The Megyn Kelly Show - Megyn's NYT Interview, WHCA Fires Unfunny Comedian From Dinner, and Newsom's Failed Shift, with Emily Jashinsky and Eliana Johnson ｜ Ep. 1038

00:00:00.500 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.

00:00:12.080 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Monday.

00:00:16.600 The White House Correspondents Association is reversing course, deciding that we are now in such a, quote,

00:00:23.060 quote, consequential moment for journalism, that they will be canceling their scheduled comedian for their big gala in late April

00:00:32.820 and focusing only on honoring the very important work our corporate media does every day to fight for democracy or something like that.

00:00:41.900 They really want to honor the White House reporters who gave it all, left it all on the playing field this year.

00:00:48.600 You know how, like, they covered the Biden mental infirmity so closely and explosively and blew the lid, right?

00:00:57.580 Oh, wait, no, that never happened.

00:01:00.140 Will that award be given in April for all the people who completely blew it and instead of exposing that, ran cover for him?

00:01:08.640 Because, yeah, that happened over the past 12 months since their last big gala.

00:01:13.000 Or are we just going to honor the reporters who are taking a dump on Donald Trump every day?

00:01:18.220 I can't wait to find out.

00:01:20.240 I was invited to this shindig, and as I have for every year over the past 10, I declined to go.

00:01:26.820 I'm not going to this.

00:01:27.960 When I was a very young reporter, I found this exciting before I understood what was what in Washington and back, frankly, when it was relevant and kind of cool.

00:01:36.240 I hate to tell the people going, those days are over.

00:01:39.160 However, you're now sort of saying yes to what's become a loser party where they can only get the dregs.

00:01:46.440 And I urge anybody with, you know, ego and self-respect to say no, no, I'm not going to that.

00:01:54.980 And speaking of corporate media, I went over to the New York Times earlier this month.

00:02:01.860 I mean the actual New York Times building, the belly of the beast, and sat down for two hours for their, quote, the interview podcast.

00:02:11.920 This is part of the biggest podcast in America called The Daily, which the New York Times drops Monday through Friday.

00:02:20.960 And then on Saturday, they drop, quote, the interview podcast with millions of downloads per episode.

00:02:27.360 And I have some thoughts and some behind the scenes moments for you on what happened, how it came out, and why I did it.

00:02:34.460 So let's get into it. Joining me now, the EJs, Emily Jashinsky, DC correspondent for UnHerd and host of Undercurrents,

00:02:42.560 and Eliana Johnson, editor-in-chief of the Washington Free Beacon and co-host of the Ink Stained Wretches podcast.

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00:04:03.200 Ladies, welcome back. 1.00

00:04:05.060 Hey, Megan.

00:04:05.460 Hey, Megan.

00:04:06.520 Great to see you both.

00:04:08.500 Good to be here.

00:04:09.320 Um, okay, so why I went over to the New York Times.

00:04:13.680 They, they gave me this invitation and I talked with Steve Krakauer, my executive producer, about it quite a bit.

00:04:20.360 And Abby's funny because she always, like, gets the incoming.

00:04:22.840 She's like, don't do it.

00:04:23.960 Don't do it.

00:04:26.160 She's like, they're going to hate you.

00:04:27.580 You don't want, you don't want anything to do.

00:04:29.380 And, uh, she's very defensive of me.

00:04:31.860 But Steve was more like, oh, we should consider this one.

00:04:35.280 And we talked about it.

00:04:36.660 And I have a couple of things that, you know, we're promoting right now.

00:04:40.380 Like our AM update and our expansion into this more podcast network where we're bringing on other voices and trying to promote them.

00:04:47.560 So I thought if I were to do it, this would be a time.

00:04:50.600 And the truth is I listen to the daily most days.

00:04:53.260 And I talk about the daily on this show a lot.

00:04:55.140 And I'm a weird fan of the show.

00:04:56.980 Like I, I love to rip on it, but I do learn from it as well.

00:05:01.540 I think it's a useful podcast.

00:05:04.500 Sometimes it's useful just to bash.

00:05:06.940 Sometimes it actually does provide information.

00:05:08.740 Like I loved the podcast they did on what Trump's tariffs are doing down in Mexico when it comes to fentanyl labs.

00:05:16.400 Like that was actually a fair and balanced piece.

00:05:18.160 And I think they're making an effort to like drop a few here and there that might be a little more acceptable to Trump fans.

00:05:25.000 In any event, I figured, um, I would, I would do it.

00:05:29.580 So, um, I was asked to sit down with Lulu Garcia Navarro, who is a legit reporter.

00:05:36.620 She's been all over the world covering actual news for the New York times and other outlets for many, many years.

00:05:43.120 And, um, I didn't know her very well.

00:05:46.460 I knew she'd done JD Vance and she seemed fair with him.

00:05:49.760 So I figured, all right, you know, here we go.

00:05:53.040 And Michael Barbaro is the host of the one Monday through Friday.

00:05:55.780 And I, truth be told, I kind of like him and we have a friendly relationship.

00:06:00.560 We're not friends, but friendly.

00:06:01.820 So in any event, I decided to go over there.

00:06:04.140 So it was 90 minutes sitting down together in the New York times building.

00:06:07.260 And then it was another, I don't know, half an hour or 45 minutes the next day after you've had a time to reflect, which is kind of funny.

00:06:13.960 Even that is kind of leftist, right?

00:06:17.620 We're going to reflect and then we're going to chat again.

00:06:20.060 Um, so we went over to the New York times building guys, and it was very fun.

00:06:25.300 It was walking in there.

00:06:26.920 I have to say they were very nice.

00:06:28.440 They were very polite.

00:06:29.360 They treat me well, but you know, there are all these heads at the New York times, like, whoa.

00:06:35.340 Right.

00:06:35.680 So I'm walking through like, yes.

00:06:38.960 And then you could hear all the like, like, and we weren't even on the main floor.

00:06:44.000 We were just all like on the podcast floor, but everybody did like a one 80 as it was very funny.

00:06:50.020 And the one guy, sort of the handler who was dealing with me before Lulu came in and said, uh, you know, Lulu, she often takes people up into like the, the heart of the newsroom when the interview's over and introduces them to people.

00:07:01.600 So she might do that with you.

00:07:03.180 Let's just say that didn't happen.

00:07:05.280 It was, there was no tour of the New York times.

00:07:08.960 It was a, no, uh, I, I appreciate that.

00:07:13.080 Why did, why would she want to do that? 0.94

00:07:14.920 Why would this gains Lulu zero street cred in walking through the New York times, uh, newsroom with me?

00:07:21.520 It was fine, but I have to say, I liked her.

00:07:24.940 She was very kind to me, like in terms of our, you know, dealings behind the scenes.

00:07:29.020 She was very nice.

00:07:29.760 You can kind of tell when someone hates your guts and they're about to interview you.

00:07:33.120 I didn't feel that way about her and the interview itself didn't reflect some, you know, animus on her part or bad faith.

00:07:40.820 I thought, you know, she's, I think of the left and came at these issues from the left that was understood and not surprising, but I didn't sit her sit across from her thinking, this is someone who can't stand me.

00:07:53.000 And that would have led to a bad interview had I felt that way.

00:07:55.720 So that's why I think it, it all worked, you know, it came off fine.

00:08:00.020 I was more relaxed and giving her answers.

00:08:02.620 And she was a good interview in terms of saying like, tell me about that as opposed to, you know, just trying to hammer me on various things.

00:08:11.120 So in any event, it posted on Saturday.

00:08:13.120 I hope people take a listen to it.

00:08:14.360 We'll talk about a couple of the sound bites and a couple of the outtakes just cause those are always fun to know, you know, what happened.

00:08:20.080 Um, we released a couple on social media over the weekend and I'll tell you the biggest divide between Lulu and yours truly, which we talked about was she didn't understand exactly what it is.

00:08:33.600 People like us do the, the two women I'm looking at and myself, right.

00:08:38.880 That like we do offer political commentary and we do offer our own opinions, but we also are journalists, but we all exist in this new ecosphere, right?

00:08:49.640 Like we all have podcasts.

00:08:51.040 We all have direct relationships with our audiences.

00:08:54.240 We're all in new media as opposed to corporate legacy media.

00:08:59.040 You know, the free beacon is its own entity, but I mean, Eliana does instinct wretches and is very honest.

00:09:05.400 In any event, that was where we really kept tripping wires because she didn't get how I can still call myself a journalist and have endorsed Donald Trump.

00:09:16.360 Which one is that Steve?

00:09:18.940 Okay.

00:09:19.680 That's number four.

00:09:21.480 And we'll kick it off with that one.

00:09:23.820 Well, you interviewed him and it was a fair interview, a tough interview, but you opened it by saying, you know, that he was a friend.

00:09:32.420 You said, I've been really dismayed by the amount of pylon that he's been suffering. 1.00

00:09:37.580 And I've been outraged by the unfairness of the media's coverage of the allegations.

00:09:41.260 And that's a direct quote.

00:09:42.380 And so, you know, I'm curious what you're doing in that interview because you're setting up the interview in a particular kind of way that perhaps it wouldn't be set up in the mainstream media.

00:09:54.300 Yeah.

00:09:54.780 Well, I'm glad you asked that because I feel like part of our discussion before and today is getting at something that like our wires are crossing your wires and my wires are crossing in a way.

00:10:08.900 Like you're kind of looking at me and saying, it's not behaving like a typical journalist.

00:10:14.240 And it is still calling itself a journalist.

00:10:16.900 And I'm trying to say to you, yes, I'm still a journalist.

00:10:19.920 I'm trying to understand it.

00:10:21.340 Yeah, no, I know.

00:10:22.100 I'm not saying you're judging me.

00:10:23.720 Right.

00:10:23.880 But I'm trying to say to you, yes, I'm still a journalist, but I'm in this new ecosystem where the old rules don't apply.

00:10:32.140 You know, I'm in this world with, yes, Charlie Kirk and Dan Bongino and Ben Shapiro.

00:10:38.040 But my world is also Joe Rogan with these in-depth interviews and also Theo Vaughn.

00:10:45.440 And it's a very large world and how the consumer receives it is by going on YouTube.com on their television screen or going to the vertical integrations on Instagram or TikTok and just taking in content.

00:11:00.100 What's the content that you want to receive?

00:11:01.900 I'm on the list of content creators.

00:11:03.940 And so the fact that I'm also a journalist who breaks news and reports on news is like an extra.

00:11:10.260 But what's most important in my business now is authenticity, that you are honest with the audience.

