The Megyn Kelly Show - DeSantis vs. Trump Fight Heats Up, and the Demise of Black Lives Matter, with Dave Rubin and Hotep Jesus ｜ Ep. 559

00:00:00.440 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:00:11.640 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Friday. We made it.

00:00:17.260 Yippee! 1.00

00:00:18.380 The left is now using boycott calls against corporations like Target to say conservatives

00:00:24.880 are calling for violence. What? What?

00:00:27.500 So, you know, the pushback against Target for holding the, you know, bathing suits out is

00:00:32.540 talkable spaces. They're getting all sorts of crap and we'll get into the financial penalties 0.81

00:00:38.580 that they appear to be suffering. And now the left is saying this is conservatives calling 0.98

00:00:43.520 for violence. This is straight out of their playbook. This is what they do. They punish

00:00:48.160 any corporation that doesn't toe the line on their far left agenda. Finally, conservatives have

00:00:52.600 figured out how to fight back and it's violent. It's a it's a call for violence.

00:00:57.500 This is Florida Governor Ron DeSantis begins his campaign in earnest and is directly attacking

00:01:04.500 former President Donald Trump. Now accusing Trump of, quote, running to the left and not

00:01:09.960 being, quote, moored to conservative principles. Oh, it's getting interesting. Joining me now

00:01:14.940 to discuss it all. Dave Rubin, host of The Rubin Report and author of the book Don't Burn

00:01:20.380 This Country, Surviving and Thriving in Our Woke Dystopia. Dave, my friend, good to see you.

00:01:26.420 How are you, Megan? It's good to see you as always. Can I say before we begin that you are

00:01:31.500 looking vivacious? I was looking for the the right adjective. Something's going on with the hair

00:01:37.640 today. I'm looking at you like, yeah, this chick's got it. That's courtesy of Sarah. She comes and does

00:01:43.620 it on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays. That's when I look the best. Can we send Sarah down to Miami?

00:01:48.260 I don't I don't have as much to work with, but maybe she could help me out.

00:01:51.740 There's not a person she cannot help. She's a master master. OK. And by the way, when you're

00:01:56.860 something funny, we were just talking about she actually trolls the comments on YouTube looking

00:02:00.400 for comments about my hair. So don't say anything nasty about my hair. I'm a YouTuber. She starts

00:02:05.420 spiraling. She goes, I spiraled.

00:02:07.340 Isn't it funny? You could do politics all day long and like people can say all the mean things

00:02:11.800 that they want about you. And oh, she's a sellout and she doesn't know what she's talking about and 1.00

00:02:15.840 blah, blah, blah. But it's like if they say something about your hair, it's like a whole

00:02:19.160 different situation. You know, it's OK with me. But but Sarah, she doesn't deserve her. I have

00:02:23.140 her feelings for it like that. So, yeah, be nice to Sarah in the comments. She's got talent because 1.00

00:02:27.420 my hair does not look like this normally. OK, I think this is fascinating. It had to happen.

00:02:32.640 It has to happen. There has to be daylight between the two men. Otherwise, there's no

00:02:35.640 reason, you know, to to vote for DeSantis over Trump, given Trump's poll numbers and the

00:02:40.000 fact that he was former president. You got to create some sort of a policy difference

00:02:44.060 other than I don't tweet the way he does. Right. And he's starting to do it. So now and

00:02:49.440 this is an interesting way in. So he DeSantis, that is, goes on. He's doing sort of like a he's

00:02:54.640 doing an interesting media tour and it is including some local radio hosts and so on in some

00:03:01.020 key locations, including in Tennessee, a conservative radio host, Matt Murphy. He said it, I think

00:03:06.280 just this morning. Here is the latest messaging. It seems like he's running to the left. And

00:03:12.900 I have always been somebody that's just been more than conservative principles. And these

00:03:16.900 will be interesting debates to have. But I can tell you, you don't win nationally by moving

00:03:22.240 to the left. You win nationally by standing for bold policies. We showed that in Florida.

00:03:28.240 I never watered down anything I did. I don't know what happened to Donald Trump. This is

00:03:32.820 a different guy today than when he was running in 2015 and 2016. And I think I think the direction

00:03:39.620 that he's going with his campaign is the wrong direction.

00:03:44.120 So, you know, he's not wrong that thus far DeSantis is kind of positioning himself to the

00:03:50.160 right of Trump. And Trump isn't totally disputing that in some areas. What do you make of it?

00:03:59.240 Yeah, it's kind of interesting. I mean, what DeSantis said there is true. Whether it works

00:04:03.080 in an election is a different thing. I mean, look, first, let's do the abortion one because 1.00

00:04:07.240 you know how happy I am here in Florida. And it was in large part moving here was in large

00:04:12.080 part because of DeSantis and his policies. And I not only moved my family, but two companies

00:04:17.140 and other family members and a whole bunch more. On the abortion one specifically, you know,

00:04:22.700 Florida had 15 week abortion ban. Now we're a very red state, obviously. 15 weeks, it's basically

00:04:27.740 three and a half months, which is far longer than most pro-life or conservative people

00:04:32.720 want. Generally, they don't want any abortion. But I can tell you in a year and a half in

00:04:37.180 Florida, I've been to plenty of Republican events and conservative events and events with

00:04:41.340 DeSantis. I never heard anyone talking about abortion because everyone sort of felt, you

00:04:45.800 know what? We don't love 15 weeks, but let's just kind of let it be. It's not what we love.

00:04:50.200 But it's really what most Democrats would have said was fair, say, 20 years ago. Joe Biden

00:04:54.980 would have said, you know, safe and rare 15 weeks, 20 years ago. Now, now the Democrats,

00:04:59.300 you know, want eight month abortions, which most of us can agree is completely insane.

00:05:02.960 So on a personal note, I actually disagree with what DeSantis did. I happen to be more

00:05:08.880 pro-choice myself. I think 15 weeks was just fine. I think it probably does help him in the primaries

00:05:15.360 because yeah, now he can run more to the right of Trump in the primaries. But I do think in the

00:05:20.640 general, it's going to become a problem because we know that the Republicans did not get that red

00:05:25.560 wave in large part because of the Roe v. Wade situation. Now, the part that's like, just like

00:05:30.600 you have to be politically nuanced about it is that it's not like the president sets the agenda on

00:05:36.340 abortion. The whole point of the reversal of Roe v. Wade is that it is now left up to the states.

00:05:41.520 So it is irrelevant to someone living in California, what Florida does on abortion.

00:05:46.280 But at an optics level, if if the average woman out there who tends to be more pro-choice, 1.00

00:05:53.460 if she sees that and as an attack on her, that could create a problem for him. So I can give

00:05:59.520 you some on the border and some of the other stuff. But but I'd love to hear your thoughts on that.

00:06:02.740 Well, he's got to get past Trump. He can deal with the general election later,

00:06:05.480 I think, is the thinking. And I know this is a longstanding debate of like, do you go so far

00:06:10.000 right in the primary to make yourself unelectable in the general? You have to be careful of that

00:06:14.660 on both sides. You have to worry about going too far to the extremes. But I mean, I do see a viable

00:06:20.360 way for DeSantis to get to the right of Trump on abortion. And then if he manages to get the 0.95

00:06:26.220 nomination to then say to the general electorate, I'm out. These are my personal views. These are

00:06:31.060 the views of Floridians. I'm not going to do a federal abortion law and I'm not going to interfere

00:06:35.220 in the states that are passing state by state legislation. So don't worry about me. That is plausible.

00:06:40.220 Yeah, I think that's legit. And that actually is the truth. Right. And by the way, you know,

00:06:45.820 I was at an event with him about three months ago, I think when or maybe it was even a little bit more

00:06:49.740 when the Roe v. Wade thing was really hot and people kept asking him about his feelings on it.

00:06:54.220 And he was very honest. He said, you know, I through my faith, I'm a Catholic. I am pro-life.

00:07:00.500 He said, sorry, Florida has the 15 week abortion ban. We'll see about that as we get through

00:07:06.200 the legislative session. But he was making it clear that he has his own pro-life feelings about

00:07:13.220 this. And he was elected governor of Florida. So he is allowed to do what he wants. And if the

00:07:18.260 people are not happy with it, well, he's a two-term governor now. So this would be his last time

00:07:22.640 anyway. But the point is you do what you think is right. Hopefully as a politician, that's what

00:07:27.720 we want out of politicians. Now you may not agree with it, but I do believe it's an honest

00:07:32.340 assessment by him. I don't think it was purely political, but you know, I'm not, I'm not inside

00:07:36.720 his brain, obviously. Let's talk immigration because of course, Trump, I mean, one of the

00:07:40.220 main reasons he was elected was build the wall. That was the biggest applause line forever at all

00:07:46.000 of his rallies. In the end, just ask Ann Coulter, the wall was not built. And though the immigration

00:07:52.840 policies certainly got a lot tougher under Trump, just ask Stephen Miller, who we've had on the show

00:07:58.240 many times. So there's no question that Trump cracked down on the border, but didn't fulfill

00:08:02.300 all the promises he made about it. And now DeSantis is using the W word, um, as well,

00:08:08.000 building the wall and cracking down on the Southern border and sort of making the point

00:08:11.780 that whatever Trump did or didn't do, it didn't work because look where we are now. Now, of course,

00:08:16.540 that kind of sort of discounts what happened after Trump, which was Biden. All right. You opened the

00:08:23.080 door and said, come on in. So how do you see the distinction there of him getting to the right on

00:08:28.600 Trump? Yeah. Well, let's first just drive home your, your latter point there, which is that you

00:08:33.420 have to just go on the knowledge that Biden has completely wrecked this thing. Mayorkas is

00:08:38.920 completely in negligence of his job as a Homeland security and, and the Democrats have completely

00:08:45.000 wrecked it. That's regardless of whether Trump or DeSantis is right on this on the, on the actual

00:08:49.680 facts of this whole thing. You know, Trump was going after DeSantis for not voting for the wall a couple

00:08:55.100 of years ago. Uh, DeSantis actually is making a good case on this. What, what was happening was

00:09:00.780 the bill that was put up was that you were going to get a wall, but it was also going to give 2

00:09:04.980 million illegals amnesty. DeSantis made it clear. I am not just going to sign something that's going

00:09:09.900 to allow 2 million illegals just to be here. Now, again, anyone watching this can have their own

00:09:15.220 feelings on whether we should have amnesty, whether a wall is effective or anything else. But DeSantis is

00:09:21.040 being very clear in why he did not vote for that funding of the wall. It wasn't that he was against

00:09:26.360 the wall. It was that if he voted for the bill, then 2 million people were immediately going to

00:09:31.860 get citizenship. So we can have a debate about that, but that's really what's going on here.

00:09:36.620 It was 25 billion to build the wall. So, I mean, I think DeSantis referred to this as like a pittance or

00:09:43.240 something like that, but it's not a pittance. 25 billion is a good amount of dough. But his point is it,

00:09:48.180 it didn't, it wasn't going to actually get the job done and we were going to have to grant amnesty to

00:09:53.060 a whole bunch of people we don't want to do. So yeah, I see that. I see that how that's going

00:09:57.120 to play out in a debate stage. It's sort of neutral. Um, what else? Because to me, as somebody

00:10:02.980 who's very fired up about the gender ideology, it seems to me like DeSantis is to the right on Trump

00:10:08.200 on this, though I've been pointing out too, we haven't heard from Trump on this issue in a while.

00:10:12.020 We kind of heard maybe a little bit more from Don Jr. Um, not sure if we can say he speaks for

00:10:18.680 Trump, uh, especially on this issue who doesn't want, I think the Republican party going too far

00:10:23.180 to the right on it. And DeSantis is firmly where I am, which is a man can't become a woman. A woman

00:10:28.580 can't become a man and pretending otherwise is silly and certainly isn't for boys and girl sports 0.92

00:10:33.620 or any of the other nonsense we've been seeing. Yeah. I mean, I'm with you, Megan DeSantis has done 0.56

00:10:38.960 this thing right there. There are things that should not be debated anymore. Uh, you know,

00:10:43.500 my feelings on what an adult is allowed to do with their life. You want to dress up however you want

00:10:47.680 to dress up. You want to marry whoever you want to marry all of those things. I'm completely fine

00:10:52.360 with what DeSantis has done is get this woke nonsense out of our schools. Uh, you know, for you,

00:10:57.740 Megan living in New York, I mean, it's literally why you moved because of the gender stuff that was 1.00

00:11:01.720 going on with your own kids. Nobody there's just, it's just the simple truth. Nobody has more

00:11:06.700 effectively taken wokeness when it comes to gender ideology and this crazy neo-racism.

