QUESTIONS - Should Women Be Allowed To Vote？
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Summary
Pastor Joel and Josh debate whether or not women should be allowed to vote in the United States, and why they don't believe it. They also discuss the role of women in society, and the impact of women's suffrage.
Transcript
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Hi, Pastor Joel. I've been listening to you on Biblical Patriarchy,
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and I'm wondering what you think about women having the right to vote.
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Since men lead the home and men should be the governing authorities, then should women have
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part in deciding the direction of society? Thanks, Josh. Appreciate that one. Josh is like,
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I got him. I, you know, now he's going to have to be controversial. Yeah. I've said this before,
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so I don't mind saying it again. No, I don't think women should vote. I think that women's
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suffrage has done more for women's suffering than almost anything else. Women suffer because of
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women's suffrage. And this is, you talk about data and those kinds of things. You can look it up. I
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tweeted it recently. But you can look it up. 2016 election results. Somebody did some kind of,
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they posted a map of the US and all the states and which way they went, blue or red. And the
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electoral vote and what it would have been. And they did it by subtracting all of the male votes.
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What would the outcome have been? You want to guess? Anybody want to guess? Type it in the
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comments real quick. What do you think? You think Hillary would have beaten Donald Trump if men
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couldn't vote, if it was just women's votes? In a landslide. In a landslide. I think there was
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only like three or four states out of 50 that went red if you take men's votes out of it and
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it's only women voting. I think Mississippi was one of them. Uh, Oklahoma, I think was one of
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them. Kansas might've been one of them. That's it. Texas went blue. Uh, yeah, I mean, it was,
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I think it was like, I can't remember exactly. It was like 86. It might've been like 93% of the
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electoral vote. Clinton, Hillary, if only women could vote. Um, and I've got a lot of thoughts
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on this and a lot of them are controversial, but they're truthful. So I'll share them. One is
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Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a sinner. First Timothy chapter two,
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verse nine through 15, right? I do not allow a woman, right? Women must learn quietly and in
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full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, right? And then
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Paul, he hinges the argument, not on some cultural thing in his time and place, but on the created
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order that is timeless before sin ever entered the world. The design and creation of the woman
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herself. Adam was made from the dust of the ground, and so was the woman. Nope. Adam was
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made from the dust of the ground. The woman was made from man and for man, as a helpmate from man
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and for man. Even her origin, her design, her creation is all distinct and for a purpose,
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for a reason. And so it goes on and we have multiple other places. We have 1 Peter chapter
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3. We've got 1 Timothy chapter 2. We've got Genesis 1, 2, and 3. And one of the things that
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Paul says commentating on Genesis 3 in the fall that we find happened in the garden is that both
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sinned, Adam and Eve, but only one was deceived. And there's been a lot of talk and debate about
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that. So are women on average in general, more gullible, more vulnerable to being deceived than
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men? That has been the reigning position. Yes. In the affirmative. Yes. Women are more easily
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deceived than men. That has been the position of the church throughout church history, like all
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the way up until yesterday. That was not a controversial statement. That was not a
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controversial belief that is what the church held with with no pushback no no confusion like just
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of course of course they are why for well for two reasons because we see it all the time in our
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experience and because the bible says so like and it's not just about eve and the fact that she was
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deceived by the serpent but multiple other places paul talks about false teachers they creep right
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So 2 Timothy 3, these men, they creep into households and entice and lure, deceive weak-willed women.
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Now, that doesn't mean men can't be deceived, and that doesn't mean that women can't ever not be deceived.
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There are godly women, and there are some stout women.
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and praise god so we're talking about a general role right it's the same as serving in the
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military right women should not be serving in combat roles in the military period and they
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certainly shouldn't be drafted yeah but think about that all right let me connect the dots
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women's suffrage the right for women to vote women's draft don't you think for a second that
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these things aren't intrinsically correlated women's suffrage the right to vote directly
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not indirectly not even with a million different multivariant factors no directly one-to-one
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ratio women get to vote women get drafted into war and that is probably going to happen unless
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unless we have some serious revival some serious changes that that that's that's where we're headed
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that discussion is popping up all the time all the time in the news right equality women getting
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draft my daughters being forced to go into war in the name of equality that's honoring women
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are you kidding me sending women to the slaughter is honoring women how did that happen women's
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suffrage that's how women voting that's how it is so yeah if number one if only men could vote so
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statistic, here's another statistic for you. If only men could vote, we didn't have women's
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suffrage. Uh, we would not have one Democrat president in the last 50 years. Did you know
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that? Not one. So no, I don't think women should vote. And, and it's not just because they vote
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badly and they do again, it's a general rule. So in the same way that like in general, men can
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bench press more than women, but there's a few women out there that can bench press more than
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a few men. Certainly, of course, I got that. It's a general rule. Okay. So I already gave the
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disclaimer, but in general, because of this rule, um, yeah, in general, men vote better than women.
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They do because men are less prone to being deceived and they're less emotional.
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And when it comes to leadership, being overly emotional is not a virtue. It's not right. That's
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the problem with liberals, right? Liberals, the old saying goes like this, liberals always think
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in terms of solutions, whereas conservatives think in terms of cost or trade-offs. I mean,
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when a conservative hears of a problem and suggests a solution or hears of a solution
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suggested, he immediately thinks of what's the cost, which is maturity. It recognizes, again,
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that we don't live in a vacuum, that we live in a context. And one decision over here may alleviate
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this problem for this group of people, but cause another problem for this other. That's the way
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conservatives think. And guess what? Statistically, men, more men are conservatives. So that's the way
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conservatives think because that's the way men think. Because that's the way men were designed
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to think. Because that's what men were called to do. Men were called to make decisions for large
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groups of people. Women are called to make decisions for the four cute chubby cheeked people
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sitting in her lap. And so for them, like what does a woman need? If she's going to be a godly
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mother and these kinds of, what are some of the virtues and the attributes? Like she needs
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compassion. She needs to be nourishing. She needs to be hospitable. She needs to be patient. She
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needs to be like all the things that women are because women are better than men at a lot of
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things but the question is what things are they better at and and then what roles what tasks do
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those virtues those strengths are they best suited for you know so here's another way to say it
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kentonji uh brown jackson right our new supreme court justice pick right she's fully qualified
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because she's black and a woman of course uh those are the only qualifications that she met
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apparently because of the only qualifications that were being sought after by our great president
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joe biden but she's now right she's now sitting on the supreme court and and one of the things
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conservatives guys like ted cruz and other guys were throwing at her and saying you're not qualified
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you should not be on the supreme court is is that she had very light penalties judgments rulings
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for child predators pedophiles pedophiles and she would always and maybe not always many times in
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many cases it wasn't just one instance that many cases were brought up where she gave the lightest
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sentence the lightest penalty she possibly could to the perpetrator why because that's the guy who's
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standing in front of her not the kids that he endangered that he abused but but the guy himself
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the criminal. He's the one who's standing before her and she's a woman. So what does she do?
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She exercises mercy, compassion, which is great in the home. It's not great in the civil magistrate
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because the civil magistrate is not called, it's not Romans 13, right? God appointed the
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civil magistrate and he equipped the civil magistrate with warm hugs. No, with a sword.
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so the question is who should bear a sword i've heard some guys really conservative guys and i
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would agree with this they've argued that well the sword is a phallus and phalluses belong to men
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being a part of the civil magic even if you're not in a combat role in the military or this or
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that just just the role itself whether it's mayor or governor or city council or or supreme court
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justice the civil magistrate is it is for men it is to make decisions not just for individuals in
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your home such as your children but but rather to make decisions that will hurt one group and help
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another because we live in a fallen world we live we don't we don't live in this magical unicorn
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rainbow world that liberals think we live in where it's just solutions oh people are poor so
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a universal income. No, no, we live in reality, right? There are trade-offs, right? Another
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famous saying, you know, that you've probably heard before is this. If a man is not a liberal
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or if a person is not a liberal, whatever, something like that. If you're not a liberal
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when you're young, you don't have a heart. If you're not a conservative when you're old,
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you don't have a head or a brain. There's a reason why young people tend to vote Democrat.
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And then those same people, as they get older, not in every case, again, just talking about
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generalities, but as you age, you start to vote conservative.
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Well, because when you're young, you just want solutions and you don't want to ever be a
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You just want to vote in such a way that it forces somebody else to solve this problem
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But when you're older, here's one of the things that you have when you're older, money.
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so now that solution you're the dude who it's taking taxes out of your check you're the guy
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who actually has to pay for that solution now when you're 60 versus when you're 20
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so older people tend to be more conservative and not just because oh you know we've evolved as a
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culture yeah there's there's plenty of truth there but it's not just like oh young people
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it's it's just the way we're heading and and and we're just always going to have liberal people
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from now on the older people that's just because they were from a previous generation no no think
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about this for a second the baby boomers the baby that's the 60s generation make love not war
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the boomers who are voting for republicans are the 60s people who are standing on the white
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white house lawn holding signs you know and and protesting everything and smoking copious amounts
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of marijuana. It's not two different groups of people. It's the same people. They grew up.
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They just grew up. It's the same people, just the people changed. And part of what changed them
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is maturity. They grew up. They grew up and they began to see different things. They began to see
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it's not just solutions, but there are trade-offs. If we do this, that means that. And I think in
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general, that comes with two factors, right? Because I'm kind of getting off a little bit,
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but let me bring it back. I think part of that comes with maturity and age, and part of it also
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comes with testosterone. I really think that. I really think that there is something innate to
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being a male that allows, again, general rule, not each and every individual, but in general,
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I think men are able to pan out and remove themselves from the situation and not be geared
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or dictated by their own emotions and look at the bigger picture. I just think that that is a
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reality. So I think in experience and the way that God designed men, men have been made, I think,
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to make decisions for others. So no, I don't want women voting and making decisions for the nation
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as a whole if their whole heart and mind. Another thing is both men and women are called to work,
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right? Titus chapter two, workers at home. Women are called to work, but in the home, keepers at
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home. Their ministry is at home. So their focus is towards, it's oriented in. Men are oriented
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out. We're looking out. We're thinking out. Men think about society. They think about these kinds
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of things. Men just, men read the news statistically more than women. So they're also just more
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informed, not just less vulnerable to being deceived, you know, and their personality and
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this kind of thing. But like, they also just have more information because they tend to be more
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interested in political matters and this, it's just, I think it's blatantly obvious. And then
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you just throw the scripture in the mix and then it's, you know, case closed. The scripture,
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I think it's very clear that men are called to lead societies. And this idea of the man is the
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head of his house. Well, what is society? Think about that. That's what the question is getting
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at. And you did a great job, Joshua, because I know you're thinking this and so good on you,
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but what is society but the sum of individual households so we're going to say men should be
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the leaders in their homes but men and women can be leaders in society society is homes that's all
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society is society is just the summation of households so if if what if god says men should
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be the head of their wives and the head of their children in the home but and in the church right
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with male elders and i would argue for a male diaconate from first timothy chapter three like
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if, if men are called, so the Bible explicitly says men lead in the home of the church.
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And then we're just going to say, well, but the Bible is not explicit enough for the marketplace
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or for the civil magistrate or for like, I don't think the Bible is super explicit on those other
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arenas because, well, I'll say it like this for the same reason, the apostles did not find it
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necessary to write a verse in the Bible to Christians. It says upon conversion, continue
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to inhale and exhale. Like in the same way, what I'm saying is in the same way the apostles didn't
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find it necessary to explicitly command us to breathe because they felt like it went without
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saying. I think the apostles likewise thought that it was quite obvious that if men are called
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to lead in the church and the home, and the church and the home is the bedrock of society, then
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obviously men are called to lead in society as well. Last thing I'll say is this.
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women's suffrage. Another reason why I don't like it is it's not just that women don't tend in
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general to not vote well, which is true. That is statistically proven. Women don't vote well.
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But in addition to women not voting well, women's suffrage, the design, and you can read some of
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the early feminists and what they were trying to do. They wanted to break up the household.
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They wanted to turn women against their husbands
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Women always got a vote in our nation's history, always,
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Husbands voted, not just on behalf of themselves,
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The head of the household cast the household vote.
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But as of now, all we've seen of that is bad fruit.
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Women's suffrage didn't just mean women could vote
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but it also meant that women could divide against their husbands and that the household,
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it was no longer, this is the vote of our family, but it became atomistic, individualistic, right?
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The whole mindset of Americans began to shift with women's suffrage and multiple other factors
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as well, but focusing on that one, it began to shift from households, families, society,
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community to individual individual individual me me me just me we began to view ourselves as
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individual autonomous autonomous people rather than no we we belong i i'm a member of a family
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i vote for my family and and what shapes my vote is the interest and the needs
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the well-being of my family, my wife, my children, and I vote accordingly. And I'm listening to my
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wife. She does by proxy get a vote because my wife has my ear. And I hear her voice.
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I hear her concerns. And all that is going into the equation. But when we cast our vote,
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it's our vote, not my vote and her vote. And I really do think that women's suffrage,
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It divided marriages, it split the household, and it brought women into a realm where they're simply not built for it.
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And in the name of what women do best, good things, good things, but compassion and nurturing and kindness and all these things,
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it brought good things that are good in the right context into the wrong context and the result has
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