The NXR Podcast - THE LIVESTREAM - BUILDING CHRISTIAN BURROUGHS - No longer plan B

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00:00:41.940 They didn't wait for Washington to come and fix it.

00:00:44.980 When the Puritans landed in New England, they weren't petitioning Parliament.

00:00:48.940 They were planting churches, building schools, raising crops, and electing elders.

00:00:53.560 When Christian settlers carved towns out of the American frontier, they didn't wait for cultural 0.91

00:00:59.460 permission. They brought the book, the rifle, and the plow, and they built. Today, too many

00:01:06.160 Christians are still acting like tenants in someone else's crumbling house. They're debating 1.00

00:01:11.180 how to rearrange the furniture while the foundation splits in half. But the new Christian 1.00

00:01:17.240 right is done waiting. We're not trying to tweak the machine. Instead, we're walking away from it.

00:01:23.560 We're not asking what can be salvaged from D.C., we're asking what can be secured in our own

00:01:29.280 counties, our own churches, and our own homes. We're not retreating, instead we're fortifying.

00:01:36.600 It's time to build Christian boroughs again. Worship-centered, economically linked, family-led,

00:01:42.800 law-respecting communities that can survive the collapse and seed the next Christendom.

00:01:48.080 If that sounds too ambitious, then remember this, the future does not belong to the most powerful.

00:01:54.580 Instead, it belongs to the most planted.

00:01:57.640 This episode is brought to you by our premier sponsors, Armored Republic and Reese Fund,

00:02:03.460 as well as our Patreon members and our generous donors.

00:02:07.180 You can join our Patreon by going to patreon.com forward slash right response ministries,

00:02:12.780 or you can make a donation by going to rightresponseministries.com forward slash donate.

00:02:19.840 So how do we start? Where do we dig in? And which hills are actually winnable? Let's talk strategy.

00:02:36.220 Here we are. Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Good to see you all again.

00:02:40.100 Glad to be here again with you all.

00:02:41.800 Looking forward to this discussion very much. 1.00

00:02:44.420 The G-ist of A's.

00:02:47.440 The G-ist of A's.

00:02:48.920 This episode is going to be a little bit different in that it's going to be just more conversational 1.00

00:02:54.020 as we are talking about the practicals, what actually can be done in the short, medium, 0.88

00:02:59.880 and long term to build Christian boroughs, to build up Christian communities that not 0.61

00:03:05.720 not just kind of hunker and bunker down in the middle of the storm, but that actually

00:03:10.480 develop into centers of cultural, political, and economic power in the nation. And so I'm looking

00:03:17.960 forward to the discussion. In preparation for it, I wanted to just share my biggest takeaway as I

00:03:24.740 was thinking through the episode, and it is this. We have talked a lot, Wes, especially you and me,

00:03:29.980 about why the decline of the nation,

00:03:35.960 especially of Christianity in early America,

00:03:39.300 seems to have happened so quickly.

00:03:41.380 Like what did the founders not account for

00:03:43.780 when they wrote the Constitution

00:03:46.400 and then launched it out?

00:03:49.700 And why did the decline seem to happen?

00:03:52.700 And, you know, we see evidence of it pretty early on.

00:03:56.280 And there's a lot of answers to that.

00:03:58.040 This is not the definitive answer.

00:03:59.220 But I think one thing that we have to consider is, in my opinion, what Americans stopped doing was building Christian communities. 0.92

00:04:08.320 They tamed the West. 0.95

00:04:10.560 They, you know, pursued the gold and the gold rush.

00:04:13.540 They built the railroad system that connected the entire continent. 0.86

00:04:18.100 But a working theory that I'm thinking through is one of the things that we did was we stopped building Christian communities. 0.58

00:04:27.280 And that had two things.

00:04:28.480 It allowed the perceived idea of the separation of the church and state to solidify in stone.

00:04:35.980 And what I mean is the separation of church and state is a good idea in—not in practice or in theory.

00:04:44.700 It's a good political idea.

00:04:45.920 You don't necessarily want the church making the laws, and you don't want the state issuing the ordinances and the sacraments of Christ, right?

00:04:53.240 But what we fail to consider is that the fusion of church and state or religion and politics is the lives of people.

00:05:04.040 And what we stopped doing, and I think it was just the fact that we assumed a Christian perspective on all things,

00:05:12.820 and we stopped building explicitly Christian towns and cities and enterprises.

00:05:18.780 And there's something about starting something new that makes you really sharp and focused and gives you a clarity that you don't always get once you're just managing it later on.

00:05:30.240 And those who started the nation had that sharp clarity.

00:05:33.160 You know, even before the War for Independence, you read the writings and you read the Charter of Canada, and it was very explicitly about the glory of God and building a place for Christians to worship, but not just to worship, to live the kind of life that God called free men to live.

00:05:50.120 They were building communities where they could be governed, that's the state, and that they could worship, that's the church, in the proper way.

00:05:57.380 And my biggest takeaway that I'll say it again at the end, but I hope that the listeners take away from this is the call and the new movement to build Christian boroughs is not simply a strategy for when we're under heavy fire and the cards are against us, the chips are stacked against us, and we've got no other options.

00:06:20.300 And so now, finally, is the time for us to build Christian boroughs.

00:06:24.320 This actually, I hope to make the point, ought to be the norm of practice of Christian societies. 0.74

00:06:30.760 We should always be building Christian boroughs. 0.98

00:06:33.120 And one of the things, like so many other things, we live in the time of forgetting right now.

00:06:37.380 And we've forgotten how to do that.

00:06:39.120 And that's why we have to have episodes like this where we, who are trying to do it here,

00:06:44.120 but I think all three of us would admit, like, we have a long way to go here in Georgetown,

00:06:48.040 are going to offer some advice.

00:06:49.760 And I think all of us would say we're not experts in this, but we've lost it from the past.

00:06:56.440 And the thing that should be normative Christian polity, Christian boroughs, Christian towns, has largely been lost.

00:07:03.260 And so I hope that as we begin to talk about this, number one, I hope it's not overwhelming.

00:07:07.040 If you're a guy and you've got a couple friends around you and you think we want a Christian community, we want our town to be Christian, right?

00:07:12.900 Like, hopefully this isn't overwhelming, but also I hope this is a perspective that just infects the new Christian right, not for the three years of the rest of Trump's office or the next 10 years until things have kind of cooled down. 0.76

00:07:27.180 This ought to be the pattern of Christian civilization at all times. 0.88

00:07:31.820 Good point. 0.97

00:07:32.340 Do you tie it to urbanization, that kind of loss of—because we talked about before, imagine growing up in a small town.

