The Michael Knowles Show - Daily Wire Backstage： Debate Me, Bro.

00:00:00.000 Hey, Michael Knowles here. The latest episode of Daily Wire Backstage is available now.

00:00:04.240 Join me and a star-studded Daily Wire cast as we discuss the most important news of the day,

00:00:10.080 the cultural insanity spreading across the country, and take live questions

00:00:13.980 from the viewers, all while enjoying a wonderful cigar. Take a listen.

00:00:30.000 That was like my fourth try at that during the countdown to the show. Welcome to Daily

00:00:42.700 Wire's Backstage, brought to you by ExpressVPN. Tonight, I am joined by Ben Shapiro, Matt Walsh,

00:00:49.960 Andrew Klavan, maybe a surprise guest. There's all sorts of stuff going on here. Obviously,

00:00:56.960 the debate with all of the candidates. We all want to know what Doug Burgum has to say about

00:01:02.980 2024. We've all got Burgum momentum. We've got Asa Hutchinson fever. And of course,

00:01:10.820 we will see the launch of the croissants, the croissants for short, for Mr. Christie's campaign.

00:01:17.580 Gentlemen, before we get too far into the show, predictions for the debate?

00:01:21.820 Absolutely. Absolute, cataclysmic boredom. I mean, so here's the thing about this debate.

00:01:29.860 Basically, it's going to be all against DeSantis. And the only question is whether DeSantis can

00:01:34.340 survive. DeSantis has been taking incoming for weeks. He's dropped in the polls from in April.

00:01:40.340 He was in like the 24% range. He's down to in the real-class politics polling average in the 14% to

00:01:44.160 15% range with a significant decline. About half of that support has gone to Trump. About half of that

00:01:48.120 support has gone to Vivek. The big question for DeSantis is, can he weather the storm tonight?

00:01:54.080 Because I'm not of the opinion that he can actually win tonight in any way, shape, or form.

00:01:58.120 He's challenged on one side by Trump, who's 40 points ahead of the field. But on the other side,

00:02:03.760 by the entirety of the field, which is seeking to claw him down like a crab pot back in there so that

00:02:08.800 somebody can take that second place slot. The other contenders on the stage all have sort of

00:02:14.800 various motivations for even being there in the first place. So I'm not of the opinion, for example,

00:02:18.240 that Vivek Ramaswamy actually believes he's going to be president of the United States.

00:02:21.340 To me, he seems like a candidate who pretty clearly is running for vice president of the United States,

00:02:25.420 Senate in Ohio, or a media slot. If you look at Mike Pence, Pence is there basically just to

00:02:31.180 provide a counter to Trump. He has to know that he has no shot at the actual nomination. If you're

00:02:36.760 Nikki Haley or Tim Scott, you're basically just hoping that you're standing around when somebody dies

00:02:40.100 and that you have kind of a small percentage of the base. And if you're Chris Christie,

00:02:44.900 you're a kamikaze. And Chris Christie is showing momentum in New Hampshire, which he's up to second

00:02:50.420 by some polls in New Hampshire. He's still like 14% and really doesn't have a real shot at the

00:02:54.900 nomination, which means that their real motivation on the stage is claw down DeSantis because basically

00:03:01.600 everybody is now waiting for something bad to happen to Trump. I mean, that really is the dynamic of

00:03:06.960 the race because the only way to defeat Trump realistically, there are only two possibilities

00:03:11.580 and one really doesn't exist. Possibility number one, you make the case to the American people

00:03:14.940 and to the conservative base that Donald Trump was a less than stellar president who would perform

00:03:19.380 worse as president than you would and that he made a series of mistakes that he will repeat.

00:03:24.200 That case has very little durability with the Republican base, which has a lot of faith in

00:03:27.740 Trump by virtually every polling metric, even if I think there's merit to the case that he

00:03:31.100 underperformed particularly in his last two years as president. Then there's the second part of the

00:03:34.800 case, which was always the case against Trump and particularly the case for DeSantis. And that

00:03:38.420 was the electability case. DeSantis' entire case for Trump was, I'm Trump but electable. The problem

00:03:42.960 is in order to say that Trump was unelectable, you have to say the one thing that Trump people don't

00:03:46.720 want you to say, which is he lost in 2020. Because if you won't say he lost in 2020, he's not

00:03:50.780 unelectable. He was very electable in 2020 if he won, right? And so his entire case that he won in 2020

00:03:55.540 and the entire field being very shy about saying, no, it was a bad election, a lot of bad stuff

00:03:59.960 happened, and you lost because you were in a bad race and you're a bad candidate and you lucked out

00:04:04.000 against Hillary Clinton because everyone hates Hillary. People don't hate Biden as much as they

00:04:06.760 hate Hillary. That's the case that somebody is going to have to make. No one has made it yet.

00:04:10.680 If one of those two cases doesn't get made, Trump's the nominee. You also, you can't make the case in

00:04:15.420 a primary race if you're trailing Trump by 30 to 50 points for some of the single-digit people.

00:04:21.080 I think you can make the case in a primary race saying that in general, I'll do better than Trump.

00:04:24.500 But the problem is you need to show polling data that suggests that unless what you say is that

00:04:28.620 we already know how this race ends for Trump. You don't know how the race ends for me

00:04:32.360 because things could change, but you know how the race ends for Trump because we already did this

00:04:35.980 one time. Do you want to do this thing again? And honestly, I think that's a pretty robust case,

00:04:40.140 but nobody's willing to make it because they're so afraid of saying the reality, which is that

00:04:43.660 Donald Trump did in fact lose to Joe Biden. Yes, the rules were changed. Yes, the media were corrupt.

00:04:49.300 Yes, the media jobs. I was told by all that stuff is going to happen again. I was told by judge Michael

00:04:53.240 Ludig, a once respected conservative judge who now plays Ed McMahon to every hack on MSNBC.

00:04:58.520 I was told that 2020, I'm not joking, he said this, is the most fair election ever conducted

00:05:05.540 in the history of the United States. And because I want to stay on YouTube, I of course agree with

00:05:10.040 that. On the DeSantis point, I actually think, I don't see any way that he loses unless the people

00:05:17.360 on the stage find a way to attack him from the right. That's the one advantage that he has in this

00:05:22.100 context. Fox News debate, friendly audience, almost all the attacks against DeSantis have been,

00:05:27.520 number one, just kind of ridiculous on the merits, but also they've been from the left.

00:05:32.560 I'll tell you the point, the one who's going to go kamikaze obviously is Christie. Christie

00:05:36.540 committed a murder-suicide against Marco Rubio in 2016. He's going to try and do the same thing

00:05:40.540 on the stage right now. What he's going to do is he's going to say, Ron, everything you say is

00:05:44.220 scripted. We know the script because it was revealed to us. And then he's going to say some

00:05:48.440 line that Ron says. He's going to play exactly the same prank on Rubio. He's going to try to do the

00:05:54.120 same thing with DeSantis with Rubio. Remember you did this with Rubio? Rubio's not saying the same

00:05:56.700 phrase over and over. I have a slightly different analysis here. I'm watching all this campaign

00:06:01.240 and DeSantis, everything DeSantis says is true and effective, but he's not charming. And so he's

00:06:07.600 losing points. Everything Vivek says is charming, but complete crap. I mean, every word out of his

00:06:13.540 mouth is complete nonsense and he's gaining points. So this seems to me that Senator Scott is the guy

00:06:18.500 because he's absolutely charming and saying absolutely nothing. So he should have a great evening.

00:06:22.820 And then as for Trump, the fact that he lost this election, it reminds me of the scene in Game of

00:06:32.160 Thrones where the dwarf is talking to the cripple and the cripple says, I'm not a cripple. And the

00:06:36.680 dwarf says, I'm not a dwarf. It's like he lost. He lost the midterms. He lost the next midterms. He

00:06:42.360 keeps losing. He won by a short hair against the least likable candidate on earth by a fluke of

00:06:50.420 electoral, the electoral college, which I support, but still he's not going to win the general election.

00:06:55.960 I suppose the argument against it is, I agree. He won by a short hair against Hillary in these

00:07:02.980 decisive states. But then actually before the election, the FBI saw him as enough of a threat

00:07:09.520 to spy on his campaign. Then the DOJ saw him as enough of a threat to consistently undermine his

00:07:15.020 presidency. Now, I think the Democrats see him as enough of a threat to upend two centuries of

00:07:19.700 American history. More than that, throw him in prison. Is he enough of a threat or enough of a

00:07:22.960 mark for them? Like they see someone who's vulnerable. I don't know. I mean, listen,

00:07:26.640 I have a question. Does that matter? Meaning like the one question that Trump has never been asked

00:07:30.420 and has never answered is, you say the election was stolen from you. Let's say that's true.

00:07:34.140 What is your plan to unsteal Russia in 2024? Right. To avoid the lockdowns that permitted the

00:07:38.760 policies to change the... Now, before I explain to you my brilliant theories about everything in the

00:07:45.660 world, we have got to get to brains before beauty here. We have our friend Candace Owens

00:07:51.080 is actually in the field in Milwaukee right now at the GOP debate, perhaps announcing a run for

00:07:57.280 president. I think she's polling higher than Doug Berger. She would poll higher than everybody.

00:08:00.720 Candace, what is going on in Milwaukee? Hey! Well, I'll tell you one thing. It's really hot. So if I

00:08:06.920 look like I'm sweating, it's because it is unbelievable weather out here. But people are very excited.

00:08:11.920 I'm listening to all of your predictions. Tend to agree with Klavan tonight. I think that I would

00:08:17.220 not be sitting comfortably if I was walking in as DeSantis, obviously having lost effectively 10

00:08:21.660 points since June, at least according to the Emerson College poll, which recently came up. I

00:08:25.820 think the person that everyone wants to watch tonight is Vivek because he kind of snuck up from

00:08:30.120 behind. This seemed to be a dog on dog fight between Trump and DeSantis. Everyone was paying attention

00:08:35.500 to them slinging mud at each other and no one sort of watched the youngest candidate in the field.

00:08:39.260 And here's the truth. He's hustled harder than the rest of them. He's doing every podcast big and

00:08:43.900 small. He's running this like a startup. And I think that what Vivek said was accurate on my show

00:08:49.020 when he said that what DeSantis is suffering from, aside from a communication problem, I think there

00:08:54.240 are too many people communicating on behalf of DeSantis and we don't know what his thoughts are versus

00:08:58.920 his communications team's thoughts are. But aside from that, I think he just had too much of a big

00:09:04.160 start, too much money. You know, he came in like a corporation, not like a startup. And it's hard to know

00:09:08.660 which direction to focus. So the question tonight will be whether or not DeSantis can refocus his

00:09:12.960 campaign, actually listen to some of the criticism and realize that, you know, you know, you got a

00:09:16.700 little bit of a personality problem. We want you to sound a little bit more excited. And by the way,

00:09:20.140 he showed this issue back when he was debating Gillum, Andrew Gillum in the gubernatorial election.

00:09:24.860 You know, he struggled to get over the finish line. Obviously, we don't have Trump here tonight,

00:09:28.740 so people are going to be paying attention to the next two candidates, which are Vivek and DeSantis.

00:09:32.360 Ben, you might be right. We might see Vivek go for DeSantis. We might see them both try to stay

00:09:38.300 clean. Vivek has thus far kept his hands pretty clean. So it'll be interesting to see if he shifts

00:09:43.320 his strategy. Overall, I think Vivek will thrive in this environment only because he's a true academic.

00:09:48.820 And I just imagine that he was probably in the debate club back when he was in Yale. But who knows?

00:09:53.300 Do you, in fact, I can vouch for some of that. Do you know, though, Candace, if any of this will

00:09:59.020 change the polls? So let's say they all tear each other to shreds and DeSantis murders Vivek or Vivek

00:10:05.640 murders DeSantis or they gang up and eat Chris Christie. Does that actually affect the standing

00:10:10.340 in the eyes? That was a softball. Do you think that affects the overall polls?

00:10:16.580 I think it will. And I think here's how it's going to affect it. The names that we're not saying

00:10:20.000 tonight. You guys aren't saying Tim Scott. You guys aren't saying Nikki Haley. Well, where are those

00:10:23.920 points going to go when they realize that their candidates are effectively going nowhere? We're not

00:10:26.960 even talking about Pence. I don't think any of you guys, at least since I've had you on, have mentioned

00:10:30.360 Pence. I think eventually their donors and their followers will say, OK, this is obviously not going

00:10:35.360 to work. Where are we going to jump ship? Are they going to jump on the DeSantis ship? Are they

00:10:39.400 going to jump on the Vivek ship? I would assume if they're with Nikki Haley and Tim Scott, they're

00:10:42.880 probably not going to go on the Trump ship. So I do think that if I'm making a prediction tonight

00:10:48.040 that Vivek will get a bump in the polls after this and for DeSantis, it's going to be all based on his

00:10:53.120 performance tonight. I don't know what I would be thinking if I was him. OK. Anybody

00:10:57.560 else with questions for our lovely friend in Milwaukee? What are you hearing from the

00:11:01.580 Doug Burgum camp? Is he going to bring the magic that we have been promised? And the gift

00:11:06.560 cards that we've been promised?

00:11:07.480 Well, the crowd is wild for Doug Burgum. And that is the truth. The absolute truth.

00:11:18.180 That's great, Candace. And just obviously before we go, where do you stand on Asa Hutchinson?

00:11:25.520 Do you think he should be only a vice president or should he be at the top of the ticket?

00:11:31.620 I'd like to see him at the top of the ticket. And if that doesn't work out, press secretary for

00:11:35.580 sure. Press that. He's so good at communicating. Candace, thank you so much. You probably have to

00:11:39.540 get in there. Enjoy the debate. We'll probably be texting you for updates and give our regards to

00:11:44.860 all our pals out there. OK. All right, guys, we'll check in soon. All right. Can I say one thing?

00:11:51.520 Oh, two things. No. Only one. The thing about they go after Trump, the deep state goes after Trump

00:11:58.040 because he's effective. I just I reject that premise because the deep state will go after any

00:12:02.540 Republican. They hate all Republicans. They hate DeSantis. They'll do whatever they can to destroy

00:12:07.180 you. If you make it easier for them, then they'll be able to destroy you even more. Trump tends to

00:12:10.580 make it easier for them. Second, on DeSantis, you know, what I would love to hear DeSantis say,

00:12:14.640 maybe he's already said a version of this, I'd love to hear it say tonight is just like, listen,

00:12:18.380 if you're looking for a homecoming king, if you're looking for Mr. Personality, I'm not that guy.

00:12:22.940 I admit it. That's not who I am. But if you're looking for a killer who's just going to get things done

00:12:26.660 and you can look at the scoreboard and look what he actually achieved, then I'm your guy for that.

