The Megyn Kelly Show - Exclusive with Montana Parents Who Had Daughter Taken Away, Plus New Fani Willis Drama, with Sara Gonzales, Josh Hammer, and David Menzies

00:00:00.520 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:12.040 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:15.640 We begin today with a stunning story out of Montana.

00:00:19.720 You may have seen the news about the couple that has lost custody of their 14-year-old daughter

00:00:25.360 over what they believe is their refusal to affirm her gender confusion, a parent's worst nightmare.

00:00:34.160 Today, these parents join me live for an exclusive interview.

00:00:37.620 Todd and Krista Kolstad have chosen to tell their story, despite a court order demanding that they remain silent.

00:00:45.900 America First learned about their play in a lengthy video statement that Todd and Krista felt they were forced to reveal to the world,

00:00:52.100 and they posted online detailing what happened with their daughter.

00:00:57.360 Here's a small portion.

00:00:58.760 We're set to lose custody of our daughter because allowing her to be transgender is in her therapeutic interest

00:01:05.440 and we are not following recommended therapy.

00:01:07.980 Our daughter has been in the group home setting.

00:01:10.760 We have had numerous meetings regarding our wishes for her not to be referred to as a boy.

00:01:15.340 Our wishes are for the program to be therapy-based and allow our family unit to continue to have the right

00:01:21.860 to parent our daughter as we seek it to maintain her care.

00:01:26.160 Our daughter is only referred to there as Leo, he, and him.

00:01:30.260 This is kind of gendering our child against our wishes.

00:01:33.320 This is a medical kidnapping and this needs to stop.

00:01:35.580 They are here today to tell their full story.

00:01:39.300 At the parents' request, we will not use their daughter's real name in this interview.

00:01:43.340 Instead, we will be referring to her by the name Jennifer.

00:01:49.280 Welcome to the show, Todd and Krista.

00:01:50.880 I'm so sorry.

00:01:51.740 I'm so sorry that you're going through this.

00:01:53.400 This is a nightmare.

00:01:54.980 I appreciate you coming on to tell the story here.

00:01:57.420 So, first of all, it's shocking that this happened in Montana.

00:02:00.100 You know, I might have believed California.

00:02:01.920 When I hear stuff like this happening in Canada, I'm slightly less shocked.

00:02:06.500 But Montana, this I don't get.

00:02:09.900 So, let's just start back with the problems with Jennifer before this.

00:02:15.440 You knew that Jennifer was having some mental health issues before the gender confusion.

00:02:21.020 Is that correct?

00:02:22.500 That's correct.

00:02:23.600 She's always, she struggled with bullying at school for many years.

00:02:27.160 And she's had a few traumatic events in her young life that we sought counseling for and

00:02:33.360 tried to help her as much as we could as her parents kind of get through those events.

00:02:38.880 And just so the audience understands, Todd, you are Jennifer's biological dad.

00:02:45.200 And Krista, you are her stepmom.

00:02:47.340 Her biological mom lives in Canada, correct?

00:02:50.920 That is correct.

00:02:51.760 Okay, and she, how many children did you and Jennifer's birth mom have together, Todd?

00:02:59.240 Five.

00:03:00.680 Five kids, okay.

00:03:02.200 And so, has the biological mother been involved in raising Jennifer at all?

00:03:08.760 No, because I have a son that resides with her.

00:03:13.960 And at the time of the divorce, Jennifer was with myself.

00:03:19.780 And so, it's for that reason.

00:03:24.760 Okay.

00:03:25.360 And I understand, just from reading the papers, Krista, that, because this will become relevant

00:03:29.560 later, the times that Jennifer has gone up to visit her biological mom in Canada have

00:03:36.420 been relatively few.

00:03:38.580 And they haven't gone particularly well.

00:03:40.360 These two are not close from your observations anyway.

00:03:44.300 She's actually never been to Canada to see her biological mother.

00:03:48.140 The biological mother moved to Canada and got remarried about seven years ago.

00:03:54.700 Jennifer, our daughter, has seen her biological mother one time in the last seven years.

00:04:01.500 One time.

00:04:02.880 And my understanding is that there has been some allegations with respect to that mom's

00:04:09.020 conduct toward the children that have given you two some concern.

00:04:13.500 That's correct, yes.

00:04:14.920 Okay, so the bottom line is you two have been raising Jennifer since birth.

00:04:22.340 I have been in Todd's life since Jennifer was about six, going on seven.

00:04:27.700 But Todd has raised her since birth, primarily as a single parent, yes.

00:04:32.960 Yes, okay.

00:04:33.960 So, Jennifer starts manifesting some mental health issues.

00:04:38.200 It's not uncommon, certainly, you know, in today's day and age in general.

00:04:43.420 And when there have been divorces and all that, it can just complicate a kid's life.

00:04:47.400 There's all sorts of reasons why kids wind up feeling unhappy or depressed.

00:04:50.980 And before she said anything about gender confusion, how was Jennifer saying that she was unhappy?

00:04:58.940 Was she saying things like, I'm depressed, I'm suicidal, before the gender stuff?

00:05:04.480 Never.

00:05:04.960 No, never.

00:05:06.500 She's always been very sympathetic to people that feel suicidal, but she's always made the

00:05:13.120 statement that that's not what she would do, that she loves life, you know, and that she's

00:05:18.600 primarily struggling with bullying, which led to some depression issues with her.

00:05:24.860 Okay.

00:05:25.140 So, what was the first clue you two got that now we've transitioned into something new?

00:05:32.160 Jennifer's only 14 years old.

00:05:33.800 We've transitioned into, I'm not just depressed, I'm a boy.

00:05:38.240 I think I might not be female.

00:05:39.580 I think from our church, there are some people saying, referring to our daughter as our son,

00:05:50.940 and some of the other people that are like counselors, that kind of thing.

00:05:56.180 They said that she was telling people her name was Leo and she was a boy.

00:06:02.140 Anyway, when we asked her about it, she denied it, and that would have been probably about

00:06:08.100 a little over two years ago.

00:06:10.680 Okay.

00:06:11.200 So, she was only 12 years old.

00:06:12.740 So, she denied it to you.

00:06:14.000 Did she start to look more masculine in her clothing, her hair, that kind of thing, or no?

00:06:19.980 Not really.

00:06:20.860 We used to allow her to color her hair, and then she had an incident in seventh grade where

00:06:28.780 she got into an argument with another person over her hair color.

00:06:32.300 So, we just said, okay, well, no more hair color for a while.

00:06:35.660 You're obviously not mature enough to have different color hair as a kid, but she wasn't

00:06:41.180 appearing herself as a boy.

00:06:43.040 We've always let her pick her own clothes, but the way that we do that is she would put

00:06:47.020 the clothes in the Amazon cart, and then we would look at them and say, okay, this

00:06:50.820 isn't an appropriate shirt, this isn't an appropriate shirt, and let her buy what we

00:06:54.800 felt was appropriate.

00:06:56.960 You know, she's always been a jeans and t-shirt kid, never super dressy or anything like that,

00:07:03.380 but never men's clothes.

00:07:05.980 Yeah, same.

00:07:07.020 I mean, I've told the audience before, I was a complete tomboy as a child doesn't mean

00:07:10.340 you're a boy.

00:07:10.900 So, there'd be no clue there.

00:07:12.200 I'm just wondering where, like, how recently did she start to go more hardcore on the,

00:07:20.180 I'm a boy and I want you to call me Leo?

00:07:23.480 Well, there was, after what we mentioned two years ago, there was nothing for a couple years.

00:07:29.580 There was nothing to do with any of that.

00:07:32.420 She was happy.

00:07:33.760 Life was really good.

00:07:35.260 It wasn't until her summer job called and asked if our son could come in to work early.

00:07:44.140 So, that's where it came back off.

00:07:46.520 And that would have been during this, I think, the early to mid part of this last August, August

00:07:53.320 2023.

00:07:55.660 So, that's the first you found out she was out there representing herself as male.

00:07:59.820 I mean, that must have been quite a stunner.

00:08:01.220 We were shocked.

00:08:04.060 You know, we had, when she had said at the church that she wanted to go as Leo, we had

00:08:08.560 put her in counseling and we had a talk with her and we said, why don't we look at why do

00:08:15.580 you feel this way?

00:08:16.540 Why do you not like yourself so much that you don't feel you have self-worth and self-value

00:08:21.940 that you want to change everything about yourself, even your sex?

00:08:26.500 And so, we put her into counseling, having them discuss that with her.

00:08:30.320 And she went through about six, eight months of counseling.

00:08:32.940 So, we thought we were in a different place.

00:08:36.440 Do you know now whether that counselor was one of those affirm, affirm, affirm counselors

00:08:43.160 or whether it was a legitimate counselor who explored all mental health issues?

00:08:47.960 They were not an affirm, affirm, affirm counselor.

00:08:50.740 We met with them prior.

00:08:52.980 This is someone that we knew through the church and we were pretty comfortable with that they

00:08:58.600 were on the same page as we were.

00:09:00.860 Just reading up on your story, I have to say, you two seem pretty clued in on the gender

00:09:07.320 insanity that's being pushed at every turn.

00:09:10.480 I mean, we'll get to the details of the story, but you seem pretty clued in on, no, we're not

00:09:15.580 going to let you talk to our daughter alone.

00:09:17.720 No, we're not going to just ship her off to a state that transes kids with medical procedures.

00:09:23.740 Had you guys been following this in the news?

00:09:26.640 Because I think many parents would not have had the awareness that you two do.

00:09:31.340 Not exactly following in the news or anything like that.

00:09:34.960 It's just we have a firm belief that, you know, transgenderism is more on the make-believe

00:09:41.300 scale than on something that is appropriate for a child.

00:09:45.280 You know, we felt, in addition, we felt pretty safe from that being in Montana because the

00:09:51.580 schools that our daughter went to where we live are fantastic.

00:09:57.220 The staff is fantastic.

00:09:59.160 The counselors, everything is good.

00:10:01.580 So we never would have seen this coming.

00:10:04.880 You never would have suspected it.

00:10:06.300 Yeah, of course.

00:10:06.980 I mean, in California, you could go to school during school hours and get cross-gender hormones

00:10:11.160 from the Planned Parenthood clinic, and the school will allow it and never tell your parents.

00:10:16.080 Montana, very different story.

00:10:18.620 So now we're in August, and you get the call saying, you know, your son, Leo, and the work,

00:10:23.400 and you're, I mean, that's got to set off the five-alarm fire.

00:10:26.780 So what happened between you and Jennifer?

00:10:30.300 We'll get to when CPS showed up, but like from August to when Child and Family Services starts

00:10:35.640 knocking on your door, which would be this past fall.

00:10:38.260 What was going on?

00:10:38.920 It was really just a matter of a couple days.

00:10:41.780 So we had discussed, Todd and I, that she probably, school was going to start that Monday,

00:10:47.500 I believe the 21st.

00:10:48.560 It could have been Tuesday the 22nd, but school was about to start in a few days.

00:10:52.400 And Todd and I had discussed that we felt she needed to focus on going into ninth grade,

00:10:57.660 having a clean slate this year, and kind of getting on track.

00:11:00.820 So we wanted her to quit her summer job.

00:11:03.060 But we discussed with her, if you're doing great, by the Christmas semester, you can go

00:11:09.220 back and work one or two days a week, and we'll incorporate it into your school year.

00:11:13.360 We just want you to stop and focus on school right now.

00:11:16.480 At that point, she was very, very angry with us, and didn't agree with us, of course, and

00:11:21.460 made the statements to another child that she met at a track meet that she had wanted to

00:11:28.600 kill herself, and that's when the whole thing kicked off.

00:11:31.020 So it was really like that day when Children's Services got involved with us.

00:11:35.920 And what day is that?

00:11:37.420 August 18th.

00:11:39.500 Okay.

00:11:40.420 Because in the affidavit that they submitted, Child and Family Services, they say someone

00:11:45.900 called them concerned about Jennifer.

00:11:48.020 Do we know who that was?

00:11:50.160 I do know who that was, yeah.

00:11:51.600 It was the child that she was making these statements to.

00:11:55.220 Okay.

00:11:55.880 That makes sense.

00:11:56.700 So the next thing you know, was the first sign of serious trouble you had in the moments

00:12:06.440 leading up to this hospitalization and the removal of Jennifer, that Division of Child

00:12:10.920 and Family Services showed up?

00:12:12.400 Was that what happened that day to clue you in?

00:12:14.240 Like, oh my God, we've gone to DEFCON 1?

00:12:16.200 Or was it Jennifer coming to you both saying, no, it's really escalated now.

00:12:20.880 I'm suicidal.

00:12:22.120 Like, what happened that day to tell you it was getting bad?

00:12:25.260 That particular day, we were having a good day at home.

00:12:31.080 We had friends and employees over at our house.

00:12:35.140 And it was nice out.

00:12:36.600 And we just brought back a new small Aussie Shepherd dog.

00:12:40.680 And so she was happy that day.

00:12:42.880 But at the same point, you could tell there was maybe a little bit something wrong.

00:12:48.320 But she was happy.

00:12:49.160 And she was in and out of the house a lot.

00:12:50.780 But we, nothing to be alarmed about.

00:12:56.020 Okay.

00:12:56.720 And then what happened?

00:12:58.300 So then at, it was exactly 1.48, because I keep a pretty detailed timeline of the events.

00:13:04.480 An officer called us from our local police department and said that our daughter had

00:13:09.700 made statements to another child that she had wanted to kill herself.

00:13:14.480 And how did we feel about that?

00:13:16.560 Did we feel that she was safe?

00:13:18.000 So while I was on the phone with this officer, I walked down the hallway to Jennifer's room.

00:13:23.380 And I spoke to her.

00:13:24.500 And I said, you know, this is going on.

00:13:26.400 This police officer is on the phone.

00:13:28.140 How do you feel about, like, what's going on here?

