00:06:52.760Very, very difficult transition for me.
00:06:54.580the first year out of the Marine Corps while working at a church where I know people loved
00:06:59.780me and cared for me. I had a pastor that cared for me. I was an absolute train wreck. I was a
00:07:04.620mess at home, two small kids, a wife that loved me, and I was angry all the time, which manifested
00:07:11.400itself in throwing things and hitting things. Not my wife or my kids, thankfully, but just about
00:07:16.000everything else. On a church staff, blowing up in staff meetings, getting thrown out of staff
00:07:22.800meetings eventually after about 11 months of that my pastor called me to his office and said this
00:07:28.120is just not working i love you i care for you i care for your family but you're going to have to
00:07:32.840go somewhere else if you don't get this thing figured out sent me away for a week said come
00:07:36.820back at the end of the week and tell me what you're going to do this is 2003 um i guess 2004
00:07:41.880at that time post-traumatic stress and you know the issues we're going to talk about today
00:07:46.100weren't things that the church was talking about and um you know i knew my pastor loved me but he
00:07:51.540didn't know how to deal with me. And that's fair looking back. And through a process of
00:07:57.860conversations with my wife and praying and, you know, really trying to understand where I was,
00:08:02.660I realized that so much of what I was doing was my fault and my responsibility. It wasn't everyone
00:08:08.180else in my life. Everyone's a jerk. Everyone is a problem. No one knows where I've been or what1.00
00:08:12.280I've done. That's what I was telling myself. I mean, that's the story. You know, I continue to
00:08:15.840tell myself, but really it was, I was not doing what I needed to do. I was not living the way
00:08:21.460that I should have been living. And, um, once I got ahold of that truth, the personal responsibility
00:08:27.360aspect, uh, everything changed. Um, it didn't change overnight, but I was able to move forward
00:08:33.740and, um, stayed at that church for another four years, served on that staff for a total of five
00:08:38.200years, eventually pastored a church in the San Francisco area for another seven years before
00:08:43.160doing what I do now, working with veterans and our military. So a long road, interesting road,
00:08:49.840and kind of a convergence of the military and my ministry life now in, you know, doing what I do
00:08:55.300now. And I'm thankful for the path that God brought us down. But yeah, it was a very interesting
00:09:00.780transition. But here we are. Now we serve the military. Praise God. Well, tell us about serving
00:09:07.180the military. So you've told us your story, a little bit of your testimony, how you got up to
00:09:11.140that point. So what is it that you do with Mighty Oaks Foundation? So we work with essentially four
00:09:19.320groups, veterans, active duty service members, first responders, that's police officers and
00:09:24.220firefighters, and then spouses. And we could talk about all that is involved in that. But
00:09:30.040there are a lot of programs for all of those groups of folks, particularly the veterans and
00:09:36.680the active duty service members. A lot of programs that deal with post-traumatic stress and combat
00:09:40.480trauma, you know, other, we'll say mental health related issues, a lot of programs.
00:09:47.360What most of those programs fail to deal with or address, however, is the spiritual need.
00:09:53.880And what we understand is that you can, you know, put a Band-Aid on a wound, but that's
00:09:59.100all it is if you haven't dealt with the actual problem.
00:10:01.640And so many of our service members, whether it's veterans or active duty service members,
00:10:05.560and really in our first responder community as well the programs that they have access to
00:10:10.860are putting a band-aid on a you know a gaping chest we're going to get a hole in their chest
00:10:16.340and and we're covering it up we're trying to change habits or whatever and not dealing with
00:10:21.160the spiritual issue the founder of the mighty oaks foundation who i work with chad robishow
00:10:27.340is also a marine veteran i'm a marine veteran and as we were working through a lot of this a long
00:10:33.220time ago, 10 years ago, we decided very clearly and very, I was going to say very fundamentally,
00:10:45.720that's not the right word, but we decided that what we would do as Christians who have found
00:10:51.120healing through a relationship with Jesus Christ and aligning our lives to his purpose for our
00:10:56.020life is we would move beyond the programs and the therapies, all the other stuff that
00:11:02.680service members have access to and address specifically that spiritual need. And in the
00:11:10.320beginning, folks said, if you do that, you will never have access to the active duty military.