00:11:12.280 No one has more effectively taken it out of schools and institutions than Ron DeSantis, period,

00:11:18.520 like full stop, period. Now I agree that junior, I don't think he can fully speak for his dad. I'm

00:11:24.080 friends with junior. I liked him a lot. He's a good dude. He really is. Uh, you know, he was sort of

00:11:28.880 pushing that Republicans shouldn't boycott Anheuser-Busch as much because they've given some money to

00:11:34.780 Republicans. Uh, I think that this boycott against Anheuser-Busch and now what we're seeing with

00:11:39.220 target, I think it's great. I think we've been trying to figure out for these last couple of

00:11:43.360 years of cancel culture, like how do we effectively fight this? Well, you know how you effectively fight

00:11:49.240 it. You will fight it. You fight it by joining up with other people who see the world as you see it.

00:11:54.760 And if a company is going to push a trans woman or man or whatever Dylan Mulvaney is

00:12:00.400 on a bud light, when you know that they're not marketing it to the people that drink it and

00:12:05.280 they're going to spit in your face, the executive who pushed that campaign literally said, in essence,

00:12:10.840 we don't like the people who are buying our beer. Well, you know what people, people are pushing back.

00:12:16.380 So yeah, I think that Trump has a real problem here because as he's come out sort of for Disney,

00:12:21.960 because DeSantis has been anti Disney, it's like, wait a minute. He's the guy he's completing the

00:12:27.420 work. Trump, you get credit for being anti woke. Of course, you woke up woke a lot of us up to this.

00:12:32.160 No pun intended. But he's the guy that is actually doing the thing. And, you know,

00:12:38.340 the proof is in the pudding, regardless of how many fingers you eat it with.

00:12:42.660 That's a weird rumor. Do you think there's any truth? I mean, truly, it just seems like it does.

00:12:46.980 It must have some basis. In fact, it seems so bizarre to be made up of out of whole cloth.

00:12:53.080 Whatever. Like, it's just what I want to know. It's not whatever. Did he stick his fingers in that

00:12:57.300 pudding and eat it or didn't he? It's important. I need to know. What do you think on that on that

00:13:03.200 front? I think there's always like a nugget of truth in these things. Maybe it was like,

00:13:07.520 maybe it's like the last bit of the pudding and you can't get it out with the spoons. We just did

00:13:10.960 like a one finger. I actually meant on the on the Disney DeSantis thing, not the pudding thing. But

00:13:17.880 that's good to know. I have thoughts on that, too. So I I'm torn on it, to be perfectly honest with

00:13:25.880 you, Dave, because I like the fact that DeSantis is fighting. You know, I am 100 percent with him

00:13:30.880 on the fight against woke. And I love the Florida's where woke goes to die thing. And he's lived up to

00:13:35.420 it. It's not just rhetoric. But I see massive dangers in governments punishing corporations

00:13:42.180 for their privately held views. I don't want that. And if we go down that road, guess who's going to

00:13:47.900 lose? We are. Because the Democrats control virtually all the corporations. They have a way bigger

00:13:53.300 hold on them than than our side does, you know, the side of reason. So we're going down a slippery

00:13:59.380 slope there. If we say that this is fine and you can punish corporations for challenging legislation

00:14:04.320 or saying this legislation sucks. That's how Disney feels. Why can't they feel that way? 0.85

00:14:08.900 Well, well, OK, so that's good, because I think we have a little difference of opinion there. So

00:14:12.400 look, I am completely fine with the government using power when it is appropriate to be used.

00:14:19.780 Disney, as you know, they had special laws related to their properties. They had special

00:14:25.860 tax exemptions. Let's not pretend this wasn't a punishment. This was a punishment, though.

00:14:29.820 There's no question. No, no, but that's fine. Why should why should Disney? Why should Disney

00:14:34.560 have special exemptions and tax benefits that say SeaWorld and Universal Studios, which are basically

00:14:40.380 in the same business, also in Orlando, that they don't have? So all he did was even the playing

00:14:45.680 field. He got rid of crony capitalism and gave us the even playing field that we all want. Now,

00:14:50.960 I get your point, though. I like it. I love seeing the people I hate punched in the face. I really do.

00:14:55.560 I can't stand Disney. I hate what they're doing to my children and everybody else's. However,

00:14:59.300 I care more about America and our fundamental ideals like the First Amendment, like government

00:15:03.280 shouldn't be infringing on the free speech of individuals or corporations. And I still happen to

00:15:08.560 believe that a corporation has the right to feel the way it feels about legislation, whether it's

00:15:13.320 a Republicans or a Dems and deserves not to be punished for said beliefs by a politician,

00:15:19.280 which is what yet it's fine that they just lowered him back down to regular status. It's still a

00:15:23.320 punishment from where they were to where they are now. And you you would not be singing this tune

00:15:28.880 if it were Citibank doing this to conservatives who objected to some woke agenda inside of the bank.

00:15:35.400 Well, no, no. The difference would be if they if they had special privileges. I don't want any

00:15:41.300 corporation to have any special privileges. Right. Like my companies don't deserve special

00:15:45.720 privileges. But the fact that they're lowering it from special to normal doesn't erase the fact

00:15:49.840 that it's a punishment. No, but the fact that they that it's lowering them from special status

00:15:54.960 back down to normal status does not. And which I agree, that's what happened,

00:15:58.580 does not change the fact that it is a punishment being exacted on the company by a governor,

00:16:02.940 by by somebody who we elected. It's a slippery slope. You don't think this is going to not

00:16:07.780 going to happen by Democratic governors now. They're like the turnabout will be fair play.

00:16:12.880 Well, but I would be OK if if there are situations in Democrat run states where certain corporations

00:16:18.500 have special privileges and then those companies got into fights with those Democrats, regardless

00:16:23.080 of what the fight was about. If the end result is what we now have in Florida, which will be an

00:16:27.800 even playing field for Disney, I would be OK with it. I get philosophically. I actually I completely

00:16:33.360 understand what you're saying. You want to make sure that government is not weaponized.

00:16:38.080 But the simple truth is it would be weaponized if they had if it was even to begin with.

00:16:42.920 And then he started saying, OK, we're going to throw extra taxes or extra regulations on Disney. 0.54

00:16:48.660 That would be a true weaponization of government. If anything, he took some of the weapon weaponization

00:16:53.560 away because you could absolutely argue that the weaponization of government was being used

00:16:59.280 against Universal and SeaWorld because they didn't they had more strict guidelines to play.

00:17:04.720 Nice try. Nice try. No, not persuaded. But I appreciate your support of him and his policy.

00:17:10.260 And that's fine. And like I say, I like to see Disney suffer. Don't get me wrong. I just this is

00:17:15.920 as a lawyer, as a citizen. I know this is not the way to do it. You go out there and convince people

00:17:21.720 to boycott Disney, you know, through third party groups, not as a not as a governor. Let the people

00:17:26.660 have their say. Let the people exact the punishment the way we did with Bud Light.

00:17:29.800 But government should stay the hell out of it. I don't like government. It's not up to Ron DeSantis

00:17:33.900 to punish Disney for its views. It's up to you and me and the people listening to this show.

00:17:39.960 Government should stay out of it. Trust me, Joe Biden unleashed on Republicans to do this kind of

00:17:44.840 thing is going to cause far more damage than Ron DeSantis ever will to Disney.

00:17:49.740 Yeah, I. All right. I can agree to disagree on one. That's all right.

00:17:53.100 Yeah, that's fine. I mean, look at this. These are interesting issues to debate. And I appreciate

00:17:58.520 having it. And I appreciate that he's trying new things. Usually what we see is these, you know,

00:18:04.120 Republican leaders roll over. You know, they do nothing. Now, I don't like the tactic here, but

00:18:09.220 I appreciate the willingness to engage. And he has been he has been losing in the courts on some of

00:18:15.520 his agenda because he's been stepping on the First Amendment. That's one of my concerns about DeSantis is

00:18:20.480 he's a little he's a little there's a little too much swagger for government for me. I'm I got a

00:18:26.600 healthy libertarian strain in me. And he's like, you can't tell the colleges how they're supposed to

00:18:33.240 feel about an issue. You can't punish corporations with these DEI, you know, initiatives or punishments

00:18:39.800 of their DEI thing because you don't like it as the state. It's up to the citizenry to to stand up

00:18:45.760 and fight it. You can't have the government legislate a corporation's viewpoint.

00:18:51.260 Yeah, again, I think we just have a disagreement here, which is which is well,

00:18:54.760 the courts are siding with me. So, yeah, no, it's it's it. Well, no, because they've removed

00:19:00.240 DEI from a lot of the schools here in Florida and it's been perfectly legal and everything else.

00:19:04.380 I mean, look, schools are different. The schools are different. Don't conflate. Corporations are a

00:19:08.560 different situation. The schools are different. Government can always legislate the schools

00:19:12.340 at 100 percent. We have a right from our government bodies to legislate what's being

00:19:16.180 taught in K through 12. That's different from telling a corporation that it may not

00:19:20.580 do business in the state of Florida or receive certain funds in Florida if they have certain

00:19:24.160 viewpoints. He's lost in the courts on this. He tried. No, no. But again, they've removed the

00:19:30.120 special status that Disney had. That's why Disney is talking about other corporations, Dave. All right,

00:19:35.200 never mind. This is a legal dispute. But trust me, he's losing in the courts on this issue.

00:19:38.380 It was something that was universally praised by conservatives last August. And then I said,

00:19:43.120 this is not going to be upheld. It promptly went into court and DeSantis lost. This is my only like

00:19:47.280 this is my substantive criticism of his policies. It's not to say he shouldn't be innovative in his

00:19:54.360 crackdown because the left is way more innovative than the right is. They're at every turn trying new

00:19:59.680 ways of infecting our lives with this crazed, woke ideology. So we need to be creative in getting it out

00:20:06.760 as well. To try and fail is better than to not try at all. But I wish he would be a little bit more

00:20:11.900 careful about wielding government power because it's going to be used the other way. And the left

00:20:17.760 controls way more than the right does. Let's talk. Let's shift for one second, though, because I want

00:20:23.220 to ask you, he said, have written down. DeSantis said yesterday that he believes Republicans will rally

00:20:30.580 around him if he wins the Republican nomination. He says, it's not like I'm taking policy positions

00:20:36.120 that are alienating massive segments of Republicans. Now, I think that's probably true. I think that's

00:20:43.020 right. I think most Republicans actually like DeSantis a lot. They just diehard Trumpkins get upset when

00:20:47.900 he's like that he's threatening Trump's next run. Right. Like that's what they don't like about him

00:20:52.740 for the most part. However, this is this goes back to our viral debate, Dave, that we had about

00:21:00.660 what would happen, like how DeSantis could ever get past the 800 pound gorilla. And, you know, I was

00:21:07.700 saying Trump is not going to go quietly into the night if DeSantis were to do it. You know, I don't

00:21:14.320 really see how DeSantis can do it with so many people in the field head to head, perhaps. But if DeSantis

00:21:20.120 were to do it, he's right that Republicans, his positions are not alienating to massive segments

00:21:27.040 of them. But look at what Trump did on the Senate in Georgia. He is not a good loser. So and he wants

00:21:37.020 this nomination. So if DeSantis gets it somehow, do we really think Trump's going to be like the best

00:21:43.460 man one? All the best to you, Ron, Rob. He's calling him Rob now. You know, take care.

00:21:50.180 Congratulations, Rob DeSantis. You did beat me. We're very excited. Well, look, Megan, I would say

00:21:55.400 this. That's where the train stops. Right. So I've said this on my show a couple of times. Look,

00:22:00.780 there is a very nice ending to this story. I do not know that it is the ending we are going to get.

