The Michael Knowles Show - Ep. 999 - No Roe V. Wade Is Armageddon For Libs

00:00:00.000 We have entered day three of the liberal freak out over the potential overruling of Roe versus

00:00:05.880 Wade. Very few of the sounds and shrieks that the liberals are making even vaguely resemble

00:00:12.240 arguments. But one guttural moan in particular that I heard, while still not constituting an

00:00:18.520 argument, did get to the heart of the issue. This came from Anna Kasparian at the Young Turks.

00:00:23.620 These comments might be strong, but it's how I genuinely feel. I don't care that you're a

00:00:29.240 Christian. I don't care what the Bible says. I feel like it's a clown show, like sitting 1.00

00:00:34.520 here trying to decipher what your little mythical book has to say about these very real political

00:00:41.540 issues, right? I don't care if you're Christian. In fact, I will fight for you to have your religious

00:00:48.720 liberty and practice your Christianity. I believe in that. I don't believe in Christianity, which 0.54

00:00:54.680 means that you do not get to dictate the way I live my life based on your religion.

00:00:59.880 I don't care what the Bible says. You have every right in the world. All those women who 1.00

00:01:04.840 identify with your religion have every right in the world to not get an abortion, to not

00:01:09.080 take birth control. But they do not have the right to dictate my life and what I decide to

00:01:14.180 do with my body. I don't care about your goddamn religion. 1.00

00:01:20.360 Anna doesn't care about our religion. Anna doesn't care what we believe. And I think 1.00

00:01:24.740 she is expressing the actual view of what the left thinks here. The thing is, I don't

00:01:31.060 care what she believes about this. I don't care what she believes about abortion, about

00:01:36.500 infanticide on a separate issue. I don't care what she thinks about transgenderism. I don't

00:01:41.540 care. And she doesn't get to force those views on me just because she really, really wants

00:01:46.300 to. We live in a political community. We get to persuade one another of our views. I think

00:01:52.720 that my view is correct on abortion, on transgenderism, on all sorts of other issues. And so we're

00:01:58.620 going to persuade one another and we're going to have standards and we're going to decide

00:02:01.180 how to live together in a political community within the bounds of the Constitution. That's

00:02:05.240 how this works. So you can scream and yell and say, me, me, me, I want it my way. That's

00:02:08.600 not the way government works. That's not the way politics works. We have a political community

00:02:13.860 and limits called the Constitution. And there is simply no question, whatever you think

00:02:17.580 about abortion or anything else, there is simply no question, there is no right to abortion 0.99

00:02:22.260 in the Constitution. I'm Michael Knowles. This is The Michael Knowles Show.

00:02:32.160 Welcome back to the show. My favorite comment yesterday is from Mikey79, who says, when we are

00:02:38.420 told abortion is reproductive rights, I just want to ask them, well, what are you reproducing? 0.98

00:02:44.160 Right? The very word, it's an ironic term, reproductive rights, because of course, abortion

00:02:50.140 is not a right. And it results in the opposite of reproduction. The very fact that one is acknowledging

00:02:56.580 that this is about reproduction tells you that there is a baby present and the baby has certain

00:03:01.640 rights and you don't just have the right to kill the baby. We have a guest coming up who 1.00

00:03:05.960 is going to articulate the pro-abortion side of this issue because, look, we don't want to

00:03:10.760 knock down straw men. All right. First, though, you got to text Knowles to 98, 98, 98. Finally

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00:04:12.420 98, 98, 98. Secure the gains that you've made while you still can. We don't want to just be talking in

00:04:17.800 an echo chamber here. We don't want to be pyromaniacs in a field of straw men. And so we sometimes invite

00:04:23.660 left-wingers on the show to present the strongest version of their point of view. I'm always very grateful

00:04:28.340 when left-wingers come on the show. Not an easy thing to do. Most of them just refuse to do it.

00:04:34.200 So I'm very pleased that our guest is Bronte Remzik, who is a third-year medical student,

00:04:40.440 a social activist, very much in support of legal abortion. We've gone back and forth on TikTok and

00:04:46.540 Twitter and MySpace and all sorts of social media platforms. So we thought, let's just have her on the

00:04:51.020 show and discuss the issue. Bronte, thank you so much for coming on.

00:04:54.060 Hi, Michael. I can't say that it's a pleasure, but I'm excited to help you expand your perspective.

00:05:00.080 Well, that's very kind of you to do that. So Bronte, before we get to the issue of abortion

00:05:03.960 itself, which I suspect we will get to, I guess we have to get to this issue that Anna Kasparian

00:05:09.360 raised and that is really at the heart of this Supreme Court decision in the past week of the

00:05:13.820 news cycle. Namely, does the Constitution enshrine a right to abortion? It seems very difficult to argue

00:05:21.080 that it does. One, because I don't see that right anywhere. The judges who decided that there was a

00:05:26.900 right in 1973, a right that previously had never been acknowledged in the Constitution, they said

00:05:32.200 that it was found within the emanations and the penumbras, and they couldn't quite point to exactly

00:05:37.480 where it was. But anyway, it's there. Then you had Planned Parenthood v. Casey in the early 1990s,

00:05:42.260 which actually overruled part of Roe versus Wade, at least in the argument for why we needed legal

00:05:47.820 abortion, but nevertheless upheld legal abortion. And it was all kind of just a big jumbled mess.

00:05:53.860 So is it your position that the Constitution provides for some heretofore invisible right to an

00:06:01.780 abortion, regardless of what you think about the issue? It is my opinion that we have a right to

00:06:07.120 privacy and abortion is a medical procedure. And the right to privacy does extend to the discussions

00:06:15.600 between a patient and a medical provider. Okay, but I could have a right to privacy with my

00:06:21.200 mafia capo and we could decide to whack my political enemy. And those, I guess those conversations would

00:06:26.840 be private. I don't think there is some generalized right to privacy in the Constitution, but even if

00:06:31.300 they were, that would have no bearing on the life of the person that we're going to kill, right?

00:06:35.960 Well, the discussion between you and your mafia friend is very different from a discussion between

00:06:41.400 a patient and a medical provider. We have laws that protect patient privacy for this exact reason.

