The Megyn Kelly Show - Elitist Maddow Smears MSNBC Bosses, and Culture Shift on Biological Reality, with Batya Ungar-Sargon, and Marcellus and Annemarie Wiley

00:00:00.600 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:12.220 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:15.500 Oh, we have a lot to talk about.

00:00:17.560 The fallout from Joy Reid's firing at MSNBC continues.

00:00:21.940 She signed off from the show for the last time last night.

00:00:24.920 I mean, you know, we are going to miss her in our own special way.

00:00:27.560 And her now former colleague, Rachel Maddow, never one to not be the center of attention

00:00:35.000 if she can find a way of injecting herself into a story, decided to deliver a monologue aimed directly at her bosses.

00:00:44.020 And this is the theme of what we saw.

00:00:47.760 I looked it up today just so I would know the actual definition.

00:00:51.340 Merriam-Webster, sanctimony, affected or hypocritical holiness.

00:00:59.520 Wikipedia describes sanctimony as a feeling or display of moral superiority.

00:01:07.560 Here's another one for you.

00:01:09.420 Self-righteous from Oxford.

00:01:12.080 A certainty, especially an unfounded one, that one is totally correct or morally superior.

00:01:24.180 I give you Rachel Maddow.

00:01:26.980 We will kick it off with Sot7.

00:01:29.440 In all of the jobs I have had, in all of the years I have been alive,

00:01:35.040 there is no colleague for whom I have had more affection and more respect than Joy Reid.

00:01:41.360 I love everything about her.

00:01:43.620 I have learned so much from her.

00:01:45.360 I have so much more to learn from her.

00:01:47.160 I do not want to lose her as a colleague here at MSNBC.

00:01:50.460 And personally, I think it is a bad mistake to let her walk out the door.

00:01:54.540 It is not my call, and I understand that.

00:01:56.480 I will tell you, it is also unnerving to see that on a network where we've got two,

00:02:02.080 count them, two non-white hosts in primetime,

00:02:05.020 both of our non-white hosts in primetime are losing their shows,

00:02:09.540 as is Katie Fang on the weekend.

00:02:12.640 And that feels worse than bad, no matter who replaces them.

00:02:16.160 That feels indefensible, and I do not defend it.

00:02:20.940 And I do not defend it.

00:02:22.460 It feels indefensible.

00:02:24.660 And I do not defend it.

00:02:27.480 Okay, she really is one of the most,

00:02:30.480 maybe she's the most annoying people on television.

00:02:34.500 She oozes sanctimony and self-righteousness.

00:02:38.900 And here's the real capper.

00:02:41.020 She took her boss's faces and rubbed them in shit last night.

00:02:46.700 That's what she did.

00:02:47.340 I, you, the guy who oversees, she's got two bosses now, right?

00:02:53.100 All right, she's got the first boss who's new.

00:02:55.220 I've got to look up her name because I don't remember her name.

00:02:57.720 What's her name, Steve?

00:03:00.280 Rebecca Cutler.

00:03:01.240 Okay.

00:03:01.660 Who answers to a different boss who's above Rebecca Cutler.

00:03:05.560 His name is Mark Lazarus.

00:03:07.120 His current title is prospective chief executive officer of Spinco.

00:03:10.780 That's Comcast plan spinoff of MSNBC, basically.

00:03:15.740 He's responsible for the company's networks.

00:03:17.480 Well, Rebecca and Mark, do you have any spines whatsoever?

00:03:23.740 Are you actually going to let an employee, that's what she is, Rachel Maddow,

00:03:28.960 talk about you, your company, and your decision-making this way?

00:03:34.880 Mr. Lazarus, do you have any testosterone?

00:03:38.880 Do you have any testicular fortitude to stand up for yourself as a professional and executive,

00:03:46.340 never mind a man, and tell this woman, you're fired too.

00:03:51.060 You're fired for insubordination and for disparaging the network publicly in front of our four viewers.

00:04:00.020 We're very upset about what they must now think.

00:04:03.720 Why don't you?

00:04:05.200 If one of my employees ever did this to me, let's say, you know, we start an MK network

00:04:09.920 and we have MK employees who go from being my producers to going out there and offering commentary.

00:04:14.560 It's happened in many places.

00:04:15.600 Um, and they did this, I would fire them so fast and I would not be, um,

00:04:22.980 you couldn't get me to back down with claims of, oh, you're, you're, you know,

00:04:27.960 it's viewpoint discrimination.

00:04:28.860 You're, you're cracking down on free speech.

00:04:30.700 No, you work for me that you work for me.

00:04:34.540 I'm going to give you my airwaves so you can go out there and rip on me.

00:04:37.380 No, that's not going to happen.

00:04:40.340 And look, it's one thing if you're in the middle of a whistleblower scandal.

00:04:44.320 All right.

00:04:45.060 You know, I actually thought it was to her credit when she called them out at NBC, at

00:04:49.200 NBC, when they were lying about not having the Harvey Weinstein story knocked down, that

00:04:55.100 was one thing, but just getting on to randomly disagree with their decisions and accuse them

00:05:01.660 of racism because you would have come to a different conclusion.

00:05:05.540 She should be fired.

00:05:07.000 They won't fire her because I don't say the P word, but they are a bunch of peas and they,

00:05:12.960 she's the only one who comes close to putting numbers on the board.

00:05:15.700 It's all relative, trust me, but you know, thinnest kid at fat camp and all.

00:05:20.820 And, um, so they're not going to fire her, but what she got away with on the air last night

00:05:24.640 was absolutely disrespectful and it was insubordinate.

00:05:29.660 And it is just evidence of how she is affected.

00:05:37.000 She, she is, she is somebody who evinces an affected or hypocritical holiness, a feeling

00:05:43.880 or display of moral superiority.

00:05:47.400 You really have to watch the whole five minute bit, but I'm going to take you through it.

00:05:50.820 Okay.

00:05:51.060 Before we have our guests come, um, she starts off by saying, I'm going to take a little

00:05:54.860 point of personal privilege here for just a moment.

00:05:57.340 If it is okay with you, well, we're your prisoners, Rachel.

00:06:00.220 So yeah, go ahead.

00:06:01.560 You may have already heard about these changes announced today, Miss NBC, the new president

00:06:05.480 of our network goes nameless.

00:06:08.540 Rebecca does not get a name.

00:06:10.420 Made it official today.

00:06:11.560 This woman just took over on February 12th, by the way, it's not her.

00:06:14.200 It's not her doing this definitely came from all the way up.

00:06:17.220 I, I guarantee you, this was a Comcast call.

00:06:19.580 This is probably Brian Roberts call.

00:06:21.560 Rumor has it that he couldn't stay on Jory Reed, which makes sense because she hates white

00:06:25.320 people and he is one.

00:06:26.860 So that's probably how that went down.

00:06:29.440 Brian Roberts is not a complete lunatic.

00:06:31.980 He's a businessman and he likes making money.

00:06:35.520 And that's why, you know, as long as MSNBC was doing well, he kind of let the machine go,

00:06:40.620 but now it's hemorrhaging money.

00:06:42.200 And so you start to take aim at the most annoying and weak actors first.

00:06:46.840 And that sadly joy is where you fell on both counts.

00:06:50.780 So it's not this woman, Rebecca's fault, but Rachel Maddow would like to go out there

00:06:55.280 and pillory all of them, including the new president who made it official today.

00:07:00.580 Some of the shows are moving, blah, blah, blah.

00:07:02.080 Then she wants everyone to be assured that she, she is, uh, here, she's going to be here five

00:07:11.580 days a week for the first hundred days of Trump's, Trump's presidency as planned.

00:07:17.060 Okay.

00:07:17.620 But as planned, I'm going back to just Mondays after I'm hell.

00:07:21.460 No, I'm not working five days a week on an ongoing basis.

00:07:24.000 Here's just a little of that in prime time.

00:07:28.200 Just so you know, I am here five days a week for the first hundred days of Trump's presidency

00:07:33.120 as planned and as planned, I will go back to just Mondays after that.

00:07:38.520 That is not changing.

00:07:40.780 Hell no.

00:07:41.860 Why would I change that?

00:07:42.840 I'm not working full time for my first 30 million and now $25 million a year.

00:07:48.220 She had to take a pay cut.

00:07:49.280 You see, maybe you've had to take a pay cut at your job recently, given the economy.

00:07:53.240 Did you go from 30 to 25 million and then act like you took one for the team?

00:07:59.240 Oh, little smallest violin from poor Rachel Maddow down to 25 million meager bucks a year.

00:08:05.860 But that's not changing.

00:08:07.040 I, I agreed to do first hundred days, five nights in the anchor chair, but I'm not agreeing

00:08:12.560 to come back full time because I'm Rachel Maddow and I run this network.

00:08:18.480 I run you, Brian, and I run you, Mark Lazarus, and I run you, Rebecca.

00:08:26.120 And if you don't like it, you can kiss my lesbian, white, fat ass.

00:08:30.280 That's really what she's saying.

00:08:31.700 And they will, they will because they have so far and they've let her get away with hell.

00:08:36.640 Okay.

00:08:37.220 She points out that Alex Wagner is not coming back at nine.

00:08:42.560 She will be a senior political analyst.

00:08:45.280 That's obviously a demotion.

00:08:46.460 I don't have to walk you through why.

00:08:48.180 Jen Psaki will take over doing the other four hours of Rachel Maddow's 9 PM.

00:08:55.300 She talks about Joy, who is not taking a different job at the network.

00:09:00.640 She's leaving the network altogether.

00:09:03.080 And that is very, very hard to take.

00:09:05.680 Very, very hard to take.

00:09:07.740 I'm 51 years old.

00:09:09.040 I have been gainfully employed since I was 12.

00:09:12.260 And I have had so many different kinds of jobs.

00:09:14.660 You wouldn't believe me if I told you, oh, are you just a woman of the people?

00:09:18.180 Why don't you tell us?

00:09:19.360 Walk us back to when you were a normal person.

00:09:21.780 Because now with your $30 million a year and your multiple homes for doing no work,

00:09:27.980 not many of us can really relate to you.

00:09:29.880 I'm going to be honest.

00:09:31.080 All right.

00:09:31.340 Miss, what was it, Stanford and Oxford Road Scholar.

00:09:36.460 It's possible you lost your tether to the normal people of the world, even if you want

00:09:43.400 us to believe you that you've had so many different kinds of jobs.

00:09:47.100 You wouldn't believe me if I told you.

00:09:48.800 Why is that?

00:09:50.280 We wouldn't believe you because you've become such an out-of-touch elitist snob that nobody

00:09:55.540 would understand if you had any sort of a working class experience in your background.

00:09:58.820 Uh, okay, she goes on, but in, I'll get to that in a second, Deb, but in all the jobs

00:10:05.120 I've had, in all the years I have been alive, there is no colleague for whom I have had more

00:10:11.620 affection and more respect than Joy Reid.

00:10:14.580 I'm going to tell you something.

00:10:15.920 I played part of this at the top.

00:10:18.000 This is over the top and I'm going to put it on the table.

00:10:21.280 I think it's racial.

00:10:22.620 I think she is saying this in, in the way people say some of my best friends are black.

00:10:29.400 It's, it's like, see how much I love my black colleague.

00:10:33.080 Listen to how she talks.

00:10:34.800 There is no colleague for whom I have more affection or more respect than Joy Reid.

00:10:40.980 I love everything about her.

00:10:43.860 I have learned so much from her.

00:10:46.660 I have so much more to learn from her.

00:10:49.980 Let me make sure I put myself in this subservient position to Joy Reid, because that is what

00:10:55.680 we do in the Robin DiAngelo field of being an anti-racist, the Ibram X. Kendi field of

00:11:01.620 being an anti-racist.

00:11:02.820 We just put on our listening ears, remember the girl and the white women for Kamala, and

00:11:08.900 we learn, we listen.

00:11:10.660 And God forbid we feel the need to correct a person of color.

00:11:14.840 We stop and take a beat because people of color can't be wrong and they can't be fired

00:11:20.820 either unless they are, in which case then everybody on the left side has to yell racism.

00:11:26.580 And also that they were my best friend and I greatly respected them more than anybody.

00:11:31.900 And I learned so much of them and I have more to learn.

00:11:34.780 Okay.

00:11:35.100 It's a form of self-flagellation and it's pretty obvious.

00:11:38.200 This is not how normal people talk about their colleagues.

00:11:42.560 She is doing this for effect.

00:11:45.880 Okay.

00:11:46.780 I do not want to lose her as a colleague here at MSNBC.

00:11:50.180 And personally, I think it is a bad mistake to let her walk out the door.

00:11:53.820 By the way, think of what like a fuck you, this is really to her network, which is paying

00:11:58.780 her the 30 million or 25 million a year.

00:12:00.740 Like who asked her?

00:12:03.200 She's not breaking news here.

00:12:04.540 She's just offering her opinion.

00:12:05.900 My employer fucking sucks.

00:12:07.100 And I think is actually kind of racist.

00:12:08.760 Like you needed to go on the air with that.

00:12:10.900 That's what a door is for.

00:12:12.300 You go and you knock on it and you talk to your bosses directly.

00:12:14.880 If you disagree with the decision that they have made, you're not, this is not the Pentagon

00:12:19.060 papers here.

00:12:19.900 This is not calling them out on their lies about Harvey Weinstein, which she did.

00:12:23.960 To her credit.

00:12:25.080 This is, I disagree with your decision.

00:12:26.620 And I think you're a racist.

00:12:28.360 Well, if you really think that, then you should not be working there.

00:12:30.600 Why don't you take your 25 million and walk sister, put your money where your mouth is.

00:12:35.000 You already have enough money to get you through the rest of your life.

00:12:37.440 If you're really so disgusted with a racism over there, and I'll get to more of her accusations

00:12:42.140 that her bosses are racist, then leave.

00:12:44.920 Why do you want to work for a bunch of racists, Rachel?

00:12:47.260 It's going to be that you have a tinge of racism inside of you as well, which is why you

00:12:50.320 feel the need to make such a big deal out of your friendship with the black co-host who

00:12:55.340 you respect more than anybody you've ever worked with ever.

00:12:57.980 Okay.

00:13:00.320 She goes out.

00:13:01.220 It's not my call.

00:13:02.320 And I understand that.

00:13:03.420 But that's what I think.

00:13:05.220 I will tell you, it is also unnerving, and you heard this up top, to see that on a network

00:13:11.380 where we have two, and she does the fingers, two, two, count them, two, non-white hosts

00:13:18.680 in primetime, both of our non-white hosts in primetime are losing their shows, as is Katie

00:13:24.540 Fang on the weekend.

00:13:25.780 And that feels worse than bad, no matter who replaces them.

00:13:29.400 That feels indefensible, and I do not defend it.

00:13:33.380 So we have two non-white hosts in the primetime.

00:13:38.220 I mean, not for nothing, but 7 p.m. is not primetime, where Joy Reid was.

00:13:42.000 The people in that slot like to say it is, but it's not.

00:13:44.960 Primetime is 8, 9, 10, and the people who have 11, they try to glom on to.

00:13:48.780 But really, primetime is 8, 9, 10.

00:13:51.060 Anyway, we'll count it for now.

00:13:52.580 So that's the one, Joy Reid, the non-white host losing her spot.

00:13:58.040 And the other one is Alex Wagner, who I actually didn't know what her ethnicity was exactly.

00:14:05.400 I looked it up.

