The Megyn Kelly Show - First Person： Female College Athlete Speaks Out About and Sues NCAA Over Biological Male On Her Team ｜ Ep. 915

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00:00:15.640 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:26.580 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly.

00:00:28.080 Welcome to this Megyn Kelly Show and our special first-person episode.

00:00:33.180 The fight to protect women's sports is underway, and right now the focus is on college women's volleyball.

00:00:39.280 Teams in the Mountain West Conference have recently forfeited games against San Jose State University

00:00:45.460 after it was revealed that one of the top players on their team is a male pretending to be a woman.

00:00:52.820 His name is Blair Fleming, and he continues to play.

00:00:56.500 Putting these women, including those on his own team, at risk.

00:01:01.060 And now one of his teammates is bravely speaking out.

00:01:06.240 Brooke Slusser is a setter on the San Jose State University team. 0.99

00:01:11.100 She recently joined a class-action lawsuit against the NCAA

00:01:15.140 and is going public with efforts by her university to cover up the fact that Fleming is a male.

00:01:23.280 Brooke Slusser joins me now.

00:01:24.460 Brooke, so good to meet you.

00:01:28.200 Thank you so much for being here.

00:01:30.500 Thank you so much for having me.

00:01:33.080 You're a courageous young woman because you're still on this team,

00:01:36.640 and I know the blowback has been severe.

00:01:40.780 So first just tell us what made you speak out.

00:01:44.340 What was it?

00:01:44.820 I mean, I think it just, at the end of the day, it has so much more to do with right now.

00:01:51.920 And this honestly probably won't affect Blair and playing on my team at this time,

00:01:58.840 but it has to do with the generations of girls coming through wanting to play Division I sports

00:02:04.560 and making that change for them so they don't ever have to go through this.

00:02:08.580 And I think that's the biggest push factor of why I felt so inspired to want to join this lawsuit.

00:02:14.280 You are so spot on, and you really are brave.

00:02:20.420 I didn't expect to play this ad this high up in our interview, but I'm going to.

00:02:26.440 Our friend Jennifer Say has this XXXY Athletics brand. 0.97

00:02:30.600 She used to help run Levi's, and she got basically forced out of there

00:02:34.180 because she didn't want COVID lockdowns and schools not letting kids in.

00:02:38.640 So now she's opened up this brand that is meant to support women, women like you,

00:02:44.260 who are just trying to play sports on a fair, equal playing field.

00:02:47.800 And she dropped this ad, which is a Dear Nike ad.

00:02:52.800 The point of the ad, which I'm going to play, is that Nike is not standing up for women.

00:02:56.660 The NCAA is not standing up for women.

00:02:59.080 Your school is not standing up for women. 1.00

00:03:01.360 And amazingly, it takes somebody like you, Brooke.

00:03:04.360 It takes an actual woman who's affected by their cowardice to make change. 1.00

00:03:11.040 Here's the Nike ad.

00:03:13.020 Dear Nike.

00:03:14.220 Dear Nike.

00:03:15.320 Dear Nike.

00:03:16.360 Why won't you stand up for me?

00:03:17.980 Why won't you stand up for me?

00:03:19.440 Why won't you?

00:03:20.540 Why do you claim to support women and girls?

00:03:23.120 Yet when we need you most.

00:03:24.540 You remain silent.

00:03:26.000 Today, males are claiming our identity.

00:03:28.000 Our sports.

00:03:29.000 Our spaces.

00:03:30.120 Men and boys are stealing opportunities.

00:03:32.320 Medals.

00:03:33.000 Trophies.

00:03:33.520 And our future.

00:03:34.940 And is not fair.

00:03:36.160 Or just.

00:03:37.280 In fact, it's often dangerous.

00:03:39.100 Yet you refuse to use your platform to stand up.

00:03:41.880 You say you're for social justice and progress.

00:03:44.200 So why do you allow men's rights to come before ours? 0.97

00:03:47.140 See, with a big platform comes an even bigger responsibility.

00:03:50.720 You have a chance to do the right thing.

00:03:52.620 Not just do the easy thing.

00:03:54.200 So we're asking you, Nike.

00:03:55.580 So we're asking you, Nike.

00:03:56.980 So we're asking you, Nike.

00:03:58.480 As the biggest voice in all of sports.

00:04:00.720 Will you stand up for me?

00:04:02.280 Will you stand up for me?

00:04:03.700 Will you stand up for me?

00:04:04.920 Will you stand up for me?

00:04:06.200 Will you?

00:04:06.900 Will you?

00:04:07.540 Will you just do it?

00:04:11.620 Hashtag Save Women Sports.

00:04:13.380 XXXY Athletics.

00:04:15.780 Amazing.

00:04:16.540 Very moving.

00:04:17.740 And so far, the answer from Nike has been no in the form of silence.

00:04:22.720 But Brooke, you're doing it.

00:04:24.220 And you're doing it while you have skin in the game.

00:04:26.200 You're on this team with this male, pretending to be female.

00:04:30.280 Everyone is against you.

00:04:32.040 So walk us through how this first happened to you.

00:04:36.120 Because I understand you transferred into San Jose.

00:04:38.340 Yes.

00:04:39.680 Yes.

00:04:40.880 Yeah.

00:04:41.160 So I went into the transfer portal going into my junior year.

00:04:45.800 And I just wanted to go somewhere where I could find love for the game again.

