The NXR Podcast - THE FRIDAY SPECIAL - DMT & The Astral Realm ｜ Ep 3 with @TheCultishShow

00:00:00.520 DMT, dimethyltryptamine, is a powerful psychedelic compound found in various plants and animals,

00:00:06.200 as well as being synthesized for recreational and ceremonial use.

00:00:10.060 It is known for its intense hallucinogenic effects, which can include profound alterations

00:00:14.500 in perception, consciousness, and spiritual experiences.

00:00:17.820 Although it is difficult to find information on this subject, there is a growing movement

00:00:21.180 of individuals who are attempting to use DMT in order to make contact with entities who

00:00:26.420 are described as those who inhabit the astral realm.

00:00:29.880 This ritual is far beyond the mere recreational use of drugs, which is still incredibly dangerous

00:00:34.580 and harmful in itself. But those who use substances, such as DMT, are not simply searching

00:00:39.780 for an experience of physical pleasure. In almost every case, this movement utilizes DMT as a part

00:00:45.540 of some spiritual or mystical practice. Their true aim is to commune with beings from beyond

00:00:51.200 our physical world in an attempt to acquire secret knowledge, skills, dark magic, and power.

00:00:59.240 All right, here we are. This is episode three, DMT in the astral realm. And Andrew, why don't

00:01:10.100 you just, you know, start us off by, you know, we were talking a little bit as we were preparing to

00:01:14.860 record this episode, and it would be helpful to give some guidelines, some boundaries in defining

00:01:21.680 terms, pharmakia. What is, you know, if as a Christian, right, like we're not Christian

00:01:28.340 scientists, you know, like if I take an aspirin, am I in sin? Like what does the Bible mean when

00:01:33.940 it talks about pharmakia being like witchcraft and those kinds of things? Yeah, absolutely. So

00:01:40.500 pharmakia, at least as I see it described in the Bible, would be the poisoning of someone's body

00:01:46.860 through substances in order to achieve a higher knowledge or contact with entities, which is an

00:01:52.180 abomination to the Lord. Can you say that again? That's a really helpful definition. Say it one

00:01:58.120 more time. Yeah, pharmakia is the use of substances to poison your body in order to, let's say, thin

00:02:05.900 the silver cord of your consciousness or this material realm in order to access a spiritual

00:02:11.720 realm to get uh higher knowledge through entities right and a secret knowledge a secret knowledge

00:02:19.260 exactly yeah so that's what pharmakia would be and we would see that use uh being done by the

00:02:24.800 ancient pagans uh in various methods of you know ingesting plants or maybe even glands from animals

00:02:32.520 in order to poison yourself to get near-death experiences really uh to contact and the ancients

00:02:37.880 or Native Americans. Yeah. Peyote. Yeah. How do you say it? Peyote. Peyote. Yep. That would be an 0.99

00:02:44.220 example of a hallucinogenic drug that would give experiences. But I think what God's really getting

00:02:52.000 at is that truth cannot be found in these substances, right? There's what you would

00:02:57.120 quote unquote call a higher level of knowledge or secret knowledge that's not necessarily true

00:03:02.980 knowledge. Because what do we find all throughout the scriptures? Fear of the Lord is the beginning

00:03:06.920 of wisdom and knowledge, not poisoning the body that God gave you in order to contact

00:03:12.140 entities to give you information, really. Right. It's good. Yeah. Yeah. And so this is,

00:03:18.300 again, talking about what worldviews do come in. So talking about one versus two,

00:03:23.980 what you end up having is that if you have a view of oneism, there's no distinction between

00:03:30.640 creator and creation. All is one or all is self. So you end up worshiping the self.

00:03:35.920 And the way to expand upon yourself is to expand your consciousness. And the goal is to ascend. At least that's the attempt. Now, I want to also lay a foundation. One of the biggest difficulties is why that worldview collapses in and on itself is because there is no truly true way to ascend.

00:03:55.700 because wherever you go there you are so when you're trying to go through all these processes

00:04:02.000 to ascend how where exactly do you ascend to in a worldview of one ism where all is one and all

00:04:10.700 is self and self and there's no distinctions so that's the one of the reasons too is that when

00:04:16.300 you have a lot of the interviews that we've had with new agers and they've tried everything from

00:04:20.500 astrology to divination to all sorts of spells and sorceries. One of our old interviews,

00:04:28.880 she went to the Mayan temple in 2012, and her and everyone in white robes believed that they

00:04:36.740 were going to ascend into 5D consciousness. That came and went. And that was the next thing,

00:04:41.340 and the next thing, and the next thing. My good friend, Will Spencer, who's been on our podcast

00:04:45.920 multiple times, and a shout-out to the Renaissance of Men.

00:04:48.080 He's talked about where he did multiple ayahuasca ceremonies

00:04:52.240 back-to-back-to-back.

00:04:54.160 But still, it ended up craving and longing for the next trip, per se.

00:05:00.320 I know Will. I've been on his podcast.

00:05:02.720 Yeah, I like him.

00:05:03.840 Yeah, shout-out to Will.

00:05:05.520 But here's where it gets interesting, because when it comes to this topic,

00:05:13.240 Again, another thing from a worldview standpoint,

00:05:16.020 but again, people embracing modernity,

00:05:18.380 thinking that this is something that is brand new

00:05:21.460 and it's exciting,

00:05:22.940 that somehow this is something that's super revolutionary,

00:05:25.600 like being able to take some sort of DMT

00:05:28.780 or some sort of hallucinogenic, you know,

00:05:30.100 psilocybin mushrooms

00:05:31.080 and to get into an altered state of consciousness

00:05:33.240 when this has been going on for a very, very long time.

00:05:38.420 I mean, you think about the movie, the 300, right?

00:05:41.700 So we think about that it depicts Greek culture, and what happens in there is that Leonidas goes to the priest, and they get a message of whether or not they should fight, what's the will of the gods, and they end up having, you know, these women, you know, who they give them a psychoactive substance, and they start convulsing, and they get in contact with a higher entity, and that's where the priest gets their message.

00:06:06.320 And this is depicting, you know, depicting in a very cinematic way, ancient Greece.

00:06:10.040 And obviously, I don't think the men in 300 is actually how they were, like, historically.

00:06:15.440 But you see that depicted, you see that depicted in all ancient civilizations with the Mayans.

00:06:21.460 In a lot of these places that we think, these places where human sacrifices took place,

00:06:26.500 where, you know, you look at how culture has affected India, like, you look at the culture in India,

00:06:31.720 You look at the culture in ancient South America. 0.84

00:06:35.560 Like, this is not pinnacle civilization.

00:06:38.180 But now, all of a sudden, we think that we can bring, you know, taking these medicinals and taking these substances.

00:06:45.400 Somehow, that's going to bring out the perfect utopian society.

00:06:50.280 It's like, well, what exactly are you doing?

00:06:52.260 And it's being popularized right now.

00:06:54.480 You think, like, Machine Gun Kelly and Megan Fox.

00:06:56.580 They've been very well known for now going down to South America and doing ayahuasca ceremonies and then just going there and just vomiting excessively.

00:07:06.660 And somehow at the very end of it, they come to this higher level of consciousness expansion and awareness.

00:07:13.920 You've had people like Russell Brand, Joe Rogan.

00:07:16.800 And what's interesting, too, is that when it comes to even this conversation, and it also comes down to who we are ontologically as being, kind of carrying over off of AI, but you have, there's a similar pattern going on.

00:07:31.320 So there's not just neural, you know, there's a physiological aspect that's taking place.

00:07:36.300 Your neurons are being affected, and there's a physiological component, but it always comes back to a common thing.

00:07:44.620 You end up somewhere on a realm, specifically an astral realm, and eventually getting in contact with entities that initially give you good information that seem like they might be friendly initially, but they end up getting hostile and turning on you.

00:08:02.560 And that's a commonality to the question is, how do you give an accounting of that?

00:08:07.560 What worldview do you make sense of that?

00:08:10.140 So this isn't just about taking it for medical reasons or doing it, you know, there's even a big now push for it to deal with veterans with PTSD, you know, and we should be able to think about that.

00:08:21.800 I think, you know, mental health is something that we shouldn't shy away from.

00:08:25.040 We're made in the image of God, the Imago Dei.

00:08:27.140 That's something we should embrace and should entrust.

00:08:29.400 But then, again, if something is being popularized that is going to, quote unquote, help people, but there is a commonality, like, this is where it goes to.

00:08:38.720 Like, we have to be able to understand as Christians, okay, how do we approach this topic?

00:08:42.700 What actually is happening?

00:08:44.340 Is this visitation and contact with entities?

00:08:47.900 Is this some sort of self-psychosis?

00:08:50.020 Are they just hallucinating in their own head?

00:08:52.960 Or is this just something they're just making up?

00:08:55.200 Or is there truly, is there an unseen realm that we don't need DMT to know about or to

00:09:02.780 see?

00:09:03.060 We can't view with our naked eye, but we do have a lens of scripture where it unequivocally

00:09:07.900 talks about what this realm is. And there are ways to access it in a proper way, because there's

00:09:15.280 only one who has truly ascended into heaven, namely the Son of Man. But there's also improper

00:09:19.840 ways to ascend, shortcuts, but it's not where you end up in contact with. If you think about

00:09:27.860 over the air, the artwork, Pilgrim's Progress, there are a couple times where Christian takes

00:09:33.660 sideways and he ends up in contact in places where he shouldn't be and ends up getting in

00:09:39.840 trouble for it. So I think that's something to really think about as we kind of unravel into

00:09:44.600 this discussion. Yeah. And I think it's good for the listener to understand that people who are

00:09:50.120 using DMT or any form of psychedelic substance in order to gain a higher level of truth are

00:09:57.060 committing a Gnostic heresy, right? They're saying that being connected to this material realm

00:10:03.320 uh there's there's something higher than the material which is the supernatural spiritual

00:10:08.560 or preternatural really if they're connecting this weird realm is where actual all truth lies

00:10:14.700 and that they need to be more separated from what's in front of us in order to connect to

00:10:19.020 this higher spiritual the physical is is just um it's a hindrance it's a prison right i need to be

00:10:25.220 liberated my spirit needs to be liberated from its cell of of a body in order to tap into this

00:10:33.180 elite secret knowledge. Yeah, exactly. And what I find interesting about that is that

00:10:38.920 in order for me to truly understand who the father was, what did Jesus actually do? What

00:10:43.180 did the word do? He took on flesh. He took on flesh for me to get a proper understanding

00:10:47.700 of the father. So it's the opposite. Like we as humans are created with body and soul.

00:10:52.580 And one day we'll have glorified immortal bodies. Jesus Christ was the firstborn from the dead.

00:10:58.100 So the truth in which I inhabit that God has given me has given me for a reason, right? So

00:11:02.680 I get truth through general and special revelation, of course, found in the incarnation perfect work

00:11:07.980 of Jesus Christ, what is revealed in his word. But again, the word took on flesh, right? So I mean,

00:11:13.160 me personally- Yeah, in our eternal existence, I mean, that in itself is pretty profound to think

00:11:17.820 that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. So when we die, we will go in

00:11:24.640 spirit to be with the Lord, but not forever. We will go for a time, but eventually there will be

00:11:31.660 a final culmination to human history in this gospel age in a final physical return of Christ

00:11:38.960 and the resurrection of the dead, both those for damnation and those for glory. And then we will 0.65

00:11:47.260 receive back our bodies glorified now, resurrected and glorified, and our final existence, our

00:11:54.120 existence that actually is forever, that has no end, will be a physical existence. It won't just

00:12:01.160 be a spiritual existence it will be a spiritual and physical existence with physical bodies and

00:12:06.800 like to think that like when you think of god who is spirit you know like you know both 1689 and

00:12:12.440 the westminster he's a most pure spirit without um body parts or passions you know or john chapter

00:12:18.060 four you know like um you know the father is spirit god is spirit and those who worship him

00:12:22.780 must worship him in spirit and truth so you have this spirit god and yet his final climax like

00:12:30.980 like everything is like is is crescendoing into this greater and greater you know ultimate climate

00:12:37.380 but the final climax for his image-bearing creatures is the dirty rotten inferior flesh

00:12:44.880 is finally gone no drum roll please perfect physical existence yep the physical doesn't

00:12:52.300 go away. That is God's plan. And what God calls good, for us to say, oh, it's icky.

00:13:00.200 Real quick, before we continue with the show, I wanted to let you know that this is actually just

00:13:05.060 one episode of a 10-part series that we will be slowly releasing to the public on places like

00:13:12.020 YouTube and your favorite podcast platform over the coming months. However, if you want to get

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00:13:25.460 exclusively for our Patreon members over at patreon.com forward slash right response ministries.

00:13:33.700 Here are the titles for just a few of those episodes. We've got transhumanism and artificial

00:13:39.820 intelligence. We also have DMT and the astral realm. We also have neopaganism. And another

00:13:48.600 of my favorite episodes is an entire episode devoted to the grays. So again, head on over 0.99

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00:14:33.980 providing for you the best answers that we possibly can from the Word of God.

00:14:37.860 So don't delay. Go to patreon.com forward slash right response ministries and become a supporter today.

00:14:45.020 Yeah, and that's what people, when they're doing hallucinogenics, to get a higher form of knowledge, that's the error that they're committing, right?

00:14:51.580 It's a denial of the flesh. It's actually poisoning your flesh in order to loosen that silver cord again to reach something or some area.

00:15:00.320 So the question would be, we called it the astral realm, but really is, well, where are they going, right?

00:15:05.900 what is happening? And I think Paul actually gives a good example when he says caught up into the

00:15:11.160 third heaven, right? So we're talking about, well, what is Paul talking about? Well, the Bible

00:15:15.740 describes three different parts of heaven, right? We have the sky, we have space, right? Outside of

00:15:21.600 the sky. Then we also have where God dwells, caught up into the third heaven, which is outside

00:15:25.760 of the known cosmos. But when we actually have the Bible then describing demons and where they

00:15:31.480 inhabit, is it otherworldly? Is it a third heaven? No, he uses power of the air, waterless places,

00:15:39.260 meaning that it's not where God dwells. It's not where truth dwells, right? The way and the truth

00:15:44.160 and the life is Jesus. He exists in the third, the highest level of heaven. The error that these

00:15:49.380 people are committing really is that they think that's where they're going. They think they're

00:15:53.080 going to the embodiment of truth in this astral realm, but really where they're going is the air.

00:15:56.940 They're going to the power of the air, the waterless places, as the Bible describes, not their third heaven.

00:16:03.000 It's not where higher knowledge lies, but it's actually where these entities dwell.

00:16:08.000 That's helpful.

00:16:08.840 Yeah.

00:16:09.340 Yeah.

00:16:10.100 Okay.

00:16:11.040 Yeah.

00:16:11.540 And I think then the question is, I think you have even Christians now who are still already asking the question, like, could I take psychedelics?

00:16:21.980 Is it actually okay?

00:16:22.940 And I think this would be also just indicative of the zeitgeist of our age going from one versus two.

00:16:31.100 In one of the first interviews we ever did, we talked with Stephen Bancars. 0.99

00:16:34.960 He's a former New Ager. 0.92

00:16:36.400 And I remember in the very first interview I did with him, we did an overall view of just the New Age. 0.93

00:16:42.440 We were parsing old clips of Walter Martin in the 1970s and 80s talking about the New Age.

00:16:47.220 And he kind of gave his commentary sort of expanding on it.

00:16:50.600 And in it, he mentioned ayahuasca.

00:16:54.400 And Barney was like, wait, what's that?

00:16:56.220 Like, what are you talking about?

00:16:57.300 Is that some name of some deity or like, what is,

00:16:59.940 is that the name of some guru or something?

00:17:01.840 Like, I had no idea.

00:17:03.020 So I just, and I felt silly for asking him

00:17:05.340 because I'm like, I didn't know, I didn't want to ask,

00:17:07.180 but I was thinking back in my head, okay, what's ayahuasca?

00:17:09.480 But now, you know, five years later,

00:17:12.140 it's something I'm hearing,

00:17:13.700 I started hearing consistently more and more about.

00:17:16.060 And now it's become part of what used to be part of the fringe.

00:17:20.660 It used to be part of an old, you know,

00:17:22.920 it wouldn't be on people's minds regularly.

00:17:25.460 It's now a regular thing.

00:17:27.220 The same way how UFOs was referred to people living in their basement

00:17:30.860 who watched too many episodes of X-Files now is normalized.

00:17:34.120 It's on all the news stations.

00:17:35.200 I mean, just this last election cycle, you had Donald Trump being talked about.

00:17:38.760 You know, his son, Donald Trump Jr. was interviewing him.

00:17:43.180 It's like, are you going to ever tell us about what's going on at Roswell?

00:17:45.620 And then you also have numerous people like the Department of Defense

00:17:49.700 and in the Pentagon making statements about the existence saying, there is something out here,

00:17:54.300 but we don't know what these are. So you have that being normalized. You're seeing a lot of

00:17:58.520 things which are, they're related to the sphere and the world of paganism, but now you're seeing

00:18:04.200 normalization of that. And so what you're seeing, if you look at just the pinpoint of this whole

00:18:10.000 conversation, that the normalization of psychoactive use, psychoactive substances is a direct

00:18:15.200 correlation to the rise of neo-paganism in our culture because it's the the conversation behind

00:18:22.540 it is inherently spiritual because it's not just something you take for the sake of taking it

00:18:26.880 it's an it's inherently a spiritual gateway and that's why even with cultish i mean we deal

00:18:33.180 definitively we talk about definitive cults and the one commonality they ever seen a cult leader

00:18:38.780 has, there's always some private esoteric revelation that's internally verified. And

00:18:45.500 the ultimate authority is because I said so. And so what you actually see is a lot of these gurus

00:18:50.620 who are giving their knowledge is because I said so, is because basically, follow what I say,

00:18:56.240 because I looked at Toad in Costa Rica, and I went into an altered state of consciousness.

00:19:00.440 Therefore, you have to understand my truth. You're describing Joseph Smith right now.

00:19:06.080 Right. And substitute the toad with something, but it's basically the same thing.

00:19:10.820 Right. And it's silly and it's foolish because what they're trying to say is a lot of these 0.98

00:19:16.600 gurus who try and articulate what they found in the outside realm, they'll say, well, truth comes 0.98

00:19:21.300 within. Look to within for truth, but follow me because I'm the guru. It's self-refuting.

00:19:26.860 Dude, think about this. And what does Paul say when he went to the third heaven? He said there

00:19:30.420 was things that man, which he could not utter to men, but what are these people doing? They're

00:19:35.760 doing the inverse, right? They're not going to the third heaven. And then they're telling everyone

00:19:39.120 about these experiences. It's the opposite. They're going to the second heaven, maybe.

00:19:44.640 Right. Yeah. They're going to, it's the reverse of the incarnation, right? Like Jesus Christ.

00:19:49.320 They're going to the prince of this air. Exactly. Like it's the opposite of the incarnation really

00:19:54.560 because they're committing a Gnostic heresy. But what I find so funny about it is they're 0.97

00:19:59.420 actually using the materials of the earth to commit it. So if the material is something that

00:20:04.860 is bad, the flesh is bad, the material is bad, why are you taking a material object and putting

00:20:10.200 it in your body, creating a material poisoning in order to have a spiritual experience? I find it to

00:20:15.860 be counterproductive and illogical. Yeah, that's funny. I think about, well, here's something I

00:20:23.960 wanted to get to. What do you guys think about some of the testimonies of DMT and different

00:20:32.280 are psychedelics that have been used by governments, including our own.

00:20:37.880 Any thoughts on that?

00:20:40.000 Well, that would kind of go to, I mean, that would go to, you know,

00:20:43.620 you should talk about like MKUltra.

00:20:46.120 That is something that's irrefutable, it's incontrovertible.

00:20:49.080 We were telling you before, there's a book by Tom O'Neill

00:20:52.340 that we did an episode on a while back called Chaos.

00:20:54.620 And it was about Tom O'Neill as this journalist who was doing a,

00:20:58.120 he was doing an article,

00:21:00.240 a magazine piece

00:21:00.980 on Charles the Manson murders.

00:21:02.440 It was the 30th anniversary

00:21:03.460 of the Manson murders.

00:21:05.520 And there were just some things off.

00:21:07.040 He interviewed Vincent Bugliosi.

00:21:09.100 There's some things in his interview

00:21:10.260 that just seemed off.

00:21:11.980 And it created an obsession

00:21:13.680 where he studied the Manson case

00:21:14.820 for 20 years.

00:21:16.140 And what he came to the conclusion of

00:21:18.140 is that Manson was on some level

00:21:20.580 some sort of informant

00:21:21.720 for the government.

00:21:23.540 There's a lot of just

00:21:25.060 every component of the official story

00:21:27.660 of Manson doesn't, there's, there's, there's holes. It's with every aspect of it is Swiss

00:21:32.640 cheese. He doesn't give a definitive answer, but what he does mention is that the head of the,

00:21:37.100 everything within the NKUltra program was in, took place in San Francisco, which just so happens to

00:21:43.820 be where Manson started as Colt right outside, you know, he started in San Francisco and then

00:21:48.540 I believe he was right outside of LA at Spahn Ranch. And, but what you end up seeing is that

00:21:53.340 somebody who conveniently, you know, managed to have people kill on command through the uses of

00:21:58.100 LSD. And that was the argument. That was a whole way, that was how Vincent Bugliosi utilized the

00:22:04.980 Helter Skelter to convict Manson, even though he wasn't present at the crime. But what you end up

00:22:09.880 seeing is that somehow or another, he argues in a test that he was sort of a person who could get,

00:22:16.280 like, these people were someone who acted on command, but it ended up being almost a psyop

00:22:20.960 where, post-Manson murders, all the objections

00:22:23.800 to American policy in regards to the Vietnam War,

00:22:26.720 now all the hippies who are protesting it,

00:22:29.180 the appeal towards hippie, people started fearing them

00:22:32.380 versus being drawn to them, because all they could see

00:22:34.380 was Manson and Susan Atkins and all the girls in the courtroom

00:22:38.220 with the X's marked over their heads, 0.81

00:22:39.720 where they could see that.

00:22:41.640 So I think, you know...

00:22:44.060 Like, and it's not just the United States.

00:22:46.360 I mean, the government, there's so...

00:22:48.780 The government has always been not always in the vested interest

00:22:52.880 of wanting to help.

00:22:54.940 But yeah, there's a large part of history

00:22:57.760 where they've used psychoactive substances

00:22:59.820 for that use. I think it's incontrovertible.

00:23:02.640 I think the story of chaos,

00:23:04.400 that could be another episode in itself.

00:23:06.740 But you do see, even if there's realms of hearsay

00:23:12.940 regarding Tom O'Neill,

00:23:14.860 they are tapping into something real

00:23:16.660 in that MKUltra did utilize LSD and psychoactive substances

00:23:21.800 to try and get people to bend them to do their will.

00:23:25.180 Yeah, and I think there's a lot to say in terms of psychedelic drugs.

00:23:29.120 If we look at MKUltra and the tests that they were doing on American citizens

00:23:32.320 trying to create a Manchurian candidate,

00:23:34.180 which is essentially a mind-controlled super spy,

00:23:37.020 when we think about the link between mind control and psychedelics,

00:23:41.920 I think it says a lot, right?

00:23:43.060 Like, uh, me personally, when I was growing up, uh, in my prodigal son era, I did a lot

00:23:48.160 of psychedelics.

00:23:48.900 I never did DMT, but I did, uh, stuff called course eating cold and cough, which is abusing,

00:23:53.700 uh, pills really, uh, that you can buy over the counter in which you can trip for days.

00:23:58.440 I did a lot of mushrooms.

00:23:59.880 I did a lot of psychedelic drugs.

00:24:02.680 Uh, and what's funny is that you get pleasure from these substances.

00:24:07.500 Okay. 1.00

00:24:07.880 And I'm going to link something now going back to divine feminism. 0.99

00:24:11.300 All right.

00:24:11.720 I think people can be controlled by pleasure, right? 1.00

00:24:14.760 I think women can also control people by pleasure. 0.88

00:24:16.900 I think a society controlled by pleasure 0.96

00:24:19.540 is also a society that's very influenced by women, right? 1.00

00:24:24.120 So I think what we can find in terms of mind control

00:24:27.340 and a link with psychedelics is a feminized culture,

00:24:30.860 men who are ruled by their pleasures and passions.

00:24:33.520 And in reality, what kind of people do you want

00:24:36.700 when you're in a government, right?

00:24:38.340 You want people that you can control.

00:24:40.100 You can control with pleasure.

00:24:41.420 you can control with passion.

00:24:43.080 Not people who are self-governed

00:24:44.980 in thinking for themselves.

00:24:46.780 So we talk about-

00:24:47.300 You don't want sober people.

00:24:48.680 You don't want sober people.

00:24:49.820 Like Karl Marx, 1.00

00:24:50.980 he stated that religion

00:24:52.700 is the best opiate for the masses.

00:24:54.260 He's absolutely wrong.

00:24:56.020 He is absolutely wrong. 0.70

00:24:57.520 Religion and true religion

00:24:58.380 is the only thing that frees the masses

00:24:59.840 from a centralized form of government 0.95

00:25:02.120 that controls everything.

00:25:03.480 You know what's the best opiate for the masses?

00:25:06.320 Opium.

00:25:07.040 Exactly.

00:25:08.100 That's what I'm saying.

00:25:09.240 Like making, yeah, exactly.

00:25:10.140 Like rejecting Christ.

00:25:11.240 yeah, I know you're saying that, but rejecting Christ and then, and then having terrible 0.96

00:25:16.800 governors who they're not just, it's not just incompetent, but they're nefarious and evil and 0.95

00:25:21.320 sinister. And they make, they give the people everything they want all their debased, you know, 0.96

00:25:26.100 their lowest, you know, vices. And, and a lot of that being like substances that, that take away

00:25:34.900 your ability to think. Yeah, absolutely. And I, I see the fruit coming from that because I have

00:25:41.100 lot of individuals that I grew up with that were my friends that are, that are still enslaved to

00:25:46.100 this type of thinking, you know, like when I did these drugs, when I was younger, I didn't do them

00:25:50.760 to have a quote unquote spiritual experience. I did them to try to escape my life. You know what

00:25:55.320 I mean? It was a form of escapism, but also what I was doing though, was opening myself up to a

00:26:00.800 realm of thinking. That's a debased mind in which I thought truth or escape could actually occur

00:26:07.120 by poisoning my body, which isn't true. That's not how you find freedom. It's not in substances.

00:26:13.180 It's in the word made flesh. I need to feast on Christ, not feast on poison. But the thought

00:26:21.060 remains is that the culture that we live in, especially when controlled by drugs, what's the

00:26:26.700 fruit that it's produced so far with these individuals? I mean, there's the random Joe

00:26:30.780 Rogan who does some psychedelics and he can still have some form of manliness. But the question is,

00:26:35.860 well, what is the main fruit from, you know, taking DMT, from doing ayahuasca? We're seeing

00:26:42.240 a feminized culture that's controlled by its passions and its pleasures, but the true man

00:26:47.340 conquers passions and pleasures through Christ. Yeah, that's a really good point.

00:26:54.980 Right Response Ministries 2025 conference is a go. This is three days, full jam-packed conference

00:27:03.360 with eight main sessions, three to four hour and a half long panels, and an all-star super-based

00:27:09.660 lineup of speakers, 15 speakers in all. Who are they? Steve Dace, Jeff Durbin, Orne McIntyre,

00:27:16.720 Stephen Wolf, Brian Sauve, Andrew Isker, John Harris, Eric Kahn, A.D. Robles, Dan Burkholder,

00:27:24.160 the Christian Prince himself, Dusty Devers, Ben Garrett, David Reese, and yours truly,

00:27:29.760 Pastor Joel Webin. Again, this is April 3rd, 4th, and 5th, 2025, and the early registration is open

00:27:38.020 right now. This is the longest conference with the most speakers we've ever offered, and yet

00:27:44.020 it is our all-time lowest price. The early registration available today is only $140

00:27:50.620 for an adult. So go to rightresponseconference.com. Again, that is rightresponseconference.com

00:27:58.460 to register right now because the early registration will not last long.

00:28:04.560 Any final stories or testimonies or thoughts on this topic?

00:28:10.460 Yeah, I think when it comes to this is that it's important for Christians to just understand

00:28:16.140 how to deal with this. And I think, especially in the Reformed world, I think one of the things

00:28:20.920 would be very, very helpful is to get a healthy understanding of the supernatural. And so I think

00:28:26.820 most people who are in the form camp tend to also side

00:28:31.000 and kind of fall in the cessationist camp.

00:28:33.480 And I think there is, I would even call it sometimes

00:28:36.420 a realm of hyper-cessationism, where you only give precedent.

00:28:39.840 You tend to be very skeptical of giving any credence

00:28:43.320 to the existence, to the supernatural,

00:28:45.400 just because you've seen realms of hyper-carious mania abuse it.

00:28:50.080 So there's a tend to pendulum swing.

00:28:52.420 We get it. Benny Hinn is back.

00:28:54.240 But then you overreact and you're like,

00:28:56.620 There's no spiritual experiences whatsoever.

00:28:59.880 And to explain things away, and I think that's one of the reasons why a lot of former New Agers, they tend to just find themselves, even unintentionally, in a charismatic church.

00:29:10.280 Because you do see the one area in which, while I have friends who are charismatic or Pentecostal that I love as brothers, and I think one of the areas in which they are good at is they acknowledge the reality of the supernatural.

00:29:23.160 even though sometimes it's, many times it's to their detriment

00:29:27.120 because they go too far and give too much credence

00:29:29.500 to the authority of private experience.

00:29:32.000 But I think having a grounded understanding of the reality

00:29:36.040 of the supernatural and trusting God at his word

00:29:39.280 gives a gravitas to, while I have never been involved with the occult,

00:29:45.780 the first time I ever heard about it when I was,

00:29:47.820 we'll talk in later episodes about Mormonism

00:29:50.040 and understanding Joseph Smith's, you know, the fact that he was tried and convicted

00:29:54.640 as a sorcerer, as somebody who did glass looking, which is a form of occultism.

00:29:59.660 That was my first introduction to it.

00:30:03.060 But understanding the reality and gravitas behind what God says about the supernatural,

00:30:08.300 it creates a very powerful apologetic.

00:30:12.040 And I remember I was in a conversation with someone,

00:30:14.460 I was just at this business networking meeting,

00:30:17.140 and I ended up speaking with this lady about Burning Man.

00:30:20.040 And she said she last year, she's a former burner.

00:30:22.340 She had been a burning man a couple of times and just started having a conversation with her.

00:30:26.600 And I asked about her uses of psychedelics and DMT.

00:30:30.200 I know about what God says about it.

00:30:33.160 I know it makes you, I believe, I believe in the unseen realm because God says that it's there and it exists because the Bible is a dimensional book.

00:30:43.420 And so it gives a real constitutional reality, even though we can't see it with our naked eye, we can see it through the lens of scripture of what the unseen realm is. So believing New Agers experience. So when you have somebody who's coming in, say they're in counseling and they start talking about the supernatural experience, you can believe them. 1.00

00:31:06.340 you have to believe them because one god says you have god says this is a reality but if you don't

00:31:12.340 you'll be gaslighting them because there's a they're experiencing something that's real intangible

00:31:16.320 and so i was speaking with this lady and she was talking about her experiences with different you

00:31:22.700 know psilocybin mushrooms and dmt and i just said so what was it like when you talk with those

00:31:27.100 entities at three o'clock in the morning where they're initially friendly or hostile and she

00:31:31.640 looked like what who is this person is this guy some sort of prophet or something but it was like

00:31:38.160 you know the fact that she like i believed her because no i did i've never i didn't i don't know

00:31:45.960 her experience i don't know what the astral realm is i don't ever intend to see what it because god

00:31:50.360 says don't go there but i know that realm exists through the lens of scripture but through that

00:31:55.660 I was able to articulate what that realm was, and I was also able to articulate the gospel,

00:32:03.940 because she did talk about how those entities were hostile, and they were scaring her.

00:32:08.120 And the one commonality that all New Agers have, people who have gone down that realm,

00:32:13.380 who have been in the astral realm, those entities, and it just seemed nice and friendly,

00:32:18.600 and whether it's sexual pleasure or esoteric knowledge or an understanding of higher

00:32:25.540 consciousness, they end up turning on you. They become hostile. There's experiences on YouTube

00:32:32.800 influencers who are in the New Age who will talk about the dangers of having entities still

00:32:37.520 attached to you when you go from your astral body back into your physical body. The one commonality

00:32:43.560 that every New Ager has and how their effectual calling began the process is that the entities 0.82

00:32:51.400 turned on them. They became hostile, and all of a sudden, they felt inclined to call out to Jesus

00:32:58.720 of Nazareth. And all of a sudden, it stopped. And that was, wait a minute, what was that?

00:33:07.460 What was that? I've tried, and these entities have been attacking me and giving me nightmares

00:33:13.280 and all this stuff, and I've tried everything. I've tried burning incense. I've tried

00:33:16.820 seances, I try to do a different positive, you know, positive energy, like sort of psychoactive

00:33:23.640 ceremony to get rid of those entities, and then I take on new entities. Now it's gone. Who is this

00:33:28.620 Jesus of Nazareth? And that leads them to a Bible, and that's all of a sudden that leads them to

00:33:34.180 acknowledge Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. And all of a sudden, they have this conviction

00:33:38.780 that I have to get rid of all my tarot cards, all my astrology charts. I can't sell those in

00:33:46.420 I have to burn those. Like, this is independent. They come to their own fruition because of this.

00:33:51.860 And so, that's where, you know, you see not only the reality of believing in the supernatural realm and seeing that, you get to see, especially, you know, as Reformed people, we love those five points, right? 0.90

00:34:04.860 So, we talk about total depravity, irresistible grace, or effectual calling, like the stories of New Age testimonies. When you hear those, like, I don't understand. I hear those like, I have to be a Calvinist.

00:34:17.840 Like, because you see God affectionately drawing people through himself, and he's utilizing the unseen realm. And I think that's an area to which the reform rule, we have to reform that area, because we all would easily give credence to somebody who, if they, let's just say, I've heard testimonies before, somebody is out on, you know, the college district, and they've just burned the candle at both ends.

00:34:43.980 They're partying and drinking and just living a life of debauchery, and all of a sudden, there's somebody preaching on a street corner, and they're drunk, and they just blur some obscenities, and somebody hands them a tract, and they stuff it in their pocket, and they wake up the next morning hungover, just feeling devoid of life, and all of a sudden, they have a moment of sobriety and say, like, I can't live like this, and they pull that tract out, and they start reading on there.

00:35:10.540 on that tract, the gospel, say it's a Ray Comfort way of the master tract, and the gospel's

00:35:15.480 articulated, and all of a sudden, they're like, oh, I think, yeah, maybe God's law, maybe I have

00:35:21.600 broken that. That's why I, you know, there's no peace at the every single, you know, I'm trying

00:35:26.160 to drown my sorrows, but my sorrows are really good swimmers. And then all of a sudden, that

00:35:30.640 leads me to a Bible, and that leads to conviction of sin. Like, we're okay with accepting that 0.53

00:35:36.280 testimony, because it's all something tangibly we can see. Like I say, a college district,

00:35:42.020 we can see that. We've seen that. You know, we've seen people who are drunk and intoxicated.

00:35:46.880 We've seen people, if you've seen people who are street preachers, you see people who are hostile.

00:35:50.420 We get that. We've seen that. And then you see, you know, people who are at church telling their

00:35:56.080 testimony, they're being baptized, and they're professing Christ. We see that with our naked

00:36:00.280 eye, but there's a supernatural reality going behind that. But Christ is king over the supernatural

00:36:06.940 and the material and the immaterial realm. That's what Colossians 1 talks about.

00:36:12.060 And so, in the same token, when we hear a story of somebody who is an ex-New Ager who 0.98

00:36:18.540 all of a sudden has, you know, you might call like an initial like vision of Jesus for being 0.93

00:36:22.780 attacked by entities, and this crazy stuff that's happening in the supernatural realm,

00:36:28.060 and then their effectual happenings,

00:36:30.020 we tend to be super skeptical of that.

00:36:32.400 And I don't think we should be. 0.72

00:36:33.700 I think especially as being Reformed Christians

00:36:36.180 and believing in the sovereignty of God

00:36:37.840 and Sola Scriptura,

00:36:39.120 we should be able to address

00:36:41.560 and to minister to those people with confidence

00:36:43.500 because we have a complete framework,

00:36:47.580 a geographical topographical map

00:36:49.840 of the unseen realm through the lens of Scripture

00:36:52.400 to where we can believe them

00:36:53.820 and point them to the North Star,

00:36:55.980 which is Christ,

00:36:56.800 to where they can find hope.

00:36:59.500 And that's where, you know,

00:37:00.680 when it comes to the whole psychedelic experience,

00:37:03.700 Walter Martin, you know, our show is based on,

00:37:06.120 you know, it's sort of a continuing homage

00:37:07.720 to the late Dr. Walter Martin

00:37:08.880 who wrote the book Kingdom of the Cults.

00:37:11.040 There's also another great book

00:37:12.100 called Kingdom of the Yaw Cult,

00:37:13.320 which is assembled by Jill Martin,

00:37:16.060 who is, you know, Walter Martin's daughter is assembling.

00:37:19.240 It's just sort of a compilation of his lectures

00:37:20.740 and talks on the subject.

00:37:22.500 But in one of his prayers, he said this.

00:37:26.100 He just said, you know, they're, they're telling us all the occultists like Helena Blavatsky or these other, you know, Alice Bailey's and these people, you know, also women, a lot of these women who are into this esoteric stuff, the ones who really normalize the new age and the occult in the Western world, especially.

00:37:43.000 But, you know, they like Walter Martin would say that they are telling us to reach out beyond to try and transcend.

00:37:50.020 But you have told us to draw near to you and you will draw near to us.

00:37:54.780 and like that's like that's what we have to do and it's very easy in this world especially when

00:37:59.900 it comes to the new age and the occult to sort of sometimes you know look at them and almost sort of

00:38:05.080 look at them in a disparaging way but in reality they are going after they're trying you know

00:38:12.120 they're made in the image of god they're trying to transcend with the spiritual fervor but they

00:38:15.760 are going to burn the candle at both ends because there's no way to ascend they are stuck in the

00:38:21.720 internal wheel of oneness. That's why when it comes to this, you know, that's why the gospel

00:38:26.080 is so important because at the end of the day, those who try and find peace through the realm

00:38:32.520 of a psychoaptic substance, there's no end in sight. It's just a continuation of that. Is there

00:38:38.300 anything last things you want to add on? Yeah. It's like their body is the mediator

00:38:41.220 to a higher level of consciousness, right? And your body's not the mediator between you and God.

00:38:47.360 it's the God, man, Jesus Christ, right? When thinking about these experiences that people

00:38:53.420 have with DMT, you were talking about how we should accept what they're telling us. And we

00:38:58.580 absolutely should. We have it in scripture in, cause you were even asking the question earlier,

00:39:03.120 Joel, what about these people who have experiences? They have contacts with certain entities and

00:39:06.400 stuff. Well, in scripture in Deuteronomy 13, it says, if a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises

00:39:10.340 among you and does what produces miracles, signs and wonders, right? But if they lead you after

00:39:15.580 another God, God you have not known, don't believe them. So we have there already a precedent in the

00:39:20.760 Bible that there's things that can happen. Right. The false prophet is not just one who makes a

00:39:24.780 prophecy that ultimately doesn't come true. It could even be producing true signs and wonders,

00:39:30.440 but does it lead you to God? Right. Exactly. So when we think of them, the false prophet,

00:39:35.520 if they're not the mediator between God and man and the voice for God, they're the mediator between

00:39:39.740 God or between man and something else. So when we're thinking about psychedelic substances,

00:39:44.640 is it's the same type of prophet or mediator.

00:39:47.060 It's taking you somewhere away from God

00:39:49.860 and bringing you somewhere where you do not find truth.

00:39:53.560 But according to God's word,

00:39:55.340 when we're having conversations with people

00:39:56.980 that are literally doing these things,

00:39:58.820 we can't gaslight them in their experience.

00:40:00.900 But what we can help them see

00:40:02.200 is that their experiences don't determine truth.

00:40:05.120 The barometer of truth is God's word.

00:40:07.980 This was a place that you should have not gone at all.

00:40:11.020 There's a reason God loves us so much rich in his mercy 1.00

00:40:13.680 that he tells us not to deal in pharmakia. 1.00

00:40:16.420 He says, don't sacrifice your bodies 0.90

00:40:18.340 and poison yourself to try to be the mediator

00:40:21.220 between God and man.

00:40:22.700 Focus on the true mediator

00:40:24.480 who sacrificed his own flesh for us,

00:40:27.260 which is Jesus Christ,

00:40:28.260 in order for us to be indwelt with the Holy Spirit,

00:40:30.300 to have a relationship with God.

00:40:31.980 Like you said, in Hebrews,

00:40:33.040 he draws near to us so we can draw near to him.

00:40:35.500 Like it's a beautiful thing.

00:40:37.520 Psychedelic substances will not do that.

00:40:41.480 Scientology does the same thing.

00:40:42.860 the bridge to total freedom, it will never end.

00:40:47.180 You will go after one drug, another drug,

00:40:49.680 and another drug, and another drug.

00:40:51.300 It will never end.

00:40:52.360 You'll never be wise enough.

00:40:53.460 You'll never be smart enough.

00:40:54.820 You'll never be disconnected from the material realm enough

00:40:57.120 to bridge the gap between you and God.

00:40:59.400 It's only done through Jesus Christ.

00:41:01.340 Yeah, and even too, I mean, you're doing the series right now,

00:41:04.800 The Jury Quarter with Brian and Ben from Haunted Cosmos.

00:41:07.840 I remember it wasn't, I think on X, I saw a tweet.

00:41:12.140 I still call it a tweet, even though it is X.

00:41:13.860 Are they still called tweets?

00:41:15.200 They still are?

00:41:15.740 They're X's, bro. 0.59

00:41:16.560 They're X's?

00:41:17.100 They're X's.

00:41:17.960 All my X's are in Texas.

00:41:19.660 We are in Texas.

00:41:20.700 But yeah, there was, I think there was a post that either Brian or Ben shared,

00:41:25.380 and maybe it was on the Haunted Cosmos X page.

00:41:28.380 But it was just somebody who was a fan, became a fan of their podcast.

00:41:33.080 And through the whole process, that there might have been a couple of episodes,

00:41:36.260 I got to catch up.

00:41:37.580 But he, well, they were talking about the same thing we're talking about,

00:41:41.260 the nature of the supernatural realm

00:41:43.100 and psychoactive psychedelics,

00:41:45.400 whether or not you should take them.

00:41:46.860 But I think the person just said,

00:41:48.260 hey, I just want to say thank you

00:41:49.560 because it was through your show

00:41:50.980 and through the content that they addressed

00:41:53.240 that I became convicted,

00:41:54.120 I can't take these psychoactive substances

00:41:56.020 because this doesn't glorify God.

00:41:58.640 And so, like, praise God for that.

00:42:00.360 And I think what you are seeing,

00:42:02.440 like, why the appeal of, like, this conversation?

00:42:04.420 Like, why did Haunted...

00:42:05.980 I mean, Ben and Brian are doing a great, great job

00:42:08.340 with our show, very well done, very well produced.

00:42:10.380 But I think, honestly, one of the reasons for the success that even they've had is because they're tapping into something that is, we all know what's going on.

00:42:20.880 We all know this re-enchantment is going on.

00:42:24.180 And they're giving a true, tangible reality to it, but giving a biblical precedent behind a how-then-shall-we-live, like Francis Schaeffer approach.

00:42:33.600 And I think that's what you end up seeing.

00:42:37.080 So you're able to help people walk through, like, this is why I shouldn't take this psychoactive substance, you know, and that's, you know, and honestly, this is an area where we're supposed to train my kids, you know, like, I'm going to have to probably have like talks, you know, with my son about this is why if a friend tells you, you know, the same kid might pull out a cigarette, you know, from the, I got from the, I have a pack of cigarettes, you know, that was a cool and rebellious thing to do.

00:43:02.200 I remember I was with my neighbors, you know, on this horse property I live up over in Gilbert, and they snuck a beer out of this dad's fridge. And like, we all like took this Bud Light beer and we thought it was super cool and rebellious to go around and take, you know, swigs of it, you know, and I thought that was a cool rebellious thing, you know, back then, you know, like our kids are going to be probably say, hey, I did this trip. Do you want to know what the Astro Realm is? Do you want to go with me?

00:43:26.360 Like, that's a real thing that, you know, as we're going through this re-enchantment, like, we're going to have to train our kids about. We're going to have, you know, Burning Man. Like, these things, you're going to have to give them, understand, like, one versus two, and understanding the worldview implications of that, and ultimately, you know, what is our goal as a Christian to love God with all our heart, soul, mind, and strength in a world where things, people like the Sean Ryan show, like, he is very popular among conservatives.

00:43:55.900 I mean, he has a lot of conservative guests and he, he has a lot of good content, but he does push the normalization of psychedelics among veterans that deal with PTSD. So now you're seeing it like intergrained, even in the, you know, secular conservative world, you know, somewhat, you know, general, you know, very generic Christianity, like you're seeing that ingrained there.

00:44:16.540 So it's a very much, you know, this whole thing, if I could just sum it up, this is very much a how then shall we live.

00:44:22.560 We can't stick our heads in the sand.

00:44:24.520 If we're going to be truly faithful as Christians, we have to understand the spiritual age of what we're in.

00:44:31.960 And knowing that this isn't my dirty, this is something brand new, there's nothing new under the sun, but we need to have a formulated apologetic for it.

00:44:38.760 And to be able to train our children to self-govern, to family-govern, but also to love our neighbor and to explain the hope of the gospel that there's only one way to truly transcend, and that's through Christ.

00:44:49.780 Not to try and find peace through a psychoactive substance.

00:44:55.860 Yep. That's good. Andrew, can you say what you did again? I feel like it'd be great to end the episode with just the reverse of the true gospel.

00:45:04.300 is trying to sacrifice my body in order to ascend instead of... Say that. How did you say that?

00:45:10.240 That's the truth. We are creatures that are innately created to worship. We want to have

00:45:16.300 a connection with God, but we're sinful human beings. And in our sin, we look to sacrifice

00:45:22.360 our own flesh, poison our bodies through psychedelic substances in order to have a

00:45:27.180 connection with what they would call the divine. But that's false worship, and that's trying to

00:45:32.460 sacrifice yourself. It's asceticism. The reality is, is that Jesus Christ is God in the flesh and

00:45:38.580 he died on the cross with his body. You know, his blood was shed for me on the mercy seat of God

00:45:44.100 so that through belief in him, not the sacrifice of myself, I can actually have a relationship

00:45:49.900 with God being indwelt by the Holy Spirit who can show me and teach me his ways. He doesn't

00:45:56.060 want my sacrifice, right? He didn't want Isaac. He wanted to send his son, but looking for anything

00:46:00.540 else will give you a cipher or a siphon to something that is other than God. The prophet,

00:46:06.720 whether it be mushrooms or Joseph Smith, will teach you and lead you after another God, a God

00:46:11.120 which you have not known. The God who we know did it through his humility in Jesus Christ. We didn't

00:46:17.660 deserve it. It's through grace and mercy and my belief in him. I can have a relationship with him

00:46:21.400 through his death, burial, and resurrection. Amen. All right. Thanks for tuning in. And this was

00:46:26.840 episode three. This is a 10-part series, so feel free to take the journey with us every Friday at

00:46:33.180 4 p.m. Central Time. We're launching these to the public, but if you want to skip ahead and get ad

00:46:39.720 free access, early access to all 10 episodes, it's available now at patreon.com forward slash

00:46:45.700 Right Response Ministries. Patreon.com forward slash Right Response Ministries. All right,

00:46:50.840 thanks for tuning in. Real quick before you go, we hope that you enjoyed the episode and we hope

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The NXR Podcast - July 19, 2024

THE FRIDAY SPECIAL - DMT & The Astral Realm ｜ Ep 3 with @TheCultishShow

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