The Megyn Kelly Show - Trump vs. DeSantis Culture War, and Sorority Trans Pledge Lawsuit, with Jeffrey Lord, Michael Duncan, Viva Frei, and Vinnie Politan

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00:00:31.000 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations.

00:00:42.460 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Wednesday.

00:00:46.840 We've got a hot show lined up for you today.

00:00:48.540 In just a bit, we're going to break down the settlement which happened just after we went off the air yesterday

00:00:53.160 between Fox News and Dominion.

00:00:55.000 So I got my wish. I got my wish.

00:00:57.540 I did not want this thing to be tried through for very good journalistic reasons.

00:01:01.660 And I think it was a great result for Dominion.

00:01:04.300 I think it was the right result for Fox, given where they were.

00:01:08.420 And it was the wrong result for Nerd Prom.

00:01:12.360 Nerd Prom's sad.

00:01:13.740 Nerd Prom doesn't get to spend the next six weeks writing about the cool kids at Fox News.

00:01:18.500 Brian Stelter.

00:01:21.020 I can only imagine the discussion he had at home.

00:01:23.440 He's got a book, a podcast, and a column of Vanity Fair going based on this trial, which now has settled.

00:01:30.100 Plus, we're going to have a big follow-up to the fake rape story out of Stanford.

00:01:34.400 The students were protesting all over campus, saying Stanford supports rapes and rapists.

00:01:41.260 Turned out she was a liar.

00:01:42.880 She had made up not one, but two fake rape stories, potentially ruining a man's life.

00:01:48.940 We'll bring you the update.

00:01:50.240 But we begin today with politics and the increasingly ugly battle between former President Donald Trump

00:01:55.460 and as yet undeclared presidential candidate, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis.

00:02:00.420 Buckle up.

00:02:00.860 It's going to be a bumpy ride.

00:02:02.400 Joining me now, Michael Duncan, co-host of The Ruthless Podcast, flying solo today without the rest of the gang,

00:02:08.760 and Jeffrey Lord, a political strategist and contributing editor to The American Spectator.

00:02:14.320 Great to have you both here.

00:02:15.340 Thanks for coming on.

00:02:16.820 Hello there, Megan.

00:02:18.160 Great to be here.

00:02:19.680 Yeah, it's great to see you.

00:02:20.560 Okay, so it's starting to get, you know, a little thorny.

00:02:23.420 It's presidential politics.

00:02:24.640 It should.

00:02:25.320 This is what's expected.

00:02:26.260 But we'll kick it off on an issue near and dear to my own heart, which is the madness around the transgender conversation these days.

00:02:35.720 Ron DeSantis giving an interview to Benny Johnson, who went down there, spent some time with him walking around.

00:02:41.320 We played a clip yesterday, but then Governor DeSantis got really specific on where he stands on this issue.

00:02:47.520 And our pal Matt Walsh over at Daily Wire, who's been in many ways leading the charge in this whole thing.

00:02:53.340 He's the one behind the movie What is a Woman?

00:02:54.900 All that stuff.

00:02:55.820 He loved this clip.

00:02:57.300 He loves DeSantis.

00:02:58.240 And he was saying no other candidate has come close to being this direct on this issue.

00:03:04.740 Let's play it.

00:03:05.580 It's not one.

00:03:07.020 Some of this is, yes, it's taking away opportunities and athletics and some other stuff.

00:03:11.840 And that's really, really important.

00:03:12.980 But I think there's also just the issue of, are we going to be a society based on truth?

00:03:17.880 Are we going to be a society based on deceit?

00:03:20.580 And if you take a man and they dress up as a woman and you tell me I have to accept that they're a woman, then you're asking me to be complicit in a lie.

00:03:28.360 And I just refuse to do that.

00:03:31.080 Wow.

00:03:31.900 Pretty extraordinary.

00:03:33.480 And right on the nose, like going beyond sports and women's locker rooms and all that.

00:03:40.060 Before I bring you in, I'll just play the other side.

00:03:42.980 Here's just like a highlight reel of Donald Trump Jr., I think, is in here and Donald Trump himself.

00:03:49.660 And there's a little bit of DeSantis.

00:03:51.460 It's just a mashup of the other guys, including a little DeSantis and their prior positions on this.

00:03:57.860 I don't give a shit, dude.

00:03:58.900 If you're an adult and you want to be trans and you do it, great.

00:04:01.240 If you're happy, you're productive.

00:04:02.960 I actually don't give a shit.

00:04:04.260 I'm fairly liberal on the issue.

00:04:05.680 And if you take a man and they dress up as a woman and you tell me I have to accept that they're a woman, then you're asking me to be complicit in a lie.

00:04:14.260 And I just refuse to do that.

00:04:16.300 Speak about North Carolina bathroom law in particular.

00:04:19.440 Leave it the way it is right now.

00:04:21.140 There have been very few problems.

00:04:23.440 Leave it the way it is.

00:04:24.220 If Caitlyn Jenner were to walk into Trump Tower and want to use the bathroom, you would be fine with her using any bathroom she chooses.

00:04:32.300 That is correct.

00:04:32.920 That was from David Reboy, who put it together.

00:04:36.920 Just, you know, you can see some lines are being drawn.

00:04:39.560 Let me kick it off with you, Jeffrey, since you are new to the program, but I always admired you while you were in Trump as a fierce on CNN as a fierce Trump defender.

00:04:48.380 You know, it's like you need both sides represented.

00:04:50.900 I'll just say to the audience, this is one of the problems we had last time around at Fox News.

00:04:54.560 We were going into the election in 16 and we had all these sort of conservatives on who were more establishment types, who looked at Trump as a joke.

00:05:03.960 And sooner or later, Roger Ailes realized we had no true Trump defenders on the show.

00:05:08.220 We only had like Republicans who hated him, which really did leave lead to an imbalance that the audience objected to.

00:05:15.080 So I appreciate you coming on as a as a full-throated Trump defender.

00:05:18.100 And we'll get to Duncan's perspective, too.

00:05:20.140 Go ahead.

00:05:20.660 Your thoughts on this issue and how it's unfolding.

00:05:22.920 Well, I think I think Donald Trump, in one sense, is a bit of a libertarian when he comes to this, you know, just shrug your shoulder, do what you're going to do.

00:05:31.380 But I do think on on the other hand, you know, this whole business with Bud Light.

00:05:37.600 I mean, that was not organized.

00:05:39.880 It's not like somebody planned to do that.

00:05:43.100 The the outrage, as it were, that swelled up from the bottom, I think, really says where the country is.

00:05:50.880 They may not care about some of this, but for heaven's sakes, they're not going to be pushed into going along with some of it, whether it's on sports teams or the silly business with the beer or what have you, what have you.

00:06:04.180 And I just think that that is a major political force here in this discussion.

00:06:09.640 And you will see it surface again and again and again.

00:06:14.380 I haven't heard Trump talk about this issue lately, Jeffrey.

00:06:18.400 I feel I could be wrong.

00:06:20.600 But if you were to compare the way I sounded on this issue four or five years ago versus now, I would sound very different.

00:06:30.020 And I do wonder whether Trump is going to sound different.

00:06:32.480 Now, Rick Grinnell didn't sound different.

00:06:35.220 You know, he was sort of coming after people like David on this, suggesting some of this talk is transphobic.

00:06:41.200 But I wonder, do you think Trump is going to sound more like DeSantis in that clip when he does speak about this?

00:06:49.280 Oh, I think I think Donald Trump will always sound like Donald Trump.

00:06:53.060 He he he used to kid me that I compared him all the time to Ronald Reagan.

00:06:57.900 But as I also tried to say, Trump is Trump.

00:07:01.640 You know, Reagan was Reagan.

00:07:02.940 And I think in this case, Trump is not going to be DeSantis.

00:07:06.080 He'll be Trump and his own unique take on this, not to mention everything else for that matter, but certainly on this.

00:07:15.060 You know, Michael, we had we played the clip earlier this week of Don Jr.

00:07:20.320 out there ripping on the Bud Light boycott.

00:07:25.240 I'll play just a little bit of it to freshen people's memory, but he was against it.

00:07:29.740 Here he is.

00:07:31.680 Anheuser-Buss totally shit the bed with this Dylan Mulvaney thing.

00:07:36.300 I'm not, though, for destroying an American and iconic company for something like this.

00:07:42.260 When I actually look into it, I'm not going to blame the whole company for the inaction

00:07:46.020 or the stupidity of someone in a marketing campaign that got woke as hell.

00:07:50.560 And we looked into the political giving and lobbying history of Anheuser-Busch.

00:07:56.560 And guess what?

00:07:58.280 They actually support Republicans in in woke corporate America.

00:08:03.320 Anheuser-Busch supports Republicans.

00:08:06.600 And by the way, here's Ron DeSantis on the issue of Bud Light.

00:08:12.260 I've ever seen a drink Bud Light.

00:08:16.180 I mean, like, honestly, that's like them rubbing our faces in it.

00:08:19.980 And it's like these companies that do this, if they never have any response, they're just

00:08:24.820 going to keep doing it.

00:08:26.020 If you don't have conservative beer drinkers, you're going to feel that.

00:08:29.580 And so, you know, I think it's a righteous.

00:08:31.860 I think it's a righteous thing.

00:08:33.140 Will we ever see you drinking a Bud Light again?

00:08:35.060 No, I don't think so.

00:08:37.660 Go ahead, Duncan.

00:08:38.400 What do you make of it?

00:08:38.880 Well, I think, number one, there's a particular irony of Team Trump, who has been attacking

00:08:44.720 Ron DeSantis as sort of this globalist shill for the, you know, the donor set, talking about

00:08:51.300 how, oh, well, Bud Light donates to Republicans, so we got to lay off them, right?

00:08:55.280 Like there's something dissonant about that, number one.

00:08:58.220 I mean, but then also, I think the Trump team has to decide whether they want to be a commentator

00:09:02.920 about the issue of culture if they want to engage in the culture war itself.

00:09:06.400 And, you know, clearly Ron DeSantis has decided that he's going to be a culture warrior on

00:09:10.860 this issue.

00:09:11.400 In particular, it animates the base, not just because of women's sports or, you know, the

00:09:17.680 Dylan Mulvaney issue, but when it comes to kids, that's where I think, you know, primary

00:09:23.320 voters are going to be incredibly animated.

00:09:25.640 And I think, you know, also Donald Trump's clearly uncomfortable talking about these sort

00:09:30.380 of culture issues.

00:09:31.100 You saw it with the bathroom bill in that clip that you played earlier.

00:09:33.720 And so I think what you'll see is he sort of retreats to commentator Trump, and I've

00:09:39.700 talked about this a lot on the show, where instead of really engaging on the issue or

00:09:43.600 in policy, he's talking to you like a guy on your couch, right?

00:09:47.900 And, you know, you see that with Disney, right?

00:09:50.180 He's out there on truth social.

00:09:51.920 He's putting up truths about, oh, you know, DeSantis is getting played by Disney again,

00:09:56.740 yada, yada, yada, how bad that is.

00:09:58.400 But he's not really talking about the issue itself that animates the fight in the first place,

00:10:01.780 which was a Disney coming out against the DeSantis legislation in Florida that the media

00:10:08.080 falsely claims is a don't say gay bill.

00:10:10.920 So I think, you know, Donald Trump and his strategy is going to kind of triangulate around

00:10:14.640 the culture war and basically criticize DeSantis or other candidates for what he sees as perceived

00:10:20.620 missteps in the fight rather than engaging as directly as a Ron DeSantis will.

00:10:25.820 By the way, for our audience, if you did not listen to last Thursday's Ruthless, which did

00:10:29.680 a postmortem on the Tucker Trump interview and how Trump answered some of the questions

00:10:33.780 you missed out, as you guys were talking about how Trump does have this ability to talk to

00:10:38.380 you like you're his buddy on the couch.

00:10:40.400 And they were like, you know, Tucker said something like, you know, what do you make of

00:10:42.680 she?

00:10:43.620 And he said something like he had the hottest translator.

00:10:47.340 His translator was so beautiful.

00:10:48.600 You guys had me crying with that analysis.

00:10:55.920 Well, but it's it's it's so true, Megan.

00:10:57.600 And it's also what he does so well on a debate stage.

00:10:59.800 Right.

00:11:00.620 It's like you can attack Donald Trump for any number of things that you might want to based

00:11:04.500 on, you know, what he did as president or, you know, comments he's made.

00:11:07.280 But what he's doing is he's having a meta conversation with the audience.

00:11:10.120 And, you know, half the time he's like, can you believe this guy?

00:11:13.080 Can you believe this guy's attacking me?

00:11:14.920 And it's effective.

00:11:16.280 It really is.

00:11:16.940 But this one is interesting for me, Jeffrey.

00:11:21.820 Well, but let me ask you, let me see on this for a second, because this is interesting to

00:11:24.520 me.

00:11:24.640 I think this is going to be one of those issues that the GOP field, they're going to be

00:11:29.420 divided on.

00:11:30.000 You're going to have to pick a lane.

00:11:31.200 Are you just in the sports locker room bathroom lane on women's rights and versus transgender

00:11:39.080 rights?

00:11:39.420 Because you do have to make a choice there.

00:11:40.680 Or are you more in the Matt Walsh, Ron DeSantis field of you can put on a dress all you want.

00:11:47.940 Doesn't make you a woman.

00:11:49.080 That's not factual.

00:11:50.500 That's a lie.

00:11:51.400 I'm not going to say it.

00:11:53.740 That's been a very controversial view.

00:11:55.860 I think it's coming more into vogue.

00:11:57.420 To me, that sounds more like a position the Republican Party would be saying at the presidential

00:12:01.700 level.

00:12:03.080 Transgender voters are a very, very small sliver of the populace.

00:12:06.180 But the woke is a much larger sliver.

00:12:09.880 But I mean, like, are the GOP going to try to go after the woke vote?

00:12:13.380 I don't I don't think so.

00:12:16.740 And, you know, interestingly, when I think think back about this, I've met Caitlyn Jenner

00:12:21.340 but once.

00:12:22.380 And you know where I met her?

