The Michael Knowles Show - ＂What's Hidden In The Vatican？＂ FACE-Off Bishop Barron Vs Michael Knowles

00:00:00.000 These are questions that take cultures thousands of years to answer.

00:00:04.740 During Answer the Call, I take questions from people just like you

00:00:07.920 about their problems, opportunities, challenges, or when they simply need advice.

00:00:12.700 How do I balance all of this grief, responsibility?

00:00:15.800 How do you repair this kind of damage?

00:00:18.080 My daughter, Michaela, guides the conversations

00:00:20.540 as we hopefully help people navigate their lives.

00:00:24.080 Everyone has their own destiny. Everyone.

00:00:30.000 Which of the following is a popular but unproven conspiracy theory

00:00:36.320 about the Vatican Archive?

00:00:37.540 That they house a time machine,

00:00:38.880 they contain proof that aliens existed on Earth,

00:00:41.200 they hold the lost gospel of Jesus,

00:00:43.140 they house the Ark of the Covenant.

00:00:44.640 I've never heard the alien. That's kind of funny.

00:00:47.020 There's the Area 51.

00:00:48.760 The best is the Ark of the Covenant.

00:00:49.940 If they really have the Ark of the Covenant,

00:00:51.360 which is some plausibility.

00:00:53.580 The Vatican does not have aliens, correct?

00:00:55.700 Not that I know of, yeah.

00:00:58.180 In preparation for the Pope and the Fuhrer, 0.82

00:01:00.360 the secret Vatican files of World War II,

00:01:02.960 streaming exclusively on Daily Wire Plus,

00:01:04.820 August 13th,

00:01:05.800 we're stepping inside the smallest country in the world

00:01:08.140 with some of the biggest secrets,

00:01:09.800 Vatican City.

00:01:10.920 Our competitors?

00:01:12.100 In one corner, Michael Knowles,

00:01:13.440 who's here to uncover the real third secret of Fatima

00:01:15.900 and promote his new documentary.

00:01:17.640 And he's all out of promo scripts.

00:01:19.620 And in the other corner, Bishop Robert Barron,

00:01:21.300 a man who knows the Vatican and its secret archives so well,

00:01:24.300 he might just break news and reveal lost secrets

00:01:26.520 right here on this very show.

00:01:28.400 Hopefully.

00:01:29.240 Maybe.

00:01:30.040 Please.

00:01:30.520 I hope so.

00:01:31.140 Let's get into it.

00:01:31.920 This is Face Off, Vatican Mysteries.

00:01:37.840 Gentlemen, thank you so much for being here.

00:01:39.520 Ben, thanks for having me on my own show.

00:01:41.580 How does a Protestant know about the third secret of Fatima? 0.97

00:01:44.080 I didn't know you knew what that was.

00:01:45.880 Google.

00:01:46.540 You know, there's some wild, wild theories about it.

00:01:48.700 And hopefully, Bishop Barron can fill us in on how that's going.

00:01:51.800 Before we get started,

00:01:52.740 I have to ask about the premise here.

00:01:54.020 The premise was you were going to bring me on for Vatican trivia,

00:01:57.820 and I have to play against His Excellency Bishop Robert Barron,

00:02:01.980 not only a member of the Episcopate,

00:02:03.920 one of the most knowledgeable and scholarly men of the church today.

00:02:08.860 Is that right?

00:02:09.700 Yeah, but not about Vatican City.

00:02:11.660 So I've been to Vatican City, but all the details of it,

00:02:14.840 I don't know how good I'll be.

00:02:16.060 Which subway line goes to, I don't know, actually.

00:02:18.360 You may have an event.

00:02:19.000 I don't think Michael's been there.

00:02:19.920 Michael, have you actually been to Vatican City?

00:02:21.260 Yes, I have.

00:02:22.080 Thank you very much.

00:02:22.760 Of course.

00:02:24.320 Not recently.

00:02:25.300 Not recently.

00:02:26.000 All right, so the rules.

00:02:26.920 I'll read a question.

00:02:27.700 You'll have 30 seconds to write down your response.

00:02:30.100 At the end, whoever loses will do a commercial for the other person.

00:02:34.700 All right.

00:02:35.060 Okay.

00:02:36.600 Are you ready?

00:02:37.240 What is the commercial for a bishop?

00:02:38.760 I'm ready.

00:02:39.040 I don't know.

00:02:39.440 Like, I'm going to promote the succession from the apostles?

00:02:43.720 Well, the various books, the fantastic books that Bishop Barron has written.

00:02:46.860 We're on fire.

00:02:47.220 Yeah, we're on fire.

00:02:48.080 Okay, fair enough.

00:02:49.360 You'll figure it out.

00:02:50.140 All right, here we go.

00:02:54.260 All right.

00:02:54.740 Question one.

00:02:55.440 How many of the 95 theses can you write?

00:02:58.820 Go.

00:03:00.040 No, just kidding.

00:03:00.520 How many do I choose to write?

00:03:02.400 How about that?

00:03:03.100 You have to write them down.

00:03:05.120 I don't know any of them.

00:03:06.220 So anyway.

00:03:06.400 How many do I choose to burn?

00:03:07.720 Okay.

00:03:08.140 Yeah.

00:03:08.400 Here's the real one.

00:03:09.100 Okay.

00:03:10.000 Question one.

00:03:10.600 If you walked around the full border of Vatican City, how long would it take you to walk at

00:03:15.660 a brisk pace?

00:03:17.140 A.

00:03:18.440 Go ahead.

00:03:18.960 I rode my bike around Vatican City at the end of a trip from Paris to Rome with this friend

00:03:23.820 of mine, and we did a victory lap around Vatican City.

00:03:26.860 So I can answer by, so this is by foot though, huh?

00:03:29.160 At a brisk pace, by foot.

00:03:30.660 And we have multiple choice.

00:03:31.700 I'm going to go ahead.

00:03:32.100 A.

00:03:32.740 10 minutes.

00:03:33.660 B.

00:03:34.140 40 minutes.

00:03:35.180 C.

00:03:35.740 90 minutes.

00:03:36.720 D.

00:03:37.020 2 hours.

00:03:39.060 All right.

00:03:40.280 And you know, I'm a New Yorker, so you got to shave off.

00:03:42.680 I'm doing it in New York time.

00:03:44.400 That shaves off 10%.

00:03:45.840 You ready?

00:03:47.320 I'm ready.

00:03:47.860 I'm still riding.

00:03:48.380 All right, Mike, what do you have?

00:03:49.280 I would say 90 minutes around.

00:03:52.040 Mr. Barrett?

00:03:53.420 I said B.

00:03:55.640 B is correct.

00:03:57.560 All right.

00:03:58.240 Yeah.

00:03:58.640 This is not a good start.

00:03:59.880 Well, I did ride my bike around.

00:04:01.140 I can tell you that.

00:04:01.780 It took about 10 minutes, maybe.

00:04:04.880 Yeah.

00:04:05.380 Actually, Vatican City is only about 0.6 miles around.

