Melania Trump, Meghan Markle, Taylor Swift, and the Donna Adelson Trial - MK Media Highlights
Episode Stats
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Summary
First Lady Melania Trump has been on the cover of Vogue three times in the past, but what does she need to do to be on it again? And why does it matter that she's married to a Republican, a man with an R next to his name?
Transcript
00:00:00.000
I'm Chris Hadfield. I'm an astronaut, an author, a citizen of planet Earth.
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Join me for a six-part journey into the systems that power the world.
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Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.
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Hey, everyone. It's me, Megyn Kelly, and I hope you're having a happy Labor Day.
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We are back with a new show tomorrow, but today I want to bring you some recent MK Media Podcast Network highlights.
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We're kicking things off with Spot On with Link Lauren, then some After Party with Emily Jashinsky,
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some The Nerve with Maureen Callahan, and also we have our newest MK Media show,
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MK True Crime, with our Kelly's Court friends and legal experts.
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We heard so many great emails from all of you saying more of that.
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We really enjoyed the compilation, so enjoy this too,
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Just like clockwork, this happens all the time, right?
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The liberal literati, these folks who preach about diversity and acceptance and loving everybody,
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they don't love diversity of thought, and that's what we've seen with the folks over at Vanity Fair.
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So Vanity Fair, the editor-in-chief, a man named Mark Giaducci,
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reportedly wants First Lady Melania Trump to be on the cover.
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But the folks at Vanity Fair are threatening to walk out and protest
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if they put the First Lady of the United States on the cover.
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Here's what they said, I will walk out the mother-effing door and half my staff will follow me.
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We are not going to normalize this despot in his wife.
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If I have to work bagging groceries at Trader Joe's, I will do it.
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If Giaducci puts Melania on the cover, half of the editorial staff will walk out.
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My message to the staff is, bye, don't let the door hit you on the way out.
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Okay, if you're a little pansy crybaby and you can't handle that your magazine might put First Lady Melania Trump on the cover,
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this probably isn't the industry for you, right?
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When we've seen in the past, look at Vogue magazine and Anna Wintour.
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They put Michelle Obama on the cover three times.
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If you're a Democrat, you could be a terrible First Lady.
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Because you happen to have a D next to your name and you're a Democrat and you check their boxes,
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First Lady Melania Trump, because she happens to be married to a Republican in the Republican Party
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and have an R next to her name, suddenly she's persona non grata at these magazines.
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This is one of the most secure, confident women, right?
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Objectively, the most stunning First Lady we've had at least in decades, probably ever.
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So First Lady Melania Trump, does she care that the folks at Vanity Fair want to put her on the cover?
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I think First Lady Melania Trump was on the cover back in maybe 2017 or at the beginning of the first term
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or right before the first term, maybe in 16 or 15.
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She's probably busy raising Barron, working on the Take It Down Act, working on Be Best.
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She's focused on doing things that are actually going to help kids in this country.
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I don't think First Lady Melania Trump cares about being on the cover of Vanity Fair.
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They melt down and they flip out if a Republican woman gets anything cool or exciting, right?
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If you put a Republican woman on the cover, we're going to walk out and bag groceries.
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And like I said, my message to them is go ahead and walk out.
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And what's interesting to me, and I've spoken about this before, when you look at First Lady
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She pulled herself up by her bootstraps and made things happen, right?
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She had a full successful career, a full successful career before she ever met Donald Trump, before
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she ever became First Lady of the United States, right?
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And she's carried herself with grace, dignity, and class as she's had friends stab her in the
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Friends stab her in the back, turn on her, get unfair press time and time and time again.
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You can even look at someone like Usha Vance, right?
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Thinks she's the first Indian second lady of the United States.
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She's the first South Asian second lady of the United States.
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But because she's a Republican, she is going to get bad press as well.
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So First Lady Melania Trump and Usha Vance, these are folks that the left would have loved,
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You've got Usha, you've got Melania, who's self-made.
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But because she happens to be a Republican, she gets crapped on by the liberal media.
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But the good thing here, and I'm looking at these quotes still, the good thing here is
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They want to do a walkout and do some like Gandhi protest and walk out of the Vanity Fair
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offices because they might put Melania Trump on the cover.
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Look at like MSNBC and CNN and all these networks.
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And as you guys know, I love the First Lady of the United States.
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If she ends up on the cover of Vanity Fair, great.
