The Megyn Kelly Show - Real Story Behind Hegseth ＂Double Tap＂ Reporting, and Katie Miller vs. Abby Phillip Throwdown, with Mark Halperin ｜ Ep. 1203

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00:01:00.420 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:01:12.140 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly.

00:01:13.780 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Monday.

00:01:16.180 I hope you and your family had a great Thanksgiving.

00:01:19.260 We did.

00:01:20.160 It was like the real Thanksgiving, but it felt like the fake Thanksgiving because we already

00:01:23.960 had our fake-sgiving with our extended family, and so it was super easy.

00:01:27.580 We actually went out to this lovely restaurant and somebody else cooked, which, you know,

00:01:31.200 for my family, that's a gift to us all.

00:01:33.780 Caught a little bit of a cold, but I'm on the mend, and now we are back with a packed show.

00:01:39.640 I'm so excited.

00:01:40.440 It's December.

00:01:41.040 For those of you who are listening, we have in the red studio now our Christmas trees,

00:01:46.000 our white, like, well, they're green Christmas trees with fake snow all over them and little

00:01:50.560 white blinky lights.

00:01:51.700 It makes me so happy.

00:01:53.580 We have our Christmas decorations up already.

00:01:56.080 I wonder if you do too.

00:01:57.420 Doesn't it just improve your mood?

00:01:59.560 Here in Connecticut tomorrow, we're supposed to get some snow.

00:02:02.380 Oh, I want to, I miss snow.

00:02:04.900 At heart, I'm just a Syracuse girl.

00:02:06.560 That's where I live the first 10 years of my life.

00:02:08.440 I miss snow and sledding.

00:02:11.080 I love Christmas.

00:02:12.340 I know you do too, so let's take a moment on this December 1st.

00:02:16.900 You only get some 80 to 90 to 100 of them if you're lucky in your life.

00:02:21.180 And enjoy the most wonderful time of the year.

00:02:25.380 And no, it is not too early to play the Christmas carols.

00:02:28.580 Even my boys had to admit I'm allowed to play them now.

00:02:31.860 Okay, just before we went to break, a group of Democrats dubbed the Seditious Six by the Trump

00:02:39.300 administration released a video urging military members to disobey orders they think are illegal.

00:02:45.160 It came out of nowhere.

00:02:47.400 No one, even the left-wing press, started, you know, asking questions about this.

00:02:50.860 No one knew what the hell are the orders that they're talking about, and they didn't know.

00:02:55.240 These lawmakers got embarrassed repeatedly, thinking that the media would just go along with

00:02:59.260 this, like, of course, it's Trump, so he's issued illegal orders.

00:03:03.440 They didn't.

00:03:04.520 And it got to the point where even Caroline Levitt complimented the mainstream media for

00:03:08.440 asking questions of these Democrat lawmakers who then looked like morons, unable to name

00:03:14.820 the alleged illegal order.

00:03:18.000 So that's basically how it went down.

00:03:20.260 And then, of course, since their friends had been embarrassed, meaning the Democrats, the

00:03:25.480 media went to work trying to find some new reporting that actually would suggest there had been

00:03:30.880 an illegal order, and lo and behold, they came up with it.

00:03:33.260 I mean, it's just like—I'm sorry, but we would be remiss if we didn't point out, can

00:03:38.620 you imagine the Washington Post doing this in order to actually run cover for our Republican

00:03:46.960 administration as opposed to expose one?

00:03:49.780 Can you imagine if they had done something like this, this, you know, next-level reporting

00:03:53.940 to get to the bottom of how many orders have been issued and where and how, and which one

00:03:57.680 may have crossed the line when Joe Biden was the president?

00:04:00.920 It's just so on the nose.

00:04:03.660 We'll get into what they've come up with.

00:04:05.420 Plus, the spin continues after the tragic shooting in D.C. of two National Guard members

00:04:10.560 by an Afghani national last week.

00:04:13.160 Joining me now to discuss it all, Mark Halperin.

00:04:15.280 He is the host of Next Up with Mark Halperin on the MK Media Podcast Network.

00:04:19.600 Go and subscribe right now.

00:04:21.120 It's a great, great show.

00:04:22.680 I love listening to Mark's opening talking points.

00:04:25.160 He keeps me centered and up-to-date on the latest Inside the Beltway.

00:04:29.740 So go ahead and subscribe right now, wherever you get your audio podcasts, and on YouTube

00:04:33.080 at NextUpHalperin, H-A-L-P-E-R-I-N.com.

00:04:39.440 Believe it or not, Christmas is sneaking up fast.

00:04:42.560 Can you believe it?

00:04:43.260 And let's be honest, between shopping, travel, and endless to-do lists, it can be chaos every

00:04:48.480 year.

00:04:49.180 But we don't have to just survive it.

00:04:51.260 We can reclaim the peace and purpose Christmas was meant to bring.

00:04:55.420 Somewhere along the way, Advent became a marathon of gifts, dinners, and decorations.

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00:05:18.260 A young woman's life upended, a man protecting his family, and a corrupt ruler trying to destroy

00:05:24.260 it all.

00:05:25.040 And yet, they found peace.

00:05:27.360 This is not about a hallmark moment.

00:05:29.560 It's about finding stillness and divine peace in a broken world.

00:05:33.620 Try Halo free for three months at halo.com slash megan.

00:05:40.380 Mark, welcome back.

00:05:41.980 Good to be here.

00:05:42.800 And I broke the rules and started listening to the Christmas music on Tuesday.

00:05:47.860 Yes.

00:05:49.260 Now, let me ask you a question about that.

00:05:50.840 Do you listen to only Christmas music, like when you're in your car, or do you go back

00:05:55.420 and forth, you know, for the next three weeks?

00:05:57.620 No.

00:05:58.140 When I'm in the car, it's the SiriusXM holiday channels.

00:06:01.080 And, you know, I like Sinatra, the Carpenters.

00:06:05.100 I like pretty much any artist I've ever liked.

00:06:08.760 I just love spinning up the Christmas stuff.

00:06:10.560 And then, you know, if I'm being let down, I just switch to the phone and program myself.

00:06:16.540 Yes, same.

00:06:17.580 I love SiriusXM has made channel four now, the Holly channel.

00:06:22.500 They've got the 15 is now the Fallon Christmas.

00:06:25.260 That's a new one.

00:06:25.940 But those are good ones that I haven't always heard.

00:06:28.300 And then I love traditional Christmas, which I think is 71, Sinatra's 70, which also is

00:06:33.160 a good channel, by the way.

00:06:34.360 It's a great channel.

00:06:35.180 Those are the three I listened to.

00:06:36.460 We were just away for Thanksgiving.

00:06:38.920 And so I had the car and I just locked in on those three.

00:06:42.320 I saved all three channels.

00:06:43.960 Yes.

00:06:44.640 It's like it gets you right in the mood.

00:06:46.900 And soon we'll be busting out the Christmas specials.

00:06:49.360 Do you unleash those in a certain way?

00:06:51.120 I'm curious.

00:06:51.560 I'm a linear TV guy when it comes to Christmas specials.

00:06:55.980 I like to watch them as they're offered up by the majors.

00:06:59.080 Oh, old school.

00:07:00.900 Okay.

00:07:01.240 Do you have a favorite?

00:07:01.900 Uh, I love Rudolph and I love, uh, the Charlie Brown one.

00:07:07.960 Oh, interesting.

00:07:08.980 Oh, yeah.

00:07:09.920 I love Santa Claus is coming to town.

00:07:12.320 Yeah.

00:07:12.600 The Burger Meister Meister Burger.

00:07:14.060 That's a great one.

00:07:14.860 Except we fast forward through the scene where Jessica sings.

00:07:18.440 It's a bad one.

00:07:19.440 You know?

00:07:19.640 Yeah.

00:07:19.860 I agree.

00:07:21.000 It's a little warbly.

00:07:22.440 I love Playmation.

00:07:24.160 And I tried to explain to my son, like, that when I was a kid, Playmation was the equivalent

00:07:28.020 of, like, 4D graphics, but I just, there's something about the Claymation I just find,

00:07:34.320 like, any, any Claymation that's got Santa whiskers, I just love.

00:07:37.940 Yes.

00:07:38.680 It's good stuff.

00:07:39.380 And I'll give you one more before we move on to the news, which is, I grew up watching

00:07:42.500 this.

00:07:42.860 It's, I'm going to be honest, it's not well made.

00:07:45.320 You, you see that when you're an adult in a way that you don't when you're a kid, but

00:07:48.400 I still love it.

00:07:49.520 And it's called The Christmas That Almost Wasn't.

00:07:52.860 It's so good.

00:07:54.220 You can find it on, at one point, you couldn't find it anywhere before we had apps all over

00:07:59.040 our TVs.

00:07:59.820 And I had to order it from some remote website in Italy.

00:08:04.580 I don't know.

00:08:04.980 I got it.

00:08:06.060 Anyway, it's so cute.

00:08:07.980 It's about this guy named Mr. Prune who lives to ruin Christmas.

00:08:12.040 And he's harassing Santa and Mrs. Claus at the pole, at the North Pole.

00:08:16.360 And Santa has to go get a job down in like every man town. 0.99

00:08:20.360 He takes one at a toy store.

00:08:22.260 Mr. Prune won't let up.

00:08:23.740 He's a major antagonist, this guy.

00:08:26.220 It's just such a fun one.

00:08:27.720 And of course, for me, it brings back childhood memories.

00:08:29.800 I don't know that one, but I like the Dickensian name of Mr. Prune.

00:08:33.600 Yes.

00:08:34.140 There you go.

00:08:34.860 We just watched, I'd never seen it, The Dog Who Saved Christmas.

00:08:37.620 You ever seen that?

00:08:38.700 No.

00:08:40.520 It's hokey, but it's really good.

00:08:42.920 Recommend.

00:08:43.420 Okay.

00:08:43.840 Thank you for that, sir.

00:08:44.640 And I do need to mention one other thing.

00:08:48.320 I mention it every year, but my favorite Christmas special of all time is Christmas in Connecticut,

00:08:54.380 which is from 1947.

00:08:57.100 Barbara Stanwyck.

00:08:58.920 Hello, black and white.

00:09:00.620 They have a sleigh that they ride.

00:09:02.940 That's me hitting the horses with the straps.

00:09:05.800 Through the Connecticut countryside, the snow.

00:09:09.260 Oh, it's a very weird and inappropriate love story that somehow you root for anyway.

00:09:14.680 And just the whole setting of it makes me feel like it's Christmas time.

00:09:18.620 I love that.

00:09:19.080 I'll tell you, I know we said we both keep saying one more, but I have to do one more,

00:09:22.700 which is the Bing Crosby, David Bowie, Little Drummer Boy.

00:09:26.140 Do you know that?

00:09:26.540 Yes.

00:09:27.480 That's a great one.

00:09:28.940 It's magical.

00:09:30.140 That truly is one of the greatest of all time.

00:09:33.000 I watched that 10 times during Christmas.

00:09:33.680 Yeah.

00:09:33.980 It's incredible.

00:09:34.620 See, now that is an appropriate use of the term magical.

00:09:38.240 This morning on AM Update, which you sometimes host on, we talked about the Cory Booker engagement,

00:09:44.300 and Cory Booker used the term magical to describe, I think, their date or their second date.

00:09:51.720 Then when he proposed, he had Mariah Carey playing Mark.

00:09:55.360 He took her out on their first date to Broadway to see a female empowerment play, Suffragette,

00:10:02.060 the Sufs.

00:10:03.100 I don't, I've got questions, Mark Halperin.

00:10:05.840 What's happening with Cory Booker?

00:10:07.400 Well, first of all, they gave the exclusive pictures and TikTok and backstory to the New

00:10:13.840 York Times, but it read like People Magazine.

00:10:16.680 It was just like this classic there.

00:10:18.620 There we're seeing, those of you watching on YouTube, you can see.

00:10:22.940 And the whole thing that you just outlined and you hit most of the highlights, I felt

00:10:26.940 was written by ChatGPT, like composed the TikTok of Cory Booker's whirlwind romance with

00:10:35.620 this young lady.

00:10:36.900 Yes.

00:10:37.820 Now, they made her Jewish in the real version, which was a little bit of a surprise.

00:10:43.520 Yeah.

00:10:44.500 Did not know that.

00:10:44.880 I don't know.

00:10:45.900 Yeah.

00:10:46.480 Yeah.

00:10:46.920 They had like a split wedding.

00:10:49.000 They got married at City Hall and then they had like a show wedding that was half Jewish

00:10:52.820 and half whatever it is he is.

00:10:55.640 Half Jewish, half gay.

00:10:58.020 Yeah.

00:10:58.620 There you go.

00:10:59.040 That's what everybody's thinking.

00:11:00.560 I mean, everyone I know who knows him is surprised, but not surprised.

00:11:04.940 And, you know, he is, he has gone to New Hampshire in the last couple of months and he is kind

00:11:11.440 of an under discussed person of ambition.

00:11:13.780 You remember James Carvel's famous line about running for president when somebody says, well,

00:11:18.360 that person ran or they really get before they really run it run again.

00:11:21.660 And James said, running for president's like having sex.

00:11:24.880 You don't just do it once and then say, ah, I did it.

00:11:27.500 I'm done.

00:11:28.020 Don't need to do it again.

00:11:29.700 So.

00:11:30.180 I didn't hear it.

00:11:30.720 I've never heard that.

00:11:31.540 That's very funny.

00:11:32.120 Yeah.

00:11:32.780 Now, now, in this case, as you said, some people are raising the question of what kind

00:11:36.300 of sex are we actually talking about?

00:11:38.380 But because I heard on his way to New Hampshire, he swung by Chelsea in Manhattan and also Provincetown,

00:11:44.600 Massachusetts.

00:11:45.020 It's just a it's unconfirmed report.

00:11:47.180 Allegedly, Mark.

00:11:48.460 Good places to raise money.

00:11:50.380 Look, people have talked about his personal life forever.

00:11:54.300 Um, and, uh, you know, you don't need to have the world's most sensitive gaydar to have

00:11:59.480 a point of view here.

00:12:00.320 But, um, but he's now like Tim Scott, he's legally wed.

00:12:04.660 And, um, I wish the young couple all happiness.

00:12:07.520 Me too.

00:12:08.420 Me too.

00:12:09.120 However short lived it may be, may take him right through to 2028 and the primary season

00:12:14.680 and not beyond.

00:12:15.400 But I hope I'm wrong and I'm just a cynical mofo and I've misread the entire situation.

00:12:20.500 Though I do view Mariah Carey as a blaring red siren warning sign for any woman dating

00:12:27.780 a man.

00:12:28.380 That's no man should select that song.

00:12:30.720 Wasn't Cher or Mariah Carey.

00:12:32.340 I mean, Cher or Liz Liza Minnelli.

00:12:34.780 So.

00:12:35.060 Yeah, true.

00:12:35.980 Equally damning.

00:12:37.160 You raise a good point.

00:12:38.320 Um, it's the trifecta.

00:12:39.800 In any event, good luck to them.

00:12:41.620 They're going to need it.

00:12:42.840 Um, okay.

00:12:43.820 Back here, we've got the Democrats have stumbled upon their alleged illegal order and they're

00:12:49.980 thrilled.

00:12:50.480 They're so excited.

00:12:51.760 Um, what they're saying is that on one of those Venezuelan drug boat strikes, we struck

00:12:57.720 the boat, that there were two survivors, drug dealers, uh, driving the boat or on the boat

00:13:04.020 who were then clinging to the remnants of the boat and that on Pete Hegseth's order,

00:13:08.960 they then dropped a second bomb to take out the two survivors and then two more bombs

00:13:14.900 to, um, sink the boat. 0.58

00:13:16.940 Because I guess we, we want no remnants of the boat whatsoever.

