The Megyn Kelly Show - McCarthy's Speaker Fight, and Horrific NFL Injury, with Emily Jashinsky, Eliana Johnson, and Clay Travis ｜ Ep. 463

00:00:00.400 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:00:11.860 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:15.460 We begin today with a shocking story that happened last night.

00:00:20.740 A 24-year-old NFL player is now in critical condition following a seemingly routine tackle

00:00:26.960 during last night's Monday night football game.

00:00:29.300 First, a warning for those watching this on YouTube.

00:00:32.780 The video we're going to show you is tough to watch.

00:00:37.020 You see the Buffalo Bills' DeMar Hamlin make a tackle, get up, and then three seconds later,

00:00:44.280 he collapses, stunning the refs and the players nearby.

00:00:49.280 He went down on his back with seemingly no attempt to stop himself.

00:00:53.960 Clearly, there had been a significant health event.

00:00:57.460 Trainers rush the field, appearing to recognize the severity of the situation almost immediately,

00:01:02.940 and then CPR is administered.

00:01:06.140 His devastated teammates, the opposing players, surround him, many with tears streaming down

00:01:12.480 their faces, grown men, some turning away, unable to watch him in distress.

00:01:18.640 For 16 minutes, the medical teams worked on him before taking him into an ambulance,

00:01:25.560 rushing him to the nearby University of Cincinnati Medical Center, a level one trauma center, thankfully.

00:01:31.700 The game between the Bills and the Bengals was then postponed.

00:01:35.900 Overnight, around 140 in the morning, the Bills revealing that Hamlin had indeed suffered cardiac arrest.

00:01:42.460 How, why, we have very few details on.

00:01:47.660 Outside the hospital, look at this.

00:01:49.760 Oh, you've got to watch this on YouTube later if you're listening.

00:01:52.460 Fans from both teams are spotted standing shoulder to shoulder, praying together,

00:01:58.940 some holding candles, recognizing that this is about so much more than a football game.

00:02:04.600 But also, there's football in it, the football community coming together to recognize,

00:02:09.700 you know, we can war on the field, we can fight it out, but in the end, we love each other,

00:02:14.080 we're Americans, we love this game, and when one of ours goes down, we come together.

00:02:19.800 Many others across the country now showing their support by donating to Damar Hamlin's charity

00:02:25.380 and big time.

00:02:27.660 It had, I think, he was shooting for a couple thousand in donations to help kids in need of toys.

00:02:34.100 Last check, it was, I think, over $3.5 million that had been donated by well-wishers overnight

00:02:40.320 as we all await an update on his condition.

00:02:44.240 Joining me now with the very latest is Clay Travis.

00:02:46.800 He's the founder of Outkick and co-host of the Clay Travis and Buck Sexton show,

00:02:51.100 and Outkick is Outkick the coverage.

00:02:53.180 This is your business, sports, Clay, your original business.

00:02:56.260 Now you do sports and political and all sorts of commentary.

00:02:59.380 But I was not watching this game.

00:03:01.440 I had friends of mine, you know, women who are big NFL fans text me immediately to say,

00:03:06.480 did you see it?

00:03:07.720 I assume you were watching it.

00:03:09.500 And just put it in perspective for us how significant this was.

00:03:14.580 Yeah.

00:03:14.840 So first of all, Happy New Year.

00:03:16.140 Thanks for having me on, Megan.

00:03:18.120 Hi to my wife, who's a big fan of your podcast and will be listening and did not know that I

00:03:22.080 was going to be on today.

00:03:23.000 So I hope she enjoys it.

00:03:24.440 Um, but, uh, look, I was like a lot of football fans out there all over the country, uh, putting

00:03:30.640 this into context, the Cincinnati Bengals, the Buffalo Bills, two of the best teams in

00:03:35.140 the NFL this year, and they are fighting for first place in the NFL playoffs.

00:03:39.680 This is a Monday night football game.

00:03:41.300 Everybody's watching the same game.

00:03:43.820 There are 32 NFL teams, everybody on Monday, certainly given the significance of this game,

00:03:49.500 elite quarterback play and, uh, Josh Allen and Joe Burrow sitting down and watching this,

00:03:54.180 not to mention Megan, it's coming out of the Rose Bowl.

00:03:57.480 So even if you're just kind of a casual NFL fan, the Rose Bowl is one of the most watched

00:04:02.240 college football games every year too.

00:04:04.460 So we're talking about just a monstrous crowd of, uh, of, of football fans watching this game

00:04:10.120 and about 20 minutes into the game, uh, or so this hit happens.

00:04:16.960 And the DeMar Hamlin hit, as, as you mentioned, is there are thousands of more violent hits that

00:04:23.900 have taken place in football games over the past couple of weeks alone.

00:04:28.220 It did not strike anyone as a notable hit.

00:04:31.620 He stands up, he immediately collapses.

00:04:34.820 And from that moment in time, what happened was we went from, I always say, and it's not

00:04:40.460 my phrase, but it's one that, that is, is steeped into the consciousness.

00:04:44.900 Sports is the toy chest of life, right?

00:04:47.620 Um, meaning that for adults and obviously a lot of kids as well, but this is the not serious

00:04:54.260 part of your, uh, your enjoyment.

00:04:56.740 This is the dessert for your meal, right?

00:04:59.220 Uh, and most of the time it's about entertainment and really instantaneously, Megan, this story

00:05:06.520 shifted from, Oh, who's going to be the overall number one seed.

00:05:10.460 You mentioned Josh Allen, the bill's quarterback and the fact that he was in tears, he missed

00:05:14.400 a throw on the first drive for the Buffalo bills that he would probably hit eight or nine

00:05:18.960 times out of 10 that would have given the bills a first down, potentially given them a

00:05:23.080 touchdown.

00:05:23.420 And he was disgusted with himself and he went on the sideline and, you know, like he's reacting.

00:05:28.480 He's upset at the joy, at the, at the, the play that he put out.

00:05:32.380 That's what we're used to seeing.

00:05:33.900 And then to see the pivot go from, Hey, sports is a serious thing to the guys on the field

00:05:39.240 to a truly life altering life or death situation is frankly something we haven't seen Megan.

00:05:45.920 And, and, and I've never, and I watch a lot of football, I have never seen a situation

00:05:50.840 like this where CPR has to be given and a player has collapsed, uh, as happened with

00:05:56.420 DeMar Hamlin.

00:05:57.200 We've seen serious health instances.

00:06:00.080 Usually those are a guy make you worry that he maybe got paralyzed because he led with

00:06:05.240 his head.

00:06:05.800 And the way that the hit happened, uh, you know, you watch it and then they, they come

00:06:10.240 out and they, they immobilize his head and they put him on a stretcher and they may even

00:06:14.140 take him off on an ambulance.

00:06:16.000 That's relatively rare, but we've at least seen it.

00:06:19.260 I I've never seen, uh, in, in my experience as a sports fan, CPR being performed like that

00:06:25.300 on a player that might well have been dead.

00:06:28.320 Uh, but for, I think we've got to give a lot of credit to the medical community, uh, the,

00:06:33.000 the trainers, the, the doctors on the sidelines who all rushed in, uh, and were able to give

00:06:39.060 immediate, uh, life-saving potentially treatment to this player, uh, uh, where, uh, where we

00:06:45.780 frankly, usually you're having a guy run out because you're worried about whether or not

00:06:49.400 he has a knee injury or, uh, has he, uh, injured an armor or a leg.

00:06:54.460 And here you have, uh, a life-saving, uh, process.

00:06:58.060 I'm sure more details will come out about the treatment that he received, uh, in the days

00:07:02.060 and the hours.

00:07:02.560 We are learning a little, we're learning a little clay.

00:07:05.240 So we're, um, I mean, it, if, as they now say, uh, he was in cardiac arrest and his

00:07:10.860 heart was not beating, you know, he was not alive, you know, I mean, they, they resuscitated

00:07:15.220 him.

00:07:15.480 They, those medical personnel brought him back and we are learning now that they did use

00:07:19.900 a defibrillator on him, or at least that one was present on the field.

00:07:23.080 Thank God.

00:07:24.260 Thank God.

00:07:25.140 Those things are such lifesavers.

00:07:27.360 There would be no excuse not to have it in this situation, but I will say this, um, the

00:07:32.320 NFL apparently has an emergency plan and it, it worked.

00:07:35.940 Uh, this is how it is each week.

00:07:37.660 The league runs through its emergency action plan with all 32 clubs, every stadium rehearses

00:07:42.160 a medical situation, just like this one annually.

00:07:44.980 The plan is also brought up at the pregame meeting between the coaches.

00:07:48.340 Part of that plan involves having a level one trauma center nearby in every home market.

00:07:53.300 And it calls for an ambulance in each stadium, as well as a doctor who can handle severe medical

00:07:57.980 problems like cardiac arrest.

00:07:59.620 And that would, of course, include a defibrillator.

00:08:02.120 And, and there was a, a doctor, a Miami-based cardiologist named Bernard Ashby, who was tweeting

00:08:06.860 about this last night, Clay.

00:08:08.260 And he said, um, the video from a cardiologist perspective resembled commotio cortis, a phenomenon

00:08:14.620 that occurs when a sudden blunt impact to the chest causes cardiac arrest.

00:08:20.120 Timely defibrillation is life-saving and prevents anoxic brain injury.

00:08:24.620 Because of course, the longer your brain goes without oxygen, which is what happens if you're

00:08:28.760 not, your heart is not beating, you have brain damage, even if they can bring you back.

00:08:32.460 But it sounds like within four minutes, the ambulance was on the field for four to six

00:08:36.800 minutes.

00:08:37.100 The ambulance was on the field.

00:08:38.020 The doctors were on the field.

00:08:38.940 Even before that, I'm sure they brought the defibrillator as soon as they realized his

00:08:42.280 heart was not beating.

00:08:43.140 So, I mean, this guy on, if there's a bright side, got the very best medical care you could

00:08:47.820 get in the circumstances.

00:08:50.640 Yeah.

00:08:50.800 And that medical condition you're referring to, Megan, uh, assuming that that ends up being

00:08:54.900 what occurred, um, it happens incredibly rarely, uh, but it usually has happened occasionally

00:09:01.800 in sports where basically like a ball or, uh, it's happened in hockey with the puck.

00:09:07.540 It happens to strike the heart region right at the exact moment where this crippling, uh,

00:09:14.500 you know, can occur.

00:09:15.880 Uh, and maybe that's what happened with the hit.

00:09:19.840 It got delivered.

00:09:21.400 Um, again, it's incredibly rare, almost never happens.

00:09:25.180 Uh, but, uh, but as you mentioned of all the places that it could happen, uh, for, for

00:09:31.340 an athlete, there probably is not a better place in the United States in terms of having

00:09:36.200 a team of people ready and able to assist you and potentially save his life.

00:09:41.220 And yeah, we hope being in a hospital, this is the best, you know, case scenario.

00:09:46.880 Um, uh, an NHL player, uh, Chris Pronger, I guess, former, I said, he was tweeting out

00:09:53.440 about this, offering his prayers and saying prayers that he can have the same outcome.

00:09:57.380 I was fortunate to have with my incident.

00:10:00.140 Um, he had something happen.

00:10:02.360 Let's see.

00:10:02.840 Uh, I'm trying to get the exact, we have the video, but it happened in 1998 during a

00:10:07.000 playoff game between the St. 0.90

00:10:08.120 Louis blues and the Detroit red wings.

00:10:10.120 And this guy played for the blues.

00:10:11.660 He took a slap shot to the chest, continue to play a couple seconds.

00:10:14.380 And here we have video of him going down.

00:10:17.340 Same thing.

00:10:17.960 It caused cardiac arrhythmia, uh, which interrupts the normal pulsating of the heart.

00:10:22.620 He was told he was unconscious for 20 to 30 seconds.

00:10:25.140 In that case, it was mother's day.

00:10:27.160 His parents were in the stands.

00:10:28.560 He was taken off the ice into the hospital, spent that night at the hospital.

00:10:31.980 He was back in the blues lineup two nights later.

00:10:34.500 So it was obviously less dire, but here to DeMar Hamlin's family was in the stands,

00:10:39.680 watched him go down, was able, were told to get into that ambulance.

00:10:43.520 Oh, clay with him on the way to the hospital, just the humanity of it, the effect this must

00:10:49.240 be having on the players, the refs, the coaches, the family, your heart goes out to them.

00:10:54.100 No doubt.

00:10:55.680 And, uh, you know, there's always that story.

00:10:57.600 I've got a kid who plays tackle football and, uh, and obviously I go and cover a lot of football

00:11:03.380 games and, you know, his mom, I believe was in the stands and there's a, the line that

00:11:07.800 I've heard that, that I think is a hundred percent accurate, uh, in my experience, the

00:11:12.140 mom watches her son on almost every play, right?

00:11:16.100 Like, even if he's the lineman, you know, the, the dad will watch where the ball goes

00:11:20.740 and, you know, but the mom is so just completely invested in the health of, of her baby, her 0.95

00:11:25.980 son.

00:11:26.540 And so this is the worst possible feeling, you know, anybody out there who's got kids that

00:11:31.100 play sports where you could have, I mean, again, the kid, I say kid, I mean, he's 24

00:11:35.540 years old, right?

00:11:36.560 Um, to me still basically a kid, um, and, uh, and mom is in the stands and sees that

00:11:41.980 happen.

00:11:42.320 I mean, it's, it's heart rending, I think on an emotional parent based level for anybody

00:11:46.520 out there to be thinking about it.

00:11:48.260 Uh, and again, this is something that is basically without precedent in the world of the NFL,

00:11:53.120 uh, to have this caliber of, uh, of serious health event, frankly, we've never seen.

00:11:58.180 And so you, you, you point out we've had injuries where you worry about paralysis and

00:12:03.780 serious injuries, obviously neck injuries, but I don't remember them ever canceling a

00:12:09.780 game.

00:12:10.040 Like after the injury, the players always go back out.

00:12:13.940 It's never happened.

00:12:14.940 And there's been criticism of the NFL over this because they didn't immediately cancel.

00:12:18.900 I think that look, the internet, Megan, as you well have experienced, certainly I have

00:12:23.440 on, on some level is a blame factory.

00:12:26.360 Something happens and there is a desire to decide, Hey, you're an awful person.

00:12:31.800 And so there was this immediate reaction of on, on social media in particular, Oh my goodness,

00:12:37.900 how was the NFL ever thinking that they were going to play this game?

00:12:41.500 Well, first of all, it's without precedent.

00:12:43.820 Secondly, what usually happens, take it outside of this scenario.

00:12:46.920 You could have a serious injury.

00:12:48.600 Let's say a guy, uh, they're worried that he might've been paralyzed.

