The Megyn Kelly Show - Dems Mad at Memes, Lemon and Reid's Racialized Crime Comments, and Michelle Can't Stand Barack, with Glenn Greenwald ｜ Ep. 1161

00:00:00.540 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.

00:00:12.220 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:15.380 Well, the government has been shut down since midnight, and both sides don't seem to be anywhere near a deal.

00:00:22.100 Can you feel the excitement?

00:00:25.840 I mean, I guess they did it this time, so that's something new.

00:00:28.860 Normally, they just do the brinksmanship up until the last second, and then they cut a deal.

00:00:32.600 And I don't know, like, okay, this is our government.

00:00:37.760 The Democrats seem more concerned about Trump's funny AI videos that put sombreros on people than in getting the government going again.

00:00:49.940 We'll talk about what they're doing.

00:00:51.800 Plus, Jimmy Kimmel and Stephen Colbert appeared on each other's shows last night, where they once again played the I'm a millionaire victim card.

00:01:00.900 That's a thing for them.

00:01:02.440 Joining me now to react to all of this and more is Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist and host of Rumble's System Update, Glenn Greenwald.

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00:02:19.180 Glenn, great to see you again.

00:02:20.700 Thanks for being here.

00:02:22.180 Happy to be here, Megan.

00:02:23.060 Thanks for having me.

00:02:24.420 I mean, all right, we'll start with the shutdown.

00:02:26.700 It's going to be fun when we get to Kimmel and Colbert.

00:02:28.620 But we'll start with the shutdown.

00:02:30.220 So they weren't able to strike a deal.

00:02:32.480 To me, it's so galling because it's like what the Democrats are saying is we want you to undo some of the things that just passed in the big, beautiful bill.

00:02:41.260 Well, you already lost that fight.

00:02:43.720 It's been signed into law.

00:02:45.280 It's law now.

00:02:46.180 And they're like, we're not going to fund the government unless you reverse pieces of your law.

00:02:50.760 And the Republicans are like, that's not how legislation is done or undone.

00:02:56.420 And that's not how spending is negotiated.

00:02:59.560 And I think as near as I can tell, the Democrats are trying to follow the Ezra Klein rule where he was like, we've got to get out there and fight.

00:03:08.340 We have that sound bite.

00:03:09.580 Do we not?

00:03:10.020 We have Ezra Klein with his warning.

00:03:11.820 Oh, no, sorry.

00:03:13.040 It was an it was an article.

00:03:14.960 And I'll read it to you, what he said in part.

00:03:17.860 But this is Ezra Klein saying we got to fight.

00:03:20.920 It's the New York Times op-ed.

00:03:23.320 I often heard people complain that Democrats lacked a message.

00:03:27.060 What Democrats really lacked was power.

00:03:29.680 And so we're facing the question again.

00:03:31.160 Should Senate Democrats partner with Senate Republicans to fund this government?

00:03:34.600 I don't see how they can.

00:03:36.380 We are no longer in the muzzle velocity stage of this presidency.

00:03:39.260 We are in the authoritarian consolidation stage of this presidency.

00:03:43.480 I want to be very clear about what I'm saying here.

00:03:45.460 Donald Trump is corrupting the government.

00:03:47.720 He's using it to hound his enemies, line his pockets and entrench his own power.

00:03:51.240 This is what Democrats cannot fund.

00:03:53.280 This is what they have to try to stop.

00:03:55.820 This is not just how authoritarianism happens.

00:03:58.740 This is authoritarianism happening.

00:04:02.000 Right now, Democrats have no power, so no one cares what they have to say.

00:04:05.180 A shutdown would make people listen.

00:04:07.740 And I think, near as I can tell, that's exactly what's happening now, Glenn.

00:04:11.040 Your thoughts on it?

00:04:13.800 I sense this kind of ennui and almost boredom in the tone you used when you first started

00:04:18.680 talking about this government shutdown.

00:04:20.240 And I feel the same way.

00:04:21.200 I was talking to my team about it, you know, this week in terms of how we were going to

00:04:24.200 cover it.

00:04:24.680 And I said, you know, I feel like this is something, if you pay attention to politics,

00:04:28.460 happens basically every two years.

00:04:30.720 There's kind of a brinksmanship.

00:04:33.260 Sometimes they even do shut down the government for the while.

00:04:35.600 Each side goes on cable all day and blames the other.

00:04:38.580 And eventually it works out.

00:04:40.600 I do think that what really is going on more so than any fight over a particular budgetary

00:04:46.880 item is the fact that, you know, we often talk about how Democrats are so, you know,

00:04:52.160 historically unpopular.

00:04:54.000 And the main reason is, is because their own base also views the Democratic Party in a very

00:04:59.800 negative way.

00:05:00.440 And the reason for that is that they perceive the Democrats aren't fighting enough in order

00:05:05.080 to stop Trump.

00:05:05.860 And there's a lot of pressure among Democratic Party elected officials, including, you know,

00:05:10.620 the kind of message that you just read from Ezra Klein, to show some sort of battle, to show

00:05:16.000 some sort of willingness to confront Trump.

00:05:18.080 And the problem for the Democrats is not that they keep trying to embrace these almost like

00:05:24.060 theater kid gestures, like, you know, they have Chuck Schumer going on and like trying

00:05:27.840 to curse sometimes or Gavin Newsom, you know, trying to show that he can talk like Trump.

00:05:32.820 And the problem with the Democratic Party is not that they're not performative enough or

00:05:38.960 fighting enough in terms of like showing this.

00:05:41.680 It's that they don't really, no one knows what they stand for.

00:05:44.000 They don't really have any sort of passionately felt views.

00:05:48.000 And the ones they do feel passionately about, they feel like are too unpopular to really

00:05:52.460 forefront.

00:05:53.660 And so you have this kind of vapid kind of theatrical gesture of fighting, but there's

00:05:59.480 just no substance behind it.

00:06:01.860 And so there's no galvanizing force that it really is generating.

00:06:05.420 And at some point, they're going to capitulate.

00:06:07.440 All I can picture is like the skinny kid on the playground up across from like the muscly guy 1.00

00:06:13.200 going like, make, make me, make me, right?

00:06:17.940 Like you really don't want him to respond, you know, like sometimes you actually need

00:06:22.800 to be able to fight and not just be able to threaten that you're willing to fight. 0.94

00:06:28.580 And I just feel like the Democrats are the skinny kid with no muscle.

00:06:31.920 They've got no cards to play.

00:06:34.000 They're going to get blamed for this shutdown.

00:06:36.040 Um, the Republicans were ready to just continue the funding levels at existing levels and

00:06:43.240 said, let's just, let's go forward, you know, as we have been for the, at least the next

00:06:47.100 seven weeks.

00:06:47.660 And the Democrats said, no, we want you to take away these provisions that have been

00:06:52.000 passed into law and continue supplementing Obamacare payments, which, and basically funding

00:06:58.120 illegal healthcare and, and because the big, big, beautiful bill cracks down on Medicaid

00:07:03.320 funding for illegals.

00:07:05.480 And I don't, I mean, I guess there is a real question about who's going to get blamed,

00:07:08.920 but to me, it just seems like the Republicans were willing to continue funding the government

00:07:14.240 and the Democrats weren't.

00:07:16.260 So the public will blame the Democrats.

00:07:18.620 I like, I, I'm not sure exactly how the Democrats win on this.

00:07:21.800 And on top of all that, Trump is threatening to do more doge cutting now that the government

00:07:27.760 is shut down, which is his priority, which is his prerogative.

00:07:31.460 He can do that, which the Democrats hate too.

00:07:34.360 And they think like their old argument when we had doge and Elon was the American people

00:07:38.540 are going to hold this against you.

00:07:40.040 Guess what?

00:07:40.320 They didn't.

00:07:40.880 We just saw in the latest New York times poll, Trump's ratings haven't slipped at all

00:07:45.700 from four months ago when he was doing all the dogeification.

00:07:48.620 So I really just don't see the hand the Democrats have to play other than bending the knee to

00:07:53.420 Ezra Klein.

00:07:55.660 I mean, the thing is, you know, in our elections, because 50% of the country just doesn't vote

00:08:01.960 because they don't believe in the system or they don't believe it matters.

00:08:05.340 Being able to galvanize your vase is actually an extremely important obligation of any party

00:08:11.340 that wants to win, especially in a midterm year when there's no presidential election.

00:08:14.600 And if you're faced with a situation, as the Democrats are, where huge amounts of your voters,

00:08:20.680 your core voters are really disillusioned with you based on their perception that you're not

00:08:25.100 fighting Trump enough.

00:08:26.020 And Trump actually himself this week said, you know what?

00:08:28.700 The left and liberals, they're kind of dead. 1.00

00:08:32.720 They're kind of pathetic. 1.00

00:08:33.640 I was expecting much more of a fight from them. 1.00

00:08:35.460 And they don't really fight anything.

00:08:37.000 This is the perception that pretty much everyone has, in large part because it's true. 1.00

00:08:40.620 They're led by these really old people who have been around for decades.

00:08:44.520 They are trapped between the interests of their donor base, their corporate donor base,

00:08:49.340 and their voter base that has a much different set of ideas about.

00:08:52.860 And they're very, very lost.

00:08:54.840 And I don't know, I get like, you know, it's always a feature of our democracy that

00:08:58.320 although a party is in the minority, they're still supposed to have a say.

00:09:02.620 And it's just that the problem with the Democrats, it was the problem with the Kamala Harris

00:09:06.860 campaign is they don't have a persona.

00:09:10.720 Like, what do Democrats believe in?

00:09:12.980 They're trying to center it around this idea that Republicans want to cut Medicaid, which

00:09:18.020 a lot of the core Republican voters, like the white working class and even like multiracial

00:09:22.120 working class voters in these swing states that voted for Trump will actually suffer

00:09:25.700 from.

00:09:26.040 It's not a terrible issue.

00:09:27.080 It's not a bad issue.

00:09:28.300 It's just that there's no charisma.

00:09:30.160 There's no energy.

00:09:30.980 There's no like vibrancy.

00:09:32.240 And when they try and demonstrate it, it's so clearly coming from the script of a, of

00:09:36.340 a, of a PR consultant that it just falls so flat and almost makes you feel sorry for

00:09:41.080 them rather than intimidated by them.

00:09:43.260 And that's their real problem.

00:09:44.840 They, I love your use of the term theater kids.

00:09:47.920 No offense to theater kids.

00:09:49.300 Cause you know, I have a daughter who loves theater, but, but I get it.

00:09:52.400 It like connotes a certain, like at my high school, we had groups.

00:09:56.420 This is back in the eighties.

00:09:57.720 Of course, the more popular kids were called the swelts. 0.97

00:10:00.860 You had the jocks.

00:10:02.180 They were cool too.

00:10:03.740 Then you had the dirties who were the people who hung out in the smoking section during free

00:10:07.880 time and played hacky sack.

00:10:09.580 And then you had the creamies who were the theater kids. 0.62

00:10:13.360 It just connotes a certain kind of approach.

00:10:16.860 And the creamies on Capitol Hill right now want us to believe they're super tough, but they're 0.84

00:10:23.100 what we know.

00:10:23.560 They're not actually tough.

00:10:25.020 We know it's, it is cosplaying.

00:10:26.500 And that I think of like Gavin Newsom who like, he's not in Capitol Hill, but he's,

00:10:31.680 he's like their best imitation of a tough guy.

00:10:34.180 I think, you know what I mean?

00:10:35.240 Like nobody believes Chuck Schumer is a tough guy.

00:10:38.300 Hakeem Jeffries doesn't seem scary at all.

00:10:41.320 Then you got Newsom who's like, Oh yeah, I'm a badass.

00:10:44.100 And he's trying to do the Trump tweets with the all caps and do his best imitation of JD

00:10:49.560 or Trump.

00:10:50.120 But you can tell it's acting.

00:10:52.420 It doesn't work if I can tell it's acting.

00:10:57.340 Exactly.

00:10:58.140 And to me, this, if you were to ask me, what is the singular factor that explains Donald

00:11:03.760 Trump's political dominance over our country over the last 10 years, they would have no

00:11:07.380 difficulty answering.

00:11:08.680 It's that Trump for whatever faults he has, for whatever mistakes he makes, whatever things

00:11:13.740 he says that you might find off putting, he is who he is.

00:11:17.480 It's who he has always been.

00:11:18.900 It's his personality since the time he emerged decades ago on the public scene.

00:11:23.320 He's comfortable in his own skin because he's being himself.

00:11:27.340 And that's something you cannot fake.

00:11:31.060 That's something you can't manufacture.

00:11:33.700 And I think, you know, honestly, if you look at the Democrats who have galvanized people's

00:11:38.520 excitement for whatever you might think of them, people like Bernie Sanders or Zeran

00:11:42.420 Mondami or even AOC, they at least have a kind of like conviction.

00:11:48.360 A set of beliefs that they are willing to say.

00:11:51.920 And yeah, it's authentic.

00:11:53.560 Whatever else might be true about them.

00:11:55.280 And the problem with the Democratic Party is especially in the age, you know, since Bill

00:11:59.380 Clinton's emergence, which is which was one of the successes of the Clinton machine, they

00:12:03.040 merged with the elite centers of power in the United States.

00:12:06.060 So if you want to rise in the Democratic Party ranks, you have to know how to speak to Ivy

00:12:09.960 Lee graduates from Wall Street and Silicon Valley and Hollywood.

00:12:14.460 Those are the people who rise like the Chuck Schumers, the Hakeem Jeffries, the Gavin Newsoms.

00:12:19.580 These people rise because they're very good at raising massive amounts of money from the

00:12:22.940 country's elite.

00:12:24.060 That's where they're most comfortable.

00:12:25.560 And they don't have this other side to them.

00:12:27.440 They can't fake it.

00:12:28.360 And when they try, it just makes things worse for them.

00:12:30.400 Okay, so Trump, very effectively, I discussed this yesterday on the show, drops this video

00:12:38.140 of Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer.

00:12:40.540 It's AI altered with Hakeem Jeffries, a sombrero comes down on his head, a Mexican mustache appears

00:12:47.600 on his face.

00:12:49.000 And then they have Chuck Schumer in an AI voice saying, we have no voters left because of all 1.00

00:12:55.400 of our woke trans bullshit. 1.00

00:12:57.760 Okay, so Trump posts this. 1.00

00:13:00.400 On Monday night, it's got over 20 million views.

00:13:03.340 I mean, way to call attention to a shutdown and who you say is to blame, like very effective.

