The Michael Knowles Show - Daily Wire Backstage： Go Buy Ben's Book Edition

00:00:00.000 Hey, Michael Knowles here. The latest episode of Daily Wire Backstage Go Buy Ben's Book Edition

00:00:04.560 is right around the corner and you don't want to miss it. Join me, Ben Shapiro, Andrew Klavan,

00:00:09.760 and the God King, Jeremy Boring, as we talk about the madness in today's culture and as we do our

00:00:15.020 best to sell you on Ben's new book, How to Destroy America in Three Easy Steps. Take a listen.

00:00:21.740 Politicians pander to protesters as police persist in preventing perpetual pandemonium

00:00:26.080 in Portland, The Pandemic Precipitates Preposterous Presumptions, and Go Buy Ben's Book. This is The

00:00:31.740 Daily Wire Backstage. Welcome to The Daily Wire Backstage Go Buy Ben's Book Edition. I'm Jeremy

00:00:50.600 Boring, known around these parts as your friendly neighborhood God King, and we're glad that you

00:00:55.080 have tuned in. Is America past the point of make up sex? Can Donald Trump claw his way back in the

00:00:59.680 polls? Was Portlandia actually a documentary? Ben covers all of this and more in his book,

00:01:05.480 How to Destroy America in Three Easy Steps. If you don't have one, I've said it twice. Go buy Ben's

00:01:10.760 book. I'm joined today, of course, by the man himself, Mr. Ben Shapiro, also by Andrew Klavan and

00:01:15.900 Michael Knowles, one of whom has actually written other books, and the other who has outsold both.

00:01:21.520 Also, by the lovely Alicia Krause, who is with us via satellite, she'll be taking your questions hot

00:01:27.100 off the interwebs and giving us a chance to dazzle you with our answers. Jazz hands. That wasn't even

00:01:32.780 in the prompter. I just totally outlived that. Say hi, Alicia. Hi, guys. How are you? It's good to be

00:01:38.640 back. And yes, I will be taking those subscriber questions. And how can you ask the questions you

00:01:43.520 wonder? Well, you have to be a Daily Wire member, an All Access member to be exact. And if you're not an

00:01:48.440 All Access member, then you're definitely missing out. And if you're like me and you like a deal,

00:01:52.320 turns out we have one for you. Because All Access members get to participate in our All Access Live,

00:01:57.600 where one of the Daily Wire hosts hangs out with you via live stream. It's way better than a corporate

00:02:02.140 Zoom, I promise. And All Access members also join us for real-time online Q&A discussions, like the one

00:02:08.280 that we're all going to have together after tonight's episode of Backstage. And it will be available on both

00:02:13.260 the website and the Daily Wire app. So tune in to get your questions ready. That's once again,

00:02:17.820 if you're an All Access member. And if you're not, then head on over to dailywire.com slash subscribe

00:02:22.260 to get your two, yes, two leftist tears tumblers with that 15% off coupon code backstage right now.

00:02:30.480 That's dailywire.com slash subscribe. Use the 15% off coupon code backstage right now and join us for

00:02:37.200 the discussion after the show. So I've been trying to figure out, I was on this trip down

00:02:41.400 to Texas and someone asked the question, you know, are you an internet celebrity? As people

00:02:46.520 will often ask. And I thought about my Twitter following, which has grown, but has still not

00:02:53.880 gotten to the goal that I set in life when I was a small child. And my father said, what do you want

00:02:57.600 to be when you grow up? And I said, I want to have 100,000 Twitter followers. And he said, your life is

00:03:02.340 going to be filled with disappointment, kid. And he was, so far, it turns out that he's right.

00:03:06.000 And also, what's Twitter? Don't ruin my story, Ben. But I've been looking for an answer to this

00:03:13.180 question. Does my life have any meaning? And then I found Ben's book, How to Destroy America in Three

00:03:18.160 Easy Steps. And I realized nothing has meaning. You two could be filled with the kind of optimism

00:03:24.640 that I have if you were to read this book. Ben, since I went ahead and named the whole episode after

00:03:29.580 your book, tell us just a little bit about it. Let me tell you about this book. So here's the deal.

00:03:34.400 The basic thesis of the book is that the battle in the United States right now is not exactly left

00:03:40.100 versus right, although it largely mirrors it. It's between people who I call unionists and people

00:03:43.200 who I call disintegrationists. Unionists are people who believe that the country ought to remain

00:03:46.900 one unified body. And they believe that there are certain ties that bind us together, namely

00:03:50.900 philosophy, culture, and history. The philosophy of the American founding that is suggested in the

00:03:55.680 Declaration of Independence, that all men are created equal, endowed by their creator with inalienable

00:03:59.680 rights, protected by a government of limited powers. And that if that government should choose to exceed

00:04:03.700 its powers, then it would lose its reason for being. That was the core philosophy of the United

00:04:07.140 States. And then that was preserved by a system of checks and balances and federalism created by

00:04:11.140 the Constitution. That was the core philosophy. Then there was the core culture of the United

00:04:14.520 States, which was a culture that valued social institutions and inculcating virtue like church

00:04:18.260 and family, a culture of entrepreneurship and adventure, the culture of the pioneers, people

00:04:22.500 who are pushing over Hill and Dale in order to open new vistas in the human experience, a culture

00:04:28.740 of tolerance for other people's rights. Even though you may not agree with how I speak,

00:04:32.020 you acknowledge that I do have the right to say what I am saying. And also a culture of militant

00:04:37.440 defense of those rights, that if the government were to overstep its boundaries, they would get

00:04:40.560 a stern warning. And finally, a shared history. The idea that we are all part of the same history,

00:04:44.880 the same historic stream, even though American history obviously has victims and villains,

00:04:48.840 even though American history has horrible periods, even though American history has significant

00:04:53.120 periods in which many people in the United States strayed from founding principle. The actual story of the

00:04:57.040 United States is not 1619. The actual story of the United States is 1776. United States was founded

00:05:01.880 on true, eternally good principles. And the story of the United States is about how we have attempted

00:05:06.780 to fulfill those principles increasingly well over time and extend the promises that were made in the

00:05:11.700 Declaration of Independence to more and more human beings over a period of time. So black and white 0.77

00:05:15.360 Americans are part of that story. Black Americans heroically overcoming Jim Crow and slavery, white

00:05:20.740 Americans helping them do so and overcoming their own innate sin in all of this and moving toward those

00:05:25.800 founding principles. So that is the unionist philosophy, culture, and history. And all of

00:05:29.360 those elements are being disintegrated purposefully by people I call disintegrationists, people who wish 0.99

00:05:33.900 to see the country fall apart, who believe that America's philosophy is a lie, was a lie when it

00:05:37.640 was written. This is openly stated by the members of the 1619 Project. People who believe that all men 0.78

00:05:41.900 are created equal is actually just a cover for power politics. Because if we treat everybody equally

00:05:46.040 under the law, what about people who are not as well off? What about people who are not as well

00:05:49.800 situated? We have to have injustice under the law in order to achieve group or social justice. The

00:05:54.600 culture of the United States is inherently bad. The culture of adventure and entrepreneurship is

00:05:58.400 actually a culture of exploitation and cruelty to others. The culture that says that I have to

00:06:03.060 respect your rights is really about me wanting bad people to win. Because if I really didn't want

00:06:07.440 those people to win, I wouldn't respect their rights. The culture of valuing social institutions,

00:06:12.240 churches are bad because they cram down social values upon you. Family is bad because family is an

00:06:17.420 exploitative institution. And finally, the history of the United States is not the story of triumph over

00:06:21.740 innate and universal human sin. The story of America is that America was founded in human sin

00:06:26.900 and has merely deepened and broadened that sin over time to the point where all the institutions

00:06:32.280 of America are so thoroughly corrupted they must be torn down at the root. That is the battle that

00:06:35.420 is happening in the United States. It's not quite left-right. There are some liberals who actually

00:06:38.720 believe in a lot of the things that I said are unionist. And there are some conservatives who may not

00:06:42.580 agree with all the things that I said are unionist. But that, in large scale, is the battle. And we're

00:06:46.680 seeing it play out in the streets of Portland, in the streets of Seattle. We're seeing it play out in the

00:06:49.460 halls of Congress. We're seeing it play out every day in the mainstream media and in the halls of

00:06:53.200 academia. But could you have written something more topical, Ben? I think that's the question

00:06:56.520 on everyone's minds. That was good. Nobody needs to buy the book now. You heard the whole thing

00:07:00.980 straight from the mouth. And now we'll get on to talk about what's going on in the country,

00:07:05.720 which is basically just everything Ben just said. In particular, so I haven't been in the news much

00:07:11.060 this week. I've been traveling quite a lot. As God King, I'm Lord of all that I survey. So I thought I

00:07:16.880 should go look at some stuff. Turns out a lot of it doesn't belong to me. Really, the title is

00:07:22.140 kind of giving me a false sense of self. But on my travels, I wasn't able to be in the news much.

00:07:27.760 But every time I did log on to the internet, all I could see was the disintegration of one or another

00:07:33.180 American city. And what's going on in Portland the last few days seems to really be the giant story

00:07:39.860 that no one's actually allowed to talk about. If I'm near a TV, I don't see anything about Portland.

00:07:44.420 If I'm on the internet, it's the only way I hear anything about it. Michael, tell us a little bit

00:07:47.140 of it. Catch me up. What's happening?

00:07:48.780 So everything you think is happening, like if you were to have a fevered nightmare,

00:07:52.980 that's what's happening. It's happening in Portland. And there's this big debate now,

00:07:57.220 because you've had these insurrectionists in Portland attacking a federal courthouse and other

00:08:01.860 places as well. They look like a truly an armed militia. And so federal troops have come in.

00:08:08.840 And by troops, I should be more specific. I'm talking about the Department of Homeland Security.

00:08:12.700 This has raised a big debate. Should these federal agents be able to come in?

00:08:17.160 There's a lot of lies that are going on about this. The left is saying that the federal agents

00:08:20.900 have no right to do this. Of course they do. One of the reasons we have DHS in the first place

00:08:25.240 is to protect federal property. They're saying that the federal agents are not allowed to go,

00:08:29.980 for instance, arrest people who are committing crimes on federal property, but then leave that

00:08:33.720 property. That's also not true. It's very clear from U.S. code that they are absolutely allowed

00:08:37.820 to pursue those individuals. They're saying that the federal agents are ununiformed. They're not

00:08:43.920 saying who they are. That is also not true. They're wearing uniforms. Clearly says they're

00:08:47.260 in DHS and they actually have agent numbers. So you can even identify the individual agents.

00:08:51.900 So typically a lot of lies from the left and a lot of insurrection that's going on. And the biggest

00:08:56.820 lie of all, I think, is they're saying that this is un-American. You know, it's Hitler-esque to send

00:09:01.620 in federal troops to put down this insurrection. That is absurd. There is an American history of

00:09:06.960 putting down insurrections that goes back to 1787, goes back all the way to Shays' Rebellion.

00:09:11.420 And actually, one of the reasons we have our constitution is because the Articles of

00:09:15.860 Confederation were not strong enough to efficiently put down that insurrection. And so one of the

00:09:20.680 reasons we got the Constitutional Convention right after Shays' Rebellion was in order to beef up that

00:09:25.080 power. And fortunately, finally, people are restoring a little bit of order to the streets.

00:09:29.600 So what about the politics of it, Drew? It seems to me that the president, slow to act on some of the

00:09:35.280 things that have taken place in America's cities during the sort of Black Lives Matter

00:09:39.340 riots that have been taking place. Now he is acting. He's sending in federal troops to protect

00:09:44.540 federal property. But there's a risk, right? The risk is that going into the election, one risk is

00:09:50.740 you look like you've lost control of the country. The other risk is that you look like you're a 0.97

00:09:55.120 totalitarian, which sort of plays into the narrative that the left has painted of the president

00:09:59.620 really since before he even took office. How do you think this shakes out for the president?

00:10:04.540 I think the bigger risk is doing nothing, frankly, even though a lot of people on the right are just

00:10:08.920 saying, let these cities burn. They're Democrat cities. They're suffering from Democrat policies. Let

00:10:13.020 them go. I think that's wrong. Trump has got to show that he's going to do something that he's going

00:10:17.020 to take care of the country and not let the cities go. I think this has been one of Trump's best

00:10:21.280 weeks. And of course, obviously, it goes unreported because anything Trump does that's positive

00:10:25.700 goes unreported. But I think if he can actually he's he's very far back in the polls. And I think

00:10:31.100 he knows it. And I think he acted to fire his campaign manager. And right after that,

00:10:35.580 he suddenly became a really different candidate. Now we've got the question, you know, the $64,000

00:10:41.720 question. Does he have the discipline to maintain doing what he did this week? He suddenly took a new

00:10:46.600 tone on the Chinese flu. He suddenly took it seriously. He came out. He was very sober.

