The Michael Knowles Show - Ep. 24 - Is The Swamp Swallowing Trump？ w⧸ fmr. Congresswoman Nan Hayworth

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00:00:30.700 Steve Bannon has accused Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell of being swamp monsters.

00:00:36.100 My dear friend, the first female physician ever elected to Congress,

00:00:39.560 Dr. Nan Hayworth, will join our show to discuss the swamp,

00:00:44.260 congressional gridlock, and the wealth of nations.

00:00:46.340 Then, Emily Butler and Jacob Berry will join the panel of deplorables

00:00:49.560 to talk about the biggest mistake in modern political history,

00:00:52.680 Pope Francis' implied admonition that pro-lifers must support DACA,

00:00:58.000 and Miss America's opinion on Russian collusion.

00:01:01.080 I'm Michael Knowles, and this is The Michael Knowles Show.

00:01:10.880 And before we do any of that, we have a sponsor.

00:01:14.220 Marshall, we got a sponsor.

00:01:16.140 We finally did it.

00:01:17.220 This is great.

00:01:17.800 We're going to possibly be able to keep the lights on on more than just selling leftist tears tumblers.

00:01:22.960 So this – and I'm – this was Providence.

00:01:25.500 This was the perfect first sponsor for our show.

00:01:29.400 We talk all the time on the show about how nobody knows anything about history.

00:01:33.840 That's why all the hysterical people on the left are talking –

00:01:37.140 they always compare Trump to Hitler or the Third Reich or fall of Rome.

00:01:40.160 It's because no one ever knows anything about history other than the fall of Rome and the Third Reich. 0.57

00:01:44.540 Well, luckily, there is a great new podcast.

00:01:47.840 I really like this podcast.

00:01:49.560 I've listened to it so far.

00:01:51.220 You've got to go check out the first episode.

00:01:53.140 It's called Tides of History.

00:01:55.020 It's a new podcast from Wondery,

00:01:57.060 and the podcast is from PhD historian Patrick Wyman,

00:02:01.000 who happens also to be an MMA analyst,

00:02:03.800 and he answers all of these two periods that constructed our modern world.

00:02:08.320 Antiquity, so the classical era, the fall of Rome,

00:02:11.520 and the beginning of modernity, 1350 to 1650,

00:02:15.420 the period where we see the West building on all that we have from classical antiquity

00:02:20.560 and creating the modern world, creating nation states.

00:02:24.000 Where does capitalism come from?

00:02:25.600 Why did all of these governments organize in roughly the same way around roughly the same period?

00:02:31.140 Why do we have states to begin with?

00:02:32.820 How did modern trade routes get started?

00:02:35.260 How did globalization start?

00:02:36.640 What periods of globalization have already happened?

00:02:39.640 We're seeing a new period happening now, but when have they happened before and why?

00:02:43.620 And what happens when you privatize militaries?

00:02:46.320 Sounds spooky.

00:02:47.240 You'll have to listen to find out.

00:02:48.860 All of these questions can be traced back to the period of time during the Renaissance

00:02:53.600 and just before the Enlightenment.

00:02:55.680 So what Patrick does, it's so good.

00:02:58.500 He takes what could be really dry history.

00:03:01.340 I remember I was a history major,

00:03:02.680 and you always hear that history is just one fact after another.

00:03:06.360 He takes what could be really dry, boring history,

00:03:08.660 and he weaves it into really engaging narratives.

00:03:12.240 I listen to it when I'm driving, and it's a great way.

00:03:15.360 It's really hard to take the time to read books.

00:03:17.520 You know, I only get an hour or two to read a day.

00:03:19.800 But I drive a lot.

00:03:21.160 I'm in Los Angeles.

00:03:22.220 If you commute, you can listen to it.

00:03:24.020 And it's just like injecting your brain with history knowledge.

00:03:28.360 And so not only can you impress people at cocktail parties,

00:03:30.660 but you'll also be able to understand your own civilization,

00:03:34.160 your own moment in politics.

00:03:35.580 It will make you realize that perhaps not everything is falling apart.

00:03:38.940 Or if it is all falling apart, why is it?

00:03:41.400 And where are the historical backgrounds for that?

00:03:43.960 So what you should do is you've got to Google it right now.

00:03:46.620 Tides of history.

00:03:48.080 Go and Google it.

00:03:48.840 It's on Apple Podcasts.

00:03:49.960 It's on Google Play.

00:03:50.760 It's on Stitcher.

00:03:51.540 All of the podcast sites.

00:03:53.940 So look it up right now.

00:03:55.240 Tides of history.

00:03:56.440 It's with Patrick Wyman.

00:03:57.800 I think you're really going to like it.

00:03:59.340 And tweet me and let me know what you think about it,

00:04:01.060 because I've really enjoyed listening to it so far.

00:04:03.660 And go over there so we can keep these lights on.

00:04:05.520 Come on, guys.

00:04:06.480 Okay.

00:04:07.000 We had some explosive political news over the weekend,

00:04:10.640 and that was Steve Bannon's interview with Charlie Rose on 60 Minutes.

00:04:15.000 If you missed it for some reason, if you were hiding under a rock,

00:04:17.720 here is just a clip of it to get the gist of it.

00:04:20.380 The Republican establishment is trying to nullify the 2016 election.

00:04:26.040 That's a brutal fact we have to face.

00:04:27.820 The Republican establishment.

00:04:28.640 The Republican establishment.

00:04:29.740 Wants to nullify the 2016 election.

00:04:32.180 Trying to nullify the 2016 election.

00:04:34.060 Absolutely.

