The Megyn Kelly Show - Polls Shift Toward Trump, and How Dems Abandoned Their Voters, with Nicole Shanahan, Charles C.W. Cooke, and Jim Geraghty

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00:00:31.200 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:42.820 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:46.020 So new polls out this week are highlighting major red flags for the campaign

00:00:50.880 of Vice President Kamala Harris.

00:00:53.180 This, what's happening with Gallup in particular is really telling.

00:01:00.000 It's where we're going to start in one second.

00:01:02.020 All of this comes as Harris is sitting down for a hard-hitting interview this afternoon.

00:01:06.520 Okay, maybe it will be.

00:01:08.700 Maybe we'll be super surprised.

00:01:11.160 And MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle, who literally on Friday was telling Bill Maher that Harris should not do any interviews

00:01:20.400 because Trump is such an existential threat to America.

00:01:24.000 Maybe she'll be tough.

00:01:26.560 I mean, I wonder how she landed this interview.

00:01:30.140 What was it about her messaging that appealed to campaign Harris?

00:01:34.120 We'll watch, and hopefully we'll be eating these words tomorrow.

00:01:40.700 Later today, Nicole Shanahan, the former VP nominee for RFKJ, will be here on this show for the first time.

00:01:47.260 What a journey she has had to now supporting the MAGA movement.

00:01:51.160 But first, joining me now, two of our pals from National Review, Charles C.W. Cook, who's a senior writer and host of the Charles C.W. Cook podcast,

00:02:01.060 and Jim Garrity, a senior political correspondent for National Review and co-host of Three Martini Lunch.

00:02:07.520 It's a great podcast.

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00:02:44.080 Guys, welcome back.

00:02:46.240 Thank you.

00:02:46.880 Great to be here.

00:02:47.460 Okay, so the Gallup thing is very interesting, guys.

00:02:50.820 Gallup, their track record is very good on predicting the national popular vote by tracking party identification and leaners, right?

00:03:02.740 Like how many identify Republican, how many identify Dem, and then whichever party gets the leaners, it adds to their score.

00:03:10.400 And so just going through the numbers, in 2008, they said the country had, it was plus eight on Democratic registrations.

00:03:19.560 Obama won by 7.2.

00:03:21.780 This is put out in a tweet by Eric Doughty, but verified by our staff.

00:03:25.960 2012 said D plus four.

00:03:30.000 Obama won 3.9.

00:03:32.180 2016, it said D plus three.

00:03:35.380 And Clinton did win the national vote, 2.1.

00:03:39.980 So very close.

00:03:41.740 2020, D plus five.

00:03:44.720 Biden won 4.5.

00:03:46.500 And you know what it says?

00:03:48.460 In 2024, for the first time in some 20 years, R.

00:03:53.800 R plus three.

00:03:56.460 Amazing.

00:03:57.180 Just to see that Republicans have the edge on the national voter ID right now.

00:04:02.180 And if you go by track record, that would put Trump in a position of not only winning the national vote, but in the case of a Republican who wins the national vote, almost certainly winning the electoral college gym.

00:04:14.940 What do you make of that?

00:04:15.480 If that comes to pass, and I guess I put this in the category of news that is so good for Republicans, my skeptical instinct kicks in.

00:04:26.780 I'm almost afraid to believe.

00:04:28.300 It can't possibly be true.

00:04:30.180 Chalk that up to me being a Jets fan and just seeing when good things happen, something terrible is about to happen the very next moment.

00:04:36.620 So there's actually two schools of thought about how people identify in terms of their partisan lean.

00:04:42.020 One is if you ask people, which party are you part of?

00:04:44.500 If they think of what they're registered with, then they will say, I'm a registered Democrat, I'm a registered Republican, which might be surprising because there are a bunch of people, particularly in the South, less so now than, say, maybe a decade ago, but who were registered Democrats, but who are pretty darn cultural conservative on gun issues, on abortion, things like that.

00:05:00.700 The other one is that people are much more fickle.

00:05:04.000 And if it's a news cycle where the Democrats are looking terrible, then they're more likely to identify as Republicans and vice versa.

00:05:10.840 I think even if it's even, you're looking at that, that would probably be a Trump victory.

00:05:16.640 If it's Trump by three, as this Gallup point thinks, well, not only is Trump maybe going to go seven for seven in those big swing states that matter.

00:05:24.580 No offense to anybody in these other states, but clearly this election is coming down to Arizona and Nevada, the other Sunbelt states, North Carolina and Georgia, and then the big three in the blue wall, Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania.

00:05:35.440 But if it's really Republicans by three on election day, when you count up all the votes, well, then you've got to worry about New Hampshire.

00:05:41.440 Then you've got to worry about my home state of Virginia.

00:05:45.740 I also noticed this bizarre thing in which in Minnesota, Tim Walls, the Democratic vice presidential nominee, is the governor of Minnesota, and the last three polls have Democrats ahead by five percentage points.

00:05:57.040 Now, that's fine.

00:05:58.000 Everybody kind of expects Minnesota to be a blue state, but Biden and Harris carried the state by four and a half points.

00:06:04.020 So adding Tim Walls to the ticket, added a half percentage point to the Democratic total.

00:06:08.980 Good call.

00:06:09.740 Good call.

00:06:10.620 Hey, at least there was nobody else who could have helped Harris in, you know, Pennsylvania or something like that.

00:06:15.800 Right.

00:06:16.320 Whomever could it have been?

00:06:17.700 The thing about the Gallup number, Charlie, is it's starting to look like it's backed by polling.

00:06:23.880 And of course, you know, a month ago, the polling was very different.

00:06:27.320 A month from now, when we're a lot closer to the election, it could be very different as well.

00:06:31.220 So big asterisk on the discussion.

00:06:33.680 But one month out from where were we in late August, we were post-Democratic National Convention.

00:06:41.980 Kamala Harris was still on cloud nine.

00:06:44.340 She had been anointed.

00:06:45.520 She was wonderful.

00:06:46.780 She had no flaws.

00:06:48.180 She had Michelle.

00:06:49.060 She had Barack.

00:06:49.780 She had Bill.

00:06:50.320 She had Hillary.

00:06:51.020 She had Oprah.

00:06:51.660 She had them all.

00:06:53.600 Now, where is she?

00:06:54.720 Well, the latest Quinnipiac poll of likely voters shows in a two-way race, they're tied nationally at 48 in an expanded race, including Stein, these other minor candidates.

00:07:08.980 It's a one-point Trump lead.

00:07:12.760 Either way, razor thin.

00:07:15.640 I mean, very, very tight, which is good for Trump.

00:07:18.960 I mean, any national number showing Trump even in it, you know, tight, never mind, up by one, has very good implications for the electoral college.

00:07:30.040 That's Quinnipiac.

00:07:30.720 CNN likely voters in a four-way race showing Harris up over Trump by one, by one point.

00:07:39.860 And so all of this trends kind of neatly with those Gallup numbers I started with.

00:07:47.100 What do you make of it?

00:07:48.180 I think that we spend so much time, myself included, talking about Trump, and when I talk about Trump, it's relatively critical, that we sometimes forget that the Democratic Party is very weird, and also that the Democratic Party is in power.

00:08:08.000 It's in charge of the White House, and it's in charge of the Senate.

00:08:13.580 It also exercises a lot of cultural power in other institutions, in academia, in the media, in Hollywood, and increasingly in corporations.

00:08:24.540 And people often react to that.

00:08:28.900 And in a sense, since 2015, 2016, the Trump show has distracted from what's going on with the Democrats.

00:08:38.640 So it isn't greatly surprising to me to see either a close race at the presidential level or to see those numbers from Gallup.

00:08:49.180 And if you look at the current Democratic coalition, it doesn't make much sense.

00:08:55.520 It might make more sense if you add in that Donald Trump is the nominee.

00:09:00.600 But absent that, it doesn't make much sense.

00:09:04.380 What is the Democratic Party at the moment?

00:09:07.360 It's this very strange coalition of public sector unions and minorities, although less than it used to be, and upper middle class, white people, and social liberals, and people who have PhDs.

00:09:24.520 And their interests and political alliances don't necessarily mesh.

00:09:29.800 And you're beginning to see this, for example, with the Democrats running away pretty hard from raising taxes on 98.1% of the population, which is interesting, given they also want to spend a lot of money.

00:09:42.700 So I'm never shocked when I see this, when I see the Republicans doing well despite their problems, because I think the Democratic Party is a massive mess.

00:09:53.860 And I think that when Trump is gone, whether it's because he loses or wins this time around, those contradictions are going to come to the fore, especially if Trump wins, because then you're going to have essentially a four-year primary.

00:10:07.520 And that four-year primary is going to have as its heart, what should our positions be on everything, on foreign policy, on Israel, on taxes, on spending, on transgender stuff, on abortion.

00:10:19.640 Perhaps abortion is a good issue for the Democrats, but there's also a contradiction there, especially with black voters.

00:10:25.060 So it doesn't shock me to see this sort of close election or close number.

00:10:31.680 You know what?

00:10:32.080 You mentioned your home state of Virginia, the Commonwealth, Jim.

00:10:36.040 And there was a poll out just the other day, University of Mary Washington, polling on Virginia, showing it a two-point race.

00:10:47.880 Kamala 48, Trump 46.

00:10:49.900 Now I realize there'll be other polls that show it a much bigger lead for her there.

00:10:55.240 But that's getting back into the Joe Biden territory numbers where they did the coup to get him out of the race altogether.

00:11:03.620 I was going to say, beginning of the year, before there was any serious talk, before the debate between Trump and Biden, Biden was either barely ahead or, you know, they were running neck and neck.

00:11:15.180 By the way, keep in mind, Virginia, by and large, is a blue state or purplish blue.

00:11:20.900 We have Governor Glenn Youngkin, who's a Republican, but otherwise very tough for Republicans to win statewide.

00:11:26.360 And I believe the last Republican presidential candidate to carry the state of Virginia was George W. Bush back in like 2000 or 2004.

00:11:33.900 So since the Obama days, I used to joke when I lived in my old neighborhood, which I nicknamed Yuppie Acres, the Obama yard signs came pre-installed with the house.

00:11:42.520 It was just an assumption that, you know, I live in.

00:11:45.200 Wait a minute, this is news.

00:11:45.700 This is news.

00:11:46.400 Are you telling me the reason they refer to your home area as Authenticity Woods right now on the Editor's Podcast is because you used to be in Yuppie, what was it?

00:11:56.140 Yuppie Acres.

00:11:56.880 Yes, I can tell you that was Alexandria.

00:11:59.340 And that's, you know, keep in mind, before Alexandria, I lived in the District of Columbia.

00:12:04.320 So people would say, how do you like it?

00:12:05.540 Like, whoa, we have way better socialists out here.

00:12:08.680 They're much better about plowing the snow and stuff like that.

00:12:12.200 So let me tell you, when you've lived in D.C., northern Virginia, that seems like a conservative paradise.

00:12:17.080 Now I'm in Fairfax County, which used to be, you know, I narrowed it down to a county with a million people.

00:12:22.260 So Authenticity Woods is a corner of northern Virginia where I would describe it as all the Democrat voters, you can tell they have a Kamala Harris yard sign in their house, in front of their house.

00:12:34.020 And the Donald Trump sign, the Donald Trump voters have nothing on their front lawn because they don't want anyone to know.

00:12:40.400 But they're out there.

00:12:41.340 I think it was about two to one.

00:12:42.760 And a candidate like Youngkin can split it.

00:12:44.600 But the point where I was going with this is that Biden was on pace to lose Virginia, particularly after the debate.

00:12:50.700 The bottom fell out.