00:07:38.840 you had a church there the church had a cemetery near it and all of your life was kind of oriented

00:07:42.960 towards i go to church but also i know my end the cemetery and i'm here and i'm rooted and grounded

00:07:48.020 do you think it was kind of urbanization where people traveled more and they were more transient

00:07:51.920 and we had definitely a shift towards universe universality in principles versus a particular

00:07:56.440 would you say that was at least maybe one of the factors to blame i think that's um largely um a

00:08:03.020 big part of it you know one of the things that's that's interesting that we hold up as the example

00:08:06.980 is geneva and calvin's time um but one of the things that we realized is they actually were

00:08:12.320 were kind of the guys on the ropes at the time estimates historical estimates uh say that the

00:08:17.760 geneva was about 12 000 people at the time and which is very very small right um and you know

00:08:23.820 we'll talk about it a little bit later in the episode but even the what we think of as the

00:08:27.880 cosmopolitan geneva the city of calvin it was not it wasn't a london it wasn't a paris it wasn't

00:08:35.080 half the size of huddle right now yep um so i west i think that's a large part of it and i i don't

00:08:41.880 know what to do about that fact right like and i'll even say too i literally said to my wife last

00:08:46.160 night like honestly like rural living a living that's connected to the land your kids are going

00:08:50.860 outside you see the trees and god's creation getting grounded getting grounded you're touching

00:08:55.660 grass literally touching grass i actually do think that is a superior mode of life now not everyone

00:09:01.380 can escape the city not everyone has those options but all else being equal all else being

00:09:06.560 equal right the urban life in a concrete jungle with a job that's much more maybe technology

00:09:11.580 focused or abstract or remote working on the 27th story working on 27th story on your 27th

00:09:18.160 powerpoint slide on your 27th coffee uh no the rural life is better right all else being equal

00:09:24.540 and so if we're going to return to that it's not like well we just do cities like tim keller was

00:09:28.640 big on the city right i don't think there's a way to pack people in as tight as in new york

00:09:32.900 and just go great for centuries on end i also don't know though that we're going to get rid

00:09:38.760 like cities have sprung up in all major civilizations right right and so they haven't

00:09:43.300 been as big probably as we see now but i had a big group chat argument about it like it went a

00:09:48.700 couple hours but i think the big thing would be density so absolutely always you look at any

00:09:52.760 distribution be it height there's always going to be you know a greater cluster towards the center

00:09:57.180 less on the outside so there will always be places that are more populated than others

00:10:01.020 to your point though the question is do we stack them 30 stories high right so you could have a

00:10:05.380 city where people actually live closer together but there's still green spaces like central park

00:10:09.340 you're not stacking people as high as possible you're not covering over thinking over in concrete

00:10:14.000 you're not putting trams buses all of that so there will always be cities but what those cities

00:10:18.580 look like i think is still up to us well and um i've thought before on the old testament

00:10:24.740 um requirements of what constitutes um i guess for youtube we have to say some

00:10:31.760 different word but sexual assault we'll put it that way in the old testament right and what it

00:10:38.260 had to be there was if you were in town the woman had to yell right and it's so ironic that we live

00:10:46.280 in a time where people are so packed together but if you're in an apartment in new york you yell

00:10:53.080 the way that we have built life is such that we're actually totally separate from each other

00:10:58.160 i don't think anyone would hear a woman yelling really um or more importantly or or or even would 0.81

00:11:03.420 care but my point is like in the in the great population density that we have we aren't living

00:11:09.240 an open communal life which you would think the more densely populated we are the more communal

00:11:15.660 and and in each other's lives would be that has not been the case but it's so diverse it's so fun

00:11:20.440 now everyone is like so you're packing them in the density is high but everybody is still living

00:11:25.560 a life of perfect isolation because we have low trust society for a number of reasons chiefly

00:11:31.380 being you know apostatizing against the lord jesus christ and our christian founding but in

00:11:35.940 addition to you know the the religious reasons it's also you know multiculturalism it's all you

00:11:41.460 know there's all these different factors for why people don't trust each other you know like i

00:11:47.280 remember we got in trouble for i didn't even say it i just defended eric khan for saying it but you

00:11:51.880 know the whole um somebody commentating on aristotle it wasn't him directly but him saying

00:11:57.220 that you know that a purely democratic governmental system in a multi uh ethnic um environment uh is

00:12:05.860 just the ripe you know seed ground for um oligarchy and for you know for correct leaders

00:12:12.860 to rise up through the ranks and then to pit different, you know, identity groups against

00:12:19.420 each other, playing identity politics. And all that assumes, you know, because it's Aristotle,

00:12:24.920 that assumes that it's a context that's a bad form of government, pure democracy, which all

00:12:31.040 the founders despised. None of them thought that we should have a pure democracy. None of them

00:12:35.720 were advocating for universal suffrage. They believed in representative...

00:12:40.500 democracy raw is you're really expanding the votes so it's not just representative of this

00:12:45.340 side of the other how many people vote yeah elements of democracy like all the founders

00:12:49.160 were well-versed in democratic process voting for some things so they all had deuteronomy they all

00:12:54.680 had leviticus but they also had plutarch they also had aristotle they had plato they you know

00:12:58.800 and and what they were trying to form was kind of in many ways it wasn't a pure government that

00:13:03.560 anybody had really known uh in the past you know maybe there were elements in rome you know or

00:13:08.180 elements in Greece, you know, but, uh, but they, they wanted something that had, uh, that had an

00:13:13.160 element of democracy, right. Representational government all the way down, not to the individual,

00:13:18.680 but to the household. But they also wanted it to have elements of a constitutional Republic,

00:13:22.820 you know, and then even elements of not oligarchy, but an aristocracy. Um, and, but, but we just have

00:13:28.900 to recognize that that's what the constitution was fashioned for the con the constitution wasn't

00:13:34.060 written in a vacuum and that it's suitable for anybody in any place in any, you know, any form

00:13:39.020 of government. It was, it was, you know, comprised for, for a particular people in a particular

00:13:45.700 place at a particular time. And we don't have those people anymore. We just, we don't, yeah,

00:13:51.300 we don't have those conditions. We also, I think, you know, personally for me, it's, it's not even

00:13:56.400 necessarily a population, a matter of, of just raw population numerically, but, but geography

00:14:02.320 in terms of of just size uh to have a nation the size of these united states uh that's one nation

00:14:09.760 with one federal government is um is it seems to be a little a little naive a little you know

00:14:17.060 wishful thinking um you know because uh yes the you know the geography hasn't changed well it's

00:14:22.460 changed a little bit you know over time louisiana purchase and these kinds of things um but but for

00:14:27.160 the most part, the land has stayed the same, but to have, uh, this many people in that size of land

00:14:34.120 and to have not just, uh, this many people, you know, who are wasp, you know, for instance,

00:14:39.720 you know, or Anglo Protestants, but this many people that, uh, that, uh, includes Somalians

00:14:45.220 and includes Haitians and includes, you know, all these different people who, uh, many of them don't

00:14:50.140 even speak the language, uh, right. You know, uh, English. And so to, and, and then also on top of

00:14:55.720 it to walk away from the lord jesus christ so when you think of our founding you're thinking

