The NXR Podcast - THE INTERVIEW - Biblical Giants Were Way Bigger Than You Think - ICYMI with @hauntedcosmos_

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00:00:42.400 All right, I'm going to be honest with you.

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00:01:12.320 Why?

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00:01:43.780 What conversation am I even talking about?

00:01:46.580 I'm talking about a nine-part series between myself and Pastor Andrew Isker on Israel.

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00:02:10.700 And so our entire moral framework is based around 1930 and 1940, and every bad thing is Hitler, every failure to confront the bad thing is Neville Chamberlain, and, you know, Saddam Hussein, Hitler, Vladimir Putin, Hitler, Donald Trump, Hitler, right? That's the only moral framework that we have that is operable. 0.53

00:02:33.140 So the moment that a young man crosses the aisle and the don't believe your lying eyes rhetoric doesn't work any longer, and he's just noticed too much because it really is that blatantly obvious, and he crosses the aisle, well, the moment he crosses the aisle, there's no reasonable, wise, mature leader over there.

00:02:50.300 You would just have the guys on the TV telling them, this is what the Bible says.

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00:03:02.860 When that is actually, when you look at all of church history, that's the minority view, a tiny minority view.

00:03:11.440 The rest of theological history in the church is the kind of stuff that we're saying.

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00:03:32.660 All right, welcome back to another episode of Theology Applied. I am your host, Pastor Joel

00:03:37.240 Webin with Right Response Ministries. In this episode, I'm welcoming to the show,

00:03:41.560 Brian Sauve and Ben Garrett, the co-host of Haunted Cosmos. Now what we're going to be

00:03:45.860 talking about is the giants. Many of you watched the episode that Ben and I did a couple months

00:03:50.940 ago that focused on the Watchers and the Nephilim, fallen angels and their immediate offspring with

00:03:56.800 the daughters of men, a humanoid hybrid between fallen angel and human being, the Nephilim.

00:04:03.060 But now we're going to be looking with Brian coming on the show to join us as well at the

00:04:07.660 offspring descendants of the Nephilim, which gives us various tribes and classifications of giants.

00:04:14.320 the first thing that you need to know is this, not all giants are the same. Some giants like

00:04:19.340 Goliath may have been 10, 11, 12 feet tall, but there are other giants. We believe in the Bible

00:04:25.160 validates this, that we're 30, 35, 40 feet tall, different classifications, different tribes,

00:04:32.400 different special abilities and techniques that they learned through the ages, through their

00:04:37.120 fathers, all the way back up to the fallen angels who taught them various things. That's what we're

00:04:42.340 discussing in this episode, and it's going to be fantastic. Now, I'd be remiss if I didn't

00:04:47.180 mention this. Brian and Ben are going to be joining me live in person at our conference

00:04:52.900 happening March 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. This is the Blueprints for Christendom 2.0 conference,

00:04:59.760 and we're going to do a live 90-minute Haunted Cosmos show. If you haven't registered for the

00:05:05.220 conference, tickets are selling out. You need to go and register today. You can go to

00:05:09.720 rightresponseconference.com. Again, rightresponseconference.com to register and see a

00:05:16.480 live Haunted Cosmos show with Brian, Ben, and I at our conference. We'd love to meet you there.

00:05:22.020 Without further ado, let's go ahead and get ready to start the show.

00:05:26.220 Applying God's Word to every aspect of life. This is Theology Applied.

00:05:31.760 All right, we're going to get right into it. Ben Garrett, go ahead and just lead the way here.

00:05:40.380 Give us a little bit of a synopsis, a bit of a framework. How do we go to giants? Where do

00:05:46.580 they even come from? Fallen angels, Nephilim, the whole nine yards. Give us the synopsis version. 0.76

00:05:51.880 I'd love to, Joel. So we start with giants in Genesis 6-4, where we're told that the sons of

00:05:57.880 God came into the daughters of men at that. And at that time, the Nephilim were on the earth at

00:06:03.180 that time. And any time after when the sons of God came into the daughters of men and the 0.98

00:06:08.900 supernatural view, which is the historically Orthodox view is that the sons of God is referring

00:06:13.500 to fallen angels and the daughters of men are just the daughters of men, the human beings that

00:06:18.280 are women. And they create this offspring. That's a hybrid of the two, a partially divine and 0.96

00:06:23.600 partially human earthbound offspring called the Nephilim. And what's interesting is when the

00:06:28.620 Greeks were doing their translation into the Septuagint of the Old Testament, they, without

00:06:33.640 question, every time the Nephilim Hebrew word came up, which is gaborim, they translated it into the

00:06:40.060 Greek as giants, as gigas. And then we see that popping up later through the Old Testament as

00:06:46.560 well in Numbers multiple times and in Deuteronomy, referring to other Canaanite clans that Israel had

00:06:52.520 to go in and dispossess and destroy. And multiple times it refers to them, for example, like the

00:06:58.040 Anakin as the direct descendants of the Nephilim and they were giants. And when the spies go in to

00:07:04.040 spy out the land of Canaan that they're going to go in and take, they come back and say, well,

00:07:07.880 we're really scared because there's giants there and the Nephilim are there. And we looked like

00:07:11.640 grasshoppers compared to them. So that's, that's a really quick overview of how we get there.

00:07:16.800 And I've heard people object and say, well, are you going to believe these 0.96

00:07:20.280 liver, you know, yellow-bellied, cowardly Israelite spies about how big these people were. 0.98

00:07:28.140 They were just exaggerating. But the crazy thing is that as the narrative develops through the 0.98

00:07:34.560 Old Testament, first of all, in that context, nobody disputes that they were giant, that they

00:07:40.500 were huge. Not even Caleb, not even the guy who wasn't afraid. That's not the point. But then

00:07:45.340 later we see that the people of God are always fighting giants. Og, Goliath and his brothers.

00:07:52.060 I mean, the existence of giants in the Old Testament is just sort of almost casually like,

00:07:59.200 oh yeah. And then there were some giants that they had to fight and it was pretty metal,

00:08:02.420 but then God cut their heads off. And now there's no more of that. It just acts like that's a norm.

00:08:08.520 to me how casually it references it demonstrates how widespread this knowledge was in the ancient

00:08:15.940 world that oh yeah there were giants like all over the place yep i completely agree uh giants

00:08:20.940 in the days of noah so some time periods were quick in the days of noah um but also it seems

00:08:25.340 like abraham was fighting giants and potentially he even had a couple giants who teamed up with him

00:08:29.660 not that they were like wholly necessarily but more neutral so abraham's got giants so there's

00:08:34.320 Noah time period giants. There's Abraham time period. Of course, there's Moses, and then Joshua,

00:08:40.980 and then you have David, and it seems like David's kind of rounding up some of the last of them, but

00:08:45.260 it seems as though maybe some might have continued. So those are the kind of things we want to talk

00:08:49.200 about giants. Real quick, though, with the Nephilim, the key word in my assessment, me and Ben were

00:08:54.620 talking about this offline, but the word whenever, so that, you know, it says that the Nephilim were

00:08:59.420 there on the earth uh before the flood and after and some translate it but the the better translation

00:09:05.780 from from my study uh the hebrew word is it's not uh when uh the the sons of god saw you know took

00:09:12.520 the daughters of of uh men but it's actually whenever so i think that explains like how did

00:09:17.660 they how do we get giants nephilim and then giants from the nephilim after the flood because it seems

00:09:23.760 as though this is something that these fallen angels uh did multiple times that they took the

00:09:28.820 daughters of men before the flood but then it happened again after the flood so so we're not

00:09:34.120 saying that giants are surviving necessarily you know or nephilim on on rafts not you know

00:09:40.600 the reason why i wouldn't hold that position is because i like to think that that god flooded the

00:09:44.420 earth for the reason and it wasn't in vain uh that god was successful um but that this happened

00:09:50.060 again and that kind of blows out of the water the speculation that that giants uh would be smaller

00:09:55.220 Because if it's actually the sons of God a second time, so you're starting first generation Nephilim again, then the giants that Abraham, you know, post-flood after Noah, that Abraham's facing Joshua, Moses, these may not be, you know, 10th generation giants that are maybe a little smaller in stature.

00:10:13.780 That could be the case with David. 0.59

00:10:15.460 But it seems like when Amos says that the Amorites were as tall as cedar trees, that could be true.

00:10:23.600 What do you guys think about that?

00:10:25.220 Definitely agree. There's some legends in pagan history of their equivalent of Og, this king of Bashan that Moses goes in and defeats.

00:10:35.540 Their equivalent, and they say that Og held on to the back of the ark and was able to basically hold on and tread water and survive the flood.

00:10:43.960 And I don't think that you need that because of the wording of Genesis 6-4, where it clearly seems to indicate at least the possibility that the same watcher and human cohabitation event took place, the fornication event took place multiple times before and after the flood.

00:11:03.220 And then after the flood, they just began, just like the rest of the world, taking more distinct clans among themselves, like the Rephaim, the Anakim, the Emim, the Zuzim.

00:11:14.640 Yeah. 0.63

00:11:15.520 You even see, you know, close to Mount Hermon, where it seems like some of this activity was centered around this Nephilimic activity, that we have megalithic structures like the...

00:11:27.000 The Gilgal Rephaim, which literally means the wheel of giants or the wheel of ghosts.

00:11:32.500 There's some speculation that that may have been an ex-carnation chamber for Og in his body, like a place where they would put his body, a bone ossuary.

00:11:44.320 You can see how these places might become places of worship over time where people would venerate these, you know, like spiritual beings or these great beings, these mighty men, the gibberim, you know, as it is.

00:11:59.780 And you could see how all of these legends and ancient worship might grow up around these different real personalities who have real spiritual connection and begin to enslave and demand worship.

00:12:11.760 You see giants associated over and over in folklore, as well as even we believe in scripture with eating people.

00:12:19.760 Yeah, they're people eaters.

00:12:21.280 They're devourers of men.

00:12:22.720 And just the ubiquity of these folkloric accounts across time and culture, I think, really demonstrates, you know, not some sort of just collective unconscious that people are, you know, inventing the same mythology over and over, but that these are actually rooted in actual historic events that took place, even with characters in the Bible like Nimrod, for example.

00:12:49.000 Yeah.

00:12:49.520 Can you guys talk about Nimrod for a moment?

00:12:52.140 Let's unpack Nimrod a little bit here.

00:12:54.540 Joel, I would love to talk.

00:12:55.480 We would love to talk.

00:12:56.940 I mean, like, bro, tell me about Nimrod.

00:13:01.260 Yeah, Nimrod's really fascinating because we don't get a lot of information in scripture about him,

00:13:05.900 except for his name and the fact that he is a mighty hunter before the Lord,

00:13:10.540 and also the fact that he founded cities like Babylon and Nineveh.

00:13:15.960 And so the idea is that Nimrod was kind of the head honcho of the Tower of Babel project build.

00:13:23.040 And what's interesting is when you really get into the subtitle Mighty Hunter Before the Lord, what you learn is that in the original Hebrew text, it's clearly meant to indicate that he was a tyrannical opponent of God.

00:13:35.300 So when it says Mighty Hunter Before God, it means that he was a hunter of men that God was disgusted with.

00:13:42.500 And part of how we get that understanding is that Nimrod's name actually means the rebel or to rebel or the rebellious one.

00:13:51.260 And then also in other Near Eastern histories, we get clear parallels with Nimrod, like in the character of Ninurta, even Marduk, Osiris in Egypt, even Hercules in Greece, where both of these men that all biblical scholars, secular and Christian agree, are probably based on the same person.

00:14:12.500 went through mighty acts of valor in order to win favor among the gods and among men.

00:14:20.060 And even stuff like the flood narrative, where Ninurta is fighting against the God who sent the flood

00:14:26.900 in the hopes of saving the people that he's leading.

00:14:30.420 Twisting scripture into saying that the God who sent the flood is actually the bad guy.

00:14:34.920 And Ninurta or Nimrod is actually the one who's good trying to save everyone.

00:14:38.620 So it's just really striking to me how you get these clear connections with even older myths.

00:14:44.300 And it really makes you pause and question, are all these myths lies or are they rooted in truth?

00:14:50.340 And if so, how far does that truth go?

00:14:52.260 Even that overtone that you hear there about the recasting of these stories in pagan mythology where the villains of Scripture are recast as heroic figures is unsurprising and that the God of the Old Testament is evil.

00:15:09.360 This is, again, just warmed over Gnosticism, that the God of the Old Testament is a lesser deity who created the physical world and that to be truly enlightened is to escape his worship and worship the true deity that's above him.

00:15:22.960 There's a lot of these rhymes that you see across ancient mythology and ancient pagan cultic ideas where they end up essentially inverting the story of Scripture in a way where the serpents become the hero instead of the serpent crusher.

00:15:41.320 And yet what we see in scripture with the giants particularly is that they're a rich foreground or soil where many typological pictures of Christ's victory grow up.

00:15:54.420 You know, for example, Goliath, when Goliath comes out and taunts the Israelites, he's clothed in scales.

00:16:01.420 It's told he's clothed in like a coat of mail.

00:16:04.060 It's like the Hebrew word quaskasim, something like that.

00:16:07.780 And it's used to describe dragon or fish scales.

00:16:11.180 So here's this serpent-like giant figure who comes out. 0.77

00:16:16.160 David calls him a dog, which is to say like you're an uncircumcised, you're outside of the covenant people. 0.63

00:16:22.420 And then what does David do? 0.99

00:16:23.920 He crushes his head with a stone, and then he cuts off his head with his own weapon.

00:16:29.840 And this is exactly what Christ, the true shepherd king, does to the greater giant of the serpent and of death itself.

00:16:39.900 he disarms him he puts him to open shame and even through his own weapon of death christ cuts the

00:16:46.580 head off of he crushes the head of the serpent so all of these these giant this giant stuff is

00:16:52.960 actually not just some peripheral little oddity it actually runs right through the center in many

00:16:59.360 ways of the redemptive typological story of the old testament so that's why i do think it's

00:17:05.540 important that we don't just go oh that's kind of an oddity but we really pay attention yeah no i

00:17:10.840 think you're absolutely right giants are everywhere in the old testament and i you know we've been

00:17:15.120 preaching through the book of joshua we actually just finished uh with my church covenant bible

00:17:19.140 church and you know joshua being a type of christ you know he i mean even leading after the death

00:17:24.720 of moses who was also a type of christ so it's like you have one christ type who dies you know

00:17:29.800 and then there's this three-day period you know it says in three days time you will cross over

00:17:33.980 the Jordan River. The river signifies, I think, John Bunyan in Pilgrim's Progress. There's this

00:17:38.300 symbol of death. And so Israel, now led by the second Christ type. So it's like Christ dies 1.00

00:17:46.380 in Moses' death. Three days' time, they cross the Jordan. Now under Joshua, type of Christ,

00:17:51.640 so this resurrection. But they're resurrected not unto rest, but they're resurrected unto war.

00:17:57.160 And you think of the church militant, that yes, we've died with Christ. And yes, we've risen again

00:18:03.200 with christ but we've been resurrected in this life the church here on earth not to rest that

00:18:08.060 comes later but we've been resurrected given resurrected life for the purpose of war and then

00:18:12.540 under joshua yeshua this deliverer a type of christ um primarily what he's doing is he's cutting off

00:18:19.640 the heads of snakes uh he's going you know i mean he even takes his men of war his chiefs of war

00:18:25.120 um and there's five particular kings that unite against joshua and he you know as the battle's 0.99

00:18:30.660 still raging he wants to you know kill them properly the death that they deserve and make a 0.95

00:18:35.120 you know a mockery of them an example of them and so you know they're taken captured and they're put 1.00

00:18:40.540 into a tomb just like christ it's a cave uh in a mountain and they cover it with stones just like

00:18:47.400 you know jesus laid in the tomb um and then they go and run down all the rest of of the men the

00:18:52.320 fighting men of war under these five kings and they they neutralize the threat then they come

00:18:56.480 back, they move the stones, and they take these kings out alive and lay them on their backs. And

00:19:02.500 Joshua has his chiefs of war put their feet on their necks as a sign of God's superiority,

00:19:09.540 his supremacy over all the false gods of the pagans in Canaan, but also as a promise to the

00:19:14.960 people of Israel that they would take heart and be encouraged that God would continue to do this.

00:19:19.320 So Joshua is, he's snuffing out all the kings, but even when Joshua says, I am going to go the

00:19:24.400 way of all the earth. He's going to die. And he gives the allotments of land as inheritances to

00:19:30.080 each of the various tribes of Israel. Not all the enemies are gone, but the significant threat

00:19:36.800 has been neutralized. These kings have been cut off, but there's still inhabitants in each of

00:19:42.280 these various inheritances of land given to each of the respective tribes of Israel. So they're

00:19:47.640 expected to finish the job. And I think of that in the big picture of Christ and his life, his

00:19:53.300 death and resurrection, that he has neutralized the lethal portion of the threat, that the

00:20:00.120 lethal weapon that Satan possessed has now been stripped from him, that he has crushed

00:20:05.400 the head of the serpent.

00:20:06.400 But that doesn't mean that there's not any more battle left to do.