00:13:30.220 How do you feel about this?

00:13:31.780 How, where are you at?

00:13:33.400 You know.

00:13:33.980 And she, she presented us fine.

00:13:36.920 She was mad at us.

00:13:37.860 And we knew she was mad at us.

00:13:39.060 But she, she made no remarks like, well, I am going to kill myself.

00:13:43.080 She didn't say anything like that.

00:13:44.780 So the police officer was on the phone with me.

00:13:47.160 He could hear the conversation.

00:13:49.000 And he, you know, I stepped back in the other room and I told him that I would keep an eye

00:13:52.800 on her.

00:13:53.180 If I felt there was danger, I would definitely transport her to the hospital and keep in touch

00:13:57.520 with authorities.

00:13:59.020 And that was at 1.48.

00:14:01.060 At approximately 7.40 that evening is when Children's Services came to our house because

00:14:05.840 they said the police officer could not speak to the child or lay eyes on the child, even

00:14:10.960 though he had never asked to do that.

00:14:12.460 Hmm.

00:14:14.360 This is still in August, this past August.

00:14:16.740 So.

00:14:16.940 Yep.

00:14:17.120 That was August 18th.

00:14:18.540 Yes.

00:14:19.140 Why was she mad that day?

00:14:20.420 What was the fight about?

00:14:22.720 She, go ahead.

00:14:23.820 She, she didn't want to quit her summer job.

00:14:26.700 And, and I started looking at it.

00:14:28.700 It was all the same day.

00:14:29.800 This was all.

00:14:30.740 Because, um, in hindsight, the way to understand that the easiest is she had kind of built

00:14:36.240 in hindsight, we didn't know this at the time, but she had kind of built a little

00:14:40.380 mini environment, I think where she worked, where everybody knew her as a boy named Leo

00:14:44.260 and that world was imploding with school starting.

00:14:48.280 And she already had anxieties about starting school that year.

00:14:52.120 So, but even though she was a really good student, very high grades and everything.

00:14:57.440 Hmm.

00:14:57.980 Okay.

00:14:58.380 So she was mad that she wasn't going to be able to go back there.

00:15:01.640 And the next thing you know, that's seven, whatever that evening, CPS shows up.

00:15:06.880 And Krista, were you, were you both there or were you there too, Todd?

00:15:11.120 Yes.

00:15:11.560 Us.

00:15:11.880 And we had, um, friends over too.

00:15:14.260 We, we had to be very like, I can't imagine that must be very, very jarring to have division

00:15:20.160 of child and family services show up and start questioning your parenting and whether your

00:15:24.180 child is safe in your home.

00:15:25.780 You have you ever had that happen before?

00:15:28.460 No, no, we've never been involved with them before.

00:15:32.760 And I should have asked you this before, but what do you guys do for a living?

00:15:35.720 Tell us just a little bit about your regular life outside of this.

00:15:38.420 Well, we own a company that manages networks, does computer repair in, um, in both Kalispell

00:15:48.560 area and in Northeast Montana as well.

00:15:51.620 And I, and I recently retired as a mortician in, in Montana also.

00:15:56.760 And I came on to help him with the company more.

00:15:59.780 And what part of Montana are you in?

00:16:02.640 In Valley County.

00:16:04.400 Okay.

00:16:05.560 So you, you're just living regular lives.

00:16:08.200 You're, you're not used to getting called by police or having child services come over

00:16:13.000 that, but they did come.

00:16:14.320 And what happened when they showed up?

00:16:17.320 So when, when the worker showed up, um, like I said, it was about seven 40 in the evening

00:16:21.700 and I was making dinner because we had had a really late lunch that day.

00:16:25.320 We've been working in the yard.

00:16:26.840 So, um, I gave her a tour of the house and I kept telling her, I'm like, I'm not real.

00:16:30.840 Do you need to see every room in the house?

00:16:32.740 Like, how does this work?

00:16:33.860 I don't really know what you need.

00:16:35.580 So I even took her into our personal bathroom and bedroom.

00:16:39.740 Um, we renovated and we had an apartment downstairs that was empty at the time.

00:16:43.780 And I showed her that, took her all through that.

00:16:46.040 And she was like, yeah, okay, well, this is, this is good.

00:16:48.800 This is great.

00:16:49.700 And then she had said she wanted to talk to our daughter and, um, she wanted to talk to

00:16:54.700 her alone.

00:16:55.200 And I wasn't real sure what the procedures were.

00:16:57.600 So at first I said, oh, okay.

00:16:59.760 And they went out on the front porch and began talking.

00:17:02.180 And then after about 10 minutes or so, I was like, I don't know that I feel okay with

00:17:07.920 this.

00:17:08.100 Like this feels weird and wrong and scary.

00:17:12.600 And so that's when Todd and I went on the front porch and we were told that our daughter

00:17:18.160 had drank toilet bowl cleaner and taken an overdose of, um, Tylenol.

00:17:22.580 OK, and, and we should explain to the audience why that did not send you a new and immediate

00:17:29.000 panic.

00:17:29.800 Oh my God, what's happened that, that, that wasn't your reaction.

00:17:33.500 And, and it turns out you were, you were onto something in, in sort of dismissing that as

00:17:39.940 the huge alarm she suggested it might be.

00:17:43.280 Yeah, we were with her all day.

00:17:45.520 So, and she was happy and, and if she would have had cleaner, there would have been burns

00:17:51.800 to her esophagus or something.

00:17:53.080 And I had been working at my laptop at the kitchen table where the cleaners and the, um,

00:17:58.540 all the ibuprofen and Tylenol stuff had been kept.

00:18:01.340 And so I knew that she hadn't taken those.

00:18:03.380 Plus she has a history of, um, attention seeking behavior and telling stories to get what she wants.

00:18:11.700 Yes.

00:18:12.660 OK, so you had some parental inclination towards skepticism on it.

00:18:18.120 And as I understand it later, when they brought her to the hospital, she was fine.

00:18:21.920 Physically, they confirmed, I read in the affidavit from CPS, she was physically fine.

00:18:27.440 Correct.

00:18:27.940 There was no trace of cleaners or medication in her system at all.

00:18:32.840 I mean, so really my take on this was your, your parental instincts were vindicated that

00:18:38.580 this was an attention seeking attempt.

00:18:40.600 Um, she wanted to get their attention.

00:18:42.300 She did get it, but you know, in these situations, CPS has got to read the parents too.

00:18:46.100 And there has to be some level of trust who to trust.

00:18:49.780 Is it this child trying to mislead me because they want a certain result?

00:18:52.920 Or can I believe the parents that any normal parent, if they believe their kid had just

00:18:58.000 tried to take a bunch of, you know, poison would say, oh my God.

00:19:03.100 So she didn't read the situation correctly.

00:19:05.620 The CPS woman.

00:19:06.960 Um, but what, what was it that Jennifer wanted in that moment?

00:19:10.940 Was she saying, get me out of here?

00:19:13.000 These people won't recognize I'm a boy.

00:19:15.420 I'm Leo.

00:19:16.240 What, what, what do you, what was her ask?

00:19:18.740 I think it was, um, short circuiting almost in anger because her, like I mentioned, her,

00:19:25.960 uh, world was falling apart there at work, you know, um, that she had built.

00:19:31.400 So I think it was that.

00:19:32.960 Cause that's how that was the disorder we've been battling with her.

00:19:36.360 I think it was that and a lot of anxiety towards, um, restarting school the next week.

00:19:42.280 So I think we were battling two things at that moment.

00:19:45.080 And I think she just saw it as a way to delay school.

00:19:49.360 And I'm not quite sure what she was trying to achieve, um, get back at her parents.

00:19:55.700 Well, as you mentioned, there'd been bullying, there'd been conflict with you guys.

00:20:00.400 And I read in the affidavit, she, she admitted, or at least she claimed that she'd been a cutter,

00:20:05.180 you know, where girls cut themselves.

00:20:07.300 Is that, you don't believe that?

00:20:09.200 That's not exactly.

00:20:10.740 She did say that.

00:20:12.260 Um, however, I think it's important to note that, and I have the pictures, um, she made

00:20:17.820 a little tiny scratch on her arm the year before, and she had an appointment with her counselor

00:20:24.380 the next day.

00:20:25.320 I immediately took a picture of the little scratch that she made.

00:20:28.380 It was a scratch.

00:20:29.640 It was not a cut.

00:20:30.780 And I sent it to her counselor.

00:20:32.400 And I said, this just happened.

00:20:34.420 I just found this on Jennifer's arm.

00:20:36.080 And she's saying it's because she's stressed out at school.

00:20:39.120 Will you handle this tomorrow in counseling?

00:20:41.420 And they said, absolutely.

00:20:43.640 So it was addressed immediately.

00:20:46.340 Yes.

00:20:47.120 Okay.

00:20:47.520 So it's not like a chronic, I mean, some girls can do this chronically and in a way that's

00:20:52.520 very damaging to themselves.

00:20:53.660 Not at all.

00:20:54.560 Not at all.

00:20:55.120 And again, I think it, I was more under the impression.

00:20:58.040 I felt that it was more attention seeking at that point.

00:21:01.540 Um, then, uh, what you see in some, some young kids who, who do, you know, cut themselves

00:21:09.200 extensively.

00:21:09.860 That's not what was going on there.

00:21:11.920 So what happened then with it?

00:21:13.520 She's the CPS lady is saying, Oh, Jennifer just told me that she.

00:21:17.040 She swallowed poison and she took a bunch of ibuprofen, uh, that she's suicidal.

00:21:21.640 I, I mean, I imagine at that point, the CPS woman is saying we got to go to the hospital.

00:21:27.200 Yeah.

00:21:27.640 She did.

00:21:28.320 And for safety reasons, we said, absolutely.

00:21:30.440 Let's go get this checked out.

00:21:31.820 We, we said, we don't believe that this happened, but let's err on the side of caution and, and

00:21:36.500 go to the hospital and have this looked into and checked out.

00:21:39.620 Yeah.

00:21:40.480 Okay.

00:21:40.920 And this is where the problems really began.

00:21:43.900 Um, absolutely.

00:21:44.860 So tell us what happened inside that Montana hospital.

00:21:49.460 Do you want me to?

00:21:50.440 Yeah.

00:21:51.360 All right.

00:21:52.140 So, um, starting at the hospital, it started right in the emergency room.

00:21:56.200 She said she wanted to be called Leo and, um, be referred to as he, him.

00:22:00.580 And we, we consistently said, Hey, this isn't something that we believe in.

00:22:04.820 This goes against everything we believe in morally and our core values.

00:22:08.620 And we're not okay with this.

00:22:10.220 Please call her by her birth name.

00:22:12.760 And it just, the, the emergency room staff was kind of, um, at a loss at what to do.

00:22:19.360 So when she was transferred over to a room, that's really, really where the problem started

00:22:24.340 and things happened.

00:22:25.220 Like the aides would roll their eyes at us.

00:22:27.800 If we would say, please call her by her birth name.

00:22:30.200 This is her name.

00:22:31.000 It's not Leo.

00:22:31.760 Um, further, they put an aid outside her door who began talking about having top surgery

00:22:36.960 and how she herself was non-binary so that, you know, we reported that to the doctor is

00:22:43.180 like, Hey, this is really inappropriate.

00:22:44.700 We're not okay with this behavior.

00:22:47.200 And there were some other aides who just consistently rolled their eyes at us.

00:22:51.380 Um, at one point a tray was brought in with lunch on it.

00:22:55.000 And I suggested to Jennifer that she eat something healthy on the tray and the nurse who was stationed

00:23:00.360 outside the door just went, rolled her eyes at me and inside real loud and yelled down

00:23:06.320 the hallway, get this young man, a banana split dessert.

00:23:09.040 So no matter what we did, yeah, we were constantly undermined as her parents and as any kind of

00:23:15.060 parental authority figure.

00:23:17.240 Oh, this must've been infuriating for the two of you.

00:23:20.020 That is so disrespectful.

00:23:21.760 She's a minor.

00:23:22.880 You are empowered by the law to make decisions for her.

00:23:26.580 And as you probably know, there are huge risks to socially transitioning a child at all for

00:23:34.640 a school to be affirming, for a place of employment to be affirming, because once that starts happening,

00:23:40.000 it's very hard to pull them back.

00:23:42.520 Yes.

00:23:42.880 Yes.

00:23:43.360 Very much so.

00:23:44.960 The nerve.

00:23:46.400 So was there anyone at the hospital that was responsive to these concerns?

00:23:50.280 No, we were pretty much told by the doctors on duty that we need to be more concerned about,

00:23:56.440 you know, her trying to hurt herself than what the aid is talking about outside the door.

00:24:01.360 When I said something about the TV, you know, she was allowed to watch any amount of TV she wanted.

00:24:06.780 And they were like, well, we're trying to make her comfortable.

00:24:09.960 We're more concerned about how she feels and her suicide ideation than we are about what she's watching on TV.

00:24:18.720 Hmm.

00:24:20.780 And meanwhile, you're trying to get them to understand there are real reasons to doubt that she has any suicidal ideations at all,

00:24:28.020 that this is somebody who wants some attention and is having a mental health struggle,

00:24:32.400 not somebody who's about to commit suicide because of a gender issue.

00:24:38.500 Correct.

00:24:39.180 Yes.

00:24:40.340 Hmm.

00:24:40.900 Okay.

00:24:41.420 So, so it seems like at some point in this visit, how long was, was she in this hospital?

00:24:46.240 From the 18th to the morning of August 23rd.

00:24:50.980 Okay.

00:24:51.520 So sometime in that five-day period, it was agreed that Jennifer needed to go from the hospital to a mental health facility.

00:24:59.720 Correct.

00:25:00.400 And we were in agreement that she needed inpatient acute psychiatric care.

00:25:05.080 We were 100% in agreement that that needed to happen.