00:22:06.540 But the ending to this story, to me, is that DeSantis is going to win the nomination. He's the best

00:22:12.000 candidate. I think he's he's the guy that not only can get the base for reasons we just laid out,

00:22:16.900 but he can get all of the disaffected liberals. I think people like you and I or the people that

00:22:22.580 maybe when we were there four years ago, seeing some of this nonsense, there's a whole slew of

00:22:27.040 those people. You have to remember, there aren't many segments of American society that don't know

00:22:31.240 which way they're going to vote. But there are a lot of disaffected liberals who might vote Republican.

00:22:36.720 And by the way, that's not I'm not just making that up. They're all moving to Florida. I meet them

00:22:40.900 every day. Lifelong Democrats from New York and Cali and Illinois who are now down here who are

00:22:47.200 the most hardcore Republicans because they've lived through the onslaught. So I think that the nice

00:22:53.620 ending is that DeSantis gets the nomination, that Trump realizes what time it is. And he says,

00:22:59.460 you know what? It's my ego is actually less important than what's right for the country.

00:23:04.800 And I'll back the guy and I'll do. No, it may not be. It may not be the ending. I'm just

00:23:09.560 telling you part of your comedy routine. You do stand up comedy. This seems like a bit because

00:23:13.860 there's zero chance that's happening. Megan, Megan, you know what? Trump likes to be liked.

00:23:18.500 Don't forget that. And don't over don't underestimate that because if he sees the

00:23:23.280 writing on the wall, the Senate, Dave. What?

00:23:27.360 He cost Republicans the Senate, Trump. He spoiled the Senate.

00:23:32.560 No, no, I'm just telling you. OK, so now I can give you the other version of it.

00:23:35.020 So I gave you the nice version. He doesn't give two shits about being liked. 0.98

00:23:37.700 OK, fine. So I gave you the nice version. The negative version, the negative version would be 0.98

00:23:42.160 that he's like, all right, I'm just going to burn it all down. It was me or nobody.

00:23:45.420 And I'm going to take the base with me. And I'm either going to run third party or I'm going to

00:23:49.320 demand that all my people don't. But if he's going to do that, then then it's like,

00:23:53.920 all right, then in essence, you are a Democrat because you'll usher in Joe Biden or Kamala

00:23:58.020 Harris or Gavin Newsom or whoever it's going to be. So you can make art. You can look at it

00:24:02.900 either way. I'd rather see Biden win again. Trump would rather see Biden win again than

00:24:07.260 DeSantis win. I'm going to say you might be right. And that's that's really depressing.

00:24:10.700 And I think that that should make the most ardent Trump supporter wonder why they're voting for

00:24:14.580 Trump. If he would really be willing to do that. What what what more proof do we need than the

00:24:19.360 Senate? What more proof do we need? No, so I'll go with you on that. So if you really

00:24:23.660 believe that and lose well, if you really believe that and you might be right on that,

00:24:27.300 then I think anyone supporting Trump who would gladly destroy DeSantis in the name of their blaze

00:24:33.220 of glory with Trump to then end up with Biden as president, you really should think about why

00:24:37.420 you're voting for this guy. Well, I think they're they're feeling is like Trump says he's a Paul

00:24:44.400 Ryan shill, right? He's another he's a globalist. You know, they're buying some of them, not all of

00:24:49.580 them, but they're buying this Trump argument about him. And it's the old like I'd rather see the

00:24:53.900 Republican Party implode and suffer and rebuild from the from the ground up than just yet another

00:25:00.520 Mitt Romney type, which I realize I don't think that's true of Ron DeSantis. But a lot of people

00:25:04.920 do because that's what Trump's saying. Well, they they believe that a certain segment of the base

00:25:09.200 believes that because Trump keeps saying it. It has nothing to do with the truth. DeSantis is not

00:25:13.200 a globalist. No one has done more conservative stuff effectively than Ron DeSantis, far more at

00:25:19.500 this point than even Donald Trump. Ron DeSantis is not backed by Soros. And I'm sure you've seen the

00:25:24.840 clips on Twitter, Megan, of the gajillion times that Donald Trump was praising Paul Ryan as his

00:25:31.020 good friend and everything else. And Mitch McConnell and Mitt Romney and all of the other guys. And he

00:25:36.320 brought in Christopher Wray and all of that stuff. So it's like it's not true. But yes, he has convinced

00:25:42.080 a certain segment of the, I would say, very online base that somehow Ron DeSantis is a globalist.

00:25:48.580 But it's just not true. So there it is. Well, but I mean, we're just talking about we're not even

00:25:54.600 really talking about truth or falsity right now. We're talking about what will the base do if Trump

00:25:58.760 says I lost in the 100 percent. He's going to say it was unfair. He's going to say he stole it like

00:26:06.100 history. Right. But there's zero chance of him being a good loser if he loses. And, you know, you look at

00:26:11.060 these polls and I realize DeSantis is out there. I assume you were at his little conservative

00:26:14.720 like briefing where he got everybody his talking points on these issues yesterday. I was not part

00:26:19.480 of that. I read what happened. But there's like he's he's out there sort of trying to shore people

00:26:26.020 up on these issues because he knows that they're coming at him. And right now he's saying, OK, look,

00:26:31.380 I'm more I have better favorability ratings in places like Iowa, New Hampshire. OK. All right. True.

00:26:39.400 But first of all, the media is going to drive his favorability ratings right through the floor

00:26:44.540 just as soon as he actually stands a chance. He's just declared yesterday or two days ago.

00:26:49.080 They're going to it's going to be an all out of self on him now that he's actually in the game.

00:26:52.180 And if he starts to gain ground, oh, you watch. And second of all, that that ignores the actual

00:26:58.440 polling where he's getting crushed. He's getting crushed by Trump. And unless he can manage to

00:27:03.580 convince Tim Scott and Nikki Haley and Mike Pence, who's probably going to get in

00:27:06.680 and Vivek and all these others to get out, he's he's in the same position of 61 percent Trump,

00:27:14.360 16 percent DeSantis. Yeah, I just don't think that polling really is right. And I also don't

00:27:20.440 think that any of those guys I happen to like a lot of them. I personally like Nikki a lot.

00:27:25.160 You know, I've had Vivek on a couple of times. I like Tim Scott. Like, I think this is a good

00:27:28.340 crop of people. It's significantly better than what the Democrats put out last time.

00:27:32.220 But the truth is, none of them have any momentum like they don't. They just don't.

00:27:36.960 Everyone knows this is a two man race. And yes, I suppose that for the one percent that they're 0.99

00:27:42.140 all going to get, it does whittle it from DeSantis rather than Trump. But I can tell you this,

00:27:47.000 and this is totally anecdotal, but I think it I think it actually strikes a chord that'll make

00:27:50.520 sense to you. About two months ago. So this is well before DeSantis announced. I did an event at

00:27:55.900 University of Wisconsin, Green Bay. OK, I did a poll. It's about 400 people in the crowd. And I did a poll.

00:28:01.680 I said, how many of you voted for Trump last time? I think literally every hand in the room

00:28:06.040 went up. Literally every hand in the room. I said, how many of you would prefer DeSantis

00:28:10.320 this time? It was everybody except about seven people. Now, I get it. It's an audience that

00:28:15.320 came there for me. So is what it is. But it was a cross section of students and faculty

00:28:19.820 and donors, et cetera, et cetera. And I started asking them asking them why. And then I did a

00:28:24.880 little cocktail thing after. So I was individually one on one chatting with people and everybody

00:28:29.880 was saying the exact same thing. We like Trump. We appreciate Trump. We thank Trump for what he

00:28:35.480 did. He woke us up. I used to be a Democrat, blah, blah, blah. But DeSantis is doing it right.

00:28:40.760 And it doesn't have the drama. And he's younger and he's more effective. And we know about Florida

00:28:46.620 with COVID and all that. And we're just tired of the thing. And I think what what DeSantis really has

00:28:52.120 the magic of what he has under the policy is that I think people are starting to realize it doesn't

00:28:57.800 have to be this way. And I don't think people want it to be this way anymore. I think that's

00:29:02.680 really what's going on here. Well, I mean, that's an interesting point. I hope you're right that it

00:29:09.240 doesn't have to be this way like that, that we can. But we have to make that decision ourselves,

00:29:12.940 right? Well, it only doesn't have to be this way. We're not giving Trump enough credit,

00:29:17.400 though, because, look, Chris Rufo participated in this event with DeSantis the other day about CRT's

00:29:21.740 worked with DeSantis and CRT in Florida. Guess who made Chris Rufo a household name? Trump.

00:29:27.540 He was on Tucker's show. Trump then worked with Chris Rufo to get rid of CRT in these federal

00:29:32.700 administrative agencies. So it's it's not like Trump did nothing on CRT. It started to explode

00:29:38.120 during the course of his administration. And he did start battling this. And who underestimates

00:29:42.900 Trump's willingness to fight the woke? Hello. This is like his signature bread and butter brand,

00:29:49.680 you know, being politically incorrect and not standing up for this nonsense.

00:29:53.080 They just have different tactics in it. But I'll tell you this, Dave, like and I'm listen,

00:29:57.360 I've said yesterday, this is not I'm taking the opposite side because I know you're very pro

00:30:00.920 DeSantis. And I have a lot of viewers on both sides. So as do I, by the way, I'm just telling

00:30:06.600 people what I think. But I know I have a certain segment of my audience pissed at me. But you know

00:30:10.640 this. You can only say what you believe. It's as simple as that. Oh, it's fine. I mean, listen,

00:30:14.200 either one of these guys could get my vote. But but I will say this. I'm on the show every day.

00:30:19.520 And we take callers all the time. And I hear from them and I hear from them in my emails and so on.

00:30:23.920 And I can give you exactly the opposite argument when it comes to DeSantis and Trump,

00:30:27.600 the people who say, well, I like DeSantis a lot. I can't wait for him to run next time.

00:30:31.680 It's not his turn. Trump got screwed off out of his first term. And we're not going to let him get

00:30:36.480 screwed out of and he got screwed out of his second term. And we're not going to let him get 0.97

00:30:39.680 screwed out of this go at getting elected again. The Durham report confirms how unfair he was 0.83

00:30:45.920 treated, how unfairly he was treated, how his first term was stolen from him and that DeSantis,

00:30:52.100 you know, right now he doesn't have all the baggage, but he'll get it. The mainstream media

00:30:55.000 will put it on him like that and that Trump deserves another go at it. They also point out

00:31:00.900 the charisma differential. And I don't think you can argue that like Trump oozes it out of his pores

00:31:05.640 and DeSantis seems pretty wooden. Yeah, look on the charisma side, I mean,

00:31:11.580 Trump's a reality TV host. He loves impromptu stuff and going off the cuff and all that stuff.

00:31:16.360 Like, yeah, there's, there's not a debate on that one. I actually think DeSantis is,

00:31:19.440 is totally friendly and interesting and all of those things. Uh, but is on that, if we're,

00:31:23.960 if we're measuring whether you want a guy to just like hang out with and get stupid and, 0.99

00:31:29.000 and play, you know, trade memes with, yes, Trump is better. If you want an executive, 0.99

00:31:33.900 who's a president, who's going to write the ship and do the right thing and has a track record of

00:31:38.640 literally doing everything he said, well, then it seems like it's DeSantis. But, but I want to back

00:31:42.940 up to something you said, because I agree. Trump deserves all of the credit for waking up that

00:31:47.380 stuff, uh, waking people up about the woke and everything else. But I would say, you know,

00:31:51.560 when, when we're worried, let's say about the, the media going after DeSantis, the same way they went

00:31:56.600 after Trump, you have to remember, this is not 2016 anymore. The mainstream media is in absolute

00:32:02.140 free fall. And it's a very slim amount of people, not none, but it's a much smaller amount of people

00:32:08.380 who believe the lies of the mainstream media, some of which you just laid out then did back in 2016.

00:32:14.260 So I think regardless of whether it's Trump or DeSantis, more people with a skeptical eye will

00:32:19.880 not be swallowing all of them. Oh, now DeSantis raped this person. And like all the nonsense that 0.98

00:32:24.940 they're going to make up. I don't think people will fall for it the way they did against Trump.

00:32:29.660 And by the way, that's partly credit to Trump for breaking through that thing.

