The Megyn Kelly Show - May 15, 2025


Trump's Appeal to Working Class, and Michelle Obama's Wild Marriage Rule, with Sean O'Brien and RealClearPolitics Hosts ｜ Ep. 1073


Episode Stats

Length

1 hour and 47 minutes

Words per Minute

189.06462

Word Count

20,361

Sentence Count

1,498

Misogynist Sentences

34

Hate Speech Sentences

24


Summary

Former Vice President Joe Biden served as Vice President from January 2009 to January 2017. His term was supposed to end in January 2019, but Biden was still in office until the end of his term. Now, new details about his last days in office are emerging about the events leading up to his departure.


Transcript

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00:00:31.300 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.
00:00:42.560 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.
00:00:45.620 More shocking revelations about just how bad things got with Biden at the end of his term.
00:00:50.480 All right, we wrote that in script, but I gotta be, I'm not shocked.
00:00:54.040 Are we, are any of us really shocked?
00:00:55.380 It's like, we all knew, we knew, we knew, we knew.
00:01:01.280 We may not have known the specific details, but I mean, I guess what's,
00:01:05.500 no, there's nothing shocking.
00:01:06.700 There's just, it's just not shocking.
00:01:08.100 It's just like, it's shocking that he actually lived to the day of Trump's inauguration.
00:01:14.020 That's what's shocking.
00:01:14.960 But I'm still interested.
00:01:16.600 Like I'm reading the stuff.
00:01:17.840 Are you, are you interested?
00:01:19.080 Are you interested in like these details as they come out?
00:01:21.140 Now there's a guy coming out saying that what's in the Tapper Thompson book actually may not be true.
00:01:29.880 There was a very interesting segment on Mark Halpern's show saying, where this, a guy who was in attendance when Joe Biden met George Clooney,
00:01:38.540 who said, I'm telling you, it was Biden's finance chair, who said, I'm telling you right now that they got this story from George Clooney and it's a lie.
00:01:45.940 He wasn't defending Biden's mental acuity, but he was like, this is George Clooney being George Clooney.
00:01:51.420 Like, oh, he didn't know me, but he was like, he, that's not what happened.
00:01:55.680 He walked in and the president's representatives were like George Clooney and Julia Roberts.
00:02:02.720 And then he walked in the room and said, hi, George.
00:02:04.800 Hi, Julia.
00:02:05.360 Like there was no mystery to it.
00:02:07.000 So is, is the book even factually correct?
00:02:09.580 I don't know.
00:02:11.040 The whole drama around it is kind of interesting.
00:02:13.160 You guys know that they're coming on the show on Tuesday.
00:02:15.720 That will be interesting.
00:02:17.800 We'll get to all that when the guys from Real Clear Politics join me later.
00:02:21.240 But first, a first time guest on the Megyn Kelly show who made big headlines last year when he did something many thought would be impossible.
00:02:30.000 He, head of the Teamsters Union, spoke at the Republican National Convention.
00:02:36.160 Sean O'Brien is general president of the International Brotherhood of the Teamsters
00:02:40.400 and host of the Better Bad Ideas podcast.
00:02:43.820 He joins me now.
00:02:45.440 Since President Trump's election, the eyes of the nation have been on Mar-a-Lago and the free state of Florida.
00:02:51.100 It is a thriving, booming place.
00:02:53.380 South Florida is a special place because of its amazing water for boating, swimming, fishing, and drinking.
00:02:58.880 Well, today, clean water is endangered by toxic algae.
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00:03:03.600 You may have heard of red tide or blue-green algae.
00:03:06.620 It can be dangerous and it can be gross.
00:03:08.300 In his first term, President Trump signed a law to solve the problem with a new reservoir south of Lake Okeechobee
00:03:15.820 to keep clean, fresh water flowing constantly to South Florida.
00:03:20.720 President Trump said,
00:03:21.620 After years of rebuilding other nations, we are finally rebuilding our nation.
00:03:25.860 Washington can finish the job in next year's budget and keep President Trump's promise.
00:03:31.080 The Everglades Foundation, our advertiser, says that would be very good for Florida and good for the Everglades.
00:03:37.580 Learn more about President Trump's Everglades support project at evergladesfoundation.org.
00:03:45.240 Sean, welcome to the show.
00:03:46.900 Thank you very much. I appreciate you having us on the show.
00:03:50.200 So nice to meet you.
00:03:51.560 What do you make of that?
00:03:52.340 Like, let me start there.
00:03:53.360 You know all these Democrats, they've been coming to you for years trying to get your donations and get you to support them.
00:03:59.220 What do you make of all this news around Biden's mental acuity and the finger-pointing on who knew?
00:04:03.700 Yeah, well, you know what's funny?
00:04:05.980 We've been saying it since December of 2023.
00:04:09.600 When I first took over the Teamsters Union, our goal was to work bipartisan and work with the people that are going to represent working people,
00:04:16.200 whether it's Democrat, Republican, or Independents.
00:04:18.840 And when we started down that road, it was ironic how fast the Democrats turned on us, some of them.
00:04:30.240 You know, they were very vindictive, very critical.
00:04:33.880 But we knew that, you know, President Biden was failing.
00:04:37.600 We could tell.
00:04:38.260 I mean, you didn't have to be a rocket scientist or a medical professional to figure it out.
00:04:42.300 And that we knew Kamala Harris wasn't the answer to what Americans needed, American working people.
00:04:48.500 So it's funny now.
00:04:50.780 Everybody had amnesia when, and no pun intended, amnesia when the election was happening.
00:04:57.040 But now they are saying that the Democratic Party had this code of silence and no one knew how bad it was.
00:05:03.620 I mean, come on.
00:05:04.340 That's a little far-fetched, don't you think?
00:05:07.660 I mean, how did I know?
00:05:09.640 Well, like, it's like, how did half the country know?
00:05:11.840 How did half of the press know and report on it?
00:05:15.220 Just the left-wing press wouldn't.
00:05:17.540 And those around Joe Biden downplayed it.
00:05:20.600 Right.
00:05:20.780 And you know what?
00:05:21.400 They did him a disservice.
00:05:22.820 I mean, when I met with him, and I got to know him a little bit prior to the election cycle.
00:05:28.300 And it was kind of, you could tell he was deteriorating.
00:05:31.520 And I used to tell people all the time, it kind of looks like elderly abuse.
00:05:34.740 Like, you know, people are forcing him into doing something he didn't want to do.
00:05:37.720 It's like, you know, you're taking your grandmother or grandfather's license away.
00:05:40.580 It's hard, but it's necessary at times.
00:05:43.600 And I think he got bad advice.
00:05:45.220 And the Democrats are in this position, finger pointing, instead of taking a look in the mirror
00:05:49.820 and saying, we're responsible for what we don't agree with in this country.
00:05:53.820 Let's stop blaming everybody.
00:05:55.100 And let's blame ourselves for not having a strategic plan and or a vision to what they
00:06:00.720 thought this country needed.
00:06:02.320 And look, I'm a Democrat.
00:06:03.700 There's no running from that.
00:06:04.660 I grew up in the great city of Boston, where I'm very proud.
00:06:08.740 But, you know, we've got to call balls and strikes.
00:06:11.020 And, you know, the candidates that they put forward after Joe Biden pulled out certainly
00:06:17.200 is not the answer for this country.
00:06:18.500 So you mentioned you didn't think Kamala Harris was going to be the answer back in 2020,
00:06:24.580 looking at this pair, if and when Joe Biden failed.
00:06:28.640 Why is that?
00:06:30.380 Look, I mean, I don't trust her, to be honest with you.
00:06:34.320 The way she talked to people, the way she demanded support.
00:06:38.920 Look, the one thing that myself personally and I think most Americans, they don't want
00:06:43.860 to be told what to do.
00:06:45.000 They want to be told what someone is going to do for them.
00:06:49.660 I mean, we pay their salaries where their constituents.
00:06:53.140 And I know growing up where I grew up and I've been in trouble my entire life, when someone
00:06:57.020 told me to do something, I always did the opposite, just to see what the consequences
00:07:00.760 were going to be.
00:07:01.480 And they didn't want to listen anymore.
00:07:03.520 And, you know, that's they paid the consequence for it.
00:07:07.060 What was she like when when you guys met with her?
00:07:08.800 Because you met with her in advance of the November vote.
00:07:11.740 Yeah.
00:07:11.880 So ironically, we've met with every presidential candidate.
00:07:15.000 And I'll say this, President Trump, as soon as we reached out, because we've never done
00:07:20.160 this before, we had a roundtable with rank and file members and our general executive
00:07:24.300 board.
00:07:24.860 We interviewed every single candidate.
00:07:27.280 President Trump's team responded immediately in December of 23, saying, we'd love to do it.
00:07:33.000 Here's some dates.
00:07:33.640 The Biden administration was very difficult to schedule and they pushed back probably till
00:07:40.500 like May.
00:07:41.300 And then when he got out of the race, Kamala Harris came in and very difficult to deal with.
00:07:48.300 I mean, we gave each candidate 16 questions, all the exact same previous to the meeting.
00:07:55.400 Most of the candidates answered all of them.
00:07:58.620 Joe Biden answered about nine out of 16.
00:08:01.660 And then when Kamala Harris came in to answer, her team was very clear that she was only going to
00:08:06.700 answer a certain amount of questions.
00:08:08.780 And halfway through, I got a note slipped under me saying that this will be the last question.
00:08:13.920 And she only answered four of them.
00:08:15.040 So it was a typical attitude where, you know, I'm going to be the president of the United States.
00:08:21.140 And she said on the way out after she gave her closing statement to us that I'm going to win
00:08:26.920 with you or without you.
00:08:29.060 So that was pretty arrogant.
00:08:30.520 And, you know, we had a pretty diverse rank and file presence there along with our general
00:08:36.140 executive board.
00:08:36.960 So, you know, it didn't sit well with us, didn't sit well with our members.
00:08:41.580 And look, we polled extensively and 65 percent of our members were voting for President Trump.
00:08:50.180 Why do you think she was so arrogant?
00:08:51.840 That's just stupid politics.
00:08:53.480 I mean, that's the kind of thing you say to your husband after you leave a contentious meeting,
00:08:57.200 not to the people whose support you're asking for.
00:09:00.000 Yeah, I mean, I just think it's it was it's the attitude of the party.
00:09:04.080 I mean, for so long, the party has and I can speak for the Teamsters Union in my own opinion.
00:09:09.880 And we've given the Republican Party millions upon millions, Democratic Party millions upon
00:09:15.340 millions of dollars.
00:09:16.940 And I think they just thought it was like 10th grade geometry was a given.
00:09:20.060 They were just going to get it, tell us what we wanted to hear and that they were going
00:09:24.260 to win.
00:09:25.000 And look, our members are sophisticated.
00:09:27.340 I think the American people are a lot more sophisticated and they pay attention.
00:09:31.320 And, you know, the arrogance, I think, was a downfall.
00:09:34.100 You know, they talk to people like we were schoolchildren, you know, telling us what we should
00:09:37.340 do, what we shouldn't do.
00:09:38.760 And she's just not a good candidate.
00:09:40.620 And the funny thing is, you know, when she talked about her intention, she embraced technology.
00:09:47.880 She embraced a lot of things that will destroy American jobs.
00:09:52.180 And she was actually reflecting upon what the Democrats, the Republicans used to say 20 years
00:09:57.800 ago.
00:09:58.160 So it was like a script was flipped and, you know, she just wasn't resonating with us.
00:10:02.980 And, you know, her running mate, I mean, really, I mean, that guy, he called me out saying
00:10:08.360 this was hilarious, calls me out saying all the courageous union leaders that endorsed
00:10:13.880 our ticket, you know, they should be applauded.
00:10:17.060 And the ones that didn't have the courage, you know, basically, you know, screw.
00:10:20.740 And I'm laughing at him.
00:10:21.700 I'm like, here's a guy that has a false narrative of his service for this country.
00:10:26.920 And he looks like a creepy wrestling coach in high school that you wouldn't want your
00:10:30.380 kids rolling around the ground with.
00:10:31.580 So, you know, I just thought that was funny coming from him.
00:10:35.160 He didn't resonate with you with his camo hat and his attempt to look like a hunter?
00:10:39.960 No, I mean, look, when it when and again, I've never served in the military regret I have.
00:10:44.980 But, you know, I wouldn't look at him as a as a war hero.
00:10:47.860 I look at him maybe as like a Cub Scout or a Boy Scout.
00:10:50.160 But that's about it.
00:10:51.840 Yeah, well, he you know, they he's now admitted that they put him out there to be the guy who
00:10:56.280 is going to attract working class white guys.
00:10:59.060 And I think that's you.
00:11:00.560 That's your guys.
00:11:01.640 So why do you think it didn't work?
00:11:03.880 Well, it didn't work because, you know, he he embraced the social justice warrior rhetoric
00:11:10.420 that was going around from the far left and my members.
00:11:13.380 I know my members better than anybody else.
00:11:15.080 And I know working people during this election.
00:11:18.160 It wasn't about social issues at all.
00:11:20.320 It was about the economy.
00:11:21.500 It was about jobs.
00:11:22.300 It was about taking home more than your paycheck.
00:11:25.260 It was it was about less inflation.
00:11:28.260 And that's not the narrative they spoke in, which further leads to a point where you've
00:11:33.480 lost touch with the people that you should be representing and you don't talk to the people
00:11:37.760 you should be representing.
00:11:38.540 So that narrative clearly blew him out of the water.
00:11:42.840 Will you what do you think about that?
00:11:44.660 Like the Democrats and their embrace of this social justice, woke, annoying, you know, the
00:11:51.000 demonization of whites, white men in particular?
00:11:54.420 I mean, I think it's a massive, massive vulnerability of theirs, and I don't think they're capable
00:11:59.320 of fixing it.
00:12:00.080 I just think that wing of their party is just metastasized into too big a blob to excise.
00:12:07.140 But what what do you think of it?
00:12:08.880 Look, I think this and I often tell people this, the Teamsters Union and I'm a fourth generation
00:12:14.580 Teamster, we've been fighting social injustices through the work that we do on behalf of the
00:12:19.680 members that we represent.
00:12:20.840 We negotiate strong contracts, we make sure there's wage equality, we make certain that
00:12:25.440 people are promoted based upon their ability.
00:12:29.040 And that's what unions are for.
00:12:30.620 You know, I think embracing all of this rhetoric of the social justice system that they've basically
00:12:39.320 doubled down on, it's not what the Democrats or the Democratic people in this country.
00:12:44.920 And the other disturbing piece is, you know, I've been in conflict my entire life, whether
