The Michael Knowles Show - Ep. 140 - Republicans Invented The Income Tax

00:00:00.000 I've been drinking since 6 in the morning.

00:00:02.760 That could describe most days, but it's especially true of today because today is tax day.

00:00:08.600 Today is one of the worst days in America.

00:00:11.600 It's also known as the 4th of July for Democrats, but for Americans who work and hold a job, it's a very terrible day.

00:00:18.140 President Trump acknowledged this in an op-ed.

00:00:20.620 He wrote, Tuesday is a day hardworking Americans may dread more than any other.

00:00:26.400 Tax day.

00:00:27.940 But that's not really why I've been drinking.

00:00:29.420 That's not why I'm so upset.

00:00:30.620 I hate shelling out my money to the federal government, but the great shame of tax day.

00:00:35.360 I don't even know if I can say it.

00:00:38.120 Republicans gave us the income tax.

00:00:40.400 I know.

00:00:40.920 It pains me as much as it pains you.

00:00:43.000 It's really awful.

00:00:44.020 We will go through the history of that.

00:00:45.840 We will analyze why and how it was actually Republicans twice who gave us the income tax.

00:00:51.260 Then, speaking of the government taking all of our hard-earned money, whatever happened to libertarianism,

00:00:55.720 whatever happened to the libertarian moment that we were all promised,

00:00:58.880 we will talk with libertarian broadcaster extraordinaire, former marine and foreign currency trader,

00:01:04.920 Jason Stapleton of the Jason Stapleton program, and explain what happened and why the federal government

00:01:10.700 is so big and bloated and stealing all of our money.

00:01:13.640 I'm Michael Knowles, and this is The Michael Knowles Show.

00:01:15.620 How do you like the new digs?

00:01:24.500 This is kind of a plus for tax day.

00:01:26.840 I am in Mobile, Alabama.

00:01:28.980 I'm going to be speaking tonight at the Alabama Policy Institute, and this is really good for tax day.

00:01:33.760 It's like a safe space for conservatives.

00:01:35.740 I just shelled out a bunch of money to the federal government, a bunch of blank book money

00:01:39.540 to the federal government, very frustrating, and the Trump tax cuts haven't kicked in yet,

00:01:45.080 so it was more money than I wish we could have done.

00:01:48.180 I guess it's not so bad because I didn't do anything to make it, but nevertheless,

00:01:51.580 I'll be in a safe space tonight with conservatives.

00:01:53.940 We can lament together.

00:01:55.380 If you happen to be in Mobile, Alabama, come on by the Alabama Policy Institute,

00:02:00.160 and we will be discussing conservatism yesterday, today, and in the future,

00:02:05.120 and then I will be at Trump University on Thursday in Philadelphia.

00:02:09.400 So if you're in the neighborhood, come on by.

00:02:11.400 That speech will be on the topic reasons to vote for Trump.

00:02:14.900 It should be very good, especially since it looks like he's brought peace to the Korean peninsula.

00:02:19.360 That's also in the news.

00:02:20.520 Maybe if we have a little time at the end of today, we'll be able to get to that.

00:02:23.880 How after 70 years, Donald Trump, President Kofefe, is finally the guy to bring peace to Korea.

00:02:30.480 Not Eisenhower, not Kennedy, not Reagan.

00:02:33.740 Nope, just Donald J. Trump.

00:02:36.600 That is a beautiful thing.

00:02:39.040 So it is tax day.

00:02:41.280 To celebrate tax day and also to give me an opportunity to just keep drinking,

00:02:46.700 we will discuss whatever happened to libertarianism.

00:02:49.680 You know, in 2016, everybody in the media, they told us this is the libertarian moment.

00:02:55.340 And conservatives talk a good game on this.

00:02:57.060 They say, this is the libertarian moment.

00:02:58.520 We're going to just, we want small government and no spending and to keep to ourselves and put America first.

00:03:04.920 Rand Paul was supposed to be the great candidate.

00:03:07.780 Of course, he was practically the first one out.

00:03:10.200 We will discuss with Jason Stapleton.

00:03:12.380 I spoke with him last week.

00:03:13.740 Here he is.

00:03:14.660 Jason, thank you for being here.

00:03:16.100 Thank you so very much for having me on the show.

00:03:17.960 I appreciate it.

00:03:18.500 So, you are, you're the new voice for liberty in America, host of the Jason Stapleton program.

00:03:24.780 In 2016 and 2015, all I could read in Newsweek, the New York Times, all the mainstream media,

00:03:30.780 they said, this is the libertarian moment.

00:03:33.500 And it was going to be Rand Paul was going to run away with the nomination.

00:03:36.460 And this was finally the moment after years of Ron Paul.

00:03:39.620 We're going to get a libertarian candidate.

00:03:41.120 What happened to the libertarian moment?

00:03:44.640 That is a very, very good question.

00:03:46.560 It's relatively easy to answer.

00:03:48.340 I think that you had two of the most polarizing and really, if you want to be honest with it,

00:03:53.280 terrible candidates for president of the United States, because neither one of them were really

00:03:58.020 very well liked.

00:03:59.620 And what you ended up having was everyone was looking to third parties.

00:04:03.160 And this was, the libertarian party has been around for 40 years, and they've been trying

00:04:06.180 for a long time to figure out how they're going to, how they're going to gain market share,

00:04:09.760 I guess, in the political movement.

00:04:11.120 And this was a really key opportunity for them to kind of sell libertarianism as a viable

00:04:17.800 third party option.

00:04:19.440 The problem is they picked the wrong candidates.

00:04:21.440 So they, Rand Paul really didn't ever, was never going to be the candidate for the Republican

00:04:25.640 party.

00:04:26.820 And so that was never going to happen.

00:04:28.460 So then you turn to the libertarian party and say, okay, who are they going to put up?

00:04:31.500 Well, then they ended up putting up what is really one of the, one of the craziest guys

00:04:36.280 that they could possibly pick who didn't really represent libertarianism well.

00:04:40.420 And then they got for his vice presidential candidate, uh, Bill Weld, who was, who was

00:04:45.360 really just a Republican who decided he wanted to get into, stay in politics.

00:04:49.120 And so he ran as a libertarian.

00:04:50.960 And Bill Weld, he wasn't even much of a libertarian Republican.

00:04:54.980 He was like-

00:04:55.540 No, he wasn't a libert, he's not a libertarian at all.

00:04:57.420 This is one of the things that really offends, uh, I guess offends those of us who really

00:05:01.640 do hold these principles of, you know, we shouldn't hurt people and we shouldn't take

00:05:05.480 their stuff, which is at its core, what libertarianism believes.

00:05:08.760 Uh, we recommended that he had, he had absolutely, he did not represent the message because he wasn't

00:05:15.040 a libertarian.