00:13:20.380 And, um, Trump was asked about this on Air Force One and Trump, uh, denied that, that

00:13:26.340 Pete had done it.

00:13:27.260 He actually said, Pete told me that, that he hasn't done it, that he, that he did not agree

00:13:31.660 to that.

00:13:32.400 And now we've had two, uh, inquiries opened in Republican controlled bodies of Congress,

00:13:39.740 the House and the Senate.

00:13:40.640 So the Republicans, or at least making a show of seeming interested in whether this happened

00:13:46.200 because many military experts have said they don't see how this could be legal.

00:13:52.280 Like that you are, you're not allowed, they say, and this is still under investigation

00:13:56.280 about what happened.

00:13:57.300 But if, if what I just said is true, and that's an if, that it would be clearly illegal because

00:14:03.260 you're not allowed to kill people who survive an initial strike and who are, even if they're

00:14:07.680 enemy combatants, kind of hanging on, or in this case, possibly literally hanging on for

00:14:12.400 dear life.

00:14:12.940 Your thoughts on it?

00:14:13.660 Well, I contain multitudes on this.

00:14:16.580 First of all, I'm a big fan of stopping the invasion of drugs into the United States.

00:14:22.020 And I think our children and our grandchildren are going to be so confused when they read

00:14:27.100 in the history books that we had presidents who did nothing about it and just sat back and

00:14:31.280 let people send drugs into the country that killed people and hurt productivity and just

00:14:36.120 all the scourge of things that drugs do.

00:14:38.940 So I'm a big fan of anything that addresses that.

00:14:41.740 Number one.

00:14:42.120 Number two, I think President Trump has proven that if you use force aggressively and you

00:14:48.960 use it in a way that minimizes or doesn't cause any loss of American life, that it can be a

00:14:54.960 great deterrent.

00:14:56.100 We saw that, at least potentially with Iran.

00:14:59.420 We've seen it in other cases and we're seeing it here.

00:15:01.680 So people who say, well, you know, they're not interdicting all the drugs, they're just

00:15:06.320 getting a few boats.

00:15:07.520 No, they're sending a message to people whose families and individuals are going to be

00:15:12.000 more reluctant to go to the high seas with drugs destined for the United States or elsewhere.

00:15:16.440 So I don't want to I don't want to be misunderstood.

00:15:19.100 I think those two things are good.

00:15:21.040 But I'm also old fashioned about two things.

00:15:23.640 And I think they're really fundamental to what America is about.

00:15:26.980 Number one.

00:15:28.040 I don't think the president of the United States should kill people indiscriminately or our

00:15:32.620 forces should kill people indiscriminately in violation of law and American tradition.

00:15:38.520 And that may be what's happened here in this particular case.

00:15:43.280 But but but it's clearly the case in general.

00:15:45.380 And I think there's been insufficient debate about it, insufficient scrutiny about it.

00:15:49.520 And number two, super old fashioned and kind of diluted.

00:15:52.980 I think Congress is a co-equal branch and in some cases a superior branch when it comes to

00:15:57.700 the declaration of war.

00:15:58.760 And I think I think no American, whatever you call your politics, no American should be

00:16:03.840 complacent about presidents.

00:16:05.720 All the post-World Cold War presidents have done this using their power and disregarding

00:16:12.280 Congress's role in declaring war.

00:16:14.400 And I think that's what's happened here, too.

00:16:16.040 And I think that's at a minimum should be examined.

00:16:19.100 Well, that's that touches on an interesting dynamic that's popping up more and more in

00:16:24.240 the press about whether there's some group of Republicans that are dejected and demoralized

00:16:31.400 on Capitol Hill right now, Mark, because they feel like a rubber stamp to Trump.

00:16:35.940 They feel like they can't challenge him or they're going to get primaried and chased out

00:16:40.440 of Congress, MTG style.

00:16:41.820 And so they they do feel like they've ceded their their constitutional authority because

00:16:48.880 they're all so afraid of the 800 pound gorilla.

00:16:51.480 Now, is that an actual thing right now or is that just a leftist media fever dream?

00:16:57.040 No, it's an actual thing.

00:16:58.180 It's not it's not based on, you know, talking to Democrats or talking to Don Bacon or Tom

00:17:05.580 Massey.

00:17:06.360 They're they're they're Trump loyalists who are unhappy.

00:17:09.360 Now, some of them are unhappy because of principle.

00:17:12.460 And you don't see, as we did over the weekend, normally in the Trump era, you don't see the

00:17:17.740 Republican chairs of the applicable committees in the House and Senate saying this needs to

00:17:22.360 be investigated and saying it in a bipartisan way with the Democratic ranking members.

00:17:26.640 And they're doing that because they are troubled by this on principle.

00:17:30.940 Most of the unhappiness amongst Republicans, again, not a Democratic or media creation, is

00:17:35.580 is concerned about the midterms, concerned that they're going to lose the House majority

00:17:39.800 because of the economy and a feeling that the White House is insufficiently moving to

00:17:47.740 address what voters are concerned about, particularly how much things cost.

00:17:51.680 So those are two different areas of unhappiness, one principle, one pure politics.

00:17:56.160 And again, I think the political one is probably if you could quantify unhappiness, probably a

00:18:01.340 greater source right now amongst Republicans.

00:18:03.960 Right.

00:18:04.500 Because while we were talking about this a little on the tour, that it's in a way, it's

00:18:10.520 it's so much more fun to be in the opposition, you know, and just like lay criticisms on the

00:18:16.040 people in power.

00:18:17.620 But then when your team is in power and there's infighting and there's all sorts of articles

00:18:22.860 every day about how terrible they are.

00:18:24.680 And I know it's from mostly the mainstream, which hates Trump and hates everybody in the Trump

00:18:29.000 administration, but it's aggravating and it's irritating and it can be kind of a downer.

00:18:34.340 And I feel like the Republican Party is going through that right now.

00:18:37.300 What do you think?

00:18:38.720 Yeah, I mean, there's there's sort of three main areas.

00:18:42.000 Right.

00:18:42.420 One is about dealing with the economy.

00:18:46.280 There's this word that the president doesn't much like affordability.

00:18:49.780 But these are these are tough problems.

00:18:52.280 The cost of housing, the cost of food, the cost of energy.

00:18:55.660 These are tough issues for any president to deal with.

00:18:58.100 So that's one source of of anxiety and infighting, too, is there's some cabinet members like

00:19:04.580 Pete Hegseth, like Cash Patel, the head of the FBI and like Kristi Noem, who have now had

00:19:11.180 to face multiple stories that are super negative about their stewardship that, again, are not

00:19:15.560 from the deep state.

00:19:16.580 They're not from Democrats.

00:19:18.020 There are some cases published in the legacy media, but not always.

00:19:23.520 So today, for instance, New York Post has a story about Cash Patel by Miranda Devine.

00:19:27.580 I saw it.

00:19:28.660 We should talk about it.

00:19:29.500 It's devastating.

00:19:30.540 It's devastating.

00:19:31.580 And again, you've got to consider the source.

00:19:33.500 Miranda is a great reporter and writer and columnist.

00:19:36.640 She's not writing a negative story based on the deep state sources.

00:19:39.540 She's just that's what concerns me.

00:19:40.960 She's so good.

00:19:42.040 Yeah.

00:19:42.300 So that's number two is you've got some cabinet members.

00:19:44.820 And then the president's poll numbers just aren't good.

00:19:47.800 And again, that's not the liberal media.

00:19:49.780 It's not fake polls.

00:19:51.120 Every poll, including private Republican polls show.

00:19:53.760 It's a snapshot of where we are.

00:19:55.420 It doesn't mean they'll be bad next year.

00:19:57.080 It doesn't mean he can't turn things around.

00:19:59.180 But his poll numbers are really bad right now.

00:20:01.820 And that's just all the one that just hit is from Gallup, which is, you know, the mother

00:20:04.900 of all polls.

00:20:06.100 Forgive me.

00:20:06.400 I'm having a cough drop.

00:20:07.620 But that that has approval rating down to 36, a new second term low.

00:20:12.360 Keep going.

00:20:13.460 Yeah.

00:20:13.600 And amongst independents, I think in that poll, it's 25.

00:20:16.900 Yeah.

00:20:17.040 And again, this is not it's not liberal.

00:20:20.160 It's not it's not anti-Trump.

00:20:22.560 If his numbers are that bad at the midterms, they'll lose the House.

00:20:26.140 They might lose the Senate.

00:20:27.420 So that just causes anxiety.

00:20:29.480 And this White House has done a very good job of not just making Republicans in Congress

00:20:34.200 afraid of them, although they're good at that, but making them feel they're being communicated

00:20:38.420 with.

00:20:38.760 And right now they're claiming they don't feel that way.

00:20:41.800 Uh, the White House takes issue with that and says they're communicating all the time.

00:20:45.160 And it's just it's just an excuse to to to rail against the White House.

00:20:48.880 But this is not this is not a great time right now for the president's political team.

00:20:54.560 But there's there's a you know, there's an interval here to improve things.

00:20:57.820 But at the moment, there's there are these sources attention.

00:21:00.760 And when you see somebody like Miranda Devine write a piece like that about Kash Patel, who's,

00:21:06.440 you know, the ultima mega loyalist, it just makes everybody think, huh, you know, like

00:21:11.340 a horror movie, like the the the the villain or the the enemy or whatever you want to describe

00:21:17.520 it.

00:21:17.780 They're in the house.

00:21:18.720 They're not outside the house.

00:21:19.840 They're in the house.

00:21:21.360 Well, the FBI report she she references confused me because this is what she her headline is

00:21:29.380 opinion damning report labels FBI rudderless ship under Kash Patel with him and Dan Bongino

00:21:36.320 more concerned with building personal resumes, which is a quote.

00:21:41.340 And then she she bases her report on it's called a 115 report, quote, source reporting

00:21:48.380 and analysis of the FBI under the leadership of FBI Director Kash Patel, a pulse check for

00:21:54.720 the first six months for U.S. Senate Committee on the Judiciary and Chairman Chuck Grassley

00:21:59.660 and U.S. House Committee on the Judiciary and Chairman Jim Jordan by the National Alliance

00:22:04.740 of Retired and Active Duty FBI special agents and analysts.

00:22:08.580 So I remain unclear on whether this was requested by the Senate committee, whether this is just

00:22:14.400 a bunch of like ex FBI people who are disgruntled and predictably don't like Dan and Kash or what

00:22:22.380 this is sounds so official.

00:22:23.560 Well, I don't understand whether it is, but what we do know is it's very nasty.

00:22:29.820 It it really goes after Kash.

00:22:32.860 They have a passing shot at Dan Bongino trying to diminish him, but mostly it's focusing on

00:22:37.440 Kash Patel.

00:22:38.000 And the thing that they're really zeroing in on is what they say is like a vanity, I guess, of his

00:22:45.880 a vanity that they talk about how when he flew out to the Charlie Kirk staging, like the FBI staging

00:22:52.740 in the wake of it, he was insistent on getting an FBI jacket brought to him on board the plane

00:22:59.340 before he disembarked and that he apparently did not have his own, quoting here, FBI raid jacket with him.

00:23:07.400 He refused to step from the plane without wearing one that FBI special agents at the Salt Lake City

00:23:12.860 field office busy working on the Kirk case, quote, had to stop and ask around to find an FBI raid jacket,

00:23:18.140 a medium sized one that would fit.

00:23:20.460 When a jacket belonging to a female agent was delivered to Patel on the plane, he complained

00:23:25.320 that, quote, two areas on the upper sleeves did not have Velcro patches attached.

00:23:31.040 And then he would not leave the plane, quote, until he had two patches to cover those areas.

00:23:36.600 Quote, so members of an FBI SWAT team took patches off of their uniforms and ran those patches over

00:23:41.920 to Patel at the airport.

00:23:43.600 The patches were then attached to the loner FBI raid jacket and Patel disembarked from the plane.

00:23:48.560 And the director was not happy with the way the investigation was going.

00:23:52.140 He had an expletive filled tirade, whatever.

00:23:54.380 All that's kind of ridiculous.

00:23:55.540 Of course, people yell in these tense times.

00:23:57.260 But the jacket story, if true, it's not great.

00:24:01.280 Now, look, I had the same reaction you did, too.

00:24:03.960 Like, I'm reading this story.

00:24:05.160 I've read my share of stories about stuff like this.

00:24:07.680 I don't remember this kind of quasi-official anonymous report that's handed over like that.

00:24:15.200 I just don't remember anything quite like that, not just with the FBI.

00:24:18.560 I don't remember anything like that.

00:24:19.800 They wrote like a serious, rigorous report with all these details.

00:24:23.040 But it's not official, but it's kind of official.

00:24:25.460 And then, again, the question of Miranda.

00:24:28.680 She's the only one, as far as I know, who's reported this so far.

00:24:31.600 She's not anti-Trump.

00:24:32.880 She doesn't write for an anti-Trump publication.

00:24:34.740 And yet, with a few to-be-sure paragraphs of positive things, it's a very negative story.

00:24:41.340 It's a very negative report.

00:24:42.980 So you've got to ask yourself, you know, how did this thing get done?

00:24:46.960 And how did it end up with Miranda?

00:24:48.780 And how did Miranda decide to write it up?

00:24:50.760 These are not the only stories like this about Kash Patel.

00:24:56.420 There's other stories, but most of them have circulated in, you know, places like the Washington

00:25:00.560 Post, the New York Times.

00:25:01.580 So it's a bit of a mystery.

00:25:03.020 But you've seen the same things with Pete Hegseth and, to some extent, with Kristi Noem, which

00:25:08.300 is, you just, again, it's not liberal media.

00:25:12.160 It's people who love the president, who care about the president, who are using different

00:25:17.800 outlets, in this case, the New York Post, to put out their problems.

00:25:22.880 It's hard to escape the conclusion that the people are motivated by a desire to get the

00:25:28.800 president to make a change in personnel.

00:25:31.040 And he's not done that yet.

00:25:32.320 And it's not clear, you know, if these will have an impact.

00:25:36.400 It's always, today we had a decision from the Third Circuit Court of Appeals before we

00:25:41.580 came on the air, saying that Alina Haba cannot be the acting U.S. attorney for a district 1.00

00:25:49.100 in New Jersey.

00:25:51.080 And this is separate from the Tish James and James Comey challenge, which is still making

00:25:57.040 its way up to the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals.

00:25:59.140 And we'll see whether that court affirms the lower court decision that she, too, was, that

00:26:04.260 the prosecutor there was also not appointed correctly.

00:26:07.360 That's Lindsay Halligan.

00:26:10.360 So this is a separate thing.

00:26:11.480 It's Alina Haba.

00:26:12.300 She was Trump's personal lawyer.

00:26:13.420 And he made her acting U.S. attorney within this district in the Northeast that answers

00:26:18.480 to the Third Circuit Court of Appeals.

00:26:19.980 Third Circuit Court of Appeals came down unanimously.

00:26:21.800 Three-judge panel saying they don't have the power to appoint her.

00:26:25.780 She's got to go.

00:26:26.740 She was not properly appointed.

00:26:28.000 She's not the proper U.S. attorney. 0.56

00:26:29.400 This is not a great decision for Trump.

00:26:31.100 It's not a great decision to the extent it gets considered by the Fourth Circuit that's

00:26:34.680 deciding something similar, though not identical, with Lindsay Halligan.

