The Peter Attia Drive - December 31, 2019


Qualy #85 - The past, present, and future of medicine, hospitals, and healthcare


Episode Stats

Length

13 minutes

Words per Minute

164.69899

Word Count

2,153

Sentence Count

3


Summary

Health care is one of the least disrupted industries by technology, but is it also the most lucrative? In this episode of the Qualies podcast, we discuss the pros and cons of the health care industry, including the benefits and risks of investing in it.


Transcript

00:00:00.000 welcome to the qualies a subscriber exclusive podcast qualies is just a shorthand slang for
00:00:10.640 a qualification round which is something you do prior to the race just a little bit quicker
00:00:14.880 qualies podcast features episodes that are short and we're hoping for less than 10 minutes each
00:00:19.920 which highlight the best questions topics tactics etc discussed on previous episodes of the drive
00:00:26.100 we recognize many of you as new listeners to the podcast may not have the time to go back and
00:00:30.920 listen to every episode and those of you who have already listened may have forgotten so the new
00:00:35.000 episodes of the qualies are going to be released tuesday through friday and they're going to be
00:00:39.000 published exclusively on our private subscriber only podcast feed now occasionally we're going
00:00:43.580 to release quali episodes in the main feed which is what you're about to hear now if you enjoy these
00:00:49.100 episodes and if you're interested in hearing more as well as receiving all of the other subscriber
00:00:53.260 exclusive content which is growing by the month you can visit us at peter tmd.com forward slash
00:00:59.240 subscribe so without further delay i hope you enjoy today's quali you know it's interesting when you
00:01:06.160 look at all of the businesses that have been disrupted by the internet and contrast it with
00:01:11.420 those that have not right so you've just given us a very eloquent description of how the music industry
00:01:16.440 was disrupted but you also pointed out something interesting which is it wasn't just the internet
00:01:20.880 that disrupted it was the desperation that followed the decimation that permitted the restructuring
00:01:27.300 of course then you can rattle off all the glib and obvious examples right what amazon has done to
00:01:32.560 retail what netflix has done to you know blockbuster and you know stores on the side of the street
00:01:37.580 what uber has done to taxis what you know all of the travel sites have done to travel agents i mean
00:01:42.880 it's been incredibly disruptive and yet when i think about medicine it's like one of the least
00:01:48.540 disrupted industries by technology and you know you basically still have hospitals eat all the rent
00:01:56.140 payers although most people generally perceive them as bad guys generally don't get paid that much
00:02:01.960 providers get less and less on a per encounter basis and it's you know overall a pretty much
00:02:08.480 similar system to what it was 20 years ago and that's i don't know i mean i guess i'd have to think
00:02:13.980 about it but i can't think of too many industries that are as unchanged in the presence of this
00:02:19.160 revolution as health care no i think you're right the appeal of investing in health care is exactly what
00:02:26.680 you just expressed and that's what drew me into it several years ago and what i've learned since then
00:02:33.260 has been slightly disillusioning but i'll give you my take on it the first thing i would say is that
00:02:39.800 health care is still an industry that largely gets paid through labor so most of the money
00:02:48.900 ultimately goes to labor goes to doctors it goes to health care personnel the hospitals don't make
00:02:57.620 that much money they're not that great a business you know if you look at kaiser for example which is
00:03:02.480 an integrated payer provider you know in california i think they have a three or four percent gross margin
00:03:08.060 it's not a phenomenal business the payers to your point have very low margins they in fact have
00:03:15.280 legally imposed limits on the amount of gross margin that they can generate which you know you can argue
00:03:21.440 about the ethics of the pharmaceutical companies who everyone hates seemingly extract enormous profits
00:03:30.300 on the other hand it's a very competitive industry and apart from the legalized monopoly given to
00:03:37.780 them via patents on new drugs they are the only companies sort of as i said about record labels
00:03:45.140 they're the only ones who are out here designing new solutions and taking an enormous risk taking an
00:03:51.500 enormous risk and their shareholders are taking that risk now whether they're being overpaid or
00:03:55.440 underpaid to take that risk is totally debatable the other thing is that it's unclear where technology
00:04:04.480 can deliver dividends in terms of human health and so we're thinking about medicine at a moment in
00:04:13.100 which we as a species have already made enormous progress i mean whatever we've doubled or tripled
00:04:18.580 lifespan and you know i mean you know these numbers better than i do but even if you get rid of the infant
00:04:24.380 mortality factor and these other things that distort the numbers people are living quite a bit longer on
00:04:30.640 average than they were even seemingly 30 years ago that's especially true of affluent societies until they
00:04:37.280 get afflicted by the diseases of affluence so where can we get more life from or where can we reduce
00:04:46.380 suffering and disease by way of technology is a little unclear there are all sorts of things that we
00:04:53.680 could of course do to make hospitals more efficient and to spend less than we do on things like end of
00:05:00.780 life care that maybe aren't a good use of capital but there's not so obviously a spotify of health care
00:05:10.040 waiting to happen it's more like there are a million little it operating efficiencies that mckinsey
00:05:18.520 consultants will over the next several decades implement in large health organizations and then
00:05:24.480 the big promise is around new types of medicine that i think will arise in the biotechnology industry
00:05:34.020 and that's where i'm now spending a lot of my time and attention yeah it's sort of interesting because
00:05:38.740 i think one of the challenges of health care and i think this was most evident during the debates many