00:04:35.000 Who?

00:04:36.300 I think Mitch McConnell and, to a degree, Paul Ryan.

00:04:38.880 They do not want Donald Trump's populist, economic, nationalist agenda to be implemented.

00:04:45.800 It's very obvious.

00:04:46.520 It's obvious as night follows day.

00:04:50.780 Give me a story that illustrates that.

00:04:52.680 Well, Mitch McConnell, when we first met him, he said, I think, in one of the first meetings

00:04:57.480 in Trump Tower with the president, as we're wrapping up, he basically says,

00:05:02.580 I don't want to hear any more of this drain the swamp talk.

00:05:04.480 They do not support the president's program.

00:05:06.520 It's an open secret on Capitol Hill.

00:05:08.060 Everybody in this city knows it.

00:05:09.160 And so, therefore, now that you're out of the White House, you're going to war with him.

00:05:12.680 Absolutely.

00:05:14.040 The main question I had after watching this interview, you can watch the whole thing,

00:05:17.320 it's about an hour long, is how Charlie Rose got his job.

00:05:20.500 He just comes off so poorly and uninformed and like a left-wing hack.

00:05:26.340 But this is CBS News, so perhaps it was ever thus.

00:05:29.800 To comment on the swamp, I bring on now, I have the great privilege of bringing on my friend

00:05:34.740 of a very long time, the first female physician ever elected to Congress.

00:05:38.560 She represented New York's 19th congressional district until we got gerrymandered out

00:05:42.840 and a few extra cities were added in.

00:05:44.500 My friend, Dr. Nan Hayworth.

00:05:46.980 Nan, thank you for coming on.

00:05:47.940 Big fan of yours, sir.

00:05:48.880 And I was able to win that election for the sake of all the people we think so much about.

00:05:56.500 Thanks to you.

00:05:57.300 You were an incredibly potent force for us.

00:06:02.020 And everybody who knows you is not surprised to hear that.

00:06:05.400 So thank you, Michael.

00:06:06.160 Thank you, Nan.

00:06:06.900 And someday on the show, maybe I'll start telling some stories about all the lawsuit threats

00:06:11.960 and the ex-rock stars and everything else that came out of that campaign.

00:06:16.420 Because it was the most fun thing, pretty much, in the history of politics.

00:06:20.500 You were just brilliant.

00:06:22.200 I just tagged along.

00:06:26.100 You are too humble, Nan.

00:06:27.420 We must get into the politics of what Bannon is talking about here.

00:06:33.060 He is accusing D.C. of being an institutional place.

00:06:36.840 He's saying the office of the speaker is an institution.

00:06:40.300 Office of the leader is an institution.

00:06:44.160 There are forces like lobbyists and think tanks and donors and this and that.

00:06:49.840 And this, that, and the other thing that are controlling Washington, D.C.

00:06:54.520 Now, you were elected on a Tea Party wave.

00:06:58.160 You represented a very important district.

00:06:59.900 You were on the Financial Services Committee.

00:07:01.620 You were, I believe, a deputy whip.

00:07:03.740 You helped.

00:07:04.780 I was one of the freshman whips, yeah.

00:07:06.940 You were one of the freshman whips. 0.97

00:07:08.720 Is he right?

00:07:10.000 Are these guys the swamp monsters?

00:07:12.580 And if not, where is the swamp?

00:07:14.440 How do we drain it?

00:07:15.220 Well, Michael, in some ways, the swamp is, in a sense, the swamp is ourselves.

00:07:25.100 I'll accept you from that company, but.

00:07:28.160 No, you make a great point.

00:07:30.160 It's, we are not, one of the many lessons I learned when I was in Congress was that we look

00:07:39.540 to our electeds to change things, but they will not be able to change anything unless they have

00:07:50.380 the support of their constituents.

00:07:52.840 And most of these, especially on the long-term public servants, quite honestly, or those

00:08:02.220 who should be public servants, long-term electeds, are there because they have managed to satisfy

00:08:10.020 their constituents.

00:08:11.260 So if we want really to change, we have to look to ourselves as Americans and say, we have

00:08:17.020 to understand what we ask all these people to do when we send them to Washington.

00:08:21.720 We have to understand the Framers' brilliant design for the federal government, the limitations

00:08:28.260 of the federal government, and how far we have exceeded them.

00:08:32.540 And unless we do that, we are not going to get change for the better, and we're not going

00:08:37.820 to get change that makes the people who are seeking change happy with what happens.

00:08:43.980 You are making an obvious point that nobody in this populist climate will make, which is

00:08:49.040 that we are the swamp monster.

00:08:50.640 David Mayhew became a famed political scientist for making the incredible observation that

00:08:57.920 members of Congress are primarily motivated by re-election, and they will do what their

00:09:02.760 constituents tell them to do, what their constituents ask them to do, and then their constituents will

00:09:07.660 complain when they do it.

00:09:10.800 Depending on what happens.

00:09:12.240 That's right.

00:09:12.640 Look, if their constituents understand, when they say, we need to cut budgets, and they

00:09:19.480 then understand that when we say that, that means we're going to have to cut some things

00:09:25.980 that you like, then we could have a rational conversation about these things.

00:09:31.920 But most of the time, that's not what's happening.

00:09:34.420 Everybody wants somebody else's ox to be gored.

00:09:37.060 That's exactly right.

00:09:39.620 And that's a big part of the problem.

00:09:42.340 I have, and that's not to say, by the way, that I have enormous sympathy for the predicament,

00:09:51.140 if you will, in which Senator McConnell in particular finds himself.