00:11:19.880 And really, this is a point we just kept coming back to where she she thinks in a way you can be too honest if you get on stage with a political candidate and endorse him and tell people you're voting for him.

00:11:31.020 And you think they should, too, that you've crossed a bridge that that burns as you walk across it and you can never return back over to journalism land.

00:11:41.440 And I just didn't see it that way at all.

00:11:44.480 We had a long debate and a lot of debates about owning one's bias.

00:11:49.340 And she didn't understand if you could if you own your bias, like, doesn't that sell your soul, basically, that how can the audience then trust you to rip on your own side?

00:12:01.280 And the following soundbite is in that context.

00:12:04.060 Top one.

00:12:05.980 I think the most serious thing I've heard about him has been the E.

00:12:09.020 Jean Carroll allegation that he sexually assaulted her in a Bergdorf dressing room.

00:12:13.900 And I don't believe one word of that.

00:12:16.100 There are other women who have said I've interviewed some of them.

00:12:20.200 But look, the things I heard was were included things like he got handsy on an airplane.

00:12:25.520 Now, I don't know whether that happened or it didn't.

00:12:27.920 But do I find that a deal breaker for a possible politician?

00:12:31.340 Not really.

00:12:32.420 At least I reported on their stories and did them the courtesy of bringing them to air in front of millions of people and let the audience make up its mind.

00:12:41.320 My problem is more with these Democrats who will bury these allegations against their candidates or their candidate spouses and then play holier than thou.

00:12:49.500 When they're looking at Donald Trump.

00:12:51.280 Do you see yourself as a journalist still?

00:12:53.780 Or would you not describe yourself like that anymore?

00:12:55.980 No, I'm still a journalist.

00:12:56.440 I mean, I break news all the time.

00:12:57.840 And when I sit with Trump or anybody else in the administration, I ask tough questions.

00:13:01.800 I mean, as recently as September of 23, I interviewed Trump.

00:13:05.280 And he got so mad at me.

00:13:06.320 He didn't talk to me for six or seven months.

00:13:09.140 So it's not, look, it's a tough job to do.

00:13:12.760 You have to be able to hit the people you admire.

00:13:16.140 And I do. 0.86

00:13:17.120 You know, I've hit them all.

00:13:18.720 Right before the election, I ripped on Trump's Madison Square Garden rally as too bro-tastic and got specific about why.

00:13:24.680 You have to understand, like, if you haven't sold your soul, you have to be willing to criticize the people, even you, that you admire on your, quote, side.

00:13:35.100 And my owning my bias by going out there on stage with Donald Trump and saying, I'm voting for him and you should too, is a bonus when it comes to my credibility.

00:13:45.100 Now, everybody has zero doubt about where I stand, and they can filter everything I say through the appropriate lens.

00:13:50.780 What typically happens in journalism is they say they have no bias, and then they just work it out in the printed word or on their shows without owning it.

00:13:59.260 But the audience knows it, and it creates a distrust and a divide.

00:14:03.540 Okay, two, just two points as an addendum, and then we'll get into it.

00:14:08.940 So I went on in the one answer, and she did find I have no problem with the way the Times edited the interview.

00:14:14.900 This is not a Ben Smith situation where I just thought he just tried to hammer me for his own reasons.

00:14:21.000 She was very fair.

00:14:21.760 But I just want to say that, and that one answer where I'm like, what I have a problem with is these people who will go after Donald Trump and play holier than thou when covering him, but will bury the allegations against Democrats.

00:14:36.700 And what I said at the end of that, because we have a transcript of it, was, like, I didn't see a lot of questions by the Times or anyone else about why Doug Emhoff allegedly wailed on his ex-girlfriend, the one he dated, right before Kamala.

00:14:48.860 Where was the deep investigation into whether he fathered a love child with the nanny and why the ambulance came to her home on the night she lost the baby?

00:14:56.000 Nobody cared about that.

00:14:57.080 I've actually reported on both of those stories, which is something about two reporters in America can say.

00:15:02.820 And then added just a bit later when she was like, I don't get how you can go out and endorse this guy, understanding he's going to make mistakes, he's going to do things that are wrong, who you know, she says, will have to be criticized because that's the nature of any political leader.

00:15:17.860 And I said, you know, see, see, to me, it's funny to hear you ask that, because I guarantee you my audience is going to laugh at this question because they're going to say that is rich coming from The New York Times, which did more to run cover for Joe Biden than virtually anyone else in media.

00:15:33.840 I don't run cover for Donald Trump.

00:15:35.640 I've ripped on Trump endless numbers of times.

00:15:37.900 I put my record of ripping on Trump up against the record of anybody in the leftist media of running against Joe Biden or calling out his infirmities.

00:15:46.660 Even when Trump was running, one of the reasons why he attacked me after I hosted a presidential debate that he did not participate in is because I raised questions about Trump's mental acuity.

00:15:55.880 And I had noticed he was having some word slips saying the wrong thing about Obama when he meant Biden, World War Three when he meant two.

00:16:02.840 And he got mad.

00:16:03.560 He attacked me, which is totally fair game. 1.00

00:16:05.740 I am fair game.

00:16:07.080 I'm in the arena and I'm fair game.

00:16:09.140 I'm not above getting attacked by him.

00:16:11.360 I wasn't in 15.

00:16:12.680 I'm not in 25.

00:16:13.700 So to me, it's funny to hear you ask that question because you must not listen to the show that often.

00:16:20.940 OK, so having said all that, Emily, your thoughts?

00:16:24.920 Well, yeah, I mean, that was a part of the interview that you just played that I was trying to like stand up and clap when I was listening because it was such a great explanation of what people are doing now and where the wires are exactly getting crossed,

00:16:35.460 which is that I actually think a lot of even thoughtful people who are coming to this conversation in good faith, like I genuinely think she was, don't totally watch the programs that they're engaging with enough to understand what's really happening and what the relationship is with the audience.

00:16:53.120 It's because your audience would hear the question that you just read out and say, what do you mean?

00:16:58.100 Like, of course, Megan has to criticize. 0.71

00:17:00.960 It doesn't matter that Megan went and endorsed Donald Trump.

00:17:03.240 She's been criticizing him like three days later.

00:17:06.160 It just is a complete and a lot of times it's from these soundbites that go viral is when people who don't regularly listen to a show will dip in.

00:17:14.820 And so they kind of think that they understand what happens, but it's really totally different.

00:17:20.760 Like your relationship with the audience is totally different than somebody who genuinely doesn't listen to it every day fully understands or, you know, even like three times a week understands.

00:17:29.640 And that is where I think it's, you know, I think she thought that you were working with the campaign, cooperating with the campaign, that you were a part of the campaign because you gave that speech.

00:17:42.400 When in fact, all you did was be more honest with your audience than a lot of the journalists who are even just straight news reporters who work in their desk at the White House and absolutely know that they are voting for Kamala Harris.

00:17:53.640 Come to every question, believe in Kamala Harris, good, Donald Trump, bad every time they sit down and write copy.

00:17:59.340 You're just being honest with your audience.

00:18:01.020 And that's an improvement for most Americans.

00:18:04.800 Yeah, Eliana, this is what I was trying to say to her.

00:18:06.560 Like, basically, you guys at The Times are not fooling anyone.

00:18:12.060 Everyone knows that you're leftist and everyone who listens to this show knows I'm more on the right.

00:18:19.100 And in owning it and just expressly saying this is what I'm going to do in the ballot box and this is what I think you should do, it's really not it's it's not as big a transgression off of where we used to be as she would have us believe.

00:18:33.540 Like, there's no one in America who thinks the majority of New York Times staffers voted Trump.

00:18:39.420 I think that was a really important part of the conversation.

00:18:46.120 And look, for 20 plus years, you know, you can trace it back to Dan Rather in 2004.

00:18:55.500 But even before that, when we had these experiences with titans of supposedly neutral purveyors of the news who claimed to be one thing,

00:19:07.440 and then there were scandals that showed them to be operating in the service of one political party.

00:19:12.900 And so your statement that, hey, disclosing your biases up front actually builds trust with an audience rather than undermining it or undermining one's credibility was, I think, really important.

00:19:27.180 And what I think that The Times often misses is that our problem with them, you know, our frustration with them.

00:19:35.640 And I say this from the Beacon all the time, like the Beacon, we say we're conservative, like we we own that.

00:19:42.740 And our problem with you is that you claim to be down the middle and we know you're something else. 0.89

00:19:49.060 And that is what is broken trust with audiences and readers.

00:19:52.380 So when you don't cover Doug Emhoff and the scandals surrounding him, that's trust breaking.

00:20:00.700 If you were to come out and say, like, hey, we don't cover scandals about Democrats because it undercuts our political priors or our mission here.

00:20:09.820 It's going to piss off our readers.

00:20:11.080 Like, OK, we'd be fine with that.

00:20:13.520 It's the posturing that you're fair.

00:20:15.700 Yes.

00:20:16.460 Right.

00:20:16.940 That just own it.

00:20:17.780 I don't understand why they don't, you know, but it's that is why there's this wide open space for people like you and Joe Rogan and others to go build these huge audiences because they're not fooling people.

00:20:32.720 Well, Megan, can I breaking trust with people?

00:20:34.900 Can I answer why they don't?

00:20:36.140 I think that's actually a really interesting part of this, because I I believe that you could fix trust in media tomorrow if the New York Times and even the good faith people like there's maybe 10 percent of journalists can genuinely.

00:20:47.780 be neutral and don't have like significant biases in one direction or the other.

00:20:51.940 You can't tell it in their copy.

00:20:53.260 Like there are some people who can do that, but they're very, very rare.

00:20:56.180 But the New York Times and The Washington Post just came out tomorrow and said, our reporting, not our editorial side, our reporting leans left.

00:21:03.900 The vast majority of our reporters are liberal.

00:21:06.080 We think, you know, maybe they put one of those signs in this house, we believe X, Y and Z outside of The Washington Post and The New York Times.

00:21:12.100 Like they would fix trust it with their audience, like right off the bat because they do some genuinely decent reporting.

00:21:17.800 Just tell us what you think.

00:21:19.120 But the reason they can't do that is that they are all in these cultural bubbles where they don't understand that their biases are biases.

00:21:27.240 Like they think this is just a matter of, you know, human rights or decency or civility.

00:21:32.120 But they don't understand that actually those are significant biases in one direction or the other.

00:21:36.880 So they're in such a bubble that they're not even able to determine anymore what's a bias and what's like actually just the things that are still controversial and contentious outside of their little bubbles.

