Spencer Klavan is STUNNED By Michael's Answer ｜ YES or NO
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 10 minutes
Words per Minute
176.47815
Summary
The Yes or No Game is available for pre-order now, and it's a Christmas gift to you, the listener. It's a card game that tests how well you know your friends and family and loved ones. You can play with up to 9 people and discuss all the most important issues of the day, including: Do aliens exist? What are the merits of vegan suffrage? What do you know about God, life, the universe?
Transcript
00:00:00.120
Skipping leg day is a lot like attending a liberal arts college and staying committed to your cheating girlfriend.
00:00:07.740
In both cases, you are throwing your life away while also acting like a butter-soft simp who just hopes things will work themselves out.
00:00:30.000
Like the former president, I have a major announcement.
00:00:36.520
If you go right now to dailywire.com slash shop, you can get your very own copy of the Yes or No game.
00:00:47.080
Look at this. We've got game pieces in here. We've got a scorecard. We've got cards.
00:00:50.640
This is the real deal. We had an initial run of these. I think we had about 1,000 boxes of this game.
00:01:00.260
And so, unfortunately, I think we would have sold 10,000 of these things had we had them in time for Christmas.
00:01:05.700
You can't get it as a stocking stuffer, but you can pre-order your copy right now.
00:01:09.460
And you should pre-order because I think these are going to sell out to dailywire.com slash shop.
00:01:12.800
You can play with up to nine people. Test how well you know your friends and family and loved ones.
00:01:19.080
Discuss all the most important issues of the day.
00:01:28.620
What do you know about God, life, the whole universe?
00:01:35.440
Get your copy of the Yes or No game in the flesh.
00:01:42.920
We have in the flesh here my very good friend of many, many years.
00:01:50.860
When you buy the game, does it come with the day drinking?
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It does. It does. You can. It's not required that you have a couple of Coca-Colas when you
00:01:57.780
play the game, but you can, and I, for one, encourage it.
00:02:02.060
It does enhance the experience. We have our drinks. I have a bit of a girly drink.
00:02:06.620
You know, I actually think the martini, it's a manly drink.
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It gets a bad rap because people put berries and things.
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That, okay, this is very important. Maybe this is, like, you know, a side piece, but
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If you, like, sugar, if you've got, like, sugar around the rim, you're serving something else.
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I do. I saw this troll on Twitter who said, it was like, you know, all these conservatives,
00:02:38.500
And so I thought, I not only have a beard, I have whiskey neat at 2.30 in the afternoon.
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I am one of those manly conservatives you heard about.
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You know, 2.30 is usually when I go to the dentist.
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Like porn, violent or graphic video games are bad for society and should be banned.
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So I have to say whether you think that's true or not.
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So I say conditionally, it's a real margin call.
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Only because I do think that some video games can warp your mind.
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Like when I was playing Donkey Kong Country as a kid, man, that stuff had me messed up, okay?
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Yeah, I was walking around throwing barrels at people everywhere I went.
00:04:07.000
I was, I never played a lot of video games, but I did get a kick out of Grand Theft Auto.
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It was shocking, but when I was learning to drive, because I had played Grand Theft Auto
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a lot, where all I would ever do is I'd try to hit the guys on the motorcycle and make
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When I was learning to drive, there was a motorcycle coming down the road.
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I had the impulse to veer in and hit him head on.
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And so I think in extreme cases, there should be some regulatory authority to set standards
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But broadly speaking, like I wouldn't ban Call of Duty or something like that.
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Well, somebody obviously knows me because they're trying to, they're trying to mess with me with
00:05:01.060
I mean, I am kind of, not famously, but known as some, like a kind of video game optimist.
00:05:08.260
I think they contain some of the great works of art of our generation.
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I think like as fine art has dithered into abstraction and obscurity, you can actually
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turn on like Final Fantasy and see panoramas like, you know, unlike anything else that's
00:05:22.620
So all of that to say like, I'm a total lib about this.
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And part of this, I think, is probably because my taste in video games is like Crash Bandicoot,
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like Fuzzy McFuzzerson defeats the evil dragon.
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Because in Crash Bandicoot, you don't carjack hookers that shoot them, right?
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And then, so then it's, and I do, I mean, I like like God of War was one of my favorite
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Everything is of war, but the Gears of War game.
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And those are definitely, I wouldn't give them to a child, you know, like, and I think
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like, there's a huge domain of parental supervision and engagement.
00:06:05.940
It's one of those problems that goes like way deeper than the thing that is the tip of
00:06:11.340
It's like, well, the breakdown of society, like, you know, the failure of the modern
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American family, like the corrosion of our values, all of it, like, you know, you'd have
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to rectify all of that before I would be like, and you also should ban the video.
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But I, I mean, like, like movies, I definitely don't think, you know, I think there should
00:06:26.860
be some restrictions in place to make sure kids aren't playing like Grand Theft Auto.
00:06:32.440
So since we both got it right, we just chose to drink anyway.
00:06:36.940
I, I, that's, I, I can't, the, the glass is too appealing.
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And it's, the other thing, I've, I've really restricted my drinking on this show in some
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recent episodes because we shot the thing at like 10 in the morning.
00:06:48.500
And even for me, all right, even I am not that much of a degenerate.
00:07:04.580
One of the most overrated writers in history is Shakespeare.
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I did not know that Stephen Crowder thinks this.
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That Shakespeare is the most overrated writer in history?
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Like, there's just a huge, like that chick that wrote the, uh, the poem at the inauguration.
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I mean, I saw, I was in a bookshop the other day and I saw two collections of her poetry.
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The things that I don't know because I know that is probably too depressing to think about.
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Like, there's some line of poetry I've forgotten, but I know Amanda Gorman's.
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I remember a line of literary criticism where the late, great literary critic Harold Bloom
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So, I'm going to make the strongest possible case for this.
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I mean, because, for one thing, it's impossible to be more highly rated than Shakespeare.
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I mean, you know, if you leave aside the woke crazies who, like, is that white man, whatever,
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you know, he is kind of, his name is, like, synonymous with literary excellence.
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And I at least think that there are some other writers in the English canon, Milton, for
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instance, even if just, you're just restricting yourself to, like, English language poetry.