00:26:38.660 But the first thing I did when I got it, Mark, was to look at who are the judges?

00:26:42.580 Who was appointed?

00:26:43.540 Who were they appointed by?

00:26:44.420 And in today's day and age, what you need to see is not just a Republican president.

00:26:49.740 You need to see Trump, that it was a Trump appointee, if Trump has any fighting chance.

00:26:55.560 If you see George W. Bush appointee, George H.W. Bush appointee, Reagan, you're not going

00:27:01.920 to see it.

00:27:02.380 You might as well see it be a Barack Obama judge.

00:27:04.720 It's almost that bad.

00:27:06.340 They all hate Trump.

00:27:08.200 And that court was two W appointees and an Obama appointee, so not surprisingly.

00:27:14.420 We knew how it was going to go, and that's exactly how it went.

00:27:17.860 And that's kind of what I think when I see a lot of the Republicans leaking on Trump,

00:27:23.600 because clearly this came from somebody who's more, I think, right-wing aligned.

00:27:27.060 They went to Miranda.

00:27:28.140 I could be wrong, but it's not just Miranda.

00:27:30.520 I see some of these reporting in other right-wing papers.

00:27:33.820 And I think it's the Bush-era people who, just because they're part of the Trump administration

00:27:41.360 in some way, shape, or form, like they're currently at the FBI, does not mean that they're pro-Trump.

00:27:46.960 And if you were there, even if you're a Republican, but you're a more George W. Bush Republican,

00:27:51.340 you might go to the Post or the Wall Street Journal in particular and leak something very

00:27:56.840 damaging to Trump.

00:27:57.740 So it will look like it's, you know, right-on-right violence.

00:28:00.460 It'll look more credible to the right wing, that is.

00:28:02.700 But you really hate him just as much as the left hates him.

00:28:06.260 And what you almost never see is Democrats doing this to Democrats.

00:28:11.180 I'm like, you're telling me there weren't terrible stories to leak about Pete Buttigieg,

00:28:15.180 Bull, you know, or Merrick Garland, for that matter, or Chris Wray, even.

00:28:19.420 There were.

00:28:20.380 It just doesn't happen.

00:28:23.280 Well, it does happen with Kamala Harris. 0.75

00:28:25.560 So there's at least one exception there.

00:28:27.420 There were stories like that about her and her staff.

00:28:30.180 Um, uh, I think that, um, it's a sad thing, but it's true. 0.99

00:28:36.520 Judges are result oriented.

00:28:37.780 And I used to say it all the time after Bush v.

00:28:40.160 Gore and, um, and lawyers and various political lawyers would call me and say, no, no, judges

00:28:47.160 are fair.

00:28:47.740 Justices are fair. 0.52

00:28:48.680 They follow the law.

00:28:49.760 No, they're almost all result oriented.

00:28:51.820 And I think that's just horrible.

00:28:53.060 They should be ruling based on the law.

00:28:55.100 And, you know, no matter who nominated them for the court in this case, you're, you're

00:28:59.920 absolutely right that it's a cheat for a reporter to say Republicans are saying if they're Bush

00:29:05.740 Republicans, because, you know, the Bushes and the Bush, you know, team Bush are not fans

00:29:10.300 of Donald Trump, you know, any more, as you said, than the team Obama is.

00:29:14.580 But I'll say again, there are Republicans now who are unhappy with Kash Patel, who are Trump

00:29:19.340 Republicans.

00:29:19.900 There are Trump Republicans who are unhappy with Donald Trump right now, uh, some about,

00:29:24.440 um, uh, the economy, some about Epstein.

00:29:28.240 Um, so, and, and you see that reflected, not just at this, at the elite level, which is

00:29:32.900 I'm talking about, but you see that in the Gallup poll, but also in other, even Republican

00:29:37.060 polls, Republicans for various reasons are unhappy, even Trump Republicans with the president

00:29:42.120 right now.

00:29:42.840 And his first order of business is to turn that around, uh, not just overall, but on issues.

00:29:47.760 Republicans need to be confident about the economy and his policies.

00:29:50.960 They need to be confident about Epstein and his view there, et cetera.

00:29:54.380 So he, he, he no doubt has problems with Bush Republicans and Reagan Republicans, but he's

00:30:00.740 got some problems with Trump Republicans too now.

00:30:02.740 And I know that because, because I talked to him directly.

00:30:05.640 Well, we have a year to go before the midterm.

00:30:08.700 So it's, it's reversible, but it requires some honesty right now about what exactly are the

00:30:15.260 problems and are they fixable like the economy, like a better message and actual better policy

00:30:20.380 on healthcare, like not running around saying we need all these Chinese immigrants here and,

00:30:26.080 uh, in our universities and that we, that we, we need H1B visas to abound because our workers

00:30:32.720 can't do it.

00:30:33.520 Like that interview with Laura Ingram, that's the kind of stuff that etches away at the base.

00:30:38.240 They do not want to hear that stuff at all.

00:30:40.380 Um, even though the more chamber of commerce Republicans do like it.

00:30:44.980 And that's why he says it.

00:30:46.060 Okay.

00:30:46.220 Let's keep going though on this, um, story about the alleged illegal strike.

00:30:51.420 The left is now very, very concerned, very concerned about a president or his department

00:30:57.040 of warhead ordering an illegal death, an illegal killing of someone deemed an enemy combatant,

00:31:04.200 except they didn't much seem to mind during the Obama era.

00:31:09.220 I was on all the time talking about these strikes that Obama was doing with the drones.

00:31:13.900 I remember O'Reilly and I having many, many debates about this and, um, hold on.

00:31:19.040 We've got some with Obama bragging about how good he was at killing people.

00:31:24.000 And, oh, he told you that in your book too.

00:31:27.240 Hold on a second.

00:31:27.980 Where is that soundbite, Debbie? 0.76

00:31:29.840 I know that one's not on tape, but the Obama drone strike is.

00:31:33.480 This is where he was.

00:31:35.060 Thought seven is where he was joking about how good he was with the predator drones.

00:31:39.220 At the White House Correspondents.

00:31:40.760 And there's a joke, but it's based on reality because he really was taking out not just alleged

00:31:45.760 terrorists, but Americans who had had no due process with his drones. 0.52

00:31:51.860 Here's the joke.

00:31:52.500 And then we'll get to the bigger news you made with him in your book.

00:31:56.580 The Jonas brothers are here.

00:32:00.400 They're out there somewhere.

00:32:03.240 Sasha and Malia are huge fans.

00:32:05.120 But, uh, boys don't get any ideas.

00:32:09.480 I have two words for you.

00:32:11.680 Predator drones.

00:32:14.560 You will never see it coming.

00:32:20.020 Okay.

00:32:20.600 So they're perfectly willing to yuck it up.

00:32:22.240 I didn't see, like, a six-senator video saying,

00:32:26.460 Oh, disobey illegal orders in case you get one to take out the Jonas brothers.

00:32:32.100 Um, but with you, Mark, he, he, he took that joke and made a very serious comment that showed

00:32:38.220 his real feelings about his use of those drones.

00:32:40.180 And what did he say?

00:32:41.900 Well, he didn't say it directly to me.

00:32:44.020 He said it.

00:32:44.760 It was, we reported that he said it to his ace.

00:32:46.660 He said, I guess I'm pretty good at killing people.

00:32:48.460 Um, I think that's the quote, uh, in, uh, in, uh, double down, the sequel to game change.

00:32:54.760 And, and as you said, he killed an American, at least one American.

00:32:58.200 That's a big difference, right?

00:33:00.220 So the president of the United States, no, you know, do we owe the same level of due process

00:33:03.920 to, to, to people who aren't Americans, who the president says we're at?

00:33:07.860 I don't think so.

00:33:08.780 But for an American to get no due process and have his president kill him, that's quite something.

00:33:14.600 Now, again, might've been justified by some, by some moral, uh, you know, situational ethics

00:33:20.260 thing.

00:33:20.760 But as you said, where was the outrage then by the press?

00:33:24.440 I was outraged.

00:33:25.880 I was, I was, uh, I was talking quite a bit about it, but where was the outrage from the

00:33:30.380 media and, and, and, and from Democrats, uh, and, and Republicans who are principled, like,

00:33:36.480 again, there might be a justification for it, but in this country with our traditions, this

00:33:41.660 should be discussed and debated.

00:33:43.160 And the president should have to justify it rather than just saying, I control the weapons.

00:33:48.520 And now with the drones, you know, even easier, I control these things.

00:33:52.320 And so I'm going to kill whoever I think should be killed.

00:33:55.020 That's a, that's a, that's just not our tradition.

00:33:58.020 It might, there might be justification for it.

00:34:00.180 And I'm not saying I don't, I don't share the goals, but it should be debated and discussed

00:34:04.720 and scrutinized.

00:34:05.440 And there should be disclosure about it.

00:34:07.060 And, and, and, and I, you know, I would say nothing could be more MAGA than saying we,

00:34:12.680 we can't have a, a president who's unfettered in their ability to use our military to do

00:34:18.300 whatever he wants.

00:34:19.360 We just, that's just not, that's just not the way America is.

00:34:22.480 He said to you, or they quoted in your book, Double Down 2012, turns out I'm really good

00:34:28.420 at killing people.

00:34:29.780 Didn't know that was going to be a strong suit of mine.

00:34:32.760 I mean, wow.

00:34:33.840 It was a 16 year old.

00:34:35.860 He was an American citizen, excuse me, killed by a U.S. drone strike in Yemen.

00:34:40.200 He was the son of terrorist Anwar al-Awlaki and the justification was wrong place, wrong

00:34:47.600 time.

00:34:48.440 Like too bad.

00:34:49.660 Sorry, not sorry.

00:34:51.520 And look, the problem they have in the Hegseth situation is reportedly, and again, this is

00:34:57.880 a big asterisk because it's Washington Post reporting, that allegedly after this incident

00:35:04.580 on September 2nd, they then changed the policy, the approach to not, quote, double tap if there

00:35:13.460 were survivors on the boats, from the boats now swimming in the water after their boat

00:35:18.020 was blown to smithereens.

00:35:19.500 So it would suggest an acknowledgement that having taken out those two on September 2nd

00:35:24.840 was not ideal.

00:35:26.540 I don't know if it's an acknowledgement it was illegal, but it certainly seems to have

00:35:30.940 been a change in policy and in the law, that's exactly the kind of thing you use against

00:35:34.020 somebody, the change in policy or the change in behavior.

00:35:37.280 Having said all that, Mark, these guys are in no danger whatsoever.

00:35:40.380 If some overzealous, you know, Senate panel leads to a recommendation for charges, the DOJ

00:35:46.600 somehow finds, I don't know, some weird independent streak and decides to indict these guys or whoever

00:35:53.560 it would be, it might be a military prosecution.

00:35:55.880 President Trump is going to pardon them.

00:35:57.660 These guys have nothing to worry about for this strike.

00:35:59.660 Well, they don't have anything to worry about.

00:36:04.500 I agree with you from the point of view of a Justice Department indictment.

00:36:08.520 And I may be wrong about this, but I don't know that the president can pardon people in

00:36:11.660 the Court of Military Justice and certainly can impact their careers.

00:36:16.680 I think they can.

00:36:17.980 Really?

00:36:18.500 I don't know.

00:36:19.000 I'm trying to think of an example of that.

00:36:20.600 Well, I'm trying to remember, I was reading, among others, Andy McCarthy this morning, who was

00:36:24.940 very tough on the president here, very tough on Hegseth, and not at all on his side.

00:36:30.120 But I think he did acknowledge up front that a pardon would be likely and could render it moot.

00:36:35.160 Yeah.

00:36:35.580 You know, if you read the Washington Post story carefully, as you did, people should know

00:36:40.840 that the Washington Post story leaves room for the notion that the order to kill the last

00:36:46.800 two gentlemen, allegedly, was not a direct order from Hegseth, that Hegseth's order was

00:36:52.020 make sure, you know, everybody gets killed.

00:36:54.460 But it's possible if you read the Post story literally that it was the commander who said,

00:37:00.600 do the second tap rather than Hegseth himself.

00:37:03.480 Well, I mean, I guess that won't necessarily affect anything other than the truth of Hegseth's 0.51

00:37:11.300 denial as espoused by Trump on Air Force One, that Hegseth told me he did not order that.

00:37:17.520 So, I mean, that may get Hegseth off the hook.

00:37:19.800 In any event, it's like, to me, it's kind of annoying to even debate it.

00:37:22.800 I do think our soldiers and, you know, all armed forces should not commit war crimes.

00:37:29.680 Definitely on the team, don't commit a war crime.

00:37:33.000 But I also feel like I object to even the scrutiny of this event because it's all manufactured.

00:37:40.780 It's only being done to retroactively justify this, you know, seditious six and their, that's 0.51

00:37:48.960 what Hegseth is calling them, and their video, which was based on nothing.

00:37:52.020 They're just now digging.

00:37:52.980 It's a fishing expedition.

00:37:54.240 And it does feel a little, you know, Stalin's right-hand man-esque, like, show me the man

00:37:59.140 and I'll show you the crime.

00:38:00.240 That's how it feels to me.

00:38:01.400 So I'm really not that into it, nor do I really care that we're killing the drug boat

00:38:05.860 guys trying to kill my kids and yours right now by bringing their fentanyl to the United

00:38:11.580 States to try to get our kids when they go to college with, you know, some drug in some

00:38:16.860 moment of weakness where they think they're taking a Xanax, like what happened to poor

00:38:20.220 Eric Bolling's child, and instead it's laced with fentanyl.

00:38:23.580 So I really do kind of not only want to see them killed in the water, whether they're

00:38:28.700 on the boat or in the water, but I'd really like to see them suffer.

00:38:32.120 I would like Trump and Hegseth to make it last a long time so that they lose a limb and

00:38:37.640 bleed out a little.

00:38:38.720 Like, I'm really having a difficult time ginning up sympathy for these guys who, 10 seconds

00:38:45.120 earlier, almost got taken out by the initial bomb, but because they managed to get ejected,

00:38:51.520 you know, a little too soon, had to be taken out in the water.

00:38:54.720 I realize legally it may make a difference, but truly, Mark, this is a tough case to really

00:38:58.740 gin up the sympathies of the American people.

00:39:01.420 Yeah.

00:39:01.680 Like I said, I share the premise that you just raised because I think it's important that

00:39:08.620 we do something to keep our porous border from being flooded with drugs that are killing

00:39:14.060 our people.

00:39:14.940 So if this is in service of that, I think it's something that should be considered.

00:39:19.840 I just think there needs to be more debate because I just don't think it's good for the

00:39:24.400 United States to be violating international law, if that's what happened here, or taking

00:39:29.580 human life under conditions that aren't vetted.

00:39:33.480 Now, I would say, every one of these, you know, actions has a legal team.

00:39:41.100 And my hope would be that the legal team is signing off on this stuff.

00:39:44.360 So while outside lawyers may say this is a clear violation, let's find out, you know,

00:39:53.500 again, declassification without revealing sources and methods and operational details, let's

00:40:02.460 find out what the legal justification was for it.

00:40:04.860 Because if it can't be justified legally, then it's hard to defend it, even if the mission

00:40:11.580 and the goals are admirable and necessary.

00:40:14.700 But presumably, these were signed off by lawyers.

00:40:17.520 So let's see what they said.

00:40:18.780 Let's see how they justified it.

00:40:19.960 That hasn't been forthcoming, and I do think that that would quiet the complaints of at

00:40:25.460 least some who are fair-minded about this.

00:40:28.380 Yes, and Hegseth says they did have sign-off from lawyers at the top of the DOJ and the

00:40:33.780 military system on these strikes, though his memo's a little ambiguous on, like, what about

00:40:39.400 the question of the two swimming in the water?

00:40:42.100 In any event, I'm not going to lie, I'm glad they're dead.

00:40:44.820 Let's keep going, because there's a new ad out today.

00:40:49.160 This whole thing got started as a result of this so-called seditious six.

00:40:52.080 Again, that's a Hegseth term for these lawmakers.

00:40:55.200 Now, today, there's a new ad that's just been put out by the Women's March, which is such

00:41:01.940 a weird thing to still have around as, like, an organization dropping ads.

00:41:07.340 And this one is trying to do the same thing.

00:41:09.600 And the way those six tried to get between the commander-in-chief and his armed military,

00:41:14.860 this one seems to try to get between the commander-in-chief and his armed ICE officers.

00:41:21.660 Here it is.

00:41:22.180 Watch this.

00:41:25.060 You will be caught.

00:41:26.600 You will be removed.

00:41:27.640 It's a little girl of drawing.

00:41:28.140 And you will never return.

00:41:31.280 Kristi Noam on the TV.

00:41:37.000 Someone comes in with handcuffs.

00:41:38.600 A man.

00:41:40.140 He looks forlorn.

00:41:41.400 She's hugging him.

00:41:43.520 Daddy, how was your day?

00:41:45.900 He's an ICE officer.

00:41:51.240 What will you say, read the captions, when she asks about your day?

00:41:58.320 Now, these dramatic scenes of ICE taken out of context, arresting people.

00:42:02.640 A mask can't hide you from your neighbors, your children, and God, they'll know.

00:42:12.080 You can walk away before the shame follows you home.

00:42:18.560 Daddy, how was your day?

00:42:19.740 You can walk away.

00:42:27.680 You can walk away as an ICE officer while not and still receive your paycheck,

00:42:32.000 because these are just cops who are charged with making arrest, Mark,

00:42:35.400 based on warrants that are given to them through a duly enacted process.

00:42:40.240 That's not what the left will tell you.

00:42:42.060 They think it's all like dragging kids out of their homes and making little girls cry.

00:42:45.620 That's what the Women's March wants you to believe. 0.99

00:42:48.400 But they also thought that, you know, equal rights meant wearing a pink P-word hat

00:42:53.580 and standing on the Upper West Side doing absolutely nothing.

00:42:56.780 That's the same group.

00:42:58.840 Yeah.

00:42:59.120 The tens of millions of people who voted for President Trump

00:43:01.560 left no ambiguity about the mandate he had on these issues.

00:43:06.180 And they may not like every way ICE operates,

00:43:08.560 but the macro mission to do what is necessary to not just control the border

00:43:14.060 and not just remove certain people from the United States,

00:43:17.420 but to send the message that you cannot come to this country illegally

00:43:21.360 and expect to be treated like a citizen.

00:43:23.440 That's what's happening.

00:43:24.700 Now, are things happening that are in error or in excess

00:43:28.640 or that aren't to the liking of a Democratic mayor or governor?

00:43:32.280 They are.

00:43:33.340 And that's being fought out on the streets of the United States.

00:43:36.960 And, you know, the hard cases,

00:43:40.440 the hard cases are when some American citizen gets caught up

00:43:43.840 or some grandma who's been sewing clothes in a community for 30 years gets caught up.

00:43:49.300 But if people are here illegally,

00:43:52.120 then the law says they need to go.

00:43:54.860 And in some cases, they're being told to go.

00:43:57.880 If a citizen is caught up,

00:44:00.500 the government should do its best to make amends

00:44:02.900 and to figure out how to keep that from happening.

00:44:05.280 But this is this is this isn't some rogue operation that's disconnected from democracy.

00:44:11.660 This is what people who voted for the president in the main,

00:44:15.120 one of the main things that they wanted to see him do.

00:44:18.160 And that's that's what's happening.

00:44:21.720 Circling back,

00:44:23.060 you can be pardoned by the president under the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

00:44:26.520 It happened under Biden via the U.S. Probation Office.

00:44:29.560 The president can pardon somebody under the for federal offenses,

00:44:35.040 including those obtained in U.S. District Courts,

00:44:38.000 the Superior Court of the District of Columbia and Military Courts Marshal.

00:44:42.740 Yeah, that's what I thought.

00:44:43.820 All right.

00:44:44.140 I stand corrected.

00:44:45.700 Yeah, no worries.

00:44:46.400 They can they can be pardoned by Trump and they will be.

00:44:48.380 So they're not really facing any actual legal jeopardy,

00:44:50.400 at least not under this administration.

00:44:51.800 And given what we saw at the end of Biden,

00:44:53.760 I wouldn't be surprised if we saw just a blanket from Trump on his way out that he pardons all the military officers for any crimes,

00:45:00.020 any alleged crimes in connection with the Venezuelan drug boat raids so that they don't have to worry.

00:45:05.300 And they shouldn't have to worry.

00:45:06.340 This should not be a distraction for them.

00:45:07.560 They already have to put their lives on the line every day.

00:45:10.240 Their actual safety.

00:45:11.280 They shouldn't have to worry about this B.S. too.

00:45:13.580 All right.

00:45:13.960 Forging forward.

00:45:16.880 Let's talk about what's happening in Minnesota,

00:45:18.340 because we spent the first like 42 minutes talking about some not great things for Republicans,

00:45:22.700 with which they are going to have to deal.

00:45:25.080 But they do have something happening on Team Blue that is an outrage.

00:45:29.600 And that gets right to the heart, I think, of why most Republicans cannot stand Democrat rule.

00:45:37.180 This excessive government purse that is filled with other people's money,

00:45:44.700 none of which anyone can afford,

00:45:46.740 that is then doled out to favored interest groups.

00:45:50.040 And then even when fraud is detected, the purse is not closed.

00:45:54.420 Instead, it's refilled with more of your money and mine to fund, in this case,

00:45:59.480 Somali immigrants who are buying luxury cars, fancy jewelry, nice homes and clothes,

00:46:06.740 and in some cases funneling money back to Somalia to pay for a terrorist group,

00:46:11.200 terrorist group, al-Shabaab.

00:46:12.660 And all under the, I mean, open eyes of Minnesota lawmakers who reports City Journal and the New York Times

00:46:22.920 in a combo, a pair of reports, knew.

00:46:26.040 They knew they were being defrauded, but didn't want to say anything

00:46:28.560 because they were worried about being called racist, Mark.

00:46:31.500 You know, the parallel is to this horrible thing that's happened in the UK with immigrants molesting children. 1.00

00:46:41.420 Thank you.

00:46:41.880 And government officials say the same thing.

00:46:44.280 Well, we didn't do anything because we didn't want to appear to be racist or prejudiced.

00:46:48.680 This story is so outrageous that the New York Times wrote one of the most fair anti-democratic stories

00:46:56.140 that I've ever read in the paper about what's happened.

00:46:59.680 And as you said, all these charities, all these government programs, government-funded programs,

00:47:06.280 and in many cases, government-funding private groups, some coming out of COVID,

00:47:10.980 they just created fraudulent schemes, fake patients, fake students, young people with diseases and afflictions.

00:47:18.440 And they just basically said, you know, we help these hundred kids, so give us all the money that we should get from the government.

00:47:26.980 And as you said, basically, the Democrats would see the cookie jar being robbed,

00:47:33.860 and then they put more cookies back in the same jar and then turn their backs again.

00:47:38.840 This is a massive scandal.

00:47:40.540 And the scale, it's not just kind of symbolic.

00:47:42.920 The scale of it is like a billion dollars in Minnesota alone for the fraud in these programs.

00:47:49.340 As you said, most of it, most of the people who've been charged by the U.S. attorney are from the Somali community.

00:47:55.640 Now, many of them are American citizens, either born here or naturalized.

00:47:58.440 But as you said, many also have ties back to Somalia.

00:48:02.040 And the Democrats don't really have an explanation for how this happened, except to say, as you did,

00:48:08.480 well, we didn't want to appear racist.

00:48:10.420 We didn't want to appear prejudiced.

00:48:11.500 This is an important community in our state.

00:48:15.020 Massive ripoff of the taxpayers.

00:48:17.180 Massive.

00:48:17.900 And a massive repudiation of the notion that you can just hand out government money

00:48:23.700 and hope for the best that people aren't going to commit fraud.

00:48:27.940 Oh, I mean, I don't even know if it was hope for the best situation.

00:48:31.560 I mean, I watched this one guy who's part of the Democratic lawmaking crew.

00:48:36.240 I think he's a Republican, but he's part of the statehouse in Minnesota over the weekend.

00:48:40.080 And he was like, they all knew.

00:48:42.620 Everyone knew.

00:48:43.400 We've all been jumping up and down about this for years.

00:48:46.360 They just didn't care.

00:48:47.460 They just decided it was in their interest group to funnel the money to this interest group that paid for them.

00:48:53.640 You know, all these Somali immigrants are voting Democrat.

00:48:55.760 And he was saying it doesn't make any sense because if you look at their values on paper, they sound more like Republicans.

00:49:02.780 Culturally, the Somali crew is not exactly far left.

00:49:07.060 They like school choice, he said, is their number one most important issue.

00:49:10.680 So why are they voting Democrat?

00:49:11.700 Because of this.

00:49:12.800 Because they're giving them cash giveaways.

00:49:14.000 Anyways, here's a tweet put out by the Minnesota Department of Homeland Security.

00:49:18.240 I'm not going to read the whole thing because it's long.

00:49:19.800 Hold on.

00:49:20.080 Actually, I have it here.

00:49:23.280 Okay.

00:49:24.820 Again, just a couple highlights.

00:49:27.180 Tim Waltz is 100% responsible for massive fraud in Minnesota.

00:49:31.540 We let Tim Waltz know of fraud early on, hoping for a partnership in stopping fraud.

00:49:36.000 But no, we got the opposite response.

00:49:37.540 He systematically retaliated against whistleblowers using monitoring threats, repression, and did his best to discredit fraud reports.

00:49:45.180 Instead of partnership, we got the full weight of retaliation by him.

00:49:48.660 It's scary, isolating, and left us wondering who we can turn to.

00:49:52.600 This is a cascade of systemic failures leading up to Tim Waltz.

00:49:58.080 Then they go on just a little bit more.

00:49:59.920 Fundamentally, Tim Waltz is dishonest, lacks ethics and integrity, has poor leadership abilities, and has never taken accountability for his role in fraud.

00:50:10.700 Instead, he deflects by blaming national politics for his own failings.

00:50:15.620 That's exactly right.

00:50:16.860 As far as I can see, and they thank the New York Times for bringing the plight of Minnesota to the national stage.

00:50:22.360 I have to say, Mark, I think Tim Waltz is done.

00:50:25.000 I think this will bring him down.

00:50:26.240 He's running for a third term.

00:50:27.960 I think it's over for him.

00:50:29.140 What do you think?

00:50:30.380 Well, the current speaker, Republican speakers, is going to probably be the Republican nominee, I think.

00:50:36.840 And whoever their nominee is, I think it's hard to win a third term.

00:50:40.060 And this story is going to continue to reverberate around the state.

00:50:43.220 It is more of a blue state than a purple state, though.

00:50:45.740 So for whatever reasons he got elected twice, maybe he can win again.

00:50:50.000 But certainly he's imperiled.

00:50:52.120 And certainly the threads on this are going to continue to be pulled.

00:50:56.560 But I'm not ready to predict he's going to lose.

00:50:58.440 But he's obviously now in a very tough political position.

00:51:01.660 When the New York Times does a very long, big story calling into question your competence and maybe your ideology, it's a sign of trouble for sure.

00:51:09.960 What did you make of the City Journal report followed a few days later by the New York Times report?

00:51:13.600 I was like, first of all, go City Journal.

00:51:15.180 But do you think the New York Times have been working on this and got scooped?

00:51:18.420 Or are they hustled together?

00:51:19.520 Because a lot of these facts have been out there.

00:51:21.340 Yeah.

00:51:21.700 It's a good question.

00:51:22.460 The timing, obviously, probably not coincidence because they're so close together.

00:51:25.580 The question of the money being used to go overseas to fund criminal activity, I still want to see more documentation on that.

00:51:33.200 It's certainly suggestive, but I'd like to see more because it's obviously a huge charge and a potentially massive story.

00:51:40.020 Well, I tip my hat to the good folks of City Journal who are ahead of a lot of the mainstream news reporting, and that is a publication well worth your time, ladies and gentlemen.

00:51:50.880 Mark Halpern stays with us.

00:51:52.020 We will be right back, and there's a lot more news to get to.

00:51:54.560 Stand by.

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00:53:40.740 When I got a great deal on a great gift at Winners, I started wondering, could I get fabulous gifts for everyone on my list?

00:53:47.180 Like this designer fragrance for my daughter.

00:53:49.480 At just $39.99, how could I resist?

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00:53:54.940 This gold watch for my partner.

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00:54:00.220 Ooh, European chocolate for the crossing guard.

00:54:03.560 At these prices, could I find something for everyone at Winners?

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00:54:15.240 Mark Halperin is back with me.

00:54:16.900 He is the host of Next Up with Mark Halperin on MK Media.

00:54:20.800 Go and subscribe.

00:54:22.340 Get it on YouTube.

00:54:23.520 YouTube.com slash AT Next Up.

00:54:26.860 Not AT.

00:54:27.740 At.

00:54:28.140 At.

00:54:28.960 I feel like Ron Burgundy.

00:54:31.500 You gotta do the at is what he's trying to tell me in this prompter.

00:54:35.080 It's YouTube.com slash AT, like the AT sign, Next Up Halperin.

00:54:40.340 Okay.

00:54:40.880 I don't know why they did that, Mark Halperin, but it's annoying.

00:54:43.040 Can I tell you the best story about that I heard the other day?

00:54:46.580 It's about someone we both know, but I'm not going to say who it is.

00:54:49.020 Oh, good tease.

00:54:50.000 A missed person was reading prompter, and it was a story about the Hague.

00:54:54.700 And this person was reading the prompter and said,

00:54:57.540 the hagu, they said.

00:55:00.540 Oh, no.

00:55:01.520 The hagu.

00:55:02.520 Yeah.

00:55:02.820 Now, Abby hates when I tell this story, but I have to tell it because she's so fun.

00:55:10.780 Abby's very smart, but she has this weird thing with pronunciations that she does. 0.99

00:55:15.120 She's laughing.

00:55:18.560 She has like a mental block on certain pronunciations and certain words.

00:55:22.980 And one time, Mark Siegel was sitting on the set with me at Fox, and he had like updated his thoughts.

00:55:31.260 I don't know what she was bringing me, but she was bringing me something about the segment that we were doing.

00:55:35.300 And what it said, what it was about was, wait, okay, reverse.

00:55:42.480 She had to transcribe something, a medical presser that had just happened, and give it to me while I was interviewing Mark Siegel.

00:55:48.260 And the document she brought out that she had typed up said, they said she suffered a grandma seizure.

00:55:54.360 That's, if you're going to have a seizure, it's one of the best ones to have.

00:56:02.540 Totally.

00:56:03.360 But it's still.

00:56:04.420 So much better than like the mean uncle seizure.

00:56:06.160 Yeah.

00:56:07.140 Or the mean kin down the block seizure.

00:56:09.540 There's all sorts of bad ones.

00:56:10.700 But the grandma one.

00:56:11.420 Right.

00:56:12.040 That's awesome.

00:56:12.680 I love that.