00:04:08.200 Smaller than most miles.

00:04:09.040 Is it really?

00:04:10.340 All right.

00:04:11.080 Huh.

00:04:11.420 Okay.

00:04:11.940 That's bad.

00:04:13.100 All right.

00:04:13.240 Number two.

00:04:14.140 How long did it take to build the current St. Peter's Basilica?

00:04:17.840 A.

00:04:18.600 151 years.

00:04:19.500 B.

00:04:20.040 59 years.

00:04:20.920 C.

00:04:21.340 88.

00:04:22.240 D.

00:04:23.060 120.

00:04:26.680 What did you write, Michael?

00:04:29.060 Well, it's the letters.

00:04:30.360 No, I didn't do a number.

00:04:31.560 You gave letters.

00:04:32.680 What is it?

00:04:33.280 I said A.

00:04:34.660 I said D.

00:04:36.060 120.

00:04:37.020 Bishop Barrett is running away with this.

00:04:38.520 It is D.

00:04:39.020 120.

00:04:40.880 All right.

00:04:41.600 That was my second choice.

00:04:42.660 Do I get partial credit?

00:04:44.220 No.

00:04:45.340 This is bad.

00:04:46.260 Construction began in 1506 under Pope Julius II.

00:04:50.260 Yeah.

00:04:50.540 And then early, what?

00:04:53.320 1600s.

00:04:53.880 They finished it.

00:04:54.640 Yeah.

00:04:55.160 1626.

00:04:55.740 Yeah.

00:04:56.280 I'm going to be demoted to whatever is below laity.

00:04:59.460 I don't know if there's anything, but I might, I don't know.

00:05:02.420 I don't know.

00:05:02.640 Alter boy.

00:05:03.560 Alter boy.

00:05:05.720 All right.

00:05:06.940 All right.

00:05:07.480 Go ahead.

00:05:07.760 Roughly how many printed books and manuscripts are housed in the Vatican Library?

00:05:13.240 Oh, my gosh.

00:05:14.300 This is roughly.

00:05:15.300 A, 40,000.

00:05:17.320 B, 250,000.

00:05:19.680 C, 800,000.

00:05:21.540 D, 1.1 million.

00:05:24.480 Hmm.

00:05:25.380 Well.

00:05:27.320 Bishop Barrett, what do you have?

00:05:28.860 I had D.

00:05:30.000 I chose the highest one.

00:05:31.220 Oh, thank goodness.

00:05:32.140 Yeah.

00:05:32.540 All right.

00:05:32.800 So, we rise or fall together on this one.

00:05:35.180 I said, dude.

00:05:36.140 That was smart, Michael, because you're both correct.

00:05:37.800 Oh, good.

00:05:38.420 All right.

00:05:39.720 I figured the highest number, yeah.

00:05:41.160 Yeah.

00:05:41.780 Yeah.

00:05:42.940 Michael, I don't know why you're doing so.

00:05:44.080 I think you should have really, like, prayed before we started doing this.

00:05:47.060 I do.

00:05:47.420 I pray a lot.

00:05:48.480 Not enough.

00:05:49.080 Not enough, certainly.

00:05:50.620 You know what would help you pray more?

00:05:52.440 Oh.

00:05:53.540 That was a good segue that I totally missed.

00:05:55.940 Go check out Hallow.

00:05:57.500 Right now, you got to go to hallow.com slash Knowles.

00:06:00.360 This August, I want you to join me for the St. Michael's Lent Challenge on Hallow.

00:06:05.740 That doesn't refer to me.

00:06:06.660 It refers to the archangel, actually, who boots the devil down to hell.

00:06:10.500 It's a 40-day journey of prayer, fasting, and real spiritual growth,

00:06:14.280 inspired by St. Francis of Assisi's devotion to St. Michael the Archangel.

00:06:17.540 Now, this is not a typical self-help program.

00:06:20.940 St. Michael's Lent is an ancient tradition that calls us to virtue, sacrifice, and sanctity.

00:06:25.260 You will tackle the seven deadly sins head-on, pride, anger, lust, envy, sloth, gluttony, and avarice,

00:06:31.460 with insights from Fulton Sheen's Victory Over Vice, read by Chris Stefanik and Father Isaiah.

00:06:37.660 You will hear honest, sometimes hilarious stories from people like comedian Shane Smith about battling vice in real life.

00:06:43.460 Plus, you will journey with the real St. Francis, not the sanitized hippie version with little birds, you know, chirping in his ear.

00:06:50.560 We're talking about the bold, radical saint who was completely in love with God.

00:06:54.780 The challenge includes the litany of St. Michael, gospel reflections, and a powerful closing novena.

00:06:59.560 As we approach Michaelmas on September 29th, this is your chance to armor up spiritually.

00:07:04.780 If you're tired of soft, secular, squishy approaches, and ready to grow in grace through real spiritual discipline,

00:07:11.120 join St. Michael's Lent.

00:07:12.560 It starts August 13th on the Hallow app.

00:07:14.900 Get three months free at hallow.com slash Knowles.

00:07:17.360 All right, number four.

00:07:19.040 In miles.

00:07:19.660 All right.

00:07:20.600 In miles, okay.

00:07:21.940 How long is the shelving space inside the Vatican Library and Apostolic Archive combined?

00:07:28.160 That's going to be the closest without going over.

00:07:30.520 In miles.

00:07:31.660 In miles.

00:07:32.260 Closest without going over.

00:07:33.840 There's no multiple choice.

00:07:35.060 It's just...

00:07:35.420 Almost.

00:07:36.240 Oh, I see.

00:07:36.820 Okay.

00:07:37.880 And the Apostolic Archive is what we used to call the secret.

00:07:40.320 The secret archive.

00:07:42.400 That's correct.

00:07:44.640 Well.

00:07:45.680 Have you seen it?

00:07:47.880 Me?

00:07:49.220 Oh, Bishop Barron.

00:07:50.000 Yeah, no.

00:07:50.500 They don't let me into it.

00:07:51.360 I've been into the parts of it, yeah.

00:07:53.560 Oh.

00:07:54.100 So he'll probably have a better guess on this than you.

00:07:56.360 No, but that's a total guess.

00:07:57.700 How many miles?

00:07:59.200 You weren't like counting off the shelves.

00:08:00.860 Like, all right.

00:08:01.380 How many miles is the entire Vatican Library and Apostolic Archive combined?

00:08:07.700 How many times around Vatican City does it go?

00:08:11.080 I guess is the question.

00:08:13.080 All right.

00:08:13.620 Ten seconds.

00:08:14.440 Ten seconds.

00:08:14.800 I don't...

00:08:15.580 Either way, DW's budget has to be pretty weak.

00:08:17.740 You didn't even get me a marker with ink in it.

00:08:20.640 Yeah, my marker's very good here at Word on Fire.

00:08:23.040 Yeah.

00:08:24.240 I think we need to hire some of the producers from Word on Fire.

00:08:26.880 I know.

00:08:28.400 3.1.

00:08:29.900 He said 3.1.

00:08:31.420 Oh, I said 5.