00:11:14.520You'll never have access to police officers and firefighters. Maybe you'll get some veterans to
00:11:18.620come to your program. But if you talk about God, talk about who he is, talk about what it is to
00:11:22.800have a relationship with him through Christ. If you talk about these kind of spiritual healing or
00:11:27.380what the Department of Defense would call spiritual resiliency pieces, you'll never have access to
00:11:32.060real people who are really hurting. And we said, well, we'll just do the best we can to see what
00:11:37.360God opens up. And that's what we've done for the last 10 years. We've had more than 4,000 people
00:11:42.860come through our week-long programs where we bring people to one of our facilities across the
00:11:47.940country. We spend a week with them talking about what it is to align your life to the life that
00:11:53.460your creator created you to live. Most of the folks who attend our programs are not Christians.
00:11:58.520Many of them would have what they would call no faith at all.
00:12:01.900Some of them might even be adversarial to God because of the loss of friends and so forth.
00:12:07.260They would say they hate God or they're angry at God, but they tried everything else.
00:12:10.840They end up with us because they have nowhere else to go through donors.
00:12:14.240We pay for the programs. We pay for travel. So there's no you know, there's nothing.
00:12:18.880They're not losing anything in the process. So they'll come and they'll sit and we'll say simply observe what we do.
00:12:25.360Watch what we do. Listen to what we say. Look at the lives that we are demonstrating to you through testimony and compare your life to that and see if you have what you need to continue moving forward.
00:12:37.820We talk about, again, God, the creator. If there's a creator, then there's a plan.
00:12:41.440If there's a plan and we need to understand that if we align to that plan, then the traumas and the difficulties and the trials and the stuff that is holding you bondage and captive will no longer have control over you.
00:12:54.280And we've, again, seen 4,000 folks come through those week-long programs.
00:12:58.620We've spoken to more than 150,000 active duty troops, whether it's in bases or conferences
00:13:04.540across the country, as unit commanders and unit leaders have reached out to us and said
00:13:08.800things like, we don't really care what you do or what you say, but we need help.
00:13:13.240And if you can come and help us, we'll open the door for that.
00:13:16.260God has been very, very good to us in just opening doors of opportunity that really should
00:13:31.660Well, let's talk about PTSD for a little bit.
00:13:34.060So just so you know that where I'm at, you know, we talked a little bit before we started recording this episode.
00:13:38.700But for me personally, as a pastor and being a Reformed Baptist pastor and conservative in my convictions, I would prescribe to biblical counseling.
00:13:48.820I think that a lot of secular psychology
00:18:44.960And what do you do as a Christian trying to help people with this, but without giving into, you know, godless psychology or what portion might be right?
00:18:55.200What's your perspective on that issue?
00:18:57.680Yeah, so that was a really big question.
00:19:06.540So great question. I think that that is what we as those who would hold to the sufficiency of scripture.
00:19:14.120That's what we struggle with. And it's a struggle because, you know, all the things that you just illuminated.
00:19:20.620We go to doctors. I believe in the sufficiency of scripture.
00:19:23.720But if I have a broken arm, I'm going to go to a doctor to have that arm set because they have the experience and the tools and the resources to do that.
