The NXR Podcast - July 30, 2022


QUESTIONS - Is Pastor Joel Legalistic？

Topics
law divisions law of God ceremonial law
Hosted by
Joel Webbon Harrison Smith Antonio Griffith Dale Partridge Wewsley Todd Calvin Robinson
Mentioned
Paul Sabbath Gentiles Glenn Ferris David Torah Adam
DAILY TRUTH - The God Of Order SUNDAY SERMON - The Blessings of Obedience (Part 3) ｜ Psalm 19

Episode Stats


Length

19 minutes

Words per minute

209.39

Word count

4,119

Sentence count

276

Harmful content

Toxicity

4

sentences flagged

Hate speech

20

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode, Pastor Ken teaches on the three uses of the Ten Commandments, and how they relate to the law of God. Glenn Ferris and Dr. Ken discuss the role of the law as a mirror, a shield, and a lamp to our feet.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00 Hey guys, real quick, before we get started, I have a small request.
00:00:03 If you've been blessed by our content and you like this show,
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00:00:21 Glenn Ferris, can you explain 1 Corinthians 9, 20 and 21, where Paul states,
00:00:26 we are not under the law. What is Paul stating in these verses? To the Jews, I became a Jew in
00:00:31 order to win Jews. To those under the law, I became as one under the law, though not being myself 0.89
00:00:37 under the law, that I might win those under the law. To those outside of the law, I became as one
00:00:41 outside of the law, not being outside of the law of God, but under the law of Christ, that I might
00:00:46 win those outside the law. All right, leave this up for just a second because I need the scripture
00:00:51 and I want the audience to be able to see the scripture as I seek to execute it. All right,
00:00:55 The first thing that you need to understand, great question, by the way, Glenn Ferris,
00:00:58 fair question, good question, nothing wrong in asking questions. 1.00
00:01:02 I was about to say there's no such thing as a stupid question, but there are stupid questions. 0.99
00:01:05 This is not one. 0.98
00:01:06 Okay, so 1 Corinthians 9, verse 20 through 21, first thing we need to understand is the
00:01:10 divisions of the law, the divisions of the law, right?
00:01:13 So the reformers argued there was three uses of the law, right?
00:01:16 The law, it reveals our need for a savior.
00:01:18 None of the use of the law, there are three within the reformed perspective of understanding
00:01:23 the law of God.
00:01:24 none of these three uses is the law being used to save. The law is not saving. No man will be
00:01:30 saved by works as done unto the law is what the apostle Paul says elsewhere. But the law does
00:01:35 reveal our need for a savior, right? The law of God helps us to recognize and realize that God is
00:01:41 holy, right? Because the law is holy and therefore reflects the holiness of the law giver. And by way
00:01:47 of consequence, as we see God's holiness through his holy law, it reveals to us, it functions as
00:01:52 a mirror and reveals to us our lack of holiness and therefore our need for a savior. So the law
00:01:57 is not a savior, but it does reveal our need for a savior. The law also functions as, so that's
00:02:02 mirror, shows us our need for a savior. It functions as a shield. It has a common grace,
00:02:07 a common grace expression where it holds evil at bay. The law, again, it's powerless to change the
00:02:13 heart. So it doesn't hold evil at bay or mitigate evil at the level of the heart inwardly, but it
00:02:20 does suppress outward manifestations of evil, right? So even for the pagan who's unregenerate, 0.87
00:02:26 who hates God and is bent on doing evil, not just harboring evil in his heart, but doing evil 0.91
00:02:33 actions, he will be less inclined to murder if there are laws in his society against murder and
00:02:40 penalties for murderers, right? So the law has a common grace function, not just for the people
00:02:45 of God, but for all people to restrain outward manifestations of evil. So the law is a mirror,
00:02:50 reveals our need for a savior. It's a shield, restrains outward manifestations of evil.
00:02:54 And lastly, the law is a lamp unto our feet. I'll say it's a compass. It's a guide. It doesn't show
00:03:00 us the way to salvation. It shows us the way from salvation. David says, I delight in your law. It's
00:03:05 a lamp unto my feet, a light unto my path. Path to where? It's not a path to salvation, but it is
00:03:12 a path from salvation. So the law doesn't lead us to salvation. It does reveal our need for salvation,
00:03:18 which leads us to the gospel. But the law does, it shows us which way to go, not to salvation,
00:03:23 but from salvation, right? Because I've been freely saved as a gift by grace alone, through faith
00:03:28 alone, in Christ alone, I now want to love God as a response of gratitude. And if I love God,
