The NXR Podcast - QUESTIONS - What Would The Current Population Be If Adam Never Sinned & No One Ever Died？

00:00:00.000 Hey guys, real quick before we get started I have a small request. If you've been blessed by our

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00:00:14.660 gets out to as many people as possible. Thanks. What would the current world population be if

00:00:23.280 there was never death due to sin? Fantastic question, all right? And so this is, you know,

00:00:27.660 some people push back on this and say, you know, they'll say, well, it's what I was talking about

00:00:34.360 earlier, right? So it's theology, anthropology, all those kind of things, but let's just work

00:00:39.140 with theology for a second. God is not Klaus Schwab, right? God is not Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,

00:00:48.900 who has no power, you know, but whatever, you know, he's just, you know, somebody who takes

00:00:52.360 pictures and does social media. What I'm trying to say is God is not trying to somehow organize

00:01:04.820 the end of the world. God is not cruel. God doesn't hate humanity. God looked at creation,

00:01:12.340 even though it's been fallen under the curse of sin, God said it is good. And God is in the

00:01:16.200 business of restoring creation and saving humanity through jesus christ okay so all that being said

00:01:22.700 god would not create man ever even before sin entered the world and had it never entered the

00:01:29.480 world like your question god would not have created a scenario with the creation that he says is good

00:01:35.700 and and man adam and eve which he said is very good on the sixth day god would not have created

00:01:43.040 these things which he loved. God has compassion on all he has made, the Psalms say. God would

00:01:47.080 not have created these things which he declared are good and that he loves and has compassion on

00:01:51.320 and then engineered them in such a way and

00:01:55.000 explicitly commanded them in such a way that they would lend towards their own

00:01:58.780 implosion, demise,

00:02:02.940 self-destruction. And then God's sitting back there, you know, in the

00:02:06.800 global forum laughing, you know, maniacally,

00:02:10.400 ah, ah, ah, ah, I told them to be fruitful and multiply. Little do they know, I baked into the

00:02:15.760 cosmic, you know, creation, the physical world order that I made. I baked into the equation a

00:02:20.960 very limited amount of resources, and once they multiply to a certain point, they'll then, you

00:02:26.200 know, be plagued with poverty and sickness, and people will starve, and mass diseases will spread,

00:02:31.520 and this and that. It's just not the nature of God. So we can't believe that, right? We're

00:02:37.440 Christians. That is distinctly not Christian. So therefore, we have to believe that what God said 1.00

00:02:44.400 was good and what God loves, his creation and man, had sin never entered the world, and God

00:02:51.420 commanding them to be fruitful and multiply and to fill the world, that that wouldn't have lent

00:02:56.960 towards destruction. But if anything, the results of that, the fruit of man being fruitful and

00:03:03.100 multiplying and filling the earth would have been strictly positive. Now, that doesn't mean there

00:03:07.900 wouldn't be challenges to figure out. Now, sin, right, because we're talking about a hypothetical

00:03:11.220 situation where sin didn't enter the world, but there would still be challenges, right? So some

00:03:15.260 people, they think, you know, well, government, you know, government only, civil government only

00:03:18.360 exists because sin entered the world. Well, I disagree. If sin never entered the world, you'd

00:03:22.920 still have to decide which side of the road to drive on, the left or the right. Somebody would

00:03:28.840 have to make that rule, that determination. And then that would have to be a rule that everyone

00:03:34.020 is followed, that everybody follows for order, right? God's law doesn't just deal with sin,

00:03:41.160 but it also deals with order. And so even with a sinless world, there would still need to be,

00:03:47.920 there are certain things that would still need to be determined. Now, civil government would be,

00:03:52.300 the state would be a lot smaller. It should be a lot smaller even now with a sinful world,

00:03:56.520 but it would have been incredibly small. You wouldn't have some bloated, with just millions

00:04:03.360 of state employees doing a bad job at everything, but it'd be a small state, but there'd still be a 0.96

00:04:09.860 civil state. And I believe that if Adam and Eve had been fruitful and multiplied, Adam had an

00:04:15.860 eschaton. Some of you have heard me talk about this before. He had an eschatology before sin

00:04:20.520 ever entered the world. I believe that Adam was on probation, okay? So this is what a lot of the

00:04:24.880 reformed Puritan type thinkers, you know, would say about the creational covenant or the covenant

00:04:30.180 of life that we often refer to as a covenant of works that God established with Adam in the garden

00:04:35.000 before the fall. Remember, Adam was made in the wilderness, okay, and then placed by God in the

00:04:40.500 garden. And you might say wilderness, well, but this is before sin entered the world, so how could

00:04:46.200 there be a wilderness, you know, because thorns and thistles were, you know, the ground being

00:04:51.200 cursed, that's a result of Adam's sin. Because Adam is federal head, not just of his wife and

00:04:56.940 all their posterity, but Adam is not just federal head representative of humanity, but representative

00:05:01.780 of the earthly cosmos, the created physical world. Meaning that when Adam sins, it's not just that he

00:05:07.540 and his wife and all their children are cursed, but cursed is the ground because of you, Adam.

00:05:12.040 He represented all physical earthly creation. All right, so how could Adam be made in the wilderness

00:05:17.720 before sin entered the world, because isn't the wilderness a kind of ground cursing

00:05:22.780 fruit or result of Adam sinning? And I would say, no, there's a difference between thorns and

00:05:29.100 thistles, the world being cursed versus the world still needing to be put in order and developed.

00:05:34.320 And that's not to say that God is not a God of order. He looked at the world and he said it was

00:05:38.100 good. So it was without sin, but there was still much to do. There was still much to do. So there's

00:05:44.000 a garden. There's Adam and Eve. Adam's called to work and keep the ground, work and keep.

00:05:49.840 In working, so keep, I think, is, you know, defense, protect, right? And Adam failed in that.

00:05:54.520 The serpent shouldn't have been able to get into the garden, certainly not slither up to

00:05:58.580 his wife and start, you know, lying about God. So Adam failed in that. But keeping, I think,

00:06:04.180 is protecting. Working, though, is cultivating the ground, working as a gardener in the garden.

00:06:10.340 that's agriculture and all those kinds of things, but not just

00:06:13.580 cultivating, but I think that inherent in working is also

00:06:17.560 expanding, developing, increasing. That as Adam worked and kept,

00:06:22.600 guarded the garden, but also worked the garden, he would be expanding the garden.

00:06:26.660 It would be increasing and multiplying. So it's not just that

00:06:30.480 Adam and Eve were called to be fruitful and multiply in terms of making more people,

00:06:34.520 multiplying people. I think they were also called to multiply the garden.

00:06:37.720 and I think that Adam's eschaton was the garden

00:06:41.800 he would expand the garden, he and his sons

00:06:45.700 they would work together over multiple generations

00:06:48.340 and they would expand the garden over the whole face of the earth

00:06:52.100 where there would be no void empty places left, there would be no wilderness

00:06:55.260 like the place where he was created and then placed in the garden

00:06:58.460 but eventually the whole earth would be covered by the garden

00:07:02.900 just as the whole earth in our eschatology

00:07:06.140 this post-millennial glorious hope, the whole earth will be covered with the knowledge of the

00:07:12.200 glory of God as the waters cover the sea. Well, I think Adam was going to do that with two things,

00:07:17.100 with the garden and with descendants, the garden and people. Expand the garden, multiply the garden,

00:07:23.180 multiply people. So that you have, the garden was the sanctuary, it was the church,

00:07:28.600 and that eventually the whole earth would be encompassed in this sanctuary, and not just a

00:07:34.520 big sanctuary, but only a couple people, right? So you need both, multiply garden, multiply people,

00:07:39.080 but also worshipers, image bearers of the living God, to fill this now global, worldwide garden,

00:07:46.940 to sing the praises of God. And not to sing, but to live them out in everything that they do,

00:07:52.060 in every area and realm of life. So all that being said, if sin had never entered the world

00:07:57.140 at this point, right? So you wouldn't have all the, I mean, think of all the deaths that we've had

00:08:01.120 in infancy until very recent and, you know, modern, recent human history. And then, and not

00:08:08.800 just the deaths in infancy, but of course all deaths, right? You'd have all the people who ever

00:08:12.640 had lived, but it'd be exponential, right? So right now we have like 8 billion people in the

00:08:18.220 world is the latest, like coming up on 8 billion or just hit it. And then you got all the people

00:08:23.720 since the beginning of the world. And I would date the, you know, I'm not a heretic, so I'm a

00:08:27.620 literal six-day, 24-hour period day creationists, young earth. But let's say anywhere from six to

00:08:33.380 10,000 years. There is, I think, some reasonable debate. But six to 10,000 years of human history

00:08:39.680 and the creation of the world. Eight billion now. Everybody who ever had lived, if they had lived,

00:08:48.340 or were still alive, and there was no sickness and there was no death, I think that that would

00:08:52.080 give us about another eight billion. I haven't looked recently, but I've seen some studies that

00:08:56.520 say we have more people alive on the planet today than have ever lived, you know, or comparable.

00:09:00.960 So let's just say 8 billion plus 8 billion, right? So that's 16 billion. But then you also have to

00:09:06.620 talk about the fact that people would be continuing, right? Women would be able to continue 0.99

00:09:11.840 to get pregnant, to be fertile for, I would assume indefinitely. So having multiple generations of 0.99

00:09:20.800 children from the same mother, right? And then all the children who have died in our world that

00:09:25.660 would have lived, that died in infancy, that would have produced. And then also you're talking about

00:09:30.000 sin not entering the world and how that affects how many children people want to have and people's

00:09:34.000 view of children and seeing them as a burden. Or they actually can't care for children because

00:09:39.180 they're completely impoverished in North Korea, which again is a result of sin. So you're talking 0.89

00:09:44.760 about a world where there's no poverty and everybody has a right view of children and

00:09:51.280 everybody is no sin. So they're living in obedience to God in the commandment to be fruitful and

00:09:56.660 multiply. And there's no stop on the clock of a woman's fertility. So you don't just have 8 0.99

00:10:05.380 billion plus 8 billion, but all the exponential factors that I've just... 60 billion. That's the

00:10:11.580 minimum threshold. I'd put it at exponentially. 100 billion would be small, probably 100 billion

00:10:18.440 to a trillion. That's my answer. Pull the question up one more time. A hundred billion to a trillion

00:10:24.380 is what I'm going to say. Yeah. And right now you can fit the whole world in the state of Texas

00:10:29.220 comfortably. And so, you know, eight billion. And so if we had a hundred million, I believe that we

00:10:35.240 could all fit on earth. And here's a couple of other things just to add that. And even a trillion,

00:10:42.540 I think we could do that on earth. But you're also talking, you're not just talking about more

00:10:45.980 people. You're talking about unfallen people. So think about how far we've gotten in terms of 1.00

00:10:54.540 science and innovation and discovery. And that's because we're made in the image of God, but sin

00:11:00.060 is working against us. Sin is working against us. We're still able, unbelievers are able to do

00:11:05.180 amazing things because they're made in the image of God. But every time an unbeliever discovers 1.00

00:11:09.680 something that is actually true, it's only because they're working inconsistently with their actual 0.94

00:11:15.520 worldview, and their worldview does hang them up. It does impede their progress. It does, which is

00:11:23.780 why all the major innovations and discoveries have been Christians historically, until Christians 0.87

00:11:29.000 surrendered all these things because of dispensationalism, or premillennialism, and

00:11:32.680 pietism, and radical two-kingdomism, and all these things, but I digress. So you're talking about

00:11:38.680 a lot of people, but you're also talking about, and here's the thing, you're talking about

00:11:44.580 Adam still being alive. So you're talking about, oh, here's a guy who's 8,000 years old.

00:11:49.860 He's been learning and developing without the hindrance of sin and the way that affects our

00:11:55.400 development, the way that affects our learning, the way that affects how we discover and understand

00:12:01.900 the truth and not just spiritual truth, but truth in this world, because all truth is God's truth,

00:12:06.840 truth about the stars and truth about mathematics. Think about that. Think about that. Adam would be

00:12:13.420 8,000 years old. What do you think he would have invented? Right? Elon Musk has like 16 kids

00:12:22.420 from multiple wives. He's a complete pagan. He's got weird dealings with China and wants to put

00:12:27.300 chips inside your head. And that guy might get us to Mars. That guy might get us to Mars. I'm 0.94

00:12:34.020 grateful for Elon Musk because the bar is so low. You know, I'll take what I can get. But that guy

00:12:38.240 might get us to mars i think adam would have got us to mars i like a long long time ago and i'm i

00:12:44.560 don't know maybe we shouldn't go to mars but he my point is um let's so let's scale it back not

00:12:49.420 let's not even get to other planets and stuff and you know we could talk about moons with jupiter

00:12:52.800 and places that we could go there which i think there's there's some great arguments but here's

00:12:56.400 the deal let's just start with our world antarctica okay so before we try to colonize mars let's just

00:13:02.900 colonize Antarctica. Adam could have pulled it off. He could have. Seth could have done it with

00:13:08.900 him. You know, I mean, bring your son to work day, right? And your son is, you know, 7,700 years old,

00:13:15.360 you know, and you're 8,000 years old, and you're bringing all your grandsons, and it's just all

00:13:18.940 these titans, right? And that, man, that isn't even, whew. So we could go and go and go. This

00:13:24.140 is fun. But there's a debate to be had for the size, literally the physical stature and size

00:13:28.800 of Adam, right? So I believe, right? Call me a lunatic, but I like to call it just a Bible-believing

00:13:35.440 Christian who's not so proud that he has to pretend to be sophisticated, but the Word of God 0.69

00:13:39.920 is actually good. It's actually good for me. I'll take it. I'll take the Word of God. So that being

00:13:44.520 said, water's above, right? Sky, God created an expanse between the two, not one, but two bodies

00:13:50.140 of water. The water's above and the water's below, right? So we have oceans and seas, but we also have

00:13:54.980 what I would believe would be a canopy of water, right? Somewhere about where we would say the

00:13:59.660 ozone layer is, you know, or was until, you know, Ron DeSantis, you know, used too much hairspray.

00:14:04.680 But like the ozone layer, you know, the thing that was going to fall apart and we're all going

00:14:08.520 to be dead by now, you know, the false prophets. Well, around there, a canopy of water. And that's

00:14:14.940 one of the things that I believe that in the flood, God opened the geysers, the deep, right?

00:14:21.360 So there were bodies of water under the earth that opened up and then rising sea levels and

00:14:25.600 then rain, but not just rain like we know rain, right?

00:14:29.180 Not just like in Texas, we would say, you know, hard rain would be a gully washer, right?

00:14:33.620 Because it rains so much, it starts to flood all the ditches and it just wipes everything

00:14:37.820 clean, a gully washer.

00:14:39.660 But not just that, you're talking about the, I think that the canopy of water above popped

00:14:44.860 and it really was a global flood and flooded every square inch of the world. And the reason

00:14:52.480 why was to wipe out wicked humanity, which I would believe again, because I believe the Bible,

00:14:56.780 right? Getting crazy here, but just telling you my beliefs. Part of the reason God wiped out all

00:15:02.080 these people is not just because they were wicked. We've always had wicked people, but that these

00:15:06.860 people were hybrids. Yes, hybrids. That fallen angels, the sons of God, saw that the daughters 1.00

00:15:13.960 of men were beautiful and married them and went into them and created the Nephilim. And that the

00:15:20.780 Nephilim were horrible, horrible people, wicked, wicked people. And that Noah, it's not just that 1.00

00:15:27.000 Noah was this one righteous man in moral terms, but I also believe that Noah and his wife, his

00:15:32.160 three sons and their three wives, were the only ones who biologically, their genetics had not

00:15:38.280 actually been compromised, that they had not intermarried with fallen angels or the offspring

00:15:44.140 of fallen angels. And so God wipes out the world. But here's the deal. That's a freebie. All that

00:15:50.540 being said, the point is before the flood, there's a canopy of water. What would that do in terms of

00:15:57.120 oxygen levels? What would that do in terms of... So there's some guys who would say that basically

00:16:02.240 it would create almost like a synthetic hyperbolic chamber, meaning you could have

00:16:09.520 larger creatures that could get enough breath, like dinosaurs, dragons, or whatever it might be,

00:16:17.240 and that people were probably larger also. Plus, there's no chemicals and pesticides and all these

00:16:22.360 different things that we put in our food. So you're just eating pure food with greater oxygen

00:16:29.980 levels, protection from sun rays, and all these different things, and living indefinitely

00:16:36.100 lifespans that don't end.

00:16:38.780 So you're not just talking about intellect that just grows for thousands of years and

00:16:43.700 unimpeded by sin, but then you're also talking about physical stature, right?

00:16:49.840 That you have large beings.

00:16:53.040 Adam could have been, I don't know, he could have been six feet tall, right?

00:16:56.760 this, you know, this is a little bit, we're going a little bit off script here, okay? But I'm just

00:17:00.900 saying that it's a permissible, it is a reasonable view to hold that Adam could have been nine feet

00:17:05.820 tall, 10 feet tall, 12 feet tall, right? I feel like Ricky Bobby right now, right? With modern

00:17:10.920 advances and science and my high-level income, and, you know, no one lives forever, but it's not

00:17:14.900 preposterous, and, you know, 240, 250, you know, Adam could have been, you know, 12 feet tall,

00:17:18.420 but I believe that, you know, that's possible. So increased physical stature, purity of thought,

00:17:24.660 massive, tightened intellect, because no sin impeding it, and being able to intellectually

00:17:31.380 develop without Alzheimer's or anything for 10,000 years, because there's no stop on your

00:17:36.040 lifespan. So what does that all equate to? Well, I think in population equates to about

00:17:43.100 100 billion to a trillion people. In terms of, well, what do you do with a trillion people, Joel?

00:17:49.120 um i don't know i think you i think you colonize antarctica and you figure that out

00:17:56.420 i think there's no more sahara desert right because i already said earlier that i think

00:18:01.140 that that was adam's eschaton was be fruitful multiply in terms of descendants people image

00:18:06.140 bearers worshipers but also um the worship sanctuary the garden i think that there would

00:18:11.800 have been a way if sin had never entered the world especially without thorns and thistles

00:18:14.820 I think there were still arid places, void places, like the wilderness in which Adam was

00:18:19.420 created by God and then placed in the garden. But you don't have thorns and thistles. And if you're

00:18:25.400 saying, well, is a desert a wilderness or is a desert thorns and thistles category a result of

00:18:30.160 sin? I don't know exactly. I don't know exactly. I probably should think about that because I think

00:18:34.760 it's just fascinating. Maybe get back to me next time. Is desert wilderness level pre-sin or is

00:18:41.600 desert, thorns and thistles, curse brought on the ground from sin. I don't know. But the point is

00:18:47.260 there would be some difficult geographic climate, you know, topography, you know, kinds of

00:18:53.320 environments and ecosystems, and, you know, they would have to be overcome, like Antarctica,

00:18:58.080 like the Sahara Desert. But I have to believe they'd be less difficult without the curse of

00:19:03.340 sin and thorns and thistles and these kinds of things. And I think they'd be easier if people

00:19:09.160 were physically stronger and bigger, which that gets into, you know, some of the monuments that

00:19:14.200 we have, like archaeologists, you know, discovering pyramids and things like that. Like we're Nephilim

00:19:18.020 involved in this, you know? And so anyways, but all that kind of stuff, Adam, if he's bigger

00:19:22.560 and all his posterity, if they're physically bigger and stronger and they don't get tired

00:19:27.140 and they don't get sick and they don't get this and they don't get that, and then they live 1.00

00:19:30.540 forever and they're smarter because they're not, sin makes you stupid, right? Well, you need to 1.00

00:19:35.720 know that, right? The Bible uses the word stupid. Proverbs, Psalms, I mean, the word stupid is like, 1.00

00:19:40.300 why not say foolish, Joel? You're just trying to get it. No, foolish is a biblical word. So is the 1.00

00:19:44.540 word stupid. That's not me translating the word foolish. I mean, the Bible will say fool in one 1.00

00:19:49.980 verse and then say stupid. And sin makes us stupid. And so if you're living for 8,000 years instead of 1.00

00:19:55.600 80, sinless? Dude, what, I mean, what would, what would people be inventing? Think about what people

00:20:04.740 have invented with, with, with 50 year lifespans. And, and think about what people are doing right

00:20:13.040 now, inventing right now, while thinking that a boy can be a girl and a girl can be a boy,

00:20:18.620 and they're only going to live for about 70, 80 years. That's insane. So now say that the person's

00:20:25.740 not stupid because they're not a God hating rebel, you know, perverted by sin. And they 1.00

00:20:29.920 actually don't think that a boy can be a girl and they understand basic things and they're not,

00:20:34.740 their inventions aren't inconsistent with their worldview, but stemming and flowing out of their

00:20:38.680 worldview and worship of the triune God. And not for 70 or 80 years, but for 8,000 years. And when

00:20:45.580 it comes to whatever physical components are wrapped up into innovation, all that kind of

00:20:48.860 stuff, you're eight feet tall and you can bench press a house. Boom. Okay. The point is a hundred

00:20:54.420 billion to a trillion people, but you can figure it out. There's no more deserts. There's no more

00:21:01.780 Antarctica, you know, ice, everything is inhabitable and fruitful, not just harsh,

00:21:06.380 but fruitful. And I think you definitely could do it with every square inch of earth. Cause I think

00:21:10.720 that was Adam's eschatology and you might be able to do it even beyond the earth, even colonizing

00:21:15.820 the stars, which I'll have to do another episode on that. And I just, I got to get, I got to get

00:21:20.760 Alex Jones on the podcast and get my tinfoil hat, you know, to be prepared for that one.

00:21:24.020 Without tinfoil on my head, I cannot do that episode. Um, but it's an episode that needs to

00:21:29.340 be done. All right. All right. All right. Stop twisting my arm. I know you want to hear the

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The NXR Podcast - December 17, 2022

QUESTIONS - What Would The Current Population Be If Adam Never Sinned & No One Ever Died？

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