A jury in Texas has handed down a nearly $50 million judgment against Alex Jones for defamation in a case brought by the parents of a victim of the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting. Megyn tells the story behind the case and the testimony of Neil Hesslin, the father of slain 6-year-old Jesse Hesslin.
00:52:35.740If you haven't gotten your kid the vaccine yet.
00:52:38.020And you're being told he can't enroll this year unless he gets it.
00:52:44.480Is there any point to that, given that they're now working on new vaccines to combat Omicron?
00:52:50.920So it's an admission that the current vaccines are really not that effective against Omicron.
00:52:55.240So why would I stick my kid with a vaccine that was for a version of this virus that is now a couple of versions old, only to be told probably in six months, I have to have him stuck again with the new one they're coming up with that actually addresses the current variant of this virus that we're dealing with?
00:53:14.860But, you know, no, Megan, the whole thing's confused and, you know, fortunately in terms of the, you know, the new toddler, um, governor DeSantis likes to call them toddler vaccines.
00:53:29.020And so I enjoy that he calls it that, um, in terms of those, I mean, fortunately parents are just, you know, they're just almost all saying, you know, thanks.
00:53:40.000So I, it gives me some, um, some faith and, um, and some confidence that some sanity is being restored in terms of parents, like listening to their intuition, obviously the fact that very few of them under the five-year-old group have said, no, thanks.
00:54:00.860While Dr. Falchi and, you know, Dr. Walensky and everyone else at the federal level is saying, you should, you have to do this.
00:54:09.620It gives me some, um, more faith and parental intuition.
00:54:14.160And I think, you know, I saw, I was pleased to see that LA backed down and I'm glad that, um, that, you know, some parents decided not to fold.
00:54:23.800And I think that, I think it's going to be a tricky battle because the, the, the issue is beyond, you know, which variant is being targeted or whatever, you know, the bottom line is just before any other issues, right.
00:54:38.640Before you ask about waning immunity, before you look at, well, you know, how safe are these in children, um, before any of those other questions, there's just, just that basic question of, you know, is this something that my kid is going to be better off receiving?
00:54:54.280And the fact is, and it is a fact that a benefit in healthy children or children who've had COVID and therefore have immunity has like never been demonstrated.
00:55:08.880So, you know, so in other words, why are we even talking about this?
00:55:13.280Why is this even something that they're putting on the table?
00:56:18.580Um, I mean, my answer is that I haven't seen a study that shows that, but my other, like the more relevant question is like, this is ludicrous.
00:56:30.980That's, that is the relevant response.
00:56:40.300You know, like, you know, was that an end point in the trials?
00:56:45.440No, I mean, that's doctors care about, and public health is about, you know, making, helping people be as healthy as possible when you, I mean, I don't know.
00:56:56.240It's almost, I don't know whether to put people like that in a box and like just a lock up the, you know, lock it and then let them out in a couple of days and ask them again if they still want to do that.
00:57:06.520It's crazy talk because they'll say, and this, by the way, this is an all boys school.
00:57:10.200So they're dealing with the population, especially at those older ages, that actually does have to worry about myocarditis and, you know, a real risk from the vaccine that's been documented.
00:57:19.800So you ask them on the other side, well, okay.
00:58:04.760They, they want everyone to be shot with that vaccine.
00:58:09.260I don't know why I, they just, they ignore the myocarditis and they say, you can't say that you have like a history of blood clots in your family.
00:58:18.480You could have any sort of problems in your family.
00:58:27.820And only then if you have a doctor, a doctor they approve of, say little Johnny had, you know, whatever hives, only then can you get out of shot two.
00:58:36.900And meanwhile, they're telling the doctors that, hey, we're going to scrutinize any, any vaccine exemption that you do.
00:58:45.980And I mean, I, I just, I know that it's, can be really difficult, less difficult now than it was in the middle of all the craziness that we all had to deal with.
00:58:56.400But I just, I encourage people to, you know, to, to, to, to just not participate, to really do their very best not to participate.
00:59:05.960You know, I mean, I know it's difficult, you know, in, in California, you know, some of my colleagues when they were faced with the vaccine mandate, you know, they bit the bullet and, and they, if they didn't believe in it, there weren't many.
00:59:21.380And most of my colleagues did believe in it, but, you know, I had a few that, you know, one guy's not working there anymore.
00:59:28.520Another guy was going to retire, but they, you know, they approved his religious exemption and, you know, my wife and I, you know, we were, we, you know, when we had to move to Florida,
00:59:39.000if like the crazies had gotten their way and instituted vaccine mandates for flying, we'd have driven to Florida, you know?
00:59:46.680Um, so I just, it's just, I know that I know, I know it's not easy and I know it's way beyond not easy, but, you know, it's only, it is, it is courage that changes the world.
01:00:00.160And, um, and with every person that makes that step, it makes it a little bit easier for the next person and courage always rules the day.
01:00:09.920That would definitely, I mean, if enough parents say, take a hike to the, um, administrators at any school, that policy is done.
01:00:19.520Mm-hmm. Yes. Well, hopefully parents are starting to feel that more and more now that we see the vaccines are not what they were billed to be.
01:00:27.480Um, one other thing on Florida, there's been quite a bit of news this weekend as the Florida Board of Medicine voted this past Friday to start the process of setting rules for treating transgender minors.
01:00:41.400This is a debate that has come up state after state after state, you know, places like Florida, like Texas have said, we're going to close down these transgender quote care clinics.
01:00:54.020They're nothing of the sort. We shouldn't be giving cross sex hormones and so on to young teens, or we should at least severely restrict it.
01:01:02.300More and more red states are saying that. So now Florida is going to take a hard look at this issue. And where do you stand on it?
01:01:09.420Yeah, I was, I, you know, I attended that board meeting, so I heard some of the discussion and I contributed a little bit to it.
01:01:16.740You know, it's interesting, Megan, if we had had this conversation six months ago, I wouldn't have been able to say the things I would say now.
01:01:23.280And, um, I wouldn't have known what to say. And, um, you know, what I've, what I've done is I reviewed every study, every published study that has been, um, cited by both proponents and opponents of, um, of these, you know, the hormonal treatments and the, the sex change and surgeries, you know,
01:01:49.780the mastectomy is the, the, um, uh, and, you know, sex reassignment surgeries and, and I've honestly, like I, I had to, you know, I almost had to kind of wire my, my jaw shut shut.
01:02:02.780It is, um, it truly Megan is appalling, um, how much, um, how far physicians in this area have gone, um, compared to how much we know, how certain we are about the evidence.
01:02:21.200And, um, essentially, you know, the studies, these people, you know, the advocates like to say that the surgeries, you know, either reduce like improve mental health or, you know, you know, whatever, they have some benefits like these therapies.
01:02:38.740And you look at these studies, Megan, and, um, not a single one is, is a, um, like a prospective study with good control groups.
01:02:50.660There's not a single randomized clinical trial.
01:02:54.140All of the evidence basically that they make their arguments on are, um, what we call observational studies.
01:03:01.520And they are vulnerable to like profound confounding.
01:03:08.600So essentially there is no high quality evidence that has shown a benefit.
01:03:17.760And despite all of the procedures and all the hormones that have been administered, there's not a single high quality study that shows a benefit.
01:03:25.680On the other side, there's tremendous risk with these, uh, therapies and, you know, why is there a risk?
01:03:38.600I mean, with the hormone, hormone blockers, that's a, the pure, the pubertal period is, you know, that's an extremely, um, complex period where hormones are changing
01:03:53.260and they are active in development, including brain development.
01:03:59.140So, you know, we don't know what we're doing at all in terms of, you know, in terms of long-term effects or short-term effects of doing, of manipulating this, these, um, hormones that are critical to development during puberty.
01:04:19.240And then, you know, obviously with the sex, um, sex reassignment surgeries, there are clear risks of sterility and infertility.
01:04:27.240So when you look at the fact that the benefits haven't been proven and there's been opportunity, this could have been prospectively studied, you know, randomized clinical trials could have been done.
01:05:15.240You know, they can't provide, you know, the, you know, there, there, there's a technical term called assent in medical, but they, to think that there is informed that the individual has the capacity when they're a minor to make such a, you know, such a monumental
01:05:32.240treatment decision, that's, that's just ridiculous.
01:05:36.240Like, you know, so, you know, for multiple reasons, I mean, this, it falls outside the standard of care.
01:05:43.240They're upset because people are noticing and they're asking questions and they don't have good answers.
01:05:49.240And I hope, and I'm, I'm confident that the Florida Board of Medicine will rule in a way that is appropriate.
01:05:59.240They would be one of the outliers, sadly.
01:06:01.240It's just more and more protests happen when you cut off ubiquitous access to this kind of care.
01:06:08.240And as you point out, when it's a minor, nine times out of 10, you have somebody else doing some agenda pushing on the person and their yes is not a legal yes.
01:06:19.240I want to remind our audience, you were the associate professor of medicine at UCLA from 2016 to 2021 before being recruited by Governor DeSantis to go on over to Florida and be the surgeon general of Florida.
01:06:32.240Prior to that, got your bachelor of arts in chemistry from Wake Forest University, then moved down to get your MD from Harvard Medical School, PhD in health policy from Harvard as well, all the fancy degrees.
01:06:45.240It's very hard for them to dismiss you.
01:06:48.240You did, you checked all the boxes they wanted you to check and then you started to sound like a conservative and now they hate you.
01:06:55.240You know, they're funny, but they take that degree back if they could.
01:07:02.240But yeah, no, I mean, it's, you know, it's, it's a lot of, a lot of, a lot of craziness out there, but we will, you know, that's, that's my favorite part of the job is, is, you know, being a voice of sanity, of sanity in a field of insanity.
01:07:17.240Yes, well, and you found the right partner in Governor DeSantis.
01:07:20.240So you write this book, Transcend Fear, a blueprint for mindful leadership and public health.
01:07:25.880And I was surprised at your backstory and how forthcoming you were about it and how much time you spent on the abuse that you suffered.
01:07:36.480And I think you must have felt this was very important to your personal story and sort of how you got to where you are.
01:07:43.660You tell me why, why was that in there?
01:07:45.780Or was it hard to reveal so much about your personal background?
01:07:50.900Yeah, thanks for that question, Megan.
01:07:52.960Well, I mean, I honestly, Megan, I love people and I really want everyone to, you know, have the best chance that they can to, you know, to, to live a life that they want to live and a life that, you know, that they find fulfilling.
01:08:07.760And, you know, and, you know, and I, I can't, I can't be honest about me without sharing those things, because sort of me being here is not, is not an accident.
01:08:20.940And ironically, you know, had, you know, had that, you know, the babysitter not abused me, not sexually abused me in the way that she did.
01:08:34.640And I, you know, I wouldn't have developed the sort of the numbness that I carried around in my life and thought didn't think anything of it, because I thought that's how, you know, that it was normal.
01:08:47.340And I wouldn't have, you know, I wouldn't have had such a sort of a volatile sort of crisis, kind of an emotional, physical, emotional, spiritual crisis, when I fell in love with my wife.
01:09:05.540And had I not had all that, I would not have, you know, essentially been forced to, forced to, you know, face it and, and get help.
01:09:17.920And my wife is the one who, she's guided me the whole way.
01:09:22.800And, and how not all that happened, I would have been able to, you know, essentially to transcend my own fear, to, to shed the, the, the things that I was holding on to in my own life that were, that were preventing me from, you know, from being free of fear, being able to connect to other people,
01:09:45.160being, being able to be authentic, to be who I, you know, to find who I am, and to be who I am, and to be, you know, the reflection of God that, that all of us are.
01:10:00.840Though we all manage, you know, in this world to, you know, to collect all this stuff, that is this buffer between, between who we are, and, and how we end up, you know, showing up in the world.
01:10:15.160So, you know, without those things, I wouldn't be where I am, I wouldn't be able to do the things that, that I've done.
01:10:22.960I certainly wouldn't have been able to sort of withstand and sort of sail through the criticisms that, that I've received without like changing something about myself or whatever, or, you know, dealing with tremendous doubt, losing my way, losing my clarity.
01:10:39.280So, you know, all of those things, you know, I fortunately got on a path, thanks to my wife that led me there.
01:10:48.520And I think that's the most important thing is, is, you know, to share that with folks so that people who are also interested in getting free of their own fears.