00:12:29.960 I think he just has to. That should always have been his message. Yeah, 100 percent. The big

00:12:33.900 problem, I think, is that there and listen, when you're explaining, you're losing. But I think the

00:12:38.240 reason why DeSantis' campaign has run into some choppy waters is because he kind of he made a

00:12:42.820 couple of core assumptions about the nature of the Republican electorate that just are not true.

00:12:46.440 One of those core assumptions is that racking up wins would actually matter to the electorate.

00:12:49.800 And this is a core assumption that is not true. I mean, the fact is that people have short memories.

00:12:54.680 Well, not only that, DeSantis doing a thing is being treated exactly the same thing as Vivek saying a

00:12:58.740 thing. So Vivek will say something like critical race theory is terrible. And then DeSantis will

00:13:02.200 pass a bill in Florida banning critical race theory in the classroom. And people like those are the

00:13:06.320 same thing. Those are basically the same thing. And it's like, well, that's that's that's not the

00:13:09.780 same thing at all. So when he says, listen, I'm competent at being governor, I'm competent at doing

00:13:14.280 these things, the Republican base doesn't vote for that anymore. Like the idea of core competency

00:13:19.320 as a requirement for the office went out with Trump because Trump had no experience.

00:13:23.180 Wait, wait, wait, wait. Trump represents something. I've always felt that there was

00:13:27.380 Trump, the person who is the person, but there's also Trump, the voice of the people. And he

00:13:31.320 embodies the voice of the people. This is 60 years of culture war of telling the American people

00:13:37.940 they stink. Their country stinks. Their religion stinks. Their patriotism stinks. Their way of life

00:13:41.900 stinks. Their race stinks. Everything about him stinks. And Trump, as far as I'm concerned, is a polite

00:13:46.200 response to that. The response could easily have been pitchforks and torches outside.

00:13:50.120 I don't disagree with any of that, but that has nothing to do with. So what I'm saying,

00:13:54.740 though, is there was a time when a DeSantis would have been easily the front runner, when people

00:13:59.860 would have been paying attention to policy, when people would have been paying attention to results.

00:14:03.780 They're not anymore because they're just too damned angry. And I think the anger is justified,

00:14:08.300 but it's also. But by the way, there is I'm with Ann Coulter circa 2016 when she wrote this book

00:14:13.820 with a ridiculous title, but it had good substance. E Pluribus Awesome in Trump, we trust

00:14:18.500 was the title. But the thesis was that people, a lot of people think people voted for Trump for his

00:14:23.820 personality, forgetting about his policies. She said it was the opposite. And what I would say

00:14:29.260 differentiates Trump from the other Republicans, at least in my lifetime, are three big issues.

00:14:33.960 Immigration, which he, yes, other Republicans had been anti-immigration. He took it a lot further

00:14:38.160 and called Mexicans rapists and murderers. Trade, every other Republican and every other Democrat in my

00:14:43.940 lifetime was for basically more free trade, more globalization. Trump opposed that. He's now calling for

00:14:48.020 mercantilism in the 21st century and war. Every president who gets elected would bomb Iraq.

00:14:54.420 That was a rite of passage for every president in my lifetime. Donald Trump was generally opposed

00:14:58.740 to these imperial wars. Those are three priorities. How did he advance those first two when he was in

00:15:03.800 office? Well, illegal immigration plummeted during his first year in office. And then after it became

00:15:09.400 clear that the established bureaucracy was not going to enforce the laws, then immigration ticked up

00:15:15.620 again. But he had a massive drop in the first months of his presidency. He built some of the wall.

00:15:19.560 This is what we're always hearing. We're always hearing, well, for the for the first part, it was

00:15:23.040 good. But yet it's hard when you've got an entrenched bureaucracy. It's hard, but that's part of the

00:15:26.920 problem. When you're explaining you're losing. I said it about a campaign. It also happens to be

00:15:29.980 true of administrations. I guess, except Trump's at 50 percent in the polls. It looks like he's winning.

00:15:35.080 No, he's winning. Now you're changing the metric of winning. So I'm not denying that he's winning

00:15:40.000 the primaries. Yeah, he's winning the primaries. The question is, did he advance the conservative

00:15:44.020 agenda enough as president? I think there are I think there are many legitimate objections to,

00:15:49.260 for example, his covid handling or, for example, BLM riots or, for example, his spending habits.

00:15:54.440 I mean, there are a lot of problems. But, you know, the thing that I most object to, aside from your

00:15:58.440 person, you know, just as a human, the thing the thing that I most object to is this idea, this

00:16:03.760 intellectualization of Trump as Trump was a basket of issues. He was not. He was an impulse. The impulse

00:16:08.040 is what Drew is saying. The impulse was a giant pulsating orange finger to all of the people.

00:16:12.880 But he's a person and people matter in Democratic politics. So his personality does matter.

00:16:17.620 Stop shifting your argument, though. I agree with you. I think it was chiefly about personality,

00:16:20.400 which is why right now he is shifting around on a wide variety of issues. And it doesn't seem to

00:16:25.260 matter one iota. On those core issues, he's pretty concerned. It's not true that he didn't achieve

00:16:29.660 things because he was up against the deep state. Every Republican president, any conservative

00:16:33.940 president is going to be up against the deep state. He mistreats people.

00:16:37.660 And that's not the way you run politics. He couldn't he couldn't repeal Obamacare because

00:16:42.020 he treated John McCain like a piece of garbage. And all I hear from Trump's words, well, he

00:16:45.620 is a piece of garbage. I don't care. I don't care. You needed his vote. You need his vote.

00:16:49.440 You kiss his ass. And also the excuse that, well, he tried and they blocked it. I could almost

00:16:56.200 buy that if there's evidence that he really tried. But, you know, for me, the number one

00:17:00.740 unforgivable thing, putting aside, COVID was bad. BLM was bad. But the fact that he didn't

00:17:06.700 lock her up like he ran on lock her up and then he's in office. They would have prosecuted

00:17:11.420 him the second he locked her up. OK, but a lot of Republicans there was no attempt. There

00:17:15.000 was no even discussion or attempt to actually hold any of these people accountable. That's

00:17:18.740 actually the one where I blame him the least. Because there was actually, you know, a generally

00:17:23.000 agreed upon idea that you did not prosecute the person who is the candidate of the of the

00:17:27.080 opposing party. It's just that he was fibbing the entire election when he said he would.

00:17:30.160 Well, I know that Trump's supposed to be the guy that does that. That's what sets it apart.

00:17:32.940 So the transgressive speech didn't actually match the policy in a lot of ways. And, you

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00:18:53.000 So here's the thing. I will acknowledge that the arguments that we are currently making about

00:18:57.420 his shortcomings on policy have no truck with the base. They don't. Okay. And this is the big

00:19:01.740 problem for a lot of the other candidates. DeSantis is like, look at my record. Look at

00:19:04.480 Trump's record. My record as governor of Florida is better than Trump's record as president of the

00:19:08.880 United States, which by the way, is fairly inarguable. If you just look at what...

00:19:12.980 Look, I love DeSantis, so I'm not knocking him, but it's easier to run a state than the United States.

00:19:17.340 That's a fair argument. But in terms of what DeSantis has done to reshape the state of Florida

00:19:22.020 in a conservative image, there is no question he's had significantly more progress. And I'm...

00:19:25.980 Whether you're talking about shifting a 0.5 percentage point state to a 20 percentage

00:19:29.540 point state, and moving almost a million... Yeah, but why was that in-migration happening?

00:19:33.700 I can tell you because my family moved there. I'm personally responsible for almost 20 people

00:19:37.020 in my immediate family and surroundings moving to the state of Florida, and that is because of

00:19:41.200 the governance of people like DeSantis. So... But again, I will fully acknowledge that it doesn't

00:19:45.900 matter almost at all in this primary, and this is the thing that DeSantis is finding out,

00:19:50.620 which means that the only thing that he could pitch... I think what he thought is,

00:19:54.520 I'm going to pitch strong governance, plus I can talk like Trump. I can be confrontational.

00:19:59.100 I can be spicy. I can say a lot of the same things. But I don't also have the kind of crazy

00:20:03.460 attributes of saying every weird thing that comes into my head and all of this.

00:20:06.240 Mika's face and all that.

00:20:07.220 Exactly. And that didn't work because you can't out-trump Trump. And the former part of it,

00:20:12.380 which is the solidity of governance, clearly is not of top priority to the conservative movement,

00:20:17.280 which is really interested right now continually. And again, I understand the emotional appeal

00:20:21.040 of throwing the giant orange middle finger. There's no substitute for the giant orange middle

00:20:25.060 finger. It is fun to... Listen, I've done it myself. It is fun to go up to left-wing celebrities,

00:20:29.520 I've done this, and explain to them that I personally will vote for Trump before I vote

00:20:32.740 for the Democrat if Trump is the nominee. They lose their minds. It's fun to do. I totally get it.

00:20:36.620 It is fun. Okay? And by polling data, this is one of the big gaps between Trump and DeSantis.

00:20:40.280 Trump is fun, DeSantis is not. Totally get it. You know what's not really supposed to be fun?

00:20:44.180 Governing and Winning. Okay? Governing and Winning is supposed to be victory. You know what?

00:20:48.680 You know what's not supposed to be fun? Politics is not supposed to be about the

00:20:51.600 entertainment value of the politics. It's not. You know, we live in a democracy, right? Do you

00:20:55.700 know... Democracy has been about bread and circuses and about at least appealing to people

00:21:01.740 on a basic level, going back to Pericles. You know, wait, wait, wait. All of them lamented this.

00:21:06.780 Bread and circuses comes from my old friend Juvenal, who was saying you gave up your democracy

00:21:12.140 for bread and circuses. That is the problem. So it's like, that is the stage we're at now.

00:21:17.600 People are willing to give this stuff up for fun. But I think we should add here for just

00:21:22.960 a minute, because I'm not completely, I mean, it's most likely Trump's going to be the nominee,

00:21:27.940 but I'm not completely sold on it. The DeSantis campaign was objectively crappy from the very

00:21:33.260 start. And it's gotten better. And it's getting better. But he started out going, basically,

00:21:37.820 I'm little Trump. I'm Trump 2.0. I'm the nice Trump. All the stuff he said, even his slogan,

00:21:43.720 which I can't even remember anymore, was MAGA 2 or whatever. It's a bad campaign. And I think

00:21:48.840 the people he fired, they look at that and they say that's chaos, but it's also an improvement.

00:21:53.140 His staff knew nothing about social media. They didn't let him say the things he was going to say.

00:21:58.340 If they let him go, he's won elections before. It's possible.

00:22:01.200 The other thing that DeSantis really needs to do, when they know it and they have to do it,

00:22:05.120 he became famous, not just because his policies were good. Every politician makes this mistake.

00:22:09.540 They think they became popular because their policies are good. It's not true. He became

00:22:12.620 famous because the entire media made him the enemy. And he beat him up. And he punched them in the

00:22:15.840 face. And he has avoided all confrontational media for the entirety of this campaign so far.

00:22:21.940 You cannot do that. The reason that Vivek is doing well is because he goes into confrontational

00:22:25.920 media spaces and he's confrontational. Now, I think he's fibbing, right? I think that he'll say

00:22:30.380 things to the Atlantic and then five seconds later, he'll pretend he didn't say that thing to the

00:22:33.260 Atlantic. And then he'll crap all over Caitlin Collins for asking about it. But DeSantis has

00:22:38.700 to go into unfriendly spaces and he has to punch people. I think he assumed that he had stocked up

00:22:42.860 enough goodwill with the base that he could avoid that. And he's wrong. It's not true.

00:22:47.280 Speaking of going into unfriendly spaces, do I have to, this is a message to the producers. This is not

00:22:54.140 to the audience. This is not even to you gentlemen. Do I have to talk about this stupid nonsense

00:23:00.980 nonsense about the aliens coming into our spaces? Do I?

00:23:05.640 This is because Trump didn't believe it.

00:23:06.420 They're telling me yes in my ear too.

00:23:07.600 Are they? Yeah, I don't know. It's silent in my, do we have, did you, I heard you made a

00:23:11.460 documentary, Matt. Is that true?

00:23:13.240 Yes, we did. We, this is, we're going to play the entire thing apparently.

00:23:17.380 No. It's about, it's about 45 minutes long.

00:23:22.840 I don't know. I don't think, well, look, I don't think a lot of setup is necessary. Obviously,

00:23:26.240 Ben and I have had our disagreements over the alien issue and it is, it, it made me think,

00:23:31.860 and I've, I've spent the last several weeks doing a deep dive investigating. What I was really trying

00:23:37.280 to figure out is his arguments are so terrible and I've embarrassed him so much in this debate

00:23:42.860 over aliens and yet he persists and so it made me think, what is really going on here?

00:23:49.220 And I put together a report and, uh, take it away. Please take it away. Please.

00:23:55.420 UFOs exist. The U.S. government found quite a number of them and they are indeed of non-human

00:24:01.820 origin. I'm just going to go, no. We have spice craft from another species. There are no aliens.

00:24:09.280 Do we have the bodies of the pilots who piloted this craft? Non-human biologics came with some

00:24:14.980 of these recoveries. We are not alone. We're definitely not alone. That mother f***er back

00:24:21.460 there is not real.

00:24:22.740 Facts don't care about your feelings. This catchy cliche was coined by Ben Shapiro, owner of the

00:24:41.480 popular conservative news outlet, The Daily Wire. Mr. Shapiro recently targeted me in a public smear

00:24:47.720 campaign after I provided a mountain of evidence proving the existence of aliens. For some reason,

00:24:54.420 he refused to acknowledge the fact that we are simply not alone.

00:25:04.240 Matt Welch is a very controversial person for a number of reasons. Dude really thinks that, like,

00:25:08.400 the aliens are here. Let's take this logically for just a moment to destroy Matt with facts and logic.

00:25:12.520 The evidence you're presenting me is going to have to be better than a guy saw a shadowy image

00:25:16.260 that appeared to defy the laws of physics. Probably it's aliens. Again, this is a question

00:25:19.920 of likelihood, Matt. You have nothing. I'm sorry, you have nothing. There are no aliens on planet

00:25:24.780 Earth. I don't believe it. I don't see the evidence for it. And I think all of this is a giant waste of

00:25:28.400 time.

00:25:31.840 Sympathy poured in from around the world to comfort Mr. Shapiro after this public embarrassment.

00:25:37.300 However, he continues his anti-alien campaign to this day. This irrational alienophobia,

00:25:43.860 while easily dismissed as quackery, raises the question, does Ben Shapiro pretend to hate aliens

00:25:51.500 because he is one?

00:25:55.680 To protect the integrity of this investigation, all of the evidence here about to be presented

00:25:59.900 was collected by our trained investigators. Using the most advanced strategies, equipment,

00:26:04.580 and techniques, we'll finally learn if the one who smelt it, dealt it.

