The Michael Knowles Show - Spencer Klavan is STUNNED By Michael's Answer ｜ YES or NO

00:00:00.120 Skipping leg day is a lot like attending a liberal arts college and staying committed to your cheating girlfriend.

00:00:07.740 In both cases, you are throwing your life away while also acting like a butter-soft simp who just hopes things will work themselves out.

00:00:30.000 Like the former president, I have a major announcement.

00:00:36.520 If you go right now to dailywire.com slash shop, you can get your very own copy of the Yes or No game.

00:00:47.080 Look at this. We've got game pieces in here. We've got a scorecard. We've got cards.

00:00:50.640 This is the real deal. We had an initial run of these. I think we had about 1,000 boxes of this game.

00:00:58.040 They sold out instantly.

00:01:00.260 And so, unfortunately, I think we would have sold 10,000 of these things had we had them in time for Christmas.

00:01:05.700 You can't get it as a stocking stuffer, but you can pre-order your copy right now.

00:01:09.460 And you should pre-order because I think these are going to sell out to dailywire.com slash shop.

00:01:12.800 You can play with up to nine people. Test how well you know your friends and family and loved ones.

00:01:19.080 Discuss all the most important issues of the day.

00:01:22.600 Debate. Do aliens exist?

00:01:24.900 Mist? What are the merits of vegan suffrage?

00:01:28.620 What do you know about God, life, the whole universe?

00:01:31.780 Head on over to dailywire.com slash shop.

00:01:35.440 Get your copy of the Yes or No game in the flesh.

00:01:41.000 In the box. I don't know. In the cardboard.

00:01:42.920 We have in the flesh here my very good friend of many, many years.

00:01:46.660 Indeed.

00:01:47.160 Spencer Clavin.

00:01:48.180 Hey. Good to see you.

00:01:49.600 I'm glad you're finally on this show.

00:01:50.860 When you buy the game, does it come with the day drinking?

00:01:53.080 It does. It does. You can. It's not required that you have a couple of Coca-Colas when you

00:01:57.780 play the game, but you can, and I, for one, encourage it.

00:02:01.040 It enhances the experience.

00:02:02.060 It does enhance the experience. We have our drinks. I have a bit of a girly drink. 0.94

00:02:06.620 You know, I actually think the martini, it's a manly drink.

00:02:09.140 It's the James Bond drink.

00:02:11.180 It's the James Bond drink.

00:02:12.880 It gets a bad rap because people put berries and things.

00:02:16.120 That, okay, this is very important. Maybe this is, like, you know, a side piece, but

00:02:19.580 that is not a martini.

00:02:21.300 That is not a martini.

00:02:21.840 If you, like, sugar, if you've got, like, sugar around the rim, you're serving something else.

00:02:25.760 Yes, that's not. 0.95

00:02:26.540 It's like a sex on the beach.

00:02:27.440 Now, you have a delicious glass of scotch. 0.96

00:02:29.940 I do. I saw this troll on Twitter who said, it was like, you know, all these conservatives,

00:02:33.940 they grow these beards to try to look manly. 0.94

00:02:37.080 Because this is fake masculinity.

00:02:38.500 And so I thought, I not only have a beard, I have whiskey neat at 2.30 in the afternoon.

00:02:44.260 I am one of those manly conservatives you heard about.

00:02:46.640 That's right.

00:02:47.160 You know, 2.30 is usually when I go to the dentist.

00:02:52.720 Okay, shall we begin?

00:02:53.920 I'm ready. Bring it on.

00:02:57.200 Like porn, violent or graphic video games are bad for society and should be banned.

00:03:05.840 There's a lot.

00:03:07.120 There's a lot there.

00:03:07.860 There's a lot of portions of that question.

00:03:11.360 Violent or graphic video games.

00:03:14.200 So I have to say whether you think that's true or not.

00:03:18.280 I'm going to put you on the yes.

00:03:20.980 I'm not sure.

00:03:21.780 This is like a how-based-is-Knolls question.

00:03:24.400 I know.

00:03:25.720 And you've got me on no.

00:03:27.180 Now what happened?

00:03:27.860 I've got you on no.

00:03:29.000 Okay.

00:03:35.400 Conditionally, yes.

00:03:36.400 You're right.

00:03:36.880 Okay.

00:03:37.280 And my answer.

00:03:38.740 Conditionally.

00:03:39.660 All right.

00:03:40.180 I want to hear about the conditions.

00:03:41.160 But first, you have to drink, right?

00:03:42.680 Or no.

00:03:43.160 Well, did I get you wrong?

00:03:44.480 What's your answer?

00:03:45.060 No, no, no.

00:03:45.360 You got me right.

00:03:45.900 So I guess you get to.

00:03:46.800 Okay.

00:03:47.080 Okay.

00:03:47.360 Very well.

00:03:47.800 So I say conditionally, it's a real margin call.

00:03:50.480 Only because I do think that some video games can warp your mind.

00:03:56.020 Like when I was playing Donkey Kong Country as a kid, man, that stuff had me messed up, okay?

00:04:01.440 You had misapprehensions about monkeys.

00:04:03.260 Yeah, I was walking around throwing barrels at people everywhere I went.

00:04:06.120 Did nobody, yeah.

00:04:07.000 I was, I never played a lot of video games, but I did get a kick out of Grand Theft Auto.

00:04:12.560 Oh, sure.

00:04:12.940 It was so outrageous.

00:04:15.280 Right.

00:04:15.420 It was shocking, but when I was learning to drive, because I had played Grand Theft Auto

00:04:20.340 a lot, where all I would ever do is I'd try to hit the guys on the motorcycle and make

00:04:23.480 them fall off the motorcycle.

00:04:24.380 Yeah.

00:04:24.720 When I was learning to drive, there was a motorcycle coming down the road.

00:04:29.840 Okay.

00:04:30.160 And I, it all turned out okay. 0.99

00:04:33.040 I had the impulse to veer in and hit him head on. 0.79

00:04:36.700 Oh, interesting.

00:04:37.580 Because I'd played this video game so much.

00:04:39.440 And so I think in extreme cases, there should be some regulatory authority to set standards

00:04:48.340 for video games.

00:04:49.120 Right.

00:04:49.880 But broadly speaking, like I wouldn't ban Call of Duty or something like that.

00:04:54.580 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:04:54.960 What's your take?

00:04:55.920 Okay.

00:04:56.200 Well, somebody obviously knows me because they're trying to, they're trying to mess with me with

00:05:00.520 this question.

00:05:01.060 I mean, I am kind of, not famously, but known as some, like a kind of video game optimist.

00:05:08.260 I think they contain some of the great works of art of our generation.

00:05:12.000 I think like as fine art has dithered into abstraction and obscurity, you can actually

00:05:17.160 turn on like Final Fantasy and see panoramas like, you know, unlike anything else that's

00:05:22.220 being made up.

00:05:22.620 So all of that to say like, I'm a total lib about this.

00:05:26.220 And part of this, I think, is probably because my taste in video games is like Crash Bandicoot,

00:05:32.060 like Fuzzy McFuzzerson defeats the evil dragon.

00:05:36.020 And so I'm like, these are great.

00:05:38.760 Like, they're so beautiful.

00:05:39.980 I'm having so much fun.

00:05:41.300 Because in Crash Bandicoot, you don't carjack hookers that shoot them, right? 1.00

00:05:45.640 I think you can get an expansion pack.

00:05:47.440 Okay.

00:05:47.760 Because it's like a skin.

00:05:48.480 You can reskin it.

00:05:49.680 Well, no.

00:05:50.060 And then, so then it's, and I do, I mean, I like like God of War was one of my favorite

00:05:53.180 games.

00:05:53.360 And Gears of War.

00:05:54.400 Everything is of war, but the Gears of War game.

00:05:56.200 And those are definitely, I wouldn't give them to a child, you know, like, and I think

00:06:00.960 like, there's a huge domain of parental supervision and engagement.

00:06:05.940 It's one of those problems that goes like way deeper than the thing that is the tip of

00:06:10.460 the iceberg.

00:06:11.340 It's like, well, the breakdown of society, like, you know, the failure of the modern

00:06:15.200 American family, like the corrosion of our values, all of it, like, you know, you'd have 1.00

00:06:19.420 to rectify all of that before I would be like, and you also should ban the video.

00:06:23.300 But I, I mean, like, like movies, I definitely don't think, you know, I think there should

00:06:26.860 be some restrictions in place to make sure kids aren't playing like Grand Theft Auto.

00:06:31.040 I don't know.

00:06:31.440 They do melt your brain.

00:06:32.440 So since we both got it right, we just chose to drink anyway.

00:06:36.100 Naturally.

00:06:36.640 Okay.

00:06:36.940 I, I, that's, I, I can't, the, the glass is too appealing.

00:06:40.080 It's too appealing.

00:06:40.760 And it's, the other thing, I've, I've really restricted my drinking on this show in some

00:06:44.320 recent episodes because we shot the thing at like 10 in the morning.

00:06:48.500 And even for me, all right, even I am not that much of a degenerate.

00:06:52.040 Right.

00:06:52.200 All right.

00:06:53.220 You're up.

00:06:53.700 Oh boy.

00:06:54.140 Okay.

00:06:54.500 So I get to pick.

00:06:56.520 Uh, wow.

00:06:59.300 I did not know this.

00:07:00.260 Okay.

00:07:01.240 Uh, Stephen Crowder is right.

00:07:04.580 One of the most overrated writers in history is Shakespeare.

00:07:08.340 I did not know that Stephen Crowder thinks this.

00:07:10.100 I, yes, I had never said that.

00:07:12.140 We pay no attention to facts on this show.

00:07:14.100 No.

00:07:14.200 So that may or may not be true.

00:07:15.300 But I'll take, I'll take them at this point.

00:07:16.580 Just pick somebody.

00:07:17.220 Jeremy Boring thinks that, uh, yeah, right.

00:07:20.200 That Shakespeare is the most overrated writer in history?

00:07:25.160 Yeah.

00:07:25.780 It's a big claim.

00:07:27.640 One.

00:07:28.440 Definitely.

00:07:29.280 This is an easy one for me.

00:07:30.520 It would be a no.

00:07:31.500 It's a big no.

00:07:32.360 Has he ever heard of Toni Morrison?

00:07:35.640 I know Zora Neale Hurston.

00:07:37.480 Like, there's just a huge, like that chick that wrote the, uh, the poem at the inauguration.

00:07:42.460 Oh my goodness.

00:07:43.180 I mean, I saw, I was in a bookshop the other day and I saw two collections of her poetry.

00:07:49.780 What was her name?

00:07:51.200 I can't remember.

00:07:51.700 Amanda Gorman.

00:07:52.480 Amanda Gorman.

00:07:52.900 Wow.

00:07:53.240 I'm shocked at myself.

00:07:54.200 Where'd you pull that from?

00:07:55.120 No idea.

00:07:56.000 Yeah.

00:07:56.760 The things that I don't know because I know that is probably too depressing to think about.

00:08:01.100 Like, there's some line of poetry I've forgotten, but I know Amanda Gorman's.

00:08:03.640 I remember a line of literary criticism where the late, great literary critic Harold Bloom

00:08:08.020 referred to slam poetry as the death of art.

00:08:10.980 Ah.

00:08:12.600 What's with the hate for Shakespeare?

00:08:14.060 Why would anyone hate Shakespeare?

00:08:15.120 So, I'm going to make the strongest possible case for this.

00:08:18.720 I mean, because, for one thing, it's impossible to be more highly rated than Shakespeare.

00:08:23.700 I mean, you know, if you leave aside the woke crazies who, like, is that white man, whatever,

00:08:26.960 you know, he is kind of, his name is, like, synonymous with literary excellence.

00:08:30.460 Yeah.

00:08:30.820 And I at least think that there are some other writers in the English canon, Milton, for

00:08:35.580 instance, even if just, you're just restricting yourself to, like, English language poetry.

00:08:38.540 Yeah, yeah.

00:08:38.840 Right?

00:08:39.020 There's definitely other contenders for the throne of the great poet of English.

00:08:44.420 And the other thing you could kind of adduce, as perhaps Crowder does, who knows,

00:08:49.180 is that, you know, Shakespeare's reputation is kind of invented in the generations after

00:08:55.640 his death by, you know, Johnson and Boswell and, you know, those great, who put him on

00:09:01.020 the stage with, like, Aeschylus and he's our, you know, he's the English languages.

00:09:05.280 But I don't know, man, you know, for God's sake, let us sit upon the ground and tell sad

00:09:10.880 stories of the death of kings, how some have been deposed, some sleeping killed, some poisoned

00:09:17.120 by their wives, all murdered, for within the hollow crown that rounds the mortal temples

00:09:23.800 of a king keeps death his court.

00:09:26.060 And there the antic sits, allowing him a breath, a little space, to monarchize, be feared, and

00:09:35.040 kill with looks, and, humored thus, comes at the last, and with a little pin, bores through

00:09:44.540 his castle wall, and farewell, king. 0.98

00:09:48.460 Cover your heads, and mock not flesh and blood with solemn ceremony, for you have but mistook

00:09:55.480 me all this while.

00:09:56.860 I live with bread, like you, taste, want, feel, grief, need, friends, subjected thus, how

00:10:12.660 can you say to me, I am a king?

00:10:17.380 Remember, Jew, though justice be thy plea, consider that no, it's one of the more politically 1.00

00:10:21.980 incorrect ones than you are. 0.73

00:10:23.460 I was going to say, you're getting us banned even without the bad questions.

00:10:26.860 I was getting us banned by reading Merchant of Venice.

00:10:29.800 Ultimately, when you're faced with a genius of that totality, which really, I mean, the

00:10:35.700 language aside, the completeness of his vision of human life, the capacity of it.

00:10:40.320 I mean, we've been talking a lot about Dante lately, and I think he's maybe the person you

00:10:44.220 could put next to Shakespeare for that just, like, totalizing vision of human life.

00:10:48.860 It's got to come from one mind, and I have no, I've seen no evidence why it shouldn't have

00:10:54.100 been Shakespeare.

00:10:54.500 And if it was some guy named Bob, like, what difference does it make?

00:10:57.660 Bob Shakespeare.

00:10:58.760 Bob, Billy, Olin.

00:10:59.800 I love when they say Shakespeare was actually, he was actually multiple people.

00:11:03.440 And I think, yeah, because you know, you know what produces really great art?

00:11:08.300 Committees.

00:11:08.880 Committees are known for their artistic vision and skill, right?

00:11:11.640 All right, next question.

00:11:14.680 Yes.

00:11:15.380 I am more inclined to believe that the earth is flat than that bodies were recovered from

00:11:24.980 Roswell.

00:11:25.560 Okay, after we answer this, we have to diagram.

00:11:28.640 Yes, basically.

00:11:29.900 Actually, I'm seeing many verbs, and I'd like a lot, yeah, snaking.

00:11:34.820 Okay, so I am trying to decide whether you think it's more likely that the earth is flat

00:11:41.880 than that bodies were recovered from Roswell.

00:11:47.300 Oh, this is actually really hard.

00:11:48.920 I thought it was easy, and then it turned out to be hard.

00:11:50.380 Drink.

00:11:59.300 Hey, boy, oh, boy.

00:12:01.020 Okay, this is good.

00:12:01.780 This is a good one.

00:12:02.720 Once we re-run it, it's a good one.

00:12:03.300 I'll drink, too, just in solidarity.

00:12:06.760 Okay.

00:12:08.120 No, I am much more inclined to believe in the flat earth theory, since the earth actually

00:12:13.380 is flat for all intents and purposes.

00:12:15.040 This is Jonathan Peugeot's big thing, right?

00:12:17.120 This is Owen Barfield's point.

00:12:19.900 Yes.

00:12:20.380 Okay, so that was why I instantly went for, you know, and then I thought, actually, he's

00:12:25.740 probably going to say that Owen Barfield, yes, go on.

00:12:28.360 I also, like, demons exist.

00:12:31.680 Aliens don't exist, but demons exist. 0.94

00:12:33.460 Right.

00:12:33.700 But they don't have bodies.

00:12:34.720 The definition of an angel or a demon is that they're pure spirit.

00:12:37.820 Right, right, right.

00:12:38.700 So they didn't, whatever they found at Roswell or whatever, you know, Soviet spy planes, even

00:12:43.720 if they found a demon, they wouldn't be able to grab his body.

00:12:45.700 He doesn't have a body.

00:12:46.380 Right, right.

00:12:47.020 But what about, what about counter-argument?

00:12:49.120 What about what Beatrice says to Dante when he asks her whether the blessed souls really

00:12:56.460 are on Venus or really are?

00:12:59.140 She says, they showed themselves to you here, not because this is their sphere, they all

00:13:02.760 live in the Empyrean, but as a sign for you, since this is suited to your senses.

00:13:06.400 And in this way, the Bible condescends, right, to speak of God as having hands and feet, but

00:13:10.740 meaning something else.

00:13:11.820 Yes.

00:13:12.240 All of this to say, right, like, couldn't, it might be the case that although angels and

00:13:16.460 demons don't have bodies. 0.86

00:13:17.540 They could appear to have bodies.

00:13:19.100 Exactly.

00:13:19.400 At Roswell.

00:13:20.160 Yes.

00:13:20.420 I suppose that's true, but I guess the way I picture that, because we entertain angels

00:13:23.840 unawares.

00:13:24.540 Absolutely.

00:13:24.720 And I could give you examples where I'm quite confident this actually happened.

00:13:29.140 Please.

00:13:29.760 But I'll tell you, I didn't reach out and grab them.

00:13:32.320 I kind of wonder if there really were demons or something, you know, at Roswell.

00:13:36.020 The moment that the cops went out there to get him, it'd be like a B ghost movie, where

00:13:41.840 they go grab him and just feel like, you know, they just kind of fall right in.

00:13:44.400 Yeah.

00:13:45.000 Interesting.

00:13:45.680 Now, so, I was correct on the Flat Earth thing?

00:13:49.960 You were right.

00:13:52.480 You're more inclined to believe in the Flat Earth.

00:13:54.080 Well, but only, is that what you said, that I'm more inclined to believe?

00:13:57.580 Right.

00:13:57.880 But only in this Owen Barfield-y way, which we should probably define since people are going

00:14:02.280 to be watching as I'm asking, which is to say that the notion that there is a scientific

00:14:09.940 theory of physical space that doesn't simply correspond to our perceptions, but actually

00:14:18.800 outlines the bedrock of reality, is heretical and a scientific fallacy.

00:14:24.140 Yes.

00:14:24.480 This is why, right, this is the problem with Galileo.

00:14:28.100 It's not that he thinks the Earth revolves around the sun.

00:14:31.700 One, it's that he thinks there is an answer to, does the Earth revolve around the sun

00:14:35.480 or vice versa, which reflects some absolute fundamental truth, which makes a fundamental

00:14:39.320 truth physical rather than spiritual.

00:14:40.880 Yes.

00:14:41.200 Okay.

00:14:41.420 Yes.

00:14:41.700 So we're all in the same.

00:14:42.080 Because that's what they say.

00:14:43.020 Yeah.

00:14:43.560 Sometimes, if people ask the Galileo question, they'll say, does the Earth revolve around the

00:14:48.060 sun?

00:14:48.200 And I'll say, man is the center of the universe.

00:14:49.900 Yeah.

00:14:50.120 They'll say, but, you know, does the Earth revolve?

00:14:51.860 I'll say, the best way I have of describing reality is that man is at the center of the universe.

00:14:58.800 That's right.

00:14:59.260 And they will say, no, no, no.

00:15:00.620 Yeah, I get it. 1.00

00:15:01.440 You're using some stupid metaphor talk. 0.99

00:15:02.740 But, like, literally, objectively. 1.00

00:15:05.500 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 1.00

00:15:06.260 Well, literally and you're telling me that the fundament of reality is some stupid rock? 0.98

00:15:11.200 I mean, that's not true. 0.98

00:15:12.460 Nobody really believes that.

00:15:13.440 Right, right.

00:15:14.040 And, I mean, it is, in fact, true, so far as I understand, that you can describe the

00:15:18.800 universe as, you know, revolving around the Earth.

00:15:22.300 I mean, it's just the equations are a lot more complicated.

00:15:24.240 But the fact that they're more complicated doesn't mean that they don't actually describe,

00:15:29.060 you know, they don't predict the outcomes of our observations.

00:15:32.300 That is all, like, it is a kind of a fiction, a pernicious fiction, that when we write math,

00:15:39.340 which predicts physical outcomes, we are somehow getting something more real than the experience,

00:15:46.120 the quote-unquote subjective, which by which people usually mean arbitrary, right?

00:15:49.620 The experience of the world as it occurs to our senses.

00:15:53.780 Right.

00:15:53.920 This is, like, a real problem.

00:15:55.420 And so the argument that the Earth is flat is not that if you walked far enough, you'd fall off it.

00:16:00.880 But that for your, in your experience of the world, it is flat.

00:16:05.940 You don't have to account for its curvature as you walk.

00:16:08.200 You can see its, you know.

00:16:09.340 So, yeah, I think that's true, although that's not what the conspiracy theory...

00:16:14.000 I guess the conspiracy theory is also scientistic and is also referring to a physical.

00:16:18.660 But, yes, if someone said, Michael...

00:16:22.980 Well, the question that keeps coming up, what is a woman? 0.99

00:16:24.800 Right.

00:16:25.300 Is what is a woman? 1.00

00:16:26.160 And, unfortunately, the conservative answer keeps being two X chromosomes and a uterus.

00:16:30.900 That's right.

00:16:31.280 Adult human female.

00:16:32.320 Adult human female.

00:16:32.780 Even that's better than two X chromosomes and a uterus. 0.93

00:16:35.020 But you know the real answer.

00:16:36.540 Go on.

00:16:37.040 Sugar, spice, and everything nice.

00:16:38.520 That's a much more accurate and descriptive answer.

00:16:41.300 It is.

00:16:41.780 Yes.

00:16:42.560 Yeah, I would say, you know, it's a two-legged rational animal, you know, of the female gender. 0.99

00:16:48.080 And, yeah, there is this problem, and this happens a lot, I think.

00:16:54.720 It occurred to me just the other day that there's a certain form of biblical literalism,

00:16:58.780 which is also scientistic.

00:17:01.460 Because you start out with the true statement that everything in the Bible is true.

00:17:05.260 And then you defend that statement by trying to claim that every word of the Bible corresponds to a physical event in space and time.

00:17:15.040 Which, you know, again, if you chase this down, you get, like, in the Psalms, you get the earth revolving around the...

00:17:19.820 Or you get the sun, rather, moving across the sky, revolving around the earth, and so forth.

00:17:23.540 But, and this is a con that the libs pull the traditionalists into, which is they say, like, oh, well, you can't prove, you know, show me on a map.

00:17:32.320 And then our response is, like, yes, I can show you on a map.

00:17:35.000 It's the XX chromosomes. 0.97

00:17:36.280 It's the whatever.

00:17:37.500 And, of course, the response should be that's a completely childish and untenable view of the world, even according to science.

00:17:43.740 Like, even once you get down to the quantum level, you realize that perception does have this, like, fundamental role to play.

00:17:49.340 Right, right.

00:17:50.120 Describe a kiss.

00:17:51.260 Exactly.

00:17:51.920 Like, oh, it's when these lips, which are made up of these atoms, kind of do this, like, it's like this thing, and then, like, maybe a little, like, a tongue, if you're French, kind of comes in.

00:18:02.620 Yeah, yeah.

00:18:02.980 And then dopamine.

00:18:04.020 And then the dopamine surges.

00:18:06.400 Right.

00:18:06.560 And then that's what a kiss is, right?

00:18:08.620 Of course.

00:18:09.220 Okay, so it's my turn.

00:18:10.220 Here we go.

00:18:10.660 Okay.

00:18:13.740 Okay, well, this is going to be easy.

00:18:17.440 There's no possible way that a gym selfie could be considered an appropriate thing for a self-respecting man to post on Instagram.

00:18:27.400 Well, you know my answer to this, but I'm not sure I know yours.

00:18:31.120 We're going to spill a little bit of tea here, I think.

00:18:33.820 Are we going to pull out gym selfies?

00:18:35.760 That's right, yeah.

00:18:37.060 They made me take away my phone for this.

00:18:42.360 Oh, okay.

00:18:43.200 No possible way.

00:18:49.500 You're correct.

00:18:50.360 Oh, boy.

00:18:50.980 Okay, I'm going to drink anyway.

00:18:52.180 Yeah, I choose to as well.

00:18:53.720 Okay, you are also correct, of course.

00:18:56.020 And I must have gotten this from you, so I guess it's sort of cheating, but when I think of arete, when I think of real excellence, okay,

00:19:04.520 I think, yes, we can demonstrate our intellectual, yes, oh, and yes, we can demonstrate some virtues through acts of kindness and charity,

00:19:13.220 but also we need to post-physique is what we need to do, because the physical excellence matters, too.

00:19:19.260 Yes.

00:19:19.520 This is in the central, one of the central chapters of my book, which I should probably talk about, because I'm supposed to, like, publish it.

00:19:29.500 I would plug that.

00:19:30.180 You know, I'll plug the book.

00:19:31.180 It's called How to Save the West, and there's a whole section on the body and the relationship between body and soul.

00:19:34.920 And this is, it's a tricky thing, because I accept the premise of the question, which is, if I were to rephrase it, I would say there's no possible way that most gym selfies that get posted are something that a self-respecting man would post on Instagram.

00:19:54.320 On the other hand, we live in a culture where, in order to break down every standard of objective excellence, we are constantly assaulted with ugliness.

00:20:09.860 Yes.

00:20:10.100 That is one of the major kind of means of our, I wouldn't even call it, you know, I mean, leftist is almost too small a term for it.

00:20:19.920 It's like, you know, my friend James Poulos calls it the Borg, right?

00:20:23.100 It's this totalizing, out-of-control kind of sameness.

00:20:27.840 And, you know, in C.S. Lewis's Screwtape Proposes in Toast, he has a perversion of democracy, which is kind of reflected also in, like, de Tocqueville, the total equalizing impulse that I'm as good as you, everything is good as everything else.

00:20:43.280 And, you know, why are we constantly being shown images of obese women in their underwear, right? 1.00

00:20:49.540 Like, that didn't used to be the case.

00:20:51.040 I used to.

00:20:51.540 I remember because I was a kid.

00:20:52.620 Uh-huh.

00:20:52.900 And the Victoria's Secret billboards and the catalog, it'd have super hot chicks. 1.00

00:20:57.960 And now it doesn't. 0.99

00:20:59.520 And the minute you say this, people say, you hate fat people. 0.99

00:21:02.440 Yeah. 0.97

00:21:03.040 Which is like, eh, no, no, no.

00:21:04.640 I don't hate fat people. 0.61

00:21:05.680 You've got Michelle Obama over here. 0.94

00:21:06.840 Oh, my gosh. 0.98

00:21:07.800 Some of my best friends are fat. 0.92

00:21:08.560 Yeah.

00:21:09.860 But the point is not at all what is the range of things it's okay for a person to be.

00:21:17.380 Yeah.

00:21:17.540 The point is, what do we aspire to?

00:21:20.640 Yeah.

00:21:20.740 What are our images of excellence?

00:21:23.000 And to deny that there's such a thing as physical excellence is corrosive and demeaning and belittling to people.

00:21:30.680 And just obviously not true.

00:21:33.100 Right.

00:21:33.220 We all know that it's not.

00:21:34.540 I know, I say this as an international sex symbol.

00:21:37.460 Let's recognize physical beauty and excellence where it is.

00:21:41.160 Exactly.

00:21:41.680 Okay.

00:21:42.380 Did I read that one or you?

00:21:43.880 That was me.

00:21:44.520 That was you.

00:21:44.960 Okay.

00:21:45.080 I read this one.

00:21:46.580 America will not correct course and will cease to exist as we know it before 2050.

00:21:52.100 2050?

00:21:52.960 Yeah.

00:22:04.180 Correct.

00:22:05.280 Drink.

00:22:07.200 Go on.

00:22:09.000 You think I'm a pessimist about this?

00:22:12.040 Yes.

00:22:12.820 You think that I think America is doomed?

00:22:14.940 Yeah.

00:22:15.340 You're an editor at the Claremont Review.

00:22:17.180 Goodness gracious.

00:22:18.380 Well, I know that pessimism is like a favorite pastime of the conservative movement.

00:22:25.500 And I'm only saying no because of the absolutism of the prediction, which I reject out of hand.

00:22:30.520 I think nothing is written in the stars until it happens.

00:22:33.080 I also think, you know, things could go terribly wrong.

00:22:36.120 You can always see how things could go terribly wrong.

00:22:38.020 But there's a ton of, you know, energy and excitement also about recognizing the problem,

00:22:43.200 more than I think has been true in a long time.

00:22:45.700 So, no, I'm not a determinist about anything.

00:22:50.900 I think determinism is unmanly.

00:22:52.600 You know, I was wrong because I underestimated your optimism.

00:22:57.520 You were right because you overestimated my optimism.

00:23:02.720 Interesting.

00:23:02.900 My feeling is that America won't be so fundamentally different in the future from where we are now.

00:23:07.560 It'll just limp on it.

00:23:08.520 It'll just kind of, yeah, we're already on like a kind of a bad path.

00:23:12.360 But maybe we can change it.

00:23:13.300 I agree.

00:23:14.640 Determinism is for wimps. 1.00

00:23:15.940 Yeah, yeah. 1.00

00:23:16.340 Losers. 1.00

00:23:16.800 Right, right. 0.98

00:23:17.560 But there's a difference between a conservative optimist and a conservative pessimist.

00:23:21.940 That's okay.

00:23:22.760 A conservative pessimist says things can't get any worse.

00:23:26.420 And a conservative optimist says, oh, yes, they can.

00:23:28.520 Oh, yes, they can.

00:23:29.680 That's great.

00:23:30.400 Yes, I remember that.

00:23:31.520 Yeah, I mean, it's big like, you know, late Western Roman Empire hours.

00:23:35.480 Like 2050 is small.

00:23:37.040 That's nothing compared to the like horse.

00:23:39.220 You know, we could elect a horse as a senator. 0.76

00:23:40.840 We could do any sort of thing.

00:23:42.380 We may have.

00:23:42.780 All right, we got to answer some of these questions.

00:23:44.800 Okay.

00:23:45.140 Okay.

00:23:45.800 Ooh, good.

00:23:47.300 Stoicism is compatible with Christianity.

00:24:05.420 Yeah, okay.

00:24:08.420 Go on.

00:24:09.340 I mean.

00:24:10.040 You got me right.

00:24:11.060 It's a hard question.

00:24:11.660 It's another one of these hard questions because Paul reaches for the Stoics almost more than

00:24:17.680 any other.

00:24:18.220 I mean, I don't have like a tally, but I feel like he's more into the Stoics than any other

00:24:22.720 Greek philosopher.

00:24:23.820 And John, the prelude to John's gospel in the beginning was the word is obviously in some

00:24:29.940 deep consonants with Stoic metaphysics.

00:24:32.380 Yep.

00:24:32.460 But Stoicism full stop is incompatible with Christianity, right?

00:24:38.480 It's the cyclical notion of time, this whole thing that like the soul dissolves into atoms

00:24:44.540 like or whatever the soul is made out of, right?

00:24:48.080 That's incompatible.

00:24:49.140 But I think Stoicism is one of the most easily baptizable and most frequently baptized forms.

00:24:54.320 I noticed a lot of kind of tech bros and Silicon Valley types got really into Stoicism in the

00:24:59.580 last 10 years or so.

00:25:00.920 Yeah.

00:25:01.040 And I think that is not contrary to what I see as a Christian revival.

00:25:05.420 I think it's sort of part of the Christian revival.

00:25:08.120 But yes, ultimately, the two are not.

00:25:10.700 This is, I just wrote this whole, we're coming out with this new introduction to the Stoics,

00:25:15.220 gateway to the Stoics.

00:25:16.440 We're just reprinting some old translations, but I wrote a forward to it.

00:25:19.280 So I did a lot of this, like, you know, I went on the Reddit forum for Stoicism, which is huge.

00:25:24.500 I mean, like, who doesn't?

00:25:25.480 Yeah, every night, you know, right before bed, I'm...

00:25:27.880 I know, you think you're joking, but it's like half a million people are on it.

00:25:30.560 Like, these Reddit bros be like, you know, scrolling through Epictetus, you know?

00:25:35.920 And they talk about this stuff.

00:25:37.240 And I did find a lot of this kind of, it's sort of like Christian atheism, you know?

00:25:41.740 It's like, I like the thing that this delivers, but I don't want to like the bullet of metaphysics of it.

00:25:46.700 And so I did find a lot of people being like, well, you can't really talk about gods anymore.

00:25:52.120 But, you know, it's like, well, look, I mean, the things that appeal about Stoicism are all things that, you know,

00:25:57.100 we come to us through Christianity, like all men are brothers, right?

00:26:00.220 It's like, so who's their father, right?

00:26:02.700 All men are brothers.

00:26:03.540 Who's the dad, right?

00:26:04.900 Oh, we're all brothers.

00:26:05.820 Yeah, yeah, exactly.

00:26:06.740 I mean, we're not, it's not literally true.

00:26:08.080 So something must be spiritual about that and it must be real.

00:26:10.420 Yeah.

00:26:10.580 And I do think there's like a temptation among these people to be like, oh, I got Stoicism, now I have a false.

00:26:16.960 Now we're good.

00:26:17.820 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:26:18.300 It's like, you think, you think Tidus is epic, you know?

00:26:21.340 Just wait until you discover John.

00:26:23.920 Yeah, let me tell you about a little somebody called John of Patmos.

00:26:27.000 A little something, something.

00:26:29.380 Yeah, exactly.

00:26:30.960 It's okay to be white is a racist statement.

00:26:34.360 Oh.

00:26:35.880 This is too easy.

00:26:36.860 No, I'm joking.

00:26:40.080 I'm joking. 0.99

00:26:41.620 All right, you white supremacist. 0.94

00:26:42.960 It's not, it's not, that's not racist. 0.98

00:26:44.420 We're going to get kicked off of YouTube.

00:26:45.920 We are for this.

00:26:47.000 I know.

00:26:47.680 No, I think not only.

00:26:48.600 It's like I'm sitting across with Kanye here.

00:26:49.740 You said you're a white supremacist, you know?

00:26:51.600 You just called me a Jew.

00:26:53.120 I don't know.

00:26:55.520 I, uh, no.

00:26:56.700 I mean, not only is it okay to be white, not a racist statement,

00:27:01.940 but calling it a racist statement is how you end up with actual white supremacists.

00:27:07.360 Yeah, right.

00:27:08.540 At a certain point, I think, you know, I'm truly as open-minded, sort of.

00:27:15.100 I don't get angry.

00:27:15.680 I'm like the only guy in the conservative movement, probably other than you,

00:27:17.780 who doesn't get angry.

00:27:18.300 We were just talking about this backstage.

00:27:19.440 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:27:20.200 And I, and I don't think about race almost ever.

00:27:24.220 Right.

00:27:24.340 But I think, you know, if you're, if you just come up to me and you say like,

00:27:27.200 it's not okay to be white.

00:27:28.540 You know, I think like, well, all right.

00:27:29.620 Yeah, nobody would have ever had to, like, you know, I, it would have never,

00:27:32.500 it would have been completely ungentlemanly.

00:27:34.680 Yeah.

00:27:35.040 Like 20 years ago for me or anybody to be like, go out there and pump my fist

00:27:39.460 and be like, it's okay to be white, right?

00:27:41.160 Like that would just seem uncouth, you know?

00:27:43.460 And so naturally, I think you and I both are fairly affable fellows, you know?

00:27:47.600 We don't want to like go out here carrying signs that say things like, you know,

00:27:51.640 men are men, you know?

00:27:53.260 Nobody wants to be, better things to do with my time and more interesting things to say.

00:27:57.020 But like, but if you're going to call it into question, then yeah.

00:28:01.220 Yes, I got to say it.

00:28:02.240 Right.

00:28:02.560 I know.

00:28:03.260 I know.

00:28:03.640 We should drink to that.

00:28:04.460 We should.

00:28:04.820 Amen.

00:28:05.220 Cheers.

00:28:05.700 All right.

00:28:10.140 My turn, right?

00:28:10.940 Your turn.

00:28:11.440 Okay.

00:28:15.240 These are great.

00:28:16.600 Libertarians.

00:28:17.800 You guys did a great job.

00:28:19.240 Good job.

00:28:19.880 Well done, everybody.

00:28:21.620 We need to talk about grammar, but we'll get to that later.

00:28:23.700 Libertarians are basically communists who either shower or don't live off their parents.

00:28:32.460 That's the whole thing.

00:28:33.900 Well, fair enough.

00:28:35.640 Oh, boy.

00:28:36.780 Yeah.

00:28:39.220 Are you going to make me drink for that or no?

00:28:40.480 We obviously agree.

00:28:41.600 Oh, man.

00:28:42.900 I feel like I have to make you drink just to be like nice.

00:28:45.400 Yeah, we're all friends.

00:28:46.620 Look, some of my best friends are libertarians.

00:28:47.880 Yeah.

00:28:48.080 Truly.

00:28:48.480 I mean, truly.

00:28:48.980 Yeah.

00:28:49.280 That's what I was going to say. 0.98

00:28:49.840 Some of my best friends are fat. 0.99

00:28:50.740 Some of my best friends are fat libertarians. 0.98

00:28:52.180 But the statement is correct.

00:28:56.020 I mean.

00:28:58.260 The statement's correct because the libertarians and the communists, I think, ultimately share

00:29:03.640 the same view of anthropology.

00:29:07.040 Ultimately, they believe that men are fundamentally individuals born primarily in as much as we

00:29:13.680 have a political life with rights and entitlements.

00:29:17.380 And the commies say we're all individuals, and then they bunch us all up together in their

00:29:20.940 sort of hideous collective, and the libertarians just don't get to that next stage.

00:29:25.000 But both of them reject the reality of man as not merely an individual, but as a social

00:29:30.780 being, as a political animal born into a family, in time and space, into a community, into a

00:29:35.880 nation, with, I think, primarily duties and obligations and traditions.

00:29:41.780 And he has rights and things, too.

00:29:44.020 But that's not the primary fact of his political nature.

00:29:47.440 This is a great argument, and it's making me understand, I think, what my answer to this

00:29:52.740 question is.

00:29:56.000 Solzhenitsyn.

00:29:56.840 Sorry.

00:29:57.300 Dostoyevsky.

00:29:58.020 Do I have Jordan Peterson on the show?

00:29:59.220 Yeah, right, exactly.

00:30:02.140 Dostoyevsky, the narrator in Brothers Karamazov, very early on, says, socialism is just the

00:30:10.040 Tower of Babel project.

00:30:12.200 Yeah.

00:30:12.840 Done for real.

00:30:14.060 The effort to bring heaven down to earth.

00:30:15.800 Yeah.

00:30:15.960 And I think this is an extremely apt statement, and you are basically saying libertarians

00:30:22.540 and communists have the same fundamental idea about human personhood, which is that we are

00:30:28.980 interchangeable widgets.

00:30:30.700 And even though libertarians don't chase this to its logical conclusion, that is the Tower

00:30:35.780 of Babel project.

00:30:36.660 Let us all have one language, one place, just the total uniformity follows on from the idea

00:30:44.620 of the individual as seemingly autonomous, but actually just kind of empty, right?

00:30:49.680 Just consumer A, consumer B. And so my answer is actually, I think, going to be the same

00:30:55.960 as my answer about stoicism, which is to say stoicism alone cannot save. Libertarianism alone

00:31:02.400 is, you know, as like a totalizing philosophy of the world, is basically the metaphysics of

00:31:07.220 communism. But I know a lot of people who have libertarian ideas and leanings about how

00:31:11.820 we should operate within a constrained sphere, who are not really, you know, who think that

00:31:17.520 libertarianism is like an operating system that you can run within an already existing

00:31:21.580 computer called America.

00:31:22.940 Yes.

00:31:23.380 And the critique of libertarianism is, well, that computer is like now completely, has

00:31:28.000 gone viral.

00:31:28.720 Yeah, it's totally fried, in part because of like an excess of classical liberalism.

00:31:33.700 So, yeah, I don't think you have to drink, but go on.

00:31:36.300 Yeah, okay, but I'll drink anyway.

00:31:37.080 But right, why not?

00:31:37.720 In fact, your turn.

00:31:39.700 Okay, and by the way, Spencer, I just, I'm going to give you a little show business right

00:31:46.280 now.

00:31:46.560 They're telling me in my ear that they split this question into two cards.

00:31:50.860 I feel like I got the backstage pants.

00:31:53.220 You got it.

00:31:53.800 This is how it really works around you.

00:31:55.580 Are they, as the alien, are they giving you like directives?

00:31:58.120 They are.

00:31:58.580 They always are.

00:31:59.420 They're speaking when I have an earpiece in and when I don't.

00:32:01.720 This is all those, those computer theorists are going to, on Twitter, they're going to.

00:32:04.660 Mm-hmm.

00:32:05.060 Mm-hmm.

00:32:06.300 Conspiracy.

00:32:07.620 Realist.

00:32:07.980 Conspiracy scholars, shall we say.

00:32:12.480 We are being conditioned so that before the 2024 election, there will be a transgender 1.00

00:32:16.100 version of George Floyd along with the subsequent protests and social unrest.

00:32:23.920 Knowles, this is a fun game.

00:32:26.240 I like this game.

00:32:27.020 I love this game.

00:32:27.600 Yeah, people should buy this game.

00:32:28.720 It's a great game to get at home, by the way.

00:32:30.500 I don't know how much it costs or when you're going to get it, but it is going to sell out,

00:32:33.720 so you actually should.

00:32:34.340 But I did that, I did that just because you let me plug my book, so.

00:32:38.340 Mm-hmm.

00:32:38.580 Thank you.

00:32:39.020 Thank you very much.

00:32:39.840 They're going to, they're going to call this, they'll call it grift, but really it's just

00:32:42.760 friendship.

00:32:46.680 Whew, boy.

00:32:47.460 Okay, so, um, there will be a transgender version of George Floyd. 0.97

00:32:51.660 Yeah.

00:32:51.840 You've already put my drink.

00:32:52.760 I say no.

00:32:53.420 Oh my gosh.

00:32:53.840 Um, I say you say, I don't know what I say.

00:32:57.280 Or you don't know what I say.

00:32:58.120 I don't know what you say.

00:32:58.900 I don't think you know what you say either.

00:33:00.440 For that matter.

00:33:01.000 Half the time.

00:33:01.620 I create your answer by moving your martini.

00:33:04.440 Um, oof.

00:33:11.720 Yeah, no, that's not going to happen.

00:33:13.840 It's, there's like 12 of them, and I know that they're, they're trying to groom the kids

00:33:17.620 now, so it's, like, 20% plus of Gen Z, according to that one random survey.

00:33:22.740 Right, right, right.

00:33:23.460 They're questioning and everything, but, but, uh, no, it doesn't work.

00:33:26.660 There's a lot of kids out there who think they're transgender.

00:33:28.860 Yeah.

00:33:29.060 That's a very different thing.

00:33:30.200 Yeah.

00:33:30.400 From like, yeah.

00:33:31.380 Um.

00:33:32.160 Also, it's just, race is the line in America that actually has been an issue from the earliest

00:33:38.300 days of the country.

00:33:39.400 Right.

00:33:39.840 Whereas, this new gender fad is simply that. 0.98

00:33:43.880 There were no transgender plantations.

00:33:46.080 Yes.

00:33:46.380 There was not, like, an actual crime against humanity, like, embedded into our history

00:33:52.180 vis-a-vis transgender people.

00:33:53.760 Yes.

00:33:54.220 Yeah.

00:33:54.480 Um, whereas, you're right, like, the, the whole thing about race in America is that

00:34:00.260 they're actually grabbing onto something truly awful and traumatic in our past.

00:34:04.820 Yeah.

00:34:05.420 Um, and the other aspect of this is it's too specific.

00:34:09.780 It's like, you know, it's, it's a little tinfoil.

00:34:11.580 Um, but, uh, I certainly think if they could, they would.

00:34:16.960 I mean, the, the version of this that's kind of, that is real is, and this, we're going to

00:34:22.540 get banned for, like, five different reasons off of YouTube.

00:34:24.520 This is the end of this show.

00:34:25.940 I hope that's okay.

00:34:26.460 Yeah, that's fine.

00:34:26.820 I had a good run.

00:34:27.280 Yeah, right.

00:34:27.800 Exactly.

00:34:28.260 It sold some, sold some games.

00:34:29.380 Um, no, the, the version of this that is real is the, like, transgender people are being 1.00

00:34:36.440 murdered en masse in the streets, right?

00:34:38.800 They kind of have this line that goes on, and that is created to, and also, if you don't

00:34:44.780 pump your kid full of hormones, they'll commit suicide. 1.00

00:34:46.680 No, yeah, you've, you've killed your kid. 1.00

00:34:48.240 Right.

00:34:48.540 They totally hold you emotional hostage with all of these things, which are, which are

00:34:51.880 lies, right?

00:34:52.340 These are not true things.

00:34:53.940 Um, but no, I don't think they can fabricate out of nothing.

00:34:56.700 I mean, I don't think they fabricated George Floyd out of nothing, you know?

00:34:59.000 So, like, so, so, no.

00:35:00.080 Yeah.

00:35:00.340 Okay.

00:35:00.860 Yeah.

00:35:01.640 I'll drink anyway.

00:35:02.700 Yeah.

00:35:03.020 Why not?

00:35:03.560 Let's be honest.

00:35:04.400 Mm-hmm.

00:35:04.860 Mm.

00:35:05.860 I like where, I like the start.

00:35:07.240 I like where this is going.

00:35:08.440 95% of our political issues in America would be solved if benching 225 pounds was a requirement

00:35:17.360 to vote.

00:35:19.640 Mm.

00:35:20.640 Well.

00:35:23.120 Mm.

00:35:24.400 Mm.

00:35:24.680 Mm.

00:35:29.560 Yeah.

00:35:30.160 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:35:30.980 I agree.

00:35:31.220 You know, I, I remember one time, maybe it was Ann Coulter, said we need to repeal the

00:35:36.620 19th Amendment. 0.91

00:35:37.460 Mm-hmm.

00:35:38.140 And she's, I'm sure she said it more than one time.

00:35:40.400 Sure.

00:35:40.620 But I was talking to Elisa about this.

00:35:42.500 And Elisa, this was early on in our sweet little Elisa in my dating life.

00:35:47.420 Mm-hmm.

00:35:47.440 And she goes, oh my gosh, that's, that's crazy.

00:35:49.600 You know, come on.

00:35:50.260 And I sort of thought, and I said, well, what's the point of voting?

00:35:55.280 Because what, what you are being asked right now, you sweet little Elisa, would you give

00:35:58.880 up your vote to have a better political outcome?

00:36:02.480 Mm-hmm.

00:36:03.020 So I thought of it and I said, because women vote for Democrats and men vote for Republicans.

00:36:07.360 It's more complicated than that.

00:36:08.900 But basically.

00:36:09.380 But basically that's what it is.

00:36:10.380 Right, right.

00:36:10.840 And I thought, well, young people vote for Democrats. 0.56

00:36:15.200 Mm-hmm.

00:36:15.460 And older people vote for Republicans.

00:36:17.080 So if you told me tomorrow, Michael, the only people over 50 get to vote.

00:36:21.940 Right.

00:36:22.180 Would I agree to that?

00:36:23.340 I absolutely would agree to that.

00:36:25.040 I'd lose my vote.

00:36:26.480 Right, right.

00:36:27.940 But I'd have a better political outcome for my community.

00:36:30.860 Now, I'm not saying I can't bench 250 pounds.

00:36:33.140 No.

00:36:33.780 But.

00:36:34.360 Right.

00:36:35.060 If it were a risk that I couldn't. 0.95

00:36:37.140 Hypothetically.

00:36:37.620 In the hypothetical universe where you're not putting up three plates for reps.

00:36:40.500 Yeah, yeah.

00:36:40.860 Like a big beefcake that I am.

00:36:41.860 Like a big dude.

00:36:42.720 Yeah, right.

00:36:43.180 Exactly.

00:36:43.820 I would still go for it because it would have a better outcome for my political community.

00:36:48.000 Yeah, yeah.

00:36:48.360 This body by lasagna.

00:36:49.400 Well, okay, so I am in favor of voting.

00:36:57.440 I mean, I am not a, like, everybody must vote, you know, like.

00:37:01.140 Lower the age to five.

00:37:02.420 Yeah, exactly.

00:37:05.040 Twice, in fact, if, you know, if possible.

00:37:07.780 So, so I think, you know, I've heard good arguments for, like, you should own land to vote.

00:37:14.640 You know, I, I, I do think the question was, would our political outcomes be improved?

00:37:19.980 Yes.

00:37:20.260 And the answer to that question is certainly yes.

00:37:22.460 Totally.

00:37:23.580 The other question behind it is, should we therefore do it?

00:37:27.360 And I'm, I'm not, I'm enough of a lib to say just because you get better outcomes doesn't mean it's just.

00:37:31.700 Well, and you won't get it.

00:37:32.420 There's no, there is no mechanism within politics to actually do it.

00:37:35.060 But yes, would, if only GigaChads voted. 0.53

00:37:38.320 Yeah, yeah.

00:37:38.700 Would we have better political outcomes?

00:37:40.160 Yeah.

00:37:40.400 I just think that's a statistical fact.

00:37:42.000 Even, even lib gym bros are way more reasonable than lib, like, couch potatoes.

00:37:47.420 Totally, totally.

00:37:48.140 Okay.

00:37:48.520 Easy.

00:37:48.900 Okay.

00:37:49.700 I'm up.

00:37:51.060 There is at least a 51% chance JFK was not killed by the communist Lee Harvey Oswald.

00:37:57.280 Hmm.

00:37:57.480 51% chance that he was not killed by Oswald.

00:38:09.920 I think he was killed by hate.

00:38:14.300 There is an epidemic, the real epidemic.

00:38:16.300 The real epidemic.

00:38:17.100 Yeah, exactly.

00:38:17.700 No, no, he was killed by Oswald, I think.

00:38:19.420 Do, do the people who, like, I know there was just this release.

00:38:24.380 Yeah.

00:38:24.540 Where Tucker did a whole segment where he essentially said that the CIA was involved in JFK killing.

00:38:29.480 But, and there are all these files from the CIA and their relationship with Oswald that was sort of, have not come to pass.

00:38:36.140 But even still, does anybody say that Oswald didn't pull the trigger?

00:38:41.700 I am not up on this conspiracy theory.

00:38:43.840 Yeah.

00:38:43.960 This is like, I'm kind of, I like the, I'm into the moon ones, I'm into a, you know, like, I mess around with some of those.

00:38:50.240 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:38:50.980 But, like, this is one that kind of bores me because, yeah, I sort of think he did pull the trigger.

00:38:57.120 I, like, so, no, I don't think anybody thinks it was, like, Grover.

00:39:01.860 Like, who, like, a puppet.

00:39:03.600 Yeah, I don't, yeah, it wasn't just LBJ sitting on the knoll.

00:39:07.040 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:39:07.440 As much as he might have celebrated.

00:39:08.960 He would have been delighted.

00:39:09.820 Right, yeah, yeah.

00:39:10.360 Right.

00:39:10.680 Okay, all right.

00:39:11.260 Okay, that's good.

00:39:11.960 All right.

00:39:12.420 The only conspiracy theory that we have.

00:39:17.300 Ah, this is a good one.

00:39:19.460 The Respect for Marriage Act is neither respectful nor about marriage.

00:39:26.580 Hmm.

00:39:36.600 Respect for Marriage Act is neither respectful nor about marriage.

00:39:41.020 So we're saying, saying yes, it is not respectful or about marriage.

00:39:45.680 That's right.

00:39:46.100 If you agree that it is about neither of those things, you should say yes.

00:39:56.760 Hmm.

00:40:01.120 I was going to say no, and now that you've said that, I think maybe I do think yes.

00:40:06.180 Okay, don't drink and we'll explain the sides of this, I think.

00:40:10.100 Um, because, well, I'm going to drink anyway.

00:40:15.280 Are you, right, right.

00:40:16.060 First of all, did I, did I get it right?

00:40:17.500 Do you think that?

00:40:17.560 No, I would say it is, it is not about respect or marriage.

00:40:21.400 I don't think it's, I don't think it's at all.

00:40:22.260 Oh, so I also have to, I have to.

00:40:23.620 So you have to drink.

00:40:24.400 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:40:25.560 So, because I, I was thinking you would say, well, it is about marriage.

00:40:28.920 It's about.

00:40:29.660 It's about destroying marriage.

00:40:30.100 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:40:30.900 No, but the people who pushed it, the libs who pushed it, I don't think they give a damn

00:40:36.680 about marriage, and I don't think they want to respect people.

00:40:38.980 I think they want to drive Jack Phillips and Masterpiece Cake Shop out of business.

00:40:42.760 And they tried to do it through the court, and the court wouldn't let them do it.

00:40:45.880 And so now, and it's not, and they take the Obergefell decision, which redefines marriage,

00:40:50.940 and they go further than that.

00:40:52.440 And they say, no, no business, no wedding website maker, no cake shop owner, whatever,

00:40:59.840 is allowed to not participate in a gay marriage.

00:41:04.540 Totally.

00:41:05.240 And I think this is, that interpretation of it's not about marriage is definitely correct.

00:41:10.900 You know, I think it's about, it's nominally, obviously, about marriage.

00:41:14.880 But I agree that, and I've gotten a little red-pilled on this.

00:41:19.680 The moment is when they rejected the Lee Amendment, which basically just said in the, like,

00:41:25.660 kind of gentlest possible terms, perhaps you, you know, perhaps it's unconstitutional to

00:41:31.460 sue, not even an organization, but an individual out of existence because they expressed.

00:41:38.100 And so, yeah, I mean, I think, I agree with you about Obergefell.

00:41:42.060 I mean, we're on the same page, I think, about that.

00:41:44.060 And I think that, you know, when the bill first came up, I thought, well, I truly believe

00:41:50.980 that when it comes to, like, some sort of place in society for freedom-loving gay people,

00:41:58.740 like, we can work this out.

00:42:00.480 Do you know what I mean?

00:42:01.020 Like, we'll call it floof, we'll call it whatever.

00:42:02.860 Like, there's something, there's some arrangement that makes sense that recognizes that a man

00:42:07.040 and a woman producing children is at the center of our civic life, is marriage, but there are 0.98

00:42:13.240 these arrangements that kind of still have a place in our society.

00:42:15.900 I think there's, like, I really believe there's room for a good reasonable.

00:42:20.500 Which is the, that is the sort of Jonathan Peugeot, who made this point on another conversation

00:42:24.380 we were having where he said, you know, if you look at medieval manuscripts, there are

00:42:29.040 all these kind of odd and eccentric things all around the corners of the page.

00:42:33.440 The marginalia.

00:42:34.240 The marginalia.

00:42:34.900 But they're not at the, they're not at the center of the universe.

00:42:37.320 No, you wouldn't want the guy who's, like, farting a demon out to be, I'm not making

00:42:42.920 that up.

00:42:45.460 No, but I think this is, this is right.

00:42:47.600 And I think that, you know, anybody sensible of any political persuasion.

00:42:52.740 And so I thought, well, maybe there is some, Obergefell is not that.

00:42:57.180 And that's why I dispute it, not because of its outcome, but because of its logic is not

00:43:02.040 that, it's the logic of the, we talked about this before, the total all is the same, you

00:43:06.240 define your, you define reality, a man and a man in a relationship is the same as a man

00:43:10.480 and a woman in a relationship.

00:43:11.520 I think you can believe a man and a man in a relationship is okay, you can believe it's

00:43:16.340 not okay, but you can't believe it's the same.

00:43:18.980 Nobody seriously believes it.

00:43:20.500 Nobody can believe that.

00:43:21.360 Right.

00:43:21.540 Because that means that men and women are the same.

00:43:23.120 So that's, they're not the same, right?

00:43:24.440 And so when they, when they rejected little, little Mr. Lee, who is like, maybe you might

00:43:31.040 like to not sue people out of, out of business.

00:43:34.320 Then I was like, okay, so you're just totalitarian.

00:43:36.840 And so, yeah, my basic answer is like, yeah.

00:43:38.200 Trying to crush, yeah.

00:43:39.080 I know, I know.

00:43:40.220 I'll tell you one other thing about that, Bill, and then I guess we have to do another

00:43:43.520 question, but.

00:43:44.160 I guess, I don't know.

00:43:45.320 These are too interesting.

00:43:47.360 The other thing about that, Bill, that suddenly occurred to me is that all of these things

00:43:51.340 were going to codify, because we found out that actually you can't just write things

00:43:55.660 in.

00:43:55.840 If you just write things into law via the courts, you can actually unwrite them.

00:44:00.340 And this whole, it was this absurd thing that they did where it was like precedent.

00:44:03.680 You can't overturn precedent.

00:44:05.600 It's like, where does, what?

00:44:06.920 Like, where did you get that?

00:44:07.620 You can't overturn precedent, like Plessy.

00:44:08.900 No, no, Plessy.

00:44:09.980 Plessy, this is settled law.

00:44:11.940 Like, you know, right.

00:44:13.260 You don't want to do that.

00:44:14.200 So they found this out and they were like, well, what we really need, therefore, is a bill

00:44:17.740 to codify.

00:44:18.560 It's like, I have a news for you about Congress, like, every two years, like, we vote in new

00:44:26.340 people.

00:44:27.500 And it's like, if they ever did overturn Obergefell, which I think they should do, and I think we

00:44:32.120 should re-litigate this question, if they ever did that, like, you'd just vote on another

00:44:36.820 bill.

00:44:37.200 So it's like, you can do it.

00:44:38.160 You don't need the permission of the Supreme Court to pass a bill.

00:44:41.040 To pass it.

00:44:41.560 Right.

00:44:42.500 Everybody wants, on all these questions, abortion, on gay marriage, everybody wants some cataclysmic 1.00

00:44:47.780 victory that is going to, we're not going to have to think about it because one side

00:44:50.720 won.

00:44:51.340 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:44:51.760 That ain't politics in America. 0.99

00:44:53.940 Like, we are having this, let us have the damn discussion. 0.99

00:44:56.680 Anyway, that's. 0.99

00:44:57.360 Right.

00:44:57.860 Okay.

00:44:58.060 Yeah, very good point.

00:44:58.760 I'm glad we both drank on it, even though I don't really.

00:45:00.800 I don't, I can't remember what we said.

00:45:02.220 I can't, I mean, yeah, that's the point of the drinking.

00:45:04.440 Skipping leg day is a lot like attending, it's a lot like attending a liberal arts college

00:45:09.100 and staying committed to your cheating girlfriend.

00:45:11.940 In both cases, you are throwing your life away while also acting like a butter soft simp

00:45:18.640 who just hopes things will work themselves out.

00:45:23.260 Did they make these like more and more extravagant?

00:45:26.820 I don't think it's merely my perception.

00:45:28.460 No, no, it's not the, yeah.

00:45:30.020 Okay.

00:45:31.740 There's so much in that question.

00:45:33.320 I'm not even going to try to parse it.

00:45:34.640 I'm just going to take the spirit of it.

00:45:37.000 Right.

00:45:37.360 Right.

00:45:39.620 Yeah.

00:45:40.880 Which is, I was going to say, this is like pretty self.

00:45:46.380 I call it like I see it.

00:45:47.780 I like to think I'm quite unbiased.

00:45:49.660 Mm-hmm.

00:45:50.240 Yes.

00:45:50.520 Okay, even when my personal interest or ego are challenged by something.

00:45:55.020 Hypothetically, in Minecraft. 0.97

00:45:56.580 Hypothetically. 0.99

00:45:57.180 Calling balls and strikes.

00:45:58.460 That's what I do.

00:45:59.140 Yeah.

00:45:59.680 You're big into neutrality.

00:46:00.700 I'm a big neutrality guy.

00:46:02.120 You're a big neutrality guy.

00:46:04.500 Michael Knowles, famous neutrality enjoyer.

00:46:07.640 Average neutrality enjoyer.

00:46:09.780 Oh boy.

00:46:11.500 Generally speaking, if Protestants were to accept a tenet of Catholicism, either the Immaculate

00:46:17.940 Conception or Purgatory, it's more likely it would be Purgatory.

00:46:22.380 There are a lot of Protestants in the world.

00:46:29.800 There are a lot of Protestants.

00:46:30.960 That's a difficult question.

00:46:31.620 Yes, yes.

00:46:32.600 Many shades.

00:46:33.460 Yes.

00:46:33.760 Some say 30,000.

00:46:34.880 Some might say that's a strike against Protestantism in the great schismatic debates, but that's

00:46:41.480 a separate question.

00:46:46.900 Yeah.

00:46:47.560 Yes.

00:46:48.040 Okay.

00:46:48.420 Right.

00:46:48.560 Yeah, for sure.

00:46:49.200 Yeah.

00:46:49.560 It's very hard.

00:46:50.400 It's very hard for many Catholics to accept the Marian dogmas, to even accept that Mary 0.99

00:46:55.720 has a really important place in the faith.

00:46:57.560 For me, I was an atheist for 10 years.

00:46:59.200 I came back into the faith, in many ways through Protestants, some of whom now are Catholic,

00:47:04.520 actually, interestingly, or reverted to Catholicism.

00:47:07.120 But even for me, even well into it, the Marian stuff was tough for me. 0.99

00:47:13.420 Yeah.

00:47:13.700 And now, I find it so enriching and edifying and sanctifying and, like, really central.

00:47:23.660 Yeah.

00:47:24.240 If not perfectly central, like, quite close to it.

00:47:27.780 That's right.

00:47:28.420 My, this Protestant would accept, would take Mary before Purgatory, although I'm open to 0.99

00:47:34.940 both, I'm kind of like both of them, you know.

00:47:36.680 Yeah.

00:47:37.120 Um, I, I am your, I am an average Mary enjoyer, and I think, like, but, but the reason that

00:47:44.360 the correct answer to this is yes, is that people are ready, they'd be out there ready

00:47:48.500 to restart the 30 years war over this question.

00:47:51.340 I mean, if you talk to people, they will be like, they're Catholics, they are the idolaters 1.00

00:47:54.340 because they have another god, and she's a woman, and whatever. 0.79

00:47:56.740 They worship Mary.

00:47:57.480 They worship Mary, right.

00:47:58.720 No, you need, I mean, there is, um, C.S. Lewis says that what is beyond time and space

00:48:04.740 is so male that in relationship to it, we are all female.

00:48:08.680 This is true, this is beautiful, and it is right and just that the representative of humanity

00:48:13.720 and man's relationship to God should be a mother and a woman.

00:48:15.800 That's, that's, that to me, that's the beauty of the doctrine.

00:48:18.540 I disagree about the perpetual virginity.

00:48:20.360 There's also, but yes, that, I would, I would go with that first, but I think most people

00:48:23.100 would take it.

00:48:23.600 That's great.

00:48:23.980 But on the next game, we'll, we'll, we'll talk about marriage and virginity.

00:48:27.480 But it is, I, I do remember, I remember when you got Mary-pilled and, and, or as you became

00:48:33.260 increasingly Mary-pilled, and it is, it is harder.

00:48:35.380 It's, purgatory, some of my Protestant, you know, they don't like it, but they can kind 0.99

00:48:40.240 of see more, see more of it, but, yeah, we'll have to do a whole yes or no game on Mary. 0.98

00:48:46.300 On Mary, yeah, I think the doctrinal questions.

00:48:48.960 Uh, you, yeah.

00:48:50.660 That's me, okay.

00:48:51.460 Mm-hmm.

00:48:51.660 Sisyphus is rolling a boulder toward the Grand Hilbert Hotel.

00:48:57.240 The hotel has an infinite number of rooms, but they are full, so they may not be able

00:49:01.700 to accommodate him or his boulder.

00:49:03.620 If he chooses to divert his boulder, it will instead destroy the ship of Theseus.

00:49:08.780 But the ship has had all of its constituent parts replaced, so it may not actually be the

00:49:15.340 same ship.

00:49:16.840 Is Sisyphus happy?

00:49:18.580 I think, I know, did people send these questions in, or did the producers just write them?

00:49:24.840 I think the producers just write them.

00:49:26.340 Wow.

00:49:27.340 I feel like I know exactly who asked this question, but I can't, I must be wrong.

00:49:31.600 Uh, it's too late in the game to answer this question in a serious way.

00:49:38.240 Uh, also no.

00:49:39.740 He's pushing a boulder up.

00:49:40.900 He's pushing a boulder.

00:49:41.420 You know, that's not, you can't be happy.

00:49:42.540 This is not happy.

00:49:43.620 Right.

00:49:43.880 It's not all.

00:49:44.620 This is not happy.

00:49:45.700 There will be no existentialism sympathy on this here podcast.

00:49:50.600 We will not accept even I. 1.00

00:49:52.540 Not your folks.

00:49:53.520 No. 0.99

00:49:54.120 Stoicism, libertarianism, fat people.

00:49:56.840 We can entertain all of these possibilities, but existentialism is a bridge too far. 0.98

00:50:02.240 You get your dirty camu out of here.

00:50:03.820 I can't believe you brought up the C word on this here. 0.84

00:50:08.440 It's a good name for a band, Dirty Camu.

00:50:10.840 Uh, if I had to pick between pre-, mid- and post-tribulation, oh, I hate this whole thing.

00:50:16.020 This is bad.

00:50:16.960 I'm like the least Protestant Protestant.

00:50:18.180 Pre-, mid- and post-tribulation?

00:50:19.560 Am I going to have to explain what this is?

00:50:20.180 You're speaking Greek?

00:50:20.820 I don't know what you're talking about.

00:50:21.420 Yeah, exactly.

00:50:22.020 Uh, I tend to side with the left-behind movie take and think rapture would be pre-tribulation.

00:50:29.560 That sounds to me much more complicated than the Sisyphus question.

00:50:32.580 It's vastly more complicated, and this is a series of questions.

00:50:37.580 Whatever.

00:50:38.180 But do your answer, and then I will go on my way.

00:50:39.540 Sure.

00:50:39.560 Well, I've got to move yours.

00:50:40.120 That's the wrong one.

00:50:40.820 I'm sorry.

00:50:40.940 So.

00:50:43.780 Uh.

00:50:44.660 I don't even know what the question was.

00:50:46.540 Uh, I'm going to say no because, no.

00:50:48.820 Yeah.

00:50:49.240 Yeah.

00:50:49.540 Whatever.

00:50:50.000 I mean, sure.

00:50:50.620 Why not?

00:50:52.800 Okay.

00:50:53.620 I'm being the worst Protestant here because this is like, especially for evangelical Protestants, 1.00

00:50:59.060 this is a matter of utmost concern.

00:51:01.260 I've had so many people ask me about this.

00:51:03.280 This is about the end times?

00:51:05.020 It's about the end times.

00:51:06.400 It's about whether the thousand-year reign is going to be, I'm going to get this so,

00:51:10.240 so bungled, but it's about whether, like, the lake of fire and the thousand-year reign,

00:51:14.480 like, when is Christ coming in between?

00:51:16.480 Like, when does Christ actually come back?

00:51:18.800 Yeah, yeah.

00:51:19.180 And then what happens after that?

00:51:21.060 What happens before it?

00:51:22.780 To me, this is a question on which we are expressly told we have no idea.

00:51:30.360 No one knows the day or the hour.

00:51:31.780 No one, not even the sun, but only the Father in heaven.

00:51:35.000 And so I find all of this to be vastly above my pay grade.

00:51:38.740 I think the book of Revelation is a profound mystic vision, which, if read carefully, it's

00:51:44.580 like people always say, is the tribulation, is the revelation, whatever, is it about the

00:51:49.580 sacking of the temple in, you know, by the Romans after Christ's death, or is it about

00:51:54.200 some cosmic thing?

00:51:55.560 And it's like, yes.

00:51:56.660 Yeah.

00:51:56.980 The answer is yes.

00:51:57.640 Yes.

00:51:57.780 Like, you know, there are real historical events that this refers to, and those historical

00:52:01.200 events—

00:52:01.580 Is the book of Revelation a mystical description of the Holy Mass?

00:52:05.840 Yes.

00:52:06.280 Yes?

00:52:06.480 Yes, it is.

00:52:07.280 Right.

00:52:08.700 And so all of this simply to say, like, stop worrying about it.

00:52:13.960 Yes.

00:52:14.360 Yeah.

00:52:14.880 I agree.

00:52:16.100 Let's drink to that.

00:52:16.900 Let's drink to that.

00:52:17.620 Yeah, yeah.

00:52:20.920 You read the tribulation.

00:52:22.280 Yeah, yeah. 0.99

00:52:23.060 Science is fake and gay. 0.99

00:52:31.880 Obviously. 0.98

00:52:32.340 I mean, right?

00:52:33.000 Didn't you just give a little speech about this?

00:52:34.380 I remember saying that.

00:52:35.340 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:52:36.120 I mean, I've recently been a little bit, like, libed on this in that what I really think 0.55

00:52:40.700 is fake and gay is scientism. 0.98

00:52:43.980 Mm-hmm. 0.99

00:52:44.220 And I think that natural philosophy is a venerable thing to do.

00:52:47.960 Yes.

00:52:48.180 And I think that people who—

00:52:49.780 But—

00:52:50.100 I didn't say—or, well, I didn't say any of these.

00:52:52.220 Natural philosophy. 0.90

00:52:53.120 I would never say natural philosophy is fake and gay.

00:52:56.020 I think most of the time what people mean when they say science is a thing that is fake 0.95

00:53:01.160 and gay. 0.96

00:53:01.580 Yes. 0.93

00:53:01.860 And that is scientism.

00:53:04.880 Easy.

00:53:05.500 Easy.

00:53:05.960 Yeah, yeah.

00:53:06.360 The referent of the word science.

00:53:08.980 The understood referent.

00:53:11.040 Oof.

00:53:11.420 It is okay to wear sweatpants in public.

00:53:15.860 Hmm.

00:53:16.180 It's very hard when one does not go to the gym to understand the thinking of one who

00:53:29.600 does go to the gym.

00:53:30.800 What are you saying?

00:53:31.320 Are you saying you don't—

00:53:32.440 Are you saying—

00:53:32.700 No, no, no.

00:53:33.040 No, right, no, no. 0.99

00:53:33.680 Hypothetically.

00:53:34.080 Yeah, yeah.

00:53:36.620 I'm sitting here in my t-shirt with a man in a suit.

00:53:39.020 No, I think—

00:53:40.100 But you're not wearing sweatpants.

00:53:42.820 That's right.

00:53:44.300 I'm not wearing sweatpants.

00:53:46.120 The question hinges on the meaning of the word in public.

00:53:48.680 So I think I'm going to make you drink because I will sweatpants to the gym.

00:53:52.260 You were correct on my end.

00:53:53.600 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:53:55.020 Would you wear—if, hypothetically, you were to go to the gym, would you wear sweatpants

00:53:58.540 to—

00:53:58.700 Spencer, I would not wear sweatpants in private.

00:54:00.140 No, you would wear a bow tie to the gym.

00:54:02.600 I would.

00:54:03.560 Yes.

00:54:04.200 I can't—I did—no, I wouldn't count the gym as in public.

00:54:09.080 I mean, I'm saying, you know, the one walking down the street, I would not.

00:54:12.000 But there was a period where The Daily Wire was going to make a movie, and I was told to

00:54:18.200 beef up for this movie.

00:54:19.240 Oh, I remember.

00:54:20.340 When I said body by lasagna, I wasn't counting.

00:54:22.140 No, this is true.

00:54:22.820 I remember you eating all that.

00:54:23.140 I was shoveling in pasta, pizza, meat, all this stuff.

00:54:27.300 And I really did gain—I gained 20 pounds, and I cut my body fat in half.

00:54:30.500 So it was actually muscle.

00:54:31.560 I never cut—I never actually cut after, but I—

00:54:35.440 No, you did it, bro.

00:54:36.400 You totally—I remember.

00:54:37.920 First time of my life.

00:54:38.760 Only time of my life.

00:54:39.780 And I did purchase a pair of sweatpants for the occasion, and a pair of sneakers also to

00:54:44.820 wear.

00:54:44.920 Yeah, yeah.

00:54:45.180 And they have not had much use since then.

00:54:48.180 Did you—when you put them on, did you scream, Adrian?

00:54:51.380 Adrian!

00:54:53.020 I tried to break my nose a few times so that it would look convincing.

00:54:58.160 Okay.

00:54:58.360 Most likely, the elites at the top, such as Bill Gates, George Soros, and Klaus Schwab,

00:55:05.020 are all just possessed by demons and or directly worship the devil in an attempt to transcend

00:55:10.560 the human race and merge with their existence in a higher plane.

00:55:14.960 Due to YouTube rules, make your guess, but do not verbally confirm if the other person

00:55:22.040 guessed correctly.

00:55:23.040 Give only an ambiguous, nonverbal confirmation.

00:55:30.500 Gates, Soros, and Schwab all worship demons or are possessed by demons.

00:55:34.800 I feel afraid to speak.

00:55:36.920 I think I've just signed some sort of—

00:55:38.700 Don't speak.

00:55:39.100 —terms of service.

00:55:39.820 All right.

00:55:40.080 I won't speak.

00:55:44.340 Can we talk about it?

00:55:52.560 Do we just have to—

00:55:53.240 You can talk about things.

00:55:55.880 You can talk in the abstract.

00:55:57.280 In the abstract, in Minecraft, let me tell a little story.

00:56:04.040 Mm-hmm.

00:56:04.320 When Dobbs came down as an actual decision, and when Roe v. Wade was overturned, I saw on

00:56:15.780 Reddit in a Satanist forum, somebody struggling with whether or not to convert to Satanism.

00:56:25.600 And one poster said, Satanism isn't really about worshiping Satan.

00:56:34.700 It's just about bodily autonomy and privacy.

00:56:39.980 It's really enlightenment virtues.

00:56:43.520 And I thought, boy, do I have news for you.

00:56:49.180 And that's my only answer to that question.

00:56:52.860 It's my very good answer.

00:56:54.040 All right.

00:56:54.300 Very good answer.

00:56:54.720 The war in Ukraine is roughly 5% crazy Russians and 95% money laundering for the new world 0.99

00:57:05.420 order.

00:57:12.440 I have to think what you say.

00:57:14.120 You are right.

00:57:20.460 Yeah, you have to drink.

00:57:21.760 Oh, good.

00:57:22.740 Okay.

00:57:23.080 All right.

00:57:23.660 I don't think it's money laundering for the new world order.

00:57:26.760 I think it's an imperial war between the Western Empire and the Eastern Empire of Russia.

00:57:30.900 And I think that any—the West is dishonest when they say it's about national independence

00:57:37.320 for Ukraine.

00:57:37.940 That's obviously absurd.

00:57:38.960 It's about getting Ukraine to join NATO and the broader Western alliance.

00:57:45.620 And that's why when there was a pro-Russian leader of Ukraine before 2014, we wielded our

00:57:51.580 political power, as great powers do, to influence the politics in that country and housed the

00:57:58.880 pro-Russian guy and put in a more favorable pro-Western guy.

00:58:02.320 And then Russia responded to that by increasing its influence operations, including military

00:58:09.080 operations in Ukraine.

00:58:10.720 And then Obama, because he was weak, wasn't able to stop that.

00:58:14.440 And Trump was able to stop these things.

00:58:15.920 He was able to at least put a pause on them.

00:58:17.540 And then Biden essentially invited Russia—I mean, actually invited Russia to invade when

00:58:22.680 he said if it's only a minor incursion in the East, then we won't really do anything

00:58:25.500 about it.

00:58:26.340 And so Russia did that. 0.71

00:58:27.420 And Russia said it's unacceptable for Ukraine to join NATO.

00:58:30.520 And Ukraine is a buffer state, and buffer states often do better when they play great 0.62

00:58:36.040 powers off of one another than when they declare an allegiance to one or the other.

00:58:39.660 That's often the proximate cause of war.

00:58:41.620 And I think that's what happened in Ukraine.

00:58:43.980 All those beautiful towers.

00:58:49.500 Yeah.

00:58:51.680 No, that's very eloquently said.

00:58:55.460 I think people misunderstand—the transgender question is like this, too.

00:58:59.500 I think people misunderstand how the new world order works.

00:59:03.340 And I think you see this with COVID as well.

00:59:07.060 Yeah.

00:59:07.600 That, oh, it's the pandemic, or they engineered this in a lab.

00:59:11.500 No, no.

00:59:12.140 They don't have—they're nowhere near competent enough to orchestrate these massive global

00:59:16.600 events.

00:59:17.740 What's true is that they have a totalizing philosophy about how the world works, which

00:59:24.860 is anti-human, which is, you know, post-human in some ways, which is evil and wrong, and which

00:59:35.340 inclines them to respond—the only thing restraining that philosophy is circumstances.

00:59:43.160 The fact that we live in a country which is still nominally a constitutional republic,

00:59:47.420 to which politicians must still pay some form of lip service in order to succeed and so forth,

00:59:52.140 that held them back for however many years from saying what they already believed long ago about

00:59:58.700 public health.

00:59:59.540 It's not like COVID brought into being some new attitude about public health, right?

01:00:06.120 And in fact—

01:00:06.800 It barely brought into being a new virus.

01:00:08.820 Exactly.

01:00:09.100 It's just a variation on an old virus.

01:00:10.460 Exactly.

01:00:11.120 And so, similarly, I don't think that any—I don't think that, like, money—nobody orchestrated

01:00:16.640 the war in Ukraine to launder money.

01:00:18.900 Right.

01:00:19.620 The war in Ukraine happened for a number of reasons, among them those that you just laid

01:00:24.120 out.

01:00:25.400 And it is the case that our leadership class is feckless, incompetent, and foundationally,

01:00:32.980 philosophically wrong about metaphysics, which makes you evil. 0.84

01:00:36.660 Being wrong about metaphysics makes you evil, even if you don't sit there with your hand—rubbing

01:00:40.820 your hands together.

01:00:41.800 Right.

01:00:42.240 Right.

01:00:42.500 Good point.

01:00:43.040 Am I up?

01:00:43.780 Oh, sorry.

01:00:44.300 It's you.

01:00:44.460 I'm up.

01:00:44.740 It's you.

01:00:45.140 Okay.

01:00:46.620 They are pervasive and key pillars of some of the most influential and wealthy brands

01:00:52.400 in America.

01:00:53.720 They strike at the very heart of American civilization and must be eradicated from society if the West 0.79

01:00:59.660 is to have a fighting chance at survival.

01:01:01.020 But to mention them is to be looked down upon with derision and contempt.

01:01:06.920 By they and them, I mean seed oils.

01:01:16.240 Wow.

01:01:17.360 I was a little nervous, fellas.

01:01:19.020 Yeah.

01:01:19.800 A little nervous.

01:01:22.940 Woo.

01:01:27.580 Duh.

01:01:28.400 Oh, yeah.

01:01:28.940 Duh.

01:01:29.260 Come on.

01:01:30.120 At this point—

01:01:30.980 Does this need defending?

01:01:31.900 Yeah.

01:01:32.420 At this point, I believe that one's view of seed oils is far more indicative of one's

01:01:41.260 entire political outlook and whether or not I agree with a person than their view on immigration

01:01:47.820 or whatever.

01:01:48.840 Right?

01:01:49.060 It is one of the most defining political issues, even though it seems somewhat out of left field.

01:01:55.040 Yeah.

01:01:55.220 These are way deeper signifiers.

01:01:57.000 And this is, like, a generational thing that you have a hard time explaining to older people

01:02:00.700 because it's—

01:02:01.040 It is definitely more of a millennial—

01:02:03.160 Yeah, yeah. 1.00

01:02:03.540 This is why you get—it's not because boomers are, like, stupid or wrong. 1.00

01:02:06.460 Yeah. 1.00

01:02:06.600 It's like, you know, they say things like, you don't believe in, like, unfettered free

01:02:09.980 markets.

01:02:10.460 Like, you must be—because, like, that was once—that was once seed oils.

01:02:13.480 Like, that was once the, like, signifying issue.

01:02:16.800 But the seed oil thing.

01:02:17.840 I'm totally—

01:02:18.840 Totally.

01:02:19.380 And I get more pushback on this than anywhere.

01:02:22.360 But also more engagement.

01:02:23.820 Like, people are—

01:02:24.660 Do you know how crazy Elisa's gotten with this, sweet little Elisa?

01:02:27.380 She says to me—I mean, she's gone down the rabbit hole.

01:02:30.120 No plastics in the house and—

01:02:32.340 Well, I mean, there's plastics.

01:02:33.280 Right.

01:02:33.380 But not with our cooking that we heat up.

01:02:35.380 And no seed oils.

01:02:36.560 It's all butter or avocado or olive oil, which I think are much tastier anyway.

01:02:41.380 But then she goes to me.

01:02:42.320 She says,

01:02:42.700 Mac!

01:02:44.020 What?

01:02:45.220 You gotta get rid of your right guard deodorant.

01:02:48.400 And because I have, I'm like an old—I'm an old man, so I use the spray aerosol deodorant.

01:02:52.360 Sure.

01:02:52.680 She goes, Mac! 1.00

01:02:53.200 You gotta get rid of that.

01:02:53.940 It's pure poison.

01:02:55.740 Like, okay, what do I have to do?

01:02:56.960 She goes, I got this deodorant that you gotta try.

01:02:59.420 It's made of—

01:03:00.700 And I kid you not, it's made of grass-fed beef tallow.

01:03:05.560 I was—honestly, I was gonna say yak butter, and that wasn't far off.

01:03:09.040 You were not far off.

01:03:09.920 You were too timid.

01:03:11.600 Yeah.

01:03:11.940 Yes.

01:03:12.240 Right.

01:03:13.940 Do you know—so I said, how much does this cost?

01:03:16.340 I'm still on my first bottle.

01:03:18.000 No.

01:03:18.400 And probably my only bottle.

01:03:20.200 I said, how much did you pay for this?

01:03:21.580 Is that what this is?

01:03:22.420 Is that—I've been wondering.

01:03:23.680 That's what you're—yeah, yeah.

01:03:24.820 This beautiful musk.

01:03:26.540 This aromatic, sort of natural—yeah, right.

01:03:30.740 I said, how much did you pay for—how much did I pay for this?

01:03:32.740 She goes, I don't want to tell you.

01:03:34.860 I said, how—well, what was it?

01:03:37.340 Was it—because my right guard said $3.

01:03:39.200 I said, was it like—was it like $5 or $6?

01:03:43.620 No.

01:03:45.500 $10?

01:03:47.440 No.

01:03:47.760 $22.

01:03:52.120 And I think, do I really want to live that bad?

01:03:54.440 Do I want to live $22 bad?

01:03:56.280 I don't know.

01:03:57.160 I shave a few years off my life.

01:03:58.980 I save $22.

01:03:59.940 Yeah, yeah.

01:04:00.280 I think that's fine.

01:04:00.900 How much do you care about the ozone layer?

01:04:03.280 Yeah.

01:04:03.800 If I'm in a state of grace, I'll get to go to heaven eventually.

01:04:06.160 Yeah, I understand.

01:04:06.580 I need a million or two years in purgatory.

01:04:07.880 No, I think this is a million years in purgatory, you know.

01:04:11.520 It's like this or that.

01:04:13.220 No, I—that is hilarious.

01:04:17.580 And the question is not, are our foods killing us?

01:04:21.780 The question, as you say, is how much are we willing—how much are we willing to do about it?

01:04:26.300 No, I remember when this was a crunchy granola lib thing, and now it's like a hard-wing white nationalist.

01:04:32.540 Anti-vax used to be a crunchy granola lib thing.

01:04:34.860 Yes.

01:04:35.440 Now it's a total conservative.

01:04:36.680 Right.

01:04:36.920 It just depends on—my biggest conspiracy theory, and I'm going to say this is the first time I'm saying this on camera,

01:04:41.480 but I've said this to a lot of Daily Wire guys.

01:04:43.660 We—you and I will live to see the day when nicotine is good for you.

01:04:49.120 When the health industry—

01:04:51.380 Your mouth to God's serious.

01:04:52.620 Yeah, amen, amen.

01:04:55.040 Oh, dang.

01:04:56.300 Speaking of conspiracy—this is my—this is my big conspiracy theory.

01:05:00.200 I don't know how to pronounce—I still don't.

01:05:01.860 I refuse to learn.

01:05:03.020 The fact that you just said that, I bet I could tell you.

01:05:04.880 Do you know what it's going to be?

01:05:05.760 Yes.

01:05:06.460 If it's your—this is your—

01:05:07.960 This is my personal proprietary conspiracy theory.

01:05:10.800 Does it have to do with a certain secretary?

01:05:13.700 It does.

01:05:14.120 To answer, okay.

01:05:14.800 It certainly does.

01:05:15.280 Somebody knew—first of all, I still don't know, and I refuse ever to learn how to pronounce the name that begins this question.

01:05:23.620 Chasten Buttigieg is most likely aware Pete is a deeply closeted, straight CIA plant.

01:05:35.580 I mean—

01:05:36.660 Duh.

01:05:37.480 Obviously.

01:05:38.100 How could they do it without his—

01:05:39.380 This is actually your—the first and maybe only time I've heard this is from you.

01:05:44.360 Oh, yeah.

01:05:44.940 Nobody else.

01:05:45.780 This is my—I totally—I'm actually—

01:05:48.700 Buttigieg is not gay.

01:05:49.860 That's your theory.

01:05:50.200 I will almost—this is my theory.

01:05:51.280 I will almost never claim ownership over—if I see an idea that I think maybe somebody got this for my piece, whatever, this is one that I will die on this hill.

01:05:58.980 I invented this, but I'm sure I'm right. 0.60

01:06:01.520 That man is not a homosexual.

01:06:05.200 Yeah.

01:06:05.860 Yeah.

01:06:06.260 He's an opportunist.

01:06:08.480 Yes.

01:06:09.260 And—

01:06:09.660 A cynic.

01:06:10.200 He understood that the way the wind was blowing, you could never—as a kind of, you know, Ivy League—I don't actually know if you—probably Ivy League.

01:06:18.040 Harvard, wasn't it?

01:06:18.620 I think he was a Harvard guy.

01:06:19.460 Yeah, yeah, so Ivy League, yeah, you know, veteran, JFK mold lib.

01:06:26.820 Yes.

01:06:27.200 Once he realized that that was passing away and you had to check an identity box, what's the identity box you can check?

01:06:32.720 Yeah.

01:06:33.100 Easiest.

01:06:33.720 Yes.

01:06:34.640 Marry a man. 0.87

01:06:35.600 Now, do you have evidence for your theory?

01:06:40.100 Other than his—look, his poor taste?

01:06:41.920 The evidence?

01:06:44.300 His incapacity to match his ties with his slacks? 1.00

01:06:49.460 Like—

01:06:49.960 That's good evidence.

01:06:55.420 Yeah, right.

01:06:55.820 I tell you, you know, because some of the audience might not know that we're college buddies.

01:07:00.260 That's right.

01:07:00.780 Going back to your freshman year, my sophomore year.

01:07:03.300 So, yeah, when you said we've known each other, we've been friends for many years.

01:07:05.640 Yes, many, many years.

01:07:07.120 But because we went to a very liberal, elite school, we know a lot of these guys.

01:07:13.780 We do.

01:07:14.440 A lot of these guys, and there's a type.

01:07:16.260 And they're all—

01:07:17.800 They all look like Pete.

01:07:18.580 They all look like Pete.

01:07:20.060 They all kind of, you know, they all just kind of sound like Pete.

01:07:22.980 And they're all—they're going to go get a job after college because they're really passionate about management consulting.

01:07:27.320 Totally consulting.

01:07:28.480 Consultancy.

01:07:28.980 Yeah, yeah.

01:07:29.080 I just really want to improve efficiency within certain corporate structures.

01:07:33.400 This is a very good impression.

01:07:34.540 And then he goes and he, you know, he has—he is a military veteran.

01:07:38.180 Yes.

01:07:38.840 And he did the Ivy League, and he did the corporate consulting, and he's just the perfect political candidate, except old Pete is a pretty bland white guy.

01:07:48.580 Yeah.

01:07:48.680 And so you're saying he had to have something, and I—

01:07:54.080 I don't understand why it's more artificial than any other part of his personality for him to pretend to—you know what I mean?

01:08:01.180 Like, all these guys are cooked up in a lab.

01:08:04.000 They, you know, carefully curate, as we know from rubbing shoulders with them, they carefully curate every aspect of their life, including their disavowal of the curation.

01:08:15.800 Right, like, including, like, oh, I just—I'm so—like you said, I'm so passionate about, like, you know, synergistic incentivization of, like, spreadsheets.

01:08:24.280 Birth control in Africa, whatever.

01:08:26.660 Like, name it.

01:08:27.440 But then they get into power, and they—right.

01:08:29.940 And, like, that pipeline was so clear that he wasn't going to let a little thing, like, being a heterosexual stop him.

01:08:37.620 Like, look, for the right price, you know, I'm whatever sexuality.

01:08:41.160 Yeah.

01:08:41.320 You know, I mean, it's, like, it was better than, like, castrating himself and being the first trans candidate, you know?

01:08:47.200 Lucky Pete, he came along, you know, five years, just in time. 0.96

01:08:50.780 Because let me tell you, that gate is closing on white gay men, like, you know? 1.00

01:08:54.460 It's like— 0.94

01:08:55.220 Yeah, it's about to be part of the established power class.

01:08:59.500 Exactly.

01:08:59.880 So, do we know who won?

01:09:01.920 I think we both won, Spencer.

01:09:03.280 I feel that I won, and I think—

01:09:05.060 Shin Shin, you probably did.

01:09:08.180 No, I mean, just by being here.

01:09:09.820 Yeah.

01:09:10.020 Yeah.

01:09:10.700 Yeah, you're right.

01:09:11.860 Cheers to that.

01:09:13.320 I'm a little ashamed of us, because we've gone out many times, had many, many cigars, many, many—we only had—you had your full drink.

01:09:20.920 I think—

01:09:21.100 I'm a little child here.

01:09:22.540 I only had half of my mind.

01:09:23.380 Well, we were so engaged in—

01:09:24.920 You're right.

01:09:25.360 —the profundities.

01:09:26.360 You're right.

01:09:26.700 That's true.

01:09:27.680 Spencer, you've already finished yours, Shin Shin.

01:09:29.900 Cheers to that.

01:09:30.200 To your health.

01:09:31.000 Yes.

01:09:31.380 We will see you next time on the Yes or No Game.

01:09:34.120 We'll see you next time.

01:09:35.420 Thank you.

01:09:36.520 Chaos

The Michael Knowles Show - December 30, 2022

Spencer Klavan is STUNNED By Michael's Answer ｜ YES or NO

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