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If she doesn't, I'm here to tell you, she certainly doesn't care.
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I want to show, first of all, Megan prepping for Chrissy and the way in which Megan introduces her.
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So let's get to her mincing about in anticipation of Chrissy Teigen.
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She's the quintessential multi-hyphenate model, entrepreneur, mom, cookbook author, and all-around foodie.
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Who told Courtney Stodden, a young starlet who was really struggling to go take a dirt nap and find other ways of killing herself.
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You know, Megan, who told us that she was so suicidal when she was pregnant, but the royal family wouldn't let her get help,
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and allegedly, reportedly, has a file this thick over at Buckingham Palace investigating her own bullying of staff over there,
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decides who better for a show about friendship and entertaining than Chrissy Teigen.
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Well, don't forget, Megan this year was in New York on CBS promoting the Parent Network,
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this charity that is supposed to protect children from online bullies, protect children from suicide because they're being harassed online.
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And then she spotlights an online bully that targeted a teenager.
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I think the London Standard made a huge deal about this this week about the chef that's featured on her first episode is also accused of terrorizing his employees.
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Is that where you go when you're an a-hole with love Megan to just, you know, try to rebrand yourself?
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Yeah, it's like, you know, my mom always used to say, water seeks its own level, you know?
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Like, anybody of, like, quality you would think would go nowhere near this.
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I mean, so this is the next part where, because you see truly, I think, the desperation in who she can book for this show.
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She talks about Chrissy being one of her Hollywood friends, like a friend.
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She uses the word friend who she hasn't seen, Kinsey, in 20 years.
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So she met her at an event once, you know, and they exchanged emails, maybe.
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So first of all, they were both deal or no deal girls at the same time and were not friends.
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Yeah, and so they're, and they kind of discuss it.
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And you get, you, even when they're discussing it, you realize that these two are not friends,
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that they were not friends throughout the time that they were both deal or no deal
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They both did a promotional event for direct TV for a Super Bowl back in the day, like back
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They reconnect when Meghan Markle writes her op-ed about baby loss.
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Because Chrissy Teigen, we all know this thanks to the photo shoot she did after she lost
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her child, also has publicly acknowledged child loss.
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But the, but especially in Meghan's case, we want our privacy.
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You know, she picks and chooses when she wants her privacy.
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But I have a little bit, I want to ask you about the John Legend appearance.
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I have a source in LA, I have a source in London who works with a charity that Meghan Markle
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I don't have all the details, but there is fear that Meghan Markle's going to try to do
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something in the music space around the holidays.
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And the charity is upset because they feel like it conflicts with Catherine, the Princess
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Not only does she do this gorgeous choir concert, but remember when she sat down and played the
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piano around, and that video went viral of Catherine playing the piano?
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I'm wondering if Meghan has roped in John Legend to try to do some sort of music project
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associated with this London charity to help promote her Christmas special on Netflix.
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Because the John Legend thing is too bizarre to me.
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I mean, I guess Chrissy Teigen needed him there to tell her when their child was born.
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Well, you know, they travel together all the time.
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They're like, Chrissy Teigen drags him everywhere, like an emotional support spouse.
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I can only hope that Meghan Markle gifts us this Christmas with entering the music space.
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I do not predict it would be John Legend, though.
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I mean, those two are fame whores, and they'll go anywhere.
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No, I'm going to think it's going to be someone more like a little Wayne, and we're going to
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be reenacting like the twerking video from the delivery room.
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But yeah, the charity is concerned because they're like, what is she going to do?
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And really, she has been such a burden to them, demanding.
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She picked her own photographer for a shoot at one point for this charity.
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She did not like the photos, demanded that the photos be retaken.
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And it was going to be like at least $5,000, and the charity had to go back to her and say,
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If you want to do these pictures again, if you need to use your own photographers, we can't
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I mean, she is such a burden that I understand almost why she's completely disappeared when
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She's really – I don't understand why these charities just don't cut her loose.
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You're actually befouling our brand, and we've had sufficient.
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Now, when Chrissy comes in to admire the finished bread, the sourdough dome, which has been sliced
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into, there's not a lot of continuity in this production.
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But Chrissy has those coffin nails, which all those do is collect dirt and dust mites and
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And she has her hair, which is styled with no end of product, and then, of course, her
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She then takes said hands and puts them all over the bread, all over the bread to remark
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upon its texture and its feel, and so disgusting.
