The Megyn Kelly Show - Intermittent Fasting - What You Need To Know, with Cynthia Thurlow

00:00:00.520 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:00:11.820 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:14.900 Today on the program, intermittent fasting.

00:00:17.920 Should you be trying this? I highly recommend it and I absolutely love it.

00:00:21.780 For my body, it has been transformational.

00:00:24.960 And Cynthia Thurlow feels the same.

00:00:26.540 She's a nurse practitioner, she's an expert in intermittent fasting, and she's a nutrition expert as well.

00:00:32.160 And she will walk you through what it is, how you do it, how you prepare for it, and what happens if you falter.

00:00:38.660 And when you do it and then you're in your eating window, what should you eat?

00:00:42.820 Can you eat normally? I do.

00:00:45.240 And we'll sort of get into who shouldn't, who might, and sort of what the benefits of it are.

00:00:51.880 Because it's not just your shape.

00:00:53.640 It's really been impactful in my own life.

00:00:55.500 And what I love about it is, you don't feel like you're dieting.

00:00:57.620 When you're eating, it's not like you can go totally nuts, but you can have big meals.

00:01:03.060 And you can leave your table feeling totally sated.

00:01:07.720 And that's not always the case, you know, when you're watching your weight or when you're trying to lose weight in particular.

00:01:12.740 Anyway, we're going to get into all of it and some extra sort of health tips for all of us as we sit here midsummer.

00:01:19.000 Women, men, could help your sex life too.

00:01:21.480 So there's a lot to go over, and we'll do that with Cynthia in one minute.

00:01:31.300 Cynthia, hi. How are you?

00:01:33.440 Good. How are you?

00:01:34.480 It's so nice to connect with you.

00:01:36.260 Likewise. I'm so excited for this discussion.

00:01:38.280 I have been doing this intermittent fasting for a few years now, and I absolutely love it.

00:01:45.260 And I did see your viral TED Talk, and I was like, this woman knows what she's talking about.

00:01:50.080 You're a very effective communicator and advocate for this method.

00:01:54.180 So there's so much I want to get into.

00:01:55.800 But can we start with what brought you personally to intermittent fasting?

00:01:59.680 That's a great question.

00:02:00.620 You know, I think on so many levels, I have always been really interested in, you know, health and wellness, you know, trained as a nurse practitioner working in cardiology.

00:02:09.860 I was able to see what was not working for many, many people.

00:02:13.840 And I think it was probably close to the time that I was in my early 40s, and I started to see changes in my own body that definitely impacted my ability to, you know, maintain body, you know, body composition and, you know, just be, you know, healthy in my own skin.

00:02:31.940 And so on many levels, I think I really came to it out of curiosity initially, you know, I read Jason Fung's book and felt that, you know, if there are other, you know, Western medicine trained providers that are really advocating for a strategy that's been around since biblical times, that it's probably something that I can consider myself.

00:02:51.680 And so initially, the four, I was really selfish, it was to, you know, kind of, feel like I had some control over some of the changes that were happening in my early 40s.

00:03:02.600 And then I felt so good, I intrinsically felt more energetic, I had much more mental clarity.

00:03:09.620 And then I started thinking that this might be a great strategy to use with patients, and then with my own clients.

00:03:16.080 And so that's initially how I started, but really, it was happenstance.

00:03:19.940 And, you know, prior to that, you know, I certainly, you know, living in a very, you know, diverse area of the country, I certainly had lots of patients who practiced fasting as part of their religious rituals.

00:03:34.580 And so it was something that was not, you know, uncommon for us to discuss, but it was certainly not something I thought I would be doing on a daily basis moving forward.

00:03:43.100 But I'm so delighted that I found the strategy, and obviously, I'm a huge proponent of it.

00:03:47.760 Yes. That's a good point. You know, I, I live on the Upper West Side of Manhattan, and I live in a building that's most mostly Orthodox Jewish people, and they fast all the time.

00:03:56.940 And in my religion, Catholicism, we never have to fast. At least, I don't think so. I don't know all the rules perfectly.

00:04:02.400 But I've never been told that I need to fast as a Catholic. So I never even thought I could do it. I mean, like, why would you do that to yourself? But like you, as I got into my late 40s, I went to my doctor and I said, you know, it used to be that if I were two or three pounds up, I would just watch what I ate for a week or two, and it'd be gone.

00:04:21.680 And I'm noticing that's no longer the case. And he said, Yeah, he said, How old are you now? And I think at the time, I was 46 or 47. And he goes, Yeah, you're actually gonna have to try now.

00:04:31.460 And I'm like, Oh, okay. You know, and he's like, he goes, And then once you get into your 50s, you won't be able to eat at all. He was joking, right? But he's, he's talking about what naturally happens, especially to women, but to women and men.

00:04:43.020 And as we get older, our metabolism slows, and it's much harder to keep off the pounds, even though you're not necessarily eating more.

00:04:50.520 Yeah, it is a sad fact of nature that there are lots of physiologic things that change in our bodies. As we're getting older, I always think about the fact that we become more likely to become insulin resistant as we get closer to menopause.

00:05:06.220 You know, certainly we start losing lean muscle mass, and that is a normal function of aging unless we work against it.

00:05:11.880 And so on so many levels, you know, your doctor is right. And unfortunately, that the game changes, if you will, what I could do in my 20s and 30s, I definitely can't do in my 40s. And as I get creeping closer to 50, same, same situation. So it's nice to know that there are opportunities where we feel like we have some control over things that we otherwise have no control over.

00:05:34.520 Well, and he was saying to me what you said, too, which is in your 50s and 60s, the average woman gains one and a half pounds a year, right? A year, which in one year, that may not be a big deal.

00:05:46.500 But over the course of 20 years, that's a major change in your body weight and your appearance and the way you feel. So his point was, you got to stay on top of it. Don't you know, like that one and a half pounds in one year actually does matter because it adds up.

00:06:00.960 And that's really when I started to take a look at this. I'm like, okay, I don't want to diet. I don't really want to diet. So what what can I do? And intermittent fasting, it wasn't as hard as I thought it was going to be.

00:06:14.040 I really thought it was going to be torture. But I and I follow the 16 eight method, which we'll get to and I think that's totally doable for people who even for people who are like, I couldn't possibly fast. But there's all sorts of ways that you can go about it. All right. So let's just talk about before we get to how you do it, the benefits for men and women, like what what will it do other than watch your weight, right and control weight, you can use it for weight loss or just weight, weight maintenance. But there's a lot of other benefits.

00:06:40.580 I agree. So body composition, I always say that that's what brings people to intermittent fasting is they want to lose weight, but they stay for all the other benefits. So we know that we get improved mental clarity, because we have lowered insulin levels. For many people, they're surprised at how much more productive their mornings are. So improve mental clarity, what do you mean lowered insulin levels? And before you said we can get insulin resistant as we get older. So can you just talk about insulin for a second?

00:07:06.240 Yeah, yeah. So insulin is a hormone. It's not a bad hormone. But it's a hormone that we want to master. And we want to ensure that we're not secreting insulin all day long, which is kind of aligned with this methodology slash dogma that many of us were raised with that you want to eat many meals and snacks. And that's how you are able to keep your metabolic fire going. It couldn't be farther from the truth. And so what happens when we're eating frequently throughout the day, whether it's sugar sweetened beverages,

00:07:36.080 whether it is snacks and mini meals, what we are doing is we are secreting insulin more frequently. And with secreting insulin more frequently, what we're essentially doing is we shut off fat burning. And so what happens with intermittent fasting is you're eating less frequently. So you are using less insulin. And when you keep insulin low, it allows your body to use fat as a form of energy.

00:07:59.920 And that is a really important principle for people to understand in a metabolically unhealthy population like we have. I think the latest statistic was 88% of Americans are metabolically unhealthy, which means they're either insulin resistant or obese or overweight.

00:08:14.960 You really want to kind of embrace strategies that will try to keep your insulin levels better balanced. And one of those is just decreasing meal frequency and not snacking. So each one of those Starbucks, you know, people think of, and I don't mean to call it on Starbucks, but you know, there's sugary coffee beverages that are more like desserts. If you're having a couple of those a day in between meals, you're really setting yourself up for not being able to support, you know, support your body the way that it's designed to thrive.

00:08:42.280 I didn't realize that. I didn't realize that. So you're saying not only should we be doing the intermittent fasting where you go a certain number of hours without eating anything. But you're saying even when you're in your eating window, you should not be snacking in between meals.

00:08:56.500 No, because really, if you get your meals properly put together, meaning, you know, a certain amount of animal protein or plant based protein, depending on who you are, with some healthy fats, you should be satiated from lunch to dinner, you shouldn't be getting hungry in between. And if you are, it just means that you need to increase your protein portion at your next meal.

00:09:19.060 And so a lot of what I talk about is just helping people understand what macronutrients are, which is protein, fat and carbs, so that they can structure their meals properly. So they're not getting hungry in between meals. And I feel on many levels, we've done ourselves a disservice telling people snacks and mini meals are the way to go, because that just contributes to that degree of metabolic inflexibility, because your insulin levels aren't being managed properly.

00:09:44.000 And you're not tapping into your fat reserves the way you could be that that could be fueling your walk around town. Instead, you're using that insulin that you got from your little snack. Okay, so keep going with the with the benefits, sharper mental acuity, which I can say I have experienced that on intermittent fasting, I thought it would be the opposite. I thought, you know how if you go too long, without eating, they say, Oh, your blood sugar drops, and then you get a little cloudy that that that's happened to me. But on intermittent fasting, I have the opposite. I it's almost like a fight or flight.

00:10:13.540 Feeling with your brain where it gets extra tuned in. Yeah. And that's absolutely related to the ketones that are produced in our in cross the blood brain barrier, which we can dive into. But in terms of other benefits, we know that you get improved biophysical markers. So while you're fasted, you're going to be improving your blood sugar levels, you're going to be improving your blood pressure, you have the ability to ultimately improve lab values that are done through your private primary care providers office or specialist

00:10:43.300 office. We know that it helps reduce our, our likelihood of developing things like neurodegenerative disorders could be Parkinson's type three diabetes, which is Alzheimer's and another, another thing that we are more at risk for as we make that midlife transition.

00:11:00.300 We know on many levels that for many people, it helps keep their hormones better balanced. So for many women or men that are going through these middle age changes, it helps with balancing. I touched on insulin already, but it helps balancing sex hormones. It can be very, very beneficial in helping people sleep better. I find that a lot of people that are experiencing sleep disorders, when they start fasting, that can be improved upon because they're not eating so close to bedtime.

00:11:28.100 Their insulin, their insulin and blood sugar are better balanced. So they're not waking up in the middle of the night. I mean, those are some of the key things that we like to focus on. And one of the kind of nerdy science terms that I think everyone that fast should really be familiar with is autophagy. And so this is this waste and recycling process that goes on when we are in a fasted state and our bodies, when we start eating, it kind of down regulates, kind of stops that autophagy process.