00:25:07.780 Where things really started to fall apart was we were told that there were six facilities in the state of Montana

00:25:14.760 and that they had put her name out to these six facilities and we were waiting on a bed.

00:25:20.160 Todd and I expressed that we would prefer Billings, Montana, because that's where we went often for some other medical issues,

00:25:27.280 and that would be convenient.

00:25:28.400 However, we understood it could be anywhere in Montana, and we were fine.

00:25:32.860 We knew she needed to do that.

00:25:34.540 Then they kind of slipped Wyoming in sort of nonchalantly.

00:25:38.880 Well, there is this facility in Wyoming.

00:25:40.700 And at that point, because we were being so disrespected as our parents,

00:25:44.560 we immediately looked up Wyoming on our phones, and we're not lawyers or anything,

00:25:50.940 but it looked to us like the same laws that Montana had in place that Wyoming did not have in place,

00:25:56.120 and that was very alarming to us.

00:25:58.100 Yes.

00:25:58.620 Montana has a ban on the cross-gender procedures for minors, and Wyoming doesn't.

00:26:03.560 Go ahead, Todd.

00:26:04.440 Yes.

00:26:05.000 So Idaho, North and South Dakota, and Montana all had the same stance.

00:26:10.660 The only one that was different was Wyoming, where it had just been shot down.

00:26:14.280 So Casper, Wyoming is where that facility is at.

00:26:17.400 And we could just tell that even when they would say she's next up for a bed in Billings,

00:26:24.120 we could tell by their gestures to our daughter that they were saying,

00:26:33.060 no, we're going to send you to Wyoming.

00:26:34.480 Don't worry.

00:26:35.120 So that's what the gesture said.

00:26:37.500 And so we discussed that.

00:26:39.320 We said, no, they're going to try to send her to Wyoming.

00:26:41.560 You know, it was pretty easy.

00:26:42.820 What did you worry would happen to her in Wyoming?

00:26:46.720 Well, we were concerned that we didn't understand that when somebody is in CPS's care, that they

00:26:55.060 cannot take any, supposedly, they cannot have any treatments or anything unless the parents

00:26:59.300 agreed to it.

00:27:00.340 So we were concerned that she could go to Wyoming and get puberty blockers or anything else that

00:27:06.060 she had wanted to do this transition.

00:27:09.220 And we were not okay with that at all.

00:27:12.760 And a reminder to those listening, once a child goes on puberty blockers, 97, 98% of

00:27:18.120 them go directly to cross sex hormones.

00:27:20.000 Once you've done that, the overwhelming statistics prove not only will you wind up sterile, but

00:27:26.440 you'll never have sexual enjoyment in your life.

00:27:28.420 This is what we're talking about.

00:27:29.900 This is what was in the balance in that moment at a bare minimum, separate and apart from

00:27:33.880 surgeries.

00:27:34.360 So you were right to be very concerned about what would happen to her if somebody other

00:27:40.020 than the two of you were making the decision.

00:27:41.680 So you say, we don't want her to go to Wyoming.

00:27:45.180 I assume you said, we'll wait for a bed in Montana.

00:27:48.700 That's correct.

00:27:49.580 And our CPS worker said to us, and she kind of blew us off.

00:27:54.080 She said, well, you know, with all the facilities in Montana, we're pretty sure that a bed will

00:27:59.000 come up in Montana and Wyoming isn't an issue.

00:28:02.000 But if we have to cross that bridge, we'll cross it together and we'll answer.

00:28:05.940 She made it sound like they would answer all of our questions and that we make sure our

00:28:09.560 daughter was protected.

00:28:12.060 Okay.

00:28:12.600 But what in fact happened?

00:28:14.960 So what happened was on the day of August 22nd, we were told she was next in line for

00:28:21.240 a bed in Billings, Montana.

00:28:22.560 Um, that night, Todd and I, we, we went to dinner and we were home.

00:28:27.720 It was about seven 30 and the hospital called us and said that a bed had opened up in Wyoming

00:28:32.820 and that she needed to go.

00:28:35.060 And we were really confused and blown away.

00:28:38.220 And we were like, wait a minute.

00:28:40.780 We don't know what to do.

00:28:42.180 Who can answer our questions?

00:28:43.720 What are our rights here?

00:28:44.900 And the doctor said to us, well, she has to leave this facility because we're not doing

00:28:50.300 her any good here.

00:28:51.460 She has to go to Wyoming.

00:28:53.240 So within 10 minutes of that call, children, the children's services worker and the police

00:28:58.620 showed up at our door, serving us with papers to remove her from our care, saying that we

00:29:03.280 were unable or unwilling to provide her medical care.

00:29:06.180 And that's just not true at all.

00:29:07.700 Wow.

00:29:10.180 So that was the moment that they seized her really from you and said, this kid is going

00:29:15.880 to Wyoming, whether you like it or not.

00:29:18.500 Yes.

00:29:19.160 Yes.

00:29:20.940 Well, I mean, and you two are sitting in your home that night in what state?

00:29:25.180 I mean, feeling how?

00:29:27.840 Shocked, helpless, um, crushed.

00:29:30.360 You know, this is, this is our, our daughter.

00:29:34.660 Yeah, it was heartbreaking.

00:29:35.720 I can't imagine.

00:29:36.280 It was total, total shock.

00:29:39.220 I can't.

00:29:40.080 And I would imagine you feel angry.

00:29:42.320 I would feel so angry at what was being done in my family.

00:29:46.400 I, so now what do you do?

00:29:48.500 I mean, you're not, I assume a very wealthy couple with a bunch of connections to high

00:29:53.360 power law firms.

00:29:54.840 So, you know, what do you do?

00:29:57.600 How do you even go about fighting this?

00:29:59.380 So we were assigned public defenders and, um, I don't know if every state is like this,

00:30:07.660 but in Montana, I have a public defender.

00:30:09.760 Todd has one.

00:30:11.280 Um, CPS has a, uh, a lawyer appointed to them and so does the child.

00:30:16.360 So it's kind of like everybody has an attorney in Montana.

00:30:19.400 And again, I don't know if it's like that everywhere.

00:30:21.140 So at that point we were assigned public defenders and everything just kind of kicked off from

00:30:27.060 there.

00:30:28.460 How long did Jennifer stay in the Wyoming facility?

00:30:31.920 About a month.

00:30:33.800 She came back to Montana on, um, I believe it was Monday, September 25th.

00:30:38.820 Were you allowed to talk to her during that month?

00:30:42.940 She, when she was in the Wyoming facility, the calls were monitored by, um, by her counselor

00:30:49.080 at the time.

00:30:50.340 And we were expressing concerns because they were at that time socially transitioning her.

00:30:55.140 They were letting her go as mail names, giving her mail products, um, you know, things

00:31:00.640 that we were not okay with.

00:31:01.920 Yeah.

00:31:03.540 And she was, they were reporting that she was having hallucinations there, things of

00:31:07.960 that nature back at us, but there really wasn't communication back.

00:31:13.640 We, they gave us incorrect phone numbers for the location.

00:31:17.200 Um, so there was, um, um, a lot of issues with that where we were given.

00:31:22.960 Were you allowed to visit?

00:31:24.840 Did you ever go there?

00:31:26.000 No, we, we would have visited.

00:31:28.320 Um, but we were under the impression that we were, we were not allowed to visit.

00:31:31.920 So when you called her at the facility, did you have to say Leo?

00:31:37.960 Correct.

00:31:38.640 They wanted us to refer to her by Leo and then, um, she would get on.

00:31:43.880 And I know that the call was monitored by a counselor or the staff on duty, whoever was there.

00:31:50.820 Hmm.

00:31:52.100 Okay.

00:31:52.540 So when she's coming out of the facility after 30 days, is it understood by everyone?

00:31:56.640 And she's coming home to you two in Montana?

00:32:00.660 No, CPS then informed us that she had to go to a group home setting, um, in that she would

00:32:07.600 be in Montana.

00:32:08.840 So, yes.

00:32:10.320 Okay.

00:32:10.720 But not with you.

00:32:11.520 And what happened in that group home?

00:32:14.460 In the group home, she's been socially transitioned.

00:32:17.360 And 100%.

00:32:19.100 Yeah, completely.

00:32:20.360 Um, she's in a therapeutic school setting and she is in the all boys groups in the, in

00:32:25.760 the school setting.

00:32:26.760 She's allowed to wear a chest binder.

00:32:28.500 She's allowed to only wear men's clothes, um, men's shoes.

00:32:33.100 She got a haircut where she actually shaved her head and, um, you know, presents herself

00:32:39.020 as a boy.

00:32:39.900 She also has a chest binder.

00:32:42.080 Um, everything that we've a hundred percent asked them not to do is being done.

00:32:47.300 Do you, are your public defenders objecting to this?

00:32:51.460 They're, they're very nice people and I don't want to throw them under the bus, but what

00:32:56.700 they have said to us is, um, really to play nice, get her through the six to nine month

00:33:01.720 program and then have her back under our roof and go on with our lives.

00:33:06.040 It's not going to work.

00:33:07.360 She's going to be transitioned by then.

00:33:09.060 I mean, they don't get less dug in.

00:33:11.640 Right.

00:33:12.160 And that's the thing she's, she is transitioned now.

00:33:14.980 She, she lives as a boy.

00:33:16.420 And how, how, how could she come back to her?

00:33:20.060 They've destroyed our family unit.

00:33:21.800 Yeah.

00:33:22.780 Oh my gosh.

00:33:24.060 So they will say the plan is for Jennifer to go to this facility for six to nine months

00:33:28.500 and that she goes and she's Leo.

00:33:30.440 It's totally affirmed.

00:33:31.380 She's a boy.

00:33:32.060 The girl, Jennifer is basically gone.

00:33:34.520 Now there's a Leo.

00:33:35.720 Now you don't have your daughter anymore.

00:33:37.280 Your family's been blown up.

00:33:39.000 And is that, is that, how long did she stay there?

00:33:42.420 Is she there right now?

00:33:43.800 Yes.

00:33:44.080 She's still there.

00:33:45.040 Yes.

00:33:45.580 And she's done an all boys group.

00:33:48.000 An all boys group.

00:33:49.960 In the school setting.

00:33:51.940 The, the group home is co-ed.

00:33:54.060 So there's girls and boys that live in the group home.

00:33:57.100 Okay.

00:33:57.900 And what is, has there been an order that when she gets out of the group home, she's going

00:34:04.640 up to Canada?

00:34:05.280 Correct.

00:34:07.060 So on January 19th was our, our, one of our, one of our final hearings that we had.

00:34:13.700 And at that time, the attorney for children protective services asked if they could release

00:34:21.420 the child to the birth mother and then release the case so that children's services wouldn't

00:34:25.220 be involved.

00:34:26.560 So the judge asked some questions and our lawyer asked some questions like have, has anyone

00:34:31.540 seen the birth mother's home to make sure it's an appropriate house?

00:34:34.700 You know, have there been safety checks done?

00:34:37.100 How has anyone investigated the birth mom?

00:34:39.120 And the, and the answer was, well, not really, but we did ask for a background check in the

00:34:44.780 Providence where she lives in Canada, but that doesn't cover all of Canada.

00:34:49.260 So she could have been in trouble anywhere in Canada and it would, it wouldn't come up.

00:34:53.620 And so that was part of our concern that we also have some concerns about just the way

00:34:59.280 that her household is handled is different than ours.

00:35:03.280 How so?

00:35:03.960 I know I've, I mean, I've read some allegations that you've made that it's not, it's not safe

00:35:07.220 there.

00:35:08.940 We don't feel it's safe there.

00:35:10.900 She has an older child that her and Todd have together, a young man who is 20 now, and

00:35:16.440 he's doing some things like tearing apart her home, peeing on the floor when he gets mad,

00:35:23.000 ripping apart furniture.

00:35:23.980 And she sent us these text messages asking us to help her with the young man.

00:35:29.760 So we, we presented these to children's services that, Hey, we're concerned about this.

00:35:34.580 And their attitude has been like, well, we're not really concerned.

00:35:39.040 They just want to offload her.

00:35:40.540 They want to get her out of the facility and land her with someone who's going to be more

00:35:44.140 affirming.

00:35:44.700 That's what, that's how it sounds.

00:35:46.240 Todd, have you talked to your ex-wife about this?

00:35:48.700 I mean, is she, where does she stand on it?

00:35:51.460 Well, very little.

00:35:52.740 Initially, it seemed like she, when it first came up and CPS first came, we did bring it

00:35:58.400 up to her.

00:35:59.040 We spoke to her on the way back from Billings.

00:36:02.340 We spoke with her a little bit about it, um, to keep her informed and we weren't, um, there

00:36:08.220 was no kinds of tension between us and her and her family there.

00:36:12.560 We haven't seen them in seven years, so we don't know what they do or don't do, but, um,

00:36:17.420 we try to keep her informed.

00:36:19.620 Do you know, um, is she, is she an affirmer or is she more on the same page with you guys?

00:36:25.080 She, she is affirming that our, our daughter be called Leo and be a boy.

00:36:30.080 Yes.

00:36:32.340 So Jennifer's in this facility where they've transitioned her to a quote boy.

00:36:37.880 And when she gets out, she's going to a mother that didn't raise her and whose house may not

00:36:43.100 be safe.

00:36:44.340 And the parental relationship with you two is where now?

00:36:47.460 I mean, what is it legally, what are they telling you?

00:36:49.600 What are your rights?

00:36:50.700 Well, we knew, we knew this was coming in terms of the guardian ad litem had told us that they

00:36:56.140 assigned that if we're not willing to call her by her preferred pronouns and raise her as

00:37:02.200 a boy, then we're not going to like what they have to say about us in court.

00:37:05.340 That's what they told us.

00:37:06.520 The guardian ad litem is a court-appointed representative for Jennifer.

00:37:10.560 Correct.

00:37:11.100 So we knew that this was probably coming.

