The Megyn Kelly Show - The Nuzzi-RFK Drama, Attacking Tucker's Son to Smear Vance, and New Cancel Culture, with Emily Jashinsky ｜ Ep. 1196

00:00:00.000 Every child deserves to splash, to laugh, to share adventures with friends, to feel like they belong.

00:00:10.900 But for some, that joy comes with a price tag that's beyond their reach.

00:00:15.420 Help the YMCA bring its transformative programs to those who can't afford them.

00:00:20.160 Because connections, cannonballs, and confidence should never be out of reach.

00:00:27.060 Donate today to your local YMCA.

00:00:30.000 When I got a great deal on a great gift at Winners, I started wondering, could I get fabulous gifts for everyone on my list?

00:00:36.300 Like this designer fragrance for my daughter.

00:00:38.560 At just $39.99, how could I resist?

00:00:41.400 This luxurious wool throw for my sister.

00:00:44.060 This gold watch for my partner.

00:00:45.980 A wooden puzzle for my niece.

00:00:47.720 Leather gloves for my boss.

00:00:49.340 Ooh, European chocolate for the crossing guard.

00:00:52.380 At these prices, could I find something for everyone at Winners?

00:00:55.560 Stop wondering. Start gifting.

00:00:57.540 Winners find fabulous for less.

00:01:00.820 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:02.600 Live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:01:12.440 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly.

00:01:14.060 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:01:15.460 It's a very busy news day.

00:01:16.740 There's a lot happening right now.

00:01:17.840 The House is expected to vote on the release of the Epstein files this afternoon.

00:01:22.380 A move President Trump now says he supports.

00:01:26.720 We'll talk about it.

00:01:28.020 Plus, we have to get into the soap opera that literally everybody in the media and the political world is talking about.

00:01:32.660 Involving Olivia Nuzzi and her former fiancé, Ryan Lizzo, who used to work for Politico, and RFKJ, and now another politician.

00:01:42.220 You may know a lot of these figures.

00:01:44.620 RFKJ, of course, has been on this show many times.

00:01:48.580 He's now our Health and Human Services Secretary.

00:01:50.720 Olivia's been on this show, too, and is a friend.

00:01:54.120 Ryan Lizzo of Politico, never on this show, but man, is he fighting back in this love triangle in which they allegedly find themselves with the reveal about another politician.

00:02:03.340 I mean, what this has to do with your life, I know not.

00:02:06.400 Literally nothing.

00:02:07.840 But it's just one of the biggest stories that's out there right now.

00:02:11.820 Literally everybody I know has sent it to me.

00:02:14.240 Everybody wants to know what we think, what you think.

00:02:19.040 Does it mean anything in the larger scale of life?

00:02:23.220 I don't know.

00:02:24.100 I think our guest today will have some thoughts.

00:02:26.800 She is Emily Jashinsky, and she is the host of After Party with Emily Jashinsky on the MK Media Podcast Network.

00:02:33.380 She's also now the host of the Megyn Kelly Wrap-Up Show that airs on SiriusXM Channel 111, the MK Channel.

00:02:41.120 That's at 2 p.m. right after the show.

00:02:42.720 You can speak to her every weekday by calling 833-44-MEGYN, 833-446-3496, starting at 2.

00:02:50.500 Or you could get on the line a little early if you want to be one of the first ones.

00:02:54.100 Ever read the label on a typical bag of chips?

00:02:56.300 It's often a science experiment of seed oils, MSG, artificial dyes, and mystery ingredients.

00:03:02.380 Masa is part of the growing movement to bring back real food.

00:03:06.000 Masa's chips contain just three ingredients, organic corn, sea salt, and 100% grass-fed beef tallow.

00:03:12.400 Not only do these chips avoid the bad stuff, they also taste incredible too.

00:03:16.500 Snacking on Masa chips is nothing like eating regular chips.

00:03:20.780 With Masa, you feel satisfied.

00:03:22.520 You feel light, energetic, with no crash and no bloat.

00:03:26.300 And if you love Masa, then you will love Vandy Crisps too.

00:03:30.480 Vandy, Masa's sister company, makes the most delicious three-ingredient potato chips too.

00:03:36.380 Ready to give Masa or Vandy a try?

00:03:38.420 Use code MK for 25% off your first order at masachips.com or vandycrisps.com.

00:03:44.740 Or simply click the link in the video description or scan the QR code to claim this delicious offer.

00:03:50.140 Don't feel like ordering online?

00:03:51.780 Masa and Vandy are now available nationwide at your local Sprouts supermarket.

00:03:56.840 Stop by and pick up a couple of bags before they're all gone.

00:04:00.680 Emily, welcome back.

00:04:01.740 Great to have you.

00:04:02.800 Thanks for having me, Megan.

00:04:03.720 Good to be here.

00:04:05.640 It's as good a place to start as anywhere else, I guess, since everybody's talking about it.

00:04:10.240 Now, most of the audience is like, who?

00:04:12.600 So Olivia Nuzzi is this rising star in the journalism field.

00:04:19.120 She worked for New York Magazine.

00:04:21.260 Prior to that, she went to Fordham, and then she worked for some far-left publication, didn't she?

00:04:27.220 I can't remember which one.

00:04:28.260 Yeah, she was at Daily Beast.

00:04:28.780 Daily Beast, okay.

00:04:29.800 Yeah, Daily Beast.

00:04:30.820 And she got a job working for New York Magazine.

00:04:32.380 She's got, you know, sort of a flair with the pen and the storytelling, in my view.

00:04:37.720 I enjoy reading her stuff.

00:04:39.580 She was one of the few reporters to come out and report on what she saw around Joe Biden's mental infirmity prior to the election.

00:04:47.320 It was late in the game, don't get me wrong, but it was prior to the election and prior to the debate, I should say.

00:04:52.860 Right?

00:04:53.120 Wasn't it?

00:04:53.500 Was it prior to the debate?

00:04:54.420 It was right around there.

00:04:55.040 Yeah, I think so.

00:04:55.600 Right after the debate.

00:04:56.540 Okay.

00:04:56.740 In any event, there weren't that many leftists who were willing to write about what they saw in Joe Biden.

00:05:01.760 She was one of them.

00:05:02.400 But then it came out that she was having an alleged affair with Bobby Kennedy.

00:05:13.080 Like a, I mean, they're calling it a digital affair, which sounds wrong.

00:05:17.960 But what they mean by that is no in-person interludes, like phone sex, basically.

00:05:25.480 Forgive me, audience.

00:05:26.880 And that basically her career wound up taking a massive hit because Kara Swisher, as the reports have it, went to the head of New York Magazine and said,

00:05:38.080 Olivia, one of your reporters, is having an affair with RFKJ, whom she profiled, which is what makes it professionally very dicey.

00:05:46.940 And she got turfed from New York Magazine. 0.94

00:05:51.220 They fired her. 1.00

00:05:53.120 The story has another wrinkle because she was engaged at the time to political writer Ryan Lizza.

00:06:00.500 And they'd been living together.

00:06:04.060 And he did not go quietly into the night when all of this happened.

00:06:09.380 She wound up filing for a restraining order against him in court, accusing him of taping her and, you know, stalker-esque behavior.

00:06:19.520 He denied all of it and said, she's the only one who's done anything wrong here, not me.

00:06:24.160 And she wound up withdrawing her motion for a restraining order. 0.98

00:06:26.800 However, he points out without any proof of her allegations against him.

00:06:32.180 So he feels, and to use his word, that he's been defamed by her without evidence and that people are still walking around with this idea that he somehow did anything wrong.

00:06:42.180 Whereas he says, you know, I'm the victim.

00:06:44.680 I got cheated on by, you know, my fiancé.

00:06:48.760 I thought I was going to marry.

00:06:51.560 RFKJ came out at the time and said, I don't even know her.

00:06:54.740 She just profiled me one time.

00:06:56.800 And, like, apparently has developed a stalker-esque interest in me.

00:07:00.760 And I don't know what this is about.

00:07:03.280 I did not ask Cheryl Hines about this when she came by my set to promote her book because it just felt very rude and untoward.

00:07:10.600 And if this is true, how is it Cheryl's fault?

00:07:14.000 Maureen, my pal Maureen, our fellow star on the MK Media Network, Callahan, she would beg me right now to make the point that her reporting is that Cheryl and RFKJ got together when he was still married to his previous wife, Mary, I think her name was, who was having severe, you know, mental issues.

00:07:35.580 And she was basically being driven crazy, I think, in part, according to Maureen, by some of Bobby's actions.

00:07:41.800 And so Maureen is very unforgiving of Cheryl, too, because, look, there is that old saying, you lose them how you get them.

00:07:48.720 You lose them how you get them.

00:07:50.640 And there's another report that Ryan Lizza was with somebody else when he got together with Olivia.

00:08:00.760 So once again, you lose them how you get them.

00:08:04.320 I don't know whether this is true.

00:08:05.340 That is in the news today that he allegedly, people on Twitter are saying, you can't play the victim.

00:08:09.600 You cheated with her on somebody else.

00:08:11.720 Forgive me, Ryan Lizza, do not know whether that's true.

00:08:13.720 But that's what the folks are saying.

00:08:15.920 If you deny that, we'll report that, too.

00:08:18.360 So this is a very tawdry mess.

00:08:20.680 But Olivia has just gotten rehired by Vanity Fair to write for them. 0.85

00:08:26.460 And she's also releasing what appears to be a sort of memoir called American Canto, C-A-N-T-O.

00:08:36.540 She's moved to L.A.

00:08:37.560 She was in D.C.

00:08:39.100 She's moved to L.A.

00:08:41.300 And she was in New York for a time, too.

00:08:43.320 And this book sort of juxtaposes between her life as a political reporter on the trail covering Trump, covering, you know, these big presidential races,

00:08:52.940 and her obvious allegations that she had an affair with Bobby Kennedy, which, by the way, I've got to just be honest, I buy entirely.

00:09:03.780 I really have zero doubt it happened.

00:09:06.320 For the record, I have to tell you he's denied it.

00:09:08.440 But it's just ridiculous.

00:09:09.720 It's so detailed.

00:09:10.500 Like, she'd have to be a true lunatic to say all this because she would get sued so quickly for defamation.

00:09:16.080 And if he were innocent, he would sue her.

00:09:19.300 Think of it.

00:09:19.920 If you're a health and human services secretary, you're a married man, and somebody's coming out, reporter, saying all these things with you, and not a word of this is true, you would absolutely sue her.

00:09:29.600 But you wouldn't if it were true and you knew she had your text messages and so on.

00:09:33.720 I don't really care.

00:09:34.800 I've got to be honest.

00:09:35.700 Like, I think half the people we have in office right now have probably cheated on their spouses. 0.82

00:09:39.540 And I just, like, post Me Too, Emily, I'm kind of like, oh, it's their business.

00:09:45.040 It's hard enough to find, you know, great politicians.

00:09:49.420 It's not ideal.

00:09:50.500 It's not something I would choose, you know.

00:09:52.320 Like, it's wonderful.

00:09:53.240 But, like, I don't know.

00:09:55.520 I've kind of given up on these fights.

00:09:57.180 I used to be much more interested in them.

00:09:58.600 And now I'm just kind of like, whatever.

00:09:59.740 Can we just find somebody who knows how to govern?

00:10:01.720 And I mean that for Democrats, too.

00:10:03.460 I don't think it's great.

00:10:04.480 I certainly don't like when somebody holds themselves up as a paragon of virtue like Doug Emhoff.

00:10:10.000 And then we find out that they've got this kind of a history.

00:10:12.520 Like, please spare me.

00:10:13.540 You're moralizing.

00:10:15.620 Okay, but I'm getting, we'll get to the end on what Ryan Lizard just did, which adds a brand new wrinkle to the story in one minute.

00:10:23.840 But what does this say to you, this whole saga?

00:10:27.100 Because it's, like, so many topics that we all, and people that we all cover and know of, and an industry that we cover and we know of and we're in intimately.

00:10:39.100 And it's just, like, it's all anybody can discuss.

00:10:42.000 What are your thoughts on it, EJ?

00:10:43.360 Well, this is obviously a sort of an amplified example of the kind of thing that happens behind closed doors and sometimes not even behind closed doors in Washington, D.C., in New York, Los Angeles, among very powerful, wealthy people.

00:10:58.340 But I think everybody understood that this was a messy relationship.

00:11:01.920 Certainly everybody in D.C. seemed to understand that this was a messy relationship as it was happening.

00:11:06.060 Ryan Lizard had kids.

00:11:07.180 He was much older than Olivia.

00:11:08.360 And it all just seemed, like, tornadic the way that they got together and carried out their relationship.

00:11:15.540 But, listen, like, where I'm from, this would be, these would be people you wouldn't want to babysit your children.

00:11:21.840 These would be people that you wouldn't want, you know, around your family or your kids because the behavior here is just grotesque and sad.

00:11:29.360 And I think, you know, Olivia is talented enough to seem interesting and to sometimes mistake self-indulgence for talent. 1.00

00:11:39.860 And she definitely has talent.

00:11:41.620 But there's this, I think, permission structure people who want to be great writers sometimes give themselves, which is if you are self-deprecating enough, that's license to also be very self-indulgent.

00:11:54.340 And the writing in the Vanity Fair excerpt of the book that was released yesterday, it is so overwrought.

00:11:59.740 And you could just tell that she wants to be great.

00:12:04.020 And I think that's good that somebody wants to be great.

00:12:06.260 She's certainly talented. 0.98

00:12:07.180 But I also think young women, younger women, I think Olivia and I are roughly the same age, have been taught that this pain is in some way, and the suffering is some way art in and of itself and is talent in and of itself.

00:12:21.540 And I just hope she gets better.

00:12:23.020 I hope Ryan and Liz's family gets better.

00:12:24.620 But I also doubt that because the arc here seems to be going towards something even worse.

00:12:29.880 And based on the allegations that Liz unfolded in the sub stack yesterday.

00:12:33.520 I know, I mean, it's like, I don't know, very clearly, Olivia and Ryan, Liz, did not belong together, seemed very clear, this was not a good match.

00:12:46.640 And, you know, lots of people handle that bad situation badly, rather than getting out of the relationship honorably.

00:12:54.780 They make bad choices, which wind up hurting the other person.

00:12:58.420 And I'm always hesitant to really, like, completely go scorched earth, again, unless they hold themselves up as a paragon of virtue, because you never know what the other side is.

00:13:08.520 You know, it's like, in my experience, generally, somebody does not cheat unless the relationship has really gone bad.

00:13:14.820 Now, that can be very, very wrong.

00:13:16.900 Sometimes, like, really sweet spouses who are very loving and caring and supportive do get cheated on because the other person has got some issue.

00:13:24.080 But, you know, how do we know on the outside?

00:13:27.400 In any event, look, I'm not excusing it.

00:13:28.800 I'm just saying this is, it's complicated to try to analyze these things from the outside.

00:13:33.000 Okay, so she decides, I mean, it's very interesting because she never gave an interview about this alleged affair.

00:13:40.320 You know, it was all articles about her.

00:13:42.320 But it was very clear, especially on someone like the Page Six reporting, the New York Post reporting, that she was cooperating behind the scenes.

00:13:49.980 You know, you can usually tell.

00:13:51.340 As the pictures get nicer of the person they're reporting on, you can usually deduce that there's some cooperation.

00:13:57.180 So, in any event, weirdly, like, her star has kind of risen as a result of it.

00:14:07.800 She's, you know, like, her name has been out there.

00:14:10.620 She's kind of painted as a femme fatale. 0.99

00:14:14.340 I don't know.

00:14:15.200 There's, like, intrigue around her.

00:14:16.480 She's a stunning, absolutely beautiful woman.

00:14:19.220 And I think she's very talented.

00:14:20.860 People are mocking the writing because it's a little flowery.

00:14:24.720 But I think it's very good.

00:14:26.140 I've always enjoyed her pieces.

00:14:27.800 I appreciate some effort in making political coverage somewhat flowery as opposed to just a punch in the face.

00:14:33.240 For lack of a better adjective, she probably wouldn't like flowery.

00:14:35.440 But you know what I'm saying.

00:14:36.580 She works at the rhetorical flair.

00:14:38.920 And I'll take a little flair, you know.

00:14:41.780 It's too much for our friend Charles C.W. Cook over at National Review, who's not a fan.

00:14:45.880 But that's not a surprise to me.

00:14:48.000 He's, you know, he's English.

00:14:49.780 So now she writes this book, and the excerpt is in Vanity Fair, and we've got some of it here.

00:14:59.400 Okay.

00:14:59.660 First of all, before we get to what's in here, let's go to the Emily Jashinsky dramatic reading from After Party.

00:15:05.860 Last night, After Party with Emily Jashinsky airs live on YouTube, Mondays and Wednesdays at 10 p.m.

00:15:10.520 If you're missing it, you're missing the party.

00:15:12.860 And then you can pick it up as a podcast or a YouTube show, so you can still check it out.

00:15:16.160 But anyway, here's just a little clip of EJ giving her dramatic reading full with the black sunglasses that Olivia wears in her photo shoot on the Vanity Fair spread.

00:15:26.680 Her watch.

00:15:27.020 I did not like to think about it just as later.

00:15:33.760 I would not like to think about the worm in his brain that other people found so funny.

00:15:40.960 I loved his brain.

00:15:42.820 I hated the idea of an intruder therein.

00:15:46.800 Others thought he was a madman.

00:15:48.720 He was not quite mad the way they thought, but I loved the private ways that he was mad.

00:15:54.200 I loved that he was insatiable.

00:15:57.580 In all ways.

00:15:58.840 As if he would swallow up the whole world just to know it better if he could.

00:16:05.620 Thanks for making me watch that.

00:16:08.460 It wasn't that dramatic.

00:16:10.240 It was, you know, it was a rereading of what she said.

00:16:14.160 Tasteful.

00:16:15.460 Well, yeah.

00:16:18.760 She, here's one of the opening paragraphs of the excerpt in Vanity Fair that dropped yesterday.

00:16:24.180 I would take a bullet for you, the politician said.

00:16:27.920 He always said that.

00:16:29.340 Please don't say that, I said.

00:16:30.680 I always said that.

00:16:31.980 From his mouth, the bullet theoretical launched the bullet possible.

00:16:35.700 I did not like to think about it.

00:16:37.160 About the armed man at his speech or the armed man who broke into his home.

00:16:41.360 And she goes on to set up this relationship in which she cared about him and vice versa.

00:16:47.240 I loved the private ways that he was mad.

00:16:50.000 I loved that he was insatiable in all ways.

00:16:52.760 As if he would swallow up the whole world just to know it better if he could.

00:16:56.260 He made me laugh, but I winced when he joked about the worm that you just referenced, the brain worm.

00:17:01.900 Baby, don't worry, he said.

00:17:04.340 It's not a worm.

00:17:07.460 A doctor he trusted had reviewed the scans of his brain obtained by the New York Times.

00:17:11.360 He told her he did not still have a brain worm or ever, as far as we know.

00:17:19.260 Okay, it goes on.

00:17:20.360 She does talk about what she loved about him, his blue eyes.

00:17:24.200 Her favorite body part of his, which she says was, guys, there shouldn't have been a long pause there.

00:17:32.980 His nose, his nose.

00:17:35.200 His nose.

00:17:36.060 And her favorite of his, or his favorite of hers, which was her lips.

00:17:44.500 And then, hold on, this is the part that everybody kind of wants to hear about.

00:17:50.320 So, she writes, okay, she did not care about their 39-year-old, 39-year-age difference.

00:18:00.700 She said, okay, they both, they both, quote, moved through the world with amused detachment and deep sensitivity, contradictions that worked somehow in concert.

00:18:10.240 She writes that, despite being sober for decades, Kennedy told her he still uses psychedelics and even smoked DMT, a powerful drug on which people are known to have what feel like near-death experiences.

00:18:24.420 She told him she liked uppers.

00:18:26.280 I told him that I took Adderall.

00:18:28.940 And she writes that she said, I love you only after he said it first.

00:18:36.660 He called her Livy and wrote her poems.

00:18:39.040 He said he wanted her to have his baby.

00:18:42.520 He promised to take a bullet for her in the part I just read.

00:18:46.380 She, as the excerpt reads in the New York Times profile that just dropped, profiling her in the book, she loved him.

00:18:56.160 She loved the politician, even though she was a political reporter.

00:18:59.280 And he was then a presidential candidate she had written about.

00:19:02.240 She loved his eyes, blue as the flame.

00:19:04.320 She loved that the sight of something as trivial as a rose could move him to tears.

00:19:09.800 She loved his insatiable appetites and his particular complications and particular darkness.

00:19:16.220 They write about a digital affair with Kennedy that revolved around texts and phone calls.

00:19:20.160 The revelation derailed her career, leading to her fire at New York Magazine and a very public explosion of her relationship with Chris Silliza.

00:19:27.460 Kennedy tried to brush it off, brush her off, sending her into self-imposed exile in Los Angeles.

00:19:33.900 The book paints a picture of a nation and a personal life for her on fire.

00:19:38.960 She describes the mutual infatuation that consumed her, even if it was never consummated.

00:19:43.240 She's ambiguous in the book, but said in one of many interviews, we were not sleeping together.