00:14:59.400 um a fraction of the population um you're thinking of of for the most part homogenous in many ways

00:15:06.520 yes there were some people who came in but there's still there's a difference in bringing in the

00:15:11.480 irish which there were plenty of objections at the time to the irish and the italians

00:15:15.640 but but there's a difference in bringing in the irish and the italians and some hispanics you know

00:15:20.360 in texas that helped and fought you know defended the alamo and like um which i personally would

00:15:25.140 include in heritage americans uh when i think about i think about you know pretty much pretty

00:15:30.240 much not necessarily anybody but most people who were here before civil rights before the heart

00:15:36.380 cellar act um and especially when i think of heritage american i'm thinking three generations

00:15:40.760 plus where i can look at my neighbor and say your granddad and my granddad fought in the same wars

00:15:46.160 that's that's what i'm thinking of um uh but but my point is that yes there was immigration um and

00:15:52.380 yes, there were new peoples coming in, but you still had a fraction of the total numerical

00:15:56.140 population. And you still, with these people who were coming in, you still had a lot of

00:16:01.960 commonality. You had cousins, right? So if it's primarily Anglo-Protestant, right? So British

00:16:09.560 Protestants, and now you're inviting Catholic Italians. There's some big differences, don't 0.98

00:16:14.640 get me wrong. And that's why the Italians, with a Catholic religious backdrop, ended up, for the 0.97

00:16:20.720 most part being the mob bosses in new york and destroying the city so i'm not saying that there 0.95

00:16:24.400 were no problems right that people hated the italian irish and the irish too you know and so

00:16:30.240 um and for some decent reasons um it wasn't just you know racial animus but there were actually 0.97

00:16:35.440 some they were coming in and destroying things um but but my point is still italians coming in 0.98

00:16:41.360 as difficult as that was uh is still a far cry a large significant difference from haitians right

00:16:49.120 coming into iowa you know into one town 30 000 all at the same time um coming into one town and

00:16:55.520 it's a third the population of that town and they're driving motorized vehicles for the first

00:17:00.980 time not speaking english and running over uh people and and alleged i'll say allegedly but

00:17:07.080 but potentially maybe also eating some pets you know like that's he who has not barbecued the

00:17:12.840 neighbor's cat cast the first stone i mean we've all eaten a pet here or there um you know but but

00:17:18.740 to eat pets at that rate allegedly um it's just from the park it's just we don't do that here

00:17:24.040 you know this is america we don't do that here and so my point is that's um when you think of

00:17:28.880 the founding a fraction of the population yes some immigration but you're talking about cousins not

00:17:33.380 complete strangers and still predominantly a christian foundation right right there was a time

00:17:39.660 where 90 percent of the united states was identified as being christian 90 plus right

00:17:45.500 where we're in new york city you had three you know skyscrapers lit up on good friday with three

00:17:50.580 crosses you know and we're talking what was that 50 years ago 60 years ago holy trinity versus

00:17:55.200 united states the supreme court we're a christian nation right that was just about a hundred years

00:17:59.580 ago give or take and so so three major elements the immigration the overall population and the

00:18:06.800 the apostasy from christianity we no longer have in many ways a christian nation and so

00:18:11.840 if if christianity is no longer the bedrock and the foundation and you don't just have italians

00:18:16.640 but you have haitians and somalians and people millions and millions of people who don't even

00:18:21.360 speak the language and um you have you have you know 20 times 30 times 50 times the population

00:18:28.560 um at that point um you have to rethink your inks you have to you have to start rethinking and and

00:18:34.880 And none of this, just for the record, none of this is coming as a substitute or at the expense

00:18:39.640 of doing the work of an evangelist and seeking to fulfill the Great Commission. So you have to be

00:18:44.800 pushing for the crown rights of Jesus Christ and doing that at an interpersonal level,

00:18:49.300 first and foremost, with your wives and children in your home with family worship,

00:18:53.000 catechism, being in a local Bible preaching church, and doing the work of an evangelist

00:18:57.940 and telling your neighbors about Jesus and praying and working towards that many might

00:19:02.520 be born again and come to saving faith so so nothing at the expense of that but just simply

00:19:08.060 recognizing that in addition to that um there are some political solutions uh that need to be

00:19:14.820 explored and it may it may be and i'm not even advocating for this this is not necessarily a

00:19:19.560 prescription but simply a description of what i predict may happen inevitably may happen is that

00:19:25.760 the united states may have to break up into smaller land masses we may end up having five or six

00:19:31.220 countries uh instead of one because what we are currently doing we are on a trajectory that is

00:19:37.580 not feasible something i've been thinking about um is the elements of a nation and um it's a

00:19:45.500 curious question of like how strong each of the elements of a nation have to be um and i think

00:19:52.020 that the reason it's a tricky question is because there's not like a it's not a recipe in in a book

00:19:57.980 It's one-third a cup of lineage and two-thirds a cup of worship and a dash of common loves and things like that.

00:20:09.100 But one of the reasons why we are dealing with the things that we're dealing with right now about the questions of ethnicity and race and all of those things is because some of the things that bound peoples together in our history in the past that are legitimate, like a common worship, that were very strong, are just gone.

00:20:26.320 They're eroded.

00:20:26.900 right and so then as one rubber band snaps either other rubber bands have to become stronger

00:20:34.440 or there has to be dissolution and that's why people are really um that's one of the reasons

00:20:40.920 there are many reasons and many legitimate reasons why people are asking the questions about well

00:20:44.400 what is the racial and ethnic makeup of a nation of our nation in particular well if we had strong

00:20:50.240 heritage uh uh shared loves everyone obeyed the law we were all worshiping the same god

00:20:55.840 we wouldn't be as it wouldn't be as urgent of a question be different the lineage question as it

00:21:01.700 is right now but but that's not where we are right now right as as you know michael uh coined you

00:21:06.540 know the six l's in his book right here in defense of christian nations which you can get on amazon

00:21:11.440 michael belch in defense of christian nations but um those six loves uh not arguing that a nation

00:21:17.620 you you you know held strong that a nation can never be anything less than land and lineage right

00:21:22.620 land and lineage you know people and place um but you argue that a nation is more so land

00:21:28.920 lineage language laws loves that would be tradition and rituals and heritage these kinds

00:21:33.840 of things and then lastly liturgy um religion and so what we're saying is that part of the

00:21:38.540 conversation around race which is probably not the best word but whether it's race or ethnicity

00:21:43.680 or whatever um part of the conversation around this and the reason why this is making its way

00:21:49.420 into mainstream conversation.

00:21:51.220 It's not going away.

00:21:52.400 Brothers and sisters in Christ, hear me.

00:21:54.520 It's not going away.

00:21:55.600 You're going to have to carve out a position on this.

00:21:57.660 I pray that you would do it courageously

00:21:59.040 and that you would also do it responsibly

00:22:01.080 and that you would have a Bible in your hand

00:22:02.740 as you seek to answer some of these questions.

