The Megyn Kelly Show - The Fallout From Racism Accusations： Two Real-Life Stories ｜ Ep. 65

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00:01:01.280 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:03.240 Your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:01:12.860 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly.

00:01:14.620 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:16.300 Today, we have something extraordinary for you.

00:01:19.380 A young girl, who we are calling Jane Doe, speaking out here exclusively on what she says

00:01:26.680 was the shocking abuse her St. Louis school allowed her to suffer, all in the name of critical

00:01:32.860 race theory and its racist approach to education.

00:01:36.340 This is a real-life victim of this insanity we've been talking about on this show, or so her complaint

00:01:45.660 alleges.

00:01:47.040 At age 17, she was accused of a racist act by a classmate.

00:01:51.420 She denied it, and all hell broke loose from there.

00:01:54.880 We're going to get into it in a second.

00:01:56.060 As she walks us through, incident by incident, how her life started falling apart, and her

00:02:02.960 school's indifference to any pain she suffered, allegedly.

00:02:07.480 We'll get to the school's response.

00:02:09.480 Her attorney happens to be a name you might know, Mark McCloskey.

00:02:13.580 Remember him?

00:02:14.880 This is the guy who, along with his blonde-haired wife, was brandishing a gun in front of their

00:02:19.660 home in St. Louis last summer, as a group of BLM protesters trespassed into his gated community.

00:02:24.180 He and his wife were threatened, they were terrified, and they were ultimately charged

00:02:28.740 with felonies for that moment, for defending their home.

00:02:33.980 No shots were fired, nothing happened.

00:02:36.760 They were scared, they had their guns, apparently they weren't holding them properly, according

00:02:40.840 to Dana Lash, but that's beside the point.

00:02:42.840 But he's going to tell us not only about the lawsuit he has filed on behalf of Jane Doe,

00:02:48.680 our guest, Mark is a lawyer in St. Louis, but where his own case stands and what's

00:02:53.980 happened to him since this past summer.

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00:05:07.020 Joining me now is Jane Doe.

00:05:10.100 We know her real identity, but we're not going to make that public.

00:05:13.660 She was a minor when this happened and has gone anonymous in the court pleadings.

00:05:20.060 And we're going to be respectful of that.

00:05:21.300 So Jane, thank you so much for being here.

00:05:23.640 Thank you for having me.

00:05:24.720 So you're 18 now, right?

00:05:27.980 But how old were you in October of 2020?

00:05:31.500 I was 17.

00:05:33.120 Okay.

00:05:33.560 So you were 17 when the events happened.

00:05:36.340 And at that time, I guess, and now, what year were you in in high school?

00:05:42.280 I'm a senior.

00:05:43.840 Okay.

00:05:44.500 And have you had generally a good experience at this school, Villa Duchesne in Missouri?

00:05:50.060 Yeah.

00:05:50.400 I mean, I had somewhat of a good experience there, for sure.

00:05:55.140 I wouldn't have expected this to happen.

00:05:58.160 All right.

00:05:58.340 Help us understand what your life was there prior to all this.

00:06:01.720 Were you an athlete?

00:06:02.940 Were you popular?

00:06:04.100 Did you go to dances?

00:06:05.180 You know, just give us a general feel for life for you.

00:06:07.620 Well, Villa's like a very small school.

00:06:10.240 There's like 56 or 54 girls in my class. 1.00

00:06:14.340 And all girls. 0.67

00:06:16.920 And, I mean, I'm a three-sport athlete.

00:06:19.780 So I played basketball, tennis, golf, lacrosse.

00:06:25.580 Like, I was just very involved.

00:06:27.780 I was on student council.

00:06:29.420 I started the ping pong club.

00:06:31.760 That's a very exciting thing.

00:06:34.600 And I'm super involved in the pro-life club.

00:06:37.720 I'm definitely involved in the school.

00:06:40.420 And I thought I had a relatively good relationship with everyone.

00:06:43.340 And did you get good grades?

00:06:46.540 Yeah, I have good grades.

00:06:48.660 Are you going off to college next year?

00:06:50.260 I am.

00:06:51.340 Okay.

00:06:51.740 So life was looking pretty good for you.

00:06:54.060 My kids are in smaller schools, too.

00:06:55.840 And I realize when you have a class of about 50 people, you know everybody really well.

00:07:01.440 And in most cases, it depends on the student.

00:07:04.580 But you've been in school with them perhaps as many as 12 or 13 years.

00:07:08.840 Is that the case for you or no?

00:07:10.220 Um, I came to Villa in eighth grade.

00:07:13.800 So I've known them all.

00:07:15.780 Or I've known the majority of them since eighth grade.

00:07:18.480 And then a whole bunch of girls come freshman year as well.

00:07:20.900 So I've just known them for a while.

00:07:24.380 And is it, describe the culture of the school.

00:07:26.320 You know, is it clicky?

00:07:27.620 Or is it pretty cool?

00:07:29.320 Is it like a sisterhood?

00:07:30.420 What is it?

00:07:30.880 Um, well, I mean, I think like any school, you know, you find your friends who you're

00:07:36.560 going to hang out with on the weekend, especially like since coronavirus, everyone's circles

00:07:41.240 have gotten a little bit smaller and more like exclusive.

00:07:46.240 But at school, everyone's friends and like everyone talks and helps each other out, especially

00:07:51.240 because like if you're an athlete, you're playing on every team.

00:07:54.880 So you're going to be friends with everyone.

00:07:56.760 Yeah, so I guess it's a little bit of a mix.

00:08:01.280 I understand you come from a Republican family.

00:08:04.160 Yes.

00:08:04.860 Is that unusual in your area?

00:08:07.500 Like where I am, there are no Republican families on the other side of Manhattan.

00:08:10.540 Is it unusual or where you are?

00:08:12.080 I live in St.

00:08:13.340 Louis, so it is unusual to be Republican.

00:08:17.480 But it's not unusual to be Republican if you go a little bit further out past St.

00:08:22.620 Louis.

00:08:22.960 So there's like a bunch of girls that are.

00:08:25.480 And how did you how did you become a Republican?

00:08:29.260 Like what what's what are your parents like?

00:08:31.260 Well, my parents are great, but that's not really why I'm Republican.

00:08:35.260 I I'm super pro-life.

00:08:37.880 So anything that like I'm just interested in furthering like the pro-life message.

00:08:46.120 And so.

00:08:47.680 Yeah, that'll do it.

00:08:49.340 OK, so so life's sort of going along.

00:08:51.660 You're dealing with COVID.

00:08:52.520 And did you guys go remote for for the fall?

00:08:55.640 Were you remote?

00:08:56.880 We were online for the end of last year, but we're completely in person now.

00:09:01.760 And we've been the whole entire time.

00:09:03.460 You have the option of going online, but you can't just you can't go online if you don't

00:09:08.700 have like early quarantine.

00:09:10.660 OK, OK, so as of September, you've been back in person in school.

00:09:16.100 Yeah.

00:09:17.340 OK, so now as I read your complaint, you say that there was an incident starting on October

00:09:25.300 10th, 2020, where you were informed by a fellow student that I guess there are three black

00:09:31.600 young women in your in your entire grade and that one of them was accusing you of doing 1.00

00:09:38.700 something awful.

00:09:40.760 And this is how you learned about it from a friend.

00:09:42.860 A friend came over and said, hey, you got to know this is happening.

00:09:45.220 So what did your friend tell you was going on that you were being accused of?

00:09:51.060 Yeah.

00:09:51.440 So we were at a sleepover and we're all sitting around the fire.

00:09:58.180 This is like, you know, October.

00:10:00.600 So it's not it's not that cold outside.

00:10:03.380 And she told me like, hey, do you know what's going on at school?

00:10:08.820 Well, you know what everyone's saying about you.

00:10:11.040 And I was like, no, no one's ever like I kind of suppose it doesn't happen that much

00:10:15.200 at Bill.

00:10:16.280 And she's like, yeah, well, my accuser came up to her in the common room, which is where

00:10:25.220 like we're all allowed to like sit and hang out and was like, gosh, sorry.

00:10:33.760 That's OK.

00:10:34.220 I'm really emotional about this.

00:10:36.240 So I just didn't look super traumatic for me.

00:10:39.860 So but so my accuser, she got into my friend's face and said that I said I stood up in class

00:10:48.500 and screamed in her face. 1.00

00:10:49.640 Black lives do not matter. 1.00

00:10:52.160 And that I'm like and just like really like push that. 0.99

00:10:56.880 And then all the girls in the common room at the time heard that and that she was calling

00:11:02.680 me a racist and then a whole bunch of the girls in the common room were like, oh, we 1.00

00:11:08.120 need to teach her a lesson. 0.99

00:11:10.260 She's such a racist. 1.00

00:11:11.440 She needs to get smacked in the face. 1.00

00:11:13.420 We're going to jump her in the parking lots like that started spreading. 1.00

00:11:16.600 And then just like it started like spiraling all over the school and I just didn't know

00:11:22.300 about it.

00:11:22.960 So, I mean, that had been going on for like two or three days by the time that I found

00:11:26.900 out.

00:11:27.300 And while I was like we're around the fire, other girls were like chiming in telling me

00:11:31.640 what they had heard and stuff like that.

00:11:33.940 And some of the girls that were at the sleepover, they were actually in the room when like my

00:11:42.080 accuser said that I said that.

00:11:46.060 So there's like a Zoom recording of it.

00:11:48.160 And the girls that were in there, they all know I didn't say anything.

00:11:53.120 So, well, let's hold up.

00:11:54.220 Hold on a thought because I want to I want to get there.

00:11:56.000 But before we go there, how long have you known the accuser?

00:11:59.900 Since eighth grade.

00:12:01.080 And were you and she friends prior to this?

00:12:03.700 Um, I've always felt bad for her.

00:12:06.340 Um, but, and I've always been very nice to her.

00:12:10.560 I wouldn't say we were like friends, but she kind of causes a hard time sometimes.

00:12:17.640 And when people give her too much trouble back, I always was sticking up for her.

00:12:22.900 So when you say you felt bad for her, why is that?

00:12:25.620 Um, she just is very upset all the time.

00:12:30.940 And I think that it would be a very like miserable life to live that upset, like in your own head.

00:12:39.240 Even prior to this summer, George Floyd, I know, you know, all the schools have been reacting to that.

00:12:46.580 But even prior to that, did you notice this thread with with the accuser?

00:12:52.300 Since I've known her, she's always been just like, very like wound up and sad.

00:12:59.880 Always around race issues or other issues?

00:13:02.740 Typically around race issues.

00:13:05.400 Like everything was a race issue.

00:13:08.460 And do you know, has she accused others in your grade or class of racist behavior prior to this?

00:13:17.420 Yes, but not the same.

00:13:20.360 Not to this level.

00:13:21.080 If she's like confused on something at math, she'll be like, oh, the math teacher is just racist. 0.89

00:13:27.840 They're not teaching me as well.

00:13:30.260 Like that.

00:13:31.160 But nothing as bad as what happened to me.

00:13:34.120 So you find out at this event with your friends, a social event that she has accused you of having stood up in a class, pointed at her and said, black lives do not matter.

00:13:48.400 And, and, and apparently the class in which you allegedly did this was a zoom class.

00:13:54.920 So does that mean it had taken place the previous spring?

00:13:57.780 No, this took place in October and the class was in person, but we like, it's recorded on zoom for people who are not there.

00:14:10.320 So like all of our classes were recorded.

00:14:13.060 Ah, I see.

00:14:14.580 So not just, just forgive me because I don't totally understand the tech, but not every zoom class is recorded.

00:14:21.020 So you're, but your school has made the decision to actually record the classes that they're offering via zoom.

00:14:28.560 At this point, we were recording the classes, um, because if a girl wasn't there so that they could like keep it up.

00:14:37.300 Cause some girls, um, like if they weren't there, they would just watch all the classes at night cause they were like out of town or something. 0.98

00:14:45.960 Okay. Okay. So that seems like a pretty simple case, right? Like, okay, let's go back and look at the tape.

00:14:54.680 I mean, was she specific on what day it happened?

00:14:57.480 Oh yeah. I mean, it's like, that's the thing. Like it, the school knows I didn't say it. That's not the problem.

00:15:05.060 The day it happened, like they all know that and the time and like, it's not that they don't know. I didn't say it.

00:15:11.700 Well, so have you seen the tape of that class?

00:15:14.880 No, we, we asked for them to send us the tape and they said that they wouldn't send it to you.

00:15:21.040 Had they admitted to you that the tape does not show you doing anything like that?

00:15:24.860 I never asked that. I just, my teacher told me, or my, my principal, Ms. Steenberg, she told me that she knew I didn't say it.

00:15:32.420 And I know I didn't say it. And my advisor, Ms. Lish, she's like, I didn't say it. So I know that the recording doesn't say it.

00:15:39.780 Well, I mean, the thing is, Jane, that if you had stood up in class in October of 2020 and, and pointed at a black fellow student and said, black lives do not matter.

00:15:51.260 Am I correct in assuming that would have been a major deal in your school and in your class at the moment you did it?

00:15:58.540 Well, yeah. The problem is, it's like, it's a major deal right now because I'm being treated like I said it.

00:16:04.580 It's just upsetting because I didn't think anything was wrong for like, so like three or four days in which like the whole, that rumor of me saying it got spread.