00:19:48.200 But American Canto is far more than bearing witness to Trump world and about how she believes that warped her just as it warped the country.

00:19:58.460 Okay, that's basically the highlights before we get to Ryan Lizza's response.

00:20:05.560 But I don't know.

00:20:07.240 Am I being too forgiving of this affair?

00:20:10.340 I feel like it's a Kennedy.

00:20:11.320 If I married a Kennedy, I would not be expecting fidelity.

00:20:15.560 I know maybe that's wrong.

00:20:17.260 Honestly, especially if when I got together with a Kennedy, he was cheating on his existing wife.

00:20:22.140 Like, honestly, what do people think?

00:20:25.760 If you're going to marry somebody who's cheated on other spouses and you're cheating with him when you fall in love and then you marry, what do you think is going to happen?

00:20:36.520 You know, it's like some people have these deals.

00:20:39.340 This is not my deal.

00:20:40.200 This is not what I want, you know, for my relationship, my children's relationships.

00:20:44.420 But some people do have these deals where it's either implicit or explicit that they're going to look the other way.

00:20:50.420 And again, to the point that you were making, without knowing what's really happening, I mean, even the book refers to him as just the politician.

00:21:00.220 And so it's very intimate, but also sort of detached in a way.

00:21:04.100 And we don't have his side fully.

00:21:06.020 We don't have the full details.

00:21:08.360 We never could.

00:21:09.360 We can't go back and, you know, be in their social circles and know exactly what was going on behind the scenes.

00:21:14.900 But I will say I do think it's interesting that Olivia told the New York Times she kind of demurred when asked whether she had the text messages because RFKJ says this was basically unrequited.

00:21:30.340 That she was sending him, as you mentioned, Megan, text messages, sexual types of text messages.

00:21:36.620 It is hard for me to believe she would do that without it being requited because what an insanely risky thing to do to a man who is as high profile and powerful and married.

00:21:47.600 But she also told the New York Times she seemed to say she wasn't going to be releasing any of these text messages and that she kind of said maybe she doesn't even have the text messages.

00:21:57.040 And then Liz's story sounds a lot like RF Kennedy Jr.'s story, which is that she was texting him all of the time.

00:22:04.500 So, again, I just don't know.

00:22:06.480 I genuinely don't know what's true.

00:22:07.680 It's not hard for me to believe on the one hand, given Kennedy's history, even with his deceased wife, that was very public.

00:22:15.640 So it's not out of the realm of possibility, certainly.

00:22:19.620 One other thing I wanted to add, though, is also that as talented as I think Olivia is, she does moralize. 0.95

00:22:25.400 And she did a lot in Trump 1.0.

00:22:27.180 And that's part of what bothers me about this story.

00:22:29.040 I remember the time she held up her phone playing crying migrant children during a White House briefing in Trump 1.0.

00:22:35.600 And the entire media hailed her as like this brave hero.

00:22:38.780 I think as the administration went on, she kind of like learned to have more like detached bemusement and a little bit of fun with it.

00:22:46.940 But her and Ryan Liz both are sort of like anti-right people who have held themselves up as responsible journalists and criticized a lot of people on the right for a long time.

00:22:57.760 So I also do feel a bit irked by the revelations of their very, very, very messy and sordid personal lives.

00:23:07.780 Fair enough.

00:23:08.820 I will say she's always been very fair to me in her writing and her approach.

00:23:13.260 She's never ostracized me and I'm on the right.

00:23:15.840 Like that's rare.

00:23:16.740 That is very rare.

00:23:18.380 So I always liked her.

00:23:19.780 I mean, she's definitely farther left than I am, but I don't really care.

00:23:23.600 To me, this is just like, obviously she's got a thing for older men.

00:23:28.140 Okay.

00:23:28.320 So before we get to Ryan Lizza, it's a dark thing too.

00:23:31.740 It's a freaking dark thing because that penchant led her first to Keith Olbermann.

00:23:38.960 Isn't that punishment enough for anything that happened thereafter?

00:23:42.140 Isn't that the rest of your life?

00:23:45.740 Yeah.

00:23:46.000 She's paid her penance for whatever would come later.

00:23:49.180 He's so disgusting.

00:23:50.880 It's amazing.

00:23:51.840 Katie Turin, he as well, lived together for years.

00:23:56.720 Katie Turin?

00:23:57.740 Katie Turin.

00:23:59.140 Yeah.

00:23:59.440 Of MSNBC.

00:24:00.840 Who is many years his junior.

00:24:02.960 They were together for many years and he continues to attack her now publicly.

00:24:07.780 He's so angry about how that ended, I guess.

00:24:10.920 She must have dumped him.

00:24:12.140 And now he was with Olivia for four years.

00:24:15.640 Four years, Emily.

00:24:17.160 The reporting is that he, and this brings me to Ryan Lizza.

00:24:22.060 We knew, I think, that she was with Olbermann.

00:24:24.380 I think, did we?

00:24:25.540 Steve Krakow will let me know.

00:24:27.540 Steve knows everything.

00:24:28.840 Yeah.

00:24:29.140 There's been rumblings, he said.

00:24:30.160 I thought I knew that.

00:24:31.120 I wasn't surprised to learn she'd been, but I didn't remember that they lived together

00:24:34.380 for four years.

00:24:35.140 Four.

00:24:35.380 So Ryan Lizza, I'll get to Keith Olbermann and Ryan Lizza now.

00:24:40.860 So Ryan Lizza, he's not exactly the jilted fiance.

00:24:44.520 He's more the cheated on fiance.

00:24:46.200 I think he jilts her.

00:24:48.100 Or perhaps at that point it was just mutual.

00:24:50.240 I mean, it's like, but he comes out with this extraordinary piece.

00:24:54.980 Oh, wait.

00:24:55.460 All right.

00:24:55.640 Just one second.

00:24:56.520 My team points out there is something else in her excerpt I need to read.

00:24:59.600 Um, okay.

00:25:01.780 She writes the following.

00:25:02.940 She, she writes like all men, but more so he was a hunter.

00:25:06.600 Okay.

00:25:07.640 In a literal sense, he used not a bullet, but a bird.

00:25:11.540 It was not about a chase.

00:25:13.340 Was it?

00:25:13.840 I don't even actually totally understand that.

00:25:15.280 Like birds and bees.

00:25:16.160 No.

00:25:16.740 Um, it was about not, not about a chase, but about a puzzle of logic and skill that amounted

00:25:22.040 to a test of his self mastery.

00:25:23.920 He was the mouse and the architect of his maze, the giver of his own pleasure and torment.

00:25:31.420 He desired, he desired desiring.

00:25:34.640 He desired being desired.

00:25:36.420 He desired desire itself.

00:25:38.760 I understood this just as I came to understand the range of his kinks and complexes and how 1.00

00:25:43.500 they fit within what I thought I understood of his soul.

00:25:47.060 All right.

00:25:48.500 Can I say, I believe every word of that.

00:25:51.960 I believe he desired.

00:25:52.860 I believe he desired desiring.

00:25:54.460 I believe he desired being desired.

00:25:56.020 I believe he desired desire itself.

00:25:58.240 That's, that's not unusual for a man who's a serial cheater.

00:26:03.120 Again, like, I don't know what's going on in his marriage with Cheryl, but like, just read

00:26:07.980 Maureen's book, ask not, um, that many men who are unhappily married feel that.

00:26:14.420 And the reason they don't act on it is because they're not monkeys and they have self-control

00:26:19.200 and they took vows and ostensibly they like Kennedy may have a commitment to their faith,

00:26:24.640 to Catholicism, to doing what is right, what is moral and, you know, what is honorable.

00:26:30.380 I mean, this is Bill, this is why Bill Maher says he never got married because he didn't

00:26:35.160 want to give up passion and desire, which he was convinced would go away after a few years

00:26:43.780 of marriage.

00:26:44.440 And he and I have had many behind the scenes debates about this where I've urged him to

00:26:49.620 accept from me that that is not something you have to give up when you get married.

00:26:53.380 It's not, it's not the way it was in year one when you're first dating somebody, that's

00:26:57.540 true, but that there can be like total hot passion and burning desire, even in my case,

00:27:04.400 20 years into the relationship, you know, and there are all sorts of ways of keeping that

00:27:08.860 alive, which we can discuss in another show.

00:27:11.120 Um, but like she's describing something that is probably real.

00:27:17.040 I get that people think this is kind of cheesy, but it's probably real.

00:27:20.160 And she's still young.

00:27:22.020 I mean, you're young too.

00:27:23.140 I don't know.

00:27:23.940 Like, am I being again, too generous to a friend and saying like, she may have been swept away

00:27:30.540 by this desire from a Kennedy presidential candidate in a way in particular, a younger woman might 0.79

00:27:37.320 fall for like this.

00:27:39.300 He desire, desire is unique or real or something new and exciting.

00:27:42.680 That's like literally every man.

00:27:45.100 No, I don't think, I mean, it's, it's entirely believable that she would have been about

00:27:50.120 30 years old at this time, maybe even a little younger than that.

00:27:53.740 And the power imbalance, I mean, we talked about that throughout Me Too, but the power

00:27:57.540 imbalance in a situation where you have this like swaggering historic figure in Bobby Kennedy.

00:28:03.840 Um, and I'm not saying Olivia fell prey to any like predatory situation.

00:28:07.440 I'm just saying there's something.

00:28:08.320 And she doesn't say that either.

00:28:09.900 No, not at all.

00:28:10.980 There's just something that, you know, there's, there's something romantic and seductive from

00:28:15.020 her perspective, clearly in the writing about being approached by somebody that famous and

00:28:20.880 powerful mythical who wants her.

00:28:23.600 So, yeah, I mean, I think Kennedy is probably very aware of the effect that he has on women

00:28:29.460 just by virtue of being a Kennedy.

00:28:31.040 I think every Kennedy is very aware of that.

00:28:32.880 And Olivia is clearly through this writing.

00:28:34.640 You can see taken in by the mythology of all of it.

00:28:38.960 Uh, and you could probably put any random like 27 year old in her shoes and, uh, you 0.95

00:28:44.500 would get the same result.

00:28:46.080 There's, I think a 39 year age difference between them.

00:28:49.340 I mean, like it's something massive.

00:28:51.460 It's, it's, it is clearly it's a thing where she likes the older men a lot because truly like

00:28:56.460 I'm 20 years younger than RFKJ.

00:28:59.700 And I mean, I, there's zero, I'd be like, okay, of course he's married and I'm married,

00:29:04.760 but like, I, I wouldn't date somebody 20 years older than me at all, by the way, just a word

00:29:09.060 for dating somebody your own age.

00:29:10.360 I just want to put that on the record.

00:29:11.900 Something wonderful about dating somebody your own age is that you age together.

00:29:15.680 Like you cross, you know, new barriers together, new, new big birthdays together, but you,

00:29:21.740 they also know all of your, your references.

00:29:24.600 I've said this before, but I really mean it.

00:29:26.180 Like if I make some stupid joke about eighties music or even like songs of the seventies or

00:29:31.580 sitcoms or, you know, what happened in the nineties, my husband knows all of them.

00:29:35.260 We, we both crack up.

00:29:37.040 You know, we, we grew up in the same movies.

00:29:39.900 Not long ago, we were talking about something and about somebody who had jumped some crazy,

00:29:44.880 uh, amount of distance.

00:29:46.800 And I said to Doug, guy did a Peter Pan right off this bridge.

00:29:51.120 And he knew immediately what that was.

00:29:52.900 And the audience, do you know what I'm talking about?

00:29:54.380 Are you, are you, do, is anyone getting the movie?

00:29:57.280 Um, you can write to me if you know what it was.

00:29:59.620 It's Megan at megankelly.com.

00:30:01.640 The point is there's real joy in having those shared references.

00:30:06.020 We laugh 10 times a day based on one of these things.

00:30:08.900 I just think it'd be very different, but there are especially a lot of young women who like

00:30:14.040 older men.

00:30:15.240 And I don't know if it's a daddy issue.

00:30:17.460 That's probably something for a psychiatrist, not for me, but Olivia, definitely, this is

00:30:22.780 her type because that brings me to Chris.

00:30:26.700 Wait a minute.

00:30:27.540 Not Chris, Ryan Lizza.

00:30:29.100 Chris Lizza is disgusting and not Ryan Lizza and definitely not somebody who Olivia would

00:30:35.120 date.

00:30:35.840 Um, well, so, well, I mean, I mean, hard to say.

00:30:40.520 Yeah, I don't, he's too gross.

00:30:42.820 She would never, but okay.

00:30:44.380 So Ryan Lizza decides upon the excerpt of this thing being published in Vanity Fair to finally

00:30:50.900 really speak out about this, which he really hasn't so far.

00:30:55.680 I mean, Olivia did give a couple of minor interviews just to sort of salvage her reputation 1.00

00:31:00.180 when this was all happening to her, but she did, she hadn't done the big in-depth thing

00:31:03.120 like she just did with the New York Times and the excerpt of Vanity Fair.

00:31:05.800 So now Ryan Lizza has had about enough of this and he decides on, um, he left Politico

00:31:14.380 during this whole scandal and he decides on his new, it's not Substack, it's a publication

00:31:19.100 I hadn't actually yet heard of.

00:31:21.320 What's it called, Steve?

00:31:23.480 Telos.

00:31:24.280 Oh, it is his Substack, but he just calls it Telos News.

00:31:27.940 What does that mean, Telos?

00:31:29.360 Is that a Spanish reference?

00:31:30.480 I don't even know what that is.

00:31:31.260 What is Telos?

00:31:31.980 T-E-L-O-S. 1.00

00:31:32.300 I think it's Latin.

00:31:33.780 It's Latin?

00:31:34.680 Oh, I went to public school.

00:31:36.120 I don't, I don't understand that.

00:31:37.820 I can't tell you what it means.

00:31:40.140 Okay.

00:31:41.000 Well, in any event, I'll ask my kids.

00:31:43.060 They're in private school.

00:31:43.840 They know, they know Latin or at least a few words.

00:31:45.900 I knew, I learned a few in law, but not enough.

00:31:47.900 Okay.

00:31:48.640 So he is like, okay, bitches, it's time for me to pick up my pen because I'm a writer too. 0.99

00:31:56.280 Oh, and here's what happens.

00:32:02.580 The New York Post is writing this up.

00:32:05.160 They say, Lizza, well, I mean, I read his piece, so actually we don't need to, I have it here, stand by.

00:32:14.420 We don't need to rely on the New York Post, though they did do a good write-up of it.

00:32:18.820 Where is it?

00:32:19.320 I have so many papers.

00:32:21.160 Okay, I left it in the other room.

00:32:22.480 My God.

00:32:23.780 I like how they went to the overhead camera so we can see all of your papers.

00:32:27.420 Like there's so many, like there's so many affairs to keep track of.

00:32:31.300 I don't have it all.

00:32:32.600 Okay.

00:32:32.940 In any event, I guess I left it back in my other room, but I do have the write-up on it and my team's write-up on it.

00:32:38.580 Okay.

00:32:40.420 He writes about how early on in their relationship, he helped her out of a jam with Keith Olbermann, whom she had dated.

00:32:50.940 The way he words it in his piece is a little weird.

00:32:54.000 It almost makes it sound like she cheated on him with Keith Olbermann, but that's not it.

00:32:59.040 She dated Keith Olbermann when she was very young, like 20, 21, and like new to New York, and lived with Keith Olbermann, or at least he paid for her studio apartment.

00:33:10.500 And points out like he spent lavished thousands of dollars upon her.

00:33:15.640 Keith Olbermann is now gleefully confirming all of this, saying, oh, I was making tons of money at the time.

00:33:21.760 We were together four years, that's four birthdays, four Christmases, four anniversaries.

00:33:25.840 What was I supposed to get her?

00:33:26.900 Like a, you know, plus a Kmart gift card?

00:33:31.460 You know, like, okay, you're super important, Keith Olbermann.

00:33:34.580 But I'm not going to lie, him actually being Olivia Nuzzi's boyfriend for four years does make him slightly cooler than I thought he was. 0.91

00:33:41.140 Um, so he's out there, he's enjoying every second of this.

00:33:46.320 And, uh, Ryan Lizza writes about how she came to him, Olivia did, and is like, please help me, you know, clean up this mess that I made with Keith Olbermann.

00:33:57.840 And he did.

00:33:58.560 I'm not exactly sure how they needed to do it, but he, she needed to get away from him.

00:34:02.700 She didn't like Keith Olbermann when all was said and done.

00:34:06.620 And what a shock.

00:34:08.380 And, uh, he helped her clean up that mess.

00:34:10.600 Do we still have Emily?

00:34:11.560 Did we lose her?

00:34:14.660 Uh-oh.

00:34:16.060 We lost Emily.

00:34:17.060 Oh my God.

00:34:17.900 Who, is it Keith Olbermann?

00:34:19.200 He's interfering.

00:34:19.960 This is, this is the part where it just gets good for Keith Olbermann.

00:34:22.820 All right, we're going to get her back on, but she knows the story.

00:34:24.740 So I'm going to continue reading for the listening audience.

00:34:26.600 Um, okay, and then Ryan Lizza writes as follows, that there was a period in their relationship where he uncovered a secret love letter on hotel stationery after she returned from covering what he thought was just the presidential race in 2020.

00:34:49.800 She was on the road, he thought she was just doing, like, presidential politics coverage, and he finds a secret love letter she began to pen but did not yet complete on hotel stationery.

00:35:00.120 Um, and it was not addressed to Ryan.

00:35:02.640 It was addressed to someone named Mark.

00:35:05.740 Um, it went on to, like, have some kind of corny lines, like, quote,

00:35:13.960 if I swallowed every drop of water from the tower above your house, I would still thirst for you.

00:35:19.960 She had written in this note dated March 5th, 2020, according to Lizza.

00:35:24.600 Their home, he noted, had no water tower.

00:35:28.940 Oh God, this is so, so sad.

00:35:31.820 Why do we know this?

00:35:33.120 Why are we knowing any of this?

00:35:35.260 Uh, he wrote that another page named the recipient of the letter as Mark, which is not his name,

00:35:41.160 which he said confirmed what he feared, an alleged physical relationship with someone other than himself.

00:35:49.620 By early 2020, he, Ryan, and Olivia had signed a contract to write a book on the presidential race, he says.

00:35:59.040 Uh, but Newsy was busy spending more and more time on the road, uh, including in South Carolina,

00:36:04.920 which he believed was for reporting.

00:36:07.040 Instead, Lizza now claims, uh, that she, quote, secretly followed this particular man on the campaign trail

00:36:16.900 to pursue him, allegedly sending him explicit photos and messages while telling Ryan Lizza

00:36:24.060 that she was, quote, dealing with the crisis concerning her sick mother.

00:36:27.840 He says she admitted to him that the relationship with this man intensified, ultimately leading to a sexual encounter at his home

00:36:38.040 the night she went dark and stopped answering messages, uh, from Lizza.

00:36:43.800 And he finishes his piece, stand by, uh, by phoning his agent and delivering the news.

00:36:55.060 Quote, we have a big problem, he recalled telling the agent, quote, Olivia is sleeping with Mark Sanford.

00:37:05.440 Mark Sanford was a presidential candidate back in 2020 who made news because he was caught cheating on his wife

00:37:11.860 with a different woman, which became the big story.

00:37:14.900 Remember he went, like, hiking with her on, like, some Argentinian trail or something?

00:37:18.960 I can't remember the details, but it was, like, it was all over the news.

00:37:23.280 And it, he had been considered a frontrunner, and then it just killed his chances back in 2020.

00:37:28.240 People weren't responding to this kind of news the way Trump did, you know.

00:37:31.040 It was like, fake news!

00:37:33.180 Screw everyone!

00:37:34.460 And then people looking the other way, like, pretending not to believe it.

00:37:38.100 Um, it, it really did mess up his campaign.

00:37:41.220 And now it turns out, according to Ryan Lizza, that Olivia, too, was having an affair with Mark Sanford.

00:37:47.680 And at a time, he alleges she has not yet responded to this, so we'll find out whether she denies this,

00:37:53.340 at a time when she was covering him.

00:37:56.100 And indeed, if you look back, she did profile Mark Sanford.

00:37:59.280 Uh, there are pictures of it.

00:38:01.440 And, um, Ryan Lizza says, at this time,

00:38:05.940 she was either in the midst of or beginning an affair with him and went on to continue covering him.

00:38:11.500 And, um, she was sleeping with her subject, which is a very clear journalistic no-no.

00:38:17.500 That is not okay by any, any, anyone's measure.

00:38:21.420 Um, he asks, how could we write a book about the presidential campaign

00:38:26.080 if Olivia had a sexual relationship with one of the candidates?

00:38:30.140 And they didn't write that book,

00:38:33.280 though I think by 2024, when they broke up over the alleged Kennedy affair,

00:38:38.020 they had once again decided to write a book together.

00:38:41.960 Like, they patched things up after Sanford, stayed together,

00:38:45.420 and once again had decided to write a book together,

00:38:50.180 which once again had to be shelved.

00:38:53.800 Because again, she was covering RFKJ and allegedly fell in love with him.

00:38:58.920 Well, she said she fell in love with him and began this via text affair, she claims.