00:12:51.700 There were a whole bunch of Democrats who just clearly they may not have been ready to jump on the Trump bandwagon, but they just saw Biden as a reanimated corpse that was shuffling around like a zombie and basically were like, I can't vote for that.

00:13:04.180 With Harris, she's back in the lead, but it's closer.

00:13:07.440 It is not the slam dunk that it looked like it was going to be in the Obama days.

00:13:11.720 And, you know, I think, like I said, there's the big seven, New Hampshire, this state, and maybe one or two others are kind of the next rung on the ladder that Democrats need to worry about.

00:13:23.340 I don't think one thing that's got me nervous is the Republican get out the vote effort.

00:13:28.220 The Trump campaign has outsourced it to a bunch of groups and shooting Charlie Kirk's group kind of haven't done this before.

00:13:34.260 And Elon Musk's super PAC, you know, could work, could be great.

00:13:39.120 Still, I think it's not hard to find Republicans who are like, eh, these guys have not done this before.

00:13:44.160 So that's that one little X factor that still could play out between now and Election Day.

00:13:48.020 Yeah, we're actually having a deep dive show on the get out the vote effort on both sides next week.

00:13:52.960 So you guys should tune in because we'll tell you everything you need to know.

00:13:55.300 I'm touting it. That's what I'm doing.

00:13:57.360 What the Republicans are doing.

00:13:59.000 I mean, I was just in Pennsylvania yesterday.

00:14:00.580 You cannot you cannot turn on the television.

00:14:03.580 You cannot turn on any radio.

00:14:05.600 You better not leave your house.

00:14:07.180 I mean, like you will be assaulted by ads, promos, you know, people trying to get you to vote for their candidate.

00:14:12.880 You know, Charlie, on your answer, we're talking about how Democrats, they are weird.

00:14:18.580 I mean, their positions that there's a lot of weirdness over on that side.

00:14:21.860 But I really think the number drop, you know, for her because she was she came on to the scene.

00:14:27.620 She got all the fawning media coverage.

00:14:29.600 She had the DNC.

00:14:31.120 She wasn't forced to say any policy positions and so on.

00:14:33.880 And her numbers went up a lot from where Biden was and then passed Trump in a lot of these swing states.

00:14:39.380 I think the difference is she has not a lot, but she started talking.

00:14:46.100 She's talking.

00:14:47.700 And that's all Trump needs to win.

00:14:51.260 Truly, like the more she talks, whether it's to these today, she doesn't do an interview with like these local or these NBA stars.

00:15:00.000 And she's going to sit with Stephanie Rule.

00:15:02.060 She sat with Dana Bash.

00:15:03.960 Just talk.

00:15:05.460 Forget the debate because there she gave her memorized lines.

00:15:07.740 But bit by bit, the facade is pierced and people are realizing what you've been writing about now for five years.

00:15:19.660 I think she's in a catch 22.

00:15:21.920 I agree with what you just said, but I think they also don't like her when she says nothing.

00:15:26.500 So the challenge for Harris is to say things eloquently and convincingly and persuade people to her side.

00:15:35.560 But she can't do it.

00:15:36.560 I think this is a race against the clock.

00:15:38.900 She might win.

00:15:40.000 She will, if she wins, be unpopular very quickly because people will cotton on.

00:15:45.840 It's just a question of whether or not the election comes before or after that.

00:15:50.620 I was in Pennsylvania on Sunday as well.

00:15:53.920 I was in Pittsburgh.

00:15:54.660 And watching Sunday Night Football in a bar, as you say, you just can't move for presidential election ads.

00:16:03.500 They seem to me to be about three to one in Harris's favor.

00:16:07.380 But what was most notable about it was the ads for Harris say nothing, almost literally nothing.

00:16:15.540 They're the same ads for Harris that we get occasionally here in Florida.

00:16:19.180 They are incredibly vague.

00:16:21.320 They just say things like, Harris was a prosecutor.

00:16:24.440 Harris will lower prices.

00:16:25.820 That's it.

00:16:26.260 That's a one second assertion.

00:16:28.800 And Harris is good for the country.

00:16:33.460 And then they move on.

00:16:35.480 Whereas the Trump ads are specific.

00:16:38.280 The Trump ads talk about fracking.

00:16:40.540 They talk about immigration.

00:16:41.980 And they talk about transgender surgeries on minors.

00:16:46.700 Now, it seems to me that if you're watching TV in Pennsylvania all the time, and these ads are on all the time, you get, whether you like him or not, a lot more out of the Trump ads than you do from the Harris ads.

00:17:01.160 And there has been some research I've seen that suggests that people liked Harris when she first came along because she was new.

00:17:08.000 She wasn't Joe Biden.

00:17:09.760 And the vagueness helped because it didn't immediately define her in their minds as somebody who was toxic.

00:17:15.820 But that being normal people, normal voters, they wanted to learn more about Harris.

00:17:22.320 And they haven't.

00:17:23.780 And the problem she's got, Megan, I think, is then we get to your rubric, which is, well, she has to talk.

00:17:29.400 She has to say something.

00:17:30.420 And she's awful at it.

00:17:32.000 There's just no sugarcoating this.

00:17:34.200 First off, she has a horrible voice.

00:17:36.340 I'm sorry if that is superficial, but she does.

00:17:39.880 She's going to talk for four or eight years if she's president.

00:17:42.700 I don't think she helps herself physically when she speaks.

00:17:46.360 Second, what she says is nonsense.

00:17:49.380 It is absolute nonsense.

00:17:51.040 That local media interview we saw recently where she spoke for two minutes about how she was going to lower prices and said precisely nothing.

00:18:01.340 I mean, it was like AI-generated trash.

00:18:04.000 And three, she is in a bind because she said all these ridiculous things in 2019, and she is trying to run away from them.

00:18:13.080 But she also doesn't want to very publicly disavow them because she doesn't want to look like a flip-flopper and she doesn't want to upset the base.

00:18:19.080 So what does she do?

00:18:20.100 She gets the people on her team to issue a statement to some journalist that says, well, she no longer believes that.

00:18:25.280 But the clips are still out there.

00:18:26.680 I saw them in Pennsylvania.

00:18:28.420 Trump and Dave McCormick are using them in those ads.

00:18:31.400 So there's all of this footage of her saying, of course, I'm going to bang fracking, of course this, of course that.

00:18:36.380 And then there's nothing actually to counteract it with.

00:18:38.900 And when she is asked to present a counterargument or to say what she's going to do in the future, she won't do it.

00:18:44.780 And I think she can't do it because I don't think she's actually thought through much about her political positions.

00:18:50.020 And I think that's crazy.

00:18:51.200 It's just a matter of whether or not people notice this in large enough numbers before the election or after.

00:18:56.760 But there's going to come a point, whether she's president or not, where her approval rating hits 25%.

00:19:01.500 Charlie, did you watch the Oprah interview or portions of it?

00:19:05.440 Yeah, I did.

00:19:08.000 How did you enjoy that?

00:19:09.040 It was crazy.

00:19:10.000 Well, you know, my favorite part about it, Megan, was not that Harris sat there and talked in her strange sort of fortune cookie through Google Translate manner,

00:19:19.660 but that Oprah, who is no stranger to speaking in platitudes herself, reacted at various points as if she was John Steinbeck.

00:19:28.620 I mean, she's sitting there saying, hmm, hmm, hmm, fact, yes, hmm.

00:19:33.000 It was nonsense.

00:19:34.180 What you need is a journalist who's going to sit there and say, what does that mean?

00:19:37.080 Yeah, but what does that mean?

00:19:38.040 Okay, but what does that mean?

00:19:39.400 But no one does it.

00:19:40.240 And Stephanie Rule is not going to do it, which is why she's been chosen for this interview.

00:19:44.740 Yes.

00:19:45.220 All right, I'll get to Stephanie in one second.

00:19:46.440 So before we go to her, on the subject of the people sitting in Pennsylvania and some of these other swing states, Jim, they may not like Trump.

00:19:55.820 You know, that's why they're still undecided.

00:19:57.540 That's why there are possible swing voters.

00:19:59.760 They don't like him.

00:20:01.200 And the polls do show he's not well liked beyond the core base, like 37 percent or so of the Republican Party.

00:20:09.000 Like, they'll vote for him.

00:20:09.840 The Republicans are going to vote for him for the most part.

00:20:11.620 But he's not loved as the MAGA base loves him.

00:20:15.300 But they liked his presidency by a majority.

00:20:19.960 And that's that CNN poll I just referenced, which has it in a four-way race.

00:20:24.140 Harris, 48, Trump, 47, shows that they like Trump's presidency.

00:20:29.300 Fifty-one percent of those polled, likely voters, say his presidency was a success.

00:20:34.380 Forty-nine percent say it was a failure.

00:20:36.140 So it's tight, but he's got majority support on whether his presidency was a success for the United States.

00:20:42.700 Joe Biden, 37 percent say his presidency has been a success.

00:20:48.500 Sixty-three percent say a failure.

00:20:51.920 She's part of that administration.

00:20:53.820 And that led Harry Enten over on CNN to be making the following distinction in a hit we just saw.

00:21:00.880 Watch this.

00:21:02.520 Look at this.

00:21:03.580 Think his presidency was a success.

00:21:05.660 Donald Trump, 51 percent.

00:21:07.780 The majority think his presidency was a success, despite his personal popularity being meh.

00:21:13.240 Look at this for Joe Biden, way down at 37 percent.

00:21:17.440 I think that this is a real drag on Kamala Harris, despite her own personal popularity.

00:21:22.300 While Donald Trump, with thinking his presidency is a success, I think the net favorability ratings don't actually get into the fact that there are a lot of folks who like the job he did as president, but don't necessarily like him personally.

00:21:32.960 So here we go.

00:21:33.880 George W. Bush, obviously a Republican, didn't succeed him.

00:21:37.740 Lyndon Johnson, there was no Democrat who succeeded him.

00:21:41.060 Harry Truman, no Democrat who succeeded him.

00:21:43.720 Now we're looking at Joe Biden.

00:21:45.120 Could a Democrat succeed him, despite his net approval rating being as low as it is?

00:21:49.140 History isn't so kind.

00:21:50.600 But again, we're really just looking at a sample size of three.

00:21:53.660 But the bottom line is, I think we can say Joe Biden is a drag on Kamala Harris.

00:21:58.780 What do you make of that, Jim?

00:21:59.820 Because I feel like our friend Andy McCarthy needs to see that, because he's always talking about how high Trump's unfavorables are.

00:22:05.360 And they are.

00:22:06.880 But better numbers when they look at his presidency.

00:22:10.740 Well, Joe Biden is such a drag on the Harris ticket and is such a liability for the Democrats that he will be spending mid-October in Germany and in the country of Angola in Western Africa.

00:22:26.400 No, this is important.

00:22:27.660 There are important issues for Joe Biden to be discussing with the Angolans.

00:22:32.340 And that's why he will be spending three days in that country that no U.S. president has ever visited before, three weeks before Election Day.

00:22:39.840 That's absolutely where you want your president.

00:22:43.080 Look, if they could put him in a closet, they would put him there.

00:22:45.640 But they couldn't do that.

00:22:46.400 So they sent him on this long foreign trip in the middle of the month.

00:22:50.160 Yeah, look, everything Enten said there is clear.

00:22:53.260 But I know Democrats think, ah, you know, Trump's last year was a disaster.

00:22:57.840 We lost so many jobs, et cetera.

00:22:59.900 Everybody in America is like, well, that was the pandemic.

00:23:02.480 It wasn't Trump's fault.

00:23:03.820 It started, could have started anywhere, Wuhan Institute of Biology.

00:23:08.200 And as a result of that, it was something, it's outside force.