00:37:14.160 Um, it still is, is gut-wrenching, you know, to be told that.

00:37:18.280 And I think it's also important to bring up, there's a form that we've been asked to sign

00:37:23.240 for her to go to Canada that says, um, I don't have the exact quote in front of me, but it

00:37:28.120 says that we agree that we will be separated from our minor child, possibly, um, permanently

00:37:35.280 if she is to cross over into Canada.

00:37:37.460 And I know about this form because we ended up in mediation with the birth mom in 2017

00:37:42.640 because we refused to sign the form for, um, the young man that, that lives up there, Todd's

00:37:47.600 son.

00:37:49.200 So why would you ever sign that?

00:37:51.820 Why would you ever do that?

00:37:55.120 Um, we don't, it's not our intention to sign it, but we feel like it's probably going to

00:38:00.280 be ordered that we sign that form.

00:38:02.200 Um, it hasn't come up in court yet.

00:38:04.280 It was just sent to us by children's services to go ahead and sign for our daughter.

00:38:09.060 And we're like, no, we're not going to agree to that.

00:38:11.980 We would never agree to that.

00:38:13.280 The court did order that we would, um, uh, complete all the necessary paperwork to send

00:38:19.140 her to Canada.

00:38:20.000 So that would be this.

00:38:22.480 Right.

00:38:22.840 Have you, have you done that?

00:38:24.900 Not yet.

00:38:26.440 Are you going to?

00:38:27.640 We have not only, only because, um, we want some legal counsel on this form before we sign

00:38:33.940 it.

00:38:34.640 But as far as what about your appeal?

00:38:36.560 Right.

00:38:37.100 And that's kind of where we're at.

00:38:38.360 Like, where do we go legally with all this?

00:38:41.860 It's not over till it's over.

00:38:43.320 I, I, I know you're, I mean, and now you're smart to go to the media because the pressure

00:38:48.900 is increasing on the governor of Montana and others to take a look at this case.

00:38:53.580 And I know he's claiming he had his Lieutenant governor look at this, um, and is not intervening

00:38:57.940 right now.

00:38:58.560 I've got real questions about how hard they looked.

00:39:01.540 I looked at the whole affidavit and I say this not to embarrass anybody.

00:39:04.540 What I see in there is at worst, an allegation that you Todd may have an alcohol problem and

00:39:10.720 that you Krista may have been quote, verbally abusive toward Jennifer.

00:39:15.380 That's Jennifer's allegation to the CPS people trying to get away from you.

00:39:20.040 That's you don't take children.

00:39:22.100 I'm saying worst case scenario.

00:39:23.500 You did it all.

00:39:24.160 It's all true.

00:39:24.720 You don't take children away from their, their parents for, for that.

00:39:28.540 That's, there are a lot of alcoholics out there.

00:39:30.440 There are a lot of moms who say nasty things.

00:39:33.240 You don't lose your child.

00:39:35.360 Right.

00:39:35.560 And I think it's important to, to put into, I mean, we've never had, uh, DUIs.

00:39:41.400 We've never had, um, you know, domestic violence issues.

00:39:46.180 We've never been, um, I've never been accused of being verbally abusive to any of the children

00:39:50.900 that were ever in our care.

00:39:51.940 You're listening to an angry 14 year old child.

00:39:55.320 May, may I also say to that in those same statements, she had also said that the church

00:40:01.420 was putting, her counselors were putting a real loaded gun to her head and then taking

00:40:05.740 the bullets out that they even asked us, CPS even asked us for help, for our daughter's,

00:40:11.340 um, cancer records for when she was fighting cancer.

00:40:14.480 She never, ever had cancer.

00:40:16.160 She, there was a whole bunch of other things.

00:40:18.860 So, so CPS handpicked those two items out of about a dozen false crazy lies.

00:40:25.680 So, of course, but it's interesting to me because now you you've lost, right?

00:40:33.020 I mean, is, has the court said custody is awarded to the biological mother?

00:40:37.540 Yes.

00:40:38.540 Um, the way out that I understand it is child protective services has legal say for the

00:40:45.200 next six months and placement will be with the birth mother.

00:40:48.780 I don't know if they do it before the end of that six months or if they wait six months.

00:40:52.480 I I'm not sure.

00:40:53.920 And your ability to make decisions for your child is terminated.

00:40:58.120 It's never, they've never really given us the right to make decisions for her.

00:41:04.260 And so, yes, well, to answer that question, even better, how can we make decisions when

00:41:09.160 they were this whole time, they were supposed to be including us into any of the medical

00:41:13.580 treatment of our daughter, what medicines are given her flu shots, that sort of thing.

00:41:17.960 They did absolutely none of that, even though we kept begging weekly for that, even through

00:41:23.700 the court appointed attorneys, they never once did it.

00:41:26.520 But then in the last couple of weeks from right now, for the first time they did, but once

00:41:33.700 the law, once the courts got involved, this is God gave you the right, God gave you the

00:41:37.980 right to, to make decisions for your child.

00:41:39.720 They don't, they don't give you these rights that they can only take them away during in

00:41:43.920 very narrow and extremely compelling circumstances.

00:41:46.760 And what I see here is not even allegations against you of abuse or anything that would rise

00:41:53.920 to the level, what the affidavit says is you refuse to affirm.

00:41:58.640 That's what they're mad about.

00:42:00.220 That's what Montana is mad about.

00:42:02.380 You refused to affirm her and therefore your custodial rights are ending.

00:42:08.160 It's an absolute outrage.

00:42:11.040 So what, so the court issues this ruling, it just happened, right?

00:42:13.640 January, uh, what was the date?

00:42:15.800 It was 19th.

00:42:17.020 Okay.

00:42:17.340 So it just happened.

00:42:18.660 And on top of all that, you were told by the court, don't speak out about it.

00:42:23.920 Is there a gag order on you?

00:42:25.200 Cause I, I know you're in trouble now potentially for speaking out.

00:42:28.460 That is correct.

00:42:29.440 Yes.

00:42:29.700 They, they imposed a gag order, but, um, we're not, we're doing this because we feel like

00:42:35.600 we have no choice.

00:42:36.780 And as far as I know, we're the first family in Montana that this has happened to.

00:42:40.920 And because our rights have been so trampled on now, we're at a point where our family

00:42:46.020 unit has been destroyed.

00:42:47.300 And the best thing we can do is stand up for other families and get the word out and not

00:42:53.020 allow this to happen to anybody else again.

00:42:55.860 Yes.

00:42:57.300 What's, what's happened with the governor?

00:42:59.740 Because this is a Republican Montana went for Trump, I think plus nine.

00:43:04.180 This is a red state and you, and they've already recognized the dangers of the transitioning

00:43:10.880 children there.

00:43:11.760 So why isn't this Republican governor helping you?

00:43:16.600 Um, he tweeted, I don't know if you saw his tweet thread, there were like eight tweets and

00:43:21.760 they, they really were, in my opinion, a bunch of word soup that didn't say anything.

00:43:27.020 Um, basically we, we've never heard from him.

00:43:32.280 Um, I don't feel that he's doing anything to protect families and to protect our family.

00:43:38.160 He said he referred this case to his Lieutenant governor and asked the Lieutenant governor to

00:43:45.420 look into it and then wound up saying, well, we did that.

00:43:49.020 And you know, we're not going to do anything.

00:43:51.900 He says, uh, let's see, upon hearing the recent allegations, I asked Lieutenant, Lieutenant

00:43:56.760 Governor, Christian Juris, an experienced attorney, a constitutional conservative mother or

00:44:00.240 grandmother to review it, um, consulting with the director of division and child family services

00:44:06.020 and personally examining the case documents.

00:44:08.060 The Lieutenant governor has concluded, um, that they have all followed state policy and

00:44:13.960 law and their handling of this case.

00:44:15.840 I've asked her to continue monitoring the case, uh, and goes on to tout the laws in Montana.

00:44:22.580 So it doesn't seem like whatever he saw was persuasive to him.

00:44:27.760 By the way, Montana is a plus 16 state for Trump.

00:44:30.920 Um, the Republican is controlled by a Republican super majority.

00:44:35.180 So why is this so hard?

00:44:36.860 I'm looking, I read the affidavit.

00:44:38.840 I'm looking for the smoking gun against you two.

00:44:41.420 Even taking everything Jennifer said is true.

00:44:43.940 I've, I've told the audience the worst stuff.

00:44:46.260 I don't get it.

00:44:47.280 It seems like what's even been so persuasive to the Lieutenant governor is the allegation

00:44:51.920 that you won't affirm is, please tell me, am I missing something?

00:44:55.920 No, you're not.

00:44:56.540 Because even, um, I'm not going to give the names, but they're, uh, really respect them.

00:45:00.500 Some of the lawmakers in Montana that have passed the laws flat out said on that video in the

00:45:06.400 comments that they passed this law, they passed the law and they are not following it right.

00:45:11.700 They're doing everything backwards.

00:45:12.760 That was right in the comments on our, on our, uh, video.

00:45:17.080 And that came right from the lawmakers in Montana.

00:45:21.580 So can you appeal this decision, right?

00:45:24.260 I mean, there's, this is the, uh, Montana 17th judicial court district court.

00:45:29.900 So are you going to appeal this up?

00:45:34.300 Yes.

00:45:34.980 Um, we're currently talking to a few attorneys that may take our case.

00:45:40.540 Um, call Alliance defending freedom.

00:45:42.760 Have you talked to Alliance defending freedom?

00:45:44.720 We are in, um, oh gosh, I'm so sorry.

00:45:47.660 It slipped my mind just now who we're talking to an Eric cell with, I believe it's American

00:45:51.880 civil liberties currently.

00:45:53.840 Um, and he's seeing if he can help us.

00:45:55.900 We also have an attorney that I'm going to put you in touch with Alliance defending

00:45:59.280 freedom.

00:45:59.600 You got to talk to Alliance defending freedom.

00:46:01.200 This is the group that, that you need to help you.

00:46:04.320 Uh, I'm sure they're going to pay attention.

00:46:05.680 There's probably already paying attention to this, but you need somebody who's going to really

00:46:09.300 fight for you on this.

00:46:10.420 This is an outrage.

00:46:11.860 And so now, I mean, so as you watch that play out, is Jennifer gone?

00:46:18.220 Do you feel like, you know, the tether has snapped and, and she's, you know, she's gone.

00:46:24.680 Absolutely.

00:46:25.120 It was a best friend relationship with her, her whole life.

00:46:28.860 Um, she, because we're both at home and, um, with her all the time, um, she, she had

00:46:35.800 everything she could want, everything she wanted.

00:46:37.940 She was a very smart, smart kid.

00:46:40.380 And we supported every interest.

00:46:42.560 She was great at playing guitar, self-teaching her, uh, and, and just, we're really-

00:46:48.180 So I feel like what Todd's saying is that basically, as I've said, our family has been gutted and

00:46:54.360 destroyed by this.

00:46:55.580 Um, even if they return her to us and we certainly want her back, we'll never stop fighting for

00:47:00.720 her.

00:47:01.460 Um, they've undermined our parental authority.

00:47:03.780 They've taught her to weaponize the system.

00:47:06.100 They've taught her that all she has to do is make up some lies and say, well, I'm going

00:47:10.400 to take my life.

00:47:11.680 And, um, everybody comes running and gives her what she wants.

00:47:14.920 We've been totally undermined as any kind of authority figure whatsoever.

00:47:19.760 And so what's your, what's your message to her if she's watching this?

00:47:26.240 Just that we love her very much.

00:47:29.100 Love her very, very much.

00:47:30.520 And want her, want her to come back home and, uh, yep, we want her back home.

00:47:35.100 Um, you know, we, we're never going to stop fighting for her.

00:47:38.040 She's our daughter and, um, you know, parent, she's not a throwaway kid.

00:47:42.360 We're not just going to throw her away.

00:47:44.780 Uh, we, all we wanted for her is when she's an adult, that she has every option and every

00:47:49.620 dream possible to come true.

00:47:51.160 We don't want her to make any decisions while her brain is still developing.

00:47:55.540 That'll take away all those options and destroy our happiness as an adult.

00:47:59.320 We want her to have all those cards on the table when she's an adult.

00:48:03.160 And in the minute we have left, what do you want other parents to know?

00:48:08.680 Be aware of how quick this can happen to your family.

00:48:12.080 Um, know what your rights are.

00:48:15.100 Be very diligent on if, if CPS gets involved with your life, what, what are your rights as

00:48:21.200 the parents?

00:48:21.840 Ask a lot of questions, um, raise a lot of heck.

00:48:25.280 Just be very diligent.

00:48:26.580 Yeah, that, and do we really want a Montana or an America where any child can want to

00:48:34.800 do anything, whether it's alcohol, gender transition, anything.

00:48:38.500 And if they don't get what they want, they can simply just say, I'll hurt myself.

00:48:41.520 I'm depressed.

00:48:42.060 And they're out of there.

00:48:43.380 They get what they want.

00:48:44.480 That's what this, that's exactly what's happened to us.

00:48:46.980 This is so disturbing.

00:48:51.100 Todd and Krista, I'm, I'm going to say a prayer for you.

00:48:53.940 I'm going to connect you with Alliance Defending Freedom and I wish you all my best.

00:48:58.160 Thank you so much for telling your story.

00:49:00.380 Thank you for having us.

00:49:01.480 Thank you.

00:49:02.540 Praying for Jennifer too.

00:49:03.860 Really praying for Jennifer too.

00:49:05.020 But like so many other girls, she manages to get out of this, this cult of gender ideology,

00:49:12.960 which has sucked in so many, especially of our young women who historically have not suffered

00:49:19.160 from gender dysphoria at all.

00:49:21.940 What's happened here is deeply wrong.

00:49:23.940 There are a lot of people to blame and we are going to call the Montana governor's office

00:49:29.840 ourselves to find out more about this.