00:04:50.440 Just be happy doing what I've always wanted to do.

00:04:53.700 And got recruited by San Jose State.

00:04:57.520 And it was never brought to my knowledge that there was a male on the team.

00:05:01.740 And obviously, there would have been no way that I would have came here if I had known that.

00:05:07.520 And so they recruited me.

00:05:10.820 Everything seemed great.

00:05:12.300 And I also got recruited in the summer.

00:05:13.740 So I only got to meet two of the girls on the team at the time that just happened to be on campus while I was taking my visit.

00:05:20.540 So I didn't really know anyone on the team until I got here.

00:05:23.380 And then they also, being a transfer athlete, recommended that one of our group of girls that are on the team had an open room and that I move in with them.

00:05:33.940 Because it would be good to help me bond and get to know some of the girls on the team.

00:05:38.360 And I was like, that sounds amazing.

00:05:39.880 Like, I would love to do that.

00:05:42.120 So I move in.

00:05:43.880 And it's with three of my teammates.

00:05:45.400 And come to find out, one of those teammates is Blair, who I did not know was a male.

00:05:53.860 So I'm not only on the team with a man, but also was unknowingly living with one.

00:06:01.280 Wow.

00:06:01.980 No one told you that Blair was a biological man, was a male, before you moved in?

00:06:07.160 No.

00:06:08.760 So how did you find out?

00:06:10.280 So I was here for about two and a half months, and nothing was said.

00:06:18.720 And then I went to a food truck with one of my teammates and two of the men's basketball players at San Jose State.

00:06:26.320 And I kind of overheard them talking while we were waiting for our food, talking about Blair being a man.

00:06:33.300 And I kind of turned around, and I was like, what are you all talking about?

00:06:37.380 And they were like, you don't know?

00:06:38.780 And I was like, what are you talking about?

00:06:42.300 And that's when everything kind of unfolded for me.

00:06:46.720 And they told me what they knew.

00:06:49.200 But still, it was nowhere out in the open.

00:06:51.280 No one talked about it.

00:06:52.840 It was all just whispers behind closed doors.

00:06:55.960 It was never addressed.

00:06:57.920 So I went through a whole stage of, like, denial.

00:07:02.380 Because, I mean, just with the way I was raised,

00:07:04.280 I'm not second-guessing if someone is the gender that they're telling me they are. 0.93

00:07:09.740 So, and I've never had to deal with this before.

00:07:12.540 So it was just a whole, like, mind game of trying to figure out how to deal with this on your own.

00:07:20.800 Again, this was not talked about by anyone.

00:07:22.780 So when I found this out, it's not like I went to practice and was able to talk about it with my coaches

00:07:26.840 and have someone to go to about this.

00:07:29.480 It was just a situation in the back of my head where our teammates who were figuring it out slowly

00:07:36.180 were able to talk about it with each other.

00:07:37.800 But there was nothing we could do about it.

00:07:40.520 Is Blair, and we showed the picture there, is Blair, like, tall, physically imposing?

00:07:46.420 Describe Blair.

00:07:48.680 Blair is about 6'1".

00:07:51.020 Oh, wow.

00:07:51.500 Definitely the most muscular person on our team, by far.

00:07:56.400 So, I mean...

00:07:58.020 Do we know whether Blair went through male puberty?

00:08:02.160 I don't, I could not tell you.

00:08:04.260 I'm not sure.

00:08:04.980 We don't know when Blair, quote, transitioned or attempted to start looking like a woman? 1.00

00:08:11.700 I couldn't give you an exact age.

00:08:13.840 I just know it was young.

00:08:15.060 And I want to say around 13, 12 years old.

00:08:22.180 But, again, I haven't sat down with Blair and asked these questions.

00:08:28.260 Yeah, yeah.

00:08:28.940 It doesn't look like Blair's willing to have this conversation.

00:08:31.240 So we don't know whether Blair's been through male puberty.

00:08:34.180 Certainly the height would suggest maybe, though there can be tall girls, especially in volleyball, too. 1.00

00:08:40.080 Not that Blair's a girl.

00:08:42.640 He's not.

00:08:43.140 He's a man.

00:08:43.960 So you find this out, and now you're living with Blair.

00:08:47.580 And is it true, too, that you had actually shared a room with Blair from time to time, like on the road, was it, for games?

00:08:55.120 Yes.

00:08:57.580 Yeah, so I, when we have travel trips, there's two girls to a room, usually. 1.00

00:09:04.520 And your coaches just give you anyone on the team, and they usually switch it up with people that they know you're not as close with, so that you can get to know different people on the team.

00:09:13.700 And I was like, this is great.

00:09:14.900 I'm a transfer player.

00:09:15.900 Like, I'll get the opportunity to get to know some new people on the team that I haven't really gotten to know yet.

00:09:20.620 And then I noticed as time went on that I just kept getting roomed with Blair, which I found very odd because everyone else on the team was getting switched around.

00:09:29.980 Again, I'm a new person on the team.

00:09:31.840 I wasn't going to sit and ask questions or cause trouble just because I do what I'm told, and that's just, it is what it is.

00:09:38.920 At the time, I had no reason to question what anyone was doing and who I was rooming with.

00:09:43.420 And then come to find out later, they asked Blair who he was comfortable rooming with on away trips.

00:09:53.580 And apparently there was a selected few of us that were on that list, and I was one of them.