00:32:34.360 Well, and I'll give you this point. The thing about, you know, the thing about Trump,

00:32:39.560 some people loved, but it also leads to that fatigue factor you were just discussing

00:32:44.900 was mostly self-generated, like the weird tweets, some of the weird comments, the weird behavior,

00:32:52.400 like this, the strange comments about Elaine Chao, you know, it's like, what? He just,

00:32:57.640 he would say something and then it would drive the news cycle for like three days as opposed to like

00:33:03.220 just getting along or getting onto the people's agenda. And so Trump is just erratic. He's erratic.

00:33:09.360 And, you know, I understand it's part of the package, but I also understand the fatigue factor

00:33:13.920 that leads people to be like, oh, for the love of Jane, like what's like, we need something that's

00:33:19.140 more normal. We're used to the mainstream demonizing people like Romney, McCain, who are not

00:33:24.120 really controversial. We know what we're going to get. Same thing with DeSantis. We know how to

00:33:29.280 prepare for that. With Trump, it's just so much of it. It's like, okay, there's a porn star who he

00:33:35.180 paid off and now there may be a bookkeeping thing. And then there's the Mar-a-Lago documents and then

00:33:39.300 there's an FBI raid. And then there may be like, it's just like the drama tends to follow him.

00:33:45.160 But Megan, I'll give you a bonus with that one, which is that he's also feeding the beast that we all

00:33:51.000 want destroyed, which is the mainstream media. There's a reason you're doing this show independently

00:33:55.540 the way that you are, which is so freaking awesome and allows you to be your boss, right? And there

00:34:00.340 is nothing that you can't say. And if you say something that gets you in trouble, you're the

00:34:05.220 one that's ultimately responsible for that. Trump, unfortunately, he was right about CNN, CNN fake

00:34:10.980 news, right? That's Trump's credit, except he just did a town hall with them. So he keeps them alive

00:34:16.260 and they need him for clicks. So it becomes, it becomes this very twisted game that these guys

00:34:21.600 are playing. The New York times, he'll tell you they're the failing New York times. And then who

00:34:26.040 does he give access to more than anyone else? Maggie Haberman at the New York times. DeSantis

00:34:31.200 is doing the workaround that we've all been asking for. He's going to Twitter spaces.

00:34:36.000 Don't get me started. He's not being interviewed by NBC because they keep lying about him.

00:34:39.880 Or me. Seriously, it's not about me, but he's got to grow a pair. Like, come on for an adversarial

00:34:47.320 inner. Go with somebody who's going to ask you some tough questions. Be a man. I'm sick

00:34:51.960 of like the duck and cover drill that he's doing only with friendly media. Would you grow

00:34:56.980 up? I'm not adverse to DeSantis, but he is going to get some tough questions. Who has

00:35:01.440 he done? Who has he done that's asked him tough questions?

00:35:04.260 Well, first off, I, a hundred percent would be for DeSantis doing your show. He absolutely

00:35:09.560 should. I am. Why is he not on the list? We've asked a million times. We asked again

00:35:12.940 this round. He's too chicken. Go ahead. Yeah, no, no, no. I think you're in touch with

00:35:18.920 them. So he absolutely should. I 100%. I'm in touch with them, but I haven't gotten a

00:35:23.820 yes. I mean, literally like with all due respect to like the local radio host in Tennessee, which

00:35:30.280 he's going, he doesn't need to worry about. Why wouldn't he? Our show is literally one

00:35:35.740 of the biggest shows in the country. I mean, we've got way more viewers than anything he

00:35:39.400 could do on most of Fox News, other than a couple of the primetime shows, all of CNN,

00:35:44.580 all of MSNBC. It's insanity. There's only one reason. There's only one reason, Dave. He's

00:35:50.180 afraid of being asked tough questions. That's absurd, first of all, because he can handle

00:35:54.940 adversarial media. We've seen him do that in the local Florida level, and it's bad for

00:35:59.240 him. It's one thing to give the middle finger to MSNBC. Right on, Ron. I agree with him

00:36:05.540 and not Vivek on that, right? There's no gettable viewers over there, though you could make the

00:36:11.380 argument you have a Carrie Lake type moment that leads to a viral campaign situation where 1.00

00:36:17.120 taking on the truly leftist hating media is good for him. But there's no excuse not to

00:36:21.940 do just challenging people who are not sycophants of his. So it's not about me. I don't need,

00:36:27.480 let me just say this. I don't need DeSantis. My show's crushing it. I don't need him.

00:36:30.740 And there's some liberty in not having him on because, you know, I can say whatever the hell

00:36:35.420 I want. Like what's true for me? I don't need to suck up to get him on the program. But I do see

00:36:40.960 this as a problem. You can't be so insulated. You never subject yourself to the tough questions.

00:36:45.740 And then what? You're on the debate stage and suddenly you're looking at Anderson Cooper

00:36:49.540 and it's like, oh, wait, I mean, how's that going to go?

00:36:53.960 Megan, I 100 percent agree with you. He absolutely should do your show. And I'll even talk directly

00:37:00.640 to the camera and say, Governor DeSantis, or if any of your people are watching the Megan Kelly

00:37:05.340 show right now, this is Dave Rubin. You know me. And you should absolutely sit down with Megan.

00:37:10.120 You are 100 percent right on that. I can't speak to what's going on there behind the scenes.

00:37:13.860 Um, I have I have literally no idea, but you're of course you're right.

00:37:18.740 Listen, on that note, Megan Kelly needed Dave Rubin's endorsement. If you would have told

00:37:22.620 me that 10 years ago.

00:37:25.960 Well, you're a power broker now, Dave, and it's a pleasure to have you on. Up next,

00:37:30.220 we're going to discuss the Biden disastrous poll numbers. My God, my God, these numbers are

00:37:36.060 absolutely dreadful. I mean, I'm actually starting to wonder whether RFK Jr. can somehow get this

00:37:41.040 nomination. We'll talk about it. Stand by. We've talked about the inter-GOP war. Let's talk about

00:37:50.480 what's happening over on the Dem side. It's not good. CNN has a new poll out among Democrats.

00:37:57.700 Biden has 60 percent support to become the second term president. RFK Jr. has 20 percent, 20 percent.

00:38:07.240 Marianne Williamson has eight and anyone else has eight. So you've got 36 percent of the Democratic

00:38:13.660 Party saying, for the love of God, give us somebody else. We don't want this old man.

00:38:18.360 That's terrible. And then you look at the independent support. Biden gets 40 percent of

00:38:23.580 the independents. These are important. These are the ones who win or lose elections for the candidates

00:38:27.020 on both sides. Biden has 40 percent of them. Kennedy has 32 percent. Williamson has nine. Someone else

00:38:33.920 has 14. So 32, 42, 46 plus nine is 55. The vast majority of Democrats want the independents want

00:38:45.200 someone other than Biden. You go down the favorability nationwide. Biden has 35 percent favorable,

00:38:53.520 57 percent unfavorable. By the way, that's basically how Trump's numbers look as well.

00:38:57.840 And you look deep into these numbers and what it shows is that most of Biden's decline is occurring

00:39:03.600 among independents. He's down at least nine points in the past just few months. It doesn't get better

00:39:12.160 from there. Everyone thinks it would be a disaster, a disaster or a setback. 67 percent of the electorate

00:39:18.780 says for Biden to be reelected would be a disaster or a setback. Similar numbers for Trump. So,

00:39:24.520 oh, my God, what is what the Democrats have a massive problem? And his name is Joe Biden.

00:39:30.560 Well, first off, on eight percent of the Democrats supporting Marianne Williamson,

00:39:34.940 the woman is completely bananas. So let's just let me tell you one thing about Marianne 0.78

00:39:40.480 Williamson real quick, just like purely purely to show you what what politics is all about or what

00:39:46.000 this game is often all about. I had Marianne Williamson on my show. I really try not to bad

00:39:50.260 mouth any of the guests that I've ever had on. But she did something that you'll you'll appreciate

00:39:54.360 what happened. I had her on and she gives me all of her sort of lefty, progressive, socialist,

00:40:00.940 everyone's a racist, all the stuff. I treat her with the exact same respect as I treated everybody

00:40:04.960 else. Of course, it's what I always do. The second the camera went off, she was like this. I mean,

00:40:11.460 I mean this literally the second it went off. She was like, you know, I'm mostly a libertarian.

00:40:14.740 And actually, I've never gotten as much hate from the right as I have from the left. They're really

00:40:19.400 just so awful. And I was like I said, I was like, Marianne, why didn't you say that on camera?

00:40:24.880 So that sort of tells you everything you need to know about her. But let's let's just move on from

00:40:28.740 her. The RFK thing is super interesting because 20 percent is not nothing. He's making a lot of sense,

00:40:34.800 especially on the covid stuff and some security state stuff and intelligence agencies and all that.

00:40:40.580 But I will bet you my entire life's fortune that Joe Biden will never step on a debate stage with

00:40:47.900 that people. What RFK is about to find out, if he does not know it already, is that the deep

00:40:53.580 corruption of the Democrat Party, just ask Bernie Sanders, is so deep, it is so ingrained that they

00:40:59.340 will do everything they can to destroy him. And I haven't had RFK on yet. We've been trying to get

00:41:04.820 him. So we'll see what happens. But what I would like to know from RFK really is what makes you a

00:41:10.560 Democrat at this point. And now I get you're a Kennedy. So it's it's this is, you know,

00:41:14.840 intertwined. That's fine. But I think by the time the Democrat machine is done with him and won't

00:41:19.980 put him on stage, he should leave the party, say he's a Republican. And guess what? The Republicans

00:41:24.800 will put him on the debate stage. But I don't what I maybe you know the answer to that. What do you

00:41:28.860 think makes him a Democrat? I've asked him that a few times. Like, why are you still a Democrat?

00:41:33.840 And I think on social issues, he's still more liberal. You know, I'm sure he's pro choice. He's

00:41:40.560 he's made his whole fortune, his not a fortune, but he's made his whole bones as an environmental

00:41:44.500 lawyer. So he's very, you know, pro cleaning up the environment, which I realize Republicans would

00:41:49.560 like to clean up the environment, too. But there's a big diversion on how to do it. Sure. You can go

00:41:54.240 back and look at the list. But he he I've tested that just like within the past six or seven months.

00:41:58.780 And he said, yeah, no, 100 percent Democrat. But here's what's interesting about that run.

00:42:02.480 In addition to just his numbers, Dave, like what if he were to run as a third party?

00:42:08.160 What if he doesn't, you know, not going to he's not going to get the nomination

00:42:11.760 and just completely screwed up the Biden vote like that could be really interesting.

00:42:19.080 That would be really interesting. You know, it definitely screws up the Biden vote. I think

00:42:23.260 when it on the Republican side, it would really depend on whether it was Trump or DeSantis.

00:42:27.200 You could probably figure out ways to argue it either way. Right.

00:42:30.620 You know, the thing with the with the third party vote is, well, first off, there's there's so

00:42:34.840 many issues related to ballot access and if you can actually get on the ballot. Now,

00:42:39.000 the Libertarian Party is on, I think, pretty much every ballot. They exist as a party as

00:42:43.760 ineffectual and as really ridiculous as they've been for for decades at this point. And I would 0.99

00:42:48.240 say that, unfortunately, by the way, in 2016, I voted for Gary Johnson, who was the Libertarian

00:42:53.420 candidate. He was a terrible candidate. I just couldn't pull the lever for either one of Hillary 0.99

00:42:58.000 or Trump at the time. Obviously, I did vote for Trump the second time. But ballot access would

00:43:02.600 be the main thing. I think I think RFK probably has a very bright future influencing things more

00:43:09.380 from the outside after this. But my guess is I'm telling you that the Democrat, you know,

00:43:13.800 Megan, the Democrat machine is so nasty and corrupt that he will glad like environment is making you 0.87

00:43:20.420 a Democrat. OK. I mean, the Republicans, as you said, they don't hate the environment. It's whether 0.98

00:43:24.540 the government should do it or private or whether we can do it at all or what energy we should use.

00:43:29.460 As far as the social issues, there's very few Republicans who are trying to reverse gay 1.00

00:43:34.700 marriage. It's not a thing anymore. And an abortion, you know, it's left up to the state. 0.96

00:43:39.900 So it really shouldn't be that much of an issue for presidential politics anyway.