00:13:10.500 It went so viral because it was so different from anything any president has ever done for

00:13:16.020 all sorts of reasons.

00:13:17.900 And then you had the left meltdown over it, calling more attention.

00:13:21.580 So it's a very effective, smart move by Trump.

00:13:24.280 It was, you know, of course, his brand of humor, but it also was an effective political

00:13:28.600 move, I think, because so much attention got called to it.

00:13:30.960 Then last night, Trump doubled down by putting a new spin on it.

00:13:36.140 And here that is in Sot 3.

00:13:37.420 A team is speaking.

00:13:47.020 And the hat comes down and the mustache comes on.

00:13:52.620 But now there's a mariachi band behind, all wearing sombreros and they're all Donald Trump

00:14:00.760 playing the guitar, whatever behind him.

00:14:06.740 It's very funny.

00:14:09.380 And if Democrats were smart, they would laugh at themselves or roll their eyes at Trump and

00:14:16.420 maybe come up with their own response.

00:14:18.300 I'm sorry, but this is the funniest thing I've done with Trump.

00:14:21.160 He's playing the trumpet, playing the guitar, doing all the instruments.

00:14:25.040 A trumpet and a sombrero.

00:14:26.760 I find it very funny.

00:14:29.940 But they're not smart.

00:14:31.500 Everybody finds it funny.

00:14:33.800 That's the whole thing.

00:14:34.720 You know, I think one of the most clever things Trump did was, and to this day, I laugh about

00:14:40.660 this when I think about this, is when that whole thing with Elizabeth Warren emerged about

00:14:43.920 how she faked being a Native American, he started calling her Pocahontas, which, you

00:14:48.360 know, it's just like the perfect name to call somebody who's this like white lady who tried

00:14:51.700 to be a Native American.

00:14:52.840 And I remember even one time he had these like elders from some like Cherokee tribe in

00:14:57.300 the Oval Office where he was like honoring Native American Day or something.

00:15:00.080 And he was like, to them, he was saying, and we have a woman who's in Congress.

00:15:03.400 We call her Pocahontas. 1.00

00:15:05.420 And every time he would do it, the Democrats and the media would be like, he's a racist. 0.99

00:15:10.840 He's a racist. 0.99

00:15:11.620 He's mocking Native Americans. 0.99

00:15:13.400 When in reality, he was always mocking Elizabeth Warren for pretending to be Native American.

00:15:17.780 He was never mocking Native Americans themselves.

00:15:19.980 And the more angry they got, the funnier it became.

00:15:23.880 This is so basic.

00:15:25.060 Like, how do you not know this?

00:15:26.120 You know, it's like if you go on the Internet and somebody is mocking you, the worst thing

00:15:29.320 you can do, the best thing you can do for them is get up on your high horse and say,

00:15:32.760 how dare you?

00:15:33.860 Like, everybody knows this.

00:15:35.060 This is so basic.

00:15:36.740 And so I don't know.

00:15:38.020 They've been doing this for eight years.

00:15:39.620 They like play right into Trump's hands so perfectly.

00:15:41.960 And, you know, you can make an argument like, yeah, the president should be above it.

00:15:46.580 But that's no longer our politics.

00:15:48.240 That's the politics that Trump broke.

00:15:50.060 I don't think people like that in our politics, that everybody has to pretend to be one thing,

00:15:54.140 but in reality is something else.

00:15:56.100 And this is the kind of thing people laugh at over the water coolers, even if they know

00:16:00.340 that they're not supposed to.

00:16:01.600 And it is a huge, powerful weapon that Trump has a Democrat still, you know, like he's

00:16:07.080 going to go around and be like, this is racist.

00:16:09.000 This is bigotry.

00:16:09.980 How dare?

00:16:10.440 I mean, it's just it's so it makes it funnier, honestly.

00:16:13.560 Yes.

00:16:13.920 And that's why they double down on it.

00:16:15.680 No one's moved by that. 0.98

00:16:17.280 And someone should tell that to Teresa Fernandez, a representative damn from New Mexico. 1.00

00:16:23.020 Here she is in five. 0.98

00:16:25.560 That's right.

00:16:26.200 And then what does that shameful man do?

00:16:28.760 After a meeting where you're supposed to be working out details, where you're supposed

00:16:33.680 to be negotiating a deal, you post something that draws a sombrero and a mustache.

00:16:44.280 Yes, that's the move.

00:16:46.160 Correct.

00:16:46.900 Oh, the horror.

00:16:48.360 You're supposed to be working.

00:16:50.140 I mean, truly, who responds to that school marmy scolding, Glenn?

00:16:53.640 I mean, yeah, you feel like you're in eighth grade and somebody is just like, you know,

00:16:58.960 you did a little harmless joke.

00:17:00.580 And now somebody standing over you saying this is inappropriate.

00:17:03.280 But I do want to say I think there's something a little bit deeper going on here, which is

00:17:06.280 that, you know, one of the things that is odd about it is Hakeem Jeffries is actually

00:17:10.340 not Latino.

00:17:11.400 He's he's black.

00:17:12.660 Right.

00:17:13.120 And I remember that that's the funny part.

00:17:15.960 That's also funny.

00:17:17.600 Right.

00:17:18.020 That's what it would be one thing if it were like actually a Latino person. 0.99

00:17:20.880 And then people would be like, I don't know, that seems kind of racist.

00:17:23.000 But the fact that he's not even Latino.

00:17:24.800 And I remember this is one of the other funniest things I've ever seen was remember that time

00:17:28.560 when Trump went before that black association of journalists to be interviewed in the height

00:17:33.420 of the campaign.

00:17:34.580 And he just threw that thing out there where he was like, oh, Kamala's black.

00:17:37.820 I never really even knew she was black.

00:17:39.300 And I remember talking to people.

00:17:40.140 Because she's black now. 1.00

00:17:42.360 Yeah. 0.90

00:17:42.680 And then what happened was CNN went to like a black barbershop, which is where like CNN

00:17:47.620 thinks all the real black people congregate. 0.99

00:17:49.740 That's how they show their authenticity. 0.98

00:17:51.000 They go to the black barbershop in Philadelphia.

00:17:52.740 And there were like these 12 black guys sitting around in the barbershop.

00:17:55.600 And the CNN correspondent went in and said yesterday, Trump said that Kamala is not really

00:18:00.040 black.

00:18:00.400 Do you think she's black? 0.93

00:18:01.640 And of course, they were expecting her to say that. 0.53

00:18:03.480 Them all to say like, yeah, of course, she's black. 1.00

00:18:05.000 And they all kind of looked at each other.

00:18:06.660 And one of them finally was like, I don't know.

00:18:09.860 Is she?

00:18:10.600 And then a couple of them were like, I don't think so.

00:18:13.560 And this is a major.

00:18:15.640 Yeah.

00:18:15.960 This is a major split in the problem.

00:18:18.640 This is a major problem with the Democratic Party is they're like, look, we have all 0.92

00:18:21.420 these black people.

00:18:22.140 We have Kamala Harris and Hakeem Jeffries. 0.70

00:18:24.000 These are people who look like they just came out of boardrooms of like Aetna or, you

00:18:28.740 know, like some kind of like, you know, bureaucratic general counsel meeting.

00:18:33.540 These are not people who identify who seem like to resonate with the kind of black voter

00:18:38.880 that Trump has had success.

00:18:40.020 And I think that's part of it, too, is kind of like blurring, blurring the lines of what

00:18:44.740 Hakeem Jeffries really is, because at the end of the day, he's really just like a swamp

00:18:48.740 creature who most comfortable with D.C.

00:18:50.980 lobbyists and fundraisers and not with the people he wants to represent.

00:18:55.580 The board meeting for Ed.

00:18:59.620 That's how I always thought of Kamala Harris, like coming out like in her suit, like being 0.66

00:19:03.440 like, well, we've adopted some very important protocols for insurance claims, you know,

00:19:07.700 and that's who the Democratic Party keeps putting forward.

00:19:10.120 And Hakeem Jeffries is very much like that.

00:19:12.500 Yes.

00:19:13.000 Oh, my God.

00:19:13.500 It's so funny.

00:19:14.240 Oh, this whole thing is so funny.

00:19:17.440 Here's Hakeem Jeffries fresh out of health care reform.

00:19:22.400 We're reacting to Trump's A.I.

00:19:24.420 video.

00:19:24.940 Here it is up for.

00:19:27.120 Mr.

00:19:27.700 President, the next time you have something to say about me.

00:19:30.980 Don't cop out through a racist and fake A.I.

00:19:41.600 video. 0.71

00:19:43.520 When I'm back in the Oval Office, say it to my face.

00:19:48.500 Say it to my face. 0.62

00:19:52.140 OK, again, it's the skinny kid on the playground.

00:19:56.140 And by the way, you'd be better off doing that, Hakeem, without the whoo, yeah, whoo.

00:20:03.940 And the little mild milquetoast white lady with the glasses behind you in the suit shaking 1.00

00:20:08.860 her head mildly.

00:20:10.000 Yes.

00:20:11.000 Yes.

00:20:11.640 Go, Hakeem. 0.99

00:20:14.320 Also, it took like two or three days for him to come up with that.

00:20:17.240 Like this video first emerged, you know, a couple of days ago.

00:20:19.660 Like if that were really his visceral reaction like that, I'm going to go down to Oval Office,

00:20:24.600 let him say that to my face.

00:20:26.180 Maybe that would be a little convincing.

00:20:28.160 But this was something like that.

00:20:29.360 That's what I should have done.

00:20:30.320 About that they script.

00:20:31.660 Yeah.

00:20:32.020 Well, that's but that's not who he is.

00:20:33.720 And that's the problem.

00:20:35.160 Right.

00:20:35.560 Like if he were that and he he would have reacted that way immediately and maybe that

00:20:40.120 would have been more effective.

00:20:41.020 But this was something that happened after a couple of days of them, like sitting in

00:20:43.920 planning strategy meetings, saying like, oh, let's have Hakeem get up to the microphone

00:20:48.560 with, you know, Maxine Waters behind him making like noises and pretend that you're

00:20:53.880 now not offended anymore, but ready to fight over it. 0.97

00:20:56.520 It just it just comes off as so inauthentic, really so pathetic. 0.97

00:21:00.100 And I'm sure Trump's going to put a sombrero on his head when like today, later today, when 0.96

00:21:04.440 when he they show video of Hakeem saying that.

00:21:07.620 Yes.

00:21:08.060 And by the way, I just feel like Hakeem, the whole thing is empty because, of course,

00:21:15.860 Trump would say that to his face.

00:21:17.260 Trump says whatever the hell he wants right to the face of whoever is sitting there right

00:21:21.960 in front of. I mean, think of what he's been saying to world leaders just over the past

00:21:25.520 couple of months. He just doesn't doesn't care.

00:21:27.740 Like the notion that Trump is too afraid of Hakeem Jeffries to mock him in person.

00:21:32.800 OK, try that on somebody else.

00:21:36.020 But I actually think if I were advising the Democrats because their fight is twofold.

00:21:41.780 They do want they want these Medicaid cuts because the Republicans crack down on waste,

00:21:46.000 fraud and abuse in the big, beautiful bill of Medicaid.

00:21:48.340 And they've argued all along. These aren't really cuts to Medicaid.

00:21:52.020 These are kicking people off Medicaid who would never should have been on it or taking

00:21:56.500 advantage of a program that they don't belong on.

00:21:59.000 And that is meant for the truly needy, like able bodied, you know, young males would be

00:22:04.200 one example. And the Democrats try to just say, oh, you cut health care for the poor.

00:22:10.220 But they really are getting funding of Medicaid for illegals back on the table in this fight.

00:22:18.720 And if I were a Democrat, I would say, you know what?

00:22:23.460 F this guy. I'd say, I know none of us want to pay for health care for illegals. 1.00

00:22:28.520 I get that. But let me ask you this.

00:22:30.600 If there's somebody who's here illegally and, you know, they have a terrible car accident 1.00

00:22:36.840 and they're dying and they get brought to the hospital, should Medicaid pay the bill?

00:22:41.860 I mean, could we in the in the rare circumstance foot the bill of somebody like that?

00:22:46.560 By the way, I think there are already rules where they have to take you if you're dying in these

00:22:49.780 in these emergency room conditions. 0.99

00:22:52.780 But like, make the make the case if you actually are supporting this, which he is, make the damn 0.97

00:23:00.200 case rather than just pretending that you're not doing it and hiding behind the say to my face, 1.00

00:23:06.980 he's a racist. We're fighting for health care, like empty generalizations.

00:23:14.580 You know, you're so right. And to me, this is the crucial point.

00:23:18.320 If you talk to Democrats like in Congress or the kind of people who, you know, strategize for them,

00:23:23.240 which I've had, which I have the unfortunate experience of doing with some some amount of

00:23:27.640 frequency, these are the things they will argue for in a not entirely unpersuasive way

00:23:35.820 are things that they are afraid to say publicly because they think the country is against them.

00:23:41.520 And I'll tell you something like when it comes to immigration, immigration has been a winning

00:23:45.140 issue for Trump, like at the highest level of generality, right?

00:23:47.840 Like people perceive there's way too many people flowing into our country in an uncontrolled way

00:23:52.460 that our communities can't absorb them. We don't have the money that it's usually working class 1.00

00:23:56.080 Americans who suffer the most, all of which is true. At the same time, Americans are very empathetic

00:24:01.700 and there are certain levels of cruelty that they don't, I don't think people are really comfortable

00:24:06.460 with like seeing, you know, farm workers or hotel workers who have just like lived a quiet life

00:24:12.000 of law abiding, trying to make a better fit, like be treated in a gratuitously cruel way.

00:24:16.600 So there is space even on immigration for Democrats to make the arguments they really

00:24:20.780 actually believe in that they want to make. And the problem is they're so petrified of their own

00:24:25.420 shadow. They're still listening to, do you think that Trump ever listens to like a Republican

00:24:30.400 political strategist, like telling him how to speak or never, never. And even if they write speeches for

00:24:36.940 him sometime and if there's like five minutes, he's super bored and he goes back to being Trump.

00:24:40.540 The Democrats are too petrified to do that. And I do like, that's what leadership is. Anybody can

00:24:47.580 follow polling. You know, anybody can follow polling. That's the easiest and most pathetic

00:24:51.700 thing there is to do. Leadership is about when you, when you like touch people and like move their 0.97

00:24:57.260 emotions, whether it's anger or pride or, or compassion or, or whatever resentment, these are

00:25:02.860 all things that you have to be able to do in politics. But if there's no authenticity to you,

00:25:06.780 you're closed off as a person, you can't connect to anybody else. You can't move anybody else. You

00:25:11.500 can't convince people. And there is space for Democrats to argue on these issues. Undoubtedly,

00:25:16.240 and polls show that people do get uncomfortable seeing gratuitous cruelty, even if it's somebody

00:25:21.040 who crossed the border illegally, if they think they're not here to commit crimes, they're here 0.60

00:25:23.940 just to work and to better their family. But the Democrats are so lost. They're so confused.