00:16:17.300 And then whenever, so then I'm being treated like that by not only people from my school that didn't know me or weren't in the room, but kids from other schools too.

00:16:29.940 And like, I didn't, you know, I didn't do it.

00:16:32.920 Right. And it's knowable. I mean, that's the thing that's so crazy is in most situations, this would be a, she said, she said, but there are, there's a room full of witnesses who can tell us whether it was said.

00:16:44.540 And there's even a videotape. And as far as you know, how is the class lined up? Like, is the class being asked? And I realize you're telling me the principal and the teacher have already said she didn't, she didn't say it, but like, has the class weighed in on this at all?

00:16:59.400 Yeah. So they have pulled in girls to like, when I say they, I mean, the principal has pulled in girls to talk to them and like, but they're saying that the girls aren't allowed to tell anyone that they're being pulled in and interrogated, including their parents.

00:17:20.900 So it's like, I don't, they're not telling me that they're getting pulled in, but I've like heard snippets.

00:17:27.360 And one of my friends told me she was pulled in one time. So like, I know that it's happening, but the school's making them not like the school's scaring them and telling them they're not allowed to tell anyone.

00:17:39.340 But you, do you know, just from your private conversations that people have been telling the principal, Jane never said this, this isn't true.

00:17:48.760 Yeah. Yeah.

00:17:49.840 Okay.

00:17:50.740 They know, like the school knows.

00:17:52.960 And just, just for the record, do we, do you agree that anybody who would say such a thing would be doing something totally outrageous?

00:18:02.280 Yeah.

00:18:02.880 Like you wouldn't defend a comment like that?

00:18:05.360 No, no.

00:18:06.520 And I, I'm, well, let me ask you this way. Do you believe that black lives do matter? 1.00

00:18:13.040 Yeah, of course.

00:18:14.700 Okay. So you're, you're reeling. You find out with your friends in a social setting that this thing is going around about you. And especially in this political climate, I'm sure you understood the gravity of something like that.

00:18:26.100 Even if you knew it wasn't going to be backed up by the video evidence, but I understand having gone through middle school and high school, I understand that's got to be damn scary.

00:18:35.260 So your complaint alleges that threats began, even physical threats. Can you talk a little bit about those?

00:18:43.180 Yeah. So girls were talking about jumping me in the parking lot. And that scared me really bad. And like that I needed to get smacked in the face was one that I kept hearing. And like, um, like she needs to be taught a lesson. 0.99

00:19:00.700 My house was threatened to be vandalized, which it later did get vandalized. My, um, and like my accuser, she's in her English class and she started like getting riled up about this. And she was like, I already told my mom, I don't care if I get expelled. I'm going to.

00:19:20.000 She was like, she was like making fist punching motions and just like threatening me. And it was like, also in addition to like the physical threats, like socially, the girls, like the majority of the girls at my school, um, there was like a lot of girls in there at the time who were like defending me and everything.

00:19:42.540 But like the social aspect of this, of like kids from other schools who don't know me, but know my name or like who can find me on Instagram or whatever. That's like another scary thing. Cause like Villa's just girls, but I don't know. Being labeled as a racist is a really dangerous thing to be labeled as, especially when you didn't do it.

00:20:05.520 Hmm. Oh my goodness. So I assume you told your parents about this. Yes.

00:20:13.340 Yeah. I didn't tell my parents right away because I was, well, how it happened was that my friend told me and like my friends were telling me what was happening. And then, um, I, we were actually camping. So I, we were having a really good time. So I kind of let it go and then I couldn't sleep. So then I emailed my

00:20:34.620 principal right away, like at night. And that was like way before I told my parents, I told my parents when I had gotten home, like later the next day, but I told my, like contacted my principal first.

00:20:49.400 And so I understand that the principal on October 13th, again, going from your complaint, uh, arranged a meeting between you and her. And, um, you, you told her what you were hearing was being said about you. And she set up a second meeting for that same day between you, your accuser, your teacher and her, the principal. Is that correct?

00:21:14.020 Um, yeah. I mean, she didn't really set up the first meeting. She never responded to my email, um, that I sent her like three days prior about what was happening to me, where I told her like in the email, I told her how there was physical threats being made to me.

00:21:31.020 And like that my house had been vandalized and that, or like the threats of vandalized. Oh wait, no, my house hadn't been vandalized. And like that there was a zoom and that like what she said, and then she wouldn't meet with me the next day. Or like when I, we got back to school, which it was a long weekend. That's why there was so many.

00:21:51.180 And so I, and so I like literally forced myself into her office to try and meet with her. Cause I realized like time is of the essence here. And then I asked to meet with my like accuser and my advisor. And so then we had a meeting later that day.

00:22:10.500 Is your advisor, uh, Ms. Wiss?

00:22:14.100 Yeah.

00:22:14.420 Wiss. Okay. And this is also the person who was the teacher during the alleged class.

00:22:19.500 Yeah.

00:22:19.700 Okay. So you do have that meeting on October 13th and I know there's an allegation and a complaint about what happened right before you went into the meeting. You overheard something allegedly in the stairwell. What was that?

00:22:32.800 Oh yeah. Um, uh, one of the girls, uh, my accuser's friend said, do you want me to face that bitch with you? And I like heard that while I was walking up the stairs, which freaked me out. 1.00

00:22:47.100 And the accuser's friend is also a black student.

00:22:51.540 She is.

00:22:52.480 Okay. So, so there's a threat that you hear before you go in allegedly. And now you walk into the meeting, which I'm sure felt tense. And what happened?

00:23:02.380 I just forgot to say something before, but in the meeting that I was with it, when it was just me and my principal, Ms. Stainberg, uh, she was incredibly supportive of me. And she was like, yes, I know you would never say anything like that. I know you didn't say it. Um, we're going to fix this. Like she's so, so supportive.

00:23:24.040 So I went in upset, but with like the confidence that I had, my principal support and like, I was going to be vindicated that you're going to be supported and backed.

00:23:36.520 Yeah. I really did think I was going to be supported. So whenever we go to the meeting, it was super awkward because it was just me and the girl for like 10 minutes because my principal and was late.

00:23:49.860 And the advisor just left, or Ms. Swiss left because it was so awkward. So we're just sitting there staring at each other. Um, anyway, that's just nothing was said.

00:24:00.840 Oh, nothing was said. No, it was very tense.

00:24:04.980 I can feel it from here.

00:24:07.400 Yeah. And then finally Ms. Stainberg comes in and she start, or like whenever, like she starts out with like, 0.97

00:24:17.780 so there was a situation in your class and then the, my accuser, she starts like being like, 0.89

00:24:27.500 I can't believe you'd be lying right now. It's like all direct to me. And she's like raising her voice,

00:24:32.840 getting really upset. She's like, I can't believe you'd lie right now. Like, I just cannot believe you're

00:24:37.960 doing this. Like, and then she's, she denied saying anything, like making any of the statements about

00:24:43.820 me. Like she then like, well, she was contradicting herself the whole entire meeting, like saying she

00:24:49.540 did by the end. But, and she was like, calling me and she's like, you know, you're racist. You're 0.78

00:24:57.240 the biggest racist in school. You're in love with Trump. You have Trump screensaver, socks and poster. 1.00

00:25:03.760 Everyone knows all Trump supporters are racist. And she's just like, really like upset. And I kept

00:25:10.460 trying to like, bring it back to, I was like, this is just not a political thing. Um, this is just a,

00:25:17.220 you made a lie that's making my reputation or you said something that's a lie that's making my

00:25:23.500 reputation bad. And like, I'm just trying to fix the lie. Like all this is like a political thing

00:25:29.320 aside. Like, this has nothing to do with politics. I don't have like a Trump screensaver or any of that

00:25:34.100 stuff. It was weird that she was saying all that. And she's like pointer finger in my face and like

00:25:39.560 loud and like calling me a liar, that I'm the fakest pro-life person she's ever met, that I

00:25:45.040 constantly devalidate her life and the lives of the two other, um, African-American girls at my 1.00

00:25:52.120 school. And that, um, I have a police support flag on my computer and that it's like further showing

00:25:58.700 how big of a racist that I am. Every time that that was being said, I kept, I kept trying to bring

00:26:04.080 it back to the actual lie. And Ms. Steenberg isn't saying a word and I'm crying. And then

00:26:10.140 Ms. Wiss, she like looks over at me and she knows, like she was there and she's like, you need to

00:26:16.780 realize that having a blue lives matter flag is racist. And that it was made to crush the black 0.98

00:26:24.340 lives matter movement. Simply having that sticker, I need to expect to be treated like a racist and

00:26:30.840 that I'll never understand the pain of like people of color. I just need to accept that. 1.00

00:26:37.820 Um, and then she asked the girl, if I took the sticker off my laptop, would she feel more

00:26:44.980 comfortable? And she's like, no, she's still racist. That's never changed. 0.97

00:26:50.040 Can I just ask you what were the, what, first of all, what did, I know there was a dispute about

00:26:54.300 whether it was in fact a blue lives matter flag or something else. Can you talk about that?

00:27:00.840 The police support flag is what I have been calling it because like, that's why I have

00:27:08.160 it. Like I have family members that are police officers and I, um, really respect them. And

00:27:15.140 so I said that and the girl, like her dad's a police officer. So I didn't think that, oh yeah. And

00:27:25.280 it's like a flag with a line and a blue line in it. So it's not, there is a, like, there is an

00:27:31.200 actual blue lives matter flag that, um, it doesn't just have one blue line. I think it's got

00:27:36.880 many. And I can't remember obviously black stripes and blue stripes, but anyway, so the, but the point

00:27:42.320 is you were trying to show your support for police and was that placed on there after the whole BLM and

00:27:49.280 the summer and all that, or had it been on prior to that? It has been on there for a really long

00:27:53.400 time. It like, I, I don't actually know when I put it on there, but let me ask it this way.

00:27:59.300 What, why did you put it on there? I put it on there just because my uncle and my cousins

00:28:06.180 have just, are just sharing their experiences. And I'm, I'm really proud of like the way that

00:28:12.620 they've led their life for their family and like to protect all of us. I just think it's a very

00:28:20.960 honorable job that they've been doing. And did you, did you worry at all when you put it on there

00:28:28.600 that it might be seen as provocative by, you know, some other students, especially the black students

00:28:34.480 in, in light of what was happening in the country? I didn't really worry that much about it

00:28:39.240 because they all have like black lives matter stuff on their computers. They do. So you're allowed 0.94

00:28:44.980 to sort of take a, a stance on issues that are, you know, charged racially and politically in your

00:28:51.320 school. Well, I mean, I guess I did worry a little, like one of my friends told me that like my

00:28:57.620 friends, they all, it's a little bit different because for those types, like black lives matter and

00:29:04.240 stuff, like you're allowed to wear that stuff at school and you would not wear, like, you wouldn't

00:29:10.540 wear something about like guns or anything like that. Like, or the blues, like police support,

00:29:17.320 you wouldn't wear that at school. So. Would you wear, would it, would anybody wear like a MAGA hat?

00:29:22.220 No, no. How about Joe Biden? Like what were people openly supporting him?

00:29:28.460 Like, okay. So that's interesting. Uh, so sort of one view is being allowed, but not all views were

00:29:35.920 being allowed. Yeah. All right. So, I mean, I, I understand that. I mean, I have to tell you,

00:29:41.180 like, I get that. I, I have police in my own family of whom I felt very defensive when these massive

00:29:47.140 sweeping statements about cops, all cops being racist and wanting to hurt or kill unarmed black

00:29:55.420 men were being pushed is I just, I know it's not true. There may be a problem in some circles with 0.79

00:30:00.500 policing, but I understand the need to support them in a way that doesn't diminish the experience

00:30:07.120 of black people, right? It's like, you don't want to be forced to choose a side. It's not about

00:30:11.280 choosing a side. It's about saying the narrative isn't correct. At least this is my case. The

00:30:15.100 narrative isn't correct that you're pushing and we have to get real about what the facts are. And I

00:30:19.720 don't mean to put words in your mouth, Jean. I just, I don't mean to make you feel uncomfortable

00:30:24.160 about putting the flag on your computer. I just recognize this. I think you do now that,

00:30:28.260 that that would be likely to turn into an issue. Yeah. I was surprised in the meeting. I did say,

00:30:33.880 I was like, I, of course I don't support police brutality. Like that is, I would never support

00:30:40.040 police brutality. I'm supporting the good police. More with our guest in just one second. And we'll

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00:31:12.740 job even more challenging, especially if you've got to hire for brand new roles. That's where

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00:32:03.440 And so your teacher, Ms. Wiss, basically told you that your sticker was evidence of racism and 0.89

00:32:15.720 that you should have realized that and you should expect to be treated like a racist.

00:32:21.780 How did the meeting wind up?

00:32:23.300 Well, I was crying and my principal was like, well, I think we had a very constructive conversation here.

00:32:32.420 And then I stood up and I like, and we all left. I like ran, like it was, I was not a constructive

00:32:42.240 conversation. Like I was being screamed at for the whole time. So I would, so, oh, the bell rang and

00:32:49.120 then she wrapped it up and said that. And I mean, that meant me and the girl had to walk out into the

00:32:58.120 same parking lot at the same time. And she's walking out happy as a clam because she just got 1.00

00:33:04.700 away with that. And she's telling her story to everyone. And I walk out like sobbing. I had to

00:33:11.440 stop on a tree because I thought I was going to throw up. Everyone sees that. Like then it is like

00:33:17.780 for like how upset I was and how happy she was made it look like by not like ever saying what she did

00:33:27.200 didn't happen. And like, it just really made it look confusing to everyone else.