00:43:44.180 You can talk them into it. You'll try to talk them into it. But look, these guys have a massive

00:43:48.520 problem here with these numbers because they're not enthusiastic about Joe Biden. And in the number

00:43:53.980 two position, as you know, God forbid something happens to Joe Biden, we're going to be stuck

00:43:58.200 with this eloquent, inspirational speaker who's going to inspire us to unite and come together

00:44:06.260 and and celebrate things like technological achievements like the semiconductor. Listen

00:44:12.120 to her wax eloquently about that. Without semiconductors, your smartphone would not be

00:44:21.360 a smartphone. It would be a paperweight that occupies a big space in your pocket.

00:44:30.560 I mean, Dave, what's not to love? Megan, that woman is a human paperweight. OK, 1.00

00:44:35.960 she's just I'm I'm shocked she didn't somehow say something about a Venn diagram there. That's

00:44:42.800 her whole thing. Everything is a Venn diagram. I give you a Venn diagram of Kamala Harris's

00:44:47.760 speeches and sheer stupidity, and we could put those together and it would it's all so idiotic. 1.00

00:44:53.800 But look, at least the Biden thing is brilliant. 1.00

00:44:57.460 You know, keep going. The Biden thing is such a disaster right now. I think you really could

00:45:04.300 argue that Biden is the worst president in modern history because Joe Biden is obviously not running

00:45:10.400 the show. There's no confidence in him. You know, I've tweeted this out a couple of times and I would

00:45:15.420 ask you to do the same thing. Try to get an ardent Biden supporter on your show. We are to believe he

00:45:21.840 got 81 million votes and people still love him and think he's great and all of that stuff. But you can't

00:45:27.220 get anyone to really defend him. Get get his biggest supporter to come on your show and ask them,

00:45:33.060 do you think Joe Biden is mentally capable of being president at this point? And they will either lie

00:45:38.760 to you or not give you the answer or realistically, they're not showing up. He's more of a construct

00:45:43.240 at this point to just keep the Frankenstein machine going than actually president. There is simply

00:45:49.740 if do you think for one day he could be assistant manager at McDonald's? The guy's not right. That's

00:45:56.080 very sad. I want a president who's competent, whether I agree with his policies or not. But they have a

00:46:02.220 major problem because she's obviously one right behind him. I have looked. And also, did you see

00:46:06.760 the video? What was it about a week ago when he was in Japan and he fell down the stairs? And it's

00:46:11.160 like he usually falls up the stairs. This time he fell down the stairs. But we're a broken hip away

00:46:15.320 from Kamala. So everybody better be worried about this. And we're six years away from the end of his

00:46:21.480 second term. If he were to be reelected, try to picture him as president of the United States,

00:46:25.940 six years from where he is right now. It's really scary. I mean, it's almost like a forgive me, but it's

00:46:33.240 like a taxidermied president, you know, like there's nothing there anymore. And yet he's in charge of the

00:46:40.140 nuclear codes and how we all live because he's been, you know, very aggressive about interfering on things

00:46:46.580 like education and how our children are. So now we're supposed to behave. And it's terrifying because we'd have

00:46:51.160 no idea who is actually in control. All right. My friend, Dave Rubin, it's always a pleasure,

00:46:56.240 my friend. Check him out on the Rubin Report on Rumble. Love Rumble. And we'll do it again soon.

00:47:03.820 See you, Megan. All right. And don't forget, folks, you can find the Megan Kelly show live on SiriusXM

00:47:09.000 Triumph Channel 111 every weekday at noon east, the full video show and clips by subscribing to our

00:47:14.760 YouTube channel. That's YouTube dot com slash Megan Kelly. If you prefer an audio podcast,

00:47:19.680 go ahead and download and follow us wherever you get your podcasts for free. If you go on over to

00:47:24.780 Apple, you can leave a like a comment and I will read it and you'll get our full archives,

00:47:29.220 more than 550 shows. Also want to tell you, go ahead now to Megan Kelly dot com. You can sign up for

00:47:35.020 the American News Minute. It's my Friday email to you. It's got all sorts of fun updates on what we

00:47:40.120 cover during the week, all the news you need to know in 60 seconds or less, and an update on my

00:47:45.340 little buddy, Strudwick Brunt. He is the littlest Brunt, but also the biggest pain in the ass. 0.99

00:47:54.940 Joining us now for the first time is Brian Sharp, better known to the world as Hotep Jesus. 0.99

00:48:01.780 Hotep is the host of The Grift Report on YouTube, and he has a unique perspective on what's been going

00:48:07.560 on with so many subjects from BLM's potential bankruptcy, the latest with the machete wielding

00:48:13.960 professor out of New York City. Much, much more. Hotep, welcome to the show. Nice to meet you.

00:48:20.100 Megan, thank you so, so much. It's an absolute pleasure to be here. I had a friend call me this

00:48:24.720 morning. She's like, oh my God, you're going to be on Megan Kelly. I can't believe it.

00:48:28.400 I like her. She's not smart. All right. So for those of the audience who don't know what Hotep is about,

00:48:34.600 can you explain that?

00:48:35.300 So Hotep was, it's a term that we used. It stems from like 60s and 70s in the Black community. So in

00:48:45.080 the Black community, it's pretty much bifurcated, just like the white community, where you have your 1.00

00:48:48.980 conservative side and you have your liberal side, right? So in the Black community, we were using 0.96

00:48:53.100 this term Hotep, which means peace, you know, say hi or goodbye, et cetera, et cetera. But when Black Lives 0.99

00:48:59.960 Matter came into prominence, Hotep turned into a pejorative, basically a way to hurl invective

00:49:08.560 comments at Black conservative minds. And I said, not on my watch. So we took it, we exalted the term, 0.97

00:49:15.680 and here we are today. I'm Hotep Jesus. We run Hotep Nation, which is a nonprofit organization that

00:49:20.740 supports the homeschooling community. But it was just basically to reclaim something that had

00:49:25.420 greatness attached to it, while the Black left tried to throw it in the mud. 0.94

00:49:31.040 That's very cool. I like it. It took me a while to pronounce it correctly. So I practiced Hotep.

00:49:35.500 I thought, first I thought it was Hotep. Like, no, not it. Not it. Hotep got it. 0.98

00:49:39.900 Well, one time, I was hanging out with Charlie Kirk one time, and he called me Hotstep.

00:49:45.280 That's good, too.

00:49:46.300 I didn't correct him, because, you know, I'm Black, so obviously he thought it had some sort of

00:49:50.900 hip-hop connotation to it. So when he called me Hotstep, I was like, you know what, I'll let it slide.

00:49:54.540 It kind of works, too. You could go either way with it. Now, so you grew up, and I understand you

00:50:00.960 were not always more of a conservative commentator. You were more kind of firmly on the left and more

00:50:05.520 pro-BLM and, like, pro the narrative on guys like Michael Brown and Trayvon Martin. That's 0.62

00:50:12.500 interesting. So how did you sort of have this journey from there to here?

00:50:15.900 Okay, so that is half correct. I was raised conservative. I wouldn't say,

00:50:22.080 you know, technically politically conservative, but the Black community, for the most part,

00:50:27.120 is very conservative. And I was on the Black conservative end of things. And I was never 0.98

00:50:33.540 a supporter of BLM, the organization. In fact, I was one of the first people to call them out in 2014

00:50:38.900 and 2015. You can go look at the receipts. You know, I've done videos, and I think 2015,

00:50:45.120 my video was on BLM, the rainbow agenda, or the Bud Light agenda. So I've been on top of that and

00:50:53.320 trying to expose them for a really long time. And that was part of the reason why I got labeled

00:50:57.000 Hotep, because they didn't like that I was exposing that situation. But as far as Mike Brown was

00:51:03.340 concerned, you know, I really didn't care about the case or anything that much. My problem was

00:51:12.780 seeing my peers. I felt the pain of my peers and how they viewed that case and how they viewed those

00:51:21.440 events and how it turned out. And I felt bad that their emotions were being manipulated. And

00:51:27.840 then there was the Darren Seals situation. OK, now Darren Seals was on the ground in Ferguson with

00:51:36.900 Mike Brown's mom, et cetera, et cetera. And he was the one that really exposed BLM. And he was talking

00:51:43.100 about how, you know, these people were coming in. They were co-opting the Ferguson, the Ferguson

00:51:48.060 demonstration, because at first it was organic on the ground. And then all of a sudden the BLM types 0.85

00:51:53.600 came in and co-opted it. Antifa types came in and started becoming provocateurs. So then once the

00:51:59.800 cameras started coming in, you have the BLM infiltrators coming in and he was talking about

00:52:04.620 all this money was coming in. He even talks about there's a clip out there of him saying he was going

00:52:08.880 to he smacked DeRay McKesson. So, yeah, he you know, I was definitely on on his side of things.

00:52:15.800 And we were trying to, you know, alert people to the dangers of BLM.

00:52:21.400 Hmm. I'm I'm just reading like my producer said, I think you used to call yourself a black

00:52:27.160 nationalist. And so what did that mean to you? Yeah. So I'm still kind of a black nationalist,

00:52:36.300 but like, what does that even mean? Right. This and it has a it has a term in that,

00:52:41.120 you know, nationalists. Right. So you think of nationalists and you think,

00:52:45.100 you know, for example, we say white nationalists, you think of Patriot Front in some white hate

00:52:50.600 group. So when you say black nationalists, you think of some black hate group. And there was a 0.98

00:52:55.940 time in my life where, you know, I did not like white people. I had animosity towards white people. 0.53

00:53:01.900 And then I had this spiritual awakening and, you know, I found resolve within myself.

00:53:06.120 And I got away from that, you know, toxic mentality. I'm still very pro black.

00:53:13.460 However, it's definitely from a different point of view. You know, when I say black nationalists,

00:53:20.000 like some people were calling me radical back in the day. But the only thing radical about me,

00:53:23.760 I was calling for things like, you know, boycott Nike and boycott the NFL and all these things that

00:53:30.820 black people gave their energy to. And, you know, focus on your health and focus on economics,

00:53:36.640 focus on capitalism. And that stuff just didn't it didn't fit too well with the community. Obviously,

00:53:43.180 the black community has been monopolized by Nike. They love sports. And, you know, when I

00:53:49.880 brought up, what was the other one I just said?

00:53:54.520 Um, it's the sports, Nike. And what was the other one I mentioned, Megan? Help me out.

00:54:01.660 I'm not sure which one you mean.

00:54:03.220 But anyway, but anyway, yeah. Um, so, oh, oh yeah. Capitalism. So that's when I realized that

00:54:10.140 the black liberals were very much socialist. And then I started having to dive into all of the 1.00

00:54:16.960 studies of, um, Russia and Germany and understanding how socialism and communism came about and then

00:54:23.980 how it proliferated through the black community, et cetera, et cetera. So when they realized I was a

00:54:30.000 capitalist, I was basically canceled. And I was like, no, capitalism is definitely the way. And

00:54:34.200 then that's when I got into Thomas Sowell's work, Walter Williams' work, Milton Friedman. Then I wrote

00:54:38.740 my book, The Patriot Report. So I'm a capitalist through and through. And I thought that capitalism

00:54:42.740 was the way for black people to get out of the, you know, the struggle that they're in and reduce

00:54:48.860 regulation. And they were like, no, we need more government, you know, vote Democrat, et cetera,

00:54:54.180 et cetera. And I'm just like, uh, yeah, that's not it. Hmm. Do you think like that, that some of those

00:54:59.720 same folks who gave you a hard time about these issues are having an awakening of any kind, you know,

00:55:04.500 between Candace Owens' Blexit and, you know, Larry Elder and his films, and it just seems like there's a

00:55:11.100 bit of a sea change now through Trump too, given the, you know, I realize it's nothing to like,

00:55:16.500 it's not exactly a huge groundswell of black support, but he certainly increased his numbers

00:55:21.620 amongst the black voters. Do you feel like there's any sort of change underway?

00:55:27.140 The change has all been done by the Biden administration. When you go to the grocery

00:55:31.300 store, when you go to the gas station, these are the things that are changing people's minds.

00:55:36.080 This is what I understood about the black community is they're very much about the mighty green 1.00

00:55:39.800 dollar. And once you affect that mighty green dollar, you know, that's when they're going to

00:55:43.780 start to question things. So, uh, you know, Larry Elder, uh, Candace Owens, they've done great work.

