The Megyn Kelly Show - Glenn Beck on America in 2021, the Media, and COVID Lockdowns

00:00:00.520 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:00:12.020 Hey everyone, it's Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:15.280 Today on the program, we've got Glenn Beck, one of the best known and most talented media personalities in the world.

00:00:22.300 Now he's a media mogul too, having founded The Blaze, where he hosts The Glenn Beck Show.

00:00:27.420 We taped with Glenn a couple of days ago, discussing the fissures in this country right now, and his call for secession, though perhaps not exactly in the way you're thinking.

00:00:40.080 So we're going to get into it. Is that where we are? Is that the point at which we find ourselves?

00:00:44.520 Now that discussion was before the riots at the U.S. Capitol. So first, a word on that.

00:00:50.480 Those rioters breaching the Capitol building on Wednesday, who terrorized the lawmakers and the others inside, that was deeply disturbing.

00:00:59.440 They endangered themselves, they endangered our lawmakers, our elected leaders, not to mention the law enforcement officers who were there to protect the facility and all of those people inside.

00:01:09.240 As you know by now, a woman died trying to breach one of those doors after she was shot by a cop and at least three others were killed reportedly from health emergencies during the thing.

00:01:21.600 I was ashamed. I was ashamed. I was ashamed of those rioters, of their lawless behavior, and I was angered by it.

00:01:30.180 Each of those lawbreakers should be arrested, tried and punished to the fullest extent of the law.

00:01:36.120 And no right wing equivalent of Justin Timberlake, remember him during the BLM riots, should bail any of these people out of jail and give them an ethical pass.

00:01:46.140 Let's make them stand up for what they did and face the judgment of the legal system.

00:01:52.580 But let's be honest, the preening by the Democrats and the media the day of the riot and since about how ripe they'd been from the start, about Trump and his supporters all along was insufferable.

00:02:07.960 Media personalities who had no problem with the Black Lives Matter riots.

00:02:11.660 I speak not of the protests that were, in many instances, peaceful.

00:02:15.900 I speak of the riots we saw over the summer.

00:02:18.180 And those who had no problem with what happened in Seattle, the autonomous zone, suddenly grew a conscience about riots.

00:02:25.480 Suddenly they found them outrageous.

00:02:27.660 The same anchors who had zero care for the small business owners whose shops were burned or looted or for the cops who were shot dead,

00:02:36.060 trying to protect people during those lawless melees, suddenly found their outrage when it was Trump supporters breaching the people's house.

00:02:47.300 And by the way, these criminals did not represent the vast majority of Trump's 74 million supporters.

00:02:52.480 The same as the rioters over the summer don't represent the vast majority of people who would like to see us address racial inequities.

00:02:59.720 Well, the truth is, both events, both sets of riots were disturbing.

00:03:04.400 Those by the BLM activists and Antifa and this one.

00:03:08.300 Both sets of criminals were wrong and ought to be charged.

00:03:11.020 And the Johnny-come-lately's to the riots are bad narrative?

00:03:14.360 Better stick to it the next time said rioters are pushing a democratic cause.

00:03:19.300 Because the more of that you see and give a pass to, the more people get it in their heads that it's not so bad.

00:03:25.000 It's not such a bad idea or a big deal.

00:03:26.980 Well, the people who terrified lawmakers on Capitol Hill this week did serious harm to the American psyche.

00:03:35.080 We haven't seen something like that in this country since 1812.

00:03:38.080 And frankly, to the honest questions about voter fraud that large portions of the electorate still have, according to the polls.

00:03:47.640 Contrary to the media lecturing that now all such allegations, any talk of voter fraud absolutely must be abandoned forever,

00:03:54.400 or those raising them will have blood on their hands.

00:03:57.540 Not all of those questions actually have been addressed.

00:04:00.420 And not everyone is ready to say there's no there there.

00:04:03.220 And you know what? That's okay.

00:04:04.880 We can still have that discussion in a meaningful way.

00:04:08.180 Frankly, it should not be President Trump leading it.

00:04:11.960 The president's team was unable to produce the evidence needed to support their public claims of sweeping voter fraud.

00:04:17.220 That's a fact.

00:04:18.960 All right? That is a fact, I can tell you as a lawyer.

00:04:22.120 They were arguments, the ones on fraud, that Trump's team notably declined to make in court.

00:04:27.100 They wouldn't say it.

00:04:27.920 The lawyers wouldn't say it before the judges.

00:04:29.840 And that's because there are real ethical consequences to lawyers who mislead judges.

00:04:34.100 It's different from misleading reporters.

00:04:36.940 I have said from the beginning that the legal arguments being advanced by the president's team in no way appeared robust to me.

00:04:45.160 But enough proof was put forward in the limited time they were given that we we should be taking a hard look at how to improve this system going forward.

00:04:52.220 Why wouldn't we if for no other reason to restore some of the voters lost trust, which is considerable, again, according to the poll, something like 75 percent of the Republicans don't believe this was a fair election and a large portion of Democrats, too.

00:05:04.480 So I don't know.

00:05:10.020 More importantly, probably the most important point is that we need to take a hard look at how this erosion of trust in our systems was born, because it's not just it's it's writ large.

00:05:24.040 I mean, it's just it's across institutions now.

00:05:27.280 What why were so many Trump voters willing to believe the Kraken was coming despite weeks of them not being able to produce it?

00:05:35.340 You know, why why is QAnon getting so much support with their conspiracy theories?

00:05:40.880 Why why were so many people motivated by a seemingly unstable for the moment, at least, president to mob the Capitol at great risk to themselves and others for a cause that was utterly futile?

00:05:53.960 The woman who breached the door trying to get into I think it was the House chamber who was shot and killed was a service member.

00:06:01.040 She'd been in the armed forces.

00:06:02.520 It's a young woman.

00:06:04.560 She'd been convinced this was righteous.

00:06:06.920 How do we get to that point?

00:06:09.280 I mean, there's no there's no doubt that these folks were egged on by President Trump and his surrogates.

00:06:14.420 They were.

00:06:15.940 You can't deny it.

00:06:17.140 And there's no doubt that his core, core supporters that that sort of small but incredibly loyal group can really be moved by his words.

00:06:25.760 And I've been saying from the beginning, he has an extra responsibility, given this cult like relationship to use those words carefully, judiciously.

00:06:34.480 But he doesn't.

00:06:35.300 But the truth is that institutions and the trust in them is at an all time low.

00:06:42.620 Trust in the other party is near non existent in this country.

00:06:47.560 It's there's no trust.

00:06:48.680 There's hatred.

00:06:49.520 And trust in the media is entirely gone.

00:06:52.980 It's gone.

00:06:54.460 People no longer believe what the press tells them.

00:06:59.140 Never mind the other side.

00:07:00.120 And it's a real problem.

00:07:01.660 There are real consequences to the Democratic overreach on Russia, on Ukraine, and to treating every single little thing President Trump did from the moment he took office as a catastrophic outrage.

00:07:13.160 We are seeing the fruits of that right now.

00:07:18.360 There are also real problems to Trump's repeated lies, his untethered relationship with the truth.

00:07:25.440 So how do we begin to start clawing this back?

00:07:28.740 Is it even possible?

00:07:31.020 I don't I don't have all the answers.

00:07:34.000 But I know outside independent media is a good start.

00:07:37.380 I'm happy to be a part of that that medium.

00:07:39.500 Um, a boring president who dazzles no one but deals in facts.

00:07:45.960 That'd be good, too.

00:07:47.880 Are we actually getting that with Joe Biden?

00:07:49.600 I don't know.

00:07:50.340 Maybe.

00:07:51.360 But based on his comments about Hunter Biden, his dodges and so on, and the help he's gotten from Twitter and Facebook, etc., I'm not so sure.

00:07:58.200 I'm not so sure we're about to get that.

00:08:00.580 Open minded, but unsure.

00:08:03.740 The bottom line right now is that Americans need to fend for themselves when it comes to information and what is real.

00:08:09.900 It wasn't always thus.

00:08:11.520 It isn't right.

00:08:12.500 It shouldn't be this way.

00:08:13.840 But it is.

00:08:15.940 Partisan news anchors should be abandoned.

00:08:20.420 Decide for yourself who you can trust for unbiased information.

00:08:25.440 You can make up your mind on how to spin it, what you want to do with it, whether you think it's persuasive for your side of the others.

00:08:30.660 Fact is knowable and important.

00:08:32.720 I actually believe there's still a market for it.

00:08:37.120 And frankly, I think the early success of this show helps prove that.

00:08:40.580 For our part, we're going to promise to continue bringing you the facts without spin.

00:08:47.740 When I'm giving an opinion, I'll identify it as such so you know it's opinion.

00:08:51.800 It's how I feel.

00:08:53.340 It's not what the facts are.

00:08:55.220 But as I have my entire career, I will deal in facts as I did as a lawyer and as a reporter and now as a host of this show.

00:09:01.860 We'll bring it to you without spin and as we say every day at the end of the show, without fear.

00:09:09.300 And we will try very hard to be a part of the solution.

00:09:17.220 We'll get to Glenn Beck in just one second.

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00:10:50.000 And now to the man who is in the Radio Hall of Fame and the host of the Glenn Beck program on Blaze TV.

00:10:59.940 Glenn Beck, great to have you.

00:11:01.680 How are you?

00:11:02.140 And happy new year.

00:11:03.140 Happy new year to you, too, Megan.

00:11:04.920 Thank you.

00:11:05.760 It's great to talk to you, as always.

00:11:07.300 I love our conversations and always have.

00:11:10.280 Always have.

00:11:10.740 And I think you're a good person to have at the beginning of the new year because you've always had a great predictive ability.

00:11:16.540 You've been underestimated and under-celebrated for your ability to predict the future.

00:11:22.100 Oh, yeah.

00:11:22.560 All you really have to do, though, to predict the future is just take people who say they want to destroy you at their word.

00:11:29.460 And then you're like, yep, they did it.

00:11:33.160 As it turns out.

00:11:34.380 As it turns out, they meant that.

00:11:36.320 The Democrats have won both of these Georgia Senate races.

00:11:40.480 What does that mean for America?

00:11:41.920 A different America.

00:11:44.700 You know, again, I take people at their word.

00:11:48.760 And when they say they want to transform something, they mean it.

00:11:53.320 And every indication is they look at a very different America that doesn't really reflect our founders, our founding principles, or our Constitution.

00:12:05.540 And I think the radicals are in charge, and I think they mean everything they say.

00:12:14.140 And if the Democrats do win, I think you're looking at the end of America as we know it.

00:12:23.080 And if not, you're looking at a split nation and possibly a civil war.

00:12:34.360 Okay, let's talk about that.

00:12:35.840 I don't think you're wrong.

00:12:38.380 I don't think you're wrong.

00:12:39.600 I mean, I'm really concerned about where we're going and how divided we are.

00:12:44.700 I understand the division.

00:12:45.760 I actually, I don't want to say I support the division, but I don't support submission to the crazy demands being made right now.

00:12:54.680 Right?

00:12:55.240 So it's like, what choice do we have?

00:12:57.600 Well, you know, I said on the air this week that I am coming out for secession.

00:13:04.280 But not our secession, because I still believe in the Constitution.

00:13:09.040 I believe in all of the amendments and the Bill of Rights.

00:13:13.300 If you don't believe in capitalism, the free market, the Bill of Rights, the Constitution, the rule of law, then you should secede.

00:13:24.060 And I'm fine with that.

00:13:25.540 I really am.

00:13:26.700 If you want to live a different way, that's fine.

00:13:29.040 But this Marxism and this total transformation of what we have always been, no thank you.

00:13:37.180 And I have the documents on my side.

00:13:40.360 So I'm not seceding.

00:13:42.180 You are.

00:13:43.260 You're not wrong that they want the far left, the AOCs of the world, want a total reformation of America as it was intended to be and as it has been for the better part of 244 years.

00:13:55.240 She wants to remake the entire experiment.

00:13:57.140 And there are a lot of people on her side who feel the same.

00:14:01.240 And with Joe Biden, I realize Joe Biden's not the same as AOC, but that wing of his party is growing and they're powerful.

00:14:08.160 And they've taken over so many cultural institutions, Glenn.