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There's definitely other contenders for the throne of the great poet of English.
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And the other thing you could kind of adduce, as perhaps Crowder does, who knows,
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is that, you know, Shakespeare's reputation is kind of invented in the generations after
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his death by, you know, Johnson and Boswell and, you know, those great, who put him on
00:09:01.020
the stage with, like, Aeschylus and he's our, you know, he's the English languages.
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But I don't know, man, you know, for God's sake, let us sit upon the ground and tell sad
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stories of the death of kings, how some have been deposed, some sleeping killed, some poisoned
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by their wives, all murdered, for within the hollow crown that rounds the mortal temples
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And there the antic sits, allowing him a breath, a little space, to monarchize, be feared, and
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kill with looks, and, humored thus, comes at the last, and with a little pin, bores through
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Cover your heads, and mock not flesh and blood with solemn ceremony, for you have but mistook
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I live with bread, like you, taste, want, feel, grief, need, friends, subjected thus, how
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Remember, Jew, though justice be thy plea, consider that no, it's one of the more politically
00:10:23.460
I was going to say, you're getting us banned even without the bad questions.
00:10:26.860
I was getting us banned by reading Merchant of Venice.
00:10:29.800
Ultimately, when you're faced with a genius of that totality, which really, I mean, the
00:10:35.700
language aside, the completeness of his vision of human life, the capacity of it.
00:10:40.320
I mean, we've been talking a lot about Dante lately, and I think he's maybe the person you
00:10:44.220
could put next to Shakespeare for that just, like, totalizing vision of human life.
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It's got to come from one mind, and I have no, I've seen no evidence why it shouldn't have
00:10:54.500
And if it was some guy named Bob, like, what difference does it make?
00:10:59.800
I love when they say Shakespeare was actually, he was actually multiple people.
00:11:03.440
And I think, yeah, because you know, you know what produces really great art?
00:11:08.880
Committees are known for their artistic vision and skill, right?
00:11:15.380
I am more inclined to believe that the earth is flat than that bodies were recovered from
00:11:25.560
Okay, after we answer this, we have to diagram.
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Actually, I'm seeing many verbs, and I'd like a lot, yeah, snaking.
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Okay, so I am trying to decide whether you think it's more likely that the earth is flat
00:11:48.920
I thought it was easy, and then it turned out to be hard.
00:12:08.120
No, I am much more inclined to believe in the flat earth theory, since the earth actually
00:12:20.380
Okay, so that was why I instantly went for, you know, and then I thought, actually, he's
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probably going to say that Owen Barfield, yes, go on.
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The definition of an angel or a demon is that they're pure spirit.
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So they didn't, whatever they found at Roswell or whatever, you know, Soviet spy planes, even
00:12:43.720
if they found a demon, they wouldn't be able to grab his body.
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What about what Beatrice says to Dante when he asks her whether the blessed souls really
00:12:59.140
She says, they showed themselves to you here, not because this is their sphere, they all
00:13:02.760
live in the Empyrean, but as a sign for you, since this is suited to your senses.
00:13:06.400
And in this way, the Bible condescends, right, to speak of God as having hands and feet, but
00:13:12.240
All of this to say, right, like, couldn't, it might be the case that although angels and
00:13:20.420
I suppose that's true, but I guess the way I picture that, because we entertain angels
00:13:24.720
And I could give you examples where I'm quite confident this actually happened.
00:13:29.760
But I'll tell you, I didn't reach out and grab them.
00:13:32.320
I kind of wonder if there really were demons or something, you know, at Roswell.
00:13:36.020
The moment that the cops went out there to get him, it'd be like a B ghost movie, where
00:13:41.840
they go grab him and just feel like, you know, they just kind of fall right in.
00:13:45.680
Now, so, I was correct on the Flat Earth thing?
00:13:52.480
You're more inclined to believe in the Flat Earth.
00:13:54.080
Well, but only, is that what you said, that I'm more inclined to believe?
00:13:57.880
But only in this Owen Barfield-y way, which we should probably define since people are going
00:14:02.280
to be watching as I'm asking, which is to say that the notion that there is a scientific
00:14:09.940
theory of physical space that doesn't simply correspond to our perceptions, but actually
00:14:18.800
outlines the bedrock of reality, is heretical and a scientific fallacy.
00:14:24.480
This is why, right, this is the problem with Galileo.
00:14:28.100
It's not that he thinks the Earth revolves around the sun.
00:14:31.700
One, it's that he thinks there is an answer to, does the Earth revolve around the sun
00:14:35.480
or vice versa, which reflects some absolute fundamental truth, which makes a fundamental
00:14:43.560
Sometimes, if people ask the Galileo question, they'll say, does the Earth revolve around the
00:14:48.200
And I'll say, man is the center of the universe.
00:14:50.120
They'll say, but, you know, does the Earth revolve?
00:14:51.860
I'll say, the best way I have of describing reality is that man is at the center of the universe.
00:15:06.260
Well, literally and you're telling me that the fundament of reality is some stupid rock?
00:15:14.040
And, I mean, it is, in fact, true, so far as I understand, that you can describe the
00:15:18.800
universe as, you know, revolving around the Earth.
00:15:22.300
I mean, it's just the equations are a lot more complicated.
00:15:24.240
But the fact that they're more complicated doesn't mean that they don't actually describe,
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you know, they don't predict the outcomes of our observations.
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That is all, like, it is a kind of a fiction, a pernicious fiction, that when we write math,
00:15:39.340
which predicts physical outcomes, we are somehow getting something more real than the experience,
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the quote-unquote subjective, which by which people usually mean arbitrary, right?
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The experience of the world as it occurs to our senses.
00:15:55.420
And so the argument that the Earth is flat is not that if you walked far enough, you'd fall off it.
00:16:00.880
But that for your, in your experience of the world, it is flat.
00:16:05.940
You don't have to account for its curvature as you walk.
00:16:09.340
So, yeah, I think that's true, although that's not what the conspiracy theory...
00:16:14.000
I guess the conspiracy theory is also scientistic and is also referring to a physical.