00:55:50.640 I can't say it's touched the black community. Um, but I can say those prices have and the economic

00:55:57.660 strain, for example, I know, um, like 50% of small business or maybe black business, just business in

00:56:04.440 general small business was hurt by the pandemic. So, you know, these lockdowns that most, you know,

00:56:10.060 democratic governors, um, coveted and enforced, a lot of that stuff has them, you know, questioning,

00:56:16.680 you know, democratic policies. But the truth of the matter is there's not much voter participation

00:56:21.520 in the black community. I mean, less than half of the black community actually votes. So when we're

00:56:27.380 talking about who's actually voting, it's mostly skewed black women. And many of them work for the 1.00

00:56:33.060 democratic party. Um, you know, they do the door knocking, they do the phone calls, et cetera,

00:56:37.940 et cetera. And they're really held hostage by this notion that Republicans are racist.

00:56:43.040 And also I think they've been held hostage from an education point of view and from a fake stream

00:56:50.600 media point of view to where they only get one side of the story. Um, also Hollywood has done a great

00:56:57.360 job. For example, we see the movie, the color purple, they keep the black community suspended in a 1.00

00:57:03.040 certain time period. And from a certain viewpoint of that time period, which points to stories of

00:57:09.780 struggle and oppression where the white man had his foot on your neck. So they're not seeing the

00:57:15.580 full picture. They're not seeing, you know, the first legal, uh, case one by a slave owner was a

00:57:22.800 black man. They're not, they're not looking at the side of things where there was black bankers. And

00:57:28.240 they're not looking at the fact that black wall street was destroyed, but was also rebuilt. And

00:57:34.800 the only thing that destroyed it was integration, uh, something that was pushed by the NAACP. They're

00:57:40.540 not seeing how the NAACP isn't doing a great job for the black community. They've got a few small cases

00:57:46.920 where they've done some great things for individuals, but for the most part, the things that they push for

00:57:51.420 are not good, uh, in the longterm, it's very, very short term thinking. So, you know, I say that the

00:57:58.460 black voters, those mostly women have been manipulated at the school level, the university 1.00

00:58:04.500 level and the media level, both in the news and Hollywood. So, you know, they don't have a holistic

00:58:11.260 view of how this world works or how this country works and how things came to be. And when you don't

00:58:16.700 have both sides of those, you know, you're going to, you're not going to make the best decisions.

00:58:21.200 Do you, do you just listening to you talk? I know you've talked many times about the fact that you

00:58:25.340 did not go to college, but you are self-educated. You've read a ton on so many different interesting

00:58:29.840 subjects. Um, starting with Orwell, like everything he's written. And I know the Russian revolution and

00:58:35.200 so on, this seems like an advantage, right? Because you didn't go through four years of that

00:58:40.760 indoctrination. They didn't get their claws into you with some of the stuff they're pushing. I mean,

00:58:45.780 especially today, um, that, that seems like an advantage in staving off that ideological

00:58:51.000 hold. Yeah. Well, they wouldn't have got their tentacles on me anyway. I mean, if you looked at

00:58:58.100 some of the books, my dad had me reading, I'm talking about like, I remember probably maybe 10,

00:59:05.620 12 years old, some conspiracy theory books about AIDS was developed in a lab and was spread on the

00:59:12.100 African continent through vaccines, you know, all this stuff that, you know, I was reading some

00:59:17.000 really based material when I was really young. Okay. So, um, they weren't going to get their

00:59:24.560 tentacles on me anyway. In fact, that's why for grabbing. Yeah. And they, and I think many of my

00:59:29.680 professors, when I did go to college, they picked up on these things. Like I remember one time I went

00:59:34.260 to college, uh, or a class and I showed up late and he said to me, you know, Brian, you're late.

00:59:40.140 And I said, well, I pay to go here. I'll let you know when you're late. And the whole class was like,

00:59:45.060 Oh, so I always had this like different view of life and things, but you know, I think self-education,

00:59:53.140 um, has been my greatest asset and, uh, curiosity, but also like,

00:59:59.900 you know, um, you know, removing those emotions that, you know, the leftist media wants to,

01:00:07.040 wants to keep black people suspended in like, you know, Republicans are bad. And I, you know,

01:00:11.620 I wasn't the person that would say, okay, Republicans are bad. I have to stay away. I was

01:00:15.000 like, Republicans are bad. Okay. Why tell me why? And I never got those answers. So I just went and

01:00:21.820 started speaking to, uh, Republicans and checking them out. And then they started educating me because I

01:00:28.900 I was asking things like, you know, what should I read on communism, for example? And they gave me

01:00:35.000 a litany of different documents and books or, well, of course, as well. And, uh, I sat down and I

01:00:42.320 studied, you know, it's, I was speaking to, um, I think it was, uh, Carpe Duncombe at, um, at an event.

01:00:49.940 And, uh, he said to me, you know, the, the turnaround, the turnover in this industry is, um,

01:00:56.980 like two years or something like that. And I've been around a lot longer. And I told him, I think

01:01:01.700 that's because when the Trump Hillary election came around, I didn't spend time grifting. I spent time

01:01:08.420 educating myself. And then I wrote my dissertation, the Patriot report, unmasked the conspiracy of money

01:01:13.340 and war. I studied, I educated myself and I used Republicans or conservatives, I would say, to,

01:01:21.120 to help educate me. And that's how I, you know, devoured all the soul content. I devoured all the

01:01:26.840 Walter Williams content, Milton Friedman, um, you know, some of the Mises stuff, you know, I just

01:01:33.720 used the time to really educate myself because I, you know, I didn't want to be a LARPer. I remember

01:01:37.960 one time, you know, I used the term 1984 and Orwell, and I'm like, wait, I never even read the book.

01:01:42.780 So I sat down, I read that and I read animal farm that I read some of his letters and his writings.

01:01:48.780 And, you know, I just think that, you know, if you're going to really do battle on this playing

01:01:54.740 field, self-education is going to be the key. And it's really easy to destroy the liberals because

01:01:59.240 everything they have is just pure emotions. Do you get, you know, the same sort of blowback

01:02:04.760 on these positions as we've seen on this week for Tim Scott or, you know, for Clarence Thomas,

01:02:10.740 any conservative black man or woman gets horrendously attacked and diminished. And it's,

01:02:17.880 they get a total pass for it in the media. Have you experienced that?

01:02:21.260 No, no, they, they, I'm, I'm Teflon now because, you know, I warned the black community about BLM 1.00

01:02:27.520 so, so early and so many people blocked me and so people, so many people lambasted me.

01:02:33.600 But now like the black community is like, yo, we have to give Hotep Jesus his flowers because he 1.00

01:02:38.640 warned us about this scam years ago and we would not listen. So now I think the black community see me, 0.99

01:02:45.280 you know, like Candace Owens, she did her documentary like a year or two ago.

01:02:49.240 Okay. So when Candace Owens was a Democrat, I was exposing BLM, right? So they view us very

01:02:56.840 differently because I was in the trenches. I came from black nationalism, so to speak. I came from the

01:03:03.140 Hotep community. And also when I speak, they know I know my stuff. Okay. It's really hard to pin me.

01:03:09.940 And I've had so many great interviews. Like I had great interviews with Scott Adams and so many other

01:03:14.000 people, Joe Rogan. So I've spoken to so many people and I, I, I think it's because for example,

01:03:22.380 right? Fox soul, Fox soul had me on one time. And then the next time I came back on, they pulled

01:03:28.920 some shim sham when I pulled up to the zoom about, you know, I didn't have some paperwork signed or

01:03:33.200 something like that when we already settled that, but Fox soul won't even speak to me.

01:03:38.140 So the thing is, I think they're afraid to even highlight me. I had an argument today

01:03:43.240 with, um, Ebro from hot 97. I said, Ebro, you know, why won't you bring me up to hot 97

01:03:48.960 and have a discussion and speak to the black community? So they don't attack me. They just

01:03:53.820 try to avoid me and ignore me because I think if they put the spotlight on me, I might start

01:03:58.560 changing more minds. And, and, and that's really what they're scared of.

01:04:02.180 Right. That's, that's a problem that Republicans have of all, of all colors in dealing with the

01:04:07.400 mainstream. So what, what about the BLM collapse? It's been pretty brutal. They're not bankrupt,

01:04:13.660 but they're facing a possible bankruptcy. The latest reports are just, they've lost,

01:04:18.580 you know, tens and tens of millions of dollars. They've wasted tens of millions of dollars on

01:04:23.060 lavish homes for the founder. Patrice colors was forced out, uh, in 2021 amidst scandal.

01:04:29.380 And it seems like the, the giving well has dried up certainly versus 2020. So do you see a future

01:04:37.580 for BLM, the organization in the wake of all this?

01:04:42.200 BLM's job is done. The BLM is no longer needed. So if they're going to get money, it's going to be

01:04:49.720 from big donors. It's going to be from big corp. Um, they've lost all, all support from the black 1.00

01:04:57.820 community. There's very, very few people in the black community who still support BLM. There's

01:05:02.920 BLM chapter statement.com, which have the different chapters of BLM, which have accused, um, the Black

01:05:09.360 Lives Matter global network foundation of some, you know, funny money schemes happening. They're not

01:05:14.960 getting support, you know, hundreds of million dollars have poured into the coffers of the BLM

01:05:19.160 mothership and nothing has gone to her children chapters. So you even have BLM, the organizations,

01:05:26.240 you know, mutiny, um, against the mothership. So, but coming back to my point, like BLM is done. Like

01:05:36.140 their, their, their role was to Trojan horse the Bud Light agenda. That was, that was the whole thing

01:05:45.880 was to turn everybody into a different gender. Let's just call a spade a spade. And they used 1.00

01:05:54.160 black power, black energy, black women, black issues, black men. Cause you got to remember on

01:06:02.020 the website, it said mothers, parents, children, they omitted black men from the website very early

01:06:08.300 on. And that was one of my first, um, red flags when I saw that on the website. So black men wanted, 1.00

01:06:15.060 they wanted to erase black men because they were going to protect our community. Men protect women 1.00

01:06:19.920 and children. So they erased us and then they wanted to insert the rainbow agenda. Now the rainbow 0.83

01:06:26.160 agenda is here. You see that with Bud Light, you see that with Target and so many other things.

01:06:30.500 We got Pride Month next month with, which we're co-opting. We're calling it, um, Strong Dad Month,

01:06:36.880 uh, Strong Dad June. So we're co-opting that, but with Target, Bud Light, that was created

01:06:47.980 using black energy, using black lives matter. So when you look at black lives matter falling apart 1.00

01:06:53.980 now, it's because the job's done. Can we just talk about that? Cause I think that is an element

01:06:59.260 of BLM that a lot of people don't know about. Like they, they did speak about, um, getting rid of

01:07:05.580 the nuclear family, getting rid of the heteronormative default, that there was sort of a quote,

01:07:12.080 queer agenda associated with black lives matter. And that wasn't publicized as much. I mean,

01:07:18.740 probably because of the reasons you pointed out a minute ago that the black community does tend to

01:07:22.320 be a little bit more conservative on a lot of these social issues. That's why Karl Rove used gay 1.00

01:07:27.100 marriage as a wedge to drive out the black vote in 2004 to get George Bush reelected. You know, 0.52

01:07:32.180 he understood that and it worked. Um, but this was a piece of BLM. So I see what you're saying when it

01:07:37.960 comes to, cause the target people might be confused because the target controversy is about them

01:07:42.120 putting weird trans clothing at the front of targets where little children can see women's 0.96

01:07:47.160 bathing suit with quote, extra material for the tuck. And it's not a black issue, but there was a

01:07:53.220 crossover with that group. Yeah. I've seen some of these, um, black leftist panels say things like 0.96

01:08:01.700 if you don't support trans people, then you're not for black people. So they have them. 0.71

01:08:10.420 I'm seeing that more and more. I'm seeing that more and more in the messaging hotel. Like,

01:08:14.120 you know, they don't, we have to boycott this company because they didn't stand up like Bud Light.