00:56:13.480 No, it's like, it's kind of nice to you and gives you a bunch of candy at the end.

00:56:15.680 Yeah, it pinches your cheeks.

00:56:18.860 Speaking of grandparents.

00:56:19.840 Take some saliva and mats your hair.

00:56:21.220 Yeah.

00:56:23.020 Back to Tim Walsh, because we can't leave that story without me showing the following war between, well, I'll get into this in one second, between Trump and Walsh.

00:56:32.200 But here's Walsh trying to like do damage control on this, on Meet the Press.

00:56:36.700 I don't think he understands what that term means.

00:56:39.660 Here he is with Kristen Welker, SOT-19.

00:56:42.460 Do you take responsibility for failing to stop this fraud in your state?

00:56:48.760 Certainly.

00:56:49.060 I take responsibility for putting people in jail.

00:56:51.380 Governors don't get to just talk theoretically.

00:56:54.320 We have to solve problems.

00:56:55.520 And I will note, it's not just Somalis.

00:56:58.060 Minnesota is a generous state.

00:56:59.660 Minnesota is a prosperous state.

00:57:00.980 A well-run state.

00:57:02.100 We're AAA bond raided.

00:57:03.540 But that attracts criminals.

00:57:04.980 Those people are going to jail.

00:57:06.440 We're doing everything we can.

00:57:07.960 But to demonize an entire community on the actions of a few, it's lazy.

00:57:13.840 So they're so well run that the criminals were attracted to Minnesota.

00:57:18.500 And it's not all Somalis. 0.65

00:57:20.240 It's literally hundreds of Somalis, except for the eight who are non-Somali.

00:57:24.940 So don't generalize, Mark.

00:57:26.860 He, too, has gotten the research paper on don't alienate the Somalis.

00:57:30.740 They're still voting for us.

00:57:31.680 Yeah, I mean, it's very reminiscent of how he handled controversies during his presidential,

00:57:39.200 vice presidential campaign, which is he's got some stuff to say, and he hopes the parade

00:57:43.240 moves on before anybody asks a follow-up question.

00:57:46.460 I did a little checking during the break.

00:57:49.180 Minnesota used to have two-year terms for president, for governor.

00:57:52.680 They don't anymore.

00:57:53.460 Four-year terms.

00:57:54.380 No term limits.

00:57:55.320 But no one's ever won a third term.

00:57:56.940 No one has ever successfully been a third term, four-year governor.

00:58:03.480 And I think he might not break the streak after that answer.

00:58:07.560 Yeah, if they vote for him, they deserve what they're getting at this point.

00:58:10.560 But so here was a little war of words between Trump and President Trump, President Trump

00:58:17.500 and Governor Walz, which is the opening shot.

00:58:20.400 It's actually, the opening shot was in a truth social in which President Trump called

00:58:24.060 Tim Walz retarded. 0.94

00:58:25.700 He used the word, quote, retarded.

00:58:27.760 And then Tim Walz responded to that, again, on Meet the Press.

00:58:32.880 I think it's SOT 20.

00:58:35.720 Look, Donald Trump insulting me is a badge of honor for me.

00:58:39.100 But I think we all know, both as an educator for a couple decades and as a parent, using

00:58:45.420 that term is just so damaging.

00:58:48.920 It's hurtful.

00:58:50.320 This is cruelness.

00:58:51.240 This is meanness.

00:58:52.020 It's aimed at a broader community.

00:58:53.240 And as far as demonizing our Somali community, maybe he could help us on some things.

00:58:58.380 Demonizing an entire community, folks who are in the professions, educators, artists,

00:59:02.400 doctors, lawyers, entrepreneurs.

00:59:03.920 They bring the diversity and the energy to a place like Minnesota.

00:59:10.220 And for him to just randomly decide to do this, it makes no sense.

00:59:15.020 Do your job.

00:59:15.720 Get the criminals out.

00:59:17.180 Secure our border.

00:59:18.040 But do it with dignity and respect to the American tradition of respecting immigrants and refugees

00:59:22.980 as a beacon of hope.

00:59:25.000 Okay.

00:59:25.500 Trump shutting down immigration from third world countries was not done randomly.

00:59:29.940 It was done in the wake of this reporting and the shooting of these two National Guardsmen

00:59:34.340 by an Afghani national over the weekend.

00:59:36.540 It wasn't random.

00:59:37.540 But let me just give you the last piece of the story, which is Trump then responding

00:59:40.860 to that chastising from Tim Walsh on Air Force One Sunday night.

00:59:45.360 It's not too.

00:59:47.320 You called him what many Americans do find in a fix of war, retarded. 1.00

00:59:52.360 Do you stand by that claim of calling Tim Walsh retarded?

00:59:55.260 Yeah, I think there's something wrong with him.

00:59:56.760 Absolutely.

00:59:57.340 I'm sure.

00:59:57.960 You don't think that...

00:59:58.640 You have a problem with him?

01:00:00.020 You know what?

01:00:01.040 I think there's something wrong with him.

01:00:02.540 Anybody that would do what he did, anybody that would allow those people into a state 1.00

01:00:07.100 and pay billions of dollars out to Somalia, there's something wrong with Walsh.

01:00:13.140 Okay.

01:00:13.660 So Trump's defense is he actually is slow.

01:00:18.900 He's not even taking on the issue that that term is offensive to some.

01:00:24.280 He's like, but it's real.

01:00:25.860 I'm telling you, he's not...

01:00:27.240 He's slow.

01:00:30.100 Which is classic Trump.

01:00:32.980 Classic Trump.

01:00:33.720 I was going to say, anyone who's spent any time with Donald Trump is zero surprised at

01:00:37.500 that response.

01:00:38.740 Yeah.

01:00:39.380 He's not sorry, Mark.

01:00:40.760 You're shocked?

01:00:41.740 No.

01:00:42.060 He's not even sorry, not sorry.

01:00:43.500 He's just not sorry.

01:00:45.680 Oh, no.

01:00:46.220 Not sorry.

01:00:47.400 And I have to say, like, I've been thinking about that word because a lot of people are

01:00:50.820 starting to use that word again.

01:00:52.300 I don't mean to be too philosophical about it, but I do think it's one of those, like,

01:00:57.460 it's a message word.

01:00:59.520 It's not really like anybody wants to make fun of people who are slow when it comes to

01:01:04.840 brain development.

01:01:05.940 It's that they're sick and tired of being told what they can and cannot say.

01:01:10.140 That term was used for decades, you know, without it.

01:01:13.800 No one's trying to actually say something negative about that community.

01:01:16.620 They're trying to say something about the person they're targeting, that they're kind

01:01:19.440 of slow.

01:01:20.900 And this is a way of saying we're done being word policed.

01:01:24.300 I think that's why Trump says it, too.

01:01:27.100 Yeah.

01:01:27.300 And also, it's a word that he grew up using, I'm sure, because when he was a kid, that

01:01:31.200 was a word people use.

01:01:32.260 So, again, I'm not surprised by it.

01:01:35.900 I'm always against word policing.

01:01:39.140 This is a general matter.

01:01:40.840 Yeah.

01:01:41.400 And it never works with Donald Trump.

01:01:42.960 I can speak to that firsthand.

01:01:44.660 Just don't go there.

01:01:46.500 He's not going to be moved by you at all.

01:01:49.640 No matter how good your research is, no matter how good your research is, no matter how I

01:01:53.780 profile the debate moment, he will not be moved by the word police.

01:01:57.120 That's right.

01:01:57.640 But this wound up being a great strength of his as things turned out.

01:02:03.020 OK, speaking of the National Guard soldiers who were shot, that tweet that Trump sent out

01:02:08.100 true social in the wake of this tragedy, these two poor young National Guardsmen, 120, 124,

01:02:15.620 the 20-year-old now dead, the 24-year-old still fighting for his life.

01:02:19.400 I don't know.

01:02:20.040 It doesn't sound good, Mark.

01:02:22.860 The perpetrator shot and expected to make it, shot by a third National Guardsman.

01:02:27.680 But now Trump sends out this true social, which is just, I mean, it is a barn burner.

01:02:35.660 And I have to say, it may be, in the view of many Americans, the best thing he's done

01:02:40.120 since becoming president for the second time.

01:02:43.640 I'm going to read just a couple highlights.

01:02:45.080 Very long.

01:02:45.600 But here are the highlights.

01:02:48.500 He's talking about how he's going to get rid of these migrants and asylum seekers. 1.00

01:02:52.060 And he says, a migrant earning 30 grand with a green card will get roughly 50 grand in

01:02:55.600 yearly benefits for their family.

01:02:58.320 As an example, hundreds of thousands of refugees from Somalia are completely taking over the 1.00

01:03:01.920 once great state of Minnesota.

01:03:04.000 Somalian gangs are roving the streets looking for prey as our wonderful people stay locked 0.93

01:03:09.040 in their apartments and houses, hoping against hope that they will be left alone.

01:03:12.600 The seriously retarded governor of Minnesota, Tim Walz, does nothing. 0.99

01:03:16.800 And on we go.

01:03:17.580 Then he says, I will permanently pause migration from all third world countries to allow the 1.00

01:03:22.540 U.S. system to fully recover, terminate all of the millions of Biden illegal admissions,

01:03:27.680 including those signed by Sleepy Joe Biden's auto pen, and remove anyone who is not a net

01:03:32.440 asset to the U.S. or who's incapable of loving our country.

01:03:37.020 I will end all federal benefits and subsidies to non-citizens of our country. 1.00

01:03:42.080 I don't know whether any of that or all of it is true, but I think most Republicans would

01:03:58.520 say, shoot it into my veins. 0.73

01:04:00.840 That's exactly what I voted for.

01:04:03.080 Yeah.

01:04:03.560 And not just only Republicans, some independents, some Democrats.

01:04:06.520 That's been Donald Trump's poor message for a while.

01:04:08.980 And very informed by the experience with Europe.

01:04:12.100 You know, Europe is dealing with all of these problems in some ways more severe than what

01:04:16.920 the United States has dealt with.

01:04:18.600 Whatever laws might be broken by what the president's suggesting, whatever traditions, whatever norms,

01:04:24.880 whatever downsides there are, the coalition that elected him president two out of three times

01:04:31.220 is well on board with that philosophy about what America needs to do to be safe and prosperous.

01:04:39.120 So there are tens of millions who don't like what the president wrote, but there are tens of millions

01:04:43.460 who do.

01:04:44.080 And again, no one should be surprised that that's his reaction to what occurred.

01:04:48.600 And we talked about the Gallup poll earlier, which had an overall not great approval number

01:04:53.540 for Trump.

01:04:54.280 But one of the areas in which he's still very much holding on is immigration.

01:04:58.000 So you tell me whether this retort to that truth social by Mark Kelly, who's one of the

01:05:06.300 so-called seditious six in connection with that Pete Hegseth story we covered earlier,

01:05:09.960 but also has decided to weigh in on this whole thing with the National Guardsmen as well.

01:05:15.640 Tell me whether this is effective, given those poll numbers, SOT 9.

01:05:20.560 This is kind of more of the same from this president.

01:05:23.080 When he says things like third world countries, what is he really saying?

01:05:26.760 I think what he's saying is he doesn't want brown people in our country.

01:05:32.340 Mark?

01:05:33.720 I mean, if he wants to get the squad's endorsement for president, it could be effective.

01:05:39.360 Is that what that is?

01:05:40.740 I mean, it's more than that.

01:05:43.460 It's the belief of the Democratic Party about Donald Trump.

01:05:48.940 They believe he's motivated by racism.

01:05:51.080 It's what they think about Stephen Miller, too.

01:05:52.760 They think they're bigots who want America to be an all-white country when that's not what they want.

01:06:00.520 But that's the—Mark Kelly is enunciating the view of blue America about President Trump's view on immigration.

01:06:07.600 I mean, honestly, it's so tired.

01:06:12.160 It's so worn.

01:06:13.400 It doesn't work.

01:06:15.000 It's like, okay, you can keep trying to, you know, use those plays out of the old playbook,

01:06:19.160 but you use them to try to get a woman elected president and it failed. 1.00

01:06:23.140 What would make you think it's going to work better now on an issue that Trump,

01:06:26.640 notwithstanding his overall sagging numbers, still has huge support on?

01:06:31.360 So, okay, I guess that's what they're going to do.

01:06:33.220 Um, there's more of that coming.

01:06:36.060 You'll be shocked.

01:06:36.800 From Jasmine Crockett on MS Now, here's thought 10.

01:06:41.640 And the idea that one person can get out of line and commit such a horrific crime

01:06:47.480 as shooting two of our National Guardsmen, two National Guardsmen that never, ever asked to be here.

01:06:53.340 In fact, we know the young lady that lost her life specifically were saying that this is a waste of time.

01:06:59.000 But now you want to go against every single immigrant.

01:07:02.840 That doesn't make sense.

01:07:04.660 And it's frankly not who we are, because if that's the case, let's talk about the white supremacists

01:07:08.620 and how many of them need to be kicked out of this country, because I can guarantee you,

01:07:13.020 I can track down more crimes that they've committed, because overall,

01:07:16.320 immigrants have a lower crime committal rate than white supremacists.

01:07:22.640 But we don't want to talk about that in this country.

01:07:24.280 Overall, I love that. Overall, yes, because there are indeed still more Americans in America

01:07:29.800 than there are immigrants, madam.

01:07:32.280 But once again, playing the race card there and a bunch of disinformation as she does it. 1.00

01:07:39.980 Trump prioritizing deporting migrants instead of white supremacists.

01:07:45.420 Your thoughts on her?

01:07:47.180 Well, I have to confess in the last three weeks,

01:07:49.460 Representative Crockett has become a guilty pleasure for me.

01:07:52.680 I love watching her on TV and watching how her mind works as it connects to her mouth.

01:07:57.600 I really do.

01:07:58.460 It's just something mesmerizing about how she takes questions and spins them back with.

01:08:05.660 It's like it's like not it's not word salad.

01:08:08.660 It's like word pad Thai.

01:08:10.860 It's a lot of complexities.

01:08:11.760 There's different flavors, textures all in there.

01:08:15.000 So it's hard for me to analyze what she says, because I just I watch her like this.

01:08:19.460 For those listening on the podcast version, I dropped my mouth in slack jawed disbelief.

01:08:26.600 I mean, it's it's incredible the things she says.

01:08:30.120 And and and she's still thinking of running for statewide office, which I would look forward to.

01:08:34.400 And by the way, that that reference she made to the National Guards woman who was killed thinking it was pointless or a waste of time to be doing this in D.C.

01:08:43.960 is way, way out of context and shame on her for doing that to a newly fallen soldier.

01:08:50.180 What the woman said, Sarah, was that it's pointless if they're not going to let us actually do law enforcement.

01:08:57.840 She wanted to have the reins taken off of her and the other National Guardsmen.

01:09:03.060 She wanted to do more law enforcement. 0.96

01:09:05.360 She was upset over, you know, these constant crackdowns on them, not not to be able to do anything to actually help the city of D.C.

01:09:12.940 So that's a Democrat problem.

01:09:14.620 Jasmine Crockett, that's not a complaint that she was there in the first place.

01:09:18.100 It was a request for people like you to try to to take the reins off so that the National Guard can do what they're capable of doing.

01:09:26.680 But who would expect media honesty from her?

01:09:31.580 OK, you mentioned the you mentioned Stephen Miller and he's kind of in the news today because of his wife, Katie Miller, who went on CNN and had a very interesting exchange with Abby Phillips.

01:09:48.320 Who tries to act like she's just totally benign, totally neutral.

01:09:55.340 You know, it's just the facts that make her always come down on the side of the Democrats.