00:26:18.020 In 2021, Young America's Foundation hosted a speech at Florida State University featuring Ben Shapiro.

00:26:24.440 At this event, Mr. Shapiro demonstrated alien mind control capabilities in front of a live audience.

00:26:30.100 Hi, Ben. How are you?

00:26:31.720 Doing okay. How are you?

00:26:32.880 Great.

00:26:34.360 How come you claim to be 5'9 even though you're like 5'5?

00:26:39.060 I don't know. How tall are you?

00:26:41.840 You're 5'9?

00:26:42.620 I'm actually 5'9.

00:26:43.500 Okay, come over here. Let's see.

00:26:44.480 Spatial perception is affected by distance, so considering the student in the video was close

00:27:07.920 enough to see Mr. Shapiro, it's reasonable to assume he was close enough to accurately

00:27:12.560 judge his height. Yet, the young man's calculations were off by 4 inches. Take another look.

00:27:28.460 A leaning expert on extraterrestrials testified on Twitter that aliens possess the ability to

00:27:33.360 control human minds and make us see things differently than they really are.

00:27:37.500 Did Ben Shapiro alter his perception in order to publicly own him? Does this explain all of

00:27:45.780 the college students Shapiro has destroyed?

00:27:48.000 According to Wikipedia, Ben Shapiro was born in January of 1984 in Burbank, California.

00:28:05.820 Our researchers checked online for any birth announcements with the name Ben Shapiro in 1984

00:28:10.220 and found nothing. Aside from a certified birth certificate, no evidence exists that anyone

00:28:16.440 named Ben Shapiro was born on that day in Burbank or anywhere else.

00:28:20.680 Renowned physicist Stephen Hawking made a startling confession at some point before his death

00:28:30.520 that unlike his contemporaries who speculated aliens are friendly explorers, he believed aliens

00:28:36.900 might actually hate humans. Is there evidence Ben Shapiro is hostile towards humanity?

00:28:43.760 Our team pieced together this video from clips they found on the Daily Wire's website.

00:28:48.160 The company tried to suppress this evidence behind countless hours of newer content, but

00:28:53.860 what we were able to uncover is shocking.

00:29:03.640 Why do I hate Michael Knowles? Because the gods have smiled upon Michael Knowles for no reason I can discern.

00:29:09.980 What the f***? I'm going to be trapped in a locked room with Michael Knowles for a given period of time,

00:29:15.440 which sounds technically like the definition of hell.

00:29:18.260 Michael Knowles, a man who only fails upward.

00:29:21.480 You went to Yale. I could not find any other productive thing that you had done in your entire life.

00:29:25.800 Michael Knowles, a man hired at this company for one job, did not do that job well, and so was given a podcast.

00:29:31.000 You were an unemployable person, so we apparently just kept paying you.

00:29:35.140 Yeah.

00:29:35.500 And then I'm going to just hand this over to you. We'll take a picture for the cameras.

00:29:38.260 This is really incredible.

00:29:39.200 There we go.

00:29:39.740 Thank you.

00:29:40.060 Absolutely.

00:29:41.520 No! No!

00:29:43.040 We've had many complaints about you walking around shirtless in the office.

00:29:46.880 See, in the movie, the pedophile's outside the room, Michael.

00:29:48.920 Never go in the dressing room when Knowles is in there.

00:29:50.860 Five more minutes and I was going to marry you and eat you.

00:29:52.440 Yeah, yeah, uh-huh.

00:29:53.080 That's why Michael Knowles will eventually pay the ultimate price when I run him over with my cop.

00:29:57.980 We reached out to Mr. Shapiro for a comment right before recording this video, but our email went unanswered.

00:30:06.360 For more information and a closer look at the evidence, visit benshapiromightbeanalien.com.

00:30:16.500 Wow, Matt. That was some really bang-up work.

00:30:19.300 Yeah, amazing.

00:30:20.000 Thank you.

00:30:20.920 I rest my...

00:30:22.500 Ah!

00:30:24.660 Don't believe it.

00:30:26.300 Don't believe it.

00:30:26.980 Yeah, it might just be the...

00:30:28.820 I don't believe it.

00:30:29.420 You guys don't believe it either.

00:30:30.580 No, I don't believe it at all.

00:30:31.580 I don't know what the mask's talking about.

00:30:32.180 Is that with the lighting, perhaps?

00:30:33.680 You don't...

00:30:34.100 Yeah.

00:30:34.760 No one believes it.

00:30:35.660 No one.

00:30:36.140 That's a great...

00:30:36.600 No one here believes it.

00:30:37.380 That's a great mask, actually.

00:30:39.500 The human mask that he puts on for...

00:30:41.760 Exactly.

00:30:42.540 Exactly.

00:30:43.020 That's what I'm talking about.

00:30:44.720 Yeah, I think...

00:30:46.140 You should just keep that on for the whole rest of this.

00:30:48.420 That's my life, apparently.

00:30:49.560 I like what's so interesting about the alien species is that they have beige-colored skin just below the neck.

00:30:56.220 Well, that's actually what people have said.

00:30:58.100 They've said that my only scandal is my tan skin.

00:31:02.720 That's how they throw you off.

00:31:04.720 Yeah, well...

00:31:05.480 Yeah, it's incontrovertible.

00:31:07.300 I like that there's a lot of other shows that are doing very serious debate analysis before the big debate.

00:31:13.700 Yeah.

00:31:14.140 And we played a five-minute video about...

00:31:16.100 I can't breathe in here.

00:31:17.180 I can't breathe in here like a...

00:31:18.620 Oh, Ben!

00:31:19.220 Oh, God.

00:31:19.580 There was just an alien where you're sitting.

00:31:22.280 Oh, well...

00:31:23.280 I felt like Joe Biden in there for a second.

00:31:25.120 I can't breathe.

00:31:26.000 I'm falling asleep.

00:31:26.700 I also love...

00:31:27.580 At our multi-hundred-million-dollar media company, I like that all of our gags cost about 14 cents at most.

00:31:35.500 Want to know why we're a couple hundred million?

00:31:38.480 That's how it works.

00:31:39.440 Can we officially put an end to this and all future discussions?

00:31:45.400 No, that was a setup for at least a 20-minute conversation.

00:31:48.820 Who is the most like an alien on the Republican debate stage?

00:31:51.520 Nate...

00:31:52.160 Ooh.

00:31:56.720 I'm...

00:31:58.280 You know, this is...

00:31:59.380 This is a good question, right?

00:32:00.380 Now you're thinking about it.

00:32:01.500 This is a credit to him.

00:32:03.940 Actually, it's not an insult.

00:32:05.380 But the answer is Mike Pence.

00:32:06.900 Because he's just so solid.

00:32:08.740 This guy, he doesn't sweat.

00:32:10.540 He doesn't blink.

00:32:11.260 He doesn't move.

00:32:12.060 He's unflappable.

00:32:14.140 And only he, only he doesn't know that he sacrificed his career when he saved the Republic by not overturning the election.

00:32:20.880 He's the only person in America.

00:32:21.960 He's a friendly alien.

00:32:22.860 He's a friendly one.

00:32:24.100 I do want to get to at least one topic that actually matters tonight.

00:32:31.720 But before we get to that, I want to plug Candace.

00:32:35.180 Thank heavens.

00:32:35.960 I was feeling inadequate.

00:32:36.760 Okay, before we do that, I want to get to...

00:32:40.080 You know Candace.

00:32:41.260 You saw her earlier today on the show.

00:32:43.540 Well, I want to take a moment to remind you that in case you weren't aware, we are mere weeks away from the premiere of her new 10-part docuseries, Convicting a Murderer.

00:32:52.280 The series will finally reveal the evidence that was omitted in the popular docuseries, Making a Murderer.

00:32:58.120 If you know anything about Candace, you know that she loves to bust up media narratives.

00:33:02.560 Well, that is exactly what she's done in this new series.

00:33:06.020 Take a look.

00:33:06.520 This is a collect call from...

00:33:09.840 How's Steve?

00:33:10.240 ...an inmate at the Calumet County Jail.

00:33:12.500 The man served 18 years in prison until DNA evidence cleared his name.

00:33:16.120 The Two Rivers man was convicted of sexual assault in 1985, but exonerated with DNA evidence in 2003.

00:33:22.760 So this is the infamous Avery Lott.

00:33:27.100 Now, two years later, he again finds himself tied to a police investigation.

00:33:32.360 Accused of murdering Teresa Hallbuck on the Avery property.

00:33:35.660 Stephen Avery's 16-year-old nephew admitted his involvement in the rape and murder of Teresa Hallbuck.

00:33:41.500 The car is discovered just around the bend.

00:33:45.540 It was just this worldwide phenomenon.

00:33:47.800 I think they framed this guy.

00:33:48.720 I think he intended to crush the vehicle, but ran out of time.

00:33:52.400 Avery thinks the $36 million lawsuit he filed is why he's being targeted in this investigation.

00:34:02.400 Netflix made millions of dollars from Making a Murderer, but the filmmakers left out very important details.

00:34:11.560 Mountains of evidence that you have not yet seen.

00:34:14.120 The blood vial.

00:34:14.960 The most egregious manipulation from the movie.

00:34:18.060 Interrogations.

00:34:18.580 That's when he started beating me, because I told him that he's sick.

00:34:22.260 Cell phones.

00:34:22.960 And I saw melted plastic parts of a cell phone.

00:34:25.640 Interviews.

00:34:26.060 Her arms were pinned behind her head.

00:34:27.640 They made Stephen Avery look like a victim.

00:34:29.760 Do you ever believe your brother's guilty?

00:34:31.960 I don't know if I'm a suspect.

00:34:33.760 I got an eye.

00:34:39.300 I'm getting sick and tired of media deception.

00:34:42.960 Evidence piling up.

00:34:44.180 Why would they omit so many different things?

00:34:46.100 Why are you editing my testimony?

00:34:50.100 I am not going to make the same mistake that the filmmakers did.

00:34:53.940 Rearranging the testimony.

00:34:57.380 They delete a portion of it at the end.

00:34:59.660 How could they claim to care about the truth?

00:35:01.940 They all know that Stephen Avery committed this crime.

00:35:04.960 The evidence forces me to conclude that you are the most dangerous individual ever to set foot in this courtroom.

00:35:16.780 Convicting a murderer is available exclusively for Daily Wire Plus members.

00:35:24.560 Head on over to dailywire.com slash subscribe to sign up.

00:35:27.460 Right now you'll save 25% on your membership.

00:35:30.360 There has never been a better time, so sign up tonight.

00:35:32.960 I have to say, as a former court reporter, a guy who used to cover courts, everybody's guilty.

00:35:38.400 Everybody's guilty.

00:35:39.160 And every one of these shows is some sweet little white girl coming in and saying,

00:35:43.820 I want to help people.

00:35:44.680 Here's a murderer.

00:35:45.300 I'll set him free.

00:35:46.180 They're like, no, no, that's not how you do that.

00:35:49.460 By the way, also a great way of getting out of jury duty.

00:35:51.360 Just say that one.

00:35:52.560 It's true.

00:35:53.100 Yeah, I'm glad we're doing this because I remember making a murderer.

00:35:56.540 And that was, when that show came out, it was whatever little bit of faith in humanity I had left to that point was gone.

00:36:02.720 Just the way that everyone bought that.

00:36:04.740 There was no, and I remember very distinctly afterwards trying to tell people like,

00:36:08.960 no, just spend five seconds on Google and you'll clearly see some facts about this case.

00:36:14.000 Or serial.

00:36:14.980 Right.

00:36:15.480 Serial, yeah.

00:36:16.240 That was the one.

00:36:17.300 Same girl.

00:36:19.060 Just a different girl, but the same girl.

00:36:20.580 Speaking of human tragedy with more questions than answers, at least in the popular narrative,

00:36:26.940 we all know about this tragedy in Maui.

00:36:29.280 We were told 100 people dead.

00:36:30.840 Obviously, the number is probably an order of magnitude, at least higher than that.

00:36:34.180 Biden finally gets guilted into flying into Maui, and he decides to spend his time cracking jokes and falling asleep.

00:36:42.100 Yeah.

00:36:42.540 We are a community that relies on famine, on ohana, whether by blood,

00:36:50.580 or by French.

00:36:51.460 I don't want to compare difficulties,

00:36:56.940 but we have a little sense, Jill and I, what it's like to lose a home.

00:37:02.800 Years ago, now 15 years ago, I was in Washington doing Meet the Press.

00:37:09.180 It was a sunny Sunday.

00:37:11.440 And lightning struck at home on a little lake that's outside of our home, not a lake, a big pond,

00:37:17.860 and hit a wire, and came up underneath our home into the heating ducts, the air conditioning duct.

00:37:26.380 To make a long story short, I almost lost my wife, my 67 Corvette, and my cat.

00:37:36.640 But all kidding aside, I watched the firefighters, the way they responded.

00:37:44.980 You know, there's an old expression.

00:37:47.440 I grew up right across the street from a fire hall in Claremont, Delaware.

00:37:51.400 You guys catch the boots out here?

00:37:57.540 That's a hot ground, man.

00:38:00.040 Pretty hot ground, man.

00:38:01.300 A thousand people dead, or more, many of them children.

00:38:04.920 This guy makes it about a kitchen fire he had, almost losing his car,

00:38:08.240 and how funny it is that his shoes are a little bit hot.

00:38:10.820 What's amazing, too, is the press coverage of this has been virtually non-existent.

00:38:14.980 Yeah.

00:38:15.160 Especially when you look back, I mean, it's ridiculous at this point to care,

00:38:18.460 but the coverage of George W. Bush during Katrina,

00:38:22.300 where basically they made it sound as if he had blown really hard,

00:38:25.360 and that caused the hurricane and destroyed New Orleans,

00:38:27.960 which was destroyed by a thousand, not a thousand, a hundred years of Democrat malfeasance in that city,

00:38:33.920 which didn't support the dams that were destroyed.

00:38:38.620 Yeah, the levees that were destroyed.

00:38:40.040 You know, this is an actual disgrace.

00:38:42.820 This is an actual American tragedy.

00:38:44.680 The worst fire in a hundred years.

00:38:47.200 The worst, most fatal fire in a hundred years.

00:38:49.720 3,000 people died on 9-11.

00:38:51.380 And this guy shows up, this guy shows up and talks about a kitchen fire that he had.

00:38:55.100 Falls asleep.

00:38:57.140 You know, I mean, it's...

00:38:58.280 And the media spinning for him is just...

00:39:00.260 And the media, not just spinning, they're not even covering how did this happen?

00:39:04.160 Why were the roads blocked?

00:39:05.200 Where did the fire start?

00:39:06.120 Why wasn't it stopped?

00:39:07.020 All of those things are not being covered anywhere except by Brett Barrett.