00:14:06.500 Her father's white, and her mother is from Burma, from Burma, now Myanmar.

00:14:13.320 So she's Southeast Asian.

00:14:15.100 So she's half Southeast Asian, and she's upset about Katie Fang, who is also Asian American.

00:14:20.660 And that's ultimately just so ironic, right?

00:14:24.160 Of course, because it is the white liberals like Rachel Maddow, who have been making the

00:14:29.780 arguments that Asians don't count on the oppression scale, just ask the kids who had to bring that

00:14:34.760 affirmative action case against Harvard, saying, we're getting perfect grades, we're getting

00:14:39.600 perfect SATs and ACTs, we're getting tons of extracurriculars on our resumes, and none

00:14:44.140 of us can get into these schools because you discriminate against Asians.

00:14:47.400 And then we were told, well, you're not on the oppression roster, so that's why.

00:14:51.160 Get out.

00:14:51.780 We don't care about the Asians.

00:14:53.180 But now, now that one half Southeast Asian, and Katie Fang is Asian American, are getting

00:14:59.840 not fired, but just not allowed to sit in their anchor desk chair anymore, now that's

00:15:06.800 racist, too.

00:15:07.600 That's, here they count.

00:15:09.300 When Rachel needs to make a point, you're back on the list.

00:15:12.060 Congratulations.

00:15:13.400 Welcome back to Destitution Derby.

00:15:15.200 You are back in the running toward the overly oppressed.

00:15:19.380 Okay.

00:15:19.960 She goes on.

00:15:22.040 Okay.

00:15:22.600 This is where, now this, we kind of talked about her white guilt.

00:15:25.980 Now she's going to get to her rich guilt.

00:15:28.300 But there's just one other piece of it that you should know.

00:15:30.840 From your side of the TV screen, you low-life surfs out there, you will mostly see changes

00:15:36.000 in terms of who's in the anchor chair, the vaunted anchor chair.

00:15:39.580 Don't forget, remember the way they talked about themselves when they fired Ronna McDaniel?

00:15:44.160 The vaunted halls of NBC News.

00:15:48.100 Remember?

00:15:48.480 Remember Nicole Wallace?

00:15:50.240 She had the same badge as we did.

00:15:54.480 The disgust.

00:15:55.700 This is how they actually feel about where they work.

00:15:59.000 And actually, everybody who's going to be in the anchor chairs from here on out, they're

00:16:03.080 great.

00:16:03.480 They're great.

00:16:04.220 They're great at what they do.

00:16:04.980 You're not going to be disappointed at all in who's on our air and who you're seeing.

00:16:09.160 Oh, and by the way, we never covered the fact that, yes, two of the four hosts in, you

00:16:14.260 know, her version of primetime are women of color who are getting ousted.

00:16:20.520 Joy Reid's being replaced by three people of color.

00:16:23.920 Net, net, they have more now.

00:16:25.500 All right?

00:16:25.740 They have more.

00:16:26.780 So it's like Alex Wagner, half Southeast Asian, she's gone.

00:16:30.340 Well, a Latina's coming into the primetime who wasn't there before.

00:16:33.320 Joy Reid is leaving.

00:16:34.180 She's a black woman.

00:16:35.180 Well, two black people are taking over her spot with that Latina.

00:16:37.840 Now, so, I mean, if we're really just going to go by the numbers, Rachel, I think you've

00:16:42.520 increased your numbers.

00:16:43.620 Is that, how does it work?

00:16:44.980 Let's call in Ibram.

00:16:46.640 Let's call in Rachel, um, or whatever her name is, Robin.

00:16:51.460 Okay.

00:16:52.420 So she goes on.

00:16:54.080 Okay.

00:16:54.500 You're going to love everybody.

00:16:55.320 But one thing you cannot necessarily see, you people at home, is that the people who

00:17:00.740 get our show on the air, they're really, they're being put through the ringer.

00:17:06.140 Dozens, dozens of producers and staffers, including some who are among the most experienced and

00:17:11.100 most talented and most specialist producers in the building.

00:17:15.280 It doesn't really sound like a Rhodes Scholar.

00:17:16.560 Are facing being laid off, laid off.

00:17:21.040 I say there could be actual job losses here.

00:17:25.000 She's absolutely disgusted that now they are quote being invited to reapply for new jobs,

00:17:32.160 but that this has never happened at this scale in this way before when it comes to programming

00:17:36.820 changes, presumably because it's not the right way to treat people and it's inefficient and

00:17:44.320 it's unnecessary and it kind of drops the bottom out of whether or not people feel like this is a

00:17:49.420 good place to work.

00:17:50.740 And so we don't generally do things that way.

00:17:54.040 All right.

00:17:54.760 And she goes on.

00:17:56.260 But in the meantime, being put in this kind of limbo, the anxiety and the discombobulation

00:18:02.820 is off the charts.

00:18:05.020 It's off the charts.

00:18:06.160 And I'll get to that in one second.

00:18:07.700 So here she is trying to be like the person I, I feel for the little guy.

00:18:13.480 I'm the one who's not, I don't really care mostly about joy.

00:18:16.880 I care about joy's staff because they're the good people who are now wondering what's going

00:18:22.040 to happen to them.

00:18:22.520 And indeed they were told that they're laid off reportedly that they could reapply for a

00:18:27.060 new position on a different show.

00:18:28.460 But obviously NBC news had had it with the messaging coming off of that show at seven.

00:18:35.640 And they're a hundred percent right that not only did joy read need to go, but the whole

00:18:39.880 staff needed to go.

00:18:40.620 Obviously what kind of a lunatic would stay working for joy read if they did not believe

00:18:46.320 what she's saying?

00:18:47.040 I mean, as I said, not long ago, the woman tried to start a race war multiple times,

00:18:51.480 including right after Trump won.

00:18:53.160 There's just, yes, I'm sorry, but you all have to go.

00:18:57.220 You all have the stank of her racist viewpoints and hatred of America all over you.

00:19:04.600 Good luck getting any other job.

00:19:06.620 Maybe you'll find one at MSNBC, but Maddow's not wrong.

00:19:10.000 You probably won't find one if not there.

00:19:12.620 So yeah, but here's Rachel.

00:19:14.720 She's so upset.

00:19:16.220 She's so upset about the fact that there are layoffs.

00:19:18.620 Meanwhile, you know why there are layoffs?

00:19:20.940 You know why joy read finally lost her job?

00:19:23.340 You know why Alex Wagner lost hers?

00:19:25.440 Because of you, Rachel Maddow, because of you and your colleagues who completely destroyed

00:19:33.920 the credibility of your entire network.

00:19:38.280 You more than anyone did that.

00:19:42.280 Yes, joy read is a racist race baiter who hates the country, but you are the biggest conspiracy

00:19:49.580 theorist on television.

00:19:51.160 You're the one who pushed Russia, Russia, Russia, Russia, Russia, Russia, Russia for years, trying

00:19:59.960 to make it sound like you had special insights you could let us in on that only the great Rachel

00:20:05.020 Maddow could see through to.

00:20:06.920 And night after night, trying to drive up your numbers with a bunch of made up bullshit.

00:20:12.680 And the reason we know it was made up and it wasn't a good faith error, which can happen,

00:20:16.820 but didn't hear, is because you never owned it and you never apologized and you never corrected

00:20:22.700 the record.

00:20:23.980 Your network is imploding because you have lost the credibility of even your far left viewers.

00:20:33.520 They know you're bullshit.

00:20:36.340 They know your colleagues are bullshit.

00:20:38.400 They know you hate the United States, that you've been misleading them serially for years

00:20:44.700 now.

00:20:45.060 So I'm glad you feel sad that some staffers are getting laid off.

00:20:49.980 But if you're looking for someone to blame, look in the mirror, sister.

00:20:54.380 It's actually not the fault of the new woman, Rebecca, who took over two minutes ago.

00:20:59.340 It's your fault.

00:21:00.880 And it's absolutely Joy Reid's fault and Lawrence O'Donnell and Chris Hayes.

00:21:05.860 And you know what?

00:21:06.440 If we're going to play by your rules, why isn't somebody answering at MSNBC over the fact

00:21:10.900 that the two white guys and the white woman, Joy Reid, Rachel Maddow got to keep their jobs

00:21:16.380 and Jen Psaki, another white woman, got elevated into the primetime?

00:21:19.760 Why don't they have to answer for that?

00:21:21.080 Those are their rules.

00:21:21.960 Pure numbers.

00:21:23.280 DNC, they've got to count how many non-binaries are running for the top position.

00:21:26.940 MSNBC, you've got to account for every white man you leave in his role.

00:21:29.880 And if Rachel Maddow feels so bad about the numbers of whites in their primetime lineup,

00:21:37.220 you know what she can do, don't you?

00:21:39.480 You know what she can do.

00:21:41.140 She can ride her, whatever bike she rides, right off set and go home to one of her mansions.

00:21:51.840 She can leave.

00:21:53.200 She can quit.

00:21:53.860 Make room for a white person to leave the stage and open it up for a black anchor or a

00:22:00.800 Southeast Asian anchor to come in.

00:22:02.840 Someone, someone, dare I say, Rachel, maybe as good as you, maybe even better than you.

00:22:09.220 Maybe somebody you could respect even more than a Joy Reid.

00:22:12.060 She'll never do it.

00:22:13.820 She needs her power.

00:22:15.180 She needs to feel important.

00:22:17.080 She needs her $25 million a year.

00:22:19.840 She needs it.

00:22:20.980 But she's still a good person.

00:22:22.580 She's not an elitist snob because she's mentioning the little people who are being laid off as she

00:22:28.120 cashes her own check.

00:22:30.980 Let me tell you something.

00:22:32.040 I was cross from Rachel Maddow for years in the prime time of cable news at 9 p.m.

00:22:38.760 And I fucking crushed her.

00:22:40.620 She never came close to me.

00:22:42.080 But I know what it takes to put one of those shows on the air.

00:22:45.840 And you can do it with 11 or 12 people, 11 or 12 producers.

00:22:49.520 And that would cost Rachel Maddow or MSNBC maybe $4 million, maybe $4 million if you're

00:22:56.300 going by generous cable news salaries.

00:22:57.840 And she can afford that in about two weeks.

00:23:02.940 She's been making that 30, 25, you know, just took the pay cut, but $25 million a year.

00:23:06.920 She's been making that for at least eight years, I think, by my back of the envelope calculation.

00:23:12.160 She's got plenty of money.

00:23:14.020 After taxes, you know, New York City, you cut it in half.

00:23:16.360 So it's, what, 12 and a half for rounded up to 10 years on this 120, over $120 million in

00:23:23.000 the bank.

00:23:23.720 That's not earned.

00:23:24.560 That's net.

00:23:26.680 Why don't you want to save half of them?

00:23:29.360 You don't have to save.

00:23:30.000 Save half.

00:23:31.100 Do 2 million.

00:23:31.780 If you care so much, leave your post, open it up for a person of color, and why don't

00:23:37.160 you pay some of those salaries who MSNBC can no longer afford because of you, because of

00:23:44.560 your enormous salary, which is totally outsized to the numbers and results you produce.

00:23:51.180 Spare me your sanctimony and self-righteousness when you're not willing to actually do anything

00:23:57.700 about it other than go out there and virtue signal and try to act like a better person

00:24:03.920 than the lowly Rebecca and Mark Lazarus and Brian Roberts of Comcast, all the racists who

00:24:11.780 surround you.

00:24:13.280 It's a joke.

00:24:15.160 It's offensive.

00:24:16.880 She won't do it.

00:24:18.920 Then she goes on.

00:24:21.440 This is about how hard it is to be a member of the press right now.

00:24:26.720 They don't need this added stress, Comcast.

00:24:30.040 They're already having a difficult time enough in the wake of the Trump presidency.

00:24:35.280 Here's a bit of that.

00:24:37.300 Being put in this kind of limbo, the anxiety and the discombobulation is off the charts at

00:24:44.500 a time when this job already is extra stressful and difficult.

00:24:48.620 It is not news for me to tell you that the press and freedom of the press are under attack

00:24:53.160 in a way that is really, um, it's a big deal for our country.

00:24:57.980 It's very visceral for us here.

00:25:00.560 Okay.

00:25:02.160 So it's a very difficult time, very difficult time.

00:25:06.760 And the job is already stressful and difficult.

00:25:10.200 We're at Normandy.

00:25:12.160 That's she's, they're storming the beaches right now.

00:25:16.180 The Germans are up there.

00:25:17.860 They're firing from the cliff above and she's there in the boats coming up to the shores

00:25:24.020 to save the world.

00:25:26.700 That's how she sees herself.

00:25:28.600 That's how these other leftist so-called journalists see themselves.

00:25:31.940 And that's what she's talking about.

00:25:33.280 It's very hard to save democracy.

00:25:35.080 We've got a tyrant dictator autocrat in the white house and press freedoms are being eroded

00:25:41.300 censorship around every turn.

00:25:43.760 Oh wait, no, that was Joe Biden.

00:25:45.580 Where were you then again?

00:25:46.700 What did I know?

00:25:47.940 Did you, oh, that wasn't, that wasn't stressful.

00:25:51.180 That was not difficult, right?

00:25:52.300 Because you were asleep at the switch.

00:25:53.840 So we had four years of fake Russiagate claims.

00:25:56.140 Then we had a sleep at the switch and people at your network telling us that it was the best

00:25:59.900 Joe Biden ever, ever in March of 2024 saying that then Trump won and it's Normandy.

00:26:10.460 You're back at it.

00:26:11.420 It's very stressful.

00:26:12.620 I'm sure it's very difficult for you, Rachel, with your ability to have a masseuse waiting

00:26:16.720 for you at home every night before you go to bed, to have a bed full of gold bars awaiting

00:26:23.540 you.

00:26:24.460 I'm sure it's really stressful for you journalists over at MSNBC.

00:26:30.680 And then she says, okay, what pains me, what pains us here the most is not what happens

00:26:37.940 to us.

00:26:38.960 That's 100% false.

00:26:40.080 That's exactly what pains her the most.

00:26:41.320 She cares mostly 100% what happens to her.

00:26:44.080 It's what happens to our coworkers on whom we depend and who you don't necessarily know,

00:26:48.920 but we respect and love them and depend on them.

00:26:51.060 See, I love you.

00:26:51.840 I love you.

00:26:52.220 Don't go to page six with nasty stories about me.

00:26:53.840 I love you, even though I can buy and sell you.

00:26:57.120 And did I mention we respect them?

00:26:58.380 Again, she throws in, this is a difficult time in the news business, but it does not need

00:27:03.080 to be this difficult.

00:27:04.600 We welcome new voices to this place and some familiar voices to new hours.

00:27:07.840 Okay, and then she finishes up with, look, I believe, and I bet you believe that the way

00:27:16.260 to get there, like to get to growing the audience and to staying here forever on MSNBC is by treating

00:27:23.300 people well, finding good people, good colleagues, doing good work with them and having their back.

00:27:30.200 Should we have the back of racists on television?

00:27:34.920 Rachel, is that a good policy?

00:27:36.700 Should we have the back of the Joy Reads of the Tiffany Crosses?

00:27:40.080 Or are we allowed to say they've gone too far?

00:27:42.420 They've offended more than half the country.

00:27:44.880 They've offended large swaths of the black community, nevermind the white community.

00:27:49.980 Are we allowed to ever say that?

00:27:51.480 Or they're black and they're fired and that's a problem for you.