01:09:58.660 It's not her bias. It's just the facts.

01:10:00.700 She can't be in charge of the fact that all the facts run in favor of Democrats.

01:10:05.560 That's just how it goes.

01:10:07.680 So they had an exchange on her show.

01:10:11.100 And I'll just let it play out. You'll you'll get it.

01:10:13.040 This is Friday night, SOT 26.

01:10:14.320 Wait, you have Jennifer Welch on your show very often and you've never pushed back as she has called my health, my son, my husband, a white nationalist.

01:10:22.100 Hold on. That is no different than Nick Fuentes going on Tucker Carlson's show.

01:10:25.540 It's not. And you should admit it.

01:10:26.540 Hold on. Wait, hold on. How is it anything similar?

01:10:29.700 It's not remotely similar at all.

01:10:31.540 Nick Fuentes sits around and says that he likes Hitler.

01:10:34.980 How is that similar to do with it?

01:10:36.820 What does she have to do with it? 0.99

01:10:37.800 She has nothing to do with it.

01:10:39.620 Literally nothing.

01:10:40.560 Scott, Scott, Katie is the person who just said to me that it is comparable to say that Nick Fuentes, who is literally a neo-Nazi, is the same as somebody, a liberal who who has an opinion who is not a neo-Nazi.

01:10:56.060 They are not a hateful opinion.

01:10:57.360 They are not the same.

01:10:57.940 How do you want? Excuse me.

01:10:58.920 Hold on.

01:10:59.180 Let's go back one more time.

01:11:00.680 But Nick Fuentes can espouse an opinion on Tucker Carlson's show.

01:11:03.580 It is not the same thing.

01:11:04.300 He didn't push back the same way you didn't push back when someone called someone in my family.

01:11:07.420 Hold on a second.

01:11:07.940 It's not different, Abby.

01:11:08.420 Hold on a second.

01:11:09.160 It's not.

01:11:09.500 If someone comes on this show and says, I love Hitler and I admire what he did, they would never, first of all, I would never invite them on the show and they would never be invited back. 0.95

01:11:19.140 So those two things are not the same thing.

01:11:20.560 But yet you've gone on Jennifer Welch's podcast.

01:11:21.980 It's the same thing.

01:11:24.300 Okay.

01:11:25.320 So Jennifer Welch came up. 0.96

01:11:27.460 I think I said that that's Stephen Miller's wife, Katie Miller, but also she was on Doge.

01:11:32.140 She's an independent professional in her own right and podcast host.

01:11:36.660 That Jennifer Welch, who I'm just now getting to see in these podcast clips, who is possibly the most hateful person in the national dialogue today. 1.00

01:11:45.540 It's like tough to say, but even Joy Reid is more joyful than this woman.

01:11:49.620 She's truly, deeply, deeply hateful of everybody on Team Red.

01:11:53.700 Here's a sampling of this person who Abby Phillip is totally fine with, has on her show repeatedly, went on this woman's show herself.

01:12:02.320 Abby Phillip did.

01:12:03.420 Not hateful.

01:12:04.160 See, Stephen Miller, hateful.

01:12:05.880 Jennifer Welch, not hateful.

01:12:07.320 That's Abby Phillip's world.

01:12:08.480 Here, watch.

01:12:08.820 Shockingly, the conservatives that I thought were just crusty, old white people have morphed into this young group of misogynists.

01:12:19.800 And I can tell you when I'm around white people, they test the racist water.

01:12:24.540 They test it on people like you all.

01:12:27.400 Stephen Miller is a Nazi and he is a sociopath.

01:12:31.840 He is a little insecure white supremacist.

01:12:35.680 This guy was bullied in high school and he's unattractive and he's four foot ten and nobody fucking likes him.

01:12:42.260 You get to J.D. Vance, who is a failed drag queen. 0.99

01:12:44.980 Because little Moses Mike Grindr Johnson worships two things.

01:12:50.200 Donald Trump and his closeted life.

01:12:52.720 For this dementia-ridden, diaper-wearing sack of shit.

01:12:56.640 He started off his 60 Minutes interview by saying, I am not a Nazi.

01:13:01.840 Okay?

01:13:02.100 He clearly, clearly is a Nazi. 0.75

01:13:05.800 People that triple Trump should be banned, boycotted from enjoying the best thing that America has to offer, which is multiculturalism.

01:13:14.260 Get your fat asses out of the Mexican restaurant. 1.00

01:13:16.640 Get your fat asses over to Cracker Barrel. 1.00

01:13:18.440 Because nobody wants to see your fucking smug ass, teeny-weeny, pink arm, big gut around. 1.00

01:13:26.960 Nobody wants to see that shit.

01:13:28.600 No one.

01:13:28.980 You got it?

01:13:31.340 Not hateful.

01:13:32.120 It's fine.

01:13:32.820 Abby Phillip, that's just a liberal with an opinion.

01:13:36.260 That's how she described her.

01:13:37.900 Stephen Miller, with his integration crackdown, supported by the vast majority of Americans, hateful.

01:13:44.180 Clearly, Abby Phillip has no problem with him being called a white supremacist or a Nazi.

01:13:47.440 Because she was actually on Jennifer Welch's show when Jennifer said that directly to Abby Phillip.

01:13:54.480 Fine.

01:13:55.460 Your thoughts?

01:13:57.140 I just think the left has to play by the same rules as they want the right to play by.

01:14:01.880 And if they want to be the police of who can speak on the National Town Square, then they need to recognize that they've got policing to do in their backyard as well.

01:14:12.460 And they just, right now, that's just not how they feel.

01:14:14.820 And they should, because they should either let everybody speak or they should police their own side. 0.76

01:14:19.580 But here's what's happening there.

01:14:23.220 I mean, you're being polite.

01:14:24.800 But Abby Phillip finds absolutely nothing wrong with what that woman said.

01:14:29.480 I guarantee you she agrees with all of it.

01:14:33.180 She's a fan of this Welsh person.

01:14:35.760 And so she wants her to come on her show, I think four times we counted.

01:14:39.900 She said yes to going on this person's show.

01:14:44.000 Then this woman, do we have the soundbite, you guys? 0.98

01:14:46.020 I don't know where we are, but like in the SOT lineup.

01:14:48.780 But she went on her show and the woman said it directly to her. 1.00

01:14:53.180 Here's that.

01:14:53.720 Listen to this.

01:14:54.460 There was no pushback.

01:14:55.600 Here's what Abby Phillip tried to just sort of say.

01:14:57.600 Oh, gee, I don't know what's in his head.

01:14:59.500 Gee, could be white supremacist.

01:15:01.760 Who can know?

01:15:02.740 Watch.

01:15:04.720 Stephen Miller is a white supremacist.

01:15:06.680 I mean, he is.

01:15:07.720 And he's basically running the White House.

01:15:10.300 They keep Trump busy with his decorating projects.

01:15:12.660 He's got building the arch now.

01:15:14.200 He's got his Oval Office design.

01:15:16.360 And then you have these real sociopaths that are real anti-Semites, true white supremacists

01:15:22.920 like Stephen Miller.

01:15:24.160 And even though he's Jewish, he's like a Nazi Jew. 0.98

01:15:26.800 Well, look, I can't speak to what Stephen Miller's motivations are.

01:15:32.080 You're such an asshole.

01:15:33.720 I'm sorry, but Abby Phillip is a fucking asshole. 1.00

01:15:35.740 She let her call him a Nazi Jew and just said, I'm sorry, but I can't speak to what his motivations

01:15:45.580 are.

01:15:46.000 What a cowardly dodge just to try to maintain some semblance of objectivity.

01:15:51.320 The only proper response to that is, come on, hold it.

01:15:56.340 Hold it.

01:15:57.140 We can criticize his immigration policy all day long if you want.

01:16:00.080 Don't call him a Nazi Jew.

01:16:02.100 That's disgusting.

01:16:04.320 Well, she calls balls and strikes. 0.75

01:16:05.920 She's just she's never seen a Democrat or anything but a strike.

01:16:09.500 She's going to have to have her glasses readjusted really soon. 0.79

01:16:12.580 But this is the mainstream of CNN, Mark.

01:16:15.500 This is the reinvented, more mainstream, moderate CNN.

01:16:19.200 That's truly one of the faces of it.

01:16:20.880 Yeah, if Paramount buys them and Ellison, you know, enacts his vision, I'd be surprised

01:16:28.100 if she's still in that job. 0.97

01:16:29.760 Good.

01:16:30.540 Get her, Ellison. 0.53

01:16:31.880 Go Barry.

01:16:33.200 You can do some crossover programming.

01:16:35.020 They're going to need your help.

01:16:36.340 Get her. 0.58

01:16:36.880 Get rid of her. 0.92

01:16:37.820 And by the way, she will fail in the independent lane because she has no personality. 1.00

01:16:42.320 She has a lot of bias and no personality. 1.00

01:16:44.700 It's a bad combo, actually, but perfect, perfect for CNN.

01:16:48.180 She's making our friend Scott Jennings rich. 0.98

01:16:51.760 Well, that's good.

01:16:52.300 We're in favor of that.

01:16:53.480 But he can go on some other loser show at CNN for that when she gets fired. 1.00

01:16:58.460 Something else happened on regular TV, CNN, with Abby Phillip that actually is kind of interesting.

01:17:05.540 And that is the son of Catherine Zeta-Jones and Michael Douglas went on and reportedly, as

01:17:14.980 Maureen would say, reportedly, allegedly, did not do that well to the point where, hold on,

01:17:20.880 I'm just going to give you the headline before we play it, that the parents are said to

01:17:26.940 be so furious with CNN that they intend to blacklist the entire network moving forward.

01:17:35.100 Now you're having Scott Jennings weigh in on this and others as well.

01:17:40.140 This is from a debate that happened on November 10th, but is only now causing the response.

01:17:46.460 Yeah, you can.

01:17:47.020 Before you play it, because I skimmed the New York Post story.

01:17:49.700 What does their son do for a living?

01:17:51.300 Like, why was he on CNN?

01:17:52.680 It's funny you should ask.

01:17:53.520 He is host of Sirius XM's Young Americans with Dylan Douglas and a 2022 graduate of Brown

01:18:01.100 University, which is pretty much all we need to know about him.

01:18:04.400 Was going to guess Wesleyan, but okay.

01:18:05.120 His Gen Z political show airs Saturdays at 10 a.m.

01:18:08.660 Must have missed it.

01:18:09.740 What were you going to say, Mark?

01:18:10.680 I said I would have guessed Wesleyan, but Brown's okay.

01:18:13.960 Brown.

01:18:14.180 I mean, literally, there's no school, no school in the nation to which I would less want to

01:18:23.680 say, I would, I would, there's no school worse than Brown when it comes to Woketopia.

01:18:29.160 They're number one.

01:18:29.940 They're worse than Columbia.

01:18:31.000 They're, they're number one.

01:18:32.820 Oberlin, Oberlin.

01:18:34.160 Oberlin.

01:18:34.680 No, what's worse about Oberlin?

01:18:36.100 Oberlin.

01:18:36.500 I know they're terrible.

01:18:38.400 They, they, they've been ensconced and scammed.

01:18:40.880 But truly, like, I think Brown is an outpost for Hamas. 0.94

01:18:44.180 I, I think that's almost literally true.

01:18:46.840 Almost.

01:18:47.480 But they're so bad.

01:18:50.600 Oberlin's bad.

01:18:51.980 Come on.

01:18:52.360 It's really bad.

01:18:53.540 Oberlin is, is not, like, if you.

01:18:56.680 Let's go.

01:18:57.300 Let's go undercover.

01:18:58.600 Let's go undercover.

01:18:59.380 Can we post, do you think we could both pass for college students?

01:19:02.560 Let's go undercover.

01:19:03.260 Here's, here's what I'd like to do.

01:19:04.680 Go undercover as a Jewish American and go to Brown University. 0.97

01:19:10.040 And like, if I were a man, I'd wear the yarmulke.

01:19:12.220 I'd do like something to make it obvious.

01:19:14.840 Because they are breeding, breeding anti-Semites, in my opinion, at Brown University. 0.97

01:19:21.760 It's disgusting.

01:19:23.280 It's worse than any place.

01:19:25.220 All right.

01:19:25.560 Let's, let's do this.

01:19:26.520 Let's get a makeup artist who can turn you into an Orthodox Jewish man. 0.96

01:19:30.380 And I'll get a camera.

01:19:31.540 I think we just have to take off the makeup and then wear, like, the right hair.

01:19:35.300 Let's go to Brown and we'll go to, we'll go to the Hillel.

01:19:39.120 And then you'll walk out and we'll just shoot the whole thing and see what happens.

01:19:42.620 Yeah.

01:19:43.040 I think, well, I'll be lucky if I make it across campus because that university is disgusting. 0.96

01:19:48.340 In any event, back to Mr. Douglas.

01:19:51.040 Dylan, that is.

01:19:52.480 Who's the dual Nepo baby. 1.00

01:19:53.900 And this is what, look at this.

01:19:57.440 This is reportedly what has his parents so irate over his, quote, humiliation, allegedly at the hands of CNN, that they're going to boycott the network here.

01:20:08.520 Like, you cannot put on the American people that Democrats were the one that were hurting people, making this plight.

01:20:14.760 Who was casting the votes against opening the government, Democrats or Republicans?

01:20:18.780 Who was wanting to, no, who was casting the votes?

01:20:21.660 Scott, who was wanting to cut SNAP benefits?

01:20:23.540 Nobody.

01:20:24.260 Republicans voted to fund SNAP 15 times.

01:20:26.460 Who was playing up SNAP benefits after two courts ruled that it was unallowed?

01:20:29.440 Republicans voted to fund SNAP 15 times.

01:20:32.620 Democrats voted to defund it 15 times, and now it took, and we had to get eight to join us.

01:20:38.560 You talk about the Affordable Health Care Act, okay?

01:20:40.560 It's terrible.

01:20:41.000 Landmark legislation is not perfect.

01:20:42.820 We understand that Democrats, Republicans, independents.

01:20:44.700 That is an understatement.

01:20:45.140 70% of Americans, not Democrats, not just independents, 70% of Americans believe that they should include, increase those subsidies past the dead mark of December, the COVID era subsidy benefits.

01:20:57.780 So it's a huge, huge thing that Democrats, Republicans, 70% agree with.

01:21:02.780 And look, when it comes to the government shutdown, I was of the persuasion that to go for it, I didn't really get it.

01:21:08.120 You know, Democrats wanted a fight.

01:21:09.660 They got a fight.

01:21:10.320 Chuck Schumer, back in last year, didn't fight.

01:21:14.420 He got a lot of flack for it, particularly in his home state of New York.

01:21:17.260 So they wanted a fight, but they found a fight that was worth fighting.

01:21:20.320 We're talking about the Affordable Health Care Act.

01:21:22.700 People were with them.

01:21:24.020 Democrats were leading in the polls.

01:21:25.220 We won big on Tuesday.

01:21:26.560 That's what it was for, right?

01:21:27.420 It was for the election, right?

01:21:29.040 Well, I think we should have kept going.

01:21:30.520 What I don't understand, and which I would love others to help me out and understand, I don't understand why we caved so soon when the American people seemed to be on our way.

01:21:37.660 Because the election ended.

01:21:38.560 You just said it.

01:21:39.140 It was for the election.

01:21:40.080 The election ended, then he caved.

01:21:43.160 That's it?

01:21:45.120 Seems like normal.

01:21:46.500 Normal, like, whatever.

01:21:48.240 I'm booking him on NextUp, by the way.