00:39:09.640 But they're just saying climate change.

00:39:11.080 It's climate change.

00:39:11.580 Climate change is always the excuse for complete human failure.

00:39:14.120 And remember, the big thing with Bush was that he flew overhead.

00:39:18.380 That's right.

00:39:19.640 And looked over...

00:39:20.540 Rather than rappelling down into a flood zone, he flew overhead.

00:39:23.520 And that was the defining...

00:39:24.400 We were told by the media, they still say it's a defining image of his presidency.

00:39:27.500 An image that will live in infamy.

00:39:28.780 It was total disgrace.

00:39:29.840 That was two days after the hurricane hit.

00:39:33.260 Two days later, he's on the scene.

00:39:35.160 Not there physically because it's literally a flood.

00:39:38.040 It took Joe Biden two weeks to show up.

00:39:39.760 And also, by the way, that...

00:39:40.800 After a couple of vacations, right?

00:39:41.880 Right.

00:39:42.240 He was on vacation.

00:39:43.480 We can't remember...

00:39:44.300 We can't forget also the no comment when he was first asked about the victims of the fire.

00:39:47.720 He said no comment.

00:39:48.800 But also, that clip there of him sleeping.

00:39:50.760 It's actually true.

00:39:51.680 NBC News did run cover for him.

00:39:53.820 And they ran a video, high resolution to show...

00:39:57.180 You could see the whites in his eyes.

00:39:58.260 He actually wasn't sleeping.

00:39:59.580 And that's true.

00:39:59.980 He actually was not sleeping.

00:40:00.980 But that's more concerning.

00:40:02.560 The fact that you can't tell if he's awake or asleep.

00:40:04.860 But he's got his eyes open, but he's dead in the...

00:40:07.520 Yeah, his eyes are open, but he's just sitting there.

00:40:09.000 You can see the breath.

00:40:09.880 I mean, he's breathing so deeply in that particular clip.

00:40:12.740 I mean, that's like REM breathing.

00:40:14.260 But in any case, it doesn't even matter.

00:40:15.620 I mean, the bottom line is that the great lie the media have been telling about Joe Biden

00:40:19.120 for literally his entire career is that this is the captain of empathy.

00:40:22.720 He is such an empathetic human being.

00:40:24.340 This is pitched in 2020 as well.

00:40:25.940 He's just so filled with empathy for others and caring for others.

00:40:30.020 And sure, he has no actual vision.

00:40:31.500 This is the rip on him that Richard Ben Kramer writes about and what it takes.

00:40:34.240 But he has no actual vision.

00:40:35.060 He has no actual policies.

00:40:36.000 He doesn't actually care about things.

00:40:36.980 But he just has the connect, right?

00:40:38.800 He just connects with people, and he's so empathetic, and he's so caring.

00:40:41.980 It all goes back to the pain that he experienced when his wife and his daughter were killed in

00:40:45.080 that car crash.

00:40:45.860 And then it goes back to Bo's death and all the rest of this.

00:40:48.160 Here's the thing.

00:40:48.920 You can get away with that for decades when you're young, vigorous, and you can lie with

00:40:53.120 alacrity.

00:40:53.880 As you get older and that stuff falls away, all you look like is a callous narcissist who's

00:40:58.620 constantly citing himself in order to talk about himself rather than about others.

00:41:02.420 So in the Jewish community, I talked about this on my show, in the Jewish community, when

00:41:05.460 somebody dies, you hold what's called a shiva.

00:41:07.640 A shiva is seven days in which basically you shut down.

00:41:11.380 You live in your house.

00:41:12.300 You do not leave your house.

00:41:13.160 The entire community comes to you.

00:41:14.300 They bring you food.

00:41:15.520 You're supposed to pray three times a day, so they bring an entire minion with them.

00:41:18.080 They bring a Torah to your house, the whole thing.

00:41:20.440 And they come and they just listen to you talk about your family and ask you questions

00:41:23.560 about the person who died.

00:41:25.220 Number one rule of visiting a shiva house or any house in the morning, do not talk about

00:41:28.900 yourself.

00:41:29.500 Don't do it.

00:41:30.160 It's like the number one rule.

00:41:31.240 If somebody has died and you walk into a house in the morning and you immediately start

00:41:34.060 with, well, you know, my dad also died or, you know, I also had a similar experience.

00:41:38.520 This makes you a garbage human.

00:41:40.560 You are not supposed to do that.

00:41:41.960 And every time Joe Biden runs into somebody who's experienced some sort of horrible tragedy,

00:41:46.000 sometimes tragedy that's his fault, as in the case of Afghanistan, he immediately starts

00:41:49.740 telling tales about how, well, I know exactly what that's like because I've gone through exactly

00:41:54.260 the same thing that you have because Bo came home in a flag-draped coffin, which is a lie he

00:41:58.760 didn't. And he said, I mean, he tells these kinds of stories all the damn time because

00:42:02.980 he is a pathological narcissist who cares only about himself. And then projecting that narcissism

00:42:08.600 into faux empathy that the media eat up and pretend like it actually, how would you like

00:42:12.100 it if somebody came to, you know, your family got burned to a crisp? How would you like it

00:42:14.620 if somebody arrived and like, well, there was that one time where I had a bad kitchen fire?

00:42:17.420 Yeah, I almost lost my car. So there are three theories here on what caused the fires.

00:42:23.720 The liberal establishment theory is that it was the sun monster. It was climate change

00:42:28.420 because we didn't placate Mother Gaia. She burned Maui to a crisp. The second theory is

00:42:33.860 that this was malfeasance by the energy company, that they diverted all their money into green

00:42:39.580 energy policies to no avail, apparently. And four years ago, they were acknowledging the

00:42:44.040 risk of wildfires. They didn't do anything to stop it. So it was government incompetence.

00:42:48.580 There's a third theory, which I'm not saying is applicable here, but it's applicable a lot

00:42:52.300 of the time, which is that we know for a fact, many reports from the Department of Homeland

00:42:56.380 Security, that radical environmentalists start a lot of these fires, that arson is a concern.

00:43:01.240 We know arsonists were setting fires all over Maui, even within the last year. We know that

00:43:05.580 the Hawaiian Police Department was investigating that. We've seen confirmed examples of many hundreds

00:43:10.640 of these cases in recent years around the U.S. What caused the fires?

00:43:16.340 I know. And, you know, I would guess the most likely thing is that there was an electrical,

00:43:21.400 you know, fire and the winds made it spread. That's the most likely thing. But why shouldn't

00:43:26.220 you have a conspiracy theory when they're not telling you anything and they're purposely lying

00:43:29.260 to cover for...

00:43:30.900 I also don't know why that's a conspiracy theory when you're just positing possibilities,

00:43:34.120 meaning like it's not impossible and you're not saying that it actually happened that way.

00:43:36.660 Well, from the very beginning, people were saying like Oprah burned things down so she could...

00:43:39.860 Well, I mean, that kind of stuff is crazy. Like Oprah, I feel like, has better... I mean,

00:43:43.160 she does own a space laser. So, I mean, theoretically you could... But the... You don't even need

00:43:48.300 to go that far. First of all, I mean, I don't know how many of you guys have spent any time

00:43:51.240 in Maui or in Lahaina. So that used to be because we're on the West Coast. That was like my family's

00:43:55.220 getaway every single year. So we were in Lahaina like seven out of ten years. And it is just

00:43:59.420 a spectacular little... It was a spectacular little town. It was a wonderful place to hang out.

00:44:03.880 And it was always packed to the brim this time of year because that's where you would go to watch

00:44:07.820 the sunset. I mean, it's just a gorgeous place. And the fact that it burned down this quickly is

00:44:12.520 really insane. It has nothing to do with climate change, by the way. Every climatologist will tell

00:44:15.700 you. If they're worth their salt, it has nothing to do with climate change. The temperature there

00:44:19.560 is incredibly variable. They've had a very dry summer. They had a very wet winter. They had a

00:44:22.860 very dry summer. But what this always comes down to, for me, every single time, is government

00:44:27.100 mismanagement of these disasters. And you know the way you can tell? It's when they start blaming the

00:44:30.340 other stuff. Right? So when there was a hurricane that hit Florida and knocked out a bridge,

00:44:34.060 the bridge got rebuilt inside of two days and things got fixed. When the same hurricane then

00:44:39.420 moved up into the northeast and flooded part of the northeast, the media spent the next week talking

00:44:43.720 about how climate change was responsible for the fact that there was flooding in the streets of New

00:44:46.900 Jersey, as though the human failures there had nothing to do with anything. The human failures

00:44:51.900 here are astonishing. I mean, astonishing. There's an article from the AP today where they go into

00:44:58.020 detail about what it was like to be in Lahaina and what exactly was happening on a minute-to-minute

00:45:00.760 basis. The cops set up perimeters around Lahaina because there's only one road in and one road

00:45:06.400 out of Lahaina. It's really hard to get in and to get out. That's particularly true if you're on

00:45:09.080 Front Street, which is the part that's like right by the water. And it's a very crowded place all the

00:45:13.920 time. And they were telling people to turn back because there were downed electrical wires.

00:45:18.580 So you're talking about like triaging a problem. How about like direct people around the electrical

00:45:23.160 wires? The people who disobeyed the cops lived. The people who listened to the cops went back to

00:45:26.760 Lahaina died because all of the winds just picked up and rammed right through it.

00:45:30.320 Yeah, that's why the question is not, well, there is a question of what started the fires. But

00:45:34.340 to me, no matter what started them, even if environmentalists did start them,

00:45:38.900 the bigger question is why was the fire, why did it kill a thousand people or more?

00:45:44.860 Why did they close the only roads out? I'm not suggesting that it couldn't have simply been

00:45:51.620 incompetence. It probably was incompetence. But you can certainly see why people would conclude,

00:45:57.460 huh, something's a little screwy here. Is there something more going on?

00:46:01.600 This is the way you solve the problem of disinformation as Obama has always wants to

00:46:05.980 solve that problem by cutting out everybody who has an opinion different from his. That's

00:46:09.640 what he can, how he defines disinformation and misinformation. The way you solve misinformation

00:46:14.120 is by telling the freaking truth. If you were the authorities, get the information, spread it to the

00:46:19.080 people. Then when other people come up with crazy conspiracy theories, they sound like crazy

00:46:23.120 conspiracy theories. Now, crazy conspiracy theories sound like perfectly reasonable explanations

00:46:28.020 because the government is constantly lying. Did you hear what the mayor of Maui says? The mayor

00:46:30.860 of Maui is confronted by a reporter in a small press gag. What were there? Half a dozen reporters

00:46:35.300 there. And here was his answer on how many kids are dead.

00:46:38.160 I don't know. Yes, you do. How many children are missing? You know. I'll send you the answer

00:46:47.280 to that. I'd be happy to answer that. You have no estimate as to how many children are missing?

00:46:52.200 Nothing? I guess we can end this right now if you guys want.

00:46:56.160 This is one of the biggest questions that the people of Mahina have, but you don't want to

00:46:59.740 answer. It always takes one or two to ruin it for everybody. Please, this is our first

00:47:04.200 son. Well, we can say that about you. You've ruined it for everybody. You're welcome to

00:47:08.200 say it. You're the media. You can say whatever you want. You're a disaster.

00:47:11.200 All right. Okay. Please. You've been the worst mayor we could possibly imagine.

00:47:16.200 No, you won't even wait for your turn. Respect? Respect what? This is the most dismal response

00:47:21.200 we've ever had. Please. You won't wait for your turn. You want to shout over these guys that

00:47:25.200 are legitimate. Why don't you give them the real answers then? Give them the real answers.

00:47:29.200 That's not his question. Let him, let him. Yeah, yeah. Okay, yeah. You can go, you can go.

00:47:33.560 He's on the answer. Sorry. Oh, sorry. You're one guy asking a tough question, not even a basic

00:47:39.280 question, ruins it for everybody. I guess this is my other question. Even if you could say, well,

00:47:43.280 the cops shut down the roads because they just had no idea what they were doing and they were down

00:47:46.940 power lines. How is it? I mentioned earlier, 3,000 people die on 9-11. Here, we're looking at 1,000

00:47:53.300 people as it seems to be the estimate. A third of the worst tragedy in American history and the media

00:47:59.100 basically black it out? They blacked it out. Why are they blacking it out? I know.

00:48:02.880 I mean, the part, again, I just come back to the insanely obvious double standard with regard to

00:48:08.280 Biden. Like, that's the pure, that's the, let's do it to protect Biden, basically. A hundred percent,

00:48:13.120 100 percent. Or the governor of Hawaii, who's a Democrat. Yeah. Or the mayor of Maui, who's a

00:48:16.760 Democrat. Or the senators who are Democrats. I promise you that if this had happened in Florida,

00:48:20.880 all you'd get morning till night is Ron DeSantis is to blame for this. His emergency management

00:48:24.860 response has been dismal. Where was he? If George W. Bush were president, if Donald Trump were president,

00:48:28.520 and he didn't show up for two weeks while he was on vacation, I promise you, every single waking

00:48:33.600 media moment. And then if you went there and started telling fibs about how I had a kitchen fire,

00:48:38.180 like, it's just, it's the most egregious possible thing. And, you know, this is the one area where,

00:48:44.460 I think, if you're going to say that Republicans have sort of a prayer of a hope, it is that the

00:48:48.780 Democrats have created such an immense bubble around Joe Biden that he believes he can get away with

00:48:52.380 legitimately anything. And there may come, maybe he can, or maybe there'll come a point where he can't.

00:48:57.020 Maybe there'll come a point where it doesn't matter almost who the Republican, I think this is part of

00:49:00.000 the logic behind Trump. Many of the Republicans are like, well, you know what? In the end, it's not

00:49:03.700 going to matter who we nominate because Trump, because Biden is so eminently beatable. And there's

00:49:07.120 just such a wellspring of dislike. And that may be true. And that's not totally implausible. I mean,

00:49:12.820 the fact is that they've been lying on his behalf for years on end. He's presided over the worst

00:49:17.660 foreign policy disaster of my lifetime in the pullout of Afghanistan. He's presiding over one of the worst

00:49:21.020 natural disasters of my lifetime in Hawaii. I think the economic disaster over which he's presiding is

00:49:25.500 being soft peddled. Like what we are watching right now in the economy in the next six months

00:49:30.500 is going to come to. It's working. It's working. It's working. All of that, I think that's the hope

00:49:36.280 for Republicans is that it almost doesn't matter who you nominate. I don't know why you'd want to

00:49:38.780 take the risk. It seems to me the thing you'd want to do is nominate the person who has the best shot

00:49:42.800 of beating Joe Biden. But I certainly understand the feeling, which is the dual appeal of maybe he's so

00:49:48.320 weak, anybody can beat him and also screw you guys. Is that's a pretty strong emotional.