00:21:48.400 And what's, you know, actually just something that's a point of consensus that we all agree on.

00:21:52.300 They can't tell one from the other because they're so siloed in what Charles Murray called super zips, New York, Washington, D.C., L.A., where upper middle class educated people disproportionately cluster and are disproportionately powerful.

00:22:06.320 They can't even tell anymore.

00:22:08.340 Yeah.

00:22:08.520 OK, so I I've had these debates online and the audience knows I love Sasha Stone.

00:22:13.940 She's she has a great sub stack, Free Thinking Through the Fourth Turning, which she turns into a podcast.

00:22:19.440 And I love she's been on the program.

00:22:20.640 But she she asked this online recently and I took a stab at answering it.

00:22:24.520 We had like a back and forth on it.

00:22:25.580 But she was asking, like, I'm going to screw it up.

00:22:29.200 But it was basically, why are they doing it?

00:22:30.540 Like, why?

00:22:30.960 Why?

00:22:31.340 Why do they do this to us?

00:22:32.840 They continue to pretend that they're neutral and we know they're not.

00:22:37.200 And I said that they genuinely believe they're neutral.

00:22:41.420 Like, they're not like, I'm I'm biased and I don't want anyone to find out, Eliana.

00:22:48.420 They're like, no, we are the truthful ones.

00:22:52.580 Like where we are the gatekeepers, you know, like what is life going to be like if there are no rules?

00:23:01.120 What and in fact, she and I kind of got into this, too, where she's like, you know, what does that look like?

00:23:05.500 You know, where the rules are out the window.

00:23:08.560 So and here's a little bit of that in stop five.

00:23:12.920 I think you're right that there is some way that we are seeing things or discussing something different.

00:23:21.240 Right.

00:23:21.800 I guess what I'm trying to understand is what are the rules of this new world that you are inhabiting?

00:23:27.200 Are you sort of making them up as you go along and you sort of seeing what it is?

00:23:31.180 Or do you adhere to some of those old values that you used to embrace?

00:23:34.020 The only way one succeeds in this medium is by violating all those rules that we used to have in journalism, where you don't really talk about yourself at all.

00:23:45.100 You don't talk about your opinions.

00:23:46.900 You might have a bias.

00:23:48.040 Your only goal is to hide it, not to own it and then get past it with the audience.

00:23:52.980 It's just a whole new world.

00:23:54.780 And it's OK.

00:23:56.060 We used to be much more partisan and openly partisan in our journalism and our media, you know, 100 plus years ago.

00:24:02.800 And we survived that just fine.

00:24:04.900 And we will survive this just fine, too.

00:24:07.760 What the audience wants from me is my authentic self and no filter.

00:24:12.920 What they can smell from a mile away is a phony.

00:24:15.600 So they have no problem with me endorsing Trump, even if they don't like Trump.

00:24:20.660 What they would have a problem with is me pretending I don't have a horse in the race and going out and trying to deliver the news as though I'm completely objective and I'm just as open minded to Kamala as I am to Donald Trump.

00:24:34.740 And the secret addendum to that, Eliana, is that is not only actually the rule for me in new media, it's actually the rule for you, too, Lulu.

00:24:48.200 It's actually the rule for everyone.

00:24:51.060 You just haven't realized it yet.

00:24:52.820 I mean, look, I think there's some truth to the idea that they don't realize they're biased, but I'm not totally sure that's that's the case.

00:25:07.920 I mean, when you have the CEO of NPR testifying before Congress and saying, yes, we're 87 Democrats and zero Republicans, like it does sort of defy logic that they can truly believe that doesn't actually show up in any of the news coverage.

00:25:26.460 Mm hmm.

00:25:27.100 I mean, and not to mention, like, do you believe this country is about black plunder? 0.95

00:25:32.980 Right.

00:25:33.540 But I genuinely believe that woman is there, like, I, you know, I don't remember ever tweeting that, but that sounds right.

00:25:42.660 You know, like, I genuinely believe that woman took to the congressional seat last week and was like, I'm not biased and NPR is not biased.

00:25:50.820 You know, like we check our bias.

00:25:53.160 There's a there's a legit wall between me and the actual reporters at NPR, Emily, and, you know, that protects us from.

00:26:00.500 And then when you ask the follow up question, we're like, what about the people on the other side of that wall?

00:26:05.500 What have you done to satisfy yourself that they're not just like you and reflecting those biases in their reporting?

00:26:11.440 It's like the monkey with the see, no evil, hear, no evil speak.

00:26:15.200 Like, I know nothing.

00:26:17.560 Seriously.

00:26:18.360 And I think actually Eliana's point is a legitimate one.

00:26:21.280 And one time one thing you hear from the media a lot when you point out those discrepancies is they will say, OK, but it's because like, look at Donald Trump.

00:26:29.740 It's because Republicans don't have as many serious people to put forth that aren't trafficking and disinformation.

00:26:37.760 That's always the excuse.

00:26:39.060 Right.

00:26:39.480 But they don't even understand sometimes that like they don't they're completely out of the loop.

00:26:45.000 They dismiss as conspiracy theories often when Republicans point out the lies or the pattern of lies that certain Democrats have told.

00:26:53.300 Because, again, they will categorically say it's not serious if it's coming from the Federalist.

00:26:58.760 It's not serious if it's coming from Ben Shapiro.

00:27:01.040 So they don't even understand, like they're not even even able to make those equivalencies.

00:27:04.900 You know, they say, well, of course, we don't platform as many Republicans as we do Democrats.

00:27:09.360 Republicans have an endemic truth problem.

00:27:11.440 And it's like you weren't covering, for example, Biden, as you started with, Megan, like every the White House was suddenly talking about how those these were, quote, cheap fakes.

00:27:20.940 And you guys literally like reprinted their press releases for several weeks until the debate.

00:27:25.920 And you couldn't do it anymore.

00:27:27.340 Or there's certain storylines like Tara Reid, there's certain storylines that they just check out of because they assume it's how many people literally how many people in Americans can say that they've interviewed both Trump accusers on the sexual assault or harassment front and Tara Reid.

00:27:45.480 I literally I might be the only one like the New York Times cannot say that, you know, that's what I was trying to say to her.

00:27:51.180 Like there was another part that didn't make the dance where I said, look, to me, it's funny, you know, that you're asking this about me and how I can maintain my ability to criticize him, notwithstanding my endorsement, because I wrote I said, this is the sin of which the left is guilty.

00:28:08.540 You know, like no one on the left can really ask this question you're asking me.

00:28:13.680 There are very few who actually do raise these questions on their own side and who are willing to go after Kamala and Joe Biden or Barack Obama or, God forbid, Michelle Obama in the way I go after the right and Trump.

00:28:26.960 They just won't do it.

00:28:28.380 If you listen to my show, you listen for a week, you'll have multiple examples of me raising questions about the way Trump has done something or his team has done something.

00:28:37.360 But I don't have TDS.

00:28:39.240 I can see the good he does very clearly, and I have no problem giving him credit for the wins.

00:28:45.760 After that, she said, I'll say that Ezra Klein, one of my colleagues, was one of the earliest people to call for Biden to drop out of the race.

00:28:53.660 Yes. And I said, where was the Times editorial doing that at any point prior to the debate?

00:28:59.720 That was also January. I mean, that was that was January like this.

00:29:03.680 And he was only saying that he's old. Ezra Klein was saying Biden's too old.

00:29:08.080 He wasn't saying he's lost it. You know, he's like, oh, he's too old to be president.

00:29:12.420 And, you know, she said, oh, well, I said, where was that?

00:29:15.600 Where's the Times editorial doing that before that debate?

00:29:18.280 She said, well, the editorial pages, as you know, are different than the news pages.

00:29:22.580 And I said, where was the news coverage? Where was the news coverage?

00:29:25.500 Where was Peter Baker documenting the fact that these brain doctors had been to the White House 10 times over the prior year?

00:29:32.100 And she said, I'm not going to litigate the Times's coverage.

00:29:34.340 And I understood she was not there to defend the New York Times, which I totally get.

00:29:38.320 Like she wasn't sent to me to come on my show as a representative of the Times and to defend them.

00:29:43.940 She's like, I'm trying to do a nice profile of you, lady.

00:29:46.420 Why do you keep attacking me?

00:29:47.980 And I was basically saying, you can't ask me how I could possibly be fair to Trump, notwithstanding my endorsement, when you're the New York Times.

00:29:58.940 You just can't do it.

00:30:00.080 And here's let me explain to you why you can't do it.

00:30:02.520 That's sort of where we were going, Emily.

00:30:04.480 Yeah, and that's a really good point.

00:30:08.260 And to me, it's just like some of these lines, some of these like that actually is a good example about the cheap fakes, because it's not just what their editorial writers, their columnists were saying.

00:30:20.340 I mean, your point is that the straight news coverage is shot through with the bias that should be on the editorial side if there were this traditional neutral firewall, which just doesn't really exist.

00:30:32.400 Nobody believes that it exists.

00:30:34.160 They will tell you in our newsroom every day there's no overlap, but they believe roughly the same things.

00:30:39.860 Even if there's, you know, little debates, they believe roughly the same thing.

00:30:43.660 So why wasn't there the Peter Baker stories like that's the question we need to have answered about the White House being having doctors coming in and out of it about donors being upset when they saw him in person?

00:30:55.780 Like those stories were nowhere to be found.

00:30:57.360 Instead, it was the cheap fake storyline on any.

00:31:00.480 It's not just the Times.

00:31:01.320 We're picking on them because I sat with them.

00:31:03.180 But NPR with her little firewall, those NPR reporters weren't running around covering the Joe Biden mental acuity problems.

00:31:11.300 And you all saw last week and when it happened, what they did with the Hunter Biden laptop.

00:31:15.780 Like we're not our viewers aren't interested in that fake news story.

00:31:19.020 That's that's the problem.

00:31:20.900 You know, like neither the editorial nor the journalism side is open minded to any bad news to Democrats that doesn't like dovetail with their worldview.

00:31:29.400 You know, like if a Democrat works with a Republican, they might do a negative story on him.

00:31:33.520 Right. But like they're not going to cover things that could actually undermine Joe Biden's chances of reelection in an honest way.

00:31:40.180 And everyone knows it.

00:31:42.060 That's what I was trying to say.

00:31:42.820 Like you go back 150 years in this country.

00:31:45.660 We used to be very partisan.

00:31:47.080 You know, that so-called yellow journalism period.