00:11:55.460 So when you think about the fact, by the time we hit the age of 40, we have plenty of, you know, it's kind of like tires on a car over a period of time, the tires get worn out and we replace the tires. And so when we're not eating, our body is able to go in and scavenge up disease and disordered cells that we need to get rid of.

00:12:13.200 It's an efficiency process. But if we're eating more frequently, our body isn't able to go in and do that cleanup. It's almost like it takes out the garbage, but we can't take out the garbage if we're eating too frequently.

00:12:24.320 So autophagy is a really key principle that I think is really important for people to understand and sometimes can help reinforce why eating less often really is something of tremendous benefit for our health.

00:12:35.760 Well, that's the thing is like you you think of fasting as something that would be painful and potentially bad for you, uncomfortable. And the more I looked at it, the more I read articles and other thoughts saying, look, this is how our ancestors used to live.

00:12:50.440 You know, they didn't have pantries full of food and refrigerators full of food. They might go two days between meals. And that was OK. And if you try to reframe the thought of fasting in your mind is not this painful, punishing thing, but something that is totally natural that you can get through and that the feeling of hunger doesn't have to be a bad feeling.

00:13:12.880 It's it's it's more manageable. And I'm trying to I want to be careful because I certainly don't want to encourage eating disorders. Right. That's something I don't want to sort of get into the messaging that anorexics give to themselves.

00:13:23.860 But I do think as a healthy person of a healthy body weight, that mind shift has helped me. So I don't want to be encouraging people to lean into that. I'm not going to eat mindset. But but that's that's different than looking than reframing fasting.

00:13:38.200 Well, and I think it's important for people to understand that fasting just means you're eating less often. You're still eating.

00:13:44.960 I do think that there is definitely and I see it on social media. There are certainly women that hide their eating disorder with intermittent under the guise of intermittent fasting.

00:13:54.240 So, you know, when I when I talk to people about fasting, being very clear about who it's appropriate for and who it is not, but also making people understand that you are eventually going to break the fast, eat a good meal, probably eat a second meal, depending on the schedule that you embrace.

00:14:13.240 But we are not suggesting that people starve themselves, that they not provide their bodies with sufficient nutrients.

00:14:20.200 That's not what this is about. And much to your point, when we look at the ancestral health perspective, this is how our bodies are designed to thrive, because food scarcity was a real issue.

00:14:29.420 So, you know, before there were supermarkets and grocery stores and convenience stores and ordering things on Amazon Prime that show up at your house the same day prior to that, you know, 150 plus years ago or even longer.

00:14:42.880 Sometimes people, if they had a if they had a kill, maybe they they shot a deer and they they had meat and then they went through a period of time where they might have just had, you know, twigs and berries.

00:14:53.040 And I'm not exaggerating that, you know, food scarcity was a real issue.

00:14:56.280 So if our bodies weren't designed to be able to be fat adapted, if you will, tap into fat stores for energy, we would not have sustained.

00:15:05.760 We would not have been able to survive.

00:15:07.200 So on many levels, we've gotten. Yeah, we've gotten very comfortable as a society because we have quick access to food all the time.

00:15:15.400 But that doesn't mean that we should be eating all the time.

00:15:17.880 So I'm going to get to the plans that are available and like how you do it in one second.

00:15:22.020 But I do want to ask you about metabolism, because, you know, we've all we've all been told you can't you can't go long periods without eating because it will slow down your metabolism.

00:15:32.600 You have to have breakfast every day because that's what jumpstarts your metabolism for the day.

00:15:37.360 Otherwise, your body thinks it's starving and it goes into starvation preservation mode where it lowers the number of calories it's going to burn and starts to protect you as though you're in the Arctic with zero access to food for the next two weeks.

00:15:49.860 I believed that for a long, long time.

00:15:52.040 And it wasn't until I started to do intermittent fasting that I was like, I don't understand the science, but that turns out to be BS because I can see the pounds coming off.

00:15:59.780 Yeah, I mean, it's it's unfortunate that even as a health care professional, there are many of us that are still touting, you know, bad information.

00:16:08.340 And we've really counseled our patients improperly with regard to meal frequency.

00:16:13.980 And so I think one of the things that's really interesting is that when people start fasting as it pertains to metabolism, is that we get these secretion of counter regulatory hormones that will help suppress that hunger cue.

00:16:28.420 So you're not going to feel like you're starving.

00:16:29.880 And much to your point, you said, you know, I didn't think I would be able to do this at first.

00:16:33.180 And I actually started to feel really good.

00:16:34.940 And that's done for a number of reasons.

00:16:38.600 You know, we know that, you know, one of the other things that happens while we're fasted is we get secretion of a hormone called growth hormone.

00:16:45.820 And, you know, that really is potentiated when we are fasting.

00:16:51.220 And so on many levels, I like what you said, growth hormone, which, you know, helps us maintain muscle.

00:16:56.760 So the more muscle mass we have, the more calories we're able to actually consume or macros, depending on how you want to look at it.

00:17:04.360 And that in and of itself helps with our metabolism.

00:17:07.760 So I always like to remind people that our body is very smart and, you know, has the ability to flex in and out, meaning that if we're eating less frequently, but we're still getting a proper amount of macronutrients in during our feeding window,

00:17:22.580 we're actually making our body more efficient, more fuel efficient, we're actually supporting that metabolism as opposed to making it harder to work.

00:17:30.980 It's almost like we put more fuel efficient gas in our car.

00:17:35.080 And on many levels, I think that a lot of people, until they actually practice intermittent fasting, they don't fully understand that.

00:17:41.740 But the mechanics of our body really get gunked up if we're eating too frequently.

00:17:46.980 And that can make the metabolism piece have to work a whole lot harder, be a whole lot less efficient.

00:17:51.320 And if you're getting closer to, you know, 40s and beyond, you'll start to realize that things are not working as efficiently as they once did.

00:18:00.580 All right. Up next, what are the plans that are available to you?

00:18:04.340 What how can you do intermittent fasting and what are the most popular ways?

00:18:08.180 That's right after this.

00:18:12.320 Let's say I do intermittent fasting five days of the week and two days of the week.

00:18:16.240 I don't do it. I have breakfast.

00:18:17.840 I'm eating during what would not be considered an eating window.

00:18:20.900 That doesn't come back on me.

00:18:22.440 I have noticed, like, if I'm not trying to lose weight, if I'm just trying to maintain, I can do that.

00:18:26.920 I can not intermittent fast a couple of days of the week.

00:18:29.160 And it's not like my body's like, whoa, I have I had a breakfast.

00:18:32.300 And suddenly you see that pound on the scale.

00:18:34.180 It seems like you make your body more efficient in dealing with food overall.

00:18:40.360 OK, so let's get to the plans.

00:18:42.620 Like what are let's go through maybe the top three most popular plans and what would be like the most popular you think that people are doing?

00:18:50.340 I would think right now, I think it's probably between like a 16, eight or an 18, six, which means 16 hours or 18 hours fasted with a six or an eight hour feeding window.

00:19:01.040 I see a lot of people doing OMAD, which is one meal a day.

00:19:04.540 And that seems to be popular for a variety of reasons.

00:19:07.720 And I have some concerns about that long term.

00:19:10.360 But I would say those are probably the two most popular, I think, because they're accessible.

00:19:14.600 I think it's harder for people to wrap their heads around doing every other day fasting, per se, or doing a 5-2, which generally means people are consuming a normal meal frequency over five days.

00:19:28.540 And then two days, they have what I refer to as a subcaloric deficit, a significant one for men.

00:19:35.240 It's less than 600 calories per day and women less than 500.

00:19:38.860 So I think that the 16, eight or 18, six and the OMAD seem to be what's most popular, certainly with my own clients and, you know, people that I interact with online.

00:19:48.920 So I do the 16, eight and I really like it because I stop eating at 8 p.m. and then I can eat again at noon.

00:19:55.900 And for me and my own lifestyle, that works perfectly.

00:19:58.960 It's not hard to not eat after eight.

00:20:01.020 You know, you can have whatever.

00:20:02.520 You can have a bunch of tea.

00:20:03.640 You can have water.

00:20:04.740 You can have seltzer or whatever.

00:20:06.620 Sometimes I will have a glass of wine.

00:20:08.020 We'll get to that.

00:20:08.800 But so it's not always hardcore zero calories for me.

00:20:12.720 But then I can make it.

00:20:13.700 The morning, I would say between 10 and 12 is the toughest time.

00:20:17.120 But you can get, you know, you can wake up.

00:20:18.620 You can have coffee.

00:20:19.320 You can have tea.

00:20:20.320 And then you're kind of through the morning.

00:20:22.180 And then it's just that last two hours like that.

00:20:24.280 So you're really, I almost feel like the whole challenge of intermittent fasting for me just

00:20:27.600 comes down to those two hours.

00:20:29.800 And you can suck that up.

00:20:31.060 Like anybody can suck that up, especially if you get out of the house, you go for a bike

00:20:33.900 ride or you go do something, you get yourself away from the food before you know it, it's

00:20:37.100 noon and you're done.

00:20:38.460 Right.

00:20:38.720 And I think, you know, there's a couple of things in there, you know, giving ourselves

00:20:41.740 grace because you may have a day where you break your fast earlier and that's totally

00:20:46.220 okay.

00:20:46.920 You may also have a day that's a little busier and you may realize it's 1.30 and you haven't

00:20:51.140 eaten.

00:20:51.380 And that's okay as well.

00:20:53.060 You know, one of the key things with fasting that I think is important for people to understand

00:20:56.820 is we want to be flexible, you know, give ourselves grace, acknowledge our schedule.

00:21:01.300 It may not look the same day to day.

00:21:02.900 And that is totally okay.

00:21:04.780 Your schedule 12 to eight works really well with your lifestyle.

00:21:07.780 And for someone else, they may break their fast at 10 and they close their feeding window

00:21:11.820 earlier.

00:21:12.280 And that's okay as well.

00:21:13.320 I have quite a few people who prefer to do like a two, you know, they'll, they'll, they

00:21:19.400 actually do ship work, a lot of healthcare professionals.

00:21:21.620 And so they, they want to adjust their, their fasting and feeding windows.

00:21:25.660 And the beautiful thing is you can flex that every single day if you choose to, you know,

00:21:30.840 it doesn't have to be rigid and in stone.

00:21:32.820 Some people prefer to have things be rigid and in stone and that's okay.

00:21:36.520 But there are many people who like to have a little bit of flexibility day to day.

00:21:41.180 That's certainly the way that I now practice.