00:06:46.880 But I suppose you're right. The distinction is that right now it's illegal for me to talk to my

00:06:51.420 mafia boss and call out a hit on someone I don't like. And it is legal right now, at least according

00:06:56.460 to the civil law, for a woman to talk to a doctor and kill her child. But that very likely will not 1.00

00:07:02.540 remain legal if Roe versus Wade is overturned in 13, 14 states. Instantly, that will become illegal.

00:07:08.180 So I guess I'm just talking about the matter itself beyond questions of the civil law,

00:07:12.860 which might be changing in real time right now. What's the difference? If you're saying it's all

00:07:17.340 about a right to privacy, I'm saying, no, it's about the baby that's being killed. So do you have an

00:07:22.420 answer for that or are we just denying the humanity of the baby? No, absolutely. So when you put up a

00:07:27.580 scenario of trying to put out a hit with the mafia, you are talking about murdering a born living,

00:07:34.600 unconscious, sentient, autonomous person. When we talk about abortion, we are talking about ending a

00:07:40.860 non-autonomous life. You do not have the right to bodily autonomy if you are not autonomous.

00:07:47.940 And if you are a fetus prior to the limit of viability, you do not have autonomy. Therefore,

00:07:53.740 you do not have the right to bodily autonomy. This is a great point. You reside inside of the

00:07:59.620 body of an autonomous person. And the right to bodily autonomy allows you to refuse to use your

00:08:06.040 body to support the life of another person. So this is a precise and important point you've made.

00:08:12.420 You've acknowledged that abortion ends a life, but you've said, those were your exact words. You just 0.76

00:08:16.840 said that the life is not autonomous. Would you say that a two-day-old post-birth baby is autonomous?

00:08:25.500 It is. It has bodily autonomy and it's able, its body system is able to function autonomously. Yes.

00:08:34.360 You are trying to get to the point where they require external resources, but any person can

00:08:41.280 provide that infant external resources. The utilization of someone's internal organs is very

00:08:47.500 different from providing external resources. You cannot force someone to be a parent and provide

00:08:53.760 external resources. You can give up that child at any point that you stop consenting to your

00:08:59.240 parental responsibilities and your parental rights. Okay. So that's fine. So we've acknowledged now

00:09:04.420 that the baby is living in the womb or outside the womb. It's a living being. And that the baby

00:09:10.240 is not really autonomous. I mean, maybe it's not attached by an umbilical cord, but it certainly

00:09:16.440 doesn't have autonomy when it's two days old. It needs to eat. It needs everything taken care of for it.

00:09:22.460 What you're saying is though, once the umbilical cord has been severed, the baby can be taken care

00:09:27.320 of by someone else. So then my question is, why would we not merely encourage adoption? If the

00:09:33.040 mother feels she can't take care of the baby, why not just give up the baby for adoption rather than 1.00

00:09:37.700 killing the baby in the womb? Because pregnancy in itself is a very serious medical condition that has

00:09:44.440 physical, mental, emotional, and financial burdens for the pregnant person. And to force a person to 0.98

00:09:49.980 endure that experience against their will is simply immoral. And it's belittling the experience

00:09:55.140 that pregnancy is. Well, so when you say against their will, what you are, you're referring to 0.82

00:10:00.000 cases of rape basically, right? Because when you engage in sex, you are engaging in an act of the

00:10:06.560 will, the consequence of which is historically speaking, always pregnancy. Correct. But when you

00:10:12.760 consent to sex, you're not consenting to pregnancy. You are consenting to the possibility of pregnancy,

00:10:16.900 but you can think of it like this. You can think of it like this. You understand the difference

00:10:21.640 between consensual sex and sexual assault. You should then understand the difference between

00:10:27.540 wanted pregnancy and unwanted pregnancy. Technically, physically, they are the same thing. But when your

00:10:34.220 body is being used against your will and without your consent, those are very different experiences for

00:10:40.020 the person. But Brunta, you've just acknowledged that when you consent to sex, you are consenting to the

00:10:46.080 possibility of pregnancy. So there you have it. There you are. You have consented to that. Now, you

00:10:51.080 might not want to become pregnant. You might want to use all sorts of contraceptives and things like 0.64

00:10:55.180 that. But surely, I mean, you've just said it yourself. You are consenting to that possibility. And so now

00:11:00.140 you're telling me that if one wants to then withdraw one's consent because one doesn't want to be 0.99

00:11:04.520 uncomfortable for some matter of months, you're saying that the better alternative is to just kill the 0.96

00:11:09.200 baby whom you have acknowledged is alive. First of all, calling pregnancy simply discomfort is 0.97

00:11:15.480 belittling the experience. But you can also think it's beautiful and miraculous too, but it's also

00:11:20.220 uncomfortable. There's the white man who will never experience it. But you can think of it, no.

00:11:24.600 I thought that can men become pregnant or no? If you have a uterus. 1.00

00:11:28.920 A man with a uterus. Do you have a uterus, Michael? Because if you don't have a uterus, 0.93

00:11:33.400 then you're not the men that we're talking about. Well, look, I'm not a biologist, so I'm not sure

00:11:36.500 if I'll become pregnant. I do have a little emoji that tells me that these days men can become

00:11:40.120 pregnant. Regardless of that, if you're talking about non-consensual sex, what percentage of

00:11:47.160 pregnancies arise from rape, incest, or involve a threat to the life of the mother? Well, it's hard to

00:11:52.540 say because about three quarters of sexual assault go unreported. So any statistic that I would give to you

00:11:57.720 is going to be inherently inaccurate. I'll give you a statistic, a statistic from the most

00:12:01.600 left-wing source I can give, the Guttmacher Institute. It's the think tank for Planned

00:12:05.300 Parenthood. Less than 1% of abortions take place because of rape, incest, or pose a threat to the

00:12:10.200 life of the mother. So we're talking about an extraordinarily small number.

00:12:11.620 Yeah, according to the ones that have been reported. According to the ones that have been

00:12:14.820 reported. Don't you think if there were a scarier statistic that the most pro-abortion

00:12:21.540 organization in the country might use those statistics?