00:25:28.700 They can't stop analyzing themselves. And because of that, they're paralyzed.

00:25:32.480 You're, you're, you're shutting down the government for, for a reason. I know you want to tell us

00:25:37.300 it's all about this one reason, but it's very clearly about this other reason involving the

00:25:41.440 illegals. So tell me why try to persuade me. Then if you lose, if you, if you don't persuade me, 1.00

00:25:48.820 you've been sent a message that you can then do something with, but why do we have to have these

00:25:53.700 debates on these artificial astroturf terms that aren't the real thing we're supposed to be

00:25:57.300 fighting about? This is a thought from Capitol Hill yesterday where a reporter gets up into

00:26:04.640 Maxine Waters face. I'm making that sound more aggressive than it was. She was just asking her

00:26:09.200 a legit question on this very issue. Now, Maxine Waters has been around for 200 years. She,

00:26:15.740 she can answer a question. She realizes a microphone in your face is an opportunity. 0.87

00:26:20.680 Does she take it? Here's how it went.

00:26:23.840 Aren't Democrats demanding healthcare for illegal aliens? 0.83

00:26:26.080 Democrats are demanding healthcare for everybody. We want to save lives. We want to make sure that

00:26:36.300 healthcare is available to those who would die, but having the help of their government. You don't

00:26:45.620 need to ask that question. You're just trying to get controversy here. You're not going to get it

00:26:49.880 for me. We want to save healthcare for all people.

00:26:55.600 I, how are we supposed to help those who won't help themselves, Glenn? I don't, I can't, I got nothing.

00:26:59.900 Yeah. I mean, and that's somebody who is in as safe a seat as you could possibly be in, right? Like each party should want these kind of like bomb throwers, the ones who just go kind of far.

00:27:11.720 And I know like, you know, sometimes they're, you know, each side has them like the Democrats have Jasmine Crockett. I think one of the reasons they like her is because she does throw those bombs and, and, and Republicans have had people like

00:27:21.940 that who do that for a while, plays well on TV, et cetera. Maxine Waters is the ultimate case of somebody who could do that. She's like, she's going to, even after she dies, I'm convinced she's going to keep getting reelected. And they're going to like prop her up in that chair the way they did with Dianne Feinstein.

00:27:34.760 And, and so like, why is she of all people afraid to just say like, yeah, we want healthcare for people who are in this country, who are contributing to our country, who are working and we don't want them dying in our streets, you know, because we cruelly deny people life-saving care. Like why not make that argument instead of acting all offended that you've been asked it?

00:27:52.560 We, uh, do we have the Caitlin Collins, Mike Johnson soundbite guys? Okay. Cause he went on, uh, speaker Mike Johnson went on with Caitlin Collins last night. I just want to play the exchange. Here it is.

00:28:06.720 As you know, people who are here in the United States legally have never been eligible for the Obamacare subsidies for Medicare, for Medicaid. Um, so what exactly are you saying that they're trying to do when you talk about giving free healthcare to them?

00:28:19.080 I'm so glad you asked. Okay. So when we passed the one big, beautiful bill, the working families tax cut, we had Medicaid reforms in the bill. You and I talked about it on the air. What we did was to eliminate fraud, waste and abuse. There were a lot of people on the program who were enrolled in the program who were never eligible to be there. Medicaid is intended for eligible U.S. citizens, not illegal aliens, not also U.S. citizens who are able-bodied workers like young men.

00:28:42.940 So we passed the law. The president signed it into law. Democrats voted against it, of course. And it's been wildly successful. The CBO, the Congressional Budget Office, which is the neutral arbiter of all these things, released a report a few weeks ago, earlier this month. And they said, you know what? The bill has had its intended purpose. Premiums are coming down. Listen, because 2.3 million ineligible enrollees had been kicked off of Medicaid, which helps to save the program, prop it up. And $185 billion has been saved already.

00:29:09.920 So basically, she's obstinate on it, like refusing to understand what he's saying. It's been explained by him. It's in the bill. I'll tell you the three specific sections that Democrats want to roll back entirely from the big, beautiful bill, which I love. The Republicans are now calling the working families tax cut. It's like the names on Capitol Hill, right? Like somebody realized, oh, one big, beautiful bill doesn't really telegraph anything that helps our side. Let's call it working families tax cut. The next bill will be called, we'll help you live forever.

00:29:39.920 Tax bill, whatever. Like, just shove any.

00:29:43.140 I dare you to vote against that. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

00:29:45.120 Right? Exactly. Just choose the selection from the land of Eden. So here are the three specific sections that they want to roll back entirely, as if they hadn't been enacted. And this would allow free health care to illegal aliens. 0.83

00:29:57.440 One, it's Section 71109, alien Medicaid eligibility. Restricts Medicaid and other coverage starting in fiscal year 27 to U.S. citizens, to lawful permanent residents, to certain Cuban-Haitian entrants, and others.

00:30:13.820 Okay, but it says exceptions remain for emergency services and certain care for lawfully present children and pregnant women. That's what I was getting to before. The law already requires you to take care of certain people like that, even if they're illegal and they come into the emergency room, and it still does. 0.98

00:30:27.860 Okay, then there's Section 7110, expansion FMAP for emergency Medicaid. Reduces the federal Medicaid federal match rate for emergency services provided to illegal immigrants in states that expanded Medicaid.

00:30:42.860 And then the last one is 71301, permitting premium tax credit only for certain individuals. Restricts eligibility for premium tax credits under the Obamacare law to lawful permanent residents, Cuban and Haitian entrants, and individuals lawfully present under certain agreements.

00:31:00.700 They point out that Biden's administration circumvented this by granting legal status to groups like parolees and asylees. And basically what they did was they created an incentive system for hospitals to get reimbursed more if it's an illegal. They can get reimbursed more. You get this premium tax credit if you treat an illegal.

00:31:21.820 And they reduce that saying, no, now you can only get this premium tax credit if the person you're treating is a U.S. citizen or somebody who's here lawfully. That's what they're fighting over.

00:31:29.740 The Democrats want all of those repealed. And the Republicans are like, no. In any event, you're not going to hear any of that on, you know, mainstream media or on CNN, certainly, though Mike Johnson certainly tried to explain it to her.

00:31:42.400 Here's J.D. Vance, by the way, taking a shot on Fox and Friends today and doing a good job of it. SOT7.

00:31:47.380 They say we're not actually trying to give health care benefits to illegal aliens. And here's why it's not true.

00:31:52.220 There are two Biden era programs that explicitly gave the taxpayer health care money to illegal aliens that we turned off when President Trump took over in January.

00:32:03.920 Program number one is there's a lot of emergency health care at hospitals that are provided to illegal aliens that was funded by the federal government. 0.73

00:32:12.180 We turned off that funding because, of course, we want American citizens to benefit from those hospital services, not to be taxed and then to have those hospital services go to illegal aliens. 0.99

00:32:22.360 The second of which is the Biden administration gave mass parole to millions upon millions of illegal aliens, and then they simultaneously made those parolees eligible for health care benefits funded by taxpayers.

00:32:36.480 In the one big, beautiful bill, President Trump and congressional Republicans turned off that money to health care funding for illegal aliens.

00:32:44.200 The Democrats want to turn it back on.

00:32:45.640 He's so effective, Glenn. There's there is no Democrat counterpart to J.D. Vance right now.

00:32:54.320 Yeah, I mean, I'm a little at a disadvantage because I'm not the expert in these health care debates and in these legislative details.

00:33:02.320 But, you know, I think the Democrats have kind of a conceptual argument, which is that one of the priorities of the Trump administration was to make sure that the tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans,

00:33:15.100 for corporate America got cut even further, or at least the tax cuts remained and got extended.

00:33:20.880 And then at the same time, they're trying to pay for those tax cuts by throwing people off of Medicaid.

00:33:24.860 And you're absolutely right.

00:33:26.500 The argument of the Republicans is, no, we just want to make sure that there's no abuse going on with Medicaid.

00:33:30.460 I think we can all agree that, you know, you leave it to like a bunch of regulators.

00:33:33.700 Some people who maybe should be on Medicaid or have the right to be on Medicaid are going to get kicked off Medicaid.

00:33:38.240 So you have a kind of you could create a conceptual argument that's based on a political ideology.

00:33:45.460 The problem and this is the problem for Democrats, like if you have the populist wing of our Democratic Party, because populism has worked for Republicans to come in and say exactly that.

00:33:54.100 That might be an effective understanding for Americans.

00:33:57.180 The problem is, is that the donor base of the Democratic Party does not allow them to speak in populist terms because the donor base of the Democratic Party wants those Trump tax cuts as much as, you know, the corporations on the Republican side.

00:34:09.220 And that leaves them with these like bureaucratic squabbles that are very difficult for people to understand and that ultimately do seem like, you know, they're they're arguing for more benefits for for people who are in the country illegally.

00:34:20.820 And that's the problem that Democrats have on top of what you said, like J.D. Vance, you know, I think he's an extremely effective political communicator.

00:34:28.060 And I also don't see a counterpart, as you said.

00:34:31.700 I mean, you saw what happened when Tim Walts tried to go against him.

00:34:34.340 And that was one of the biggest blowouts of a debate I've ever seen, the way that J.D. Vance handled that.

00:34:39.880 And he only gets better the more you know, he's still a newly arrived person on the political scene and he's only getting better.

00:34:44.960 And I think that's a big problem for Democrats as well.

00:34:47.140 You know, you know, what J.D. does that is so effective is he does not run from the danger.

00:34:51.680 He stays right over the target and he'll speak in very frank terms about it, which is very disconcerting for the other side.

00:34:59.060 He doesn't telegraph fear at all by bridging away, by giving like a pat answer and then bridging to something more comfortable.

00:35:05.140 He stays right over the target and completely exploits his own rationale and those of his side for why they're doing what they're doing.

00:35:13.500 It's very powerful.

00:35:14.780 It's very effective.

00:35:15.500 It's why people over time do come to see him as a truth teller, because he'll take you on no matter what you ask him, even if you think he's vulnerable when you pitch the question.

00:35:25.920 Here here is.

00:35:28.240 Oh, OK, yeah.

00:35:30.180 Here is Chuck Schumer.

00:35:31.200 This is making the rounds.

00:35:32.160 It was unearthed by an X account that goes by Western Lensman.

00:35:35.580 Very, very good and worth to follow.

00:35:37.300 This is Chuck Schumer in 1996.

00:35:39.540 OK, about this problem of illegals. 0.99

00:35:41.920 Listen here.

00:35:42.340 SOT 10.

00:35:42.700 All over where we go, people say, well, why can't you stop illegal immigrants or others from coming here? 1.00

00:35:52.700 And the number one answer we give our constituents is when they come here, they can get jobs, get benefits against the law because of fraud.

00:36:00.580 Yes, that's a problem, which now we're attempting to fix.

00:36:07.120 But the Republicans have held steady on it and the Dems have switched their tune.

00:36:10.980 OK, on the subject of J.D. and Gavin Newsom.

00:36:15.300 So Hakeem Jeffries did not respond with an A.I. video of his own.

00:36:19.040 He did not like jokingly show up with a little like one of those.

00:36:24.280 What's it called?

00:36:25.080 The little.

00:36:25.620 Sombreros.

00:36:26.180 Yeah.

00:36:26.520 Yeah.

00:36:26.880 Like, yeah.

00:36:27.400 Yeah.

00:36:27.540 If he showed up like wearing the Mexican garb in an actual sombrero.

00:36:33.100 We would all have such a fun laugh.

00:36:36.160 We would actually like him a lot better.

00:36:38.520 No.

00:36:39.340 Gavin Newsom drops an A.I. video.

00:36:41.540 And instead of taking aim at Trump, he takes aim at J.D. Vance, resurrecting a photo from J.D., I think, in law school at a costume party or a Halloween party.

00:36:53.140 And here's what he offered in SOT 6.

00:36:55.720 It's an A.I. video of J.D. Vance in that costume dancing.

00:37:01.640 Let's clear something up.

00:37:02.740 Yes.

00:37:03.600 There's a photo of me in drag from a college party.

00:37:06.620 And that's normal.

00:37:07.740 A.I.

00:37:08.040 Everyone experiments in college costumes, makeup, whatever.

00:37:13.680 Totally normal.

00:37:15.180 But what I don't understand is why people are so obsessed with this other thing, couch intimacy.

00:37:25.220 Like, really?

00:37:26.440 That's the part you're hung up on?

00:37:28.200 Out of everything?

00:37:29.560 That's bizarre to me.

00:37:31.320 Look, couches are comfortable.

00:37:33.040 You have a couch.

00:37:33.820 They're dependable.

00:37:35.040 They support you when you're down.

00:37:37.500 If you can't appreciate that kind of bond, maybe you're the one with issues. 1.00

00:37:41.400 I feel so much better just being able to get this off my chest and give you piece of shit. 0.99

00:37:47.080 Internet bullies a piece of my mind. 1.00

00:37:49.900 Now, grow up and go get a job.

00:37:53.660 Go follow Nostroma Core.

00:37:56.220 And good night, America.

00:37:57.380 And then it's got the fake J.D. Vance twerking.

00:38:04.660 Your thoughts on that one?

00:38:07.520 All right.

00:38:08.080 First of all, I will confess, and maybe this is my own ignorance and I'm confessing something I shouldn't be.

00:38:13.340 But, you know, I obviously pay close attention to politics.

00:38:16.040 It's my job.

00:38:17.020 I actually never understood this couch issue with J.D. Vance.

00:38:20.880 It was made up. 0.96

00:38:21.660 It was made up out of whole cloth that he was like had sex with a couch, like completely made up, never real. 0.77

00:38:30.180 And the Democrats decided to run with it when he got named Trump's VP.

00:38:33.400 Well, but like it's like that.

00:38:35.900 But that's what I'm saying.

00:38:36.520 It's like even if it were made up, but still effective as a political tool, I could at least respect it for it.

00:38:43.240 But I don't even like this.

00:38:45.960 I've never heard anybody talking about people who enjoy intimate sexual intimacy with the couch before.

00:38:52.040 So it's like I know it just comes from nowhere.