00:08:32.680 Total guess.

00:08:33.900 The correct answer is over 50 miles.

00:08:36.580 So Bishop Barron takes it again.

00:08:38.900 I win.

00:08:39.440 Okay.

00:08:40.280 50 miles?

00:08:41.260 Seriously?

00:08:41.760 Yeah.

00:08:43.580 Okay.

00:08:44.260 How high are they stacking them?

00:08:45.640 You said all the way around is 0.6 miles.

00:08:48.340 So how high are those walls?

00:08:49.680 There must be so many shelves running through there in the archive.

00:08:52.280 All that matters is that I won.

00:08:53.700 That's the only thing that anyone's going to remember.

00:08:56.040 That's all that matters.

00:08:57.360 I'm glad I got one point that Bishop Barron also got.

00:09:01.060 That's good.

00:09:01.640 That's good.

00:09:01.960 Yeah.

00:09:02.540 What's the current score?

00:09:04.320 A billion to one.

00:09:05.540 Is it 5-1?

00:09:05.960 No, it's 3-1, isn't it?

00:09:08.640 4-1, Bishop.

00:09:09.420 Okay.

00:09:09.920 4-1.

00:09:11.020 Who's counting?

00:09:12.160 Here we go.

00:09:13.580 Which of the following is a popular but unproven conspiracy theory about the Vatican archives?

00:09:19.580 A, that they house a time machine.

00:09:21.980 B, they contain proof that aliens existed on Earth.

00:09:25.580 C, they hold the lost gospel of Jesus.

00:09:28.400 D, they house the Ark of the Covenant.

00:09:30.580 Or E, all of the above.

00:09:33.740 So, a popular but unproven conspiracy theory.

00:09:36.680 Yes, popular but unproven.

00:09:37.640 Okay.

00:09:38.060 It has to be popular, though.

00:09:39.700 Okay, well, I think I'll...

00:09:41.440 Say D, the Ark of the Covenant.

00:09:42.840 I'm going to say all of the above.

00:09:46.500 Don't do this to me, Ben.

00:09:47.720 Don't do this to me.

00:09:48.860 It is E, all of the above.

00:09:49.740 No, it's not.

00:09:50.740 What are you talking about?

00:09:52.220 No, because I've heard at least a couple of those.

00:09:54.240 That's why the Ark of the Covenant, for sure, and the alien life and all that.

00:09:58.180 So, I figured, why not all of the above?

00:10:00.080 Oh, I've never heard the alien.

00:10:02.140 That's kind of funny.

00:10:02.860 That there's the Area 51 of Italy.

00:10:07.500 Okay.

00:10:07.960 Bishop Barron, can you spill some tea on the time machine?

00:10:10.460 Because this one actually has some legs and some stories behind it.

00:10:12.980 Have you looked into this at all?

00:10:14.040 Does it?

00:10:14.480 Yeah.

00:10:14.840 No, I must say that one I don't really know.

00:10:16.500 The time machine.

00:10:17.540 Yeah, there was like a Cardinal Smith had left, and then he drew what it looked like

00:10:20.860 and claims that they had this time machine down in the base.

00:10:22.780 It was wild.

00:10:23.300 This is a wild story.

00:10:24.780 And the Vatican hasn't.

00:10:25.560 Yeah, that the Vatican has, and there's a drawing of it.

00:10:27.980 The best is the Ark of the Covenant.

00:10:29.540 If they really have the Ark of the Covenant, which is some plausibility.

00:10:33.380 Yeah.

00:10:34.240 Yes.

00:10:34.600 If it was still around at the time of the Roman destruction of Jerusalem, that's the question.

00:10:40.040 Don't they say if the Ark of the Covenant still exists anywhere, it's either in the Vatican

00:10:44.080 or—doesn't Ethiopia claim to have it?

00:10:46.380 Or Ethiopia. 0.75

00:10:46.660 Yeah.

00:10:47.180 Yeah.

00:10:47.460 In fact, I was—not long ago, I was with an Ethiopian priest, and we talked about that.

00:10:51.380 And he said, oh, of course, we have it in Ethiopia.

00:10:53.580 Did you—I wouldn't want you to call your friend a liar.

00:10:58.000 Do you find—do you have any credence to these theories, or?

00:11:02.520 I think it was lost around the time of Jeremiah, and we don't know where it is.

00:11:05.720 I think either he hid it someplace and it remains hidden, or it was destroyed at the time of the captivity.

00:11:13.360 That's our best guess.

00:11:14.480 There's the Tannis theory, because, of course, Jeremiah goes to Egypt and likely died there, was killed there.

00:11:21.080 Did he take it with him?

00:11:22.600 Was it taken with exiles?

00:11:25.740 Who knows?

00:11:26.640 Interesting.

00:11:27.120 We have the new Ark of the Covenant anyway, so it's not—it's just a historical curiosity as far as I'm concerned.

00:11:32.740 You mean we have the true Ark?

00:11:33.900 The true Ark.

00:11:34.460 The true Ark, yeah.

00:11:35.180 Yeah.

00:11:35.800 Right.

00:11:36.860 Do you know where Ben Shapiro thinks it is?

00:11:39.560 No.

00:11:40.160 Where does he think?

00:11:41.080 He thinks you guys have it.

00:11:42.060 He thinks it's in the Vatican.

00:11:43.020 Oh, he—I kind of remember.

00:11:44.620 I think he said that on a yes or no once.

00:11:46.040 He did, yeah.

00:11:47.160 Well, it's a theory, and it's—if it were still around Jerusalem when the Romans came and, you know, destroyed Jerusalem,

00:11:54.940 they certainly would have taken it, and they'd taken it back to Rome,

00:11:58.040 and then the church, you know, plausibly might have gotten a hold of it, but who knows?

00:12:03.180 Yeah, okay.

00:12:03.880 But Mary's the true Ark of the Covenant.

00:12:06.060 That's right.

00:12:06.520 That's the most important thing.

00:12:08.280 It's all that matters.

00:12:09.620 It's all that matters.

00:12:10.700 It's really all I care about with regard to this question, though I do have to ask.

00:12:15.800 The Vatican does not have aliens, correct?

00:12:17.940 That is no—

00:12:19.280 Not that I know of, yeah.

00:12:20.460 I met some weird people in the Vatican.

00:12:23.000 I don't know about aliens, though.

00:12:24.320 And what we also know is that Michael's still currently getting destroyed as we go into number six.

00:12:29.660 Yeah, okay, good.

00:12:30.120 That's all that matters.

00:12:30.880 You don't need to update.

00:12:32.220 I remember.

00:12:32.980 I remember.

00:12:33.580 You don't need to update.

00:12:34.440 All right.

00:12:34.780 Which pope commissioned Michelangelo to paint the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel?

00:12:38.960 Is it A, Pope Innocent III, B, Pope Leo X, C, Pope Julius II, D, Pope Clement VII?

00:12:47.360 All right.

00:12:49.200 Man, this is so embarrassing.

00:12:51.300 This is so embarrassing.