00:49:51.980 Powerful is very powerful. I think I think the I'm open to the theories that there was malice and that

00:49:59.480 some of this was intentional. I mean, I think that's a perfectly valid thing is we need to explore it.

00:50:03.180 But right now, if I had to pick a theory, it just seems to be this is this is bureaucracy.

00:50:08.100 Like it exists to not work. It exists to diffuse responsibility. No one's held accountable.

00:50:13.900 And so in this case, you've just got all these different. You've got the power company.

00:50:17.260 You've got the police. You have local you have the local government. You have the people in charge

00:50:23.800 of the water. And you've got this woke guy that was on record saying that, you know, when we're

00:50:27.760 distributing water, we want to make sure we take into account equity. So you've got all these various

00:50:31.240 different realms that that in a moment like this need to work together and need to communicate in

00:50:38.140 a competent way. And they just don't. It all completely breaks down. My problem with this theory,

00:50:42.240 though, is that for years, we've said bureaucracy doesn't work. Bureaucracy is the problem. We need

00:50:47.440 to dismantle the bureaucracy. But I'll tell you what, this bureaucracy, the federal bureaucracy

00:50:51.100 seems to work pretty well when it comes to rounding up Midwestern grannies from January 6th.

00:50:55.440 Yeah, I think the bureaucracy works pretty well when it comes to imprisoning political dissidents and

00:50:59.940 the lawyers for the Donald Trump and that who is currently the chief political rival to the

00:51:04.160 president. The bureaucracy seems to work pretty well spying on Catholic masses and arresting pro-lifers

00:51:09.260 and trying to throw pro-lifers in prison for 11 years that they're doing right now.

00:51:12.740 11 years, pro-lifers are facing a completely unjust trial because they had the audacity to

00:51:17.220 oppose abortion. So in many ways, the federal bureaucracy seems to be working all too well.

00:51:22.180 It works to defend itself. That's what it does.

00:51:25.240 They didn't care enough. That's politics. But this being ready for a disaster is a practical

00:51:31.220 concern where you have to actually care about the lives of human beings.

00:51:34.780 And when DeSantis was available to help Florida after a hurricane, they called it his, this is

00:51:40.560 his Katrina.

00:51:41.660 When Ted Cruz went to Cancun, he's a senator, he's not a governor. He went to Cancun when

00:51:46.800 there was a freeze, a cold freeze in Texas. And the media declared that this meant that

00:51:51.140 Ted Cruz did not give a crap about anybody except himself and his family. Joe Biden goes

00:51:54.840 on vacation for two weeks. He's going back to vacation now and he's clearing the lid every

00:51:59.400 single day. And meanwhile, his FEMA team is going, well, it's really up to the localities

00:52:03.540 to handle this sort of thing. It's insanity to me. And I understand, again, what I keep

00:52:10.640 coming back to for Republicans, I get it. I get the feeling that inevitably the pendulum

00:52:15.000 has to swing back the other way and the bad people have to get clocked. I totally get it.

00:52:18.740 But there's no rule that says that's true. The notion that the unjust will pay their price.

00:52:25.680 Well, there is something to this because the thing that the Democrats have done repeatedly,

00:52:31.480 they call it the curly effect, they basically chase the non-Democrat voters out of localities

00:52:38.060 by making it so unlivable there that the only people left are the people who will vote for

00:52:42.140 them. So you get the doom loop in San Francisco. That actually works if you happen to be in

00:52:46.640 government because the only people left in San Francisco will be the people who will vote

00:52:49.780 you back into office every single time because they're doing fine. They're living on the streets.

00:52:54.620 That's where they want to be. That actually works. The problem is it doesn't work for the entire

00:52:59.580 nation because there's nowhere for the entire nation to go. People in California can go to

00:53:03.900 Florida. People in America got nowhere to go. So ultimately, this government is now so corrupt,

00:53:10.360 so unresponsive, and so dishonest in dealing with the public that there is some chance that the people

00:53:15.800 will just say, you know what, we've had it. They did it with Reagan. They did it with Giuliani in

00:53:19.340 New York. They may well do it again, but to me, Trump is like a big fat elephant stuck in the

00:53:28.160 door that he opened. He opened the door of the future, but he's now stuck in it, and he's not

00:53:31.940 going to let anybody get through. The only thing you're wrong about is there is a place for American

00:53:35.120 conservatives to go. We've seen it in the recent years, and that, of course, is hunger.

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00:54:47.020 life. That is pound 250. Say baby or visit pre-born.com slash backstage. Now we've been floating some

00:54:55.360 conspiracy theories. Did you know this? By the way, you always say I never make you any money. I finally

00:55:00.520 made you like a little tiny bit of money. What? Like a little, like enough to buy you like and maybe

00:55:04.760 my shoes. So this was a little unexpected. I am the most popular game show host in America.

00:55:12.020 This show we started on the Daily Wire YouTube channel. It is the yes or no game. We've sold a

00:55:16.560 bazillion of these games. They, uh, they, we sell out every single time. We now have the expansion pack.

00:55:22.200 The expansion pack is the conspiracy theory pack. And the producers of this very show want answers

00:55:28.820 from four of the cards on this, on this game. Just your, listen, you don't, you're not being

00:55:33.500 held to anything. Media Matters is going to clip it out anyway, but this is a safe space.

00:55:37.600 If I say something about 9-11, I'll pretend I never said it.

00:55:40.320 Hypothetically. Don't worry. Hypothetically.

00:55:41.480 That were to happen. Your polls will go up. These are, I did not write these cards. I take no

00:55:45.540 responsibility for them. Just want to go round robin a little bit here. This is a mean one. This

00:55:52.080 is actually a mean one. I don't even want to say it.

00:55:54.420 It was me. I mean, ask me the question, but I'll read it too.

00:55:58.100 Michelle Obama is a man. Uh, can I take that one? Yeah. I am increasingly convincing. There's

00:56:06.720 some validity to that. No, I really am. I've seen, look, some people have looked into this

00:56:11.580 and, uh, I think especially. Joan Rivers. She looked into it. God's sake, Matt, you're the only

00:56:18.180 one in America who knows that women can't be men. Stop it. Well, but the question is,

00:56:23.780 question there. I don't know. Look, and we, and we, some, some information has come out

00:56:28.020 about, about Obama recently that, uh, that, that also confirms what we were told was once

00:56:33.220 a conspiracy theory. He did like dudes. He did like dudes. That is the thing that he wrote

00:56:35.920 about. Yeah. So I don't know. Girlfriend, which is a weird thing to write to a girlfriend,

00:56:38.160 by the way. Yeah. Very weird thing to write to a girlfriend. I can explain it. Of course you

00:56:41.440 can. No, I can explain it. I know. I was waiting for this moment. Listen, I know that I tap

00:56:44.980 dance. I've done musical theater. I was by far the straightest man ever to enter my particular

00:56:49.260 alma mater, uh, and live in New York and LA because a lot of people there, they say one

00:56:54.200 in four, maybe more. And one thing I noticed is even the straight guys in these liberal enclaves

00:57:00.040 act kind of gay. But he said he had fantasies. Yeah. Yeah. But he, every day. No, I look,

00:57:05.400 he probably did fantasize about dudes, but the way he wrote it, he said, look, I think we can

00:57:10.460 transcend sex. He actually was writing about transgenderism kind of early. And he said, I think

00:57:14.640 that we can transcend these things. I want to be larger than my attraction to this, that,

00:57:19.500 or the other thing. But he also said, I just fantasize in my head, but I, he said, channel

00:57:25.920 it toward him. Yeah. He said something. Yeah. I channeled it toward my ruthless political ambition,

00:57:28.940 but he also said, I know my body tells me I'm a man. And so that's just what I'm going to

00:57:34.420 do both in my identity and in my desires. The only male I've ever fantasized about sleeping

00:57:39.920 with is Winnie the Pooh. And I was very small and we were just cuddling. And I think if you're

00:57:44.140 actually fantasizing every day about guys. It's weird. It's a weird thing. It's a little

00:57:47.960 strange. By the way, that doesn't mean she's a dude. So the phenomenal interview in Tablet

00:57:52.700 Magazine, the reason this came up again is because there's this phenomenal interview with

00:57:55.540 his biographer in Tablet Magazine. A serious biographer. Everyone has dodged. Why are we

00:57:59.580 dodging this question? Yeah. Michelle is obviously a man. Oh God. Okay. Stop. Ben Shapiro.

00:58:05.360 Not a man. She's a woman. I heard Ben Shapiro say. Very bad woman, by the way. She's a woman.

00:58:10.560 She's not a man. I'm disappointed in you, Ben. I am. I've always thought he was a fearless

00:58:16.600 truth teller. For those who haven't read the interview between Obama's biographer and Tablet,

00:58:23.800 it is fascinating because one of the things that one of the interviewers says is that when they

00:58:28.800 went to interview Obama, Obama had like a stack of his writings on the table, like his old letters

00:58:34.620 and stuff that he wouldn't let him see. And it's the belief of the interviewer and the biographer

00:58:38.640 as well, that Obama would literally sit there and like write journals to himself. And then

00:58:42.340 he would encode them in letters to his girlfriends with the notion that in one day these letters

00:58:46.860 would be discovered and then eventually be used in biographies. And of course this thing

00:58:51.540 got buried. This thing got buried, right? It ended up at Emory University. No one quoted

00:58:54.300 it. Nobody ever talked about it because it would have been super awkward when he was running

00:58:57.660 for president. I fantasize about sleeping with men every day. It would have been kind of weird

00:59:00.740 for him and might've led to, you know, some further questions about whether that was acted

00:59:03.800 upon by, uh, by that guy. But no, but the guy, the guy who uncovered it, uh, David Garrow,

00:59:08.440 he's a Pulitzer prize winning biographer and a leftist and he's a leftist. Yeah. And as was

00:59:13.040 the guy who interviewed him. Yeah. And we just have to ask why Joan Rivers died so suddenly

00:59:16.760 after she said a certain thing that was on that card. Okay. Uh, next one on here. Dinosaurs,

00:59:21.900 as we know them are fake. Hmm. What do you mean? As we know them? I don't know. Interpret it

00:59:29.540 as you like. No. Dinosaurs are not fake. They've, they've all testified to me that they're

00:59:33.800 absolutely real. They do. Well, you were friends. I was there. I was there. Well, I, okay. I think

00:59:38.480 dinosaurs existed, but probably a lot, the, the, the popular conception we have of them

00:59:43.500 is like, there's a lot of, uh, there's a lot of probably baseless conjecture. Well, now they

00:59:48.040 change it. Now they say they look like chickens. I mean, I said they have feathers in some of them.

00:59:50.980 Yeah. Well, there is, there's every possibility that some of the dinosaurs, and they, they acknowledge

00:59:55.460 this, by the way, are like the reconstruction of the, of the lion in like 13th century Britain.

01:00:00.560 Yeah. You know, where they, they tried to bring a lion back from Africa to Britain and it, and it

01:00:04.840 died and it decomposed. And by the time they got it back to Britain, it was basically like a bag of

01:00:08.400 bones. And so when they stuffed it back together, it looks like this bizarre cat cow kind of thing.

01:00:13.600 It's possible we're doing that with the dinosaurs. And when you go in, you see all the bones put

01:00:16.160 together. It's like, well, actually the neck wasn't that long or this is a tailbone or something.

01:00:20.720 That's fine. But also dinosaurs exist. We saw Jurassic Park. They were obvious. They were there.

01:00:24.960 Chris Pratt told me, my take is that dinosaurs are real, but they were dragons. That's my

01:00:32.580 take. I mean that, I mean that sincerely. Breathing fire or no?

01:00:35.480 Yeah. No, like in the sense that dinosaurs are this construction of modern scientific, atheist,

01:00:41.240 materialist, stupid culture. And, and dragons are the product of the, uh, intuition and imagination

01:00:48.420 of every, and they were placed here by aliens. No. Yeah. Basically it, dragons are

01:00:54.940 to dinosaurs. What? They were flying and breathing fire. They were at least flying. Well,

01:01:01.060 I mean, we know they're flying, but they're breathing fire. They're the, whatever legend

01:01:06.440 cropped up, look, they may have been breathing fire, but whatever legend cropped up that they

01:01:09.760 were breathing fire comes from a real place like legends about all historical things.

01:01:14.140 I don't like that, but I will say, you know, I watch a lot of nature documentaries with my

01:01:17.300 kids and that you, when you watch what, especially about dinosaurs and you have some, uh, you know,

01:01:20.820 scientists is like, pulls out a fossil with one little line in it and has this whole story about,

01:01:25.840 well, this is clearly a triceratops that was, you know, 40 tons and a female and five years old.

01:01:30.980 It's like, how can you possibly know all that? So I think there's a lot of, yeah.

01:01:34.600 They didn't know their gender, first of all.

01:01:36.120 Who would?

01:01:36.800 How could they?

01:01:37.080 Who could?

01:01:37.700 Nobody could.

01:01:38.580 Okay.

01:01:38.820 Things they said about Michelle.

01:01:40.280 The CEO, oh, this is going to get our company destroyed. That's cool.

01:01:43.720 Really smart big guys. The CEO and founder of Facebook is a reptilian, not a dragon, but

01:01:52.820 a reptilian. Ben?

01:01:59.460 Robot, not alien.

01:02:01.200 Robot, not alien.

01:02:02.220 Robot, not alien.

01:02:02.700 Who's constructed in a lab, not on planet Xenuf 10.

01:02:06.300 Yeah, like he's not, he's not like a reptilian alien who's wearing a skin suit and here to

01:02:11.260 destroy humanity. He is what we, in modern notions, call, call robots engineers.

01:02:19.800 Like, that is what he is.

01:02:21.200 I think the more interesting reptilian question is the guy on the plane, on the infamous plane,

01:02:26.380 the mother of the reference, who wasn't real.

01:02:27.800 Yeah.

01:02:28.040 Which is so strange. Everyone's like, where is the woman? Where did she go? And then we

01:02:31.540 found the woman. Nobody ever asked, like, what about that guy? Have we ever heard a word

01:02:35.160 from him?

01:02:35.920 Yeah, what did she see?

01:02:37.420 Maybe she saw him.

01:02:37.880 Yeah, did the guy, it was a real question. Did that guy ever do any kind of interview and say,

01:02:40.800 you know, and why, why was it okay to trace this poor woman down?

01:02:44.840 Right.

01:02:44.960 I think it's so awful.

01:02:47.080 It's so awful.

01:02:47.480 That, that they, they tracked this poor woman who had spooly shards at the, at the lobby,

01:02:54.160 you know, or at the, the bar.

01:02:55.220 She should have claimed parentage in the Biden family.

01:02:57.180 Somebody there were $20 million.

01:02:57.940 And they never would have found it.

01:02:58.880 And also, what does she have to apologize for?