00:23:11.480 It's not anything Trump could have done.

00:23:12.980 By the time it got to the U.S., it was too late.

00:23:15.460 We don't hold that year against them.

00:23:16.920 They think of the first three years.

00:23:18.420 They look at the wage growth.

00:23:19.540 They look at how wages were growing faster than inflation.

00:23:21.540 And they have pretty good feelings about that.

00:23:23.780 The Harris campaign, I don't doubt they are running the campaign that they want to run.

00:23:29.120 And they're running the campaign that they think they ought to run.

00:23:32.340 But you look at the results.

00:23:33.820 I don't think that's the right campaign.

00:23:36.060 I think objectively, the Democrats had a good and successful convention.

00:23:41.080 Protests were very low.

00:23:42.320 Everybody raved about the speeches, et cetera.

00:23:44.300 Very little bump in her polling numbers, particularly in these swing states.

00:23:47.360 I think objectively, she won the debate.

00:23:49.040 I think Trump really had a lousy night.

00:23:51.020 But you look at the debate bump, little or no, and certainly very little in the swing states.

00:23:55.080 I think a majority in these swing states looks at Harris and says, look, first of all,

00:23:59.780 notice how often, whether it's in the Oprah interview or in the Wisconsin NPR interview,

00:24:04.580 tonight she's doing Stephanie Ruhle, who is for people who find Rachel Maddow too heavy-handed

00:24:09.700 in favor of Trump.

00:24:11.200 That's what her program's for.

00:24:13.460 That everyone, she gets some version of a question of, what are you going to do?

00:24:17.540 And Megan, we've heard her answer a bunch of times now.

00:24:19.640 I grew up in a middle-class tax, middle-class household.

00:24:25.020 She gets asked, what are you going to do?

00:24:27.420 Yes.

00:24:28.040 They cared about, she gets a, what are you going to do?

00:24:29.160 If she says it like, we don't care about our lawns.

00:24:30.440 Everyone cares about their lawn.

00:24:31.580 Anyone who has a lawn cares about their lawn.

00:24:33.600 I mean, what is she's like the, as if that makes her relatable, you know, like what?

00:24:37.720 Like rich people don't care about their lawn?

00:24:39.400 I don't even know what she's trying to say.

00:24:41.020 It is a Bill Clinton, I'll feel your pain answer.

00:24:45.080 It is an empathy answer.

00:24:46.440 But the problem is, people didn't ask, do you care about me?

00:24:50.220 They asked, what are you going to do?

00:24:52.880 And her very first question on the economics, you know, early on in this campaign was price

00:24:57.400 controls.

00:24:58.300 Now, over at the Washington Post, my colleague, Catherine Rample, is by no stretch of the imagination

00:25:02.640 a conservative.

00:25:03.360 But her reaction was, if you're going to be called a communist by your Republican opponent,

00:25:07.980 maybe don't propose price controls as your first economic idea.

00:25:11.920 Maybe just kind of, you know, you know, you can find down, dine the wool, Democratic economists.

00:25:18.720 Look at the idea of the federal government trying to set prices for groceries and say,

00:25:22.200 no, no, you don't want to go down this road.

00:25:24.420 It never works out.

00:25:25.660 It creates shortages.

00:25:27.020 It creates, all you're doing is limiting supply.

00:25:28.960 You're not increasing demand.

00:25:30.200 So she has this bad, I'm going to go to 30,000 feet.

00:25:34.420 I'm going to, I'm going to talk about emotions.

00:25:36.200 When people really want to hear, what are you going to do about policies?

00:25:40.120 And the really tough question is, what are you going to do differently than Biden?

00:25:43.740 Because you've been his vice president for the past three to eight years.

00:25:47.500 That's exactly right.

00:25:48.540 I have more.

00:25:49.180 I don't know.

00:25:49.500 Did you guys see that clip on Fox where Sandra Smith was interviewing a campaign surrogate

00:25:55.620 for Kamala Harris on the issue of price gouging?

00:25:59.600 We're waiting.

00:26:01.560 Okay.

00:26:02.300 There's a lot of aspects to it in regards to looking at it online.

00:26:07.260 So let's talk about lowering the grocery costs because that's something that's brought up.

00:26:11.840 The viewers can look at this online.

00:26:13.740 She talks about certain things in regards to advancing the first federal ban on price

00:26:19.380 gouging on food and groceries, to set clear rules to the road to make it clear that big corporations

00:26:24.860 can't unfairly exploit consumers as well.

00:26:27.980 Is that happening?

00:26:29.240 Is that happening?

00:26:31.400 It's not at this moment.

00:26:33.420 No, this is her plan that's laid out for the first hundred days when she becomes president

00:26:38.160 of the United States of America.

00:26:39.560 But price gouging, is that currently happening?

00:26:43.420 In regards to the, I don't know exactly if that's currently happening or not because

00:26:48.140 I'm not privy to that type of information.

00:26:50.920 But there are people are costing, costing a lot of money in regards to, to groceries.

00:26:56.760 Okay.

00:26:57.780 And that potentially is.

00:26:59.040 It seems like you're having your time time articulating your plan.

00:27:01.200 I'm not.

00:27:02.400 Honestly, that's not true.

00:27:05.040 I'm constantly being interrupted by you, which, as I'm saying,

00:27:08.160 as a woman, I think is, is disrespectful.

00:27:11.660 And when I'm trying to speak, every time I try and speak, you, you speak over me.

00:27:16.440 It was pretty remarkable because Sandra Smith was just asking her, like, who's doing that?

00:27:21.340 Who's, which, which grocery stores are gouging?

00:27:24.980 Couldn't answer.

00:27:26.480 Who's doing that?

00:27:28.280 Couldn't answer.

00:27:29.440 And it was really remarkable, right?

00:27:31.160 Because everyone who's studied this since Kamala Harris injected it as a problem that she's

00:27:36.180 ready and uniquely fit to solve has been looking at the same thing, saying they, they have

00:27:41.180 a one to 2% margin on their products.

00:27:44.860 They're not making any money on their products.

00:27:47.320 Like what, why are you focused on that as the solution to prices at the grocery store?

00:27:52.940 If they go any lower, the grocery stores are going to go out of business and then they'll

00:27:58.180 have no place to shop.

00:27:59.300 So it was remarkable just to watch somebody really pressed.

00:28:02.500 It wasn't Kamala Harris.

00:28:03.600 It'd be wonderful if somebody would really do that to Kamala Harris.

00:28:06.000 And that does lead me to Stephanie Rule because she has a background in, um, by business news.

00:28:13.300 So perhaps tonight will be the night.

00:28:16.300 She will get out there and ask those questions like who's doing that or perhaps not.

00:28:23.680 But this is how she interviewed Joe Biden, uh, not long ago when he was still the nominee.

00:28:34.160 You have a very strong economic recovery story to tell.

00:28:38.640 As I said, you have a very strong economic recovery story.

00:28:41.740 Have you given up on Congress doing anything?

00:28:43.900 I know you believe in the American dream and you talk about fighting for the soul of America.

00:28:48.820 Okay, I'm not feeling that good, starting to reevaluate my, my suggestion that we might

00:28:57.780 be surprised tonight.

00:28:58.780 Here she was in the clip we mentioned in the intro on Bill Maher this past Friday, which

00:29:03.720 has led many to ask whether this is how she got the Kamala sit down to begin with.

00:29:08.680 Here it is.

00:29:10.220 My fear is that she doesn't really have a very good command of what she wants to do as president.

00:29:18.240 It's not too much to ask Kamala, say, are you for a Palestinian state if Hamas is going

00:29:24.060 to run that state?

00:29:25.040 I'm not, I just said I'm not going to vote for her.

00:29:27.100 Kamala Harris is not running for perfect.

00:29:28.700 She's running against Trump.

00:29:30.620 We have two choices.

00:29:32.360 And so there are some things you might not know her answer to.

00:29:36.380 And in 2024, unlike 2016 for a lot of the American people, we know exactly what Trump

00:29:43.040 will do, who he is, and the kind of threat he is to democracy.

00:29:46.980 The problem that a lot of people have with Kamala is we don't know her answer to anything,

00:29:53.480 okay?

00:29:53.760 But you know his answer to everything.

00:29:56.220 And I don't think it's a lot to ask her to sit down for a real interview as opposed to

00:30:00.800 a cut piece in which she describes her feelings of growing up in Oakland with nice laws.

00:30:06.960 Then I would just say to that, when you move to Nirvana, give me your real estate broker's

00:30:11.940 number and I'll be your next door neighbor.

00:30:14.080 We don't live there.

00:30:16.380 What a joke of a comment for an actual journalist, someone who purports to be an actual journalist,

00:30:22.120 that we'd have to be living in Nirvana for her to give a real interview where we get to

00:30:29.300 ask and receive answers on her policy positions.

00:30:32.060 Charlie, that's 100% why she was chosen to sit down with her next.

00:30:38.600 They said, we got a live one.

00:30:42.920 It's a false premise.

00:30:44.160 And it's a premise I hear all the time.

00:30:47.000 I'm sure you do, Megan.

00:30:48.160 I'm sure you do, Jim.

00:30:49.040 That if you don't like Trump, or if you're not going to vote for Trump, or if you're

00:30:58.240 a Democrat and you always vote for the Democrat, you should therefore not be interested at all

00:31:03.680 in anything to do with the Democratic candidate because you think the other person is worse.

00:31:10.420 That is a ridiculous premise for anyone to adopt.

00:31:14.000 But were Stephanie Ruhle some random voter, I would think that that was a ridiculous premise

00:31:19.580 for her to adopt.

00:31:21.220 The idea that you cannot evaluate somebody who wishes to be president of the United States

00:31:28.060 with all of the power, domestic and foreign, that that entails is grotesque in a free republic.

00:31:35.980 But for a journalist to say it blows my mind.

00:31:40.200 Bret Stephens was not sitting there whitewashing or even praising Donald Trump in any sense.

00:31:47.840 He wasn't arguing that Stephanie Ruhle or Bill Maher or the audience should vote for Donald

00:31:52.580 Trump.

00:31:52.960 He wasn't talking about Donald Trump.

00:31:55.160 He was saying, independently of Donald Trump and his virtues or flaws, here are some problems

00:32:02.280 with Harris as a candidate for president in a free country.

00:32:05.320 Hillary, don't you think they're an issue?

00:32:08.140 And she can't process it.

00:32:10.540 She can't grasp it.

00:32:12.180 Her position is, don't talk about that because that intrudes upon the anti-Trump message.

00:32:19.980 Now, look, when you get into the voting booth, you do have to think like that in one sense

00:32:23.580 because you're choosing one person and not the other.

00:32:25.700 You can't say 70% for this person, 30% for the other.

00:32:28.760 You can't shade the circle.

00:32:32.400 But as a writer, as an interviewer, as a thinker, as a citizen, you should treat every candidate

00:32:41.040 the same, whether you like them or not.

00:32:43.800 You should ask, do they reach the threshold at which they have proven themselves adequate

00:32:48.780 to be president of the United States?

00:32:51.180 And I think the answer with Harris is no.

00:32:53.440 And I think Bret Stephens is absolutely right.

00:32:55.320 The reason for that is we don't know anything about her.

00:32:57.840 We don't know what her answers will be.

00:32:59.200 We don't know how she wants to use power.

00:33:02.000 I cannot grasp how people got themselves into this position.

00:33:05.980 The correct way of looking at this is to say, I have chosen to vote for or prefer candidate

00:33:12.540 X over candidate Y, and now I'm going to give candidate X hell.

00:33:18.600 And just to follow up on that, I saw you tweeted on this earlier.