00:19:31.440what so on the front end going back to your original point of starting point when we talk
00:19:38.740about clinical treatments for post-traumatic stress disorder and i'll talk about how we view
00:19:43.880that but when we talk about clinical treatments that would include secular psychology but it
00:19:49.180would include a lot of other things too there are therapies there are medications there are a lot
00:19:54.280of things that fall into that clinical care bucket the the problem with clinical care a lot
00:20:00.980problems but one of the major problems and the probably the biggest problem for veterans and
00:20:06.560service members who are struggling to try to figure all this out is the starting point a
00:20:11.300clinician will say we're going to start with therapies that therapy will probably include
00:20:16.200medication we have folks who attend our program that are on more than 20 medications a day 20
00:20:21.340medications a day because a clinician has said well you need this for sleep and you need this
00:20:27.320for awake and you need this when you feel bad and this when you feel manic, you know, and they'll
00:20:32.760try to balance it all out chemically. There are a lot of other therapies and a lot of other
00:20:37.640therapeutics that can be used, but that's their starting point. And if somewhere along the
00:20:42.380treatment route, something spiritual needs to be interjected, then they'll include that as well
00:20:48.460in their therapy. Their starting point is clinical and somewhere along the way, there may be
00:20:54.880spiritual, if it's needed. We would say the starting point is spiritual. We have to deal with
00:21:02.560who you are before a holy God, your standing before God, the fact that you were created,
00:21:09.120that there is design, and the reason you're struggling so much in your relationships,
00:21:14.160etc. The reason you're struggling to figure out your path forward is not because of what
00:21:18.380happened to you, but because you're not aiming at the right target. You're not moving in the
00:21:22.320right direction we start with the spiritual and if something clinical is helpful along the way
00:21:27.960then we can look at that as it aids in spiritual healing gotcha now to your point there are both
00:21:36.520psychological and physiological impacts of post-traumatic stress and this is all still
00:21:43.340being researched and still being understood on one hand you have traumatic brain injury which
00:21:49.060you know for many many years until fairly recently the way that it would manifest itself
00:21:55.160the symptoms of a traumatic brain injury a concussion for those that aren't familiar
00:21:58.580because of an explosion because of you know head injury which is very very common in the military
00:22:04.220for our combat veterans in particular the symptoms of that traumatic brain injury looked very much
00:22:10.720like post-traumatic stress disorder the anger the emotion you know uncontrolled emotions you know
00:22:17.200all the things that go into post-traumatic stress disorder. And so we were diagnosing them the same
00:22:21.840way, not addressing the physical, the very real physical, biological, physiological issues
00:22:27.320associated with a concussion. And particularly when there have been multiple concussions,
00:22:32.600the TBI, the traumatic brain injury has a real impact on the body. And that needs to be dealt
00:22:36.800with. Thankfully, again, doctors, to your point, have figured this out and have begun to treat that
00:22:42.480separate from post-traumatic stress disorder. And that's fantastic. And so we're seeing some great
00:22:47.520things happen there. Post-traumatic stress disorder is very interesting and it goes back
00:22:54.480to the creation piece. God created us perfect again, as you mentioned earlier, and he created
00:23:00.620us with some presets in our brain that are designed to keep us safe. One of those things
00:23:07.840is how we handle trauma. We have a subconscious response to traumatic events that take place in
00:23:13.860our lives. It is a place in our brain where the limbic system where information is stored and
00:23:22.960it's stored in a way that we don't even always recognize so that if we find ourselves in a
00:23:28.220similar situation in the future, this stored information kicks in all those presets so that
00:23:34.440we can respond better. We were in this situation and something bad happened. An example that we
00:23:40.520use, and it's a great example because a lot of combat veterans can picture it, you are on a
00:23:46.120forward operating base somewhere. It's a fairly secure situation, but you're being mortared by
00:23:51.080the enemy every day. This becomes very commonplace. Mortars start to fall one night as they have
00:23:57.460Every other night, you have a bunkmate, and he's taking his time because this happens every single day.
00:27:30.980You think about Noah, who had to deal with being locked inside of the ark as his friends, those who were outside, the people he preached to for 120 years, are trying to get in, and they're drowning, and they're dying.
00:27:42.680I guarantee there are people banging on that door and scratching on the side and trying to hang on, which may be why we find him doing some of the things that he did later in the story.
00:27:53.400You know, throughout Scripture, we see trauma.
00:27:55.020to include Jesus Christ in the garden as he sweat drops of blood I mean this is this is life life
00:28:00.580is traumatic and trauma being a part of your life doesn't give you an excuse to behave badly
00:28:06.220but you need to know how to move forward in spite of that and that how is in alignment with the
00:28:14.680word of God that was a long answer I don't know if I got to your point there but yeah yeah no that
00:28:19.400was great yeah i appreciate it so continuing in this vein but maybe maybe shifting gears slightly
00:28:27.060you know one of the things we talked about you know before we started recording the episode was
00:28:31.600uh in light of you know the things that we see in our news cycle and and now for me as a civilian
00:28:37.340i don't get the inside scoop and so i you know but i have common sense and so i i'm willing to
00:28:42.580bet that you know that um the headlines i well i wouldn't bet this i'll hope this i hope that
00:28:49.660the headlines of the military going woke you know or for four star general or five star general you
00:28:56.480know uh you know reading white fragility by robin d'angelo you know i i i hope that those things
00:29:03.360may make the headlines with a few people you know big wigs in the military that really more
00:29:09.680politicians. But I imagine and I hope that on the ground that that's not really seeping in. But
00:29:16.660if we don't turn from our wicked ways as a nation and our culture, if we don't repent of these
00:29:22.820things, then that is something that could happen and probably at least in trickles here and there
00:29:29.520is happening. And I'm thinking about that in light of everything we've talked about thus far
00:29:34.360in terms of living in a world of trauma.