00:38:53.740 It's not it doesn't fall.

00:38:55.000 It was literally made up by a random Internet account who nobody ever heard of saying, oh, he wrote all about it in his book.

00:39:01.760 Also a lie.

00:39:02.980 And now like now Gavin Newsom thinks that people have a working knowledge of this, that it's real and that he can use it to make fun of J.D.

00:39:10.280 Right.

00:39:10.720 And I guess that's what I'm saying.

00:39:11.920 Like if I don't have a working knowledge of it for as much time as I spend online, for as much time as I spend paying attention to political discourse, as much time as I spend working on it because it's my job.

00:39:20.500 How many people beyond like the hardest core of the hardcore like resistance liberal base even understands this reference?

00:39:26.940 It's also very draggy.

00:39:28.440 It's like very slow.

00:39:30.420 There's also this weird thing of like simultaneously trying to insist that, you know, being trans and experimenting with gender ideology is this wonderful liberating thing.

00:39:38.220 But that I'm like mocking J.D. Vance for having done it.

00:39:40.600 You know, it's just all so muddled.

00:39:43.020 And this is what I think they need to find a way.

00:39:46.600 There are like Democrats.

00:39:47.920 There are liberals and people on the left who are real people who actually speak in a real way, who understand things, who who have a set of opinions that they're not afraid to express.

00:39:56.060 Those aren't the people who rise within Democratic Party ranks, though.

00:39:59.020 And they're stuck with these like very state establishment figures trying to be something that they're not.

00:40:04.180 And it's cringy to watch.

00:40:06.640 It's like the A.I. sucked to like the ones making J.D. Vance say the things he didn't say. 0.92

00:40:11.760 It sucked. 0.91

00:40:12.320 It's something I could have put together, which definitely tells you it's bad. 0.97

00:40:15.980 All right.

00:40:16.540 Before we leave the subject, I have got to show you the best piece of the story.

00:40:20.020 I can't believe it's taken me this long.

00:40:21.160 So last night, Deb, what what channel was it that ran that was at NBC?

00:40:26.340 OK, it's GMA on ABC.

00:40:28.720 Good morning, America.

00:40:29.500 This morning tried to cover.

00:40:32.220 Look at this.

00:40:33.520 They covered the Trump A.I. video for the listening audience on screen left.

00:40:37.900 It's a screen grab of the Chuck Schumer standing next to Hakeem Jeffries wearing the sombrero and the fake Mexican mustache.

00:40:46.040 And then on the right, they're interviewing Speaker Johnson.

00:40:48.420 So that's why the screen grab shows him.

00:40:49.660 But over the Schumer, Hakeem Jeffries sombrero shot, they've added the words A.I. generated image because they this is what they think of their audience, Glenn.

00:41:06.480 They need to be told that Hakeem Jeffries did not grow a huge Mexican mustache overnight and show up in a sombrero next to Chuck Schumer.

00:41:17.660 Well, also, you know what, Megan, part of this whole like self seriousness that's so pathetic is I saw a few MSNBC clips and they were, of course, they wanted to talk about the outrageous racism involved in this video.

00:41:30.780 But they kept making a point of saying, like, look, we are a news organization and we will not show you this video.

00:41:36.040 This video is fake.

00:41:37.240 Since we're a news organization, we cannot show you fake and fabricate.

00:41:42.020 It's like, yes, you can.

00:41:43.700 If like a politician is saying something you think is false, you can absolutely show the footage of the politician saying that it's false and then debunk it.

00:41:50.100 But they were like, you know, remember when they used to like show Trump speeches and then Rachel Maddow would cut in and she, OK, enough, enough.

00:41:56.320 We're a news organization.

00:41:57.380 We refuse to.

00:41:58.820 And it's like you think because you're MSNBC and you're going to cut off Trump's speech or a comp, you know, it's just it's like the self seriousness that nobody.

00:42:06.960 It's very, it is like it's very schoolmarm-y behavior.

00:42:11.400 And the more Trump mocked it, the more they fall into it.

00:42:15.060 It's a AI generated image.

00:42:17.380 Oh, oh, good to know.

00:42:18.640 I didn't realize he didn't grow that mustache overnight.

00:42:22.040 And decide to show up dressed as like a Mexican, like cha-cha dancer or something at the White House. 0.52

00:42:27.960 Thank you for letting me know that that's not what happened.

00:42:30.540 You're right, though.

00:42:31.220 I saw all like the, oh, we're not we're not going to show that video.

00:42:34.760 We're not showing that video.

00:42:36.100 No, no, we're a news organization.

00:42:37.820 We're very serious.

00:42:38.560 We're very serious.

00:42:39.300 We're a news organization.

00:42:40.500 The same people who spent years telling them that like there was a pee pee tape of Donald Trump that Vladimir Putin was using the button.

00:42:46.100 No, we're too much of a serious news organization.

00:42:49.140 No, we would never.

00:42:49.740 And by the way, if they they were the ones who claimed they thought all those Biden stumbling videos were fake, that they were deep fakes.

00:42:57.000 But they showed those.

00:42:58.300 Why don't I don't understand the double standard.

00:42:59.760 I guess if it's racist and fake, you can't show it.

00:43:02.140 But if it's just fake, you can.

00:43:03.460 And I'm not sure what they're how their rules work.

00:43:05.720 But I love that that ABC one on the subject of fake news.

00:43:09.720 I wanted to get to this at some point today.

00:43:11.320 Might as well do it today.

00:43:12.420 Did you see the thing yesterday that went around the Internet in about two seconds that I am going to CBS News?

00:43:20.400 Did you happen to see this, Glenn?

00:43:22.740 Megan, the reason if you want to set it up, go ahead.

00:43:24.980 But I have a very specific comment to make about this because it really amazed me since I was on your show two weeks ago and we talked about exactly this.

00:43:31.360 Go ahead and set that up if you want.

00:43:32.760 So you did see it.

00:43:33.520 I did see it.

00:43:34.740 I get off the air yesterday and I see, oh, my team sent it to me saying this is on Mediaite, which is a website that covers media right now.

00:43:45.200 And it was like headline is Megyn Kelly seen as CBS News that I might be going to CBS News.

00:43:49.960 And it's got my old pal Bernie Goldberg, who I love and who is great and worked at CBS, but with bad info, talking to another guy named John Daly, who I also know a little.

00:44:00.880 And they're breaking the news that Newsflash, I was seen at CBS for a, quote, screen test and that I'm going to CBS News as part of like their attempt to become more fair and balanced over there now that they're under new ownership.

00:44:17.580 And by the way, this hit without me even having been asked about it, like I got off the air and there it was.

00:44:24.420 Like, what's this?

00:44:25.620 You know, typical journalistic practice would require that you call the target of your reporting to say, is this true?

00:44:30.620 So then I find out later the guy who wrote it up for Mediaite sent a note to my producer while we were live on the air saying, is this true?

00:44:41.020 And when he didn't receive a response back within an hour, posted it.

00:44:45.660 That's not responsible journalism.

00:44:47.140 Sorry, that does not cover you as if there's the only way that covers you.

00:44:51.280 And all journalists know this is if there's some rush to get it to air.

00:44:54.400 It's like you got to get this report on right away.

00:44:56.500 Emergency.

00:44:57.340 Yeah.

00:44:57.620 Nothing.

00:44:58.180 Obviously, that's when you get a pass for.

00:45:00.960 So, no, there was no urgency on Megan Kelly's going to CBS.

00:45:04.860 Literally not one word of it is is fake.

00:45:07.880 I mean, is real.

00:45:08.920 Literally not one word of it is real.

00:45:10.420 Not one word.

00:45:11.240 Not going to CBS.

00:45:12.240 Didn't go to CBS.

00:45:13.460 Didn't have a screen test at CBS.

00:45:15.180 I'm not talking to CBS.

00:45:16.300 Don't want to go to CBS.

00:45:17.680 Would never leave this job for CBS.

00:45:19.800 Have zero desire to go back to CBS or any mainstream television broadcast or cable network.

00:45:25.160 Believe me, if I did, I would have gone.

00:45:26.900 I've had plenty of offers.

00:45:28.080 The absurdity of this.

00:45:30.040 It went all the way so fast.

00:45:32.020 And I do wonder why people were so excited to publish this after it was just a speculative report by Bernie, who has since retracted it, apologized and offered now an addendum on his own podcast saying he was wrong.

00:45:46.580 Yeah, and it was also, like, it was so detailed, too.

00:45:51.860 It was, like, that you had gone and done a screen test as though, like, CBS would need you to, like, let's see what Megyn Kelly looks like in front of a camera.

00:45:58.540 Nobody knows.

00:45:59.260 Like, let's try and test how she might seem. 0.90

00:46:01.160 But the thing personally that made me so amazed by it was that I was on your show, I don't know, two, three weeks ago, and one of the topics we discussed was Barry Weiss and the reports that she might go to CBS News or seems on her way to CBS News to assume some kind of editorial position.

00:46:17.160 And you asked me about it, and I had my own views relating to the Ellison family and why they were buying up these properties.

00:46:22.540 But your view on it, which you and I ended up discussing and agreeing on, was, like, why would you be an independent media, which is the place where everything is growing, everything is vibrant, it's the future of media, you're your own boss, you can do everything you want, you operate without constraints.

00:46:36.060 Why would you give that up, especially if you have a large audience, you're having a successful independent media outfit, and go and submit to all the suffocating constraints that comes from working within a gigantic media conglomerate, only one unit of which is the media.

00:46:52.440 And you were basically saying that as a friend of Barry's, you don't understand why she's doing it.

00:46:56.440 You personally would never do it.

00:46:57.780 So the fact that I just listened to you three weeks ago in a very passionate way say, you think it's crazy to give up a successful career in independent media where all the impact is, where all the growth is, to go and work for a dying corporate news outlet, to then, you know, open my computer and see Megyn Kelly is doing a screen test at CBS News because she wants to go there.

00:47:19.400 You know, I just instantly knew it was false because you just told me three weeks ago how crazy you thought it was.

00:47:25.280 Why would I say that?

00:47:26.000 Really quickly.

00:47:27.800 Right, right.

00:47:28.580 You said it because I know that's what you think.

00:47:31.120 I know that's what you think because that's how I feel, too.

00:47:33.180 I would, in a zillion years, never return to anything like corporate media, especially given that it's so obviously dying.

00:47:40.620 Yes.

00:47:41.000 But, you know, I just want to quickly say, like, you know, a lot of people distrust the media for good reasons.

00:47:45.880 A lot of people understand that the media often spreads false claims.

00:47:49.680 But I remember, like, the first time I was really at the center of a major international media story was when I did the Snowden reporting.

00:47:55.000 And that's what, you know, it's one thing to, like, read in the newspaper things that you think are false.

00:47:59.920 But so often I would read things in, you know, the most established procedures journals about things I did, things I said, things that happened in the middle that I was involved in.

00:48:08.840 And they were said in the most authoritative tone.

00:48:10.860 And I knew firsthand they were false.

00:48:12.560 And it was, like, constant one after the next.

00:48:14.560 And there's nothing like having the media say false things about you that makes you realize, like, the true depth and pervasiveness of how often they just fabricate and mislead and deceive.

00:48:25.700 Yes, completely.

00:48:27.820 And I think that the reason that they ran with it and it went viral so quickly is because this organization, Mediate and others like it, want it to be true.

00:48:38.860 They want some sort of affirmation from people in our lane that this is the wrong lane, that these other more traditional media entities are the right lane and the better lane.

00:48:51.100 And my, like, returning to broadcast news would be an acknowledgment that this was just, like, the ugly redheaded stepchild over here as opposed to the prom queen, which is allegedly CBS News, when it's exactly the opposite. 0.78

00:49:06.340 Yeah, like, we're all just waiting for the day that we can get back into corporate media and we're all pretending not to like corporate media.

00:49:12.160 But the reality is we're just praying and hoping for the day when, like, we can go work.

00:49:16.220 Like, imagine just going, like, entering the CBS corporate building and knowing that you have all these editorial bosses in comparison to what you're doing now.

00:49:22.900 And it would be one thing if, like, we were reaching small numbers of people, but the way you reach the largest numbers of people now is by doing independent media.

00:49:30.720 It's not like that world.

00:49:32.380 You endure the constraints of it because you get to have this major impact.

00:49:36.420 Again, ask anybody under 50 years old when the last time is that they watched CBS News and they'll barely know what you're talking about.

00:49:42.280 For my kids, TV doesn't even exist.

00:49:44.360 You know, my kids don't even know what TV is.

00:49:46.940 I said this in a quote, the Daily Mail called me, and I was like, who has more influence, Anderson Cooper or Joe Rogan?

00:49:55.340 I mean, like, that's really all you have to ask yourself.

00:49:57.480 And you don't have to go as big as Joe Rogan.

00:49:59.160 He's the biggest of them all.

00:50:00.980 Like, truly, let's keep it apples to apples.

00:50:02.780 Who has more influence and relevance, Aaron Burnett or yours truly? 0.97

00:50:08.620 I mean, it's like, don't be ridiculous. 0.89

00:50:11.620 Right?

00:50:12.120 I'm sorry, with all due respect to her, it's not.

00:50:14.780 And so it's just these sort of dinosaurs who are in that industry and cover that industry who still think that, you know, it's the sun and we all revolve around it and think that we're in just this lane that's just sort of odd or fringy.

00:50:26.920 And that's great because those people are still going to be left behind while we're, you know, far ahead, actually making news and changing lives, like changing the whole presidential cycle.

00:50:36.280 In any event, it's very fun to think about.

00:50:38.560 And I'm here to tell you, there is zero chance I'm going to CBS News.

00:50:42.860 And even Abby was like, did you go to a building near CBS?

00:50:46.040 Why are they writing that?

00:50:46.840 I'm like, I literally just went to Sirius XM.

00:50:49.080 That's totally understandable.

00:50:50.200 Anybody who saw me going into there would know why I was going in there.

00:50:53.220 But you know how these things are.

00:50:54.480 What is it?

00:50:54.720 The lie makes its way around the world before the truth even gets its pants on?

00:50:58.000 Fact.

00:50:58.780 We'll be right back.

00:50:59.880 Glenn's with us for the whole show.

00:51:01.260 Don't go away.

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00:52:10.360 We absolutely have to keep talking.

00:52:18.360 It's more important now than ever.

00:52:20.340 To cower, to hide, to go silent is not the answer. 0.94

00:52:24.960 And all I can tell you is there is no fucking way I am canceling one stop on this chore. 0.93

00:52:30.440 Not one stop. 0.98

00:52:34.540 I'm going.

