The NXR Podcast - THE INTERVIEW - President Trump Is In Real Danger w C. Jay Engel & Andrews Isker

00:00:00.000 In less than a year, our podcast has gone from an average of 10,000 downloads a month

00:00:04.300 to 50,000 downloads. What made the difference? You leaving us a five-star review. The more

00:00:10.260 positive reviews, the more the algorithm picks us up, and more people are confronted by the law

00:00:16.360 and gospel of Jesus Christ. Help us press forward the crown rights of King Jesus by leaving us a

00:00:23.480 five-star review on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks. All right, welcome back to

00:00:28.940 another episode of Theology Applied. I am your host, Pastor Joel Webbin with Right Response

00:00:33.120 Ministries. Today, I've got Andrew Isker, CJ Engel. They're co-hosts of a podcast. They're

00:00:38.400 coming on the show. They talk politics. They're both solid Christian men, but they're good

00:00:42.720 thinkers, really, really good thinkers. They can actually think in categories. They don't just do

00:00:46.260 the Jesus juke and, you know, we'll just preach the gospel. They're actually okay with the state

00:00:50.220 doing what God ordains in scripture, Romans 13, and actually using the sword and exercising power.

00:00:56.300 Christians having power is not inherently wicked or wrong.

00:01:00.020 Christians are called to exercise power

00:01:02.900 as much as God and his providence would allow for

00:01:05.040 in responsible, righteous ways

00:01:06.960 for the good of their neighbors, out of love for neighbor.

00:01:09.780 If our neighbor is being overrun

00:01:12.100 by an invasion of military-aged men at the border,

00:01:14.960 we wanna exercise righteous laws

00:01:16.680 and use power in Christian ways

00:01:18.360 to love and protect our neighbors.

00:01:20.460 So those are the kinds of things

00:01:21.920 that we're talking about.

00:01:22.700 Predominantly, we're gonna be talking about Donald Trump,

00:01:24.620 the phenomenon of Donald Trump, and some of our predictions of what we think

00:01:28.320 may be on the horizon this election year in 2024. So let's go ahead and get ready and start the

00:01:34.880 show. Applying God's word to every aspect of life. This is Theology Applied.

00:01:46.580 All right, welcome back to another episode of Theology Applied. I'm your host, Pastor Joel

00:01:50.160 Webbin with Right Response Ministries. And in this episode, we're going to be talking about

00:01:54.140 the very real possibility that former president Donald J. Trump could be assassinated. Now,

00:02:01.460 that's not all we're going to talk about. And I mean that in the literal sense. I don't mean

00:02:04.800 metaphorically that politically he might not. I really think that the regime hates him so much

00:02:09.860 and is so desperate that the only way, I don't know if some of the court charges are going to

00:02:14.460 work. There's multiple different strategies, threats to try to neutralize the political

00:02:19.880 opponent to our current regime, uh, you know, get them in jail, but I don't know if it'll work

00:02:24.380 rig an election and, you know, voter booths and all that. There's a lot of different things,

00:02:28.220 but it may be that the only way to keep them out of office is, um, to put a bullet in his chest. 0.90

00:02:33.680 Um, I, and so we're not saying that's going to happen. I'm not, I don't have a crystal ball. 0.94

00:02:37.780 I'm neither a prophet nor the son of a prophet, but that's what we're going to be talking about.

00:02:40.820 It's election year. Uh, the people of God need to have discernment. We can't be naive. We can't be

00:02:45.680 foolish. We need to know, all right, 2020, it wasn't random. It was an election year. That's 0.98

00:02:50.680 a big part of the COVID thing. That's a big part of BLM and riots and the summer of love, all these

00:02:55.160 things. What's going to happen in 2024? We don't know, but likely it will be as severe, as bad as

00:03:01.920 2020, if not worse. So that's the topic of the discussion. And for this topic, I wanted to get

00:03:07.520 guys who I think are some of the better thinkers within the reformed world of Christianity today.

00:03:14.460 and so to help me with this because they'll have uh ideas that i don't have and better ideas that

00:03:19.580 i don't have so i'm welcoming to the show cj engel and uh andrew isker who are the co-host

00:03:25.560 of contra mundum uh their podcast welcome to the show guys thank you joel thanks for having us right

00:03:31.140 tell our listeners about yourself uh tell them about the show tell them about you and um yeah

00:03:35.500 give your credentials whatever you want to do sure yeah so i um andrew and i have been doing

00:03:40.960 this for a year or two but we we we've been talking politics for 10 plus years probably

00:03:46.140 um we got our origins in a um you know clutch your pearls the libertarian world and um not

00:03:53.900 quickly but eventually realized that there were uh myriad problems with that and we began to see

00:04:00.140 the world the more realistic way and we um have gone rightward ever since uh but we yeah we've

00:04:05.980 grown together um through numerous events and it's been a fun journey but basically we have a

00:04:10.820 podcast and um i spend a lot of my time doing all the the reading and writing and commenting and

00:04:16.280 things like that just having a good time and fighting the good fight it's it's funny because

00:04:20.480 you know years ago you know you just you think it's just a goofy thing to spend time reading

00:04:25.160 and writing and sharing your thoughts but it actually does change conversation and affects

00:04:29.600 paradigms and shifts silverton windows and it's it's really fun to see the effect and say you know

00:04:34.440 I've, I've been, I've been part of that, but having conversations does matter.

00:04:39.180 Minds can be changed and, you know, people,

00:04:41.880 I'm always surprised to see how quickly things are changing and you know,

00:04:45.480 that reinvigorates me and motivates me to keep the momentum.

00:04:48.700 Yep. Amen. Andrew.

00:04:51.420 Yeah. I, I could just echo what, what CJ said there that we've, yeah,

00:04:55.980 we've been, we've been following this stuff for, yeah,

00:04:59.060 at least 10 years and we've known each other, I think since like 2014.

00:05:02.220 uh and yeah we were we were in the libertarian ron paul kind of world and over time we independently

00:05:11.280 of each other both were like wait this you know this world that we used to have doesn't really

00:05:17.680 exist anymore and we we still certainly love you know liberty and freedom and and you know the

00:05:25.140 free market things like that but it's like no our whole our whole society has been destroyed

00:05:29.500 And there is nothing we can do except for fight back and restore order. That is the biggest thing that's needed is just a restoration of sanity and normal political order. And you're not going to be able to affect that by appealing to the non-aggression principle, things like that.

00:05:54.740 So, yeah, we just kind of moved more rightward. I read, I started reading, you know, like Russell Kirk and and men like that. I was reading Paul Gottfried, who's friends with CJ and thinking, oh, these guys get it.

00:06:11.320 Like they get what, what was going on and what, what we have to do and how, how a society functions and works and, and where the political element of that is important, which, you know, in the libertarian world was very neglected.

00:06:26.380 And so, yeah, we, we, and we both kind of came at it from different directions, but we certainly at the time probably had very different theological perspectives or not, you know, different within the reformed world, at least.

00:06:39.880 Um, and over time we both kind of came to the same position where it's like, no, there, there is, um, there's an order that God has, has built into the universe.

00:06:49.340 He's, he's written it into, into the, into the world, into his creation.

00:06:54.040 And it perfectly conforms with what he says in his word too.

00:06:57.600 So it's like, you know, I was, I was much more theonomic and CJ was much more natural law.

00:07:02.080 And we both were like, we don't really have to be in conflict at all with these things.

00:07:08.480 Um, that, that there's a way that, that both these perspectives, you know, more or less, uh, fit together. And, and we viewed, you know, politics from, from the same frame, uh, that, that, that politics is something that, you know, certainly in the last hundred years in the evangelical world is something that's been just completely ignored.

