BONUS - Pearl Davis Interviews Pastor Joel Webbon | Biblical Patriarchy & Christian Nationalism
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 47 minutes
Words per minute
191.3854
Harmful content
Misogyny
31
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Toxicity
36
sentences flagged
Hate speech
100
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Summary
In this episode of the Just Pearly Things YouTube channel, Pastor Joel Webber sits down with me to discuss the differences between Protestantism and Catholicism. We talk about the difference between Calvinism and Calvinism, and why Catholics and Baptists have very different theology.
Transcript
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all right what up guys welcome to the just pearly things youtube channel and welcome to the sit down
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today i have a man named joel webin look it i first saw you you are one of the few pastors that
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i have seen that is not pushing this like woke agenda so that's where i initially saw you i
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think i reacted to one of your videos welcome welcome to the show thanks i'm honored introduce
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yourself to the people. Yeah. So my name is Joel. My wife is Megan. And then we have four children,
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Olive and Ruth and Eleanor and then Franklin. We got a boy. And I am in Georgetown, Texas. So
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about 45 minutes north of the capital, Austin. I always tell people we are close enough to Austin
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to where you can hop on a toll and work for Elon, but far enough away to where hopefully our police
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don't get defunded. Austin is terrible. But we're happy to be here. Georgetown is a small quaint
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town. I pastor a church called Covenant Bible Church, and I'm the president of a social media
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ministry thing called Right Response Ministries.
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Right Response Ministries. Okay. So question, you're Baptist, right? Is that correct?
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Barely Baptist is what I would say, but yeah, technically, yes, I'm Baptist.
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Okay. What is the difference between that and like, because I grew up Catholic. So what is
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the difference between that and Catholicism? Yeah, well, really for all Protestants, I mean,
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a lot of Protestants are completely compromised and out to lunch, but let's say faithful Protestants,
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if we assume that, the main difference would be the five solas. So Martin Luther, Catholics aren't
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a huge fan, I can see why. But those were the five things before you get into the five points
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of Calvinism or soteriology, which is just doctrine of salvation, the five solas, sola is the Latin
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word for alone. So Martin Luther, he coined this idea that it's scripture alone, it's grace alone,
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it's faith alone, it's Christ alone, and then it's to the glory of God alone. So the big difference
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between any Protestant, Presbyterian, Anglican, Baptist, the big difference is going to be that
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word sola or alone. So Catholics in a nutshell, I would say, and I'll just speak frankly, I think
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that Roman Catholicism is what I would call the plus Christian religion. The plus meaning that
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it's scripture plus tradition. So you see within the Council of Trent and different Catholic
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founding documents that it is two equal streams is the language they use. You have both scripture
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and tradition. So tradition is not subordinate to scripture, but they're on the same plane.
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Equal authority in the Catholic church is notorious for saying, well, the church actually
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gave birth to the scripture. Whereas we would say that Council of Nicaea, you know, early church
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fathers, that they didn't, that they didn't deem the scripture or give it its weight, but rather
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simply recognized the word of God. And so anyway, so scripture plus tradition, then they would say
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grace plus sacraments. Grace is not imputed, accredited to our account through faith alone,
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but it's infused through, you know, the mass, the Eucharist, through confession, all the seven
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sacraments that Catholics have. We have two, baptism and the Lord's Supper. And then faith
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alone, Catholics would say faith plus works. We would say that salvation is not faith plus works,
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but rather faith equals salvation plus works. So it's faith alone that saves. And if you're
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really saved, you're going to do good stuff. You're going to obey Jesus. And then it's Christ
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alone. We would say that Catholics, it's Christ plus saints, Mary and other saints. And then to
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the glory of God alone. And we would say just the logical conclusion, if it's grace plus sacraments,
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faith plus works christ plus saints and it's scripture plus tradition then you can't say that
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it's to the glory of god alone you have to say it's to the glory of god plus the pope tradition
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church fathers mary so yeah see i get i get a little um i put it i see both sides somehow
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because on one hand i see when like i guess from like a catholic's point of view when i i don't
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know if Baptists fall into this, so you could correct me if I'm wrong. You clearly know more
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about this stuff than I do. But like when they talk about reading the Bible and then coming to
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conclusions is like basically what I've gathered from more Protestant churches. I almost feel like
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that's how sometimes the wokeness gets like in thrusted into a lot of these churches because
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it's like people coming to their own conclusions. But then I don't know how you can not see what's
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been going on with the catholic church in the last couple of years no it would be a great argument
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make you you know make you question it when you're like well if this institution is guided
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by god why do i have right what who is in charge of this right you're right on its face it would
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be a great argument uh the counter argument is uh a little guy called the pope who's the wokest
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woke i mean you know that all the transgender stuff that the catholic church is changing its
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it's mind on, you know, suddenly after 2000 years, you know, being rooted in a certain position. And
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so I think the reality is that at the end of the day, you know, I say this, you know, it could
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apply to Roman Catholicism, but I say it with my Presbyterian brothers, you know, they're like,
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well, Baptist, you know, you, they hold to local church autonomy. So there's no ecclesiastical
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authority outside of that one local church. It's easy for one local church if there's no formal
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authority outside of it to go off the rails. And I always tease them and say, yeah, when Presbyterians
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go off the rails, the whole denomination goes off the rails. And I think it's the same with
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Roman Catholicism. In every single realm, the reality is that if society as a whole loses its
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mind, if the world loses its mind, then it's just going to be one piece of the puzzle at a time
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compromising or the whole enchilada simultaneously. But at the end of the day,
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there is, you know, we're talking about polity, forms of governance. There is no single, I believe
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that one form of polity is correct from a biblical perspective, but there is practically
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speaking no church polity that is perfectly immune to compromise. Yeah, well, and that's kind of,
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I mean, that's what we're finding out with the Catholics, because I feel like, especially like
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when I talk to like older Catholics, they kind of thought we were immune to a lot of that
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stuff because we had the institution. My grandma passed away, but I was like, she would be rolling
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in her grave right now if she saw what was going on. What do you think has contributed to just
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this general trend across the board of seeing churches get more and more woke?
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Yeah. So part of it is going back to Protestants, like what you were saying in terms of it would
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seem on the face that Roman Catholicism would be more immune or less vulnerable to wokeness.
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um i think there's something true there so part of it i think is um just subjectivism um the idea
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and protestants i think are more vulnerable um to subjectivism uh the idea of being atomistic
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individualistic um we don't think of societies and cultures and nations as a whole anymore
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so for me i you know i'm a unapologetic christian nationalist i'm patriarchal i'm a theonomist we
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can talk about what that means. I'm post-millennial, you know, lots of things that make lots of people
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mad. But the point is, you know, as it pertains to this question, everybody thinks that they're
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an isolated atom. So thinking, you know, like chemistry, you know, we're not molecular anymore.
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So I think of the family unit is a molecule, right? So like water, it's not just hydrogen,
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it's, you know, it's H2O. But we've split the molecule. You know, what we've done in science,
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you know, we, we've now done, you know, uh, in society, the same kind of principle. And so now
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it's no longer the family. Um, but it's, you know, I was looking over just even my personal family's
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history and it was, it was 15 minutes ago. It was, we're not talking about thousands of 15 minutes
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ago, you've got listed families in a town, you know, and it says head of household, there's the
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man. Right. And everyone was fine with that language. Nobody was losing their minds. Nobody
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was offended, head of household, whoever, Jim Roger, and it's the husband, it's the father.
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And now it's not households represented by a head, but it's, I'm my own person. And so when
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everybody becomes individual and separated from society, separated from churches, separated from
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families, and all of a sudden meaning and truth, instead of being transcendent and objective and
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universal. It becomes subjective and interpersonal. And then, yeah, you begin to become meticulously
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introspective, constantly navel-gazing, looking within, looking to yourself to find meaning.
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Just looking at my belly button, just obsessed with me. Instead of looking up and looking out,
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I'm like, wow, look, I have a freckle there. Well, even because I did 12 years of Catholic
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school and i don't even think they went over like patriarchy at all like i can't i can't if they if
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they did i don't remember it they it must have been like a quick and it's kind of funny because
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you would think the catholics would uh because they're pretty big on the you know uh the idea of
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the holy father no you know catholics talk i mean the pope you know he's he's you know he's a father
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you know or priest father you know bless me father for i have sinned like that i mean father language
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and that's all patriarchy means just for the record the simplest and most accurate definition
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is father rule that that's that's what i mean that's what patriarchy is is father rule so as
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from a christian perspective whether you're on the catholic side of the aisle or the protestant
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side of the aisle wherever you land if you're within the larger banner of you know christianity
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um patriarchy is is i mean it's nothing to be ashamed of and it's and it's inescapable even
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if you're not identifying as a Christian, truth is truth. We live, so we would start with the
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Father, right? Father God. We live in the Father's world and the Father has chosen to bless people,
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his image-bearing creatures, through human fathers in three primary spheres, which would be familial
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fathers. That's the biological father in a home, families, through civil fathers, right? That's
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the state, the civil magistrate, which I believe should be made up of men, qualified men.
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and then you also have uh church fathers women shouldn't vote right i do not yeah so i think
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the 19th amendment is a serious problem yeah yeah yeah i don't even think we should be in office i'm
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like what you want to check on her period well and that's what i was saying is speaking about
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not even the vote but but about the office itself uh isaiah literally says that so the book of isaiah
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the prophet he says that one of the marks of god's judgment upon a people is that they would
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be ruled by women and children. Um, and you look at, you know, our, our leaders in the West. Yeah.