00:33:32.340 So they just sat there and let her hurl the allegations without saying,

00:33:35.400 yeah. Madam accuser, we, I, Ms. Wiss was there and she didn't say it or we've been speaking to

00:33:42.340 people in the class and she didn't say it. They didn't say anything.

00:33:45.500 No, they didn't say anything, especially after Ms. Steenberg told me earlier that she knew I didn't

00:33:51.960 say it. She didn't say anything. And she's trying to act like that was a constructive conversation.

00:33:58.040 So can I ask you just a couple of questions? Cause in your complaint, you alleged that in that meeting

00:34:01.840 you were subjected to a verbal and physical assault. What was the physical assault?

00:34:06.720 It was the, like the gestures that, um, uh, the accuser was making, like just really like

00:34:13.960 in my face. Okay. So she didn't actually lay hands on you. 0.93

00:34:17.760 No, no, there's no hands on you. Okay. And then you, your house at some point was indeed

00:34:23.980 vandalized. You say, what happened to it? Um, we had a Trump sign in my yard and it was like

00:34:32.700 destroyed. So then time passes, you know, some time passes, let's say, I think it was 10 days

00:34:41.040 and you get pulled out of class again. Um, and you get brought down, I think to Ms. Steenberge,

00:34:48.960 the principal's office again. And there, there's going to be another meeting now that you didn't

00:34:54.200 expect. It's got some other parties in it, but notably it doesn't have your mom, your dad,

00:35:01.260 your lawyer, who they admit they knew you had hired by that point to help protect you.

00:35:05.480 And I wonder like, to me, that just sounds outrageous at the point that you'd involved

00:35:11.520 a lawyer and they knew that this was becoming a thing that they wouldn't include any grownup for

00:35:18.120 you. That just sounds incredible. Especially after like, I kept asking for my mom the whole entire

00:35:24.760 time. I was asking for my mom and I asked for my lawyer and they would not let me leave. They

00:35:30.000 wouldn't let me bring anything. And like, I didn't want to even leave the class. You're discussing

00:35:35.040 final project. And so like, that was like 10 days after the meeting that I had where the girl was 0.96

00:35:42.880 yelling at me and like threats were getting worse at that point and they weren't responding to my

00:35:47.600 parents. So like I, and like my principal before that meeting, she had like, I was crying in the

00:35:57.380 hallway and I was crying in the bathroom and I realized, okay, you've been crying for a while now.

00:36:04.600 I mean, like I could barely think at school. I was so scared. Like my friends would walk me in and

00:36:09.400 out of school and to each class. Like I was, I was such a wreck. And because I'm like, my school

00:36:16.860 didn't help me at all. So my principal saw me in the hallway with like all my like tears on my face.

00:36:23.260 And she like pulled me into her office and told me I was mentally unstable and I needed to be able to

00:36:28.740 deal with trauma like this. And like that, this stuff happens. I just need to be able to deal with

00:36:35.220 it. So like that happened. And my, and my parents kept like trying to contact the school. And so

00:36:41.640 like whenever I got pulled in on the October 23rd and it's like three administrators and me

00:36:49.400 and them like screaming in my face and me not being able to have anyone to support me was scary.

00:36:56.820 So you're telling me you were saying, can I please call my mom? Can I get my mom down here? And they

00:37:01.920 said, no.

00:37:03.620 Yeah. They were like, no, we need an answer from you now.

00:37:07.540 What was your, what was the question?

00:37:09.120 There was a variety of questions. So like they, so like whenever, yeah, whenever,

00:37:16.860 when, sorry, I'm thinking it was very upsetting. Um, so whenever the meeting started, um, Miss

00:37:24.180 Deanberg said that she's like, Oh, we got a letter from your lawyer. And I had no idea that there was

00:37:30.080 any threats to your physical safety, which is like a lie right off the bat, which I knew this was

00:37:35.400 going to be a horrible meeting, right? When she says that, cause that I, she knows that I said that

00:37:40.300 my first email and all the like meetings with her and she's, um, so then at like, she's like, we need

00:37:50.700 to, um, they were like, we need to come up with a solution for this. I was like, well, I just need

00:37:57.260 to talk to my mom. And then, then things started to like heat up and, um,

00:38:05.400 my principal was like, you need to realize that you are racist and that like everyone who's white 0.81

00:38:12.600 is racist. Uh, I'm racist cause I'm white and she is white. And then, but the whole meeting was like 0.97

00:38:20.320 mainly, um, led by Mrs. Morrow, who is, um, who used to be my basketball coach. She's African-American 0.79

00:38:28.860 and like the fact that she was even in the meeting was like, it was just strange. And then there was

00:38:34.800 also my, uh, she's a Dean of students now, I think. Um, or not, she's like the Dean of excellence.

00:38:42.620 We got a whole new bunch of new roles, but, and then Mrs. Catherine was also in the meeting 0.99

00:38:48.360 and Mrs. Morrow was really angry and she was like, like karate chop handing to me, like hand gestures 0.98

00:38:57.260 to me. And like, she was, she was like, you need to say that you feel safe. Like, tell me you feel

00:39:01.760 safe. You feel safe. Say it. This is a yes or no. Say yes or no. And I was like, I don't feel safe.

00:39:08.560 And she's like, what percentage do you feel safe? And I was like, I don't feel safe. And she was,

00:39:12.880 and then she was like, say you're racist. You're like, you're white. Like you need to realize that 0.93

00:39:18.180 all white people are racist. And then like, she was trying to say that she was trying to get, 0.95

00:39:23.400 she was like, say, Oh, she was saying like, if you won't tell me, tell me the names of the girls

00:39:30.200 who are making you feel unsafe. And I, after they were like, kept trying to tell me that I was racist.

00:39:36.140 And I like, like every time I got a break, I would say no, like I want to, my mom. And they just kept

00:39:42.620 saying no. And so then they were trying to get me to say that because I, I, sorry, I refused to get

00:39:54.380 the names of the people who were making me feel unsafe because I have already given those names

00:40:01.640 to them and like prior emails and conversations. And like, it's not like this was any new information.

00:40:10.200 And at this point they're like in my face telling me I'm a racist. Oh, and right when the meeting

00:40:16.280 started, Ms. Mara told me like, yeah, the girl, like my accuser, yeah, she's not getting punished at

00:40:22.500 all. So I just want you to know that. So like, I just knew nothing good is coming out of this meeting

00:40:28.560 for me. And so then, so she's trying to get me to say that, um, I'm lying about the

00:40:40.180 physical threats and that my dad's putting me up to this and that this is all actually all in my head

00:40:47.340 and that I'm over all of this and that none of this matters to me anymore. And I kept having to

00:40:53.400 like defend myself and saying like, no, it does matter. Like, I'm not over this. Like, this is not

00:40:59.300 a lie. And then my friend who had, who the accuser had actually said the like statement to, they're

00:41:08.220 trying to get me to say that she was not a credible source and that she's lying.

00:41:14.980 Wait a minute. But just to back up, just to back up in that first meeting that you had with the

00:41:18.420 principal and the accuser, didn't the accuser ultimately stand by that allegation anyway and

00:41:24.880 say she did say it? Yeah, but, um, she did say that. Unfortunately, like at that point, it just

00:41:32.080 nothing mattered because she had said that she didn't say it. And then she said, she said it. And

00:41:36.020 obviously the teachers are like, didn't care. So nobody was paying any attention really to the

00:41:43.300 original allegation, which was by the accuser against you, uh, an allegation that, you know,

00:41:51.040 allegedly will not be proven out by the videotape or the witnesses who are in that class. That's all

00:41:56.360 been abandoned. And now it's an effort to get you to stand down and your complaints about getting

00:42:02.360 bullied, the house getting vandalized, getting besmirched as a racist. It's all about getting

00:42:09.140 you to drop all of that. Yeah. And I actually was saying stuff in the meeting, like, because

00:42:15.920 there is like a strange dynamic, like I am a kid. So, um, like these are my teachers who I'm supposed

00:42:24.920 to respect. But like in that meeting, I knew everything had changed. Like they were sent in

00:42:30.460 the meeting to get me to say some things because it was no longer like, cause whenever I had to hire

00:42:36.340 a lawyer to get them to, or my family had to hire a lawyer to even get them to respond,

00:42:40.860 then they were given the task to get me to say some things so that they could like,

00:42:48.100 I don't know, clear their own name. Like, cause the way they were talking was not the way that they

00:42:52.220 were talking prior to this meeting. And so like in the meeting I said, like, if this was, I was like,

00:43:00.760 you guys are literally, I can't believe this is happening right now. Like I seriously cannot

00:43:04.900 believe that this is happening. Like if this was a different situation and there was someone going

00:43:11.180 around calling me a slut and that I'm such a whore and just ruining my reputation and I brought it to 0.94

00:43:16.020 the school, you guys, I know I'm confident that you guys would do something to help me, but because 0.99

00:43:21.040 this is a race issue and she's black, you're too scared to help me. And like, I just can't believe 1.00

00:43:28.060 that this is happening. And they were like, yeah, I did. And then, uh, yeah, what did they say?

00:43:34.640 They were saying like, you have to understand, like my accuser is hurt and hurt people hurt. And I said,

00:43:41.480 I understand that she's hurting and I've always felt for her. Um, but let's get her help instead

00:43:48.860 of like allowing this kind of behavior, because if she goes out into the world and continues to do

00:43:54.220 this, it's never going to help her. She's never going to be able to succeed. Like if, because

00:43:59.480 she's hurting, like, let's get our like school therapist to help her. Like she needs to be able 1.00

00:44:04.180 to deal with emotions like this, but she cannot make up lies about people who didn't do stuff like

00:44:09.140 this. And you guys can't just like allow it to happen. And, um, after that, nothing got better

00:44:15.740 for me. They continue to like, try and get me to admit that I was over it. So, and did you admit

00:44:25.100 that by the way, did you admit any of the things they wanted you to, that it was all in your head,

00:44:28.820 that your, that your witnesses were lying? No. None of that. And let me just ask you for the record,

00:44:36.040 do you have any history of mental problems or, uh, have you ever been accused of being a serial

00:44:41.980 fabulist of somebody who makes things up stories over and over? No. And have you, have you had any

00:44:49.080 problems at the school prior to this? Have you, have you been on probation? Have you been suspended?

00:44:53.340 Have you had issues like disciplinary issues prior to this? No. Okay. And I should, I should note for

00:44:58.500 the record at this point that these are allegations and the other side hasn't, hasn't been,

00:45:03.860 I mean, we invited them and of course offered them the chance to weigh in on all of this. Um,

00:45:09.680 they declined. They do deny the allegations. I'll, I'll read their statement in just a bit,

00:45:13.900 but they, um, they, they say these are unproven and they're not true. So that, you know, they're,

00:45:18.880 they're going to fight it in court and they're going to fight it in the court of, of public opinion

00:45:21.960 too. I might as well just read it now since I'm pausing. This is what they gave us, Jane. They said,

00:45:26.920 um, dated February 8th, a lawsuit was filed against our school in late December,

00:45:31.020 2020 regarding allegations of discrimination. While it is not our policy to publicly discuss

00:45:35.980 the details of lawsuits involving our school, we dispute the allegations made in this lawsuit.

00:45:41.240 And the complaint is full of factual inaccuracies, distortions, and conversations taken out of

00:45:47.780 context. Our primary focus remains on our mission of providing an excellent sacred heart education.

00:45:54.760 While conflict is inherent in a school that fosters dialogue and analytical thinking,

00:45:58.860 we strive for relationships characterized by inclusion and mutual respect. We love and care

00:46:05.100 for each and every one of our students signed Michael F. Baber, head of school,

00:46:09.940 village of Shane and Oak Hill school. Any thoughts on that? Um, yeah, I mean, they have like a rule book

00:46:20.680 that they're not following. It's just really like, this is upsetting to me that this is still going on

00:46:26.360 and that like literally just an apology would have ended this and that like, they're allowing this

00:46:32.620 kind of thing to happen. They actually, during that meeting, um, Ms. Kaplan was taking, well,

00:46:40.440 she kept telling, like, I wasn't asking. She was on her computer the whole entire time. And she told me

00:46:45.060 like three times that she wasn't taking notes. Like, it's not about this. Don't worry. And then

00:46:51.100 after the meeting, my lawyer gets sent like a whole bunch of notes from the meeting that don't have,

00:46:59.260 like the majority of the meeting, the other, or Mrs. Morrow was talking. It wasn't me. And it,

00:47:05.540 the notes have my words taken so out of context or not like things I didn't even say. And like,

00:47:14.280 just like one question and not all the stuff that they said to me. So like, I, that's just,

00:47:23.040 I like, after I heard that, after that happened, I was really, really upset because I just couldn't

00:47:28.780 believe that they would take my words and like twist them like that. Like I'm a kid. I don't,

00:47:32.920 I didn't have any defense. I kept asking for someone like, I, and like, I was like trapped in

00:47:38.360 there. Like I didn't want to be in there. Do you believe what you are suggesting that

00:47:42.640 they're treating you differently and your accuser differently because you're white and she's black?

00:47:48.600 Yeah. They said that they've been saying like, you have to understand like, this is a

00:47:53.580 difficult issue because of race being involved. How has this affected you?