00:33:21.040 You've got some reporters even outside of the right wing ecosphere, like this Alex Thompson

00:33:27.580 at Axios, who, as near as I can tell, about once or twice a week, fires off questions to

00:33:35.060 the Kamala Harris campaign saying, here is her old position, old as in like a couple of

00:33:40.500 years ago.

00:33:41.160 Does she still stand by it?

00:33:42.480 Just, just the latest were, um, she ran for DA in 2003.

00:33:47.460 And since then she's been an outspoken opponent of the death penalty.

00:33:51.940 We asked if she's still opposed and would push for legislation or an executive order to ban

00:33:56.780 it.

00:33:57.420 The campaign didn't respond.

00:33:59.080 Then it came, uh, to sex workers.

00:34:02.920 Harris's campaign is declining to say whether she still supports decriminalizing sex work,

00:34:07.400 a position she took in 2019, asked if she was available for a brief interview on the

00:34:11.740 topic.

00:34:12.480 The campaign didn't respond.

00:34:14.460 Then it was a question of amnesty to dreamers.

00:34:17.280 Um, we asked if she still supported that, which she said she did in 2019, her campaign

00:34:22.780 declined to say, here's another one, Axios as Harris's campaign, whether she was available

00:34:27.760 for a five to 10 minute interview to discuss her position on immigration, a campaign spokesperson

00:34:32.980 declined than it was last week where she was asked about, or two weeks ago after the debate

00:34:40.640 where Trump said she wants to use taxpayer money to pay for sex change operations for

00:34:45.300 illegals and for prisoners.

00:34:47.640 And the campaign would only say that's not a position she's espoused in this campaign,

00:34:54.140 not disavowing the one in 2019.

00:34:57.120 It's incredible.

00:34:58.880 It's incredible.

00:34:59.920 I'll actually bring this one to you, Jim, how she's getting away with that.

00:35:05.280 Well, actually, I mean, like, yeah, she's getting away with it from the media.

00:35:09.100 I think the fact that she is still neck and neck is an indication that she's not getting

00:35:13.500 away with it, but the broader electorate, uh, the Kamala Harris of 2019.

00:35:18.380 And by the way, like we refer to her 2020 campaign, but she never actually made it to

00:35:22.100 the year 2020.

00:35:22.820 So I guess technically it's her 2019 campaign, um, that those, that those positions did not

00:35:29.140 get, I get her the nomination did not even get her to the primary process ran out of money.

00:35:34.200 And so the question is, she wants to say, Oh, I'm a totally different person from who

00:35:38.160 I was back then.

00:35:39.160 I have totally different positions from what I had back then, but I'm not going to say

00:35:42.660 it on camera.

00:35:43.820 And I'm not going to sit down and do a real interview.

00:35:45.980 Like there's nothing wrong with changing your mind on any of these issues.

00:35:48.680 And she could go out and say, you know, I had that.

00:35:51.620 And since then I've become vice president.

00:35:53.380 I've got complete briefings on all of these issues.

00:35:56.000 And I see the issue differently now because of X, Y, and Z.

00:35:59.940 And if X, Y, and Z are persuasive enough.

00:36:01.540 All 12 of them, it would be tough.

00:36:03.160 Yeah, it'd be a lot, you know, but, uh, and notice how many of these involve, you know,

00:36:07.800 prosecution of criminals.

00:36:09.780 You'd think that'd be a topic she'd be, you know, pretty familiar with.

00:36:12.760 You think that would be her bread and butter.

00:36:14.300 But, uh, if she says, you know what, before I wanted decriminalization of sex work, and

00:36:19.440 now I've looked at evidence indicating that when you do decriminalize it, like they did

00:36:23.180 over in Europe, uh, it actually increases the amount of sex trafficking involved because

00:36:28.060 you increase demand, the creepy mob sex traffickers move in and they set up shop and they end up

00:36:34.080 having more, uh, abuse of young women and things like that.

00:36:38.040 If she said that, this is my, this is why I changed my mind.

00:36:40.980 I think people would be, would say, okay, all right, that makes sense.

00:36:43.500 She's not doing any of this.

00:36:44.520 And so I think what's holding her back is that people see this and they say, hmm, she's

00:36:51.140 hiding something.

00:36:52.120 She's probably a lot more progressive.

00:36:54.480 She's probably a lot further to the left that she wants us to, to believe or to recognize.

00:36:59.360 There's a, creating this sense of they, the public, or at least a decisive slice of it,

00:37:03.360 particularly in these seven swing states, just doesn't trust her because the, you know,

00:37:07.240 the question has come up, apparently later this week, she might go to the border.

00:37:10.720 If she doesn't go to the border, it's like, she's asking, you know, hoping, uh, the public

00:37:15.540 will just forget about the issue of illegal immigration and the insecure border between

00:37:19.660 now and election day.

00:37:20.740 Well, they're not going to forget.

00:37:22.340 So you might as well talk about it.

00:37:23.840 You might as well have something to say about it.

00:37:26.020 And if you're going to do it, you should at least go to the border and pretend that you

00:37:29.980 care and pretend that you look like you actually worried about this stuff instead of just

00:37:34.240 kind of hiding and sticking it and giggling and wanting to talk about, you know, coconut

00:37:38.160 tree memes.

00:37:39.860 You know, Charlie, this, she just did this again.

00:37:43.180 First of all, I just want to point out, she was asked about her flip-flop on fracking by

00:37:46.780 Dana Bash in that interview.

00:37:48.160 She was allowed to lie and say she had made her position clear in 2020 versus the one in

00:37:55.560 2019 in which she said she wants to ban fracking.

00:37:58.820 I made that clear on the vice presidential debate stage in 2020 that I'm not in favor.

00:38:02.460 It was a lie.

00:38:03.980 She said on the debate stage, you guys know at this point that that was Joe Biden's position

00:38:08.320 after Joe Biden had won the nomination.

00:38:10.520 She has never spoken to hers, hers.

00:38:14.000 And then in an act of journalistic malpractice, when ABC got her for the debate, they failed

00:38:21.140 to exploit that sleight of hand and let her get away with it again.

00:38:29.160 That would have been an affirmative debate question I would have asked her.

00:38:31.720 You said it's not true.

00:38:33.440 What you said on the debate stage was about Joe Biden.

00:38:36.120 I'm putting it to you right now.

00:38:38.040 Did you switch your position when and why?

00:38:40.200 No.

00:38:40.720 Once again, she told the same lie.

00:38:42.140 She was allowed to get away with it.

00:38:43.240 It's so incredibly frustrating.

00:38:45.000 But she did give an interview to hold on a second.

00:38:50.080 Who was it?

00:38:50.520 It's Wisconsin Public Radio.

00:38:52.280 And it aired on Tuesday.

00:38:54.440 And in this interview, she said that she supports ending the Senate filibuster, which protects

00:39:03.020 minority rights in the Senate, in an effort to restore Roe versus Wade.

00:39:07.460 I think we should eliminate the filibuster for Roe and get us to the point where 51 votes

00:39:12.180 would be what we need to put back in law, the protections for reproductive freedom.

00:39:17.040 Now, this is what's amazing.

00:39:19.920 Tom Cotton pointed this out.

00:39:21.900 In 2017, when she was a senator, she signed a letter pledging to support the filibuster to

00:39:28.100 ensure the Senate continues to serve as the world's greatest deliberative body.

00:39:31.880 And Cotton went on to say her word is meaningless.

00:39:35.600 She'll say anything to get elected.

00:39:38.380 So I think this tells us an enormous amount about who she is, this shift on the filibuster.

00:39:48.480 She entered the Senate in 2017.

00:39:51.660 And at that point, the Democrats had no control at all in Congress or the White House.

00:39:58.840 And as such, the prerogatives, the aims of the Democratic Party were to stop Republicans

00:40:05.840 changing federal law.

00:40:07.040 That's totally reasonable.

00:40:07.720 That's why we have political parties.

00:40:10.300 And the letter that you referenced was therefore enthusiastically signed by 31 of the 47, I think,

00:40:21.300 Democrats in the Senate at the time.

00:40:24.420 It was also signed, Megan, by 28 Republicans and endorsed by Mitch McConnell and spearheaded

00:40:31.720 by Susan Collins.

00:40:33.620 So there you've got 30 Republicans who are acting against their self-interest and also defying

00:40:39.200 Donald Trump, who wanted to abolish the filibuster at the time.

00:40:42.740 Harris signs on to this.

00:40:44.220 Why?

00:40:45.000 Because it helps her.

00:40:45.920 Because it helps her party.

00:40:46.940 Because it helps her thwart Republicans.

00:40:48.320 Now, a couple of those Democrats moved into the majority in 2020 and kept the position that

00:40:57.380 they had held before, Kyrsten Sinema and Manchin.

00:41:00.200 Most of the remaining Democrats did not.

00:41:02.580 Well, Kamala Harris moved from the Senate to the Naval Observatory and became vice president.

00:41:08.260 And she changed her view completely.

00:41:11.400 Why?

00:41:12.600 Well, because the Democrats now had control of the Senate.

00:41:15.900 She was a tying vote and she was in a different branch of government.

00:41:19.500 But it's worse than that.

00:41:21.060 She didn't just completely change her view because she had moved and her party now had

00:41:25.240 power, which is bad enough in and of itself.

00:41:27.180 You're supposed to believe in institutions for their own sake.

00:41:29.600 She moved into a position in which she was calling for partial filibuster repeal or filibuster

00:41:40.440 reform or a carve out on the two things that she and Joe Biden were the most upset about

00:41:46.340 at the time, voting rights, so-called, and abortion.

00:41:49.640 In other words, Harris's position in 2022 was that the filibuster should be ignored for

00:41:57.560 the couple of things that she wanted to get done, but kept for everything else.

00:42:02.480 So she wanted the protection of the filibuster in case Republicans tried to change things that

00:42:08.140 she likes, but she didn't want it to block the Democrats when they were trying to push

00:42:13.080 through the agenda that she and Joe Biden had worked for.

00:42:16.340 That, of course, is the party of the rule of law, we can see right there.

00:42:19.480 Now she's running for president.

00:42:21.640 She thinks she's going to be president.

00:42:22.960 And she doesn't want any blocks at all on what she can accomplish.

00:42:27.880 And so now she's for getting rid of the filibuster completely.

00:42:31.440 This is a great example of Kamala Harris's fundamental dishonesty, hypocrisy, vacuousness,

00:42:40.280 and thirst for power.

00:42:41.780 There is nothing there.

00:42:43.840 She might not be answering questions.

00:42:45.720 She might be dodging where she can.

00:42:47.740 But this she can't remove herself from because she's on the record.

00:42:51.880 We've seen her go from the filibuster must be cherished to save the Senate as an institution.

00:42:57.260 It's imperative for America's future to we should carve out just those things that I

00:43:02.260 happen to want in my new role to, well, now that I might be president, get rid of it.

00:43:06.720 What does that tell you about her?

00:43:08.380 It tells me that she doesn't actually believe in institutions at all.

00:43:12.720 She doesn't believe in rules at all.

00:43:14.320 She has no conception of a neutral order in which she is but a small part.

00:43:18.520 She wants what she wants, and she will say what she says in order to get it.

00:43:22.700 And that is why it matters so much that she won't answer questions.

00:43:26.560 That's why Bret Stephens was right in that clip that you played, because it doesn't matter

00:43:30.420 what you think of Trump or whether you're voting for Harris or Trump.

00:43:33.440 We should know what it is that the people we are sending to Washington and giving enormous

00:43:39.120 power want to do.

00:43:40.280 And the one concrete example we have shows her changing her mind on the fly to get exactly

00:43:46.440 what she wants and impose it on the rest of the country.

