The Megyn Kelly Show - Trump's Miraculous and Historic Hostage Deal, with Batya Ungar-Sargon, and Cheryl Hines on Smears of RFK Jr.

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00:01:00.000 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east.

00:01:06.320 One of the most consequential moments in history unfolding this morning in the Middle East.

00:01:19.140 The long nightmare for the families of the Israeli hostages is over.

00:01:24.040 All 20 of the survivors released hours ago into the arms of their loved ones, and I cannot get enough of the videos.

00:01:34.680 They're incredible.

00:01:36.780 All right, we're going to go through a few of them.

00:01:38.300 Among those released, 25-year-old Matan Zengauker.

00:01:43.460 He was kidnapped from his home on October 7th.

00:01:46.780 His final text to his mother that day was,

00:01:48.980 Mom, I love you.

00:01:50.520 Someone is here.

00:01:52.100 Last week, when his mother found out he would be released,

00:01:54.820 she said the moment she was looking forward to the most was when her son's eyes could sink into her own.

00:02:01.420 Today, she got that moment.

00:02:03.240 Watch.

00:02:03.520 It's amazing.

00:02:25.080 In each one of these, they're holding on to them like they might never see them again.

00:02:30.280 I mean, they're holding on to their sons exactly the way that you would hold on to your son.

00:02:34.320 I mean, exactly the way you would hold on to your son if you hadn't seen him in two years

00:02:37.500 and he were in the hands of a terrorist group in some cave.

00:02:41.060 You can feel the relief and the joy and the gratitude.

00:02:47.600 The gratitude.

00:02:48.220 It's like oozing out of the screen.

00:02:50.820 And it's just one of the reasons why it's so emotional to watch these.

00:02:56.420 Also among the released 24-year-old, let's say, Eviatar.

00:03:04.100 I'm sorry.

00:03:05.440 They're tough names, but I'm trying.

00:03:07.140 Eviatar David.

00:03:09.040 Eviatar was kidnapped from the Nova Festival in southern Israel.

00:03:13.660 This is a photo of him before he was taken hostage.

00:03:16.600 In August, Hamas released video of him showing him looking emaciated.

00:03:21.900 This is him.

00:03:22.600 This is Eviatar right here.

00:03:23.720 Look, it's terrible.

00:03:24.800 For the listening audience, he looks like a Holocaust victim.

00:03:27.820 So skinny.

00:03:28.900 Skin and bones.

00:03:30.260 In an underground tunnel.

00:03:32.960 Showing him just looking awful.

00:03:35.160 And his face looks forlorn.

00:03:37.600 And digging in a cramped underground tunnel.

00:03:40.020 When his family was shown the video, his father said he did not even recognize that this was his son.

00:03:44.200 And this was Eviatar today.

00:03:48.200 He blew kisses to the crowd of onlookers as he arrived to a hospital in Israel.

00:03:54.920 He still looks thin, but he was smiling and he was waving.

00:03:59.720 And his life has been saved.

00:04:01.840 Wow.

00:04:03.000 Another hostage released was shown in one of the most widely shared videos of the October 7th attack.

00:04:10.200 Avinathan Orr was at the Supernova Music Festival with his girlfriend, Noah Argamanid.

00:04:18.540 When Hamas terrorists attacked the music festival, they spent hours hiding in a ditch.

00:04:24.640 But they were discovered by the terrorists.

00:04:27.200 And Noah was seen being driven off toward Gaza on a motorbike.

00:04:31.500 Everyone has seen this video.

00:04:33.480 Here it is.

00:04:34.080 She's reaching for him.

00:04:47.300 She looks terrified.

00:04:48.760 She's got the long, dark, curly hair.

00:04:50.720 You can see just nothing but distress on her face as she reaches for him.

00:04:54.960 She cries, don't kill me.

00:04:56.420 While reaching for Avinathan, they were both taken.

00:04:59.360 And the reports were that he actually had a chance to escape prior to this, but wouldn't go because he wasn't going to leave her.

00:05:07.940 I'm not exactly sure how it went down, but he apparently had the chance to spare his own life and leave her behind, and he wouldn't.

00:05:14.020 Eventually, they were both taken, but Noah was freed after an Israeli military operation earlier in these past two years.

00:05:20.700 His mother once said about finding out that he was a hostage, quote,

00:05:24.880 It's like lightning striking, but from all directions at once.

00:05:29.080 Then all the light inside of you disappears, and the darkness means no thoughts, no emotions, no air, just nothing.

00:05:36.640 Today, he's free.

00:05:38.100 In the first images of his release, he is shown pumping his fist.

00:05:43.540 And then later, he was reunited with Noah.

00:05:47.340 Noah, oh my gosh, they're hugging.

00:05:50.880 They fall on this bed that's in the back.

00:05:54.260 They're holding on so tightly.

00:05:57.660 They won't let go.

00:05:58.860 He's kissing her.

00:06:01.280 There's not an inch between them.

00:06:03.140 Now he's giving her a real kiss, touching her face.

00:06:06.500 Hopefully, they can get past this nightmare, and we'll have a long and happy life together with lots of kids.

00:06:12.440 We're all praying for them.

00:06:13.680 One of the most emotional scenes today came from the family of Segev Kalfan.

00:06:20.000 He, too, was taken from the Nova Music Festival.

00:06:23.140 He called his family that day as he was trying to run from the terrorists.

00:06:26.740 They never heard from him again and only found out in February of this year that he was still alive.

00:06:34.980 When Segev was reunited with his family today, you'll see it at first.

00:06:38.280 He tries to keep it together, but then he wails with emotion at the first sight of his loved ones.

00:06:43.900 He has no return.

00:07:13.900 his dad is kissing his head. He's got his elbows on his knees. He's overwhelmed. So it's like so

00:07:21.680 emotional to watch, isn't it? My God, the raw emotion. I'm sure both he and his family thought

00:07:29.140 he was going to die for the entirety of those two years. Why would you put any faith whatsoever in

00:07:34.200 Hamas? So many of them did die. One of the things we're still waiting on today is the release of

00:07:40.280 the deceased bodies. Hamas has not complied with the obligation to release them

00:07:44.800 immediately, contemporaneously with the live hostages. And so far as we came to air, only four

00:07:52.160 of the deceased bodies had been released. That'll be a fight we'll see play out in the coming days

00:07:57.120 as they try to retrieve them from under rubble. And also we are told in some cases, they're not sure

00:08:01.800 where the remains are. So thank God Segev is okay. It easily could have gone another way.

00:08:07.720 Gosh, those screams are so powerful. You could hear him screaming and his wailing is a better word

00:08:14.260 and his dad wailing. And you just think of like a father's love for his son and what any father would

00:08:21.100 give to have been the one taken instead of the son, you know, to trade places with his boy. So his boy

00:08:26.880 didn't have to go through what Segev did and then to have them back. You know, it's like if you've ever

00:08:32.200 lost someone, one of the five stages of grief is bargaining and you bargain that you'll be given

00:08:38.360 that moment that like something will be wrong with the news you were given and that you, you'll get

00:08:43.520 the moment of finding out he's not dead and you can hold him. You can wail like that with relief that you

00:08:51.740 were wrong and he's been brought back into your life. I was like, every time I see one of these, I, this

00:08:58.540 isn't some big promo for Trump, but I do think of Trump. Like what is it in that crazy mind of Trump's

00:09:06.540 that just let him never give up? What is it about like sort of the madness that drives our president

00:09:13.660 in the best sense that makes him say, no, I, I can get it done. I can do it. No, I'll, I'll keep going

00:09:20.800 through the indictments. I don't care that my freedom's in jeopardy. No, I know I was just shot in

00:09:25.340 the head, but I'm going to stand up and say, fight, fight, fight when we don't know whether

00:09:28.660 the shooter's dead. No, I don't care that they impeach me twice. I'm going to run again. They're

00:09:33.280 trying to keep me off ballots. They're trying to attack my family. No, I'm, I'm going to win. I'm

00:09:37.760 going to run and I'm going to win. No, I don't care that you tell me this court or that, that I can't

00:09:42.480 send troops there because people are dying and I want to make sure ICE officers are protected and I don't

00:09:48.800 care. Like I'm going to find a way to do it because I know it's, what's right. I know this is,

00:09:53.940 what's right. I, I know that this war needs to wrap up. Those were president Trump's terms.

00:09:59.600 That's what he said. Time to wrap it up, but there has to be a way of getting the hot. There has to be

00:10:05.820 a way of getting the hostages out. What we have to apply pressure. That's my business. Let, what are

00:10:12.460 the pressure points? Go, go to Qatar, go to Egypt, go to Turkey, twist the financial concerns up,

00:10:19.580 give them what they want, make it worth their while so that they can lean on, on the Palestinians

00:10:26.460 in a way that the United States cannot because we lack the leverage points. There's something in his

00:10:32.080 head that just doesn't let him take no for an answer. He's a miracle worker. That's what it feels

00:10:41.320 like we're seeing. Segev walking out and holding his dad like that is a miracle after that picture of

00:10:46.700 him in the tunnel. And as these hostages have been coming out one by one today, President Trump

00:10:52.940 this morning, he's been going all night. You know, he, he flew to Israel. It was like 2.40

00:10:58.100 U.S. time. There's seven hours ahead. So, you know, add seven. I screwed that up on the AM update,

00:11:05.120 by the way. I had the reverse. Apologies for that. But he was over there, 2.40 landing,

00:11:11.620 meeting with Israeli families, addressing the Knesset, the Israeli parliament. Then I think

00:11:17.960 right now is already off to Egypt. Like one place, it's just what he's doing over there is superhuman.

00:11:24.540 The man's 79 years old. Most of us complain if like we have a full day of work plus home

00:11:31.620 responsibilities, plus like a social engagement in the evening. A lot of us, maybe not most,

00:11:35.660 I do. It's incredible. So he addressed Israelis, the Israeli parliament this morning,

00:11:43.060 talking about what's been achieved and his new hope for the region.

00:11:47.940 After two harrowing years and darkness and captivity, 20 courageous hostages are returning

00:11:56.260 to the glorious embrace of their families. And it is glorious. 28 more precious loved ones are coming

00:12:04.400 home at last to rest in this sacred soil for all of time. And after so many years of unceasing war

00:12:14.040 and endless danger, today the skies are calm, the guns are silent, the sirens are still,

00:12:20.480 and the sun rises on a holy land that is finally at peace. A land and a region that will live,

00:12:27.520 God willing, in peace for all eternity. I love Israel. I'm with you all the way.

00:12:35.300 You will be bigger, better, stronger, and more loving than ever before. Thank you very much. God bless you.

00:12:44.480 God bless the United States of America. And God bless the Middle East. Thank you, everybody.

00:12:50.720 Good luck. Thank you very much. Thank you.

00:12:57.460 Standing ovation.

00:13:07.000 Chanting Trump. Joining me now, Batya Ankar Sargan. She's the host of Batya on News Nation and author

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00:14:06.660 Go to beekeepersnaturals.com slash megan or enter code megan at checkout to get 20% off your order.

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00:14:24.240 are also available at Target, Whole Foods, Walmart, Amazon, CVS, and Walgreens. Batya, what a day.