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It's like, I wouldn't touch a thing out of that kitchen.
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So here comes Chrissy talking to her good – her great best friend, Megan, about how
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much fun she's having with 80 crew crammed into this fake kitchen.
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This is my most ideal day that I could imagine.
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When you sit around making this, I literally was just like, oh, do I want any more bread?
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It actually comes from a really dense texture to this kind of fluffy, whipped goodness.
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It's so weird how she makes all of this stuff before the guests come over.
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Wait, wait, wait, there's something called the discard of the starter, which I think they
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Okay, it's called the discard of the starter, the starter being the sourdough mix.
00:16:30.660
And that struck me as very interesting because you are probably familiar with the concept of
00:16:38.800
And that is when the narcissist is done with you.
00:16:41.180
And those who may be familiar with Megan's narcissistic discard, just my opinion, are
00:16:46.740
Megan Markle's father, Megan Markle's sister, Megan Markle's spouse, who she FedExed the
00:16:57.480
The Queen of England, Prince Philip, King Charles, Prince William, and Catherine, Princess
00:17:05.520
This is a People Magazine opinion article, I'm a Millennial Swifty headline and I'm going
00:17:10.220
to say it, Taylor and Travis's engagement felt like a milestone win for our generation.
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I'm giggling because the way that's written is a little cringe, but I've actually written
00:17:20.360
about some of Taylor's past records as milestone losses for our generation.
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I think I wrote a piece at the Federalist a couple of years ago about how her arc reflects
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the arc of a lot of millennials who do sort of serial dating and don't settle down
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And because they haven't settled down, in some ways look to politics, materialism as
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their identity and where they find their meaning and their purpose.
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And I really believe this is true, that Swift reflected that.
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And I think this author, again, as cringy as the headline is, is correct, that Swift is
00:18:06.220
again, once again, mirroring the millennial generation as people hit their 30s, mid-30s
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Now, there are a lot of, there was a really smart conservative reaction in Compact magazine
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by Patrick Brown of the Ethics and Public Policy Center.
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He said, there's not going to be a Taylor Travis baby boom.
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Having, you could, I think, fairly argue, prioritize, whether willingly or not, careers.
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And they're probably not going to be able to have that many children.
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What we see, there's statistics, Limestone at the Institute for Family Studies has this data
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on how women right now in America are saying that they end up having fewer children than
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That's a really serious thing for us to think about as a culture and not an unserious point
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But the author of the People magazine piece, Emily Rella, great name, Emily.
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There's so many damn millennial Emilys that I could have literally guessed that her name
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I was always Emily J in class because there were like 20 other Emilys in every class
00:19:28.260
And everyone back home in Wisconsin still calls me MJ, E-M-J, because there were so many people
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So this Emily R writes, I for one was shook, shook by how emotional the news of the engagement
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I'm usually able to reel it in when big life moments like this happen.
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I started feeling myself tearing up with joy upon looking at Taylor and Travis's engagement
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photos before panicking that I was some parasocial fangirl freak, of which there are many.
00:20:07.060
But then after that passed, I found myself thinking, why of all things, is this hitting
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And the author goes on to write, oh, this is awful.
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And I've become comfortable with the idea that maybe it won't happen for me the way it
00:20:27.880
I've built a beautiful, chaotic life for myself, complete with relationships, situationships,
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No matter how they've ended, they've all taught me something that has helped me define how I
00:20:40.260
But as valuable as these lessons have been, they do occasionally feel like puzzle pieces
00:20:43.900
putting together a picture that will eventually be incomplete.
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And another part, I actually skipped over this.
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The author writes, as a millennial, our current cultural examples of love, true soulmate level,
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This notion of yearning and desire and all or nothing consuming passion is seemingly dwindled
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with the fairytale ending seemingly out of reach.
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It's not so much that millennials stop believing in love in some jaded, brooding way.
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I think it's more so that we've become more comfortable with the idea that it might not
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happen for us in the way we once dreamed of when we were younger.
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Now, that reflects the data from Lyman Stone at the Institute for Family Studies I just referenced
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Attracting romantic attention, Emily R goes on to say, or affection isn't difficult these
00:21:30.940
Just look at the popularity of the modern-day situationship or the influx of dating apps,
00:21:35.000
which let you mindlessly scroll through suitor after suitor on your phone and decide in
00:21:38.200
a split second whether or not you want to potentially be with this person forever based
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And goes on to write, I mean, this is, I actually really do recommend reading this piece.