01:08:17.760 They didn't stand up for the LGBTQ plus and black community. It's like, wait, what? Wait, 0.99

01:08:23.040 how did, how did race get in there? Yeah. Um, matter of fact, if you ever look at,

01:08:28.160 there was a gangster named Bumpy Johnson in Harlem and Bumpy Johnson used to work for, 0.88

01:08:33.380 I forget her name, uh, Madam Saint something, but she was a lesbian. The black community had no 1.00

01:08:41.060 problem with gay people. Um, in fact, there's also, I want to say the Mark Marchese family. I forget. 0.93

01:08:49.500 There's another Italian family who protected the gays in New York city. Um, and, and really what it was,

01:08:56.860 it was the government that was oppressive against gays. It wasn't people. So we never really had

01:09:01.920 a problem with, you know, gay people at all. Um, so this is more of a fabrication. This is more 0.94

01:09:09.920 following Hegelian dialectic where they pretend like, okay, there's a huge problem. There's

01:09:15.400 violence against trans people. But when you look at the numbers, for example, with the gay community,

01:09:20.440 when you look at domestic violence, domestic violence is higher amongst same sex couples than

01:09:25.200 it is for, um, opposite gender couples. So when they look at the problems, I think the community

01:09:31.500 needs to look inward. When they look at violence with trans people, you have to look at those cases

01:09:36.100 because they're not being transparent with, uh, you know, whoever they're dealing with,

01:09:41.180 they're hiding what they are. And then when there's backlash for you hiding that you have a,

01:09:46.380 a thang thang between your legs, you know, now all of a sudden you're, you know, you're wondering why 0.98

01:09:51.240 you're getting punched in the eye. And I don't believe in violence. I wouldn't condone that, 0.98

01:09:54.600 but they, you know, they prey on people and then try to play victim. Um, but again, coming back to,

01:10:01.240 you know, BLM, the BLM website, again, introduced some of these terms like cis, heteronormative,

01:10:08.480 all these things. Like, I didn't know what cis was until BLM came about. And matter of fact,

01:10:14.540 it was, it was funny because when Bruce turned into Caitlyn Jenner, I said something about that

01:10:21.060 on Twitter. And then I was excoriated by a horde of Twitter accounts. And I went through the line

01:10:28.300 and I clicked on each one. And as I clicked on each one, they all had BLM in the bio. I said,

01:10:34.100 wait a second, what does trans people have to do with black people? And then again, on the website,

01:10:40.540 you saw affirming queer lies, affirming trans lies. And it was like, you know, I just said to myself, 0.97

01:10:47.680 you know, what does this have to do with being black? And you got to remember, I come from black

01:10:50.880 nationalism. So it's just, you know, in black national, we teach black first. We don't teach 0.92

01:10:55.800 gender first. We teach black first. And they were putting the queer agenda, the rainbow agenda ahead 1.00

01:11:04.120 of blackness. And that to me was a huge red flag. I'm like, okay, this isn't BLM. This is Bud Light 1.00

01:11:10.760 Lives Matter. So, you know, when that stuff started happening and started coming out and

01:11:16.780 well, I started, you know, exposing that and making videos, YouTube videos, warning the community what

01:11:23.980 it is now, but the black community, they totally see it. The Bud Light situation has been, I think,

01:11:31.160 really encouraging. You know, they really have been taught a lesson. I said the left wanted to

01:11:35.080 boycott them. They do. It's the right that's boycotting them because of the Dylan Mulvaney

01:11:38.540 thing. But the left in response is saying, well, they weren't supportive enough of Dylan Mulvaney

01:11:43.340 in the face of the storm. And therefore we need to boycott. I mean, it's like crazy, but something

01:11:47.520 similar is going on now with Target and Target, as I mentioned, put these, this clothing up front

01:11:53.700 celebrating pride month with the women's bathing suits with the extra material for you can tuck it,

01:12:00.600 which we don't need. Thanks, but no, thanks. We don't need it. And people are mad. And so now

01:12:05.780 down in some Southern states in particular, Target has agreed to move the merchandising

01:12:09.920 displays to the back of the store. And in the week since this controversy broke, this is for

01:12:15.500 the New York Post, Target has lost $9 billion in market value. Now it's not a loss unless they sell

01:12:23.240 their stock, you know, unless they actually have a sale, but it's dramatic with the consumers having

01:12:28.960 their say. A week ago Wednesday, their stock closed at 160.96 a share, giving them market

01:12:36.080 capitalization of $74 billion. Now it's down to $65 billion. A week later, this is the Daily Mail

01:12:43.360 reports that a major conservative investment fund is now boycotting Target because of this problem,

01:12:50.100 the pride collection that they're putting on display. And this, it's called American Conservative

01:12:54.300 Values and they are selling their target shares, adding them to a refuse to buy list. The founder

01:13:01.380 of this conservative investment fund says not only weren't they smart enough, Target, to stay apolitical,

01:13:06.880 they picked the wrong side. So it's getting kind of interesting because the conservatives are

01:13:13.480 learning how to send their own message, which we haven't seen in years. We haven't seen anything like

01:13:19.880 this. It's, it's accelerationism. This LGBT program was accelerated again via BLM, but these corporations 0.93

01:13:33.220 don't really care about the bottom line, the dollar. For some reason, it seems that they care about

01:13:42.860 the power of the agenda more than their profits, which is a violation, you know, to, to their

01:13:51.660 shareholders. You know, they're, they're supposed to do what's in the best interest of their

01:13:55.140 shareholders. They're playing a very dangerous game. And I think one of the dangerous games they're

01:13:59.940 playing is with their employees and their stores, because people are going to start revolting.

01:14:04.420 People are going to start rejecting some of this stuff, especially when you start inserting

01:14:08.440 kids into these conversations. When we look at DeSantis, Ron DeSantis and what he's doing in

01:14:13.960 Florida, there's been this notion that he's erasing black history. Now I saw some bins of some books

01:14:22.540 and I'm not sure if some of those should have been taken out or not, but I haven't read them. So I

01:14:26.560 don't know. But when I think about critical race theory, you know, it comes along with critical

01:14:32.660 race theory. And again, you know, black people are like needles and inside these needles are, 1.00

01:14:48.880 you know, formulations of LGBT ism. So they'll use us to inject it, you know, use us as a Trojan horse. 1.00

01:14:56.740 And that's what people are also rejecting. So, you know, when people have said, Hey, you know,

01:15:00.680 Ron DeSantis is racist and so on and so forth. I looked at the critical race theory curriculum,

01:15:08.600 the syllabus at some of these universities. I hadn't found anything in there that I would

01:15:14.320 like to teach my children. The only thing I found in there that I would like to teach my children is

01:15:19.600 what to avoid and what to look for in the agenda, in the Marxist agenda, the debauchery and the lechery.

01:15:26.400 And to be quite frank, this is about children. When we look at the rainbow agenda, it's to come 0.98

01:15:36.760 after children. We're starting to see reports of T people sexually assaulting children and so on and 0.96

01:15:44.420 so forth. But it's not about adults. It's about targeting children. These people are sickos.

01:15:51.640 These are the people that are hanging out at Epstein Island, et cetera, et cetera, pushing this 0.99

01:15:55.420 agenda because they want access to children. And that's why they want to teach their children this

01:16:00.660 stuff. I saw a clip from a cartoon that's teaching people about non-binary and gender and all this

01:16:07.640 stuff. So there's putting it on YouTube inside, you know, children's programs. You know, the other day

01:16:13.960 I was looking and my daughter was three years old and she's on her iPad and she's watching a program

01:16:21.320 and it's a dude in a dress with a beard. And I had to snatch the iPad away and I had to start putting

01:16:26.880 restrictions on it because this is the stuff that they're inserting in the children's program. So

01:16:31.440 the people have to understand is I don't care if you want to copulate with another adult, but the

01:16:38.820 real issue here is that they want your children. And you're starting to see that with Target where

01:16:43.100 they're putting this stuff near children. And that's the scary part.

01:16:48.100 Well, that's the problem. It's like, I don't, I'm not familiar with reports of a trans person

01:16:52.460 assaulting a child, although I'm sure it's just as possible as it is for a, you know, a cis person 1.00

01:16:58.340 to assault. I mean, people do bad things, but what they're doing in these hospitals, what they're

01:17:03.180 doing in these hospitals to these children is an assault. They're not able to consent. There's no such

01:17:08.220 thing as informed consent for a minor to have his penis chopped off or to have her breasts chopped 1.00

01:17:13.060 off. And the more of these companies who partner with hospitals like that, we just saw that too. 1.00

01:17:21.240 That's actually, I think, hold on. Yes. The latest on Bud Light is they're sponsoring a pride parade. 0.99

01:17:28.620 They're listed as a sponsor on the Cincinnati pride parade website, partnering with Planned Parenthood and

01:17:34.600 the Cincinnati Children's Hospital. Well, you might think that they're non-controversial,

01:17:38.940 but you would be wrong. They medically transition minors per the Daily Wire. And you need to be 0.89

01:17:47.340 careful as a company, especially when it's as much hot water as Bud Light is about who you hold

01:17:52.460 hands with. Planned Parenthood is, you know, controversial enough. Nevermind a hospital because

01:17:56.760 they don't all do this. That's performing these procedures on little kids, on young kids who are

01:18:01.660 unable to consent. But I'm encouraged by, you know, the right finding its voice. I'll tell you

01:18:07.020 something that interested me, and that's from the Washington Post, Greg Sargent, I mentioned at the

01:18:10.900 top of the show. Here's how he's spinning it. So the left is now looking at the right finding its voice,

01:18:15.420 right? And holding companies like Bud Light and Target accountable for surrendering on these things.

01:18:20.720 And this is, this is, I mean, this takes balls to write about this situation this way.

01:18:25.260 He says, targets surrender. And what he means by surrender is in a couple of Southern states,

01:18:30.060 they're moving the displays to the back. That's it. It's still, you know, the displays are still

01:18:33.880 going to be there. Their surrender, which came after concerted attacks from MAGA media personalities,

01:18:39.580 points to a bigger story. The anti-woke right is increasingly wielding heavy-handed tactics.

01:18:47.660 Hello, preacher, heal thyself. The left is the king of the heavy-handed tactics. They boycott everybody.

01:18:55.120 Okay, so he says, the anti-woke right increasingly wielding heavy-handed tactics,

01:18:58.120 including state power and violent threats, violent threats, to block corporations from making their

01:19:04.300 own decisions about how to adapt to social change. This, to me, Hotep, is like the, this is the

01:19:11.800 quintessential example of not understanding. That's you, sir. That's you, Greg Sargent, and your side

01:19:17.380 that's been doing that to corporations who don't submit to your agenda for decades now.

01:19:22.120 Yeah, straight out of Saul Alinsky's playbook, Rules for Radicals, blame your enemy for that which 0.94

01:19:28.520 you are guilty of. But this plan has been perfected since the Russian Revolution. You know, what we're

01:19:36.780 looking at today is Trotskyism and Marxism, mostly through intimidation. Now what we're dealing with

01:19:46.500 is online intimidation. They'll call and get you fired from your job and threaten your life. And

01:19:54.280 I don't mean, you know, threaten your life lethally, but basically trying to, you know, un-person you.

01:20:03.460 But this is, this is just, you know, genuine Marxist tactics. And then, of course, like you said,

01:20:10.840 they're going to blame the right for that. But it's just weird because they're trying to say that

01:20:16.660 they're, they're for democracy, right? Which means that the majority is going to rule. So if the

01:20:25.040 majority of people are saying, hey, we're going to reject what's happening in Target, we're going to

01:20:29.340 reject what's happening in Bud Light, then they should capitulate. You know, I just feel like we

01:20:35.600 should just find a spot on Epstein Island and just send all these people there. They don't belong,

01:20:40.840 uh, here in our society. They are a detriment to our society. They are dragging us down. They are

01:20:46.120 slowing down progress in America. They are killing the black community. I mean, every single policy 1.00

01:20:51.020 they put out, you know, it seems to be directly targeted at destroying the black community, 0.98

01:20:55.620 starting with minimum wage. There's nothing good that can come from a leftist mind. But I get it, 0.93

01:21:03.360 right? It's like you have a heart, you have a heart, but you ain't got no brain. 0.81

01:21:07.100 Well, unfortunately they're, they're in charge and their pressure stays on at maximum at 10

01:21:15.860 on all of these corporations. And you know, that's not going to stop. The more target gives

01:21:21.420 one inch, the more the left pressures them. And this guy from this conservative investment fund

01:21:26.520 is exactly right. Like they didn't have this march to just stay apolitical. That's all we're asking.

