The Megyn Kelly Show - He'll NEVER Endorse Biden Again ｜ Charlamagne tha God x Megyn Kelly - The FULL Interview

00:00:00.600 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:12.080 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show. It is our 800th episode today.

00:00:18.840 Wow. 800 episodes. How did we get here? Thanks to all of you. That's how. Thanks so much for

00:00:24.500 tuning in this day and all the others. We've had some great shows recently and today is

00:00:28.320 yet another that I'm super excited to bring to you. Remember that viral, you ain't black if you're 0.99

00:00:34.820 not voting for me comment by then candidate Joe Biden during the 2020 campaign? Well, you can

00:00:40.920 thank my next guest for that one. Joining me now is Charlamagne Thagad. He is the author of the new

00:00:48.220 book, Get Honest or Die Lying, Why Small Talk Sucks. Find out more and get tickets for book signings at

00:00:56.820 WhySmallTalkSucks.com. Charlamagne, welcome to the show.

00:01:01.940 Thanks, Megyn. Thank you for having me. How are you?

00:01:04.000 I'm great. It's so nice to meet you. You've made so much news with politicians and other cultural

00:01:08.880 figures over the year, many of which we've played on this show, the soundbites thereof. That one with

00:01:14.620 Joe Biden just went completely viral. And then I saw you on The View yesterday where they were trying to

00:01:21.240 zero in on you and Biden and this presidential race. And those ladies really, really, really wanted 1.00

00:01:27.420 you to say that you endorse him. You didn't want to do it, but eventually you admitted, okay, it's

00:01:34.160 kind of a binary choice here. I mean, it's basically a binary choice and that you're not going to vote

00:01:39.280 for Trump. So why wouldn't you just be explicit about it? I wondered about the hesitation.

00:01:44.780 Simply because I'm not a fan. And I don't think that an endorsement... People think that me not

00:01:54.460 wanting to endorse means that I'm not voting, which I think is the strangest thing ever.

00:01:59.520 There was another moment in that conversation where I even said, hey, there's third-party

00:02:02.900 candidates. Whoopi told me she'll beat my behind if I bring up third-party candidates. So I just think

00:02:08.740 it's kind of strange where we are as a culture and as a society where it's almost like there's either

00:02:14.220 one of two extremes. And if you're a person who just simply chooses to be objective, simply

00:02:20.220 chooses to look at both candidates and say, hey, I think there's some right things here. There's some

00:02:26.380 wrong things there. There's some good things here. There's some good things over here. Just me being

00:02:31.640 able to explore both options are all options that are out there. For some reason, it bothers people.

00:02:38.280 And I don't understand why.

00:02:38.900 Yes. They were really pressing you. They were like, do Biden a solid. They wanted you to go

00:02:44.620 to your audience and say, vote for Biden. And it was very strange. You've got some magic wand that's

00:02:50.860 going to turn this thing if you just say, I endorse. Can I ask you about third parties? Would

00:02:55.420 you consider RFK, Jay?

00:02:58.780 I mean, I've looked at all of them. I've looked at RFK. I've looked at Marianne Williamson. I've looked at

00:03:03.060 Cornel West. I've looked at all of them. I've been looking at third parties since 2016. Like,

00:03:11.020 you know, like 2016, people would say we didn't have the best options, right? But I felt like

00:03:15.580 Hillary Clinton was overly qualified to be president. But it's not like I didn't explore

00:03:19.720 everything. After President Obama, I explored everything. I explored conservatives. I explored

00:03:25.240 the Green Party. I explored Democrats. I feel like that's what you should do as an American citizen.

00:03:31.040 I don't think the two-party system has been the best thing for us here in America. And I don't

00:03:37.340 think there's anything wrong with exploring everything. I'm actually shocked that there

00:03:41.380 hasn't been a third-party candidate that's been able to come along and, like, really galvanize

00:03:45.960 people, especially being that America seems to be, you know, so disappointed in the choices that we

00:03:50.840 have now.

00:03:52.140 Mm-hmm. Do you think that there's, like, more pressure on you to, quote, endorse because you're

00:03:58.600 black and there's a presumption that you have some influence with black voters who, not by huge

00:04:04.280 margins, but by some margins, are migrating from the Democrat to the Republican Party, or at least

00:04:09.580 from Biden to Trump?

00:04:11.480 I think people, I don't know if people are necessary. And I see the numbers, like I think

00:04:16.200 I said, what, 22 percent of people, 22 percent of black people may vote for Donald Trump. I think

00:04:20.480 that number is overstated a little bit. But my guy, Tim Ryan, you know, who used to be a

00:04:25.320 congressman in Ohio, Tim Ryan always, well, a senator in Ohio, I'm sorry, Tim Ryan used to

00:04:29.980 always, he talks about the exhausted majority. And I think that's what most people are in this 0.63

00:04:35.300 country. We're the exhausted majority. So it's not even just about being tired of, you know,

00:04:40.020 Democrats or being tired of Republicans. People are just tired of politics, period. You know?

00:04:45.600 And I think that's what you're seeing a lot of now. Like, even, you know, having the conversation

00:04:50.880 about, you know, who I'm choosing to vote for, listen, I've said it over and over, what

00:04:56.140 I think about both candidates, right? And it's only me. I don't know what's going to happen

00:05:02.700 between now and November. I don't think much is going to change. But if these people want

00:05:07.180 people to be, if these parties want people to be more energized about their candidates,

00:05:11.480 maybe they should just run better candidates.

00:05:12.860 You know? I don't think it's rocket science.

00:05:17.820 You, in the book, you write about your background. You grew up pretty poor in a single wide trailer

00:05:25.760 and spending most of your time running around through the woods and had very hardworking mom,

00:05:30.720 had a more complicated relationship with your dad. Did you ever think that that kid,

00:05:34.420 right, who was learning how to catch a rattlesnake on his spare time, would be in the position now

00:05:39.860 where it's like, your magic words of, I endorse this candidate, would be so important, right,

00:05:47.900 to political TV shows and pundits?

00:05:50.040 No, not on that aspect. I always knew that I was, you know, here to do something. I always

00:05:55.720 felt that in my spirit. I used to be in my grandmother's yard in Monks Corner, South Carolina,

00:06:00.140 and the field, like, there used to be a field in front of her yard that used to separate my

00:06:04.420 grandmother's house and, like, my cousin Gloria's house. And it's back when I was smaller,

00:06:09.140 the field seems so big, but it's actually not that big. But I used to always be acting like I

00:06:13.460 was on a stage. And I used to be acting like, you know, I was performing, right? And it was always

00:06:18.500 like I was in a rock band. And then, you know, as I got older, it was like I was a rapper. So I always

00:06:24.660 knew that I was, you know, supposed to be delivering some kind of message. And this might sound kind of

00:06:30.180 crazy to some people, but I remember meeting a medium back in 2006. And, you know, he said to me,

00:06:38.320 he goes, you know, he was just talking to me and he said, you know, you're going to achieve a lot of

00:06:41.420 your goals relatively easy. But I just want you to know that, you know, when you get the way you're

00:06:46.160 supposed to go, you're here to deliver a message. And that same medium told me that he saw like a

00:06:52.160 microphone in my future. And he was talking about radio. And he said he was naming different radio

00:06:58.200 personalities. And it was it was not spooky at the time, but it was just like, hmm, he even told me I was

00:07:03.800 going to have a daughter. And that was in 2006. I didn't have my first daughter till 2008. So long

00:07:09.740 story short, I always knew I ended up having four. Long story short, I always knew that I was here

00:07:14.380 to, you know, be on a platform of some some sort. But I didn't know that it would be I didn't know

00:07:20.800 I would be Captain Saber Joe in an election. You know, I think I read the book and I really enjoyed

00:07:28.440 it. And I think what makes you special is your extreme ability to be introspective,

00:07:35.200 reflective about your life, to keep challenging yourself to keep change, keep changing, keep

00:07:40.100 growing. And you're very, very honest about what you perceive as your own shortcomings, whether it

00:07:45.860 was early on in your marriage, something you addressed, whether it was the life lessons you took

00:07:51.060 from your dad and your uncle, and you're sort of growing up, which you realized as an adult weren't so

00:07:55.400 great. Or even right down to we don't have to get into it. But like the size of certain man parts

00:08:00.420 that you just like Howard Stern style, put it out there, Charlemagne. I have to say you're a brave

00:08:06.900 man. I don't know if you call it brave. I just I think that we lack self awareness, man. And I think

00:08:12.740 that one of the main reasons that, you know, a lot of people just aren't being honest with

00:08:17.580 themselves, which is why the book is called Get Honest or Die Lying, is because it's so easy to be

00:08:22.100 real with other people. But it's so hard to be real with yourself. And you know, they have all of

00:08:27.000 these cliche terms like I keep it real. But usually the people who keep it real can only do that with

00:08:31.780 others. But man, when that mirror gets in front of them, it's very hard for them to have those like

00:08:37.100 super honest conversations with they self. And my whole life, that's what I've, you know, challenged

00:08:42.160 myself to be just honest, because, you know, my dad used to always tell me something when I was young, he was

00:08:46.900 like, man, when you lie to me, you're not lying to me, you lying to yourself. And that's something

00:08:52.380 that just always stuck with me. And you can kind of tell the people who are lying to their self in

00:08:57.620 our society. And I went on, I went away on a spiritual retreat, you know, earlier this year,

00:09:02.260 me and my wife. And one of the things that came up for me during that time away was stop lying to

00:09:08.060 yourself and stop volunteering those lies to other people. And that's, that's literally what what I

00:09:13.500 wrote this book for. I wrote this book for people to stop lying to themselves and stop volunteering

00:09:17.280 those lies to other people. All right, I've got to read you this because my fourth grade boy

00:09:22.380 was at an end of year ceremony just two days ago. And my husband and I went and their fourth grade

00:09:28.740 teacher read to this class of boys the following poem, which speaks exactly to what you're saying.

00:09:33.080 I cried. I'm not going to lie. You're a dad. You can be able to relate. But it's called that guy in

00:09:37.980 the glass. It's by Dale Wimbrough. And it goes as follows. When you get what you want in your

00:09:42.700 struggle for self and the world makes you king for a day, then go to the mirror and look at yourself

00:09:47.460 and see what that guy has to say. For it isn't your mother, brother or friends whose judgment you

00:09:52.740 must pass. The person whose verdict counts most in your life is the one staring back at the glass.

00:10:00.140 You can go down the pathway of years receiving pats on the back as you pass, but your final reward

00:10:06.320 will be heartache and tears if you cheated that guy in the glass. That's exactly what you're saying.

00:10:13.580 That's a theme of your book in some ways. Powerful words. Whoever that was who wrote that,

00:10:18.420 they remixed Michael Jackson's Man in the Mirror. I just want you to know I'm talking about the man

00:10:25.000 in the mirror. Yeah. I'm asking him to change his way. That's all that is. But whoever wrote that is

00:10:32.460 absolutely positively true. The hardest thing for us to do is look in the mirror every day and be

00:10:37.220 honest with ourselves. And I literally challenge myself every day. I wake up every day and before

00:10:42.660 I'm honest with anybody else, before I'm telling anybody else about what I think they may be doing

00:10:48.680 wrong or if I give them compliments on what they're doing right, I talk to myself first.

00:10:53.220 Like, you know, that inner voice in your head, the things you tell yourself are really the most

00:10:58.340 important. And that's what I do every morning. It's something you've worked at, you've cultivated.

00:11:05.420 You talk in the book about the therapy you've been through all the way down to, I don't know if

00:11:10.460 this didn't exactly come from your therapist, but you have a spiritual guru in your life as well.

00:11:15.680 And the tree hugging, you're a tree hugger, but not exactly in the Green New Deal sense,

00:11:22.160 in a different kind of way. Explain.

00:11:24.880 Yeah. It's a chapter called Tree Hug the Block. And, you know, I just talk about the benefits of,

00:11:30.500 you know, doing things like forest bathing, you know, walking around in your yard with your shoes

00:11:35.420 off and your socks off and just doing grounding exercises, you know, going up to trees, putting

00:11:40.140 both hands on the trees, putting your forehead on the tree, taking a few deep breaths, you know,

00:11:44.240 saying a prayer, you know, sometimes, you know, just, just sitting shirtless with your back to

00:11:50.380 the tree, you know, uh, me and one of my spiritual advisors, her name is Yadi Alba. We laugh because,

00:11:55.360 you know, she always says, you know, lay down in the ground, face, face down, ass up. Right. And 0.99

00:12:00.120 just, just let the, let the earth just feel the earth. And man, you'd be surprised how when you're

00:12:05.340 stressed out or if, you know, you're, you know, battling like about a depression or your anxiety levels

00:12:10.340 are high, you'd be surprised how that just brings you right back to center. And, you know, we used

00:12:14.720 to laugh, you know, back at, back in the day at the people who used to consider themselves,

00:12:18.680 you know, tree huggers. You'd be like, oh man, they just high. Everything, everything is great

00:12:23.160 when you're high. And guess what? Megan, they right. You know, when you're walking around doing

00:12:28.520 some grounding in the backyard, even when you're not high, it really does feel great. And it really