00:12:51.400 And thankfully that has not happened, uh, in, in, in recent history in the NFL.

00:12:56.020 But usually what would happen is they, they, even if they load the guy up, take him in

00:13:00.420 an ambulance to the, uh, to the hospital later, they would come back and they would say, Hey,

00:13:05.220 good news.

00:13:05.880 You know, a player has got movement in his arms and legs.

00:13:08.800 Paralysis is not an issue, but they continue playing the game.

00:13:11.920 And so my bet here is that the NFL was thinking, Hey, they're going to be able to handle the

00:13:17.620 medical issue on the field.

00:13:19.080 And within a couple of minutes of him coming off the field, we'll get a phone call, uh,

00:13:24.520 and they'll say, Hey, talk to the doctors, everybody in the ambulance, he's going to be

00:13:28.500 fine.

00:13:29.280 Let everybody know on the field that he's going to be okay.

00:13:32.280 And we'll go back and we'll finish the game.

00:13:34.480 That's what usually happens almost without, uh, without fail.

00:13:38.500 Uh, that obviously was not able to be the case in this situation.

00:13:42.600 I'm hopeful that we'll get information later that he's going to be okay.

00:13:46.400 And that maybe it's just like the hockey player and that he's going to be able to go back to

00:13:50.480 his normal life.

00:13:51.880 Um, but so far that hasn't happened.

00:13:53.760 And I think the other thing is those players are so upset, right?

00:13:57.180 Like, it's like, I, as a spectator understand, but I mean, the football players are bred to

00:14:02.400 be tough, to play hurt, to be like the toughest of the tough out there.

00:14:06.520 And they were so distraught, like the inhumanity of forcing them to go back out there where their,

00:14:12.360 their brother in, you know, uniform had essentially just died before their very eyes only to be

00:14:19.040 brought back.

00:14:19.680 I mean, that is just too high a request of any athlete.

00:14:25.200 I I'm so glad that some humanities took place there and the NFL said, no, don't play.

00:14:29.780 And the coaches were like, we're not in there.

00:14:31.020 And I'm sure the players were like, no, not tonight.

00:14:34.000 No.

00:14:34.700 Yeah.

00:14:35.240 Well, and I think the other thing on this, Megan is Buffalo.

00:14:37.540 I know you've got a lot of experience, uh, in, in, in outside in New York and you went

00:14:41.900 to Syracuse, right?

00:14:42.740 But Buffalo is, uh, is an incredibly, an incredibly close knit community, uh, even in the NFL context.

00:14:50.560 I mean, these teammates are obviously very close because of what they do for a living.

00:14:54.060 Uh, but you know, this is not living in New York or LA or Chicago, you know, big metropolitan

00:14:58.880 areas.

00:15:00.040 Buffalo is a lot like green Bay.

00:15:01.820 Uh, and I've been fortunate to know a bunch of bills players over the years.

00:15:05.120 And they're like, you know, we're super close, even for an NFL team.

00:15:09.440 Uh, and so the guys spend their time together.

00:15:11.840 This is not, um, you know, it's something where you go in, you're there for five or six

00:15:15.580 hours, you leave, and there's not a lot of interaction between teammates.

00:15:19.160 These guys live together, uh, even more so than most players would.

00:15:23.980 So to see one of their close friends, uh, at, at, at a place that it can connection like

00:15:30.220 Buffalo, um, I think was just next level.

00:15:33.020 I'll also say this, Megan, I think it's important.

00:15:34.720 Remember, this is a road game.

00:15:36.660 And, uh, we were talking about how, you know, the fun and frivolity of a football game, the

00:15:40.580 entertainment, you want your team to win, but in Cincinnati, they pivoted, I thought so

00:15:46.820 well from, you know, rabid.

00:15:49.200 We want to beat the crap out of the Buffalo bills to my goodness.

00:15:53.340 Let's, uh, worry about let's, let's bring together the humanity of sports.

00:15:58.300 Uh, they lit up the stadium, uh, in Cincinnati and Buffalo bills colors, uh, in the evening

00:16:04.800 after this game, there were a lot of Cincinnati Bengals.

00:16:07.860 I'm sure you shared some of those videos, I think, and bills fans who went to the hospital

00:16:11.920 and had a candle lit vigil to park, to pray outside of the stadium.

00:16:15.180 And regardless of what your religion is, football players are very religious, uh, and it doesn't

00:16:22.700 get talked about a lot, but they pray.

00:16:25.340 And what you saw in the immediate aftermath and during this process was virtually every

00:16:32.620 player was on their knee praying for, uh, whether they were a bills player, whether they're

00:16:37.540 a Bengals player, a lot of people I'm sure in the stadium and certainly millions around

00:16:41.500 the United States as they were watching it play out.

00:16:44.420 Uh, there was a great amount of prayer that went, uh, up into the, into the cosmos, uh,

00:16:50.560 for this individual.

00:16:51.760 And to me, it represented what sports often can, uh, represented its best, the innate goodness

00:16:59.360 of the American people and our common humanity.

00:17:02.780 And that's why, uh, to me, they're raising over three and a half million dollars, Megan,

00:17:07.560 over 140,000 people have donated to that charity because to me, that's just something bad happens.

00:17:15.200 And I think most Americans don't think, oh, I'm going to go on social media and I'm going

00:17:20.560 to make things worse, right?

00:17:21.980 I'm going to blame somebody else and try to, you know, make this situation more, uh, difficult

00:17:26.940 than it already was.

00:17:28.360 Most Americans innately good think what small gesture can I make?

00:17:32.780 And I talked about this last night, but it's the same thing as when someone dies and maybe

00:17:37.740 you're a small town or you're in your church and you take food over to their house.

00:17:41.100 You're not fundamentally altering the trajectory of the tragedy, but you're just showing a little

00:17:48.180 bit of human decency and kindness and doing some small measure to make things better.

00:17:53.080 And at 3.5 million for the kids, for the, for the presence, for underprivileged kids,

00:17:58.780 the guy was hoping to raise 2,500.

00:18:00.860 To me, that's the best of sports.

00:18:02.280 The outpouring that we've seen as millions of dollars raised in.

00:18:06.680 Sports, Americans, humanity, like all of it.

00:18:11.320 Um, and it's something for us to hold onto, you know, as we pray for him, I, I do want

00:18:15.460 to say we've gotten this, um, a family representative who described himself as a good friend of, uh,

00:18:21.240 the player told ABC's good morning America today, his relatives, Hamlin's relatives are

00:18:26.060 in good spirits, but going through a lot and need their privacy.

00:18:29.640 He declined to give details on his condition other than to say he is sedated.

00:18:33.300 All I can say is he's fighting, he's a fighter.

00:18:36.240 So we know that he's sedated.

00:18:37.560 We know he's in critical condition.

00:18:39.320 We know he had a cardiac arrest on the field that his heartbeat was restored.

00:18:43.000 We're told he's been intubated.

00:18:44.680 He's got the breathing tube doing his breathing for him, which would explain the sedation.

00:18:49.140 They don't want you conscious while you're being intubated.

00:18:51.540 It's too distressing.

00:18:53.060 Um, and the messaging from this friend sounds somewhat optimistic.

00:18:57.960 His relatives are in good spirits.

00:18:59.420 That gives me some hope.

00:19:00.660 I mean, you know, they know more than we know.

00:19:02.800 I think, um, we were told by his Mark Hamlin's marketing, uh, representative last night that

00:19:08.680 his vital signs were back to normal, but again, pointing out he's intubated.

00:19:12.980 The hospital does not have plans for a Tuesday press conference.

00:19:16.180 Um, so that's a little concerning.

00:19:17.700 We'd like to see them schedule that just so we could get to know more final question to

00:19:22.320 you though, Clay, there is the matter of the playoffs and the Superbowl.

00:19:27.820 And again, you know, me not a, not a big football follower, but this is what I read, uh, that

00:19:32.760 the game was stopped in the first quarter.

00:19:35.500 The Bengals were leading seven to three, that this is the final week of the regular season.

00:19:40.320 The playoffs begin January 14th.

00:19:42.400 Both of these teams were striving for the number one seed in the ASA playoffs.

00:19:47.980 So as you pointed out, they're great teams and they both wanted and needed a win in this

00:19:51.700 game.

00:19:51.980 So does this game ever actually get played?

00:19:55.480 Does it get rescheduled?

00:19:56.540 What happens?

00:19:57.740 It's a great question.

00:19:58.640 And, uh, you know, if they were able to come out and say, Hey, he's going to be okay.

00:20:04.740 Then I think maybe they could try to reschedule it.

00:20:08.000 I don't know what the logistics are in terms of how quickly they could get a game played.

00:20:13.060 Uh, presumably if they played it, they would pick up with where they already were in the

00:20:17.580 game, right?

00:20:18.240 They'd played a few minutes.

00:20:19.960 Uh, I think the NFL has three options in my mind, Megan.

00:20:22.960 Uh, they can try to replay the game.

00:20:24.740 I think that would have to happen either today or tomorrow.

00:20:26.760 Uh, because after that way, the schedule works, it isn't able to be done.

00:20:31.380 I think they could call it a no contest and just let these two teams only play 16 games.

00:20:36.800 Uh, I think they could call it a tie.

00:20:38.780 Uh, the, the challenge here is, and this is going into the specifics.

00:20:43.380 The bills are right now, the number one seed.

00:20:46.100 If you are the number one seed, you get a buy and you advance to the final eight of the

00:20:52.120 NFL playoffs.

00:20:53.820 If you're not the number one seed, you have to play a game.

00:20:57.120 And if the bills don't play this game and win, then they are likely to end up the two

00:21:02.760 seed.

00:21:03.580 Um, and that would mean that they lose that buy.

00:21:06.380 And it would mean for people out there, Kansas city chiefs would become the number one seed

00:21:10.840 and people say, okay, what's the big difference there?

00:21:13.200 Well, one, you have to play an extra game to you in theory would have to go on the road

00:21:18.880 to play in the AFC championship team, uh, game in the opposing team stadium, which is

00:21:24.500 obviously a much more difficult environment than getting to play at home in your own state.

00:21:29.140 So there are a lot of competitive choices that have to be made here.

00:21:33.600 And I would imagine that right now, as we are speaking, Megan, in the NFL offices in New

00:21:38.340 York city, they are debating all of these different permutations and trying to figure

00:21:43.200 out what the best way to handle this is.

00:21:46.440 One small measure of, of, of comfort here, I would say is they got a lot of practice in

00:21:51.660 how to schedule and reschedule games surrounding COVID.

00:21:55.560 Uh, and then where they played the entire 2020 season in the NFL.

00:21:59.660 So I don't know what sort of scheduling, uh, you know, movement they have, but in 2020,

00:22:05.400 they played games on every day of the week.

00:22:08.700 Maybe there is a way still to get this game played, but again, I think they would have

00:22:12.680 to do it either today or at the absolute latest tomorrow, or else they would have to decide

00:22:18.420 this is a no contest and either say, then we're going to call this a tie and each team

00:22:22.560 gets a tie, or we're just going to only make them play 16 games.

00:22:26.160 Um, you feel for the bangles too, who are, you know, the opposing team, their head coach

00:22:31.080 went to the hospital as did several of those players were told.

00:22:34.320 Um, again, there was no, you know, team in this.

00:22:37.620 There was only a humanity and, and Americans doing the right thing.

00:22:41.300 I want to tell the audience that, uh, that the, the foundation that, um, that we were talking

00:22:47.140 about, that's gotten all of the donations.

00:22:49.600 Damar Hamlin's foundation is called the chasing M M capital M apostrophe S chasing

00:22:56.180 M's foundation community toy drive.

00:22:59.400 Uh, it's a go fund me.

00:23:01.200 Wow.

00:23:01.880 It, they had a $2,500 goal.

00:23:04.400 It's now up to 3.9 million.

00:23:06.560 If you want to support that's amazing.

00:23:09.000 Say a prayer for Damar, for his family going through the worst life can offer.

00:23:14.440 And in these moments, just worrying about your loved one, uh, dying under the most bizarre

00:23:18.600 circumstances and honestly, for the, for the other player, it wasn't his fault.

00:23:22.420 This guy, Damar was tackling the other player and did manage to do the, the tackle.

00:23:26.560 It's just that his shoulder got Damar in the heart, uh, from the look of it, uh, we'll

00:23:31.060 know more as we hear directly from the doctors.

00:23:33.520 Clay, thanks so much for making time for us today.

00:23:35.960 Keep up the good work, Megan.

00:23:37.220 And I just say, yeah, if you want to just join me and donate a little bit of money, uh,

00:23:41.080 that is, I think the best possible thing you can do.

00:23:43.580 If you're troubled by this story, try to bring some, some goodness and a little bit better

00:23:47.640 humanity to the world.

00:23:48.820 I'm encouraged by how, how so many sports fans have already done that.

00:23:52.600 Yes, absolutely.

00:23:53.420 Right.

00:23:53.600 You're on, uh, Clay.

00:23:54.820 All the best.

00:23:55.260 Thank you.

00:23:56.200 Thank you, Megan.

00:23:57.660 Okay.

00:23:58.020 We're going to keep you updated on this story as we get new details on it.

00:24:00.640 But up next, we shift gears.

00:24:02.600 The EJs are here. 1.00

00:24:03.740 Emily Jashinsky and Eliana Johnson.

00:24:06.320 Don't miss them.

00:24:07.460 Will Kevin McCarthy be the next speaker of the house?

00:24:16.160 We'll see today.

00:24:17.320 Maybe it's happening at this moment.

00:24:20.180 Uh, and our guests are going to join me in one second, but first, let me just tell you

00:24:22.520 what's happening.

00:24:23.360 Uh, he's come in today.

00:24:24.720 The vote for house speaker is happening now, and there are about five to nine GOP holdouts.

00:24:32.720 These are sort of the more conservatives, uh, within the Republican party who don't like

00:24:38.540 Kevin McCarthy and think that he should be making more concessions to their wing of the

00:24:42.680 party.

00:24:43.520 And, uh, he's tried.

00:24:45.100 He's definitely offered some concessions, some serious concessions, like only five people

00:24:50.180 within my party or within the house would have to vote for an impeachment voter to kick

00:24:54.200 me out.

00:24:54.580 I should say as, as speaker.

00:24:56.920 And, um, you know, that would empower these guys to force a vote on whether he should remain

00:25:00.620 a speaker if he becomes speaker.

00:25:01.780 And they said, no, not good enough.

00:25:04.240 Um, it has only happened.

00:25:06.080 I think last time they had more than one vote was 1923, 1923.

00:25:12.120 I believe it's only happened once since the civil war.

00:25:15.260 So what they're looking to do here is embarrass him.

00:25:19.000 They don't have another candidate.