00:14:11.340 I really worry about where we'll be four years from now.

00:14:15.060 I don't think we're, gosh, I hate saying this, Megan, but I just don't think we are in a safe place.

00:14:27.620 I don't think the world is.

00:14:29.320 You know, as we were battling COVID, China marched across the Hong Kong border and we've lost Hong Kong because we didn't pay attention.

00:14:38.460 Imagine an America that is so divided, that is in civil war or just is is so crippled on the inside.

00:14:48.680 The world changes four years from now.

00:14:51.680 We're living in a very different world.

00:14:54.080 And obsessed with navel gazing on issues like our lady parts or our skin color or I mean, it's like so there are real things happening in the world that need our attention.

00:15:07.060 And yet we're obsessed with with things that we cannot control, that we were reducing to afterthoughts in a very positive way.

00:15:17.060 And we've now decided to prioritize them over things, as you point out, like the loss of Hong Kong or what China is doing to the Uyghurs, you know, an actual genocide happening in the world that we once might have stood up to.

00:15:27.000 Even though Trump's done amazing things on China that no other president would have done, we seem to have lost our appetite for attention to those things instead to focus on the extremely myopic and ultimately meaningless issues like gender.

00:15:43.960 I don't think the average American is there.

00:15:46.100 I really don't.

00:15:47.360 Now, maybe I'm naive because look what's happened to us.

00:15:51.660 But I really, truly believe all of this stuff is coming because Facebook manipulation, Google manipulation.

00:16:00.480 I mean, Black Lives Matter didn't trend organically.

00:16:04.240 I don't know if you know that.

00:16:05.700 But Facebook started getting heat when Black Lives Matter was really taking the summer and taking things by storm.

00:16:13.680 They changed the algorithm and made Black Lives Matter trend.

00:16:20.560 So when it trends, but it wasn't really trending, what's the truth?

00:16:26.760 Were people really behind that?

00:16:29.100 Or were people convinced to get behind that because of a bogus algorithm?

00:16:34.260 What is the truth?

00:16:36.800 I don't know.

00:16:37.580 But I just and maybe it's just the the optimist that is always screaming to get out that allows me to believe still that that's not who America is.

00:16:50.680 They're just we've just put up with it.

00:16:53.240 You know, there was a there was a piece in City Journal recently that was entitled A Wokeism is Silencing America.

00:17:00.640 And the author was talking about how self-censorship is soaring, that Democrats and Republicans, both you would expect Republicans,

00:17:08.420 but also Democrats, both worry about speaking their minds to the tune of about 40 percent of each party.

00:17:14.560 They don't want to say how they really feel because they're scared, right?

00:17:17.440 They're going to get canceled.

00:17:18.440 They're going to be judged.

00:17:19.520 They're going to be demonized, called awful names.

00:17:21.160 And the author's point was basically when honesty is out of fashion, we're at a dangerous point, because if you won't speak up against policies or groups or movements that you can see the fundamental risks of, then they become more powerful.

00:17:34.860 Then more people throw their hats in that that basket because they think they have to and their power grows.

00:17:40.660 And that is something that we've seen happen with Black Lives Matter, a group that has really troubling leanings.

00:17:45.540 And I wonder about I wanted to ask you about them in particular, because I know at some point, I think it was 16, you came out and said, I support Black Lives Matter.

00:17:51.820 I get it.

00:17:52.580 And you'd interviewed some folks who supported it.

00:17:54.780 I wonder now how you feel about the group today.

00:17:58.020 Oh, no, I didn't.

00:17:58.720 I was very careful when I went how I worded that.

00:18:02.060 I support some of the people who were marching with Black Lives Matter here in Dallas because they had a they had a point.

00:18:11.120 Their community is in trouble and no one is listening and no one is doing anything to help.

00:18:17.820 They're using all of these political offices and everything else.

00:18:22.260 They're using the black community.

00:18:24.820 And so when I said I I agree with those people who are marching with Black Lives Matter, some of them, because I spoke to them, they themselves said, we don't agree with the main organization.

00:18:38.020 We don't believe in the destruction of the nuclear family.

00:18:41.820 We don't believe in any of that stuff.

00:18:43.640 But nobody is speaking for us.

00:18:45.760 And so that that was the real problem was if you look at Black Lives Matter, there's there's two.

00:18:53.020 There's the real Black Lives Matter.

00:18:55.080 And then there's this this this, I guess, hope of what it should be by a lot of the people who claim to support Black Lives Matter.

00:19:07.100 And they just they yes, of course, Black Lives Matter.

00:19:09.980 And yes, the community is under assault.

00:19:12.340 And yes, there's problems.

00:19:13.800 But that's not the same thing.

00:19:15.980 And it is it is a truly frightening development in our society that something as toxic, as dangerous and as deadly as the real mission behind the organization Black Lives Matter can just be swept in.

00:19:37.260 And nobody questions it.

00:19:39.440 And nobody in the media is willing to actually stand and say, wait, wait, let's separate this.

00:19:47.500 Who's going to get hurt when the police get defunded in the inner cities?

00:19:51.440 Not Glenn Beck, not Megyn Kelly.

00:19:53.320 We'll be fine.

00:19:54.100 You know, we live in these privileged communities and these doorman buildings.

00:19:57.440 It's women and children in the inner city.

00:19:59.740 It at best is completely irresponsible, especially now.

00:20:05.320 You've seen the local Black Lives Matter saying we didn't get any of that money.

00:20:10.040 Where is that money?

00:20:11.400 Right.

00:20:11.880 Millions of dollars went to the Black Lives Matter Global Inc.

00:20:18.580 That is a terrifying thing.

00:20:20.520 And I got news for you.

00:20:21.820 They're not black people up at the top of that organization.

00:20:23.880 These are not people who are looking at the plight because they've lived through the plight.

00:20:31.460 All right.

00:20:32.020 Let's go back to secession because that's a headline.

00:20:35.480 What does it mean?

00:20:36.560 I mean, honestly, I've heard it talked about more and more.

00:20:39.420 I mean, what I'm not suggesting the United States is actually in a position where that's

00:20:43.400 going to happen, but it's sort of happening ideologically, even if not in fact.

00:20:49.580 Right.

00:20:49.740 So what does that look like before our states actually secede from the union and we get into

00:20:54.900 another potential civil war?

00:20:57.180 What's actually happening right now?

00:20:58.980 How could this happen in sort of theory as opposed to in fact?

00:21:04.160 First of all, there's several levels of secession.

00:21:08.840 And I think the left has already done it in some regard with sanctuary cities.

00:21:12.820 Um, and I think there should be states that say we are abiding by the constitution and the

00:21:23.260 bill of rights.

00:21:24.520 And if you want to pass whatever you want to pass in Washington, DC, if it goes against

00:21:30.720 the constitution or the bill of rights, we're not enforcing it.

00:21:34.720 Um, that's one level of, of secession.

00:21:37.960 Uh, and I think states like Texas would do that.

00:21:41.900 You pass something against the second amendment.

00:21:44.140 I don't think Texas is going to enforce it.

00:21:46.760 Um, and so you have that.

00:21:49.220 I personally think the, the, the talk of secession, um, has always been dangerous, uh, and flippant,

00:21:59.460 um, because you just don't want to break this thing up.

00:22:03.360 I mean, we don't realize what we have until it's gone.

00:22:07.540 Um, however, I think what one of the legislators here in Texas is trying to do where he is,

00:22:15.440 he is calling for a bill on secession.

00:22:18.300 And I thought it was a little irresponsible until I talked to him and he said, we're not

00:22:23.060 talking about breaking up.

00:22:24.720 This is not a vote to say we're getting out of the union.

00:22:27.140 This is a vote on, should we even talk about it?

00:22:31.740 And should we bring that up at the federal level?

00:22:35.000 So at least someone takes us seriously.

00:22:38.860 There's a problem in our country.

00:22:41.460 And until somebody finally says, you know, I've had enough and I don't want to leave,

00:22:47.660 but you guys are doing crazy things.

00:22:50.160 Now, can we sit down at the table and talk?

00:22:51.920 Cause again, we don't want to leave.

00:22:53.620 I think that's, I think that's a reasonable thing to say.

00:22:58.220 I feel like it's to some extent it's already happening.

00:23:02.180 I mean, when you see the total elimination of any first amendment rights on college campuses

00:23:06.920 and more and more in all of academia, and now it's spreading to corporate America and

00:23:11.700 sports and so on, right?

00:23:12.640 You can't have your own opinion.

00:23:14.460 Your opinion must be what they tell you it is.

00:23:17.100 Um, you're already seeing a rejection of fundamental constitutional rights for millions

00:23:22.900 of Americans.

00:23:23.980 And then you couple that with something like the green new deal, which by the way, our

00:23:29.100 vice president elect Kamala Harris co-sponsored.

00:23:32.220 She loves it.

00:23:33.020 Um, where they're, they're talking about, um, just paying people who just don't want to

00:23:37.420 work.

00:23:37.880 Let's just give them, give them a monthly income.

00:23:39.700 Who, who pays for that?

00:23:40.720 I know you're a big Ayn Rand reader who, what, what happens to the country when we have the

00:23:45.220 workers and the non-workers, you know, the ones who make and the ones who take like

00:23:49.040 already, we're separating in real fundamental ways.

00:23:52.840 It's happening.

00:23:54.580 You know, it's, what's interesting is we're having the same argument we had in the 1850s.

00:24:00.520 Um, uh, in the 1850s, they had, there was a, you know, basic theory that is this 1619

00:24:09.880 project, uh, that we started in Jamestown and that there was nothing but death and destruction

00:24:16.700 there and slavery and everything else.

00:24:19.660 That was part of America believed that another part of America believed, no, no, no.

00:24:26.660 It was the pilgrims that really set the table.

00:24:29.720 They were the ones that, uh, our founders grew out of.

00:24:33.940 And all of the ideas of America came from, uh, from, uh, Bradford and the, and the pilgrims.

00:24:43.560 Well, during the war, I think of 1812 or the revolution, um, governor Bradford's diaries,

00:24:50.800 uh, were lost and we didn't know where they were.

00:24:54.220 So we couldn't really have this argument.

00:24:55.900 And around the 1850s, they found those diaries in an old church and England copied them for

00:25:04.060 us and sent them over.

00:25:05.520 And it, it changed the debate, uh, in America from, oh, wait a minute.

00:25:12.600 We're not a nation of slave owners.

00:25:16.140 We didn't come over here to do that.

00:25:18.060 We came over here to do something glorious and good for all mankind.

00:25:22.200 We're not having that conversation.

00:25:25.060 And it's why the 1619 project is so poisonous, um, because it destroys the belief who can defend

00:25:33.520 Jamestown.

00:25:34.500 You can't.

00:25:35.800 Well, I mean, these people who have been, you know, pushing for getting rid of the American

00:25:41.040 experiment and so on, they, they don't have any pride in our country's history.

00:25:45.440 They think it's an awful place.

00:25:46.680 They, they believe what the 1619 project suggests, which is we were founded in evil and we remain

00:25:51.780 evil, not just on a racial level, but on, on many levels of capitalism, just being one

00:25:56.540 of them.

00:25:56.800 And it is the most dangerous and the most racist, anti-human kind of statements, anti-God.

00:26:06.820 I mean, it's, it's wrong on so many levels to believe that you're racist, you'll always

00:26:13.800 be racist and you're racist because you're an American or you're a racist because you're

00:26:17.640 white or you're a racist because whatever reason it is so damaging and so enslaving that

00:26:25.080 there is no other word for it, at least that I can find other than evil.

00:26:29.720 It is evil.

00:26:30.780 What is being taught to people right now, America and, and God, the, the Judeo-Christian value

00:26:38.600 is that yes, you make mistakes, but you get back up and you try harder.

00:26:44.660 The, the line in our constitution is so critical, a more perfect union, not a perfect union.

00:26:52.680 It requires us every day to strive to make it a more perfect union.

00:26:58.620 And now we've just, we're surrounded by people who say it was never good.

00:27:03.540 Nobody involved was good.

00:27:05.560 And, and you're left desolate and, and hopeless.

00:27:10.520 One of my favorite people in history is, uh, Churchill.

00:27:14.600 I just love him, love him for so many reasons.