00:10:01.400 Wow.

00:10:01.860 Without any disclosure whatsoever.

00:10:04.540 So did you get along with Blair?

00:10:06.880 What kind of a person is Blair? 0.82

00:10:08.240 That's what the hardest part was, is because I did get along with Blair before finding all this out.

00:10:15.580 I mean, living with a person, you're around them a lot.

00:10:20.060 And so Blair was a friend to me.

00:10:24.120 And so after all of this coming out, like, it was, again, just I'm in such denial because someone you think is a friend and then come to find out their life is a lie to you.

00:10:38.780 Is how I perceived it.

00:10:41.220 So I think that's why it's so hard for so many people to deal with this in our situation right now.

00:10:46.700 Did you notice a difference on the court in Blair's play versus the other girls? 0.79

00:10:53.620 Oh, 100%.

00:10:54.560 I mean, anyone, you don't have to know volleyball at all.

00:10:58.980 You could come and sit and watch one of our games.

00:11:01.200 And it's so obvious that there's so much more power and strength behind that swing.

00:11:07.060 I mean, you go watch a male game and a women's game.

00:11:09.860 There's a complete difference.

00:11:11.800 There's a reason that they're separate.

00:11:13.240 So if you come and watch our games, it's the same thing.

00:11:18.840 Like, there is a massive difference.

00:11:24.040 There is a massive difference.

00:11:25.120 Explain for the non-volleyball observer here.

00:11:27.900 What are we seeing?

00:11:28.920 Why is that extraordinary with Blair spiking the ball?

00:11:31.800 I mean, you just can see how high Blair is jumping. 1.00

00:11:34.920 I mean, he's swinging over the block against anyone that we're playing.

00:11:39.340 And then it's not just a hard swing.

00:11:42.420 It's a hard swing straight down.

00:11:44.220 Like, that is undiggable.

00:11:46.640 And for people who don't know, volleyball reference digging is just playing defense against a hitter.

00:11:51.640 Like, these swings are just, you're unable to stop it.

00:11:56.080 And so it's just an insane difference.

00:11:59.400 And not just the power, but the ability to even keep the ball up.

00:12:03.800 Right.

00:12:04.620 Just last night, Blair played in a game and spiked a girl in the face. 1.00

00:12:13.180 Here it is.

00:12:13.920 Watch.

00:12:15.220 Let's go!

00:12:16.620 They'll have to continue to look forward as they trail by 10 points here.

00:12:20.860 Fleming!

00:12:21.660 Right there.

00:12:23.320 Right there.

00:12:24.040 Hits her in the face. 0.60

00:12:24.780 And the announcer would go on to comment on how the girl's face was turning pink from the hit. 1.00

00:12:32.700 That's not the first time that Blair's extraordinary abilities.

00:12:37.240 With a massive blow from the back row and a good job getting it back up.

00:12:40.480 Kira Heron has it pink in her ear and her face is starting to look like 0.64

00:12:43.920 she's matching that as obviously took the contact, but also got to feel a little embarrassed as she's trying to laugh off that last ball.

00:12:50.060 Aw, right.

00:12:52.460 I think he nailed it.

00:12:53.820 She's embarrassed and she's trying to laugh it off.

00:12:56.140 And it wasn't the first time that even the announcers noticed a difference in Blair and the way Blair plays.

00:13:02.900 Here's another example in Sop 50.

00:13:06.060 Her vertical is in this match unmatched. 0.88

00:13:10.980 Blair Fleming, ladies and gentlemen, might be the most impressive athlete on the floor tonight. 1.00

00:13:16.060 Not any of the women, the man posing as one. 1.00

00:13:21.540 So that seems to be just a couple of examples of them seeing what you say you experienced firsthand.

00:13:29.220 Mm-hmm.

00:13:30.860 Yes.

00:13:31.460 And did you feel safe in playing like with Blair on your team?

00:13:35.500 Like, I assume you kind of scrimmage, I don't know what the word is, against one another in practice and so on.

00:13:40.860 Did you feel like you were safe?

00:13:44.080 Oh, no.

00:13:45.240 I mean, there's, I think it's noticeable now for anyone that can go on, like, our team has access to film that you can go watch for practice.

00:13:53.560 And you can just see girls the entire practice having to dodge out of the way of a swing.

00:13:59.140 So, like, just in that video that you showed, we're not getting slammed in the face.

00:14:03.200 And I don't feel safe.

00:14:06.160 I've gone to my coaches and I've said I refuse to play against Blair if there isn't at least a block-up, which, if we're being honest, doesn't only make a difference for anyone.

00:14:15.780 But, yeah, I mean, girls, if a block, if there's no block-up, then Blair is just going with no one up at the net, just openly swinging. 1.00

00:14:26.260 So, at least if there is a block-up.

00:14:27.900 A way of minimizing the danger would be to put girls along the net on your team on defense against Blair? 0.90

00:14:34.020 Yes.

00:14:35.220 And there are times in practice, even if there is a block-up, people are still getting hit in the head.

00:14:40.960 People are still dodging Blair's swings.

00:14:43.700 It's not safe.

00:14:45.020 And it's talked about all the time.

00:14:46.840 It doesn't, we don't feel safe playing defense against Blair.

00:14:49.900 Because, again, the power is just unmatchable for any woman. 1.00

00:14:53.060 It doesn't matter how good or bad anyone wants to say that Blair's play is comparatively to some of the top players in the NCAA.