00:52:35.440 I'm going to stand on these stages, and I'm going to say all the things that we say all the time on this show.

00:52:41.360 We're going to make it safe for me.

00:52:42.320 We're going to make it safe for my team and my guests and you.

00:52:45.240 We're going coast to coast and do something really important, which is say what's true and what's real to honor him.

00:52:52.960 I really now more than ever would love to see you all face-to-face.

00:52:57.920 God, I would love to see you face-to-face.

00:53:00.980 I need to see you face-to-face.

00:53:03.680 I am doing this tour, and I would love for you to join me.

00:53:07.680 Megankelley.com for the tickets.

00:53:13.240 Welcome back to The Megan Kelly Show.

00:53:14.660 Back with me now, Glenn Greenwald, who will be joining me for our first ever in-person interview.

00:53:20.780 That's so crazy on the Megan Kelly live tour.

00:53:24.680 We're going on tour, and we're going to go meet all of you face-to-face, and I would love to see you.

00:53:30.480 We're going to try to create an opportunity for Q&A where we can interact directly.

00:53:34.340 If you want to buy a behind-the-scenes VIP meet-and-greet with me and Glenn and Emily Jashinsky, who will be there, too.

00:53:41.960 You can do that.

00:53:42.780 Just go to MeganKelley.com.

00:53:44.180 We're all getting together down in San Antonio.

00:53:46.420 Yes, I can't wait to get down to San Antonio, Texas.

00:53:48.420 Again, it's going to be Glenn, EJ, Emily Jashinsky, and yours truly on October 24th.

00:53:54.280 That's just three weeks away.

00:53:55.620 We're kicking things off in Texas.

00:53:57.820 That's our first weekend of the tour.

00:54:00.320 So please, please come out and see us.

00:54:02.800 For so many reasons, I feel like it's kind of important that we all do this.

00:54:06.240 So go to MeganKelley.com to buy your tickets.

00:54:09.080 All 10 of our dates are there.

00:54:11.080 Find out more info.

00:54:12.460 And already some of them are selling out, so don't wait too long.

00:54:15.400 I'd love for the audience of this show to be up front and first on the ticket sales.

00:54:20.540 Find all the info at MeganKelley.com.

00:54:23.540 Okay, Glenn, let's get back to it.

00:54:25.860 So there's a lot still.

00:54:28.020 I guess I'll start with Joy Reid, who's out there saying Joy Reid-type crazy stuff. 0.85

00:54:33.940 But it's becoming like a theme amongst lunatics on the left. 0.83

00:54:39.920 She's saying it. 0.64

00:54:41.500 Don Lemon said something similar the other day.

00:54:45.060 Maybe we'll start with him, and then we'll play what Joy Reid just said.

00:54:49.840 But they need a serious reality check.

00:54:51.940 Here he is.

00:54:52.560 So my question this morning is, white men, are you okay?

00:55:02.160 Are you okay?

00:55:03.140 You're sending troops, National Guard to cities.

00:55:08.920 You keep talking about, oh my gosh, Chicago and black-on-black crime.

00:55:12.380 Because this country keeps waking up to bodies in the pews, blood on the floor, every single time.

00:55:22.760 The face behind the trigger looks nearly the same.

00:55:25.440 These shooters again and again and again and again look just like their base.

00:55:34.700 We hear about anything but the culture of grievance and violence that the right has been feeding for decades.

00:55:45.660 Something is cracked deep inside when so many of you believe the answer to fear, to loss, to change is violence.

00:55:58.780 Are you listening to me?

00:56:01.740 I hope I'm saying it loud enough for the people in the back. 0.98

00:56:04.700 Okay, so it's white men who he says are the problem in America. 0.98

00:56:11.320 That'll be news to his husband, who happens to be a white man. 0.99

00:56:15.480 And Don Lemon thinks that the white community needs to look at itself because we're producing the killers. 0.98

00:56:20.660 We're a violent community.

00:56:23.300 Just FYI, the National Institute of Justice in 2022 did an analysis of the latest 172 mass shootings.

00:56:30.660 Show that they were 52% white, 20.9% black, 8.1% Latino, and 6.4% Asian.

00:56:42.180 Okay, so whites made up the majority, 52%, and blacks had 20% of the mass shootings,

00:56:50.460 even though there are only 6% of the population black men.

00:56:56.480 On top of that, Don Lemon conveniently excludes from his analysis what we're seeing when it comes to gang violence.

00:57:03.000 And by the way, so do all of the stats.

00:57:06.000 No stat that puts together who's committing the violence in America counts gang violence.

00:57:12.420 And I say this almost eerily, Glenn, because it's a point that Charlie Kirk had literally just made before they shot him.

00:57:21.960 That was a point he was raising about who's committing the mass shootings, that we don't have all the accurate data because they exclude gang violence.

00:57:30.640 And moments later, his life was taken.

00:57:32.740 It's not just Don Lemon.

00:57:34.540 Here's Joy Reid on a show called BET Talks.

00:57:39.880 It's 30 minutes long.

00:57:40.880 The entire thing has music under it, which is a very strange thing.

00:57:44.660 Nothing telegraphs this is not a news show, more than putting music under all 30 minutes of your interview.

00:57:50.820 Here's that in SOT 25.

00:57:54.940 Somebody says black on black crime.

00:57:56.520 We need to correct them. 0.52

00:57:57.500 Immediately.

00:57:58.120 Especially if we're in media.

00:57:58.840 Yeah, no, that's just called crime.

00:58:00.160 Yeah.

00:58:00.380 If a person commits a crime, it's just crime. 0.79

00:58:02.280 Because when a white person hurts another white person, well, then that's white on white crime. 0.59

00:58:06.100 And maybe we need to start pointing it out. 0.98

00:58:08.120 There is a pathology that's happening in this country that is not happening among black folks. 1.00

00:58:12.980 This is a crisis in their community. 0.95

00:58:14.480 But you don't see black commentators saying, we need you all to sit down and start to look at your culture.

00:58:19.100 You need to think about what's happening in your culture. 0.70

00:58:21.460 But when you have a crime that a black person commits, we get lectured as to whether we need to look at hip-hop.

00:58:26.980 We need to think about whether our children are being raised poorly by single moms. 1.00

00:58:30.440 We need to ask that same question of them.

00:58:32.640 They're the majority.

00:58:33.700 They commit the majority of crimes. 0.94

00:58:35.380 They commit the majority of mass shootings, rapes, and sexual assaults and assaults against children.

00:58:39.720 Right.

00:58:39.980 We should start asking the same question in reverse.

00:58:42.160 Okay, so none of that was true.

00:58:46.160 Whites do not commit the majority of crime as a population, as a percentage of crime.

00:58:51.720 She's going by sheer numbers because whites are still the majority in America. 1.00

00:58:55.580 But blacks commit over 60% of the violent crime in America, despite the fact that they're only 13% of the population. 0.98

00:59:01.840 And by the way, it's not really black women who are doing it. 0.99

00:59:03.940 It's mostly black men who are caught that in half. 0.99

00:59:06.620 6.5% of the population commit over 60% of the violent crime in America. 0.96

00:59:10.720 That's what's true.

00:59:13.400 There are all sorts of reasons for it that the left won't be honest about.

00:59:17.100 But yeah, fatherless homes is a big piece of it.

00:59:19.660 And gang violence is a big piece of it. 0.84

00:59:22.080 91% of black homicide victims, 91% were killed by other blacks. 0.75

00:59:26.840 That's the truth. 0.99

00:59:28.640 The vast, vast majority of black homicide victims are killed by other black people. 0.98

00:59:33.120 Heather McDonald, who's like an encyclopedia when it comes to stats on this, 0.96

00:59:38.540 points out that black juveniles are now shot at 100 times the rate of white juveniles.

00:59:46.520 Blacks between the ages of 10 and 24 die of gun homicide at nearly 25 times the rate of whites at that age. 0.61

00:59:53.120 Shooters are overwhelmingly not the police and not whites, but other blacks. 1.00

00:59:57.820 In 2021, she goes on, 87% of all nonlethal interracial violent crimes were black on white.

01:00:06.980 87%.

01:00:07.500 480,000 in change incidents with a black offender and a white victim.

01:00:12.000 69,000 in change incidents with a white offender and a black victim.

01:00:15.680 Or seven times as many black on white as white on black. 0.97

01:00:18.560 She says, in other words, whites have more to fear from blacks than blacks do from whites. 0.97

01:00:26.100 A fact contrary to the race hustle narrative. 0.98

01:00:28.920 There is no deep problem within the white community that we need to examine 0.99

01:00:35.300 because of the massive numbers of whites killing other whites. 0.98

01:00:38.840 Just like all of this is a rewriting of facts because they think it's part of like, 0.96

01:00:43.800 I don't know, a DEI initiative to try to change the narrative.

01:00:47.100 If everybody living in America understands that black people are not inherently violent, 0.89

01:00:53.140 that violence in America is not the fault of black people. 0.84

01:00:56.160 But if you're going to make an issue out of race when it comes to crime, 0.94

01:00:59.540 then we are going to have to talk about the stats.

01:01:01.700 And they don't reflect well on, in particular, black men.

01:01:06.980 You know, there's so much going on there, Megan.

01:01:09.320 And just by the way, you know, Joy Reid said,

01:01:11.780 none of us ever try and tell them that they're the ones who have the race problem. 0.79

01:01:17.100 And just like 10 seconds earlier, we listened to Don Lemon saying,

01:01:20.140 hey, white men, you're the ones with the problem of violence. 0.99

01:01:23.340 You're the ones who are going around killing everybody. 0.99

01:01:25.440 And I like I know you kind of briefly mentioned the fact that Don Lemon is married to a white man. 0.86

01:01:32.340 But I just want to focus on that for a second, because like, you know,

01:01:36.840 I was long associated with the left for the first like decade or a little more of my journalism,

01:01:42.280 not entirely, but primarily.

01:01:44.000 And one of the things that began to alienate me most was this constant need to talk about people

01:01:49.940 based on which group they belong to and what that means about in terms of their group membership

01:01:54.940 and what rights and what prerogatives and what things you're allowed to say about some groups

01:01:58.620 and not allowed to say about others.

01:01:59.960 And this constant like divvying of people up and trying to divide them constantly and pit them

01:02:04.180 against one another instead of treating people as individuals.

01:02:06.700 And like part of the reason why it bothered me so much is because I have an interracial family.

01:02:10.360 Like, I don't want to have to think about the world in terms of like, oh,

01:02:13.460 white people over here and black people over here.

01:02:15.420 Like, this is the thing I thought that we were trying to fight against and trying to overcome.

01:02:18.640 And then suddenly like the left starts embracing everything through this identity lens where now

01:02:24.400 everything is a fight between groups.

01:02:26.120 Like, no, you're more violent.

01:02:27.080 You're more violent. 0.98

01:02:27.720 You're more violent.

01:02:28.540 And I have to say, like, I can't help but notice that a lot of times like the people who are

01:02:32.980 the worst race hustlers, like the ones who are constantly trying to be most incendiary with 0.88

01:02:37.420 racial discourse are people like Don Lamont who's married to a white person or people like 0.98

01:02:41.480 Nicole Hannah-Jones or like Wesley Lowry who are, you know, with have a white parent who

01:02:46.280 weren't like who aren't 100 percent black.

01:02:49.100 A lot of it is like an identity crisis.

01:02:51.000 And so they're constantly trying to overcompensate by saying, I'm a black person. 0.92

01:02:55.180 Our problems are white people. 1.00

01:02:56.880 And as you say, like everybody who lives in the American experience understands that, 0.99

01:03:00.580 of course, there are large sectors of the United States that are predominantly black where

01:03:04.340 there is a massive crime problem.

01:03:06.420 And a lot of these white liberals who want to deny that would never go walking in those

01:03:09.720 neighborhoods at night precisely because they understand the truth, even if they want to

01:03:13.120 deny it.

01:03:13.920 Now, what did that mean?

01:03:14.840 Maybe there's a socioeconomic element, which I think is true, that predominates and a lot 0.77

01:03:19.480 of black neighborhoods are economically deprived and therefore more criminal, whatever.

01:03:23.060 I think what's so toxic about left wing discourse, as we've just heard, is that overwhelmingly they're 0.96

01:03:29.380 the ones for whatever reason, like there's different reasons, psychological benefits, political

01:03:33.500 benefits.

01:03:34.140 I think a lot of it is just like anger and rage and resentment who are constantly trying to

01:03:38.860 insist that we shouldn't be judged as individuals, that not only are we understandable and defined

01:03:43.540 by our group membership, but our rights and privileges and obligations are also determined by whatever

01:03:49.500 group we belong to.

01:03:50.560 And it goes across the line until you're finally like dividing everybody along these like micro

01:03:54.980 levels.

01:03:55.400 And nothing is injecting more division in our country than that kind of discourse.

01:03:59.300 It makes me sick.

01:04:00.300 And I think if we look at who does it, it's often very revealing in terms of what their

01:04:04.080 lives are or who they are about why it is that they're doing it.

01:04:07.240 Mm hmm.

01:04:08.880 It's it's really disturbing, too, because if you're going to play that game and you really

01:04:12.800 want to get down to the identities of those who commit these shootings, I'll look forward

01:04:16.180 to his trans analysis.

01:04:17.980 I look forward to him taking a hard look at the number of shootings, mass shootings we've

01:04:22.160 had over the past.

01:04:23.220 Let's just do the last two years who had some sort of trans association.

01:04:27.840 Right.

01:04:28.280 I mean, it's his side, the leftist FBI under Joe Biden, who tried to hide that stuff from

01:04:32.680 us, like what was going on with the shooter in Nashville, Tennessee, at that school.

01:04:38.140 And, you know, he wants to talk about like they look like MAGA.

01:04:41.460 Oh, really?

01:04:41.820 Did the Ascension school shooter look like MAGA?

01:04:45.120 It was a trans person who saw a demon when they looked into the mirror. 1.00

01:04:49.160 That was obviously a deranged lunatic who had fallen, unfortunately, into this bizarre 0.94

01:04:53.980 ideology of the trans community and was actually living to regret it, according to his journals. 0.78

01:04:59.080 But like there's not going to be an honest analysis.

01:05:01.320 This is somebody who's just interested in dividing us by race, as you said.

01:05:05.340 You know, it reminded me, I'm preparing this memo that I'm going to deliver on the air.

01:05:09.400 I'm taking a hard look at the criticisms of Charlie, which I know to be untrue.