00:14:33.120 It's overwhelming, isn't it? Utterly, utterly overwhelming. That was such a beautiful opening,

00:14:40.580 Megan. And you're so right. We just witnessed a miracle. Trump just performed an actual miracle

00:14:49.740 before our eyes. I never believed these men would see the light of day again. And what he had to go

00:14:57.060 through to get them out? He's the only person who could have done it. And even he, I didn't keep

00:15:04.640 the faith. And I just have to say, Megan, I hope I can get through this. This is a huge, huge win for

00:15:12.420 the United States, just like it is for Israel. Every American who voted for Donald Trump, but especially

00:15:22.740 people like you, Megan, who played a role in getting him elected, who stood by him, who told the truth,

00:15:31.420 who told the American people what he was going to do for us. You own this. There are 20 lives that are

00:15:40.980 going to be alive because of you, Megan. In Judaism, we say, if you save a life, it's like saving the whole

00:15:47.940 world. And Megan, you saved 20 worlds. You get a share of this and you get to know this for the

00:15:55.020 rest of your life, that you played a role in rescuing these 20 precious, innocent souls. And

00:16:02.220 everything that comes from the Middle East now, I do believe there will be peace. Every person who

00:16:08.100 helped Trump get to this place, it's yours. Also, it is your victory. Of course, it's ours as Americans,

00:16:15.020 because he's our guy. And it's just the most incredible, incredible day. I mean, glory to God,

00:16:23.520 as you tweeted. And to President Trump, I did not think that I would live to see something like this.

00:16:30.840 It is a world historic moment. We just witnessed Jewish history being made. And you now get a piece

00:16:36.680 of that, Megan. So thank you from the bottom of my heart. You are so sweet, Batya. I wish I had

00:16:42.460 something to do with it. But I do believe we wouldn't be here if Kamala Harris had won. I accept

00:16:48.960 that piece of it. I agree with you. He's the only person who could have gotten this done because of

00:16:56.500 that beautiful madness. I don't know what it is that makes Trump the way he is, just like a dog with a

00:17:04.160 bone. You can't stop. When he wants something, he's going to have it. And if you can align the

00:17:12.340 United States' interests, or in this case, the world's, with Trump's crazy desire to just make

00:17:18.780 what he wants happen, miracles can happen. We're watching it time and time again. There's no

00:17:25.480 question those 20 people are alive today because Donald Trump just did not have the ability to

00:17:31.440 give up. It's not in him. And so he backed Israel, I mean, very forcefully from the beginning,

00:17:38.620 but he also applied pressure on Netanyahu, who is his dear friend and whose back he's absolutely had,

00:17:45.360 but was willing to pressure him when pressure was required, and then understood the Middle East and

00:17:50.680 had already been over there in Trump 1.0 with Jared Kushner, with the Abraham Accords,

00:17:54.620 treating them as equals with whom we could deal and listen to and address their concerns and maybe

00:18:02.840 do business economically and not just treat as these weird, otherized people who we would never

00:18:08.900 deign to interact with. That foundation was laid, and he has been exploiting it in Trump 2.0 to say,

00:18:16.000 you need buy-in. We need buy-in from you. How can I make this worth your while,

00:18:20.820 such that you get involved in a way that the Palestinian people listen to you? They listen

00:18:25.640 to Qatar a lot more than they're going to listen to Donald Trump. And it worked. He sent two real

00:18:31.360 estate guys over there, and they negotiated a deal. It happened. It's so unbelievably incredible.

00:18:40.100 He threw out this sort of post-World War II world order to where there was this sort of fiction

00:18:49.600 that we have shared values with people who are utterly different from us. And either the Obama

00:18:56.580 model where they actually want democracy or the Bush model where, well, we'll just foist it on them,

00:19:02.940 right? You don't get anywhere with that because they don't share our values. Donald Trump has zero

00:19:08.800 interest in shared values. He's interested in sharing value, right? He doesn't want to give them

00:19:16.720 democracy. He wants them to give us money. He believes in shared interests. And you're completely

00:19:24.260 right. From the beginning of this second administration, he made that big trip to the UAE,

00:19:31.200 Qatar, and Saudi Arabia. And I don't think he went on that trip thinking, I'm going to bring peace to the

00:19:37.700 Middle East. He went on the trip to bring $10 trillion of investment back to the United States.

00:19:44.060 But here's the key for Trump is that because he doesn't believe in this nonsense about shared values,

00:19:49.440 because he wants to put America first, and he thinks that will be good for the entire world,

00:19:54.240 his foreign policy and his economic policy are two sides of the same coin. So he went there for

00:20:00.360 economic reasons. He went there because he had sort of used tariffs in order to get leverage,

00:20:05.500 and he wanted to see what could I make with that leverage, got all of this investment back.

00:20:10.780 And because he had intertwined our economy with the economies of these moderate Gulf Arab states,

00:20:17.560 they believed him when he came in for a foreign policy diplomatic mission that he had their best

00:20:24.580 interests at heart because their economy is now intertwined with us. Of course, he wants them to do well.

00:20:30.680 So on the one hand, he's the most pro-Israel president we've ever had. He's very

00:20:35.160 proud of that. He brags about it all the time. And you would have thought in the old world model

00:20:40.500 that, you know, you have to sort of keep Israel at arm's length. If you want to do something with

00:20:44.920 the Arabs, you have to equalize. No, Trump said that's ridiculous. Everybody knows I'm pro-Israel.

00:20:49.920 I love Israel. I've got their back. That doesn't mean I can't also align the interests of this other

00:20:56.880 side because he's thinking about interests as interests, right? Literally as investment.

00:21:02.600 And so this is, I think, the key to his dealmaking. You know, number one, ignore the experts. Number

00:21:09.120 two, align the interests. You can always find a way to end a kind of stalemate by rethinking what

00:21:17.020 the interests are. And number three, what you said, Megan, play the long game. Take the win. As he told

00:21:23.520 Netanyahu, take the win. He refused to let him back out of this. It's just so genius. And he's the only

00:21:31.760 person who could have done it. It sounded like spouses arguing when he's like, you're so fucking

00:21:36.520 negative. Just take the win. It was very funny to me how he's like, trust me. And Netanyahu was smart

00:21:44.140 to trust Trump. It's like, Trump's got a long history of winning and he's very, very savvy

00:21:49.620 politically. And Netanyahu, you know, it's like, if you keep doing the same thing over and over and

00:21:54.740 again, you're going to get the same result over and over again. And Trump actually does have a history

00:21:58.640 of dealmaking, the impossible deal. And he listened. He did treat it like a win. And look,

00:22:03.760 no one's saying, okay, it's guaranteed peace forevermore. But this is the biggest breakthrough

00:22:08.240 we've had in modern history. I haven't heard anybody saying, oh, but this other one beats it.

00:22:14.300 This other one is more promising. The closest we've had is these mealy mouth Dems like Antony Blinken

00:22:21.340 and this other person, former Deputy Pentagon Press Secretary, Sabrina Singh, who are like,

00:22:29.500 you know, he finished what we started. This is really our process that we got going. And he just

00:22:35.020 kind of put the cherry on top. As I said to Doug this morning, they're like, we loosened it. We,

00:22:39.460 you know, we loosened it, the jar. He just did the last little turn. Here's this person Singh on camera,

00:22:46.720 Sot32. I know the Biden administration on its way out tried to get to a deal. It did not.

00:22:53.920 What do you think is the difference here in this moment that put the Trump team ahead?

00:22:58.740 Yeah, the framework that has been put into place in this 20 point plan that the Trump administration

00:23:02.760 has implemented builds on the framework of the Biden administration. And of course,

00:23:07.140 there are a few differences in the plan, but it was always a phase, phase one, two, and three approach.

00:23:13.320 Great. How, how come you didn't do it then? Truly, if it was all your idea, like Anthony,

00:23:20.420 Antony Blinken tweeted, like it was, they're just picking up where we left off. This is really our

00:23:24.800 deal. Why didn't, why don't you get it done? Truly, seriously. If you had the idea, you had the vision,

00:23:30.520 you had the ability, why didn't you do it? I mean, this is so petty.

00:23:35.680 It's so ridiculous. It's like saying, because they said the words two-state solution,

00:23:40.080 therefore a person who actually got the two-state solution implemented owes them credit. It's

00:23:45.540 ridiculous. The implementation is the whole thing. Trump went in there and got Hamas to give up

00:23:51.720 all of its leverage. Like, do you understand what a miracle that is? They have nothing now. They're

00:24:00.300 back to killing other Palestinians because they can't kill any Jews. It is so amazing, unbelievable.

00:24:06.740 Like, literally got them to give up their leverage. And again, it comes back to the

00:24:12.500 real estate dealmaker in him. So in the Obama-Blinken model, the way that you get a deal is

00:24:19.900 you have, you know, the weaker party down here and the stronger party up here. So you got to,

00:24:24.520 you know, build up the weaker party and weaken the stronger party. And then as equals, this fiction of

00:24:29.920 their equality, they'll meet there and make a deal. And Trump says, that's nonsense. If you make the

00:24:35.240 weaker party stronger, they'll never concede to anything because you're building them up and

00:24:39.920 holding them up. If you bring down the stronger party, why should they agree to anything? You just

00:24:44.600 weaken their hand. Trump, who's a real estate guy says, no, here's how you get to a deal.

00:24:50.760 You weaken the weaker guy and you strengthen the stronger guy. And then everyone has an incentive

00:24:55.240 to come to the table because the strong guy doesn't feel threatened. And the weak guy is like,

00:24:59.560 oh my God, I have no leverage. I better make a deal. That is what we just saw. That was phase

00:25:05.200 one. He wasn't doing Hamas any favors. He stole their only leverage out from under them. And he did

00:25:13.240 it by going to Turkey and Saudi Arabia and Qatar and finding out what each of them wanted because

00:25:19.820 they each wanted something. And again, throw out the experts who said, oh, these people,

00:25:25.460 they're Muslims. They just want the end of the Jewish state. Bullshit. They have legitimate

00:25:30.940 interests. They want things more than they want to kill Jews. And Trump figured that out. And he

00:25:37.260 figured out how to make them see that he had figured it out. And what's so amazing is in the speech to the

00:25:43.660 Knesset, he's still closing with Bibi. So he's kind of negging him. But then he does the one thing he

00:25:49.860 knows Bibi really wants, which is he tells the Knesset, oh, why don't you guys give him a pardon?

00:25:54.260 Pardon. What's a bit of champagne? It was amazing. And now he goes to the Arabs and he's sitting in

00:25:59.920 Egypt. And what does he say to them? He keeps talking about how rich they are. Because of course,

00:26:04.320 that's what they want to hear, right? He just knows exactly what he is doing. And to just watch him be

00:26:11.620 able to perform at this level, bringing the expertise of a life in real estate to solve one problem after

00:26:19.920 another. And then the last point I'll make is just these previous wars, these failed attempts to bring

00:26:25.760 democracy to the Middle East. It's not just that they failed. It's that they cost us trillions and

00:26:32.100 trillions of dollars and the lives of precious, precious soldiers. And what Trump has done is the

00:26:38.900 exact opposite. Not only are we not paying for this, it's making us rich. Ten trillion dollars of

00:26:46.360 investment in our economy, in our working class, in our manufacturing base, was table stakes for the

00:26:54.400 Arabs to come and deal with him. So it's the exact opposite of the Democrats' approach to foreign

00:27:00.160 policy. It's bringing home the bacon while bringing peace. It's just total, total genius.

00:27:07.180 Yeah. I will say the one group that really does just want to kill Jews is Hamas. I mean,

00:27:12.920 he read that correctly too. The entire Middle East may not be as dedicated to that mission,

00:27:18.060 but that group is. And he understood that he needed to get these other Arab states to force them to say,

00:27:23.560 we're not going to have your back. It's going to be very painful for you unless you give up the

00:27:28.280 hostages and end this thing. So their protectors basically told them it's over. And Trump made those

00:27:34.820 protectors do it while looking at BB saying, yes, you need to take this deal, but also if they

00:27:41.280 don't take this deal, do your thing. End them. And he said openly to Hamas, they're going to obliterate

00:27:47.160 you and I will not stand in the way. So this is your last chance. He has their allies saying,

00:27:51.980 you're effed unless you take this. We're out of here. It's more important to us to do business

00:27:55.460 with the United States. And you had Trump looking directly at them saying, see this crazed bulldog next

00:28:03.080 to me who really would love to wipe every last one of you out. I'm going to let him off his leash.

00:28:07.920 I'm the only thing holding his leash and I will look forward to him killing you and ending you if

00:28:12.440 you don't come to reason. That's why it ended. So it's, you know, we talked about some of the

00:28:16.920 things that led Trump to think it could be done and actually get it done. But I would say too,

00:28:23.040 the other, the other reason he was the only one who could do it. And it's like, it's destiny.

00:28:28.460 It's almost just, it's destiny. Like it, it had to be him and it had to be him right now is he crazy,

00:28:35.720 like in a great way, you know, but Trump crazy. He's a little crazy. He's like all the crazy shit

00:28:43.220 he does where it's like from, you know, Soleimani to like threatening judges that he might, he might

00:28:49.400 not follow their rulings. He has followed them, but like openly threatening them. Um, and just like,

00:28:55.080 he's indicting Letitia James, which is good. I think she might've done something really bad.

00:28:59.480 So I'm in favor of it, but I'm just saying like, these are all stuff. Every, all like the mainstream

00:29:04.440 people, the respectable people said, don't, don't do any of that. Stop all of that. Don't,

00:29:10.120 why are we getting a new white house ballroom? Why are you taking a plane from Qatar? Why,

00:29:14.420 why did you gild the white house? Why? And it's all part of the same crazy ass, awesome package.

00:29:25.800 It's all that's so destabilizing for the people who watch him. They're like,

00:29:29.800 holy shit. There's no knowing what he might do. Like he, he posed for the mugshot and then

00:29:37.120 put his mugshot on t-shirts and mugs and like sold them. He did like crypto with his like,

00:29:44.340 all the crazy ass shit he's done has led everyone, including Hamas to realize

00:29:50.000 that motherfucker is going to do whatever he wants. He cannot be shamed out of this course

00:29:55.900 of action. There's no conglomerate that can pull him back by the bit. He is a singular historic

00:30:03.240 figure and for better or for worse. And in Hamas's case, I think they concluded for worse.

00:30:08.160 We're stuck with him.

00:30:09.400 I think I told you the story once, but I had a subway experience that I think perfectly

00:30:15.300 encapsulates what you're describing, which is I got on the subway and there was a slightly crazy

00:30:20.920 person sitting opposite me, you know, nothing too menacing, talking to himself, you know,

00:30:25.160 twitching, giggling. Yeah, exactly. We pull into the station, the doors open and a person who's like

00:30:31.680 really crazy gets on. And this is one of these people who's like shouting and gesticulating. And,

00:30:36.320 you know, everybody's like, Oh God, is there going to be an incident? Please don't look at me,

00:30:40.120 you know? And Megan, that slightly crazy person sat up straight, stopped talking to himself and

00:30:47.400 immediately started behaving because he didn't want to attract any attention to himself. It was like a

00:30:53.120 game recognized game situation. And I always think about that when I see Trump sitting next to

00:30:58.480 somebody like Erdogan, you know, or CC or Putin, you know, Trump is the crazier dude. So they are

00:31:06.160 going to sit there and behave because he just has the bigger cojones and they just don't know what

00:31:12.780 he's going to do because he answers to nobody, but the American people.

00:31:16.740 It's true. This is like, this is one of his most and least attractive features. It's like such a

00:31:25.080 crazy combination. And one man will never have anybody like him. We really should be thanking God

00:31:31.680 every day that we have this president and he's our leader. We're so lucky. We're so lucky. He's

00:31:36.480 willing to serve. He's rich beyond measure. He does not need this job. He could be off with the

00:31:42.000 beautiful Melania, enjoying his Scottish golf course, whatever he wants. He wasn't done. And

00:31:49.120 honest, like today, Peter Doocy raised the question of heaven again with Trump. This is a very interesting

00:31:55.560 ongoing thread with Trump. He's got real doubts. He's going to get in. He clearly believes in heaven.

00:32:01.740 He was raised Christian and going to church on the Upper West Side and with Norman Vincent Peale as his

00:32:07.080 pastor, um, power of positive thinking. And, uh, he asked him again today. You would think today of

00:32:13.340 all days, Batya, you know, you, you had me convinced I'm getting in because of what you said,

00:32:17.880 even though I really had nothing to do with this, but I was, I was liking, uh, yeah, maybe this,

00:32:22.640 I could use this when I get to the pearly gates and he brings up all the mean things I said about

00:32:25.680 people. Um, and Trump too, even on a day like this clearly has doubts, which almost suggests a touch

00:32:37.300 of humility. What's going on? The pigs, they're flying. Watch this.

00:32:44.780 You had talked a couple of weeks ago, you were doing an interview and you talked about how you

00:32:48.280 hope to end the war in Ukraine because it might help you get into heaven. How does, how does this help?

00:32:54.120 Does this help? I mean, you know, I'm being a little cute. I don't think there's anything

00:33:00.260 going to get me in heaven. Okay. I think, I think I'm not maybe heaven bound. I may be in heaven right

00:33:07.080 now as we fly an air force one. I'm not sure I'm going to be able to make heaven, but I've made life

00:33:12.460 a lot better for a lot of people. Really incredible. He wouldn't say that if he weren't actually thinking

00:33:21.060 about it, you know, Trump, he really doesn't lie. Like he lies the way politicians lie, but

00:33:25.100 this isn't a lie. You can tell that he's genuinely been thinking about it as everyone does as they get

00:33:30.000 later in, in the years. And I do wonder about you, is that what we're seeing there? Like

00:33:34.580 humility? What's it, what is that? What's happening?

00:33:39.620 I have been seeing on his face, the same look. And I wonder if you agree with me as on the first night

00:33:46.900 of the RNC, which was the first time we had seen him since the Butler assassination attempt,

00:33:52.520 that same sort of almost beatific, like that he understands that this is now, it's just, it's,

00:34:00.900 it's notched up to the next level. He's leveled up. That same kind of humility vis-a-vis the greatness

00:34:07.100 of what is transpiring around him and because of him. And then of course, just like when he finally

00:34:14.980 gave his speech at the RNC and he, you know, he opened his mouth and it was Trump again, right?

00:34:19.060 Same thing at the Knesset, you know? So he had this look on his face of almost awe at what was

00:34:23.900 happening around him. And then he became Trump like immediately. And it was like a relief. Okay.

00:34:28.120 He's still him. You know, I I've been thinking a lot about something Ben Shapiro said after Charlie

00:34:33.060 Kirk was assassinated, which is, you know, Charlie wasn't just a great man. He was a good man.

00:34:39.940 And, you know, sometimes I think, you know, you don't actually have to be a good man to be a great

00:34:45.860 man. Although I do think Trump is a good man and the people who know him closest to talk about a very

00:34:51.120 giving person, you know, that, that, that thing of like the greatness is not always something that a

00:34:58.140 person might themselves interpret as, you know, the kind of banal, you know, mundane, everyday little

00:35:04.760 kindnesses that one typically thinks in a religious context are the kinds of things that would get you

00:35:09.000 into heaven. But I hope he doesn't really believe that he's, he's not headed there because obviously,

00:35:14.880 you know, he's gone. He's for sure. He's gone. If Trump doesn't get into heaven, there's no hope

00:35:19.680 for the rest of us because listen, if it's a balancing test at all, if it's like, if the test

00:35:23.960 is, have you done anything bad? We're all screwed. If the test, if it's a balancing test, he's, he's got

00:35:29.140 it. I can tell you Trump is a lawyer. You're good. I've done the, the weighing of the evidence. It's,

00:35:34.800 it's beyond a reasonable doubt that you're getting in. So you should celebrate personally,

00:35:38.840 too. All right, standby. I've got to take a break. Really enjoying this day. This is a wonderful,

00:35:43.660 wonderful day and we should celebrate. God bless the United States of America. God bless Trump.

00:35:49.060 God bless the Middle East, just as he put it. Uh, and that's not an accidental turn of phrase. Uh,

00:35:54.360 the other presidents used to just say Israel and president Trump intentionally widened it to say,

00:35:59.600 we're looking at all of you. We're, we're here for all of you. There's goodness to be had

00:36:04.700 for all of us. More with Bhatia coming up right after this. Speaking of goodness,

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00:37:41.380 We absolutely have to keep talking. It's more important now than ever. To cower, to hide,

00:37:47.700 to go silent is not the answer. And all I can tell you is there is no fucking way I am canceling

00:37:54.520 one stop on this tour. Not one stop. I'm going. I'm going to stand on these stages and I'm going to

00:38:03.940 say all the things that we say all the time on this show. We're going to make it safe for me. We're going

00:38:08.100 to make it safe for my team and my guests and you. We're going coast to coast and do something really

00:38:14.500 important, which is to say what's true and what's real to honor him. I really now more than ever would

00:38:21.580 love to see you all face-to-face. God, I would love to see you face-to-face. I need to see you face-to-face.

00:38:28.600 I am doing this tour and I would love for you to join me. MeganKelley.com for the tickets.

00:38:38.420 Thank you for standing up to the lies against Israel and the United Nations.

00:38:46.020 Thank you for brokering the historic Abraham Accords. Thank you for withdrawing from the

00:38:54.500 disastrous Iran nuclear deal. Thank you for supporting Operation Rising Line and for your

00:39:02.900 bold decision to launch Operation Midnight Hammer. My friends, this is only a partial list.

00:39:11.520 But it's enough to affirm what I've said time and again. Donald Trump is the greatest friend

00:39:18.700 that the state of Israel has ever had in the White House. Everyone is getting up on their feet.

00:39:28.520 Everyone cheering.

00:39:35.820 Trump's sitting there behind and next to Netanyahu. Wow. That's the most you ever get from Trump is just

00:39:42.620 sort of like a beguiling smirk. He's definitely enjoying it. It's funny because he works so hard,

00:39:49.400 but he actually doesn't really take himself that seriously, even in a moment like this. You think

00:39:54.300 he's proud of himself, but he's kind of like, hey, this is kind of cool. He actually got a literal red

00:40:00.380 carpet rolled out for him when he landed. There was on the beach, the big, we love President Trump.

00:40:07.900 There's been all these, I mean, everybody, people are going crazy on social media in Israel,

00:40:13.380 singing his praises, saying, oh my God, there was this one woman like, I wasn't going to vote for

00:40:18.260 you. I didn't like her. I didn't want you to win. In other words, I didn't grab him by the P word.

00:40:23.060 No. And she's like, I was wrong. I was wrong about all of it. Like completely jubilant over there

00:40:29.740 watching him. He was asked about the pettiness by some here at home. It's not happening with the

00:40:36.400 Israelis, but some of our own, like I mentioned, Blinken and others. And he had, he had a good

00:40:41.500 response. Here it is in Sot 33. Blinken says it's good that President Trump adopted and built on the

00:40:48.920 plan that the Biden administration developed. What do you think about that? Everybody knows

00:40:54.440 that's a joke. Remember when B.B. came and he begged that you not do what they were doing with

00:40:59.300 Iran? You remember that, right? Begged him and they wouldn't even listen to him. Everything they did

00:41:04.560 was the opposite of what you should have done. And it's nice that they try and take a little

00:41:08.800 credit. That was years ago. And the mistakes were made years ago. And it was both by Biden and Obama.

00:41:16.780 Right on. And then listen to this, Baja, just to turn the page a little. The media. So the media

00:41:23.620 has had to admit what an accomplishment this is. It's been very fun to watch. Like they're so

00:41:29.960 angry about it. They're just like begrudgingly. They have to be like, it's a huge win. Never seen

00:41:35.640 anything like it. All right. And then here's Christiane Amanpour. I mean, truly, you can watch

00:41:43.100 the TDS coming out of her ears as she says the following. Watch this. And I think for sure,

00:41:50.380 people who start to talk to the hostages who've only just been released will find that it will take

00:41:55.960 a long, long time for them to recover physically, but also mentally. It's been a terrible, terrible

00:42:03.140 two years for them because not only are they there, you know, they're probably being treated

00:42:07.700 better than the average Ghazan because they are the pawns and the chips that Hamas had.