00:15:01.740 They're amazing players, but, again, the power behind this swing is just so different.

00:15:07.040 And if you're not completely prepared for it, you will get blown up.

00:15:11.160 And that's the scariest part, because that could end your career.

00:15:13.700 Right.

00:15:15.820 Well, I mean, I'm sure you guys are aware of Peyton McNabb in North Carolina, a young volleyball player who did play against a male who was posing as female and suffered permanent nerve damage and brain damage.

00:15:30.660 And she's been outspoken about it since, but she's only 16 years old, and they allowed this to happen to her.

00:15:36.260 So there is real risk.

00:15:38.720 There's genuine danger to you.

00:15:40.600 Like, what did your parents say?

00:15:42.160 What did your family say when they realized the school had placed you in this position?

00:15:46.800 My parents were enraged.

00:15:49.020 I mean, you can only imagine.

00:15:50.880 It's like you're sending your child off, putting them in the hands and trust of these coaches to basically take care of you and be able to relay, like, life decisions and everything through them.

00:16:02.980 And then come to find out that they said all these things, like, bring Brooke here, we'll care for her, we'll love for her, and lie about a man being on the team.

00:16:14.000 And allowing me to move in with a man on the team after knowing everything that I'd been through personally with my past in volleyball.

00:16:22.620 So it was, they could not have been angrier about the whole situation.

00:16:28.360 I mean, rightfully so.

00:16:30.120 I feel for them entirely and would have shared the outrage.

00:16:34.900 So you now are faced with this information.

00:16:37.760 And most people, even Riley Gaines, who I know we both love, in the moment did not say anything, you know, because everything's on the line.

00:16:48.980 You work so hard.

00:16:50.340 She was at the NCAA championships and they were screwing her over.

00:16:55.240 So in the moment, I think an athlete's instinct is, I'm tough.

00:16:59.300 I am trained to suck it up.

00:17:00.620 I play through pain.

00:17:01.660 I play through a lot.

00:17:03.220 That's how you become a champion.

00:17:06.160 So what, how are you able to get around that great mentality and seek a higher goal, which really is what you're doing to say, this is morally wrong.

00:17:17.420 I mean, so we've had so many meetings about all of this with the media people from our school, with admin, compliance, everyone.

00:17:29.100 And from the beginning, when we had that first meeting, it was when the first article came out about Blair being trans and basically saying, don't tell Blair's story.

00:17:42.020 If people ask about it, it's not your story to tell.

00:17:45.200 No comment.

00:17:45.840 Like it's probably be a, it's probably best if you don't make a comment.

00:17:50.100 And with that being the first meeting, no one really made comments about it.

00:17:53.480 We all just kind of left.

00:17:54.800 And it was just this feeling of like, what about us?

00:17:58.500 Like there's 18, 19 other women on this team that are having to deal with this and the backlash. 1.00

00:18:05.580 And then also having to mentally go through the fact of finding out that this is a man we're playing with and that this it's connecting all the puzzle pieces of why Blair played so differently.

00:18:15.840 And I think over time, I just got so fed up with this like heavy feeling of they don't care about us and they're not doing anything to protect us.

00:18:28.060 They only care about protecting Blair, which I don't understand.

00:18:32.860 And no one else understood, but it was like, there's so many things that everyone else is going through.

00:18:37.780 I'm going to deal with this, but yet don't make a comment.

00:18:40.580 Your feelings don't matter.

00:18:43.220 Don't tell Blair story.

00:18:45.000 It's not your story to tell.

00:18:46.120 And I think I just got so fed up with that because everything in my body was like, this is so wrong and nothing about this is right.

00:18:56.360 It's not fair.

00:18:57.400 It shouldn't be happening.

00:18:58.440 And so when I got the opportunity and got reached out to by icons to join the lawsuit, I sat in it for a minute and I was like, I never want anyone else to have to go through what my team is having to go through right now.

00:19:12.700 I mean, these girls grow up again, just wanting to play D1 volleyball. 1.00

00:19:16.600 It's your dream.

00:19:18.040 And now we're to the point where we're barely talking about volleyball and we're only talking about how to deal with the outside noise of all of this and how to handle it and how to deal with it.

00:19:27.200 But we don't have anyone in the school really telling us how to do those things, just telling us to be quiet and be happy and nothing's going to change.

00:19:36.080 And so I think at the end of the day, I just got so fed up.

00:19:38.860 I was like, I want to be able to make this change for other people coming into collegiate sports.

00:19:42.700 I am so sorry that this happened to you.

00:19:47.140 This is so wrong.

00:19:49.400 I know some young volleyball players who have given everything.

00:19:55.680 They're on that core all the time.

00:19:58.120 And I know what it takes to get division one volleyball.

00:20:01.640 That's a dream.

00:20:02.940 That's a dream.

00:20:03.720 You have to work so hard for that.

00:20:05.120 And then to have this thrown at you, you must endanger yourself.

00:20:08.780 You must accept yourself to possible brain damage, nerve damage, physical harm in the name of equity or some other unstated goal.

00:20:19.080 It's deeply immoral.

00:20:20.740 It's unsafe.

00:20:21.600 All I can think of right now, and by the way, for those just tuning in, we're talking to Brooke Slusser.

00:20:27.540 She is the co-captain of the San Jose State women's volleyball team right now.