00:12:53.780 I'm a Philistine.

00:12:55.840 I am—

00:12:56.640 Wow.

00:12:58.720 Well, what do you have, Michael?

00:12:59.880 Let's let His Excellency go first.

00:13:01.200 Okay.

00:13:02.700 It's C.

00:13:05.060 Michael.

00:13:05.520 Was that Julius?

00:13:07.000 Yeah, Julius.

00:13:07.600 Oh, thank goodness.

00:13:08.360 Oh, yeah, okay.

00:13:09.360 All right.

00:13:10.020 I thought so, and I didn't want to be laughed out of the room.

00:13:13.020 Michael, you thought it was Julius?

00:13:14.460 I remember Julius.

00:13:15.760 Okay.

00:13:16.120 Yeah.

00:13:16.680 All right.

00:13:17.600 What's hidden beneath St. Peter's?

00:13:19.360 Oh, sorry.

00:13:19.860 We're on the next question?

00:13:20.780 Go ahead.

00:13:21.320 Sorry.

00:13:21.480 There's something else you want to add?

00:13:23.080 You want to give Michael another lesson?

00:13:25.400 No.

00:13:26.600 All right.

00:13:27.180 What is hidden beneath St. Peter's Basilica?

00:13:30.920 Ah.

00:13:31.440 You'll have to be more specific, I think.

00:13:33.300 Do we have options, or do we just have to say what it is?

00:13:35.700 No, it's whatever—

00:13:36.640 Okay.

00:13:37.680 —this answer.

00:13:38.380 Is this, like, however many things you can name you get at that many points?

00:13:41.820 Well, this is, like, the main thing.

00:13:42.960 If you Google what's underneath St. Peter's Basilica, this is what comes up.

00:13:46.260 There's two possible answers I'll take.

00:13:48.400 All right.

00:13:48.620 What do you have, Michael?

00:13:49.900 Oh, my God.

00:13:50.340 I said the relics of the first pope, St. Peter.

00:13:53.660 Bishop Barron?

00:13:54.840 Well, I say the scavi, which means the excavations under St. Peter's.

00:13:59.460 The correct answer that I have is first-century necropolis and the bones of St. Peter.

00:14:05.220 Hey, I mean, so Bishop Barron is literally correct, but can I get the point?

00:14:09.860 The scavi, that's what it uncovered, was that first-century cemetery.

00:14:14.360 So I think I deserve credit for that.

00:14:16.140 But Your Excellency, Mr. Davies is not cultured enough to have used that nice foreign word.

00:14:22.480 So can I get double points for that instead?

00:14:24.960 Yeah, because that word could mean whatever you tell me, because I know my Latin is so bad

00:14:28.580 in Italian.

00:14:30.260 I believe you that it's underneath there, so we can take that.

00:14:33.360 I deserve some credit for that answer.

00:14:35.560 I'm not going to rest until I get some credit for that answer.

00:14:38.060 You know, I was actually—

00:14:40.220 Have you been down there, Michael?

00:14:41.020 Have you been to the scavi tour?

00:14:42.640 I've never been.

00:14:44.380 It's spectacular.

00:14:45.540 I take you down there, and it does indeed reveal this first-century cemetery with little

00:14:50.920 roads and graves, and they lead you finally to where they are pretty sure they found the

00:14:55.340 tomb of St. Peter.

00:14:56.920 That's amazing.

00:14:57.500 Actually, just yesterday, I was having lunch with a friend of mine who, you know, in recent

00:15:01.540 decades, Catholics don't seem to care as much about relics as we used to for the first

00:15:05.640 roughly 2,000 years of church history.

00:15:08.140 And so priests and other people have given her relics.

00:15:11.680 And I actually saw what purports to be a relic of St. Peter.

00:15:16.980 And she has some certificates of authenticity and things like that.

00:15:19.620 But it struck me because modern Christians and even Catholics today, they look at relics

00:15:27.680 like it's kind of weird or idolatrous or superstitious or something.

00:15:31.500 But it seems to me Christians have always had a great reverence for relics.

00:15:36.580 Go back to the Acts of the Apostles.

00:15:38.200 You can see people going up to St. Paul and touching him with handkerchiefs and all that.

00:15:42.080 No, it's a very ancient practice.

00:15:44.320 It's all over the Church Fathers, the ancient Church.

00:15:47.160 It's an extension of the incarnational principle, right?

00:15:50.340 That God really became one of us.

00:15:52.140 And then the saints who are aligned to Christ is sort of a continuation of that incarnational

00:15:57.820 principle.

00:15:58.780 And so in reverencing the bones or the flesh or the remnants of saints, you know, we're

00:16:03.880 reverencing Christ ultimately.

00:16:05.820 I was just in France.

00:16:06.940 We're filming on this cathedral documentary I'm doing.

00:16:10.320 And in Amiens Cathedral is the relic of the skull of St. John the Baptist.

00:16:15.020 It's like the front part of the skull, which came to Amiens 1206 from Constantinople.

00:16:22.140 And then, you know, so they were very big in the Middle Ages.

00:16:25.860 People loved relics.

00:16:27.660 And still to this day, talk to a Catholic, they love collecting relics.

00:16:31.140 Yes, I was actually, my friend who I had lunch with, she was very kind and gave me two first

00:16:35.600 class relics.

00:16:36.460 One of St. Jerome and one of St. Thomas Aquinas.

00:16:43.200 And I was, you know, I said, all right, that's so kind of you.

00:16:46.980 And I found, I don't know, especially because I'm a revert, so I have to learn everything 1.00

00:16:51.300 that I should have learned when I was 10.

00:16:53.100 I find the veneration of relics is really helpful in my prayer life.

00:16:58.880 Can I tell you a story about the Thomas relics?

00:17:01.320 So this is a year ago, March.

00:17:02.940 I was in Rome for this conference on Aquinas.

00:17:05.620 And we went down to Fossanova, where he died.

00:17:08.900 And there was a great mass.

00:17:10.060 And Cardinal Perolin said the mass.

00:17:11.480 He was a papabile in the recent election.

00:17:13.540 And then right, I didn't even notice it until halfway through the mass, right in front of

00:17:18.060 the altar, they had the Fossanova skull.

00:17:21.500 So the people there claimed that when Thomas's bones were moved to Toulouse, that's where most

00:17:26.940 of them are now in the south of France, they kept the skull because that's where he died

00:17:31.600 in Fossanova.

00:17:32.880 So they have it to this day.

00:17:34.440 And it was brought by car through the city.

00:17:37.280 And there's this photograph of the driver.

00:17:39.260 And next to him is the skull of Aquinas.

00:17:41.900 And then it was up in front of the altar.

00:17:45.060 And it's very moving, you know.

00:17:46.400 So there are two skulls competing for authenticity of Aquinas.

00:17:50.920 And people say, well, he was so smart, he needed two hands.

00:17:54.000 One could not have possibly held it all.

00:17:55.900 Right.

00:17:56.840 Right.

00:17:57.220 So during the mass, I remember just sort of noticing the skull of my great spiritual

00:18:01.720 hero, Thomas Aquinas.