00:10:51.320 He was very direct. He actually had facts in front of him and he used those facts.

00:10:54.860 And he started to move against these cities. You cannot have cities devolving into chaos.

00:11:00.540 And if you really want to know whether this is good for Trump or not, all you have to do is look

00:11:04.920 at the fact that the minute Trump threatens to act, the mayors and governors suddenly act before he can

00:11:10.180 get there. So you suddenly have in Portland, they declare a riot after something like 56 days of

00:11:15.660 burning and vandalism and violence. Suddenly it's a riot when Trump says he's going to send in the

00:11:19.760 troops. The same thing happened in Seattle with their Chaz. The same thing happened in New York.

00:11:23.920 They closed the Chaz that's been open in front of City Hall all this time the minute he threatened.

00:11:28.720 So the left knows that this is not a good look for them, but they can blame it on Trump until

00:11:33.320 he acts. And the minute he acts, they've got to shut it down. So I think this was a great week for

00:11:36.740 Trump. You know, it's always a question with him whether he's just going to blow it all with a

00:11:40.760 single tweet. But right this minute, he looks very good.

00:11:43.060 So it occurred to me watching the events unfold that you really only have two options, right? You

00:11:48.360 can either allow, you can either defend federal property with federal force, or you have to pull

00:11:53.880 all of the federal infrastructure out of these cities, which in addition to being practically

00:11:57.740 impossible, no one on the left would stand for, right? Like if you just basically said, fine,

00:12:03.140 we'll just shut down the Social Security Administration in Portland if we can't send, if you're not going to

00:12:07.600 protect it, we're not going to have it be there. If you're not going to do that, Ben, don't you have to

00:12:11.640 actually defend this property and defend these employees?

00:12:14.180 Well, of course. I mean, under federal code, you do have to defend this property. It is the

00:12:17.040 responsibility of the Department of Homeland Security to do so. They have the power to call

00:12:20.880 from other agencies through the General Services Administration, other people to serve in this

00:12:25.880 battle against people who are, as Michael rightly noted, insurrectionists. The fact that this is

00:12:32.060 controversial at all is a testament to how much our media are just damned liars. I mean, they are just

00:12:37.680 damned liars. I've been very hesitant to talk about the media as the enemy of the people,

00:12:42.840 mainly because I just don't like the phrase. I don't like the phrase enemy of the people because

00:12:45.480 it brings up Stalinist sort of associations. But the way that the media have acted over the

00:12:49.780 past few months is just disgusting. I mean, the mask is now completely off. If you thought it had

00:12:54.080 slipped some with Kavanaugh and slipped more with the Covington Catholic kids, it is just gone at this

00:12:58.660 point. I cannot trust a single narrative, not one, that is being fed to me by the media. If you

00:13:03.020 listen to the media right now, Portland is entirely peaceful and the only people who are creating chaos

00:13:07.260 are the federal agents who are actually members of the Gestapo. Everything in Chicago is hunky-dory,

00:13:12.080 except that President Trump is threatening to go in there specifically because Lori Lightfoot is 0.88

00:13:15.020 black and a woman. Everything in New York is absolutely fine. The only reason that you're 1.00

00:13:19.280 seeing any sort of uptick in violence is just because Trump is president, not because they've

00:13:22.520 decided to absolutely castrate the NYPD. If you listen to the media on COVID, everything that's bad

00:13:27.760 that's happening is the fault of Ron DeSantis, Greg Abbott, and Doug Ducey in Florida,

00:13:31.800 Texas, and Arizona, respectively, or Trump, more broadly speaking, California just ceases to exist.

00:13:36.620 Also, apparently Trump is at fault for the second wave that we are now seeing in Spain,

00:13:40.620 in France, in Japan. Apparently Trump is in charge of the entire world. Literally every narrative that

00:13:45.820 has been trotted out over the past several weeks is not just a little bit wrong. It's not just a

00:13:49.940 little wrong. It is overtly false. It is overtly false. I'm amazed that the media think they can get

00:13:54.860 away with this. And so far they have. I mean, that's the sad truth is that when you have this

00:13:59.200 blanket wall tsunami, I think that I felt this way after 2006. I remember after 2004,

00:14:03.520 there was this feeling with Republicans after Bush beat Kerry that we're never going to lose again.

00:14:07.620 And finally, the power of the mainstream media with Dan Rather collapsing in on himself like a dying,

00:14:11.320 crazy, drunk old star, that he was basically going, that was the end of the mainstream media.

00:14:15.900 Their power had been broken. The back had been broken. And then in 2008, it felt like, oh no,

00:14:19.620 the media is still there. Then Trump wins. And then Republicans again are like, well,

00:14:22.360 it looks like the power of the media is broken. And now it doesn't feel like that at all again.

00:14:26.440 And it feels like there is just this vast tsunami-like unified wave that has been rushing over

00:14:31.780 informationally the American population. And the best case I can see is not even about Trump. It's

00:14:36.740 about the approval ratings in Florida, Texas, and Arizona. Ducey, DeSantis, and Abbott are all

00:14:41.040 underwater. Gavin Newsom is still at 58% in the state of California, despite experiencing a surge

00:14:45.280 exactly the same size as the other states and not having opened in the first place.

00:14:48.720 That's right. Drew?

00:14:50.040 You know, the most interesting person in the country to me right now is Kayleigh McEnany.

00:14:53.480 I call her the species girl because she's a hot blonde who rips men's spines out with her tongue. 1.00

00:14:59.200 But I think what makes her so fascinating to me is that she is incredibly prepared. She knows

00:15:05.960 exactly how to go after that. She's kind of like you wish that she would use Trump,

00:15:09.720 be a ventriloquist for Trump, like Trump would open his mouth.

00:15:12.320 Singing in the range, goes behind the curtain.

00:15:14.540 Exactly, exactly. She is doing everything that one wishes that a George W. Bush or a Donald Trump,

00:15:20.040 who are not exactly articulate, you wish that they would do. And the media is attacking her

00:15:25.020 for telling the truth and being prepared. They're attacking her for having effective notes. They're

00:15:30.820 attacking her for using tabs in her notebooks so she can find things. Today, I think it was today,

00:15:35.920 it may have been yesterday, she actually showed a movie, a video of what was actually happening in

00:15:41.220 Portland, and they cut it off. It's like, please don't interrupt us while we're lying.

00:15:44.800 And I think that if she can do what she can do, if she will actually accomplish what she wants to

00:15:51.740 accomplish, she could be a very, very powerful weapon. Because Ben, I couldn't agree with Ben

00:15:56.180 more about this. This is an amazing, amazing desertion of any journalistic ethos by journalists.

00:16:03.920 Yeah. I want to talk about that. You know, today, the number two podcast in the country

00:16:07.500 is this podcast by the New York Times, hosted by a white woman, by the way, suggesting that the

00:16:12.740 problem with American public education is white parents. So the fact that the media has gone all 0.79

00:16:18.240 in for activism, I think, is one of the most important stories happening in the country.

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00:18:49.960 slash backstage. Hey there, Alicia. What you reading? Oh, just this book. I think it's by this guy we all

00:18:57.640 know named Ben Shapiro. How to Destroy America in Three Easy Steps. Ben, I really only wish that

00:19:03.320 you'd written this a lot faster so I would have had something to read during COVID. I took up needle

00:19:06.900 pointing instead and really getting to my eyesight. Anyway, you should go buy Ben's book right now.

00:19:12.980 Apparently, though, you only get a signed copy if you, you know, co-host his live signing

00:19:17.220 because this one's not signed to me. But anyway, this is also a reminder to join our most exclusive

00:19:23.140 membership tier so you can ask questions of the guys and I will give them all the questions and

00:19:27.800 you will get their pithy answers throughout backstage tonight. With that all access membership

00:19:31.820 tier, you can also join us for the live online Q&A discussion that's right after this episode of

00:19:36.740 backstage. That's 15% off a coupon using backstage right now at dailywire.com slash subscribe. The

00:19:43.020 coupon code is backstage to ask questions during backstage. Ask us questions after backstage and

00:19:48.580 get not one but two tumblers. Okay, first question. Ben, you ready to roll? First of all, it's a

00:19:53.740 little insulting to me. I'm just going to get this off my chest. You all have, when you do your shows,

00:19:58.340 you all get to use your own name as the promo code. So it's like, promo code Shapiro. Oh, K-L-A-V-A

00:20:04.640 and there are no E's in Clavin. However, Knowles does say, I've never listened to shows. I can only assume

00:20:09.120 he has one. But anytime I'm around, it's either still Shapiro for some reason, giving me absolutely no

00:20:15.040 credit. Or it's the generic backstage. Why can't we have promo code God King or promo code Jeremy's

00:20:20.080 great? Or promo code, could somebody give Jeremy a little more money? I don't know. I don't like it.

00:20:24.680 Listen, it's hard enough to be a grifter. To be a grifter and not get paid for it is the absolutely

00:20:30.620 worst thing imaginable. What a waste of time. Let's take some questions. So do you want to take the

00:20:36.120 first question, Jeremy, so you don't feel like a grifter? Can I toss it to Ben, who we really know is

00:20:39.860 the boss? Wow, that hurt. But yeah, better give it to Ben. Okay. He's looking

00:20:45.020 right at me. I mean, he did. He's looking right at me and he did leave me an unsigned book in the

00:20:48.920 studio to talk about. So, all right, Ben, is America's position on the UN Security Council

00:20:54.360 reason enough to stay in the UN or should we pull out of the UN immediately? No, we should,

00:20:58.880 we should pull out of the UN immediately. We should neutron bomb the building and salt the earth.

00:21:02.780 The UN is a horrific organization, always was a horrific organization. If you look at the origins of

00:21:07.640 the UN, it basically Stalin insisted that the USSR have a veto on the Security Council, which ended

00:21:13.380 any and all possibility that there would ever be anything good that ever came out of the UN.

00:21:17.440 The UN has literally done, you can count the number of good things the UN has done probably

00:21:21.240 on one hand and maybe on like three fingers. It's really incredible what a useless and awful

00:21:26.560 organization the United Nations is. All you have to do, obviously, is look at what they pass in the

00:21:30.540 General Assembly where every single resolution is about Israel and they're not condemning the

00:21:33.520 United States. All you have to do is look at the UN Human Rights Council, which is staffed by great

00:21:37.240 nations like Iran and Sudan. All you have to do is look at the fact that every time they can steal 1.00

00:21:42.240 money and use it to enrich a local despot, they absolutely do it. The UN is garbage. We should

00:21:46.940 have a League of Democracies instead, or we should just have a bunch of bilateral agreements. Frankly,

00:21:50.920 I think the President Trump's approach to alliance is in many ways closer. You're never going to hear

00:21:56.620 me say again. You ready for this, guys? His view on alliance is actually closer to the Washingtonian

00:22:00.680 view of alliance than many of the people who have been promoting the sort of we're all friends and

00:22:07.780 neighbors routine for a very long time. Trump's view of alliance is basically you're friends with the

00:22:11.580 people you're friends with, and you're not friends with the people you're not friends with. And

00:22:14.280 that's exactly what Washington says in his farewell address. It seems to me that we've strayed far

00:22:17.580 from that, and the UN is the formalization of straying exactly from Washingtonian principle.

00:22:21.580 Ben, I agree. I've been waiting for you to say that Donald Trump reminds us of George Washington

00:22:25.820 for many years now, and I'm glad that we agree.

00:22:28.340 No, that's right. He also has false teeth and...

00:22:30.280 And funny hair.

00:22:31.860 Bad wig.

00:22:32.380 Yeah.

00:22:32.700 Funny hair.

00:22:36.140 Let's sit here awkwardly.

00:22:37.320 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:22:38.240 Sorry, I thought Michael was going to go on, but you know, okay.

00:22:40.720 Okay, it kind of petered out. Just like all of our shows, it just sort of came to a sliding

00:22:44.120 halt right there.

00:22:45.560 All right, Michael.

00:22:46.220 I got very tired.

00:22:47.060 This next question is for the Michael Knowles, you know, illustrious author himself. Will

00:22:51.260 Republicans have to lose in 2020, you think, in order to win big in 2024? I think that's for

00:22:55.880 not just the White House, but the House and the Senate.

00:22:58.000 No, you don't win by losing. You don't. You cannot win by losing. Sometimes people,

00:23:02.800 we get very clever about this, and we say like, okay, well, I'm going to lose this race, 1.00

00:23:06.600 but then I'm going to win it this way 10 years from now. And that's just not how it works.