00:21:49.320
And now we're here watching Taylor put a final puzzle piece into place.
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Every heartbreak, every devastation, every grand beginning and glimmer of hope, it all led
00:21:59.240
And it's because we experienced all those milestones right alongside her as we grew into new life
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faces at the same time that this moment of Taylor finding true, unadulterated, effortless
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love felt like something to celebrate personally.
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I think all of those viral videos you're seeing right now about Taylor and Travis and all of
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the anodyne reposts, people wishing Taylor Swift well, it feels like a lot.
00:22:33.180
I think this author put her finger exactly on the reason.
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And I know we have this post from Lindyman that we can also throw up on the screen.
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I thought this was a really good take, too, that gets to some of this.
00:22:52.300
Marriage used to be the entry point into adult life, one of the first steps.
00:22:55.180
Today, marriage has become the culmination of adulthood, the final step after a long run
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People are expected to first build careers, live alone, travel, date for years, and only
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It is no longer the stabilizing base that anchored young people early, but an almost luxury milestone
00:23:16.120
once life is already sorted out, which is precisely why it's rarer now.
00:23:22.640
And I think it's a totally fair reaction to the Taylor Travis engagement story.
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There's the startup marriage versus the merger marriage.
00:23:30.500
If you're Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey, who have vast wealth, success, and a decade plus
00:23:37.220
of living alone after college or after your career started, then, yeah, you're definitely
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And we lose the benefits of the startup marriage in a culture that's primarily, where people
00:23:50.840
are primarily ending up in the merger marriage.
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But I just wanted to reflect on why this touched such a cultural nerve.
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It's not just because people really like Taylor Swift.
00:24:04.160
She's been like Anne Hathaway, who's had her moments where people, the culture decides, the
00:24:10.500
We're sort of hot and cold on Taylor Swift, depending on what quote era she's in, even
00:24:14.660
though her hardcore fan base is with her all the way.
00:24:23.940
But over the last couple of years, it's been pretty steady.
00:24:26.700
You know, she's been criticized by people on the right, including myself, for her forays
00:24:33.620
One of her worst songs is You Need to Calm Down, and it's just this classist anthem that
00:24:39.420
should be seen as probably the anthem of that, like, peak woke era, capital P, capital W.
00:24:48.760
It sounds like that was when she was also really unhappy.
00:24:51.580
And I'm not, I don't think it's fair to say by any means that she's like, or even think
00:24:56.560
or care that she's like about to become a conservative.
00:25:00.780
Like, who, I don't, could not possibly care about Taylor Swift's personal politics.
00:25:08.100
But I think everybody wants Taylor Swift to be happy.
00:25:10.940
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I'm Megan Kelly, host of The Megan Kelly Show on SiriusXM.
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It's your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and
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important political, legal, and cultural figures today.
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That's SiriusXM.com slash MKShow and get three months free.
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We've got these videos, we've got audios, we've got wiretaps, we've got it all in this
00:27:19.720
trial, and the prosecution is working its way methodically through this evidence.
00:27:25.840
Sometimes, Matt, as you know, and as Jonna, of course, knows, when you're prosecuting a
00:27:29.660
case, you have things that, you know, sometimes we just call them a wart, right?
00:27:34.080
The case is not perfect, and one of the things that a smart prosecutor might do is to try to
00:27:41.840
bring out some of these things during their presentation of evidence so that when the defense
00:27:48.320
hammers on it, you kind of have taken the sting out a little bit.
00:27:51.880
And in that thought, we just heard that recording from one of the wiretaps, you essentially have
00:27:56.880
Charlie Adelson telling his mother, you know, that she didn't do anything wrong and she's
00:28:03.020
And so I think that what that was, was a prosecutor's effort to kind of take the sting out of this
00:28:09.880
so that this piece of it, which doesn't exactly support their case, doesn't have as much weight
00:28:16.980
to be given to it when the defense gets around to their case and to cross-examination on this
00:28:23.100
point so that, you know, the jury kind of takes it in stride and it doesn't sink the case because
00:28:28.760
it actually, this particular piece of it is what we would call exculpatory as to Donna Adelson.
00:28:35.120
But on balance, I think this trial is going along great and I look forward to seeing what
00:28:44.860
What does the defense have to work with in your mind?