00:07:27.720 that there is no you know christian understanding of of the political and and so for me like i i

00:07:35.760 looked at that i thought like this is something that we have to recover and restore there's so

00:07:38.900 much like we've we've i don't know if we mentioned steven wolf yet but like he's done a ton of work

00:07:44.180 just recovering uh what what reformed thinkers hundreds of years ago thought about politics

00:07:49.820 and it's like wow this stuff is great this has been here the whole time i can't believe it uh

00:07:54.400 You know, people, you know, wise theologians and pastors and writers and thinkers had a lot of good stuff to say about things that are relevant to us today.

00:08:05.500 And we've just totally neglected all of that completely to have this sort of pietistic, almost anabaptistic view of politics where it's like, oh, I'm only going to preach the gospel and everything else, right, doesn't matter because I'm preaching the gospel.

00:08:20.860 And it's like, that's not how reformed people talked about their world at all 100, 200, 300 years ago.

00:08:26.420 And so we've kind of dived headfirst or dove headfirst into that.

00:08:31.360 And it has been great.

00:08:34.140 Like CJ said, you thought like, I'm just posting online and maybe I'm just shouting out into the void.

00:08:41.760 Like, is this just a hobby or just a fun thing to do?

00:08:45.100 But you actually see that this moves the needle for people.

00:08:49.040 I mean, look at people like in Oklahoma with Dusty Deavers.

00:08:54.060 I mean, he's heavily influenced by our circles, maybe even came out of them.

00:09:00.960 So these things have real world implications.

00:09:04.040 And I think that right there in 10 years was like a huge white pill for me.

00:09:09.060 Like just seeing that, like he reads our stuff.

00:09:12.380 He echoes the themes that we echo.

00:09:14.500 He's got priorities that reflect our own.

00:09:16.660 and he's now writing bills to outlaw pornography in oklahoma it's like these we can do this this

00:09:23.200 is happening it's possible yeah right yeah absolutely yeah the part of the problem is

00:09:28.720 evangelicals and people in general and not just picking on christians but in today's world our

00:09:32.640 culture we can't we just can't think in categories we can't speak in categories and so you know for

00:09:38.080 a lot of christians it's just you know preach the gospel the gospel alone you know like uh you know

00:09:42.660 trump is not the savior of the world he's not you know you're not going to have a political savior

00:09:46.380 jesus is the savior and say you're you're we're talking past each other of course jesus is the

00:09:51.800 savior like which i resent those kind of remarks because really that's i mean that's a that's

00:09:56.920 actually levying levying a very serious accusation in charge it's it's just straight up calling you

00:10:02.340 um a heretic like because what they're asserting is that that you worship donald trump or you

00:10:06.660 literally but it's like you know i don't believe that you know i'm not praying to donald trump

00:10:11.400 you know i haven't asked donald trump into my heart and to forgive me of my sins like

00:10:16.040 like you know that but you're still doing it so it's not even ignorance at that point it's just

00:10:20.000 it's it's um it's devious and sinister it's it's levying a false charge against a fellow brother

00:10:24.680 you know sister in christ and and so but we the problem is part of it is you know like i said some

00:10:29.880 of these guys are sinister but but for others who maybe are the less sinister breed um it's just 0.99

00:10:35.340 just astounding ignorance and stupidity, but we need to work on ourselves. We need to grow. We 1.00

00:10:42.380 need to be discipled. We need to learn. We need to realize, okay, you know what? The civil magistrate

00:10:46.840 bearing the sword, you can legislate morality. That's all legislation is. And absolutely,

00:10:52.820 that makes a difference because we're not just talking about eternal salvation. That's first

00:10:58.020 and foremost. That's the highest. But we're also talking about, I'd love for my kids not to be in

00:11:04.640 physical danger. I would like for them to be able to live a long life on the earth and be protected

00:11:09.280 from degenerates and criminals and murderers. And the state does that. The state with the sword

00:11:16.620 says, I'm sorry, you cannot do this wicked thing. And if you do this wicked thing, we're not going

00:11:25.000 to preach the gospel to you. We're not going to ask you politely to stop. We're going to hang you.

00:11:30.320 Like I recently had a show where I said, you know, I was talking about like, I was, well, you know, I was talking about at the time, it wasn't that recent, I guess it was a while back, but I was talking about Ketanji Brown Jackson and just saying that, you know, I don't believe that women should serve in these positions of leadership. 1.00

00:11:48.540 And in part, because I don't believe that they're designed for it. 0.97

00:11:52.260 I believe it's unbiblical, but God's not arbitrary with his rules and what the Bible teaches. 0.99

00:11:57.220 I think they're not suited for it. 1.00

00:11:59.120 And so I said like, you know, women are uniquely designed by God to nurture, but criminals don't need nurturing, they need hanging. And that's what men do. Men hang well. And so, you know, and that was like my, you know, my big, you know, quote zinger. And so, you know, but my point is that like, now I'm thinking about that now. And I'm thinking about sadly, you know, like, I mean, she seems like a wonderful woman in many regards, but now I'm thinking about, you know, Amy, Amy Coney Barrett.

00:12:25.140 Um, and I'm thinking, and here's the deal.

00:12:26.920 I was adopted, right?

00:12:27.780 So I'm just going to say this, Eric Collins, you know, infamous tweet about adoption that

00:12:31.200 got so much negative feedback.

00:12:32.780 Um, I, you know, I was adopted.

00:12:35.200 I'm pro adoption.

00:12:36.200 I think that's great.

00:12:36.880 But one of the things right now, I think with evangelicals is we can't speak in categories.

00:12:40.740 Also, um, evangelicals have been discipled to despise nature, right?

00:12:44.540 So they only care about the spiritual, they hate, cause that's a common denominator, whether

00:12:48.220 it's adoption or whether it's, um, uh, tweets about why you should dress up on Sunday or

00:12:53.880 why working out matters or why a man should have a gun to protect. All those are natural things.

00:12:59.780 And nature, anything natural is viewed as vanity. It's viewed as sinful. It's viewed as,

00:13:05.180 at best, it's viewed as a distraction and without value. At worst, some of the more devious players

00:13:12.500 within evangelicalism will actually say that you're doing something destructive and it's bad.

00:13:17.340 It's heretical. It's idolatry. Exactly. Idolatry. And so my point is that with the adoption thing,

00:13:23.660 what Eric Kahn was getting at, he wasn't dogging adoption. People are reading in the least

00:13:28.060 charitable light, but what he was trying to say is that nature matters. Nature matters. Once you're

00:13:32.840 adopted, then that is your child. That is your child and you have more obligations as a parent

00:13:37.180 to provide, to love, all those kinds of things. But he was talking about the decision to adopt

00:13:41.220 before they've become your child and saying you shouldn't adopt another child to become your

00:13:47.800 child. They're not your child yet. If it's going to put you in a precarious situation where you're

00:13:53.100 compromised in your moral obligation to your natural children, if you already have children.

00:13:57.600 And there's case study after case study of adopting through the foster care system,

00:14:01.240 which is a wonderful thing to do with wisdom, with prudence, but adopting an older child that's

00:14:06.320 going to come in and you have a two-year-old and this older child is 13 and has been through the

00:14:12.000 fight. That may not be the wisest thing to do. It was a perfectly reasonable tweet,

00:14:16.000 but he gets destroyed. All that back to the Amy Coney Barrett. My point is, 0.94

00:14:19.140 is it a coincidence that um not a man but a woman on the supreme court it was all five women who

00:14:25.420 over you know who overruled texas john roberts but yeah well you're right yeah yeah i think joel

00:14:31.700 joel was setting up for that joel's right yeah women of both sexes uh but yeah but but it's

00:14:37.160 four women and and one one dude that we can count on um to to vote the wrong way but um but it's 1.00

00:14:43.020 it's so it's these five individuals overruling texas right to stop an invasion of military

00:14:48.520 fighting age men at our border by the millions uh that endanger our prodigy our native citizens

00:14:55.820 our natural people um for the foreigner so that the foreigner uh we're gonna we're gonna let the 0.62

00:15:01.680 foreigner in as it is it a coincidence that the woman that if for most of uh cases is is more

00:15:08.680 conservative by comparison on the court of of nine individuals but on this particular issue

00:15:13.980 that deals with loving the stranger at the cost of your natural kinsmen and your native citizens.