00:49:32.380 I haven't done that yet.

00:49:34.020 Willing to hear what he has to say, but I bet you I can get a call in there and I know I

00:49:38.460 can get a call into these lawyers.

00:49:39.900 So this isn't over.

00:49:41.240 This is not over.

00:49:42.760 And sadly, Jennifer will not be the only child swept up in this, nor Krista and Todd, the only

00:49:48.180 parents who suffer.

00:49:50.140 Stay tuned.

00:49:50.800 We'll be right back.

00:49:53.940 Our friend David Menzies of Rebel News in Canada is at it again with an incredible new

00:50:01.380 report regarding five college age men who are now dominating women's volleyball up there.

00:50:09.080 As a listener of this show, you know, it's an issue that we are dealing with here in the

00:50:12.420 United States too.

00:50:14.200 Last year, high school volleyball player Peyton McNabb suffered a severe head and neck injury

00:50:20.620 resulting in long term medical problems after a transgender player, a boy pretending to be

00:50:26.060 a girl, spiked a ball in her face.

00:50:28.600 Video of the incident sparked outrage online.

00:50:32.260 And Peyton actually came on this show to discuss what happened to her and how the male player

00:50:36.400 was allowed to just keep on playing.

00:50:38.360 I was hit and everything went black.

00:50:43.380 My teammates and coaches said I was unconscious for about 30 seconds.

00:50:49.420 While my team was huddling around me, the opposing team was laughing.

00:50:54.260 Um, but when I came back to consciousness, a trainer took me to the sign lines and checked

00:51:02.520 me for a concussion and told me I was fine and could go back in.

00:51:07.800 But luckily my coach didn't let me go back in.

00:51:10.940 Did they pull the trans athlete, the other school, the other team?

00:51:15.020 No, they didn't.

00:51:16.260 So this person continued playing against your teammates even after you were hurt?

00:51:20.220 Yes.

00:51:20.660 And she went on to describe the permanent damage she has suffered as a result of her

00:51:26.980 injuries that day.

00:51:27.880 That interview with Peyton is episode five, three, nine.

00:51:31.100 If you want to check it out in our archives, just go to Apple and look at all episodes.

00:51:35.200 You'll find it there.

00:51:35.820 Episode five, three, nine.

00:51:37.040 So that brings me to David's reporting today.

00:51:39.300 Earlier this week, he was tipped off about five male players from two teams taking part in

00:51:45.500 women's college volleyball up in Toronto.

00:51:48.000 His source told him female players have suffered concussions, just like Peyton McNabb.

00:51:53.620 David is here live.

00:51:54.600 But first, take a look at his incredible reporting.

00:51:58.320 We were tipped off that this female volleyball game that we witnessed earlier featured not one,

00:52:04.700 not two, not three, not four, but five men pretending to be females.

00:52:11.740 The male players were always on the court.

00:52:15.120 So you had biological female substitutes just sitting on the bench.

00:52:21.140 Excuse me.

00:52:22.000 Sir, sir, why are you playing with the woman?

00:52:24.160 Why are you taking away a real woman's spot?

00:52:27.020 Are you a misogynist?

00:52:28.640 Excuse me.

00:52:29.540 You're not allowed over here.

00:52:31.280 I'm just asking questions.

00:52:32.800 You're not allowed over here.

00:52:33.580 Who are you, ma'am?

00:52:34.820 You're not allowed over here.

00:52:36.160 Why?

00:52:37.040 Hey, don't touch me.

00:52:38.660 You touched me.

00:52:39.360 You ran into me.

00:52:40.140 You ran into me.

00:52:41.080 We got it on camera, ma'am.

00:52:42.280 Hey, coach, coach, coach, why are you playing male players?

00:52:48.700 Coach, why are you playing male players?

00:52:51.140 I'm not.

00:52:52.040 They are.

00:52:52.700 They're male.

00:52:53.180 They're biological males.

00:52:54.840 Why are you doing that?

00:52:56.020 What happened to chivalry?

00:52:57.900 It's not dead in my room.

00:52:58.880 Why are you filming me?

00:52:59.660 You don't have my permission.

00:53:00.620 We don't need your permission.

00:53:01.700 We're in a public space.

00:53:02.340 Okay, so then why are you talking to me then?

00:53:03.340 Well, you came to us, actually.

00:53:04.440 You came to me.

00:53:05.600 No, you came to us.

00:53:06.740 So why are you being disrespectful then?

00:53:07.500 Huh?

00:53:07.700 Why are you being disrespectful?

00:53:08.920 Why are you being transphobic?

00:53:09.880 Like, why am I being transphobic?

00:53:12.800 Why?

00:53:13.240 Shut up.

00:53:13.920 What?

00:53:14.380 Oh, wow.

00:53:15.040 I hope you can go rotten hell.

00:53:16.200 You're fucking white.

00:53:17.140 Wow.

00:53:17.980 What happened to love Trump's hate?

00:53:21.600 Okay, so you're disrespectful, David Menzies of Rebel News, but you can also go rotten hell,

00:53:27.900 you white piece of shit.

00:53:29.140 Okay, so you're the disrespectful one.

00:53:31.500 David, thanks again for your great work and thank you for being here.

00:53:34.200 So this is unbelievable.

00:53:36.300 Five players across.

00:53:37.700 This is college volleyball?

00:53:40.560 That's right.

00:53:42.280 And Megan, I just want to say right off the hopper, that little interview clip you had

00:53:47.220 with Peyton McNabb, that's really rattled me.

00:53:51.440 Equal parts the concussion that happened to her, thanks to a biological male spiking the

00:53:56.480 ball, but even more so, the lack of empathy on the other team of female players laughing

00:54:05.440 at a fellow female getting hurt like that.

00:54:10.380 And it just goes to show you, you know, Megan, I've said this to all my female friends and

00:54:15.220 colleagues, the worst enemy you have right now in this battle of trans sanity is young

00:54:23.140 biological females.

00:54:25.140 They are so ignorant and so indoctrinated, they actually will chant, trans women are real

00:54:31.920 women, trans women are real women.

00:54:33.580 They'll get hysterical.

00:54:34.940 They'll cry about it.

00:54:36.080 Meanwhile, if you are, as a female, if you subscribe to that mantra, Megan, it's kind of like chickens

00:54:43.340 in support of Colonel Saunders, if you know what I mean.

00:54:46.680 Yeah.

00:54:47.280 It is unbelievable.

00:54:49.400 So when that coach said to you, we're not playing biological men on these teams, he was

00:54:54.700 lying.

00:54:55.240 He's of the trans women are women.

00:54:59.560 That's it.

00:55:00.180 That's the tweet field of thinking.

00:55:03.920 Indeed, Megan.

00:55:04.700 And I get it.

00:55:05.680 You know, you're a varsity level college coach.

00:55:08.200 What do you want to do?

00:55:08.980 Like every coach, you want to win by any means necessary, including cheating and make no

00:55:13.960 mistake.

00:55:14.740 That's what this is.

00:55:16.060 And I'll tell you, Megan, this is verifying my prediction that I kind of made in jest just

00:55:22.440 a couple of years ago, but it's actually coming true.

00:55:24.800 I think unless we put an end to this madness in our lifetime, we will see varsity level teams

00:55:33.320 all around the Western world where you'll have the men's team that will be the men's A team.

00:55:41.040 And then you'll have the men's B team.

00:55:44.220 Those will consist of all the loser males that couldn't make the A team.

00:55:50.020 So the men's B team will be that team that once upon a time was known as the women's team.

00:55:57.680 It's an absolute disgrace.

00:55:59.680 That's right.

00:56:00.440 You've got five players already taking spots that belong to women and endangering the women

00:56:04.780 who have made the teams and have shown up to play in good faith.

00:56:08.060 And at least two now have suffered concussions.

00:56:10.920 And as I read your report, David, there's one, one of the men who caused a concussion as

00:56:18.140 recently as January 22nd is named Franz Lagardas.

00:56:22.880 You report that during a game at Seneca College versus La Cite Collegiate, he attacked the ball

00:56:29.020 with heavy force and hit an opposing player in the head.

00:56:32.620 And this guy last year was on the men's team, literally last year.

00:56:40.740 Here he is.

00:56:41.780 And this is his team photo last year.

00:56:43.780 We actually pulled his last year photo.

00:56:46.180 And now here is his picture while he's on the women's team this year.

00:56:49.380 Take a look.

00:56:51.100 Nothing.

00:56:51.800 They don't pose it.

00:56:53.120 They don't post it because they don't want us to know it's a dude.

00:56:58.300 It's it's amazing, Megan, but it's deja vu, isn't it?

00:57:02.000 We covered last year the fiasco that was Ash Davis, real name Tommy, playing on the Fergus

00:57:11.120 women's rugby team.

00:57:13.080 And the year before that, just like this fellow, he was on a male team and voted the hardest

00:57:20.780 hitter on the men's Fergus team.

00:57:23.780 Um, I truly believe, uh, we are catering, we're bending over backwards to cater to mental

00:57:30.200 illness.

00:57:31.200 And, uh, we dare not say anything because if you are deemed to make a transphobic, uh, comment,

00:57:38.300 well, that's almost as bad as being Islamophobic.

00:57:41.660 Actually, it might even be worse in this day and age.

00:57:44.320 But you saw that clip when you were running, um, the video, uh, Megan, of, uh, there were

00:57:49.600 members of the rainbow mafia in the stands, uh, watching this.

00:57:54.520 I don't know why volleyball is skewing.

00:57:56.380 So trans.

00:57:57.380 And I was there with my camera woman, Avery and that fellow, and I don't know what he

00:58:03.900 is.

00:58:04.160 Maybe he's trans, maybe he's pansexual, whatever he was.

00:58:08.560 He wanted to slug my camera woman.

00:58:11.160 And he was saying something very telling, uh, which was just because you have a vagina, does

00:58:16.520 that, do you think that's what makes you female?

00:58:19.000 And I'm like, uh, yeah, that's pretty much the benchmark, but right now, I mean, how do

00:58:29.660 you address that?

00:58:30.640 And also the subtle racism there, you white piece of S right.

00:58:35.900 Unbelievable.

00:58:36.860 What does your whiteness have to do with anything?

00:58:38.900 Right.

00:58:39.240 Take a seat.

00:58:40.100 Um, is it true that almost all of these guys playing in this volleyball league have done

00:58:46.180 nothing about their testosterone?

00:58:48.160 They haven't done it.

00:58:49.820 They just declared themselves female.

00:58:52.200 Not that the testosterone stuff helps, honestly.

00:58:54.640 Like once you've gone through a male puberty, it's a, that's it.

00:58:57.280 But they haven't even tried that stuff here.

00:59:01.000 You know what, Megan, here's the deal.

00:59:03.300 Even if they have gone through the motions, even, I don't know what the international volleyball

00:59:08.040 ruling is on this, but I can tell you by precedent, we know from world rugby way back in 2020,

00:59:14.880 they were pioneers in stating you cannot play with female rugby players if you're a male.

00:59:20.480 Well, Rugby Canada and Rugby Ontario is ignoring the, um, the rules of the international governing

00:59:27.120 body.

00:59:27.720 Why?

00:59:27.900 Well, because, because of human rights commissions and tribunals, uh, if you think you're a woman,

00:59:33.820 if you think you're a man, if you think you're a lobster, so be it.

00:59:37.360 We have to bend the knee to that.

00:59:39.580 Same with swimming.

00:59:40.920 Nicholas Cepeda, the 50-year-old male who identifies as a 13-year-old girl.

00:59:46.600 Well, World Aquatics stated last year, you as a trans individual now have to compete in

00:59:53.380 the other or open category.

00:59:55.540 World Aquatics went bent over backwards to make a new category.

00:59:59.040 And Megan, as you may know, at the World Swimming Championships last October in Berlin,

01:00:04.160 precisely zero trans swimmers showed up because, and so much for years and years of hearing from

01:00:11.340 that community, accommodate us.

01:00:13.800 We demand accommodation.

01:00:15.100 Okay, you're accommodated.

01:00:16.120 No, it's not good enough.

01:00:17.640 I still want to swim with the real woman.

01:00:20.000 I still want to change with the real little girls and expose my male genitalia to them.

01:00:25.760 I think that's really what's going on.

01:00:28.240 We are catering to perversion and women's sports, as well as women's shelters.

01:00:33.860 And in Canada, women's penitentiaries are being destroyed.

01:00:38.080 In America.

01:00:38.480 Sacred female spaces are being eradicated.

01:00:41.480 That when you caught up with this Nicholas, who now goes by the name of Melody Wisehart,

01:00:46.660 we talked about this last week when you were on, swimming against 12 and 13-year-old girls,

01:00:51.240 they're allowing him to do that because he says, I identify as a 13-year-old girl.

01:00:54.720 Well, our astute listeners and viewers, David, pointed out that's obviously a lie because when you caught up with him, he got into his car and drove away.

01:01:05.780 If he really thought he was a 13-year-old girl, he couldn't drive.

01:01:09.440 Oh, but Megan, you're so behind the times, my dear.

01:01:15.300 When he's in the pool, he's a 13-year-old girl, but gender and age, it would seem, is fluid.

01:01:22.560 Oh, it's so fluid. I see.

01:01:24.560 Yeah.

01:01:25.120 So, you know, you kind of change your descriptor like normal people would change their socks or underwear.

01:01:33.160 So, when he gets into his car, he's back to being a 50-year-old male, I guess, and this is a wonderful example of diversity, equity, and inclusion when really, it's garden variety misogyny.

01:01:44.140 Yeah, that's the irony.

01:01:45.540 Let's just watch a little bit of that clip for those who did not see it.

01:01:48.800 I finally have a definitive answer to where Nicholas Cepeda changes and showers.

01:01:56.740 It is in the girls' dressing room.

01:02:00.000 I saw it myself with my own eyes.

01:02:01.940 He didn't go into the male dressing room.