00:03:35 what does Jesus say? If you love me, you'll obey me. And so, okay, obey what? The law, the law.
00:03:39 So those are the three uses of the law, but it's also important that we understand the
00:03:43 three divisions of the law.
00:03:44 The three divisions of the law is we take Old Testament law and chop it up, being careful 0.65
00:03:49 in our chopping.
00:03:50 But what we see is this, we see the moral law of God, which is eternal.
00:03:54 We see the ceremonial law that was unique to Israel as the nation state, God's chosen
00:04:00 priesthood, his people under the old covenant before the work of Christ.
00:04:05 And then we see a moral ceremonial and civil law.
00:04:09 And so I'll explain this as quickly as I can.
00:04:12 The moral law of God is the Ten Commandments.
00:04:14 It's the Decalogue.
00:04:16 So moral law, I believe, is synonymous with natural law and divine law.
00:04:22 I talked about this last week a little bit.
00:04:23 So the moral law of God is the Ten Commandments.
00:04:26 Love the Lord your God and love your neighbor as yourself.
00:04:28 The first table of the law of God, the first four of the Ten Commandments,
00:04:31 show us how to love the Lord our God.
00:04:33 Have no order of the gods before me.
00:04:34 Do not make any graven images.
00:04:36 Do not take the Lord's name in vain.
00:04:37 Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy.
00:04:38 That's how we love the Lord our God.
00:04:40 And then the next six of the Ten Commandments, honor your father and mother.
00:04:43 That's commandment number five.
00:04:44 Do not murder.
00:04:45 Do not commit adultery.
00:04:46 Do not steal.
00:04:47 Do not bear a false witness and do not covet.
00:04:50 That shows us how to love our neighbor.
00:04:51 This is the moral law of God and it is eternal, meaning it is without end, but it's also without
00:04:56 beginning, right?
00:04:57 There'll never be a time in heaven where it'll be okay to murder, right?
00:05:00 This is always the law of God and it always was the law of God.
00:05:04 it did not just, the Ten Commandments, the moral law of God, did not just come into play on tablets
00:05:10 of stone at Mount Sinai through Moses, but the law of God was written on tablets of human hearts
00:05:16 even before Moses. So the law of God was written on Adam's heart all the way back in the garden
00:05:21 before sin ever entered the world. The law of God is something that is instinctively known. And we
00:05:26 know this from Romans chapter one and Romans chapter two. Romans chapter one talks about
00:05:31 natural revelation, that by God's creation, he's revealing something about who he is and what he's
00:05:36 done. And that's Romans chapter 1. Romans chapter 2 talks about not just natural revelation, but
00:05:42 natural law, that even the Gentiles who have never received special revelation, meaning an evangelist,
00:05:47 a preacher, or the Torah, or scripture, they never received special revelation, but that the Gentiles
00:05:54 who have received natural revelation, right, they can see the truth about who God is by virtue of
00:05:58 what he has made, back to Romans chapter one, Paul says in Romans chapter two, that the Gentiles
00:06:05 are a law unto themselves, that they, their conscience bear witness against their lawless
00:06:12 deeds. So you can go into a lost tribe in South America, if any more exists that we've never
00:06:18 found, and let's say we discover them tomorrow, you will find that there are certain things that
00:06:23 that are not permissible in their culture, in their tribe, because they're deemed as being
00:06:29 wrong and sinful. And some of these things may be perverse because they're sinners, but many of them
00:06:34 will match, line up with the law of God because the law of God is written on people's hearts.
00:06:38 That's the moral law of the Ten Commandments. The ceremonial law is the priestly sacrificial
00:06:42 system, certain rituals and customs about hand washing and things like this. This has been
00:06:46 fulfilled by Christ. All the law, including the moral law, has been fulfilled by Christ. That's
00:06:50 the only reason we're saved, is because Christ, he didn't just die in our place, substitutionary
00:06:55 atonement. He didn't just die in our place for our sin, but he also lived in our place.
00:06:59 Jesus dying in our place, it removes the penalty of our sin. But Jesus living in our place
00:07:06 imputes to us his righteousness. If Jesus only died in our place, it could make us innocent,
00:07:11 but it wouldn't make us righteous. So Jesus, he didn't just die as our substitute, the Lamb of
00:07:15 God that takes away the sins of the world. Our sin imputed to him and the wrath of God poured
00:07:20 out on him, right? The wages of sin is death. So he received the death penalty of God because he
00:07:26 took our sin. And so he atoned for our sin by, as a substitute dying for us, but also as a