00:09:54.880 I am actually quite angry that he doesn't move to do the one thing that the president has urged

00:10:04.580 so strongly that I think has to be done if we are actually to pass a legislative package,

00:10:11.300 a legislative agenda that achieves something approaching the populist goals that the president

00:10:17.340 espoused.

00:10:17.980 And that is to put more Americans back to work, to make it possible for employers and 0.85

00:10:23.820 businesses and small businesses to work better, to reduce the cost of labor in this country.

00:10:30.380 And that means, and the president's made some progress with that, as much as he can make

00:10:33.460 from the executive branch in reducing regulations.

00:10:36.760 And he has done some things for which he deserves praise.

00:10:39.980 But that's not going to happen unless they break the filibuster.

00:10:42.840 We're not going to get that package of reforms.

00:10:45.400 I totally agree.

00:10:46.680 We have to break it.

00:10:48.080 I don't dislike the idea of a filibuster, but the way that it's been abused by Democrats

00:10:53.400 for so long, and the way that the government has been abused by Democrats, it seems to me

00:10:58.300 a natural step.

00:11:00.320 And it's surprising that McConnell won't do it.

00:11:02.820 Well, they like their prerogative, and they worry about being in the minority again.

00:11:10.740 And that's what looms over their heads.

00:11:13.380 No senator wants to give up a filibuster.

00:11:17.680 But the problem is, the Constitution allows the Senate to create its own rules.

00:11:25.600 True.

00:11:26.060 But the filibuster is not constitutionally required, mandated.

00:11:30.740 Yeah, I don't remember that provision of the Constitution, right?

00:11:34.200 Precisely.

00:11:34.720 Now, it's also said, and people will say in praise of the filibuster or in justification,

00:11:40.780 well, you know, the Senate is supposed to be a great deliberative body, to which I respond,

00:11:44.940 absolutely.

00:11:46.060 And guess what?

00:11:47.180 But over the most of the 20th century and into the 21st, we have asked the federal government

00:11:54.840 to do vastly more than its original portfolio, so that we were never meant by the framers

00:12:02.020 to be waiting on the Senate to reach consensus about matters that have to do with how citizens

00:12:08.480 conduct their lives, namely pensions and benefits in particular, housing, education.

00:12:13.860 Since the 17th Amendment, since the popular election of senators, it appears that the

00:12:18.640 deliberation of that body, or the deliberative nature of it, has been dramatically weakened.

00:12:25.460 Well, it's, we have, and we've expanded the, my biggest concern, as it was for many in

00:12:32.400 the last election, was the composition of the Supreme Court.

00:12:36.820 And Justice Scalia's death was a blow.

00:12:39.560 I mean, it was like a punch to the gut.

00:12:42.780 So that also, of course, emphasizes to all of us what can happen when our side is in

00:12:50.340 the minority.

00:12:51.420 And we like to have that filibuster power, if you will, to, you know, forestall events

00:12:58.700 that we would find troubling, like the elevation of a Supreme Court justice whose opinion, particularly

00:13:05.740 in the Commerce Clause, was different from Justice Scalia's, as would have been the case, had

00:13:11.160 McConnell not use the filibuster, right, to block the nomination.

00:13:16.180 But he had to break the filibuster to elevate Justice Gorsuch.

00:13:19.080 And at this point, this is, this is like football in two ways.

00:13:22.960 Number one, Chuck Schumer's like Lucy, he, you know, he issues the sanctimonious twaddle

00:13:27.380 about how, of course, now we have to compromise and he intones and, you know, yes, he's so serious.

00:13:32.020 He lifts up that ball.

00:13:32.840 He has no intention, right?

00:13:34.060 He's going to keep moving that football.

00:13:36.360 And Mitch McConnell's Charlie Brown.

00:13:38.260 But the other way it's like football is that we have to say at this point, you know what,

00:13:41.020 we've got to play this quarter because we may not have a game after this.

00:13:46.320 And if they don't break the filibuster on cloture on legislation, they're never going to reach

00:13:50.780 a package that will have enough fiscally conservative reforms that we really do need.

00:13:56.620 And I'm a partisan in that way. 0.98

00:13:58.020 Damn it, we need Republicans to pass this thing. 0.99

00:14:00.020 I don't want to exclude Democrats, but I don't want them to obstruct. 0.98

00:14:02.440 We're never going to get there unless they break the filibuster on legislation.

00:14:05.360 And to mix metaphors as much as we possibly can, you bring up a point that I really admire

00:14:10.780 you for.

00:14:11.280 I really admire the way you've conducted yourself from the last, from this last presidential

00:14:15.820 election onward, which is that you have to play the hand you're dealt.

00:14:19.660 You have to play the cards in front of you.

00:14:22.140 Politics is not about imagining how lovely it would be if something else had happened or if

00:14:27.780 we lived in a different universe where Donald Trump were polite and nice and behaved himself

00:14:33.140 at cocktail parties or that some, that Jim Gilmore were the nominee of the Republican party.

00:14:38.540 You have dealt in reality.

00:14:40.680 Or Mitch Daniels.

00:14:41.040 Or Mitch, or Mitch Daniels.

00:14:41.720 I mean, you and I, you turned me on to Mitch Daniels.

00:14:44.340 We spent a long time trying to get that guy to run, but you know, I've spent long enough

00:14:48.760 imagining what it would be like to have that guy run for office.

00:14:51.960 And you supported Donald Trump.

00:14:54.800 You, perhaps the most intelligent and educated member of your class in Congress and possibly

00:15:00.240 in DC, period.