00:18:03.080 I had this thought, you know, in my office here, I have a Caravaggio St. Jerome writing as

00:18:07.760 a memento mori that I should do my work so that I don't waste all my life.

00:18:12.340 And then I found, I even put, when my friend gave me these relics, I thought, these are

00:18:16.460 two wonderful relics to have when you're trying to write.

00:18:21.200 Because St. Jerome and St. Thomas are, they're definitely a little more prolific than me.

00:18:26.460 I crank out three tweets.

00:18:27.840 I'm basically spent for the day.

00:18:30.540 No, they both were extraordinary.

00:18:32.100 You know, especially Aquinas.

00:18:33.240 In a short career, he dies at 49.

00:18:35.400 Yeah.

00:18:35.600 So his writing career is about 25 years.

00:18:38.680 And he wrote a library of books at the highest level of literary and philosophical achievement.

00:18:46.720 So, I mean, he's one of the great geniuses.

00:18:49.500 Dictated to three or four secretaries simultaneously.

00:18:52.200 Like a chess master, you know, moving from chessboard to chessboard.

00:18:55.940 He would dictate, you know, Aristotle commentary, a Bible commentary, part of the Summa, and then

00:19:02.380 a sermon or something.

00:19:03.260 And he would just go around like that, dictating.

00:19:05.660 And they say in the afternoon, he took a little nap and would dictate in his sleep.

00:19:10.680 That is actually, at the Daily Wire, that is how I do my tweets.

00:19:13.800 That happens a lot.

00:19:13.900 I'll say, okay, talk about the American Eagle jeans ad, you, and now you're going to talk.

00:19:17.180 Yes.

00:19:17.360 Right.

00:19:18.120 It's pretty impressive.

00:19:19.820 That's, I'm sorry that I even have to continue the game.

00:19:24.140 It was so fascinating.

00:19:25.240 Well, I'm just trying to distract from my losing.

00:19:26.840 Yeah, sorry.

00:19:27.140 I guess we're out of time.

00:19:27.900 Well, I'm sorry to butt in, yeah.

00:19:30.480 Well, I'm sure you just want to continue because you're winning by such a large margin, Bishop.

00:19:35.720 Of course.

00:19:36.360 Let's continue.

00:19:37.180 Yeah, we'll just knock this out.

00:19:38.200 Number eight, what year did the name Vatican Secret Archives change to the Vatican Apostolic Archive?

00:19:45.020 Closest without going over.

00:19:46.580 Without going over.

00:19:47.020 Or to name the exact year?

00:19:48.700 Yeah.

00:19:51.600 I'm going to say...

00:19:53.160 Without going over.

00:19:55.160 And the reasoning was citing the negative connotation of the word secret.

00:19:58.680 Yeah.

00:20:00.080 I don't think secrets are bad.

00:20:01.280 I think discretion is good and people don't have enough of it these days.

00:20:05.160 Bishop Barrett?

00:20:05.960 I'm guessing 1985 during John Paul II's time.

00:20:12.100 I think it's more recent.

00:20:13.040 I think it's 2013.

00:20:15.040 Correct answer is 2019.

00:20:17.040 Yes.

00:20:17.420 Really recent.

00:20:18.260 No way.

00:20:18.840 2019, that recently?

00:20:20.180 Yeah.

00:20:21.320 Oh, okay.

00:20:22.320 I thought it was in the Francis Puntin.

00:20:24.520 He did.

00:20:25.040 Well, I mean, it makes sense because he's done so much research in the Secret Vatican Archives,

00:20:29.820 especially during World War II, actually, Michael.

00:20:33.380 That's true.

00:20:34.060 And you can all watch that show.

00:20:35.400 The Pope and the Fuhrer, The Secret Vatican Files of World War II at Daily Wire Plus, August 13th.

00:20:41.740 I want to share something that I'm very proud to have led here at Daily Wire Plus.

00:20:44.660 That is a new docu-series that uncovers one of the most distorted historical narratives of the modern age.

00:20:50.700 It's called The Pope and the Fuhrer, The Secret Vatican Files of World War II.

00:20:53.800 For decades, Pope Pius XII, one of the most consequential men of the 20th century, one of the greatest men of the 20th century,

00:21:00.220 has been slandered and condemned for his supposed silence during Hitler's rise and during Nazi atrocities.

00:21:06.620 That narrative was always false.

00:21:08.460 Now, with unprecedented access to the Vatican's wartime archives, we uncover what really happened and why the truth was buried for so long.

00:21:15.500 Check out this teaser.

00:21:16.880 History is written by the victors.

00:21:21.040 But what if the victors got it wrong?

00:21:27.120 For 80 years, the world has condemned one man as the Pope of Silence, the man who stood by in the face of shocking evil.

00:21:35.200 But can we trust the popular narrative, even after all these years?

00:21:43.800 This is not just a story about Hitler and the Holocaust.

00:21:47.460 One of the worst lies ever told about the Catholic Church is what she did or did not do in one of modernity's darkest hours.

00:21:56.080 Now, for the first time, the Vatican's secret archive is open, and the truth is far more shocking than the fiction.

00:22:01.800 Propagandists have peddled one story for decades, but now we can definitively know better.

00:22:09.400 Join me in this four-part series, where we will discover the true story of Pope Pius XII, Hitler, and the Second World War.

00:22:20.260 The series premieres Wednesday, August 13th, exclusively on Daily Wire+.

00:22:25.000 Looks like a great show.

00:22:26.900 I'm glad you're doing that, because there's a great calumny against Pius XII,

00:22:30.440 and against a lot of Catholics at that time, so I'm glad you're doing that. 0.98

00:22:33.740 Yeah, I was thrilled when we could release this, because of all the maligned men of the 20th century, 1.00

00:22:42.460 you know, some people earned their reputation, but Pius XII has just really been slandered, in my view,

00:22:49.080 and so I hope that people can enjoy it when it comes out.

00:22:53.080 No, good.

00:22:53.720 I think that's important to rehabilitate him, because it was a great calumny against him.

00:22:58.040 I was just in Münster, Germany, you know, before Rome, I was in Münster, and I went to the cathedral there,

00:23:03.420 and there was the grave of Cardinal von Gallen, and his nickname, he was known as the Lion of Münster,

00:23:08.560 because he spoke out so strongly against Hitler.

00:23:11.720 So there were some very courageous figures, not to mention the great martyrs, like Edith Stein and people like that.

00:23:17.480 So no, it's important to round out that story, certainly.

00:23:22.100 Yes.

00:23:22.980 And you can round it out in your own estimation, everyone out there, if you just tune in, Daily Wire Plus.

00:23:28.380 How's that?

00:23:28.940 That's correct.

00:23:29.960 And speaking of popes who have passed, how many popes are buried underneath St. Peter's Basilica?

00:23:35.580 Would it be A, 5, B, 12, C, 45, D, over 90?

00:23:41.600 It's like, the way you said D makes me think it's D.

00:23:47.620 Oh, you know me too well.