00:05:44.200 years ago not many but what i call it eight ten years ago around the aca and around complete
00:05:49.160 revisiting a restructuring of health care and one of the things i found a little painful in listening
00:05:54.220 to politicians talk about health care was they spoke about it like there was just one problem to be
00:05:59.020 solved but the way i sort of think about it is there are at least three completely separate but highly
00:06:05.140 related problems which is you know quality of care and that can be broken down into two levels you can
00:06:11.200 sort of have it as just keeping people from dying versus like generating alpha so you know really
00:06:17.320 improving quality there's cost which is just the cost to the system and about 90 percent of the dollars
00:06:25.660 are basically spent by three entities the government the employer and the payer depending on who's at risk
00:06:32.560 the consumer is on the hook for about 10 percent of that cost so how could you reduce the cost
00:06:37.640 and then the third leg of that stool is access how do you ensure access and so when we talk about
00:06:45.020 technology disrupting health care it's like where do you start right because you know for me i can
00:06:50.920 see things where technology can be quite helpful on quality of care not entirely obvious to me how to
00:06:57.580 leverage technology to lower cost people much smarter than me i'm sure think about that and not entirely
00:07:02.740 clear at least at a practical level how it can drive access although in theory that should be the
00:07:08.640 first place you'd want to go after leveraging technology but i think i'm trying to think about
00:07:14.240 what you said about how spotify went about it and trying to see is there a parallel there because
00:07:18.140 the thing with spotify that was hard was you had multiple constituents right you have artists you have
00:07:23.000 labels you have consumers and they all kind of want something a little different and that speaks of an
00:07:28.740 optimization problem which is clearly what health care is but going on what you said a moment ago it
00:07:34.600 sounds like today you're a little less encouraged than you would have been four years ago and you're
00:07:39.740 thinking on this problem well let me try and recapitulate your three legs of the stool and in one
00:07:47.100 simple framework which is something that we should all be aiming for is to generate universal access
00:07:55.780 to the current best available health care that anyone in the world receives you know one of my
00:08:02.960 favorite quotes i always forget whose quote it is but venture capitalists talk about it a lot which is
00:08:08.580 that the future is already here it's just not evenly distributed and i think that's almost always true
00:08:13.660 look at what rich people are doing and assume that in 20 or 30 years everybody will have that
00:08:20.700 and so what are rich people doing right now well they're paying doctors like you a lot of money
00:08:27.480 to do very bespoke types of medicine that leverage all sorts of deep biometric analyses of their bodies
00:08:36.060 a lot of thinking by you and your team and a lot of spend on the usage of what are currently
00:08:45.840 expensive machines mri machines to do preventative screening for tumors every year things like this
00:08:54.200 that if you're really rich you know you might as well go get an mri every year get a full body mri
00:08:58.820 every year i mean just see if there's anything going on why not and so what stands between today
00:09:06.020 and orphans in somalia receiving that level of care and what stands in the way i think is to some degree
00:09:16.520 a level of technological leverage what is happening in your head when you look at a patient's blood tests
00:09:26.060 and try to gel that with your biophysiological mental models
00:09:32.760 is something that i believe computers will be able to do in the future
00:09:36.700 and so right now we use physicians for thinking and for bedside manner and for guidance
00:09:49.380 and then we use some physicians like surgeons for physical procedures that they're essentially athletes at
00:09:58.040 you know you want high performing athletes who don't mess up who are very precise who've done it a million
00:10:02.540 well the roboticization of physical medicine like surgery is something that i believe will just
00:10:13.000 continue to get better and better it may take longer it may not be replaceable immediately but
00:10:18.000 that will you know we will be primarily doing robotic surgeries 100 years from now the cognitive work
00:10:24.160 that physicians do will i believe largely be replaced by computational systems that can
00:10:32.420 leverage the same types of theoretical frameworks that our minds are utilizing to make good decisions
00:10:38.640 and what you're left with is all the touchy-feely personal stuff that you as a physician and any other
00:10:45.700 physician knows really matters it's not superficial the ability to help someone make good decisions about
00:10:54.380 their own health to make someone care about their physical health to help them navigate difficult
00:11:00.840 decisions that aren't straightforward that involve trade-offs are the sort of things that physicians
00:11:06.220 right now don't have the time to do that they did when they were taking their medicine bag around to
00:11:11.300 people's houses and hanging out for a couple hours and so in a certain way we may go back to an older style of medicine
00:11:17.840 but the people who do that may look more like highly skilled nurses than like physicians so i believe that
00:11:25.120 what you'll see is globally a lot more technology involved in the deployment of medicine and a shift in the
00:11:33.340 composition of the labor market around medicine towards something that looks more like a large population of
00:11:40.300 highly skilled nurses fewer overpaid or appropriately paid but maybe over trained physicians that right now
00:11:50.180 are very scarce that only rich people can access and then most excitingly you're going to see a lot of new
00:11:56.840 medicine that's the stuff i'm focused on now as an investor and that's the stuff that i think is going to be
00:12:03.420 the most game-changing that's the stuff that's going to buy us years of additional life
00:12:07.820 i hope you enjoyed today's quali now sit tight for that legal disclaimer this podcast is for general
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