00:07:33 substitute, he lived for us. And in his life, he didn't just avoid sin, but the Bible says he
00:07:37 fulfilled all righteousness. He was perfectly obedient to his heavenly father. And he lived
00:07:42 also as a substitute. He lived in our place. So through faith in Jesus, our sin is imputed to him
00:07:47 and he takes our penalty, but also his righteousness is imputed to us. So we receive his reward,
00:07:54 not just the reward of an innocent person, but the reward of a fully righteous person,
00:07:59 which is amazing. This is double imputation. This is the great exchange. This is the heart
00:08:04 of the gospel. Jesus died in our place. He also lived in our place. So because that is a gospel
00:08:09 truth, we must say that Jesus fulfilled all the law of God, including the moral law. He fulfilled
00:08:14 the ceremonial, the civil, and the moral law of God. Jesus fulfilled it all, but he did not
00:08:19 abrogate it all. Jesus abrogated the ceremonial law. So he fulfilled the ceremonial law, but he
00:08:24 also abrogated this priestly animal sacrificial system, certain customs about hand washings and
00:08:30 cleansing rituals. A woman on her period has to go outside of the camp for seven days. That has
00:08:36 to do with cleansing. That's a part of the ceremonial law that was unique under the old
00:08:40 covenant given to Israel. Jesus not only fulfilled this, but Jesus also abrogated it. He ended it
00:08:46 because he is our forever high priest in the order of Melchizedek. He is also not only the priest,
00:08:52 but he is the sacrifice, the lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world. And he also
00:08:56 is the one who purifies and sanctifies his church by his blood. He makes us clean. So the ceremonial
00:09:01 law is not only fulfilled by Christ as the moral law is, but also abrogated by Christ. It's done
00:09:06 away with. That leaves us the civil law. The civil law, according to the Westminster Confession of
00:09:11 Faith, according to the 1689 Confession of Faith, the civil law is unique to Israel, but the general
00:09:17 equity still remains. What I mean by that is you take all these civil codes, right? You only have
00:09:22 10 commandments with the moral law, but then you have hundreds of civil codes in Israel, right? If
00:09:27 an ox gores somebody, it needs to be put to death, you know, or if it's accustomed to gore, then it
00:09:31 must be hemmed in. It must be kept in with a gate. If its owner isn't diligent to keep the ox in and 0.82
00:09:37 it gets out and it gores someone else, then the owner is actually now liable. He too would be put
00:09:41 to death, not just the ox, right? That's a civil code. That's a civil law, right? Borders on the
00:09:46 perimeter of your houses so people don't fall off. That's a civil code. And so there's a civil law
00:09:52 of Israel, which is a case law system. That is not a one-to-one ratio for us in America as Christians
00:09:58 today. However, the general equity still applies. The general equity would mean that you get to the
00:10:04 heart of each of these civil laws. What is the heart level, which would be one of the 10
00:10:10 commandments, always one of the 10 commandments. The general equity of hundreds of civil laws
00:10:15 is always one of the 10 moral laws. So the ox thing, well, what of the 10 commandments does
00:10:22 that come from? Well, the sixth commandment, thou shall not murder, stated in the positive sense
00:10:25 would be, thou must esteem and cherish and protect the sanctity of human life. And so certain things
00:10:31 that would be a threat and a danger destroy human life made in the image of God must be dealt with,
00:10:37 right? So the civil law of the ox or the civil law of the border along the roof, the general
00:10:43 equity is coming from the sixth commandment. And so we don't hang out on our roofs in our culture
00:10:47 today. So we shouldn't say, oh, well, that was a civil law for Israel. They should all be civil
00:10:53 laws for us in America. Well, no, let's get to the general equity of each of these civil laws,
00:10:58 which takes us right back to the 10 commandments. And then let's apply that in our time, in our
00:11:03 place, given our culture, our technology, all these kinds of things. If people aren't hanging
00:11:07 out on the roofs, then we don't need to have a board around it. If people don't have oxen,
00:11:11 well then, okay, we don't need to deal with that. So back to your question. Here's the point.
00:11:16 The point is when Paul says to the Jews, I became a Jew in order to win Jews to those under the law,
00:11:22 I became as one under the law. Paul is not talking about the 10 commandments.
00:11:28 That's the short answer. He's not talking about the moral law of God. The moral law of God,
00:11:33 according to Paul in Romans chapter two, applies to all people in all places. So there is no one,
00:11:39 there is no one who is not under the law. It's not just for Jews. It's not just for Christians. 0.97
00:11:44 All people in all places in all times are under the 10 commandments because they're written on
00:11:50 people's hearts. And that's precisely what Paul gets at in Romans chapter two. So when he says
00:11:55 to the Jews, I became a Jew in order to win Jews. To those under the law, I became, this is, and to
00:12:01 those under the law being again, Jews. So he's just saying the same thing a second time, but in a
00:12:05 different way. So I became like a Jew to win Jews. In other words, I became under the law so that I 0.95
00:12:11 might win those who are under the law. I behaved as though I'm under the law, even though I'm not,
00:12:16 I'm under grace, though I myself am not under the law, that I might win those under the law. 0.92
00:12:22 Again, speaking of Jews. So what Paul's saying is this. He's not saying, so I pretended that 0.66
00:12:26 the 10 commandments are binding for me, even though they're not. Because Jesus fulfilled the
00:12:30 law. No, no. Jesus fulfilled the moral law of God, the 10 commandments, but he did not abrogate
00:12:36 the 10 commandments. They came into existence before Mount Sinai with Moses, and they have
00:12:43 continued in existence today. The Ten Commandments are repeated in the New Testament, right? In the
00:12:48 New Testament, the Apostle Paul, specifically apostolic authors, after the life and death and
00:12:53 resurrection and ascension of Christ and the pouring out of the Spirit at Pentecost, under the
00:12:57 New Covenant, under the New Testament church, it's still wrong to commit adultery. It's still wrong
00:13:02 to covet. It's still wrong to murder. It's still wrong to steal. The only thing in question would
00:13:07 be the Fourth Commandment about the Sabbath, and I don't have time to go into that, but I think the
00:13:10 Sabbath continues as well. I think that that was not removed by Christ, but Jesus as the Lord of
00:13:15 the Sabbath renewed, did not remove the Sabbath, but renewed the Sabbath from the last day of the
00:13:20 week to the first day of the week by virtue of his resurrection being raised from the dead on
00:13:24 the first day of the week. And even that sets for us a gospel pattern. So instead of working for six
00:13:29 days and being rewarded for our work by a day of rest, rather we rest on the first day of the week
00:13:35 and then we work the next six days following that day of rest, meaning that our work is coming out.
00:13:41 It stems from our rest in Christ, who is our Sabbath rest. So anyways, people can push back
00:13:45 on that. That's fine. But I'm confessional and confessionally reformed. So I'm going to
00:13:50 hold to the Sabbath. But the point is all the 10 commandments with a debate about the Sabbath,
00:13:54 but they're reiterated in the New Testament, in the New Testament. So we know the moral law of
00:13:59 God didn't end. Jesus didn't fulfill it and abrogate it. He fulfilled it. He lived in our
00:14:04 place. That's why we're saved. That's why we have, we're clothed in righteous, the righteous robes
00:14:09 of Christ because he didn't just die in our place. He lived in our place, fulfilling all righteousness.
00:14:13 So he fulfilled the moral law, the 10 commandments, but he did not abrogate the 10 commandments. He
00:14:18 did not do away with them. They are still eternal. So when Paul says, you know, to the Jews, I became
00:14:23 as a Jew in order to win Jews. And what I mean by that is, you know, the Jews are under the law. So
00:14:27 I, you know, pretended to be under the law, under the 10 commandments, the moral law, even though
00:14:31 I'm not actually under the 10 commandments. It would be totally appropriate and totally
00:14:35 permissible for me to murder. I pretended that I was under that law, the sixth commandment,
00:14:41 thou shalt not murder, just in order to have common ground with the Jews in order that I
00:14:45 might win them to Christ. And then verse 21, right? That's a bad way to read it. Verse 21,
00:14:50 continuing that, this facetious hermeneutic, to those outside of the law, right? The Gentiles, 0.99
00:14:56 those who don't have the law of God, you know, I, I, uh, pretended to be, uh, someone who is 0.99
00:15:01 outside of law. So I actually murdered a bunch of people and I was committing adultery, uh, left and
00:15:05 right. And I was coveting everybody's stuff and I was stealing their stuff, you know, and, and
00:15:09 cause, cause, you know, those who are outside of the law, the Gentiles, you know, I wanted to, 1.00
00:15:13 uh, you know, when in Rome, right. Do as the Romans do. And so I wanted to be like the Gentiles. 1.00
00:15:19 And so I lived lawless, um, even though I technically am not outside of the law of God, 0.94
00:15:23 but under the law of Christ, right?
00:15:26 There's a distinction right there.