00:27:54.660 Then we didn't have their back.

00:27:56.000 We betrayed them.

00:27:57.060 There was a disloyalty problem by the bosses.

00:27:59.680 And she says here, so I believe we could find these good people, good colleagues, and do

00:28:04.300 good work with them and have their back and that we could do a lot better, a lot better.

00:28:11.680 I wonder how Ronna McDaniel feels about Rachel Maddow having her back.

00:28:15.300 Did she have the back of that good colleague?

00:28:18.060 Did she stand up for a Republican who, in the most mild and milquetoast ways, got behind some

00:28:23.960 of Trump's election questions, but it was a bridge too far to wear the vaunted NBC News badge?

00:28:29.940 I don't remember her having her back.

00:28:33.180 And Rachel Maddow trying to say what pains us the most is not what happens to us is a lie to.

00:28:39.600 The reason she won't give the $4 million or the $2 million to save any of those jobs,

00:28:43.080 and she doesn't have to cut him a check, she could actually just take it out of her current

00:28:47.000 salary.

00:28:47.600 She could just reduce her salary from $25 to $23.

00:28:51.200 Could you make do on $23 million, Rachel?

00:28:53.080 Could you do it?

00:28:53.860 Like, seriously, if you went in there, why don't you do the Tom Brady, right?

00:28:56.800 Didn't Tom Brady go in there?

00:28:57.820 I don't know anything about sports, as you know, but I believe he went in there at one

00:29:00.140 point and said, I'll take a cut so that I can save my offensive line.

00:29:04.360 That's what you actually do if you care about your supporting teammates, as she claims she

00:29:09.540 does.

00:29:10.160 You know why she won't?

00:29:11.840 Because she's got bills to pay and her lifestyle is too important to her.

00:29:16.360 Rachel Maddow currently, according to my calculation, and I'm sure it's much more, has a $10

00:29:21.240 million penthouse, penthouse, I say, on the Upper East Side, where her neighbors are Jodie

00:29:28.320 Foster and Barry Manilow at some point.

00:29:32.240 It's got, according to its listing that she owns, breathtaking views of Central Park and

00:29:37.540 the city sideline.

00:29:39.600 It's got not one, but two private terraces, including one right off of her master bedroom,

00:29:46.680 where she can go.

00:29:47.520 And that's the right term, because she can go out there as master and say, oh, let them

00:29:53.120 eat cake.

00:29:54.320 I expressed how badly I feel for them.

00:29:57.680 I said I respected them.

00:30:00.720 I, oh, Bitterman, bring the car around, please.

00:30:02.740 Because that's her life.

00:30:05.400 Then on the weekends, she jets off to Western Massachusetts to what is described as a pre-Civil

00:30:12.260 War farmhouse, which has both a main house and a decked out bathhouse, complete with spa.

00:30:19.060 This is the bathhouse, spa and beds and other accoutrements.

00:30:23.900 Well, it's so special.

00:30:25.820 It got its own spread in New York Magazine, built in 1869, and her small, this is just

00:30:31.000 the, again, the bathhouse.

00:30:32.120 This is not the main house you're looking at, which she didn't put on camera.

00:30:35.280 So this house that she owns in Western Mass is built in 1869, and in one of the most expensive

00:30:40.720 states in the Union, sits on 12 acres.

00:30:44.720 Maybe you could have one of the staff go stay in the bathhouse.

00:30:49.600 Maybe you could have a little retreat where they get to ride their bicycles around your 12

00:30:53.560 acre estate.

00:30:56.060 Maybe you could let them come and enjoy some cocktails, some farewell cocktails on your

00:31:00.740 double terraces, and then look at them and say, but at least I feel bad about it.

00:31:05.600 I feel really sad about what's happening to you and how hard it is to be me, meaning a

00:31:10.000 journalist in 2025 under Trump, Normandy.

00:31:13.820 She is full of shit.

00:31:16.340 She's self-righteous and sanctimonious, and everyone knows it.

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00:32:30.080 Joining me now with reaction, Batya Angarsargan.

00:32:33.060 She's a columnist.

00:32:33.900 Now for the free press, which is a great move out of the disgusting Newsweek week, which did

00:32:38.480 the most vile piece I've seen in recent history on this mass murder of a family in Connecticut.

00:32:45.700 It happened about a month ago.

00:32:47.020 Before I bring Batya on, I just want to tell you this.

00:32:49.240 It was the Pettit family, and this father and mother and their two daughters were attacked

00:32:54.200 by these two monsters.

00:32:56.440 These two guys laid in wait.

00:32:57.840 They followed the mother and the daughter, saw them grocery shopping, then laid in wait,

00:33:02.260 went into the house and tied them up, got the mother in the morning to go to a bank, got

00:33:07.460 the mother to make a withdrawal.

00:33:08.740 The mother said, while in the bank, I'm being kidnapped.

00:33:12.080 The bank teller did wind up calling the police, but by the time the cops got there, within

00:33:16.820 38 minutes, I think it was, the mother had been killed.

00:33:19.920 The father managed to escape last minute, and both daughters, 17 and 11, had been killed.

00:33:25.740 One burned.

00:33:26.620 They were burned alive after they raped the 11-year-old.

00:33:30.920 And Newsweek took the opportunity, within the last 30 days, to do a sympathetic piece

00:33:37.480 on one of the two killers facing, he's in jail for the rest of his life, and how he

00:33:42.080 is now a she, and how he is going to be suing for his gender-affirming care to be paid for.

00:33:48.700 And I just want to tell you something.

00:33:49.840 We taped an hour on this.

00:33:51.240 It was an extra that we released sometimes on the show.

00:33:53.320 We did a whole hour on this.

00:33:54.520 And I said to the team when it was over, we can't release it.

00:33:58.100 And they said, why?

00:33:59.040 And I said, because I was too angry, and it was too dark.

00:34:03.200 It was so dark, going through the details of that horrific crime.

00:34:07.300 And I call out the writer by name, and I call out Newsweek by name.

00:34:11.840 And I didn't, it's not Batia's fault, but I said, I can't believe they have somebody as

00:34:15.260 good as Batia working at this disgusting publication that did this.

00:34:19.480 And I didn't, I just never released it, because it was so dark.

00:34:24.880 I actually would love to get your thoughts on whether that's something you even want

00:34:29.160 to hear.

00:34:30.520 You can email me, megan at megankelly.com.

00:34:32.780 But in any event, I'm thrilled that Batia has gone over to the free press, which has absolutely

00:34:39.200 nothing in common with the vile Newsweek.

00:34:42.300 Batia's the author of the book, Second Class, and she's back with me today.

00:34:46.120 Batia, great to see you.

00:34:47.540 Thank you so much for having me, Megan, and for all those kind words.

00:34:50.700 I absolutely adore you.

00:34:51.440 I saw you at CPAC, and I have never seen a crowd that in tune with a speaker.

00:34:58.280 It was brilliant.

00:34:59.520 And thank you so much for having me.

00:35:01.700 Oh, thank you.

00:35:02.620 And honestly, I mean, I know you had some good times at Newsweek, and not everything they

00:35:06.680 do is bad.

00:35:07.100 But what they did was such an egregious sin.

00:35:09.280 I just, I find it unforgivable.

00:35:10.980 And I'm thrilled you're no longer there.

00:35:13.100 They don't deserve you.

00:35:14.460 Um, okay, so your thoughts on Rachel Maddow, the, on the beaches of Normandy, also on her

00:35:23.820 two terraces on Central Park, looking out at her city and her park views.

00:35:28.800 But it's a very difficult time to be a journalist.

00:35:31.900 I think it's so important that you called out the economic aspect here, because this is

00:35:42.440 really what the Democratic Party has become, which is, you know, Rachel Maddows and AOCs

00:35:50.060 and other elites making themselves the main story when the American people are hurting,

00:35:58.060 and the American people are desperate for some kind of representation, desperate for

00:36:02.360 service, and are constantly asked instead to extend empathy to, in people like Rachel

00:36:09.540 Maddow's case, very wealthy people.

00:36:12.200 And the point I would make, Megan, is that the fact that she's so rich and the race baiting

00:36:19.980 are not actually independent of each other, but they're really two sides of the same coin.

00:36:27.180 And this is what my first book, Bad News, was about, which is that the wokeness, this idea

00:36:33.000 that somehow, you know, gender or race are determinative of value instead of right versus

00:36:42.160 wrong, right?

00:36:43.600 This woke ideology is itself a smokescreen for the fact that the Democrats created an

00:36:52.520 economy, which is an upward transfer of wealth from hardworking, working class Americans into

00:37:00.520 the pockets of the elites, not just billionaires and millionaires like Rachel Maddow, but, you

00:37:06.640 know, the top 20%, that over-credentialed college elite, who now have a lock on over 50% of the

00:37:14.320 GDP and are the only ones in America who are really guaranteed the American dream.

00:37:19.120 So how did this happen?

00:37:20.220 Well, for 50 years, the Democrats implemented economic policy, which was wage theft of working

00:37:28.680 class people.

00:37:30.060 There is a great article in the New York Times that really, really, really portrays this well

00:37:34.940 about how the Hamptons is in an uproar that their slave caste is going to be deported.

00:37:42.920 And these people with absolute seriousness are like, who is going to cut our grass?

00:37:50.180 We are so compassionate.

00:37:52.540 Leave them here.

00:37:53.340 And they don't realize that what they're saying is, my God, we might have to pay an American

00:37:58.740 a living wage, right?

00:38:00.200 This is the Democratic Party, okay?

00:38:03.220 So how do they hide this from the American people, that they are rich and they want indentured

00:38:09.220 servants to clean their homes so they don't have to pay Americans a living wage to do it?

00:38:14.600 They latched onto this woke ideology of race and gender where they said, oh, we don't want

00:38:25.040 open borders because we want slaves.

00:38:27.880 We want open borders and you guys are racists if you oppose it.

00:38:33.820 We are the compassionate ones and you are the racist ones.

00:38:37.720 We are the ones who support Joy Reid.

00:38:40.420 If you criticize her, you are racist.

00:38:43.620 We are the ones who support Rachel Maddow.

00:38:45.900 If you criticize her, you are anti-gay.

00:38:49.120 They used the woke ideology to portray themselves as the good guys while they were robbing their

00:38:57.900 neighbors blind and calling them racist and sexist to hide their crimes.

00:39:05.560 This is who the Democratic Party is.

00:39:07.400 And what we're seeing now with the firing of these people, and obviously, you know, Rachel

00:39:12.320 Maddow refused.

00:39:13.160 You're totally right.

00:39:14.180 That whole speech last night, all the only thing people should take away from it is that

00:39:18.080 she refused to actually resign in protest, right?

00:39:21.380 Like that's the thing that happened there, right?

00:39:23.860 What we're seeing now is if the wokeness took a worldview that Americans used to have based

00:39:29.900 on the difference between right versus wrong and replaced it with a worldview based on powerful

00:39:36.040 versus powerless, race, white versus black, straight versus gay, right?

00:39:41.720 And whoever is a person of color or gay is inherently virtuous because they have less power.

00:39:46.380 And whoever is white is inherently evil because they are the oppressor.

00:39:50.320 We are now seeing with the firing of these people a return on the part of the American

00:39:56.280 people to a worldview based on right versus wrong and common sense, which has been ushered

00:40:02.900 in by the mass support for President Trump from minorities and from working class people

00:40:09.600 of all races.

00:40:10.420 We're entering a new unified moment of average Americans reclaiming what they know is their

00:40:18.560 right to a worldview based on right versus wrong, their right to define who they are as

00:40:24.060 good people and just the absolute silencing of this garbage from the woke elites who are

00:40:30.900 also not coincidentally all millionaires.

00:40:33.800 Yeah, that's so true.

00:40:36.520 I want to play the Jane Fonda soundbite from the SAG Awards the other night, which encapsulates

00:40:41.660 a lot of this too.

00:40:42.520 But I've got to spend a minute on that New York Times article.

00:40:45.120 We read this as a team over the weekend and we were all like, thank God Bacia is here on

00:40:49.400 Tuesday.

00:40:49.860 We cannot wait to talk about this with Bacia.

00:40:52.220 It's worth quoting from.

00:40:53.340 Okay.

00:40:53.560 So the headline is in the New York Times, they helped make the Hamptons the Hamptons and now

00:41:00.620 they're living in fear.

00:41:02.940 Sub headline, Latino immigrants care for some of America's most lavish beachside mansions.

00:41:09.380 Their disappearance would affect the wealthy too.

00:41:12.680 By Dion Searcy, reporter who writes about wealth and power and Anna Lay, who covers mass

00:41:19.800 transit in New York.

00:41:20.840 Okay.

00:41:21.120 Some samples.

00:41:22.680 Wealthy residents of the Hamptons demand perfection.

00:41:25.720 Now, many of the people who make it so, Latino immigrants, some of them undocumented,

00:41:29.620 are panicking about President Trump's deportation orders.

00:41:33.240 The fear is on display outside a convenience store where day laborers sprint into a nearby

00:41:36.980 field when a stranger approaches.

00:41:39.260 It is present in the nervous apologizing of a longtime housekeeper when she interacts

00:41:44.280 with police after a minor automobile scrape.

00:41:47.240 And it courses through a small encampment in the woods where a landscaper is awaiting warmer

00:41:51.520 weather so he can start cutting grass again to send money home to his family in Mexico.

00:41:54.520 Obviously an illegal.

00:41:55.300 Tom Homan, alert.

00:41:57.280 In the Hamptons, with miles of privet hedges and luxury homes, Latino immigrants make up

00:42:01.840 the bulk of the workforce, logging 12-hour days, flipping mattresses, scrubbing toilets

00:42:05.820 and hanging drywall.

00:42:07.280 And in the summer, tending vineyards and assembling patio furniture under the hot sun.

00:42:11.360 Some arrived illegally, crossing the U.S. border after grueling desert or jungle treks.

00:42:15.980 Some have legal working papers but are worried they could be swept up in raids or that their

00:42:20.300 undocumented family members and friends could.

00:42:21.940 Some believe Trump is going after criminals, others aren't sure.

00:42:26.120 In the town of East Hampton, which encompasses many of the villages at the East End, Latinos

00:42:29.220 make up more than a quarter, blah, blah, blah.

00:42:31.040 Okay, then they go on.

00:42:33.040 Uh, bah.

00:42:33.940 Okay.

00:42:34.640 Some of the wealthy are quietly beginning to make calculations about what it would mean

00:42:38.960 if their undocumented workers were deported.

00:42:42.080 Who would mow the lawn?

00:42:44.080 Everyone relies on housekeepers and carpenters and tree cutters and grass cutters, said Merit

00:42:48.680 Mullen, founder and executive director of Hamptons Community Outreach.

00:42:52.020 People come to the Hamptons to enjoy their houses.

00:42:54.300 And who is going to take care of them now?

00:42:57.440 It's amazing, Batya.

00:43:00.960 It's amazing.

00:43:02.060 And the piece explores how a lot of these people, a lot of the illegal immigrants, are

00:43:06.880 living in encampments in the woods.

00:43:09.200 Because, of course, they can't afford a home or even to rent on the Hamptons.

00:43:13.080 Their indentured servants are literally homeless.

00:43:17.920 They're day laborers.

00:43:19.420 And they are fighting to keep their slaves as if they are walking across the Edmund Pettus

00:43:26.180 Bridge with Dr. King.

00:43:28.360 It is so absolutely disgusting.