00:28:52.960
No, I have a slightly different opinion of the last thought that we just saw than my good
00:29:01.140
I don't, I wouldn't call that piece of evidence so far a war.
00:29:04.900
I think what the prosecution has, many, many dots that they need to connect in this case,
00:29:13.180
It's just not, you know, as we all know, it doesn't line up in a nice, simple, linear
00:29:19.700
Like they're connecting a dot here, then they're connecting a dot there.
00:29:22.180
And what they're trying to do circumstantially is show the involvement of Donna Adelson in
00:29:31.320
And they're doing it through all of their witnesses.
00:29:33.500
This last piece of evidence that we saw on that side, I think can cut both ways.
00:29:41.380
And in one sense, if you think that a convicted killer telling a potential killer on trial that
00:29:48.040
she didn't do anything wrong is exculpatory, but maybe a juror could look at that and say,
00:29:54.040
well, this just shows another level of involvement in this granny sitting at the defense table.
00:30:01.540
I think the prosecution is doing a pretty good job of trying to weave this all together.
00:30:10.980
And what I think the defense did was something very surprising.
00:30:15.360
It might have been yesterday when they really went at Wendy Adelson, who is the defendant's
00:30:22.600
They kind of went at her like a pit bull showing no mercy.
00:30:28.340
I don't know if anybody had a chance to see that testimony.
00:30:35.660
When you're talking about cases like this, does the defense have to notify the prosecution
00:30:43.200
When will we know one way or another if Donna Adelson is going to take the stand?
00:30:50.940
And interestingly enough, a few weeks ago in one of the last pretrial hearings, she announced
00:31:00.020
And now that's not, she's not obligated to testify.
00:31:03.300
The defense never has any burden to produce any evidence or anything like that.
00:31:08.740
The burden is on the prosecutor and it never shifts to the defense.
00:31:14.540
And I think the strategy, the best strategy is between a criminal defendant and their lawyers,
00:31:20.780
wait and see how the prosecutor's case goes up.
00:31:24.700
And then you can decide whether or not you think your client should or maybe needs to testify
00:31:29.500
because a lot of times they can be their own worst enemy.
00:31:33.700
Sometimes the case is going great for the defense until the defendant opens his or her mouth
00:31:40.940
So it's one of these things where we won't know until the last minute.
00:31:45.320
She's announced that she's going to testify, but that could be just a tactic to try to throw
00:31:51.300
the prosecutor off, although a good prosecutor is going to prepare for either scenario.
00:31:57.360
And I promise you, if she testifies, the cross-examination is going to be something
00:32:07.240
You've cross-examined about a million people over the course of your career.
00:32:10.380
And from people I've talked to, you are deadly in the courtroom.
00:32:13.780
I haven't seen that yet, but I haven't seen you in court.
00:32:17.960
If you had to put Vegas odds on this, what do you think at this point?
00:32:23.120
Is Donna, are we going to see Donna Adelson on the stand?
00:32:26.200
And part two of that, is she going to throw her daughter Wendy under the bus?
00:32:31.400
She's already tried to in the cross-examination of Wendy.
00:32:37.180
I think she tried to do that and did it a little bit.
00:32:41.100
And sidebar, my favorite part of any trial is cross-examining witnesses.
00:32:46.840
I know a lot of us think that, oh, closing argument is my favorite part.
00:32:49.600
I love cross-examining witnesses and I love cross-examining them hard.
00:32:54.960
And you're going to have to do this in this case if you're in Donna's camp.
00:33:00.680
This is really funny because in the beginning, in the closing, in the opening statement, or
00:33:06.320
not even, in voir dire, when the prosecution was asking potential jurors, hey, do you think
00:33:16.740
But as we watch this trial, you guys, she does present like a little granny, even though
00:33:25.880
We know from the testimony of her daughter that she was a very controlling, involved, in
00:33:35.520
From everything from her daughter's dating habits to what the kids would do.
00:33:47.560
But as she sits there, just the optics, she looks kind of frail and unassuming.
00:33:57.760
So I'm interested when we fast forward into the future, when we get a verdict, if any jurors
00:34:06.840
Well, let me, if I can add to that point real quick.