00:29:38.020You said life is traumatic because we live in God's world,
00:29:43.220and so it's good, and yet we live in God's fallen world.
00:30:00.060And so we experience heartache, we experience tragedy,
00:30:02.660We experience terrifying and traumatic situations.
00:30:08.040And I would imagine, at least if I put myself into somebody's shoes
00:30:11.980who's in the military, that if I'm waking up with cold sweats in the night
00:30:17.480and reoccurring nightmares and struggling with PTSD,
00:30:20.960because I've seen my friend get his body ripped apart with shrapnel,
00:30:27.540and then i have to sit through lectures about how to be more empathetic what i'm saying is
00:30:34.560if there's real trauma like men being ripped apart by a real enemy that doesn't care about
00:30:39.840political correctness you know china doesn't care china loves the effeminacy of america because0.77
00:30:47.020you know and china is as you know that i mean they're even legislating getting rid of0.96
00:30:51.500sissy men in movies and entertainment and those kinds of things. And so China, they don't care0.95
00:30:57.700about that. So there are real enemies out there, not so much the Chinese people, but the communist
00:31:02.860Chinese party is at enmity with God and hates America because there are still remnants of God's
00:31:08.500law in America and those kinds of things. And so there are real enemies, there are real problems,
00:31:12.860and there are real trauma. And then there's what I want to call pseudo-trauma, where you're
00:31:20.520You're making someone a victim who's not a victim and you're trying to create trauma or really just drama because you like it and you thrive on it and you're trying to get attention.
00:31:34.080And I would imagine that these two things would be in conflict, drama and trauma.
00:31:38.520And as drama comes into the military with people who have actual trauma, real situations, not pseudo made up situations, I would see this hurting that the drama and the political correctness, the wokeness in the military, in many ways, even demeaning and almost mocking real trauma and real pain.
00:32:27.340I'm, you know, 20 years removed just about from my military service.
00:32:31.760And I've known a lot of folks who I served with who are now in positions of senior leadership, whether, you know, colonels and generals and folks that I respected and still respect who are still doing good work.
00:32:45.180When one makes it to the level of the Joint Chiefs and some of these appointed military positions, they certainly are politicians.
00:32:54.500They think like politicians. They act like politicians. And they're there because they're political.
00:33:02.840When we get to the operational side of the military, you know, different branches will be more.
00:33:11.740I don't like the term woke because I think it's pretty broad, but but woke or, you know, social justice aware or whatever you want to call it.
00:33:18.180than than than others uh united states army united states military uh united states marine
00:33:23.280corps rather tend to be the least of those the navy the air force a little bit more uh the jobs
00:33:29.260have a lot to do with that the types of people they attract have a lot to do with that but when
00:33:33.400you get to the operational forces there is a job to be done and one thing that i have seen from my
00:33:40.180time in the military and forward is that those young people go into the military and do that job
00:33:45.380Do it and they do it well. So whatever it is that our senior leaders are talking about as they are sitting before Congress, the books that they read and the nonsense that they so often espouse does not affect the the impact that our young servicemen and women have doing their job.
00:34:07.520However, and this is the big however, when those political ideologies become policy, that begins to affect the operating force.
00:34:19.920We have seen this the most clearly this year or more clearly this year than at any other time, probably in military history, with the vaccine mandate in the military.
00:34:30.340The fact that political military leaders have put as a matter of policy in place something like a vaccine mandate, and they are willing to lose a percentage of the United States military to enforce this policy.
00:34:50.040And we could talk about that all day long, but to enforce a policy that has zero bearing on the operational force, but is impacting every level down.
00:35:41.640The Department of Defense put out a study last year.
00:35:46.180So in calendar year 2020, that had some interesting findings.
00:35:51.440So typically, we say that there are 20 to 22 veterans a day that commit suicide to take their lives, 20 to 22 a day.
00:36:00.340It's a terrible number. That's the number we've used for a lot of years.
00:36:04.140On the active duty side, that number has been right around one and a half.