00:43:32.780 Everyone has to read this article because they just have zero sense of, you know, no awareness

00:43:39.620 of how this would come across to an average American.

00:43:42.560 And, Megan, I'll just give you one data point.

00:43:45.680 There is not a single industry in America that is a majority illegal immigrant.

00:43:52.620 Not one.

00:43:54.340 Not a single one.

00:43:55.520 Which means that every time a Democrat says they're doing the jobs an American doesn't want,

00:44:01.780 they are insulting millions and millions and millions of Americans who get a lot of dignity

00:44:09.860 from cleaning toilets or doing farm work or any of the other number of mowing the lawn

00:44:16.900 that these rich Democrats would rather kill themselves than do.

00:44:21.560 And I think that's the key here.

00:44:22.840 I mean, it's hilarious and it's infuriating that they call people racist who call them out

00:44:27.520 for this.

00:44:28.280 But at the end of the day, the Democrats' version of the economy is they want everybody

00:44:33.580 who they care about, all of their, you know, college-educated, professional managerial elites

00:44:38.460 to be making, you know, $250,000 a year.

00:44:41.980 They want all manufacturing shipped overseas to China and all of the service industry jobs

00:44:47.520 to be done by slaves who are brought here by cartels.

00:44:50.460 That's their model of the economy.

00:44:52.900 They're going to pay off working class people to stay home.

00:44:55.020 The people who live in the woods who mow their lawns and scrub their toilets, they don't

00:44:59.980 get paid a real salary.

00:45:03.080 They don't have a paycheck.

00:45:04.940 They're all paid cash under the table so that these people don't have to pay any sort of employer

00:45:11.440 worker insurance and so that they can pay them this lower wage that the immigrant takes

00:45:17.580 the full balance of, that that person doesn't have to pay taxes on it.

00:45:21.240 So both parties understand they're going to have to pay less.

00:45:23.420 Believe me, I had lots of people who suggested to me when I was younger and needing nannies,

00:45:29.200 you know, when my kids were little, oh, here's this woman, but she wants to get paid under

00:45:32.060 the table.

00:45:32.780 No, I said, no, no, no, no.

00:45:36.120 We're not doing that.

00:45:37.740 And I paid everybody.

00:45:39.480 I mean, I'll never fail an audit because all of anybody who's ever helped me has gotten

00:45:43.920 paid over the table.

00:45:45.260 And yes, you then have to pay a little more because you want somebody who's great and you

00:45:49.840 want their net salary to be competitive for them, to be a living wage that they can actually

00:45:55.140 enjoy life with or they will find somebody else to work for.

00:45:58.380 And it does cost more.

00:45:59.260 I could have gotten lots of folks who were undocumented to work for me for a cheaper

00:46:02.940 wage, but I didn't do it.

00:46:04.940 But these people in the Hamptons who have more money than I do, way more money than I

00:46:08.620 do, there's a home out there worth four hundred and fifty million dollars.

00:46:12.100 They don't know.

00:46:12.960 I'm not talking about this particular owner, but I'm saying people like that who are in

00:46:15.940 this article don't want to have to pay their they're scrimping and saving every last dime

00:46:21.740 and they don't want to pay it to an American who, yes, might cost a little more, especially

00:46:27.760 because you'd have to pay him over the table.

00:46:30.460 That's exactly right.

00:46:31.420 And you will be surprised to know who the last Democrat to admit this was.

00:46:35.060 It was Bernie Sanders in 2015 when Ezra Klein asked him in an interview, he said, you care

00:46:41.300 so much about the poor Senator Sanders.

00:46:44.020 Shouldn't we have open borders?

00:46:45.940 And Bernie's response was he went like this.

00:46:48.500 And Megan, I'm going to do my Bernie Sanders impression only for you.

00:46:51.320 Yeah, he went open borders.

00:46:54.740 That's a Koch brothers proposal.

00:46:57.360 He was horrified.

00:46:58.860 He went on to say the Koch brothers would love that.

00:47:02.080 Have an open border, pay people two, three dollars an hour.

00:47:05.280 And then he went, I don't believe in that.

00:47:07.740 He said, I believe in paying American workers.

00:47:10.340 And the point I would make about this is Lori DeRiemer, the President Trump's labor secretary

00:47:20.320 pick.

00:47:21.300 She made this point that an open border hurts the working class.

00:47:25.440 This used to be the Democrats view.

00:47:27.680 And now watch as every every Democrat, including Senator Sanders, are going to vote against

00:47:32.440 her.

00:47:33.040 Tulsi Gabbard was raked over the coals for opposing war and opposing spying on Americans.

00:47:40.140 These used to be left wing positions.

00:47:42.420 Now they're Donald Trump's positions.

00:47:44.500 And so every single Democrat voted against her again and again with these picks.

00:47:50.300 You see Donald Trump pushing views, great views, sensible views, views that represent where

00:47:56.640 the American people are at.

00:47:58.640 And because he's pushing them, the Democrats have turned on them.

00:48:02.900 There is not a single principle that the Democrats would not abandon if they thought Trump liked

00:48:08.420 it.

00:48:08.660 And it is just such an amazing moment to see the gap between the elites in that party and

00:48:14.700 the unity of the American working class supporting this agenda.

00:48:18.060 I give you Jane Fonda the other night at the SAG Awards, where she was given a Lifetime

00:48:24.420 Achievement Award.

00:48:26.100 Make no mistake.

00:48:27.240 Empathy is not weak or woke.

00:48:29.560 And by the way, woke just means you give a damn about other people.

00:48:32.960 Any of you ever watched a documentary of one of the great social movements like apartheid

00:48:39.600 or our civil rights movement or Stonewall and asked yourself, would you have been brave enough

00:48:46.340 to walk the bridge?

00:48:48.620 Would you have been able to take the hoses and the batons and the dogs?

00:48:54.840 We don't have to wonder anymore because we are in our documentary moment.

00:49:01.180 This is it.

00:49:03.760 And it's not a rehearsal.

00:49:06.920 This is big time serious, folks.

00:49:10.800 So let's be brave.

00:49:12.980 This is a good time for a little Norma Ray or Karen Silkwood or Tom Joad.

00:49:19.020 We must find ways to project an inspiring vision of the future.

00:49:23.260 She says woke.

00:49:25.720 It just means being nice to people.

00:49:27.760 That's what it means.

00:49:28.420 You're virtuous.

00:49:29.520 In other words, Batya.

00:49:30.580 And this we're basically in the middle of the civil rights movement again, thanks to Trump.

00:49:34.620 These people are so disgusting because we are in a new civil rights era.

00:49:40.640 We are in a new era in which minorities are going to flourish and women are going to flourish.

00:49:46.100 But it's the MAGA movement and they just can't see it because they are high on their own

00:49:51.720 supply and they hate working class people.

00:49:55.480 This is all hatred of the American working class.

00:49:59.260 And she's I mean, not only is she rich in her own race, a fonda and a successful actress,

00:50:03.000 but she was married to Ted Turner.

00:50:04.220 She was married to Ted Turner for many years, I think for a decade.

00:50:08.240 She's got plenty of dough to throw around.

00:50:10.060 More with Batya on the opposite side of this break.

00:50:11.680 Don't go anywhere.

00:50:12.200 So many people these days are super focused on their health, right, on eating healthier

00:50:17.140 and living healthier.

00:50:18.340 And in that vein, let me tell you about Jacob and Kristen, the founders of We Heart Nutrition.

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00:51:13.320 Go to weheartnutrition.com and use the code Megan for 20% off.

00:51:18.440 That's weheartnutrition.com, code M-E-G-Y-N.

00:51:22.080 That my show had value and that, I'm sorry, that what I was doing had value, had value.

00:51:36.820 And then it mattered.

00:51:37.920 Where I land is that the moment of guilt that I felt that I went hard on so many issues,

00:51:45.060 whether it was the Black Lives Matter issues of a young baby or a mom or a dad that was

00:51:51.980 killed, went hard for immigrants who've done nothing but come to this country like my parents

00:51:56.600 did, or whether we've talked about what the president is doing that is subversive to the

00:52:02.280 Constitution, defending books that people find inconvenient.

00:52:07.160 And yes, whether it's talking about Gaza and where I come down on that is I'm not sorry.

00:52:13.060 I am not sorry that I stood up for those things because those things are of God.

00:52:20.560 I'm not sorry.

00:52:21.840 I'm just proud of my show.

00:52:24.740 Of God.

00:52:25.760 Joy Reid wants you to believe that she's Mother Teresa.

00:52:28.460 She's Mother Teresa slash Rosa Parks, a combination of both.

00:52:32.800 We are back now with Free Press columnist Batya Angarsargan.

00:52:35.860 There she was on Saturday having learned her show was about to be canceled with a group of

00:52:40.100 online supporters talking about herself, again, like she was saintly.

00:52:45.700 Here's the reality and an actual taste of what Joy Reid's show looked and sounded like the

00:52:51.800 following mashup put together by Tom Elliott of Grabian.

00:52:54.800 Donald Trump wants to never let Black and brown folk up off the mat.

00:52:59.300 Evident what they mean by DEI, right?

00:53:00.920 Why don't you just say what you mean?

00:53:02.640 You can't stand Black people.

00:53:03.640 We get it.

00:53:04.340 You've been heard.

00:53:05.060 If you are Black plus anything else, you are Black.

00:53:07.500 Violent white nationalism that today threatens our national security.

00:53:11.620 We do have a fascist groundswell in parts of this country, mainly among white men.

00:53:16.840 Let's be clear.

00:53:17.620 Make your own dinner, MAGA.

00:53:18.900 Make your own sandwiches.

00:53:20.040 Wipe your own tears.

00:53:21.100 Similarities to what happened in Germany and what's happening now in America are just undeniable.

00:53:26.200 Donald Trump is acting like a Nazi, talking like a Nazi, and now posting like a Nazi.

00:53:30.540 Like, right winners were saying, get in the oven anytime you made any benign comment on Twitter.

00:53:35.800 Yes, Biden is aging.

00:53:37.220 He shuffles when he walks and, like, forgets names and makes gaffes.

00:53:40.060 But he's not incoherent.

00:53:41.500 He can give us a prompter speech.

00:53:43.680 Kamala Harris has passed the audition flawlessly.

00:53:46.120 This has been, in many ways, a perfect campaign.

00:53:48.460 I got into Harvard and, okay, Yale, Vassar, and the University of Denver, too, because I had a really high GPA and fantastic SAT scores.

00:53:57.200 Let me just be clear.

00:53:58.120 I got into Harvard only because of affirmative action.

00:54:02.700 Okay.

00:54:03.660 Just one other point here.

00:54:05.340 You heard her mention tears, white tears, male tears.

00:54:11.080 She's got a thing about it.

00:54:13.400 Most normal people watching her cry at the beginning of that soundbite, you know, what we did matter, might feel a pang of sympathy for her, empathy.

00:54:21.520 So they might.

00:54:21.940 And then you remember who she actually was on the air and clips like this one, which I mentioned yesterday, reacting to the Kyle Rittenhouse trial in 2021, SAT 6.

00:54:33.520 There's a thing about both white vigilantism and white tears, particularly male white tears, really white tears in general, because that's what carrots are, right?

00:54:47.780 They carrot out, and then as soon as they get caught, it's like, green waterworks.

00:54:53.160 Yeah, right.

00:54:54.280 It's white tears are fake.

00:54:55.500 Kyle Rittenhouse, 18-year-old, put on trial for murder, called a white supremacist unfoundedly by the running next president of the United States.

00:55:03.660 He was faking it.

00:55:04.980 His white male tears, they're racist, too.

00:55:07.300 And white female tears are racist.

00:55:09.480 And to the point where she found them so fun, she would mock them.

00:55:14.460 So, no, I have zero sympathy for her.

00:55:16.260 None whatsoever.

00:55:17.160 I revel in her termination.

00:55:19.120 I will shoot those tears right into my veins.

00:55:21.920 I'm going to put them on my nightside table in my glass, and I will drink them gleefully, cry, go.

00:55:31.000 I'll watch.

00:55:32.740 Am I being too hard?

00:55:34.320 I mean, the white tears meme comes from the Robin DiAngelo book, How to Be an Anti-Racist, where she says when white people are accused of racism,

00:55:45.800 they cry, and their tears are a weapon they use against black people.

00:55:51.680 And it's like, no, they're crying because to be racist is to be evil, and they know they are not evil.

00:55:59.420 And you are accusing them of being evil.

00:56:01.960 Like, they took a thing that is a good thing about Americans, that we would rather do many unpleasant, horrible things than be accused of racism because we are not racist because we are good.

00:56:14.760 And they use that as a sign of somehow being bad, which makes people question themselves.

00:56:22.640 And that is ultimately what they wanted with this meme, was when you as a white person feel upset that you've been falsely accused of racism, you then need to question your most basic godly instincts.

00:56:38.500 You can never trust your sense of right versus wrong.

00:56:41.780 Only they can tell you who is right and who is wrong, who is good and who is evil.

00:56:48.040 This is the most horrific, heinous thing to do.

00:56:51.640 They tried to re-racialize American life at a time when we have finally overcome the sins of our past.

00:56:58.800 They tried to create a new standard of anti-racism to give themselves power and to make a lot of money.

00:57:07.740 And I am so unbelievably grateful to God and also grateful to President Trump that we are coming to a moment as Americans where this just does not work anymore, Megan.

00:57:20.160 Mm-hmm.

00:57:20.920 No, it's true.

00:57:21.680 I saw in the news yesterday Don Lemon was out there upset that I'm enjoying the Joy Reid termination.

00:57:27.780 Once again, calling me nasty names.

00:57:30.500 And really what's happening here is when one cannot generate light on oneself by oneself, they may find it fine just to bathe in the reflective light of someone else who actually is successful.

00:57:43.160 That's what's really happening there.

00:57:45.160 Don Lemon has no viewers.

00:57:46.800 He has no listeners whatsoever.

00:57:48.320 He has not been able to make it in the cable news world where he was repeatedly demoted and then fired.

00:57:54.040 He was fired two minutes after getting hired by Elon, which should have been a lifeline to him, but he was too stupid to actually take advantage of it.

00:58:01.220 And now he's too stupid to actually make it in the digital lane.

00:58:04.320 So he did the one thing that he could think of to do, which was get into the press by attacking me.

00:58:09.540 And now he's gotten more ink than he's gotten in the past four years.

00:58:13.040 But he's a sad, pathetic little man who actually cannot make it in business on his own.

00:58:17.880 And really, at this point, thoughts and prayers, Don, hang in there.

00:58:21.440 But that's that's right.

00:58:22.860 He, Joy Reid, all these race essentialists are failing because the jig is up.

00:58:29.000 People see what they're doing.

00:58:30.200 We're over it.

00:58:30.940 The great awokening happened with Trump's reelection and the fever has broken.

00:58:36.140 That's why, yes, Joy Reid got fired because, Bacha, I asked my team to go pull the numbers.

00:58:40.800 OK, in January, MSNBC's demo was the lowest in prime time it has ever been, ever.

00:58:46.640 Worst January ever for MSNBC.

00:58:49.620 In February, it was a 28 percent decline in the overall numbers.

00:58:56.560 So they're down 30 percent in February versus 2024.

00:59:00.120 So they are hemorrhaging viewers still.

00:59:03.880 Joy Reid's show is bad.

00:59:05.900 It's a little worse than her colleagues, but it's not that much worse.