00:15:27 That's key between the law of God and the law of Christ,
00:15:29 that I might win those outside of the law.
00:15:31 So that doesn't make sense.
00:15:33 It makes sense when you read it like this,
00:15:34 the three divisions of the law,
00:15:36 moral 10 commandments, that's eternal.
00:15:37 That's not what he's talking about.
00:15:39 But there is the ceremonial and civil law,
00:15:42 ceremonial and civil law.
00:15:44 So what Paul is saying is this,
00:15:45 when I'm ministering as an evangelist among the Jews
00:15:49 who still hold to the ceremonial and civil law, 0.92
00:15:52 I do my best to keep to those customs, even though I know that these things have not only
00:15:58 been fulfilled by Christ, but abrogated. But to those who are outside the law, to Gentiles who 1.00
00:16:05 are not Jews and don't have certain rituals about cleansing and hand-washing and not being able to 0.98
00:16:11 eat pork or shellfish, if they serve me lobster, I eat the lobster. Because I know that in reality,
00:16:17 I'm not under that law, speaking of ceremonial law, because that's been not only fulfilled by
00:16:25 Christ, but also abrogated. However, I am still under the moral law, the 10 commandments.
00:16:30 And that's precisely what he says in that parenthetical statement, halfway in between
00:16:34 verse 21, not being outside the law of God, but under the law of Christ. Well, right here,
00:16:40 he's drawing a distinction. He's speaking of the Old Testament ceremonial portions of the law
00:16:44 unique to Israel that had been done away with because of Christ versus the law of Christ.
00:16:53 And if you ask, well, what is the law of Christ? Well, the law of Christ is the greatest and the
00:16:56 greatest and the second greatest commandment, Matthew 22, 37. Let's see if I can do it from
00:17:03 memory. Matthew chapter 22, verse 37, 38, 39, and 40. And he said to him, you shall love the Lord,
00:17:10 your God with all your heart, soul, mind. And this is the greatest commandment. And the second
00:17:16 is like it, that you should love your neighbor as yourself. All the law and the prophets depend
00:17:21 on these two commandments. So where's the law of Christ? Love the Lord your God with all your
00:17:25 heart, soul, mind, and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. And again, what does that
00:17:30 look like? What does it mean? The 10 commandments. The first four dealing with how to love the Lord
00:17:34 your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength. And the next six of the 10 commandments,
00:17:37 the second table of the Decalogue, moral law, how to love your neighbor as yourself. So Paul is
00:17:42 saying, I'm no longer under this Jewish law, but I am still under the law of Christ. And what is
00:17:47 the law of Christ? It's the moral law of God, the Ten Commandments. The Ten Commandments are
00:17:51 eternal. They're always binding for everyone, every place, throughout every time. But the Ten
00:17:59 Commandments are not the only portion of Old Testament law. You have the moral law, Ten
00:18:05 Commandments, but it's helpful to have these dividers, different types of law, three divisions,
00:18:10 not just three uses of the law, but remember this, the three divisions of the law, the moral law,
00:18:15 that's the Ten Commandments, but then also the ceremonial and civil. I think Paul is maybe
00:18:19 talking about the civil a little bit, but primarily I think he's talking about the ceremonial law. 0.58
00:18:24 So when I'm with Jews who still think the ceremonial law is in effect, I'm not quibbling 0.83
00:18:28 about that. We'll get to that eventually because it is important that they recognize that Christ
00:18:32 fulfilled and abrogated the ceremonial law, but I'm not going to bicker about that right off the
00:18:37 bat. First, I just want to preach the gospel to them. And so I'll abide by some of these ceremonial
00:18:41 laws as much as I can in order to win the Jews. But when I'm with the Gentiles, I know that I'm 0.99
00:18:47 not actually under the ceremonial law because Christ is our high priest. He's our sacrifice.
00:18:50 He makes us clean by his blood. And so I'm eating shellfish and lobster, having a good time with the
00:18:56 Gentiles preaching the gospel because I'm never, I'm not really under that law to begin with, 0.98
00:19:02 because Christ has fulfilled and abrogated that law. However, that doesn't mean I'm murdering
00:19:07 because that law actually has been given to the Gentiles. Romans chapter two, their consciences,
00:19:12 that law was written on their heart. Their consciences bear witness of the moral law
00:19:16 of God. All right. So that's how we understand under law, not under law. That's what I think
00:19:21 Paul's talking about. Hope that that's helpful. Thanks so much for listening. But real quick,
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