00:20:09.300 Now the church is going to go and run him down.

00:20:12.120 It's the strong man, right?

00:20:13.600 If you're going to plunder the house, first bind the strong man.

00:20:16.640 And that's what Christ has done.

00:20:17.700 But the house still needs plundering.

00:20:19.640 And there are various enemies along the way, but the big enemy has been taken out.

00:20:24.420 And I feel like that's what you see with Abraham.

00:20:26.620 You see it with Moses, with Joshua, and David, who also is a type of Christ. 0.96

00:20:31.300 They're all giant killers.

00:20:33.020 And then Jesus comes and slays the true ultimate giant. 0.99

00:20:36.860 And then we, true Israel, the church, are going to run them down.

00:20:40.380 We've inherited the earth. 1.00

00:20:41.880 The meek inherit the earth. 1.00

00:20:43.460 But we have to have this mindset of we're still at war. 1.00

00:20:47.280 It's not time to rest yet.

00:20:49.040 And so you're absolutely right.

00:20:51.320 There's spiritual implications.

00:20:52.720 It's fun to talk about, but it's not just fun to talk about.

00:20:55.900 It'll preach.

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00:23:40.660 All right. So tell me a little bit more about Nimrod, because you said something, Ben,

00:23:44.700 just a second ago that kind of threw me off, because it sounded like you said something that

00:23:50.760 might be pre-flood, but then you also said that, you know, maybe he's accredited with founding

00:23:56.760 nineveh and and uh babel and uh these other cities which would be post flood so so what what were you

00:24:03.640 saying there can you clarify that what what was the pre-flood thing that i said maybe i just got

00:24:08.580 confused so nimrod was after the flood i'm just clarifying okay and and mighty man of renown was

00:24:14.040 he are we saying that he was uh first generation nephilim that like he is half fallen angel or are

00:24:21.280 saying that he's one of the giants down the line so i think uh i think that maybe he is a first

00:24:27.640 generation nephilim because of the way that his genealogy is spelled out in genesis where it says

00:24:34.580 that cush fathered nimrod it's this really interesting thing it says cush fathered nimrod

00:24:39.360 who was a mighty hunter before the lord and then when it goes into cush's generations nimrod is

00:24:45.360 not mentioned at all and so it does make me wonder if there was some kind of bastardization

00:24:49.960 that was attributed to Nimrod, because perhaps Cush offered up his wife. This is like completely

00:24:56.360 speculative, by the way. We have no way of knowing if this is true. But it would just be one way to

00:25:01.620 try to harmonize these two data points that seem to be at least a little bit finicky, where maybe

00:25:06.660 Cush offered up his wife to one of the fallen angels as an offering, and Nimrod was the product

00:25:13.960 of that offering. Or I have heard some Roman Catholics say that their idea is that the fallen

00:25:20.300 angels actually possessed human men. And that was how they achieved this union. I don't think I

00:25:27.440 really give that much credit, but it is what it is. It's an idea. And that was how the Nephilim

00:25:32.640 were produced with possessed men who were inhabited by fallen angels with normal women.

00:25:38.280 That could help explain the genealogical differences, but the essential truth is still there, and that's that Nimrod was either a first-generation Nephilim or, at the very least, a later-generation giant, if the story is to be believed, which, of course, it is to be believed.

00:25:55.460 And then if you also take that and harmonize it with the other myths that are clearly alluding to the same character, even even with with Ninurta being the god of the hunt in Mesopotamia.

00:26:07.480 I mean, it's quite literally the same supposed to be the same guy.

00:26:11.100 Then you have to realize that he was thought by every ancient person to be a giant demigod, essentially, who was able to even build mountains in the in the Mesopotamian myth as a as as a sort of insult to the God who sent the flood.

00:26:28.460 And that, of course, reminds us of the Tower of Babel.

00:26:30.560 Yeah, Ethan, we go into quite a bit of detail surrounding Hercules and Inerta and Nimrod in an upcoming episode of Haunted Cosmos.

00:26:41.580 Which episode?

00:26:42.620 Episode six of season two is going to be devoted to the, we just recorded it actually, the giant lore of the Bible essentially, the giant history of the scriptures.

00:26:54.800 And then the seventh episode of that season will be branching out into really far flung giant folklore and mythology proper that goes out across the world, even into the modern day in that seventh episode.

00:27:10.180 So even in that, you know, we don't have our notes in front of us here, but if you compare Hercules and Inerta and the task, the 11 tasks and 12 tasks, you find so much overlap with this time period and the hunting, you know, trope that there's at least a compelling like, wow, what if, what if they're actually talking about Nimrod?

00:27:31.180 And just the same way that the flood myth, many of them recapitulate Noah into a different mythological character.

00:27:37.260 And let's not forget that when Nimrod was at large in the world, everyone was able to speak the same language and understand each other, at least for a portion of his life.

00:27:46.060 So it would make sense that after their language is confused, they disperse and the myth of Nimrod becomes corrupted here and there, exaggerated here and there.

00:27:55.400 He becomes a hero instead of an anti-hero.

00:27:57.840 It all makes perfect sense when you think about how humans work with stories.

00:28:02.600 Totally.

00:28:03.200 You think of Hercules and it's like, okay, his father is a god.

00:28:07.260 you know like uh and and in the case of hercules both his father and mother you know but but the

00:28:11.500 point is that like he's a demigod he's he's kind of like half half man half god you know that that

00:28:16.300 he's you know he he's flesh and blood he actually is mortal you know he can die but he has this

00:28:22.540 divine god-like angelic strength and it's like well i mean there's so many stories like that

00:28:28.140 with so many cultures geographically spread way out and and very very old um that that it makes

00:28:35.500 you think maybe it's not just a coincidence i think part of the problem is that you know we 0.99

00:28:39.420 think of the ancients we think of people from very long ago as being that they were all stupid 0.99

00:28:44.220 we just think they were all stupid and that we're so smart um but these are people who are keeping 0.99

00:28:49.260 records sure that like i'm sure they had some concept of entertainment like we do today um 0.99

00:28:55.660 but but even when you when you look at things like beowulf that you know that was um you know

00:29:01.340 perhaps meant to be entertaining and meant to be fictional it doesn't it doesn't have the detail

00:29:07.340 but then you you look at other other pieces of old literature and it's like this this seems like

00:29:12.680 they're trying to account for history and not just a made-up story and and so all that makes perfect

00:29:18.860 sense to me um do you guys know anything about arba uh that he's the father of anak and then

00:29:24.640 anak coming down you know the anakin coming down his line that's where we get goliath did you guys

00:29:29.660 discuss any of that no i i read briefly some stuff about arba but i couldn't remember it

00:29:35.880 and then i got i got too i got too enthralled with the anax stuff yeah with anakeem and nephilim and

00:29:43.200 right so okay well let's i'll i'll talk about arba in a second but real quick you guys have

00:29:48.960 named several tribes can you can you do your best it doesn't have to be exhaustive but all these

00:29:53.720 different tribes that that have giants are one question is are they all giants or these are

00:29:59.860 tribes that giants are among can you and how many are of these tribes are there i kind of want to

00:30:05.360 see if we can get into classifications of giants and even discuss um from the scripture as much as

00:30:11.840 we can but then maybe a little bit of speculation about sizes of these giants and even skills like

00:30:17.360 nimrod was you know a hunter um so so talking about classifications or tribes of giants um sizes

00:30:23.860 of giants and then and then various skills or even i don't know supernatural abilities that they may

00:30:29.840 have possessed i like the idea that the giant clans because of their association with false

00:30:37.860 worship uh had a hobby of collecting people and that they liked to collect human followers like

00:30:45.340 full normal people followers as their, you know, basically like their servants and their worshipers

00:30:52.420 and tried to establish, you know, this common story we see through history that

00:30:56.560 the king or the ruler is somehow the son of the gods or he's semi-divine. He's, you know,

00:31:03.420 like Pharaoh, the son God was my third cousin, twice removed kind of thing. And so I like the

00:31:09.820 idea, or I think it's coherent with history and scripture that some of these giant clans probably

00:31:15.320 had human followers as well mixed in with the clans and the tribes that they were interbreeding

00:31:20.980 even, but that they also demanded worship of them. So you see like the Zuzim, the Rephaim,

00:31:26.380 the Anakim, the Emim. Zuzim means tall ones, something like that. So a lot of the giant

00:31:32.380 kind of association is even built. The long neck. Right. These are big people. I think like

00:31:38.380 Girgashite is another one, Hivite, the Gathites, of course, the sons of Gath. 0.90

00:31:47.020 And then, of course, the Canaanites and the Philistines. We know that the Philistines 0.93

00:31:49.820 had giants as well. In terms of size and classification, there is a kind of thread

00:31:56.540 that I find that I don't think is that plausible. I think it's more exaggeration. And that's,

00:32:03.420 i believe in the enoch tradition in the book of enoch i think there are examples of giants that

00:32:09.660 are hundreds of feet tall and i don't know that i necessarily would go that far you know yeah i

00:32:18.380 looked into enoch a little bit and it depends on i forget the name of the measurement ben you

00:32:22.060 might know but he says thousands of blank whatever this unit is right um that it depends on like what

00:32:29.580 what is that is that you know is it equivalent to a centimeter then then maybe but if not then

00:32:34.540 you know depending how you interpret the actual you know like the bible will say a cubit and a

00:32:38.300 cubit is about you know a foot and a half 18 inches uh but but enoch uses i can't remember

00:32:43.740 the word but a particular term that's a unit of measurement that that apparently i mean you would

00:32:49.020 have to assume it would be small but you would have to assume it would be really small like a

00:32:52.700 centimeter yeah yeah and then you get giants that are like 90 feet tall if it's a foot you're talking

00:32:58.780 like thousand some you know thousands of feet giants which that one's hard to that one's hard

00:33:04.460 to swallow there's the whole um this is a classic youtube or um memed kind of ancient history as

00:33:13.660 spooky and supernatural and weird where it's like the plateaus are tree stumps yeah and in the there's

00:33:20.540 no forest yeah there are no yeah like the mountains were so they're a hundred foot tall there are a

00:33:24.700 thousand foot tall giants and they chopped down these plateau trees and look at all. So I think

00:33:30.820 a lot of that is just, um, you know, mythology, people being speculative and, and trying to get

00:33:37.260 clicks. You know what, though, to your point, there is, there is an important scriptural example

00:33:42.340 of a unit of measure, uh, changing dramatically that met that changes the story. Yeah. It

00:33:47.600 completely changes the story. So, and it's Goliath, it says, and I believe the ESV uses the

00:33:53.500 Septuagint where it says that he was four cubits and a hand and a span or span like that like six

00:34:02.300 foot nine yeah which would be six foot nine no the the Septuagint was translated in Alexandria

00:34:09.360 and Alexandria used a different unit of measure for or they used an Egyptian cubit as opposed to

00:34:16.260 a Hebrew cubit which was longer per cubit so it was actually if you go by the Hebrew cubit

00:34:22.680 Goliath would have been nine feet, nine inches, because the, the, the oldest Hebrew text that we

00:34:29.920 have corresponding to that passage in the old Testament, which is, which is later than the

00:34:34.320 Septuagint, by the way, uh, says that he was six cubits and a span, which would be nine feet,

00:34:40.240 nine inches. So the idea is that the Hebrew scholar who was putting it back into Hebrew

00:34:44.420 is noticing the fact that the Alexandrians used a different measure for cubit. And so he,

00:34:51.040 to try to be consistent to do the right thing is putting it back into the Hebrew measurement

00:34:55.520 so that his audience would understand what the Egyptians wanted to convey.

00:34:59.720 And this is important because if you take the six foot nine ish height, it's difficult to see what

00:35:05.860 was so scary about Goliath, given that King Saul was likely six foot six or so. He was six and a

00:35:10.820 half. He was like a foot, a head taller than everybody in that day. So why would Goliath at

00:35:17.480 six foot six i mean we have people taller than i've known people taller than that we have people

00:35:21.680 in our church taller than that right so you know i don't think that they could fight effectively

00:35:25.740 with a spear that weighed 50 pounds right and with armor that weighed 160 two to three inch diameter

00:35:30.800 you know kind of right well this is one verse that i think is helpful uh to to that end it's

00:35:36.100 deuteronomy chapter 1 verse 28 it says where can we go up our brethren have made our hearts melt

00:35:41.300 saying the people are bigger and taller than we the cities are large and fortified to heaven

00:35:46.620 and besides so that is in addition to what's already been stated people are bigger and taller

00:35:51.400 than we and besides we saw the sons of the enakim there so so the point is that that it's not oh

00:35:59.000 there are giants and giants are guys who are you know four five six inches taller than we are

00:36:04.560 right because i mean there's there's an argument to be made that at this time you know that people

00:36:10.760 in general were a little bit shorter than maybe the average man today so if the average man today

00:36:15.160 is whatever it is five nine five ten you know or even let's say six feet then maybe you know it was

00:36:20.040 like five six five seven you know and so okay so you know the the average guy in israel is like five

00:36:25.880 seven and you know if somebody's you know six feet tall you know that's well okay well that could

00:36:31.480 maybe account for part of that verse and the reason why i like this verse again deuteronomy 128

00:36:36.280 um it made our hearts melt saying the people are bigger and taller than we so if there's you know

00:36:41.080 if all the people are only five inches taller but it's all of them that is still intimidating

00:36:45.240 because it's like you know pound for pound man for man you know these guys are bigger and stronger

00:36:49.840 than us but that's not the only thing that's said is the people are bigger and taller than we

00:36:53.920 the cities are large and fortified to heaven and besides all this we saw the sons of the anakim 0.97

00:37:00.240 there and that's what actually terrifies them and that's where you get the language of the anakim 1.00

00:37:05.060 is that's where you get the language of like we were like grasshoppers um you know and they said

00:37:10.420 we saw ourselves we we viewed ourselves as though we were grasshoppers to them um but we were so also

00:37:16.720 in their sight they saw us as grasshoppers so it's not just us being cowardly and it's like

00:37:21.960 you know we know that the 10 spies right the 12 minus joshua and caleb they brought a bad report

00:37:27.060 but the bible doesn't say as you guys mentioned earlier that they brought a deceitful report they 0.69

00:37:31.300 brought a bad report if i go to the doctor and he says you've got cancer and it's true that's a bad

00:37:36.500 report right but but that doesn't mean he's lying i may not like it but you know so they give a bad

00:37:42.100 report um but but there's nothing in the biblical text that that requires us to interpret that as

00:37:48.560 though it's deceitful and it's not just they're bigger and taller like let's say on average they're

00:37:52.520 five six inches taller but but even beyond that there are giants among them and the anakim as you 0.96

00:37:59.440 look into them and like you know coming from that's where goliath came from from gath goes all

00:38:03.660 the way back to anak and anak this is what i was getting at with arba his father says the most

00:38:08.260 renowned among the anakin wasn't actually anak but his father who was arba um and it makes me

00:38:14.600 think the language seems similar it says he was the most renowned among them it uses that renowned

00:38:19.220 word it makes me think of again back to nimrod a man of renown it it seems as though some of these

00:38:25.140 guys not that a giant you know six generations down couldn't be you know famous for for such

00:38:30.520 and such, or exceedingly large. But it does seem like that the original first generation Nephilim

00:38:37.580 that would come from a watcher, a fallen angel, and one of the daughters of Cain, or later on,

00:38:45.180 post-flood, I think it would be a watcher, fallen angel, and then a daughter of Canaan, perhaps. 0.91

00:38:49.880 But those first generation Nephilim, half watcher, half angel, half man, that these are the guys

00:38:56.760 like nimrod or or arba and these are the most renowned guys who then they give birth to a

00:39:03.680 various tribes of giants in the case of arba the anakim and the anakim goes all the way down so i

00:39:09.560 think this probably happened shortly after the flood uh because canaan uh well you know his

00:39:14.340 father um was was wicked and then you know noah curses his grandson his father's son canaan and

00:39:20.780 it's the same all over again you've got adam and eve and you got seth and then but then you have

00:39:25.020 cain and he goes off and he does his thing in rebellion to god well now you've got canaan he's

00:39:29.440 doing his thing and and so it seems like the the watchers saw that whichever ones were left that

00:39:34.880 were able to survive the flood because the flood only wipes out that which has breath in its lungs

00:39:39.320 and so the watchers don't fall into it so i think the watchers that that actually came into the

00:39:43.780 daughters of men were locked in gloomy dungeons but it doesn't say that all the fallen angels

00:39:47.740 actually committed that act and so there could be another batch of angels not falling from heaven

00:39:51.900 already fallen but now committing this act again who have not been locked in gloomy dungeons taking

00:39:57.540 the daughters of men procreating with them and now doing it with you know who's going to be 0.53

00:40:01.800 susceptible to that well not Cain's daughters they've been wiped out but Canaan's daughters 0.51

00:40:06.420 post-flood and there there's where you get a Nimrod type figure as a first generation half

00:40:11.720 fallen angel or an Arba figure and then coming down off of their lines and at least in the case 0.77

00:40:16.820 of Arba that's where you get the Anakim and then way down all the way to David that's where you

00:40:21.820 get 10 foot giants like Goliath who is a son of the Anakim son of Gath down from Anakim but but

00:40:28.880 what would what would Arba's son Anak have looked like if Goliath multiple generations down is nine

00:40:35.760 foot nine what what going working back up now from not the days of David but up back to like

00:40:41.680 the days of abraham or moses or joshua um these when the bible says they look like cedar they were

00:40:49.500 like cedar trees maybe maybe it's not an exaggeration all right that's it guys i tried to

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00:43:16.560 so we can see a pretty direct correlation to time from the flood to size of giant when we compare

00:43:27.100 goliath size whichever interpretation you take to aug's size which presumably is the size of his

00:43:33.900 bed which is 14 feet long and six feet wide and it's all for him and the one of the reasons that

00:43:40.420 i think that that's actually a good uh measure for aug's actual size was because another

00:43:46.260 interpretation for bed or another translation for bed could be sarcophagus or coffin yeah so it very

00:43:52.620 well could be talking about the coffin that aug was laid in and you wouldn't need to make a coffin

00:43:56.860 any bigger than the person that's being laid in it. Apart from that, some people say that the

00:44:02.040 large bed is actually an allusion to a Babylonian sex magic ritual. I don't think that that plays

00:44:07.900 out at all because it says that Og was the last remnant of the Rephaim that was east of the Jordan

00:44:14.020 River. So we know that he had to be huge. So we can reliably then say, okay, well then the bit

00:44:20.340 about his bed being 14 feet long and six feet wide is probably giving us a good indication of

00:44:25.800 actually how big it is so in the journey in the generations between aug who is the last of the

00:44:31.240 east of the jordan all the way down to goliath we have a clear reduction in size from something like

00:44:37.940 25 feet down to 10 feet that's a pretty big reduction in size and where did we get the 25 i

00:44:45.920 i see we were going all to goliath 14 to 10 14 feet not 14 cubits my fault so yeah yeah okay

00:44:52.960 got you got you but yeah so like but you're right and his bed if it's not a coffin if it is an actual

00:44:58.020 bed it's also significant not just its measurements but that it's made of iron because that's another

00:45:02.820 thing that we don't think of um you know it's like if you've got a 12 foot dude um and and if

00:45:08.760 a six foot guy is 200 pounds the 12 foot guy is not going to be 400 pounds that's not the way math

00:45:13.260 works no he's right right it's going to be exponentially um because otherwise he'd just be

00:45:19.380 a beanpole and a gust of wind would knock them over but but if everything proportionally is

00:45:23.940 is bigger than than a guy you know if a six-foot guy is 200 pounds then a 12-foot guy with the

00:45:28.780 same proportions um what i i don't even know the math on that but what 800 or or a thousand or

00:45:35.300 1200 pounds so much it's but i mean you can even look at like silverback gorillas and how

00:45:41.040 strong and powerful and they're not even super tall relative to people right there's also some 0.83

00:45:46.840 proportional things we don't know when we look at these warlike people and look at the weapons

00:45:51.700 goliath was 150 pounds of armor and you know this 50 pound spear um i also think it's important to

00:45:59.820 note that you know the the whole idea of them seeing the nephilim this is this is straight out

00:46:04.540 of numbers 13 they say we there we saw the nephilim yeah and we seem to ourselves like

00:46:11.040 grasshoppers that's what they say we saw the nephilim so post-flood you have to say

00:46:16.420 They were there. How did they get there? You have to account for this. And the giant angle as well. I was going to note as well, I think if someone's interested in someone who I think gets the chronological snobbery thing and gets the reality of how these myths actually support the biblical text from pagan cultures.

00:46:40.860 If you read just N.D. Wilson's Ashtown Burials series, it's a fictional series, but in it, he basically sets all of these characters who are transmortals.

00:46:52.040 They've become immortal. They can't die.

00:46:54.580 And he brings in all these characters from ancient mythology into the modern story, and it's really fascinating the way that he does it.

00:47:02.240 And Gilgamesh is there, and there's all these crescents.

00:47:05.460 Which, by the way, a lot of people think that Gilgamesh was Nimrod.

00:47:08.420 Yeah. Missionary, missionary David Livingston thought that Gilgamesh was Nimrod.

00:47:12.380 And what I love about the series is he says, like, if you were to bind one of these transmortal giant type creatures in a block of stone, they can't die.

00:47:21.780 So they're in there that within a decade, people would be within a decade, people would be worshiping.

00:47:29.680 There would be an altar within a century.

00:47:31.640 there would be a temple built around it within like he the the draw of these demonic um cults

00:47:38.400 that build up around these things they're not just people who were big they there is always a clear

00:47:46.320 overtone of blood sacrifice um human eating horrible demonic worship and practices the law

00:47:52.740 of canaan the law of canaan yeah it's built like you go and you see the the things that were

00:47:58.420 happening in the land, when God sent them in to wipe the inhabitants out, they are all associated

00:48:04.460 in ancient mythology and folklore with giants. And this actually opens the door to two different

00:48:09.380 avenues that you can go down. The first, going back to Aug's bed, being made of iron,

00:48:15.100 gets into the problem of people of that long ago having the know-how and the skill to actually

00:48:23.420 rot a bed of iron. This is very difficult even today to do something that big out of just pure

00:48:30.480 cast iron is very, very difficult. And so it does make you think like, well, was there certain

00:48:35.720 skills that were passed down? And if we go back to the Enochian tradition, we remember that the

00:48:40.000 watchers gave certain skills. It was almost like they were brands for the people where one of them

00:48:45.220 taught them metallurgy. One of them taught them weaponry. The other one was cosmetology and then

00:48:50.900 cosmology and astrology. And then you also take all that. And then what Brian just said, where

00:48:56.680 it inevitably goes back to worship wherever you see it. And you look again at that thing that we

00:49:02.520 briefly mentioned earlier, the Gilgal Raphaim, the wheel of giants. And one of the things that's

00:49:07.600 really crucial to understand about that is that the way it's laid out lines up perfectly with the

00:49:13.800 solstice and equinox dates in the year. We go and we know most likely, well, actually we do know

00:49:20.860 that it was there when Og was king of Bashan, so he would have known about this monument.

00:49:25.120 And any king in the old days was the Pontifex Maximus, essentially, Israel being the exception,

00:49:30.500 where there's a high priest and a king. And so Og was leading worship at this Gilgal Rephaim.

00:49:36.960 That's what people agree on. They say, like, it was here. It's clearly a place of worship,

00:49:41.580 and it may be a tomb for Og, since he was the last of the Rephaim, so they felt like 0.96

00:49:46.700 it was a good honor to bestow upon this last remnant. Then we go back to Acts 7, and we 0.89

00:49:52.960 remember that in Stephen's sermon, he says that the Israelites in those days took up the star

00:49:58.180 of Rephin, the star of their god Molech. Where would they learn how to do that? From the giants. 0.58

00:50:06.220 Where would the Canaanites, who were full of giants? Where would the giants learn how to do 0.82

00:50:10.220 that? From their fathers, who was the demon Molech himself, the fallen angel Molech, or the fallen

00:50:16.220 star Refn himself. And so it's not a coincidence that all of these concentric circle spiral type

00:50:23.360 megalithic structures are always supposed to be ancient places of worship. And almost without

00:50:29.780 exception, they line up precisely with special dates on the equinox and the solstices, and then

00:50:36.920 astrological formations in the heavens. And then also, let's take it a step further. If you go on

00:50:44.060 Google Earth and you find this Gilgal Rephaim place in the Gilead and Golan Heights, and then

00:50:49.100 you zoom out slightly and look just a little bit to the north, there looks to be like a clearly

00:50:54.740 man-made serpent mound that's very akin to the serpent mound in Ohio. And it's all facing towards

00:51:01.620 Mount Hermon. And so we have all of these pieces coming together, and it's a really loose connection

00:51:07.260 because not many people think about this anymore. But you have giants, you have serpents, you have

00:51:12.220 worship of the host of heaven, the stars, the star Refn and Molech. And then you also have that

00:51:18.440 kind of archetype of worship spreading from the Middle East, from Mount Hermon,

00:51:25.840 through all the entire world. And so you have places like, what's the thing in England? I can't

00:51:31.340 remember the name. Stonehenge? Stonehenge. Places like Stonehenge. You have the Serpent Mount in

00:51:35.660 Ohio. You have the Rings in Africa. You have the Nazca Lines in South America. Go back a

00:51:42.140 Gobekli Tepli. Gobekli Tepli. Yeah. And the sister sites around the same region. And then, 0.98

00:51:47.180 and then, and then you start to ask the question, some of these ancient megalithic structures are

00:51:51.740 really big. And this ties in again with that making Aug's bed out of iron. How were they

00:51:56.860 able to move these stones near Gobekli Tepe? I'm sorry, in, in Peru, not Gobekli Tepe, near

00:52:04.620 Tiwanakin by Lake Titicaca, there is a megalithic stone that's 100 tons heavy and it's lifted up

00:52:13.060 onto two pillars. And everyone agrees that they would have had to quarry that stone

00:52:18.220 250 miles away. And it's, by the way, the quarry is at low elevation, close to sea level,

00:52:26.220 and this city is at 12,000 feet above sea level. Can you imagine getting today

00:52:32.500 everything that we have we couldn't a 100 ton stone no that's the thing we couldn't do it we

00:52:37.940 literally don't have the means to do that it's not a money issue it's a technology issue we can't do

00:52:42.940 that we would have to invent custom-made technological innovations to attempt it

00:52:48.100 they don't currently exist and so the myth is that the the gods that built it had a magic trumpet

00:52:53.000 and when they blew the trumpet the sound waves were able to carry the stone up we're now getting

00:52:57.400 into some of the future hana cosmos stuff with like sacred geometry and sacred sound yeah right

00:53:03.420 and again we're not saying that all of these things are necessarily real or true we don't we

00:53:08.300 don't know but when you start to go down this thread of start with ancient cultic worship

00:53:14.980 and its practices and go outward in architecture and all these different things you find a shocking

00:53:20.580 level of overlap that that actually interestingly comes back to giant yeah type of lore it's

00:53:27.960 and serpent imagery and serpent imagery so it's like almost as if the when the old testament

00:53:34.020 describes ancient demonic cultic worship as serpent like and the abode of the giants and

00:53:39.940 dragons and things like that that it's telling the truth right it's almost like the bible is true

00:53:45.480 the world is not just stuff so true yeah okay so um man that's fascinating all that um so what 0.84

00:53:56.400 what happened to the giants because it seems like joshua kicked a lot of their butts it seems like

00:54:01.220 moses was fighting them abraham arguably i think was fighting giants and then moses was fighting

00:54:06.200 a lot of them and then joshua fought a ton of them you know so it's like the ones during the

00:54:11.780 days of noah god took him out in the flood but then you've got you know abraham moses joshua all

00:54:17.440 taking out giants um but then we know that that they still didn't completely get taken out let

00:54:22.900 me give what one verse with this real quick because i think it's helpful this is um i believe it's

00:54:27.400 actually in joshua uh joshua 14

00:54:31.340 i think it's uh joshua chapter 11 verse uh 20 21 and 22 says and at that time came joshua and cut

00:54:46.080 off the anakims from the mountains from hebron from deborah from anab and from all the mountains

00:54:52.940 of judah and from all the mountains of israel joshua destroyed them utterly with their cities 0.99

00:54:58.080 there was none of the enakims left in the land of the children of israel only so not in that land 0.89

00:55:04.760 of the children of israel only in gaza in gath and in ashdod there remained so joshua took the

00:55:11.520 whole land according to all that the lord had said unto moses and joshua gave it for inheritance

00:55:16.540 unto israel according to their divisions by their tribes and so even with joshua it seems like he

00:55:22.880 took out a bulk and that works with that typological preaching you know christological

00:55:27.940 preaching that you know but even then it's not quite done so it's like joshua you know he's 0.71

00:55:32.800 cutting the head off the snake he's you know he's getting them to put their their feet on the necks

00:55:36.920 of the kings you know he's doing the um he's he's rendering the death blow but there's still the the 0.74

00:55:42.860 final you know um finishing touches of the war that have to be done it seems like you know joshua

00:55:49.000 takes out he deals a great blow um but we know that giants continue because we've got you know

00:55:54.920 goliath with david but it seems like now they're tapering off so my question is um even with david

00:56:01.320 it seems like he's you know dotting the i's and crossing the t's that joshua you know had already

00:56:06.520 done um but did any giants escape him like like are are there are there any stories of giants in

00:56:14.360 other places besides the middle east did giants make it to norway or scotland or any of these

00:56:21.480 things because it's a lot of what israel does is they they they they put the enemies of god to 0.96

00:56:26.680 death at the edge of the sword but they also drive the inhabitants out of the land in that case 0.68

00:56:32.440 driving them out of the land they're not dead they go somewhere yeah what do you guys think

00:56:38.200 i think that's absolutely accurate that they're being driven out they're being killed and driven

00:56:43.800 out and that they do go other places. I'll give a thematic answer. And then I think Ben probably

00:56:49.280 has some examples and things as well to add to it. But thematically, I think it's important to

00:56:54.880 recognize that one of the story arcs that we have gotten completely wrong in the last 200 years of

00:57:02.080 Christianity is the story arc that wickedness flourishes and the righteous are always driven

00:57:09.540 back. And if you just read Psalm 37, you see this temptation enter the thinking of the psalmist 0.96

00:57:17.160 where he says, you know, look at the wicked. They're like a great green laurel tree.

00:57:21.180 They're spreading out. And look, Lord, the righteous seem to be, you know, perishing.

00:57:26.220 The righteous seem to be suffering. And yet the psalmist does not give into that temptation.

00:57:31.060 And he affirms again, yet, Lord, you're going to cast them down. Their glory will be as nothing.

00:57:35.780 I will look for them and not even be able to find that great, spreading, green, seemingly powerful, wicked person anymore. 0.75

00:57:43.280 They will be driven out.

00:57:44.860 So I think two things we need to remember in this kind of storyline.

00:57:48.600 First, we need to remember that evil is cannibalistic.

00:57:53.480 Evil is cannibalistic. 0.82

00:57:54.920 Those who hate wisdom love death.

00:57:56.760 And so everywhere you see, you know, cultures built around demonic death cults, they are always devouring themselves over time.

00:58:04.900 This is a warning to modern America that all of our false worship is self-devouring and it will ultimately end in the blood of its worshipers. 0.53

00:58:16.240 And the second thing is that the meek will inherit the earth, that as the people of God go out in obedience and they obey the Lord and put one foot in front of the other and engage in the spiritual war that they're told to engage in, that the Lord delights to drive out our enemies before us.

00:58:32.160 So specifically, I do think that is what happens with the giants. 0.86

00:58:36.300 The cultures they build up are absolute death cultures and they devour themselves.

00:58:41.260 And then I also think that as the righteous go into the land in obedience and don't syncretize like they do later,

00:58:48.140 that you see them driven out and go to other places.

00:58:51.440 I'm sure Ben has other specific thoughts on that as well.

00:58:53.920 Yeah, no, I mean, I think that there's nothing in the Bible that disallows the possibility of multiple giants

00:59:01.680 maybe hundreds or legions of giants being alive at the time of Nimrod that also dispersed across

00:59:08.720 the earth when the Tower of Babel was judged by God. And the reason that I err towards that

00:59:15.940 opinion that did actually happen is because we see other massive pieces of weaponry found

00:59:23.020 in places like Wales, in islands like Crete, even in Russia, there's the legend of a giant warrior

00:59:31.660 who fought against the king and was finally subdued by a woman. Charlemagne, even in Charlemagne's

00:59:39.080 reign in the Carolingian time, there was a legend that Charlemagne sent his greatest

00:59:45.080 warrior to fight against a giant in some region of France. And the warrior was able to prevail

00:59:51.540 and kill the giant uh there was harry potter harry potter the giants live in england i'm sorry

00:59:58.260 go ahead there's the there's the trolls and tolkien now there's uh there's the story of also 0.97

01:00:04.020 charlemagne's sons riding a giant horse as a spoil of war that was able to carry four of them or

01:00:10.820 three of them at one time um and then there's also bones of course that have been found and

01:00:15.780 the smithsonian quickly quickly stole them away and hid them in their chambers legend says that

01:00:20.980 That the Smithsonian has suppressed huge amounts of evidence of ancient giants.

01:00:26.260 And I mean, listen, I think we can all agree that institutions, particularly ones in the bed with the powerful government establishment of the world, would never do that to us.

01:00:37.220 They would never suppress information. 0.61

01:00:39.000 The lizard people would never suppress information. 0.96

01:00:42.040 And aren't there also like bones have been found?

01:00:45.440 So you've named a lot of places.

01:00:46.920 But real quick, talk about North America.

01:00:49.820 Yeah.

01:00:50.040 So the best example in North America, there's a few.

01:00:55.200 One was the giant mummy that was found in California that was 18 feet tall, and they weren't able to disprove it.

01:01:01.520 Another is the Serpent Mound in Ohio is surrounded by other, they say they're Native American burial grounds.

01:01:09.100 But every time they look into one, they see giant bones.

01:01:12.840 And then most of the time, this is in like Wisconsin, Minnesota, Ohio area.

01:01:18.320 Every time they actually ask the Indians of the of the region, like the Pawnees, the Shawnees, they always say like, oh, no, yeah, we found those mounds like those are not we, you know, we piled some on top of it, but we actually found them as mounds.

01:01:33.060 And so there's been, I mean, dozens of cases of people claiming to have excavated giant bones, even up to 33 feet tall.

01:01:41.660 And what modernists want to do, what modernists love to do is to go, oh, those superstitious

01:01:48.620 folkloric traditions, those superstitious ancient cultures, like, man, isn't it funny 1.00

01:01:54.160 how dumb they are? 0.98

01:01:55.580 They thought the giant, like that there were giants, like, wow, they must have just thought 1.00

01:01:59.540 that all up and to scare the kids, keep the kids close to the campfire at night so they

01:02:03.760 didn't run off into the woods, you know, moral tales and that kind of thing.

01:02:07.820 And those same people will kill a baby and not think that there's anything religious about it.

01:02:14.700 Right. 0.96

01:02:15.500 Well, they won't even think it's a baby.

01:02:17.180 They won't even think it's a baby. 1.00

01:02:18.380 Those people don't know the difference between a man or a woman.

01:02:21.720 It's all religion. 0.96

01:02:23.120 We just have competing religions. 0.99

01:02:24.940 Right. 0.62

01:02:25.340 The spark of religion lies in every man. 0.98

01:02:28.140 Bavinck even says in his Prolegomena that every soul is inherently Christian until it's corrupted by their own sin, which I think is fascinating. 0.99

01:02:36.300 It's a bold statement. 0.97

01:02:37.280 but that is a bold statement i don't particularly like it but i do like i don't like it either but

01:02:44.080 i read it and i was like hey bobby my inner calvinist just twitch right that's what yeah

01:02:49.340 exactly as a calvinist i don't exactly like it unless we're using the word christian loosely

01:02:54.840 which i am a fan of doing unlike my baptist brothers there's only one christian thing

01:03:00.820 it's a regenerate individual soul you know what he means i i did i'll provide some context for my

01:03:07.640 brother herman bobbing bobbing is right yeah you got it you got to defend him because if that's

01:03:11.500 all you say then i i need to disagree with him what he means is that everyone is born religious

01:03:17.300 and specifically everyone is born with eyes in their head that are capable of looking at the

01:03:21.980 heavens and the earth seeing the glory of god everyone so in that sense he's saying every soul

01:03:27.180 is is inherently christian because everyone knows god it's just that some of them suppress it in

01:03:32.740 unrighteousness okay it's romans one it's romans yeah yeah it's romans one yeah so he said it i was

01:03:37.340 like whoa yeah no but that that is good that's important for people to realize that you know

01:03:41.680 it's not um ignorance doesn't stem from rebellion but rebellion stems from ignorance and so um or

01:03:48.100 i'm sorry um rebellion does not stem from ignorance it's not that people are born intellectually

01:03:52.940 ignorant of the things of god and therefore they're like well i don't know god he hasn't

01:03:56.340 proven himself i have to rebel so rebellion doesn't come from ignorance but rather um people

01:04:01.960 are first morally rebellious and therefore they actually make themselves progressively more

01:04:07.200 ignorant that's romans one is um it's both things can be simultaneously true in romans one you see

01:04:13.920 that um that people are born um not regenerate um but but they are born able to see true things 0.95

01:04:20.800 about god um and they progressively see less and less and less because in in their rebellion they

01:04:26.880 they're they're they gouge out their eyes they lie and suppress the truth and deeds of unrighteousness

01:04:31.380 so um so the idea if that's what he's saying then i i completely agree that i i think a child

01:04:36.080 absolutely a young child um on average is is going to have an easier time uh believing basic things

01:04:44.720 that would align with the the christian worldview the world as god made it uh than a guy who's gone

01:04:50.600 through k through 12 you know in the public school system hey to bring it full circle on our beloved

01:04:55.940 reform soteriology even the child desperately needs the grace of god to have believing faith

01:05:02.120 uh the soul is not born innocent no human is born innocent we're born guilty before god so yeah i

01:05:09.160 think that they'd have an easier time consenting to the idea that god made the heavens and the earth

01:05:13.760 uh but and bobbing would of course agree you need the grace of god to be saved yep amen so um so

01:05:20.420 where this is the final thing is okay so you talked about it ben and brian giants dispersing

01:05:27.300 and it could have been dispersing because joshua scared them off we know that happened and they

01:05:32.160 went to various places and that's just one tribe of giants the anakim uh that they went to gaza and

01:05:37.840 gath and that's where you eventually get you know um goliath and then you know david uh same thing

01:05:43.260 He kills Goliath and his brothers, and it seems like some other giants, but it doesn't necessarily mean that he killed them all.

01:05:48.940 So Joshua could have scared giants away, right?

01:05:51.780 Drive them out.

01:05:52.640 David, drive them out.

01:05:54.000 But also, like what you said, not just being driven out, but Nimrod, before you even get to Joshua and before you get to when the whole world had one language before Babel, Nimrod and other giants could have gone to various places all over the world.

01:06:07.960 And so it's entirely possible, whether it's escaping Joshua or escaping David or pre-Joshua and pre-David, pre-Babel even, just traveling and expeditions, that giants could have been everywhere over the world.

01:06:21.960 So here's the question.

01:06:23.520 Did we get them all?

01:06:26.020 Could giants be alive somewhere today?

01:06:29.480 Is that possible?

01:06:31.260 And if so, how have we not found them?

01:06:35.800 It is possible.

01:06:37.960 it is possible that giants are still out there today i think it's also possible that like the

01:06:42.520 blood of numenor as it descended through the generations and mingled with lesser men that

01:06:47.160 it was spent in its power and produced less and less of its potency you know you see that in

01:06:53.400 i'm obviously citing tolkien here but i think it's a good example where the numenoreans

01:06:58.440 intermingled with lesser men and so their lifespans instead of aragorn who lives almost

01:07:03.160 you know, what, 200 years old, 212, 212, you have, you know, men now going dwindling in their

01:07:09.360 stature and in their, their renown. I think some of that could have happened as the, as giants

01:07:15.180 went out, but, but absolutely. I think that there is a chance we have some interesting folklore

01:07:20.380 and modern folklore, even of giants still. Yeah. In, in 2001 when, or I'm sorry, 2002,

01:07:28.720 When the U.S. was just beginning its war in Iraq, there was a huge presence in the city of Kandahar.

01:07:36.660 And one of the stories is that there was a patrol team sent out into the mountains surrounding Kandahar to see if they could scout anything, any good positions or something.

01:07:45.620 And they never came back.

01:07:46.960 And they went radio silent for too long.

01:07:49.580 And so they sent a special forces unit to try and find this patrol of men.

01:07:54.060 And the special forces unit spent days hiking through the mountains of Kandahar.

01:07:58.180 And finally, in front of this cave, the mouth of this big cave, they saw a lot of the gear from these patrol officers laying around on the rocks.

01:08:09.360 And as they were kind of coming to terms with what they were seeing, as the story goes, a spear the size of Goliaths, maybe bigger,

01:08:18.540 shot out of the cave and impaled one of the men, uh, and, and went completely through him,

01:08:25.340 completely through his Kevlar vest and everything in one easy stroke and out stepped this 15 foot

01:08:31.040 tall, red haired, white skinned Kandahar giant with six fingers and six toes. And it took 30

01:08:38.000 seconds of 15 men with fully automatic weapons firing nonstop to bring him down 30 seconds.

01:08:46.380 That's a really hold your breath for 30 seconds. It's a long time. And so they radioed to their local headquarters and they asked him to send a Chinook. The Chinook came, grabbed this giant, carried him away. The men never saw it again. And they had to sign nondisclosure agreements to agree that they'd never say anything.

01:09:05.700 But that was after they had already told the legend back when they got back to headquarters.

01:09:10.600 And so it became an open and openly known lie is what they called it among the troops that were in Kandahar at that time.

01:09:18.920 That actually, yeah, this this unit of special forces officers found a giant and killed it.

01:09:25.500 And but they have to pretend like they didn't. But the government denied that, Ben.

01:09:30.300 The government did deny. Surprisingly, Snopes put in for a Freedom of Information Act.

01:09:36.520 And the government said, oh, we didn't take any giants out of Canada.

01:09:40.600 We would tell you this is an example of one of these. So this is funny.

01:09:44.040 I think there's an important point here to be made about the reliability of information, because you'll often find that sometimes people privilege ancient folklore as more likely to be true.

01:09:56.240 Like, well, I read this folkloric account from, you know, an ancient Eastern Eastern European village from the 1300s or something.

01:10:04.000 And and then you hear stories like this of like, ah, but that's just made up.

01:10:07.620 It's Internet stuff. It's Reddit. It's whatever.

01:10:09.880 But those are just our repositories of folklore folklore today.

01:10:14.880 So do we know whether this story is made up out of whole cloth, maybe some amalgamation of other stories?

01:10:21.500 Or is it just entirely true? We can't know.

01:10:24.640 We just don't know. We're not in a position to. But these kind of stories continue today.

01:10:30.020 And there are people who claim to continue to have interactions with, I think, even giants today.

01:10:35.840 So listener, you be the judge at the end of the day. What do you think?

01:10:40.440 If you are a giant, let us know in the comments.

01:10:42.580 And you are listening. Send us a photo with proof of height.

01:10:45.940 Now, I actually saw a video recently that was insane.

01:10:49.480 I don't know. It seemed like it'd be hard to fake, but I don't know anything about video.

01:10:53.040 And it was these these guys, they were like lensing while they were hunting and they looked down on this property line.

01:11:00.020 There was a river separating the two properties. And in between the trees and everything was this.

01:11:04.880 I mean, giant human looking thing. Yeah. Like slumped over long arms, massive head.

01:11:11.960 And and the guys on the video were like, what was that?

01:11:16.240 And then it just kind of disappeared. Almost like Bigfoot, like disappeared.

01:11:20.260 We have some Bigfoot episodes coming up in Haunted Cosmos Season 2 as well.

01:11:24.100 I think actually Episode 3 and 4, right?

01:11:26.080 Episodes 3 and 4.

01:11:27.160 3 and 4.

01:11:27.700 We just released Episode 2 as we're filming today.

01:11:30.180 So, like, two weeks from today as we're filming, the first one will come out.

01:11:34.100 But you see interesting things even with, like, the Bigfoot lore.

01:11:38.980 Expedition Bigfoot is a show that went out and investigated.

01:11:42.620 And they got a thermal image of a very strange bipedal-looking thing that when they replicated the exact camera location with a six-foot-tall man,

01:11:50.260 The thing was far larger, did not look like a bear, which is the only close thing anatomically in the North American woods that it could have been.

01:11:59.100 And so it's just like you're left with this.

01:12:01.520 Either they hoaxed that for television.

01:12:03.520 It's a bear and we just don't get how it could be a bear.

01:12:06.320 Or there was some weird bipedal eight, nine foot tall thing walking through the North American woods on an evening that they happened to capture.

01:12:13.640 And the thing that moderns are uncomfortable with, but that is true, is that all of those three options are possible.

01:12:19.580 Yeah, almost almost equally possible. We can't it's difficult to evaluate, right? So a lot of this stuff, you're going to end up coming back to eyewitness testimony. And when you factor in the spiritual element of some of this, and the trickstery spiritual element, you can also end up with where you're not actually just dealing with biological creatures, maybe, but that that there's deception happening is these are some themes we often discuss in Haunted Cosmos that, that the spiritual world loves to deceive as well.

01:12:49.580 And we are not fully aware of its total arsenal of all of the things that it has at its disposal to deceive.

01:12:58.920 Maybe it's able to trick a thermal camera.

01:13:02.820 Maybe it's able to trick human eyes.

01:13:05.660 Paul warns against an angel of light appearing and preaching another gospel, appearing as an angel of light.

01:13:12.500 So we have to be aware of deception and keep our eyes fixed on the main things and not fall in any of the ditches of materialism or also wild speculation and total craziness, which some Christians can fall into as well.

01:13:26.600 Keep our eye on the prize, though, that at the end of the day, when you look at the whole field of evidence, giants, demons, Bigfoot, all this stuff.

01:13:34.740 again and again it comes back to confirm the veracity of the christian witness in scripture

01:13:40.460 of the true history of the world right right right and i think that's the temptation of

01:13:47.540 anyone who hates god anyone who ultimately wants to be god himself like our government like

01:13:53.340 smithsonian or if if there was something true um today found whether it be bones or a living

01:14:01.000 giant or whatever it might be um absolutely i could see how there would be a vested interest

01:14:06.860 and incentive in those who would like to be god to cover it up because all it would do is confirm

01:14:12.560 the scripture it would immediately take credibility away from materialism and darwinism and and all

01:14:20.460 the science it would discredit it would it would humiliate and embarrass um so many leading

01:14:27.220 authorities today and all of a sudden it would be us it would be the christians that people would

01:14:33.520 be running to with all their questions because they'd be like oh these guys were right the whole

01:14:37.960 time and these guys were lying you know and and so it there would be it when people think well

01:14:44.920 there's no way that that a giant could exist or there's no way that this could exist or that

01:14:49.060 could exist or that there's you know 18 foot tall bones or or whatever that's not possible because

01:14:54.600 there's no way that that um that that could be hidden or or would be hidden there's no incentive

01:15:00.060 that people don't understand the allure of power they don't understand how uh how much incentive

01:15:06.140 there's more incentive uh to hiding giant bones um than than there would be for robbing someone of

01:15:13.500 a billion dollars because because the giant bones keeping if that gets exposed you're talking about

01:15:19.600 a shift of power and credibility and all these kinds of things that's worth trillions and

01:15:24.740 trillions of dollars over time and so yeah there's um reputations are on the line and it's entirely

01:15:30.940 possible and we're not saying anything for certain but but i think what we are saying is that the

01:15:35.940 bible's real and and that god's word is true and that we shouldn't um we shouldn't just think in a

01:15:42.060 in a in a in a chasm in one particular vein like moderns and and think that there's no possible way

01:15:48.900 that any of these other things could ever be true we want we want to we want to be well-rounded we

01:15:54.140 want to look at the evidence and we want to remember that we live in god's magical world

01:15:58.700 so any final thoughts that you guys have for this episode i was just going to say it all reminds me

01:16:04.540 of uh the scene in the silver chair uh in the chronicles of narnia that's what i keep thinking

01:16:10.260 of yeah when when puddle glum finally stands up to to the queen under which by the way is serpent

01:16:15.600 imagery, earth. And the queen's true form is revealed as this horribly grotesque serpent 0.83

01:16:24.600 demon. And one of the things that we should take from that is that it always behooves,

01:16:31.380 it's always a top priority of the powers of darkness and the schemes of the devil

01:16:35.320 to not be seen for what they really are. And so if you have a Molex state, a God state,

01:16:43.420 that's trying to cause everyone to functionally worship them, then it will always be a top 0.70

01:16:49.600 priority of theirs, no matter what the cost, to make sure you don't see it for what it actually

01:16:55.280 is. And so it may sound silly when we say like, so of course they would hide giant bones and they

01:17:00.160 would tell the soldiers to shut up. But no, that really is what they would do. Like this isn't

01:17:05.040 silly. This is just the basic tenets of good versus evil that God's given us to work with in

01:17:10.980 the world and we know that they're the basic tenets because we've already seen them in his

01:17:15.780 word and so we shouldn't be shocked if they show up again even after christ's overwhelming victory

01:17:21.140 yep amen amen all right guys thank you so much for coming on the show um haunted cosmos is now

01:17:27.800 not just on uh podcast platforms but you can uh check you guys out on youtube so a lot of our

01:17:32.800 guys you know we've got people who follow us on podcast uh platforms you know spotify and you know

01:17:37.600 apple but most of our listeners they pick us up on youtube so if you're watching this on youtube

01:17:41.720 right now you should go over and subscribe to haunted cosmos on youtube click the bell you'll

01:17:46.860 be notified every time brian and ben come out with him for uh new episodes and you guys are

01:17:51.700 it's once every two weeks that you come out with an episode of haunted cosmos but you're doing some

01:17:55.520 other things too yeah we try to do on the off weeks we try to release a uh a q a episode of

01:18:01.600 the show where we're playing chess and answering questions and we're doing both very poorly yeah

01:18:06.140 great that's called chess is not just stuff chess is not just and right now the record stands in

01:18:11.280 the games is a one nil and and that's that's you brian you're the one i don't i don't i don't want

01:18:18.120 to say hey i'll admit it brian won the first one that was on record that was on record ben actually

01:18:23.540 won the first since then i have beat him in five games in a row and that's why it's so the world

01:18:30.380 is not just stuff.

01:18:34.640 Thanks for having us on Joel.

01:18:36.120 It was an honor and a fun discussion.

01:18:38.460 We're glad to come in

01:18:39.840 and hang out with you anytime.

01:18:41.500 Cool. Thanks, guys.

The NXR Podcast - October 14, 2024

THE INTERVIEW - Biblical Giants Were Way Bigger Than You Think - ICYMI with @hauntedcosmos_

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