00:59:11.160 It's her messaging.

00:59:12.900 I absolutely believe that Brian Roberts had enough because she is being replaced by two

00:59:19.120 black people and a Hispanic.

00:59:21.100 And I don't know Simone Sanders that well.

00:59:23.640 She used to be more normal.

00:59:25.680 I think she's gotten a little woker and more annoying over the years as she's her star has

00:59:29.320 been rising on MS.

00:59:30.260 But Michael Steele, while he's a never Trump Republican, you know, he's not in Joy Reid's

00:59:35.120 field when it comes to incendiary race bombs.

00:59:38.640 I'm not excusing the stuff he says, but he's not.

00:59:40.700 Um, and Alicia Menendez, same.

00:59:45.240 So they're definitely making a move slightly closer to normal.

00:59:50.760 I don't want to say center, but slightly closer to like the bounds of normal conversation by

00:59:55.520 axing her because they know the country's over it.

00:59:59.620 Yeah, I don't think it's going to be enough for them because I mean, the truth is because

01:00:04.760 96% of journalists are Democrats.

01:00:07.420 Democrats, if you're a Democrat, right, you want to understand the moment you want to

01:00:13.400 understand how you lost.

01:00:14.980 You want to understand why so many of your fellow Americans voted for a person that you

01:00:19.540 may be, let's say, believe even because you were told by the media is literally Hitler,

01:00:23.800 right?

01:00:24.720 No conservatives have to wonder how Democrats see things, right?

01:00:28.640 We are constantly bombarded with it.

01:00:31.000 It's everywhere.

01:00:31.960 It is inescapable.

01:00:33.320 And so I think for a lot of Democrats who, you know, maybe don't like Trump, but love

01:00:38.460 this country, I'm talking about Democratic voters, they are turning now to Fox News, to

01:00:44.260 the Megyn Kelly show, to a host of conservative media outlets because they want to understand

01:00:49.960 what happened and they know they are not going to get that from the people who spent 10 years

01:00:55.400 calling Trump literally Hitler.

01:00:57.520 And so honestly, the only thing I think that could save MSNBC right now or CNN is for them

01:01:03.800 to seriously invest in bringing on conservatives, because I think that is what Americans want

01:01:09.180 to hear.

01:01:09.700 They're sick of the divisiveness.

01:01:11.540 They're sick of the polarization.

01:01:13.600 They're sick of people getting rich off of trying to get us to hate our neighbors.

01:01:17.800 They want to hear how the other side thinks so they can make an informed decision.

01:01:22.260 They want the temperature brought down and they want to see people having civil debates.

01:01:26.800 That's what I believe.

01:01:28.000 Well, it's going to be interesting to see what happens with some of the contributors

01:01:30.940 who are on Joy's show, like the racist man, Ellie Mistal.

01:01:34.700 I mean, he's truly, he and Joy were the two most racist people on TV, in my opinion.

01:01:38.880 He just dropped a new column in The Nation saying as follows.

01:01:44.180 Okay.

01:01:44.820 Pointing out the white hosts at the network remain, as of now, unaffected.

01:01:48.740 Fair point, Ellie.

01:01:50.180 Well, you should get up in their grill about that because that's their, them's their rules.

01:01:53.580 You should make them play by them.

01:01:54.540 What's happening over there is not subtle.

01:01:57.380 Cable news has never been truly comfortable with authentic black voices.

01:02:02.560 White executives tend to treat black folks as interchangeable.

01:02:06.100 Joy Reid is not interchangeable.

01:02:07.780 She's indispensable.

01:02:09.480 And having dispensed with her, cable TV news is left with a gaping hole.

01:02:14.100 The black mentor class is being fired, not just on TV, but throughout America.

01:02:19.500 That, of course, is the point.

01:02:22.980 That's why people like Joy are being cast aside.

01:02:25.820 White viewers might think of the cable network.

01:02:28.960 They might think they just went after her because she is black and outspoken.

01:02:33.540 But his point is, she is our mentor.

01:02:35.860 She is showing other black people how to be and act and complain a lot.

01:02:40.800 And shutting her up by bounce passing her out of that post was intentional by the old white

01:02:48.680 people running Comcast.

01:02:51.620 I mean, it's not surprising.

01:02:52.980 In a way, he's right.

01:02:53.860 You know, the only people of color that the extreme progressive white elites let in are the

01:02:59.860 ones who are race baiters because it's the perfect smokescreen for class, right?

01:03:04.460 Like when you're out in the Hamptons, right, and you're only willing to employ illegals who live,

01:03:09.040 you know, in the woods behind your home, you don't want to see like people of color saying,

01:03:14.500 hey, we also are not really comfortable with all of these illegal immigrants, right?

01:03:17.820 What you want is a person up there being like it's racist to oppose an open border.

01:03:22.240 And so I think in a way he's right.

01:03:23.900 The power structures that be of progressive white rich leftists, they do only let a certain

01:03:31.420 line forward.

01:03:32.220 You're not going to get someone like Lawrence Jones or Charles Payne, brilliant, brilliant

01:03:36.880 black men who are conservatives to actually show up and talk in the way that people in

01:03:42.120 their community actually sound like and actually talk like.

01:03:45.540 So you're saying he has the right point.

01:03:47.760 He's just got the wrong groups that are being allowed permission and entry versus the ones who

01:03:52.180 are getting kicked out.

01:03:52.940 Exactly right.

01:03:53.420 They won't let any.

01:03:54.360 And by the way, just just for those of you playing at home, here's a throwback to Ellie

01:03:58.020 Mistel on Joy Reid show.

01:03:59.920 So you can see why he's so upset that this platform is being canceled.

01:04:03.640 At a basic level, if you want rights in this country under this conservative Supreme Court,

01:04:08.760 you better be a cis hetero white man or an Uzi, because those are the two things that this

01:04:14.460 court believes have have rights.

01:04:18.540 It's amazing why their their numbers are so low, Bajia.

01:04:21.880 I don't I don't understand it.

01:04:22.580 All right.

01:04:22.920 Now, wait, in the time we have left, I'm dying to ask you, because the one thing I've seen

01:04:27.420 a ton from you over the past month or so is you are not a fan of Elon Musk.

01:04:34.000 And he's I think maybe I overstated it, but I don't think you are.

01:04:37.100 And he's been all over the news running Doge and sending out the email to people saying,

01:04:41.820 what did you accomplish this week?

01:04:42.820 Then Trump stood by him and said, that was a great email.

01:04:45.000 And I actually do think you need to fill that out or you could be fired.

01:04:50.060 So what is it?

01:04:51.420 Be specific about what it is Elon is or has been doing that turns you off so much.

01:04:57.580 Thank you so much for asking me about this, Megan.

01:05:01.920 I hope your listeners are aware of this, but obviously you allow voices on here that you

01:05:06.880 don't necessarily agree with about everything.

01:05:09.040 And that's very rare, unfortunately, in the media.

01:05:11.680 And I'm very grateful for you for that.

01:05:13.920 And of course, to talk about this.

01:05:15.600 His entire supply chain is in China and he is unbelievably close with the CCP.

01:05:22.560 Xi Jinping asked him to build a showroom for Tesla in Xinjiang, which is where the Uyghurs

01:05:27.460 are being genocided, and he complied.

01:05:29.620 He didn't have to do that.

01:05:30.620 He's the richest man on the planet.

01:05:32.540 So he has this unbelievably obsequious relationship with China, who I believe is our greatest adversary.

01:05:37.760 I don't see how you can truly be an American patriot when you have to bend the knee to China

01:05:42.760 and have proven willing to bend the knee to China over and over again.

01:05:46.140 He's such a maverick on Twitter when it comes to American politics, but he has never once

01:05:50.640 said a negative word about the CCP, which, of course, engages in tons and tons of human

01:05:56.280 rights violations, the genocide of the Uyghurs, and, of course, undermines America at every

01:06:00.760 turn that it can.

01:06:01.620 So on that front, I'm very uncomfortable with him being this close to power.

01:06:06.040 The way that he related to American workers over the H-1B visa squabble over Christmas

01:06:13.180 when he literally endorsed a tweet calling Americans retarded, I really, really, really

01:06:19.100 didn't like that.

01:06:20.360 I don't think he has the same values as the MAGA movement.

01:06:24.300 He's not religious.

01:06:25.640 He has this kind of transhumanist view.

01:06:29.300 He thinks that Americans are going to be, you know, people are going to become computerized

01:06:32.660 and that intelligence is going to be machine made.

01:06:35.160 All of this stuff for me really puts him at odds with the values of the MAGA movement.

01:06:40.280 Now, that said, I really trust President Trump's judgment.

01:06:43.940 He's an amazing judge of character.

01:06:45.940 He has a very clear idea of what the mandate is.

01:06:48.480 I think there's a little bit of good cop, bad cop going on with him and Elon, so I appreciate

01:06:52.660 that.

01:06:53.300 Obviously, I love getting rid of government waste.

01:06:55.420 Obviously, I'm super critical of the USAID.

01:06:58.180 I think it's amazing that they just axed all of that.

01:07:01.000 That email to me read kind of like a Karen.

01:07:03.060 I was like, wow, Elon Musk is kind of the Karen in chief, right?

01:07:06.500 Like, tell me what you did this week, right?

01:07:08.980 Like, I want it in writing, right?

01:07:11.200 So, but honestly, I don't think that Trump has, you know, I don't think he's compromised

01:07:16.880 anything here.

01:07:17.900 To me, I think he sees Elon as someone he likes hanging out with.

01:07:21.780 I think he sees him as a peer.

01:07:23.220 Donald Trump does not have many peers.

01:07:24.920 And Elon Musk, as the richest man in the world, is his peer.

01:07:29.120 And I think that he also kind of feels like, look, the guy gave me a quarter of a billion

01:07:33.160 dollars, got me over the finish line.

01:07:34.920 I'm going to give him this thing to play around with.

01:07:37.380 You know, he'll get bored in four months and he'll move on.

01:07:39.280 I don't think Donald Trump expected this to take over, especially when his achievements

01:07:44.460 on so many other fronts are colossal.

01:07:48.300 I mean, Israel, Palestine, Ukraine, immigration.

01:07:53.620 I mean, Scott Bessette is doing an amazing job in treasury.

01:07:57.140 This rare minerals deal in Ukraine, we're going to get some of our money back.

01:08:01.060 Hello.

01:08:01.500 Like, he's doing such amazing, amazing things.

01:08:04.880 I don't think for a second he thought that the media was going to take, you know, orange

01:08:09.240 Hitler bad and just try to put it on Elon.

01:08:12.360 And I also think that, you know, the media, of course, is criticizing him for all the wrong

01:08:16.000 things.

01:08:16.340 So that's kind of where I'm at on this.

01:08:19.000 Well, that's interesting because I've been seeing, I respect and appreciate your judgment

01:08:22.020 and I've been seeing that you're not a fan.

01:08:24.480 And Steve Bannon now infamously is not a fan.

01:08:26.680 Those two have been kind of at each other.

01:08:29.220 And it's fair.

01:08:29.900 You know, we had the All In guys on last Friday.

01:08:31.640 They are very much fans of Elon and what he's doing.

01:08:33.900 And I get what you're saying.

01:08:35.240 I think he's, you know, he's a very unique figure.

01:08:38.020 And the transhumanist thing was the one that stood out at me because, you know, he's doing

01:08:41.440 the neural link.

01:08:42.800 Like, that actually could, that could solve paralysis at some point.

01:08:46.340 So there's some upsides to the way he sees the human machine possibilities, too.

01:08:53.060 But we've never had a figure like him, not in modern day America.

01:08:56.720 And I would say the other thing is maybe Trump did see how much heat Elon would be taking.

01:09:01.280 And he's enjoying it because it's given him some cover for, I mean, truly, if Trump wraps

01:09:06.560 up Ukraine in the next two weeks, as he is saying they might and finishes off this peace deal in

01:09:12.360 the Middle East and with the return of the hostages, he should get the Nobel Peace Prize.

01:09:16.340 I mean, there would be no question that Trump should get the Nobel Peace Prize.

01:09:20.120 And that's within the first two months of taking office.

01:09:24.020 Right.

01:09:24.280 It's like maybe you want the big, you know, different distraction, who I will say also

01:09:31.040 calls himself retarded, whatever, over here, you know, while you're focused on things that

01:09:37.300 really deeply matter.

01:09:39.820 I totally hear that.

01:09:41.300 I do think he might actually get the Nobel Peace Prize.

01:09:44.480 I mean, he deserves it already for what he achieved with the Abraham Accords in the first

01:09:48.400 administration.

01:09:49.700 I was talking to Sebastian Gorka, who's one of Trump's advisors on counterterrorism at

01:09:54.340 CPAC, and he said that he had been at Yale and he had this feeling that these people on

01:10:00.260 the panel with him who had spent 10 years calling him a Nazi were just capitulating.

01:10:04.340 Like there's just been this mass capitulation of the elites who used to smear Trump endlessly.

01:10:09.880 I think he already deserves it.

01:10:11.100 I think he might get it.

01:10:12.220 And, you know, God willing, he has amazing things in the pipeline coming with Saudi Arabia,

01:10:17.220 with Egypt.

01:10:18.380 I mean, they are really making moves.

01:10:20.620 And, you know, Megan, after that horrific scene with the caskets of the strangled and

01:10:26.920 mangled and mutilated babies' bodies in Gaza, when thousands of Gazan civilians showed up

01:10:33.260 to cheer with their own children, I mean, this just like utterly depraved, godless scene.

01:10:39.580 I think a lot of people are having this feeling of like, we need to break everything.

01:10:46.620 And Donald Trump is just the right man in the right moment.

01:10:50.940 And he has a good heart for this stuff and a good head for how to do this stuff.

01:10:55.280 So I feel very, you know, excited about that.

01:10:58.480 I do think he really wants that.

01:11:00.000 I will say the other thing about Elon Musk is this 13 kids with four women.

01:11:04.640 He's never married any of them.

01:11:06.420 Like, it's so what we criticize about leftist culture.

01:11:11.920 You know, the sort of, I don't know, like the, yeah, we want kids, but don't we want

01:11:17.480 them in these loving two-parent homes?

01:11:19.440 And he's made such a, you know, a virtue out of this.

01:11:23.540 Like, he thinks it makes him cool.

01:11:25.600 And I think that it's, it's kind of a, there's a lot of people I think are an odd fit for the

01:11:30.080 MAGA movement, but who I think are bringing really good things into it.

01:11:33.640 And this as a role model for young men, I just don't like it.

01:11:37.080 I feel really uncomfortable with it.

01:11:39.540 Fair, fair enough.

01:11:40.860 Yeah.

01:11:41.140 The personal life.

01:11:42.380 I mean, look, we've talked about a lot in the show, the personal life of a few of the

01:11:45.080 nominees who have gone up, not ideal, but, but we have to depend on them because no one's

01:11:50.920 perfect.

01:11:51.200 I mean, like even Christy Noem, who I, I I'm just, I complete, she's lost me as a fan with

01:11:55.880 the shooting the dog in the face, poor little cricket.

01:11:59.320 And then the Corey Lewandowski, but I have to say, notwithstanding, I'm totally rooting

01:12:03.500 for her now.

01:12:04.100 She's got a very big, important job, one that like we really need her to succeed at.

01:12:08.700 So I'm, I'm just, personally, I view it through such a different lens than I used to just,

01:12:13.460 just on that front.