01:21:31.200 Just stay apolitical. And there was never much conservative backlash, at least not in the past

01:21:35.920 six, seven years or since Obergefell, the Supreme court decision legalizing gay marriage on, on the 0.55

01:21:41.960 gay pride thing. You know, it's a little over the top and gay rights were more controversial 15 years

01:21:47.340 ago, but come on, people aren't objecting to the rainbow flagging in target. It's the trans thing 0.98

01:21:53.860 in our kids faces and the co-opting of women's garments as some place to put your penis. I mean, 1.00

01:22:00.700 that's really the, that's, what's getting them in trouble.

01:22:02.680 Well, the thing is, this isn't political. It's cultural. Going back to what Andrew Breitbart

01:22:07.960 said, politics is downstream from culture and they understand this. They're trying to control

01:22:11.680 the culture. This isn't political. It's become political. The country has been split in two,

01:22:17.120 mostly because of the way mainstream media portrayed Republicans, conservatives, and Trump,

01:22:24.660 you know, from 2015 and on. And now how they're portraying DeSantis, you know, they've created

01:22:31.480 the great divide of our nation, but it's, it's like everything has become political,

01:22:38.660 but it's technically cultural. It's just that because of, um, pressure and, and, and, uh, peer

01:22:48.860 pressure and, you know, it's almost like they're holding people hostage. Cause if you talk against

01:22:56.980 this, for example, if you don't have your pronouns in your bio, your friends are saying to you,

01:23:01.540 are you racist? It's like, wait, what does pronouns have to do with, you know, are you a Republican?

01:23:06.820 Are you a Trumper? Like I have common sense. This has nothing to do with politics. It has nothing to

01:23:11.820 do with who I'm voting for. I don't want to deal in your mental illness. So it's not political, 1.00

01:23:18.000 it's cultural. And they made it political just to simplify things so that they can keep people in line.

01:23:24.060 Hmm. That's exactly what's happening with the NAACP thing on Florida, right? Like that

01:23:29.480 black people shouldn't go to Florida because it's racist. And then some people are dragging in 0.99

01:23:35.640 his policies, not only on not teaching critical race theory, uh, in K through 12 curriculum,

01:23:41.620 but also not talking about trans ideology or sexual orientation in curriculum in schools.

01:23:49.340 They're linking the two together back to what you were saying before. What do you make of that whole,

01:23:53.620 I mean, there's people aren't going to listen to that. They know that's a political

01:23:57.300 hit job. Yeah. It's, I mean, it's emotional, strong arming. They, they say, I saw an article

01:24:04.000 the other day on the route that said black people should be afraid of DeSantis. And I had to just

01:24:09.640 laugh at that. Right. And I think it was on his website, the route, but the route has been purchased

01:24:15.000 by Huffington post some time ago. Now, all you got to do is go on the route and type in, um, black,

01:24:21.720 immigration hurts the black community. So when the route first started out, it was more, 0.97

01:24:27.100 it was more black conservative. You'll start to see, you know, what black conservatism 0.74

01:24:32.800 look like organically in a, in a, in a, in a black community and not this political black 0.56

01:24:38.680 conservatism of, you know, the Candace Owens brand, but more like what it looks like without

01:24:44.460 politics, just conservatism as a culture. Now the route was talking about how immigration

01:24:52.560 was hurting black people. But then once the white liberal comes in and purchases the route, 0.95

01:24:57.780 then the agenda comes in. You have your, you know, your, your black liberals that come in and 0.66

01:25:03.540 they know what their master wants them to do. The master doesn't even have to tell him anymore.

01:25:08.260 They know exactly what the master wants. And it's basically the fear monger. And he want to make

01:25:13.720 black people afraid of Republicanism. They want to make black people afraid of the political party 1.00

01:25:21.120 that black people started. Because as Sonny Johnson says, the Democrats claim to be the party of the 0.94

01:25:28.620 poor, but you can't be the party of the poor if there is no poor. So they're, they're basically,

01:25:33.860 you know, they want to keep the black community poor. And how do you do that? You keep them irrational, 1.00

01:25:39.600 you keep them in fear and you don't keep, you don't, you do not allow them to think. It just

01:25:43.880 goes back to the old slave master, you know, a slave dynamic where he said, you know, you can't let

01:25:49.520 them think too much. Don't let them read. Don't educate them. The Democrats are the party of slavery,

01:25:55.660 but they've simply just evolved to where now it's just more mental slavery. And they don't want their

01:26:02.360 people thinking. They don't want black people thinking. They want to keep them in an emotional state, 1.00

01:26:07.560 a state of fear, just like the master. Keep them in a state of fear. They won't leave the

01:26:12.200 plantation. Keep them in a state of fear. They won't leave the Democratic Party. So now you have

01:26:17.920 DeSantis. He's the new boogeyman. We saw them out there protesting DeSantis in Florida. Why again?

01:26:24.900 Why? Oh, because you want to infiltrate children's minds with your Bud Light agenda. I get it. Can't pull

01:26:32.780 that one over on me. But, you know, the idea that DeSantis is, and it's almost like, in a way,

01:26:41.700 this is like helping Trump because they villainized DeSantis more than Trump because of the whole attack

01:26:49.300 on critical race theory. And, you know, he's saying he's erasing black history and whatnot. But the thing

01:26:53.740 is about that, like, it's not black history they're teaching. They're teaching white history. You know, 0.95

01:27:00.340 when they teach black history, it's always about, you know, what the white man did to the black man, 0.77

01:27:05.260 what the white man did to the black man. Okay. What about black people and just black history with 0.76

01:27:11.300 the omission of white people? They don't teach that. They can't teach that because if they did, 0.62

01:27:16.380 black people might stop voting for socialist policies and start to think that they can do

01:27:22.080 for themselves. But, you know, this whole attack on DeSantis just shows how desperate they are.

01:27:26.680 And it's just it's just quite frankly, you know what it is. It's kind of tired because it's the same

01:27:33.440 playbook they ran on Trump. It's intellectually dishonest. One of the things they criticize is that he

01:27:38.380 objected to this AP course in high schools on African-American history. And he reinstated the course once

01:27:45.600 they took out Kendi and the 1619 project as part of the curriculum. He didn't want it to be a politics

01:27:52.600 based, you know, leftist course. He would be happy to have actual history, actual black history and

01:27:59.820 American history taught and they just misrepresent. Last question on this. The Trump vote, Trump got,

01:28:07.300 I think it was 8% of the black vote in 2020, which was an improvement by, I think, two or three points

01:28:12.220 from where he was the time before. We saw better margins in places like Georgia,

01:28:16.580 where Governor Brian Kemp went from, I think it was, uh, eight, 5% to 12% of the black vote. So

01:28:24.460 that's, that's a decent headway, but it's still 12%. So how do you see this going, you know, over the

01:28:30.740 next 10, 15 years, do you think those numbers are going to continue to increase or do you think the

01:28:36.620 Democratic Party's control, like their, their hand on the black vote is just so established that 0.79

01:28:43.600 there's not going to be any meaningful shift? So, like I said before, not many black people vote,

01:28:52.120 less than half actually vote. So there are votes out there that can be won. It's not up to,

01:29:01.060 you know, the, the, the, the black vote is so easily won. It's conservatives that are dropping

01:29:07.700 the ball on this. It's the Republican party that's dropping the ball on this. The messaging

01:29:12.720 from the Republican party is terrible. I mean, just like F minus, minus, minus it's, it's, it's,

01:29:22.860 it's like, they don't even want to try and get the black vote and you can show them how to do it. 0.97

01:29:29.220 But the black vote is like the easiest vote to get right now because the black vote is sick of the 1.00

01:29:35.360 Democratic party. The throat, the black community for most of us throwing their hands up and like, 1.00

01:29:38.980 yo, I'm not, I'm not, I don't want to deal with any of these guys, which means there's an opportunity

01:29:43.300 to sell. And, you know, quite frankly, Republicans just suck at selling. They suck at their messaging, 0.99

01:29:48.920 suck at marketing. They have the wrong voices. They have the wrong black voices. I love Candace 1.00

01:29:54.080 Owens, but she's not reaching the black community. She's not turning anybody, anybody red. She's not

01:30:00.100 turning the black community red. And I love Candace. She's a very attractive woman, very smart woman,

01:30:04.060 very intelligent. I think she does an absolutely amazing job, but I'd like to see Sonny Johnson,

01:30:10.520 you know, be in charge of the messaging. Uh, but most of the part, you know, white conservatives,

01:30:16.460 their takes on all the events that happen that surround black people, their, their messaging

01:30:20.620 around Daniel Penny, their messaging around, um, George Floyd, you know, all these things. It just,

01:30:27.480 it just, frankly, it just sucks. And if you just make a few minor tweaks to the messaging,

01:30:33.300 you know, you can easily get the black vote. It's right there on a platter waiting for you. Black 1.00

01:30:39.760 men are ready to vote for a viable candidate. You saw what happened to Ice Cube. Ice Cube is a

01:30:46.760 prolific figure in the black community. And he was excoriated by the media when he went and sat with

01:30:52.940 Trump. Democrats didn't want to talk to him, but he came up with a plan and he wanted to talk to Trump,

01:30:58.000 et cetera, et cetera. You know, like for example, you know, I talk about reparations. Now I'm neither

01:31:03.340 for nor against reparations. In fact, I'm the black guy that goes, I want to make a case for

01:31:08.820 white people to get reparations. And I believe we can do it. Um, but when it comes to the reparations 0.85

01:31:13.920 conversation, the messaging from the right is terrible. It's like, Oh, black people shouldn't 1.00

01:31:18.360 do it. I don't want to pay the taxes, et cetera, et cetera. I'm like, bro, all you got to say is 0.99

01:31:22.660 Dems must pay. Democrats are the ones in charge of these communities. Democrats, the DNC, Hillary 0.51

01:31:31.440 Clinton, her gang should be coming out of their pocket for failing the black community. And that 0.81

01:31:37.440 is the messaging around reparations. All you got to is tell black people, Hey, listen, you want 0.93

01:31:41.800 reparations. It's a damn shame what those Democrats did to you. We should probably help you out, put 1.00

01:31:47.960 together some paperwork and sell reparations in a way that Democrats are beholden to making

01:31:53.620 these things happen. Biden. I mean, look, let's, let's run down the list. Biden and his crime bill,

01:31:59.160 Clinton and his crime bill. Um, Hillary Clinton had slaves. She exploited the 13th amendment 1.00

01:32:04.500 to have like legal, um, prison labor on her plantation. This is well, well, this is well 0.90

01:32:14.140 documented. All you got to do is go on Google, type in Hillary Clinton slaves, uh, at her home. 0.99

01:32:20.220 I showed this on my show the other day. Yes. Okay. I don't know anything about this, but, uh,

01:32:25.000 really long time. I feel like the, her GOP opponents would have seized on that one hotel,

01:32:30.960 but, but you're on the messaging. You're not wrong. And I don't think Republicans have even given it

01:32:35.980 much thought to be honest. I think they just get the vote. They couldn't get the vote. So they focused

01:32:41.220 on sort of their core constituencies, but those have been fractured over the past couple of election

01:32:45.340 cycles too. And anything's, anything's possible now, you know, I mean, the Republicans have

01:32:50.480 obviously a black candidate running. The Democrats have a black vice president. Um, things are being

01:32:55.840 equalized in a way that we haven't seen in the more recent elections on the GOP side. I mean, this,

01:33:00.120 the, the diversity in the GOP field right now is pretty astronomical. It's great. So we'll see

01:33:05.720 whether they get a little smarter and a little better at the reach out. In the meantime, can we ask you

01:33:09.920 to come back? I would love, love, love to have you back on. Oh, absolutely. Anytime you call me,

01:33:14.400 I'll be there. Thanks for listening to the Megan Kelly show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - May 26, 2023

DeSantis vs. Trump Fight Heats Up, and the Demise of Black Lives Matter, with Dave Rubin and Hotep Jesus ｜ Ep. 559

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