00:27:19.280 His humor, his, his stick-to-itiveness, uh, his intuitive, uh, nature, just love this guy.

00:27:27.260 I've read so much on Churchill from the Western point of view.

00:27:31.420 Now go read a, uh, autobiography of, uh, or a biography of Churchill from the Indian perspective.

00:27:40.580 This guy's a monster.

00:27:42.340 He's a monster.

00:27:43.960 And if you, if you only look at that side of him, he is a monster.

00:27:48.760 If you only look at the side of him from the Western point of view, he's a great guy.

00:27:53.440 So you're left with, what is he?

00:27:56.280 In today's society, we want to just say, he's a monster.

00:28:00.520 No, life is about a trajectory.

00:28:05.000 Every single one of us have a monster inside.

00:28:09.160 And it is our, it is our goal in life, our meaning of life to balance that and to keep

00:28:15.800 that at bay and to, and to encourage and grow the best parts of yourself.

00:28:21.260 Learn from the monster inside, learn from the mistakes that you've made.

00:28:25.160 And when you look at Churchill, by the end of his life, he was like, yeah, I, I really

00:28:29.500 made a lot of mistakes, uh, in, in India.

00:28:33.160 He was at least growing there and getting better.

00:28:36.380 If you just say once a monster, always a monster, there's nothing, there's nothing to live for.

00:28:43.980 No, there's no room for grace.

00:28:46.460 None.

00:28:46.840 We were, I was talking about this with Daniel Cameron about how Ronald Reagan made some very

00:28:51.200 openly racist remarks about African-Americans, but he also defeated communism.

00:28:56.520 I mean, he defeated the Soviet Union and, and, and stood against, you know, the, the iron

00:29:00.980 block.

00:29:01.340 Okay.

00:29:01.560 So, so you, you have to judge and Martin Luther King, that's another one that the guy who

00:29:06.060 wrote the Pulitzer printing, uh, Pulitzer prize winning biography on, on Martin Luther King had

00:29:11.040 access to the FBI files and reports that this guy stood by idly while a woman in his, in

00:29:16.660 his, uh, parish got raped and had no problem with it.

00:29:19.860 And it was like in the room or in the next room.

00:29:22.040 Yes.

00:29:22.320 I mean, does that, do we wipe out his entire legacy and all the good he did because of

00:29:27.000 that?

00:29:27.120 It's not that anybody supports that action or Reagan's comments on blacks or Churchill

00:29:31.920 and Indians.

00:29:32.880 No, no one supports that stuff, but you have to judge the full measure of a man or a woman

00:29:36.740 and their life trajectory, as you point out.

00:29:39.480 So let me ask you this.

00:29:41.560 Um, I don't know if you saw the movie life of David Copperfield or, uh, just came out.

00:29:47.380 Um, there's another one that I just saw the, uh, ad for on Netflix.

00:29:52.980 It's a new series on Netflix and it takes place in the time of David Copperfield, but all of

00:29:58.700 the characters are, they're not all white.

00:30:01.600 Uh, David Copperfield, I think is, uh, Indian, uh, one of his parents is white, uh, somebody

00:30:09.420 else is black and it's, it's truly colorblind, uh, show.

00:30:15.180 And I watched it and I wondered, okay, the next generation, how do they understand where

00:30:24.320 we were?

00:30:25.540 How do they understand what we've accomplished?

00:30:29.340 What we have changed?

00:30:32.580 You know, it's one thing to say, I don't like that.

00:30:34.440 Everybody is white, you know, and the queen is, is white.

00:30:37.760 Well, she was white at that time.

00:30:40.160 And that's something we can learn from and we can grow with.

00:30:44.060 But if, if you change history to make it something that it never was, there, where's, how do you

00:30:52.160 learn?

00:30:52.860 How do you grow?

00:30:53.940 You just come out of the womb thinking, nailed it.

00:30:57.200 We got it.

00:30:57.900 And we've always been here.

00:30:59.780 More with Glenn in just one second.

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00:32:21.800 My problem, Glenn, with what's happening right now, and I'm just feeling it acutely right

00:32:25.960 now, is what's happening today is the erosion of freedoms around every corner.

00:32:31.420 You know, it's like you can't say what you want to say.

00:32:34.240 You can't think the way you want to think.

00:32:36.400 You go to the university, you have to submit to the way they are.

00:32:39.580 Your corporation now, same thing.

00:32:41.800 Your taxes, right, they're going to skyrocket under this administration pretty much at most

00:32:46.420 levels.

00:32:46.940 So your money's not your own.

00:32:48.460 Your gun is not necessarily your own, right?

00:32:50.800 Like who knows what's going to happen with so-called assault weapons.

00:32:54.400 It's just around every corner we're being told how we must act, how we must be, what we can

00:32:59.620 and cannot have.

00:33:00.680 And the biggest example we've been experiencing of this is the COVID crackdowns, right?

00:33:05.740 I mean, you will wear a mask.

00:33:07.860 You'll wear a mask even after we have near perfect herd immunity because we're not exactly

00:33:14.000 sure what it's, whether it's just suppressing the symptoms or suppressing the disease.

00:33:17.300 And you will socially distance or you and you will put on the hand sanitizer or you won't

00:33:21.180 walk into this store.

00:33:22.040 And it just seems like the big government thumb is coming down on our heads at every turn.

00:33:28.460 When America doesn't go bananas, when Fauci says, yes, we are going to need some sort of

00:33:37.680 a passport that would say that you've gotten the vaccine and that way you can work, you

00:33:44.760 can go to entertainment, you can go to sports venues, you can use public transportation.

00:33:52.040 Are you kidding me?

00:33:54.300 Wait a minute.

00:33:56.440 You you you're creating a papers, please, kind of society.

00:34:02.300 And America is they just yawn.

00:34:05.780 I, I, I, I, I mean, we deserve everything that we're going to get.

00:34:11.600 And Fauci, Fauci is a liar.

00:34:15.060 Let's be honest.

00:34:16.180 He's admitted his lies now.

00:34:18.680 He has admitted that he misled us.

00:34:20.960 He misled us on the numbers needed to achieve herd immunity based on polls.

00:34:24.760 Well, who, who told Dr.

00:34:26.420 Fauci he should be reading the polls in order to inform us of what good public policy is,

00:34:31.800 right?

00:34:31.960 He's putting his thumb in the air.

00:34:33.320 This is the progressive way.

00:34:35.700 They believe they know better.

00:34:38.260 And that's the real problem.

00:34:40.080 They're treating us like children.

00:34:42.300 And I'm sorry, Americans should not stand for that.

00:34:47.340 But he did it all for the right reasons.

00:34:50.580 He just he was looking at the polls that he knew America wouldn't be ready for those truths.

00:34:56.460 And so he lied.

00:34:58.100 But yes, yes, bad lie.

00:35:00.520 But there this is a good lie because it helped us get to a better place.

00:35:05.700 Who the hell do you think you are?

00:35:09.700 You you are not the one to decide what I should know and what I shouldn't know.

00:35:16.200 But that is apparently everything that the left and the Democrats stand for now.

00:35:22.260 They will decide what's true, what's not true, what you can hear, what you can read.

00:35:29.260 It we are burning books every day.

00:35:33.180 It's just digital.

00:35:34.380 That's exactly right.

00:35:35.660 And just look what they did to those Great Barrington Declaration doctors.

00:35:39.480 These are really well-respected doctors who they dismissed and attacked in the same way

00:35:44.980 they did Scott Atlas, who have basically said, look, these prolonged lockdowns are not necessary.

00:35:52.560 They're causing catastrophic harm, especially to young people, to the working classes, to the poor,

00:35:59.020 who are dying at much higher rates at younger ages because of the lockdowns, right?

00:36:03.060 Not getting screened with respect to heart disease or cancer.

00:36:07.280 And their their mortality rates are going up versus, you know, even though they have

00:36:13.660 almost no covid deaths, you know, in the younger age.

00:36:16.400 No, no one will listen to them because they're not saying the right thing.

00:36:19.840 And can I let me tell you something?

00:36:21.680 I haven't even told my own audience and I won't get into the details.

00:36:30.680 Midnight, about a month ago.

00:36:33.680 My phone is ringing and my wife picks it up and we're both dead asleep and she sits right up in bed

00:36:43.700 and it is a teacher.

00:36:47.480 And at midnight and then the doorbell rings and my wife said, what is going on?

00:36:53.980 And my wife said, you got to go to the door.

00:36:55.620 It's probably the police.

00:36:56.600 Probably the police.

00:36:58.560 What is happening?

00:37:00.200 I blurrily stumble out into our foyer and I open up the door and it's the police.

00:37:08.460 And they asked for one of my children by name.

00:37:11.880 And I said, excuse me.

00:37:14.620 They said, sir, we got a call from a teacher.

00:37:19.240 Uh, one of my children was, um, suicidal.

00:37:26.200 Let's leave it at that.

00:37:27.720 Are you, do you have any concept of what not sending teenagers to school is doing to them?

00:37:42.580 They haven't seen their friends going on a year.

00:37:47.440 They haven't seen their friends.

00:37:50.140 They haven't been able to socialize.

00:37:52.360 They have been locked in their house and isolated for anyone to tell me what I need to do with my family.

00:38:03.100 Go to hell.

00:38:05.300 Go to hell.

00:38:06.880 I have seen it firsthand.

00:38:09.240 What happens to children?

00:38:11.020 They are destroying our children.

00:38:13.340 Can you even imagine being 15, 16, 17 years old?

00:38:18.140 Do you remember what that was like those years?

00:38:20.620 How important those years were?

00:38:22.600 And a year of it gone, just gone.

00:38:26.240 And you're locked in your house.

00:38:28.380 How dare you?

00:38:30.340 How dare you do this to my business?

00:38:33.060 How dare you tell me that I can't make money?

00:38:36.680 I can't feed my family.

00:38:38.880 You owe me.

00:38:40.520 The federal government, you took my livelihood, my business.

00:38:44.900 You destroyed it.

00:38:46.800 You knew you would destroy it.

00:38:48.820 And you did nothing.

00:38:50.880 And you fined me.

00:38:52.600 You called me a criminal.

00:38:54.420 You called me a bad guy that didn't care because I didn't want to lose everything.

00:38:59.560 And then on top of it, you do this to my children.

00:39:04.100 Oh, my gosh, Megan.

00:39:06.100 I don't know how we haven't seen a full-on revolution or the absolute wrath of God because

00:39:19.820 we are participating in the destruction of lives.

00:39:24.740 I don't know how it hasn't happened.

00:39:26.520 I'm very sorry to hear that, Glenn.

00:39:30.460 I hope she's okay.

00:39:31.920 You know, I'm very lucky in some regards.

00:39:37.720 I am, you know, my mother committed suicide.

00:39:43.520 I've had another suicide in my family.

00:39:46.340 And so we're all very, very well aware.

00:39:49.360 Um, this one, uh, was a shock, just a total shock, but I'm blessed to have great children

00:40:00.940 and an unbelievable life.

00:40:02.580 And, you know, we are all together and, uh, we've, we've just had about a month of really,

00:40:11.180 um, good things with each other.

00:40:14.840 You know, in the holidays too, we speak between the holidays and the COVID lockdowns and the

00:40:21.020 isolation, it affects a lot of people.

00:40:24.000 You know, she's not alone in that, in that depression and that hopelessness.

00:40:28.120 You know, first of all, thank you for sharing that because I guarantee you're not the only

00:40:32.260 one in this conversation we're having right now there with our listeners.

00:40:35.220 I know it.

00:40:35.960 I know it.

00:40:37.380 I, I can't tell you.

00:40:39.120 I can't tell you.

00:40:40.120 I, two weeks before that, um, one of my best friends calls me and says, Hey, can't get together.

00:40:47.780 Uh, we're at the hospital.

00:40:49.980 Uh, our child is in a psychiatric unit, tried to kill himself.

00:40:54.560 And, uh, hello, this is happening everywhere, everywhere, and no one is even recognizing it.

00:41:05.980 What is the impact of this globally?

00:41:09.800 To your point that we did what was necessary.

00:41:14.320 We did the two weeks to bend the curve.

00:41:16.260 The country did shut down and suffered mightily for it in ways that you've identified, identified.