01:12:14.280 Cause it's like, we have a country, a world to save.

01:12:17.400 And you know what, God, believe it.

01:12:20.320 It's happening.

01:12:21.880 It's happening.

01:12:23.040 So anyway, Bajia, always a pleasure.

01:12:25.040 Those poor Bebas boys.

01:12:27.320 It's, that has been the most horrific thing I've seen in a long time in the news.

01:12:30.640 And it is a reminder that evil exists and we need strong leaders on the side of the

01:12:35.100 good.

01:12:35.720 All the best, my friend.

01:12:37.240 God bless you.

01:12:37.980 Thank you so much for everything you do, Megan.

01:12:40.380 Oh, thank you.

01:12:41.180 You too, Bajia.

01:12:41.700 All right, coming up, we're going to have this.

01:12:45.300 I've actually been looking forward to meeting her.

01:12:47.440 Now, her husband is a superstar, former NFL player.

01:12:51.340 She was on The Real Housewives and she'll be here along with the husband in just a bit.

01:12:58.200 Can you guess who they are?

01:13:00.020 Stay tuned.

01:13:00.460 The stance that President Trump has been championing about keeping biological men out of women's

01:13:10.500 sports continues to connect with people all across this country.

01:13:14.700 That includes one former cast member of The Real Housewives of Beverly Hills, Anna Marie

01:13:20.360 Wiley.

01:13:20.940 Anna Marie is married to former NFL great and digital host, Marcellus Wiley, who's been

01:13:27.240 on this show multiple times and will be here to join his wife soon.

01:13:30.340 But first, we welcome Anna Marie to the show.

01:13:33.400 Nice to have you.

01:13:35.120 Hi, Megan.

01:13:35.680 Thank you so much for having me.

01:13:37.000 I was really looking forward to meeting you.

01:13:39.460 Oh, same.

01:13:40.260 So I confess that while I love The Real Housewives franchise, I only catch it like here and there.

01:13:46.940 So I did not see your year on the show.

01:13:49.420 And is it true you only got the one season?

01:13:51.540 I got half a season.

01:13:53.960 What happened?

01:13:55.580 Half a season.

01:13:56.680 You know, I was really excited for the season.

01:14:01.900 It was something that, you know, kind of fell into my lap out of nowhere.

01:14:06.320 You know, it was nothing that was on my radar.

01:14:08.120 It's not anything that I auditioned for.

01:14:11.940 I guess they had filmed half a season.

01:14:14.400 And then one of the cast members reached out to me.

01:14:18.480 I had met her randomly at a party at her home a few months prior.

01:14:23.420 And she reached out to me on social media and said, hey, you know, we just started filming

01:14:29.280 season 13 of The Housewives and production's looking for a new housewife.

01:14:34.200 Would you be interested?

01:14:35.640 And, you know, I talked to my husband about it.

01:14:37.880 Again, because, you know, I was very happy being a private person, you know, letting

01:14:42.720 my husband be the person in the spotlight, being a wife, a mother, a professional, a nurse

01:14:50.520 anesthetist, you know, just taking care of my family and my home.

01:14:53.180 And I'd never really wanted or craved to be, you know, in the spotlight.

01:14:57.360 But he was like, you know what?

01:14:59.260 You are a multi-hyphenate.

01:15:01.360 I think this would be a really great platform for you.

01:15:05.080 And I thought it would be a really great opportunity for me to, you know, showcase a nuclear

01:15:13.400 black family, because I think that that is something that is missing from mainstream programming

01:15:19.660 right now.

01:15:20.660 And also a good opportunity just to showcase a different kind of housewife.

01:15:26.840 You know, like I, yes, I come from a very varied background.

01:15:32.300 I was born in Canada.

01:15:34.160 I was born to a Dutch mother, a Nigerian father.

01:15:38.740 I was put up for adoption when I was born.

01:15:40.800 And then at two weeks old, I was adopted by a Dutch Indonesian family.

01:15:46.440 So I grew up in an Asian household.

01:15:48.600 I grew up in a very small rural town, about an hour and a half outside of Vancouver, raised

01:15:56.020 by a single mother.

01:15:57.560 I had two sisters, one of whom was also adopted.

01:16:01.140 And, you know, very humble, very humble beginnings.

01:16:04.660 And I played sports my entire life.

01:16:07.640 Um, I started running track when I was five years old.

01:16:11.220 Um, I had many, many, many knee surgeries.

01:16:14.420 And so I switched over to basketball.

01:16:16.220 I played all through high school and, um, college.

01:16:19.240 I was a collegiate basketball player as well.

01:16:21.160 And that was really how I was able to, you know, afford to go to school and get my education,

01:16:26.560 get my nursing degree.

01:16:28.120 Um, you know, and, and then six months after that, I moved here as a travel nurse.

01:16:33.080 I worked very, very long hours.

01:16:35.860 I started grad school and then I, I met my husband, you know, this big NFL player.

01:16:40.980 So, you know, I kind of have, and Marcellus does too.

01:16:43.960 We have this kind of rags to riches, adversity to affluent sort of stories.

01:16:49.260 And those were things that I wanted to be able to share with the viewers.

01:16:53.000 I wanted to be someone that was relatable.

01:16:55.300 Um, you know, someone that, so, but Bravo, I guess had different ideas, all of your diverse

01:17:01.260 background.

01:17:01.680 And I, I mean, I know you just got back from the Trump white house where you guys were

01:17:05.800 invited there to celebrate black history month.

01:17:08.360 For sure.

01:17:08.940 If that had happened prior to the real housewives thing, they would not have cast you, but

01:17:12.920 I'm going to guess that you maybe weren't saying exactly the right things to please the Bravo

01:17:19.300 executives.

01:17:19.860 Cause I don't remember the season that had anybody who wasn't an established progressive

01:17:26.280 in any of the main roles.

01:17:27.900 I mean, I've listened to that cast out there, talk about the me too movement, like believe

01:17:33.040 all women and women would never make up these stories and they hate Trump.

01:17:37.420 So it's like, I wondered, do you think that played any role in your short stint there?

01:17:42.920 Yeah.

01:17:43.520 See, it was very interesting because when it was first announced that I was going to be

01:17:47.480 filming for the season, the, the narrative was so positive and everyone was so excited.

01:17:52.960 It was, you know, wife of Marcella's Wiley.

01:17:55.820 She has such a full and exciting life.

01:17:59.440 She's a mother.

01:18:00.180 She's a professional, you know, they're, they're going to be a wonderful addition to the show.

01:18:05.160 Everyone was really, really excited.

01:18:06.740 And then someone went and, you know, dug up stuff as the media likes to do.

01:18:13.040 And they found this clip of Marcellus, I think years prior saying that he would not be in

01:18:22.220 favor of our daughters, um, playing sports, um, against transgender females.

01:18:29.160 So he's, you know, saying he would protect our daughters.

01:18:31.580 He would not allow that to happen.

01:18:32.960 And immediately the narrative completely shifted.

01:18:38.380 Um, we and I were completely vilified, labeled transphobic.

01:18:44.440 Um, they're, you know, they went so far as to even say, you know, they're like, she, she

01:18:51.460 follows Candace Owens on social media.

01:18:55.300 She's best friends with Candace Owens.

01:18:57.980 I've actually never met Candace Owens.

01:18:59.800 I do think she's brilliant, but I've never met her, but, you know, saying I was best friends

01:19:03.580 with Candace Owens.

01:19:05.040 And so, like I said, it just, the narrative completely changed from this, this, she's going

01:19:10.900 to be a perfect fit.

01:19:12.080 We're so excited about her to very, very dark.

01:19:17.380 She's transphobic.

01:19:18.840 And, you know, then I was essentially, the media essentially canceled me.

01:19:23.020 Um, and a shock, right.

01:19:26.060 And it was very interesting though, because when I look at that whole Candace Owens piece,

01:19:30.240 I want to get this in quickly.

01:19:31.840 The reason that I started following Candace Owens, um, because I was never into politics

01:19:38.780 prior to any of this, I was, you know, I was actually a, a lifelong Democrat, you know,

01:19:44.920 coming from Canada.

01:19:45.760 I was very in favor of very strong social systems.

01:19:50.140 Um, but I was a lifelong Democrat and it was during, remember in 2000, I think it was

01:19:55.900 2021 when Balenciaga put out that campaign, the pedophilia campaign, I was outraged.

01:20:04.660 I was absolutely outraged as a mother with four children, I was outraged and I did not

01:20:11.380 understand Megan, why so many people were so quiet on the issue and on social media.

01:20:18.260 Some of the people that I did notice talking about it, were you Tucker Carlson, who I also

01:20:23.320 didn't know who he was at the time.

01:20:24.860 And Candace Owens, who, again, I didn't know who she was at the time, but I started following

01:20:28.020 her because she was covering so much of it.

01:20:29.780 And so when, when that was weaponized against me, you know, saying, well, she's best friend

01:20:36.880 with Candace Owens because I was opposed to pedophilia, it was really disturbing.

01:20:45.680 It was very, very disturbing.

01:20:46.460 Candace is radical in that way.

01:20:48.080 She, she too is opposed to pedophilia and will fight out against to speak out unabashedly

01:20:53.860 when she sees it.

01:20:54.960 And meanwhile, Kim Kardashian still backed the brand, even in the midst of all that wouldn't

01:20:58.720 break ties with them.

01:20:59.600 That's what she stands for.

01:21:00.740 Her own access to designer wear, no matter the consequences, one of the many reasons

01:21:05.120 why we do not like her.

01:21:07.780 So, so then you leave the Real Housewives and you and Marcellus do this very brave thing,

01:21:13.580 which is actually go to the Trump White House.

01:21:17.300 It's not like going to the Biden White House or the Obama White House or, you know, a Clinton

01:21:21.520 White House.

01:21:22.040 It's the orange man, bad Hitler, Trump.

01:21:26.260 What made you say yes to that invitation?

01:21:29.320 You know what?

01:21:30.120 It's, it's the White House.

01:21:32.700 Um, for me, it wasn't even a deterrent that it is a Trump White House.

01:21:37.500 I, you get invited to the White House.

01:21:39.480 For me, it's a bucket list thing.

01:21:41.620 And it was the most incredible day.

01:21:45.080 I will tell you that, um, we were surrounded by so many open-minded, inspiring and welcoming

01:21:53.300 people.

01:21:53.900 It was an absolutely fantastic ceremony.

01:21:57.440 Um, his, his address to all of us there was, was incredible.

01:22:02.200 He honored, um, so many, um, wonderful Black Americans and he really instilled so much hope

01:22:10.020 in, in every one of us that was there.

01:22:13.060 It was an absolutely fantastic day.

01:22:15.080 Now, am I correct that Marcellus doesn't like Black History Month?

01:22:18.960 I think I've heard him say.

01:22:20.120 You know what, ask him that question because he, he will answer those kinds of things in

01:22:25.600 his own unique sort of way.

01:22:27.740 Because what are the two of you sitting there like, and he, and he's like, eh, and you're

01:22:31.300 like, no, it's good.

01:22:32.220 It's good.

01:22:32.720 You know, not, that's the other thing is people always think that a married couple has to agree

01:22:37.760 on everything.

01:22:38.680 And we, we do not, we do not agree on everything all the time.

01:22:42.820 That's why it was very interesting.

01:22:44.660 Again, going back to, um, you know, when we were labeled as transphobic, we had a lot of

01:22:50.260 things that we disagreed on and I was never someone that spoke publicly about that.

01:22:56.020 And, and he was, and it was because he did and because of his views that it was assumed

01:23:02.080 that those were my views as well.

01:23:04.560 But, you know, I had never, I had never been asked if I was a Republican or Democrat, as

01:23:11.680 I told you, I, I was a lifelong Democrat until this election cycle.

01:23:17.580 Um, and in terms of the transphobia issue, um, you know, I was a lifelong athlete.

01:23:25.500 I actually need bilateral knee replacements now, um, because of what I gave to my sport.

01:23:31.140 And it's just very interesting how that was something that Marcella said so many years

01:23:37.360 ago.

01:23:37.800 And now there are so many people that are coming out.

01:23:41.100 It's almost like it is acceptable to say that like Stephen A said it recently, right?

01:23:46.500 Someone who works for ESPN, he said it recently.

01:23:49.300 And so that really points to, okay, well, I think we have that actually, Anna Maria, let

01:23:54.480 me play that just so people know what you're talking about.

01:23:56.320 Stephen A Smith weighed in recently.

01:23:57.880 Um, LGBTQ rights and all of that stuff.

01:24:01.640 I'm in full support of that.

01:24:02.800 But when transgender athletes, men are transitioning to women and they're competing in female sports,

01:24:07.960 that's a different animal to me.

01:24:09.520 That's not, that's not just about LGBTQ rights.

01:24:12.480 That's about prying on the rights of females out there everywhere who were born female and

01:24:18.480 they're at a decided disadvantage.

01:24:21.100 Right on.

01:24:21.960 Amen.

01:24:22.600 Keep going.

01:24:23.160 And again, that is something that 80% of the country is in alignment with, you know,

01:24:28.280 and you have, there are certain things that you just cannot, you cannot overlook, right?

01:24:32.260 Heart size, um, lung capacity, VO2 max, oxygen carrying capacity.

01:24:37.860 Um, you know, those are just things that are undeniable and they're not about hatred.

01:24:42.680 They're not about transphobia.

01:24:43.800 They're not about bigotry.

01:24:44.740 They're just, they're just science and it's fairness and safety.

01:24:47.680 Your sport was basketball.

01:24:50.780 Correct.

01:24:51.880 So we just went on, um, Saturday night, we went to Madison square garden and we watched

01:24:55.820 Duke play Illinois, um, you know, as college teams, but they, they make the trip to like

01:25:00.740 one of the bigger arenas every once in a while.

01:25:03.160 And I mean, that Duke team is like a dream team.

01:25:05.680 They were unbelievable.

01:25:06.320 This is the men they, they were so good.

01:25:09.140 It was just like a thing of beauty.

01:25:10.720 It reminded me of back when I just graduated law school and I saw the dream team, uh, the

01:25:15.060 Chicago bulls with Jordan and Pippen and all those guys play where it was just like a

01:25:17.880 thing of beauty on the court.

01:25:18.960 Like you're, it's almost like a dance more than a sport almost.

01:25:22.780 You know what I mean?

01:25:23.160 Where it's just like, there's a flow where you're like, wow.

01:25:25.080 And I don't know anything about sports, but that's how I felt watching it.

01:25:27.640 But the thought of any one of those guys going over and playing against the women, you know,

01:25:34.380 any one of them would be a total game changer, a literal game changer in every game in which

01:25:40.480 he played.

01:25:41.660 Exactly.

01:25:42.160 And I'm like, and we're a sports family.

01:25:43.580 Like my husband played in the NFL for 10 years.

01:25:46.240 I would, and he didn't play basketball and he could still be me.

01:25:48.540 I would never in a million years want to play against him.

01:25:51.600 My nine-year-old son could probably beat me now.

01:25:53.960 And another interesting thing is there's a clip of Serena Williams, like years ago on

01:25:59.680 Letterman.

01:26:00.800 And she was talking about, I think it was Andy Roddick had asked her if she would play

01:26:05.500 against the men.

01:26:06.340 And she said, no, she said, no, you would beat me six zero.

01:26:11.020 And, and I like to play against the women.