00:15:22.680 And here's the woman who's not just a woman, but also has several children and more than one of

00:15:28.000 them adopted. And I thought, as I was watching that, I thought about that and how it related

00:15:33.160 to the Eric Kahn tweet. And I thought, gosh, I wish evangelicals could not clutch their pearls

00:15:40.080 and could speak in categories and not be such pietist and think about the ramifications of

00:15:44.960 nature and could have read eric khan's tweet and saw he's got a point and here it is just just a

00:15:50.420 few weeks later i don't think that's a coincidence just a few or maybe a couple months later here's

00:15:55.460 here's a a real world situation with massive implications that is exactly what eric khan i

00:16:01.340 mean it's almost like he's a prophet like what he was talking about what do you guys think about

00:16:05.160 that yeah it's um so so andrew said in the beginning that he was more theonomic and i was

00:16:10.780 more natural law um that's not quite true i've actually come to respect nature uh in a much more

00:16:17.300 robust way over the last you know three years i never would have considered myself um i so you

00:16:23.320 know there's just the the classic you know tomist scholastic you know frame you know framework about

00:16:29.020 you know, that grace restores and upholds nature. It doesn't repudiate it. I think that that

00:16:35.900 framework, I think, is at the root of so many of our conversations that people think the function 0.98

00:16:41.980 of Christianity is basically to undermine and tear down nature, which is evil and disgusting 0.98

00:16:47.940 and bad. And we should we should be suspicious and cynical of anything relating to nature and 1.00

00:16:54.100 natural things. Whereas the classical view, the traditional view, the view that the Bible echoes

00:17:00.080 or presumes in its own framework is that it's God's nature. He created the order. He's the

00:17:09.400 one that created the world and nature reflects his own character. And what grace does is it allows us

00:17:14.800 to reorient ourselves to pursue it and to build it up and to glorify God with it in a way that

00:17:23.640 we couldn't before grace. So grace not only restores nature, but it reinvigorates us. And so

00:17:31.600 the natural part of our humanity in our world is something that we should uphold and we should

00:17:37.320 study and we should praise. I mean, you know, Eric Kahn's tweet, you see it reflected in the

00:17:43.000 Supreme Court. You also see it reflected in the overall atmosphere of our political

00:17:47.240 culture. It's very feminine, and that has consequences. I often talk to Andrew about 0.98

00:17:54.340 the character of our totalitarianism. When you look at Soviet Russia and China, those were very

00:17:59.940 masculine totalitarianisms. You had a gun to your head, and you had to submit. There were

00:18:05.660 physical consequences. There were beatings. Those were all the aspects of communistic

00:18:12.480 totalitarianism. Our totalitarianism is very much a feminine totalitarianism. 1.00

00:18:17.240 You have to think in terms of psychological categories. You have to think in terms of emotional victims. You have to think in terms of love. Everything's framed in love and hate and all of these things. It's a very feminine thing. If you hurt the wrong people, you can get fired. That never would have happened in communist Russia. 1.00

00:18:35.260 I mean, they were they were they had outlawed homosexuality there. They still do. The Communist Party is the one that's actually right now. The Communist Party is the one that's seeking to outlaw homosexuality in Russia. Why? Because ours is a feminine totalitarianism and it seeks to undermine nature. 1.00

00:18:51.560 And that's one of the consequences of distorting nature is the political ramifications are distorted. They're grotesque. They're disturbing. And a lot of that is because we don't treat nature with a very pious, pious in the good sense, a very pious mentality. You know, we have no reverence for nature at all. We seek to destroy it. And, you know, our society reflects that, that endeavor. 0.99

00:19:14.760 Well said. Andrew, what do you think?

00:19:16.140 Yeah, I think CJ is right. And I'm sorry for saying, oh yeah, you were the natural law guy. You got on it earlier than I did. That's what I mean.

00:19:28.860 But yeah, I think that is that's very true that that a lot of people, they they I don't want to use the G word, but I think I got to the it's almost this Gnostic view that matter is bad, that the world is bad, that that anything material and physical is is axiomatically bad in contrast to the spiritual.

00:19:55.140 right that's a huge undercurrent uh within american evangelicalism and 100 and and it

00:20:01.840 perfectly fits with this kind of effeminate totalitarianism that cj is describing because

00:20:09.220 right that's precisely what they're trying to do they're trying to destroy

00:20:12.680 nature they're trying to destroy the the order of the world that god has created and and um you

00:20:19.920 know the the communists in the 20th century they were trying to do that too but it was from like

00:20:23.180 the top down right it was from um it was from like macroeconomics down that they were trying to

00:20:29.940 reorder nature whereas um our totalitarianism it's it's from like the bottom up you know it's

00:20:37.200 like the fundamental you know basis of a society that god has created is that men are men and women

00:20:43.380 are women and and a man takes a wife and they have children and that's how society continue or human

00:20:49.580 civilization continues on, but it's, it's disordering that at the very root. Right. And so 0.78

00:20:55.260 rather than, you know, taking, taking a human civilization from the top saying, all right,

00:21:00.880 we're, here's how we're going to order the economy and, and, and use brute force to accomplish that. 0.92

00:21:05.680 It's, we're going to subvert what it means to be a man or a woman from, from the very get go, 0.98

00:21:11.500 from the very bottom. And so, you know, the, the evangelical, like very pietistic, 0.56

00:21:17.080 anti-material world of viewpoint perfectly meshes with that. And so it presents like no

00:21:29.380 conflict to it whatsoever. So when you have a reinvigorated Christianity that has a respect,

00:21:39.000 or even, you know, CJ says, like it views nature piously, right?

00:21:45.800 It views it that God has created this world and it's good.

00:21:50.340 It's marred by sin, but grace takes away that sin

00:21:54.220 and restores nature to how he wants it to be.

00:21:58.120 That that presents a direct challenge to all of this.

00:22:02.180 And so you see, like, yeah, we mentioned like Dusty, right?

00:22:04.680 There was a story, you know, as of when we're recording this,

00:22:08.160 You know, recently there was the story in the New York Post about him and they're all freaking out about, you know, one little state senator in Oklahoma, right?

00:22:15.680 Like one of the small state that is flyover country, they don't care about it all.

00:22:21.420 It's like, well, how dare this guy try to roll back degeneracy in our in our in our glorious country.

00:22:27.780 and right there they're threatened by this stuff because that's this is just basic basic

00:22:33.120 christianity that he in basic christian moral order that that he is working to restore and

00:22:39.920 they he's working to restore with power by exercising power he's not just dusty and dusty's

00:22:46.340 a pastor so he is preaching the gospel and he's preaching the gospel to unbelievers in his personal

00:22:50.900 life and evangelism and all those kinds of things and unbelievers who might show up on a sunday

00:22:54.420 morning. But he's not only doing that. He's saying, I'm going to do that, but then I'm also

00:22:58.260 going to run for office. He's now a state senator. He won in his district. And immediately, it's only

00:23:03.980 been a few weeks, he's already submitted nine different bills to abolish income tax, to abolish

00:23:09.300 abortion, to abolish pornography. That's the one that the New York Post is freaking out about.