00:05:16.020 And so that was the problem.

00:05:18.020 We had a chance, I think in 2016 to really show what libertarianism was to people.

00:05:23.840 And instead we decided to put up a safe candidate and we ended up scoring what, 3% of the vote.

00:05:29.060 It was embarrassing.

00:05:30.040 Right.

00:05:30.280 Yeah.

00:05:30.480 You're not a big fan of Gary Johnson's performance as the libertarian nominee.

00:05:35.320 No, he was, he was, he's a terrible candidate.

00:05:37.540 I don't know the man personally.

00:05:38.780 He may be a very nice guy, but in terms of his, his candidacy, it was an abject failure.

00:05:44.020 So if you had had it to do over again, if the libertarians had it to do over again to

00:05:49.100 show what the libertarian party and the libertarian movement offers to the country, how would you

00:05:54.540 describe it?

00:05:55.320 And how would you describe the difference between a libertarian and a conservative, some other

00:06:00.480 kind of conservative?

00:06:01.640 Yeah, I think that at its core, libertarians believe, as I said before, that we shouldn't

00:06:05.980 hurt people and we shouldn't take their stuff.

00:06:07.740 And I think most people will align themselves with that.

00:06:11.060 If you, if you talk to them, one of the things that I find, whether I'm talking with a very

00:06:14.400 conservative person or whether I'm talking with a progressive person, that there are,

00:06:16.960 there are principles of the libertarian ideology and idea that they can agree with.

00:06:21.840 So I talk about it on my show in terms of five basic principles.

00:06:26.520 They are limited government, individualism, peace, tolerance, and free markets.

00:06:31.660 Now, what I believe and what libertarians tend to believe is that when government is small,

00:06:36.760 when we value and respect other people, when we focus on peace rather than violence,

00:06:41.700 and we focus on free markets where people can pursue their own self-interest and succeed

00:06:45.800 or fail on their own merit, that this produces more wealth and more opportunity for more people

00:06:50.420 than any other system ever devised by man.

00:06:53.000 Doesn't necessarily mean it's the best system.

00:06:55.020 It's just the best one we've found so far.

00:06:57.880 And so talking about the message, the way Gary Johnson and Bill Weld talked about it was,

00:07:02.960 oh, we're kind of a mix.

00:07:04.680 We're part conservative and part progressive.

00:07:07.580 And the truth is that's not at all the case.

00:07:09.460 What we believe is a very principled position that says you own your body,

00:07:14.620 you own the byproduct of your labor, and therefore government, if it has a role to play,

00:07:20.680 their job is to protect life, liberty, and property and nothing more.

00:07:24.380 So it's a very minimalist form of government that would exist under libertarianism

00:07:29.000 that would really allow people to pursue their own self-interest

00:07:32.280 without all of the things that everybody hates about government.

00:07:35.300 You know, I've never heard it articulated that way, but that is such a good point

00:07:38.860 that libertarians say you own your body.

00:07:41.760 And I think why the religious right and more traditionalist conservatives probably break on that

00:07:47.760 is they say you don't own your body.

00:07:50.220 Your body is owned by God and you owe something to him.

00:07:54.500 You don't have the right to kill yourself.

00:07:55.960 You don't have the right to do all of those sorts of things.

00:07:59.800 Does this mean, though, if it's don't hurt people and don't take their stuff,

00:08:03.360 does this mean that libertarians have to be pacifists?

00:08:06.200 No, not at all.

00:08:06.920 In fact, I'm not a pacifist.

00:08:09.360 Believing in peace and advocating for peace is not the same thing as advocating for nonviolence.

00:08:14.600 There are certainly times when it's time to be violent.

00:08:18.000 There are certainly times when war is appropriate. 0.99

00:08:20.920 What we believe is, as libertarians, is that you shouldn't aggress against someone,

00:08:24.520 which means we shouldn't try to impose our will on others.

00:08:27.320 And so in the case that someone would come to us and try and take our life, our property,

00:08:33.040 then we have a right to defend ourselves against that.

00:08:35.360 And we should do that with savage disregard for the other's condition.

00:08:42.200 But I think that what we see right now in terms of foreign policy in America today is,

00:08:48.480 if I can, the only way I know how to explain it is empire building.

00:08:52.000 We're not really building empires, but we are expanding the reach of American,

00:08:56.200 I guess, American power through military action.

00:08:59.720 And this is something that libertarians disagree with just simply because we're essentially forcing,

00:09:04.660 imposing our will on others through the threat of violence.

00:09:07.640 And that's the difference between pacifism and what libertarians call nonviolence.

00:09:13.220 That's well stated.

00:09:14.520 And I should point out for anyone who doesn't know, you did serve in the Marine Corps.

00:09:18.520 You're certainly not a pacifist.

00:09:20.260 And now, does this at any point break down?

00:09:24.100 So it's easy to say, I think everybody would basically agree with what you've said,

00:09:27.760 until one looks around this frequently very awful political scene in the world

00:09:33.660 and sees some terrible country aggressing against another country

00:09:38.200 or brutalizing its own people or dropping chemical bombs on its own people or whatever.

00:09:44.600 And we think, well, we could go in there and stop those tyrants and those brutal dictators from doing that.

00:09:52.440 Is there a moral obligation to help when we can in a humanitarian way,

00:09:56.600 even if it's not as a matter of self-defense?

00:09:59.560 That's a really good question.

00:10:01.080 I think my personal opinion is that there is a moral obligation to help,

00:10:04.940 but that is the individual's responsibility to do.

00:10:07.740 So what a libertarian would believe is that, okay, if we are going to people,

00:10:12.860 one of the things I believe about the military is, is that the military guys are kind of unique

00:10:18.300 because what they are essentially saying is I will give up my freedom.

00:10:22.540 I will give up my liberty.

00:10:23.540 When you sign a military contract, you are basically agreeing to go and do whatever the government says.

00:10:28.200 You are selling yourself to the government for a period of time.

00:10:31.220 And what I have always believed about that is that is a noble virtue to say I'm willing to do that.

00:10:38.440 I will turn over my liberty and I will go so that when the time arises,

00:10:43.700 when American liberty and freedom is threatened, I will go and I will fight.

00:10:48.640 I will go and I will fight so that you don't have to.

00:10:50.940 I think that's admirable.

00:10:52.760 What I believe our responsibility as American citizens are is to ensure that we never ask them to do that

00:10:58.960 unless it is absolutely necessary to protect American liberty, not American interest.

00:11:04.320 Those are two different things.

00:11:05.820 The government will always find an interest where it wants to exert its authority.

00:11:10.120 What we're talking about is liberty.

00:11:12.900 And if American liberty isn't threatened, then we have no responsibility.

00:11:16.900 We have no right to send others who have raised their hand to volunteer to go and fight and die for someone else.