00:23:50.240 It is D, gentlemen.

00:23:50.700 I say D as well, so we both got it, okay.

00:23:53.380 All right, that's good.

00:23:54.420 I maintain my lead.

00:23:56.220 You do.

00:23:56.940 I have a wine margin.

00:23:58.640 All right, number 10.

00:23:59.940 There's a sign there, they say, oh, here are the popes buried in St. Peter, this huge line.

00:24:05.320 So that's why I knew it was a big number.

00:24:06.740 You know, I was just, I was in Rome very briefly with my family about a month ago, and it was so brief, in fact, that we didn't really have time to get to the Vatican.

00:24:15.200 We were staying on the other side of the city, but we were near the papal basilica of Santa Maria Maggiore.

00:24:19.800 So I said, okay, good.

00:24:20.780 We had to fly out for Sunday morning, so we went to a vigil mass on Saturday, and we're there.

00:24:26.320 And I said, man, this is a huge line to get into mass.

00:24:29.840 I'm so glad people are showing up to go to mass.

00:24:32.060 It's a jubilee year.

00:24:32.880 But then I remembered, oh, Pope Francis is entombed here.

00:24:38.320 And so there was a separate line just to go see the pope's grave.

00:24:42.660 Well, yesterday was the feast of the dedication of St. Mary Major.

00:24:45.840 That's right.

00:24:47.000 That's right.

00:24:48.440 And it was, you know, Our Lady of the Snows.

00:24:50.060 You know that story about August 5th?

00:24:51.880 No, a little bit, but not really.

00:24:54.020 August 5th, you're at the height of Roman, you know, tropical summer.

00:24:57.420 And so way back when, when they were designing that building, snow fell anomalously on August 5th at the outline of the basilica.

00:25:07.420 That's the story.

00:25:08.380 So she's known as Our Lady of the Snows.

00:25:10.560 And they do it in the liturgy, right?

00:25:12.260 Don't they drop rose petals? 0.98

00:25:14.040 Yes.

00:25:14.460 Yeah, yeah.

00:25:14.700 And that was built right after the Council of Ephesus when Mary was declared Theotokos, Mother of God.

00:25:20.940 So it's the first great church in the West dedicated to Mary.

00:25:24.440 But it's, that's an important kind of theological point that church is making.

00:25:28.280 And Francis loved it.

00:25:29.880 He visited there all the time and that's where he's buried.

00:25:32.520 That, there's also a point where sometimes when I'm chatting with my many Protestant friends, some of them are more pro-Mary than others.

00:25:39.540 Some are decidedly anti-Mary.

00:25:42.080 And, but sometimes you'll hear, say, well, don't you know, she's the mother of God.

00:25:45.100 I mean, don't you think you should, you should show respect to your, your degenerate friend, Billy Bob.

00:25:48.940 You're nice to his mother.

00:25:49.840 Shouldn't you be nice to the mother of our Lord? 0.76

00:25:51.620 And, and they say, well, she's, she's the mother of Jesus, not the mother of God.

00:25:56.260 That's the Nestorian heresy, though.

00:25:57.940 That was what they thought about at the Council of Ephesus.

00:25:59.920 Yeah.

00:26:00.140 Because the story has said just that.

00:26:01.500 Call her, if you want, Christotokos. 0.68

00:26:03.620 She's the mother of Christ.

00:26:04.860 Or Anthropotokos.

00:26:06.320 She's the mother of the human nature. 0.97

00:26:09.540 But the church said, no, she's properly called Theotokos, bearer of God.

00:26:14.400 So that, no, it's making an important Christological point.

00:26:16.780 If you believe in the divinity of Jesus, right?

00:26:19.040 Jesus is divine.

00:26:20.060 Mary's his mother.

00:26:20.840 Well, then she has to be called mother of God, as sort of surprising as that title might be.

00:26:25.800 But that's the ancient church.

00:26:27.200 We're not talking the Reformation.

00:26:28.480 That's the, that's in the early fifth century.

00:26:31.340 They're making that determination.

00:26:32.640 But also go out to the Bible.

00:26:34.180 I say to my Protestant friends, Mary says, you know, from this day, all generations will call me blessed.

00:26:40.000 Well, that's the biblical witness that she's predicting, encouraging.

00:26:44.760 All generations will call her blessed.

00:26:46.520 So, you know.

00:26:47.460 That's right.

00:26:48.080 And there's no way to resolve modern debate.

00:26:49.900 If we can't even resolve debates from the Council of Ephesus, for goodness sakes, how are we going to get to the modern stuff?

00:26:55.000 You know, we got to, all right, we figured that one out.

00:26:56.900 Now we move on.

00:26:58.300 Well, let's settle doctrine.

00:26:59.440 That's why you should look at the council.

00:27:00.620 Let's settle doctrine.

00:27:01.600 There's no more debate about that.

00:27:02.920 Like, you can't say, let's go back behind Chalcedon.

00:27:05.460 Maybe Jesus wasn't the hypostatic union of two natures and one person.

00:27:08.900 No, you have to say that.

00:27:10.260 You can further amplify it and deepen it, but you have to say that.

00:27:13.740 So, Mary, the mother of God, that's settled Christian doctrine.

00:27:18.000 That's right.

00:27:18.600 And Luther loved Mary.

00:27:19.920 Luther's got very strong things to say about Mary.

00:27:23.180 Absolutely.

00:27:23.860 No, I think I'm noticing even in this moment of the culture we're in where a lot of people are becoming Catholic, a little bit Eastern Orthodox too, but a lot of Catholic.

00:27:30.840 I've noticed even many of my pretty hardcore Protestant Reformed friends are coming to realize that there's something to venerating the mother of God.

00:27:42.160 Well, didn't Charlie Kirk just do that?

00:27:44.300 Didn't he just say something nice about, you know, the importance of venerating Mary?

00:27:48.000 But, again, that's a deeply ancient Christian practice, and it's grounded in people like Luther.

00:27:53.820 And I'm not sure about Calvin and Mary, but Luther certainly had strong things to say about Mary.

00:27:58.200 Yeah, that's the thing.

00:27:59.280 I don't point to the Protestant revolutionaries most of the time, but if they back up the point I'm trying to make, I do cite them.

00:28:06.160 I'm happy to do it in that case.

00:28:08.080 Another hotly debated topic is the Vatican's top 45 films.

00:28:13.080 That's the next question.

00:28:14.060 Which of these films was not officially screened or included on the Vatican's list of 45 important films?

00:28:21.260 Okay.

00:28:22.180 It was not.

00:28:23.040 A, The Godfather.

00:28:24.520 B, Flowers of St. Francis.

00:28:26.460 C, Schindler's List.

00:28:27.860 D, 2001, A Space Odyssey.

00:28:30.680 Which was not included on their list.

00:28:32.420 Which was not on the 45.

00:28:33.980 All right.

00:28:34.500 What was the second one?

00:28:36.820 The Flowers of St. Francis.

00:28:38.940 It'd be kind of weird if that were the only one they didn't include.