00:12:33.240 does bring you back to center in a real way. I like the beach too. I like walking, you know,

00:12:37.640 barefoot on the beach, you know, I would hope I'm, I hope, I would hope the only time you're

00:12:41.940 walking on the beach is barefoot, but walking on the beach, barefoot, going in the ocean, you know,

00:12:46.500 you know, being in the ocean, looking right up at the sun, saying a prayer directly from the water

00:12:50.220 to the sun, man, all of that brings you back to center in such real ways. I know you say in the

00:12:55.420 book, if you, if you're feeling self-conscious about hugging a tree of actually hugging a tree,

00:13:00.540 putting your face up against the tree, start small, maybe just sit with your back up against the

00:13:05.140 tree. So people don't think you're crazy, but you could kind of graduate to a full five minute

00:13:09.160 hug of a tree and it actually could be transformative. That's such a beautiful way

00:13:13.240 of dealing with anxiety, which you admit you have dealt with for years versus just taking a pill,

00:13:19.560 which is what the medical community will push on you these days.

00:13:22.480 Oh, absolutely. You know, I'm not, I'm not against, you know, anybody who needs medication,

00:13:27.180 you know, for certain things, but, you know, personally I've, I've, I've never had to use it.

00:13:31.680 I remember my father, even when I was young, when they were trying to put me on like

00:13:34.440 Ritalin as a child, you know, my father was like, no, he did, you know, back then though,

00:13:38.760 it wasn't, you know, he don't need Ritalin cause he don't need to just be on medication. It was,

00:13:43.040 he don't need no Ritalin. He needs that beat. Right. So, but even now it's like, I don't,

00:13:47.920 we don't, we don't necessarily, medicine shouldn't be the first option all the time. You know,

00:13:52.900 I feel like, you know, this is a glorious earth that we, that we're on. And like, there's a lot of

00:13:57.360 natural remedies and holistic remedies that we could be, you know, tapping into that bring us

00:14:02.320 those same results. A lot of those things in the pharmaceutical, pharmaceutical world too.

00:14:08.340 So how did you make it so big in radio and now podcasting too, with the kind of anxiety that

00:14:16.360 you suffer from? And as you were growing up, you talk about how it was very much social anxiety.

00:14:21.640 How, how did you get over that? How do you deal with that to this day?

00:14:25.120 That's the strangest thing about anxiety, right? Like anxiety creeps up on you at weird times. It's

00:14:31.360 those times when you're just literally laying on your couch at home. And then all of a sudden you

00:14:37.680 get up and you start checking to see if all the doors are locked. Right. Or, or, you know, um,

00:14:44.380 like, like you can be laying on the couch and there's a ceiling fan going and you just start

00:14:48.180 thinking to yourself, what if that ceiling fan, you know, flies off and like cuts my head off? 0.99

00:14:53.000 Like, it's just the stupidest, strangest things. But when it comes to like getting in front of a 0.99

00:14:57.780 microphone and talking to millions of people, yes, there's a level of anxiety there, but for some

00:15:04.840 reason it doesn't give you, you know, those same panic attacks of just going through regular everyday

00:15:12.520 life. I have no idea why I'm able to get in front of a microphone and, you know, talk to millions of

00:15:19.260 people effortlessly, but I can't be in a party with 50 people without wanting to go home, you know,

00:15:26.900 because I'm already having a panic attack. Cause I'm thinking about, you know, the worst possible

00:15:30.920 scenarios happening. I am too, but it's usually that guy over there is going to come over here

00:15:36.160 and talk to me. It's not about the ceiling fans. Oh God, I don't want to do that. That is actually

00:15:41.280 another reason I wrote this book. That's, that's, that's why I think small talk sucks because I 0.93

00:15:46.060 don't think they understand when you're a person who's already dealing with anxiety and you've had to

00:15:51.080 say prayers and do breathing exercises and, and, and, and put your beads on, right. And all your, all your

00:15:57.820 other things just to show up in the world. The last thing I want to do is have a meaningless

00:16:03.360 conversation with a stranger, like at least come into my life or come up to me and bring me a

00:16:10.740 conversation of value that may ease, you know, whatever it is I got going on. I tell a story in the book

00:16:17.060 about, I tell a story in the book, how I was at the airport and, you know, you know, I'm a person

00:16:22.620 who's been attacked in the street a couple of times, right? Like right here, right here in New

00:16:25.760 York city, you know, just for things that I've said on the radio, like, you know, back in the day

00:16:29.180 though, not, not anything recently, but like over a decade ago. And, but I'm still, you still have

00:16:33.480 that PTSD from things like that. So I'm at the airport and this guy comes up to me and he's trying to

00:16:39.740 talk, but he's like, not really saying anything. So automatically I'm on alert. And then he finally

00:16:46.660 goes, he's stuttering and he's telling me that he has a speech impediment. So he's asking me to bear

00:16:53.020 with him while he gets out what it is he's trying to get out. He cut the small talk, you know, and he

00:17:00.460 told me exactly what it was from the beginning. So that one little moment eases my anxiety and lets

00:17:06.500 me know, okay, this person isn't, isn't a foe. He's not, he's not any type of opposition in any way,

00:17:11.500 shape or form. He just has something he wants to say to me and it's hard for him to get out. And if

00:17:15.880 that, if that individual who has a speech impediment can let me know that we can do the

00:17:21.240 same thing, we should be able to tell people, Hey man, I don't want to talk about that right now.

00:17:26.500 And if we ever linked social anxiety to the hatred of small talk, I have to say, I too hate small talk

00:17:35.720 and have a fair amount of social anxiety, not anxiety in the regular lane, but social anxiety.

00:17:40.700 And I, I had never linked the two. This is actually a, an insightful thought that one is causing the

00:17:48.620 other, because I like you am much more comfortable when the conversation is substantive.

00:17:53.520 Yes. And you think about it, right? It's a link because when somebody says, okay, Megan Kelly,

00:17:58.860 you have to be this place at seven o'clock at night, you're already dreading all the things,

00:18:04.680 you know, you have to do in order to get to this place. And if you got something to do the next day,

00:18:10.320 you're like, I'm going at seven. I'm going to be out by eight. I want to be back home in my bed by

00:18:16.780 nine o'clock. And I hope when I, when you get there, you're thinking about all the conversations

00:18:20.900 people want to have with you. You're thinking about, you know, what people are going to try to

00:18:25.880 get from you. Cause a lot of, a lot of it is, is people just trying to take from your energy

00:18:30.740 at these places. It's not a lot of pouring into you when you, when you go to these events.