00:39:04.680 Again, RFKJ is suggesting, though not that explicitly,

00:39:09.460 that she's some sort of a psycho stalker 0.90

00:39:12.560 who, like, developed a fixation on him after one profile of him.

00:39:17.560 Okay, that's where things are now, Emily.

00:39:20.260 She's back with us.

00:39:21.560 Um, so how do the Ryan Lizza revelations about Olbermann, Sanford,

00:39:25.840 and this allegedly being a pattern, change things?

00:39:28.540 Because I will tell you, there's now a push by Twitter, by X,

00:39:33.920 for her to lose this, the gig she's now got at Vanity Fair.

00:39:39.180 They want, they want her to be punished for all of this.

00:39:42.640 That's really what they want, more than she already has been.

00:39:44.800 She already lost her job at New York Magazine. 0.93

00:39:46.140 Well, I think that's dumb.

00:39:48.300 I mean, she's an essayist.

00:39:49.460 I think her title with Vanity Fair is West Coast Correspondent,

00:39:52.160 something like that.

00:39:53.100 And she's an essayist.

00:39:55.220 If she's not covering, like, the daily TikTok of Capitol Hill

00:39:59.020 and campaigns and politics as someone who's, like, breaking news,

00:40:03.400 then, you know, she's just going to sort of cover politics 0.93

00:40:06.300 from a literary perspective,

00:40:08.080 which I'm assuming is what the gig is going to look like.

00:40:12.000 Then, you know, if she's writing in first person,

00:40:14.100 new journalism style, by all means,

00:40:16.140 like, let's, we should be begging her to continue writing at this point

00:40:20.760 because she's giving so much.

00:40:22.880 But Lizza, I found just his revelation,

00:40:26.580 which he also wrote, he wrote in this, like, overwrought prose

00:40:29.520 where he's talking about tinkering in the garden

00:40:31.380 and tending to his bamboo and cleaning up a little bit of messes.

00:40:33.840 He's really upset about the bamboo in the garden.

00:40:35.780 He's trying to pull it out, pull it out, pull it out,

00:40:37.420 and it keeps regrowing.

00:40:39.540 I mean, you know these are the types of people who just, like, love making, like,

00:40:45.040 I don't know.

00:40:46.780 These are the types of people that think very highly of themselves,

00:40:49.660 and Lizza is the type of person here 1.00

00:40:51.860 who thinks he is coming across in a way that repairs his reputation,

00:40:57.820 but actually it is so profoundly unmasculine to treat-

00:41:03.900 Not great.

00:41:04.760 No, I mean, to treat a woman that you were with this way,

00:41:08.060 to talk about how you didn't really want to get engaged to her,

00:41:10.940 you just wanted to live with her and test her out,

00:41:13.520 and then to say, well, you know, Olivia started this.

00:41:16.660 I was going to be quiet about all of it.

00:41:18.540 We agreed to be quiet about all of it.

00:41:20.140 And then to go spill all of these details

00:41:23.880 and to be the one who nobody would have known about Mark Sanford

00:41:27.280 if he hadn't written about it.

00:41:29.240 Like, to be the man and to be the person who has to tattletale

00:41:33.780 on this younger woman that you were in a relationship with

00:41:36.840 despite having children and a family,

00:41:39.440 you were living with her, and to blame her.

00:41:42.220 I mean, it just doesn't make him come across better.

00:41:44.620 It makes him come across like a narcissist and immature.

00:41:49.320 And there's something, like, deeply unmasculine about it.

00:41:52.120 So I thought the subsec was helpful to that effect

00:41:54.800 in giving us some insight into how he conducts himself.

00:41:58.720 Not to mention, all of the men on X that I have read today

00:42:03.100 are like, dude, this is not something you want to admit about yourself,

00:42:07.880 that she had this affair, that you stayed with her,

00:42:11.420 that she had yet another affair.

00:42:13.680 You know, like, this isn't, this, it's not, it's not great.

00:42:17.120 I understand that point.

00:42:18.560 But, like, in his defense, I'll defend him.

00:42:22.280 I think he's feeling extremely angry and betrayed

00:42:25.860 because he did forgive her clearly that first time.

00:42:28.800 And I'm sure it was painful to read the excerpt.

00:42:32.220 He read it with a very different eye, I'm sure, than you and I did

00:42:35.000 and did not appreciate, you know,

00:42:37.440 they're talking about her having RFKJ's baby

00:42:40.700 and what she loved about him, his eyes and his nose

00:42:44.320 and how he said he'd take a bullet for her

00:42:46.720 and how his desire, I mean, can you imagine

00:42:49.080 if you were her fiancé, the anger that would be surging

00:42:52.700 through your veins in reading that?

00:42:54.840 Now, he says he's with another person now

00:42:56.580 and that this new gal's great and he loves doing the sub stack

00:42:59.200 and that's all good for Ryan.

00:43:00.440 But I'm sure his anger led him to just say,

00:43:03.580 fuck it, it's on.

00:43:05.020 Like, I'm going to drop the bomb that I've been withholding

00:43:08.400 which is because this really, it does change things.

00:43:12.240 I mean, honestly, it does change things

00:43:13.400 to find out it's a pattern if it's true

00:43:15.980 that, like, this is the second presidential candidate

00:43:18.700 that she's covered and slept with at the same time.

00:43:21.100 Like, I'm not saying it's great to do it once.

00:43:24.480 For the record, I've never slept with the source.

00:43:27.520 I just want to make sure, I'm not making excuses for her

00:43:30.100 because this is something, like, trust me,

00:43:31.680 I've never slept with the source.

00:43:32.920 Um, but it's one thing, like, affairs of the heart,

00:43:37.620 people are unhappily married, but, like, a pattern,

00:43:40.020 you know, and especially with, like, the older man thing

00:43:42.760 and it's, like, I see the point people are raising

00:43:44.700 which is, like, how could you employ her

00:43:47.140 as a politics reporter at this point?

00:43:50.560 She is, as you point out, West Coast editor

00:43:52.920 for Vanity Fair, which seems fine

00:43:54.800 and I don't think for one second

00:43:56.140 she should lose that position.

00:43:58.180 Yeah, I agree with that.

00:43:59.340 And, I mean, I just, the sad part of this

00:44:03.320 is Olivia did lose her father pretty young

00:44:06.360 and, you know, her also claim to fame

00:44:09.280 was parlaying a gig on the Anthony Weiner campaign,

00:44:13.600 an internship on the Anthony Weiner campaign

00:44:15.420 into a big, yeah, into a big essay.

00:44:19.420 And so it just seems like she's been through

00:44:22.660 a perfect storm of, like, personal and political

00:44:27.820 and professional pain and weirdness

00:44:31.180 and I get that's sort of the poetry

00:44:32.940 that she's trying to come across,

00:44:35.640 that she's trying to make come across in the book,

00:44:37.580 even calling it American Canto,

00:44:39.480 this idea that her personal story

00:44:41.640 has been woven with this really crazy decade,

00:44:44.480 interwoven with this really crazy decade plus

00:44:46.520 in American politics in a somewhat interesting

00:44:50.020 and instructive way.

00:44:52.220 But also, I mean, it's definitely,

00:44:55.280 there's clearly something that personally

00:44:58.120 is creating a pattern

00:44:59.900 and that's, I hope that she gets help for that

00:45:03.080 because it's replicated itself a number of times now

00:45:06.240 in a way that's brought, it has hurt other kids.

00:45:09.020 I'm sure Liz's kids have been really hurt by this.

00:45:11.100 I'm sure Liz has been really hurt by this

00:45:12.880 and nobody deserves that.

00:45:14.520 It sounds like he hurt them

00:45:16.280 and then they got more hurt.

00:45:18.560 I don't know.

00:45:19.320 I think even Lizza is 10 years older than she is.

00:45:21.720 There's Oberman who is like decades older.

00:45:24.000 Lizza's at least 10 years older.

00:45:25.560 RFKJ's almost 40 years older.

00:45:28.760 Stanford's a lot older too.

00:45:30.440 Like, I don't know.

00:45:31.880 Somebody, I think it was Charles C.W. Cook tweeted out

00:45:34.520 or somebody tweeted out a headline of like,

00:45:37.860 Olivia Nuzzi in the White House with Trump

00:45:41.840 and like three other figures and he just wrote,

00:45:44.440 uh-oh.

00:45:45.320 It was just, which was funny.

00:45:49.440 But look, I, what I would want,

00:45:51.260 and look, she doesn't need my advice,

00:45:52.620 but Olivia has tons of raw talent 1.00

00:45:57.620 and she's got a very bright future.

00:45:59.760 This is a dark chapter,

00:46:00.840 but she's going to be around as a political writer

00:46:02.900 for a very long time.

00:46:04.300 And I would love for her

00:46:07.620 and all young writers coming up

00:46:09.960 and young reporters coming up

00:46:11.000 to realize that the best and really only way

00:46:14.840 to make your name in this industry

00:46:16.240 is through your talent.

00:46:18.240 I mean, it's just,

00:46:18.900 it's the best and really only way

00:46:20.540 to rise up and sustain a career in this industry.

00:46:24.800 And, you know, the more distractions like this,

00:46:26.720 part of it is life.

00:46:27.620 People aren't, they're not perfect.

00:46:29.980 They make mistakes.

00:46:30.820 Sometimes those mistakes,

00:46:31.680 if you're a public figure, make news.

00:46:33.580 And sometimes when the news is about you

00:46:35.160 and it's so loud,

00:46:35.800 you feel like you have to say something.

00:46:37.460 I think that's kind of the position she was in here. 0.97

00:46:39.480 But it's not something you want to dine out on at all.

00:46:43.280 It's something you want to move on from quickly.

00:46:46.300 And, you know, with any sort of PR crisis like this one,

00:46:49.880 it's probably just best to own it, own it all,

00:46:51.920 own it early and move on.

00:46:53.440 Because it's not a fake news controversy.

00:46:55.220 It's a real controversy.

00:46:56.480 You know, she admits this happened.

00:46:58.140 So it's like, okay.

00:46:59.440 I mean, I will just say like,

00:47:00.620 when involved in fake news controversies,

00:47:02.880 I have learned at the ripe old age I am,

00:47:05.480 don't give them any oxygen

00:47:06.440 because that's exactly what your detractors want.

00:47:08.280 They want nothing more than for you to spin your own wheels

00:47:10.720 on their bullshit nonsense about you.

00:47:13.220 It took me 55 years as of today.

00:47:15.860 But I finally figured that one out, EJ.

00:47:17.800 So hopefully the young gals coming up behind me, 1.00

00:47:19.840 and guys for that matter,

00:47:21.180 can learn that too sooner.

00:47:22.420 It's your birthday, Megan?

00:47:24.020 It's my birthday.

00:47:25.200 Happy birthday.

00:47:26.000 This story couldn't have come at a better time.

00:47:29.760 Thank you so much.

00:47:31.280 Well, look, I guess at my ripe old age,

00:47:33.780 what I wish for all these people is healing,

00:47:36.820 actual love, wellness,

00:47:39.220 and bright careers that come from the tip of their pens

00:47:42.440 instead of any other tip.

00:47:45.020 Any other tip?

00:47:45.940 Oh my gosh.

00:47:47.060 That was beautiful.

00:47:48.420 I mean, like 30% of romantic comedies,

00:47:52.640 comedies at least,

00:47:53.780 the protagonist is a female journalist,

00:47:55.980 like how to lose a guy in 10 days.

00:47:57.720 You go down the line.

00:47:58.820 And so I think there's an archetype,

00:48:00.300 especially like millennial women, 0.97

00:48:02.200 and probably Gen X too,

00:48:03.640 saw in movies and in television

00:48:05.420 where there's this troubled journalist

00:48:07.280 who creates great art and writing

00:48:10.660 out of personal struggles,

00:48:11.960 and it's all interwoven.

00:48:13.680 And so I think it's very easy

00:48:15.380 for people to get caught up

00:48:17.060 in the romance of all of that.

00:48:19.000 So I hope that this has been

00:48:21.040 a colossal lesson for Olivia Nuzzi too. 0.89

00:48:24.840 Yeah, honestly, I think you're right about that.

00:48:27.300 She actually is getting dragged right now on X

00:48:29.300 because she, in 2015,

00:48:31.820 tweeted out a screen grab from some film or movie

00:48:34.320 or a TV show that had a reporter

00:48:37.520 sleeping with a source.

00:48:39.760 And she captioned it to the effect of,

00:48:42.340 why does Hollywood think female reporters 1.00

00:48:44.680 all sleep with their sources?

00:48:46.200 Oh, no.

00:48:47.260 I know.

00:48:48.220 And I was like, oh, well, that did not age well.

00:48:51.560 Maybe it gave an idea.

00:48:53.900 I don't know.

00:48:54.400 But here's the other problem.

00:48:55.640 Like I said up top, she's stunning.

00:48:57.820 So she'll have a lot of options.

00:49:00.220 But look, having come up through this industry,

00:49:03.620 I've been in news now.

00:49:05.580 I don't know.

00:49:06.020 I got in 2004, 2003.

00:49:07.980 So over 20 years, you will have opportunities.

00:49:13.060 You will.

00:49:13.760 It's a dirty, sleazy, sometimes sexy business.

00:49:18.860 And you put in long hours.

00:49:20.900 There are lots of hotel rooms.

00:49:22.620 There is an imbalance of power

00:49:24.040 where very rich, powerful men

00:49:26.400 will definitely desire the younger ingenue reporter.

00:49:29.800 And you really have to know

00:49:32.260 what your moral compass is going into it.

00:49:34.520 You know, you have to understand who you are,

00:49:37.020 what you will and will not do

00:49:38.140 before any of that starts.

00:49:39.640 Because, you know, once you head down that path,

00:49:42.280 sort of trying to inadvertently blow up

00:49:44.100 your life professionally,

00:49:45.480 like in the industry that you've chosen to be in,

00:49:47.560 and you want to make a name for yourself in,

00:49:49.240 it is hard to recover.

00:49:50.260 It's going to take a long time.

00:49:51.680 You can do it, though.

00:49:52.700 Like, I think she will come out of this

00:49:54.740 because she is talented.

00:49:56.200 If she sucked and she didn't have any writing talent 0.85

00:49:59.100 and reporting chops, which she does, she wouldn't.

00:50:02.560 But she does have those gifts.

00:50:04.420 So I think the money's on her.

00:50:06.220 I don't think this is going to hurt Kennedy at all.

00:50:08.100 I don't know what's going to happen

00:50:08.860 between Kennedy and his beautiful wife, Cheryl.

00:50:11.460 It's probably not great.

00:50:13.020 The details make it tough to deny.

00:50:15.060 But like I said at the top,

00:50:16.980 who the hell knows what's in somebody's marriage compact

00:50:19.500 and what they're willing to overlook

00:50:22.600 in the name of, I don't know what, you know,

00:50:26.740 I don't know, calmness, peace and serenity in one's life.

00:50:30.920 There are some women I know 1.00

00:50:32.780 who choose to look the other way

00:50:34.520 when they know their spouses are cheating

00:50:36.400 because they just, they have kids.

00:50:37.980 What are they just, they kind of feel like men are dogs.

00:50:41.560 You know, some people have that in their heads.

00:50:43.900 I hope that's not your future, Emily,

00:50:45.720 and I'm damn sure it's not mine.

00:50:48.860 I'm pretty sure it's not mine either.

00:50:51.800 All right, lady,

00:50:52.380 we're going to take a quick break

00:50:53.320 and we're going to come back with some actual news

00:50:55.460 as opposed to just news about the news reporters

00:50:58.520 and that will end today's edition of Days of Your Lives.

00:51:04.400 Grand Canyon University,

00:51:06.060 an affordable, private Christian university

00:51:08.660 based in beautiful Phoenix, Arizona,

00:51:10.360 is one of the largest universities in the country.

00:51:13.560 Praised for its culture of community and impact,

00:51:16.380 GCU integrates the free market system,

00:51:18.340 a welcoming Christian worldview,

00:51:19.880 and free and open discourse

00:51:21.440 into more than 360 academic programs,

00:51:24.300 including more than 300 online.

00:51:26.020 Join a nationwide community of learners

00:51:28.700 redefining what online education looks like

00:51:31.260 through academically rigorous

00:51:33.040 and industry-driven programs

00:51:34.720 that can spark bold ideas

00:51:36.080 and prepare you for a future that matters.

00:51:38.260 In addition to federal grants and aid,

00:51:41.260 GCU's online students received nearly $161 million

00:51:44.640 in institutional scholarships in 2024.

00:51:48.040 Find your purpose at Grand Canyon University,

00:51:51.420 private, Christian, affordable.

00:51:53.740 Visit gcu.edu slash my offer

00:51:57.180 to see the scholarships you may qualify for.

00:51:59.820 When I got a great deal on a great gift at Winner's,

00:52:04.340 I started wondering,

00:52:05.460 could I get fabulous gifts for everyone on my list?

00:52:07.920 Like this designer fragrance for my daughter.

00:52:10.180 At just $39.99, how could I resist?

00:52:13.020 This luxurious wool throw for my sister.

00:52:15.680 This gold watch for my partner.

00:52:17.600 A wooden puzzle for my niece.

00:52:19.340 Leather gloves for my boss.

00:52:20.960 Ooh, European chocolate for the crossing guard.

00:52:24.280 At these prices,

00:52:25.240 could I find something for everyone at Winner's?

00:52:27.060 Stop wondering, start gifting.

00:52:29.660 Winners, find fabulous for less.

00:52:34.040 All right, let's go.

00:52:35.400 Isn't it great to be together?

00:52:36.860 It's so great to see you!

00:52:39.360 You're not alone.

00:52:40.480 It's only the liberal media and the haters

00:52:42.140 who want you to think that.

00:52:43.320 We're in the majority right now.

00:52:44.760 We're from Chicago.

00:52:45.820 We flew in just for this.

00:52:48.000 I was like, we have to go.

00:52:49.300 And then after what happened to Charlie,

00:52:50.700 I'm like, we definitely have to go.

00:52:52.280 Don't miss your last chance

00:52:53.760 to be part of the Megyn Kelly Live Tour.

00:52:55.880 It's a very important time

00:52:57.520 in our country, Megyn.

00:52:58.700 Stand firmly.

00:53:00.100 Do not waver on the truth.

00:53:02.500 Next stops, Bakersfield, Anaheim,

00:53:04.660 and the grand finale in Glendale, Arizona,

00:53:07.800 featuring special guest Erica Kirk.

00:53:10.300 I really genuinely feel like

00:53:12.440 it's more important right now than ever.

00:53:14.600 You know, for all the reasons.

00:53:16.180 And it took courage for all of you to come.

00:53:19.180 The biggest thing we can do is be unafraid.

00:53:22.160 Fight, fight, fight!

00:53:23.440 So go get your tickets right now

00:53:26.360 before they sell out.

00:53:27.400 MeganKelley.com.

00:53:28.420 Presented by YRefi and SiriusXM.

00:53:35.440 Emily Jaschinski is back with me now.

00:53:37.640 She is the host of After Party

00:53:39.020 with Emily Jaschinski.

00:53:40.340 Go subscribe now,

00:53:41.640 wherever you get your podcasts,

00:53:43.260 and on YouTube at

00:53:45.140 AfterPartyEmily.com.

00:53:48.100 I love that.

00:53:50.540 She is also the host of the

00:53:51.960 Megan Kelly Wrap-Up Show

00:53:53.500 on SiriusXM, channel 111.

00:53:55.540 That's the MK channel on Sirius,

00:53:57.480 and she hops over there to talk to you 1.00

00:53:58.920 live right after this show ends.

00:54:00.920 Call now at 833-44-MEGAN,

00:54:03.280 833-446-3496

00:54:05.100 if you want to get on the line first.

00:54:07.380 You can just put it on hold on speaker

00:54:09.100 so that you're at the top of the line,

00:54:11.140 and Emily will get to you within the hour.

00:54:13.460 And before we get back to Emily,

00:54:15.480 oh, this is just in my prompter.

00:54:16.680 We have a breaking news video.

00:54:19.080 Oh, boy.

00:54:22.100 From one astronaut to another,

00:54:24.740 happy birthday, Megan Kelly.

00:54:26.760 What?

00:54:27.540 No.

00:54:28.400 Have you been?

00:54:30.740 Have you been?

00:54:36.480 Okay, that's clearly AI,

00:54:38.140 and I appreciate that.

00:54:39.180 I have been.

00:54:40.360 Actually, I've been, yes.

00:54:41.720 I, just like Gail, have been,

00:54:44.140 except I didn't have to ruin my career

00:54:48.280 in order to get those accolades

00:54:49.980 and then shame everybody

00:54:50.860 for not seeing me as a heroine.

00:54:52.580 Okay, let's do some hard news.

00:54:55.440 Yesterday on this program,

00:54:56.620 we had Glenn Greenwald,

00:54:57.440 and we were talking about the news

00:54:59.340 that Tucker broke on Friday,

00:55:00.780 that Miranda Devine matched

00:55:02.920 and then advanced on Monday

00:55:04.740 about Thomas Matthew Crooks,

00:55:07.360 the Trump shooter,

00:55:08.440 the guy who shot Trump

00:55:09.500 at Butler, Pennsylvania,

00:55:11.220 killed Corey Comperatore

00:55:12.400 and shot two others.