00:41:21.140 And now it's never ending, even with the vaccine here, they're not rolling it out with the speed

00:41:28.000 that we would like, but they're not even prioritizing it in the way that makes sense.

00:41:31.440 Like the great Barrington doctors have been saying, look, 50 million people in the United

00:41:35.800 States are over 65.

00:41:37.360 There is the number of vaccine doses that are available over the next two months will be

00:41:41.300 enough to vaccinate every elderly person who wants it, every healthcare worker and other

00:41:46.260 vulnerable people who want it.

00:41:48.380 And at that point, these lockdowns, they say, should end immediately and forever because

00:41:54.580 they're killing people.

00:41:57.240 The lockdowns are killing people, not just in America, but worldwide.

00:42:01.700 But they are, they won't do it.

00:42:03.640 They're, they're still saying no.

00:42:05.460 I am convinced it's not about this.

00:42:08.280 It's about the great reset.

00:42:10.220 Look, people, people say, uh, everybody's got to get vaccinated.

00:42:14.860 No, no, they don't.

00:42:17.960 Uh, I'm what?

00:42:19.800 56, uh, this year and fat out of shape, dumpy.

00:42:25.880 I mean, McDonald's is the place for me.

00:42:29.980 Uh, and I got COVID over the holiday and it knocked me for a loop.

00:42:35.620 I still, uh, you know, it was out yesterday working on the house and I was so breathless

00:42:41.640 two weeks, two and a half weeks later, uh, and it can knock you for a loop.

00:42:47.900 However, that's because I'm fat and dumpy.

00:42:51.040 If I were in shape, I wouldn't have that problem.

00:42:53.620 It wouldn't have been anything.

00:42:54.700 My family had it over the summer.

00:42:56.600 I was taking hydroxychloroquine, which yes, does work.

00:43:00.320 Uh, and so I didn't get it over the summer, but every single member of my family did.

00:43:04.460 And it was no big deal at all for them.

00:43:07.800 My grandparents, my parents, yes, they should take it.

00:43:12.540 If you have underlying health problems, yes, you should consider taking it.

00:43:17.500 We're putting together something that we've never, ever done before.

00:43:23.060 And you're going to insist that my children get it?

00:43:27.160 And just to remind people what the stats are, at least 99.95% of people under 70 survive COVID.

00:43:35.360 Okay.

00:43:35.580 So at least 99.95% of people under 70 survive.

00:43:39.980 But now they're talking about possible mandatory vaccinations of children

00:43:43.460 on whom the vaccine has not even been tested, Glenn.

00:43:47.440 No, no, I, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

00:43:52.500 And now they're saying that I need papers to prove that I, excuse me, what, I mean, this

00:43:59.400 is not the bubonic plague.

00:44:02.100 This is, this is a little stronger than the flu.

00:44:07.300 And I don't think we need another flu, but this will be with us now, like the flu of 1918.

00:44:14.320 That's the flu we have to get a shot for every year.

00:44:17.200 And you know what?

00:44:18.520 Millions of people who are old or infirm, they do get the flu shot, but it is their choice.

00:44:26.580 You are not going to rush a vaccine through and then make it mandatory that my children

00:44:33.800 who have no chance of really getting sick.

00:44:37.300 That's right.

00:44:38.460 That they have to take this?

00:44:40.120 Uh-uh.

00:44:40.620 No.

00:44:41.580 Can I tell you?

00:44:42.100 So I, I am in no way an anti-vaxxer.

00:44:44.840 I'm a pro-vaxxer.

00:44:45.740 I had all three of my children vaccinated exactly on schedule, as my doctor told me

00:44:50.080 to, despite some people trying to scare me out of doing it.

00:44:52.960 I did it.

00:44:53.380 They were fine.

00:44:54.000 Thank God.

00:44:55.280 And I will take the COVID vaccine and I, I'm not afraid to do that.

00:44:58.540 And I will absolutely encourage my mother to do it too.

00:45:00.620 But there is zero chance I'm having my children take it.

00:45:03.340 Zero.

00:45:03.620 Before it's been tested on other children.

00:45:05.840 And when the risk to children is minuscule, there's minuscule.

00:45:09.940 So my kids have to be the guinea pigs for somebody else so that an elderly teacher can't

00:45:15.760 get it.

00:45:16.040 Well, that elderly teacher should get the vaccine.

00:45:18.060 I don't have to vaccinate my kid to protect the elderly teacher who is free to get the

00:45:22.000 vaccine if he or she wants to.

00:45:23.460 And it is, it is ridiculous that we close down the schools.

00:45:27.660 We tell everybody to go away for the elderly teacher.

00:45:31.320 We can afford to pay the elderly teacher to stay home.

00:45:35.740 If it's for a year, it's for a year.

00:45:38.020 We get it.

00:45:39.340 Why are we having to dismantle our entire lives for the people that we should be protecting?

00:45:47.680 You take them out of society and you say, you need to stay over here.

00:45:52.220 It's your choice.

00:45:53.480 You could go back in, but you're probably going to get it.

00:45:55.740 Or you can take the vaccine, but stay over here.

00:45:58.700 The rest of society is being made to pay for this.

00:46:02.500 For what reason?

00:46:04.120 Right.

00:46:04.820 Right.

00:46:05.100 As you point out, this is not the plague.

00:46:07.320 The people are treating it like you get it and you die.

00:46:10.120 It isn't true.

00:46:11.840 Megan, I said in January of last year, when I first heard about it in December, and I really

00:46:19.920 tried to do my homework and everybody was starting to freak out.

00:46:22.820 And I said, I really don't believe this is the plague.

00:46:29.840 This is not the one we've been fearing, but fear the economic and spiritual side of what

00:46:39.940 the cure is going to do for us.

00:46:42.840 And the cure has been lock it all down, destroy the economy, destroy our livelihoods and our

00:46:50.700 lives.

00:46:52.020 I mean, think of just the ramifications.

00:46:54.880 You know, 30 days makes a habit.

00:46:57.300 Think of the ramifications of people that have gone to church their whole life.

00:47:02.620 Now they've had almost a year of not going to church.

00:47:06.380 How many of those people who were faithful churchgoers are just not going to go back because

00:47:12.280 they're out of the habit for a year?

00:47:14.140 A lot.

00:47:15.380 The impact on people's lives, good or bad, is astounding.

00:47:21.460 Astounding.

00:47:22.680 So where does that leave us?

00:47:24.820 Because I've been listening to you talking about how a new tea party may be coming.

00:47:30.860 That, you know, I remember, remember that, remember that videotape, Glenn?

00:47:35.140 And this is back, you and I were both on the air at Fox.

00:47:38.300 It was after Obamacare was shoved down our throats.

00:47:41.600 It was an Arlen Specter town hall.

00:47:44.100 Arlen Specter, God rest his soul.

00:47:46.100 And there was that woman who stood up and said, you have awakened the sleeping giant.

00:47:51.620 And then that term, sleeping giants, was co-opted by this far left group that tries to get everybody

00:47:55.400 canceled.

00:47:55.740 But the concept of the concept of the sleeping giants being awakened as more and more freedoms

00:48:04.440 are stolen, eroded, suppressed, open calls to eliminate them.

00:48:09.940 You know, I mean, there actually is a push to, quote, ban hate speech to add that to, you

00:48:16.100 know, the Constitution as an amendment, as if, you know, we want somebody like, I don't

00:48:19.780 know, AOC determining what's what equals hate speech.

00:48:22.500 And we're already seeing it here in the United, here in New York City.

00:48:25.540 If you say illegal immigrant with an unkind intent in your heart, you've committed a crime.

00:48:32.360 It's insane.

00:48:33.240 That's like, how is this constitutional?

00:48:35.900 Anyway, speak to that.

00:48:37.300 Is there a new tea party or a new group of sleeping giants that's been awoken?

00:48:41.640 I want to be careful on, on this, um, because context doesn't ever matter anymore.

00:48:49.380 It seems, uh, I think there is a sleeping giant, uh, that is going to be, um, is, is coming,

00:48:59.620 uh, out of slumber, but I worry who is there to lead it.

00:49:08.740 Um, I don't see the world is leaderless right now, truly leaderless.

00:49:16.020 Um, I mean, you know, when we had Reagan, we had the Pope, we also had Margaret Thatcher.

00:49:22.120 We got nothing, you know, World War II, you had a leader in Churchill and a leader, even

00:49:29.420 though I didn't like him in, in FDR, they got the job done and they were going in the

00:49:34.200 right direction and they were somebody that you could look to the, the reason why Donald

00:49:39.080 Trump was so successful and still can command the crowds and the loyalty is because he was

00:49:47.340 loyal to his people and he was loyal to anyone, anyone of any color that saw America as the

00:49:58.200 way that we've all seen it our whole lives.

00:50:02.280 I don't believe he's a constitutional scholar.

00:50:05.080 I don't believe that he's one that's going to, you know, die over the constitution, but

00:50:09.760 I do believe he loves America and sees what it can be.

00:50:15.360 If we're all just unleashed, there was no one.

00:50:19.640 And, and there is no one now, if he leaves, there will be no one that is fighting for

00:50:26.620 the little guy, the, the, um, you know, person X, if you will, the forgotten man, the guy

00:50:35.200 who is just out there working and trying to, you know, bust his butt and lives a good life,

00:50:41.880 tries to do the right thing.

00:50:43.980 Who's defending him?

00:50:46.100 No one, no one.

00:50:47.960 And that's when bad things start to happen.

00:50:51.360 And especially since you're not just ignoring, you're now demonizing that person.

00:50:57.480 You're now saying you're stupid or you want to kill people through COVID or you're racist.

00:51:04.500 People can only take so much.

00:51:08.800 And, uh, you know, I, I, I live in a really small town of about 500 people in Idaho.

00:51:14.560 And, um, uh, we were talking on vacation.

00:51:19.380 I met with a lot of the neighbors and stuff and they, it's an interesting, uh, phenomenon

00:51:24.200 that's happening.

00:51:24.980 They believe that there is great distress coming and they're all farmers.

00:51:31.580 And we've all been talking about how do we store food?

00:51:36.180 How do we, do we buy tents?

00:51:38.760 Do we, how will we help keep people warm?

00:51:41.140 If they start to flee the cities and they've lost everything and they just, they're hungry.

00:51:48.360 How can we help?

00:51:50.040 Uh, I hope that there are communities like that, uh, and people like that, but we, well,

00:51:58.000 we're not the people of the great generation, the greatest generation anymore.

00:52:01.320 I guarantee you here in New York city, where I am, you'd have people listening to that

00:52:05.360 saying, Oh, good gracious.

00:52:06.680 Give me a break.

00:52:07.680 Right?

00:52:08.160 Like people aren't going to flee the cities for the rural areas.

00:52:11.440 That's, that's nonsense.

00:52:12.820 Well, you know what?

00:52:14.100 Take a look at the major cities of America where some of these, some of these places are

00:52:18.260 seeing murders up 30 to 50%, right?

00:52:20.740 Like where you see, you know, arsonists and looters that they only get held responsible if

00:52:26.680 they have the wrong political ideology.

00:52:29.620 Why wouldn't you consider leaving?

00:52:30.880 Why is that such an absurd notion?

00:52:33.300 How, you know, the, the, the, uh, prices in New York to buy beautiful places now, uh,

00:52:40.820 really low.

00:52:41.700 Now would be the time to buy.

00:52:43.760 Why aren't people with real money buying into New York right now?

00:52:48.560 Now is the time when prices are down.

00:52:51.060 That's when smart people buy.

00:52:53.400 I wouldn't buy anything in New York city now because I can't figure out how are you going

00:52:59.480 to put that city back online?

00:53:01.260 When you have no restaurants, you have no walk-ups, you, you have a gigantic empty spaces where

00:53:11.080 companies have learned in the last year.

00:53:13.200 Gee, we don't need that huge building anymore.

00:53:16.180 And then on top of it, you have a mayor and a governor who just believe in tax, tax, tax.

00:53:23.820 They're driving more business out.

00:53:26.580 They're killing the tax base.

00:53:28.480 How are you going to keep the subways clean?

00:53:32.280 How are you going to pay for a police force on a city that size?