00:16:22.980
Well, the question that keeps coming up, what is a woman?
00:16:26.160
And, unfortunately, the conservative answer keeps being two X chromosomes and a uterus.
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Even that's better than two X chromosomes and a uterus.
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That's a much more accurate and descriptive answer.
00:16:42.560
Yeah, I would say, you know, it's a two-legged rational animal, you know, of the female gender.
00:16:48.080
And, yeah, there is this problem, and this happens a lot, I think.
00:16:54.720
It occurred to me just the other day that there's a certain form of biblical literalism,
00:17:01.460
Because you start out with the true statement that everything in the Bible is true.
00:17:05.260
And then you defend that statement by trying to claim that every word of the Bible corresponds to a physical event in space and time.
00:17:15.040
Which, you know, again, if you chase this down, you get, like, in the Psalms, you get the earth revolving around the...
00:17:19.820
Or you get the sun, rather, moving across the sky, revolving around the earth, and so forth.
00:17:23.540
But, and this is a con that the libs pull the traditionalists into, which is they say, like, oh, well, you can't prove, you know, show me on a map.
00:17:32.320
And then our response is, like, yes, I can show you on a map.
00:17:37.500
And, of course, the response should be that's a completely childish and untenable view of the world, even according to science.
00:17:43.740
Like, even once you get down to the quantum level, you realize that perception does have this, like, fundamental role to play.
00:17:51.920
Like, oh, it's when these lips, which are made up of these atoms, kind of do this, like, it's like this thing, and then, like, maybe a little, like, a tongue, if you're French, kind of comes in.
00:18:17.440
There's no possible way that a gym selfie could be considered an appropriate thing for a self-respecting man to post on Instagram.
00:18:27.400
Well, you know my answer to this, but I'm not sure I know yours.
00:18:31.120
We're going to spill a little bit of tea here, I think.
00:18:56.020
And I must have gotten this from you, so I guess it's sort of cheating, but when I think of arete, when I think of real excellence, okay,
00:19:04.520
I think, yes, we can demonstrate our intellectual, yes, oh, and yes, we can demonstrate some virtues through acts of kindness and charity,
00:19:13.220
but also we need to post-physique is what we need to do, because the physical excellence matters, too.
00:19:19.520
This is in the central, one of the central chapters of my book, which I should probably talk about, because I'm supposed to, like, publish it.
00:19:31.180
It's called How to Save the West, and there's a whole section on the body and the relationship between body and soul.
00:19:34.920
And this is, it's a tricky thing, because I accept the premise of the question, which is, if I were to rephrase it, I would say there's no possible way that most gym selfies that get posted are something that a self-respecting man would post on Instagram.
00:19:54.320
On the other hand, we live in a culture where, in order to break down every standard of objective excellence, we are constantly assaulted with ugliness.
00:20:10.100
That is one of the major kind of means of our, I wouldn't even call it, you know, I mean, leftist is almost too small a term for it.
00:20:19.920
It's like, you know, my friend James Poulos calls it the Borg, right?
00:20:23.100
It's this totalizing, out-of-control kind of sameness.
00:20:27.840
And, you know, in C.S. Lewis's Screwtape Proposes in Toast, he has a perversion of democracy, which is kind of reflected also in, like, de Tocqueville, the total equalizing impulse that I'm as good as you, everything is good as everything else.
00:20:43.280
And, you know, why are we constantly being shown images of obese women in their underwear, right?
00:20:52.900
And the Victoria's Secret billboards and the catalog, it'd have super hot chicks.
00:20:59.520
And the minute you say this, people say, you hate fat people.
00:21:09.860
But the point is not at all what is the range of things it's okay for a person to be.
00:21:23.000
And to deny that there's such a thing as physical excellence is corrosive and demeaning and belittling to people.
00:21:34.540
I know, I say this as an international sex symbol.
00:21:37.460
Let's recognize physical beauty and excellence where it is.
00:21:46.580
America will not correct course and will cease to exist as we know it before 2050.
00:22:18.380
Well, I know that pessimism is like a favorite pastime of the conservative movement.
00:22:25.500
And I'm only saying no because of the absolutism of the prediction, which I reject out of hand.
00:22:30.520
I think nothing is written in the stars until it happens.
00:22:33.080
I also think, you know, things could go terribly wrong.
00:22:36.120
You can always see how things could go terribly wrong.
00:22:38.020
But there's a ton of, you know, energy and excitement also about recognizing the problem,
00:22:43.200
more than I think has been true in a long time.
00:22:52.600
You know, I was wrong because I underestimated your optimism.
00:22:57.520
You were right because you overestimated my optimism.
00:23:02.900
My feeling is that America won't be so fundamentally different in the future from where we are now.
00:23:08.520
It'll just kind of, yeah, we're already on like a kind of a bad path.
00:23:17.560
But there's a difference between a conservative optimist and a conservative pessimist.
00:23:22.760
A conservative pessimist says things can't get any worse.
00:23:26.420
And a conservative optimist says, oh, yes, they can.
00:23:31.520
Yeah, I mean, it's big like, you know, late Western Roman Empire hours.
00:23:42.780
All right, we got to answer some of these questions.
00:24:11.660
It's another one of these hard questions because Paul reaches for the Stoics almost more than
00:24:18.220
I mean, I don't have like a tally, but I feel like he's more into the Stoics than any other
00:24:23.820
And John, the prelude to John's gospel in the beginning was the word is obviously in some
00:24:32.460
But Stoicism full stop is incompatible with Christianity, right?
00:24:38.480
It's the cyclical notion of time, this whole thing that like the soul dissolves into atoms
00:24:44.540
like or whatever the soul is made out of, right?
00:24:49.140
But I think Stoicism is one of the most easily baptizable and most frequently baptized forms.
00:24:54.320
I noticed a lot of kind of tech bros and Silicon Valley types got really into Stoicism in the
00:25:01.040
And I think that is not contrary to what I see as a Christian revival.
00:25:05.420
I think it's sort of part of the Christian revival.
00:25:10.700
This is, I just wrote this whole, we're coming out with this new introduction to the Stoics,
00:25:16.440
We're just reprinting some old translations, but I wrote a forward to it.