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So in the West today, you like, who are our leaders? Well, they're geriatric, you know,
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I mean, they're people who, I don't even know if they're physically alive or if there's like
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invisible strings, you know, and this person has been dead for six months and they just painted up
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their corpse. So they're so old they're, they're, you know, they're have dimension barely, you know,
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functioning, um, or they're children, right. Think Greta Thunberg telling, you know, the whole world
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what to do when she's 14 years old because she's got a feeling in her heart. Or it's women. It's
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not men, but it's Nancy Pelosi and this person and that person. And part of the problem with that,
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in my assessment, it's not because women are unintelligent or that they have nothing to
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contribute. For me, the problem is the way that God designed women. So again, looking at Ezekiel
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and other Old Testament books of the Bible, when it describes civil rulers or describes Rome
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you know, and, and, uh, emperors and it describes them with a allegorical language of a bear or a
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lion. They have claws and sharp teeth. Uh, whereas a woman, that's not her nature and it's not
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supposed to be, um, her nature is supposed to be warm, embracive, hospitable, nurturing. So I think
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a great example would be, uh, Kentucky, uh, Brown Jackson. So, you know, when, when she was being
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interviewed and they were pressing on her and asking questions about her, you know, the Supreme
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court, uh, Supreme court justice, the most recent one that was appointed. They're going to roast me
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for not knowing this. No, it's fine. It's fine. But the most recent Supreme court justice, you
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know, appointee who was a black woman. So it's like, well, I mean, her qualifications don't
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really seem to matter. It seems like we were just going for a stereotype and fill in the slot. And
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so, but when they were pushing on her, one of the things that the big objections that was coming
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from, you know, uh, Republicans and guys on the right was you've been soft on crime in particular,
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um, the crime of pedophilia, uh, that, that she had served as a judge, uh, for many years and had,
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you know, multiple cases where there's a man, uh, who was proven to be guilty beyond reasonable
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doubt in a court of law, uh, for, for abusing sexually abusing children. Um, and, and her,
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you know she would always give or at least there were multiple times i shouldn't say always because
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i don't know every single case but there were proven multiple cases where she gave like the
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lightest sentence possible and and what i would say is you know that is kind of the nature of a
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woman she's she's looking and saying oh this guy i bet he had a bad mom you know he's maybe he had
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a rough life and i would say that is a great disposition in a home as a mother with a four
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year old that's that's what you want if you're four you know but um but in a court of law as a
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civil ruler um you want a man who will say you did what with kids let's get some rope find a tree
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hang them like that's what men do and and that's good you need both you need women and you need
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men right well and that's like and that's when like it's like when you get red pilled you almost
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start to see that all of these women are in positions even in like corporate america even
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outside of like just because we're women not because we actually like deserve the positions
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and so it's like we almost like think we're more important and special and doing more than we are
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because they're giving us these like stupid quotas um and and that's what i realized it in
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like women's basketball um where they basically take money from the men and give it to the women
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and i'm like they do that with us for everything i bet and then like all the yeah um but i don't
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know i just it's so interesting to see it like translate into the churches because you'd always
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think like the churches were immune from this stuff right they are not not even close well so
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within the church world you know everything's you know well you would hope that everything would
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have some kind of theological reasoning we're going to do this because the bible says that
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and in my experience so so again and this would pertain to both catholics and protestants
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uh the term is complementarianism uh that usually is used uh to define that and this would be the
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conservative position which i would say is is not that conservative and and i don't really like it
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i don't think that it's faithful i don't think it's biblical but complementarianism think
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complement right so two things that are different right you don't complement uh calamari with a
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plate of calamari. Um, you might like calamari and so you want double and that's great, but that
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wouldn't be, you know, compliment, uh, to compliment calamari, you have something that's
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distinct, it's separate, um, but it goes well with it, right? So a glass of, you know, chilled
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white Riesling wine or whatever, you know, to compliment, you know, or marinara sauce, you know,
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something to compliment it. It's distinct, uh, but they work well together. So complementarianism
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was the theological term. It was coined by Wayne Grudem and John Piper, who were two pastors and
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theologians, but it wasn't coined until 1988. So very, you know, kind of 15 minutes ago situation,
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very recent. And the idea of complementarianism is that men and women are different, but they
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work well together, hand and glove, you know, they work in tandem, work in concert. But what
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happened, and this wasn't so much John Piper and Wayne Grudem, to be fair to those guys,
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but what happened is it was quickly hijacked by other people. And it became a halfway house
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between egalitarianism and patriarchy and so egalitarianism everybody's equal everybody's the
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same that can apply to gender that can apply to uh class you know and economic uh different you
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know different levels you know everyone's the same um and so then that's the heart of wokeness is
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this egalitarian neo-marxist idea so complementarianism was basically the patriarchal
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guys were saying we know this is biblical we know it's right but feminism has crept into the world
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and not only the world, but the church and everybody starting to go left going towards
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feminism and egalitarianism. So we're going to head them off like Gandalf, you know, on the bridge,
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you shall not pass, you know, and, and, uh, but in doing so they, instead of saying, stay here,
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it's good. It's right. It's true. Uh, they said, well, we'll, we'll go, we'll, we'll concede and
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we'll compromise with you in part, but can you at least stay here? And so complementarianism came in
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and this is what theologians, the more liberal ones, not Piper and Grudem so much, but what they
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did was they said, well, complementarianism means that God has assigned to men and women
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differing roles. But what they did is they took the distinction of roles of men and women and
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they hung it in midair. They made it arbitrary. So it would be like this. So think of fish and
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birds. It's like, well, God decided in creation that birds would fly and fish would swim just
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because. It's like, but don't you think it has something to do with the fact of the way that
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he made them, their design, not just their assigning of roles, but their nature, like
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that fish are called to swim, sure, but don't you think it might be because they have gills
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and fins and scales and birds are called to fly, sure, but maybe the hollow bone structure
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and the feathers and the wings have something to do with it, and so that's what happened
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with men and women is, well, they're called to different things, but it's not because
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they have different natures, it's arbitrary, it's arbitrary, they're just called to different
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rolls because god likes it and it works well together but it's not really stemming from their
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design so then you have this mindset of the woman saying anything you can do i can do better i can
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do anything better than you but i won't because i'm not called to it which quickly becomes i will
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you know so yeah well and then oh that makes a lot of sense so basically they were they were
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trying to explain it in a different way but then it got hijacked by the people that are egalitarian
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yes and then basically that's that's how because i would hear the i can't submit to my husband
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unless he submits to god have you heard that yeah i've heard that which i guess it's like it's true
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in in a way but i i use i hear it more of as used in like a way they want to control their husbands
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have you heard that or no yeah definitely that's i mean that's what what complementarianism
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essentially did in terms of a wife's submission to her husband is it it essentially said first
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and foremost, the husband's authority became, um, the last line of defense. Uh, so meaning
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non-existent, uh, functionally it's non-existent. So what it became was, um, you know, complimentary
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so that guys are trying to hold onto their biblical card, right? Cause they don't want
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to just publicly come out and say, yeah, I'm, I'm a lib and I don't care about the Bible and I'm
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woke. So guys are still, you know, they're pretending a conservative, biblically faithful
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position. So they're like, oh, we're not egalitarian. We're not feminists. We're
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complementarian. But we just don't want to use the word patriarchy because it has stigma attached
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to it and it's going to unnecessarily push people away. So we're complementarian. This term that,
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you know, was coined in 1988, you know, very, very recently. And they'll say, yeah, the husband
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does have authority over his wife. He's the head of his wife. That's Ephesians 5 as Christ is head
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of the church. But in a healthy marriage with a good husband, number one, he's going to lead his
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wife, not just command her, but he's going to inspire her and lead her and shape her and
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encourage her to where she's going to be agreeing with him most of the time because he's a great
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leader. And if she's disagreeing, it's probably because he's a bad leader. And if she ever
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disagrees in a healthy marriage, there'll be little disagreement. And when there is disagreement,
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he doesn't just pull the I'm in charge card, the authority card. Instead, they should pause and
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pray and fast and consider and this and that. And if they can't get on the same page, even after
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pausing and prayer, then they should go to the elders of the church and the elders of the church
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are probably going to take her side and most churches. So they're going to go to the elders
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of the church and they're going to weigh in as a third party and overrule the husband's authority
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in his own home and side with the wife. And if the elders in a very rare case, which never happens,
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if the elders were to say, well, actually it's 50-50, a perfect even split. You could go either
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way. Maybe he's right. Maybe she's right. So they disagree. They seek the Lord in prayer,
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still disagree, seek the elders of the church. And it's a perfect split. You could go either way.
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Then, and in that case only, then the husband gets the tiebreaker. And in a healthy marriage
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where there's not a ton of conflict, the husband, that scenario where he gets the tiebreaker will
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probably occur over the course of a 50-year marriage, maybe three times. And that's the
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authority of a husband, which is to say the authority of the husband is nothing.
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And so how do you, so how do you guys count? Do you guys counsel couples in your church?
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Like how do you do it differently? If they ask for it, of course. Yeah.
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How do you guys do it differently? Um, well, for one, I'm patriarchal. So
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I believe that the husband actually has authority over his wife. So when I'm stepping into, um,
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a marriage into a home. First, I want to have a sound biblical understanding of jurisdictions,
00:22:09.920
right? So in the same way, you know, part of my problem with COVID and all that, you know,
00:22:12.820
the branch COVIDian crap was, you know, that, well, wait a second. The state does not have
00:22:20.340
jurisdiction in these areas, in these spheres of the church or in free markets, you know,
00:22:27.960
with businesses and this and that, or families and homes. You have to stay in your lane. And
00:22:32.720
it's the same with pastors. So a governing official in the civil realm doesn't have authority
00:22:39.380
to do whatever they want in every other realm. So too, a pastor, he has ecclesiastical authority
00:22:45.620
in the church. And certainly the church is made up of families and he's going to be preaching and
00:22:51.460
he's going to be counseling and all those kinds of things. But he has to be very careful of what
00:22:56.300
authority does he actually have? So if I step into a marriage because I've been invited in
00:23:01.880
to provide counsel, I'm going to be really careful in what I, you know, the best way I could say it
00:23:08.060
is distinguishing the authority of counsel versus the authority of command. I'm going to counsel
00:23:12.760
and at times counsel strongly. I really think you would do well and be wise to consider X, Y, Z.
00:23:19.980
Or if it's something that's clear in scripture, like the husband is beating his wife, God forbid,
00:23:26.300
I'm not going to counsel and say, I really think you should stop. I'm going to say you must stop
00:23:30.600
beating your wife. And we also are going, because this is like a Venn diagram. In this case,
0.78
00:23:36.540
spheres overlap. This is a familial issue in the family sphere, an ecclesiastical issue as members
00:23:42.940
in our church, and it's a civil issue. I'm going to have to inform civil authorities. However,
00:23:49.080
if it's not something that's so cut and dry, I'm going to give not the authority of a command,
00:23:54.200
but the authority of counsel. But at the end of the day, the husband actually has the command.
00:23:59.440
He actually has the authority. And I'm going to also be really careful. I think this is something
00:24:04.520
that our whole world with Me Too, you might as well call it church too, because the church has
00:24:10.220
bought into the Me Too movement, hook, line, and sinker. And here's the thing about the church.
00:24:14.120
The church has not led the way in society for decades, sadly. So the church is actually always
00:24:21.440
behind the wokest place on earth. I believe, I truly believe the wokest place on earth right
00:24:26.300
now is the church. Uh, the reason why is because I think, well, cause the world, even, even
00:24:34.340
colleges, the world is already realizing, Oh, that was, that was a mistake. Yeah. I mean, SNL,
00:24:40.260
you watch, you watch SNL. I mean, nobody should watch SNL, but if you did, uh, they're even
00:24:44.580
backtracking and doing skits that are kind of like, yeah, maybe the woke thing's kind of dumb.
0.53
00:24:49.580
Like at every level, I think people are coming off of wokeness, coming off of some of these
00:24:55.780
But the problem is the church is always five years behind.
00:24:57.940
So the church might've been woke last, and even that would be hard to substantiate.
00:25:02.560
But let's just assume the church was woke last.
00:25:07.440
Well, the church will stay woke about five years after society has already realized it's
00:25:11.460
a bad idea because the church is not influential.
00:25:15.580
It has not been leading the way, leading the culture for a very long time.
00:25:19.620
So all that being said, my point is just that with wokeness and with me too, that's how
00:25:25.960
If a woman comes to a pastor and says, this happened biblically, the Bible addresses this.
00:25:31.600
We have clear verses in scripture, especially in the Old Testament, that should be viewed
00:25:37.060
That means it needs to be not just dropped wholesale, a one-to-one ratio in our society
00:25:41.400
today, but you extract from this Old Testament law with Israel, the general equity, the general
00:25:47.260
principles there. And then you seek with prudence to apply it in a relevant, applicable way in our
00:25:54.060
society today. And one of those laws is about victims, or I should say alleged victims. If an
00:26:00.560
alleged victim comes and says, this thing happened, you do not immediately assume that that thing
00:26:06.980
actually happened. That the reality is that in our culture, we assume that the first person to
00:26:12.840
voice a grievance is the victim. When it is entirely possible that the person who this
00:26:18.760
grievance is being voiced about, if that person's lying, that's the true victim, the person who's
00:26:24.360
being lied against. And so I go into a situation, you know, pastorally, and I don't go in with my
00:26:32.260
mind already made up that, you know, a woman cried. I remember my dad taught me this when I
00:26:36.880
was a young boy, I made a girl cry. Um, not, I didn't touch her or anything like that. I just,
00:26:42.600
you know, I said something to her that, that offended her. What'd you say? I'll come back
00:26:47.200
to that. I'm willing to answer, but I, you know, I said something and, and it made her cry. And
00:26:51.960
she told, you know, some of the leaders in the church and my dad was the pastor. And so my dad's
00:26:57.380
kind of getting pressure. The pastor's son is making girls cry. And I remember he sat me down
00:27:02.980
privately and I told him, but dad, this is what I said. And it was true and blah, blah, blah. And he
00:27:06.920
said, well, let's be careful how we say it and this and that. And I was like, I feel like I was
00:27:10.220
and I'll try and okay, dad. And he was like, all right, son, I love you. And my dad's a great dad.
00:27:16.260
And he was like, I love you. And a lesson just for the future. He said, you just need to know
00:27:21.020
that in our current world, if a woman cries, she wins always. And you just need to know that if
0.99
00:27:27.940
you're going to have any chance as a man in life, you just need to know that this is the world we
00:27:33.140
live in. And you're going to have to be shrewd, not compromised, not cowardly, but strategic.
00:27:40.600
You're going to have to be wise. So what I said was basically there were rumors in our high school
00:27:46.000
that this woman had done something, I don't want to be overly specific, but had done some things
00:27:51.400
that are unbiblical, that would be immoral, that would be bad. And I had talked to her
00:27:58.480
with another girl, it was youth group, we were teenagers, and said, hey, everybody knows that
00:28:06.660
you're in our church and you're in our youth group and they're saying these things about you
00:28:10.320
and is it true? And she was like, yes. And I was like, I think you need to say something and admit
00:28:15.340
this is wrong and and and you know because it's giving our church and it's giving christ
00:28:19.800
a bad name it makes jesus look bad yeah um and and the you know the takeaway from for her was
00:28:27.320
how could you um how could you correct me you know and so well but and um i always say like if um
00:28:35.200
and i don't know about baptist in particular but i always say if like the church really had wives
00:28:40.200
like that their men would be lined up to go to church but the problem is like exactly what you're
00:28:45.260
talking about like the general consensus i've gotten from guys is that they go to church and
00:28:50.380
find worse quality women um because it's like they go there to feel better after they've lived a life
00:28:56.220
of sin basically okay um there's probably some truth i don't know yeah like especially in like
0.90
00:29:02.280
some of the like non like i've heard this about um what is it evangelical yeah evangelical and i
00:29:09.520
just just so you know so it's all right so if you think you know catholic and protestant
00:29:14.500
Underneath the Protestant banner, you would have mainline Protestant denomination, Episcopalian, Anglican, and then evangelical would be a subgroup of Protestant.
00:29:27.120
I pick on evangelicals regularly because they need it.
0.98
00:29:35.400
I think, you know, to put a little bit more fine point on it, the type of evangelical church I think that is like that is your very seeker-friendly, you know, kind of trying to, you know, attractional church.
00:29:53.620
It's not a church with, you know, with traditions.
00:29:57.920
It's a church that has a rock concert and smoke machines, you know, and laser lights.
00:30:05.200
and it was so weird it was oh my gosh it was so weird and it's nothing against them they were
00:30:10.740
like very nice but i'm sure they were i was like i was i was like what on earth is this there's a
00:30:15.620
whole band on the front i'm i'm catholic so it's like this is very there's like um uh cameras
00:30:24.080
everywhere and then they'd lay hands on people and they'd like fall down i was like what is this
00:30:28.660
i have never seen this in my life familiar with that yeah oh wait really we don't do that but i
00:30:34.280
have i i know what you're talking about um so anyways but yeah so the charismatic is kind of
00:30:40.060
what you're describing so the laying on of hands is is a biblical principle even within you know
00:30:44.080
catholicism there would be a laying on of hands for certain blessings and certain rituals and
00:30:48.020
ordination those kinds of things i have never seen it like that i'll say yeah yeah but the falling
00:30:53.280
over charismatics would call that slain in the spirit uh that the holy spirit has like slayed
00:30:59.440
you you've just you know you know you're just overwhelmed by the love of god the power of god
00:31:04.280
whatever it might be but in a charismatic kind of circle that's big on you know falling over and
00:31:10.660
you know or speaking in tongues you know or and then tends to follow with a charismatic you know
00:31:15.900
guys you know the rock concert kind of thing and the sermon tends to be more of a ted talk
00:31:20.680
you know and or it's not even a sermon it's a guy he's sitting at a coffee table he won't even stand
00:31:25.640
up, you know, he's sitting at a coffee table. He's got his iPad instead of a Bible and a warm
00:31:30.320
cup of coffee. Uh, and, and I, I'm not going to preach at you. I'm just going to share. And he
00:31:35.160
just shares, he's very relatable and, and he sounds humble, but everything's about him. So
00:31:40.260
it's actually really prideful. Um, you know, and in that kind of environment, uh, sure. Uh, the
00:31:46.400
idea that there could be a lot of women there who are trying to clean up their lives, who are coming
1.00
00:31:51.540
from, you know, seven years going to the club or whatever it might be. That totally makes sense
1.00
00:31:56.540
because that church, even with their music and stuff like that, it kind of resembles the club
00:32:01.480
that they came from, you know, the way people dress even at church, right? People aren't, you
00:32:05.900
know, they're not dressing modestly, you know? And so, and that would make sense that in that
00:32:10.700
environment, a Hillsong would be an example, you know, or Elevation would be, these are big,
00:32:16.320
charismatic seeker-friendly churches but in that environment uh to say that and again i won't say
00:32:21.980
everyone because i'm not omniscient don't know but to say that there might be a large a large
0.65
00:32:26.860
percentage of both men and women coming from sinful past trying to clean up their life you
00:32:33.100
know but have been very worldly very vain um it's it's perfectly reasonable i think that's i think
00:32:39.400
that's likely however um if we're saying the church at large in general i would like to think
00:32:45.440
that if you're going to a sound, solid biblical church, that you are going to find both men and
00:32:51.800
women who are genuine. They're not perfect. They're sinners. We're all sinners, but that
00:32:59.740
are genuine. And there are a lot of women, I think, in sound, conservative, traditional churches,
00:33:08.380
Presbyterian and Baptist and Anglican and this, that, and the other that were raised the right
00:33:13.720
way, have not been promiscuous, who have lived chaste lives. And there are women who genuinely
00:33:20.580
want to marry a godly man and want to submit to him. And my wife is an example of that. I have
00:33:26.460
an awesome wife. She loves God. She loves Jesus. She loves me. And she seeks to follow my leadership
1.00
00:33:33.440
and I seek to lead her lovingly. And I'm not trying to just domineer over my wife, but I do
00:33:39.340
have authority in my home? And whenever I talk about it, I regularly upset women and they think,
0.99
00:33:45.000
oh, that terrible man, his poor wife and children, they're probably...
00:33:49.140
That was my next question. Do you get a lot of pushback for these opinions?
00:33:54.120
Yeah. So I had a video that went semi-viral. It's maybe not the viral standard for Pearl,
00:33:59.180
but for the Joel level of viral. But basically it was a clip. Somebody took out a clip of one
00:34:06.020
of my sermons where I was talking about authority and I was talking about different spheres so that,
00:34:10.560
you know, the state, the church, and the home. And I got to the home and I said,
00:34:14.980
at the level of the state, civil magistrates, those in civil authority, their authority is a
00:34:20.420
mile wide, but it's only about an inch deep. The state does not have that much authority
00:34:24.660
to tell people what to do. Get out of our business. You have some authority, but it's very
00:34:30.480
limited. Your jurisdiction is small. The scope, you know, if it's USA, 330 million people are
00:34:37.620
under your authority, but your authority is an inch deep. The church, I think there's more
00:34:41.380
authority, but a smaller scope. So greater degree of authority for church leaders, but a smaller
00:34:46.120
scope. And then I said, the family is the smallest scope, but a massive degree of authority. And I
00:34:53.520
says, for instance, I have authority over five individuals, my wife and four children, but the
00:34:58.440
authority that I have is a massive level of authority. And so then I said, and I gave examples,
00:35:05.140
this is where I get in trouble because I try to be helpful. And so I give, you know, not just in
00:35:08.620
theory, but in practice. So I said, you know, with my children, I said, for instance, with my
00:35:12.220
children, I have the authority over what they eat, what they wear, even when they go to the bathroom.
00:35:17.860
Now, my children are at the time, we're five, three, two, and zero, their ages. So what I'm
00:35:24.780
talking about is, yeah, I tell my young children, hey, go potty before you put on your jammies and
00:35:29.880
get in bed. We need to go potty. Did you go potty? Like I, you know, I have that authority. I wasn't
00:35:34.060
saying my 17 year old, I tell him it's 415. Yeah. You know, so, but of course people interpret it
00:35:40.200
that way because people hate me because they're feminist and I'm talking about Christians. They
0.98
00:35:44.380
are feminist and they worship women instead of Christ. And so anybody who, you know, adheres to
0.94
00:35:50.560
biblical patriarchy whatsoever, they're going to try to destroy him and they don't care if they're
00:35:53.500
twisting his words. But then I got to my wife and I said, the example I gave with my wife is I said,
00:35:57.880
in the case of my wife, for instance, here's an example. One day I was coming back from work
00:36:02.820
and walked in the house and I saw that she was reading a book. And I said, women shouldn't be
1.00
00:36:07.740
able to read. No, I'm just kidding. I didn't say that. But I said, she was reading a book and it
1.00
00:36:11.920
was on infant baptism, baptizing babies, pedo-baptism. And I'm a Baptist, I'm a credo-Baptist.
00:36:17.680
So I think baptism follows a credible profession of faith. You wait, essentially, that's the
00:36:22.480
nutshell. And I said, Hey babe, don't read that. No. And I said, um, those are, we want to believe
00:36:29.840
what's true, whether we hold to it now or not. If we don't hold to the truth, we want to change
00:36:34.120
and hold to the truth. But I don't want my wife, this is what I told her. I don't want my wife
00:36:38.480
being convinced when she's married to a Baptist pastor going to a Baptist church. I don't want
00:36:43.420
her being convinced of, of infant baptism and that being just a, an opportunity, a wedge for
00:36:49.760
there to be contention in our marriage and division within our church. And so I said,
00:36:54.340
put down that book. We're not going to read that right now. We will read it together when I have
00:36:59.540
time and we'll work through it together. And I said this in a sermon, giving this, I said it in
00:37:04.120
my marriage, but then I said it in a sermon, giving this example, and it got 750, like close
00:37:09.680
to a million views. And it was all Christians who are complementarian. Most of them would say,
00:37:14.820
oh, I'm complementarian. Men have authority in their home. They don't believe that. They don't
0.99
00:37:19.100
believe that. And so they went semi-viral and they spread it around and everybody, a ton of people
00:37:24.700
stopped following me and said, he's a monster. He won't let his wife read. Whereas like, yeah,
00:37:30.460
that is correct. Here's the deal. You guys all say that you're not feminist. I'm talking about
00:37:36.320
church people. You say that you believe the Bible, that you're not feminist. And you'll say, oh,
0.80
00:37:40.380
the husband is the head of his wife as Christ is the head of the church. But here's what you'll
00:37:43.900
never do. You'll never, ever give a practical example of it. So you always keep it out in the
00:37:50.380
17th dimension of theory. Oh yes, the husband is the head of his wife, like Christ is the head of
0.73
00:37:55.180
the church. But if any guy ever gave an example of actually using that authority, you would always
0.69
00:38:02.460
disagree with it, no matter what the example was. So just be honest and say, I actually don't
00:38:07.340
believe the husband has authority. I'm a raging feminist, just like the purple haired freak. I
0.80
00:38:12.420
just call it complementarianism so i can keep my biblical card but at the end of the day
0.75
00:38:16.420
i worship women just just be honest we could move on well yeah because how how do they respond when
00:38:25.180
you use your authority by saying no that's the real question it's all it's all fun and dandy
00:38:30.320
when you agree but when you disagree i think that's when you see who actually believes what
00:38:36.060
they say they believe but the person who didn't have a problem just for the record
00:38:39.500
with this whole thing was my wife my wife loves me she you know and to be fair my local church
00:38:45.580
my local church you can even hear on the recording they're laughing yeah because yeah because they
00:38:50.580
agree they get it they get it they know me they know that my wife is not being you know she's not
00:38:56.720
locked in a dungeon in our home like they're like yeah that's that's a good example and the way that
00:39:00.720
i told it i was being humorous with the example it was true i was being you know uh truthful but
00:39:05.240
saying, you know, I, Hey, no baby, we're not becoming pedo Baptist. Uh, you know, like we'll
00:39:09.800
wait, read that book together. And it was, it was funny. It was also true and it was applicable. It
00:39:14.680
was helpful to demonstrate. Here's a practical example of how a husband actually has authority
00:39:19.320
in, in his marriage. And my wife was fine. My church was fine. Um, but most Christians were
00:39:26.000
not fine. They were enraged. Yeah. Because they'll, they'll say that she's like being abused,
0.97
00:39:33.580
but she doesn't even know it right what do they say like stockholm syndrome yeah yeah something
00:39:39.380
like that um you mentioned earlier and i'm probably gonna say this wrong but i wrote it down
00:39:46.020
theonomist yeah theonomist theonomy what is what is what does that mean all it means it's so like
00:39:52.200
patriarchy father rule theonomy god's law so as a theonomist um i would be a general equity
00:39:59.320
theonomist, it's complicated, but to simplify it, I believe that God's law should be the law of the
00:40:06.940
land. So I believe that God's law is good and right and true and immutable, unchanging. It was
00:40:11.940
good. If it was ever good, it's always good that society doesn't get to determine morality,
00:40:17.600
that morality is transcendent. It's unchanging, it's universal. And so as a theonomist, I would
00:40:22.900
say that, you know, three kind of classifications or categorizations of God's law, particularly in
00:40:28.580
the Old Testament would be God's moral law, his civil law, and his ceremonial law. So the moral
00:40:34.400
law would be summarized most acutely in the Decalogue. That's the Ten Commandments. So Exodus
00:40:40.980
20, Ten Commandments, have no other gods before me. Do not make any graven images. Don't take the
00:40:45.980
Lord's name in vain. Remember the Sabbath, keep it holy. Honor your father and mother. Don't kill
00:40:50.280
or don't murder. Do not commit adultery. Don't steal. Don't lie. Bear false witness and do not
00:40:55.740
covet. So I would say that's the summary of moral law and that's transcendent. It's not just for
00:41:02.220
the Old Testament. It's not just for Israel. It's not just for these people at this time in this
00:41:06.720
place. It's for all people, whether you're a Christian or not. It is for all people. God
00:41:11.080
issues his law, not just to Christian people, his people, but to all people because he is not a
0.71
00:41:18.780
universal father. We're not all God's children. That's the whole idea of the Christian faith is
00:41:22.900
it. You're adopted. You become a child of God. Jesus said in John chapter eight of the Pharisees,
0.75
00:41:27.840
he said, you're not children of God. The devil is your daddy. You're children of the devil
0.67
00:41:32.740
because children always bear a striking resemblance to their fathers. You look just
0.99
00:41:36.740
like the devil. He was a murderer. He's a liar. And here you are, you're liars and you're trying
1.00
00:41:40.280
to murder me. So you are the spawn of Satan, literally. In words of Jesus, John chapter eight,
1.00
00:41:45.480
Jesus is my favorite preacher. He gets it. So we're not all children of God. We always say,
00:41:51.000
we're all God's children. No, you become a child of God through faith in Christ. If you don't have
00:41:56.140
faith in Jesus, Jesus said, no one knows the father, but the son and those he chooses to
00:42:00.960
reveal him to. If you don't know Jesus, you don't know God. You're Hindu? You don't know God. You're
00:42:07.100
Muslim? You don't know God. If you're a Jew, you don't know God. Does that mean you don't believe
1.00
00:42:12.940
in a separation of church and state? So great question. Theocracy is the idea of that there
00:42:19.980
is a God above the state. And I would say theocracy is inescapable. It's not whether but
00:42:25.080
which. So every state has a reigning orthodoxy, a dogma and a theos, a God. And it's not whether
00:42:34.220
but which. So it's either the Christian God or it's going to be, so it's going to be Christian
0.99
00:42:37.760
nationalism, which I prescribe to, or Hindu nationalism, Muslim nationalism, or the state
00:42:44.480
itself. Well, we don't believe in any God. We're very sophisticated and developed. Great. Then the
00:42:48.980
state becomes God, which is what we've seen for the last three years with COVID and BLM. So that's
00:42:53.620
just state-ism, but it's still a God. And there's always, here's the thing, there's always going to
00:42:57.560
be blasphemy laws. There's things that you can't say. In Germany, if I say that, you know, I think
00:43:02.600
the history has been embellished. I think it was 5,990,000 Jews rather than 6 million, you go to
00:43:09.840
jail, right? So there's an orthodoxy, there is a dogma and you're not allowed to blaspheme.
00:43:14.580
so yeah i know i know exactly what that is um wait so question then so i kind of i've heard
00:43:23.280
this idea before like basically there's a natural order in the world it would go god government men
00:43:29.300
women children essentially um some people think that government should be in that mix some people
00:43:35.560
don't i'm assuming you would say yes i think i think it goes god so i would not say god is is
00:43:41.960
top and then government and then church. And I don't think it works like that. I think there
00:43:47.360
are three human governments, three human governments that God instituted. They're God's
00:43:53.140
idea and they're biblical. And that is the home, the church, and the state. And technically you
00:43:57.820
could say four and say self-government. Self-government would be biblically supported
00:44:01.940
by just the idea of the fruit of the spirit, which is self-control, right? That you can lead
00:44:07.020
yourself in a healthy manner. So you could say four, but for all intents and purposes, let's say
00:44:10.980
three, if we're talking beyond just one person. So family, church, and state, and they're not
00:44:17.240
over one. It's not a hierarchy. Oh, so you don't believe it's a hierarchy?
00:44:21.480
No, it's not a hierarchy. It's an equal plane, like a Venn diagram, and there are instances
00:44:27.180
where there's an overlap in jurisdiction, where the civil government, with its God-given duties
00:44:34.520
and responsibilities, has a vested interest in something going on in the home. For instance,
00:44:38.820
if parents are abusing their children, physically abusing their children, then the state is like,
00:44:44.620
well, this is just the sphere of our family. This is the family government. Well, I'm sorry,
00:44:49.440
but you have lost your privileges and your rights. And so the state might step in. And if
00:44:53.960
that family are members in a local church, the pastors should be stepping in. So there are
00:44:58.200
overlap examples that can be given, but you have three autonomous, so some overlap, but generally
00:45:04.140
three autonomous spheres which are all governments the family government it has a head it has
00:45:11.320
authority the church government it has leaders it has authority and the state government all three
00:45:16.120
not a hierarchy but an equal plane and all under god so back to your question about theocracy
00:45:20.460
what i i am i i hold to theocracy and i want it to be a christian theocracy and so yeah yeah that's
00:45:28.320
it uh-huh so so i your voice went up a little bit does that mean no no no it's no no it's good
00:45:33.620
it's good but uh but as a venn diagram i would i wouldn't have the lines i would just draw three
00:45:37.580
circles that overlap a little bit do you see what i'm saying okay you know what i mean but
00:45:42.120
i don't mean oh i get it the three ones oh like the olympic triangle okay right exactly so but
00:45:49.340
all that being said back real quick the theocracy thing so you asked are you you want the church
00:45:53.740
and state to be connected no that would be an ecclesiocracy so an ecclesiocracy would be the
00:45:59.240
church running the state or the other way around statism where the state runs the church so i
00:46:05.200
believe biblically um i believe in the separation of church and state here's what i don't believe
00:46:11.460
in the separation of christ and state jesus is the head of the church and i believe that jesus
00:46:17.420
is also the head of the state he's king of kings like lord of lords have we ever stopped and asked
00:46:22.800
the question who are these these lords and kings that he's king over and lord over
00:46:26.360
so question would you then not let could other people practice their religion in like this
00:46:34.440
um did you is it a theocracy or yeah it's a theocracy some of these words are new no it's
00:46:40.580
okay yes it is a theocracy so you're saying you have a government that has a that has explicitly
00:46:46.400
acknowledged a god above it and of course in my ideal society that would be the triune god
00:46:53.300
the Christian God. So you would have a Christian nation with a Christian government. I don't want
00:46:58.160
to change the constitution for the record. I would like to see an adoption like Zambia has done
00:47:03.960
recently of a distinctly Christian preamble that doesn't just say God, but actually says the
00:47:10.640
triune God, Christ Jesus. So I'd like to see an adoption of a Christian preamble. I'd like to see
00:47:17.400
that. The first 10 amendments I think are good. I'd like to get back to authorial intent on the
00:47:22.980
first, that it's not polytheism. Oh, we'll have a little bit of Buddhism and Hinduism and Islam
00:47:28.340
and atheism and Talmudic Judaism and Christianity. No, it's multiple denominations of our common
00:47:35.900
Lord. I don't believe that the founders were thinking polytheism. I think they were thinking,
00:47:40.260
let's not be like England was and say that there's a national federal church. And if you're a
00:47:46.900
different denomination while still believing in the triune God, you're going to get thrown in jail
0.69
00:47:53.320
I think that was the idea of the first amendment
00:47:57.220
And then all the amendments after the first 10,
00:48:06.360
it follows the scripture and I think it's beautiful.
00:48:08.300
I think it's one of the best human documents ever made.
00:48:12.700
My problem is that America hasn't followed the constitution
00:48:19.660
so all that being said uh yes i believe in theocracy and i think right now we have uh we
0.87
00:48:24.920
have a theocracy right now we don't have christian nationalism we have tranny nationalism
00:48:29.220
but you're going to have some form of theocracy some god some dogma some orthodoxy and and stemming
0.97
00:48:36.340
from that you're going to have some form of blasphemy laws things you can't say right that
00:48:40.600
it's either going to be god's law or man's law it's going to be the triune god or some secular
00:48:45.480
pagan perverse God. It's going to be one or the other. And I don't want this, this blending of
00:48:50.400
church and state ecclesiocracy, but I do want to recognize that there should never be a separation
00:48:55.580
of Christ and state. So the church and the state, two separate spheres, two separate
00:49:00.960
governments that God established and the family being the third, but above all three of those
00:49:05.980
human governments, the head of the husband and the family is Christ. The head of the president
00:49:10.220
or the king is Christ. And the head of pastors and elders and bishops and deacons in the church
00:49:15.520
is Christ. That's not crazy. England did that. America did that. That's why the West has been
00:49:22.080
so blessed. We weren't blessed because we oppressed slaves. We were blessed because we
00:49:26.360
obeyed Jesus despite slavery. And now that we are abdicating and apostatizing and turning our back
00:49:33.440
on the Christian religion, everything is going to crap. Yeah. Well, and I had that thought,
0.99
00:49:39.180
like who do men submit to if they don't submit to god right it's kind of like then it's then it's
00:49:44.140
what money but then i think that's kind of because what when i started researching like even you said
00:49:48.860
that the tran tranny movement or whatever right it's all like money it's basically just a bunch
00:49:53.680
of autistic kids and they put them on this like tiktok marketing or whatever and they just think
0.92
00:49:59.160
it's the basically they sell that surgery as the answer to all of like you it's women mostly sign
00:50:05.580
up for it and people think it's men but it's actually women um and it's a series of surgeries
00:50:11.080
it's not just a one and done it's like oh we gotta follow up there's an infection and you might go
00:50:15.780
back it's like michael scott with the office snip snap snip snap yeah it's a life yeah yeah it's a
00:50:21.040
lifetime um you're a lifetime patient i've interviewed some of them and like i it's really
00:50:26.320
gross it's terrible it's so sad but it's basically it's gross but it's tragic more than gross it is
00:50:31.020
so sad for those people right well because they were telling me it's mostly autistic women that
0.61
00:50:36.940
sign up so it's yeah so it's like it's exploitive yeah yeah and so they basically sell the like
00:50:43.920
because an autistic woman might not feel like she fits in so or like the things that like autistic
00:50:49.980
women because it's 80 women struggle with they sell that as like the solution um is this surgery
00:50:57.480
we'll solve this we'll solve that we'll solve that when really you know but when I thought
00:51:03.140
about it I was thinking about the doctors that were performing them and I was thinking how
00:51:07.800
really what they're submitting to is money yeah because if they submitted to God they obviously
00:51:13.080
wouldn't do that couldn't do and so it's like the society kind of goes so it almost I kind of
00:51:19.580
understood the lefts I barely ever say this I never understand their point of view but
00:51:25.580
where they have criticisms of capitalism, putting the money at the top of everything.
00:51:31.960
Okay. Chronic capitalism, sure. Yeah. Yeah. I kind of understood it because
00:51:37.620
under capitalism, I guess you could argue that that should be legal because they're adults,
00:51:43.400
they can do it, but that's putting money above God. Yeah, it could be, but not inherently. I
00:51:50.520
don't think that capitalism inherently requires money to be an idol. So remember, you know,
00:51:55.640
scripture says, you know, that money is not the root of evil, but the love of money is the root
00:52:01.380
of all kinds of evil. And all that means is that there are multiple sins that can stem out of,
00:52:07.660
they can derive from greed. Money is not a sin. The love of money, idolatry of money, greed is a
00:52:14.860
sin. So greed, all that's been said in scriptures, that greed is a certain type of sin that can give
00:52:20.380
birth to all other kinds of sin. For instance, you can be greedy and want someone's wealth that
00:52:25.740
causes you to covet, causes you to lie, causes you to steal, causes you to murder. So all these
00:52:32.440
other sins can stem from that root sin of the love, not money itself, but the love of money.
00:52:37.700
So capitalism, I do not believe inherently that it necessitates greed or that it necessitates
00:52:43.920
idolatry. I think that capitalism unchecked absolutely can cause problems. And we've seen
00:52:51.620
that, but it beats the heck out of socialism, beats the heck out of communism. And here's the
00:52:56.820
thing, socialism and communism, money is still God. So don't be deceived. Money is still God.
00:53:03.340
A poor person, this is something I always teach my congregation. You can be exceedingly poor
00:53:16.840
You could be thinking about money, desiring money,
00:53:30.300
And he's seeking to steward them in a godly, moral way
00:53:36.580
And he has a billion dollars and is not a greedy man.
00:53:40.460
it doesn't necessarily he could be but it doesn't necessarily require him to be a greedy man and
00:53:45.980
somebody else can have 10 bucks and be the greediest person on the planet and in socialism
00:53:51.120
everybody has about 10 bucks uh socialism is very effective in one thing making everyone poor
00:53:55.960
equally poor but poor well yeah and even because even what you were saying about
00:54:03.140
because just being in my industry i know a lot of people that got a lot of money young
00:54:07.840
and money can't buy peace of mind right and so like a lot of times people think money will solve
00:54:14.300
their problems but it doesn't give you peace of mind which um i don't know it's interesting to
00:54:20.100
talk to especially older people they seem to have more peace of mind than the younger generation
00:54:24.680
because we're all like addicted to smartphones and stuff yeah i think you're right what do you
00:54:31.120
think um so what is checked capitalism that's basically just when there's a law i can't remember
00:54:37.720
the exact term you said but it's basically like when a law it goes against god's word or whatever
00:54:45.560
then they would just say no basically yeah so in my you know ideal theonomic christian nationalism
00:54:52.180
society that that i you know so that's the last thing is i'm post-millennial that's eschatology
00:54:57.500
eschatology just means your view of the end times i you know most most people are dispensationalists
00:55:03.160
pre-millennial they think in other words they think jesus is going to come back next thursday
00:55:06.520
It's going to be really soon, especially when you have war in the Middle East, which you
00:55:26.840
So Jesus said this, Matthew 16, I will build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail
00:55:33.520
Number one, he doesn't just say, I will sustain my church, or I will see to it that my church
00:55:38.660
survives as the church is on the ropes, you know, and Satan, you know, and hell is wailing on the
00:55:44.480
church, but the church is, you know, barely hanging in there. And then, you know, the, the, the all
00:55:48.980
12 rounds and saved by the bell and Jesus comes in with the rapture and tags the church out and
00:55:53.460
then beats up the devil. Uh, that's not my view. And I don't think that's the biblical view. I
00:55:57.040
think that is a massive misinterpretation for the last, you know, well, that movie has already been
00:56:02.280
made. It's called, uh, left behind. It's been made several times. It's been made with Nicholas
00:56:08.580
cage. It's been made with, you know, so anyways, uh, so that's not my view. My view is that Jesus
00:56:13.200
says, not just, I will sustain my church and see to it that survives. I will build, it will grow.
00:56:18.400
It will advance. It will increase Isaiah of the increase of his government. There shall be no end,
00:56:23.620
not just in the life to come, not just in a heavenly sense, but I believe this is what a
00:56:28.460
post-millennial beliefs. I believe that Christ is emerging and will emerge victorious throughout
00:56:36.940
human history, not just saved by the bell at the very end, but throughout human history,
00:56:41.820
gradually and incrementally, progressively throughout human history through his body,
00:56:47.240
which is the church, his body on earth, the church, his hands and feet. And so the last
00:56:52.860
2000 years, here's the thing with post-millennialism, I think it will happen first because it has
00:56:57.560
happened uh things are not as bad as they were um in the first century for christians not nearly
00:57:04.640
we're not being thrown to lions now maybe that happens again so just like stocks there can be
00:57:09.340
dips and there could be big dips and i think we're in a big dip i think we've been in a dip since the
00:57:14.000
enlightenment to be honest so i think we're in like a yeah multiple century i mean it's it's a
00:57:19.180
heck of a dip so but i think the general trajectory overall for these last 2 000 years is upward it's
00:57:25.640
upward. It's been the Christianization of the world. The West is, there's never been anything
00:57:30.720
like it. There's never been anything like England, nothing like America that we're talking about the
0.93
00:57:35.340
most prosperous and benevolent. Slavery was universal, virtually universal for all of human
00:57:42.900
history. And it still continues in some places and in some forms, but in large part has been abolished
00:57:49.240
by Christians. The woke don't like to admit that, but the Christians are the ones, everybody
0.98
00:57:53.980
adhered to slavery. The Christians are the ones who abolished slavery. And so all these different
0.64
00:57:59.480
things where there's been a remarkable change, right now we're in a big dip because the West
00:58:04.020
has been rejecting God, rejecting our foundation. But all that being said, I am post-millennial.
00:58:08.580
So when I say I'm a Christian nationalist, back to theocracy, theonomy, your question,
0.98
00:58:12.980
these are things that I believe should happen and I actually believe will happen. Now that doesn't
0.97
00:58:17.240
mean it's going to happen in our generation, but this is what I'm working towards for my children
00:58:21.400
and my children's children, I want to see them live in a Christian nation, and I believe that
00:58:26.440
it will happen. Now, it may not be, that nation may not be called the United States of America.
00:58:30.580
My nation could collapse if it continues to rebel against God. Right now, I think we're under God's
00:58:35.320
judgment, but I don't think we're under God's judgment, meaning that the end is right around
00:58:39.620
the corner and that Jesus is going to come back next week. I think we're under God's judgment,
00:58:43.260
and what we've seen for 2,000 years is that nations rise and nations fall. God exalts,
00:58:47.940
so the scripture says, the nation that exalts Yahweh will be exalted. The nation that exalts
0.98
00:58:54.540
Yahweh will be blessed by the Lord. And so I think that over the course of human history,
1.00
00:58:59.000
you see the rise and fall of empires and the rise and fall of nations. And so all that being said,
00:59:04.560
with capitalism or with anything else, yeah, you want God's law. It's not whether but which.
00:59:10.600
You're going to have laws. You're going to have rules. Things are going to be permissible. Other
00:59:14.700
things are going to be, um, off limits and, and, and wrong. And so, yeah, why, why, why wouldn't
00:59:20.220
we go with God's laws? I think God's laws are best. And so you're looking at the old Testament
00:59:24.820
and the new, and you're saying, this is what God has said to his people, Israel. This is not just
00:59:29.500
for Israel, but all, all people in all places. So here's one blue laws, blue laws. That means
00:59:33.780
Sabbath laws, you know, in the United States and in England, there were a lot of things you could
00:59:38.180
not do, at least in the past and even recent past on the Lord's day on the Sabbath. Um, well,
00:59:44.320
how does that affect capitalism? Well, um, one of the reasons why little guys continue to just
0.99
00:59:50.580
get destroyed, small mom and pop businesses is that you, you cannot compete with behemoths,
00:59:56.840
you know, with Leviathans like Amazon, you know, uh, house Bezos, you know, and, uh, house Gates
01:00:02.920
and how, you know, these things. And part of the reason is because they never sleep.
01:00:06.660
They've got all these worker bees and all these different things.
01:00:09.400
It's every second of every minute of every hour of every day.
01:00:15.700
But to say even online that the day of the Lord, the first day of the week, the day that
01:00:20.480
Christ rose from the dead shall be the Christian Sabbath, as we have in our confessions and
01:00:26.980
This is what Christianity has held and the West held.
01:00:30.040
And they didn't just do it privately in churches.
01:00:34.380
you will not buy and sell on the Lord's day. Now that doesn't mean mandated church attendance.
01:00:40.600
Doesn't mean that if you don't go to church, you go to the gallows, but it does mean the
01:00:44.260
marketplace is closed. And if somebody in the marketplace chooses to buy and sell,
01:00:49.100
that there will be some kind of penalty. There will be a fine or something like that.
01:00:52.420
You're going to close the marketplace. Now, one of the things that happens practically,
01:00:55.520
you do that because you want to honor the Lord, but in honoring the Lord, his laws aren't just
01:01:00.500
morally right, but they're beneficial and good. So the things that God says, Hey, this is the
01:01:04.580
right way to live. It's also not just bringing him glory, but good for people. And one of the,
01:01:09.200
the, the implications of a law like that is that these Leviathan behemoth, you know,
01:01:14.900
institutions and companies would, it would level the playing field for the mom and pop that one
01:01:20.860
day a week, everybody's got to stop business. And it would give more of a fighting chance
0.92
01:01:27.260
to the smaller business trying to grow so that's just one example of you know god's law and how it
01:01:32.700
would work in you know the realm of capitalism which is what you ask how do you you you mentioned
01:01:37.100
earlier in the interview that you're like hopeful for the future yeah um i'm quite i'm curious why
01:01:42.640
because when i look at this numbers um like i look at the birthright yep the um general trend
01:01:53.400
of society to the left the amount of people that like practice religion like all of the stats that
01:01:58.200
i i would even like crime is going through the roof now um yeah i i don't see much to be like
01:02:04.920
wow it's gonna i guess maybe it can't get that much worse you know but it can't no
01:02:11.440
but at least in my in my lifetime i've really only seen things get worse like it's really weird
01:02:18.780
um because i'm 27 so when i was younger like even just the quality of like i see more homeless
01:02:26.340
people everywhere i see more crime everywhere um i'm from a family of 10 you don't really see that
01:02:31.960
anymore um so what makes you like hopeful for the future great question yeah so i i absolutely think
01:02:39.300
things can get worse um but i think that the overarching trajectory will be better so um that
01:02:45.700
throws people off, you know, they'd be like, are you just naive? Do you have your head in the sand?
01:02:48.900
Did you take the blue pill? You know? And it's like, no, no, I took the red pill. But by the
01:02:52.880
grace of God and through the scripture and the Christian faith, I followed the red pill with the
01:02:56.860
white pill. And that would be probably one of my strongest encouragements to you and to a ton of
01:03:03.860
people who listen to podcasts like yours and mine in the red pill kind of world is we don't need to
01:03:11.020
be like Theoden, right? The ruler of the Rohinians, you know, and the Lord of the Rings, you know,
01:03:15.760
the two towers. And, you know, he's like completely overcome by Saruman, the wizard,
0.52
01:03:22.740
and he's just like lifeless. There's no blood in his veins. He's a corpse just barely sitting there,
01:03:27.780
you know, and behind the scenes, you've got Saruman, the wicked wizard, pulling the strings
01:03:32.260
and making him say this and making him say that. And then finally, he like comes back to his senses,
0.79
01:03:36.640
uh you know uh Gandalf you know frees him from the spell he comes back to his senses
01:03:41.440
but then he's he's he's red-pilled but he black pills you know and it's just like there's no hope
01:03:46.480
everything is lost um and then you know Aragorn uh he you know is encouraging him saying no no no
01:03:52.200
and and then finally you know that the big white pill is uh okay so maybe we all die um but you
01:03:57.840
know uh if we do the horn and you know and Rohan will sound once more we will ride out to meet them
01:04:05.080
we're going to go down fighting. Like we're going to, we're going to go to war. We're going
01:04:08.540
to give it everything we got. And then Gandalf, you know, comes over in the last minute, you know,
01:04:12.180
the mountain shining light, you know, and reinforcements and they win. They actually
01:04:16.880
win against all odds. So first things can get worse, but in the big picture, I believe things
01:04:21.880
are getting, so I think things are going to get worse. I think they're probably, if I had to
01:04:25.040
guess, going to get significantly worse. I'm not excited about that because I have kids and I'm
01:04:29.520
deeply, as a father, deeply concerned for my children and they may have to move. You know,
01:04:34.840
And so already I'm doing my best to store up wealth.
01:04:38.360
The Proverbs say a wise man leaves an inheritance for his children's children.
01:04:43.100
So a good Christian man seeks to plan for the financial well-being of at least two generations
01:04:55.660
Maybe Elon can get them to Mars, you know, or maybe they go to Zambia for a little while.
01:05:03.560
but my point is things could get worse i would move there they seceded amen uh so things might
01:05:09.200
get worse and in the short run and when i say the short run i don't mean two months i mean it could
01:05:13.780
be it could be you know it could be 70 years you know but in the long run here's what i believe
01:05:19.540
from the scripture i will build my church jesus says that matthew 16 and the gates of hell will
01:05:25.240
not prevail against it so one he's not just sustaining the church he's it's growing secondly
01:05:29.680
this is the other part I didn't get to, the gates of hell will not prevail against it.
01:05:33.500
The gates of hell are not offensive weaponry. It's not artillery. The gates of hell are the
01:05:38.920
defensive measures, not of the church, but of hell. Hell's on the defense. Hell is on the ropes
01:05:44.120
and Jesus Christ, head of the church, is using his church on earth as his battering ram and he is
01:05:49.880
going to knock down the gates of hell and it's not going to win. So worst case scenario, this is how
01:05:54.940
I see it. Worst case scenario, the West completely falls in good riddance. We deserve it under God's
01:06:00.260
judgment because we have completely rebelled against God. The West falls, but the whole world
01:06:06.060
won't. Uganda and Zambia and these places that right now in our hubris and our pride, we laugh
1.00
01:06:12.780
at. We say, oh, that's so dumb. These primitive third world, whatever. But the developing world
1.00
01:06:19.380
that is adopting Christian preambles to their constitution, that is saying, yeah, we're not
01:06:24.700
going to stand for perversion and that is actually having Christian laws and these kinds of, and we
0.92
01:06:28.980
say, oh my gosh, it's so archaic and it's so extreme and I can't believe it and blah, blah,
0.57
01:06:32.720
blah. We're going to continue to be under God's judgment as we continue to be proud and perverse
01:06:38.140
and rebellious. And God will do what he has done for 2000. It's not new. Ecclesiastes says there's
01:06:44.660
nothing new under the sun. What's been done before will be done again. We think it's new because
01:06:48.800
every generation thinks that their generation's unique and new. Sure. The internet is new. I'll
01:06:53.440
give you that social media is new but with the reformation what happened with catholicism you
01:06:57.880
know and lutheran all it's because god tends to do this he teams up uh profound reformation
01:07:03.920
in culture with innovation in technology so the gutenberg printing press was radical like the
01:07:11.640
internet for its time and so the gutenberg printing press was at the same time as a little guy named
01:07:16.940
martin luther and the catholic church at the time even if you're catholic now you got to admit that
01:07:21.380
Catholic Church at the time selling indulgences, making people pay money to get their loved ones
01:07:26.340
out of purgatory. It was not a bright and shining moment. You're not supposed to sell forgiveness.
0.97
01:07:31.240
You're not supposed to sell forgiveness. So it was not the brightest moment for
01:07:35.380
Roman Catholicism. And my point is, so here's this guy and he disrupts this ironclad institution
01:07:42.820
that was impenetrable. I mean, they had a monopoly on society, wealth, the truth, everything. But
01:07:49.260
God brings one guy with reformation and in the realm of technology, innovation. And those two
01:07:56.620
things happen simultaneously. I think that what we're experiencing, and it's exactly, it's cool,
01:08:00.660
it's exactly 500 years later, exactly 500 years later from the reformation, I think that we are
01:08:05.920
experiencing another reformation teamed up once again with an innovation. And at first, this is
01:08:13.640
what happens is that things always get messier first so with the dawn of the internet and
01:08:19.200
podcasting and videos and social media well what you get is you get um three million different
01:08:24.420
opinions from the peanut gallery you me and everybody else but eventually this is what you
01:08:30.000
also get you get the crumbling of corrupt institutions that before were undefeated
01:08:39.100
And now Tucker can go with Elon on Twitter, one guy, and mop the floor with Fox.
01:08:47.360
And so my point is, it's going to take time, but the truth is going to come out.
01:08:51.240
And in a worst case scenario, the West will fall.
01:08:54.200
But the rest of the world will look at that and say, what did they do that ended so poorly?
01:09:02.540
I guess what makes me a little bit more pessimistic is I'm in London so I deal with a lot of people that are like from I don't know anyone from Zambia in particular but more of the the countries that are supposedly like more traditional and like they kind of complain about the same problems that we do.
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um so like i know i know in africa zambia that's in africa yeah i know they're um like they have
01:09:35.540
issues with like paternity fraud a lot of them i know their std rates are through the roof i know
01:09:39.860
in asia um their childless women are through the roof um their like birth rates at 0.5 or 0.6 i
01:09:46.780
think in south korea so um well south korea that would make sense go ahead sorry yeah yeah and
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Eastern Europe, I don't know if it's still the case, but I know their abortion rate was pretty
01:09:59.260
high. So it seemed to be like they all have very similar problems to the West. And one thing I
01:10:06.000
learned when I came to England was our problems weren't as unique in the West as I thought.
01:10:11.520
Really, I just see the other countries as like 10, 20 years behind.
01:10:15.820
yeah well agree to disagree you may be right but like south korea for instance i see them as
01:10:25.640
the the asian wing of the west the same as israel is western like it's you know japan is western i
01:10:33.940
i view so when i think of you know uh non-western asian countries i'm i'm not thinking of japan or
01:10:39.800
South Korea. And when I think of Africa, I don't think that that's true of Africa. So certainly
01:10:46.960
they don't have some of the medical technology and advancements that we do in the West. And so
01:10:52.340
there are certain diseases that have not been fully eradicated, although things have massively
01:10:57.900
improved over the recent decades for the whole world, including Africa. But there are obviously
01:11:03.280
a lag when it comes to medical advancement and those kinds of things. But in terms of morality,
01:11:07.840
I don't think that African nations like Zambia or Uganda, I don't think that they're merely 20
01:11:13.840
years lagging behind the West. I think that they are, I know that they are, I've seen videos and
01:11:18.360
I also, there are some faithful ministers like Conrad Mbewe and Vodi Bakum who are in Zambia
01:11:25.300
starting, you know, they've been working on a seminary there and, you know, planting churches
01:11:30.000
and doing really good work. And, you know, and I've spoken with them and Zambia is hopeful.
01:11:35.340
There are problems in Zambia to be sure, but Zambia is hopeful. And they're not just 20 years,
01:11:40.860
you know, they're not your typical Western conservative who is whatever, whatever the
01:11:44.780
libs, whatever victory the libs experienced 20 years ago, we're going to conserve that, you know,
01:11:49.640
no, these, these African nations are, you know, and places in South America as well. They're
01:11:55.140
saying they're laughing at us and that's good. That's encouraging that they're, you know,
01:11:59.180
they're laughing at the west with its uh with sodomy transgenderism abortion oh yeah no
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01:12:06.540
the the trans stuff will never go there that'll never but i just met like with more
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01:12:14.400
the like breakdown of like like women like women are less traditional there's like i'm getting the
01:12:21.080
same because i interview about mostly like relationships like like that sort of stuff
01:12:24.980
okay so it's just we get a lot of people that are from not zambia i will say disclaimer i don't know
01:12:31.440
is it south africa because that would make sense if it was south africa south africa zimbabwe
01:12:39.560
nigeria kenya so it's kind of like i'm finding a lot of like similar trends i'm sure i'm sure
01:12:48.420
you're right i have no reason to discount that i i think you know and i think it's probably because
01:12:52.320
And I think this is what you're saying it because of the West influence, right?
01:12:55.720
So everybody wants to be, you know, Americans are cool, you know, and England is not quite
01:13:00.980
We, we became cooler about, uh, I believe in 1776, but, uh, you know, but all that being
01:13:07.780
said, you know, that, that I think, yeah, that most of the world looks to us as an influence
01:13:12.080
and we're a terrible influence currently, but, um, but I don't, I don't think that that's
01:13:16.720
going to continue to be the trajectory because things, here's just my overarching point.
01:13:20.660
if we pan out, get the 30,000 foot view, right?
01:13:24.200
And you're doing this, you're looking at the world.
01:13:27.700
Don't just look at the whole world instead of one nation,
01:13:38.880
it is incredible what God has done all around the world.
01:13:49.720
we're being stupid right now and making things pretty bad. And sadly, I think we could make it
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even worse. But on the whole, I mean, you're talking about lifespans, almost doubling for
01:14:02.860
the vast majority of the world. You talk about slavery, you talk about war, pirates on the open
01:14:11.160
sea and being able to do free trade. You talk about prosperity and markets. And then of course,
01:14:18.260
for me you know coming from a christian perspective uh the advancement of the christian religion and
01:14:23.760
right now the christian religion is not um is not in it in its prime right now it's not looking
01:14:29.280
great um but overall i mean the math is real simple jesus started with 12 and now we got a
01:14:35.820
couple billion i feel like we're heading the right direction so you think it'll just go down for
01:14:42.080
maybe like 50 years but then the overall trend will be up we're just yeah and and i wouldn't you
01:14:47.400
know i wouldn't put money on the 50 years um it could be it could go down for 250 years or it
01:14:53.300
could go down for five years and we could have a great revival but that's that's what we've seen
01:14:57.300
throughout human history uh in the west and in other places i mean i'm an american a christian
01:15:03.080
reformed american a calvinist you know and i so i think of the great awakenings and george
01:15:07.960
whitfield and going up and down the coast and thousands and thousands of people coming to
01:15:13.240
Christ. I think of the Puritans and the Covenanters. I think of New Hampshire and they had covenants
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01:15:19.880
with the triune God. This is before 1776 and individual colonies. I think it was 10 out of
01:15:26.640
the 13 colonies expressly called themselves Christian colonies and had a covenant with the
01:15:31.360
triune God. Christian laws on the books. We're not talking about the hypothetical of something
01:15:37.760
maybe one day happening. We're talking about the possibility of what has already happened
01:15:42.780
in history happening again. And, and, and the whole idea of things getting worse and worse and
01:15:47.340
worse, um, I feel like only strengthens my point because I think one of the ways that people repent
01:15:51.980
is by having to, uh, to take their own medicine by having to lie in the bed that they've been
01:15:57.720
making for themselves. Like one of the most compelling things. So the prodigal son, very
01:16:01.860
famous parable that Jesus told, you know, beautiful. And, and so he's, it says he's
01:16:07.040
off in a distant land and a famine hits, right? So he's, he's rebelled against his father. He's
01:16:11.860
going. He spends all his money on loose living. So it turns out, it's not just that girls can be
01:16:19.340
licentious, but here's a dude being licentious as well. And he spends all of his money. And then
01:16:24.280
he's in a distant land, a famine hits, it's hard times. He's got nothing left. He hires himself
01:16:29.820
out to be a servant of a farmer to feed pigs. And you know things are bad when it says he's
01:16:35.960
looking at the pods, the pig food, and says, that looks pretty good. So he's at the end of
01:16:42.620
his rope, bottom of the barrel. And then it says, in that moment, it says, and no one gave him
01:16:47.700
anything. And then the next words in the text is, and then he came to his senses. And he said to
01:16:54.720
himself, the servants in my father's house have it better than I. I should repent. I should go
01:17:00.300
back. And so my point is the worst thing I think that could have happened for this young, stupid
1.00
01:17:04.020
man in that moment is if a member of the father's house in the name of empathy, unbridled empathy,
1.00
01:17:10.600
had gone to find this young prodigal son and give him a handout. The thing that got him to repent
01:17:17.600
and go back to the father and apologize and express was the consequence. And the West,
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01:17:23.040
I think that we're just getting started with the consequence. And I think as we experience
01:17:28.240
the consequence more and more and more, as the chickens come home to roost for transgenderism,
1.00
01:17:33.280
I mean, you're talking about people, we've barely begun to scratch the surface of, you're talking about tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people who in the next couple of decades, 10, 20 years, they're going to be furious.
1.00
01:17:49.980
We haven't even seen the consequences of COVID yet.
01:17:52.560
We haven't seen the consequences of the vaccine yet.
01:17:55.280
yeah we haven't like there's so many things that are going to be coming back to roost and people
01:18:00.440
are going to be like oh my goodness what did we do i did a poll on twitter asking how many people
01:18:07.080
if you personally knew someone that died of covid or like not of covid of um the vaccine
01:18:12.920
and 40 of people and i think this got over like 10 000 votes so it was like a decent
01:18:18.580
yeah yeah 40 of people know someone that died from the vaccine so it kind of tells you i mean
01:18:24.900
that they think it's not like a scientific right but still that's yeah that's something so whether
01:18:30.220
it's indoctrination of children uh in state schools whether it's abortion uh which i believe
01:18:35.240
is the murder of children in the womb whether it's transgenderism whether it's you know lgbt
01:18:39.680
lmnop you know the rainbow jihad whatever it is in all those ways uh through covid through
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01:18:46.660
medical tyranny through state tyranny through uh lies of legacy media that are already crumbling
01:18:52.420
around us. In every single way, every major institution in the West, the state, the media,
01:18:58.340
medical, the family, sadly, the church, the church, sadly, is no exception. Every single one of them
01:19:04.520
has chopped off the limb that they were sitting on. They've completely discredited themselves,
01:19:09.760
proven their corruption, and the proof keeps coming. The receipts keep coming,
01:19:13.100
and we're going to get bigger receipts. It's not going to tail off. It's going to snowball and
01:19:16.780
speed up. And as that happens and people experience the consequences of polarization,
01:19:21.400
potential civil war potential world war three right now with all these different things um
01:19:27.660
yeah the the verdict is still out but it is it is coming in and and i think that the
01:19:33.640
overarching verdict when it's all said and done is going to be this um you rebel against god
01:19:40.040
you find out so what would be your prescription if you got if you were in charge tomorrow what
01:19:47.740
would you do? National repentance. I believe that, uh, nations, particularly in the West,
01:19:53.680
um, I, yeah, if I was in charge, if I was, you know, president, you know, uh, one of my friends,
01:20:01.080
I could see you running. You kind of have that like way about you. Have you ever thought about
01:20:05.120
running for president? No, I don't know. Just like for some political office. I can see it actually.
01:20:11.460
That would be cool. Maybe I don't know. That's something to pray about considered. Thank you.
01:20:14.380
that's encouraging. Um, but yeah, if I was president for, you know, and what a glorious
01:20:18.220
three days that would be a friend of mine, Doug Wilson always makes that joke. You know, it would
01:20:22.280
only, only last probably for three days. And then I would be, um, probably, you know, banished or
01:20:26.560
exiled or assassinated or something. Um, but in, in that, you know, uh, you know, whatever, uh,
01:20:32.780
hypothetical situation, I would call the whole nation, like it would be a national, um, a national
01:20:37.820
repentance. So we would, we would, you know, we would come now in our current system, there would
01:20:41.760
be difficulty. Here's another thing. This doesn't go over well, but I'm not the biggest fan of
01:20:47.340
democracy. I like a constitutional republic, a representative republic. That's back to the
01:20:52.980
19th Amendment. It's not just, oh, I don't think women should vote because they're not geared that
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01:20:56.380
way. It's also because I believe in representative government. Right now in my county and in my
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01:21:00.660
state and my nation, there's a ton of people who are representing me, whether I like it or not.
01:21:05.980
That's representative government. That's the way things work. So it wasn't that women didn't have
01:21:10.780
a vote. Women always had a vote by virtue of their husband or their fathers as a wife or a daughter
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01:21:16.400
through the household vote. One of the things the 19th Amendment did was it split the household.
1.00
01:21:21.340
It turned the household against itself, going from the molecular model, the household being
01:21:27.780
the smallest building block of society to individuals. And so all that being said,
01:21:32.920
if I was in charge and it was a monarchy and I was king for a day, not just president,
01:21:38.400
I would say we need to fast and pray like the king of Nineveh when he heard the preaching
01:21:43.120
of Jonah that judgment was upon the city of Nineveh.
01:21:55.660
We're going to get Congress or whoever, Parliament, you know, whatever the body, we're going to
01:21:59.980
We're going to write up a Christian preamble in it.
01:22:02.520
we're going to declare allegiance to the triune God, to Jesus as King of all kings, King of me
01:22:08.780
and King of this nation. We are going to make God's law. The Bible will be the law of the land.
01:22:15.000
It's going to be, it's not simple. It's complicated through courts and the judicial system. It's going
01:22:19.840
to have to be prudently applied. So for instance, you must have one Old Testament law. You have to
01:22:26.440
have a parapet, right? It's a border. It's a balcony. Like if you have a balcony, you got to
01:22:33.780
have railing on your roof for Old Testament Israel. But why? Well, in their culture, people slept on
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01:22:39.180
top of the roof. They don't have HVAC, AC. During the summer months, they would sleep on top of the
01:22:43.760
roof because it would be cool and there'd be a breeze. Now here's the way they enforce it. They
01:22:48.360
didn't have police going around and writing fines if you didn't have this border around your roof.
01:22:53.140
instead what would happen is it was punitive not preventative right not like a minority report with
01:22:59.960
tom cruise where you try to see the future who's going to commit a crime and you over police
01:23:04.060
everything like australia new zealand uh no it's it's punitive the way that you get justice is that
01:23:09.500
when injustice is done the penalty is swift and severe swift and severe so if you don't have a
01:23:16.500
border around your roof you don't get penalized but if somebody rolls off your roof and and dies
01:23:21.860
it's proportional, it's swift, it's just, it's eye for eye, tooth for tooth, life for life.
01:23:28.440
They fall off and they die, you get the death penalty. And publicly, you're going to be stoned
01:23:33.980
and put to death. And even stoning, it wasn't for the sake of being brutal. It wasn't brutality.
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01:23:38.940
The point of stoning was to say that you have sinned against all society. And so all society
01:23:43.840
will have a hand in justly punishing you. All society. And one of the things that Old Testament
01:23:49.300
scripture, another law was you shall not pity the rich, show favoritism to the rich, nor shall you
01:23:55.000
pity the poor. Justice is blind, right? If you have to figure out what color the cop is and the
01:24:00.940
alleged perpetrator before you can decide what's just, you're not doing justice, right? If it's not
01:24:06.040
proportional, this person commits murder and they get a slap on the wrist, it's not justice. If it's
01:24:11.020
delayed and happens 20 years later, it's not just, it's swift, unbiased, proportional, all these
01:24:17.360
things, and it's reactive, punitive, not preventative, where you have this massive police
01:24:21.860
force, which means less taxes, because the police force costs a lot of money to employ.
01:24:26.320
But the punitive, a gallow is cheap. So all those things being said, my point is,
01:24:30.740
back to the roof border thing, you take that biblical case law, you apply it in 2023 in
01:24:35.980
America or England, what does that mean? You have to have a board around your roof? No.
01:24:40.280
But what it means is you must esteem life. It stems from the sixth commandment,
01:24:44.960
thou shalt not murder. So it might look like speed limits on a highway. It might look like
01:24:48.840
seatbelts. It might look like this. It might look like that. And then how do you enforce it?
01:24:53.000
Well, like the Autobahn, right? You don't have all these regulations, but what you do is if someone
01:25:00.140
does cause harm to someone else and they were going above the suggested, it would be suggested
01:25:06.140
speed limit, and it's proven they were going above the suggested speed limit. You don't have a million
01:25:10.540
cops going around giving speeding tickets, but if they get in a wreck going above the suggested
01:25:15.540
speeding limit, so it was their fault and they kill someone and they survive themselves to the
01:25:21.260
gallop. And it's public. It's on the county courthouse. The whole society has a vested
01:25:26.940
interest, not because we're morbid, not because we're sadistic, but because justice belongs to
01:25:31.240
the community and we all need to be committed to carrying it out. So all that kind of stuff,
01:25:35.760
the Bible would be the law of the land through judicial system, using prudence and strategy
01:25:40.960
and wisdom of how to actually apply that in our time, our place, our technology, our cultures,
01:25:45.860
but still the general equity, the general transcendent principles of biblical law,
01:25:50.980
three days of fasting and prayer, adopting a Christian preamble, and I'd be fired by the
01:25:56.660
end of the week, but it'd be great. What do you do over at Right Response Ministries?
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01:26:02.440
podcast so i you know my my day job is i'm a local pastor so i pastor covenant bible church
01:26:08.160
um in central texas you know north of austin and then beyond that you know and everything that i do
01:26:13.420
as a husband and a father um right response ministries i'm trying to because i i feel called
01:26:19.600
and maybe not we'll see what god does but so far he's blessed it uh but i feel called to be on just
01:26:25.000
my local church my local church is my priority but i think the church kind of sucks right now
01:26:30.220
and so i'm you know i'm trying to help out and so i instead of just preaching sermons in my church
01:26:35.660
i'm hosting you know weekly podcasts and like yourself you know i have guests come on guys
01:26:40.720
that i think are also doing a similar similar you know good job and and actually have a spine
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01:26:46.080
you know actually have you know some courage and are willing to you know say yeah feminism is
1.00
01:26:51.660
demonic and it's it's bad you know and let's call it what it is you know or this or that and
01:26:56.240
And so doing that, doing podcasts, getting my sermons beyond just the local church, trying
01:27:01.700
to write a book from time to time, and holding a conference.
01:27:06.820
So I got a conference coming up in March that's this exact, what we're talking about.
01:27:12.820
It's Christian nations and gotten a lot of pushback.
01:27:16.040
A lot of people are saying, Christians, of course, it's always Christians saying, this
01:27:21.360
Jesus said, my kingdom is not of this world, which is so silly.
01:27:25.280
Jesus did not say his kingdom was not in the world, but not of the world.
01:27:28.780
What he's saying is that the power and authority for his kingdom is derived from another source.
01:27:33.580
It is a heavenly power greater than the world, but he's not saying that he doesn't care about
01:27:37.860
his kingdom being in the world, which is precisely why when Jesus taught us to pray, he said,
01:27:42.020
pray thy kingdom come to this world. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth,
01:27:48.080
not just in the 17th dimension, but on earth as it is in heaven.
01:27:51.040
So these are basic things that Christians understood. Christians understood the civil realm until, again, very recently, really since World War II. The post-war consensus has been terrible.
01:28:02.780
Wait, why is the conference considered worldly? Like they don't like conferences or just not?
01:28:07.300
Because we're saying that politics matter. We're saying that culture matters. We're saying that markets matter, that starting bids. The whole idea, so the conference, the title is Blueprints for Christendom 2.0.
01:28:19.980
So most Christians today, especially in the Protestant realm, they're pietist, meaning everything, the only thing of any value or worth at all is the spiritual, the unseen, right? So it's all inward. It's a privatized lordship of Jesus. Instead of Jesus being Lord of Lords and King of Kings, Lord of all, Jesus is Lord of my cute, precious, private, emphasis on private, heart.
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01:28:46.000
Jesus is Lord of my heart instead of, no, Jesus is Lord of all.
01:28:50.260
And so we're talking about the Lordship of Christ over every aspect of life, not just
01:28:55.260
our private heart and not just our private family with our marriage and our parenting.
01:28:59.720
You know, Christians will do, here's a parenting conference.
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01:29:02.800
Hey, our 17th parenting conference is coming up.
01:29:08.820
You snap a picture of your coffee mug and your Bible and post it on Instagram.
01:29:12.600
So Jesus' lordship is in my 15-minute private quiet time in the morning, and it's maybe
01:29:33.580
So blueprints for Christendom 2.0, not Christianity 2.0.
0.78
01:29:37.720
It's the same faith once and for all passed down to the saints, the Christian faith,
01:29:41.500
the historic creedal christian faith christendom 2.0 so think constantine king alfred uh we're
01:29:49.020
saying you know christendom we've been lied to the crusades so here's one uh god's battalions
01:29:54.180
it's the name of a book by rodney stark he gives a history of the crusades turns out like most
01:29:59.400
things uh we've been lied to about the history that doesn't mean it's all perfect um but there
01:30:05.260
was actually some really good reasons for the christians and their side and their battle in
01:30:09.720
crusades against the muslims at every level i've heard that though i haven't studied it myself but
0.99
01:30:15.980
i've heard that it's like they always rewrite history the way they want the victors get to
01:30:21.700
rewrite history we just need to know what time it is right now the victors are the the pagans
01:30:25.780
the godless pagans leftist socialist communist globalist uh they're the victors and the victors
01:30:34.040
get to indoctrinate the society uh they're the ones who get to rewrite history and that's what
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01:30:39.300
we've seen um and so so we just need to be asking questions we need to go back and think what what
01:30:45.080
did what did our ancestors that the overarching thing that that's trying to be done right now
01:30:49.220
the play is uh to try to get young western civilization uh to hate its heritage to say
01:30:57.740
that our heritage was just a bunch of slave owners and you know uh the spanish crusades and
01:31:04.260
colonizers. I've gotten that one before. Right. But it's like, okay, so Great Britain colonizes
0.90
01:31:10.960
India. And again, everybody's a sinner. So none of it is perfect. But it's like, I'm sorry. So
1.00
01:31:17.900
we're going to go into India and say- Oh, I've been told I'm the colonizer, I guess.
01:31:21.860
Yeah. But think about that. You go into India and you say, I'm sorry, you can't bury your wife
01:31:27.320
alive with a husband when he dies. Sorry to colonize you. Sorry. Is that an inconvenience?
1.00
01:31:33.440
or you come to the americas and you say okay guys there's a few things that we need to change
01:31:37.980
uh number one let's stop eating each other sorry sorry to be an oppressor yeah you know um
01:31:44.300
yeah yeah exactly all that becomes the footnote of history aztec right didn't they like sacrifice
0.76
01:31:50.720
aztec mayans caronkua indians where i'm i'm at in texas they were cannibals not like i ever i mean
01:31:57.560
it was terrible well and most of them died because of disease anyway right that's right uh it wasn't
0.75
01:32:03.420
even close to gunfire, but disease. And even with a gunfire, there were, again, problems on both
01:32:09.020
sides. So anyways, all that being said, the point is this, Christendom, so not Christianity 2.0,
01:32:15.100
the one Christian faith, Orthodox Christian faith, but Christendom is the idea of Christianity in
01:32:22.480
its outward expression in every realm of society. That's Christendom. And so what we're saying is
01:32:27.820
Christendom was not a bad idea. There were problems, but we shouldn't throw the baby out
01:32:35.000
with the bathwater. There are features and there are bugs. And so what we're saying is blueprints,
01:32:39.600
the title of the conference, Blueprints for Christendom 2.0, is we're saying we want to
01:32:43.400
get back to Christendom, all of Christ for all of life. It will either have Christ or chaos.
01:32:48.020
We want Christianity to be public in the public realm, nationally, politically, culturally,
0.75
01:32:54.080
everything. But we'd like it to be Christendom 2.0, meaning all the features of Christendom 1.0.
01:33:00.640
But yeah, I think we can do better. Let's try to get rid of some of the bugs. So the things that
01:33:06.460
actually were, not just blatant lies and slander and revisionist history, but things that actually
01:33:11.060
were a problem, whether it be King Alfred or whether it be Constantine or whether it be the
01:33:15.780
Crusades or whether it be this or whether it be that, the things that really objectively were
01:33:19.940
problems, here's the question implicitly that's begged, why were they problems? By what standard?
01:33:25.860
Were they problems because God's word would say that they were immoral or because we just say
01:33:30.260
they're immoral? And if they're actually problems, objective problems, not by our fluctuating moral
01:33:35.880
standard, but by God's immutable standard, then guess what? We need to Christian nationalism even
0.98
01:33:40.940
harder, not less, right? If we did, so if slavery was so bad, by whose standard was it bad? And if
0.59
01:33:47.780
it's bad objectively universally bad uh then it's only bad because of god's standard which means we
01:33:53.600
need more god not less right it's simple what's your what's your book about is that what your
01:33:59.600
book's about well the book is why i left california so the book is saying um i think that one of the
01:34:04.520
are you're californian no i was born and raised in texas but i moved there for 10 years and planted
01:34:09.140
a church oh okay so and then i came back for a host of reasons and it's a long conversation but
01:34:16.280
But basically, the book is just saying, I think one of the ways that we win, instead
01:34:19.340
of the fight or flight reflex, I'm saying advocating for a third strategy of fight by
01:34:24.240
flight, that one of the ways that we can fight against leftists and pagans and God-hating
01:34:29.880
society is places that are really blue, really progressive, really rebellious towards the
01:34:34.940
principles of scripture, vote with your feet, get out of dodge, stop propping it up.
01:34:40.340
I think one of the reasons that California has, you know, has the illusion of being able to last
01:34:46.300
as long as it has is because the salt of the earth props it up. There's, you know, statistically
01:34:50.820
there, you know, 42 million in California, total population, 16 million are professing Christians.
01:34:58.140
If they left and just said, you know, to Governor Gavin Newsom, that's enough, we're out. California
01:35:03.280
would actually have to, like the prodigal son, I use that as an example, he would have to deal
01:35:07.660
with the consequences of his godless policy and california would crumble and you know in a fortnight
01:35:14.220
and uh yeah and you know and then if it and that's i think that you know so you asked me earlier like
01:35:20.800
how do how am i hopeful and i gave you kind of the global scale of nations but you know as it
01:35:26.200
pertains to you know my country um i think you could have the the minor scale uh with states
01:35:31.820
that like if people continue and that's that's happening that trend doesn't look like it's going
01:35:36.140
away anytime soon. So if people continue to vote with their feet and they're like, yeah, you've
01:35:40.760
lost your minds. We're leaving California. We're leaving New York and we're moving to Texas. And
01:35:44.980
what will happen is economically, culturally, all those things, red states will get redder,
0.78
01:35:50.380
right? And they'll get better. They'll increase with wealth and prosperity and all those kinds
01:35:55.720
of things. And blue states will get worse and worse and worse. And that right there will be
01:36:00.020
used, I think, as an evidence to people saying, okay, so one set of systems works, another one
01:36:06.400
doesn't. Oh, and this one, what a coincidence. This one is more conservative and aligns more
01:36:11.780
with Christian values and that one. So, you know, and whether that we're able to do that in 50
01:36:16.760
years, you know, or even five, you know, 15 years with states at a micro level, or whether that
01:36:22.400
takes 250 years with, you know, all the way things getting so bad that, you know, people are going to
01:36:27.780
the gulags at a national international level but one way or another i think that system um that
01:36:34.460
history will prove who's right and and god's right you want to be on the right side of history
01:36:40.340
believe the bible because history gets revised you know every every 50 60 years so all you have
01:36:46.580
to do is like so right now like people think i'm crazy but all i have to do is say i'm a theonomist
01:36:51.040
i'm a christian nationalist i'm patriarchal um and i'm not trying to be offensive i'm not going
01:36:56.000
out of my way to jab and poke. But this is what I believe. Here's my reasons for believing it.
01:37:00.460
I'm not just trying to be mean, but the Bible says it. I think it lends towards the glory of
01:37:03.840
God and the good of people, including women, including children, including this, including
01:37:07.360
that. And you know what I have to do to prove that I'm right? I need to just sit and wait for
01:37:12.880
about 15 years. That's all. All I have to do is just wait. And the thing is, the stuff they're
01:37:18.240
pushing is very confusing. They'll act like they're pro-women, pro-minority,
01:37:26.000
pro all this stuff but it's very confusing to like grow up in a society that's telling us like
01:37:31.760
men are women women are men like because i'm i'm like the youngest millennial so i like grew up
01:37:38.640
like i feel like when there was like peak woke like was during my teenage years like i i see it
01:37:44.220
kind of like when caitlin jenner got that award you remember you remember like that i remember i
01:37:49.520
remember like being in school and everyone talking about it's very confusing like growing up when
01:37:54.560
it's like even the institutions you go to are telling you the wrong thing right well yeah
01:37:59.840
transgenderism is is really in some sense it could be defined as this it could be defined as uh
01:38:06.020
as the white man's secret weapon to still find himself in power uh you know so it's funny with
01:38:12.700
all the wokeness and like white people and white men are oppressive and all this kind of stuff
0.77
01:38:16.760
but then you throw in transgenderism and then what do you get well at the end of the day you
01:38:21.360
get a white male winning woman of the year award. Or you get a white guy who's more oppressed now
01:38:29.800
than this minority person. At the end of the day, transgenderism carved out a vehicle for
0.98
01:38:36.020
the white man to still find his way on top. And so it's a bit ironic.
0.91
01:38:44.440
They can go to Right Response Ministries on YouTube. That's where most people follow us.
01:38:48.440
We don't have 2 million subscribers, Pearl, but I'd like to think we're on our way.
01:38:53.300
We've got about 75,000, so they can go to YouTube.
01:39:03.140
Where is your, can I go to your church next time I'm in Texas?
01:39:07.580
And the nice thing about you visiting our church is I can expect that you'll dress modestly.
01:39:19.380
I was like, surely, you know, surely she cares about modesty.
01:39:22.580
So, but no, I would love for you to come and attend our church.
01:39:28.160
Yeah, well, and I'm not even, okay, the modesty thing, I'll tell you.
01:39:31.680
Because sometimes I'm like, even, I'm not even, I was an athlete.
01:39:38.060
But I'm like, look, there's sometimes where we look so stupid as women and nobody tells us.
0.99
01:39:43.240
and i'm like well we'll have these like wives and mothers dressed half naked i'm like this
0.98
01:39:49.120
just looks no look i'm not even saying it's okay for the younger women it's not but i'm like it
0.96
01:39:54.760
just looks especially stupid when you're over like it's like you're 40 years old lady you've
0.93
01:40:00.300
had like half a century to figure this out no absolutely and the bible talks about that that uh
1.00
01:40:05.180
that a woman who's beautiful but but doesn't exercise modesty is like a gold ring in the
1.00
01:40:11.720
snout of a pig, right? That it's, that it's, it's, it's like pearls before swine, you know,
1.00
01:40:17.680
or giving what is holy to dogs. But in this case, the actual verbiage that's used applied to
01:40:22.260
modesty is a gold ring. So something of precious worth, but just wasted. And, you know, so, so
01:40:29.120
even if it's a young woman, she should dress modestly. And, and people, you know, the pushback
01:40:34.880
is always like, well, what about the men? And that's the whole problem with our society, in my
01:40:39.340
opinion is that again we we make every exception the rule every exception the norm every footnote
01:40:46.460
the headline here's the deal men should be modest too and there are some men who are going to the
01:40:50.900
gym shirtless and blah blah blah whatever but can we just admit for a second that right now
0.98
01:40:56.420
the big problem in the west is not abusive patriarchy but rampant feminism it is not
1.00
01:41:04.460
immodest men, but immodest women. I think you have to be able to say the standard is transcendent
0.64
01:41:14.460
and it applies across the board, young, old, guy, girl, but you have to be able to say in your time
01:41:22.340
and place, in your moment in history, you have to be able to say, this is a unique problem.
01:41:27.960
right now the unique problem that we have is not a bunch of men being um patriarchal tyrants
01:41:36.300
i i think that that has been a problem at times past now even that i think is revisionist history
01:41:42.220
and wasn't quite as bad as people make it sound but there have been problems like that right now
01:41:46.320
the problem is not that men um have all their wives on leashes you know why don't why don't
01:41:53.520
men have a right to like go out and not be bombarded with women's bodies you know because
0.76
01:41:58.680
there are men that actually want to be faithful and loyal to their wives and and you guys can't
1.00
01:42:04.440
go anywhere without yoga pants booty shorts right and these half naked chicks it's like don't they
1.00
01:42:10.860
have a right to go out in public and not see you like butt naked great point and then what about
1.00
01:42:17.880
children like children need to witness this now this is getting embarrassing yeah for a lot of
0.63
01:42:22.840
families, if you are a Christian family, what it means is it means that you just, these days,
01:42:29.440
you just do a lot less in public. You know, my family and I, we have places that we go and,
01:42:33.680
you know, a lot of what the children do, you know, is we, you know, we have places like there's a
01:42:38.300
farm that we like going to, you know, it's called Sweet Eats Farm and they have a petting zoo and
01:42:42.840
the kids get to ride the horses. And, you know, and our kids, again, they're itty bitty, which is
01:42:47.580
awesome. They're super, super cute. And so we have a blast, but most of it is hanging out with
01:42:53.700
like-minded people that we trust who are part of our church community. So my kids are having a
01:42:57.940
blast like every day of the week. My wife right now is on a play date with the kids, with another
01:43:02.240
woman in the church and they, you know, they're doing fun stuff. They've got like a bounce house
01:43:06.540
inside because it's cold right now and they're jumping off the walls and, you know, Christmas
01:43:10.940
decorations everywhere. Our kid, like, so I don't want to sit here and play the world's smallest
01:43:14.260
violin you know that um you can do it and i think that that's again that's just what i said earlier
01:43:19.360
i want to white pill christians and conservatives but and say okay the red pill you got to take it
01:43:26.020
you can't put your head in the sand things are tough they are tough um but you can do it you
0.99
01:43:32.760
can do it a lot of women are are jezebel they suck um but by the grace of god there are some women
1.00
01:43:41.080
and I know them. I pastor them. There are some women who are the salt of the earth.
1.00
01:43:46.720
They are beautiful inwardly and out. They're modest. They love the Lord. And some of them
0.62
01:43:53.100
are single and they are looking forward to loving a man and submitting to his authority in a godly
01:43:59.400
way. Now, I'm not saying they're a dime a dozen because they're not. They're rare. But you can,
01:44:04.440
you can have that life that your ancestors had, it's much harder to have. I admit that much harder.
01:44:11.560
Economically, it's harder. Legally, it's harder. There's more risk. There's more danger. If a man
01:44:16.240
marries and has children at a legal level, he is immediately at a disadvantage and everything
01:44:21.860
is a risk. His whole life could be ruined. I know the red pill. I'm aware. And all that is true.
01:44:28.480
The red pill movement has correctly assessed the situation, but they have no solution.
01:44:34.240
Getting a vasectomy at 20 and never marrying is not a solution.
01:44:39.100
That is the pathway to literally end the human race.
01:44:44.540
So we need a red pill, but we need a white pill.
01:44:48.260
God, that's just the beauty, again, of the scripture.
01:44:51.600
God gives us the truth of the situation, and oftentimes it's grim, but he also gives us
01:45:21.780
but knowing that we freely have his love by grace
01:45:24.260
and we're obeying him as a response of gratitude
01:45:26.300
and not just privately, but in every realm of life,
01:45:29.380
little by little by little, the world can change.
01:45:32.620
i believe that i have to believe that if that's not true then then it's not just that i'm going
01:45:38.480
to be depressed but if that's not true then then i have no basis for believing the christian faith
01:45:44.200
i mean like what am i doing i'm a pastor you know i guess i i can i don't know i mean i've
01:45:53.340
got 75 000 followers on youtube maybe pearl you could help me find you know some kind of
01:45:57.280
fringe entertainment that i could start doing videos on that instead of the pastor stuff that
01:46:01.740
i've been doing but like what i mean really what am i going to do this is this is my life this is
01:46:05.680
what i believe and it's not just my livelihood you know for practical reasons but i believe this
01:46:10.780
down to the marrow in my bone that jesus is lord that he's changed the world the whole world changed
01:46:18.160
we literally when we do when we do the calendar there is before christ and after like this there's
01:46:27.200
no human being who has ever walked the earth that has changed the world like Jesus. You can love him,
01:46:32.840
hate him, bless him, curse him, but he is God. There's no one like him. He is the Lord of all
01:46:38.320
the earth. He changed the world in 2000 years. I'm living in a grim moment, but I'm fighting
01:46:46.180
for his glory. I'm fighting for my grandchildren and their future. And we might be in a dim moment,
01:46:51.400
But 2,000 years, he's been winning, and the next 2,000 years, he's the victor.
01:47:07.740
Tell them one more time where they can find you.
01:47:09.580
Just search Right Response Ministries on YouTube.
01:47:17.420
um and also let me know who you would want next time on the sit down thank you very much
01:47:23.220
for coming on I will talk to you guys next time