01:03:00.420 Like, she.

01:03:00.640 Right, exactly.

01:03:01.400 She, well, was she really.

01:03:02.520 It's actually crazy. That's not the same thing.

01:03:03.320 Well, but also, but she really, whatever happened, she really thought that there was some kind

01:03:07.080 of reptilian monster on the plane. And so she did the right thing with the information she had,

01:03:10.780 which was to tell everybody.

01:03:12.360 Was there?

01:03:12.820 Right?

01:03:13.200 Well, we have the clip, actually. We have this very important piece of journalism.

01:03:15.860 Say whatever you want. I'm telling you, I'm getting the f*** off. And there's a reason

01:03:22.820 why I'm getting the f*** off. And everyone can either believe it or they cannot believe it.

01:03:28.360 I don't give two f***s, but I am telling you right now, that mother f***, that mother f*** back

01:03:36.160 there is not real. And you can sit on this plane and you can f***ing die with them or not.

01:03:43.300 I'm not going to.

01:03:45.220 Would you have stayed on a plane after seeing that, right before it takes off?

01:03:48.020 Yeah.

01:03:50.240 Of course. Of course. I'm not going to miss my plane for some crazy person.

01:03:53.480 Well, those are bad vibes to start on a plane.

01:03:56.320 No, I mean, I'm not getting off the plane unless Perszynski's on it or whatever.

01:04:01.200 Prigozian, right?

01:04:01.860 Prigozian, whatever his name is.

01:04:03.000 His mistake was getting Trump elected. I think it offended Hillary.

01:04:06.500 He made the second most famous blunder.

01:04:10.840 The second most famous blunder is leading a revolt against the head of the

01:04:14.500 Russian state and then flying a plane close to his border.

01:04:18.180 The most famous is invading Russia in the wintertime, right?

01:04:20.500 It was like, you shouldn't do that.

01:04:22.060 Also, that plane committed suicide.

01:04:24.280 I mean, that's what Vladimir Putin says.

01:04:25.520 It fell off the fifth floor of a building.

01:04:27.020 I'm picturing Putin's dismay when he was running up to the field with his gun in hands and he sees the burning wreckage and there's just Hillary standing with a bazooka and she beat him to it.

01:04:39.580 He must have been so crestfallen.

01:04:41.840 It's crazy when we find out Epstein was on that plane.

01:04:43.380 You know, at first I felt bad for the other people on the plane with Prigozian.

01:04:47.640 You know, head of the Wagner group leads the coup against Putin.

01:04:50.440 But then I thought, if you're sitting on the plane with Prigozian...

01:04:54.440 Well, it's a private plane, too, right?

01:04:55.460 It's obviously a private plane.

01:04:56.480 It's not like he was on a Southwest right.

01:04:58.100 Yeah.

01:04:58.580 It's not, right?

01:04:59.320 Well, he's not A-list preferred, you don't think?

01:05:01.440 Right.

01:05:01.620 The head of the Wagner group?

01:05:02.440 If you're on, like, the private plane with the head of the Wagner group, I could bet that you're not, like, the cleanest person.

01:05:10.520 Yeah.

01:05:11.140 Yeah, you've got problems.

01:05:12.120 Hopefully there are no children aboard or something.

01:05:13.760 Like, people are not responsible for themselves.

01:05:15.220 This is the final question to debate.

01:05:17.180 Taylor Swift is the clone...

01:05:18.940 What is this?

01:05:19.860 Taylor Swift is the clone of Xena LeVay, daughter of the infamous Satanist Anton LeVay.

01:05:28.900 Right, I remember.

01:05:29.560 Whoa, man, that's crazy.

01:05:30.820 Yes, I've never heard of that, but yes.

01:05:32.440 Yeah, she is, right?

01:05:33.760 You don't even have to explain beyond Satanist.

01:05:35.060 Yes.

01:05:35.760 Yeah.

01:05:36.340 Whoa, man, that's so weird.

01:05:38.160 Am I the only person who likes Taylor Swift, I think?

01:05:39.920 Yes.

01:05:40.760 Well, yeah, you're the only person who hasn't been just sucked into this, like, demonic cult.

01:05:45.480 I know, like, and the only non-millennial white girl.

01:05:48.280 The only thing is, she writes her own music, right?

01:05:50.820 She's got that going for her.

01:05:51.620 Not anymore, right?

01:05:52.040 She used to.

01:05:53.080 Her modern songs are one of those, like, 11 people write them.

01:05:56.860 Trying to give her some credit, but...

01:05:58.500 Well, she can't sing.

01:05:59.680 Nice leg.

01:06:01.260 Damn it.

01:06:01.820 Drew, all you care about is Zena or Taylor.

01:06:04.960 Damn it, Drew, you old perv.

01:06:06.020 Just cut it out.

01:06:06.840 Is it Zena?

01:06:08.040 That was the...

01:06:08.640 Bill Buckley had that line.

01:06:09.580 He was asked if he approved of miniskirts by some young gal, and he said, well, on you,

01:06:12.440 I do.

01:06:12.980 That's basically your point, Drew.

01:06:14.920 Absolutely.

01:06:15.700 Okay, well...

01:06:16.940 That was great.

01:06:17.740 I can't believe...

01:06:18.280 I can't believe that that was a best-selling game.

01:06:20.720 So that's making money, eh?

01:06:22.000 Is that...

01:06:22.500 Yeah, this...

01:06:23.540 Guys, I think it was great.

01:06:24.240 You should go buy it.

01:06:24.840 The one...

01:06:25.540 I'll tell you, the one that really freaked me out, the Zena LeVay thing, man.

01:06:29.300 Especially because, well, this guy's talking about aliens all the time.

01:06:32.260 I point out that it's probably demons.

01:06:34.400 And, man, that's some weird demonic stuff.

01:06:36.960 That's some occult, weird Satanist stuff.

01:06:39.080 If you play...

01:06:39.980 They sound exactly the same.

01:06:41.660 Yeah, they do.

01:06:42.380 If you play them forwards, they sound...

01:06:44.200 People playing the game aren't going to have the benefit of that picture, so they're not

01:06:47.240 going to...

01:06:47.400 That's a real...

01:06:48.120 Yeah.

01:06:48.740 That's a deep cut.

01:06:49.340 That's a deep cut.

01:06:50.120 You have to...

01:06:50.500 Listen, the audience is the real creme de la creme of the political public, you know.

01:06:55.940 All right.

01:06:56.520 We have to get to...

01:06:57.380 That was a great segment.

01:06:57.880 I thought it was a good segment, by the way.

01:06:58.900 I loved it.

01:06:59.340 What we just did.

01:06:59.860 Just loved it.

01:07:01.060 Every moment was gold, basically.

01:07:02.960 Now, we have to get to something that actually involves a colleague of ours, which we'll get to in

01:07:06.580 one second, but we have to get to a shameless plug that involves

01:07:09.280 another colleague of ours, who happens to be in the place that conservatives escape to,

01:07:12.820 which is Hungary, and that would be Jeremy's Soap.

01:07:16.480 Where is that guy?

01:07:17.120 He is gallivanting all about selling soap.

01:07:21.460 He's clean.

01:07:22.100 We're seeing it more every day.

01:07:23.700 He's a clean old man.

01:07:25.640 Mainstream brands openly insult their customer base, and they expect you to be okay with it.

01:07:30.560 Well, thankfully, Jeremy's Razors not only makes great products, but the company has no

01:07:36.240 agenda either, unless you count restoring sanity to the world one product at a time, like with

01:07:43.180 Jeremy's Hand Soap.

01:07:44.020 An all-purpose cleaner.

01:07:44.980 Both are free of parabens, sulfates, artificial dyes, and wokeness, and they're made right here

01:07:50.960 in the USA.

01:07:52.300 Remember, you are not responsible for woke culture, but you sure as hell don't have to

01:07:57.860 participate in it either.

01:07:59.460 Stop giving your money to woke corporations that hate you.

01:08:02.160 Go to jeremysrazors.com today.

01:08:04.920 You do the ad all wrong, if you're going to do the ad right, you've got to close it.

01:08:06.880 You've got to hold it?

01:08:07.660 All right, let's see.

01:08:08.240 Can we get a nice close shot there?

01:08:10.200 You ready?

01:08:10.820 If you're going to do the ad, it's got to be like this.

01:08:12.280 Do you see this hand soap?

01:08:13.280 It's magnificent.

01:08:14.380 It smells delightful.

01:08:15.540 It is green tea and citrus hand soap.

01:08:18.040 Each and every day, you'll be grateful that you use this particular hand soap.

01:08:22.300 This right here is the all-purpose cleaner for all purposes.

01:08:26.340 There are literally no purposes for which you cannot use this particular cleaner.

01:08:29.800 Could you use it to clean your emails off your hard drive?

01:08:32.020 Absolutely, you could.

01:08:32.860 But you should head on over to jeremysrazors.com right now and enjoy products like the ones

01:08:37.000 that I just threw.

01:08:38.400 Take my money and give me those beautiful products.

01:08:41.380 We have an all-purpose cleaner.

01:08:42.300 That's pretty cool.

01:08:42.600 What is a paraben?

01:08:43.840 I have no idea.

01:08:44.460 I've been talking about it for weeks on the show.

01:08:46.000 No clue what a paraben is.

01:08:46.440 I think it's like seed oils.

01:08:48.320 All I know is it's bad.

01:08:49.520 It's like a quasi-ben.

01:08:50.660 It's like a paraben.

01:08:51.200 Yeah, it's a really cutting-edge hip humor on this show, folks.

01:08:59.020 Drew loved that one.

01:09:00.200 So, a pal of ours, colleague of ours, is being threatened by Canada, America's evil top hat.

01:09:08.920 This is Jordan's fault for being Canadian.

01:09:11.340 Yes.

01:09:13.020 I've never heard that before.

01:09:14.020 That's the first thing you said I loved.

01:09:15.360 Thank you.

01:09:16.000 No, I had a pun in that video.

01:09:17.420 America's evil top hat.

01:09:18.260 America's evil top hat.

01:09:19.380 And I had some joke about a cookbook that you also got.

01:09:21.500 Oh, that was amazing.

01:09:22.300 Thank you.

01:09:22.720 That was a good joke.

01:09:23.060 All right, I've got two.

01:09:23.780 You're right.

01:09:24.080 That was a great joke.

01:09:25.320 In 10 years.

01:09:27.060 Two in a decade.

01:09:27.860 Ontario is threatening to take away Jordan's psychology license.

01:09:34.060 The Superior Court of Justice ordered Jordan to pay $25,000 to the College of Psychologists

01:09:39.280 and upheld the order that he go through a so-called social media re-education program.

01:09:45.360 I pity the re-education program.

01:09:47.720 Can you imagine?

01:09:49.240 Like, yeah.

01:09:50.120 I will not tweet what you want me to tweet.

01:09:53.460 You know, they've been making this mistake with Jordan from the very beginning.

01:09:56.400 I mean, if they had just left him alone, it'd still be like teaching university classes.

01:10:00.660 For people who, you know, believe that the left in America does not want to actively shut

01:10:06.820 down speech, they do.

01:10:09.020 I mean, take a look again.

01:10:10.140 I mean, they want to destroy your life.

01:10:11.880 They really, really do.

01:10:13.580 I was explaining this to somebody, again, a friend of mine who's on the left, and I blew

01:10:17.600 his mind when I explained to him that if it comes down to Trump versus Biden, I will

01:10:21.220 vote for Trump, and it won't really take much to convince me of that, like, at all.

01:10:26.020 And he asked why, and I said, because of this.

01:10:28.020 Because you want to trans my kids, you want to, or at least you want to make it good and

01:10:32.580 proper for the public schools to work to trans my kids.

01:10:34.880 You will attempt to shut me down if I speak freely.

01:10:37.880 And then they'll be like, no, no, no, that's not true at all.

01:10:40.340 Yes, it is.

01:10:41.360 Yes, it is.

01:10:42.000 I mean, look what they're doing in Canada.

01:10:43.320 Look what they're doing in the UK.

01:10:45.160 The goal here has always been and will always be to make traditional living illegal and make

01:10:50.980 personal sexuality public.

01:10:52.600 That's like the only thing that matters to these folks.

01:10:54.740 So in order, apparently, to be a licensed psychologist, you have to be fully insane in Canada.

01:10:59.480 You have to actually parrot insanity back to people to be a licensed psychologist in Canada.

01:11:04.120 Honestly, like, Jordan is going to make their lives so miserable.

01:11:08.180 It'll be fun to watch.

01:11:09.140 It'll be quite fun to watch, Jordan, actually.

01:11:10.940 Like, I would love to sit in the room watching Jordan take social media re-education training.

01:11:16.520 It would be one of the great experiences of my life.

01:11:18.920 I would pay honest-to-God money to, like, be available in that room.

01:11:22.800 I would appoint, I would go get a Canadian bar license to go and be in that room while

01:11:26.960 they try to teach Jordan the things he can and cannot say on Twitter.

01:11:30.000 I just cannot imagine.

01:11:31.100 This is a man who, as psychology is facing this replication crisis, this whole crisis of

01:11:37.940 identity for the entire field, this man has done more good from the field of psychology

01:11:44.240 than anybody since at least Viktor Frankl and maybe just any psychologist ever.

01:11:49.440 More people are, people come up to me with tears in their lives.

01:11:52.500 I'm not exaggerating.

01:11:53.500 And they will say, Michael, you know Jordan Peterson, the man changed my life.

01:11:57.240 And grown men, like serious men.

01:11:59.300 And I think that's the guy that Castro's son goes after.

01:12:04.420 That's why.

01:12:05.120 That's why.

01:12:05.520 That's why.

01:12:05.920 Because he's changed their life for the better.

01:12:07.280 And he's made them feel better about being men.

01:12:09.300 And he's made them understand what it means to be a man.

01:12:11.680 And he speaks.

01:12:12.400 You know, the funny thing about Jordan, too, is like, you know, because he has a, he can

01:12:16.580 have a harsh, you know, affect on Twitter where he just, he gets so angry at these people

01:12:20.680 because they pick on people who are smaller than them.

01:12:22.860 He hates bullies.

01:12:24.160 But he's the most gracious, kindly person that you could possibly meet.

01:12:28.300 And he genuinely cares about the people who are being stomped on.

01:12:32.340 And that's why they're stomping on him.

01:12:33.540 Why wouldn't they?

01:12:34.540 Why wouldn't they?

01:12:35.020 By the way, you found the conspiracy theory I do believe in.

01:12:37.240 There's no question that Justin Trudeau is Castro's son.

01:12:39.780 There's no question about this.

01:12:41.500 I agree.

01:12:42.020 Zero doubt.

01:12:42.880 I have started to keep an open mind on this.

01:12:45.600 Because by some angles, he sort of vaguely kind of looks like Pierre.