00:11:23.540 And again, I'm sorry, go on.

00:11:25.340 Just on the flip side, to your question more specifically about the moral obligation we have.

00:11:30.360 If you really believe, and this is something I've said to Mark Levin, that I have said to John McCain and to Lindsey Graham.

00:11:38.800 I said, listen, if you want to go fight, if you believe we need to go over there,

00:11:42.140 if you believe that we need to fight, that we have a moral obligation to be there,

00:11:44.940 then I will pay for your plane ticket and I will buy you a rifle and you can go over there.

00:11:49.040 Because that's, if you really believe that we have a moral obligation, then stand up and go.

00:11:53.880 I know that if I really believe that my liberty was threatened and my children risked living under the heel of tyranny's boot,

00:12:00.720 I would stand up and go fight.

00:12:03.020 And so if I'm not there, it means I don't think it's important enough to put my own life on the line,

00:12:07.960 that I'm not going to ask somebody else to do it for me.

00:12:09.940 And I think most people would agree with that too.

00:12:13.560 But what about, again, in the hard case where, say, you look at a failed state like Libya,

00:12:18.960 or you look at a failed state like Iraq or Syria at this point,

00:12:22.920 and you say, well, there are interests that are threatened.

00:12:27.380 American liberty today may not explicitly be threatened,

00:12:30.780 even though, as we learned the hard way, those people can now make it across the ocean

00:12:36.160 and threaten our liberty and our safety.

00:12:38.420 But you say, if we allow that place to fail, the worst people in the region are going to go in,

00:12:44.540 they're going to train, they're going to brutalize people,

00:12:47.360 and they're going to prepare to come attack us, either in Europe or in the United States.

00:12:52.360 Is there then some strategic interest in preventing that or preempting that,

00:12:59.920 or is that still absolutely not?

00:13:02.500 No, another very good question.

00:13:04.040 And I would respond like this.

00:13:05.960 I would say, potentially.

00:13:07.040 The first thing I would ask you is, why do we have failed states in Libya and Iraq?

00:13:13.000 Well, one could argue correctly that the reason we have those failed states is because of American foreign policy.

00:13:18.760 We ousted both of those dictators, and we created the mess that's now over there.

00:13:23.080 And I don't think anybody can look at the situation in America, the threat to terrorism today,

00:13:28.440 and say we are a lot safer today than we were prior to 9-11.

00:13:32.300 In fact, all of our efforts, all of our attempts to stabilize, to control, to oust foreign dictators and put in people that would be more sympathetic to the principles of democracy and liberty that we want to promote,

00:13:46.580 quote, every effort has led to a greater destabilization of the region and more violence.

00:13:51.740 And what I have said on my show repeatedly is, I don't know what the right decision is, but I know the wrong decision is to continue the same course of action that we've been on for the past, whatever, 15 years.

00:14:02.120 And so what I have said is, let's try something radically different.

00:14:05.920 Let's try leaving.

00:14:07.540 Let's try not creating any more of a mess than we've already created.

00:14:12.120 And yes, we are walking away from a gigantic mess, and there will no doubt be vacuums that are created that must be filled.

00:14:19.160 And the only point that I make is, we are not solving the problem or fixing it with our current foreign policy interests.

00:14:28.860 So let's try something different that maybe will get us a better result.

00:14:32.620 If I'm wrong, then we can try something different.

00:14:34.560 But I'm just saying the violence, the regime change, the control hasn't helped.

00:14:39.180 In fact, it's made the situation worse.

00:14:41.440 It's a good point to make.

00:14:43.280 It is the longest war, practically the longest war we've ever fought, the war on terror writ large, the war in Afghanistan.

00:14:49.540 There are some positive things that have come out of it that can't quite be accounted for.

00:14:54.380 The invasion of Iraq did lead to the denuclearization of Libya, which led to the de-Qaddafi-ization of Libya, which might not have been a good thing.

00:15:02.500 But it was good when they got rid of their nuclear program.

00:15:05.620 It's a good point.

00:15:06.660 We've been in the region for a while.

00:15:09.600 Wars have been mismanaged.

00:15:11.280 Every single day of Barack Obama's presidency was a day of war.

00:15:14.820 They told me if I voted for John McCain, we'd get more war in the Middle East.

00:15:17.760 And they were right.

00:15:18.500 I voted for John McCain, and we got more war in the Middle East.

00:15:21.260 Right, right.

00:15:22.080 So, do you think that there's an appetite among the American people for, I won't call it isolation, but for pulling back?

00:15:30.620 Donald Trump campaigned in his words and said, we need to stop having these wars in the Middle East. 0.99

00:15:36.020 He also said, I'm going to destroy ISIS and go in and kill them. 0.99

00:15:41.980 Which guy won? 1.00

00:15:43.540 Which guy is governing?

00:15:44.860 And who did the American people elect?

00:15:46.600 Well, I, my, my gut feeling tells me, and when you talk about the American people, you're really talking about, I mean, I used to live in Kansas.

00:15:55.460 And in Kansas is very conservative.

00:15:57.620 And as I now live in L.A., which is very progressive.

00:16:00.660 I mean, it's almost like being in a completely different country, because you have very different opinions as a collective based on where you live.

00:16:08.040 And so, I think if I've got the pulse on the American people in general, I think people don't want to, I think everybody has been touched by this war in some way.

00:16:18.320 They all know somebody who's gone or somebody who's been there.

00:16:21.040 I think there is no appetite to send our men and women to fight and die when we don't understand what we're doing there, how we win, and what that looks like, and what we're trying to accomplish.

00:16:32.840 And whether you look at Iraq or Afghanistan or what we're trying to do in Syria, I mean, there really isn't a clear plan on what it is we want to accomplish.

00:16:42.180 All we're doing is spending blood and coin.

00:16:44.200 And so, I think that the American people are willing to stand up and defend liberty, and they may be willing to even engage in things that I, as a libertarian, wouldn't agree with in terms of how we handle our foreign policy if they understand what it is we're trying to get done.

00:16:59.000 And the biggest problem with foreign policy today, as it deals with our wars, is that there isn't any clear idea of what victory looks like and what we're going to do and how we're going to win.

00:17:08.100 I think Trump ran on this idea that we ought to pull people out of Iraq, that it was a mess over there.

00:17:14.660 And I think now that he's in power, they're the military-industrial complex and the powerful—

00:17:19.800 The State Department, bureaucracy.

00:17:23.040 Absolutely.

00:17:23.680 Well, even the Lockheed Martins and the people who have a vested interest in making sure that wars continue, they spend a lot of money in Washington.

00:17:32.380 And it's very, very hard to get around that sort of lobbying.

00:17:36.520 And so, I think at the end of the day, he's become subjected to the same pressures that Obama and Bush before him were subjected to.