00:23:13.660 Like, how in the world could such far-right extremist Christians think that you could

00:23:19.580 actually have a law a legitimate law that says um uh watching uh pornography is is bad and you're

00:23:28.700 not allowed to do it and it's like we're so far gone at this point as a culture that you know that

00:23:33.140 that basic i mean that's just a basic christian thought um that that just seems um that you know

00:23:39.620 and even the sad thing is even christians those or at least they would profess to be christians

00:23:43.280 they would say yeah pornography is bad but you can't you can't uh use laws to to make it illegal

00:23:48.740 yes you can all right everybody's been asking can i live stream your conference and the answer is

00:23:54.820 a resounding no you will be there in person or you will not be there at all i'm just kidding

00:24:00.400 you actually can live stream the conference we're excited to announce we're making it available to

00:24:04.860 anybody and everybody who wants to watch this conference right as it's happening which is

00:24:10.080 march 1st and 2nd that's a friday and saturday of 2024 what conference am i even talking about

00:24:16.080 it's called Blueprints for Christendom 2.0. We've got Pastor Douglas Wilson, we've got Dr. Joe Boot,

00:24:22.140 we've got Brian Sauve, we've got Eric Kahn, and then of course, yours truly, Joel Webin. We've got

00:24:27.340 seven primary sessions in the conference, each one being probably 50 to 60 minute long sessions,

00:24:34.540 lectures, sermons, whatever you want to call them, and then two live panels, each being an hour and a

00:24:40.240 half long. Now, one of the panels is on biblical patriarchy. We're going to have Pastor Douglas

00:24:44.960 wilson available for that panel and we decided to get eric khan because eric khan biblical

00:24:50.440 patriarchy let's just be honest it's a sensitive topic but eric khan i think is known as one of

00:24:55.740 the most nuanced careful and sensitive individuals especially on the twitter street so we're going

00:25:00.360 to have him as a part of that panel it'll go really well then the second panel is haunted

00:25:05.040 cosmos live show you've got brian sauve and ben garrett talking about the most unhinged things

00:25:11.080 imaginable, hopefully some things that are actually truthful. Now, there will be some

00:25:15.600 truthful things. They're going to stick to scripture, and when they speculate, and you know

00:25:18.700 they will, they'll at least let you know that it's speculation, and they won't pass it off as though

00:25:23.260 it's in the infallible Word of God. So, live stream this conference. How do you do it? Go to

00:25:27.720 patreon.com forward slash right response ministries. Again, that's patreon.com forward slash right

00:25:36.340 response ministries a lot of guys charge 50 bucks 60 bucks 80 bucks we are asking that you

00:25:42.320 would simply partner with us for 10 a month and let's be real you could do it one month

00:25:48.160 live stream all the content and then cancel your subscription and if you do no harm no foul if you

00:25:53.700 want to stick with us and support this ministry what god's doing through right response then

00:25:57.700 praise god that's great and we thank you either way technically it's only 10 bucks it's really

00:26:03.280 It's really it's really important to emphasize that, like, you know, this is considered an extreme right position to want to ban pornography.

00:26:10.600 But when you look at fifteen hundred, you know, eighteen hundred years, whatever of Christendom, it's only the last like maybe like 40 years where this was considered like a legitimate human right.

00:26:23.600 Right. Like they're the extremists.

00:26:25.220 we're that it's such a mainstream centrist position to consider pornography um as um a

00:26:32.620 criminal activity um it's so it's it's the mainstream centrist position we're the moderates

00:26:37.120 here for you know for our position uh so don't don't get um gaslit into thinking that you're

00:26:41.900 an extremist on this or you're part of like the overall current of a thousand years of legal

00:26:46.560 tradition right absolutely well okay so we got to do this i know that we there's there's more

00:26:51.140 that we can say but i do want to get into you know the way that i framed it in the beginning

00:26:54.740 in the introduction. I want to get into some predictions, you know, we, and we did this,

00:26:59.400 you know, what got us into this was doing introductions and, you know, who are you guys

00:27:02.900 and what are you interested in? What do you do? And, you know, that got us into politics,

00:27:06.180 you know, in a Christian view and biblical view of politics, because that's what you do.

00:27:09.400 And I think that's really great. And we can come back to some of that, but, um, but I also want

00:27:13.560 to do, you know, um, I want to do, you know, some predictions, right. And we're not, and we're not

00:27:18.980 saying we're not, these are not prophecies, right. We're not doing the, you know, this will happen,

00:27:23.420 right like james lindsey kind of thing like if you know uh if you know in in the month of june

00:27:28.920 um i like not i predict but it will happen that there'll be an extremist reaction to a gay pride

00:27:34.600 thing and blah blah blah and it's going to destroy you know the right and uh so we're not doing that

00:27:39.780 what we're doing instead of saying this will happen we're saying um something will probably

00:27:45.480 happen in an election year to try to get donald j trump to not be elected and one i think one

00:27:53.000 real possibility is assassination and not even from someone who's an american citizen not citizen

00:27:59.460 not even necessarily a three-letter agency that's been hijacked you know whatever the fbi or that

00:28:03.760 but even other countries i mean every the whole world has a vested interest um in in what happens

00:28:09.460 in america and who our president is and if you have a certain president who has a proven track

00:28:14.580 record of not being soft when it comes to wars in the middle east and when it you know who's

00:28:20.360 far more willing to put tariffs you know with economics with other countries to uh shut down 0.85

00:28:26.400 wars who i mean who straight up used to tweet at 3 a.m at night like you know uh i'll bomb kim jong

00:28:31.480 you know like you know like so my point is it's not just americans that you know never trump i 0.86

00:28:37.040 hate trump you know the screaming you know libtard with purple hair you know um but but it's it's 0.96

00:28:42.160 people you know uh regimes in china it's it's um it's it's ukraine it's you know i mean all over 0.93

00:28:48.340 the world, there is an incentive for many, many, many, many people worldwide to not have that guy

00:28:54.300 in office to the point of, and we know what the world's capable of doing. I mean, China already

00:28:59.100 literally released a virus on the entire world to stop an election. I really do think that that was 0.99

00:29:06.240 a big part of the incentive and motive, and I do not think it was an accident. And so all that

00:29:11.520 being said, if they did it, you know, back in 2020, I think we're naive, right? We don't want

00:29:16.540 to be doomsday. We trust in Christ. We love Christ. We're going to be obedient. We're going

00:29:21.800 to keep calm and cool heads, but we're also not going to be naive, stupid people who think that 1.00

00:29:28.740 we live in la-la land. There are wicked, wicked people in the world, in our government and in 1.00

00:29:33.940 other governments in the world. And so Christians should just be aware. Otherwise, what did we 1.00

00:29:40.200 learn in 2020? It's election time. It's going to be a crazy year. Here are some things that

00:29:44.800 could happen and here's how christians should be thinking and here's how we should prepare that

00:29:48.760 that's what i'd like love to do with the second half of the episode what do you what do you guys

00:29:52.580 what do you guys think of predictions and possibilities how should christians be thinking

00:29:57.440 about you go ahead cj make your prediction yeah okay well um first of all i think um

00:30:04.720 trump is the most popular i think trump like if if we lived in you know the the world that

00:30:11.380 people say we live in about democracy and the right of the people to select their own

00:30:16.000 political leaders, all that stuff. Trump would win hands down, like case closed. He would have

00:30:20.340 won in 2016. And he would just smash it in this cycle as well. That said, we don't live in that

00:30:27.920 world. Obviously, I mean, they brag about this in the Washington Post that they need to do what

00:30:32.180 they can to prevent him from becoming the president. They will do what they can. And they

00:30:37.580 They are experts, they're professionals in selecting political candidates who are not popular.

00:30:46.480 This is what they do in Ukraine.

00:30:48.560 This is what they do in Europe.

00:30:50.300 And this is what they do here. 0.72

00:30:52.120 They are color revolutionaries.

00:30:54.160 They know how to use media.

00:30:56.520 They know how to use lawfare.

00:30:58.360 They know how to use incentives, economic incentives, personal threats.

00:31:02.300 They will do what they can to prevent Trump from winning.