00:34:08.780
There's going to be video that's going to be shown to this jury where she is trying to
00:34:15.260
She's at the airport in Miami on a one-way ticket that she's booked to Vietnam, a country
00:34:24.660
And she's seen, like, she pulls her phone back from the cops.
00:34:28.260
And it's almost like, it looks like maybe she's very spry and like, almost like she's
00:34:32.020
wanting to even try to fight the cops or resist arrest.
00:34:35.120
So they're going to be able to contrast that evidence when we get to it with what they see
00:34:43.460
I think that this whole thing about being the granny in the courtroom, to me, that seems
00:34:51.400
Well, in the dating world, somebody who's guarding their cell phone like that is called a red flag,
00:34:56.680
I think, one of the, and legally it's called consciousness of guilt, right?
00:35:02.560
There's actually a formal legal recognition of that common sense thing, right?
00:35:06.200
When somebody is trying to hold a cell phone back or hide something, the jury's allowed
00:35:10.220
to consider that as evidence showing that she might be really afraid of what might be on
00:35:17.020
One of the things that you mentioned, Phil, you said you talked about warts.
00:35:21.620
In California, we always call that drawing the sting by the prosecutors.
00:35:25.220
Why don't we play the next thought, if we could, and let's talk about this witness, Katie Magbawana.
00:35:33.900
During these conversations with Charlie Adelson, was there ever a time when he's in the middle
00:35:42.160
of these conversations with you about what's going to happen, speaking to his mother?
00:35:46.020
From time, sometimes he would get on the phone, he'd kind of look at me weird, and then just
00:35:53.460
step out of the room and discuss whatever he needed to discuss.
00:35:57.920
How many times did this particular situation happen where you were discussing what would
00:36:02.940
eventually become the murder, and his mother was interjected in that way that you just described?
00:36:15.740
So this was like a regular part of the way this worked whenever this conversation came
00:36:21.200
He would consult his mother and come back and speak to you?
00:36:24.760
Did he ever relay to you, you know, my mom says whatever?
00:36:32.140
He never specifically said what he spoke to his mom about.
00:36:43.260
Are they drawing the sting a little bit, and why?
00:36:48.740
And again, I think I disagree a little bit with you guys.
00:36:52.620
I look at this evidence as helpful to the prosecution, and here's why.
00:36:57.480
It's sort of like, you got to remember that the jurors are human.
00:37:02.980
And do you guys remember, and this is going to be a weird analogy, so stick with me.
00:37:07.420
Do you remember back in the day when smoking was allowed, say, in restaurants, right?
00:37:12.260
And they'd have a smoking section over here, and the non-smoking section over here.
00:37:17.020
But if you were in the non-smoking section, you still smelled the smoke, like you can't
00:37:22.460
What I see the prosecution doing here is she is connecting, again, these dots.
00:37:27.780
She's got this witness who shows up in an orange jumpsuit, so the jury knows that she's,
00:37:32.720
you know, they would have known anyway, probably there was maybe testimony about it.
00:37:36.340
They know that she's convicted of something to do with this crime.
00:37:40.820
They're connecting other dots where Donna is, whether she's kind of in the center or whether
00:37:46.760
she's on the outskirts, like the smoking section of the restaurant, she's there.
00:37:51.220
And the jury, at the end of the day, is going to say, well, you know, we saw Donna in this
00:37:55.700
part of the crime, and we saw Donna in this part of the crime, and then she was back over
00:38:02.600
So I don't see this as harmful at all to the prosecution.
00:38:09.620
You know, speaking, I'm sorry, you know, let me go to the next thought, Phil, and let me
00:38:16.080
Let's play the next thought where she's asked about washing money.
00:38:19.720
Did you notice that the money was stapled together?
00:38:25.960
Did you notice something else unusual about the money?
00:38:29.640
At that moment, I did it when I opened it, but a couple days after the fact, it was wet
00:38:42.400
Right, and did you ever mention that fact to Charlie Adelson?
00:38:48.140
I'm pretty sure I contacted him and told him, why is the money wet?
00:38:56.080
Okay, and when you contacted him and said, the money's wet, or you just mentioned to him,
00:39:09.520
You started getting paychecks in September after the murder, which continued through May
00:39:21.580
All right, and you admit that you weren't doing anything to earn that money?
00:39:29.980
Who signed your paychecks from the Adelson Institute?
00:39:35.700
All right, Phil, going back to what Donna just said.