00:22:04.480 But it's not, the toothpaste is not going back in the tube.

00:22:07.900 It's just not.

00:22:08.520 The woke left overplayed their hand from 2013,

00:22:13.920 definitely 15, all the way through 2024.

00:22:16.660 So you had a decade of the woke left

00:22:18.440 making it nearly impossible for young white men especially and some asians to be able to get into

00:22:24.860 the university they wanted to get into to be able to get the job that they wanted to get 0.93

00:22:28.480 and then on top of it you have carmelo anthony stabbing a young white boy in the heart uh you

00:22:34.580 had another um african-american uh woman uh on the back of a ambulance you know stabbed an emt worker

00:22:42.240 and killed him two um two yeah only one time and these are back to back you know just in a matter

00:22:48.300 of a couple weeks and uh and on top and that would be one thing you know but then carmelo anthony

00:22:54.060 being able to raise you know go fund me from um uh virtually you know a hundred percent uh black

00:23:00.220 supporters raising over half a million dollars so that he can get um a big house and an escalade

00:23:05.600 you know, and these kinds of things and, and a lot of fears, uh, surrounding the idea that, um,

00:23:11.620 that it's entirely possible. Hopefully it doesn't happen, but it's entirely possible that he may get

00:23:15.700 off, uh, with self-defense, um, that he actually, I mean, and if that happens, which is entirely

00:23:21.140 possible, um, this is a conversation that's not going away. But to Michael's point, part of the

00:23:26.400 reason it's not going away is because of those six L's, all the other ones have eroded. And so

00:23:31.480 that's why land and lineage is is such a big conversation it matters across i i would argue

00:23:38.500 that it matters regardless right it matters regardless but the reason why it matters so

00:23:43.080 much right now is because language is being eroded we have millions of people who literally don't

00:23:48.180 speak english we have on voting booths other languages why in the world would you have

00:23:53.380 mandarin you know or or espanol or whatever any other language besides heaven forbid french french 0.88

00:24:00.280 scum god forbid but why would you have other languages on a voting booth if you don't even 0.88

00:24:06.000 speak the language of the country you have no business voting in it you know and so as languages 0.98

00:24:10.240 eroded as loves tradition and rituals and history is eroded right even our holidays are eroded um

00:24:18.600 and and certainly as liturgy religion faith christian faith is eroded then then all of a

00:24:25.540 sudden people that the eye has has turned and the gaze is now fully upon lineage and and race and

00:24:34.480 ethnicity and there's a lot of people right now who are looking around and saying we can't have

00:24:40.620 a country right right before we go to our break just to protect the podcast the escalade claim

00:24:48.520 is maybe not quite accurate the father claims he works for a used car dealership it's a company

00:24:53.940 card that he was given by the uh by the company i just okay want to set the register yeah thank

00:25:00.260 you all right let's go to our first commercial break and we'll be right back what if your

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00:25:18.120 God-given privilege and responsibility. In Genesis and Deuteronomy and all the way into the New

00:25:24.560 Testament, God calls us to be fruitful, wise, and faithful with what he provides. We help Christian

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00:25:57.080 America is a country that was founded for the purpose of allowing Christians to do their duty

00:26:00.600 before God and not to have their consciences ruled by the doctrines and commandments of men.

00:26:05.000 Rees Fund exists in order to see the Ten Commandments properly applied, not just as a

00:26:09.440 plaque on the wall, but to actually be used in business as though they're commandments from God

00:26:14.380 that we're supposed to obey. Our goal is to find businesses and to buy them and to build them up.

00:26:20.580 We want to find manufacturing businesses and use them to make sure that we can maintain our

00:26:24.800 capacity to do things here. Rees Fund, Christian Capital, Boldly Deployed.

00:26:31.120 The British statesman Edmund Burke once noted, and I quote,

00:26:35.320 When ancient opinions and rules of life are taken away, the loss cannot possibly be estimated.

00:26:44.180 It seems that we live in such times where ancient opinions and rules of life have indeed been taken away.

00:26:51.320 We are not estimating the loss, but experiencing this loss in real time.

00:26:57.000 Speaking of such times as ours, the reactionary thinker,

00:27:00.440 Nicolás Gómez de Vila, said that modern man is scandalized by what was commonplace

00:27:06.980 in traditional society. The most radical book of our time, he said, would be a compendium

00:27:13.920 of old proverbs. A compendium of old proverbs, truths, and wisdom that were once commonplace

00:27:22.440 in traditional society is just what is needed right now. Who is my neighbor is precisely

00:27:29.520 this book, an encyclopedia of ancient opinions, rules of life, truths, all once forgotten,

00:27:38.020 but now recovered. So go and get Who is My Neighbor from Western Front Books by going to

00:27:45.180 westernfrontbooks.com. Again, that's westernfrontbooks.com. All right, this is a topic that

00:27:53.820 Building Christian Burroughs, we've actually talked about it some in the past a little bit,

00:27:57.340 And it's a topic that will bear many more discussions, right?

00:28:01.840 And so what I want to do real quick is just outline, this is shamelessly stolen from the New Christendom Conference last year.

00:28:10.300 These were just some main topics that were touched on at that conference of what you should be thinking about if you want to build a Christian borough.

00:28:17.920 So I'm going to hit the five just so that you as the listener are thinking, okay, if I want to do this, I didn't even think about that or I didn't want to think about this.

00:28:24.880 But we're going to dive specifically into just one or two of them for the rest of the

00:28:30.020 episode.

00:28:30.460 So the five are a worship-centric life.

00:28:33.300 So the idea of the church being the center of public life, not the governing body, but

00:28:39.740 informing the consciences and practices and worship of the people.

00:28:44.460 Education and paideia.

00:28:46.020 It's shocking to me.

00:28:47.280 When we did our episode on education a couple weeks ago, I didn't make this connection.

00:28:53.180 Harvard as a college. It wasn't a university yet. It was started first as a college.

00:28:57.640 It was founded six years after the Pilgrims landed in Massachusetts. I mean, they were taking that 1.00

00:29:04.940 seriously. They said, we need an educated, at least elite class that can be trained in theology

00:29:11.080 and in the higher disciplines. So that's, it's really crazy. Economics, Christian economics,

00:29:18.520 local businesses, but also we've talked about the parallel economy and how maybe that's not

00:29:25.240 totally a realistic expectation. But being able to have access to capital, being able to have

00:29:30.740 access to funding businesses, and let's just be honest, investing in the capital and money into

00:29:37.400 local and state elections, things like that, the Christian economic system has to get better.

00:29:42.340 and you have to have some sort of way of both propelling your goal

00:29:47.460 and your vision for your town and also supporting the people in it.

00:29:50.440 So that's number three.

00:29:51.340 Number four is that it's local.

00:29:54.700 It's made up of land and family, so it's very family-focused.

00:30:00.340 It's local.

00:30:01.520 There's land involved, people owning property

00:30:05.180 and expanding that ownership over time.

00:30:07.440 And then last one is the idea of as these boroughs build,

00:30:12.340 It is a good idea for us as the Christian right to think about how they can be interconnected, right?

00:30:18.040 How they can be working together, not just carving copies of each other.

00:30:21.600 Each one will be slightly different with the localism piece that Wes is going to talk about, but interconnected.

00:30:26.460 Yeah, I would think of localism, there's a way to kind of think of it as different streams.

00:30:30.720 I would almost think of it as a foundation.

00:30:32.960 And so localism, we touched on this on an episode we did on politics.

00:30:36.020 I think it was about a week and a half ago or so.

00:30:37.880 But you're not going to be able to save everyone.

00:30:39.940 and you've got to think at just a certain geographical limit right we think of john

00:30:44.020 knox like give me scotland or i die and that sounds great like give me the united states or

00:30:47.680 i die my brother in christ scotland is the size of south carolina south carolina is the 12th

00:30:52.580 smallest state in the united states right so he's saying i've got a nation in that case it's a nation

00:30:57.220 but it's at that point the population of scotland was probably significantly 25 000 people so like

00:31:02.540 when he says give me you know scotland lest i die he's right like he would be looking at houston

00:31:07.100 and saying it's probably too big yeah exactly give me not all of it not the whole region not

00:31:13.600 the whole hemisphere give me about a city's worth yeah it's probably the equivalent of him saying

00:31:18.320 like give me williamson county yes i die like covenant bible a lot of our calculus there's a

00:31:22.560 bunch of different towns around here you have huddo you have taylor you have georgetown pflugerville

00:31:26.760 cedar park we're focused on georgetown and there's other towns around that'll be impacted and have

00:31:30.840 people from them but we've actually i don't think we've ever gone to like the huddo courthouse we

00:31:34.900 haven't gone to pflugerville we said we've got a county um christ church in yeah because they're

00:31:40.340 in taylor which is to your point about networking exactly because they're a sister church and that's

00:31:44.800 their focus but yeah like our primary focus is georgetown and because there's a like-minded

00:31:49.500 church in taylor we've done a little bit there yep so our focus is a county not a state a city

00:31:54.540 even within that so in all the place that is our focus one city and so think of that as a foundation

00:31:59.560 the next link the next layer of it i don't think it's actually church grace doesn't destroy nature

00:32:04.820 grace perfects it so what grace is actually doing when you talk about michael the worship centered

00:32:09.140 life that's actually resting on top of people doing their natural duties well i agree and grace

00:32:13.700 perfecting it if you have a church and it's 200 people and they're all dead broke you're literally

00:32:18.740 not going to be able to get much done you're not going to be able to run candidates for office

00:32:21.860 you're not going to be able to employ young men your children great wednesday prayer meetings you

00:32:26.020 are going to have great wednesday prayer meetings great saturday you know men's prayer breakfast

00:32:29.620 great. Well, the potluck will be chicken drumsticks, but you need businesses. You need

00:32:35.100 economics. And so you have your locale. Where am I focused? Then who is making money and doing

00:32:40.420 things? They're going to be the engine to support a pastor, right? The pastor should be paid if he's

00:32:45.200 doing it as a vocation, if he's doing it full time, he's doing good work in the preaching and

00:32:49.340 ministry. So you have to pay someone that requires money. You want to be politically involved. Like

00:32:53.500 we talked about a couple of weeks ago, that involves money. You want your children to stay

00:32:57.200 in the area. So if you want your children to then take up business with you and start things of

00:33:01.340 their own, they're going to go away and go to another college and work somewhere else if there's

00:33:05.580 no opportunity here. But if you say to an 18-year-old man who doesn't want to go to college,

00:33:09.420 come in here and run operations for me on this $5 million business, and you'd be paid a great

00:33:13.960 salary, and you're going to work alongside great men, and you're going to be able to keep your

00:33:17.440 wife at home, that's huge. Lots of people don't have that. So it's locale, it's business, then

00:33:23.140 the church and then broadening out and be thinking for the locale too like for us we're 35 minutes

00:33:28.420 from the capitol that means many members have gone to the capitol to protest to testify on the side

00:33:34.000 of bills so am i near my capitol am i near a city with a lot of influence if you think about

00:33:39.080 tennessee and nashville well nashville is a place where a lot of media is going in so maybe i have

00:33:43.480 a specific media focus and to add one more michael uh how are you attracting people to it so we've

00:33:49.180 got Ogden. We've got Georgetown. How do people know you exist? You need to be blasting out your

00:33:54.100 name. We have so-and-so church in and say maybe, you know, the actual city that's nearby would be

00:33:59.760 Pittsburgh. We're in city so-and-so just outside of Pittsburgh, or we're just outside of Philadelphia.

00:34:04.640 We're just outside of New York. And so people are connecting and saying, I'm connected to a major

00:34:08.860 city. There's occupations that I can do there. There's things, there's travel, like airports.

00:34:14.380 Like how are you going to have a conference if the nearest airport, I think of like the Ark

00:34:17.640 encounter is like two hours away right practically speaking it's just going to be hard where's the

00:34:22.440 capital where's the airport how do people access me these are all thinking about where do i put my

00:34:27.700 borough um scotland was 800 000 to a million so yeah yeah so less than the greater austin region

00:34:36.380 but that's actually quite encouraging because it sounds just just on a finitude side if you're if

00:34:43.100 you tell a young man go in the entire country of america give me america or i die i mean it's a

00:34:49.440 it's not a bad sentiment um but it's it's somewhat achievable to say give me williamson county or i

00:34:55.420 die right give me x county or i die right right like that's actually now we don't know knox may

00:35:03.380 have had the same sentiment if scotland was twice as big or three times as big like the point was

00:35:08.420 loved his people um right like williamson county you've got maybe 15 to 20 city council seats

00:35:16.980 that's not that hard you've got a couple of district judges like like practically speaking

00:35:21.860 15 years right that's not at all unthinkable right especially if you get with other churches so it's

00:35:25.940 not like well we've got a source city council candidates all from here or no maybe you have

00:35:29.940 about five like-minded churches and at some level the call goes out hey this guy's running for city

00:35:34.580 council hey so and so starting a business hey he's doing this run then there's support there's block

00:35:39.140 walking elected like literally like that that you bite it off in a bite-sized chunk like that

00:35:43.940 a borough becomes much more manageable but you have to be thinking who's here what towns are

00:35:48.900 there what positions are strategic where do i focus you don't have infinite resources you don't

00:35:52.580 have infinite time what are the ones that are most important to focus on that type of tactical

00:35:57.380 thinking is what actually lays out a plan when you lay out a plan you know what you're actually

00:36:00.740 aiming at so um geneva is interesting in this respect because they they kind of became a refuge

00:36:07.980 for um reformed christians who were being persecuted around europe so there was the

00:36:14.340 huguenots who fled from france because of the the wars in france the catholic and protestant wars

00:36:18.940 but there were also some italians that came and interestingly enough uh john knox spent several

00:36:25.440 years in uh geneva and was basically trained there and sent back and so uh how was geneva

00:36:32.340 able to do this well partly it was because of their massive effort on printing and sending out

00:36:37.420 material um they they were distributing information at a rate that no one else around them was doing

00:36:43.940 which is which is quite remarkable for a town of 10 to 12 000 people now they had brilliant

00:36:49.820 leadership they had you know calvin and he attracted um all sorts of people and so they

00:36:55.200 had really great thinking they had really solid uh church life and they were considering all of

00:37:02.040 life they were considering medicine and law and they were hardcore in Geneva what's that I said

00:37:07.380 they were hardcore in Geneva well they were super hardcore in Geneva yes um but the point is they

00:37:13.680 attracted people from around Europe who came and and just had to get away but within the first I

00:37:20.840 think it was a couple of six or seven years of this happening in geneva kind of establishing

00:37:25.300 itself they sent a hundred church planters back into france right like it was not like

00:37:31.140 we talk about the idea uh joel you say it all the time and i think people sometimes think that

00:37:35.920 you're joking where you say we're leaving california so that our our kids our grandkids

00:37:40.040 can go back and conquer it right right like that has to be our goal this is not a rob drear

00:37:45.760 benedict option right where we're just hunkering down and we're just going to be this monastery

00:37:51.060 that has a well so we can have our water right and no that is not it like even with like you

00:37:57.100 know the benedict option like the the thing that you know the element that's conveniently left out

00:38:01.660 is that all these monks were protected by guys who were you know that's fighting for them so

00:38:07.340 so that only works if you you know if you actually have somebody else's out there you know with blood

00:38:13.560 sweat and tears fighting for your way of life um otherwise it's just okay we're you know we're

00:38:18.940 going to stay in the shire you know but eventually um eventually they come for the shire that's what

00:38:23.940 happens in the book not the movies but in the book right this shire is scoured right your little

00:38:28.580 peaceful life or here we're retreating we're just doing life and homesteading congrats palantir is

00:38:35.100 coming and you're gonna get destroyed by drones yeah like legitimately like it's not just an

00:38:38.940 option to just fully retreat you have to be engaged and forward-facing at some level yeah

00:38:43.300 right yep okay i have a question for you two um and i don't always see these things as clearly as

00:38:48.720 you two so i this is a legitimate question on my part um can a christian borough in our time be

00:38:55.220 built without people moving from other areas like like can if you if you're part of a church

00:39:02.460 small church 30 person church but you're in a town of you know 40 000 and your church is solid but

00:39:08.900 it's not very big can you build a christian borough in our time without people moving in

00:39:16.100 from the outside i mean what is what are we at like so you've got someone listening to the podcast

00:39:20.920 and they're like we're interested in this project does it require either them moving or people

00:39:24.960 moving to them or is there a way that this can be done um in kind of a grassroots sense like let's

00:39:31.560 be really honest and blunt with with the listener yeah i think it requires moving um that's why you

00:39:37.140 know, I wrote this little book right there on the coffee table, fight by flight. And with moving,

00:39:41.720 it's not a cowardly retreat. You're not running from a fight. You're running to a fight.

00:39:47.540 You're advancing to the rear. And the beauty is that in the providence of God, there's a twofold,

00:39:53.320 you know, fruitfulness that I'm hoping will come about. One, what you're doing is you're defunding

00:40:00.980 the place that is currently unwinnable now no place is uh indefinitely unwinnable so like when

00:40:08.020 i say you know we're gonna uh get out of california but then you know we'll we'll send our

00:40:12.600 grandchildren back in to conquer the land uh you're right i i am being serious it's not a joke

00:40:16.920 um but but what you're doing is you're defunding that place temporarily so you're saying you know

00:40:23.720 because so so many places california is a great example uh it's the salt of the earth that's

00:40:27.980 propping it up right you know with their with their tax dollars with all these different things

00:40:31.780 yeah like it's it's all these people who are paying their state tax to support policies that

00:40:36.700 they hate um you know that don't represent them that aren't good for their way of life that are

00:40:41.160 destroying everything that they love uh and they're literally funding it by the mere presence of of

00:40:46.640 living there um so you're doing two things with one foul swoop you know two birds one stone you're

00:40:52.000 you're defunding godless places um that bring them more quickly to the brink where now all of a sudden

00:40:59.160 uh gavin newsom in california they actually have to lay in the bed that they've been making they

00:41:03.080 have to eat their own medicine so you're defunding them so there's an attack um by by no longer

00:41:08.380 funding them um and in one regard the place that you're leaving and then there's reinforcements in

00:41:13.600 the place that you're moving to so you're moving to places that are more winnable um you're moving

00:41:18.180 to hills that actually can be taken, that can be fortified, defended, and the tide could actually,

00:41:24.480 in the providence of God, turn in the short run. So you're going to a place that can be won now

00:41:28.800 in order to destabilize and defund a place that can't be won now, that brings it to a point where

00:41:35.780 it's actually weaker over the coming generations. And then you're fortifying over here in a place

00:41:41.380 that can be won within one or two generations, and that can be won so decisively that now you

00:41:47.220 have a surplus right you have a stronghold in tennessee you know or texas or wherever it is

00:41:51.920 and and then when california is brought to the brink uh you actually have you know reserves

00:41:57.660 that you can spare that now you can go back in because the battle has been substantially weakened

00:42:02.640 so to answer your question and to do so like you asked to do it honestly um no i don't think

00:42:08.100 there's any winning scenario uh where everybody gets to stay where they already live like the

00:42:15.160 reality is that it is inconvenient um it will require moving the problem is i talk to guys all

00:42:20.960 the time this is you know one of the most common emails that i get of guys saying i love what you're

00:42:24.940 doing and uh how do we do this here and the answer is um in many cases not all cases but in many

00:42:30.800 cases the answer is you don't like we want to do it here um we're going to start a podcast

00:42:37.300 that's a great idea but 2017 cold and would like that idea back that was a great idea once upon a

00:42:47.080 time the media landscape is so oversaturated and flooded right now it is virtually impossible like

00:42:54.920 you will be doing a podcast and it could be great you could have great content and and good

00:42:59.660 production but we're talking the social media platforms have literally you can read about it

00:43:04.180 they've literally changed their algorithms so it's not even just that it's overly saturated

00:43:08.700 the space of podcasts and media um but but in many ways they've changed the algorithms to where

00:43:14.100 uh the little guy the new guy who's just now coming on the scene doesn't stand a chance right

00:43:19.800 doesn't stand a chance and so like and i've talked to guy after guy after guy who's like we're trying

00:43:24.760 to do what you did joel and we're starting today and um and and all of them end up disappointed

00:43:31.040 it you know they start something and it's in many cases it's too late now in god's economy it's never