00:21:43.260 And I encourage people to, you know, once you're fat adapted, once you're fuel efficient,

00:21:47.880 once your metabolism is really boring to really play around with those feeding and fasting

00:21:53.060 windows and, and get, you know, get creative because sometimes you'll find whether it's

00:21:57.680 around and as an example, special celebration vacation, you may just have overeaten.

00:22:03.760 And the next day you say to yourself, I'm not very hungry.

00:22:06.520 Well, if you're not hungry, you don't have to break your fast.

00:22:08.560 You might just have one meal.

00:22:09.600 That's where I love OMAD, like around a celebration, you've overeaten, you have one meal, close your

00:22:14.480 window and go about your day.

00:22:15.760 And the next day you get back on track.

00:22:18.140 But as a general rule, I think, you know, giving yourself the ability to be flexible with

00:22:23.960 the scheduling and to acknowledge that sometimes life happens and you just need to adjust things

00:22:29.920 accordingly.

00:22:30.380 And that's totally okay.

00:22:32.400 Exactly.

00:22:32.900 It's like, if you look at it over a 30 day window, as opposed to just the,

00:22:36.520 the seven day window of the week, it's easier.

00:22:38.400 It's like over 30 days, I'll be doing this enough times, you know, adherently, that's

00:22:45.200 not a word, but I will adhere to the program, um, enough days that this will work for me.

00:22:50.340 And I'm not going to beat myself up about the days that it doesn't like it last night.

00:22:53.260 I went out to dinner with friends, by the way, for our listeners, I went back to the friend's

00:22:57.080 house who made me the enormous martini.

00:22:58.580 And he has since gotten smaller martini glasses since I shamed him on the program, Andrew Schroeder

00:23:03.460 looking at you.

00:23:04.560 And, uh, it was much better.

00:23:05.960 It was, it was much more palatable, but you know, you go out to dinner with friends, you're

00:23:08.800 not going to stop eating at 8 PM, right?

00:23:10.220 It's like, that's not how dinner's at work.

00:23:12.640 So today I'm going to try to go a little longer before I start, um, before I eat at noon, but

00:23:18.000 here's a question I have for you.

00:23:19.140 So what qualifies as fasting?

00:23:22.780 Because I know I've read your stuff that you don't think we should have cream in our

00:23:26.720 coffee and obviously sugar.

00:23:28.460 Um, I will say I'm, I do have cream in my coffee.

00:23:32.480 And as I said, sometimes I'll have a little something after my eating window, not often,

00:23:36.800 but sometimes I will, or sometimes in the morning, I don't know why, but I'll have a

00:23:40.360 couple of Ritz crackers, which I know it's not the right thing, but I will.

00:23:44.820 And it still works.

00:23:46.060 So I'm like, I don't understand why it's still working, even though I I'm not totally

00:23:50.420 fasting.

00:23:51.500 Well, it goes back to giving yourself grace because we're all human and we're not robots.

00:23:55.880 And, and that's a perfect example of, you know, you wanted to have a couple of crackers,

00:23:59.180 you had a couple of crackers, you had some cream in your coffee.

00:24:01.520 Um, I think it's important to define what your goals are, because if someone is really

00:24:06.660 struggling with weight loss, they've hit a plateau, they come to intermittent fasting,

00:24:10.640 those additional calories, um, might make a difference for them.

00:24:15.280 That may, you know, that may push them out of a position where they're maximizing, you

00:24:21.060 know, fat burning.

00:24:21.680 And I would imagine that you, because you've been doing this for a while, your body's very

00:24:25.300 efficient.

00:24:25.640 So those couple of crackers or the cream in your coffee doesn't make a difference.

00:24:28.780 So really focusing on, on what your goals are and then, you know, differentiating between

00:24:33.760 what is clean fasting and what is not.

00:24:35.880 And it does, there's no judgment here.

00:24:37.520 It's just differentiating that, you know, cream, although it does not secrete, uh, is

00:24:44.520 not going to impact your blood sugar.

00:24:45.940 It does, it is insulinemic, meaning it will secrete insulin.

00:24:49.500 And that, and that is a by-product of dairy products.

00:24:52.320 Um, and that's just a scientific fact.

00:24:54.580 So when people are dealing with nuances and there's a lot of nuances to fasting, I want

00:24:59.280 to be really clear about that, you know, defining like what your goals are, whether it's a bulletproof

00:25:04.680 coffee, and there are a lot of people that come to me that are having bulletproof coffees.

00:25:08.080 I'm like, Hey, you know, that's absolutely fine.

00:25:10.420 You know, it's something that Dave Asprey kind of created, but is very big within the

00:25:17.220 fitness world.

00:25:17.900 And so essentially what it is, is coffee typically with MCT oil and then butter.

00:25:24.160 And so it's a fatty coffee for a lot of people.

00:25:27.900 Yeah.

00:25:28.380 So for a lot of people that's, if they're coming from being a couch potato and on a standard

00:25:31.980 American diet, it can be what I refer to affectionately as a crutch that can help them

00:25:36.800 get to a point where they can fast for longer.

00:25:39.060 And so, again, there's no judgment.

00:25:40.900 I always like people just to understand MCT oil is processed a little differently in our

00:25:44.860 bodies than butter and cream and things like that.

00:25:48.240 So it's always coming from a place of education, but, you know, for many people, those little

00:25:53.300 incidentals can, you know, differentiate between clean fasting, which is water, unflavored

00:25:59.500 electrolytes, bitter teas, coffee, plain coffee and dirty fasting, which is kind of this muddied

00:26:05.100 area where, you know, people will sometimes take, um, protein powder or collagen peptides

00:26:10.360 or, um, different types of fats in their coffees or their teas.

00:26:13.960 And I'm like, as long as you understand, you know, what your goals are, what your focus

00:26:17.140 is, um, you know, I'm a total realist, but clean fasting is really just the, you know,

00:26:23.580 plain coffee, bitter teas, water with no sweeteners, um, and electrolytes and differentiates.

00:26:29.840 Bitter teas.

00:26:30.740 Um, so really like black tea, green tea, um, they're really bitter.

00:26:35.000 And, and so the, the differentiators, I think most Americans probably prefer sweeter teas.

00:26:41.300 And so, you know, when you look at celestial seasonings side box of their apple spice, so

00:26:47.180 it's got apple in it, which is going to break your fast.

00:26:49.400 It probably has, um, some sweeteners in it, which will break your fast.

00:26:53.040 And so just explaining to people that when I'm talking about bitter teas, I'm really talking

00:26:56.920 about teas that are not going to be sweet.

00:26:58.560 And they're certainly not going to be sweet on your tongue.

00:27:00.220 Peppermint tea.

00:27:00.920 That's what I drink.

00:27:01.840 Um, you know, technically, you know, when you're looking at like research, um, there's

00:27:06.500 again, a lot of nuances.

00:27:07.640 So things like, um, cinnamon will not break a facet.

00:27:11.540 Actually, there's actually evidence to show it kind of boost insulin sensitivity.

00:27:15.320 Um, you know, certain types of mushrooms, and I'm not referring to wacky mushrooms or referring

00:27:20.320 to medicinal mushrooms, like reishi and shaga lines main, um, can be consumed while fasting

00:27:26.360 and technically won't break your fast.

00:27:28.480 Peppermint is, it's my understanding that peppermint technically is like a gray area.

00:27:33.640 I mean, the way that I look at it is what does the side of the box say?

00:27:37.540 If it's just peppermint, probably okay.

00:27:41.420 But if it has artificial, when it says like natural flavors, I never know what that means.

00:27:46.340 And it's, it's a way that these food manufacturers are able to hide, um, the, the real ingredients.

00:27:52.100 They don't have to disclose it if they use natural flavors.

00:27:54.560 So, so even if it doesn't have calories, but you have to be concerned if it has something

00:28:01.380 in there other than, I don't know, just pure peppermint.

00:28:04.960 Well, I think what it comes down to is, you know, what are your goals?

00:28:08.600 Because, you know, we can make the argument that diet sodas technically have no calories,

00:28:13.400 but we know that they do have, depending on the artificial sweetener that's used has a

00:28:18.540 negative net impact on the gut microbiome and potentially insulin.

00:28:23.140 So, uh, there, there's a lot of nuances here and, and, you know, we can certainly unpack

00:28:28.440 that, but it's really just, what are your goals?

00:28:31.400 And I think for you, you know, what I'm hearing is that, you know, you're at a healthy weight

00:28:36.240 and you are doing really well with fasting.

00:28:38.880 And so like a peppermint tea, I wouldn't worry about, um, if you were struggling, if you were

00:28:43.640 saying, Hey, Cynthia, I've got five to 10 pounds.

00:28:45.540 I can't get rid of, I would say the Ritz cracker and the cream probably need to go.

00:28:49.480 The peppermint.

00:28:50.820 I will say if I, if I really want it, like, let's say I go up a few pounds after a vacation

00:28:54.940 or something.

00:28:55.360 And then if I come back and just do it hardcore and eliminate everything, you do see a difference.

00:28:59.340 I mean, the body responds, the weight comes off.

00:29:02.080 It's funny.

00:29:02.640 Cause I'll, I'm here in New Jersey for the summer at the shore and I'll see women overweight,

00:29:08.460 trying to clearly trying to lose the weight, you know, running in the hot, hot weather, sweating.

00:29:13.300 They look so uncomfortable.

00:29:14.080 And I keep thinking to myself.

00:29:15.540 You don't have to do that.

00:29:17.380 I have something that can help you because we were so focused on cardio, cardio, cardio,

00:29:22.860 cardio, cardio, and cutting back all of our calories.

00:29:25.740 And I don't find this to be a calorie cutting kind of situation.

00:29:30.000 The meals I eat when I'm eating, it's not like I have a big Mac, but you can eat, you

00:29:35.840 can eat good portion sizes.

00:29:37.820 And you do not, I mean, I will confess, I have not been exercising for a long while now and

00:29:43.480 you wouldn't know it to look at me.

00:29:45.140 I'm not saying you should get rid of exercise, but you don't have to do all that cardio.

00:29:49.020 Well, and I think, unfortunately, this is what we have conditioned patients to believe.

00:29:53.160 Exercise more, eat less.

00:29:55.300 Chronic cardio is the way to go.

00:29:56.700 And I would argue for anyone that's over the age of 35, if you want to maintain and stay

00:30:02.100 lean through middle age and beyond, you've got to lift weights.

00:30:06.360 Like I would say there's nothing wrong with walking and I would never discourage people

00:30:10.020 from doing types of physical activity that bring them joy, whether it's bar or Pilates

00:30:15.480 or yoga or, you know, doing Tai Chi, but the chronic cardio bunnies, oh, I feel, I feel

00:30:22.200 for them because they're probably miserable.

00:30:24.100 They probably think constantly about being hungry.

00:30:26.960 They're probably counting every calorie they put in their mouths and there's just a better

00:30:30.860 way.