00:25:19.280
So I did a lot of this, like, you know, I went on the Reddit forum for Stoicism, which is huge.
00:25:25.480
Yeah, every night, you know, right before bed, I'm...
00:25:27.880
I know, you think you're joking, but it's like half a million people are on it.
00:25:30.560
Like, these Reddit bros be like, you know, scrolling through Epictetus, you know?
00:25:37.240
And I did find a lot of this kind of, it's sort of like Christian atheism, you know?
00:25:41.740
It's like, I like the thing that this delivers, but I don't want to like the bullet of metaphysics of it.
00:25:46.700
And so I did find a lot of people being like, well, you can't really talk about gods anymore.
00:25:52.120
But, you know, it's like, well, look, I mean, the things that appeal about Stoicism are all things that, you know,
00:25:57.100
we come to us through Christianity, like all men are brothers, right?
00:26:08.080
So something must be spiritual about that and it must be real.
00:26:10.580
And I do think there's like a temptation among these people to be like, oh, I got Stoicism, now I have a false.
00:26:18.300
It's like, you think, you think Tidus is epic, you know?
00:26:23.920
Yeah, let me tell you about a little somebody called John of Patmos.
00:26:56.700
I mean, not only is it okay to be white, not a racist statement,
00:27:01.940
but calling it a racist statement is how you end up with actual white supremacists.
00:27:08.540
At a certain point, I think, you know, I'm truly as open-minded, sort of.
00:27:15.680
I'm like the only guy in the conservative movement, probably other than you,
00:27:20.200
And I, and I don't think about race almost ever.
00:27:24.340
But I think, you know, if you're, if you just come up to me and you say like,
00:27:29.620
Yeah, nobody would have ever had to, like, you know, I, it would have never,
00:27:35.040
Like 20 years ago for me or anybody to be like, go out there and pump my fist
00:27:43.460
And so naturally, I think you and I both are fairly affable fellows, you know?
00:27:47.600
We don't want to like go out here carrying signs that say things like, you know,
00:27:53.260
Nobody wants to be, better things to do with my time and more interesting things to say.
00:27:57.020
But like, but if you're going to call it into question, then yeah.
00:28:21.620
We need to talk about grammar, but we'll get to that later.
00:28:23.700
Libertarians are basically communists who either shower or don't live off their parents.
00:28:42.900
I feel like I have to make you drink just to be like nice.
00:28:46.620
Look, some of my best friends are libertarians.
00:28:58.260
The statement's correct because the libertarians and the communists, I think, ultimately share
00:29:07.040
Ultimately, they believe that men are fundamentally individuals born primarily in as much as we
00:29:13.680
have a political life with rights and entitlements.
00:29:17.380
And the commies say we're all individuals, and then they bunch us all up together in their
00:29:20.940
sort of hideous collective, and the libertarians just don't get to that next stage.
00:29:25.000
But both of them reject the reality of man as not merely an individual, but as a social
00:29:30.780
being, as a political animal born into a family, in time and space, into a community, into a
00:29:35.880
nation, with, I think, primarily duties and obligations and traditions.
00:29:44.020
But that's not the primary fact of his political nature.
00:29:47.440
This is a great argument, and it's making me understand, I think, what my answer to this
00:30:02.140
Dostoyevsky, the narrator in Brothers Karamazov, very early on, says, socialism is just the
00:30:15.960
And I think this is an extremely apt statement, and you are basically saying libertarians
00:30:22.540
and communists have the same fundamental idea about human personhood, which is that we are
00:30:30.700
And even though libertarians don't chase this to its logical conclusion, that is the Tower
00:30:36.660
Let us all have one language, one place, just the total uniformity follows on from the idea
00:30:44.620
of the individual as seemingly autonomous, but actually just kind of empty, right?
00:30:49.680
Just consumer A, consumer B. And so my answer is actually, I think, going to be the same
00:30:55.960
as my answer about stoicism, which is to say stoicism alone cannot save. Libertarianism alone
00:31:02.400
is, you know, as like a totalizing philosophy of the world, is basically the metaphysics of
00:31:07.220
communism. But I know a lot of people who have libertarian ideas and leanings about how
00:31:11.820
we should operate within a constrained sphere, who are not really, you know, who think that
00:31:17.520
libertarianism is like an operating system that you can run within an already existing
00:31:23.380
And the critique of libertarianism is, well, that computer is like now completely, has
00:31:28.720
Yeah, it's totally fried, in part because of like an excess of classical liberalism.
00:31:33.700
So, yeah, I don't think you have to drink, but go on.
00:31:39.700
Okay, and by the way, Spencer, I just, I'm going to give you a little show business right
00:31:46.560
They're telling me in my ear that they split this question into two cards.
00:31:55.580
Are they, as the alien, are they giving you like directives?
00:31:59.420
They're speaking when I have an earpiece in and when I don't.
00:32:01.720
This is all those, those computer theorists are going to, on Twitter, they're going to.
00:32:12.480
We are being conditioned so that before the 2024 election, there will be a transgender
00:32:16.100
version of George Floyd along with the subsequent protests and social unrest.
00:32:30.500
I don't know how much it costs or when you're going to get it, but it is going to sell out,
00:32:34.340
But I did that, I did that just because you let me plug my book, so.
00:32:39.840
They're going to, they're going to call this, they'll call it grift, but really it's just
00:32:47.460
Okay, so, um, there will be a transgender version of George Floyd.
00:33:13.840
It's, there's like 12 of them, and I know that they're, they're trying to groom the kids
00:33:17.620
now, so it's, like, 20% plus of Gen Z, according to that one random survey.
00:33:23.460
They're questioning and everything, but, but, uh, no, it doesn't work.
00:33:26.660
There's a lot of kids out there who think they're transgender.
00:33:32.160
Also, it's just, race is the line in America that actually has been an issue from the earliest
00:33:46.380
There was not, like, an actual crime against humanity, like, embedded into our history
00:33:54.480
Um, whereas, you're right, like, the, the whole thing about race in America is that
00:34:00.260
they're actually grabbing onto something truly awful and traumatic in our past.