00:12:50.860 it was in my neighborhood I grew up with or my professional career.
00:12:54.000 And it's okay to have dialogue.
00:12:55.840 It's okay to have debate.
00:12:56.760 It's okay to have difference of opinions.
00:12:58.460 But this far left and this far left social justice revolution, as I look at it, if you
00:13:04.640 don't agree with them, and you don't look like them, then you're automatically cast as
00:13:07.960 a racist person.
00:13:09.160 I grew up in a very diverse neighborhood.
00:13:10.720 I went to a very diverse high school, I've got very diverse friends, and you know, they're
00:13:14.900 clearly off the mark.
00:13:16.020 It's kind of like, you know, they lost the game, and they're sore losers about it, instead
00:13:20.320 of like any other good team would do step back, do a little adjusting, maybe, you know, get
00:13:25.940 rid of some people on the DNC, embrace candidates that aren't so far left, and that have the ability
00:13:31.960 to work with people with difference of opinions with different backgrounds and come to common ground
00:13:37.900 and solutions to problems instead of creating problems.
00:13:40.980 Have you seen them out there, a couple of these Democrats, trying to like figure out
00:13:45.800 what the magic formula is to win back the working class, which used to be voting Democrat,
00:13:51.720 and that what they're doing more and more is dropping the occasional F-bomb, which as you
00:13:56.920 know, only works if it's sincere, you know, if that's actually how you talk, if it's authentic
00:14:01.400 to you.
00:14:01.800 And everybody who actually does talk like that can smell these phonies from a mile away
00:14:06.480 in their little Argyle sweaters, like sweater vests, as they're trying to like pronounce
00:14:12.100 carefully the F-U and the C-K especially on it, so they can sound, they don't understand
00:14:16.820 how to do it, Sean.
00:14:18.200 No, listen, there's only, listen, being from Boston, we drop F-bombs better than anybody,
00:14:23.240 right?
00:14:23.480 And when you're out there looking like fucking Ward Cleaver, right, trying to drop F-bombs
00:14:29.940 and it's not authentic, people see right through that.
00:14:32.900 But, you know, the reality of it is, you know, you can't teach instinct and you can't teach,
00:14:39.180 you know, a moral compass on certain people.
00:14:41.860 And, you know, some of these people that are trying to act out now and trying to be something
00:14:47.720 they're not, that's not what people want.
00:14:49.380 And there's, the only way to fix what's broken in this country is to stop pointing fingers.
00:14:54.440 I mean, I got pissed off.
00:14:56.340 And look, I've called Republicans out, I've called, I call balls and strikes.
00:15:00.240 And what happens is, you know, I had this, I was getting criticized from the far left
00:15:05.880 because we didn't do what most normal, most people did.
00:15:09.900 We did the normal thing and listened to our members.
00:15:12.980 And I was getting killed from the left.
00:15:15.060 I was getting killed from the far right, especially after the RNC speech.
00:15:18.280 And, you know, I started calling out the DSA operatives for defaming historic buildings
00:15:26.080 and statutes in D.C., burning the flag.
00:15:29.020 But every time I called them out, they had an answer.
00:15:32.820 Like, I called someone on them, you think it's okay to burn the American flag?
00:15:36.240 Their answer is, well, the Supreme Court doesn't think there's anything wrong with it.
00:15:39.260 But morally, you don't think there's a problem with you burning the flag,
00:15:41.680 taking a knee for the national anthem?
00:15:43.000 That's bullshit.
00:15:43.640 People fought long and hard, men and women, sacrificed their lives for the freedom of this country.
00:15:48.600 Respect the fucking country.
00:15:49.720 I mean, that's the reality of it.
00:15:50.900 And that's where, that's where it's too far left.
00:15:54.760 Yes.
00:15:55.200 Oh, my God.
00:15:55.740 It's the music to my ears.
00:15:56.860 I completely agree.
00:15:57.760 They, they lost the regular Americans with their far left ideals.
00:16:02.540 You listen to, I was recently listening to a speech that, or not a speech,
00:16:05.160 which is an interview that Justice Antonin Scalia gave back when he was still alive and on the Supreme Court.
00:16:09.980 And he was saying, because he was a pivotal vote and I think wrote the opinion in that Supreme Court decision
00:16:14.400 that upheld people's ability to burn the flag as a constitutional matter,
00:16:18.220 because this is the United States of America and it's free speech.
00:16:20.780 And then he just went off on how terrible he thinks it is.
00:16:24.720 And how if Antonin Scalia were a, you know, lawmaker or trying, or in an influencer position,
00:16:30.120 yes, he would tell everybody not to do that.
00:16:31.500 It's terrible.
00:16:32.000 It's abhorrent.
00:16:32.440 What are you doing?
00:16:32.940 He would say the same message you did.
00:16:34.600 But he, as a jurist, he had no choice but to interpret the Constitution the way it is.
00:16:38.760 It's like normal people.
00:16:40.920 But isn't that troubling though?
00:16:42.280 Think about that.
00:16:43.320 Like, you know, he couldn't interpret it the way he wanted to, right?
00:16:46.520 Because of his position, right?
00:16:48.320 We have an ability.
00:16:49.920 But it's good.
00:16:50.640 I mean, like we need more judges like that, right?
00:16:52.180 Like he used to say, like, I'm really kind of a slave to the Constitution and the law.
00:16:56.000 You want to hear us interpret?
00:16:57.280 We come up with bad decisions that wind up kind of stupid.
00:16:59.760 It's because we have some laws that are bad and kind of stupid.
00:17:02.420 And it's not up – his whole constitutional philosophy was it's not up to people in robes
00:17:07.360 to, like, overrule the legislature.
00:17:09.240 That's a leftist judge's thinking.
00:17:11.180 You know, it's a living, breathing Constitution.
00:17:12.840 He's like, no.
00:17:13.840 There's nothing in there about banning, you know, the death penalty, for example.
00:17:19.300 That was legal in all 50 states or all states that we had when we adopted the Constitution.
00:17:22.640 Don't tell me that's in there because I know it's not.
00:17:24.440 He doesn't like judges who read things in there.
00:17:26.060 I feel like today we've got judges all over the country who read stuff in there like a
00:17:29.580 right to gay sex and a right to abortion that are clearly not written in the document.
00:17:35.820 Well, Scalia, I mean, I wasn't a big fan of his Janus decision.
00:17:39.340 You know, and we probably have different opinions on right to work.
00:17:42.220 I don't think right to work is good, but he heard us there.
00:17:44.780 But as far as desecrating memorials, as far as desecrating the American flag, anybody that
00:17:51.060 does that should be charged with a crime.
00:17:52.480 I'm sorry.
00:17:52.880 See, I think it's not a crime, but we should shame them.
00:17:57.060 We should totally shame them.
00:17:58.180 They should be ostracized.
00:17:59.720 I'm totally in favor of Colin Kaepernick not making his way back into the NFL after all
00:18:03.980 the disrespect he paid our flag.
00:18:05.660 That's, I think, how you do it.
00:18:06.880 You shun them, which is why I have to say it's why I think it's so stupid that these
00:18:10.200 schools that have their valedictorians this time of year have to run their speech by the
00:18:15.720 principle.
00:18:16.960 It's like the way we did it when you and I were growing up is if you get up there, you say
00:18:21.660 something stupid, you get shunned and ostracized by your classmates and you learn the hard
00:18:25.220 way.
00:18:25.500 Then you really never do it again.
00:18:26.840 What's your story?
00:18:27.920 Or if you speak the truth, you get a high five, right?
00:18:30.680 Yeah.
00:18:31.580 So the RNC speech was great.
00:18:34.320 Same thing.
00:18:34.900 You've got the operatives in the RNC.
00:18:36.860 And, you know, I did the keynote speech, as you know, the Monday night of the RNC.
00:18:43.420 So prior to this, you know, we're preparing our speech, my team, and it was a three, four
00:18:48.000 week process going back and forth.
00:18:49.720 And then we've got to submit the speech to the RNC.
00:18:54.160 Now, if you listen to my speech, I didn't choose a side in that whole speech.
00:18:59.160 It was basically a message on behalf of American workers.
00:19:02.200 Because I called out corporate elites, elitist, I've called out corporations, I called out
00:19:06.500 the far left.
00:19:07.280 Let me pause you one second.
00:19:08.640 Let me air some of it, because we have a highlight reel, and then you pick up your story in the
00:19:11.560 back end.
00:19:12.060 Watch.
00:19:12.460 Here's some highlights from it.
00:19:14.620 Today, the teamsters are here to say we are not beholden to anyone or any party.
00:19:20.680 And I don't care about getting criticized.
00:19:23.040 It's an honor to be the first teamster in our 121-year history to address the Republican
00:19:30.840 National Convention.
00:19:32.800 Think about this.
00:19:34.520 The teamsters are doing something correct.
00:19:37.200 If the extremes in both parties think I shouldn't be on this stage, you can have whatever opinion
00:19:43.580 you want.
00:19:44.100 But one thing is clear, President Trump is a candidate who is not afraid of hearing from
00:19:51.040 new, loud, and often critical voices.
00:19:55.240 And I think we all can agree, whether people like him or they don't like him, in light of
00:20:02.140 what happened to him on Saturday, he has proven to be one tough SOB.
00:20:09.380 I was there.
00:20:11.420 That was very powerful.
00:20:12.340 Keep going.
00:20:12.680 So we submit the speech.
00:20:15.660 And the RNC people were like, oh, no, you have to change it.
00:20:18.820 You have to change all the narratives.
00:20:21.000 This isn't what we want.
00:20:22.060 And I'm like, I'm not changing the fucking speech.
00:20:23.900 Sorry.
00:20:24.840 And so we reach out to Susie Wiles.
00:20:27.920 And I'm like, look, I'm not going to speak because I'm not changing my speech.
00:20:31.600 You guys asked me to speak.
00:20:33.680 I have to speak the truth.
00:20:35.280 She goes, Sean, I don't care what you do.
00:20:37.080 Say whatever you want.
00:20:38.180 She goes, do me a favor.
00:20:38.960 Can you call DJT and just tell him?
00:20:41.700 So I call him up and I say, look, they want me to change my speech.
00:20:45.480 I'm not going to do that.
00:20:46.600 And he says, I haven't even seen your speech, Sean.
00:20:48.600 He goes, this week said, exact words.
00:20:51.220 Say whatever the fuck you want.
00:20:52.640 I'm fine with it.
00:20:53.920 And so I was only supposed to speak for about like 15 minutes.
00:20:57.840 It ended up being like a 30-minute deal.
00:21:00.340 But it was pretty funny.
00:21:01.620 And it was funny because in that whole speech, when we first started out and I said, he's
00:21:08.860 one tough SOB.
00:21:10.140 Obviously, those are my initials.
00:21:11.460 So I tried to, I threw that in there.
00:21:13.020 That wasn't on the teleprompter.
00:21:14.160 And I got criticized for saying that.
00:21:17.360 I'm like, the guy just took a fucking bullet to the air two days before that.
00:21:21.780 And he's back up like nothing happened.
00:21:23.740 Like, I don't care whether you like him or you don't like him.
00:21:26.600 I mean, that's some mental and physical toughness.
00:21:29.000 Yeah.
00:21:29.500 And, you know, you get criticized, you get criticized for that.
00:21:31.880 But it was a whole funny experience.
00:21:33.780 And it just showed you how, you know, the far left or the far right, in this case, the
00:21:38.980 far right, didn't want a truthful narrative.
00:21:43.440 Wait, that takes me back to what you were saying about Kamala coming to the Teamsters and only
00:21:47.580 getting through four questions.
00:21:48.880 Was she answering them the way we saw her answer on the campaign trail with just like
00:21:53.780 a bunch of nothingness, this big air sandwich?
00:21:56.620 Or was she more substantive?
00:21:58.920 No.
00:21:59.120 I mean, she didn't answer the questions at all with any type of real substance.
00:22:07.160 You know, it was funny when she was answering the questions and, you know, I check a few
00:22:11.660 of the boxes, ADD, ADHD, OCD, whatever.
00:22:14.980 And I just remember saying, this lady's not even answering this question.
00:22:18.300 Maybe it's my OCD kicking in or ADHD.
00:22:21.460 I don't know what it was.
00:22:22.320 But I started thinking about Little League and saying if I swung the bat a little harder,
00:22:26.520 maybe I would have hit the fence.
00:22:27.640 I mean, it was just the answers.
00:22:29.680 The answers were crazy.
00:22:31.100 And it was telling at that point in time that, you know, she had a sense of entitlement to
00:22:38.440 the position, not that she wanted to work at it.
00:22:41.400 Like the narrative right now in the wake of all these books is, you know, there was a
00:22:45.000 quote from an unsourced, they didn't reveal who said it, but Democrat operatives saying
00:22:50.360 that Joe Biden effed us.
00:22:52.900 He effed us out of the presidency.
00:22:54.420 He effed the American public out of, you know, a vote because he left her so little
00:22:59.980 runway, only 107 days.
00:23:01.760 And this is the narrative that the left is going with, which is just, to me, such a blatant
00:23:05.460 lie.
00:23:06.020 She didn't have it.
00:23:07.360 More time wouldn't have worked to her benefit.
00:23:09.500 It would have sunk her even sooner and probably by a bigger margin.
00:23:13.300 That's my take.
00:23:14.040 So the, the eyes odd mafia is blaming, uh, Joe Biden for not getting out of the race
00:23:21.040 sooner.
00:23:22.160 Is that what you're saying?
00:23:22.920 Yes.
00:23:23.320 Saying that's what sunk Kamala.
00:23:25.500 Right.
00:23:25.800 So here's the narrative that we heard.
00:23:27.540 And again, this is a secondhand information, you know, when president Biden was running,
00:23:33.180 uh, he was running as a transitional president.
00:23:36.100 So the, the story that we got, and again, I, I, a secondhand story, but again, with all these
00:23:42.080 books coming out, so I think it's safe to say that this is probably accurate, that the
00:23:46.040 secondhand story went that they had a meeting two years into, and when they say they, his
00:23:50.840 close, uh, cabinet team, uh, had a meeting with, with president Biden said, you know, two
00:23:56.440 years into it, this is a great time to, uh, say that you're not going to be, you know,
00:24:00.940 running again.
00:24:01.940 Uh, you're a transitional president.
00:24:03.580 You've done some good things, passed some good legislation, uh, now it's time to step
00:24:07.600 out.
00:24:07.860 And I heard, and this was told to us by some reliable sources that everybody was in favor
00:24:15.160 of him making that announcement, but one person.
00:24:17.740 And that one person wasn't part of the cabinet or elected.
00:24:20.840 It was his wife, uh, Dr. Jill Biden.
00:24:23.440 So if that's true, um, you know, you're blaming the wrong people.
00:24:27.040 I mean, look, um, you know, when I'm 78 years old, hopefully I'll still be alive.
00:24:32.660 And enjoying, uh, retirement and grandchildren, not, not trying to get propped up and be made
00:24:39.400 a fool of.
00:24:40.120 And anybody that thought that he should have ran for another term and, or was qualified
00:24:44.960 to do it, you need to blame yourselves, not blame Joe Biden.