00:43:48.620 It's just unacceptable.

00:43:51.040 Not to mention the folly of making this a federal issue.

00:43:56.540 That's I mean, that was the beauty of Dobbs, Jim, is it did give the issue back to the states.

00:44:01.860 We return, revert to our 50 state experiment as the founders intended us to be on something

00:44:07.020 as personal as this.

00:44:08.200 If you don't like the laws in Mississippi, you can move to New York, you can move to

00:44:12.660 California, you can move to Vermont.

00:44:15.020 And that is why what Kristen Sinema said resonated with me, which has been my position all along

00:44:20.920 on this.

00:44:21.600 She responded saying to state the supremely obvious, eliminating the filibuster to codify

00:44:26.740 Roe versus Wade also enables a future Congress to ban all abortion nationwide.

00:44:32.920 What an absolutely terrible, short sighted idea.

00:44:37.740 And it also led Joe Manchin to say shame on her and saying he definitely will not endorse

00:44:43.280 her now.

00:44:44.280 I mean, I think you actually have a very good argument that this may not be regulated by

00:44:49.500 Congress as a national ban or a national permission slip under our current enumeration

00:44:55.120 of separation of powers, that they don't have the power to issue a nationwide ban or support

00:45:00.880 resurrection of the Roe regime.

00:45:03.260 I think that's the position that Republicans should take.

00:45:05.420 And I think Democrats should say that because half a loaf is better than no loaf for either

00:45:10.380 party on this issue.

00:45:12.480 But she's decided to run out there and say she'll do it.

00:45:16.140 And what's scary, Jim, is like the Democrats actually, notwithstanding the way we began the

00:45:21.940 show, they actually could win the White House.

00:45:23.820 They could keep control in the Senate and potentially even improve their margins there, though it's not

00:45:29.320 likely. And they could win the House.

00:45:31.860 So you know how they're always saying, believe Trump on his promises?

00:45:35.680 We should believe her on what she's saying here.

00:45:39.080 Yeah. And one aspect that I feel was really honestly almost absurd is the idea that they're

00:45:44.500 going to carve out an exception to the filibuster, but just on abortion.

00:45:48.520 And the Senate Democrats are going to say to every other powerful progressive interest group

00:45:53.320 in their party, well, we did that for them.

00:45:56.380 NARAL gets what it wants, but sorry, Black Lives Matter.

00:45:59.440 You don't get what you want.

00:46:00.840 Sorry, Human Rights Campaign.

00:46:02.460 You don't get what you want.

00:46:03.760 Sorry, Sierra Club, environmentalists.

00:46:05.720 I know you really want a green no deal, but we just can't get rid of the filibuster for that.

00:46:10.860 The moment you get rid of the filibuster-

00:46:12.060 Can I just say, sorry to interrupt you, but I do want to tell you, she said in 2019 she

00:46:17.540 would support ending the filibuster to pass environmental legislation known as the Green

00:46:21.960 New Deal. She wants to get rid of it for that, too.

00:46:25.280 Exactly. So once you get rid of the filibuster for any piece of legislation, it becomes, it's

00:46:30.520 like eating potato chips. It's very hard to do just one. You will end up getting rid of

00:46:34.340 the filibuster for more and more pieces of legislation, and then the filibuster will be

00:46:37.920 effectively gone forever.

00:46:39.160 The other thing is, is that I've looked a lot at the Senate races. I wrote about them

00:46:42.780 this week. The best case scenario, yeah, sure. So you add up all of the current Republican

00:46:48.460 seats that are not up for election this year. You add up all the ones that are really deep

00:46:53.080 red, open seat in places like Utah and Indiana. These are not swing states. And Jim Justice,

00:47:00.380 who is almost certainly going to win the Senate race in West Virginia. That gets Republicans

00:47:04.860 to 50 states. If everything else goes wrong, including Montana, Tester

00:47:09.140 hangs on. Then you're looking at a 50-50 Senate. Tester goes down in Montana. Then Republicans

00:47:15.440 have 51 seats. And thankfully, this filibuster discussion appears to be moot at least for

00:47:20.040 two years.

00:47:21.260 In a 50-50 Senate, what Harris is envisioning is that 50 Senate Democrats say, we want to

00:47:26.880 get rid of the filibuster. And Tim Walz comes in and breaks the tie. Now, traditionally, the

00:47:31.860 filibuster is there to protect the rights of the Senate minority. In this case, the Senate

00:47:36.260 minority would be 50 Republican senators. So getting rid of the filibuster is a terrible

00:47:41.820 idea. Getting rid of the filibuster in a 50-50 Senate is an absurdly terrible idea. And

00:47:47.980 yet this is what Kamala Harris wants to do. That's what I just find. Yeah. Sure.

00:47:52.840 Can I fill up on the horse race numbers on the Senate side? Because the conventional analysis

00:47:56.920 is that the Republicans, of course, will win West Virginia, where Joe Manchin is retiring.

00:48:01.000 West Virginia went overwhelmingly for Trump. And so that'll be a GOP pickup. And then they're

00:48:05.860 looking at Montana as their next best, the closest thing to a shoe-in. They think Tester

00:48:11.120 will go down and that the Republicans will win in Montana and that will give them actual

00:48:16.060 control of the Senate at 51. But I don't know. There's been some scary polling out of Florida

00:48:23.340 on Senate numbers. There's been some scary polling in other states. Like, I'm starting to wonder

00:48:31.780 whether the red states that have been counted as like, for sure, they're going to hold on here.

00:48:36.880 Is this too much to count on? I will leave the question of Florida to Charlie because he's there.

00:48:42.700 Look, you remember the hype around Beto O'Rourke six years ago. And he had more money than anybody

00:48:50.260 else had ever had and more gushing press coverage than anybody else had ever had.

00:48:54.880 And Ted Cruz won by three percentage points. Not a lot. It's a lot closer than we're used to seeing

00:48:58.600 in Texas. But there's this one. They keep hearing that in Wyoming, Deb Fisher is in Nebraska. I don't

00:49:06.800 think. I noticed the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee hasn't put money into any of these races

00:49:12.200 yet. And, you know, they have to make some very tough choices. So when they start dumping money

00:49:16.700 into Texas, by the way, Texas and Florida are expensive states to run. They got a lot of media

00:49:22.520 markets, very high advertising rates. So if you want to move the numbers in Florida, you got to

00:49:26.760 be putting in a couple of million minimum. So when they start putting lots of money into those two

00:49:31.580 states, then I'll believe them. Nebraska is a much cheaper state. They still haven't put any money

00:49:35.820 there. So I'm kind of skeptical. The Democrats are like, oh, this guy who nobody's ever heard of is

00:49:40.740 about to pull off the upset of the century. Look, I totally get, you know, Republicans blowing a

00:49:46.980 Senate race that they should not blow. There's plenty of history of that. So I get that. But

00:49:51.340 we haven't even gotten to talk about like Bernie Moreno in Ohio, who now is looking closer to Sherrod

00:49:56.480 Brown. McCormick is looking closer to Casey. There are a bunch of other news for Republicans.

00:50:03.500 That's all good news for Republicans. Right. So and if Trump has any coattails, you know,

00:50:08.000 if he goes in, if he manages some wave like that Gallup poll shows, that's good for all those

00:50:13.500 states. It could go the other way. My gosh, it's I mean, it's getting down to it. It's getting really

00:50:17.600 close, you know, to the to the day. It's hard to believe September 25th. It's actually my son's

00:50:23.000 15th birthday. So happy birthday, Yates. Guys, thank you both so much. Great to see you.

00:50:30.580 Thank you. Always enjoy it, Megan. Thanks for having us.

00:50:34.100 You know how it is like when it's your kid's birthday. You think not only about the fact that they're

00:50:37.440 getting so much older, but you think back on the in this case, 15 years you've had with them and

00:50:42.000 they were such little babies and where you were 15 years ago and it goes by in an instant.

00:50:49.240 And yet I'm so grateful that they still live with me. Yay. I get to hold on to them for a few more

00:50:55.460 years at least and hopefully beyond because I'm infantilizing them and not trying to foster any

00:50:59.320 independence so that they stay with me. Anywho, when we come back, Nicole Shanahan,

00:51:04.680 looking forward to speaking with her for the first time. A lot of RFKJ news to get to,

00:51:09.460 including and separate apart from her own life story, which is fascinating. Do you owe back taxes?

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00:52:50.720 Joining me now for the first time, Nicole Shanahan, Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s running mate and host of the

00:52:56.780 Back to the People podcast. She's had a fascinating life and political evolution and we are so excited

00:53:03.380 to have her here. Nicole, thanks so much for joining us. Thanks for having me, Megan. It's a pleasure

00:53:08.820 to be here with you today. I can't get over what an interesting background you have and your

00:53:14.840 political evolution in particular is fascinating. Like a lot of people who are going to pull the

00:53:21.120 lever for Donald Trump in November, you've spent most all of your life as a Democrat, supporting

00:53:29.260 Democrats, even with donations and fundraisers. So tell us a little bit about your migration over to Team

00:53:37.340 Red. Yeah. And I just want to clarify, I consider myself an independent, like 51 percent of Americans

00:53:44.120 today. And that number is growing. People are re-registering. They're giving up their party

00:53:49.480 affiliation. They're leaving the duopoly. And I very much consider myself part of that trend.

00:53:56.600 And the power within that trend is to be able to pick a candidate based on the issues they represent,

00:54:02.780 as well as where we'd like to see the direction of the country going. So it's not a your team versus

00:54:10.000 my team. It's who's really thinking about Americans, putting, you know, a real understanding of the

00:54:17.900 American family at the forefront, individual liberty at the forefront, and preserving what makes this

00:54:24.020 country so great. And so my political evolution, really, from Democrat to independent, it's come

00:54:34.180 from many directions. But I will say the overarching summary is that something is very, very wrong right

00:54:41.080 now in this country. And there is a group of people, corporatists, cronyists, you can call them

00:54:48.140 what you want to call them, transhumanists, anti-women. They seem to be collecting around the

00:54:54.280 Democratic Party. And it's something I started noticing as early as eight years ago. And so many

00:55:02.840 inconsistencies that I was seeing, even from areas of climate change, which they hold themselves up as

00:55:11.920 caring so much about. The inconsistencies in how they handle social justice work. They seem to focus

00:55:19.500 on these pro-crime initiatives without really fixing the economy and lifting communities up.

00:55:26.040 So these are areas that I care so deeply about and very invested in. Still am. I still believe that we

00:55:34.800 have to take care of our environment, care about carbon and the climate situation. And there's ways

00:55:42.960 to do it without adding toxins to our environment. So there's all these common sense ways to address

00:55:50.000 these issues that the Democrats have completely abandoned for something else. And that something

00:55:56.980 else is deeply ideological. It is anti-human in many ways. It's anti-nature.

00:56:04.800 And it's something I can no longer support in good faith.

00:56:09.400 This reminds me so much of when I met Michael Schellenberger on this show four years ago,

00:56:14.080 when we were just getting started. We didn't even have video at that time. And he, like you,

00:56:19.000 was on the left. He was a Democrat. He worked for Greenpeace. He was part of the whole Solyndra

00:56:26.520 initiative at the Obama White House, trying to get all this green energy out there. And as someone who's

00:56:32.620 who was drawn to that work out of his love for Mother Earth, he slowly but surely had the veil brought

00:56:40.920 down on how these efforts that were being pushed through by the government were doing more harm than

00:56:47.360 good. You know, the windmills and the solar panels and the toxins and the amount of land that they have

00:56:53.660 to claim and vegetation and bird life and other animal life that has to be wiped out and really just

00:57:00.180 came to it very naturally and organically. And that is what makes somebody a true proselytizer

00:57:04.880 on certain issues, right? Because you tried it the other way. You kind of believed you were a believer

00:57:10.600 only to realize you were wrong.