01:02:04.280 He didn't go into the family dressing room.

01:02:08.820 Mr. Cepeda, what is your deal?

01:02:12.120 Why are you swimming with 13-year-olds?

01:02:15.000 Why are you breaking world aquatic rules?

01:02:18.020 Why are you a coward?

01:02:20.080 Do you have a record of sexual perversion?

01:02:23.120 Protect me from these people.

01:02:24.920 Protect us from what?

01:02:28.840 Where are you going?

01:02:29.860 Yeah.

01:02:31.940 Like, he needs the protection.

01:02:34.320 So, two things.

01:02:35.080 Yeah, but you know what, Megan?

01:02:35.900 Thank you to our viewers.

01:02:36.820 Because if you want to email me, I do read the emails.

01:02:39.140 They're megan, M-E-G-Y-N, at megankelley.com.

01:02:41.820 And then secondly, I would love to get your thoughts before I let you go, David, on what

01:02:45.820 were the parents saying at the volleyball matches?

01:02:47.560 Like, where were the parents again?

01:02:51.400 Oh, yeah.

01:02:52.100 You know, as my boss says, you know, if you happen to be, and that's Ezra Levent, the

01:02:57.080 owner of this company, Megan, if you're out in the woods and you have the misfortune of

01:03:01.340 stumbling into an area where there's bear cubs and mama bear, guess what?

01:03:06.900 You are now in the most dangerous piece of real estate in the entire planet.

01:03:12.080 You're going to get maimed, even if you have no nefarious intentions.

01:03:16.920 Mama bear in Canada is in hibernation mode.

01:03:20.460 Yes, I speak to mothers and fathers, for that matter, off the record.

01:03:24.500 But there's two things at play, I think, here.

01:03:28.100 For the most part, they're worried about being canceled.

01:03:31.520 We have woke cancel culture.

01:03:33.780 You have people with public sector union jobs saying, Dave, I'm going to be fired and my

01:03:38.740 union will not go to bat for me on this issue.

01:03:41.240 You have people who own businesses saying, you know, the Rainbow Mafia will dox me and

01:03:46.380 carry out a boycott movement and I'll lose my business.

01:03:49.700 And then on the flip side, Megan, I think you have some uber woke liberals out there that

01:03:56.880 really do subscribe to trans women or real women, even if their own biological daughters

01:04:03.260 are being violated, whether it's on the volleyball court, the rugby pitch, the swimming pool.

01:04:10.280 But, you know, for the unholy trinity of diversity, equity and inclusion, this is a good thing.

01:04:15.780 Those parents should be ashamed of themselves if they all took a stand like this.

01:04:21.380 You know, the movies, Spartacus, Megan, remember the Roman centurion is looking for the slave

01:04:26.800 Spartacus and there's all these runaway slaves and it says, which one of you is Spartacus?

01:04:31.060 They just want to get Spartacus to bring him back to Rome and crucify him.

01:04:34.360 And there's a pregnant pause.

01:04:35.560 And then one guy steps forward and he says, I'm Spartacus.

01:04:38.620 And then another one steps forward.

01:04:40.360 I'm Spartacus.

01:04:41.260 They're not Spartacus, but all of them came.

01:04:43.300 And the centurions are confounded.

01:04:46.220 They don't know what to do.

01:04:47.480 That's what we need.

01:04:48.960 Either all step forward or pull your daughters from these sports.

01:04:53.820 Can you imagine what a statement that would be if Nicholas Cepeda shows up and he's the

01:04:59.480 only person on the starting blocks?

01:05:02.460 It's a swim race of one, right?

01:05:05.120 If the volleyball, if the female volleyball is just three men against two men, make a mockery

01:05:12.380 out of it.

01:05:12.780 Because you know what, Megan?

01:05:13.660 It already is a mockery.

01:05:16.020 Yeah.

01:05:16.480 Right now, these parents are hashtag part of the problem.

01:05:18.920 I stand by what I said last week.

01:05:20.700 Riley Gaines, let's go up there together.

01:05:23.660 I'll I'll I can't swim.

01:05:25.260 I won't be of any help.

01:05:26.200 But you need to register swim in this league.

01:05:27.980 If you can just identify as a 12 year old, you let's let Riley Gaines.

01:05:31.680 Let how unfair can we make it?

01:05:33.700 And while we're up there, I'll register for the debate team against all the 12 year olds and

01:05:38.500 I'll crush them all.

01:05:39.460 It'll be super fun.

01:05:40.340 It's super fair.

01:05:41.120 This is the only way we're actually going to expose how ridiculous this you would think

01:05:47.000 that Melody Wisehart would have been enough, but it's not.

01:05:49.380 Now we've got five guys, one of whom was on the male team six months ago, crushing the

01:05:54.460 women, causing concussions.

01:05:56.000 Canadians, find your spines.

01:05:58.580 All right, David.

01:05:59.400 Lots of love to you, to Ezra.

01:06:01.560 You guys have your spines and we appreciate your great work to be continued.

01:06:04.820 Well, fantastic, Megan.

01:06:06.300 And I hope you do make it up here one day, just so you can see the insanity firsthand.

01:06:11.580 But one last thing I'll leave you with, and you'll probably have a unique viewpoint of

01:06:16.800 this being a 100% biological woman yourself.

01:06:20.240 Where in blue hell is the feminist movement?

01:06:23.060 I remember when they used to fight for female sports.

01:06:25.940 I mean, you know, it wasn't until 1966 when women were allowed to compete in the Boston

01:06:31.200 Marathon.

01:06:31.840 They used to jump into the race and get tackled by police.

01:06:34.940 And finally, the feminists did the right thing.

01:06:37.520 And we have a female division in the Boston Marathon and all other marathons.

01:06:40.940 Now, women's sports are being eradicated right before our eyes.

01:06:45.180 They're on the side of these men.

01:06:45.620 What is it?

01:06:46.560 They're on the side of these male posers, the ones who claim they're women.

01:06:50.980 And we all know they're not.

01:06:51.860 David, got it wrong.

01:06:52.380 100%.

01:06:52.860 All the best to you.

01:06:54.020 Okay.

01:06:54.600 Thank you.

01:06:54.940 Now we're going to turn to two returning guests to talk about this and all the stories

01:06:58.000 in the news.

01:06:58.820 Sarah Gonzalez is here.

01:07:00.120 She is the host of the new Blaze TV show, Sarah Gonzalez Unfiltered.

01:07:04.140 And Josh Hammer, who is editor-at-large at Newsweek and host of the newly launched America

01:07:09.960 on Trial podcast, focused on all the trials happening with President Donald Trump and more

01:07:17.240 in 2024.

01:07:18.540 And we've got some updates today on that related to Fannie Willis.

01:07:22.940 Sarah, Josh, welcome.

01:07:25.200 Thank you, Megan.

01:07:27.480 Can you believe, I'm sorry, can we just stay one minute on what David just reported?

01:07:30.880 Like, the fact that the Canadian parents are allowing it.

01:07:34.660 And I know we're tough on the moms, but what about the dads, Josh?

01:07:38.240 I mean, where are the dads on that swimming story if some perverted 50-year-old wants to

01:07:43.920 swim with your 12-year-old and he gets changed with full frontal male nudity in the locker

01:07:49.720 room with them and the parents are not having an all-out meltdown?

01:07:54.360 You know, Megan, where are the fathers?

01:07:56.180 I mean, that could be the title of one heck of a 21st century book, right?

01:07:59.740 I mean, the decline of fatherhood, the decline of fathers' responsibility to their children,

01:08:05.720 you know, from conception up until they reach the age of maturity and adulthood, you know,

01:08:09.980 that has been discussed by some of us in conservative circles for a very long time now.

01:08:13.360 Certainly, my former colleague at the Daily Wire, Matt Walsh, I think, has spoken and written

01:08:16.700 at very great length about this.

01:08:18.800 And I agree with what Matt has to say about it.

01:08:20.720 But, you know, part of it, Megan, part of it is difficult to disentangle from this broader

01:08:26.200 war on manhood.

01:08:27.560 I mean, Senator Josh Hawley, to his credit, wrote a fantastic recent book about this very

01:08:31.960 topic within the past year, year and a half or so.

01:08:34.360 It was a terrific book.

01:08:35.360 I would encourage it to everyone.

01:08:36.780 We need to recover this sense of fatherly responsibility to children.

01:08:40.820 Easier said than done, of course.

01:08:42.180 But the stories like this really do just underscore how far we have come and how far we have to

01:08:46.760 go to get back.

01:08:48.100 Yes, it's protect them.

01:08:49.380 The little girls, of course, they can't say anything.

01:08:51.320 They don't feel empowered to say anything.

01:08:52.740 Even, you know, Riley Gaines, she's so brave now, she did not say anything when she was

01:08:58.260 swimming against Leah Thomas.

01:08:59.540 It takes a lot.

01:09:00.900 And we know she's strong, you know, but it takes a lot to find your spine on this issue.

01:09:05.500 And so what do you think these 12-year-olds are going to do?

01:09:08.040 My God, be the grown-up.

01:09:10.060 Protect your children.

01:09:11.500 Here's the thing, Sarah.

01:09:12.860 Even in our country, as we see in the Riley and the Leah Thomas situation, we've got parents

01:09:18.560 who are actively, or at least grown-ups, who are actively supporting this, who actually

01:09:22.460 think this is totally fine.

01:09:24.040 Go in there as a guy, show off your penis, compete against the women, and anybody who

01:09:28.520 speaks up about it, they'll call a bigot.

01:09:30.540 That brings me to my clip that I'm going to show you here from a woman who testified

01:09:33.960 this week in New Hampshire.

01:09:35.880 New Hampshire's finding its spine on these issues.

01:09:38.160 New Hampshire passed a law already.

01:09:40.140 Well, it's going to be passed.

01:09:40.960 They passed it in the legislature, about banning cross-sex medical procedures for minors.

01:09:47.340 This is the one where all the Democrats crossed over to support it.

01:09:50.340 And now they're targeting getting boys out of girls' sports, and they're taking testimony

01:09:55.980 on it.

01:09:56.720 So this woman shows up.

01:09:59.360 She says, I think she's an actual woman.

01:10:02.240 And listen to this soundbite.

01:10:05.140 Listen to this lunatic in New Hampshire.

01:10:07.100 HB 1205 is a bite into the pursuit of happiness of trans kids.

01:10:15.760 Next to come will be another crunch into the liberty of trans kids and adults.

01:10:20.860 And the main course, or the final solution, and yes, I intentionally capitalize, final solution,

01:10:27.640 is a drooling, snarling chomp that ends the lives of all trans people in this state and

01:10:34.280 the nation.

01:10:35.020 The safety issue here isn't largely that someone's cis daughter is going to lose out to a trans

01:10:44.320 girl in sports.

01:10:45.100 Statistically, the data isn't there.

01:10:46.960 And it isn't that she's going to be ruined for life by seeing a trans girl's penis in

01:10:51.420 the locker room.

01:10:52.480 In fact, statistically, that won't be the first penis she sees.

01:10:57.020 The safety issue is a straight and narrow path to elimination of minorities, trans people,

01:11:02.420 queer people, disabled people, Jewish people, black people, brown people, and a tightening

01:11:07.180 definition of what is acceptable as man, woman, and human.

01:11:12.620 She's opposed this pro-debt to trans kids bill.

01:11:16.960 Sarah, your thoughts?

01:11:20.180 Well, my first thought, Megan, is I think that we can all agree after watching that clip

01:11:25.500 that it was a mistake to eliminate the insane asylums from this country, and we need to bring

01:11:30.980 them back because the idea that this many mentally ill people are walking around advocating

01:11:37.140 for this and calling for this and saying all of the, you know, she had to include all of

01:11:41.320 these SJW buzzwords in there is just absolutely preposterous.

01:11:45.120 It is unfathomable to me that mothers, we are talking about mothers and fathers, would

01:11:52.080 sit by and watch their young daughters share a locker room with a 50-year-old man.

01:11:57.900 It is unfathomable to me that these people are abdicating their responsibility as a parent

01:12:04.320 in favor of these trans lunatics because they are scared of being called a mean name.

01:12:10.840 It is incredible to me.

01:12:13.320 They're just willing to set aside the safety of their children because they're worried about

01:12:17.940 what their neighbors might think of them.

01:12:20.320 They are the people who God entrusted to protect their own children, and they're just willing

01:12:25.640 to give it all up.

01:12:26.740 It's just mind-boggling to me that they don't see the severity of this and what it is going

01:12:31.860 to do to their children.

01:12:33.180 It is, it's infuriating to me because I'm sitting here, I'm fighting, I'm fighting behind

01:12:38.200 the scenes trying to expose this madness.

01:12:40.060 I have to go into these places, Megan, into these all-ages drag shows and take video.

01:12:44.660 I feel like I need 20 showers when I get home, but I'm going in here, I'm exposing it, I'm

01:12:49.560 doing it on my free time that I have.

01:12:52.320 And people often say to me, well, I don't have time because I'm spending time, that's my

01:12:56.580 family time, I have to watch my kids.

01:12:57.920 I said, I am doing this for my kids and for your kids, because I want to know that when

01:13:03.540 my kids grow up, I can look them in the eye and I can tell them I did everything I could

01:13:07.820 to stop this madness.

01:13:09.140 And the fact that there are so many adults in the room who are unwilling to do so is just

01:13:15.200 truly frightening to me.

01:13:17.040 Yes, this soundbite that she, at the end of it, Josh, as she says, and your daughter's

01:13:23.800 not going to be ruined for life by seeing a trans girl's penis, girl's penis is not a

01:13:29.380 thing, in the locker room.

01:13:31.080 In fact, statistically, that won't be the first penis she sees that time.

01:13:36.180 So this, you know what?

01:13:37.680 Thanks to people like her, she might be right.