00:31:49.140 People used to pick up different rags to read and they would completely affirm their worldview on the right and the left.

00:31:53.920 And that's how life was.

00:31:54.860 And we did just fine.

00:31:55.700 And if we're in a country where you're, quote, siloed that way, it's OK.

00:32:00.400 The reality is we already are there.

00:32:02.620 That is where we already are.

00:32:03.960 We're just we're just pretending in the so-called mainstream that we're not, that those are still our gatekeepers.

00:32:10.380 All right.

00:32:10.840 Moving past that particular subject, I do want to show this.

00:32:14.600 So we did get into my long history with Trump, Eliana, and, you know, me asking him that question at the debate.

00:32:21.260 And then he came after me and she raised a question that a lot of the left cannot.

00:32:26.800 And even some on the right who don't love Trump cannot understand.

00:32:31.640 Like, they can't understand how I or, frankly, anyone who doesn't totally endorse the way Donald Trump has behaved his entire life or with respect to us or an individual like, let's say, John McCain or the Gold Star families in the first race and so on.

00:32:49.320 Can come around to supporting him like they they like this is a genuine inability to understand, like, please explain to me how you can endorse that man.

00:32:59.340 And we got into E. Jean Carroll.

00:33:00.800 You heard me saying they're like, I don't believe her, but we expanded it just a bit and sought to.

00:33:06.220 I do think he's taken inappropriate liberties with women and gotten handsy with them in a way he's owned himself.

00:33:15.500 OK, years ago when he was a celebrity and it is what it is.

00:33:19.640 That's the past.

00:33:21.620 But it's just about so much more than that.

00:33:24.520 We are talking about how many people dying at the southern border because of the invasion that we've suffered under Joe Biden.

00:33:33.340 We're talking about Lincoln Riley, whose killer was led in under Biden.

00:33:36.760 We put him on a taxpayer flight down to Georgia where he murdered her. 0.99

00:33:40.300 I don't give a shit about Trump getting handsy with somebody 20 years ago. 0.99

00:33:45.560 I want someone who will close the border, which he has. 0.99

00:33:48.980 I want someone who will keep boys out of my daughter's sports, which he has. 1.00

00:33:53.140 I want someone who will stand up to the insane DEI policies so that white kids will stop hearing in school that they're born with some original sin from which they cannot recover, which he has.

00:34:04.780 And I mean, that right there, Eliana, I mean, that just sums up why so many of us happily, gleefully, hopefully and and just optimistically pulled the lever for Donald Trump in November and remain really grateful to him for the agenda he is unleashing.

00:34:26.400 It is just that, you know, anybody on the left still obsessing about Trump and like E.

00:34:33.240 Jean Carroll or like when he was a celebrity, but it's just people are dying.

00:34:40.940 You know, young women are being killed.

00:34:43.060 Young women are being hurt on the sports.

00:34:44.580 It's like have some perspective.

00:34:47.580 I actually don't think that that question was about Trump, Megan.

00:34:51.740 I think it was about you and I think the question was put to you such it it really was.

00:34:58.420 How can you, Megan Kelly, who talk a lot about how about who position yourself as pro woman who talk a bit about how to have a real career and build a family who are certainly like, you know, you're certainly not a wilting violet. 0.97

00:35:16.980 How can you have that identity, which is very much a public identity and, you know, vote for this scumbag, endorse this scumbag when you have been publicly mistreated on the basis of your, you know, lady parts like a benefit made them a subject of conversation. 0.95

00:35:38.600 So I took that to be about you and like, you know, a sort of tacit attempt to undermine, you know, your credibility on that issue. 0.97

00:35:47.460 And I actually thought it was an interesting conversation because it gets to issues that like all voters confront, which are like, what are lesser and more important issues to me that I'm going to vote on?

00:35:58.660 And you basically said, like, look, he may have mistreated me personally, like it was a micro and macro thing, but that's just less important to me than other issues the nation is confronting on which I think he's going to perform much better than she would have.

00:36:16.140 Like, it's just and I do think there's like an inability on the left to get beyond like, well, he mistreated you.

00:36:24.180 How can that not be the main issue that you're going to vote on?

00:36:26.880 Yeah, that's right. And I think it's a feeling that the left has in general on Trump.

00:36:33.160 And they did include this piece in the interview where she said, what do you think of Trump dismissing the media as enemy of the people and fake news?

00:36:41.780 Oh, and let me add, Megan, like we saw Democrats do this with Bill Clinton all the time.

00:36:46.120 It was like, oh, whatever. You know, he got handsy with an intern in the Oval Office, but like he's doing a lot of great things.

00:36:53.520 And I think that's like a perfectly fair argument to make.

00:36:57.640 Like, yeah, that's fine.

00:36:59.500 You know, any conservatives issue with him was he with was he lied under oath.

00:37:03.320 But by the same token, I think it is fine for for conservatives to say, like, we don't care that much about his personal conduct from 10 or 20 years ago.

00:37:12.020 We don't think that he, you know, never lies, but he's doing things that we think are a lot more important.

00:37:19.460 Well, and it's like you look over at the other side, it's like, well, if I vote for Kamala, I could bring in a party that has had a president office who did more than get handsy with an intern. 0.96

00:37:30.220 I mean, he was getting blowjobs from her at the Oval and while he was married, by the way. 0.99

00:37:35.540 Fine. OK. And then the woman who was running is married to a guy who's been credibly accused as an abuser and a woman abuser, which the left wouldn't even cover. 0.99

00:37:46.340 And so it's like, OK, no one is ideal like most of these characters who wind up running for us are ideal.

00:37:52.980 Maybe Mitt Romney was ideal, except for the weird dog stuff.

00:37:56.100 But his policies weren't ideal. His policies didn't speak to the Republican base.

00:38:00.480 Go ahead. This came up in the Hegseth nomination, too, where I can't remember which senator asked him, like, were you unfaithful to your wife?

00:38:07.540 And suggested that that disqualified him from being the secretary of defense.

00:38:13.860 Was that Tim Kaine?

00:38:14.760 It was like this. I can't remember who it was, but it was like, are you serious, man?

00:38:19.920 Like, right. I mean, you ran with Hillary Clinton for a you ran for president with Hillary.

00:38:26.120 How many of these United States senators have been unfaithful to their spouses? 0.99

00:38:30.280 But there is this, I think, instinct on the left to say, like, these matters of personal conduct, which, frankly, the country is so far beyond.

00:38:39.020 Like, yeah, really, you know, it's but ironically, I have to say, in the left's defense, they got that from the right.

00:38:45.400 You know, the right used to be the more judgmental, like nobody who's had an affair that party.

00:38:50.020 It wasn't until Trump came along that that was completely busted open.

00:38:53.420 Remember, the story in 15 was how can evangelicals get behind this guy, this Randy celebrity handsy percent.

00:39:01.680 Right. Yeah. Well, also, Trump was the first person to like first high profile person to understand this about American politics, because the Tim Kaine example is fantastic, at least on the right.

00:39:13.760 That is to say he brought the Clinton accusers to the debate and put them in like the front row back in 20.

00:39:20.580 It was amazing. It was genius, truly genius, because he recognized that his voters and people who could be persuadable to his side, the most important thing he could do was to show that Hillary Clinton does not have the moral high ground when she criticizes his character.

00:39:38.820 And that's what the entire stunt was proving is the emperor is wearing no clothes.

00:39:44.420 And as soon as you can prove that Trump realizes he can compete on the policy grounds, but it's convincing those persuadables that there is no moral high ground among his his critics.

00:39:54.160 And that's absolutely true. It's proven to be true over and over again.

00:39:57.880 It's funny because there was another point at which she and I discussed Trump and his attacks on the media.

00:40:02.840 And I was saying, like, why are we pretending that we're just like these little butterflies that can't have the wings plucked off?

00:40:09.000 Like, we're tough. We can take it's fine. Who cares? Basically, what Trump says?

00:40:14.500 Yes, he's demonizing the news media. The whole point would be not to lean in, right?

00:40:21.560 Like try to maintain your objectivity and and disprove the accusations.

00:40:27.200 You look at a place like CNN, that's where they went wrong.

00:40:30.560 Jeff Zucker was like, oh, he's actually giving me ideas to be an enemy of the people, to be fake news.

00:40:36.420 Yes, that's how I'll drive my ratings up.

00:40:39.380 Yeah. Put your head down and do your job.

00:40:44.500 That's it. That's it. We don't have to spend any time really thinking about his names that he's calling us.

00:40:49.620 Just do just do the work and try to be fair and try not to have TDS.

00:40:53.660 OK, so overall, I think the times for what I thought was a fair interview.

00:40:58.160 I liked Lulu. If I see her again, I think it'll be friendly.

00:41:01.680 And I think, you know, there was some value to getting in front of the times audience, which, by the way, is having a meltdown over the whole interview.

00:41:09.980 If you look at the comments on the times YouTube feed, they're so unhappy.

00:41:14.700 They're so mad that I don't believe you, Jean Carroll.

00:41:16.540 I don't believe her at all. Not one word.

00:41:19.900 Women don't run around laughing about their rapes. 1.00

00:41:22.860 And by the way, she can't even remember what year it happened.

00:41:26.140 Please give me a break.

00:41:28.040 I'll buy you Paris, Rachel.

00:41:29.840 That is not a rape survivor. 1.00

00:41:32.200 OK, anyway, I thank the times for the interview.

00:41:36.500 And I thought it was actually a very good conversation.

00:41:38.820 And I'll just add one addendum to Ben Smith of Semaphore.

00:41:42.580 That's the kind of conversation you and I could have had if you had just asked probative, like open questions to try to get it where media is right now.

00:41:50.300 Like she and I actually plowed new ground to have sort of somebody from the legacy media talking to somebody like me who was of that world but now is in the new.

00:41:59.120 So it was an interesting conversation because she was open minded and she was honest about like where she was, you know, not getting it.

00:42:06.440 And like that, we advanced the ball.

00:42:09.200 That's that's how interviews should be done.

00:42:11.000 So thumbs up.

00:42:12.180 And I encourage everybody to go listen to it.

00:42:13.800 It's on The New York Times, The Daily Feed, or you can go to their YouTube channel.

00:42:18.000 Just go to YouTube and type in New York Times, Megyn Kelly, and you'll find it.

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00:43:18.100 I'm Megan Kelly, host of The Megan Kelly Show on SiriusXM.

00:43:23.260 It's your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political, legal, and cultural figures today.

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00:44:16.060 Offer details apply.