00:31:05.560 So I think that's, so how successful are they going to be? You know, what, to what end would they do this stuff? I mean, I think they'll start with a layer of indictments, you know, see how that goes. I think that will make Trump even more popular. I think people, people are sort of in the mood that they actually want to see him get indicted and they want to see him, they want to see him get elected, you know, from prison, basically, pardon him.

00:31:26.820 I mean, seriously, but evangelicals jump in on this and say, yeah, because you like criminals and you're not very Christian in the way you approach things, but they never ask themselves, how is it that heritage America, that people who can find four, five, six generations of roots here in America, how is it that these forgotten Americans would despise the system so much that they want to see a political candidate in that situation challenge the regime in such a humiliating way?

00:31:54.520 Nobody asks what they're feeling, what they're going through. They don't care. So the question is, to what extent do the political elites hate everyday Americans? And I think that they would do anything to get Trump elected. I don't think the indictments will work, as I just said. So they have to go to the next layer.

00:32:12.180 The next layer includes things like, you know, all the the legal rules that they changed in the run up to 2020.

00:32:18.840 And so that's the next layer of things. And then they could they could go forward.

00:32:22.820 They could steal the election. They've already proven that they could do it.

00:32:25.160 You know, I want to be careful with your with your channel, but they're you know, they're very skilled in getting what they want.

00:32:30.380 You know, their preferred candidate. So I don't think that it's something that we should take lightly.

00:32:36.260 I think that they have experience. They also have all the mechanisms and infrastructure set up to do this again.

00:32:42.180 so and then of course worst case scenario would they go to the extent of ending his life i don't

00:32:50.260 see why they wouldn't i mean they do this all the time um they they hate he's he's just a proxy um

00:32:56.040 for the people they actually hate in the united states and just like he's just a proxy um for our

00:33:00.640 own political interests it's not like you know we we looked at all the candidates and we're like

00:33:04.400 we're going to choose this liberal cosmopolitan real estate developer in new york no he's a proxy

00:33:08.940 that expresses our discontent you know that's what he is which is that is a phenomenon in itself i

00:33:14.800 was talking to you know one of my friends recently and just saying how is it that a hollywood a guy

00:33:19.560 forged in the belly of hollywood a billionaire um how is it that uh everyday americans not the

00:33:26.740 elite but blue collar you know working americans and flyover country say that's our our guy i

00:33:31.720 identify with him it's not because of his his economic status certainly he has nothing in

00:33:36.400 common with a guy who makes, you know, $45,000, um, annually, you know, when he he's, you know,

00:33:41.780 worth, you know, a lot of money. And so it's not that, and it's not even his character. Like I,

00:33:47.460 I'm, I'm perfectly happy to say, like, I don't think I would have Donald Trump babysit my kids,

00:33:51.780 you know, but, um, you know, I, obviously I think DeSantis is the better, the better man in terms

00:33:56.280 of character, in terms of, you know, lots of other things. So then what's the, I, I, uh, the piece of

00:34:01.320 identification, like the mugshot, you know, which is, I mean, that's a historic, iconic picture

00:34:05.420 that like kids will be reading, you know, see that in textbooks, you know, when they arrested

00:34:08.680 Donald Trump and actually took his picture, which was a bad move. If you look at like the polls in

00:34:13.100 the primaries, when, when was it that, that Trump, right? Because there was a moment where it was

00:34:16.960 like an 11, 10, 11 point, you know, difference between Trump and DeSantis. And then Trump just

00:34:21.140 launched into the stratosphere and DeSantis started going down. This is, this is my point.

00:34:25.580 It was when they started doing more indictments, when they started, when they started attacking

00:34:32.060 him more. That's the identification piece. The American that identifies with Trump, it's not

00:34:37.900 because he's a billionaire and most people are poor. They identify with him because he keeps

00:34:46.300 getting picked on. He keeps getting pushed. He keeps getting pressed. He keeps getting lied about.

00:34:51.980 He keeps getting charges on the legal system coming after him just for existing. And that's

00:34:58.560 where people say, he's like me. He's like me. And you're right, CJ. Instead, what evangelical

00:35:04.920 pastors sadly do is they see evangelicals turn out in droves in 2016 for Trump. And then in the

00:35:12.660 primaries, again, now showing up for Trump instead of DeSantis in Iowa, and it wasn't even close.

00:35:18.900 And then immediately our evangelical leaders, what they do is they chastise the Christians

00:35:23.760 for how could you turn out for Trump

00:35:26.740 and not turn out for DeSantis,

00:35:28.660 who is the better man with better character.

00:35:30.300 And I'm not even debating those things.

00:35:31.680 I think that's true.

00:35:32.800 But instead of asking the question,

00:35:34.900 why did you turn out for this guy?

00:35:38.300 So immediately it's a chastisement, it's a rebuke.

00:35:43.280 And they think because they assume

00:35:44.840 the only reason why Christians could vote for Trump 0.80

00:35:47.120 is because evangelicals today are godless, 0.95

00:35:50.020 because evangelicals today don't have morals, 0.82

00:35:52.240 Because evangelicals today are also corrupted and compromised and morally, spiritually, because they only think in moral spiritual categories.

00:36:00.480 They can't think outside of that and think of power, systems, the regime, and thinking, hey, maybe they want Trump in office not because he's a great guy that they want to make the godfather of their next kid.

00:36:11.780 Maybe they want Trump in office because if there was a literal wrecking ball on the ballot, they would vote for that.

00:36:19.100 Right, exactly.

00:36:19.840 You know what I mean?

00:36:20.680 Exactly.

00:36:21.120 Exactly. So that's my prediction is they wish if they could get away with it, they would go all the way. So that's my prediction.

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00:37:53.360 giveaway drawing. Yeah, mine is similar to that. I think that, right, they showed what they can do

00:38:02.660 in 2020. I mean, there was the Time Magazine story right after the election about, I mean,

00:38:07.220 just bragging about all the money that Mark Zuckerberg put into it and all of the election

00:38:12.800 law changes and how they fortified the election, right? To prevent Donald Trump from getting

00:38:18.480 reelected. And so they bragged about it, right? And it was at the time where you couldn't say the

00:38:26.840 things they said in Time Magazine on Twitter or Facebook, like your posts would get taken down

00:38:32.160 if you verbatim said the same things they said in that Time Magazine story, but they could say it,

00:38:36.600 Right. So they've proven that they can do these things and they've proven overseas the kind of stuff that they've they've done.

00:38:44.060 And and yeah, 2020 was this color revolution where you have you have the pandemic, which is mysterious in its origins, to say the least.

00:38:54.540 And then you have radical left wing agitators provoke riots throughout the country for months.

00:39:02.540 And I mean, this is the same. This is literally what they did in Ukraine in 2014. And so other than the pandemic. And so they're well practiced at these kinds of operations.

00:39:17.160 And the lawfare thing is – and the indictments – I mean I think like the D.C. case is one where he's not going to get a fair trial in Washington, D.C.

00:39:31.180 He's not going to be before a jury that is going to look at it impartially or anything.

00:39:35.280 It's like the D.C. case is going to be like the Chauvin case in Minneapolis where it's like he's probably going to lose it.

00:39:41.580 No matter what his lawyers argue, no matter what evidence there is, it's already written.

00:39:47.160 Like there's, there's, he's going to be found guilty. Um, and so the question there is, you know, the timing, does it happen before the election or will it continue, you know, after he's elected president that, that, that might obscure things a little bit, but, um, they've, they've attempted these things.

00:40:05.260 And I think they attempted the indictments thinking that once he's indicted, that'll make people think that'll make him drop in the polls.

00:40:11.680 And then someone else, DeSantis or Nikki Haley or whoever else was running at the time, will take over.

00:40:17.120 I think that was the play that they were trying to run.

00:40:20.860 Because they fundamentally don't understand the phenomenon of Trump that you guys were just talking about.

00:40:27.440 People want him because they hate the regime.

00:40:30.440 They hate the system.