00:12:23.320 The Trump inaugural.

00:12:25.360 Wow.

00:12:26.020 In 2017, she was there.

00:12:29.100 She was decidedly enthusiastic.

00:12:30.640 And it, you know, I just found it very interesting.

00:12:34.220 So that may in itself tell you a tale about the future here.

00:12:39.740 Caitlyn is like poor Caitlyn has no army behind Caitlyn.

00:12:43.060 And because, you know, Caitlyn coming out as a woman was one thing.

00:12:47.440 Caitlyn coming out as a Republican was the thing that absolutely devastated her friend

00:12:50.680 base, her career.

00:12:52.280 You know, they completely turned on her.

00:12:54.060 It's been absolutely nasty what they've done.

00:12:56.160 And she's been an outspoken advocate of women's rights in sports.

00:13:00.180 And so she doesn't support all this nonsense.

00:13:02.120 All right.

00:13:02.560 Let's talk about the ad wars that are now unfolding between the two guys.

00:13:05.440 And of course, there are presidential candidates.

00:13:06.940 I should mention Tim Scott appears to be getting ready to throw his head in Nikki Haley's

00:13:11.040 already declared Vivek Ramaswamy's declared.

00:13:13.780 Asa Hutchinson.

00:13:14.940 OK, so we've got a few others out there.

00:13:16.620 Correct me if I'm missing anybody.

00:13:19.200 So DeSantis was reportedly spotted eating pudding with his fingers, unconfirmed and denied by

00:13:30.060 Team DeSantis.

00:13:31.040 But there was a report that he was spotted eating, eating pudding with his fingers.

00:13:35.380 I put this in the column of Mitt Romney putting the dog on the top of the car and Amy Klobuchar

00:13:42.480 eating her salad with a comb.

00:13:47.140 Like, why?

00:13:48.000 Why would anybody do that?

00:13:49.940 And is it true?

00:13:51.440 So it's been denied.

00:13:52.220 But Trump has put out an ad making the most of this report.

00:13:58.040 Take a look.

00:13:59.940 Ron DeSantis loves sticking his fingers where they don't belong.

00:14:03.900 And we're not just talking about pudding.

00:14:07.360 DeSantis has his dirty fingers all over senior entitlements.

00:14:11.620 Like cutting Medicare, slashing Social Security, even raising our retirement age.

00:14:19.700 Tell Ron DeSantis to keep his pudding fingers off our money.

00:14:23.740 Oh, and get this man a spoon.

00:14:26.300 OK, so for the listening audience, you can see the fingers like sticking into the pudding

00:14:34.640 and like shoving it in the man's mouth.

00:14:36.640 It was not DeSantis.

00:14:38.160 But Jeffrey, your take on that that shot across the bow.

00:14:43.680 Yeah, well, you know, this is I always say to people, buy popcorn stock because this is

00:14:50.000 going to get a lot more like that.

00:14:52.900 And for history's sakes, you know, I just think people should chill out and relax.

00:14:58.300 I went back and took a look at some of these elections in the past.

00:15:02.460 And Megan, back there in 1800, the Thomas Jefferson, John Adams fight for president.

00:15:08.860 The Jefferson people accused John Adams, no kidding, of being a hermaphrodite.

00:15:14.080 He had sex organs.

00:15:16.440 And the Adams people came back by saying Jefferson was a dangerous atheist.

00:15:20.720 Um, every four years, this kind of thing goes on, is emphasized now because of social media

00:15:27.940 and television and all of that sort of thing.

00:15:31.300 I think most Americans just look at it.

00:15:34.700 They let it go right by them.

00:15:37.060 Those of us who watch it for a profession really do like to see all this excitement.

00:15:43.760 And it gives us lots to talk about.

00:15:45.600 But I don't think there's anything new about it.

00:15:48.140 I think it will get worse before it gets better.

00:15:50.740 You know, George H.W.

00:15:51.760 Bush accused Reagan of being into voodoo economics and he wound up on the ticket.

00:15:57.700 Yeah, right.

00:15:58.480 Well, let's not forget what happened between Kamala and Joe.

00:16:01.480 So, Duncan, what did you you're you're in the business of helping various candidates get elected.

00:16:05.740 What did you make of that ad?

00:16:06.540 Uh, you know, number one, it's it's almost like a Democrat attack ad that you would see in any

00:16:12.960 general election environment, you know, for the past, gosh, decade against Republicans.

00:16:18.240 Um, I would say it's it's it's disappointing, you know, that we have the front runner Donald

00:16:25.460 Trump for the Republican nomination talking about how, you know, we're not going to touch

00:16:29.180 Social Security.

00:16:29.880 We're going to strengthen this when the program is going to be insolvent in a decade.

00:16:33.000 That's obvious for anybody who's a conservative, um, but it's obviously effective.

00:16:38.160 And I think it uses the pudding thing well to sort of wink and nod to the media that he's

00:16:43.360 hoping circulates this ad.

00:16:44.720 Right.

00:16:45.220 I mean, Donald Trump is very smart with how he uses the media to amplify his message.

00:16:49.780 And not only that, this ad's running in D.C.

00:16:53.060 You know, it's not just running in in early caucus primary states.

00:16:57.400 It's running in D.C. as well, because he knows that the audience for this ad isn't just

00:17:01.740 Republican primary voters.

00:17:03.040 It's also the media itself, because what he wants to do is get the media to attack Ron

00:17:07.020 DeSantis and be like, oh, gosh, I don't know if Ron DeSantis is ready for this, you know?

00:17:11.080 And so there's sort of like a little bit of like, you know, the tail wagging the dog here

00:17:16.560 in the creative choice in the ad.

00:17:18.800 I think it's smart, but it's also I mean, the issue itself is really depressing.

00:17:23.840 If you're a conservative, you know, no Republican wants to say that they're going to cut security

00:17:28.660 and Medicare or Social Security or Medicare.

00:17:30.580 I mean, of course, the reality is it's going away.

00:17:33.040 I'll tell you guys just the other day we were doing our pitches.

00:17:35.020 We have a staff meeting where everybody offers their pitches.

00:17:37.460 We should book this guest we should do.

00:17:38.920 And Danny, our booker, who booked both of you guys was like, we should do a segment on

00:17:42.660 whether I'm going to get any Social Security.

00:17:44.720 Danny's, I think, 24.

00:17:45.740 I'm like, you're not the segment's done.

00:17:47.920 Let's move on.

00:17:48.880 What do you mean?

00:17:49.760 What are you saying?

00:17:50.400 The 20 year olds don't realize the pot is going to be empty for me.

00:17:54.000 Never mind for them.

00:17:55.260 Go ahead, Jeffrey.

00:17:56.720 Well, one of the other things out of the corner of my eye is my phone here.

00:18:00.020 And while we've just been talking, Fox has just posted a bulletin that Robert F.

00:18:05.080 Kennedy Jr.

00:18:06.040 has or is about to announce his candidacy for president.

00:18:09.420 So in other words, the fight that we're talking about on the Republican side, there is going

00:18:13.500 to be some kind of a fight on the Democrat side.

00:18:15.840 And Bobby Kennedy Jr.

00:18:17.400 is apparently going to take it to Joe Biden.

00:18:19.420 That will be popcorn worthy as well.

00:18:22.360 I can't wait to watch that.

00:18:23.480 We just saw on announcement he's polling at 14 percent.

00:18:28.020 I have to say that's kind of impressive.

00:18:29.520 Is it not for, you know, given the circumstances?

00:18:33.040 Yeah.

00:18:33.400 Yeah.

00:18:33.720 Well, you know, if he's anything like his father and and full disclosure, when I was 17

00:18:38.320 years old, which was just the other day, I think I was a big time Bobby Kennedy supporter

00:18:44.740 and, you know, hung on everything.

00:18:48.220 And I still have my little Kennedy for president button over here on the on the desk.

00:18:54.160 Uh, and and his father pulled no punches.

00:18:56.860 He was he was known for being ruthless and out front.

00:18:59.720 And, uh, they organized a campaign against Senator Hubert Humphrey in the West Virginia

00:19:04.680 primary that accused Humphrey, who had been turned down for World War Two as being a draft

00:19:10.740 dodger, you know, to compare him to JFK, the hero.

00:19:14.480 They're pretty ruthless.

00:19:15.880 So what happens with RFK Jr.?

00:19:17.860 What happens, Jeffrey?

00:19:18.620 Does he like what happens?

00:19:21.200 Is he just a thorn in the side of Joe Biden for the next year and a half?

00:19:24.600 There is one possibility out there.

00:19:26.940 Uh, you know, in 1968, Lyndon Johnson had been cruising along from his reelection in

00:19:31.540 64 and Eugene McCarthy, the unknown senator from Minnesota, jumps into the race on the

00:19:37.840 issue of the Vietnam War and lo and behold, almost beats LBJ in New Hampshire.

00:19:42.540 And then I think he actually did beat him somewhere else.

00:19:44.940 And it resulted in LBJ getting out out of the blue.

00:19:49.420 And Bobby Kennedy Sr.

00:19:51.540 Getting in.

00:19:52.820 So there was always a possibility that there was enough dissent from the Biden world that

00:19:58.400 could give Bob Kennedy Jr.

00:20:00.840 a showing of some sort.

00:20:02.760 And then you get sort of bandwagon stuff.

00:20:05.220 I mean, that could happen.

00:20:06.340 I wouldn't rule it in 100 percent, but it's possible.

00:20:09.920 I don't put a lot of a lot of stock in that.

00:20:12.440 But I think really the reflection in his poll number now is just dissatisfaction with Biden

00:20:18.440 himself.

00:20:20.340 You know, if you look at polls of Democrat voters, majorities don't want him to run for

00:20:23.840 president again.

00:20:24.480 It's probably the reason why he's been holding off the announcement for as long as he has.

00:20:28.980 You know, so look, I think it's a it's a protest vote.

00:20:31.640 As of right now, I have a hard time thinking, you know, he'll be able to grow that momentum

00:20:35.800 because if it if he really was able to, I think you'd have other people jumping in the

00:20:40.300 ring as well.

00:20:41.080 And then there'd be a talk whispers around Washington.

00:20:43.780 Oh, I don't think Biden really has it.

00:20:45.220 You know, it's time for him to step aside for Kamala, yada, yada, yada, yada, yada.

00:20:48.860 But it is compelling itself that you keep in that protest vote alone, he can get as much

00:20:53.380 of a of the primary electorate as he has.

00:20:55.760 Well, one wonders if he I mean, he's not going to get the Democratic nomination.

00:20:59.280 The Democrats don't really like Bobby Kennedy Jr.

00:21:01.540 He's too anti-vax in some of his positions.

00:21:04.940 He doesn't like that.

00:21:05.800 But that's what they'll say.

00:21:09.000 The interesting thing about him is if he managed to run as a third party, he'd get GOP votes.

00:21:13.600 A lot of them, too, like a lot of them.

00:21:15.360 He's he sounds more like a Republican on things like covid and government overreach now that

00:21:19.760 he does a Democrat, though I've asked him this repeatedly.

00:21:22.580 He still considers himself a liberal Democrat, you know, the traditional liberal, not not

00:21:27.300 what we have today.

00:21:29.580 Yeah, but I mean, actually getting ballot access at the presidential level as an independent

00:21:34.180 is notoriously, notoriously difficult.

00:21:37.320 I have a hard time believing he'd be able to, you know, get the money behind a campaign

00:21:41.100 like that to get ballot access.

00:21:43.640 I mean, the last person to really do it successfully was Ross Perot.

00:21:46.640 And he, you know, he quit his campaign and then he came back and all of that sort of stuff.

00:21:50.860 So and I mean, that guy's a billionaire.

00:21:52.560 So, yeah, I just I don't put a lot of stock in it, honestly.

00:21:56.580 The Kennedy money will not be behind Bobby Jr.

00:21:59.440 They don't know.

00:22:00.180 They certainly know.

00:22:00.880 But I think Michael is right here that if he manages to do enough damage to Joe Biden,

00:22:06.280 the instant question would be, well, it's not going to be Bob Kennedy and it's not going

00:22:09.980 to be now Joe Biden.

00:22:11.580 So what is Gavin Newsom doing or what is, you know, fill in the blank major Democratic

00:22:16.100 star doing?

00:22:17.460 And I think that's when you could see a real change in the shift if he manages to do that

00:22:21.900 kind of damage.

00:22:23.000 And I think psychologically, too, Jeffrey, to that point is like, you know, the Democrats

00:22:27.360 are still like psychologically scarred from 2016 and that they let Hillary Clinton walk

00:22:34.800 away with the nomination.

00:22:35.780 You saw what Bernie Sanders was able to do in that primary.

00:22:37.920 I don't think you'd end up in another situation where, you know, the frontrunner candidate,

00:22:42.040 Joe Biden, in the situation was as damaged as he could be.

00:22:45.220 And they would just, you know, circle the wagons for him.

00:22:47.820 They would be too worried about electing Donald Trump again.

00:22:51.740 Yes.

00:22:52.440 Well, speaking of Joe Biden, he's he's, you know, misstep every day.

00:22:56.280 Some sort of verbal gaffe.

00:22:57.960 The politicos of the world continue to celebrate.

00:23:00.820 There was some ridiculous excerpt in I think it was political the other day, like over there,

00:23:05.560 he wasn't gaffe prone.

00:23:07.920 He was charming.

00:23:09.020 He wasn't he wasn't losing it.

00:23:12.020 He was entertaining.

00:23:13.700 And he made many bizarre comments.

00:23:16.360 Here was one we did not get to.

00:23:17.700 But I'm telling you, this is what the Democrats are going to be dealing with.

00:23:20.300 Listen to him in Ireland.

00:23:22.640 My heart, there's nothing our nations can't achieve if we do it together.

00:23:26.320 I really mean it.

00:23:27.560 So thank you all.

00:23:28.640 God bless you all.

00:23:29.580 Let's go.

00:23:30.680 Let's go late.

00:23:31.740 Let the world let's get it done.

00:23:33.160 Lick the world.

00:23:36.480 What, Duncan?

00:23:38.100 What?

00:23:39.920 I don't know.

00:23:40.660 I think he forgot where he was giving the speech.

00:23:42.980 I don't know.

00:23:43.580 I think it was almost like he was trying to transition to some sort of campaign rally and

00:23:48.280 he couldn't decide what he wanted to land on.

00:23:50.620 I mean, you know, it's embarrassing, but he's been embarrassing for a long time.

00:23:54.820 And then, you know, you haven't had anyone really turn on him yet, which is.

00:23:58.100 I was thinking of his chocolate, chocolate chip.

00:23:59.940 Go ahead, Jeffrey.

00:24:00.500 The serious part of that is, and I say this as somebody, my mom, God bless her, started

00:24:07.600 to head down when she was about 96 with dementia and I took care of her.

00:24:12.200 She passed at 99.

00:24:14.320 But watching her and dealing with her, taking care of her close up, I look at Joe Biden and

00:24:19.720 I think there is a real problem here.

00:24:21.920 And the thing about this kind of stuff is it gets worse.

00:24:24.780 It doesn't get better.

00:24:26.060 And it's not a fall off the cliff kind of thing.

00:24:28.560 It's a gentle descent.

00:24:31.020 And I think we are watching this in real time with him.

00:24:34.780 And you never know when it's going to show up, you know, whether it's Dr.

00:24:38.900 Jill taking him by the hand and leading him in a certain direction or God only knows the

00:24:43.840 Easter bunny on that one occasion.

00:24:46.160 He kind of wanders around or he shakes hands with people that aren't there.

00:24:50.180 You know, this is, you know, it's one thing for people like us to be talking about this.

00:24:54.440 It's another thing when you realize that Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping and and Kim Jong-un,

00:25:00.900 you know, are all watching this and calculating accordingly.

00:25:04.280 That's what's so dangerous about it.

00:25:05.940 Here's the here's the excerpt from Politico's Adam Cancran.

00:25:11.180 He wrote as follows, in part, it was here in Ireland that the criticisms he faces at home

00:25:18.960 seemed to fade away.

00:25:20.560 His age didn't make him old.

00:25:22.640 It provided him wisdom.

00:25:24.280 His gaffes didn't make him shaky.

00:25:26.460 They gave him charm.

00:25:29.080 Wouldn't it be so helpful to have this kind of media behind you when you're running for

00:25:33.100 president or president?

00:25:34.920 It's absolutely incredible.

00:25:35.860 I think the way I described it on the podcast was it was like, you know, a sophomore in

00:25:41.540 college writing home about their semester abroad, you know, and that's just sort of

00:25:46.940 the way the media treats him, unfortunately.

00:25:49.560 All right.

00:25:49.700 So back to the GOP side.

00:25:51.180 Now we've taken our little dalliance over into Lane Lefty.

00:25:55.400 Ron DeSantis is now finally starting to fight back.

00:25:58.520 You can see it.

00:25:59.180 You know, Trump is crushing him, crushing him in the polls.

00:26:02.800 I think the real clear politics average has Trump something like 36 points over Ron DeSantis.

00:26:07.660 If you look at all the polls that went into that average, it's like 37, 33, 35, 38, 30.

00:26:12.620 I mean, he's crushing him in these national polls.

00:26:16.040 But Trump's also been very much in the news, but it was for being indicted.

00:26:20.220 But the Republican base knows that's BS.

00:26:22.320 So they see him as wrongly being targeted.

00:26:24.620 All of that goes into these numbers.

00:26:26.460 But DeSantis has been relatively quiet and now he's getting a little louder.

00:26:29.280 His book tour didn't go over very well.

00:26:30.940 It didn't do anything for those numbers.

00:26:32.120 And now he's doing more one-on-one.

00:26:34.420 He did that thing with Benny.

00:26:35.400 He went to Capitol Hill.

00:26:36.440 He met with some Republicans.

00:26:37.760 He's trying to get some Republican state legislators behind him or Republican congressional

00:26:42.700 delegates behind him.

00:26:45.220 I'm not sure how that's going.

00:26:46.760 Let me ask you first about the change in messaging.

00:26:48.880 He released an ad and it's basically about Trump's negativity toward his fellow Republicans.

00:26:56.040 It's sought for.

00:26:56.620 Donald Trump is being attacked by a Democrat prosecutor in New York.

00:27:02.080 So why is he spending millions attacking the Republican governor of Florida?

00:27:05.960 Trump's stealing pages from the Biden-Pelosi playbook.

00:27:09.040 Repeating lies about Social Security.

00:27:11.320 Here's the truth from Governor Ron DeSantis.

00:27:13.620 We're not going to mess with Social Security as Republicans.

00:27:16.360 What did Trump say?

00:27:17.520 Entitlements ever be on your plate.

00:27:18.940 At some point they will be.

00:27:20.260 We will take a look at this.

00:27:21.360 Trump should fight Democrats.

00:27:22.800 Not lie about Governor DeSantis.

00:27:24.400 What happened to Donald Trump?

00:27:28.040 Jeffrey, I'll ask you.

00:27:29.940 Yeah, I mean, it's pretty good starting.

00:27:31.720 Yeah.

00:27:32.320 Well, you know, what I noticed about that is Governor DeSantis was here in suburban Harrisburg

00:27:37.620 two weeks ago, and you heard none of that from him.

00:27:42.540 As a matter of fact, I'm not even sure he mentioned Donald Trump's name.

00:27:46.000 He did go after Alvin Bragg and went after the justice system and all of that sort of thing.

00:27:51.760 But he never said a peep other than that about Donald Trump.

00:27:55.680 So that ad, I think, just shows that things are starting to heat up.

00:27:59.280 Now, whether he will be on the stump saying these things himself, that remains to be seen.

00:28:05.340 At some point, I don't know how he can avoid it, but I haven't seen it yet.

00:28:08.720 I thought it was a comeback, Duncan, to what Trump released with the pudding.

00:28:14.140 Like, what are you attacking me for?

00:28:16.780 Yeah, I don't understand the strategy here in, you know, basically making a process argument

00:28:24.060 about Donald Trump to the Republican primary electorate.

00:28:27.560 And you start the ad with five seconds on how, you know, evil the DA in New York is and

00:28:32.500 how sad you should feel for Donald Trump.

00:28:34.680 And I think I don't think that works.

00:28:38.180 I mean, if you're going to hit Donald Trump, hit Donald Trump.

00:28:41.060 Right.

00:28:41.340 Don't make a process argument about how, oh, it's unfair what the DA in New York is doing

00:28:46.480 to Donald Trump.

00:28:47.260 And also it's unfair that Donald Trump isn't attacking him and instead he's attacking Ron

00:28:51.200 DeSantis.

00:28:51.760 Oh, and by the way, I'm going to also try to get to the left of Donald Trump on how great

00:28:55.960 Social Security is.

00:28:57.700 So it's I think it's just convoluted.

00:28:59.860 And, you know, I like the tagline at the end, you know, what happened to Donald Trump.

00:29:04.480 And I can I can picture thematically doing a series of ads on that that would be impactful

00:29:09.240 on things like covid or the border wall or, you know, empowering Fauci or guns.

00:29:15.100 There's a whole bunch of things you could do with like this is what Donald Trump said

00:29:17.700 he would do.

00:29:18.160 And this is the reality of what happened.

00:29:19.580 But a process ad about, you know, what Donald Trump should do in attacking, you know, Democrats,

00:29:26.120 I just don't see how that works to Ron DeSantis's advantage.

00:29:30.460 I think Ron DeSantis's advantage is making an argument on electability.

00:29:34.640 And he needs to stay focused on that because, I mean, Donald process argument about Donald

00:29:40.220 Trump is just not going to cut it.

00:29:41.820 I feel like most of DeSantis's behavior makes sense.

00:29:44.780 If you understand his main goal right now is to get the Trump voters.

00:29:47.620 He assumes the establishment GOP is with him and his big challenge is to get those Trump

00:29:52.300 voters.

00:29:52.580 So he's got to say, I'm as mad as you are.

00:29:55.960 I hate Alvin Bragg, too.

00:29:57.920 But he's kind of being a douchebag.

00:30:00.120 But I mean, really, like you're right.

00:30:01.740 He's he's holding he's fighting with one hand tied behind his back, Duncan, because he

00:30:05.880 doesn't want to piss off the Trump base.

00:30:07.720 They're already a little mad at him for even running the hardcore Trumpkins.

00:30:11.560 And he's trying to dance his dance.

00:30:13.840 Why did Donald Trump get a bump in the polls after he got indicted?

00:30:18.080 And it's because every other candidate in the field was going out there in front of

00:30:21.640 a camera to talk about how unfair this was to Donald Trump.

00:30:24.300 You think Donald Trump, if the situation was reversed, this was Ron DeSantis being indicted

00:30:28.620 in New York.

00:30:29.560 You think Donald Trump would get out there and be like, oh, it's so unfair to Ron DeSantis?

00:30:33.960 Of course not.

00:30:34.960 I mean, look at what Donald Trump is doing on true social every single day about Disney.

00:30:38.940 He's commentator Trump.

00:30:40.200 He's your friend on the couch.

00:30:41.120 Oh, geez, I think Ron's really stepped in it with Disney.

00:30:44.000 You know, I mean, so, you know, I think they've sort of manifest these other candidates have

00:30:48.040 manifested that polling bump that Trump has seen, although I think it's receded a little

00:30:52.340 bit, that little bump that he got after the indictment where everyone was, you know, rallying

00:30:56.620 behind him.

00:30:57.760 But I think like, you know, if if Ron DeSantis announces a presidential campaign, he has to

00:31:03.080 be succinct and direct with what he's attacking Donald Trump on.

00:31:06.860 Otherwise, you're just going to end up arguing with the Trump electorate for a Trump light

00:31:12.000 version.

00:31:12.880 And I just don't think that actually sells with the electorate.

00:31:16.080 It's like Bill Maher said, why would we pay to see the cover band when the original is

00:31:20.680 still available?

00:31:21.340 Like, you can't be the Trump cover band and beat Trump that way.

00:31:25.120 You've got to be something different.

00:31:26.760 So we're starting to see like little tastes of that, like I said, on the trans stuff and

00:31:31.180 what's happening with the whole Disney battle.

00:31:33.000 I mean, I don't know how that turns out, but I know that the non woke like to see him

00:31:37.200 fighting.

00:31:37.560 To me, I don't think the whether he wins is really the point.

00:31:41.060 It's him fighting and trying, which so many in the GOP base feel Republicans have failed

00:31:48.060 to do for far too long.

00:31:49.760 Michael Duncan, Jeffrey Lord.

00:31:51.040 What a pleasure.

00:31:51.900 Yeah, go ahead.

00:31:52.460 I'll give you the last word.

00:31:53.460 When you see a trans figure with their fingers in the pudding, you'll know we're really into

00:31:57.920 this.

00:31:59.080 I do not need to see that.

00:32:01.500 But thank you for that image.

00:32:03.000 All the best, my friends.

00:32:04.420 Come again soon.

00:32:05.860 When we come back, we turn to the Fox Dominion settlement and some other legal cases, including

00:32:11.440 the the guy who's trans, he's masquerading as a woman who joined a sorority, Kappa Kappa

00:32:19.300 Gamma.

00:32:20.120 And now the whole thing is blown up.

00:32:22.440 What a shock.

00:32:23.040 We'll get into it.

00:32:23.640 Lots of legal news to get to today with our Kelly's Court guests, including the seven

00:32:31.340 hundred and eighty seven million dollar settlement Fox News reached yesterday with Dominion Voting

00:32:36.900 Systems.

00:32:38.240 On that first, before we bring in our legal team, we're joined by our executive producer

00:32:42.080 of this show, Steve Krakauer, who joins us to discuss the media reaction because Steve,

00:32:46.900 he is not a member of Nerd Prompt, but he does write a column, a sub stack and do his

00:32:53.680 own thing for many, many years when it comes to media commentary and following the press.

00:32:56.720 So the media is very sad, they're super sad, a single tear because this thing settled, Steve.

00:33:04.160 They are.

00:33:04.900 Yes, I think that there were two big takeaways for me when this came down about 4 p.m.

00:33:09.580 I mean, literally, you know, they had selected the jury.

00:33:11.640 They had selected the alternates.

00:33:13.260 They took a little bit of a break.

00:33:14.420 They were about to come back and do opening statements.

00:33:16.600 And then, boom, you know, settlement hits.

00:33:19.140 And all the people who are there in Delaware excited for their six weeks of of bashing Fox

00:33:24.700 will, you know, have to sadly go home and and find something else to cover for that time

00:33:30.200 and find another way to attack Fox, which they, of course, did, you know, in the hours

00:33:33.700 after.

00:33:34.320 But but it won't be able to last for so long.

00:33:36.060 So, yes, I think there are two big takeaways for me.

00:33:38.160 First of all, yes, absolutely.

00:33:39.700 The idea that the media doesn't get their punching bag here for the next six weeks, the

00:33:44.340 embarrassing moments that may have come from the Tuckers and the Rupert Murdochs being on

00:33:49.680 the stand, a little bit of what we saw with the text messages that have leaked out.

00:33:53.400 But this would have been on a much bigger scale.

00:33:54.960 So they are they are they lose that aspect of it.

00:33:58.320 But then, of course, is the is the number seven hundred eighty seven million dollars is

00:34:02.340 an enormous settlement.

00:34:03.780 I saw someone like David Frum saying, oh, this is the second largest defamation verdict

00:34:09.220 of all time in America.

00:34:10.280 It's like, well, no, this was not a verdict, but it is obviously a large settlement that

00:34:14.320 they came to.

00:34:15.480 And you really break it down from November 8th until about when Tucker went on the air and

00:34:20.680 tore Sidney Powell a new one.

00:34:22.240 Eleven days later, there was massive confusion, chaos that was happening inside of Fox, as

00:34:28.200 we know now.

00:34:29.360 And for those 11 days, it will cost them seven hundred eighty seven million dollars, it seems.

00:34:34.280 I've noticed that the media has quickly moved to a you forgot to mention they're very upset.

00:34:39.340 There was no apology.

00:34:40.280 Apology.

00:34:40.880 The media is upset that Fox was not forced to apologize.

00:34:44.100 Just shows what a stakeholder they are in embarrassing Fox.

00:34:47.600 They want to see Fox's nose rubbed in it.

00:34:49.960 They got away with instead having to say something to the effect of we acknowledge that the judge

00:34:55.120 issued a ruling saying some statements were false about Dominion in the passive voice, not

00:34:59.940 like we made false statements about.

00:35:02.160 And I'm sure that was a very difficult sticking point.

00:35:04.880 There's zero chance of Rupert apologizing ever.

00:35:08.820 Yeah, that's important because the early reporting we saw from people like Jake Tapper and others

00:35:13.440 was that Fox was going to have to admit to airing lies on its network.

00:35:18.260 And it gets to the whole Trump era situation of falsehoods, false statements versus lies.

00:35:23.300 And obviously, lies is a very much more subjective version of admitting something that was false

00:35:28.900 that got on the air.

00:35:29.800 And so, yes, there is absolutely no admission by Fox of airing lies.

00:35:34.740 And importantly, they will not have to put anything on the air at all, whether through

00:35:39.920 statements or, you know, on the actual network addressing this story.

00:35:44.280 And I know they paid the money so that they don't have to have to get some sort of admission

00:35:48.680 of what Dominion was was essentially alleging.

00:35:52.180 And obviously not just Dominion, but the entire rest of the media ecosystem had been alleging

00:35:56.500 that this was going to be this big trial about democracy and the big lie and all of that.

00:36:01.020 Yes, not going to have to happen.

00:36:02.580 I love the way the media and look, I'm not excusing the way Fox covered this case and

00:36:07.640 not for a minute, but I'm I love how the media is has cloaked itself in the in these, you

00:36:13.120 know, robes of we've never.

00:36:16.020 Oh, my God.

00:36:16.480 CNN's like, my goodness.

00:36:17.600 Can you like just look what they did to the Covington kid on the steps of the Supreme

00:36:22.560 Court?

00:36:22.820 They had to settle that case because they embarrassed Nick Sandman and tried to make him sound like

00:36:26.960 a villain who was harassing a Native American guy on the steps of SCOTUS.

00:36:30.200 And the truth was exactly the opposite, not to mention Russiagate, MSNBC, Trump's tax.

00:36:34.980 Like we could go down the list of the egregious years long misreporting that these others have

00:36:41.780 done.

00:36:42.040 But now it's all about Fox.

00:36:44.560 Yes.

00:36:45.100 Yeah.

00:36:45.360 They went on their high horse yesterday.

00:36:47.080 This was the CNN's of the world.

00:36:48.760 The Jake Tappers in particular.

00:36:50.100 MSNBC, Morning Joe, as if this was an isolated incident and as if it is it only that Fox that

00:36:57.620 does this sort of thing.

00:36:58.920 No, for years, I was just recalling this morning a conversation I had with someone who I consider

00:37:04.920 to be a very smart person, but someone who's clearly of the left, who literally to this

00:37:09.080 day, believes that Donald Trump was elected due to a hacked election, hacked in 2016 by

00:37:15.260 Russia, and that he stole the election.

00:37:17.900 This is something that he believes to this day, seven, eight years later.

00:37:21.080 And it's because of what happened, because of the coverage that happened at the time

00:37:24.600 by MSNBC, by CNN, by The New York Times, Washington Post and others that was never corrected.

00:37:29.740 That was simply let out there.

00:37:31.220 Talk about the big lie.

00:37:32.100 This is something that has continued for years and years and years.

00:37:35.380 And so it's not excusing necessarily the Fox's coverage of what happened in that moment.

00:37:40.540 Although, as we've described many times on the show, there's a big difference between

00:37:43.940 showing what Lou Dobbs was talking about and the text messages that came out showing that

00:37:49.380 people like Tucker Carlson did not believe that and yet also did not platform that sort

00:37:54.520 of language also.

00:37:55.740 And so I think it's a lot more complicated, a lot more nuanced, obviously, than what the

00:37:59.320 corporate media wants it to be.

00:38:00.640 And it also allows them to attack Fox in a way that doesn't implicate themselves in a

00:38:06.520 lot of what the problems we've seen with the press over these last seven, eight years.

00:38:09.560 Well, that's so that's the thing.

00:38:10.540 So the most damaging thing for Fox already happened, which was the release of all the

00:38:14.420 text messages, the private internal correspondence.

00:38:17.060 And that was not a good development for Fox.

00:38:20.440 Now, it hasn't changed the relationship between Fox and its audience.

00:38:23.500 As we discussed yesterday, the trust has gone up.

00:38:25.820 However, let's be honest, it has definitely changed the media's perception of Fox.

00:38:31.440 I can speak to that personally.

00:38:33.000 When I was there, the news division of Fox News was respected.

00:38:36.020 It was.

00:38:36.680 And it was the driving engine of the entire channel.

00:38:38.760 And it was the reason why there was a begrudging respect for Fox, even though people didn't like

00:38:42.920 it.

00:38:43.260 That's gone.

00:38:44.200 It's been gone for a long time.

00:38:45.800 They lost it during during Trump, during the coverage of nine or not 11, 11, but January

00:38:51.000 6th, they lost it.

00:38:53.620 But the release of these text messages was the final nail in the coffin.

00:38:58.320 It's not respected at all by competitors who used to have to at least tip the hat to the

00:39:04.260 news division.

00:39:05.920 Yeah, I think that, you know, we saw that and we addressed this also yesterday a little

00:39:09.760 bit with the Chris Steyerwald and the Bill Salmon.

00:39:11.740 That aspect of those text messages was was more damaging in the internal side of how I think

00:39:18.200 the broader media thinks about Fox and talks about Fox.

00:39:21.540 Although, you know, in a lot of ways, it feels like once 2015, once 2016 came, the divide

00:39:26.920 between the Foxes of the world and the rest of the media became this giant gulf that that

00:39:32.720 is really representative, I think, of the Trump moment.

00:39:35.680 And and so, yes, the there was a little bit of confirmation bias in a lot of ways by what

00:39:39.540 what we saw with those text messages.

00:39:41.640 Certainly, you know, internally among the media, those text messages and what happened with the

00:39:46.620 news division and how it was really after Arizona.

00:39:50.580 I mean, they became the fall guy within Fox as well.

00:39:55.120 But, yeah, this is the kind of thing that they eat up.

00:39:56.940 And and but can I can I just say this?

00:39:59.860 So, yes, they loved it.

00:40:01.080 And that's why Fox should have settled this early.

00:40:02.960 That was the point I was driving to it.

00:40:04.140 Like they should have settled early.

00:40:06.120 They could have easily settled it for eight hundred million dollars back at the beginning.

00:40:10.000 Dominion would have taken that.

00:40:11.020 They never thought they'd get this much money.

00:40:12.320 Um, so earlier would have been better.

00:40:15.660 But my point I was driving toward was, can you imagine if the text messages and internal

00:40:20.820 emails and correspondence between the top anchors at CNN or at MSNBC and the executives there

00:40:26.720 or the Today Show got released in the context of a big lawsuit or some other way, they would

00:40:32.880 look terrible.

00:40:34.560 That's why it's just so impossible to look at these people like, I'm shocked there's not

00:40:38.780 a journalistic outfit and say, OK, could you like you should take a seat.

00:40:43.020 Let the lawyers debate it.

00:40:44.160 That's fine by me.

00:40:44.980 But you cable news anchors, just stop it.

00:40:48.740 Yeah, that's it.

00:40:49.380 Well, on one level, I think that that was why, you know, James O'Keefe, when he was at

00:40:53.360 Project Veritas, released all these CNN internal 9 a.m.

00:40:56.760 calls, the call that I used to be on when I was at CNN that Jeff Zucker led.

00:41:00.520 And there was a real big nothing burger for me because it only showed that all these people

00:41:04.380 believe what they actually say.

00:41:06.300 They actually think that they're in this existential fight with Trump.

00:41:08.820 I mean, it's ridiculous, but that's it's not like they're secretly saying, oh, yeah, we

00:41:12.300 know he's just he's fine.

00:41:13.560 But on the air, we're going to portray it as something else.

00:41:16.020 No, they bought into that full sale.

00:41:17.740 So so that's one side of it.

00:41:19.420 But the other one, the thing that bothers me the most about the criticism with the corporate

00:41:23.260 press had over these text messages were the kinds of things about the business.

00:41:26.900 People talking about the stock price or the or the loss of viewers.

00:41:30.120 That is a real thing that this is a business.

00:41:32.940 Everyone who works at MSNBC or NBC or anywhere knows that.

00:41:37.240 And it's a joke if they're going to try to say that the things that they do every single

00:41:40.780 day is not about ratings, is not about the bottom line.

00:41:44.160 It's a it's a very much a part of this as as everyone in the business knows that.

00:41:48.920 Yes, that is why the series they were trying to do with Van Jones.

00:41:52.460 I can't remember what it was about, like homelessness or something.

00:41:54.660 I can't.

00:41:54.900 But that's why it's no longer on the air.

00:41:56.860 That's because no, there's no audience for that crap.

00:42:00.060 And sooner or later, the business realizes I wanted to look good, but I want profits

00:42:03.740 more just as Netflix.

00:42:05.860 You know, that's why they had to stop going so woke.

00:42:07.780 All right, Steve, thank you.

00:42:08.760 Get back to your other job now.

00:42:10.140 We're going to bring in the legal side of this story on this topic and many others.

00:42:13.680 Our Kelly's Court panel, David Fryheit, lawyer and YouTuber, better known to his audience

00:42:17.940 as Viva Fry and Vinnie Politan, lawyer and lead anchor for Court TV.

00:42:21.780 Guys, welcome back to the show.

00:42:23.160 So what do you make of the Fox News settlement?

00:42:25.920 First of all, and then I'll ask you about it's coming legal troubles because that's the

00:42:29.560 second page the media has turned to.

00:42:31.720 Like, don't be too disappointed they settled because Smartmatic has still got its lawsuit.

00:42:36.220 Let me start with you on it, Viva.

00:42:38.620 I was going to say, start with Vinnie.

00:42:40.120 Look, I'll start with Vinnie.

00:42:41.440 I will.

00:42:41.780 Go ahead, Vinnie.

00:42:43.300 Well, this is why Court TV rarely covers civil cases, because it's about money and it's a

00:42:50.120 constant negotiation and they settle.

00:42:52.800 So while everyone, and this is fascinating to listen to you, Steve, talk about this, how

00:42:57.980 people were making this lawsuit about something more.

00:43:01.880 No, it's a civil lawsuit.

00:43:03.640 It was about money.

00:43:04.820 It was one side trying to see how much they could get, the other side seeing how little

00:43:08.920 they could pay and what was it worth for one side to make it go away?

00:43:14.360 What was it worth for the other side to all of a sudden get all this money that they wouldn't

00:43:17.980 have gotten otherwise?

00:43:19.000 So the big legal takeaway from this is what we should learn is in civil cases, it's always,

00:43:26.160 except in Johnny Depp's trial, except in Johnny Depp's trial, it's always about the money.

00:43:33.100 Yeah, there was a stelter tweet that said, you could argue that Dominion wins, but the

00:43:38.940 public loses.

00:43:40.520 The public has lost.

00:43:41.480 Oh, the people relishing in Fox News as the fake news, as though CNN didn't do the Sandman

00:43:47.100 thing, Time Magazine with the Martin Luther King, all of these, Trump removing the Martin

00:43:52.180 Luther King bust from the White House.

00:43:54.660 This is such a disgusting self-congratulatory lap that all the other media are running.

00:44:01.360 But Vinny says it's about the money.

00:44:04.000 Typically it is, which is why I don't understand how they possibly settled for nearly $800 million.

00:44:09.600 I saw the news and I said, this has to be there.

00:44:12.500 This has to be inaccurate.

00:44:14.060 Who on earth settles for 50 cents of the claim the night before trial when a lot of damaging

00:44:19.300 information has already come out, when your risk at a trial is only 2xing your guaranteed

00:44:23.940 settlement, and then you abandon your appealing of the summary judgment that they just got.

00:44:28.200 You abandon your leverage about dragging this out for years and years and years.

00:44:32.260 The quantum doesn't make sense to me.

00:44:34.740 The timing makes perfect sense.

00:44:36.020 But my goodness, settling for 50 cents on the dollar of the claim and abandoning all of

00:44:41.600 the other legal recourse, which you would have used as leverage to further negotiate.

00:44:45.500 I don't want to get too conspiratorial, but there has to be something else at play here,

00:44:49.260 like really damning stuff that Murdoch and Al didn't want to be revealed, or some mutual

00:44:54.180 interest that they're both going to have in agreeing to such a monumental settlement.

00:44:58.080 But it's a terrible precedent as far as I'm concerned.

00:45:00.800 I don't think they like their chances on appeal as much as they were saying publicly.

00:45:04.100 I don't understand that theory.

00:45:06.920 Like Keith Olbermann was saying, not something identical, but something similar yesterday,

00:45:10.840 Vinny.

00:45:11.060 He was saying, I was convinced there was a new, worse email that prompted a Fox offer to

00:45:15.540 settle that Dominion that Dominion has now accepted.

00:45:18.820 In civil litigation, you have discovery.

00:45:21.200 You have all your evidence.

00:45:22.120 It's not a big surprise.

00:45:23.020 When you go to trial, you're not allowed surprises.

00:45:25.980 You know exactly what you have and what the other side has.

00:45:29.080 And, you know, maybe there's some surprise rebuttal witness or something like that, but

00:45:32.740 like there would not be a new email at this point in the proceedings unless something had

00:45:37.020 gone really, really wrong.

00:45:39.380 Right.

00:45:39.880 And there's, there's a constant calculation that you're doing, right?

00:45:43.360 So as the attorneys, you've got to constantly communicate with your client, right?

00:45:48.340 So the client here is Fox and you've got to give them, all right, what are our chances

00:45:52.540 of winning?

00:45:53.120 What does this mean?

00:45:53.840 What does that mean?