01:05:13.560 And I'm basically just finding the evidence for what he was saying.

01:05:15.920 And it's all there.

01:05:17.140 But one of the things that jumped out at me, I love Shelby Steele.

01:05:19.500 He's like a truly brilliant guy who is really honest about how we got here to this identity

01:05:25.120 politics place where some people do what you just said.

01:05:27.360 And he's really honest about the civil rights era and how what his criticism of it is that

01:05:34.700 it elevated blacks based on race.

01:05:37.820 It like singled them out and gave them sort of victimhood status, this sort of recognized

01:05:43.260 victimhood status based on race as opposed to recognizing them based on humanity.

01:05:48.460 That's what he said.

01:05:49.440 And it was the beginning, as he as he sees it, of dividing each other that way by race

01:05:55.280 and so on, and that we've never recovered from it.

01:05:58.000 We leaned into these identity politics and never recovered.

01:06:02.840 Yeah, I mean, look, there's no denying the fact that if you look at history, I mean, of

01:06:06.960 course, there were times when black people were actually oppressed, like that was true 1.00

01:06:10.440 victimhood.

01:06:11.420 I mean, there's no denying that there was no denying the fact that women at one point didn't 1.00

01:06:14.420 have the right to vote, et cetera, et cetera.

01:06:15.700 Within my lifetime, you know, just like as a person who grew up gay, like my life has

01:06:20.520 radically changed from something that like, you know, homosexuality was something that

01:06:24.180 could never be mentioned.

01:06:25.140 It was considered, you know, like such an evil sin that was implanted into the minds of

01:06:29.740 every gay kid in a way that was damaging through the fact that now we have complete and total 1.00

01:06:33.980 equality for for gay people up into and including same sex marriage.

01:06:39.440 And so then the question becomes, like, once you overcome these problems, do you want to

01:06:44.840 stew in them forever?

01:06:46.060 Do you want to insist that the trajectory of your life is one that's shaped and defined

01:06:50.340 by your victimhood?

01:06:51.500 Or do you want to insist that, OK, now that we've made this progress, now I'm emancipated

01:06:56.260 from that.

01:06:56.620 I don't need to think about that any longer.

01:06:58.080 I don't need to focus on that any longer.

01:06:59.800 That's no longer the part of the story of my life.

01:07:02.960 And ultimately, I think so much about who we are as individuals is based upon whether

01:07:08.760 we live in the present and whether we want to be emboldened as opposed to living in the

01:07:14.560 past and whether we want this victimhood label on our forehead forever, mostly to justify

01:07:19.500 our own failures or to justify our our bad behaviors or anger and race and hatred and

01:07:24.940 resentments.

01:07:26.340 And, you know, just the fact that Don Lemon has to talk about the Trump movement as being

01:07:31.100 white men, when there's huge numbers of white men who are like the hardest core, most radical 0.59

01:07:35.520 leftists in Antifa and other places.

01:07:37.520 So obviously there are huge numbers of non-white people who are in the Trump movement, very

01:07:41.600 prominent in the Trump movement, who actually support Trump's deployment of troops into American

01:07:45.660 cities.

01:07:46.260 I'm not one of the people who support that, but there are, you know, to still talk about

01:07:50.500 it that way, it's it's such a it's such a deceitful and distortive lens to pretend that

01:07:57.000 the Trump movement is all white men and all white men are Trump supporters that you just

01:08:00.780 know there's other more nefarious things going on there.

01:08:04.060 Mm hmm.

01:08:04.580 Well, it reminds me of, you know, a young man asked me a question about who commits the

01:08:11.040 vast majority of these mass shootings at the Turning Point event that I did at Virginia

01:08:14.960 Tech last week.

01:08:16.080 And he tried to say that it's I'm trying to remember exactly what he said, but he said

01:08:21.700 basically 70 percent were right wing right wingers.

01:08:25.500 And all the stats have disproven that, you know, I mean, this is left wing propaganda.

01:08:29.700 And there was just a piece out in the Atlantic like that day talking about how recently it's

01:08:35.400 been overwhelmingly left wing violence.

01:08:37.400 And actually, we took a deep dive.

01:08:39.180 There was a study by the Center for Strategic and International Studies, and even they concluded

01:08:43.920 that it's left wing violence.

01:08:45.620 But, you know, getting there, they excluded even even, you know, resulting in that in that

01:08:50.720 conclusion.

01:08:51.060 They excluded the attacks on Tesla, the Josh Shapiro firebombing.

01:08:57.080 People just categorize that as right wing violence because he's a Democrat.

01:09:02.200 But the guy who firebombed his house was not a right winger.

01:09:05.920 He was shouting free Palestine. 0.52

01:09:07.980 That's not really a right wing thing.

01:09:10.600 And the Israel attacks like the the murder of those two young people coming out of the

01:09:14.840 Israeli embassy.

01:09:15.660 That wasn't a right winger.

01:09:17.120 That's once again a free Palestine. 0.80

01:09:18.400 That's that is political violence of a different kind.

01:09:20.900 It's anti-Semitic violence.

01:09:22.320 But I mean, it's it's how is that right wing?

01:09:24.800 So that gets excluded from these stats.

01:09:27.480 And then people walk away, I guess, feeling better about themselves.

01:09:30.240 And the right wing examples in this study includes, for example, Melissa Hortman, the 0.94

01:09:36.060 Speaker of the House in Minnesota, who, again, the shooter there said that he killed her

01:09:41.840 because Tim Walsh told him to. 0.99

01:09:44.580 The guy was obviously a psycho. 0.96

01:09:46.080 And I do think there is a problem in any of these numbers of including the psychos. 0.95

01:09:51.180 You know, I mean, I even if that guy who killed Melissa Hortman had been saying he was told

01:09:56.200 by Donald Trump to kill Melissa Hortman, I don't think we should count him.

01:10:00.640 And I don't think we should count this as left wing violence because he says Tim Waltz 0.99

01:10:04.320 told him to count like that's a crazy lunatic. 0.94

01:10:06.680 That's what we're dealing with there. 0.98

01:10:07.980 That's different from the Charlie Kirk assassination.

01:10:10.500 That is different from the Donald Trump assassination.

01:10:12.460 As far as we know, though, we know precious little about that shooter where it is a purely

01:10:16.140 political assassination.

01:10:17.360 The Luigi Mangione case where he killed Brian Thompson, you know, the head of United Health

01:10:22.480 Care.

01:10:23.000 That's that's a political assassination.

01:10:24.800 That's not lunacy any more than any murder is lunacy.

01:10:27.860 And I do think it's it is important to draw that distinction, to pull out, as I said to

01:10:32.680 that kid that night, the crazies and then get really honest about what's left wing and

01:10:37.340 right wing.

01:10:40.060 Yeah, I mean, I do think that mental illness plays a more significant role than we genuinely

01:10:45.580 attribute to the motives of shooters.

01:10:48.060 There are definitely shooters who are perfectly calculated, who I think will be G. 0.88

01:10:51.540 Mangione is one, whether that he's left wing, you know, in terms of his politic.

01:10:55.360 I think that can be debated.

01:10:56.480 And we have had right wing massacres, you know, like the guy who goes into the supermarket 0.97

01:11:00.820 in Buffalo and guns down black people because he thinks that no non-white citizens are real 0.95

01:11:05.020 citizens and is, you know, against the great replacement theory or Dylan Roof and the guy 0.99

01:11:09.220 who goes to the El Paso Walmart and kills a bunch of Latino people in an anti-immigration

01:11:14.760 under an immigration banner.

01:11:16.760 We've had like people who cite Islamic motives for killing. 0.99

01:11:20.620 A lot of them turn out to be mentally ill. 0.92

01:11:22.180 Well, I do think that political factions in general can often produce violence at various 0.98

01:11:28.680 points in time.

01:11:30.260 Some are more likely to produce violence, probably when they're out of power.

01:11:33.960 I just if I could, though, Megan, I just want to say, like, when I first encountered this

01:11:37.780 whole debate, it was in the 1990s.

01:11:39.540 There was this spate of murders of abortion doctors.

01:11:43.000 And Bill O'Reilly was on the air all the time saying abortion is murder.

01:11:46.660 And some of the abortion doctors that got that got murdered were ones that he had specifically

01:11:52.020 profiled multiple times.

01:11:53.720 And there was this like Tiller to blame Bill O'Reilly.

01:11:56.180 Yeah.

01:11:56.360 And there were a couple others like George Tiller being the primary one.

01:11:58.820 And I was I was like, you can't hold people responsible because somebody goes out and murders

01:12:04.740 in the name of the cause or the belief that person is peacefully espousing.

01:12:09.400 Otherwise, we're all vulnerable to that possibility.

01:12:11.480 I remember they tried to blame the Buffalo massacre on Tucker Carlson, saying Tucker is

01:12:15.840 an advocate of the right replacement theory.

01:12:17.280 That guy, you know, cited the right replacement theory, even though they were completely different

01:12:20.980 theories.

01:12:21.440 The guy never even mentioned Tucker.

01:12:23.000 No one even knew if he knew who Tucker was.

01:12:24.800 But I'm a little bit wary of this attempt to blame people who advocate ideas peacefully,

01:12:31.180 even if they're radical ideas, for the acts of, you know, either psychopaths or crazy

01:12:37.300 people who go out and murder in the name of that cause, because we're all vulnerable

01:12:40.640 to that.

01:12:41.520 On the other hand, I do think certain political factions can start to embrace political violence

01:12:45.980 in a way that is dangerous.

01:12:47.280 And it is important to pay attention to that as well.

01:12:49.680 I just think these conversations are difficult because I think there's mostly an element of 0.66

01:12:55.280 mental illness in somebody who can go in, put a bullet in the neck of a 31 year old man

01:12:59.440 while he's holding a microphone and speaking, even if there's a political motive to it as well. 0.88

01:13:04.920 I think I agree with 90 percent of what you just said.

01:13:07.800 I generally agree with everything you just said, but I think things have changed, Glenn.

01:13:12.860 I just think, you know, there is a growing acceptance among some certain faction of the

01:13:17.560 left wing to political violence.

01:13:19.080 And you see that in the polling.

01:13:20.560 You know, it was 34 percent of of liberals like leftists think that it's OK to use political

01:13:27.900 violence to hurt somebody who you disagree with on college campuses.

01:13:33.260 They did a survey and like the numbers were overwhelming that like the vast majority think

01:13:37.020 it's OK to shout down somebody who has opposing political views on your campus, like so that

01:13:43.100 they cannot be heard to use a megaphone over them so that they can't hurt to actually physically

01:13:47.300 block that person's supporters from showing up on campus and then still a minority.

01:13:51.720 But over one third believe that political violence was acceptable in some circumstances.

01:13:56.060 So it's like I think it's growing, this acceptance and the way that people cheered Luigi and the

01:14:01.080 way that people cheered the Charlie Kirk killer.

01:14:03.720 There's like a growing inhumanity.

01:14:05.740 I don't know what's causing it, to be honest with you.

01:14:07.640 I really don't.

01:14:08.320 But I'm very concerned about it.

01:14:09.640 And so I do think it's no accident that we hear messaging nonstop that ICE is fascist.

01:14:16.860 And then you see that on bullet casings in an ICE shooting, a shooting at ICE officers 0.90

01:14:20.780 and that Charlie was a fascist and that he was anti-trans. 0.90

01:14:24.000 And then you see that on the bullets that were the bullet casings that were used to kill 0.98

01:14:28.400 him and in that murder.

01:14:30.120 Like, I just think it would be dangerous to to disavow that connection.

01:14:34.340 There is a connection between this messaging, which is ubiquitous about certain targets

01:14:40.120 and then those people winding up on the wrong end of a bullet.

01:14:44.980 You're absolutely right that in left wing culture, there emerged more strongly than ever

01:14:49.660 over the last decade, this idea that the solution to people with whom you disagree is to prevent

01:14:55.120 them from being heard one way or the other.

01:14:57.260 Remember, that was when Ben Shapiro would go on campus to Magdalena Polis and those controversies

01:15:00.840 like don't let them speak.

01:15:02.040 That was the instinct.

01:15:02.920 And by the way, I know that you're being targeted a lot with that as well.

01:15:06.180 It's like, hey, if there's people with different views, don't put them on your show.

01:15:09.340 Don't let them speak, even though I realize it's different.

01:15:11.560 Yes.

01:15:11.760 But among the left, there has been this kind of like sense, although I think it's growing

01:15:15.400 on the right, too, that like people who disagree with you aren't just people who disagree

01:15:19.180 with you. 0.85

01:15:19.560 They're bad, evil people with bad, evil ideas. 0.98

01:15:22.420 And whatever you have to do, and increasingly that means violence, to silence them is something 0.93

01:15:26.720 that is justified or even obligatory to do.

01:15:30.260 The only concern I have is that we all use strong political rhetoric.

01:15:36.780 You know, you call somebody a communist.

01:15:38.820 You call somebody a tyrant. 0.97

01:15:40.400 You call somebody deeply corrupt.

01:15:42.420 You're somebody who has been very outspoken about the dangers and threats of, you know,

01:15:46.900 men pretending to be women and the threat they pose to women in various spaces.

01:15:52.020 And so if somebody, you know, a listener of the Megyn Kelly show went out and murdered,

01:15:56.560 you know, a trans person and said, look, I've been listening to Megyn Kelly tell me that

01:15:59.840 these people are dangerous. 1.00

01:16:01.180 So I wanted to stop them by putting a bullet in their head before they could endanger women. 1.00

01:16:04.820 I don't think you should be personally responsible for that. 0.97

01:16:07.500 And that's the only note of caution I'm trying to sound here is that we all use incendiary

01:16:14.020 political rhetoric.

01:16:14.740 Sometimes it's important, but there's a huge gap between that and telling people to go

01:16:20.360 use violence in the name of the rhetoric that we're spouting.

01:16:24.960 Very few people are doing that, telling people to go use violence, right?

01:16:28.720 Like some may bless it, some may think.

01:16:31.000 But I do think like the celebration of it is, in fact, telling somebody to do more of it.

01:16:35.780 Like that is a permission slip because more and more of these people think they're going

01:16:38.880 to be greeted as a hero if they take out this political target.

01:16:41.960 And they're not wrong in some cases, like we did see a fair amount of that after my

01:16:46.200 poor friend Charlie was murdered.

01:16:47.760 I mean, it's just that it was one of the most disturbing pieces of, I can't say it was the

01:16:51.380 most disturbing, but it was definitely right up there.

01:16:54.340 And for me, I just like, I feel like we have to wrestle with the reality of 2025 America,

01:17:00.000 where these messages do seem to be getting in the heads of these killers.

01:17:05.580 And look, while sometimes I have fiery rants on this show about that, this topic or that,

01:17:09.620 I think overall, my rhetoric towards, for example, the trans community is usually careful 1.00

01:17:14.380 about their activists versus them.

01:17:18.380 I've gotten angrier in recent years, though, as they've been so aggressive in invading women's

01:17:23.700 spaces and so threatening to women who stand up to them.

01:17:27.660 I mean, just so threatening.

01:17:29.160 And then more data's come out about how the overwhelming majority within the trans community, 0.95

01:17:34.420 men who claim they're women, are autogynophiles who are actually in the midst of a sexual fetish. 0.94

01:17:39.000 And that's deeply disturbing to me. 0.97

01:17:40.680 I can't participate in that.

01:17:41.980 I don't want my daughter participating in that.

01:17:43.360 All those things need to be outed.

01:17:45.980 But I see, I totally agree with your point.

01:17:48.440 Like, I certainly wouldn't take responsibility for anybody committing an act of violence.

01:17:52.640 And can you really take somebody's random fascist chant and say, that's what caused the murder

01:17:58.680 of Charlie?

01:17:59.500 Or that's what, or ICE is behaving like fascists and say, that's what caused, you know, ICE agents

01:18:04.720 to get shot at.

01:18:05.800 No.

01:18:06.280 But when the message is ubiquitous, the way it has been on the left toward these targets,

01:18:11.280 I think you're a lot closer.

01:18:13.080 And I think there's like a real cause to look at them while Charlie's dead and in the ground

01:18:18.520 instead of home with his children and wife, to look at them to say, tone it down.

01:18:25.780 Stop.

01:18:26.220 Because in his case, too, it was overwhelmingly uniform criticism by an entire group of him

01:18:32.100 over and over and over again.

01:18:33.720 And I know that because I lived it.

01:18:35.440 And then I saw them do it to him posthumously.

01:18:37.720 They're still at it, fighting in an effort to control his legacy.

01:18:43.100 And it's really, really important to leftists like Nicole Hannah-Jones and Ta-Nehisi Coates

01:18:48.080 to make sure we know Charlie was a racist bigot.

01:18:51.040 But yeah, look, I mean, watching how many people celebrated Charlie Kirk's death was

01:18:59.640 horrific on the one hand, but I have to say totally unsurprising to me on the other.

01:19:04.360 I've seen this sentiment growing in so many different ways.

01:19:08.500 And I guess I would agree at the end of the day that it does seem to be more common on the

01:19:14.040 left.

01:19:14.400 I think in part, again, that's because the left feels like they have no power and often people

01:19:18.620 resort to violence when they don't.

01:19:21.660 But I also just want to throw one more thing in here, which I think is important that I

01:19:25.480 do actually think social media has contributed to this a lot.

01:19:28.460 I do too.

01:19:29.280 Because, you know, right now you and I are communicating like human beings, even though

01:19:34.440 we're communicating, you know, through the medium of a screen.

01:19:39.220 But, you know, half of our lives, yours and mine, we're lived without the internet.

01:19:43.340 If you grow up and all you have is the internet and you spend most of your time on the internet

01:19:47.000 and most of your communication, your relationship with other human beings is through the internet,

01:19:51.380 it's so easy to just see them as these like digitalized targets, these digitalized, you

01:19:56.300 know, screenshots.

01:19:57.100 And if you're feeding on this like rhetoric of hatred and demonization all day long, I

01:20:02.660 can easily see how the sanctity of human life starts to become very corroded.

01:20:07.840 And the idea that human life is actually something that deserves to be valorized and protected and

01:20:13.100 preserved can start to become very weakened as well.

01:20:17.240 And I also think that is a part of it.

01:20:19.300 I'm not trying to get away from the more political explanation.

01:20:21.560 I just think that this is one of the multiple ways that we have to grapple with the fact

01:20:25.840 that, you know, each new generation is spending more and more of their time interacting with the world

01:20:30.360 and other human beings through digital experiences rather than the connectivity

01:20:36.280 with human beings that we were built to have over thousands of years.

01:20:40.340 There's like a withdrawal from real life where your world gets smaller and smaller and smaller

01:20:44.660 and then actual humans get dehumanized through the process that you're discussing.

01:20:50.380 And on top of that, I don't know, you know, like Alex Berenson's been raising this.

01:20:55.280 I don't think he's totally wrong.

01:20:56.420 Like pot has played a role in a couple of these latest shootings.

01:21:01.260 You know, the pot today is not your grandfather's pot, your granddaddy or your daddy's pot.

01:21:06.640 Like that, there can be an influence of drugs that can be a little mind melding.

01:21:10.240 The video games are extremely violent, though they don't cause people to kill.

01:21:13.420 There's millions of kids playing video games right now who will never consider violence.

01:21:16.980 But I just think there can be a toxic mix in the case of some individuals who are unsteady to begin with

01:21:22.920 that gets them from law abiding to they're facing the death penalty because they pulled the trigger in a horrific way.

01:21:30.360 And I'm not exactly sure what to do to stop it.

01:21:33.360 We can't get rid of social media.

01:21:34.700 We're not going to get rid of violent video games.

01:21:36.800 We're not going to get rid of pot.

01:21:37.920 You know, this kid maybe came from a loving family, this young man who killed Charlie.

01:21:44.040 I don't know.

01:21:45.040 Social media images can be misleading.

01:21:47.040 People say, oh, no, they seem like loving parents because we see pictures of them camping and the mom has nice posts about her son.

01:21:52.840 We don't know anything.

01:21:53.960 We have no idea.

01:21:56.060 I mean, look at what Gabby Petito's posts about her relationship with Brian Landry.

01:22:00.220 You would have thought that they had, you know, an incredibly beautiful, loving romance.

01:22:04.540 He strangled her to death within weeks of those.

01:22:06.960 So we don't know anything.

01:22:09.580 Yeah.

01:22:10.180 I mean, I do think this is a deeply rooted cultural problem.

01:22:14.580 You know, if you look throughout thousands of years of history, the way we've had like, you know, we're social animals.

01:22:18.920 We need that like physical one on one connection with other human beings.

01:22:23.420 We need to gather in places physically.

01:22:25.260 You know, there used to be churches and union halls and, you know, all sorts of ways, you know, in villages and small communities.

01:22:31.020 We've lost all of that.

01:22:32.220 We're increasingly isolated.

01:22:33.480 COVID made it so much worse.

01:22:34.860 And then you take away like any kind of spirituality to people and put them solely in a material world in like this environment of nihilism where they don't believe in anything.

01:22:44.060 They're not connected to anything.

01:22:45.200 They see no future for themselves.

01:22:47.920 I don't think it's surprising that this is producing mass sickness.

01:22:51.400 And, you know, all the data in Western democracy show depression and anxiety and addiction and suicide and suicidal ideation.

01:23:00.580 Like all these are at very alarming and increasing rates.

01:23:04.220 And I think it comes from this like spiritual malady that precisely because it is so complex, it is very difficult to to figure out how to resolve.

01:23:13.540 But I also think it's important not to bracket that out because I think in a lot of ways it's at the root of so much.

01:23:18.720 And what you're talking about, about like not seeing these people as real and talking about the fact that we mentioned because you and I are going to see each other on the tour for the first time in person, which is crazy that we haven't we haven't done an interview in person.

01:23:31.560 I mean, we've been talking to each other for years.

01:23:33.840 And there was you know how like sometimes just the one comment you see online bothers you and it can be like a total minority comment.

01:23:40.380 But and normally I don't pay any mind to these, but this one did bother me.

01:23:44.260 Somebody was like, how can you say you're a good friend of Charlie's when you also openly admitted when I was on with Tucker the other week that I never had dinner with Charlie like I didn't go out to lunch with Charlie.

01:23:53.960 And I I would love to speak to that like you and I have never seen each other in person.

01:24:00.520 I consider you a dear friend.

01:24:02.240 I have actual friends in my life who I see socially, who I have not explored so many issues with the way you and I talk, whose views on the world and life and love and culture and politics and all of it.

01:24:13.760 I have no idea about in the way I I know yours and like actual friendships can be born in in doing what we are doing right here at like really meaningful relationships.

01:24:25.680 God forbid anything were ever to happen to you. 0.80

01:24:27.320 I'd be totally fucking devastated. 0.97

01:24:29.600 And like I don't understand why people don't get that. 0.97

01:24:32.260 You know, I did see Charlie in person many times and we talked behind the scenes and we did get to know each other very, very well on camera and off.

01:24:38.640 But I never had social time with him in that way, like over a meal.

01:24:41.820 And I think in part because Charlie didn't make any bones about the fact that he kind of had the who whose rule was that it was Mike Pence.

01:24:50.260 The Mike Pence rule of not spending one on one time alone with a woman not named Erica Kirk, which is not a bad policy, by the way.

01:24:56.500 It's not a bad policy.

01:24:57.360 But in any event, I don't know.

01:24:59.080 I've been thinking a lot about it, about the people who come on the show regularly, who I really love, who I am going to see for the first time on this tour.

01:25:04.940 It's meaningful, Glenn, in a way that I can't quite describe, but it is.

01:25:08.220 You know, totally.

01:25:10.380 And like I have to say, Megan, I I couldn't agree with that more.

01:25:13.520 I feel exactly the same way.

01:25:14.580 And I will say, like, like, you know, I know you get criticism for having me on or for having Tucker on or for having whoever on.

01:25:24.000 Obviously, you know, people say to me, like, oh, you claim that you think what's going on in Gaza is genocide.

01:25:28.420 And you're constantly talking to Megan Kelly and complimenting her and she's supportive of Israel, which is ironic that you're getting accused for not when you are actually an Israel supporter.

01:25:37.040 And, you know, what one of the things that I see this in terms of Charlie, too, like I didn't know Charlie well.

01:25:42.180 But like he was always extremely generous with me, like very complimentary, just like very friendly, even though we were worlds apart in so many obvious ways.

01:25:50.060 And one of the things I think can happen, too, like in terms of online presentation is that you can do so easy to pick the worst of people or the parts that make them seem the worst and put it together and make it seem like these are horrible people.

01:26:06.100 Like if you're in public life enough, anyone can make you look like a horrible person based on things you've said that are real, that you regret making things that you said totally out of context.

01:26:14.260 And so when people say to me, like, how can you talk to Megan Kelly? She supports these things you think are horrible.

01:26:18.800 Like my my answer is, is because I know Megan Kelly, like I think she's a very good person, even though we have very strong disagreements that, you know, that we're able to go on and and debate often vehemently.

01:26:30.720 And it doesn't affect our relationship with with one another. And I think that is what so much of what we're missing, that that's so much of what we're missing is the idea of humanity.

01:26:40.720 You know, like just the fact that other than like psychopaths and sociopaths and people who are totally like ill and alienated, most of us have a common humanity that we want the same things.

01:26:52.140 We have the same values. We crave the same things. And if you focus on that common humanity, as opposed to the minute somebody has a difference of opinion than I do on an important political issue, I consider them my enemy.

01:27:03.640 I just think that makes the world like a much better place, not only like socially, but for each individual as well.

01:27:11.040 And yeah, I do think it comes from exploring values, you know, like you get to know somebody from having these conversations long enough.

01:27:17.200 And those are really important ways that that you can bridge the gap between why somebody thinks this and why you think that.

01:27:25.240 And, you know, that's part of what I saw in Charlie, too.

01:27:27.300 Like the Charlie that I knew personally was so gravely different than the Charlie that they're attempting to depict, that it really makes you understand how easy it is to lose sight of people's core humanity.

01:27:39.420 And it's often done on purpose as well.

01:27:41.240 So, yeah, this is why I'm putting together this this little rebuttal of what's being done to him, because I did know him.

01:27:47.720 We talked about a lot of the controversies that would be around him many times on this show.

01:27:52.640 I knew who he was and I refused to let his legacy be totally bastardized the way it's starting to be on the left as they're starting to push back against turning points.

01:28:02.740 That's ongoing strength has, you know, more and more student groups sign up to join it.

01:28:07.420 Last check was over one hundred and twenty two thousand, which is incredible because they only had two thousand on the day Charlie was killed.

01:28:13.220 Two thousand between high school and college now over one hundred and twenty two thousand have applied.

01:28:17.720 And I think they're feeling the threat of his growing legacy and they don't like it.

01:28:22.380 And I don't know that not not staying on the left right front, but staying on like the assassin versus normal human front.

01:28:33.760 It's no accident to me that the most recent acts of violence have have included two attacks on churches.

01:28:40.260 The one in which the guy actually saw himself as a demon in the mirror target practice against the face of Jesus.

01:28:46.140 I do. I just feel like there's something spiritual underfoot right now, something spiritually wrong.

01:28:52.260 And that's something else that Charlie gave to us in his passing, which is like a renewed commitment to faith, a reminder that its absence entirely almost from the public square is not a good thing.

01:29:01.940 It doesn't lead the society any place good.

01:29:04.860 And that's also being fought by some sort of a force.

01:29:08.640 You know, you can call it left or right.

01:29:09.880 I think it's more good and evil.

01:29:11.720 You know, it's more God versus devil and like it's an existential battle that we actually have to pay attention to.

01:29:18.060 I do think that there are evil forces out there.

01:29:19.900 We have to recognize them when they stand up and shoot children in a church while describing themselves as the devil.

01:29:26.300 Why? Who are we to say it's not true?

01:29:28.260 Who are we to say there's no evil force among us that's driving these people to do these acts?

01:29:33.240 And that's to me is another reason why it's a great time to get renewed with your faith, to get back in touch with whatever it is.

01:29:39.500 It could be Judaism, could be Christianity, could be whatever.

01:29:43.140 Anyway, we don't have it solved.

01:29:44.500 Just something beyond yourself, like something beyond yourself, something beyond the material world and beyond yourself.

01:29:50.040 I think ultimately that's the key, like connecting to something greater.

01:29:53.660 It could be hiking a mountain, you know?

01:29:57.600 Yeah, nature.

01:29:58.160 Nature is, yeah, exactly.

01:29:59.500 Yeah, you take some time at the top of that and you think about this world and how it exists other than in your, you know, immediate radius or do a cold plunge in a lake.

01:30:11.200 You know, do something.

01:30:12.180 Watch a sunset.

01:30:13.260 Get up early and watch a sunrise.

01:30:14.920 Any of this stuff, it dwarfs you and your own individual humanity, which is a good thing.