00:42:12.600 Now Hamas has given up all its leverage, by the way.

00:42:16.720 Sure. It was a day at the park for the Israeli hostages who were actually starving to death,

00:42:22.720 who were in underground tunnels, who had for weeks and months, in some cases,

00:42:27.940 hoods over their heads and were beaten and abused repeatedly, who had to watch their loved ones die,

00:42:34.200 whose loved ones had been killed in their arms, whose babies died. I'm sure it was a really

00:42:37.800 wonderful experience, Christiane. What the hell is she saying?

00:42:43.480 Just absolute scum of the earth. And I don't say words like that often.

00:42:48.500 They were starved. They were tortured. The women were sexually assaulted routinely.

00:42:56.220 They were all beaten. They were tied for days and days on end. You could see the evidence of the

00:43:02.500 torture on the arms of the returning men and on the women. Just disgusting. And Megan,

00:43:09.720 that's who our legacy media is. They are the stenographers of terrorists.

00:43:14.660 She's literally running cover for Hamas. Why? What would possess you to, first of all,

00:43:24.360 lie? It's wrong. You're a journalist. You're supposed to know this. We all saw that picture of

00:43:30.280 Evyatar David, although maybe they didn't show it on CNN because they can't stand showing bad things

00:43:36.000 that terrorists do. So A, it's wrong. But B, what would possess you, even if it was true,

00:43:43.220 to try to find a positive spin on the kidnapping by terrorists of innocent young people? It's so

00:43:52.980 disgusting and yet so totally in line with how our legacy media has treated this. The New York Times had

00:44:00.260 a headline the other day. What will Hamas do now that it's given up its leverage? The New York Times

00:44:07.340 is very worried that the mass raping, baby killing group that hides behind its own women and children

00:44:14.200 and tortures and executes its own elderly and teenagers is not going to have any leverage anymore.

00:44:20.280 This is who they've been from the beginning of this conflict because they're totally woke-ified

00:44:24.300 and everybody who works and consumes this legacy media at this point are part of that disgusting,

00:44:31.260 you know, over-credentialed leftist elite who inherently side with the people they see as

00:44:36.800 having less power. And so they're completely in the bag for Hamas. But just to see that from

00:44:41.480 Christiane Amanpour on CNN on this of all days, just utterly, utterly, utterly repulsive. I'm seeing

00:44:47.700 so many people on social media saying, that's it. I'm never watching that channel again.

00:44:51.460 Good. I mean, they should have come to that realization a long time ago. But it is,

00:44:55.960 it's interesting to watch, you know, we are seeing cheers in the Middle East. We are seeing

00:44:59.500 cheers amongst the Palestinians. For Trump, we are seeing that. It's crazy. Trump made the point

00:45:04.440 earlier, and he's right. He's like, normally, you only have one side cheering when something like

00:45:08.480 this comes to a close. But we have both sides cheering here. But the media, they're not cheering,

00:45:14.980 Batya. You can watch, they're forced. They know it's such a huge accomplishment. They have to say,

00:45:21.460 like, good job. But they're not actually feeling it. I think Christiane kind of landed in the place

00:45:27.660 she felt good about. You know, like, they had it better off than the Gazans. And now you'll probably

00:45:32.800 hear that repeated, because others will be like, oh, yeah, that's a good line. That's, I'm gonna go

00:45:36.040 with that. And I do wonder, like, why? Why? Like, what did they, do they want the hostages to die? I

00:45:44.440 can't, I can't go that far for them. Did they just want this to go on and on so that Israel got

00:45:49.240 further and further demonized? You know, like, you and I have talked about this, but it's my own

00:45:54.800 support for Israel that made me say, we got to wrap it up. Like, you're losing support. We can't

00:46:00.960 have a relationship between the United States and Israel fracture. But I feel like they wanted the

00:46:06.440 opposite. They wanted it to go on and on because they saw Israel losing international support. And

00:46:11.920 they loved it. Like, go look at Mehdi Hassan's Twitter feed. He's not feeling too celebratory.

00:46:18.560 And I do wonder what's going on there. What do you think?

00:46:22.100 I couldn't agree with you more. The whole, you know, ceasefire now crowd is silent now that there's

00:46:27.480 an actual ceasefire. You know, A, because Donald Trump did it, and B, because a lot of people were

00:46:33.580 making big career moves off of this whole war and celebrating, you know, the fact that Israel was

00:46:40.900 now losing tons and tons of support. Something, by the way, that was extremely important to

00:46:45.040 President Trump to put a stop to, just like you, Megan. And he explicitly said that. He said,

00:46:49.980 you can't stand alone, Israel. Bibi, you cannot do this alone. You have to wrap it up. And then was

00:46:55.780 able to pull this off. I think what's happening here with the hostages versus the Palestinians is

00:47:00.260 that in the woke mindset, you know, only certain kinds of victims count. So in the Judeo-Christian

00:47:07.520 worldview, we divide things based on right versus wrong. You know, we have like an internal moral

00:47:13.040 compass. A lot of it comes from the Bible, comes from God, comes from our values and our tradition

00:47:17.300 that says this is wrong and you shouldn't do it. And this is right and you should do it. And the people

00:47:21.800 who do the right things are good. And the people who do the wrong things are bad. It's like a normal

00:47:25.920 way of thinking about things. But in the woke mindset, they've thrown all that out and they've replaced

00:47:31.920 it with a different binary. There's only who has more power and who has less power. And whoever has

00:47:37.700 less power, that's virtue, is being powerless. And people who have darker skin are powerless. And

00:47:45.460 people who have lighter skin are powerful and thus they are inherently evil. So it's not divided based

00:47:50.920 on your actions, but just based on your gender or your race or what have you. So that's how you get

00:47:57.500 into a situation where every Israeli, which are coded as white, the way that they code Jews as white,

00:48:03.080 is powerful and thus evil and an oppressor and a colonizer. And every Palestinian who has darker

00:48:10.100 skin is oppressed and weak and powerless and therefore inherently virtuous. And that includes

00:48:16.980 Hamas, Megan, because they have no internal mechanism to say, well, maybe not all Palestinians. No,

00:48:23.160 because it's based on race, right? It's not based on your actions. So there's nothing in the mindset

00:48:28.200 that explains to them why they should be condemning Hamas and how an Israeli who is held captive could

00:48:37.160 actually be the real victim here and the one deserving of their sympathies. And this is the mindset that

00:48:43.980 every person with a college degree and every person certainly with a graduate degree, and that's most

00:48:49.460 journalists, by the way, have graduate degrees. They all get inculcated into this woke mind virus.

00:48:55.180 And so this explains all of the legacy media there. It's not because they're on the left, although

00:49:00.020 they are. It's because they're overeducated in universities that teach them this utterly godless

00:49:05.240 way of looking at the world. Mm hmm. So where are we now, Batya, with the this thing looking like it's

00:49:12.160 been I hate to choose the word like settled, resolved. Those are all scary, optimistic words that you don't

00:49:18.480 like to use about the Middle East. But a peace deal has been struck. And the biggest part of it,

00:49:24.420 releasing the hostages, has been lived up to the live hostages. We can fight about the remains of

00:49:30.420 the dead. But getting those live hostages back was just you can't overstate how huge it was. But now

00:49:36.780 what? Given that Israel has suffered in terms of its popularity and its its favor, you know, in the

00:49:42.520 Western world, now what? Like, where do we go from here? So each of those leaders wants something from

00:49:49.880 Trump. Turkey, they want F-16s. They want an easing up of sanctions. Saudi Arabia, I think,

00:49:57.580 want into the Abraham Accords, just like Indonesia. You have Qatar, who wanted an apology from Bibi

00:50:05.740 Netanyahu and want to have very good relations with Trump. And then you have Egypt, who were desperate not

00:50:11.120 to have Palestinians in Sinai and also get a lot of foreign aid. Everybody now is thinking,

00:50:17.240 what can I get out of Trump? And I think he's thinking, how can I give each of them what they're

00:50:21.620 asking for so they give me what I want, which is this peace deal?

00:50:25.120 Mm-hmm. We have no better steward in office than this guy. I completely trust Trump and have my faith

00:50:31.920 in him on this. And literally virtually every piece of his agenda, he's doing exactly what he promised

00:50:37.720 he would do. And unlike everybody else, he's actually getting it done. Bhatia, what a pleasure.

00:50:42.660 Thanks for being us here with us on a day like this of all days. Wow. It was wonderful to see you.

00:50:48.140 Megan, God bless and protect you. Thank you for everything.

00:50:52.580 Oh, you too. Gosh, it just feels so wonderful to have good news. It's great to have good news.

00:50:57.840 Coming up, the luminous one and only Cheryl Hines. Yes, she's a Hollywood star. She also happens to be

00:51:04.600 the TV wife of Larry David, but more importantly, the actual wife of our Health and Human Services

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00:54:35.760 Cheryl Hines is an actress and comedian known for her role on Larry David's show as his wife in the hit

00:54:44.780 HBO program, Curb Your Enthusiasm. She's also the actual real life wife of our current secretary of

00:54:51.820 health and human services, who the man we affectionately call RFKJ here on our show.

00:54:57.280 Cheryl's new memoir, Unscripted, is out next month and it delves into her life growing up,

00:55:02.520 the ups and downs of Hollywood, her marriage, and the campaign trail, along with much more.

00:55:08.040 Welcome to the show, Cheryl.

00:55:09.820 Thank you.

00:55:10.780 It's wonderful to see you.

00:55:12.260 I'm happy to be here.

00:55:13.440 I was not sure you're going to be able to make it because we're having a Nor'easter up here.

00:55:17.420 I know. That's what they keep saying.

00:55:18.480 You're tough.

00:55:19.500 You're tough. I was thinking about this all the way over here. You are, you're pretty amazing. You

00:55:25.500 have really, you have risen above everybody. You know, you've been through, people like to come

00:55:38.440 at you. People like to come at you.

00:55:40.140 Yeah, they do.

00:55:41.040 And here you are, and you're one of the, you know, there are a lot of podcasters, but you're one of

00:55:46.380 the top, very top, and one of the few female. Yeah. Super top. Well, thank you. And I, I see you.

00:55:56.160 Thank you. I feel seen in her. They do come for me. I go for them too, though. You know,

00:56:01.480 it's like, it's fine. It's sort of a weird ecosystem. It's like when people go on Twitter

00:56:05.660 and then they complain that people are mean. I'm like, ma'am, this is a McDonald's. Like,

00:56:10.200 go to Instagram if you want nice people. Right. In news, it's a rough and tumble business. Yes. So

00:56:15.600 it's like, like I recently saw a friend of mine and she was like, oh, do you, you know, people are

00:56:20.460 attacking you. Are you, I'm like, oh, please. If this is, is it okay if this is the worst thing

00:56:24.680 that happens to me today? I'm good. Bad words coming at me. Well, that's the good, that's the

00:56:28.560 advantage of having gone through it many times, right? Is it like when it happens then the 10th or 11th

00:56:32.660 time you're like, yeah, I'm fine. Yeah. Now, how, how has that been for you? Because you've had a

00:56:37.480 lovely life in Hollywood as a big star. And then now, boom, you're in politics. Yeah. Through

00:56:42.420 not exactly a choice of your own. You're correct. Yeah. Um, it was a learning curve because like

00:56:54.060 you're saying, I mean, when I started out as an actress, you know, you start out and when people

00:56:58.820 start recognizing you for no reason whatsoever, people still can be mean to you online. They can

00:57:05.960 say whatever. Yes. Don't like the way you look. Don't like this. Don't like what you're wearing,

00:57:10.140 whatever. That's fine. Um, but then when Bobby got into politics, it was a different world. And at

00:57:19.980 first, uh, you know, I was kind of taking it all on like, that's so hard. I can't believe they said

00:57:27.280 that. And then now I, I'm like you, I realized, oh, oh, it's part of, it's part of the, the ecosystem.

00:57:34.480 Like you said, this is what they, what people do. It's weird. It's like when we saw Trump and

00:57:39.420 Obama sitting next to each other at the Carter funeral, yucking it up and clad handing. It's like

00:57:44.980 arch enemies. Right. When you see them publicly, when they're, they have to do politics, like the

00:57:49.500 nastiest you can get, but like behind the scenes, everybody's understand it's kind of, I don't want

00:57:55.820 to say game, which makes you light of it, but it's just sort of, you put your armor on when you're

00:58:00.720 doing politics and you do politics and behind the scenes, hopefully you can still be a person

00:58:04.960 and do what those two did. Right. Not everyone can though. And I know you've experienced some of

00:58:10.080 that and all that, but like, has it been fun? Cause when you married a Kennedy, you were not marrying

00:58:14.700 an actively political Kennedy at the time. Right. Bobby was a lawyer.

00:58:20.700 I actually, when I met him, I asked him if he was ever, you know, had a desire to go into politics.

00:58:26.040 And he said, no, um, he, you know, he said he felt like he could get, he could achieve more

00:58:31.320 as an environmental attorney. Yeah. That's not, um, that, so he could go after big corporations,

00:58:38.080 big companies, uh, without worrying about a political party. So I felt good about that.

00:58:45.520 Yeah. And then, uh, no Hollywood actress is like, how can I get more politically involved

00:58:51.060 in a way that will cause all sorts of consternation in my life? Right. I know of course. And your

00:58:56.500 career has been going so well. I mean, I'm a huge fan of yours, by the way, long before you married

00:59:01.120 Bobby. Thank you. I've long been a curb fan. I love the show. I know Larry David is not in love

00:59:07.660 with my side of the aisle, but I don't care. It's funny. And it's so clever. Right. And I always knew

00:59:14.560 that it was, and you get into it a lot in unscripted. That's why I assume why it's called

00:59:18.800 unscripted, but, um, I didn't realize how loose it is, like how much free reign you're giving.

00:59:24.620 There's no script. That's terrifying.

00:59:26.140 Well, it's, it would be if you did not have a background in improv, it would be terrifying.

00:59:34.000 Uh, but you know, I started at the Groundlings theater in LA, even though I had, even though I

00:59:40.580 had studied theater and acting with scripts, that's what they tell you when you're learning.

00:59:45.980 They're like, all your answers are in your script. Yeah. That would be comforting. Yes. That's it. That

00:59:50.260 is comforting. And then when I started learning how to improvise at the Groundlings, they said,

00:59:55.300 clear your mind and don't think of anything until you hear what that person next to you says. And

01:00:02.920 it's, it's a hard adjustment. Do you have to be genuinely clever in your own right to be good at

01:00:08.760 improv? Well, I think if you want to be entertaining in improv, you probably do. Like can a boring person

01:00:18.060 be good at improv? Yes. And that's what you have to say in improv. Uh, does, uh, does an audience want

01:00:28.560 to watch a boring person improvise? That's the difference. I guess it depends on what the scene

01:00:34.680 is and what the person is supposed to be. I mean, there aren't a lot of people that are dying to

01:00:38.760 watch boring improvs. So, um, I think you have to, you have to be able to trust yourself, which is,

01:00:48.760 it's hard to get there to say, listen, whatever you're about to say is the right thing.

01:00:58.200 And even if the audience doesn't laugh, don't sweat it. Um, if the audience boos, don't sweat it. It was

01:01:06.280 the right thing. And you're going to have the next thing that you have to say. So you have to not judge

01:01:12.380 yourself, which is hard. And you also have to not worry about the reaction. You just have to really

01:01:20.080 listen to what your scene partner is saying and say, yes. And if you're good at it, um, like live

01:01:27.400 improv, I think I find terrifying. Uh, but, but the people that are good at it are, are very entertaining.

01:01:35.220 Well, when you're across from Larry David, who really is genuinely funny, just him, just his person,

01:01:41.320 his personality. Yeah. Does it make it easier? Because you don't have to be the one that leads

01:01:46.740 every scene. Like just him being himself is going to make people laugh. It does, you know,

01:01:52.420 and especially improvising on screen to, to me is so much easier, uh, because you're not,

01:02:00.680 you don't have people like looking at you, watching you. Yes. That's how I feel about the

01:02:06.060 news business. I can do it much better sitting here in a studio than like, if I have to go and speak to

01:02:10.820 the people and look at them directly. Right. Right. Um, I think that's why podcasts are so, uh,

01:02:16.940 successful too, because it's just you and me talking in a little room, but it would be different

01:02:22.120 if there were, you know, 500 people out there watching, sitting, you know, 10 feet away from us.

01:02:27.200 Um, so with Larry, yeah, I was pretty much the straight man on the show and he would write a

01:02:33.280 story outline. So the story outline would be hilarious. Um, but I didn't have to worry about

01:02:40.800 what I was going to say. Um, and he specifically did not want you to think about what you were

01:02:48.380 going to say. He didn't want anybody to try to be funny because of the situations were already

01:02:55.220 funny. That's right. I get it. Yeah. Cause it's just, the setup is funny. Yeah. All right. So let's

01:03:00.240 go back before curb and the young Cheryl Hines. You're from Florida, grew up with not a lot of money.

01:03:06.180 It's true. Grandparents lived in a trailer nearby. Yeah. Your parents didn't have a lot of dough

01:03:11.000 either. Um, one of three kids for four. Okay. I'm sorry. Cause you lost your brother. Yeah. Thank

01:03:17.220 you. Um, and did you always know you want to be an actress? I did. I did always know that probably

01:03:23.900 since I was, uh, like eight, you know, because we, we would watch the Carol Burnett show and I thought,

01:03:34.220 Oh my God, that's what I want to do. Um, so the comedic thing resonated with you early age.

01:03:39.600 And then, um, and then when I was in middle school and high school, I was just the theater nerd.

01:03:46.440 You were. Yeah. And chorus nerd.

01:03:48.260 Were you cool or was it truly nerdy in your school? Um, it, uh, I guess high school was a

01:03:56.200 little, well, we thought we were cool. Are you a nerd if you don't know you're a nerd?

01:04:03.180 It's like, uh, we thought we were doing pretty good. I don't know.

01:04:08.180 Okay. So it was a goal, but like, it's a goal for so many people and it usually doesn't happen

01:04:12.540 because it's such a competitive industry. Right. So you actually did the cross country trip.

01:04:16.620 Like I'm going to LA. My Toyota Tercel. How old were you? I was 25. Okay. And that's,

01:04:23.500 that's young enough that you can fail. Right. And still go on to do something else. Right. Right.

01:04:29.580 Right. Right. That's true because it's interesting. You know, when I was writing the book,

01:04:35.440 you see your life and all these little jigsaw puzzle pieces and you put it together.

01:04:40.740 And I think it was great that I didn't have much growing up because I had a, my family was really

01:04:48.800 solid and I always, we always had fun together. So, and I never felt like, oh, if we only had money,

01:04:55.980 my life would be so much better. It was a good lesson for me because I, when I moved to LA,

01:05:01.940 I just, I had nothing to lose. You know, you're the one person who moved to LA with like a solid

01:05:07.820 family background and like good moral upbringing and not looking to fill some dark void that had

01:05:14.060 been created by a terrible childhood. Right. It's very rare. It is rare. It is rare. It's

01:05:19.760 interesting because, uh, I know a lot of people that, that moved to LA or, or go into, you know,

01:05:27.540 acting because they want to escape. They want to be somebody else. Yeah. Um, but I never had that

01:05:34.160 feeling. As a matter of fact, it was really hard for me to move away from my family. Yeah. It was

01:05:38.640 really hard. Well, were you funny growing up? Because that's another piece of who you are.

01:05:43.160 Uh, it depends on if you're talking about, was I in on the joke or not? Um, but when I was really

01:05:54.760 little, um, like, you know, six, seven, eight, nine, I, I would not say I was funny, but would I say

01:06:04.040 that other kids laughed? Yes. Uh, because I was, I was a, I hate to look in your eyes and say this,

01:06:14.480 but I was a tattletale. Um, I'm not, I'm ashamed of it, but it's because they excluded me. So the only

01:06:21.860 attention I could get was from the adults. And I, you know, I, we call it whistleblower or informant.

01:06:27.440 I was a young whistleblower. Um, so that's how I got attention. I got attention from the grownups and,

01:06:34.840 um, I would bring them, you know, snacks. That works. They watch TV. And then of course my siblings

01:06:41.140 hated it. They were like, what are you doing? They're the other team. Yeah. Um, so I wouldn't say

01:06:48.940 I was, I was hilarious then, but when, by the time I got to high school, I could see what was

01:06:55.740 funny, you know, even like growing up without money. Um, you know, my sister and I would go to

01:07:05.280 Goodwill to buy our prom dresses. We actually, we made our own, um, boutonnieres for our dates.

01:07:13.440 Uh, which is kind of funny because it's not as easy as you think it might be.

01:07:17.080 I would not think it is easy. Well, we, we thought it was, but we got the green tape

01:07:21.180 and got some carnations and a pin. And when we got to the dance, the guy's carnations fell off

01:07:27.220 and it was just wads of green tape. And my sister and I thought was so funny. My friend Paul was so

01:07:33.220 mad. He said, Oh, did you guys make these? Which only made us laugh more. Um, so by that time,

01:07:39.680 you know, I could, I knew what was funny to me anyway.

01:07:42.820 Was when you went to LA, did you go right into this, the Groundlings workshop? And I understand

01:07:48.380 Lisa Kudrow was teaching it. You were in there with Melissa McCarthy. Yeah. Somebody else big.

01:07:53.800 Who was the other one? Um, well, Kristen Wiig was also there around the same time.

01:07:59.580 Maya Rudolph. Yeah, Maya. Yeah. My gosh. What a class. Yeah. Well, when I got to LA,

01:08:05.680 I was bartending at a hotel in downtown LA and I, you know, I wasn't ready for rejection

01:08:15.280 because at that time you could send out your headshots and resumes to all these different

01:08:22.120 agents. There were a lot of agents and I didn't do it for the first year because I thought,

01:08:28.260 what if none of them want me and I wasn't ready. Yep. Um, so I was just, I was bartending and, um,

01:08:37.380 yeah, I met Phil Hartman's sister at the bar. She was telling me about the Groundlings theater

01:08:42.780 and I went and saw a show and I was just blown away. It was the funniest show. It's like a live SNL,

01:08:53.920 you know, you're watching it in person. Yep. And, um, and then I, I started taking classes there.

01:09:00.160 Yeah. And Lisa Kudrow was my first teacher. Was she amazing? Amazing. Yeah. So smart and funny.

01:09:08.300 And this is right before she got friends. Oh, wow. Yeah. So I would go to class and just,

01:09:14.360 you know, watch her like, Oh my gosh, she's got all the answers. And then at that time as an actress,

01:09:22.460 I always thought when you go into an audition, you should be really like professional. Right. And

01:09:30.880 this is the script and I'm going to read the script. And then when I, when I saw her get friends

01:09:35.960 and I saw her character that she created, I was thinking, Oh, she had to go into that audition.

01:09:45.320 Quirky. Yes. Quirky. Yeah. And it was a game changer for me because I thought,

01:09:52.220 Oh, I think I've been, I've been worried too much about, you know, saying the right thing,

01:09:59.900 doing the right thing. Because really all they, they want to see when you walk into a room is

01:10:05.700 who you are, what's funny about you. What do you think is funny? Right. And not every role is like

01:10:12.680 Queen Victoria. Yeah. Some require a different approach. Yeah. Yeah. You're a waitress at the

01:10:18.000 diner. Relax. Um, so it was, it was interesting. I learned so much there, you know? So you get this

01:10:24.220 audition, you were, you're at the groundlings, you get this audition for what was then an hour long

01:10:29.340 special of curb. It was not, it wasn't a series. It was, it was just like come for an hour long

01:10:34.720 special. Yes. Larry David's wife. Did you know that was the role? Yes. Yeah. Cause you had to,

01:10:39.660 did you audition with him? I did. I auditioned with him. And you, you say in the book,

01:10:43.980 the one thing you didn't know in that audition is, um, again, the book is called unscripted.

01:10:47.820 We were talking to Cheryl Hines, it's author, uh, by now the book comes out next month.

01:10:52.340 You did not know that he has a strict rule against touching him.

01:10:55.700 No, I, and I'm glad I didn't because now I know. I mean, it is so Larry, but you know,

01:11:05.720 in the improv world, you are taught to make choices so quickly and to assume a relationship

01:11:14.140 and, um, you know, have a lot of physicality in a scene. So if I just met you and somebody

01:11:22.080 said, Oh, these two are making cappuccino, you know, I might put my hand around your shoulder

01:11:27.320 or something, or help your hand with the, you know, frother. Um, but then when I was walking

01:11:34.960 into the audition, the casting director said, don't, don't touch Larry. I was like, I thank

01:11:42.240 you for telling me. Thank you for, but he shook my hand when I walked in. So I thought, okay,

01:11:48.260 okay. He's not like a troll in the corner that doesn't want anybody touching him. Although he

01:11:54.320 doesn't want anybody touching. But you said he was, he was making like a serious pitch at one point

01:11:58.220 to try to change the universal greeting from a handshake. To elbow touching. Cheryl. Yeah.

01:12:04.480 How's it going? I don't think it caught on. No, it's so awkward. People did it on the set for a

01:12:10.140 little while and then it just, yeah. I mean, you, you, you'd have a better case for just the,

01:12:14.340 Hey, I know. Right. Like the hand up. I guess this is actually touching someone in his. I mean,

01:12:20.440 in church it's transformed post COVID. Have you noticed that? No. We don't really shake hands

01:12:25.220 anymore during the piece. We used to shake hands during the piece. Now it's just like, Hey,

01:12:28.740 or the little kids will give you the actual peace sign. That's adorable. I feel like Larry would

01:12:34.060 enjoy the Catholic church in that way. Yes, definitely. Yeah. He loved social distancing.

01:12:40.740 Yeah. He was like, well, finally everybody, everybody's on board. Getting on my program. Yeah.

01:12:45.520 Yeah. So you go in there and you know, my husband, he read your book too. You're, you're actually going

01:12:50.080 on his show. I know. I'm excited. Um, but he was the one who first read aloud to me the,

01:12:54.820 the following scene, which is very funny about, about when you got the call from Larry about making

01:13:02.520 the, uh, getting the role. Okay. Here it is. Um, he calls, Hey, HBO wants to turn the series into a

01:13:12.520 special or the special into a series. And I would like for you to play my wife. You, Oh my God.

01:13:18.000 That's the best news I've ever had him. I hope that's not true. Please tell me that's not true.

01:13:24.300 It's true. Don't say that. There have to be other things that have happened that are better than this.

01:13:29.660 Yeah. That's so Larry. That is amazing. He can't let you enjoy one thing. He's like,

01:13:35.300 yeah, this is the best news. He's like, don't say that. No, I don't. I can't possibly be your

01:13:41.780 highlight. He's like, you are. Okay. Okay. Well, we'll talk later. Yeah. Is he like

01:13:47.860 that in person? Like, is there ever any actual enthusiasm for anything? I mean,

01:13:51.320 the name of the show is Curb It. Uh, I'm trying to think of any time I've seen him excited.

01:13:59.240 You know, it's, it's that thing with, um, even a lot of comedians, comedic actors,

01:14:05.600 they'll watch another comedian or somebody funny. And instead of laughing, they'll say,

01:14:10.140 that's funny. Yeah. Right. Right. They just don't, not all the time, but, uh, yeah, I don't see him

01:14:18.680 really get excited about things. There was, um, some line by Hemingway to the effect of like,

01:14:24.760 I don't want to read anybody else's book because if I don't enjoy it, that's, that's bad for me. And

01:14:31.000 if I do enjoy it, I'll be so envious that that's bad for me too. I've completely screwed it up,

01:14:36.100 but that's basically the notion of it. Like Larry seems to be like that kind of a guy. Like

01:14:40.760 I'm not really rooting for you. Right. I'm not really rooting for myself either. Right. Right.

01:14:46.040 There's really no good outcome to any day. It's true. And to me, he's almost like a Woody Allen

01:14:50.640 character. Yeah. I don't know if you saw Woody Allen, uh, he's out with a book and there was a

01:14:54.740 big profile. I'm in the New York times a couple of weeks ago. And he had a quote in there saying

01:14:58.880 something like, uh, you know, I've had a great life. I come from a great family. My, my kids are great.

01:15:04.400 And, and I'm really appreciative. I'm 89. I feel in good health. I'm totally miserable. The whole

01:15:10.240 thing has been a disaster. Yeah. That does sound like Larry. Well, you know, Larry did a Woody Allen

01:15:16.240 movie. Oh yeah. I think I saw it. Now I can't remember the name of it, but. I mean, it seems

01:15:21.060 like if you're like a comedic actor and you came up over the past, you know, 50 years, you probably

01:15:25.700 had some stint in a Woody Allen movie. Good for good or for worse. So you get this job and I did not

01:15:32.060 realize Cheryl was the series on the air for 24 years. Well, we had, I think 12 seasons, but you

01:15:42.180 know, most shows her was not like most shows. Most shows would do, um, a season a year. Right. Yeah.

01:15:53.940 But for curb, even after the first season, after we wrap the first season, Larry said that that's it.

01:16:00.940 Well, we're done. So, you know, I would drive home thinking, okay, I've got to look for my next

01:16:06.880 job. And then I get a call. Oh, we're going to do another one. And so there was no rhyme or reason

01:16:14.220 to the timing of it, but yes, over 24 years, we did 12 seasons. There were, I think there was a time

01:16:21.680 when there was, um, like maybe a five-year gap. I remember that. I remember the gap. Like what,

01:16:26.920 what happened? Right. Where is it? No finale. Just like, okay. It's classic. Yeah. We have a lot

01:16:32.900 of clips, but I want to start with one that doesn't involve Larry. It's, it's, uh, from season 11. I'm

01:16:38.340 sure you've been subjected to watching this. This is with the character Maria Sophia. Oh my gosh.

01:16:44.180 Yeah. It was the funniest thing. And I love curb. I've, I've haven't watched every single episode,

01:16:48.780 but I've seen most of them, but it was really one of the funniest things I'd ever seen. I mean,

01:16:52.920 on television, she's hysterical and you're hysterical. And it just for the listening

01:16:57.600 audience, the premise of the scene that we're going to show is, uh, Larry, some guy drowned in

01:17:04.160 your Larry's pool and, um, he's worried about a lawsuit and long story short, like the,

01:17:10.980 a relative of that guy, or there's a guy who runs a restaurant who Larry's trying to appease

01:17:17.320 into not suing him. And he agrees to give that guy's daughter in the restaurant, a role in his

01:17:23.960 upcoming series. Oh, that was good. Yeah. You nailed it. Okay. And so her, his, that,

01:17:27.920 that man's daughter is named Maria Sophia and she cannot act, but she's hysterical. She's so off.

01:17:35.960 She has all the wrong emotions for every single line that they try to give her. And Larry has to

01:17:40.600 pretend she's great. Cause he's got to convince his fellow, right. To cast her. So there's a scene in

01:17:46.660 which you, as I think you were the ex-wife at that point, he asked you if you will like give

01:17:52.020 her an audition tape, like help her with her audition. Yeah. And her audition tape. Yeah.

01:17:55.980 So she comes over to your house and she, she acts up this scene and you are, you don't know what

01:18:03.160 you've been handed. Yeah. Okay. Here it is in part. I wanted to talk to you about that David boy.

01:18:11.600 Larry. Yeah. That's his name. Larry David.

01:18:14.800 Well, what about him? I feel like you're being seductive right now.

01:18:20.160 You're talking to your mother. Are we not close? In real life? Do you ever talk to your mother

01:18:25.900 like that? No, I don't seduce my mom. What is wrong with you? God. I don't really care for him.

01:18:31.440 I think he's mentally disturbed. He is not mentally disturbed. I saw that choice that you made and

01:18:40.160 maybe it's time to make a new choice. Like what kind of dance? No, not a little bit of salsa.

01:18:46.120 Let's keep going. Let's just keep. He's got mailman written all over him. You want bald children with

01:18:51.680 no brains? Go right ahead. I don't have to listen to you. If I want to see Larry, I am going to see

01:18:59.600 Larry. You are a horrible mother. I never want to see you again. Yeah. And I know that you stole my

01:19:08.820 jacket. What are you talking about? Don't touch me. Don't touch me. What are you saying? It's a jacket.

01:19:15.440 I don't know what you're talking about. Come on, Brad. elle, what are you doing? Let it go.

01:19:21.660 Get off me, I can't move. Oh my God. What is wrong with you? Don't touch me. Don't touch me.

01:19:28.440 Hang on, Cheryl. Cheryl. Oh my God. I'm coming. I want my jacket back. Let her go.

01:19:38.520 She's beating the hell out of you. Ted Danson's there too. Ted Danson comes in and gets tackled.

01:19:45.060 So that scene was so funny because she was, she was so good. And when she,

01:19:49.340 when she makes the turn and she's like, give me my jacket. It's like, what are you?

01:19:55.900 So how much is it? Was that planned? Like she's going to beat the hell out of you. That must've

01:19:59.740 been scripted. That was planned. She was going to beat the hell out of me. But yeah, all of the

01:20:05.740 dialogue is improvised. Oh my God. I love your, I see the choice you made there. About a different choice.

01:20:11.940 Something else. I feel like you're being seductive.

01:20:15.680 About your mother. It's just like, what are you doing? And then she just would get so angry.

01:20:21.960 Cheryl, how do you not laugh? Like seriously, how do you not break down in hysterics as she's

01:20:26.260 doing the weird dancing and the seductive to her mother thing?

01:20:28.840 No, that was hard. I have to bite the inside of my cheek.

01:20:32.040 Do you?

01:20:32.540 Yeah.

01:20:33.200 How?

01:20:33.940 Well, it works.

01:20:34.920 See, that's a, that's a bad habit because it can swell up with scar tissue and then it

01:20:39.560 interferes with your speaking. I know about this because.

01:20:43.980 It sounds like you do.

01:20:45.060 Because I never had my wisdom teeth removed and my mouth is too small for all those wisdom

01:20:50.040 teeth. I know no one would believe it. Small mouth. And I was going through a thing where

01:20:54.400 I kept like biting on my cheek. It was killing me. So I had one wisdom tooth pulled.

01:21:00.520 Can I ask you this? You don't have to answer. Well, why didn't you have them removed?

01:21:04.020 I don't, I came from a not well-off family that didn't think about things. The same reason

01:21:07.900 I didn't take any review course for the SAT.

01:21:10.460 Same.

01:21:11.040 Right?

01:21:11.660 By the way, the SAT, I took that thing the night after our homecoming dance.

01:21:18.700 Yeah.

01:21:21.400 I didn't do great. Let's be honest.

01:21:23.860 It was a surprise. I didn't even know we were having the SAT. I was like, oh, it's the

01:21:27.420 SAT today?

01:21:28.140 What's up?

01:21:28.620 Shit. Does anyone have a number two pencil?

01:21:30.840 That's exactly how it was. And I was like, okay. And I never took it again.

01:21:33.920 Did you ever take it again?

01:21:34.940 No, I never took it. No one even thought to tell me to take it again.

01:21:37.460 No.

01:21:37.860 My parents were like, oh, okay, that's fine. It was terrible.

01:21:40.500 That is so interesting.

01:21:41.760 I did terribly. And miraculously, I still got into Syracuse University because I had a decent

01:21:46.920 GPA. And I think they actually were, they just had mercy on me because my dad, like,

01:21:53.980 they did.

01:21:54.620 I don't think that's how it works in admissions.

01:21:56.680 No, they did. But I have a story because my dad had taught there my first 10 years of

01:22:01.440 life. We lived in Syracuse and then my dad had passed. And so my story, you know, was

01:22:07.000 like, and I think they actually did just have mercy on me because I did not really. Syracuse,

01:22:11.060 it's much harder to get into now, but back then it wasn't that hard. But I still shouldn't

01:22:14.800 have been admitted with that SAT score. I was just like, no, I was focused on other things.

01:22:20.120 You know what I mean?

01:22:20.640 Yeah. It is a different world. And it's a different world when you come from,

01:22:27.840 I was going to say wealth or money or resources.

01:22:32.020 Yes. We would never let our kids go into the SAT without having taken some practice tests.

01:22:38.940 Right.

01:22:39.320 Like, that's not even a thing in the world I'm in now.

01:22:42.460 No, I know. It's weird, but maybe because we grew up, because you know how I, I mean,

01:22:48.520 it's amazing that my, all my siblings went to college. It's amazing because our parents were

01:22:55.200 not, you know, they didn't say you guys have got to go to college.

01:23:00.280 Oh, it's like a thrill that you seem to be kind of happy and not upset about too much.

01:23:05.260 Yeah.

01:23:05.800 You know, do your thing.

01:23:06.600 Yeah. Do your thing.

01:23:07.240 You went to cosmetology school.

01:23:09.620 I did.

01:23:10.140 Before I went to college.

01:23:11.100 Yeah. You eventually went to college.

01:23:12.600 But like, did anybody care about that? Because, you know, in, in this community, if a kid said,

01:23:17.380 I'm going to cosmetology school, the parents would be like, what do you mean? You're going

01:23:20.640 to an Ivy League.

01:23:21.700 No, my mom was thrilled. And as a matter of fact, like halfway through, you know, I was

01:23:28.260 17 when I started cosmetology school and I was having to do perms and jerry curls. And

01:23:35.900 this woman came in and, and I, I thought something looked off and I asked my teacher to come look

01:23:43.680 at her hair and she said, she has lice and you need to go tell her. And I was like, I

01:23:49.740 don't, I don't, I don't want to tell her.

01:23:52.940 I don't want anything to do with this.

01:23:54.200 And I've been like shampooing. There's so many things.

01:23:58.180 I can feel them right now.

01:23:59.300 I know. I know. And, um, at one point I thought, I don't think I want to finish this.

01:24:06.240 And my mom gave me a long talk and she said, do not quit. Like finish what you start. You

01:24:15.180 started this and you should finish it. I was like, well, we're talking about beauty school,

01:24:19.380 right? Um, but it was a good, it was a good lesson. And I did. And I did.

01:24:23.340 And those are skills you can always use.

01:24:25.640 It's true.

01:24:26.080 You know, I always wish I had taken something like that because it would have saved me a

01:24:30.220 fortune.

01:24:30.700 I know.

01:24:31.160 I know.

01:24:32.260 Do you do your own hair and makeup or no?

01:24:33.860 Not today.

01:24:34.700 So it's not, so you just, it's not saving you a fortune.

01:24:36.740 Yeah, it wasn't. But I think it was helpful when I was going out on auditions and stuff.

01:24:40.540 Yeah.

01:24:40.700 I think that was helpful.

01:24:41.520 Yeah.

01:24:41.940 Yeah.

01:24:42.200 And then you go back to college. Okay. So now you get the role on curb and then you

01:24:45.820 shot to stardom quickly. That's a big role for your first big break.

01:24:50.520 What was interesting because the show was, um, I don't want to say small, but compared to

01:24:58.080 the other shows that were on HBO at the time, I mean, when we premiered, we premiered after

01:25:04.600 sex in the city before the Sopranos.

01:25:07.760 Wow.

01:25:08.160 So you had those shows that were so big. I remember the Sunday nights watching it.

01:25:13.460 Yes. It was appointment television.

01:25:15.300 So we were kind of the little show in between, um, was supposed to look like a documentary.

01:25:22.880 So it was sort of, you know, it was not shiny and pretty like, like the others. Um, and so

01:25:32.340 at the beginning, it was really the industry liked it, liked the show because they loved

01:25:40.900 Larry. Larry co-created Seinfeld and, and he's so funny and everybody wanted to see what he

01:25:48.280 was going to do. And, um, but the rest of the country, you know, a lot of people didn't

01:25:56.320 know what to make of it.

01:25:57.380 What is it? It took a while to get familiar with it and its cadence and realize like, it's

01:26:02.760 a show about nothing like Seinfeld, you know, it really is.

01:26:05.480 Yeah. And there aren't punchlines because there's no script.

01:26:07.880 No, but you never turn out without having had genuine laughs.

01:26:12.240 Yeah. Even when you're, even when you sit down and you're, and you think I'm not in

01:26:17.140 the mood to laugh out loud and I'm just going to watch this. And then Larry does, you know,

01:26:22.500 I don't know, trip Shaquille O'Neal during the Lakers game. And now all of LA is mad at

01:26:27.840 him.

01:26:27.940 Or he's stealing sneakers from the Holocaust museum.

01:26:30.960 Oh my gosh.

01:26:31.780 Nothing is untouchable.

01:26:33.340 No.

01:26:33.720 Nothing.

01:26:34.200 No. And then you keep, you can't, and you turn it off going, I can't believe he just

01:26:38.320 did that.

01:26:39.260 Right.

01:26:39.760 How is he still getting away with it?

01:26:41.160 I know he can get away with it. So now what, so then 2014, you and Bobby got together.

01:26:47.020 What was the year you, you guys got together?

01:26:49.100 I don't know.

01:26:50.560 Somewhere in there.

01:26:51.240 Yeah. Let's say somewhere in there.

01:26:52.840 And at that point he was a Democrat from a famous family who was an environmental lawyer.

01:26:58.800 So I imagine there was no like, why him? Like there would have been, had you married

01:27:03.580 him like today.

01:27:04.420 Right. Right.

01:27:05.420 Okay. So it's like, great, cool. A Kennedy.

01:27:07.300 Right. But then he, you know, now I feel like knowing him the way I know him, which

01:27:13.460 is just a little from, you know, this era of his life seems inevitable. He was going

01:27:18.700 to get into politics in some way. Like he's just too dedicated to like helping people and

01:27:22.780 these causes that mean so much to him.

01:27:24.580 Right.

01:27:24.860 So, but it was a surprise to you. He went first, people may forget he ran for president

01:27:30.140 for a year and a half before he actually, you know, endorsed Trump and then went the HHS

01:27:34.860 route. So you, not only does he say he's getting into politics, he's getting into presidential

01:27:39.580 politics. And by the way, I guess we kind of skipped the part where he was banned. He

01:27:45.320 was at the top of the disinformation dozen by the Biden White House.

01:27:48.160 Right. Ours was one of the very first shows that platformed him. And he's been very sweet

01:27:54.920 and thanked us publicly many times for helping pave the way back.

01:27:57.520 He's very grateful to you.

01:27:58.800 Oh my God. We, it was our pleasure, but you would not believe how hard it was because none

01:28:03.340 of the platforms wanted him.

01:28:05.260 Yeah.

01:28:05.800 So we had to do this crazy interview with him. It was three hours long, four hours. We

01:28:09.440 did two hours and two hours. We're like, we had to fact check him on all these things

01:28:12.780 just to make it live.

01:28:14.080 Right.

01:28:14.540 You know, quote fact check.

01:28:15.600 Right.

01:28:16.040 In other words, just challenge him.

01:28:17.440 Right.

01:28:17.960 And, and he did, it lived on every single platform. And after that, he was like, not

01:28:22.900 legit untouchable anymore. Yeah. It was like, we had done it and it was like, it's fine.

01:28:27.220 You can interview him and it can live and you won't get censored everywhere.

01:28:29.900 Right. And then the more people listen to him, I think the more they were like, oh my

01:28:32.720 God, he makes so much sense.

01:28:34.380 Yes.

01:28:34.800 This is what they've been telling us is so terrifying.

01:28:37.260 I know.

01:28:38.020 So what was that like for you to see him sort of normal environmental lawyer, then disinformation

01:28:42.780 dozen banned, and then kind of back and running for president?

01:28:46.000 Well, that's why I wrote a book because it was crazy. It was crazy. There were times that

01:28:54.780 were really challenging. You know, it also times that were fun, more challenging than fun,

01:29:04.780 but it was definitely a shift. And it's, it's strange the way it all happened, right? Because

01:29:10.700 the, when, when everybody shut down for COVID, there was a shift in the world, right?

01:29:19.600 Yeah.

01:29:19.820 And probably a shift in everybody's family because everybody locked down and now you're

01:29:26.780 with your family under the same roof 24 seven. So that, that was a shift in itself. And then,

01:29:33.320 you know, Bobby was questioning the vaccine safety and that was so, um,

01:29:42.540 people were so passionate about it on volatile. You were not allowed. It was like, but the odd

01:29:50.080 thing was, I mean, odd in a weird way is like a lot of crunchy people in California had questions,

01:29:55.280 you know, his constituency was sort of weird. Yeah. Couldn't always predict it by party label

01:30:00.560 or even voting history. Like a lot of his people probably never voted. Right.

01:30:04.700 But they had questions too. Right. Which I actually, I love that about Bobby. And I loved

01:30:10.840 when he was running, I really loved his supporters and the, the makeup of the supporters, because

01:30:19.000 there were Republicans, independents, and Democrats who were coming together and they were,

01:30:27.260 you know, they, they were all there because they wanted something better for each other,

01:30:32.420 for themselves and they supported Bobby. And it was so great. I just loved his, you know, supporters,

01:30:39.200 but it was so interesting because yes, in LA, um, there is a lot of, um, the people are,

01:30:50.720 I would say very careful about what they eat, what, you know, they exercise. Yeah. So you have these,

01:31:00.840 uh, people, mothers who have always been thoughtful about what they give their kids as far as medicine

01:31:09.320 goes, they, you know, so that when Bobby steps forward, um, and says, I'm, I hear you and you're

01:31:17.280 right. You should be questioning. You should be thinking about it. Then to see some people turn

01:31:23.300 against him was so strange. It's like on that issue. I mean, I've said this before when I was

01:31:28.760 at Fox, if you said anything about the vaccine schedule for kids, you get a call immediately

01:31:35.440 to stop talking about that. Yeah. And you know, Pfizer was one of our big advertisers. I was young

01:31:40.520 and didn't really put it together. Right. But it is crazy. Like there are certain things you're not

01:31:46.140 allowed to talk about. Right. You can't talk about it. And he was like a third rail. Let me love it.

01:31:51.640 Let me hold it. I know. And you're over there like, oh. I'm like Bobby, everybody, you're like

01:31:58.520 making people go crazy. He's like, I don't care. No. And you can tell that's true. Yeah. That's the

01:32:05.100 challenge. Yeah. Um, a new opportunity arose. Yes. An opportunity. I like the way that you say that.