00:30:31.220 I agree with you so much.

00:30:32.320 I agree with you so wholeheartedly.

00:30:33.920 In fact, every time I, you know, see like a new potion or pill or powder or junk that's,

00:30:39.780 you know, touted on social media, I'm like, save your money.

00:30:42.560 Like you could, you know, embrace the strategy, even if you do it a couple of days a week,

00:30:47.640 my goodness, and you can do it for free.

00:30:49.920 You don't have to, you don't have to buy a hundred dollar powder.

00:30:54.420 You don't have to pay for a class.

00:30:55.920 You could just eat less often.

00:30:58.380 And that would have a huge net impact on your health and very beneficial ways.

00:31:02.680 And I have to say that you don't even have to take our word for it, right?

00:31:06.120 Because you just look at the soul cycle class, right?

00:31:09.660 How many women in there who do soul cycle two hours a day still are a little overweight.

00:31:16.480 Now, why is that?

00:31:17.380 They're, they're working out way more than I work out.

00:31:19.600 That's for sure.

00:31:20.640 But all that cardio tends to drive up your appetite and you overcompensate with your calories.

00:31:25.780 And I think your body, you tell me if it seems like your body gets used to it and it no longer

00:31:29.780 produces results for you.

00:31:31.100 You've just sort of raised the floor of what you need to do in a day to not gain weight,

00:31:35.480 as opposed to you're actually losing weight.

00:31:37.340 Well, I think it's a couple of things.

00:31:39.320 I used to think affectionately about friends of mine that just ran constantly.

00:31:43.840 You know, they always looked haggard by the time they were meeting their mid forties.

00:31:48.400 And I think, you know, we know that a lot of that chronic cardio drives a cortisol.

00:31:53.240 And as we are getting closer to, to menopause and beyond our bodies just don't utilize.

00:32:01.160 Uh, it doesn't respond to stress as readily as it, as it did before.

00:32:05.380 And so I would argue for anyone who wants to lose weight, you should be doing strength

00:32:09.960 training because the more muscle mass you have, the more caloric burn you have, the more

00:32:14.640 glucose reservoirs you have for what you're eating, uh, and, you know, save the time that

00:32:20.700 you're spending two hours.

00:32:21.760 If you're doing two hours of soul cycle, my goodness, unless you're training for a race,

00:32:25.140 there's really, there's really nothing that's a benefit to that.

00:32:28.960 And I'm not suggesting people be sedentary.

00:32:30.640 I like everyone to be active and to walk and to move every day, but you'd be better served

00:32:35.380 lifting weights so that you are maintaining muscle mass as you get older.

00:32:40.540 I mean, that's critically important.

00:32:42.420 Um, you know, if you look at marbled meat, I always remind people of this when you're looking

00:32:45.840 at young, uh, I'm thinking of tenderloin.

00:32:48.440 If you look at a tenderloin, there's very little fat or marbling in it.

00:32:51.500 But if you look at a fattier cut of steak, um, you know, like a, uh, porterhouse, I mean,

00:32:57.620 there's a lot of marbling in there and that's the muscle loss.

00:33:00.840 Uh, you're replacing it with fat and that's what happens to our muscles as we get older.

00:33:05.080 So less muscle mass, less calories you burn, the more you're going to struggle to lose weight.

00:33:09.680 And that's why those strategies of being a chronic cardio bunnies are not going to get

00:33:13.920 you anywhere.

00:33:14.620 Uh, and this really applies to men and women.

00:33:16.540 Uh, I see just people who it's like, my God, who's got, who's got the hours in the deck.

00:33:21.500 Now here's, so if you, if you do OMAD, right, is that what you said?

00:33:25.760 OMAD one meal a day to compensate for a day of eating too much, or let's just say you're

00:33:31.160 in your eating window.

00:33:32.640 Um, our executive producer, Steve is asking, can you, this is a quote, can you really like

00:33:37.160 have a whopper and fries and go crazy in your OMAD?

00:33:40.020 Right?

00:33:40.460 Like that a lot of people want to know that.

00:33:42.140 Is it, is it a free day?

00:33:43.740 Can you go nuts?

00:33:45.020 No, no.

00:33:45.820 In fact, I would, I would argue that the amount of seed oils and high fructose corn syrup you

00:33:51.200 consume with that big Mac is probably going to undo any good that you would be doing for

00:33:55.300 your body.

00:33:55.920 So, um, I, I'm not a big fan of like the concept of a free for all.

00:34:00.920 I think everyone has celebrations and we have fun times and whether it's alcohol or dessert

00:34:05.660 or too many carbs or whatever it is that people have indulged in, it's like, enjoy it and let it

00:34:10.700 go, but I would not want to look at OMAD as an opportunity to eat something like super

00:34:16.000 unhealthy because you probably a, won't feel all that great and be what you're doing to

00:34:19.860 your body on the other side is just so inflammatory.

00:34:23.840 Um, so OMAD typically you'll see, and I see a lot of men doing this.

00:34:28.040 They seem to be able to consume quite a bit of calories in one sitting, whereas I find

00:34:31.480 most women just don't have the, uh, the ability to do that.

00:34:35.560 So a man could sit down and maybe they have a 2,500 calorie meal.

00:34:39.540 Maybe they're having a big steak, maybe they're having an appetizer, maybe they have a glass

00:34:43.280 of wine.

00:34:44.240 I mean, they have a good size meal and then they close their feeding window.

00:34:48.020 Whereas I find women really struggle to be able to get enough macros in, in a very short,

00:34:53.380 tight feeding window, whether it's two or three hours compressed.

00:34:57.360 So, uh, no, unfortunately, Steve, I'm sorry to say, I would not recommend that you have a

00:35:01.520 big, a big Mac and a bunch of fries.

00:35:03.580 I would probably have a steak, have, um, like a nice baked potato and have like sour cream and

00:35:09.220 butter and whatever else you like in it, have, you know, a salad and vegetables, maybe a glass

00:35:13.120 of wine.

00:35:13.560 I would rather you consume more whole food sources than that big Mac.

00:35:18.480 Cause I don't think you're going to feel very well afterwards.

00:35:21.120 But, but to your point, you also don't have to just have a salad filled with vegetables

00:35:26.020 with just a small amount of oil and vinegar.

00:35:29.600 Like I can't eat like that.

00:35:31.080 I don't, I'm Italian.

00:35:32.280 I need some substantive food in my life.

00:35:35.640 And this is another thing I like about intermittent fasting is it's not like I can have pasta every

00:35:39.780 day.

00:35:40.100 Of course, I know woman in her fifties can, but as I keep trying to explain to my dog

00:35:44.620 thunder, I'm like, let me explain to you what it's like to be a female thunder.

00:35:47.580 You can't have the loaf of bread off of the counter and still maintain your girlish figure.

00:35:51.940 So she doesn't seem to care.

00:35:54.180 Um, so, but you can, you know, I, I cook for my kids and I'm not a chef, so I make very

00:35:59.220 basic things and if I want to have a little bowl of pasta, even pasta with, you know, meatballs

00:36:03.960 or whatever, I can do it.

00:36:05.460 It's not necessarily prescribed, but I can do it without it coming back to haunt me.

00:36:10.240 I don't have to have salad every day.

00:36:12.320 Right.

00:36:12.860 Right.

00:36:13.240 And I think it's really important for people to understand like, where's your sweet spot?

00:36:17.340 Meaning, you know, for me, I eat a very protein heavy, every meal I eat very protein heavy.

00:36:23.420 That's the bulk of what you'll see on my plate.

00:36:24.900 And I, I do enjoy vegetables, but I too don't want to just eat salads.

00:36:29.460 I am not sitting back in a core, like a calorie fixated state.

00:36:34.000 I just allow my hunger to kind of guide me.

00:36:36.380 And I agree with you when I go on vacation, when I have a celebration, when I have a birthday,

00:36:40.220 when I'm out with my husband and we have date night, I am not sitting back and just

00:36:44.040 sitting there eating a salad at my dinner.

00:36:46.260 So I think it's really important for people to understand, like we are eating real food.

00:36:50.140 Uh, we are not feeling like we're very restricted and I have a thing for dark chocolate.

00:36:54.860 Anyone that follows me on social media, I always say like my, my big vice in life is dark chocolate.

00:36:59.620 Um, I have a little bit of dark chocolate every day.

00:37:01.900 And I think that's important.

00:37:03.200 There's a lot of health benefits to high quality dark chocolate, but the point being that I

00:37:07.600 don't sit back and, and, you know, eat like a, a nun like existence.

00:37:11.120 I mean, I do eat real food and I do enjoy real food.

00:37:14.180 I do occasionally have some wine, although not very often anymore, but it's one of those

00:37:18.960 things where, you know, you have to find something that's sustainable.

00:37:21.820 And that's the key.

00:37:22.700 I think when we're talking about dieting, like a dieting culture is, Oh, this is short

00:37:27.340 term.

00:37:27.740 I like to think of fasting as a long game.

00:37:30.700 It's a long-term strategy for men and women.

00:37:33.640 It's a way to live a lifestyle and to be able to be flexible and enjoy your life, but also

00:37:39.420 allow yourself to, uh, really kind of get intrinsically connected with hunger to get really

00:37:45.820 intrinsically connected with how your body works.

00:37:48.760 Um, I know a lot of people are very disconnected from their bodies and I think it's just important

00:37:52.400 for people to understand that there's more to living than counting calories and doing

00:37:57.760 chronic cardio.

00:37:59.000 I remember, um, when I was at Fox, there was a, an anchor there who I, I loved, and she was

00:38:03.420 always so thin.

00:38:04.160 She had all these children.

00:38:05.200 I'm like, how, how are you doing it?

00:38:06.860 Like, how can you have all those kids and be that thin?

00:38:09.300 And her approach was, she says, I, I eat whatever I want the whole day.

00:38:15.300 Like I, I have whatever I want for breakfast, dinner, uh, and lunch, but I only take three

00:38:20.100 bites of it.

00:38:21.020 So I was like, okay, I'll try it.

00:38:23.260 You know, you'll try anything.

00:38:24.120 And, um, I'm like, I'm going to try it.

00:38:26.100 So flash forward to, you know, day two.

00:38:28.960 And I was taking the most obnoxious, like the biggest bites of everything.

00:38:35.720 Like it was disgusting.

00:38:37.340 The amount of food I try to shove in my mouth out of those three bites.

00:38:40.680 So people, most people will try anything that when I abandoned, probably day two.

00:38:47.000 Up next, the 24 hour fast.

00:38:49.580 I tried it.

00:38:51.060 How'd that go?

00:38:52.040 We'll talk about it next.

00:38:53.340 Uh, but before we get to that, I want to bring you a segment.

00:38:56.240 We have here a feature on the MK show called from the archives.