00:48:00.360 This has been like really upsetting to me, obviously, because I'm like scared at school.

00:48:06.300 And I mean, I'm really lucky to have like a really supportive parents and like some really

00:48:14.620 great friends, but like people are like commenting on my Instagram to kill myself and that like, 0.54

00:48:22.260 I need to die and all this stuff. And like a whole bunch of girls at school, like school, 1.00

00:48:27.740 like good girls all used to say hi to me in the hallway. Now they just like look down.

00:48:31.440 So unless like, you know, the whole story, which it's so hard for me to tell the story. Like

00:48:37.780 it is so hard for me to get all this like information out. It's been so traumatic for me.

00:48:43.280 All you're hearing is a story that my accuser has given out, which makes me like, obviously like the

00:48:51.160 girls are thinking that I said that if they didn't know my, like they didn't hear what I said, 1.00

00:48:56.880 the other thing. Yeah, I said that. Do you feel like as your school states in this statement to us

00:49:03.060 that they are striving for relationships characterized by mutual respect?

00:49:09.620 Absolutely not. They're just trying to avoid the problem.

00:49:13.500 Well, they say they love and care for each and every one of their students. Do you,

00:49:17.300 do you feel like they love and care for you?

00:49:19.420 Um, I do not feel like the administration love and cares for me, but, um, there is like one teacher

00:49:28.700 who's been incredibly nice to me. Um, who like he was whose class I got taken out of, um, to go to that

00:49:38.400 meeting. And also I was like a Kairos leader, which is our, like, it's like a senior retreat. So I like

00:49:46.460 led one of the retreats and I was writing to talk with him and he like, he has been so supportive of

00:49:54.020 me. He's like, he always is like offering out his like prayers and trying to talk to me and make sure

00:50:01.240 that everything's okay. Because like, um, he just knows how much this has been affecting me. And

00:50:06.520 he's just been so supportive and great.

00:50:10.600 And what happens now in the hallways? Like, do you, do you and your accuser see each other? What's

00:50:16.200 the dynamic like?

00:50:18.020 Um, well, the,

00:50:22.620 Oh, it's okay, babe.

00:50:29.500 Um, the dynamic is so much different. Like I used to be like,

00:50:35.520 I like, um, like for example, I started ping pong club this year and it was like the biggest club

00:50:46.540 at Villa, like the big, biggest club ever to like happen. And I'm like super excited about it.

00:50:54.080 Now, like the thought of emailing my whole school makes me nauseous. Like there's so like, I, there's

00:51:00.840 no way I could like clear my name to the whole entire school. Like there's like all these

00:51:09.380 underclassmen, all these girls that don't know me that, cause like, I just don't know underclassmen 0.87

00:51:16.260 because we haven't been doing sports like we used to. So like, there's no way for me to like get,

00:51:21.240 like not even all the girls in my grade know what fully happens. So, um, like it's just,

00:51:28.820 I'm not like, I used to be able to talk to anyone and now I'm like, I can't. And, um,

00:51:35.020 it's like, it's just really upsetting because the school told me that they would make an

00:51:43.060 announcement clearing my name and they said that they're not going to do that. And so like, I can't,

00:51:48.640 like, I just want this to be over and I don't, yeah.

00:51:51.520 Well, I mean, that's where the law comes in. That's, that's why we have the law and juries

00:51:59.860 and judges to run a fair procedure where you can't just say, you know, we don't care what the

00:52:07.100 facts are. That's the, the courts are still the one area in which that is not okay to do. And this

00:52:13.260 seems like a good place to bring in Mark, your lawyer. Um, don't go away cause I'm not, we're not

00:52:18.860 done. I'd love to keep you in this conversation too. Mark, thank you for joining us and for making

00:52:24.120 Jane available too. It's heartbreaking. It's just so, it's so damn sad. And it, it makes me so angry

00:52:30.900 because these school administrators, I mean, unless Jane is pathological and has made this up from

00:52:37.420 start to finish, uh, these school administrators have a lot of explaining to do and really ought to

00:52:43.320 be ashamed of themselves.

00:52:44.280 Yeah. Appreciate how easy it would have been to solve this entire thing. At that first meeting

00:52:50.160 on October the 13th, all the principal and the, uh, and this wish had to do is say, we know this

00:52:57.880 didn't happen. By the way, let me backtrack a little bit. The school has a parent student handbook

00:53:02.640 that outlines different kinds of disciplinary offenses and remedies. And they outline various things with

00:53:10.060 penalties such as detention, full day detention. And then there's a category for more severe offenses,

00:53:16.580 which require more severe discipline than even full day, uh, detention. The first one is lying.

00:53:23.440 The second one is bigotry. And the third one is internet abuse. And so by the time of that first

00:53:29.940 meeting, the administration of the school knows that the accuser made up a lie. It was a lie based on

00:53:37.400 race and bigotry. And it was posted on the internet. And so all the first three of the major

00:53:43.860 enhanced offenses as outlined in the student handbook have been violated. And yet my client's

00:53:51.120 told that this accuser will not be punished under any circumstances because she's African American.

00:53:57.760 And my client is asked to fix the problem by admitting to lies. And all the school had to do,

00:54:04.800 all the administration had to do at the very first meeting is say to the accuser,

00:54:08.600 we know this didn't happen. Apologize for it. They don't even have to discipline her if they're 0.98

00:54:14.360 afraid of disciplining an African American student and, and make a public statement that this did not

00:54:20.180 happen. Instead, to this day, as from the statement you just read a minute ago, they're still denying it

00:54:25.620 happened. And they're still not coming to the support of a person that they know is innocent.

00:54:29.640 And, and it sounds like they've abandoned even entertaining the allegation that Jane may have

00:54:37.640 stood up in a class and looked at the accuser and said, black lives do not matter.

00:54:42.580 You know, and it seems to have gotten to be beyond that. It seems that their need now, 0.96

00:54:46.700 their, their kind of knee jerk need to support the concept of critical race theory,

00:54:51.720 obviates anything in the way of a, of a real discourse or obviates the need to investigate

00:54:56.680 what did or did not happen because the, uh, the, the need to enforce the concept of critical race

00:55:03.760 theory that all white people are racist because they're white overrides any factual inquiry.

00:55:10.100 And, and is that something I, I mean, I, I guess I could ask Jane that too, but is,

00:55:14.440 has critical race theory been, um, used? Has it been taught this year as we've seen at so many

00:55:20.520 schools or are you just referring to the messaging she got in the meetings?

00:55:25.520 Um, you know, it's my understanding. Well, let me, let me back up and say this. Since we filed this

00:55:29.620 lawsuit, I've gotten calls from parents from a variety of the prep schools in St. Louis, both,

00:55:34.660 um, Catholic prep schools and others, including one that I went to, uh, complaining about critical

00:55:41.140 race theory being forced down the throats of their kids. I think Villa Duchenne has probably had less of

00:55:46.400 that than the other schools that I've been contacted by. Um, despite the fact that in,

00:55:51.780 in my client's specific case, they've made no bones about their belief in critical race theory and

00:55:56.800 their desire to enforce it by force and intimidation if necessary.

00:56:01.400 Mm-hmm. What do you make of the fact that these teachers, uh, are allowed to, and students too,

00:56:08.140 are allowed to display BLM stickers and paraphernalia? And this is a controversial group. I don't,

00:56:13.320 I don't care who has a problem with me saying that it is a controversial group to, to put it at a

00:56:18.780 minimum. It's the concept of black lives matter is not controversial, but the group is, um, and yet 1.00

00:56:24.740 you're not allowed to show support for police and no one would feel comfortable showing support for

00:56:30.460 Trump. You know, what do you make of that? Well, you know, I gotta say that I know, and I know that

00:56:35.920 the administration knows, I know that Mr. Baber, the, uh, the head of school knows that BLM is a, uh,

00:56:41.940 as a Marxist organization, this anti-Catholic, anti-family, anti-capitalism, and that it stands

00:56:48.400 for everything that, that, uh, the traditional American values stand against. And no one can

00:56:54.120 honestly promote black lives matter as the organization, um, without being a, without having 0.52

00:57:01.360 at core adherence to a concept that America is intrinsically an evil place, that capitalism is

00:57:08.960 intrinsically evil, that families are bad, and that the religion is antithetical to, uh, to a race

00:57:15.840 free existence. I mean, this black lives matter is not a benign organization and anybody who promotes 1.00

00:57:22.420 it is, they either have to feign ignorance or they're, or they're in on it, in my humble opinion.

00:57:28.580 Well, that's the thing is that the group, like the, the idea of it was not that controversial,

00:57:32.900 right? I mean, like, that's why the marketing is so brilliant because lowercase black lives matter is 1.00

00:57:37.400 something everyone can agree with. But as we saw over the summer, the organized group has caused

00:57:43.240 a lot of damage and they are anti-capitalist. They are Marxist. That was in their own founding

00:57:49.320 documents, which up until recently were online until they started to scrub them, um, and have

00:57:54.540 problems with the nuclear family and so on and so forth. They go, it goes on and on, but I think it 0.67

00:57:59.580 was one thing to let somebody have a black lives matter t-shirt or sticker, uh, prior to all the damage

00:58:04.860 that was done this summer. But as of October of 2020, you know, cops had been murdered. David

00:58:09.500 Dorn was murdered right outside of, right in St. Louis, wasn't he? The retired cop who got killed.

00:58:13.500 Yeah. About a half of them are sitting right now.

00:58:16.540 Yeah. So it's like, look, all my, my only point is they're controversial and there's this one girl

00:58:23.280 who's got a couple of cops in the family who wants a single blue line and a flag just to say like,

00:58:28.980 not all cops are bad. And this turns into, you know, something really dark according to your

00:58:35.500 complaint. Um, so what, what should happen? I mean, actually, no, let me back up. Can we just

00:58:41.560 talk about the video? Have you seen the video of the, of the class? Will they not release that to

00:58:46.260 you? We have not gotten it. The, uh, the school was just served in this litigation, I think this

00:58:51.580 week because of COVID, um, the court system works very slowly. We filed this lawsuit, I think on

00:58:57.400 December 23rd, summons just got issued recently. And I think the school has just served this week.

00:59:03.700 And so we don't have any discovery yet. The, um, I'm the second lawyer on the case. The first lawyer

00:59:08.480 who's not, um, necessarily a litigator, uh, had requested the video. They refused to produce it.

00:59:15.700 Interestingly, uh, the standard practice to the school was that all the, all the zoom, all the,

00:59:20.660 uh, classes were zoomed and the zoom, uh, conferences were recorded and then posted to the internet

00:59:26.920 saying that this, this video has never been posted. And now, uh, after we filed our lawsuit,

00:59:34.160 the policy has changed to where you can only get the videos of the zooms upon its written request.

00:59:41.320 Um, but nonetheless, they have never produced this video.

00:59:44.920 Hmm. That's fascinating. I mean, the video, like that, that's very telling because of the video had

00:59:51.020 Jane on it, standing up and saying black lives do not matter. This would be a slam dunk for them. 1.00

00:59:56.920 Oh yeah. Well, you know, it's not, we're not in a unique situation where, where, uh, facts are all

01:00:03.720 into the discourse. Right. So, so what about the meeting then when she was represented either by

01:00:12.180 you or your predecessor, uh, Jane and her family had gotten a lawyer and the principal nonetheless pulls

01:00:18.500 her in for a meeting without any representation. And even without her parents, that to me sounds

01:00:25.540 hard to believe that you'd have a crying teenager there saying, please, may I call my mom? And the

01:00:31.740 principal is saying no, as another teacher's yelling at her, that she's a racist and it has

01:00:37.340 to admit it's all in her head and that she feels safe when she's saying she doesn't.

01:00:40.840 And more than that, this was prearranged because as she's called out of her class, she's specifically

01:00:46.580 told that she could not bring anything, including her cell phone. Um, and so they had every intention

01:00:52.000 of browbeating her into, well, she put it very nicely. They've gotten a letter from council.

01:00:57.360 They know that they, that they're, uh, in some hot water and what they wanted to do was to

01:01:03.000 coerce her, browbeat her into saying things, which could then be taken down by Ms. Kaplan on her laptop

01:01:09.060 in defense of, of what they saw as a coming lawsuit. And to have three adults, and by the way,

01:01:14.880 we're talking to principal of the school, uh, Ms. Michelle Mora, who is the quote, Dean of Student

01:01:20.980 Excellence, uh, which I don't even know what that means. And Ms. Kaplan, who's I think the Dean of

01:01:26.320 Students, um, three senior administrators, all browbeating a 17 year old girl who's begging to 0.89

01:01:34.040 talk to her mom and they won't let her. That's the, that's the basis of the, um, uh, unlawful

01:01:39.780 restraint aspect of our, of our lawsuit. But I mean, you imagine that. And by the way, all three of

01:01:46.200 these people are new to their positions. Ms. Steenberg is newly the principal. Ms. Morrow had been the

01:01:52.140 basketball coach until she got elevated to Dean of Student Excellence. Ms. Kaplan had just recently

01:01:58.760 become the Dean of Students. None of these people have advanced degrees or any specialized training

01:02:03.920 and administration. They were just bodies that needed to fill slots. And it'd be interesting to

01:02:09.600 find out, um, what the, what the selection criteria was for these positions. I know that the head of

01:02:16.600 school, Mr. Faber, um, had come from the East coast, I think he was from Connecticut. He had spent some

01:02:22.240 time in Chicago. He had most immediately before taking over his head of school at Philadelphia,

01:02:27.940 been the head of school at another sacred heart school down in the Lafayette, Louisiana, um, called

01:02:34.300 the Grand Coteau and, uh, had instigated a very, um, extreme, uh, uh, anti-racist criteria down there.

01:02:46.360 And by anti-racist these days, we mean racism, by identifying people by race and segregating them

01:02:52.080 by race to, uh, to, uh, to show how unracist we are by, by treating everybody differently based on

01:02:57.440 our race. What do you make of that statement they gave us that I, that I read? I don't know if you

01:03:01.720 heard that, but yeah, what do you, what do you make of that? Well, I'd like to know what lawyer

01:03:05.400 drafted it, um, because it seems to be, uh, at least to what I know so far, completely the opposite of

01:03:12.180 what that in fact occurred and what has continued to occur. Now their student, uh, parent handbook

01:03:17.860 states expressly that they're going to treat everybody the same, regardless of race and

01:03:22.700 religion and national origin, that they want to treat everybody fairly. I mean, what that letter

01:03:27.140 that she wrote, that statement she just read says is basically verbatim out of their student parent

01:03:32.260 handbook, but it flies in the face of the fact that they have in fact treated my client differently,

01:03:38.680 expressly, expressly based on her race and her political positions, um, and have expressly treated

01:03:44.920 her accuser differently and beneficially because of her race. I will, I've, since the time that we

01:03:51.700 filed the lawsuit, I have learned that there was one phone call from the principal with my client's

01:03:57.960 parents in response to, uh, the initial, uh, complaint. And, uh, the parents were told by the

01:04:05.300 principal that the accuser who had been there since the seventh grade, uh, says that there had been,

01:04:10.740 this is a, this is the statement from the principal of true. There had been a lot of, uh, hostile

01:04:16.860 outbursts from the accuser since the seventh grade, but she hasn't hurt anybody yet. And therefore they

01:04:24.420 didn't, they weren't concerned for the physical safety of Jane. Um, since even though this, this accuser

01:04:31.060 had been hostile and, and, and engaged in outbursts on a regular basis, um, she hadn't actually hurt

01:04:36.940 anybody yet. So we're just going to ignore it. Hmm. Well, I mean, I, you can hear the pain that your

01:04:44.300 client's going through. You can hear it. She's a kid. This is extremely traumatic stuff. And, you know,

01:04:50.800 it sounds like the school is just totally insensitive to, to anything that Jane might be going through,

01:04:56.400 at least according to what she said to us here today. And I, and I realized the school

01:05:00.520 gets its day in court too, but they just, I don't know that Jane's pain matters to anyone.

01:05:08.500 I think there is such a, uh, the fear of, uh, not going along with the, the, the new reality of,

01:05:14.980 of education, that everything is race-based and that everything in every course, whether it's math

01:05:19.800 or science or religion or art or music, um, or history or social studies or anything else,

01:05:25.660 everything is based on race now. And I think that, I don't know what happened to this country in this 0.98

01:05:31.680 last year, but now every school is basing every course and every, every concept on the need to

01:05:38.820 segregate us by race and treat us differently. And I think every administrator is now afraid of going

01:05:44.160 against that grain for fear of losing their job, losing their futures, um, and being, you know,

01:05:50.180 called a racist. Oh, I mean, here in New York city at the Dalton school, parents just wrote a letter

01:05:55.560 complaining. I mean, this is one of the most liberal schools in the country. Just wrote a

01:05:58.580 letter complaining about that. Among other things, they're having the kids reenact, uh, cop shootings,

01:06:04.560 reenact alleged, you know, shootings of racist white cops and black men. I mean, it's like, it's nuts. 0.99

01:06:12.920 Yeah. And I know that I've read the Dalton school manifesto and it's just, it's, it is almost exactly

01:06:19.820 like the, uh, uh, uh, movement for black lives, uh, manifesto that was published in 2016. I mean,

01:06:28.660 it's just, it's, it's a movement that is centrally organized and is emanating out of, of basically,

01:06:35.460 you know, uh, the weather underground and black Panthers. And, um, you know, I, I get into this for 1.00

01:06:42.300 hours because I just, I can't imagine how the entire country has been taken over by this. And nobody has

01:06:47.280 mentioned the fact that these people are just blatant racist. Well, you know, that that's why

01:06:52.160 it's like, I feel like people like Coleman Hughes or Chloe Valdary or Glenn Lowry are very brave

01:06:57.480 because those are two, the first two I think are more liberal for sure. And Glenn Lowry is more

01:07:02.780 conservative. These are just a couple of news, but these are black scholars who are speaking out

01:07:07.200 against this saying we all want the same thing. We want unity. We want cohesiveness. We want love.

01:07:13.480 We want support. Um, but we have very, very different views of this country, the, the severity

01:07:19.760 of racism in the country, whether it's institutional or not, and the way forward. And, um, you know,

01:07:25.920 you're allowed to, you're, you're allowed to have different views and, and the, the schools that are

01:07:29.740 just jumping right into all white people are racist, you know, and just shoveling Robin DiAngelo's

01:07:34.540 messages down the throats of children with no thought for how that's going to make them feel or change

01:07:40.080 their lives are really endangering them. This is, this is dangerous stuff. So what that, which leads

01:07:47.020 me to the question of what do you think should happen to the, these teachers and these administrators?

01:07:52.740 Well, I think that, uh, I'm hoping that in the course of this litigation, we're going to demonstrate

01:07:57.980 that, you know, the facts are, are what we allege they are, that the administrators knew that at the time

01:08:05.660 and that they put the, uh, the political, uh, expediency of critical race theory and black lives

01:08:13.280 matter movement, uh, ahead of the, uh, of the welfare of the kids. I mean, it's, you see that

01:08:19.580 every place. I mean, I, I, uh, had a, uh, another client of mine whose, uh, uh, son goes to the same

01:08:27.760 prep school I went to here in St. Louis where a math teacher went off in a math class, totally

01:08:32.780 unprovoked for, you know, 45 minutes about critical race theory, about how all these kids

01:08:37.380 were racist and they need to admit it. And, uh, when that current sent a letter to the headmaster

01:08:43.160 and had it sit down with him, the headmaster was shocked and put an end to it. And that's

01:08:48.640 all that needed to happen here. All they need to do is acknowledge what really happened and what

01:08:53.440 didn't happen and support the student instead of sacrificing the student on the altar of critical

01:08:58.780 race theory. What is the claim for? Well, you know,

01:09:02.780 uh, I always say to my clients, all I can do is turn their, their pain and misery into

01:09:07.700 dollar bills. Unfortunately, the way the legal system works, that the only remedy is really

01:09:12.400 monetary. But that I think is a, is the secondary import in this case. I think what my clients

01:09:18.620 want to do is just have an opportunity to show the community that this is what's going on. This

01:09:23.460 is, this is what's festering amongst them. And, and parents don't realize it. And by the time

01:09:30.180 it comes to a head, by the time they realize what kind of poison is being fed their children,

01:09:35.100 it's already happened. And so this is kind of a wake up call. This is an opportunity to let the

01:09:39.660 community know that, uh, uh, that this is going on. And the problem is what's your alternative?

01:09:45.920 The, um, I got another, I have another client who told me last week that, uh, his son goes to the

01:09:52.500 public school, uh, in the wealthiest neighborhood in St. Louis and, uh, that they've had an hour long 1.00

01:09:59.060 session where they were lectured on, um, uh, ACAB, all cops are bastards. And they had to accept that. 1.00

01:10:07.760 And, you know, I, I, you know, I, I, I know that in your case, your, your former kid's school wanted

01:10:14.440 to teach them that in every classroom, there's a killer cop being bred, but I mean, this is every

01:10:20.400 place. And just in one year, how the heck did that happen? I know, I know it's disturbing. And I know

01:10:27.160 you've had personal experience with this to some extent. Well, I'll talk to you about that in one

01:10:30.880 second, but can I ask you, um, I don't have the complaint in front of me, in front of me, but what are the

01:10:35.360 claims? One is a breach of contract because the contract executed by my client and the school

01:10:42.220 incorporates by reference, the student parent handbook where, um, and I detail it paragraph by

01:10:48.940 paragraph, all the different ways that the school has violated their mutual covenants in that, that

01:10:54.620 student parent handbook by treating my client differently because of race, by not enforcing

01:10:59.940 discipline evenly, um, by preferences based on, on race and political opinion, um, all contrary

01:11:07.800 to the contractual obligations, uh, uh, based on the student parent handbook. Then there's

01:11:13.020 kind of an interesting claim under Missouri law. We have a Missouri, uh, uh, merchandise practices

01:11:19.240 act, uh, where it's, uh, actionable in Missouri if you sell a product under false pretenses, similar

01:11:27.000 to the federal statute. And there's a, and it has been specifically applied to selling education

01:11:33.460 as a, as a, a merchandise. And if they take in students and accept tuition on the basis,

01:11:42.800 on the representation that they're going to be unbiased, non-racist, even-handed, and treat

01:11:48.680 all people equally on the, on the basis regardless of their, of their race, gender, or national origin,

01:11:56.100 in fact, they know that's not true. That's a, that's an actionable, um, misrepresentation

01:12:01.600 under the merchandise practicing act.

01:12:03.860 Do you think you have available to you, um, a discrimination claim, you know, a, a claim

01:12:09.460 that they've discriminated against Jane on the basis of race?

01:12:12.820 Yes. And, you know, we, uh, Missouri, uh, constitution specifically prohibits that. That's,

01:12:17.160 that's the last allegation of the, of the petition. Uh, unfortunately that unless they're accepting,

01:12:22.980 uh, some federal or state aid, uh, if they're accepting support, I'm not sure we have a,

01:12:30.300 a good constitutional claim. But once again, we've alleged that because we do not know whether

01:12:35.100 or not that's the case, but if they're using federal money or state money to promote this

01:12:39.320 propaganda, then yes, that's a, that's a constitutional violation as well.

01:12:43.240 Are you prepared to try this all the way through? I mean, would this be a jury trial? And are you

01:12:46.580 prepared to actually try the case?

01:12:47.940 I don't file any lawsuit though. I'm thinking all the way through if I have to.

01:12:51.820 Hmm. Let's just go the other way. If, if Jane really did stand up in the classroom and yell this 1.00

01:12:57.020 and then feigned indignance at being falsely accused, then there's something seriously wrong

01:13:04.240 with Jane and the school has been awfully aggrieved. Um, but I, I just keep coming back to you. If that,

01:13:11.940 if that were the case, they would have released the video that the video would show us and we'd see

01:13:16.780 Jane on the tape and, and maybe they'll do that and, and I can have you back. And then I'll say,

01:13:20.960 Hey, Mark, there she is. But until that happens, they, they don't deserve a presumption in their

01:13:26.640 favor.

01:13:27.460 Well, even, even if let's say, let's say the facts weren't so self-evident, let's say the case

01:13:32.340 wasn't videoed and a class wasn't videoed. And it was a, he said, she said, or she said,

01:13:36.820 she said in this case, even if that were the factual background, what on earth would be the

01:13:42.160 legitimate basis for pulling my client into the principal's office and having her brow 0.99

01:13:46.920 beat? What would be the point in having your accuser spend an hour screaming at her and jabbing

01:13:52.940 her finger in my client's face, calling her a racist? That's no way, even if the facts are in

01:13:58.880 dispute, that's no way to reach a resolution. That's the way to escalate rather than deescalate

01:14:04.460 the situation. And I've got to tell you, yeah. And since then, as, as Jane referenced when you were

01:14:12.820 asking her question, since these events, her accuser has become emboldened. She feels that

01:14:18.480 the school is supporting her and knows that nothing she does will result in any sanction against her.

01:14:24.100 And so she's become more outspoken and more defiant and more out there than she was before.

01:14:32.040 And so it's given, it's given the accuser license to, to kind of flourish while at the same time

01:14:39.980 really crushing my client, making her life miserable. I mean, at this point, Jane can't

01:14:45.580 transfer to another school, right? I mean, we're, we're four months away from the end of the school

01:14:49.260 year. Yeah. I'm just hoping that, uh, that she's allowed to graduate. We've gotten at least one

01:14:54.660 ominous, uh, uh, correspondence from the school talking about how close she is to the end of her,

01:15:01.100 uh, high school career and how they hope that this won't interfere with their ability to

01:15:06.400 conclude her seniors, uh, her final semester. It kind of not very, you know, well hidden

01:15:13.380 subtext there. Well, we'll look forward to covering that if they try to kick her out before 1.00

01:15:18.340 she's had her day in court. That's talk about adding insult to injury. Up next, Mark is going

01:15:23.320 to walk us through the latest on his case and wait until you hear what happened to this activist

01:15:28.640 prosecutor who has been coming after Mark and his wife. Guess what she did and the consequence to

01:15:36.500 her in trying to make these guys into a political football that's up in one second. But first let's

01:15:43.340 talk about HR issues. I mean, how many conversations do you begin like that a day? Hey, talk about your,

01:15:49.460 actually we should, because the reason you want to avoid talking about HR issues is because they're

01:15:54.180 stressful. And if you're a business owner, they can kill you wrongful termination suits and minimum

01:15:59.080 wage requirements and red tape and labor regulations. And it's overwhelming and no one wants to do it.

01:16:04.040 And you don't have to, that is where Bambi comes in B A M B E E. See how I spelled that? I spelled that

01:16:12.500 perfectly. It was created specifically for small businesses. And look, if you want to hire like a

01:16:18.360 dedicated HR manager, it's an average of $70,000 a year to get somebody. You don't want to do that.

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01:17:14.220 That's Bambi.com slash MK. Bam to the B-E-E dot com slash MK. Check them out. And now we want to

01:17:23.220 bring you a feature we have here on the show called Asked and Answered, where we try to respond to some

01:17:28.480 of our listener mail. Steve Krakauer is our executive producer, and he's been sorting through

01:17:33.860 the submissions. Hey, Steve. Hey, Megan. Yeah, lots of good ones this week. And this one comes to us at

01:17:39.200 questions at DevilMayCareMedia.com, so people can write in there or just ask a question on one of

01:17:45.220 our social media accounts at Megan Kelly Show. This one is from John Harbor, and he's got a question

01:17:49.940 that I ask myself every day. He says he's a moderate. He enjoys listening to the show, appreciates your

01:17:55.460 points of view, but he has one question. Why are you still using Twitter? The obvious solution to me,

01:18:00.520 he says, is for conservatives to drop it. It's a great point, John. I think I'm just going to go over

01:18:05.100 to Parler. Oh, wait. You know, you know, it's like they have a monopoly. And I was on Parler,

01:18:14.200 and I was actually doing pretty well on Parler until I got pulled. But I confess I didn't leave

01:18:18.420 Twitter, and it wasn't because I thought Parler would go out of business. It's because Twitter

01:18:22.520 just has such huge reach, and I've got pretty significant reach on it. And even though it's

01:18:29.340 completely dominated by the left, I mean, Twitter is definitely a leftist site. So you're going to be

01:18:34.860 subjected to a fair amount of bullying, ridicule, and scorn if you're not a leftist over there.

01:18:41.300 And frankly, even if you are a leftist, they're not nice to anyone. But especially if you're not,

01:18:45.540 it is also a place where I feel a connection to people who are sane, who are kind, who I think are

01:18:53.800 rooting for me and for whom I am rooting. And I'll just give you one example. You remember we had

01:18:58.060 Bridget Phetasy on the show, right? I wouldn't have known about Bridget Phetasy had it not been for

01:19:01.940 Twitter. Chloe Valdary, same thing. I found her on Twitter. Love her. She's the answer to all of

01:19:06.760 our problems. If you haven't listened to that episode, go do it. And Bridget, you know, she sent 0.93

01:19:11.200 me a sweet DM, you know, the direct message on Twitter after I left NBC. And I was like, who is

01:19:16.200 this wonderful person who's thinking about me? You know, she said she was worried about me. I'm like,

01:19:20.940 oh my God, who's this beautiful person who's worried about me? Most people are like, F you,

01:19:25.340 enjoy your money, you biatch. Right? So it's like, it's like so sweet. That's how we became friends. 0.95

01:19:31.640 And that's it. And if you don't know Bridget, listen to that episode too, because you'll see

01:19:35.280 what a beautiful person she is. Anyway, lots of relationships like that for me have begun on

01:19:41.820 Twitter and it's amusing. I have to say it's very funny. They're like Jesse Kelly. He's,

01:19:48.120 uh, he's with the first he's hysterical. That guy has me in stitches. Um, Stephen Miller,

01:19:55.260 not the one who worked at the white house. Another one. He's hysterical. He's like the

01:19:59.940 funniest guy on Twitter. So clever, literally makes me laugh out loud all the time. There's

01:20:04.480 a lot of people I could go on and say this stuff about. So it's worth the follow. And you,

01:20:09.420 you know, you get the news quickly, you get amused quickly, you get abused quickly. I'm on like a rap

01:20:14.960 now. So I would say net net is still a positive experience for me. And it doesn't really bother

01:20:20.260 me too much. Like when they, they, I start trending as people take something totally innocuous and make

01:20:25.340 it sound awful. I have learned by this point in my life that the people who are with me,

01:20:29.400 the sane people that doesn't make them hate you or think you've done anything wrong. They just scoff

01:20:34.300 at it and move on. Right. And if a left wants to get themselves, get themselves all up in arms about

01:20:38.300 something I've said. Okay. Kind of the way I felt about, there was this website when I was at Fox

01:20:42.880 and, um, their motto was we watch Fox. So you don't have to, and they would write just terrible

01:20:49.200 things about all of us. And I, it used to amuse me. Like think about your critics, the people who

01:20:54.800 hate you the most sitting around all day, watching you, listening to you, documenting your every word

01:21:03.920 you've already won. You've already vanquished them. Right. So it's, it's kind of like that when you

01:21:10.980 stir these people up who are dishonest brokers, right? Like I've already won. Just, just the fact

01:21:15.800 that you've tried, you, you picked the fight has, has been a win for me. So anyway, long-winded

01:21:22.000 answer, John, but I hope that helps you understand. And look, if we could, if we could actually build a

01:21:26.860 meaningful competitor to Twitter, I'd go in a heartbeat, but for now it's like, it's like high

01:21:32.260 school, right? Like we're talking about high school today. It's like high school. You've got to deal

01:21:35.620 with the bullies, but hang with your friends. And now back to Mark. Let me shift gears with you now,

01:21:45.300 if I may, because we got to talk about the fact that you've had your own experiences

01:21:48.200 with black lives matter, the protesters at least. And we're in the news all over the news in June

01:21:54.840 because you are the man who had to quote the mansion. Everybody made sure to refer to your house

01:22:00.860 as the mansion and stood out there with your gun with your wife because the protesters had come

01:22:06.080 into your private development through the gate and, um, were, were right by your property.

01:22:12.560 And the crazy thing that happened there, people had all sorts of opinions about whether you guys

01:22:16.800 should have been out there with your guns. The crazy thing that happened there was when all was said

01:22:20.740 and done, this, what appears to be a radical, uh, prosecutor, the circuit attorney has charged

01:22:28.120 only two people, you and your wife, not one of the people who were trespassing on, on the property.

01:22:35.680 You know, your, your development has been charged. Only you got charged. You and your wife got charged.

01:22:42.760 And she has basically said, this is a quote from circuit attorney, Kimberly Gardner.

01:22:48.340 We must protect the right to peacefully protest and any attempt to chill it through intimidation

01:22:54.540 will not be tolerated. And she says, you place the protesters in fear for their safety. And that's

01:23:02.340 why you're now facing felony charges, Mark. How, uh, how are you feeling about that today? And where

01:23:08.040 does that case stand today? Oh gosh, you know, I gotta tell you, I'll give you a little frame of

01:23:12.280 reference. Um, St. Louis is the murder capital of the world. This is one of the, this is the most

01:23:19.280 dangerous place for homicides in the country per capita. Uh, last year we had 262 murders in the

01:23:26.020 city of St. Louis out of a population of about 300,000. On June 1st and 2nd, after the George

01:23:31.560 Floyd thing, uh, the, the, uh, people of, uh, of the, the choose to hold themselves out as our moral

01:23:39.660 superiors and resolve all our problems through peace and love decided the way to, to show their

01:23:44.760 peace and love is to burn down downtown St. Louis. And that night, uh, millions of dollars worth of

01:23:49.740 property was burned down. Four police officers were shot. Uh, retired captain David Dorn was

01:23:55.340 murdered in a secondary employment at a pawn shop, not very far from my house. Uh, we watched the

01:24:01.380 7-Eleven in downtown St. Louis, my wife and I from a live helicopter feed for 10, 20, 30, 40 minutes

01:24:08.040 from the time the first rock went through a window, place gets looted empty. Then they set fire to it.

01:24:13.200 Building becomes engulfed in flames. Roof falls in. Not a single policeman shows up. Not a single

01:24:19.260 fireman shows up. And this is two blocks from police headquarters in downtown St. Louis.

01:24:23.920 We look at each other and say, oh my God, you know, when the pit hits the sand, you're all on

01:24:27.720 your own in this world. And then, um, the organization, the Antifa-like Black Lives Matter 0.55

01:24:33.720 organization in St. Louis called Expect Us, which is headed by none other than my new Congresswoman,

01:24:39.500 Cory Bush, starts having, um, periodic mob action, uh, peaceful protests. And because when you live in

01:24:48.120 a, in a city which has been controlled by Democrats for now 77 years, uh, and you've got a circuit

01:24:54.580 attorney who's vowed not to prosecute anybody for what they consider minor offenses, including up to

01:24:59.880 assault and everything else. Um, they advertise, Expect Us advertises when and where they're going to

01:25:05.900 have a mob action, including in my neighborhood. Um, but when you talk about Kimberly Gardner not

01:25:12.880 prosecuting anybody other than us for that, what happened on June 28th, 250 people or so got arrested

01:25:19.020 on that night of June the 1st and 2nd, the night when David Dorn was murdered and, uh, four other

01:25:24.660 police officers were shot. I think with the-

01:25:26.900 This is one of the darkest days. This is one of the darkest days of those Black Lives Matter 1.00

01:25:31.600 protests that wound up being riots. That, that death toll and the death of David Dorn was the,

01:25:37.580 I'll never forget that. I mean, that, and people gloss right over it when they, when they defend BLM

01:25:42.260 and you can wear the t-shirt and there's no accountability for it. I'm sorry. I just, I,

01:25:46.100 I wanted to weigh in because that's, that's your neighborhood. That's your town.

01:25:49.880 And I've lived here. I've lived in the city of St. Louis. We, when, when my wife and I,

01:25:53.340 I grew up in St. Louis, but I went to school in Dallas, started practicing there. And, uh,

01:25:58.180 then my wife and I moved back to St. Louis. We were out in West St. Louis County on five

01:26:02.820 acres with our horses in the backyard and everything. And we decided to move back into the city

01:26:07.440 at a time when, when nobody was moving back to the city, when everybody was fleeing the

01:26:11.360 other direction. And we spent, well, on February the 11th of this year, it'll be 33 years in

01:26:16.320 that house. And, uh, we, we have lived in what has always been the most dangerous city in the

01:26:22.420 country now for 33 years. And, uh, um, when we protect our house against an angry armed and

01:26:31.020 dangerous mob, we've faced four years in prison. Kimberly Gardner is not prosecuting any of the

01:26:37.260 250 people that got arrested on that night of June 1st or so. Wow. Not one? Nope. People that

01:26:44.580 killed David Dorn, I think three out of four of them, um, or maybe four out of five of them have

01:26:48.860 been captured. Um, they were just random protesters, just the angry mob. Um, but all the other people,

01:26:55.840 the arsonists, the people that shot the other cops, nobody's getting prosecuted. In fact,

01:27:00.400 nobody in the city of St. Louis gets prosecuted for virtually anything. Uh, and now there's a big

01:27:05.640 movement. There's a big movement now to quote, well, you know, if you read the Black Lives Matter

01:27:10.100 stuff and the movement for Black Lives Manifesto, um, going back to, even before that, going back to

01:27:16.500 the 90s, that's the same program to, to defund the police, decriminalize everything, and, uh,

01:27:23.860 and to destroy traditional values. And right now, at least one of the people running for mayor in the

01:27:29.140 city of St. Louis wants to, uh, decriminalize prostitution and all drugs, uh, uh, uh, expunge

01:27:37.920 everybody's record for anybody that's ever been arrested for any sex or drug related crime and

01:27:43.360 then reimburse them for the time that they've lost whilst being in jail. Oh, come on. Crime does pay.

01:27:52.700 No, no. And you know, um, I'll go on and on, but I mean, I got to tell you this, but I, the fact

01:27:58.280 that people like Chris Cuomo and Don Lennon and all these guys support Black Lives Matter expressly

01:28:06.320 and never mentioned, for example, stuff like, well, you know who Susan Rosenberg is, right?

01:28:11.920 No, who is that?

01:28:13.300 Well, she, um, as of now or last summer, she was on the, uh, uh, she was vice chairman of an entity

01:28:20.260 called Thousand Currents, which was a funding branch of Black Lives Matter. Susan Rosenberg was

01:28:26.580 a member of the M-19 communist organization in the 70s and 80s. She, um, was the getaway driver in a

01:28:34.420 branch robbery where two police officers and one guard were murdered. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I covered

01:28:39.440 that. I mean, I, I didn't cover it when it actually happened, but she, she, uh, her role in it came up

01:28:44.580 again. Her group, including her, bombed the U.S. Capitol building in 1984. They bombed an FBI office.

01:28:53.860 They bombed the Israel aircraft industry's office. They bombed the South African consulate. They bombed the

01:29:00.520 Morton, D.C., uh, Naval Yard, uh, Fort McNair. Um, she was sentenced to 58 years in prison. Oh,

01:29:08.680 more than that, she and her fellow, uh, uh, Linda Sue Evans created a, uh, prison break where two other 1.00

01:29:16.200 communists, one of whom is, uh, two of which are now still on the FBI's most wanted list, one of whom,

01:29:21.480 um, who, uh, uh, uh, is, her name was, uh, Joanne Chesemar, but she now goes by the alleged African 0.69

01:29:28.680 name of Assante Shakur hiding out in Cuba. Um, this woman got 58 years in prison and guess what?

01:29:37.000 On the last day of Bill Clinton's administration, at the insistence of none other than Jerry Nadler,

01:29:44.440 she gets her sentence commuted along with, uh, um, uh, Evans. These people are about communists.

01:29:51.560 They have, uh, they have, um, sworn to the destruction of the United States. They have,

01:29:57.640 they were trained in Cuba. Um, they have engaged in actual terrorism. They have been convicted of

01:30:04.600 actual terrorism. They have bombed the U.S. Capitol building. Susan Rosenberg, who, who is a convicted

01:30:11.000 terrorist and murderer and bomber of the Capitol building, um, is vice chair of the funding arm of

01:30:19.560 black lives matter. Okay. This is public, this is public record. Oh no, you, you know how it is, 0.97

01:30:25.800 Mark, any pushback on this group and people say you're a racist, like, and you just have to get

01:30:31.560 okay with being called terrible names. If you want to engage in this battle, because there are some of

01:30:36.280 us who are committed to facts and truth, wherever it leads us, whether it makes groups that sound great,

01:30:41.880 look bad or groups that sound bad, look great. We have to just go where the evidence takes us. And,

01:30:48.040 and in your case, I, I watched, I didn't know you. I, I wasn't rooting for you or anybody else. I

01:30:53.480 watched. I'm like, I don't think they don't look that, that menacing. I don't know. Why did they have

01:30:58.200 the guns? I guess I, I might do that. I might be a little worried if they had come into my private

01:31:03.000 development, which was trespass. And then I follow the evidence and I saw the police actually alleging,

01:31:10.360 contrary to what Rasheen Aldrich, who helped lead the protest in your neighborhood said, he said it was

01:31:15.160 peaceful and there were no threats so that you guys, the McCloskey's were overreaction,

01:31:19.000 overreacting. Uh, and the police investigated and said, all right, we found at least one person who

01:31:25.000 was armed. We found another person who had a bulletproof vest on. We found people holding

01:31:30.120 signs that read, you own a business. Your business is gone. We're coming back, baby. You ain't the only

01:31:35.640 blank blank with a gun and they coming back to your house. Then there was another protester heard on

01:31:42.120 tape saying I was the one who opened the gate. The gate was broken after they pulled a gun.

01:31:47.080 What law did we break? We keep guns there, but not for show, not to look a certain way, but for use,

01:31:53.800 they would have shot. Then they would have been put down. So I, I will say when I look at your case,

01:32:00.440 I think it had I been the prosecuting DA, I would have said, and I'm just going to stand down on accusing

01:32:05.880 the McCloskey's of a disturbing the quote, peaceful protest by trying to chill, uh, and otherwise

01:32:14.680 entirely lawful thing through intimidation. You are trying to defend yourself in your home.

01:32:21.160 And you know, Megan, it's so much worse than you can possibly imagine. My, my wife, um, is still,

01:32:26.600 still brought to tears whenever she sees any of the video of this stuff. I mean, we're talking

01:32:31.080 three to 500 people screaming, shouting, threatening, threatening murder and rape and arson.

01:32:39.720 And, and not for just the 32 seconds that everybody saw in college, but this thing goes

01:32:44.440 on for 15 minutes. And, uh, uh, we were terrified and it, it was not a benign event. And it was

01:32:52.760 only the first of two events. The thing that the media did not cover is that that was June 28th.

01:32:58.280 We heard from a client of ours who's a member of the organization that they're coming back on July 0.60

01:33:02.920 the 3rd for the express purpose of killing us and burning down the house. And they did come back

01:33:08.760 on July the 3rd. And it was a crowd of up to a thousand people. And we couldn't get private

01:33:14.280 security of people that we normally would retain secondary employment cops. They didn't want to

01:33:19.720 get involved because they were afraid of getting bad press. We were referred to an entity that does

01:33:25.720 international corporate security, you know, special forces type guys that do pretty high

01:33:30.760 profile stuff all over the world. They got bad press over the Ferguson riots and they wouldn't

01:33:35.720 get involved. So I say to the guy who owns it, what the heck are we supposed to do? And he says,

01:33:42.680 well, I would just take whatever you can't live without, put it in your car, leave and abandon the

01:33:47.720 house. I said to him, there's no effing way. And heck, I'm going to do that. I'm going to go down to the

01:33:52.200 ship if I have to, but we're not going to, we're not just going to let these people take over and

01:33:55.720 burn down our house. And so, um, we had gotten a call earlier in the week from a gentleman at the

01:34:01.320 White House that said that the, uh, the president wanted to express his support. And if there's ever

01:34:06.680 anything that he could do for us, let us know. Well, now it's getting to be later on in the week.

01:34:11.640 And we've been, uh, we know for a fact that this crowd is going to come back with the express purpose 0.91

01:34:17.400 of killing us and burning down the house. So I called back up the White House and I said,

01:34:21.640 wait, you know, you, you guys said if there's ever anything you could do, um, for us, this is a

01:34:25.880 pretty gosh darn good time. So he gave me a Mark Meadows cell phone number. And I talked to Mark

01:34:30.680 Meadows and told him the long version of this very short version of the story. Uh, and he got to work

01:34:36.360 on it. Uh, the next call I made was to Tucker Carlson. Um, and I'm sitting on the bench in the kitchen

01:34:42.280 of our house. My wife is crying in the background. I'm telling the story I just told you about how

01:34:47.080 I can't get any help. The police have been ordered to stand down. Um, and we're facing death and

01:34:52.520 destruction on Friday. And I think this is probably Thursday by now. And, uh, Tucker goes on air with

01:34:58.360 that, which I kind of call arms, but we've spent now it's Thursday evening. Our daughter 31 years

01:35:05.400 old had been staying with us. Uh, she was in for, for dinner the prior Sunday and stayed because what 0.79

01:35:09.880 was going on. And, uh, um, she gave us each a hug and a kiss, took her favorite stuffed animal

01:35:16.200 from when she was a kid and left expecting to never see us again. Um, and then, uh, Thursday

01:35:22.680 comes Thursday's over and we not slept since Sunday. We're like, I'd been sweating 24 seven,

01:35:28.600 literally sweating, um, hiding stuff, sticking stuff in walls and under beds and trying to

01:35:35.160 think what the heck we're going to do. Um, with every expectation that our lives are going to end on

01:35:40.200 Friday. Uh, and then stuff came together. I mean, we had, by the time the crowd hit our gate on Friday

01:35:47.400 evening, uh, we had, uh, uh, six Navy SEALs, uh, that some had come up from Texas wanted the fourth

01:35:55.160 generation cattle farmer had heard our situation through his gear and his pickup and drove straight

01:36:01.640 in, got here about six 30 on Friday evening. Um, thanks in part to, to Tucker. Um, we got a whole

01:36:08.680 bunch of secondary employment, rural cops that showed up. Um, we had, uh, uh, the chief of police,

01:36:15.960 the only police officer in the city of St. Louis that was actually there that night all night

01:36:20.040 was a chief himself, John Hayden, by the way, he's an African-American gentleman, super guy.

01:36:25.000 He came and met with our private security forces and, uh, and organized a, you know, a plan of defense.

01:36:31.160 And he stayed there virtually all night when the crowd had served up against the fence,

01:36:37.240 he would personally go and talk them back, but we, uh, we survived, but I mean, it was harrowing.

01:36:42.600 It was, it was now a thousand people and it was, uh, that, that, that part of it never gets mentioned

01:36:50.040 by the press. And then we've got that night on July 3rd, when the crowd is coming down the street,

01:36:57.240 chanting, burn the MF down in the front of the crowd is none other than Corey Bush on a megaphone

01:37:03.720 standing out in front of my house, chanting, you can't stop the revolution. You can't stop

01:37:09.960 the revolution. Now she's got the goal to stand up on the floor of the House of Representatives

01:37:16.200 and say that anybody who supports insurrection is unfit to be in the House of Representatives.

01:37:22.280 Well, I got news for you. Her organization, uh, disavows peaceful protests. Um, you talked about

01:37:30.120 Rashid Aldrich. He has expressly said that expect us, this Antifa-like organization, doesn't like,

01:37:37.400 doesn't want to have peaceful protests. They want to be as disruptive and as in your face as possible,

01:37:43.880 uh, that they have to break laws in order to get their message across and they have no intention of

01:37:48.360 being peaceful. And you mentioned the gun and the, and the body armor, but I can tell you,

01:37:54.280 and I'm backtracking a little bit because this is the night of June the 28th. I'm out in the front

01:37:58.760 porch and I'm holding my rifle and my wife is holding that pistol that she knew didn't work. 1.00

01:38:04.120 And it's right in front of us in order to be intimidating are these two guys. One of them's

01:38:08.760 wearing camo colored body armor. Um, and the other guy's wearing the desert storm stuff,

01:38:14.600 style light colored body armor. The guy in the camel body, body armor is close enough to me that

01:38:20.440 he sees that I can see. So he pulls out from the ammo pouches on his, on his armor, two loaded

01:38:26.360 magazines, points them at me so I can see that they're loaded with cartridges, clicks them together

01:38:31.000 in front of me, points at me and says, you are next. Meanwhile, the, uh, the guy, uh, in the light

01:38:37.000 colored body armor, whose arm starts creeping closer and closer. And he's got typical, you know,

01:38:43.000 Antifa kind of face covering and head covering. So you can't see anything but the slit of his eyes.

01:38:48.120 And he keeps creeping closer and closer and closer. And I look at over at Patty and I said,

01:38:54.200 you know, if he comes a foot closer, I'm going to have to kill him. And, uh, he's armed and being 0.99

01:39:00.120 intimidating. And Patty leans over to me and, uh, says, you're not killing anybody tonight.

01:39:05.880 You know, the voice of reason, but we didn't, didn't put off the shot.

01:39:09.720 Yeah. Can I ask you, can I ask you the city slicker, you know, elite media question? Because

01:39:16.360 I do have this question genuinely. If this had been happening to me and I've got some property

01:39:21.480 in New Jersey, so I do have a little bit of a suburban existence, but I would have gone inside

01:39:26.120 my house. I would have gone inside. I would have deadbolted everything. And I would have called

01:39:29.240 every cop and every security person I could. So I'm sure you've got an answer to that, but what is it?

01:39:33.640 Well, the answer is this. I did a, uh, a, uh, interview with, uh, Carlos Watson, uh, last week

01:39:39.880 where he asked the exact same question. I like Carlos Watson. He's, he's a good guy.

01:39:44.440 He really is. And, and he is probably been, uh, he gave us all the time we wanted to. He's very

01:39:51.320 even handed, um, very honest and very sincere. And I was very impressed with his, with his interview.

01:39:56.520 And, uh, we told him so at the end, I, you know, at the end of it, he, he had asked us earlier,

01:40:01.080 who did we respect to the media? And after the interview was over, I said, well, you know,

01:40:04.840 now I can list you.

01:40:07.080 Aw, that's great. I, he doesn't get enough attention for being the fair guy he is.

01:40:12.440 So anyway, the, the answer to the question is that between June the 1st, when they burned down

01:40:17.560 downtown St. Louis and shot four officers and killed Captain Doran, who, by the way, was,

01:40:23.640 you know, very well respected, just a wonderful guy. Um, uh, we have started seeing more and more

01:40:31.240 of the neighborhood getting burned and broken. The little pharmacy, I'm sitting here in my office,

01:40:35.480 which is three blocks to my house. This is a, uh, um, 1880s Victorian house that we, we turned in

01:40:41.720 our office building. Around the corner is a pharmacy we use. We've gone over there, um, shortly before

01:40:47.880 June the 28th, the windows were broken out, the steel roll-up doors were destroyed, and the place was

01:40:53.480 a mess. I was talking to the owner, and I said, what happened? He said, the alarm went off. I said,

01:40:58.440 you, you come down to see what was going on. He said, no, I didn't want to get killed. I said,

01:41:02.360 so what happened? Well, the alarm goes off. They were inside for six hours, breaking everything,

01:41:08.120 stealing everything they could steal and destroying everything they couldn't take. I said, did the police

01:41:12.520 show up? He said, yeah, 10 hours after the alarm went off. We started seeing more and more of the

01:41:18.600 buildings, uh, in the central west end here where we live boarded up, more and more, uh, businesses

01:41:24.360 closing down. Somebody drove a truck to the front of the office depot, uh, just across the street and

01:41:30.440 down a little bit from my office. Um, and the, the answer to the question is that the events that

01:41:37.480 were going on in St. Louis in those days, no matter whether they were billed as peaceful protests or

01:41:42.440 whatever, in every one of these events, things got broken and people got hurt. And the likelihood

01:41:48.680 that this crowd, when they crashed through the gate, broke it down and it started storming in,

01:41:53.480 the likelihood that they would be benign was small. And so I said to Carlos, for example,

01:41:59.960 if I thought that half of the time they were peaceful protesters and I had a 50, 50 chance of

01:42:06.360 being murdered or my house burned down, that's still too high of a percentage. But the percentage

01:42:11.000 wasn't that. The percentage was every time they've stayed in one of these actions, things got broken

01:42:16.280 and people got hurt. And that same night on June the 28th, after they left my house and they went

01:42:22.840 to the mayor's house, one of the peaceful protesters produced an AK-47 rifle and confronted an NBC

01:42:29.960 affiliate broadcaster who, by the way, was, had an armed guard with her and her, her armed guard. 0.52

01:42:37.640 Yeah. I mean, these people that are embedded with the, with the mob and the journalists,

01:42:42.280 I mean, they're, they don't think it's going to be a benign event. She had an armed guard.

01:42:46.680 The guard was going to, was, drew his weapon. They're about to have a gun battle in front of

01:42:51.160 the mayor's house, at which point the NBC affiliate reporter and her guard fled. But then they proceeded

01:42:57.400 to try to set the mayor's house on fire. And they've done that many times since.

01:43:00.520 Hmm. So the same crowd, the same night that I'm supposed to go inside my house and hope that

01:43:07.400 they don't burn my house down or come in and kill me, proceeded to pull weapons and try to burn down

01:43:12.440 the mayor's house, uh, after they left my place. And when I stood out in the front porch, the first

01:43:18.680 thing I said, right, actually I was out in the wing of the patio because we were barbecuing when they

01:43:22.520 broke down the gate. First thing I said was private property. As soon as I said private property,

01:43:29.160 it enraged them and they came in and, and immediately started being very violent, very loud, very

01:43:37.960 angry. And, uh, that's when I grabbed my rifle, Patty went inside to call 9-1-1. My daughter went

01:43:45.000 inside to call 9-1-1. Um, not that it was going to be very useful, but, uh, as soon as we got in,

01:43:51.720 as soon as they got in the house, uh, and called 9-1-1, uh, they walked by the front doors of the

01:43:57.480 house with her glass. And the crowd outside the door of the house was such that my daughter,

01:44:02.760 once again, she's 31 years old, fell down to the ground out of terror and then ran upstairs and

01:44:08.760 hid behind a sofa. And that's when Patty grabbed that pistol and went out to the front porch.

01:44:13.800 Well, that's the thing is that that's why I framed the question the way I did, because I'm always

01:44:17.880 cognizant of the fact that I live in New York city. I live in a doorman building. There are many,

01:44:22.280 many layers between me and the outside world. And it's not the same. You know, I talked to my

01:44:27.400 pal, Dana Lash, who's a big second amendment advocate. She's a spokeswoman for the NRA,

01:44:31.400 her husband. Yeah, that's exactly right. She's St. Louis now, now in Texas, but you know, those two,

01:44:38.440 they're so comfortable with a gun and like that they're just, you know, it's like second nature

01:44:43.000 to them and they live in a much more exposed, you know, area. They would never ask that question.

01:44:49.520 I ask it for my listeners who are more in my camp, you know, like they don't understand why

01:44:53.600 wouldn't you just go inside and cower, which is exactly a hundred percent what I would do.

01:44:56.640 I'm like, victim here, victim here. But I appreciate the explanation.

01:45:03.120 Well, the first person to ask me that question was, I was on a breakfast in the

01:45:06.480 Harry Morgan show sometime very early on.

01:45:09.300 Oh yeah. He doesn't like guns.

01:45:11.480 No. The lady asked me that exact question. I said, well, you know,

01:45:14.840 yeah, I had every expectation that if I hadn't gone out and defended my house,

01:45:19.700 sort of interviewing me here today, you'd be attending my wedding. And that's exactly the way

01:45:24.100 I felt.

01:45:25.640 Just speaking of Dana and Chris Lash, there was something on Twitter the other day where the

01:45:30.000 question was something to the effect of a guy breaks into your house and goes over to your

01:45:34.900 refrigerator. What's the one thing you don't want him to steal? And people were offering up,

01:45:38.980 you know, my burgers, my Hellman's, whatever. And Chris Lash responded, he would never make it to the

01:45:44.280 refrigerator. I just think, you know, it's a mentality, you know, that's why we have castle

01:45:50.740 doctrines in this country. You are allowed to defend your home, your safety, your well-being.

01:45:56.620 And I do think most of the world has never even had to really contemplate that. But when you try to

01:46:02.620 put yourself in Mark's shoes and ask yourself what you do, and you have to think of the greater

01:46:07.300 context of what was going on in the world, in his neighborhood, all the videotapes we'd seen,

01:46:11.800 the threats, all of it. It's just the situation was fraught. Okay, can I end with this? I was

01:46:17.600 delighted to see that the circuit attorney has been booted off of your case, yours and your wife's,

01:46:23.700 because she did something wrong. Can you tell us what she did?

01:46:26.960 Sure. She used us in her advertising and her fundraising while she was running for

01:46:31.260 re-election of circuit attorney. She did so before we were charged. And then 48 hours or so

01:46:39.400 after we charged, she sent out another funding request to her constituents talking about how

01:46:46.980 she was going to fix this problem of people like us and President Bush, President Trump.

01:46:55.700 And when you read her campaign material, it has nothing to do with curing crime or reducing the

01:47:04.500 murder rate in the city of St. Louis. It had exclusively to do with restructuring the power

01:47:09.580 structure. But because of that, because she had used us in her fundraising, both the judge in my case

01:47:16.720 and the judge in Patty's case disqualified her and the entire circuit attorney's office from the 0.98

01:47:22.260 client from the case, she took that up on a writ to the Eastern District Court of Appeals,

01:47:27.880 which denied the writ in both cases. And so the status right now is we're waiting to see whether

01:47:32.800 or not she's going to take that up to the Missouri Supreme Court or not. If the Missouri Supreme Court

01:47:39.800 agrees with the trial judges, or if she does not take it up to the Supreme Court, then the local

01:47:46.320 judges will have to appoint the local statute says some other attorney to prosecute the case.

01:47:53.960 Yeah, she really wants to be the attorney. She's dying to be the attorney who prosecutes you. 1.00

01:47:58.720 Well, and you know, at the hearing, at the hearing where we were arguing, and my attorney was arguing

01:48:04.500 that she ought to be disqualified because of her bias and her interest in pursuing this on a political

01:48:08.980 basis, they denied that they had any political interest in pursuing the case. They were just doing it for

01:48:14.480 the safety and health and welfare of the citizens of St. Louis. And, you know, the proof of that is how

01:48:19.880 much she doesn't care whether or not she gets to prosecute us, right? Instead, she's doing everything.

01:48:24.620 Like a dog with a bone.

01:48:25.980 Absolutely. Absolutely.

01:48:27.780 Well, we'll see. I don't predict this going anywhere. I just cannot see this case going anywhere. I know

01:48:32.600 the attorney general of the state is more on your side, and we'll see how it plays out. But I predict

01:48:38.520 this is going to end well for you. Quick question. How are you doing with your neighbors? How are your

01:48:44.800 neighbors feeling about you?

01:48:46.420 Well, I have one or two neighbors that, well, first of all, you got to appreciate that the

01:48:50.420 central west end of St. Louis is about as leftist as you can possibly get. And we're, you know,

01:48:55.980 the only people in the neighborhood that had a Trump sign out, I can tell you that.

01:48:59.800 We had our annual meeting for our neighborhood last Tuesday night, I guess, maybe two Tuesdays

01:49:06.140 ago. And every vote was 18 to 1, if that's any indication. You can guess who the 1 was.

01:49:15.360 One. These things is not like the others.

01:49:19.740 Well, you know, I got it. I got to tell you. I was just doing a little head scratching last

01:49:25.220 night. You know, I don't know if this is off limits with you or not, but you get you get

01:49:29.640 camped for saying something about blackface. When you were in high school, I can't remember

01:49:34.620 the exact quote. It's OK as long as you're in character. And, you know, it wasn't anything.

01:49:40.080 Yeah. It used to be OK as long as you're in character.

01:49:43.640 But then you have what? Justin Trudeau. Did he have to resign as prime minister in Canada?

01:49:50.700 You've got Ralph. What's his name in Virginia?

01:49:55.640 Northam. Ralph Northam. Yeah.

01:49:57.760 Who may. Listen, in his defense, he may not have been in blackface, something I've never worn. He 0.91

01:50:01.260 may have been wearing a KKK outfit. So, like, let's get it straight.

01:50:05.100 That makes it all better. OK. And then the president nominates for the head of the civil

01:50:13.120 rights division of the Department of Justice, the people that will decide what is racist and what

01:50:18.560 isn't. And who needs to go to jail for being a racist and who doesn't?

01:50:22.320 A woman who has written that blacks are genetically superior to whites. 0.96

01:50:27.800 And he is nominated for what? Undersecretary of Education. 0.90

01:50:32.160 A woman who is in glowing words talking about a woman who says that our children are being 0.94

01:50:38.940 spirit murdered by white. Yeah. 0.96

01:50:42.560 Yeah. I mean, that's right. And yet and yet I'm the guy that's facing four years in prison

01:50:48.860 for intimidation. But can I tell you something, Mark? I don't know if you feel this way, but I

01:50:52.080 hate I hate when this stuff happens because, you know, I am a fighter like I can tell you are.

01:50:57.420 And when people veer off of the facts and the law, I have like a visceral instinct to to put them

01:51:03.340 back, like stay between the rails. These are the rules we all agreed to play by. Right.

01:51:07.080 There's no racial discrimination. Doesn't matter what the pigmentation is. You're not allowed to

01:51:10.880 hold someone's immutable characteristics against them in this case. And when they keep trying to

01:51:17.200 do it. Right. Like when it's like, well, you're bad. You're less than just because of your pigmentation.

01:51:21.820 Then they force you to say, no, I'm not. And you've got to get into this fight. And now you're in sort

01:51:26.280 of a race fight. And no one wants to be in a fight over race because it just doesn't tend to end well

01:51:30.780 for anybody. Right. And I feel like that's that's where your client is. That's where you are.

01:51:36.040 I've been there. And it's it's one of the great frustrations of this whole overreach is we can

01:51:41.920 agree that we could absolutely implement some police reforms that would make sense for our

01:51:48.180 community. We can agree that protest is as American as apple pie. But riots are criminal

01:51:54.460 and must be stopped. And by the way, we can agree that most cops are not violent and are actually out

01:52:00.160 there trying to protect in particular the communities of color that need the most. But the countries in a

01:52:05.440 place right now where it seems to have lost its mind. And I think it's a manifestation of what

01:52:09.320 began as political correctness and has morphed into something very dangerous. Wokeness is too cute

01:52:15.220 a name for it. One of my listeners wrote me that it's too. It makes it sound like they're adorable.

01:52:20.900 And what they're really what they really are is anti-American and trying to tear at the fabric

01:52:25.600 that holds us together as as Americans. So I appreciate your willingness to stand up for what you

01:52:33.240 believe in. And and also, you know, for what it's worth to protect others. You know, I mean, Jane

01:52:38.540 is a lot more vulnerable vulnerable right now than you were, or then I am. And she needs help. You can

01:52:45.440 hear how rough it's been on her, right? You can you can feel it. You know, I don't know what the future

01:52:52.460 holds. But I know that the powers that be the mainstream media, the political party in charge,

01:53:00.980 they're not ignorant. They don't misunderstand what's going on. They are promoting organizations

01:53:09.720 and elements in our society that actually are actively working to destroy Western culture.

01:53:16.560 America, as we know it, to destroy the underpinnings of the of the four pillars of our civilization. 0.69

01:53:22.720 That's family, God, individualism and capitalism. And this isn't this isn't coincidental. It's not

01:53:31.960 done because they're ignorant of what's happening. They're promoting it. They're actively promoting

01:53:36.620 entities that they know are not just a little to the left, but they're basically promoting Marxist,

01:53:44.460 communist, universal revolution. You go back to the very earliest documents of the movement for black

01:53:50.620 lives and its predecessor organizations. And they expressly say that they seek a universal

01:53:57.560 restructuring, which progresses beyond capitalism, is their way of phrasing. And this is very frightening.

01:54:05.580 And there's nobody, with very few exceptions, standing up and saying, that's what's going on right now.

01:54:12.260 And if the people don't wake up and take some action against it, and pretty gosh darn soon,

01:54:17.220 our real life is going to be history. Yeah, the country's changing in a radical and dangerous way.

01:54:24.740 Listen, do me a favor, if you get your hands on that videotape, we'd love to see it. And we'd love

01:54:29.100 any updates in your case or in Jane's case. And all the best to both of you guys. Thank you so much

01:54:35.420 for doing this and for being here. Oh, thank you for having us on.

01:54:38.560 Today's episode is brought to you in part by Legacy Box. Trust Legacy Box to digitally preserve

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01:55:01.200 for us to stay in touch with you. And you don't want to miss our next show because we've got Eric

01:55:05.220 bowling. Now, Eric and I are pals and have been for a long time, and I had him on the show to talk

01:55:09.800 politics once before, and that's fine. We'll talk politics when he comes back on. But what I really

01:55:14.520 wanted to have Eric on for this time was to talk about Eric's life and some of the stuff that he's

01:55:22.520 gone through. You know, he lost his son, Eric Chase, to a drug overdose when Eric Chase was in college.

01:55:29.820 And it was a tragic story. And it was totally misrepresented by the vicious press. And he's been

01:55:37.540 he's handled it all so beautifully. The guy's been through so much. Anyway, you're gonna love him. You're

01:55:43.120 gonna love the personal side of Eric. And we're gonna get into that. And we'll get his latest take

01:55:46.920 on all the politics. And so he's got a new podcast of his own with Brett Favre, by the way, or as I

01:55:52.200 said for years, Brett Favre. And we'll find out what's happening with that. So don't miss it. That's

01:55:59.180 Friday. Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear. The Megyn Kelly

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The Megyn Kelly Show - February 17, 2021

The Fallout From Racism Accusations： Two Real-Life Stories ｜ Ep. 65

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