00:57:14.180 Well, I actually have been working in climate change and evaded a lot of the energy projects

00:57:22.260 because I have a background in economics and the private market will solve for energy issues through

00:57:28.400 innovation. That's my background. I'm an intellectual property attorney. I've studied the evolution of

00:57:34.600 human innovation. I created an AI to study every patent humans have ever created. And I understand the

00:57:43.060 cost basis economics of certain innovational projects. So energy is something that the government doesn't

00:57:50.520 actually have to be involved in because the private market will oftentimes innovate to solve these

00:57:56.800 issues. Obviously, there's coordination and the grid and regulatory issues. But in a perfect private

00:58:03.260 market environment, you don't need the kind of government spend that the Democrats have been throwing so much

00:58:12.380 money at. And so where I spent my time in climate work is looking at farming and soil, because it's the only

00:58:23.960 category in climate change mitigation that is a true win-win. If you do it right, you eliminate toxins from the

00:58:35.620 environment. You create food security. You create small businesses. And it is an area, however, that is going to

00:58:45.520 require some government assistance to get away from large corporate farming and large corporate

00:58:51.300 centralization. We have to rewrite how we think about the farm bill. We can't keep supporting big ag and

00:58:59.040 agrochemical companies. And a small injection. I mean, look, our current farm bill is going to be over a

00:59:07.040 trillion dollars at this point. It's going to be the largest farm bill in history. And if they just spent

00:59:12.360 one percent of that on regenerative agriculture, it would do more for climate issues than any of the

00:59:21.600 Inflation Reduction Act or the Green New Deal would do.

00:59:25.700 So why don't they? Why don't they? Because what we had, I watched the whole hearing,

00:59:30.700 just so the audience knows, there was a great hearing on Monday. Casey Means was there. RFKJ was

00:59:35.520 there. Callie Means. Casey's brother was there. He's been amazing on this issue. Jillian Anderson,

00:59:40.340 a bunch of people who our audience, sorry, Jillian Michaels, a bunch of people who our audience would

00:59:44.860 know and have been on the show talking about some of these issues. Casey gets into regenerative

00:59:50.200 agriculture and farming in her book, Good Energy, which everyone should buy and read.

00:59:55.020 But you saw what the media did afterward. I mean, they couldn't have cared less. And the one

01:00:02.340 publication that really wrote it up, The Atlantic, which bothered to send somebody to it, was absolutely

01:00:08.080 sneering and disgusting in its coverage of it, calling it the woo-woo caucus. Screw you, Elaine Godfrey,

01:00:16.660 because some of us have kids whose very lives are going to depend on these reforms that they were

01:00:23.440 discussing at this hearing. But the reason The Atlantic has to crap on this messaging, Nicole,

01:00:30.260 is they're owned by Steve Jobs' widow. And she's very close with Kamala Harris. And they decided to

01:00:39.580 take a nonpartisan event that spoke about things like the soil and the problems and turn it into

01:00:45.960 some sort of ad for Trump, which it wasn't. And then, without considering any of the ideas,

01:00:52.700 dumped all over it.

01:00:56.080 Yeah. Laureen Powell Jobs, I've met her a few times. I know Emerson Collective a bit. I've crossed paths

01:01:04.740 with them. They're here in Silicon Valley. My office used to be around the corner from their office in

01:01:09.060 Palo Alto. And I think that she is stuck in something. She's created something that she

01:01:17.940 didn't intend to create. You have to recognize all the stuff we're seeing with immigration that came

01:01:23.140 through her foundation, Emerson Collective. She's she I think out of her root wants to do the right

01:01:32.640 thing. But she's working with bad actors. And I don't think I think she's aware of some of it,

01:01:41.960 but I don't think she understands the full scope of it. And I say that because it I ran into similar

01:01:49.160 issues as well. When I started working in the criminal justice reform space, I came in as a good

01:01:54.460 actor. I wanted to reform the infrastructure of the justice system. I wanted to make sure there was

01:02:00.780 balance in it. I wanted to make sure taxpayers weren't overspending on incarceration. And something

01:02:08.080 happened. Bad actors came in and other forces came in. I will say we do have foreign influences

01:02:15.900 that are directing some of these funds in very bad ways. And, you know, next thing I know,

01:02:24.240 we have all these anarchists claiming to be criminal justice reformers. And they've somehow

01:02:30.700 taken over our politicians who are supposed to be overseeing these funds. And what do you mean?

01:02:36.080 I guess the biggest funder is George Soros, who's not an anarchist, but he's a steeply problematic man

01:02:41.940 who's determined to fundamentally change this country for the worst.

01:02:48.260 I would say that some of the stuff he's done is is very much in the mindset of anarchy,

01:02:53.840 anti-government or sorry, you were saying foreign actors, foreign actors. Yes. So if you look at some of the

01:03:03.180 things that are coming in through TikTok, TikTok's a really great example of how young people are being

01:03:10.740 influenced today. Some of the content creators are being paid by Chinese companies. And you're like,

01:03:19.160 why? Why are some of these influencers getting two hundred thousand dollars a year to talk about

01:03:24.040 American social issues? And and you look, I think that we need to do a deep, deep dive into

01:03:34.780 exactly how these funds work, what what they're doing to our country. But in the area of criminal

01:03:42.480 justice reform, you know, there's evidence that BLM, for instance, received money from groups affiliated

01:03:49.940 with Chinese entities. And if you look at what BLM did to the criminal justice reform effort, which was

01:03:58.740 going very well, we got the crime rate down. We got incarceration rates down. Communities were doing

01:04:05.420 better. This was around 20, 2016. And then by 2020, it turned into just this hellscape. And the good

01:04:15.180 faith actors who are trying to fix the criminal justice system, who are making progress, no longer

01:04:20.660 could make progress anymore. The DAs that were supposed to be doing this great reform work became

01:04:28.040 unreachable. And I will say, having been on the front lines of that and seeing it and the dynamics

01:04:36.460 and the grassroots groups and and the messaging changing and becoming radicalized, it's it sounds

01:04:44.640 more anarchist than it does a good faith approach to making a fair justice system.

01:04:54.180 Yeah. Well, listen, I I take back that George Soros was not is not an anarchist because he's funded

01:04:59.900 enough upset and rioting across the shores of America that you could make the case just the

01:05:07.740 foreign actor thing through me. But I mean, right now, he's obviously behind all these soft on crime

01:05:13.220 prosecutors. He doesn't want them to prosecute any crime. He's behind a lot of this, the pro-Palestinian

01:05:18.640 protesting that we're seeing on college campuses. He hasn't seen rioting or protesting in America.

01:05:23.620 That's on a left wing cause that he doesn't want to get behind. And his son just had a meeting with

01:05:28.160 Tim Walls. His son is just like him and is now very close to the Harris Walls campaign. So I hope

01:05:34.700 you like George Soros if you're voting for Kamala Harris, because you're going to get a whole lot more

01:05:38.340 just like it. But you I, too, I'm an independent. But I've told my audience I'm voting for Trump.

01:05:44.680 Um, you're able, notwithstanding, coming from the left to see the truth about the MAGA movement.

01:05:52.480 And you put out, I think, the best ad I've seen about MAGA since it was born. I've had many of my

01:06:01.060 friends who consider themselves MAGA forwarded to me so that we would talk about it. And it's absolutely

01:06:07.880 beautiful. Here is part of it, the MAGA people. Stop 33.

01:06:16.420 Across the Atlantic in the North American country of the United States lies a fascinating and often

01:06:21.340 misunderstood collective. From its northeastern cities to its midwestern towns to its expansive

01:06:27.560 west, this courageous group of individuals are most notably known for their unwavering patriotism.

01:06:32.860 Join us as we explore the fascinating world of the MAGA people. Contrary to what we had been told,

01:06:39.740 we found the MAGA people to be warm, loving, and even rather cheeky at times.

01:06:45.780 As we spent time with the MAGA people, we learned that their mantra,

01:06:49.180 Make America Great Again, is an optimistic belief that the United States will once again prosper by

01:06:54.160 returning to its founding principles of a government by and for the people.

01:06:57.600 It's quite brilliant, Nicole, like the sort of the, you know, the 1950s feel of like

01:07:04.200 foreign space alien has come down to America and investigated this odd group. And so absolutely

01:07:12.460 lovely. So why? And there's, you're doing a series of these ads and they're all this quality and this

01:07:18.480 effective. So why did you get behind that? Like, how did that come to you?

01:07:22.200 Yeah, it was very organic. We didn't hire a sophisticated team at all. We have one editor

01:07:30.660 that we work with. Each of those films cost about $7,000 to produce. That one and TDS were my original

01:07:41.800 idea. And it's in part just comes from a place within my own being of trying to figure it out

01:07:51.240 and explain my own bias. You have to understand, I was fully deep in the Kool-Aid of the left-wing

01:08:00.400 media and believed everything they were telling me about MAGA being a domestic terrorist organization.

01:08:08.860 And the programming was so deep, Megan, that I would see someone with that MAGA cap on and I would feel

01:08:18.620 tension and fear inside. And this is very true for many of those who are still stuck in that mindset

01:08:26.740 and stuck in that programming. And we attempted a few approaches to the who are the MAGA people

01:08:33.620 or what is MAGA. And a lot of them were very serious. Some of them didn't sway me. So I needed

01:08:49.100 something that was going to engage someone from my background and was going to deliver a gentle message

01:08:57.560 and was going to deliver it in a way that felt truthful. And so when we made this one, it was

01:09:06.780 very much about these BBC and investigative anthropological studies of these other people.

01:09:16.720 Because that's what's happened in America is that we've been so divided that we're almost

01:09:22.680 different clans. We have to try to figure out how to understand each other in narratives

01:09:29.660 that our consciousness has seen before. And so these BBC anthropology trips seemed like a really great

01:09:41.400 way of helping us rediscover one another here in America.

01:09:46.400 So good. It's so well done. You referenced TDS. I think our audience knows that stands for Trump

01:09:54.320 Derangement Syndrome, which is a real thing. And that one's excellent too. Here's a bit of that in

01:10:00.780 SOT 31. Are you or your loved ones suffering from illnesses such as TDS, also known as Trump

01:10:07.640 Derangement Syndrome? Do you dismiss or deny the current issues facing our country, such as historic

01:10:13.080 inflation, illegal immigration, corporate corruption, World War III escalations, and the chronic disease

01:10:19.080 epidemic? Are you willing to elect someone who was the least popular vice president in modern history

01:10:24.320 and who offers no policy or vision for America simply because your brain keeps telling you anyone

01:10:29.540 but Trump? If so, you might be struggling from TDS. Introducing Independence. Independence allows you

01:10:37.620 the freedom to finally think independently once again. So good. So do these drop only on YouTube? And

01:10:44.660 how can we get these in front of all of your California neighbors? So interestingly, TDS went super

01:10:53.620 viral in the first 48 hours and has now been viewed close to 90 million times. And then the Who is the

01:11:03.360 MAGA peoples? Didn't go quite as viral, but people used it to send to their family members or friends or

01:11:14.800 colleagues. And they said, look, I know you think MAGA is a domestic terrorist organization, but just take

01:11:21.740 two minutes of your day and watch this video because this is my understanding of who MAGA is.

01:11:27.480 Um, and, and, and that's been really heartening for me to hear the feedback on because that really was

01:11:34.820 the intention of these, um, short videos, just something that, you know, would really tickle people's,

01:11:43.700 um, humor and curiosity, um, and create a forum for having open conversation with one another again,

01:11:51.840 because it is so divided. Uh, we're working on one right now, which is really a love letter from

01:11:58.860 my heart to moms and families out there, um, and to grandparents, uh, because boomers are really hard

01:12:08.300 to reach in this country. Liberal boomers are some of the most stubborn when it comes to changing their

01:12:14.940 opinion on Donald Trump. They're hooked to legacy media. I call it boomer news.

01:12:21.840 Right. That's good. And, you know, this one it's called, um, the dear dad ad and it's a family

01:12:31.880 story. It's my family story of, of my sister-in-law, um, trying to communicate with her dad,

01:12:40.560 who's a never Trumper there in Arizona. Um, and her son, uh, little boy, Jack was severely vaccine

01:12:49.720 injured and almost passed away. Um, and this was a clear case of vaccine injury. Uh, and, you know,

01:12:58.300 so dear dad is, is just this gut wrenching letter she wrote, um, that we're going to try to get out

01:13:06.620 there and help people understand that, you know, this is one election cycle, but we've got bigger

01:13:13.580 battles to fight right now. Um, we've got to uncover the depths of the corruption. Um, and

01:13:21.080 this is not vindictive. This is not a vindictive journey. Uh, we're not trying to, you know,

01:13:28.000 throw anyone in prison for the rest of their life, but we, we want freedom. We want our liberty back.

01:13:34.440 We want honest healthcare. We want our children protected. We don't want to see any more of these

01:13:41.080 one and a half year old, two and a half year old babies struggling to breathe on ventilators.

01:13:47.860 Yeah. I mean, obviously the affinity for RFK junior becomes obvious when you get to this part of your

01:13:55.340 story. Um, and you know, he's been, it's for us, it's been great to watch him from being totally

01:14:01.280 banned on all social media to being, you know, called at this congressional hearing as a true

01:14:06.180 authority on children's health and to be an important endorsement for Donald Trump and really

01:14:12.320 potentially, uh, an important member of the next administration. Um, I wanted to ask you because

01:14:18.600 your, your personal story is equally interesting to your professional, uh, and political evolution.

01:14:24.600 You used to be married to one of the co-founders of Google, Sergey Brin, who is reportedly worth

01:14:30.620 130 billion dollars. And the reason I think this is relevant to what we're discussing today is on

01:14:37.180 Thursday night, we had this interview. Um, that's an air quotes by Oprah Winfrey of Kamala Harris,

01:14:46.020 Oprah Winfrey. She may not have as much money as Sergey, but she's got some $4 billion. And I was saying

01:14:53.120 to the audience, she has become completely unrelatable. She has no idea what the problems of

01:15:01.440 the working class are. The old Oprah who we fell in love with in our living rooms back in the late

01:15:07.780 eighties, early nineties is gone. She's evaporated. There is a new elite David Geffen yacht riding version

01:15:16.500 of her trying to pretend to be that other person. And I read in one of the articles that you, uh,

01:15:22.900 participated in, in that you spent some time in that world that, you know, you didn't come from

01:15:29.480 anything, but suddenly you're married to one of the richest people on earth. And you felt that

01:15:35.140 you've, you talked about how you felt that disconnection, like the astronaut who gets his

01:15:41.400 line tethered from the space ship. Can you expand on that? Yeah, it's, uh, I think you're spot on about

01:15:50.520 Oprah. Um, and you know, Megan, I've heard you talk about it too, going to these parties with

01:15:56.460 celebrities and talking very superficially and how everyone's looking at you, but they're also

01:16:03.100 looking behind you to see who their next social target is. Um, and so I spent eight years in that

01:16:10.980 world and I, I had, I had been a self-made young woman. I grew up poor in Oakland, spent time on

01:16:21.580 government assistance, uh, parents didn't work, never had a home or a rental of their own. I lived in

01:16:28.180 grandparents' homes and I worked really hard. I believed in a merit-based society. I found my way

01:16:37.680 to Stanford university as a post-doctoral fellow in law and computer science was building a very

01:16:44.800 sophisticated early AI. Uh, it was a large language model on, on the patent corpus. And, and I met

01:16:53.280 Sergey and, and that was 2014. And you have to remember in 2014 tech could do no wrong. It was still

01:17:02.240 considered, um, this breakthrough, fun, lighthearted exercise in human endeavor. And, and it's, it was

01:17:14.620 fun here in the Bay area. It was, it was, um, you know, people could experiment and, um, it was very

01:17:22.660 liberal and liberating. Uh, and I saw things change here in Silicon Valley. I, I, you know, I can talk

01:17:30.200 about the wealth too. I mean, when you have unlimited wealth, you think differently and you think bigger

01:17:36.420 sometimes, but then you can also lose sight of, of what the world is really like for, for everyone

01:17:44.240 else. And, um, I will say that, you know, Silicon Valley changed a lot in 2016 after the election. Um,

01:17:55.980 Trump won, uh, Hillary lost tech was blamed for it and things changed really dramatically. Um,

01:18:06.780 the risk profile of being a tech elite changed. I saw families around us who went from small security

01:18:15.740 teams to small armies. And, and that's the reality amongst these top billionaire families is that

01:18:24.300 their security teams rival, uh, I mean, they're better than the secret service for sure right now.

01:18:30.500 Well, say much, but we hope so. Yeah. But, but these are, um, really sophisticated, uh, personal armies

01:18:42.680 and they, the wealthy in this country today, uh, are more organized and more powerful,

01:18:53.740 than the United States government, in my opinion. Um, it's really scary armies. They've got their

01:19:00.000 guns. They've got their self-protection. They've got their compounds. They've got their kids set for

01:19:04.180 life. You know, that I think is why you said it was in an interview with people. What I learned in

01:19:12.180 the marriage was it's nearly impossible to have mega wealth and be deeply grounded. And yet these people

01:19:19.480 are everywhere, you know, look at who zoomed into that so-called town hall, Meryl Streep, right? Chris

01:19:27.740 Rock, Julia Roberts, Oprah Winfrey, not one of them is going to have to live with the consequences

01:19:36.120 of a Harris walls administration when it comes to criminal justice, when it comes to the way we eat,

01:19:44.000 when it comes to the second amendment, when it comes to anything. They're immune to it. They're

01:19:50.180 completely immune to it because they can send their children to private schools where, uh, parental rights

01:19:57.320 still exist. They can move their children from expert healthcare provider to expert healthcare

01:20:06.580 provider. They can evade vaccine mandates. They can evade lockdowns. I saw it. I lived it.

01:20:13.600 I was able to evade some of the lockdowns because we were so immensely wealthy. We could rent entire

01:20:21.200 airplanes out. Um, well, yeah, had private airplanes as well, but you could fly anywhere. You could go to

01:20:27.880 Fiji. You could get a special license. And, and, and that's, that really disgusted me. I'm, I,

01:20:33.600 I think I got to a point in my experience living this double standard where, um, I was surrounded by

01:20:43.100 all of these public health experts that were locking everybody else down, but we were able

01:20:47.500 to kind of just evade all of these lockdowns. Um, I, I, it's wrong. It's morally and ethically wrong.

01:20:56.700 And I would love to see a world in which some of these elites open their eyes and just take

01:21:05.520 into consideration what life is like for, you know, the, the mom who owns the small retail shop.

01:21:12.000 I was just talking to you here in California, who has high school aged girls, um, in the public school

01:21:17.760 system and coming home with English homework where they interview their parents on gender ideology.

01:21:26.480 Um, and if you're conservative, right. Or not even conservative. Many of these Californian

01:21:34.020 parents are liberals. They believe in Liberty, uh, and freedom and being who you are. But now they're

01:21:42.880 having to play these games, um, with the school where they have to show that they're buying into

01:21:48.760 the gender ideology just so that their kids can get by every day so that the families aren't singled

01:21:53.700 out. Um, and, and so they're playing into these pronouns, even though they don't necessarily believe

01:22:00.680 in, in the pronoun ideology, but they, they have to teach their kids that at school, you have to be

01:22:07.000 one way, but you're still allowed to have your own belief system. Um, and that being a woman or a

01:22:14.360 girl or heterosexual is just as important, right? It's, it's, it is who you are and you shouldn't be

01:22:22.000 ashamed of it. Um, but you know, being in a public school system right now is really, really hard. And

01:22:28.400 the elite left have no idea what the rest of the country is going through. Um, you know, many of

01:22:37.460 them, when I tell them that there are sandboxes and bathrooms for furries, they're like, what the

01:22:42.700 hell are you talking about? Nicole? I'm like, no, this is real. This is the media didn't believe

01:22:50.380 that Kamala Harris had said in her ACLU questionnaire in 2019, she wants taxpayers to fund sex change

01:22:57.240 procedures, operations and medications for prisoners and illegal immigrants. And the media thought that

01:23:04.780 was so outrageous. It had to be a lie. It was written in her own hand, right? They they're so

01:23:12.140 out of touch with what's happening in this realm that the gender thing is just one. They can't

01:23:17.340 possibly believe it. By the way, Oprah Winfrey doesn't even have children. So she doesn't even have to

01:23:23.080 worry about this being done to her offspring. She has none, which is particularly galling. It may be

01:23:28.900 why she didn't ask one question about that, but she was very interested in abortion. Let's make sure

01:23:34.440 we have the right to abort the babies, but we're not going to spend any time on what's being done to

01:23:39.040 them once they're born. Yeah. Yeah. And I run into, um, this, uh, chasm, this ideological chasm

01:23:49.980 on the left where they become very myopic on these issues and they sometimes can't see past the veneer,

01:24:00.820 the things that are marked a human rights issue. And then a veneer put over them, they'll, they'll

01:24:07.380 abide by completely, um, wholeheartedly and with blinders up. And so unless you experience some of

01:24:15.980 these things firsthand, you don't truly understand the impact and implications. And I saw a lot of

01:24:23.800 this, um, in my work in women's health and women's reproductive research, uh, cause I wanted to,

01:24:33.680 to fund foundational science into ovarian function and how to keep healthy women healthy longer.

01:24:40.400 I also was very curious as to why so many women were having infertility issues. Um, and then I

01:24:47.160 wanted to figure out if there were ways that we could provide fertility services that were not

01:24:53.520 thrusting women into egg freezing and IVF. There's gotta be this intermediate ground we could be looking

01:25:00.760 at. And so I put, I, I contributed a hundred million dollars into this and I will say finding

01:25:09.080 scientists who want to do this work for women, um, to allow women to have natural childbirth when

01:25:19.460 they're ready in their forties, you know, women in their forties have been having healthy babies for

01:25:24.280 a very long time. This is not an unusual, odd concept. Um, but I was, I kept running into these groups

01:25:34.500 groups that use the word reproductive longevity and fertility to infer assisted reproductive technology,

01:25:44.380 which is very, which is a very big jump. Um, and I kept running into these trans humanists,

01:25:51.960 I'm going to use the word trans humanists, but you can use whatever word you want. Um, you can just,

01:25:56.620 you know, artificial reproductive technology is, is a very common one, but what's falling under that

01:26:04.100 umbrella of assisted reproductive technology is truly science fiction. Um, but it's here, it's real.

01:26:10.020 It's, it's, it's, uh, considered science today. And you know, you have individuals like, um, Martine

01:26:18.560 Rothblatt, who's a transsexual, um, uh, was a man is, is now identifying as a woman sits on the board of

01:26:29.420 the Mayo Clinic, authored the first gender bill, runs something called a, um, a xenotransplantation

01:26:38.200 farm. Um, which I'm afraid, uh, yeah, it's, it's definitely something that we should all be aware

01:26:45.760 of is happening. Um, but xenotransplantation technology is a way of moving genetic material

01:26:52.620 around and it can be animal genetic material. It can be genetic material from multiple humans.

01:27:00.420 Um, and you know, it's well on path to, um, creating a new species, a new species. I don't

01:27:09.180 know if you can call them humans, um, but, but it, you know, the science is working right now

01:27:14.840 and I haven't seen any attention being put on this. Uh, it's, it's, you know, it's such a far

01:27:24.800 cry from the kind of science that I care deeply about, which is, you know, women's health. Um,

01:27:32.400 but, you know, I think a lot of the funds that they're saying, this is for women's reproductive

01:27:37.780 health is, is being, um, and, and moved over to these more transhumanist reproductive efforts.

01:27:48.380 And is this, is this the, um, where they're growing babies outside of the womb, right from the,

01:27:54.300 like the baby never is in the mother. They're in some incubator from conception, that kind of thing.

01:28:00.680 There's so many different ways to mix it. Um, but that's one of the ways that that's the artificial

01:28:07.120 womb, which is the FDA is looking at an application for it. They're claiming, no, no, we're not using

01:28:14.240 it for, um, you know, two men to have a child yet. As of right now, we're specifically using it for

01:28:22.120 premature babies. So there's now companies that are relying on premature babies in order to prove

01:28:29.500 the efficacy of this technology. So we have these really perverse incentive systems. Um, like we need

01:28:36.140 sick moms in order to progress some of the science, we need sick babies in order to progress artificial

01:28:42.160 womb testing. Um, it's, uh, this, just so the audience knows, this is exactly what they were

01:28:49.500 saying over and over again at this hearing on Monday and what Dr. Casey means said in her book

01:28:54.140 and on this show and on Tucker show, which is the whole system, the whole system, the way we eat,

01:28:59.880 the way we're fed, the way the grocery stores are stocked, the way the doctors approach medicine,

01:29:04.520 the way they teach med students, it's all set up without the incentive to actually improve our

01:29:12.220 lives. It's got the opposite incentive that, I mean, to be perfectly frank, a sick child is like

01:29:19.940 a golden ticket for these industries because now he's with the doctor forever and a big pharma patient

01:29:27.800 forever. And there's no interest in getting to what you're talking about. Why, what, what can we do to

01:29:34.560 help the actual individual maintain fertility longer as opposed to having artificial means come in and

01:29:41.300 help? What can we do to actually start cutting back on the, the colon cancers that Gen Z is getting

01:29:48.600 at strange rates? It's not just about treating colon cancer, coming up with a faster cure. It's about

01:29:54.820 what are they eating? What are we, what's in the environment? What there's no interest in figuring

01:30:01.120 out the causes, which is a true tragedy. It's an epidemic and a tragedy, which is why I love what

01:30:08.720 you are doing. I will take a break right there. It's as good a place as any to come back quick ads.

01:30:14.580 And then back to Nicole Shanahan. So happy to have her here today. Every big election makes us think

01:30:20.500 about the future. It is a great reminder to plan for your family's future too. A lot can happen over

01:30:25.540 the next four years and life insurance provides peace of mind, ensuring your loved ones are

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01:31:12.340 or click the link in the description to get your free life insurance quotes and see how much you

01:31:17.040 could save policygenius.com. I'm Megan Kelly, host of the Megan Kelly show on Sirius XM. It's your home

01:31:26.640 for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political,

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01:32:12.480 That's Sirius XM.com slash MK show and get three months free. Offer details apply.

01:32:19.620 You've probably been hearing a new phrase lately. Make America. Make America. Make America. Make

01:32:26.660 America. Make America. Make America. Make America healthy again. Make America healthy again. But what

01:32:34.400 does that mean? Well, turns out a lot of things. It means embracing things like this and this and this

01:32:43.880 It's a little less of this and a little more of this. Less of this. More of this. Less of this. And this. Even this.

01:33:05.840 So, yeah. Turns out it's a lot of things that, well, seem pretty great.

01:33:18.020 Make America healthy again. For the listening audience, it was saying more things like fruits

01:33:24.560 and vegetables and exercise and some sunlight and some action with your significant other and less

01:33:32.480 processed foods and toxins and all sorts of other things that are bad for you. Pills, nonstop medication

01:33:40.200 and so on. That gets right to the heart of it, Nicole. It doesn't surprise me one bit to learn that

01:33:46.220 you and RFKJ connected. This has been, you know, obviously one of his big things too. And I wonder

01:33:52.940 if you think, obviously his candidacy did not wind up working out because he was stopped by the

01:34:00.180 Democratic establishment. You guys were stopped. But do you think that this message, this make America

01:34:06.400 healthy again message is here to stay? Because I've been disheartened at how the media has just

01:34:12.920 dumped on it or ignored it. I think it's definitely here to stay. And I'm optimistic because I've watched

01:34:21.520 the progression of MAGA. MAGA is truly a grassroots organization. It's not tied to Donald Trump. They

01:34:29.520 picked Donald Trump as someone that they've identified as representing MAGA values, but they

01:34:36.540 will pick someone, you know, after Donald Trump's hopefully next four-year term. And I think MAHA will

01:34:45.240 be on a very similar trajectory. It will be a movement that will outlive any candidates. You know,

01:34:55.860 Bobby Kennedy is a fantastic leader for spearheading it and creating this movement.

01:35:03.060 I'm dedicated for my lifetime. I'm sure that Callie and Casey Means are dedicated. We've got incredible

01:35:11.500 partnerships across this country of individuals, of farmers, of scientists, of doctors, of media

01:35:20.600 personalities who look at this as a non-negotiable need. And as long as that's the case, you know,

01:35:30.140 we can be ignored by the what is the dying mainstream media. I mean, look at their numbers. They're abysmal.

01:35:36.740 And we're going to take MAHA and it's, I call it DTV, direct to voter issue. We don't have to go through

01:35:44.640 a party. We don't rely on any representative member of Congress to, to be a spokesperson for this. This is

01:35:52.140 something that originates from the individual. It originates from the home. It's lived experience every

01:35:59.160 single day. It's people coming together and talking about these incredible changes they've made in their own

01:36:05.600 lives that have resulted in previously unreachable goals. Uh, people getting off of insulin injections, people

01:36:15.420 curing their skin diseases, um, women who were told by an IVF clinic that they didn't have enough functioning

01:36:26.080 follicles, all of a sudden having a healthy baby naturally. So these are the, these are, these are the

01:36:34.860 underpinnings of MAHA. Um, and I'm very excited it's here. I'm glad that people like you, Megan, um,

01:36:43.200 are excited by it as well, because I do think that the independent media, and this is something that

01:36:50.260 gives me great optimism for our future is that the, the independent journalistic, uh, movement,

01:36:57.000 it's, it's also not going anywhere. It's just going to grow. That's right. It's just going to grow.

01:37:02.940 And, and they're very open-minded shows like Joe Rogan and Tucker and so many others. I mean,

01:37:07.880 Huberman, there's been tons of independent Peter Atiyah, uh, independent broadcasters who are

01:37:14.180 spending a lot of time on this. So the word is getting out. I did think it was amazing watching

01:37:20.080 the hearing the other day. I was fortunate because I didn't get to watch it on Monday, but then I had,

01:37:24.760 uh, a personal thing I had to take care of yesterday. So I had the time and I watched all four

01:37:28.600 hours of it. And I recommend if you go to YouTube, you guys, you can watch this whole thing and you'll

01:37:32.540 learn a ton, but, um, Bonnie Harry was there, Bonnie Harry. And, um, she was amazing. So she

01:37:40.160 got up there and you may have seen this clip on, uh, Twitter guys, but she was holding up the,

01:37:44.660 the difference between, uh, Kellogg's cereal with the, you know, the colors in it in the United States

01:37:51.280 versus the UK. They don't have the colors. They're not using the food dyes over there.

01:37:55.180 If they dye food over there, they use carrot or they use beet over here. It's all chemicals.

01:38:00.220 That's getting into our kids' bloodstreams and bodies at an early age and a world of

01:38:04.640 microplastics and, uh, toxins and pesticides. And I mean, we're, they're just overloaded.

01:38:11.100 And here was a great moment for her in SOP 40.

01:38:14.480 In the U S there's 11 ingredients in the UK. There's three and salt is optional French fries.

01:38:19.620 An ingredient called domethylpolysiloxane is an ingredient preserved with formaldehyde,

01:38:24.460 a neurotoxin. This is Skittles. Notice the long list of ingredient differences,

01:38:30.380 10 artificial dyes in the U S version and titanium dioxide. This ingredient is banned in Europe because

01:38:37.180 it can cause DNA damage. My name is Vani Hari. And I only want one thing. I want Americans to be

01:38:43.660 treated the same way as citizens in other countries by our own American companies.

01:38:53.660 If you watch the whole thing, you really, you wind up angry. And Cali leader said,

01:39:01.340 if a significant portion of the people who hear this would just stop buying Kellogg's because they're

01:39:07.720 doing this to fruit loops, it would actually change the national conversation to be these,

01:39:12.400 these companies will not stop doing this to us. Unless as you point out from the ground up,

01:39:16.840 the consumers say, I'm not buying your shitty cereal. Not one more day. Will you shove your

01:39:23.000 weird chemicals into me or my kid? Yeah. And, and just, you know, but, but talk about how hard that

01:39:32.300 is if you're from a lower income household and a lower income neighborhood in the United States,

01:39:40.580 where you can only get cereal with those ingredients, because it's the only cereal that

01:39:48.080 you can both afford and access at your local grocery store. And then add the fact that many

01:39:53.460 of these ingredients are highly addictive. So we have these true addicts in our homes and they're

01:40:00.520 little people, they're eight year olds and they're running around your house, dysregulated,

01:40:07.120 screaming and tantruming, looking for that fix. Um, that is the situation in this country right now.

01:40:16.960 And it's abysmal. Um, you know, even look at the autism rate, autism rates are going down Marin

01:40:22.940 County, California, one of the wealthiest counties in the state, uh, has autism rates going down and

01:40:29.840 we're trying to investigate why. Could it be food? Could it be, they changed the vaccine schedule.

01:40:35.740 Um, but it is wealthy individuals that have figured it out and, and their community as a whole is

01:40:43.880 benefiting, but that kind of research isn't getting out and it's certainly not getting out to low income

01:40:51.000 communities. So not only that, but we're funding certain meals for these low income kids at school

01:40:58.560 and they're filled with highly processed foods, ultra processed foods, sugar. It's disgusting.

01:41:04.960 We're, we're, we're doing this to low income kids, um, everywhere with our government assistance on

01:41:12.120 this, on the store shelves and so on. Please come back. We're out of time, Nicole, but would you please

01:41:17.380 come back? Cause I want to continue this discussion. There's so much more I would love to get to with you.

01:41:21.840 Oh, thank you, Megan. It's, uh, been a real pleasure. And anytime I'm happy to come back,

01:41:28.420 I, you know, I'm not going anywhere. I have my sights set on helping my state of California heal,

01:41:34.000 get healthy as well, fix our economy. We're in tens of billions of dollars of debt under Gavin

01:41:38.860 Newsom's tutelage. Uh, so yeah, I'm not going anywhere. Happy to come back anytime.

01:41:44.240 I'm thrilled, thrilled to hear that. All the best. Okay. Tomorrow we'll have Carrie Lake and James

01:41:51.260 O'Keefe on his new documentary. Wait for that. See you then. Thanks for listening to the Megan

01:41:57.840 Kelly show. No BS, no agenda and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - September 25, 2024

Polls Shift Toward Trump, and How Dems Abandoned Their Voters, with Nicole Shanahan, Charles C.W. Cooke, and Jim Geraghty ｜ Ep. 897

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