00:44:21.780 I do want to spend a minute on Kara Swisher, who is a tech journalist, very nasty person, who I used to kind of get along with. 0.97

00:44:32.640 I met her at NBC, where she was a contributor when I was working there, and interviewed her for some tech story involving the Me Too movement.

00:44:43.040 I can't remember who it was, but it was like a couple of guys out there in Silicon Valley who were not great.

00:44:47.920 And so we interviewed her, and we interviewed a bunch of women who were kind of complaining. 1.00

00:44:51.860 And so that's the foot on which we got off, which I would say is a leftist foot, right?

00:44:55.740 Like she met me doing a more left-leaning story, and therefore she liked me, right?

00:45:00.500 Because it's like, great, you're a woman of the right, but you're open-minded to sexual harassment claims, so let's go.

00:45:07.480 Well, we maintained an occasional correspondence via text, et cetera.

00:45:11.600 And I met her, like, once or twice for a drink.

00:45:14.860 And I have to say, like, we got along.

00:45:16.960 She's a very tough, ballsy, openly lesbian woman. 1.00

00:45:23.620 And that's fine.

00:45:25.080 I actually have a fair amount of friends who are LGB.

00:45:28.500 LGB.

00:45:30.680 And that's great.

00:45:33.260 Whatever.

00:45:34.140 I've got absolutely no issues there.

00:45:35.500 As you know, we stop at the T.

00:45:38.860 Anyway, so how did things go south?

00:45:42.260 Well, let me play the soundbite first, and then I'll tell you how.

00:45:45.420 Here's her on her podcast.

00:45:46.880 Megan Kelly is launching a podcast network.

00:45:48.840 Lots of people are doing this.

00:45:49.820 MK Media launching next month.

00:45:51.300 We'll have shows from Mark Halperin, Maureen Callahan, and Link Lauren.

00:45:55.720 I think the company she's worked with was sold to Fox, the Red, whatever you call it.

00:46:00.760 Let's listen to what Megan has to say about this.

00:46:03.100 So excited about these three.

00:46:05.520 Aren't these a great three to launch with?

00:46:08.020 They cover the gamut, right?

00:46:09.420 It's like Link has got such a following amongst young, sort of right-leaning people or independent-minded people who have just had it with the weird left.

00:46:19.320 Anyway, her podcast, which launched in 2020, I was one of the first people to talk to her about doing a podcast.

00:46:24.180 As I've said before, it's consistently one of the most popular news podcasts in the country.

00:46:28.380 I don't know if it's news exactly.

00:46:30.540 You're kinder than her.

00:46:31.600 I think she's just a rage machine, and she has a little act that she takes on the road and screams at women, a lot of women. 1.00

00:46:37.780 But the idea of what's happening here is a bigger thing, is there's a lot of really interesting independent companies being created, whether they're unconservative or liberal.

00:46:46.240 And it really is.

00:46:47.280 This idea of doing these podcast networks is going to be really interesting in how you do them and keep them entrepreneurial.

00:46:53.420 I know Scott and I have talked about it, especially the voices on the weird left like ourselves.

00:46:58.060 What is wrong with her? 1.00

00:47:01.720 What is wrong is I see you, and I hear you, and I see how nasty you are to everybody.

00:47:06.520 And I love that she calls me a rage machine. 0.99

00:47:08.820 She is literally known for, like, walking away with people's balls. 1.00

00:47:12.580 It's a mystery in Silicon Valley why people continue to sit down with her. 0.99

00:47:16.820 Elon hates her guts.

00:47:17.900 All she does is rip on Elon night and day. 0.98

00:47:20.660 If you are an executive in Silicon Valley that sits with her, you know she's going to try to leave with your jugular. 1.00

00:47:25.780 That's what she's known for. 0.91

00:47:27.060 By the way, I will put my record of protecting women up against Kara Swisher's any day of the week.

00:47:34.300 In fact, I can't think of a single thing Kara Swisher's ever done for women at all, except what?

00:47:39.960 Support abortion rights.

00:47:41.140 That's probably what she's thinking.

00:47:43.260 But I'll tell you how things went wrong.

00:47:46.700 And she's right.

00:47:47.880 She did encourage me to launch the podcast.

00:47:49.860 I remember she sent me a text that said something like, the lesbians are for it. 1.00

00:47:54.580 Because she was seeing a bunch of, like, either lesbian podcasters or just friends that she was after a drink we had. 1.00

00:48:00.340 And I appreciated that.

00:48:01.600 Now, honestly, I was very open-minded to Kara Swisher and understood our politics are very different.

00:48:06.860 But, you know, I have a lot of friends who are on the other side of the aisle and would never make those the stakes of a relationship.

00:48:12.040 You know where things went south was she didn't like my COVID commentary once I actually did launch the podcast, either on the show or on X, which was then Twitter.

00:48:24.500 And I was pointing out that young people were getting myocarditis, especially young teenage men, and dying and suffering the world over as a result of these vaccines.

00:48:37.680 And it wasn't being disclosed.

00:48:39.120 And I was citing Dr. Vinay Prasad, who was way ahead on this issue, was having pediatric cardiologists on his show and talking about it.

00:48:46.920 But she didn't like that.

00:48:48.780 None of the left liked that.

00:48:50.680 And, unfortunately, she invited me to go on her podcast.

00:48:55.580 And I agreed.

00:48:56.740 That's not the unfortunate part.

00:48:58.400 I said, fine, I'll do it.

00:48:59.820 I was fine.

00:49:00.560 And I'm fine mixing it up with people.

00:49:02.240 I was scheduled to go on, I think, on a Tuesday or a Wednesday.

00:49:09.440 And the previous Friday, so like five days prior, my sister died.

00:49:15.860 My sister unexpectedly had a heart attack and died at age 58.

00:49:21.780 And I had Abby text her assistant to say, MK has had something personal happen.

00:49:28.020 Something personal came up.

00:49:29.240 And she's not going to be able to make it.

00:49:30.680 This is five days in advance, but I knew very well I wasn't going to be doing anybody's podcast.

00:49:35.580 And she responded, not the assistant, she responded and said, oh, that sounds like a good idea.

00:49:45.580 And I certainly hope she'll stay off X in the meantime.

00:49:50.640 So her instinct was to question, right, like why I was doing it.

00:49:55.200 Like she wasn't really accepting that it was a personal thing that had happened to me.

00:49:58.540 She thought I was trying to avoid her because I was on X saying controversial things that she was objecting to.

00:50:07.640 And that I wasn't strong enough to go on Kara Swisher's podcast. 0.94

00:50:12.060 Again, like somebody who doesn't fucking know me at all, right? 0.81

00:50:15.200 Like I'm afraid of having somebody ask me tough questions or mixing it up. 0.98

00:50:19.040 And Abby responded by saying, actually, her sister died.

00:50:26.000 And she writes back, oh, well, I was only joking.

00:50:29.520 I was only joking.

00:50:30.720 You know, sorry.

00:50:32.580 I'm sorry, but she's a bad person. 1.00

00:50:35.220 That's you're a bad person.

00:50:36.840 Did she ever send me a note?

00:50:38.760 Did she ever say like, I'm so sorry about your sister?

00:50:41.340 And like the last correspondence we had had was, sure, I'd be happy to come on your podcast. 0.99

00:50:46.880 Then she shits on me to my assistant and finds out that she's a shit, that I've had a death in the family, someone close to me. 0.99

00:50:55.420 And does she say, politics don't matter. 1.00

00:50:58.100 I'm going to shoot her a note.

00:50:59.360 You know, we've had these drinks.

00:51:00.800 I helped her, whatever.

00:51:02.320 No.

00:51:03.140 She says, oh, I was only joking. 1.00

00:51:05.140 She tries to cover her own ass because she knows she's now made herself look terrible. 0.99

00:51:11.600 And from that point forward, all she's done is rip on me. 1.00

00:51:14.400 And frankly, vice versa.

00:51:15.740 I mean, I just see her very differently now.

00:51:18.140 I think she's a bad person. 0.71

00:51:19.220 I think there's a kind of person that cannot put politics to the side.

00:51:24.900 She liked me when she thought I was a Me Too loving NBC News employee.

00:51:29.780 And once she realized I wasn't, that I really am more conservative in my worldview, that I would question the COVID vaccines, that suddenly I was too scared to go on with Kara Swisher and must be in bad faith in saying I can't make it after all.

00:51:48.560 And not revealing in the first email my personal tragedy, which Abby would never do without my permission anyway.

00:51:55.980 It's just to me, this just shows what we're up against.

00:51:58.780 And now she's out there like she's a rage machine. 1.00

00:52:01.000 And what is she talking about weird left?

00:52:03.960 Talking about you, Kara, you.

00:52:06.440 You need to make an examination of yourself and your own heart.

00:52:10.820 Okay.

00:52:11.300 Any thoughts on that?

00:52:13.200 Well, I mean, she's just the combination.

00:52:15.900 She has a combination that's really, I think, dangerous, which is sanctimonious and closed-minded.

00:52:20.960 And when you combine those two things, it's really toxic.

00:52:24.980 And it makes for very unhappy people and I think very unappealing media personalities.

00:52:31.060 And so I'm not entirely surprised by this, but it's just, I think there's a type of journalist who gets validation and sort of the moral affirmations of commentary.

00:52:41.260 And I think, unfortunately, she's one of those people and it's very dangerous.

00:52:45.260 Yeah.

00:52:46.140 I don't, it's just like, I'm so over it.

00:52:48.380 I don't know.

00:52:49.140 Eliana, you've been like openly conservative for a long time.

00:52:51.700 Like, do you have friends on the left?

00:52:53.380 Do you maintain friendships?

00:52:55.100 Do they make politics the stakes?

00:52:57.400 You know, it's an interesting question.

00:53:00.760 I've always found, like, when I worked at Politico and when I was a contributor at CNN and even in college and that sort of left-wing environment, I found if you keep your views to yourself and don't express them, that's how I've sort of made my way and made peace there.

00:53:20.640 And I haven't found people necessarily coming to, you know, a few people, a few people will come and pick fights with you.

00:53:28.880 But the trouble comes if you actually openly express your views.

00:53:33.800 Right.

00:53:34.420 People don't like it.

00:53:35.520 Like, if you want to talk about what you think, it becomes a problem.

00:53:38.980 If you're going to keep your head down and not say what you think, like, you can get by peaceably.

00:53:44.920 It's so sad.

00:53:46.240 It's really sad.

00:53:47.220 Like, I, that's how different we are.

00:53:50.300 Like, I knew very well how leftist she was.