01:13:39.880 Because people like her are pushing porn in the public schools, are fine with these drag

01:13:45.320 shows that Sarah covers.

01:13:46.900 Like, I'm not, I don't know anything about this particular woman.

01:13:48.920 I'm saying people like that who have that agenda are just fine with the sexualization

01:13:52.920 of minors in the classroom, in the libraries.

01:13:55.700 They're right.

01:13:56.300 They're trying to get the penis in front of the young ones at the earliest age possible.

01:14:00.640 You know, Megan, there are any number of policy issues in our national political discourse

01:14:05.760 where I'm willing to have a civil conversation with my interlocutors on the other side.

01:14:09.920 I'm happy to have a debate over what the capital gains or highest marginal income tax rate

01:14:14.540 should be, what the child tax credit should be.

01:14:16.760 We can talk about what U.S. foreign policy should be vis-a-vis Russia, China, Iran, whatever.

01:14:22.060 But there are some positions that some people take that there's just really no other way

01:14:26.740 to describe it other than evil.

01:14:29.000 And when I was watching that testimony there in New Hampshire that you just showed for

01:14:33.500 Sarah Me, that really was the word that came immediately to mind there, was evil.

01:14:38.360 They're using all these buzzwords here.

01:14:41.260 It's classic, classic leftist rhetorical gymnastics, Megan.

01:14:44.740 You know what I think about as well?

01:14:45.700 It's similar to for how many years, for decades, the left would refer to the abortion procedure

01:14:51.760 under the euphemistic terminology of pro-choice.

01:14:54.080 They've actually moved a little bit away from pro-choice in recent years.

01:14:56.300 But what they're trying to do there is to obfuscate you and to deliberately mislead you

01:15:00.560 as to what is actually going on.

01:15:02.100 That is exactly what we just heard in this clip there.

01:15:03.980 They're talking about affirming the dignity of trans children and all these various other buzzwords

01:15:09.200 to escape the fact that what you're talking about is genital mutilation, chemical castration,

01:15:14.720 and forever, forever injuring these vulnerable young children whose parents, per our previous

01:15:19.860 conversation a few minutes ago, are apparently MIA.

01:15:22.600 No idea what's going on there.

01:15:24.460 And to make matters worse, Megan, unfortunately, it's not just these leftist lunatics who are

01:15:27.960 saying this stuff.

01:15:28.600 Unfortunately, there are some useful idiots on our own side as well.

01:15:31.400 I think back to when he was then governor of Arkansas, Asa Hutchinson, who vetoed the

01:15:35.540 Arkansas legislature with a strong piece of legislation protecting vulnerable youth in

01:15:39.860 that state.

01:15:40.420 Thankfully, Governor Huckabee Sanders has since signed that legislation.

01:15:43.780 Nikki Haley had that quip a few months ago.

01:15:45.820 She then said she didn't say what it seemed like she said.

01:15:48.020 So the viewers can make up their own mind on that.

01:15:50.440 But we have to be one voice on this.

01:15:52.760 I mean, we have to be, Megan, the side of civilizational sanity, if nothing else.

01:15:56.880 And if you are not willing to take a stand as a statesman to protect your vulnerable

01:16:01.640 children, your next generation, from being castrated by vulnerable, predacious medical

01:16:07.360 lobby and doctors and big pharma, then get lost and get out of the business of politics.

01:16:12.140 Megan, can I add something to that?

01:16:13.320 I urge my friends.

01:16:13.980 I urge my friends in the media.

01:16:16.640 It took me a while to get here.

01:16:18.380 And I forgive all of you for taking as long or longer as I did.

01:16:22.820 But stop using the preferred pronouns.

01:16:24.940 You're adding to the problem.

01:16:26.260 You're adding to the confusion.

01:16:27.460 It's it's a it's opening the door for these guys to come into the girls' spaces and locker

01:16:32.620 rooms and so on.

01:16:33.440 We you may feel rude.

01:16:35.020 It's not rude.

01:16:36.020 You're doing it to protect young women.

01:16:38.740 Stop using the preferred pronouns, especially if you're a member of the media.

01:16:42.680 Go ahead, Sarah.

01:16:44.140 Yeah, I was just going to add to Josh's point, you know, people like Asa Hutchinson, who he

01:16:49.020 mentioned these people.

01:16:50.520 I had the opportunity to ask Asa Hutchinson about vetoing that bill.

01:16:54.640 And I said, what what would you say?

01:16:56.560 What would you say to all of these detransitioners who are coming out and sharing their stories

01:17:01.440 about how the medical community, to Josh's point, are sterilizing them, are castrating

01:17:05.780 them, are chopping off women's perfectly healthy breasts, and they will never know the joy of

01:17:10.620 breastfeeding their their children.

01:17:12.220 What would you say to all of these detransitioners who say that they were harmed by the medical

01:17:16.680 community?

01:17:17.300 And his answer to me was, well, they can just sue for malpractice.

01:17:22.320 I couldn't believe it.

01:17:23.900 I thought, oh, so a bunch of money thrown at them is going to solve the mental problems

01:17:29.720 that they are going to have, the emotional problems that they are going to have for the

01:17:32.920 rest of their life, knowing that they can't get these things back.

01:17:36.480 They are body parts.

01:17:37.620 They can't just grow them back.

01:17:39.240 They're not lizards.

01:17:40.140 And so it just was shocking to me to hear the callousness in some of these people's

01:17:46.440 reasoning for why they don't advocate for this.

01:17:49.220 It's just, oh, we'll just sue.

01:17:50.720 And don't worry, money will make it all better.

01:17:53.580 Oh, my God.

01:17:54.400 Can the lizard grow back the body parts?

01:17:57.160 The tail, I think.

01:17:58.540 The tail.

01:18:01.080 Note to self, consult Mr. Google later.

01:18:04.160 OK, let's let's shift gears because I do.

01:18:06.600 I'm interested in your new podcast, Josh.

01:18:08.080 I think it's a great idea.

01:18:09.940 You're basically going to take a hard look at the Trump trials, the big legal news coming up over the next year, which, of course, I love for many reasons.

01:18:15.900 And you're going to have plenty, plenty to keep you busy.

01:18:19.060 So today there is legal news around the Trump trials.

01:18:22.540 And it involves Fannie Willis.

01:18:24.020 A couple of things on her.

01:18:25.860 Number one, her alleged lover, Nathan Wade, has settled his divorce proceeding.

01:18:31.120 It's been going on for all this time.

01:18:33.540 You know, the wife obviously was playing some hardball.

01:18:36.300 I think that's why we know what we know about his alleged affair with Fannie Willis.

01:18:41.220 And they settled.

01:18:42.140 So he does not have to be cross-examined about this.

01:18:47.600 He was supposed to be testifying today.

01:18:49.400 So but that's not the end of the road for him, because separately he has to testify in the case against Trump, because that's where this first came out, where one of Trump's co-defendants in that RICO case, Fannie Willis, is pursuing against him in Georgia.

01:19:03.400 Filed a motion seeking to kick Fannie off the case.

01:19:06.140 Nathan Wade off the case saying they're having an affair on the taxpayer's dollar.

01:19:09.400 They're going all over hell and gone together.

01:19:11.520 And this is like she's benefiting financially off of this prosecution.

01:19:15.060 So he is going to have to testify this Friday.

01:19:18.980 He has to respond to the allegations.

01:19:21.420 And then there's a hearing on February 15th.

01:19:24.240 So mark those days in your calendar.

01:19:26.120 This is just something I think is interesting.

01:19:31.140 It's come out via the Daily Caller.

01:19:33.140 She hired one of those press monitoring firms right before she filed this case against Trump and used $10,000 of the taxpayer's money to keep an eye on her PR and got an update, updates like the following one, an email from somebody internally, I think this was, talking about the firm critical mention and saying,

01:19:57.560 while the numbers can be a bit exaggerated, it says in the last week we've gotten media coverage equivalent to $67 million in advertising, even half of that value would be staggering.

01:20:08.480 All of this makes her look terrible.

01:20:12.740 Yeah, so you've got two big things coming up in the Fannie Willis case.

01:20:15.820 You mentioned February 15th.

01:20:17.160 That's when you're going to have this hearing where Nathan Wade, among others, will be testifying as to whether Fannie Willis is even right to prosecute this case, to try this case against Donald Trump in the first place.

01:20:26.780 That's kind of the million-dollar question right now because you do have allegations and news bits, like you just said, come up.

01:20:32.480 That case is totally topsy-turvy right now.

01:20:34.800 You know, one thing about Donald Trump, Megan, that you have to say about him, he really does have the most cartoonish enemies imaginable in the world, doesn't he?

01:20:41.920 I mean, you know, not to jump too quickly here, but, you know, in this defamation case with E. Jean Carroll, this absurd $83.3 million in damages, including a likely unconstitutional verdict of $65 million in punitive damages, you know, this is a total loonbag of a woman who was on TV, on CNN, you know, saying how she has dreams about being raped.

01:21:02.000 They basically had to cut her off the air.

01:21:03.700 She has a dog, if I'm not mistaken, that she named after her genitalia.

01:21:07.880 So, you know, Fannie Willis and Nathan Wade fit right into that.

01:21:10.600 He does really quite get lucky here.

01:21:12.980 So as of right now, the actual trial date in Georgia is tentatively set all the way for August.

01:21:17.540 People don't realize this.

01:21:18.940 The actual trial start date right now in Georgia, I think, is August 5th.

01:21:23.400 So if these motions and these hearings continue, that's going to only get punted back further.

01:21:28.180 Trump really might get lucky here because, to be honest with you, Megan, when these four criminal prosecutions dropped last year, I was among those who thought that Georgia could be and probably was going to be the most dangerous of the four.

01:21:39.160 But he might get a huge break here down in Georgia.

01:21:41.900 And then on top of this hearing on February 15th, you also have the Georgia State Senate voted 30 to 19 last Friday to start a new committee with which they have subpoena power because they're a legislative body to investigate Fannie Willis as well for misallocation of taxpayer resources along the lines of what you just said, $10,000 for some, you know, cushy cushion of a PR shop.

01:22:02.500 So it's going to get really dicey down there in Georgia.

01:22:04.740 But if you're Trump right now, you're probably smiling in Mar-a-Lago.

01:22:06.940 Yeah, you've got the Georgia Senate creating this committee to investigate her, and they can issue subpoenas and demand testimony.

01:22:13.140 And you've got the motion and the hearing on it in open court on that co-defendant who raised this whole thing to begin with.

01:22:19.500 So they're not going to be able to avoid answering the questions about what their relationship is and what they've used taxpayer money for and whether she's paying him a whole lot more than she's paying at least one of the other special prosecutors,

01:22:30.560 even though the one she's allegedly paying less, has all this experience in RICO cases, and Nathan Wade, her alleged lover, has none.

01:22:37.720 All these questions are going to have to be answered.

01:22:40.520 In the meantime, something else interesting in it, Sarah, is the law firm that's representing the Trump co-defendant, Michael Roman, who filed this thing and got this whole thing about Fannie started,

01:22:50.740 they have sued Fannie Willis' office for alleged failure to disclose records.

01:22:58.460 They filed a lawsuit Monday, per the Daily Caller, alleging that she failed to disclose the public records as required.

01:23:06.340 They demanded that she produce, among other things, according to the Open Records Act, basically the FOIA of Georgia,

01:23:11.520 any contracts between Willis and the state of Georgia and anybody hired to work on the Trump case.

01:23:18.700 So they want to see the contract between her and the special prosecutor she's alleged to be sleeping with and the other two.

01:23:23.240 They want to see it all, as well as analytics produced by that media monitoring company that we just discussed,

01:23:30.360 as well as copies of how money has been spent, basically, by the office.

01:23:35.340 And they refused, according to the lawsuit, her office has refused to provide plaintiff with many of these materials,

01:23:43.640 which are not subject to any exceptions, and they smell a rat.

01:23:48.520 They think the documents they need are being withheld.

01:23:52.420 What do you make of it?

01:23:53.940 Well, I mean, full disclosure, I'm no legal expert, as the two of you are.

01:23:58.520 I'm just a regular old girl who tricked Blaze into paying me to run my mouth for a living.

01:24:03.140 But what I will say about this is that, you know, these people have no morals.

01:24:10.840 They have no values.

01:24:12.040 They call out Donald Trump for all of the, you know, oh, he's participating in election fraud.

01:24:16.800 Oh, he's a misogynist.

01:24:18.340 Oh, he cheats on his wife.

01:24:20.080 Oh, and they list all of the things that they say that Donald Trump is doing wrong,

01:24:24.500 as if they have any values or morals themselves.

01:24:27.360 And you're seeing this play out with the Fannie Willis case.

01:24:30.340 Fannie Willis doesn't give a crap about what Donald Trump did.

01:24:33.260 She just wants to be the one who is elevated by the Democrat Party because she wants to be the one to get Trump.

01:24:39.660 She wants to be the one to get that, you know, get that indictment, get that verdict.

01:24:43.900 And so meanwhile, she's going to be a little bit sloppy, I would think, because these people don't have any morals.

01:24:49.500 They don't have any values.

01:24:50.560 We all know she hired her boyfriend because it was her boyfriend.

01:24:53.040 He had absolutely no experience, as you pointed out, Megan, on RICO cases.

01:24:57.100 He was a personal injury lawyer.

01:24:58.580 We all know that it stinks to high heaven.

01:25:00.720 And so it will be interesting to see how this plays out, because obviously we can see what's right in front of our noses on this.

01:25:06.280 You don't have to be a legal expert to understand that.

01:25:08.300 But what will be interesting is how it will play out in the judicial system.

01:25:12.440 I don't have much faith.

01:25:13.720 I'd love to get your feedback, but I don't have much faith in the judicial system right now as we see it become so weaponized against the American people,

01:25:21.760 you know, against all of these people who are getting decades in prison, who didn't even show up on January 6th.