00:25:21.060 You know, they say they're hoping that they could just force a vote after vote after vote

00:25:24.620 of him not getting it and that he would be so weakened then that somebody else would

00:25:29.120 come forward to say, all right, I'll do it.

00:25:30.760 And that person, presumably more closely aligned with them, would then get the necessary votes.

00:25:36.720 Uh, but either way, it's not a great way for the Republicans to be starting, um, their

00:25:41.640 new term.

00:25:42.380 And we do need a speaker of the house, uh, as much as I, you know, I like gridlock too,

00:25:46.920 but there are certain things we need the house to get done.

00:25:49.420 So we'll find out.

00:25:50.640 Um, okay.

00:25:51.520 Joining me now to discuss it.

00:25:52.940 Uh, we're going to have Emily Jashinsky in one second, but Eliana Johnson is here now. 1.00

00:25:56.480 She's editor in chief of the Washington free beacon and co-host of the podcast, ink stained

00:26:02.260 wretches with Chris Dyerwald.

00:26:04.780 Great to have you back.

00:26:05.840 How you doing?

00:26:07.360 Happy new year, Megan.

00:26:08.620 Doing great.

00:26:09.700 You too, Eliana.

00:26:10.440 So you're actually the perfect person to ask about this because you're neck deep in politics

00:26:14.560 all day long for a living.

00:26:15.720 So what, what's going to happen here?

00:26:17.200 Nobody knows.

00:26:18.980 And that is really the crux of the problem.

00:26:22.120 Suffice it to say, this is not the situation that Kevin McCarthy, the, uh, former majority,

00:26:27.940 the current majority leader wanted to be walking into, um, because Republicans don't have the

00:26:33.360 majority that they expected to have going into this boat.

00:26:37.220 Um, uh, McCarthy can only lose four votes on the floor.

00:26:41.680 And so he has got to make sure he's got every single one of these votes locked down.

00:26:46.820 And he simply hasn't gotten any commitments, um, from all of the Republicans that he needs

00:26:53.460 going into this vote.

00:26:54.580 And you mentioned Megan in your introduction that he's been negotiating and making, making

00:26:59.200 concessions.

00:26:59.880 And I think he thought that in exchange for these concessions, um, the holdouts would

00:27:04.180 say, okay, you've got my vote, but he's been making the concessions and not getting

00:27:08.080 the votes in exchange.

00:27:09.260 Um, and so a failure for McCarthy on this first vote, as you said, would be the first time in

00:27:15.200 a century that this has happened.

00:27:16.880 And the result will be if he wins on a first vote or a second vote, he's going to be a weakened

00:27:24.120 speaker.

00:27:24.800 And that's going to be a problem for Republicans as they, um, head into the majority and, um,

00:27:32.080 face off in, in some kind of a unified front against Biden.

00:27:35.620 Because at the end of the day, this is the Republicans in Congress against a democratic Senate

00:27:40.300 and the Biden administration.

00:27:41.500 This is basically the same sort of wing of the party that's loyal to Trump saying, burn

00:27:46.840 it down.

00:27:47.560 We don't give a damn if he's weakened.

00:27:49.560 We don't give a damn if this is our one branch of government that we, the Republicans control.

00:27:54.220 We're not pro Republican just because, you know, it's, it's not Democrat.

00:27:58.300 We, we object to a lot of the ways Republicans do business too.

00:28:02.040 And we want concessions to us and the way we think in order to support this guy.

00:28:06.960 And I like Kevin McCarthy, but he has been all over the board.

00:28:09.900 He's sort of a notorious flip-flopper when it comes to like currying favor with one group.

00:28:13.820 And then it turns out that's out of favor.

00:28:15.340 And he's like, forget that.

00:28:16.520 I have a new position and these guys sense it.

00:28:19.080 And, you know, I, I guess this is the point, right?

00:28:21.680 To weaken him and cause some chaos.

00:28:23.200 Yes, it's to enhance their power, um, at the expense of his power and probably at the

00:28:31.020 expense of the power of the party.

00:28:33.260 Um, and so going into this, um, they are extracting concessions, um, from McCarthy such as that

00:28:40.620 it only takes five Republicans to, um, call a vote for a new speaker on the house floor.

00:28:46.020 And if you recall, um, this is what did in John Boehner, um, back when it was Boehner,

00:28:50.780 it took only one Republican, uh, to do this.

00:28:53.540 So they've increased it to five.

00:28:55.420 Um, but that is something that means McCarthy's power could go, uh, in the scope of 24 hours.

00:29:01.440 And that's been a huge problem for Republican speakers.

00:29:04.720 And, and you're right.

00:29:05.880 I think they would not say that, you know, where the Trump caucus, um, and that, uh, they

00:29:12.020 want to let chaos rule.

00:29:13.520 They would say that they're adhering to principle over party.

00:29:16.860 They've demanded some investigations, um, an investigation into, uh, commission into, um,

00:29:23.520 China's growing power, um, and a couple of other investigations, um, that McCarthy has

00:29:29.140 agreed to give them.

00:29:30.420 Um, but the reality is, um, they are creating, um, incredible chaos and weakness in Republican

00:29:37.560 house leadership that is really not going to be prepared to unify against, um, Democratic

00:29:43.140 control in the Senate and in the white house.

00:29:46.300 Meanwhile, so there's, there's 222 Republicans now, 213 Democrats, technically to 12 now because

00:29:52.500 one died.

00:29:53.660 Um, so McCarthy needs, he needs 218 and, um, to, to win.

00:29:59.900 So he's got 222 Republicans.

00:30:01.420 He needs 218 to win and you got five to nine holdouts.

00:30:05.440 So it's, you know, not so good.

00:30:06.880 The math, he's got to work on getting a few more over to his side or he's about to be

00:30:11.500 embarrassed.

00:30:11.900 Again, it's happening now.

00:30:12.880 So we've got our eyes on it and we'll bring in the updates.

00:30:15.360 None of the Democrats is moving.

00:30:16.820 According to what I read, they're all going to vote for their minority leader.

00:30:21.040 Now that they're in the minority, Hakeem Jeffries over and over and over.

00:30:24.160 And their instructions are show up for every vote because if they, the fewer Democrats show

00:30:29.580 up, the lower the threshold he needs, because it's basically a majority present for the

00:30:33.580 vote.

00:30:34.260 So they're under strict orders, get your ass into the chamber and make sure you vote so

00:30:39.960 that he has to keep getting 218 and a number they don't think he could get.

00:30:43.840 There's some drama, you know, politics.

00:30:45.840 I don't usually like it at this level when you're really up close to the ugly painting,

00:30:50.240 you know, like it gets unattractive and just hard to follow.

00:30:54.640 But this is kind of an interesting battle.

00:30:56.880 And I'm sure McCarthy will say a win's a win if he gets it ugly or otherwise.

00:31:02.100 Great.

00:31:02.680 But it's really not 100 percent clear he's going to get it.

00:31:05.880 And it could take days now to find out.

00:31:09.200 Absolutely.

00:31:09.620 If McCarthy wins this, he's the speaker of the House and he will definitely say a win is

00:31:14.860 a win.

00:31:15.420 And you're right.

00:31:16.320 This is a majority of the votes of everybody present, of all the lawmakers present on the

00:31:21.180 House floor, Republicans and Democrats.

00:31:23.060 So Republicans need they need to unify their party.

00:31:26.460 As you said, there are 222 Republicans and McCarthy can only afford to lose four because

00:31:33.240 they are essentially voting against all of the Democrats present on the floor.

00:31:37.220 So he needs 218 out of 222 in order to be elected speaker.

00:31:42.300 If he loses on the first vote, they go to a second vote.

00:31:45.020 And where the drama would really begin is if he gets fewer votes on that second vote,

00:31:50.780 the question becomes, does he step down or bow out?

00:31:54.140 Now, McCarthy's people, of course, aren't going in saying, yeah, you know, he'll step

00:31:57.160 aside if we get to a second vote.

00:31:58.760 They're saying he's going to stick it out to a second, third, fourth, fifth vote.

00:32:02.360 But I think in reality, we don't know what will happen.

00:32:05.960 And he does not know exactly how many votes he has.

00:32:08.500 You said, you know, between five and nine.

00:32:10.160 That's a problem.

00:32:10.860 Every one of these votes matters.

00:32:13.340 And because he doesn't have firm commitments from a lot of these guys yet, he doesn't know

00:32:19.480 exactly how many votes he has.

00:32:20.900 If we get to a second or a third vote, you're going to hear people talking about who's the

00:32:24.840 backup here.

00:32:25.940 Who is the backup?

00:32:27.000 And one of the problems for these holdouts, Matt Gaetz and others, is they don't have a

00:32:33.440 preferred candidate?

00:32:34.140 I think Steve Scalise would be the next in line, but he's not exactly their preferred

00:32:40.020 candidate either.

00:32:41.300 He's been a part of House leadership for years and years.

00:32:44.780 And by the way, that would throw all the rest of the Republican House leadership slots open

00:32:51.120 because Scalise holds one and everybody else would start moving around in those slots.

00:32:55.980 So we're in for a lot of drama if this goes to a second or a third vote.

00:33:00.820 What about this?

00:33:01.180 This may be crazy.

00:33:02.120 What about like Elise Stefanik, you know, somebody who is acceptable to the more Trumpy

00:33:06.280 wing of the party, but seems to be liked by most Republicans?

00:33:10.100 I mean, is there anybody like that on on deck?

00:33:13.180 It's a good question, Megan.

00:33:14.520 I think you'd be surprised.

00:33:16.040 Elise Stefanik is one of the few House Republicans.

00:33:19.060 And I have a lot of respect for her.

00:33:20.400 She's a young woman.

00:33:21.080 She's my age, 38, you know, super smart, Harvard graduate, super ambitious.

00:33:26.420 But she was one of the few Republicans who, after this midterm election, came out and endorsed

00:33:32.360 Donald Trump for president.

00:33:34.060 Kevin McCarthy hasn't done that.

00:33:35.680 None of the other House leaders have done that.

00:33:37.640 And I do think that that is something that is going to cause her problems with some of

00:33:41.300 the moderates in the caucus who, you know, were eager for Republican leaders to come out

00:33:46.400 and say, no, Trump was actually the part of the problem in these midterms.

00:33:50.680 And part of the part of the reason that Republicans are in this situation, that they don't have

00:33:55.360 a bigger majority and that they're in the middle of all of this chaos right now.

00:33:59.800 That's the problem.

00:34:00.400 So you you get you shore up that right wing base and you start losing your people start

00:34:04.960 peeling off in the moderate middle and you're back to the same problem, only with a different

00:34:09.320 candidate.

00:34:10.240 All right.

00:34:10.480 Stand by, Eliana.

00:34:11.240 Emily Jashinsky is here.

00:34:12.600 She's culture editor at The Federalist.

00:34:14.440 Highly recommend their podcast as well.

00:34:17.220 Emily, thank you for joining the party.

00:34:18.860 And so before we move on from Speaker McCarthy, do you have any interesting predictions on how this

00:34:23.720 is going to go?

00:34:24.720 Told Kevin McCarthy has gotten to the floor and that the vote will be underway.

00:34:29.380 And I don't know.

00:34:31.760 I don't know.

00:34:32.280 Every smart person I know is like, have no idea.

00:34:35.080 Well, let's watch and see.

00:34:36.960 Yeah.

00:34:37.140 And most of the people I know that have their sort of their finger on the pulse of what's

00:34:42.260 happening with House Republicans say the same thing right now.

00:34:44.580 They have absolutely no idea how this is going to shake out.

00:34:47.360 It's always pretty inscrutable because you never know what backroom deals are being struck.

00:34:51.820 But I would also say that, you know, conservatives should feel comfortable like taking a W on this

00:34:57.340 because House leadership on the Republican side, it's just never going to be Jim Jordan.

00:35:02.880 It's never going to be the sort of conservative fantasy.

00:35:06.180 And I think that's an indictment of the Republican Party, but it's also reality.

00:35:10.700 And what conservatives have done is pushed Kevin McCarthy, really, I mean, gotten some

00:35:17.120 serious concessions out of him.

00:35:18.640 It's hard to even you can't emphasize enough how big his flip flop on the motion to vacate

00:35:23.880 is.

00:35:24.180 That's just a huge concession to the right, puts them back in the situation they were

00:35:27.620 in with John Boehner, which was a hugely successful moment for the Tea Party wing of

00:35:31.660 the Republican Party at the time.

00:35:33.060 And so I think, you know, it's it's a really important thing for conservatives to recognize

00:35:37.660 that this is a new time.

00:35:39.360 They were really able to drag Kevin McCarthy over to the right.

00:35:41.980 And if I had to place a bet, I would say I think McCarthy will pull this off.

00:35:45.860 I think he will ultimately be fine precisely for that reason, because he's been so transactional.

00:35:50.700 He's been so willing to make concessions to House Republicans because and I interviewed

00:35:55.180 him about all this back in September.

00:35:57.240 He does at least one thing you can say, like him or not, is that he really understands the

00:36:02.120 conservative movement right now.

00:36:03.320 He really understands the Trump movement.

00:36:05.220 He knows where voters are.

00:36:06.960 He's not where voters are, but he does know where they are.

00:36:10.260 And that's actually it sounds like a small thing.

00:36:12.480 But for D.C., that's actually a pretty important thing.

00:36:15.880 Well, I was saying he's flip flop a lot, but he survived.

00:36:18.540 You know, it's like you can make the case that was smart flip flopping because he wound up

00:36:22.620 still in office and a lot of those Republicans didn't.

00:36:25.860 One of the things they're going to have to decide today is whether to seat representative

00:36:30.860 elect George Santos.

00:36:33.020 Haven't had the pleasure of discussing this case yet since we were all on break.

00:36:36.340 He's one of the Republicans elected, newly elected in New York, in New York state, one

00:36:40.680 of the ones that made the difference in giving that control to the Republicans.

00:36:44.060 Unfortunately, he appears to be an utter fraud of a politician, of a professional who knows

00:36:52.080 of a man.

00:36:52.640 I don't know, but I'm horrified by what I read in The New York Times.

00:36:56.400 And for once, The New York Times actually took a deep dive.

00:36:58.220 And the first thing I said to my husband was, I really wish they do this on some Democrats

00:37:01.280 that this is great information to have about this guy, Santos.

00:37:04.200 Be wonderful if they would just take a deep dive into George into Joe Biden's many lies.

00:37:07.980 Let's do that next.

00:37:09.340 So I don't mean to dissuade The Times because this was an important piece of journalism.

00:37:12.640 But of course, it's not applied equally.

00:37:14.360 So we'll get to that piece of it in a second.