00:53:54.480 I didn't care.

00:53:55.820 I don't care.

00:53:57.200 I just don't care about that in my friendships.

00:53:59.860 Life is too short.

00:54:01.680 You know, but she cared.

00:54:03.960 Like, she, once she saw where I stood on COVID, it was a bridge too far.

00:54:08.960 She was, she turned off. 0.94

00:54:10.020 She thought I was, like, somehow gross and afraid and a liar. 0.84

00:54:14.780 Like, it's, okay, whatever. 0.77

00:54:16.640 I mean, enough time spent on her.

00:54:18.040 But, yeah, go ahead, Emily.

00:54:19.140 But you were right.

00:54:20.160 This is what drives me crazy.

00:54:21.620 It's like, you were right.

00:54:22.640 And she was holding herself up as the, as the sort of fact-based arbiter of truth and using

00:54:28.460 her platform to smear you. 1.00

00:54:30.760 And it's turned out that you were vindicated.

00:54:33.240 So that's what I think is just, like, so egregious.

00:54:35.720 So there's no humility looking back and thinking, like, I was the one who was in the wrong.

00:54:40.080 And I was coming out real hot.

00:54:42.060 I was real sanctified.

00:54:43.240 I was real close-minded.

00:54:44.620 I was wrong.

00:54:45.420 Megan was right.

00:54:46.080 Shouldn't have smeared her. 0.73

00:54:46.980 There's just none of that.

00:54:47.760 It's just more smears.

00:54:49.720 Yeah.

00:54:50.140 I just don't understand why you wouldn't then reach out to me and say, hey, hope you're okay.

00:54:56.720 I just, I genuinely don't get it.

00:54:58.460 It's a mystery to me.

00:54:59.940 Whatever.

00:55:01.100 Life's about, you know, the people who are there for you, not the ones who aren't.

00:55:05.380 Okay.

00:55:05.780 So let's move on.

00:55:07.720 I think it's fascinating that the White House Correspondents Association has canceled this

00:55:13.260 comedian.

00:55:13.900 Now, this guy, Eugene Daniels, we've shown him to the audience before.

00:55:17.820 He's the one.

00:55:18.620 He's openly LGB.

00:55:21.740 I don't know about T.

00:55:23.520 I mean, he's posting pictures of himself in, like, trying to look like Beyonce and sexy

00:55:29.720 Beyonce clothing and wigs.

00:55:31.460 Okay.

00:55:31.860 This is the, this is him.

00:55:34.080 He's the president of the White House Correspondents.

00:55:36.880 Okay.

00:55:39.320 Yeah.

00:55:39.820 I don't.

00:55:40.600 Okay.

00:55:41.660 The listening audience, please just go to youtube.com.

00:55:44.160 Okay.

00:55:44.540 I can't do this justice.

00:55:45.860 Go about an hour into the show and you will see it.

00:55:47.480 YouTube.com slash Megan Kelly.

00:55:48.560 And, uh, Eugene thought this woman, Amber Ruffin would be a great hire for the White House

00:55:56.240 Correspondents dinner.

00:55:58.540 And now why did he think that she would be a great hire for this dinner where the rule

00:56:03.040 here at the gridiron at the Al Smith dinner, all of which are events at which the president

00:56:09.340 will typically appear.

00:56:11.300 I mean, it's a great get the president will come and he'll make fun of himself and he'll

00:56:15.440 take the press's barbs to, or those of a comedian and that, and it's like a spirit of unity,

00:56:19.580 but the rule was always singed.

00:56:21.860 Don't burn.

00:56:22.820 That is the rule until Trump.

00:56:25.860 And then these comedians started coming out and lighting bonfires about Sarah's Huckabee

00:56:33.080 Sanders and her devil mascara or whatever the line was. 0.98

00:56:37.300 I can't remember it, but it was mean and, um, ripping Trump, like talk about burning.

00:56:44.420 I mean, it was truly like five alarm fire burning.

00:56:47.400 Okay.

00:56:47.700 We have, we have an example of this.

00:56:49.240 Yeah.

00:56:49.760 Here's a montage.

00:56:51.320 Oh, here we go.

00:56:51.760 My team's way ahead of me of some of what we've seen over the years.

00:56:54.780 It's not 11 against Trump.

00:56:56.620 And I am truly honored to be here, even though all, all of Hollywood pulled out.

00:57:00.680 Now that King Joffrey is president, it feels like the red wedding in here.

00:57:03.880 We got to address the elephant.

00:57:05.820 That's not in the room.

00:57:06.940 Trump isn't here.

00:57:08.000 If you haven't noticed, he's not here.

00:57:10.140 And I know, I know I would drag him here myself, but it turns out the president of the 1.00

00:57:15.540 United States is the one pussy you're not allowed to grab. 1.00

00:57:20.640 Nice. 1.00

00:57:21.420 You're all supposed to keep it classy, but anyway.

00:57:23.660 So Amber Ruffin gets hired for the gig and, um, hold on a second. 0.99

00:57:30.920 Do we have, we have, okay.

00:57:32.920 We have a little bit of how she sounded prior to getting hired.

00:57:38.260 Here's take a listen.

00:57:41.180 In an interview on Monday, President Trump said that the phrase black lives matter is

00:57:46.440 quote bad for black people.

00:57:48.180 I fact-checked that statement and I found out that it is in fact not true. 0.99

00:57:53.760 I did some more digging and found out that it was also a dumb thing to think. 0.98

00:58:00.820 In addition to that, it's an even dumber thing to say. 0.99

00:58:05.440 And those are the facts. 0.98

00:58:07.280 Oh my God.

00:58:10.440 That is just so typical leftist.

00:58:12.620 It's not funny.

00:58:14.240 It's political.

00:58:15.840 It's stripping Trump.

00:58:17.500 She's looking for applause, not laughs.

00:58:19.540 And so Eugene Daniels was like, yeah, right on.

00:58:24.000 That's our girl.

00:58:25.440 Let's do this.

00:58:26.820 So she gets hired and the Trump White House through a spokesperson, a deputy comms person

00:58:32.660 tweets out, um, I think, I think comms tweets out something like, really, really?

00:58:37.940 And she then goes on a media tour promoting her gig and the media tour gets her fired here 1.00

00:58:46.060 in particular is what appears to have gotten her fired. 0.62

00:58:49.320 Sot seven.

00:58:50.660 Okay.

00:58:51.220 So will anyone from the administration be attended?

00:58:53.840 How much do you actually know about who will be in attendance?

00:58:58.540 Do you get like the rundown?

00:59:00.660 I'm sure that I will at some point.

00:59:02.640 Well, I know the news organizations that will be attending.

00:59:06.260 Like, I'm not a hundred percent interested in being like, ha, you're here. 1.00

00:59:09.620 Look at your stupid head. 1.00

00:59:10.640 You're burned. 1.00

00:59:11.440 I care. 1.00

00:59:12.260 Like, you're kind of a bunch of murderers. 0.96

00:59:16.180 I mean, so like, they were like, you need to be, you know, equal and make sure that the, 0.88

00:59:24.640 that you give it to both sides and blah, blah, blah.

00:59:27.460 I was like, there's no way I'm going to be freaking doing that, dude.

00:59:31.200 Under no circumstance.

00:59:32.380 Yeah.

00:59:32.980 I think it's just that burns on Trump hurt.

00:59:36.680 Badly.

00:59:37.560 And, and then it trickles down to everyone who's around him because y'all are also guilty.

00:59:43.180 So I think it just, they got their feelings hurt, but it may want that false equivalency

00:59:48.480 that the media does.

00:59:49.580 They want that.

00:59:50.480 It feels great.

00:59:51.460 It makes them feel like human beings, but they shouldn't get to feel that way because

00:59:54.880 they're not.

00:59:55.360 Some people are more culpable than others.

00:59:58.820 That's right.

00:59:59.880 And they get more jokes made about them.

01:00:02.940 And the jokes are meaner because they're doing things that are worse.

01:00:07.460 Yeah.

01:00:07.780 In a lot of ways.

01:00:08.780 That's how that goes.

01:00:11.200 It can't be even.

01:00:13.060 It actually can't.

01:00:14.300 You could do it.

01:00:15.120 It can't be even handed and becoming a part of what's wrong.

01:00:18.180 This is who they hire.

01:00:20.720 So that finally got her fired with this sanctimonious statement by Eugene Daniels, who had earlier

01:00:26.340 said, I mean, this woman's beliefs about Trump and the right were not a mystery.

01:00:30.200 We could play 10 more sound bites.

01:00:31.660 But when he hired her on February 4th, he announced he personally chose her, that her talents are

01:00:37.760 unique and the ideal fit for this current political and cultural climate.

01:00:42.960 Her perspective will fit right in, right in, he said, at this dinner.

01:00:48.700 And only when she came out and said the truth about what she's going to do to Samantha Bee

01:00:53.180 on this podcast was he then forced because the White House and the right were completely

01:00:58.940 ripping them to shreds.

01:01:00.520 And I'm sure that there were many right-leaning journalists saying, we're not going, not going

01:01:04.680 to go sit there.

01:01:05.400 And the administration, I mean, Trump's not going already, but maybe they got an administration

01:01:09.960 official or two.

01:01:11.180 I'm sure all of whom said we're out.

01:01:13.600 Then he issues this statement saying, the White House Correspondents Association board

01:01:18.300 has unanimously decided we are no longer featuring a comedic performance this year.

01:01:24.420 I want to ensure the focus is not on the politics of division, but entirely on

01:01:29.540 awarding our colleagues, he says, at this consequential moment for journalism, entirely on awarding

01:01:36.100 our colleagues for their outstanding work, their scholarship and mentorship for the next

01:01:42.300 generation of journalists.

01:01:44.580 So what do you make of it, Emily?

01:01:47.300 It's now, there's not going to be a comedian because what we need to do is focus on the outstanding

01:01:51.980 work of the White House press corps.

01:01:54.480 Oh, yes, it must be celebrated.

01:01:56.960 This is exactly what we were talking about earlier in that anytime they say that there's

01:02:01.180 disproportionate, you're like, oh, your coverage isn't even, it's not balanced between Republicans

01:02:04.800 and Democrats.

01:02:05.360 They say that's because Republicans are worse.

01:02:07.380 This is where they can't even tell what their own biases are.

01:02:10.860 And obviously, this is a comedian who is clearly on the left.

01:02:14.320 She's not claiming to be anything else.