00:28:41.440 You know, they put the Godfather, they put a mob movie on there, but they don't, hmm.

00:28:46.680 Bishop Barron seems very confident.

00:28:48.660 Bishop Barron, yeah.

00:28:49.180 Not really, I'm just kidding.

00:28:51.080 I said C, Schindler's List.

00:28:53.340 I said A, The Godfather.

00:28:55.360 The correct answer is A, The Godfather.

00:28:58.580 All right.

00:29:00.920 It's not, it's just that Schindler's List is not, it's just, I'm not saying it's like a terrible movie.

00:29:05.720 It's just, to me, it doesn't rise to the level of greatness of A Godfather or, or.

00:29:11.720 I vaguely remember that list when it came out.

00:29:14.660 That's right.

00:29:15.000 And I, I think I remembered Schindler's List being on it.

00:29:18.340 Yeah.

00:29:18.820 Okay.

00:29:19.560 Ugh.

00:29:19.980 That's brutal.

00:29:20.500 I think Clavin hates that movie.

00:29:22.720 He says it totally misunderstands the whole, the entirety of the war.

00:29:26.080 I think, I don't want to put words in his mouth, but I just did.

00:29:27.880 So too bad.

00:29:28.360 If Drew, if you disagree with that.

00:29:29.500 Schindler's List.

00:29:29.780 Correct me.

00:29:30.220 Yeah.

00:29:30.400 Schindler's List.

00:29:31.020 Yeah.

00:29:31.420 Okay.

00:29:32.500 I've never been to the Vatican either.

00:29:33.340 I have no idea of these questions.

00:29:34.780 Number 11.

00:29:36.260 You've never been to the Vatican, huh?

00:29:37.620 No.

00:29:37.860 Go ahead.

00:29:39.000 Which artist designed the grand colonnade that surrounds St. Peter's Square?

00:29:43.000 A.

00:29:43.340 Michelangelo.

00:29:44.380 B.

00:29:44.860 Dante Bramante.

00:29:46.720 My Italian's great.

00:29:47.840 C.

00:29:48.260 Raphael.

00:29:49.060 D.

00:29:49.840 Gian Lorenzo Bernini.

00:29:53.160 Please tell me it's Bernini.

00:29:54.660 Is it Bernini?

00:29:56.080 It's Bernini.

00:29:57.140 It is, in fact, Bernini.

00:30:00.460 When you stumbled over Bramante.

00:30:02.120 There's no ground on me.

00:30:03.300 Number 12.

00:30:05.140 Which of these does the Vatican have?

00:30:07.540 A.

00:30:07.900 Its own telescope and its astronomical observatory.

00:30:11.160 B.

00:30:11.520 Its own McDonald's.

00:30:12.800 C.

00:30:13.260 Its own spa.

00:30:14.540 D.

00:30:14.880 Its own Starbucks.

00:30:16.060 There's such good coffee in Italy.

00:30:18.040 Why would they need a Starbucks?

00:30:19.580 You know, I love Starbucks, but...

00:30:21.580 Only one of these things is in the Vatican.

00:30:23.940 What do you have, Michael?

00:30:24.700 I'd say it's the Golden Arches.

00:30:26.220 They don't have a McDonald's.

00:30:27.940 This is the one it does have.

00:30:29.620 Oh, that it does?

00:30:30.420 You said that it does have.

00:30:32.100 So it does have.

00:30:32.760 Oh, at the observatory.

00:30:35.920 That's what I had, the observatory, which is out of Castle Gandolfo.

00:30:39.540 It's not at the Vatican, but it's considered Vatican territory.

00:30:43.280 That makes more sense.

00:30:44.500 I was wondering where the Vatican started.

00:30:45.980 Isn't it in, like, Phoenix, like the actual telescopes in Phoenix?

00:30:48.040 Well, there's one in Phoenix, too, or outside of Tucson, but the big ones are Castle Gandolfo.

00:30:55.040 That makes so much.

00:30:56.540 I've said I've been to the Vatican, I don't know, three times.

00:30:59.040 Maybe I never got the Vatican quarter pounder, the Vatican, the big vet.

00:31:04.720 I thought the spa might throw you off, but, and you're such a big Starbucks fan.

00:31:07.800 I was like, maybe, maybe.

00:31:08.600 Yeah.

00:31:09.200 Okay, all right.

00:31:10.260 All right, number 13.

00:31:11.180 This is a true or false.

00:31:12.840 Can the Vatican's telescope see the Apollo mission equipment on the moon?

00:31:19.020 The Apollo, oh, like the remnants of the Apollo?

00:31:22.760 Yeah, the landing equipment.

00:31:23.760 Can the telescope see that?

00:31:25.340 Can the Vatican telescope see that?

00:31:27.120 Of our alleged trip to the moon?

00:31:29.860 Oh, yeah, right.

00:31:33.780 Yeah, Michael.

00:31:35.000 Yes?

00:31:36.160 Mr. Barron?

00:31:36.780 I'm going to say it was false, but I can't see that.

00:31:39.040 That's correct.

00:31:39.760 Oh, man, come on.

00:31:41.680 But it's not just y'all's telescope.

00:31:43.600 Even Earth's most powerful telescopes can't resolve that small amount.

00:31:46.660 I was trying to imagine a telescope being able to see to that degree.

00:31:49.300 Oh.

00:31:49.960 So, all right.

00:31:50.600 So, that backs up my first insinuation.

00:31:53.600 Yeah.

00:31:54.000 It was obviously totally fake, right?

00:31:56.040 We can't even see it in the telescope.

00:32:00.520 All right, what is the name of this building inside Vatican City?

00:32:04.140 What is the name of this building?

00:32:07.680 I hope that someday the name will be the former building that stood on this location when it's

00:32:12.540 renovated.

00:32:14.580 This is one of the more modern buildings, which is always Michael's favorite.

00:32:16.700 I know that building very well.

00:32:18.900 Yeah.

00:32:20.620 It's known for its modern design and massive seating capacity.

00:32:23.900 Yeah.

00:32:24.200 Over 6,000.

00:32:24.940 I don't think I'm at any risk of becoming Pope, but if I ever do, that will be known

00:32:30.500 as a ruin, actually, and will be rebuilt.

00:32:34.660 Technically, you could, right, Michael?

00:32:36.240 You could theoretically.

00:32:38.600 I would baptize Catholic male.

00:32:40.580 But I would then have to have holy orders, wouldn't I?

00:32:42.980 Once I was elected.

00:32:43.780 To ordain you.

00:32:44.520 Yeah.

00:32:44.800 Yeah.

00:32:45.700 My wife would not be thrilled.

00:32:46.900 She actually might be thrilled.

00:32:47.920 I don't know.

00:32:48.220 You're right.

00:32:48.840 That might be a good vacation plan for us.

00:32:51.840 I'd say, okay, you go to Rome, Mike, you'll see you.

00:32:54.620 What is the name, Michael?

00:32:55.720 What do you have?

00:32:55.900 Is that Paul VI Auditorium?