00:53:36.460 That city is going to be in so much trouble, so much trouble because there isn't a Rudy

00:53:42.760 Giuliani that understands the broken window theory.

00:53:46.480 More with Glenn in just one second.

00:53:50.300 We're going to talk next about our Fox days together and why he now says he's never been

00:53:55.160 more wrong about anything than he was about Donald Trump.

00:53:58.700 How about that?

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00:55:20.500 And now it's time for a feature we have here on the show called Asked and Answered.

00:55:24.500 Our executive producer, Steve Krakauer, has got the asked part of the question.

00:55:28.720 Hopefully, I'll have an answer too, but he's bringing us the questions of you, our listeners.

00:55:33.220 And today, Steve Krakauer, our question is from whom?

00:55:35.640 Our question, Megan, is from Max Williamson, who is in Carlsbad, California.

00:55:40.020 Love this.

00:55:40.380 He says he's enjoying listening to the podcast while he delivers food for DoorDash.

00:55:43.940 So, Max, thanks for listening while you're working there.

00:55:46.220 His question for you, Megan, is from which failure or mistake have you learned the most?

00:55:50.700 Well, it's funny because I actually don't look at my setbacks with those words, you know.

00:55:56.240 Really, I don't use those words, failure or mistake.

00:55:59.240 I kind of believe there is no failure or mistake, you know, that you make the decisions you make,

00:56:04.440 what comes next is what comes next.

00:56:07.460 And it's only problematic if you don't learn from it.

00:56:10.380 It may not be pleasant, right, in the moment, but it's only problematic if you don't learn.

00:56:14.900 So if you just keep an open mind, it could turn into something great.

00:56:18.040 You know, I mean, I think people listening to this who know my professional history might say,

00:56:21.760 well, going to NBC wasn't a good move.

00:56:23.700 Well, look, that wasn't the place for me.

00:56:25.140 It's true.

00:56:25.860 But I kept an open mind about how it all went down.

00:56:29.440 And now I don't really see that as a failure.

00:56:32.000 I see that as a huge learning opportunity for me.

00:56:34.760 I got the chance to stretch some muscles, to grow some new skills that I didn't have.

00:56:38.340 And some of those skills I learned on that morning show I was doing, I still apply.

00:56:42.400 And I wouldn't have otherwise acquired, you know, my job in cable.

00:56:46.520 I met a lot of nice people.

00:56:48.000 I met some, you know, not so great people.

00:56:50.100 But I met a lot of nice people who I still am friends with and I miss.

00:56:54.920 So I can't describe that as all bad.

00:56:56.520 Got to interview Vladimir Putin, among many other awesome, like normal, regular, non-star type people on that show who really helped me learn about how to approach life, how to approach problems.

00:57:06.960 There's one in particular who I'm going to put on the show at some point.

00:57:09.800 And you're going to freaking love this guy.

00:57:11.980 Anyway, so I think about it in terms of my first marriage, too, right?

00:57:14.860 Like it didn't it didn't end in success, right?

00:57:17.880 We got a divorce.

00:57:19.360 But I'm still friends with Dan, my first husband.

00:57:21.880 And if I had never married Dan, there would never be a Doug.

00:57:24.900 Honestly, I would never have been as good at marriage as I think I am if I hadn't tried it and not not really done that well the first time around.

00:57:35.080 You just learn, like, what do I need?

00:57:37.340 What is it that isn't working for me?

00:57:39.440 Why didn't it work out?

00:57:40.960 Right. And if you, again, pay attention and keep an open mind, you can turn it into a smash success, which thankfully my marriage to Doug is.

00:57:50.600 And I actually don't think you build any sort of strength or resilience as a human being unless you have setbacks, right?

00:57:56.340 You've got to fall down.

00:57:57.300 You've got to, like, smash your face against the pavement every once in a while to come back stronger.

00:58:01.080 So do do welcome adversity into your life.

00:58:04.080 Do welcome what somebody else might call a failure or mistakes.

00:58:08.140 Mistakes only mean you've taken risks.

00:58:09.580 That's good.

00:58:10.220 That's the only way successful people become successful.

00:58:13.000 It's the only way strong people become strong.

00:58:14.700 Take a risk.

00:58:15.520 You might fail, quote unquote, fail.

00:58:17.860 It might not work out.

00:58:19.120 But if you do the right thing in response, you're going to become the superhero you want to be.

00:58:23.800 Really, I mean that.

00:58:24.920 So thank you for the question, Max.

00:58:26.940 And thank you for DoorDash.

00:58:28.360 And I hope you're not one of the employees who's been screwed by this weird law in California that says you can't work for DoorDash unless they make you a full-time employee and you can't earn your independent contractor.

00:58:37.640 Anyway, I've just been reading up about that thinking this is such nonsense.

00:58:40.920 In any event, thank you for the question, Max.

00:58:42.680 And I hope you'll keep listening.

00:58:44.160 I was on – well, I was just going on vacation when the story about Dalton, the Dalton School here in New York broke.

00:58:53.080 But I have a lot of friends at that school.

00:58:55.080 And for people who missed it, it's one of these elite private schools here in New York, K through 12, that already was very diverse, really committed to diversity long before the current push of the past summer.

00:59:10.080 And you know how it is, Glenn.

00:59:12.320 It's like the schools that are most woke get targeted first.

00:59:17.880 There was an editorial recently that said the uber-woke demanding purity will come first for the moderately woke.

00:59:24.360 And that's exactly right.

00:59:25.720 So this school, the push – in a letter signed by 120 teachers wants 12 new diversity officers.

00:59:33.860 They want any black student who appears in an ad for the school, like his image is in a school publication, or if they participate in any anti-racism initiative, to get paid.

00:59:43.760 They want required courses on black liberation and white supremacy for everyone.

00:59:48.140 Yearly, yearly anti-racism training for employees, trustees, parent association, volunteers.

00:59:52.820 They want all faculty and staff to produce individual, public, anti-racism statements of their own.

00:59:58.680 In other words, they have to become advocates.

00:59:59.960 They want to abolish tracked courses by 2023 if blacks and whites aren't at parity.

01:00:06.260 They're talking about eliminating AP courses unless all of the black students get the same grades or better than all of the white students.

01:00:14.160 They want equality of outcomes, Glenn, equality of outcome.

01:00:18.300 It's Marxist.

01:00:19.700 And this is – so the people living here in New York have to deal with – they've defunded the police by a billion dollars.

01:00:25.360 The crime rates are going up.

01:00:26.880 The schools are shoving this stuff down your throat.

01:00:29.440 I mean, it's a great city if you're from the far left and everybody else has got to ask themselves, what are the other options?

01:00:36.820 Right.

01:00:37.140 And especially now, everything's closed.

01:00:39.240 There's no Broadway.

01:00:40.540 There's no – I mean, there's no great restaurants.

01:00:43.420 Why am I there?

01:00:44.900 Why am I there?

01:00:46.360 You know, Megan, there's a – if – you could tell me to stop at any time on this.

01:00:50.760 But there is – one of my favorite poems by Rudyard Kipling answers the first question that you asked me.

01:00:58.280 What is coming?

01:00:59.980 What does it look like in the future?

01:01:02.460 Rudyard Kipling was a guy who listened to all of the Fabian socialism right before the Second – or the First World War.

01:01:11.480 And he was like, this is insane.

01:01:14.620 What you guys are doing is insane.

01:01:17.380 And they said, oh, it's going to be a better world and everything else.

01:01:20.480 After the First World War, he went and he spent the rest of his life going to grave sites of fallen soldiers from World War I and caring for them.

01:01:30.480 But he also wrote this poem.

01:01:32.740 And would you indulge me?

01:01:35.160 Please.

01:01:35.900 Just tell me if this isn't today.

01:01:39.400 As I pass through my incarnations in every age and race, I make my proper prostations to the gods of the marketplace.

01:01:47.860 Peering through reverent fingers, I watch them flourish and fall.

01:01:52.160 And the gods of the copybook headings, I notice, outlast them all.

01:01:56.220 So copybook headings were the things that you would write in middle school when you were learning cursive.

01:02:01.700 And it would say, water will wet, fire will burn.

01:02:04.920 They were all things that were true.

01:02:07.700 And then he goes on.

01:02:08.920 We were living in the trees when they met us.

01:02:11.260 They showed us each in turn that water would certainly wet us as fire would certainly burn.

01:02:17.460 But we found them lacking in uplift and vision and breadth of mind.

01:02:22.480 So we let them teach the gorillas while we followed the march of mankind.

01:02:28.520 We moved as the spirit listed.

01:02:31.400 They never altered their pace, being neither cloud nor wind-borne like the gods of the marketplace.

01:02:37.220 But they always caught up with our progress.

01:02:40.060 And presently word would come that a tribe had been wiped off its ice field or the lights had gone out in Rome.

01:02:46.360 But with the hopes that our world is built on that they were utterly out of touch.

01:02:53.140 After all, they denied the moon was Stilton.

01:02:55.480 They denied she was even Dutch.

01:02:57.240 They denied that wishes were horses.

01:02:59.380 They denied that pigs had wings.

01:03:01.320 So we worship the gods of the market who promised all of these beautiful things.

01:03:06.560 When the Cambrian measures were forming, they promised perpetual peace.

01:03:11.040 They swore, if we just gave them our weapons, that the wars of the tribes would cease.

01:03:18.180 But when we disarmed, they sold us and delivered us bound to our foe.

01:03:23.020 And the gods of the copybook heading said,

01:03:25.860 Stick to the devil, you know.

01:03:28.660 On the first feminine sandstones, we were promised the fuller life,

01:03:32.400 which started by loving our neighbor and ended by loving his wife.

01:03:36.340 Till our women had no more children, and men had lost reason and faith.

01:03:43.080 And the gods of the copybook heading said,

01:03:45.360 The wages of sin is death.

01:03:48.040 In the Carboniferous epic, we were promised abundance for all.

01:03:52.100 By robbing, selected Peter to pay for collective Paul.

01:03:56.360 But though we had plenty of money, there was nothing our money could buy.

01:04:00.100 And the gods of the copybook heading said,

01:04:01.980 If you do not work, you will die.

01:04:04.460 When the gods of the markets finally tumbled,

01:04:07.960 and their smooth-tongued wizards withdrew,

01:04:11.020 and the hearts of the meanest were humbled and began to believe,

01:04:14.800 it was true that all is not gold that glitter,

01:04:18.780 and two and two do make four.

01:04:21.700 And the gods of the copybook headings limped up to explain it once more.

01:04:26.120 As it will be in the future, it was at the birth of man.

01:04:29.780 There are only four things certain since social progress began.

01:04:35.120 That the dog returns to his vomit,

01:04:37.720 the sow returns to his mire,

01:04:40.220 and the burnt fool's bandaged finger goes wobbling back to the fire.

01:04:45.120 And after all of this is accomplished,

01:04:47.260 and the brave new world begins,

01:04:49.600 when all men are paid for existing,

01:04:51.820 and no man must pay for his sins,

01:04:54.300 as surely as water will wet us,

01:04:57.240 as surely as fire will burn,

01:04:59.640 the gods of the copybook headings

01:05:01.660 with terror and slaughter return.

01:05:06.580 Rudyard Kipling.

01:05:08.640 If that doesn't describe where we're at,

01:05:13.320 and the truth that happened after World War I and World War II,

01:05:17.920 when everybody was told,

01:05:20.700 hey, this is different,

01:05:22.220 this is going to be good social progress,

01:05:25.460 you restore the truth either peacefully,

01:05:29.020 which we still have the opportunity to do,

01:05:31.940 or the truth comes back with wrath,

01:05:36.260 because you can't alter eternal truths.

01:05:40.200 How does that manifest?

01:05:42.360 I mean, I think Trump was one first manifestation of it,

01:05:45.760 that I think neither you nor I,

01:05:48.480 back when he was running, predicted.

01:05:50.880 You know, he just seemed so different,

01:05:52.720 and is he conservative?

01:05:54.100 He doesn't seem so.

01:05:55.360 And yet I do think he was the first response to this.

01:05:58.580 And now that he's not,

01:05:59.860 he's not exiting the national stage,

01:06:01.540 but he is going to exit the Oval Office.

01:06:03.420 So what's the next stage of fighting that?

01:06:08.740 I don't know.

01:06:09.860 I talked to the president over the holiday,

01:06:12.440 and he was very clear.

01:06:15.380 I will never concede.

01:06:19.660 Now, it doesn't mean he's not going to leave,

01:06:22.940 but he is not done fighting,

01:06:25.900 and you will never convince him.

01:06:27.440 And quite honestly,

01:06:28.340 you'd have a hard time convincing me

01:06:30.280 that this was not a stolen election.

01:06:32.620 There's just too many things

01:06:33.820 that I wish they would just open up

01:06:37.100 and have a real hearing on.

01:06:39.560 But I don't think he's going away.

01:06:45.340 And I worry.

01:06:47.760 You know, I worried about him at the beginning.

01:06:50.480 I was very dead set against him.

01:06:52.400 And I've never had,

01:06:55.800 I've never been as wrong,

01:06:58.120 I think, as I was on Donald Trump.

01:07:00.840 I really didn't think that he would do the things

01:07:03.480 that he said he would.

01:07:04.460 I didn't think he would be loyal

01:07:06.140 to the principles of America.

01:07:08.560 I thought he would money grab himself

01:07:11.560 and, you know,

01:07:12.880 you know, just be a New York businessman.

01:07:17.780 And he was remarkable in the things that he did.

01:07:22.500 And I kind of feel bad for people

01:07:25.260 that always took him seriously

01:07:27.540 because I think he's really funny.

01:07:29.420 And I think we missed a really good time.

01:07:31.940 But I think I listened to you back then

01:07:34.720 and I didn't see somebody who loathed Trump.

01:07:37.960 I saw somebody who wanted a proven conservative, right?

01:07:42.960 And that's you liked Ted Cruz.

01:07:44.700 So that made sense to me

01:07:46.660 that you would get behind somebody like Cruz.

01:07:48.460 You were not a fan of Trump.

01:07:50.000 But as you saw him govern,

01:07:52.040 his behavior, his policies brought you into the fold.

01:07:56.320 I mean, why is that not an okay

01:07:58.460 and acceptable organic evolution, right?

01:08:01.020 I mean, some people hold it against you

01:08:02.640 that you weren't formed right from the beginning.

01:08:04.880 Well, who cares, right?

01:08:05.960 You learned.

01:08:06.960 Donald Trump doesn't.

01:08:08.140 I mean, he called me, I don't know,

01:08:09.780 two years ago when I first started saying,

01:08:12.160 okay, I think I was wrong about him.

01:08:14.200 He called me and he said,

01:08:16.880 hey, I just wanted to thank you for what you're saying.

01:08:19.380 And I said, Mr. President,

01:08:21.340 you don't have to thank me.

01:08:23.400 I said, I don't know if you know,

01:08:24.540 but during the election and he said,

01:08:26.900 oh, no, I'm very well aware.

01:08:28.640 And I said, no, no, no.

01:08:29.780 I know you're aware of that.

01:08:31.680 But what I said was, I hope that I'm wrong.

01:08:34.880 And if I am, I'll be the first to admit it.

01:08:37.640 I said I was wrong about you.

01:08:39.300 And what kind of person just stays the course

01:08:43.420 and doesn't admit when they're clearly wrong?

01:08:48.060 Right.

01:08:48.520 Well, I mean, I think if you're not open-minded

01:08:50.640 to Trump's positives,

01:08:52.080 if you're unwilling to see the good

01:08:54.160 he's done for the country,

01:08:55.600 notwithstanding some of his personal failings,

01:08:57.620 I mean, we all have him and his are magnified,

01:09:00.540 given just his outsized personality and his role,

01:09:03.440 then you're not being honest.

01:09:04.940 You know, you're not being an honest broker

01:09:06.500 and no one should be listening to you.

01:09:08.180 And that brings us to the media.

01:09:11.520 And where and what?

01:09:14.260 So as there is a backlash, right,

01:09:16.560 as people will see how strong it is,

01:09:19.300 we'll see who the next standard bearer is in the fight.

01:09:22.000 Maybe it will continue to be Trump, though.

01:09:23.580 So, you know, it's tougher when you're not the president.

01:09:27.440 The media has a massive role in all of this.

01:09:30.780 Their microphone, I think,

01:09:32.000 has been very damaging to the country,

01:09:34.700 especially over the past four years.

01:09:36.740 And I, of course, don't expect them to be tough on Biden,

01:09:40.180 but I actually think they're really dangerous now.

01:09:43.280 And I wonder how,

01:09:44.380 how does the media landscape unfold

01:09:47.640 over the next four years?

01:09:49.680 I don't know.

01:09:51.200 You know, when I left Fox,

01:09:52.780 and I don't know if I said this to you,

01:09:54.660 I doubt I did,

01:09:55.580 but when I left Fox,

01:09:56.840 I told my staff for about the last eight or nine months

01:10:01.040 that I was there,

01:10:01.540 I said, we have got to get out of here.

01:10:04.760 All of this,

01:10:05.800 all of these networks are going to burn themselves to the ground.

01:10:08.840 I mean, this is a disaster waiting to happen

01:10:10.780 because they just didn't get it.

01:10:13.260 And they still don't get it.

01:10:16.180 Um, and they think they're living in,

01:10:19.420 you know, the 1970s.

01:10:20.880 I remember when Barbara Walters,

01:10:22.660 uh, did, uh, you know,

01:10:25.600 her most intriguing people of the year

01:10:28.240 or whatever that thing was.

01:10:29.020 Most fascinating.

01:10:30.120 Yeah.

01:10:30.700 And, uh, and she was interviewing me.

01:10:33.680 I was one of the most fascinating.

01:10:35.460 It was a tough year.

01:10:36.060 I remember.

01:10:37.060 I remember that.

01:10:38.080 But I got to work that day

01:10:40.100 and they were shooting it at my office

01:10:42.080 and they had closed down Sixth Avenue.

01:10:46.260 They had closed the block for this interview.

01:10:49.880 And I remember walking up and I said,

01:10:51.940 what the hell is going on outside?

01:10:53.860 And they said, oh, well, you.

01:10:56.540 And I said, what are you talking about?

01:10:57.880 They said, it's Barbara Walters.

01:10:59.600 ABC is closed.

01:11:00.740 They closed, they closed the road in New York.

01:11:04.940 Um, so she could get her people in

01:11:07.100 and all the trucks and everything else.

01:11:08.520 And I remember they took two days

01:11:11.220 to set everything up.

01:11:13.080 They had, I don't know how many people up there.

01:11:15.520 And the interview was like six or eight minutes.

01:11:18.140 And I thought to myself,

01:11:19.360 they have no idea that the world has changed.

01:11:22.940 The world has completely changed.

01:11:24.860 Um, and then for them to be so dishonest

01:11:29.680 on top of this, uh, the, the arrogance

01:11:34.600 that they think they know the truth

01:11:37.340 and they know better than the collective American mind

01:11:41.720 and that they, that they think

01:11:44.220 that the American mind answers to them,

01:11:46.820 not the other way around.

01:11:49.300 I, I, it's, I just don't see it lasting

01:11:53.100 without, uh, you know,

01:11:56.240 some sort of a military support.

01:11:58.580 How, how do you, how do you disenfranchise

01:12:02.060 most of the country and expect that

01:12:05.160 people are just going to continue to buy your crap?

01:12:08.060 They're not, they're not.

01:12:09.680 They need, they need what Ted Koppel told me

01:12:12.600 they needed to do.

01:12:14.140 And he was dead serious.

01:12:15.680 He said, we need to, people like me

01:12:18.900 need to, uh, have a process

01:12:21.500 to license people like you.

01:12:23.580 You, really, Ted, really,

01:12:28.040 you think you have the authority

01:12:31.480 to say his voice counts,

01:12:34.380 his voice doesn't count.

01:12:36.360 That, that, that is only, uh,

01:12:39.320 kept stable by force.

01:12:42.080 Why do you think Glenn?

01:12:43.700 Cause I was with you at Fox during that time

01:12:45.860 and your meteoric ascent,

01:12:49.020 which was something to behold.

01:12:50.800 It was something to behold.

01:12:51.800 I was, you're only in your mid forties.

01:12:53.940 You're only there for a couple of years,

01:12:55.280 but you dominated all of media at the time.

01:12:58.500 And I wondered,

01:12:59.280 and you became a huge target,

01:13:01.740 huge, huge, huge.

01:13:03.320 Why, why did you become such a target

01:13:05.680 in a way that somebody,

01:13:08.300 uh, so here's the end of my question

01:13:09.580 in a way that somebody like Sean Hannity

01:13:12.020 hasn't been, I mean, they don't like Sean,

01:13:15.020 but he, he has not been a target

01:13:17.640 in the way you have been.

01:13:18.860 Why?

01:13:19.060 Roger Ailes gave me the biggest compliment

01:13:22.560 of my career.

01:13:24.840 Um, he said,

01:13:27.160 I haven't seen someone as effective

01:13:30.020 on television since Jack Parr.

01:13:33.280 And I was a huge fan of Jack Parr.

01:13:36.520 Um, when someone can make a connection

01:13:39.980 with the audience,

01:13:40.880 and there's been several that can do it.

01:13:42.580 I mean, Jon Stewart at the time

01:13:43.700 was doing it as well.

01:13:44.600 When you can make a connection

01:13:46.920 and, and the audience feels they know you,

01:13:52.300 they like you,

01:13:53.660 you can make them laugh.

01:13:55.320 You can tell them the uncomfortable truth

01:13:57.660 and, and encourages them

01:14:01.100 to think for themselves.

01:14:02.840 I said over and over again,

01:14:04.960 I don't want your trust.

01:14:06.680 I don't need your trust.

01:14:08.100 Do your own homework.

01:14:09.880 Prove this to be true or wrong

01:14:11.880 and go to original sources.

01:14:14.300 And if I got it wrong,

01:14:15.240 I'll be the first to admit it.

01:14:17.260 When you have,

01:14:18.500 you can actually credibly

01:14:21.000 say those things,

01:14:22.640 mean them,

01:14:23.160 and the audience connects,

01:14:25.600 you are the most dangerous person alive.

01:14:28.860 And, and, and one of the reasons

01:14:31.840 why I left there, Megan,

01:14:33.220 was because I started to like it.

01:14:36.700 And, you know,

01:14:38.280 and I know, you know,

01:14:39.420 this feeling when you say something

01:14:42.280 live on air and you can feel

01:14:46.140 the country tilt,

01:14:48.540 you can feel it connect.

01:14:51.320 And if you're not really careful

01:14:53.760 or a much better person than I,

01:14:55.500 that I am that's intoxicating

01:14:59.820 and becomes just so dangerous

01:15:04.120 for the country,

01:15:05.180 but also just dangerous to your soul.

01:15:07.640 It's battery acid for your soul.

01:15:10.680 Now you will,

01:15:11.940 you, maybe you'll find this interesting.

01:15:13.260 Maybe you won't.

01:15:13.920 I did not experiencing this.

01:15:16.780 I did not experience that

01:15:18.420 in the same way.

01:15:19.920 I knew that I had power

01:15:21.960 and influence

01:15:23.140 and certainly a good salary,

01:15:25.080 but I never reveled in that.

01:15:30.440 I never really wanted power.

01:15:32.440 I never really wanted influence.

01:15:34.480 I wanted to report the news.

01:15:36.280 I thought it was fun

01:15:37.240 and I thought it was a good public service

01:15:38.960 and I knew I was good at it.

01:15:40.960 And what the reason I left Fox

01:15:42.960 among others,

01:15:43.640 but the biggest one was

01:15:44.980 I always had my eye on the ball,

01:15:47.300 which is what is most important to me

01:15:48.900 is my husband

01:15:50.100 and the three little people

01:15:50.980 that we made back at our house.

01:15:53.180 And the more I have to sacrifice them

01:15:55.540 for this job

01:15:56.380 that I used to think was fun

01:15:57.800 and a service,

01:15:59.200 but now has become

01:16:00.760 really mostly just toxic,

01:16:02.560 toxic argumentation

01:16:04.460 inside and outside the building for me.

01:16:06.840 What am I doing this for?

01:16:08.120 Right?