01:02:16.040 But that's the White House Correspondents Association, the bastion of journalistic integrity, saying

01:02:22.120 her views are going to fit right in.

01:02:23.720 Of course, like this is exactly what we need.

01:02:26.640 And, you know, if they wanted someone who would do a great job skewering Trump and skewering

01:02:31.740 Democrats as well, you could find someone like Thea Vaughn or you could find someone like 1.00

01:02:36.020 even Joe Rogan or Shane Gillis, Andrew Schultz, these guys.

01:02:39.740 Sebastian Maniscalco.

01:02:41.480 Right.

01:02:41.760 And it's actually a really good parallel with what we're talking about with your New York Times

01:02:44.940 interview. It's like they don't understand that some really popular comedians actually

01:02:49.120 go after Republicans to actually go after Trump like their equal opportunity in the same

01:02:55.480 way a lot of podcasters are equal opportunity.

01:02:57.420 They don't hold back when they disagree with him or when he does something that's funny

01:03:01.820 and could be spoofed or satirized.

01:03:04.840 And so they have no idea.

01:03:05.880 They're just in these insane bubbles where they think the only person who could do a good

01:03:09.860 job at the White House Correspondents Association dinner is Amber Ruffin, who is not funny. 1.00

01:03:14.940 It's like they hadn't evolved since 2017 with the rest of the country, even though Donald

01:03:20.340 Trump was just elected again with an even higher margin in the Electoral College.

01:03:24.880 So they're completely out of touch.

01:03:26.680 They were caught in it.

01:03:27.980 And the last thing I'll say is this is always what the White House Correspondents Association

01:03:31.160 dinner should have been.

01:03:32.540 They want to claim it's a fundraiser.

01:03:35.000 They want to claim the moral high ground.

01:03:36.480 We're fundraising for journalism.

01:03:38.500 It's about democracy.

01:03:39.740 OK, well, then stop making it a Hollywood spectacle and just fundraise.

01:03:44.640 Do that.

01:03:45.560 Fine.

01:03:46.160 But stop acting like this is some great thing for the country when it's actually just an

01:03:50.200 orgy of elitism.

01:03:52.320 Yeah.

01:03:52.680 Or, you know, it would have been so easy, Eliana.

01:03:55.220 Go for Jim Gaffigan, who spoke at the Al Smith dinner.

01:03:59.140 He's a comedian.

01:04:00.140 He he's never been really a Trump fan, but he did a great job that night of ripping on both

01:04:05.320 sides.

01:04:06.240 Remember, this is the one that Kamala didn't show up at.

01:04:08.380 It's this big Catholic ado in New York City. 0.99

01:04:11.580 We were there and Trump clearly finds him acceptable because Trump showed up.

01:04:16.460 Gaffigan was there.

01:04:17.260 Trump was there.

01:04:18.660 Trump laughed.

01:04:19.560 He was very able to make fun of himself.

01:04:22.060 Very open to it.

01:04:23.660 If it's a singe, not burn.

01:04:25.240 It's not that hard. 0.67

01:04:26.140 Just freaking pay up.

01:04:28.060 Go with Gaffigan. 0.82

01:04:28.940 Go with somebody, you know, Trump.

01:04:30.200 But they didn't they don't care.

01:04:31.940 They don't want Trump there.

01:04:33.860 And by the way, Eugene Daniels knew that because he did a joint interview with this

01:04:39.340 Amber Ruffin on Morning Joe when they made the announcement and the following exchange

01:04:43.620 happened.

01:04:44.060 Look at Sot 9.

01:04:45.660 You say you have invited President Trump and the first lady to attend in his first term.

01:04:50.740 He never did.

01:04:51.560 He didn't.

01:04:52.200 He didn't.

01:04:52.740 He had four shots.

01:04:54.280 Four shots.

01:04:55.220 He missed them all.

01:04:56.160 Do you hope to see him there?

01:04:57.260 No.

01:04:57.500 No, no, she said sitting next to Eugene.

01:05:01.720 He's well aware of Amber's feelings about the Trump administration and Trump himself.

01:05:08.040 That's how she got the invite.

01:05:09.760 So why do you think he pulled it?

01:05:11.960 Like, why didn't he just say, oh, calm down?

01:05:16.140 We're going to stick by her.

01:05:18.380 A couple of reasons.

01:05:19.840 I mean, first of all, the goal should be to have the president there makes it a more

01:05:24.760 newsworthy event.

01:05:25.880 And one thing we haven't talked about is that there's talk of actually the White House

01:05:30.260 participating in a counter-programming event with conservative journalists, which would

01:05:36.020 actually take the air out of this event.

01:05:38.260 But Eugene Daniels, who was a co-author of Politico Playbook, sort of the flagship newsletter

01:05:44.640 of the D.C. elites, has quit that and left to be a host on the left-wing MSNBC, which is

01:05:55.500 spinning off from MSNBC or from NBC to become its own, you know, network, independent network.

01:06:03.040 And as a result of that, there have been calls for him to resign from the White House

01:06:08.240 correspondence from the presidency of the White House Correspondents Association, which

01:06:14.240 is supposed to be held by somebody, you know, who's an ostensibly neutral White House reporter.

01:06:19.060 And he's resisted those calls.

01:06:22.060 I think there's also been some unhappiness with the way the White House Correspondents

01:06:25.820 Association has managed this rift with the White House over the White House's takeover of the pool,

01:06:33.460 the White House press pool.

01:06:34.440 This is all very, very Washington inside baseball.

01:06:37.140 But the long and short of it is there is a vibe shift in this town. 0.92

01:06:41.700 And this is part of it, which is that it now hurts you to have some lunatic comedian

01:06:47.060 appearing at the White House Correspondents Association dinner.

01:06:51.840 And rather than be honest about that and say this is not an appropriate entertainer for our dinner

01:06:57.440 because she said X, Y and Z, they're doing a New York Times and they are lying to their audience

01:07:04.600 about the real reasons for this shift.

01:07:09.040 And beyond that, you know, the ultimate defense of comedy is being funny.

01:07:15.900 And she did not have that defense, you know, like that's just no, that's right.

01:07:21.340 That's not her goal.

01:07:22.080 Like Stephen Colbert, like Jimmy Kimmel.

01:07:25.300 Well, that was another thing I forgot to mention that Lulu and I had an exchange on my time at NBC

01:07:31.140 and blackface and there was a point which I said, you know, I would look, I was asking the question

01:07:35.700 about when did that go from being something you could do with impunity to something you'd get

01:07:39.660 canceled for? And, uh, she was like, everyone knew it was racist. And I said, did they really?

01:07:47.880 I like everyone knows now, you know, thanks to what happened to me at NBC. That's also why we have

01:07:54.400 more black Santas everywhere. So you're welcome, everyone. Um, and so I said that everyone knows

01:08:03.000 now. And, uh, she was like, and then here's, I hear, I'll tell you what I said. I actually have

01:08:08.760 it here. Stand by. I meant to read this earlier. I said, uh, I knew that that had been my experience

01:08:15.800 growing up in the seventies and eighties that people used to do it. I just didn't know that NBC had been

01:08:19.620 airing shows in the past couple of years with people doing it like scrubs, like Jimmy Kimmel.

01:08:23.580 I meant Fallon. Um, you know, they opened the Oscars with Billy Crystal in blackface.

01:08:28.580 There were so many examples. Um, I said in the interview, but I didn't have it at the ready

01:08:33.560 because I wasn't expecting a huge controversy over it. What'd you say, Steve Krakauer?

01:08:38.020 Um, and then Jimmy Kimmel, of course did it too. Jimmy Kimmel did it doing Carl Malone. I mean,

01:08:42.700 he was speaking in Ebonics. It was like the most offensive thing you've ever seen in your life.

01:08:46.200 Fine. He's on ABC news every night tonight or ABC every night. Then I went on to say,

01:08:50.700 she said, I, she said, I, I thought everyone understands that blackface is racist. And I said,

01:08:56.700 now they do, but trust me, some of this made the dance, but not much. I said, Jimmy Kimmel didn't

01:09:02.080 understand it. Jimmy Fallon didn't understand it. NBC didn't understand it. Julianne Hough,

01:09:05.400 who opened the Oscars doing a land acknowledgement the other night, didn't understand it when she was

01:09:08.880 wearing it. Ted Danson didn't understand it. Whoopi Goldberg didn't understand it. I mean,

01:09:12.720 I could keep going now all day. If you want to, I could give you 12 more names. So it's not true,

01:09:18.240 Lulu, that everybody understood that it is not. So that was my question. When did it go from

01:09:23.120 something that people used to do with impunity? Hello, Justin Trudeau. She included that part

01:09:27.320 to something that will get you canceled. If you go back and look at my comments on the air,

01:09:31.740 that is what I asked. And I went on to say, um, and that, and for that question,

01:09:37.640 as you point out, ostensibly, they ruined my career. They bazooka'd me, not they, Andy Lack.

01:09:45.360 He bazooka'd me by the way. He later lost his job. Um, so any who that's this woman, Amber Ruffin

01:09:53.220 and her history was well known to these people. I have no sympathy for them. I'll just give you one

01:09:57.740 other soundbite, which is why I think Eugene Daniels hired her and loved her so much and thought

01:10:02.460 she was a perfect fit. Here she was, um, in 2021 after the Kyle Rittenhouse verdict on her own show,

01:10:11.300 which was on NBC's Peacock. It's not okay for the judicial system to be blatantly and obviously 0.55

01:10:20.920 stacked against people of color. It's not okay for there to be an entirely different set of rules

01:10:28.480 for white people. White people have been getting away with murder since time began. 0.99

01:10:33.040 I don't care about that. I care about you. You matter so much that the second you start to get 0.99

01:10:37.680 a sense that you do, a man will grab a gun he shouldn't have in the first place and travel

01:10:42.720 all the way to another state just to quiet you. So yeah, that's why he wanted her. And he learned

01:10:51.420 the hard way. Those days are over that kind of, you know, just divisive rhetoric is over.