00:12:23.560 But these statistics are very difficult to collect because, again, sexual assault is a difficult

00:12:29.980 issue when people don't often report them because you see how our political system doesn't often

00:12:34.800 support victims of sexual assault. And so our system doesn't support people reporting sexual

00:12:40.280 assault. Therefore, it is underreported. So this seems difficult for me, Bronte. Well,

00:12:45.240 one, it seems that in the years after the Me Too movement, there was quite a great political impulse

00:12:50.380 to report sexual assault and all sorts of sexual issues. But furthermore, you're telling me that

00:12:54.680 we need to rely on these statistics, trust the science, trust the public health organizations

00:12:58.880 when it's convenient for your argument and convenient for abortion. But we shouldn't trust

00:13:02.860 the statistics when it's inconvenient for your argument and supports the pro-life argument.

00:13:07.420 That is incorrect. You simply don't understand how these statistics work and how they are collected.

00:13:11.960 When you understand and when you analyze statistics, you have to understand the bias

00:13:16.700 and the flaws that they have. And what you are specifically citing statistics that have inherent

00:13:23.060 flaws. That doesn't mean that all of the statistics that we cite are inherently flawed.

00:13:28.380 You have to understand the issue at hand and how those statistics are collected.

00:13:32.000 Okay, fair enough. So you're saying you don't believe these statistics that are inconvenient,

00:13:37.100 but you say you have perfectly good reason not to believe the statistics. I suppose the question,

00:13:40.800 though, is really beyond the statistics, isn't it? If you are acknowledging, Bronte, that the baby is

00:13:47.820 alive, if you are acknowledging that the baby could be given up for adoption, if you are acknowledging

00:13:54.440 that instances of rape are, I think we can acknowledge they're quite rare, at least when we're

00:14:00.440 talking about, even if you dispute some of the statistics, they're the exception, not the rule.

00:14:04.440 If you are acknowledging all sorts of, if you are acknowledging the relatively low maternal mortality

00:14:11.300 rate, if you are acknowledging the advancements in science, if you are acknowledging that very,

00:14:16.680 very few women die every year from illegal abortions and all sorts of the other scare statistics that

00:14:23.880 come out, if you're acknowledging all of those numbers, even beyond that, don't we still have the

00:14:29.660 fact of the baby? Don't we still have the non-utilitarian, non-statistical simple fact that you're talking

00:14:35.620 about a living human being?

00:14:38.120 No. So first off, you said that we have a low mortality rate, which actually we have one of the

00:14:42.740 highest maternal mortality rates amongst all of the developed countries.

00:14:46.420 But it's still quite low. What is the maternal mortality rate, according to the CDC?

00:14:49.300 I don't know it off the top of my head.

00:14:50.640 20 out of 100,000. And that includes communities that do not have very good public health outcomes

00:14:56.360 because of various behaviors and pathologies in the community. So it's relatively quite low.

00:15:00.480 How many women died from illegal abortion the year before Roe versus Wade? 0.98

00:15:04.500 I'm not sure, but that's besides the point.

00:15:06.560 39 women. How many women died from legal abortion the year before Roe versus Wade? 0.99

00:15:10.520 I think what you're misunderstanding is that death is not the only negative outcome of pregnancy.

00:15:14.960 Just because you don't die does not mean that your life and your body is not impacted for the rest of

00:15:20.680 your life. Because a lot of people are left with chronic pain and your body is functionally and

00:15:26.740 structurally altered. And so death is not the most accurate statistic to determine whether or not

00:15:33.220 pregnancy is a negative experience. 0.98

00:15:35.020 There we go. So we move past the question of death and we say, well, really, forget about death for a

00:15:41.660 second. It's just that it's very uncomfortable. And not only uncomfortable for nine months, it might

00:15:46.160 be uncomfortable for the rest of your life, or it might change your body chemistry,

00:15:49.440 might change the way you look or it might change. Is any of that, Bronte, I'll leave you with this

00:15:53.520 because I know we're way over the time. Is any of that an argument now that we've kind of chipped

00:15:57.120 away? I think at least it's up for the viewers to decide, chipped away at the constitutional argument

00:16:02.260 or the legal argument or the statistical argument or the argument for mortality. Now we get down to,

00:16:06.640 well, it's just, I just don't like what it does to my body. Is that an argument, Bronte,

00:16:10.900 for killing a human being who you admit is alive?

00:16:14.340 Absolutely. Everyone has the right to determine the status of their body. They have the right to

00:16:21.160 decide when and how their body is used. And if you would like to go back to, I know that you've

00:16:27.040 had a lot to say about vaccines and masks. So I don't think it's very confusing for you to

00:16:31.940 understand when you are concerned about certain effects that certain things might have on your

00:16:36.700 body. Someone has every right to decide whether or not they consent to that.

00:16:41.760 Well, my only issue with the masks and all the COVID stuff is that it's very silly and disordered,

00:16:46.200 but I'm not even making some sort of maximal bodily autonomy argument. Regardless though,

00:16:50.780 I think they're a little different because we're acknowledging the baby. So I guess I would leave

00:16:54.860 you with this thought from Naomi Wolf, a well-known feminist, made this point in the 1990s. She said

00:17:01.560 that what the pro-abortion movement needs to be able to do is defend abortion. And she was,

00:17:07.200 and I think still may be a defender of abortion. She said, we need to defend abortion by acknowledging

00:17:12.680 the baby, the unborn baby. We need to say that the unborn baby is a baby. Stop pretending he's 0.81

00:17:17.920 not a human. Stop pretending he's not alive. Acknowledge that he's a baby and say that for

00:17:21.400 women to be equal, they must be able to kill the baby in all of his humanity. Would you agree with 1.00

00:17:25.720 that statement? What I agree with is that in order to protect and value an unborn, non-viable, 0.99

00:17:34.660 non-sentient life, you have to actively devalue and dehumanize the pregnant person.

00:17:41.820 You cannot pretend to protect unborn life without actively dehumanizing and devaluing the pregnant 0.56

00:17:48.920 person and removing their bodily autonomy. And that is the issue at hand.

00:17:52.800 It seems to me when we treat women as mothers, we are valuing them. I think it's devaluing women 1.00

00:17:58.700 to use them for sex and try to avoid the consequences of sex by killing the baby and 0.99

00:18:02.600 then pretending it's somehow legitimate because the baby is not sentient. So as though we could 0.99

00:18:07.120 kill someone in a coma or as though someone who were asleep, the baby were not particularly 1.00

00:18:11.060 conscious as though we could kill people who had mental disabilities. I don't think any of those 0.99

00:18:14.740 arguments really work. And I think, I think the issue that's at heart here is that you are

00:18:19.460 suggesting that, uh, women, uh, being used as vessels for sexual pleasure without dealing with 0.90

00:18:27.720 the consequences of sex, namely the creation of human beings, that that is somehow more liberating

00:18:33.340 and more empowering than women coming together, uh, in love and giving that love with a man to a

00:18:38.820 human being. I think that's what it really comes down to.

00:18:40.920 I find it interesting that whenever you talk about women having sex, you say that we are used

00:18:45.140 and that proves the fact. No, not whenever, not whenever only, no, no, only in your version of 0.57

00:18:49.440 not, not in, I don't think women should be used for sexual pleasure. Incorrect. It does. It seems 1.00

00:18:53.660 like men still believe that sex is something that they do to women and not. No, no, no. You must

00:18:59.600 have misheard me, Bronte. I said that men and women, no, I, and I don't think I did, but that's up for

00:19:03.960 the listeners to decide. I said that the, the more valuing, liberating, flourishing view of sex is that

00:19:10.080 men and women come together because they are complimentary. They love one another. They join together in

00:19:14.160 marriage and they create new human life. And that's a beautiful, miraculous, wonderful thing.

00:19:17.980 And I think that the view of the pro-abortion movement is that women ought to be used as, uh,

00:19:24.380 merely, uh, vessels for sexual pleasure with, with an out of accountability such that if there is a

00:19:31.920 product of love or maybe not so much love, namely a child that comes out of that sexual union, that 1.00

00:19:37.760 that baby ought to be killed. I think that's a devaluing of women, uh, rather than a valuing or a 1.00

00:19:42.580 liberation. Minimizing women's value to the role of motherhood is simply misogynistic.

00:19:49.540 Minimizing. I think that's maximizing, frankly. I think, I think the universe worldview,

00:19:54.140 which is obviously flawed. Well, I don't know. We, we were both born of mothers and I'm quite

00:19:58.200 happy for that value that was added to my life. And I'm very happy that my mother consented to the

00:20:02.760 pregnancy that brought me forth, but I would never want my mother to bring me into the world against

00:20:07.200 her will. All right. Uh, I, I, I mean, yeah, I, I don't think that, uh, I don't think our discussion

00:20:13.920 of will or value or any of those things, I, I, I think it has boiled down to this, this particular

00:20:20.720 point of, of what the body is for, right? I mean, isn't that kind of what we're talking about here

00:20:26.080 is, is our body for, is sex for the maximal individual pursuit of pleasure or is it for something

00:20:35.040 else? Is it for a baby? Is it for, uh, unitive love? Is it for something beyond just our own

00:20:41.160 desires? Your body is whatever you want it to be used for. That is the basis of consent and bodily

00:20:47.660 autonomy. You cannot decide what the use and value of someone's body is for them. And that is the root

00:20:53.900 of the pro-choice stance. What about the, what about the body of the baby in the abortion?

00:20:58.940 When the baby, when the baby lacks autonomy and it requires the body of an autonomous person in order

00:21:04.800 to live, that autonomous person must exercise their bodily autonomy. And at any point they must

00:21:09.840 consent to supporting that possible life. Must exercise. All right. I'm way over as usual,

00:21:15.100 Bronte, but I, listen, I really appreciate your coming on. Uh, it's, uh, takes, takes a lot of

00:21:19.440 chutzpah. I know there's a lot of sexual confusion these days, but it takes cojones to come on a 0.99

00:21:23.520 conservative show and discuss the issue. Uh, I, I hope that, uh, as you think about this issue and stew on 0.98

00:21:29.200 it some more, that, uh, your eyes are opened to the reality of the situation, but I, I appreciate your

00:21:34.600 coming on in any case, Bronte Remzik, where can people find you? Absolutely. They can find me

00:21:38.820 on TikTok at Bronte Remzik. I also have my website is bekindandcurious.com. All right. Thank you,

00:21:44.820 Bronte. Appreciate it. Now, now that we have solved the issues of the world and resolved the most

00:21:50.140 pressing, uh, political problem in the entire country, when we're talking about proper uses

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00:22:58.540 rockauto.com. You can thank me later. The, the, I'm really glad Bronte came on the show

00:23:05.840 that she didn't quite go all the way to the Naomi Wolf statement, but I think she expressed that

00:23:13.380 view, which is, yeah, I was afraid that Bronte was going to say, no, it's not a baby. No, he's not

00:23:18.180 alive. No, it doesn't really matter. But Bronte said, no, the baby is alive. It's just that for women to be 1.00

00:23:24.660 equal, we need to, we need to be able to kill the baby. It's a, it's a ghastly argument, but I am 1.00

00:23:32.160 glad that she took it beyond, beyond the issue of even consent, right? She took it beyond, she just

00:23:40.300 said, no, this is an act of, this is an act of the will that I am going to force onto my baby and I'm

00:23:47.400 willing to stand by it. It's, it's ghastly, but it, it's a little more honest than a lot of the

00:23:52.560 pro-abortion arguments that one typically hears. It seems to me her, the weakest part of her argument

00:23:59.200 was on the constitution because she said, well, there's some general right to privacy. We have

00:24:02.460 no idea where it is, but don't worry. It's somewhere. We'll find it somewhere. And so that's

00:24:07.400 why you have the right to an abortion. That, that doesn't really hold water. Roe versus Wade held

00:24:11.340 that you could kill a baby based on a trimester system. This was partially overruled in Planned 0.70

00:24:16.200 Parenthood v. Casey in 1992 and it replaced the trimester system with a viability system.

00:24:21.700 So once the baby is viable, then you can have restrictions on abortion. But even viability

00:24:27.140 is very difficult because modern medical technology has moved that scale so far back that, that

00:24:32.420 viability is always going to be a moving target. Uh, now, uh, the Dobbs case is deciding whether

00:24:38.920 or not there's a right to an abortion at all. I don't think there is, but there, there are 0.97

00:24:42.340 two, two arguments that the conservatives can make and the pro-lifers can make here. One

00:24:46.560 is that it's the sort of, uh, Scalia argument that abortion is simply not mentioned in the

00:24:51.160 constitution. This is an issue for the legislatures and this is an issue for the states. There is

00:24:55.120 a stronger argument, I think, which was recently pushed by the legal scholars, John Finnis

00:24:59.700 and, uh, Robbie George, uh, who argued in a brief on the Dobbs case that actually the Supreme

00:25:06.060 Court does have a right to determine abortion policy because the 14th amendment to the United 0.99

00:25:11.000 States constitution prohibits abortion. And the reason for that is that people have equal 0.99

00:25:17.140 protection under the laws. And they make a really strong argument that, uh, that even,

00:25:22.960 even the phrase born persons refer to babies who have not yet been born. And the argument

00:25:29.260 for this goes back to Blackstone's commentaries, probably the most famous treatise on the English

00:25:34.900 common law published before the American revolution, which says explicitly that babies in the mother's

00:25:39.980 womb are for all intents and purposes of the law already born. And we know that this was 0.78

00:25:45.500 in the minds of the people who were writing the 14th amendment because the 14th amendment

00:25:49.820 is based on the civil rights act of 1866. And you see in the debates regarding the civil

00:25:55.120 rights act of 1866, you see direct references to this sort of thing in Blackstone and elsewhere.

00:26:00.120 So we don't need a crystal ball. You don't need to take out your Noel Stradamus hat to think,

00:26:04.320 well, what did the framers really mean? What do these words really mean? We actually know there's

00:26:09.060 a lot of writing and a lot of debate on the issue. That would be a stronger argument.

00:26:14.160 Regardless though, the argument that seems to have won the day if the Alito case is,

00:26:19.180 or if the Alito opinion in the court is legitimate, which it would appear to be,

00:26:23.680 is that the issue is going to go back to the states and the issue is going to go back

00:26:26.700 to the legislatures. And so it's not the end of the pro-life movement. Really,

00:26:30.020 it's only the very beginning. Uh, this is going to get much more heated, much more hot.

00:26:36.700 We can go back to Anna Kasparian on, on the young Turks who made another, not legal, 0.73

00:26:42.320 not scientific, not medical argument, but another emotional plea as to why we should have legal

00:26:49.580 abortion. We don't even have paid family leave. We don't even have affordable childcare in this

00:26:55.940 freaking country. Okay. And the people who fight against those kinds of laws are Republicans. 0.96

00:27:02.360 And yet- What do you want them to do with their kids when they have to go to work?

00:27:07.540 What do you want them to do? What do you want them to do? I want them to answer that freaking

00:27:11.420 question. Answer the question. Journalists, ask them the question. Ask them. Ask them. 0.99

00:27:19.020 Isn't it amazing?

00:27:19.980 Ask them. Ask them the question. God. Okay, I'll answer. Anna, I'll answer the question. It's okay.

00:27:28.940 What do you want mothers to do with their kids? Raise them. That would be one idea. What do you 1.00

00:27:33.720 want mothers to do with their kids? Yeah, they could raise their kids would be one option. 1.00

00:27:38.080 But what about when they go to work? Well, ideally, they could stay home and their husbands could go to 0.99

00:27:44.980 work. And I know that that's difficult these days because the way the economy has been restructured.

00:27:49.100 Well, ideally, hopefully, we can rework the American economy such that you can support a 1.00

00:27:55.560 family on one income. That would be my ideal solution. And Blake Masters running in Arizona

00:28:00.400 is calling for that sort of thing. J.D. Vance, the Senate candidate who just won the Ohio GOP primary,

00:28:06.460 he's calling for that sort of thing. We had that for a long time in this country. That would be a

00:28:10.540 solution to that question. Well, what about single mothers? Well, we could discourage divorce 0.99

00:28:16.460 and we could encourage marriage. What are we going to do? What if you just can't raise the kid,

00:28:21.980 you don't feel you're capable? Well, you could give the kid up for adoption. You could do literally

00:28:26.280 anything else other than kill the kid, right? How about we try that? Simple answers to this. You 0.99

00:28:33.160 don't need to get all heated and angry and emotional. Very often when people get heated and angry and

00:28:38.300 emotional, it shows that they don't have a very solid grasp on the situation. But what the libs

00:28:43.840 are so furious about this that they're going to upend all sorts of norms and traditions. You know,

00:28:49.800 right now, our economy is very upended, which is why you've got to check out Alto IRA. Right now,

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00:29:51.560 altoira.com slash Michael. Jen Psaki, speaking on behalf of the president, she was asked, will Joe Biden

00:30:00.060 accept a Supreme Court opinion that overrules Roe versus Wade and overrules Planned Parenthood v. Casey?

00:30:07.220 And Jen Psaki didn't quite answer. If the Supreme Court does move to strike down Roe, should Americans

00:30:14.140 be prepared to accept that decision as legitimate? And would President Biden accept that decision as

00:30:21.020 legitimate? Well, I can't speak for what actions could be possible on the legal front. I would point

00:30:26.940 any of the Department of Justice on that. But what I can tell you will happen is, and this is what we

00:30:32.020 are preparing for the possibility of, that if Roe were to fall, abortion would probably be illegal in

00:30:37.960 about half the states in the country, up to 26 states, particularly in the South, the Midwest, and West.

00:30:44.800 It sounds like you're saying then that's a yes, he would consider this a legitimate decision.

00:30:48.440 Well, there is not even a decision yet. We don't know the validity of the, we know that this is a

00:30:53.840 leaked document. It is not the final opinion. So I just can't speak to that hypothetically at this

00:30:57.800 point in time. Of course you can speak to that. What are you talking about? It's a leaked opinion.

00:31:02.380 It's a, it's an opinion that everyone has been expecting for a long time, which is that the

00:31:07.200 Supreme Court has overruled Roe versus Wade. Will the president accept that? Well, I just, I don't know.

00:31:12.020 I can't even imagine that. What are you talking about? You Democrats have been fundraising on this

00:31:14.940 for 50 years on the threat of overruling Roe versus Wade. You, you certainly can imagine that.

00:31:20.780 It's a very simple answer. Yes, the president respects the Supreme Court. Yes, the president

00:31:25.420 respects the separation of powers and our constitutional structure and our democracy.

00:31:29.860 Oh, wait a second. No, you don't respect any of that stuff when it's not convenient for you.

00:31:34.380 I never want to hear it again. I never want to hear about January 6th and our sacred democracy.

00:31:40.780 When you walk into the Capitol, the sacred temple of democracy, you don't believe any of that 1.00

00:31:44.920 crap. You don't believe that for one second. Because the moment that the Supreme Court 0.99

00:31:51.800 rightly upholds and interprets the constitution, you suggest, yeah, we're not going to do that.

00:31:59.020 It reminds me of, of the Democrats who made such a big fuss about getting Donald Trump to say that

00:32:04.000 he would accept the results of the 2016 presidential election. And then he won and the Democrats didn't

00:32:08.360 accept the results of the 2016 election. That's what we're talking about. So transparent. By the way,

00:32:14.100 we're getting more wins from the Supreme Court. There's a big win just came out, totally separate

00:32:18.440 from the abortion issue. This was on the First Amendment. There was a case in Boston over at

00:32:24.620 the Boston City Hall. There are multiple flagpoles that are standing there. And one of the flagpoles

00:32:31.480 is open to fly various flags that the community wants to put up. And so they put all sorts of flags

00:32:37.600 up there. And a Christian group wanted to fly a flag. And Boston City Hall said, absolutely not.

00:32:42.720 You can't do that. The Supreme Court just ruled that that was a violation of the Christian group's

00:32:48.360 First Amendment rights. The city had already approved more than 280 flag raisings over a dozen years.

00:32:53.540 They only rejected one. And that was Camp Constitution's Christian flag. So this was a 0.87

00:32:59.080 unanimous Supreme Court decision. Even the libs went on with this and said, no, you can't. You can't just

00:33:04.620 single out the Christians and say that you don't get speech. But every other group in the country 0.56

00:33:09.420 does get speech. This was a really good opinion. And actually, Justice Stephen Breyer, who is a

00:33:14.060 liberal justice on the court, he even got a snarky little comment in there about how ugly Boston City

00:33:18.800 Hall is. So he said that the flagpole at issue stands at the entrance of Boston City Hall, built in

00:33:24.820 the late 1960s. Boston City Hall is a raw concrete structure, an example of the brutalist style.

00:33:29.900 Critics of the day heralded it as a public building that articulates its functions with strength,

00:33:33.960 dignity, grace, and even glamour. The design has since proved somewhat more controversial.

00:33:38.960 See Boston City Hall named world's ugliest building, which is true. It is one of the ugliest buildings

00:33:45.260 in the world. So this was, generally speaking, a wonderful decision for conservatives, for Christians. 0.98

00:33:52.340 And yet I knew, I know even as I read this, I knew putting my little Nolstradamus hat on,

00:33:58.880 taking on my crystal ball, I knew this is going to be used by the Satanists.

00:34:01.880 And not two days later, the Satanists come out and they say that they want to raise their flag at

00:34:08.840 City Hall. And the leader, the co-founder of the Satanic Temple says, religious liberty is a bedrock

00:34:15.360 principle in a democracy and religious liberty is dependent upon government viewpoint neutrality.

00:34:20.480 Therefore, we want to raise the Satanic flag over City Hall. This is going to split people,

00:34:26.080 even on the right. The hardcore libertarian types are probably going to say, yeah, let the Satanists 0.91

00:34:32.740 raise their flag. Viewpoint neutrality, man. And the conservative people are going to say,

00:34:37.960 no, no, we're not, we're not going to tolerate Satanist flags flying above City Hall.

00:34:43.540 So who's right? Well, according to the principle that the Satanists articulated,

00:34:49.900 any flag should fly, right? He said that we need viewpoint neutrality. The government cannot have

00:34:55.300 any views on any matter whatsoever. It's the same thing that Anna Kasparian was articulating

00:35:00.940 at the top of the show. I don't, I hate Christianity and I'm not a Christian, but you can have your 0.85

00:35:05.600 Christianity. Just don't impose it on me, she says, as she's imposing her views on us. That's the,

00:35:11.140 that's the Satanist position, viewpoint neutrality. Conservatives know there's no such thing as

00:35:16.760 neutrality. First of all, here's a little history check. Here's a good rule of thumb. What would

00:35:21.380 Washington do? What would the founding fathers do? What would the men who built our country do?

00:35:25.380 Do you think they would, they would exalt the raising of a satanic flag as the high point of the

00:35:32.040 blessing of liberty? No, I don't think so. I think they would run the Satanists out of

00:35:35.460 town on a rail and they would, they would probably deport them from the country. So no. So what

00:35:40.460 happened? How did we end up in this spot? Well, the view that, that this guy articulated, viewpoint

00:35:44.780 neutrality, comes in recent years from a 1995 Supreme Court case, Rosenberg versus Rectors and

00:35:53.020 Visitors of the University of Virginia. This, this case is really the beginning of our national

00:35:59.040 obsession with viewpoint neutrality. And, and conservatives and Christians have, have really embraced this

00:36:05.200 idea of viewpoint neutrality because at the moment it's protecting religious people, or it seems to

00:36:10.100 be protecting religious people from the predations of an atheist culture. But it's a silly idea. 0.92

00:36:14.680 There, there is, of course there's no neutrality. Of course there is no, of course a political 0.89

00:36:19.800 community has the right and the obligation to say that some things are good and some things are bad.

00:36:24.200 Every political community in the history of the world has held something sacred and, and held other

00:36:29.220 things taboo. There's no avoiding that. We can bury our heads in the sand and pretend otherwise,

00:36:32.960 but that's not the case. We have sacred images today. Unfortunately, the sacred images in our

00:36:37.580 country are the pride flag. The sacred images are the face of George Floyd, the sacred images,

00:36:42.520 but we have them and we have a whole liturgical calendar. We have a culture and we have ultimately

00:36:49.260 religious views that must be held because all politics ultimately comes down to religion,

00:36:54.780 whether Anna Kasparian or the head of the satanic temple want to admit it or not. Okay.

00:36:59.980 We're talking about important things here, folks, life and death. You are going to die, 0.97

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00:37:25.200 your business, to take care of the things you're leaving behind? Okay. If you do not have a will

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00:38:18.800 today. When you look at our culture all around us, you'll notice that it is reflecting

00:38:24.660 everything except for what we believe. So it's time to build our own culture. That's what we're

00:38:28.560 doing here at The Daily Wire. We're taking on Hollywood. We're taking on razor companies that

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00:38:52.800 We'll be right back with a lot more. Speaking of demonic activity, the Secretary of Health and Human

00:39:09.240 Services, Xavier Becerra, is now publicly defending irreversible sex mutilation for children.

00:39:17.360 Could you explain what irreversible top and bottom sex change surgeries are and why that is on the

00:39:29.940 portal as well? Senator, as you've just indicated, there are many different types of procedures that

00:39:38.260 can be deployed. What I will say to you is, again, in any case, no individual, no patient will proceed

00:39:46.160 forward unless his or her doctor has advised of the procedure. And it is considered by the FDA and

00:39:55.200 others who have to go ahead and certify a medicine or a procedure to be safe and effective.

00:39:59.800 So I'll try to distill it into a more simple form. In what case would it be appropriate

00:40:06.360 to perform irreversible sex change surgery on kids? Those decisions are made by that individual

00:40:15.760 in consultation with physician and caregivers. And no decision would be made without having

00:40:23.560 consulted appropriately. The decision will be made by the kids. Hold on. I thought the whole point of

00:40:28.720 kids is that they can't make decisions. They can't give consent. That's why we have consent laws. 1.00

00:40:33.100 That's why we say that a 16-year-old can't consent to have a one-night stand because that kind of a

00:40:40.300 sexual decision is too great. And we as a society have decided that we should not allow 16-year-olds 1.00

00:40:47.140 to make that kind of decision. And yet we're going to make, if we're not going to allow a 16-year-old 0.62

00:40:51.120 to make a fleeting sexual decision, why would we allow a six-year-old to make a permanent

00:40:56.420 irreversible sexual decision? It doesn't make a lot of sense. But it's actually the same issue

00:41:03.460 that Bronte was talking about at the top of the show. I was so happy that Bronte didn't just focus

00:41:08.460 on consent or straw man arguments because she got down to the heart of it, which is autonomy.

00:41:12.460 So it's what I want to do. It's my will. We've focused our entire politics on will. I want.

00:41:20.080 Okay, you're even seeing this in some of the reaction to the Supreme Court right now.

00:41:22.920 Why are we listening to the Supreme Court? We have the power. Let's just knock down the 0.96

00:41:27.160 Supreme Court. Let's burn this thing to the ground. That's what people are saying because 1.00

00:41:31.100 they're pursuing a politics of pure will, divorced from logic and divorced from reality. And that's

00:41:37.780 not good. So when we do that, I want to be as charitable as I can to Xavier Becerra. Maybe he's

00:41:43.380 a groomer. Maybe he's a creep. Maybe he's a weirdo. But probably he's not. He's probably just 0.94

00:41:46.680 deluded. And he's probably just in the thrall of this ideology that says that all that matters is

00:41:53.980 our own exercise of the will. And little kids and little babies create a problem for this because

00:41:58.760 they do not have fully developed wills. They cannot really exercise their autonomy whatsoever.

00:42:04.900 And we have a responsibility to restrain our autonomy and our desires so that we can take care

00:42:10.140 of those children. That's the difference between a politics that's entirely about rights and

00:42:15.280 entitlement and a politics that recognizes that, no, we're not born free-floating atoms,

00:42:18.960 that actually we're born with responsibilities and duty and we're born into a family and into

00:42:23.580 a legal community and into a political community. We have responsibilities, especially to kids,

00:42:31.480 which brings up the most important national saga, of course, Kim Kardashian and Kanye West and

00:42:38.400 Ray J and the sex tape. This story has been floating around really for 15 years now,

00:42:43.940 but it's come back up in the news because Kim Kardashian is plugging a new show.

00:42:48.060 And what Kim Kardashian said was that her son was looking on the computer and saw an ad pop up

00:42:53.520 for new scenes from Kim Kardashian's sex tape. And she came out and made a big news story out of this

00:42:59.360 and said, I'm being victimized again. And I was already victimized when the tape was leaked so many

00:43:04.220 years ago. And I'm the victim of revenge porn or something like that. And now there's new stuff.

00:43:09.720 And there was this whole long saga. And Kim Kardashian's co-star in the sex tape just came

00:43:14.380 out and said, that is not what really went down. I did not. I'm not the bad guy here. I did not

00:43:20.980 secretly leak this tape. Actually, Kim, you and I agreed to release this tape and your mother

00:43:26.240 brokered the deal. And we've all been business partners on this tape for 15 years and we're still

00:43:30.360 making money on it. That was his argument. Again, I don't know exactly who's telling the truth here,

00:43:36.400 but there have been rumors for a long time that Kim Kardashian was in on this because she saw that

00:43:42.420 Paris Hilton's sex tape made her a big star. And so there was a planned release of the sex tape before 0.81

00:43:47.080 Kim Kardashian's TV show. Regardless of what really happened here, this is awful for the kids.

00:43:53.820 This is awful. It's awful to put kids in this situation. It's awful to put your whole personal

00:43:58.760 life on television all the time for years and years for everyone to see. It's awful if the story is

00:44:03.140 true that Mrs. Kardashian, what's her, Kris Jenner pimped out her daughter to make some money. That 1.00

00:44:09.940 would be very sad if that is true. And it would be much better if we just didn't allow this stuff.

00:44:15.300 Okay, what then? What the overruling, the potential overruling of Roe versus Wade is showing us

00:44:22.840 is that we actually have a lot of rights in the political community. When a bunch of robed lawyers

00:44:28.080 on the Supreme Court don't take our rights away, when a bunch of robed technocrats in the CDC and

00:44:33.320 the NIH like Dr. Fauci don't take all of our rights away, we the people have a lot of rights.

00:44:37.400 There are boundaries set by the Constitution, but they're relatively limited. And then we the people

00:44:41.980 can kind of decide how we want to live. What if we passed a law that said, hey, no porn. Porn is

00:44:47.780 illegal. We've had laws like that in this country before. What if we passed a law that said, hey,

00:44:52.920 no more porn. Kim Kardashian wouldn't have to worry about her kid finding her sex tape ads on the 1.00

00:44:58.480 internet. Almost certainly wouldn't have to be much, much harder to distribute that sort of thing.

00:45:03.340 Furthermore, we wouldn't have the Kardashians. Can you imagine how great that would be? That's,

00:45:06.900 that's what I'm going to run on when I, when I try to pass this bill. Okay, no more weird internet

00:45:11.820 sex tape porn stuff. I'm going to get out there and I'm going to say my strongest argument is had we

00:45:15.880 had this law in place in 2007, we wouldn't be subjected to the plague of the Kardashians and all of

00:45:20.760 their TV shows and all of, all of their tawdry culture. What if we just did that? We can do that.

00:45:26.920 We have the right. And Anna Kasperian can cry about it. And lots of libs can cry about how we 1.00

00:45:33.620 have the right to set our own community standards here. But we do. Okay. And we have to do it.

00:45:38.260 Someone's going to set it. Either it's going to be the radicals or it's going to be us. What if we say

00:45:41.260 no more, no more chopping off the genitals of the little kids, no more cross sex hormones for 1.00

00:45:45.300 seven-year-olds. We can do that. What if we said no more transgender surgery for anyone because it's 1.00

00:45:49.880 wrong and it harms everybody and it helps nobody. We can do that. We can do that. We have political

00:45:54.440 power if we are willing to exercise it. Okay. We got to talk about really tangible things here.

00:46:00.440 When you, when you talk about the digital world, whether you're talking about digital sex tapes

00:46:04.380 or anything else, there was a, a video that went viral about a week ago that I loved so much.

00:46:09.780 Everyone was making fun of the girls in this video. I thought they made a great point. The question

00:46:14.260 was if I offered you right now, one Bitcoin or $100 bill, which would you take? $100 cash or a

00:46:22.720 Bitcoin? Okay. What would you rather take? $100 cash or a Bitcoin? I got to say $100 cash. $100 cash

00:46:31.920 every single time. Why, why, why? Bitcoin is a little fake to me. Not going to lie. I, first of all,

00:46:38.800 don't know what Bitcoin is. Second of all, it seems like a scam. But it's at $40,000.

00:46:43.980 I don't give a shit. $100 cash in my hand? $40,000? What is that? Dollars. What are we getting? 0.99

00:46:50.600 We're getting straight dollars. Like $100 cash in my hand feels way more tangible and way more real

00:46:58.340 than like Bitcoin. Like I don't, I don't even know what Bitcoin is. Now I know these girls are 0.98

00:47:04.360 totally wrong and misguided, except they're obviously right. Yes, it's true. Today, a Bitcoin

00:47:09.840 is worth whatever, 40 grand or something. And the $100 is $100. But the point they're making,

00:47:15.920 which is that Bitcoin seems kind of scammy and fake and weird and not very tangible. That's

00:47:19.520 obviously true. I say this as someone, I've lost money on cryptocurrencies because I thought, oh,

00:47:23.580 this would be a fun kind of currency. It goes up and down and up and down. And it's really just a

00:47:26.340 speculative asset at this point. Unfortunately, because of Joe Biden's inflation, the $100 bill isn't

00:47:30.860 worth very much anymore either. But it does seem more tangible. And beyond this sort of silly viral

00:47:36.360 video where the girls were supposed to pick the Bitcoin, but they said, no, I actually want

00:47:39.900 something tangible. This gives us an important lesson about politics. Offer voters something

00:47:45.140 tangible. The American people are rebelling against the virtual reality that the libs are trying to stuff

00:47:52.240 on us. The telecommuting and the stay in your pod and don't own anything and you'll be happy.

00:47:56.580 And the transgenderism and the transhumanism, people are rebelling against that. You're seeing

00:48:01.040 it in Virginia. You're seeing it in Florida. You're seeing it all around the country.

00:48:04.040 The arguments that are going to win the day on abortion are just looking at the baby. Hey,

00:48:07.220 look, it's a baby. You shouldn't kill babies. That's a bad idea. Don't get in your own head.

00:48:15.500 Don't clench defeat from the jaws of victory. Don't get lost pie in the sky. Offer people tangible

00:48:20.140 stuff. When we're looking ahead to the midterms, when we're looking ahead to 2024, hey,

00:48:24.100 we need cheaper gas. Hey, we need cheaper food. Hey, we need to protect your kids from weirdos 0.94

00:48:28.680 in schools. Leave the crazy, bizarre, virtual reality metaverse theories to the libs. That 0.98

00:48:34.740 is not popular. People want cold, hard cash and cold, hard reality. I'm Michael Knowles.

00:48:40.280 This is The Michael Knowles Show. See you tomorrow.

00:48:47.560 If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to subscribe. And if you want to help spread the

00:48:52.160 word, please give us a five-star review and tell your friends to subscribe. We're available

00:48:57.000 on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever else you listen to podcasts. Also, be sure to check

00:49:02.780 out the other Daily Wire podcasts, including The Ben Shapiro Show, The Andrew Klavan Show,

00:49:07.020 and The Matt Walsh Show.

00:49:08.300 The Michael Knowles Show is produced by Ben Davies. Executive producer, Jeremy Boring.

00:49:13.300 Supervising producer, Mathis Glover. Production manager, Pavel Vidovsky. Editor and associate

00:49:18.600 producer, Danny D'Amico. Associate producer, Justine Turley. Audio mixer, Mike Coromina.

00:49:24.740 And hair and makeup by Cherokee Heart. The Michael Knowles Show is a Daily Wire production.

00:49:29.280 Copyright Daily Wire 2022.

00:49:30.860 Today on The Ben Shapiro Show, not a single major Democrat will condemn the leak of a

00:49:35.480 Supreme Court opinion overturning Roe. Joe Biden says the Trump base is the most extreme

00:49:39.020 political organization in American history, and the Federal Reserve boosts interest rates

00:49:43.380 a full half point. That's today on The Ben Shapiro Show. Give it a listen.

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00:50:14.140 Download Carrot, spelled with a K, and start selling today.

The Michael Knowles Show - May 05, 2022

Ep. 999 - No Roe V. Wade Is Armageddon For Libs

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