01:32:11.700 Um, so it was interesting because, you know, the thing about LA too, that I think a lot of people

01:32:19.600 think about it because it is very liberal and it, and at the same time, there are plenty of people

01:32:28.300 who aren't, there are plenty of Republicans. The ones who don't say anything. Yeah. Those are the

01:32:33.000 Republicans. Yeah. Um, so it was, it was tough because I did, and I talked about it

01:32:41.160 in the book, unscripted. There we go. By Cheryl Hines. Cheryl Hines coming out November 11th.

01:32:46.000 Um, I talk about it because I would have been happy to never talk about vaccines. And I, I don't mean

01:32:55.840 that in a bad way because they are, it's very important. Um, and it's of course very important

01:33:04.240 to everyone's health and we need to look at it, but I, that's not what I do. No, it's not my background.

01:33:11.060 It's not. And at that time I had people from both sides coming at me saying, can, let me tell you

01:33:19.220 about this thing that happened to me or tell your husband to stop saying that. Oh gosh. And it was

01:33:26.340 overwhelming at times, you know, he felt so bad. I know. When we talked to him and whatever it was,

01:33:32.980 he felt so bad. He was a poor Cheryl, like the nicest person. And he was, I know. And, uh, he

01:33:40.720 offered like to do a fake separation just so you didn't get the blowback. It was like, which was

01:33:45.700 sweet. But I was thinking, I don't know how that would work. Yeah. No, those can, those things can

01:33:54.020 tend to lead to the real deal. Well, right. It's like, Oh, are they set? And then that's

01:33:57.540 the story. Are they separated? No, they're still together. No, it's, but it's crazy how people

01:34:02.320 expected you actually to leave him. Yeah. Like, of course my team pulled together all sorts of

01:34:08.460 tweets, but the one I'll read and I, I don't want to give the haters a lot of airtime, but

01:34:12.340 the one, let me see if I can find it. It was from Bradley Whitford where I really wanted to punch

01:34:16.480 in the face after reading this. My God, what a douchebag. And I, and I talk about it. I talk

01:34:22.040 about that in my book. He really thinks he's like, he, he thinks he's the West wing character.

01:34:26.560 Hello. I know he tweets out. Hey, Cheryl Hines, way to stay silent while your lunatic husband

01:34:31.460 throws his support behind the adjudicated rapist who brags about stripping women of their fundamental

01:34:36.380 rights. Gutsy. Great example for the kids profile and courage. Do you ever think about responding?

01:34:42.220 Do you ever want to be like, yo, Bradley, go fuck yourself.

01:34:46.480 Yes. Yes. I've had those thoughts. Well, it's interesting because, you know, I know Bradley

01:34:53.880 just casually, you know, I've, I'm sure I've worked with them somewhere somehow, but so I talk about

01:35:03.680 it in the book because I tried to stay off social media. I tried to stay off it as much as possible.

01:35:09.480 And then I wake up and I see these texts like, wow, that guy's an asshole. Yeah. And I was thinking,

01:35:13.520 oh, let's see of all the guys I know that could be an asshole making bets with myself. Who could

01:35:20.540 this be? Well, I'm sorry, but it must, you must've thought Rob Reiner first. Cause I know you worked

01:35:25.120 with him. He's got crazy TDS. Yeah. But, but Rob, uh, I like Rob and I don't think he would ever,

01:35:35.320 he would never come after me. Yes. There's a difference. He might go after Bobby. Um,

01:35:40.720 and that's fine. And that's fine. That was so weird about this out there. Yeah. What's so weird

01:35:44.740 about this is coming for you, the spouse. I know I was so, uh, I was, I was, uh, sort of confused

01:35:55.620 because I didn't understand what he was hoping for. Yeah. Like you're supposed to walk out in a

01:36:02.740 huff. Yeah. He's right. Yeah. It's over. It's over, Bobby. It was a very odd. And, um,

01:36:12.480 that day I kept, you know, I'm texting my best friend, Rachel. I'm like,

01:36:17.660 and my friend, and, and I'm like, uh, do I say anything? Do I need to make a statement? I love my

01:36:25.360 husband and I'm not going to have a divorce or his politics. Sorry. He could feel better or worse

01:36:32.740 or I don't know. So that I can maintain Bradley's love. You're more important to me, Bradley. Right.

01:36:40.120 Thank you for this tweet. Now that you mentioned it, I'm going to do some work. Uh, so it was

01:36:44.920 interesting because I, so I didn't do anything. I didn't, I just, you know, took a breath and was

01:36:50.520 at the end of the day, it's a, in my opinion, sort of a silly tweet. Also, what does he say

01:36:58.360 something about the kids? Like, wait, a good example for the kids. Yeah. Yeah. I was like,

01:37:03.640 what kids? I didn't even understand that part either. Bobby's stepkids. Yeah. Your stepkids

01:37:10.120 have hit. Right. And it's like, well, actually for my kids. Yeah. I think it's good to stand by

01:37:17.340 your husband, your wife, your spouse when they're, they're doing something that's important.

01:37:25.580 They're there. So that was also, it's very strange. You do find out as Eric Trump was just

01:37:32.400 telling us on the show on Friday, who your friends are when you get into politics, you know, that

01:37:36.540 Donald Trump senior sat them all down when he announced him 15 and said, now we're going to

01:37:41.200 find out who our friends are. And it's so true. Yeah. Like, because there'd be highs and lows. And I've

01:37:46.460 said this many times on the show, but no one gets as bad as Bobby. Like we're from the press.

01:37:52.300 They hate Elon. The press hates Elon. They hate Pete Hegseth, but they really hate Bobby in a

01:37:56.720 particular way. Cause he was a Democrat and you're not allowed to turn on them.

01:37:59.700 But by the way, when he was a Democrat, they did not embrace him.

01:38:02.480 No, because he was asking the wrong questions. He was embracing the wrong third rails. But I was

01:38:07.620 telling the audience in my house, I get the wall street journal, the New York times and the New York

01:38:11.720 post every day. And when he's in the news for whatever, all three are bad. It's very rare.

01:38:16.500 The very, very rare figure who has universally bad press, but he's the most popular cabinet member.

01:38:22.560 Did you know that? I did. Yeah. He's the most popular with the people and the least popular

01:38:28.400 with the press, which I think says he's doing something right. Now I know you, you write about

01:38:34.920 how you've become friends with some of the other like spouses to the cabinet members. Is there a

01:38:39.880 favorite? Is there like, do you have a bestie? Oh, well, I really like Jeanette Rubio. I like

01:38:47.320 Marco. I probably shouldn't call him Marco. I mean, that's, that's the other thing I'm always

01:38:52.240 asking Bobby, you know, because I see everybody at dinner and we're just hanging out that I'll say,

01:38:58.880 am I supposed to call Tulsi? Um, I even forget what her. Madam director. Yes. Director.

01:39:05.460 He's like, I don't think so. Sounds kind of communist when you say it like that, doesn't it?

01:39:08.480 Yeah. That's too much. But I can't even remember every, what I was supposed to call

01:39:13.240 everybody, but I liked them all. It's interesting because I thought, I don't know what I thought.

01:39:20.000 I didn't really think about it too much, but I, I guess I thought it would be a lot of boring

01:39:27.480 politicos. Probably in a different administration. You're probably right. I think you're right.

01:39:33.400 This, this president's got a, you know, a colorful personality and it attracts.

01:39:38.160 Yes. Right. You're right.

01:39:39.360 Colorful personalities too.

01:39:40.660 And they like each other, this cabinet.

01:39:43.420 Wow.

01:39:43.820 It's interesting. I mean, once again, I've never paid attention. I couldn't tell you,

01:39:48.640 I don't know anything about anybody else's cabinet in the history of, you know, politics.

01:39:55.140 Um, but, uh, but from everything I know and see, and I'm experiencing, it sounds like this is a

01:40:03.960 different, uh, way of leading. Yeah. That they really are supportive of each other. Yeah. You can

01:40:12.560 see that it's a team effort. Yeah. Speaking with Cheryl Hines about her book, Unscripted comes out

01:40:18.300 next month. Get your advanced copy. Now do you politics usually in my experience can be very

01:40:26.440 beneficial to the world. It can give one a sense of fulfillment because you're doing good. Um,

01:40:31.320 it can also be very, very hard. It can be, it can be somewhat soul crushing. I know a lot of people

01:40:36.040 have gone through the process and like emerged battle weary because it can be soul crushing. It's

01:40:42.380 just nonstop controversy and so on. So how are you guys feeling about that aspect of it? Just the

01:40:48.200 nonstop onslaught. Um, actually we, I don't want to say we feel good about it. Who can feel good

01:40:56.400 about it, but it's, it's, you know, it makes, um, it makes us stronger. Me and Bobby makes us really

01:41:08.840 strong because we have fun together. Even when we go to these, you know, um, parties or dinners,

01:41:17.940 as long as we're together, we'll have fun. And then to see what he is accomplishing and what the

01:41:24.680 administration is accomplishing, it feels like it's okay. People can say what they're going to say.

01:41:32.220 We're doing something higher. Yeah. And you see, you know, Bobby's getting petroleum dyes out of our

01:41:39.620 food source, you know, we're out of our food. Um, he's getting arsenic and lead out of our baby

01:41:45.600 formula. And so it's okay. We'll take the heat. We'll take the digs. We'll take the headlines,

01:41:52.820 whatever. But if he's, he's actually getting really good work done and same with, um, drug prices,

01:41:58.300 um, favorite nation drug prices that everybody, everything I'm talking about is beneficial for

01:42:04.740 every American. Yeah. So it's not just one party. It's stuff you don't understand how anybody could

01:42:08.180 object to. Right. Have you been eating like this since you met him? Like, have you been doing the

01:42:12.400 beef tallow and all that? I'm a vegetarian. Oh yeah. Um, so beef tallow, no.

01:42:20.140 I just picture like, what is life living, like, like living with Bobby Kennedy? Is he up at dawn

01:42:27.420 first mile run and then all like the natural organic everything? Yes. Yeah. He's up at dawn.

01:42:35.080 He gets up at the same time every day. The alarm goes off and I'm like, um, he gets up early. He,

01:42:42.560 he, he works out every day. Yeah. You can see that in the videos. He, he goes to a meeting,

01:42:48.340 you know, he's, he's in the program and that's very important to him. And, um, and that's how he

01:42:54.940 starts to stay, you know, and he eats, uh, clean. Yeah. He does not have the McDonald's on board Air

01:43:01.780 Force One with the Prez. No, I don't walk in and see him eating like a bag of Doritos watching football.

01:43:08.040 That never happens. Not surprised. Yeah. Listen, I'm so, so you're a Washington wife right now,

01:43:13.680 right? I mean, like currently having dinner at the white house. So this is a whole new

01:43:18.320 phase and yeah, is it enjoyable? Like, are you enjoying this phase? I am, you know, I think,

01:43:25.720 uh, I have a lot of friends who at our age, my age, um, you know, their, their kids have gone,

01:43:34.820 they moved out and their life is sort of quiet and they're bored. And my life is the opposite.

01:43:42.020 You are not bored. It would be impossible. Yeah. I got to wrap it because we're going to hit their

01:43:47.100 hard break, but the book is unscripted. It's by Cheryl Hines. Highly recommend it. It's an easy,

01:43:51.880 fun, fascinating read. Make a good present just in time for Christmas and Thanksgiving and all the

01:43:56.860 holidays. Lots of love. Thank you so much. Thanks for being here. Thank you so much. See you soon.

01:44:03.880 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

01:44:08.540 Bye.

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01:44:31.000 So, everyone is,

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The Megyn Kelly Show - October 13, 2025

Trump's Miraculous and Historic Hostage Deal, with Batya Ungar-Sargon, and Cheryl Hines on Smears of RFK Jr. ｜ Ep. 1170

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