01:21:50.500 Are you?

01:21:50.940 You should.

01:21:51.400 Will you do it?

01:21:52.060 Right now.

01:21:52.540 I'm trying right now.

01:21:53.560 As we speak, I'm using my hand off camera to text the booker and say,

01:21:57.940 I want that kid.

01:21:58.360 I actually would listen to that.

01:21:59.660 Yeah.

01:21:59.920 Let's see if he does any better with you.

01:22:01.200 He didn't do well.

01:22:02.100 I mean, that's clear.

01:22:02.820 He wasn't substantive, and he didn't have his talking points lined up, never mind actual substance.

01:22:07.720 But did anyone expect any different?

01:22:09.900 Like, why did they think their 22-year-old son would go on to CNN across from the Scott Jennings of the world and do well?

01:22:15.920 Why did they think that?

01:22:17.520 I mean, I don't know.

01:22:18.240 For a liberal in a CNN pundit slot, I didn't think he was so bad.

01:22:22.400 I mean, it wasn't great, but I didn't feel like he was.

01:22:24.800 I mean, with those qualifiers, okay.

01:22:27.160 Yeah.

01:22:27.720 But honestly, like when I was 22.

01:22:29.060 I mean, I could name names, but I mean, I thought, you know, whatever, like grading on the normal curve.

01:22:34.360 I don't know.

01:22:35.160 If I were his parents, maybe they didn't like the part in his hair, I would redo the hair.

01:22:41.520 But to me, it is about that it exposes something.

01:22:45.520 No, it never works.

01:22:46.640 Not on a man.

01:22:47.700 I have a center part.

01:22:48.660 It's good.

01:22:49.580 But it doesn't work on a man.

01:22:50.900 But am I right that he had a center part?

01:22:53.740 Can we roll the tape again?

01:22:54.740 I need to see it now.

01:22:55.880 I think, maybe I'm wrong.

01:22:57.140 I thought he had a center part.

01:22:58.780 No, it requires investigation.

01:23:00.220 It's important.

01:23:00.460 On the American people.

01:23:01.660 I agree.

01:23:02.000 That Democrats were the one that were hurting people, making this play.

01:23:04.660 Kind of.

01:23:05.300 Who was casting the votes against him and the government?

01:23:07.660 Yeah.

01:23:07.960 It's a little early.

01:23:08.820 It's indistinct.

01:23:10.200 Who was casting the votes?

01:23:11.280 It's not great.

01:23:11.900 Scott, who was wanting to snap that?

01:23:13.120 So, if my son said, I'm going up against Scott Jennings, and I'm going to have a center part,

01:23:18.320 I'd say, no.

01:23:20.120 Pick a side.

01:23:22.280 First of all, right.

01:23:23.480 Show up like a man with a real opinion and a real part.

01:23:26.300 But I think this espouses so much about Hollywood.

01:23:31.540 I think those two are used to everybody genuflecting when they walk by, never mind their offspring,

01:23:39.580 with the dual royalty of Hollywood legends, at least Michael Douglas aside.

01:23:46.380 But Catherine Zeta-Jones is no slouch in her own right when it comes to Hollywood fame, success, and movies, and so on. 1.00

01:23:51.580 And they're horrified.

01:23:53.040 They don't understand what it's like to be in our lane, Mark.

01:23:57.880 I mean, honestly, it's like...

01:23:58.660 Totally agree.

01:23:59.200 Totally agree.

01:23:59.640 Right?

01:23:59.900 They don't...

01:24:00.240 Like, it's a day ending in why to have multiple negative stories written about you that are not true,

01:24:06.780 to have people say the most vile things.

01:24:09.080 This guy had mild pushback by Scott Jennings in a segment for which he was not prepared.

01:24:13.460 Who cares?

01:24:14.140 Like, look what happened with Katie Miller the other day. 0.85

01:24:16.340 Like, this...

01:24:17.460 They should not allow their 22-year-old son to be out there if their skin is this thin.

01:24:23.640 Totally agree.

01:24:24.680 And I'll say, in my dealing with Hollywood people around politics and, you know, and public policy,

01:24:31.440 they're pretty thin-skinned.

01:24:32.540 They just want to be told they're right.

01:24:33.760 So, I'm not surprised that they thought their precious little bundle was overwhelmed in the rough and tumble of a CNN set with Scott Jennings.

01:24:44.700 Well, while we're on the university set, Brown, Oberlin, and Dylan Douglas,

01:24:53.440 let's take a march across the pond, I guess a sail, a sail across the pond,

01:24:58.200 to see what's happening with the now ex-elected president of the Oxford Union.

01:25:04.820 This guy, George Auberonier, got elected to be the head of the president of the Oxford Union, the debate club,

01:25:13.240 which is historic and has been around for a long, long time.

01:25:16.340 And months earlier, before Charlie Kirk's death, he debated Charlie.

01:25:21.440 And Charlie crushed him.

01:25:22.900 It was beautiful.

01:25:24.420 Charlie, this guy who never graduated college, never went to college,

01:25:28.460 up against this Oxford kid, who was the, you know, now elected head of the debate society,

01:25:35.080 and Charlie swept the floor with him.

01:25:38.000 It was great.

01:25:39.600 And right after Charlie was shot, and as you know, we were on the air together,

01:25:45.060 it was clear right from the moment that first, not even the most terrible video hit,

01:25:50.380 but the first video hit, that this was obviously a very severe situation and life-threatening at a minimum.

01:25:57.160 And instead of recognizing that, this guy, George Auberonier,

01:26:02.640 who had debated in a gentlemanly fashion against from Charlie,

01:26:06.540 Charlie didn't, you know, throw shots under the belt or anything like that,

01:26:10.820 celebrated it, sending, we have it?

01:26:14.160 I thought it was just a tweet, tweeting out something like,

01:26:18.360 it's wild, wow, LOL, that Charlie got shot.

01:26:22.500 And now, he decided to sit down with the British outlet LBC

01:26:27.600 and try to justify his disgusting tweets, again, which were totally insensitive,

01:26:33.580 to Charlie, to his then wife, now widow Erica, to his children,

01:26:38.520 to the community that loved Charlie and supported him,

01:26:41.080 who he knew was suffering when he did all this,

01:26:43.740 but had absolutely no compunctions about doing it anyway.

01:26:46.720 And now, here he is trying to explain why he sent out the repeated tweets.

01:26:51.720 A stupid and kind of silly thing for me to say,

01:26:57.400 I reacted to kind of a notification and the headline,

01:27:00.540 I had no real context for, you know, what happened,

01:27:03.560 I didn't really understand the severity of the situation,

01:27:05.520 I reacted poorly, and then upon kind of realizing

01:27:08.000 just how serious kind of these things were,

01:27:09.600 I kind of deleted everything,

01:27:11.100 I posted on my social media kind of apologizing.

01:27:13.820 Because there'll be some people listening saying,

01:27:15.200 well, you know, did you really need to know how severe the situation was,

01:27:18.420 and you knew a guy who you'd met, had got shot.

01:27:20.820 Of course, and I think it's a valid position, I think.

01:27:23.340 Why did you?

01:27:24.200 I think part of the, Mr. Kirk's comments don't exist in a vacuum, you know.

01:27:28.260 He's an incredibly kind of polarizing figure,

01:27:31.300 and I think it's almost a symptom of him and my reaction,

01:27:35.060 a symptom of kind of how we have discourse online,

01:27:37.500 in which, you know, it's oftentimes very reactive,

01:27:40.740 it's oftentimes about saying something almost inflammatory,

01:27:44.060 almost because I wanted to, say, spark a conversation

01:27:45.900 about kind of what happened,

01:27:47.420 and the fact that, oh my God,

01:27:48.780 like, this is such a major event that's just taken place.

01:27:51.060 You wanted to get a reaction.

01:27:52.800 Exactly, I wanted to get a reaction.

01:27:53.780 I wanted to have a conversation and, you know.

01:27:55.540 A laugh?

01:27:56.420 Almost exactly, like, a laugh and a bit of a reaction,

01:27:58.980 and kind of, I realized afterwards that, you know,

01:28:01.940 that wasn't the right way to go about it.

01:28:04.540 Oh my God, Mark.

01:28:05.640 The original tweets are,

01:28:07.140 Charlie Kirk got shot.

01:28:08.900 Let's fucking go.

01:28:10.000 He posted on WhatsApp shortly after the shooting.

01:28:12.680 Charlie Kirk got shot.

01:28:14.700 L-O-O-O-L. 0.99

01:28:16.560 He added on Instagram.

01:28:18.600 It was repeated.

01:28:20.160 This is not, there was a melee at the Charlie Kirk event.

01:28:25.300 There was a gun that went off.

01:28:27.360 He knew Charlie got shot.

01:28:30.680 And now this idiot interviewer lets him get away with,

01:28:33.660 I didn't realize how serious it was.

01:28:35.660 And the fact that this guy's even still,

01:28:37.440 I think he's still at Oxford.

01:28:39.000 He did eventually get a vote of no confidence

01:28:40.880 to be president of the Debate Society for this year.

01:28:44.380 But he's at Oxford right now

01:28:46.620 and given a total pass for those comments.

01:28:50.320 I mean, the original behavior on social media is just so abhorrent.

01:28:55.700 But to then decide to sit for an interview

01:28:58.300 where the ostensible premise is to explain what you did

01:29:01.720 and to come so ill prepared

01:29:03.100 and to make the whole thing just worse and more grotesque,

01:29:07.540 I just, I find it to be one of the saddest things.

01:29:10.540 And of course, the premise of his defense

01:29:13.160 is that Charlie was some evil, polarizing monster,

01:29:18.860 which, you know, in the months since he's died,

01:29:21.840 the left and the media has had all this time

01:29:24.720 to produce evidence that Charlie was a bigoted, hateful person.

01:29:30.500 And of course they haven't because he wasn't and they can't.

01:29:33.940 And yet that's what he brings to the table as his defense.

01:29:37.080 Well, I could say these things

01:29:38.400 because Charlie was such a hateful person.

01:29:41.620 Just makes me sick.

01:29:43.620 It's disgusting.

01:29:44.880 So this was LBC's leading Britain's conversation

01:29:48.600 with Louis Goodall.

01:29:50.640 Louis, you failed.

01:29:51.740 That was a disgusting display.

01:29:53.300 That was a pathetic attempt

01:29:54.560 at actually holding him to account

01:29:56.440 for what he, in fact, wrote in those two posts.

01:30:00.000 And I didn't realize how serious it was

01:30:02.380 when the tweets themselves say Charlie got shot.

01:30:06.920 Fuck you, Louis.

01:30:07.580 You fell down on the job

01:30:09.060 and you humiliated yourself,

01:30:11.020 humiliated yourself against a true villain too,

01:30:13.960 which makes it especially egregious.

01:30:16.500 Stand by.

01:30:17.120 Mark Halpern returns after this quick break.

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01:33:20.340 Hey, everyone.

01:33:23.440 It's me, Megan Kelly.

01:33:24.520 I've got some exciting news.

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01:33:36.060 Along with the Megan Kelly Show,

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01:33:38.320 Mark Halperin,

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01:33:56.760 Mark Halperin is back with me.

01:33:58.400 Mark, tomorrow is election day,

01:34:00.700 not in very many places,

01:34:02.680 but in some places,

01:34:03.760 including in Tennessee,

01:34:05.380 where there is a U.S. House seat

01:34:08.560 up for grabs right now.

01:34:10.680 The Republican who held the district

01:34:12.640 has retired to go be part

01:34:14.880 of the private sector,

01:34:15.900 but was apparently facing

01:34:16.820 some sort of a scandal anyway,

01:34:17.980 so he's out.

01:34:19.140 And now this Afton Bain,

01:34:21.120 who's a Democrat,

01:34:22.380 she's currently serving

01:34:23.340 in the Tennessee State House

01:34:25.380 as a representative,

01:34:26.760 is running for now to be

01:34:28.560 a member of the U.S. Congress

01:34:29.860 against a Republican

01:34:31.620 who would seem to be a shoe-in.

01:34:34.780 I think this district went,

01:34:36.120 what, 30 points

01:34:36.640 or something like that,

01:34:37.400 overwhelmingly to the Republican

01:34:38.600 last time around.

01:34:39.860 The Democrats now say

01:34:40.900 it would be like a victory

01:34:41.820 if they could get it

01:34:42.860 to, you know,

01:34:43.660 within 10 points,

01:34:44.800 this race.

01:34:45.320 But this woman 0.93

01:34:46.860 who they are running

01:34:48.160 is an apparent lunatic.

01:34:50.420 We covered her

01:34:51.340 on AM Update last week

01:34:52.640 before we went on vacay.

01:34:54.020 But here she is,

01:34:55.020 we didn't get to this soundbite,

01:34:56.500 outside of the Tennessee State House

01:34:58.620 where she was trying

01:34:59.640 to make some sort of a point

01:35:00.680 but looked much more like

01:35:02.400 our children

01:35:03.140 when they were toddlers.

01:35:04.440 Here it is.

01:35:04.780 She's trying to barge into the 1.00

01:35:11.320 I think it's the speaker's office.

01:35:16.180 Sorry, the governor's.

01:35:18.360 That's her screaming. 1.00

01:35:20.500 Are you okay?

01:35:22.900 Sorry, that was

01:35:23.660 completely unnecessary.

01:35:26.880 Then the video goes on

01:35:27.980 for another two minutes

01:35:28.920 with her just sitting 0.60

01:35:30.020 on the floor moaning,

01:35:31.580 just rocking and moaning

01:35:33.200 like a drama queen. 0.93

01:35:35.220 Like you're trying

01:35:36.400 to play it up

01:35:37.060 for the cameras.

01:35:38.340 And now this woman

01:35:39.160 who says she can't stand Nashville,

01:35:41.060 she hates,

01:35:41.420 is running for,

01:35:42.320 you know,

01:35:42.820 a Congress position

01:35:43.380 that would represent Nashville

01:35:44.340 among other areas

01:35:45.360 in Tennessee.

01:35:46.440 And you tell me

01:35:47.360 whether the Democrats

01:35:48.800 have any shot

01:35:49.580 at actually winning

01:35:50.460 or coming within

01:35:51.960 their alleged goal

01:35:53.120 of keeping the race 0.99

01:35:54.100 relatively tight.

01:35:55.880 Well, you never know for sure.

01:35:57.360 It's hard to poll

01:35:57.920 special elections.

01:35:58.700 She's unlikely to win 0.57

01:35:59.600 largely because of the makeup

01:36:01.160 of the district,

01:36:01.840 very pro-Trump.

01:36:02.600 But she will outperform

01:36:03.820 Kamala Harris

01:36:05.060 in the district.

01:36:05.840 And so I don't,

01:36:06.960 assuming she's not going to win,

01:36:08.220 I don't think it matters

01:36:09.100 that she's going,

01:36:09.840 how close she comes.

01:36:11.600 I think what matters

01:36:12.480 is why is she coming close? 0.74

01:36:14.020 Because as that clip

01:36:15.420 and many others

01:36:16.100 I've seen suggest,

01:36:17.120 I haven't had a chance

01:36:17.660 to go out there

01:36:18.120 and watch for myself,

01:36:19.440 she's not a very good candidate. 0.93

01:36:21.140 Sometimes, you know,

01:36:21.980 you can overperform

01:36:22.760 in a district

01:36:23.420 if you're a Democrat

01:36:24.420 in a Republican district

01:36:25.400 because you're awesome.

01:36:26.940 She's not,

01:36:27.680 although her media

01:36:28.320 is pretty good.

01:36:29.080 Her paid ads 0.90

01:36:30.160 are pretty good.

01:36:30.780 So I think that

01:36:31.820 the issue here is,

01:36:33.480 are the issues

01:36:34.140 that are resonating

01:36:35.120 in this race

01:36:35.760 that are allowing

01:36:36.400 a liberal Democrat

01:36:37.760 to overperform

01:36:38.660 in a very red district,

01:36:39.860 will those be the issues

01:36:40.960 that resonate next year?

01:36:42.520 And if you look

01:36:43.120 at her campaign ads,

01:36:44.360 particularly the last couple,

01:36:46.300 they could be

01:36:46.800 Donald Trump ads

01:36:47.480 from 2024.

01:36:48.380 All the issues

01:36:48.920 she's talking about

01:36:49.900 in terms of being

01:36:50.860 anti-Washington,

01:36:51.840 pro-change,

01:36:53.020 worried about

01:36:54.500 working class voters,

01:36:55.800 they're all Trump rhetoric.

01:36:57.600 Doesn't have the same solutions,

01:36:58.800 but they're all Trump rhetoric.

01:36:59.600 So I think the important thing

01:37:01.480 is to see

01:37:02.360 how close she comes

01:37:03.800 as a measure of

01:37:05.520 just how potent

01:37:06.880 these set of issues

01:37:07.840 might be for Democrats

01:37:08.900 next year

01:37:09.460 because every Democrat

01:37:10.800 is going to run

01:37:11.280 on the same issue

01:37:11.900 she's running on.

01:37:14.480 What I think is interesting

01:37:16.560 about this person,

01:37:17.500 and again,

01:37:18.280 last week's AM update,

01:37:19.380 I think it was Monday

01:37:20.020 or Tuesday,

01:37:20.440 had a lot of soundbites

01:37:21.520 from her.

01:37:22.100 She's a nut. 1.00

01:37:23.140 But what I think

01:37:23.640 is interesting is,

01:37:24.460 to me,

01:37:24.940 this seems to be

01:37:25.540 like a trend

01:37:26.200 for Democrats.

01:37:27.060 I think they're

01:37:27.980 leaning into crazy.

01:37:30.480 They seem to like this.

01:37:31.880 They seem to think,

01:37:32.620 oh, she'll get attention. 1.00

01:37:35.080 She's going to get clicks 0.96

01:37:36.280 like that crazy podcaster,

01:37:37.880 Jennifer,

01:37:38.860 whatever, Welsh.

01:37:41.100 This seems to work for them,

01:37:42.580 they think,

01:37:43.600 in generating enthusiasm.

01:37:46.120 So is that the future

01:37:47.080 of the Democrat Party?

01:37:48.720 Well,

01:37:49.600 I think some of her

01:37:50.420 quote-unquote

01:37:50.880 crazy stuff

01:37:51.720 may be not

01:37:52.380 helping her

01:37:53.400 and maybe not

01:37:54.360 why they're attracted to her.

01:37:55.160 I'll tell you what I do see,

01:37:57.000 and I mentioned this before,

01:37:58.200 the quality of her ads.

01:37:59.920 She's very good on camera

01:38:01.220 in controlled situations,

01:38:04.120 like Mandami,

01:38:05.280 right,

01:38:05.620 like Zoran Mandami.

01:38:06.580 So I think they're looking

01:38:07.980 for people

01:38:08.460 who are good on social,

01:38:09.660 good on video,

01:38:10.980 who can,

01:38:12.000 you know,

01:38:12.900 get attention,

01:38:14.040 right?

01:38:14.460 And she's gotten attention.

01:38:15.940 The last ad,

01:38:16.800 I think it's her last ad

01:38:17.740 of the campaign,

01:38:19.100 at the very closing shot,

01:38:20.360 she winks at the camera.

01:38:22.120 And it's,

01:38:22.760 you know,

01:38:23.080 it's very effective.

01:38:23.840 Whether you like her

01:38:25.160 or hate her

01:38:25.660 or care about her politics,

01:38:27.600 you can't help.

01:38:28.180 She's very watchable.

01:38:29.580 And I think you're seeing

01:38:30.540 not just Democrats,

01:38:31.680 but everybody in politics

01:38:32.920 gravitating towards watchable.

01:38:35.660 Because that's one thing

01:38:36.880 that Donald Trump has

01:38:38.360 as part of his success.

01:38:39.880 You can't teach it,

01:38:41.660 you can't package it.

01:38:42.840 But if you find candidates

01:38:43.940 who have it,

01:38:44.880 it's a big advantage

01:38:45.720 because you've got to get

01:38:46.860 people to pay attention.

01:38:48.960 And Trump has shown the way

01:38:50.540 in how to do that.

01:38:51.740 Well,

01:38:52.160 that leads us back

01:38:52.760 to your friend,

01:38:53.580 Jasmine Crockett,

01:38:54.480 your girlfriend,

01:38:55.560 who you can't take

01:38:56.040 your eyes off of

01:38:56.700 when she's on the camera,

01:38:57.640 on the screen.

01:38:59.340 She's my guilty pleasure,

01:39:01.320 not my girlfriend.

01:39:03.080 But I think you would say

01:39:04.420 she's watchable.

01:39:05.760 But I mean,

01:39:06.380 what of the fact

01:39:07.440 that these two women

01:39:08.160 are watchable

01:39:08.800 for all the wrong reasons?

01:39:10.180 As a woman,

01:39:10.800 I have to tell you,

01:39:11.960 I object.

01:39:12.700 I object to their stupidity,

01:39:14.400 to their drama.

01:39:15.800 They're giving all of us

01:39:16.640 a bad name.

01:39:17.840 Yeah.

01:39:18.400 And they're giving,

01:39:19.040 to some extent,

01:39:19.720 they're giving,

01:39:20.200 you know,

01:39:20.740 substantive politicians

01:39:21.920 a bad name.

01:39:23.140 But what's incredible

01:39:24.840 about her is

01:39:25.420 Mondani is consistently

01:39:26.700 a pretty good performer.

01:39:27.940 He had a bad second debate.

01:39:29.080 But she is,

01:39:30.820 I've talked to people

01:39:32.000 who've been on TV with her.

01:39:33.520 She's not a good performer 1.00

01:39:34.880 except in these

01:39:35.920 controlled situations.

01:39:36.840 Crockett or this other gal in Tennessee? 1.00

01:39:37.220 No, this is in Tennessee.

01:39:38.780 Crockett, I don't know.

01:39:39.640 I need more data.

01:39:40.600 But this woman in Tennessee,

01:39:42.100 she's good

01:39:42.680 when she's packaged.

01:39:44.340 And that's,

01:39:44.980 you know,

01:39:45.340 that's something

01:39:45.840 because a lot of politics

01:39:47.120 can be packaged.

01:39:48.640 You know,

01:39:49.200 I'm surrounded by people

01:39:51.720 with divergent views on AOC

01:39:53.440 and whether she'll be

01:39:54.560 a strong presidential candidate.

01:39:56.140 But there's no doubt

01:39:57.300 that those who think

01:39:58.220 she'll be a strong candidate 0.76

01:39:59.320 if she runs,

01:40:00.640 see in her,

01:40:01.660 you know,

01:40:02.040 just the attention economy,

01:40:03.820 the capacity to get folks

01:40:05.760 to listen to what she has to say,

01:40:07.580 it's quite high with her.

01:40:09.020 And that's something

01:40:10.440 because,

01:40:11.020 you know,

01:40:11.420 Governor Beshear

01:40:13.480 ain't got that.

01:40:15.840 So what do you think, Mark?

01:40:16.880 We started the show

01:40:17.520 by talking about

01:40:18.240 where Trump's polling is right now,

01:40:19.920 that Gallup poll

01:40:20.740 and some of the problems

01:40:22.180 that the Republican Party

01:40:23.020 is facing at the moment.

01:40:24.540 Yes,

01:40:24.860 they have 12 months,

01:40:26.660 just about 11 months,

01:40:27.780 I guess,

01:40:28.120 to work it out.

01:40:29.920 I mean,

01:40:30.180 if Trump can get

01:40:31.080 some better economic numbers

01:40:32.340 and not just get the numbers

01:40:33.460 but actually make people feel

01:40:35.040 like things have gotten better,

01:40:37.360 is that all going to turn around?

01:40:38.760 Like,

01:40:39.020 if he called you up tomorrow, Mark,

01:40:40.680 and said,

01:40:40.940 what should I do?

01:40:41.800 What do you say?

01:40:43.260 I'd say talk to someone who knows,

01:40:44.900 but then I'd say,

01:40:46.280 I'll tell you secretly

01:40:47.700 on Megyn Kelly.

01:40:49.580 I think the economy,

01:40:50.880 which is,

01:40:51.220 of course,

01:40:51.420 it's a truism,

01:40:52.480 it's always the biggest issue,

01:40:53.660 but I think

01:40:54.100 there's just a big gap now

01:40:55.660 between how people feel

01:40:56.540 about the economy

01:40:57.280 and the better parts

01:40:58.760 of the economy.

01:41:00.060 And so,

01:41:00.980 I think I'm really,

01:41:02.140 you know,

01:41:02.560 I don't want to waste December,

01:41:03.740 I won't be sitting around

01:41:04.520 doing nothing,

01:41:05.100 but I'm really focused

01:41:06.120 on State of the Union

01:41:06.940 because I think

01:41:07.620 State of the Union

01:41:08.220 is when he'll get

01:41:09.260 massive audience

01:41:10.600 and he'll get a chance

01:41:11.780 to say,

01:41:12.560 here's my theory of the case,

01:41:14.460 here's what's worked so far,

01:41:15.580 here's what hasn't,

01:41:16.540 and terrorists

01:41:17.100 will be a big part of that,

01:41:18.120 the relationship with China

01:41:18.980 will be a big part of that,

01:41:20.440 but so will

01:41:21.480 all these questions

01:41:22.600 about what is America's,

01:41:23.820 what is America's economy

01:41:24.760 going to be?

01:41:25.340 Are we going to be

01:41:25.820 a manufacturing country?

01:41:27.100 Are we going to be

01:41:27.720 a big exporter?

01:41:28.920 How are we going

01:41:29.720 to make people feel better

01:41:30.920 about their kids'

01:41:31.760 economic future?

01:41:32.520 And I don't think

01:41:33.540 currently he's explaining

01:41:34.640 that in a very linear way.

01:41:37.540 Mark,

01:41:38.120 you're not going

01:41:38.380 to believe this.

01:41:39.480 My crack team

01:41:40.140 just forwarded me

01:41:40.760 a new Emerson College poll

01:41:42.360 slash the Hill. 0.95

01:41:44.280 It has that Tennessee race 1.00

01:41:45.960 within two points.

01:41:47.640 It has the Republican

01:41:48.660 up two,

01:41:49.980 Matt Van Epps,

01:41:51.700 and this crazy lady, 1.00

01:41:53.400 Democrat Afton Bain,

01:41:55.160 at 46.

01:41:56.820 Small sample.

01:41:58.200 Likely voters,

01:41:59.000 though,

01:41:59.180 which is good.

01:41:59.820 Only 600 people surveyed,

01:42:01.040 but my God.

01:42:02.160 That's a bit of an outlier,

01:42:03.460 and even the Democrats

01:42:04.180 don't have the race

01:42:04.880 that close.

01:42:05.300 But, you know,

01:42:05.800 I never predict

01:42:06.560 special elections

01:42:07.320 because the polling

01:42:08.060 just can't capture

01:42:08.960 who's going to turn out

01:42:09.940 right on December 2nd,

01:42:12.380 not normally a time

01:42:13.100 people are, you know,

01:42:13.960 hyped up to go vote.

01:42:15.200 But the district is such

01:42:16.760 that she'll fall short.

01:42:18.020 And as I said,

01:42:18.540 people will make up

01:42:19.580 all sorts of rules

01:42:20.220 if she's within five,

01:42:21.280 it means this,

01:42:21.820 10 means this,

01:42:22.440 whatever.

01:42:22.980 She's going to do

01:42:24.060 substantially better

01:42:24.840 than Kamala Harris.

01:42:26.560 And Republicans had to

01:42:27.920 spend a lot of money

01:42:28.760 in this race.

01:42:29.460 What if she wins?

01:42:31.320 It'll be,

01:42:31.920 it'll be by the standards

01:42:33.500 of like special elections,

01:42:34.620 it'll be an earthquake

01:42:35.260 if she wins.

01:42:36.160 Because the level

01:42:36.740 of overperformance

01:42:37.580 will be so dramatic

01:42:38.740 and Republicans

01:42:39.720 will have spent money,

01:42:40.800 right?

01:42:41.260 You could say,

01:42:41.700 well,

01:42:42.080 we can fight this message

01:42:43.280 by spending money.

01:42:44.440 They spent a fortune

01:42:45.380 to try to make sure

01:42:46.280 they held the seat.

01:42:47.380 And it makes

01:42:48.520 Speaker Johnson's majority,

01:42:50.160 you know,

01:42:50.680 virtually non-existent.

01:42:51.980 So it'll be a massive deal

01:42:53.400 if she wins,

01:42:53.980 but I don't know anyone

01:42:54.900 in the state

01:42:55.440 who thinks she's going to.

01:42:56.380 I mean,

01:42:58.140 if this is the standard,

01:42:59.380 like my,

01:42:59.700 my Strudwick is available.

01:43:01.300 He's free.

01:43:02.040 He's good looking.

01:43:03.600 He's starting to respond

01:43:04.820 to commands,

01:43:05.600 which the Democrats love.

01:43:07.060 I don't like this woman 1.00

01:43:08.020 is not the answer.

01:43:08.940 Can he wink?

01:43:09.380 Can he wink?

01:43:10.680 Not everybody can wink.

01:43:12.600 He can crap

01:43:13.380 and eat it.

01:43:14.340 Okay.

01:43:15.780 See?

01:43:16.600 See,

01:43:17.080 there's a metaphor there

01:43:18.140 that surmounts

01:43:20.440 and surpasses

01:43:21.220 all other metaphors.

01:43:23.860 This could work

01:43:24.700 in politics.

01:43:25.860 Yeah.

01:43:26.160 This is actually

01:43:26.720 a useful skill

01:43:27.520 for any lawmaker

01:43:28.780 headed to Washington.

01:43:30.100 Exactly.

01:43:30.680 Mark Halperin,

01:43:31.600 thank you.

01:43:32.480 Thanks for helping me

01:43:33.020 on this.

01:43:33.340 Thank you, Megan.

01:43:33.360 Good to see you.

01:43:34.500 Under the weather day.

01:43:35.720 Happy holidays.

01:43:36.640 Ho, ho, ho, ho. 0.87

01:43:37.840 You too.

01:43:38.880 Bye.

01:43:39.380 All right.

01:43:39.600 We will be back tomorrow.

01:43:41.080 It's an NR day

01:43:42.060 and we look forward

01:43:43.000 to seeing you then.

01:43:46.820 Thanks for listening

01:43:47.680 to The Megyn Kelly Show.

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01:44:28.200 Hi, Dad.

01:44:29.200 Did you get a new car?

01:44:30.220 Sure did.

01:44:30.940 In this economy?

01:44:32.300 Relax.

01:44:33.240 It's the Kia Sportage Hybrid.

01:44:34.600 I'm saving so much on gas.

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01:44:54.420 Movement that inspires.

The Megyn Kelly Show - December 01, 2025

Real Story Behind Hegseth ＂Double Tap＂ Reporting, and Katie Miller vs. Abby Phillip Throwdown, with Mark Halperin ｜ Ep. 1203

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