00:38:59.460 And this is our feature where we look back in our growing library now of episodes and

00:39:03.700 bring you something that we feel you need to hear.

00:39:05.780 We want to draw your attention to it.

00:39:07.120 If you've missed it, or you might want to listen to it again because it's become particularly

00:39:10.640 relevant today.

00:39:11.820 We're going to December of last year and episode 33.

00:39:15.800 I can't believe Andrew Sullivan was on an episode 33 and now we're up at like 130 something.

00:39:21.080 That's crazy.

00:39:22.200 Uh, Andrew Sullivan is fascinating.

00:39:23.920 He is so brilliant.

00:39:25.600 Um, and he had just launched his new sub stack publication at the time, which has been great

00:39:31.020 recently, particularly his piece earlier this month.

00:39:33.680 What happened to you?

00:39:35.220 You remember I recommended this when we had our critical race theory debate.

00:39:37.860 If you haven't gone back and read that on his sub stack, please do it.

00:39:40.580 Google Andrew Sullivan.

00:39:41.780 What happened to you?

00:39:42.620 You will thank me.

00:39:43.800 Uh, well, shortly after the election in 2020, Sullivan was on and the conversation that we

00:39:48.400 had was going to be a great preview of the year in which we now find ourselves.

00:39:53.000 Take a listen.

00:39:53.920 Liberals, moderates, conservatives, they're all being silenced.

00:39:56.480 Most people don't feel comfortable expressing their views.

00:39:59.840 The only ones who do are the progressives.

00:40:01.460 I know you've pointed that out and like sort of the left, left progressives.

00:40:05.300 But I know you think that you wrote that you felt they were dealt an astonishing rebuke

00:40:10.560 in the last election.

00:40:12.820 How so?

00:40:14.020 The striking thing for me, Megan, I don't know whether this is true for you, but the election

00:40:19.100 results really surprised me in the way that they seem to have surprised the president,

00:40:22.840 which is that we were expecting a big wave of some sort.

00:40:27.360 Uh, that's what the polling suggested.

00:40:29.300 An eight point lead for Biden in most cases, uh, which ended up being something like four.

00:40:34.720 But what was also interesting was that the Republicans did pretty well.

00:40:39.720 I mean, they gained in the House, they're probably almost certainly going to retain the Senate,

00:40:45.440 that people turned out to be actually quite supportive of the police, not least minorities

00:40:52.360 who need the police to be protected.

00:40:54.900 That the notion that this country right now, this multicultural, chaotic, amazing, diverse place

00:41:03.300 is somehow the equivalent of a KKK-run white supremacy, which is now literally the words

00:41:10.880 used by people to describe America in 2020.

00:41:13.560 Most people don't buy it.

00:41:16.680 Um, and when they were actually given, uh, a chance to affirm some of those left ideas,

00:41:22.400 such as in California, where there was a proposal to enable the government to discriminate on the

00:41:28.440 basis of race, it went down in flames.

00:41:30.920 You saw after four years of what we were told was white supremacy, that non-white votes for

00:41:37.660 Republicans actually increased.

00:41:39.440 What you, what you found was that people, believe it or not, despite their, or whatever their

00:41:45.240 identity, have ideas of their own and they have views and they're not all identical.

00:41:51.160 That, that, that, that, that Latinos as a block is a kind of dumb idea.

00:41:55.860 Um, it's fact very diverse, rather like the old immigrants from Italy or Ireland or Poland

00:42:02.660 or, or, or, or, or Germany.

00:42:05.260 They're, they, yes, they have similarities, but they're also extremely different in their back

00:42:09.440 grounds.

00:42:10.160 And we see in many Latino voters, uh, uh, a wide variety of opinions, including those

00:42:17.180 who really don't like illegal immigration, including those who, who, uh, who want to

00:42:23.140 assimilate, want to integrate, want to succeed in America and have quite traditional, uh, American

00:42:28.980 ideas want to actually be part of this melting pot as I want.

00:42:32.620 And so there was really, you realize that a lot of this notion that we live in this oppressive

00:42:39.240 racist society is entirely something concocted in the heads of very wealthy left liberals.

00:42:45.180 And in reality, although obviously in every society, prejudice exists, bias exists, racism

00:42:52.320 exists, but America actually is a story of overcoming of that rather than the entrenchment

00:42:58.500 of it.

00:42:59.500 A Sullivan is certainly no conservative, and yet he and I see eye to eye on so much these

00:43:04.200 days, while the woke progressive left takes more and more power in our culture.

00:43:08.980 It's really disturbing.

00:43:10.100 We, we've got to fight back.

00:43:11.460 And a preview, Andrew Sullivan's going to be back with us next month.

00:43:14.780 And in the meantime, we will keep bringing you clips to listen to from the archives.

00:43:18.900 And now back to Cynthia right after this.

00:43:21.020 Okay, let's talk about the other options.

00:43:27.900 If you don't want to do, um, 16, eight or 18, six, um, what's the next most popular?

00:43:34.980 I would probably say when people are dipping their toe into the proverbial intermittent fasting

00:43:40.460 pond, uh, people will try to do a 24 hour fast.

00:43:43.600 They'll just say, I'm going to fast one day a week.

00:43:46.080 And this is what I'm going to do.

00:43:47.660 And I think for a lot of people, they're surprised much to your point about when you get to the

00:43:53.040 end of your, you know, your 16 hour fasted window, they do really well until they get

00:43:58.220 to about 20 to 22 hours.

00:43:59.640 And then it becomes a mental game.

00:44:01.000 And then, you know, they'll go take a walk.

00:44:02.900 They'll distract themselves.

00:44:04.120 But I would say one 24 hour fast a week appears to be quite popular or an every other day fast.

00:44:09.720 Now I don't recommend every other day fast for people that are already at a goal weight,

00:44:14.180 but the bulk of the population, that that's not what we're talking about.

00:44:18.220 And so they actually will do really well.

00:44:20.400 You know, they'll have three meals on Monday and then they fast for 24 hours and they, you

00:44:24.900 know, they'll have two meals on Wednesday or whatever ends up working in their schedule.

00:44:29.100 And then they'll fast the following day.

00:44:30.640 And I find for a lot of people, 24 hours, do you mean, do you mean the whole day of Tuesday,

00:44:34.240 they eat nothing?

00:44:35.460 Right.

00:44:35.800 They obviously stay hydrated.

00:44:37.420 They can have coffee or tea.

00:44:38.760 And I find for some people that that suits their personality or what you'll see is some

00:44:43.540 people will do five days a week of their normal two to three meals, and then they'll fast two

00:44:48.160 days, two non-consecutive days.

00:44:50.540 And it may be that, you know, that, that is, you know, the five, two can be looked at a couple

00:44:55.540 different ways, but I oftentimes see that that is quite popular.

00:44:58.580 People feel like they they'll fast, um, during the week when it's a work day, when they're

00:45:03.260 distracted, they're not home, they're not near the refrigerator anymore.

00:45:05.860 It's not, you know, calling to them, um, that can be hugely impactful, but really kind

00:45:11.500 of figuring out.

00:45:13.000 So my doctor, I, a year into my intermittent fasting, I went to see my doctor for my annual

00:45:18.240 physical and he noticed that I had, I had lost weight and he said, what are you doing?

00:45:22.120 And I said, uh, you know, I probably should have run this by you, but I've been doing

00:45:25.360 intermittent fasting.

00:45:26.220 What do you think of that?

00:45:26.800 And I didn't know what he'd say.

00:45:27.980 And he said, I love it because I've got almost all of my patients on it.

00:45:31.220 And he asked me which one I was doing.

00:45:32.720 I told him 16, eight, and then he told me the one that he recommends.

00:45:37.260 He said, 16, eight is fine.

00:45:38.380 If it works for you, he said, but something for you to try is one day a week fasting where

00:45:45.280 he, and he said his overweight, his obese patients, he makes them do it two days a week.

00:45:49.180 But, um, he said, this is how it works.

00:45:52.120 Let's say Sunday night you eat, you eat normally on Sunday.

00:45:55.060 And then Sunday evening, he said for dinner, have only carbs.

00:45:59.920 He said, you could have five watermelons and two baked potatoes, but you can't have butter.

00:46:04.880 You can't have any oils or protein at all.

00:46:08.980 And then you're done.

00:46:10.720 He's like, then, then you go to bed.

00:46:12.500 You don't eat anything on Monday.

00:46:14.260 He said, as an, and I quote, not even a tic-tac.

00:46:17.180 So you can't have anything just to your point, the black coffee, the black teas and so on.

00:46:21.340 And then you go to sleep Monday night and you, when you wake up on Tuesday, you eat.

00:46:26.680 So you haven't eaten at all on Monday.

00:46:29.000 You haven't eaten after your dinner on Sunday night.

00:46:31.580 And he thinks if you do all carbs for that last meal on Sunday, it puts your body into

00:46:37.820 the fasting state faster because I guess your body holds onto proteins and fats longer.

00:46:44.860 It takes longer to digest, right?

00:46:46.160 It's not like your system clears out those carbs more quickly than the other two.

00:46:50.440 Now, not to put you in a position of going against my doctor, but do you, do you agree

00:46:55.060 with that?

00:46:56.140 Um, that that's interesting because I'm generally not a fan of people eating carbs by themselves,

00:47:01.540 but, uh, carbs are going to provoke an insulin response more, more strongly than protein and

00:47:09.380 certainly, um, a stronger response than what you get with fats.

00:47:13.620 Typically when I'm recommending that people do a 24 hour fast, I usually say, make sure you

00:47:18.600 have a good dinner with protein and healthy fats because it's going to be more satiating

00:47:23.560 because I feel like when you, when you give someone carbohydrates and, and watermelon's

00:47:27.600 a good example, watermelon's delicious, especially this time of the year.

00:47:30.380 But if you give someone a lot of, um, you know, simple carbohydrates, they're going to digest

00:47:35.500 them really quickly.

00:47:36.440 Yes, potentially.

00:47:38.720 Uh, but you also think about that the net, you know, um, and it really depends on the

00:47:43.360 individual.

00:47:43.820 Some people are, uh, able to, their body's able to secrete enough blood, uh, enough insulin

00:47:49.580 to bring their blood sugar down, you know, fairly quickly.

00:47:52.400 But I, I, I would not recommend that strategy given the fact that I typically counsel doing

00:47:59.340 protein and fats because that's going to keep you satiated.

00:48:02.100 And I find a lot of people do better when they're doing as they're, as they're preceding

00:48:05.840 a longer fast, making sure that they've gotten their macros, really macros again, protein,

00:48:11.040 fat, and carbs really dialed in so that they head into that next day and they're not feeling

00:48:16.500 so hungry.

00:48:17.040 I would suspect that if I ate a bunch of watermelon and slid into a 24 hour fast, I would be very,

00:48:23.480 very hungry by morning.