00:23:09.900 You're going to lose. I mean, sometimes it's inevitable that you lose, but you have to try

00:23:13.800 to win because politics moves on. Politics is about eternal principles applied to constantly

00:23:19.960 changing circumstances. And so in those circumstances, you can't predict what it's

00:23:24.040 going to look like. Forget four or eight years from now, you can't predict what it's going to

00:23:27.440 look like in three months. If the election were held today, I think a lot of people think President

00:23:31.180 Trump would lose. But who knows? Who knows what's going to happen over the next 100 days?

00:23:34.940 So no, you got to win. You got to try to win. And if you lose, which is going to happen eventually,

00:23:39.520 then you got to regroup and try to win the next time.

00:23:42.560 All right, Drew, this question is for you. It's kind of a two-part question. Part one is,

00:23:45.940 should schools that teach the 1619 Project lose their federal funding? And what curriculum can

00:23:51.280 be used to counter the 1619 Project?

00:23:54.240 That's a great question. And yes, A, yes, I think that you should not be a public school

00:23:58.740 teaching 1619. It's not true. I mean, that's the first thing. It's not true. Plus, it's anti-American.

00:24:04.740 If you can't teach your children to love the country you're in and what's beautiful about it,

00:24:07.920 what's great about it, instead teaching it that it's inherently evil, I cannot see how that is in

00:24:13.620 any way an education. What we need, what we need is a history of freedom. We need to follow the train

00:24:19.320 of freedom through Western history so that that really takes us from Greece to Rome to the formation of

00:24:24.740 Europe and to America. It's an idea. You know, it's the idea that really lights up Western history,

00:24:29.940 makes it different than everybody else. And really, it shows you, you can trace then when it falls off,

00:24:35.400 why it falls off, when it surges, when it rises, and what keeps it alive. And I've always thought

00:24:40.320 that the history that hasn't been written, and I'm just not equipped to write it, unfortunately,

00:24:44.160 is a history of freedom, a history of how this idea has stayed alive. Really, all we have are Lord

00:24:49.280 Acton's letters, which kind of are interesting, but they're just not the same thing as having

00:24:54.260 a textbook that traces this idea. And that's what I think we should be doing on the right. And of

00:24:58.780 course, we never do anything on the right to fix the culture, but that would be one of the things,

00:25:02.760 a project that I think we should be fronting and paying for.

00:25:06.480 All right, Jeremy, the God King, not that many people, I mean, actually, they follow you on

00:25:10.080 Twitter. They're one of the hundred thousand people who do follow you on Twitter. They probably

00:25:13.040 know that you're a big baseball fan and that you usually take the whole Daily Wire crew to see a

00:25:16.820 Dodgers game once a year on the anniversary. But with that in mind, what do you think about the

00:25:21.480 guys at the MLB caving to the woke mob and promoting these players kneeling?

00:25:26.200 Yeah, well, first of all, it's one of the horrible things that's happened is the loss of sports.

00:25:31.620 You know, the point of sport is that it allows us to work out our sort of baser instincts. You know,

00:25:37.500 everybody is a little bit tribalistic. Everybody's a little bit jingoistic. And what sports allow us

00:25:41.800 to do is root, root, root for the home team in an environment where the struggle has no meaning

00:25:47.400 beyond a sort of local regional pride. This is why I sometimes argue with Ben. He's obviously a big

00:25:53.560 White Sox fan. And sometimes when we go to Dodger Stadium, he'll wear his White Sox cap. And I'll

00:25:57.480 say to him, you know, it actually is important that we root for the home team. Like, it's good.

00:26:02.180 It's fine when we have a team that we love from afar.

00:26:05.000 But then I'd be rooting for Los Angeles. And Los Angeles is a bag of garbage, dude.

00:26:08.240 They would have taken it all this year if they were actually baseball anymore. They've got such a

00:26:13.060 great team. But it's just the case that that's part of what sports are supposed to be. That's why

00:26:16.820 team sports provide something that boxing or like the Red Bull kind of individualistic sports don't

00:26:22.600 actually provide. You know, I like to watch UFC or I like to watch sometimes the extreme stuff from

00:26:28.100 Red Bull. But you can't root for that. You're not a part of that. They don't represent your community.

00:26:31.840 They don't represent your, they don't represent your, they're not your team. You know, they're not

00:26:36.560 in any way representative of you. You're supporting them in what they do. When we support a baseball team,

00:26:41.560 they represent in some way us. And if the Dodgers are a terrible bag of garbage, then that's because

00:26:49.100 Ben has chosen to be part of a bag of garbage community. Or his parents did. I don't know.

00:26:56.800 All of that to say, the loss of sports right now in our country is going to have a real impact.

00:27:03.120 It's one of the few things left in our social fabric that would bring us together in, you know,

00:27:08.140 a sort of shared struggle, a shared, a shared celebration. That's what sports is for. We don't

00:27:14.140 have that now. Obviously, they've made them political. COVID is also part of this. They've

00:27:17.840 destroyed sports. Apparently, the one place where you can't be in an outdoor environment,

00:27:23.580 shouting is at a sports arena. Anywhere, if you're in a town square, you can do it. But if you're in a

00:27:29.400 sports arena, you will definitely get the COVIDs. I think it's a huge mistake to insert the kind of

00:27:35.260 politics in it the way that the owners are right now. My hope is that they will lose enormous

00:27:40.440 amounts of cash as a result. I think that that's what's going to happen. I suspect that people will

00:27:45.800 just turn it off. That's not what people watch sports for. I may be wrong because the entire

00:27:49.760 country is shut down. It may be that we're so desperate for any kind of distraction that people

00:27:54.100 will go ahead and watch sports sort of in spite of this. That's not what I hope happens. I hope they

00:27:58.560 lose 40% of their ratings and are forced to correct because we need them to correct because we need

00:28:04.540 sports. Listen, I'm blind in one eye. I'm horribly uncoordinated. I've humiliated myself at almost

00:28:10.920 every sport that's popular among America's youth. Nevertheless, I think sports are incredibly

00:28:16.060 important. I think that the entire idea of sport, sometimes people will say, America puts too much

00:28:20.980 emphasis on sports and not enough emphasis on reading, writing, and arithmetic. Right, but we invent

00:28:26.800 everything. We have the military that defends democracy and freedom all across the globe,

00:28:32.700 and we're the greatest economy in the history of the world. Our love of sport and the fact that

00:28:37.960 we inculcate love of sport into our children is part of the reason for our success because sports

00:28:43.160 actually teach you the values of capitalism. They teach you that hard work, that perseverance,

00:28:48.420 that overcoming adversity can lead to success. They teach you that you can't rely on rigged rules.

00:28:54.300 You have to, at the end of the day, rely on yourself and on your team. That is an important part of

00:29:00.360 what we teach our kids. I think that it's an enormous loss if it continues down the path that

00:29:05.320 it's going right now. Can we stop on this topic for a second? Yes, please. Because it really is

00:29:08.640 devastating for those of us who are like major, major baseball fans. So I am a diehard Chicago

00:29:14.240 White Sox fan. I wrote an entire book about the Chicago White Sox 2005 championship season with my

00:29:18.220 father. Both of us have united over baseball. Singular championship season. Singular. Well,

00:29:22.700 they had one. Well, it was all the way back in 1918, though, 1917, actually. But the basic kind of

00:29:29.660 destruction of all common areas of American life is so horrifying. And it's happening everywhere,

00:29:35.600 right? I mean, it's not just sports. It's happening in entertainment. It's happening that

00:29:38.960 basically it is now dictated to you that when you buy an HVAC part, you have to make sure that the CEO

00:29:44.140 of the HVAC company agrees with you on politics. You have to make sure that the head of Goya

00:29:48.400 agrees with you about Donald Trump, even if he's already done a different press conference with

00:29:52.420 Barack Obama just a few years beforehand. Everybody has to agree on everything. And the corporations,

00:29:57.360 I mean, I'm going to sound like Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren right now. The corporations

00:29:59.880 are to blame for this. Corporations have not stood up for principle. Corporations have decided that the

00:30:03.900 easiest way out is to cave to the woke mob. And they can make a quick buck by caving to the woke mob

00:30:07.660 because there are enough conservatives who aren't going to boycott them that they feel like they can just

00:30:11.700 grease the squeakiest wheel and get away with it. And it really is short sighted. It's quite

00:30:16.380 disgusting. And again, when, when they, when, when MLB decides that they're going to put out like

00:30:21.080 this vague Morgan Freeman, social justice statement, where he talks about Tim Robbins going through 500

00:30:26.000 yards of foul smelling stench, like you can't believe. And everybody's kneeling and it's all about

00:30:31.060 empathy and equality. And the statement, by the way, meant nothing. I mean, if you actually listen to

00:30:34.820 what Morgan Freeman said, it made no sense at all. Like it really didn't make any sense. But

00:30:39.000 the, the basic notion here, they knelt the footage that you're seeing right now is the,

00:30:43.060 is the nationals and the Yankees both kneeling before the national anthem. And this was their

00:30:46.460 compromise, right? We're not going to kneel during the national anthem because that might be perceived

00:30:49.720 as disrespectful. Instead, we'll kneel before the national anthem to signify that America is

00:30:54.160 systemically racist. I don't feel particularly respected now as, as a member of the systemically

00:30:59.340 racist American public, apparently, and systemically a racist American system. I don't feel

00:31:03.520 particularly not insulted by a group of largely diverse millionaires and 10 millionaires telling

00:31:10.400 me how racist the American system is. And if we don't buy that, then what? We're not patriotic.

00:31:14.660 What? We're not, we're not allowed to watch sport. The corporate owners who are doing this kind of

00:31:18.220 stuff, they don't understand that they're cutting off their nose to spite their face and they're

00:31:20.780 ruining the country in the process. And it's, it's gone everywhere, right? Because if you even say

00:31:24.400 this, that's political. If you say you don't like politics and sports, now you're being political

00:31:28.080 and you trend on Twitter for saying, I like my sports without politics. Even though, as my friend

00:31:31.820 Clay Travis says the root of the word sport, the etymology is disport from the French,

00:31:36.060 meaning literally distraction. The whole point of sports is to distract you from real life.

00:31:40.260 There's plenty of crap happening in real life. When I turn on a game, the last thing I want to see

00:31:43.300 is a bunch of vague social justice messaging that is semantically overloaded and could mean

00:31:47.520 everything from support black lives matter as an organization to America systemically racist,

00:31:51.040 to the completely inarguable principle that black people matter, which of course they do. 1.00

00:31:54.520 You know, this is a very good point. We, we obviously don't want these kinds of partisan

00:31:58.340 distractions, but there, there is, I would push back and say a political element to sports going

00:32:03.460 all the way back to ancient Greece. And it's a very basic one. And the basic political element

00:32:08.420 is patriotism. Sports have always been patriotic. They've been about celebrating as Jeremy says,

00:32:14.200 the home team or celebrating your country. And one of the virtues that they inculcate among all the

00:32:19.400 others that, that Jeremy, you mentioned is loyalty, loyalty to your teammates. If you're playing the

00:32:24.740 sport, loyalty to the home team. If you're going out and watching the sport, loyalty to your country,

00:32:29.160 when you stand up for the national anthem. And Ben, as you say, the common areas of American life

00:32:34.680 have been completely eroded. If we cannot even recognize one another as fellow Americans,

00:32:40.000 if we cannot even agree on the star spangled banner, there is nothing left. That is the most

00:32:46.300 basic level of American unity and solidarity. So much for that loyalty. By the way, Anthony Fauci can't

00:32:51.940 throw, right? I mean, we've established this, right? I mean, I feel bad for him. He's 80,

00:32:55.300 but he's the one who chose to get out there on the mound. I get to make fun of you if you throw

00:32:57.820 that out as the first pitch, right? Yeah. I'm just going to say that if you're ever invited to

00:33:02.020 throw out the first pitch at any baseball game, just say no. Just don't do it. Yeah. If you didn't

00:33:06.140 play college ball, do not get up there and try to throw it out. W threw it out, right? W. He

00:33:11.060 thrown a baseball team. One assumes he had thrown a baseball a few times in his day. If you get the

00:33:17.160 opportunity, Ben Shapiro or Michael Knowles or Andrew Klavan. But even Donald Trump has a good

00:33:21.620 throwing motion. Internet celebrity. Well, yeah, he's never exercised. I feel like I'm

00:33:24.980 praising Trump so much this episode. If you had never exercised, you could throw out a baseball

00:33:28.520 too. You keep picking these guys. That's true. No, he does have all his life force.