01:25:27.020 You put your feet up on Nancy Pelosi's desk and have to spend decades of your life in federal prison.

01:25:32.140 You have these pro-life protesters who are, you know, could possibly face up to 11 years in jail for peacefully protesting and praying and singing hymns.

01:25:40.360 And so I don't have that much faith in the judicial system.

01:25:43.500 But what I can tell you is that these people are so corrupt and are so morally broken.

01:25:49.080 Being exposed.

01:25:50.400 Yes.

01:25:50.940 Yes.

01:25:51.760 It's about damn time.

01:25:52.600 That's the beauty.

01:25:52.840 It's like, thank God for this clever lawyer, Ashley Merchant, who represents the one defendant, Roman, because without her, we wouldn't know any of this.

01:26:00.840 You know, Fannie Willis would still be parading around like she's she's the, you know, this paragon of virtue whose word we have to take it, you know, as at face value because she's the vaunted prosecutor.

01:26:10.360 It's a no.

01:26:11.380 All right.

01:26:11.720 Stand by.

01:26:12.140 There's a great, great story involving Mark Cuban and his supposed diehard commitment to diversity.

01:26:17.340 Turns out he's violating the law and got called out by the EEOC commissioner.

01:26:23.880 It's my favorite story of the day.

01:26:25.880 Stand by Sarah and Josh.

01:26:26.900 Come back in one minute.

01:26:47.340 Probably love great people like Dr. Laura, Glenn Beck, Nancy Grace, Dave Ramsey, and yours truly, Megyn Kelly.

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01:27:32.560 So, guys, when I first launched this show, I had Mark Cuban on and I appreciated him coming on.

01:27:36.300 And he gave me a bunch of waxing poetic about how human rights really matter and you have to stand up for them.

01:27:41.680 And in the context of BLM being spray painted all over New York and on his basketball courts and so on.

01:27:46.480 Then we got to the part where he and the NBA are taking all this money from China.

01:27:51.000 And his commitment to human rights changed a little.

01:27:54.040 He talked about it a little differently than he did when bashing America.

01:27:58.280 I think Mark Cuban's not a bad guy, but it was a fun exchange.

01:28:02.200 He was caught and he knew it.

01:28:04.120 Okay.

01:28:04.340 So, he's still out there trying to pretend that he is the chief spokesperson for DEI.

01:28:10.000 And this is after the Mavericks got in a bunch of trouble for, like, terrible treatment of women.

01:28:14.120 So, now he's, like, kind of pretending, like, oh, no, no, no, I'm the chief DEI person ever.

01:28:18.520 And he tweeted out.

01:28:20.180 He's been very defensive of it.

01:28:21.340 Bill Ackman, among others, have been pounding him, saying, you don't understand what you're supporting.

01:28:24.860 You know, look what DEI has done to the Jews, for one example.

01:28:28.220 No, he won't hear of it.

01:28:29.240 So, he tweeted out just the other day, two days ago, it's a long tweet, but what he says in part is,

01:28:34.840 I've never hired anyone based exclusively on race, gender, or religion.

01:28:39.660 I only ever hire the person that will put my business in the best position to succeed.

01:28:43.700 And, yes, race and gender can be part of the equation.

01:28:48.140 I view diversity as a competitive advantage.

01:28:51.380 Okay, so then, enter the EEOC commissioner, one of them, Andrea Lucas, who responds,

01:29:01.240 Hey, Mark Cuban, EEOC commissioner here.

01:29:05.020 Unfortunately, you're dead wrong on Black Letter Title VII law.

01:29:09.180 As a general rule, race slash sex can't even be a motivating factor, nor a plus factor, a tiebreaker, or a tipping point.

01:29:18.460 It's important employers understand the ground rules here.

01:29:22.980 It's exactly right.

01:29:24.940 He has fallen afoul of the law, Josh.

01:29:29.240 And she actually tweeted out this woman, an old article she had written right after the Supreme Court decision striking down affirmative action at the college level,

01:29:36.380 saying, hello, this finally brings universities into compliance with what's been happening or should be happening under the law in corporate America for years,

01:29:44.840 saying the court has never blessed employers taking race-conscious employment actions based on interests in workforce diversity.

01:29:52.480 It's illegal.

01:29:53.860 You cannot hire someone as a plus factor or weight the fact that they're Black or they're Native American.

01:30:00.680 And it's a hard no.

01:30:02.080 It's unlawful.

01:30:03.060 And yet they've been getting away with this, especially since George Floyd, as long as the person not getting hired is white.

01:30:09.500 Well, Megan, racial discrimination in America is obviously illegal.

01:30:12.760 It is unconstitutional under the 14th Amendment and is statutorily illegal under the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

01:30:18.480 But, you know, it is ironic.

01:30:19.820 And the great Christopher Caldwell of Claremont Institute wrote a whole book on this called Age of Entitlement.

01:30:24.740 It is really unfortunate how the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which was a noble statute that had I been a legislator at the time, I would have proudly voted for.

01:30:33.440 But it is unfortunate that the courts and the administrative state have weaponized that statute in unfathomable ways,

01:30:41.300 or at least ways that could not possibly have been contemplated by the lawmakers at the time that they passed it.

01:30:46.340 And, you know, you mentioned affirmative action.

01:30:47.880 It's very hard to not talk about affirmative action in this context.

01:30:51.240 You basically had in the aftermath of the Civil Rights Act and the emergence of the affirmative action regime with the Bakke case at the court in the late 1970s,

01:30:59.120 you had the emergence of two twin conceptions of the American regime.

01:31:03.200 On the one hand, you have the actual American regime, which is the regime of colorblindness that we are all equal under the law,

01:31:09.260 the regime of Thomas Jefferson writing the Declaration of Independence, of Abraham Lincoln leading the Union to victory in the Civil War,

01:31:15.460 of the Reconstruction Amendments, and then Martin Luther King speaking there on the National Mall.

01:31:19.040 And then on the other hand, you have this other conception of the American regime.

01:31:22.980 That would be the conception of Ibram X. Kendi of critical race theory,

01:31:26.440 the notion that the only remedy to past discrimination is present discrimination.

01:31:30.240 The remedy for present discrimination is future discrimination.

01:31:33.120 And you actually saw that play out in the affirmative action cases at the court just this past summer.

01:31:37.660 So Clarence Thomas's concurrence opinion, one of my favorite writings that CT has probably ever written on the court,

01:31:43.240 wrote for however long it was, 30, 40, 50 pages, taking the first position.

01:31:47.360 By contrast, Ketanji Brown Jackson tried, I think she grossly failed,

01:31:51.560 but she tried to defend that second alternative conception of the American regime.

01:31:56.560 Those are the basic tradeoffs.

01:31:58.240 So for a while, we basically just have not been enforcing the letter of the law,

01:32:02.200 what the law actually says, because of the courts and the administrative state.

01:32:05.780 Good for this EOC commissioner in trying to reassert what the law actually says,

01:32:09.420 especially after the affirmative action case.

01:32:11.620 Mark Cuban, unfortunately, is totally clownish when it comes to these topics.

01:32:14.760 I'm happy that you schooled him, and I hope that others continue to do so as well.

01:32:18.540 I think people have forgotten in the wake of George Floyd, Sarah,

01:32:21.160 that it's illegal to discriminate on the basis of race in hiring and in most places.

01:32:26.680 You cannot not hire somebody because you need more people of a different race.

01:32:32.640 So your company looks, quote, more diverse.

01:32:35.300 And here, in case you had any doubts about Mark Cuban's commitment to doing exactly this thing

01:32:40.260 that violates the law, is the CEO of the Dallas Mavericks in, it's right after George Floyd.

01:32:46.600 Her name is Sint Marshall.

01:32:48.360 She puts it all out there.

01:32:49.500 Look at her.

01:32:50.920 I know the business case for diversity, and you have to have a diverse group of people around the table

01:32:54.940 if you really want to be as successful as you can be.

01:32:58.280 And so we took that on.

01:32:59.600 So we laid out that vision, laid out a set of values, and then I had one-on-one with all the employees

01:33:04.720 and then made some leadership changes.

01:33:06.640 And so now we have almost 50% women in leadership and 47% people of color.

01:33:12.100 And so diversity matters.

01:33:13.700 It matters.

01:33:16.740 We've got to get rid of the white men.

01:33:18.920 That's what she's saying.

01:33:19.880 It's illegal.

01:33:21.200 And it's just morally wrong, Sarah.

01:33:22.980 And I think people have caught on to how absurd and wrong this is.

01:33:27.160 I mean, you're absolutely right.

01:33:28.380 It is morally wrong.

01:33:29.420 But I would also like to bring up, it's a dumb business strategy, too.

01:33:33.540 It is entirely preposterous to think.

01:33:36.120 I mean, she just said the key to success for a business is diversity.

01:33:40.260 Absolutely not.

01:33:41.660 The key to success for a business is, of course, hiring based on merit and experience and expertise.

01:33:47.480 I mean, these people are so ridiculous with their virtuous, you know, crying for all of the buzzwords

01:33:54.120 and making sure that they have all of these diversity hires.

01:33:56.440 You know why I know Mark Cuban understands the ridiculousness of it?

01:34:00.360 Because if he was truly worried about diversity in every shape, way, or form, he would have a bunch of fat white guys on his basketball team.

01:34:09.020 Why doesn't he?

01:34:10.000 Well, because, A, they're white.

01:34:11.440 And, B, he knows that that won't make his team better.

01:34:14.260 And so they keep throwing around all these buzzwords because they want to be the most virtuous among us.

01:34:19.800 It's always white men who do this, you notice, as Mark Cuban is.

01:34:23.120 But I will say I am calling for any white man who has not been hired by the Dallas Mavericks.

01:34:29.640 File that lawsuit, baby.

01:34:30.980 All right.

01:34:31.240 Everyone needs to be filing these lawsuits to expose these people because I think that's going to be the only way to deter them from engaging in these practices.

01:34:41.020 Yes.

01:34:41.240 Your case is made for you.

01:34:42.600 You've got Mark Cuban, the owner, and the CEO on camera and in writing saying, we discriminate against whites and men.

01:34:51.020 That's the flip side of the way they put a positive spin on it.

01:34:54.400 But what they're saying is, we discriminate against whites and men.

01:34:58.560 Think about how outrageous it would be 40 years ago for somebody to say, we discriminate against blacks and women.

01:35:05.720 It's a real plus for you if you could come in here as a white guy.

01:35:09.320 It's obvious when you just flip it on its head.

01:35:11.760 But we've been getting away with it for far too long.

01:35:13.680 All right.

01:35:13.860 Quickly, Josh, I want to ask you, yet another plagiarism scandal out of Harvard.

01:35:18.180 This time, it's the head of DEI.

01:35:21.100 I mean, here we are again.

01:35:22.360 DEI is pernicious and must be stopped.

01:35:24.960 So she, according to the Free Beacon, which did a big report, her name is Sherry Ann Charleston, appears to have plagiarized extensively at least 40 allegations of plagiarism that span the entirety of her thin publication record.

01:35:39.240 They're citing from a complaint that was filed with Harvard on Monday and a Washington Free Beacon analysis.

01:35:46.720 It goes on.

01:35:47.760 She took credit for her husband's paper, his research paper, and a 2014 paper she published with him.

01:35:53.120 But they didn't cite it.

01:35:54.180 They offered it apparently as though it was new thinking, which all the experts consulted by the Beacon say that is research fraud, plain and simple.

01:36:03.220 Of course, she's got a long history in gender studies and DEI this and that.

01:36:07.360 So what do we make of it?

01:36:08.240 Well, you know, quickly, Megan, first, I want to make a plug for the writer who exposed this, Aaron Sabarium, who is doing just absolutely indispensable work at the Free Beacon.

01:36:17.660 He, alongside Chris Rufo, was the one who helped bring down Claudine Gay in the first place there.

01:36:21.440 So go ahead and follow his work if you're not already doing so.

01:36:23.560 So when it comes to the subject here and the DEI officer, you know, it's kind of ironic, as a friend pointed out to me, that, you know, one of the things that you can't discuss when it comes to crime, Heather McDonald discusses it, but no one else does, is how the biggest victims of black crime are actually other black people.

01:36:38.480 How about the fact that oftentimes it seems when it comes to plagiarism, academia, Claudine Gay and her, the other biggest victims of black academics when it comes to plagiarism, having to be other black people.

01:36:48.760 It's kind of a weird thing as well.

01:36:50.640 I never would have ever thought about that, but it seems to be the case here.

01:36:54.100 Look, this woman obviously should go.

01:36:55.860 All these people should go.

01:36:57.120 And not just the ones who plagiarize, by the way, but we have to go department by department, bureaucracy by bureaucracy all across the country, just trying to ultimately gut this cancer from our higher education system.

01:37:06.560 Yeah, I mean, is it any surprise that the DEI mavens at various places are breaking the law, plagiarizing, like if you get ahead for doing one thing, you major in women's studies or African-American studies, some made up specialty, you extract some $350,000 out of these universities to pay you to keep the right number of whites and men out, violating the law.

01:37:29.640 Yes, at the college setting now as well.

01:37:32.460 And you get away with it unless people like that EEOC commissioner weigh in and call attention to you.

01:37:37.360 God bless her.

01:37:38.220 Guys, thank you both so much.

01:37:39.540 Pleasure seeing you both again.

01:37:41.240 Thank you so much, Megan.

01:37:41.860 Thank you.

01:37:42.740 And thanks to all of you for joining us tomorrow.

01:37:44.460 We've got Newt Gingrich and Adam Carolla.

01:37:47.120 See you then.

01:37:51.060 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show.

01:37:52.900 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

01:37:59.640 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show.

The Megyn Kelly Show - January 31, 2024

Exclusive with Montana Parents Who Had Daughter Taken Away, Plus New Fani Willis Drama, with Sara Gonzales, Josh Hammer, and David Menzies｜ Ep. 714

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