00:36:09.560more recently a little bit higher than that maybe as high as four active duty service members a day
00:36:18.380tragic number the department of defense did a study last year and the findings were this active
00:36:24.960duty suicide rates active duty suicide rates went up 25 percent across the active duty community
00:36:32.560across the department of defense this is all services 25 percent the army of the active duty
00:36:38.600suicide rate went up 35%. The Air Force, it stayed the same as the previous year. The previous year
00:36:43.780was the worst year for active duty Air Force suicides in the Air Force's history. So these
00:36:50.440policy decisions being made by political military leaders do have a real implication when it comes
00:36:57.680to things like what we're experiencing right now. So yeah, there is a real consequence for those
00:37:04.460who lead. And it's funny because it's always been a belief that it doesn't matter who's leading the
00:37:12.260military. Marines will do what Marines do. Soldiers will do what soldiers do. There's a job to be
00:37:16.240done. There's a mission to be accomplished. But now a lot of that is changing and we'll see where
00:37:22.860that ends up. I don't know where that will end up. Taking that one step further though, and I think
00:37:28.300This is where pastors and churches and Christians need to focus.
00:37:33.320We work with veterans and active duty service members who almost to a person will say they have post-traumatic stress as a result of combat or just their military service.
00:37:46.720A lot of folks now particularly haven't been in combat, but they have something that happened in their military service.
00:37:54.600When they come to us, that's their presenting problem, if you will.
00:37:58.300As we begin to present a biblical blueprint of what it means to live your life, what the Word of God says, who God is, and how that applies to you, these things that we talk about, what we learn very quickly over just a couple of days is that most of the folks who talk about combat-related post-traumatic stress were traumatized as children.
00:38:21.500A lot of sexual assaults, a lot of abuse, relationship issues, pornography issues, a lot of sexual sin that they brought into the military that was perhaps exacerbated by what they did in the military, but that that is not the problem.
00:38:37.880They're looking at the wrong place.0.53
00:38:39.480So when it comes to churches and Christians who are trying to deal with this and address it, we have got to get back to discipling, to teaching the word of God,
00:38:48.260to helping young men and women understand who they are before God,
00:38:52.200what the Bible says, how to filter their lives
00:38:54.940and their view of the world through the Bible
00:38:56.520so that when they're confronted with these other issues,
00:39:47.300You know, different special agencies that are just, you know, where multiple individuals on staff found, you know, like with child pornography and child abuse and all these kinds of things.
00:39:58.580And it seems as though, it seems as though there's just been a lack of accountability maybe with, you know, like, so like what you're saying is on the ground level, people who are involved in the military and we could say other organizations outside of the military, you know, there's a job to be done.
00:40:14.740people have a mission and people will rally and people will get it done um but it usually tends
00:40:20.880to be the people who aren't really they're they're not actually on the team anymore they're
00:40:25.880not they're not actually that it's they don't have the mission anymore they've they've they
00:40:30.320they accomplish the mission and then they achieve some kind of reward status to where they're not
00:40:36.140really military anymore they're a politician or they're not really a worker anymore they're you
00:40:47.560And we see just how much abuse of power there is.
00:40:51.420And it goes all the way back to, you know, like just a little kid, you know, gets to be the hall monitor, you know, and they become a tyrant.
00:40:59.940And just, you know, power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
00:41:04.340And there's just been so much tyranny, whether it be the vaccines or whether it be mask mandates
00:41:11.680or shutting down churches and all these different things.
00:41:14.900And you're right, like the result across the board in the military, but with civilians
00:41:18.940and just across the board, suicide has gone up tremendously for young adults, whether
00:41:25.280they be civilian, whether they be military.
00:41:28.300And it's just, yeah, it's really sad to say that in the name of public safety, what we
00:41:33.760did was we stripped everyone of liberty and it seems like that's always the trait right it's it's
00:41:39.280individual liberty versus public safety and it seems like people in power they have an agenda
00:41:45.160they have something that they they have a new mission some kind of global mission or whatever
00:41:50.280they just want to they just want to be remembered and make a name for themselves or whatever it is
00:41:54.360but they have their own mission and the thing that gets in their way is all those pesky
00:42:00.280provisions in the constitution you know those freedoms those liberties because america has a
00:42:04.940great foundation and so then they have to get people to voluntarily forfeit those liberties
00:42:10.740and so what in the world you know but liberty is so precious what in the world is going to make
00:42:15.640someone in their right mind give up liberty for you know what you got to trade something pretty
00:42:20.300valuable for someone to to give up liberty but the illusion of safety will do that you know and
00:42:26.920And there's this God complex, like I'm going to shut down the virus, or I'm going to stop tornadoes.
00:42:32.720Policy doesn't stop tornadoes. Policy doesn't shut down epidemics.
00:42:40.720And when you over-police things, and you pretend to be God,
00:42:44.100and you scare the living daylights out of everybody with just this fear-mongering mainstream media
00:42:50.240and all these kinds of things, and then tell them that I'm the Savior,
00:42:54.000And if all you have to do is give me your liberty and I will make you safe.
00:42:58.760And it turns out that not only do we not solve the original problem, whether it be COVID or whatever else, it didn't work.
00:43:07.440But all we did was we created new problems.
00:43:09.720There's substance abuse off the charts, suicide off the charts, unemployment off the charts, you know, all these different things.
00:43:17.460Now, inflation off the charts, they just came out with a study saying that the average family is next year is going to have to pay middle class family $4,000 more on total expenses annually, which that's, you know, that's not just like gas costs a little bit more, but that's a real that people will feel that.
00:43:38.140And it's a crazy thing, too, because that lack of trust in the institutions, it impacts someone who's already struggling and has struggled through their lives with trust and finding a place to belong.
00:43:56.180So if you see someone who was traumatized as a child, they are obviously carrying a lot of trauma if it hasn't been dealt with.
00:44:02.300and a lot of those folks will end up in an organization like the marine corps the army
00:44:08.340the military because it's a place where they can find belonging they can find trust they can find
00:44:13.160brotherhood and camaraderie and care and they've got leaders who care for them and watch out for
00:44:17.200their best interests and you know we've all seen the movies and so we know that's how it works
00:44:21.100and then it doesn't and there is such an identity wrapped up in the trauma of a child and then that
00:44:29.180identity is traded in a lot of ways for the identity of military service. I wear the uniform.
00:44:34.780I am this. I am this thing. And then when our leaders let us down or walk away from us,
00:44:41.440we lose our identity in that process or we get out of the military or we're pushed out of the
00:44:47.000military or whatever the case. And we no longer know who we are. So a big part of even what we
00:44:53.100deal with with veterans is helping them understand that that job you did is not who you were,
00:44:58.020the trauma you experienced is not who you are. It's all a part of your life and a part of your
00:45:02.020story, but that's not who you are. We need to understand, you know, what our identity is
00:45:07.880because, you know, it happens in churches where, you know, a pastor will do something
00:45:14.040egregious and those that he's led and taught and who have trusted him,
00:45:20.220he betrays them in that sense. It's a betrayal of God, but it's a betrayal of those that he leads
00:45:25.160as well. And the trauma and the loss of identity, who am I now? And what do I believe now? Churches
00:45:32.940go through that. Congregations go through that. Kids go through that with parents that do the
00:45:36.480same thing. And certainly it happens in the military. And then you add that acute trauma
00:45:40.740on top of it, you know, the physical trauma. It's a very deep and dark hole that you have to help
00:45:47.840someone work their way out of. Yeah. Yeah. You're right. Well, do you have any final thoughts on
00:45:54.120PTSD or trauma or just serving our troops maybe I could put it like this um what are some things
00:46:02.140that you know you know I was in San Diego for a long time pastoring a church there and we had
00:46:06.880some marines but a lot of navy and um you know so so maybe for some of our listeners who find
00:46:13.720themselves in in one of those kinds of areas and maybe they're a civilian you know speaking to
00:46:18.560civilians for a moment but they're in a church where there's a military presence you know where
00:46:23.320they have brothers and sisters in Christ that they see on a regular basis who are active duty
00:46:30.420in the military. What are some just practical ways that civilian Christians can love
00:46:35.600and serve them? Yeah. Yeah, that's a great question. Loving and serving is a great place to
00:46:41.840start. Loving people, genuinely caring for people, military folks. I can't speak for all
00:46:52.200military folks, but generally speaking, someone in the military who attends a local church
00:46:56.620is not there because they want to be singled out as someone in the military. They want to be
00:47:02.000loved and cared for as a human being, as someone who would go to that church, just like anyone else
00:47:07.300who would go to that church. I often have pastors reach out to me, and they'll ask something like
00:47:12.580this, how do I help those in my church who were in the military who were struggling? I didn't serve,
00:47:19.240So I can't relate to them. And while I understand the heart of that question, the reality is if scripture is sufficient, it's sufficient for all people, not just people that you have a common experience with or understand.
00:47:34.560To apply scripture to the issues that service members are dealing with, struggles that they're having, you know, the feelings that they're feeling, that's always the right way as one Christian to another.
00:47:45.600And so it's lovingly applying scripture. But I think beyond that, it's just it's being loving.
00:47:51.260It's showing care. If you are in a community of active duty service members, a lot of ways to show care.
00:47:57.280You can care for the spouse and the children while the service member is away.
00:48:02.360The church that I'm a part of now and I was many years ago is in Oceanside, California, right outside of Camp Pendleton.
00:48:10.340and we'll have times where you know a third of the church is on deployment and there are a lot
00:48:17.940of wives and a lot of kids who need to be cared for and man there's no better way to show love
00:48:24.600and care and concern than to be there for them and take care of them yeah also there are a lot
00:48:30.580of people who are struggling and you know there are resources that are needed our organization
00:48:34.500has written several books we have a lot of resources we do a lot of content production
00:48:40.020in terms of video. We've got some podcasts. Pointing people to those resources can be helpful
00:48:44.780as well. For someone who needs help but may not want that help, you can point them to others who
00:48:49.960have also served, you know where they've been and where they're coming from, and hey, go check this
00:48:54.060out. That's been helpful as well, and just being there for them. Yeah, that's good. You said you
00:49:00.200were in Oceanside. Did you ever know, this is a random question, but did you ever know a pastor
00:49:04.180there named jonathan ransom uh you know i met him years ago but it's been it's been a long time
00:49:11.480yeah i remember when i was in san diego he was he was there for a while and then he ended up being
00:49:16.140stationed in japan but yeah he was a good guy so and since you were in the ocean side i thought i
00:49:20.660yeah it's funny i haven't heard that name in a long time but years ago yeah it's a good name
00:49:24.520huh i wish my last name was ransom that's a great it's gonna be a lot easier to say if it was ransom
00:49:29.220Yeah. Yeah. Well, thanks so much, Jeremy, for coming on the show. The last question is this. Let our listeners, could you tell them how they could follow you and keep up with your ministry?
00:49:39.340Yeah, the best place to go is just to our website, MightyOaksPrograms.org.
00:49:45.380So, it's Oaks with an S, Programs with an S, MightyOaksPrograms.org.
00:49:51.160And so, there on our website, first thing you'll see is a place to apply for the program.
00:49:56.040A veteran, active duty service member, first responder, or spouse can apply for our program.
00:50:01.440There's no cost to attend, and we'll work with you to do all the logistics and all the planning.
00:50:06.820We'll cover the cost of travel so that there really is nothing that would prevent someone from attending the program other than the five days it will take to go.
00:50:14.080So we want to make that available. Please apply. We have a great team that can make that happen.
00:50:20.000We also have places for resources. We have a blog that we run off of that Web site.
00:50:25.120We have video and other resources as well. So check that out. And we put all that out there.
00:50:31.300We do charge for our books, but we give, so for instance, last year we gave 45,000 books away.
00:50:38.660So when we charge on our website, it's so that we can give them away to our active duty folks. So
00:50:42.760if someone falls onto our website, they look at something they want and they think it would be
00:50:47.100helpful just to email us and we'll send it to you. You can't afford it. So we just want to make sure
00:50:51.200that every resource needed is available. That's great. Well, Jeremy, thank you so much for coming
00:50:56.620on the show. We appreciate it. Yeah, it's awesome. Thank you. Appreciate all you do.
00:51:00.500As a special thank you for your gift of any amount, we'll be happy to send you a free digital book from our store.
00:51:06.680To access this offer, visit rightresponseministries.com slash offer.
00:51:11.500We highly recommend Pastor Joel's book, Am I Truly Saved?
00:51:15.160If you or someone you know has wrestled with doubts about the love of God, this would be a great resource.
00:51:20.940As a reminder, to get this offer, go to rightresponseministries.com slash offer.
00:51:25.240And thank you for your generous support.