00:20:31.760 And she is speaking out about what this school is doing to her and the other girls and the girls in the league by refusing to pull a male player who is pretending to be female and instead forcing them all to play against him.

00:20:47.280 All I can think of is Megan Rapinoe, one of the most well-known names in women's sports who said, and I quote, show me all the trans people who are nefariously taking advantage of being trans in sports. 0.99

00:21:02.580 It's just not happening.

00:21:05.240 What would you like her to know?

00:21:06.280 I mean, at the end of the day, it's just not right.

00:21:13.040 Like, again, male and female, there is a reason there is men's sports and women's sports. 0.70

00:21:19.900 That didn't start just for nothing.

00:21:23.580 So there's, at the end of the day, if this is going to keep going the way it's going, why wouldn't coaches just recruit a full team of men if they're allowed to be in women's sports?

00:21:33.900 I mean, you would obviously win everything.

00:21:38.960 It's a no-brainer.

00:21:40.180 Exactly.

00:21:40.720 As long as they're willing to put on a skirt and say they're not male, they're in.

00:21:44.380 And, I mean, there's money attached to it.

00:21:46.780 There's bragging rights attached to it.

00:21:48.920 Universities pay millions, millions of dollars to get the right recruits and make sure that the university is built up to have winning sports teams.

00:21:56.760 It helps with donations, with alumni.

00:21:59.320 There's a lot of money riding on it.

00:22:00.420 Why not?

00:22:01.020 This is great.

00:22:01.640 Once you've got the camel's nose under the tent, just go for the whole camel.

00:22:05.520 Why have the women at all? 1.00

00:22:06.540 They're so annoying and such losers, really.

00:22:08.780 I mean, men make the best women. 1.00

00:22:10.860 We've seen that time and time again.

00:22:12.540 That's really where this argument takes us.

00:22:15.440 So you decide you mentioned the lawsuit.

00:22:18.740 This is the Riley.

00:22:19.560 Riley didn't take long before she found that voice.

00:22:22.160 And she's been so fierce on this whole issue.

00:22:25.760 And she's been a leader in, among other things, bringing this lawsuit saying, you violated my Title IX rights, NCAA, and should never have put me or others in the position that they are putting you, Brooke, in right now. 0.51

00:22:42.360 Unsafe, unfair, and unlawful.

00:22:45.440 And they, so ICONS, which is a group that helps women in this position and well worth your time and your money if you want to donate, folks, is now, they reach out to you.

00:22:56.460 They get you involved.

00:22:57.100 You say, yes, I'll join the lawsuit.

00:22:58.620 Very, very brave.

00:23:00.240 You've got current standing.

00:23:01.760 No court could say you don't.

00:23:03.340 This is an active issue for you right now.

00:23:05.100 And what kind of reaction do you get from your teammates and your coaches?

00:23:13.860 I think my coaches were very caught off guard when I first told them.

00:23:19.920 I think they said a lot of things that all I asked of them, I said, I just ask that you respect me and my decision as much as you're respecting and deciding to support Blair in his decision to be here.

00:23:38.740 And I said, you don't have to think of me the same off the court, but on the court, I just want the same respect.

00:23:43.000 And just from how everything had been going, I knew that my coach wasn't going to be happy about me joining, most likely.

00:23:53.900 But again, I kind of just left it at, I just want the respect on the court.

00:23:58.180 I don't want anything to change on the court.

00:24:00.760 And he was like, of course, like, I'm not going to change the way I treat you as a coach.

00:24:08.120 To this day, I don't know if that's still happening.

00:24:10.400 But from my team, I've had so much love.

00:24:15.820 I mean, we have such an amazing group of women on our team. 1.00

00:24:19.800 And that is the only reason I'm still able to be here is for them.

00:24:24.220 Because they come in every day and they work their butts off.

00:24:28.260 And it's such a selfless act.

00:24:30.420 I mean, I tell them day in and day out.

00:24:32.280 I mean, there's only so much you can ask of these young women to come in and work hard going through what they're going through.

00:24:38.540 I mean, I said it last night to them.

00:24:40.220 There is no one else that can say in the nation in NCAA sports that they're going through what we're going through right now.

00:24:46.400 And it's like, there's only so much mental strength that a woman can have every day to come in and suck it up and just put a smile on your face. 1.00

00:24:54.100 So if it wasn't for them, I wouldn't be able to keep going the way I'm going every day going to the gym.

00:25:00.480 This is such bullshit.

00:25:04.200 This is so wrong.

00:25:05.660 This is so wrong.

00:25:06.820 It's just like, we talk about it all the time on this show and the audience knows.

00:25:11.620 But it's to hear a first person account of what it's like.

00:25:15.060 And you're raising such good points.

00:25:17.380 These girls are going through it right now. 1.00

00:25:19.520 Are they also suffering?

00:25:23.560 Oh, 100%.

00:25:24.700 I mean, I'm just right now as hard because I think it's so hard to talk about because, again, you don't know who you can trust talking about these things with.

00:25:33.500 And so it's just me making sure that I can still reach out to my teammates, especially those young girls.

00:25:42.780 Imagine being an 18-year-old in college trying to figure out the new lifestyle of being away from your family and getting homesick and then introducing collegiate sports in that scenario and then college classes and then adding this to that.

00:25:57.360 So I'm just making sure that I'm reaching out, being like, please come talk to me if you need help.