01:26:12.820 So she, she really addressed this a long time ago before this was a, you know, hot button,

01:26:19.640 no-go zone topic.

01:26:22.400 But because it was before this, it flew under the radar, but really she addressed this and

01:26:26.660 said the same thing.

01:26:27.660 Well, it's incredible because that sort of camel's nose under the tent of like, well, let's just

01:26:32.640 be fair and let these so-called trans kids play in sports, you know, and forget what it does to

01:26:37.300 the girls has now the full camels under the tent where they're really erasing women.

01:26:42.300 Every day you awake to a new story.

01:26:44.440 Thank God Trump is fighting back against it, but the left is not letting go of this easily.

01:26:48.620 The trans activists are the most rabid of all activists.

01:26:54.200 And the latest nonsense comes out of Washington state where, I know, forgive me.

01:27:00.220 There is something in Washington state, but this one's from Wisconsin where the governor,

01:27:04.020 Tony Evers has decided to refer to, um, the people who would benefit from his IVF law, you know,

01:27:11.920 protecting IVF procedures as inseminated persons.

01:27:17.140 That's instead of mothers, here he is defending the decision, SOT 34.

01:27:22.980 Not more, uh, gender neutral.

01:27:24.860 Um, what was behind that, that, uh, decision and you stand by it?

01:27:28.840 Of course I do.

01:27:29.760 It's, it's absolutely, you know, what the Republicans say is a lie, you know?

01:27:34.280 So of course I'm pretty, uh, PO'd about that.

01:27:37.540 So I didn't know that I, that, uh, Republicans were against IVF, but apparently they are.

01:27:42.420 Because that is what that's about.

01:27:44.380 Moms are moms, dads are dads.

01:27:46.540 And, uh, what we want is legal certainty that, that, uh, we're able to, uh, have, that moms

01:27:54.620 are able to get the care they need.

01:27:56.600 That's it.

01:27:58.380 Totally dodging.

01:27:59.740 His decision to refer to mothers as inseminated persons.

01:28:04.020 No man can be an inseminated person carrying a baby.

01:28:07.960 Yeah, I, I think this is really one of the reasons why I say that I didn't leave the Democratic

01:28:14.320 Party.

01:28:14.840 The Democratic Party left me.

01:28:16.960 I can't think of any woman that is okay with being referred to as an inseminated person.

01:28:23.520 It just goes so far away from, um, valuing mothers and, you know, really paying homage

01:28:31.760 to what, what we go through, um, to be given that blessing.

01:28:36.260 Um, it's yeah, it's really indefensible.

01:28:39.020 And by the way, not for nothing, but I've done IVF.

01:28:42.960 I used it for my kids and you're not technically an inseminated person.

01:28:46.120 When you do IVF, you're, you're, you're having something implanted in you.

01:28:49.240 That's an embryo.

01:28:50.020 An embryo is the semen happens outside of the body.

01:28:53.360 When you do use IVF governor Evers, if you really want to get technical, but truly think

01:28:58.200 about the term and how kind of gross it is.

01:29:00.740 You, you say mother and you think of a soft place to fall, a fierce mama bear who protects

01:29:07.080 her young against the most ardent threats.

01:29:09.740 You think about somebody who is both loving and caring and nurturing and strong, providing

01:29:14.780 guidance and discipline where necessary.

01:29:17.020 And when you say inseminated person, I'm sorry, all I picture is a penis ejaculating inside

01:29:23.900 of a woman's birth canal.

01:29:25.160 That's what I, it really is.

01:29:26.920 It reduces you down to sperm, to semen.

01:29:30.800 That's all motherhood now is it's so offensive.

01:29:35.360 Yeah, it really does.

01:29:37.520 And you know, it's happening in the name of, um, inclusion.

01:29:41.740 And I think that's where a lot of people also get lost because you're using terms, um, like,

01:29:52.060 you know, if you don't agree with this, then you're not being inclusive or you're being

01:29:55.820 transphobic because of that.

01:29:57.340 And you're really doing it in a way to, um, to silence people and force hate their way for

01:30:04.200 not going according to a certain agenda.

01:30:06.900 And, you know, all we're saying here is no, we're women.

01:30:10.820 We want to be respected as such and appreciated as such, and not just, you know, relegated down

01:30:19.240 to, to labels that don't value us as who we are.

01:30:23.420 And I think that's really what's happening.

01:30:25.180 So we talked on the show yesterday about the loony Maine governor, Janet Mills, who's trying

01:30:32.300 to make a name for herself by not, uh, not enforcing the Trump federal EOs on gender and,

01:30:38.480 and boys trying to play girls sports.

01:30:40.240 She's going to lose, but that one's playing out in the courts.

01:30:42.620 And then I mentioned, mentioned Washington state.

01:30:45.020 Now we have the education chief defending so-called trans athletes claiming it is inaccurate

01:30:51.480 to say that there are only two genders.

01:30:55.500 Here is that man, Chris Rekedal in SOT 33.

01:31:01.040 It is quite simply inaccurate to say biologically that there are only boys and there are only

01:31:07.160 girls.

01:31:07.960 There's, there's a continuum.

01:31:09.980 There is a science to this.

01:31:11.520 There are children who are born intersex.

01:31:13.900 There are children whose chromosomes and their hormones aren't consistent with their sex at

01:31:18.820 birth.

01:31:19.120 Our state laws make clear that students get to identify and participate in activities

01:31:24.200 based on the gender in which they identify.

01:31:28.080 That I'm sorry.

01:31:29.180 That's just creepy.

01:31:29.900 It's such a mind bending alteration of reality.

01:31:34.280 Yeah.

01:31:34.940 Well, I do understand.

01:31:36.220 And I do appreciate that there are some gray areas, right?

01:31:39.920 There are some situations where I do feel like the, the situation needs to be looked at

01:31:45.300 on a case by case basis.

01:31:46.680 But I think when it's something that is just very clear cut of the XX versus XY, you know,

01:31:55.380 I think we just need to go back to the basics and understand that there, you know, once someone

01:32:01.340 who was assigned male at birth goes through puberty, there are undeniable physical differences

01:32:08.060 that exist that, that hormone replacement or, you know, blockers and things like that.

01:32:15.920 They can't, they can't account for that difference.

01:32:18.840 And it does become an issue of safety and it does become an issue of fairness.

01:32:22.320 And it's not about trying to exclude anyone from participation.

01:32:27.240 If you look at it the other way, when you have, um, trans male athletes, they're, they're

01:32:34.640 still competing with the females, but it's only becomes an issue when you have the trans

01:32:40.440 women that are competing with the women.

01:32:43.460 Can I ask you a question, Anna Maria, because, because you said assigned male at birth, which

01:32:48.780 is that's leftist ideology.

01:32:50.860 Like, cause I, I wonder why you say that.

01:32:53.480 I know it's the leftist language, but I see the cross around your neck and I know you don't

01:32:57.740 believe God makes mistakes on babies.

01:32:59.840 And when the baby comes out male, it's a boy.

01:33:03.060 It's not assigned anything by a man or a woman who happens to be an MD.

01:33:09.080 So I just wonder why you use that term.

01:33:12.080 I do that in, in only the vein of not, um, not offending anyone.

01:33:18.720 I think, you know, I have no problem with anyone wanting to, to live their life the way that

01:33:25.180 they choose, do what makes you happy.

01:33:28.640 Um, I think it only becomes an issue when there are other people that are being affected by

01:33:34.640 it.

01:33:35.180 And, you know, if someone doesn't want to use that language, you know, you can't force

01:33:39.060 them to use that language.

01:33:40.440 If someone, you know, once you become, once you come into spaces where women don't feel

01:33:47.320 comfortable, that's when it needs to be respected.

01:33:49.340 So really I'm just offering respect that I would hope that we would get back as women.

01:33:57.720 I, I, I, quick break here.

01:33:59.340 I have to say this.

01:34:00.520 I, I think I would love for you to consider just speaking truthfully as opposed to what

01:34:05.760 somebody else has told you is respectfully.

01:34:07.400 Cause I really think that the slow by the, the bit by bit erasure of women, and I wasn't

01:34:12.820 always here.

01:34:13.260 My audience knows this, but I'm firmly here now.

01:34:15.160 It begins with the manipulation of the language.

01:34:17.220 There are realities, biological realities, you know, anyway, stand by because I have to

01:34:21.880 take a quick break and we're going to come back with Marcellus and we can pick it up there.

01:34:24.640 I'm sure he'd love to jump in on this too.

01:34:26.120 I'm Megan Kelly, host of the Megan Kelly show on Sirius XM.

01:34:31.340 It's your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and

01:34:36.220 important political, legal, and cultural figures today.

01:34:39.320 You can catch the Megan Kelly show on Triumph, a Sirius XM channel featuring lots of hosts

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01:35:29.840 Back with me now is Anna Marie Wiley, as well as her husband, Marcellus Wiley, host of Hydration

01:35:36.480 Situation and more.

01:35:38.500 Where can they find Hydration Situation?

01:35:40.040 Just so they know.

01:35:41.500 On YouTube.

01:35:43.060 Yes.

01:35:43.500 You can find it on YouTube.

01:35:45.760 Marcellus Wiley, Dat Dude TV.

01:35:48.260 Going and growing.

01:35:50.000 All right.

01:35:50.580 So when we left off, I was just, yeah, lecturing.

01:35:54.100 It wasn't right, but I had to do it, Anna Marie, about saying assigned male at birth or assigned

01:35:59.640 female at birth as opposed to like just born a boy or born a girl.

01:36:03.160 I don't know.

01:36:03.780 I'm over any of the gentle language.

01:36:06.180 I'm all pro-truth.

01:36:07.300 But what do you think, Marcellus?

01:36:08.300 I mean, your wife is probably nicer than the two of us.

01:36:11.500 I don't know.

01:36:12.840 Yeah.

01:36:13.420 You know, it's interesting times, man.

01:36:15.620 It feels like I got to a party so early that the DJ wasn't set up.

01:36:20.760 No food was out.

01:36:22.060 No drinks there.

01:36:23.320 I've been saying this for so long and now everyone's like on board and I'm like, all

01:36:27.300 right, I'm glad we can all dance together now because the truth has always been there.

01:36:31.860 And it's just unfortunate so many people want to read the temperature and gauge the

01:36:37.280 winds and see when is it the best time to tell the truth instead of all the time.

01:36:42.860 I think we will be much more unified if we just live by that truth instead of how we're

01:36:48.440 feeling and some of the pandering that comes along with it.

01:36:51.500 So I love the fact that my wife is speaking out and speaking the truth.

01:36:56.520 There was a time where that headwind was strong in her world and all of us have been

01:37:01.560 through it.

01:37:02.640 I was just born with a disposition and raised in a condition where I didn't give a damn

01:37:08.260 from hello.

01:37:09.060 And I'm glad to see more people are doing the same.

01:37:11.960 Yes.

01:37:12.580 I know.

01:37:13.040 Honestly, it's a, it's a journey for a lot of people.

01:37:15.100 And I think girls in particular are raised to be nice, quote, nice.

01:37:18.420 And so, you know, they don't want to do anything that would just be unnecessarily offensive to

01:37:22.760 people.

01:37:22.980 That's a totally normal and laudable instinct.

01:37:25.860 I submit that it's been taken advantage of by not well-meaning activists who are exploiting

01:37:33.220 it to hurt our young girls.

01:37:34.380 And so we, as adult women need to say, no, no, we're done.

01:37:38.020 We're done doing that.

01:37:39.520 Um, okay.

01:37:40.060 I want to talk to you about where we are on the sports thing, Marcellus, because we have

01:37:44.500 made leaps and bounds.

01:37:45.560 I think Elon's buying X was instrumental in getting us all to be able to talk about what's

01:37:50.520 real fundamentally.

01:37:52.020 But now it got to the point where this was the deciding thing in the last election.

01:37:56.240 This was at least one of the, I think it was the, in the swing states, but at least one

01:37:59.960 of the top items in the last election.

01:38:02.320 And so I wondered now, like in four years, whether you think there's any chance this pendulum

01:38:07.840 swings back the other way, if God forbid, we have a Kamala Harris presidency, by the way,

01:38:14.920 that she's already talking about running again.

01:38:17.000 Yeah.

01:38:17.820 Yeah.

01:38:18.360 I've heard.

01:38:19.240 And I've seen, uh, she, she dressed in the park now she's, uh, she's stepping up the

01:38:23.840 garb so she could look more presidential.

01:38:26.140 I've noticed already.

01:38:27.740 Good luck with that.

01:38:30.620 Yeah.

01:38:31.100 You know, I think, look, there's an overcorrection all the time in societies.

01:38:35.640 If you just study world history, you know, that there's always a swing of the tides and

01:38:40.860 then they will go in excess and other way just to find that happy medium.

01:38:45.300 I don't think on this issue, when you're talking about sports and if we're talking about transgender

01:38:49.320 rights, um, that this issue will swing back in a different direction.

01:38:53.880 Uh, this issue was already misplaced from hello based off of the.

01:38:59.880 Uh, social elements, not the biological elements.

01:39:03.420 So that conflation had a lot of people confused.

01:39:06.540 And look, I understand the power dynamics in our country.

01:39:10.300 Um, I know when that headwind is in front of you and is facing you, you're saying, do I

01:39:16.260 speak to power?

01:39:17.360 And a lot of people felt like they couldn't, but there was this brewing silent majority

01:39:23.500 that happened not only in politics, but in sports that was saying, man, if somebody doesn't step out

01:39:29.180 and say what it is, what's going to happen?

01:39:31.980 And finally, that first domino fell, whoever that may have been, wherever they may have

01:39:37.180 be, they may be, but it all adds up to now you have that strength.

01:39:42.920 Now you have that courage.

01:39:44.680 Now you have that movement.

01:39:45.860 And I don't think it moves back in the other direction.

01:39:48.520 The Democrats aren't able to let it go, uh, which has gotten them a lot of criticism, even

01:39:53.280 from their side, because smart people realize this is a loser of an issue.

01:39:58.260 Here was Charlamagne Tha God talking about it just the other day on his show, SOT 31.

01:40:05.580 Why are folks still talking about trans athletes?

01:40:08.060 Like that is a losing talking point.

01:40:09.920 America's not with it.

01:40:10.980 And they keep making a micro or macro with that conversation.

01:40:13.940 It impacts such a small, small group of people, but it makes a whole lot of people think folks

01:40:18.840 lack common sense.

01:40:19.880 So why are they even having that conversation?

01:40:21.660 And I can't believe it's states that still want to die on that hill.

01:40:24.760 Like none of these states have a high percentage of trans athletes.

01:40:27.140 So what do you, what, what's the issue?

01:40:30.360 So what do you make of that?

01:40:31.560 I mean, what do you think of that?

01:40:32.300 Anna Maria, Anna Maria, let me ask you, because it's, I think it's mostly Democrats doing that.

01:40:37.100 The Republicans have said how they feel and Trump won.

01:40:39.740 So they're ready to move on.

01:40:40.660 But the Democrats, if you turn into CNN or MSNBC, they're still very obsessed with this.

01:40:46.120 They're still fighting for this.

01:40:47.040 They're still putting on men posing as women, trying to claim that they can't have their

01:40:51.000 so-called rights shut down by Trump executive orders.

01:40:53.200 Yeah, you know, I'm asked all the time, because I'm very vocal about this on my social media

01:40:59.680 pages specifically.

01:41:02.160 People are like, it affects such a small percentage of people.