01:30:22.380 It reminds you how small you are in this world.

01:30:24.280 You don't always need to be reminded of how big you are.

01:30:26.160 Or you're small, you are but a cog in the wheel, and this thing is going to go on long after you.

01:30:31.520 Maybe spend some time thinking about that, about like who else out there might be suffering, how you can help them.

01:30:37.020 They always say like charitable works, doing something for others, no matter how much you have or don't have, is actually a direct route to happiness.

01:30:44.760 Like just a bit here and there.

01:30:47.060 Exercise is another way where you can improve the amount of serotonin in your brain and your feelings day to day that make you feel just a little bit more generous towards your fellow man.

01:30:57.060 They look like small things, but they're not.

01:30:59.860 All right, I've got to take a break.

01:31:00.920 We're going to come back and we'll finish on a very fun note as we talk about Jimmy Kimmel and Stephen Colbert together last night.

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01:33:40.300 We absolutely have to keep talking.

01:33:42.960 It's more important now than ever.

01:33:44.920 This fall, Megyn Kelly is taking her show live to cities nationwide.

01:33:49.720 To go silent is not the answer.

01:33:52.080 I'm going.

01:33:52.800 I'm going to stand on these stages, and I'm going to say all the things that we say all the time on this show.

01:33:58.540 We're going to make it safe for me.

01:33:59.480 We're going to make it safe for my team and my guests and you.

01:34:02.540 And do something really important, which is say what's true and what's real.

01:34:06.640 And I would love for you to join me.

01:34:08.600 MegynKelley.com for the tickets.

01:34:09.920 You can stream The Megyn Kelly Show on SiriusXM at home or anywhere you are.

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01:34:26.900 Go to SiriusXM.com slash MKShow to subscribe and get three months free.

01:34:33.080 That's SiriusXM.com slash MKShow and get three months free.

01:34:38.600 Offer details apply.

01:34:43.720 You started as a radio, you know, disc jockey.

01:34:46.560 As you said, when you were, you know, spinning platters and making with a banter.

01:34:51.160 Yeah.

01:34:51.480 Did you ever think the president of the United States would be celebrating your unemployment? 1.00

01:34:56.900 I mean, that son of a bitch, you know, is really unbelievable. 1.00

01:35:03.740 Mr. Son of a bitch. 1.00

01:35:04.520 I mean, Mr. Son of a bitch. 1.00

01:35:06.780 His royal, yes. 1.00

01:35:08.700 No, I never imagined that we'd ever have a president like this.

01:35:12.680 And I hope we don't ever have another president like this again.

01:35:17.260 I mean, I never imagined, I never even imagined there would ever be a situation in which the

01:35:23.420 president of our country was celebrating hundreds of Americans losing their jobs.

01:35:28.380 But somebody who took pleasure in that, that to me is the absolute opposite of what a leader

01:35:34.720 of this country is supposed to be.

01:35:37.960 Hear, hear.

01:35:39.680 You literally argued that people who didn't get vaccinated shouldn't be treated in hospital

01:35:43.940 beds and should be left to die if they have a heart attack. 0.98

01:35:46.340 So F off. 1.00

01:35:47.960 Good gracious.

01:35:49.500 I never imagined we have a leader who would celebrate someone losing his job.

01:35:52.560 Oh, the horrible sin.

01:35:53.860 That, of course, is because you tried to blame Charlie Kirk's assassination on MAGA, which was

01:36:00.140 a lie for which you've never apologized and which you've never acknowledged, including last

01:36:05.420 night, Glenn.

01:36:06.120 They did not talk about Jimmy Kimmel's original sin that led to his five day suspension and to

01:36:13.300 the president expressing some mild joy at it.

01:36:17.920 You know, I think it's sometimes it's hard to express how insulated these people are.

01:36:24.460 I mean, I think they think that they are like political geniuses.

01:36:29.820 You know, the commentary they're offering is really scathing and cutting when in reality,

01:36:33.380 it's just the most banal and vapid anti-Trump MSNBC hysteria.

01:36:39.300 There's nothing interesting about it.

01:36:40.840 There's nothing radical about it.

01:36:42.680 There's nothing substantive to it.

01:36:44.340 And I think that they think that because they live in this culture in Hollywood where

01:36:49.720 everybody constantly affirms the same view, there's almost nobody who deviates from it

01:36:54.340 or questions it, that they're speaking this kind of ultimate truth.

01:36:59.420 And they think their success, relatively speaking, in like network late night TV and the amount

01:37:05.460 of money that they make and the notoriety they've gained means that they must have something

01:37:09.980 really unique to say and insightful to say.

01:37:13.020 And they're constantly reinforcing that amongst each other, like speaking as though they're

01:37:17.920 not just martyrs, but political revolutionaries. 0.98

01:37:21.300 And it's really pathetic to watch. 0.94

01:37:23.500 He actually wants us to feel sorry for him, like this multimillionaire with this megaphone 0.97

01:37:30.460 on broadcast television, despite his terrible ratings.

01:37:33.480 By the way, I speak of both of them in that commentary out there like we're the real victims. 0.98

01:37:40.040 Meanwhile, he's a bully.

01:37:41.080 He uses that platform to demonize a group of people, just MAGA, right, which includes tons,

01:37:48.680 millions of working class Americans just going about their day trying to make the bills, you 0.96

01:37:53.860 know, and not have to worry about them from paycheck to paycheck, which is what they do

01:37:56.960 without ever getting a vacation.

01:37:58.760 But he uses his platform to smear them as creating the Charlie Kirk assassin. 0.97

01:38:03.440 Doesn't even have the balls to come out there and say, I was wrong to do that. 0.95

01:38:06.780 I was factually wrong and morally wrong and to apologize and now turns around with the 0.99

01:38:11.240 help of his fellow multimillionaire, just Trump-hating, MAGA-hating guy and plays the

01:38:18.320 victim.

01:38:19.280 It's absurd.

01:38:20.380 It's really a twisted display.

01:38:23.480 It make it really, you know, it really makes me sick.

01:38:26.580 And, you know, I'll tell you what's worse about it is they have this certain set of beliefs,

01:38:32.180 like let's take immigration.

01:38:33.260 So if you have untrammeled immigration into the United States, there are a lot of people 1.00

01:38:38.160 who are affected by it, the people who have to live among unassimilated immigrants, people 1.00

01:38:43.340 who might have increased crime, who have competition for jobs because they're willing to work for

01:38:48.200 lower wages.

01:38:49.220 And these are mostly like working class and poor people who have the obligation to endure 1.00

01:38:55.120 and deal with and confront the effects on their lives and on their neighborhoods.

01:38:58.920 Jimmy Kimmel and Stephen Colbert, they're insulated from every single consequence of the policies

01:39:05.060 they so self-righteously insist everybody else embrace.

01:39:08.740 And there's no awareness of that.

01:39:10.680 That's the thing that makes me the angriest.

01:39:12.960 Like they really think that there are these bastions of political wisdom and even like moral

01:39:19.080 turpitude when their lives are completely twisted and distorted.

01:39:23.500 And also, like, as you say, it would be one thing if they were making all this money because

01:39:28.080 everybody wanted to watch them.

01:39:29.480 Like Johnny Carson, you know, everybody in the United States watched Johnny Carson, like

01:39:32.880 wanted to watch Johnny Carson.

01:39:34.160 I remember that.

01:39:34.880 That's capitalism.

01:39:36.380 Yeah.

01:39:36.840 And it's like, OK, he earned it.

01:39:38.660 These people are like they won some kind of twisted, weird lottery where nobody watches

01:39:43.640 them.

01:39:44.100 And yet at the same time, they make 15 and 20 million dollars a year and enjoy all the fruits

01:39:48.880 of that, that they completely unearned.

01:39:51.260 These are the least self-aware people that exist on the planet.

01:39:56.660 After Meghan Markle.

01:39:59.040 Well, she's like part of this.

01:40:00.460 I mean, she's part.

01:40:01.360 I mean, she came from Hollywood. 1.00

01:40:02.380 Right.

01:40:02.640 And like to her, the whole royal family thing was was part of Hollywood.

01:40:06.900 I'm going to pitch here Maureen Callahan, who I know we is a lot that we share, because 0.90

01:40:12.020 this is what is so great about her commentary, like a very cultural commentary.

01:40:15.500 She like pierces the the the bubble in which these people who are really sick in which 0.54

01:40:20.800 they live.

01:40:21.800 And I somebody who comes by liberalism or like leftism, honestly, I'll engage them.

01:40:27.940 There's parts I agree with them.

01:40:28.980 I understand the human impulse.

01:40:30.440 These people are just empty vassals. 0.70

01:40:32.860 These are the worst people there are.

01:40:34.400 And speaking of all that, let me give you the latest soundbite from Barack Obama about his

01:40:41.120 marriage to Michelle.

01:40:43.780 Oh, sorry.

01:40:44.280 Reversing that.

01:40:44.960 Michelle Obama about her marriage to him.

01:40:46.500 We always have the kids to talk about, right?

01:40:48.340 Right.

01:40:49.100 But not on a day to day basis.

01:40:51.140 So now that we're empty nesters, it's like, well, what are we going to talk about?

01:40:54.860 So we're together all day and we do this thing where it's like, I'll see him and it's like,

01:41:00.860 what you've been doing?

01:41:01.460 It's like, oh, don't tell me until dinner, because we're we got to have something to talk

01:41:06.820 about at dinner.

01:41:07.680 Are you sitting there from in a place that you know what matters to you in that moment?

01:41:13.320 And are you curious about your partner's edge or where they're at?

01:41:18.500 Like, what are you thinking about?

01:41:21.920 Do you really go there?

01:41:23.380 And then do you really say, because how many times do you, somebody asks, what are you

01:41:28.860 thinking about?

01:41:29.500 And you're like, well, let me make up a thing because I don't want to actually tell you what

01:41:33.480 I was thinking about right now, which was like, the way you're chewing makes me want 0.98

01:41:37.980 to smack you upside the head. 0.86

01:41:40.020 That's why guys don't want to have it.

01:41:41.100 Would that be an edge?

01:41:42.320 That would be an edge.

01:41:43.720 And that would be really interesting.

01:41:45.140 You could like open something up there in a big way.

01:41:47.540 Why does your chewing annoy me so much?

01:41:50.440 She cannot stand him, Glenn.

01:41:53.380 I mean, you know, the only time I ever see clips of Michelle Obama is when you force

01:41:58.240 me to see them.

01:41:59.360 And I'm so happy because it is, I like watch that with my mouth agape.

01:42:03.020 Like everything else we've discussed makes sense to me.

01:42:05.240 The level of contempt and hatred that she harbors for him.

01:42:08.540 And not only does she harbors for him, but apparently feels like a strong need to let

01:42:11.680 everybody know she has.

01:42:13.040 Like it's not enough for her to just silently hate him.

01:42:16.000 She wants to like publicly talk.

01:42:18.580 I mean, I think we discussed the last time I was here that MSNBC article about that woman 1.00

01:42:23.480 saying how terrible marriage was because like these terrible smells and eventually you come

01:42:28.940 to hate the person.

01:42:29.800 And we were like, that's not the marriage that I am familiar with.

01:42:33.480 That sounds like hell.

01:42:34.700 And that's what Michelle Obama is describing Barack Obama as being.

01:42:38.420 They have nothing to talk about unless they save it until dinner.

01:42:41.260 He smacks his gum and she's like stewing all day like this. 0.93

01:42:44.200 I mean, this is a, this is real contempt and hatred in a marriage.

01:42:48.400 Like, yes, she's, it was a couple's therapist.

01:42:51.840 First of all, she had on a couple's therapist, which is very interesting.

01:42:54.160 Her selection of guests and Barack wasn't there.

01:42:56.760 And she talks about him as though she says it like, we're all going to relate to like

01:43:00.520 sitting there at the dinner table with daggers in your eyes towards your husband or your mate. 0.98

01:43:05.640 Like he's disgusting. 0.99

01:43:07.420 I have only to hold myself together. 0.97

01:43:09.800 So I don't say it out loud.

01:43:11.740 Meanwhile, he's probably sitting across from her thinking I had no idea.

01:43:14.920 She was totally bald on the left side of her head. 0.54

01:43:16.700 What happened to the hair in that, in that lightning bolt that's missing?

01:43:20.480 I'm sorry, but if you have that issue with a lot of women do, 1.00

01:43:24.160 then you should cover it up.

01:43:25.520 You should not, you should not be shot from the left.

01:43:27.660 You should maybe hide it with it.

01:43:29.180 Okay, sorry.

01:43:30.000 I just took a little like jaunt off to the side, but these two can't stand each other.

01:43:35.120 That's the bottom line.

01:43:36.660 We diagnosed it early.

01:43:38.100 And once again, Glenn, you, Maureen and I were right.

01:43:42.640 Yeah.

01:43:43.040 I mean, I like the Meghan Markle show.

01:43:45.760 I become an addict of, and I blame you and Maureen Callahan completely.

01:43:49.400 I've been avoiding the Michelle Obama thing just because it's like, it's just watching 0.97

01:43:54.960 somebody so full of, you would think she was like the most marginalized, like screwed, 0.99

01:44:01.080 discriminated against, like impoverished, abused person on the planet. 0.88

01:44:05.940 I don't know how somebody like that not only gets so full of hatred, but hatred toward the

01:44:10.980 person that you chose to marry and who is responsible for all the blessings you have

01:44:14.720 in the world.

01:44:15.100 Well, it's, I've never seen that before.

01:44:17.220 I don't know, but I feel like someone needs to perform a rescue of Barack Obama.

01:44:21.540 Like the next time he gets on camera, I'm telling you right now, Barack, blink twice

01:44:25.840 like that.

01:44:26.280 If you're okay, just twice like that, squeeze your eyes together and then we'll know not

01:44:29.400 to rescue you.

01:44:30.240 If you don't do that, someone's coming in with the flowered van to grab you because this

01:44:34.140 man needs some sort of an intervention.

01:44:36.440 Glenn, thank you.

01:44:37.740 Great, great conversation as always.

01:44:39.260 Always great to see you, Megan.

01:44:40.820 All right.

01:44:41.420 And don't forget, everybody go to megankelly.com to get tickets for our tour.

01:44:44.700 You can meet me and Glenn in person.

01:44:46.920 We'll see you tomorrow.

01:44:49.480 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show.

01:44:51.580 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - October 01, 2025

Dems Mad at Memes, Lemon and Reid's Racialized Crime Comments, and Michelle Can't Stand Barack, with Glenn Greenwald ｜ Ep. 1161

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