01:11:00.680And fear is the most central one of all the things that, that tend to, you know, confine us as humans.
01:11:15.500I mean, you, you don't get those credentials without doing that, but you're open about the fact that you were wrestling and you were struggling.
01:11:28.480And I love the part about how, when you fell in love, this actually happened for my husband and me in a way too, where we were dating long distance when we first got together.
01:11:38.100And so you're kind of forced to fall in love with the person's mind or not at all, right?
01:11:43.420It's not like a physical thing all the time.
01:11:45.760And for you, in your case, that was actually very important.
01:11:57.460And, you know, the thing about different types of traumatic experiences, as you know, is that they affect everyone differently, you know?
01:12:03.440So you don't know how, how they'll affect anyone.
01:12:08.020And for me, when, when that babysitter broke my boundaries, you know, it, it affected me in a way that not only sort of numbed me to, to just kind of emotions and experiences,
01:12:25.140but it also, it also, it kind of introduced all the sexual trauma where I basically couldn't handle, and when I say handle, I mean, actually take in.
01:12:40.960And so I couldn't handle the, you know, sort of the, the energy of, of anything sexual.
01:12:55.460You know, I wasn't really sexually connected.
01:12:57.580Even if I were sexually active, there wasn't any, there wasn't any, there was no, um, there was really no humanity in it, no me in it, because most of me was, um, all of me, in fact, was sort of shelled off.
01:13:12.800So, you know, you fall in love and, um, and, and fortunately, and, and, you know, having the long distance relationship, having the phone conversations with my wife and falling in love unknowingly over the phone, um, move that out of, of the equation.
01:13:30.540And so I, I couldn't introduce that whole, you know, screwed up part of myself into the relationship.
01:13:38.040And, um, and, you know, that let her kind of come in through the back door of my heart.
01:13:56.740And ultimately she introduced you to somebody who would help you really get things under control and change your life.
01:14:05.700Tell us who that was and sort of the new techniques that came into your life, um, as a result of, well, Christopher Marr and, and sort of what you learned at that point forward.
01:14:28.040I could apologize from now until the day I leave is her.
01:14:30.940But, you know, fortunately she knew that, you know, underneath all that, um, all that crap, there was a, you know, a really good man.
01:14:41.620And, um, and so, you know, the, the, the, she finally, we tried lots of things and everything helped a little bit, but, you know, I was, I was really effed up.
01:14:54.200Um, and finally she got me to Christopher Mir and Christopher is a, he's a Navy SEAL, he's an ex Navy SEAL and has had his own journey.
01:15:04.700And, um, and basically out of this journey, he, um, he has developed, you know, uh, like a number of like techniques that he uses to help individuals get free of their, their traumas.
01:15:22.720And it's the stuff that every single person on this earth accumulates as they, um, as they live on this earth.
01:15:30.080And, um, you know, and it, it's a combination.
01:15:32.920And I really don't understand it, but I'll share it.
01:15:35.600I'm sharing, not as someone who understands it, but rather someone who went through it and, and, and emerged from it.
01:15:40.780Um, as, as a combination of like, it's a lot of stuff that's based on like Chinese, um, medicine and Meridian theory and like Chi and the flow of Chi.
01:15:53.000Um, and it involves like different techniques, like, um, one of them's this thing called mouching that, um, where basically, um, stress and trauma are released through the thighs.
01:16:08.500And it's because I think it's because there's a Meridian that, um, it's like one of the more, one of the more, uh, um, sort of fuller Meridians or one of the more powerful ones in terms of its access to, you know,
01:16:26.240And, you know, that's one of the techniques he uses.
01:16:29.540He uses another technique called body of light that, I mean, it's, it's, uh, it, it, as a, as someone who went to medical school, it's nothing that you read in books, but I can tell you that it works in terms of like releasing trauma.
01:16:44.360And then he's developed a number of, um, of X there.
01:16:48.600He, he, he, he calls them bestercises.
01:16:50.720Um, but they're essentially like exercises, stretches that, um, that are, that help, um, um, process like the daily stress that we build up.
01:17:04.300And, you know, I, I do those every day.
01:17:07.800Um, and, um, and, you know, I'll tell you that it's the closest thing to a miracle that I've ever experienced.
01:17:17.780I worked with him for five days and that's like sort of the standard thing that he does.
01:17:23.960He's helped thousands of people actually.
01:17:26.760And, um, you know, I, I, I was, I mean, I honestly, I was complaining before the, before we started it because my wife, you know, she came home one day and she was like, my poor wife.
01:17:39.280I mean, I, I really, I honest to God, now that I look at myself and what I was doing and all part of my language about the shit that was coming out and I was just throwing it all on her, which is how many people live their lives.
01:17:49.280Their shit comes up and they just like spew it out into the field.
01:17:52.940And anyway, one day she came home and it was like October, 2019.
01:17:56.900And she was like, honey, I think I found someone for you.
01:17:59.540I think I found the right person for you.
01:18:01.180You know, this guy, he, he helps people who've had traumas.
01:18:04.240And I was like, I was like, all right, she don't mean the price.
01:18:09.500And I looked for, I found, try to find every way to like, get out of it to, you know, and I talked to Christopher and I, before we met and I was, I was trying every single way of it.
01:18:22.340But I will tell you after just the first day, um, cause I woke up and something had already changed.
01:18:29.040It was my ability to emotionally connect with other people.
01:18:31.420And after the first day, like it was already worth it.
01:18:37.500And I told him and he laughed about it when I came in for the second day, but I would tell you that like, I would give every penny, every penny with not a drop of hesitation to, in exchange for what I've gotten from working with him.
01:19:06.100I'll squeeze in a quick break and we'll come back, uh, with that, with that nugget.
01:19:09.740Before we get onto COVID policy and how all these life lessons helped you there and the sort of the, your takeaways on it, what do I need to do to my thighs to be a better manager of my stress?
01:19:26.440Well, I, you know, I will do the best I can considering I'm just, I'm a, I'm a beneficiary, but I'm not a practitioner.
01:19:34.180But, um, you know, basically, um, my understanding is that, you know, again, one of the most powerful meridians, apparently it runs through your, you know, through your thighs and your legs.
01:19:46.980And it, um, it has access, it's sort of like when this, this meridian has access to, um, aspects of your, of your, of your physical being, your mental being, your emotional being, your spiritual being more so than, um, any other meridian.
01:20:05.340So, so I think Christopher often will work with people on this meridian early on in the work, just, I think, because the benefit is, is, um, is, is, is high for the input.
01:20:20.320And so I'm, I, you lay down, I'm laying down on the ground.
01:20:24.460So I'm, you know, I don't know, you know, I can't, I don't have eyes behind my head, but I'm, you lay down, he has you laying down on the ground.
01:20:30.460And basically, I don't know exactly how he does it, but he, he basically, I think it translates into horse stomping.
01:20:38.520And he kind of walks up and down your thighs, the back of your thighs and your, um, legs.
01:20:45.120At least then that's what it feels like.
01:21:08.280But, um, basically what the experience feels like is, um, I'll share, I'll share it all with you.
01:21:14.920So he, so it, um, it feels like, like initially, you know, on a scale of one to 10, I mean, some places that I think he knows sort of exactly where to, to put pressure.
01:21:27.960I mean, it feels like a, like a nine or a 10 out of 10.
01:21:34.640And, um, I mean, it, it effing hurts and, um, eventually it'll, it'll come down a little bit, a little bit.
01:21:46.080Um, and eventually it'll feel like, at least for me, it basically felt like a five or, you know, maybe even a four where it was like, it wasn't even hurting really, you know?
01:21:59.100And, um, and, and this is a very good thing because it means that you're having more flow sort of more cheese flowing through that meridian.
01:22:08.880And, um, and so there's, there's that.
01:22:11.880Um, and so I'll share a little bit more, I don't write about this in the book, but I'll share a little bit more.
01:22:18.100Um, so we did it and he does a number of different things, but that particular thing, we probably did two or three separate times and maybe the last time or the penultimate time we did it at the end of it, by this time, it felt pleasurable.
01:22:39.180Like it, it, instead of pain, it felt good.
01:22:42.960And, um, as crazy as it sounds, Megan, I actually felt like a tiger.
01:22:49.800I, and I know it sounds nuts, but, um, I felt like an, like an animal, like I was connected with, uh, with an animal and, um, and Christopher, I told him, cause that's, that's what it felt like.
01:23:02.420And, um, he, he shared with me that it was my spirit animal.
01:23:06.360And, um, and, um, and one of the times when he finished it, when he finished doing it, I felt, um, I felt, uh, I felt frozen.
01:23:26.060I felt incredibly cold just in my chest.
01:23:29.920And, um, I, I was, I was shivering and Christopher laid me down, you know, and tell me to lay down on the couch.
01:23:40.240And, and, and so I was shivering, I was freezing, um, this is a, you know, you know, we're indoors and freezing and, and shaking and shivering and just here from, you know, kind of just to my chest.
01:23:56.340And Christopher explained to me that, um, that that was the, the fright from my experience when I was, uh, you know, when I was three or four years old, melting away.
01:24:09.000And, um, and, you know, and I, and I laid on that couch and shiver for maybe, you know, 40 minutes or so, um, that I was like freezing and, and then it went away.
01:24:27.560Um, so, you know, it's like, you know, like I said, there's, I never have had anything like it before, but be certain, but I know from my own experience that there is far more to our bodies and our beings, um, than, you know, than we, you know, sort of learn in medical school.
01:25:03.140So Christopher, he, you kind of, he wrote a book about his own experiences, Christopher Mayer, and he calls it free for life.
01:25:09.180And that's actually what his goal, that's like, that's what he's, um, that's what his, uh, purpose is when he works with people to help them get free for life.
01:25:22.900Um, does it mean that everything is perfect?
01:25:26.660No, you know, it's, it's, it's not, it's not really so much, so much that, and I still work with stuff.
01:25:33.360You know, there's different, not new things, right?
01:25:35.280Not the same things I like to have challenges now that, um, that are different obviously than, than what I had, you know, before I worked with them, you know, but they're, you know, but it's, um, but they're also more evolved challenges and they're more honest challenges and they're less messy because there's less of my own past trauma in the room with me.
01:25:59.620There's less, you know, caring that I'm carrying around.
01:26:03.020There's less of my own, you know, honestly bullshit, right?
01:26:06.800Like that's how most of, you know, many of us, like all of us really function, caring difference, different amounts of this in terms of like what we believe about ourselves and the world and like what we should, you know, what we're entitled to and, and how things should be and all that stuff.
01:26:25.000So, you know, so I still have challenges, but they're, they're nothing like the challenges I had before and, you know, and that's for, and for me and, you know, for almost, I think everyone who works with him, who wants to actually get better, it's, it's totally, it's free.
01:26:41.580So, you know, so for me, like one of the things that, that was a constant part of my life was fear.
01:26:52.620And, you know, you look at me on the outside, you wouldn't know, you know, but that's because I had really good self-control in terms of, you know, blocking.
01:27:03.280And frankly, part of the way that happens is I had a lot of disconnection.
01:27:07.060You know, I wasn't very well, I wasn't connected to my, you know, to my insides.
01:27:12.120So it was easier to sort of block off, you know, whatever it was that, you know, keep it from showing externally, right?
01:27:19.840Because I was less connected and, and, you know, the fear that I was just a constant permeating part of my life was gone.
01:27:38.440And, you know, it was, it was like just kind of having almost like a, like a clean plate or something.
01:27:45.420Yeah, I feel like listening to you, this allowed you to start making decisions intellectually and not necessarily emotionally, you know, like driven by demons, by past trauma.
01:27:56.680If, if any of that can get removed in any large portion, not entirely, of course, we are human.
01:28:04.720So I, the name of the book means more to me now, Transcend Fear, Transcend Fear.
01:28:11.120By the way, I just, I do want people to know it's, it's not out yet.
01:28:14.040It's available everywhere on August 23rd, but you can pre-order it right now on Amazon, which helps out the good doctor.
01:28:19.960The pre-orders help it come out ideally at number one, which the New York Times will try to stop it from being.
01:28:25.580But together we could help overcome that if we pre-order it in great enough numbers, transcend fear, transcend the New York Times blocking system on conservatives, and transcend all of that nonsense.