The NXR Podcast - August 04, 2022


QUESTIONS - What If Your Husband Is Theologically Inferior To You？

Hosted by
Joel Webbon Harrison Smith Antonio Griffith Dale Partridge Wewsley Todd Calvin Robinson
Mentioned
Paul Adam Jillian Doug Wilson Tim Keller
DAILY TRUTH - The Fear of Man DAILY TRUTH - God Will Not Be Mocked

Episode Stats


Length

10 minutes

Words per minute

184.83

Word count

1,916

Sentence count

103

Harmful content

Misogyny

9

sentences flagged

Toxicity

6

sentences flagged

Hate speech

33

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode, Beth and Jenna discuss the role of women in the home and the church. They discuss why women should not be outspoken in the church and why men should be the head of households. They also discuss the need for a male diaconate and why women shouldn't be preaching on the Lord's Day.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00 Hey guys, real quick before we get started, I have a small request.
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00:00:21 How far should we apply Paul's instructions that women should ask their husbands at home?
00:00:26 any theological questions they have
00:00:29 and not be outspoken in the church.
00:00:31 Great question.
00:00:32 Let's read it one more time.
00:00:33 This is from With Love Jillian.
00:00:36 How far should we apply Paul's instructions
00:00:38 that women should ask their husbands at home
00:00:41 any theological questions they have
00:00:43 and not be outspoken in the church?
00:00:46 All right, great question.
00:00:47 So this comes from 1 Corinthians 14,
00:00:49 comes from a lot of passages.
00:00:51 We see the principle at play.
00:00:52 So 1 Timothy chapter two, verses nine through 15, right? 1.00
00:00:57 I do not permit a woman to have any authority to teach or exercise any authority over a 1.00
00:01:02 man. 1.00
00:01:03 She must be silent, you know?
00:01:06 And so Paul goes into that.
00:01:07 She needs to be in submission.
00:01:09 And then he makes a, he pulls on the created order to, to bind his argument.
00:01:13 So it's not cultural.
00:01:14 He doesn't say, because, you know, in our particular culture, you know, we want to be
00:01:18 winsome and people want to, they'd see this as radically feminist. And now that's, but Paul
00:01:24 doesn't argue like Tim Keller. So he argues biblically. And so he roots it not in some
00:01:29 winsome cultural argument that would come and go and be subject to change, but he roots it in a
00:01:34 timeless, unchanging principle before sin ever even entered the world, namely the created order,
00:01:39 right? Adam was formed first, then Eve. Adam was made from the dust of the ground, but Eve was made
00:01:44 from Adam and for Adam as his helpmate. So he uses that argumentation to talk about why men should
00:01:52 lead, they should have authority, and men should teach, and a woman should not, right? And he's 0.98
00:01:57 making that argument with the church, but I do think that there's a broader principle in society,
00:02:01 even outside of the home and the church, right? I'm not merely complementarian. I am patriarchal.
00:02:06 I think that that's right. I think that that's biblical. I think it makes no sense to say men
00:02:10 should be the head of their households and wives should submit to their husbands as the church
00:02:14 submits to Christ. And men should lead the church as elders. And I would argue also for a male
00:02:19 diaconate and women should not function as elders and they should not be preaching on the Lord's 0.99
00:02:24 day. And so in the church and the home, it is led by biblically qualified men. Women are not leading. 0.99
00:02:31 They're not in positions of authority over men. But then when we come into society, whether it 0.99
00:02:36 the political realm or the cultural realm or whatever, any other institution, academia,
00:02:42 something outside of the home of the church, all of a sudden we flip that order on its
00:02:45 head.
00:02:46 That just, that makes no sense.
00:02:48 If men are leading households, if households, right, because what is a society? 0.79
00:02:52 Think about that. 0.73
00:02:53 What is a society but a gathering of households?
00:02:57 Societies are made up by households.
00:02:59 And you might say, well, not everybody's a part of a household.
00:03:01 Not everybody's married. 0.73
00:03:02 They're single women. 1.00
00:03:03 Great. 1.00
00:03:03 They're under their father then. 0.62
00:03:05 There is no woman who is not underneath the headship of a man, whether it be her father 0.89
00:03:10 or whether it be her husband, if she's a Christian woman, whether it be her male elders in the
00:03:15 church.
00:03:16 So women, God has set up his created order in such a way that men lead, men lead. 0.86
00:03:23 And so to advocate that men should lead in the church and they should lead in the home, 0.96
00:03:26 but then when we get away from the church in the home, then we can flip God's created
00:03:30 order on its head is inconsistent. 0.98
00:03:33 And I believe hypocritical. 1.00
00:03:35 So, women asking questions of their husbands at home. 1.00
00:03:39 1 Timothy 2, verse 9-15 talks about men are the ones who are teaching the church, but 0.94
00:03:44 1 Corinthians 14 explicitly says that in church, women should be silent. 0.89
00:03:50 In fact, the Apostle Paul says, it is shameful for a woman to speak in church. 1.00
00:03:56 Shameful for a woman to speak in church.
00:03:58 And he specifically says, if a woman has questions, she should ask her husband at home. 1.00
00:04:02 Now, the first thing that I think Paul's addressing is this, he is addressing outbursts in the 0.56
00:04:09 Lord's day gathering of the saints.
00:04:12 Women should not be objecting or interrupting and no one for that matter, but especially
00:04:19 women should not be objecting or interrupting as a pastor is teaching, as the saints are
00:04:25 gathered on the Lord's day for the administering of the ordinary means of grace, publicly
00:04:29 preaching the word publicly praying the word publicly singing the word with psalms hymns and
00:04:34 spiritual songs and publicly seeing the word s-e-e-i-n-g and the only two images that the
00:04:40 lord has instituted namely baptism and the lord's supper right these are the ordinary means of grace
00:04:46 the church is committed the gathered saints they're committed to gather together to ecclesia
00:04:51 to assemble together on the lord's day um the christian sabbath the first day of the week the
00:04:56 day that Christ rose from the dead for the administering of the ordinary means of grace
00:05:01 and this is a time of order and this is what Paul is talking about in first Corinthians 14 not just
00:05:06 in regards to women but in regards to the gifts of the sign gifts which I believe has ceased but
00:05:11 but in his day in the church at Corinth the sign gifts of prophecy and tongues Paul's whole argument
00:05:17 saying that the prophecy is superior to tongues is because Paul wants order and he wants clarity
00:05:24 He wants order and clarity.
00:05:26 He wants whoever is speaking to do so intelligibly.
00:05:29 And he talks about, even with prophecy, he says, at most, two or three should prophesy.
00:05:33 And he's not saying two or three prophesy at the same time. 0.99
00:05:36 That is an idiotic reading of the text. 0.93
00:05:40 He does not say that because he specifically says, if to one is given a revelation, the 1.00
00:05:44 one who is currently speaking should stop speaking so the one who's just received a
00:05:49 revelation from the Lord, a prophetic word, can begin speaking, meaning what?
00:05:53 that the two should not speak simultaneously one is speaking they stop so that the other can speak
00:05:58 so that only one person speaks at a time why so that it is intelligible so that it is clear so
00:06:05 that it is done in order and then he says two or three should prophesy and we know he's not talking
00:06:11 about simultaneously because he's already addressed that so what he's talking about by
00:06:15 by way of implication is that two or three should prophesy at most throughout an entire gathering
00:06:21 throughout a service where the church is gathered together. Two or three men, because he later talks
00:06:28 about women, how it's shameful for a woman to speak in church. So what we can assume is this,
00:06:32 biblically qualified men should speak in church one at a time and only two or three at most so 0.75
00:06:39 that everything can be done with clarity and order. God is a God of order. So the first thing
00:06:46 that Paul's saying when he says it's shameful for a woman to speak at church, and he encourages
00:06:51 and commands women to ask their husbands if they have any questions at home, is he is setting up
00:06:57 barriers against interruptions in the Lord's Day gathering. Do not object and do not interrupt.
00:07:04 And no one should be doing that because of what Paul says earlier about how one should speak at
00:07:08 a time. No one objects, no one interrupts, but especially women. It is especially shameful for 0.99
00:07:14 For a woman who has not been given the assignment and the ministry by God to lead or to exercise 0.79
00:07:20 authority over men or to teach men, again, that's cross-referencing back to 1 Timothy 1.00
00:07:25 chapter 2, it is especially shameful, therefore, for a woman to interrupt and to speak in church. 0.99
00:07:32 All right, now, asking their husbands at home, the way that I'm answering the question is 1.00
00:07:36 this.
00:07:36 I think that it's appropriate for a woman to ask a question of her pastor, to ask a question
00:07:42 of her male pastor, who is not her husband, outside of the Lord's Day gathering.
00:07:48 Not interrupting, not objecting, not in the middle of a service, not causing a scene,
00:07:53 not an outburst, but to reach out with her husband's permission, not against her husband,
00:08:00 not being divisive, not undercutting his authority, but for her to reach out with her husband
00:08:05 to their pastor and to ask him a question.
00:08:08 Now, here's the deal, though.
00:08:09 This should never be used to turn against her husband. 1.00
00:08:12 So the only reason that a woman should really be doing this is when she has already asked 0.99
00:08:17 her husband and he doesn't know the answer. 0.68
00:08:19 And here's the beauty.
00:08:20 At that point, it becomes his question.
00:08:23 It's not exclusively her question anymore.
00:08:26 It's now his question.
00:08:28 And if the man is a godly husband, Doug Wilson says it like this.
00:08:31 He says, not every man will be a professional theologian, but every man has the obligation
00:08:36 of being a residential theologian, a resident theologian, not a professional, not all men
00:08:43 will be professional theologians, meaning some men will have be more theologically inclined than
00:08:47 others. Not all men will be professional theologians, but every man should be a resident
00:08:52 theologian, meaning he is the pastor of his home. He is the theologian of his family, which means
00:09:00 his wife and his children, when they have theological questions, they should go to him
00:09:04 and they should know this.
00:09:05 My husband, my dad, he will either have the answer
00:09:09 or he will be committed diligently to finding the answer.
00:09:15 He'll either have the answer or he'll find the answer. 0.99
00:09:19 So I think that women should certainly not have an outburst 0.79
00:09:23 and interrupt in the Lord's Day gathering.
00:09:25 But even beyond that, I think that women 1.00
00:09:27 should ask their husbands at home 0.64
00:09:30 before emailing their pastors.
00:09:31 and their husband will either be able to answer the question
00:09:36 or if he can't, it now becomes his question.
00:09:39 It's not just her question anymore.
00:09:41 It is now also his question
00:09:43 and he can lead the way in approaching one of the pastors
00:09:48 in getting the answer to this question
00:09:50 or he can do some research at home.
00:09:52 He may not even need to approach the pastors.
00:09:54 He may be able just through personal study
00:09:57 find the answer to this question
00:09:59 to be able to answer it for his wife.
00:10:02 That's how I would answer your question.
00:10:03 Jillian, thanks for writing in.
00:10:05 Thanks so much for listening.
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