01:16:08.280 So it wasn't,

01:16:09.000 I never sort of got drunk on the power.

01:16:10.820 In fact, I remember people saying to me

01:16:12.540 when I was going to leave Fox,

01:16:13.760 we have so much power.

01:16:14.980 You have such a platform.

01:16:15.840 And me saying,

01:16:16.720 I don't care about any of that.

01:16:20.200 I just never have.

01:16:21.040 I, and, and I'm with you.

01:16:23.600 I didn't,

01:16:24.900 I wasn't drunk on the power.

01:16:26.380 I was afraid of the power.

01:16:28.260 I'm a recovering alcoholic

01:16:29.880 and I made so many mistakes,

01:16:31.700 um, in my early life

01:16:33.640 because of my ego

01:16:34.420 and arrogance and everything else.

01:16:35.600 And the power scared me to death.

01:16:39.040 Uh, and, uh, uh, you know,

01:16:42.400 I knew it was my wife

01:16:44.400 and I had talked about leaving

01:16:45.340 for about six months.

01:16:47.660 And, um, and I said, uh, one night,

01:16:51.420 it was a, just an amazing night.

01:16:53.500 And I'm, I, I was asked for,

01:16:56.240 you know, my opinion on some, uh,

01:16:58.640 on some Broadway stuff from Bono

01:17:00.980 and got home and I was just

01:17:02.560 as high as a kite

01:17:03.440 because I'd never been the cool kid

01:17:05.480 and I'm hanging out with Bono.

01:17:07.760 And, um, uh, and I got home

01:17:10.340 and we had already decided

01:17:11.540 that I was going to tell Roger

01:17:13.020 the next day that we were indeed leaving.

01:17:15.540 And I got home and I said,

01:17:17.040 how can this be?

01:17:18.180 I mean, look at,

01:17:19.380 look at the access we have,

01:17:20.860 look at the things that we can do

01:17:23.000 and change and everything else.

01:17:25.020 And as soon as I said it,

01:17:26.380 my wife, thank God said,

01:17:27.860 I'm going to bed.

01:17:29.000 Um, but I, I, I stood there

01:17:32.640 on my floor to ceiling windows,

01:17:34.280 looking over Rockefeller, uh,

01:17:37.100 Plaza and Times Square and everything.

01:17:38.580 And I thought, I just feel like I heard

01:17:42.080 if you don't leave now,

01:17:43.560 you'll, you won't leave with your soul

01:17:45.120 because you will be, I, cause I,

01:17:47.220 I liked the influence.

01:17:50.000 And even though I wanted to use it for good,

01:17:52.500 that's, that's that you get lost in that fast.

01:17:56.600 You can't, you can get lost in that fast.

01:17:59.600 Well, I, I can relate to that

01:18:01.060 because I I've said this before,

01:18:03.160 but I, I was a hundred percent convinced

01:18:05.620 that if I signed another deal at Fox news,

01:18:08.320 I would get cancer.

01:18:09.940 I could feel myself getting sick,

01:18:13.600 getting physically unwell

01:18:15.380 as a result of the lifestyle I was leading.

01:18:18.360 And it's not that the people at Fox news

01:18:20.400 are all terrible.

01:18:21.440 It's not that it's,

01:18:22.620 it's the nature of that business.

01:18:25.040 It's horrible.

01:18:26.160 What it, what it is now,

01:18:27.600 it just was stomach turning to me.

01:18:30.100 And I did not wish to be a participant

01:18:32.040 in it for one minute longer.

01:18:34.820 And then there was the whole Ales thing

01:18:36.380 on top of that,

01:18:37.040 which is another thing.

01:18:38.300 Uh, I, I heard, uh,

01:18:39.840 I heard your, uh, podcast

01:18:41.760 where you were talking about

01:18:43.080 why people in your position

01:18:45.160 get paid so much.

01:18:46.720 And, uh, and by the way,

01:18:48.600 I love your podcast.

01:18:49.460 I listen all the time.

01:18:50.260 You're really good.

01:18:51.080 Um, but, uh, uh, you were so right.

01:18:55.680 It's people think,

01:18:57.800 oh, I'd love to do.

01:18:59.840 No, not, not so much.

01:19:01.300 There's a lot,

01:19:02.080 there's a lot of great stuff.

01:19:03.820 It's the best and the worst.

01:19:06.520 And, uh, it can kill you just because,

01:19:09.800 I mean, especially when you're

01:19:11.420 at the very top of the game,

01:19:13.300 my gosh, it is non-stop all the time.

01:19:17.520 Um, people may not, you know,

01:19:19.920 who didn't watch Fox,

01:19:20.720 they may not be aware of this,

01:19:22.420 but I agree with what Roger said.

01:19:24.340 There's, there's no one like you

01:19:27.400 on television.

01:19:29.400 You are spectacular

01:19:32.060 in a really special way.

01:19:34.720 I watched your show every night.

01:19:36.840 I couldn't take my eyes off the screen.

01:19:39.520 You do have a supernatural ability

01:19:42.400 to connect with an audience

01:19:43.760 and anybody who looked at you

01:19:46.060 could see it.

01:19:47.520 And I think you're right

01:19:48.820 that your effectiveness

01:19:50.220 made you a bigger threat.

01:19:52.240 And I flatter myself

01:19:53.300 on a very, very small, uh, level

01:19:55.780 compared to yours, your abilities

01:19:57.760 to know seriously to say,

01:19:59.820 I think that was actually

01:20:00.780 one of the reasons

01:20:01.860 I too became successful

01:20:03.020 and also became a huge target, right?

01:20:05.180 Because the more effective you are,

01:20:07.480 the more of a threat you are,

01:20:09.080 you know, the more dangerous you are,

01:20:10.080 the more, and the more they need

01:20:11.100 to sort of target you.

01:20:12.740 And I, I admire the people

01:20:14.520 who can just say, I don't care.

01:20:16.060 I don't, you know, I don't care.

01:20:16.880 I'll just go out there

01:20:17.460 and keep fighting.

01:20:18.440 I was like, life is short.

01:20:20.680 I could die in it any day

01:20:22.140 and I don't want to live like this,

01:20:24.420 you know, and I actually am happier.

01:20:26.420 I don't know if you remember this,

01:20:27.800 but, um, uh, right towards the end,

01:20:30.960 um, my daughter and I, uh, we had always wanted

01:20:35.720 to go see, um, Hitchcock in the park

01:20:38.420 and, you know, every summer at, um, uh,

01:20:42.180 what is it?

01:20:42.640 The, uh, the park right by the library,

01:20:44.760 uh, Bryant, is that Bryant Park?

01:20:47.060 Uh, yeah, Bryant Park is in the forties.

01:20:48.820 Yeah.

01:20:49.240 And so they were, they were doing

01:20:51.480 a Hitchcock movie and my daughter said,

01:20:53.460 dad, let's go.

01:20:54.680 Now I should have known better.

01:20:56.700 Uh, you know, I got to the point

01:20:57.940 where I couldn't walk with my children

01:20:59.820 in the street.

01:21:00.880 Um, because you had six security guards

01:21:03.340 surrounding you at all times

01:21:04.580 and it was necessary.

01:21:05.760 It was necessary.

01:21:06.260 It was horrible.

01:21:06.920 But anyway, um, somebody, we go down

01:21:10.080 and I tell the security, I, I don't want

01:21:13.240 anybody around us.

01:21:14.180 Just please let us be a family.

01:21:15.920 We go in thinking that it's going to be fine.

01:21:18.460 The crowd is so hostile.

01:21:22.360 They threw wine at my wife.

01:21:24.960 Uh, they were, um, calling them names

01:21:28.260 when my wife and my daughter went to the bathroom.

01:21:31.160 I mean, half a block away from me,

01:21:32.880 uh, just horrendous, horrendous treatment.

01:21:36.920 Uh, and you know, there's, there's only so much

01:21:40.100 that you can, you can do.

01:21:42.260 And I, I didn't want my children around it.

01:21:45.000 Um, you know, I just, I just didn't want

01:21:47.660 my children exposed to any of that stuff.

01:21:50.060 And I, I miss it cause I like New York.

01:21:53.000 Um, I like the diversity of New York.

01:21:55.240 I love the fact that I could sit down

01:21:57.800 with really bright minds who completely

01:22:01.000 disagreed with me and we could have

01:22:02.980 a great conversation and I'd walk away

01:22:05.420 learning something.

01:22:06.180 I miss that.

01:22:08.020 Yeah.

01:22:08.940 Well, I see it happening to Tucker now.

01:22:11.260 And, um, you know, so far I think he,

01:22:13.420 he's done a good job of sort of

01:22:14.880 just shrugging it off and, but he,

01:22:17.300 his life has become very limited too

01:22:19.100 as a result of it.

01:22:19.860 I mean, I'm not at liberty to reveal

01:22:21.420 all of it, but I know he's,

01:22:22.560 he's become much more insular because

01:22:24.520 you can't live a normal life when you

01:22:27.480 have that much negative attention focused

01:22:29.380 on you and your family.

01:22:30.220 I just, I love, I just love Tucker.

01:22:32.840 I think he is so effective.

01:22:35.460 You know, he's, he's called me from

01:22:37.480 time to time and said, uh, Hey Glenn,

01:22:39.700 when you were doing this, what?

01:22:41.900 And it's weird because, uh, not a lot

01:22:45.920 of people can have experienced it at

01:22:48.480 his level.

01:22:49.820 Um, and, uh, it's, it's sad, uh, quite

01:22:54.420 honestly, but I think he's, he's getting

01:22:56.120 hammered because he is so effective, so

01:22:59.420 effective.

01:22:59.780 Well, and so what, and, and here is one

01:23:02.120 of the, uh, what, of course, what you

01:23:04.080 hear about Tucker all the time is, well,

01:23:05.620 he's a white supremacist, right?

01:23:06.720 He's a racist, which isn't true, but of

01:23:08.980 course this is what they do.

01:23:09.880 And I was, I was, you know, they give

01:23:11.180 me a packet in, in, in preparation for

01:23:13.120 all of these interviews, Glenn, and the

01:23:14.860 one on you raised the, you know, the

01:23:16.940 comment on Fox and friends, how you, at

01:23:18.600 that time you said something like, I

01:23:19.840 think Obama is a racist.

01:23:21.640 And you later drew took that back and

01:23:23.920 said, I phrased it wrong.

01:23:25.360 But after you said that at least 57

01:23:28.780 advertisers requested that their ads be

01:23:31.120 removed from your programming.

01:23:32.480 Okay.

01:23:32.780 Now contrast that, that, so that was

01:23:35.420 your opinion, not, not perfectly put,

01:23:37.320 but that's what you said at the time.

01:23:39.540 Contrast that with a number of media

01:23:42.000 personalities who openly call President

01:23:44.900 Trump a racist in today's day and age.

01:23:47.900 And their defense would be, oh, but he

01:23:49.520 is, but he is.

01:23:50.420 I know, I know.

01:23:51.580 And you know what, Megan, I actually

01:23:54.000 have amended that, uh, apology because

01:23:58.200 I was searching for something.

01:24:00.300 If, if you watch it, I, I was thinking

01:24:02.160 and I, and I was just, I'm stupid

01:24:04.280 because I think out loud a lot and not

01:24:07.000 the thing to do in today's world.

01:24:08.580 And I, uh, I said, he's a racist.

01:24:11.720 No, that's not quite right.

01:24:13.100 I just think he has this, this deep

01:24:15.600 seated hatred for the, the white

01:24:17.720 culture.

01:24:18.500 I didn't understand what critical race

01:24:21.480 theory was.

01:24:22.760 He's a critical race theory guy.

01:24:24.900 That's who he is.

01:24:26.060 That's why so many Americans felt this

01:24:29.540 disdain for, uh, what he would say is

01:24:35.280 otherness, um, that, that, uh, he just

01:24:39.000 had this disdain for our history and our, uh,

01:24:42.860 and our, our culture.

01:24:44.120 It felt, and what that is, is critical

01:24:48.880 race theory.

01:24:49.720 So when I said he was a racist, well, no,

01:24:54.300 I just think he believes in the critical

01:24:55.900 race theory, which happens to seem a

01:24:58.760 little racist to me.