00:40:31.280 They hate the people that are running things that hate them.

00:40:34.140 and and so he's this avatar for them or this proxy for them and that's why his popularity

00:40:39.760 was boosted where people are like no that isn't right i mean the same thing with like the russia

00:40:43.360 stuff during um during his his uh administration right people looked at that they're like this is

00:40:50.100 this is silly like he didn't do anything wrong and they're impeaching him over this that's that's

00:40:55.680 nuts um and so and so every guy who got fired from his job in 2020 and 2021 um because uh he was he 0.95

00:41:05.600 had a racist tweet that his boss found you know racist spelled you know r-a-y uh you know like

00:41:12.440 so every so what what immediately they they identified and felt like that's that's me so

00:41:18.740 when they see them come at you know with the steel dossier or with the russian collusion or

00:41:22.760 you know, whatever it is, all these different things, they, um, that's the, that's the, uh,

00:41:27.160 connecting piece. The connecting piece is not, oh, I, you know, I grew up, uh, doing, uh, uh,

00:41:32.660 shows in Hollywood. Uh, yeah, we both have that in common. No, of course not. Like, oh, I also

00:41:37.180 have hundreds of, of millions of dollars and we have, you know, no, of course we, that, that's

00:41:41.120 not the connecting piece. The connecting piece is, um, every day people say that the system is rigged

00:41:48.440 against minorities when the facts are right in front of my face it's rigged against me

00:41:53.000 and has been for decades yeah and i know it and i feel it my kids feel it my wife feels it

00:41:59.780 and this is the first guy who agrees with me who says it you know and and that same system is

00:42:08.740 attacking him and every time but the difference is it attacks me and i can't do anything it attacks

00:42:13.480 him, and it's like launching a nuke

00:42:15.540 at Godzilla. He just gets bigger

00:42:17.440 and stronger, and then all of a sudden, it's like,

00:42:19.800 yeah, you don't want to be friends with Godzilla,

00:42:21.620 you don't want to have Godzilla over for dinner, but all of a sudden

00:42:23.520 you find yourself, you know, in Tokyo,

00:42:25.680 and when all, at first you think

00:42:27.480 Godzilla's the problem, but then when Moth, you know,

00:42:29.780 Mothra and all these other,

00:42:31.660 like a thousand other monsters come out

00:42:33.580 of Hollow Earth, you know, and

00:42:35.420 they start destroying the city, and Godzilla all of a sudden

00:42:37.580 turns and starts wrecking shop on

00:42:39.500 them, then you find yourself in the streets, say,

00:42:41.380 Godzilla, Godzilla!

00:42:43.480 you know that's just like that's the natural reaction and i don't think that means that

00:42:47.740 you're not a christian or you don't care about morals you don't care about character think

00:42:51.820 pastors even just stop for a moment and think you know and show a little bit of all that sympathy

00:42:57.320 that you you showed when you were woke 15 minutes ago yes we remember you were woke you're writing

00:43:02.200 books against it now but you were woke all the sympathy that you had uh towards every single

00:43:07.700 person in the church on the left not that long ago like last wednesday um could you show a fraction

00:43:13.080 of that a fraction of that um to to the people who pay your salary to the people who have been

00:43:18.720 faithful year after year tithing going to the like it's such an insult you know that's the thing too

00:43:24.820 like they they talk about um you know we can we can bring up like joe rigney and empathy and things

00:43:29.500 like that like they they're all about empathy empathy empathy right empathizing with with the

00:43:34.860 the outcast and the stranger and the people you know which just is code for the left right uh

00:43:40.280 They're totally empathetic to the left, but normal average Americans who have jobs and families and mortgages and are trying to get by and see someone who they think might make my life better, might make my country better.

00:43:56.980 and because that's his vision and this is why he connects with people is is because he presents

00:44:02.460 this positive this positive vision of of what he wants the country to be what we want the country

00:44:10.160 to be we want the country to be great again uh to say that's not and it could be once more like

00:44:15.520 that's that's a powerful thing that connects with a lot of people and they can't empathize in the

00:44:20.200 least with that they can't understand what normal people are going through they can't understand

00:44:24.840 the fact that all of our major cities are completely overrun with crime. And people

00:44:29.920 are very concerned with that. They can't understand that tens of millions of foreign 0.91

00:44:35.220 people from third world countries rushing your borders might actually be a bad thing for ordinary 1.00

00:44:40.860 people. They can't even conceptualize that state of mind that regular people have. And so you have 1.00

00:44:49.100 people like Beth Moore who will say, oh, they just want to bully and a nasty person. They've 1.00

00:44:53.420 fallen and it's there you know that all of this moral disorder and evangelicalism that's what it's

00:44:57.740 a symbol of and it's like no it's it's not that at all and they they don't want to care about

00:45:03.200 the people of our country at all and it's much easier to just chastise them well the other thing

00:45:08.820 too is you know they they go back to our conversation about nature and grace i mean the

00:45:13.780 response to all this is you know you're putting too much stock in your own well-being here on

00:45:18.120 earth you're putting too much stock in you know you know the quality of your of your life the

00:45:21.860 material value of the things that you possess and the things you know your god says not to worry

00:45:26.660 about your food you know look at the birds of the air and so they use this very pious language

00:45:30.320 basically to undermine our own natural instinct our god-given natural instincts to take care

00:45:36.620 of our families to build communities to um to build kingdoms on earth i mean that's part of

00:45:42.920 our human nature that's part of the task that was given to adam and his posterity is to build

00:45:48.600 natural things and so we should care about our well-being because it's not just about us it's

00:45:53.100 about our children it's about our grandchildren and the mentality that we are pilgrims on earth

00:45:58.380 is being distorted in such a way as to undermine a thousand years of christian development a

00:46:04.920 christian society they so so every time someone talks about things like well i can no longer

00:46:10.680 afford to eat um half the you know my food bill that i used to like four years ago i can't i can

00:46:16.640 only afford half of what I was able to buy four years ago. Well, you're just putting too much

00:46:20.060 stock in the natural things of life. God gave us creation to nourish us, to build us so that we

00:46:26.000 might be strong and that earthly things might reflect heavenly order. And I think that they

00:46:31.240 completely despise and repudiate these classical categories of natural kingdom building.

00:46:39.360 Right. And one thing I want to add to that, CJ, is, yeah, so it's definitely the grace,

00:46:44.680 nature distinction. They think that grace just, it's supersedes nature. It eradicates nature,

00:46:49.820 replaces nature. Then now they, you know, the more conservative evangelical types will, you know,

00:46:55.360 they'll, they'll kind of be inconsistent with that, with like Galatians 3.27, there's neither

00:47:00.820 male nor female, you know, slave or free, you know, Jew or Greek. And so when it comes to male

00:47:06.220 or female, they'll acknowledge, oh, well, you know, but I'm not woke, you know, like a man's

00:47:09.900 still a man and a woman's still a woman and we're complementarian and we have only male pastors,

00:47:14.200 There's, you know, but then they all of a sudden shift hermeneutics when it comes to Jew or Greek, right? 0.89

00:47:20.600 So male or female, like that still exists. 0.83

00:47:22.960 Jew or Greek, that, you know, there's only one race, the human race.

00:47:25.420 And I understand that we all descended from Adam.

00:47:27.400 We are all human beings.

00:47:28.900 But there are different races or ethnicity or whatever you want to use. 0.99

00:47:34.000 And that's part of the problem.

00:47:34.660 Yeah, it's one of those terms that's like there's plurality and there's unity in it.

00:47:38.300 All it means is common ancestor.

00:47:40.040 So the unity part of it is that we all have a single common ancestor.

00:47:43.580 The plurality part of it is there's downstream ancestors that we don't share.

00:47:47.520 I mean, it's really not that complicated.

00:47:49.100 It's not.