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00:35:33.840 the phone. Getting life insurance, listen, I kid, it is very important, especially once you start

00:35:39.020 having children, especially when you have dependents, especially when you have other people who you need

00:35:42.480 to provide for. The loss of a loved one is a terrible enough thing. Don't put people in a position

00:35:47.680 of not only having to mourn for you, but also have to worry about how they're going to meet those basic

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00:36:12.400 and the best shopping experience, a winning combo. PolicyGenius, it is important and nice to get your

00:36:17.360 life insurance right. So, before we went to break, we were talking, Drew, about this idea of the media

00:36:24.260 having completely taken off the mask, as Ben said, and revealing that they're partisan activists. I referenced

00:36:28.800 this podcast, this second biggest podcast in the country today in which the New York Times says that

00:36:35.020 the problem with education in America is white parents. Of course, this comes right on the heels 0.99

00:36:39.740 of the 1619 Project and some great reporting done by the Daily Wire discovered that the New York Times

00:36:45.240 spent over $3 million promoting the 1619 Project and was able to obscure the specifics of how they spent

00:36:50.840 that money. Just three ads from the 1619 Project. Just three individual ads by exploiting a protection that

00:36:55.420 was afforded them because they're not activists, because they're supposed to be straight journalists.

00:36:59.640 Of course, then they behave as activists. The very fact that they're printing curricula now to put

00:37:06.420 into elementary, junior high, high schools, doesn't this evidence that they aren't, in fact,

00:37:12.480 journalistic institutions anymore at all? I mean, are we really seeing not only sort of the reveal,

00:37:18.940 but aren't we seeing a shift happen where these organizations are now directly engaging in

00:37:24.000 politics in a way that maybe has not been the case in the post-war consensus?

00:37:28.600 Yeah, it's the Trump effect in a lot of ways, because Donald Trump hasn't caused any of this

00:37:33.460 to happen. He simply lanced the boil. I mean, it really was this bad. Everybody has this myth that

00:37:40.020 suddenly with Donald Trump, the journalistic community lost it. But that's not true. You go back

00:37:45.200 to George W. Bush. He was Hitler every day. Every word he said was a scandal. And the system is,

00:37:50.240 as I explain often, the system is not each individual story. It is to create an attitude,

00:37:55.860 an atmosphere of chaos so that when something actually happens, like Hurricane Katrina or the

00:38:01.340 Chinese flu, suddenly you think like, oh, yeah, it really has been chaotic all this time. It's really

00:38:06.040 been a disaster. So all that's happened now is the full reveal. And it's not just journalism. It really

00:38:12.240 is across our institutions. We have let our institutions get hollowed out. I mean, we have

00:38:17.020 a legislature that doesn't legislate. We have a court system that does legislate. We have journalists

00:38:23.520 that don't cover anything, academies that don't teach. And I think this is a genuinely serious

00:38:28.160 problem. And it's one of the reasons you should probably buy this book. By the way, I want to say

00:38:33.640 I want to say I saw this title, How to Destroy America in Three Easy Steps, and I thought I was going to

00:38:37.220 open up and say, oh, my God, it's a cookbook. It's not for that. No, but I mean, I think this is we

00:38:44.420 are actually seeing something quite, quite serious, which is the hollowness of our institutions. And as

00:38:51.140 long as Trump is there, everybody can sort of point to him and say, oh, look, this is the problem. But

00:38:55.660 it's just not so. I mean, Trump is an effect of this. And the press, our entertainment system,

00:39:02.320 all of this has been hollowed out for years. I've been talking about it for years. And suddenly,

00:39:07.920 suddenly my phone starts ringing and people say, you know, gee, what are we supposed to do about

00:39:12.360 this? And I say, well, about 20 years ago, you're supposed to start building, you know,

00:39:16.060 news agencies. You're supposed to start building movie studios. You're supposed to start building

00:39:20.740 academies and teaching institutions. And look, the right has not done this. And the right,

00:39:26.740 one of the reasons the right has not done this is because I think our philosophy has been emptied out

00:39:31.080 by fusionism, by basically saying we're going to put together libertarians, religious people,

00:39:36.320 and capitalism. And it all kind of comes, it's all sort of been about money. I mean,

00:39:40.520 all we've ever said to people is like the pursuit of happiness is about money. Capitalism is the

00:39:44.880 greatest thing ever. And now one of the things that Ben was talking about, about the fact that

00:39:49.220 corporations are signing on to this racist, Marxist, disgusting Black Lives Matter philosophy, 0.99

00:39:55.380 it shows you that capitalism won't save you. You've got to start with the values. It has to start

00:39:59.440 with the values. And unless we become a values party or a values movement, we can't stop this

00:40:05.540 because we have no message. Until we have a message, we can't do the messaging. And I think

00:40:10.440 that it really is a problem that has finally just kind of come open, like I said, like a boil being

00:40:15.160 lanced. I think that I'm a little bit more pro-capitalism. I may be the last...

00:40:19.040 Totally pro-capitalism, but...

00:40:20.280 I actually think there's a slightly nuanced distinction that I would make. I think one of the problems

00:40:25.580 that happens with the right is that we don't profit off of the culture at all. And so we

00:40:32.880 abandon the culture entire. If you go to... If you ask why do conservative billionaires not fund film

00:40:40.140 or music or technology? It's another... Conservatives famously don't get involved in any major way in

00:40:45.960 technology. The answer, I think, is because conservatives tend to be fairly conservative

00:40:51.160 in their approach. And therefore, rich conservatives tend to be people who got rich through very

00:40:56.700 conservative practices. So for example, while I was in the DFW area over the last week,

00:41:03.160 there's so much real estate wealth. There's so much energy wealth that goes on in those places,

00:41:08.320 right? I mean, famously, if you make your money in real estate or in energy or in oil,

00:41:14.400 you're in Texas. And think about how those guys make their money. If you make your money in real

00:41:18.080 estate, you can put on a spreadsheet the steps to allow you to prosper over time. You could start

00:41:24.000 now with very little money in your own bank account. And you could build your way to being

00:41:28.940 an extraordinarily wealthy person in a very meat and potatoes, very predictable, one step in front

00:41:33.520 of the other way. And so if you become a very wealthy, conservative real estate person, you probably

00:41:39.860 have spreadsheets that tell you, if I increase the rental rates in my skyscraper by 10% over the

00:41:47.900 next three years, I'll be able to afford to do a remodel of the entire structure, which will allow

00:41:52.740 me to increase my rate by 20% over the three years after that, which will allow me to buy a second

00:41:57.320 skyscraper. And if I raise my rent 10% over the next three years there, I can do a renovation,

00:42:01.540 which will allow me to... And they can, very one step in front of the other, see these ways to build

00:42:05.860 wealth. With the exception of wildcatting, a lot of the energy industry functions the same way.

00:42:11.580 If we frack this many wells, there's a ratio to understand. And so you might make two, three,

00:42:18.060 four, five, $20 billion in those businesses, but you always know what the next thing to do with your

00:42:23.760 money is. If you make a billion dollars in real estate, you put the billion dollars back into

00:42:29.140 real estate so that you can make $2 billion. Now, imagine that you're that guy. You know what to do

00:42:34.640 with every dollar that comes your way and how to turn that into another dollar, how to turn that into

00:42:38.900 a better downtown in your community. Let's don't pretend it's just money. How to turn that into

00:42:43.340 better jobs for the people in your community and all the things that come with that kind of growth.

00:42:47.540 And now a kid walks into your office with a backpack and he says, hey, dude. Nobody calls me dude. He

00:42:54.020 says, yeah, man, listen, I built this app. What's an app? Well, it's this thing on the computer. I built

00:43:00.200 this website and basically I put up a bunch of pictures of hot chicks from my college and I let people 0.96

00:43:06.320 vote with a thumbs up or a thumbs down. And if the chick gets a thumbs up, then she moves to the 1.00

00:43:11.280 second ranking and more people can vote on her. Please give me $10 million. I think I could grow

00:43:15.420 this into something where people can really talk to each other, man. You'd be like, how did you get

00:43:20.660 in here? And you would kick that kid out of your office and you wouldn't even know 15 years later

00:43:26.060 that he's worth $75 billion and that that app that he built for voting on how hot chicks are became the

00:43:32.820 most important communication platform ever devised in the history of man. Because you knew meat and

00:43:40.000 potatoes, how to take your money and put it into the next thing. So we now imagine some beatnik kid

00:43:45.980 walks into your office with a backpack and he's got an idea for how he can tell a story that's kind of

00:43:51.880 funny. And he thinks maybe people will laugh. And he tells you a couple of jokes that he wrote into

00:43:55.680 scene three about a bong hit. And you're like, what on earth? But it turns out that guy goes on to be

00:44:00.700 Adam Sandler or something. And he creates one of the most profitable film franchises or film

00:44:06.280 companies in modern Hollywood. He has a deal with Sony for years. He's the most popular film producer

00:44:12.460 on Netflix for a number of years. In other words, there's nothing in the experience of the kind of

00:44:17.160 people who have excess cash on the right to help them understand why they should back these cultural

00:44:21.580 plays. Meanwhile, guys who made their money in technology, like Silicon Valley guys, they see money

00:44:27.560 completely differently. They make a billion dollars and there is no next apartment building

00:44:32.060 to buy. There is no community in which they have invested in. They didn't pick downtown Fort Worth

00:44:37.260 to be the place where they were going to build and grow. They made their money in these very abstract

00:44:41.060 ways. And so they're willing to take bets on other people who think abstractly. I think that there is

00:44:46.080 just a culture. It's funny, a cultural difference for how the culture is perceived from people who made

00:44:51.900 their money in abstract ways and people who made their money by renovating apartment buildings.

00:44:55.920 You know, I have to tell you, I have to tell you why it's not that I disagree with what you're

00:45:00.340 saying, but I think that you're seeing something you're saying that something is built into the

00:45:03.980 system. And I think that it's, it's actually a matter of values. This is one of the reasons you

00:45:08.160 and I always disagree about Ayn Rand, who I just hate. And I think that if you take the value,

00:45:13.620 if you put values first, you can have capitalism and it will be the wonderful machine that it is

00:45:19.220 for raising everybody up. But if you don't put the values for, you know, when, when Jesus said,

00:45:22.640 you can't serve God and mammon, he wasn't just whistling Dixie, which would have been racist.

00:45:26.560 He was actually, he was actually saying, you have to put some, one thing before the other.

00:45:32.520 And I think the thing is when we see, when we see Amazon sending me on my webpage saying,

00:45:38.220 oh, if you like the collected poetry of William Wordsworth, you might like white fragility. And you 1.00

00:45:42.480 think like, I'm sorry, what he, he has got to be making a calculation that somehow that's going

00:45:47.480 to help him financially down the road. And he may be right. When Oprah takes the 1619 project,

00:45:53.520 that's an Ayn Randian success. I mean, that's everything that Ayn Rand supports, except that

00:45:58.200 it's destructive of the country. If you don't put the values first, if you don't put the values above

00:46:02.440 the money, and we have, we fail to preach this as conservatives. If you don't put the values above

00:46:06.700 the money, you really hollow out what capitalism is. And you have China basically, where they have 0.99

00:46:12.240 free markets and no freedom.

00:46:13.560 Well, I think that there is a problem that you're diagnosing, but I think that I'm not sure I agree

00:46:18.200 with the exact diagnosis. So I totally agree that conservatives have failed to talk about

00:46:22.420 values in markets. They've talked about the value of markets, but not values in markets. And that

00:46:26.380 makes a huge difference. The, as soon as conservatives made the moves to talk in terms of utilitarianism,

00:46:32.240 they lost. Conservatives are not utilitarians. As soon as conservatives started to say, the reason

00:46:36.680 that markets are good is because they produce prosperity and wealth. It was over because it's so easy

00:46:41.440 for somebody else to say, right, but prosperity and good for whom, right? How about this group?

00:46:45.540 This group's been left behind. Why can't we just capture the value of the market? And then we can

00:46:49.440 turn it and twist it and we can do X, Y, or Z with it, right? This is the sort of language that both

00:46:53.940 Tucker Carlson uses on the right about markets, right? Markets are just a mechanism and we can chain

00:46:57.860 them to anything we want. So why don't we chain them to things that we like? And Elizabeth Warren,

00:47:01.260 who will say things like, the markets are just a mule that you can hitch to your wagon and it will take

00:47:05.460 you exactly where you want to go. The point of markets, and this is something that I've been focused on for a

00:47:09.180 very long time. The reason that markets are good is because markets are a reflection of a truth about

00:47:13.720 human nature was that human beings are free and deserve to own their own labor. And so people

00:47:18.400 have asked me, okay, so what if a market was less efficient than a fascist economic system? I would

00:47:22.100 still believe in the market. I would still believe in the market because I think that there's an

00:47:25.300 inherent goods, the belief that human beings own their own labor, that they are individuals created

00:47:29.300 in the image of God. And as Locke argued, if you're an individual created in the image of God and you mix

00:47:33.060 your labor with the earth, you then own that labor. That is an inherent good. And that is not reliant

00:47:37.260 on the effect of the capitalist enterprise. It just turns out that this also happens to create

00:47:42.160 the most wealth in the history of humanity. But you have to argue that people actually own their

00:47:45.380 own labor and that they ought to own their own labor as a moral matter, not as a utilitarian matter.

00:47:50.320 So I think reading values in capitalism and opposition is incorrect, except in that people 0.93

00:47:55.760 have started to discuss capitalism only in utilitarian terms. And very often when they speak about capitalism

00:48:01.380 in utilitarian terms, they don't mean long-term utilitarian terms, right? The problem with Ayn Rand is she

00:48:05.480 assumes that everybody who engages in capitalism is going to think more than five minutes down the

00:48:09.960 road. She assumes that people are going to forego the immediate profit margin that is to be found

00:48:14.900 in doing the wrong thing in order to preserve the system that is going to... Ayn Rand actually does

00:48:19.800 assume that there is a value that you are assuming in your own life, your ownership of your own

00:48:23.720 living, right? This is why as much as I disagree with her sort of values on capitalism when applied to

00:48:28.620 your personal life and your treatment of family, when she talks about selfishness is a value,

00:48:33.440 what she really means is that you ought to own your own labor. There is a value in owning your

00:48:37.680 own labor. There is something good in the creative human spirit, right? That is a value-laden argument

00:48:41.780 and that's been left behind by a lot of the people who tend to speak about capitalism purely as a

00:48:45.380 utilitarian creator of wealth. But there's also this issue, I mean, Ben, I agree with you exactly on

00:48:49.280 the utilitarian point and Drew, I agree with you on this point that you need values. We've made this

00:48:54.100 mistake, especially Republicans have, you know, at Republican fundraisers for the last 30, 40 years,

00:48:59.280 which is that the Republican party fundraiser speech was always schizophrenic. It began with,

00:49:05.000 we need to maintain strong communities and family values and conserve all of our wonderful rituals

00:49:09.680 and traditions. And by the way, we need to destroy all of that for creative destruction that is

00:49:14.200 constantly ever progressing and is always making people move all over the place and not even just

00:49:18.920 all around the country, but all around the globe. Isn't that great? We're all going to make a lot more

00:49:21.980 money. And the latter part of that argument undercuts the very values that you're talking about at the

00:49:28.040 beginning. So I agree entirely, Ben, that you need to make a moral argument for not just markets,

00:49:33.760 but for so many other facets of our economic system. But you also, you have to begin with

00:49:39.740 the human person, what we want, an authentic politics, which since ancient Greece means a lot

00:49:45.200 of people coming together and deciding how we want to live, debating ethical questions, ranking our

00:49:49.600 priorities. And only then will you be able to even have an economic system that doesn't completely

00:49:54.980 undercut itself as we're seeing right now with the woke companies who are chopping off at the knees,

00:50:00.260 the very country that allowed these markets to flourish.

00:50:02.200 So, yeah, I think it's possible. I mean, I always make the moral argument for capitalism. I agree with

00:50:07.700 you a hundred percent on that, Ben, but you're, you're looking at it from one side, which is if

00:50:12.300 fascism worked better, was more efficient than capitalism, would fascism be all right? And of course,

00:50:16.620 the answer is no. But if capitalism starts to sell fascism and make a bundle, would that be all

00:50:21.120 right? And the answer is also no. I think when, when, uh, when you're using corporations, for

00:50:26.000 instance, when you have corporations that are silencing free speech, that are cutting down free

00:50:29.740 speech, to me, that is a value that actually supersedes all kinds of capitalist rules. If your company is in

00:50:36.520 any way harming the right of Americans to speak freely in an effective way, your company's got to go.

00:50:41.900 Your company should be just shut down. You know, your rights, if you don't start with the fact that

00:50:45.760 your rights come from God, then there's always going to be different kinds of power centers that

00:50:50.080 can take away those rights. And I think those rights have to be defended because they are holy,

00:50:54.760 because they come from a source outside our, ourselves and capitalism. Listen, again, I'm a

00:50:59.980 total capitalist, but capitalism has to rest on that pedestal. It can't create that pedestal itself.

00:51:07.280 And if you want to defend that pedestal, you need to go talk to our friends

00:51:10.100 manufacturing. When the founders created the constitution, so beautiful.

00:51:18.560 Listen, I'm the true capitalist. You all give a lot of lip service to it. I'm the only one who

00:51:22.660 makes sure you all get paid. When the founders crafted the constitution, the first thing they did

00:51:26.800 was make sacred the rights of the individual to share their ideas without limitation by their

00:51:30.700 government. The second right they enumerated was the right of the population to protect that speech

00:51:35.060 and their own persons with force. You know how strongly each of us here believes in these

00:51:39.300 principles. Every one of us here, a gun owner and owning a rifle in particular is an awesome

00:51:44.860 responsibility. Building rifles is no different. Bravo Company Manufacturing, BCM, built a professional

00:51:49.760 grade product, which is built to combat standards. That's because BCM believes that the same level of

00:51:54.720 protection should be provided to every single American, regardless of whether or not you're a

00:51:58.740 private citizen or a professional. People at BCM assume that when a rifle leaves their shop,

00:52:03.140 it will be used in a life or death situation by a responsible citizen, law enforcement officer,

00:52:07.340 or a soldier overseas. With that in mind, every component of a BCM rifle is hand-assembled and

00:52:11.720 tested by Americans. The people at BCM feel it's their moral responsibility as Americans to provide

00:52:17.220 tools that will not fail the end user when it's not just a paper target, but someone coming to do

00:52:22.020 them harm. BCM also knows that making a reliable, life-saving tool is only half the story. The company

00:52:27.860 also works with leading instructors of marksmanship from top levels of America's special operations

00:52:32.760 forces, from Marine Corps force reconnaissance to U.S. Army special operations forces,

00:52:37.100 connecting them with other Americans. These top instructors teach the skills necessary to defend

00:52:41.380 yourself, your family, or others. We love the guys over at Bravo Company Manufacturing. They make a great

00:52:46.760 product, and they actually do believe it's based on the values, as Drew was saying. They make a great

00:52:53.080 product. They're great in the marketplace, but they also believe that that product serves the ideals

00:52:58.520 that are ensconced in the Second Amendment to the Constitution. Bravo Company Manufacturing, Ben.

00:53:03.440 To learn more about Bravo Company Manufacturing, head on over to bravocompanymfg.com. You can

00:53:07.700 discover more about their products, special offers, upcoming news. That is bravocompanymfg.com.

00:53:12.260 If you need more convincing, find out even more about BCM and the amazing people who make their

00:53:15.940 products at youtube.com slash bravocompanyusa. Here, we imitate masculinity by having men smoke cigars.

00:53:21.340 There, they just do masculinity by making firearms. 0.94

00:53:24.520 And smoking cigars.

00:53:25.460 And smoking cigars. YouTube.com slash bravocompanyusa or bravocompanymfg.com.

00:53:31.600 Alicia?

00:53:32.560 Does that code work for people that work at the company? Just asking for someone.

00:53:36.560 Alrighty. Reminder to join our most exclusive membership tier. Are you like me? You like

00:53:41.780 exclusive things? Well, turns out, even at the Daily Wire, we have a very exclusive membership tier.

00:53:46.800 It's our all-access tier, and you can join us for a live online Q&A discussion right after this

00:53:52.500 episode of Backstage using that code that Jeremy doesn't love because it doesn't have his name in

00:53:56.520 it. Backstage. It's the name of his show, though. And that code will get you 15% off using the code

00:54:02.300 Backstage with two tumblers. So dailywire.com slash subscribe. Code Backstage for 15% off for the

00:54:08.940 very exclusive all-access membership. Go and do it now because we still have time to ask the guys your

00:54:14.620 questions and get answers from them. First question goes to Ben Shapiro, New York Times.

00:54:18.240 I just want to say, I mean, I know it's our show. It's just that you guys also have your show. That's

00:54:23.960 the problem. It's my show. I guess in a way they're all my show. Yeah, you're the executive

00:54:29.540 producer of all of the shows. I mean, your name pops up on every single one. Oh, that's something.

00:54:34.480 Yeah, there you go. The men behind the curtain. All right, Ben, how would you handle the concentration

00:54:39.280 camp situation in China? And should there be more sanctions from the United States? And when is the

00:54:44.300 world really morally culpable without taking direct intervention? And why hasn't more action been

00:54:49.240 taken? It's like a four-part question, but I think it's a really good one. Yeah, that was a lot. So

00:54:52.900 when it comes to when is a country responsible for taking a direct humanitarian intervention,

00:54:57.680 my general rule of thumb is if the risk is low and the benefit is high, then you should do it.

00:55:02.900 The risk obviously is not low. If you're going to talk about bombing China over this,

00:55:06.240 then the question becomes, are you really willing to basically start World War III

00:55:09.480 at this point in time? And the answer there is no for pretty much everybody involved. I mean,

00:55:15.080 China is the world's most populous country. Is India now? Has India passed them? China may be 0.60

00:55:19.120 the second most populous country on planet Earth. In any case, a billion people over in China with an

00:55:23.040 incredibly large army and significant capacity to do Americans harm. Starting a war with China would 0.96

00:55:28.680 be a mistake. Does that mean that you have to abandon people to their fate? Absolutely not. We should be

00:55:32.380 engaging with the Chinese government exactly the way we engage with the USSR, which is to say we should cut 0.96

00:55:37.000 them off at the knees economically. We should recognize them for exactly the threat they are

00:55:40.940 globally speaking. They are an evil dictatorship, a full on evil dictatorship, not merely for what

00:55:46.000 they're doing to the Uyghurs, shaving heads and sending people on trains to concentration camps where 1.00

00:55:49.800 they force them into slave labor and or sterilize them. But what they've done to Hong Kong in subjecting

00:55:54.340 a free people to the predations of absolute communistic tyranny and the rest of the world shrugging

00:55:59.280 and yawning is an unbelievable chastisement of the idea that the West was ever willing to stand up for

00:56:04.180 the freedom of anybody in that region. And the next people who are going to take it directly on

00:56:08.380 the nose of the folks over in Taiwan, which is why the United States should immediately recognize 0.97

00:56:12.140 Taiwan as an independent country. They shouldn't wait more than five seconds. China ain't going to

00:56:15.780 start a shooting war over it. It might get mad at us. Tough. The United States should immediately

00:56:19.180 declare Taiwan a sovereign country. No more of this two systems, one country nonsense that China insists

00:56:25.060 upon. The United States should immediately sanction pretty much any business that is currently run by

00:56:31.320 the Chinese government. And if the United States wants to take measures to prevent people from

00:56:34.760 doing business with China, I'm not against it. I mean, right now, the problem is that you have a 1.00

00:56:38.260 collective action problem, which is that if businesses don't do business with China, they're

00:56:41.520 immediately undercut by other businesses that do do businesses with China. But that is exactly why

00:56:45.420 governments should get involved and they should be sanctioning China on a full scale. One of the great 1.00

00:56:49.200 mistakes, I think, in history, and maybe it was excusable at the time because we were at war with the

00:56:53.680 Soviet Union. But one of the great mistakes, in my view, was the opening of China. The idea that economics was ever 0.78

00:56:58.020 going to overcome values has been thoroughly rebuked by the presence of Chinese dictatorship,

00:57:02.640 which has strengthened, become more powerful, become more deep, more tyrannical, with the advent

00:57:08.180 of more capitalism. They've just taken all the spoils of a state-run, basically, fascist economy,

00:57:14.760 and then they've dumped it into their own dictatorship. The entire Western world should be united against

00:57:19.080 China right now. Whether they will or not is anybody's guess, but as the leaders of the free world,

00:57:22.900 it seems to me that we should be doing whatever we can to make it known to the Chinese economically

00:57:26.760 that we are simply not going to abide by their intellectual property theft, their human rights

00:57:30.640 predations, and their expansionism. All right, next question is for Jeremy. This is a pretty

00:57:35.960 interesting take, too. It says that we've seen this week, I know that you guys have seen that poll

00:57:39.240 that Frank Luntz and others have tweeted out that shows that 62 percent of Americans are afraid to share

00:57:43.760 their political views. But does this mean that the recent polls showing that Trump is down double

00:57:48.660 digits are then meaningless? So I'm not one who believes that we can just write off polls as

00:57:54.040 meaningless. Very often when conservatives say, well, the polls were wrong, the polls actually

00:57:58.300 weren't that wrong. You know, we like to say the polls showed that Hillary Clinton was going to win

00:58:04.000 in 2016, but she did win more votes in 2016. And basically by the same numbers that the polls

00:58:09.820 said that she would, the polls were very useful at helping understand human behavior. They were not

00:58:14.320 very good at specifying what was going to happen in some of the Midwestern states, which came down to

00:58:19.600 some fairly, very small and very anomalous things that occurred that allowed Trump to win. Listen,

00:58:25.060 I'm not saying he didn't win fair and square based on the system we have. He did. What I'm saying is

00:58:29.760 that the polls also were not wildly wrong about what the outcome was going to be in terms of the

00:58:33.840 human voting behavior at that time. That said, one other thing, there is no silent majority of

00:58:40.080 conservatives. There's this sort of idea hearkening back to Nixon that there's this silent majority

00:58:44.260 that all think the way that we do is going to rise up. It's very comforting, I think,

00:58:48.100 for conservatives to believe that. But it is not true. The left has won. Their opinions are the

00:58:55.700 more popular opinions by and large in the country, in particular among the young. If the election were

00:59:00.800 held today and only millennials were able to vote, Donald Trump would probably win zero states. At

00:59:06.500 most, he would win one state. And lest you roll your eyes and say, oh, who cares what the millennials

00:59:11.500 think? You're wrong about who millennials are. Michael Knowles is a millennial. The 20-year-old

00:59:16.220 that you just hired to work at your factory or the 16-year-old kid who you're still trying to get

00:59:22.020 out the front door. You got a couple more years of raising them. They aren't millennials. They're a 0.92

00:59:25.240 whole new generation that's coming up behind the millennials. The millennials are closer to 40 by and

00:59:30.200 large than they are to 20. And they are, for the first time in our history, the largest voting

00:59:36.580 demographic in the country. So the idea that you could have the largest voting demographic in the entire

00:59:42.860 country utterly despise everything that we believe, and yet somehow we're still a silent

00:59:48.520 majority and secretly everybody agrees with us, it's absurd. And it's going to be cold comfort when

00:59:55.680 to tell ourselves, oh, well, there's still a silent majority. They just didn't show up to vote

00:59:59.780 when we start getting pummeled in elections. Instead, we better stop lying to ourselves and do something

01:00:04.900 about the problem. So with those two caveats in mind, are there a lot more people who agree with us

01:00:12.100 than are willing to admit it? Of course. Are you out of your mind? You could lose everything by

01:00:16.060 agreeing with us on even the most benign topics. Men are not women, right? Men are not women is 0.99

01:00:22.620 bannable, boycottable in our society today. Even more benign things than that, saying I agree that

01:00:29.460 Black Lives Matter, but I don't agree with Black Lives Matter, would cost most people working in most 1.00

01:00:35.540 companies in this country today to lose their job. So you bet your rear end, there are a lot of

01:00:41.540 people afraid they should be afraid to speak their mind. I want to, though, tell you what I think the

01:00:46.500 answer is and not just leave you with a sort of despair. You know, Ben said that the government

01:00:51.640 needs to get involved in China because one of the good things that capitalism does is it creates 0.97

01:00:57.360 competition and competition creates efficiencies. We produce a wonderful tumbler, the leftist here's

01:01:03.760 hot or cold tumbler. The leftist here's hot or cold tumbler is manufactured in China. You might say,

01:01:08.900 why don't you manufacture it in America? Because there are zero companies in the United States of

01:01:14.280 America that manufacture still tumblers. It's not that it's more expensive to do it here. It is that

01:01:20.840 it is not possible to do it here. We've looked into it. Maybe we've missed one and somebody will correct

01:01:26.260 me to our ability to search it out. Trade with China has been going on now for over 50 years. There

01:01:33.480 are consequences of that change. We have moved a lot of our manufacturing overseas and I know some of you

01:01:38.760 are going to write in pissed off at me now and say, you're a hypocrite for buying your tumblers in 0.78

01:01:43.580 China. And you're going to type to me, of course, on your iPhone, which was also made in China or your

01:01:48.840 Android, which was made in China or your laptop, which was made in China. And I'm going to ignore 0.80

01:01:53.120 you because you're only actually proving the fact that manufacturing happens in China.

01:01:58.140 China. You don't stop that by Daily Wire saying, we're going to start a tumbler company. There's

01:02:05.080 no reason why we, you would need to make millions of tumblers. We purchased tens of thousands of

01:02:11.200 tumblers. We can't start a tumbler factory. Someone should start a tumbler factory and they will do so

01:02:16.620 when there's incentive for them to do, when they can do it competitively, when they won't lose by doing

01:02:21.800 it. One thing that I've discovered is everybody says that they want to buy American until they see the

01:02:26.400 price tag for buying American. And then everybody just buys China or buys India.

01:02:30.680 Jeremy, this happened. My wife said at the beginning of all the craziness with China, 1.00

01:02:34.720 you know, even before the pandemic, how they're cheating on the trade is, she said, we're just

01:02:37.800 going to buy American. I said, okay, that's fine. Buy dresses, buy shoes, buy American. There are only,

01:02:42.540 as you say, like three companies that do this. And even they get a lot of their stuff from China,

01:02:46.980 but the price, I'm actually willing to pay it. I am actually like, I am stubbornly American enough to

01:02:53.500 pay for it, but it's not just 20% more. It's like three X. Like it is so much more expensive.

01:02:59.480 So we looked at what it would take to actually manufacture the tumbler and our cost on manufacturing

01:03:04.640 the tumbler wouldn't be three X. It would be 20 X. If we were to manufacture the tumblers directly

01:03:10.660 and the machines that we would have to install in order to do it are themselves made in China.

01:03:16.520 So the only way that you deal with a problem like this is to take some sort of collective action

01:03:20.900 where the people who do what we don't want aren't the ones who succeed at the expense of the people

01:03:25.820 who try to do the thing that we do want. This is why capitalism actually does. There is a value

01:03:30.680 component to capitalism, which is that competition makes it to where the people who do the best make

01:03:39.020 the most. And when you start interfering with that in a bad way, I think you create some perverse

01:03:42.660 incentives. The same thing holds true though, on this question of the silent majority, the people

01:03:47.140 who are afraid to speak out. It is a collective action problem. If every single person in America

01:03:52.420 today who thinks that it is egregious that major league baseball is kneeling and condemning our

01:03:58.660 society before the game would just turn off the game. A hundred percent of us, you would see change.

01:04:03.920 If every one of us who is afraid that we might lose our job for speaking mainstream, traditionally

01:04:09.020 middle of the road, American opinions, like for example, segregation is bad. Equal justice under the

01:04:17.160 law is good. Hard work is not only for white people, which the Smithsonian literally said last week,

01:04:23.660 hard work is a white value that is, or the nuclear family is only a white value system. If we would all

01:04:29.700 just say bull crap, men are men, women are women, everybody can and should work hard. Black people are

01:04:34.880 not inferior or superior to white people. They're just people who should be held to the same set of

01:04:39.660 standards. Yes, some people are born in circumstances that are worse than others. Some of those people

01:04:45.280 are black. Some of those people are white. Some people are born with circumstances that are better 0.95

01:04:48.640 than others. And some of those people are black and some of those people are white. And the best we can

01:04:52.460 do is make a fair society and leave each other the hell alone. If we would all say that, they couldn't

01:04:57.140 fire all of us at the same time. The problem is we don't. And then we let one or two brave suckers

01:05:04.160 stick their necks out and they lose their jobs. And we all go, well, I wish somebody would stand up

01:05:09.480 to the left. And we go hide in the corner. It's a collective action issue. When the day comes that

01:05:15.400 we're all willing to stand up, they will have to stop, even if we're not the majority. A significant

01:05:21.540 plurality is enough to put a stop to this. And rant. Next question for Andrew. All right. Drew,

01:05:29.540 this comes from a Daily Wire all access subscriber, by the way. That's why they get to ask you a

01:05:33.940 question. And they say that they've been rereading 1984. And is it not so very concerning how similar

01:05:39.340 the structures that seem to be being built currently are to the structures and the procedures

01:05:43.820 of this fictional book? Drew, you didn't write 1984. No, I did actually. I used a different name

01:05:51.340 then. But no, listen, 1984 is a perfect description of Soviet Russia. And of course, the left always works

01:05:58.920 the same way. It has to work the same way. If you don't have, you know, the thing about it is,

01:06:02.720 there actually is a moral order. There actually is moral truth and spiritual truths. And in order

01:06:08.380 to erase these things, you have to erase every form of logic and information that can be, that is

01:06:14.420 available to people. It's not enough. It's not enough to lie to people. You have to stop people

01:06:18.720 from telling the truth. That's why you have cancel culture. There's no reason to have cancel culture

01:06:22.960 if you're right, if you're actually telling the truth. So everything in 1984, the famous scene in

01:06:29.060 1984, where they torture Winston Smith, and they say to him, it's not the two and two is four. It's

01:06:34.880 not the two and two is five. It's the two and two is whatever the party says it is. That's the system

01:06:40.560 that you have to install in order to overcome reality. And so whenever you have a movement like

01:06:46.620 Black Lives Matter, like Antifa, like anything that comes from the far left, that is actually in opposition

01:06:52.800 to reality. Those same systems for silencing the truth, for silencing people's, even their own

01:06:58.540 thought processes have to come into play. 1984 is prophetic. You know, they always used to say that

01:07:03.940 he got it wrong in 1984 and it was Brave New World that got it right. But no, I think the two of them

01:07:09.340 hopscotch over each other. Brave New World is a technological tyranny. But 1984 is the face of tyranny

01:07:15.300 in a technological world. And it always will be, and it will always remain. And when you look at what's

01:07:20.400 happening in our media, when Ben talks about the media, that's 1984. That's exactly what we're

01:07:25.420 talking about. When you talk about cancel culture, that is 1984. I wish people would read it because

01:07:30.460 it is an absolute exact and precise case study of this kind of tyranny. By the way, here I will again

01:07:37.220 stump for a movie that everybody should go watch right now. If you're looking for a good piece of

01:07:40.120 entertainment that really does have excellent values and has something to say, go check out the movie

01:07:45.260 Mr. Jones on Amazon. You should go rent it. It is the story of Gareth Jones, who is the

01:07:50.160 journalist who uncovered the Ukrainian Haladomar. And the villain in the piece is Walter Durante,

01:07:54.600 who is portrayed clear-eyed as the villain. I'm astonished. New York Times reporter. Yeah, I'm amazed

01:07:59.880 the movie was ever made. It's really clear-eyed and accurate and worth the watch. Well, you know,

01:08:04.360 speaking of the New York Times and 1984, when we were talking about that podcast, Jeremy, earlier,

01:08:09.680 that basically said the whole problem in American education is white people. Yeah. I reacted to that

01:08:14.980 jokingly and I said, yeah, white people are terrible and every other kind of person is better 0.96

01:08:19.460 and they're better particularly because of the color of their skin. Hashtag anti-racism. And

01:08:24.600 you know, obviously a little bit of a joke, except it actually makes sense from within the framework of

01:08:29.840 the New York Times and the left, because what they have defined racism as is anything white people do,

01:08:35.380 right? They say all white people are racist and racism is exclusively white. So you can't be any other 0.74

01:08:40.920 kind of color or ethnicity and, and be racist because blah, blah, blah. I don't know, because

01:08:46.160 they've come up with some definition of that. And so it, it, it actually does make sense that you have

01:08:50.920 to just say that white people are the problem for everything. If you live in a world where the, 0.60

01:08:55.120 the definition of words is not what it was today. It's not what it was yesterday. It's not even what

01:09:00.800 it will be tomorrow. The definition of words is what the party says it is. And where can we read that?

01:09:06.360 You read that in the New York Times and every other cultural institution the left took over.

01:09:09.620 Yeah. Michael, this question is for you. If you could construct an art to preserve man's

01:09:15.000 greatest works of art and literature, what would be the first three things that you'd put in there

01:09:19.900 after the Bible? Of course. After the Bible, it would be Dante. It would really be Inferno,

01:09:26.040 Purgatory and Paradise. The three parts of Dante's Divine Comedy. Or if you get rid of that,

01:09:30.360 I would do Dante and then I would do Shakespeare. And then I would do, I don't know, let's throw like a

01:09:36.000 Coravaggio in there just because- How to Destroy America in three easy steps.

01:09:40.700 I like left it hanging there for you, dude. It was so obvious. Like, just pick it up and be like,

01:09:45.980 here you go. Is that not in Dante's Divine Comedy? That was the fourth canticle of Dante's. You know,

01:09:52.380 I am rereading Dante right now. Man, that guy- You don't say. I am. I love, I actually haven't

01:09:57.180 really read it in 10 years. God, you're a douchebag. It is. It's so great. It's, well,

01:10:01.800 no, but this time, Ben, I'm reading it in English. So I haven't done that before. And I, you know,

01:10:05.580 initially was in the Italian, of course. And- You read the Milton in the Italian.

01:10:10.400 It's so great. Like, I, this is the thing that drives me the craziest about how the left has

01:10:14.580 destroyed education is it's not even that they teach us just stupid nonsense, like, you know,

01:10:19.540 feminist dance theory or all these other kinds of crazy things. It's what they don't teach you 1.00

01:10:25.220 because the whole point of education is you're supposed to get to enjoy all of these great

01:10:29.980 works of your civilization that you, you are simply not exposed to anymore. And even at like top

01:10:35.260 colleges, you, if you get an English degree, you're no longer required to read Shakespeare.

01:10:39.780 And so I think actually after the educational institutions completely deteriorate, we are

01:10:44.900 going to have to go to that desert island and I hope we bring good books.

01:10:48.780 All right. This question comes from a Daily Wire subscriber, also All Access,

01:10:53.100 which don't forget to use that code for 15% off backstage and two tumblers that are made in

01:10:58.220 China, apparently. Who knew? But Ben, this question is where- I mean, it says right on a

01:11:03.140 made in China. I mean, we weren't really hiding it. Ben, where should this Daily Wire subscriber 0.82

01:11:09.580 get all of their COVID news? I mean, other than the Daily Wire. So there are a couple of websites

01:11:13.920 that are, that are really worth checking out. There's one called COVID in Markets. It's run by a guy

01:11:16.940 named David Bonson who writes for National Review. And every day he puts together kind of the most

01:11:20.580 relevant charts with regard to COVID. And it really is as objective as objective can be.

01:11:23.980 He looks at the data with a skeptical eye. He is not alarmist in any way, but he is realistic about

01:11:30.280 sort of where things stand. He'll look internationally as well as domestically. So that's very good.

01:11:33.880 In terms of mainstream media, frankly, there's the Washington Post Health 202 blog is actually quite

01:11:38.020 good and shockingly nonpartisan in a way that the rest of the newspaper just is not. The political

01:11:43.760 pages cover COVID, which is insane. The political pages should not cover COVID. Only the health pages

01:11:47.820 really should cover COVID because it's a health issue. And that's why you see kind of idiot

01:11:51.420 reporters who don't know the first thing about even the coverage of epidemiology pretending they

01:11:56.440 know what they're talking about. But those would be a couple of really good sources. There are a

01:12:01.460 couple of people on Twitter who are sort of skeptics that I sort of balance with people who are not as

01:12:04.660 skeptical. I'll say something controversial. I'll take a look at Alex Berenson. I'll take a look at

01:12:09.100 Aaron Gann. I'll take a look at Younone Weiss. These are all three people who are kind of skeptical

01:12:14.140 of the mainstream media narrative on this stuff. But then I will also follow people like Scott

01:12:18.320 Gottlieb from the FDA. I'll try it. One of the big problems here is that there are no experts on a

01:12:23.240 brand new pandemic. So when people say, listen to the experts, no one is an expert on a thing that

01:12:27.100 has never happened before. It is impossible to be an expert on that, which means that we basically

01:12:31.120 what we've been left with is a piece of expertise that is not expertise at all. Stay away from other

01:12:34.740 people. Don't breathe on them. Wear a mask if you're going to be in close proximity to them and wash your

01:12:39.840 hands a lot. Okay. Which is all crap that we knew in 1918, right? Literally nothing has changed

01:12:43.740 except that we pretend that we know things that we absolutely don't know. And then we blame Trump

01:12:47.280 for all the things that we don't know. Trump is the God of the gaps for so many of these reporters.

01:12:51.460 It really is amazing, right? They're constantly talking about religious people. Well, you know,

01:12:54.720 in the areas where science doesn't have an answer yet, you say, oh, there's where God is. Well,

01:12:58.300 that's exactly what they do with Trump, right? Once the science has made clear that lockdowns

01:13:02.420 may not have worked all that great. Once the science makes clear that California does one thing

01:13:06.160 and Massachusetts does another, New York does another, and Florida and Texas, they all do different

01:13:09.760 things. And yet the result seems kind of similar. So we don't actually know what the hell is going on.

01:13:12.800 To New York where everybody died. Well, yeah, that's different. That's because

01:13:15.020 Andrew Cuomo is a horrible, but the, but the, the go-to is a God of the gaps. You don't know

01:13:20.100 what's happening. Trump, right? It's unbelievable. The religious fervor with which they dedicate their,

01:13:24.300 their lives to sussing out the various doctrinal intricacies of Trump's mind. When, as we all know,

01:13:31.080 it ain't that intricate guys. So like it really isn't. By the way, just quick note on this. I know it's

01:13:35.960 off topic. Have you been following Andrew Cuomo and his fast and his fascist quest to outlaw buffalo wings?

01:13:41.900 Well, making restaurant serve sandwiches, everything that they say about Trump and COVID,

01:13:47.380 that he's a fascist, that he, that he's incompetent, that he's running everything into the ground, 0.88

01:13:51.020 that he's micromanaging and that he wants to control your life. Every single one of those

01:13:54.340 things is true about Andrew Cuomo, except 83,000 times more, including the number of deaths. And

01:13:59.800 Andrew Cuomo is building fricking paper mache mountains of the dead. And then standing in front

01:14:06.540 of them, like Richard Dreyfuss with a fork in front of a giant sculpture of Devil's Tower,

01:14:10.540 explaining to people that he has actually saved thousands of lives. How that, that guy has a 60,

01:14:15.860 70% approval rating in New York. I don't want to hear about how New Yorkers are smart anymore. I just

01:14:19.080 don't. I'm not willing to hear it anymore. You've blown your opportunity to prove to me how smart you

01:14:22.380 are by telling me that Andrew Cuomo is a good governor and Bill de Blasio is a good mayor. What the

01:14:25.960 hell is wrong. Come on. Two months ago, you know, California has taken COVID more seriously than

01:14:30.340 many places. Two months ago, though, if you walk around my neighborhood in the evening,

01:14:33.780 out walking a chief executive dog, Jasper here, you would see that most people had a mask, but they

01:14:39.120 weren't wearing a mask. Why were they not wearing the mask? Because they were outside and it was 90

01:14:43.340 degrees and they were walking. And they would go out of their way to avoid you, you know, and everybody

01:14:48.460 gave each other a wide berth. Today, you walk out on the streets, everyone is wearing a mask. Why?

01:14:53.800 What's the reason? The answer is the same as why Cuomo has a 65% approval rating. It's because

01:15:02.580 COVID has become decidedly political. And the mask, it's not a mask against getting COVID. It's a mask

01:15:10.300 of being in any way perceived to be rejecting the narrative that you must believe in order to be a

01:15:17.340 virtuous person. And so you will see people jogging in the now 90 degree Sherman Oaks heat wearing masks.

01:15:23.160 It's not to keep them safe from the virus. It's to keep them safe from the mob. And that's why

01:15:28.640 that's the same reason Cuomo, it doesn't matter how many people die on Cuomo's watch. Cuomo has been

01:15:33.040 determined by the party to be the great responder to the pandemic. And therefore, he is no data required.

01:15:42.740 All right. This question is about health care. Speaking of COVID, somebody wants to know broadly,

01:15:46.720 how can we improve the system? And is it possible to unlink insurance from work or create privatization

01:15:52.640 to encourage better competition like across state lines, et cetera? This question is for Ben.

01:15:58.960 Well, okay. So let me put down the popcorn for just a second here. So here's the deal.

01:16:04.560 It didn't seem like it was going to be a Ben question.

01:16:06.140 Right. I mean, I just answered one like one second ago. Anyway, this around the horn has really

01:16:10.100 stopped dead. So the answer is it is actually quite difficult to de-link employment and insurance at

01:16:16.600 this point in time, simply because so many people are dependent on it. If you threw people back on

01:16:20.300 their own personal insurance, people would freak the hell out. They would lose their minds, even

01:16:24.200 though that is really the only step that could be taken to really heavily privatize the insurance

01:16:28.120 industry and link your level of cost with your level of risk, which is what is necessary in order

01:16:32.760 to have a transparent and functional market. So with that said, there are certain things you can do

01:16:37.380 around the edges to make the markets more efficient. You can certainly remove a lot of

01:16:40.280 the regulations that are placed on insurance companies, which are, by the way, not earning

01:16:43.720 money hand over fist. This idea that insurance companies are just raking it in is not true.

01:16:47.540 That is a 2% industry at best. That's like a good year for the health insurance industry is they

01:16:51.240 make a 2% margin. They're not raking it in to the tune of billions and billions. If they are raking it

01:16:55.560 in, the reason they're raking it in is because the government is subsidizing them, which is one of the

01:16:59.360 reasons that so many insurance companies actually supported Obamacare, because in the short term,

01:17:02.620 it mandated that people buy insurance, which meant that the insurance companies in the short term made a lot of

01:17:06.540 money, even though on the back end, they were going to lose a lot of money when Obamacare's

01:17:09.760 regulations started to kick in. And all of a sudden, you have to cover all these people with 0.99

01:17:12.780 preexisting conditions who'd never joined before. There are certain things you can do that Avic Roy

01:17:18.120 has talked about this over at the Apothecary and the Forbes blog. He's written full studies on what

01:17:22.680 could be done to make health markets more efficient. Getting rid of regulations on state lines would be 0.75

01:17:28.160 an easy one. Getting rid of a lot of the regulations with regard to how insurance is done would be an easy

01:17:32.300 one. If you actually want to make health insurance cheaper, then what you have to do is get

01:17:36.480 rid of all the provisions that nobody is willing to do politically, namely preexisting conditions.

01:17:40.380 Health insurance is never going to be cheap so long as it's not insurance at all. If I'm insuring

01:17:45.200 myself and I already have a disease, that's not insurance. That is me buying the same coverage at

01:17:50.360 a discount. In the same way that if I set my house on fire and then buy insurance, that's not me buying

01:17:55.880 insurance against the fire. That is me attempting to game the system by having the insurance company

01:17:59.880 pay for the damages that I have already incurred.

01:18:02.700 You're stealing from all the people who are actually paying the whole time.

01:18:05.320 Right. And that's not true for people with preexisting conditions who are just desperate

01:18:07.680 to get care, obviously. But what we're talking about here is how you lower costs. So the

01:18:11.680 framework I always use in discussing health insurance is very easy. You can have two of

01:18:15.280 the following three. You cannot have all three. You can either have a universal system or you

01:18:18.540 can have a quality system or you can have a cheap system. You cannot have all three of

01:18:21.400 those. There's no such thing as a universal quality cheap system. They do not exist. If you

01:18:25.160 want a universal system that is quality, it will be expensive. If you want a universal

01:18:28.380 system that is cheap, it's going to lack in quality. If you want a cheap system that has good

01:18:32.040 quality, it is probably not going to be universal. Andrew, is it possible for you to name a member

01:18:37.380 of the media or just in general that's a liberal that you follow or read that actually has some

01:18:42.120 well thought out arguments that make you think about their perspective? Is that one for me?

01:18:46.860 Andrew. Oh, you know, that's that's a really good question. I read the New York Times every

01:18:51.920 single morning and it has become consistently it is consistently gone from being a fair statement of

01:18:59.640 what the left believes to being crazy land. I mean, you really feel I always I always call the op-ed

01:19:04.220 page knucklehead row, but it's almost more like an asylum at this point. And when I think of like

01:19:09.440 liberals who are thoughtful, I can't when I think of liberals who are thoughtful, I'm now thinking of

01:19:16.160 conservatives. I'm thinking of conservatives who are a little bit more to the center center. I think

01:19:22.180 I live a little bit more in the center in most things. And I think that almost, you know, a long time

01:19:27.240 ago, Lionel Trilling, the famous literary critic, said that there is no such thing as an intellectual

01:19:32.080 conservative movement. Conservatism is just a kind of emotional gesture. I think that's true of the

01:19:38.020 left now. I don't think that there is an intellectual left. I think that there is only an intellectual

01:19:42.240 right, which goes from middle of the road guys to the far right. And I think that this is where the

01:19:48.020 debates are happening. It's where the where nobody's afraid to speak. I mean, I always say, you know,

01:19:52.300 I said to Barry Weiss when she left the New York Times, I said, you know, you're you're on the wrong

01:19:56.320 side. You know, I keep saying this to all these people. You know, you're on the wrong side. Barry Weiss

01:20:01.080 would be an example of a thoughtful of a thoughtful person who considers himself liberal that I do read.

01:20:07.540 My sister, Caitlin Flanagan, is a very fine writer who frequently says really interesting things. And she

01:20:12.700 tends to trend toward the left a little bit. There are these people, but they are fighting a system that really

01:20:18.160 wants to shut them up. So if you want to go to places where you can argue with things, if you

01:20:22.340 want to live in the sort of Dave Rubin world where we're all talking to each other, you really have

01:20:26.780 to be on the right. This is where the conversations are taking place. Quick note here. So I want to

01:20:30.520 just say about that Harper's Weekly letter. So there's Harper's Weekly letter where a bunch of people

01:20:33.720 who are sort of liberal minded said we're done with cancel culture. And there wasn't a single Trump

01:20:37.360 voter on that list. I'm very happy that that letter exists. And until one member of that group is

01:20:42.760 willing to have a conversation publicly with a person who did vote for Trump, it means nothing.