00:48:24.660 And that, and that's as a season faster.

00:48:27.620 Well, for sure.

00:48:28.180 I mean, I I'll tell you, I've tried it and I was hungry.

00:48:30.960 I've done it actually a few times.

00:48:32.460 I would say I've done it maybe 10 times in my, you know, the past few years and I hate

00:48:36.840 it and I, I am very hungry, but I'll tell you the worst part of it.

00:48:40.820 And it's not based on that last meal.

00:48:43.720 It's based on the 24 hour fast, that fast, unlike the 16, eight eating window makes me

00:48:49.840 feel entitled to eat whatever the hell I want for the rest of the week.

00:48:53.440 Even though, you know, intellectually, I know I can't do that.

00:48:57.400 I know it's not a pass to eat.

00:48:59.100 I can't help it.

00:49:00.700 Like on some sort of emotional level, I'm like, I went, it's not just 24 hours.

00:49:06.340 It's longer than that.

00:49:07.000 It's like more like 30 plus hours without eating.

00:49:09.860 I can, I'm having three slices of pizza.

00:49:12.480 I'm having Haagen-Dazs.

00:49:14.000 I'm having brownies.

00:49:15.500 I'm going to have cereal.

00:49:16.580 Like, and then by the end of that week, I have gained weight.

00:49:19.880 And so I've sworn off of it.

00:49:21.660 Well, and I mean, here's the thing, you know, there is a part of our brain called the amygdala

00:49:26.780 and it's our lizard brain.

00:49:29.380 It is the primordial brain.

00:49:32.000 It's the, you know, fear.

00:49:33.560 It's, it's the, the part of our brain that governs reactions, visceral emotions, et cetera.

00:49:40.680 And when we're stressed, it'll override the prefrontal cortex.

00:49:44.840 And this is important because what happens for some people when they fasted too long,

00:49:49.260 that lizard brain says, I'm starving.

00:49:51.720 I need as much food as possible.

00:49:54.440 And so what that speaks to for me, and this is a great, uh, a great indication of why

00:49:58.700 bio-individuality is so important, Megan.

00:50:01.460 Uh, this would be a great example of why I would not encourage you to push to a 24 hour

00:50:05.960 fast because your body is reacting to the fact that it believes food is scarce and therefore

00:50:12.820 it's going to do everything it can to bring in a surplus of food to make sure that this

00:50:18.140 doesn't happen again.

00:50:19.340 So when someone says to me, I tried to do a longer fast, but I overate that first meal,

00:50:23.860 or I felt like I, Oh, I binged the entire week.

00:50:26.360 I just say things I didn't normally crave or eat, et cetera.

00:50:29.040 I was like, well, maybe next time you just do a 20 hour fast, or maybe next time you do

00:50:33.260 a 19 hour fast, uh, or an 18 hour fast, because, you know, I look at that kind of behavior

00:50:39.120 and it just speaks to the fact that, you know, understanding that our brains have these

00:50:43.020 very primitive mechanisms and your brain was screaming, uh, I'm paranoid.

00:50:48.320 I'm not going to have access to food.

00:50:49.760 Like food scarcity is a problem and I need to eat as much calories as I can, as quickly

00:50:54.320 as I can to make sure this doesn't happen.

00:50:56.860 So, you know, that really lingers throughout the week too.

00:51:00.320 In my case, it's more like if I break the fast on Tuesday morning and I, and I overeat

00:51:05.000 there, I just keep overeating.

00:51:06.360 I just keep like, I, I get, I didn't eat on Monday.

00:51:08.660 I can have what I want.

00:51:09.640 It's for me, that one's no good, no bueno.

00:51:12.840 Okay.

00:51:13.280 Let's get to a couple of things that people need to know, like preparing for intermittent

00:51:18.080 fasting.

00:51:18.780 So people who have listened to this, they're like, I'm going to give it a try.

00:51:21.620 What are like the top three or four things they should do to prepare?

00:51:24.860 I would say first and foremost, stop snacking.

00:51:26.840 Um, that's number one, uh, because you want to get to a point where your body can go more

00:51:31.960 than two or three hours without food and you have to kind of, it's kind of dipping your

00:51:35.960 toe in the pond.

00:51:37.120 Number two, you really need to think about putting your meals together strategically, meaning the

00:51:42.880 most satiating macronutrient that we have is protein.

00:51:46.660 So you have to make sure that when you are no longer snacking, that you make sure each

00:51:52.080 meal, breakfast, lunch, and dinner has sufficient amount of protein.

00:51:55.300 And if you want to guide on how much protein I would imagine most, if not all of us are not

00:51:59.620 consuming enough.

00:52:00.780 It's really based on, uh, the concept of muscle centric medicine.

00:52:05.400 Um, and that is one gram, uh, per pound of ideal body weight, which means most of us,

00:52:11.640 if not all of us are not consuming enough protein.

00:52:13.560 So more protein than what you think you initially need, it will be the size of your palm, like

00:52:17.940 the, just the size of your palm, a chicken.

00:52:19.580 And I'm always like, that's too small.

00:52:20.820 I want more.

00:52:21.880 No, that's great.

00:52:22.560 That's exactly.

00:52:23.240 And I say to people, you know, push the envelope, like make sure that piece of steak or bison

00:52:28.020 or chicken or fish, et cetera, make sure that it's a good size portion because that is what's

00:52:33.000 going to keep you full.

00:52:34.140 And we want to focus on, you know, maintaining muscle.

00:52:37.020 That's super critical.

00:52:39.120 Um, so protein and healthy fats.

00:52:41.060 And sometimes they're together, like you've got a piece of salmon, there's already healthy

00:52:44.100 fats in there.

00:52:44.640 So don't go add in like five cups of macadamia nuts.

00:52:47.960 Um, that's number two.

00:52:49.140 And I think the other piece is making sure you understand what you can consume during

00:52:53.860 the day, um, in between meals or while you're fasted.

00:52:57.280 So we kind of touched on the water piece, water and electrolytes are like, you have to

00:53:01.760 put them together.

00:53:02.620 Electrolytes are important because as you move to fasting longer, you are going to lose it,

00:53:09.340 especially if you're mindful of your carbohydrate intake, you are going to lose electrolytes,

00:53:14.420 things like salt, um, potassium, magnesium in your urine.

00:53:17.680 And so you want to make sure you're replacing electrolytes.

00:53:20.660 So this is a best practice strategy.

00:53:22.840 Uh, you want to make sure that you understand you can have water with electrolytes.

00:53:26.640 You can have those bitter teas and coffee during a fasted state, and that will keep you in a

00:53:31.200 fasted state.

00:53:31.920 That's completely fine.

00:53:33.060 Water with electrolytes.

00:53:34.360 What is that?

00:53:35.560 Yeah.

00:53:35.700 So, so filtered water.

00:53:37.240 Yeah.

00:53:37.420 So you drinking water is really important.

00:53:39.820 Uh, electrolytes are the things I was kind of mentioning.

00:53:42.340 So these are, um, you know, sodium, you probably have heard some of these magnesium, potassium

00:53:47.740 chloride, and we will lose these while we are like a vitamin.

00:53:51.260 Uh, not well, so electrolytes are things that provide communication between cells.

00:53:55.800 So every cell in our body has gradients that control, uh, the influx of these electrolytes.

00:54:01.840 So when we don't have enough of them going around and for a lot of people that are new

00:54:05.360 to fasting, they will develop symptoms like headache, nausea, muscle aches.

00:54:10.500 They'll feel like they have the flu.

00:54:11.620 It's called keto flu.

00:54:12.920 And what it is in essence is that they are not replacing the electrolytes they're losing.

00:54:17.340 So to me, a best practice strategy when we're talking about fasting is electrolytes.

00:54:21.680 And there are lots of clean options that don't have sugar in them that you can consume in

00:54:26.420 a fasted state.

00:54:27.300 And I'm happy to share those with you.

00:54:29.800 Um, so I like brands like Redmond's and element, uh, they have unflavored options.

00:54:35.200 You can also consume electrolytes during your fasting window, your feeding window as well,

00:54:40.380 but I still don't get it.

00:54:41.320 I don't mean to be dense, but I don't understand what I understand if to eat food, you certain

00:54:46.860 foods would bring them to you, but are you saying this is like a supplement you put in

00:54:49.640 your tea or you get a specific kind of tea that has electrolytes in it?

00:54:53.440 Yep.

00:54:53.880 And it's really important.

00:54:54.960 And it is a differentiator for people that are fasting, especially newbies, because they

00:55:01.000 are probably making some changes to their nutrition program at the same time, and they

00:55:06.200 will lose these electrolytes in their urine.

00:55:09.060 And if they're not replacing them, uh, that can be problematic.

00:55:12.800 That can provoke some of the symptoms that I, I kind of alluded to.

00:55:15.860 And I find even experienced fasters are not using electrolytes.

00:55:20.780 And that can be the differentiator.

00:55:22.600 For example, for you, um, when you try to do that longer fast and your body was just

00:55:26.900 like, Whoa, wait a minute.

00:55:28.180 I'm, this is not working for me.

00:55:30.640 Uh, that can be a huge differentiator.

00:55:32.940 So making sure that the newbies, you know, stop snacking, restructure your meals.

00:55:38.760 The next, you know, best practice thing would be make sure you're having electrolytes with

00:55:42.780 your water.

00:55:43.240 You want to stay hydrated.

00:55:44.180 It is really, really important.

00:55:45.560 When it's summertime, uh, it's hot outside, people are perspiring left and right got to

00:55:50.460 add in electrolytes because every time we, so think about it this way, our body just

00:55:54.960 through perspiration, defecation, urination, breathing, we lose electrolytes, but it's

00:56:00.060 even exacerbated more while we're in a fasted state.

00:56:02.900 So really important that people are being mindful about these things.

00:56:06.760 Is that clear?

00:56:07.640 I know one of the things you say is, is work on sleeping better before you start intermittent

00:56:12.160 fasting and be mindful of your sleep while you're in intermittent fasting.

00:56:15.880 I have to say that is so true.

00:56:18.100 I'm sure everyone listening to this can relate.

00:56:20.100 If you get a bad night's sleep, you are going to overeat the next day.

00:56:23.520 I mean, it is like, you can take it to the bank.

00:56:26.520 So how do you do that?

00:56:28.280 Great question.

00:56:29.060 So it's all about hormones.

00:56:30.680 Uh, what I would say is probably, I know you have, you have children as I do, but when

00:56:35.700 they were toddlers and babies, we had a sleep ritual.

00:56:38.080 There was a ritual that we kind of went through that told them it was time for their bodies

00:56:41.920 to go to sleep.

00:56:43.020 And as adults, it is the same thing.

00:56:45.580 We're in this sympathetic overdrive.

00:56:47.760 We're overstimulated 24 seven.