00:34:05.420
Um, and the other aspect of this is it's too specific.
00:34:09.780
It's like, you know, it's, it's a little tinfoil.
00:34:11.580
Um, but, uh, I certainly think if they could, they would.
00:34:16.960
I mean, the, the version of this that's kind of, that is real is, and this, we're going to
00:34:22.540
get banned for, like, five different reasons off of YouTube.
00:34:29.380
Um, no, the, the version of this that is real is the, like, transgender people are being
00:34:38.800
They kind of have this line that goes on, and that is created to, and also, if you don't
00:34:44.780
pump your kid full of hormones, they'll commit suicide.
00:34:48.540
They totally hold you emotional hostage with all of these things, which are, which are
00:34:53.940
Um, but no, I don't think they can fabricate out of nothing.
00:34:56.700
I mean, I don't think they fabricated George Floyd out of nothing, you know?
00:35:08.440
95% of our political issues in America would be solved if benching 225 pounds was a requirement
00:35:31.220
You know, I, I remember one time, maybe it was Ann Coulter, said we need to repeal the
00:35:38.140
And she's, I'm sure she said it more than one time.
00:35:42.500
And Elisa, this was early on in our sweet little Elisa in my dating life.
00:35:47.440
And she goes, oh my gosh, that's, that's crazy.
00:35:50.260
And I sort of thought, and I said, well, what's the point of voting?
00:35:55.280
Because what, what you are being asked right now, you sweet little Elisa, would you give
00:35:58.880
up your vote to have a better political outcome?
00:36:03.020
So I thought of it and I said, because women vote for Democrats and men vote for Republicans.
00:36:10.840
And I thought, well, young people vote for Democrats.
00:36:17.080
So if you told me tomorrow, Michael, the only people over 50 get to vote.
00:36:27.940
But I'd have a better political outcome for my community.
00:36:37.620
In the hypothetical universe where you're not putting up three plates for reps.
00:36:43.820
I would still go for it because it would have a better outcome for my political community.
00:36:57.440
I mean, I am not a, like, everybody must vote, you know, like.
00:37:07.780
So, so I think, you know, I've heard good arguments for, like, you should own land to vote.
00:37:14.640
You know, I, I, I do think the question was, would our political outcomes be improved?
00:37:20.260
And the answer to that question is certainly yes.
00:37:23.580
The other question behind it is, should we therefore do it?
00:37:27.360
And I'm, I'm not, I'm enough of a lib to say just because you get better outcomes doesn't mean it's just.
00:37:32.420
There's no, there is no mechanism within politics to actually do it.
00:37:42.000
Even, even lib gym bros are way more reasonable than lib, like, couch potatoes.
00:37:51.060
There is at least a 51% chance JFK was not killed by the communist Lee Harvey Oswald.
00:38:19.420
Do, do the people who, like, I know there was just this release.
00:38:24.540
Where Tucker did a whole segment where he essentially said that the CIA was involved in JFK killing.
00:38:29.480
But, and there are all these files from the CIA and their relationship with Oswald that was sort of, have not come to pass.
00:38:36.140
But even still, does anybody say that Oswald didn't pull the trigger?
00:38:43.960
This is like, I'm kind of, I like the, I'm into the moon ones, I'm into a, you know, like, I mess around with some of those.
00:38:50.980
But, like, this is one that kind of bores me because, yeah, I sort of think he did pull the trigger.
00:38:57.120
I, like, so, no, I don't think anybody thinks it was, like, Grover.
00:39:03.600
Yeah, I don't, yeah, it wasn't just LBJ sitting on the knoll.
00:39:19.460
The Respect for Marriage Act is neither respectful nor about marriage.
00:39:36.600
Respect for Marriage Act is neither respectful nor about marriage.
00:39:41.020
So we're saying, saying yes, it is not respectful or about marriage.
00:39:46.100
If you agree that it is about neither of those things, you should say yes.
00:40:01.120
I was going to say no, and now that you've said that, I think maybe I do think yes.
00:40:06.180
Okay, don't drink and we'll explain the sides of this, I think.
00:40:17.560
No, I would say it is, it is not about respect or marriage.
00:40:25.560
So, because I, I was thinking you would say, well, it is about marriage.
00:40:30.900
No, but the people who pushed it, the libs who pushed it, I don't think they give a damn
00:40:36.680
about marriage, and I don't think they want to respect people.
00:40:38.980
I think they want to drive Jack Phillips and Masterpiece Cake Shop out of business.
00:40:42.760
And they tried to do it through the court, and the court wouldn't let them do it.
00:40:45.880
And so now, and it's not, and they take the Obergefell decision, which redefines marriage,
00:40:52.440
And they say, no, no business, no wedding website maker, no cake shop owner, whatever,
00:40:59.840
is allowed to not participate in a gay marriage.
00:41:05.240
And I think this is, that interpretation of it's not about marriage is definitely correct.
00:41:10.900
You know, I think it's about, it's nominally, obviously, about marriage.
00:41:14.880
But I agree that, and I've gotten a little red-pilled on this.
00:41:19.680
The moment is when they rejected the Lee Amendment, which basically just said in the, like,
00:41:25.660
kind of gentlest possible terms, perhaps you, you know, perhaps it's unconstitutional to
00:41:31.460
sue, not even an organization, but an individual out of existence because they expressed.
00:41:38.100
And so, yeah, I mean, I think, I agree with you about Obergefell.
00:41:42.060
I mean, we're on the same page, I think, about that.
00:41:44.060
And I think that, you know, when the bill first came up, I thought, well, I truly believe
00:41:50.980
that when it comes to, like, some sort of place in society for freedom-loving gay people,
00:42:01.020
Like, we'll call it floof, we'll call it whatever.
00:42:02.860
Like, there's something, there's some arrangement that makes sense that recognizes that a man
00:42:07.040
and a woman producing children is at the center of our civic life, is marriage, but there are
00:42:13.240
these arrangements that kind of still have a place in our society.
00:42:15.900
I think there's, like, I really believe there's room for a good reasonable.
00:42:20.500
Which is the, that is the sort of Jonathan Peugeot, who made this point on another conversation
00:42:24.380
we were having where he said, you know, if you look at medieval manuscripts, there are
00:42:29.040
all these kind of odd and eccentric things all around the corners of the page.
00:42:34.900
But they're not at the, they're not at the center of the universe.
00:42:37.320
No, you wouldn't want the guy who's, like, farting a demon out to be, I'm not making
00:42:47.600
And I think that, you know, anybody sensible of any political persuasion.
00:42:52.740
And so I thought, well, maybe there is some, Obergefell is not that.
00:42:57.180
And that's why I dispute it, not because of its outcome, but because of its logic is not
00:43:02.040
that, it's the logic of the, we talked about this before, the total all is the same, you
00:43:06.240
define your, you define reality, a man and a man in a relationship is the same as a man
00:43:11.520
I think you can believe a man and a man in a relationship is okay, you can believe it's
00:43:21.540
Because that means that men and women are the same.
00:43:24.440
And so when they, when they rejected little, little Mr. Lee, who is like, maybe you might
00:43:31.040
like to not sue people out of, out of business.
00:43:34.320
Then I was like, okay, so you're just totalitarian.
00:43:40.220
I'll tell you one other thing about that, Bill, and then I guess we have to do another
00:43:47.360
The other thing about that, Bill, that suddenly occurred to me is that all of these things
00:43:51.340
were going to codify, because we found out that actually you can't just write things
00:43:55.840
If you just write things into law via the courts, you can actually unwrite them.
00:44:00.340
And this whole, it was this absurd thing that they did where it was like precedent.
00:44:14.200
So they found this out and they were like, well, what we really need, therefore, is a bill
00:44:18.560
It's like, I have a news for you about Congress, like, every two years, like, we vote in new
00:44:27.500
And it's like, if they ever did overturn Obergefell, which I think they should do, and I think we
00:44:32.120
should re-litigate this question, if they ever did that, like, you'd just vote on another
00:44:38.160
You don't need the permission of the Supreme Court to pass a bill.
00:44:42.500
Everybody wants, on all these questions, abortion, on gay marriage, everybody wants some cataclysmic
00:44:47.780
victory that is going to, we're not going to have to think about it because one side
00:44:53.940
Like, we are having this, let us have the damn discussion.
00:44:58.760
I'm glad we both drank on it, even though I don't really.
00:45:02.220
I can't, I mean, yeah, that's the point of the drinking.
00:45:04.440
Skipping leg day is a lot like attending, it's a lot like attending a liberal arts college
00:45:09.100
and staying committed to your cheating girlfriend.
00:45:11.940
In both cases, you are throwing your life away while also acting like a butter soft simp
00:45:18.640
who just hopes things will work themselves out.
00:45:23.260
Did they make these like more and more extravagant?
00:45:40.880
Which is, I was going to say, this is like pretty self.
00:45:50.520
Okay, even when my personal interest or ego are challenged by something.
00:46:11.500
Generally speaking, if Protestants were to accept a tenet of Catholicism, either the Immaculate
00:46:17.940
Conception or Purgatory, it's more likely it would be Purgatory.
00:46:34.880
Some might say that's a strike against Protestantism in the great schismatic debates, but that's
00:46:50.400
It's very hard for many Catholics to accept the Marian dogmas, to even accept that Mary
00:46:59.200
I came back into the faith, in many ways through Protestants, some of whom now are Catholic,
00:47:04.520
actually, interestingly, or reverted to Catholicism.
00:47:07.120
But even for me, even well into it, the Marian stuff was tough for me.
00:47:13.700
And now, I find it so enriching and edifying and sanctifying and, like, really central.
00:47:24.240
If not perfectly central, like, quite close to it.
00:47:28.420
My, this Protestant would accept, would take Mary before Purgatory, although I'm open to
00:47:37.120
Um, I, I am your, I am an average Mary enjoyer, and I think, like, but, but the reason that
00:47:44.360
the correct answer to this is yes, is that people are ready, they'd be out there ready
00:47:48.500
to restart the 30 years war over this question.
00:47:51.340
I mean, if you talk to people, they will be like, they're Catholics, they are the idolaters
00:47:54.340
because they have another god, and she's a woman, and whatever.
00:47:58.720
No, you need, I mean, there is, um, C.S. Lewis says that what is beyond time and space
00:48:04.740
is so male that in relationship to it, we are all female.
00:48:08.680
This is true, this is beautiful, and it is right and just that the representative of humanity
00:48:13.720
and man's relationship to God should be a mother and a woman.
00:48:15.800
That's, that's, that to me, that's the beauty of the doctrine.
00:48:20.360
There's also, but yes, that, I would, I would go with that first, but I think most people
00:48:23.980
But on the next game, we'll, we'll, we'll talk about marriage and virginity.
00:48:27.480
But it is, I, I do remember, I remember when you got Mary-pilled and, and, or as you became
00:48:33.260
increasingly Mary-pilled, and it is, it is harder.
00:48:35.380
It's, purgatory, some of my Protestant, you know, they don't like it, but they can kind
00:48:40.240
of see more, see more of it, but, yeah, we'll have to do a whole yes or no game on Mary.
00:48:46.300
On Mary, yeah, I think the doctrinal questions.
00:48:51.660
Sisyphus is rolling a boulder toward the Grand Hilbert Hotel.
00:48:57.240
The hotel has an infinite number of rooms, but they are full, so they may not be able
00:49:03.620
If he chooses to divert his boulder, it will instead destroy the ship of Theseus.
00:49:08.780
But the ship has had all of its constituent parts replaced, so it may not actually be the
00:49:18.580
I think, I know, did people send these questions in, or did the producers just write them?
00:49:27.340
I feel like I know exactly who asked this question, but I can't, I must be wrong.
00:49:31.600
Uh, it's too late in the game to answer this question in a serious way.
00:49:45.700
There will be no existentialism sympathy on this here podcast.
00:49:56.840
We can entertain all of these possibilities, but existentialism is a bridge too far.
00:50:03.820
I can't believe you brought up the C word on this here.
00:50:10.840
Uh, if I had to pick between pre-, mid- and post-tribulation, oh, I hate this whole thing.
00:50:22.020
Uh, I tend to side with the left-behind movie take and think rapture would be pre-tribulation.
00:50:29.560
That sounds to me much more complicated than the Sisyphus question.
00:50:32.580
It's vastly more complicated, and this is a series of questions.
00:50:38.180
But do your answer, and then I will go on my way.
00:50:53.620
I'm being the worst Protestant here because this is like, especially for evangelical Protestants,
00:51:06.400
It's about whether the thousand-year reign is going to be, I'm going to get this so,
00:51:10.240
so bungled, but it's about whether, like, the lake of fire and the thousand-year reign,
00:51:22.780
To me, this is a question on which we are expressly told we have no idea.
00:51:31.780
No one, not even the sun, but only the Father in heaven.
00:51:35.000
And so I find all of this to be vastly above my pay grade.
00:51:38.740
I think the book of Revelation is a profound mystic vision, which, if read carefully, it's
00:51:44.580
like people always say, is the tribulation, is the revelation, whatever, is it about the
00:51:49.580
sacking of the temple in, you know, by the Romans after Christ's death, or is it about
00:51:57.780
Like, you know, there are real historical events that this refers to, and those historical
00:52:01.580
Is the book of Revelation a mystical description of the Holy Mass?
00:52:08.700
And so all of this simply to say, like, stop worrying about it.
00:52:33.000
Didn't you just give a little speech about this?
00:52:36.120
I mean, I've recently been a little bit, like, libed on this in that what I really think
00:52:44.220
And I think that natural philosophy is a venerable thing to do.
00:52:50.100
I didn't say—or, well, I didn't say any of these.
00:52:53.120
I would never say natural philosophy is fake and gay.
00:52:56.020
I think most of the time what people mean when they say science is a thing that is fake
00:53:16.180
It's very hard when one does not go to the gym to understand the thinking of one who
00:53:36.620
I'm sitting here in my t-shirt with a man in a suit.
00:53:46.120
The question hinges on the meaning of the word in public.
00:53:48.680
So I think I'm going to make you drink because I will sweatpants to the gym.
00:53:55.020
Would you wear—if, hypothetically, you were to go to the gym, would you wear sweatpants
00:53:58.700
Spencer, I would not wear sweatpants in private.
00:54:04.200
I can't—I did—no, I wouldn't count the gym as in public.
00:54:09.080
I mean, I'm saying, you know, the one walking down the street, I would not.
00:54:12.000
But there was a period where The Daily Wire was going to make a movie, and I was told to
00:54:20.340
When I said body by lasagna, I wasn't counting.
00:54:23.140
I was shoveling in pasta, pizza, meat, all this stuff.
00:54:27.300
And I really did gain—I gained 20 pounds, and I cut my body fat in half.
00:54:31.560
I never cut—I never actually cut after, but I—
00:54:39.780
And I did purchase a pair of sweatpants for the occasion, and a pair of sneakers also to
00:54:48.180
Did you—when you put them on, did you scream, Adrian?
00:54:53.020
I tried to break my nose a few times so that it would look convincing.
00:54:58.360
Most likely, the elites at the top, such as Bill Gates, George Soros, and Klaus Schwab,
00:55:05.020
are all just possessed by demons and or directly worship the devil in an attempt to transcend
00:55:10.560
the human race and merge with their existence in a higher plane.
00:55:14.960
Due to YouTube rules, make your guess, but do not verbally confirm if the other person
00:55:23.040
Give only an ambiguous, nonverbal confirmation.
00:55:30.500
Gates, Soros, and Schwab all worship demons or are possessed by demons.
00:55:57.280
In the abstract, in Minecraft, let me tell a little story.
00:56:04.320
When Dobbs came down as an actual decision, and when Roe v. Wade was overturned, I saw on
00:56:15.780
Reddit in a Satanist forum, somebody struggling with whether or not to convert to Satanism.
00:56:25.600
And one poster said, Satanism isn't really about worshiping Satan.
00:56:54.720
The war in Ukraine is roughly 5% crazy Russians and 95% money laundering for the new world
00:57:23.660
I don't think it's money laundering for the new world order.
00:57:26.760
I think it's an imperial war between the Western Empire and the Eastern Empire of Russia.
00:57:30.900
And I think that any—the West is dishonest when they say it's about national independence
00:57:38.960
It's about getting Ukraine to join NATO and the broader Western alliance.
00:57:45.620
And that's why when there was a pro-Russian leader of Ukraine before 2014, we wielded our
00:57:51.580
political power, as great powers do, to influence the politics in that country and housed the
00:57:58.880
pro-Russian guy and put in a more favorable pro-Western guy.
00:58:02.320
And then Russia responded to that by increasing its influence operations, including military
00:58:10.720
And then Obama, because he was weak, wasn't able to stop that.
00:58:17.540
And then Biden essentially invited Russia—I mean, actually invited Russia to invade when
00:58:22.680
he said if it's only a minor incursion in the East, then we won't really do anything
00:58:27.420
And Russia said it's unacceptable for Ukraine to join NATO.
00:58:30.520
And Ukraine is a buffer state, and buffer states often do better when they play great
00:58:36.040
powers off of one another than when they declare an allegiance to one or the other.
00:58:55.460
I think people misunderstand—the transgender question is like this, too.
00:58:59.500
I think people misunderstand how the new world order works.
00:59:07.600
That, oh, it's the pandemic, or they engineered this in a lab.
00:59:12.140
They don't have—they're nowhere near competent enough to orchestrate these massive global
00:59:17.740
What's true is that they have a totalizing philosophy about how the world works, which
00:59:24.860
is anti-human, which is, you know, post-human in some ways, which is evil and wrong, and which
00:59:35.340
inclines them to respond—the only thing restraining that philosophy is circumstances.
00:59:43.160
The fact that we live in a country which is still nominally a constitutional republic,
00:59:47.420
to which politicians must still pay some form of lip service in order to succeed and so forth,
00:59:52.140
that held them back for however many years from saying what they already believed long ago about
00:59:59.540
It's not like COVID brought into being some new attitude about public health, right?
01:00:11.120
And so, similarly, I don't think that any—I don't think that, like, money—nobody orchestrated
01:00:19.620
The war in Ukraine happened for a number of reasons, among them those that you just laid
01:00:25.400
And it is the case that our leadership class is feckless, incompetent, and foundationally,
01:00:32.980
philosophically wrong about metaphysics, which makes you evil.
01:00:36.660
Being wrong about metaphysics makes you evil, even if you don't sit there with your hand—rubbing
01:00:46.620
They are pervasive and key pillars of some of the most influential and wealthy brands
01:00:53.720
They strike at the very heart of American civilization and must be eradicated from society if the West
01:01:01.020
But to mention them is to be looked down upon with derision and contempt.
01:01:32.420
At this point, I believe that one's view of seed oils is far more indicative of one's
01:01:41.260
entire political outlook and whether or not I agree with a person than their view on immigration
01:01:49.060
It is one of the most defining political issues, even though it seems somewhat out of left field.
01:01:57.000
And this is, like, a generational thing that you have a hard time explaining to older people
01:02:03.540
This is why you get—it's not because boomers are, like, stupid or wrong.
01:02:06.600
It's like, you know, they say things like, you don't believe in, like, unfettered free
01:02:10.460
Like, you must be—because, like, that was once—that was once seed oils.
01:02:13.480
Like, that was once the, like, signifying issue.
01:02:24.660
Do you know how crazy Elisa's gotten with this, sweet little Elisa?
01:02:27.380
She says to me—I mean, she's gone down the rabbit hole.
01:02:36.560
It's all butter or avocado or olive oil, which I think are much tastier anyway.
01:02:45.220
You gotta get rid of your right guard deodorant.
01:02:48.400
And because I have, I'm like an old—I'm an old man, so I use the spray aerosol deodorant.
01:02:56.960
She goes, I got this deodorant that you gotta try.
01:03:00.700
And I kid you not, it's made of grass-fed beef tallow.
01:03:05.560
I was—honestly, I was gonna say yak butter, and that wasn't far off.
01:03:13.940
Do you know—so I said, how much does this cost?
01:03:30.740
I said, how much did you pay for—how much did I pay for this?
01:03:52.120
And I think, do I really want to live that bad?
01:04:03.800
If I'm in a state of grace, I'll get to go to heaven eventually.
01:04:07.880
No, I think this is a million years in purgatory, you know.
01:04:17.580
And the question is not, are our foods killing us?
01:04:21.780
The question, as you say, is how much are we willing—how much are we willing to do about it?
01:04:26.300
No, I remember when this was a crunchy granola lib thing, and now it's like a hard-wing white nationalist.
01:04:32.540
Anti-vax used to be a crunchy granola lib thing.
01:04:36.920
It just depends on—my biggest conspiracy theory, and I'm going to say this is the first time I'm saying this on camera,
01:04:41.480
but I've said this to a lot of Daily Wire guys.
01:04:43.660
We—you and I will live to see the day when nicotine is good for you.
01:04:56.300
Speaking of conspiracy—this is my—this is my big conspiracy theory.
01:05:03.020
The fact that you just said that, I bet I could tell you.
01:05:07.960
This is my personal proprietary conspiracy theory.
01:05:15.280
Somebody knew—first of all, I still don't know, and I refuse ever to learn how to pronounce the name that begins this question.
01:05:23.620
Chasten Buttigieg is most likely aware Pete is a deeply closeted, straight CIA plant.
01:05:39.380
This is actually your—the first and maybe only time I've heard this is from you.
01:05:51.280
I will almost never claim ownership over—if I see an idea that I think maybe somebody got this for my piece, whatever, this is one that I will die on this hill.
01:06:10.200
He understood that the way the wind was blowing, you could never—as a kind of, you know, Ivy League—I don't actually know if you—probably Ivy League.
01:06:19.460
Yeah, yeah, so Ivy League, yeah, you know, veteran, JFK mold lib.
01:06:27.200
Once he realized that that was passing away and you had to check an identity box, what's the identity box you can check?
01:06:44.300
His incapacity to match his ties with his slacks?
01:06:55.820
I tell you, you know, because some of the audience might not know that we're college buddies.
01:07:00.780
Going back to your freshman year, my sophomore year.
01:07:03.300
So, yeah, when you said we've known each other, we've been friends for many years.
01:07:07.120
But because we went to a very liberal, elite school, we know a lot of these guys.
01:07:20.060
They all kind of, you know, they all just kind of sound like Pete.
01:07:22.980
And they're all—they're going to go get a job after college because they're really passionate about management consulting.
01:07:29.080
I just really want to improve efficiency within certain corporate structures.
01:07:34.540
And then he goes and he, you know, he has—he is a military veteran.
01:07:38.840
And he did the Ivy League, and he did the corporate consulting, and he's just the perfect political candidate, except old Pete is a pretty bland white guy.
01:07:48.680
And so you're saying he had to have something, and I—
01:07:54.080
I don't understand why it's more artificial than any other part of his personality for him to pretend to—you know what I mean?
01:08:04.000
They, you know, carefully curate, as we know from rubbing shoulders with them, they carefully curate every aspect of their life, including their disavowal of the curation.
01:08:15.800
Right, like, including, like, oh, I just—I'm so—like you said, I'm so passionate about, like, you know, synergistic incentivization of, like, spreadsheets.
01:08:27.440
But then they get into power, and they—right.
01:08:29.940
And, like, that pipeline was so clear that he wasn't going to let a little thing, like, being a heterosexual stop him.
01:08:37.620
Like, look, for the right price, you know, I'm whatever sexuality.
01:08:41.320
You know, I mean, it's, like, it was better than, like, castrating himself and being the first trans candidate, you know?
01:08:47.200
Lucky Pete, he came along, you know, five years, just in time.
01:08:50.780
Because let me tell you, that gate is closing on white gay men, like, you know?
01:08:55.220
Yeah, it's about to be part of the established power class.
01:09:13.320
I'm a little ashamed of us, because we've gone out many times, had many, many cigars, many, many—we only had—you had your full drink.
01:09:27.680
Spencer, you've already finished yours, Shin Shin.
01:09:31.380
We will see you next time on the Yes or No Game.