00:39:44.440
Well, other than it being a bizarre amount of obvious hearsay coming into this trial by
00:39:50.620
someone who's a convicted felon who has a motive to fabricate her testimony because
00:39:55.640
she's already stated she wants to get some benefit from the prosecution, although she says
00:40:00.460
nothing was promised, um, and although she's testified previously in court in a wildly different,
00:40:07.560
uh, way, uh, putting all that to the side, if a jury believes her, you've got the, you've
00:40:17.240
Like Donna was saying, the smoke is one, is making its way around the room.
00:40:21.400
Here she is signing checks at the Adelson Institute.
00:40:25.160
And even if she doesn't, if that doesn't prove that she knew about the murder ahead of time,
00:40:30.800
she knew that, that this woman, uh, McBanawal was not doing any actual work at the, at the
00:40:37.560
So she knows that she's paying her for something that's, that's illegitimate.
00:40:43.720
And this whole conversation where, you know, McBanawal and Charlie are talking about, you
00:40:49.720
know, the, the conspiracy, and then he gets off the phone and he goes and talks to, to
00:40:55.120
That also kind of shows that, you know, she is sort of the hidden hand, if you will, that's
00:41:04.360
And it plays into the prosecutor's theme of her being sort of the, the mastermind.
00:41:09.260
So I think that on balance, this does move the needle forward a little bit for the prosecutor,
00:41:14.080
but it all hinges on the credibility of Catherine McBanawal, which, uh, that's a very much an
00:41:23.580
Uh, signed checks, uh, after the fact, and I mean, that's not necessarily hinging just on
00:41:29.840
You got, they have physically the checks, uh, signature matches.
00:41:35.100
What do you think as far as the power of that evidence?
00:41:39.960
And you know, this is going to be a theme in the closing argument.
00:41:44.200
When we get there, like if, if Donna Adelson really has nothing to do with anything, why
00:41:50.160
is she paying a person who's not working for the practice?
00:41:54.900
Why does she get nervous when she gets the bump?
00:41:57.440
Why does she contact Charlie and talk in this weird kind of code?
00:42:04.180
And maybe, maybe the defense at some point is going to try to argue to the jury.
00:42:10.680
How do you parse out when her involvement began?
00:42:14.240
Maybe she didn't have anything to do with the planning phase of this.
00:42:20.360
They're going to see too much of Donna's fingerprints figuratively and probably literally on a lot
00:42:30.240
So speaking to the bump, let's play the next thought if we could, um, where the undercover
00:42:42.200
I believe that happened in South Miami, somewhere near her residence.
00:42:48.100
And did you just walk up to her on the street, sidewalk?
00:42:54.680
Well, I was instructed to walk up to her and, um, engage her in small discussion as to
00:43:03.540
why I was meeting with her and then eventually handing her a flyer.
00:43:09.780
And this cell phone number that it belongs to the phone, the phone number that's written
00:43:14.920
here, are you personally going to carry that around and answer it if, if someone calls it?
00:43:20.540
That's solely in my hands and I'm the only one answering.
00:43:23.100
And States 117, those are all the phone calls associated with this number on the sheet here.
00:43:28.600
We've got one from you to the Adelson Institute family business.
00:43:36.180
And then one from Charlie Adelson to this phone number.
00:43:41.140
And one from Donna Adelson to this phone number, correct?
00:43:44.480
You know, let's, let's go into the next, uh, shot if we could, and let's connect these
00:43:51.620
If we could play the next shot and then I want to get your guys input on, on this.
00:44:05.880
Listen, just want to let you know that, um, we know that your family, uh, has been taking
00:44:10.420
care of Katie and her friend who's going through a replacing time after your problem up north
00:44:17.880
And I want to let you know that my brother, he's incarcerated.
00:44:21.280
He helped your family with this problem you guys had up north.
00:44:24.620
And we want to make sure that he's going through some rough times.
00:44:27.920
And we want to make sure that you take care of what he's going through, the way you're
00:44:46.560
And we get, we got it in the next shot, but Phil, you're an innocent person.
00:44:49.880
That dude comes up to you on the street and hands you essentially what looks like a blackmail
00:44:55.840
Well, so, you know, this whole thing about the bump, the, the significance of this, uh,
00:45:02.220
event in the whole story of this case and this murder and this trial cannot be understated
00:45:07.720
because that is what really leads to the broader investigation that, that I think is going to
00:45:13.260
ultimately ensnare, uh, Donna Adelson to the point of conviction.