00:55:14.860 And they reported that Crooks

00:55:17.960 had a very large online footprint,

00:55:20.600 that he had been getting

00:55:21.840 increasingly violent in his rhetoric

00:55:23.640 for the two years prior

00:55:25.520 to Butler, Pennsylvania,

00:55:26.860 that he had been firmly on the right

00:55:28.600 for half of that time,

00:55:29.980 and then almost like a switch flipped,

00:55:32.700 went over to the left

00:55:34.400 and started to sound more like

00:55:36.020 an MSNBC host,

00:55:37.300 and then beyond that

00:55:38.420 with his violent, violent rhetoric

00:55:40.480 and calls for hurting people

00:55:42.680 and his hatred of Donald Trump.

00:55:44.900 And then Miranda advanced the story

00:55:47.260 by purporting that he also

00:55:48.900 was part of the furry culture,

00:55:51.640 trans-furry culture, 0.99

00:55:52.740 that he was using pronouns,

00:55:55.040 they, them, like non-binary stuff, 0.99

00:55:57.680 and was into furries,

00:55:58.820 just like we've seen

00:55:59.720 with the Charlie Kirk-accused shooter,

00:56:02.300 with the Ascension Minneapolis

00:56:04.340 school shooting, and so many others,

00:56:06.440 the one in Nashville, Tennessee,

00:56:08.780 we could, I mean,

00:56:09.240 we would be here for a long time,

00:56:10.300 like more than 10 now.

00:56:11.880 We've seen either a trans ideology, 0.86

00:56:13.980 a non-binary, or a furry ideology pop up.

00:56:17.060 And we speculated on the show

00:56:18.520 that maybe Miranda got her sourcing 0.93

00:56:20.260 from the FBI,

00:56:21.320 which wanted to like maybe change

00:56:22.940 the conversation from what Tucker dropped.

00:56:25.460 She clarified with me on Twitter yesterday,

00:56:27.860 on X yesterday, that's wrong.

00:56:29.640 And she outed it, 0.84

00:56:31.240 how she got the story pretty openly,

00:56:33.100 saying, I got it from the same source

00:56:34.640 Tucker got it from.

00:56:36.400 So the same person apparently

00:56:37.760 went to Miranda and Tucker.

00:56:40.080 And they both gleaned various facts

00:56:42.560 from the reporting

00:56:43.180 and came up with these stories.

00:56:45.400 And Miranda was clear to point out

00:56:47.580 publicly on Twitter,

00:56:49.660 the reason it rankled her

00:56:50.740 is because she wrote,

00:56:51.500 all I've ever gotten from the FBI,

00:56:52.900 including under Trump,

00:56:53.640 is gaslighting and stonewalling

00:56:55.120 and occasional irate phone calls.

00:56:57.000 So it definitely was not the FBI

00:56:59.240 who gave her the story.

00:57:00.260 She said, the leadership of the FBI

00:57:01.440 has been nothing but hostile.

00:57:03.300 So wanted to clarify that

00:57:04.860 and then also add a third reporter

00:57:08.080 who got this same leak

00:57:09.700 from the same source,

00:57:11.340 independent journalist,

00:57:12.160 Brianna Morello,

00:57:13.960 who advanced the story

00:57:15.000 by reporting that

00:57:15.980 this shooter had,

00:57:17.640 quote, multiple deviant art accounts

00:57:20.180 that she says are potentially

00:57:21.920 associated with Thomas Crooks.

00:57:23.880 One such account prominently

00:57:25.040 displays they, them pronouns.

00:57:27.840 A secondary account

00:57:29.080 under the username

00:57:30.040 The Pick Microwave

00:57:32.320 has since been deleted,

00:57:33.480 but its contents remain viewable.

00:57:35.400 The account contained

00:57:36.340 eight original artworks

00:57:37.660 created by the user,

00:57:38.440 all of which were overtly violent

00:57:39.920 and depicted individuals

00:57:41.080 being shot, beaten,

00:57:42.320 or covered in blood.

00:57:43.500 There's one example

00:57:45.040 with like a cartoon figure

00:57:46.760 with a yellow face

00:57:47.820 and a blue shirt

00:57:49.040 holding a rifle

00:57:50.800 and two people

00:57:52.380 clearly dead

00:57:53.320 and shot

00:57:54.020 on the ground.

00:57:55.100 We're showing it

00:57:55.560 for the watching audience

00:57:56.640 right in front of them.

00:57:58.920 She also reports

00:58:00.240 Crooks allegedly

00:58:00.880 opened a PayPal account

00:58:02.100 under the alias

00:58:02.800 Rod Swanson.

00:58:05.040 Important note,

00:58:06.060 that name Swanson

00:58:06.720 may have been inspired

00:58:07.520 by former FBI senior agent

00:58:09.120 Rod Swanson.

00:58:10.420 The former FBI employee

00:58:11.840 was the chief of investigations

00:58:13.340 for the state of Nevada

00:58:14.380 during the 2017 Vegas

00:58:16.100 mass shooting.

00:58:18.080 He also had a Gab account

00:58:19.380 under the name

00:58:20.500 Epic Microwave.

00:58:22.900 And there he posted

00:58:24.560 a series of pro-lockdown

00:58:26.840 anti-Trump messages.

00:58:29.240 This dovetails

00:58:29.820 the Tucker reporting.

00:58:33.080 More and more,

00:58:34.280 there are questions

00:58:35.100 about what the FBI knew

00:58:38.220 and what they didn't know.

00:58:40.300 whether this stuff

00:58:44.700 was offered to them

00:58:45.880 and whether they took it,

00:58:49.320 were interested in it,

00:58:50.500 and did anything about it.

00:58:51.860 Right?

00:58:52.100 This reporter,

00:58:53.180 this person who went

00:58:54.060 to Tucker,

00:58:54.600 Miranda,

00:58:55.300 and Brianna, 0.93

00:58:56.460 like,

00:58:57.120 did that person 0.90

00:58:57.680 go to the FBI as well?

00:58:59.380 Did they review the files?

00:59:00.520 Did they think

00:59:00.860 this was interesting?

00:59:02.080 And why aren't they

00:59:02.920 briefing us on this

00:59:03.800 at all,

00:59:05.020 given that Crooks

00:59:05.800 is dead

00:59:06.920 and the investigation

00:59:08.540 appears to be over?

00:59:12.200 This is unfathomable.

00:59:14.120 I mean,

00:59:14.540 the fact that

00:59:15.200 none of this information

00:59:16.400 has been made public,

00:59:17.880 that the FBI

00:59:18.600 has not once come out

00:59:20.140 and said

00:59:20.720 there's also evidence,

00:59:23.080 substantial evidence,

00:59:24.180 by the way,

00:59:24.820 from Crooks' 0.85

00:59:26.820 posting history

00:59:27.800 of him flipping

00:59:29.000 to the left

00:59:30.540 and then posting openly

00:59:32.340 pretty violent musings,

00:59:34.200 that is,

00:59:36.060 the fact that we have

00:59:36.980 had nothing on that

00:59:38.220 until a source

00:59:39.560 went to Tucker Carlson

00:59:40.840 and then to Miranda

00:59:42.020 and to Brianna

00:59:43.140 with this information,

00:59:44.940 according to Tucker,

00:59:45.900 which was used with,

00:59:47.060 which was gleaned

00:59:47.940 by using private detective tools,

00:59:49.860 so at the minimum

00:59:50.820 of what the FBI

00:59:51.860 would have access to,

00:59:53.240 there are two possible explanations,

00:59:55.180 neither of them is good.

00:59:56.420 One is that

00:59:57.340 the FBI

00:59:58.060 didn't know

00:59:58.920 any of this,

00:59:59.820 which I don't buy.

01:00:00.900 In fact,

01:00:01.280 I think it's likely

01:00:01.940 they probably

01:00:02.560 had some of these

01:00:04.000 posts come on their radar

01:00:05.240 before the shooting itself.

01:00:07.160 The second explanation

01:00:08.140 is just that

01:00:08.980 they've been keeping it

01:00:10.000 from the public

01:00:11.120 for some reason.

01:00:12.940 They claim

01:00:13.620 active investigation.

01:00:14.600 That makes pretty much

01:00:15.820 no sense whatsoever,

01:00:17.300 but they have,

01:00:18.920 you know,

01:00:19.320 been very quiet

01:00:20.640 about what appears

01:00:21.860 to have obviously

01:00:22.720 been known

01:00:23.300 behind the scenes.

01:00:24.220 I mean,

01:00:24.340 I don't buy

01:00:24.860 the first explanation,

01:00:26.100 the first possible explanation

01:00:27.140 that this was not

01:00:28.000 on their radar,

01:00:28.780 and I don't

01:00:30.460 particularly understand

01:00:31.620 why they would have

01:00:33.120 any good reason

01:00:34.060 for the second explanation,

01:00:35.400 which is that

01:00:35.880 they've just been

01:00:36.720 sitting on this information

01:00:38.060 about potential

01:00:39.000 they-them pronoun use.

01:00:40.520 Not potential,

01:00:41.280 I mean,

01:00:41.500 pretty obvious,

01:00:42.280 linked to the phone number,

01:00:43.280 linked to the email.

01:00:45.000 It's outrageous.

01:00:45.920 Furry culture.

01:00:47.320 Yes,

01:00:47.620 and if I'm the family

01:00:48.480 of Cory Comparator,

01:00:49.900 and I see the back and forth

01:00:51.260 with the, quote,

01:00:52.280 Willie Tepes figure

01:00:53.300 that you talked with Glenn

01:00:54.220 about yesterday,

01:00:55.020 someone who is linked

01:00:56.460 to what has been designated

01:00:57.640 as a foreign terrorist organization,

01:00:59.360 a European Antifa group,

01:01:01.000 I'm absolutely furious

01:01:02.560 because it seems insane

01:01:04.560 that the FBI

01:01:05.880 either missed this

01:01:06.940 or has been keeping it quiet.

01:01:08.820 That is just,

01:01:09.740 either way,

01:01:10.320 it is unfathomable

01:01:11.200 and infuriating.

01:01:12.060 And why does,

01:01:13.420 according to Tucker's reporting,

01:01:14.540 Thomas Crook's

01:01:15.280 online profile

01:01:16.380 end

01:01:17.340 virtually as soon

01:01:18.640 as he starts corresponding

01:01:19.620 with this William Tepes?

01:01:21.360 I mean,

01:01:21.740 if you were

01:01:22.340 going to speculate about it,

01:01:23.820 you might guess

01:01:24.620 they moved the communications

01:01:26.060 to a different forum

01:01:27.320 that's not traceable

01:01:28.680 and not retrievable.

01:01:29.720 You know,

01:01:30.220 maybe they took it over

01:01:31.000 to Telegram

01:01:31.520 or they took it over,

01:01:32.400 I don't know,

01:01:33.100 even to WhatsApp

01:01:33.660 or someplace other than

01:01:34.960 a place that's easy

01:01:36.240 to retrieve

01:01:36.960 because it does,

01:01:38.360 he was posting

01:01:39.760 quite a bit prior to that

01:01:41.120 so it doesn't track

01:01:42.580 that he just suddenly

01:01:43.760 went silent.

01:01:45.140 We're talking 700 plus

01:01:46.800 YouTube comments

01:01:47.600 over the course

01:01:48.160 of a couple of years.

01:01:49.400 That is not a limited

01:01:50.800 social media profile,

01:01:52.360 which is what,

01:01:53.100 or a limited digital footprint,

01:01:54.480 which is what the FBI

01:01:55.540 said initially it was.

01:01:57.840 And when the FBI

01:01:58.600 initially made comments,

01:01:59.660 they basically said

01:02:00.840 Crooks had anti-immigrant

01:02:02.540 and anti-Semitic,

01:02:04.580 which clearly he had

01:02:05.360 actually serious

01:02:06.580 anti-Semitic posts

01:02:07.700 and that's what

01:02:08.840 they were public with.

01:02:10.000 So when the FBI

01:02:10.740 publicly said that,

01:02:12.180 are we to believe

01:02:12.940 they only saw

01:02:13.800 the first half

01:02:14.600 of his digital footprint

01:02:15.580 and not the more

01:02:16.620 recent stuff

01:02:17.520 by the time

01:02:18.020 he committed the shooting

01:02:19.040 that was completely

01:02:21.440 left-wing anti-Trump?

01:02:23.140 I mean,

01:02:23.320 that's also unfathomable.

01:02:24.680 And I went back

01:02:25.200 and looked at

01:02:25.920 the report,

01:02:27.720 the congressional report

01:02:28.500 that was released

01:02:29.080 last December,

01:02:30.160 December 2024,

01:02:31.400 by the task force

01:02:32.660 on this attempted assassination.

01:02:33.840 And they reported

01:02:35.160 something similar

01:02:35.800 to what Miranda

01:02:36.560 as a journalist experienced,

01:02:37.980 which was just

01:02:39.160 insufficient cooperation

01:02:40.440 from the FBI.

01:02:41.380 It is in that report.

01:02:42.700 So this has been going on

01:02:43.380 for more than a year now

01:02:44.320 where even congressional

01:02:45.260 Republicans

01:02:45.920 are frustrated

01:02:47.160 with the FBI.

01:02:49.040 A journalist like Miranda,

01:02:50.300 who is very good

01:02:50.940 on this topic,

01:02:51.580 frustrated with the FBI.

01:02:52.660 So what are they

01:02:54.100 being so cagey about?

01:02:56.760 None of the possibilities

01:02:58.120 right now

01:02:58.740 seem to reflect well

01:02:59.740 on the FBI.

01:03:01.320 I want to give them

01:03:02.720 the benefit of the doubt

01:03:03.300 because I haven't spoken

01:03:03.940 to them and they've always

01:03:04.740 been very good to me.

01:03:05.620 And so,

01:03:06.120 you know,

01:03:06.700 they're the ones,

01:03:08.380 they helped us out.

01:03:10.120 They broke the news

01:03:12.360 of the rest of the manifesto

01:03:14.860 of the Nashville shooter.

01:03:16.920 We broke that.

01:03:18.340 You know,

01:03:18.660 Stephen Crowder had gotten

01:03:19.620 his hands on it originally

01:03:20.600 and did amazing reporting

01:03:21.600 early on.

01:03:22.080 And then we got the rest

01:03:22.800 of the story

01:03:23.340 and the FBI was not shy.

01:03:25.000 This Trump's FBI,

01:03:26.120 Cash and Dan,

01:03:26.880 not shy about calling out

01:03:28.800 the trans ideology

01:03:30.520 of that shooter.

01:03:31.920 They weren't shy about it

01:03:33.160 in the Minneapolis shooting.

01:03:35.060 So,

01:03:35.380 like,

01:03:35.620 I don't get why

01:03:36.660 this would have been

01:03:37.700 ostensibly a secret

01:03:39.300 in the case of

01:03:40.440 the Butler shooter.

01:03:42.100 You know,

01:03:42.420 maybe it's that

01:03:43.200 they weren't able

01:03:43.920 to actually verify it.

01:03:45.340 You know,

01:03:45.580 like,

01:03:46.180 neither Tucker nor Miranda

01:03:47.280 nor Brianna

01:03:48.020 are saying,

01:03:49.240 like,

01:03:49.560 definitively,

01:03:50.400 we could swear to it

01:03:51.300 in a court of law.

01:03:51.980 It's 100%

01:03:53.180 Thomas Crooks

01:03:54.160 and his social media.

01:03:55.660 But it seems clear

01:03:56.880 that it is.

01:03:57.480 Like,

01:03:57.640 they've gotten us

01:03:58.260 one stop short of that.

01:04:00.780 So maybe that's

01:04:01.800 the FBI's hang-up.

01:04:02.820 Like,

01:04:03.200 they're the FBI

01:04:04.020 and they can't

01:04:04.900 say it publicly

01:04:05.980 unless they have it.

01:04:07.220 Like,

01:04:07.540 they've got it nailed.

01:04:09.220 I don't know.

01:04:10.180 But the whole thing,

01:04:11.540 there should just be

01:04:12.480 an openness.

01:04:13.320 Like,

01:04:13.840 ideally,

01:04:14.300 Cash will give an interview

01:04:15.120 or Dan will give an interview

01:04:16.280 where they just answer

01:04:17.100 the questions about this

01:04:17.860 and say,

01:04:18.340 we did know

01:04:19.360 or we didn't know

01:04:20.140 and this is why

01:04:20.860 we can't run with that.

01:04:22.320 You know,

01:04:22.520 they have a different standard

01:04:23.400 for reporting

01:04:24.000 than those of us

01:04:25.160 in the podcast world do

01:04:26.180 and that I understand too.

01:04:27.460 So,

01:04:28.540 put a pin in it,

01:04:29.360 more to come

01:04:30.020 as we get it.

01:04:31.020 And of course,

01:04:31.580 this was the Biden-FBI.

01:04:33.300 So,

01:04:33.560 I mean,

01:04:33.880 it's possible

01:04:34.420 that they're still,

01:04:35.140 like,

01:04:35.440 raking through the muck

01:04:36.460 of the Biden-FBI

01:04:37.660 and trying to get

01:04:38.340 to the bottom

01:04:38.680 of what happened themselves.

01:04:41.060 I guess so.

01:04:42.360 Just,

01:04:42.740 it's hard to believe

01:04:43.360 there's a bigger case

01:04:44.660 to look through

01:04:46.080 at the FBI

01:04:47.160 than the Butler shooter,

01:04:48.980 the guy who tried

01:04:49.520 to take out Trump.

01:04:50.440 Like,

01:04:50.940 Trump's now president.

01:04:51.920 There's more reason

01:04:52.440 than ever to figure out

01:04:53.220 who did it

01:04:53.780 and if there's somebody

01:04:54.600 else behind it,

01:04:55.260 we need to know

01:04:55.700 that ASAP,

01:04:57.100 Trump's not,

01:04:57.560 like,

01:04:58.160 less controversial today

01:04:59.320 than he was in July

01:05:00.220 of 2024

01:05:00.900 and certainly not

01:05:01.980 less powerful.

01:05:02.820 So,

01:05:03.460 I don't know.

01:05:04.220 That,

01:05:04.680 I don't know.

01:05:05.580 Okay,

01:05:05.980 let me keep going

01:05:06.680 because there's other news

01:05:07.300 to get to.

01:05:08.300 We talked also

01:05:09.160 with Glenn yesterday

01:05:09.840 about how J.D. Vance

01:05:11.200 is now getting attacked.

01:05:12.920 Of course,

01:05:13.700 he's going to be

01:05:14.140 even worse than Trump.

01:05:15.480 Trump,

01:05:16.020 you know,

01:05:16.460 was he really a racist?

01:05:17.680 But J.D. Vance

01:05:18.340 is definitely a racist. 0.51

01:05:19.380 He's an anti-Semite.

01:05:20.700 He's associated

01:05:21.480 with Tucker Carlson

01:05:22.560 who everybody knows

01:05:24.140 is an anti-Semite

01:05:25.100 and a Nazi. 0.52

01:05:26.260 Mark Levin told me so.

01:05:28.620 And they're trying

01:05:29.440 to, like,

01:05:30.080 wrap that around

01:05:30.880 J.D. Vance now

01:05:31.780 because they're friends

01:05:32.500 and he hasn't

01:05:33.040 condemned Tucker.

01:05:34.360 You're a long time waiting.

01:05:35.960 He's never going

01:05:36.800 to condemn Tucker.

01:05:38.060 I hate to disappoint

01:05:39.040 Tucker's critics.

01:05:39.960 Mark my words,

01:05:41.780 J.D. Vance

01:05:42.540 will never condemn him

01:05:44.620 because he's not a dick. 0.75

01:05:46.660 He is going

01:05:47.580 to stick by his friend

01:05:48.540 and I don't think

01:05:49.300 J.D. Vance

01:05:49.840 thinks that Tucker

01:05:51.180 is an anti-Semite

01:05:52.180 or believes any of the things

01:05:53.280 that people are saying

01:05:53.940 about him.

01:05:54.520 And he's not going

01:05:54.980 to say something

01:05:55.380 he doesn't believe.

01:05:56.860 Okay.

01:05:57.600 But he is standing up,

01:05:59.820 like he's actively

01:06:01.000 standing up,

01:06:02.640 for Tucker's son,

01:06:06.360 Buckley Carlson.

01:06:07.220 Now, there are two

01:06:08.120 Buckley Carlsons.

01:06:09.440 Tucker has a brother

01:06:10.340 named Buckley,

01:06:11.200 who I think is two years

01:06:12.180 younger than he is.

01:06:13.120 And then Tucker

01:06:14.020 named his son Buckley.

01:06:16.300 And that son

01:06:17.300 is working for J.D. Vance

01:06:18.980 in the comms shop.

01:06:20.560 And because he's

01:06:22.060 Tucker's son,

01:06:23.200 he's now getting

01:06:24.860 all this pressure

01:06:25.840 on him.

01:06:26.360 He's getting labeled

01:06:27.680 like a bigot.

01:06:29.040 It's crazy.

01:06:30.260 The attacks on

01:06:31.100 Buckley Carlson,

01:06:31.820 which are totally

01:06:32.300 unjustified,

01:06:33.000 and they've just decided

01:06:34.020 to pick on him

01:06:34.960 and pretend he's got

01:06:35.980 positions that he

01:06:36.900 doesn't have

01:06:37.420 and demand that

01:06:38.620 someone speak out

01:06:39.820 about it.