01:20:46.640 Okay. Because, because that entire, that entire statement was designed to open the Overton window

01:20:51.560 just enough for them. In other words, like we want to escape the cancel culture ourselves, 1.00

01:20:56.220 but how many of us are willing to actually cry? Now here's the truth. I know a lot of people on

01:20:59.840 that list and I know some of them are willing to have those conversations, but that letter is only

01:21:03.360 going to matter when that letter includes people ranging from Noam Chomsky to people like you drew

01:21:08.620 and ranging from people like Ann Applebaum to people like Knowles and ranging from people like

01:21:12.940 Thomas Chatterton Williams to people like Jeremy, right? That's the only time that's going to matter

01:21:16.380 because either there's going to be an alliance built between the old school liberals who are

01:21:19.820 not hardcore leftists and people on the right who are committed to free speech, or there will be no

01:21:24.220 alliance at all. And the left is just going to eat this entire, this entire steak piece by piece.

01:21:27.840 You know, on this point of the, where to look in the apparatus of the mainstream media,

01:21:33.100 I don't think there is any place to look. I mean, you met like, I love Caitlin Flanagan and a couple

01:21:37.840 other people, but I don't think that's really where you look. I think the interesting far left even stuff

01:21:44.100 and certainly right-wing stuff you see is on Twitter. It's on these accounts that are named,

01:21:50.200 they're like puns on old philosophers or there are other kind of meany kinds of names. And you know,

01:21:55.540 you can actually find some accounts there that are anonymous because if these, even the leftists,

01:22:00.040 if they say things that are contrary to the approved views of, you know, the liberal establishment,

01:22:04.760 they'll get killed. So they, you know, they, they hide their, their names. You can find some

01:22:10.360 interesting debates happening there. But you know, as you mentioned, Ben, these people are so

01:22:14.380 afraid to even come out and speak to anyone who may have voted for Trump. They're so afraid that

01:22:18.800 those, those conversations, unfortunately right now often have to happen anonymously.

01:22:23.360 I just want to point one thing out about that Harper's letter too, which is really interesting

01:22:27.480 that it, it started out with this big kind of liberal throat clearing about how the right is so much

01:22:32.980 worse, but we're going down this wrong road. And there was a line in there saying,

01:22:36.460 we know that the right is, is, is really the censor, uh, censorious side. Yeah. And every time

01:22:42.120 I see them make that statement, I think name one time, name one place where right-wingers censor

01:22:47.420 people, just please, where they cancel people, where they get people fired. It is really impossible.

01:22:52.120 And this, I feel this way about Trump too. I love, by the way, Ben, I got to tell you, I love

01:22:55.900 Trump of the gaps. I think that that is the only original thing anybody said about Donald Trump

01:22:59.780 the last year. But I think every time I hear that Trump is a unique threat to our way of life,

01:23:04.880 I think name one thing, name a thing he's done. And the New York times, as Barry White said,

01:23:09.760 when you read their op-ed section, it's one op-ed after another saying, what a terrible threat to

01:23:14.300 our way of life is Donald Trump. And I think, okay, name a specific thing. And they never can.

01:23:18.680 It's, it really is amazing. And that the reason for that is they don't listen to anybody but

01:23:22.660 themselves. Well, and that people like Barry and people like we've got, I won't name them for

01:23:29.560 this unfair. Many of our friends who are part of the either intellectual dark web movement or

01:23:34.380 the sort of online moderate centrist, self-described centrist movement. Even they,

01:23:42.020 they're like people who used to be Republicans but call themselves libertarians because maybe they

01:23:46.120 wouldn't get made fun of at work. This movement is a group of people who cannot acknowledge even

01:23:50.840 to themselves that both sides aren't equally bad. The only way that they're able to criticize

01:23:56.720 the left at all is if they first denounce the right. And I, and I don't actually, I will say,

01:24:04.360 I don't think they're just doing it. Barry's letter didn't do that. So to be fair,

01:24:06.860 Barry's letter didn't. But the Harper letter certainly did. And I don't think that they're

01:24:12.600 just posturing in their own minds. They are just posturing, but I'm sure that in their minds,

01:24:17.520 they've actually carved out some way in which they believe that that's true because they're still

01:24:22.500 looking at a right that doesn't exist. And, and many of you, Michael and I were actually talking

01:24:27.120 about this before the show about, uh, uh, someone with whom we're all friendly who the, the right

01:24:33.180 they denounce is not the right that actually exists. They don't know what people on the right

01:24:37.720 actually believe. And so they want to say things like, well, you know, yes, on, on the extreme end

01:24:43.440 of the left, uh, you've got people who are tearing down statues and calling for segregation,

01:24:48.380 but you know, on the extreme side of the right, you guys have a lot of people who want to tear

01:24:52.240 down statues, uh, and go back to segregation too. And you're like, well, no, that's not on the

01:24:57.120 extreme side of the left. That's on the very mainstream side of the left. Uh, like literally

01:25:01.340 not one person in Congress will denounce either of those ideas if they're a Democrat. And on the

01:25:05.960 right, there is no one in the Republican party in Congress who wouldn't denounce anyone who

01:25:11.900 believed that. And they look at you like you're crazy. Like, well, that can't be true because in my

01:25:16.300 mind, that's what the right is. It's very comforting to believe that if there's sort of equal

01:25:21.180 evil on both sides or they're both the problem, but it just ain't the case. Sorry. Sorry, folks.

01:25:25.980 And you know, the, the funny thing is, is when people get red pilled, they first get red pilled

01:25:29.660 and they start to associate with, uh, conservatives. The first thing they say is, gee, people are so

01:25:34.620 nice. And when you consider the four of us, if they're saying that about us, people on the left

01:25:39.020 must be awful. No, but this is all, that's exactly right. Because every time I was on Joe Rogan's

01:25:44.320 show this week, and I'm very friendly with Joe. I think Joe's a great guy. We have a lot of fun

01:25:47.240 together. And all the comments are like, I didn't know that, that Shapiro was such a nice guy. He's

01:25:51.440 such a human being. And it's like, I'm the exact same human being on my show as I was on Joe's

01:25:54.820 show. It's just that nobody on the left really wants to have an open conversation. If they do,

01:25:59.440 it's extraordinarily rare, but they actually want is to browbeat people or not to have them on at all.

01:26:03.980 Right. That's, that's really the goal. And it's, it's really, it's quite disheartening because

01:26:08.540 I really believe that if there is to be a, a future for the country that lies in rights,

01:26:13.020 there is going to have to be a liberal part of the country that stands up on its hind legs and says,

01:26:18.140 I would rather associate with these people. I disagree with about nearly everything when it

01:26:21.400 comes to policy, then you people with whom I agree with on policy about a lot of things,

01:26:25.760 but you guys want to tear down the entire system. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to give

01:26:29.300 away my rights just because you and I both agree that America should move toward a more progressive

01:26:33.320 tax system. Like that's not something I'm willing to do until liberals are willing to actually cross

01:26:37.060 that aisle and shake a few hands and reckon more than anything, just recognize that we're human

01:26:41.220 beings too on this side. I mean, it's what I've said a thousand times. It's the happy birthday

01:26:44.240 problem. Every time I have a birthday, I will get 20 texts from people who are on the left inside

01:26:48.240 mainstream leftist organizations with whom I am friendly, who I've offered a public shoulder to

01:26:52.980 when they have been ripped on, right? I'm the guy out there defending fricking Matt Iglesias,

01:26:56.500 who I've called the Ralph Wiggum of the internet. When he's being assaulted by the, by the members of

01:27:00.580 his own publication, I'm out there defending Matt Iglesias. I'll get bunch of, I'll get, you know,

01:27:04.160 letters from inside major organizations on the left, happy birthday. And then on Twitter, nothing because the minute you

01:27:09.940 acknowledge that people on the right are human beings, then you have, you have humanized them

01:27:13.260 and you must never, ever humanize anybody on the right. It's more important not to humanize anybody

01:27:16.560 on the right than to preserve the rights for everybody. Yeah, that's right. And we all know

01:27:20.560 that Ben's really a robot and he just put on a different mask when he went on Joe Rogan. It was a

01:27:24.460 very enjoyable interview, by the way. I finally get to curse. I mean, with Joe, it's almost, it's in the

01:27:29.200 water or the DMT or whatever it is. It takes you a while to warm up though. Like the first 10 minutes,

01:27:32.420 you're like the effing. And then you like eventually got there. Eventually you're dragged down into,

01:27:37.840 into Joe's world. That's the way that that works. Speaking of being dragged down, Michael,

01:27:43.360 do you think that Ghislaine Maxwell will make it to testify and other thoughts?

01:27:49.320 I was under the impression she had already committed suicide in the future. What day is it? Is it not?

01:27:55.180 No, it's what you're right. I'm sorry. The Clintons haven't scheduled that until at least next Monday.

01:27:59.460 I actually do think, I mean, all, all sort of Clinton, Epstein didn't kill himself jokes aside.

01:28:03.720 I do think she probably will make it because if, if this woman ends up dead in her jail cell, 1.00

01:28:12.860 like the conspiracy theorists will take, they will march on Washington. They will take over the

01:28:18.000 country because by the way, it will be evidence of a conspiracy. So you can't call it a conspiracy

01:28:21.440 theory anymore. It seems as though she's already cooperating with the feds. It seems that she's

01:28:26.200 given up some names, which I'm sure will remain redacted, you know, for, for the near future because

01:28:31.360 they, uh, you know, implicate so many powerful people around the world. But, but this, this is

01:28:36.080 the, like the real problem. I don't particularly care about Ghislaine Maxwell in particular,

01:28:39.620 but on this issue generally, the left is always, and some people on the right complain about

01:28:43.740 conspiracy theorists. Why are there, and you know, the left will even label sort of mainstream ideas,

01:28:48.960 conspiracy theories, but they never ask themselves, why do conspiracy theories take hold? They take

01:28:54.240 hold because we have no faith in our institutions, in the media, in the administrative government,

01:28:59.420 and we have no faith in them because they have squandered that faith. They have squandered

01:29:04.600 that credibility. You can't believe what you read on the papers or see on cable news. And you,

01:29:09.380 you see obvious incidents of incompetence or corruption in the federal government or, or very

01:29:14.880 often both. So, you know, I, I, I'm sort of sick of hearing the left complain about the conspiracy

01:29:20.100 theorists, uh, quit, quit creating the breeding ground on which those, uh, conspiracies crop.

01:29:26.620 Also Jeffrey Epstein didn't kill himself, man. I mean, come on. I have said a lot of warm words

01:29:33.040 about president Trump. He, he made it into the same sentence as Washington in the same sentence

01:29:36.880 as God for me on this very podcast. Let me just say it's real weird that he went into a press

01:29:41.380 conference and wished Ghislaine Maxwell the best. I love, I don't know what, of course you loved it.

01:29:46.720 What other answer was he going to give? Was he supposed to, I hope she fries in hell. She was 0.98

01:29:50.060 procuring underage prostitutes for overage men. Like, how about that? That'd be a good answer. 1.00

01:29:54.460 No presumption of innocence. What the heck? We need, we need due process even for, uh, the madam 1.00

01:29:59.220 of the most notorious monster that we've seen in the last 30 years. Listen, I think that if we

01:30:05.240 can't even agree on whether or not Donald Trump was right to, to approve of Maxwell, then it's

01:30:10.580 probably time to call this show off and engage in our inner, uh, uh, internet. Yeah. Well, we have

01:30:16.700 no unionist tendencies left. Uh, go buy Ben's book. That was the name of the episode. And it's also a

01:30:22.040 good note on which to conclude. Also become an all access member. If you're not already

01:30:26.160 one, you can keep hanging out with us right now over yonder at dailywire.com where we'll

01:30:31.260 be taking even more questions. If you haven't been over to one of these because you're not

01:30:34.880 an all access member, you're really missing out. We answer, I think it's fair to say a

01:30:39.680 hundred questions probably get answered, uh, during the course of this, uh, all access discussion

01:30:43.980 that we're going to go. 92 by Ben. Cause he types so fast, but the rest of us get in there.

01:30:47.680 Yeah. Yeah. Come over and see us. Thanks for hanging out with us and we will see you

01:30:51.300 over at dailywire.com. Bye Ben's book.

01:30:59.680 Daily wire backstage is produced by Robert Sterling. Executive producer is me, Jeremy

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The Michael Knowles Show - July 24, 2020

Daily Wire Backstage： Go Buy Ben's Book Edition

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