00:15:02.020 You know, I really admire this because you come from circles that would be considered

00:15:06.240 educated, elite, intelligent, socially refined.

00:15:10.500 And you put your political goals and the political good of the country before your own image and

00:15:18.760 your own sense of associating with a man who many consider uncouth.

00:15:23.500 Well, and I know, Mike, we've talked about it, but President Trump represented to me by far

00:15:32.580 the better alternative for all of us.

00:15:35.200 And he is someone who has acknowledged the advice and counsel of people like Larry Kudlow

00:15:44.580 and Steve Moore and Art Laffer and David Malpass, all of whom have the best ideas on how to move

00:15:52.220 us forward in terms of fiscal policy.

00:15:54.700 I know they're not the only voices the president has heard, but I know this quite firmly.

00:16:01.080 Hillary Clinton would have given them no credence. 0.97

00:16:03.920 Uh, and you know, if it's a matter of aesthetics, uh, the president is blunt, uh, he's forthright,

00:16:11.340 uh, and he sometimes, uh, says things that, uh, others might with justification find

00:16:17.220 objectable for one, objectionable for one or another reason.

00:16:20.240 Uh, but we don't elect a president based on aesthetics.

00:16:23.220 We base it and look at how he has performed with FEMA, with all the people whom he and his

00:16:29.460 administration put into place to manage these two back-to-back enormous natural disasters.

00:16:35.720 And he's got nothing but praise for it.

00:16:37.940 When he's gone overseas and he's talked with our allies, they have welcomed him.

00:16:42.500 This is a man who understands far more than he's given credit for.

00:16:47.040 Uh, and you know, Michael, I am, I have run out of patience, uh, with, and you and I both

00:16:53.100 know the elites of which we speak.

00:16:55.460 You're exactly right.

00:16:56.500 The, uh, the Ivy League elites in particular.

00:16:59.520 Uh, and I'm on the Princeton University Politics Department Advisory Council.

00:17:04.240 I think Yale is going to rescind my diploma.

00:17:06.540 I don't, I don't know how I stand with them anymore, but it's nice that you've, that you,

00:17:10.900 they haven't totally kicked you out of the association.

00:17:13.720 Since last October, but we did have a raft of work that we did and then it was, uh, kind

00:17:19.740 of done for a while, but, uh, but you know what I, and I enjoy it and I appreciate it.

00:17:23.000 And I think, you know, there's some terrific people working there, uh, including our chairman,

00:17:27.320 but, uh, at our meeting in October before 16, before the election, uh, we had a discussion

00:17:33.260 after formal business was concluded about for whom we would vote for president.

00:17:37.500 Uh, and again, I'm not the only Republican on this committee, but I was certainly the only

00:17:41.100 one who said, well, I'm going to vote for Donald Trump.

00:17:43.820 You were the only one.

00:17:44.900 You were the only, even among Republicans.

00:17:47.400 Michael, far and away.

00:17:49.000 I mean, I was assailed.

00:17:50.760 Well, Michael, as you know, uh, those whom we, um, brush at, if you will, uh, you know,

00:17:57.640 whom we give the designation establishment Republicans, uh, have at least as much disdain,

00:18:04.080 uh, or had at least as, as much disdain for the prospective Trump voter as did Democrats.

00:18:10.140 Absolutely right.

00:18:10.700 That's absolutely right.

00:18:11.760 And as certainly at least as much disdain for Donald Trump as they do for Hillary Clinton.

00:18:17.320 Oh, absolutely.

00:18:18.920 Well, so many of them voted for, uh, Hillary Clinton.

00:18:21.920 And I, and I thought, you know, number one, I saw no moral, uh, divide between these two

00:18:29.620 candidates.

00:18:30.220 Uh, you know, I didn't think that that really was a valid set of considerations at all for

00:18:36.260 a lot of different reasons.

00:18:37.380 You don't think that Hillary is some example of moral purity and virtue and nobility?

00:18:42.840 Oh, you know, I, uh, when she, when, when, when Secretary Clinton was first lady and was

00:18:50.400 designated by, uh, her president, then her husband, then President Clinton, uh, to manage

00:18:56.260 healthcare, I, uh, as a woman and as a professional and as someone who's had many blessings in this

00:19:02.640 country and understands that it's generations of women before me who helped make that happen. 0.96

00:19:06.780 But I was insulted because I thought this is exactly the wrong message to say that because

00:19:13.240 you are married to the president, uh, you know, now you are endowed with the power to reshape 0.90

00:19:19.460 the nation's healthcare.

00:19:20.400 Who, who, who elected you?

00:19:23.680 No one.

00:19:24.220 That's, that's absolutely right.

00:19:26.560 Yeah.

00:19:27.100 And so switching gears just a little bit, it is the, the anniversary of 9-11.

00:19:32.720 You and I are both New Yorkers.

00:19:35.020 Uh, I, you know, I was a kid when it happened.

00:19:37.620 Um, what, how should we think about our nation, our nation's response to that terrorist attack,

00:19:45.900 our nation's response to catastrophes in general, 16 years later?

00:19:51.780 Well, Michael, it does, as you know, uh, these, uh, unimaginably horrible events do, uh, lift the

00:20:02.820 soul in showing us the best of what our nation represents, uh, in the response to, not only in

00:20:13.800 the immediate time, the incredible courage of the New York, uh, police and fire departments,

00:20:20.900 you know, New York's bravest, New York's finest.

00:20:23.100 I mean, uh, nothing can compare to what they did, not only during the attacks, but in the aftermath,

00:20:31.340 uh, but the wall street journal made a superb point a couple of weeks ago when they had their

00:20:38.340 editorial board, uh, had an editorial, I think it was called disasters and the wealth of nations.