00:26:04.100 Like, let's go get coffee.

00:26:05.880 Let's go get out of town and go do something.

00:26:09.540 And it would be insane the amount that everyone is just like, I just need to get out and just have a mental break.

00:26:16.760 Like, and it's just so sad to see these young girls have to experience their freshman year of college, sophomore year of college, having to go through this or first year at this school and wanting to transfer and find somewhere happy and then have to go through this.

00:26:33.080 So it's like me just trying to be strong for them.

00:26:36.380 Exactly.

00:26:36.500 So you, did you ever, well, you must have had an interaction with Blair after you joined the lawsuit.

00:26:43.580 How did that go?

00:26:44.340 I mean, I sat down with him and I just thought it was the respectful thing to do is still being a teammate.

00:26:54.820 And I said, this is what I'm doing.

00:26:56.800 I'm joining this lawsuit.

00:26:58.720 I feel like in every bone in my body, this is the right thing to do.

00:27:02.780 I prayed about it.

00:27:03.500 I've thought about it.

00:27:04.240 It wasn't something I just thought about overnight.

00:27:06.460 And again, like what I kind of said to my coaches, I don't think you need, if this makes you mad, that's fine.

00:27:16.580 But on the court, I still deserve your respect and I don't expect anything to change on the court and vice versa.

00:27:23.360 And I said, this isn't about us.

00:27:26.380 This is about our team and not having a terrible season because we would need to do this for the team and be selfless just in the way the team has been selfless for you.

00:27:34.160 And then after that conversation, keep, keep going.

00:27:38.600 Yeah.

00:27:38.680 What did he say?

00:27:40.380 After that, basically he said, I need to think, I just need to think this is a lot.

00:27:45.540 And this is before any article came out.

00:27:48.160 And so after that left and really haven't talked to him since, unless we're in the gym for volleyball.

00:27:57.040 And then you just keep it about the sport or how do you manage that?

00:28:02.300 Yeah, we really don't speak unless it's about a set or a play or something to do with what's going on in practice or a game.

00:28:11.460 But meanwhile, other schools are rising up and refusing to play your team, which is also an act of courage and moral certitude.

00:28:25.940 I mean, you've had, I think, four teams now say we would rather forfeit than play a team with a male on it. 0.89

00:28:33.540 Is that the case?

00:28:35.240 That's 100 percent true.

00:28:37.120 And I mean, I commend them.

00:28:39.840 I think it's a it's so sad because you read things and see things and it's like, yes, we're losing the chance to play in a game.

00:28:48.720 But it's like it's so much more than that.

00:28:51.760 It's women finally feeling the courage to take a stand and say, you know what? 1.00

00:28:58.240 I don't agree with this.

00:28:59.540 I'm done.

00:29:00.360 I'm not playing against them.

00:29:01.720 And I think that's what's so amazing about the whole thing is people are finally getting the courage to stand up and say, no, this isn't right.

00:29:08.940 No matter what their school is telling them, no matter what the uppers are telling them, they're saying, no, this isn't OK.

00:29:15.960 And I think that's just an amazing thing in itself.

00:29:18.360 Like, yes, we're losing the opportunity to play, but for such a good reason.

00:29:21.620 I mean, so many people I've heard say it.

00:29:24.420 I've said it.

00:29:25.400 If I was on their team, I'd do the same exact thing.

00:29:28.000 And I commend them for this.

00:29:31.160 Yeah, but it's heroic.

00:29:33.120 It's downright heroic in today's day and age because no one's been doing it.

00:29:38.480 You know, we've had a couple of examples here.

00:29:40.620 We had the shot putters.

00:29:42.560 We've had a couple of runners and a couple of bikers. 0.78

00:29:45.120 But for the most part, I'd say over 90 percent of women placed in this terrible position suck it up, not because they're bad, but because they're tough. 1.00

00:29:53.740 They're athletes.

00:29:54.560 They want to play.

00:29:55.560 They they've been taught and the whole culture of sports is suck it up.

00:30:00.840 You know, you can handle anything.

00:30:02.540 But there's this other principle of morality, safety, fairness.

00:30:09.900 And this issue forces you to prioritize one over the other.

00:30:15.520 It forces you and sometimes you get to those impossible decisions in life and you must figure out the priorities in your moral compass.

00:30:24.420 I have been there in other ways.

00:30:26.300 So I appreciate the difficulty of this.

00:30:29.740 And no young woman should be placed in this position. 0.97

00:30:32.360 As you say, there are a lot of other things to be worrying about at this point.

00:30:36.680 Yeah.

00:30:36.880 And I mean, if you really like I don't think people understand how courageous it is that these women are finally taking a stand and saying no, they have worked their lives for these D1 scholarships, playing collegiate sports.

00:30:49.720 So there's so much on the line that potentially could happen for people deciding to take a stand and speak out.

00:30:57.400 And yet four teams have decided not to play against us.

00:31:01.280 And I just think that is so courageous of that entire team, because honestly, going through that whole process of not playing against us, they probably had no idea what could happen or what could come of that.

00:31:13.020 And yet they still did it.

00:31:14.580 And I think that's what's amazing, because, again, that's why not a lot of people are speaking out.

00:31:19.000 So many people are told just do your work, put your head down, work hard, do what you're told.

00:31:24.760 And I think that's why.

00:31:26.080 And also that there will be backlash thing. 0.98

00:31:28.480 Yeah, exactly.

00:31:29.120 Right. The other fear is not just suck it up because that's what we do.

00:31:32.600 But also, if you speak out, you will be targeted.

00:31:35.880 You will be called a bigot, a transphobe.

00:31:39.160 Employers won't want you.

00:31:40.800 I mean, that's what like Paula Scanlon, who was on the UPenn team with Leah Thomas, that's what they were threatened with.

00:31:49.360 They were told by UPenn, get therapy.

00:31:51.840 If you have an objection to it, you need therapy.

00:31:54.800 And you're not going to be hireable by others.

00:31:57.840 These were the allegations, at least, that the university tried to guilt them and that they just naturally had a fear, given the climate we're in, that they would be rendered unhirable.

00:32:05.860 So how have you and other girls you've talked to in this reconciled that threat, that possibility?

00:32:11.900 I mean, I think I know it helped me a lot to be able to talk with everyone that's in the lawsuit and icons and all the people involved in that, because they're the ones that really gave me the courage that I needed.

00:32:27.220 Because, again, I was just like everyone else.

00:32:29.320 I was like, okay, well, I only have three months of volleyball in my life left.

00:32:34.460 Am I going to lose my scholarship?

00:32:35.920 I don't come from a family that's just going to easily be like, okay, we'll just pay for your school.

00:32:39.980 It's fine.

00:32:40.900 That was my biggest fear, is just losing my scholarship.

00:32:43.380 And once I feel like they bring to light, they can't do anything to you for speaking your story and what you're going through.

00:32:53.280 And it's going against everything that our entire team and everyone else that is getting gaslit and pushed into thinking you can't speak, you can't stand up and say these things.

00:33:04.940 That's wrong.

00:33:05.560 That's not your thing to talk about.

00:33:08.060 And once you finally sit down with some rationalized people that actually know what they're talking about and they tell you that's all live there, that's all gaslighting.

00:33:17.140 They just want to be able to control you and tell you what to say.

00:33:20.540 And that's at the end of the day where I was like, okay, I'm done.

00:33:23.720 Like, they're not going to be able to gaslight me anymore.

00:33:28.280 I want to be able to be a person that can have this knowledge to spread to my team and be like, you can speak, you can do these things.

00:33:35.540 And they're lying to you.

00:33:37.480 And so I think that's what gave me the courage is just actually having the knowledge of what can and can't happen for speaking out and trying to stop this.

00:33:47.160 Because genuinely, they really can't do anything to you.

00:33:50.440 And I think, I mean, I'm a great example of that.

00:33:52.580 I've been speaking out.

00:33:53.700 I've been trying to make this come to light for people.

00:33:56.960 And they have done nothing.

00:34:00.280 And it goes against everything that they were saying beforehand.

00:34:03.720 You were elected as co-captain?

00:34:05.540 Yes.

00:34:06.920 All right.

00:34:08.980 So the girls on your team elected you to lead.

00:34:12.340 And that's exactly what you're doing.

00:34:13.680 They saw something in you that told them you could be that person, that you had that strength inside of you.

00:34:20.640 And now you're using it to change the lives, not just of these women, but of so many other women behind you, of my daughter, who's only 13, of my listeners' daughters, of the young women who listen to this program.

00:34:35.300 That's exactly what you're doing.

00:34:36.820 You're captain for us all, in a way, at the moment.

00:34:40.680 But it's come, I know, with some serious downsides.

00:34:45.580 I understand there was a game recently at which there was a heavy police presence and security presence.

00:34:52.960 And it was not to protect Blair.

00:34:56.300 It was because you were getting serious death threats.

00:35:00.880 And there was a threat that if you played the game, you might not live to see the end of it.

00:35:07.620 So tell us about that.

00:35:09.200 Yeah, so obviously there's been so much love for me joining this lawsuit.

00:35:17.420 But like you said, there's that group of people that just want to hate on it and they want you to stop.

00:35:24.200 And the night before that game, I've gotten a pretty serious threat to me physically.

00:35:31.920 And so they added so much security.

00:35:37.020 They added bag checks, metal detectors, which for a volleyball game at this level, usually not in postseason.

00:35:46.740 It's not a rivalry game.

00:35:48.100 It wasn't supposed to be anything crazy.

00:35:50.100 There's a few security guards, like normal here and there.

00:35:53.340 But they packed in the security guards just for that night because I was starting to get these death threats

00:35:59.920 and threats against me physically harming me and not just the hate of a person behind the commuter.

00:36:08.480 So I think for me, that was the first time it really sunk in that, like, I didn't feel safe.

00:36:16.040 And I think that's what's really scary.

00:36:18.420 And that was the first time that something like that had happened.

00:36:20.960 And I don't know, it just felt like I had, like, the first time reading the message, I just kind of had chills through my body.

00:36:29.200 I was like, this doesn't feel okay.

00:36:31.420 And especially being on a volleyball court, you're so out in the open.

00:36:33.700 I'm like, yes, you can add security to around the court.

00:36:37.460 But when you're on that court, you really are very vulnerable.

00:36:39.920 And I also have five other girls on the court with me and our whole bench that are out open and vulnerable.

00:36:47.440 So I think that was really scary for me is just knowing that, like, something that I decided to join could potentially hurt my teammates or me trying to just play the game that we love.

00:36:59.780 This is so crazy.

00:37:02.040 This is absolute madness that they're allowing this.

00:37:04.020 Is there any hope that the university will do the right thing, notwithstanding the lawsuit?

00:37:14.780 I mean, there's, if I'm being completely transparent, I don't trust what they're doing here.

00:37:22.660 I think from what I've heard, they fully support Blair being here.

00:37:27.660 And this whole time, we've seen it.

00:37:31.140 I mean, it goes to show Blair is still here.

00:37:34.020 And if they wanted to do something about it, they easily could have a long time ago.

00:37:37.840 And the fact that they brought a man here and it was hidden, it wasn't told to anyone.

00:37:46.600 Obviously, they knew they were doing something wrong and yet still decided to bring Blair here and support having a man on this team.

00:37:54.920 So at this rate, I don't see them doing anything to make a change for that.

00:38:00.540 Because, again, all they care about is taking care of Blair and what Blair needs. 0.95

00:38:05.600 And, yes, they ask us, how can we help you?

00:38:08.060 Are you okay?

00:38:08.760 But the only right answer to that question is, I would be perfectly fine if we weren't playing with a man.

00:38:17.160 I would feel safe if we weren't playing with a man.

00:38:19.980 There's nothing wrong with me being sad, anxious, stressed about having to deal with this situation.

00:38:26.800 And they keep asking us how they can fix this.

00:38:29.040 But if anyone stands up and says, oh, just kick Blair off the team, they immediately say that's not happening.

00:38:35.860 So, no, I don't think there's going to be any change from the school anytime soon or ever with this whole situation.

00:38:41.800 They must be forced to comply with Title IX and its protection of women as it was. 1.00

00:38:50.900 I mean, right now it's been challenged.

00:38:52.120 The changes that Joe Biden's tried to push through have been paused because of all the lawsuits by so many states saying this is unconstitutional.

00:39:01.900 You can't do this.

00:39:02.840 I mean, you're aware of how he's trying to redefine womenhood and allow men into women's sports with the stroke of his pen, I assume, since you've got a Title IX lawsuit that you've joined.

00:39:13.060 Do you have thoughts about presidential politics and what you want to see?

00:39:19.240 I mean, I don't genuinely think this whole situation has anything to do with politics.

00:39:25.600 I think it has the whole thing to do with men just should not be in women's sports. 0.51

00:39:30.980 It should be completely separate.

00:39:33.680 And it has nothing to do with who is president and who is going to get elected.

00:39:38.120 Well, it does a little because you've got Kamala Harris saying trans rights are human rights, period.

00:39:44.500 See, I think things could move along a lot faster if a specific someone was elected.

00:39:50.960 But it's just so crazy to me that people can sit there and obviously see the difference and still support it.

00:39:59.080 And that's just something that I can't understand because it's all these people that are trying to say facts about this to support it that just have no background information and facts and science to actually back it up.

00:40:17.000 Or they do and they just want to signal that they have virtue and they're a good person, unlike people who challenge it, who just don't understand how hard it is on the trans athlete without giving any consideration to what it's doing to the actual girls around him.

00:40:35.460 Can I just ask you, Brooke, where are you from?

00:40:38.620 Like, how did you get to be so strong?

00:40:40.340 You must come from a pretty strong, cool family.

00:40:44.120 I'm from Dallas, North Dallas, Texas.

00:40:47.600 Yeah.

00:40:49.040 Born and raised.

00:40:50.580 So and I will be going my daughter.

00:40:51.760 Where do you fall in the birth order?

00:40:54.240 I'm the youngest of two.

00:40:56.760 So I have an older sister.

00:40:59.220 Yeah.

00:40:59.520 Good.

00:40:59.880 Okay.

00:41:00.580 Well, your parents have done a lot right.

00:41:02.780 That's obvious.

00:41:04.120 And hats off to you and the whole family.

00:41:06.340 I'm totally rooting for you.

00:41:07.880 I pray and hope that you win this case for so many reasons.

00:41:12.880 And I really admire your courage.

00:41:15.080 Good luck out there.

00:41:16.520 Thank you.

00:41:18.840 Stay well.

00:41:20.460 Wow.

00:41:21.400 Great job, Brooke. 0.86

00:41:22.500 Thank you.

00:41:24.020 Wow.

00:41:25.200 Wow.

00:41:25.740 What an extraordinary young woman.

00:41:27.500 That's so cutsy.

00:41:29.160 Please remember her story when you hear these stories in the news.

00:41:33.240 That there are real people.

00:41:34.900 There are real young women who get affected by this stuff.

00:41:37.980 It's not just outraged anchors like me going off about the stuff on a podcast.

00:41:44.320 This is wrong what we're doing.

00:41:47.540 It's wrong.

00:41:49.300 It's truly evil.

00:41:51.520 And it has to stop.

00:41:53.220 Thank you guys for listening.

00:41:54.700 See you tomorrow.

00:41:55.100 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. 0.94

00:41:58.640 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

00:42:01.220 You're welcome.

00:42:02.700 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. 0.94

00:42:04.020 Bye I guess.

00:42:04.300 Bye.

00:42:04.480 I'll see you tomorrow.

00:42:04.940 Bye.

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00:42:06.280 Bye.

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The Megyn Kelly Show - October 13, 2024

First Person： Female College Athlete Speaks Out About and Sues NCAA Over Biological Male On Her Team ｜ Ep. 915

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