00:32:57.920 The Paul VI Audience Hall.

00:32:59.540 That is correct.

00:33:00.220 Yeah, okay.

00:33:00.740 All right.

00:33:02.260 All right.

00:33:03.040 I spent two months there, the Synod, the last two Octobers.

00:33:06.300 I spent six days a week, eight hours a day in that hall.

00:33:12.140 It's not my favorite place.

00:33:13.660 No.

00:33:14.280 I can't.

00:33:14.880 You know, I'm not asking you to tell tales out of school or anything, Your Excellency,

00:33:18.600 but there's a lot of great art and architecture in the history of the Catholic Church.

00:33:23.680 I don't think that the Paul VI Audience Hall makes the first 2,000 buildings list.

00:33:28.820 So what –

00:33:29.600 Yeah.

00:33:30.380 It was of its time, you know, like Paul VI himself was a devotee of modern art and thought,

00:33:36.360 you know, let's bring the modern sensibility.

00:33:38.360 And he knew people like Jacques Maritain who very much appreciated like, you know, George

00:33:43.040 Rual and people like that. 0.99

00:33:44.180 So he did have, I think, he had good taste in modern art, but that was so much of its

00:33:49.960 time where it looks like, you know, something from the space age.

00:33:52.700 And it's, to me, not a very warm space.

00:33:56.280 And I don't like the kind of metallic sculpture behind where the Pope sits.

00:34:00.960 So, no, I'm not the biggest fan of it.

00:34:03.040 Yeah.

00:34:03.780 To me, the good taste in modern art is kind of like being the best basketball player among

00:34:08.200 the Pygmies, you know.

00:34:09.120 But listen,

00:34:09.680 As far as I'm concerned.

00:34:12.880 No, I think some of – like go to the east wing of the National Gallery in Washington,

00:34:16.640 you'll see some of like the early Picassos like from the 1920s.

00:34:20.540 And some of them, I think, are very fine.

00:34:23.240 But, yeah, that hall to me does not speak the best of the Catholic artistic tradition.

00:34:29.380 The most diplomatic phrase I've ever heard in my life.

00:34:32.560 Well, speaking of art, it's the last question.

00:34:35.080 Roughly how many –

00:34:36.160 Oh, the last one.

00:34:36.520 Yeah.

00:34:37.600 Roughly how many works of art are housed in the Vatican Museum collection?

00:34:42.260 Closest without going over.

00:34:44.220 All right.

00:34:44.780 Oh, you have to just give the number?

00:34:46.400 How many works of art are in there?

00:34:49.240 And we know your least favorite.

00:34:51.080 What about these other ones?

00:34:52.560 All right, Mike, what do you have?

00:34:53.180 I said Aleph Nall, accountably infinite number of works of art.

00:34:57.920 Is that –

00:34:58.600 You get no credit for that.

00:34:59.960 I don't –

00:35:00.380 Is it highest without going over?

00:35:02.600 How did you know?

00:35:05.460 I said 1 million, simply as a guess.

00:35:08.180 What's the answer?

00:35:08.980 Around 70,000.

00:35:10.420 Only 20,000 are on public display.

00:35:12.820 So 70,000 is all there is?

00:35:14.860 I thought you were much more than that.

00:35:16.000 20,000 are on display.

00:35:17.080 There's other ones that are hidden away.

00:35:18.460 So if it's closest without going over, then both a million and countable infinity are –

00:35:23.820 so then we're even on that one.

00:35:25.220 You are even.

00:35:25.840 Yeah, we both went over.

00:35:27.200 Okay.

00:35:27.440 Which means Bishop Barron ran away with it.

00:35:29.760 So, Michael, would you please give us a 30-second commercial report?

00:35:32.740 Hold on.

00:35:33.000 You used to do a thing, Ben, where you'd say whoever won, you'd say you could double or

00:35:36.540 nothing on a bonus question.

00:35:38.180 What happened to that?

00:35:39.040 I don't think there's any chance that Bishop Barron would want to gamble away.

00:35:43.100 No.

00:35:43.360 Amazing victory.

00:35:44.160 Truly astonishing.

00:35:45.240 Even because he's an intelligent man?

00:35:46.660 Yeah.

00:35:46.860 This is the greatest victory we've ever had on Face Off.

00:35:49.520 Oh, is that right?

00:35:50.380 Yeah.

00:35:51.220 Yeah.

00:35:51.960 That's bad.

00:35:54.000 I think I may have automatically just –

00:35:56.140 I might have automatically become a Lutheran because of that.

00:35:59.680 That's bad.

00:36:00.340 I got to – oh, man, I got to put in a little work next time.

00:36:03.540 Well, in any case, I can very sincerely say that you should all – well, you should go

00:36:09.080 to church, and you should avail yourself of the sacraments, and that's Bishop Barron's

00:36:14.440 main job.

00:36:15.320 But his side hustles are really great, too.

00:36:18.040 Word on Fire is absolutely magnificent.

00:36:20.020 All of the lectures, all of the series, all of the books, the Word on Fire Bible is wonderful.

00:36:25.580 I have editions of it with the epistles and with the gospels in my home, and so you should

00:36:31.520 go check out all of that.

00:36:32.880 I don't – somehow – I'm not a bishop.

00:36:35.780 I'm not a priest.

00:36:37.180 I don't – all I do is this, and somehow Bishop Barron manages to produce more content,

00:36:42.260 marvelously compelling content, and also manages to do his day job as well, which is very

00:36:47.160 impressive.

00:36:47.460 Well, thank you for that.

00:36:51.400 That was very nice.

00:36:52.280 My pleasure.

00:36:52.980 It is great.

00:36:53.480 I do have – you know, I have a picture of it somewhere on my bookshelf.

00:36:56.560 I have a little statue of Dante.

00:36:58.240 I have certain little, you know, icons and relics and things, and I've got the Word on

00:37:03.300 Fire Bible, right?

00:37:04.380 Two books of it right there.

00:37:05.540 Beautiful.

00:37:06.900 Thank you for that.

00:37:07.980 Well, there you have it.

00:37:08.880 If you haven't already, go follow Bishop Robert Barron at Bishop Barron, and subscribe

00:37:12.980 to the Word on Fire show, and don't forget to grab a copy of What Christians Believe,

00:37:17.620 Understanding the Nicene Creed, available wherever books are sold.

00:37:20.880 Drop us a comment.

00:37:21.680 Let us know who you'd like to have on next, and what topic to cover in the next episode

00:37:25.620 of Faith Off.

00:37:26.360 See you then.

00:37:26.620 Bye.

00:37:31.360 See you then.

00:37:32.120 Thank you.

00:37:32.420 Bye.

00:37:32.460 Bye.

00:37:33.420 Bye.

00:37:34.620 Ciao.

00:37:34.920 Bye.

00:37:35.080 Bye.

00:37:36.160 Bye.

00:37:48.640 Bye.

The Michael Knowles Show - August 10, 2025

＂What's Hidden In The Vatican？＂ FACE-Off Bishop Barron Vs Michael Knowles

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript