The NXR Podcast - THE FRIDAY SPECIAL - We’re Sorry Christian Nationalism Is Happening To You

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00:00:30.000 Okay, here we are. This is the final episode of our 10-part series. Myself,

00:00:49.500 Pastor Joel Webin, and Dr. Stephen Wolf, and we have been talking about all things

00:00:53.200 Christian nationalism following roughly the outline of your book, The Case for Christian

00:00:58.400 nationalism, but it's not just following the book. So for those who read the book,

00:01:03.240 I certainly wouldn't conclude that, oh, well, you know, been there, done that, bought the t-shirt.

00:01:08.000 I think there's a lot of things beyond the book that we've discussed.

00:01:10.760 You can buy a t-shirt, by the way.

00:01:11.780 Yeah. Oh, really? Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. So you could buy the t-shirt, but I think

00:01:16.740 we've discussed things, you know, beyond just the scope of the book that were fascinating,

00:01:21.380 if nothing else, by virtue of the fact that I'm on the show also and can't help myself.

00:01:26.700 kind of say whatever you want it's your show right you could yeah talk about america throwing

00:01:31.420 the antioch declaration i did you know so our last episode we did the antioch declaration probably

00:01:36.220 our spiciest was episode four we got into israel and somehow somehow i like what you told me last

00:01:43.580 night you're like joel i don't know i don't know if it actually correlates like and i my response

00:01:49.340 was but but were you not entertained that's what i tried to in the fourth episode we talked about

00:01:53.900 Israel and I did a silly little trope and comparing it to Atlantis. And so lots of

00:01:59.800 fascinating things. I think many helpful things, all of them interesting things. But in our final

00:02:06.000 episode, in the name of the spirit of helpfulness, we wanted to get really practical and move away

00:02:11.980 from the political philosophy, move away from some of the theology. Some of that will be here,

00:02:16.940 I'm sure, but we just wanted to try to raise and answer the question, okay, if I'm sold

00:02:23.920 and Christian nationalism is the way to go, how do we do it? Where do we go from here? Because

00:02:30.220 I think that's, you know, I'm a post-mill guy, you're all-mill. But some of the post-mill guys,

00:02:35.260 not all of them, Ogden, they're post-mill. And I think they're more like me. Andrew Isker is

00:02:40.820 post-mill he's more like me ad robles um but there are some post-millennial guys who um they have a

00:02:48.300 really clear picture in their mind of z and they know what's happening presently a but b c d e f

00:02:56.380 like there's not a whole lot of it's just yeah other than personal evangelism and maybe god

00:03:02.380 sends revival and we get a bunch of enough regenerate hearts that um everybody will just

00:03:08.380 they'll vote in the kingdom of god and uh and that's one of the things i think that appealed

00:03:13.900 to me with christian nationalism i am still post-millennial in my post-millennial in my

00:03:18.140 eschatology but i liked christian nationalism because of its practical helpfulness like i felt

00:03:24.540 like the christian nationalist guys were a little bit less of the persuasion of um

00:03:30.540 this is going to happen in 50 000 years instead the christian nationalist guys were saying

00:03:35.660 we can't promise it's going to happen but we think it could happen and by god's grace uh there's

00:03:42.600 actually clear steps that we can take it could happen even in our lifetimes and that's appealing

00:03:47.860 to me so if we could talk about some of those steps that in our lifetime that could make a

00:03:54.280 serious difference for our kids yeah this is the question of what to do next is that is the hardest

00:04:01.860 question for me to answer. Uh, I, I, I wrote the book, it's 10 chapters, an intro, and then I get

00:04:08.500 to the end and I'm thinking, okay, they're going to want to know what do we do now? Right. You've

00:04:15.140 read, you've somehow made it through 400 pages of this book. Um, now I need to, I need something

00:04:22.700 practical of, of what to do. And I have to admit that I, I did not know what to say. Um, because,

00:04:28.620 it's a different question.

00:04:31.880 The question of whether or not

00:04:33.340 there'd be civil government

00:04:34.500 before the fall,

00:04:35.740 that's something I can tackle.

00:04:37.800 But then in the real world

00:04:39.240 with the complex dynamics,

00:04:42.540 with the left controlling

00:04:43.580 the institutions,

00:04:45.120 with a lot of eager people

00:04:46.300 to do something

00:04:47.040 in their own individual sphere,

00:04:49.080 their own vocation,

00:04:50.940 it was something that I didn't,

00:04:52.580 at the time, two years ago,

00:04:55.040 did not feel prepared to answer.

00:04:57.280 And even to this day,

00:04:58.620 it's still a difficult thing to, uh, to address. Um, and so when I wrote the epilogue, it was me

00:05:04.640 just sitting down and typing out a bunch of thoughts. And then I got 39 or 40 of them.

00:05:11.860 And I said, that's all I got. Um, but in there I did say like, Hey, this is, this is not just

00:05:17.980 my thing. Like this is, I say something effective. We need the political theorists. We need the

00:05:23.380 foot soldiers. We need the popularizers. We need the average guy who's got a plumbing business or

00:05:29.780 a landscaping business. Like we need those guys. We need the military officers, you know,

00:05:34.300 we need all these people in their different various vocations to think through of what do

00:05:39.040 I do now? So I think a lot of what we're going to talk about now, it has to be contextualized,

00:05:44.460 but at the individual level, you have to think. But so there are some thoughts I have,

00:05:50.600 and I'm curious what you think as well.

00:05:53.060 I think that,

00:05:55.340 like they say there's like an epidemic

00:05:56.580 of a sort of loneliness.

00:05:58.160 Yes.

00:05:58.740 I don't know if that's a younger generation.

00:06:01.920 It's not something I've experienced.

00:06:03.740 I married kind of young and so,

00:06:06.940 but I know among a lot of young people

00:06:09.040 there is that sort of thing.

00:06:10.540 And there's also a feeling of isolation.

00:06:12.640 Even if you're married,

00:06:14.000 you discover Joel Webin

00:06:16.100 and you start listening to him

00:06:17.340 and you become convinced of patriarchy

00:06:19.240 and you listen to me

00:06:20.280 you're becoming convinced of Christian nationalism. And in your wife, it's harder to

00:06:24.440 get her on board with that, especially if you're in your 40s or whatever it is. And so people feel

00:06:29.820 very isolated. So one thing I would say, and it's one thing I'm doing, is that every other week

00:06:34.920 I meet with a group of guys. We have an email list. It's like 20, 30 people. And ordinarily,

00:06:44.060 we discuss an American Reformer article. And we usually get off topic within five minutes. But

00:06:49.080 the idea is that we're coming together and we're generally like-minded and we develop friendships

00:06:55.360 and we learn what this guy does and what he does and you can use their services if he does this

00:07:00.160 or that and you start the networks and then you find out that this guy knows this guy and and so

00:07:05.860 it's a way for you to gain friends of like-minded people so you're not just stuck on the internet

00:07:10.800 with your your anon friends which is good which is fine but it's good to have it in person so if

00:07:17.860 you're able and there's a location, just meet every other week. Um, so that's just a simple

00:07:23.620 thing. But in terms of the friendship, like that's been really great. Uh, and you learn a lot,

00:07:29.380 like, like just the average guy, um, you, you learn like a huge amount from that guy. So

00:07:35.280 that's one piece of advice I'd give. Yeah. That's great. Yeah. We, um, similar. So yeah,

00:07:43.100 I would, I would certainly agree with that. Um, you have to have relationships because so much,

00:07:47.680 of um right now among you know the new right the dissident right the you know whatever um

00:07:54.920 i think some uh some of our friends in moscow called it the uh the dank right uh like not even

00:08:01.980 right but right yeah um the the dank right with a t i actually like that one i i'm happy to i was

00:08:09.520 like hey that's pretty cool i'll you know i mean like dank memes that's an old like old internet

00:08:13.660 at things. So now they're bringing it back. Yeah. But anyways, whatever you want to call it,

00:08:19.220 Christian Nationalist, you know, our, our guys, our team, the people who people like Moscow or

00:08:26.660 I'm sorry, Ogden, Warren McIntyre, guys who like his show, guys who listen to you, listen to me,

00:08:34.640 listen to Contra Moondum, CJ and Isker are, you know, so anyways, if you're, if you're guys like

00:08:41.580 that my point is that um there's a lot of camaraderie there's a lot of um collaborating

00:08:47.920 but so much of it really is online and so i'm just saying all this to affirm what you said

00:08:53.420 um that's not enough uh now i i think that that is helpful i don't want to disparage that because

00:08:59.320 you know people always say like uh twitter's not real life x is not real life and and i know what

00:09:04.460 they're saying i think that in one sense that is true um uh you know because there's there's a

00:09:09.900 whole swath of a type of person that i think is probably the majority of people who aren't on x

00:09:14.020 at the same time though um i've made real life relationships from x like it is real life yeah

00:09:20.720 at least in some regard um because there's guys who i now have spent time with and i wouldn't

00:09:26.820 know them otherwise and so it's like x is i think a great place not only the coliseum you know it's

00:09:33.120 it's not really the public square it's it's not a discourse it's uh it's battle it's war so it's

00:09:38.200 the Colosseum, you go there to fight. And as Christians, we want to fight well. But that

00:09:44.200 doesn't just mean we want to fight, you know, in a moral fashion. We want to fight well, meaning

00:09:48.060 like we also would like to fight and win. And so doing both, you know, fighting in a moral manner

00:09:54.660 and fighting in a victorious manner, actually being efficient and successful. But another

00:09:59.980 purpose I think of X is the fight and pushing ideas forward and pushing on the Overton window

00:10:06.740 and permissible discourse expanding that uh but also it's a great place not for friendship um not

00:10:14.120 not to um not to have friends but to make friends and uh and so i would say you know for guys who

00:10:20.980 are on the distant right who follow us um in some ways it's less important your your uh interactions

00:10:29.260 with with steven wolf you know or joel webin it's it's more so uh down in the comment thread

00:10:35.580 your interactions with each other, you know, and then following each other and then DMing each

00:10:39.920 other and networking with each other. That's, this is why conferences matter. I mean, all the

00:10:43.920 content you can find online, you know, like who cares about, you know, what, like, why do people

00:10:48.480 go to conferences? I think it's just to, even if it's just two days out of the year, it's to remind

00:10:53.320 yourself that you're not alone, that you're not crazy, that there's actually real flesh and blood

00:10:57.040 people. And it's not just bots on the internet, but like they represent real people who actually

00:11:02.720 agree with you. You know, it's to maintain sanity. And so I think, you know, use X. My point is use

00:11:08.660 X, use conferences, use these venues. But remind yourself that these things aren't sufficient to

00:11:19.140 have friendship, but they can be highly effective to make friendship. And then upon making the

00:11:26.020 friendship, then create some other kind of context. So like I created, you know, and I have

00:11:31.680 plenty of friendships but but for the sake of others i created um a cohort and um of guys who

00:11:39.460 were following me and some of the you know the people who who were most um participating the

00:11:44.220 most and and commenting the most and sharing my post the most and um and i like found a way to

00:11:49.840 kind of collect these guys got about a hundred of them and and got their emails and reached out

00:11:54.920 and now they're all uh and set up a trip and i said hey you know like i'm willing to do if you

00:12:00.280 guys are interested and they were all eager but like i'm willing to do a quarterly zoom call with

00:12:04.740 all of us where i'm not talking the whole time i'm talking but but we're all able to correspond

00:12:10.220 two hours in call once a quarter um uh and and then interactions you know whether it's a group

00:12:17.740 chat or whatever uh on a on a more daily basis and then an annual trip and so we've got all these

00:12:24.320 guys that are coming actually in january so by the time this airs that will have already passed

00:12:30.260 um but uh but i'm excited like they're going to come and spend a weekend come to church on sunday

00:12:35.380 arrive on friday and we're just gonna you know hang out and smoke cigars and and there's not

00:12:41.740 really much of an agenda we'll talk like we'll talk about social media strategy but then we're

00:12:46.380 also going to talk like practically about like you know business and stuff and like hey so you're

00:12:51.220 you're a lawyer and this guy needs a lawyer you know or like you're doing this thing you're five

00:12:55.960 years into your landscaping business you're one year in you know and like and yeah so those kinds

00:13:00.140 of things um so anyways i i think you're right is uh friendship is key um this the the social

00:13:07.240 internet friendship is uh is not sufficient uh but it is a great springboard for making friends

00:13:14.720 but then finding context in real life for keeping friends yeah so doing doing some of that yeah

00:13:21.640 i think yeah along those lines uh also is uh yeah like helping each other out in like once you once

00:13:33.620 you know these guys and you know their problems you know their their their uh like let's say

00:13:39.620 financial or employment problems uh if you have a strong business you should consider hiring that

00:13:47.000 person like you could if you know the guy and you know he's a good guy and he has a potential to be

00:13:53.440 competent at that job you might have another hire that you're looking at and you think that guy

00:13:59.640 knows what he's doing but he's also not a christian right or he is a christian but he's not aligned

00:14:05.800 um ideologically or politically then hire the hire the guy who you think has potential for that job

00:14:13.040 bring him in into that employment um and build the build that up i i mean if someone is doxed

00:14:20.780 and they lose their job right find some way if you can to hire that guy right um if you know a

00:14:27.400 guy who has a lot of potential to be a sort of influencer um but if he becomes an influencer

00:14:34.400 he'll get fired well maybe that's a good guy for you to hire so then he can become that he can do

00:14:38.800 that with his own name

00:14:41.020 and all that. So there's just

00:14:42.800 all these different ways that if you think

00:14:44.700 think of all of the various

00:14:46.280 resources you have.

00:14:48.660 The ability to employ a guy is a resource.

00:14:51.380 Huge resource.

00:14:52.640 Think about that. And this also

00:14:54.700 brings up the fact that

00:14:55.760 you've emphasized before

00:14:58.840 pursue wealth,

00:15:00.880 pursue your vocation, be the best you can

00:15:02.920 be at that, and see

00:15:04.820 that as a

00:15:06.780 means for you to help

00:15:08.800 the the common good which is opposed to the good we have the sort of good we have today

00:15:14.720 um so orient all those things around that yep um and also doing that people that's how just like

00:15:20.840 the average person who doesn't have fancy degrees or cameras and lights uh can can make i mean

00:15:27.880 really any sort of movement or any kind of change it happens it's it happens because there's a lot

00:15:34.340 of regular guys doing ordinary things. Like there's always the extraordinary, like you got

00:15:39.520 the big figure, you got the name, you got the great man, but it's those little guys who are

00:15:43.720 like, you know, being the foot soldiers for the movement. Yeah. It won't work without them. Um,

00:15:49.040 yeah. One of the ways that I've, um, Oh, real quick, I was going to say, uh, the same kind of

00:15:54.160 concept of providing, um, protection and impunity and those kinds of things at a vocational level.

00:16:01.600 if you are a business owner by hiring a guy who it's not just a charity, like he will work hard,

00:16:09.340 he'll do a good job, he's a good Christian man, but the world would hate him, not because he's

00:16:12.920 objectively a bad guy, but the world will malign him. And when I say the world, sadly, I mean,

00:16:17.600 many evangelicals as well, they would just say, oh, he's a terrible person.

00:16:21.320 They might be the worst. 0.64

00:16:22.180 They might be the worst, probably will be. And so you can provide, you can be a shield and provide

00:16:28.060 protection as a business owner. You can also do that. Um, and it's sad that this even has to be

00:16:34.440 done, but I think it bears saying, uh, you can also do that as a pastor. It's like one way to

00:16:39.460 push Christian nationalism further is we need, um, we need guys, you know, um, business owners

00:16:46.340 on the right. We also need pastors on the right. And you would think that they, they, you know,

00:16:51.540 of course pastors are on the right. Not really. You know, like, like you need, you like, you

00:16:56.620 actually need because here's the thing like um steven wolf needs a church and i won't share any

00:17:02.160 details you know but uh but the fact that i'm not going to share any details illustrates the point

00:17:06.440 that i'm making right like that um i am a part of a church by the way you are of course of course

00:17:12.140 but my point is yeah right yeah but the fact um you could not go to any church sadly and that's

00:17:18.880 i think that's terrible that's a shame um and so what i'm saying is that like we need christian

00:17:24.900 nationalist pastors even, so that guys who are good Christian men, but by normie evangelical

00:17:35.440 standards are viewed as monsters. Now, hear me, it's imperative that when evangelicals call you

00:17:42.480 a monster, that you actually are not. There are real monsters in the world. There are real men

00:17:48.820 who are terrible men. So don't be one of them. But for those who are labeled as monsters,

00:17:55.400 not just by the left, but even by conservative, neo-conservative evangelical Christians,

00:18:01.440 those guys need churches. So those guys need to be employed. So we need Christian nationalist

00:18:06.460 bosses, business owners. They also need churches. We need Christian nationalist pastors who are

00:18:12.840 willing to say, I'll take that young guy and not that he can do whatever he wants, but I'm going

00:18:20.300 to walk with him. I'm going to shepherd him and I'm not going to crush him. And he can be a member

00:18:26.920 in good standing in our church. So that's another thing. I think that's crucial. And I've said it

00:18:33.600 many times that the pastor doesn't have to be an expert on politics, nor does he have to preach on

00:18:40.700 politics all the time or all those things. You prefer that he doesn't. If you remember my church,

00:18:46.800 you'd probably be like, all right, Joel, nice try. I've changed a little bit on that. That's

00:18:50.340 mainly because I thought most pastors are horrible in politics. But I've changed a little bit on

00:18:56.080 that. But I think one of the most important roles of a pastor is it's like a chaplain in the

00:19:05.240 military. So the chaplain in the military is not in the chain of command as a chaplain,

00:19:12.980 but he ministers to the people as they're doing their war fighting. So he's not telling, he's not

00:19:18.920 saying, you know, hey, Saw Gunner, go there and that's your target. He is, once that, you know,

00:19:26.540 that mission's complete, he's ministering to that guy. And so I think a Christian nationalist

00:19:33.220 pastor or pastor involved in this, would make sure, first of all, that he would affirm

00:19:39.180 their desire for a Christian nation, that he would affirm their work in whatever capacity

00:19:52.860 they do it. He'd say, what you're doing, it is good to desire and work for the heritage of faith

00:19:59.780 that America has and to work for a Christian nation that is good.

00:20:04.480 What a lot of pastors do now, and you're very well aware of this,

00:20:08.900 is they'll say, you care too much and you shouldn't care.

00:20:11.800 And it's a zero-sum thing.

00:20:13.800 The more you care about politics, the less you care about Jesus.

00:20:16.840 And so they act as then a means to inaction,

00:20:19.900 to actually stifling that courage and that desire to bring in God.

00:20:27.760 it's the war on masculinity and ambition is i think in many ways innately masculine and so

00:20:34.180 part of being holy uh to to be a holy righteous virtuous christian is to uh we we have conflated

00:20:42.620 um righteousness uh holiness with femininity yeah and so uh what does it look like for a man to be

00:20:50.920 um a good christian man well it um it looks like having a quiet and gentle spirit uh not being

00:20:59.160 um overly ambitious um being subservient being submissive and like basically you would just

00:21:05.840 take every verse in the bible that uh is directed towards women and prescribe that to men yeah and

00:21:11.360 so so my point is a christian nationalist pastor well one thing uh that what is a christian

00:21:17.420 nationalist pastor, one thing would be he's a masculine pastor. And by virtue of being a

00:21:22.080 masculine pastor, he's a pastor who doesn't throw cold water on ambition.

00:21:27.680 Right. Yeah. And by not doing that, you affirm their ambition for that. But I think the right

00:21:35.960 pastoral role is saying, look, I affirm that, but let me make sure that this is not

00:21:42.760 preventing you from the highest good, that is Christ. You can get caught up in the internet

00:21:51.520 wars. And you can get so caught up that you no longer read the word, you no longer pray.

00:21:58.080 And the pastor should be, I'm not telling you not to do those things, but make sure

00:22:03.040 that your first heart is for eternal life. It is for Christ. So that's like the chaplain thing.

00:22:10.480 It's like, it's not only to encourage you

00:22:13.000 in the work you know how to do,

00:22:14.960 it's also to feed your soul at the same time.

00:22:17.280 Reorient you away from that work, not to disparage it.

00:22:20.660 So ambition is good, but to also remind

00:22:22.520 you are an eternal creature.

00:22:24.940 Right, and it's not, yeah,

00:22:26.420 so they don't present it as a zero-sum game.

00:22:28.980 You care more about politics.

00:22:30.120 If you care about politics, you don't care about Jesus.

00:22:31.860 It's saying it's good that you care about politics,

00:22:34.020 but don't let that kind of cloud your chief end.

00:22:40.480 which is eternal life in Christ.

00:22:42.800 And so that's really important for a pastor.

00:22:45.320 And there are, I know young guys

00:22:48.120 and they're in seminary now

00:22:49.620 and they're kind of keeping their heads down.

00:22:51.360 We've talked about this a little bit.

00:22:52.880 And they see that.

00:22:54.620 Like they see in the internet world,

00:22:57.520 a lot of young guys who are very ambitious

00:23:00.380 and on fire for the political side,

00:23:02.900 but they do fear that that is a problem

00:23:05.320 for them with regard to spiritual things.

00:23:08.360 And they want to be the pastor who says,

00:23:10.480 yeah great do that for christ but also don't neglect your soul right um in your pursuit of

00:23:17.740 these earthly goods that are good but don't don't lose focus on those other things right it makes

00:23:23.660 me smile uh because i don't know why but i just i couldn't get um out of my uh mind the picture of

00:23:29.880 john doyle do you know who that is yeah yeah so i've talked to him some offline and he's a good

00:23:34.440 guy um uh what's the show heck off commie i think is the name of his youtube channel and uh and he

00:23:42.080 he actually he's super sharp and uh super young and super sharp and has some great stuff and uh

00:23:47.860 but i remember like in one video it was leading up to uh you know he's he's like he loves trump

00:23:52.600 and uh and and his instincts were right on trump from the beginning all the way back in 2015

00:23:57.500 and uh but uh heading towards the election he um he did like a video where he was like

00:24:04.240 look your soul matters um and uh and this matters and that but he said but um but right now it

00:24:10.720 doesn't we're coming up to an election if you're not on twitter 14 hours a day

00:24:14.420 then you are not a patriot get your he said you need to be having 17 anon accounts and

00:24:21.680 and he was you know he was saying it tongue-in-cheek but it was it was really funny like

00:24:25.980 but he was sarcastically he was saying yeah like um you we need to be serious we need to win but

00:24:33.600 he was acknowledging in a sarcastic way that um but you can't you can't obsess you need to be

00:24:40.260 disciplined you need to be ambitious but you can't obsess uh one other thing i was gonna say so we

00:24:44.040 need the business owners we need the pastors um i i said this i don't know if you if you remember

00:24:49.360 this but um when we were at the ogden conference i got in trouble with this right when we watched i

00:24:53.580 think I clipped it out, but I said, I want to win. And I said, and I don't know how to win

00:24:59.380 without seizing power. And so I want to see Christians seize power, which is not inherently

00:25:04.900 good or bad, but then wield power as a tool in righteous, good ways for the good. And what does

00:25:13.880 that look like? Well, wielding power righteously looks like a blessing to your friends and crushing

00:25:21.920 your enemies and uh and everybody you know lost their mind and i you know but i said it like

00:25:27.620 other guys say it but but i'll say things very very matter of fact you know and and i was like

00:25:33.720 yes i want to crush my enemies and so then later i did like a post you know because i i got in

00:25:38.940 trouble for it and so i you know i did a post where i fleshed out i i can't remember four or

00:25:42.580 five different ways of crushing enemies in a christianly manner um and so i said like now

00:25:47.880 when i say crushing enemies i don't mean in the middle of the night cutting you know somebody's

00:25:51.180 break lines. Um, but, but what I do mean is, uh, depending on your vocation and like, I think of,

00:25:57.560 you know, first Corinthians, like each man should remain in whatever station of life when the Lord

00:26:01.000 called him. And I know that particularly that's pertaining to singleness and marriage and, um,

00:26:05.660 marital status, but, but there's also a sense in which like, even like Roman centurions, you know,

00:26:10.120 and soldiers went to Jesus and they asked the question, like, you know, what is like, Hey,

00:26:14.720 we want to be your disciples too. What does Christianity mean for us? And, and it's almost,

00:26:19.120 you can almost read out of out of it you know it's not explicitly there but you can always put

00:26:23.400 yourself in their shoes they're probably expecting if i had to guess they're probably expecting like

00:26:28.640 it's almost like baked into the question is um can't like not just what what does christian life

00:26:33.380 look like for romans and uh uh soldiers but it's almost like they're asking um is christian life

00:26:38.900 compatible with being like basically like um they're asking you know uh not just how can we

00:26:44.580 be roman soldiers christianly um but they're probably implicitly in that they're asking do

00:26:50.240 we need to quit our job and and the fascinating you know thing is that uh jesus response is is a

00:26:56.400 bit you know surprising that he's like um he doesn't say oh you're roman soldiers well what

00:27:02.240 does it look like to be my disciple it looks like uh you know uh giving your resignation

00:27:07.040 you know and finding a better vocation but jesus doesn't say that uh and he and then he begins to

00:27:13.180 talk about how you can remain even in that station, um, in a Christian manner and being

00:27:19.300 content with your wages and not extorting and, you know, these kinds of things. And so, so what

00:27:24.380 does it mean to crush your enemies as a blessing to the righteous and a terror to, to those who do

00:27:29.360 evil, um, based off of vocation? Well, if you're the civil magistrate, it means wielding the full

00:27:34.040 weight of the law in a, in a just way, according to, and the ways that the law is compatible with

00:27:38.800 the law of God against those who do evil. But then if you're not a civil magistrate,

00:27:44.180 so that's in the legal system. If you're not a civil magistrate as an employer, you can

00:27:50.020 economically crush enemies, not just as an employer, but even just as a patron. And where

00:27:56.140 do we spend our money? Like voting with your pocketbook. Another way that I sought to crush

00:28:02.740 my enemies was moving out of California, moving to Texas. I thought like, I don't want to give

00:28:08.480 them another cent of my tax money. I don't want it to go to California. I want to see California

00:28:13.000 change or implode. And then I can send my grandkids back. It's beautiful. We'll take back

00:28:19.040 over the land later on. But they need to be knocked down or wrong. And so you can do it

00:28:24.960 geographically where you live. And then politically, even thinking, I was like, okay, so you can leave

00:28:31.480 California or New York or whatever and move to a deep red state, but you also, family should be

00:28:36.760 taken into account and jobs and all those kinds of things. But if all things are equal,

00:28:40.440 why not move to a swing state? I think it was like 46,000 votes in 2020 that Trump lost,

00:28:47.460 allegedly lost by. If you look at four of the seven swing states that ended up going for Biden,

00:28:56.980 four of them would have been enough in the electoral college for him to win. And the

00:29:00.360 combined popular vote in those four states, the combined margins of all four of them together

00:29:05.700 that Biden, you know, allegedly won by was less than 50,000. So it's, and yet there were 6 million

00:29:11.540 Trump votes in California compared to 12 million for Biden, you know, so it's like 6 million down

00:29:17.920 the toilet. And I was one of them because we left in December right after, you know, I wasted my

00:29:21.960 vote for Trump in California. And so, but my point is like, that's another way to crush your enemies

00:29:26.860 is move to Michigan or Pennsylvania 0.98

00:29:30.640 and vote red, start a business and hire Christians 0.52

00:29:37.280 and not liberals and leftists as a patron

00:29:42.380 and not just how you do wages,

00:29:45.360 but how you spend money, like patron good businesses.

00:29:50.320 And if you're a civil magistrate,

00:29:51.920 using the weight of the law as a pastor,

00:29:54.140 um letting uh not disparaging right-wing young men in your church and like guys who believed

00:30:02.080 what every christian believed 100 years ago uh not excommunicating them like all in all these ways

00:30:07.460 these are practical ways to work towards christian nationalism yeah um

00:30:13.180 yeah and the topic of crushing your enemies the thing about the right that actually that is very

00:30:19.460 masculine is that we will just straight up say it right like we will say that that politics is uh

00:30:25.760 in part a uh a friend enemy distinction we'll say that up front whereas all the people who deny that

00:30:32.600 they practice that just as much oh yeah uh i mean just recently that hit that like uh that uh hoax

00:30:38.900 thing that uh this just happened on amref yeah on american reformer through james lindsey it was

00:30:44.480 of course dragged and it was actually embarrassing for for lindsey and all the people who promoted

00:30:48.420 right because he ended up changing like 90 right yeah it was like 95 change like it was just it

00:30:54.020 was silly like a bunch of very large even non-christian twitter accounts just dragged him

00:30:59.400 and took him out and there's even it's even even today i saw that there's there's like tim pool 0.89

00:31:03.740 did a whole video on it attacking him so so yeah american reformer it was actually a boost for them

00:31:08.900 but but nevertheless all the people who say that they denounce the front enemy distinction

00:31:15.300 are practicing the front enemy distinction. 0.60

00:31:18.020 They use a hoax from an atheist 0.73

00:31:19.860 in which he lies about his identity, 0.95

00:31:22.100 lies about the content, really,

00:31:23.640 because it's really not the Communist Manifesto

00:31:26.840 changed to look like it's right-wing.

00:31:30.100 It's really just a right-wing document

00:31:31.960 with very little overlap with Marx's right.

00:31:35.400 But the leftist group, Babylon Bee,

00:31:38.180 wasted no time at all.

00:31:40.660 Like Seth Dillon and Joel Berry,

00:31:42.000 they couldn't even contain themselves.

00:31:43.840 the bubbling up you know joy of like yes it wasn't just those guys it was like it was like christians

00:31:50.620 it was like the the mid-level big eva guys like samuel james and samuel say um and some other

00:31:57.100 people who are very explicitly denounced that frenemy but they're willing of course they're

00:32:01.460 willing to use that sort of tactic to take down uh their enemies so even like just it's a it's

00:32:09.280 just the the the rule of thumb it's just a solid principle that the the the people who most denounce

00:32:14.240 friend-enemy distinction are the least trustworthy people or are trustworthy in the fact that they

00:32:19.280 will seek to crush uh crush their enemies and so the left is doing it the the the liberals are

00:32:25.200 doing it the classical liberal christians are doing it the centrists the moderates whatever

00:32:29.800 they are center right they're all doing it they just uh they moralize about the friend but we're

00:32:36.020 actually very clear up front about it. And this is the thing about the right. It's very masculine

00:32:39.760 saying, this is what we're up to. It's also honest. It's honest. Yeah. And, and we do it

00:32:44.840 through, uh, like they say it's unprincipled, but we do it through principled means. Um, and, uh,

00:32:50.500 so it's, that's why I wanted to flesh out when I say crush your enemies. Yeah. Uh, if you're a

00:32:54.580 civil magistrate, if you're a business owner, uh, this is how you do it in the household. This is

00:32:57.940 how you do it in the church. All, all, uh, none of it is a visual anti-ism. None of it is like

00:33:03.380 dragging people out of their cars or raiding their houses or um uh you know uh like doing

00:33:09.700 illegal things or abusing the law or none of it is uh let's violate the constitution and none of

00:33:16.240 it's none of that stuff but you can do it um like for instance remember when uh you know somebody

00:33:23.180 said charles haywood did a good job on this but like uh somebody said something about like oh i

00:33:28.460 uh not only like i wish that trump with the assassination attempt i wish it had been

00:33:32.220 successful and he had died but also celebrated the the person who did die the death of a conservative

00:33:37.780 trump supporter and was like good and it's like this dude's a firefighter he's a husband he's a

00:33:43.060 father and this you know this person online celebrated it and they were an employee i think

00:33:47.080 at home depot or something like that or lowe's and and um and and it went viral and and they got

00:33:52.960 fired and like like clockwork a bunch of people even on the right came out like that's too far

00:33:59.640 like i feel bad for them and charles haywood did a good job said no you don't just need hearts for

00:34:05.420 revival you need stomachs for revival yeah this is uh this is lawful this this person did not get

00:34:11.560 beat up this person wasn't assaulted in the proper sphere their employer was shamed by the the

00:34:19.820 objectively shameful thing that this person said publicly and the employer uh wanted to get away

00:34:26.800 from it and fired them. That's great. The left has been doing that for decades. And if the right

00:34:33.480 doesn't have the stomach for that. Well, the right does have the stomach for it, as we've talked

00:34:37.360 before. If it's a racist, they'll absolutely celebrate the fire. They have the stomach for it

00:34:41.380 to do to their own. Yeah, to do it to their own and to use the left to do it. Basically, you,

00:34:46.680 yeah, I mean, we talked about that already. But yeah, they do have the stomach for it.

00:34:51.360 Right. But when it's the left, then it's like, oh, my moralism comes out and my moral witness

00:34:56.260 thing it's always so much of the of the rhetoric of the evangelical moderate or third way or center

00:35:03.660 right is really just moralizing to appeal to the left yeah and so that moralizing can be if it's a

00:35:09.560 left-wing person who gets fired you're going to then feel sad if it's a right-wing person who gets

00:35:14.400 fired they have it they had it coming to them it's all their fault and now they can drive a truck or

00:35:18.840 whatever i mean it's it's it's the same thing every single time yeah um uh but anyway yeah

00:35:24.980 well i was gonna say real quick with the friend enemy distinction um you know the carl schmidt

00:35:30.040 like he's a nazi like yeah i you know nazis drink water and so do i you know um he he's right he's

00:35:36.140 right about that the friend enemy distinction this is what i've noticed though the people who

00:35:39.000 who um deny the friend enemy distinction as you already said i just want to add one extra

00:35:44.640 component because because it's it's like an unbreakable rule it's always true and it's

00:35:48.640 helpful to be aware of um the people who deny the friend enemy distinction they say that's a

00:35:53.360 terrible thing and we deny that, number one, they practice it religiously to a T. So they do

00:35:59.300 practice a friend-enemy distinction while publicly denying it. And their public denial of the friend-enemy

00:36:05.220 distinction does not mean they don't practice it. They do. What you can take away from that as a

00:36:11.300 guarantee, you can take it to the bank, is if they deny the friend-enemy distinction, it doesn't mean

00:36:17.540 that they don't actually practice it. All it means is that they do have friends, they do have enemies,

00:36:21.140 and you are the enemy.

00:36:24.380 And that's important to know.

00:36:26.080 So every time Samuel Sayers, I like Samuel Sayers.

00:36:28.380 That is crucial.

00:36:29.000 I do.

00:36:29.520 Like I spoke at a conference with him

00:36:30.740 and he's a brother in Christ.

00:36:31.820 We'll worship Jesus together in eternity.

00:36:34.960 He's a great guy.

00:36:37.200 I wish, you know, slow to write.

00:36:39.160 I wish he was a little slower to write, you know,

00:36:41.580 but he's a great guy, but his instincts are wrong

00:36:45.060 and certainly politically wrong.

00:36:47.140 But he very much practiced,

00:36:48.900 like as soon as this article came out, you know,

00:36:51.140 or not article but the event unfolded that james lindsey had pulled a fast one on american

00:36:56.500 reformer with the communist manifesto even though he changed it 95 percent um you know a guy who

00:37:02.660 literally his handle is slow to write like it was like 15 minutes yeah you know that he came out on

00:37:09.120 twitter and he was probably most of these guys and he literally said in a mocking manner because

00:37:13.100 he's always like his whole thing is like i'm very respectful and you know even when i disagree i'm

00:37:17.460 very respectful sir he always says like he who like it's one thing to speak that way but he like

00:37:22.100 will type out on twitter uh uh dear sir i did and i'm like who says sir on twitter you know but

00:37:27.620 but anyways but with this one there's no sir it was uh it was literally it was mocking it was he

00:37:32.960 came out and the post i i can't quote it exactly but it was something like uh it was retweeting

00:37:37.460 uh james lindsey it was like protect this man at all costs you know he uh exposed the woke right

00:37:42.360 and made them look like the fools that they are and again this is without getting any of the facts

00:37:46.700 like uh he he ultimately made himself read the communist manifesto maybe he has and if he did 0.98

00:37:53.260 it was in college i haven't most of these guys like laughing at this wouldn't even know the

00:37:59.080 first thing of what that of what it says yeah they're just like oh james lindsey's back at it

00:38:03.220 again but it's in the end it's it's just embarrassment to them but yeah these guys

00:38:07.720 wouldn't have caught it but that's my point is the average person would not have caught it right

00:38:11.700 um and even like the like people use the opening line or some version of the of the opening line

00:38:18.540 of the comics manifesto in writings all the time i've done it before when i've written something

00:38:22.760 it's everyone knows it they know it's kind of a it's a little catchy little phrase

00:38:27.280 and then and so using that's not out of the ordinary so it's so then if you change 95 percent

00:38:33.760 of the rest you're not going to notice it even if you're a marx expert right so anyway but the

00:38:39.120 point is everybody practices the friend enemy distinction those who deny it do practice it

00:38:44.300 and the only thing that they're confirming um is that you're their enemy yeah and they will always

00:38:50.160 always they will waste no time to uh to mock you to uh expose whatever they think is a failure

00:38:57.060 for you i mean that's part of the reason why my clips go viral uh and but there's a two-part

00:39:02.780 process to it one is because of actual leftists that really hate christ and hate conservatives

00:39:08.560 and hate christians um but if it was just that i i people wouldn't really know they wouldn't know

00:39:15.760 who who i am they wouldn't have heard of joel webin it's a two-prong approach right wing watch 0.56

00:39:20.880 or mother jones or something like that you know it's leftist they pick me up uh but what gives

00:39:25.680 it staying power to where i don't just go viral for an afternoon but for a week or a month is um

00:39:31.680 um all the joel berries and samuel says and um and those guys who then retweet right wing watch

00:39:40.500 like these leftists that hate christ and hate christians and wish we were dead i i joyfully

00:39:47.260 will side with them if it means crushing joel webin because they do have enemies they do have 0.96

00:39:52.940 friends the problem is they just have the wrong ones right wing watch friend joel webin christian

00:39:58.580 pastor enemy yeah yeah so the other thing i wanted to mention before our time's out uh is

00:40:06.700 if you have aspirations um so younger guys if you're in high school or you're in college

00:40:12.980 uh it's it's not necessarily wise for you to jump out into the fray with your own name

00:40:19.920 and start doing these things that's good what actually what would be best is if you say i want

00:40:25.680 to be a statesman or politician, or I want to be a pastor, or I want to be a military officer,

00:40:31.480 or I want to be this and that. It's wise for you, if you have an anonymous account, have good OPSEC,

00:40:37.320 but also have that long-term goal that eventually I will be a leader in an institution.

00:40:44.640 And you'll have built up a network of like-minded people. That's one of the things just

00:40:51.620 Christians, broadly speaking, especially Protestants, have not done well on. They have 0.99

00:40:59.020 not entered the institutions. And they have not entered the institutions, one, as Protestants, 1.00

00:41:03.700 as Christians, and they have not prepared to lead for the right. And so pursue that. 0.88

00:41:13.860 Like that, that should be, if you're in seminary right now, uh, you are among a bunch of seminary

00:41:21.840 professors who'd be very good at what they do, but they're not going to understand if you start

00:41:26.920 bringing up Christian nationalism and other stuff you and I say in class in ways that position you

00:41:32.740 on that side, it's going to be harder for you then to get into that presbytery or whatever

00:41:37.600 church, unless your bag is maybe Baptist, have easier time. I don't know. But especially in

00:41:41.780 the Presbyterian world, you have to get it. You have to come under the care and eventually get

00:41:48.380 licensed and get a call. And that the Presbytery has a significant role in that. And so you kind

00:41:56.300 of, you don't have to, you don't have to lie. Yeah. You don't have to lie. And this has happened

00:42:01.060 to people where they're, they're actually ministers and then something happened and they're

00:42:04.920 out. And now getting back in to that denomination into a Presbytery is extremely difficult because

00:42:10.740 they they say we don't want that sort of person in um so i'm not saying lie i'm just saying uh

00:42:17.020 you have to you have to be the uh the kind of normie guy for a while yeah um but not just just

00:42:24.160 not just seminarian in the church but also um in the uh in all other fields vocations you want to

00:42:30.500 be a white collar guy you want to be get get in the corporate world now you want to do business

00:42:34.260 you're gonna have to probably a little while so be smart be wise if you want to go into politics

00:42:38.200 i've thought about this too late yeah i thought like yeah i thought like you know like it would

00:42:43.100 be cool to uh run for public office and i'm like wait a second i'm joel webin well i've i have like

00:42:49.520 a uh history internet history a mile long of all the things yeah you know what i mean like it's

00:42:55.780 possible but the overtime would have to shift a great deal yeah you know for joel webin to well

00:43:00.860 i've thought like locally i wanted to get on um development boards um school boards uh things

00:43:07.160 like that and even if these people were willing i'd hesitate because i'd be like well i don't

00:43:12.360 you know i don't want to harm the institution because of my name at this point right but i

00:43:16.740 wouldn't be considered even for voluntary boards at my local in my county that if i wanted to let

00:43:22.620 alone county commissioner or anything like that for that reason and that and that's that's the

00:43:27.700 sort of fate someone you and i have to deal with that we have to be the people with the microphones

00:43:32.760 or writing because somebody has someone else does have to do right but we don't need everyone else

00:43:38.260 not everyone has to do what we do um and that and that's good that means that the other people can

00:43:45.100 kind of kind of kind of lay low and get in get the credentials get the institutional competence

00:43:50.740 that's a big thing too is like you can't just show up to like i'm going to be in the school

00:43:55.380 board or i'm going to be in this you don't you don't you don't know anything like you have to

00:43:59.060 work up the ranks um even like even if you like suddenly go get on like a state legislature

00:44:05.380 there's a lot to learn like if you don't already have an involvement in politics that immediate

00:44:10.420 gap in knowledge even if you have all of your ideological political principles in a row

00:44:17.120 now you're in a whole new institution with its own rules its own dynamics its own culture

00:44:22.420 and you have to be able to navigate that so yeah so just learn your job learn your vocation learn

00:44:28.600 the institution and just wait for your time to come right you know that's super important because

00:44:33.720 i i i've had to tell uh young guys aspiring you know particularly to pastoral ministry um

00:44:39.540 because they're like well you're outspoken and you're a pastor and they think that that's like

00:44:45.060 the norm and what they don't realize is like i have to remind them and say like um but guys you

00:44:50.900 don't like one you you probably don't want to be me and and two um you have to recognize like that

00:44:58.420 even if you want to be me, um, your chances are slim. Like the, the path that I took is a very

00:45:04.040 unorthodox path. And what I don't mean like theologically, but, um, I didn't go to seminary.

00:45:11.440 Um, I'm not a part of any denomination. Uh, I, uh, never got a phone call from a church saying,

00:45:19.580 hey, we'd like for you to come. I had to plant a church twice now, starting from my living room,

00:45:25.640 with zero pay.

00:45:28.720 It's literally just the grace of God

00:45:30.300 and the fact that I happen to be gifted

00:45:31.580 in terms of communication

00:45:33.620 that I was able to speak in such a way

00:45:38.180 and use media to eventually draw people

00:45:42.240 to where I ended up being successful

00:45:43.960 and I was able to accumulate enough critical mass.

00:45:46.580 But the average guy,

00:45:48.480 there's a reason there are certain designated paths.

00:45:51.800 There are paths to be a doctor.

00:45:53.520 There are paths to be an engineer.

00:45:55.400 and they're a pastor to be a pastor.

00:45:57.460 And sure, there are maybe some exceptions.

00:46:01.440 Not so much, hopefully not with the doctor thing,

00:46:03.540 but with the pastor thing.

00:46:05.480 But there are exceptions.

00:46:08.440 The exceptions are the exceptions.

00:46:09.640 The norm is the norm.

00:46:10.780 You don't want to make the footnote the headline

00:46:12.700 and the headline the footnote.

00:46:14.120 And so most pastors go to seminary,

00:46:17.280 they get an MDiv,

00:46:18.580 they get a call from a preexisting church.

00:46:21.620 Most church plants fail.

00:46:23.480 They're not successful.

00:46:24.200 so you're actually getting a call somebody wants you in a pre-existing church so you have to be

00:46:29.760 accepted by a seminary finish a seminary um if you're not baptist and you have to be ordained

00:46:34.680 um then you have to get an external call from you know from and so for all those things to happen

00:46:40.760 um like and people say well okay so joel you did it you know but as a church planter and as a baptist

00:46:46.700 and independent uh but other guys have done it joel you're not the only guy you know like doug

00:46:50.540 Wilson did it. And he's a Presbyterian. Yeah. He created his own Presbyterian.

00:46:56.200 Doug Wilson is an exception also. You just have to write it. And I'm not even dogging that. That's,

00:47:00.180 you know, fine, whatever. But like, I'm just saying, these are extraordinary examples.

00:47:03.960 And to think like, well, Joel did it, or you might think of Ogden. It's like, well,

00:47:07.960 Ogden did it. Yeah. But, but Brian took over a Calvary Chapel church in extraordinary circumstances.

00:47:16.140 He was the music intern guy as a 17-year-old, I think, I believe, very young, and was part-time

00:47:26.100 staff as a pastoral slash music intern worship guy.

00:47:29.880 And then in his early 20s, there was no other leaders present in the church.

00:47:35.540 There was a sudden and tragic moral failure from the pastor.

00:47:40.580 brian was the only guy on the scene and and calvary chapel happens to be one of those

00:47:45.860 denominations where the individual church actually owns the building and gets to make the decisions

00:47:49.940 there's no diocese or anything above it in ecclesiastical formal sense and so brian was

00:47:55.120 he just happened to be the only guy available and and that's how he got his pastoral gig

00:47:59.640 if it wasn't for but that is that is not the norm and so my point is like every single one

00:48:03.960 of these guys that you look at it's like well he did it he did every single one of them is an

00:48:08.700 exception yeah but for every one of those there's a hundred other pastors that went the normal route

00:48:15.120 of seminary getting a call being examined being ordained and uh and if they were if they were out

00:48:21.880 as outspoken as brian or eric or me or you or um they wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell

00:48:28.880 well i mean i'm i'm a i guess i would be a sort of exception as well is that i i'm older than most

00:48:34.260 you guys and i i became i'm not famous but like known in a certain circle when i was like 38 39

00:48:43.280 and before that i spent a you know a good deal in school um but yeah i was i was working i was in

00:48:49.980 the army and uh they think well wolf can somehow make an income somehow you survive no one actually

00:48:55.200 knows how i i make my money um but it's uh it's it's largely passive income from the times i was

00:49:02.480 working full-time yeah selling books yeah there's a lot of money in books yeah every time you buy a

00:49:07.140 book i get to feed my my kid half an ice cream um or a pack of ramen noodles yeah yeah or like a

00:49:12.960 not even a pack of gum anyway didn't you say it was like less than a dollar a book it's i mean

00:49:18.080 it depends on who who's if it's through amazon it depends on who's buying it and it's actually

00:49:22.100 more than that now as you know but anyway um anyway uh source but for me i can do what i do

00:49:28.920 because i have passive income from i own like four houses so that's now everyone knows so i own i own

00:49:35.720 houses and i have rental income from that and so i'm i'm that where i can do what i want i could

00:49:42.280 i could spend half my day outside building a deck or chopping wood and then the other part of the

00:49:46.720 day you know typing or whatever or doing these things um so i'm kind of like that unique situation

00:49:52.020 so yeah people shouldn't say well you know wolf can write these things and make money

00:49:55.500 so you have to really then yeah for the vast majority of people you have to um expect that

00:50:03.360 you're going to be 38 40 45 like you have to play the long game yes um just like just i don't know

00:50:10.360 if i played a long game but that's the fact i'm 41 yeah um you're 30 something 38 okay so yeah

00:50:16.240 in order to do these things you have to you have to do the work you play the long game intentionally

00:50:22.480 you were you were quiet i played the long game unintentionally yeah in the province of god 0.95

00:50:27.920 by simply being dumb and not coming into these views until later in life okay like you know 0.89

00:50:36.860 that's so so the guys that we're talking to are we're assuming guys who have come into these views 0.96

00:50:41.180 now yeah going to have to sit on them they're on the yeah right and that that's harder because

00:50:45.340 yeah i i didn't i didn't come into these views until i don't know several years ago so yeah so

00:50:50.780 if you're 22, it's hard, but just like that anonymously counts the best you got at this point.

00:50:56.320 And just play the game for a while. Don't be stupid. Don't lose your job. It's not compromise. 1.00

00:51:04.300 It's just basic wisdom. That's strategy. It's shrewd. It's innocent as doves, but as cunning

00:51:09.640 as serpents. We're called to be like that. And one of the reasons why the left always wins is,

00:51:15.600 for one, they don't have any category of compromise because they don't have any

00:51:19.040 virtues or you know um so there's no way to compromise you know if you're just evil um but

00:51:26.400 but conservatives uh obviously we have standards we have principles we have virtues like we we're

00:51:31.360 held accountable under god we're all going to have to stand before him one day so we're not saying

00:51:35.280 so you know lie cheat and steal uh we're not saying that but we are saying that there's there

00:51:39.600 is still a very clear line there's there's i would say even a pretty wide chasm between uh

00:51:46.080 deceit and dishonesty and sin versus strategy, shrewd, wise. And there is a way of having a

00:51:57.360 clear conscience before God and being a righteous, good man and being shrewd without being a coward.

00:52:04.000 That doesn't make you a coward. Wanting to feed your family does not make you a coward.

00:52:08.440 Right. And there's ways to have conversations with normie people where you just ask questions

00:52:17.140 and you say, I heard this, I read this, and when I think about that, and there's ways to have a

00:52:23.820 public presence that doesn't damage you long-term. And the same thing in a seminary class. You could

00:52:30.460 be like, you know, well, yeah, Calvin says this in his institutes about the civil magistrate.

00:52:35.240 doesn't this argument seem to work or don't you think your argument is this and that

00:52:38.900 and that doesn't you know that you're just being a good seminary student at that point

00:52:44.200 and dealing with arguments so there's there's so you don't have to come out and said well wolf said

00:52:48.300 this wolf is of course you know he's got a phd and don't say that please but um but yeah anyway

00:52:54.640 yeah there's there's smart ways to go about conversations both online you know facebook

00:53:00.220 Twitter without damaging your potential long-term. Just imagine that your potential,

00:53:06.120 like most people, and this is just true for even the corporate world, you hit the top in your 40s

00:53:11.160 or early 50s. And most of the time, you're just playing the game. And the same thing on the

00:53:16.060 political side as well. Just play the game until you get that opportunity.

00:53:19.820 Right. And that's a great place to land the plane. Because the one thing I wanted to add to that is

00:53:26.420 not only are we advocating for a virtuous, uncompromising position of waiting and playing

00:53:36.980 the game, but you said it briefly for just a moment. It's not just that this is wise to wait

00:53:42.640 so that you can have maximum leverage later, once you've arrived and you have institutional power,

00:53:47.100 you've accumulated wealth, and then you can be bolder and more pointed and outspoken.

00:53:52.660 And so it's not just that this is necessary now, awaiting now so that I can be loud and effective

00:54:00.300 with power later. It's not just that, but in passing, what you said briefly is it's actually,

00:54:04.920 it's a win-win. It's a double win because right now, even though you have to be tempered and you

00:54:12.440 as a young man may be frustrated by that because you'd like to be more outspoken, you have to be

00:54:16.560 tempered. Well, here's the thing. Your temperance now, not only is it patience that will set you

00:54:22.140 up better for later. But your temperance now is actually oftentimes going to be used in the

00:54:27.720 providence of God to win people, not just later, but now that mean you can't win. So you're listening

00:54:33.460 to Stephen Wolf and Joel and the normie hates us and won't give us the time of day. They're not

00:54:38.740 going to listen to us, but you're listening to us, but then intentionally for your own self-preservation

00:54:44.000 are refusing to say things exactly like us. So you're putting a normie filter on Wolf and Joel

00:54:52.120 and other guys. But you're in a crafty, careful way, disseminating information that you've heard

00:55:02.480 from us. And you're doing it for two reasons. One, to self-preserve because you can't oust

00:55:07.420 yourself so that you can be effective later. But also in being filtered now, you're able to reach

00:55:13.700 a whole market of people, the majority of people who you and I can't actually, they won't give us

00:55:19.600 the time of day but they're listening to you because you filtered it so you filtered it to

00:55:23.740 preserve yourself but it actually becomes a great benefit to them because now they're hearing

00:55:29.060 distilled versions of wolf and joel and these kinds of thinkers um and and and it's starting

00:55:34.960 the thought process for them and then turns out you know it may take six months it may take two

00:55:39.860 years but all of a sudden your normie buddy is uh you know six months later he's he's watching

00:55:45.340 the loan will work, you know? Right. You're preparing the ground that there's people who

00:55:49.340 are so deeply in like their political socialization that it, it, it takes time. Like there's, there's

00:55:55.800 different. Yeah. This, this is why I don't actually go after people who are more, I guess,

00:56:02.540 more to my left. It's like, there's a, there's a, there's a way to, there's a pipeline. Yeah.

00:56:08.540 There's a way to kind of cultivate ideas in someone who would be very, have a kind of a weak

00:56:14.680 self-awareness and weak will to deal with those that you can start kind of kindling that so that

00:56:20.840 they can um that so they can later on be receptive right yeah okay all right well thank you guys for

00:56:28.880 tuning in we hope that this uh series has been helpful for you especially this final episode

00:56:33.820 trying to be a little bit more practical and uh even pastoral we hope that it's a blessing to you

00:56:40.820 And we hope that, well, if you can, in keeping with everything we've said thus far, don't get

00:56:47.040 yourself in trouble. But in the instances where you can, we hope that you would share some of the

00:56:51.160 content with a friend. So thanks for stopping by. And we'll see you in future series that we do with

00:56:57.440 Right Response Ministries. And also to plug Wolf, of course, you can buy his book, The Case for

00:57:02.340 Christian Nationalism. But you also are starting some of your own media and podcasting. Where can

00:57:07.460 they go yeah so it's the the lone bull work on youtube i think it's the lone bull work with

00:57:12.100 steven wolf um so go on there subscribe to that that'd be great um also twitter you'll just search

00:57:17.780 steven wolf and i'll probably be the first guy there cool all right well thank you guys god bless

The NXR Podcast - September 06, 2025

THE FRIDAY SPECIAL - We’re Sorry Christian Nationalism Is Happening To You

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