01:06:40.160 It's like, what?

01:06:41.220 So I'll give you

01:06:42.120 an example.

01:06:42.940 There is someone

01:06:43.520 who calls herself

01:06:44.280 a journalist

01:06:44.940 who goes by

01:06:45.660 Sloan Rackmuth,

01:06:47.300 and she has decided

01:06:48.840 to, according to

01:06:50.040 J.D. Vance,

01:06:50.600 he posted this,

01:06:51.660 obsessively attack

01:06:53.460 a staffer

01:06:54.800 in his 20s

01:06:56.180 in J.D.'s office.

01:06:57.120 He's talking about

01:06:57.580 Buckley Carlson

01:06:58.200 because, J.D. goes on,

01:06:59.340 she does not like

01:06:59.920 the views of his father.

01:07:01.620 J.D. goes on to write,

01:07:02.440 every time I see

01:07:03.140 a public attack on Buckley,

01:07:04.220 it's a complete lie,

01:07:05.660 and yes,

01:07:06.140 I notice every person

01:07:07.240 with an agenda

01:07:07.900 who unfairly attacks

01:07:08.980 a good guy

01:07:09.460 who does a great job

01:07:10.280 for me.

01:07:11.180 Then this podcast host,

01:07:12.560 Daniel Mayle,

01:07:13.640 responds with,

01:07:14.360 Mr. Vice President,

01:07:15.500 Sloan Rackmuth,

01:07:16.420 asked if Buckley Carlson,

01:07:17.800 your employee,

01:07:18.980 shares the same affinity

01:07:20.300 for bigotry

01:07:21.320 that his father does.

01:07:22.960 How should we interpret

01:07:24.120 your answer?

01:07:26.540 This woman,

01:07:27.680 Sloan Rackmuth,

01:07:28.500 has been really going

01:07:29.880 after Buckley Carlson

01:07:31.320 as if he's the sitting

01:07:32.940 vice president,

01:07:34.300 it's very untoward

01:07:35.420 and nasty,

01:07:37.080 and J.D. goes on,

01:07:40.100 this Sloan describes herself

01:07:41.620 as a defender

01:07:42.340 of Judeo-Christian values.

01:07:44.080 Is it a Judeo-Christian value

01:07:45.820 to lie about someone

01:07:47.260 you don't know?

01:07:48.320 Not in any church

01:07:49.160 I ever spent time in.

01:07:50.720 And then goes on

01:07:51.380 to post this,

01:07:52.300 I have an extraordinary

01:07:53.200 tolerance for disagreements

01:07:54.500 and criticisms

01:07:55.080 from the various people

01:07:56.640 in our coalition,

01:07:57.800 but I'm a very loyal person,

01:07:59.220 and I have zero tolerance

01:08:00.540 for scumbags

01:08:01.380 attacking my staff.

01:08:02.520 And yes,

01:08:03.440 everyone who I've seen

01:08:04.720 attack Buckley with lies

01:08:06.520 is a scumbag.

01:08:08.300 So good for him.

01:08:10.000 He's amazing.

01:08:11.200 Like,

01:08:11.820 taking on these,

01:08:12.680 like,

01:08:13.320 online smear campaigns,

01:08:15.060 you could argue

01:08:15.700 it's beneath the dignity.

01:08:16.960 I don't think so at all.

01:08:17.960 I think it restores the dignity

01:08:19.980 of the vice president's office.

01:08:21.660 He's a young vice president.

01:08:23.520 He knows that online

01:08:24.460 does matter in some circles,

01:08:25.960 and it can drive narratives

01:08:27.280 about people.

01:08:27.960 And this is a totally

01:08:28.980 innocent young man

01:08:31.200 who's done nothing

01:08:32.480 other than be born

01:08:34.020 to someone the left hates.

01:08:36.680 So good for the vice president

01:08:37.840 for saying,

01:08:38.780 you keep coming at me,

01:08:39.780 you're going to hear from me.

01:08:41.440 And by the way,

01:08:42.580 Buckley Carlson,

01:08:43.200 he used to work for Jim Banks.

01:08:44.740 He is being confused

01:08:45.700 for his uncle

01:08:46.600 who has some fiery

01:08:48.180 social media posts.

01:08:49.560 But if you consider yourself

01:08:50.580 a journalist,

01:08:51.180 as the Sloan,

01:08:52.100 Rackmuth,

01:08:52.680 and others do,

01:08:53.980 they immediately,

01:08:54.820 it appeared a lot of people,

01:08:55.840 immediately conflated

01:08:56.840 or confused his uncle

01:08:58.840 for him,

01:09:00.080 which is a very easy thing

01:09:01.380 not to do.

01:09:01.980 It just takes a little bit

01:09:02.840 of Googling

01:09:03.420 before you post

01:09:04.720 and a little bit of verification

01:09:05.660 before you post

01:09:06.460 if you say you're acting

01:09:07.380 in a journalistic capacity.

01:09:09.600 And nobody here

01:09:10.740 in D.C.

01:09:11.020 By the way, Emily,

01:09:11.600 by the way,

01:09:12.000 also because if you look

01:09:12.980 up Buckley Carlson,

01:09:13.820 the brother,

01:09:14.600 his ex-bio,

01:09:15.700 is like loving father,

01:09:18.000 husband,

01:09:19.040 you know,

01:09:19.480 brother.

01:09:20.660 Clearly Buckley Carlson,

01:09:22.220 the younger,

01:09:22.940 is all but a kid.

01:09:24.700 He's in his young 20s.

01:09:25.640 He just got out of college.

01:09:26.980 He almost certainly

01:09:28.660 would not have

01:09:29.260 the description

01:09:29.840 that the older

01:09:30.860 Buckley Carlson has.

01:09:31.800 It wouldn't take much

01:09:32.720 to figure out

01:09:33.600 there are two people

01:09:34.220 by that name.

01:09:35.440 Right.

01:09:35.800 And Buckley,

01:09:36.740 the younger Buckley,

01:09:37.660 worked for Jim Banks

01:09:38.740 for a while.

01:09:39.340 He's been in D.C.

01:09:40.120 and nobody in

01:09:40.860 conservative circles

01:09:41.920 in D.C.

01:09:42.380 has a bad word

01:09:43.220 to say about Buckley Carlson.

01:09:44.580 Everybody likes

01:09:45.320 Buckley Carlson

01:09:46.440 who works for J.D.

01:09:47.440 In fact,

01:09:47.760 that's how you end up

01:09:48.620 working for the vice president

01:09:49.600 is that people think

01:09:50.640 you're a good guy

01:09:51.480 and they slot you

01:09:52.780 into that role.

01:09:53.580 So it's just

01:09:54.880 completely ridiculous.

01:09:56.400 And I think part

01:09:57.080 of the reason

01:09:57.720 Vice President Vance

01:09:59.220 has stepped into

01:09:59.920 the mix here

01:10:00.500 is that he recognizes

01:10:01.640 what this is actually about

01:10:03.220 and is nipping it

01:10:04.600 in the bud

01:10:05.560 because he recognizes

01:10:07.320 that for years to come,

01:10:08.500 as you said, Megan,

01:10:09.200 there's going to be

01:10:10.300 a guilt-by-association

01:10:11.540 drumbeat of attacks

01:10:13.260 on Vice President Vance

01:10:14.940 because of his relationship

01:10:16.120 with Tucker Carlson.

01:10:18.000 And that's what this is

01:10:19.400 actually about

01:10:19.980 at the end of the day.

01:10:21.600 So then we get

01:10:22.920 Dave Rubin

01:10:24.620 responding to J.D. Vance

01:10:26.620 with a post that reads,

01:10:28.060 Mr. VP,

01:10:28.780 I submit this respectfully.

01:10:30.080 You're totally right.

01:10:31.000 Nobody should be judged

01:10:31.960 for their parents'

01:10:32.680 words or actions.

01:10:33.880 But, and I think

01:10:34.620 you know this,

01:10:35.500 the very people

01:10:36.180 relentlessly attacking Jews

01:10:37.980 now have Indians 0.99

01:10:39.820 next up on the docket.

01:10:41.340 And that includes

01:10:42.140 your wife,

01:10:42.820 even if she eventually

01:10:43.820 converts to Christianity.

01:10:45.700 So yes,

01:10:46.240 Tucker can interview

01:10:47.060 whoever he wants.

01:10:48.400 His brother can post

01:10:49.440 garbage memes all day.

01:10:51.060 And his son,

01:10:51.860 who may be just fine,

01:10:53.020 can work for the Vice President.

01:10:54.480 But I think people

01:10:55.200 are asking you

01:10:56.060 to stand up

01:10:56.900 when you see something evil.

01:10:58.920 While I know

01:10:59.440 you are trying to hold

01:11:00.220 an increasingly fractured

01:11:01.280 coalition together,

01:11:02.560 you were elected

01:11:03.140 to be a leader,

01:11:04.040 not follow the whims

01:11:05.220 of the trolls.

01:11:06.920 And since they eventually

01:11:07.960 will turn

01:11:08.720 on your own family,

01:11:10.340 at some point

01:11:11.100 you might want

01:11:11.720 to get ahead of it.

01:11:13.140 Those are my two cents

01:11:14.080 and I'll continue

01:11:14.580 to defend all the good things

01:11:15.640 you and President Trump

01:11:16.320 are doing.

01:11:17.320 Something that this crew

01:11:18.460 of people never do.

01:11:20.860 What do you make

01:11:21.240 of that one?

01:11:22.940 Unfortunate.

01:11:23.720 I mean,

01:11:23.920 really unfortunate.

01:11:25.200 It's just,

01:11:26.360 the Vice President

01:11:27.040 has relationships

01:11:27.900 with people

01:11:28.600 as every single person

01:11:29.820 in the conservative movement

01:11:30.800 does right now,

01:11:31.900 by the way,

01:11:32.660 who disagree with them

01:11:33.780 on the issue

01:11:34.460 that is,

01:11:35.360 Dave Rubin

01:11:36.020 appears to be

01:11:36.740 talking about right now.

01:11:37.960 Which is the question

01:11:39.300 of Israel.

01:11:40.480 And there are some people

01:11:41.520 who believe criticism

01:11:42.720 of Israel

01:11:43.540 from Tucker Carlson's

01:11:45.360 guests,

01:11:45.840 and some people

01:11:46.840 will say Tucker Carlson

01:11:47.640 himself,

01:11:48.520 have flirted

01:11:49.440 with open

01:11:50.240 anti-Semitism.

01:11:51.460 And then there are people

01:11:52.080 who disagree with that.

01:11:53.340 And, you know,

01:11:54.260 I obviously disagree

01:11:56.260 with a lot of the

01:11:57.280 over-inflation

01:11:58.300 of that label

01:11:59.300 because I think

01:11:59.820 we learned

01:12:00.240 over the last 10 years

01:12:01.300 that when you inflate

01:12:02.180 labels like racist

01:12:03.120 and bigotry,

01:12:04.260 when people are having

01:12:05.660 good-faith disagreements,

01:12:07.340 you end up

01:12:08.560 cheapening

01:12:09.320 the word itself,

01:12:11.240 which is rightfully

01:12:12.040 stigmatized

01:12:13.020 in the United States

01:12:14.080 of America.

01:12:14.620 We have, like,

01:12:15.160 fought,

01:12:15.740 people have died

01:12:16.660 to make bigotry

01:12:18.220 something that is

01:12:18.840 deeply stigmatized

01:12:20.000 in the United States.

01:12:21.260 And so I think

01:12:21.660 people are allowed

01:12:22.140 to disagree

01:12:22.760 about that,

01:12:23.620 of course.

01:12:24.260 But people find

01:12:25.400 themselves right now

01:12:26.180 in these really

01:12:26.880 fraught personal

01:12:27.920 relationships

01:12:28.480 that they're working

01:12:29.280 out on their own

01:12:30.320 behind the scenes.

01:12:31.580 And it's obviously

01:12:32.260 much more complicated

01:12:33.140 when you're the vice president

01:12:34.440 or when you're

01:12:35.260 a public figure.

01:12:36.600 But Dave Rubin

01:12:37.460 knows that.

01:12:38.420 Dave Rubin

01:12:38.640 absolutely knows that.

01:12:40.220 And I just think

01:12:40.920 too often

01:12:41.460 it becomes

01:12:42.120 virtue signaling

01:12:42.860 along the lines

01:12:43.760 of the same thing

01:12:44.560 that we saw

01:12:45.140 over the last 10 years

01:12:46.500 from the left.

01:12:47.160 And I do feel like

01:12:48.120 this post from Dave

01:12:49.200 was a kind of

01:12:50.100 verging on public

01:12:51.160 virtue signal.

01:12:52.320 And that is the stuff

01:12:53.880 that's going to needlessly

01:12:55.000 tear people apart.

01:12:57.040 Yeah,

01:12:57.180 there's definitely

01:12:57.620 a faction

01:12:58.080 of the conservative right

01:13:00.020 that's the more

01:13:00.820 neo-Chani fashion,

01:13:01.860 the more pro-Israel

01:13:02.620 faction that is

01:13:04.700 turning into

01:13:05.820 BLM 2020.

01:13:07.380 I mean,

01:13:07.640 it's very alienating

01:13:09.140 and it's very

01:13:09.940 not conservative.

01:13:11.220 And it's not going

01:13:12.140 to serve anybody well.

01:13:13.420 Not the right,

01:13:14.120 not them.

01:13:15.880 It's a pointless exercise

01:13:17.620 because most conservatives

01:13:18.960 will recoil

01:13:19.860 when faced with

01:13:21.060 the choices of like,

01:13:22.020 say it,

01:13:22.840 say it my way

01:13:24.040 rather than get on board.

01:13:26.100 That is just not

01:13:26.840 for us.

01:13:27.620 It's just like,

01:13:28.500 it's not how we've operated.

01:13:29.620 It's not like

01:13:30.100 in our DNA.

01:13:31.700 Um,

01:13:32.300 so yeah,

01:13:32.680 I agree with you

01:13:33.400 on that wholeheartedly.

01:13:34.920 The other thing is

01:13:36.400 I don't understand

01:13:37.020 what he's talking about.

01:13:38.080 Like,

01:13:38.420 what,

01:13:38.800 what do you mean?

01:13:40.300 What,

01:13:40.680 not to follow the whims

01:13:41.860 of the trolls?

01:13:42.840 Like,

01:13:43.180 what does he mean?

01:13:43.700 I think people are asking

01:13:44.580 you to stand up

01:13:45.540 when you see something evil.

01:13:46.980 What is the evil thing?

01:13:48.220 Is Tucker evil?

01:13:49.420 Because I don't think

01:13:50.060 J.D. Vance believes that

01:13:51.060 and he does,

01:13:51.400 he's not required to.

01:13:52.820 You're talking about Fuentes?

01:13:54.580 Here's something

01:13:55.060 that's bothering me.

01:13:56.000 I mentioned it yesterday,

01:13:56.940 I didn't get to it.

01:13:57.540 But if he's implying

01:13:59.160 that J.D. Vance

01:13:59.800 hasn't said anything

01:14:00.500 about Fuentes,

01:14:01.440 he's wrong.

01:14:03.120 Just as the New York Times,

01:14:05.300 Jamel Bowie,

01:14:06.360 was wrong yesterday

01:14:07.620 when he said

01:14:08.940 that J.D. Vance

01:14:09.720 refuses to condemn

01:14:10.960 Nick Fuentes.

01:14:11.700 He has condemned him.

01:14:14.020 He doesn't spend

01:14:14.720 all day every day

01:14:15.800 condemning Nick Fuentes.

01:14:17.660 This guy is a podcaster.

01:14:19.440 But,

01:14:19.660 but,

01:14:20.260 he has done it.

01:14:21.700 I remembered him doing it

01:14:23.120 and I actually asked

01:14:23.700 my team to pull the clip

01:14:24.680 and here's at least

01:14:25.380 one of them.

01:14:25.920 I think he's done it

01:14:26.500 repeatedly.

01:14:27.260 Watch.

01:14:29.360 In your own movement,

01:14:30.980 that,

01:14:31.460 that's what I want

01:14:31.880 to ask about

01:14:32.520 because one of the

01:14:33.360 supremacists

01:14:34.080 who was saying

01:14:35.100 things like this

01:14:35.740 about your family,

01:14:37.480 Nick Fuentes,

01:14:39.140 an avowed anti-Semite,

01:14:40.860 went after your wife.

01:14:42.640 He had previously

01:14:43.360 dined at Mar-a-Lago

01:14:44.460 with Donald Trump.

01:14:47.880 Does this have

01:14:48.660 any room

01:14:49.600 in your movement,

01:14:51.240 in the MAGA movement?

01:14:52.180 Of course it doesn't

01:14:52.960 have any room

01:14:53.620 in the MAGA movement.

01:14:54.640 And of course,

01:14:55.080 You disavow him

01:14:55.840 and this.

01:14:56.600 And of course,

01:14:57.220 Donald Trump

01:14:57.900 has criticized this person.

01:14:59.560 Look,

01:14:59.740 I think the guy

01:15:00.180 is a total loser. 0.81

01:15:01.480 Certainly I disavow him.

01:15:02.620 But if you ask me

01:15:03.440 what I care more about,

01:15:04.940 is it a person

01:15:05.640 attacking me personally

01:15:06.840 or is it government

01:15:08.060 policy that discriminates

01:15:09.340 based on race?

01:15:10.060 Because that's

01:15:10.960 what I really worry about.

01:15:13.380 Disavow,

01:15:14.240 total loser.

01:15:15.340 That was as recently

01:15:16.140 as August of 2024.

01:15:18.400 What more is he

01:15:19.380 supposed to do?

01:15:20.280 Is he supposed to,

01:15:21.080 as the vice president,

01:15:21.880 like monitor daily

01:15:23.040 the podcast,

01:15:24.500 do a podcast

01:15:25.700 in rebuttal?

01:15:27.240 You know,

01:15:27.600 it's really,

01:15:29.060 let's face it,

01:15:29.860 about his friendship

01:15:30.520 with Tucker.

01:15:31.100 That's what it's about.

01:15:32.460 That's 100%

01:15:33.320 what it's about.

01:15:33.900 And it's not,

01:15:34.460 and even beyond that,

01:15:35.860 it's about his willingness

01:15:36.900 to engage with people

01:15:38.080 like Tucker Carlson

01:15:38.940 who are pushing the boundaries

01:15:40.060 of what is acceptable

01:15:41.120 conservative Republican Party

01:15:43.020 foreign policy

01:15:43.880 and to ask really deep

01:15:44.940 questions about that.

01:15:45.880 And listen,

01:15:46.400 I actually completely understand

01:15:47.920 as someone who's been

01:15:48.620 fairly critical

01:15:49.360 of our relationship

01:15:50.300 with Israel

01:15:50.700 throughout the last couple

01:15:51.460 of years,

01:15:52.300 completely understand

01:15:53.440 why the Jewish community 1.00

01:15:55.380 in the United States

01:15:56.040 of America

01:15:56.540 is frightened

01:15:57.640 by the growth

01:15:59.220 of Fuentes' platform.

01:16:01.580 I understand that.

01:16:02.500 We are within

01:16:03.000 the generation 0.55

01:16:03.720 of people

01:16:04.940 who lost family members

01:16:06.580 in the Holocaust.

01:16:07.240 There are living

01:16:08.040 Holocaust survivors

01:16:09.280 right now to this day

01:16:10.600 and they are very,

01:16:11.680 very understandably

01:16:13.020 sensitive,

01:16:13.880 especially as the algorithm

01:16:15.160 picks up on Fuentes' world

01:16:17.600 and all of that

01:16:18.300 and starts churning it out

01:16:19.380 and pushing it in your feed

01:16:20.460 and amplifying it.

01:16:21.460 So completely understand

01:16:23.040 the sensitivities,

01:16:24.160 but just in the same way

01:16:26.360 that the right

01:16:27.060 asked the left,

01:16:28.560 people on the left,

01:16:29.500 who, by the way,

01:16:30.600 there are living survivors

01:16:32.280 of Jim Crow 0.82

01:16:33.100 and there are people

01:16:34.960 who are reasonably sensitive

01:16:36.040 about racism

01:16:37.100 in the United States

01:16:38.020 just as the right

01:16:38.820 asked people

01:16:39.600 on that side of this

01:16:40.680 to act in good faith

01:16:43.160 and to be judicious

01:16:45.120 as there were criticisms

01:16:46.900 along the lines

01:16:47.600 J.D. Vance just made

01:16:48.640 about policies made

01:16:50.480 in the name

01:16:50.820 of affirmative action

01:16:52.060 that were fully racist

01:16:53.300 and ideas coming out

01:16:54.600 of people like Ibram X. Kendi

01:16:55.640 that were fully racist

01:16:57.120 and Robin DiAngelo

01:16:58.220 just as the right

01:16:59.300 was critical

01:16:59.860 of the definition

01:17:00.960 of inflation

01:17:01.440 over the last 10 years there.