00:20:43.820 Uh, and they were referring in the immediate, uh, instance to hurricane Harvey, we will get

00:20:49.180 through this.

00:20:49.700 And the reason we'll get through this and the reason we will rebuild is in no small part,

00:20:54.840 not only due to the American spirit, which we celebrate, but also due to the fact that we

00:21:00.480 are blessed to be, uh, within the world's and history's greatest, uh, economic engine of

00:21:09.840 prosperity ever known.

00:21:11.880 And that is not a random occurrence.

00:21:14.340 It is by design.

00:21:16.680 No, exactly.

00:21:17.840 It is by design, the design of our constitution, the most humane and empowering document ever created.

00:21:24.340 And unless we can fully appreciate, uh, when calmer moments come and we can think beyond

00:21:34.440 the, uh, events at hand and beyond the immediate, uh, need for recovery as we do now for, for

00:21:41.780 Irma, uh, but as we did after September 11th, unless we think beyond that to understand that

00:21:48.120 we have to empower those who are most productive, empower our workers, uh, not have a federal

00:21:57.200 government that imposes unreasonable burdens to have, uh, elected officials who can be modest

00:22:03.920 enough to recognize that it is not they who are the heroes.

00:22:10.220 It is not they who are supposed to distribute largesse, uh, to a needy public, but it is

00:22:18.420 in fact, their constituents who must be empowered to have the dignity of working and producing

00:22:25.440 for themselves in their society.

00:22:27.060 And earning and reaping the rewards of their work.

00:22:30.060 Exactly.

00:22:31.100 They don't.

00:22:31.920 Right now we have a federal government that is confiscatory and predatory and whatever they

00:22:35.960 claim to deliver in terms of benefits, people like Charles Schumer, uh, who want to set

00:22:41.680 themselves up as our, uh, as our heroes because they, uh, demand that the federal government

00:22:47.900 do everything for us as much as possible.

00:22:51.240 You know, that is actually weakening us and taking away resources and making us inefficient

00:22:57.400 and ineffective and dependent.

00:23:00.000 Uh, so we create wealth by putting Americans to work and letting them do the rest. 0.53

00:23:06.280 That's a wonderful moral case, uh, relating the, the spirit of America, the engines of

00:23:11.600 growth that have made America and our resilience are almost our anti-fragility to borrow a phrase

00:23:17.380 from Nicholas Taleb in the face of catastrophe, in the face of natural disaster and terrorist

00:23:22.840 attacks.

00:23:23.320 There is something about the American spirit and the American system, the American way of

00:23:27.920 life that is under attack.

00:23:29.900 And it's under attack by the left wing in America.

00:23:34.040 From within, from within, exactly.

00:23:36.880 And some of it, Michael, as you know, is actually, it is facilitated by prosperity.

00:23:43.200 And I think that's one reason that president Reagan, uh, said so cogently, you know, that,

00:23:50.780 that we cannot take our great democracy for granted.

00:23:54.380 We must fight for it with every generation.

00:23:56.960 Freedom is never one generation away from extinction.

00:24:00.320 Exactly.

00:24:01.300 Exactly.

00:24:01.980 I mean, we see it happening on college campuses, you know, your alma mater and mine, uh, and

00:24:09.180 they are not isolated, uh, alas, you know, have actually instituted measures that actively

00:24:17.220 suppress speech.

00:24:19.080 That's right.

00:24:19.560 They don't preach what they practice.

00:24:20.820 They don't preach the mechanisms in their lifestyles or in their professional lives that have allowed

00:24:27.880 them to become what they are.

00:24:28.940 Absolutely right.

00:24:30.020 Nan, on that note, anyway, we've, I've taken up way too much of your time.

00:24:34.980 It was so good to have you here that what a, what an excellent message to leave on, on this

00:24:39.580 anniversary.

00:24:40.560 And, uh, and, but there's so much more I want to talk to you about.

00:24:43.220 I want to talk to you about, uh, Trump making deals with Schumer and Pelosi.

00:24:47.000 I want to talk to you about all those things, but we don't have time, so we'll just have

00:24:49.800 to bring you back.

00:24:51.260 Well, I'll just have to come back and all you have to do is ask.

00:24:54.580 All right.

00:24:54.960 Thank you, Nan.

00:24:56.080 Ladies and gentlemen, Nan Hayworth, the first female physician ever elected to Congress.

00:25:00.840 With that, we have got to bring on our panel of deplorables.

00:25:05.320 Nan could never be on the panel of deplorables because there's nothing deplorable about her 1.00

00:25:08.460 other than that she voted for Donald Trump.

00:25:10.040 So right now we're very lucky to have Jacob Airey and Emily Butler.

00:25:14.600 So let's talk a little bit more, but let's go right back to the politics.

00:25:17.460 We've had all of the uplifting stuff from Congresswoman Nan Hayworth.

00:25:21.140 So let's go back into Steve Bannon, perhaps not as uplifting.

00:25:25.660 Uh, uh, I want to know, Emily, does Bannon have any clout or is, you know, is he speaking

00:25:32.600 for the Trump administration or is he just some jilted ex-employee?

00:25:36.300 I don't think that Bannon ever actually speaks for anyone other than Bannon.

00:25:42.900 Bannon is out for himself.

00:25:44.460 Bannon is a strategist at heart.

00:25:46.620 Um, he's speaking to an audience and maybe that audience isn't exactly apparent when you're

00:25:52.280 watching him on, you know, CBS or, or 60 Minutes.