00:56:49.640 We're under, you know, blue, we're in front of blue lights all day long.

00:56:53.040 So it's important that we are thinking about sleep way before we are getting into bed.

00:56:58.140 One of the easiest things you can do is get sunlight exposure.

00:57:01.260 First thing in the morning, five to 10 minutes without sunglasses, it will help.

00:57:05.640 Um, we have receptors in our retina that, you know, communicate with our internal body

00:57:11.180 clock.

00:57:11.700 Um, it's got a long name.

00:57:12.960 It's the SDN, um, and kind of reminds our bodies it is time to get up.

00:57:17.820 It helps support cortisol, which is that hormone that tells our bodies it's time to get up.

00:57:22.100 We secrete the, the bulk of it, uh, in the morning, and then it ebbs and flows throughout

00:57:26.300 the day.

00:57:26.680 So sunlight exposure in the morning.

00:57:28.860 That's huge.

00:57:29.680 I didn't know that.

00:57:30.980 And I can tell you, even just being at the beach, I sleep so much better here in New Jersey

00:57:34.820 than when we're at our high rise in Manhattan, which does not have a lot of natural light,

00:57:39.480 especially back in the bedrooms.

00:57:40.760 And it's depressing.

00:57:41.940 First of all, it is depressing to not be without, you know, to not be with natural light.

00:57:45.740 All New Yorkers suffer from this problem, but I'm just, it's just now dawning on me that

00:57:50.500 it's related to the sleep ritual.

00:57:52.600 Yeah, no.

00:57:53.480 So, so it's that.

00:57:54.380 And I also think about things like, um, you know, right now it's summertime, so it really

00:57:59.860 doesn't get dark until after eight o'clock, but as we start hitting dusk time, as we're

00:58:04.480 getting closer to when the sun will fully set, you want to be thinking about blue blockers.

00:58:09.940 And, and so these are special lenses.

00:58:12.500 Um, there's lots of price points.

00:58:14.680 Um, they will help mitigate the exposure to blue light that's emanating from electronics.

00:58:19.220 And I don't know any adults or even teens or probably kids that aren't on TV, a device,

00:58:24.860 their computer in the evenings.

00:58:26.140 And so this will help, you know, also kind of prime the body.

00:58:29.080 We want to make sure that we're not suppressing melatonin, which is that key hormone secreted

00:58:33.940 in the brain that kind of reminds our bodies it's time to go to bed.

00:58:37.440 I think something that's also blue blockers, like the thing I put on my computer screen

00:58:41.340 to make it less glowy, like something you put on your clock, or are you talking about

00:58:44.800 glasses?

00:58:45.860 Glasses.

00:58:46.360 I think sometimes are easy because then you can wear them anywhere.

00:58:49.380 Um, and I've found, you know, some of the, the, you know, if you turn down the glare

00:58:54.460 or the brightness on your tablet or on your computer, it may not be enough.

00:58:58.480 And so this is part of that process.

00:59:00.400 I think it's also, you know, if we're looking at chronobiology, really thinking about, um,

00:59:05.220 you know, not eating close to bedtime.

00:59:06.760 I think that kind of goes without saying, you know, none of us sleep well when we, you

00:59:10.800 know, have a big meal and then try to go to bed two hours later, obviously hugely dependent

00:59:14.700 on your lifestyle.

00:59:15.640 But if we're looking again at chronobiology, eating earlier during the day or not eating

00:59:20.220 very close to bedtime can be hugely beneficial.

00:59:23.380 I think for a lot of people who feel like wired and tired, having a ritual, you mentioned

00:59:28.180 you enjoy having tea, but there's lots of herbal teas that you could have at the end of your

00:59:32.500 feeding window that would not, you know, break your fast.

00:59:35.220 I think about, you know, like dandelion and chamomile.

00:59:38.400 I mean, some of those things are completely fine and they're herbal.

00:59:40.760 So there's no caffeine that's in them.

00:59:42.380 But thinking about magnesium, this is certainly, it's another one of those electrolytes, but

00:59:46.880 either in supplement form or even topically, um, there are magnesium based lotions.

00:59:51.800 We did a lot of this in cardiology, trying to get people's magnesium levels up, but, um,

00:59:56.840 you know, there are certain brands that make really good quality products.

00:59:59.460 You can rub them on your skin at night.

01:00:00.880 So they get really good magnesium and there's specific ones.

01:00:05.800 Um, there's specific formulations.

01:00:07.860 Some there's lots of formulations of magnesium.

01:00:10.300 A lot of them you don't absorb, but like magnesium three and eight actually crosses the blood brain

01:00:15.120 barrier, which is what you want.

01:00:16.980 Um, cause that's very, you know, brain supportive.

01:00:18.980 And so topical magnesium, oral magnesium can be very helpful and even specific herbs, um,

01:00:26.120 adaptogenic herbs.

01:00:27.180 I'm going to use one as an example, rhodiola.

01:00:29.740 Uh, so this is something that's naturally occurring.

01:00:31.780 It's a plant-based compound and we know it can help buffer cortisol.

01:00:35.460 So if someone's feeling a little anxious or wired, um, adaptogenic herbs are another really

01:00:41.040 nice example.

01:00:41.780 And those are all, as you take these off, Cynthia, I'm wondering, I'm thinking of the

01:00:44.760 audience is wondering like, where can they go to get a list of this stuff?

01:00:47.200 Do you have a website that they can, you know, this is all written down where they can follow

01:00:50.600 up?

01:00:51.140 Yes.

01:00:51.400 Uh, my website is www.cynthiatherlo.com.

01:00:56.200 And we have lots of blogs and podcasts on, um, these topics.

01:00:59.880 It's something that I feel, uh, all those years of cardiology as an MP really do come of benefit

01:01:06.300 as it pertains to sleep and electrolytes.

01:01:08.420 Cause I've learned a lot of tricks on how to help people dial in on sleep quality.

01:01:13.220 No, let's, so let's jump to the opposite end.

01:01:15.300 So you, that's, that's what you do to prepare.

01:01:16.820 Then you do the IF and you know, whatever pattern works for you, you can experiment.

01:01:20.620 And then let's say you overeat, uh, you've got sort of a list of things you should not

01:01:25.420 do.

01:01:26.020 And you should do, uh, if you overeat drinking the water with the electrolytes, uh, maybe

01:01:31.880 OMAD you say.

01:01:33.500 And, and another thing that I know you've said is do not get on the scale.

01:01:38.060 So why?

01:01:38.840 Cause sometimes, you know, sometimes getting on the scale can be like, Oh my God, look at

01:01:42.680 the problem.

01:01:43.180 I've got, I've really got to stop eating.

01:01:45.080 I guess it could work the other way and just being self-defeating too.

01:01:48.080 Yeah.

01:01:48.160 Well, and that's more of what I'm referring to because there are people who live and die

01:01:51.920 by those numbers every day.

01:01:53.280 It impacts their mood and their emotional wellbeing.

01:01:55.800 But we know that if you've overeaten, had too much alcohol, had too many sweets, et cetera,

01:02:00.840 whatever it is that you've done overindulged, uh, there's going to be a certain degree of

01:02:04.820 acute inflammation in the body and that will show up on the scale.

01:02:07.760 And so I remind people, I usually say, give yourself a couple of days.

01:02:10.860 If you are fixated on the scale to begin with, give yourself a couple of days to kind of

01:02:15.280 clean things up, adjust your diet, uh, make some improvements, see where things go.

01:02:21.000 I just think that the scale in many ways can serve as large of an impediment to your

01:02:25.860 mental health as a lot of other things.

01:02:27.920 And yeah, like the non-scale victories are what we want to focus on, but, you know, maybe

01:02:34.000 put on that pair of pants.

01:02:35.280 That's like your tell, you know, the, the pants that you can tell if you've maybe got

01:02:40.560 a little bit more, there's, there's some adjustments that need to be made.

01:02:44.080 You can be honest with yourself.

01:02:45.160 I think we all certainly women, we all have that pair of pants that if you want to really

01:02:49.180 know, if you need to scale back on what you're doing, put that pair of pants on those evil

01:02:53.940 pants.

01:02:55.300 We're back with the end of our show in less than one minute.

01:03:01.980 All right.

01:03:02.520 Now let's, let's finish up with the three exercises you say we all need to do daily.

01:03:08.460 And then you've got to talk to us about 15 minute cold showers.

01:03:14.320 Yeah, no, I know it's, it's oftentimes life-changing.

01:03:18.780 So three exercises, I think, you know, just the, the general walking piece I think is hugely

01:03:23.960 impactful.

01:03:24.860 You know, I always say like the benefit of having an Apple watch is that I know how, how

01:03:29.600 much I've walked during the day.

01:03:30.740 So just walking is helpful, but doing even body weight exercises, doing squats or lunges,

01:03:36.800 which are fairly easy to do, you know, compound exercises, being able to do a plank is a good

01:03:42.880 indicator of how strong your core is.

01:03:45.320 I also think about, you know, when we're looking at things that are, you know, helpful, you know,

01:03:50.400 even just doing like an overhead press, very, very helpful.

01:03:53.540 Um, I think those kinds of things, are we talking about physical exercise?

01:03:57.280 Are we talking about exercises as in, uh, you know, in things that are helpful for us

01:04:02.500 to incorporate into our daily schedule as an overall theme?

01:04:05.900 Well, I know you like, you like meditation too.

01:04:08.060 I know that, and getting the good sleep and all that, but I, yeah, squats, playing some

01:04:11.860 walking.

01:04:12.200 I've heard you say, I think one of the key themes about whether it's sleep or stress management

01:04:17.420 is really getting us out of this, uh, you know, sympathetic dominant state that most of us

01:04:22.520 are in, we're like, go, go, go, go, go all the time.

01:04:24.800 And so things that put us in the parasympathetic, you know, you mentioned meditation.

01:04:28.540 I think about gratitude journaling.

01:04:30.540 I think about, um, I have lots of biohacking devices and this is something I completely

01:04:35.060 nerd out over and it's not suggesting everyone has to do this, but I think it's very, very

01:04:39.500 important to get yourself out of that rat race brain mindset.

01:04:43.660 And so I also think about, um, you know, when we're talking about things that can get us

01:04:50.040 out of that sympathetic dominant state, I also think about exposure to cold therapies.

01:04:56.000 And it could be that at the tail end of your shower, you do 15 seconds to start of cold

01:05:02.140 water.

01:05:02.460 Like you take it from the hot water and you take it all the way to the cold water.

01:05:06.120 And what you're doing is you're building resiliency.

01:05:08.420 You're giving your body a little bit of a hormetic stressor, much like intermittent fasting, but

01:05:13.000 it's helping making you more resilient.

01:05:14.540 And it'll get you into that parasympathetic rest and repose side of the brain.