01:17:03.480 We should be demanding

01:17:04.700 the exact same thing

01:17:05.820 of our own side

01:17:06.460 because it only makes

01:17:07.420 situations worse

01:17:08.260 when you impugn

01:17:08.920 people's motives

01:17:09.640 by accusing them

01:17:11.100 of being engaged

01:17:12.060 in actual bigotry

01:17:13.940 rather than good faith criticism.

01:17:16.380 And if you genuinely believe

01:17:17.660 that J.D. Vance

01:17:18.520 falls into that category

01:17:19.900 because Tucker Carlson

01:17:21.660 did an interview

01:17:22.200 you thought that was

01:17:22.840 too soft with Nick Fuentes,

01:17:24.660 despite the fact

01:17:25.360 that in the middle of it

01:17:26.200 he did go on this

01:17:27.120 back and forth with Fuentes

01:17:28.100 about how blood guilt

01:17:29.160 is not Christian. 0.52

01:17:30.720 Now, I would have done

01:17:31.240 the interview differently,

01:17:31.960 but that part

01:17:33.280 I probably wouldn't have

01:17:33.920 done the interview at all

01:17:34.560 actually to be honest

01:17:35.260 but that part

01:17:35.960 was actually pretty powerful

01:17:37.440 where he's debating

01:17:38.340 Fuentes on ascribing

01:17:40.280 blood guilt to people

01:17:41.460 because of who they are

01:17:42.720 and that's not getting

01:17:44.020 attached to J.D. Vance.

01:17:46.140 I mean, it's just all so

01:17:47.500 it's all so ridiculous

01:17:48.680 and really unfortunate

01:17:50.520 and you'd think

01:17:51.380 that we would have

01:17:52.000 enough distance

01:17:52.740 from the woke movement

01:17:54.140 of the last decade

01:17:54.960 to see

01:17:55.620 to recognize some of that

01:17:57.840 when it crops up

01:17:58.640 on the right.

01:17:59.220 Yeah.

01:17:59.880 I mean, I feel like

01:18:01.000 Tucker answered this

01:18:02.940 when I interviewed him.

01:18:03.940 You know, I said

01:18:04.460 what do you say

01:18:05.000 to the critics

01:18:05.500 who say you should

01:18:06.120 have gone tougher

01:18:06.620 on Fuentes

01:18:07.380 and he said

01:18:08.040 do your own interview.

01:18:09.420 I'll give you

01:18:09.740 his cell phone number.

01:18:10.760 Like, go ahead and do it.

01:18:11.940 I'm me.

01:18:12.560 I'm Tucker.

01:18:13.160 I do the interviews

01:18:13.800 the way I see fit.

01:18:14.860 That's a totally

01:18:15.540 acceptable answer.

01:18:16.600 Like, if you don't like

01:18:17.160 his brand of interviewing

01:18:17.860 you don't have to click

01:18:18.460 on his face.

01:18:19.560 Tough shit, right?

01:18:20.760 Like, he's not required

01:18:21.940 to do his interviews

01:18:22.580 exactly the way you require.

01:18:24.340 Clearly he has

01:18:25.140 a very large fan base

01:18:26.140 that loves the way

01:18:26.800 he does his interviews.

01:18:28.020 Like, if you don't like it

01:18:29.140 that's fine.

01:18:29.820 You don't have to.

01:18:30.540 But he doesn't have to

01:18:31.140 change his interviewing style

01:18:32.340 to appease his critics

01:18:34.280 who, you know,

01:18:35.360 want him to ask

01:18:36.200 exactly the following thing

01:18:37.340 in exactly the following way.

01:18:38.440 Of course he's not

01:18:39.060 going to do that.

01:18:40.000 And they're like,

01:18:40.540 oh, but he was tough

01:18:41.080 on Ted Cruz.

01:18:41.600 He was tough on Ted Cruz

01:18:42.400 because he called Tucker

01:18:43.740 an anti-Semite

01:18:44.440 within the first four minutes

01:18:45.380 of the interview.

01:18:46.060 That has a way

01:18:46.860 of sending you

01:18:47.540 into a more offensive posture

01:18:50.460 against your guest.

01:18:51.520 I would have done the same.

01:18:53.760 You know that feeling

01:18:54.420 when you find

01:18:54.960 the perfect gift?

01:18:56.320 The one the person

01:18:57.060 can actually use

01:18:57.800 every single day?

01:18:59.040 That's Cozy Earth.

01:19:00.580 Their bamboo pajama set

01:19:01.740 is unbelievably soft,

01:19:03.100 lightweight,

01:19:03.560 and cool to the touch.

01:19:05.100 It's that rare mix

01:19:05.960 of cozy and breathable

01:19:06.960 so you never overheat.

01:19:08.420 It can be your go-to

01:19:09.380 for quiet nights

01:19:10.200 at home

01:19:10.820 or weekend mornings.

01:19:12.140 And if you really

01:19:12.700 want to make someone's day,

01:19:13.740 the bubble cuddle blanket

01:19:15.080 is next-level comfort,

01:19:16.680 plush, textured,

01:19:18.160 and ridiculously soft.

01:19:20.060 Whether it's movie night

01:19:21.160 or just winding down

01:19:22.260 after a long day,

01:19:23.480 it's the kind of gift

01:19:24.200 that instantly makes

01:19:25.160 any space feel special.

01:19:27.140 Their bedding

01:19:27.620 and bath products

01:19:28.360 are completely risk-free,

01:19:30.000 backed by a 100-night

01:19:31.000 sleep trial

01:19:31.580 and a 10-year warranty.

01:19:33.420 Black Friday has come early

01:19:34.560 at CozyEarth.com.

01:19:36.220 Use my code MEGAN

01:19:37.000 on top of their site-wide sale

01:19:38.820 for up to 40% off,

01:19:40.340 but these deals

01:19:40.940 will not last long.

01:19:42.240 So head on over

01:19:42.840 to CozyEarth.com today.

01:19:44.420 Use my code MEGAN

01:19:45.180 and wrap the ones you love

01:19:46.680 in luxury this season

01:19:48.140 with Cozy Earth.

01:19:49.640 And if you get

01:19:50.240 a post-purchase survey,

01:19:51.380 don't forget to mention

01:19:52.060 you heard about them

01:19:52.760 from us.

01:19:54.200 Let's be honest.

01:19:55.420 America can still

01:19:56.240 be a dangerous place

01:19:57.160 and you cannot afford

01:19:58.380 to wait for help.

01:19:59.720 Sure, you could use

01:20:00.200 a firearm,

01:20:00.900 but in today's America,

01:20:02.140 defending yourself

01:20:03.060 with deadly force

01:20:03.960 could have legal consequences.

01:20:06.060 According to FBI data,

01:20:07.240 99.9% of all altercations

01:20:09.500 do not require lethal force.

01:20:11.640 And that's exactly why

01:20:12.460 so many are turning to Burna.

01:20:14.300 Burna is proudly American,

01:20:16.040 hand-assembled

01:20:16.600 in Fort Wayne, Indiana.

01:20:18.060 These less lethal

01:20:19.400 self-defense launchers

01:20:20.640 are trusted by hundreds

01:20:21.860 of government agencies,

01:20:23.040 law enforcement departments,

01:20:23.960 and also private

01:20:25.340 security companies.

01:20:26.880 Over 600,000 Burna pistols

01:20:28.500 have been sold,

01:20:29.700 mostly to private citizens

01:20:31.280 who refuse to be victims.

01:20:34.320 Burna launchers fire

01:20:35.380 rock-hard kinetic rounds

01:20:37.240 and also,

01:20:38.640 if you choose this route,

01:20:39.940 powerful tear gas

01:20:40.980 and pepper projectiles.

01:20:42.240 See, I like those

01:20:43.020 because you don't have

01:20:44.380 to hit the perpetrator

01:20:45.260 if you're just shooting

01:20:46.900 with the tear gas

01:20:48.540 and the pepper.

01:20:49.640 You have to just get it near him

01:20:50.840 and he gets incapacitated.

01:20:53.140 These things are capable

01:20:54.060 of stopping a threat

01:20:54.780 from up to 60 feet away.

01:20:56.520 No background checks,

01:20:57.600 no waiting periods,

01:20:58.720 and Burna can ship

01:20:59.800 straight to your door.

01:21:01.160 Take responsibility.

01:21:02.420 Protect your future.

01:21:03.800 Visit Burna.com right now.

01:21:05.380 That's B-Y-R-N-A dot com. 1.00

01:21:07.220 Or just visit your local

01:21:08.520 sportsman's warehouse.

01:21:10.380 Burna.com

01:21:11.140 or your local

01:21:11.780 sportsman's warehouse.

01:21:13.480 Visit now

01:21:14.040 and be prepared

01:21:14.980 to defend.

01:21:16.940 When I got a great deal

01:21:18.520 on a great gift

01:21:19.200 at Winners,

01:21:19.860 I started wondering,

01:21:21.000 could I get fabulous gifts

01:21:22.060 for everyone on my list?

01:21:23.440 Like this designer fragrance

01:21:24.760 for my daughter.

01:21:25.740 At just $39.99,

01:21:27.120 how could I resist?

01:21:28.540 This luxurious wool throw

01:21:30.240 for my sister.

01:21:31.220 This gold watch

01:21:32.280 for my partner.

01:21:33.160 A wooden puzzle

01:21:33.900 for my niece.

01:21:34.880 Leather gloves

01:21:35.500 for my boss.

01:21:36.500 Ooh, European chocolate

01:21:37.900 for the crossing guard.

01:21:39.820 At these prices,

01:21:40.780 could I find something

01:21:41.420 for everyone at Winners?

01:21:42.740 Stop wondering.

01:21:44.060 Start gifting.

01:21:44.980 Winners find fabulous

01:21:46.460 for less.

01:21:48.300 We are going on the road.

01:21:50.320 Join me live.

01:21:51.500 Megyn Kelly live.

01:21:52.660 Ten stops across the country.

01:21:54.620 Join me for no BS,

01:21:56.540 no agenda,

01:21:57.340 and no fear live.

01:21:59.240 I'll be joined by

01:21:59.920 Tucker Carlson,

01:22:00.960 Ben Shapiro,

01:22:01.920 Glenn Beck,

01:22:02.660 Adam Harola,

01:22:03.620 Charlie Sheen,

01:22:04.320 Piers Morgan,

01:22:04.980 Donald Trump Jr.,

01:22:05.800 Eric Trump,

01:22:06.640 and Erica Kirk.

01:22:08.320 Send a message

01:22:09.220 that we will not be silenced.

01:22:11.820 It's Megyn Kelly live

01:22:12.860 presented by

01:22:13.540 Why Refi

01:22:14.320 and Sirius XM.

01:22:15.800 Go to

01:22:16.120 Megyn Kelly.com

01:22:16.980 to get your tickets now.

01:22:18.760 You can stream

01:22:19.680 The Megyn Kelly Show

01:22:20.540 on Sirius XM

01:22:21.340 at home

01:22:22.060 or anywhere you are.

01:22:23.380 No car required.

01:22:24.840 I do it all the time.

01:22:25.800 I love the Sirius XM app.

01:22:28.060 It has ad-free

01:22:29.100 music coverage

01:22:30.460 of every major sport,

01:22:31.880 comedy talk,

01:22:32.480 podcast, and more.

01:22:33.360 Subscribe now.

01:22:34.000 Get your first three months

01:22:34.840 for free.

01:22:35.360 Go to SiriusXM.com

01:22:37.480 slash MK show

01:22:38.820 to subscribe

01:22:39.420 and get three months free.

01:22:41.280 That's SiriusXM.com

01:22:43.280 slash MK show

01:22:44.620 and get three months free.

01:22:46.760 Offer details apply.

01:22:47.860 Dasha Nekrosova,

01:22:54.340 who is one half

01:22:55.800 of the Red Scare podcast,

01:22:58.320 which is awesome.

01:22:58.860 She's awesome. 0.83

01:22:59.900 She's been on this program

01:23:00.820 many, many times.

01:23:03.000 The two of them

01:23:03.720 are amazing.

01:23:06.260 Just got canceled.

01:23:07.760 For the listening audience,

01:23:09.220 Dasha is the half

01:23:11.000 of Red Scare

01:23:11.720 that is the actress. 0.64

01:23:12.960 She is,

01:23:14.440 she's been starring on the,

01:23:15.600 well, she did star

01:23:16.220 on the show Succession,

01:23:17.560 which is about,

01:23:18.500 you know,

01:23:18.720 loosely based on the Murdochs.

01:23:19.880 And she played a PR agent

01:23:21.780 who kind of was dating Greg,

01:23:24.340 the ne'er-do-well nephew

01:23:26.680 of the powerful family patriarch.

01:23:30.780 In any event,

01:23:31.440 she's great.

01:23:32.360 She's very talented.

01:23:33.280 She's been in other shows as well.

01:23:35.000 These two were also reportedly

01:23:36.520 the characters

01:23:38.080 that the two daughters

01:23:40.360 in the original White Lotus

01:23:41.980 were based on.

01:23:43.060 There's one daughter.

01:23:44.940 It's Connie Britton's character.

01:23:46.880 And she and her friend

01:23:47.960 go on a trip

01:23:48.600 with their mom,

01:23:49.260 Connie Britton.

01:23:50.380 And they're based on Dasha

01:23:52.000 and Anna.

01:23:53.680 And it's so amazing

01:23:54.740 because one of those characters

01:23:56.340 was played by Sidney Sweeney.

01:23:58.260 So it's like,

01:23:58.740 everything's connected.

01:24:00.120 In any event,

01:24:01.160 she's fascinating.

01:24:02.060 Very interesting.

01:24:02.700 She's from Belarus.

01:24:03.920 And Anna,

01:24:04.600 her partner in crime

01:24:05.340 on Red Scare,

01:24:06.060 is from Moscow.

01:24:07.820 They both came over

01:24:08.480 to the United States

01:24:09.060 when they were kids.

01:24:09.660 But they have a healthy appreciation

01:24:11.380 for authoritarian,

01:24:12.960 countries

01:24:14.420 and crackdowns

01:24:15.500 on free speech

01:24:16.120 and how important it is

01:24:17.120 to say, like,

01:24:17.800 the most outlandish things

01:24:19.020 and just test the limits

01:24:21.040 of that First Amendment.

01:24:21.860 Like, great.

01:24:22.420 It's wonderful to be in a place

01:24:23.400 where we can have

01:24:23.920 these very provocative conversations.

01:24:25.980 Well, some fucker 1.00

01:24:26.960 who goes,

01:24:27.620 his name is Brown?

01:24:28.420 Is that his full name?

01:24:29.880 I'm reading the Hollywood Reporter piece

01:24:31.720 by Seth Abramovich,

01:24:33.140 which is very good.

01:24:34.780 The guy's name seems to be Brown.

01:24:36.740 He's 36.

01:24:37.640 He was once an actor.

01:24:39.120 Didn't have a lot of success,

01:24:40.360 but did have a role

01:24:41.360 in 2012's hit comedy,

01:24:42.580 Project X.

01:24:43.460 Never saw it.

01:24:44.660 Finding himself disillusioned,

01:24:45.960 writes Abramovich,

01:24:46.700 with the acting world.

01:24:48.300 He transitioned to producing,

01:24:49.720 most recently with the comedy,

01:24:51.160 horror,

01:24:51.820 Fuck My Son!

01:24:53.260 with an exclamation point.

01:24:54.480 Real nice.

01:24:55.040 It's the title of which drew titters

01:24:57.740 ahead of its premiere,

01:24:59.300 Jonathan Brown.

01:25:01.200 This guy, it turns out,

01:25:03.640 has for years, years now,

01:25:07.220 been trying to get Dasha canceled.

01:25:10.780 He is emailing relentlessly

01:25:13.060 the agency that represents her

01:25:15.100 in Hollywood.

01:25:16.080 He's been tracking her for years,

01:25:19.540 keeping the agency updated

01:25:21.940 on who she's having on Red Scare,

01:25:24.440 why they're too controversial

01:25:26.060 for polite company,

01:25:27.320 what she did or did not do

01:25:28.700 during the interview.

01:25:30.920 Keep in mind,

01:25:31.660 these two were originally

01:25:32.540 Bernie bro supporters, right?

01:25:34.280 They kind of migrated rightward

01:25:35.940 when the woke left exploded,

01:25:38.420 but they were fine with Hollywood

01:25:40.460 when they were Bernie supporters.

01:25:41.840 Now they come under the microscope

01:25:43.240 because they're not woke.

01:25:44.760 He continued to email them

01:25:48.040 to post on Instagram about her

01:25:50.540 to list their alleged crimes.

01:25:52.280 Meanwhile, it wasn't them

01:25:52.960 saying anything.

01:25:53.520 It was their guests

01:25:54.420 and he didn't like

01:25:55.380 that their guests

01:25:56.900 said certain things

01:25:57.840 that were controversial

01:25:58.540 and they were.

01:26:00.520 Went on to list,

01:26:02.640 oh, they had on Alex Jones.

01:26:04.220 I cannot sit by in silence anymore.

01:26:06.140 I ask you to do the right thing.

01:26:08.220 Condemn this hate.

01:26:09.660 This cannot be

01:26:10.340 what our industry is about.

01:26:13.320 Steve Bannon,

01:26:14.200 they were outraged.

01:26:14.780 He was outraged.

01:26:15.400 Steve Bannon was on the show

01:26:16.420 and on and on and on.

01:26:18.420 And then like expanded out

01:26:21.480 the people he was targeting,

01:26:23.380 including this movie producer

01:26:26.320 who had just cast Dasha

01:26:28.540 in his movie writing,

01:26:30.520 be careful.

01:26:31.520 She just did a podcast

01:26:32.540 with Nick Fuentes.

01:26:34.200 This is in October.

01:26:35.240 Didn't make any news.

01:26:36.660 There was no scandal.

01:26:37.480 The way there's been with Tucker.

01:26:38.900 Bad idea to be associated

01:26:40.380 with anyone who is openly pro-Hitler.

01:26:43.300 Okay, so what?

01:26:44.000 She's now pro-Hitler 0.94

01:26:44.780 because she had Nick Fuentes on?

01:26:46.620 And the producer responds,

01:26:47.820 oh, wow.

01:26:48.780 The other producer,

01:26:49.640 this is a quote,

01:26:50.160 is Jewish and is friends with her.

01:26:51.640 I don't know her.

01:26:52.840 When news broke

01:26:53.500 that her talent agency,

01:26:55.160 Gersh,

01:26:55.680 dropped Dasha

01:26:56.780 at this guy,

01:26:57.760 Jonathan Brown's

01:26:58.500 nonstop insistence

01:27:00.220 and harassment,

01:27:01.340 Brown texted the producer again.

01:27:02.820 I hope you find

01:27:03.820 an excellent actress

01:27:04.760 to replace her.

01:27:06.640 Yes,

01:27:06.940 responds the producer.

01:27:07.960 She is being replaced

01:27:08.980 right now.

01:27:10.300 So her agency

01:27:11.140 and the movie

01:27:12.420 have dumped her.

01:27:13.920 She so far

01:27:14.380 has declined to comment

01:27:15.320 on it

01:27:16.580 other than

01:27:17.220 she retweeted this article

01:27:18.680 I saw

01:27:19.060 and said something like,

01:27:20.740 you know,

01:27:21.800 something like,

01:27:22.380 can't a girl 1.00

01:27:22.980 just do a podcast?

01:27:23.920 Something to that effect.

01:27:25.240 This is insane.

01:27:26.640 She's been blacklisted now 0.81

01:27:28.020 in Hollywood

01:27:28.920 and with the talent agents

01:27:30.160 because she has a podcast

01:27:31.740 on which she invites

01:27:32.660 controversial figures

01:27:33.520 and they too,

01:27:34.300 Emily,

01:27:34.660 do not like the way

01:27:35.960 she interviews those people.

01:27:38.480 It's an entertainment podcast.

01:27:40.360 It's not even like

01:27:40.980 a political news podcast.

01:27:42.420 They talk about culture

01:27:43.500 and they talk about politics

01:27:44.720 and foreign policy sometimes,

01:27:46.260 but it's entertainment.

01:27:47.200 They don't purport

01:27:47.820 to be journalists.

01:27:49.240 They don't purport

01:27:49.900 to be like deep moral actors.

01:27:51.760 They're literally just

01:27:52.600 when they remember

01:27:53.420 to turn the microphone on

01:27:54.700 having conversations

01:27:56.380 about like news of the day

01:27:58.520 and pop culture.

01:27:59.700 And I actually feel like

01:28:01.300 I learned a lot

01:28:02.020 about Nick Fuentes

01:28:02.740 from the interview

01:28:03.320 that they did with him

01:28:04.560 because, you know,

01:28:06.220 it was,

01:28:06.760 it was a soft interview.

01:28:08.940 Like it was a,

01:28:10.480 she's an actress. 1.00

01:28:11.660 She's an artist.

01:28:12.480 They're on an entertainment podcast

01:28:13.640 and they were doing

01:28:14.480 like a human interest piece

01:28:16.400 with Fuentes

01:28:17.220 where they're just talking

01:28:18.120 about him,

01:28:18.640 talking to him

01:28:19.360 about why he does this,

01:28:20.360 why he does that.

01:28:21.500 And they,

01:28:22.720 I think,

01:28:22.900 had his guard down

01:28:23.700 more than he has

01:28:24.860 in other interviews.

01:28:25.840 So I actually thought

01:28:26.800 it was a pretty

01:28:27.520 compelling conversation.

01:28:28.740 Same thing with Steve Bannon.

01:28:30.320 Now, again,

01:28:31.280 you and I are journalists.

01:28:33.120 We act in journalistic capacities.

01:28:34.620 We're not saying

01:28:35.340 that we would do podcasts

01:28:36.780 like Red Scare does podcasts,

01:28:38.040 but they are literally artists.

01:28:40.640 They are not,

01:28:41.360 what's the,

01:28:41.860 Camille Paglia had a great line

01:28:42.920 during Me Too

01:28:43.540 where she said the idea

01:28:44.380 of an artist as a moral actor

01:28:46.320 is, quote,

01:28:46.740 a sentimental canard

01:28:47.840 of Victorian moralism.

01:28:49.660 And this idea that-

01:28:50.280 That should go up

01:28:50.640 on our first segment.

01:28:51.660 That's how we should have

01:28:52.260 started this show

01:28:52.900 right before we got

01:28:53.580 into the affair chapter.

01:28:56.200 It's right,

01:28:56.640 but it's like this idea

01:28:57.960 that people who are-

01:28:58.480 Can you say it again?

01:28:59.200 Can you say it one more time?

01:29:00.400 The idea that an,

01:29:01.440 I'm paraphrasing the first part,

01:29:02.540 but the idea that an artist

01:29:03.840 has to be a moral actor

01:29:04.880 is, quote,

01:29:05.360 a sentimental canard

01:29:06.620 of Victorian moralism.

01:29:08.280 I think she wrote that

01:29:08.860 in the Hollywood Reporter

01:29:09.660 in the middle

01:29:10.040 of the Me Too movement.

01:29:10.720 I've never forgotten it

01:29:11.540 because it so well describes

01:29:13.560 how the left has tried

01:29:14.640 to shift our expectations

01:29:15.780 of what we see

01:29:16.820 from actors

01:29:17.380 in popular culture.

01:29:18.880 It's one thing

01:29:19.380 to hold a politician

01:29:20.180 to that standard.

01:29:21.160 It's one thing

01:29:21.480 to hold a journalist

01:29:22.120 to that standard,

01:29:22.620 but it gets even more ridiculous

01:29:23.840 when you're holding

01:29:24.580 an actress slash

01:29:25.560 podcaster

01:29:26.340 to that standard.

01:29:28.220 And by the way,

01:29:28.840 one quick point on that.

01:29:30.420 There are people

01:29:31.440 who listen to Nick Fuentes

01:29:33.460 who are not actual bigots,

01:29:35.960 and that is one

01:29:36.640 of the interesting things

01:29:37.440 about Dasha,

01:29:38.060 who does listen.

01:29:38.980 She's a Catholic convert

01:29:39.860 who does listen to Fuentes

01:29:40.960 and references Fuentes.

01:29:42.600 You can actually learn

01:29:43.680 a bit about the appeal

01:29:45.200 that Fuentes has

01:29:46.300 with some younger,

01:29:47.840 non-bigoted people,

01:29:49.040 which, again,

01:29:49.920 I don't listen to Fuentes.

01:29:50.840 I'm not listening

01:29:51.780 to America First.

01:29:53.120 It's just not happening.

01:29:54.660 But there are people

01:29:55.480 who do,

01:29:56.140 and they are worth

01:29:56.740 understanding

01:29:57.560 because they're looking

01:29:59.180 for criticism.

01:30:00.720 My theory is they're looking

01:30:01.580 of some criticism

01:30:02.560 of the MAGA movement

01:30:04.040 from the right,

01:30:05.040 and one of the only places

01:30:06.160 they find it

01:30:06.880 is in Fuentes.

01:30:08.620 Mm-hmm.

01:30:09.040 That's such a good point.

01:30:11.000 Like, it is more important

01:30:13.200 right now to figure out

01:30:14.260 why is he so popular

01:30:15.960 than to just try

01:30:18.160 to cancel anybody

01:30:19.220 who is trying

01:30:21.280 to figure it out, right?

01:30:22.340 Like, why don't we stop

01:30:23.940 and consider the mission

01:30:25.280 that they're on?

01:30:25.960 Like, why is he so popular?

01:30:28.060 Why?

01:30:28.920 And I know, of course,

01:30:30.340 our Jewish friends are like,

01:30:31.900 he hates Jews.

01:30:33.180 Like, that's all we need

01:30:34.360 to know.

01:30:35.280 But it's not all

01:30:36.640 we need to know

01:30:37.140 because, like,

01:30:38.400 there is a growing number

01:30:40.040 of disaffected young men

01:30:41.540 in particular in America

01:30:42.840 who are really deeply unhappy

01:30:45.860 and have been told

01:30:47.040 they're to blame

01:30:47.580 for all of society's ills.

01:30:49.760 And his message

01:30:51.080 is resonating with them.

01:30:52.300 He talks about more

01:30:53.380 than Jews and Blacks 0.79

01:30:55.500 and women on his show. 0.99

01:30:57.420 When he talks about

01:30:58.260 those groups,

01:30:59.000 it's not great.

01:31:00.500 It's not great

01:31:01.240 for any one

01:31:02.020 of those three categories.

01:31:03.200 I can attest to that.

01:31:04.760 But it's not all

01:31:06.120 he talks about.

01:31:06.980 And so some of his stuff

01:31:07.840 is compelling

01:31:08.480 and it's very interesting

01:31:09.540 and he says it very well.

01:31:11.040 He's a persuasive arguer.

01:31:13.220 So I understand

01:31:14.120 the perceived threat

01:31:15.300 with him.

01:31:15.720 But what we need

01:31:16.380 to figure out is why.

01:31:17.660 What is it about him?

01:31:18.480 And I think

01:31:18.880 from that standpoint,

01:31:19.980 these interviews

01:31:20.360 do have real value

01:31:21.720 because maybe

01:31:23.520 there really is a need

01:31:24.460 that needs to be filled

01:31:26.140 by somebody

01:31:27.100 for whom the price

01:31:28.520 of admission

01:31:28.960 is not so high.

01:31:30.300 Right?

01:31:30.520 Like, you don't have

01:31:30.900 to get through

01:31:31.420 all of that bile

01:31:32.620 in order to hear somebody

01:31:34.140 say these other things.

01:31:36.180 And I don't know.

01:31:36.540 Like, I'm sick and tired,

01:31:37.400 though, of, like,

01:31:37.780 the New York Times

01:31:38.480 saying he's the new Charlie.

01:31:40.060 Like, he's filling

01:31:40.640 the void Charlie left.

01:31:42.040 That's all bullshit.

01:31:43.300 Like, no, he's not.

01:31:44.460 Those two couldn't

01:31:45.700 stand each other.

01:31:47.200 Charlie was noble

01:31:48.260 and beautiful

01:31:49.500 and faith-based

01:31:50.940 and a God-loving

01:31:52.420 Christian.

01:31:54.080 Nick Fuentes

01:31:54.580 is not noble

01:31:56.060 and he's not beautiful.

01:31:57.600 He's angry.

01:31:58.360 And I understand it.

01:32:00.180 And I actually,

01:32:01.700 like, I forgive him

01:32:02.520 his anger.

01:32:03.480 Clearly, he's had, like,

01:32:04.800 some bad things

01:32:05.340 happen to him

01:32:05.980 and I get all that.

01:32:07.400 I hope as he matures

01:32:08.360 he understands

01:32:09.020 that it's not

01:32:10.400 the right move

01:32:10.980 to blame it

01:32:11.540 on whole groups

01:32:12.120 of people

01:32:12.620 or condemn whole groups

01:32:14.160 because you've been

01:32:14.720 treated wrong,

01:32:15.360 whether it's by a woman

01:32:16.200 or a person of color

01:32:17.480 or a Jewish person,

01:32:18.260 whatever it is he's doing.

01:32:20.300 Because he does have the shot,

01:32:21.860 if he were able

01:32:22.480 to somehow reform

01:32:23.480 those other things,

01:32:24.300 of being, like,

01:32:25.180 a hugely consequential figure.

01:32:27.900 And I don't know.

01:32:29.220 He doesn't seem

01:32:29.700 to have any interest

01:32:30.260 for now

01:32:30.660 in doing anything

01:32:32.120 on those other fronts.

01:32:33.240 He seems to really revel

01:32:34.440 in alienating those groups

01:32:36.020 and saying the most

01:32:36.620 hateful things

01:32:37.060 possible about them.

01:32:38.120 So, in any event,

01:32:38.700 okay, so that's enough

01:32:39.620 about him.

01:32:40.460 One question for you.

01:32:41.600 There was Rod Dreher.

01:32:44.160 Is it Dreher?

01:32:44.760 I never know

01:32:45.140 how to pronounce it.

01:32:45.880 I really like him.

01:32:47.680 But he's been suggesting

01:32:50.180 that there's as many

01:32:50.980 as 30 to 40 percent

01:32:52.720 of GOP, Capitol Hill,

01:32:55.920 and White House staffers

01:32:57.500 who are Groypers,

01:32:59.180 who are Nick Fuentes followers.

01:33:01.220 Now, that's not the same thing

01:33:02.460 as the New York Times

01:33:03.140 saying it.

01:33:04.060 The New York Times

01:33:04.580 would say that

01:33:05.000 just to try to, like,

01:33:06.120 demonize a whole group.

01:33:07.680 Rod doesn't have

01:33:08.400 those motivations.

01:33:09.800 So, I know you've been

01:33:10.560 doing some reporting on this.

01:33:11.820 What have you found?

01:33:13.040 Yeah, no, I heard that figure.

01:33:14.200 I read Rod every day.

01:33:15.160 I really, really appreciate Rod.

01:33:16.720 And he reported

01:33:17.980 that a D.C. insider

01:33:19.140 told him as many

01:33:20.340 to 30 to 40 percent

01:33:21.360 of Gen Z staffers,

01:33:23.240 Republican staffers

01:33:24.020 in Washington, D.C.,

01:33:24.900 were Groypers.

01:33:26.080 And then he said

01:33:26.620 he talked to about

01:33:27.240 10 Zoomers,

01:33:28.740 Gen Z people,

01:33:29.320 when he was in D.C. recently

01:33:30.440 who all confirmed

01:33:31.320 that number to him.

01:33:32.900 And, I mean,

01:33:33.340 I've been here

01:33:33.740 for a long time,

01:33:34.340 been involved

01:33:34.740 in the conservative movement,

01:33:35.840 youth movement

01:33:36.400 for a long time,

01:33:37.460 deal with tons of students,

01:33:38.700 have done, like,

01:33:39.740 literally more than

01:33:40.420 100 coffees

01:33:41.200 probably in the last

01:33:42.000 five years alone

01:33:43.420 with students.

01:33:44.960 And so I went

01:33:46.020 to sources.

01:33:47.060 I went to seven sources,

01:33:48.580 people everywhere

01:33:49.480 from the White House

01:33:50.180 to Capitol Hill,

01:33:51.440 all with the exception

01:33:52.180 of one,

01:33:52.600 I would say,

01:33:53.020 populist aligned,

01:33:54.560 nobody older than

01:33:55.840 youngish millennial.

01:33:58.200 And everyone was like,

01:33:59.760 that number is crazy,

01:34:01.000 which confirmed

01:34:01.520 my suspicion

01:34:02.340 that that number

01:34:02.860 was way too high.

01:34:04.160 One person,

01:34:04.880 an administration source,

01:34:05.820 said it's not even

01:34:06.900 double digits.

01:34:08.000 So what's important

01:34:08.860 about that

01:34:09.380 is there are some,

01:34:11.060 and Fuentes has made

01:34:11.960 a concerted effort

01:34:13.080 to infiltrate institutions.

01:34:14.840 He says that's what

01:34:15.700 his movement

01:34:16.860 is trying to do.

01:34:18.060 So, yes, it's true.

01:34:19.360 Like, there actually

01:34:20.020 are some,

01:34:20.920 particularly young men,

01:34:21.840 who fall into that category.

01:34:23.400 But I think that's why

01:34:24.340 it's so, so,

01:34:25.340 so important for people

01:34:26.620 who are commenting on this

01:34:27.680 to always show their work,

01:34:29.520 to tell us how you got

01:34:30.620 from point A to point B,

01:34:31.740 how you said this person

01:34:33.060 is actually an anti-Semitic,

01:34:34.760 an anti-Semite, 0.54

01:34:35.980 told me exactly what they said,

01:34:37.860 why that is anti-Semitic,

01:34:39.560 and, you know,

01:34:40.440 how you got to that point.

01:34:42.900 And the same thing

01:34:43.820 should be done

01:34:44.500 when you're, you know,

01:34:45.520 making claims about

01:34:46.860 who is what,

01:34:48.460 because otherwise

01:34:49.300 Fuentes wins.

01:34:50.220 If everyone is like,

01:34:51.280 yeah, 30 to 40%

01:34:52.220 of staffers are Groypers,

01:34:53.900 and I don't begrudge

01:34:54.840 Rod for saying that.

01:34:55.520 He had people,

01:34:56.040 he's a journalist,

01:34:56.560 he had people telling him that.

01:34:58.040 I just question that

01:34:59.080 those sources are in touch

01:35:00.420 with the actual kind of

01:35:02.160 youth orbit in D.C.

01:35:04.260 Because, again,

01:35:05.460 like, I know people have said,

01:35:06.720 why would someone go

01:35:07.780 tell a journalist

01:35:08.500 if they're a Groyper? 1.00

01:35:09.320 But that's not how

01:35:09.960 this reporting was done.

01:35:11.000 I was talking to people

01:35:11.940 who would definitely know,

01:35:12.960 younger people

01:35:13.400 who would definitely know,

01:35:14.780 and who I know and trust

01:35:16.320 are good sources,

01:35:17.300 populist sources,

01:35:18.300 and even they were like,

01:35:19.460 no.

01:35:19.920 So there is some number

01:35:20.840 of people,

01:35:21.440 and that's why we have

01:35:22.100 to be extremely careful

01:35:22.980 about it.

01:35:23.460 Mm-hmm.

01:35:25.040 I also think that

01:35:26.580 if there are people

01:35:27.880 who are tuning into him

01:35:29.180 because they do have

01:35:30.340 negative feelings

01:35:31.180 about those groups,

01:35:32.820 right?

01:35:33.200 Like, if it's not

01:35:34.080 his other messaging,

01:35:35.140 if it is the messaging

01:35:36.300 about Jews,

01:35:37.380 or Blacks,

01:35:38.200 or Hispanics,

01:35:39.340 or Indians,

01:35:40.120 or women, 1.00

01:35:41.180 that's important

01:35:42.580 to know, too.

01:35:44.040 Yes.

01:35:44.300 And the answer

01:35:46.240 to that

01:35:46.980 is not

01:35:48.500 to call

01:35:50.420 Tucker

01:35:51.140 or anybody

01:35:51.620 platforming

01:35:52.220 Nick Fentis

01:35:52.640 or talking about

01:35:53.180 like an anti-Semite 0.52

01:35:54.920 or a woman-hater

01:35:55.580 or a bigot.

01:35:58.940 The answer

01:35:59.900 is to provide

01:36:01.140 more information

01:36:02.080 to those people

01:36:02.880 and

01:36:04.200 to try

01:36:06.280 to rescue

01:36:06.880 the conversation,

01:36:08.080 in other words.

01:36:08.620 Like,

01:36:09.180 I don't think

01:36:10.080 creating him

01:36:11.800 as like this

01:36:12.500 boogeyman

01:36:13.280 who can never

01:36:13.940 be platformed

01:36:14.700 or discussed

01:36:15.700 in polite society

01:36:16.560 will help.

01:36:17.180 I think it will only

01:36:17.780 make people

01:36:18.340 more interested

01:36:19.580 in him.

01:36:21.040 And look,

01:36:21.420 as somebody

01:36:21.820 who definitely

01:36:22.200 does not want

01:36:22.640 to see

01:36:23.060 bigotry,

01:36:24.500 misogyny,

01:36:25.480 anti-Semitism

01:36:26.060 grow,

01:36:27.540 I think

01:36:28.600 we have to be

01:36:29.200 careful about

01:36:29.700 not behaving

01:36:30.700 so badly

01:36:31.620 that it just

01:36:32.920 gets used

01:36:33.620 against us

01:36:34.580 as like,

01:36:35.140 God,

01:36:35.540 you really

01:36:35.840 are awful.

01:36:37.040 Like,

01:36:37.340 these female 1.00

01:36:37.880 shrews

01:36:38.560 are trying

01:36:39.280 to shut 0.69

01:36:39.580 them down

01:36:39.960 and tell

01:36:40.260 me I'm

01:36:40.480 a bad

01:36:40.740 person

01:36:41.000 for listening.

01:36:42.100 You know,

01:36:42.700 because that's

01:36:43.380 what they're

01:36:43.660 doing.

01:36:44.080 They're saying

01:36:44.520 like,

01:36:44.980 oh,

01:36:45.460 Jews,

01:36:46.120 didn't I

01:36:46.400 tell you?

01:36:47.440 You know,

01:36:47.680 and like,

01:36:48.140 it's getting

01:36:48.440 used against

01:36:49.060 them

01:36:49.400 because they're

01:36:50.460 trying to

01:36:50.760 silence

01:36:51.020 conversation.

01:36:51.720 So like,

01:36:52.120 I don't even

01:36:52.780 play into it.

01:36:53.700 You know,

01:36:53.840 just like,

01:36:54.440 you can calmly

01:36:55.600 and effectively

01:36:56.480 say,

01:36:57.560 let me tell you

01:36:58.080 all the things

01:36:58.420 that Nick Fuentes

01:36:58.920 has said.

01:36:59.640 This is who

01:37:00.040 you're backing.

01:37:01.000 This is who

01:37:01.620 he actually is.

01:37:02.780 I think that's

01:37:03.280 very effective

01:37:03.960 as opposed to

01:37:05.080 like trying

01:37:05.420 to shame

01:37:06.060 people,

01:37:06.800 call names,

01:37:07.700 de-platform

01:37:08.300 or whatever,

01:37:09.140 delegitimize.

01:37:10.380 Just,

01:37:11.200 you don't have

01:37:11.620 to look far

01:37:12.100 to find out

01:37:12.760 what Nick Fuentes

01:37:13.260 has actually said

01:37:14.360 about all those

01:37:15.420 groups I listed.

01:37:16.120 It's a long list.

01:37:16.960 He doesn't,

01:37:17.600 it's not just

01:37:18.220 Jews.

01:37:19.080 He hates

01:37:19.540 a lot of

01:37:20.160 groups or at

01:37:20.600 least has

01:37:21.640 hate in his

01:37:22.060 heart for

01:37:22.740 a lot of

01:37:23.580 those groups.

01:37:24.560 He's not shy

01:37:25.340 about espousing

01:37:25.940 it.

01:37:27.020 In any event,

01:37:27.480 it's just,

01:37:27.760 that's a question

01:37:28.140 of tactics.

01:37:28.940 Okay,

01:37:29.140 I have one

01:37:29.580 thing I got

01:37:29.920 to ask you

01:37:30.220 about because

01:37:30.380 I know

01:37:30.580 you've got

01:37:30.880 to go

01:37:31.180 because you've

01:37:31.500 got to prepare

01:37:31.860 for the wrap-up

01:37:32.680 show,

01:37:32.900 but I got to

01:37:33.180 ask you one

01:37:33.600 thing.

01:37:34.700 You being a

01:37:35.220 young person

01:37:35.700 and having

01:37:36.220 your finger

01:37:36.540 on the pulse

01:37:36.960 on Capitol

01:37:37.380 Hill of where

01:37:38.420 young men in

01:37:39.120 particular stand

01:37:39.780 right now.

01:37:41.140 Bill Ackman,

01:37:42.400 he of the

01:37:43.180 400 paragraph

01:37:44.020 tweet,

01:37:44.680 has weighed

01:37:46.960 in on the

01:37:47.400 plight of

01:37:47.800 young men

01:37:48.160 in America

01:37:48.560 today and

01:37:49.740 he has

01:37:50.120 posted the

01:37:51.900 following on

01:37:52.460 X a couple

01:37:53.120 days ago.

01:37:53.520 I hear from

01:37:54.080 many young

01:37:54.480 men that

01:37:55.320 they find

01:37:55.620 it difficult

01:37:55.960 to meet

01:37:56.260 young women

01:37:56.700 in a public

01:37:57.220 setting.

01:37:58.100 In other

01:37:58.380 words,

01:37:58.620 the online

01:37:59.040 culture has

01:37:59.620 destroyed the

01:38:00.100 ability to

01:38:00.660 spontaneously

01:38:01.140 meet strangers.

01:38:02.520 As such,

01:38:03.020 I thought I

01:38:03.360 would share

01:38:03.660 a few words

01:38:04.340 that I used

01:38:05.400 in my youth

01:38:05.940 to meet

01:38:06.340 someone that

01:38:07.020 I found

01:38:07.460 compelling.

01:38:08.420 I would

01:38:09.000 ask,

01:38:09.960 may I

01:38:11.120 meet you

01:38:11.760 before engaging

01:38:14.080 further in a

01:38:14.640 conversation.