01:10:56.840 The vast majority of the country has rejected it and we don't think it's funny. We don't think her

01:11:01.700 brand of comedy is funny. So goodbye. Enjoy your ongoing obscurity. Amber, um, in the world of

01:11:09.120 podcasting and media shows is now Gavin Newsom, the governor of California. There is no bigger fan of

01:11:15.320 Gavin Newsom than Bill Maher. He loves the guy bill snap out of it. And he had Gavin Newsom on his show

01:11:25.300 on Friday night. A couple of soundbites making the rounds, including this one on the trans issue,

01:11:32.940 SOT19. A lot of people lately talking about this 80-20 issue. And I think you are on the other side

01:11:40.140 of this now, the side with the 80. 80 being 80% of the people in this country. Again, this is the 0.80

01:11:46.000 issue of should biologically born men be able to compete in women's sports? That's tough. And, 0.79

01:11:52.920 you know, you, I saw the polling here in California. They think you're a traitor for 0.93

01:11:57.500 saying this. Yeah. You know, when most kind of people call you a traitor, there's a word for that,

01:12:01.740 electable. If the Democrats can't get with 80, how are they going to do something when it's a 51-49?

01:12:11.860 No, look, I get it. And that's, look, and the other side weaponizes these issues. They

01:12:17.460 dehumanize, they attack, they demean, and they've weaponized this issue extraordinarily well. That said,

01:12:23.540 on the fundamental question, is it fair? And I can give you example after example,

01:12:27.640 just in my home state, there was someone that won a triple jump by eight feet. It was fundamentally

01:12:33.880 unfair. We haven't been able to figure that out. You see, the right has weaponized,

01:12:39.720 one might even say they pounced, Emily, on this issue. I mean, yeah, of course, it was the right 0.99

01:12:46.860 who was just so excited to talk about bathrooms and locker rooms. They just couldn't resist it,

01:12:54.500 couldn't wait. It wasn't the Obama administration that had a dear colleague letter that wasn't even

01:12:59.800 going through the proper legislative process and suddenly transformed how every school around the

01:13:05.540 country had to use their bathrooms and locker rooms and do sports. No, no, no. It was absolutely the

01:13:11.380 right who just couldn't wait to make an issue out of transgender kids. I mean, this is why Gavin Newsom,

01:13:17.460 I think, is having a hard time on his rehabilitation tour as he's launched his podcast. And it's because

01:13:23.560 he's like, it's impossible for him to run from his actual record because he can't fully disavow it.

01:13:30.700 Um, you know, he, he can't fully get away from it. It's like how he said, nobody in our office

01:13:35.260 ever used Latinx. And then a million clips were produced of Gavin Newsom himself, let alone his

01:13:40.800 office saying the word Latinx. Like he can't fully divorce himself from the last 10 years of politics.

01:13:46.980 So he tried to tell Charlie Kirk, like nobody in my, in my office has ever used that term Latinx.

01:13:51.680 And then, um, who was it that put this together? Uh, the, the long, oh, it was, it was the K-file, 1.00

01:13:58.060 Andrew Kaczynski, who is one of the best things about CNN. It's a very short list. You got Harry

01:14:03.500 Enten and you got Andrew. I'm sure there's something more. Um, I like Tapper. He's a friend of mine,

01:14:09.320 but I know our audience, not, not, not huge fans. Um, here, here's what he found put together after

01:14:16.240 when Newsom was out there claiming I'd never, never, I hope we can really paint a picture in

01:14:22.520 terms of our consciousness, uh, of how impactful this has been on the Latinx community, Latinx

01:14:28.600 community, the Latinx and black communities got politicians that are banning, not assault rifles,

01:14:34.720 but the word Latinx, they're not even serious. That's so fun. Gavin, Gavin, a simple Google search

01:14:42.600 about yourself will serve you well before you make these sweeping claims. But on the same

01:14:47.820 dishonest, um, disingenuous front, he tried to act like he's the reasonable one on the trans and the

01:14:55.640 children issue, Eliana, which is a lie. His state is as radical as they come. Only Minnesota under Tim 0.97

01:15:04.680 Walls is more radical, which to his credit, cause Bill Maher is on the right side on this issue,

01:15:10.320 meaning correct side. He did raise with Gavin Newsom who then wiggled and wormed and which was

01:15:18.220 typical in the interview, did not accept any responsibility. Here it is in side 18.

01:15:23.460 But governor, you were the poster boy for a lot of this stuff. California had a rule that schools

01:15:29.160 cannot be required to notify parents if their kids in school have changed their gender, their pronouns.

01:15:38.140 It makes a lot of people go, well, you know what? That's the party without common sense. Now,

01:15:43.300 if that's your state, how are you, are you? I just, I just disagree with that. I mean,

01:15:48.580 the law was you would be fired. A teacher would be fired if a teacher did not report or snitch on a kid

01:15:55.300 talking about their gender identity. I just think that was wrong. I think teachers should teach. I

01:16:00.000 don't think they should be required to turn in kids. And by the way, turn in, we're talking about

01:16:04.340 their parents. How can you snitch? I don't, the idea of a snitch and a parent to me doesn't

01:16:09.060 compete. Well, I just, I don't, but what is, what is the job of a teacher? It's to teach. If Johnny's

01:16:13.960 talking about some identity issue or some issue about liking someone of the same sex, is the

01:16:18.760 teacher's job to then report that? By the way, in this law, the teacher can still do that, but they

01:16:24.600 can't be fired if that's what, it can't be fired if that's not what they do. And that's something I

01:16:30.360 think is, I, I just think that was fair. God bless Bill Maher for trying, Eliana. I, I genuinely

01:16:36.840 appreciate him with the retort of how can you snitch to one's parents when you're talking about a minor

01:16:44.260 and very serious mental problems? I, I agree with all of that. However, I hate to say, I do think

01:16:55.340 that this podcast thing that Newsom do it is doing is, is pretty smart. If he wants to run for president

01:17:01.220 in 2028, it appears he is laser focused on that. And Maher actually introduced him as, you know,

01:17:07.620 he's running for president too. Cause he's like, look, you said he's worse, uh, except for Tim

01:17:13.440 Walls. Well, he's doing better than like the vast majority than the democratic party, which is

01:17:18.380 switching his position. Uh, so he's like, well, you know, far ahead of all of them. And so the

01:17:25.680 question really is like, are people going to hold it against him that he is, uh, switched all of his

01:17:31.420 positions? I'm not sure if that's really going to matter four years from now, there's going to be

01:17:35.900 lots of embarrassing video. Um, but that's sort of the question that's hanging in my mind is, um,

01:17:41.500 how much will that dog him? But, uh, but he's doing better than the rest of his party mates.

01:17:46.560 He, I mean, I said this on the times interview as well. He is smart to start this. And the reason

01:17:52.900 he's smart to start it is because he has no muscles, Emily, none. He's a sinewy little weakling 0.94

01:17:59.460 when it comes to arguing any of these issues, especially cultural issues, because he, like all

01:18:05.480 liberals has never had to do it. So now he's trying to get his training, which is smart on his part,

01:18:11.460 and it would be smart on the part of conservatives to say no, because they declined to help him

01:18:17.100 get in shape before the big bout. We're supposed to be helping Rocky, not Drago.

01:18:24.120 What happens if this, you know, there's no Republican president and, uh, all everything

01:18:29.420 just sort of goes back to the way that it was before Gavin Newsom's not going to be the bulwark for

01:18:34.900 sanity when it comes to kids sports, uh, or bathrooms or locker rooms. Look at what happened to the

01:18:40.260 prisons in California. I mean, it's just been awful, awful under him. So he is, it is smart,

01:18:45.900 but if he could go a step further and be honest about what he got wrong and why he got it wrong,

01:18:51.380 that would be really impressive. But that's the one thing he will not do. Uh, he can't admit that's

01:18:56.640 why he said Latinx, nobody used it in our office. Like the one thing he can't do is say, here's why

01:19:01.100 I was using the word Latinx. Here's why I thought it was right. Here's why I was supporting these locker 0.98

01:19:05.900 room things. Here's why I thought it was right. And here's why I was wrong. He won't do that.

01:19:09.820 So he's not really going to get a lot of the trust back. Um, it's a start because it's not sincere.

01:19:14.320 It's not sincere. Like if it were sincere, he would totally own it and say like, you know,

01:19:18.660 I am genuinely sorry about this. It's Carol Markowitz has a great piece in the New York post

01:19:23.280 today writing about, it was posted on real clear politics, talking about how the, the left seems to

01:19:29.600 be at least grappling with the fact that wokeism was an epic fail and like heartily rejected by

01:19:37.880 the American people has been and continues to be, but they want to quietly move past it without any

01:19:43.240 acknowledgements of what they did. And same on COVID same exact thing on COVID the New York times,

01:19:50.000 you know, two weeks ago with its piece, like, gee, it really looks like it came from a lab. Why didn't

01:19:53.680 anyone discuss that? Like, you know, conservatives, like fire coming out of everybody's ears. What

01:19:59.600 is because you, your paper work, they were calling people racist. What do you mean? We were discussing

01:20:05.060 it. Yeah, we, we were misled. So it's like, they're trying to do this little sleight of hand,

01:20:13.280 not little, large sleight of hand because they lost that there. They looked at that swing state polling,

01:20:21.240 which said they lost because of these issues, the trans thing, especially in sports number one.

01:20:26.900 And now they're quietly trying to just reverse where they stand without any acknowledgement of

01:20:32.560 what they've done. And frankly, of the reality that 30 days ago, they unanimously voted against a very

01:20:41.260 short, clean, simple bill in the U S Senate that would have said boys may not participate in girls

01:20:47.480 sports nationwide, period. They all reject not one Democrat said, I will vote for that. And nor did

01:20:54.020 Gavin Newsom come out and say, I would really like it if our California state senators or U S senators

01:20:59.320 would, would vote for this because it's unfair. I was an athlete. I have daughters. Let me tell you

01:21:05.580 why I know he's not leading on this because none of this is sincere. It is all electoral politics.

01:21:12.300 It's smart electoral politics, but it's not sincere. Okay. I stole the last word. We're out of time.

01:21:18.100 You guys, thank you so much. It's a pleasure as always. Thanks Megan. Thanks Megan. And thanks to

01:21:23.680 all of you for listening. Uh, we are going to have two episodes coming out tomorrow. I'm actually going

01:21:28.680 to do a, like a speech, a speaking engagement tonight. So we actually have a very interesting

01:21:34.020 show that's on tape. That is all new content for you during the 12 o'clock hour tomorrow. And then

01:21:39.020 we will drop a new podcast that I will be, uh, doing live later in the day tomorrow when I get

01:21:45.300 off the airplane. So look forward to that. Thank you all as always for watching and listening.

01:21:51.840 Thanks for listening to the Megan Kelly show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

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The Megyn Kelly Show - March 31, 2025

Megyn's NYT Interview, WHCA Fires Unfunny Comedian From Dinner, and Newsom's Failed Shift, with Emily Jashinsky and Eliana Johnson ｜ Ep. 1038

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