00:43:37.360 ultimately too late um but the reality is that there are various times throughout history where

00:43:42.960 it's too late for something particular so i'm not saying it's too late for the next thing i'm not

00:43:48.260 saying that there's there's no opportunity um but but there are plenty of plenty of times throughout

00:43:53.680 history where it's like okay it's it's too late for gold right like you know but there's something

00:44:00.100 else there's silicon you know and then there's something else you know there's lithium or what

00:44:05.020 like there's always going to be whether it's whether it's oil or whether it's the light bulb

00:44:09.140 or whether it's this or whether there's always going to be new innovations um but to say i'm

00:44:14.360 going to come into this this space that's already saturated um and i'm going to come in you know

00:44:20.720 a decade late and i'm going to expect that i could still somehow be successful or even experience the

00:44:27.760 same measure of success as the guys who were grandfathered in you know who were early adopters

00:44:33.020 and started right away like you got guys like um mike winger for instance like mike winger has a

00:44:39.080 low production value you know it's not like this like highly produced our show was more produced

00:44:43.460 than his show um so it's like so what's the success of mike winger and people say oh well

00:44:47.740 he's so educated or he's got great content or he has a likable personality and i don't want to

00:44:52.820 disparage him i think some of that's true i don't think i would say it's you know like that strongly

00:44:57.360 like i don't i don't think his content's that great he's pretty much just soft evangelical normie

00:45:04.640 like nazarene barely complementarian mostly egalitarian like like it's my point is it's

00:45:12.080 really not that special it's not that unique so then like well then why does he have over

00:45:17.120 half a million subscribers because he started doing youtube before anybody else in the christian space

00:45:22.320 he just started early and long obedience in one direction pays off and so he was an early adopter

00:45:28.980 who was doing youtube videos again and again and again and again he was consistent and he didn't

00:45:34.420 drop and he just kept going and kept going and kept going before anybody else did and it became

00:45:38.560 successful and so all that being said back to the original question or like um do do i have to move

00:45:45.320 i i think i think many people do uh many people do and everybody's just kind of staying put a

00:45:52.840 lot of guys are just staying put and hoping that the calvary will come to them but the reality is

00:45:58.700 it probably won't and so so then what are you looking for um you know because most people

00:46:04.260 aren't even going to know that you exist it's like well so we have our borough project here

00:46:08.880 in this location but nobody knows about it and so it's like all right so you need media yeah but

00:46:14.480 But it's like, but if you haven't already been doing it, it's like, well, we're going to start

00:46:17.720 a podcast. Yeah. And no one's going to hear it probably. And so then what do you do? Well, I

00:46:24.420 think, you know, one of the things that we could do is basically the reverse of everything that

00:46:29.400 we've done over the last 30, 40, 50 years of evangelicalism. What we did was instead of

00:46:35.340 winning somewhere, we opted for losing everywhere. Essentially, in a nutshell, what we did within

00:46:41.160 evangelicalism over the last half a century is we spread our forces too thin we did this

00:46:46.360 internationally with global missions and we did this also domestically with church planting and

00:46:52.680 we took everybody and we split them up right and and we you know we had ways of justifying it you

00:46:59.140 know and like well we're against mega churches or we're against this we're again well there's

00:47:03.300 nothing biblically there's nothing inherently wrong with mega churches the church in jerusalem

00:47:07.180 we know was a megachurch i mean it started with 3 000 converts that were added on the day of

00:47:12.040 pentecost when peter stood up and preached a sermon 3 000 people were added to the faith

00:47:15.740 now there were people in town obviously what was going on you know with their their customs

00:47:20.240 there were people from all over and so many of those people probably went back but there still

00:47:24.180 was probably a very large church that was left in jerusalem antioch had a very large church and

00:47:30.800 there's nothing inherently wrong with these churches the megachurches that we despise or

00:47:34.480 that we should despise are megachurches that have grown because they've adopted attractional

00:47:39.060 methods that come at the cost of compromising sound biblical doctrine. Well, that's a problem.

00:47:45.620 That's a problem. But if Refuge Church in Ogden, Utah, I mean, it's grown substantially. It's

00:47:52.240 grown from just 100 people over the years to now 400, 500 people plus. And if Refuge Ogden did a

00:48:00.360 4X in the next five to 10 years and built, you know, a new building that had 2,000 people in

00:48:06.700 their church, but they maintained their doctrinal, you know, distinctives and all these kinds of

00:48:10.580 things, then that's great. There's nothing wrong with that. And by God's grace, they could actually

00:48:15.940 take Ogden. They could actually take it for Christ. Same thing with us. You know, we started

00:48:20.380 with 20 people on the couch in my living room. And in four years, we are now over 200 people,

00:48:27.000 and we're building a building, a church building is under construction. And if we grew to a thousand

00:48:31.980 people, if we 4X'd over the next five to 10 years, then that would be great. But when you look at 0.99

00:48:38.260 who actually stands a reasonable chance of being able to achieve that kind of growth in the next

00:48:44.360 five to 10 years, it's going to be churches that are already known today. Not a church that you

00:48:49.840 hope to be known, but a church that already has some kind of substantial presence and is able to

00:48:56.080 attract people foundation already some kind of foundation but then also some kind of media

00:49:00.600 presence like that it's it's nationally known that people um have seen it and they and they've

00:49:06.640 heard about it and and so then it's drawing in the reinforcements it's it's doing the reverse

00:49:11.560 instead of instead of opting to lose everywhere it's opting to win somewhere we're going to win

00:49:18.880 in a few places and we're going to do what it takes to win so decisively that um after securing

00:49:25.640 the victory and and shoring it up we're going to eventually have um we're going to have people and

00:49:32.860 resources to spare so then we can win also in the town uh next right right over and um or this place

00:49:40.960 is now on the brink and there's these seats that are available in this county and blah blah blah

00:49:44.900 because because they you know their their leftist policies you know the chickens have finally come

00:49:50.000 home to roost. And we depleted them of conservative resources by drawing back outside of being behind

00:49:56.900 enemy lines. But now they've depleted in their strength and they're crumbling. And now we can

00:50:01.600 go back in. We have these resources, these people. I think it's going to require like a chessboard.

00:50:08.420 You're not going to win without moving any of your pieces. You're going to have to move around.

00:50:13.900 And basically what that requires is a lot of guys, this is the difficulty. Yes, there's the

00:50:19.460 practical constraints. Moving can be difficult financially, all these different things. But for

00:50:24.260 a lot of guys, it's not just practical. A lot of guys, I think it really is, it's more moral.

00:50:31.100 It's spiritual. And what I mean by that is what a lot of guys liked, including myself, about the

00:50:36.200 church planting movement or these kinds of things, is a lot of guys who are better suited to play

00:50:41.840 second chair, they liked the church planting movement because it allowed them to play first

00:50:46.900 chair. It took a number two guy and said, you get to be a number one guy. And that appealed

00:50:53.620 to a lot of guys. But the result of that strategy is that we lost everywhere. We lost the country.