01:38:16.060 I almost

01:38:16.980 never got a

01:38:18.260 no.

01:38:18.980 It inevitably

01:38:19.680 enabled the

01:38:20.580 opportunity for a

01:38:21.280 further conversation.

01:38:22.040 I met a lot of

01:38:22.560 really interesting

01:38:23.000 people this

01:38:23.440 way.

01:38:24.180 I think the

01:38:24.740 combination of

01:38:25.520 proper grammar

01:38:26.740 and politeness

01:38:28.140 was the key to

01:38:29.500 its effectiveness.

01:38:30.880 You might give

01:38:31.560 it a try.

01:38:32.540 And then he

01:38:32.780 goes on to

01:38:33.160 say,

01:38:33.780 I failed to

01:38:35.540 mention that

01:38:36.600 this works much

01:38:37.380 more effectively

01:38:38.060 when you are,

01:38:39.780 and I thought he

01:38:40.440 was going to

01:38:40.740 say,

01:38:41.700 rich?

01:38:43.440 I'm sure that

01:38:44.940 it's something to

01:38:45.580 do with your

01:38:46.020 success.

01:38:46.800 No, when you

01:38:47.520 are moving in

01:38:48.560 motion on

01:38:49.400 subways,

01:38:49.820 elevators,

01:38:50.200 escalators,

01:38:50.700 et cetera.

01:38:51.540 So your

01:38:52.220 thoughts,

01:38:53.000 I don't know

01:38:53.920 why, but

01:38:54.420 your thoughts

01:38:54.900 on Bill

01:38:55.320 Ackman's 0.97

01:38:55.860 love life

01:38:57.040 advice to

01:38:58.280 men your

01:38:58.920 age.

01:38:59.980 I love

01:39:00.760 when Bill

01:39:01.120 Ackman gives 0.84

01:39:01.720 unsolicited

01:39:02.460 advice every

01:39:03.820 time.

01:39:04.660 It's usually

01:39:05.360 unsolicited, but

01:39:06.460 that is the best

01:39:07.080 type of advice

01:39:07.740 from Bill Ackman

01:39:08.400 is unsolicited.

01:39:09.160 The idea of

01:39:09.620 going up to

01:39:10.120 somebody and

01:39:10.740 saying, may

01:39:11.600 I meet you

01:39:12.180 with a $50,000

01:39:13.420 Rolex on your

01:39:14.960 watch, definitely

01:39:16.060 going to work

01:39:16.560 every single

01:39:17.140 time.

01:39:17.420 And that is

01:39:17.780 my impression

01:39:18.400 as to why

01:39:19.300 Bill Ackman

01:39:20.020 thinks that

01:39:21.320 this line is

01:39:22.280 so useful.

01:39:24.240 The proper

01:39:24.980 grammar, like

01:39:25.800 what is he

01:39:26.240 talking about?

01:39:27.020 Nobody, nobody

01:39:28.040 wants this, Bill

01:39:29.120 Ackman. 0.94

01:39:29.560 Who told Bill

01:39:30.300 Ackman that

01:39:30.880 this, I think

01:39:31.700 it was probably

01:39:32.120 because he was

01:39:32.660 walking around

01:39:33.420 like with a

01:39:34.240 Rolex on and

01:39:35.060 like Gucci

01:39:35.500 loafers and

01:39:36.140 people were

01:39:36.460 like, you may

01:39:37.100 indeed meet

01:39:38.300 me.

01:39:38.700 Yeah.

01:39:39.060 Like, do you

01:39:39.500 want to like

01:39:40.100 help me like

01:39:42.300 with my

01:39:42.660 investments?

01:39:43.100 Because I

01:39:43.780 also would

01:39:44.280 like a

01:39:44.540 Rolex.

01:39:45.700 I would

01:39:46.080 like to

01:39:46.400 know

01:39:46.560 billionaires.

01:39:48.140 Yeah.

01:39:48.480 No, I

01:39:48.900 appreciate the

01:39:50.420 thought of

01:39:50.980 politely being

01:39:53.120 the one to

01:39:53.640 reach out,

01:39:54.520 right?

01:39:54.720 Like that I'm

01:39:55.420 in support

01:39:55.840 of.

01:39:56.260 And also

01:39:56.980 of a man

01:39:57.660 being the

01:39:58.240 first to

01:39:58.740 sort of

01:39:59.040 knock on

01:39:59.400 the door

01:39:59.720 or be

01:40:00.060 the initiator.

01:40:01.800 I think we

01:40:02.080 do need to

01:40:02.440 get back to

01:40:02.860 that.

01:40:03.120 I think it's

01:40:03.900 in a man's 0.53

01:40:04.400 nature to

01:40:04.980 be the

01:40:05.220 pursuer, you

01:40:06.060 know, to

01:40:06.220 be the

01:40:06.440 lion.

01:40:07.400 And women

01:40:08.440 need to

01:40:08.720 remember that.

01:40:09.220 That's good

01:40:09.500 for men and

01:40:10.000 it's good

01:40:10.240 for women.

01:40:10.860 Like, the

01:40:11.160 men like to

01:40:13.100 suit and we

01:40:13.480 should get

01:40:13.740 back to

01:40:14.020 that.

01:40:14.180 That's great.

01:40:14.640 It's a good

01:40:14.820 dynamic.

01:40:15.260 It doesn't

01:40:15.460 have to be

01:40:15.760 that way,

01:40:16.100 but it's

01:40:16.320 good.

01:40:17.180 But I'm

01:40:18.460 not sure

01:40:19.000 may I

01:40:19.980 meet you

01:40:20.700 is the

01:40:21.780 way I

01:40:22.460 would say

01:40:23.060 something like,

01:40:24.680 you know,

01:40:25.960 wow, you're

01:40:27.100 stunning.

01:40:27.980 Who are you?

01:40:29.300 That might

01:40:30.160 get a woman's 0.99

01:40:30.720 attention, like

01:40:31.580 a compliment

01:40:32.120 or a joke,

01:40:34.160 something even

01:40:34.680 self-deprecating,

01:40:36.000 something to

01:40:36.560 make a woman, 0.98

01:40:37.360 making a woman 0.99

01:40:37.840 laugh is like a

01:40:38.860 beeline to most

01:40:39.540 women's hearts.

01:40:40.960 May I meet

01:40:41.700 you would

01:40:42.080 probably

01:40:42.760 project to

01:40:43.240 me this

01:40:43.480 person's

01:40:43.800 going to

01:40:43.920 be bad

01:40:44.200 in bed.

01:40:45.340 That might

01:40:47.280 be where I,

01:40:47.980 in my head,

01:40:49.300 went with it.

01:40:50.360 You just

01:40:50.660 earned yourself

01:40:51.960 like a 4,000

01:40:52.940 word Bill

01:40:53.580 Ackman post

01:40:54.380 on X about

01:40:55.380 why he is

01:40:56.280 actually very

01:40:56.960 good in

01:40:57.760 bed and

01:40:58.340 you can expect

01:40:59.640 it to be

01:40:59.940 highly technical,

01:41:01.360 but I'm

01:41:02.760 sure that that

01:41:03.420 is forthcoming

01:41:04.260 at this point.

01:41:05.460 By the way,

01:41:06.440 meet people in

01:41:07.020 your social

01:41:07.400 circles.

01:41:08.140 I can't

01:41:08.940 recommend that

01:41:09.860 enough.

01:41:10.220 The idea

01:41:11.800 of going

01:41:12.200 up to a

01:41:12.640 random person

01:41:13.240 at a bar

01:41:13.940 is what

01:41:14.440 people do

01:41:14.820 when they're

01:41:15.040 trying to

01:41:15.480 sleep with

01:41:16.380 someone,

01:41:16.780 not have a

01:41:17.220 relationship

01:41:17.680 with them,

01:41:18.580 but meeting

01:41:18.960 people in

01:41:19.420 your social

01:41:20.040 circles is

01:41:21.200 a great way

01:41:21.980 so that you

01:41:22.420 can avoid

01:41:22.980 doing the

01:41:23.640 may I meet

01:41:24.420 you line

01:41:25.060 anyway.

01:41:26.340 You can

01:41:26.660 actually just

01:41:27.280 have some

01:41:27.680 built-in

01:41:28.120 trust that

01:41:29.400 this person

01:41:29.800 knows that

01:41:30.200 person and

01:41:30.720 that person

01:41:31.220 and you

01:41:31.620 have some

01:41:32.500 social fabric

01:41:33.940 that already

01:41:34.360 ties you

01:41:34.780 together.

01:41:35.480 Just a tip,

01:41:36.160 just a tip.

01:41:36.620 Yes,

01:41:37.280 but I do

01:41:37.980 appreciate him

01:41:39.200 trying.

01:41:40.040 I have to say

01:41:40.460 there really

01:41:41.020 is a crisis

01:41:41.560 with young

01:41:41.940 men and

01:41:42.300 people are

01:41:42.620 not meeting

01:41:43.420 each other,

01:41:43.880 they're not

01:41:44.100 getting married

01:41:44.620 anymore,

01:41:45.300 they don't

01:41:45.540 believe in

01:41:45.900 marriage,

01:41:46.040 young women

01:41:46.480 don't believe

01:41:46.900 in marriage

01:41:47.240 according to

01:41:47.680 the latest

01:41:47.940 polls.

01:41:49.040 More guys

01:41:50.360 actually should

01:41:51.180 think of

01:41:51.860 the young

01:41:52.220 men and

01:41:52.700 say,

01:41:53.500 for whatever

01:41:53.940 it's worth,

01:41:54.880 this is how

01:41:55.420 I did it.

01:41:56.240 There will

01:41:56.960 be other

01:41:57.460 nerdy types

01:41:58.400 like Bill

01:41:58.900 Ackman for

01:41:59.880 whom that is

01:42:00.560 a nice line

01:42:01.280 and it will

01:42:01.880 work with

01:42:02.400 their personality.

01:42:04.240 You know,

01:42:04.560 it's so

01:42:05.800 whatever,

01:42:06.260 take it for

01:42:06.720 whatever it's

01:42:07.320 worth and

01:42:07.940 you know,

01:42:08.340 Bill Ackman

01:42:08.760 married this

01:42:09.540 completely stunning

01:42:10.620 brilliant woman 1.00

01:42:11.460 who went to

01:42:12.300 MIT so it

01:42:13.520 all landed

01:42:13.960 pretty well

01:42:14.440 for Bill

01:42:14.740 Ackman so 0.52

01:42:15.300 who are we

01:42:16.080 to judge?

01:42:16.820 Emily,

01:42:17.360 a pleasure.

01:42:18.240 We will see

01:42:18.660 you on the

01:42:19.200 after show.

01:42:20.040 Thanks for

01:42:20.340 doing it.

01:42:21.260 Thanks for

01:42:21.540 having me.

01:42:21.860 833-44-Megan.

01:42:23.180 Everyone call

01:42:23.660 in.

01:42:24.660 M-E-G-Y-N 1.00

01:42:26.320 because many

01:42:27.780 years ago

01:42:28.340 today my

01:42:29.340 mother Linda

01:42:29.720 was giving

01:42:30.100 birth to me.

01:42:30.620 She had given

01:42:31.040 no thought to

01:42:31.700 how to spell

01:42:32.140 my name

01:42:32.580 and when

01:42:33.700 I was born

01:42:34.480 she said

01:42:35.440 she figured

01:42:36.280 OB-GYN 0.97

01:42:37.880 M-E-G-Y-N 1.00

01:42:39.460 and that is

01:42:40.240 why you have

01:42:41.400 to call

01:42:41.740 833-44-M-E-G-Y-N

01:42:43.940 to reach

01:42:44.480 Emily

01:42:44.900 on the

01:42:45.940 after show.

01:42:47.420 Yeah,

01:42:47.560 I talked to her

01:42:47.920 this morning.

01:42:48.740 As she always

01:42:49.400 does on my

01:42:49.700 birthday,

01:42:50.640 she told me

01:42:51.180 a story about

01:42:51.640 how she went

01:42:52.060 in there

01:42:52.340 to give

01:42:52.680 birth to me.

01:42:53.380 I was the

01:42:53.780 third child

01:42:54.380 so the doctor

01:42:55.300 said,

01:42:55.600 oh,

01:42:55.740 you're going

01:42:56.000 to give

01:42:56.480 birth right

01:42:56.960 away.

01:42:57.420 You know,

01:42:57.600 like you go

01:42:58.260 to the fast

01:42:58.760 lane because

01:42:59.340 you're on

01:42:59.820 three of

01:43:00.240 three.

01:43:00.840 And there

01:43:01.160 were two

01:43:01.400 other gals 1.00

01:43:02.580 about to

01:43:02.720 give birth

01:43:03.060 to their

01:43:03.340 first babies

01:43:04.080 and they

01:43:04.860 had to go

01:43:05.180 into like

01:43:05.580 the waiting

01:43:06.040 area because

01:43:06.600 they thought

01:43:06.900 that was

01:43:07.120 going to

01:43:07.260 take forever

01:43:07.640 and my

01:43:08.660 mom went

01:43:09.180 in there

01:43:09.660 on November

01:43:10.200 17th early

01:43:11.100 in the morning

01:43:11.540 and it

01:43:12.140 was more

01:43:12.960 than 24

01:43:13.400 hours later

01:43:13.880 that I

01:43:14.340 came out.

01:43:15.760 So they

01:43:16.160 were wrong.

01:43:17.240 Then as

01:43:17.940 now,

01:43:18.940 I was a

01:43:19.700 late arrival

01:43:20.560 and I've

01:43:21.920 been kind

01:43:22.200 of behaving

01:43:22.480 that way

01:43:22.820 ever since.

01:43:23.320 Emily,

01:43:23.780 thank you,

01:43:24.340 madam. 0.98

01:43:24.560 I don't

01:43:24.720 want to

01:43:24.860 make you

01:43:25.100 late so

01:43:25.420 I'll

01:43:25.500 let you

01:43:25.680 go.

01:43:26.500 Thanks,

01:43:26.840 Megan.

01:43:27.180 Good to

01:43:27.380 see you.

01:43:27.600 Happy

01:43:27.720 birthday.

01:43:28.280 You too.

01:43:28.900 All right.

01:43:29.500 Yeah,

01:43:29.900 okay,

01:43:30.060 we'll keep

01:43:30.400 it rolling

01:43:30.640 here because

01:43:31.140 as you know,

01:43:32.660 Emily's coming 0.92

01:43:33.060 up but we've

01:43:33.540 got a little

01:43:33.800 more news to

01:43:34.340 do before

01:43:34.660 we toss

01:43:35.020 it to her.

01:43:37.680 Okay.

01:43:40.000 What?

01:43:41.460 Steve's talking

01:43:41.960 to me.

01:43:42.360 We only have

01:43:42.740 30 seconds

01:43:43.140 left in show?

01:43:44.520 Well,

01:43:44.840 we didn't

01:43:45.040 give Emily 1.00

01:43:45.420 a lot of

01:43:45.760 time to go

01:43:46.140 prepare for

01:43:46.620 her show.

01:43:47.360 I mean,

01:43:48.020 in our defense,

01:43:49.260 she knows

01:43:49.560 everything that

01:43:49.900 was on the

01:43:50.220 show because

01:43:50.520 she was

01:43:50.740 actually part

01:43:51.180 of it today.

01:43:52.400 Wait,

01:43:52.660 I really

01:43:53.120 wanted to

01:43:53.480 get to

01:43:53.720 that thought

01:43:54.900 of Bill

01:43:57.480 Marr.

01:43:59.220 Scott

01:43:59.620 Galloway.

01:44:00.420 Let's play

01:44:01.000 it.

01:44:01.940 Where is

01:44:02.300 it?

01:44:03.460 Saw

01:44:03.740 10.

01:44:06.060 The second

01:44:06.760 worst thing

01:44:07.220 to happen

01:44:07.540 to young

01:44:07.860 people is

01:44:08.540 remote work.

01:44:09.540 One in three

01:44:10.080 relationships

01:44:10.580 begin at work.

01:44:11.380 This is where

01:44:11.680 you find

01:44:12.020 friends,

01:44:12.460 mentors,

01:44:12.820 and mates,

01:44:13.300 and especially

01:44:13.700 young men

01:44:14.140 need the

01:44:14.440 guardrails

01:44:14.980 of a

01:44:15.700 workplace.

01:44:16.280 But in

01:44:16.560 my view,

01:44:17.080 the worst

01:44:17.420 thing that's

01:44:17.760 happened to

01:44:18.240 young people

01:44:18.800 is the

01:44:19.120 anti-alcohol

01:44:19.720 movement.

01:44:20.260 I've had

01:44:20.580 Huberman on,

01:44:21.220 who I'm a

01:44:21.500 big fan of,

01:44:22.040 and my point

01:44:23.740 is that the

01:44:24.380 risk to your

01:44:24.940 25-year-old

01:44:25.720 liver are

01:44:26.340 dwarfed by

01:44:28.340 the risk

01:44:28.720 of social

01:44:29.640 isolation.

01:44:30.620 In sum,

01:44:31.440 think of all

01:44:32.000 the amazing

01:44:32.500 relationships

01:44:33.040 you've had

01:44:33.480 in your

01:44:33.700 life,

01:44:34.160 and be

01:44:34.620 honest.

01:44:35.440 Did

01:44:35.620 alcohol

01:44:35.960 play a

01:44:36.420 role?

01:44:36.720 In sum,

01:44:37.640 get out,

01:44:38.400 drink more,

01:44:38.980 and make

01:44:39.180 a series

01:44:39.560 of bad

01:44:39.920 decisions

01:44:40.360 that might

01:44:40.720 pay off.

01:44:41.300 Yes!

01:44:43.800 I love

01:44:44.480 that.

01:44:45.080 I totally

01:44:45.600 agree with

01:44:46.060 him.

01:44:47.420 It's not

01:44:47.980 that you

01:44:48.200 need to

01:44:48.440 totally

01:44:48.740 booze it

01:44:49.380 up,

01:44:49.660 but alcohol

01:44:50.660 has been

01:44:51.000 so demonized,

01:44:51.960 and it

01:44:52.140 really can

01:44:52.600 be a

01:44:52.920 social

01:44:53.240 lubricant,

01:44:53.940 especially

01:44:54.280 at a

01:44:54.560 young age.

01:44:55.040 The New

01:44:55.700 York Times

01:44:56.000 did a

01:44:56.240 very long

01:44:56.580 podcast on

01:44:57.180 this two

01:44:57.740 summers ago,

01:44:58.340 and it was

01:44:58.540 actually very

01:44:59.080 illuminating.

01:45:01.180 We've gotten

01:45:01.900 to be such

01:45:03.000 teetotalers that

01:45:03.940 we're taking the

01:45:04.900 fun out of

01:45:05.380 everything.

01:45:06.100 You can't have

01:45:06.760 any processed

01:45:07.700 food ever,

01:45:08.600 no candy,

01:45:09.560 no sugar,

01:45:10.420 you can't have

01:45:11.000 a drink,

01:45:11.600 or you're

01:45:11.880 going to drop

01:45:12.780 dead and also

01:45:14.620 wind up arrested.

01:45:15.580 It's like these

01:45:16.360 young men are 0.99

01:45:17.640 having a tough

01:45:18.280 time meeting

01:45:19.240 women. 0.81

01:45:20.200 Thanks to

01:45:20.860 COVID and other

01:45:21.460 things,

01:45:21.800 they're not

01:45:22.220 doing a

01:45:22.540 very good

01:45:22.880 job of

01:45:23.660 socializing in

01:45:24.900 a way that

01:45:25.320 leads to

01:45:26.180 love and

01:45:27.040 romance.

01:45:28.000 And by the

01:45:28.360 way,

01:45:28.600 they're not

01:45:28.820 having sex 0.83

01:45:29.340 either.

01:45:30.040 That's also

01:45:30.500 been demonized.

01:45:31.380 It's like if

01:45:32.260 they need to

01:45:32.660 have a couple

01:45:33.080 of drinks,

01:45:33.520 no one's

01:45:33.900 talking about

01:45:34.260 getting like

01:45:34.660 fall down,

01:45:35.180 blackout drunk,

01:45:35.800 but if they

01:45:36.120 need to have

01:45:36.480 some drinks,

01:45:38.280 have a good

01:45:38.740 time,

01:45:39.400 they're in

01:45:39.700 college,

01:45:40.380 stop guilting

01:45:41.860 them.

01:45:42.400 Stop guilting

01:45:43.120 them nonstop

01:45:43.720 about what they

01:45:44.340 eat.

01:45:44.840 Stop guilting

01:45:45.400 them nonstop

01:45:45.960 about what they

01:45:46.900 drink and how

01:45:47.420 they live.

01:45:47.900 They're entitled

01:45:48.440 to a little

01:45:49.300 fun.

01:45:49.620 Thanks for

01:45:52.420 listening to

01:45:52.880 The Megyn Kelly

01:45:53.420 Show.

01:45:54.080 No BS,

01:45:54.900 no agenda,

01:45:55.700 and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - November 18, 2025

The Nuzzi-RFK Drama, Attacking Tucker's Son to Smear Vance, and New Cancel Culture, with Emily Jashinsky ｜ Ep. 1196

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript