QUESTIONS - Does Theonomy Allow For Other Religions In Society？
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Summary
In this episode, Pastor Joel and I discuss what it means to be a Christian in a post-millennial, patriarchal, patriarchal society, and what it would look like if we re reestablish Christodom.
Transcript
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Mawson says this, in a perfect theonomic society, amen. I like the beginning of this.
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would a mosque be allowed to function in that society or would it be required to worship
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the biblical God alone? Great question. In a perfect theonomic society that will come
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incrementally over time, I'm not an incrementalist when it comes to abortion, just for the record.
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When I say incrementally, I don't mean by putting forward unjust, unbiblical laws that compromise
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the scripture, but incrementally in terms of the mustard seed gradually fills the whole,
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you know, grows into a tree and fills the whole earth. The leaven gradually works through the
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whole batch of dough. So like with abortion, for instance, guys like Jeff Durbin, I would agree
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with him, are incrementalist, not in terms of getting gradually more biblical laws, which
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requires you to, um, at first submit unjust laws. That's can't do that as a Christian. That's,
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that's sinful. Um, but it is incremental in the sense that Roe right now, very likely going to
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be overturned incrementally abolish abortion in all 50 States incrementally being one state at
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a time, just laws always being put forward, but let's, let's do it in Louisiana. Let's do it in
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Texas. Let's do it in Oklahoma. And eventually, um, New York and California will bow the knee
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to Jesus and stop murdering babies. So really, we were talking about Christodom. I think Christodom
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is good. That is my life's mission. And that involves planting churches, involves preaching
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the gospel, baptizing, all these things. But I would say the big headliner is this. I want to
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re-usher in Christodom 2.0. And the same way that we look back on the founding of our nation,
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America, and we say, all right, well, slavery wasn't good. But I think it's important that
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We don't try to rewrite our history and lie like the 1619 project, but rather we say,
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okay, slavery is there, but that's a bug, not a feature.
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And slavery was eventually abolished because the founding of our nation was good and we
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eventually lived up to the ideals in our constitution.
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Likewise, looking at 2000 years of church history, looking at guys like Constantine,
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looking at Christodom, and when it was in effect, or at least partially successful before and
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saying, well, America, you know, had slavery and Christodom had the Spanish Crusades, right? So,
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I would say, well, the Spanish Crusades is like slavery was to America. The Spanish Crusades are
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to Christodom. The Spanish Crusades are not a feature, but a bug. And if Christodom had been
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more successful eventually over time, as they lived more consistently with Christodom and the
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ideals of scripture, they would have stopped doing crusades, okay? So, that being said, I want to
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reestablish Christodom. I want to play my tiny little part, and it's probably going to take a
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very long time, and it's not going to happen as much as I want it to happen in my lifetime, but
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generationally, I, along with other faithful Christians, want to see Christodom reestablished.
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So, I don't think, well, Christodom had the Spanish Crusade, so it's bad. No, I think the solution is
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let's do Christodom 2.0, and let's just do it better. And it's probably going to take us a few
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tries. I think it could be a few thousand years before Jesus returns. And so we may be on Christodom,
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you know, 7.0 by the time that we finally really are getting it right. And that mustard seed is
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grown into a tree that's spreading its wings over the whole earth. And justice is rolling down like
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waters, you know, like Amos says, and the leaven has really, a good leaven has worked through the
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whole batch of dough. So that could take time. So in a perfect theonomic society, that picture
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that I'm painting, Christodom 7.0, whenever we get it right, what will it look like, right?
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Basically, that's what you're asking is, as a post-millennial, theonomic, patriarchal,
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you know, Christendom-loving Christian, Pastor Joel, what do you think societies and nations
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will look like in terms of their laws about expressions of other religions right before
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A perfect theonomic, you know, right before the return of Christ.
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the mosques are gone and again i'm not a universalist that's a heresy so so as a
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post-millennial and as someone who wants to restore christendom and as somebody who is theonomic and
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i would say a general equity theonomy because there are different there's a spectrum of theonomy
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i would say general equity theonomist holding the positions that i do right before the return
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of christ i believe at that time a majority of people living on earth at that time will be saved
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But even then, and that would be the best case scenario, right?
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When things are at their best, right before the return of Christ.
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But even then, it won't be that each and every individual is regenerate.
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But all the nations will be Christianized.
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Not meaning that every individual in every nation is a Christian, but Christianized,
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meaning all the nations will be so drenched and so under the influence of the Christian
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worldview and Christian teaching, Christian influence, that they will have Christian
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laws and a Christian sense of justice, which is actual justice, true biblical justice. And in that
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kind of environment, blasphemy will not be permitted. And the last thing I'll say on this,
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and that's what it would be, worshiping of false gods and false religions would be,
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it would be breaking the first commandment. Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
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it would be a breach of the third commandment. It's vain worship. It's a breach of all these
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different commandments. And many of these false religions also have images and try to make
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their God in the image of man or whatever it might be. So, a breach of the second commandment.
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But the point is this, it's not whether but which, right? You guys have heard me say this
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several times. It's not whether, but which. Every culture has a reigning orthodoxy, a worldview,
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and it's always religious. Secularism is a religion. It's not the absence of religion.
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It's not whether, but which. Secularism is a religion. So, it's not whether we're going to
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have a religious society. It's just which religion will we have. Modernity and secularism and feminism
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and all these, this is religious. The word culture comes from the Latin cultus. It means worship.
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It's not whether we're religious, but which religion will we have.
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And within that worldview, there is a reigning orthodoxy.
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So right now within secularism, we have, which is religious.
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um, we have religious priests and these religious priests are, are, are laying out for us the new
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orthodoxy, right? What, what are you talking about, Joe? I'm talking about the ministry of truth,
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right? I'm talking about this Orwellian crazy madness that we're seeing in the news right now
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that, that Democrats, the Joe Biden administration wants to, to appoint a, a
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inso facto ministry of truth that decides what's misinformation and what's, uh, disinformation
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and what's actually true. And it's going to be headed up by the same people that said Hunter's
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laptop was a conspiracy theory and false fake news. But it wasn't. Spoiler alert, it was true.
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You know, so like that's an orthodoxy. That's a dogma, right? So it's not whether but which.
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Every society, every culture, cultists is worship. You're going to worship someone, just
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who and how. And it's going to be religious and every religion has a worldview and a reigning
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dogma or orthodoxy of what's permissible. And then everything outside of that orthodoxy is
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going to be your blasphemy. Blasphemy. So right now, think about it. In the current religion
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that is predominant in America today, which is not Christianity, I think that is our founding
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religion. So I do believe we're a Christian nation in the sense that I would say we're
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currently a Christian nation in the process of apostatizing and apostatizing in the direction
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of going towards another religion, specifically secularism. So, secularism being this rising
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religion in America, as we're turning our back on the Lord and apostatizing from our original
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founding of being a Christian nation, not saying all the founders were perfect Christians, but
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you get my point, Christianized. As we're embracing the religion, the worship of secularism
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and its new dogma, everything outside of that dogma, outside of that orthodoxy,
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what's been deemed as permissible is blasphemy. So are there blasphemy laws currently in our
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nation with the reigning religion that we have right now of secularism? Are there blasphemy
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laws? Let me ask the question like this. Are there things that you can get canceled for?
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Is there a cancel culture in our religious society in America today? And the answer is,
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of course, yes. It's not whether but which. So, I'm not a free speech absolutist, meaning aka I'm
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not a neocon, you know, squishy Republican libertarian. No, no, no, no. I want law. I'm
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not lawless like the libertarian. I want law. I just, I want God's law. It's either autonomy,
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man's law, or theonomy, God's law. And if it's God's law, it's not who, if we worship, it's who
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we worship and how we worship. So, if we're going to be worshipers, a culture, cultists worship,
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which we are, we have no choice in that, then let's worship God. The God that actually exists,
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let's adopt his worldview, his orthodoxy, and then everything that he says is outside of that
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would be the actual blasphemy law. So, you're going to cancel something and someone, is my
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point. You're going to cancel something and someone. And right now, our nation, who are
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they canceling? Straight, white, evangelical men. So, you're going to cancel someone. It's not if
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we cancel, it's just who we cancel and what we cancel them for, right? So, you're going to cancel
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someone. Yeah, I would like to cancel Islam. Yes. And I'm not saying I want to round up Muslims like
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they do in China and hurt people. But yeah, I would say that in a perfect theonomic society,
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which I think we will have, it's going to take time, but I think we will have that,
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yeah, Islam would be blasphemy. It would be worship of a false god. It would be a breach
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of the commandments and you would not be able to build a mosque in a perfectly theonomic world,
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which I do believe we will have. What the penalties would be for false worship,
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what the penalties would be for those who blaspheme, there's a debate to be had about
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that, but again, I think case law that we find in Israel, and I think a lot of the penalties that
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you find are saying that this is the full extent of the punishment, right? So, if a child is
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disrespectful and rebellious to his parents, you know, case law says in the Mosaic law,
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civil law, that he should be stoned, put to death. Guys like Doug Wilson argue that that's the full
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extent. So, just like we have case law in our system that was built off of the Bible, the Bible
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system of laws. You know, we have certain crimes, things that are deemed as crimes,
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and then you have the maximum penalty that can be inflicted. And so I would look at some of
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these civil laws with Israel saying this is the maximum. So not saying that Israel would have
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been in sin if they didn't put a wayward rebellious son to death, but saying that they could put him
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to death, but they would be in sin if they didn't punish him at all. There'd have to be some kind
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penalty. So there's a minimum penalty, right? This is the minimum fine, the minimum penalty,
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the maximum. And so there would be something along those lines for worship of false gods
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in a perfect theonomic system and society. And so somebody who is a Muslim in their heart
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privately, and it's not witnessable, and they're not a Muslim evangelist, and they're not doing
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these public things, then that would be a sin, but not a crime, right? There's a distinction.
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But if they committed the crime of doing something public, like raising a mosque to a false god
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in a Christian nation, which should be our goal, then yes, there would actually be a
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penalty and there'd be a spectrum, minimum and maximum.
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