00:17:44.960 Do you think, from the libertarian perspective, is he exceeding your expectations?

00:17:51.060 I had very low expectations when he was elected, so he certainly exceeded mine.

00:17:55.600 I've been all in for the covfefe.

00:17:57.380 I've been pleasantly surprised.

00:17:58.660 Do you think that he is advancing a liberty agenda, not doing anything, or damaging it?

00:18:06.520 Yeah, yes and no.

00:18:08.020 I think on some things, he's done well.

00:18:10.000 I think he's reduced regulation.

00:18:11.620 I like that.

00:18:12.880 Tax decreases.

00:18:14.040 I like that.

00:18:15.060 I don't like the fact that he's adding to the deficits.

00:18:18.140 I absolutely abhor his foreign policy and also his trade policy.

00:18:24.640 I think those are very, very damaging to America long term.

00:18:28.400 So, I think it's a mixed bag.

00:18:30.180 And one of the things, see, I'm not left or right.

00:18:32.460 I don't play politics.

00:18:34.700 I believe in five principles of liberty.

00:18:37.360 And whoever supports and advocates those, I'll support.

00:18:40.700 And if you support them in one area and not another, then you'll get my support in the area where you support them.

00:18:45.700 I am about principle, not party.

00:18:48.720 And so, Trump has been a mixed bag as that goes.

00:18:53.100 This is my problem with the libertarian movement because I like so much of it.

00:18:59.300 I agree with so much of it.

00:19:02.160 But I'm always reminded of the Lord Acton quote, which I'm going to butcher, but it's something to the effect of.

00:19:07.440 The friends of liberty have always been few, and they have achieved their goals when they've achieved them by associating with auxiliaries whose own goals differ from the friends of liberty.

00:19:17.360 And there's a risk involved with this.

00:19:19.400 There's a moral risk.

00:19:20.480 But we do it anyway, even though it could blow up in our face and really damage our, say, our integrity or our view of ourselves.

00:19:27.740 Does the libertarian movement, is the path forward for the freedom movement or the libertarian movement to form its own party, have a viable third party, get 2% of the vote, 3%, 5%, try to grow it that way?

00:19:40.860 Or is the goal to work within one of the two major parties and move the Republican Party more in its own direction?

00:19:52.820 Can I, yes.

00:19:53.860 I don't, I don't, here's, I have a real problem.

00:19:58.600 If you, if anybody who's listened to my show knows I absolutely have disdain for the libertarian party.

00:20:04.000 I think they've done a terrible job of advocating the principles that we believe in.

00:20:08.440 They've done an even worse job of getting people elected and putting them in positions of authority where we might be able to affect some change.

00:20:15.060 On the same side, on that same token, it's very, very difficult to get liberty minded people and libertarians specifically elected under the GOP because the GOP simply funds the candidates that they want and makes it very difficult for guys.

00:20:30.940 Austin Peterson, for example, is a libertarian who's now running as a Republican in Missouri against Claire McCaskill.

00:20:36.060 I think he'd be a great choice.

00:20:38.160 He's, he's an advocate for liberty.

00:20:39.740 I know him personally and, but he's, he's going up against the GOP front runner who's raised $10 million.

00:20:46.820 And he just, it's very, very difficult for people to fight that.

00:20:50.040 So I think if we want libertarianism and these, I, these ideas that I just, I've been talking about to, to ever gain traction, uh, we have to put some more people in power one way or another.

00:21:01.640 The guys like Rand Paul, Justin Amash, uh, you know, Thomas Massey.

00:21:06.100 I mean, those guys need help in Washington and we cannot mount a defense against entrenched Republicans and Democrats, uh, until we have more guys like that.

00:21:15.760 I always wonder with the libertarian movement, which has, you know, vacillated in some ways, it's left wing in some ways.

00:21:23.380 And for certain periods, it leans more right and they vote more Republican or, or with conservatives.

00:21:28.740 I wonder if people ask, well, how come you don't just vote on issues?

00:21:33.620 How come you don't just vote on the candidate?

00:21:35.900 Are the current parties coherent?

00:21:38.240 I wonder if it, it does make sense if there's a kind of logical, uh, conclusion that comes from saying, okay, I believe in God.

00:21:47.620 I therefore support more freedom, uh, but I support this kind of strength and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

00:21:52.900 And for the left, you know, I don't, I don't really know what they support, like pot and high taxes or whatever, whatever they, I don't know what they do.

00:21:58.960 But if there's a kind of natural logical conclusion to those and does the libertarian movement find itself outside of that or too heterodox, will it be forced to go one way or the other?

00:22:11.920 No, I don't.

00:22:12.700 One of the things I love about libertarianism and the people who, who, who are call themselves libertarians is that they, they really do have a, a moral, like a moral foundation.

00:22:22.660 So, so for example, I believe that things like rape and murder and, uh, and theft, see, I think those are morally wrong, not because God says they're wrong, which, which is fine for Christians if, if that's the route they want to take. 0.97

00:22:35.740 But I believe that they're morally wrong because they violate someone's property rights.

00:22:39.500 I think morality starts with property rights.

00:22:42.000 It starts with self-ownership.

00:22:43.680 But it does not, not to cut you off, but if, if, if that is the ground for it, if property rights are the inviolable moral standard, why, why is that?

00:22:57.080 Well, because, well, first of all, it just starts with self-ownership.

00:23:00.660 So we, when people talk about property rights, they think about my house or my car, but really we're talking about self-ownership and what, what is derived from that.

00:23:08.360 So if I own myself, then clearly I would own the by-product of my labor.

00:23:13.840 And if I own the by-product of my labor, I ought to be able to do what I want to with that, with, uh, with either the, so if I, if I chop down a tree and I build a chair out of it, well, that chair is now mine.

00:23:24.340 I've, I've created it with my own hands and the by-product of my labor.

00:23:27.180 Therefore, I ought to be able to sell it whoever I want to.

00:23:29.740 I ought to be able to set it on fire if I want to.

00:23:32.100 Uh, I ought to be able to do anything I want to with my own body and with, uh, with my own property.

00:23:36.960 And so if, if there is another reason beyond just a religious conviction, then I would like, I would love to know it.

00:23:45.100 To me, a religious conviction is just a, a personal belief in faith, which is fine.

00:23:49.660 I have, I have no issue with that at all.

00:23:51.340 I'm just saying from a moral perspective, the reason that these things are immoral is not because God says so.

00:23:58.900 It's because it violates one's property rights.

00:24:01.700 I'm a little skeptical.

00:24:02.860 I think both of them are true.

00:24:03.840 I do think, I think it's immoral because it violates property rights, but I think that that's a good measure of, uh, morality because God says so.

00:24:12.320 And the reason I suggest this is that, uh, in no culture that did not have metaphysical thought and, uh, metaphysical concepts did an idea like libertarianism or liberty evolved.

00:24:24.980 The, the, the, the, the Western concept of liberty came out of a Christian culture, a culture that was informed and shaped by Christianity.

00:24:32.260 And I just wonder, since we're talking about metaphysical things, morality, freedom, justice, fairness, things that aren't tangible, they're not material.

00:24:41.940 I didn't create them.

00:24:43.400 I didn't create a moral code.

00:24:45.120 I didn't create justice because they're metaphysical and they're, they're pre they're, they're beyond what is physical.

00:24:52.100 One must ask the question of what the metaphysical realm looks like.

00:24:56.340 Why, why are there ideas?

00:24:58.520 Why are, why is there a morality?

00:25:00.560 What, where does the morality exist?

00:25:02.600 If there's justice, who is the judge?

00:25:05.040 If, if there is a moral legislation, if there's a moral code, then who's the legislator?

00:25:11.120 I, not to, uh, not to proselytize to you on my show, but I do wonder if that is a, if that is a point of libertarianism that hasn't been followed to its logical beginnings.

00:25:22.140 Or if I'm just, if I'm just the, having a, giving you that old time religion.

00:25:26.360 No, no, no.

00:25:27.400 And, and, uh, no, I, it's, here's the beautiful thing about libertarianism is that libertarianism allows for any religion.

00:25:35.040 It allows for any, I mean, frankly, it allows for socialism.

00:25:38.060 If, if you want to be honest, I mean, if people want to collectively come together and pool their own resources, uh, as long as it's being done voluntarily, a libertarian is not going to object to that.

00:25:47.620 It's, it's the voluntary nature of the action that's important to a libertarian.

00:25:51.160 And so when we talk about religion, um, I, I have whatever religion one wants to believe.

00:25:56.900 And if you want to go back to, uh, you know, talking about it philosophically, I think that that's, that's wonderful.

00:26:02.440 One of the things I harp on about libertarians is they spend a lot of time in the philosophical.

00:26:06.720 And I like to spend a lot of time in the reality of improving liberty and free markets and, and individualism, uh, of peace and tolerance over, uh, over trying to discuss the philosophical.

00:26:17.860 And, uh, but there's, there's, there's a place for that too.

00:26:20.660 So I think that inside the libertarian, inside of libertarianism, you are going to find Christians. 0.92

00:26:26.360 You are going to find atheists. 0.99

00:26:27.780 You are going to find, uh, just a variety of people who believe in the idea that you own yourself and you own the byproduct of your labor, that you shouldn't hurt people and you shouldn't take their stuff.

00:26:39.260 And so, um, if you can agree fundamentally with those principles, I think you're going to find a lot of friends inside the, the libertarian movement.

00:26:47.420 And I think, frankly, if you disagree with some of those principles, as I do, you'll still find a lot of common ground and friends in the libertarian movement.

00:26:55.000 I love your, uh, your dichotomy here between being up in the ether and the philosophical realm all the time and the practical effect of this, because we're talking about politics.

00:27:04.740 We had Austin on the show, Austin Peterson, and I'm, I'm, I wouldn't call myself a libertarian exactly, but I'd vote for Austin in a heartbeat because I think he'd make the country better.

00:27:14.360 And I think he'd move it in a direction that is more open to liberty.

00:27:17.480 And I, I really encourage people in politics to avoid what Michael Oakeshott calls rationalism in politics and saying, well, who cares if it works in practice?

00:27:27.280 Does it work in theory, you know, and really get down to the nuts and bolts and on the nuts and bolts of that, the last question.

00:27:33.160 Uh, I'll, I guess we can talk about politicians writ large.

00:27:37.240 Would you vote today for say Donald Trump's reelection or any of the Republicans in Congress or Senate for their reelection?

00:27:46.160 Are they doing more good than they're doing harm?

00:27:49.300 Or would you say we got to burn it down?

00:27:50.960 We need a more liberty minded candidate.

00:27:53.520 Well, I don't believe in burning things down.

00:27:55.760 I've been, I, like I said, you know, I've, I've been in a couple of different war zones.

00:27:59.740 And I think the idea that we would, we would burn something to the ground just creates, people don't understand what that means.

00:28:05.980 Um, I have a very simple philosophy on, on whether or not someone gets my vote.

00:28:09.740 Uh, I ask one question, do they believe as a primary, do they believe in liberty as a primary political value?

00:28:17.160 And what I mean by that is just simply, do I believe that this candidate will constantly ask with every decision that he makes, does this move us closer towards liberty or further away?

00:28:26.400 Now, because in politics, you, it's a lot of horse trading. 0.86

00:28:30.420 So you're going to have to do some give and take.

00:28:32.780 I, I can account, I'm not so much of a purist that I, I won't accept that.

00:28:36.640 But what I want is I want at the end of the day, after the horse trading is done, I want to be further, I want to be closer towards tyranny and further towards statism or totalitarianism.

00:28:45.700 And if I have, if I have a candidate, if I have a, or someone who's in office, who I believe really is trying to do that and who's asking that question, then they'll get my vote.

00:28:54.620 That's absolutely.

00:28:55.560 And it's, it's funny that you bring up the example of the military because so many of my friends who have served or family members, they do trend a little bit libertarian.

00:29:04.440 And I think it might be because that is a real practical job and career.

00:29:09.380 You, you really see very quickly what's working and what's not working.

00:29:13.020 And yeah, it's a really great point.

00:29:14.700 Jason, we got to go.

00:29:15.980 I'm going to let you get back to your show, but great to talk to you.

00:29:19.780 We're going to have to have you back.

00:29:21.680 The Jason Stapleton program, a new voice for liberty in America.

00:29:25.600 Thanks so much.

00:29:27.900 You know, I was looking at my Twitter feed while we were playing that interview and I had women writing into me, led by none other than our own Alicia Krauss, writing into me and saying, oh, Michael, Jason Stapleton, hubba hubba.

00:29:41.040 Thanks, baby.

00:29:41.620 Yeah, so I, and I guess that's like the answer to the panel of deplorables.

00:29:46.040 You know, I bring on for months and months and months just the most beautiful women in the conservative movement, but basically just for my own edification. 0.99

00:29:54.100 And so that's okay.

00:29:55.520 We'll throw you a little heartthrob libertarian man every once in a while for the ladies who watch this show. 1.00

00:30:01.380 We have to say goodbye to Facebook and YouTube, but stick around because we're going to talk about the great shame.

00:30:07.540 The great stain on the Republican Party.

00:30:09.780 Republican Party is pretty good.

00:30:11.120 We've always stood for ordered liberty.

00:30:12.900 You know, we free the slaves who want more liberty these days.

00:30:15.540 We defend life.