00:24:49.180 Yeah, I, you're right.
00:24:50.800 And she, she's absolutely the chief villain.
00:24:53.280 I mean, I can not imagine doing that to my husband or him doing that to me.
00:24:56.740 It's horrifying.
00:24:57.820 All right.
00:24:58.120 Talk to me about why Trump is resonating with the working class of America in a way
00:25:02.880 Republicans haven't in a long time.
00:25:04.780 I know, I know the Teamsters supported Reagan, right?
00:25:06.740 They supported, uh, George HW Bush, but it's been a long dry spell between Trump and the
00:25:12.300 Teamsters or not Republicans and the Teamsters for a good reason.
00:25:15.080 So what's changing right now?
00:25:16.920 That's, that's connecting so much with your members.
00:25:19.980 Well, I think it's, what's important is to look back over the last 20 years,
00:25:22.760 the Democrats controlled 16 out of the last 20 years.
00:25:27.280 Um, and we didn't get anything done.
00:25:28.980 I mean, you look at the Obama administration, uh, during the Obama administration, you had
00:25:33.600 a full, uh, democratic house, Senate, and president.
00:25:37.180 Our biggest, uh, objective was to pass the employee free choice act, which would make it
00:25:41.800 easy to organize contract neutrality, no retribution or retaliation for joining the union.
00:25:46.660 Um, and remember people forget all these bad trade deals that were done under the Clinton
00:25:53.020 administration, um, have come to surface because of the Trump administration.
00:25:58.960 And we are finally realizing that we lost a lot of jobs.
00:26:03.080 We lost a lot of manufacturing.
00:26:04.220 We lost a lot of goods and services that were produced in this country.
00:26:07.660 Um, so I think that's part of the, part of the problem.
00:26:11.380 That's part of the reason why there's a gravitation, uh, towards the Trump.
00:26:14.840 Plus, look, I think, and you look at the narrative from the Chuck Schumers of the world in the
00:26:20.280 nineties, and you look at the Hillary Clinton, uh, 2008 narrative on immigration, it's all
00:26:27.680 in line with what president Trump is doing right now.
00:26:30.660 So it's not that the American people or the American worker has changed their, their morals
00:26:36.560 and their beliefs.
00:26:37.300 We've remained constant.
00:26:38.900 Uh, it's the Democrat party, Democratic party who has flipped the script and embraced billionaires
00:26:44.340 have embraced technology and embraced everything that they once hated.
00:26:47.900 Um, and now they're criticizing tariffs and things that may be able to bring good American
00:26:53.180 jobs back here.
00:26:54.580 Um, I think that's one of the reasons why in, in, you know, president Trump, you know,
00:26:58.580 do I agree with everything he does?
00:26:59.980 Absolutely not.
00:27:00.820 But do I agree what he's been doing?
00:27:02.220 I mean, look, I'll tell you this for the teamsters union, whenever there's a, a, a decision
00:27:07.180 made on labor or how, how potentially this could, uh, benefit or hurt organized labor.
00:27:14.320 Um, he calls us, they call the teamsters union and we've had frank discussions on certain
00:27:19.360 things and that's what it's about, having a dialogue.
00:27:22.020 And it's great.
00:27:22.740 I mean, look, the most recent thing, um, is this taxing and tariffing these motion picture
00:27:27.960 companies that are taking jobs out of the United States and going to Europe and Paris and
00:27:35.260 masquerading Paris as New York city, those people should be paying, or those companies
00:27:39.380 should be paying a tax for that.
00:27:41.040 And he called me up and he said, look, Sean, I want to do this.
00:27:44.080 Uh, do you mind working with John Voight and some other folks, uh, in Hollywood?
00:27:47.820 Cause we represent, you know, a vast number of, uh, members that work in Hollywood teamster
00:27:52.780 members.
00:27:53.360 And I said, absolutely not.
00:27:54.560 He goes, push as hard as you can.
00:27:56.080 I want to make this happen.
00:27:57.260 So how do you, how do you criticize someone that is calling you up saying, Hey, I want to
00:28:02.680 bring American jobs back here.
00:28:04.080 Please do me a favor, push as hard as you can.
00:28:06.600 Uh, we'll work together on this.
00:28:08.260 Now there's some other unions that, you know, maybe upset federal employees where there's
00:28:12.360 been significant layoffs and that that's that, you know, layoffs are tough and I get that.
00:28:16.660 But the reality is for the teamster's perspective, when, you know, our members, uh, uh, fighting,
00:28:21.720 uh, to protect jobs and keep, keep good American jobs in this country.
00:28:25.320 And the president is calling us up saying, you know, this is what we want to do.
00:28:29.400 I think it's a, I think it's a pretty good start.
00:28:31.320 It's more than we've gotten in the past.
00:28:32.620 And then, like I said, the Democrats were in charge for 16 out of the last 20 years.
00:28:37.200 Well, I got to show you, this is how you criticize it.
00:28:39.300 So Robert De Niro, who's got a severe case of the TDS, um, is in conference right now.
00:28:45.800 Almost all of the muckety mucks are, and he's very unhappy about what Trump is doing to try
00:28:51.480 to keep filmmaking, American filmmaking in America by slapping tariffs on foreign made films so
00:28:57.640 that he can basically try to force people to make them domestically again for the American
00:29:01.700 audience that they're meant to serve.
00:29:02.860 And here's what De Niro said on Tuesday.
00:29:04.780 America's Philistine president has had himself appointed head of one of our premier cultural
00:29:11.900 institutions.
00:29:13.160 He has cut funding and support to the arts, humanities, and education.
00:29:18.220 And now he has announced a hundred percent tariff on films produced outside the U.S.
00:29:25.340 Let that sink in for a minute.
00:29:28.360 You can't put a price on creativity, but apparently you can put a tariff on it.
00:29:35.360 Of course, this is unacceptable.
00:29:38.680 All these attacks are unacceptable.
00:29:42.080 And this isn't just an American problem.
00:29:45.280 It's a global one.
00:29:46.800 What do you make of that?
00:29:49.780 Well, it's a global problem because it's the greediness of these studios and some of
00:29:54.300 these actors that, you know, make a lot more money overseas than they would here.
00:29:57.820 But I look at, I look at the film industry in the United States and my father worked in
00:30:03.360 the film industry in Boston.
00:30:04.560 He was a transportation coordinator for the Teamsters Union.
00:30:07.300 So I know a little bit about it.
00:30:09.780 I look at the film industry as we have some of the most creative people in the world in the
00:30:15.900 United States that have been making movies for hundreds of years.
00:30:19.060 And I look at the film industry in America as like Major League Baseball is America's
00:30:24.740 sport.
00:30:25.240 You can't put the Boston Red Sox in Great Britain and call them the Boston Red Sox, right?
00:30:30.700 So, you know, people should look at filmmaking as the same as they would look at American
00:30:36.200 sport.
00:30:36.780 We are at the forefront.
00:30:39.200 We have a great opportunity to create hundreds upon thousands of jobs.
00:30:43.620 And the film industry not only creates hundreds of thousands of jobs, there's also a residual
00:30:49.620 benefit or indirect benefit from all the goods and services, supplies, restaurants, hotels
00:30:55.140 within the United States and employ millions of people.
00:30:57.860 So that's the thought process.
00:31:00.040 I mean, Robert De Niro, I mean, I've seen some of his antics.
00:31:03.620 I was a big fan of his, but I'm a big fan of keeping American people working.
00:31:08.480 And again, American films are right up there with American baseball.
00:31:12.460 It's American sport.
00:31:13.140 Well, and it's like, how long has it been since Robert De Niro knew what it was to be
00:31:16.640 working class and to understand what it was like to worry about where your next paychecks
00:31:20.240 coming from, how you're going to pay the mortgage at the end of the month?
00:31:23.260 You know, he's not thinking about your guys at all, right?
00:31:26.280 He's talking about how Donald Trump's a Philistine, meaning he doesn't understand modern culture
00:31:30.960 and, you know, cultural and the culture and the arts, the way Robert De Niro does, you
00:31:36.100 see.
00:31:36.940 Well, I think it's a great example of hooray for me.
00:31:39.300 Fuck everybody else.
00:31:40.100 Because if you look at average Hollywood actors, and we supported SAG, Screen Actors Guild on
00:31:47.060 this strike, there's only four or five percent of actors making the Robert De Niro, that type
00:31:54.740 of money.
00:31:55.480 Most people that film a movie, you know, you give 35 percent to your agent, to, you know,
00:32:00.920 whatever other payout you have to make.
00:32:03.340 Your PR.
00:32:03.880 Manager, PR, and everything else, right?
00:32:05.700 So at the end of the day, you know, these folks, they make a 16-week movie.
00:32:10.540 The average person that's an actor or an actress makes a movie 16 weeks.
00:32:15.260 They're making the minimal, and they're unemployed in 16 weeks.
00:32:18.560 So it's easy for him to say, you know, or to get on, you know, to get on his soapbox and
00:32:23.100 pontificate about creativity and everything else.
00:32:25.780 The guy's worth $200 million, and you got some poor stiff that's actually very talented
00:32:32.340 trying to make a living, grind out a living in L.A. or New York.
00:32:36.600 I mean, you know, again, talk about not being in touch.
00:32:39.700 And I guarantee you, if it came to Robert De Niro working behind a strike to make some
00:32:46.560 money, there'd be clear choice he would cross that picket line, because he's actually crossing
00:32:50.420 a picket line right now by going overseas and doing American film work where it should be
00:32:55.040 done in America, not overseas.
00:32:56.540 Yeah, the nerve of him saying it, from Cannes, France, of all places, my God.
00:33:01.120 You know, Trump has been so good about trying to pressure American companies into bringing
00:33:07.640 business back here.
00:33:09.180 And there's no better example of that in the news recently than Apple.
00:33:13.540 It's really kind of an outrage.
00:33:14.780 I mean, literally, almost everybody has one of these devices, right?
00:33:17.420 One of these Apple phones.
00:33:19.000 They're by far the dominant product that we use for our phones.
00:33:22.380 It's an American company.
00:33:23.700 It was born in America.
00:33:24.780 It was invented by an American.
00:33:26.180 And they make all of the phones over in China and now India.
00:33:32.040 They don't make any of them here.
00:33:34.960 Those could be actual, well-paying jobs for real, live Americans.
00:33:40.760 I mean, talk about a living wage.
00:33:42.040 It could be a great wage.
00:33:43.160 They don't want to pay it because they can buy making it labor for cheap in China, in India.
00:33:48.360 So Trump let it slip this week that he had a tense phone call.
00:33:52.280 He's over in the Middle East right now.
00:33:53.640 He was in Qatar.
00:33:54.380 And he kind of went off on a side about a phone call he just had with Tim Cook, the CEO.
00:33:58.500 Take a listen to this.
00:33:59.220 Apple, as you know, it's coming in.
00:34:03.580 And I had a little problem with Tim Cook yesterday.
00:34:06.180 I said to him, Tim, you're my friend.
00:34:07.580 I treated you very good.
00:34:08.640 You're coming in with $500 billion.
00:34:10.420 But now I hear you're building all over India.
00:34:12.360 Tim, I said, Tim, look, we've treated you really good.
00:34:15.040 We put up with all the plants that you built in China for years.
00:34:20.120 Now you've got to build us.
00:34:21.320 We're not interested in you building in India.
00:34:24.000 India can take care of themselves.
00:34:25.320 And then he said Apple is going to be upping their production in the United States, though
00:34:31.520 he didn't provide further details.
00:34:33.600 How do you feel about it?
00:34:35.020 Well, I think I think he's spot on as far as American companies doing work overseas.
00:34:39.960 You can create these jobs and infrastructure in the United States.
00:34:43.200 And, you know, I think the problem is, you know, you get back to the corporate greed and
00:34:46.600 the wage disparity between, you know, the CEOs and the people that are actually providing
00:34:51.440 the labor in the United States, although it's probably it's much cheaper to go overseas
00:34:55.380 and do it.
00:34:56.260 I don't think it's that cheap.
00:34:58.180 It should be that it should be viewed as as being cheaper.
00:35:01.140 I think bring those jobs back here.
00:35:03.020 Take a little bit more off your bottom line and give it to your workers.
00:35:06.660 And I think it'll be fine.
00:35:07.920 I mean, that's what we're supposed to be.
00:35:08.760 CEOs shouldn't be making 2000 times more than an American worker, especially when the
00:35:13.460 American worker is doing all the work.
00:35:14.940 So I think it's a great narrative.
00:35:17.800 Yeah, I mean, Apple's one of the most successful companies in world history.
00:35:23.060 Like, I wonder what the difference would be if they paid Americans a real living wage versus
00:35:28.200 giving a bunch of Chinese and Indians some not great wage.
00:35:32.240 Like, OK, they probably have a smaller profit margin, but you'd be giving real jobs to your
00:35:36.680 fellow countrymen.
00:35:38.060 Right.
00:35:38.560 The profit margin would shrink.
00:35:39.920 There's no doubt about that.
00:35:40.960 But you'd actually be providing opportunity for people in this country.
00:35:44.480 Uh, opportunity to have, you know, nice homes, good educations for their children.
00:35:49.660 What's wrong with reinvesting in the American people, even if, you know, cost you a little
00:35:53.760 bit more, uh, in a profit.
00:35:55.640 And, you know, look, you know, I think the one thing is, and Trump was criticized saying
00:36:00.860 he was beholding to Wall Street while he was running.
00:36:03.420 Clearly, uh, he hasn't given two shits about Wall Street right now because of, you know,
00:36:08.380 he's, he's announced these tariffs.
00:36:09.860 He's announced a lot of things that have shook Wall Street.
00:36:12.680 Um, and it's a good thing.
00:36:14.240 I mean, I talk about it all the time.
00:36:15.540 I'm like, I care about Main Street before Wall Street any day of the week.
00:36:19.140 And that's where people should be focused in these corporations that American base, but
00:36:23.340 provide their labor in a third world nation.
00:36:26.280 That's what they should be focused on as well.
00:36:28.000 Main Street, not Wall Street.
00:36:29.180 Um, the guys from the All In podcast, two of the so-called besties, I don't know if you've
00:36:35.040 ever seen it, but they're great.
00:36:36.400 Um, they're tech guys.
00:36:37.640 They've made it all big in tech out in Silicon Valley.
00:36:40.080 And two of them were on the show about a week ago and they, we, we got into a debate about
00:36:43.900 illegal immigration.
00:36:45.600 And, um, they were saying, realistically, Trump is not going to be able to get out these
00:36:49.280 10 to 20 million illegals.
00:36:50.560 He's just not going to be able to do it.
00:36:51.720 And the economy would collapse, they argued, if he did it, that we're so dependent on these
00:36:56.120 illegals doing, you know, the line, the jobs Americans will not do that.
00:37:00.440 We can't realistically ship them off.
00:37:02.600 And I was saying, well, maybe you're right because he's not imposing the E-Verify system,
00:37:06.780 which, you know, many have wanted him to do for a long time, which would really kind of
00:37:09.900 make it impossible for employers to hire illegals.
00:37:12.720 So maybe Trump at some level knows there would be economic ruin at some level if we shipped all
00:37:18.300 of them out, because that would be a real tool to get them to leave.
00:37:21.720 Um, do you accept this, Sean?
00:37:23.640 Cause I was saying, I don't accept that the economy will collapse.
00:37:27.500 I believe they would, these employers would be forced to turn to Americans and pay them
00:37:34.000 the wages they demand to do these jobs.
00:37:36.200 Yeah, there's no doubt.
00:37:37.800 We have, uh, an abundance of people available for work in this country.
00:37:41.920 We've got the brightest and best, and this is just an excuse by corporate American corporate
00:37:47.940 greed, um, on why they want to pay people less.
00:37:51.760 Um, because they, you know, the reality of it is there's plenty of people that need good
00:37:55.220 paying jobs.
00:37:56.040 There's plenty of Americans in this country that could do a lot of this work.
00:37:59.240 So I don't, I don't buy that bullshit at all.
00:38:01.680 And, and let me ask you something.
00:38:02.860 Are they, are they putting, uh, are they putting, um, ads in the Mexican paper to having these
00:38:08.300 people come over here and say, Hey, we got these jobs.
00:38:10.200 No, they're actually trafficking people over here to do these jobs so they can expand their
00:38:14.900 profits on their balance sheet.
00:38:16.520 There's not, there's nothing wrong with that.
00:38:18.300 I mean, those corporations should be, should be fined.
00:38:21.240 They, like you said, they should be humiliated.
00:38:23.300 And if someone doesn't act accordingly, they should be shamed.
00:38:26.600 Exactly.
00:38:27.100 There's a, there's a law of natural consequences that the public can unleash way better than
00:38:31.160 any sort of white collar command center can.
00:38:33.940 Um, I know that you guys, uh, you work at UPS, you're big at UPS, and you've been in a
00:38:40.000 dispute with Amazon for quite some time, the Teamsters union, right?
00:38:42.800 You're doing the truck.
00:38:43.560 So what's going on with Amazon?
00:38:44.840 Cause I'm interested in their boss and his fiance too.
00:38:49.820 Well, that guy, I mean, clearly he's gone on a little, uh, uh, supplemental program.
00:38:54.580 You know, he looked like, uh, he looked like Potsy Weber and now all of a sudden he's trying
00:38:59.080 to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger.
00:39:00.580 So, um, no, but the reality of it, look, it's, I, I refer to Amazon as a white collar crime
00:39:05.020 syndicate.
00:39:05.980 Um, the way they treat their people, their employees, um, which they don't, you know, they
00:39:11.200 don't, they have 150% turnover ratio.
00:39:13.580 Uh, they focus on distressed communities, uh, to build their fulfillment centers, uh, and
00:39:19.540 they hide behind, uh, a third party leasing arrangement, um, what their drive is called
00:39:25.500 a, um, DSP model where they, you know, they, uh, they're not a W2 employer, uh, 1099, these
00:39:33.380 delivery drivers.
00:39:34.040 Conversely, UPS is our largest employer.
00:39:37.100 Um, we have negotiated a $30 billion deal.
00:39:41.000 Um, we first came into office on behalf of 340,000 part-time and full-time members at
00:39:46.860 UPS, uh, where they get, uh, high wages, they get the best benefits and they get pension
00:39:52.400 for doing the same exact work.
00:39:54.380 Uh, so Amazon is clearly, um, Jeff Bezos, his attitude, and I'll tell you this, it's very
00:39:59.860 smug.
00:40:00.360 Uh, he doesn't, uh, he doesn't respect the people that work for him.
00:40:04.840 Uh, he exploits, uh, distressed communities, uh, and he thinks that this should be the United
00:40:10.960 States of Amazon, not the United States of America.
00:40:13.480 And I love the fact when he stepped on his dicks, excuse my language, and he wanted to
00:40:19.100 put what the tariffs would cost per piece.
00:40:22.920 And I took it one step further and I said, why don't you put what your profits reflect
00:40:27.900 on every single package, uh, by exploiting the DSP model, third-party leasing arrangement,
00:40:34.640 the 1099 wage scam you have going on.
00:40:37.020 I would love to see that on your packages.
00:40:39.560 And, you know, he doubled down and, you know, re typical, um, you know, hit now he's hiding.
00:40:45.940 Didn't, didn't comment on, on, on one of the dumbest things he's ever said.
00:40:49.860 Yeah.
00:40:50.320 Now he's, they've reportedly reversed it because they had a phone call from Trump saying,
00:40:53.880 what are you doing?
00:40:54.700 Or somebody talked to Trump and what are you doing?
00:40:57.260 Um, you know, his yacht has a yacht.
00:41:00.760 Fezos' yacht has its own yacht to carry all the toys for the big yacht.
00:41:06.440 And it's reportedly where Lauren Sanchez goes off to the other yacht with her girlfriends
00:41:11.660 who don't make the main dance on the main yacht.
00:41:13.880 Like what I've heard, this is not, not, not my independent reporting, but what I've been
00:41:19.220 told is that she has her girlfriends, like the Kardashian types who ride along on the
00:41:23.680 second yacht, the yacht's yacht.
00:41:25.120 And that's how she goes over and parties with them because he's got more of like the
00:41:28.580 dignitary, dignitary types on his yacht.
00:41:30.960 But then her yacht is the one that carries the helicopter for his yacht.
00:41:35.560 And I, this is the man who's referring, refusing to pay this fair wage, to do the right thing
00:41:41.720 by the drivers who are really that bread and butter of the Amazon, uh, products.
00:41:46.300 And look, it's not that I begrudge him his success, but I just think he's an American.
00:41:50.780 We made him super rich and like, why, what's the point at this point?
00:41:55.520 Does, does the second yacht need its own yacht?
00:41:57.780 Like, what's the point at this point?
00:41:59.060 Um, so that's a clear example of, you know, his, his wife or, or fiance's his wife now
00:42:06.940 or fiance didn't have, she's about to be there.
00:42:09.200 They're, they're about to get married.
00:42:10.000 So just think about this.
00:42:11.840 You're, you're, you're better half.
00:42:13.600 You're a significant other buys you a separate yacht because he's embarrassed by the, your
00:42:19.880 friends who he doesn't want to call mingling with the dignitaries.
00:42:23.560 I mean, that should, that should send a signal up right away.
00:42:26.020 I mean, um, is he, is he worried about like another version of a ditty party or something?
00:42:31.640 I don't know.
00:42:32.280 Yeah, I don't know, but it's, they definitely, their yacht definitely has a yacht.
00:42:36.420 And, um, I have heard stories about her going, her friends being relegated to the yacht too.
00:42:41.400 She is being honored.
00:42:42.640 What does that tell you?
00:42:42.980 Like I stand by my friends.
00:42:44.240 I grew up in a neighborhood and I, my friends come from, I always tell people, my friends
00:42:49.100 are cops, robbers and clergy.
00:42:50.600 Okay.
00:42:51.460 And whether they're good, they're bad or indifferent, they're still my friends.
00:42:55.720 I grew up with them loyalty.
00:42:57.180 I mean, what does that tell you about someone if they're not standing up for their friends
00:43:00.120 because they might not be good enough or not come from the same class?
00:43:03.260 Just think about how he looks at his workers who go to work every single day for him to
00:43:07.980 make them the success.
00:43:09.320 You think he's looking at them any differently than he's looking at his wife's friends where
00:43:12.600 he exile him to, uh, to Gilligan's Island while he's, you know, somewhere else.
00:43:17.820 Yeah.
00:43:18.320 Well, I'd love to get to the bottom of whether that's true and why exactly he's doing it,
00:43:22.540 but I do know his yacht has a yacht.
00:43:24.000 I hope.
00:43:24.500 No, his yacht definitely does.
00:43:25.600 It does.
00:43:26.020 Yeah.
00:43:26.300 And it carries his helicopter cause he can't be bothered to actually just like take the
00:43:30.380 dinghy out to the yacht.
00:43:31.360 That's for losers who have to do that.
00:43:33.420 Um, his soon to be wife is being honored at the con film festival.
00:43:38.720 This is just a little news of the day.
00:43:40.080 Um, she's going to receive the global gift women empowerment award for her commitment
00:43:45.880 to climate justice with the Bezos earth fund and social justice with this is about humanity
00:43:53.420 and organization dedicated to reuniting families separated at the U S Mexico border.
00:43:57.240 So they're honoring her to get her, I guess, to the con film festival.
00:44:02.300 I got a better, bad idea.
00:44:04.460 Catchy phrase, right?
00:44:06.040 Have her go work.
00:44:07.000 If she, if she's so concerned about social justice, have her go work in one of her husband's
00:44:12.560 facilities and see the exploitation of American workers, see the social injustices that are
00:44:19.100 happening in that workplace every day.
00:44:20.620 And then maybe she can take credit for an award that she clearly is not, uh, she clearly shouldn't
00:44:27.540 be getting.
00:44:28.440 It's a great idea.
00:44:29.420 Let me ask you about this.
00:44:30.240 Cause I grew up in a middle-class family and, um, now I have money and I'm living in a
00:44:36.380 sort of fancy community.
00:44:39.380 And I look around at everybody here.
00:44:41.160 Like they want their kids to get an internship with the U S Senate or like with some, with
00:44:45.500 JP Morgan or something like that.
00:44:47.480 Right.
00:44:47.640 That's what they want.
00:44:48.160 Even in high school, even in high school, Sean, I don't want that.
00:44:51.040 My, my oldest, who's really the only one who can work.
00:44:54.280 He was a bus boy last summer, which I loved.
00:44:57.040 And my daughter's going to be a bus girl this summer.
00:44:59.540 But I really, I was talking to my husband about this.
00:45:02.360 Like, what do you think?
00:45:04.120 What's the Sean O'Brien plan for actually making sure, you know, kids like ours learn
00:45:11.160 what they need to learn in the summers.
00:45:12.740 Like I'd love to see him go be with the teamsters for a summer.
00:45:15.280 Like what would be the Sean O'Brien perfect summer education program for four years?
00:45:19.840 Like, what would you have the kids doing?
00:45:21.660 Oh, I have my youngest.
00:45:23.200 Uh, I had my youngest.
00:45:24.340 He's a, uh, sophomore Suffolk university plays hockey.
00:45:27.600 And, you know, I have two kids, one's 24 and one's 21 great kids.
00:45:32.020 Um, but again, like you, I grew up, I, I, I didn't grow up upper middle class or middle
00:45:36.400 class.
00:45:36.800 We were just beneath it.
00:45:38.140 Um, but you know, we always want more for our kids.
00:45:41.060 So we work that much harder, provide more for them.
00:45:43.680 Um, but one thing that they needed to understand that there's a work ethic.
00:45:47.300 No one gives you anything.
00:45:48.240 No one gives you a home.
00:45:49.200 No one gives you a spending money.
00:45:51.060 You got to go out and earn it.
00:45:51.940 So my oldest is a plumber.
00:45:53.840 He's in the plumbers union.
00:45:55.100 Um, you know, he works, uh, he finishes a program.
00:45:57.600 He's 24 years old.
00:45:59.500 And then I got my youngest who I always say, like, he's thinks he's a Kardashian.
00:46:04.320 You know, he wants Lululemon.
00:46:05.440 He's a hockey player, typical hockey player, you know, wants to do a very enormous, but
00:46:09.600 Oh yeah.
00:46:10.720 He's got a big ass and a big attitude to go with it.
00:46:13.940 And, um, but you know, my point is I made him work in the union, uh, at a, at a cement
00:46:18.640 company, uh, ready mix company.
00:46:20.200 Um, just, I want to, this is, this is, this is where you come from.
00:46:24.240 You know, if you, if you want to do better in life, get an education, not that you're
00:46:27.880 going to do better, but if you want an easier job, that's less taxing on your body, uh, you
00:46:33.140 got to get to know the people that gave you the ability to enjoy your life that you have
00:46:36.840 right now.
00:46:37.180 These two paying members.
00:46:38.320 And so I think, look, hard labor is great for kids in college.
00:46:42.440 Look, we've got tremendous amount of jobs throughout the United States where when I started out,
00:46:47.440 I got a full scholarship to play football.
00:46:49.360 Um, the summer before I went, um, to, to play, I was in the union.
00:46:54.080 I was throwing rubbish on the back of a truck, um, in the city of Boston.
00:46:57.960 And I learned a good work ethic, but I was around people that I grew up around the dinner
00:47:02.280 table with hardworking people that were out there providing opportunity for their family.
00:47:05.720 And there's nothing wrong with going to work every single day, providing that opportunity,
00:47:09.200 but you know, you can't forget where you come from.
00:47:11.960 So your children busing tables, they're going to learn to respect people.
00:47:15.480 They're going to learn to respect the people they work with.
00:47:18.380 And hopefully when they rise up through the ranks and become successful and they're getting
00:47:21.900 weighted on that, they'll take into consideration the trials and tribulations they went through
00:47:26.480 and obviously embrace and respect the people that are serving them.
00:47:31.200 There's no better people in this world than people that are providing services,
00:47:35.480 whether it's in restaurants or whatever it is.
00:47:37.520 And I got to tell you, I've always told my kids, uh, you always respect the people that
00:47:42.840 are serving, that are serving you in restaurants because they are trying to make ends meet.
00:47:46.360 Some of those folks are working three and four jobs.
00:47:48.700 And, you know, but to your point, you want your son to go to work.
00:47:51.940 Let us know if you live in Connecticut, we'll put them on the back of a rubbish truck.
00:47:54.980 We'll put them in a liquor distributor, whatever you want.
00:47:57.260 And by the way, they get, they'll get two educations because you know, it's funny.
00:48:01.280 My son's like, dad, does everybody hate their wives?
00:48:03.900 I'm like, no, not really.
00:48:05.180 But you know, it's just, I go, it's like a locker room.
00:48:07.240 People say a lot of shit that they really wouldn't have the balls to stay in front of
00:48:10.000 their significant others.
00:48:11.040 So just let it go.
00:48:12.020 It's just, it's just workplace jargon.
00:48:13.740 I think our son would love that because he, the, the biggest thing he learned about being
00:48:17.940 a bus boy last summer was you get covered in quote garbage juice, which is not a pleasant
00:48:22.760 experience, but, but it's one from which one learns.
00:48:25.000 I've got to ask you about this.
00:48:26.520 You're the perfect person to ask about this because we're talking about these enormously
00:48:29.680 privileged people who don't care.
00:48:31.340 They, they lost touch with where they came from and how important it is not to do that.
00:48:35.920 Please let me play for you this Michelle Obama soundbite and get you to react.
00:48:40.100 It's driving me insane.
00:48:41.500 It's projecting that if you win, which I thought he could and should, he would be somebody that
00:48:48.260 I would want as my president.
00:48:50.420 It was all about, this is going to, you know, our kids are little, we're going to have to
00:48:55.740 move.
00:48:56.600 How do you raise kids in the White House?
00:48:59.300 It's dangerous.
00:49:00.760 As the first Black potential president, we knew there'd be death threats.
00:49:06.120 There was just all the, how would we afford it?
00:49:08.360 Because it's, it's expensive to live in the White House.
00:49:11.700 There's many people don't know.
00:49:14.060 I mean, much is not covered.
00:49:16.200 You're paying for every food, every bit of food that you eat.
00:49:19.880 You, you know, you're not paying for housing and the staff in it, but everything, even travel.
00:49:24.740 If you're not traveling with the president, if your kids are coming on a Bright Star, which
00:49:29.340 is the first lady's plane, we had to pay for their travel to be on the plane.
00:49:34.340 It is an expensive proposition and you're running for two years and not earning an income.
00:49:41.220 Single tier?
00:49:42.840 What do you make of it?
00:49:44.480 I mean, I make, that's what every single parent and family does.
00:49:49.540 They pay for their own food.
00:49:50.920 They pay for their housing.
00:49:52.400 They pay for their travel for vacation.
00:49:55.080 I mean, are you shitting me?
00:49:56.260 Isn't it unbelievable?
00:49:59.540 They, these people could just get out of touch, right?
00:50:01.560 Like the Obamas now, they have hundreds of millions, if not a billion dollars by this
00:50:05.140 point.
00:50:05.600 They, and that happens.
00:50:07.100 We don't begrudge people their success in America.
00:50:08.660 Talk about when you lose touch with how real people live, and especially if you're in
00:50:14.000 power, it's dangerous.
00:50:15.880 I'll give you the last word, my friend.
00:50:17.380 Well, you know, it's funny.
00:50:18.120 I mean, talk about security at the White House.
00:50:21.020 You can't ask for a better security than having your kids grow up in the White House.
00:50:24.900 I mean, really?
00:50:26.360 Yeah.
00:50:26.860 I mean, it's just crazy.
00:50:27.620 But look, the reality, the reality of this world is, you know, I think we've got a great
00:50:31.040 opportunity right now to reset the American culture, create opportunity for American workers,
00:50:38.820 and create the ability to have respectful dialogue without all this hatred and venom.
00:50:44.960 And all these people that are spewing all this bullshit, whether you're from the far
00:50:48.520 left or the far right, need to take a step back and stop being an individual and do what's
00:50:53.940 best for this country.
00:50:55.840 Right on.
00:50:56.880 It's a real pleasure to meet you.
00:50:59.120 Thank you so much for being here.
00:51:00.260 Well, I appreciate you.
00:51:01.680 I'm a huge fan, and I'm a subscriber as well.
00:51:06.320 Oh, you're the best.
00:51:07.500 All right.
00:51:07.780 Well, I'm going to be shipping my son off to you soon, so I'm glad we bonded.
00:51:12.120 This was not the purpose of the visit, but I'm pleased as punch to know you.
00:51:15.620 Come back soon.
00:51:16.280 All the best, Sean O'Brien.
00:51:16.920 Uncle Sean will take care of him.
00:51:19.400 Okay, good.
00:51:20.320 Good.
00:51:20.680 And I think you're an Irish Catholic just like me, so we got to get those values in.
00:51:23.500 We got to get them in young.
00:51:24.840 See you soon, Sean.
00:51:25.880 All the best.
00:51:26.440 We'll be right back with The Real Clear Politics, guys.
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00:53:05.720 We're getting to the news now with our friends from the Real Clear Politics podcast.
00:53:13.700 Tom Bevan, who is co-founder and president of Real Clear Politics.
00:53:17.700 Carl Cannon, who is the Washington Bureau Chief for Real Clear.
00:53:20.980 And Andrew Walworth, the Chief Content Officer for Real Clear Politics.
00:53:25.040 They're also on SiriusXM.
00:53:27.900 Guys, welcome back.
00:53:28.800 Great to have you.
00:53:30.200 Thanks.
00:53:30.500 Okay, so what's happening right now in Washington is a big and important argument at the U.S.
00:53:39.480 Supreme Court.
00:53:40.900 And it's undergirding the argument is whether Trump has the right to end birthright citizenship.
00:53:48.520 But it's not really what's coming up today.
00:53:50.860 What's really being argued is can federal district courts issue nationwide injunctions as opposed to an injunction that just affects the litigants in front of them or perhaps even the people who are in the jurisdiction of said federal district court, but not something that would stop a presidential executive order or a congressional law from proceeding coast to coast.
00:54:14.940 Is that too much power that was never envisioned or intended for federal district court judges?
00:54:20.500 So I've been on the air for most of this time, so I haven't been following what's happened since then.
00:54:25.480 But what I'm hearing is that there's a shot, which I think is actually quite good news for Donald Trump, that there's a shot of stopping the nationwide injunction thing would be big.
00:54:38.220 If Trump can get five justices to say that, he can restart his agenda, which has been held up by these nationwide injunctions.
00:54:46.720 I'll play you a couple of soundbites and just listen to, I'll just frame the basic debate.
00:54:51.660 You're going to hear in some of these soundbites of them discussing Rule 23, which governs when a class action can be filed.
00:54:57.860 And what Trump's lawyer is arguing is basically that, his name is John Sauer.
00:55:03.860 Or you'll hear him in these soundbites, he has like a scratchy voice.
00:55:07.960 He's trying to say on behalf of Trump, if you're going to get a nationwide injunction, you have to file a class action.
00:55:14.320 You have to say, I'm here to represent everybody, everybody who's in this affected class of like people who no longer will have birthright citizenship.
00:55:22.300 And then only the U.S. Supreme Court would be able to issue such an injunction for you.
00:55:27.540 And the other side is saying, no, there's nothing wrong with nationwide injunctions.
00:55:33.260 And at best, at best, you could say maybe they could only be limited, used in certain small limited circumstances.
00:55:41.860 So you hear Rule 23, they're talking about class actions.
00:55:44.400 Let's take a listen to a little bit of how here in this one, Sonia Sotomayor might be the dumbest one.
00:55:51.220 I don't know.
00:55:51.840 I'm sorry, but she's like, it's tight.
00:55:53.860 I think she's my number one favorite for dumbest.
00:55:57.120 She's questioning Sauer.
00:55:59.180 That's Trump's guy, Solicitor General.
00:56:00.920 And you'll hear she tries to interrupt him.
00:56:06.840 And John Roberts, the chief justice, isn't happy.
00:56:10.400 Listen.
00:56:10.540 Both the Supreme Court and no lower court can stop an executive from, universally, from violating that holding, those holdings by this court.
00:56:25.240 We are not claiming that because we're conceding that there could be an inappropriate case.
00:56:29.280 Only a class, only by a class.
00:56:30.740 Can I hear the rest of his answer?
00:56:32.920 A Rule 23 class action.
00:56:35.060 And then the more fundamental point as to all those Supreme Court decisions you referred to.
00:56:38.420 So what do we do temporarily?
00:56:41.500 Temporarily, the court may issue, the lower courts may issue injunctions that remediate the injuries to the plaintiffs that appear before them.
00:56:50.120 He's saying issue injunctions that apply only to the litigants in front of you.
00:56:54.460 But that's a good sign for Trump that John Roberts wanted to hear him out because he's kind of wishy-washy, as people know.
00:57:02.420 And what Jonathan Turley tweeted out this morning is that, from what he heard, Justices Thomas, Alito, and Kavanaugh seem strongly in favor of the administration.
00:57:11.660 Roberts also made repeated points that seemed to support some of the arguments of the administration, though it was not clear how he would vote.
00:57:17.740 So on the left, you've got, of course, Kagan and Sotomayor and Ketanji Brown-Jackson.
00:57:23.820 And the fight is over Gorsuch and Barrett, two Trump-appointed judges.
00:57:28.380 Gorsuch has previously expressed criticism of universal injunctions, but asked probing questions on both sides.
00:57:33.820 Barrett seemed more accommodating and seeking a way to uphold universal injunctions.
00:57:38.080 In other words, Turley writes, this could be a nail-biter.
00:57:41.560 But a nail-biter, again, I think for Trump, is maybe better, Tom, than Trump, well, maybe not Trump himself, but his top legal advisors would have expected.
00:57:52.180 I agree with that.
00:57:53.860 And, you know, Clarence Thomas had said during these hearings that the country got along just fine without nationwide injunctions until 1960.
00:58:02.720 These are a relatively new phenomenon, and they've happened a lot more since Trump took office in 2016, 2017.
00:58:11.300 And I think some of the numbers on that is I think something like 75 percent of the national injunctions have been against Donald Trump just in the last 10 years.
00:58:19.860 So this is a problem that has cropped up recently that is now being dealt with.
00:58:25.340 And I agree with you.
00:58:26.160 I think the way this has gone so far, it looks decent for Trump, but it probably is going to be pretty close.
00:58:33.860 Here's that sound in Sot 31 from Justice Thomas.
00:58:38.740 General, when were the first universal injunctions used?
00:58:45.520 We believe that the best reading of that is what you said in Trump against Hawaii, which is that Wurtz in 1963 was really the first universal injunction.
00:58:54.900 There's a dispute about Perkins against Lukens Oil going back to 1940.
00:58:58.840 And, of course, we point to the court's opinion that reversed that universal injunction issued by the D.C. Circuit and said it's profoundly wrong.
00:59:06.260 So when the court has considered it and addressed this, it has consistently said you have to limit the remedy to the plaintiffs who are appearing in court and complaining of that remedy.
00:59:13.360 So we survived until the 1960s without universal injunctions.
00:59:18.460 That's exactly correct.
00:59:19.340 And, in fact, those are very limited, very rare, even in the 1960s.
00:59:22.840 It really exploded in 2007 in our cert petition in Summers Against Earth Island Institute.
00:59:28.160 We pointed out that the Ninth Circuit had started doing this in a whole bunch of cases involving environmental claims.
00:59:33.700 What do you make of it, Carl Cannon?
00:59:35.700 Because even though I don't like what's happening to the Trump agenda, I've got to be honest,
00:59:39.640 I really loved that nationwide injunction stopping Joe Biden's revisions of Title IX and sat on this set and cheered it.
00:59:48.460 However, that was a different story.
00:59:50.180 We didn't have these ubiquitous courts issuing them to stop an entire presidential agenda.
00:59:55.460 So what are your thoughts, Carl?
00:59:56.760 Well, Elena Kagan said an interesting thing.
00:59:58.800 I was listening to the oral arguments.
01:00:00.260 You can't watch it, but you can listen, right, on C-SPAN.
01:00:03.080 And she said, well, she said, well, this executive order, and she's talking about Trump rescinding birthright citizenship.
01:00:11.080 She said, it's just wrong.
01:00:11.920 It's unconstitutional.
01:00:12.760 She sort of said it like she thought the other justices would agree with it.
01:00:16.600 That's an obvious thing.
01:00:18.240 And then she said, so what's our remedy?
01:00:19.960 So what she's trying to do is remind the judges, is to remind her colleagues, probably the two you mentioned, Megan,
01:00:26.680 what this is not just about, it's not a law school exercise.
01:00:29.660 It's just not about all these, you know, Democratic judges around the country doing various things to thwart Trump.
01:00:35.820 It's about this case, birthright citizenship.
01:00:38.780 And what else can the court, what else can these courts do, but just issue an injunction?
01:00:43.780 So she was trying to get them back on what she thinks is a safer ground for the liberal bloc,
01:00:50.500 which is this birthright citizen question and away from what we're talking about.
01:00:54.840 They're definitely not going to go there.
01:00:56.220 I mean, you know this as well as I do, Andrew, that the Supreme Court likes to decide things as narrowly as possible.
01:01:03.300 And there's no way they're just going to like be like, oh, and also let's take on birthright citizenship while we're all here.
01:01:08.680 Yeah, I think I think what's interesting about this to me is also the fact that this is really very important for the for progressives,
01:01:18.620 because this is sort of one of the last levers they have left is these courts that they have no control in the hill.
01:01:26.220 And, you know, the party's in disarray.
01:01:27.980 So they've really relied on the courts to sort of do their do what they want.
01:01:32.000 And as you pointed out, this is not just a Trump.
01:01:35.100 Trump isn't the first president, I'll put it this way, who doesn't like presidential doesn't like these injunctions.
01:01:39.980 So it's not just like this sort of every executive doesn't like the fact that anybody messes with what they're trying to do, let alone sort of local courts.
01:01:49.980 So it is being framed narrowly, as you say, about this sort of what seems like a procedural question.
01:02:00.660 And it'll be interesting to see when they get to the substance of it, if they ever do get to the substance of it, how they rule,
01:02:05.740 because that's a that's a constitutional case that I think would be a lot harder for the president to make.
01:02:09.760 Oh, yeah. And that one will get there, too. That's that's going to wind its way up.
01:02:13.220 I mean, these these cases are those cases that will come back after they get litigated on the merits to the Supreme Court.
01:02:20.580 But they have to get past this first thing about whether the injunctions that were issued in stopping Trump's executive order saying no more birthright citizenship can stand.
01:02:30.120 So these are the cases that will put that substantive challenge in front of the Supreme Court at some point next year, probably.
01:02:36.900 But they're not there yet. OK, so that's an interesting point.
01:02:40.700 I just want to before we leave this time. Andrew's not wrong.
01:02:43.780 This is this is resistant to point oh, this is what the lawfare and how they've been doing it.
01:02:48.740 I mean, through left wing judges who are they pick selectively, they file in exactly the jurisdictions they know they're going to do well in like D.C.
01:02:57.660 And if the nationwide injunction thing is lifted, that is a massive loss for the Democrats.
01:03:03.640 Two point oh resistance. Oh, absolutely. There's no question.
01:03:07.500 I mean, and you made a really important point there, which is part of how this has gone is that they're shopping.
01:03:13.680 They're judge shopping. Right. The Democrats and the progressives, they go around and they find judges who they know are sympathetic.
01:03:18.740 To their cases. And so that's part of it. And the argument is that the administration is making is, look, you know, these judges can only issue injunctions for the people who come before them.
01:03:29.660 They can't make these blanket statements nationwide. And and that would also curtail this effort that the way the Democrats have have found to effectively use the courts to thwart Trump's agenda nationally.
01:03:43.160 And so it is a very important case. It's going to be a very important ruling in that respect.
01:03:49.660 I can't wait to find out what they think. And thankfully, since they're hearing it so late in the term, we won't have long to wait.
01:03:55.460 You know, we will get this decision before they take off.
01:03:58.460 Usually they go all of June and a couple of days into July of history's any indication.
01:04:03.620 OK, let's let's turn the page to the book that everybody's been talking about.
01:04:08.480 I heard you guys talk about it on your show, which I love, by the way.
01:04:10.920 I love the Real Clear Politics podcast. And it's this original sin book by Jake Tapper and Alex Thompson of Axios.
01:04:18.460 And we reported yesterday, we didn't report, but repeated a report in Politico that the guys had hired a crisis PR agent to help them because, you know, the press for them has been absolutely terrible this week.
01:04:34.240 I mean, it's just been an all out assault on them from everyone who's in the independent media or right of the independent media.
01:04:41.140 Guys like you, us, everybody, you're not like right wing, you're independent because we all saw Biden's infirmity and we all discussed it for years, for years prior to when these guys are acknowledging it was an issue.
01:04:55.740 I mean, like we it's not a cover up if half the country, all the country knew and half the press reported it.
01:05:02.920 What really just needs to be examined is why did the other half not report it?
01:05:06.140 Because half the this isn't like, you know, a cover up like Watergate style where people didn't know that they were bugging the offices like here.
01:05:13.760 We knew we knew we knew it's just such a weird thing to claim cover up.
01:05:16.780 OK, but I believe Tapper's PR crisis PR person has gotten to him on maybe how to massage the message around his participation in the cover up or at least absolute lack of curiosity around the issue.
01:05:33.420 And here's the new message in SOT6.
01:05:37.760 I think some of the criticism is fair, to be honest, of me.
01:05:42.760 Certainly, I'm not going to speak for anybody else.
01:05:44.780 But knowing then what I know now, I look back at my coverage during the Biden years and I did cover some of these issues, but not enough.
01:05:54.200 I look back on it with humility.
01:05:57.940 Look, what we learned through our reporting is that starting in around 2019, 2020, there were two Bidens.
01:06:05.720 There was a Biden that was perfectly workable, serviceable, seemed fine.
01:06:09.420 And then there was a non-functioning one that couldn't come up with names of top aides that would lose his train of thought to an alarming degree.
01:06:16.480 And that non-functioning Biden reared his head increasingly over and over.
01:06:23.140 It really seemed to exacerbate and get much worse in 2023, 2024.
01:06:29.680 All right, Carl, does that get it done?
01:06:31.700 I look back on my reporting with humility.
01:06:35.700 I thought that I was struck by that and remarked about it on our podcast.
01:06:39.720 It's a nice start.
01:06:41.980 But, you know, that's a clip from CNN.
01:06:43.580 And then, Megan, you said he's gotten tough press coverage, but he's gotten really lovely press coverage on CNN.
01:06:50.140 They've been very respectful of Jake, very solicitous.
01:06:53.200 You know, he's coming here on Tuesday.
01:06:55.420 Oh, good.
01:06:56.880 Yeah, listen, you know, you want to say better late than never, but that's probably not good enough either.
01:07:02.800 There are journalists, Jake Tapper was one of them, who attacked other journalists who wrote about Biden's mental state.
01:07:11.820 But that's and what I think in the reckoning of this, we have to ask some questions.
01:07:19.420 And the basic questions are twofold.
01:07:21.500 What why did the why did the hierarchy of the Democratic Party and this cabal of White House's aides?
01:07:26.540 We're talking about dozens and dozens of people, maybe hundreds.
01:07:29.380 Think that this was OK to present the president as a person they knew that that wasn't realistic.
01:07:36.180 And the second thing is, and this is what you're getting to, Megan.
01:07:39.420 Why did why did the media go along with it?
01:07:41.620 How do they how they rationalize so much of the media?
01:07:44.540 How do they rationalize it to themselves?
01:07:46.280 You know, and what and what are they going to do better going forward?
01:07:49.620 The Wall Street Journal wrote before that debate a story about Joe Biden's diminished capacity was attacked from like the paper was attacked from the white podium by the White House press secretary.
01:08:01.040 You remember this, Megan. And we've talked about on our show.
01:08:05.300 Well, what are they saying about that now?
01:08:07.720 And they ought to be they ought to be required to answer this on the record.
01:08:12.080 And, you know, a woman on CBS thing is that didn't even hit until was it April?
01:08:17.860 It was April of twenty twenty four.
01:08:20.620 Like very late in the game.
01:08:22.960 Well, it was like they were very late to the party.
01:08:27.100 That's right. But at least but it was before the debate.
01:08:29.160 It was June. You know, that's right.
01:08:31.140 It was June. And all these questions.
01:08:32.980 But earlier in June, the debate was also June.
01:08:34.920 All these questions afterwards.
01:08:37.120 Kamala Harris was never asked even after President Biden pulled out of the race and wasn't running.
01:08:42.220 She was never asked the question.
01:08:43.360 And we the three of us would scratch our heads because the question you want to ask her is,
01:08:47.420 Madam Vice President, are you really telling the American people that you saw something on June 27th that you had never seen before?
01:08:55.600 And this was the kind. So this this cover up existed, continued even after President Biden pulled out of the campaign.
01:09:04.880 Well, and on that front. So, Andrew, what's your verdict?
01:09:07.280 Because we've been kind of debating on this show all week.
01:09:09.460 So so given that, are we in favor of these books or no, because they're too stomach turningly hypocritical?
01:09:19.240 Well, I'll tell you one thing.
01:09:21.100 There is one person at least who is very happy with this week's coverage, and that's the publisher of Jake Tapper's book, because this publicity has been great.
01:09:30.000 This is the third book, I think, that's come out just in the last 30 days or so about this topic.
01:09:36.700 And it's the one that's getting the most coverage.
01:09:39.940 Part of that is because Jake Tapper wrote it and he's so prominent and well known.
01:09:45.100 And because of this sort of strange because he's on television, I think, in part, there's a lot of focus on his personal coverage.
01:09:53.960 There's this great clip of him talking to Laura Trump on CNN, where Laura Trump is.
01:09:59.840 We have it, Andrew. Let me show it. And then you pick it up on the back end.
01:10:03.280 Yeah, here it is.
01:10:04.880 Every time he comes on stage or they turn to him, I'm like, Joe, can you get it out?
01:10:08.960 Let's get the words out, Joe. You kind of feel bad for him.
01:10:12.240 How do you think it makes little kids with stutters feel when they see you make a comment like that?
01:10:17.040 First and foremost, I had no idea that Joe Biden ever suffered from a stutter.
01:10:24.580 I think what we see on stage with Joe Biden, Jake, is very clearly a cognitive decline.
01:10:30.220 That's what I'm referring to. It makes me uncomfortable to watch somebody on stage search for questions.
01:10:35.980 It's so amazing to me.
01:10:37.420 And try and figure out an answer.
01:10:39.560 A cognitive decline.
01:10:40.180 But when you're trying to tell me that what I was suggesting was a stuttering, I had no idea, Joe Biden.
01:10:45.460 Yeah, I think you were mocking his stutter. And I think you have absolutely no standing to diagnose somebody's cognitive decline.
01:10:52.480 Go ahead, Andrew.
01:10:53.780 Well, yeah, that's the clip that he can't live down, I think.
01:10:58.720 So I like these books. I plan to read all of them.
01:11:04.540 And Jake's comes out, I think, later this week.
01:11:09.440 It hits Tuesday.
01:11:10.580 Yeah, but I'm glad you're going to be talking to him because I do think he's got some explaining to do.
01:11:14.640 I think it's a problem, too, if you step back from it.
01:11:18.720 And we're going to talk about this on our podcast.
01:11:20.880 There's a problem for all those politicians who are very close to Biden during this period, the Democrats.
01:11:27.480 I mean, if you're Pete Buttigieg and you're in the cabinet, how do you explain, you know, that you want to be president?
01:11:33.980 This is a story that's going to sort of dog him.
01:11:36.700 It's going to dog Kamala Harris.
01:11:38.100 Not so much if you're a governor running from the outside.
01:11:43.140 But I think this is going to be sort of a litmus test.
01:11:46.360 And I think that the, you know, presidential primaries are pretty nasty.
01:11:52.040 And I think the Democrats are going to go after one another on this very topic.
01:11:55.440 And I think if you're inside the cabinet or close to the president, you might have some real, you know, answering to do.
01:12:02.880 And people will use that against them.
01:12:05.300 We've seen a cascade, Tom, of Democrats saying yesterday, just yesterday, Chuck Schumer, moving forward, moving forward.
01:12:12.900 That was how he tried to handle this.
01:12:14.540 These tough questions.
01:12:15.660 There have been at least two other Democrats on camera.
01:12:17.460 Somebody did a mashup of them online.
01:12:19.580 Moving forward, not looking backward.
01:12:21.440 This is apparently a strategy they think is going to work.
01:12:25.180 And then here was Colorado Democrat Senator Michael Bennett on the Mark Halperin Next Up podcast, which is part of our MK Media Network, in a very awkward exchange on Wednesday.
01:12:37.580 Watch this.
01:12:38.940 He had gotten to a point, I wouldn't say of mental decline, but of decline that put him in a position of not being able to wage a vigorous campaign against Donald Trump.
01:12:51.120 And there's no way you can beat Donald Trump unless you can wage a vigorous campaign.
01:12:56.320 And he couldn't do it.
01:12:57.760 Why wouldn't you say mental decline?
01:13:00.240 Did you not see that publicly?
01:13:02.260 I didn't see.
01:13:03.160 Well, look, when the first thing that I really saw, other than one visit to the White House on an immigration matter, there was about, I think, six weeks before this, was when I saw his debate with Donald Trump.
01:13:17.660 And I think I was the first Democrat to publicly say on network television that we were going to lose in a lance fight if he stayed at the top of the ticket.
01:13:28.160 But let me ask you about that, because that's a common answer.
01:13:31.080 He once addressed a dead congresswoman at an event meant to honor her as if she were there.
01:13:36.140 He was sequestered from the media, talked to the media far less often, even in 2020, including 2024.
01:13:42.720 I don't think you need it to see anything secret or private or that debate to see mental decline.
01:13:49.360 Do you not agree with that?
01:13:50.980 Well, I think that, again, I have not made a personal assessment.
01:13:56.920 Oh, Tom, oh, secondhand embarrassment.
01:14:02.920 I mean, there are just so many, so many things about this that require more investigation.
01:14:07.860 And I hope you play that clip for Jake Tapper and have him respond to it.
01:14:12.140 And there were other instances.
01:14:13.620 Look, when her report came out, you know, Democrats and folks in the media, they had people on to rebut that, that Wall Street Journal piece that you talked about.
01:14:23.520 Did anyone have those Wall Street Journal reporters on their shows or did they just have the surrogates for Biden come on to say, oh, this is, you know, wave it away.
01:14:31.920 And remember, I mean, this is, you mentioned this, the public knew early on that polling on this was pretty, pretty clear that that people were concerned about his age and his mental decline.
01:14:42.280 And we all knew it. And so and remember, up until if that debate had not happened or if Joe Biden had not had a bad debate that night, this whole charade would have continued all the way through Election Day.
01:14:55.020 I mean, Democrats, you know, the staffers would have kept lying.
01:14:58.360 The media would have kept reporting it and saying, oh, he's fine.
01:15:00.820 But we know now that he wasn't fine for a long time.
01:15:05.020 And oh, by the way, he stayed in the job as president of the United States for six more months.
01:15:10.380 And they're trying to argue now that, well, he was just, you know, yeah, he had some mental decline, but but he was really effective at doing the job.
01:15:17.180 And I mentioned this the other day. I mean, that just is total BS.
01:15:19.800 There's no way that you can cordon off and say, well, you know, he he had these mental decline issues, but, you know, he was on top of the job when he was doing, you know, taking three a.m. phone calls on matters of national security.
01:15:30.620 I mean, just it doesn't even pass the smell test.
01:15:32.440 So, look, there's a lot that and I know it's fine for Jake Tapper to say he's been humbled and he's going to approach this with humility.
01:15:39.940 But I just have no confidence that him or the media writ large would not do this exactly again or wouldn't, as I said, wouldn't have continued it had that debate not happened.
01:15:51.940 There are now questions being raised about whether the antidotes in the book have been tested enough.
01:15:59.400 And this is an interesting twist to the story for me, because I what I sense as a possibility, I'll ask them about it when they're here on Tuesday, is perhaps in the zeal to now be the ones on the left to own the story, like to try to be first on the left.
01:16:17.840 At least they're not, as we discussed, nowhere near first writ large.
01:16:24.680 Did they put things in the book that they should have tested more strenuously?
01:16:31.620 And the reason I'm asking this is because this guy named Rufus Gifford, who's the finance chair he was for the Biden campaign, went on.
01:16:40.820 Here's our friend Mark again. Mark Halpern's everywhere interviewing this guy, Rufus, and watch what happened.
01:16:50.580 Were you at the famous George Clooney fundraiser?
01:16:53.460 I was. And I was I was one of the eight people in the room when this moment happened.
01:16:58.120 So do you think it's in the room?
01:17:00.000 Do you think it's true that he didn't recognize George Clooney?
01:17:02.120 No, is the answer to the question. And I mean, it's like an absurd thing.
01:17:07.940 Hold on. I just want to clarify something. You were there and you were standing right there.
01:17:12.140 You weren't over on the side of the room. And you can say without fear of any contradiction.
01:17:16.240 And you remember clearly the president did not not know. He knew who George Clooney was.
01:17:21.280 It was it's like not knowing someone who someone is in the photo line. You're introduced to them.
01:17:25.860 So you're saying, Mr. President, George, this is your host, George Clooney and Julia Roberts.
01:17:30.000 And you heard the person say that. Yeah, yeah. He's an advanced guy.
01:17:33.680 Yeah, that's what happens. So so so you're saying there was no opportunity for the president not to recognize George Clooney.
01:17:38.400 That's right. I mean, so George might have thought he didn't know who he was.
01:17:41.280 But I mean, it just that moment didn't exist.
01:17:44.980 And what Rufus also said, you guys, was he he'd bet dollars to donuts that their source was George Clooney and that this this the implication was that this is a matter of hubris on his part or inflation of how bad it was.
01:17:59.400 Now that he's kind of leaning into being the one who spoke truth to power and journalists on the receiving end of that are supposed to kick those tires and look for secondary sources and get people to go on the record so that they can go back and test these things.
01:18:12.180 Right. And none of that that wasn't done here. This book is mostly anonymous sources, Carl.
01:18:16.160 Well, that's why you want for real history to have name sources.
01:18:21.000 And then you want to talk to, you know, if you're doing a real history of this and not a quick book and I'm not trying to criticize these guys, they're they're not really writing history.
01:18:29.340 They're writing the kind of the first draft of this revisionism.
01:18:34.140 You talk to everybody in the room and I don't know if George Clooney was the source or not, but but is this guy really trying to say that Biden's fine?
01:18:43.520 Because that's not I don't think people I don't think he was sustainable.
01:18:47.680 If you listen to him, he wasn't trying to say that, but he was pointing out, you know, like that can't be the excuse.
01:18:54.560 Use if this story is wrong. Right. Like that's you have to get rid of a president because he didn't recognize a movie star.
01:19:01.280 No, but I'm just saying, like, if the was the book tested, was it was was it double source?
01:19:06.580 Did they make sure in the zeal again to get this thing to print and to be the first and to be like the ones of the left who are going to speak the truth?
01:19:13.780 Did they skip some important reportorial steps?
01:19:16.980 I'll go with you to to you on it, Andrew, because like this guy says he was there.
01:19:22.040 And what the book says is Biden came in and, you know, how nice to see you.
01:19:27.580 Nice to see you. Nice to see you. And then he kind of breezed up to George.
01:19:31.480 Nice to see you. And somebody said, you know, George.
01:19:35.280 And it's like, nice to see you. And they were like, George Clooney, you know, the one of your hosts tonight.
01:19:40.660 And then he was like, oh, George. Oh, yeah.
01:19:42.720 So it's a very different story from the one we just heard from Rufus.
01:19:45.500 Yes. Well, I would guess if there were eight people in the room, you'd have eight different stories.
01:19:50.660 Well, but let me just say what one of the things what this guy is saying is that, no, it cannot be a difference of opinion,
01:19:57.000 because what literally happened, you have to listen to a longer clip, was the president was arriving and his advance team.
01:20:03.820 I don't know. I can't remember if he said it was his chief of staff or whoever was on the inside with George and Julia Roberts, like across the doorway.
01:20:10.560 And the advanced man came in with the president and said, Mr. President, you know, George Clooney and Julia Roberts, who were greeting him.
01:20:20.500 He didn't have a chance to work a rope line and say, nice to see you. Nice to see you.
01:20:24.700 Or make any like that's what this guy Rufus is alleging.
01:20:28.060 Yeah. And it sounds like a scene out of Veep, you know, like where there's always the aide who's like whispering in her ear, saying, you know, the fact about whoever she's going to meet next.
01:20:37.120 So I look, I think it has the ring of truth to it. And he's he's on the record. So you got to give him that.
01:20:42.480 I mean, he's so I don't know. I mean, who knows what really happened in the room?
01:20:48.380 I haven't read the book, so I can't really comment on.
01:20:51.540 I'm going to ask them. I'm going to ask them for sure.
01:20:53.960 Can we go back to that stutter thing for a minute? Yeah.
01:20:57.420 Do you remember this cropped up, you know, when he was in national office?
01:21:01.380 I covered this guy back in the Senate. He spoke. He'd give Fidel Castro length speech.
01:21:05.940 I once had a lunch with him and he spoke for thirty five minutes without even breathing.
01:21:10.620 I never heard this stutter thing until recently.
01:21:13.340 And then it was it was it was sort of offered up as his excuse.
01:21:16.780 And then, well, he had and he would have a cold.
01:21:19.620 They said in the debate he was still tired from an overseas trip that happened three weeks earlier.
01:21:23.960 Right. They just kept coming up with these new excuses.
01:21:27.300 And I mean, to step back a minute from that George Clooney anecdote, what you expect from a press corps is to be more skeptical and and they weren't.
01:21:35.220 And so Tapper's blowing the whistle on that. And as you point out, he's blowing the whistle himself, too.
01:21:41.200 Maybe all these vignettes aren't perfect. And I would have liked to see on the record sources.
01:21:46.160 But let's take a step back. You had a president who was compromised and a political party that decided to hide that fact and a mainstream media that went along with it.
01:21:55.760 That's the big story here. And I guess I'm glad Jake Tapper wrote this book.
01:21:59.880 And in the relative scheme of culpability, I give the media absolutely no pardon, none whatsoever.
01:22:08.060 You're like Tom. That's what Tom's been saying.
01:22:09.940 I know. This is one of the many reasons I love Tom, not to not to make any judgment about the other two parts of the podcast.
01:22:15.860 But can we just say, though, I think I think I think Alex Thompson's was a little better on his coverage than he was.
01:22:24.040 Tapper was. He was. But then he got out of the White House Correspondents Dinner and said, we missed it.
01:22:28.200 We missed the story, which is not true. But what I was going to say, Tom, is that I'm sorry, if you're assigning relative blame.
01:22:35.160 Yes, the media is right. But there's no question that the deepest, worst, most unforgivable sin was by the Biden aides and the Biden family members who actively work to cover this up.
01:22:47.980 Absolutely. I mean, there's just no question. And we don't have an understanding of exactly who was running the country, how much Biden was in charge, how much auto pen was used, what was done in his name that he knew or didn't know.
01:23:00.440 And that is a massive scandal. I mean, if you just take a step back and you look at the scope of this thing, I mean, this is the biggest scandal maybe in political history, certainly of the modern era.
01:23:09.620 I mean, nothing even comes close in my mind. And the media was part of it. I mean, again, remember, you know, that fundraiser, George Clooney comes out and that was the whole cheap fakes thing. Right.
01:23:19.540 He's standing there on stage. He has no clue where he is. Barack Obama has to grab his arm, lead him off stage.
01:23:23.720 And everybody, again, the entire country watches that and is horrified by it.
01:23:29.600 And the White House comes out, said, these are cheap fakes. This is, you know, this is a cheap fake.
01:23:33.900 And that was dutifully reported by everyone in the media, including CNN.
01:23:39.060 And so they don't get a pass in my book for any of that that happened.
01:23:44.220 But it is a there's a lot more that we need to know about exactly what happened, because I think this is just a huge scandal.
01:23:50.560 Same. All right. Let's move on to some other news.
01:23:52.420 First, we have finally had an awakening on the left, similar to the awakening on the left we just discovered and the press, too.
01:24:00.660 But I repeat myself on how refugees may not be that desirable.
01:24:05.600 People flocking to America from other countries claiming that they must because their countries are war torn or they're endangered may not.
01:24:12.500 We may not want them. It's very late in the game, but they finally discovered it because said people happen now to be white.
01:24:17.780 So it's a no. So we're taking in what what the administration is calling refugees from South Africa, white families.
01:24:28.360 Some I think it's 59 of them, 49. And the left is upset.
01:24:35.280 They're very, very upset that they haven't been vetted. This is the complaint.
01:24:38.960 They haven't been vetted. Normally you have to run this by the U.N.
01:24:41.760 We haven't we haven't run it by the U.N.
01:24:43.460 They get here. They wave American flags. They were wearing American flag T-shirts.
01:24:47.660 They all speak English.
01:24:49.600 They had to go through like this screening process to make sure they wanted to assimilate. Yes, yes, yes.
01:24:54.140 And now we get. OK.
01:25:00.320 Yeah. OK, now we get the left again, freaking out about it, upset because they're not pro racial justice or social justice.
01:25:10.080 Elon Musk tweeted out as follows. Post it, I should say.
01:25:12.200 But the South African government just said whites are cowards who are fleeing racial justice or fleeing racial justice.
01:25:20.620 But what exactly do they mean by racial justice?
01:25:23.340 And indeed, this is what the South Africans had said.
01:25:26.180 The South African president came out with the following comment.
01:25:30.740 As South Africans, we are resilient. We don't run away from our problems.
01:25:33.680 We must stay here and solve our problems.
01:25:35.580 When you run away, you're a coward.
01:25:37.580 And that's a real cowardly act, the running away.
01:25:40.040 Then they also, through their Congress, put out a statement that reads, in part,
01:25:45.120 what the instigators of this falsehood who are fleeing South Africa seek is not safety, but impunity from transformation.
01:25:51.460 They flee not from persecution, but from justice, equality and accountability for historic privilege, historic privilege.
01:26:01.160 They're taking their land away from them without paying them and just giving it to other people in South Africa who have the right skin color and with no remuneration.
01:26:12.940 And so now you have people all over CNN saying, we don't want them and the view, we don't want them because what?
01:26:22.220 You tell me, what has changed in this calculation?
01:26:24.440 Would anybody like to take a shot?
01:26:25.960 Well, I would just say that this is trolling of such a high caliber that you really have to give the administration credit.
01:26:36.300 Because as you say, they're letting in, you know, 49, 50 people.
01:26:41.120 People and the left can't help themselves.
01:26:44.660 They just go for that bait so hard and, you know, end up looking kind of silly in the view, I think, of a lot of Americans.
01:26:54.100 So, yeah, it's I view it as high level trolling.
01:26:57.960 I think it's very effective.
01:26:58.920 And you've got to give the administration credit for for for understanding the politics of this in a way that the left just doesn't.
01:27:06.120 Well, now they're upping the ante because their White House is threatening to pull out of the G20.
01:27:14.600 Trump threatened he would not attend the G20 leaders meeting in Johannesburg unless the situation is taken care of.
01:27:20.600 That summit is set to be held in November.
01:27:23.140 The U.S. is set to host the summer summit next year.
01:27:26.120 And the White House National Security Council on Wednesday ordered U.S. agencies and departments to suspend work with the group of G20 conference.
01:27:33.440 They're trying to I mean, these are all tools that the left uses to try to punish Republicans who do things or other countries who don't do things the way they want it.
01:27:41.560 So turn about fair play, Carl Cannon.
01:27:44.180 I think that I think that what Andy said is right and mild.
01:27:48.500 I don't think it's silly.
01:27:49.520 I think it's ugly.
01:27:50.540 This character attacking these people.
01:27:53.160 They they let in about 50 people or so.
01:27:56.860 So that's how many white farmers are killed every year on their own in their own houses in this this campaign to terrorize them.
01:28:06.780 And so they want to come here to be safe.
01:28:09.240 And you let in in the previous administration, four or five million people who are economic refugees, but not refugees in the sense that the law and envisions.
01:28:20.020 And these people are they're afraid for their own safety and for and there are rallies.
01:28:25.260 You can find them on YouTube of the of South African, a political party calling to kill the Boers.
01:28:30.380 That's what these Afrikaners are called.
01:28:32.140 And these are white people.
01:28:34.200 They're told some woman was on MSNBC who used to work in the bond administration say, yeah, they should go back where they came from to Germany.
01:28:42.200 Well, of course, they didn't come from Germany.
01:28:43.440 They came from Holland about 350 years ago.
01:28:47.020 Most of the Afrikaners came to South Africa, you know, 10 generations ago or something.
01:28:52.840 They came before the United States was a country.
01:28:55.260 This has been their country.
01:28:56.280 And they're being they're afraid for their safety.
01:29:00.080 Appropriating land is just one aspect of it.
01:29:02.520 Megan, their calls for them every day at rallies to be murdered.
01:29:06.780 And many of them are being murdered.
01:29:08.540 And I just I hope I hope a prominent Democrat steps forward and sort of puts an end to this because it's it's it's disgusting and vile.
01:29:17.700 Racism is always ugly, no matter who's doing it.
01:29:21.180 Here's what's amazing.
01:29:22.220 OK, you get you get a headline like this from this moronic person over at the website Mediaite.
01:29:28.280 And the headline she posts yesterday is white South African refugee in quotes brought to US by Trump says, quote, Jews are untrustworthy and dangerous.
01:29:41.100 OK, wait till she finds out how the Palestinians feel about Jews who were brought over here by President Biden in much greater numbers than forty nine or fifty one.
01:29:54.160 The numbers beat that in even just one year.
01:29:56.700 And he wanted to bring more.
01:29:58.380 He wanted to bring far more.
01:29:59.520 There was just such political blowback.
01:30:00.820 He couldn't.
01:30:01.460 I don't remember her article about how they feel about Jews because now they want to vet the people, Tom.
01:30:07.600 Now they're like we need they have been vetted.
01:30:10.020 We don't know if they're going to assimilate.
01:30:11.800 They know they may not share our values.
01:30:13.960 Should we talk about the men who came over from Muslim countries under President Obama?
01:30:17.780 Do they share our values?
01:30:18.960 Because I think most of them would put me in a burka.
01:30:22.300 Right.
01:30:22.940 And and some of the commentary on this has just been ridiculous.
01:30:25.900 I mean, they were arguing.
01:30:27.100 I think it was on CNN.
01:30:27.900 I saw a clip the other day saying, you know, that this is not that.
01:30:32.700 Sure, there's violence against these Afrikaners, but, you know, it's not genocide.
01:30:36.620 And so we could should be able to tolerate a certain level of violence or something.
01:30:39.660 I mean, it's it's ridiculous.
01:30:41.420 And I think Carl was Carl was, you know, light about four or five million extra folks who were led into the country.
01:30:49.800 I mean, I think he was just using refugees.
01:30:51.600 Right.
01:30:52.000 He was just referring to refugees.
01:30:53.420 Because I assume, Carl, because we I mean, the illegals just is at least twice, probably.
01:30:58.420 But we do.
01:30:58.960 I mean, this is all this is all, you know, again, the public looks at this and says, wait a minute.
01:31:03.000 You know, we let 10 million people in under the Biden administration.
01:31:07.500 Borders were basically thrown wide open for people.
01:31:09.960 They all claimed asylum, that they were fleeing from some sort of political violence or whatever.
01:31:14.260 We know that was not true.
01:31:15.420 And it's just a massive abuse of the system.
01:31:17.540 And yet here you have 50 folks who literally are in danger and are offered, you know, to be given asylum and refugee status.
01:31:25.880 And suddenly the Democrats are like, no, we can't we can't do that.
01:31:28.200 And it's all about race and white replacement and all this stuff.
01:31:31.880 I mean, it's just it's it's ridiculous.
01:31:33.300 And I think the public sees right through it.
01:31:36.180 All right.
01:31:36.380 Last but not least, is Trump going to have his plane from Qatar or isn't he?
01:31:43.740 Anyone?
01:31:44.140 Well, you know, how about this?
01:31:46.180 This contract with Boeing was in 2018 when he was president the first time, Megan.
01:31:51.340 I guess let's go back to first principles.
01:31:53.540 How come this iconic American company can't produce one plane in seven years?
01:31:58.680 I know.
01:31:59.360 And how are they going to deliver 160 over to the Middle East now under this new deal he just brokered?
01:32:05.740 They can't even make the two we ordered.
01:32:07.180 I look, I taking a plane, this plane as a gift is absurd.
01:32:12.420 But I kind of get Trump's frustration.
01:32:15.360 Where's the plane?
01:32:16.120 Where's the new Air Force One?
01:32:17.780 Trump's the only president in history that his plane that he was using before.
01:32:22.500 Air Force One is to step down from that plane.
01:32:25.580 But it can't withstand a nuclear blast, which Air Force One is supposed to do.
01:32:30.160 But, you know, I even heard the New York Times is the daily podcast yesterday, Andrew, no fans of President Trump talking about how the Air Force One ride is like kind of alarmingly shuddery on takeoff and landing because the planes are 30 years old.
01:32:45.760 And they're, you know, they're huge.
01:32:47.180 It probably takes a lot to make the plane able to resist, you know, a rocket propelled grenade and a nuclear bomb.
01:32:53.760 But she was saying, you know, that even she had questions about like, is this OK, you know, on takeoff and landing on the thing?
01:33:00.440 And I'm sure Trump 10 times that.
01:33:02.580 And here's Qatar with these magnificent, like fleet of planes because they're used to flying around all these, you know, Arab dignitaries saying, hey, you can have this one.
01:33:11.960 And Trump's like, yes, I just saved us 400 million bucks.
01:33:16.320 Yeah, I think I think the question is what happens to the plane?
01:33:19.460 Well, the way the way we've done done this is plane is being given to the Defense Department.
01:33:23.160 It's not being given to Trump.
01:33:24.600 That's what he says to.
01:33:25.480 Yeah.
01:33:25.780 Yeah.
01:33:26.380 So it seems to me that with all the aid that we've given everyone in the world taking a 400 million dollar plane or whatever sort of chump change.
01:33:36.520 Why not?
01:33:37.280 I have no problem with that.
01:33:38.760 Personally, the question is, then, what happens to the plane after?
01:33:42.200 The president's term is up and the idea that it's going to a library that or maybe Ivanka and Jared get it.
01:33:48.520 We haven't really heard.
01:33:49.760 Well, God, he did.
01:33:51.380 Trump did say it's going that he would not be using it.
01:33:53.940 He clarified that on the library, which is his kids.
01:33:57.120 We don't know.
01:33:57.600 That's what he says now.
01:33:58.860 Right.
01:33:59.300 Yeah.
01:33:59.640 I think, you know, I would just assume that his his the next president get the use of that plane and then president after that until Boeing gets their act together, which looks like it might be a long time.
01:34:11.100 But I don't like I don't know.
01:34:14.380 I mean, I don't love it, but I also feel like it saved us four hundred million dollars.
01:34:20.060 You know, like, I don't know.
01:34:21.760 Is it so bad if it's a gift to the United States, assuming that our Defense Department could make sure the thing is debugged?
01:34:28.500 Tom, like, is it so bad if it's if it if it's a gift to our Defense Department?
01:34:33.760 And I'm not totally sure I even care if it remains for the next president.
01:34:39.620 I'm like, I'm not really 100 percent sure whether I even care about that.
01:34:42.600 I just feel like Trump wants a better relationship with Qatar with or without this plane.
01:34:46.840 Oh, absolutely.
01:34:47.780 That's true.
01:34:48.360 And the deals he made suggest that we are now going to have that sort of more tight relationship.
01:34:54.460 But as to the plane, I mean, I'm with you.
01:34:57.100 If it stays the property of the U.S.
01:34:59.040 government and and it can be used by future administrations, I have much less of a problem with it than I do if it was somehow transferred to his library or to him or his kids or whoever.
01:35:08.460 But, you know, Hillary Clinton posted something on X the other day saying, oh, this is amazing.
01:35:14.260 Nobody gets.
01:35:14.580 Yeah, nobody gets four hundred million dollars from from Qatar without, you know, them wanting something for it.
01:35:19.400 Be serious or something.
01:35:20.460 And then people immediately posted that, you know, she had received the Clinton Foundation had received, I think, one million, maybe even four million in gifts while she was secretary of state.
01:35:29.800 Yeah.
01:35:30.960 She promised that she was going to, you know, have that looked at and it wasn't.
01:35:35.020 And so it was kind of a self-own on Clinton's part.
01:35:37.580 Look, there's the people who are talking about this being, you know, grift and graft and corruption on Trump's part, I think, are are out over their skis a little bit.
01:35:46.020 There's no indication that Donald Trump's going to do anything, you know, do Qatar's bidding because of this.
01:35:52.560 But again, you know, perception is reality.
01:35:55.500 And there's there's an appearance of of potential impropriety.
01:35:59.800 But again, if it stays, if it stays the property of the U.S.
01:36:01.760 government, I think Trump will say it can stay the property of the U.S.
01:36:05.000 government if a Republican takes over after him.
01:36:09.620 There's no way he's going to he's going to let Gavin Newsom fly around in his Qatar gifted plane.
01:36:17.120 Guys, it's a pleasure.
01:36:18.200 As always, thanks for coming on.
01:36:20.160 Thanks for having us.
01:36:21.700 All right.
01:36:22.060 We'll hear you guys later.
01:36:23.100 OK, we're going to take a quick break here.
01:36:25.420 We're going to come back with a little bit more on.
01:36:27.780 Yes, it's a daily theme.
01:36:29.920 Michelle Obama's.
01:36:31.080 I'm not kidding.
01:36:32.440 Latest rounds of fill in the blank.
01:36:34.540 You guessed it.
01:36:35.120 What does she do?
01:36:35.940 Nothing but complain.
01:36:38.080 Her latest round of complaints don't go away.
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01:39:17.000 I'm Megan Kelly, host of The Megan Kelly Show on Sirius XM.
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01:40:16.340 We're back to our daily segment of Michelle Obama's terrible, terrible life.
01:40:26.980 Boo effing who.
01:40:29.000 She went on a podcast called Diary of a CEO.
01:40:31.940 It's kind of ringing rings a bell like a founder kind of situation.
01:40:35.120 And once again, wants you to know how awful it is to be married with children.
01:40:40.440 There are just many natural reasons why marriage, infertility, trying to have kids makes things difficult.
01:40:50.960 It's like I try to tell couples, of course it's hard.
01:40:55.680 Just listen to what I said, right?
01:40:58.180 Like it's probably if you're having some issues in your marriage, it's not you.
01:41:03.900 It's the process of marriage.
01:41:06.340 It's just all hard because guess what happens when it all works out right?
01:41:10.280 You know what you end up with?
01:41:13.040 Babies.
01:41:15.480 Little people with their own sense of everything.
01:41:19.800 They mess you up.
01:41:21.280 You love them dearly, but they're a hassle.
01:41:25.580 What?
01:41:27.220 There's something wrong with this person.
01:41:28.980 Like she's seriously depressed.
01:41:30.700 She has the most negative, dark outlook on life I've ever heard from a public figure.
01:41:35.680 Certainly one who's been given so much.
01:41:38.520 Okay.
01:41:39.060 Her window into motherhood and having a child, the first thing she says, they mess you up.
01:41:46.360 They mess you up.
01:41:48.640 Maybe that's what happened to her.
01:41:50.180 Maybe she was totally delightful before the two daughters came along.
01:41:53.360 I don't know.
01:41:53.940 She clearly is not enjoying motherhood and enjoying being in a marriage.
01:41:57.240 Even less, it's not you if things get hard.
01:42:00.920 It's all hard.
01:42:02.280 It's all hard.
01:42:03.780 This is so backward.
01:42:06.180 I have news for you.
01:42:07.420 I've been married twice and I get along with my ex-husband, but I can tell you that in my
01:42:12.580 marriage to Doug, which is now in year 18, it's not hard at all.
01:42:16.820 It's totally delightful.
01:42:18.520 If you marry the right person.
01:42:20.440 And by the way, my ex-husband is happily, happily married now, too.
01:42:23.120 If you marry the right person, it's not hard.
01:42:25.140 You don't talk about it this way.
01:42:26.260 It's not to say you never have a hard spot.
01:42:27.740 But she talks about like the whole institution is a nightmare.
01:42:32.600 Poor Michelle Obama.
01:42:33.900 And then you have the babies and they mess you up.
01:42:36.660 They F up a mother.
01:42:38.020 I mean, this woman needs an intervention.
01:42:41.320 She needs our help.
01:42:42.440 And that's not all.
01:42:43.680 She can't make fun of herself.
01:42:45.560 This has been obvious for years.
01:42:47.480 She's incapable of laughing at her own expense, which is an absolutely dreadful quality in a
01:42:53.120 person like I don't think I could hire a person who works for me who doesn't have that ability.
01:42:57.840 I think it's a sign of intelligence when you can.
01:43:00.260 And it's definitely a sign that you have a strong id like you you know who you are and
01:43:05.320 you cannot be easily moved off of that by detractors or anyone else.
01:43:10.460 You have a strong moral core.
01:43:12.640 She doesn't have it.
01:43:13.760 That's why she's so thin skinned.
01:43:15.200 That's why she hates America.
01:43:16.700 That's why she's obsessed with us being a racist country.
01:43:20.580 Hates America.
01:43:21.740 That's my opinion.
01:43:22.460 Seems clear based on her many statements.
01:43:25.980 It makes perfect sense because she doesn't believe in herself.
01:43:30.320 She's got absolutely no self-confidence.
01:43:32.320 That's why she called her book Becoming.
01:43:33.840 Nobody with actual self-confidence would have to tell us how becoming she is.
01:43:37.820 It's not what you do.
01:43:40.040 And so here's a second soundbite.
01:43:41.540 This one is from Amy Poehler's podcast just a couple of days ago, May 13th, on the rules
01:43:47.440 between Michelle and Barack and also brother Craig.
01:43:51.360 What I like about you and what I feel like is your family is like teasing is your love language.
01:43:57.780 Oh, for sure.
01:43:58.600 Same.
01:43:59.100 For sure.
01:43:59.920 Can you explain how important it is to be able to tease people that you love?
01:44:03.920 Oh my God.
01:44:04.580 This is funny because both Barack and Craig will say that I don't let them tease me.
01:44:11.860 See, we have a deal, Barack and I, in our marriage.
01:44:14.340 And it started very early.
01:44:16.360 It's like, I can tease you, but you cannot tease me.
01:44:19.860 You know, so when he does, I was like, oh, oh, oh, oh, wait a minute.
01:44:25.080 What's going on here?
01:44:26.400 And he's like, I'm teasing you, right?
01:44:28.240 I was like, none of that.
01:44:29.680 Because he likes to tease.
01:44:30.980 Oh my God.
01:44:31.820 Yeah.
01:44:31.980 But when me, Malia and Sasha are, all of us are together, he doesn't stand a chance.
01:44:39.920 We mercilessly go after him.
01:44:43.400 I believe that.
01:44:44.760 I have no doubt you do because you do it publicly whenever you can.
01:44:49.320 When was the last time you said anything kind about him?
01:44:51.780 Like it's a 99 to one ratio in your public comments.
01:44:55.860 So that's their rule.
01:44:57.720 She and her daughters can tease him mercilessly.
01:45:00.180 And he is not allowed to say anything about becoming over there on the other side of the couch.
01:45:07.660 Only compliments allowed.
01:45:10.020 Only praise.
01:45:11.760 And by the way, I got a tip for you.
01:45:13.180 Pro tip, Barack.
01:45:13.940 It'll never be enough.
01:45:15.580 It'll never, it doesn't matter how much praise you heap on her.
01:45:18.200 Could, could praise everything.
01:45:19.360 Could praise these ridiculous hairstyles she's wearing.
01:45:21.720 The stegosaurus cuts that she's getting with her three bumps on the back of her head.
01:45:26.980 Or the weird little pigtails up here.
01:45:30.660 It'll never be enough.
01:45:32.420 Because she's not fill-up-able.
01:45:34.740 Because look at her extraordinary life.
01:45:36.740 Look, look where life took her.
01:45:38.260 And she's still bitter.
01:45:39.120 She's pissed.
01:45:40.140 She had to pay for the groceries in the White House.
01:45:41.520 She's pissed.
01:45:42.440 She had her own plane and so did you.
01:45:44.120 But she had to pay the equivalent of a plane ticket for her daughters when she traveled with them.
01:45:47.900 She had to buy her groceries just like literally everybody.
01:45:50.460 Literally everybody.
01:45:52.120 Including, you think of somebody like J.D. Vance's mom, Beverly, with a 10-year heroin addiction.
01:45:57.680 Nobody was paying for her groceries.
01:46:01.080 Maybe the public taxpayer paid a little.
01:46:03.380 But everybody pays for their lives, Michelle.
01:46:06.460 You're not unique in that way.
01:46:08.680 You are unique in that your husband was elected president.
01:46:11.820 You were made first lady.
01:46:12.780 You had nearly universal approval.
01:46:14.500 We put you in a 55,000 square foot mansion.
01:46:16.800 Gave you a full staff of people.
01:46:18.860 Chauffeurs, drivers, motorcades with armed guards everywhere you went.
01:46:22.840 An 18 or 19-acre estate around you with a rose garden whenever you wanted to go and stop and smell them.
01:46:27.920 But you never did.
01:46:29.560 You were too bitter having a bitter party of one.
01:46:33.800 That's your problem.
01:46:35.240 You were too busy with your bitterness.
01:46:38.260 And it's obvious to the point where you can't even have somebody take a fun pot shot at you because your thin skin can't handle it.
01:46:48.820 My next pro tip is for you, Michelle Obama, to go back into the private life you were living.
01:46:55.880 Your Like Me and Relate to Me tour is failing, as is your podcast.
01:47:01.300 And I think you benefited from the, you know, idea of like the mystery around you, the image that was curated by you and your people.
01:47:13.540 And you're suffering right now from the adage, familiarity breeds contempt.
01:47:17.960 I know I'm feeling it.
01:47:19.560 Good luck.
01:47:20.760 That's it.
01:47:21.540 That's all I have to say.
01:47:22.360 We should end the show now.
01:47:26.200 More tomorrow or soon.
01:47:28.640 I've got some thoughts on the Diddy trial.
01:47:31.300 We'll be back with that at some point very soon.
01:47:33.820 Bye.
01:47:36.960 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show.
01:47:38.840 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.