01:12:51.520 No, no.

01:12:52.880 I'm sorry that you're experiencing a stigmatism.

01:12:54.840 Yeah.

01:12:56.120 Okay, you're right.

01:12:57.400 You're right.

01:12:57.720 He's the son of the Cuban dictator.

01:12:59.700 By the way, I think what you said is really important.

01:13:02.100 Because to me, that's the even more dire implication of stories like this.

01:13:05.000 There's the free speech angle, really important.

01:13:06.900 But the fact that this is what the psychology industry has become is people need to understand

01:13:12.400 that.

01:13:12.580 I mean, this is why I'm so skeptical and critical of it fundamentally.

01:13:17.040 Totally.

01:13:17.220 And I would, before I would advise any loved one to go see a psychologist, I would be very,

01:13:22.940 very careful because the entire industry has been totally ideologically captured.

01:13:28.020 I mean, there was a story a few days ago about a child psychologist, prominent one in California

01:13:31.780 somewhere, of course, I think, who was talking about gender.

01:13:34.960 Some children are gender minotaurs or you could be a gender Prius.

01:13:39.980 Well, they made it illegal to practice actual psychology, right?

01:13:43.260 If a kid comes into you and says, I'm sexually confused.

01:13:46.040 And then you say, well, maybe you ought to wait on that and see how it develops.

01:13:49.680 It's perfectly normal at the age of 14 to be sexually confused.

01:13:52.860 That's a no-no.

01:13:53.640 That's conversion therapy.

01:13:55.020 And most psychologists have gone along with that completely, with very few exceptions,

01:13:59.280 and the ones that have not gone along with it, like Jordan Peterson.

01:14:01.340 This is the irony of the so-called conversion therapy.

01:14:04.740 All therapy is, by definition, conversion therapy.

01:14:07.800 Yes, and why should you not be able to go to somebody and say, I'm gay, I'd like to not

01:14:12.920 be gay, can you possibly help me?

01:14:14.760 And see, and explore that.

01:14:16.060 I don't understand that at all.

01:14:17.220 Right, but if you go to any psychologist, you say, I have a mental problem, I've got

01:14:21.720 some block, can you convince me to think in a different way and behave in a different

01:14:25.480 way?

01:14:25.880 That is a conversion.

01:14:26.900 Every time it's a type of conversion.

01:14:28.240 There is a strain, and it is a strain under fire, no question about it.

01:14:32.160 There's a strain of Christian psychology that I think can be very useful to people.

01:14:36.180 I think it's useful to people to talk to someone.

01:14:38.160 I think talking to someone who cares about you and doesn't have a stake in your life can be

01:14:43.160 immensely important, but you're absolutely right about this.

01:14:46.300 I think it can be useful, but it can also cause more damage than it does good.

01:14:52.540 Well, if the person is incompetent or evil.

01:14:54.700 But I think, you know, I'm also critical of just the idea of like, well, go to therapy.

01:14:58.400 Everybody just always go to therapy.

01:14:59.700 I think what drives people to go to therapy oftentimes is just that they want to just

01:15:03.120 talk about themselves.

01:15:04.000 Right.

01:15:04.100 And they have a lot of fun talking about themselves, and they want to kind of wallow in their own

01:15:10.340 misery, and they want to tell their own story, and all the suffering they've gone through.

01:15:15.360 That's all they actually want to do.

01:15:16.700 That's why there's no, as far as I'm aware, no data supporting the idea that simple talk

01:15:20.820 therapy is worthwhile.

01:15:21.880 It has to be combined with cognitive behavioral therapy, right, which is an actual intervention

01:15:25.300 by the psychologist saying, your train of thoughts, for example, you're anxious, and

01:15:28.780 your anxiety is being caused by this train of thoughts.

01:15:31.080 We need to intervene and say, is this train of thoughts logical?

01:15:33.240 Is this correct?

01:15:33.900 Are you actively realizing what you're doing?

01:15:36.160 That's CBT, right?

01:15:36.880 So CBT, actually, there's very good data, but that's an interventionist approach to psychology.

01:15:42.100 I don't know when the confirmatory approach to psychology came about, but even Freud rejected

01:15:46.800 that.

01:15:47.180 I mean, what's amazing is that when Freud talks about, for example, polymorphous perversity,

01:15:52.540 right, this idea that there's like this human sex drive and that we're driven to, that

01:15:55.620 we're truly driven by the sex drive, he then suggests that that's bad, and that the way

01:15:59.300 that you actually end up being a productive human being is you sublimate that in favor

01:16:02.700 of, he does say this, I mean, if you sublimate that, correct, in favor of higher purposes,

01:16:07.820 and the act of maturing is maturing out of treating those desires as primary and sublimating

01:16:13.300 them to higher desires and better things.

01:16:15.420 That's the entire process of growing up.

01:16:16.940 It's only in the 1960s where they say, no, no, no, real authenticity is where you strip

01:16:20.120 away the sublimation.

01:16:21.040 Sublimation is a form of anxiety, and you have to deal with it.

01:16:23.440 There is an underlying philosophy to Freud, which he didn't intend, but it's simply built

01:16:29.020 into the system where the true reality of you is your basest desires, and everything

01:16:35.520 else is laid on top of that, and that's not always been the case.

01:16:38.480 I mean, if you think of Plato and the chariot analogy, all of our instincts, including our

01:16:43.680 noble instincts, are included in us, and they're part of who we are.

01:16:47.000 And I think that, you know, I have to say, on a more shallow level, I worked with a lot

01:16:53.340 of suicidal people.

01:16:54.320 I've been on hotlines and things like this.

01:16:56.200 50% of them call up to tell you why they can't be helped.

01:17:00.220 50% of them do not want to be helped.

01:17:02.160 50% of them are looking just for somebody to say, you're not awful.

01:17:05.760 And that's not a bad thing.

01:17:07.020 I don't think that's a bad thing.

01:17:08.020 I think that's helpful.

01:17:09.120 But I think one of the problems with the psychology industry is that the only hope we

01:17:16.620 Jordan Peterson is a good psychologist because he's a good philosopher.

01:17:20.100 And psychology is not really, the idea that it's like medicine or science, it's not exactly.

01:17:24.680 A good psychologist is someone that has a good idea of, like, what a human being is

01:17:29.880 supposed to be.

01:17:30.900 Absolutely.

01:17:31.340 And that's what you go to a psychologist with that question.

01:17:33.200 What am I supposed to be?

01:17:34.120 How am I supposed to think?

01:17:35.700 What ways am I supposed to act?

01:17:37.340 And those are not medical questions.

01:17:39.880 Those are not scientific questions.

01:17:41.240 Those are philosophical questions.

01:17:42.560 The reason why Jordan Peterson is so effective is because he's just a good philosopher.

01:17:46.340 He's got a good, he's got wisdom.

01:17:47.620 He's got a good sense of how a person is supposed to be.

01:17:49.620 You're right about this because when it comes to medicine, there is an agreed upon standard

01:17:53.260 of what you are trying to achieve, right?

01:17:55.380 When it comes to medicine, you come in, your leg hurts.

01:17:57.980 The idea is, how do I make it so my leg doesn't hurt and functions properly?

01:18:01.040 But functions properly is well understood.

01:18:02.420 A leg that functions properly lets you go places, supports your weight, all of these sorts

01:18:06.040 of things.

01:18:06.600 When you come in, you say, I as a human am not functioning properly, that requires some

01:18:10.540 explication.

01:18:11.180 What does it mean to function properly as a human?

01:18:12.900 And this is where you get into the philosophy section, right?

01:18:14.880 Because we have generate, we have millennia of traditions suggesting what it means to

01:18:18.860 be a properly functioning human being.

01:18:20.340 And really, over the course of the last century and a half, we've decided that to be a fully

01:18:22.900 functioning human being means to essentially humor your basest desires.

01:18:27.260 That's what it means to be a fully functional human being.

01:18:29.460 And it's really all of these other impositions by society that have prevented you from engaging

01:18:33.500 in the great you that exists internally.

01:18:36.600 And that's where psychology has gone utterly wrong.

01:18:39.080 And that is not, not what history, the history of philosophy tells us.

01:18:44.300 The history of philosophy has always said that there is an aspect of the human being that

01:18:47.580 knows right from wrong, that can reason to right from wrong, and that can impose restrictions

01:18:51.700 on its basic issues.

01:18:53.060 And that's built into the human person.

01:18:55.060 Psychology, like modern psychology, never asks, in order to accomplish what?

01:18:59.280 So again, when they say like, heal your leg, it's in order to accomplish walking, in order

01:19:02.640 to accomplish carrying.

01:19:03.720 When they say, I want to be a whole human being, in order to accomplish what?

01:19:06.340 Because what you want to accomplish is going to be a large part of which direction we're

01:19:10.240 actually directing the healing.

01:19:12.080 If you say, I want to be non-anxious, and so I want to be non-anxious so that I can party

01:19:17.080 all night long and drink without worrying about it, then a psychologist theoretically could

01:19:22.060 do that.

01:19:22.420 They could say, you know what?

01:19:23.040 Don't worry about anything in your life.

01:19:24.380 Get rid of all of your worries.

01:19:25.340 Get rid of all of your cares.

01:19:26.240 Live off of welfare.

01:19:26.920 And do all those things, and you won't be anxious anymore, and your anxiety is healed.

01:19:29.760 But that's not a properly functional human being.

01:19:32.180 The other way to actually deal with the anxiety is to say, you're anxious about some things

01:19:35.260 that are actually real.

01:19:36.080 Let's figure out solutions that allow you to channel that in the most positive possible

01:19:38.920 direction for your flourishing and the flourishing of your family.

01:19:41.860 What's amazing, there used to be, in the olden days, before modern people ruined everything,

01:19:45.940 there was a simple answer that old Uncle Aristotle gave us, which is this idea of the four causes.

01:19:50.540 We have a formal cause, a material cause, an efficient cause, and a final cause.

01:19:54.200 So the formal, for us, for people, the formal cause is the soul, the material is the body,

01:20:00.020 the matter, the efficient is, well, God makes us, you know.

01:20:03.300 And the final cause is, Aristotle would say, happiness, eudaimonia, human flourishing.

01:20:10.000 We Christians would say, to know God and to love him forever and to serve him here on

01:20:13.580 earth.

01:20:15.020 Modern people say, that's BS, that's a bunch of mumbo jumbo from a pre-scientific age.

01:20:19.220 Forget about the final cause stuff.

01:20:20.880 Forget about the formal cause.

01:20:21.860 You don't have souls.

01:20:22.540 You don't have any of that.

01:20:23.120 Come on, get out of here.

01:20:24.580 But they don't actually get rid of it.

01:20:27.280 What Aristotle understood is, you have to have an answer to that, and the modern people have

01:20:31.140 an answer to that.

01:20:31.900 They say now, instead of the formal cause being the soul, they say, well, you know,

01:20:35.180 man, it's just like my identity, man.

01:20:37.080 It's my whatever.

01:20:37.620 And for the final cause, what do they say?

01:20:39.980 What the implicit final cause today, for human beings, as they say, is just to feel good.

01:20:45.040 You know, just to have pleasure.

01:20:46.480 Yeah.

01:20:46.780 And it makes people miserable.

01:20:48.040 And also, they have forgotten the fact that to do right,

01:20:51.400 to do right is the path to feeling better about yourself.

01:20:54.940 To do, you know, this-

01:20:56.220 Well, ironically, as we've gotten rid of death-

01:20:57.700 People speak as if there were no moral standards.

01:20:59.360 Well, but in order to understand that, because we become such a healthy, physically, general

01:21:04.880 people, and we live so long, ironically, our time horizon has disappeared.

01:21:09.040 And so the idea always, with eudaimonia, or simcha in Hebrew, or any of these words that

01:21:14.920 we're talking about, the idea was, over a long period of time, right, the way that you

01:21:18.600 establish whether you are happy is you look back at your life, and you look at all the

01:21:22.140 things that you built, and the process of building those, and even the things that you're

01:21:26.040 most miserable about in the moment, may be the things that make you happiest.

01:21:28.860 There have been a bunch of studies where Roy Baumeister does a lot of really good work

01:21:31.660 on this, when he found that there is a wide differential between what people experience

01:21:35.260 as joy and what people experience as meaning.

01:21:37.360 They're not the same thing at all, and that becomes most apparent, obviously, when it comes

01:21:41.160 to children.

01:21:41.600 When it comes to children, what you experience as joy and what you experience as meaning

01:21:44.420 are very often incredibly disparate.

01:21:46.280 Yeah.

01:21:46.400 Because raising kids, as Matt knows even better than I do, because he's got six, but I've

01:21:49.440 got four, that's a lot of kids.

01:21:51.440 And it's not always, you know, roses and butterflies.

01:21:54.700 There are a lot of times when it is rough.

01:21:56.280 It is very difficult.

01:21:57.180 I mean, last night, when you're up in the middle of the night, three to five in the morning

01:21:59.460 because your baby has too much snot, and you're sucking the snot out of the baby's nose,

01:22:03.060 the baby can breathe.

01:22:03.960 Is that joy?

01:22:04.740 No, but that's meaning.

01:22:05.840 And that meaning is what leads to happening.

01:22:07.160 But that requires a time horizon, because in order for you...

01:22:09.520 You also just corrected something.

01:22:11.460 I misspoke when I said the efficient cause is God.

01:22:13.560 The efficient cause for our creation is our parents, is our family.

01:22:17.580 That's the other thing that they totally deny, and they deny the truths that you're just explaining.

01:22:20.640 And there's also a distinction between joy and happiness.

01:22:22.440 I mean, happy, you win the lottery or happy for a day or whatever, you know, and then

01:22:25.820 you become miserable because you have money that you didn't earn.

01:22:28.880 But joy is something you can experience even in grief, even in crisis.

01:22:32.980 And you're right.

01:22:33.560 It's totally connected to meaning.

01:22:35.120 It's totally connected to fulfilling who you are.

01:22:38.020 And it's iterations over time.

01:22:39.200 It has to do with iterations over time.

01:22:40.520 As the time horizon goes away.

01:22:42.120 Well, because in the moment, you're struggling, you're stressed out and all that stuff.

01:22:45.320 But the joy can be there even in those moments because you understand that this is what

01:22:50.120 you're here for, you know, I mean, to suck the snot out of your baby's nose when that's

01:22:54.100 when you, that's why you're here.

01:22:55.380 That is, and that purpose does, I mean, I can say this because I'm now at the end of life.

01:23:00.340 You do look back and say like, that was great.

01:23:03.080 You know, I'm so glad that happened.

01:23:04.840 Now, speaking of reasons we're here, there's one topic we have got to get to.

01:23:07.960 We talked about one of the Republican debates tonight, but it's about to kick off in 10 minutes

01:23:12.780 or so, or I'm sorry, it's about to kick off in half an hour, but we got to get to the

01:23:16.000 member block.

