The Megyn Kelly Show - What's Behind the Elon vs. Trump Drama, and Insane Leftist Arguments, with Ben Shapiro, Anna Khachiyan, and Dasha Nekrasova

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00:00:31.240 Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at New East.

00:00:42.800 Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show.

00:00:46.120 It's the story that everyone's talking about. I mean everyone.

00:00:49.440 Elon Musk versus Donald Trump.

00:00:51.780 Let me give you the background on it and then I'll give you my take on it.

00:00:54.260 This started when we were on the air yesterday, but it escalated quickly after we said goodbye.

00:01:00.040 President Trump writing on True Social that he asked Elon to leave the administration.

00:01:04.380 That's news.

00:01:05.740 His special governmental employee status had expired, but it can be renewed.

00:01:10.220 It goes for 130 days. It could be renewed, renewed, renewed.

00:01:12.620 That's what they did with Anita Dunn.

00:01:14.420 In any event, he's now saying he asked Elon to leave because he said he was, quote, wearing thin.

00:01:19.320 And Peter Doocy at Fox News reporting this morning that same news and saying it had been going on for about a month,

00:01:25.140 about a month prior to all this, that he'd been, quote, wearing thin.

00:01:28.240 And that Musk went, quote, crazy, said Trump, when Trump took away the electric vehicle mandate.

00:01:34.640 Trump then threatening to cancel government contracts that Musk has, his companies have, with the government.

00:01:41.420 Musk responding by claiming Trump is in the Epstein files.

00:01:46.060 Have a nice day, DJT, he wrote.

00:01:49.460 The world's richest man, that would be Elon.

00:01:52.660 Next, claiming that he was decommissioning SpaceX Dragon spacecraft.

00:01:58.240 That was the one that just rescued those astronauts off of the International Space Station.

00:02:02.580 And, by the way, right now, it's our only means of getting crew and cargo up to the ISS.

00:02:09.700 And we have three astronauts up there right now, so it's kind of like an oh-shit moment for them.

00:02:13.700 Like, uh-oh, my ride just got canceled.

00:02:16.860 But then some obscure Twitter account said, why don't you, quote, cool down and don't do this?

00:02:23.180 And Elon said, oh, okay, we won't decommission the Dragon.

00:02:27.660 Now, I mean, obviously, Elon was just looking for something that this guy did not convince him.

00:02:33.240 He shot off a threat in his anger and regretted it moments thereafter.

00:02:38.640 There's no way Elon's leaving the three American astronauts stranded up there at the ISS over a dispute with Donald Trump.

00:02:45.580 All of this happening after months of the pair praising each other over and over and over and over and over.

00:02:51.100 And his rocket company is the only reason we can now send American astronauts into space.

00:02:58.260 Come here.

00:02:59.900 Take over, Elon.

00:03:01.140 Yes, take over.

00:03:02.200 As you can see, I'm not just MAGA.

00:03:04.180 I'm dark MAGA.

00:03:05.120 Tell you, we have a new star.

00:03:07.380 A star is born.

00:03:08.520 Elon.

00:03:12.000 Elon, I love the double hat button.

00:03:14.460 He's the only one that can do that.

00:03:16.760 Get away with it.

00:03:17.820 Well, Mr. President, you know, they say I wear a lot of hats.

00:03:22.600 That's true.

00:03:24.160 Even my hat has a hat.

00:03:27.420 I mean, look, in terms of imagination, I think I have a great imagination.

00:03:32.760 Who else but this guy would design this?

00:03:34.960 You've got to give him credit.

00:03:36.000 You've become one of your best friends.

00:03:37.320 He's working for free for you.

00:03:38.840 Well, I love the president.

00:03:39.620 I just want to be clear about that.

00:03:41.540 You don't care about that?

00:03:42.680 No, I love the president.

00:03:43.660 You love the president.

00:03:44.500 I think I think President Trump is a good man and he's, you know, that's the way he

00:03:50.740 said that, you know, there's something nice about it.

00:03:52.700 It really is.

00:03:53.400 You know, you can almost if you listen carefully here, Barbra Streisand's the way we were running

00:03:59.700 underneath that montage of sound.

00:04:04.660 Memories amid rumors that Musk and Trump would talk over the phone today and put this whole

00:04:10.300 thing to bed.

00:04:11.060 Trump telling multiple reporters he has no interest in speaking with Musk, shrugging

00:04:17.660 off the feud and saying he is totally focused on policy.

00:04:22.600 Let me tell you what I think is happening here.

00:04:24.700 You have two giant egos.

00:04:27.420 It's like Godzilla versus King Kong.

00:04:30.120 There's a high entertainment value in watching it happen.

00:04:33.400 I know some people are upset by it.

00:04:34.640 I'm not upset by it actually at all.

00:04:36.720 I don't think it hurts anything or anybody on the right.

00:04:40.880 I really don't.

00:04:41.720 I think it's just two massive egos doing battle, like brawling.

00:04:47.220 And Trump let Elon go out there and pound the big, beautiful bill for a while.

00:04:52.440 And then the criticism got a little sharper and a little sharper.

00:04:56.280 And Trump, you know, of course, he's going to eventually have enough of that.

00:04:59.440 So he did.

00:05:00.260 He brushed back and said, you're just mad about the EV subsidies being taken out.

00:05:03.840 And then Elon went like DEFCON won on him and said that he was in the Epstein files,

00:05:09.740 which literally nobody believes, because how on earth would there be a Democrat White House

00:05:15.940 that didn't reveal that Trump was?

00:05:19.600 I mean, what does it even mean in the Epstein files in some nefarious way?

00:05:22.640 I mean, I'm sure he means more than just in Jeffrey Epstein's black book, because we knew

00:05:27.100 that Trump and Epstein knew himself, knew each other.

00:05:29.000 That's not news.

00:05:29.680 So to suggest he's in the files means like what he's a he's a pedophile.

00:05:33.900 He's a pervert.

00:05:34.660 He he he's like a Prince Andrew who had sex with, you know, a 17 year old.

00:05:40.160 Bullshit.

00:05:40.700 There's no way that Biden's administration would have kept that a secret.

00:05:44.760 He was running against Trump.

00:05:46.500 He was running against Trump.

00:05:48.040 That's so that's not true.

00:05:49.000 And, you know, then Trump said, all right, you know, I'm going to cancel your government

00:05:55.060 contracts back and forth.

00:05:57.140 And Elon doesn't really want his SpaceX program and its help to NASA to be canceled.

00:06:02.040 So he saw the.

00:06:03.080 So there's I don't know.

00:06:04.760 It was kind of bound to happen.

00:06:06.920 We all knew it was going to happen.

00:06:08.660 No one's really the worse off.

00:06:10.320 Trump's certainly not the worse off.

00:06:11.640 There was a poll out just this morning, interact, interactive polling showing everybody sided

00:06:17.040 with Trump.

00:06:17.560 All the Republicans have sided with Trump, not with Elon.

00:06:20.660 Trump had like 72 percent of Republicans saying they're with him.

00:06:24.140 Only six percent said they're with Elon.

00:06:26.520 Democrats hate them both.

00:06:28.680 So where has this gotten us?

00:06:31.580 Trump's not hurt.

00:06:32.480 The big, beautiful bill will pass.

00:06:34.840 Elon's already unpopular, maybe slightly more unpopular with some today.

00:06:39.040 Um, no government contracts are canceled.

00:06:42.520 Trump's not in the Epstein book in any meaningful way.

00:06:45.680 And we just watched the King Kong guerrilla fight, which was, you know, pretty entertaining.

00:06:50.920 That's my take.

00:06:52.020 Ben Shapiro's here with his.

00:06:53.200 He's the Daily Wire co-founder and host of The Ben Shapiro Show and author of the forthcoming book,

00:06:59.140 Lions and Scavengers, The True Story of America.

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00:08:13.860 Ben, welcome back.

00:08:15.080 All right.

00:08:15.380 So dying to hear your thoughts on it.

00:08:17.460 Well, I mean, I'm pretty much with you.

00:08:18.980 Wildly entertaining, right?

00:08:20.300 It's King Kong versus Godzilla and watching the two of them smack each other is definitely

00:08:25.120 high on the entertainment scale.

00:08:26.780 Do I think it has any real lasting impact on the Republican Party?

00:08:30.000 Not really.

00:08:30.660 I think that there was always a sort of awkward alliance between the tech bro right and the

00:08:35.080 blue collar populist right.

00:08:37.060 And I think that this has exposed some of those fissures for sure, because you can see people

00:08:40.780 who are sort of stuck in the middle and feel awkwardly stuck in the middle of that.

00:08:45.000 Do they side with Elon or do they side with Trump?

00:08:47.380 Who's this influencer going to side with?

00:08:49.080 And so there's a lot of sort of entertainment weekly drama happening in the political sphere,

00:08:53.060 and that's entertaining.

00:08:53.940 But as far as sort of the broader coalitional point, is the big, beautiful bill going to

00:08:58.520 pass?

00:08:58.860 The answer is yes.

00:09:00.220 Is SpaceX going to stop providing services to the United States government?

00:09:03.420 The answer is no.

00:09:04.380 There is no substitute for SpaceX or the United States government.

00:09:07.220 Blue Origin isn't ready.

00:09:08.180 There's no real alternative.

00:09:09.500 So with all of that said, how does this shake out?

00:09:12.140 It might shake out in terms of kind of the personalities at play, that if Elon is outside the administration

00:09:17.640 sounding off on particular policy matters, President Trump goes by his gut and he also

00:09:21.880 tends to be quite reactive.

00:09:23.060 So if Elon, for example, comes out in favor of one particular policy, you could see the

00:09:26.940 president sort of come out in reverse of that policy just to spite Elon.

00:09:31.440 You could see more splits inside the Republican Party in congressional elections.

00:09:35.500 Maybe Elon doesn't want to be involved in congressional elections in 2026.

00:09:39.160 And so what you see is less money in those congressional elections from the Elon part of the of the

00:09:45.320 aisle.

00:09:45.700 And again, you will see some strains emerge when it comes to, I think, particular political

00:09:49.720 figures.

00:09:50.360 One that comes to mind here the most is the vice president, who, of course, has one foot

00:09:53.060 in Silicon Valley and one foot in blue collar Appalachia and sort of is getting torn down

00:09:57.540 the middle here a little bit just in terms of who is who is he loyal to, which which side

00:10:02.280 does he like?

00:10:02.800 But in the end, does it really make any large scale difference for the American voter?

00:10:06.340 Not not really.

00:10:07.120 I think it's just more dramatic and entertainment than anything else.

00:10:10.680 I think J.D.

00:10:12.320 Vance is not torn.

00:10:13.480 I mean, he only spent a couple of years with Peter Thiel out there and did not have a positive

00:10:17.100 experience.

00:10:18.020 Nothing against Peter, but just he hated San Francisco.

00:10:20.580 He hated being in tech.

00:10:22.060 And his loyalties are obviously to Trump, as are the Republican parties.

00:10:26.060 I mean, what Elon, I think, is starting to realize is while he can his money can make

00:10:31.900 a difference, it definitely can make a couple points of a difference in a certain political

00:10:36.460 race here or there, not across the board.

00:10:38.200 We saw it not work in Wisconsin on that Supreme Court, excuse me, election.

00:10:43.440 The real person with influence is Donald Trump and the person with the party loyalty is Donald

00:10:48.420 Trump.

00:10:49.280 Donald Trump took a bullet for the country and the party and everybody watched that heroic

00:10:54.060 moment.

00:10:54.400 He's been through hell and back with these, you know, litigations against him and criminal

00:10:59.140 trials against him.

00:11:00.280 He's earned the love and loyalty of the Republican Party in particular in a way I don't know that

00:11:07.000 anybody ever will again.

00:11:08.140 I really don't.

00:11:08.660 I just feel like he's been through so much.

00:11:11.560 It's just there's no if if it's between so and so and Donald Trump, Donald Trump is going

00:11:16.960 to win, even if they're Elon Musk.

00:11:19.240 The thing about Elon is I think I speak for many when I say everybody's grateful to him.

00:11:22.960 The biggest thing he did to influence the election was buy X and restore free speech in America.

00:11:28.340 But you cannot take on Trump politically with the right.

00:11:33.420 You'll lose.

00:11:34.940 Well, I mean, I think that's true.

00:11:36.260 I do think that there's one other thing that Elon did that's sort of fascinating, and that

00:11:39.860 is he did, in fact, open Silicon Valley to the idea of publicly expressing support for

00:11:44.280 Trump.

00:11:44.780 And that was not a minor thing in terms of sort of the overall cultural acceptance of President

00:11:50.060 Trump.

00:11:50.380 So so what Elon did by being a major tech figure and saying, I'm not only supporting President

00:11:55.720 Trump, I'm going to go campaign for President Trump.

00:11:57.440 And then suddenly you have Zuckerberg saying, you know, that that's a brave guy, President

00:12:00.740 Trump, after after the butler attempted assassination.

00:12:03.340 And suddenly you have Senator Pinchai over at the inauguration.

00:12:07.000 The sort of opening up of the tech universe to the Trump universe has has had some pretty

00:12:13.120 impressive effects inside the Republican Party.

00:12:15.160 But it also, as I say, opened up a bunch of fissures over everything from sort of free

00:12:18.740 trade and tariffs where tech pros are not in favor of tariffs.

00:12:22.140 They're much more in favor of free trade.

00:12:23.560 President Trump obviously is much more in favor of tariffs.

00:12:25.700 And that tension has been playing itself out inside the administration to issues regarding

00:12:30.200 crypto, technological development, AI.

00:12:33.180 You know, all of that sort of stuff is a sort of complicated mix for sure.

00:12:37.660 And Elon brought something to the table beyond his money, I think.

00:12:40.040 And that was, again, this image of this this guy who was for a long time the coolest person

00:12:45.480 in America.

00:12:45.980 I mean, the SpaceX guy, Tesla guy, innovator, bringing that to the table of a Republican

00:12:51.420 Party that might have been perceived three or four years ago as a slightly older, more

00:12:55.820 rural party.

00:12:56.800 And so I do think that that he brought that to the table.

00:12:58.980 And if that starts to fray, you could see a change in the coalition.

00:13:01.820 Let's put it that way.

00:13:02.520 For President Trump, I don't think it makes much of a difference for the future of the

00:13:04.920 Republican Party.

00:13:05.560 I think this was always going to happen because when you have a coalition that is formed against

00:13:10.720 the dominant party, which is what happened in 2024, the Democrats were dominant.

00:13:14.880 Republicans were not dominant.

00:13:16.120 Republicans and sort of allied parties put together a workable coalition against the

00:13:21.360 Democrats.

00:13:21.940 But then you get into power and you have to govern.

00:13:23.780 And this happens with every single administration is that you see battles that start to emerge

00:13:27.960 between the various factions of the administration.

00:13:30.740 And President Trump is unifying in a way no other Republican figure of my lifetime has been.

00:13:35.200 He can sort of float above a lot of those aspects.

00:13:37.900 And because he's non-ideological, he can pragmatically pick and choose kind of from the tree of policy

00:13:42.520 in a unique way.

00:13:44.720 But, you know, after President Trump is president, I think you will see a lot of these battles

00:13:49.560 start to resurface.

00:13:50.560 I think they're resurfacing now, even while President Trump is president.

00:13:53.480 And that is fascinating.

00:13:54.240 So I just want to pick up on what you said about Elon making the Republican Party a bit

00:14:01.300 cooler.

00:14:02.040 It had been more rural and maybe not as like hip.

00:14:06.440 I don't agree with that.

00:14:08.060 I love Elon.

00:14:08.820 And I really do believe more than any other American he's saved free speech in this country.

00:14:13.240 I think on the trans issue, we'd be light years behind where we are right now if it hadn't

00:14:17.220 been for him buying X and being really bold about that whole thing.

00:14:20.360 But, I mean, having obviously covered Trump for a long time, very closely, day to day,

00:14:25.840 I think Donald Trump is the one who made the Republican Party cool again.

00:14:29.120 Trump is the one who, you know, just with his fuck you attitude and his taking on wokeness,

00:14:35.180 he brought Elon over.

00:14:36.980 You know, Elon, he wasn't responsible for building Trump's constituency.

00:14:40.480 It was totally Trump.

00:14:41.980 Elon came, I mean, with all due respect to Elon, he was quite late to the party.

00:14:45.620 We were all there celebrating Trump and he had brought in tons of young people and changed

00:14:51.320 the coalition with black and brown and other Americans.

00:14:54.840 And then Elon seemed to really get on board and respected what happened with Butler and

00:14:58.720 all that.

00:14:59.000 And so, like, I just feel like he was one of the late arrivals.

00:15:02.500 He was more in the Joe Rogan, Theo Von camp, who very late in the game said, I love this guy.

00:15:07.600 But a lot of us were there without those guys for a very long time on President Trump's

00:15:13.180 side and singing his praises.

00:15:14.320 I mean, again, I agree with that.

00:15:16.600 And of course, as soon as President Trump emerged from the first primary in Iowa, I think, you

00:15:20.900 know, some of us were campaigning with him, some of us were raising money for him and

00:15:24.180 all of the rest.

00:15:25.300 But I will say that the one area where I do think something happened is there was a permission

00:15:29.780 structure that did not exist before Elon and some of the tech bros jumped in that said

00:15:34.720 that it was OK to be a high income earner in a blue area and say out loud that you supported

00:15:39.620 President Trump.

00:15:40.580 Three years ago, if you lived in San Francisco and you supported President Trump, you would probably

00:15:44.200 lose your job.

00:15:45.140 And that is no longer the case.

00:15:46.740 Yes.

00:15:47.200 And that is no longer the case in a lot of these blue areas.

00:15:49.600 It made it acceptable.

00:15:50.500 Something changed.

00:15:51.620 And it wasn't one thing.

00:15:52.780 I think it was many things.

00:15:53.620 I think one of the things was Joe Biden's absolutely abysmal performance as president, the fact

00:15:57.500 that he was dead.

00:15:58.380 I think part of it is that President Trump ran an actually shockingly disciplined campaign.

00:16:03.260 And people forget about how disciplined the campaign actually was for the vast majority

00:16:06.320 of the campaign.

00:16:06.940 And obviously, the assassination attempt changed a lot of things about the campaign.

00:16:11.400 There were so many topsy-turvy events.

00:16:13.220 But one of the things that I do think Elon should be given credit for is, again, the creation

00:16:17.920 of a permission structure in people who would be considered the tech community or the white

00:16:24.220 collar community to say, yeah, you know what?

00:16:26.460 I like Trump and I'm going to put on a MAGA hat, for example, which is something that a lot

00:16:30.020 of those people wouldn't have done.

00:16:30.780 They might have behind closed doors been like, yeah, you know, I like Trump and I'm voting for

00:16:33.300 him.

00:16:33.380 I mean, I know a lot of those people.

00:16:34.420 I know, Megan, you know, a lot of those people, too.

00:16:36.360 But it was really only in the late stages of this election cycle where you started to

00:16:40.020 hear people who were quietly saying that they might support Trump.

00:16:42.600 All right, I get it.

00:16:43.120 I'm going to back up, though.

00:16:43.900 I'm still not agreeing.

00:16:45.580 I'm still not agreeing.

00:16:46.660 I don't dismiss Elon's role in Trump's victory.

00:16:50.460 I do think he played a role.

00:16:52.980 And it's been great to have him on the side of Team Sanity and paving the way for Team Sanity.

00:16:58.540 I've told the story before, but I had a discussion with a very, very, like the top

00:17:02.400 guy in tech who was like, oh, you know, we're starting to come around now on our censorship

00:17:07.320 policies when it comes to the gender debate and the race discussions.

00:17:11.520 And I was like, oh, you're starting to come around on it now?

00:17:14.900 Like, oh, now you're going to stop the censorship?

00:17:16.960 And he was like, well, you know, attitudes have changed on it.

00:17:19.880 So like, I'm like, how do you think that happened?

00:17:22.860 How do you think the attitudes changed?

00:17:24.560 Because Elon Musk had balls and most of the rest of you did not.

00:17:29.600 He had balls to let those discussions play out.

00:17:33.740 And when they were allowed to play out without forcing our side to have an arm tied behind

00:17:38.440 its back, we won.

00:17:40.520 So I have that's the role that I see Elon playing.

00:17:43.420 That's been so critical in all and all this.

00:17:45.060 But Trump, those guys out in Silicon Valley, they bent the knee after Butler.

00:17:51.140 Everybody saw a superhero emerge on the stage that day and said, holy shit, I need to touch

00:17:58.900 his cape.

00:17:59.900 That's what happened with Mark Zuckerberg.

00:18:01.820 He didn't do it because of Elon.

00:18:02.980 He didn't even like Elon.

00:18:04.520 David Sachs was coming on this program regularly for the two years leading up to the election

00:18:08.240 and was very in on DeSantis.

00:18:10.340 But eventually DeSantis lost and he went with Trump, I think, over Ukraine, where he's much

00:18:16.420 more in sort of the J.D. Vance field on Ukraine.

00:18:19.340 But it wasn't Elon that got David over.

00:18:21.860 If anything, it was maybe David who influenced Elon.

00:18:24.200 That's been my take in watching it unfold.

00:18:26.200 So I just think Elon may have overestimated his own role in the Trump rise and victory

00:18:33.520 and Trump of all people was not going to cede one inch on the big victory and who was

00:18:39.680 responsible for it.

00:18:41.000 I mean, I don't disagree with actually a lot of that.

00:18:43.300 And I think the timeline lines up with what you're talking about.

00:18:45.140 The Butler assassination attempt changed an enormous amount and it opened up a door for

00:18:49.240 people like Elon to do that thing.

00:18:51.120 The place where I'm actually most grateful to Elon, aside from obviously opening up X,

00:18:54.920 is that I do think that what he actually tried to do with Doge was quite heroic to actually

00:18:58.760 give up your life running some of the biggest companies on planet Earth and to take billions

00:19:03.960 of dollars in hit in terms of market cap in order to come in and try to cut the government.

00:19:08.260 Now, again, I think there is something naive and ideological about it that I find actually

00:19:12.920 kind of charming because government just doesn't change that quickly.

00:19:16.100 You can't shift whatever the United States government is, a giant cruiser on a dime the

00:19:21.100 way that Elon was attempting to do.

00:19:23.020 And I think that a lot of the frustrations that he's expressing are frustrations that some

00:19:26.020 of us have been having with the size and scope of the federal government for legitimately

00:19:29.440 decades.

00:19:30.940 But yeah, again, I think that when I've been breaking it down, I've been trying to break

00:19:34.200 it down politically, business wise, and then in terms of personality, obviously, politically,

00:19:38.980 I think you have here a battle between somebody who is extremely ideological and almost naive

00:19:45.220 in his ideological commitment to cutting government versus the pragmatism of President Trump.

00:19:49.720 And obviously, ideologically, I agree with Elon.

00:19:52.360 But when it comes to what actually can get passed and what can be done, President Trump is just

00:19:55.860 correct about that with the big, beautiful bill.

00:19:57.880 Well, when it comes to-

00:19:58.580 Yes, Trump has never been, he has never been the opposite of a spender.

00:20:02.560 He's a spender.

00:20:03.480 He was a spender in his first term, and he's still a spender.

00:20:05.720 Literally, he literally, I mean, this is the thing that is driving me crazy about some of

00:20:08.480 the people who are real fiscal hawks.

00:20:10.180 I'm a fiscal hawk, but President Trump won in 2016, in part because in the primaries,

00:20:14.280 he literally said he would not touch the entitlement programs.

00:20:16.860 So people who are now frustrated he won't touch the entitlement programs, he rejected the Tea

00:20:20.620 Party message in 2016 and in 2020 and in 2024.

00:20:23.420 You get a car, and you get a car, and you get a car philosophy of government.

00:20:27.640 That's just true.

00:20:28.740 That's why a lot of folks in the more traditional lane of conservatism didn't want Trump as the

00:20:33.920 nominee.

00:20:34.360 They got him anyway, and they decided it was worth it over Kamala Harris, obviously.

00:20:38.200 But yeah, he's not going to be the person to keep the purse super tight like Elon and some

00:20:42.800 others would like.

00:20:43.760 Right, exactly.

00:20:44.420 So that battle is playing itself.

00:20:45.700 And that's a normal battle.

00:20:46.780 That's the same battle as the battle between Rand Paul, for example, and the president over

00:20:50.280 the big, beautiful bill.

00:20:51.020 Where it comes to the personality stuff, this is the sort of stuff where you have two gigantic

00:20:55.520 personalities.

00:20:56.460 I mean, you know both of them.

00:20:57.220 I know both of them.

00:20:58.540 Neither of these guys is a small ego.

00:21:01.060 Neither of them takes insults particularly easily.

00:21:03.860 They don't really like it very much.

00:21:05.300 The president is a pretty forgiving guy.

00:21:07.860 I mean, there are a lot of people around him who have really gone after him over the

00:21:11.020 course of his career, and he's surrounded by them.

00:21:13.160 I mean, J.D. Vance called him Hitler in 2016.

00:21:14.860 Now he's the vice president.

00:21:15.680 Marco Rubio ran against him in 2016.

00:21:17.620 Now he's the secretary of state.

00:21:19.420 You and the president have had some run-ins.

00:21:20.880 I've had some...

00:21:21.420 And the president is okay with all of that.

00:21:23.820 But with that said, in the moment, there is never going to be an insult that passes that

00:21:28.200 he does not slap back at.

00:21:29.280 That's just not how he operates.

00:21:30.700 And Elon is very much the same way.

00:21:32.960 And so the two of them going at each other this way, again, I think it would have been

00:21:36.740 shocking if that had not happened at any point here.

00:21:38.940 The thing that set it off is really the question.

00:21:41.540 What actually set this thing off?

00:21:43.160 And I don't think it was the big, beautiful bill.

00:21:44.760 I think the thing that actually set this off...

00:21:46.020 I think it was the NASA guy?

00:21:48.600 I think it was the NASA guy.

00:21:49.540 I think the firing of Jared Isaacman at NASA was the thing that really set that off.

00:21:53.520 And that is a tactical mistake by the Office of Personnel Management.

00:21:56.060 It really is.

00:21:56.900 I mean, like the idea that...

00:21:58.500 They tried to needle.

00:21:59.500 Just set it up for the audience because we haven't talked about it yet.

00:22:02.320 Sure.

00:22:02.540 So Jared Isaacman is a billionaire space entrepreneur who was nominated for the NASA

00:22:08.880 administrator while Elon was in the administration.

00:22:11.860 And he's a very close friend of Elon.

00:22:13.600 And Elon, obviously, if I'm going to decide who I want picking the NASA administrator, Elon

00:22:17.740 actually is the person I'm going to ask.

00:22:19.440 He's legitimately...

00:22:19.800 Yeah, he's got some expertise there.

00:22:21.500 Yes.

00:22:21.760 I mean, he's the person who knows what he's doing.

00:22:23.440 And Isaacman, last week, right after Elon left the administration and had started fighting

00:22:29.000 with the president over the big, beautiful bill, right after that, Isaacman,

00:22:32.340 his nomination was withdrawn by President Trump, presumably at the behest of the Office of

00:22:36.860 Personnel Management, which I believe is run by Sergio Gore.

00:22:39.600 And the sort of idea that was put forth was that Isaacman had to be withdrawn because he

00:22:44.380 had Democratic donations.

00:22:45.440 Now, first of all, that would have been super easy for them to figure out when he was first

00:22:49.100 nominated, right?

00:22:49.720 He was nominated weeks in advance.

00:22:51.300 It wasn't as though this happened within 24 hours.

00:22:53.540 They knew that all along.

00:22:54.900 What that really is was a way of needling Elon and kind of slapping Elon like he's out the

00:23:00.220 door and he's mouthing off.

00:23:01.400 And so we're going to take your friend and we're going to throw him out of a third story

00:23:03.880 window.

00:23:05.280 And I think Elon reacted very strongly to that.

00:23:08.000 And that I get.

00:23:09.400 I don't agree with the way that Elon went about his sort of revenge tour against the

00:23:13.040 president.

00:23:13.480 And I disagree again with with like the Epstein thing, as you say, is pretty ridiculous.

00:23:17.780 I mean, first of all, the idea that Democrats had access to all the Epstein files would have

00:23:21.680 sat on information that Donald Trump was pedophilically assaulting children on Epstein

00:23:25.840 Island.

00:23:26.500 Can you imagine like Joe Biden is sitting there?

00:23:28.340 He's got that info and they don't release it yet.

00:23:30.160 No way in hell.

00:23:30.980 Somehow President Trump's IRS records are out there.

00:23:33.120 I mean, it's just it's an absurdity.

00:23:34.520 But with that said, you know, the sort of pettiness of that, of getting rid of Isaacman,

00:23:40.440 who appeared to be at least a competent NASA administrator, just to kind of just kind of

00:23:45.100 slap it at Elon.

00:23:46.720 This kind of stuff, it should be, you know, beneath the administration.

00:23:50.700 And then Elon's response should be beneath Elon.

00:23:52.940 But I guess that we no longer do beneath, right?

00:23:55.380 Yeah, we don't.

00:23:56.160 Exactly right.

00:23:57.100 Well, that's where it got.

00:23:58.020 I mean, let's let's be honest.

00:23:59.560 Who was leaving X yesterday afternoon for those three hours?

00:24:03.200 I mean, some of the tweets that people were sending out were hilarious.

00:24:06.180 It was it was entertaining.

00:24:07.680 And I have to admit, I didn't feel sad.

00:24:09.800 Like a lot of Republicans are like, I'm sad.

00:24:11.220 I'm like, I don't feel sad.

00:24:12.200 This is ridiculous.

00:24:12.940 They're having a fight like their big egos and big ids behind them.

00:24:17.180 And they'll probably make up.

00:24:19.380 And this is just kind of drama.

00:24:20.780 And sometimes we like drama.

00:24:21.900 I don't know.

00:24:22.580 I do get a little nervous when I'm like, when I'm seeing the left so happy, like those

00:24:27.480 the late night comedians last night, I'll give you a taste of how they sounded.

00:24:31.660 If they're happy, I'm not happy.

00:24:33.540 Like, I'm not happy about the fight, but I'm just saying I'm not like sad.

00:24:37.180 And all these people are like forlorn or it's like, all right, grow up.

00:24:40.240 They're having a dispute.

00:24:41.380 It was bound to happen.

00:24:42.660 They'll get past it.

00:24:43.500 As you point out, Trump is extremely forgiving.

00:24:45.300 And I'm sure Elon is too.

00:24:47.540 I mean, Trump's not whatever.

00:24:49.580 Laura Ingraham reported last night.

00:24:50.860 She's been told it's irreparable.

00:24:52.480 Nothing is irreparable with Donald Trump.

00:24:54.660 Nothing is irreparable.

00:24:56.120 But here's how the late night losers were making fun of it.

00:25:01.460 Elon gave us a fun one.

00:25:03.460 Time to drop the really big bomb.

00:25:05.580 Donald Trump is in the Epstein files.

00:25:08.060 That's the real reason they have not been made public.

00:25:11.360 Have a nice day, DJT.

00:25:13.460 Oh, oh, damn.

00:25:17.180 Is this Twitter war a cheesy gordita crunch wrap supreme?

00:25:25.520 Because it's dripping hot, messy filth, and I'm eating up every sloppy bite.

00:25:30.620 Oh, it's disgusting.

00:25:32.460 Oh, that's disgusting.

00:25:35.960 Time to drop the really big bomb.

00:25:39.260 Donald Trump is in the Epstein files.

00:25:43.420 That is the real reason they've not been made public.

00:25:46.560 Have a nice day, DJT.

00:25:48.440 I knew this day would come, and yet somehow it's even better than I imagined.

00:25:58.800 It's like coming down the stairs on Christmas morning and finding a second tree.

00:26:03.780 What does Elon know?

00:26:05.340 What evidence could there possibly be that Trump was in league with Jeffrey Epstein?

00:26:10.020 Other than this and this and, well, who could forget this video that Elon went ahead and posted today?

00:26:16.940 Okay, so they're going to shoot that into their veins, and that is one reason why we should be glad.

00:26:24.240 They seem to reach detente.

00:26:26.180 I mean, I guess the phone call's off, Ben, but Elon's tone on X last night was much more conciliatory in response to that one guy, like, okay, I won't cancel Dragon.

00:26:36.300 And then Bill Ackman yet again tried to be the mediator of it, and Elon responded favorably to, like, all right, yeah, we should stand down.

00:26:43.880 Then Trump was holding an event with the Fraternal Order of Police and was given the chance to comment on it and, you know, further bash Elon, basically, with the press who were asking him questions, and he declined to do it.

00:26:55.820 So it does seem like we've downshifted, which is also good.

00:27:00.720 Yeah, I mean, that's right.

00:27:02.060 And the big, beautiful bill is going to pass, and then all of this is going to be kind of in the rear view mirror.

00:27:05.860 Because that was Elon's main critique.

00:27:08.080 Again, I think that Elon is going to step away from a lot of the sort of overtly political stuff.

00:27:12.920 He's already said that he needs to, and I think that that's probably right.

00:27:16.160 So this is part of that broader shift away.

00:27:19.180 Of course, the left is happy about this.

00:27:20.680 What's amazing about this is that the left truly has been absolutely prone during the Trump administration.

00:27:25.860 I mean, I'm amazed at this.

00:27:27.280 Their absolute inability to consolidate around any single point of resistance means that, of course, they're going to enjoy this in the same way that you would enjoy it or I would enjoy it.

00:27:35.860 If, you know, President Biden and Alex Soros had suddenly started publicly feuding with one another, right?

00:27:41.540 It would be, like, wildly enjoyable, and it would be really fun.

00:27:44.180 And, of course, you'd be following it with bated breath.

00:27:46.320 And I'll admit that, you know, watching Elon, you know, kind of just randomly tweet crap about Trump and watching Trump slap back at him on his own social media service, like, it's good writing by God.

00:27:55.740 I mean, I will admit that the writing this season by God I thought was a little weak, and then God always sticks the landing, like, right at the very end.

00:28:02.360 The season finale brings all the threads together.

00:28:04.880 And I will admit that, like, people who are treating this as like, oh, my God, it's a tragedy and the rending of clothing and the weeping and the gnashing.

00:28:11.940 Like, come on, guys.

00:28:12.880 Like, really?

00:28:13.380 I think these are kids of divorce.

00:28:14.660 Yes, it's like it's a, you know, it's triggering for them because to most normal people, I think it's just been highly entertaining.

00:28:21.240 Like, unfortunate, yes, it's not like something you'd want if you could choose not to have it, at least as if you're a Trump supporter.

00:28:27.820 But here are some of the fun reactions yesterday.

00:28:30.560 Kanye, his tweet got a lot of attention.

00:28:33.080 Bros, please no, with a hug emoji.

00:28:36.480 We love you both so much.

00:28:38.320 Babylon Bee, always for the W.

00:28:41.080 Judge determines Trump will get the nation on weekdays.

00:28:43.780 Musk gets every other weekend and holidays.

00:28:47.300 Ex-user McGills, a federal judge just issued an injunction against the Elon-Trump breakup.

00:28:54.700 That's right on.

00:28:56.600 And then there's someone named David Burge.

00:28:59.320 He writes, get your entry in now for the new Trump-Elon nickname pool.

00:29:04.040 I've got a fiver on Muskrat.

00:29:06.340 That made me laugh out loud.

00:29:08.100 The red-headed libertarian.

00:29:10.060 Ex is giving me anxiety today.

00:29:11.580 I should probably go unwind with a serial killer documentary.

00:29:16.380 And then this one from Ginny Hogan.

00:29:18.780 Today is a huge win for every woman concerned she acted like a psycho during her last breakup.

00:29:23.500 And that leads me to this one, Ben, which we, I mean, like, everybody was thinking about this movie as we watched it happen.

00:29:33.540 I'll give you the clip from Mean Girls.

00:29:35.580 I don't know if they've seen it.

00:29:58.840 I can't report that firsthand, but there seems to have been some inspo for it.

00:30:03.200 Yeah, no, there are a bunch of people making comments that this is, like, the worst thing that could happen during Gay Pride Month.

00:30:07.620 It's just, just watching the breakup is just terrible.

00:30:10.840 And, you know, like, the whole thing is, like, honestly, on a comedic level, if you can't laugh at this, I'm not sure what you can laugh at.

00:30:19.440 I mean, it's inherently hilarious.

00:30:19.940 You're too close to politics.

00:30:21.480 Yeah, exactly.

00:30:22.000 And also, you take politics too seriously.

00:30:24.840 Okay, first rule of politics, watching gang, and I've been doing it for a quarter century at this point.

00:30:29.040 First rule, it is never House of Cards.

00:30:31.320 It is always Veep.

00:30:32.600 Always.

00:30:33.560 And this idea that it's, like, geniuses in the back room and they are coming up with magical plans and it's all 40 chests and underwater, upside down, hungry, hungry hippos.

00:30:40.940 It just isn't.

00:30:41.720 It just isn't.

00:30:42.280 It's a bunch of big personalities who are fighting over increasingly important things.

00:30:47.180 I mean, like, okay, and you know what's going to happen at the end of this?

00:30:50.620 It's nothing.

00:30:51.800 SpaceX will continue to operate with the United States government.

00:30:54.320 The big, beautiful bill will still pass.

00:30:56.120 Again, like, the only fallout that I see is that, and you can kind of see it in influencer world, the people who really are lamenting.

00:31:01.480 It's like, oh, my God, I'm on X and now I love Elon, but I also, I'm loyal to Trump and who do I back and how do I manipulate the situation?

00:31:09.420 And Elon, I'm following particular people and all this.

00:31:11.500 Like, here's the deal.

00:31:12.320 If you feel the necessity to sit around wondering what Elon thinks of you or what Trump thinks of you about taking sides, you think too much of yourself.

00:31:21.200 These people are very-

00:31:21.900 Yeah, that's exactly right.

00:31:23.020 They don't care.

00:31:23.440 Like, really.

00:31:23.940 No one gives a rat's ass.

00:31:25.820 Seriously.

00:31:26.480 Like, get over yourself.

00:31:27.780 These are two big egos with the richest man in the world, the most powerful man in the world, having a catfight.

00:31:33.660 And you know what?

00:31:34.520 You have nothing to do with it.

00:31:35.420 And in the end, if it doesn't matter to the voter, then I don't really care, and I'm just going to enjoy the fireworks a little bit.

00:31:40.620 There's a very Trump-supporting X account, but he also loves Elon, that goes by the name of Cat Turd.

00:31:47.940 And somebody tweeted out, who gets cat turd in the divorce?

00:31:51.160 You know, like, we have so much that we're going to have to settle here.

00:31:54.160 But the other rule of politics, too, you're right, Veep, more than House of Cards, is there are no real friends in politics.

00:32:00.340 There are no real friends in politics.

00:32:02.600 And anybody who took the old were BFFs, and I love Donald Trump as much as a non-gay man can love.

00:32:10.140 It's like, okay, you know, they love each other as much as two people who are in politics, and Elon has been in politics for the past six months, can love each other.

00:32:21.620 That's until the love expires over something like the Big Beautiful Bill.

00:32:25.500 I don't think the Big Beautiful Bill is ever at risk of causing Mrs. Dr. Shapiro and Ben Shapiro to break up.

00:32:33.180 It's also not at risk of dividing Doug Brunt and yours truly.

00:32:37.300 It's not love, and it's not real friendship.

00:32:39.840 It's an allyship, and it's there until it doesn't work for one or both parties.

00:32:45.140 That's exactly right.

00:32:45.980 I mean, it's a business, like any other business.

00:32:47.820 And I think Elon knows that.

00:32:48.780 I think Trump knows that.

00:32:50.100 I don't think either of them is personally affected in any deep and abiding way by any of this.

00:32:55.240 I think the one lesson that should come out of this, actually, when it comes to sort of the arguments over the electric vehicle mandate and SpaceX subsidies and all this kind of stuff, is actually, ideologically, Elon is right.

00:33:05.620 You know what would be awesome is if the government were so small that you couldn't use it as a giant grab bag of cash for particular policies?

00:33:11.620 But as we say, I think the overwrought drama, and people, it is fun to watch.

00:33:17.600 I mean, I will admit that watching the exchanges between, like, Cat Turd and Alex Jones over who they side with.

00:33:23.400 And, like, Alex Jones literally said to Cat Turd today on X, I'm not part of your cult.

00:33:28.020 And I'm like, I don't even know what's going on anymore.

00:33:30.000 But you know what?

00:33:30.840 I'm just, like, sitting back, popcorn meme, like, okay, you know what?

00:33:34.540 I'm here for the ride.

00:33:35.460 Okay, whatever.

00:33:36.100 Same.

00:33:36.700 We were joking that our, you know, we have this now morning news update podcast that we put out.

00:33:43.160 We were joking that our producers on it last night were like, oh, my God, like, trying to keep up with every iteration as soon as you thought you had it, like, done.

00:33:49.740 It wasn't done.

00:33:50.460 There was another iteration coming your way.

00:33:53.380 More of the leftist reaction to this.

00:33:55.640 These are actually kind of laughable and fun.

00:33:57.360 Let's check in on AOC and see what she has to say.

00:34:00.860 Any quick reaction on what's going on with Elon Musk and President Trump on Twitter right now?

00:34:06.620 Oh, man, the girls are fighting, aren't they?

00:34:09.840 I think this record we've been seeing a long time coming, but we'll see what the impacts are of it legislatively.

00:34:19.200 Okay.

00:34:20.240 You're so cool referring to them as the girls.

00:34:23.180 She's above it all, Ben.

00:34:24.280 That's what she's trying to telegraph.

00:34:25.460 You see, she's the adult in the room, the one out there who does a preacher accent, and she leans into her fake Latina accent, and she's the adult in the room.

00:34:37.500 Yeah.

00:34:38.280 Again, like, Democrats had a good day yesterday, but it isn't that great a day because their poll numbers still suck.

00:34:43.780 And Donald Trump's poll numbers are stronger than they've been actually for weeks at this point.

00:34:48.180 And so if the best they can do is just enjoy the fireworks the same way you and I are enjoying the fireworks, that doesn't win them any additional votes.

00:34:53.580 It's not as though anyone is going to vote against Republicans because Donald Trump and Elon Musk are having a fight or vote in favor of AOC because there's some drama happening in the White House.

00:35:02.800 That's not the way any of this works.

00:35:04.080 That's right.

00:35:04.760 Or vote down the BBB.

00:35:06.720 Yeah, exactly.

00:35:07.400 She has no power.

00:35:08.880 She has no influence.

00:35:10.120 Like, 20% of the Democratic Party thinks she's the thought leader.

00:35:12.940 I think Republicans at this point are probably rooting for her to be the thought leader of the Democratic Party because it means they have no thoughts.

00:35:17.760 But this sort of, you know, like, oh, my God, the girls are fighting kind of stuff.

00:35:23.320 Who thinks that's charming or interesting or fun?

00:35:26.680 I know.

00:35:26.940 Good luck to the Democrats.

00:35:28.340 She's the mature one.

00:35:28.720 Again, the amazing thing to me, I will never get over the fact that the Democratic Party has been given some actual opportunities if they wanted to attack the Trump administration to do so.

00:35:37.660 But they can't let go of their insane radicalism long enough to do it.

00:35:41.220 It really is like an amazing, incredible thing.

00:35:43.520 They're still out there doing the trans athletes in sports and illegal immigrants need health care routine.

00:35:48.800 And meanwhile, Donald Trump is actually getting things done with executive orders and major legislation on the foreign policy front.

00:35:55.820 You could imagine a world where the Democratic Party was not insane and they actually were able to somehow twist this into a broader narrative.

00:36:01.860 But they just have no capacity to do it.

00:36:04.460 Oh, Chris Murphy's out there.

00:36:05.980 OK, he says the following.

00:36:07.740 When 15 million Americans lose their health care and plunge into personal crisis, none of them are going to give a shit.

00:36:14.260 This is his new things to drop swears.

00:36:15.860 He thinks it makes him relatable about a made for clicks Twitter fight between two billionaires, blah, blah, blah.

00:36:22.400 OK, get get boys out of girl sports, you disgusting pervert.

00:36:25.940 I'm sorry.

00:36:26.540 But anybody who enjoys watching that, there's something wrong with them.

00:36:28.940 There's something wrong with Chris Murphy.

00:36:30.900 No, like take a seat until you know how to protect 12 year old girls.

00:36:35.020 You can be quiet.

00:36:36.020 No one wants to hear your opinion about anything.

00:36:38.460 And then I'll give you this one from my old pal over the New York Times, Lulu Garcia Navarro.

00:36:43.620 She's she's not really my pal, but she interviewed me and I actually liked her.

00:36:46.940 But she's a leftist and saying leftist things about the Trump Elon fight.

00:36:51.740 Here's what she said on CNN.

00:36:54.680 I have so many thoughts about this.

00:36:57.340 So, you know, I think this is bad for Musk.

00:37:02.640 I am if you look at the history around the world of authoritarians breaking up with their oligarch buddies, those oligarch buddies don't end up in a good place.

00:37:13.500 They either end up impoverished, imprisoned or dead.

00:37:16.800 I'm not saying that that's going to happen to Elon Musk here, but the power is with the government.

00:37:22.020 You saw Donald Trump immediately say, all right, we're going to take away your, you know, contracts.

00:37:32.120 Impoverished, imprisoned or dead.

00:37:34.740 I'm not saying that's what is going to happen, but that's typically what would happen in this kind of a fight.

00:37:40.840 Everybody needs to calm the F down.

00:37:42.480 Seriously, just calm the F down.

00:37:43.860 And it's not just her, by the way.

00:37:45.860 Like, I know Steve Bannon is just enjoying himself wildly.

00:37:48.920 And Steve's like Steve is having like Steve's orgasmic over this because Steve for.

00:37:53.480 Can I play you some?

00:37:54.400 Can you just hold that thought?

00:37:55.420 Forgive me, because we have a little bit of that.

00:37:57.420 And here's let's play the audience.

00:37:59.340 What we're talking about.

00:37:59.940 Stop for from Bannon last night.

00:38:02.280 President Trump should be taking immediately.

00:38:03.580 I think when he threatens to take one of the big programs out of SpaceX, President Trump tonight should sign an executive order calling for the Defense to Production Act to be caught in SpaceX and seize SpaceX tonight before midnight.

00:38:20.540 And he said that Trump should deport Elon, who Steve is convinced lied about the facts in order to get his citizen application approved.

00:38:31.040 Steve is so thirsty to be in the White House.

00:38:33.300 He is so thirsty.

00:38:35.200 And listen, you know, again, Steve and I don't get along.

00:38:38.440 I agree with some of the things Steve says.

00:38:40.200 And Elon and he don't get along.

00:38:42.220 Oh, well, he hates Elon.

00:38:43.320 I mean, like, really hates Elon.

00:38:44.360 He hates Elon.

00:38:44.940 Yeah, hates him.

00:38:45.820 And so from the day that Elon had influence with Trump, he's been waiting for this moment to kind of insert himself back into the narrative.

00:38:52.080 But I love that the way that Steve does that is always by taking the most outrageous possible position.

00:38:56.440 We should put him in jail and then we should slay him for execution the next morning by firing squad.

00:39:00.620 And seize his company.

00:39:01.220 We should nationalize all of SpaceX and Tesla just for good measure, just to F with him.

00:39:07.420 We should take X and we should reverse merge it into truth social.

00:39:10.580 Like, come on, really, Steve?

00:39:14.360 Really?

00:39:14.880 Like, OK, I get it.

00:39:16.080 I get it.

00:39:16.660 Stop being so thirsty.

00:39:17.660 President Trump will eventually return your phone calls.

00:39:20.200 Like, really?

00:39:20.720 It was fun.

00:39:23.680 All right.

00:39:23.960 So over on Team Sanity, that's that's AOC.

00:39:27.740 That's what she would tell you the Dems are or Chris Murphy, that they're they're now Team Sanity.

00:39:31.280 Um, they're having debates about the immigration problem that include terms like undocumented citizens.

00:39:39.880 But just let that sink in undocumented citizens, a term that was actually dropped on CNN last night.

00:39:47.700 Um, listen to it here.

00:39:49.560 Scott Jennings is involved.

00:39:50.880 Bakari Sellers is involved.

00:39:52.280 And then Kat Abugazela, a Democrat, Illinois congressional candidate on free health care for illegals.

00:39:59.940 Watch.

00:40:01.480 Everyone deserves health care.

00:40:02.940 Even illegals?

00:40:04.000 Every single person in the world deserves health care.

00:40:05.840 Just for the record, as a candidate, you're for illegal aliens getting Medicaid.

00:40:08.780 I think everyone in the world deserves health care.

00:40:10.500 That's a yes.

00:40:11.260 That's a yes.

00:40:12.140 Can I start my logic train with you?

00:40:13.320 Are you for it or not?

00:40:14.020 My logic train starts with the fact that I don't want to I don't want to kick 11 million people off of Medicaid.

00:40:18.740 Do you want illegal aliens on or not?

00:40:20.520 Do I want to, first of all, do I want undocumented citizens to have health care?

00:40:24.540 The answer is yes.

00:40:26.580 Oh, God.

00:40:27.920 That is not a thing, Ben.

00:40:30.740 No, it is not.

00:40:32.520 In fact, you need to have your documents to be a citizen.

00:40:36.940 That is oxymoronic.

00:40:39.380 I mean, it's amazing.

00:40:41.880 Emphasis on the moronic.

00:40:43.080 They literally cannot just let go of their far left priors.

00:40:47.260 And it's going to sink them.

00:40:48.540 It truly is.

00:40:49.320 Again, if you are strategizing this out, if you're a Democrat, what you'd be strategizing out right now is something where you say, look, the economy could be soaring right now.

00:40:57.040 Instead, the economy is sort of wavering right now.

00:40:59.620 And that's because of the tariff war or that's because of the cozy relationship between business and Trump and all of their people who are getting rich while the American workers being left behind.

00:41:09.340 You could you could try to trot something out like that, but they can't do it.

00:41:12.440 Instead, they're arguing over where they're undocumented citizens, which which, again, makes literally zero sense, literally none.

00:41:19.600 And it's like saying felonious innocence.

00:41:22.000 Like that.

00:41:22.320 That's not how it works.

00:41:23.780 They do it.

00:41:25.200 Trotting that out.

00:41:26.040 And that's your pitch.

00:41:26.780 This is your big pitch for getting back in the game.

00:41:29.120 This is it.

00:41:29.940 This is your thing.

00:41:30.940 When you see the numbers like the polls that show the American public is so overwhelmingly in favor of, yes, deporting all not not just the criminal illegals.

00:41:38.600 They're all criminal illegals, but the extra criminals like who have committed murders and rapes and child molestation.

00:41:43.680 But all of them, all of them.

00:41:45.440 So here's a little bit more from that same debate because it descended into being about slavery.

00:41:50.000 OK, watch.

00:41:52.280 Scott, do you think that your family was born here?

00:41:54.980 You weren't born here, Scott.

00:41:56.340 I was born in.

00:41:57.060 First of all, where's your family come from?

00:41:59.160 My family wasn't born here.

00:42:00.420 Our country is built on immigration, period.

00:42:03.860 What kind?

00:42:04.900 Period.

00:42:05.480 What kind?

00:42:06.080 Oh, well, first of all, before we go to commercial, what kind?

00:42:09.260 What kind of immigration was I brought here?

00:42:11.420 You're already in the hole.

00:42:12.040 You sure you want to stop digging?

00:42:13.040 No, because it was slavery.

00:42:14.000 That's not immigration.

00:42:14.760 Come on.

00:42:15.680 Well, OK.

00:42:16.260 Come on, what?

00:42:17.100 There's a lot to be said.

00:42:18.520 Hold on, hold on.

00:42:19.120 No, no, no, but you just can't say, come on, when somebody's like, my family was brought

00:42:23.240 here in chains.

00:42:24.500 The answer's not, come on.

00:42:25.820 We're going to.

00:42:27.480 What?

00:42:28.980 This is what the left always does when you have them against the wall.

00:42:32.100 They play the race card.

00:42:33.900 That's their favorite thing to do.

00:42:35.280 Or it could be the identity card, it being Pride Month.

00:42:37.560 That's a favorite for the month of June.

00:42:39.440 But he was trying to make the point, we were not built on illegal immigration.

00:42:43.500 The country was in a very different position because that's what the left always wants

00:42:47.120 to say.

00:42:47.480 We're built on immigration, built on immigration.

00:42:49.920 We weren't importing against the law, against U.S. policy, a bunch of criminals from Venezuela.

00:42:57.080 That's not how the United States was built.

00:42:59.160 Right.

00:42:59.560 And again, it seems kind of insulting to actually the descendants of slaves to compare people

00:43:04.060 who were literally brought here in chains against their will to people who are voluntarily

00:43:07.980 illegally crossing the border and then receiving government benefits.

00:43:11.040 That doesn't seem like the same thing to me at all, actually.

00:43:15.240 It's a bizarre argument for certain.

00:43:17.900 But again, just demonstrates that the Democrats, they cannot get out of their own way.

00:43:20.700 They cannot get out of their own way.

00:43:21.800 They're so ideologically tied to this intersectional view of what politics has to be and hoping

00:43:27.440 that there's some deus ex machina that basically saves it.

00:43:29.680 I think that's really what's happening partially with this Elon-Trump fight and them hoping

00:43:33.700 this is the deus ex machina, that this is going to be the event from the outside, the exogenous

00:43:37.680 shock that somehow is going to wake Americans up to the fact that Trump is crazy and Elon is

00:43:42.020 crazy and the entire Republican Party is so crazy.

00:43:44.300 And then they'll move back into our category.

00:43:46.380 Guys, whatever's going on between Elon and Trump ain't half as crazy as the proposition that

00:43:50.060 boys are girls and America ought not have a southern border.

00:43:52.860 Right on.

00:43:53.840 By the way, Trump tweeted out the other day that Joe Biden died in 2020 and that this

00:43:58.560 version of him is like fake.

00:44:00.160 So if that like that didn't really convince anybody that that was a day ending and why

00:44:06.540 in the current, you know, political era.

00:44:09.380 So no one's going to believe Trump's crazy.

00:44:11.300 He says crazy things to get a rise out of people to entertain us, but that they haven't

00:44:16.180 been able to sell that thus far.

00:44:17.360 Here is the other piece of the Democrat problem.

00:44:20.500 They're elitist snobs and all these policies.

00:44:22.940 They're desperate.

00:44:23.760 And we see this with some of the Chamber of Commerce Republicans, too.

00:44:26.320 They're desperate to keep these illegals here because they really do want them to mow their

00:44:32.140 lawns.

00:44:32.800 That's how they see it.

00:44:33.780 It's like they always say, who's going to mow your lawn?

00:44:36.600 Who's going to take care of your garden if we don't have illegals here?

00:44:39.580 And now we have this nutcase videos from Vermont Daily Chronicle.

00:44:43.380 Democratic Representative Becca Balint had an appearance the other day putting an even more

00:44:50.620 interesting spin on it in Sot 9.

00:44:52.000 We have to come to a place in Congress where it is no longer a political issue, but we

00:45:02.540 see it as an existential issue for the country.

00:45:07.240 If we don't have avenues for people to come here legally to work or to build a home here,

00:45:15.700 I'm going to be really through right now.

00:45:17.540 We're not going to have anybody around to wipe our asses because we don't have enough

00:45:21.740 people.

00:45:22.320 Oh, my God, Ben.

00:45:27.120 Hmm.

00:45:27.640 That's a take.

00:45:28.820 That's a take.

00:45:29.880 Got to have some people here legally so they can wipe some asses.

00:45:32.720 That's that's that's a take.

00:45:34.120 I mean, I assume that Biden family has enough money that they can hire people who are legal

00:45:38.400 to to wipe the ex-president's ass.

00:45:40.200 But that is like this is I love that if a Republican ever said that about illegal immigrants,

00:45:46.040 it would immediately be the most racist thing you ever heard.

00:45:47.920 And Democrats just kind of drop that stuff out there as though it's totally normal.

00:45:52.460 And then everybody just kind of goes about their business.

00:45:54.820 It really is an amazing thing.

00:45:56.480 So we've heard in the last 10 minutes that illegal immigrants are akin to slaves and also

00:46:01.500 that illegal immigrants must be here to wipe the butts to wipe our asses of Americans.

00:46:07.240 And that's somehow that wait, were there like our parties, the racist party?

00:46:12.580 I'm really concerned about how Becca Balint.

00:46:15.260 Does she not know how to wipe her ass?

00:46:17.020 Because I don't know how she's made it to this point in adulthood.

00:46:19.480 Well, I mean, to be fair, she's in Congress.

00:46:22.280 That's that.

00:46:22.960 I'm not going to go there.

00:46:23.900 That's that's that is quite possible.

00:46:25.940 A significant percentage of Congress does not know how to wipe their own ass.

00:46:29.120 That is.

00:46:29.460 But here's the big question.

00:46:30.660 Who is who has a dumber general collection?

00:46:32.740 General like if you average the IQ, which group would be dumber?

00:46:36.100 Members of Congress or members of the media?

00:46:39.240 Oh, God.

00:46:40.840 Wow.

00:46:41.880 I know.

00:46:42.840 Even with your IQ, that's a tough one to answer.

00:46:45.240 Yeah.

00:46:46.100 Yeah.

00:46:46.360 I don't know the I mean, it I believe that zero that you can't go below it in terms of

00:46:51.940 IQ.

00:46:52.660 So now you're asking me to compare zero to it's like comparing infinity to infinity.

00:46:56.260 Like the number is equivalent.

00:46:57.740 I'm not sure that we're in negatives.

00:46:59.760 OK, well, listen, this might put you over the edge.

00:47:02.500 I'm going to try.

00:47:04.000 Hold on a second.

00:47:04.740 There's so many to choose from here that I've got teed up for you.

00:47:07.000 Here is Christiane Amanpour, who, well, I'll just let the soundbite speak for itself.

00:47:13.420 Stop 19.

00:47:13.980 When I went to Harvard to give this speech, and it was just a few days ago last week, I

00:47:22.200 must say I was afraid.

00:47:23.400 I'm a foreigner.

00:47:24.400 I don't have a green card.

00:47:26.140 I'm not an American citizen.

00:47:27.580 I'm fairly prominent.

00:47:28.680 And I literally prepared to go to America as if I was going to North Korea.

00:47:35.400 I took a burner phone, Jamie.

00:47:37.680 Imagine that.

00:47:38.460 And I was really afraid.

00:47:40.400 I'd even talked to the CNN security person because of this.

00:47:45.440 I've heard that many, including British citizens, have been stopped at the border and questioned

00:47:50.080 for hours and hours.

00:47:51.080 It was scary.

00:47:53.140 Luckily, Jamie, I was welcomed.

00:47:55.920 I mean, the immigration officer at Boston where I came in could not have been nicer.

00:48:05.420 Christiane Amanpour, she's worried she's going to get hunted down in the street for

00:48:08.780 being a British citizen.

00:48:11.300 Yeah, and she's the international reporter.

00:48:13.300 I mean, she should try going to many of the countries that she covers and see how she's

00:48:17.200 treated there.

00:48:18.380 But by the way, I'm going to go full Steve Bannon here.

00:48:19.800 We totally should have arrested and deported.

00:48:21.940 I was like, sure.

00:48:22.760 Why the hell not?

00:48:23.880 I mean, he's not wrong about everything.

00:48:25.700 He's not wrong about everything.

00:48:26.960 I mean, and by the way, she thought she was going to be treated badly at Harvard.

00:48:30.280 At Harvard?

00:48:31.020 Like, really?

00:48:32.140 Okay, I went to the law school over there.

00:48:33.500 Christiane Amanpour, basically, they have a statue of her at the Harvard School of International

00:48:37.020 Relations or the Kennedy School of Government.

00:48:39.480 Like, what absolute horseback?

00:48:41.740 She was scared.

00:48:42.400 I'm sure she was deeply fearful.

00:48:44.580 I'm sure it was like traveling into Syria or something.

00:48:47.120 I got another one for you.

00:48:48.200 We deserve this fun today, Ben Shapiro.

00:48:49.760 We deserve it.

00:48:50.500 We work hard for a living.

00:48:51.760 We do this every day.

00:48:52.820 Some days are leaner than others.

00:48:54.340 But today is an abundance of riches.

00:48:56.460 I give you Whoopi Goldberg on Maryland Governor Wes Moore.

00:49:02.120 He is a black man who many thought, well, still think, could be the Democrat nominee.

00:49:07.540 Although, officially, he said he's not interested.

00:49:09.400 But listen to this.

00:49:10.040 You know, you have someone like Wes Moore, who is the perfect candidate.

00:49:15.000 I love Wes Moore.

00:49:15.600 Oh, my gosh.

00:49:16.420 And people are saying, well, he, you know, you can't elect a black man.

00:49:20.920 Why not?

00:49:21.420 Oh, hell yeah.

00:49:21.920 We did it twice.

00:49:22.780 Well, I'm just, but I'm saying, you know, what I like about Wes Moore, for example, he thinks

00:49:29.580 outside of the box.

00:49:31.780 People are saying you can't elect a black man.

00:49:35.100 Literally, no sane person is saying that.

00:49:37.720 Well, I mean, we did twice.

00:49:39.100 So, I mean, that's kind of weird.

00:49:41.840 And then they tried to have us elect a black lady after their candidate died.

00:49:46.040 So, yeah.

00:49:46.760 And we did elect that black lady twice as our vice president.

00:49:49.760 Well, once as our vice president and once as a U.S. senator.

00:49:52.640 That is true.

00:49:53.860 To our great and everlasting shame and discredit.

00:49:57.620 But yes, the most intelligent people at The View.

00:49:59.620 The View, collective IQ, negative.

00:50:02.820 Again, we might have to tip the scales in favor of Congress

00:50:07.760 as being the smarter group.

00:50:09.480 I hate to do it.

00:50:10.500 I mean, I know Jasmine Crockett is there.

00:50:12.820 But I'm just sorry.

00:50:14.080 We've got Jim Acosta, Ben.

00:50:15.600 It's, I'm afraid we're going to have to wave the white flag.

00:50:20.120 Fair enough.

00:50:22.360 Thank you for participating and for jacking up our average.

00:50:25.140 It's a pleasure, my friend.

00:50:26.360 Take care.

00:50:27.340 Good to see you.

00:50:28.560 All right.

00:50:29.020 Coming up next, the ladies from Red Scare.

00:50:31.480 Grand Canyon University, a private Christian university in beautiful Phoenix, Arizona,

00:50:35.920 believes we are endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights

00:50:39.520 to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

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00:50:59.800 are designed to help you achieve your unique academic, personal, and professional goals.

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00:51:08.820 GCU meets you where you are and provides a path to help you fulfill your dreams.

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00:51:21.760 Visit gcu.edu.

00:51:23.320 While we enjoy the temporary mean girls fight happening between the world's richest man and

00:51:31.840 the world's most powerful one, the martinis are back, and so are the ladies from the Red

00:51:36.320 Scare podcast.

00:51:37.560 Here with me in studio again, Anna Kachian and Dasha Nekrasova.

00:51:42.420 Ladies, welcome back.

00:51:44.000 Thanks for having me.

00:51:45.080 And all best wishes to you on your new marriage.

00:51:48.140 Thank you.

00:51:48.660 Oh, that's amazing.

00:51:50.020 So you got married just in May, or?

00:51:52.120 Yeah, about a month ago.

00:51:53.440 Oh, how's it going so far?

00:51:55.000 So good.

00:51:56.000 I mean, they call it the honeymoon phase.

00:51:58.220 Yes.

00:51:58.400 But I love being married.

00:51:59.880 How long were you engaged before you?

00:52:02.160 Oh, beautiful.

00:52:03.040 Look at that picture.

00:52:04.640 Oh, yeah.

00:52:05.320 Where is that?

00:52:06.120 Where is that?

00:52:06.540 That's at my church in the East Village.

00:52:07.880 Oh, my gosh.

00:52:08.500 Gorgeous.

00:52:10.460 Oh, wow.

00:52:12.500 How long were you guys together before you got married?

00:52:15.980 About a year.

00:52:16.940 We got married pretty quick.

00:52:17.820 That's good.

00:52:18.320 That'll do it.

00:52:19.100 Yeah.

00:52:19.400 You want kids or?

00:52:20.980 Oh, good.

00:52:21.460 Yeah.

00:52:21.780 I bet you make a great mom.

00:52:23.340 Did you go?

00:52:24.300 Of course.

00:52:24.820 Yes.

00:52:25.060 Okay.

00:52:25.660 Though our haters were speculating that I didn't because I was absent from the pictures because

00:52:30.260 I was so busy taking pictures of everybody.

00:52:32.880 This is one of my fears as a mother.

00:52:34.400 Can I tell you this?

00:52:35.040 That like I'm always taking pictures of my kids and Doug and the moments together that

00:52:39.880 I worry someday they're going to look back and be like, she was never there.

00:52:43.860 What do you mean?

00:52:44.800 Who do you think was holding the camera?

00:52:46.460 Exactly.

00:52:46.820 It's like that footprints thing with the Lord.

00:52:49.460 They're carrying you.

00:52:51.380 Anyway.

00:52:52.300 Okay.

00:52:52.700 What do you guys make of the Elon Trump Mean Girls dust up?

00:52:57.520 I was begging and pleading with my friends in the group chat this morning to give me like

00:53:02.740 a summary of the bill.

00:53:03.960 The bill sounds good overall.

00:53:07.100 I'm sure with like bill, big bills like that, there's always some filler.

00:53:10.200 I think that he flew too close to the sun.

00:53:13.560 He like overestimated his power.

00:53:15.460 Elon.

00:53:15.960 Yeah.

00:53:16.320 Because I think like he is a guy who, you know, he, we have to be grateful to Elon because

00:53:22.540 he did buy Twitter.

00:53:24.860 He was a top donor to the Trump campaign.

00:53:27.400 I think he really moved.

00:53:28.340 He said Trump wouldn't have won without him.

00:53:29.600 Yeah.

00:53:30.320 You're really playing with fire.

00:53:31.460 Well, that was the crazy part because I think he really did, for example, move the needle

00:53:34.880 and getting a lot of the other tech moguls like Bezos and Zuckerberg to come around to

00:53:39.920 the right more.

00:53:40.820 Um, but when he's talking, when he's like going on the computer and talking about, um, that

00:53:47.380 Trump should exercise a little bit more gratitude, he sounds like an ungrateful immigrant.

00:53:51.660 Right.

00:53:51.880 He, right.

00:53:52.340 He said so, so ungrateful or something.

00:53:54.220 Yeah.

00:53:54.480 Yeah.

00:53:54.820 Which was, he seems like a scorned lover.

00:53:57.520 Yeah.

00:53:57.840 You're, you're at risk of seeming like a bitter ex.

00:54:00.520 Yeah.

00:54:00.880 I mean, there's part of me cause I have a little bit of a paranoid streak that thinks it's all

00:54:05.400 a little bit of theater and K-fab perhaps.

00:54:08.540 But what do you mean K-fab?

00:54:09.960 What is that?

00:54:10.280 Like from wrestling where they like are kind of stunting.

00:54:13.920 But they all, everyone knows that it's fake.

00:54:16.620 Trump's always doing a little bit of that.

00:54:18.340 Yeah.

00:54:18.660 I mean, I don't know if he, I feel like Elon, he's erratic.

00:54:24.160 Very much so.

00:54:25.300 And so I feel like he probably did feel attacked when they yanked his NASA nominee.

00:54:30.680 He didn't like that.

00:54:31.600 He reportedly almost came to blows with Scott Bessent over who was going to head up the

00:54:36.080 IRS.

00:54:36.600 Elon wanted that whistleblower.

00:54:40.240 He's a good man.

00:54:41.160 Gary Shepley.

00:54:42.320 Yeah.

00:54:42.700 Who was one of the ones who blew the whistle on how they were slow rolling the investigation

00:54:46.600 into Hunter Biden.

00:54:48.060 And that the Joe Biden DOJ was not letting him and his team of investigators actually figure

00:54:53.660 out what Hunter did in time for a criminal case to be brought.

00:54:57.380 So he's a heroic man, in my view.

00:55:01.020 And Elon reportedly was behind him as the head of IRS.

00:55:04.920 But Scott Bessent didn't want him.

00:55:07.000 He wanted, as Scott Bessent is at Treasury, obviously the IRS is under his purview ultimately.

00:55:12.460 And he wanted his own guy.

00:55:14.360 And reportedly they almost came to actual blows in the White House those two.

00:55:19.160 So I think Elon is, he's got an explosive temper.

00:55:23.440 Yeah.

00:55:23.940 And he was pissed that his NASA proposal guy who was well on his way to getting chosen and

00:55:30.640 confirmed got yanked because OMB decided it wasn't the right guy.

00:55:34.980 And the guy was actually a Democrat.

00:55:36.940 Ben Shapiro and I were talking about it a little bit.

00:55:38.820 I think Elon didn't appreciate that.

00:55:40.020 I think Elon genuinely does hate the big, beautiful bill.

00:55:42.200 Yeah, he wants a slim bill, he says.

00:55:45.660 Yeah, he says slim, slim and beautiful, better.

00:55:49.360 Yeah, I mean, I don't think it's really like about deficit spending.

00:55:53.120 Oh, cheers.

00:55:55.200 Yeah, the deficit.

00:55:56.460 I don't think it's about deficit spending.

00:55:57.580 Not for him.

00:55:58.480 Like people are saying it's about the NASA appointee, the EV mandates and so on and so forth.

00:56:03.960 I think that he just really miscalculated his role in the administration, his place in

00:56:10.000 the organization, his place in the cosmos, because he's obviously a very smart guy who's

00:56:17.880 a little bit autistic and retarded.

00:56:19.660 And I think he's made the classic error where he thinks because he's had like, you know,

00:56:25.040 some not some but a great deal of success and has a lot of expertise in certain particular

00:56:32.020 fields that this kind of translates to some greater wisdom or omniscience across the board.

00:56:37.860 Well, and especially when you're talking about politics, it's its own animal.

00:56:43.380 In the same way, Trump should not spend six months at, you know, SpaceX and try to advise

00:56:48.580 Elon on how to make rockets.

00:56:50.420 Right.

00:56:50.700 Like Elon is on thin ice spending six months in politics trying to tell Trump how you get

00:56:56.400 legislation through, what can be done.

00:56:58.080 I mean, the whole thing is always so ugly and disgusting and a turnoff.

00:57:03.220 That's politics.

00:57:05.240 Well, Bannon's probably feeling pretty vindicated.

00:57:07.120 And Bannon's feeling really happy because he's been harping about the tech oligarchs.

00:57:11.900 Yeah.

00:57:12.420 Batya Angarsargon, same.

00:57:14.100 She's been she writes now for the free press, but she's a Democrat who's a Trump voter and

00:57:20.020 very focused on the working class.

00:57:21.680 And she's not an Elon fan.

00:57:23.640 There's this guy, Dave Marcus, who used to come on this show, but then he got hired for

00:57:26.500 Fox by Fox.

00:57:27.340 So now he can't come on.

00:57:28.060 But he's he's skeptical about Elon.

00:57:31.020 A lot of guys who are really like in touch with the working class.

00:57:33.700 And I would include all three I just said, have been very skeptical of Elon and thinking

00:57:38.380 that this whole thing is about Elon pushing Elon's interest, not this fight, but his whole

00:57:42.320 alliance.

00:57:43.200 I don't believe that.

00:57:44.880 Yeah.

00:57:45.260 He seems like autistic enough that he believes he believes about in some like greater principle

00:57:50.960 or ideal.

00:57:52.040 I don't think strictly about his.

00:57:54.200 He's also calculated.

00:57:55.780 He's not going to do something that's against his interest.

00:57:58.620 Except for having this huge crash out from.

00:58:02.920 Well, or getting political in the first place was dangerous just because look what happened

00:58:07.200 to Tesla.

00:58:08.180 But the truth is, you know, Elon, I saw him last September, September of 2024 at the all

00:58:15.800 in summit out in California.

00:58:17.680 And I mean, his big issue was we're going broke.

00:58:22.340 We're going bankrupt and that we have to find ways to say within this federal government or

00:58:27.920 we're going to go bankrupt.

00:58:29.060 And, you know, the politician attitude is kick the can down the road until we are bankrupt.

00:58:34.640 It's really someone else's problem.

00:58:36.720 It's like sustainably unsustainable forever and ever until it's not.

00:58:40.800 And obviously, like with this bill, as a friend of mine pointed out, trillions of dollars.

00:58:44.520 Yeah, it's thirty seven trillion.

00:58:45.960 Ten years, you said debt.

00:58:48.140 And it's going to raise it three trillion more over the course of 10 years.

00:58:51.440 It's all less unless GDP spurs like it gets spurred by the tax cuts and it goes up proportionally.

00:58:57.980 But I mean, it's obviously the the spending cuts will not be enough to offset the tax cuts,

00:59:03.940 as I understand it.

00:59:05.460 Is this bill getting passed in the first place?

00:59:08.000 It is.

00:59:08.320 OK, it's going through.

00:59:09.340 But Trump is banking on like what happened in twenty seventeen is Trump lowered that corporate

00:59:14.160 tax rate, like by double digits.

00:59:16.780 He lowered taxes across the economic spectrum.

00:59:20.280 The poor who barely pay taxes to begin with all the way up to the uber wealthy all got a tax cut

00:59:25.940 and the economy got chugging.

00:59:28.360 I mean, it was great before COVID hit.

00:59:30.660 It was great.

00:59:31.540 And he's banking on the same thing happening now.

00:59:34.160 He doesn't listen to it is a left leaning CBO, Congressional Budget Office, that scores

00:59:38.080 how much will be added to the deficit.

00:59:40.360 And they don't really bake in the American worker engine of like this is going to make

00:59:46.580 people higher.

00:59:47.180 Truly, if if I get to keep the tax cuts I got in twenty seventeen, by the way, net net,

00:59:52.600 my taxes went up because in the tri-state region we had the salt deduction taken away.

00:59:57.200 It was whatever.

00:59:57.740 Fine.

00:59:59.060 But I will hire.

01:00:00.220 I'd be more likely to hire than than I would to fire.

01:00:03.000 Like if they jack my taxes up, I'm not going to take the hit.

01:00:06.560 I'm probably just not going to hire an additional body.

01:00:08.760 I mean, that makes sense.

01:00:09.920 And with the deficit, I just don't think normal people even really understand.

01:00:13.620 Or when you're talking about like trillions of dollars, people can't even really conceive

01:00:18.000 of that.

01:00:19.000 And it just isn't.

01:00:20.720 I know it sounds naive, but I just don't think it's that big of a deal.

01:00:23.900 It's like when you're in debt ceiling.

01:00:26.360 I know.

01:00:26.880 Let's sure raise it.

01:00:28.420 I know, right?

01:00:29.200 Have you been in bad debt at all ever?

01:00:31.620 So I was just law school.

01:00:35.080 I was taking on over $100,000 of debt and I was paying for it myself.

01:00:39.000 And, you know, it gets a little scary because you're not sure you're going to get a good

01:00:43.660 job at the end of this.

01:00:44.780 You hope you will.

01:00:46.900 But I remember that feeling.

01:00:48.980 And you go without, right?

01:00:50.660 You can't buy anything.

01:00:52.060 I lived in a very crappy apartment and I was not buying.

01:00:55.200 I couldn't really buy whatever you frivolous spending stories where you go to like the

01:01:00.060 clothing store and you get a cute new outfit or what I, my big goal was I wanted to be

01:01:03.280 able to go into Pottery Barn and buy what I wanted.

01:01:05.520 Right.

01:01:05.820 I was looking forward to that as a goal.

01:01:08.120 Anyway, my point is I couldn't buy anything.

01:01:10.140 But if the credit card company had come to me at the time and said, we'll raise your limit

01:01:14.920 by 10 grand and you can buy one of the, I would have said yes.

01:01:18.660 You're investing in yourself.

01:01:21.360 You have to spend money to make money.

01:01:22.940 That's one of the only things I know about economics.

01:01:24.800 That's how we keep our business afloat.

01:01:27.220 Well, talk about that.

01:01:28.420 What do you mean?

01:01:28.780 Like, what do you do as an actress?

01:01:30.960 Does this mean like investing in your looks and making sure you stay atop the field?

01:01:34.780 That's how I justify, yeah.

01:01:36.020 I mean, yeah, you can't hoard your resources.

01:01:40.060 It's, you have to allocate them towards yourself in a spirit of prosperity and abundance.

01:01:46.080 Okay.

01:01:46.560 Which Donald Trump's.

01:01:47.600 Yeah.

01:01:47.800 I mean, it sounds.

01:01:48.660 He's a prosperity gospel guy.

01:01:50.400 He is.

01:01:51.280 It sounds kind of like easy when we say it, but like, if you are not anxious about money,

01:01:56.680 you tend to make money.

01:01:58.520 Anxiety about money is a killer for any sort of like ambition or like financial success.

01:02:06.840 I agree with that.

01:02:07.620 Now, I have a question for you since we, I brought up Hollywood.

01:02:10.920 What is everyone doing to their faces out in Hollywood?

01:02:13.640 What is Gwen Stefani?

01:02:16.540 There's Kris Kardashian.

01:02:18.180 There's Anne Hathaway.

01:02:20.780 Who else am I missing?

01:02:22.100 Mid-plane facelift.

01:02:23.280 Okay.

01:02:23.480 What is that?

01:02:24.640 I don't totally know, but it's less.

01:02:27.120 Wait, deep plane, right?

01:02:28.360 Deep plane.

01:02:28.840 Is that what it's?

01:02:29.300 Why don't they have any scars?

01:02:30.720 Those close-ups of Anne Hathaway.

01:02:33.360 I saw a close-up behind her ear and I saw nothing.

01:02:36.440 Huh?

01:02:36.700 I think they're doing like a deep plane, which is when they not only stretch the skin back,

01:02:41.880 but they move the muscle underneath.

01:02:44.280 Is this new?

01:02:45.040 Because why does, why did those facelifts, if that's what we're talking about, look so

01:02:48.500 much better than everybody else's?

01:02:49.460 I think I'm sure there's been some like advancement in the technology.

01:02:52.460 And I suspect they're also probably just doing fat transfers.

01:02:54.920 So they're taking fat from somewhere in your body and re-injecting it.

01:02:58.080 And they're taking volume.

01:02:59.700 I want that.

01:03:00.420 Me too.

01:03:01.100 Me too.

01:03:01.660 That solves two problems at once.

01:03:03.700 Not really though, because the truth is if you ever see somebody who's had like too

01:03:07.000 much lip liposuction, it just looks weird.

01:03:10.340 The skin?

01:03:11.340 Yeah.

01:03:11.820 And by the way, those fat cells then have to regrow someplace else.

01:03:14.800 So if you overeat, you know, suddenly you have fat elbows instead of thighs, which looks

01:03:20.240 normal, you know?

01:03:21.800 Yeah.

01:03:22.340 I mean, Anne Hathaway looks fantastic.

01:03:23.940 She's never looked better.

01:03:24.820 She looks unbelievable.

01:03:25.440 And also Christina Aguilera, Lindsay Lohan, they all have.

01:03:28.540 Yes.

01:03:28.940 That's another one.

01:03:29.900 Lindsay Lohan in particular.

01:03:31.180 Yeah.

01:03:31.980 She claims she drinks like lemon water.

01:03:35.380 Maureen Callahan was off on this.

01:03:37.280 It was amazing.

01:03:39.040 Water.

01:03:39.720 Sure.

01:03:40.200 Water.

01:03:41.060 That's staying hydrated.

01:03:42.240 That's that'll do it.

01:03:43.840 It's so ridiculous.

01:03:45.780 Yeah.

01:03:46.060 I think that they also probably have like they probably do a lot of like red light therapy

01:03:51.340 and lasers.

01:03:51.980 And it's also just like photography lies and they're like filtered at all times.

01:03:56.840 The other one I want to know about is Jennifer Connelly.

01:04:00.200 Nothing.

01:04:00.760 What about her?

01:04:01.260 She looks so good.

01:04:03.120 Well, she was in Dark Matter.

01:04:04.380 I don't know if you guys watched that, but it was great.

01:04:06.380 I worked with her.

01:04:07.360 You did?

01:04:07.940 Yeah.

01:04:08.360 Wait, and what?

01:04:08.940 We did a film together called Bad Behavior.

01:04:11.160 Oh.

01:04:11.540 And I really, she's actually, maybe she's had like minor tweaks, but really like she's

01:04:16.500 just aged so well and is so beautiful.

01:04:18.740 It's incredible.

01:04:19.500 If you see her in Dark Matter, she's got like the chin is like, oh, that's the Roosevelt

01:04:24.180 Island.

01:04:25.520 And then down, you know, it's like she's my age and she looks so good.

01:04:29.740 No, it's the one, this guy, the theory of Dark Matter is this guy comes up with sort

01:04:34.660 of a way to time travel.

01:04:36.880 You go into this black box and you go to an alternate universe in which you might already

01:04:43.280 exist.

01:04:43.760 Like you could sort of spy on another version of yourself.

01:04:47.380 And then as the series goes on, you realize like this guy has created like an infinite

01:04:52.800 number of alternatives of himself running around to the point where you no longer really know

01:04:58.600 who the original is because every clone has exactly the same memories and childhood experiences

01:05:04.440 of the original, thus kind of wiping out the original entirely.

01:05:09.620 Like there's no more like patient zero because they all have the same.

01:05:13.740 It's bizarre and it's great.

01:05:15.500 And I'm not generally into sci-fi, but I recommend this one.

01:05:18.720 You like it?

01:05:19.220 Yeah.

01:05:19.380 It's out now.

01:05:20.120 This sounds like Michelle Welbeck possibility of an island where the protagonist corresponds

01:05:24.340 with his future clones over time.

01:05:27.460 It's like a similar vibe.

01:05:28.380 If you could clone yourself, would you?

01:05:29.980 No.

01:05:30.480 No.

01:05:31.040 No?

01:05:31.320 I'm ready to die.

01:05:32.280 I don't care.

01:05:33.160 No.

01:05:33.660 I might do it.

01:05:35.000 What?

01:05:35.260 And then do what with your clone?

01:05:37.840 Ask the person for advice.

01:05:41.180 I just think it'd be cool.

01:05:42.620 First of all, my life would be a lot easier.

01:05:44.360 But I think we will all be cloned in the future because we're going to be AI deep faked.

01:05:49.580 Can I tell you like several rich people I know, I mean like very rich, are cloning their

01:05:54.400 dogs.

01:05:54.700 But yeah, didn't Malay do that?

01:05:59.180 The Argentinian?

01:06:00.500 Oh, did he?

01:06:01.060 Javier?

01:06:01.800 Yeah.

01:06:02.220 He cloned his-

01:06:02.720 Oh, yeah.

01:06:03.120 He was like in love with his German shepherd or something.

01:06:05.520 That's right.

01:06:05.920 And he's like had four that are all-

01:06:08.620 I can tell you for a fact, I will not be cloning Stredwick, my dog.

01:06:13.060 Okay.

01:06:13.620 So back to New York City, where I lived for 17 years.

01:06:17.320 You live now.

01:06:18.200 I live now, yeah.

01:06:18.920 There's a lunatic running for mayor, and I saw that he got your attention.

01:06:23.480 So he's one of these Democrat socialist types.

01:06:26.700 He's not-

01:06:27.900 He wasn't born in America.

01:06:29.400 Here are some fun facts about him.

01:06:30.680 This is not exactly a New York City story.

01:06:32.960 It's a leftist insanity story.

01:06:35.280 Here are some facts about him.

01:06:36.500 His name is Zoran Kwame Mamdani.

01:06:40.040 He's a New York City Assembly member.

01:06:42.340 He's running for mayor.

01:06:43.440 He wants to freeze the rent, make buses fast and free, and deliver free universal healthcare

01:06:47.520 or childcare.

01:06:48.860 It's free.

01:06:49.460 Free.

01:06:50.200 Trust me, you won't have to pay a dime.

01:06:52.320 He was born and raised in Uganda.

01:06:55.460 He moved to New York City age seven.

01:06:57.320 He graduated from the New York City Public School Systems, attended the Bronx High School

01:07:00.520 of Science.

01:07:01.100 He became a naturalized American citizen in 2018.

01:07:03.920 He represents the 36th district in this New York State Assembly, which is an immigrant

01:07:10.380 heavy slice of Queens, and he wants to be mayor.

01:07:13.300 Well, they just had their first televised debate in New York, and he had a lot of fun things

01:07:19.520 to say, including-

01:07:21.640 Hold on a second.

01:07:22.660 Yeah.

01:07:23.000 What is it?

01:07:23.400 46?

01:07:23.940 I lost my soundbite sheet.

01:07:25.760 Yeah.

01:07:26.040 Oh, yeah, yeah.

01:07:26.760 Let's do that.

01:07:27.640 46.

01:07:28.500 Take a listen to him.

01:07:29.160 I am Donald Trump's worst nightmare as a progressive Muslim immigrant who actually

01:07:35.160 fights for the things that I believe in, and the difference between myself and Andrew Cuomo

01:07:39.340 is that my campaign is not funded by the very billionaires who put Donald Trump in D.C.

01:07:44.380 Donald Trump would go through Mr. Vandami like a hot knife through butter.

01:07:49.500 He's been in government 27 minutes.

01:07:51.600 He passed three bills.

01:07:53.220 That's all he's done.

01:07:54.360 He has no experience with Washington, no experience in New York City.

01:07:58.240 He would be Trump's delight.

01:08:02.720 Okay.

01:08:03.600 Trump's delight.

01:08:04.480 What do we think of him?

01:08:05.840 Well, people have been screaming at me for days now because they're like, why are you

01:08:10.020 so negatively obsessed with this guy?

01:08:12.560 Is someone paying you to insult him?

01:08:16.560 And I'm like, I live in New York.

01:08:18.180 I have a kid.

01:08:19.260 He's running for mayor.

01:08:20.640 Yeah.

01:08:20.900 He probably won't win.

01:08:22.600 I'll insult him for free.

01:08:23.480 But come on.

01:08:24.900 And he's that clip.

01:08:27.400 Dasha shared it on Twitter a couple of days ago when I was we were coming home from some

01:08:31.640 event.

01:08:32.080 And it really put me in a bad mood.

01:08:34.260 That kind of like media trained decision to turn to the camera and brag about being a

01:08:40.780 progressive Muslim immigrant in that voice.

01:08:43.500 That's like a mixture of vindictive righteousness and nervousness.

01:08:49.200 You can tell he's mining for like a little moment, a little viral moment.

01:08:55.320 And I just I'm so insulted really by his policies that they're really like they're so flagrantly

01:09:03.780 empty rhetoric, like lip service to progressivism.

01:09:08.140 They're like low hanging fruit for rent freeze, which like, yeah, that sounds so good.

01:09:13.800 But it really only applies to already rent stabilized apartments that already can only be raised a

01:09:19.720 certain percent.

01:09:20.580 And like, yeah, rent freeze would be great, but it's not the most important issue in New

01:09:24.900 York's free buses, free bus.

01:09:26.920 Anybody who's working will have to pay.

01:09:29.780 Yeah.

01:09:30.140 I mean, I can sound off on the free buses because this is a boutique issue that's not

01:09:35.560 that's like very low on the political wish list of most people in New York City.

01:09:41.620 And we have bigger problems in New York City, such as given how high cost or how high the

01:09:51.800 cost of living is in New York City.

01:09:53.260 We have a real rampant vagrancy problem.

01:09:55.820 There are like homeless people being menacing, threatening on every block.

01:10:01.040 Not to mention relieving themselves in all ways in the middle of the sidewalk.

01:10:05.880 Yeah.

01:10:06.020 I live downtown.

01:10:06.980 The playground next door to me is completely taken over by homeless crackheads.

01:10:10.820 And, you know, I said this on Twitter, but this is like a homelessness incubator to to

01:10:15.660 promote a policy of free buses.

01:10:17.240 And the bigger issue with that is that these policies are basically designed for people

01:10:23.200 who already live subsidized or free in New York City.

01:10:25.840 They're there for the poor and who will be picking up the tab.

01:10:28.980 He's like a Brandon Johnson.

01:10:30.260 He's like a Chicago mayor for New York.

01:10:32.000 He wants to do to us what's happened there.

01:10:34.480 Here's another piece from him.

01:10:36.060 It's a campaign ad in Sop 48.

01:10:38.480 I'm Assemblyman Zohran Maldani, and I'm running for mayor to freeze the rent for every rent

01:10:46.040 stabilized tenant.

01:10:48.060 Wait, you're going to freeze my rent?

01:10:50.420 Yes.

01:10:51.740 Did I hear rent freeze?

01:10:53.900 Yes.

01:10:54.620 This guy's going to freeze the rent.

01:10:56.540 No hike?

01:10:58.240 None.

01:10:59.340 This guy's going to freeze the rent.

01:11:02.020 It's true.

01:11:02.960 As your next mayor, I will freeze your rent.

01:11:06.380 Paid for by Zohran for NYC.

01:11:08.920 I mean, I never thought I'd say this, but I'll take Andrew Cuomo.

01:11:12.940 Yeah, or Eric Adams.

01:11:14.340 I'll take anybody over this guy.

01:11:16.100 Yes, Eric Adams.

01:11:16.800 I'm only joking, by the way.

01:11:17.880 Don't vote for Andrew Cuomo.

01:11:19.000 Yeah.

01:11:19.320 Vote for Eric Adams.

01:11:20.580 He's the best option there is.

01:11:22.300 Well, he's running as an independent.

01:11:24.420 I don't even care if he's a grafting criminal.

01:11:27.240 I don't either.

01:11:28.040 I don't either.

01:11:28.540 I don't care.

01:11:29.240 I'm so shocked.

01:11:30.640 Cuomo's a criminal.

01:11:32.040 And I mean, I believe because of what he did to the nursing homes.

01:11:35.280 And you've got Eric Adams, who at least is starting to see the light and has at least

01:11:40.040 a background as a cop.

01:11:40.900 And then you've got this lunatic.

01:11:42.240 Like this guy frees the rent.

01:11:44.100 Like you say, like what what portion of New Yorkers have rent subsidization?

01:11:48.260 Like most people are paying through the nose.

01:11:50.400 I do.

01:11:50.960 You do?

01:11:51.340 I do.

01:11:51.680 So why don't you rent stabilization is a lot of New Yorkers actually have.

01:11:58.540 God, I never had that, even on my in my lowest earning days.

01:12:03.000 And you might have.

01:12:03.800 You might have not owned your rights.

01:12:04.920 Technically, if you live in a building that's more than six units that was built before 1970

01:12:09.620 or something, they can't raise your rent more than 2% on a year lease, 5% on a year lease.

01:12:15.540 I did not have that.

01:12:17.000 When I when I first moved to New York, I moved downtown.

01:12:20.440 I this is 1997.

01:12:23.220 OK, I was a very young lawyer and I moved to New York.

01:12:27.020 And this is, you know, I used to go hang out in the World Trade Center and get my coffee

01:12:30.660 and read the paper over there.

01:12:31.960 It's how long ago this was.

01:12:33.120 And I was right next to Trinity Church, which is where Alexander Hamilton is buried.

01:12:38.180 And it was down in the financial district, which now has had some more development, but

01:12:41.800 at the time was absolutely barren, you know, just complete concrete jungle.

01:12:47.060 I'll never forget moving in there because it was so stark and not warm, just cold, white

01:12:53.880 concrete everywhere.

01:12:55.460 And I was 26.

01:12:56.980 And I had one of those moments that you have in life where my phone wasn't on, my electricity

01:13:04.020 wasn't on, you know, nothing worked yet.

01:13:06.720 Like everybody had been supposed to they were supposed to have arrived that day to turn it

01:13:10.820 all on and they didn't.

01:13:12.080 So it was dark.

01:13:13.380 I had my boxes and I had concrete jungle around me.

01:13:16.420 And I walked to a hotel, the Millennium Hotel down there.

01:13:21.600 I'm trying to remember now.

01:13:22.440 And I called my mom on a pay phone, OK, like cell phones just started on 95.

01:13:29.120 And I called my mom crying like I felt so scared and alone and like, what have I done?

01:13:34.920 I don't know if it's a good idea.

01:13:36.340 And my mom was so great.

01:13:37.640 She said, you need to get some family pictures up.

01:13:41.100 You need to tomorrow.

01:13:42.280 First thing, figure out where your grocery store is, figure out where your dry cleaner

01:13:45.680 is smart, like take a walk around the block, familiarize yourself with your new neighborhood.

01:13:50.840 Take a deep breath and welcome to adulthood.

01:13:54.140 Yeah, it was great.

01:13:55.260 You know, I was like, so anyway, I don't know why I'm telling you this story, but that was

01:13:58.100 my life in downtown New York.

01:13:59.520 And it definitely was not rent subsidized.

01:14:01.060 And sadly, after the World Trade Center went down on 9-11, one of the plane's engines was

01:14:08.300 found on top of my old building.

01:14:10.860 That's how close it was.

01:14:12.580 Thank God I had left.

01:14:13.780 I had left in 2000 right before.

01:14:16.660 So it was like, by divine right order, I wasn't down there at the time.

01:14:21.380 Were you guys living in New York back then?

01:14:22.700 You were young.

01:14:23.920 No.

01:14:24.480 You were children.

01:14:25.140 We were, I was in high school and Dasha was probably in elementary school.

01:14:29.140 Yeah, yeah.

01:14:29.800 These are the moments.

01:14:30.620 I was in kindergarten.

01:14:31.520 Very long in the tube.

01:14:32.280 Um, no, but that like the 9-11 thing too, it's just crazy that, um, you know, New York

01:14:37.500 City, uh, experienced 9-11 and now we have this DSA candidate who's like panning to the

01:14:42.920 camera and saying, I'm a progressive Muslim immigrant.

01:14:45.420 His whole provenance is very sketchy.

01:14:47.640 He's launched this like ostensibly grassroots campaign with his funding that he gets as a

01:14:53.120 secret intelligence asset.

01:14:54.400 I'm sure, uh, his parents, uh, he only became a citizen, as you mentioned in 2018, didn't

01:15:02.240 seem to care much about citizenship up until then.

01:15:04.760 His parents are like these kind of global citizen types.

01:15:07.780 His mother is a, you know, it's a female filmmaker Friday.

01:15:11.460 She's a famous filmmaker.

01:15:12.860 His father is a academic who has like cushy sinecures at Columbia and the University of Uganda.

01:15:20.100 He studied, uh, his, um, specialty is, uh, Africana studies and colonialism.

01:15:26.280 Of course it is.

01:15:26.560 Uh, he, I think, you know, their attitude as, uh, my friend, Ina Stepman pointed out,

01:15:33.080 out was that, um, uh, citizenship is kind of a minor administrative matter, a trifle.

01:15:39.500 And I, that's kind of the attitude that he held until recently, as she says, up until the

01:15:44.140 point that he decided he wanted a position of power in the United States.

01:15:47.600 Does he have a chance?

01:15:49.000 I haven't been following the polls closely.

01:15:50.900 Well, he has a chance because I've hated on him so much that the leftists are going to

01:15:54.020 come out and drove.

01:15:54.800 So if he wins, my bad.

01:15:56.780 No, he's pulling AOC endorsed him.

01:15:59.960 Yes.

01:16:00.460 That's scary.

01:16:01.220 That's reason enough to vote against him.

01:16:03.000 Well, he's like AOC deja vu.

01:16:04.600 I mean, it takes me back to 2018 when we got in trouble because we were critical of the

01:16:11.900 AOC like campaign ad where she's switching from, um, sneakers to heels on the subway and bragging

01:16:18.200 about being like a barista or a bartender or whatever.

01:16:20.720 And you could tell that it's like totally fake astro turfed.

01:16:24.260 I really can't believe that anybody is falling for DSA candidates in 2020.

01:16:29.220 I know.

01:16:29.740 Neither can I.

01:16:30.340 It's so ridiculous.

01:16:30.780 Especially after all, like the day after 10 seven, they were in the middle of time square

01:16:34.760 chanting.

01:16:35.180 It's all Israel's fault.

01:16:36.880 Like, okay, this is kind of the end.

01:16:38.780 I think they were outside my apartment because I live by the Egyptian embassy.

01:16:42.400 They were writing piss reel on the sidewalk.

01:16:44.620 Wow.

01:16:45.100 October 8th.

01:16:46.440 Wow.

01:16:47.000 Ben Shapiro back in here.

01:16:48.640 Yeah.

01:16:49.120 What would he say?

01:16:49.920 I'm sure he would not be a fan of the DSA.

01:16:51.900 I can't believe they still exist.

01:16:53.380 All right.

01:16:53.920 Let's shift gears because there's a lot more to go over.

01:16:55.960 Uh, John Hamm is resurrecting his, he's having a renaissance of sorts in his career.

01:17:04.620 Like he would kind of went silent after Mad Men for many years.

01:17:07.360 By the way, whatever happened to Anthony or not Anthony, Andrew, Matthew Wiener, Matthew

01:17:13.660 Wiener.

01:17:14.360 He was the genius behind Mad Men.

01:17:16.200 Oh yeah.

01:17:16.780 He wrote it.

01:17:17.880 He was the showrunner.

01:17:18.980 And then he kind of just like went away.

01:17:21.600 He's just counting his money.

01:17:22.860 But that's how John Hamm became famous on Mad Men.

01:17:25.360 And he was brilliant as Don Draper.

01:17:27.880 And now he's back in this Friends and Neighbors.

01:17:30.660 Have you seen it at all?

01:17:31.620 No.

01:17:32.060 All right.

01:17:32.380 We just started watching it, Doug and I.

01:17:33.900 Okay.

01:17:34.820 And, uh, it's very interesting.

01:17:36.900 He's like a down on his luck financial trader guy.

01:17:40.920 I don't remember what area of finance he was in, but on the first episode, he loses his

01:17:46.060 job and you find out he lost his marriage because his wife cheated on him.

01:17:50.680 Amanda Pete.

01:17:52.160 And she's great.

01:17:53.520 Then he, I mean, spoiler alert, but you learned it in the first episode.

01:17:56.880 He becomes a thief.

01:17:57.980 So he has the advantage of living in this very rich community and knowing all these rich

01:18:02.820 people because he was one like yesterday.

01:18:04.540 Okay.

01:18:04.980 So they don't expect him at all.

01:18:06.460 And he knows when they're all at the local benefit for the children.

01:18:10.440 And he uses those knights to go into his friends' homes and starts burgling them and stealing

01:18:17.080 watches, et cetera, and then finds a fence, a fence for the, for the stolen goods.

01:18:21.960 Well, apparently we're a little behind.

01:18:23.780 Doug and I are only on episode three, I think, or four.

01:18:25.800 But in episode six, he and Amanda Pete, and I don't know whether this is a throwback, doesn't

01:18:32.240 matter, but he and Amanda Pete, his ex-wife, go into a church and steal the Eucharist and

01:18:41.420 start snacking on it.

01:18:43.120 Which I have to say, even as somebody, I am Catholic and I am observant.

01:18:47.980 We go to church every week.

01:18:49.020 I just had my two eldest kids confirmed is fucking bullshit.

01:18:54.960 Okay.

01:18:55.540 I say that as a Catholic.

01:18:57.880 Here's a scene in Sot 34.

01:19:02.400 Here we go.

01:19:02.780 Oh, that was upside down.

01:19:03.840 It's in.

01:19:04.460 Now watch.

01:19:05.340 You just give it a shot.

01:19:06.360 And I'm taking the lock into Jesus' house.

01:19:19.860 This is a church.

01:19:21.300 This house of worship.

01:19:22.080 You have to be very respectful.

01:19:34.380 You're going to hell.

01:19:35.620 Yes.

01:19:36.360 Tell me something I don't know.

01:19:37.820 Oh my God.

01:19:38.380 They open up the tabernacle.

01:19:39.660 They have the senior wafers here.

01:19:41.580 And they're snacking on them like triscuits.

01:19:44.060 Are we sure it's a Catholic church?

01:19:46.160 Yes.

01:19:47.980 They put jelly on them.

01:19:55.020 She's also showing shoulders.

01:19:56.940 No.

01:19:57.900 This is the least of their problems.

01:19:59.560 I know.

01:20:00.240 As a non-Catholic, I take offense to that.

01:20:02.320 This is disgusting.

01:20:11.020 I mean, I'm also Catholic, practicing, but I'm not so scandalized.

01:20:16.500 You don't care.

01:20:17.200 I mean...

01:20:17.700 You're rarely scandalized.

01:20:20.600 Sort of.

01:20:21.160 I guess.

01:20:21.700 Yeah, maybe.

01:20:22.360 But with that, it's like Hollywood is so secularized and hostile to Christianity and then Catholicism,

01:20:32.500 especially because it's the main one.

01:20:34.080 So I was going to say, if that's true, they're just so secularized.

01:20:36.380 Where is the film on showing somebody drawing the so-called prophet Muhammad?

01:20:41.280 We're going to make it.

01:20:42.660 You should.

01:20:43.600 I'll help bankroll it.

01:20:45.200 We'll be dead by 2026.

01:20:46.580 But that's the difference between Islam and Christianity.

01:20:49.580 Catholics are easier targets because of their own scandals and perceived hypocrisies.

01:20:57.180 And Catholicism, you know, through some fault of its own, has a lot of, like, cachet.

01:21:04.720 And it's like a sexy...

01:21:06.240 Well, they have the same bashing priests as, like, don't leave your daughter or your son alone with them.

01:21:10.280 I'd say, eh, unfortunately.

01:21:11.780 I think they did this on purpose to generate some kind of viral outrage or whatever.

01:21:17.740 They were like, let's do some...

01:21:18.980 What would be something...

01:21:20.120 You know, I can imagine the writers doing where they're like, let's do something scandalous.

01:21:23.440 The bunch of Jewish guys in the writers were like, let's pissing people.

01:21:27.860 I'm not a diehard Catholic.

01:21:29.500 I don't know scripture.

01:21:30.840 Like, I'm not one of those people.

01:21:32.140 I listen to, like, my pal John Rich talk about the Bible.

01:21:35.940 And I sit in awe just learning.

01:21:38.320 But I am a believer.

01:21:40.740 And I'm a Catholic.

01:21:42.980 And I have to say, like, that is the most sacrosanct thing they could take to bash.

01:21:48.600 Sure.

01:21:49.260 And having just been through my two kids, like, my son should have been confirmed a year earlier.

01:21:53.700 We just slept on the job.

01:21:55.640 So he and his little sister, who's a year younger, got confirmed at the same time.

01:21:59.300 But as part of confirmation, they made the kids watch one of those videos about how sacrosanct the communion wafer is and how they genuinely, we genuinely believe it is the body of Jesus Christ.

01:22:14.700 And about how our former Pope, Pope Francis, came from this diocese in Argentina where they did experience a miracle.

01:22:25.440 They found a communion wafer on the floor of the church.

01:22:28.860 And somebody brought it to the church or to the priest to say, somebody must have dropped this.

01:22:33.540 And there's a whole protocol they're supposed to go through when that happens.

01:22:36.700 You have to, like, lock it up or whatever.

01:22:38.160 And they did that, and the thing was bloodied after a couple of days.

01:22:43.620 They called in an outside agency.

01:22:45.800 They tested it.

01:22:47.060 They found actual, like, flesh, DNA.

01:22:49.940 You can believe or not believe that's—but I'm just saying, for Catholics, we believe that that's the actual body of Jesus Christ.

01:22:57.320 And fuck you for using it for your PR.

01:23:00.600 It's a sacrament.

01:23:01.840 It's—yeah, it's whole—it's absolutely.

01:23:03.840 But I think, like, people in entertainment understand that they have, like, plausible deniability because they can say, well, this is art.

01:23:09.260 It's supposed to entertain you, titillate you, make you think, whatever.

01:23:13.260 It is safe.

01:23:14.080 It's like—it's like the left loves to practice, like, safe racism against Italians and Irish who happen to make up the bulk of the Catholics in the United States.

01:23:22.880 Right, right.

01:23:23.280 Like, probably a rising—

01:23:24.460 My people on both sides.

01:23:25.480 Yeah.

01:23:26.460 Well—

01:23:26.940 I mean, well, charitably, I'll say also, maybe on the next episode, they get struck down by God.

01:23:32.540 Yep.

01:23:32.660 Oh, no, no, I think they do.

01:23:33.840 Yeah, have you been watching?

01:23:34.820 No, no, I'm just saying, like, maybe they'll learn a hard lesson.

01:23:38.420 Who's on National Review was—and he's very Catholic.

01:23:41.040 He's a much better Catholic than I am.

01:23:42.780 Maybe you, too, but I don't know.

01:23:43.700 But he's very devout.

01:23:44.980 And he was saying something bad, something very bad does happen to the characters.

01:23:49.240 Oh, okay, so there you go.

01:23:50.280 Yeah, I do think—maybe there's divine right order.

01:23:52.000 That's in service of a plot.

01:23:54.460 I'm a little tipsy, so I'm just going to circle back to Zoran Mamdani for a minute, because it just occurred to me that his parents gave him the name, the middle name Kwame, which has nothing to do with his heritage on either side, to prime him for a life in politics.

01:24:10.600 Which is so much more sinister than any of this, like—

01:24:14.600 That's what we should really be exercised about.

01:24:17.060 Yeah.

01:24:17.220 Well, Maureen Callahan, who's got a show within the MK Media Network, opened her podcast, which has been a total hit, going off on Jon Hamm.

01:24:25.700 And I was shocked, because I loved Mad Men, and I loved Jon Hamm, like most people who enjoyed that show.

01:24:35.080 And she revealed this dark history of the guy, where she found the police report where he absolutely hazed, to the point of alleged criminality, a kid in college.

01:24:51.620 In, like, a fraternity?

01:24:53.220 Yes, to where the kid had a broken spine and was, like, tortured by him, allegedly, according to this police report.

01:25:01.780 And it—if one word of it is true, the guy's a sociopath.

01:25:06.380 I, like, I was shocked.

01:25:07.980 He's a male actor, so.

01:25:09.900 Well, I can't—like, it was—but if you watch this show, you can sort of see playing the absolute asshole comes very easily to this guy.

01:25:18.420 Yeah, maybe Don Draper wasn't so far out of his reign.

01:25:21.640 Maybe he's not a great actor.

01:25:22.780 Mm-hmm.

01:25:23.200 He's just playing himself.

01:25:24.460 Have you ever been across from somebody like that?

01:25:26.080 You know, you were across from Greg.

01:25:27.360 He was so good.

01:25:28.480 What's his real name?

01:25:29.420 Nick Braun.

01:25:30.040 Yeah, in succession.

01:25:31.140 He seems like a genuinely nice guy.

01:25:33.020 Oh, yeah, he is.

01:25:33.740 He's wonderful.

01:25:34.860 I feel like he couldn't play that level of asshole the way Jon Hamm can.

01:25:40.140 I wonder.

01:25:40.680 Well, he's in that movie Cat Person.

01:25:42.300 Do you remember that story?

01:25:43.260 I actually haven't seen it.

01:25:44.260 There was a story in The New Yorker that's about, like, a problematic age gap relationship.

01:25:49.000 Yeah.

01:25:49.180 They ended up making the movie.

01:25:50.740 Yeah.

01:25:51.220 How many years is too many?

01:25:53.660 For us?

01:25:54.580 I don't know.

01:25:55.340 While we're on the topic, what do you think?

01:25:58.360 I mean, it's just a number.

01:26:00.020 I think it more just depends.

01:26:01.840 It's, you know, if you're 50 and they're 70, but if you're 10 and they're 30, you know?

01:26:09.280 It's not even a moral question.

01:26:10.840 It's a practical one, especially if you want kids.

01:26:14.720 Yeah.

01:26:14.920 I think it just really just depends.

01:26:16.880 Yeah.

01:26:17.560 I don't know.

01:26:18.060 Like, I was surprised when I interviewed Caroline Leavitt that she had a husband who is 30 years older than she is.

01:26:24.680 I think she's 27 and he's 56.

01:26:28.440 Yeah.

01:26:29.020 So.

01:26:29.780 How did they meet?

01:26:30.860 I can't remember.

01:26:32.000 She did tell me.

01:26:32.820 I think when she was running, she ran for office.

01:26:35.100 She ran for Congress.

01:26:36.540 And she met him then.

01:26:37.860 But they fell in love.

01:26:38.920 Now she's got a young baby and it's working.

01:26:41.160 I like, well, I kind of go by the woman.

01:26:43.320 She seems like she's got her head on her shoulders.

01:26:45.580 Right.

01:26:46.080 So for whatever reason, who knows?

01:26:48.320 You know, like we all have weird things in our past that make us, that drive our decision making.

01:26:52.300 If it works, it works.

01:26:53.680 Yeah.

01:26:53.940 So far it seems to be working for her.

01:26:55.720 Yeah.

01:26:56.000 All right.

01:26:56.180 Stand by.

01:26:56.840 We've got to take a break and we're going to sip on these martinis some more and then we'll pick it back up with the ladies from Red Scare next.

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01:29:24.720 I'm Megan Kelly, host of The Megan Kelly Show on SiriusXM.

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01:30:23.840 We've got to talk a minute about Blake Lively and Justin Baldoni.

01:30:32.620 I'm very into this whole lawsuit because it's like completely self-destructive of her.

01:30:38.860 I don't know if she's doing this because she has a self-destructive streak

01:30:41.520 or because she just didn't anticipate the backlash she was going to be getting by making these claims.

01:30:46.700 But they, in my opinion, have fallen apart claim by claim in the months since she made them.

01:30:52.660 I don't know anything about this.

01:30:54.880 This started because she was kind of being a bitch on the promotional tour.

01:31:00.200 Yep.

01:31:00.620 Her public conduct wasn't excellent.

01:31:04.340 Yeah.

01:31:04.740 And so then she tried to deflect by implicating.

01:31:09.240 Well, people noticed that she had unfollowed him and that he wasn't in any of the cast pictures.

01:31:14.600 And meanwhile, he's the co-star.

01:31:15.920 I mean, there are equals in this movie.

01:31:17.180 What is the movie?

01:31:17.880 It's about domestic abuse.

01:31:19.480 Okay.

01:31:19.800 And so he's the abuser and she's the abused.

01:31:21.960 Okay.

01:31:22.300 So it's like life imitates our.

01:31:26.560 Well, yeah.

01:31:27.200 That's what she would say.

01:31:28.200 Yeah.

01:31:28.560 But he's the director.

01:31:30.080 And it was his film.

01:31:31.220 He directed it.

01:31:32.060 Yeah.

01:31:32.540 So he's wailing on her in the film.

01:31:35.260 Right.

01:31:35.680 Okay.

01:31:36.060 He optioned the book.

01:31:36.920 He got Blake Lively to star in it.

01:31:39.020 And then things went south when she claimed she'd been Me Too'd on the set.

01:31:42.760 And they had to bring in.

01:31:43.800 Oh, Josh's dad is going to write a note about this.

01:31:46.360 He doesn't.

01:31:47.860 And I just spilled her martini on herself.

01:31:51.620 So we're getting to that point of the program.

01:31:53.740 Anyway, so they've been.

01:31:55.380 Now, she filed an HR complaint with the California Human Rights Council and leaked it to the New York Times.

01:32:03.420 Yeah.

01:32:03.720 This is my memory.

01:32:04.820 So double check me because I, too, am drinking the martini.

01:32:07.620 But leaked it to the New York Times.

01:32:08.820 You girls are facing yourself.

01:32:10.120 I'm really not this time.

01:32:11.440 Well, it's.

01:32:12.200 It's okay.

01:32:12.440 We only have like 10 more minutes of show.

01:32:14.020 We've got to get on it.

01:32:14.880 Yeah.

01:32:15.060 And he filed a defamation lawsuit against the New York Times.

01:32:19.980 Then she, after that, filed the claim against him saying, you harassed me.

01:32:24.060 Then he counterclaimed against her saying, you've been defaming me.

01:32:27.540 These are lies.

01:32:28.360 And now what we saw this week was, Justin's represented by my lawyer, Brian Friedman, who is who you want.

01:32:35.780 If you remember in a bare knuckled bra.

01:32:37.840 He's an M-F-er in the best sense.

01:32:40.540 Love that.

01:32:41.380 So she filed a claim against him, a counterclaim for intentional infliction of emotional distress.

01:32:48.600 And these are pretty notorious as bullshit claims in the law.

01:32:53.580 And his lawyers, understandably, did what every defendant receiving one of these claims does, which is file a motion to compel her to turn over her medical records so we could see the distress.

01:33:05.640 Like, okay, you want us to pay you for your distress?

01:33:08.980 What is it?

01:33:09.660 What did you say to your psychiatrist?

01:33:11.720 What expenditures have you had in like trying to fix it?

01:33:15.320 Like a jury's going to have to figure this out.

01:33:17.300 We're entitled to see it.

01:33:18.520 And she ran into court and said, never mind.

01:33:21.800 I want to withdraw that claim.

01:33:23.640 Okay.

01:33:24.720 Okay.

01:33:25.180 So either she just doesn't want us to see her medical records, like what she's been saying to her shrink.

01:33:30.840 Or the claim is false.

01:33:32.260 Or the claim is bullshit.

01:33:32.820 I think it's the former.

01:33:33.780 Or both.

01:33:34.300 I think she doesn't want us to see the medical records.

01:33:36.980 God only knows what's in there.

01:33:38.000 But he, I mean, her maid adversary in life now has a legal right to see the records, which is a nightmare for her.

01:33:44.520 But you shouldn't have filed that claim.

01:33:45.860 Any lawyer would have told her, this is a dangerous claim because you're going to have to back all these claims up about how poorly,

01:33:52.540 you know, you've been affected, how terribly you've been affected by him.

01:33:55.540 So she goes into the court and says, I want to dismiss those claims without prejudice so that I can refile them all the way up to trial if I decide to.

01:34:05.780 Can you explain that?

01:34:06.440 You're the lawyer.

01:34:07.080 It just means that when you dismiss it without prejudice, you can always refile.

01:34:10.400 There's no downside to you.

01:34:12.380 You pull your claim.

01:34:13.520 It doesn't reflect poorly on you for having done that.

01:34:16.100 Well, I mean, it might, but she's basically trying to like hedge her bets so that now she could go to a psychiatrist and be like, boo-hoo.

01:34:23.660 Okay, here are my records.

01:34:24.920 Right?

01:34:25.200 Like between now and next March, which is when the trial is scheduled for, she could spend every day in with a shrink being like, Justin's ruined my life.

01:34:32.820 And then maybe she'd refile and be willing to turn over her records then.

01:34:37.200 I have no idea what's up this woman's sleeve.

01:34:38.820 She's clearly, in my opinion, very devious and not trustworthy.

01:34:42.120 So she asked the court if she could dismiss with prejudice and the court said no.

01:34:47.520 This Judge Louis Lyman wrote, citing here from Variety and Tatiana Siegel on June 3rd, wrote that that day, Baldoni's motion to compel these materials denied based on plaintiff's representation that the claims will be withdrawn.

01:35:05.820 Now, Blake Lively's request that because the parties have agreed to dismiss her causes of action on this front, the court should exercise its authority to dismiss these claims without prejudice is also denied.

01:35:19.780 The parties must stipulate as to whether the dismissal is with or without prejudice.

01:35:25.760 And the court says if the claims are not dismissed, the court will stop her from offering any evidence of her emotional distress.

01:35:32.300 So she's not allowed to say she's had all this emotional distress and then not turn over these records so that they can dispute it.

01:35:38.940 So she just got majorly effed.

01:35:41.880 She's not going to.

01:35:42.820 She wanted to proceed with this claim without offering any backup for it.

01:35:46.940 And when his team said, let's see the proof, she pulled the claim, tried to keep the threat over them.

01:35:52.960 And the judge said, that is not going to happen.

01:35:55.280 You're pulling the claim with prejudice, meaning you cannot refile it or your claim stays and you turn over the records.

01:36:02.920 Your choice.

01:36:04.020 So, well, she's clearly operating.

01:36:06.640 I think she's just clearly operating on like a older Me Too model where those sorts of things wouldn't have been rejected or people would have taken them at face value or someone could have had a, you know, trial in the media.

01:36:19.540 That was then implicated them.

01:36:21.820 I guess that's what she was trying to do was to give him a trial in the media.

01:36:25.540 I remember when I first caught wind of the story and I didn't fully understand what was happening and still don't understand to this day.

01:36:31.260 I was like, oh, it's like two egomaniacs fighting.

01:36:33.800 But I guess it's her really trying to smear him.

01:36:36.260 To ruin his life.

01:36:37.480 Yeah.

01:36:37.960 I mean, she's like.

01:36:38.820 After he had the grace to put her in a movie.

01:36:40.680 To put her in a movie.

01:36:41.280 I know.

01:36:41.920 And if you read the emails between them and the texts, this guy bent over.

01:36:46.160 It was Blake Lively.

01:36:47.120 Nobody really knew who Justin Baldoni was.

01:36:48.900 Right.

01:36:49.080 And he bent over backwards as you would expect to make her happy, to like make her feel good about her weird fashion choices and her, you know, she was a little larger because she just had a baby.

01:37:00.540 Oh, no.

01:37:01.320 He was so nice to her about it.

01:37:03.180 You know, like when now in her lawsuit, she paints him as being a complete jerk.

01:37:07.600 Uh-huh.

01:37:08.160 Cream it up.

01:37:08.880 Yeah.

01:37:09.220 Yeah.

01:37:09.640 That's what you get.

01:37:11.260 Man, fellas, no good deed goes unpunished.

01:37:14.980 Honestly.

01:37:15.840 Well, on the subject of physicality, I want to ask you about this.

01:37:20.760 It's in The Cut, which is part of New York Magazine.

01:37:24.180 And they are taking aim at this woman named Liv Schmidt, who's a 23-year-old model in New York, who encourages her followers to, quote, live the skinny girl lifestyle.

01:37:36.020 Skinny with an I at the end of it.

01:37:37.680 By following her weight loss advice, they talk about this young, this 37-year-old teacher named Emma, who broke up with her boyfriend.

01:37:45.600 She stumbled on this woman's TikTok.

01:37:48.080 Schmidt had more than 600,000 followers.

01:37:50.480 She's very beautiful.

01:37:51.540 Mm-hmm.

01:37:52.640 And-

01:37:53.320 She looks kind of like Facetune Julia Fox.

01:37:55.360 She's hot.

01:37:56.080 They're all Facetuned.

01:37:57.440 Mm-hmm.

01:37:57.780 Mm-hmm.

01:37:57.980 But New York Cut is pointing out that in one video, she mocks women who wear sundresses to hide their puffy face and bloated bodies.

01:38:05.960 And she once re-posted a TikTok with the caption, girls be 300 pounds, saying, I'm a snack, no Megatron, you're the effing vending machine.

01:38:14.200 And they're taking aim at her for fat shaming, and they don't quite understand why she has so many followers who sign up for her DMs and her chat groups when they're trying to lose weight like this gal Emma was or stay thin and talking about, like, her advice.

01:38:31.960 They say, they write about how she gives recipes, workout videos, diaries of everything she eats in a day.

01:38:36.980 Um, members post their step counts, their meal plans, and their before and after photos.

01:38:42.580 And this gal Emma writes about how suddenly she felt weak and exhausted all the time.

01:38:49.040 She was on the treadmill, and she had to get off after a minute, lightheaded and drenched in sweat.

01:38:54.580 She wasn't quite doing that well and following the weight loss tips.

01:38:59.520 And, um, that she, I guess many people feel like it's an unattainable, like, goal.

01:39:05.200 These number of steps and these low-calorie diets, and they experience hair loss and dizziness, and is this really just encouraging anorexia?

01:39:13.240 I've got my own thoughts on it, but I'm more interested in your takes.

01:39:16.280 Well, what's your take?

01:39:17.800 Well, the eating disorder community is one of the biggest female communities online, and it's existed since the early days of the internet and continues to.

01:39:27.740 So, I don't know why Liv Schmidt is getting really the heat for, like, a culture that exists online around dieting.

01:39:36.420 And she doesn't seem like she's even, like, brought Anna in the, you know, where they're, like, competitively.

01:39:42.600 She's not tragically.

01:39:43.340 And there are certainly in a site.

01:39:45.040 Yeah.

01:39:45.460 There are, and they combine, like, female vanity with, like, male autism because they're so obsessive about.

01:39:52.640 So, yes, maintaining the low weight and, like, calorie counting, and it's not even, like, fun or cool.

01:39:59.240 Yeah, it's like a cry for hell.

01:40:00.740 But in Liv Schmidt's case, that doesn't seem to be the case.

01:40:03.360 I don't see what differentiates her from, I mean, there's so many lifestyle influencers.

01:40:08.340 Well, my own take on it is somewhat jaded because when I was on NBC, I talked to this woman who was, like, incredibly fit.

01:40:16.460 She'd just given birth to three kids, and she was basically like, what's your excuse if you don't look amazing?

01:40:21.760 Because she just had three kids, and she looked incredible.

01:40:25.240 And this woman was talking about how she kind of regretted the message because she got a bunch of blowback, and she was just trying to say, you can do it.

01:40:32.760 Right.

01:40:32.960 But she did it inartfully.

01:40:35.000 But sometimes that works for people.

01:40:36.380 Well, I said to her when I was in law school, I used to say, because I lived with my mom and my stepfather for the last year, I'm like, if you see me get up to go back into that kitchen, please call me fat ass or say something negative to me to keep me out of there.

01:40:48.180 And then it was Meghan McCain, frankly.

01:40:50.640 But many others ginned up a backlash against me for, like, fat shaming.

01:40:55.720 And I regret to tell you that I then went on the air and, like, apologized for it.

01:41:00.000 Like, okay, I know.

01:41:01.620 And now with the benefit of, like, some years between that episode and today, I'm like, you know what?

01:41:06.260 Fuck those people who shamed me.

01:41:07.860 That's how I stayed thin.

01:41:09.520 And I look good.

01:41:11.340 And I don't judge people who don't go that course, but fuck those people who judged me.

01:41:15.640 It helped me stay in shape and stay healthy.

01:41:17.960 And, by the way, not for nothing, but the reason I had a stepfather who's now passed is because my actual father died of a heart attack at age 45.

01:41:27.620 So it actually is really important to stay thin and watch your weight.

01:41:31.860 I'm sick of people, like, skinny shit.

01:41:34.180 My dad died of a heart attack at 52 because he had, you know, diabetes, heart disease, the whole nine yards.

01:41:39.220 There are just way more health risks to being overweight than there are to being underweight.

01:41:42.960 Right.

01:41:43.900 That's just the truth.

01:41:44.780 It's the truth, yeah.

01:41:45.560 Like, okay, you lose some hair and develop osteoporosis.

01:41:50.460 You're not going to have a heart attack.

01:41:52.000 Though there's a cure to osteoporosis, and yet we haven't figured out how to cure heart attacks.

01:41:56.960 But I think people, like, okay, I'll put it this way.

01:41:59.380 I think that people, like, a Meghan McCain, let's say, who, by the way, I'm a big Meghan McCain truther.

01:42:04.200 I think she's one of the most beautiful girls out there.

01:42:06.640 She's just a little heavy, but she has great bone structure.

01:42:09.080 That's being a truther?

01:42:10.180 A truther of Meghan McCain.

01:42:11.060 People hate when I say that, but she is cute.

01:42:15.560 I think people who are, like, overweight and struggle with their weight are jealous of people who are willing to have the discipline and the vanity to go through with it.

01:42:27.080 That's really what it comes down.

01:42:28.140 It's easier to say that you're being hurt and shamed than to just take accountability.

01:42:31.180 Yeah, people, when we first started the podcast, that was one of the first points of criticism leveraged against us, was that we were fat.

01:42:39.520 No, that we were fatphobic.

01:42:41.120 That we made disparaging remarks about fat people or whatever.

01:42:45.240 And how did you handle it?

01:42:46.840 We doubled down.

01:42:47.960 Yeah.

01:42:49.300 Why did I even ask?

01:42:50.360 But here's what's so annoying about it.

01:42:54.120 Like, I come from a long line of fat people.

01:42:57.800 My mother loves it when I say this, but I do.

01:43:01.200 My nana, her mom was obese.

01:43:03.840 She lived to 101, by the way.

01:43:05.840 She's, like, crazy.

01:43:07.340 My mom was always overweight.

01:43:09.960 She's now on the thinner side, but she's 83.

01:43:12.680 My sister was morbidly obese and had a gastric bypass.

01:43:17.680 Yeah.

01:43:18.200 Wow.

01:43:18.740 So, like, I have a long line of heavy people who I love.

01:43:23.420 So you're kind of, like, overcompensating.

01:43:25.600 Well, no, no.

01:43:26.100 I just feel like I will not be fucking shamed out of my opinion.

01:43:28.980 Obviously, I have nothing against overweight people.

01:43:31.260 You know, they're the people I've loved most in my life.

01:43:33.780 But I also had my dad die very young on me at a young age.

01:43:37.800 I'm like, I'm just not going to let this happen to me.

01:43:40.280 I'm going to make different choices so that I can live.

01:43:43.800 That's how I feel.

01:43:44.600 And I also am much more vain than my nana was or my mom is.

01:43:49.020 Well, that's what it comes down to.

01:43:50.360 It's, like, some of us are more vain than the others.

01:43:54.200 And I think people really resent that because they see vanity as, like, a very grave sin.

01:43:58.800 And it's really not compared to all the other ones.

01:44:01.300 Yeah.

01:44:01.640 I mean, we all, like, I don't see anything wrong with vanity because if it helps you stay thin, which is healthy.

01:44:09.460 It's fine.

01:44:10.240 I mean, like, all things, like, it's good in moderation.

01:44:12.500 Like, I think if the vanity takes over your life and makes it impossible for you to, like, take care of your children or something like that.

01:44:19.840 Or you become Catwoman with the plastic surgery.

01:44:22.920 I have seen this one, like, Instagram influencer around who clearly has, like, advanced anorexia.

01:44:27.920 And she somehow managed to give birth to children.

01:44:30.880 Oh, my God.

01:44:31.680 And they're, like, kind of involved in her, like, brand and grift.

01:44:36.680 That's upsetting.

01:44:36.840 And I find that to be upsetting, yeah.

01:44:38.900 That's a separate mental illness.

01:44:40.780 But we've, like, crossed over from this point of, like, we used to bully fat people, like, when I was growing up in the 70s, and that was wrong.

01:44:47.060 Yeah.

01:44:47.480 Sure.

01:44:47.800 I remember instances like that with my mom that upset me, like, or mean about her.

01:44:53.080 And I hated that.

01:44:54.700 She's such a good, funny, amazing person.

01:44:57.500 So I would never be that person.

01:44:59.000 In no way would I bully somebody who, because eating is difficult to control for a lot of people.

01:45:03.420 Fully and another thing to make a statement of facts.

01:45:05.860 And I feel like amongst, like, with my family and, like, my other Russian friends, I feel like it is okay to just say, hey, you're fat.

01:45:15.280 I'm telling you that you're fat because I love you.

01:45:18.360 And I don't want you to be fat because you're going to get sick.

01:45:20.900 Would you say that to your friend?

01:45:22.920 Some of them, yeah.

01:45:24.200 Have you said that to anyone?

01:45:25.820 Eugene.

01:45:27.100 Eugene.

01:45:28.420 Would you say it to Anna?

01:45:30.000 If she got fat, maybe.

01:45:31.400 If I got fat.

01:45:31.960 If she got fat, I might tell her.

01:45:33.740 You need that friend.

01:45:34.600 And Josh is like, you're fat.

01:45:36.200 You need that friend.

01:45:36.700 You need to reel it in.

01:45:37.940 Well, that's the thing now.

01:45:38.980 Like, well, you have a daughter, don't you?

01:45:40.600 A son.

01:45:41.020 A son.

01:45:41.500 Okay.

01:45:41.800 So it's less, a little less complicated.

01:45:43.160 It's much better because he's naturally really skinny and taken up for his father.

01:45:47.340 Well, you have to think about this stuff when you have a daughter.

01:45:50.820 Because.

01:45:51.000 Right.

01:45:51.280 You don't want to give her a complex.

01:45:52.300 You don't want to give her a complex.

01:45:53.200 You definitely don't want to encourage an eating disorder.

01:45:55.020 But you want to be honest about, like, if you sit down and have a bag of Doritos at 12 o'clock.

01:46:01.960 At night.

01:46:02.500 Yeah.

01:46:03.140 Especially as you start to age, you will pay for it.

01:46:06.420 Like.

01:46:06.820 Yeah.

01:46:07.220 I mean, people are very nasty to me specifically.

01:46:09.500 And they'll say, like, it's a good thing she has a son, not a daughter.

01:46:12.300 Because if she had a daughter, she would really, like, ruin her life and her self-esteem.

01:46:16.100 I don't think that's true.

01:46:16.120 But that's, like, just not true.

01:46:17.280 I would.

01:46:19.040 Much like I don't inflict my, like, political and ideological convictions on my child.

01:46:24.320 Same.

01:46:24.500 I would never ruin their perception of themselves because of my own.

01:46:31.980 Right.

01:46:32.360 Like, hang-ups or whatever.

01:46:33.720 But, yeah.

01:46:34.820 I think, like, you just have to.

01:46:35.960 As a parent, you just have to lead by example.

01:46:37.720 It's not, like, the advice or the discipline you give them.

01:46:40.320 It's how you live your life that really counts.

01:46:42.580 That's right.

01:46:43.400 Well, like, what's the point of this whole piece in New York in the cut?

01:46:49.180 I think it's to, you know, under the auspices of taking, like, a fair and balanced look at this woman's product.

01:46:54.960 What they're really trying to do is shame her for being too quick to participate in shaming young girls who are fat or, like, shaming fatness in general.

01:47:05.280 Well, now it seems especially, like, poorly timed because with Ozempic and stuff, like, people who are formerly body positive, like Adele or probably some other, like, they all go.

01:47:17.060 If they, when they can, they do.

01:47:18.460 They lose the weight.

01:47:19.780 Lizzo.

01:47:19.840 Lizzo's going to be thinner than we are soon.

01:47:22.060 What's her name?

01:47:22.760 Who?

01:47:23.840 Barbie.

01:47:24.620 Barbie.

01:47:25.400 Who's she?

01:47:26.540 Which one is that?

01:47:27.120 She was an actress on it.

01:47:27.480 She was, like, the fat girl in Euphoria.

01:47:29.200 She was really pretty, but fat.

01:47:30.980 But her whole plot line was about how she was fat and, like, yeah.

01:47:33.880 Now she's shredded.

01:47:35.420 She slimmed down.

01:47:36.280 Yeah.

01:47:36.720 Of course, very few actually say that they're doing Ozempic.

01:47:40.780 My hairstylist and I always used to joke that if they really wanted to push those COVID vaccines on people, they would have put some Ozempic.

01:47:47.540 People would have been rushing to get the next, I'll take the 25th shot.

01:47:51.560 It's fine.

01:47:54.020 I don't know.

01:47:54.660 I just feel like there's another element to this, to be honest.

01:47:58.260 And it is attractive people have, there are polls, like, there are studies that show they do better in society.

01:48:07.500 They get, they're quicker to get jobs.

01:48:09.120 They're quicker to get promotions.

01:48:10.660 That makes sense, yeah.

01:48:11.420 And that can be, like, it doesn't mean you have to be, like, born winning the genetic lottery, but it means it's better to stay put together.

01:48:19.660 Like, put a little makeup on, like a little cover up.

01:48:22.860 Like, do your hair.

01:48:24.320 Buy a nice outfit.

01:48:25.260 Tuck in your shirt.

01:48:25.960 Like, have good posture.

01:48:27.660 Walk in there looking put together.

01:48:30.780 And if you can keep your weight, you know, at a, like a healthy level, it will help.

01:48:37.980 It's not to say you can't be trusted.

01:48:39.820 And while that, if you're an overweight person, again, my own mom is, has had a life.

01:48:44.580 There's plenty of, like, fat geniuses who exude insane charisma.

01:48:49.420 And my mom is very successful and very funny.

01:48:52.080 She's always like, stop telling everybody I'm fat.

01:48:56.500 She's so funny.

01:48:57.480 But I'm just saying, like, what I would like for my kids is that they keep it within certain lines so that they stay well, they're perceived well, and they feel well.

01:49:06.500 Yeah.

01:49:07.120 I mean, that's the health is really the biggest.

01:49:09.260 But the left is still in a different place of, like, trying to shame people out of saying that.

01:49:14.700 What do you do to stay thin?

01:49:16.700 I don't eat much.

01:49:17.940 There you go.

01:49:18.720 Yeah.

01:49:19.800 It's not easy.

01:49:21.660 It's like low-grade calorie restriction, which nobody wants to talk about.

01:49:25.600 The best thing that ever happened to me was I have, like, my primary care physician is, like, a fattest.

01:49:33.800 He is very against weight gain.

01:49:36.420 So I'd go in there, and I would have put on two pounds, and he'd be like, put on two pounds.

01:49:41.300 I was like, that's like water weight from, like, a Monday to a Thursday.

01:49:44.720 And he's like, do you know how many two pounds adds up to be over 10 years?

01:49:48.380 You'll never lose 20 pounds.

01:49:49.740 Then you're fat.

01:49:50.780 That's true.

01:49:51.220 I know he's, like, really against gaining weight.

01:49:55.180 And it's not because he cares what I look like.

01:49:57.440 It's because he shows me the chart every time I go in there of the number of diseases that go up your risk for all of them as you gain unnecessary weight.

01:50:05.680 It's true.

01:50:06.100 It's because three out of four of my grandparents lived into their 90s, and they were always, like, in relatively good shape.

01:50:14.900 And my father's generation, like, the boomer generation really wasn't.

01:50:21.240 And there's a bunch of, like, political reasons for that with regard to the Soviet Union.

01:50:25.940 But a lot of it is just, like, keeping, like, they were starving.

01:50:30.000 They were starving.

01:50:30.800 They were alive during NEP in the Soviet Union.

01:50:33.420 What do you gals do?

01:50:34.060 Because you're both thin.

01:50:34.900 Like, how do you stay thin?

01:50:36.280 I do weight training.

01:50:37.880 That helps.

01:50:38.600 If you build muscle.

01:50:39.380 I do weight training, too.

01:50:40.240 I work out with a personal trainer.

01:50:41.740 And I eat.

01:50:42.200 Get some muscle on there.

01:50:43.200 It will eat calories.

01:50:43.980 I go to the gym every day and, like, eat moderately.

01:50:47.980 Like, I eat what I want.

01:50:49.260 I do Pilates occasionally and weight train, and I eat.

01:50:52.800 I don't, like, I'm not, like, a live-to-eat person anyway.

01:50:58.060 Do you eat three meals a day?

01:51:00.520 No.

01:51:00.920 No.

01:51:02.100 That's what my fattest doctor said when I was 46.

01:51:05.420 He goes, when you're 50, you're not going to be able to eat at all anymore.

01:51:08.580 And I was like, well, what should I do?

01:51:09.780 So get it all in now.

01:51:10.680 Not at all.

01:51:11.540 Like, no more eating?

01:51:12.940 And I was like, what am I going to do?

01:51:14.080 And he said, OMAD, which stands for one meal a day.

01:51:17.820 Oh.

01:51:18.300 Now, I can't do that.

01:51:19.300 That's not good.

01:51:20.160 Well, I've heard that intermittent fasting and stuff like that is really bad for women specifically.

01:51:24.160 It's still too many.

01:51:24.680 I have heard that, but I do do it, but I don't do it quite as radically as I used to.

01:51:28.540 I stop eating around 8 p.m.

01:51:30.640 That's good.

01:51:31.280 And then I usually have breakfast at 10 a.m.

01:51:34.100 So I'm on a 14-hour.

01:51:36.700 And I like that.

01:51:37.840 And I read Dr. Dale Bredesen's book on the end of Alzheimer's.

01:51:41.540 He's been on the show.

01:51:42.160 I'm very paranoid about getting Alzheimer's.

01:51:43.880 Oh, yeah.

01:51:44.740 Do you have it in your family?

01:51:45.840 No, but I'm just paranoid about it.

01:51:47.360 Like Sandra Doe O'Connor got it on the Supreme Court.

01:51:50.420 Like, anybody can get it.

01:51:52.000 It's a terrible.

01:51:52.740 It doesn't matter how much you use your brain.

01:51:53.860 Just because you've got to do the crossword puzzles.

01:51:56.940 I'm totally trying.

01:51:58.260 I mean, notwithstanding this martini in front of me, I swear, I'm doing everything in my power to stop Alzheimer's.

01:52:04.160 No, it's good.

01:52:04.800 But it's like that famous line that I keep quoting from John Cassavetes' husbands.

01:52:09.900 And he's like, it's not the smoking or drinking that'll kill you.

01:52:12.920 It's the stress.

01:52:13.480 Like, if you stress out about things, like, you should have, like, a martini every now and then.

01:52:17.840 Every now and then with the girls, yeah.

01:52:19.580 I don't stress, and I do have the martini, so I'm not sure I have this excuse.

01:52:23.780 You'll be fine.

01:52:24.660 I think so, too.

01:52:25.440 I feel like not being a stressed out person is...

01:52:28.580 Well, it also makes you thinner because stress is like cortisol and gives you the midsection up.

01:52:34.740 Well, that's the one downside of drinking is you go out drinking.

01:52:37.600 Yeah.

01:52:37.980 Like, not now in the middle of the day.

01:52:39.580 But if we were to go out tonight, Friday night, and then wake up tomorrow hungover,

01:52:43.640 we'd all eat too much.

01:52:44.800 Yeah.

01:52:45.280 That's the biggest danger.

01:52:46.300 No, it's the cycle.

01:52:48.340 So, I don't know.

01:52:49.200 They say, like, the best exercise is pushing yourself away from the table.

01:52:53.780 I'll tell you what I eat.

01:52:55.180 I generally eat around 10 or 10.30 before the show.

01:52:59.980 I just found a great new yogurt.

01:53:02.940 I was eating that fahe yogurt.

01:53:05.140 It's an old phage.

01:53:06.160 Yeah.

01:53:06.400 But then Dr. Mark Harmon came on and told me you should be eating grass-fed, which I didn't

01:53:12.680 even think of in my yogurt.

01:53:14.860 Of course, we all think of that in our milk.

01:53:16.680 Yeah.

01:53:16.980 But I didn't even think, yes, that's totally right.

01:53:19.060 Also milk.

01:53:19.500 Yeah.

01:53:19.620 But it's the same thing.

01:53:20.260 So, Maple Hill.

01:53:21.400 You can find it at Whole Foods.

01:53:22.780 I buy this one, yeah.

01:53:24.940 Both organic and grass-fed and Greek.

01:53:29.060 I don't like the regular yogurt.

01:53:30.220 I like the stuff that's a little thicker.

01:53:31.740 So, you have a little yogurt.

01:53:32.740 I have that with some berries at around 10.30 in the morning, and that gets me through the

01:53:38.420 show.

01:53:38.740 And then after the show, I usually have like a salad with a little protein in it and like

01:53:43.660 two tablespoons worth of dressing that doesn't have seed oil in it.

01:53:47.680 And then at dinner, I have a protein and a vegetable.

01:53:50.980 Yeah.

01:53:51.280 And that's really what I eat.

01:53:52.600 And I do have a little bit of a sweet tooth.

01:53:54.700 Like, I will, maybe three nights a week, have a small thing of like ice cream.

01:53:59.900 Oh, that's fine.

01:54:01.100 Yeah, that's totally fine.

01:54:02.120 And this, this works.

01:54:03.780 Like, I feel like that is a very reasonable diet for a 54-year-old.

01:54:07.100 No, there's so many like fad diets, but avoid completely cutting out one thing or only eating

01:54:12.800 one type of food.

01:54:13.760 And that's, I think, very wrong.

01:54:16.340 Do you guys have like a general diet that you eat?

01:54:19.180 Tell me what you eat.

01:54:19.940 Well, I'm kind of like, I'm eating more because I'm sort of fertility-packing.

01:54:25.420 Yes, you do.

01:54:27.360 So, I'm like taking supplements.

01:54:30.220 Oh, that's exciting.

01:54:31.000 You know.

01:54:31.440 Oh, I can't wait until you get pregnant.

01:54:32.660 And so, yeah, I'll drink.

01:54:34.100 I'm like drinking a little more milk and trying to like, I don't know.

01:54:37.840 Oh.

01:54:38.400 Eat like a sweet potato.

01:54:39.780 I'm 34.

01:54:40.560 Yeah.

01:54:40.820 So, you got, you got a lot of time.

01:54:42.100 You have time, yeah.

01:54:42.600 Yeah.

01:54:43.420 I think you're going to conceive this year.

01:54:45.960 I was 34 when I conceived.

01:54:47.700 So, I think.

01:54:48.000 Okay.

01:54:48.980 And your son is how old?

01:54:50.160 Four.

01:54:50.900 Okay.

01:54:51.160 So, you're 38.

01:54:52.080 39.

01:54:52.600 39.

01:54:53.000 Right.

01:54:53.220 So, you.

01:54:53.780 Well, you still have like, I don't know if I believe anymore in metabolism.

01:54:57.680 Like, I'm starting to doubt that.

01:55:00.040 No, metabolism is real.

01:55:01.960 I don't know if I believe it.

01:55:03.260 Because you eat.

01:55:03.980 What do you guys mean?

01:55:04.720 Like, if you did the OMAD, your metabolism would be worse.

01:55:08.880 I think that's right.

01:55:09.500 Because then your body would be like.

01:55:10.980 I think your metabolism increases when you do like weight training.

01:55:14.980 Yes.

01:55:15.320 Because you have more muscle.

01:55:16.360 It's like very basic.

01:55:17.340 Like all of this stuff.

01:55:18.260 There's so many like fad diets, influencers.

01:55:22.040 Esoteric health advice.

01:55:23.740 And it's just very basic.

01:55:24.920 You have to build muscle and moderately calorie restrict.

01:55:29.260 Yep.

01:55:29.620 That's like literally and get, eat protein and.

01:55:32.760 You can move a little.

01:55:33.600 That'd be good.

01:55:34.520 Yeah.

01:55:34.780 Yeah.

01:55:35.100 Like get your 10,000 steps in.

01:55:37.440 It helps having a toddler because I carry him around a lot.

01:55:40.660 And it's like kind of natural, spontaneous weight training.

01:55:45.400 Yes.

01:55:46.260 That's when I, when I had my three kids, my left arm got so strong because I'm right handed.

01:55:50.940 But you've constantly got your kid on the other side, on the non-dominant side.

01:55:54.860 Yeah.

01:55:55.180 So I look forward to your, are you ready?

01:55:57.220 I am.

01:55:57.580 I look forward to seeing you with that left arm.

01:55:58.860 You're going to have one weird deformed arm.

01:56:01.200 And stronger and stronger.

01:56:02.260 But yeah, I think that's, that's exactly right.

01:56:05.200 And I, I don't know.

01:56:05.760 I just think like, as I've done shows on this, I am, I really believe, notwithstanding what

01:56:14.220 my fattest doctor says, you can eat in your fifties.

01:56:17.420 But I, I had a pair come on this show.

01:56:20.600 Steve, can you find the episode where we had our friends come on to talk about seed oils?

01:56:25.780 And it was like life changing.

01:56:28.460 I was like, oh my God, what am I, what have I been doing?

01:56:30.900 These seed oils I'm convinced are really bad and give you bad fat.

01:56:36.320 That's true.

01:56:37.020 But it's harder to get rid of.

01:56:38.720 It's hard to say because like, we're like Russian.

01:56:40.740 So we, I think, ingest a lot of seed oil.

01:56:44.280 Well, because we eat like sprouts and stuff.

01:56:46.980 Wait, so you're backing seed oil?

01:56:48.520 No, no, no, no.

01:56:49.180 I, I agree with you guys, but like I do fundamentally just.

01:56:53.800 I don't think it's as bad.

01:56:54.880 I was very, I talked to a nutritionist at one point and I told her, I said something about

01:56:59.680 seed oils and she was like, what are you talking about?

01:57:02.120 And I was like, I was like, I was like, well, they cause inflammation.

01:57:04.940 And she was like, are you worried about inflammation?

01:57:07.580 Like, what are you?

01:57:08.300 Isn't every woman at this, at this point, well, at this point I was pretty underweight and she

01:57:12.080 was like, you need to, you could be inflamed.

01:57:13.840 She was like, you should just eat and not worry about like, she's like, don't worry about

01:57:19.120 the peanut butter.

01:57:20.120 Well, they were saying, but by the way, I love peanut butter.

01:57:22.240 Sometimes I'll have like a, an Ezekiel toast or just I'm into sourdough now.

01:57:28.040 You get it.

01:57:28.920 When I started eating bread, did you see that?

01:57:31.120 Who did?

01:57:31.500 Gwyneth Paltrow.

01:57:32.280 I've got a lot of issues with her.

01:57:34.080 Well.

01:57:34.940 But yes, but you know what?

01:57:36.780 I respect her eating plan.

01:57:39.080 Like I, I love that she shares it with us.

01:57:41.120 I have to say she's weird and I've got some objections to this woman, but I like that she

01:57:46.200 shares her eating plan and what she's learned.

01:57:49.020 You can take it or leave it.

01:57:50.380 But like, I, I'd take that any day over these.

01:57:53.080 I just drink a lot of water.

01:57:54.720 Right.

01:57:55.080 Yes.

01:57:55.440 Liars.

01:57:55.960 Yeah.

01:57:56.260 Bullshit artist.

01:57:57.060 Does she still smoke a cigarette once a week or whatever she's lying about?

01:58:00.380 I hope so.

01:58:00.640 I saw her at one of my favorite New York city restaurants, Elio's, by the way, if you need

01:58:07.220 a place to go in New York, don't blow it up.

01:58:09.760 I know there's that, but it's amazing.

01:58:11.900 It's great.

01:58:12.400 It's Italian and it's so good.

01:58:14.640 Yeah.

01:58:14.820 Up or East.

01:58:15.340 And the pasta, that's what you need to get.

01:58:17.900 It's so good that the pasta that has the ham and the cream and the peas.

01:58:23.420 That sounds amazing.

01:58:24.480 Wait, let me ask you this dog.

01:58:26.540 Does he, he's just naturally thin because he's a guy.

01:58:29.320 Doug's he watches it.

01:58:31.440 So Doug has a sweet tooth.

01:58:32.520 That's his biggest risk.

01:58:33.680 But he always says he's lived his life by, uh, if you put on a few pounds, cut a meal

01:58:41.140 out or cut a meal in half.

01:58:43.560 I'm like, that is the simplest and it works.

01:58:47.500 That easy.

01:58:48.080 Right.

01:58:48.540 So he doesn't really do a ton of snacking.

01:58:51.160 That's key.

01:58:52.140 Snacking is kind of the devil.

01:58:53.600 Snacking is the death of all women.

01:58:55.780 Yeah.

01:58:55.880 We love snacking.

01:58:56.980 It's, it's like, do something else.

01:58:58.520 Drink a glass of water.

01:58:59.540 Go for a walk.

01:59:00.340 Call a friend.

01:59:01.660 Smoke a cigarette.

01:59:02.360 Do anything other than go into the pantry.

01:59:06.360 Really?

01:59:06.860 Yeah.

01:59:07.260 But Doug is very like, he does.

01:59:09.540 He'll cut a meal out or cut a meal in half.

01:59:11.880 And he's very thin.

01:59:13.340 I don't know.

01:59:13.920 Like in a good way.

01:59:15.080 He's like svelte.

01:59:16.100 Yes.

01:59:16.560 I know.

01:59:17.920 They're amazing.

01:59:18.400 I'm very jealous of men.

01:59:19.580 I look at my son and he has perfect eyebrows and eyelashes that I would pay good money for.

01:59:23.580 And I'm just, I literally showed my lash extension girl, a photo of my husband's eyes.

01:59:30.060 Cause he has like, are you getting the fake?

01:59:32.220 You have fake lashes on there?

01:59:33.080 I have fake ones on now.

01:59:34.320 So my, but my concern, I had those for a while when I was at Fox and I felt like they were

01:59:37.980 ruining my actual eyelashes.

01:59:39.760 They do a bit, but I had, I have like three things this week.

01:59:42.760 So I just did it.

01:59:43.500 You just did it.

01:59:44.000 And I did it for the wedding.

01:59:45.180 But usually I wouldn't.

01:59:46.520 It looks natural.

01:59:47.740 They don't look fake.

01:59:48.760 Yeah.

01:59:48.860 They look, they don't look fake.

01:59:50.080 They're so brown.

01:59:51.020 That's why they're subtle.

01:59:52.260 Oh.

01:59:52.740 Oh, you didn't go for black?

01:59:54.180 Mm-mm.

01:59:54.540 Oh, that's interesting.

01:59:55.300 No, you can't.

01:59:56.000 Cause if you're fair, it just looks weird and kind of trans.

01:59:59.140 Well, I put my, my makeup on heavily, you know, obviously for the show.

02:00:02.980 Do you do your own makeup?

02:00:03.980 Yeah.

02:00:04.440 Oh, wow.

02:00:05.060 Yeah.

02:00:05.480 Cool.

02:00:05.860 I don't do my own hair.

02:00:07.220 Well, that's, that's, yeah, I would do the same.

02:00:09.200 After all these years, like my stylist said, we should teach Yardley, my 14 year old, how

02:00:13.880 to blow out her hair.

02:00:14.660 Cause she's got tons of thick, beautiful hair that she takes after Doug.

02:00:18.700 Um, and I was like, yeah, you should show her.

02:00:21.160 I have no idea.

02:00:22.000 After 20 plus years in this business, having, watching it get blown out every day when I

02:00:27.140 was at Fox, I have no idea how to do it.

02:00:29.060 It's this whole scale.

02:00:29.880 I don't either.

02:00:30.380 My hair always just looks like shit.

02:00:31.940 I don't know how to style it.

02:00:33.040 Well, you want to hear something funny?

02:00:34.000 So we're going on vacation next week and we're going to be like on a beach and it's, and,

02:00:38.240 uh, so I have hair extensions and my, my audience knows I don't, I don't make any

02:00:41.660 secret of it.

02:00:42.140 Okay.

02:00:42.340 I was going to, I was going to ask.

02:00:43.640 Oh yeah.

02:00:43.880 I couldn't grow hair like this if my life depended on it.

02:00:46.220 I, my hair, it's nice.

02:00:48.060 Like it's nice hair.

02:00:49.000 It's, this is my, all my hair and this is some of my hair, but like this way down here.

02:00:53.340 And, um, so I'm going to take the extensions out for my vacation.

02:00:57.040 Cause I don't know how to, and she's going to give me a halo.

02:01:00.720 Do you know the halo?

02:01:01.900 No, it's like a little, you clip it in yourself.

02:01:05.460 It's like a, it's like picture a headband.

02:01:08.160 That's almost in percent, in percent, imperceptible and it's got hair on it.

02:01:13.000 So you put it on.

02:01:13.920 I'll show, I'm going to show the audience how to do it.

02:01:15.780 When I learned, Sarah's going to show me on Tuesday.

02:01:18.060 So you put it like under your hair, your, your actual top hair, and then it kind of hangs

02:01:23.000 down.

02:01:23.260 But that way I can like be myself during the day when we swim and whatever.

02:01:27.140 And then is this a couple's vacation or a family vacation?

02:01:30.800 It's fam.

02:01:31.600 Oh, that's nice.

02:01:32.600 And now that the kids are older, you can call your trip a vacation.

02:01:37.360 That's true.

02:01:38.320 You know, when they're four, it's a trip.

02:01:40.700 Right.

02:01:41.600 Right.

02:01:41.840 You're going to find yourself.

02:01:42.800 You have to go to like a resort.

02:01:45.580 Right.

02:01:46.060 And like, it's hard labor.

02:01:48.020 Yeah.

02:01:48.580 It's, it's fun.

02:01:49.340 You love your child.

02:01:50.200 You love being with them.

02:01:51.480 Well, that's why I went island hopping for my honeymoon.

02:01:53.280 Cause I was like, that's going to be way harder to do with a child than something like

02:01:57.780 going to a different place.

02:02:00.060 What do you mean?

02:02:00.520 Island hopping?

02:02:01.480 Well, I went to Greece.

02:02:02.580 Oh yeah.

02:02:02.840 Right.

02:02:03.040 Just throughout Greece.

02:02:04.560 Um, we went in the Cyclades.

02:02:06.700 Um, we went to Idra, Ciros, Tinos, Mekinos, but like, yeah, wrangling a child and getting

02:02:14.080 on a ferry.

02:02:14.860 It's like, that's something you want to do kind of coupled or alone.

02:02:17.920 Well, what was that like?

02:02:18.720 Was it like on your honeymoon in Greece with your like new husband?

02:02:24.320 Was it complete?

02:02:25.460 Was it Shangri-La?

02:02:26.260 What was that like?

02:02:26.940 Yeah.

02:02:27.300 No, I kept like kind of thinking I having this kind of banal thought, but I was like getting

02:02:31.660 married is so romantic and I feel like that's a lot, you know, and what's he like?

02:02:38.340 He's great.

02:02:39.580 He's very, um, what's he like?

02:02:42.560 And I mean, um, he's my favorite of Dasha's boyfriend.

02:02:46.520 Sure.

02:02:47.020 I'm good.

02:02:47.740 Um, who I love them all to death, but they're, he's very calm.

02:02:52.060 He's very, he's very gentle, kind Christian.

02:02:54.820 Did you mean not a pushover?

02:02:56.440 No, he's actually Orthodox, but yeah, he's, he's a carpenter.

02:03:00.940 No, no, American, American, full American.

02:03:04.580 Yeah.

02:03:05.380 So what, he's a carpenter.

02:03:06.780 So how did you guys meet?

02:03:07.960 We met through mutual friends and like the, through the art world that he had like, was

02:03:13.500 friends with, but had worked for it before.

02:03:14.680 So he's a carpenter.

02:03:15.640 Was he like at all intimidated by your weird Hollywood life?

02:03:20.640 I think maybe initially.

02:03:23.040 Yeah.

02:03:23.580 He felt like he didn't really understand why I was so interested in him.

02:03:27.840 Um, but I always really liked him and he always made me feel really like good.

02:03:32.420 Your age.

02:03:33.420 Apropos.

02:03:34.000 He's a little older, but like two years.

02:03:35.600 I just did this long interview with Jordan Peterson, which was actually really interesting.

02:03:40.240 How's he doing?

02:03:42.400 Better.

02:03:43.120 Like health wise, he's better.

02:03:44.980 It was a very interesting interview.

02:03:48.180 I have to tell you, like it was one of the most interesting interviews I've ever given.

02:03:52.520 Is it live now?

02:03:53.580 Yeah.

02:03:53.900 It's, it's out there on his, on his feed.

02:03:55.540 I think there's no problem in setting out those honest truths, which are your life will be

02:04:02.000 happier if you have a partner and children.

02:04:05.120 I just think that's just true.

02:04:06.740 And people should be told that.

02:04:08.300 And then they should be told the realities of, of fertility, because those are realities

02:04:13.060 that, you know, can be potentially meddled with, but there's no guarantee.

02:04:17.040 And if you cannot, if you're one of the people who cannot meddle with it and you missed your

02:04:21.140 window, it will be a lifelong regret that will be unsolvable and will be like a deep

02:04:26.740 source of pain, an ongoing deep source of pain.

02:04:29.460 So it's not something that you could easily brush off.

02:04:31.520 And so all those truths need to be shared while at the same time prizing and sharing the

02:04:38.100 fullness of the rewards of motherhood with young women, which isn't done.

02:04:43.780 He's very, he's brilliant.

02:04:46.280 And he's come on this show a couple of times.

02:04:48.380 And when he came on the most recent time, we had a great hour and a half where he said

02:04:53.180 all of his things and I loved it.

02:04:54.620 And when it ended, he said something like, you're very useful.

02:04:59.800 What does that mean?

02:05:00.880 Useful.

02:05:02.160 It amused me.

02:05:04.280 Well, I think Jordan's very focused and in a good way on what's happening to young men

02:05:09.620 in our culture.

02:05:11.220 And I think Jordan didn't know if I was like a raging feminist who was kind of the enemy

02:05:18.120 with blood coming out of her, whatever.

02:05:22.280 Well, like whether I was like this sort of like, I hate men kind of gal, he just didn't

02:05:28.040 know me very well.

02:05:29.420 And so I think he was kind of like checking it out.

02:05:32.520 And when we talked on my show, he heard enough to like satisfy himself that I wasn't a threat

02:05:39.220 to what he stands for.

02:05:40.420 That was my own take.

02:05:41.820 Then he invited me to go on his show.

02:05:43.800 And he had a lot of negative things to say about like some women, which I didn't totally

02:05:49.640 reject.

02:05:50.140 Like we're not perfect and we haven't had a uniformly perfect role in society and history

02:05:55.580 and formation of humanity, et cetera.

02:05:59.960 But I, we were, it was an, it was like, there was some tension there because I think I'm more

02:06:04.420 bullish on women than he is.

02:06:06.460 Right.

02:06:06.940 So I wanted to give him his valid points, but I also felt somewhat defensive of our sex.

02:06:12.520 I didn't want us to be grouped and disparaged as a group.

02:06:15.700 Well, in his like critiques of, or like his mentorship of men, he's addressing inadequacy

02:06:23.380 that I feel like men, because they can't, they don't have as much to offer as they used

02:06:30.800 to.

02:06:31.500 Women don't have the incentives to be as like.

02:06:34.280 What do you mean?

02:06:34.600 Because they're all, they're all like rendered.

02:06:36.220 Well, they're all on a problem.

02:06:37.420 I mean, neither side has the incentive to commit to the other side, obviously.

02:06:42.000 And I don't think women not also, yeah, they don't want to be like the docile kind of

02:06:47.400 like, I don't know, Petersonian model of femininity because men are not able to rise the occasion

02:06:55.120 to like, well, let me ask you, let me ask you, cause he said to me, he and his wife are coming

02:07:00.360 up with like guidelines for young women on who, and he raises a good point.

02:07:06.440 It was a legit point on how so many go career and then realize too late, holy shit, totally

02:07:13.980 forgot to nurture relationships.

02:07:15.740 Now I'm 38 with no romantic prospects and my eggs are not great.

02:07:22.180 And I'm effed like the available men don't necessarily, you know, who want kids.

02:07:28.980 They're not like, let me find a 38 year old.

02:07:30.600 They're more like, let me find a 28 year old.

02:07:32.600 And so that's real.

02:07:34.820 Like that was a legit dynamic that he was pointing out.

02:07:37.060 And he was saying like, we're trying to come up with these like guidelines for young women

02:07:39.900 and like, consider doing it this way because you've been misled by third wave feminists

02:07:44.180 into thinking you can have it all and you can have it all at the same time.

02:07:48.920 And I just thought that was a very interesting proposition.

02:07:52.020 And I think what they were leaning toward, though he hadn't finalized, it was like, do get

02:07:56.440 married, do have kids in your 20s and maybe push the career off until the 30s where you

02:08:02.720 will be able to generate something and get something going.

02:08:05.000 But like you can't necessarily generate fresh young eggs when you're out here promoting

02:08:10.000 teen pregnancy.

02:08:11.140 That's down across the board.

02:08:12.620 I don't disagree exactly, but it's you.

02:08:17.080 That was when women were like, you know, trapped in traditionalist marriages where they didn't

02:08:21.620 have income.

02:08:22.600 That's why it was so hard for them to leave because they it's not so easy to just start

02:08:26.300 a career.

02:08:28.640 So what would you say to him?

02:08:32.200 Yeah, that there's just has to.

02:08:33.420 Well, it's just the it's the dual income household is the real the realism of that's

02:08:41.360 reality for most young people.

02:08:43.460 So, yes, you should have a job.

02:08:46.400 You should find a way to have some income, but you shouldn't like devote your life maybe

02:08:51.860 to being the most successful in some field if what you want is a family and you just have

02:08:58.380 to be honest with yourself.

02:08:59.220 It's hard to identify what you want in life and whether you want a family.

02:09:05.040 I think people young people struggle with that because we're all so brainwashed to kind

02:09:10.600 of be antinatalist, not want children because it's like an infringement upon our ambitions,

02:09:16.320 our lifestyle, that sort of thing.

02:09:18.540 And the PR around it has gotten so negative when it should be so positive.

02:09:23.000 And I think like all the dating discourse that you see on the Internet is profoundly like

02:09:26.780 toxic and unsound because it's like reactive and retarded.

02:09:31.140 And basically, there's no way to game the system.

02:09:33.360 It is a crapshoot.

02:09:34.200 It is unclear whether you will meet the person who's right for you.

02:09:37.400 That's just like what everybody has to reckon with.

02:09:39.700 Well, he was raising a good point, which was that I'm going to botch this, but he was basically

02:09:45.200 saying if you look at the averages of like the number of dating relationships the average

02:09:49.920 person will have, they're relatively few.

02:09:53.060 I think he said it's like maybe five.

02:09:55.020 Yeah, that makes sense.

02:09:55.800 Because if each relationship is like a year or two, plus the recovery time, plus the time

02:10:02.040 it takes to meet somebody new, he's not wrong.

02:10:05.680 So you build that into the process from like 20 forward, then you are looking at like by

02:10:11.860 age 30, those have happened.

02:10:14.520 I was like, God, this is really stark.

02:10:17.280 But then there are situations like mine where I did marry somebody at age 30 and I divorced

02:10:21.560 that person at age 35.

02:10:23.840 And later in my 35th year, I moved out from Dan in February of 2006.

02:10:28.860 And I met Doug in July of 2006.

02:10:31.340 Like it can happen, but everybody always looks at me and they're like, oh, that's extraordinary.

02:10:35.180 You know, like it's like one in a million and your career is one in a million.

02:10:38.740 And I don't, I'm more of the abundance mindset that we discussed earlier.

02:10:41.800 Where I'm like, it's not one in a million.

02:10:43.900 You can manifest it for yourself too.

02:10:45.720 Like you can.

02:10:46.760 And then when I say that people call me like a fourth wave feminist, like you're just a

02:10:50.220 conservative feminist.

02:10:51.160 I'm like, no, I'm a, I'm an optimist.

02:10:53.080 Yeah.

02:10:53.800 Power of positive thinking.

02:10:55.420 Yeah.

02:10:55.800 Yeah.

02:10:56.300 Retain, you know, maintain hope.

02:10:57.880 Yeah.

02:10:58.360 That's how I feel like, like it will happen for you if you make it happen for you.

02:11:01.800 You believe it can happen.

02:11:03.540 And then you like, you have to manifest it.

02:11:05.600 I know that sounds nuts, but I believe in it.

02:11:08.660 And, but you have to also be willing to make sacrifices.

02:11:11.000 Like we were, we're talking about this recently.

02:11:13.260 That's so much of the like dating market conversation is so problematic because so many

02:11:19.940 people, men and women like overvalue them themselves.

02:11:23.180 And people ask like, what can you do for me versus what can I do for you?

02:11:27.700 Yeah.

02:11:27.900 This is what Jordan would say too.

02:11:29.280 I mean, it's a lot of these women are like, he's not good enough.

02:11:31.800 Right.

02:11:32.060 Or it's like, well, what are you, what are you bringing to the table?

02:11:35.140 And it's like, it's unfathomable for me to go into a relationship thinking like, what,

02:11:40.340 what can he do for me?

02:11:41.480 Can he pay my bills?

02:11:42.540 Can he like make me feel good about myself?

02:11:44.420 Like that's the wrong narcissistic way of going about it.

02:11:48.160 You have to ask yourself, um, whether you're willing to love another person.

02:11:53.960 And of course they have to be in on the game too, as to be a mutual thing, but it's outrageous

02:11:58.400 that people, I mean, you should expect a baseline of like positivity.

02:12:02.060 And like love and care and affection, but people expect so much from another person without

02:12:08.260 giving anything in return.

02:12:09.400 Well, that's the thing.

02:12:10.800 Now that's, that's it right there.

02:12:12.400 Yeah.

02:12:12.620 Like I've taken heat for saying, you know, I, I want to be a working woman, which I am,

02:12:19.520 but I still want Doug to open my door for me.

02:12:21.860 Yeah.

02:12:22.140 And I want him to do all the gentlemanly things that he does for me.

02:12:25.860 And people say like, Oh, what is that?

02:12:27.680 You know, like, what is, so what, what are you committing to?

02:12:29.740 But my own feeling is there's nothing incongruous with those two goals.

02:12:34.120 I also am a working woman, but feel like I have primary responsibility generally for

02:12:40.160 the housework we haven't made.

02:12:42.180 I'm not going to, I'm not trying to fool anybody, but like as between me and Doug, I'm

02:12:47.000 more likely, but you manage the household.

02:12:48.980 Yes, I am.

02:12:49.580 And I'm more likely to like, I mean, I take care of all like presents and birthdays and

02:12:54.400 like celebrations.

02:12:55.000 Like, I know that's, and like, that's what are the dinner plans?

02:12:57.440 Like, that's generally women's work.

02:12:59.460 And I'm fine with that.

02:13:00.600 I don't, I don't mind that.

02:13:01.680 I enjoy it.

02:13:02.300 Like, I love taking care of him in that way.

02:13:04.920 And there are other ways too, which I'm fine with, right?

02:13:08.440 Like, even though we have this sort of atypical on paper relations, just, just given my success

02:13:14.080 in broadcasting.

02:13:15.420 Right.

02:13:15.740 I, I like being more traditionalist in some ways.

02:13:18.540 I don't think it is incongruous.

02:13:20.240 No, not at all.

02:13:21.340 Yeah.

02:13:22.140 We should all go on Jordan the next time together.

02:13:24.560 That would be fun.

02:13:25.680 You guys should go on with him.

02:13:26.940 I actually want to make that happen.

02:13:28.440 You should.

02:13:28.900 We've been trying to get him on our show.

02:13:31.300 Oh, I'll, I'll, I'll reach out to him.

02:13:33.420 Yeah.

02:13:34.020 I think he would really enjoy this.

02:13:35.280 He loves intellectual stimulation.

02:13:36.420 Yeah, we would get along, but he, um, I taught, I don't know if I should say this

02:13:39.880 aloud, but, um, I know like his assistant or public, I don't know what this guy does

02:13:45.480 for him, but he mentioned that like, uh, they just have very like hard quotas for like

02:13:50.320 viewership or something like that.

02:13:52.160 Yeah.

02:13:52.460 Oh, before you can get on his show.

02:13:53.720 Yeah.

02:13:53.980 Yeah.

02:13:54.180 Yeah.

02:13:54.260 So that makes sense.

02:13:54.800 He is a star.

02:13:55.400 Like very bottlenecked.

02:13:56.440 Yeah.

02:13:56.940 Oh yeah.

02:13:57.720 But you know what?

02:13:58.100 Did you see his debate?

02:13:59.800 Which one?

02:14:00.340 He went on that Jubilee show.

02:14:01.760 Oh, Jubilee.

02:14:02.500 They asked me to go on Jubilee.

02:14:03.800 Oh, don't do it.

02:14:04.900 I said no.

02:14:05.540 I said no.

02:14:06.580 But it would be bad.

02:14:07.400 Don't do it.

02:14:08.280 I don't want to do it.

02:14:08.520 You're way better than that.

02:14:09.820 I just feel like this is not my jam.

02:14:12.040 Well, they had him debating as a Christian debating 20 atheists.

02:14:17.500 Oh no.

02:14:18.500 But then one of the Christians or atheists asked him point blank if he was a Christian and he

02:14:24.440 wouldn't say that he was.

02:14:25.540 What?

02:14:25.680 So he changed the title of the YouTube video to like non-atheist.

02:14:29.860 Did he say this is something?

02:14:32.120 That's actually quite clever.

02:14:34.060 That kid made news.

02:14:35.640 Yeah, he was a little annoying and trollish, but he got his point across.

02:14:40.960 So Jordan's not a Christian?

02:14:42.640 He wouldn't identify as a Christian, at least.

02:14:45.760 Yeah.

02:14:46.180 Super.

02:14:46.520 Even in the purposes of this debate where he was a sensibility.

02:14:50.340 Well, that's actually really interesting.

02:14:52.320 Now that makes me want to watch it.

02:14:53.340 But I just thought like, why do I want to debate a bunch of possible know-nothings on

02:14:59.180 my core issues?

02:15:00.500 About what?

02:15:00.860 Did they even give you a suggestion?

02:15:02.260 They let it be up to me.

02:15:03.480 But I was like, I lazy.

02:15:05.660 Plus, I'm not like, I'm not that person in the culture.

02:15:08.920 I'm not like a culture warrior.

02:15:10.520 I have thoughts, but I'm more about facilitating conversations than being like a main debater

02:15:16.200 and killer of other people's points.

02:15:18.260 I'd be more likely to be like, oh, that's actually really interesting.

02:15:20.980 Go on.

02:15:21.580 Yeah.

02:15:22.160 You know, then being like, you're wrong.

02:15:24.280 You suck.

02:15:25.640 So I don't think I'm right for that show, but you know, it's my kids.

02:15:30.080 It's fun.

02:15:31.320 Have you, did you, have you been on it?

02:15:33.480 Oh, yeah.

02:15:34.320 I mean, I won't.

02:15:35.720 I might go on it.

02:15:36.740 Speaking of Ben Shapiro, he goes on it.

02:15:38.960 Okay.

02:15:39.500 And Charlie Kirk goes on it.

02:15:41.100 And Jordan goes, like, these are, you know, they're combative.

02:15:44.060 Right.

02:15:44.280 I know people think I'm combative, but I'm not exactly combative like that.

02:15:47.300 No.

02:15:47.800 No.

02:15:48.280 I'm only combative when you stumble upon one of my core issues, which tend to be just natural

02:15:51.980 truths and you're lying about them.

02:15:53.760 Yeah.

02:15:54.280 But you're not, you're not trying to own people.

02:15:56.000 No, not at all.

02:15:56.980 And they are, because they're dudes.

02:15:58.400 No, I'm a, I'm a learn-it-all.

02:16:00.520 I don't know at all.

02:16:01.820 You know, anyway, it's so much fun.

02:16:04.700 I don't even know what, it's 2.30.

02:16:06.320 We've been here forever.

02:16:07.620 For so long.

02:16:08.240 We got to go.

02:16:09.060 You're not getting paid extra for this, but you're not getting paid at all.

02:16:12.260 We don't get paid anything.

02:16:13.220 It's been a pleasure.

02:16:14.520 You guys, thank you so much for being here.

02:16:16.100 Thank you for having us.

02:16:17.060 It's so fun.

02:16:17.720 Yeah.

02:16:18.240 The ladies of Red Scare, everybody, only one team like this.

02:16:21.500 It's such a pleasure.

02:16:22.100 We have Charlie Kirk coming on Monday.

02:16:24.040 And in the meantime, I hope you have a great, great weekend.

02:16:27.840 Go ahead and download The Megyn Kelly Show on Apple, Pandora, Spotify, or Stitcher.

02:16:31.520 I mean, honestly, I gotta, I gotta be honest.

02:16:33.080 Maybe you should download on Spotify because we got completely effed over by Apple about

02:16:37.740 a week ago where they didn't download the show.

02:16:40.020 They, we have no idea why they didn't download the show.

02:16:42.520 People who listened to the show on Apple had to go like nine hours waiting for it to appear.

02:16:47.300 No one would talk to us.

02:16:48.380 At least Spotify talks to us.

02:16:50.300 YouTube, I love now.

02:16:51.640 They talk to us.

02:16:52.640 They have like many executives who are like, we will make sure the MK show gets online.

02:16:57.040 They have never taken down the show.

02:16:58.800 Not even a clip of the show.

02:17:00.520 We've been demonetized.

02:17:02.020 That's my problem, not yours.

02:17:03.360 They've never taken down a clip of the show.

02:17:05.560 Anyway, wherever you get it, go ahead and enjoy it.

02:17:08.420 And we'll see you Monday.

02:17:09.180 Thanks for listening.

02:17:13.000 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show.

02:17:15.120 No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

02:17:21.640 Thank you.

02:17:22.700 Amen.

02:17:23.340 Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly tell you what you saw before your head.

02:17:27.920 Take care.

02:17:29.520 Thank you.

The Megyn Kelly Show - June 06, 2025

What's Behind the Elon vs. Trump Drama, and Insane Leftist Arguments, with Ben Shapiro, Anna Khachiyan, and Dasha Nekrasova ｜ Ep. 1088

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