00:45:54.360 I don't know, were they not happy perhaps with the, with the panel that ended up on

00:45:59.100 the jury?

00:45:59.900 Because that's the one thing that happened in court just before the settlement.

00:46:03.140 Here's the jury that we ended up with.

00:46:05.120 Do we like it?

00:46:05.840 Do we not like this jury?

00:46:07.100 It's all part of the continuing calculation that you do during a civil case and determining

00:46:12.200 what's our exposure and what's, what's the pain that we'll have if we go forward?

00:46:18.220 What's the possible worst case scenario?

00:46:20.600 What's our best case scenario?

00:46:21.860 How have things changed now that we know exactly who the people are that are going to be making

00:46:26.760 this decision?

00:46:28.400 I, in watching Fox from the outside and the inside over the years, my general feeling is

00:46:34.480 they will fight to the bitter end.

00:46:37.080 They will be absolute pricks about it.

00:46:39.620 They will scare you to within an inch of your life.

00:46:42.120 But then in the, in the last, literally the last minute, they will pay up.

00:46:46.340 They don't actually want their biggest stars, their biggest executives taking a stand in

00:46:51.500 front of a Delaware jury.

00:46:52.900 This is not Texas.

00:46:54.160 So I think it was a smart move to not put this case in the hands of that Delaware jury.

00:46:59.480 And I know $800 million is a lot, Viva, but it's Rupert Murdoch.

00:47:04.040 He's literally one of the richest men in the world.

00:47:06.500 This is a rounding error.

00:47:07.740 Well, I said, I made a face earlier, because if I'm agreeing with Keith Olbermann, then

00:47:11.840 I'm going to start questioning my own existence.

00:47:13.640 But the $800 million is a lot, which is why typically the settlements hedge your bets.

00:47:18.160 They, they mitigate your risks.

00:47:19.840 When you're agreeing to pay 50 cents on the dollar guaranteed, no appeal, no further leveraging.

00:47:25.580 If it's all, if you can afford $800 million, take it to trial and take your, your chances

00:47:29.740 on a verdict.

00:47:30.860 But they're, I mean, and you said like, maybe there was more damage.

00:47:33.280 But your stars, your biggest stars, your top executives have to take the stand.

00:47:37.340 I agree.

00:47:38.100 But you know, that, if that was the rationale, then they should have settled this before the

00:47:41.660 discoveries when the damaging information already came out.

00:47:44.640 I mean, if anything, according, as far as I'm concerned, they could have attenuated their

00:47:48.480 bad depositions and their bad discoveries on the stand and said, yeah, we thought, we thought

00:47:52.340 Sidney Powell was crazy, but that's my personal opinion.

00:47:55.220 We were just reporting the news.

00:47:56.360 They could have attenuated their bad discoveries.

00:47:58.640 Go ahead, Vinny.

00:47:59.260 I think, I think, though, the real problem here is the, the reality, right?

00:48:05.280 Like reality check for the client, right?

00:48:07.200 The beginning, like, oh, we're going to fight this.

00:48:09.360 We can win this.

00:48:10.380 You start losing the legal motions.

00:48:11.980 You see which way things are going with the judge.

00:48:14.000 You're seeing how things are playing out.

00:48:15.820 Then there's the PR aspect of it, right?

00:48:18.120 That Fox has to take into consideration.

00:48:20.320 But this is like the moment, right?

00:48:21.800 The trial's about to start.

00:48:23.600 Once the trial starts, now things get really weird.

00:48:27.340 Yeah, and you're like, I can see where it's going.

00:48:30.380 Let's cut the losses.

00:48:31.840 800's a lot to us, but it's not that much to Rupert or to Fox.

00:48:35.880 Okay, stand by.

00:48:36.880 We're going to get to that trans case and many others next.

00:48:38.760 All right, so let's start with this case that's been making a lot of news.

00:48:45.820 It's gotten the attention of Tucker Carlson, among others, and it involves a man down in

00:48:50.960 Texas.

00:48:52.080 Daniel Perry, 33-year-old white man, has been convicted of murder in connection with his

00:48:59.220 shooting of a man named Garrett Foster, 28, also white.

00:49:02.180 Okay, so both guys are white, but Garrett Foster was a white man who was a BLM protester.

00:49:07.940 And they encountered one another when Daniel Perry's car found itself in the middle of a BLM

00:49:13.240 protest, and Foster came over to the window, the driver's side window.

00:49:18.220 Some sort of a confrontation or words were exchanged, and Daniel Perry, the 33-year-old,

00:49:25.640 shot and killed Garrett Foster, the 28-year-old white man.

00:49:29.660 He was in Austin, Texas, that's where the rally was happening, and he's just been found

00:49:35.000 guilty by a jury.

00:49:36.440 All right, well, it might not get your attention, but now there's a big push immediately to have

00:49:41.840 him pardoned, and Governor Greg Abbott has taken this on before there's even been a sentencing.

00:49:46.500 Governor Greg Abbott has personally taken this on and said, do we have sound from him?

00:49:50.700 I can't remember what we got, or it's just a tweet.

00:49:52.860 No, okay, so he said, quote, in a tweet, I am working as swiftly as Texas law allows regarding

00:49:57.240 the pardon of Sergeant Perry.

00:50:00.080 Texas has one of the strongest stand-your-ground laws of self-defense that cannot be nullified

00:50:04.520 by a jury or a progressive district attorney.

00:50:07.360 However, he can't just do it with his pen.

00:50:09.320 He's got to get the Texas Board of Pardons and Parole to recommend the pardon before he can

00:50:14.160 sign off on it.

00:50:15.320 But after he took this stance, after I think Tucker did a segment on it, and it got a lot

00:50:21.340 of attention, all these texts of the accused murderer were released, and they do not reflect

00:50:28.760 well on Mr. Perry.

00:50:30.580 So we'll get into all of it.

00:50:31.660 Viv, I could see you wanted to say something in my description of the case.

00:50:34.260 Go ahead.

00:50:34.600 Yeah, I think maybe one critical element you missed is that the victim, the person who was

00:50:38.620 shot dead, was open carrying an AK-47 when he confronted Perry in the car, and as per

00:50:46.800 Perry's testimony, it looked like he had the barrel raised, not aimed, that was a little

00:50:52.060 discrepancy in the evidence at the trial, but pointed or lifted in the general direction

00:50:56.500 of Daniel Perry, who then fired five shots.

00:51:00.300 But yeah, the open carry is the determinant element here as to who provoked who.

00:51:05.620 So it's an interesting story.

00:51:08.780 I followed a bit of the trial, and I've gotten into a debate on Twitter with another lawyer,

00:51:14.320 Branca, who's a self-defense lawyer, who seems to be, yeah, and he's relatively convinced

00:51:19.280 that this was not self-defense, and is challenging people's perceptions of that.

00:51:26.860 I happen to disagree with the judgment, but it is difficult to say, well, I didn't hear the

00:51:31.500 evidence, I wasn't the jury, but I am of the opinion that if you take a wrong decision,

00:51:35.620 wrong turn, or even if you turn deliberately, and your car is swarmed and encircled by

00:51:40.420 protesters, one of whom is carrying a weapon that Perry said it wasn't, I didn't want to give him

00:51:46.520 time to aim, but he said that it was pointed in a potentially threatening manner.

00:51:52.460 I mean, everybody here is playing stupid games, and this is how tragedies happen, but there's

00:51:56.520 a lot of inverted comparisons that you can make to the Rittenhouse case, where Rittenhouse

00:52:00.540 crossed state lines with a weapon, was open carrying, and he was public enemy number one,

00:52:03.500 and here, the same circumstance, the person who ends up getting shot and killed is public

00:52:07.680 victim number one, so there's a lot of ideal, you know, some double standards here.

00:52:12.000 This guy who got shot and killed, Vinny, this Garrett Foster, was there in like the Kevlar

00:52:17.720 vest, he was dressed like he was going to war, this guy, so it's hard to believe that he was

00:52:21.840 just out there for a little stroll, holding up a little placard, BLM, you know, he had the

00:52:26.700 Kevlar, he had the AK-47, how do you even get your hands on that?

00:52:29.820 Hello, that's the gun that all the people who want to take the guns away think everybody's

00:52:34.880 running around with, but really, they're not.

00:52:36.840 This guy had it, and this guy who's, you know, they're both veterans in the car, you

00:52:43.240 see that coming at you?

00:52:44.600 I mean, I can understand his fear.

00:52:46.540 However, the prosecution argued he was intentionally putting himself in the midst of this so-called

00:52:53.820 protest, Vinny.

00:52:54.640 Yeah, I think that's a key factor, right, because in a self-defense case, what I've seen

00:53:01.040 at Court TV, and we've covered a lot of them, and we've covered a lot of not-guilties, including

00:53:04.600 the Kyle Rittenhouse case.

00:53:06.480 One distinguishing factor in the Kyle Rittenhouse case was video of everything that happened,

00:53:11.600 and it was very compelling video.

00:53:13.540 It was video, it was audio of everything that was happening that night, painted a much

00:53:17.480 different picture than was painted by the media of what actually happened in the Rittenhouse

00:53:21.140 case.

00:53:21.900 This one, now you're relying upon witness testimony, and everyone, and every witness

00:53:27.020 in this whole thing obviously has some level of an agenda in the way they're going to see

00:53:32.020 something, right?

00:53:32.620 If you're at a protest, you have a perspective.

00:53:35.580 You're there for a reason.

00:53:37.280 So at the end of the day, we put it in the hands of a jury, and the jury has to make a very

00:53:43.880 tough call in self-defense.

00:53:45.100 The Texas jury.

00:53:46.620 The Texas jury.

00:53:47.400 It's a Texas jury, but are we in Austin, Texas, or are we in regular Texas?

00:53:52.220 Yeah, that's a good point.

00:53:53.200 This is Austin, Texas.

00:53:54.500 Okay, that's a good point.

00:53:55.840 It's not real Texas.

00:53:56.800 It's a different state.

00:53:57.940 I've been there.

00:53:58.780 It's a different state than the rest of Texas.

00:54:01.380 The laws are the same, but the people who are applying the law to the facts of the case

00:54:06.880 are much, much different.

00:54:07.980 Well, but here, so the prosecution wanted us to believe that this guy, that Perry sped

00:54:13.220 up his car, like an attempt to mow down protesters, and then this guy, Foster, was trying to stand

00:54:19.400 up for the fellow protesters, like, hey, what are you doing?

00:54:22.200 And he has a partner or a spouse who was, hold on, his fiance, who's a quadruple paraplegic

00:54:32.220 black woman, the victim, Foster.

00:54:34.280 Um, that's his spouse.

00:54:36.280 I don't know if she was right there with him, but the point, they, the prosecution tried

00:54:39.820 to say that the defendant, Perry was, you know, a hothead who gunned the engine, tried

00:54:46.540 to drive into this group of protesters, and then Foster was trying to say, hey, what are

00:54:50.080 you doing?

00:54:50.820 But there was expert testimony there saying that the car did not speed up, that the other

00:54:57.360 one expert testified that he was slowing down when his car entered the demonstration.

00:55:01.460 Um, so there was, you know, a dispute on that.

00:55:04.200 The jury wound up, I guess, I mean, they found against the defendant.

00:55:08.680 So that matters because the Texas Stand Your Ground law, Viva, says as follows.

00:55:14.300 Um, it removes the duty to retreat before using deadly force if the person is in a place they

00:55:20.820 have a right to be.

00:55:22.100 He was, that's, he has that one.

00:55:25.420 He is not engaged in criminal activity.

00:55:29.140 That's also true.

00:55:30.120 Even speeding up to get through a crowd of protesters.

00:55:32.820 I don't, I don't know that you'd be charged with a crime, but here's the third one and has

00:55:36.800 not provoked his assailant.

00:55:39.360 So the prosecution was trying to say, you did provoke, um, you provoked this confrontation

00:55:45.120 and you can't.

00:55:47.460 So therefore, Stand Your Ground is not available to you.

00:55:49.780 Yeah.

00:55:50.000 And the basis of the provocation was allegedly turning his vehicle into the crowd, uh, to

00:55:55.260 provoke them.

00:55:56.340 Uh, look, the, the problem is this.

00:55:58.760 Yes, a jury found a verdict of guilty and it's the risk of when you go to court and, you

00:56:04.100 know, Fox News just avoided the risks of, of leaving things in the hand of a jury.

00:56:09.440 Uh, the broader problem might be you leave things in the hands of a jury of a crime that

00:56:14.260 possibly ought not have been prosecuted in the first place.

00:56:17.560 You can't then wash your hands of this unjust prosecution just because of a verdict.

00:56:22.340 Uh, so a jury subsequently ratified the prosecution with, which might be a questionable verdict.

00:56:28.320 Yeah, they said, okay, he provoked the crowd.

00:56:30.100 Uh, I, but for Rittenhouse, I'd say who would provoke a man carrying an AK 47?

00:56:34.980 Who would provoke, uh, BLM rioters by the evidence, the expert evidence with which the

00:56:39.900 jury heard and didn't take into or didn't, um, retain, he wasn't speeding up.

00:56:44.400 He was slowing down by all accounts.

00:56:46.280 His car got swarmed and encircled at a protest.

00:56:49.460 And we have, we live in a world where despite the guy's texts, which we do need to get to

00:56:53.020 because they're very, very incriminating.

00:56:55.120 We, we live in a world of, you know, the Rodney King, uh, riots where people were pulled

00:57:00.000 out of their cars and beaten mercilessly, uh, where people are pulled from their cars and

00:57:04.180 shot where we saw what happened during the summer of love.

00:57:06.400 Uh, you know, people randomly shot by the, by, by mobs who are on the street.

00:57:10.480 So you have that always in the frame of the mind to explain the, the rationale of the person.

00:57:16.420 One has to reconcile all of this now, however, with these prior texts, Facebook messages,

00:57:21.320 we'll get to that one second.

00:57:22.960 But here's the thing.

00:57:23.660 Here's what troubles me.

00:57:24.540 So the, um, Foster's family has a civil attorney who said, what is governor Abbott doing?

00:57:29.120 Talking about a pardon.

00:57:30.260 We haven't even had the sentencing phase yet and not remind an appeal.

00:57:33.960 And he said, this turns the rule of law on its head.

00:57:36.440 I totally agree with that.

00:57:38.100 We cannot have governors stepping in before cases have even reached their finality to undo

00:57:44.060 a jury verdict.

00:57:45.180 Because if you let, you may like it in this case, cause you, you're anti BLM or you're

00:57:49.700 pro, you know, gun or whatever it is.

00:57:52.120 Um, you're not going to like it in the next one.

00:57:54.260 Cause that, if that's the power of the governor, if that's appropriate action by a governor,

00:57:57.960 you know how many cases they're going to undo that, that you don't want to see undone.

00:58:01.780 That's not the proper role for a pardon.

00:58:04.200 And the jury had it say the appellate process is there for a reason.

00:58:09.580 So here's what happened.

00:58:12.660 Abbott comes out, takes a strong stance, refers it to this parole board, went on April 10th.

00:58:18.020 Um, Fox news is playing on it too.

00:58:20.220 Like, yeah, this is an unjust verdict.

00:58:22.240 Then they release, uh, this guy, Perry, the defendant, uh, his texts and one text, one

00:58:30.580 exchange did get in front of the jury, but it sounds to me with, and I haven't gone in

00:58:34.860 depth on this, but it sounds to me like the judge limited what would get in front of the

00:58:38.560 jury to just this.

00:58:39.700 So it wouldn't be too unfairly prejudicial to the defendant.

00:58:42.120 What was, what was shown to the jury was six weeks prior to the shooting.

00:58:46.000 Uh, Perry had privately discussed, uh, a similar situation that happened between a driver

00:58:50.780 and a protester in Seattle.

00:58:52.580 And, uh, he told a friend he had watched the video of it, of a protester getting shot in

00:58:57.040 Seattle after pulling someone out of a car.

00:58:59.220 And Perry said, uh, since that happened in Seattle, the gun would probably go to prison,

00:59:03.840 but if it were in Texas, he'd already be released.

00:59:07.520 Okay.

00:59:08.040 Not great.

00:59:08.740 Jury saw it.

00:59:09.780 They did convict him.

00:59:11.120 What wasn't shown to the jury.

00:59:12.880 Oh my God.

00:59:13.960 Was just all this crazy stuff.

00:59:16.880 Perry often made racist comments.

00:59:21.200 This is from the court filings.

00:59:22.900 Um, they were released by the Travis County judge unsealed by the Travis County judge often

00:59:27.980 made racist comments regularly made clear his desire to kill protesters in the months

00:59:31.180 leading up to Foster's death.

00:59:33.200 According to social media posts and texts contained, they say a newly unsealed court document.

00:59:37.820 So I suppose guys, it is possible the jury saw this and just, we didn't see it.

00:59:40.760 I don't know the answer in a Facebook message from May, 2020, just weeks before the shooting,

00:59:44.500 Perry told a friend he might have to kill a few people who were riding outside of his

00:59:47.940 apartment.

00:59:48.640 Then said, uh, quote, I might go to Dallas to shoot looters said in a Facebook message

00:59:53.040 two days later, no protesters go near me or my car.

00:59:56.420 The other man replied, forgive me audience replied, can you catch me a Negro daddy?

01:00:01.520 And Perry responded.

01:00:02.840 That's what I'm hoping.

01:00:04.280 Again, the man he shot was white, but he was at a BLM protest and his fiance was black

01:00:08.660 and may or may not have been with him.

01:00:09.720 Uh, he went on to say in another text message, the blacks are gathering up in a group.

01:00:16.280 I think something's about to happen.

01:00:17.980 I wonder if they will let me cut the ears off of people who've decided to commit suicide

01:00:22.800 by me.

01:00:23.840 Uh, went on to compare the black lives matter movement to a zoo full of monkeys.

01:00:27.680 I could go on.

01:00:28.940 It's deeply disturbing.

01:00:30.500 And this is, this is awful, but this is relevant.

01:00:33.220 Again, in April of 2020, he sent out a meme, which included a photo of a woman holding her

01:00:38.200 child's head under the water in the bath with the text quote, when your daughter's first

01:00:43.040 crush is a little Negro boy.

01:00:46.380 So in other words, a white girl being with a black boy or, you know, interracial marriage,

01:00:52.180 uh, relationships tick this guy off.

01:00:55.100 And that's what his victim was in again, do not know it's relevant to find out whether

01:01:02.100 the fiance was right by him.

01:01:03.940 But the point is here he is at a BLM riot and all those statements, my God, my God, who

01:01:09.140 would like to take it?

01:01:10.740 I'll take, I don't think that we can, that we can equate a white person killing a white

01:01:18.020 person with a, as a, as, as a hate crime, as a race.

01:01:22.220 I don't see the relevance of that stuff.

01:01:25.440 You can talk about general character, but it's clearly irrelevant for the jury.

01:01:29.960 And in this instance, the piece that was allowed in front of the jury, I think is a great issue

01:01:35.080 on appeal, whether or not just hearing that just my team is telling me the jury did not

01:01:38.880 hear all that.

01:01:39.460 I was right the first time, but all that stuff they didn't hear, but the one that they did

01:01:43.200 hear, I don't even know if that was probative.

01:01:45.420 Uh, it was more probative than, than prejudicial.

01:01:47.460 I don't know what relevance it had talking about another situation, bombing someone else

01:01:52.740 under different circumstances where someone was, was pulled out of a car.

01:01:56.160 So, um, this, but to me, it's the same analysis as the Rittenhouse case.

01:02:01.120 Everyone trying to make Rittenhouse into a case about race and a hate crime.

01:02:04.280 And I, I kept saying it was, everybody was white.

01:02:07.460 Everybody's white in this case, everybody's white.

01:02:09.360 So what are we talking about?

01:02:10.440 What, what is the relevance of him being a racist?

01:02:13.640 I get it's a BLM protest route, but the victim.

01:02:17.460 Someone is not, he didn't go there and shoot someone of another race.

01:02:20.820 It wasn't a hate crime.

01:02:22.360 Um, to me, all that sort of stuff is only relevant if you're charging someone with a hate crime.

01:02:27.540 So, uh, whether it's part of his sentencing, I still don't think it should be.

01:02:32.260 Well, but now we're talking about pardon.

01:02:34.700 I, I see your point.

01:02:36.100 I see why the judge kept it out from the jury.

01:02:38.220 By the way, the wife was there.

01:02:39.780 So how does it play when you talk about a pardon?

01:02:41.820 Now you're getting into politics, right?

01:02:43.860 Politics.

01:02:44.340 And that's, I mean, that's when you talk about a pardon, it's not, it's not necessarily pure law.

01:02:50.900 It's, does this guy deserve this extraordinary relief of the governor stepping in?

01:02:56.040 Go ahead, Viva.

01:02:56.980 I'll say two things.

01:02:58.540 One of which there's no defending the statements, period.

01:03:02.060 Uh, in law, even a racist has the right to self-defense.

01:03:06.180 And it's, you know, it goes back to the other arguments of, uh, a felon in, in, in possession

01:03:10.600 of an unlawful firearm still has the right to use that unlawful firearm for the purposes

01:03:14.860 of self-defense.

01:03:16.020 The, the, the racist, uh, text messages, et cetera, I imagine could only be relevant if

01:03:21.360 they want to show some sort of animosity that he had for the victim because the victim is

01:03:25.820 involved in an interracial marriage.

01:03:27.140 As far as I know, or, or just add a BLM protest.

01:03:30.200 True.

01:03:30.800 As far as I know, that evidence wasn't deduced.

01:03:33.100 The, uh, other text messages, which I could easily argue for the, you know, the probative value,

01:03:38.300 the relevance to set the frame of mind, this was somebody looking for a fight, not somebody

01:03:42.080 who found himself in one.

01:03:43.480 Uh, I can understand that, but again, it's not because he said stupid things or had, uh,

01:03:49.560 even, even if we attribute it to ill intent prior that he wasn't in a position at the

01:03:54.120 current moment where he felt, uh, the need for legitimate self-defense and was entitled

01:03:58.160 to it.

01:03:58.520 Uh, when a mob, if, I mean, this is sort of like victim blaming, like, well, you shouldn't

01:04:03.160 have been out at two o'clock in the morning.

01:04:04.860 You shouldn't have been out at a BLM protest.

01:04:06.540 Uh, and if you do that, when they swarm your car with one guy with an AK 47, uh, you just

01:04:10.820 have to take a beating to quote, uh, Binger from the Rittenhouse case.

01:04:14.300 I, it's definitely, um, not, it's very bad.

01:04:18.100 I mean, it makes it look terrible.

01:04:18.920 It makes it politically more dangerous to defend publicly.

01:04:21.820 Uh, you just have to bring it back to the evidence as to whether or not, uh, this should

01:04:25.900 have been prosecuted in the first place because there was evidence from the lead investigator

01:04:29.760 that this was basically a political prosecution from the get-go that the lead investigator

01:04:33.780 said, we should not be prosecuting this.

01:04:36.040 I don't think we should.

01:04:37.000 And he had like a hundred pages of his PowerPoint presentation or whatever it was, uh, removed

01:04:42.160 from what was submitted to the grand jury.

01:04:44.200 Screw the jury heard from that expert and nonetheless convicted.

01:04:47.280 It is nuanced, but it gets really politically dirty when they start revealing those text messages

01:04:51.720 because they don't make any, they don't make it very popular to continue defending this

01:04:55.380 guy.

01:04:55.640 Even if in law, he might be right.

01:04:57.280 You're making good points.

01:04:57.940 And the other thing is, you know, think about yourself in his position, even, okay, maybe

01:05:02.000 he's doing some tough talk.

01:05:03.280 Maybe he's saying this is such bullshit.

01:05:04.840 What's happening on these riots.

01:05:06.020 You know, if they tried that with me, they get a different result, putting the race stuff

01:05:08.740 to the side.

01:05:09.900 Um, there could be that kind of tough talk.

01:05:11.800 That wouldn't mean you'd actually go out there trying to provoke an encounter in which

01:05:14.900 you could kill somebody.

01:05:16.480 But if some guy comes up to your car in the midst of a BLM protest, riot, you know, whatever

01:05:22.400 you want to call it with an AK 47, and these are military guys, they know that gun.

01:05:26.760 Um, it's not like me.

01:05:27.800 I, I, any big gun, I'd be scared, but an AK 47 and he's wearing the vest neoprene, not

01:05:34.060 Kevlar.

01:05:34.900 Um, I don't know the difference.

01:05:36.780 Uh, I'd be scared too.

01:05:39.660 Kevlar would have been like bullet would have been ballistic resistant to some extent, but,

01:05:43.180 um, of course you'd be scared.

01:05:45.200 And then, and then you have to get into the contradicting, uh, uh, evidence that the defendant

01:05:50.160 himself gave Perry, where he said, uh, he was pointing the gun at me, but then in, in,

01:05:54.080 in some deposition or investigation, he said, I didn't want to give him a chance to aim.

01:05:58.220 Yeah.

01:05:58.580 Look, you're in one of those situations where even if you understand that, like, I mean,

01:06:02.960 what, think about it, Viva, like, did he really have to show that the guy was pointing the

01:06:06.860 gun right at him?

01:06:07.620 It's like, you came over to my car, you confronted me, you got my, me to roll my window down.

01:06:12.680 You were armed to the teeth.

01:06:14.040 He also had a knife.

01:06:14.860 You had an illegal weapon that could do inflict mass damage in a split second.

01:06:20.400 You had a mob of people.

01:06:21.940 I had nothing, nothing.

01:06:22.860 I was in shorts and a t-shirt and flip-flops.

01:06:26.180 So yeah, I was where I was at, where I had a right to be under the law, all those things.

01:06:30.760 I don't just, nobody says it.

01:06:32.800 I don't think the gun gun was illegal.

01:06:34.400 I think it was legal.

01:06:35.200 And I think it was a legal open carry, but yeah, you're in a circumstance.

01:06:38.460 AK-47s, those are not legal to carry around.

01:06:40.780 What?

01:06:41.000 Uh, I'm, no, I'm, I, unless I'm mistaken and maybe the crew could check this out in

01:06:45.340 real time.

01:06:45.700 I think that gun was lawfully owned and it was a legal open carry.

01:06:48.200 Uh, but I'm, I'm open to being wrong because I'm not an expert on that stuff.

01:06:51.240 We're checking, we're checking.

01:06:53.200 This is one of those situations also where you can have both sides having a legitimate

01:06:58.040 defense in law of mutual self-defense and like in gauge, uh, gross crowds in the Rittenhouse

01:07:03.980 case where, you know, had he been an innocent bystander who was carrying a gun and saw the

01:07:08.680 situation and pulled it and shot Rittenhouse.

01:07:11.620 Um, you know, there could have been an argument for both parties in their own minds would have

01:07:16.180 been within their rights to use self-defense gross cross.

01:07:20.320 The context was a little different because he chased down Rittenhouse and you know, all

01:07:23.620 that, but you could find yourself in an unfortunate situation where both parties think they're

01:07:27.760 invoking legitimate self-defense and they can in fact raise legal arguments to that effect.

01:07:31.560 But yeah, you get swarmed by a mob and there's a guy carrying an AK-47 with a knife and you're

01:07:36.540 in flip-flops with your, your girlfriend or your wife in your, in the passenger side.

01:07:40.240 I mean, who the heck is looking for that fight to begin with?

01:07:45.160 There's okay.

01:07:46.040 So now my team is clarifying AK-7, AK-47 type weapon and it was legal.

01:07:51.700 So I don't know what that means in the liberal press.

01:07:54.280 That's an AR-15, which is not the same thing at all.

01:07:57.320 So we do have to dig deeper on some of these facts.

01:07:59.420 The point is any sort of long gun, most people would be scared.

01:08:02.780 You know, what list?

01:08:03.580 Um, so yeah, we'll see.

01:08:05.720 I mean, so far, governor Abbott is not backing down.

01:08:08.160 He submitted the request on April 10th or the parole board got the case on April 10th

01:08:12.120 and this stuff came out and he has not changed, uh, his stance.

01:08:15.380 All right.

01:08:15.540 So let's, we'll find out what happens.

01:08:16.940 Let's move on to Kappa Kappa Gamma, which is the greatest lawsuit I've ever seen.

01:08:20.800 I mean, this may be my favorite case and I've done so many Kelly's for it.

01:08:24.100 I'm, it's wonderful.

01:08:25.540 You are welcome America for me, from me for bringing it to you.

01:08:29.300 University of Wyoming.

01:08:32.760 This is incredible.

01:08:35.260 Seven sorority sisters are suing the Kappa Kappa Gamma fraternity.

01:08:39.800 They say, though it's a sorority, I guess they're all technically fraternities, but claiming

01:08:43.500 that Kappa Kappa Gamma has violated its stated purpose by inducting a transgender member.

01:08:51.340 The transgender member really wanted to be a Kappa.

01:08:55.860 I personally was a Tridelt and this was never an issue at Tridelt, but Kappa Kappa Gamma

01:09:00.760 at Syracuse was the very, very blonde, very, very sweater set, pearl wearing group of gals

01:09:06.940 who had tea while we were throwing back shots, Jell-O shots over Tridelt.

01:09:12.520 Okay.

01:09:12.720 So it was a different land back then, apparently, because now Kappa Kappa Gamma has gone trans

01:09:17.780 and I'm sorry, but it's not like, you know, a trans person who's really making an effort

01:09:24.320 to pass as a woman and trying to blend in, like really just wants to be a Kappa.

01:09:30.000 This is the trans person.

01:09:31.300 Okay.

01:09:31.600 And this trans person, this is a man who wanted to join Kappa Kappa, did the pledging in August

01:09:39.560 and was rejected probably because he has a penis, but he didn't get in.

01:09:46.480 Then he decided to go through the informal process that came a couple months later where

01:09:52.220 it's called like an open bid students through meetups, usually to test for compatibility

01:09:56.620 with the sorority get together.

01:09:58.240 And you can use that lump of that loophole to get in, though the girls were told there's

01:10:03.220 a 99.9% chance.

01:10:04.680 We will not be offering this person whose name is Artemis a bid.

01:10:08.560 So not to worry.

01:10:09.480 Got to go through these hoops, but Artemis is not coming in.

01:10:11.820 Well, wrong, wrong, because then they did something in coordination, alleged lawsuit with the national

01:10:19.740 chapter that wanted more trans people where they had not an anonymous vote on Artemis, but

01:10:26.080 a public vote.

01:10:26.960 You had to register your email to offer your vote.

01:10:29.220 And Vinny, the girls felt pressured and they were explicitly told if your answer is no on

01:10:33.480 Artemis, you have to say why specifically it has to be like a personality trait that you've

01:10:37.900 encountered.

01:10:38.440 So you must have met him.

01:10:41.000 And they felt like they're going to be and they said, or it'll be rejected as bigotry.

01:10:46.520 So he got in.

01:10:47.860 And then I don't know if you've read the details, but it's absolutely horrifying what happened

01:10:53.840 with Artemis inside the sorority house after that.

01:10:57.700 This is a picture of the girls with Artemis over there on the left.

01:11:00.220 I don't have to point that out because it's blatantly obvious which one of these things

01:11:03.700 is not like the others.

01:11:05.120 So what do you make of the case before we get into the details?

01:11:09.540 Oh, Vinny, go for the legal side of this.

01:11:12.160 I'll go for the social cultural side.

01:11:14.900 Well, I want us to know what the bylaws are with with the sorority and what they're you

01:11:20.140 know, what you agree to when you agree to be a member of all this and what the rights

01:11:25.420 and responsibilities are back and forth.

01:11:27.760 I didn't pledge.

01:11:28.900 So I don't know.

01:11:30.960 The other part of this is when you get into some of these other allegations, I think that's

01:11:35.140 probably a better route for the sorority members that don't want the new member to be a member

01:11:42.780 of the of the sorority.

01:11:44.800 And that is some of the behavior that they are alleging.

01:11:47.380 To me, that's a much better route.

01:11:49.360 This is going to get really messy.

01:11:50.740 But to me, it's almost like a contract case.

01:11:53.760 Right.

01:11:54.080 And I want to know what what exactly each side has promised to one another as a member

01:11:59.860 and being a member.

01:12:00.940 So I think that's that's the first part of the attack for the plaintiffs here.

01:12:07.500 Hmm.

01:12:08.540 They I'm dancing.

01:12:10.660 I'm dancing around this one.

01:12:12.060 This is a very this is a dangerous position because I don't want to say the wrong thing

01:12:16.880 here.

01:12:17.240 Welcome to my world, Vinny.

01:12:18.620 Go ahead.

01:12:18.940 And and at some point, people are just going to have to I don't say that you lack a spine,

01:12:24.220 but people are just going to have to say I'm going to say it, even if it's going to be

01:12:26.440 unpopular, that might be part and parcel of the problem that got to this in the first

01:12:30.160 place.

01:12:30.800 People didn't want to vote, not anonymously because they didn't want to deal with the

01:12:34.040 repercussions.

01:12:34.620 And then this is what happens.

01:12:36.620 Yeah.

01:12:36.840 The the the bylaws, as far as I understand, it was a sorority set up for ladies.

01:12:41.780 So this might be Katanji Jackson Brown's like SCOTUS decision.

01:12:45.020 They use that 1871 bylaws say any lady may become a candidate for a membership who shall

01:12:50.600 be of good moral character and above average talent.

01:12:53.240 By the way, Artemis, not for nothing, has a one point nine GPA.

01:12:56.660 One point nine.

01:12:59.040 This might be the moment when Katanji Jackson Brown gets that expert biologist on the stand

01:13:03.520 at SCOTUS to say what a woman is like.

01:13:05.300 What's a lady?

01:13:05.920 What was a lady in 1870?

01:13:07.160 It's it's it's it's a no brainer what was intended by the bylaws, the behavioral side

01:13:12.220 of it, because apparently, in addition to not meeting the scholastic criteria, the individual

01:13:16.200 also would sit around the watching the girls change.

01:13:20.080 Basically, this reminds me of this reminds me of the case up in Canada where you had this

01:13:26.760 teacher who purported to be trans wearing obscenely, ridiculously large prosthetic breasts

01:13:33.140 in Woodshop class.

01:13:34.920 And no, and I'm convinced that this is people trolling.

01:13:38.220 And these are people who are trying to push the limits of what, you know, push the limits

01:13:41.920 of a tolerant society.

01:13:43.000 Disagree.

01:13:43.520 Sexual fetishes working themselves out on our children and our sorority sisters.

01:13:47.920 That's what it's not a troll.

01:13:49.220 That guy in Canada is a dude who takes off those enormous breasts.

01:13:52.740 He was caught by Rebel News up there.

01:13:54.440 It's the most unbelievable report I've ever seen that 10 minutes by the Rebel News was spectacular.

01:13:59.560 They chased him down.

01:14:00.480 It's Kayla Lemieux without the enormous boobs.

01:14:04.560 And he runs.

01:14:05.980 And then the Rebel News reporter runs.

01:14:08.260 It's all a farce.

01:14:10.320 Everyone, they all brave and demand their rights until it comes time to, you know, answer questions

01:14:14.100 for their conduct.

01:14:14.980 But what I, you know, a troll as to whether or not it's to push the limits or a troll as

01:14:18.980 in to push their fetishes, you know, we'll just, we're agreeing on the same principle,

01:14:22.600 just different explanations.

01:14:23.780 Yes.

01:14:24.040 Um, but, uh, it is, um, I mean, this is what happens when women who have been reluctant

01:14:31.020 to be vocal about defending women's rights, um, you know, in the name of tolerance and

01:14:36.220 the name of, you know, social media virtue signaling sort of, uh, that type of currency

01:14:41.860 don't say anything.

01:14:43.020 And then lo and behold, you now have to change in front of a biological male.

01:14:46.320 It's like, uh, Megan, I've been saying this for a little while, five years ago under the

01:14:51.220 hashtag me too movement, Jeffrey Rush was being canceled because he allegedly exposed himself

01:14:56.220 to female members on a crew on, on, on a film.

01:14:59.780 And now you got Riley Gaines, you got these sorority girls here who are being compelled

01:15:04.760 to undress in front of biological males.

01:15:07.340 And you're, they're, they're being in Riley Gaines case, even physically assaulted by men

01:15:12.060 while speaking up for women's rights.

01:15:13.900 The world has gone absolutely topsy turvy mad.

01:15:17.000 And it takes a, you know, a bit of courage and a bit of willingness to deal with the blowback

01:15:22.240 to say, I'm voting against it.

01:15:23.960 And here's why.

01:15:24.940 And I'm within my rights.

01:15:26.040 And if you do it, I wish I had been in this sorority.

01:15:27.760 I wish I had been in this or I, I would have walked right over Artemis and said, what the

01:15:32.480 fuck are you doing with your hand down your pants, get your hand out of your pants right

01:15:35.540 now and get the hell out of this sorority right now.

01:15:38.180 Before I call the police on your ass, you are 100% evicted from the sorority.

01:15:43.000 The only question now is whether you're going to prison.

01:15:44.720 That's it.

01:15:45.480 All right.

01:15:45.740 You're, you're kicked out.

01:15:46.780 I'm probably going to sue you.

01:15:48.000 And my next call is going to be to nine one one.

01:15:50.320 Get out.

01:15:51.260 Here's what he did.

01:15:52.520 Uh, the lawsuit accuses, allegedly the lawsuit accuses.

01:15:57.420 Uh, the him of sitting on the couch in the second floor common area, not studying, watching

01:16:02.140 the women.

01:16:02.520 The women felt uneasy, uh, as he's stared at them without talking for hours.

01:16:08.340 One sorority member walked down the hall to take a shower, wearing only a towel.

01:16:11.080 She felt an unsettling presence turned and saw Artemis watching her silently.

01:16:15.700 The lawsuit alleges that Artemis behaved inappropriately around her, around the sorority sisters on numerous

01:16:20.960 occasions, including once when Artemis had an erection visible through his leggings.

01:16:25.860 Other times he had a pillow in his lap.

01:16:28.740 Oh, I wonder what was going on beneath that pillow.

01:16:30.960 The complaint alleges that Artemis took photographs of the women at awkward moments when they were

01:16:35.080 not prepared when they were at a sorority slumber party.

01:16:37.800 Artemis, I am going to beat the, okay.

01:16:40.500 Then the, the, the, the question, uh, okay.

01:16:43.680 Uh, oh, apparently he repeatedly questioned the women about what vaginas look like, breast

01:16:49.100 cup size, whether women were considering breast reductions and birth control.

01:16:52.740 You know what?

01:16:53.820 I've had this experience with newly trans people myself.

01:16:56.240 They think that women sit around and talk about this shit.

01:16:58.380 We don't.

01:16:58.840 That is not what women sit around and talk about.

01:17:00.580 Like, they think this is like what, like fitting in.

01:17:03.140 Look, what does your vagina look like?

01:17:06.900 Abby.

01:17:07.260 I'm afraid I cannot partake in this.

01:17:14.760 I can't partake in this portion of the conversation, but Megan, you say I would have called the cops

01:17:19.240 if you're in Canada and you call the cops, like you saw what happened to billboard Chris

01:17:22.980 out in Vancouver where he gets physically assaulted by, by a man at a, and then, and then the cop

01:17:28.760 is there saying, well, you're, you're wearing a billboard that says, you know, children can't

01:17:32.600 consent to purity blockers.

01:17:33.480 That's provocation.

01:17:34.800 I mean, you're not even sure to get justice from the police or the courts.

01:17:39.140 It's what happens when the entire system has been captured by ideology.

01:17:43.340 Oh my gosh.

01:17:44.360 You're so right.

01:17:45.280 This is, this should be a sexual harassment suit.

01:17:47.640 That's what it should be.

01:17:48.860 That should be your basis.

01:17:50.160 And, and, and you bring in the sorority as well for enabling all of it.

01:17:54.840 That's, that's where you have to go.

01:17:56.680 Let them, let them fight.

01:17:58.160 Let them fight that fight.

01:18:00.040 That's the one that you want.

01:18:01.860 You endangered us.

01:18:03.140 Exactly right.

01:18:03.900 You endangered us.

01:18:04.700 You pressured us.

01:18:05.780 You made us unable to reject this person who we could identify as a potential pervert.

01:18:10.120 And then we were subjected to his lewd and lascivious behaviors.

01:18:14.140 Uh, just a couple more.

01:18:15.500 Other members told the woman that, uh, he appeared sexually aroused after having seen one world,

01:18:21.060 one girl take off her top and stood near the door with his hand over his genitals.

01:18:25.220 Since then, he keeps asking the woman about her romantic attachments.

01:18:29.120 He stood in the back of a sorority yoga class for an hour, watching the assembled young women

01:18:33.900 flex their bodies.

01:18:35.440 These poor girls.

01:18:37.140 This is so sad.

01:18:38.540 Like this makes me so angry.

01:18:40.660 I really want to punch the people at Kappa Kappa Gamma.

01:18:43.360 Nevermind Artemis who behaved absolutely disgustingly.

01:18:46.960 And you're right.

01:18:47.720 Should be the subject of a lawsuit, but should 100% be kicked out.

01:18:50.840 And by the way, guys, uh, I'm told that now Artemis lives outside of the sorority house

01:18:56.060 at the moment, but it's slated to live at the sorority in the coming year and often stays

01:19:01.020 there for meals and other secret sorority rituals and events.

01:19:04.360 This is a nightmare.

01:19:05.660 This is, we reap what we sow.

01:19:07.700 KKG is to blame.

01:19:09.220 I don't blame the girls for suing.

01:19:10.440 Go ahead.

01:19:11.360 Everyone walk out of that sorority and leave it with, leave it with one member.

01:19:15.380 But can you believe Megan, we're living in a world where we are expected to describe

01:19:19.860 this individual, the defendant as having, you know, as covered her penis.

01:19:24.440 I mean, this is, this is the absurdity of the world in which we're, it's, it's absurd

01:19:28.180 and it's not wrong to say it's absurd.

01:19:30.260 Um, and people have to appreciate that this is, uh, it is an abuse of people's otherwise,

01:19:37.300 uh, tolerant willingness to accommodate.

01:19:40.080 Um, and, and people have, you know, it's not a question of, uh, violence or aggression

01:19:45.160 or anything whatsoever.

01:19:46.240 It's a question of basic justice.

01:19:48.500 These, these entities were set up for a specific purpose in the first place.

01:19:53.240 And now you have like the cases, uh, being revealed by James O'Keefe and, uh, OMG media,

01:19:57.140 um, you know, uh, prisoners getting impregnated after trans prisoners are led into women's

01:20:03.480 facilities.

01:20:03.900 There was a reason why.

01:20:05.660 Yeah.

01:20:06.300 Why, why, why did Artemis choose to pledge?

01:20:09.240 How long has Artemis been a fake woman?

01:20:12.300 Um, because we have videotape of Artemis two years ago in 2020 during the COVID pandemic

01:20:17.680 on camera, right?

01:20:19.420 2020, what is it?

01:20:20.340 21, um, on camera with, with some panel discussing COVID and Artemis looks and sounds very much

01:20:27.360 like a man who's not trying to pose as a woman.

01:20:29.640 Here's a bit of it.

01:20:30.300 Um, communicating with friends, uh, putting that, you know, social network that you have,

01:20:37.560 uh, from in-person to an online format, uh, would be extraordinary beneficial.

01:20:45.980 And I wish that I had developed that better, but living in a new environment, uh, it was

01:20:53.260 really difficult.

01:20:57.360 Oh my God.

01:20:59.340 This is not a woman.

01:21:01.020 This isn't even really a trans person from the look of it.

01:21:03.420 This is this to me that, that what effort was made there, what suggests to you that this

01:21:07.940 is a transfer?

01:21:08.640 How did they let this person in Kappa Kappa Gamma?

01:21:10.760 If we don't find our voices and start speaking up against this nonsense, we can kiss every

01:21:16.340 woman's space.

01:21:17.020 Goodbye.

01:21:17.380 We can kiss women's rights.

01:21:18.580 Goodbye.

01:21:19.180 We can kiss sororities.

01:21:20.720 Goodbye.

01:21:21.140 We can take off our tops and our underwear and do our yoga in front of perverted men who

01:21:27.200 just want to get off watching us till the cows come home.

01:21:30.640 Stick your daughter in the sorority.

01:21:32.380 Let them add her.

01:21:33.600 Find your voices, ladies, and the men who support us.

01:21:36.780 Otherwise, this is our future.

01:21:38.640 I'm sorry.

01:21:39.220 I'm done.

01:21:39.940 I'm done.

01:21:40.300 I don't want to deal with this shit at a tried out at Kappa Kappa Gamma in the women's

01:21:44.820 locker room.

01:21:45.720 You can be supportive of trans people and what they're going through without surrendering

01:21:49.720 to this madness.

01:21:53.340 It's it's exposing women to danger.

01:21:56.180 And the whole reason why there were separate sports was to protect women.

01:22:01.020 There there are call Wikipedia a bigot website.

01:22:04.600 There are biological physiological differences between men and women, males and females.

01:22:10.280 The sports were set up to protect Wikipedia for that.

01:22:13.660 I'm just waiting for Wikipedia to edit that entire page that explains the skeletal differences,

01:22:19.020 the muscular differences, the brain development differences.

01:22:21.460 Just wait for that to be bigoted to note science.

01:22:24.340 These divisions were set up to protect women physically, to prevent them from being exposed

01:22:28.740 to certain types of assault that, you know, women are uniquely exposed to.

01:22:33.840 And we're seeing what happens.

01:22:35.220 The second these rules start getting bent, the second these rules get violated in the

01:22:40.660 prison setting.

01:22:41.620 Lo and behold, you end up you are literally locking women up to the to the foxes who are

01:22:46.380 breaking into the hen house.

01:22:47.640 And it's no different with Kappa Kappa Gamma, whatever this sorority is.

01:22:50.600 And there needs to be a great plaintiff's lawyer who's going to take these cases now because

01:22:55.980 you're endangering women.

01:22:58.160 Women are the victims here.

01:22:59.900 And you you litigate those cases.

01:23:02.780 You you put people on notice that no, no, no, it's not OK.

01:23:06.560 You can't endanger these women and Kappa should end up paying the tuition for these for these

01:23:13.020 women, for the rest of their undergrad degrees and their grad degrees and should buy them

01:23:18.120 their first home for this.

01:23:21.060 But you need a good plaintiff's attorney who is going to is going to be able to withstand

01:23:26.460 whatever blowback that they have and push forward with it.

01:23:30.240 And Gloria, Gloria Allred, go get Gloria.

01:23:34.280 I'm tested.

01:23:35.400 I'm tempted to dust off my shingle, guys, and go out there and do it myself, although

01:23:39.220 I'm not admitted in Wyoming, but I was admitted in New York and Massachusetts, Illinois, all

01:23:44.520 over the place.

01:23:45.500 So, you know, if I really want to put it out, I have to do a lot of CLE in any way.

01:23:50.040 Are you suing state court so Court TV can cover that trial, Megan?

01:23:53.860 I will do it.

01:23:54.820 You don't want to wire them to the federal court.

01:23:56.660 You're going to be state court.

01:23:58.000 I am fired up.

01:23:59.120 I just got this whole all this stuff has gotten so insane.

01:24:02.600 I have just had it.

01:24:03.620 I've had it.

01:24:04.340 As Viva says, we have to start talking honestly about it.

01:24:07.620 Or it's preposterous.

01:24:10.060 Nobody out there wants to take any rights from trans people because they're basic human

01:24:14.880 rights.

01:24:15.440 But what the trans debate has morphed into is basically what I'm calling biological supremacy

01:24:20.360 over women.

01:24:21.560 There are biological, physiological reasons for which divisions were set up, for which, you

01:24:27.200 know, sororities were set up.

01:24:28.640 And we're now basically saying that trans rights, whatever rights that trans people are purported

01:24:32.820 not to benefit from, trump women's rights.

01:24:35.080 And if someone's rights trump somebody else's rights, we're doing it wrong.

01:24:38.760 And it's just time to have that discussion without feeling guilty, feeling like the social

01:24:43.220 media mob is going to say, you're denying trans rights.

01:24:45.580 I'm not denying trans rights.

01:24:46.840 I'm preserving women's rights.

01:24:48.060 They were fought long and hard for.

01:24:49.940 And everybody's got a mother.

01:24:51.280 And, you know, a lot of people out there have wives and daughters.

01:24:54.000 And you're not just standing up for yourself at some point in time.

01:24:56.440 You're standing up for the future of your children because it really is in peril right

01:24:59.640 now.

01:25:00.020 Isn't this how Tom Hanks started his career at the sorority game?

01:25:04.800 That was when drag was fun.

01:25:06.560 That was when drag was just good old clean fun.

01:25:09.820 That is one of the benefits of being in the position I'm in now.

01:25:12.560 They can't cancel me.

01:25:13.760 I'm independent.

01:25:14.940 You can't take away my voice.

01:25:16.700 You tried it once.

01:25:17.700 I rose again.

01:25:18.920 And I am here to speak the truth.

01:25:24.320 There's a Kelly's Court update I want to get to in a second, but let me just kick it

01:25:26.740 off with Alec Baldwin.

01:25:27.480 Soon, he has requested that this wrongful death lawsuit filed against him be dismissed

01:25:33.340 with prejudice.

01:25:35.260 Now, the husband of Helena Hutchins, the cinematographer, sued him for wrongful death or, you know, was

01:25:40.520 going to, but they settled the case.

01:25:42.880 Then Helena Hutchins' family sued him for wrongful death.

01:25:49.400 And that is why, Viva, he's claiming it needs to be dismissed.

01:25:52.920 He's like, I already settled the wrongful death lawsuit, as I understand it.

01:25:56.260 And they're saying that the plaintiff must be married to the decedent under California

01:26:01.120 law in order to be compensated for wrongful death.

01:26:04.820 Yeah, I don't know what the details of California law are on this.

01:26:10.840 I mean, at some point you do, you could get sensitive to the fact that you can't have every

01:26:15.300 extended family member suing for the wrongful death of a family member.

01:26:18.180 But the mother and the sister, if I'm going back to my criminal law in Canada, I'm pretty

01:26:24.060 sure they can sue for loss of enjoyment of life.

01:26:26.560 The fact that he settled with the husband is neither here nor there, but you got to give

01:26:31.940 it to Alec.

01:26:32.580 He's not afraid of taking the unpopular position that the lawsuit should be dismissed with

01:26:37.600 prejudice because you weren't close to her anyhow.

01:26:39.680 So no basis to sue.

01:26:41.920 Yeah, I don't exactly know the nuances of California law, but I'd be flabbergasted if

01:26:45.480 the mother and sibling of someone who was wrongfully killed would not be able to sue

01:26:49.240 a sibling for wrongful death.

01:26:50.620 And there's another development, I think, that is really, really bizarre.

01:26:57.880 Alec has waived his right to be at his criminal preliminary hearing, which is coming up in

01:27:02.720 May.

01:27:03.520 And now he apparently has resumed filming the Rust movie.

01:27:09.620 So weird.

01:27:10.780 Where this shooting happened.

01:27:12.800 So he can't be at his criminal preliminary hearing for shooting and killing the cinematographer

01:27:21.760 during the filming of Rust because he is going to be filming Rust.

01:27:30.100 That's bizarre.

01:27:31.240 That was part of the settlement with the husband is that they have to finish, you know, finish

01:27:35.660 shooting the film.

01:27:36.340 I actually made the prediction that they were never going to resume filming despite their agreement

01:27:40.160 because of the criminal charges that were looming.

01:27:44.860 It's the whole the whole situation is is utterly bizarre.

01:27:47.400 But I don't I as far as I understand, like settling with the husband is not going to eliminate

01:27:51.940 potential lawsuits from others who have claims against Alec.

01:27:55.500 Well, here's the response.

01:27:56.520 A lawyer, a lawyer for Hutchinson's mother and father and sister who are behind the wrongful

01:28:00.180 death suit, the new one.

01:28:01.240 They slammed his attempt to avoid responsibility.

01:28:03.100 That was their word saying we're not surprised that he's once again attempting to avoid responsibility.

01:28:07.860 Attorney Gloria Allred, as if on cue, she says it's abundantly clear under New Mexico law,

01:28:15.900 which is where the shooting happened, she says, which will be applied in the California

01:28:20.140 court, that he is responsible for all the harm he did to the entirety of her family.

01:28:26.020 We're we're here to make sure that he's held accountable.

01:28:28.280 So it'll come down to a choice of law issue.

01:28:30.220 I haven't checked New Mexico law, but if they're right.

01:28:32.240 By the way, we looked up more on the AK-47 issue.

01:28:34.820 New an AK-47 is legal in Texas as long as it's been modified to be a semi-automatic and not

01:28:42.180 do the carnage, you know, that it does when used as a true weapon of war on the fields

01:28:47.220 of battle.

01:28:47.580 That makes some more sense, though.

01:28:49.220 It doesn't undermine the fear of somebody who's looking one in the barrel or even on the

01:28:53.400 side.

01:28:54.280 Guys, that was a fun one.

01:28:57.040 Hope you come back.

01:28:58.340 It's been a pleasure.

01:29:00.060 Thank you very much, Megan.

01:29:01.680 Thank you.

01:29:02.600 See you soon.

01:29:04.820 An update in the Stanford fake rape case.

01:29:08.600 We brought this to you in March when I was in Montana with the fifth column.

01:29:11.960 It was a great episode.

01:29:13.320 This woman named Jennifer Grease, 25 of Santa Clara, Stanford University employee, accused

01:29:18.440 someone of raping her not once but twice.

01:29:22.260 She went to the medical center.

01:29:23.960 She was reluctant to bring in the police, but she sat for a medical kit.

01:29:27.840 She gave details about how one time the guy had dragged her into the basement.

01:29:30.880 Another time the guy had grabbed her into a bathroom and brutally raped her, described

01:29:35.700 the man, six foot one, black, looked very much like her co-worker in his late 20s.

01:29:42.640 Her race has not been disclosed publicly, which I really do find interesting.

01:29:46.400 And there's no picture.

01:29:47.840 There's no mugshot.

01:29:48.660 Let's find out.

01:29:49.280 It was all lies.

01:29:51.760 She almost ruined this man's life just because he ticked her off somehow.

01:29:56.160 She said she was upset with him because he gave her false intention and turned her friends

01:29:59.880 against her.

01:30:00.900 Stanford students were protesting for weeks.

01:30:03.280 Stanford's not safe.

01:30:04.040 Stanford supports rape.

01:30:05.240 Stanford do more.

01:30:06.340 Defund police, by the way.

01:30:07.480 Same time.

01:30:07.900 Um, she was a liar.

01:30:09.980 And last we knew she was just outed and fired or put on permanent leave.

01:30:15.960 Now she has been criminally charged.

01:30:19.000 Yay.

01:30:19.760 Perjury charges because she filed for benefits for victims.

01:30:23.300 Uh, and she allegedly lied about it, um, in other, in connection with the case.

01:30:27.460 So she's got, she just, uh, had her first appearance, two felony counts of perjury, two

01:30:31.300 misdemeanor counts of making a false crime report.

01:30:33.740 Good.

01:30:34.660 Email me Megan at Megan Kelly.com with your thoughts.

01:30:37.280 And while you're there, sign up, sign up for my newsletter.

01:30:39.280 See you tomorrow with Alex Berenson.

01:30:43.940 Thanks for listening to the Megan Kelly show.

01:30:45.840 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

The Megyn Kelly Show - April 19, 2023

Trump vs. DeSantis Culture War, and Sorority Trans Pledge Lawsuit, with Jeffrey Lord, Michael Duncan, Viva Frei, and Vinnie Politan ｜ Ep. 532

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