01:05:19.780 And that's really what we want to do.

01:05:22.000 We want to provide our bodies with opportunities to not be as stressed.

01:05:27.440 And one other thing that I want to tie into the eating piece, um, most people don't realize

01:05:32.920 that our brains are the first, uh, organ involved in digestion.

01:05:38.340 I think we think of our mouths, we think of our esophagus, we think of our stomach, but

01:05:42.100 really we have to be out of that sympathetic dominant straight because if we're not, we

01:05:47.620 actually, our bodies actually don't digest our food as well.

01:05:50.960 So even if you just for one meal a day and Megan, I know as a busy mom, this might be

01:05:55.340 a tough to do one meal a day that you are not like on email, uh, multitasking, yelling

01:06:01.720 at your kids, sitting in a car, but maybe one meal out of the day that you look out at

01:06:06.180 something beautiful outside, or you just read something that brings you joy.

01:06:11.640 Uh, because when you're not in the parasympathetic, when you're eating, you actually, your bile

01:06:16.420 isn't properly, you know, um, isn't properly excreted so that it'll help break down and emulsify

01:06:22.860 fats.

01:06:23.560 Your liver doesn't work quite as efficiently.

01:06:25.920 You know, when you're in this sympathetic dominant state, your body just isn't in the

01:06:30.260 right frame of mind, literally to digest your food.

01:06:32.340 I just wanted to make sure I, for a family dinner, we sit down for family dinner.

01:06:36.040 We say no electronics, of course, at the table.

01:06:38.460 That's not just good manners.

01:06:40.120 It's, it's good for intermittent fasting and for your overall health.

01:06:43.480 Correct.

01:06:44.120 Which is my kids know this.

01:06:45.860 Yeah.

01:06:46.040 Wait, so can I ask you about the cold showers?

01:06:47.620 Cause I actually, a friend of mine got me doing, but she made me do a polar plunge for

01:06:52.780 my 50th birthday.

01:06:53.760 And it actually was incredibly invigorating.

01:06:57.240 I did not want to do it, but I did.

01:06:59.760 And I liked it.

01:07:00.600 And then we kind of started doing it a little, Doug and I here and there, where we'd come

01:07:04.820 down to the beach in the, in November and early December.

01:07:07.380 And, um, that, uh, the cold shower I've tried and I, I can do a little bit at the end of

01:07:12.020 my hot shower.

01:07:12.640 It is pretty painful.

01:07:14.040 Um, but I can't even imagine 15 minutes now that my team tells me you are working up to

01:07:19.480 a 15 minute cold shower.

01:07:21.100 Now, how is that even possible?

01:07:22.920 And why are you doing that?

01:07:23.940 What is 15 minutes better than the, just the minute at the end?

01:07:26.520 Well, I mean, I think it's something it's a, it's like a muscle.

01:07:30.140 I mean, it's something that you work up to.

01:07:31.820 I also do cryotherapy.

01:07:33.040 So if, if like the thought of doing a longer cold shower is totally unappealing, doing two

01:07:39.600 minutes and, or two to three minutes in a cryo tank is a really, really cool experience.

01:07:45.000 I think everyone should do at least once.

01:07:46.820 Um, it's really, again, it's, it's really tapping into that parasympathetic and, you

01:07:51.840 know, it slows your breathing.

01:07:53.160 It's, it's really invigorating when you get out as, as strange as this sounds.

01:07:57.760 It also, it's good for our bodies to get a little uncomfortable, much like, you know,

01:08:02.020 you're drawn to fasting as a, and I'm sure many of the listeners are as well.

01:08:05.700 It's usually important to integrate things into our lives and make us a little uncomfortable,

01:08:09.760 safe, but a little bit uncomfortable because that is what builds resiliency.

01:08:13.500 And that is what stresses our bodies.

01:08:16.080 Little micro stressors day to day is beneficial because largely as a culture, we've just gotten

01:08:21.200 way too comfortable and it's easy to continue to do that.

01:08:24.440 And let me be very clear, Megan, much easier for me to take a cold shower in the summer than

01:08:28.740 it is in the dead of winter, much, much, much easier.

01:08:32.660 So, okay.

01:08:33.020 So, um, lastly in, in sort of the health warnings for people who should not be doing this,

01:08:38.640 there's gotta be a population.

01:08:39.680 And we talked about people who are prone to, or have suffered with eating disorders that

01:08:44.000 they should not be doing this.

01:08:45.020 I assume.

01:08:45.840 And who else?

01:08:47.100 Yeah.

01:08:47.360 And I would say that the caveat with those that have binge, uh, anorexia, bulimia tendencies

01:08:52.800 or history, they need to be working with a, uh, a therapist who is very experienced, not

01:08:58.340 only with fasting, if they're going to do it, but also with their eating disorder.

01:09:02.480 Um, I would say any individual that's underweight.

01:09:04.720 So if your BMI is under 18, I don't like fasting for kids.

01:09:09.160 Uh, I get messages about that all the time.

01:09:11.540 Um, if you're frail, it doesn't matter what age you are.

01:09:14.460 If you're frail, not a good thing to do.

01:09:17.180 If you are a brittle diabetic, which means you're not able to differentiate when your blood

01:09:21.280 sugar is low, probably not a safe thing to be doing.

01:09:24.380 And I think anyone that's got like significant chronic health problems, much like you had

01:09:29.540 a conversation with your doctor.

01:09:30.760 I think it's really helpful to make sure that your healthcare professional knows what you're

01:09:35.700 choosing to do.

01:09:36.320 And that can be as simple as you may lose weight and need less blood pressure medicine.

01:09:40.320 You may need less diabetes medication.

01:09:42.580 You may not need to be on your cholesterol medication, but you need to be checking in

01:09:45.400 with them.

01:09:45.860 So if you're taking a lot of medications, have a long medical history, just make sure you're

01:09:50.780 talking with your healthcare professional.

01:09:52.460 But most other people, oh, and I want to make sure I mentioned, um, if you're pregnant or

01:09:56.720 breastfeeding, there are a lot of people in the industry, um, they're fit pros that tout

01:10:03.620 their, you know, breastfeeding and their intermittent fasting and they're pregnant and their intermittent

01:10:07.920 fasting ladies.

01:10:09.180 This is like the one or two times in our lives that we really need to be super, super focused

01:10:14.780 on ensuring that our body is not missing any nutrients that we need to convey either to

01:10:20.140 a fetus or to our babies.

01:10:22.040 And so I never recommend that people are calorically restricted in any capacity, uh, unless, you

01:10:29.940 know, they're under a medical provider supervision.

01:10:32.760 If you're pregnant or breastfeeding, the weight will eventually come off while you're breastfeeding

01:10:36.680 or after pregnancy, but it's not an excuse to restrict calories.

01:10:41.520 And that's something I've started seeing and bothers me enormously, uh, because I just think

01:10:46.900 it's a very unhealthy practice for them.

01:10:49.440 I've never read a book on intermittent fasting.

01:10:51.400 I didn't know the one that you referenced up top, but if people want to read a book on

01:10:54.960 this, um, what do you recommend to get started or get informed?

01:10:58.280 Yeah.

01:10:58.940 I mean, I am a huge proponent of Jason Fung and Jimmy Moore's book, the complete guide

01:11:03.620 to fasting.

01:11:04.160 It is really comprehensive, easy to read, very, very clear on the methodologies and research.

01:11:12.420 Um, of course I am in the process of, I'll have a book out in 2022, but it's specific to

01:11:18.480 intermittent fasting.

01:11:19.140 Yeah.

01:11:19.920 Intermittent fasting and women, but I would say Jason Fung, Jimmy Moore's book is excellent.

01:11:24.320 And that is a book that I recommend with tremendous frequency.

01:11:28.000 I would say, you know, beyond that website, it's Cynthia, Cynthia spelled the normal way

01:11:32.100 with a Y Thurlow, T H U R L O W.com.

01:11:35.780 Is that right?

01:11:36.440 Yes.

01:11:37.040 Uh, and, uh, yeah.

01:11:38.660 So I think those are two great options.

01:11:40.900 If you're a woman and I remind people all the time that we can't fast the same way that

01:11:45.520 men do.

01:11:45.960 There are definitely some differentiators and things that we have to do a little bit differently.

01:11:49.840 So, um, that, that is a resource that is definitely needed and, uh, not available.

01:11:54.480 You can live longer, you can improve your mood and your mental sharpness, and you can improve

01:12:00.580 your sex life.

01:12:01.280 We didn't even get to that.

01:12:02.500 Uh, but it will improve your sex life too.

01:12:04.760 So all sorts of goodness awaits in, uh, in trying intermittent fasting.

01:12:08.940 And there's so many different options depending on your lifestyle.

01:12:11.700 I highly recommend it.

01:12:13.040 It's really been a life changer for me.

01:12:14.520 It's made me a much happier person because I feel like my meals are better.

01:12:17.700 When I do eat, I get to eat more and I feel more satiated.

01:12:22.240 And when I'm not eating, it's actually pretty easy.

01:12:24.540 It's, it's a lot easier than I thought it would be.

01:12:26.860 So thank you for leading the way and for being so easy to understand.

01:12:30.520 And for that amazing Ted talk, which I recommend everybody.

01:12:32.980 It's got 9 million and counting views right now on YouTube for a reason.

01:12:36.520 Cynthia, it's a pleasure.

01:12:37.600 Thank you so much.

01:12:38.420 All right.

01:12:43.060 Don't miss the show tomorrow because we're going to get into Simone Biles, among other

01:12:46.640 things.

01:12:47.340 And I've got thoughts and Christina Hoff Summers is going to have thoughts too.

01:12:52.240 She's so interesting.

01:12:53.240 She says she's a Democrat, but she is with the American Enterprise Institute, right?

01:12:57.940 Which is a, which is definitely a conservative think tank.

01:13:00.480 She calls herself a feminist, but she says she's the factual feminist.

01:13:04.120 She's, she's a, calls herself a freedom feminist and authored the book, The War Against Boys,

01:13:10.760 right?

01:13:10.960 So she's an interesting person.

01:13:12.440 I love following her on Twitter and I really wanted to get her taken in a, just a thoughtful

01:13:17.580 take, not just on Simone, but what's going on with what we're doing right now in our society,

01:13:22.540 you know, and you've heard me talk about Naomi Osaka.

01:13:25.420 And I feel like we are really leaning into victimhood right now and somehow women are being celebrated

01:13:29.680 for it.

01:13:30.480 We're going to talk to her about that.

01:13:31.820 And then we're going to expand the discussion to what's happening with the cultural left

01:13:35.480 at this moment in 2021.

01:13:37.540 Don't miss that.

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The Megyn Kelly Show - July 28, 2021

Intermittent Fasting - What You Need To Know, with Cynthia Thurlow ｜ Ep. 136

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