01:24:59.960 A critical, critical race theory is the,

01:25:01.800 it is racist.

01:25:02.960 It is.

01:25:03.680 I'm not, I, I don't know what's in

01:25:05.560 Obama's heart, but that, that program

01:25:08.080 critical race theory, where you're

01:25:09.340 assumed to be a white supremacist because

01:25:11.060 you were born with a certain pigmentation

01:25:12.720 is racist by definition.

01:25:14.760 Yeah.

01:25:15.360 Yeah.

01:25:15.960 And that's what I think America was

01:25:17.460 feeling and they didn't know it.

01:25:19.200 They didn't know it when, but, but do

01:25:21.860 you see that, that hypocrisy in the way

01:25:24.420 they came down on you for, let's say you

01:25:27.080 stood by the original statement, right?

01:25:28.520 I know you don't, but let's say you did.

01:25:30.000 But now I, I was like, oh my God, how

01:25:32.640 times have changed, right?

01:25:34.000 How the worm has turned.

01:25:36.100 Oh, I know.

01:25:36.660 I can't take, I, I would have never

01:25:38.940 said a quarter of the things that were

01:25:42.060 said about Donald Trump.

01:25:43.340 I would have never, I mean, Roger, um,

01:25:46.920 uh, Roger was pissed at me for that

01:25:50.440 statement.

01:25:51.160 Uh, I mean, he, I called the president

01:25:53.240 a liar one time and he called me into

01:25:56.320 his office and he said, you do not call

01:25:58.620 the president a liar.

01:25:59.800 And I said, I know, but I think he is

01:26:02.260 here, uh, Roger.

01:26:03.420 I'm surprised you don't.

01:26:04.360 He said, it doesn't matter what you think

01:26:06.520 or I think the American people don't want

01:26:09.460 to hear someone say the president is a

01:26:13.220 liar.

01:26:13.540 I mean, that was his line.

01:26:16.800 And by the way, that was, uh, that was

01:26:18.040 Barack Obama.

01:26:18.920 That's he was, he wasn't defending some

01:26:20.420 Republican.

01:26:21.060 No, it was Barack Obama.

01:26:22.840 And, and where is the line?

01:26:25.220 These, you know, CNN is, has gone stark

01:26:29.340 raving, mad, stark raving, mad.

01:26:32.560 Um, uh, you, you, you look at what

01:26:36.440 they've said, what they've justified, uh,

01:26:39.540 the, the, the lies, the Hunter Biden cover

01:26:42.460 up, all of this stuff, you, you have no

01:26:46.840 credibility and, and then they discover

01:26:50.840 that, oh, you know what?

01:26:51.880 There is this laptop of Hunter Biden and

01:26:54.180 it's probably not really worth looking

01:26:56.480 into, but we should note that there is

01:26:58.500 something to that laptop.

01:27:00.140 Are you kidding me?

01:27:01.520 I mean, it's, it's, uh, they are

01:27:05.920 criminal, uh, in, uh, I shouldn't say

01:27:09.940 that because people will take that

01:27:11.560 literally, uh, they are responsible for

01:27:15.640 Donald Trump in many ways.

01:27:17.620 Donald Trump was a symptom.

01:27:20.400 He was not the disease.

01:27:22.880 He was in effect.

01:27:24.220 He was in effect.

01:27:26.020 I couldn't agree with that more, but I

01:27:27.880 do, it leads me back to the same

01:27:29.840 question, which is now what, because

01:27:32.320 he's not going to leave the national

01:27:33.620 stage.

01:27:33.960 He's still going to be the leader of

01:27:35.180 the Republican party, but I think it's

01:27:37.080 much bigger than that at this point,

01:27:38.500 Glenn, I think it's a matter of, you

01:27:40.900 know, people, and I don't just say

01:27:42.400 conservatives.

01:27:42.940 I know you, you see this too.

01:27:44.860 Many liberals are feeling this way too.

01:27:46.980 Many Democrats are sick and tired of

01:27:49.340 this nonsense.

01:27:50.540 And, and so where does it go?

01:27:52.160 How do we take back academic freedom

01:27:55.220 and the ability to exchange, you know,

01:27:57.520 free thoughts and ideas on college

01:27:59.180 campuses and beneath that?

01:28:00.820 How do we reclaim corporate America

01:28:03.020 where people are allowed to have

01:28:04.040 different political leanings and to

01:28:05.320 express them on their Facebook pages,

01:28:07.460 not on the corporate pages and still

01:28:09.480 keep their jobs?

01:28:10.500 How, like all of the stuff we've been

01:28:12.240 talking about, I think there has to be

01:28:13.740 like, I don't know, some massive

01:28:15.580 organization that starts fighting back

01:28:17.420 as a, you know, sort of a, I've been

01:28:18.740 approached by a bunch of different

01:28:20.180 people to help fight back in the

01:28:21.480 academic context, but it just doesn't

01:28:23.940 need to be coordinated by somebody.

01:28:25.820 Does it need to be grassroots?

01:28:27.040 Roots, what happens next?

01:28:30.000 So let me give you an answer that I

01:28:31.980 don't like.

01:28:35.880 Before he died, I was friends with

01:28:38.080 Billy Graham and I was talking to him

01:28:42.060 one day and I said, where is the next

01:28:45.360 Lincoln?

01:28:45.980 Where's the Washington?

01:28:47.320 Where is, where's Reagan?

01:28:49.360 Where's, where's any leadership?

01:28:51.560 Where is it?

01:28:52.560 And, uh, he just smiled at me and he

01:28:56.220 said, it's not going to happen that way

01:28:57.540 this time.

01:28:58.420 And I said, what do you mean?

01:28:59.480 And he said, I think there are millions

01:29:01.420 of people all around the world that know

01:29:04.380 what the truth is and they're hearing

01:29:07.260 what they're supposed to do.

01:29:09.460 They're supposed to stand up and do

01:29:11.020 something.

01:29:11.720 And they're arguing with God in their

01:29:14.200 head saying, but that's not going to

01:29:15.580 make a difference.

01:29:16.420 I can't, uh, I need something bigger

01:29:18.460 than that.

01:29:19.200 And he said, it's going to be those

01:29:21.360 people who are loyal to the voice that

01:29:23.800 they hear.

01:29:24.560 They're going to stand up and pretty

01:29:26.160 soon they'll be standing there with

01:29:27.660 their puzzle piece and they'll feel

01:29:28.940 really stupid.

01:29:30.100 And somewhere out in the dark, they'll

01:29:32.280 hear somebody else cough and they'll

01:29:33.760 go, who's here.

01:29:34.820 And they'll say, I am, I just, I don't

01:29:36.700 know what I'm doing here.

01:29:37.700 I just had this and it'll be the piece

01:29:39.360 that they were looking.

01:29:40.320 And all of a sudden, all of those

01:29:41.940 pieces will snap together and it will

01:29:45.580 be bigger than any one person could

01:29:48.000 have ever come up with.

01:29:49.840 Um, and I like that for its optimism.

01:29:53.900 Um, but, uh, it is, uh, it, it

01:29:57.800 requires tremendous courage from not

01:30:02.480 people like you and I, I mean, they

01:30:04.120 can shut me down tomorrow.

01:30:05.660 I'm fine.

01:30:06.300 I'll whatever.

01:30:07.540 Um, but there are so many people that

01:30:09.680 are living paycheck to paycheck that

01:30:11.880 don't have security.

01:30:13.600 They don't have anything and what

01:30:16.400 they're going to stand up and say

01:30:18.280 something.

01:30:18.940 It's going to require tremendous,

01:30:21.520 tremendous courage.

01:30:23.020 And we've already seen how hearts of

01:30:25.040 men are failing them.

01:30:27.020 Um, I, I just, uh, I just am, uh,

01:30:32.300 grateful.

01:30:33.300 You know, I've been your fan forever,

01:30:36.680 Megan.

01:30:36.900 And I have, I remember writing you

01:30:40.120 when everything was bad and saying,

01:30:43.420 I used to watch your show on NBC

01:30:44.720 every day.

01:30:45.840 Uh, I'm just, I'm just a real fan of

01:30:48.480 yours.

01:30:48.740 I think you're brilliant.

01:30:50.080 Um, and, and I remember thinking,

01:30:52.720 and I think I wrote to you at one

01:30:54.240 point, you are legendary.

01:30:57.400 If you just pick the things you want

01:31:01.000 to do and just interview people and

01:31:03.540 just speak the truth, you'll be bigger

01:31:06.580 than anything.

01:31:07.240 And you're already there.

01:31:09.140 You're already starting to just

01:31:10.800 explode again in a different, great

01:31:14.120 way.

01:31:14.940 Um, but I'm, I'm grateful for voices

01:31:17.860 like you and, and others that are now

01:31:21.580 willing to stand up when you know,

01:31:25.660 they're going to come for you.

01:31:27.240 They're just coming for you.

01:31:28.340 Um, and, uh, courage is contagious

01:31:32.140 and, uh, much more so than, uh, COVID.

01:31:36.780 And if we can just start finding and

01:31:41.720 highlighting those voices that are

01:31:44.180 courageous, and if we will all start to

01:31:47.960 look at, uh, this alliance of freedom,

01:31:50.780 little like NATO, an attack on one is an

01:31:53.420 attack on all, uh, we'll survive.

01:31:56.300 But if we stay separate, we don't

01:31:59.340 support people who are standing up.

01:32:01.160 We remain shy in our own life.

01:32:03.180 And, oh, well, they said it.

01:32:04.420 I don't want to say anything.

01:32:05.680 We're doomed.

01:32:06.860 We're doomed.

01:32:07.600 We have to stand together.

01:32:10.160 Great way to end it, Glenn.

01:32:11.880 It's so great to talk to you.

01:32:13.380 Let's do it again soon.

01:32:14.540 Really enjoyed every moment.

01:32:16.240 Thank you.

01:32:16.920 God bless.

01:32:20.500 Today's episode was brought to you in

01:32:21.920 part by Armbrust USA.

01:32:23.800 Go to don't shut down mask up dot com

01:32:25.940 and enter code MK for a 15% discount

01:32:28.660 on your first order of Armbrust USA masks.

01:32:31.920 Now stay tuned to the program and go

01:32:33.560 ahead and subscribe if you would,

01:32:35.560 uh, because our next guest is going

01:32:37.560 to be Kathy Lee Gifford.

01:32:40.060 We talked a bit about NBC on this show.

01:32:42.020 She was one of the bright spots for me

01:32:43.440 in that entire experience.

01:32:44.940 She was consistently kind, honestly,

01:32:47.820 like from start to finish.

01:32:49.200 We became good friends.

01:32:51.080 We went out and had a bunch of boozy

01:32:52.440 lunches to the surprise of no one.

01:32:55.500 And, um, she just, she talks about a lot

01:32:58.220 in a way that I find inspirational.

01:32:59.700 She talks about faith.

01:33:01.580 She talks about charity.

01:33:02.960 She talks about humanity, music,

01:33:05.480 her new life in Nashville.

01:33:07.160 Even hearing her talk about the death

01:33:08.900 of her husband, Frank Gifford,

01:33:10.500 will make you feel inspired.

01:33:12.120 It really will.

01:33:12.940 I know that sounds a little odd,

01:33:14.380 but trust me.

01:33:15.320 So don't miss Kathy Lee.

01:33:16.660 KLG is coming on the program next.

01:33:18.120 And go ahead and subscribe

01:33:18.880 to The Megyn Kelly Show.

01:33:20.480 Download, give us a like, if you will.

01:33:23.340 I would say give us a review,

01:33:24.480 but somehow Apple has stopped the reviews

01:33:27.000 for looking into why as of December 13th.

01:33:29.720 Hmm.

01:33:30.760 Not going to be a conspiracy theorist,

01:33:32.380 but it's weird.

01:33:33.420 Um, anyway, we'll take your thoughts

01:33:34.940 at questions at Devil May Care Media,

01:33:37.160 and we'll talk again soon.

01:33:39.120 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show.

01:33:40.980 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

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01:33:47.000 Media production in collaboration

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The Megyn Kelly Show - January 08, 2021

Glenn Beck on America in 2021, the Media, and COVID Lockdowns ｜ Ep. 48

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