00:51:00.860 And so what I'm saying is it's going to require, yes, some financial sacrifice,

00:51:06.040 these kinds of things, the practical constraints of moving and uprooting your life. But the big

00:51:12.940 factor that it's going to require in addition to all that is just some good old-fashioned humility

00:51:17.760 and i think that's probably the most the biggest hindrance to a lot of people adopting this kind

00:51:25.180 of strategy is it requires humility it requires um i'm going to go and serve with you know brian

00:51:31.000 silvey and i'm not going to be the lead pastor in fact um i may not even be an elder ever right or

00:51:36.760 if i am i may not be an elder for five years it's going to require uh that kind of humility

00:51:42.660 that I'm going to support someone else's work

00:51:46.080 instead of just doing my own.

00:51:47.660 Nobody wants to go and support someone else's work.

00:51:50.200 They want to do their own work.

00:51:51.440 But here's the reality, and you guys have to hear this.

00:51:53.420 I'm not trying to be rude.

00:51:55.280 You don't want to support someone else's work.

00:51:57.060 You want to do your own.

00:51:58.860 Here's the reality. 1.00

00:51:59.700 Your work sucks. 1.00

00:52:01.460 Your work is unimpressive. 1.00

00:52:03.720 Your work is not working.

00:52:06.280 And you know it's not working.

00:52:08.220 And at a certain point, you have to have the humility

00:52:10.420 and the courage to call a spade a spade and say, what I do and who I am and what I contribute

00:52:17.500 actually is inherently valuable, but it's not enough in isolation. But me and 20 other people

00:52:26.420 like me coming and joining Ogden, Utah or Georgetown, Texas, that would be significant.

00:52:33.780 And so you actually still do have a viable and valuable role to play, but you don't get to play

00:52:39.860 first chair yep let's have our last commercial break and leave us some practicals running your

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00:56:37.980 first free bag of coffee today so landing the plane uh we've said it a lot when it comes to

00:56:45.020 the local sphere, localism, my state, my county, we can't hold your hand. Your county is different.

00:56:51.280 Your church is different. The makeup of your church is different. You're pastoring, your

00:56:54.680 denomination, all of these things. There is no guide. Like men, you're thinking about this.

00:56:59.200 There's no guide. Well, I follow step one, step two, and step three. You're going to have to 0.98

00:57:03.660 figure it out. That's what makes great men. But here's the big tool that can help you. And that

00:57:07.840 tool is networking. And it's networking online. For most of you, say you're in Pennsylvania right

00:57:12.400 now, right? So you think of Ogden, you think of Georgetown, maybe a couple others. There's none

00:57:16.700 that are necessarily close when you think of the big ones, but I guarantee there are faithful

00:57:21.020 pastors in Pennsylvania. If you're a high caliber man, you run a successful business, you're doing

00:57:26.120 something on the ground to where instead of you're in Pennsylvania, you're like, I see the need to

00:57:30.260 move. They take your advice, Joel. They take stock and they say, this is a church that's dying. It's

00:57:34.260 in a small town. There's nothing strategic. I can take my business and move elsewhere. If you do

00:57:39.700 that, you don't necessarily have to go half a country away. You could go an hour and a half

00:57:43.720 away. But how do you become aware of that church? How do you see what the pastor is doing? How do

00:57:47.040 you join with what's happening? You become aware of them because you connect with people. You talk,

00:57:52.080 you attend meetings, you join group chats. You're just looking, who's around my area? Who's nearby?

00:57:57.180 What are they doing? How can I help with? If you have a media ministry, if you are a pastor,

00:58:02.200 you are starting something, say again and again and again. It's funny, Texas is so big. There's

00:58:07.320 been some people that they hear georgetown yeah and they're in austin or like somewhere else they

00:58:11.440 don't connect the dots but they're like wait a second texas is huge i thought georgetown was

00:58:15.200 five hours it's 40 minutes away right so if you're in texas you're in oklahoma hey guys we're in west

00:58:21.020 oklahoma just outside of x y and z city we're starting a church telling people again and again

00:58:27.200 and again hey we're here and we're here i heard i just did this recently someone was moving to

00:58:32.120 the dallas area hey do you have a church in the area i know great guys there that would love to

00:58:35.860 have you let me connect them you do that and we spend five years different men different places

00:58:40.640 some of them they're going to dallas for families they're not coming here some of them are trying to

00:58:44.060 stay in pennsylvania to be near grandparents some of them have a business this that or the other

00:58:47.820 but you do that that's how you also build up boroughs without having just for example two

00:58:52.560 options well i've got the northwest out in utah i've got texas down here what about georgia what

00:58:57.780 about north carolina what about florida you have to be networking to begin begin to become aware

00:59:02.320 of what's around you yep yep yeah and that that because in a sense what we're what we're arguing

00:59:09.660 for conflicts with other things that we said which is loving your land and your place right it is

00:59:16.040 hard it is hard for me who um i love the land of washington right the mountains and the beauty and

00:59:22.640 i do feel a connection to that moving to texas um it's it's not as natural for me to love the

00:59:29.420 land of texas as it was where i spent a significant amount of my my life and so it's not natural for

00:59:35.180 anyone to love the land of texas davy crockett certainly did it's a difficult land to love

00:59:40.720 my point is wes i i think i think your point is well taken as much as we want capable and

00:59:50.040 godly men to move and join our project here there might be a way for you to still move

00:59:56.920 and still collaborate resources but somewhere that is where you know your grandparents still

01:00:03.400 live or something like that um but to joel's point with the whole book if that's not possible

01:00:08.980 then you do have to consider plan c right yep yep agreed all right well thank you guys for

01:00:14.860 tuning in we hope that you've enjoyed this episode and found it helpful and we will see you lord

01:00:19.620 willing and the next episode our schedule just for people who are maybe new to the channel is

01:00:24.320 uh monday wednesday friday we live stream at 3 p.m central time monday wednesday friday

01:00:28.940 and we also have our friday special that airs on fridays at 8 p.m central time and uh for q2 right

01:00:36.580 now um so april and may and some of june uh what we're doing in that friday special slot uh fridays

01:00:43.420 at 8 p.m central is we are slow dripping out one piece at a time the content from our recent

01:00:49.200 conference christ is king how to defeat trash world and so uh those pieces of content are

01:00:54.720 coming out one by one uh throughout again the course of this three month period april and may

01:01:00.260 and june and then we will be launching um our friday special with stephen wolf dr stephen wolf

01:01:05.900 uh for q3 so that'll be july and august and september and so we're excited about that

01:01:11.680 but with the live stream that is going to be monday wednesday and friday every single week

01:01:17.020 at 3 p.m central time and we hope to see you then

The NXR Podcast - May 09, 2025

THE LIVESTREAM - BUILDING CHRISTIAN BURROUGHS - No longer plan B

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