00:47:49.580 And to care about the downstream ancestors to say, I care about Adam and Eve, and I care about my common ancestry, but I also care about Ireland or whatever.

00:48:00.480 That's okay.

00:48:01.580 And so anyways, that should be permissible.

00:48:03.300 But what I was going to say is, so what I think is three factors with evangelical leaders and why they don't get the Trump phenomenon and why they're constantly disparaging their own congregants, parishioners, is one, not understanding grace, elevating nature, restoring nature.

00:48:17.760 Instead, they think it just replaces nature, that natural things don't matter.

00:48:21.200 Natural born children don't matter.

00:48:23.300 Borders to protect natural citizens doesn't matter.

00:48:28.520 Working out to have natural good health as a good steward.

00:48:32.460 not not idolatry not not vanity but i hey i want to live to see my my grandkids um well that's

00:48:38.460 that's uh that's not spiritual enough that's too uh too physical that's too vain uh they don't

00:48:43.580 understand any of these things uh thinking i should have a gun in case there's an intruder

00:48:47.440 especially since we have an invasion of military age men and i live in texas you know like uh maybe

00:48:52.220 i should have a gun or that's you know not trusting the lord and blah blah so they despise

00:48:56.180 nature the the second thing i would say is a negative view of the past and then um and then

00:49:01.880 a nihilistic view of the future. I think those are the three. And so, so what I'm trying to say

00:49:06.360 is, uh, is it a coincidence that right now, uh, you got a bunch of young Christian men,

00:49:10.780 uh, what are they reading? Um, a bunch of them have, uh, an infatuation all of a sudden with

00:49:15.480 post-millennial hopeful future. Right. And, and I'm not saying you have to be post-millennial

00:49:19.760 to think that the future could be bright, um, that the foreseeable future for you, your kids,

00:49:23.620 I've learned that at first I was like, that's, I am post-millennial. I'm not moving off of that.

00:49:27.700 That is my eschatology. I think it's right. Um, I think it's right for biblical reasons,

00:49:31.500 but not just functional reasons because functionally a guy could be a pre-millennial and i've got a lot

00:49:36.720 of friends who are or are millennial and still say yeah but we could still win this thing and

00:49:40.400 we have a moral obligation to try and uh and and we we still want the world to be a better place

00:49:45.120 our country be a better place for our children our children's children and so i'm happy to be on

00:49:49.060 on the team but the point is no matter how you slice it whether it's a long vision through

00:49:52.920 post-millennial eschatology or whatever uh it's still it's a positive vision of the future right

00:49:57.120 now that like, so what's taking off over these past few years, like by storm, what's the big

00:50:01.800 trends, a positive view of the future. And a lot of that's like more than ever before, a bunch of

00:50:06.160 guys hopping on the post-mill train. That's not a coincidence. Look at that. Recognize that. Dissect

00:50:11.180 that pastor, evangelical leader. Think about why would that be? And then the last one, positive

00:50:15.820 view of the future. Why is every young Christian man on the planet right now reading Defenders of 0.54

00:50:21.520 the west sword and scimitar uh like what it's not a coincidence right they they're all of a sudden

00:50:27.100 there's a theme there and that theme gives you answers it's not random it's it means something

00:50:32.420 so what is it um all of a sudden guys are reading uh practical books by non-christians about uh

00:50:37.540 natural things like health and and uh and and all of a sudden uh guys are reading books uh with a

00:50:43.880 positive vision of the past saying maybe the crusades weren't the worst thing ever and maybe

00:50:48.260 Richard the Lionheart was, maybe I'm going to meet him in heaven. He was a good guy. Or more

00:50:53.660 recent history, maybe Stonewall Jackson was a good guy, that Martin Luther King Jr. is actually

00:50:58.980 in hell right now, but Stonewall Jackson is in heaven. And maybe I should prepare for that

00:51:03.480 reality. And then lastly, a positive future, like the post-millennial infatuation that's been going,

00:51:10.000 my point is just to say, these are not coincidences. There is a theme. And Trump,

00:51:15.140 So bringing that all the way back to Trump, and then I'll stop rambling.

00:51:18.560 But in four words, I mean, this really is, I mean, it's incredible.

00:51:24.140 In four words, make America, so not the other side of the world, not foreigners, not strangers,

00:51:30.460 but my native people, this country, make America great.

00:51:35.000 So in the future, we're going to do something that is going to have bare fruit down the road,

00:51:40.060 make it great again.

00:51:42.160 It was good in the past.

00:51:43.300 So he literally, right there, he said, here, my people, great in the future, like it was

00:51:48.820 in the past, and the most popular political character in the last 50 years, with four

00:51:55.080 words.

00:51:56.040 I mean, a bunch of other stuff too, but with four words, and I think if evangelicals, you

00:52:01.100 know, Beth Moore would stop chastising the base, I mean, she really, like John MacArthur

00:52:05.000 nailed it, she just needs to go home, but other evangelical leaders who actually are 0.85

00:52:08.820 called to leadership roles in the church, but who are very similar to Beth Moore, other Moors, 0.86

00:52:13.920 such as Russell Moore, if they would just stop for a moment and think about that and think, 0.76

00:52:20.020 maybe there's something to that. Does the Bible actually allow for this? Or maybe even give us

00:52:24.160 an impetus that this is right, it should be pursued, that the spiritual and eternal matters

00:52:29.060 most, but that nature and temporal things still have some value and that we do have

00:52:35.120 a moral obligation to steward these things in a heavenly direction, and that the past

00:52:41.940 of 1,500 years of Christendom, maybe it wasn't perfect. We're talking about human beings. They're

00:52:46.460 not sinless, but maybe Constantine, maybe Constantine, as Thomas Watson literally says

00:52:52.480 in his Ten Commandments books, he was a nurturing father. He literally lists Constantine by name and

00:52:57.040 says, be like Constantine, who was a nurturing father to the church. And so maybe that's not

00:53:04.760 crazy, and then also in the future, whether you think it's the next 50 years or 50,000,

00:53:09.860 that maybe we're not, the Bible doesn't dictate nihilism. Historic premillennialism, sure,

00:53:17.020 but dispensational premillennialism that asserts and mandates that things must progressively get

00:53:22.980 worse and worse and worse in the future, that dog won't hunt. That eschatology, because that's more

00:53:29.600 than just eschatological that's that's a hermeneutic in a way of reading this like that

00:53:34.000 that um dispensationalism is like watching the last dinosaur slowly walk off into the sunset like

00:53:39.200 that you know that dude he's dead he's he's short shelf life it's it's not coming back so my point

00:53:44.580 is could we just look at that look at the reasons and instead of blaming and chastising ask some

00:53:50.020 questions maybe maybe we've missed it in the post-war consensus for the last 60 years and

00:53:55.080 maybe there's something to this no i 100 agree with you i mean just the fact that there's there's

00:54:00.340 certain like um like a demeanor or like an instinct that um you know western christians have had in

00:54:07.260 the past which is to honor those who came before you um i mean you mentioned thomas watson that's

00:54:12.360 actually relatively recent right right exactly that's why yeah so like just just up until like

00:54:16.980 um you know maybe 60 years ago people did have this you know we are the product of good men

00:54:22.780 Good men that came before us and blazed a trail. Now, today, we're expected to apologize for them, to repudiate them, and to constantly remind ourselves that those who came before are always bad because they're in the past.

00:54:36.320 And chronologically, we're more advanced. And this is just the way that history goes.

00:54:41.640 They never consider the fact that, I mean, flyover Americans are reading like historical tomes.

00:54:48.560 They're reading biographies of great men. They're not supposed to do this. The intellectual class does not like them to do this. And so when they look to a leader like Trump, who is not like in a silo, like he's not a good man.

00:55:03.200 Like you would never, like 10 years ago, you don't have said like Trump is like an ideal Christian man. He's not a Constantine. But that type of man, the fact that he's popular reflects the fact that people are learning from the past and they recognize that leaders like him, great men of history, they are the catalysts for making society great again.

00:55:24.440 So they are looking for, you know, and they just, the intellectual class just cannot bear this. It just, it completely wrecks everything that they've built up about themselves and about flyover Americans, about everyday Americans and about the Christianity, you know, the Christian dumb that they actually seek to tear down.

00:55:41.560 Right. And the other thing they built up is their revisionist history. And so if people 0.94

00:55:45.620 are actually reading, you know, men of antiquity, actual history, and not their revisionist

00:55:49.700 history, their fake narrative, then people are going to wise up. They're going to say,

00:55:52.460 wait, wait, wait, wait, this thing that we want, that we've been told we could never

00:55:55.700 have, it just can't happen. We just preach the gospel. No, no, it's not just that we

00:56:00.140 could have it. It's, Christendom's not just a dream of something that can't come to fruition.

00:56:05.900 Not only is it possible, it's been done before here on this soil.

00:56:11.000 that's the thing and not that long ago you know yeah i've been trying to say this about christian

00:56:16.020 nationalism like uh you know what you can it's just a label right i didn't like it at first but

00:56:21.460 it's it's changed the conversation so that means it was a good label right but the what it means

00:56:26.000 it's not this creation of this new never been done utopian framework this blueprint for like

00:56:31.840 we have the secret sauce to make a good society it's actually the historical norm like this like

00:56:37.280 Like it took – it was reflected in England.

00:56:40.420 It was reflected in Germany.

00:56:41.480 It was reflected in Christendom more generally.

00:56:44.280 Like this is our past.

00:56:45.640 This is – it's calling for Christians to revitalize those that came before. 0.98

00:56:50.820 It's actually the historical norm. 0.93

00:56:52.340 It's not this new creative thing.

00:56:54.240 The new creative thing is liberal democracy and secularism.

00:56:57.280 That's the new creative thing.

00:56:59.920 Andrew, go ahead.

00:57:01.820 Andrew, give us your final thoughts, and then we'll land the plane for this episode.

00:57:04.680 But I think this has been super helpful.

00:57:06.040 Yeah, yeah.

00:57:06.620 So, you know, just to go back to the Trump thing and the whole title of the episode, I think if I were like, I don't gamble, I don't bet, nobody should.

00:57:18.460 But if I were going to put like money on it, I'd say it's like 60-40 that they will attempt it because things are going to take them out.

00:57:30.060 You don't want to say it, but I don't want to.

00:57:33.260 I think they will at least at least there will be an attempt, a serious attempt on him.

00:57:40.500 And and it only because if you look at how how terrible things are, everyone knows economically, socially, socially, everything else is in a very, very bad place.

00:57:52.580 I mean, even people who are maybe predisposed to vote for Democrats will admit this.

00:57:57.300 And so he is going to continue to be very, very popular and poll very, very well in many states.

00:58:03.860 I think in New York right now, he's like in single digits behind Biden, which is astounding.

00:58:10.560 That's crazy.

00:58:11.080 Yeah.

00:58:11.220 I think it was like nine points under Biden in New York.

00:58:15.300 Yeah.

00:58:15.580 So, I mean, almost – I mean, you're getting within striking distance at the margin of error.

00:58:20.200 And so if he's looking like he's going to win in a landslide and there's no amount of fortification that they can do,

00:58:27.300 to prevent him taking office.

00:58:30.320 Like that is like the biggest thing.

00:58:32.300 They cannot possibly allow him to return at all.

00:58:35.660 And so, right, keep bearing that in mind,

00:58:38.580 like there's one final thing they can do to prevent him from going in.

00:58:45.420 And so if it looks like there are no other options, they'll do it. 0.98

00:58:49.320 They can suicide him. 0.97

00:58:50.720 Yeah, I mean, maybe. 0.96

00:58:53.040 Jeffrey Epstein him.

00:58:54.760 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:58:55.760 In prison maybe, who knows.

00:58:56.880 But yeah, I think that that's going to happen.

00:59:01.060 And if it does, I think Christians and pastors and leaders need to think through why was he popular?

00:59:09.120 Why is the majority of the country going to be incensed that this occurred?

00:59:15.120 And what do you do from here?

00:59:17.340 And even the question of what do you do from here is relevant, even if they don't do it.

00:59:21.580 Because he's like 78 or 79 years old.

00:59:23.800 Like he's not going to be around much longer in any event.

00:59:28.080 And so where do we go from here once he's off the stage?

00:59:33.580 What are we going to do?

00:59:34.360 Because the anger at the regime that is deep in the populace of the country, that's not going away.

00:59:42.200 And it's going to look for someone to take up that mantle once again.

00:59:48.460 Are we going to be part of it or are we going to oppose it, continue to oppose it?

00:59:51.980 yep cj did you want to say something nope all right that's great let's let's plug you guys

00:59:58.460 again because i want guys to listen um i think your voices are important what you're writing

01:00:03.220 what you're uh saying uh your podcast is contra mundum it's uh where can they find you it's on

01:00:09.240 youtube uh we stream it on our twitter but like youtube's the best place probably right now for

01:00:13.480 us but um yeah follow me on twitter at uh contra mordor um and uh i always post the live links uh

01:00:20.240 for the for the podcast there and that's when you get my my fun tweets and my my actual you know

01:00:25.400 well thought out uh you know thoughts not just my rambling so yeah you have good you have good

01:00:31.060 stuff there yeah definitely follow and then what's your handle uh mine yeah on twitter uh at boniface

01:00:38.840 option is my handle and uh and yeah uh we on every friday we've been trying to be consistent now we

01:00:45.520 do a live stream on Fridays, usually at five o'clock central. This week might be a little

01:00:50.940 different because I'm in Florida. I don't know if everybody heard when Joel mentioned

01:00:56.200 DeSantis, he sent a blue heron to attack our stream here. And so I don't know if you heard

01:01:04.580 that, but yeah, we might be a little bit late this week, but in the next couple of weeks,

01:01:11.400 But usually Fridays at 5 p.m. Central is when we live stream.

01:01:15.780 And it's, I mean, you know, Joel, like the live streams are fun because you can interact with people.

01:01:19.760 And I think some people, they really like, you know, when I start chuckling at a comment in the middle of the stream, that makes them happy.

01:01:27.460 But it's, yeah, it's been great to do.

01:01:31.540 We have seen a lot of people, you know, really like, I mean, I get emails and messages from people saying like,

01:01:37.960 hey i i didn't know what to think about politics and things like this and i wasn't like looking

01:01:42.260 for someone to just give like a vaguely christian spin on whatever you would hear on the daily wire

01:01:48.520 right actually what we're trying to do is get christians to think very deeply about politics

01:01:54.880 and think about it in very old ways and um and and think about it beyond just like who am i going to

01:02:02.700 vote for and how how does the you know how do elections work things like that but rather think

01:02:07.240 about it in a much, much bigger picture than really anybody else. Great. So all of our listeners

01:02:15.020 check out, we'll put it in the description, their YouTube channel. So you can just look in the

01:02:18.620 description, find the link for the YouTube channel. Again, that's Contra Moondum. And then

01:02:22.300 you got at Boniface option. If you want to follow Isker on Twitter and then Contra Mordor, is that

01:02:27.780 what you said? Contra Mordor. Okay. Contra Mordor. So follow these guys, listen to them, give them

01:02:33.180 your support. And then also with Isker, you can go to Amazon if you want to buy his book, The

01:02:36.780 Boniface option that came out recently. That's fantastic. A lot of guys have been reading it.

01:02:40.960 I read it and he did a great job. So check out the book too. So thank you guys for coming on

01:02:45.000 the show. Appreciate it. Thank you, Joel.

The NXR Podcast - February 05, 2024

THE INTERVIEW - President Trump Is In Real Danger w C. Jay Engel & Andrews Isker

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