would be arrested, but I meant, but to be provocative was what an incredible moment that

01:25:03.500 president Trump is bringing this guy, not just to meet with them, but to meet with them in the

01:25:07.160 United States to highlight the, the starkness of this, that he was the only way to make peace in

01:25:13.000 this war is for the president to sit with a murderous dictator. That was my point. I guess I didn't

01:25:17.760 make it clear. It's, uh, the progress that we made there appears to be eroding by the second

01:25:24.000 as the Russians came out the next day and said, uh, yeah, I said, well, let me finish my point.

01:25:29.320 Russians do what Russians do. Sorry. I'm aware, uh, as they came out and said, oh, we deny everything.

01:25:35.340 Uh, like we didn't really agree to security guarantees by European countries or the United States. In fact,

01:25:41.120 that's a deal breaker. And, uh, you know, we're really not sure we're going to have a two-way

01:25:46.280 meeting with Zelensky. So they're playing their games and yet you have the Europeans continuously

01:25:52.080 and openly saying we have never been this close to ending this war since the four years, uh, that

01:25:58.560 it's been in progress and crediting the president for getting us there. All right. I got to go. You

01:26:02.820 guys, thanks for being here. We'll talk to you soon. Coming up next, the CEO of Berna. Now,

01:26:09.160 let me tell you something. Berna is an advertiser on this show and that we don't, we don't normally

01:26:13.280 have the advertisers come on as guests, but you have got to see this product. Okay. Because

01:26:18.980 it's the new thing in self-defense and I love my Berna. I'll explain why I love my Berna

01:26:27.180 and I, every single female friend I have loves her Berna and the guys too, but I'll tell you why

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01:28:43.440 I'm Megan Kelly, host of The Megan Kelly Show on Sirius XM. It's your home for open,

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01:29:46.520 Welcome back to The Megan Kelly Show. Viewers and listeners of this program have heard me talk

01:29:50.380 about Burna, a company that makes less lethal weapons for self-defense. The Massachusetts-based

01:29:56.240 corporation makes pistols and rifles, but they're not technically firearms because they're powered by

01:30:01.720 CO2 canisters rather than gunpowder or any sort of explosive. The idea is to give individuals a

01:30:07.940 powerful way to defend themselves without resorting to deadly force. The company says it has sold nearly

01:30:14.100 700,000 of its launchers since 2019 and has yet to learn about a single fatality, but that does not

01:30:21.740 mean that the weapons are not powerful. Here's a demonstration of the force of Burna's kinetic projectiles.

01:30:28.320 Watch.

01:30:30.580 Oh!

01:30:32.140 Oh!

01:30:33.560 Okay, okay!

01:30:37.060 Ooh!

01:30:41.340 Whoa!

01:30:48.760 Wow, we just learned a lot just then, and mostly it's that the Burna completely destroys random

01:30:53.760 objects.

01:30:54.580 Ah! Mother!

01:30:56.500 Ha!

01:30:57.540 You alright?

01:30:58.320 Oh, f**k.

01:30:59.640 I think that would dissuade an assailant.

01:31:02.180 Oh, God.

01:31:02.760 Ow!

01:31:03.860 Ow!

01:31:04.360 It shows a picture of the leg.

01:31:05.980 The last person shot in that video is the company's president and CEO, Brian Gantz.

01:31:11.480 Brian joins us now to discuss more.

01:31:14.000 Brian, you really took one for the team there.

01:31:16.560 You know, that was the title of the video.

01:31:18.600 CEO takes one for the team because I couldn't convince any of my employees to get shot.

01:31:23.160 So, all right, I want the audience to say I've got two of the compact launchers right here,

01:31:29.000 and I love the black one because it looks like a real gun.

01:31:31.700 I have to say, now there's no, there's nothing in here.

01:31:34.100 I've, I've been pulling the trigger because there's nothing in here and I know that and

01:31:37.740 we check.

01:31:38.060 But it's a very kind of, it's a cool looking pistol because it does resemble a real gun.

01:31:44.780 And in the moment, God forbid you get confronted by an intruder, I have to say this is something

01:31:50.300 that a lot of my friends in particular who have had no training on guns would feel comfortable

01:31:55.640 taking out because every woman I know who hasn't been trained in guns is concerned about having

01:32:01.140 a gun because she's convinced it'll be used against her and she doesn't want to get killed.

01:32:06.400 And this is a way, I think, where a woman can have something that could protect her and

01:32:12.080 she doesn't have to worry that, God forbid, it gets turned on her, that she's dead.

01:32:16.440 I mean, do you, do you feel, do you get that kind of feedback from a lot of your customers?

01:32:21.460 We do.

01:32:22.340 I mean, there's tremendous stopping power with the Berna and I'll tell you, Megan, I've

01:32:27.760 been a gun owner my entire life and, but I always wondered how quick would I be to pull

01:32:32.420 the trigger?

01:32:33.240 And I had an experience about a decade ago, which really informed me as to how quick I

01:32:39.380 would be to pull the trigger.

01:32:40.580 I was in a road rage incident and there was a guy that was right on my bumper and he was

01:32:45.900 banging his horn and I really got nervous and I pulled off to the side of the road thinking

01:32:50.900 that he would go around me.

01:32:52.340 But he didn't.

01:32:53.320 He pulled in right behind me and he got out of his truck and I've got a Glock 19, my

01:32:59.400 nine millimeter, the glove box.

01:33:00.880 And I'm thinking, do I get out of the car with my gun or do I get out without my gun?

01:33:06.100 And I'm thinking nothing good can happen if I get out of the car with my gun.

01:33:09.540 So I got out without a gun and nothing good happened.

01:33:12.700 I mean, this guy was bigger, younger, stronger, angrier.

01:33:15.640 And he came at me and he threw me to the ground and, you know, he could have really hurt me.

01:33:20.560 Fortunately, all he really hurt was my pride.

01:33:22.580 But I realized at that moment that if I wasn't prepared to pull the trigger, the gun was of no value to me.

01:33:29.580 And although I am an avid 2A supporter, I was not going to shoot an unarmed man.

01:33:35.640 And that was kind of the genesis of Berna.

01:33:37.600 We wanted to give somebody the ability to stop an assailant, to hold them at bay, to call the police, but without the risk of taking a life.

01:33:47.240 And that's what Berna is really designed for.

01:33:49.680 I think it's a good supplement.

01:33:51.580 You know, so a lot of people listening to this program will have firearms in their home.

01:33:56.100 And, but you're right, not every situation calls for it.

01:33:58.980 And so why wouldn't you supplement?

01:34:00.640 Depending on the situation, you don't always have to go to an 11 where you actually are placing, you know, a possible fatality out there as one of the outcomes.

01:34:08.760 But with Berna, you're not.

01:34:10.200 Can you explain the two different kinds of ammunition that you can put in the Berna pistol?

01:34:17.000 So here's one.

01:34:18.080 I've got these sort of, these kinetic projectiles.

01:34:20.620 This is one of the things you get.

01:34:21.800 The audience can see it's like, it looks almost like a gumball.

01:34:24.140 You'd have to keep that away from the kids and the dogs.

01:34:26.440 Strudwick is my main concern with my, my Berna kinetic projectiles.

01:34:29.840 But explain the two types of ammo.

01:34:32.480 Okay.

01:34:32.780 Well, first off, just to get back to this, this continuum of force that you were talking about.

01:34:36.900 The police have everything from, you know, a voice command to baton, pepper spray, taser, all the way up to their firearm.

01:34:43.700 For most civilians, they don't have anything between, you know, a voice command and a gun.

01:34:49.160 And, and the Berna was to give them something a little bit further down in the continuum of force.

01:34:54.540 We make two different projectiles.

01:34:56.700 The kinetic projectile, which you were just showing, is what I got hit with.

01:35:00.960 And that is basically a high-grade polymer, looks kind of like a, you know, a marble.

01:35:06.040 And it has tremendous pain compliance is what the police refer to it as, meaning it hurts like hell.

01:35:13.440 And you get hit with it and the vast majority of people are going to, you know, turn and run.

01:35:19.320 But some people might be able to power through it.

01:35:21.920 For those people, we have these chemical irritant rounds.

01:35:24.740 They're filled with either pepper, OC, oleoresin capsaicin, or with CS, which is tear gas.

01:35:32.660 And what this does is the pellets explode when they hit the person.

01:35:36.540 They form this cloud around their head.

01:35:40.980 Immediately, they're temporarily blinded.

01:35:43.960 Their skin is on fire.

01:35:45.740 They're in respiratory distress.

01:35:47.420 Most people drop whatever they're holding.

01:35:49.000 They move their hands to their eyes because their eyes are on fire.

01:35:54.040 And they generally get down on their hands and knees.

01:35:56.980 Let me show that because we have a video of that kind of projectile in SOT 52.

01:36:10.360 So you can see this person is not having a good day.

01:36:14.480 He's writhing.

01:36:15.760 He's, like, waving his hands trying to get the smell away from him.

01:36:19.000 He's crawling.

01:36:28.320 He's taking off his shirt.

01:36:30.000 He's trying to get, like, relief.

01:36:31.660 Yeah, your skin feels like it's on fire.

01:36:34.200 Anything where that chemical irritant has touched your skin would be burning.

01:36:39.320 Who's this poor guy who agreed to this?

01:36:41.780 This was actually one of our employees down in South Africa.

01:36:45.520 We had a much easier time in South Africa getting people to agree to get shot for a few hundred dollars than we did here in the U.S.

01:36:52.460 Oh, my God.

01:36:53.580 But it does bring it home.

01:36:56.040 So wait, so how would it work then?

01:36:57.980 Like, do you have to have two guns with the different projectiles?

01:37:02.260 No, the way I load my gun and the way I would recommend that you load your gun, Megan, is I put in the three chemical irritant projectiles first.

01:37:12.620 So they come out last.

01:37:14.100 And then I put in the two hard kinetic projectiles.

01:37:17.900 In most cases, the kinetic projectile will be more than adequate.

01:37:22.480 You know, you'll shoot somebody once and they will turn on their heels and run.

01:37:25.400 But if they are committed, if they're going to power through, you want to be able to physically stop them, as we just saw with that video, where you, you know, incapacitate them through temporary blindness, respiratory distress, you know, intense burning sensation.

01:37:42.900 Interestingly, though, you know, most times the burn is used, nobody even pulls the trigger.

01:37:47.900 So I was on a podcast maybe two months ago, and I can't remember the guy's name, but he wrote that book, More Guns, Less Crime.

01:37:56.580 And he's, you know, strong to a proponent.

01:37:59.100 He says 95 percent of the time when you pull out a gun to stop an assailant, you don't have to pull the trigger.

01:38:06.640 Just the idea of fighting back.

01:38:09.620 John, sorry, John, John Locke.

01:38:11.140 Yeah, I think he's been on the program.

01:38:12.700 Exactly, John Locke.

01:38:14.560 Yeah.

01:38:14.780 So just you pull it and that's enough to deter people.

01:38:18.820 But I will say something I like about the chemical irritating rounds, like the next level round, is you don't actually have to have a direct hit for it to work.

01:38:31.340 Like you could have an intruder and you could shoot the wall right next to them if your aim is not so great and still take them down.

01:38:40.480 Well, you know, there is a certain horseshoes and hand grenades aspect to this.

01:38:45.480 All you need to do is get near the assailant.

01:38:48.420 But the police have really created an art out of this.

01:38:51.600 So, for example, we're carried by over 300 police agencies.

01:38:55.580 The most dangerous thing in policing is you come up on a car, the windows are blackened.

01:39:00.660 People are not getting out of the car.

01:39:02.420 You have no idea whether they've got a gun in the car.

01:39:05.120 And, you know, if you ask any law enforcement officer, this is the single most difficult traffic stop.

01:39:11.000 What they've been able to do with the Berna is to shoot out the windows with the kinetic rounds.

01:39:15.740 So one round will take out the window and then to fire the chemical irritant rounds into the car.

01:39:22.380 And what happens is it's like a clown car where all these people come out, you know, with their hands up, coughing, choking, you know, getting down on their hands and knees.

01:39:30.600 So law enforcement uses it quite often where they don't even they can't even see the person they're shooting at.

01:39:36.780 But they can shoot rounds into a car, into a room, into some area where they want to get the people out of that car or out of that room.

01:39:45.100 Mm hmm. Like I was thinking about, remember, after the George Floyd incident in 2020, when these flash mobs for like two years would show up at the 7-Eleven or some local store and and go into the store and lood this.

01:40:01.600 There'd be looting. There'd be just rabble rousing.

01:40:03.980 This, to me, would be the perfect kind of weapon to have because you don't actually want to shoot someone to death, but you feel under threat and you do want them to get out.

01:40:12.620 You could shoot the floor, you know, away from yourself and ideally get them out of there if you can't get police help.

01:40:19.200 And in too many communities in America, they're not close to police help.

01:40:23.020 They really are on their own.

01:40:24.400 Well, look at what's going on in Washington, D.C.

01:40:27.700 So Washington, D.C. is out of control.

01:40:29.840 Thank God the president has federalized the police.

01:40:32.240 He's brought in the National Guard, but not every city has federalized police or National Guard.

01:40:37.800 And in most places, like you said, you are your own first responder.

01:40:41.880 You cannot rely on the police getting there in time and you need to have something to protect yourself.

01:40:47.760 And honestly, nobody wants to shoot, you know, a 15 year old kid, but none of us want to be a victim.

01:40:54.760 You need to have something that you can use to protect yourself.

01:40:57.960 And, you know, although I've been an avid gun owner my whole life and I've never, you know, I've never given up any of my guns, I carry a Berner which I can use first.

01:41:08.380 I still have my Glock 19 in the glove box, but I'm going to try my Berner first.

01:41:14.100 If that doesn't work, if they have a gun, then I'll pull out my lethal firearm.

01:41:18.520 But I'll first go to non-lethal.

01:41:21.820 Yes, I think a lot of people feel that way, especially given how litigious people are in today's day and age.

01:41:28.600 I know that 95% of your sales are to consumers, 5% to law enforcement.

01:41:33.380 You can get a pistol or you can get a rifle and you can get the compact Berner like I have, but I have the full size Berner too.

01:41:41.180 I've got a few of these guns and I have to tell you, I feel a lot safer thanks to Berner.

01:41:46.220 And that's the reason that I accepted them as advertisers.

01:41:48.680 We have a lot of advertisers that you're literally like one of the only ones I've ever put on to actually talk about the product because I think it could save lives, Brian.

01:41:55.120 Thank you.

01:41:55.740 Thank you so much for your support and for doing this.

01:41:57.740 Well, thank you very much, Begum.

01:41:59.520 We really appreciate the platform.

01:42:01.320 Thank you very much.

01:42:02.100 All the best.

01:42:03.000 Okay, so it's Berner, spelled B-Y-R-N-A.

01:42:05.780 We love our Y's here at the Megyn Kelly Show.

01:42:07.640 Now, Berner, B-Y-R-N-A.com.

01:42:11.040 Check it out.

01:42:11.860 I have to tell you, my Berner is the envy of all my neighborhood.

01:42:16.700 They're all going to order these things because who doesn't want multiple layers of self-defense, right?

01:42:21.660 It depends.

01:42:22.320 You never know what's going to happen and you want to be prepared.

01:42:25.860 Okay, thank you for listening.

01:42:27.040 We'll talk to you tomorrow.

01:42:28.040 We're back with Maureen Callahan.

01:42:32.580 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show.

01:42:34.540 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

01:42:37.640 We'll talk to you tomorrow.

01:42:38.660 We'll talk to you tomorrow.

The Megyn Kelly Show - August 20, 2025

Dems in Decline, Newsom's Bizarre Trump Troll Attempt, and Truth About DC Crime, with Halperin, Spicer, and Turrentine

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