00:37:15.820 But first, let's update the audience on our new Republican elect congressman from New York's

00:37:21.480 third congressional district.

00:37:23.440 Again, this is this is a district that went for Biden.

00:37:25.700 So he was not supposed to win.

00:37:27.420 This is one of the upsets, which is why Republicans are like, oh, it's terrible.

00:37:31.440 I told the lies.

00:37:34.120 Oh, well, right.

00:37:35.920 Like, I understand why they want the seat and they don't want to make this a deal breaker.

00:37:40.020 So to me, as a journalist, this is kind of fun and interesting to watch.

00:37:43.740 OK, here's the story.

00:37:45.560 He has this New York Times profile revealed that this guy fabricated much of his resume.

00:37:49.740 He claimed to work for Goldman Sachs and Citigroup.

00:37:52.160 Not true.

00:37:52.660 He worked for some third party consulting firm that may or may not have done business with

00:37:56.080 them.

00:37:56.520 Hello, George.

00:37:57.240 That's not the same thing.

00:37:58.880 That is not the same thing at all.

00:38:00.360 Sorry.

00:38:01.220 You could argue that NBC did some business with the Kremlin when I interviewed Putin.

00:38:05.540 That doesn't make me say I work for Putin.

00:38:07.980 OK, so there's a distinction.

00:38:10.000 He said he attended Baruch College.

00:38:11.760 That apparently is also false.

00:38:13.280 He said he's Catholic, but he also claimed Jewish heritage.

00:38:15.940 Recently, recently telling a Jewish news outlet he was a non-observant Jew, a genealogist tapped

00:38:21.160 by CNN to examine his family tree found no evidence of Jewish ancestry.

00:38:26.680 The New York Post interviewed him.

00:38:28.160 He called himself Jew-ish with a dash in between this.

00:38:34.040 Is that a thing?

00:38:35.260 OK, I have a ton of Jewish friends, Orthodox friends lived in a conservative building in

00:38:40.240 New York.

00:38:40.640 Does that make me Jew-ish?

00:38:42.460 I don't think so.

00:38:44.320 He claimed his mother died in the September 11th attacks.

00:38:47.400 Five months later, he tweeted she died in December of 2016.

00:38:50.420 Ladies, I'm sorry.

00:38:52.960 Don't mess with 9-11. 0.65

00:38:54.500 He claimed he lost four employees in the deadly 2016 Pulse nightclub shooting in Orlando.

00:38:59.800 That as well appears to have been a lie.

00:39:02.840 They he also lied about attending Horace Mann prep school here in New York City.

00:39:08.580 He falsely claimed that his grandparents survived the Holocaust.

00:39:11.140 And I guess he's got 9-11.

00:39:13.460 He's got the Holocaust. 0.92

00:39:14.720 He's got the Pulse nightclub, all of which appear to be utter lies, as does his academic

00:39:19.980 resume, whether it's undergrad or college, as does his professional resume, saying he

00:39:24.940 worked at Goldman and Citigroup.

00:39:27.200 He said he grew up with a white Caucasian mother, an immigrant from Belgium.

00:39:31.580 His mother was born in Brazil.

00:39:33.260 OK, according to genealogical records, he claimed to have headed an animal rescue charity.

00:39:37.860 The IRS has absolutely no record of it.

00:39:41.140 He's now under federal investigation as a result of all this by the U.S.

00:39:44.440 Attorney's Office in the Eastern District of New York, by Letitia James, the New York

00:39:48.040 State Attorney General, by prosecutors on Long Island.

00:39:50.540 And all because if he filed election documents or otherwise based on these frauds, based on

00:39:57.280 these lies, it could be an alleged it could be a criminal fraud.

00:39:59.900 He says he's not a criminal.

00:40:01.460 He says he's just an embellisher.

00:40:03.860 It's just an embellisher.

00:40:05.220 Ladies, he he came out and said, I made a mistake.

00:40:11.080 Humans are flawed.

00:40:13.040 We all make mistakes.

00:40:15.420 Alex, I'm sorry, but F this guy, I just that because there are liars on the Democrat side

00:40:21.360 doesn't mean that this is good enough for America.

00:40:24.960 This guy's a serial fabulist who has no business in the U.S.

00:40:29.740 Congress.

00:40:30.280 We need fewer liars, not more.

00:40:33.460 You don't look at the other side's lies and say, fine, let's elect a bunch of liars of our

00:40:37.100 own.

00:40:37.820 So I whatever.

00:40:39.520 OK, he can be seated.

00:40:40.520 I guarantee you the third congressional district had no idea about all this shit when they elected

00:40:44.380 him.

00:40:44.940 But, you know, what can be done is he can be promptly booted out if you have two thirds

00:40:48.000 of the vote of of the party of both sides, because there's a provision in the Constitution

00:40:53.040 to make that happen as well.

00:40:54.300 All right.

00:40:55.060 That's that's the story.

00:40:56.600 Let me start with you, Ana Eliana.

00:40:58.240 What should happen here?

00:40:59.800 Oh, man, Megan, I can tell you what I think should happen.

00:41:03.700 But, you know, I think what will happen is they're going to seat the guy.

00:41:07.120 He's going to remain a member.

00:41:08.300 You know, serial fabulous liar.

00:41:10.580 That probably applies to a lot of the members of the United States Congress, I hate to say

00:41:15.500 doesn't make it right.

00:41:17.540 But this guy, I have to say, takes it to a whole new level.

00:41:23.460 You know, we point to a lot of Democrats who have done this, but like every detail of this

00:41:27.340 guy's resume is embellished.

00:41:29.160 And I think what it comes down to is in all likelihood, he will be put back in front of

00:41:34.040 the voters in two years of his district.

00:41:35.960 And they can decide whether this is OK with them or not.

00:41:38.820 That is what I predict will happen.

00:41:40.380 Oh, my God.

00:41:41.160 He got in based on a fraud based on a fraud.

00:41:43.220 He didn't disclose all that to those people before the vote.

00:41:46.100 Article one, section five of the Constitution grants the House and the Senate the right

00:41:49.400 to kick out members.

00:41:50.380 Expulsion requires a two thirds vote.

00:41:52.680 I know it's not going to happen, Emily.

00:41:54.560 It's not going to happen.

00:41:55.280 They're not going to get two thirds to vote to kick this guy out.

00:41:57.380 But it really just is a testament to how we have no standards.

00:42:00.780 And apparently we don't have an aggressive enough media, whether you're a Republican or a

00:42:04.340 Democrat, because this should have been done before the vote.

00:42:07.740 Well, and yeah, that's one of the best takes I've seen is like this is a huge, I think,

00:42:12.260 problem with local media that we used to have so much more of a robust local media and national

00:42:17.620 media now is so big and so full of people who are not going to be doing the sort of legwork,

00:42:22.960 the shoe leather journalism that would happen in a district.

00:42:25.720 I think this is actually part of the reason we saw all of this flare ups at school board meetings,

00:42:29.520 because there were no reporters in the room for years and parents suddenly over Zoom found

00:42:34.240 out what was happening in the classrooms because there was nobody in the media and their local

00:42:37.760 media paying attention to it for them.

00:42:39.700 So we're going to start seeing some of this stuff happen more and more stuff that would

00:42:42.600 have been caught by local media.

00:42:44.840 Republicans always do vulnerability studies on their own candidates.

00:42:47.800 So it's pretty interesting.

00:42:49.640 The pattern of money that didn't go to George Santos.

00:42:52.080 What did Republicans know about this period anyway?

00:42:54.900 Now, I understand the perspective, you know, if Democrats are so curious about this pattern

00:43:00.360 of lies, they they will be shocked to learn about Ilhan Omar's past, for instance.

00:43:05.320 I can wait until they just married a brother. 0.71

00:43:07.400 I don't know.

00:43:09.020 So I understand people being like, listen, they're all warm bodies anyway.

00:43:12.760 You just want them to vote in a certain way or not.

00:43:15.740 But at the same time, this guy clearly has zero respect for his constituents because he lied

00:43:20.740 to them.

00:43:21.460 I think, you know, there is a democratic process not to seat him.

00:43:24.280 And there's a democratic process to to recall the election, perhaps, however, the sort of

00:43:28.560 mechanisms locally are for that.

00:43:30.540 So maybe we will see it happen.

00:43:32.060 But what they could do is basically what they did with Steve King.

00:43:34.700 They stripped him of his committees so you can seat him and then not put him on committees.

00:43:38.980 And that's probably what I'll expect.

00:43:40.540 What I would expect is.

00:43:41.880 OK, that's something.

00:43:43.220 Eliana, I made a mistake.

00:43:45.060 You oh, you were mistaken that your mom died in 9-11.

00:43:48.280 Oh, OK.

00:43:48.700 You were mistaken about your grandparents dying in the Holocaust.

00:43:51.400 You were mistaken that your four employees died at the Pulse.

00:43:53.720 That is not shit that we forget or make mistakes about.

00:43:57.060 The guy's seriously got a fundamental.

00:43:58.660 Now, I get it.

00:43:59.520 I get it.

00:44:00.200 Because like I you look at that because, of course, I read all of it.

00:44:03.320 Right.

00:44:03.560 And I'm looking at Jim Garrity over at National Review who reminded us of some of the Biden

00:44:09.000 lies.

00:44:09.920 He said he was arrested during a civil rights march.

00:44:11.980 Not true.

00:44:12.420 He spent part of a part of a summer working as a tractor trailer driver.

00:44:15.680 No, was arrested while trying to read Nelson Mandela.

00:44:18.660 Try again.

00:44:19.580 His son, Beau, was killed in Iraq.

00:44:21.000 No, he wasn't.

00:44:21.880 He graduated top of his class in college.

00:44:23.740 Actually, it was toward the bottom.

00:44:25.640 He, of course, he said he hit a home run in one of the three sixty eight.

00:44:29.320 I don't even know what that is.

00:44:29.980 Home run in one of the congressional baseball games.

00:44:32.240 Untrue that his first job offer was from an Idaho timber company.

00:44:35.640 Wrong that he then he later admitted to overstating his academic record in the 1980s.

00:44:40.280 He, of course, was bowed out of one of the presidential campaigns earlier because of his plagiarism

00:44:45.220 of other speeches and so on, claiming that they were his own.

00:44:49.100 Hillary Clinton claimed she was fired at on the tarmac.

00:44:51.980 Remember that lie in Bosnia? 0.92

00:44:54.420 Cheryl Ackeson called BS on that because she was there.

00:44:56.820 Elizabeth Warren said she was Native American.

00:44:58.400 She's not because of her mom on her paw paw and her high cheekbones.

00:45:01.760 Bull.

00:45:02.500 Like, we could go on.

00:45:04.000 Right.

00:45:04.520 I get it.

00:45:05.740 But this guy hasn't told the truth about anything so far as I can see.

00:45:10.480 Yeah, I was going to say, don't forget Richard Blumenthal saying that he served in Vietnam

00:45:14.660 and he didn't, but it's true.

00:45:17.560 I think the scale and the intricate level of detail of this guy's lies about his heritage,

00:45:25.180 his schooling, and his professional background adds up to a made-up life

00:45:30.720 that is a different level than what we've seen with others.

00:45:35.160 Clearly, he's got some kind of mental problem or, you know, he's a sociopath.

00:45:40.840 I don't know how to diagnose him, but the guy has a serious problem.

00:45:45.780 What if he's a Manchurian candidate?

00:45:48.560 We know so little about him, right?

00:45:50.300 Like, who the hell knows?

00:45:53.760 Seriously, it's like every tragedy, he somehow has inserted the story of his life

00:45:58.660 into, like, the grand American narrative in a way that's, like, he's cast himself

00:46:02.800 as the Forrest Gump of the new millennium because he thinks that this is some way

00:46:07.520 to win hearts and minds.

00:46:08.920 But to Eliana's point, listen, here in D.C., we all know this.

00:46:12.560 Like, they all have mental problems.

00:46:14.140 But this guy seems to be on another level of having a mental problem

00:46:17.300 that clearly he's unfit for office.

00:46:19.800 Oh, my God.

00:46:20.600 You know, by the way, even sexuality, like, we're not sure about here.

00:46:23.800 Yes.

00:46:24.340 I mean, he may be a fake gay. 1.00

00:46:25.920 Every single detail, we're not quite sure about.

00:46:28.340 Yeah.

00:46:28.660 He may be a fake gay. 1.00

00:46:29.680 He says he's gay.

00:46:30.560 Now we don't know whether he's gay at all.

00:46:32.020 I was at a dinner party or the Christmas break, and one of the questions they asked was,

00:46:35.440 name something you believed when you were young that you found out later was totally

00:46:37.820 untrue.

00:46:38.380 Or you could do the reverse, something you thought was untrue as a kid that you found

00:46:40.980 out later was true.

00:46:41.820 And I said, you know, when I was a kid, I actually used to respect, like, our politicians,

00:46:46.500 you know, members of the House.

00:46:47.680 That seemed respectable and exciting and accomplished to me.

00:46:50.520 Even members of the Senate.

00:46:52.100 Never mind president.

00:46:53.020 And then as a grown up, I felt differently.

00:46:56.660 Okay.

00:46:57.380 Stand by.

00:46:58.640 I'll let you ponder that question over the break and pick it up there when we come back.

00:47:01.980 So much more to cover as the EJs stay with us for our second hour. 1.00

00:47:05.880 Don't forget, you can find The Megyn Kelly Show live on Sirius XM Triumph Channel 111 every

00:47:09.900 weekday at noon east.

00:47:10.980 The full video show and clips by subscribing to our YouTube channel, youtube.com slash Megyn

00:47:15.060 Kelly.

00:47:15.500 Help us get over the 700,000 subscriber bar right on our YouTube channel.

00:47:20.280 That would be great.

00:47:20.880 I would love it.

00:47:21.460 If you prefer an audio podcast, follow and download wherever you get your podcast for

00:47:24.900 free.

00:47:25.120 Here is the latest.

00:47:31.140 Not going very well for Kevin.

00:47:33.040 He's lost four votes.

00:47:36.040 Again, he can lose four, but he can't lose five.

00:47:38.240 And he so far has lost Dan Bishop, Lauren Boebert, Andy Biggs.

00:47:43.900 Oh, just got the fifth.

00:47:44.900 He's lost.

00:47:45.820 So he's officially lost the speakership on the first vote, which hasn't happened in 100

00:47:50.260 years.

00:47:50.720 So not great, not not great, as the kids would say.

00:47:55.640 He's going to have to go.

00:47:57.180 He's going to have to go again.

00:47:58.640 And we'll see whether they do that right now or or later.

00:48:01.780 The New York Times reporting there were murmurs and oohs from the crowd as Lauren Boebert voted

00:48:06.960 for Jim Jordan instead of Kevin McCarthy because she had previously declined to say who she was

00:48:12.600 going to support or who she would vote for as an opponent to McCarthy.

00:48:18.100 So in any event, it didn't go his way and we've made history.

00:48:22.580 Can I just ask?

00:48:25.100 It's not just the New York Times saying this is going to be an embarrassment for the GOP

00:48:28.120 or that he's going to be weakened.

00:48:29.880 When I read that first, I'm like, oh, of course, the New York Times.

00:48:32.440 But then there are former there's like a guy in one of the papers who worked for the past

00:48:37.020 two Republican speakers of the House.

00:48:39.460 And he's saying, no, this will legitimately be very embarrassing for Kevin McCarthy, for the

00:48:45.220 Republicans.

00:48:45.620 And it actually will hobble the next speaker, the GOP speaker, whether it's Kevin or somebody

00:48:50.560 else.

00:48:51.340 How?

00:48:51.940 Like, how exactly will the if you if he lands it, how is this process going to hobble him?

00:48:58.060 Anyone want to take that?

00:48:59.580 I don't.

00:49:00.020 Yeah, I also don't buy that because the fissures in his relationships with some of these Freedom 0.59

00:49:05.040 Caucus members already existed.

00:49:06.840 So they already know what they're getting with Kevin McCarthy.

00:49:09.320 Everybody in the House Republican conference knows what they're getting with Kevin McCarthy.

00:49:15.480 These five members are just saying we're not buying it.

00:49:19.580 We're not standing for it.

00:49:20.940 We don't want it.

00:49:22.300 But they they're not in disagreement with whether or not Kevin where Kevin McCarthy sort of stands

00:49:27.060 on the ideological spectrum.

00:49:28.640 And obviously, you need to have really good relationships.

00:49:30.740 Kevin McCarthy has prided himself on his ability to make relationships with his.

00:49:35.240 He's, for instance, very close with Jim Jordan.

00:49:37.240 He saw one of his biggest moves as putting Jim Jordan on the oversight committee, which

00:49:41.420 a lot of the establishment Republicans did not want him to do to to ask Jordan to to head

00:49:46.360 that committee.

00:49:47.260 Famously, a very good maneuver by Kevin McCarthy.

00:49:49.420 He's actually has a pretty close relationship with Marjorie Taylor Greene, who has been supportive

00:49:54.080 of him throughout this process.

00:49:55.920 So I don't know that it's necessarily going to weaken him.

00:49:59.660 It'll worsen relationships that are already bad.

00:50:03.020 And that's not a huge if if he pulls it off, which I think he will.

00:50:07.440 The latest I heard is that the Lauren Boeberts and Andy Biggs who have sort of made this

00:50:11.760 like very clear red line, what they're now negotiating for is committee spots, better committee

00:50:16.820 spots.

00:50:17.680 So maybe that's what happens on the second ballot.

00:50:19.760 He gives in on some of that stuff.

00:50:21.600 But I don't think this really dramatically changes.

00:50:24.920 It's obviously not great for Kevin McCarthy, but I don't think it really dramatically changes

00:50:28.660 the dynamic.

00:50:29.460 That dynamic was already there.

00:50:31.420 OK, and the update is now six have voted against McCarthy in total.

00:50:36.200 And the number will continue to go at this point.

00:50:38.160 It kind of doesn't matter.

00:50:39.100 It's not not going to go, I don't think, much above nine.

00:50:42.360 But the point is, he needs to get those numbers down.

00:50:44.600 He can only lose four.

00:50:45.640 So we'll see.

00:50:46.180 OK, although what might happen is, though, as some people start voting against him, he

00:50:50.460 then gets like a lot of people.

00:50:52.380 There's a flood.

00:50:53.040 They say it's OK because we're all going to vote against him on the first ballot.

00:50:56.200 We can tell our constituents we did that.

00:50:58.160 Then we move on to the second ballot.

00:50:59.800 So it's possible something like that happens, too.

00:51:02.060 Good point.

00:51:02.700 All right.

00:51:02.880 Well, we'll give you the final count when we have it.

00:51:05.160 Let's talk presidential politics, because there is a very little going on.

00:51:09.120 And it is kind of interesting.

00:51:10.280 You know, I said this on my show before the break, like, what happened to Trump?

00:51:13.900 Where where did he go?

00:51:15.100 Like he did the big announcement and OK, we're off to the races.

00:51:18.960 And normally, you know, when they do the announcements at the normal time, which is usually like late

00:51:23.120 spring, it'll be late spring of this year.

00:51:25.420 Then you see them go on the campaign trail.

00:51:27.540 You see them make the TV rounds.

00:51:28.840 You see them do start to do some rallies and go to Iowa and go to New Hampshire.

00:51:32.700 None of that's happening.

00:51:34.400 So Olivia Nuzzi of New York magazine must have had the same thought.

00:51:37.580 And she's interviewed Trump before.

00:51:39.620 And she went down there.

00:51:40.920 I love when Trump gives these interviews to people from what is clearly the left wing press,

00:51:45.600 though, I think she's fair and then expects it to be a fawning piece.

00:51:49.480 Right.

00:51:49.840 I don't actually know if he expects it.

00:51:51.880 He would like it to be.

00:51:52.840 And he gives these interviews and they never wind up being a fawning piece.

00:51:56.380 And then he attacks the reporters, which is, you know, lather, rinse, repeat.

00:51:59.280 That's what happened here.

00:52:00.560 She prints the piece on December 23rd in New York magazine.

00:52:03.880 The headline is the final campaign inside Donald Trump's sad, lonely, thirsty, broken,

00:52:10.280 basically pretend run for reelection, which isn't to say he can't win.

00:52:14.280 All right.

00:52:14.900 So she does sort of take us into what's happening.

00:52:18.480 And I thought that was interesting because I have been wondering, what's he doing?

00:52:21.280 Not much is the answer.

00:52:22.840 According to her piece, she says since his announcement, he's barely set foot outside

00:52:27.920 the perimeter of Mar-a-Lago for 28 days.

00:52:30.700 In fact, he has not left the state of Florida at all.

00:52:32.820 He is sensitive about this.

00:52:34.420 He does not like what it suggests.

00:52:35.880 So he does not accept the premise.

00:52:37.740 Basically tries to tell her I am outside of Mar-a-Lago quite a bit.

00:52:40.800 I'm always largely outside of Mar-a-Lago at meetings and various other things and events.

00:52:44.380 I'm down in Miami.

00:52:45.140 I go to Miami.

00:52:46.180 I go to different places in Florida.

00:52:47.380 She responds.

00:52:48.380 What he means to say when he says Miami is that his SUV rolls down the driveway past

00:52:53.220 the pristine lawn set for croquet and through the Secret Service checkpoint at the gate for

00:52:57.220 the two hour trip to another piece of Trump real estate, the Trump National in Doral, about

00:53:02.500 eight miles from the airport in Miami-Dade County.

00:53:05.240 There he meets regularly with an impressive, ideological diverse, ideologically diverse range

00:53:10.700 of policy wonks, diplomats and political theorists for conversations about the global economy

00:53:15.280 and military conflicts and constitutional law.

00:53:17.980 And I'm kidding.

00:53:18.580 He goes there to play golf.

00:53:22.000 That's Olivia's clever turn. 0.99

00:53:24.280 I have to say it made me laugh out loud.

00:53:26.800 One advisor says his world has gotten much smaller.

00:53:29.620 He is sensitive.

00:53:30.700 She writes about smallness.

00:53:32.400 One advisor said when he was in New York in 2016, the whole world was coming to him.

00:53:37.140 Now we've got the villages and it shows.

00:53:39.700 A former White House official says it feels like he's going through the motions because

00:53:42.900 he said he would.

00:53:45.080 And Olivia says, look, this is about his need for attention, which is tied up with his fear

00:53:49.920 of boredom.

00:53:50.900 He doesn't have anything else to do, said one advisor.

00:53:53.200 What else can he do?

00:53:53.900 Why do you think he saw Kanye?

00:53:55.400 He wants to be relevant.

00:53:56.500 He wants the limelight.

00:53:57.340 He's thirsty.

00:53:58.280 And the second is his fear of arrest.

00:54:01.340 But Trump denies that played into his earlier announcement.

00:54:04.820 He defends the number of people at his announcement, saying the room was packed, sold out.

00:54:11.760 Olivia points out tickets were actually not sold at all.

00:54:14.520 Guests were invited.

00:54:15.240 The room was full, but it was not at capacity.

00:54:17.100 Chairs remained empty.

00:54:18.940 Some more glaringly than others.

00:54:20.520 And this is the final bit I wanted to read to you.

00:54:23.200 Trump's campaign schedule, described to me as busy, involved 11 events over the course

00:54:27.240 of the month.

00:54:27.780 One event was the announcement itself.

00:54:29.520 Five took place at Mar-a-Lago.

00:54:31.060 Four were not events at all, but tape videos that were aired at events where Trump was not

00:54:36.940 physically present.

00:54:39.380 His response was to say New York Magazine's on its last legs.

00:54:41.800 It's failing.

00:54:42.700 The reporter was shaky and an unattractive whack job known as tough, but dumb as a rock.

00:54:49.000 Now, I will say this.

00:54:50.340 One thing you cannot say about Olivia Nuzzi is that she is unattractive or dumb. 1.00

00:54:54.840 She is both very beautiful and obviously very smart. 0.89

00:54:58.240 But, you know, Trump's going to Trump.

00:54:59.840 And that is where we are.

00:55:02.320 But it brings me to the larger thought of what is he doing?

00:55:06.620 Why?

00:55:07.560 Why is he sitting down there?

00:55:09.340 And she's right.

00:55:10.300 There have been no real events.

00:55:11.820 So why not?

00:55:15.000 This is the invisible campaign for president where we haven't really seen Trump since his

00:55:20.980 announcement, which was itself underwhelming and poorly timed, coming on the heels of a

00:55:26.460 disappointing midterm for Republicans, for which many blame Trump's influence.

00:55:32.020 But I think, Megan, you and Olivia put your finger on the problem here is you said, why

00:55:39.360 is he doing this?

00:55:40.560 The problem is that there is no why for him.

00:55:43.760 If there was a why he would be out on the campaign trail articulating that why and taking advantage

00:55:51.240 of the fact that he doesn't have competitors.

00:55:54.520 It's just him and Biden right now.

00:55:56.940 And he could be garnering headlines, eating up airtime.

00:56:00.940 That is why he sits down and talks to the press, because he likes to see himself in the headlines

00:56:05.360 and he likes to square off against the press.

00:56:07.860 He does thrive on this stuff.

00:56:09.660 But his articulation of why he's running is to go back to what was.

00:56:15.260 He doesn't have really a why for the future.

00:56:18.740 And in fact, when he's campaigned for candidates in the midterms, you know, Republicans are uneasy

00:56:24.840 about it.

00:56:25.340 They think he's causing them, you know, as much, if not more problems than he's doing

00:56:32.360 good for the party at this point.

00:56:34.460 And so he he's he's in a tough place.

00:56:39.620 He's in a tough place with some serious competitors about to emerge.

00:56:44.540 Yes.

00:56:44.860 Now, the Federalists, I should point out, you know, Molly Hemingway, all of you guys have

00:56:48.960 always been very fair to Trump.

00:56:51.000 So what what's the what do you in your view?

00:56:53.300 What's the game plan here or is there not?

00:56:56.480 Is this folly for him to just be sitting down there not doing anything with this?

00:57:00.400 I mean, you could argue it's a it's an advantage he has for all these months just being the

00:57:03.720 only candidate in the GOP field.

00:57:05.520 Not really if he's just playing golf.

00:57:08.860 Right.

00:57:09.360 Yeah.

00:57:09.680 And the meetings all being or the campaign events that Olivia listed out all being at

00:57:13.620 Mar-a-Lago, I think, is a good indication also of how serious the campaign is at this

00:57:18.120 point.

00:57:18.380 But that's what's tough is, you know, there was the cycle with Trump in 2015 and 2016.

00:57:24.320 We all remember it.

00:57:25.520 You know, this is it.

00:57:26.240 He's getting more desperate.

00:57:27.280 He's lashing out.

00:57:28.460 He's really done it.

00:57:29.980 Voters won't stand for this.

00:57:31.640 Even Trump voters won't like this.

00:57:33.520 And the sort of pundit class tried over and over again to sort of say that this the line

00:57:39.140 had had now been crossed and it never turned out to be true because all of the other Republicans

00:57:44.620 turned out to be worse than Trump.

00:57:46.500 And it's always hard to predict exactly how bad the other Republicans will go and how bad

00:57:52.840 the sort of other options will be.

00:57:54.860 And if Trump is sort of savvy enough to manipulate himself, maneuver himself into being a spoil

00:58:01.940 or, you know, the exact sort of thing that can be the contrast that voters will latch

00:58:08.500 onto and say, we have zero standards for politicians anymore.

00:58:11.800 So you might as well throw this guy back in.

00:58:13.820 So I don't know.

00:58:15.120 It's really hard to predict that.

00:58:16.480 But I will say he took a step in clearly the wrong direction.

00:58:19.540 Again, on New Year's Day, he posted on Truth Social a really bitter, a really bitter kind

00:58:26.840 of rant against pro-life voters who he said got the big win at the Supreme Court because

00:58:32.260 of him.

00:58:32.960 He had a sentence on the Truth Social post that literally just says, it wasn't my fault,

00:58:36.840 like a five-year-old, right?

00:58:38.020 Like, it wasn't my fault, mom.

00:58:39.820 Let me read it for it because I have it here.

00:58:41.400 It wasn't my fault that the Republicans did not live up to expectations in the midterms.

00:58:45.920 I was 233 to 20 wins versus losses.

00:58:49.540 It was the abortion issue, poorly handled by many Republicans, especially those that

00:58:55.340 firmly insisted on no exceptions, even in the case of rape, incest or life of the mother

00:58:59.880 that lost large numbers of voters.

00:59:02.380 Also, the people that pushed so hard for decades against abortion got their wish from the U.S.

00:59:05.840 Supreme Court and just plain disappeared not to be seen again.

00:59:08.760 Plus, Mitch, stupid numbers, meaning money.

00:59:12.740 And then he also went into it.

00:59:14.140 Yet another attack on Mitch's wife, Mitch McConnell's wife, Elaine Chao, who served the country

00:59:18.960 admirable, admirably is, but now refers to her by this.

00:59:22.220 I don't even understand.

00:59:23.900 They say it's a racist nickname, Coco Chow.

00:59:26.520 I don't I don't I don't know what it is.

00:59:28.940 I don't know what that is.

00:59:29.780 I know it's meant to be derogatory and she considers it offensive.

00:59:33.480 He can't get off of her.

00:59:34.860 God, he's very angry with her and McConnell.

00:59:37.160 But in any event, continue your point.

00:59:38.760 It's not my fault.

00:59:40.380 And I've seen multiple pro-life groups sort of come out because this is a really big deal

00:59:44.120 for them, right?

00:59:44.580 Like most pro-life voters would take the victory in the Dobbs case over winning the

00:59:49.420 midterms any day because they see it as a matter of life and death.

00:59:52.900 But multiple pro-life groups have actually proactively put out statements saying this

00:59:56.880 is wrong.

00:59:57.540 This interpretation of the results is wrong.

01:00:00.100 And I think maybe you can make Trump's case in a place like Michigan where it was on the

01:00:03.600 ballot.

01:00:04.060 And maybe that's what puts Alyssa Slotkin over the edge or something like that. 1.00

01:00:06.840 But overall, it's just not a sharp analysis, but it is a self-interested one because Trump

01:00:12.480 needs a scapegoat and Trump is always the scapegoat for establishment Republicans.

01:00:17.340 They can always sort of point to him.

01:00:18.660 But there's truth in all of this.

01:00:20.220 I mean, there's a lot of blame to go around and he cannot escape it.

01:00:24.460 And instead, and he shouldn't escape it.

01:00:26.220 He's absolutely part of the problem in many cases.

01:00:29.120 And so when you're pointing the finger at other people, but not being willing to sort

01:00:34.700 of reconsider yourself, that's going to be a huge problem for Trump going forward because

01:00:39.580 voters rejected him in the popular vote twice.

01:00:43.340 And he's yeah.

01:00:44.020 So he's I mean, he's actually never won the popular vote in this country.

01:00:46.320 And he obviously has an advantage in the Electoral College.

01:00:48.500 But even that didn't go for him.

01:00:50.120 So obviously, obviously, he has problems, too.

01:00:53.860 All right.

01:00:54.040 So let's follow this logic through.

01:00:55.500 Right.

01:00:55.860 OK, so so Trump is problematic.

01:00:57.860 He shoots his mouth off and he says things that aren't so great.

01:01:00.860 So the GOP needs somebody new.

01:01:03.160 They need somebody without the baggage.

01:01:05.400 They need somebody that the media won't do this to, that the media will be fair to or at

01:01:09.240 least who is not constantly getting attacked and dominating the news cycle in a negative

01:01:13.000 way.

01:01:13.620 Ron DeSantis.

01:01:14.800 Enter Ron DeSantis.

01:01:16.060 Yeah, he did so many things that the Republicans love.

01:01:18.800 Oh, wait, there's Vanity Fair to give us a little preview of how that's going to go.

01:01:24.220 It's so amazing that the media is just so predictable when it comes to the GOP.

01:01:29.340 OK, it came out, I think yesterday, Monday.

01:01:32.720 A comprehensive guide to why a Ron DeSantis presidency would be as terrifying as a Trump

01:01:38.640 one.

01:01:39.500 Terrifying.

01:01:40.160 Hold on to your socks.

01:01:41.980 I'm going to give you a couple of highlights.

01:01:43.540 He thinks it's OK to treat human beings like chattel. 0.95

01:01:46.740 That's the Martha's Vineyard thing. 1.00

01:01:48.500 He is dangerously anti-science.

01:01:51.060 Examples.

01:01:52.040 He said we would, quote, never do any of these lockdowns again.

01:01:55.100 Oh, we might want lockdowns.

01:01:57.040 We love lockdowns.

01:01:57.940 How dare he say that?

01:01:59.060 He withheld pay from school board members requiring masks.

01:02:02.100 Meanwhile, I was like, he did.

01:02:03.660 I missed that one.

01:02:04.200 That's awesome.

01:02:05.500 He offered unvaccinated cops five thousand dollars to relocate to Florida.

01:02:10.280 Who the hell's offended by that?

01:02:12.020 OK, he he appointed Joseph Latipo to serve a surgeon general.

01:02:16.740 Of course, he doesn't like they don't like Latipo because he opposed masking and lockdowns

01:02:20.820 and question the safety of vaccines.

01:02:23.200 That's that you're not allowed to touch the vaccines.

01:02:25.480 He wants to make it harder for people to vote like voter I.D.

01:02:28.240 laws.

01:02:29.020 He's he passed the, quote, don't say gay bill.

01:02:31.700 Where they said you can't put sexuality or trans education into the curriculum for K through

01:02:38.040 third graders.

01:02:39.320 He's a massive bully.

01:02:40.740 He's anti-abortion.

01:02:42.500 Guess what?

01:02:42.880 Every single Republican president ever has been anti-abortion.

01:02:46.400 He supported Donald Trump.

01:02:48.140 He saw no need for the Respect for Marriage Act.

01:02:51.460 He has no interest in preventing gun violence.

01:02:55.220 And wait for it.

01:02:57.000 According to people who know him, people who know them now passes as a source in a magazine

01:03:04.200 or people who know.

01:03:05.000 OK, who?

01:03:05.800 What people?

01:03:06.640 Do they have a bad experience with him?

01:03:08.620 Tell me more.

01:03:10.580 He is an awful person and has been for many years.

01:03:14.060 Like it's it's closed, case closed.

01:03:18.740 It's quantifiable.

01:03:19.680 Like this is where he started being an awful person.

01:03:21.920 And he's been an awful person ever since many, many years in there.

01:03:24.880 So what do you make of it, Eliana?

01:03:27.820 Well, I take issue with one of the things you said, which was Republicans need a savior.

01:03:33.280 The media is going to love him.

01:03:34.820 That's that's where I think we're getting it wrong.

01:03:36.880 OK, my sarcasm media is going to hate any Republican candidate.

01:03:41.960 But that doesn't mean that Republicans can't do better than Trump.

01:03:45.700 You know, if if Republic if Ron DeSantis becomes the Republican nominee, of course, the media

01:03:51.620 will hate him.

01:03:52.240 I think the difference between Trump, who is problematic and an improvement upon Trump

01:03:58.700 will be somebody who does a better job uniting the Republican Party as opposed to dividing

01:04:04.420 it against itself.

01:04:05.480 You know, Trump now is pointing the finger of pro-lifers who are an important part of the

01:04:10.600 constituency.

01:04:12.020 And I think Republicans have to hope that they find a nominee who as aggressively as Trump

01:04:19.240 takes it to the media and to and to others who, you know, are enemies oftentimes of conservatives

01:04:30.600 and of Republicans, but who more often than not do unite Republicans.

01:04:35.600 You've seen Trump time and again point the finger at fellow Republicans who don't endorse

01:04:41.760 him, who criticize him.

01:04:43.960 The party can't succeed with that.

01:04:45.720 And we're seeing some of it play out on the House floor right now where the party's divided

01:04:49.140 against each other.

01:04:49.860 Look, suffice it to say, this is not how Nancy Pelosi's vote for House Speaker went down. 0.98

01:04:56.780 And Republicans are not going to elect a president with the leaders of the party pointing fingers

01:05:02.360 at each other.

01:05:03.240 They need a candidate that can unite the party rather than divide it against each other.

01:05:09.700 That's a good point.

01:05:10.560 I mean, listen, you're exactly right that this what we're seeing today on the House floor

01:05:13.960 is the consequence of those disastrous midterms where, yes, the GOP won the House, but not

01:05:18.700 nearly in the numbers they expected.

01:05:20.060 And he wouldn't be having these problems if they had, you know.

01:05:23.280 By the way, Megan, I would add the problem is that a candidate like Trump unites Democrats

01:05:29.680 at the same time, unites Democrats, divides Republicans.

01:05:33.060 Republicans need to look to people who who unite them at the same time as unite the opposition

01:05:41.260 and eat away at some of that opposition.

01:05:44.200 You've seen Ron DeSantis do this in Florida.

01:05:46.040 He's peeling away some of the centrist voters.

01:05:49.680 Republicans need more of that and less of people who really, really gear up their opposition

01:05:54.860 and pit them against each other.

01:05:57.000 But here is where the rubber meets the road, my friends, because if Trump loses to DeSantis

01:06:02.340 in the primary, he's going to spoil the general for the GOP.

01:06:06.860 Does anybody think he's not going to spoil the general for the GOP?

01:06:10.440 He's going to tell all of his voters, stay home.

01:06:13.100 You're not Republicans.

01:06:14.380 You're Trumplicans and F this party. 1.00

01:06:17.620 And, you know, we're not we're not going to back this sort of, you know, elite country

01:06:22.480 club Republican.

01:06:23.560 Meanwhile, consider what Trump's been doing for the past month.

01:06:26.900 Mar-a-Lago back to the golf club.

01:06:28.780 But anyway, he's going to say we're not going to back these establishment Republicans.

01:06:32.240 They're swampy.

01:06:33.060 Stay home.

01:06:34.260 And the reason I raise that is because there was a very interesting piece in American Greatness,

01:06:39.420 which is pro-Trump Web website.

01:06:41.600 I think it's fair to say he shared an article from it titled The Coming Split.

01:06:46.980 He shared this article without comment.

01:06:49.560 And here's what the article argued.

01:06:51.860 The writer, Dan Galertner, said, what should we do when a majority of Republicans want

01:06:58.060 Trump?

01:06:58.580 A majority of Republicans want Trump, but the Republican Party says we can't have him.

01:07:04.720 He is not a uniparty team player.

01:07:07.240 They would rather lose an election to the Democrats, their brothers in crime.

01:07:11.640 This is establishment Republicans, then win with Trump.

01:07:15.320 This leads us to the inevitable question.

01:07:17.340 What should we do in a majority of Republicans want Trump, but the party says we can't have

01:07:20.160 him. Do we knuckle under and vote for DeSantis because he'd be vastly better than any Democrat?

01:07:26.160 Right. And then he concludes, no, we don't knuckle under.

01:07:30.380 And I like DeSantis, he says.

01:07:31.640 I would vote for him after Trump's second term, but not before.

01:07:36.120 Do I think Trump can win as a third party candidate?

01:07:38.860 No. Would I vote for him as a third party candidate?

01:07:41.720 Yes, because I'm not interested in propping up this corrupt gravy train any longer.

01:07:47.780 And Trump shared this thing.

01:07:50.160 He shared this. So, I mean, that's the closest we've gotten to him saying, dismiss me in the

01:07:55.380 primary at your own peril.

01:07:58.020 You should either go down with me or win with me in the general.

01:08:01.280 But if you dismiss me for DeSantis in the primary, I'll take the whole ship down.

01:08:05.760 What do you make of it, Emily?

01:08:07.020 Yeah, that article is premised on a really critical error, which is that most Republicans

01:08:11.260 want Donald Trump.

01:08:12.360 There's statistically zero evidence for that.

01:08:14.800 And there has been zero evidence for that since 2015.

01:08:17.320 If there was Donald Trump and another sort of foil candidate in the Republican primary,

01:08:21.520 if Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio had dropped out or whatever, if they had all dropped out, most

01:08:25.720 voters voted against Donald Trump.

01:08:27.900 They voted for somebody else.

01:08:29.520 And in that primary, that meant, you know, that was voting against Donald Trump largely.

01:08:33.680 And right now there's a huge chunk of the Republican Party that's not interested.

01:08:36.880 It's like a third of the Republican Party does like Donald Trump.

01:08:39.280 And there are a lot of people, I wrote about this in The Federalist recently, who have very

01:08:42.680 good reasons for wanting to support Donald Trump and not wanting to vote for any other

01:08:46.760 conventional Republican politician, you know, a career politician, somebody who didn't

01:08:51.540 make their money in the business world, whatever, because a lot of voters said, and it was

01:08:55.060 a rational choice, this system has screwed me for years and years and years.

01:08:58.820 So I don't care if this person is a poor character.

01:09:01.160 In fact, I love it.

01:09:01.960 I think it's funny because Washington is a circus anyway.

01:09:04.900 So I'm just casting this.

01:09:06.120 Maybe it's a protest vote.

01:09:07.140 Maybe you genuinely like Trump, but it's not entirely irrational if you have been screwed

01:09:11.740 by the system over and over again.

01:09:13.060 And I think some people in the DeSantis camp, not DeSantis himself, they don't totally understand

01:09:18.520 that.

01:09:18.940 They don't totally understand why some people continue to like Donald Trump.

01:09:22.020 But if you're saying that most of the Republican Party wants Donald Trump, you're just as out

01:09:26.060 of touch as the people who say absolutely nobody wants Donald Trump anymore.

01:09:30.060 And that's sort of where the Vanity Fair, listen, I know Vanity Fair doesn't have a lot

01:09:33.280 of money anymore, but you think they could do better than that.

01:09:35.320 What it shows, though, is basically that they're all they conflate every single Republican

01:09:41.380 with Donald Trump.

01:09:42.880 And so you can't be a, quote, reasonable Republican unless you're an anti-Trump Republican in their

01:09:48.100 book.

01:09:48.480 And that's what when you see the writer bringing in every sort of different Republican conventional

01:09:53.380 point, like being pro-life and saying that is a line too far.

01:09:57.260 That is an evil that cannot be tolerated.

01:10:00.300 Then they're just playing.

01:10:01.660 They're showing their cards.

01:10:02.540 It's right.

01:10:02.740 Like every Republican that's not fully anti-Trump is just as bad as Donald Trump.

01:10:06.840 And that's what the truth is.

01:10:08.600 I totally agree with everything you just said.

01:10:10.700 The truth is, even Liz Cheney, if Liz Cheney ran and got the Republican nomination, they

01:10:17.200 would do that to her.

01:10:18.660 They would.

01:10:19.060 They're a little love affair with her over.

01:10:22.880 Yes.

01:10:24.360 Totally.

01:10:24.880 Go ahead.

01:10:25.180 There would be a piece exactly like that about Liz Cheney.

01:10:28.980 You know, John McCain was the darling of the media in the primary when he was trailing

01:10:34.260 in the polls.

01:10:35.020 And of course, you know, it happened to John McCain when he got the nomination and squared

01:10:39.120 off against Barack Obama.

01:10:40.380 The media precipitated precipitously chose sides.

01:10:45.040 McCain didn't have a chance.

01:10:45.940 That was for a lot of reasons.

01:10:46.960 But the question of whose side the media was on, even for a moderate maverick darling like

01:10:52.420 John McCain, there was absolutely no question.

01:10:55.760 And the other I think the other assertion from this author that I take issue with is

01:11:00.920 there's a lot of references to the Republican machine.

01:11:03.820 You know, like there are a group of people in back rooms making deals.

01:11:07.860 And he writes, the Republican machine has no intention of letting us choose.

01:11:12.040 You know, I learned a lot covering the Republican primary campaign in 2016.

01:11:17.500 And one of the things was how weak this machine really is, because if Reince Priebus and the

01:11:23.980 GOP and party leaders have had much influence at all, if they had had any power, Donald Trump

01:11:32.300 would have never been the Republican nominee in 2016.

01:11:35.120 It would have been like what happened with Clinton on the Democratic primary, where you

01:11:38.040 have Martin O'Malley and Bernie Sanders.

01:11:40.500 That's exactly right.

01:11:41.760 Well, it may not be that the entire Republican Party supports Trump, but it's also true that

01:11:46.360 all you need is about, you know, 30 plus percent of the party to win the nomination if the

01:11:52.800 rest of the field is crowded, you know.

01:11:54.380 And so that's, you know, that's why you have Charles C.W.

01:11:58.740 Cook of the National Review writing articles to these other Republican hopefuls saying, don't,

01:12:04.000 don't just you may think you can.

01:12:07.100 This is your it's not like seed unless you're you've got the groundswell behind you.

01:12:13.480 And I think, you know, he's looking at DeSantis, obviously, but the GOP is in quite a pickle

01:12:17.760 because if they have another member, remember that first Republican debate where we hosted

01:12:20.940 at Fox and we had to limit it to 10 people on the stage because there were so many can't

01:12:25.700 can't really 16 can't is like herding cats, even with the 10.

01:12:30.000 So that's probably what we're going to have.

01:12:32.160 Again, no one's going to do what's best for the party.

01:12:34.580 They do what's best for themselves.

01:12:36.680 And that's how Trump got the nomination last time.

01:12:38.720 And it could be how he gets it again.

01:12:40.260 All right.

01:12:40.780 Emily, Eliana, so much more to get to.

01:12:42.500 We're going to switch to our culture stories after this quick break.

01:12:45.360 And you guys are always awesome on that.

01:12:46.980 So stand by.

01:12:51.480 The update now is there have been 15 no votes against Kevin McCarthy for speaker.

01:12:56.420 They are only up to the letter N in the alphabet in the roll call.

01:13:00.240 So presumably we may get some more.

01:13:02.880 He McCarthy is laughing at the proceedings.

01:13:06.060 I'm sure sort of the absurdity of some of these votes from people who actually support

01:13:10.560 him but are trying to make a point are somewhat amusing.

01:13:13.120 He got a standing ovation when he voted for himself.

01:13:16.740 So that's the latest there.

01:13:18.540 The latest in connection with this Buffalo Bills player, Damar Hamlin, who was so severely

01:13:24.600 injured last night at the game against the Bengals.

01:13:27.120 Just a bit of color for you.

01:13:29.420 Niagara Falls will light up blue tonight in support of Hamlin, the Buffalo Bills and the

01:13:34.980 city of Buffalo.

01:13:35.800 God, which has been through so much this year, the city of Buffalo, right?

01:13:38.940 The shooting, the snowstorm.

01:13:40.780 This just like hearts go out to those guys.

01:13:44.620 They say both the American Falls and the Canadian Falls will be blue tonight from nine to nine

01:13:50.180 15.

01:13:51.060 Hashtag pray for Damar.

01:13:53.300 And by the way, Damar's family put out a statement.

01:13:55.460 There's no new information on his condition, but they said your generosity and compassion

01:13:59.660 mean the world to us.

01:14:00.520 Since his his charitable foundation to help kids.

01:14:03.820 What's a it's a GoFundMe is now just I mean, they're in the millions now.

01:14:09.300 He had shot for twenty five hundred bucks.

01:14:11.420 Your generosity and compassion mean the world to us.

01:14:14.260 Please keep Damar in your prayers.

01:14:16.080 We'll release updates as soon as we have them.

01:14:18.820 So those are the latest in the two stories we've been following.

01:14:21.000 OK, let's shift gears to somebody who isn't a victim, but thinks he is.

01:14:25.380 And that is Prince Harry, who is finally going to tell his story.

01:14:33.360 Finally, he's going to come out with it in his autobiography after the gazillion interviews

01:14:37.320 he and his wife have given about their poor lives.

01:14:41.080 Their castle's too small.

01:14:42.680 I don't know if you heard whether it was too small or treated so poorly.

01:14:46.680 He had to duck when he went through the doorways.

01:14:48.880 OK, that's that hard for him.

01:14:53.180 It's so hard when your castle's too tiny.

01:14:57.020 He's given two interviews now, which are being previewed.

01:15:00.020 ITV, that's the that's the station that, you know, asked Meghan Markle the question, like

01:15:04.920 in the middle of Africa, like, how are you?

01:15:07.400 She's like, thank you for asking because no one has.

01:15:11.160 Right, because we're focused on Africa.

01:15:13.280 OK, that's why no one asked you.

01:15:15.780 Anywho, they go back to the same reporter.

01:15:18.380 He's promoting his autobiography, which hits in like a week or so.

01:15:22.620 And here's just a little sampling of what poor, poor Prince Harry is saying in Sot One.

01:15:28.520 It never needed to be this way.

01:15:30.980 The leaking and the planting.

01:15:32.840 I want a family, not an institution.

01:15:34.700 They feel as though it's better to keep us somehow as the villains.

01:15:37.980 They've shown absolutely no willingness to reconcile.

01:15:41.160 I would like to get my father back.

01:15:43.040 I would like to have my brother back.

01:15:44.460 They've shown no, no willingness to reconcile.

01:15:48.520 Gee, I wonder why.

01:15:49.600 What do you why do you think the family doesn't want to get back together right now?

01:15:53.100 Does anyone raise your hand if you got a thought?

01:15:55.560 Anyone?

01:15:57.700 Emily?

01:15:58.100 You know, it could have something to do with the publicity tour that has included so many broadsides at his family and accusations of them leaking to the press as though Harry and Meghan have never they would never stoop so low as to plant stories and leak things to tabloids.

01:16:15.880 That is just not their style.

01:16:17.300 They prefer to go and make millions over at Netflix, but they would never stoop so low as to plant stories of the tablets.

01:16:23.820 It's just it's like actually very, very sad because their grandchildren are involved.

01:16:28.600 There's this family itself.

01:16:30.000 And then the country, of course, that has relied on the sort of stoicism for whatever it's worth.

01:16:34.320 Listen, I'm glad we don't have a monarchy here.

01:16:35.960 But if you're going to have a monarchy, I mean, this is just pretty sad for the entire country.

01:16:40.600 It's so disrespectful.

01:16:42.420 And I'm sad to say it's becoming sort of profoundly American.

01:16:45.300 It's sort of fitting that they moved to America and became whiny, whiny narcissists along the lines of what we have to get saddled with them.

01:16:52.800 They said in their documentary they were considering South Africa.

01:16:55.360 Why didn't they go?

01:16:56.100 Why didn't they go there?

01:16:56.940 How do we get stuck with them?

01:16:59.200 He adds on.

01:17:00.580 We reward this stuff.

01:17:01.680 They know that you go to Netflix and be like, give me money because I'm going to whine.

01:17:05.960 It's true.

01:17:06.760 It's a terrible reflection on us.

01:17:08.280 And let's not forget, she's an American, too.

01:17:10.340 My kids just the other day were like, Mom, Abby was here.

01:17:13.040 My daughter goes, Mom, are you a celebrity?

01:17:15.240 And I said, no, absolutely not.

01:17:17.080 And she looked up the definition.

01:17:18.760 It was like, you know, I don't know, whatever.

01:17:20.780 But I'm like, no, some people know who I am.

01:17:22.580 But no.

01:17:22.860 And she goes, do you think that you're the most famous Megan in the world?

01:17:26.520 And I'm like, definitely not.

01:17:31.160 So in any event, sadly, this other woman who, you know, she's definitely the best known Megan.

01:17:35.600 And she's bringing down the name and she's bringing down the country. 1.00

01:17:39.600 Here's some more whining he did to Anderson Cooper over on 60 Minutes.

01:17:43.400 And I will just submit to you, I want you to listen to the way Anderson Cooper tees this up,

01:17:47.380 because I believe this is such a joke.

01:17:49.780 He's straw manning the arguments against these people to tee up.

01:17:53.520 To me, this is a classic example of something that was prearranged,

01:17:56.640 where he knew Prince Harry wanted to say something.

01:17:58.800 And Anderson asked exactly the right question to get him there,

01:18:01.200 because the way Anderson phrases the complaint of the world against Harry is not quite right.

01:18:06.500 We'll get to that.

01:18:07.080 But listen for it.

01:18:07.820 Here's Sot 2.

01:18:09.840 One of the criticisms that you've received is that, well, OK, fine.

01:18:13.900 You want to move to California.

01:18:14.940 You want to step back from the institutional role.

01:18:17.900 Why be so public?

01:18:19.560 You say you tried to do this privately.

01:18:22.300 And every single time I've tried to do it privately,

01:18:24.700 there have been briefings and leakings and planting of stories against me and my wife.

01:18:29.480 You know, the family motto is never complain, never explain.

01:18:32.320 But it's just a motto.

01:18:33.860 And it doesn't really hold...

01:18:34.840 There's a lot of complaining and a lot of explaining.

01:18:37.100 Endless.

01:18:37.380 And private being done through leaks.

01:18:39.720 Through leaks.

01:18:40.900 They will feed or have a conversation with the correspondent.

01:18:46.120 And that correspondent will literally be spoon-fed information and write the story.

01:18:49.660 And at the bottom of it, they will say that they've reached out to Buckingham Palace for comment.

01:18:53.460 But the whole story is Buckingham Palace commenting.

01:18:57.160 So when we're being told for the last six years, we can't put a statement out to protect you,

01:19:02.020 but you do it for other members of the family, there becomes a point when silence is betrayal.

01:19:08.820 Just a small nit, but he says there becomes a point instead of there comes a point.

01:19:12.840 And he's made so many grammatical errors.

01:19:15.260 If you listen to that Netflix documentary, this guy, ironically, is not very well educated.

01:19:18.920 I went to public school in upstate New York.

01:19:21.120 I take him on any day, intellectually.

01:19:22.980 Any day.

01:19:24.020 And what he did to Eaton and all the private tutors.

01:19:26.500 Bring it, Harry.

01:19:27.840 Okay.

01:19:28.400 There comes a point, my friend.

01:19:29.740 That's how you say it.

01:19:30.400 There comes a point.

01:19:31.300 Not there becomes a point.

01:19:32.220 Anywho.

01:19:33.820 The criticism of these two is not that their complaints about their family went public.

01:19:40.480 Yes, some people have said that.

01:19:41.900 Okay.

01:19:42.020 It's not like nobody's right there.

01:19:42.960 But the privacy complaint against them is that they ostensibly wanted a more private

01:19:49.180 life.

01:19:49.480 They wanted to be left alone.

01:19:51.140 And then they never stopped giving interviews ever.

01:19:54.800 Right.

01:19:55.100 They gave them to everyone.

01:19:57.540 So Anderson tees it up like, why?

01:20:00.300 Why?

01:20:00.960 Just why not just handle this privately?

01:20:03.020 And then, of course, Harry's like, because I'm surrounded by evil villains who leaked everything

01:20:07.020 I said, there was obviously a way for them to leave their royal roles and stay in England

01:20:14.080 and continue servicing the people of England.

01:20:16.880 You know, there are plenty of royals who are not working royals.

01:20:19.580 They chose to leave in a huff because they wanted the attention, because they're brats, 0.97

01:20:24.460 because they wanted to get $100 million from Netflix and telling their story.

01:20:28.800 That's actually what happened here.

01:20:30.480 It's not about, oh, we tried to resolve it privately and we couldn't.

01:20:33.880 So we had no choice but to bring these matters out into the bullshit.

01:20:37.560 They wanted the money.

01:20:39.740 They were filming that Netflix thing for months well before Megxit.

01:20:44.800 Right.

01:20:45.000 So the whole thing is based on a lie.

01:20:47.320 And now we all just help him continue with his wine-a-thon.

01:20:51.800 Let me ask you, Eliana, because even Politico, Politico did a piece on them a week or so ago,

01:20:57.580 listing them as number one in the, quote, narcissists that we have become sick of as a society.

01:21:06.100 They had them.

01:21:07.300 They had Elizabeth Holmes.

01:21:08.740 They had some bad people in that group.

01:21:12.040 And so I do wonder whether people are getting it here in America and they've had it.

01:21:17.580 I don't think we're there yet.

01:21:18.720 What is so interesting to me about Harry's interview is I think there's a lot of projection going on.

01:21:26.220 He talks about the royal skillful use of the press.

01:21:30.900 You know, two can play at that game.

01:21:32.400 And I think it's precisely what Harry and Meghan are doing and about their desire for privacy.

01:21:38.680 In reality, Harry and Meghan have traded one type of celebrity, the celebrity of the British monarchy,

01:21:43.760 for another type of celebrity, Hollywood celebrity.

01:21:46.400 They clearly didn't desire privacy.

01:21:48.740 In reality, I think those members of the British monarchy probably have more privacy than Harry and Meghan have now.

01:21:56.500 They are playing out their messy family dramas in the headlines.

01:22:00.960 It's not just Harry.

01:22:02.020 It's also Meghan, who is whose father, who's having fights with her father.

01:22:07.560 But when you listen to Harry, I think it's just a crash course in the tactics that he and his wife are using to get what they want.

01:22:17.420 And he had a sophisticated course in this, giving his upbringing and the use of the press and the tabloids and the best schools.

01:22:23.660 And I don't know, Meghan, I'm just going to take a guess, given that, you know, you mentioned your grammar and writing skills and elocution are slightly better than his.

01:22:30.500 Because I think he probably wasn't admitted on the merits, maybe wasn't subject to the most rigorous grading at these Tony British schools.

01:22:40.040 You could be right.

01:22:40.700 You could be right.

01:22:41.520 Whereas I got in on the merits at Syracuse University.

01:22:43.740 Yeah, they may have got a little soft on him.

01:22:46.080 Um, this thing about the press, I love what you just said, that he's used the same tactics that he accuses the royal family of using.

01:22:55.860 This came out in there.

01:22:57.360 You know, they sued the Daily Mail for defamation.

01:23:00.040 It came out like Omid Scobie.

01:23:02.580 Who's he with, Deb?

01:23:03.400 Is he in Vanity Fair?

01:23:05.300 Harper's Bazaar.

01:23:06.080 OK, Omid Scobie is their stenographer.

01:23:08.060 He is Meghan and Harry's stenographer.

01:23:10.740 He's purportedly a royal correspondent.

01:23:13.160 Bullshit.

01:23:13.560 All he does is write down what they according to use Harry's word through leaks.

01:23:19.020 They will they will feed or have a conversation with a correspondent.

01:23:23.320 That correspondent will literally be spoon fed information and write the story.

01:23:28.820 And so that's exactly what this guy does for them.

01:23:31.060 And then at the bottom of it, it will say Buckingham Palace refused comment.

01:23:34.680 He says, but the whole thing is Buckingham Palace commenting.

01:23:37.140 That's exactly what Harry and Meghan do.

01:23:38.880 By the way, it's what virtually everybody in media does.

01:23:41.660 If I could tell you the number of negative stories that have been written about me, that

01:23:45.500 I understand 100 percent who was behind it, an institution that may or may not have employed

01:23:49.760 me.

01:23:50.160 And then at the bottom they say, oh, this organization was not available for comment.

01:23:54.200 Meanwhile, the whole thing has been drafted by that organization.

01:23:56.700 It's very obvious.

01:23:57.860 It's disgusting.

01:23:58.880 It's toxic.

01:23:59.920 It's nasty.

01:24:00.760 But they're not in some special place.

01:24:03.120 They're public figures.

01:24:04.900 This is what comes with the role.

01:24:06.960 Get over it.

01:24:07.700 Grow up.

01:24:09.520 And they want to make money off of being public figures.

01:24:12.440 And that's what drives me crazy about this media coverage of them.

01:24:14.780 Remember, what was it?

01:24:15.660 ABC who let Oprah interview them without really disclosing the extent of their personal relationship.

01:24:20.880 She lives like right down the street in Montecito, which is like the most beautiful place

01:24:24.120 in the world.

01:24:24.580 And they let Oprah do this like allegedly hard hitting interview. 1.00

01:24:28.380 But what that benefit that benefits Harry and Meghan and they know it because they traffic

01:24:32.540 on their reputation like that's how they make money.

01:24:34.760 That's how they go to Netflix and say, give me money, money me now.

01:24:38.880 The Charlie Day quote from It's Always Sunny.

01:24:40.880 That's how they do it is because they can say, listen, we're doing really well at these

01:24:45.140 interviews with ABC.

01:24:45.960 We can talk to CBS.

01:24:47.380 We can talk to Anderson Cooper whenever we want.

01:24:49.180 He's going to give us a positive platform.

01:24:50.860 We're going to come out looking great.

01:24:52.400 And it's the journalists who talk to them.

01:24:54.220 They're not entitled to positive media coverage.

01:24:56.640 I mean, look at the trajectory of public opinion about Meghan Markle.

01:24:59.420 It has nothing to do with her politics.

01:25:00.780 It has nothing to do with her race.

01:25:02.240 People generally liked her until she started publicly acting like a brat and then public 1.00

01:25:06.800 opinion of her tank.

01:25:07.800 It's just completely logical.

01:25:09.520 But they don't want to accept that.

01:25:10.900 And neither do the journalists who cover them because they want to pretend they want to

01:25:14.720 use these straw men and say this is this is about politics.

01:25:18.820 This is about racism because they think that's good for their ratings.

01:25:21.700 That's what they believe ideologically because they live in these bubbles.

01:25:24.760 And meanwhile, Harry and Meghan are making millions and millions of dollars off of the

01:25:28.520 nonsense.

01:25:29.740 Meanwhile, you're exactly right, because the her friends in response to that political

01:25:34.180 article listing those two as the number one narcissist we're sick of came out and called

01:25:38.940 them racist.

01:25:39.880 Politico is now racist because they attacked Harry and Meghan.

01:25:43.720 OK, I'd like it.

01:25:44.440 Of course.

01:25:44.940 Right.

01:25:45.140 You could almost like count down to the racism allegation.

01:25:48.700 All right.

01:25:49.220 Shifting gears now to a different media personality.

01:25:53.600 I'm almost sorry to bring it up.

01:25:54.920 I'm almost sorry, but but not not really.

01:25:57.480 Amy wrote up Robach and TJ Holmes remain suspended from ABC News.

01:26:01.820 They were co-hosts of a third hour of GMA that apparently aired in the middle of the afternoon.

01:26:05.980 They are suspended because they had an extramarital affair with one another, according to the

01:26:11.120 Daily Mail, which broke it in the New York Post, which had following follow up reporting.

01:26:14.480 And now they both in the month of December filed for divorce from their respective spouses.

01:26:18.140 They have young children in his family and older children in her family.

01:26:22.780 Her her older children reportedly babysat for his kids.

01:26:26.280 They were going out on double dates all the time with their spouses reportedly while they

01:26:29.540 were having an affair.

01:26:30.600 I mean, just like untoward stuff.

01:26:33.100 This is why as a news organization, ABC News felt the need to suspend them after trying

01:26:37.320 out the most awkward day ever of having them come right back on the air, pretend nothing

01:26:41.020 had happened.

01:26:41.800 And, you know, it was just too much.

01:26:43.700 Then it came out that he'd been fishing off the company pier for years.

01:26:47.240 He's dated at least reportedly two other women at the in the ABC newsroom producers

01:26:52.080 who you'd have to look at the circumstances, but you can make a case that he was above them

01:26:56.920 on the totem pole, which makes the relationship problematic professionally.

01:27:00.600 Unlike his relationship with Amy, because they're equals, their thing is more of a PR

01:27:05.160 disaster.

01:27:06.280 So here's the interesting thing.

01:27:07.620 OK, they fell in love, whatever.

01:27:09.520 They're leaving the spouses. 0.99

01:27:10.620 It didn't work out.

01:27:12.280 You tell me why now they're going like on a love parade.

01:27:17.500 Photos from page six, New York Post were published on December 28th of them packing on

01:27:20.960 the PDA in Miami.

01:27:23.080 They're out there like all over each other.

01:27:25.600 They've been spotted in Miami and Atlanta kissing, holding hands, more kissing.

01:27:32.220 Meanwhile, her cheated on, dumped ex-hutten, soon to be ex-husband, Andrew Shue.

01:27:38.920 They have three kids.

01:27:40.280 They have a bunch of kids.

01:27:41.120 Anyway, he and his three boys went to Montana for the holidays.

01:27:44.220 And one of the boys posted this photograph of the four of them, Andrew Shue, plus these

01:27:48.420 three boys, Aiden, Wyatt and Nathaniel, looking totally somber and sad.

01:27:55.100 And there's obviously no woman in the picture.

01:27:57.140 There's no mother. 0.83

01:27:57.940 There's no wife. 0.98

01:27:59.100 And I've got to ask you, because you're both media savvy, whether this is the right

01:28:03.000 move.

01:28:03.320 Is this the next move for Amy and TJ who find themselves under fire and did this morally

01:28:09.360 questionable thing?

01:28:10.520 But OK, it happens.

01:28:12.340 But then the move is to parade it.

01:28:14.900 The move is to make sure the paparazzi can see you making out while your kids are still

01:28:18.980 grieving the lot, the blow up of your family.

01:28:21.460 Like for me, I feel like can't there be some discretion and understanding that you made a

01:28:25.340 mistake?

01:28:25.800 Something unfortunate happened.

01:28:26.960 It does happen.

01:28:28.060 But must you parade it?

01:28:30.360 Must you flaunt it?

01:28:31.300 Must you be completely insensitive to the fact that there are children involved who might

01:28:36.560 not want to see that stuff?

01:28:37.700 I just to me, this is like a step in the wrong direction and getting themselves back on the

01:28:41.820 air.

01:28:42.560 What do you guys think?

01:28:43.760 Affairs and lying in a healthy culture are shameful things.

01:28:47.140 They're not things to be paraded in front of paparazzi.

01:28:49.760 Obviously, they know they're being photographed.

01:28:51.880 And I think Brad Wilcox has done a really good job at the Institute for Family Studies of showing

01:28:58.100 how the corporate media glorifies divorce.

01:29:01.880 And especially from this perspective of like, I'm living out my truth.

01:29:05.920 My truth is this.

01:29:07.020 My truth, my destiny, blah, blah, blah.

01:29:09.560 It's always about what's best for me, what's best for me.

01:29:11.680 And this gets to the sort of culture of narcissism thing we talked about with Meghan Markle.

01:29:14.860 And it's straight out of Christopher Lash's culture of narcissism and his other writing.

01:29:18.860 And that's what it does.

01:29:20.280 Our culture prioritizes the individual over the family, over the community.

01:29:24.680 And so in that sense, I think maybe it is a good move because I can see them.

01:29:29.300 And I'm curious what you guys think.

01:29:30.480 I can actually see them getting a sit down with Anderson Cooper on 60 Minutes, just like

01:29:34.000 Harry and saying, you know, we had to be true to ourselves.

01:29:38.700 We had to live out our truths and the profile might jump up and they might be become more

01:29:44.600 valuable as brands because of that.

01:29:46.300 Even if it's controversial with a section of the public, it will get media attention and

01:29:50.020 it will get positive coverage if they frame it in that light.

01:29:52.740 You know, this was just about our truths.

01:29:54.120 I really hope we're not there, honestly.

01:29:56.720 Like, I understand it's very like people make mistakes and definitely people fall out of

01:30:01.560 love and then in love.

01:30:02.440 I get that.

01:30:03.280 I get all that.

01:30:04.420 But this to me, I think it's worse than the paparazzi caught them in a PDA.

01:30:08.060 I think they set it up.

01:30:09.320 I think they made sure the paparazzi was there.

01:30:11.340 And so they're putting this in our face on purpose and they're putting it in the face of

01:30:15.300 their children on purpose.

01:30:17.660 And so if I'm running ABC News, I say on purpose, you're never coming back to your role as

01:30:23.580 morning anchors because morning TV is supposed to be fun and, you know, just lighthearted

01:30:31.640 and people shouldn't have to be thinking about the sad children's faces or your extramarital

01:30:36.740 affairs or, you know, like this isn't the move.

01:30:39.460 This was not the next move.

01:30:40.760 This was a serious misstep.

01:30:42.140 What do you think, Eliana?

01:30:44.260 I have to say, like my gut says and I don't know that like we just don't know all of the

01:30:50.700 details about this.

01:30:51.540 It struck me as strange that they would be suspended.

01:30:54.580 They are equals for having an affair with each other.

01:30:56.880 I suspect that there's more to that part of it.

01:30:59.980 Of course, now we know, well, TJ Robach, there was more to his story.

01:31:03.660 I don't know the story with her.

01:31:05.880 And yes, you know, it's untoward and inappropriate and gross that they're like parading their affair

01:31:11.420 out in public.

01:31:12.020 Like at the same time, like, why is the husband posting this sad photo of him and his children

01:31:16.360 online?

01:31:16.800 The whole thing with people's entire lives, you know, being on Instagram and on social

01:31:22.580 media.

01:31:23.400 It's not the way that I live or like to do things.

01:31:27.340 But I frankly don't know, like the intricate details of this situation.

01:31:31.100 And I suspect we'll learn more here.

01:31:33.540 But but it's it is sad and strange, especially when there are children involved.

01:31:38.180 And I totally agree with Emily.

01:31:39.540 Like, you know, I think once you have kids, it's not about you anymore and you finding

01:31:44.720 your happiness.

01:31:45.340 You know, you should you should be miserable if it makes your kids happy.

01:31:50.140 I totally condone the misery of the parents if it means the happiness of the kids.

01:31:54.560 It's actually the suspension came with Eliana now that she's a mom because she can just

01:31:59.440 unload all of this.

01:32:01.160 OK, the suspension came after it came out that he has apparently a list of women at ABC

01:32:05.960 that he slept with.

01:32:06.880 And they're they're trying to figure out whether they have another Matt Lauer on their hands

01:32:10.640 is my bet.

01:32:11.920 OK, last but not least, quickly, Whoopi Goldberg steps in it.

01:32:15.340 Again, she doubles down on the same Jewish comments. 0.60

01:32:19.300 Jews are not a race.

01:32:20.980 The Holocaust wasn't about race that she said a year ago that got her a two week suspension.

01:32:27.240 Back then, she said the Holocaust wasn't about race.

01:32:28.840 It's not about race, about man's inhumanity to man.

01:32:31.940 Now she gives an interview to the Sunday Times of London, London and says it wasn't originally

01:32:36.840 about race.

01:32:37.940 Remember who they were killing?

01:32:39.200 They were not killing racial.

01:32:40.400 They were killing physical.

01:32:41.480 They were killing people they considered mentally defective.

01:32:43.900 The reporter tells Goldberg the Nazis actually measured the hands and noses of Jews to prove

01:32:48.400 that they were a distinct race.

01:32:49.900 She replies, they did that to black people, too.

01:32:52.600 It doesn't change the fact that you could not tell a Jew on the street. 0.99

01:32:56.620 You could find me.

01:32:57.800 You couldn't find them.

01:32:59.360 That's the point I was making.

01:33:00.580 But you would have thought that I'd taken a big old stinky dump on the table, but naked.

01:33:04.160 OK, this is to me, what this shows is this is like the woke hierarchy.

01:33:09.940 No, no, no.

01:33:10.820 I I am more oppressed because you can just see that I'm a certain race just walking down

01:33:15.600 the street.

01:33:16.100 Jews, they're they're a level. 1.00

01:33:18.180 They're a different level on the oppression hierarchy because, you know, you'd have to 0.97

01:33:22.540 you'd have to work to figure out what any in any event, not suspended, forced to come

01:33:27.080 out and issue another apology. 0.89

01:33:28.780 But she's not sorry.

01:33:29.680 And she hasn't changed her views, has she?

01:33:31.880 What do you guys think?

01:33:33.660 Obviously, there's been no change in her views.

01:33:35.800 And to me, Megan, this just shows the bankruptcy of performative apologies, which the ADL had

01:33:43.120 a huddle with Whoopi Goldberg a year ago and she apologized.

01:33:47.060 But this is all a PR stunt.

01:33:50.160 There's no cure for ignorance.

01:33:52.860 And that is what she is.

01:33:55.160 She's just crazy. 0.97

01:33:56.240 She's always been crazy.

01:33:57.200 And I don't mind celebrities or pundits being crazy, but I mind the double standard.

01:34:01.500 And that's clearly been crossed and violated by her many, many times.

01:34:04.860 That's exactly right.

01:34:05.740 And she's got a cohort, a co-host there who actually wore blackface, which they put on

01:34:09.920 the board and celebrated as Joy Behar's Halloween costume.

01:34:14.220 Nobody at ABC said, oh, we shouldn't do that.

01:34:16.640 But no problem.

01:34:18.080 So in any event, always interesting to watch how the sides are treated.

01:34:21.720 Ladies, it's been an absolute pleasure.

01:34:23.700 Emily, Eliana, please come back soon.

01:34:25.640 Thanks, Megan.

01:34:27.200 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. 0.94

01:34:30.460 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - January 03, 2023

McCarthy's Speaker Fight, and Horrific NFL Injury, with Emily Jashinsky, Eliana Johnson, and Clay Travis ｜ Ep. 463

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