01:41:06.300 Why do you care so much about this issue?

01:41:08.080 And I think really the issue surrounding it is, it's kind of like, it's turning up the

01:41:13.700 temperature little bits at a time to see what we as a society will tolerate.

01:41:19.280 And so I think people that can foresee the bigger issue that this becomes, if you are

01:41:25.400 allowing, you know, someone born male to compete against women and, you know, you're essentially

01:41:31.580 erasing what it means to be female biologically, then what is going to happen next?

01:41:37.840 What comes after this?

01:41:39.240 Like things will just, dominoes will keep falling.

01:41:41.860 And, you know, I don't want my girls to look up 10, 20 years from now and be like, where

01:41:48.640 did this all come from?

01:41:50.240 Oh, I think what you mean is you're for future inseminated persons.

01:41:56.140 Oh, right.

01:41:57.280 Right.

01:41:58.260 And, you know, they're going to say, where did this come from?

01:42:00.240 And I can't live with myself, you know, knowing that I didn't say anything about it at the

01:42:05.820 time, about how, how ludicrous this issue actually is.

01:42:09.600 And the fact that people, you know, won't speak out against it.

01:42:13.200 Women who label themselves feminists won't speak out against it.

01:42:16.860 Women won't speak out against it.

01:42:18.240 And I did mention this on my social media, you know, there's a reason why people are always

01:42:23.660 silent on this issue, because if you say something about it, if you speak out against

01:42:29.240 trans athletes competing in women's sports, that's when you get labeled.

01:42:33.120 Like these words are, you call you a bigot, you call you a bigot.

01:42:37.300 They call you transphobic.

01:42:38.440 These use, these words are used as weapons in order to scare people into silence.

01:42:44.640 And they don't want to lose endorsements.

01:42:46.580 They don't want to lose contracts, but that is what I've, you know, we've been at events

01:42:51.120 where we've seen female athletes speaking on panels.

01:42:54.240 And then when they were, you know, when they're telling us quietly, like, oh, it's crazy.

01:42:58.060 Or they're texting us.

01:42:59.020 That's crazy.

01:42:59.720 But then when you, when they're asked by the moderator, that exact question, they will

01:43:03.880 go into a very, very PC answer.

01:43:06.560 And you're thinking to yourself, really?

01:43:08.600 You were, oh yes.

01:43:10.180 Oh, absolutely.

01:43:10.820 If you were competing against a biological male in your sport, you wouldn't be who you

01:43:16.860 are.

01:43:17.680 You wouldn't have your records.

01:43:19.320 You wouldn't have all your gold medals.

01:43:21.100 Like that would not be a thing.

01:43:22.620 So for someone to, you know, people are so afraid to speak up about this because they're

01:43:27.300 afraid of getting canceled like I was for it.

01:43:29.980 Yeah.

01:43:30.360 And you know, it's really not that deep.

01:43:34.560 And this is what's irritating about our political climate right now and how I try to even invade

01:43:40.300 sports culture.

01:43:41.940 There are two genders and anyone else has anything else to say about that.

01:43:46.060 I'm going to judge you outwardly and tell you that I don't think it's highly of you as

01:43:51.020 I did before you answered that.

01:43:52.580 Now, from that point on, you can look at the truth any way you want, but there's an absolute

01:43:57.820 truth to that.

01:43:59.280 Now, if you want to carve that up any way you want to and say, well, there's a little truth,

01:44:04.600 well, then that's when we start to get into where we are currently, which is I'm going

01:44:09.920 to say things and pandering to make sure that I keep my safe position wherever I am on the

01:44:16.860 scale of things.

01:44:17.740 And that's the problem.

01:44:18.640 It's so obvious that when you talk about the issue biologically, that there's a difference

01:44:24.640 and it should be respected, right?

01:44:27.000 Like there's no like advantage, disadvantage if you want to add it all up.

01:44:31.220 Yeah, I could beat my wife running, maybe.

01:44:33.580 You can beat me in anything.

01:44:34.580 Yeah, yeah, maybe.

01:44:35.600 All right, most things.

01:44:37.000 Physical.

01:44:37.720 But then she can bring life.

01:44:39.220 Like people don't look at the whole perspective of this stuff like, oh, I'm trying to beat a

01:44:44.660 woman in track and that's all it's about.

01:44:46.800 No, this is a conversation that should be based off of the truth, which is a man and a woman

01:44:53.860 are different for biological reasons.

01:44:56.660 And it's been respected for many years in sports.

01:45:00.020 And then it got invaded by a lot of these political and social issues.

01:45:04.860 I'm glad they're out.

01:45:05.860 And hopefully like Charlemagne.

01:45:07.600 So you're a football player.

01:45:08.720 I think about my kids, so they, uh, my boys now are, uh, 15 and 11 and, uh, my 15 year

01:45:16.360 old, who's a freshman in high school.

01:45:17.320 Now they have to play a sport in seventh grade for school.

01:45:21.660 And so a lot of them, most of them play football in the fall season, but they play seventh and

01:45:26.840 eighth together.

01:45:27.440 And some of the schools have seven, eight, nine together.

01:45:29.540 And you know, a boy in ninth grade versus a boy at the beginning of seventh grade, that

01:45:34.040 can be like a man playing a little boy, right?

01:45:36.940 Like it could be a post pubescent boy.

01:45:39.520 It looks like a man versus this little scrawny, skinny, right?

01:45:43.680 Like sinewy guy.

01:45:45.100 It's dangerous.

01:45:45.960 And that is the same thing as a woman trying to play male football or putting a woman into

01:45:52.900 a male sport.

01:45:53.740 Like that's the level of danger.

01:45:55.240 We moms on the sideline would be like, Oh my God.

01:45:58.180 Oh my God.

01:45:58.840 Like, Oh, I hope he lives.

01:46:01.580 And the thought of it being a girl who's not even going to touch the levels of testosterone

01:46:07.320 starting to come into that.

01:46:08.600 Even the scrawny boy's body.

01:46:10.140 It's downright scary.

01:46:11.820 You know, it's like, we would never look at NFL football and say, where are all the

01:46:16.000 women?

01:46:17.160 Yeah, it's scary.

01:46:19.640 And it was stupid.

01:46:20.640 And look, people thought I was being like, like just extreme or I was crazy.

01:46:25.920 I was like, my daughters are not competing against a transgender male.

01:46:29.380 It's not happening.

01:46:30.960 Anybody who comes out there and plays against my daughters and I have three daughters, they're

01:46:36.620 going to have to be of the same biology because I went to me a few years ago before it was

01:46:41.200 in vogue.

01:46:42.380 Yeah.

01:46:43.160 And it wasn't, and please judge me if you want, but I am not what you're saying.

01:46:49.100 I'm, I'm sensible if anything.

01:46:51.800 And I just know it.

01:46:53.060 I'm an athlete.

01:46:53.900 I know what I can do.

01:46:54.960 And I'm a washed up athlete who could still go out there with the best women, give them

01:47:00.020 some run for their business because I still have that testosterone.

01:47:04.560 I am a person who went through puberty as a male and it's a whole different animal.

01:47:08.820 Okay.

01:47:09.260 Now, speaking of football, you have to, you have to, you have to walk through me with

01:47:13.580 the controversy that I got involved in this week.

01:47:15.960 Kind of not through my own fault.

01:47:18.120 Exactly.

01:47:18.360 But the sun, uh, newspaper had a report that the Eagles were not going to go to the white

01:47:25.100 house to celebrate their win.

01:47:26.380 And I retweeted it telling them to F off.

01:47:28.980 Oh, and this, this was bad because it wasn't true.

01:47:34.540 As it turns out, it was, the sun was fake news and they hadn't even been asked to go

01:47:39.480 to the white house, much less refused.

01:47:42.000 Now the sun was reporting that they had spoke with somebody on the, they had spoken with

01:47:45.960 somebody on the ownership team.

01:47:46.940 And that person had said zero chance we're going to go.

01:47:49.460 And they did refuse to go when they won the Superbowl in 2018.

01:47:53.800 But now in the wake of all this, people who are connected to the Eagles are reporting and,

01:48:00.200 uh, the white house is confirming that they have not yet been asked, but that the Eagles

01:48:03.580 will go if asked, which would, I think, induce Trump to ask them.

01:48:08.360 So it could have a very happy ending.

01:48:10.440 But what is it about the Trump white house?

01:48:14.400 Do you think that makes it even a question mark that the Eagles wouldn't go in 2018 and

01:48:19.780 at least somebody connected to the ownership told the sun there's hell.

01:48:24.100 No, we are definitely not going to go if we win this game.

01:48:27.780 Yeah.

01:48:28.380 And it's sad to see the seesaw effect happen where, oh, don't ask us.

01:48:32.740 And then it's like the white house saying, well, we don't want to be embarrassed by asking

01:48:36.160 and getting rejected.

01:48:37.080 So both sides are sitting there playing this little cat mouse game when you should obviously

01:48:41.900 not only be honored to go see whoever the president is, but the opportunity to go to the white

01:48:48.760 house, like we just did last week.

01:48:51.020 Um, this is so ass backwards when you talk about why do people reject their opportunity

01:48:57.820 to go to the white house?

01:48:59.080 Well, I can tell you from my perspective, I see the Philadelphia Eagles, maybe some of their

01:49:04.560 players, if they reject that opportunity, like they did in the past, it's based on, they

01:49:09.420 don't want to be called a sellout.

01:49:10.680 Exactly.

01:49:11.240 It's as simple as that.

01:49:12.360 Now, I've been called a sellout so many times that I'm like, well, uh, rather that label

01:49:17.960 than being someone who's not living their truth, not living the truth, not respecting and honoring

01:49:23.580 the presidency.

01:49:25.120 When we all live in this country, we pay our taxes.

01:49:28.140 We have a huge amount of trust for him as he runs this country.

01:49:31.620 But at the same time, you don't want that opportunity.

01:49:34.740 That's fine.

01:49:35.520 But the reason that it's not fine is because they're caring about the label that will be

01:49:42.280 put on them very few times.

01:49:44.180 Just define sellout.

01:49:45.500 Like, what do you mean?

01:49:46.140 Put some meat on that bone.

01:49:47.040 Uh, yeah, well, for me, it will be a black person who doesn't speak for the black cultures,

01:49:54.160 not thinking about all black people, which is crazy because we are not a monolith.

01:49:58.920 But now I'm supposed to act a certain way, speak a certain way, and define my actions a

01:50:04.800 certain way for the whole group.

01:50:06.780 Um, I'm not in the group think.

01:50:08.220 I don't even believe in power of the people.

01:50:10.340 I believe in power of the person.

01:50:11.760 There's not a single group out there, white, black, tall, short, that you could say all

01:50:17.320 are the same.

01:50:18.560 So none of us should speak for all of us.

01:50:21.220 That's my mindset.

01:50:22.740 But sellout is, from the black perspective, oh, man, you're just doing what white people

01:50:27.160 want you to do, or you're not thinking for black people.

01:50:30.480 And that is a old mindset that needs to be discarded if you really want to go forward.

01:50:37.640 I hope you're right, because Trump definitely reached out to all communities when he was

01:50:41.520 running and then showed up at the game.

01:50:43.280 You know, no president's ever gone to the big game before.

01:50:45.860 That was great, right?

01:50:47.120 And he he was there.

01:50:48.160 He's cheering on both teams.

01:50:49.300 I really hope it works out.

01:50:50.860 I think it's a unifying moment for the country when that happens.

01:50:53.800 Yeah, it's what's wild, Megan, is the fact that I met Donald Trump twice.

01:50:57.360 And this is pre-politics.

01:50:58.940 So this is when everyone loved him.

01:51:00.900 And, you know, I judged the Miss Universe pageant back in 2003.

01:51:05.180 And it was the biggest honor.

01:51:07.840 And everyone was pumped.

01:51:08.900 Donald Trump was in the building.

01:51:10.600 You fast forward a few years.

01:51:12.400 I have a friend who was a member at Trump in New Jersey.

01:51:16.060 When we're out there and he's just on the putting green.

01:51:18.260 Next thing you know, we're talking.

01:51:19.400 Next thing you know, we're having breakfast together.

01:51:21.440 Best time.

01:51:22.140 You say that now?

01:51:24.200 Oh, dog, what are you doing?

01:51:26.100 Why would you ever want to golf with Donald Trump?

01:51:27.960 Like, it's like, are you shitting me?

01:51:29.680 You haven't even met him.

01:51:30.740 So a lot of times they want to say, well, the policies.

01:51:33.760 I was like, yeah, he's canceling Black history, but he's inviting hundreds of Black people to the White House for Black History Month to celebrate it.

01:51:42.900 So it's very hard to figure out his racism.

01:51:46.080 Very confusing racism.

01:51:47.160 That's a crazy way to show you're racist.

01:51:49.280 So I asked your beautiful wife about this, and she said for me to ask you, but is it true you don't believe in Black History Month?

01:51:55.780 No, I don't like Black History Month.

01:51:58.500 I got jokes, too.

01:51:59.680 Like, first of all, it's the shortest month, so stop it.

01:52:01.660 But no, too, like, there's no White History Month, and I understand we have different history, but I don't need anyone to single out one time where we're going to talk and really lean into all the things that are Black.

01:52:13.600 Like, if you're not going to do it all the time, don't do it any time, and I'm going to do it the rest of the time.

01:52:17.480 You know, like, I hate when people, like, give you this little handicap sticker in lane and say, all right, it's your turn.

01:52:25.080 All right, go.

01:52:25.640 It's almost like when you're coaching a kid that you know is not good, and everyone knows we're winning by, like, 90 points.

01:52:31.260 It's like, all right, finally put them in.

01:52:32.860 And that's what it feels like, Black History Month.

01:52:36.180 I always have pride in my Black history.

01:52:38.720 I always have pride in my Black presence.

01:52:41.120 So why do I need this country to single it out?

01:52:44.700 I don't like any of the identity politics when it comes to holidays, any of them.

01:52:49.540 And especially when you have to identify them, it feels like BET, and BET is now white-owned.

01:52:56.080 But even when it was Black-owned, I was like, I don't need to see BET because I would hate to see wet, white entertainment television.

01:53:04.020 And then people are saying, oh, no, that's every channel.

01:53:06.280 And I'm like, look, whatever it is, don't single me out, pander to me, pet me on the head, and coddle me.

01:53:12.940 I'll be fine.

01:53:13.760 I'll be fine myself.

01:53:15.360 I totally agree with you.

01:53:17.460 I feel the same thing about Women's History Month.

01:53:20.140 It's like, of course, the kids, every other month they're going into another one of these things.

01:53:24.820 And I have to say, my son, he asked a really good question.

01:53:27.480 He's like, it just seems like our priorities are really screwed up when we have like a Pride Month and a Veterans Day.

01:53:34.380 Like, right on, honey.

01:53:36.120 You got it exactly.

01:53:38.440 Anyway, you guys, thank you.

01:53:39.600 It's wonderful to see you both, Marcellus, Anna Marie.

01:53:41.860 Please come back.

01:53:42.940 And thanks to all of you guys for joining us today.

01:53:45.320 We'll see you tomorrow, and we will see you tomorrow morning for AM Update.

01:53:51.960 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show.

01:53:53.840 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - February 25, 2025

Elitist Maddow Smears MSNBC Bosses, and Culture Shift on Biological Reality, with Batya Ungar-Sargon, and Marcellus and Annemarie Wiley ｜ Ep. 1013

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