01:23:17.040 The other Republican debate is going to be the debate or friendly conversation.

01:23:20.580 We'll find out what it is.

01:23:21.780 Oh, we know.

01:23:22.960 Between Trump and Tucker.

01:23:23.380 Well, probably we know.

01:23:25.320 First of all, what do you think?

01:23:26.960 Was it smart for Trump to skip the debate and talk to Tucker or is it going to hurt him?

01:23:31.220 And two, what are your predictions?

01:23:33.580 So, yes, it's very smart for him.

01:23:35.460 Yeah.

01:23:36.340 On a moral level, should he go to the debate?

01:23:38.980 Of course.

01:23:39.700 Does that matter?

01:23:40.480 One iota?

01:23:41.020 Of course not.

01:23:41.500 So, this is the world in which we now live.

01:23:43.860 So, is it smart for him to?

01:23:44.780 Yeah.

01:23:45.040 I mean, why would he show up for a debate where everybody's going to attack him and go after

01:23:48.460 him and find angles against him and he may fuss around for even a moment and that'll hurt

01:23:52.740 him when he could just go hang out with Tucker in a pre-taped interview for 45 minutes on

01:23:56.380 Twitter or X or whatever we're calling it these days.

01:23:58.680 So, yeah, I will say this.

01:24:00.900 For all those people who are looking to nominate Trump because they believe that the debates

01:24:05.560 between Joe Biden and Donald Trump will be rock'em, sock'em, robots, entertainment, I just

01:24:09.300 have some, I have a bad piece of news for you.

01:24:11.980 There will be no debates between Joe Biden and Donald Trump.

01:24:14.300 It is not going to happen.

01:24:15.860 Joe Biden will not debate Donald Trump, not under any circumstances, no way, no how.

01:24:20.300 All he's going to say is, I don't debate people who are under indictment for attempting to steal

01:24:23.900 an election and the media will shrug and most of America will go, eh, and then he'll go

01:24:28.180 back to sleep in the basement.

01:24:29.320 There will be no debate.

01:24:30.060 So, are you implying that Trump is going to be the nominee?

01:24:32.260 I mean, he's the odds-on favorite to be the nominee.

01:24:34.260 He's the odds-on favorite, but you'd put your money on it?

01:24:36.280 But, of course, I mean, I always put my favorite and my money on the odds-on favorite.

01:24:39.960 That's why I'm wealthy.

01:24:40.920 I mean, that's the one, I mean, obviously, I agree with the, ultimately, the smartest

01:24:47.000 thing is for Trump not to debate.

01:24:49.100 But the one argument that you could make that he should have debated is that Biden will not

01:24:55.560 debate him.

01:24:56.260 And so, when Biden says he's not going to debate, now Trump will have no leg to stand

01:25:00.060 on whatsoever and objecting.

01:25:01.100 He'll still object, obviously, and he'll have to depend on people having a memory that

01:25:06.500 doesn't last more than 10 seconds.

01:25:07.640 But that is going to be a problem.

01:25:08.820 When Biden pulls out of the debates and Trump says, well, that's, you have to come face the

01:25:13.580 voters, and then Biden's camp can say, well, what about you?

01:25:16.180 You didn't debate at all in the primaries.

01:25:17.340 That's a problem.

01:25:18.080 I will say that, I mean, I'm a huge Tucker fan.

01:25:20.800 I do wonder if the counter-programming thing here is the best strategy because he's going

01:25:26.880 to be interviewing with Tucker, and it'll be on Twitter, and you could go anytime and

01:25:29.940 watch it.

01:25:30.840 So, it seemed like the smarter move probably would have been for him to go do a town hall

01:25:34.460 on CNN, and then you have that direct comparison, counter-programming, and then he could say,

01:25:39.780 I got better ratings than you in that moment.

01:25:42.600 And that would be, well, that's the...

01:25:44.840 It's also a slap at Fox, obviously, because Tucker and Fox are at odds, so...

01:25:47.880 Speaking of therapists, I knew a therapist once who used to say the most dangerous words

01:25:53.020 in the English language are, but I love him.

01:25:55.780 You know, it's like what masochistic women do.

01:25:57.820 You say, this guy's cheating on you, this guy's drinking too much, this guy doesn't

01:26:01.060 commit to you, but I love him, you know?

01:26:02.740 And I feel that that's the way Trump voters treat Donald Trump.

01:26:05.620 It's obvious that strategically he shouldn't debate.

01:26:08.220 It's obvious that morally he should.

01:26:10.180 And if I'm a voter with any kind of sense of myself and the responsibility of politicians

01:26:15.580 to me, rather than my responsibility to politicians, which is nil, I have no responsibility

01:26:20.500 to politicians.

01:26:21.200 All the responsibility is theirs toward me.

01:26:23.780 You would be looking at him and saying, well, shouldn't you show up and make your case

01:26:26.900 to me?

01:26:27.700 Shouldn't you be talking to me?

01:26:29.200 But it doesn't matter what Trump does.

01:26:30.640 He can blow Georgia.

01:26:31.820 He can lead people to charge into the Capitol building stupidly.

01:26:35.800 He can do all the things that he, in fact, has done.

01:26:38.540 But they love him.

01:26:39.300 Let me ask, where do you think...

01:26:41.140 I mean, you kind of shrugged at the notion that it was going to be a love fest between

01:26:44.080 Trump and Tucker.

01:26:45.060 Where do you see potential points of conflict?

01:26:46.280 I could see potential points of conflict not in the promises that Trump is making, but

01:26:52.240 in his failures in office.

01:26:53.820 So I could see Trump's failure to finish the wall, perhaps coming up.

01:26:57.860 I could see Trump's...

01:26:59.520 Maybe the VAX stuff?

01:27:00.860 Well...

01:27:01.500 Tucker has made the point that Trump has fundraised millions off the January 6th, the indictments

01:27:10.300 and all that, but hasn't spent a dime to defend anything.

01:27:12.640 It really should be obligatory for Tucker to ask him those questions.

01:27:15.560 I'll be very curious to see if Tucker does it.

01:27:17.500 I think he'll...

01:27:18.280 I think he has to bring up Fauci and the VAX stuff.

01:27:21.260 I could see some points of conflict in Tucker trying to make Trump live up to the intellectual

01:27:26.940 promise of Trump, as you would put it, rather than what we saw in practice, especially in

01:27:31.700 the last couple of years.

01:27:32.540 But my only question, as I guess the friendliest to Trump, you know, I still really like the

01:27:37.800 guy, but though I'm not...

01:27:38.880 I have no intention of endorsing in a primary.

01:27:40.900 My question is, morally, should he debate?

01:27:43.920 If it were another year, if it were another candidate, if it were another type of primary,

01:27:48.520 I'd say that the candidates have a responsibility to the voters to go and introduce themselves.

01:27:53.560 The thing with Trump is that we all know him.

01:27:56.720 The fact that this primary is a lot like 1888, the last time we had a former president running

01:28:01.020 for a non-consecutive second term.

01:28:03.180 What on earth could Trump possibly say?

01:28:06.580 What could Trump's rivals possibly say to him that would teach us anything new about Donald

01:28:11.760 Trump?

01:28:12.060 We already know him.

01:28:12.540 That's the wrong question, though, because an election is always a choice between specific

01:28:17.220 people.

01:28:17.820 So we should see Trump in comparison to Ron DeSantis.

01:28:20.320 We should see Trump in comparison to...

01:28:22.340 I also do want...

01:28:22.940 I do want to see him asked by somebody the simple question, you say that the election of

01:28:27.640 2020 was stolen from you.

01:28:29.000 How do you plan to unsteal the 2020 election?

01:28:31.280 I mean, like...

01:28:32.000 Yeah, I'd like an answer.

01:28:33.060 Because honestly, if you love Trump, you should want an answer to that.

01:28:35.260 Yeah.

01:28:35.560 If you want him elected, you should want an answer to that.

01:28:37.000 Like, that's a question for everybody.

01:28:37.920 How about, like, if you're a Republican who wants Biden beat, how do you plan on winning

01:28:43.060 an election against Joe Biden in which you're going to spend the entirety of next year in

01:28:47.180 court?

01:28:47.560 The entirety.

01:28:48.120 He's got four cases in the first five months of next year slated for the calendar.

01:28:51.960 And every dime that's going into his campaign fund right now is going directly into his

01:28:56.080 legal defense.

01:28:57.100 I mean, another question I'd love to hear asked is, you're worth $10 billion.

01:29:00.640 Why are you using your campaign funds to fund your legal bills?

01:29:02.900 Why don't you just pay your own legal bills?

01:29:04.000 Like, that's...

01:29:04.680 You think he's worth $10 billion?

01:29:06.620 Don't ask me that question.

01:29:07.920 I mean, I obviously don't think he's worth $10 billion, but he's not going to answer

01:29:11.040 that, right?

01:29:11.500 So, I mean, like, so that means that, like, it seems to me that when people donate money

01:29:15.060 to Donald Trump's campaign, one of the questions they should be asking is, are you using that

01:29:19.460 to target Joe Biden?

01:29:20.940 Like, what?

01:29:21.640 Like, I thought that was the tacit guarantee is that you were going to run against Joe

01:29:25.680 Biden and not against Fannie Willis.

01:29:28.000 Meaning, like, yeah, you have to defeat Fannie Willis.

01:29:29.820 We'd like to see you...

01:29:30.300 Yeah, it's all part of the same project.

01:29:31.260 But you have a legal defense fund.

01:29:32.620 By the way, I can show you how much Donald Trump cares about his legal defense fund.

01:29:34.940 His legal defense fund, which was set up, I don't know, a month ago, and got hacked

01:29:38.840 on Friday.

01:29:39.720 As of today, it is now Tuesday.

01:29:41.520 It has not been unhacked by the team Trump, nor have they complained about it.

01:29:45.600 They don't appear to care very deeply about whether that website for his legal defense

01:29:50.300 specifically is up and running because they're directing money from his campaign.

01:29:53.560 People are so identified with Trump that the way they see him, and I think this is fair,

01:29:58.180 by the way.

01:29:58.520 I think he has been treated monstrously unfairly.

01:30:02.080 I think every one of these indictments, except the classified documents one, is completely

01:30:07.140 bogus.

01:30:07.880 And I think the classified documents one is bogus when compared to what they did to Hillary

01:30:11.640 when she was doing the same thing.

01:30:13.360 So I think he's being treated so unfairly.

01:30:16.060 And what people are saying is, this is terrible.

01:30:18.080 I protest.

01:30:18.940 I will stand up with him.

01:30:21.040 And my feeling is, you know, I just want to do what's best for the country.

01:30:24.520 I don't, it's not that I think he can't win.

01:30:27.660 I think he's the least likely person.

01:30:28.820 That's why I would like to see somebody on the debate stage tonight get up and say, listen,

01:30:32.320 Donald Trump should not be in jail.

01:30:33.600 These indictments are bogus.

01:30:34.640 I will personally sign a check to Donald Trump's legal fund right now and take out a

01:30:37.460 check and write it.

01:30:38.260 And then say, and if, and I'm running against Donald Trump because I do not think he's the

01:30:42.960 person who's most likely to be Joe Biden.

01:30:44.480 Because both of those things are simultaneously true.

01:30:46.180 He should not be going to jail for this sort of stuff.

01:30:48.140 It also happens to be true simultaneously that you shouldn't, with a giant red target on your

01:30:52.240 back, then make yourself an even bigger target by doing dumb crap, like not turning back

01:30:55.680 in classified documents for no apparent reason, and then informing Walt Mowda, like shift him

01:30:59.400 around away from your lawyers.

01:31:00.580 I'm sorry, that's unbelievable.

01:31:01.860 That is the best thing that Ron DeSantis could do tonight, would be to come out and, and I

01:31:08.320 guess this was sort of leaked in the debate, supposed debate memo, but if he came out and

01:31:12.240 said, this is complete BS, this is, they're crossing the Rubicon, this is a hideous miscarriage

01:31:17.300 of justice and upending of the political order, I will personally donate to Trump's defense

01:31:20.780 fund, and I think I've got a better shot, and here's why.

01:31:23.220 But aside from purposely, aside from donating money to the defense fund, he has said all

01:31:30.120 that.

01:31:30.680 He has stood up.

01:31:31.180 Yes, but I think in order to, I mean just on a political level, in order to create a

01:31:36.040 defensive wall against the accusation that he's actively, secretly hoping that Trump

01:31:39.640 gets indicted, the actual signing of the check is symbolically important.

01:31:42.860 Okay.

01:31:43.220 Because then he's saying to people, listen, I'm putting my money where my mouth is, and

01:31:46.260 I'm way less wealthy than Donald Trump.

01:31:47.920 The other thing about crossing the Rubicon, by the way, it's not just Trump getting indicted

01:31:51.280 in Georgia, which seems to me the most egregious of these indictments, it, you know, it's

01:31:55.600 18 other people, some of whom are being indicted, our friend Jenna Ellis, she's getting indicted

01:31:59.620 for being his lawyer.

01:32:00.800 Okay, I got to say, why, okay, this one is on Trump, in the same way that some of the

01:32:04.240 January 6th stuff, what, like, where is Trump signing checks for the people who went to

01:32:08.600 bat for him?

01:32:09.340 He's not.

01:32:09.920 I find that, like, Jenna Ellis is openly appealing to people for her legal defense fund, which

01:32:15.320 they're saying, oh, you know, you supported DeSantis, now you're a traitor.

01:32:18.060 That's right, she supports DeSantis.

01:32:19.240 However, I did enjoy her OnlyFans mugshot.

01:32:22.020 Did you see that?

01:32:22.760 I did not.

01:32:24.840 She's such an attractive lady, but she...

01:32:26.960 God bless it, Drew.

01:32:27.960 No, she did.

01:32:29.120 She did it on purpose.

01:32:30.140 She put out this mugshot.

01:32:31.000 She looks great.

01:32:32.400 She sent it to me.

01:32:33.360 I thought, yeah, you should be an OnlyFans.

01:32:35.100 You should charge people to look at your mugshot.

01:32:36.680 That's the legal defense fund.

01:32:37.780 But on that note, I suppose we'll talk more about the defendants, the indictments, OnlyFans,

01:32:44.280 and we will take your questions.

01:32:45.800 In the member block, the member exclusive portion of our show continues now at dailywire.com.

01:32:51.420 If you are not a member, if you're just one of those freeloading hoi polloi watching now

01:32:55.200 on one of these despicable social networks, head on over.

01:32:58.640 Click the link in the description.

01:33:00.320 Subscribe right now.

01:33:01.440 We will see you there.

The Michael Knowles Show - August 23, 2023

Daily Wire Backstage： Debate Me, Bro.

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