00:25:55.700 Um, there is always a hierarchy that's at play.

00:25:59.180 And with Bannon, especially at this point in his career, he has a new objective to think

00:26:04.540 about, you know, he reached his objective to get into the White House, uh, that objective

00:26:09.840 has been fulfilled and subsequently tossed aside.

00:26:12.680 So he has a new objective that he needs to fulfill.

00:26:14.760 He has a new prerogative and a new order that he needs to establish.

00:26:17.980 So I would say there's a man trying to regain relevancy is the first step towards rebuilding

00:26:23.260 his agenda, much less of an employee going rogue.

00:26:26.460 On that note, however, I do think that as Trump's administration winds down or if there's

00:26:31.720 a new, um, upper opportunity for Bannon to squeeze in there, he's probably not going

00:26:37.740 to hold back on some negative comments from the administration.

00:26:40.000 Maybe not on Trump personally, but there will definitely be an opportunity that he will

00:26:45.040 seize.

00:26:45.680 But what's his angle here?

00:26:46.880 I mean, why is he going on 60 Minutes? 1.00

00:26:49.140 Why is he going into the heart of stupidity and lazy leftism with Charlie Rose? 0.99

00:26:53.780 I mean, I'm not Steve Bannon, but if I was Steve Bannon, I'd be thinking about what the 0.99

00:26:59.220 plan is to get back to the top of your empire.

00:27:02.920 Uh, he's been totally wiped out.

00:27:04.720 He's been, um, sort of dishonored a little bit.

00:27:09.880 Yeah.

00:27:10.200 Sidelined by being kicked out of the administration.

00:27:12.380 So you have to think about what, what I need to do to rebuild.

00:27:16.320 And the first step to that is getting as wide an audience as possible while it's relevant,

00:27:20.820 while people still want to hear from you, uh, both the left and the right.

00:27:24.660 Um, you see the same thing with Hillary Clinton all the time, just giving interview upon interview

00:27:28.220 on how she feels about her loss.

00:27:30.080 You know, uh, Trump Bannon is capitalizing on exactly the same thing.

00:27:34.180 He wants to speak out while he's still relevant and while he's going back to Breitbart.

00:27:38.260 And then if there's an opportunity to catch any leftist mainstream media in a hypocrisy,

00:27:44.240 in a crosshairs, he can seize on that.

00:27:46.400 He can fight back on that with everything in his jaws and, uh, come out looking even

00:27:51.680 better as he returns to restore himself as the captain, the leader, the head of Breitbart.

00:27:57.880 Charlie Rose is a hack, but he does have a network television platform.

00:28:02.400 CBS is usually the first channel people see when you turn on your TV.

00:28:06.120 Yeah, I guess that's it.

00:28:06.840 Just grab the platform.

00:28:08.240 Jacob, in that interview, Bannon says that the original sin of the administration was making

00:28:14.420 a deal with the establishment Republicans, that they're playing nice with them.

00:28:18.500 Uh, is he right?

00:28:19.940 And isn't there a fair question?

00:28:22.540 How would they govern without establishment Republicans?

00:28:25.480 Well, I think it depends on what he means by establishment Republicans, because some people

00:28:29.480 are lumping in conservatives who are, I should say, real conservatives in with the establishment

00:28:35.440 Republicans.

00:28:35.960 So I don't know if that is who Bannon is referring to, but I think Trump is a dealmaker, right?

00:28:41.300 That's what he always bragged about.

00:28:43.100 I'll make the deals.

00:28:44.140 I'll make the best deals.

00:28:45.700 And so for him to say, oh, it's the original sin to deal with the establishment Republicans,

00:28:49.380 the GOP is the party in power.

00:28:51.500 Who else is he going to make a deal with?

00:28:52.940 I know he's, he's chiming in about making a deal with Schumer and Nancy Pelosi, but if

00:28:57.700 he wants to move his fiscal policy forward and everything that has to do with immigration,

00:29:02.760 he has to deal with the establishment Republicans because the Democrats aren't going to help him.

00:29:07.300 So I don't really think it's fair to call it the original sin of the administration.

00:29:12.820 Oh, fair enough.

00:29:13.800 There's the religious ruling from Pastor Jacob Berry.

00:29:16.660 We now, former pastor, former Pastor Jacob Berry.

00:29:20.000 We now, unlike Paul Bois, who's the future Pope, we now have got to say goodbye to Facebook

00:29:25.680 and YouTube.

00:29:26.600 Now I know you all want to keep listening.

00:29:27.960 You want to talk to the panel of deplorables.

00:29:29.700 You want to hear about Pope Francis and illegal immigrants and Miss America and a final thought 0.52

00:29:34.520 about 9-11, but the only way that you can do that is go to dailywire.com.

00:29:38.760 Right now it's $10 a month, $100 a year.

00:29:41.660 You get me, you get the Andrew Klavan show, you get the Ben Shapiro show.

00:29:45.020 Forget all that.

00:29:45.820 That, what is that worth?

00:29:47.160 A nickel, a dime, but you get the Leftist Tears Tumblr.

00:29:51.520 This, I would pay at least the cost of a hundred Steve Crowder mugs to get this Leftist

00:29:57.040 Tears Tumblr.

00:29:57.520 It is the finest vessel for your Leftist Tears known to man.

00:30:01.840 You can have them hot or cold, they'll always be salty and delicious, and it will never

00:30:06.160 rust from the salt of those Leftist Tears.

00:30:08.360 So go over there right now, dailywire.com, and we'll be right back.

00:30:22.580 Pope Francis suggested today that pro-lifers must support Obama's executive amnesty, saying,

00:30:28.280 The President of the United States presents himself as pro-life, and if he is a good pro-lifer, 0.61

00:30:32.540 he understands that family is the cradle of life, and its unity must be protected.

00:30:37.260 He added, I think this law comes not from Parliament, but from the executive.

00:30:41.340 If that is so, I am hopeful that it will be rethought.

00:30:45.420 Emily, you're a Catholic.

00:30:47.400 What is a good conservative Catholic to do with left-wing popes?

00:30:50.820 Probably the same thing that any good patriot needed to do under President Obama, which is

00:30:58.500 just kind of hold your tongue, take the doctrine as it comes, and wait for a new pope.

00:31:07.380 We have had bad popes before.

00:31:09.240 This isn't a new thing.

00:31:10.320 Sometimes the Lord sends us bad popes to let us know that the pope is only infallible when

00:31:16.140 he's not fallible, and I'm not even saying he's a bad pope, but he does weigh in a lot

00:31:20.520 on matters of domestic American politics, which seem not to have very much to do with

00:31:26.520 scripture.

00:31:28.240 So the number one priority of the Catholic Church is the salvation of souls.

00:31:32.780 In that doctrine, it does say that the pope is quote-unquote infallible.

00:31:38.220 That goes back to Catholic doctrine.

00:31:40.960 Well, he's infallible when he speaks, yeah, that's exactly right.

00:31:43.160 He's infallible when he speaks ex-cathedra, right, and he's on matters of doctrine.

00:31:47.780 This does not have anything to do with personal opinions on climate change.

00:31:51.620 It doesn't have personal opinions on immigration.

00:31:54.620 Those things that he says are sort of unique to this pope himself.

00:31:58.460 We're not necessarily, as Catholics, obligated to heed or obey anything that he says from

00:32:04.460 his personal lectern.

00:32:07.460 When it comes down to doctrine, he's still very pope-like.

00:32:10.800 You've seen him rile up the left.

00:32:12.180 He's very pope-ish, you know.

00:32:13.820 He's kind of pope-ish.

00:32:15.560 I mean, you see him come back to, you know, sort of irritating the leftists with reiterating

00:32:20.740 his stances, the Catholic stances on abortion, transgenderism.

00:32:24.560 These are things that are still Catholic doctrine.

00:32:28.740 He said of gay marriage, too.

00:32:30.240 He said when it was up for a vote in Argentina that this is not a mere political issue, but

00:32:35.080 it is, quote, a machination of the father of lies that seeks to deceive and confuse the

00:32:39.340 children of God does not sound like a Democrat in that statement.

00:32:44.400 No.

00:32:45.040 And I think I recall a long time ago where he tried to personally sort of make gay marriage

00:32:52.340 or gay relationships not a sin and kind of got slapped back down by the church from that

00:32:57.480 and then came out and sort of backtracked that statement that he made.

00:33:01.080 It's always difficult because we have this lens of the mainstream media.

00:33:06.260 So the pope says something, and he might be making some political point.

00:33:10.420 It might be a small point.

00:33:11.560 And then the Huffington Post blows it up like, you know, the pope doesn't believe in Jesus

00:33:16.060 anymore.

00:33:16.480 And you say, well, I don't—I didn't see that anywhere in his statement.

00:33:19.980 Jacob, whatever happened to render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's?

00:33:23.320 St. Paul writes, quote, let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is

00:33:28.820 no authority except that which God has established.

00:33:31.100 The authorities that exist have been established by God.

00:33:33.720 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against God, what God has instituted,

00:33:39.280 and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.

00:33:43.540 And that would seem to be the case for the immigration laws of the United States.

00:33:47.300 Is the pope contradicting Catholic teaching by denouncing the enforcement of a perfectly

00:33:52.760 legitimate law?

00:33:54.540 I don't necessarily think so.

00:33:56.580 You fear hell.

00:33:57.660 You don't want to be struck down on the spot.

00:33:59.360 Sure.

00:33:59.860 Fair enough.

00:34:00.480 I don't think that—I think what Paul is saying that you can have a personal opinion,

00:34:07.120 and I honestly think the pope's—the pope's words don't affect our policy.

00:34:13.120 So I think it's okay for the pope to have a personal opinion.

00:34:15.920 I just want to know where his opinions are on the encroaching socialism and secularization

00:34:19.920 of Europe, as opposed to this one law in the United States.

00:34:24.400 And often people misquote the render to Caesar what is Caesar's.

00:34:28.400 What is—the question that is asked of Christ is, is it a sin to pay taxes to Caesar?

00:34:33.760 And so he says, render to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is to God.

00:34:37.700 He's not—he was saying, no, it is not a sin to pay your taxes.

00:34:41.880 Because there were certain, shall we say, pious groups back then who were teaching that.

00:34:47.840 And Jesus was saying, that's not the case.

00:34:49.320 Oh, I think it's a sin to pay your taxes, so I try never to do it.

00:34:52.000 I try to avoid it as much as possible.

00:34:53.740 Oh, me too.

00:34:53.840 You know, the Catholic Church—the Catholic Church is not the only venerable institution

00:34:58.580 that is speaking less than infallibly about American politics.

00:35:03.860 This has even infected the Miss America pageant 2018.

00:35:08.800 We don't have the clip.

00:35:09.740 I thought we had the clip of it.

00:35:10.740 But one of the questions that was asked of Miss America was, what do you think about

00:35:17.300 the Trump collusion narrative?

00:35:19.660 Did Donald Trump collude with Russia to win the election, and how so, and when will he

00:35:24.320 get caught?

00:35:25.440 Jacob, why does the left have to make every good thing boring?

00:35:29.380 They've ruined colleges. 0.99

00:35:30.860 They have made sex boring. 0.99

00:35:32.700 Now they're going after hot chicks in bikinis. 1.00

00:35:35.440 Why can't we have nice things?

00:35:38.060 It's exactly what you said.

00:35:39.640 They cannot leave it alone.

00:35:42.340 Oh, my gosh.

00:35:43.080 I, you know, I just want to see—I don't care what she thinks about the Russia collusion

00:35:47.320 conspiracy theory, because that's all it is, a conspiracy theory.

00:35:51.860 You know, I know Maxine Waters, she likes to talk about the Kremlin clan, and she likes

00:35:56.580 to go all over the place and saying the Internet's trying to kill her. 1.00

00:35:59.980 This is where the left is getting their information.

00:36:03.720 Leave Miss America alone. 1.00

00:36:06.120 You know, Emily, you bring up a great point, because this is a conspiracy

00:36:09.480 theory at this point.

00:36:10.400 Emily, does the left really believe that anyone cares what Miss America thinks about

00:36:16.820 these crazy Democrat conspiracy theories?

00:36:19.740 Or is this just about coercing every aspect of the culture to recite and toe the line on

00:36:26.840 leftist orthodoxy?

00:36:28.000 Well, as, like, a member of the United States and as, like, a member of the human race, I think it's

00:36:41.240 important that, like, all of humanity have their voices heard.

00:36:47.020 So I think that, of course, it's important to hear what we say, especially as an American

00:36:54.600 beauty pageant contestant, I'm really pretty.

00:36:58.740 You know, that was more intelligent and coherent than the question that was asked of Miss America.

00:37:04.860 So kudos to you on that.

00:37:06.420 I think if I can answer seriously, I think that probably the people who care the most about

00:37:13.680 what the American Miss America pageant contestants have to say is the contestants themselves.

00:37:19.420 Clearly, you know, when you're talking about all these questions that have been posed to

00:37:24.260 them, the political nature of the questions, and you can hear how they want the question

00:37:29.580 to be answered.

00:37:30.220 So when you're a pageant contestant, you're standing up on the stage, all you care about

00:37:34.900 is, like, winning this crown, right?

00:37:36.480 So you're going to reiterate back anything that they're going to ask you exactly how you

00:37:41.440 think you want, how you think they want the question answered.

00:37:44.440 So when you look back at it, it's, there's not really, like, anything that they're saying

00:37:52.640 that's real or that, like, they actually care about or they're believing in.

00:37:57.220 It's about continuing on this narrative about something they probably haven't even researched.

00:38:03.440 Absolutely right.

00:38:04.280 And I'm, by the way, I'm really upset.

00:38:05.700 The only reason that I wanted to talk about Miss America today was to be able to watch

00:38:09.460 them on the screen during this.

00:38:10.640 And we don't have the clip, so it's absolutely pointless as far as I'm concerned.

00:38:14.300 Okay, panel of deplorables, Emily Butler and Jacob Berry, thank you for being here.

00:38:18.700 We'll have you back.

00:38:19.720 Now, it is the, it's the 16th anniversary, you know, of September 11th.

00:38:24.800 And so we haven't talked about it very much.

00:38:27.560 And I'll, I think I would like to talk about that in my final thought.

00:38:31.560 So I'll put on my smart glasses.

00:38:37.760 It's the 16th anniversary of the September 11th terror attacks.

00:38:41.560 My sixth grade math teacher broke the news to us in suburban New York.

00:38:45.940 My mother saw the towers fall with her own eyes.

00:38:48.700 And from Harlem, she made it onto one of the last trains out of the city.

00:38:53.180 Some of my classmates' parents didn't make it out of the city.

00:38:56.300 Not that day and not ever.

00:38:58.480 After the second plane struck, Father George Rutler ran from Midtown to the Twin Towers to

00:39:03.720 offer wartime absolution to the firemen rushing into the buildings.

00:39:08.160 The first confirmed death on that day was a Catholic priest named Michael Judge.

00:39:13.240 Next to the towers in St. Peter's Church, the first Catholic parish in New York.

00:39:17.180 Father Rutler met firemen who carried Father Judge's body and recalled, quote,

00:39:23.440 They put his body in front of the altar.

00:39:25.360 It was very moving.

00:39:26.780 There is a picture of the crucifixion over the altar.

00:39:29.420 I remember blood coming down the altar steps.

00:39:32.280 I shall always remember that scene.

00:39:34.740 The image evokes St. Paul's letter to the Ephesians.

00:39:37.460 We wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against

00:39:43.660 the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

00:39:49.840 Sixteen years ago, President George Bush put it in his own words, and I'll leave you with

00:39:54.640 that.

00:39:55.240 The pictures of airplanes flying into buildings, fires burning, huge structures collapsing,

00:40:03.100 have filled us with disbelief, terrible sadness, and a quiet, unyielding anger.

00:40:10.680 I can hear you.

00:40:20.000 I can hear you.

00:40:21.900 The rest of the world hears you.

00:40:24.440 And the people who knocked these buildings down will hear all of us soon.

00:40:33.780 The thereof.

00:40:53.240 The square of the circle.

00:40:58.820 The two of those in the making.

The Michael Knowles Show - September 11, 2017

Ep. 24 - Is The Swamp Swallowing Trump？ w⧸ fmr. Congresswoman Nan Hayworth

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