00:30:16.820 It was a great party, except we invented the income tax.

00:30:20.560 I'll watch my language.

00:30:21.500 I've got salty language coming, bursting forth on this awful subject.

00:30:24.960 We'll explain that afterward.

00:30:25.980 If you are on dailywire.com already, thank you very much.

00:30:29.360 You help keep the lights on in this meeting space and in my studio.

00:30:33.240 If you're not, go over there.

00:30:34.440 It's $10 a month, $100 for an annual membership.

00:30:36.660 You get me, you get the Andrew Klavan show, you get the Ben Shapiro show.

00:30:38.780 You get to ask questions in the mailbag coming up tomorrow.

00:30:41.240 No, coming up on Thursday, so make sure you get your questions in.

00:30:43.780 You get to ask questions in the conversation.

00:30:45.800 Many are called, few are chosen.

00:30:47.360 I'm up next in the conversation.

00:30:48.880 Remember, you can get my show on Facebook, on YouTube, on iTunes, on SoundCloud, I think

00:30:54.880 on Gramophone.

00:30:55.800 I think we have wax records that you can buy if you take a time machine back to the old

00:31:00.700 timey days before we had an income tax.

00:31:02.940 And you can get to dailywire.com.

00:31:05.980 Again, none of it matters for the shows.

00:31:07.940 No one actually wants to listen to the shows or watch Ben or Drew or the conversation.

00:31:12.000 That doesn't matter.

00:31:12.860 What matters is the leftist here's Tumblr.

00:31:14.960 Guys, Donald Trump is about to bring peace to the Korean Peninsula.

00:31:17.760 That is an absurd statement.

00:31:19.840 That is one of the funniest things to happen in politics in my lifetime, certainly.

00:31:24.120 When that happens, you are going to see storms rage, not because a nuclear weapon was dropped,

00:31:29.980 you know, by the Sea of Japan or whatever.

00:31:32.140 It's because the leftist tears are going to flow freely in the United States.

00:31:36.580 You're going to need your vessel to protect yourself and your family.

00:31:39.380 They're radioactive.

00:31:40.300 The fallout is going to be horrific.

00:31:42.240 Make sure you go to dailywire.com.

00:31:43.820 We'll be right back to complain about Republicans inventing income tax.

00:31:47.760 A true historical irony.

00:32:01.540 A true, you know, Republicans now, what a great party we are.

00:32:05.300 It is the best party in American history.

00:32:07.960 And we took the traditions of the Federalists.

00:32:10.720 And then every terrible thing that the Democrats did, we opposed.

00:32:13.840 The Republican Party was founded to free the slaves.

00:32:16.720 We opposed Jim Crow. 0.87

00:32:18.380 The Democrats wanted slavery.

00:32:19.720 They wanted Jim Crow. 0.93

00:32:20.900 We were the first party to support civil rights.

00:32:23.480 We, you know, we're just like, we defend the unborn. 0.99

00:32:26.140 Democrats want to slaughter all those babies. 1.00

00:32:27.980 We defend the unborn. 0.97

00:32:29.940 We just got, right at the very beginning, we got this thing wrong on the income tax.

00:32:34.040 And it wasn't like it just happened over time.

00:32:36.080 It wasn't like, oh, some new Republican, some weird.

00:32:38.120 No, it was the first Republican president issued the first income tax.

00:32:42.580 It was the Revenue Act of 1861.

00:32:44.780 It was the first Republican president, Abraham Lincoln.

00:32:47.480 He did it because he had to raise $50 million in revenue to make the Democrats free all their slaves.

00:32:54.040 So he had to raise all that revenue.

00:32:56.240 And they couldn't do it.

00:32:57.040 So they came up with a plan.

00:32:58.040 It would include a mixture of tariffs, property tax, and income tax.

00:33:02.780 Incomes over, you know, a certain threshold.

00:33:05.340 Not everybody was taxed, but some people are.

00:33:07.680 So that happened.

00:33:08.880 And then we made the Democrats free all their slaves and reunited the country.

00:33:12.660 And so that was good.

00:33:13.480 That's fine.

00:33:14.080 Then it sort of went away for a while.

00:33:16.220 But we can't just let them off the hook that easily.

00:33:18.980 Because this poison, this poisonous idea of taking all of America's hard-earned money,

00:33:24.080 that kept seeping into the culture.

00:33:26.800 So in 1909, it wasn't some Democrat who proposed a new constitutional amendment or a new income tax.

00:33:33.720 It was a Republican.

00:33:35.460 And a conservative Republican, William Howard Taft, proposed a 2% income tax on corporations

00:33:41.560 and a constitutional amendment to collect individual income tax.

00:33:46.180 Now, we should say, it's not like people just didn't pay any taxes before.

00:33:49.700 It's that the taxes were not on their income, but they were hidden.

00:33:52.680 There were a lot of tariffs.

00:33:53.660 There were huge tariffs throughout all of our history.

00:33:56.200 Because you do have to fund the government.

00:33:57.780 Government does cost money to run.

00:33:59.300 So there was that.

00:34:00.540 And then in 1909, there was some question over what the most effective way to raise revenue was

00:34:07.140 because tariffs have a lot of downsides to them, as we all know.

00:34:10.700 I mean, that's why Donald Trump is threatening tariffs now.

00:34:12.720 I don't think we're going to see huge trade wars.

00:34:14.720 He's doing it because China is cheating and they are not participating in free trade

00:34:19.520 and they're violating World Trade Organization treaties

00:34:21.940 and they're stealing our intellectual property and they're illegally subsidizing their industries.

00:34:25.980 So there are some arguments for using this as leverage.

00:34:28.280 But tariffs have a lot of tough externalities to them.

00:34:32.320 One of which is at this time when the income tax was being proposed, there was high inflation.

00:34:36.800 This was being blamed on tariffs rather than an income tax.

00:34:39.920 So anyway, enough excuses.

00:34:41.880 Enough defending the Republican Party.

00:34:43.380 It was William Howard Taft who first proposed this, the Republican president,

00:34:46.840 the conservative Republican president.

00:34:48.480 Then the first senator to propose the income tax was a Republican senator, Norris Brown.

00:34:53.520 So, okay, they proposed this very modest income tax.

00:34:58.840 The highest marginal rate in the early days of this income tax was 6%.

00:35:03.580 Really, it was just 2% or 3%.

00:35:05.320 And then the very highest marginal rate was 6% of income.

00:35:08.320 Okay.

00:35:09.320 Within five years.

00:35:10.560 This is the problem.

00:35:11.500 Look, if someone wanted to take 2% of my income to fund the government, I can deal with that.

00:35:15.680 I can live, you know.

00:35:16.600 But what's so insidious is when the government gets its claws into your money, they just take and take and take.

00:35:21.800 You give them your little pinky and they take your whole hand. 0.94

00:35:24.800 So within five years of the income tax, federal income tax being instituted, the top marginal rate went from 6% to 77%.

00:35:32.300 That is a huge increase.

00:35:35.340 That is over an order of magnitude increase.

00:35:37.840 And a lot of this was to fund World War I.

00:35:40.780 So they said, okay, look, we have this big war.

00:35:42.360 We raised revenue during the Civil War, so we're going to raise revenue again by raising taxes tremendously, soaking the rich to pay for this war.

00:35:49.540 Okay, that's fine.

00:35:50.580 Then after the war, the tax rate went back down.

00:35:53.020 The top marginal rate went back down to 24%.

00:35:55.320 Okay, that's fine.

00:35:57.160 24% is better than 77%.

00:35:58.880 But notice how we're bouncing around, right?

00:36:00.680 At first, it's this little modest tax and 1% or 2%.

00:36:03.320 Oh, 6% top rate.

00:36:04.760 Okay, 77%.

00:36:05.760 We're going to go back down to 24%.

00:36:07.500 Well, 24% is still four times higher than 6%.

00:36:11.020 That's still many multiples higher than the previous highest marginal rate just a few years earlier.

00:36:16.260 Okay, that's fine though, right?

00:36:18.520 But then FDR comes in.

00:36:20.020 And this is where we shift the blame to Democrats.

00:36:22.620 As Republicans, we were going to play nicely.

00:36:24.880 We were going to say, okay, look, I guess you need a little revenue here or there.

00:36:27.780 We're going to be responsible about this.

00:36:29.200 But the trouble with that is the Democrats seize on these things and they run with it way beyond any boundaries of reason.

00:36:36.700 So FDR comes in and he decides that he is going to raise the rates tremendously and not for the purposes of raising revenue.

00:36:46.900 Actually, I mean, there was part of that.

00:36:48.860 You had to raise revenue for the Second World War.

00:36:51.060 But FDR proposed a 100% tax on all incomes over $25,000.

00:36:56.480 That's just wealth confiscation at that point for fairness, for purposes of fairness and equality.

00:37:02.880 And the purposes of the income tax system right now are not to raise revenue.

00:37:07.440 We're not really fighting major wars.

00:37:09.400 We're not in the middle of a world war or something or a civil war that's bloodying up our entire country.

00:37:14.540 They're just doing it for purposes of fairness or equality.

00:37:17.900 And this is an amazing thing because apparently fairness is when you steal somebody else's money and then give it to a guy who isn't working as hard.

00:37:23.700 That's fairness.

00:37:25.060 You see, greed is when I want to keep the money that I have made.

00:37:28.700 But charity is when I steal somebody else's money and keep it from myself.

00:37:32.400 That's compassion.

00:37:33.520 That's charity.

00:37:34.400 So FDR changes the game entirely.

00:37:36.640 And it's no surprise that during FDR's time, we see tax revenue as a percentage of GDP shoot through the roof.

00:37:44.080 In the early days of the income tax, from basically the founding of the country, the 18th century, all the way up to the creation of the income tax here and there, you see up until I guess about 1940, you see the revenue, the tax revenue is something like 5% at most of total GDP.

00:38:04.300 It's very low, between 3% sometimes, maybe up to 7% depending on how you're measuring it.

00:38:10.120 But then FDR comes in, in the 1940s, this thing explodes.

00:38:14.780 You get way, way higher rates, multiples higher rates, and it's stayed there ever since, you know, for the purposes of equality and fairness.

00:38:22.480 And you paid your tax, well, I don't know, my audience probably, you haven't paid your taxes.

00:38:26.160 But, like, you know, good people pay their taxes and everything.

00:38:29.100 And because they, you know, for one, they don't want to be targeted by the IRS.

00:38:32.360 And two, you know, okay, I live in this country, I have to pay my taxes.

00:38:35.240 And they just bleed us dry.

00:38:38.100 So FDR obviously ruined all of this stuff. 0.68

00:38:41.920 During World War II, you know, the rates go really high.

00:38:45.500 FDR doesn't realize that at a certain point, if you're taxed 100% above a certain income, then you're just not going to work.

00:38:54.160 Why would I work?

00:38:54.880 If I can work 50 hours a week to make $25,000, or I can work 100 hours a week to make $50,000, but I know that all of that extra wealth is going to be confiscated, why, there's no incentive to work.

00:39:09.200 This is kind of the early stages of the Laffer curve.

00:39:12.420 This is kind of the early inklings of this that conservatives would run with for years and which formed a lot of the Reagan revolution.

00:39:20.140 But even JFK intuited this.

00:39:21.480 He said there are two tax rates at least where you have the exact same revenue to the government, 0% and 100%.

00:39:31.160 If the tax rate is 0%, the government's not going to get any of my money.

00:39:34.300 If the tax rate is 100%, I'm not going to work.

00:39:37.120 So we see a curve here, and there are always two tax rates at which you'll get the same revenue to the government.

00:39:43.940 So that didn't work.

00:39:45.700 FDR wanted this 100% income tax.

00:39:47.880 Congress said absolutely not.

00:39:49.440 That was so radical.

00:39:50.380 So then FDR decided to issue executive orders for wage controls.

00:39:55.300 This created a lot of economic problems, but fine.

00:39:58.120 Then throughout the 1940s, 1950s, you had, forget about 6%, just a few decades prior,

00:40:04.100 you now had the highest marginal tax rates were 91%, 92%.

00:40:07.840 JFK comes in, he lowered the taxes and consolidated the rates to 77%,

00:40:12.060 then to 70%, then to 70% starting in 1965.

00:40:16.100 Okay, I guess that's better than 91% or 92%, but you see, do you see the trend here?

00:40:23.620 You go low rate, really high rate, lower, but still higher than you started, higher, do, do, do, do, do, do, you go all the way up.

00:40:29.960 Then Ronald Reagan came in, he lowered the rate to 50%, the top marginal tax rate.

00:40:34.740 That was from 1982 to 1986, but there were revenue problems, there was a lot of government spending.

00:40:40.580 So Reagan ultimately undid a fair portion of those tax cuts.

00:40:44.320 Then the top rate was lowered to 38.5%.

00:40:47.800 Then the top rate was lowered to 28%.

00:40:50.200 George Bush, one, who famously promised, read my lips, no new taxes, immediately ran and raised taxes.

00:40:56.440 That was like the first thing he did, that's probably why he didn't win re-election.

00:40:59.200 Then Clinton raised the top rate to 39.6%.

00:41:02.000 Bush, two, lowered it to 35%.

00:41:03.880 Then it went back up to 39.6%.

00:41:05.920 Trump lowered it very, very modestly to 37%.

00:41:09.160 That's the highest marginal tax rate now in the Trump tax reform.

00:41:14.220 So we know that virtually all of the federal income taxes are paid by a very, very small percentage of people.

00:41:21.540 And most Americans pay net negative tax.

00:41:25.240 Now there are all these hidden taxes, of course, that you pay sales tax, payroll tax.

00:41:28.920 They get you coming and going.

00:41:30.780 But most taxes are paid for by the rich, by a very small number of people.

00:41:36.160 This gets to just an important point on taxes.

00:41:39.260 Because obviously it's morally absurd to say that it's greedy for me to keep my own money,

00:41:44.300 but it's charitable for me to steal somebody else's money or for you to steal my money or something like that.

00:41:49.140 But taxes, low taxes are a good per se.

00:41:53.620 They're not, the Democrats always say, well, how are you going to pay for that tax cut?

00:41:57.600 I got two words for you, buddy.

00:41:58.820 And they're not happy birthday when you say, how are you going to pay for that tax cut?

00:42:01.860 It's my money.

00:42:02.760 That's how I'm going to pay for it.

00:42:03.740 I'm going to keep it.

00:42:05.000 That's how I'm going to pay for my tax cut.

00:42:06.280 Well, how are you going to pay for it?

00:42:07.480 As though they're entitled to my money.

00:42:08.860 They're not entitled to our money.

00:42:10.820 That is not true.

00:42:12.140 We contribute because we like our country, I guess, and really because we have to.

00:42:15.460 But lower taxes are a good per se.

00:42:18.220 It is a reflection of freedom.

00:42:20.100 I work, and so I make money.

00:42:22.120 And so the money is a symbol of my work, of my labor, of my liberty, of my life, time of my life that I spend.

00:42:29.780 If you're paying half of your money out in taxes, that means that for half the year you're a slave to the government.

00:42:34.960 That's not a good thing to be.

00:42:36.420 We don't like that tradition in America.

00:42:39.520 They try to accuse us.

00:42:40.620 Oh, you're greedy.

00:42:41.540 You want to keep your money.

00:42:42.440 Yeah, I want to keep my life.

00:42:44.040 I want to keep my life.

00:42:44.920 The money is a symbol of my liberty.

00:42:46.420 The liberty is what I do during my life, man.

00:42:49.660 And you're stealing my life.

00:42:51.380 It's a good per se.

00:42:52.720 And Republicans should get off of this bean-counting, technocratic nonsense where we say, oh, we've got to pay for this.

00:42:58.000 Oh, it's going to be revenue neutral.

00:42:59.240 I don't want it to be revenue neutral.

00:43:00.560 I want tax reform to starve the beast.

00:43:03.360 I want revenue to be way down, and then I won't have to cut government spending because it infringes on our liberty.

00:43:09.440 It is not good.

00:43:10.660 An important thing to keep in mind on tax day.

00:43:12.540 We forget this the rest of the year.

00:43:13.900 It's so, you know, initially with taxes, you would pay your congressman.

00:43:18.100 You would, there wasn't this massive bureaucracy of the IRS, and the Congress didn't really like that too much, you know, because then there's accountability there.

00:43:26.660 We say, I don't like paying all these taxes.

00:43:28.000 You can vote them out of office.

00:43:29.420 So now there are these huge bureaus.

00:43:31.180 It's very complicated.

00:43:32.840 It's so opaque.

00:43:33.800 It's going to get a little bit better with tax reform next year.

00:43:35.940 It's going to be simplified a little bit.

00:43:37.420 But it's just dreadful.

00:43:39.760 It's just a dreadful thing.

00:43:41.500 And we forget about it.

00:43:42.260 They take it right out of our paychecks because they know that we don't like paying it.

00:43:45.440 So unless you're self-employed, it just comes out of your paycheck.

00:43:48.320 You think, oh, goody, goody, I got a tax return.

00:43:50.480 Oh, how nice.

00:43:51.160 The government gave me a tax return.

00:43:52.880 The government didn't give you a tax return.

00:43:54.260 You just paid too much money throughout the year.

00:43:56.300 They just soaked you too much throughout the rest of the year.

00:43:58.220 Don't be fooled by that.

00:43:59.980 It's really awful.

00:44:01.020 And tax day is the day to remember the pain of paying taxes.

00:44:04.480 And we need people in our federal government.

00:44:07.160 We need people in our state and local governments who are aware that every dollar they take out of our pockets should be accounted for.

00:44:13.600 It should be for a good reason.

00:44:14.960 And if they can't give a good reason, vote the bums out. 1.00

00:44:17.620 Okay, happy tax day.

00:44:18.560 I've got to go back to drinking.

00:44:19.800 I've been working far too long today.

00:44:21.480 I paid so much money this morning.

00:44:22.760 I don't want to.

00:44:24.020 This is over.

00:44:25.240 I will be speaking tonight, however, at the Alabama Policy Institute.

00:44:28.220 So if you're in Mobile, come on by.

00:44:30.180 We're going to be talking about conservatism today.

00:44:32.720 And then if you're at Penn, I just got word the Penn students who are hosting me, they just showed me some pictures.

00:44:39.500 I guess the lefties are ripping down the posters for my event on Thursday, Reasons to Vote for Donald Trump.

00:44:46.100 And they're just leaving there.

00:44:47.140 So I guess, you know, those Penn students, they really don't want people to find out that I will be speaking at Penn.

00:44:53.740 So we shouldn't spread any more information about this, about this event that's going to take place on Thursday at 7 o'clock in John Huntsman Hall at the University of Pennsylvania.

00:45:02.800 Don't tell anybody.

00:45:03.720 Don't share that.

00:45:04.840 I don't want to upset the Penn students.

00:45:06.380 So don't let anybody know that I will be speaking there on Thursday at 7 p.m. in John Huntsman Hall on the topic, Reasons to Vote for Trump.

00:45:14.160 Get your mailbag questions in.

00:45:15.240 I'll see you tomorrow.

00:45:15.900 I'm Michael Knowles.

00:45:16.760 This is The Michael Knowles Show.

00:45:17.940 The Michael Knowles Show is a Daily Wire Forward Publishing production.

00:45:26.820 Executive producer, Jeremy Boring.

00:45:28.980 Senior producer, Jonathan Hay.

00:45:30.880 Supervising producer, Mathis Glover.

00:45:33.040 Our technical producer is Austin Stevens.

00:45:35.340 Edited by Alex Zingaro.

00:45:37.100 Audio is mixed by Mike Coromina.

00:45:39.100 Hair and makeup is by Jesua Olvera.

00:45:41.540 Copyright Forward Publishing 2018.

00:45:43.300 With 20 years reporting on the markets, I know that some industries are built to last, but others are built to lead.

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The Michael Knowles Show - April 17, 2018

Ep. 140 - Republicans Invented The Income Tax

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