00:18:38.000 So stuff like that, man, it's like, yes, it does cause a lot of, a lot of social anxiety. 0.96

00:18:42.600 And it's another reason why I keep telling people small talk sucks. I do not like it in any way, 0.84

00:18:47.520 shape or form. And it's not even just about the small chit chat either, Megan. It's about

00:18:50.580 how we make these micros macros nowadays. So most of the things these people are coming to talk to you

00:18:55.900 about, they're not big issues, but folks act like they're the biggest issues in the world.

00:19:00.740 And so when the actual big issues come across our desk, we don't even know how to talk about

00:19:04.380 them. You know, if we even choose to talk about them at all.

00:19:07.760 And that you sound right now to me, like Jocko Willink, the bad-ass Navy, Navy SEAL, who's like

00:19:12.940 the godfather of all Navy SEALs, who he came on the show and I was talking to him about all the stuff

00:19:17.860 we argue about all the day, every day, all the day. And he was like, just don't give it any energy

00:19:22.260 whatsoever. You know, you just, the way you solve these things that are about, you just,

00:19:26.060 you don't even talk about them. You don't, I'm like, well, there goes my whole career. I mean,

00:19:29.460 that's kind of what I'm in the business of doing.

00:19:32.220 No, I don't think you talk about small talk. I think, I think that there's a lot of macro issues

00:19:36.120 that you discussed that we both discussed, you know, and it's not that you're not going to ever

00:19:40.580 have any small talk. I just want us to cut down on it. And I want us to get into, you know, just

00:19:46.260 talking about the big issues, talking about the macro issues, the things that actually matter,

00:19:51.680 the things that actually, you know, impact us as a society. And I think social media does a horrible job,

00:19:57.780 you know, at, at discussing the macros. I think social media is the place where micros

00:20:02.120 go to become macros. And it's these small issues that really don't even matter. And you know how you

00:20:08.720 know they don't matter? Because the conversation about them doesn't even last. It'll, it'll, it'll last

00:20:13.360 12 hours at best. Give it 24, 24 hour news cycle is, is, is, is stretching it nowadays. If something

00:20:21.580 lasts 24 hours, I'm shocked. There's a lot of good advice in here for young people who, and you make

00:20:29.160 fun of yourself. And I could relate to this too, about how every generation is like this next

00:20:33.040 generation sucks. They're lazy back in my day, you know, barefoot to school, both ways. No, 0.97

00:20:38.700 but you do raise the point of like telling younger people today, and you have a lot of fans who are

00:20:44.060 young in your audience. You're not entitled to anything. You should bring a fair amount of humility

00:20:49.800 to your next job. It's hard work and elbow grease grease that are going to get you ahead and not a

00:20:55.640 sitting around thinking, why is life so unfair? That's right. Yeah. The more things change, you

00:21:01.340 know, the more they stay the same. So, you know, as we live in this society where everything looks

00:21:06.780 like it's easier than what it actually is because of social media, like, you know, my guy, you know,

00:21:11.340 pastor Steven Furtick, he's actually from my hometown, I was going to South Carolina. He has this quote

00:21:15.680 where he says social media is literally everybody is everybody's highlight reel. So you're comparing

00:21:22.220 your real life, you're comparing the process that you're, you know, going through in life to somebody

00:21:26.980 else's highlight reel. And because of that highlight reel that people are constantly posting, we feel

00:21:32.780 like we can just skip steps. We feel like we can just, you know, skip the process. Like everything, you

00:21:38.340 know, takes time. Like there's no such thing as, you know, getting pregnant and then having the baby the

00:21:43.300 next day, you know, you get pregnant and you carry that baby for nine months for a reason. There's 0.98

00:21:48.120 different trimesters for a reason. It's a process, you know, there's a process of coals going to 0.94

00:21:54.280 diamonds, right? Like it's all a process. And this generation, you know, feels like they can just skip

00:21:59.440 the process only because of social media, because it's so easy to walk down the street and see somebody

00:22:04.780 else's phantom and take a picture in front of it, if that's your thing, and then post it. And then

00:22:08.920 everybody will be putting a hundred emojis in your comments. Like you're out here doing the,

00:22:13.960 you're out here winning. It's not even your car. So it's like, I just try to tell kids,

00:22:19.580 I try to tell the younger generation, you can't escape the process and you, and you got to have

00:22:23.900 patience. Patience is another lost art nowadays because of social media, because you have all of

00:22:29.760 these people lying about where they are in life. Right. And how they got there. And it's definitely

00:22:36.160 not what you do. You, you, you write in the book about how you had, um, a time in which you were

00:22:41.780 dealing, doing drugs. And I think dealing drugs, and that's sort of the birth of your stage name.

00:22:48.700 A lot of our audience was asking in the comments before you came on, what, where, what is Charlemagne

00:22:53.380 the God? And there actually is a very interesting explanation behind it. Can you tell us?

00:22:58.600 Yeah. I come from a very small town in Monks Corner, South Carolina. The population now is probably

00:23:02.600 like 10,000, 11,000 people. But when I was growing up, it was like six to 7,000. So like everybody knew

00:23:08.820 each other. And so when I did get into, you know, selling, selling crack, like I would wear a hoodie

00:23:14.660 and I would tell people my name was Charles, because I knew that if I told them my name,

00:23:22.140 Lennard, right, they would be like, oh, that's Larry's son. Or, oh, that's, that's Julie's son.

00:23:27.300 And it was so funny, Megan, that the people who were buying crack would go tell my parents that I

00:23:33.340 was selling it. Okay. But they wouldn't tell my parents that they were buying it, you know,

00:23:37.660 even though people knew. So Charles was just like a moniker, uh, that I, that I started running with.

00:23:42.760 And then I was, um, in night school, cause I got kicked out of two high schools. I got kicked out

00:23:46.980 of Berkeley high school. Then I got kicked out of Scrappett high school. So I was in night school

00:23:49.780 reading a history book and I saw the Roman emperor, Charlemagne and Charlemagne was French

00:23:56.700 for Charles the great. And, um, he went about spreading religion and education. And I literally

00:24:03.040 just said to myself, that is a cool name. I already called myself Charles. So I'm gonna just start

00:24:08.000 calling myself, uh, Charlemagne. And, you know, back then I used to rap. So it was a cool rap name.

00:24:14.460 And I always said it would look good on, on a marquee or on the front of a book.

00:24:18.100 And I think I was right.

00:24:20.360 And it does, it does. And where did the God come from? My husband, Doug has resolved to

00:24:24.100 start using that after many phrases, after having seen me reading your book.