00:45:17.960
But there's a lot of, a lot of being made of, you know, how she reacts or doesn't react.
00:45:23.920
And generally speaking, I'm not a big fan of trying to say, all right, how someone acts, uh,
00:45:30.360
is somehow evidence of something because how are you, how are you supposed to act in any given
00:45:38.620
So on the one hand, I'm not a fan of that kind of analysis, but on the other hand, I'm a realist.
00:45:43.640
And I know that in the jury room, the jury's going to be saying to themselves, look, if
00:45:50.960
If that were me, I'm going to say, wait a minute, help my family with the problem.
00:45:56.440
I have no idea what you're talking about, but that's not what she does.
00:45:59.360
She simply takes it and then goes about her day.
00:46:01.920
And then ultimately, as we'll see, she calls Charlie and she makes some other statements
00:46:06.140
to Charlie that, um, seem pretty incriminating.
00:46:09.520
Um, but that bump and her reaction to it is absolutely critical.
00:46:16.020
It's going to be, I think something that is, it's one of the other, you know, pieces of
00:46:20.760
the pie, but it's, it's going to, along with everything else, um, be her undoing in this
00:46:25.780
case, because that is some powerful, powerful video evidence.
00:46:30.600
Let me, let's play the next thought, which is the actual phone call.
00:46:33.340
And then John, I want to get your, your, your, uh, your thoughts on what we're about to
00:46:41.100
And who is the first person that the defendant calls after the bump?
00:46:46.980
I think that's, um, I think that you did the work.
00:46:55.640
You know, that's what I thought of once, but I'm going to need to talk to you.
00:47:21.700
You know, the more we listen to that, you guys, the more I think this might be the death
00:47:29.500
I agree that, you know, sometimes when we cover murder cases and the cameras are on a
00:47:33.700
defendant and we're like, oh, we don't judge anybody.
00:47:40.260
Donna Adelson is being approached by a big dude on her little secure South Florida street.
00:47:49.380
She doesn't do what I do when, you know, I'm in Manhattan and somebody hands me a flyer.
00:47:55.940
She just calmly stands there and she's going to take it all in.
00:47:59.260
And she smartly is not going to really say a word, smartly.
00:48:03.180
But then she processes all that information, calls her co-conspirator son, and very, very
00:48:09.720
cagely, she knows, she's worried that they might be listened to.
00:48:13.800
She doesn't want to create evidence because she's smart like a fox.
00:48:17.480
And she's like, well, it could involve both of us.
00:48:22.640
If I'm in that jury box, I'm like, game, set, match.
00:48:26.420
Really, when you take that with all of the other evidence, including the evidence they
00:48:29.900
have yet to hear, but we know they will hear, that is powerful for the prosecution, my opinion.
00:48:40.280
They're going to go with an accessory after the fact defense on this thing?
00:48:46.220
Well, if they're going to go with that defense, Matt, they certainly have given no indication
00:48:52.760
of it because that would be what we call setting a theme for your defense, which normally you
00:49:00.280
You would say, look, she's only been, she's been charged with soliciting.
00:49:04.260
She's been charged with being a co-conspirator.
00:49:06.120
And she's being charged as essentially the principal of this murder.
00:49:09.840
And she's not been charged with any crimes after the murder.
00:49:14.240
And so they would have come out and they would have said that.
00:49:16.700
And they could then embrace this and they could say, well, wait a minute.
00:49:20.960
Yeah, she's, all this evidence points to her being involved with and aware of the conspiracy
00:49:29.380
And we concede that this makes her look terrible and it makes her look like a criminal, which
00:49:35.080
The prosecutor didn't charge her with any of these crimes after the fact.
00:49:38.560
And therefore, ladies and gentlemen, jury, you have to acquit her.
00:49:41.960
That would be how the defense would work if it were being employed.
00:49:45.340
And honestly, if this were my case, that would probably be the defense that I would use
00:49:52.620
And so, you know, I'm sort of a head scratcher, guys.
00:49:56.280
I don't know why we haven't seen anything like that.
00:49:58.740
But I'm struggling to find a coherent strategy by the defense other than to maybe point the
00:50:09.320
But look, if Wendy is also a member of the conspiracy, the defense of Donna pointing that
00:50:14.840
out doesn't mean that Donna can't also be a member.