00:24:28.800 I study, uh, I studied the 5% teachings, you know, and in the 5% teachings, they teach that,

00:24:33.740 uh, you know, God is a Greek word derived from the Aramic words, which means wisdom,

00:24:38.720 strength, and beauty. And the first letter of each word was used by Greek students when they

00:24:42.280 would identify their, uh, Egyptian teachers. And so it kind of really doesn't make any sense

00:24:47.340 because Charlemagne is Charles the great, and then it's the God. So it's, it's, it's Charles

00:24:51.360 the great, the God, but yo man, I was 17 and smoking a lot of back then.

00:24:57.320 But you know what? It also makes sense to me because the book does spend some time on

00:25:00.280 positive messaging and how, uh, you talk about the astronaut theory and how, when we're raising

00:25:04.940 our kids, we can't, we don't want to overcorrect so much against everybody gets a trophy society

00:25:10.700 that we veer into cynicism with our kids. Like now you, I mean, let's be realistic. You're not

00:25:17.300 actually going to the NFL. Maybe you should channel your energies a different way. You're

00:25:20.840 very much against that. I think the positive uplifting name for yourself is totally in line

00:25:26.580 with now. I know how you parent your own daughters.

00:25:28.840 Absolutely. And, and, you know, I got, I got four daughters and when they ask me,

00:25:33.240 when they tell me they want to do things, I don't shoot it down. Cause I had older people

00:25:37.880 in my life who did that to me. I tell a story in one of my, my first books, uh, cause this is my

00:25:42.660 third book, but I tell a story in my first book, Black Privilege about how, um, I had a, I had a,

00:25:47.460 a cousin aunt. She was like my mom's, my mom's cousin, but she was also like an aunt to me as well.

00:25:52.980 And I remember just talking about all of these big plans I had and all of these things I wanted to do

00:25:58.400 with my life. And I remember she said to me, don't set your goals so high, you know, don't set your

00:26:03.700 goals so high because if you don't reach them, you're going to be disappointed. And I paused for

00:26:07.940 a second and I said, that is the stupidest shit I ever heard in my life. Like, why would you ever 1.00

00:26:12.820 tell a child that? Like, I wasn't even a child. I was like, I don't know, 19, 20, but I was like,

00:26:17.540 why would you ever tell anybody that? So my thing with my kids, when they want to do something,

00:26:22.560 yo, let's try it out. Like I got one of my, one of my daughters recently started soccer and,

00:26:27.840 you know, she, she liked it at first past couple of practices. She don't want to go.

00:26:33.240 Why? She said, it's too hot out. I don't want to be out there in that heat. I'm not going to force

00:26:38.200 her to go out there and do the soccer if she doesn't want to. If she, cause if you genuinely 0.94

00:26:42.440 love something, you're going to want to do it regardless, right? That's how I was with radio.

00:26:47.000 It didn't matter that I wasn't making any money. I've been doing radio 26 years. I didn't start making

00:26:51.060 money really, really in radio till probably my, I don't know, 10th, 12th year in radio. So it took a

00:26:57.760 long time. You know, I started doing radio in 1998. I didn't start really making money till

00:27:02.200 probably 2010. Right. So, but I loved it. So that thing that you, uh, love to do that is probably

00:27:10.560 going to change your life is that thing that you're going to do for free. So if she's, if she

00:27:15.040 doesn't want to go do soccer, I'm not, I'm not going to press her to do it. Yeah. There's no,

00:27:19.220 I'll give it, I'll give it an opportunity to that at this point in your life. So I want to ask you

00:27:24.660 this because you're very positive in your messaging. You're real, uh, but you're positive

00:27:28.220 in your messaging. And then there was a chapter I wanted to ask you about, which was 16. This

00:27:33.000 wasn't you. It was, uh, Aaron McGruder, who was the man behind the boondocks comic strip.

00:27:38.820 And it was the only chapter I was like, wow, well, this is not positive. This is, this is some stark

00:27:44.580 stuff. And it's about definition. Yeah. It's about race in America. And it's about, you know,

00:27:51.920 us allegedly being a white supremacist country and Republicans don't do shit for poor white people, 0.99

00:28:00.080 but they still vote Republican and they do it because if they were to vote Democrat, 1.00

00:28:04.800 the N word would benefit. It's got a lot of incendiary thoughts on how evil Republicans are

00:28:09.760 because they really just exist to keep the black man down. And I, it's not you, but you have put it 1.00

00:28:15.680 in your book by this guy, Aaron McGruder. So what are your feelings on that? Um, I think Aaron is

00:28:22.220 expressing an, uh, uh, an emotion and feelings and saying things that a lot of people feel,

00:28:28.420 you know, a lot of people in the black community, absolutely positively feel like that, but it's not 0.99

00:28:32.100 even, you know, just Republicans. I just feel like, you know, government in general, I think that there's

00:28:37.040 been a lot of systemic things that have been done, you know, to, to, to black people in this country

00:28:41.660 to put, you know, black people in certain positions in this country. And there hasn't been enough 1.00

00:28:46.040 systemic things done, you know, to get us out. You know, I think one of the, you know, main critiques

00:28:50.760 of the democratic party is the, you know, they are supposed to be the party that, that represents us

00:28:56.060 and, and, and, and supports us. And, you know, people don't feel like they have fought hard enough

00:29:01.720 for black people. That's why every, you know, presidential election cycle, we're back having these same,

00:29:07.720 you know, conversations about, you know, Democrats going out there and earning the black vote. Like

00:29:13.080 if Democrats had done, you know, historically what they say they are going to do for black people,

00:29:20.680 you know, they wouldn't be in this position every four years where they're, they're out here

00:29:25.100 trying to push me to endorse. What do you think that is? Like, what do you think that is? Because

00:29:28.380 I know there's a divide between the parties and some factions of the country that, you know,

00:29:32.540 the Democrats, and we keep hearing them saying things that we heard Biden at the Morehouse

00:29:36.600 College the other day saying with a very dark message about this country, that the country

00:29:40.620 doesn't love you back as a young black graduate and talking in very negative terms about what their

00:29:46.440 futures look like. And you contrast that just to what Barack Obama said in front of the same audience,

00:29:51.240 you know, eight years ago, it was very uplifting and also empowering. Like you can do it. You can make

00:29:58.200 a difference in this great country. You have nothing but blue sky ahead of you. Very different,

00:30:02.680 stark messages. What's in chapter 16 sounds more like Biden. So how do you see it? More like Biden,

00:30:09.300 more like Obama? Well, I think I would like to see it more like President Obama. And the reason I

00:30:16.200 would like to see it more like President Obama, because as he said, these are his words, the

00:30:20.180 audacity of hope. Like you have to be optimistic. Like I'm optimistic because I was raised on a dirt road

00:30:26.200 and, you know, Monk's Corner in South Carolina. My mother was an English teacher. The most she ever made,

00:30:30.120 you know, was $30,000 a year at one point. You know, my father was a great guy, you know, who

00:30:36.100 had a lot of flaws. Right. And he was a construction worker, but he also had his own mental health issues

00:30:41.260 and his, you know, he dealt with substance abuse. And I'm not supposed to come, you know, out of

00:30:46.440 out of that circumstance. But because, you know, I was able to come out of that circumstance and just

00:30:52.400 because of, you know, other conversations I've seen from people who come from environments like mine,

00:30:57.040 I have to have the audacity of hope. I have to have, you know, optimism, but I also have to deal

00:31:02.620 with reality too. And it's also, it's just interesting that, you know, President Biden

00:31:07.460 would go to Morehouse and, you know, make those statements when a lot of those issues, those

00:31:13.100 problems he's contributed to, you know, whether it was, you know, the, the, the 86 mandatory minimum

00:31:18.820 sentencing, you know, whether it was the 88 crack law, the 94 crime bill, there's a lot of things

00:31:23.720 that he, you know, uh, contributed to in regards to keeping, you know, uh, the, the, the black man

00:31:29.880 down. Right. So, so it's, it's just interesting that he would go to Morehouse and, and, and talk

00:31:35.440 like that. You're the president of the United States of America. You are the person that, you

00:31:39.200 know, we are looking to, you know, at least if not change some of those things, speak to changing

00:31:46.040 some of those things because you contributed to so much of that. Hmm. What do you think? I mean,

00:31:51.660 Tim Scott, he's from South Carolina, uh, still reportedly on the short list toward becoming

00:31:56.600 Trump's VP. He says, firmly believes America is not a racist country, a belief I share. Do you?

00:32:04.940 No, I highly disagree with that. I mean, of course there's systemic racism in this country. I don't

00:32:09.740 believe every single white person in America is racist, but there is, there has been systemic

00:32:16.000 racism. Like, like it, yes, a hundred percent. Sure has been. You can look at everything from,

00:32:21.620 you know, slavery to, you know, Jim Crow laws, to redlining, to, you know, the war on drugs. Like,

00:32:28.960 yes, like the act, the act like there is not systemic racism in this country is silly and foolish. 1.00

00:32:35.040 Today, 2024. I mean, it's like to think that Democrats who run the education system and largely 0.97

00:32:40.380 the criminal justice system and so many, so much of government today who pride themselves

00:32:44.860 on being DEI and, you know, anti-racist and all that, that, that they're running these massive

00:32:50.140 racist organizations would seem a stretch to even some of them. Well, you have to have these DEI

00:32:56.620 programs because of systemic racism. So, so things like that tell you that these, uh, systemic racism

00:33:02.120 still exists because you still have to have, you know, programs like that to ensure that there's

00:33:06.960 diversity, to ensure that there's equity, to ensure that there's inclusion. So yes, systemic racism

00:33:12.300 absolutely still exists in, in, in America. It's not something, it's, it's something that we can

00:33:17.020 dismantle, but we have to want to dismantle it. And, and the only way we're going to dismantle it

00:33:21.780 is if we first acknowledge that, that it exists. Like I, as I say, you know, in the book, and it's a

00:33:27.400 great quote, you just can't heal what you don't reveal. I don't think any of us do any, do, do

00:33:32.100 ourselves any favors by acting like these things don't exist. You don't, I mean, the, I think the

00:33:39.520 difference between where you are and where I am is I acknowledge everything you said about this

00:33:44.140 country and its history. You know, we had a couple rough 200 years from the foundation with slavery

00:33:51.720 and then through the Jim Crow laws. But then we got to a place where we passed the 1964 civil rights

00:33:57.180 act. And we had a way, a revolution in the country to start looking at this differently. And when I

00:34:02.760 grew up in, you know, the eighties and the nineties, race relations had vastly improved. We were hanging

00:34:09.300 out with one another, not thinking about skin color all the time. We actually instituted affirmative

00:34:13.000 action programs, which were upheld under law, even though they're not totally consistent with our

00:34:16.640 constitution, but we did all of that because we understood the history. And now we're in this place

00:34:22.740 where it seems to be flipping to what Kendi says, which is anti-white racism. That's fine. That's 1.00

00:34:29.460 how we're going to remedy the remnants that are still left over the past. And I think that's causing

00:34:34.060 more racial division. Am I wrong? Um, I think social media makes us think that, you know, uh,

00:34:42.980 certain things, I think social media amplifies certain things on purpose. And we have to be very

00:34:48.520 careful about that because we don't even know, uh, a lot of these conversations are real on social

00:34:54.120 media. Like, you know, I, I still believe that Quintel Pro is alive and well. And I think that

00:34:58.620 a lot of times these conversations that happen on social media really just happen to keep us all

00:35:04.200 having a whole lot of small talk, having a whole lot of small talk about, you know, 0.98

00:35:10.360 foolishness and nonsense, like the, like anti-white racism. Like what, what is that? You would have to 0.99

00:35:17.240 tell me what that is. Like what is, what is it's what Kendi's pushing? What Kendi says is the answer

00:35:22.060 to past discrimination is future discrimination and present discrimination against those who

00:35:26.220 perpetrated it. Notwithstanding the fact that we had nothing to do with what happened in the 1860s.

00:35:31.900 We weren't around. It wasn't us. It wasn't most of our ancestors. And most of us have a completely

00:35:37.780 open-minded attitude toward our black and brown friends and would never do anything to hurt them or

00:35:43.380 see them as less than, and we don't want us or our children being punished because of sins of the

00:35:48.300 father, grandfather, great, great, whoever. Gotcha. Yeah. I can't, I can't speak for all

00:35:52.700 black people because all black people aren't monolithic, but you know, all the black people

00:35:56.120 that I know, they just want equality. You know, they want to be, they, they, they want to be treated,

00:36:01.100 you know, fairly. They don't want to, you know, walk outside and have, you know, a police officer

00:36:06.160 harass them just because of the color, the color of their skin. You know, they don't want to be, 1.00

00:36:10.660 you know, denied a job or, you know, a place to stay, you know, just because of the color of

00:36:16.520 their skin. We don't want to be black supremacists. We don't want to, we don't want to, you know, be 0.94

00:36:22.280 what, you know, white supremacists were to black people. Like that's not, at least the black people 0.99

00:36:27.520 I know, that's not what, what, what, what we're after in any way, shape or form.

00:36:33.140 Well, I think the messaging of the book on empowerment and possibilities and getting honest,

00:36:40.660 as, as it's called, getting honest or dying, lying, um, makes a ton of sense. And I hope we

00:36:46.440 can continue this conversation. I know you got to run, but I have so much more. I want to talk to

00:36:50.220 you about it. So please come back. Would you? I mean, I got like 10 more minutes if you want to

00:36:54.560 talk. Oh, you do? Oh, great. Oh, okay. Sorry. No, let's, let's keep it rolling then. All right.

00:36:59.680 So let's, can we, can we spend a minute on politics? Cause I am interested in your thoughts on it. Cause I

00:37:04.460 know you're not a fan of Trump and I think that you think he's racist, but you tell me because I

00:37:12.680 look at Biden's history of comments and I'm like, Oh my Lord, including to you, that thing about if

00:37:17.080 you're not going to vote for me, you ain't black. That's listed on the, on the tally of the racist 0.92

00:37:21.960 or racially insensitive things he said. You know, what's, what's the more interesting conversation

00:37:27.300 for me. And this is, I'm glad you brought that up in regard to Trump. Why does nobody ever talk

00:37:33.640 about him being unpatriotic? Like not, like not being patriotic. And what I mean by that is

00:37:39.580 if he says he wants to suspend the constitution to overthrow the results of an election, or,

00:37:45.380 you know, his lawyers were in court and his lawyers were like, well, he never agreed to support

00:37:48.960 the constitution. Or we saw him, you know, uh, attempt to lead a lead and attempted coup of this

00:37:55.540 country. Like there's, that's just unconstitutional. Like, why does nobody ever say

00:38:01.000 he's not a patriot? Like, why does that discussion ever, never come up? Because when I think about it,

00:38:06.860 when I think about how mad, you know, uh, you know, uh, conservatives seem to get sometimes when

00:38:12.600 they see people, you know, taking a knee right at, at, at football games and they call that, you know,

00:38:18.600 not being patriotic. How come nobody ever says, you know, wanting to suspend, you know, the constitution,

00:38:24.020 to overthrow the results of an election? How come nobody ever says that's not patriotic?

00:38:28.640 Yeah. Well, I mean, there's no question. I don't know what specific you're, you're referring to,

00:38:32.540 but I've seen Trump truth social posts that speak to exactly what you are saying. I don't know about

00:38:38.500 in court, but he's suggested things like that. Um, I think I'm not going to defend that. I think,

00:38:45.180 I think, but, but here's the thing. So, and I don't defend Trump's behavior after January 6th

00:38:50.480 at all. I don't think he behaved well in any way, shape or form, but I just think that there

00:38:55.540 are bigger issues. And I think if you're going to talk about actions that are extra constitutional,

00:39:00.940 there are sins, I mean, grave sins on both sides, but especially on Biden's side, you know, this,

00:39:06.780 the end around he did on the Supreme court on some of the COVID stuff on the, uh, rent abatement,

00:39:12.560 uh, possibilities on now the student loans that he's not allowed to be doing, but he's trying to find a

00:39:17.620 way to do it anyway. I'm trying to get Trump off the ballot so that voters can't vote for him on

00:39:23.440 using the justice system for the first time in almost 250 years to go after a political opponent,

00:39:29.600 all those things. They don't make me say yay for all the stuff Trump did post January 6th,

00:39:36.100 but they, even the playing field for me more where I'm like, I'm just going to vote on who I think is

00:39:41.600 going to get the country in the best shape. I think that's what most people are, but you know,

00:39:46.860 even, even with what you said just now, it's kind of like the Spider-Man meme, right? Because

00:39:50.520 you know, you can say those things about president Biden, but then you point to Donald Trump in the,

00:39:55.340 in January 6th, you can also point to Donald Trump trying to find 11,000 more votes, you know,

00:40:02.020 in Georgia. And, you know, we always know voter suppression is a thing. So it's just like,

00:40:07.680 listen, man, I just don't believe in politicians, period. And, and, and as I said earlier, anybody,

00:40:12.780 anybody that, anybody that wants me to, you know, endorse a politician at this point,

00:40:19.080 then y'all have to put out some better candidates and put out some people that I believe in,

00:40:24.000 because I don't believe in any of them. But to your point, I'm not sitting out the election

00:40:29.240 in November, which is something that I would also like to just put on record. I've never told anybody

00:40:35.060 not to vote. Now, I've had conversations with people and I've said, I've, I understand why people

00:40:40.480 don't want to, but I think that you should still get out there and vote for, you know, who you think

00:40:46.820 can, can, can, can keep this country on course. You know, like for me right now, I'm, I'm, I feel

00:40:52.440 like I'm voting to preserve, you know, democracy because, you know, I, I've read Project 25. I don't

00:40:58.760 know how you feel about it, but, you know, Project 25, it's, it's very terrifying to me. And, you know,

00:41:05.120 like I said, we've seen what Donald Trump has attempted to do, to do on, on, on January 6th.

00:41:10.000 And, you know, hearing rhetoric, like I want to suspend the constitution to overthrow the results

00:41:14.760 of an election. That's, that's scary. That's not the kind of America I want to live in.

00:41:21.300 Well, what do you think about Joe Biden bragging that he's doing ends around the Supreme Court,

00:41:25.780 which is what he just said this week on this so-called student loan forgiveness,

00:41:30.620 which essentially means the truckers listening to us right now are going to have to pay off the

00:41:34.160 student loans of the rich college elites. Something he was told by the Supreme Court,

00:41:38.760 he didn't have the power to do. He's not a king and he's out there bragging that he's doing ends

00:41:42.900 around them. Notwithstanding rulings, he's forced to follow like that stuff too, is extra

00:41:48.580 constitutional. His refusal to enforce the border law, extra constitutional. I mean,

00:41:54.540 he could have been impeached for just what's happening along the Southern border alone,

00:41:57.440 not to mention him having classified documents and all the other laws that he

00:42:01.280 has allegedly broken. I look at him and I think he's got no moral high ground.

00:42:08.580 I don't think either one, you cannot talk about anybody standing on a moral high ground when

00:42:13.800 Donald Trump is on the other side. I don't think either one of them can talk about, you know,

00:42:19.980 standing on moral high ground. But, you know, when it comes to doing things like the student loan

00:42:24.180 debt, this might sound crazy, but I know this is why people like certain elected officials. I feel

00:42:31.420 like this is why some people like Trump. I think people have no problem with you bending the rules

00:42:38.080 or breaking the rules if there's a tangible benefit to it. I think that, you know, a lot of people like

00:42:46.180 Trump and they support Trump because they know Trump is willing to go hard for who he considers

00:42:53.040 his base. Now, you know, like Aaron said in Death of a Nation in my book, you know, he's convinced

00:42:59.840 these poor, you know, white voters that he is for them, but their conditions aren't getting any better

00:43:05.440 either, you know?

00:43:07.400 But how can you say that? The economy was much better under Trump and the voter, poll after poll

00:43:11.980 reflects that.

00:43:13.960 Sure, but it never trickles down to the poor. And I don't even understand why we keep acting like it

00:43:18.600 does. Like, you know, it's like you'll see people say the economy is great. You know, stocks are up.

00:43:24.100 The people I'm talking about don't have no stocks. The people I'm talking about that live in those

00:43:29.020 rural areas in most corner of South Carolina, like where I'm from, they don't know nothing about no 0.94

00:43:33.680 damn stock market. They can't see past their bills. All they're trying to do is keep some food on their 0.90

00:43:37.560 table and a roof over their head. My first, and we laugh about this.

00:43:41.960 No, but Charlie, under Biden, inflation has risen to plus 17 percent, and then some,

00:43:48.960 it's still hovering. And these people are paying almost 30 percent more on certain things like

00:43:53.560 foods and not to mention gas prices. That's all under Joe Biden because of his spendthrift ways,

00:43:58.540 because he's just dumping the people's money on all sorts of legislation, the so-called Inflation

00:44:03.240 Reduction Act, and the COVID relief that didn't have to go through when he first took over.

00:44:07.900 All those things have consequences. Trump, he kept costs low.

00:44:13.760 Listen, the poor was still poor under Trump, and Trump did convince a whole bunch of poor

00:44:20.680 white people to go out there and vote for him, but their conditions have not changed.

00:44:24.900 I guarantee you, if you were the-

00:44:26.380 I think they've changed for the worse. I'm not saying Trump solved it, but they've changed

00:44:30.180 for the worse under Joe Biden. And the thing is, they think they worry about immigration,

00:44:34.740 right? Immigrants coming in with cheap labor, taking the jobs that were available to them. 1.00

00:44:39.380 That's all happening under Joe Biden in record numbers now. The kitchen table issues that people

00:44:46.800 vote on have gotten worse under Biden, were better under Trump. There was a black focus group in,

00:44:53.480 what state was it, Steve? Was it South Carolina? No, it was Georgia. That happened just the other day.

00:44:57.840 The MSNBC went down and conducted, and they asked these black voters, and we're talking about all

00:45:01.780 voters, not just black, but why would you vote for Trump? Like, what are you thinking? Because

00:45:06.980 they said they're going to. Here's what they said. We actually cued it up.

00:45:10.880 Do each of you support Donald Trump?

00:45:13.100 I do.

00:45:13.700 Yes.

00:45:14.060 Yes, yes, for all three of you?

00:45:15.500 Yes.

00:45:15.840 Has this trial changed your opinion, even caused you to waver or question that at all?

00:45:21.060 No, it's actually caused me to support him more. I just don't believe that's a coincidence that we

00:45:30.000 have a trial happening in Atlanta. We have one happening in New York. So the question people

00:45:36.560 are beginning to ask themselves, like I did, it's like, why now?

00:45:39.580 I've talked to many people who formally identified as a Democrat. They have changed their political

00:45:44.860 persuasion to independent, and they are looking forward to voting for Trump, because now they

00:45:49.660 find something in common with a political candidate at that level.

00:45:53.800 When you say they find commonality, what is that commonality?

00:45:56.720 They have felt persecuted by the system of American injustice, and it's not a stretch for

00:46:04.480 them to think that Trump may be a victim as well.

00:46:07.300 And there was more on it, Charlemagne, where they said they think he'd be a stronger leader

00:46:12.020 in dealing with some of our adversaries.

00:46:16.760 Yeah, I can see where they would feel that way about the stronger leader part. I hate that

00:46:20.880 whole conversation about Black people are gravitating towards Trump because we've been persecuted

00:46:27.540 by the system, and he's being persecuted by that same system. No, Donald Trump is a person

00:46:32.640 who has reaped the benefits of that system. He's a white, male, rich, privileged man. That is the

00:46:39.060 reason that these trials have even taken so long to happen, because they were even dragging their

00:46:43.960 feet. America has no system in place to even prosecute a person like Donald Trump. They never

00:46:51.280 thought that they would have to do that. A former president of the United States of America?

00:46:55.600 Like, no. So I disagree with all of that. I disagree with all of that wholeheartedly.

00:47:02.980 Now, I do feel, if you ask me why people, you know, the Black people, some Black people I know

00:47:08.500 have gravitated towards Trump, you know, a lot of them talk about money, right? Like, they talk

00:47:14.020 about the stimulus checks, and they talk about, you know, the PPP loans, right? And what I would tell

00:47:19.220 them is, yeah, you got some extra money in your pocket, but at what cost? At what cost? Because

00:47:25.640 think about the circumstances that happened in order for you to get that money in your pocket.

00:47:31.180 Millions of people had to die because of COVID, because of, you know, Donald Trump's poor planning

00:47:36.660 in regards to COVID, of him getting rid of, you know, pandemic teams.

00:47:39.700 It's a stretch to blame COVID on him. I mean, I think we have the Chinese to thank for that one. 1.00

00:47:43.400 But he did get rid of the pandemic teams that were in place to kind of, you know, at least,

00:47:47.780 at least slow down, you know, things slow down.

00:47:51.180 Oh, come on. And what do we have, Anthony Fauci? I think that's a fair thing to blame on Trump,

00:47:55.800 because he should have turped that guy out long before.

00:47:58.220 I'm just saying, I feel, I think Trump could have handled COVID better. And I don't want to see,

00:48:03.440 I do, I want more, I do, I want more Americans to get more money in their pocket, but, you know,

00:48:08.800 not at the expense of millions of people dying because of, let's just say, poor planning from

00:48:13.980 the government. And you have to say the administration that was in place at that time,

00:48:18.740 because it was the Trump administration in place during that time.

00:48:21.540 All right, well, we'll put a pin in that one. And yeah, going back over COVID is just a bummer

00:48:26.140 in general, but there is a lot more to discuss. You've got a busy day ahead promoting the book,

00:48:30.380 and I wish you all the best on it. To be continued, I hope. Yes?

00:48:33.800 Yes, that's why I like, but that's why I like these conversations. That was not small talk.

00:48:37.420 We did not have small talk the last 10 minutes. And we disagreed and didn't disrespect each other

00:48:43.340 in no way, shape, or form. We had conversation. It wasn't confrontation. Can't America learn

00:48:48.240 something from this, Megan? Yes. Right on. All right. Don't forget, buy the book today.

00:48:54.440 It's called Get Honest or Die Lying by Charlemagne Tha God. It's fascinating, as you can tell, is he.

00:49:01.640 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - June 19, 2024

He'll NEVER Endorse Biden Again ｜ Charlamagne tha God x Megyn Kelly - The FULL Interview

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